# Best 4ch. SQ amplifer in the $400-800 range?



## insoc (Jan 30, 2013)

Hello. I am placing in the front doors Focal PS165 component speakers and in the rear some Focal coaxials.
All my other amps have been made by JL AUDIO and I love the performance but my last amp was a JL AUDIO A 4300 and now (5 years later) I find that JL AUDIO is focusing on Class D amplifiers. Class D is not my cup of tea and since I have read mixed reviews I am not happy spending 800 on the HD600/4 amplifier.
I am focusing on the best SQ AB amplifier but the "problem" is that the footprint has to be the smallest possible.
I am really stuck and don't know what to choose. Basically the only amp, to my knowledge, that fit my requirements is the Focal FPP 4100 amp BUT my only fear is that said amplifier SIGNAL TO NOISE RATIO is 80db where as my former amp, the A 4300 had a SN of 100 and the HD 600/4 has an impressive 100+ SN.
I really hate hearing hiss and floor noise not to mention the dreaded alternator noise!
Any suggestions? What do you think of the Focal FPP 4100?
Your suggestions and comments are much needed! I have spent many nights deciding and I am really stuck. Part of my says: go, buy the HD600/4 amp but part of me says, you are going to regret it, buy a good AB amp...!
Thank you!!!!


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## qwertydude (Dec 22, 2008)

Head to head in a blind test you will not hear the difference between a good class D and a class AB but one thing is certain you can't have a small high powered AB amp. The reason the class D amps can get so small is they don't generate that much heat. Try to get an AB amp to shrink to those small sizes and you'll inevitably have a hot running amp because of the limited surface area and mass needed to cool the amp, sure you can put a fan but then you're introducing more complexity. Long term the fan sucks in lots of dust. That's the problem I have with many of my fan cooled amps I've owned, after a couple years they need to be regularly blown out or cleaned or risk overheating.

So you have to get your priorities straight. If you can't tell the difference between D and AB in a blind test, why should it really influence your decision? Whereas you do have the requirement of smallest size possible, if that is an absolute, then it makes sense the only amps you should be considering is a class D, not just for small size but in confined areas they're far less likely to overheat and won't need to be blown out and cleaned because of fan cooling.

You won't regret a class D amp. A lot of people here run them. For one thing your cars electrical system will be more thankful. It'll also let you run more subwoofer power and possibly smaller gauge wire.


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## Angrywhopper (Jan 20, 2010)

Have you heard a HD600/4? It's an excellent amplifier.


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## flecom (Mar 31, 2008)

qwertydude said:


> The reason the class D amps can get so small is they don't generate that much heat.


and the reason for that is efficiency


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## xxyue188 (Jul 23, 2012)

I have a similar problem to choose another 4ch amp to drive my front stage; however, I am using Focal FPP4100 now. Focal FPP 4100 is very good but I can hear the differences between my previous A/B amp. If you are interested, please feel free to look at my Thread under the same discussion section.

For your case, you may want the amp in small size that's why the HD 600/4 is more suitable. I also agree "your cars electrical system will be more thankful" because it takes less power from your battery. 

However, I prefer A/B or even pure A myself since the sound quailty is little bit warm especially when you upgrade from passive to active later on. You hear the differences not because you use a bad amp but just simply the whole system has the ability to present the distortion more throughly that you may aware of. If you plan to do any upgrade later, I would suggest A/B amp that gives you flexibility to drive even only the tweeter.


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## ZAKOH (Nov 26, 2010)

I am a lazy installer. I just want to screw the amplifier onto a random flat and sufficiently out-of-sight surface I can find in a car. This makes installing a 20 inch long Class A/B amplifier a bit complicated. I am 99% certain that 99% of people (which includes me) are obsessed with Class D amps for this reason alone. This is now where money is. I am sure this is how JL and Alpine are doing a killing selling Class D amps. I am not saying that these amplifers are not good, but the technology is still new and expensivish. E.g. compare the JL HD900 price to a Soundstream REF5.1000.

However, if you're willing to pay for or do yourself an honest to god amp install work, I don't see why not buy a good Class A/B amplifier. If you want to get hold of a good but quite affordable Class A/B amplifier, take a look at the new Soundstream Reference line. Just look at those wonderful blue enclosures.

Soundstream - Amplifiers - Reference


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## cyberdraven (Oct 28, 2009)

im always been a zapco fan. with that, i say zapco dc amps. at that price range, you will have (1) an amplifier; (2) a powerful processor and (3) a signal transmitter (no more RCA).


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## pjhabit (Aug 12, 2008)

I used to think the same way, untill I heard the HD's. I think the switching technology has greatly improved, from the days that gave full range D's a bad rap. You should really give them a listen, before writing them off.


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## slugman2894 (Feb 21, 2012)

Ill sell you mine for $450 shipped, I have an album on Facebook audio classifieds. I'm going to a arc mini for the same reason.


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## legend94 (Mar 15, 2006)

what is the max size you can fit?


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## ron82nd (May 17, 2009)

cyberdraven said:


> im always been a zapco fan. with that, i say zapco dc amps. at that price range, you will have (1) an amplifier; (2) a powerful processor and (3) a signal transmitter (no more RCA).



Not to hijack the thread but what is a signal transmitter and how does it work?


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## insoc (Jan 30, 2013)

legend94 said:


> what is the max size you can fit?


Small enough so that it can fit under the drivers or front passenger seat. My car's seat is big and I think I could so with something like the size of the Focal FPP4100, that is: 14-15/16"W x 2-3/8"H x 7-7/8"D
Something like the JL Audio Slash 300/4v3 (13-7/16"W x 2-1/4"H x 10"D) might be to deep.

You know what? After reading all the answers I think I will go with the HD600/4. I've seen some youtube videos and the sound is terrible. Yes, I know youtube should not be the place to base a decision but other amps videos sound much better or maybe is just a coincidence that all HD600/4 owners have crappy video cameras.

Anyway, what better place to read opinion than forums like this.

My reasoning is this: JL AUDIO is a very renowned amplifier brand that wouldn't make the HD line of digital amplifiers their FLAGSHIP amplifiers if they weren't absolutely sure about the great SQ and performance of those amplifiers. Don't you think?

So, yes, I'm leaning now towards the HD600/4.

Any comments? Thank you all!


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## xxyue188 (Jul 23, 2012)

Would you please let us know the result after you get the HD600/4 installed? I am thinking of HD750/1 to drive the Sub if you can have some feedback for me. Thanks!


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## KrossoverPT (Nov 7, 2011)

To be honest, go to the HD600/4 or HD750/1 as mentioned here in the post above. 

Comparing the Focal FPP4100 to a JL Audio HD600/4 ?????? What is to compare? HD all the way!

We made some car installs with Focal and JL Audio, and to be honest dont compare those two products as they can not be compared... (or at least should not be compared)


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## slugman2894 (Feb 21, 2012)

Message me if interested.


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## Boostedrex (Apr 4, 2007)

Granted I'm far from unbiased on this subject. However, given your size requirements and budget I think that you would be hard pressed to beat the JL HD600/4. It really is a great amp and the sound is top notch.

I also like the cost/performance ratio of the Arc Audio Mini amps. I've heard them in several installs and they are great.

I obviously will always back Zuki Audio. But the footprints of the ELEETS amps are far larger than what you are able to fit.


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## Sonus (Jun 28, 2010)

Zapco studio for AB or ST-D for class D


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## gckless (Oct 11, 2012)

Also a Zed Leviathan. It's 6 channel, but you didn't give a power requirement. The Levi is REALLY versatile and can put some big power out if you bridge some channels.

Don't know if you got that 600/4, but just giving an option.


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## Angrywhopper (Jan 20, 2010)

You won't be disappointed with the HD. I installed and listened to a HD900/5 today and as always it sounded great.


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## insoc (Jan 30, 2013)

Well, based on the suggestions I read on this forum, yesterday I bought the HD600/4. I am very positive about this amp because I know JL AUDIO won't dissapoint their customers with their flagship products. This forum has been so helpful to me that I'm creating another post asking for help with the setting of the amp. Thank you again!


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## cyberdraven (Oct 28, 2009)

ron82nd said:


> Not to hijack the thread but what is a signal transmitter and how does it work?


The zapco DC only accepts balanced transmitter lines, instead of normal RCA's. This is used for lower signal noise, even some, argue that such is better than a normal rca. Further, the cable comes with a transmitter (which is free when you buy zapco dc amps), that allows you to boost the signal from the HU up to 12V. The other end of the transmitter is a normal rca jack which you could plug into the hu.

The zapco dc, does (1) amplify; (2) allows you to accurately tune your system with built-in processor (10 band parametric per channel, TA, crossover, phase, levels, bridging) and (3) connects the headunit to the amp through a "balanced" signal.

Thanks

Paeng


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## KrossoverPT (Nov 7, 2011)

insoc said:


> Well, based on the suggestions I read on this forum, yesterday I bought the HD600/4. I am very positive about this amp because I know JL AUDIO won't dissapoint their customers with their flagship products. This forum has been so helpful to me that I'm creating another post asking for help with the setting of the amp. Thank you again!


You wont be disapointed


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## joms (Mar 10, 2005)

any update on this? How did the JL HD600/4 perform for the thread starter? Im also on the same boat and im thinking JL HD600/4 or Mosconi AS 100.4 to be placed under the seat


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## FartinInTheTub (May 25, 2010)

I have a Sinfoni 50.4x 4-channel for sale in the classifieds.


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## bro777 (Jun 24, 2013)

Just take a look at Hi-end home audio amplifiers like Krell, Mark Levinson, etc they are running class A. 90% of Hi-end home audio is class A or A/B. Now that's SQ.


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## bcyt13 (Jun 27, 2013)

I have the Hertz HDP4 and it works beautifully for what I needed. Puts out 150W @ 4 ohms for the front speakers and I have them bridged for 500W x 1 @ 4ohms for the sub.


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## Jepalan (Jun 27, 2013)

Angrywhopper said:


> Have you heard a HD600/4? It's an excellent amplifier.


^^^ This.

I have only had a Boston GTA-704 (class A/B) and a JL XD600/6, so I can't claim to be an expert here, but I can vouch for the SQ of the JL over the GTA. 

I am running the JL with Polk DXi6500's in front and rear and bridged to 10" sealed RF sub in back. It really opens up and sings at moderate volumes. 

If size is an issue (was for me), the JL XD's are tiny.


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## turbo5upra (Oct 3, 2008)

after pulling the 900/5 out in favor of a arc ks300.4.... I haven't looked back. The 300.2 and 300.4 just work...


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## tmm808 (Apr 23, 2013)

joms said:


> any update on this? How did the JL HD600/4 perform for the thread starter? Im also on the same boat and im thinking JL HD600/4 or Mosconi AS 100.4 to be placed under the seat


Just my 2 cents, I recently upgraded from a JL HD600 to the Mosconi AS series and am extremely surprised by how much difference it made. Don't get me wrong, the HD is a great amp for what it is, but can't say I will ever go back to it after owning the Mosconi's. I have used the Focal FPP amps as well, I also prefer these slightly over the JL HDs.


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## qwertydude (Dec 22, 2008)

bro777 said:


> Just take a look at Hi-end home audio amplifiers like Krell, Mark Levinson, etc they are running class A. 90% of Hi-end home audio is class A or A/B. Now that's SQ.


90% of Hi-end home audio is pure ********. This is the realm of speaker wire elevators, AC line conditioners, $1000 RCA cables, and even funnier equally expensive HDMI cables.

Home audio is slower to adapt to changing technologies but if you have a home theater and want to have power to play reference levels and don't want gigantic speakers for their efficiency, you're gonna go class D. Standard home electricity will only provide about 2000 watts at most to your system unless you wanna run dedicated separate high power lines just for your theater. If you're wasting half or two thirds of that 2000 watts as heat you're down to only 600-1000 watts of audio capability. Let's split that among your various speakers. How about running your TV too? So that's cutting down more power. Pretty soon you'll see why 25 watts per channel is really limiting because that's what a class A amp will get you when you set it up for a home theater. Now you need gigantic speakers to make up for the efficiency loss, gigantic speakers then introduce their own inherent distortions if not set up right because high efficiency drivers often aren't very well controlled in terms of speaker design. But a lot of people think colored sound is "SQ" kinda like people claim there's no surpassing vinyl in terms of SQ. Yeah pure ********.

So there's your high end class A amp sure, but everything else will suffer in terms of sound quality just to have your class A amp.

Better to focus your energy where it counts. Get a decent set of speakers first, and good speakers that are reasonable in size tend to be less efficient and so need more power. The only way to reasonably get that without tripping your breakers is running class D.

Basically a properly set up system will sound good no matter what technology is being used to get it. But putting a laser focus on just class A amplification will limit your choices when amplification is THE SMALLEST influencer on sound quality.


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## 2010hummerguy (Oct 7, 2009)

I know OP already made his decision but people should check out Biketronics' 4x180w amp. Made for Harleys but they are awesome for cars. Tiny, huge power and amazing performance. Four Hypex UcD180 amps and they can be upgraded to HXR regulators for even better SQ.

http://www.biketronics.com/bt4180/


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## cajunner (Apr 13, 2007)

Architect7 said:


> I know OP already made his decision but people should check out Biketronics' 4x180w amp. Made for Harleys but they are awesome for cars. Tiny, huge power and amazing performance. Four Hypex UcD180 amps and they can be upgraded to HXR regulators for even better SQ.
> 
> http://www.biketronics.com/bt4180/


a made in USA amp, 7" x 5" footprint and 720 RMS watts?

nice!

650 on the retail, kinda rough on the pocket but I guess JL's version is no bargain bin price either.


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## 2010hummerguy (Oct 7, 2009)

Yeah you gotta remember that the modules and power supply are 80% of that cost so it is actually a pretty good deal, very little markup.


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## CrossFired (Jan 24, 2008)

Most class D amps sound hard and cold(IMO). There are a couple I've heard that sound really nice, Zed comes to mind, as I listened to one for 45 minutes(loud), and never would of thought it to be Class D. Clearly Zed did there homework on amp design. If I was not sooooo happy with my Boston amps, I'd get some Zed amps! Really one of the few choice Class D amps.

Products




insoc said:


> Hello. I am placing in the front doors Focal PS165 component speakers and in the rear some Focal coaxials.
> All my other amps have been made by JL AUDIO and I love the performance but my last amp was a JL AUDIO A 4300 and now (5 years later) I find that JL AUDIO is focusing on Class D amplifiers. Class D is not my cup of tea and since I have read mixed reviews I am not happy spending 800 on the HD600/4 amplifier.
> I am focusing on the best SQ AB amplifier but the "problem" is that the footprint has to be the smallest possible.
> I am really stuck and don't know what to choose. Basically the only amp, to my knowledge, that fit my requirements is the Focal FPP 4100 amp BUT my only fear is that said amplifier SIGNAL TO NOISE RATIO is 80db where as my former amp, the A 4300 had a SN of 100 and the HD 600/4 has an impressive 100+ SN.
> ...


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## JAX (Jun 2, 2006)

Ive had a lot of class D amps and a lot of A/B amps...

some I didnt like and some were ok... the JL XD I had was tiny but lacked enough power..


Im running a JBL MS1004 bridged and its plenty loud and sounds plenty good and super easy to set up. 

since they can now be had for just over $200 its crazy not to consider...you could buy 2 or 3 for the money your talking about.

ZED I will not ever buy again..I like the looks but not the business


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