# Thoughts on this for closed-cell foam?



## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

12 Sheets Self Adhesive Closed Cell Foam 10mm Car Sound Proofing Insulation

Looks interesting, also on Amazon. Thoughts?


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## DC/Hertz (Nov 27, 2011)

That's a good deal.


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Not an Amazon guy but this is interesting too
https://www.amazon.com/SupportTM-Pr...=8-14&keywords=closed+cell+foam+adhesive&th=1

Sundley also has foil-backed CLD. Interesting. Not sure that would help our situation but still, interesting.

I ordered some Reckhorn deadener, I think it was the last of it, from Amazon. Mostly just to experiment since the CLD thread closed out, yet all these new contenders entering the market. I know Reckhorn is an established if not eclectic home audio brand in Germany. We'll see how it goes, as I have Kolossus sitting around as well and can compare the two directly. 

I'm going to order some various thicknesses of this Sundley foam unless someone has something better in mind. Also saw this:
https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Acous...65&sr=8-21&keywords=closed+cell+foam+adhesive

Nice stuff too, going by the looks! Anything waterproof and decoupling is on my looking list.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

fourthmeal said:


> Not an Amazon guy but this is interesting too
> https://www.amazon.com/SupportTM-Pr...=8-14&keywords=closed+cell+foam+adhesive&th=1
> 
> Sundley also has foil-backed CLD. Interesting. Not sure that would help our situation but still, interesting.
> ...


Have you checked out this stuff? It's a CLD/CCF(ish) combo... I think...

Soundskins Sound Deadener Kits


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## Justin Zazzi (May 28, 2012)

That first link is expensive for what it is. SDS has a good product for much cheaper.


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

I exclusively use 1/8" neoprene from foam by mail.


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

DavidRam said:


> Have you checked out this stuff? It's a CLD/CCF(ish) combo... I think...
> 
> Soundskins Sound Deadener Kits


That seems quite expensive, 11 sq feet for 90?


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

I have this stuff. I like it 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00URV8MFC/ref=ya_aw_od_pi?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Jazzi said:


> That first link is expensive for what it is. SDS has a good product for much cheaper.


I like buying from Don but my distance from him make some things less economical compared with someone else in the east coast. Finding things in Cali or around for me is usually cheaper to ship and faster.

But Don has nice ****. I do like self-adhesive stuff though if I can get it, when I can get it. Don likes using sprays, I'm less a fan of that.

But we're not talking apples to apples here. Don't stuff is 1/8" which is about 3.2mm thick. The first link is to 19.2 sq, 10mm thick for $40 shipped. 3.2mm thick for $16.35 (plus shipping) for 13.5 sq ft is Don's. I like thick foams if I can get them, thin is nice too. A mix is good.


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## Victor_inox (Apr 27, 2012)

isn`t that the same **** for half price
12 Sheets 10mm Car Auto Van Sound Proofing Deadening Insulation Closed Cell Foam | eBay


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Victor_inox said:


> isn`t that the same **** for half price
> 12 Sheets 10mm Car Auto Van Sound Proofing Deadening Insulation Closed Cell Foam | eBay


Yes, from China. The other one is from the US.


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## Victor_inox (Apr 27, 2012)

fourthmeal said:


> Yes, from China. The other one is from the US.


i don`t see a problem here, do you?


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Victor_inox said:


> i don`t see a problem here, do you?


Potentially in time concerns, as its hit-and-miss. Those SPX rep tweeters for instance, those took some days. Something from a Cali location may take 1 complete day once it starts to ship.

I might snag some of this just to mess with it. I also plan on reviewing Reckhorn, good or bad. Just in the spirit of DIYMA and the hunt for good products at a good price.


I must say, I didn't like doing the customs stuff for the MiniDSP purchase from China (I think it was), that took a while and also I got a Fedex bill for customs separate. I hated that.


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## Victor_inox (Apr 27, 2012)

fourthmeal said:


> Potentially in time concerns, as its hit-and-miss. Those SPX rep tweeters for instance, those took some days. Something from a Cali location may take 1 complete day once it starts to ship.
> 
> I might snag some of this just to mess with it. I also plan on reviewing Reckhorn, good or bad. Just in the spirit of DIYMA and the hunt for good products at a good price.


ataboy!


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## Rudeboy (Oct 16, 2005)

fourthmeal said:


> I like buying from Don but my distance from him make some things less economical compared with someone else in the east coast. Finding things in Cali or around for me is usually cheaper to ship and faster.
> 
> But Don has nice ****. I do like self-adhesive stuff though if I can get it, when I can get it. Don likes using sprays, I'm less a fan of that.
> 
> But we're not talking apples to apples here. Don't stuff is 1/8" which is about 3.2mm thick. The first link is to 19.2 sq, 10mm thick for $40 shipped. 3.2mm thick for $16.35 (plus shipping) for 13.5 sq ft is Don's. I like thick foams if I can get them, thin is nice too. A mix is good.


Just to be clear, the only place I use spray adhesive is to attach Hydrophobic Melamine Foam to a roof - and not always in that case. If there's a sunroof, I want to make sure the HMF never gets in the way.

I NEVER glue CCF to the vehicle. I did that years ago because everybody else did. I can't tell you how many times I've had to tear CCF out to get behind something I assumed would never need access. There's no performance advantage to gluing CCF in, so why do it?. Here's how I attach MLV and CCF to the vehicle:
Attaching MLV and CCF
Makes it easier to fit the materials since you have some ability to adjust as you go. Need to remove the materials? Unhook the Velcro, do what you need to do and put the CCF and MLV back where it was. Nothing destroyed in the process. Nothing wasted.


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## dcfis (Sep 9, 2016)

I used the ccf just like the op linked from eBay to cute rear deck problems. I am happy with it all around


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

It was probably years ago that we had a convo about it. I personally will not go without using adhesive, but I attach it to the door skin side, not the car metal side. In addition to strategic use of deadener to stop the plastic door panel from resonating, then I glue whatever type of barrier I want to try to the panel. Of course CLD goes on the metal side too. I don't use much MLV. I used to, but the cars I've purchased lately have very little actual road noise. I'm more after the resonance and rattle killing lately. Some cars though, they need a ton of MLV and that's OK. 

It makes sense to velcro mlv. But access to the door skin side is so minimal, I can't recall in the last ten years needing to do anything about it with any of the cars I've done, or owned.

What's your take on the materials (just at a glance) I'm seeing? Most are closer to me than you are.





Rudeboy said:


> Just to be clear, the only place I use spray adhesive is to attach Hydrophobic Melamine Foam to a roof - and not always in that case. If there's a sunroof, I want to make sure the HMF never gets in the way.
> 
> I NEVER glue CCF to the vehicle. I did that years ago because everybody else did. I can't tell you how many times I've had to tear CCF out to get behind something I assumed would never need access. There's no performance advantage to gluing CCF in, so why do it?. Here's how I attach MLV and CCF to the vehicle:
> Attaching MLV and CCF
> Makes it easier to fit the materials since you have some ability to adjust as you go. Need to remove the materials? Unhook the Velcro, do what you need to do and put the CCF and MLV back where it was. Nothing destroyed in the process. Nothing wasted.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

fourthmeal said:


> That seems quite expensive, 11 sq feet for 90?


Yes it is expensive... I just think it's cool in terms of a 2-in-1 product, easy install, etc..


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

DavidRam said:


> Yes it is expensive... I just think it's cool in terms of a 2-in-1 product, easy install, etc..


That's like luxury liner pro


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## 94VG30DE (Nov 28, 2007)

Rudeboy said:


> Just to be clear, the only place I use spray adhesive is to attach Hydrophobic Melamine Foam to a roof - and not always in that case. If there's a sunroof, I want to make sure the HMF never gets in the way.
> 
> I NEVER glue CCF to the vehicle. I did that years ago because everybody else did. I can't tell you how many times I've had to tear CCF out to get behind something I assumed would never need access. There's no performance advantage to gluing CCF in, so why do it?. Here's how I attach MLV and CCF to the vehicle:
> Attaching MLV and CCF
> Makes it easier to fit the materials since you have some ability to adjust as you go. Need to remove the materials? Unhook the Velcro, do what you need to do and put the CCF and MLV back where it was. Nothing destroyed in the process. Nothing wasted.


I'm going to ask a dumb question here: maybe not with the CCF, but at least with MLV, isn't the point to make sure the mechanical bond between the MLV and the panel is FIXED, such that the panel is forced to vibrate the extra weight, thereby dampening resonances? Wouldn't hook-and-loop be a weak mechanical bond, relative to the displacements (I dunno, like 0.001") we are talking about? For the CCF you are just floating a barrier in space so mechanical coupling doesn't matter, but am I missing the point of MLV?


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

I always took mlv to be a loose barrier product, literally a wall.


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## Marky (Nov 15, 2011)

94VG30DE said:


> I'm going to ask a dumb question here: maybe not with the CCF, but at least with MLV, isn't the point to make sure the mechanical bond between the MLV and the panel is FIXED, such that the panel is forced to vibrate the extra weight, thereby dampening resonances? Wouldn't hook-and-loop be a weak mechanical bond, relative to the displacements (I dunno, like 0.001") we are talking about? For the CCF you are just floating a barrier in space so mechanical coupling doesn't matter, but am I missing the point of MLV?


You are correct, you want to firmly attach the Dyna-Mat material to the doors and floor or wherever you are installing it. I go ape-**** with the stuff myself. 25% my ear.......I put two layers of it on and I put it EVERYWHERE. Then put CCF over the top, and yes peel and stick. If I have the room I put Jude over the CCF material.
In my doors I used two layers of MLV and two different densities of CCF as well. More dense inside door and softer behind the door panel.
I have a 2006 Ford diesel and you cant hear that engine at all inside my truck. People get all crazy over this or that product. I went with all different products and it made all the difference in the world.
I still smile driving down the road and in pure silence.

Good Luck on the project.


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

CLD is the only material that needs to be actually attached to the vehicle body panels in order for it to work. MLV is simply a sound barrier that works through its density (it is harder for sound waves to travel through denser materials)…it works best by first being isolated from anything that might vibrate against it becuase if soemthing was vibrating directly against it, then the MLV itself would be asource of vibration and noise…decoupling it with CCF assures its effectiveness as a barrier.


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Bayboy said:


> I exclusively use 1/8" neoprene from foam by mail.


They are a good price going by all the things we're looking at. I think I'll order from them in a few different thicknesses. That's 26.7 square feet for ~$21, and free shipping over $75. Good call!

edit: 81 bucks including shipping, got the gym mat in 1/2", Neoprene in 1/4 and 1/8, big ass sheets. Sweet!


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

I like the neoprene due to the fact it has a bit better thermal insulation properties and can help with heating & cooling of the interior. Kind of a 2 for 1 deal. They also offer a regular & high grade option where I normally pick the high grade for a few bucks more. So far I've been pleased with it.


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## 94VG30DE (Nov 28, 2007)

seafish said:


> CLD is the only material that needs to be actually attached to the vehicle body panels in order for it to work. MLV is simply a sound barrier that works through its density (it is harder for sound waves to travel through denser materials)…it works best by first being isolated from anything that might vibrate against it becuase if soemthing was vibrating directly against it, then the MLV itself would be asource of vibration and noise…decoupling it with CCF assures its effectiveness as a barrier.


OK thank you for this explanation, I knew I was missing something. 
\Carryon


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Bayboy said:


> I like the neoprene due to the fact it has a bit better thermal insulation properties and can help with heating & cooling of the interior. Kind of a 2 for 1 deal. They also offer a regular & high grade option where I normally pick the high grade for a few bucks more. So far I've been pleased with it.


I went with normal because I assumed that high grade is simply more aesthetically pleasing. We'll see if I assumed incorrectly.


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## drei4runner (Jan 3, 2017)

Let us know how the Reckhorn is doing for you. I purchased the Noico beforehand and when I was scrolling through Amazon, I came upon Reckhorn afterwards. Wish that I saw that first from all the great reviews I've read. The only down side was the shipping.


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## Dan B (Jun 19, 2009)

fourthmeal said:


> They are a good price going by all the things we're looking at. I think I'll order from them in a few different thicknesses. That's 26.7 square feet for ~$21, and free shipping over $75. Good call!
> 
> edit: 81 bucks including shipping, got the gym mat in 1/2", Neoprene in 1/4 and 1/8, big ass sheets. Sweet!


I have recently used the 1/8" neoprene normal quality from foam by mail. The quality seems nice to me don't really have much to compair it to but it did the job well. I looked all over and I don't think you can find a better deal


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## Dan B (Jun 19, 2009)

Also I order my MLV 1lb/sf from here
https://acousticalsolutions.com/

Nice quality stuff and was a pretty good price. Shipping wasn't bad either I ordered about 80sf and I think it was $30 shipping. Just thought I would throw it out there


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

drei4runner said:


> Let us know how the Reckhorn is doing for you. I purchased the Noico beforehand and when I was scrolling through Amazon, I came upon Reckhorn afterwards. Wish that I saw that first from all the great reviews I've read. The only down side was the shipping.


I definitely will. I'll be comparing it to a top contender, Knu Kolossus. I've got 3 sheets of that left, and was prepping for another order. Decided to be different. I like Don (SDS) products but shipping always gets me. Not his fault, he's excellent for folks on the other side of the states, no doubt. The shipping of the Reckhorn was very reasonable, considering the weight of the product (assuming its what I think it will be.) Gotta wear gloves, else I'll bleed out.
I had this idea, that if this stuff kicks ass, maybe we reach out to Klaus Reck and see if he'd like to get on DIYMA and provide us some top-notch stuff. I've never seen such positive reviews about a product, and Klaus himself answered questions on Amazon directly. Too cool! I just wish they had the stronger stuff available, I'd like to try it.



Dan B said:


> I have recently used the 1/8" neoprene normal quality from foam by mail. The quality seems nice to me don't really have much to compair it to but it did the job well. I looked all over and I don't think you can find a better deal


I would agree. I was doing basic calculations on a per square foot basis, and the foam by mail website was a leader, every time. When I saw the free shipping on $75 and over, I just knew I had to try it. Too bad they don't sell MLV, but that gym mat stuff looks killer, so I thought I'd try it since it will certainly block some sound.



Dan B said:


> Also I order my MLV 1lb/sf from here
> https://acousticalsolutions.com/
> 
> Nice quality stuff and was a pretty good price. Shipping wasn't bad either I ordered about 80sf and I think it was $30 shipping. Just thought I would throw it out there


Excellent!


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

You guys lookign for MLV, don't forget that Trademark Soundproofing sells various weights of high quality MLV always with free shipping on orders over $75.


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## pjhabit (Aug 12, 2008)

Anybody tried using this stuff? -> Uxcell Car Audio Stereo Sound Acoustic Noise Absorbing Dampening Foam 50cmx80cm 
It looks like a super cheap alternative to 3M Thinsulate (even cheaper on ebay).


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

How is it absorbing sound if it's closed cell foam? 

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## Rudeboy (Oct 16, 2005)

Bayboy said:


> How is it absorbing sound if it's closed cell foam?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


Don't think it's foam. Fibrous material with a tufted fabric scrim? Not really sure. One of the features listed: "Strengthen the Body Rigidity". Be surprised if that's right


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

From their marketing description I'm not sure they even know what it should be used for. I'd be especially leery of using it for a hood liner.


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

pjhabit said:


> Anybody tried using this stuff? -> Uxcell Car Audio Stereo Sound Acoustic Noise Absorbing Dampening Foam 50cmx80cm
> It looks like a super cheap alternative to 3M Thinsulate (even cheaper on ebay).


While that product does in fact look intriguing as a potential substitute for what is quite expensive (but also quality tested) 3m Acoustice Thinsulate, there is no telling if it works as advertised. In fact, the seller, Uxcell, has extremely poor reseller ratings on Amazon--

Uxcell Rated 1/5 stars by 20 Consumers - uxcell.com Consumer Reviews at ResellerRatings


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