# seriously conisidering horns



## Chevy454 (Apr 24, 2009)

hey guys im seriously considering buying some horn bodies from eric...can you guys recommend compression drivers to pair with them some of erics bodies that wont break the bank...my second question is will i gain anything by adding super tweeters to a setup with the horns?


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## seedlings (Jul 6, 2015)

I don't have horns, but I have been on the fence for a while. If I were to buy a set of Eric's horns to try out, I would pair them with  these Pyle Pro <--. They are decent, yet budget, and would give a good idea of how I like them. But, then I think about spending a little more and buying  these Seleniums< --.

BTW, don't leave us hanging! If you make a decision one way or the other, report back.

CHAD

*edit: I think these are "the good ones"
http://www.parts-express.com/bc-de250-8-1-polyimide-horn-driver-8-ohm-2-3-bolt--294-605


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## Rusty (Aug 29, 2012)

I've emailed Eric myself, and he had mentioned that there are limitations to the physical size of the compression drivers to use on his horns. I have been gifted a pair of bms 4550s, and according to him, I can not pair these with his mid sized horns. So I could either go with his horns and compression drivers, or find some cheap horns, and make my compression drivers work.


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## SQToyota (May 14, 2015)

I was told, theres a reason the top competitors right now dont use horns. I believe they said because you can never get it the tonality correct. Before dsps were used horns were great. But thats just ehat i was told at a comp.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

Yeah, that's a load of BS.

You can use the 4550s on either the CD2 minihorn body or on the full sized bodies, but they will not fit the CD1e bodies with the reflectors...you would need the 4552s to use those bodies.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

B&C have a DE550 coming out soon.

Those Selenium D220s are good drivers, but they are HUGE.



seedlings said:


> I don't have horns, but I have been on the fence for a while. If I were to buy a set of Eric's horns to try out, I would pair them with  these Pyle Pro <--. They are decent, yet budget, and would give a good idea of how I like them. But, then I think about spending a little more and buying  these Seleniums< --.
> 
> BTW, don't leave us hanging! If you make a decision one way or the other, report back.
> 
> ...


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## Mic10is (Aug 20, 2007)

SQToyota said:


> I was told, theres a reason the top competitors right now dont use horns. I believe they said because you can never get it the tonality correct. Before dsps were used horns were great. But thats just ehat i was told at a comp.


Makes zero freaking sense


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

Yeah, they were great before you could tune them better? Or the other speakers just sucked that bad?


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## cajunner (Apr 13, 2007)

I wish all the people who talk about how horns sound, would have actually listened to horns and have an opinion based on that, instead of listening to someone talk about horns.

I know, it's kind of hypocritical of me to suggest this, since I haven't heard some of the really high priced gear out there and yet maintain an opinion on some of it, but...

if you haven't heard horns in a car, you just don't know.

I mean, Image Dynamics.

isn't that exactly what you get, a strong image and powerful dynamics? How apt a name...

and I know, there are people who have been inside and out of horn circles, like crop circles they maintain a mystique even if we know how they are being made, haha...


but the people who move on from horns are likely never really finished with them, individual tastes may change, but a need for something less imposing in the install usually dictates why people drop their horns for some 3-way fix, or fitment is the reason...

maybe some people just like the stealth of stock speaker locations, or the DSP available makes the compromises of horn installs less attractive...

but unless you've heard some horns properly done, don't assume.


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## oabeieo (Feb 22, 2015)

cajunner said:


> I wish all the people who talk about how horns sound, would have actually listened to horns and have an opinion based on that, instead of listening to someone talk about horns.
> 
> I know, it's kind of hypocritical of me to suggest this, since I haven't heard some of the really high priced gear out there and yet maintain an opinion on some of it, but...
> 
> ...



Here a story. 

I hired a installer he's a noob , I recruited him from the spl circuit. He has won a few local spl sound offs running sundows and what not. Someone in the shop brought up horns. He was talking like he knew exactly what they are and how awful they are. He didn't know I had horns installed. I let him listen to my car , and didn't tell him I had horns. At the time they were mounted under dash . He said that was the best system he's ever heard . We were exiting the car and when I was walking away , I said ." You just heard horns" . 

So a few weeks later he asked where to get some. He just bought one of my sets of de45s on big bodies . 

They just don't know what theresaying.


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## oabeieo (Feb 22, 2015)

Btw OP 
I have 16 diffrent sets of drivers, 8 of those sets are brand new and only used for fun for less than a week. I have selenium , Beyma cd10nd, B&C , bms . 

If you decide what you want lmk I might have a set . I'll sell for much less. If your not in the United States never mind , I won't ship over seas .


Edit: I'm not selling any horn bodies , Eric would be able to help anyone that needs those . I just have a couple compression drivers I would let go of . I apologize, the ones I would let go are cd1ev3 and cd10nd and maybe some 4540s

The Beyma's are brand new they have 2 miles on them . The rest of what I have some needs new diaphragms so I'll hang on to those and the B&Cs I have I'm keeping . Lol


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## Patrick Bateman (Sep 11, 2006)

oabeieo said:


> Here a story.
> 
> I hired a installer he's a noob , I recruited him from the spl circuit. He has won a few local spl sound offs running sundows and what not. Someone in the shop brought up horns. He was talking like he knew exactly what they are and how awful they are. He didn't know I had horns installed. I let him listen to my car , and didn't tell him I had horns. At the time they were mounted under dash . He said that was the best system he's ever heard . We were exiting the car and when I was walking away , I said ." You just heard horns" .
> 
> ...


Here's my story:

I read an interview with Richard Clark in CA&E when I was a teenager. Richard was the first person I came across who was actively fighting against all the audiophile ******** that's so prevalent in the industry. It was refreshing and it got me interested in horns. I built my own horns for about half a decade. All self-taught.

Eventually I listened to a horn car (Harry Kimura's Acura) and it was everything I'd hoped for and more.

The thing is, 75% of my projects didn't work, maybe even 90%. But when it works, it's really special.

That's basically how horns work. They're easy to **** up, but when you get everything dialed in, they're kinda magical.

Having said all that, listening to Gary's car changed my perspective on a lot of things. Basically amps are so cheap and powerful, if you know what your'e doing, you can get very good dynamics with direct radiators without suffering with the drawbacks of compression drivers. That's why you haven't seen a compression driver in any of my projects lately.


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## oabeieo (Feb 22, 2015)

Patrick Bateman said:


> The thing is, 75% of my projects didn't work, maybe even 90%. But when it works, it's really special.
> 
> That's basically how horns work. They're easy to **** up, but when you get everything dialed in, they're kinda magical


Very well said. It's crazy because you know when you get it right. There is NO doubt in your mind whatso ever. There's nothing like hearing all the notes hum together in perfect harmony, with harmonic balance. You can tell when you get it right. And it's so magical. So many times I've forgot to save that one perfect eq setting and kick myself in the butt for not saving it ,lol. And fight for days getting back to the nexus !


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## cajunner (Apr 13, 2007)

Patrick Bateman said:


> Here's my story:
> 
> I read an interview with Richard Clark in CA&E when I was a teenager. Richard was the first person I came across who was actively fighting against all the audiophile ******** that's so prevalent in the industry. It was refreshing and it got me interested in horns. I built my own horns for about half a decade. All self-taught.
> 
> ...


some of your horn explorations have inspired people to also play outside the box on horns, we all should know by now the theoretical advantages of a Synergy horn even if we haven't actually heard Synergy at work...

and I think it's just a lack of focus that prevents us from actually developing a user-friendly horn for above dash, or under dash mounting that covers the frequencies from 300 hz to 20Khz.

the parameters you have specifically pointed out would be consistent with Synergy "in small places" design, are probably just a developer's phone call away.

Like, take an Aura Whisper, add a pleated surround that replaces one of the foam surrounds, make it like Alpine's HAMR form, where you can add some sensitivity and control while the motor still allows that excellent Xmax, some KMS and you've got yourself a Synergy midrange driver that you can double in a small space.

it's not that it's too hard, we have just not attempted to make the transition worthwhile to a manufacturer, who doesn't see a dedicated automotive Synergy horn, to be enough of a primer to produce a specialized driver for it.

Once we have the ideal small format midrange, we can add it to something like the new B&C DE110 or 5 or whatever, and tuck it into a dash pod, or kick panel.

I think it's just a shame that it's taking this long to apply the Synergy horn's positive attributes to the car interior.

I mean, I could make a D2 driver using a 3-D printer and some serious magnetics, I wonder why Permendur isn't used more often because even in headphones, only the uber expensive ones get the best.


I could make that D2 using injected neodymium resin, what would really freak the loan office is that I can do it with a 3-D printer!

anyways, let's keep horns close to the vest, in case we decide to continue down that road of full-spectral content direct sound approach that we know deserves to exist...


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## oabeieo (Feb 22, 2015)

cajunner said:


> some of your horn explorations have inspired people to also play outside the box on horns, we all should know by now the theoretical advantages of a Synergy horn even if we haven't actually heard Synergy at work...
> 
> and I think it's just a lack of focus that prevents us from actually developing a user-friendly horn for above dash, or under dash mounting that covers the frequencies from 300 hz to 20Khz.
> 
> ...


Oh my gosh I would love to see Eric or someone develop a dash mounted horn with pattern control for a dash . Or miniaturize his design for 1/2" throat and make it work on a dash ! I would buy it in a instant


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