# Newbie questions about Ensolite



## jmhinkle (Dec 24, 2009)

I'm going to start sound deadening the doors on my car, but after reading lots of threads I became more confused about proper methods.

I understand the need to put down a layer of the Dynamat (brand only used for example) and a layer of ensolite over it too. My problems starts here though. Chris did a great looking job on the doors and I was prepared to follow suit until I read this blurb from Raammat: "Install a small patch of Ensolite over the area behind the speakers, 8x8" 9x9", etc..

NOTE: DO NOT use more than this, if you add to much it will cause a great reduction in the midbass response and just not sound all that great. We only want to break up the back wave off the speaker and this works just as well as those expensive pads sold for this purpose"

According to them you Ensolite over the door after putting the inner panel back on and sealing the holes or it reduces midbass. Yet, everyone gave Chris kudos on his great door job. Well, which is it? I want to do this right and definitely don't want to lose any midbass as I have none currently from the fronts.

Please straighten me out on this whole ensolite installation portion of sound deadening.

Thanks to those that have helped me already and hooked me up with a few deals to get my system started.


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## Mooble (Oct 21, 2007)

Why are you using the Ensolite? Answer me that and I can guide you. 

Ensolite only reduces noise by reducing vibration. You put it between the door card and the door frame to prevent those annoying squeaks and rattles. Ensolite does absolutely nothing to block sound from getting into your car. There is no point to putting it on the outer door skin, unless you are using it to decouple a barrier on top of the deadener. 

You want something behind your woofer other than a flat surface otherwise some of the waves will bounce directly back against the back of the cone. You will see several products designed to sit behind the woofer and disperse the sound waves; things like Deflex pads. I doubt a 1/8" sheet of Ensolite is going to do squat to stop back waves, but it wouldn't hurt. Put some behind the woofer. 

It's nonsense to say that you can seal off the door too well. Seal up all the holes in the door (but not the rain holes on the bottom), and use a thin layer of Ensolite behind the door card. Don't worry about it reducing your midbass in any way. Remember that Ensolite doesn't block sound so there's no way it will reduce any sound. It just stops rattles.

This is how I use it: 1) well deadened door, 2) 1" layer Volara foam (similar to Ensolite), 3) barrier layer (decoupled from the door by the Volara foam. There is some debate about the decoupling, but I find that it works. The idea is to trap soundwaves between the outer door skin and the barrier so they can be dissipated in the foam as they bounce back and forth. Without that barrier though, the foam would be virtually useless. Maybe if you used 18" of it, you would start to block some sound, but let's be real.


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## jmhinkle (Dec 24, 2009)

Wait, so now ensolite doesn't block sound either? That is absolutely backwards from everything I've read on every manufacturers website. Every thing I have read says the closed cell foams absorb a great deal of sound which is why they work so well to block wind and road noise transmission from passing through. Nothing about vibration is mentioned. The sound absorbing properties also explain why you wouldn't want it inside your door, but in between the door and inner panel would be ideal.

As far as my use, I was going to use ensolite (or similiar product) as a the top layer of sound deadening. Lay down a few layers of the sticky mat stuff and then cover with ensolite to stop road and wind noise from passing through surfaces. Is that not right?


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

Ensolite doesn't do **** to block sound. 

It works pretty good to prevent the door panel plastic from vibrating against the metal door, or between something like MLV and the floor, but that's about it. Anyone that tells you thin foam blocks wind noise, road noise or anything like that is full of ****.

Thanks to Don and Foxpro, all this crazy voodoo about foam and ass loads of deadener is no longer believed by many of us.


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## jets88 (May 12, 2008)

You're probably confusing MLV (Mass Loaded Vinyl) for ensolite. I can't imagine ensolite stopping much sound by itself. Try covering a speaker with it and see how much sound it stops. Then try covering a speaker with MLV and see if there's a difference. IMO ensolites only good for decoupling MLV and getting rid of rattles. I guess it will also block reflections to an extent. Check out this site, it describes the proper way to sound deaden your car. http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi


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## t3sn4f2 (Jan 3, 2007)

jets88 said:


> You're probably confusing MLV (Mass Loaded Vinyl) for ensolite. I can't imagine ensolite stopping much sound by itself. Try covering a speaker with it and see how much sound it stops. Then try covering a speaker with MLV and see if there's a difference. IMO ensolites only good for decoupling MLV and getting rid of rattles. I guess it will also block reflections to an extent. Check out this site, it describes the proper way to sound deaden your car. http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi


Thar she blows.......


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## jmhinkle (Dec 24, 2009)

t3sn4f2 said:


> Thar she blows.......


?^? I really need all the help I can get. Something wrong with that site? I was all set to buy eDead products (actually I coated my trunk with their paint on stuff,) but this site seems to be highly opposed to their products so I'm rethinking what I use. I'm looking for better alternatives that won't break the bank and obviously confused myself greatly up to this point.


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## jmhinkle (Dec 24, 2009)

jets88 said:


> You're probably confusing MLV (Mass Loaded Vinyl) for ensolite. I can't imagine ensolite stopping much sound by itself. Try covering a speaker with it and see how much sound it stops. Then try covering a speaker with MLV and see if there's a difference. IMO ensolites only good for decoupling MLV and getting rid of rattles. I guess it will also block reflections to an extent. Check out this site, it describes the proper way to sound deaden your car. http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi


I think that I was thinking ensolite was a combination of the two since it appears you need both. I also think that is what the first reply was trying to say, but he made ensolite sound completely useless.


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## angelspeedfreak (Oct 5, 2009)

I really wish I could help you out (since we live in the same town), but I am in the same boat as you. I need to deaden everything and am at a loss as to what you use where..... If you find something that works for you please let me know...


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## jmhinkle (Dec 24, 2009)

Definitely. I probably won't start until I get home in March since I'm living in Portland for work at the moment. By then I should have things figured out maybe you can check it out and lend a hand too. See if you like the stuff I use for your install and what-not.


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## Mooble (Oct 21, 2007)

jmhinkle said:


> I think that I was thinking ensolite was a combination of the two since it appears you need both. I also think that is what the first reply was trying to say, but he made ensolite sound completely useless.


It has it's uses, but blocking sound ain't one of them. As far as the door card, I'd rather use 3/8" cotton batting anyway because that DOES absorb sound and it also stops rattles in the process. Most people don't have enough room for that though, so 1/8" Ensolite will work.

Like someone said, put the Ensolite over a speaker and see how much sound it blocks. It might block the highest frequencies, but it'll do nothing for low frequencies. 

Quieting a car is not an easy task. It requires many, many steps and layers. I've spent close to 100 hours just quieting my car. I noticed some benefit from using foam, but I was using 1" of it, not the wimpy 1/8" stuff. It's not worth it though. Foam gets to be expensive when you starting using 1" sheets. That money would be 10x better spent on MLV (or lead) and cotton batting. Foam works best as a decoupler.

Finally, not to discourage you, but you can't do anything about the next biggest source of noise, the windows. Unless you drive a very expensive car with double pane windows, you're limited in how quiet your car will ever get.

I've learned a lot from my trials and errors. I can promise you that my next car will be one of the quietest on the road, but it's no easy task.


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## jmhinkle (Dec 24, 2009)

Yeah, I've had a few Lexus' and the windows of my GS and SC were far quieter than my Speed6 and I don't believe either of those were even double pane. The windows in the Speed6 are some of the noisiest I've ever experienced in all the cars I've had including my Renault. I think I understand the whole layering thing now, just have to try to figure out what to use for each layer. Seems like there is a lot of agenda when it comes to the sound deadening issue and I'm having trouble finding agenda free info on the different stuff. Thanks for all the help so far guys.


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## t3sn4f2 (Jan 3, 2007)

jmhinkle said:


> ?^? I really need all the help I can get. *Something wrong with that site? *I was all set to buy eDead products (actually I coated my trunk with their paint on stuff,) but this site seems to be highly opposed to their products so I'm rethinking what I use. I'm looking for better alternatives that won't break the bank and obviously confused myself greatly up to this point.


No, not all. What I wrote was a line from the book Moby Dick, pointing out the whale. IOW, _there it is, thats the site you want to read._


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