# When will HDMI be integrated into Car Audio?



## Thumper26 (Sep 23, 2005)

I was thinking about it, and with the majority of smartphones now having miniHDMI out, or at least MHL adapters, when will we start seeing hdmi inputs on radios?

Also, who will be the first to have radios with hdmi out and amps with hdmi input? Any external hdmi converter runs on 5v, they can put the DAC on the amp, and have full digital signal in a very easy, universal plug.

If this discussion has already taken place, then ignore me. I didn't search, I just got excited the more that I thought about it.


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## Thumper26 (Sep 23, 2005)

Just to add something else to the discussion, would HDMI be a better signal choice than balanced setups like what Zapco offers now?


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## Angrywhopper (Jan 20, 2010)

Pioneer AppRadio2 has HDMI


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## Thumper26 (Sep 23, 2005)

Hah well then touche. Now just waiting on amps


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## kaigoss69 (Apr 2, 2008)

What advantage does HDMI have over Toslink, purely for audio?


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## nirschl (Apr 30, 2009)

Angrywhopper said:


> Pioneer AppRadio2 has HDMI


Beat me to it. I've got the new Japan version installed. Also, has HDMI. 


Cheers


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## t3sn4f2 (Jan 3, 2007)

When? When HDMI becomes the standard that audio over USB is now.


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## myhikingboots (Oct 28, 2010)

With HDMI replacing RCA, Component, and Toslinks in the HT world seems to make sense to have one cable that can do it all.


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## rgiorgio (Nov 21, 2012)

Why?

HDMI 1.4 is for audio + video. Video in motion is illegal. No market for video HDMI in car audio.


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## brianhj (Apr 9, 2009)

Why do you want HDMI in the car??

You want your amps to have DACs? That would be dumb. All the processing should be done in the headunit.


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## nirschl (Apr 30, 2009)

My personal reasons are video related. Rear monitor for the kids.  


Cheers


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## fisc2307 (Oct 29, 2011)

HDMI will never make an appearance for mainstream audio. HDMI as people have said is for video + audio and HDMI is a standard for video really. Additionally there is no reason to use HDMI on current HU that only dont even come close to 720 or 1080p. You have much better options for audio right now which exist as quality RCA, optical, and such. Also as other people have it is illegal to use video application whole driving. I work in automotive connectors and the only applications for high rate transfer devices right now are agricultural equipment and for consumer products rear view cameras and the like.


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## trumpet (Nov 14, 2010)

CES: Clarion Offers HDMI in Head Units | ceoutlook.com


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## jowens500 (Sep 5, 2008)

Sony has one too. It's for mirror link on android phones.


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## rgiorgio (Nov 21, 2012)

Thats a valid reason if anyone has traveled with kids.

HDMI was created to carry the highest level of video quality when HD first came out along with DVI. HDMI was finally adopted as the format because of its ability to transmit both HD video and HD audio. One cable for both. DVI could not match that. 

Nothing in car audio/video is of the caliber as say a 1080p or 4k LED televisions.

Just overkill, the standard video out rca is good enough for the market thats out there.

Im with you, if you can make it better, why not? Economics of the current car audio industry and the consumer wants prevent it.


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## Darth SQ (Sep 17, 2010)

Not so fast gentlemen.
Sony's working on putting out a double din blu-ray unit.
And yes, it does have HDMI.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZ3_qUENwNs


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## Thumper26 (Sep 23, 2005)

My thoughts weren't for the video, but rather as an inexpensive, simple way for digital audio connectivity. You could use the free pins from the video to transmit analog volume controls, assuming the dac is on the amp. In the end, I still think optical is just as good, and would love to be able to daisy chain optical cables to the amps


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## fuzzysig (Feb 4, 2010)

HDMI 1.4 has an audio bandwidth of 36.86Mbit.
TOSLINK has a bandwidth of 125Mbit.
toslink bandwidth is limited by the send/receive units /decoder/encoder.
but its easy to brake.


USB2 bandwidth effective throughput up to 35 MB/s or 280 Mbit/s
usb3 bandwidth 3.2 Gbit/s (0.4 GB/s or 400 MB/s), 
USB group reveals plans to update USB 3 to 10Gb/s


all 3 are digital data transmissions.

but as you can see USB is far ahead in data transmission speeds.

problem is
USB is a data device, not media transport. even though its digital its encoded by different standards.

but hdmi would be like running 6 cables and only using 2 of them. you only use the audio part of HDMI the rest is not used.
if there was a universal interface between head unit and audio processor and amplifier it would make life so much easier.
but its like with everything else. car audio is the last one to catch up. they always play chicken and release the features too late.

u want HDMI get a car PC.

2 years ago u thought u got the latest indash with all the bells and whistles
now you bought another one because it has the latest features that your 2 year old model didnt have.
2 years later you will have to buy another one to stay up to date.
if you re buying a mid grade or top model
you have spend from 3-6 grand in last 6 years 

car PC will cost you less than half of that and to keep up to date is just a driver or a codec download.
same goes for home theater. 
i bought 3 dvd players and 1 blue ray player and 3 digital media players
almost bought another blue ray player .
then built myself an HTPC and never had to buy another piece of (****) hardware to keep up to date since


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

nirschl said:


> Beat me to it. I've got the new Japan version [Pioneer AppRadio 2] installed. Also, has HDMI.
> 
> 
> Cheers


Cool. Do you have the model number or Link to this JDM Appradio2?

Does it have a CD/DVD transport?

Does the Android ARliberator app work with this model as well? 

TIA

Billy B.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

Pioneer AppRadio2










Preface:

I really like the OEM integration of my newer cars A LOT...voice activated handsfree BT calling & audio streaming, steering wheel controls, backup camera, iPod/iPhone, USB Thumbdrive (MP3, AAC & WAV), etc. It all "just works" very well, ya know?

Unfortunately, the SQ of the outputs of the OEM HU in my newest vehicle is absolute shiet. I'm looking into bypassing the EQ/Loudness curve that it's applying by replacing the preamp output stage, or just deriving an S/PDIF coax or optical signal upstream from the EQ/Processing that it's doing. Not easy. And IIRC, the Bluetooth Audio is routed separately.

Okay...

So, I might try the Pioneer AppRadio2 combined with my Galaxy Note phablet and the ARliberator app. The only thing I would really lose compared to my OEM HU is the built-in CD transport, but I have a portable Sony Discman with 3.5mm optical Toslink output for those rare instances when I need to spin a disc.

Note: I am running mostly Toslink digital optical sources into the various processors in my different vehicles.

Check out the YouTube video below that features an install with the Pioneer AppRadio2, a Samsung Galaxy S III smartphone, and the "ARliberator" Android app ($24.95). You can search for others as well to see some of the "bugs" mentioned below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJW4...yer]Pioneer Appradio2 & ARLiberator - YouTube


The ARliberator app was developed by an independent Android developer. ARliberator = App Radio Liberator. This app allows you to completely mirror everything on your smartphone's display and control it using the DD's touchscreen. Pioneer's OE app Does Not allow this. It only allows their pre-selected, proprietary apps to run on the AppRadio...and they're mostly crap apps.

With the ARliberator app, anything that I can do on/with my smartphone can be done through the AppRadio's touchscreen!  When you first turn on the AppRadio2, there is the usual warning Pop-Up about operating the unit while driving, etc. At the moment this cannot be bypassed, but after that you don't have any more Pop-up Warnings to tap, because you are no longer using the built-in AppRadio2's software, you are simply "mirroring" the display of your smartphone onto the Pioneer's touchscreen.

Without the ARliberator app, this HU is an absolute FAIL!!! The built-in apps are limited for starters, and only what Pioneer wants you to use (again, mostly crap apps). And there is a Pop-Up warning just about EVERY TIME you press anything on the touchscreen (for instance, switching from AM/FM radio to any of the built-in apps or back-and-forth between other built-in functions). Besides having to tap/touch "OK" or "Allow" on the HU itself, you also have to do this multiple times on the smartphone's display. FAIL!

It's the same when using an iDevice...Pop-Up Warnings everywhere! However, the actual iDevice control/integration is very good once you get past the warnings. Note that the ARliberator app only works on Android devices. Supposedly there is an independent iOS app available, but AFAIK it doesn't come close to offering the capabilities of the ARliberator app.

Pioneer touts the AppRadio2 as a "safe way to integrate your smartphone into your ICE system", haha. It is the exact opposite. Read the reviews on Amazon, etc.

Of course, you will also need a parking brake bypass. But they made it even more of a nightmare with this unit. It is a 2-stage bypass sequence. First, you have to Turn On the AppRadio2. Then, only after it is powered on, you have to apply the parking brake twice...off/on/off/on, and THEN tap the warning screen. Luckily there are already pre-made "microchip" bypasses for this unit on Amazon for $20.


++++ What the ARliberator App does for the Pioneer AppRadio2 ++++


With your Android smartphone and the ARliberator app, you circumvent 95% of the nightmarish problems above!


BUT...Here is what you would need for all of this to work:

1. AppRadio2, #SPH-DA100 (NOTE: The Original AppRadio will NOT work with this setup!) ~$350-$500 online.
2. Android Smartphone with a mini-HDMI or microUSB/MHL charging port.
3. microUSB/MHL-to-HDMI Adapter (5-pin OR 11-pin depending on smartphone or tablet model). $10-$30.
4. standard HDMI cable of an appropriate length for your install.
5. Cigarette Lighter phone charger with USB-to-microUSB cable.
6. ARliberator app (was $30, now $25 from Google Play Store).
7. Steering Wheel Control Interface if you want to keep this functionality
8. Optional: "Tasker", "Launchers" and/or other Android apps if you want to modify/customize your smartphone User Interface.
9. Optional: HDMI-to-Digital Toslink Switch/Converter (~$50 at Monoprice) if you want a Digital output. Otherwise use the AppRadio 2's RCA pre-outs.


So the AppRadio 2 uses HDMI to obtain the digital audio signal and Mirror the display from your smartphone. It also uses BlueTooth to transfer the HU's Touchscreen input to the smartphone, and for Handsfree BT calling. The specific connection sequence of Power On, BT, and HDMI to the AppRadio2 is very important, and most people are using the Android "Tasker" app to automate this connection process to eliminate multiple touchscreen presses. Warning: the "Tasker" app is very powerful, but it's quite complicated and there is a steep learning curve to set it up. The video makes this look like it's super easy but there is a lot going on behind the scenes.

The average Joe would just use the AppRadio 2's speaker outputs hooked up to their basic system/OEM speakers, or maybe the analog RCA Pre-outs if they are running amplifiers. The difference with my setup (if I decide to go this route...but not likely) is that I would use my HDMI switcher/digital converter BETWEEN my smartphone and the HU (via two standard HDMI cables) to obtain a Digital Toslink output from my Galaxy Note smartphone. This will work because my HDMI switcher/digital converter has HDMI pass-through. It's one of the cheap Monoprice 4-Port HDMI switchers.

I would probably have to use the HU's RCA line outputs to get the AppRadio's AM/FM tuner output into the 3Sixty.3, DEQ-P9, or XDP-4000X via a separate analog RCA input, but all other audio signal should go over the Toslink to the processors. However, my International model Galaxy Note smartphone actually has a built-in FM tuner with RDS, so switching inputs would be rare. 

And, before you ask, I'm one of the few crazy one's left that does not like to stream AM/FM radio stations via the TuneIn Radio app using my smartphone's mobile data connection. I prefer a standard AM/FM tuner to keep up to date with the outside world and for emergency or traffic information.

Anyway, the AppRadio2+ARliberator setup would allow me to keep in-dash touchscreen control, AM/FM radio, backup/rearview camera, and most of my steering wheel controls. However, I believe that initializing the voice-activated handsfree BT calling would now be through the Galaxy Note's voice dialing commands, which work awesome as well.

Obviously, this implementation is very complicated and not anywhere near perfect, but it's another option to look into. And I haven't found a DD NAV HU with a digital output that I like better than the "all-in-one" functionality of my modern smartphone.

Side Note: Crutchfield is carrying a new SWC interface that allows you to program a third function for each Steering Wheel Control button by using a "long press". Check out the "iDatalink Maestro ADS-MSW".

And to finish up (Whew! Sorry!), this is why several other manufacturers such as Sony and Clarion are also coming out with DD Touchscreen head units that have HDMI inputs/outputs. 99% of the Android OS smartphones and tablets have HDMI-capable ports in order to mirror the device's display onto an HDTV or computer monitor. i.e. to play your Netflix, YouTube, Angry Birds, or other video games from your smartphone on a larger monitor. Pioneer started it with the "AppRadio" and I think you'll see more and more of this.

If you've read this far you're a masochist, lol.

Further reading on HDMI:










HDMI FAQ: Comprehensive Cable.com- Learning Center » Blog Archive » HDMI Cables: What You Need to Know


IMPORTANT: I forgot to mention that in order to use the ARliberator app, your Android device Must be ROOTED. I'm pretty sure this was mentioned in the video I linked to.


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## nirschl (Apr 30, 2009)

bbfoto said:


> Cool. Do you have the model number or Link to this JDM Appradio?
> 
> Does it have a CD/DVD transport?
> 
> ...


Here you are:

??????? SPH-DA09 SPH-DA05 | ?????????? | carrozzeria

DVD/CD and a digital tv tuner! Not illegal here to watch video while driving. Dumb of course, but not illegal. 

I have full control over my iPhone or IPad(pointless i realize, but i had to try)with this unit. Now I also have a jailbroken iPhone. I've got Hulu running which is a big plus for me when on the rode. 

I'm quite sure it'd have no problem running the android app as its made here to interface with both smartphones. 

This replaced my oem navi/DVD unit which died. All my audio runs through my DEH-P01 and Arc amps. 

I'm finding it to be very usefull.  YMMV

Cheers


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

Thanks nirschl!

That is great news! I was hoping that they would announce a U.S. update to the AppRadio2 here at CES, but no such luck.  I'm happy that it is at least available in Japan. Enjoy.


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## RNBRAD (Oct 30, 2012)

Someone would have to make the leap and add a DAC to their amps or have a devoted line of equipment to this. Not sure how feasible but they need to do it to stay ahead or compete technologically. I know HK/JBL has offerings in higher end cars that are fully digital with dac's and DSP's in their amps. The technology such as Auravox, I'm not sure anything aftermarket can even compete with this type of new technology. As this technology becomes standard, aftermarket will be substandard in performance and compared to this it really is, maybe for all but the highly skilled. It's all in the tuning and this is the pinnacle. 

Harman Kardon Innovation - AuraVox


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## takeabao (Jul 18, 2005)

Already here.
Been using it to connect my Droid Razr Maxx (HDMI-micro) to my AppRadio 2 for quite some time w/ the ARLiberator Android app. I have an external DSP for the processsing.

Sounds great. 
If you're in the Bay Area and want a demo, just PM me.


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## MarkZ (Dec 5, 2005)

brianhj said:


> Why do you want HDMI in the car??
> 
> You want your amps to have DACs? That would be dumb. All the processing should be done in the headunit.




You can still do the processing in the HU (or external processor) _and_ put the DAC in the amp.


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## Thumper26 (Sep 23, 2005)

MarkZ said:


> You can still do the processing in the HU (or external processor) _and_ put the DAC in the amp.


That's my thinking. A standalone dac is cheap. I would think this would be easy, even if the dac was external to the amp.


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## MarkZ (Dec 5, 2005)

2ch DAC units are all over the place. The trick is finding multichannel ones.

That's what they'd have to figure out how to do in an amp. If you have several amps, you'd need several digital interfaces, and the HUs may not support that.

The ideal solution is one multichannel amp with a single digital interface, but we all know that most of us use multiple amps.


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## RenoAutoSound (Feb 10, 2011)

Will the pioneer hdmi work with an android tablet for just a/v in?


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## takeabao (Jul 18, 2005)

RenoAutoSound said:


> Will the pioneer hdmi work with an android tablet for just a/v in?


For the ARLiberator functionality, you need an Android device running version 3.0 or higher. You can either use HDMI if your device has it OR an MHL adapter (google it).


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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

Pioneer has a couple of HDMI head units outside of the AppRadio HU . Seems to be the connection for the Droid phones. 

AVIC-Z150BH 
AVIC-X950BH
AVH-X8500BHS
CD-AH200C Android connectivity kit to connect a compatible Android


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## D-Bass (Apr 27, 2012)

i know this is a little off topic, but the newer honda odyssey are offered with HDMI input in the rear to feed to the top end rear entertainment system, i think just in the touring model. The model below that just has rca, maybe the EX-L?


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

evo9 said:


> Pioneer has a couple of HDMI head units outside of the AppRadio HU . Seems to be the connection for the Droid phones.
> 
> AVIC-Z150BH
> AVIC-X950BH
> ...


Yes, thank you! I meant to mention that in my giant post but forgot.

If you already have one of these units and want to also use your Android phone that's fine, but you would be wasting money on the above units because you are paying extra (compared to the AppRadio2) for features that will be mostly duplicated by your Android smartphone. This doesn't apply if you want to gain CD or DVD disc functionality by using one of the head units listed above.

Also, the $80-$100 CD-AH200C "Android Connectivity Kit" is basically a combination of a $15 MHL-to-HDMI adapter and a $5 5V USB Cigarette Lighter charger. However, it is nice in that you can hard-wire it to 12v and hide it in your dash.

If you have a Samsung Galaxy SIII or Galaxy Note II, you will also need the Samsung 5-pin to 11-pin microUSB/MHL adapter. 

HDTV Adapter TIP (5 to 11 Pin Converter)

There are generic adapters available on Amazon as well.

nirschl, if the SPH-DA09 had a region 1 DVD player, English menu, and U.S. AM/FM tuner I would order one today. Looks like I could get one for $512 USD + Shipping. Hopefully, Pioneer will decide to release this unit in the U.S., as I wouldn't mind having a CD/DVD player built-in. Otherwise, the U.S. AppRadio2 (SPH-DA100) had everything I'd need.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

RenoAutoSound said:


> Will the pioneer hdmi work with an android tablet for just a/v in?





takeabao said:


> For the ARLiberator functionality, you need an Android device running version 3.0 or higher. You can either use HDMI if your device has it OR an MHL adapter (google it).



Your Tablet or Phone must also be ROOTED in order to use the ARliberator app!

And I believe that your Android Tablet would also have to have Bluetooth if you want the TouchScreen on the AppRadio2 to control the functions of the tablet.

You might also want the "Screen Standby [ROOT]" app that is mentioned in the video I posted so that the Tablet's or Smartphone's screen will turn off when you are connected to the AppRadio2. This saves your battery and prevents screen burn-in. 

You could use the "Tasker" app to automatically do this when your phone or tablet connects to the particular BT profile of your AppRadio2. Initially, the "Screen Standby [ROOT]" app was designed for Android devices that have LCD/TFT screens that use a Backlight (the app just turns off the backlight). I think the app has been modified to also work with AMOLED displays (most Samsung devices). This is necessary because AMOLED displays do not have a Backlight. Instead, the actual pixels that make up the screen "light up" (they are LEDs after all), so simply turning off the "backlight" does not work. I believe it sends instructions to the GPU to display all pixels as "Black", which basically means no power or color information is being sent to any of the individual pixels in the display, so it stays "off".

P.S. Your device must also be ROOTED to use the "Tasker" app.

Hope this helps.


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## takeabao (Jul 18, 2005)

^^

Yes, I forgot to mention the need for ROOT access since... well, all my phones are ROOT'ed/running non-stock ROM's.


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## RenoAutoSound (Feb 10, 2011)

I really don't think I care if the stereo controls the tablet because it will be mounted above it. My Asus tablet has a mini hdmi out and with a mini hdmi to hdmi adapter can I just plug it in to get the a/v to the headunit and then let that distribute video to the other monitors?


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## takeabao (Jul 18, 2005)

RenoAutoSound said:


> I really don't think I care if the stereo controls the tablet because it will be mounted above it. My Asus tablet has a mini hdmi out and with a mini hdmi to hdmi adapter can I just plug it in to get the a/v to the headunit and then let that distribute video to the other monitors?


The AppRadio 2 has no video-outputs.


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## RenoAutoSound (Feb 10, 2011)

What about with the x8500?


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## takeabao (Jul 18, 2005)

RenoAutoSound said:


> What about with the x8500?


If you're the *manager* (so says your profile to the left) of a car audio shop ("Reno AutoSound"), I _highly suggest_ you take some time to *read* the Pioneer website (at the very least) and educate yourself on the products you [might be] selling. Jus' sayin'.

AVH-X8500BHS - <b>NEW!</b> -2-DIN Multimedia DVD Receiver with 7” WVGA Touchscreen Display, MIXTRAX, Bluetooth®, HD Radio™ Tuner, SiriusXM Ready, and AppRadio Mode for iPhone® and Select Android™ Devices | Pioneer El

Yes, the 8500 unit has 1 external composite output.


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## RenoAutoSound (Feb 10, 2011)

I have read it, I have asked the pioneer reps, I have emailed the tech support not one person not one person has been able to tell me that I can use the HDMI in for my tablet. I know the 8500 has video outputs I'm just looking for an answer here since pioneer can't answer my questions.


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## joms (Mar 10, 2005)

Let me revive this thread.

I'm also interested on a Head unit that has an HDMI input so that I can plug in a Micca HD player and watch from the Head Unit's display. I tried the RCA route before but the video was not as clear. Micca can send HD video and DTS Audio signal via HDMI and I want a Head unit that can handle it. 

Does anyone know of a head unit that can do this function? I am not interested in Iphone apps and such. 

Thanks

Micca Speck:


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

joms said:


> Let me revive this thread.
> 
> I'm also interested on a Head unit that has an HDMI input so that I can plug in a Micca HD player and watch from the Head Unit's display. I tried the RCA route before but the video was not as clear. Micca can send HD video and DTS Audio signal via HDMI and I want a Head unit that can handle it.
> 
> ...


The following Pioneer brand units have HDMI inputs that would allow you to watch video on the DD screen, and listen to 2-CHANNEL STEREO via the head unit:

AppRadio2 #SPH-DA100
AVIC-Z150BH
AVIC-X950BH
AVH-X8500BHS

There are also some Clarion & Sony units mentioned above as well.

AFAIK, few if any of these units can process or playback multichannel surround sound, but I haven't thoroughly researched this so I may be wrong. The AppRadio2 just has Stereo Front & Rear, or Front & Subwoofer RCA outputs.

Also, most of the screens in these DD head units are LOW RESOLUTION, so they look the same as the standard RCA composite video signal that you have used previously. For instance, the AppRadio2 that I used was 800x480. Full HD is 1920x1080. I'm not sure about the resolution and display quality of the others, so that is something you should research.

Too bad the Alpine PXA-H800 doesn't have an HDMI input.  But, it does have an Optical Toslink input, and you could use this adapter that extracts a Digital Optical Toslink signal from the HDMI cable so that you could send multichannel surround sound signal to the H800 processor. This adapter also has an HDMI pass-through so you can send the video (and audio) to the DD head unit's display.

ViewHD Premium HDMI to HDMI + Audio (sPDIF + RAC L/R) Audio Extractor | Converter (New 2013 Model):Amazon:Electronics

It will also extract digital audio from some Android devices that have an HDMI output or an MHL-enabled microUSB port (most of the newer Samsung Galaxy S and Note phones & tablets).

So I would probably forgo the DD head unit and Micca HD unit altogether, and instead buy an Android tablet such as the new Galaxy Note 8.0 along with the Samsung Car Dock/Mount. Then use the above adapter + the Samsung 11-pin microUSB/MHL HDMI adapter to extract digital Toslink and/or analog RCA audio. 

The Note 8.0 has a decent 8" touchscreen (better than iPad Mini) and the Samsung audio & video players support almost every audio & video Codec under the sun. MX Player is also very nice Android app for video playback.

You can put a 64GB MicroSD card in the Galaxy Note 8.0 for video & audio file storage (it has 16GB built-in and they say a 32GB version will also be released). By using this or a similar Tablet, you could have a great Video & Audio Player complete with GPS/Google NAV, and many other great features in your car. But at the same time you will also have a fully-functioning Android Tablet that you can take with you everywhere...the kids can continue to watch their movie once you arrive at your destination, you can check your email or browse the web, or post on the DIYMA forums, etc. 

The Galaxy Note 8.0 is currently $399 at Best Buy and you get a free 50GB DropBox cloud storage account (2 years free) and a $25 Google Play Store credit for apps/music/books/movies, etc.

Here's a link to a video review of the Note 8.0: 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgFDgV0Lz50&feature=youtube_gdata_player


Also search YouTube for the other Note 8.0 reviews by "MobileTech Review", "Phone Arena", and "Phone Dog".

If you add the optional $50-$80 Samsung Multimedia "Smart" Dock (made for the Galaxy Note II) you have an HDMI output, a 3.5mm stereo audio Jack, 3 USB ports that support Thumbdrives, a HDD or SSD, a mouse, a keyboard (or wireless mouse & keyboard via USB dongle), a PS3 USB Controller, and a select group of USB DACs!!! Links:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009QW3TBK

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hy3wETf5o0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

There is a coupon code on the Internet for 50% OFF of the Smart Dock direct from Samsung.

Depending on which car you have, you could attach the JoyCon EXR interface to a USB port on the Smart Dock and have fully programmable Steering Wheel Controls for the Note 8.0 tablet! Link:

http://www.rcjoycon.com/base_3/menu_10.php?com_board_basic=read_form&menu=10&com_board_idx=14

I am using the setup I described above in my car with a Samsung Galaxy Note II (GT-N7100) and it works amazingly well.  But I am waiting for the release of the International 3G/Phone version of the Galaxy Note 8.0 (GT-N5100) in order to have a larger display and keep the 3G data/and phone functionality for Google Maps/NAV and an "all-in-one" device. 

We only have the WiFi version available in the United States at the moment, but there are some reputable importers such as Negri Electronics and Expansys USA that are importing the 3G/Phone version (albeit at a premium price). It is suppossed to be available by mid-May.

I just realized that you are in Manila, but the Note 8.0 should be released there soon, if it isn't already.


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## t3sn4f2 (Jan 3, 2007)

bbfoto said:


> Also, most of the screens in these DD head units are LOW RESOLUTION, so they look the same as the standard RCA composite video signal that you have used previously. For instance, the AppRadio2 that I used was 800x480. Full HD is 1920x1080. I'm not sure about the resolution and display quality of the others, so that is something you should research.


xxxx2


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## trumpet (Nov 14, 2010)

Decoding protected video content over HDMI is not supported by Clarion products at this time. I can't confirm this about Pioneer products.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

^Good to know! Thanks!


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## D-Bass (Apr 27, 2012)

we've got a nice & interesting project coming up using a pioneer's HDMI input. We're just waiting on some of the OTHER components to come in before we start on the vehicle. They Mille's & Voce sub should be here sometime next week. Hopefully within the month it'll be finished.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

D-Bass said:


> we've got a nice & interesting project coming up using a pioneer's HDMI input. We're just waiting on some of the OTHER components to come in before we start on the vehicle. They Mille's & Voce sub should be here sometime next week. Hopefully within the month it'll be finished.


Cool. Keep us posted/start a build log. Which Pioneer unit will you be using?


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## D-Bass (Apr 27, 2012)

bbfoto said:


> Cool. Keep us posted/start a build log. Which Pioneer unit will you be using?


it will use the AVHX8500BHS, some HDMI, some Toslink, some other cool gadgets. There will definitely be a build log.


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## santiagodraco (Feb 9, 2012)

Just saw this, interesting timing.

I'm working on my "first" install (starting from scratch from an aborted paid install, doing all the work myself now). Anyway just a peek at what I'm testing at the moment (this is going into an Infiniti FX50 which while not HD has a mid-resolution screen, I believe it's 800x600 or so, will confirm one day).

This is not an ideal setup, as others have stated, using composite video is not great, however it's not bad, is legible and the sound quality compared to say bluetooth (from the same device mind you) is amazing.

Don't get me wrong, there are challenges. Control is one. This is why I'm cautiously excited about the Samsung Homesync (I posted about this on another thread) which will extend full device control to another Samsung handheld). But for now....

Here's a couple of teaser shots of the new build. I'll be posting a semi-full build log soon:

My Android "mini-PC" prototype install:










And the install itself (a really crappy low light work in progress shot ;D):


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

Looks awesome, santiagodraco! I'm interested in the Samsung Homesync, too. It's amazing how tiny the Android "candy bar " computers are.

I decided to go the tablet route just because it has a great screen, and I can take this device with me and use it as a standalone tablet as well, saving the extra expense of purchasing both a tablet AND a head unit. It's portability also makes it easy to manage my media library, and my "head unit" is entirely removable to deter theft. The only advantage of my 5.5" Samsung Galaxy Note II over the Note 8.0 is that it has a built-in hardware FM Tuner.

Also, the Note II sounds phenomenal connected to the Samsung HS3000 BT Stereo Headset Adapter (both devices are Bluetooth APT-X compatible) even driving my Grado PS500 headphones directly w/o a separate headphone amp! I honestly can't tell the difference between the APT-X BT connection and a direct hardwired connection, even on FLAC files from audiophile labels like Chesky, EMI, Telarc, and AudioQuest, etc. But I can't hear much above 15kHz...was a drummer for too long and trashed my ears.

I might try to use the RM-X90 Rotary Encoder/Remote from a Sony CDX-C90 head unit connected to the USB JoyCon interface instead of/or hopefully in addition to the Steering Wheel Controls. I have the CDX-C90 and Rotary Remote in my other car and it's very easy to control the major functions of the HU just by feel/tactile touch...no need to take my eyes from the road to press a touchscreen.










I'll look for your build log soon! I'll be putting one together as well for my newest install, but want to wait until it's complete ('Bing'nam-Style) before posting it. And that might be a while. 

Good luck with your setup.


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## santiagodraco (Feb 9, 2012)

bbfoto said:


> Looks awesome, santiagodraco! I'm interested in the Samsung Homesync, too. It's amazing how tiny the Android "candy bar " computers are.
> 
> I decided to go the tablet route just because it has a great screen, and I can take this device with me and use it as a standalone tablet as well. This also makes it easy to manage my media library, and my "head unit" is entirely removable to deter theft.
> 
> ...


Thanks 

I would go the tablet route except for a number of challenges that make the tablet a tough "clean" install for me. First, in my car there's a lot of integration into the factory head unit that make replacing it next to impossible. I could certainly integrate a tablet into the system itself (ie just as the android stick pc is now) to pull out digital audio off the HDMI output stream however there's really no place in the car to install the tablet to it looks well integrated. I currently have a floor mount (seat post bolt) gooseneck with a tablet mount but it looks like a fancy cop car with it installed 

In any case if I get frustrated with the stick pc AND if Samsung takes too long on the Homesync... I may pick up a Note 8.0 and work on some kind of installation of it into the system. 

The big advantage of the Homesync is that it has Toslink out natively and you don't need to hook up a display, you can use your Samsung Note II (for example) to control it. That is very achievable. Of course using a Note 8 to control it would be even cooler!


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

Yeah. I can definitely understand the reasons for your decisions. Like you said, it depends a lot on your vehicle and how to best integrate everything with the existing OEM system. I'm hoping the HomeSync stuff becomes available soon, too, but with Samsung you never know until it's on the shelves.

I specifically purchased a vehicle with the base audio system to avoid having to integrate with factory NAV touchscreens, or a head unit or amp with built-in EQ/DSP, etc. Even the base audio system is AM/FM/CD with BT hands-free phone and BT audio streaming, plus very nice iPhone and USB Thumbdrive capability, all through voice prompts or SWC.

So I'm running the Note II to the digital input on my processsor, and routing the OEM head unit audio through the analog input on the processor. Using the processor's Remote Control that I've temporarily mounted in the ash tray to switch between inputs, preset tuning curves, and master volume control.

I'm designing a low-profile "swing-mount" tablet dock for the Note 8.0. The tablet will be suspended about an inch in front of the factory DD (non-touchscreen) head unit and dash clock. It can rotate from vertical to horizontal and will be connected to a swinging side arm/hinge that attaches between the joint of the passenger-side edge of the head unit and AC vent...similar to the "Pro Clip" dash mounts.

So if I want or need to access the factory head unit controls, the tablet will swing out of the way horizontally towards the passenger side of the car about 110°. It'll be made from aluminum and I'm finalizing the CAD design now so I can get it to the CNC-mill fabricator by next week. That's the plan anyway...reality may be different when I find out the exact cost, LOL.


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## santiagodraco (Feb 9, 2012)

I'd run my Note II as my "head unit" if I could get a freaking MLH connector that works consistently without dropping the HDMI connection.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

santiagodraco said:


> I'd run my Note II as my "head unit" if I could get a freaking MLH connector that works consistently without dropping the HDMI connection.


IME, this might be a problem with your Note II's microUSB/MHL port being bad or very dirty, and not the adapter. I've used the OEM Samsung MHL/HDMI adapter, the Multimedia Smart Dock, and the Pioneer adapter from the AppRadio2's Android Connection Kit combined with a 5-pin to 11-pin adapter, and they all worked flawlessly, with the Pioneer being best for inducted noise rejection (I think they put shielding in it as it's a bit larger than the others).

But one day my friend connected his Galaxy S3 to my setup and we had random dropouts. So I tried my Note1 and no problems/dropouts. It ended up being the SGS3 phone's microUSB port that was bad.

Oh...you also want to make sure you are using at least a 2-amp power adapter plugged into the MHL/HDMI adapter. I'm using the Rocketfish 3.1-amp cigarette lighter power adapter, model #RF-PMC55 and UPC 6-00603-13283-4 at Best Buy. It has enough power to help charge up the phone even with the screen on continuously for GPS/NAV when it's connected to the MHL/HDMI adapter.


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## Design (Mar 29, 2011)

bbfoto said:


> IME, this might be a problem with your Note II's microUSB/MHL port being bad or very dirty, and not the adapter. I've used the OEM Samsung MHL/HDMI adapter, the Multimedia Smart Dock, and the Pioneer adapter from the AppRadio2's Android Connection Kit combined with a 5-pin to 11-pin adapter, and they all worked flawlessly, with the Pioneer being best for inducted noise rejection (I think they put shielding in it as it's a bit larger than the others).
> 
> But one day my friend connected his Galaxy S3 to my setup and we had random dropouts. So I tried my Note1 and no problems/dropouts. It ended up being the SGS3 phone's microUSB port that was bad.
> 
> Oh...you also want to make sure you are using at least a 2-amp power adapter plugged into the MHL/HDMI adapter. I'm using the Rocketfish 3.1-amp cigarette lighter power adapter, model #RF-PMC55 and UPC 6-00603-13283-4 at Best Buy. It has enough power to help charge up the phone even with the screen on continuously for GPS/NAV when it's connected to the MHL/HDMI adapter.


It's a combination of shielding, power and cellular/data frequency. I am using the Samsung all-in-one 11 PIN MHL adapter (EPL-3FHUBEGSTA) matched to a Note II and Pioneer AVH-X8500BHS. Without a consistent 2 amps going to the adapter I am noticing interference whenever the phone pulls 3G data on Sprint's 1900 Mhz spectrum. But over WiFi/LTE (or with sufficient power) it will stream flawlessly.

Aftermarket MHL adapters often don't have sufficient shielding between the phone and HDMI cable.

EDIT: Also, for those interested in Android integration, be sure to consider screen specifications. Most of Pioneer's lineup, for example, uses a resistive touchscreen compared to a capacitive touchscreen in the AppRadio2.


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## t3sn4f2 (Jan 3, 2007)

Design said:


> It's a combination of shielding, power and cellular/data frequency. I am using the Samsung all-in-one 11 PIN MHL adapter (EPL-3FHUBEGSTA) matched to a Note II and Pioneer AVH-X8500BHS. Without a consistent 2 amps going to the adapter I am noticing interference whenever the phone pulls 3G data on Sprint's 1900 Mhz spectrum. But over WiFi/LTE (or with sufficient power) it will stream flawlessly.
> 
> Aftermarket MHL adapters often don't have sufficient shielding between the phone and HDMI cable.
> 
> EDIT: Also, for those interested in Android integration, be sure to consider screen specifications. Most of Pioneer's lineup, for example, uses a resistive touchscreen compared to a capacitive touchscreen in the AppRadio2.


This would not have happened with an iPhone.





































































I keed I keed!


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## santiagodraco (Feb 9, 2012)

t3sn4f2 said:


> This would not have happened with an iPhone.
> 
> I keed I keed!


I completely agree but there has to be more than one reason to switch back to Apple and everything else considered... ;D

This is why I'm anxiously awaiting the Samsung Homesync. I think that is going to be "the" media device for mobile (although it's not at all designed for it). You basically be able to control it in pretty much any way you wish, remote keyboard, mouse, trackpad, another samsung android device as a mirrored screen or as a remote trackpad/controller and you have multiple output types built right into the device. The Roku 3 might have been a great option except they decided to only have HDMI out. While the Samsung Homesync is HDMI for video it also uses optical for audio so that eliminates one converter if you need to run composite video (like I do to my cars built in display). Of course you can just forgo output and use your android device as the controller over wifi which will be very slick.


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