# 2013 Audi S6 - SQ Build



## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Just getting around to posting the audio build for my new car. Thanks so much everyone on this forum for answering questions, and sharing so much useful information.

The Car

2013 Audi S6











Equipment Previously Owned

I had the following equipment in my old car, a 2005 BMW 545i SMG.

Audison BitOne
Audison Voce AV5.1k
Audison LRx4.5
Hertz Mille 2-Way components 6.5"
Hertz Hi-Energy 2-way components 5.25"
JL Audio 12W6v2 subwoofer



My Goals

1. Build an excellent SQ system, with a 3-way active front stage.
2. Keep the Audi MMI fully functional.
3. Keep the BitOne and Voce amplifier.
4. Have a much better subwoofer setup than before.


In my old car, I had the 2-way Hertz Mille speakers which I was always pleased with. However, I wanted to go to a 3-way setup in my new car. The Bose OEM system was 3-way, so I already had those potential speaker locations. Plus, I wanted a more detailed front stage so 3-way active was one of my goals.

I already had the BitOne and Voce AV5.1k amplifier in my plans to keep, and I was trying to find a way to keep the Mille speakers but make them 3 way. After contacting Ellettromedia/Audison, I found they could sell me the matching 4" midrange for my Mille speakers. That would have given me the 3-way front stage I was looking for. Of course, then I would need another amplifier if I planned to keep my speakers actively crossed-over. The Voce AV Due 2-channel was my initial thought, since it would connect easily alongside my other Voce amp with the ethernet cable from the BitOne.

After some thought on this, I decided that I wanted to add another goal to my system plans. Try to keep the system simple with only 1 amplifier, if possible.

Trying to figure out a way to keep my system to a single amp, my thoughts turned to some of my old car stereos over the years. I had done a Lexus with Dynaudio 3-ways, and before that I had a 1994 Acura Legend coupe with Image Dynamics horns and 8" midbass up front. I remembered how much I loved my old Acura, which lead me to consider horns for my Audi.

Horns seemed like the perfect solution for my goals. I could run the horns using the Class A channels on the Voce amp, which is rated 75W x 2 @ 4 ohms. The horns would get ~ 37W @ 8 ohms on those Class A channels.
The B channels on the Voce are 140W x 2 @ 4 ohms (Class AB), which could run my midbass. And the the Class D subwoofer channel could obviously run the subs. The whole system could run on a single amp AND I get my fully active, "effectively" 3-way front stage. I was convinced this was the route to go.

The next step was finding some horns. The last time I had them was in the late 1990s, and they were Image Dynamics. I tried searching there first, but quickly learned they no longer sold them. Fortunately, I found this forum where members lead me to Eric Stevens. After some back-n-forth emails with Eric, I decided on his Ultra horn drivers and full-sized bodies. My Mille 2-ways were sold which left me enough money to justify the Ultra horns.

Eric suggested the Beyma 8G40 midbass to match up with the horns. They were 8" drivers, and came in 4 ohms which is what I needed for my Voce amplifier.

For subwoofers, I chose to go with Dynaudio Esotar 1200s in a trunk baffle. I had considered using JL Audio W7 or W6 subs, but the impedance levels were not a good match for my Audison amp. The Voce amp is stable to 2 ohms. The W7 subs come in 3 ohm, or dual 1.5 ohm voice coils. There wasn't a good option to use W7 woofers unless I did a single 13W7. The W6 subs are dual 4 ohm, which also wouldn't work well.
After talking to several people who had experience with Dynaudios in IB, I decided to give them a try.


The S6 has a beastly V8 turbo motor which means it can complete the Kessel Run in under 12 parsecs. A Bel STiR Plus & Blinder HP-905 were added to help avoid any Imperial entanglements. 


And, of course, a thread is worthless without pics so here we go.....


A quick look at the equipment to go in:
(The Bel STiR Plus is not pictured)












To begin, the front door speakers were removed. The Bose OEM system had a midrange speaker and a midbass enclosure in the front doors. Here's a look at the Bose ported midbass box.











The enclosure left a gaping hole in the door which was good because it left plenty of room for the Beyma 8" drivers. That hole had to be filled first. This was done by molding a baffle and adding a trim ring for the speaker.



















The doors were dampened extensively.

The factory panels were fitted back in place for a stealth install. The port from the old Bose midbass and the opening for the old Bose midrange were sealed up, too.










Door with factory grills back in place.










The trunk was fully dampened.


















Along with both sides of the rear deck, to try and seal it up for the trunk baffle.



















To mount the Voce amplifier, a metal rack was hung underneath the rear deck inside the trunk.











The BitOne went directly below the Bose amp, which was in the driver's side corner of the trunk. Hard to see in this picutre, but there is a USB plug sticking out of it.










Closer look here.










The trunk baffle was built from 1" baltic birch. A frame was made first, seen from the trunk here:









And from the back seat looking in:










The baffle then bolted to the frame, with the subs firing into the cabin.



























The Audison amp is safely out of the way:










The horn bodies were painted matte black and sound dampened on the outside before going in place.




























Audison DRC and the controls for the Bel & Blinder are in the ashtray compartment. The factory door still slides closed to conceal, if needed.




















The rearview mirror was sent off to Radar-Mirror.com for a concealed display.










All sensors hidden in the grill. Can you find them?





















Everything went very smoothly, and no problems thus far.
Still working on tuning everything, which is a process I'm only beginning to work on. There's definitely a lot of research and work for me to put in getting it dialed in.

Anyway, I'm glad to answer any questions... especially for any fellow Audi owners who might be considering a major install in a newer vehicle.


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## islandman (Aug 24, 2007)

Wow...liking the horns. reminds me of my usd horns with image dynamics id8 from back in the day.

I like the way the IB was constructed as well and the placement of the bitone controller is sick!!!


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## casey (Dec 4, 2006)

love the car, install looks top notch as well. Ive never got a chance to hear a car with horns yet.


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## DBlevel (Oct 6, 2006)

casey said:


> love the car, install looks top notch as well. Ive never got a chance to hear a car with horns yet.


Second that on the horns............

Love the car as well! Audi is always nice tho.


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Subscribed as an Audi is what I am rewarding myself with as a birthday gift to me lol.


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## sinister-kustoms (Jul 22, 2009)

Wow. Nice car, nice gear and nice install. You nailed it!


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

sinister-kustoms said:


> Wow. Nice car, nice gear and nice install. You nailed it!


Thanks.

Now I just need to tune it. :rolleyes2:


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## tuner culture (Jul 14, 2010)

are you going to SBN with the car this week?


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## capea4 (Sep 2, 2010)

Well done! Car and system.
I am a huge Audi fan, ended up with a BMW X5 because I hated the Q7, but will never not own an Audi.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

tuner culture said:


> are you going to SBN with the car this week?


No. I have to work. Besides, to quote a good friend of mine: "Daytona is a place that is best avoided. It is where first-year college students go to fall from balconies, and young adults go to get arrested for the first time, and for some it is the place where they come in contact with venereal and other communicable diseases."


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## [email protected] (Oct 21, 2009)

The S6 is such a beautiful car. Well done, you built a very nice system.


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## req (Aug 4, 2007)

right on! some more VAG love!

any pics of the horn install? im curious how easy it was for you to drop those in. it looks great in your car! love me some audis sir. those cars are just beautiful.


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## falstaff (May 22, 2012)

Glad to see it's finally done. Who did the work?


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## nepl29 (Mar 25, 2007)

What a small world! You're the one that bought those E1200 from Russ.


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## nepl29 (Mar 25, 2007)

falstaff said:


> Glad to see it's finally done. Who did the work?


I"m pretty sure Ultimate Auto did. I saw one of these pics in their instagram page.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

nepl29 said:


> What a small world! You're the one that bought those E1200 from Russ.


Yep. And I had the gray BMW 545i before that, so we had chatted on the E60 Forums before.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

nepl29 said:


> I"m pretty sure Ultimate Auto did. I saw one of these pics in their instagram page.


Yes, Noel @ Ultimate did the install.


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## nepl29 (Mar 25, 2007)

subterFUSE said:


> Yep. And I had the gray BMW 545i before that, so we had chatted on the E60 Forums before.


Yup Nice upgrade!! i also sold my e60, not sure what im getting next.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

nepl29 said:


> Yup Nice upgrade!! i also sold my e60, not sure what im getting next.


I loved my E60, but I had it for 9 years and over 110,000 miles. Things were breaking on it, and they were going to be expensive to fix. I decided to cut it loose. 9 years was a good amount of time to be in the same car. It had more than served its purpose.

I kept the BitOne and the Voce amp, but sold the rest of my gear to get the horns and Beymas.
Decided to try out the Dynaudio subs and see how they do. I might replace them with a pair of 15" pro drivers, but wanted to try them out first.


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## Thumperx (Nov 20, 2007)

Nice job. I impressed that you were able to mount the driver's side horn in a good and maintainable spot with the least amount of foot/pedal/ back side of horn infringement. 

Back in the day, I too was full body horn devotee (USD A-700, ID CD1E, and CD1 Pro). Install is so critical with these things. Once you got them set up correctly, man, they are awesome!

Enjoy


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Thumperx said:


> Nice job. I impressed that you were able to mount the driver's side horn in a good and maintainable spot with the least amount of foot/pedal/ back side of horn infringement.
> 
> Back in the day, I too was full body horn devotee (USD A-700, ID CD1E, and CD1 Pro). Install is so critical with these things. Once you got them set up correctly, man, they are awesome!
> 
> Enjoy


Yes, the S6 dash appears to have been well suited for the full-size horns.
If you have big feet, or prefer to use the whole foot on the pedals then you definitely kick the horn a bit. But I have always driven with my toes on the pedals, so I have no issue at all.

We had to cut the under-dash panel so the horn driver could fit up inside the dash. (Horn driver mounted on top, firing down)


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

req said:


> right on! some more VAG love!


Who doesn't love a clean VAG? 

Jay


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Thumperx said:


> Nice job. I impressed that you were able to mount the driver's side horn in a good and maintainable spot with the least amount of foot/pedal/ back side of horn infringement.


Dude.... You jinxed me.

I played golf today and had to valet park the car.
Stupid valet stepped on the horn body and snapped the mounting tab.
I'm going to have to replace the horn body now.

Luckily, the hotel says they will pay for the damages.

Oh well. Rookie mistake on my part.


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## fenis (Apr 12, 2008)

Nice install! I'm another full size horn user.

What xo points are you using on the Beyma 8G40? Do you have to eq up the 80-100hz area? I'm thinking of trying the 10G40 in my doors if I can fit the depth..


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

fenis said:


> What xo points are you using on the Beyma 8G40? Do you have to eq up the 80-100hz area? I'm thinking of trying the 10G40 in my doors if I can fit the depth..


Good question.

Right now I have them set from 70Hz to 800Hz with Linkwitz 24/dB slope.

I'm wondering if it is safe to set the HP a little lower? The Fs = 70Hz according to the T/S params.
They are installed in my front doors, and are IB.
They are 4 ohm drivers, and they are receiving 140W each from the Audison amp.
I set the amp gains using an o-scope and the Autosound 2000 CD with -5dB overlap.

I had been running them down to 50Hz @ 24/db and they were much more "punchy." But the punch felt very unnatural. I could feel the pulses coming from down low, and it was drawing my attention downward. Plus, I couldn't help but think I was stressing the drivers.

Probably my only complaint about my BitOne is that the crossover frequencies can only be adjusted in 10Hz steps for the midbass HP. So I can choose 80, 70, 60, 50, 40Hz but not anything in between those.

Any thoughts? Anyone??


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## jpeezy (Feb 5, 2012)

no need to replace horn body, just get some 3m two part epoxy, itll be just like new. From a fellow o-towner [email protected] did a really nice job. would love to hear this thing, if you do any local events let us know, i'd love to hear this audi. I am using horns in my car as well, unfortunately its not an s6 like yours(beautiful car by the way). if your having further issues getting that horn body fixed let me know, ill hook you up. I've fixed/modified many horns in the past.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

jpeezy said:


> no need to replace horn body, just get some 3m two part epoxy, itll be just like new. From a fellow o-towner [email protected] did a really nice job. would love to hear this thing, if you do any local events let us know, i'd love to hear this audi. I am using horns in my car as well, unfortunately its not an s6 like yours(beautiful car by the way). if your having further issues getting that horn body fixed let me know, ill hook you up. I've fixed/modified many horns in the past.


Already epoxied it back together. But since the hotel is paying for it, I'm going to order a replacement horn anyway.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

jpeezy said:


> would love to hear this thing, if you do any local events let us know, i'd love to hear this audi. I am using horns in my car as well, unfortunately its not an s6 like yours(beautiful car by the way)..


Which location are you at? Maybe I can swing by sometime.


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## HondAudio (Oct 19, 2006)

Is there any reason you didn't try to reuse and adapt the midbass enclosures? It might have saved you some work :\


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

HondAudio said:


> Is there any reason you didn't try to reuse and adapt the midbass enclosures? It might have saved you some work :\


Yes, there are a few reasons:

1. By leaving the Bose enclosures intact, I can easily replace the factory system when selling or trading the car. No need to purchase replacement parts. Just drop them back in a plug them up.

2. The Bose enclosures had ~ 4" drivers. Maybe even smaller? I don't think we could have fit my 8" Beymas in the enclosures, and I also don't know how they would sound in them?

3. Eric suggested I go with the 8" Beyma drivers, and run them IB.

4. I talked to a guy with my same car who had installed 7" Dynaudio midbass in the same location. I took a lot of ideas from his experience.


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## jpeezy (Feb 5, 2012)

I'm at the westside location, only there like mon., wed., and sat. (part time student).glad the hotel stepped up and took care of you. Thanks for sharing the install.


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## Thumperx (Nov 20, 2007)

subterFUSE said:


> Dude.... You jinxed me.
> 
> I played golf today and had to valet park the car.
> Stupid valet stepped on the horn body and snapped the mounting tab.
> ...


Not me Mon, I had to inform everyone who sat into the passenger seat (sometime driver side) that I have horns or kick-panel speakers and watch their feet as they entered. Most people are not observing where feet are being placed as they flop into the seat. 

Highly recommendable.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Thumperx said:


> Not me Mon, I had to inform everyone who sat into the passenger seat (sometime driver side) that I have horns or kick-panel speakers and watch their feet as they entered. Most people are not observing where feet are being placed as they flop into the seat.
> 
> Highly recommendable.


I had Dynaudio 3-ways in my old Lexus, and the mids and tweets were in kicks. People absolutely obliterated those pods. Luckily I had grill covers for them because otherwise I would have had a few high-heels through a speaker cone.


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## HondAudio (Oct 19, 2006)

subterFUSE said:


> Yes, there are a few reasons:
> 
> 1. By leaving the Bose enclosures intact, I can easily replace the factory system when selling or trading the car. No need to purchase replacement parts. Just drop them back in a plug them up.
> 
> ...


Just eyeballing them, they looked like they had 6" or 7" drivers - it looks like you have to skill to make an adapter for your 8" drivers that would have attached to the screw holes for the OEM speaker 

I was thinking maybe you could have covered or plugged the OEM port and put an aperiodic vent on the back of the plastic tubs and had it venting into the door.


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## eddieg (Dec 20, 2009)

subterFUSE said:


> Good question.
> 
> Right now I have them set from 70Hz to 800Hz with Linkwitz 24/dB slope.
> 
> ...


Hey there, forgive me but I did not catch the name? 

Try to implement the following technique:

Mute ALL speakers other than the right side woofer (the wheel is on the correct side right? which is LEFT :laugh: ) 

Set the time correction to ZERO!

Now take a trak you know very well with a lot of drums and just listen to the right woofer CAREFULLY and here is what you should look for - 

Does it play from the floor level or does it sound as if the Woofer is actually playing from the sailpanel/dashboard level? 

If it sounds as if it is playing at floor level then either change the slope of the right woofer jumping a 12db up or down - say now you are at 24db slope try either 12 or 36 or 48 

Or instead of changing the slope just go directly to the amplifier and revers polarity for your right woofer 

AT NO circumstance do you invert the phase from the Bit ONE - either you change the slope or you revers the wires! 

Now - after you did one of the changes above where you able to make the right woofer sound as if it is playing above or at sailpanel/dashboard level?

If yes (and I believe it should work like a charm) then now youre right woofer is AIMED to a correct phase!

Now - if up so far this was true and successful - then turn OFF the right woofer and turn on the left woofer ONLY and make sure you get a similar result. 

By doing this you would set you initial stage height to be solid and above the dashboard, nothing should be heard comming from the floor level neither would the sub woofer.

All that is left is to verify that now the horns are at correct polarity/slope and redo time correction as obviously it would change dramatically. 

If that worked for you I will write another response explaining how the rest of this tuning method is done. 

Oh, and once the above works as expected you should have a feeling that there are NO woofers in the doors when music is played and as well it should not matter how low you cross the woofers as long as they do not distort. 

Thanks,

Eddie


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## MARLEYMARL (Aug 11, 2012)

nepl29 said:


> I"m pretty sure Ultimate Auto did. I saw one of these pics in their instagram page.


Where is Ultimate Auto located?


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## jpeezy (Feb 5, 2012)

They are located almost in downtown Orlando, right on highway 50 (Colonial Blvd) cant miss it, its an old pontiac dealership.You'll probably see a bunch of exotic cars and trucks out there.Good guys, i've known a bunch of them for years. They do nice work.


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## MARLEYMARL (Aug 11, 2012)

Yeah judging by the way the S6 install looked, I say I agree with you. That's awesome the way they installed the horns...looked really professional!  Btw, thanks for the directions to their shop. I really appreciate it.


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## screamatamonkey (May 15, 2009)

eddieg said:


> If it sounds as if it is playing at floor level then either change the slope of the right woofer jumping a 12db up or down - say now you are at 24db slope try either 12 or 36 or 48
> 
> Or instead of changing the slope just go directly to the amplifier and revers polarity for your right woofer
> 
> AT NO circumstance do you invert the phase from the Bit ONE - either you change the slope or you revers the wires!


I know I'm a little late to the conversation, but I've got 2 questions about this:

1. How does changing the slope of the woofer alter its perceived location?
2. Why should the phase inversion only happen at the amp and not through the BitOne? Is there something specific to the BitOne that is being avoided by doing it at the amp vs through the software? (Is the same true for the Mosconi 6to8?)

Thanks


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

screamatamonkey said:


> I know I'm a little late to the conversation, but I've got 2 questions about this:
> 
> 1. How does changing the slope of the woofer alter its perceived location?


Bass frequencies are less easily discernible in their origin. If a shallow crossover slope makes the driver play the higher frequencies louder, it can cause your brain to locate the location more easily.

A steeper slope will roll off the higher frequencies faster, thereby reducing the chance for you to hear the location.



> 2. Why should the phase inversion only happen at the amp and not through the BitOne? Is there something specific to the BitOne that is being avoided by doing it at the amp vs through the software? (Is the same true for the Mosconi 6to8?)
> 
> Thanks


I have no idea about that one. Seems to me a 180 degree invert would be the same swapping the wires. I'll be interested to learn why not, if that isn't truly the case.


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## jpeezy (Feb 5, 2012)

Still want to hear that audi ?


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## Babs (Jul 6, 2007)

jpeezy said:


> Still want to hear that audi ?


Finally got into this thread after hearing this car at the meet. I can confirm this.. Yes, you definitely want to hear this car. It sounds as good as it looks, and it wasn't even fully tuned yet when I heard it.


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## greg09 (Jun 10, 2015)

What did you use to create the baffles for the front doors? I have an A7 with the same plastic Bose enclosures. I am looking to put HAT L8 speakers in the front doors.

Thanks


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

greg09 said:


> What did you use to create the baffles for the front doors? I have an A7 with the same plastic Bose enclosures. I am looking to put HAT L8 speakers in the front doors.
> 
> Thanks


I think Russ can speak in more detail on this, but I believe the materials used were some ABS plastic which had to be heated and molded to contour with the door panel. Then a wooden trim ring was fabricated to mount the speaker. The baffle was secured using the OEM bolt holes that held the Bose enclosure previously, so nothing was cut or modified in the door. It's completely reversible to stock condition by simply unbolting the baffle and bolting in the Bose speaker again.

Be sure to dampen the door sufficiently. We used Focal BAM on both the outer and inner door skin. Blackhole tiles were then used on the outer door skin behind the woofer. A layer of Luxury Liner Pro was then placed in between the door and the door card. Lastly, a foam trim ring was placed around the speaker to make it seal up to the door card, that way the speaker's energy was more efficiently transferred into the car and less into the door panel.


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## greg09 (Jun 10, 2015)

Thank you for the info. 

I currently have the HAT L6v2's in the bose plastic enclosure. I sealed up the port and used dynamat inside and outside of the plastic enclosure. It sounds pretty good, but I think when I get the HAT L8V2's I am going to have to build a baffle with a trim ring like you have. I was trying to figure out how to build it out of wood, but there are a lot of contours to the door.

I will try the ABS plastic, just doesn't seem like it would be as rigid/sturdy as necessary.


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## edzyy (Aug 18, 2011)

So how are you liking the dyn/ap combo vs the beyma mids and horns?


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## LaserSVT (Feb 1, 2009)

Great car and install. Love my Audi RS6. Now you make me want to do a nice IB setup.

So where are the updates? I see your signature does not quite match the thread. LOL


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I was wondering if he pulled the trigger on some AE 15's yet. lol

Jay


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## Huckleberry Sound (Jan 17, 2009)

Im here!!!


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## danno14 (Sep 1, 2009)

Huckleberry Sound said:


> Im here!!!


Lol! Me too.... Or close anyway

Lotsa nice cars in this part of FL!
Update?


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## rxonmymind (Sep 7, 2010)

Nice car. Convinced my wife this should be our next family car. Either the S6 or 7. Either way a win. Nice build!


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## Babs (Jul 6, 2007)

JayinMI said:


> I was wondering if he pulled the trigger on some AE 15's yet. lol
> 
> Jay


As matter of fact....


subterFUSE said:


> Put me down for 2 x SBP15 with Apollo Upgrades.


BAM!


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

edzyy said:


> So how are you liking the dyn/ap combo vs the beyma mids and horns?


I was wondering this too...

I'm interested to hear about the new speaker combo.
I also see that you've ordered new subs... will they be IB?


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