# CES 2017



## rton20s

Thought we might go ahead and start an official thread for this year as I didn't see one already. CES is coming up next week, what are you hoping to see?

I won't be attending this year, so hopefully there will be some others that can scout it out and report back. 

In the mean time, without comment and in no particular order, here are some of the press releases that have already been hitting the usual suspects...

Massive Audio Ships MMA Subwoofers | ceoutlook.com

Cadence Intros New Amplifier Lines | ceoutlook.com

Massive Audio Ships Nano BLU Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

JVC Mobile Ships New Radios Early | ceoutlook.com

After 20 Years, Infinity Replaces BassLink With Removable Model | ceoutlook.com

Hybrid Audio Intros Audiophile Speakers, Amp Pricing | ceoutlook.com

JL Audio to Intro Audiophile DSP-Ready Speakers | ceoutlook.com

Cadence Ships New Oncore Audiophile Line | ceoutlook.com

Memphis Audio Reveals Details on High End Line | ceoutlook.com

JVC Mobile Adds Android Auto at CES | ceoutlook.com

CES Preview: Kenwood Radio Displays DVR Video | ceoutlook.com

Kenwood Intros "Before The Amplifier" DSP/Amp | ceoutlook.com

Metra Announces DSP With Built-In Axxess Integration | ceoutlook.com

Elettromedia Updates Amps to Work With New ADS Maestro AR Integration Module | ceoutlook.com

OnCore Audio Amplifiers Shipping at CES - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

JL Audio to Host World Premiere of C7 Speakers at Palms Las Vegas - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Infinity Unveils Next Generation BassLink DC Subwoofer System - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Cadence QR Series Amplifiers - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Oncore Audio XW Series Woofers Shipping At CES - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Now Shipping - New 2017 Massive Audio Nano "BLU" Series Amplifiers With BT - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Audiomobile Winter Showcase Moves to W Hotel Las Vegas - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Axxess Interfaces Intros All-In-One Digital Signal Processor - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

New Subwoofer Series from Cadence - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

(OK... one comment.)


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## Victor_inox

Not going this year myself, 3 year in a row was mostly disappointing aside from terrific chinese candies.


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## Theslaking

The Axxess DSP looks interesting.


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## j4gates

Theslaking said:


> The Axxess DSP looks interesting.


Agreed. The industry needs to go this direction if it wants to keep any amount of the shrinking market. OEM integration of every electronic feature sits in the HU of most vehicles sold today. Swapping out HUs isn't feasible in a lot of vehicles. There need to be units that strip factory EQs, TA, etc. while keeping all of the alerts and integrated features.

Thanks for posting the links.


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## schmiddr2

> “There’s a rise in popularity for DSP processors that’s driving the non-use of passive crossovers,” said JL Marketing Director Bryatt Fischer.


Oh really.


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## adriancp

Could this possibly be the DSP? 

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk


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## rton20s

Morning update on the press releases...

AudioMobile Displays in Las Vegas | ceoutlook.com

CES Cadence Intros Subwoofer With 10K Watt Handling | ceoutlook.com

Morel Intros New Entry Level Audio Series | ceoutlook.com

http://www.12voltnews.com/2016/12/29/audiocontrol-teams-gary-biggs-build-ultimate-demo-vehicle-ces/


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## robtr8

sub'd


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## rton20s

Just a couple of new items (or at least new from the source)...

AudioControl Offers Training Sessions at CES Booth; Gary Biggs Demo Car | ceoutlook.com

Harman Intros Removable Car Streaming Subwoofer | ceoutlook.com

Kicker Announces New Show Vehicle, Mobile and Lifestyle Products for CES 2017 - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994


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## frontman

Sub'd...Thank you for posting the links and updates!


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## rton20s

frontman said:


> Sub'd...Thank you for posting the links and updates!


No problem. I'm just hoping it will prompt some that attend to post photos and info they get from various manufacturers.


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## HulkSmash

Sub'd


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## Bayboy

Not really seeing anything that tugs at me, but I do have to question Kenwood's dsp. Lots of channels, but "13 band and 3 point parametric"?? I hope they were meaning to say 13 parametric bands per channel.


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## DC/Hertz

Metra turbo touch dash kits!


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## BMW Alpina

Hoping to see another high end head unit (from other brand) that is similar in quality to Sony RSX-GS9 but with built in DSP


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## dcfis

Interesting metra pnp dsp


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## rton20s

Bayboy said:


> Not really seeing anything that tugs at me, but I do have to question Kenwood's dsp. Lots of channels, but "13 band and 3 point parametric"?? I hope they were meaning to say 13 parametric bands per channel.


I guess we will have to see. The 3-Point parametric EQ could mean a lot of things. Hopefully the three points refer to 1) Frequency, 2) Q, 3) Level. And that is for each band of the 13 bands and each output gets that same 13 band parametric EQ. We can hope. 

I did a little additional digging on Kenwood and found that they may be planning to release a new capacitive touch screen head unit that supports Apple CarPlay, Android Auto and DSD/High Res Audio as well. (No work on digital/optical output.)

There is additional info on a "high-end premium CD receiver" with "bolstered DSP performance from Kenwood and some information on JVC units as well. 

2016 | News Release | JVCKENWOOD Corporation


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## DC/Hertz

Im putting all my hopes and dreams in this. I spoke with Metra. They didn't say much but this should eliminate the need for the iDatalink MRR. That way you can use any headunit. 

New Line of Smart Dash Kits Include Touch Screens From Metra | ceoutlook.com


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## mmiller

Sub'd


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## rton20s

AudioControl Intros 6-Channel Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Kicker Intros New KX Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Kicker Intros Q Class Coaxials | ceoutlook.com

Jensen Intros Hi-Res Audio Ready Speakers and Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Jensen Announces New CarPlay Plans | ceoutlook.com

Dual Electronics Re-Enters In-Dash Navigation with 9 New In-Vehicle AV Products - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994


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## rton20s

AudioControl Intros 6-Channel Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Kicker Intros New KX Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Kicker Intros Q Class Coaxials | ceoutlook.com

Jensen Intros Hi-Res Audio Ready Speakers and Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Jensen Announces New CarPlay Plans | ceoutlook.com

Dual Electronics Re-Enters In-Dash Navigation with 9 New In-Vehicle AV Products - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994


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## jtaudioacc

AD is showing off their new super duper op amp.


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## rton20s

jtaudioacc said:


> AD is showing off their new super duper op amp.


Not posting your candid photos of Bing? :laugh:

How 'bout those Metra dash kits.


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## rain27

I love what Kicker is doing these days.

Awesome that they added a dedicated coaxial to their high end Q series of speakers.

And they come with vehicle specific brackets.


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## metanium

rain27 said:


> I love what Kicker is doing these days.
> 
> Awesome that they added a dedicated coaxial to their high end Q series of speakers.
> 
> And they come with vehicle specific brackets.


I got to listen to their Q-Class Demo Car - 2016 Mustang and was very impressed. The Q-Class line is legit.


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## rton20s

Soundstream dropped their 2017 catalog. Looks like they are no longer offering full DSP. I'll refrain from further comment.

Catalogs | Soundstream


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## rton20s

Arc Audio said:


> Introducing the Arc Audio Arc Series amplifier line coming in 2017.
> 
> Available in 2 channel, 4 channel and 6 channel versions each amp comes in analog or full DSP versions featuring Arc Audios Next Gen integrated DSP solution called the ISP8.8.
> 
> Power spec's are fit to the power hungry users with numbers like 500x2 @ 4 ohms on the 2 channel, 250 x 4 on the 4 channel and 175x6 on the 6 channel.
> 
> The DSP portion includes pass thru connection for additional control of other amplification, optical input, control capability from the PSC controller and much much more.
> 
> Pricing and release dates are still to be announced as they become available.


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## PPI_GUY

rton20s said:


> Soundstream dropped their 2017 catalog. Looks like they are no longer offering full DSP. I'll refrain from further comment.
> 
> Catalogs | Soundstream


A quick glance at the 2017 catalog reveals a reduction in Tarantula Nano amplifier models offered as well. Looks like the 5 channel and 2 channel are history. They may be trying to push customers into the Rubicon Nano series though as that series offers a 4, 5 and three single channel amps. 

No DSP's shown whatsoever, a couple of new "Reference" subs and a big expansion of marine audio. Probably trying to steal some of the JL market with that move. 

A quick look at the PPI website showed nothing new, not even a 2017 catalog. 
Pretty pathetic Epsilon but, not surprising either.


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## rton20s

PPI_GUY said:


> A quick glance at the 2017 catalog reveals a reduction in Tarantula Nano amplifier models offered as well. Looks like the 5 channel and 2 channel are history. They may be trying to push customers into the Rubicon Nano series though as that series offers a 4, 5 and three single channel amps.
> 
> No DSP's shown whatsoever, a couple of new "Reference" subs and a big expansion of marine audio. Probably trying to steal some of the JL market with that move.
> 
> A quick look at the PPI website showed nothing new, not even a 2017 catalog.
> Pretty pathetic Epsilon but, not surprising either.


I saw the same thing. As far as I can tell they are tracking right along with what I have expected from them over the last few years. 

Unless Soundstream and Precision Power are sold once again, I do not foresee them ever returning to any semblance of "the glory days."


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## Babs

rton20s said:


> Soundstream dropped their 2017 catalog. Looks like they are no longer offering full DSP. I'll refrain from further comment.
> 
> Catalogs | Soundstream


But oh thank Goodness they kept all those lovely head units.


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## DC/Hertz

I hope the arc gets more support then they provided with the DSP


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## rton20s

Babs said:


> But oh thank Goodness they kept all those lovely head units.


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## sq2k1

Sub'd and thanks for all the info rton20s


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## PPI_GUY

rton20s said:


> I saw the same thing. As far as I can tell they are tracking right along with what I have expected from them over the last few years.
> 
> *Unless Soundstream and Precision Power are sold once again, I do not foresee them ever returning to any semblance of "the glory days.*"


I'd love to see JL buy PPI...and do what? I don't know. But, the longer Epsilon owns that brand name, the more downhill the slide.


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## DC/Hertz

Morel just posted something on FB that looks to be a amplifier.


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## MrGreen83

Boo


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## DC/Hertz

And it looks to be 8 channels


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## rton20s

If this is the image you are referring to, wouldn't that be four channels?


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## DC/Hertz

I see 8. 16 total outputs.


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## rton20s

DC/Hertz said:


> I see 8. 16 total outputs.


You see 4. 8 total outputs. 

The vertical face is the output for either positive or ground. The angled face is the fastener location to lock the wire in place. A pretty common connection these days.

Here is an identical connector an a 4 channel Memphis amp...


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## DC/Hertz

Ah yes. I see it now.


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## rton20s

AudioControl Adds First-Ever 6-Channel Amplifiers to Mobile Audio Lineup - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

Kicker Makes Huge Updates in Unveiling of Incomparable KX-Series Amplifiers - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994


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## PPI_GUY

rton20s said:


> AudioControl Adds First-Ever 6-Channel Amplifiers to Mobile Audio Lineup - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994
> 
> Kicker Makes Huge Updates in Unveiling of Incomparable KX-Series Amplifiers - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994


Those KX amps actually look promising. But, when is Kicker going to offer a subwoofer worthy of pairing with the QS or KS component lines? They've been stuck in that plastic, waffle-looking rut for 20 years! Kicker...build something we aren't embarrassed to have seen in our rides!


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## Bayboy

rton20s said:


> Soundstream dropped their 2017 catalog. Looks like they are no longer offering full DSP. I'll refrain from further comment.
> 
> Catalogs | Soundstream



Not surprised after that epic failure with the 88R. Do it right, or don't do it at all!


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## aholland1198

PPI_GUY said:


> Those KX amps actually look promising. But, when is Kicker going to offer a subwoofer worthy of pairing with the QS or KS component lines? They've been stuck in that plastic, waffle-looking rut for 20 years! Kicker...build something we aren't embarrassed to have seen in our rides!




The new Q subs are mean. Low distortion, fast, and will dig. The QB8 is a pretty amazing little enclosure. One gets stupid loud and keeps its composure doing it. If you are speaking on looks alone, a cleaner sleeker look could benefit the brand. Something like the OG solobaric. 


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## dcfis

How could they mess up the 88r? Wasnt all the work done by mini dsp?


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## metanium

dcfis said:


> How could they mess up the 88r? Wasnt all the work done by mini dsp?


I beleve you're referring to it's predecessor, Soundstream Synthesis.


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## dawaro

Theslaking said:


> The Axxess DSP looks interesting.


I wish they included more information about how it ties into the factory system. High level inputs or can bus?

Too bad it only has 6 outputs. Sounds like it would require using passives or the use of amplifier xovers for 2-way/3-way fronts.


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## rton20s

PPI_GUY said:


> Those KX amps actually look promising. But, when is Kicker going to offer a subwoofer worthy of pairing with the QS or KS component lines? They've been stuck in that plastic, waffle-looking rut for 20 years! Kicker...build something we aren't embarrassed to have seen in our rides!


Is the KX line really any different than the models they have had the last few years? Looks like the same power output and case in a different color. Granted, I do prefer the black and red over the previous silver, black and red. 

And I hear you on the subs as well. My brother is rebuilding a magazine feature truck and wants to go back in with an all Kicker system. After emailing Kicker for more detailed T/S information on their Q Class L7 and CompQ, I think we will be going with a pair of CompQs for his truck. Either 10s in an enclosure close to double their recommended sealed volume or 12s on the higher side of their recommended sealed volume. 

It is also a nice that the CompQ is probably the least "offensive" looking subwoofer they make. It still has the big ribbed surround, but the embossing on the inverted plastic dust cap is pretty subtle.


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## rton20s

Dual Re-Enters In-Dash Navigation | ceoutlook.com

Pioneer Intros Active Add-On Subwoofer | ceoutlook.com

JVC Sets Prices on Its First Android Auto Decks | ceoutlook.com

Pioneer Adds Camera Bundles to NEX Radios | ceoutlook.com

Kenwood's New DSP/Amp Works With Maestro | ceoutlook.com

Alpine Intros First Aftermarket Wireless CarPlay Deck | ceoutlook.com


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## pocket5s

j4gates said:


> Agreed. The industry needs to go this direction if it wants to keep any amount of the shrinking market. OEM integration of every electronic feature sits in the HU of most vehicles sold today. Swapping out HUs isn't feasible in a lot of vehicles. There need to be units that strip factory EQs, TA, etc. while keeping all of the alerts and integrated features.
> 
> Thanks for posting the links.


looks to be a competitor to the JL Fix.


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## BMW Alpina

rton20s said:


> Pioneer Intros Active Add-On Subwoofer | ceoutlook.com
> 
> Pioneer Adds Camera Bundles to NEX Radios | ceoutlook.com
> 
> Alpine Intros First Aftermarket Wireless CarPlay Deck | ceoutlook.com


I don't see Pioneer adding the optical digital output to this new NEX line,
same thing with Alpine new CarPlay deck... still no digital output...
Looks like no new high end unit similar to Sony RSX-GS9 level introduced this year...

the Pioneer Active add on sub looks promising though...


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## hella356

BMW Alpina said:


> I don't see Pioneer adding the optical digital output to this new NEX line,
> same thing with Alpine new CarPlay deck... still no digital output...
> Looks like no new high end unit similar to Sony RSX-GS9 level introduced this year...
> 
> the Pioneer Active add on sub looks promising though...



Clarion NX807 with digital out announced.


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## rton20s

There was also this from Chris Simpson (VIP Autoworks) on the Indiana Sound Quality FB page...


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## rton20s

It also appears one of our DIYMA members has also gotten his hands on the Morel amps. Hopefully he'll post up what he knows here when he is done collecting swag for the day.


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## BMW Alpina

hella356 said:


> Clarion NX807 with digital out announced.


Thanks for the information,

This is very nice, 
now the key is, whether the Volume Control on the Clarion Head Unit able to adjust the volume when using the Digital Output to DSP Digital Input because I want to use the steering wheel volume control integrated with the Clarion Head Unit and I don't want to use the volume control on the DSP.


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## hella356

BMW Alpina said:


> Thanks for the information,
> 
> This is very nice,
> now the key is, whether the Volume Control on the Clarion Head Unit able to adjust the volume when using the Digital Output to DSP Digital Input because I want to use the steering wheel volume control integrated with the Clarion Head Unit and I don't want to use the volume control on the DSP.


There is a thread of people testing out last year's NX706, hopefully we'll get an answer soon about your questions. I'd assume this would apply to both units, but we probably won't know that until the 807 is released.

Link to NX706 thread


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## rton20s

hella356 said:


> There is a thread of people testing out last year's NX706, hopefully we'll get an answer soon about your questions. I'd assume this would apply to both units, but we probably won't know that until the 807 is released.
> 
> Link to NX706 thread


NX807 appears to be an NX706 with the addition of CarPlay. With the NX706 using optical out you could have fixed or variable volume over optical. So, if you want to use the head unit volume, you can. I would guess that steering wheel controls would operate the variable volume over optical as well.


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## bbfoto

BMW Alpina said:


> I don't see Pioneer adding the optical digital output to this new NEX line,
> same thing with Alpine new CarPlay deck... still no digital output...
> Looks like no new high end unit similar to Sony RSX-GS9 level introduced this year...
> 
> the Pioneer Active add on sub looks promising though...


Bummer. I was really hoping that Pioneer and Alpine would step up their game in this new digital age.



hella356 said:


> Clarion NX807 with digital out announced.


First thing I noticed in the press release that got me excited was a statement that said, "including a high-definition 7-inch touch display", only to see later in the bullet list of specs, "7-inch WVGA display with touch interface and tilt control", which is the same 'ol dismal 800x480 resolution that these DD units have had since their inception over 10 years ago, and the same that is currently in the NX706. 

Other than CarPlay, I'm guessing that this unit will still have the same GUI and all of the major shortcomings that I experienced with the NX706. I'm really surprised that Android Auto wasn't included as well...iDevices still dominate the market (but not by much) and they're missing a huge portion of consumers by excluding Android Auto, which most reviewers have rated higher and prefer over Apple's CarPlay.

I'm fairly certain that it still will not support the iPod Classic & iPod Video 5th-7th Gen devices, which I realize are outdated devices. However they still offer the best mix of overall SQ & Convenience for most of us in this hobby who also want a PMP for standalone use (jogging/workout/air travel, etc.).

Oh well.


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## BMW Alpina

hella356 said:


> There is a thread of people testing out last year's NX706, hopefully we'll get an answer soon about your questions. I'd assume this would apply to both units, but we probably won't know that until the 807 is released.
> 
> Link to NX706 thread


Hi Hella, yes I follow that thread and I read that the NX706 do have the ability to adjust the volume using NX706 even when using optical.



rton20s said:


> NX807 appears to be an NX706 with the addition of CarPlay. With the NX706 using optical out you could have fixed or variable volume over optical. So, if you want to use the head unit volume, you can. I would guess that steering wheel controls would operate the variable volume over optical as well.


Hi rton20s,
I hope you are correct that NX807 is just an NX706 with extra CarPlay function.
because if the NX807 able to control the volume via optical, 
then I am sure the steering wheel control (which control the NX807 volume control) will be functional too.

hmmmm....
no doubt the NX807 would be more versatile and practical...

but I wonder which one would sound better though,
the Clarion NX807 with optical out 
feeding Zapco HD/DSP-Z12 V PRO 
to Zapco Z-LX series Amp 
for active 2 way front...

or 

Sony RSX-GS9 with ANALOG out,
feeding Zapco ASP-X4 Analog Active Xover 
to Zapco Z-LX series Amp 
for the same Active 2 way front


hmmm, I guess the key would be, 
which one have better D/A converter processor...
the one in the Sony RSX-GS9 unit 
or the one in the Zapco HD/DSP-Z12 V PRO

ok, more research needed 

note: 
I wish Alpine or Pioneer had similar capability unit (meaning have optical digital output and Apple Carplay) like the NX807
because I don't like the plastic looks of the NX807 buttons...


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## BMW Alpina

bbfoto said:


> Bummer. I was really hoping that Pioneer and Alpine would step up their game in this new digital age.


You and I have the same thinking minutes apart


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## ErinH

Manville posted a few pics of the new JL c7 3.5" midrange on his Facebook page. Definitely looks like it has very nice build quality. I'm sure more photos will follow.


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## gumbeelee

I personally can't wait to try out Hybrids new 5 channel amp. I am really looking forward to put this in my daily driver.


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## Victor_inox

3pages and almost no pictures-lame!


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## aholland1198

rton20s said:


> Is the KX line really any different than the models they have had the last few years? Looks like the same power output and case in a different color. Granted, I do prefer the black and red over the previous silver, black and red.
> 
> 
> 
> And I hear you on the subs as well. My brother is rebuilding a magazine feature truck and wants to go back in with an all Kicker system. After emailing Kicker for more detailed T/S information on their Q Class L7 and CompQ, I think we will be going with a pair of CompQs for his truck. Either 10s in an enclosure close to double their recommended sealed volume or 12s on the higher side of their recommended sealed volume.
> 
> 
> 
> It is also a nice that the CompQ is probably the least "offensive" looking subwoofer they make. It still has the big ribbed surround, but the embossing on the inverted plastic dust cap is pretty subtle.




The Bluetooth gain controller that monitors phase and clipping. It can control up to four amps 


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## benny z

gumbeelee said:


> I personally can't wait to try out Hybrids new 5 channel amp. I am really looking forward to put this in my daily driver.


word.


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## MrGreen83

Victor_inox said:


> 3pages and almost no pictures-lame!







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## adriancp

I hope someone grabs some up close pics of the new Phoenix Gold stuff. 

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk


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## Unsecured_WiFi

I need specs on those Morel amps lol


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## BlueAc

The price points for the C7's look very attractive. I wonder which lines they are competitors of. 

MSRP USD:
C7-650cw: $449.99/ea.
C7-350cm: $349.99/ea.
C7-100ct: $199.99/ea.

Edit... just realized they said each ??*♂ lol


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## ErinH

ErinH said:


> Manville posted a few pics of the new JL c7 3.5" midrange on his Facebook page. Definitely looks like it has very nice build quality. I'm sure more photos will follow.



I pulled the pictures of the JL C7 3.5" from Manville's Facebook post. I don't think he'd mind.


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## benny z

From Buwalda's fb post:


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## jtaudioacc

mid line Morel amps. 4 channel A/B 4x70, Mono Class D 550, 5 Channel combo.



















cosmetics are great. i really like them. screw holes need some adjustment, but that's already in the works. labeling on top, and that cover thing.


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## rton20s

The press release has images with the grills on. 
JL Audio » header » News » JL AUDIO Unveils Ultra-Premium C7 Component Car Speakers
Reminds me a bit of Morel, but I am sure these were all developed in-house. And it appears they are made here in the U.S.


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## rton20s

jtaudioacc said:


> mid line Morel amps. 4 channel A/B 4x70, Mono Class D 550, 5 Channel combo.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cosmetics are great. i really like them. screw holes need some adjustment, but that's already in the works. labeling on top, and that cover thing.


I'm glad you posted. I was getting ready to cop your FB photos.


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## rton20s

adriancp said:


> I hope someone grabs some up close pics of the new Phoenix Gold stuff.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk


I'm hoping someone gets over to PG as well as Zapco to see what they have on display and what is new this year.


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## grinkeeper

What about the BERNIE BOLAND amps?


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## brumledb

adriancp said:


> I hope someone grabs some up close pics of the new Phoenix Gold stuff.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk




Also Facebook jacked...
































































































































































































































































































Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## jtaudioacc

cool stuff here.










some kicker software. i didn't get any info. most all my pics are from the previous two days. all setup days. 

Gary didn't want me to hear the car yet, then gave in. it's great, i'm a fan.












also saw some famous people, Shaq and Bing.


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## jtaudioacc

grinkeeper said:


> What about the BERNIE BOLAND amps?


i need to check those out. he was setting up booth and had nothing out yesterday. so i'm sure whoever is there today can have a look. i'll be there again tomorrow.


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## ErinH

bbfoto said:


> First thing I noticed in the press release that got me excited was a statement that said, "including a high-definition 7-inch touch display", only to see later in the bullet list of specs, "7-inch WVGA display with touch interface and tilt control", which is the same 'ol dismal 800x480 resolution that these DD units have had since their inception over 10 years ago, and the same that is currently in the NX706.


ditto. having played around with a couple capacitive screen headunits, I'm not likely to go back to resistive screens again. the capacitive ones looks awesome.


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## jtaudioacc

rton20s said:


> I'm hoping someone gets over to PG as well as Zapco to see what they have on display and what is new this year.


i forgot to go to Zapco before i left the Venitian. got a picture of the sign by their door. lol i was there before show opened and the door was closed.


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## rton20s

Nice find on the PG stuff. I'm not sure I am sold on the aesthetic of all of it. I wonder if Mantz had anything to do with any of those designs?


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## Unsecured_WiFi

jtaudioacc said:


> i forgot to go to Zapco before i left the Venitian. got a picture of the sign by their door. lol i was there before show opened and the door was closed.


Did Morel happen to have a higher power line of amps?


----------



## jtaudioacc

Unsecured_WiFi said:


> Did Morel happen to have a higher power line of amps?


no, just the ones i showed. quarter 2 for estimated release. they are pretty cheap too. sub 400. not sure about the 5 channel.


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## adriancp

brumledb said:


> Also Facebook jacked...
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Thank you sir!


----------



## metanium

Shaq.....meh. But a Bing sighting!? Holy smoke, dats famous!


----------



## felix509

adriancp said:


> I hope someone grabs some up close pics of the new Phoenix Gold stuff.
> 
> Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk


WOW, Phoenix Gold Is really making some changes....

*Blurb about Phoenix gold*

PG New Logo









from their Facebook page


----------



## dcfis

Those jls better sound like a million bucks, cause they cost it. Makes audio frog seem like it's for the poors


----------



## benny z

Also from Buwalda's fb:

"The world premier of the L2SE. A true 2-inch wide-bandwidth midrange. A true solution for all new GM applications, including trucks, SUVs, Cadillac. FINALLY a high-end option for these vehicles. Available soon!"


----------



## brumledb

rton20s said:


> Nice find on the PG stuff. I'm not sure I am sold on the aesthetic of all of it. I wonder if Mantz had anything to do with any of those designs?




I was told the Sx2's are for sure Mantz and not sure about the Ti3's.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## rton20s

brumledb said:


> I was told the Sx2's are for sure Mantz and not sure about the Ti3's.


Good deal. I knew he had some involvement with some of the previous generation amps.


----------



## rton20s

Alpine Intros Lower Cost Restyle Decks for Trucks | ceoutlook.com

JL Audio Intros New Stealthboxes | ceoutlook.com

Hifonics Intros Gemini Elite Amplifiers | ceoutlook.com

Alpine Finally Adds CarPlay, Android Auto Throughout Line | ceoutlook.com

JL Audio Unwraps C7 And C1 Speakers | ceoutlook.com

This Radio Has Dual Screens | ceoutlook.com

Phoenix Gold to Ship WiFi Streaming DSP | ceoutlook.com

Epsilon Debuts New Products for Soundstream and Power Acoustik at CES 2017 - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994

New Stealthbox Subwoofer Models from JL Audio - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994


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## rton20s

The new Alpine Type X gear...

























Press release, including updated Type R drivers...
Alpine


----------



## AccordUno

The PG processor is very intriguing as wifi streaming versus Bluetooth provides for a better connection . Now, I have questions and I know who to reach out to..


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## thebookfreak58

Alpine decks seem interesting. Finally capacitive screens.

Same with PG DSP.


----------



## MoparMike

AccordUno said:


> The PG processor is very intriguing as wifi streaming versus Bluetooth provides for a better connection . Now, I have questions and I know who to reach out to..


Wifi connectivity to laptops and smart devices too. Wireless tuning and using a phone or tablet as a controller is a nice addition.


----------



## rain27

Looks like only a tablet and PC can tune the PG processor. They mention the phone as a remote only.


----------



## JVD240

Is Audiofrog showing a DSP yet???


----------



## MrGreen83

JVD240 said:


> Is Audiofrog showing a DSP yet???




Not for SALE but yes there are a few floating around (for testing purposes) 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## nanohead

Well, you know what they say about opinions :laugh: here's mine!

Its a weird year it seems. Lots of "upmarket" stuff, and finally some more competition in the DSP space, but overall, not much is getting me motivated to spend money.

Amps simply don't get me excited anymore, especially when they seem to be getting larger in physical footprint. New ideas in speakers are always welcome, and I love Buwaldas stuff, use it in several of my cars, but not for $3500. Not feelin it.

All the new DSPs are interesting, but so many of the car audio Hardware companies have failed miserably because they suck at software (epsilon? mosconi? zapco?) it made their products fairly useless for serious users. 

I do like that there is further development of Android Auto, which is especially important outside the US, as Android is like 85% market share everywhere else. So it hopefully will help keep aftermarket head units alive a bit longer in other markets.

Surprised Pioneer didn't do new head units this year, but rather, is doing some dopey bundles. I moved to the 4200NEX for my Dakota, and its really pretty good (Android Auto motivated me).

Nice to see the JVC/Kenwood crew moving some better features into the JVC line, which seems to be priced better than the Kenwood line most of the time.

The standout so far though, seems to be Metra, which is really trying some new stuff. If they don't completely f up the software on their little DSP, it could be super interesting as an approach. Also, seems like they're taking a swing at ADS too with their new dash kits, but I suspect that it will cause Mutually Assured Destruction for them both in that market as its probably not that big... ADS has some interesting stuff (I use both the iDatalink as well as the hokey Mustang dash replacement)

I'm going to do a system in our 2014 Cayman S (with the atrocious bose system), so will likely try some of these new products. Also have an Audi A3 (oldest kid) that we're going to work on, and probably do some work on a new Jeep Cherokee too. But all are space constrained... badly.


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## MrGreen83

nanohead said:


> Well, you know what they say about opinions :laugh: here's mine!
> 
> 
> 
> Its a weird year it seems. Lots of "upmarket" stuff, and finally some more competition in the DSP space, but overall, not much is getting me motivated to spend money.
> 
> 
> 
> Amps simply don't get me excited anymore, especially when they seem to be getting larger in physical footprint. New ideas in speakers are always welcome, and I love Buwaldas stuff, use it in several of my cars, but not for $3500. Not feelin it.
> 
> 
> 
> All the new DSPs are interesting, but so many of the car audio Hardware companies have failed miserably because they suck at software (epsilon? mosconi? zapco?) it made their products fairly useless for serious users.
> 
> 
> 
> I do like that there is further development of Android Auto, which is especially important outside the US, as Android is like 85% market share everywhere else. So it hopefully will help keep aftermarket head units alive a bit longer in other markets.
> 
> 
> 
> Surprised Pioneer didn't do new head units this year, but rather, is doing some dopey bundles. I moved to the 4200NEX for my Dakota, and its really pretty good (Android Auto motivated me).
> 
> 
> 
> Nice to see the JVC/Kenwood crew moving some better features into the JVC line, which seems to be priced better than the Kenwood line most of the time.
> 
> 
> 
> The standout so far though, seems to be Metra, which is really trying some new stuff. If they don't completely f up the software on their little DSP, it could be super interesting as an approach. Also, seems like they're taking a swing at ADS too with their new dash kits, but I suspect that it will cause Mutually Assured Destruction for them both in that market as its probably not that big... ADS has some interesting stuff (I use both the iDatalink as well as the hokey Mustang dash replacement)
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to do a system in our 2014 Cayman S (with the atrocious bose system), so will likely try some of these new products. Also have an Audi A3 (oldest kid) that we're going to work on, and probably do some work on a new Jeep Cherokee too. But all are space constrained... badly.




Just curious, what don't you like about the Mosconi software? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## nanohead

MrGreen83 said:


> Just curious, what don't you like about the Mosconi software?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


They seem to have given up, i.e. no new real refinement in a while. Also, the DSP itself uses a seriously old design credo (ie, it can't be completely reset, black boxish if you will) It's crude and I have problems with it losing its marbles from time to time. It doesn't manage its save files well, and doesn't load correctly much of the time. It also has connection problems that seem ridiculous at this day in age.

I've tried almost every brand (except the overpriced ARC), and it seems that Helix is the only one that seems committed to continued software development and refinement. Haven't gotten around to the Hertz yet either.


----------



## PPI_GUY

Good to see Epsilon putting time, money and emphasis into the Power Acoustik line. 

*sarcasm off*


----------



## Patrick Bateman

rton20s said:


> The new Alpine Type X gear...
> 
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> 
> Press release, including updated Type R drivers...
> Alpine


I think we both went to all the same booths

The Alpine Type X gear looks promising. I like the diffraction reducing surround and the neo motor.


----------



## metanium

JVD240 said:


> Is Audiofrog showing a DSP yet???


Is the "Multiseat Stereo" box in the Audio Control car one of the ones being "tested"?


----------



## DC/Hertz

Hertz just posted a Mille amp line on Facebook. Mono, 4, and 5 channel. 1000x1, 250x4, and I didn't catch the 5 channel.


----------



## MrGreen83

Ahhhhh sh*t!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## MrGreen83

metanium said:


> Is the "Multiseat Stereo" box in the Audio Control car one of the ones being "tested"?




The one I personally know of being "tested" is in the hands of Ata Ehdaivand in DC. Check him on FB. He is supposed to be posting a review on it anytime now 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jtaudioacc

X-Fire DSP Will this be the next forum boner?!?!?!?!


----------



## dallasneon

jtaudioacc said:


> X-Fire DSP Will this be the next forum boner?!?!?!?!


Oh damn! That's the pro model too....pffffttt.... boner alert!

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


----------



## cvjoint

Patrick Bateman said:


> I think we both went to all the same booths
> 
> The Alpine Type X gear looks promising. I like the diffraction reducing surround and the neo motor.


My favorite release so far. I don't think Alpine is going for diffraction reduction here. This type of surround will create a more linear suspension travel. I believe John at AE explained in detail why these types of surrounds are desirable. 

I'll be waiting for the specs on the X subs. Hopefully for the first time Alpine will make a low Q sub. One can hope right. 

I was also hoping an H800 replacement would be on the horizon.


----------



## Jscoyne2

dallasneon said:


> Oh damn! That's the pro model too....pffffttt.... boner alert!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk












Um that looks Just like the SSA Evil 6.5 basket...

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

That two screen stereo looks kinda neat

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## WhereAmEye?

Jscoyne2 said:


> Um that looks Just like the SSA Evil 6.5 basket...
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk




Looks more like the focal v30 set. Midbass and tweeters look identical.











Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## DC/Hertz

I know everybody hates audison. I don't care. 
The new Bit tune gear is sick.


----------



## MrGreen83

DC/Hertz said:


> I know everybody hates audison. I don't care.
> The new Bit tune gear is sick.




Where is the info on it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## DC/Hertz

Audison facebook


----------



## rton20s

cvjoint said:


> My favorite release so far. I don't think Alpine is going for diffraction reduction here. This type of surround will create a more linear suspension travel. I believe John at AE explained in detail why these types of surrounds are desirable.
> 
> I'll be waiting for the specs on the X subs. Hopefully for the first time Alpine will make a low Q sub. One can hope right.
> 
> I was also hoping an H800 replacement would be on the horizon.


I'm curious about the new Alpine stuff as well. 28mm of Xmax (56mm Xmech) is quite impressive. I look forward to seeing full details on these. It appears that they did have BL and frequency response plots for the X-series speakers. Their press release did have a whole bunch of marketing speak, but they did mention reducing distortion on the subwoofer. Primarily by way of dual shorting rings. 



Jscoyne2 said:


> That two screen stereo looks kinda neat
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Epsilon garbage is garbage. I saw a video of the operation. I would be half way through my commute by the time both screens were visible.


----------



## Jscoyne2

Epsilon garbage is garbage. I saw a video of the operation. I would be half way through my commute by the time both screens were visible. [/QUOTE]

Never know till you try it. Sony is making a comeback. Who knows, maybe other companies will too. Those flip out single din (double din screen) always have issues with hinges anyway. Cheap Honda kids get those headunits and add a ton of bass and break the hinges in no time. 

Still. Double double din is just neat for what it is. Maybe in 50 years, we will have full dsp abilities in giant screens like Teslas ))

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## rton20s

Jscoyne2 said:


> Never know till you try it. Sony is making a comeback. Who knows, maybe other companies will too. Those flip out single din (double din screen) always have issues with hinges anyway. Cheap Honda kids get those headunits and add a ton of bass and break the hinges in no time.
> 
> Still. Double double din is just neat for what it is. Maybe in 50 years, we will have full dsp abilities in giant screens like Teslas ))
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Epsilon.



















https://www.law360.com/articles/768342/epsilon-can-t-escape-4m-fine-for-violating-iran-sanctions


----------



## KillerBox

Subscribed


----------



## jtaudioacc

random pictures i shot









































































two thumbs up for Gary Biggs BMW.


















will we ever see these working in a car? lol



























Bing's wiring got nothing on this!!









Mrs.Papasin's new setup for 2017! :laugh:









Protect yourselves men.


----------



## DC/Hertz

Sony was once a great mobile audio name. Epsilon never has been, there for can't make a comeback


----------



## jtaudioacc

DC/Hertz said:


> Audison facebook


Audison makes cool hype videos. the one of Ronda Rousey was another.


----------



## MrGreen83

Omg I can't take these boxers every time I scroll down my News Feed  why doesn't it show something else from the thread? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## 307Bronco

cvjoint said:


> My favorite release so far. I don't think Alpine is going for diffraction reduction here. This type of surround will create a more linear suspension travel. I believe John at AE explained in detail why these types of surrounds are desirable.
> 
> I'll be waiting for the specs on the X subs. Hopefully for the first time Alpine will make a low Q sub. One can hope right.
> 
> I was also hoping an H800 replacement would be on the horizon.


Ridiculously stoked about the X Series gear but I too was hoping for a new DSP from Alpine with either Mac or iPad connectivity/controllability


----------



## 307Bronco

Anyone see anything from NVX?


----------



## nstaln

307Bronco said:


> Ridiculously stoked about the X Series gear but I too was hoping for a new DSP from Alpine with either Mac or iPad connectivity/controllability


I'm also quite stoked about the new Type-X line.

I have an H800 and I can connect to it via a Macbook Pro…I can't control it via an i-anything…but I have no issues using the current Alpine offerings with my Mac.


----------



## 307Bronco

nstaln said:


> 307Bronco said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ridiculously stoked about the X Series gear but I too was hoping for a new DSP from Alpine with either Mac or iPad connectivity/controllability
> 
> 
> 
> I'm also quite stoked about the new Type-X line.
> 
> I have an H800 and I can connect to it via a Macbook Pro?I can't control it via an i-anything?but I have no issues using the current Alpine offerings with my Mac.
Click to expand...

Running parallels or something similar I assume?


----------



## nstaln

307Bronco said:


> Running parallels or something similar I assume?


Yezzir…Parallels.

I agree direct Mac support would be nice….full function control via i-device would be sick.

Kinda related….I really hoped JL would've come up with a full function control 'RUX' for their TWK….having full control realtime without a computer just seems like a no-brainer.


----------



## 307Bronco

nstaln said:


> Yezzir…Parallels.
> 
> I agree direct Mac support would be nice….full function control via i-device would be sick.
> 
> Kinda related….I really hoped JL would've come up with a full function control 'RUX' for their TWK….having full control realtime without a computer just seems like a no-brainer.


Rainbow's DSP, Phoenix Gold's DSP and AudioControl's DSPs are controllable and tunable from an iPad. There is no reason Alpine can't figure something out too.


----------



## chefhow

nstaln said:


> Yezzir…Parallels.
> 
> I agree direct Mac support would be nice….full function control via i-device would be sick.
> 
> Kinda related….I really hoped JL would've come up with a full function control 'RUX' for their TWK….having full control realtime without a computer just seems like a no-brainer.


Kicker Q Class amp DSPs are fully controllable on iDevices


----------



## rain27

307Bronco said:


> Rainbow's DSP, Phoenix Gold's DSP and AudioControl's DSPs are controllable and tunable from an iPad. There is no reason Alpine can't figure something out too.


Agree with this. Funny how the "high end" companies are the last to incorporate this. Meanwhile, Metra and Audiocontrol will be controlled from an iphone.


----------



## rton20s

The PXA-H800 was announced at CES *6 years ago*. Show me another processor that was announced/released in the same time period with iOS/tablet control. Heck, show me another DSP from that era that is still being sold that has the capabilities of an H800. The Alpine DSP is still extremely capable and in the right hands has the ability to keep up with pretty much anything else on the market. 

Manufacturers are just starting to release DSPs with CAPABLE software for tablet devices. And I could give two craps if AudioControl releases an iOS app for a DSP that isn't even capable of L/R EQ. (I understand that they are looking to correct this.) 

Yes, iOS apps allowing full DSP control are a great convenience, but I certainly wouldn't base my DSP selection on having that option.


----------



## cmusic

rain27 said:


> Agree with this. Funny how the "high end" companies are the last to incorporate this. Meanwhile, Metra and Audiocontrol will be controlled from an iphone.


Got to remember that each company has to pay whatever Apple wants in order to connect their unit to Apple products. For some companies the cost is not worth it as compared to the amount of units of their product sold. Metra and Audio Control probably figures it will sell enough product to make it worthwhile to pay for the Apple licensing, while other companies don't.


----------



## AAAAAAA

I don't understand why companies don't leverage browser based UI, it makes so much more sense... would work on pretty much anything.


----------



## Unsecured_WiFi

I really wish we would get more info about the ford sync before the amp replacements


----------



## Patrick Bateman

AAAAAAA said:


> I don't understand why companies don't leverage browser based UI, it makes so much more sense... would work on pretty much anything.


Yeah, what the hell? That's a really good point.

All you'd have to do is include a small web server, and then the DSP could be configured in any browser. That would make it compatible on EVERYTHING... Mac, PC, Android, IOS, even PalmOS. (Or whatever LG is calling it now that they bought it from my employer.)

This option would be particularly useful for emerging markets. I've worked with guys in the Philippines and India, and they do *everything* from their phones.

Taken a step further, you could include a WiFi router on the DSP board, and then you could tune your setup from the car, wirelessly, without a laptop at all.


----------



## jtaudioacc

i think all the keyboard code writers and engineers should slap together some software tonight and show it around to all the companies. millions of dollars are sure to come your way!!!


----------



## Patrick Bateman

jtaudioacc said:


> i think all the keyboard code writers and engineers should slap together some software tonight and show it around to all the companies. millions of dollars are sure to come your way!!!


24 years ago, a little program named "Mosaic" changed the world

If you have friends or kids that are trying to figure out what to do in college, I think that the author's advice here is absolutely prophetic:

Marc Andreessen on Why Software Is Eating the World - WSJ

In a nutshell, *software is taking over everything.* We no longer care about who has the best car, the best DSP, or the best phone. All we care about is who can make the best software. And this is slowly creeping into everything; Amazon is an excellent example of how great software enables a lowly book store to take over EVERYTHING.

When's the last time you looked at a car, and realized that you're only going to sign on the line that's dotted if the software is the best? No matter how fast it is, affordable it is, spacious it is. If the software sucks, everything else is irrelevant.


----------



## rton20s

In other CES news.
Epsilon Electronics Booth Robbed During CES Show - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994









Must. Resist.


----------



## dallasneon

rton20s said:


> In other CES news.
> Epsilon Electronics Booth Robbed During CES Show - 12 Volt News - Fresh Industry News Since 199412 Volt News – Fresh Industry News Since 1994
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Must. Resist.


My favorite part....

“The targeted theft of prototypes suggests that the purpose is to copy our hard work and compromise our investment in product development,” Goldberg continued. “Whoever is to blame represents the very lowest level of integrity in our business and must be stopped.”



Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


----------



## thefordmccord

dallasneon said:


> My favorite part....
> 
> “The targeted theft of prototypes suggests that the purpose is to copy our hard work and compromise our investment in product development,” Goldberg continued. “Whoever is to blame represents the very lowest level of integrity in our business and must be stopped.”
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


Mosconi ripped them off...


----------



## dallasneon

thefordmccord said:


> Mosconi ripped them off...


Exactly what I was thinking when I read that....lol!

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


----------



## dcfis

Try these on epsilon, 











This is what consumers see.


----------



## Babs

They had to jack that 2-screen beast of a bumpin soundstream head unit yo. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## diy.phil

A famous gaming/laptop company at the show had their 3-screen laptop (prototype) stolen too.


----------



## pocket5s

diy.phil said:


> A famous gaming/laptop company at the show had their 3-screen laptop (prototype) stolen too.




If that's the one I read about, it was like a $5000 laptop. Ouch. 

So much for security. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jtaudioacc

pocket5s said:


> If that's the one I read about, it was like a $5000 laptop. Ouch.
> 
> So much for security.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


i know they were giving a 25 thousand dollar reward.


----------



## PPI_GUY

dallasneon said:


> My favorite part....
> 
> “The targeted theft of prototypes suggests that the purpose is to copy our hard work and compromise our investment in product development,” Goldberg continued. “Whoever is to blame represents the very lowest level of integrity in our business and must be stopped.”


Epsilon has officially become a laughing stock. They pretty much already were with their ripoff products and crappy designs...enough with the spiders already! 
But, with those comments they're just comic relief.


----------



## AccordUno

Stuff getting stolen at CES, nah, say it ain't so.. But Epsilon, please.. In all honesty the companies sucks, but it's still wrong in any shape or form.. Even if they were to step up to the plate and create a real difference maker product, it might caused them or other companies to not want to show. Juice is not worth the squeeze, mantra comes to mind..

There's already companies setting up should outside of the conference center as it is..


Oh and about software writing. sure you could do a web based UI for them. Hell you can do it using JavaScript that runs on NodeJS, it just requires a little more time and a good testing. Unfortunately most of the developers that do that make good money as it is, to go work for a car audio manufacturer. So it does take time for manufacturers to catch up. Yes, I am one of those and yes I looked at the some of the software and wondered if I could rewrite it to make it better.. Just don't have the time at the moment..


----------



## Jscoyne2

Patrick Bateman said:


> 24 years ago, a little program named "Mosaic" changed the world
> 
> If you have friends or kids that are trying to figure out what to do in college, I think that the author's advice here is absolutely prophetic:
> 
> Marc Andreessen on Why Software Is Eating the World - WSJ
> 
> In a nutshell, *software is taking over everything.* We no longer care about who has the best car, the best DSP, or the best phone. All we care about is who can make the best software. And this is slowly creeping into everything; Amazon is an excellent example of how great software enables a lowly book store to take over EVERYTHING.
> 
> When's the last time you looked at a car, and realized that you're only going to sign on the line that's dotted if the software is the best? No matter how fast it is, affordable it is, spacious it is. If the software sucks, everything else is irrelevant.


Im kinda in that boat. 25. Wanting to go to school. Noooo idea what to go for 

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


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## Victor_inox

Patrick Bateman said:


> 24 years ago, a little program named "Mosaic" changed the world
> 
> If you have friends or kids that are trying to figure out what to do in college, I think that the author's advice here is absolutely prophetic:
> 
> Marc Andreessen on Why Software Is Eating the World - WSJ
> 
> In a nutshell, *software is taking over everything.* We no longer care about who has the best car, the best DSP, or the best phone. All we care about is who can make the best software. And this is slowly creeping into everything; Amazon is an excellent example of how great software enables a lowly book store to take over EVERYTHING.
> 
> When's the last time you looked at a car, and realized that you're only going to sign on the line that's dotted if the software is the best? No matter how fast it is, affordable it is, spacious it is. If the software sucks, everything else is irrelevant.


Absolute unquestionable truth!
My cousin headed Walmart website development. 
While it`s not up to popularity of Amazon, profit it generates for biggest retailer in the world is astonishing.


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## knever3

Maybe Epsilon was an inside job to promote the product, lets think of this. Products under development are stolen, press is all over it for free getting your name out there with all the new products. Someone will return the product or not, who cares. You can't tell me that they can't make another one for production.


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## dallasneon

knever3 said:


> Maybe Epsilon was an inside job to promote the product, lets think of this. Products under development are stolen, press is all over it for free getting your name out there with all the new products. Someone will return the product or not, who cares. You can't tell me that they can't make another one for production.


There's a good theory right there.....I wouldn't put it past Epsilon.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## PPI_GUY

dallasneon said:


> There's a good theory right there.....I wouldn't put it past Epsilon.


Iranians maybe? I hear they're pretty tight with them.


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## dallasneon

PPI_GUY said:


> Iranians maybe? I hear they're pretty tight with them.


Haha! Exactly.....

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## papasin

Some pics MrsPapasin was able to snap from the Zapco suite






















































(those amps look familiar! )


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## Huckleberry Sound

papasin said:


> Some pics MrsPapasin was able to snap from the Zapco suite


Snapping all those pics, very nice. Were you able to get some information on the Zapco ADSP-Z8?

Internally I am thinking, Amplified DSP with 8 channels?

Did they share power and etc with ya.


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## papasin

Huckleberry Sound said:


> Snapping all those pics, very nice. Were you able to get some information on the Zapco ADSP-Z8?
> 
> 
> 
> Internally I am thinking, Amplified DSP with 8 channels?
> 
> 
> 
> Did they share power and etc with ya.


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## Huckleberry Sound

papasin said:


>


Thank you so much. Is it just me or is there a misprint for the 6 channel version. It show the power at 4 x 160. Not 6 x ?????

Did you notice?


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## papasin

Huckleberry Sound said:


> Thank you so much. Is it just me or is there a misprint for the 6 channel version. It show the power at 4 x 160. Not 6 x ?????
> 
> 
> 
> Did you notice?



Likely a misprint.


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## Huckleberry Sound

papasin said:


> Likely a misprint.


Checking out there webpage and I saw the following...

ADSP-Z4 IV
Power @ 4Ω: 4 x 50 watts
Power @ 2Ω: 4 x 65 watts
Tested Volt. & THD: 14.4v / <0.1%
Signal to Noise: >90 dB A
Freq. Response: 10Hz - 23KHz

ADSP-Z6 IV
Power @ 4Ω: 4 x 50 + 2 x 120 watts
Power @ 2Ω: 4 x 65 + 2 x 140 watts
Tested Volt. & THD: 14.4v / <0.1%
Signal to Noise: >90 dB A
Freq. Response: 10Hz - 23KHz

ADSP-Z8 IV
Power @ 4Ω: 6 x 50 watts + 2 x ??? watts
Power @ 2Ω: 6 x 65 watts + 2 x ??? watts
Plus 2 x RCA Sub. Outputs
Signal to Noise: >90 dB A
Freq. Response: 10Hz - 23KHz

Hopefully they can supply some more accurate and updated info soon.

Thanks for everything.


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## Babs

That may be the one coolest thing from CES so far, IMHO.. So we're seeing a USB stick, possibly with high-rez material, directly streaming into the board which I suppose is a stand-alone DSP and providing volume control. Who the heck needs a head unit then? If this thing will do this from mobile devices, game on! So that'll make two companies (I'd consider buying from) that have this.


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## benny z

Huckleberry Sound said:


> Thank you so much. Is it just me or is there a misprint for the 6 channel version. It show the power at 4 x 160. Not 6 x ?????
> 
> Did you notice?





papasin said:


> Likely a misprint.





Huckleberry Sound said:


> Checking out there webpage and I saw the following...
> 
> ADSP-Z4 IV
> Power @ 4Ω: 4 x 50 watts
> Power @ 2Ω: 4 x 65 watts
> Tested Volt. & THD: 14.4v / <0.1%
> Signal to Noise: >90 dB A
> Freq. Response: 10Hz - 23KHz
> 
> ADSP-Z6 IV
> Power @ 4Ω: 4 x 50 + 2 x 120 watts
> Power @ 2Ω: 4 x 65 + 2 x 140 watts
> Tested Volt. & THD: 14.4v / <0.1%
> Signal to Noise: >90 dB A
> Freq. Response: 10Hz - 23KHz
> 
> ADSP-Z8 IV
> Power @ 4Ω: 6 x 50 watts + 2 x ??? watts
> Power @ 2Ω: 6 x 65 watts + 2 x ??? watts
> Plus 2 x RCA Sub. Outputs
> Signal to Noise: >90 dB A
> Freq. Response: 10Hz - 23KHz
> 
> Hopefully they can supply some more accurate and updated info soon.
> 
> Thanks for everything.


so are the model numbers indicating only the number of processed channels and not the number of amplified channels? ...like, if it's the z6, it's a 6ch processor w/ 4 amplified channels + 2 processed pre-outs?


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## Huckleberry Sound

​


benny z said:


> so are the model numbers indicating only the number of processed channels and not the number of amplified channels? ...like, if it's the z6, it's a 6ch processor w/ 4 amplified channels + 2 processed pre-outs?


We will see. I just saw some prices for the new Zapco DSP. I dont see any info for these items.

We will see how they turn out


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## felix509

With all of those ESB drivers in the pictures, It seems Zapco will be selling them again?

Would they be rebranding them or just selling them as ESB?

I was checking out the ESB website a while back and they have some interesting looking gear...


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## bbfoto

papasin said:


> Some pics MrsPapasin was able to snap from the Zapco suite


Really appreciate all of the photos Mr. & Mrs. Papasin! :thumbsup:


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## dcfis

Smoking hot gear!


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## BMW Alpina

I wonder how much the Zapco *HD/DSP-Z12 V PRO *will cost...
Hope they will be available for sale soon...


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## papasin

BMW Alpina said:


> I wonder how much the Zapco *HD/DSP-Z12 V PRO *will cost...
> Hope they will be available for sale soon...



MAP pricing from the other thread...



Huckleberry Sound said:


> HD/DSP-Z12 C APH = $1900.00
> HD/DSP-Z12 C PRO = $1590.00
> DSP-Z12 V APH = $1590.00
> 
> DSP-Z12 V PRO = $1270.00
> DSP-Z8 V PRO = $1000.00
> 
> ND Z-12-R V = $320.00
> Z-12-R V = $70.00



As I understand should be around Q2, but time will tell...


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## BMW Alpina

papasin said:


> MAP pricing from the other thread...
> 
> As I understand should be around Q2, but time will tell...


Thanks for the information


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## DC/Hertz

What's the Z12 RV?


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## Patrick Bateman

Babs said:


> That may be the one coolest thing from CES so far, IMHO.. So we're seeing a USB stick, possibly with high-rez material, directly streaming into the board which I suppose is a stand-alone DSP and providing volume control. Who the heck needs a head unit then? If this thing will do this from mobile devices, game on! So that'll make two companies (I'd consider buying from) that have this.


Zapco had a ballsy demo.

In a hotel filled with conventional loudspeakers that cost $10,000+, Zapco was doing demos of DSP units over a set of speakers that appeared to be a pair of $200 coaxials in a homemade wooden box. It sounded great, despite the humble origins.


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## bbfoto

Patrick Bateman said:


> Zapco had a ballsy demo.
> 
> In a hotel filled with conventional loudspeakers that cost $10,000+, Zapco was doing demos of DSP units over a set of speakers that appeared to be a pair of $200 coaxials in a homemade wooden box. It sounded great, despite the humble origins.



That remote seems to be one of the best designs yet, except for the USB port on the side. That might make access to the port difficult if you wanted to custom flush-mount the remote.

These might help, but AFAIK they're only up to 128GB at the moment...




















SanDisk and Samsung have similar USB 3.0 dongles available...











What are the Best Mini USB 3.0 Drives? | Everything USB


.


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## metanium

Nothing new revealed in this video discussing the AudioControl and AudioFrog collaboration.

https://youtu.be/5mzRNXI-npc

If you can fight through the language barrier (Indonesia) here's this explanation by Andy W. of Multiseat Stereo.

https://youtu.be/r5xf6W_h1zw


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## diy.phil

^yaaaay always happy to see Andy W in a video


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## LumbermanSVO

AAAAAAA said:


> I don't understand why companies don't leverage browser based UI, it makes so much more sense... would work on pretty much anything.


Seriously, I work in live event video and the gear is moving this way. I'm currently sitting in front of $100k of gear and control it all through a few tabs in a web browser. It makes life so much easier to just plug in one cable and open a few tabs.


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## dave05

PPI_GUY said:


> A quick glance at the 2017 catalog reveals a reduction in Tarantula Nano amplifier models offered as well. Looks like the 5 channel and 2 channel are history. They may be trying to push customers into the Rubicon Nano series though as that series offers a 4, 5 and three single channel amps.
> 
> No DSP's shown whatsoever, a couple of new "Reference" subs and a big expansion of marine audio. Probably trying to steal some of the JL market with that move.
> 
> A quick look at the PPI website showed nothing new, not even a 2017 catalog.
> Pretty pathetic Epsilon but, not surprising either.


The new PPI catalog got added to the site.. Looks like the only new stuff are the Atom Amps, 3-way components & sub enclosures.


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## rton20s

dave05 said:


> The new PPI catalog got added to the site.. Looks like the only new stuff are the Atom Amps, 3-way components & sub enclosures.


If you are referring to the Power Class 3 way components, they have been out for a while. The Atom amps are certainly new. If I had to guess, these are probably similar to the Ion amps, but with single sided connections. Kind of like what Epsilon did with the Picasso Nanos to develop the Rubicons.


----------

