# An article on building your own ribbons



## npdang (Jul 29, 2005)

An interesting article on building your own ribbon drivers. It's simply written and well illustrated. 

It looks as if an inexpensive, shallow, and small ribbon could be built for car use... who wants to take up that project? 

http://home.comcast.net/~hendentures/index_files/Page332.htm


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## Weightless (May 5, 2005)

This looks interesting. It looks inexpensive for a driver suited for the car environment. 

I might have to have a go at this. Also my friend runs a machine shop so I might be able to work a deal if it turns out well.

Anyone else toying with the idea?


J.


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## Guest (Jul 13, 2005)

hmmm ... ribbon line array in the A-Pillars .... hmmm

Several line segments, maybe can time delay the upper segments in the pillar, to electronically "stand-up" the pillar vertically :?:  

http://home.comcast.net/~hendentures/index_files/Page335.htm


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## hcbassplay (Jun 19, 2005)

I work at a small electronics manufacturer, I have access to all of the materials necessary to build these, I tripped up on the transformer part for a second but my boss has an EE degree so I showed the FAQ to him and he said no problemo as far as giving me a hand with winding the impedance matching transformers.

I have access to many different types of foil, molybdenum, tantalum, titanium, stainless steel, aluminum, kovar, invar, and several others in varying thicknesses. I have solid bar stock rounds, squares, rectangles, in sizes varying from 1/16" to 6" diameter/width, in stainless, aluminum of several different types, steel, copper, brass, titanium, and a few other oddballs. I have access to neodymium, samarium cobalt, and several other magnetic materials that we use in special optical filter assemblies, and several sizes of each as well. I also have a lot of experience in magnetic field formation(my boss has even more) due to countless hours spent prototyping assemblies for our special optical filters.

I have a 3-axis CNC mill, a 14" manual lathe, a hardinge ultra high precision lathe, and a good friend down the street has brand new Haas high speed CNC lathes and 4-axis CNC mills with auto tool changers. Another friend's shop does all of our anodizing, chroming, powdercoating, and enamel finishing.

I think it is very possible for me to design a ribbon tweeter comparable in size to most of todays 1" dome automotive tweeters by using a high powered magnet and making the impedance matching transformer mount in a location remote from the tweeter(somewhere in the door panel). I know that the only thing stopping me from using ribbons at this point is their physical size, and I know many more people would be using them if a smaller version was made available. 

If you guys are willing to help me with the sound testing end of things, measuring response curves, etc, and helping to critique my prototype units, I am completely capable of making this a production item for members of this message board an possibly more. Npdang, I think it would be amazing if we could collaborate on a component set with your mids, and my small footprint ribbons, I think a great deal of people would be quite interested.

I am very confident that I could make a fully finished production unit available in the range of $200 a set, and I know that if we cooperatively can figure out how to make these things sound good, at that price and with a footprint that allows their use by many more people I think that they would sell like hotcakes.


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## demon2091tb (May 30, 2005)

This would be a very good idea.....and i'm excited to see what can turn out of it.

The one thing i ask though is if the ribbon tweet could be smaller than the ones used out there as of now. A little larger footprint than say a 1" dome tweet would be awesome. I really think this is a good ideas.....a complete DIYMA component set.


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## blackreplica (Mar 14, 2005)

Just to contribute my worthless 2 cents

I am very very intrigued by the line array mid/ribbon a-pillar mounting idea, and so far the following technical considerations have come to my mind in getting the idea to work. 

First is the ribbon itself. Given the limited amount of width of an a-pillar, there would be a size restriction on the physical size of the ribbon line, which would involve a tradeoff in one of three possible areas. The first is the ribbon element itself. My question is, how does the width of the ribbon element impact performance? more specifically, could you get a really narrow ribbon to work just as well? Second compromise could be the chassis (and therefore room for magnets). This would reduce flux (and therefore sensitivity), or so i have read. Which is the better set of tradeoffs to accept? narrow ribbon or less magnets/smaller chassis

Second is the issue of time delay. werewolf, toy with us no longer and tell us how you implement passive time delay.....please?  An active solution using existing car audio processors just doesnt seem possible, unless someone out there knows of a 20 channel processor or something? 

Using the aura NSW2 (the perfect driver for this application it seems), means you are looking at a maximum crossover frequency of about 7KHz before comb filtering sets in. So then we are looking at a ribbon which only needs to play down to maybe 4-7KHz? Maybe this can allow for an even smaller ribbon size?


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## Guest (Jul 16, 2005)

blackreplica, passive time delay is a big topic ... I know I'm way late in delivering. Let me continue some thoughts in my A-Pillar Line Array thread, rather than distract from hcbassplay's _amazing_ proposal


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## raamaudio (May 4, 2005)

I'm loving it, keep it coming, make it so, it works, I am in!

making 4" mids and LCYs fit and work properly in kick panels is not an easy task, your solution would be dang sweet, especially in a car I will be racing alot

Rick


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## hcbassplay (Jun 19, 2005)

We also have a handy dandy gaussmeter:

http://www.gmw.com/magnetic_measurements/MetroLab/THM-7025.html

It allows for measurement of magnetic field strength and polarity. I am going to try the magnet assembly design freestyle first but if I have trouble I may save some bux and pick up a few different ribbon tweeters and see what they are working with magnetic field wise by measuring them with our gizmo. I think I might be picking up a few books, and doing a little reading too 

I don't want to get you guys too excited until I get a functioning prototype, but as far as I can see this should not be more difficult to reverse engineer than anything else that I've dealt with(those are probably famous last words). Every time I think something should be a cinch it ends up being the hardest thing I've ever tried to do, so we'll see what happens.


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## npdang (Jul 29, 2005)

You're getting me very excited 

Keep us posted. I know a LOT of guys that have been looking for a compact ribbon tweeter.


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## Tirefryr (May 15, 2005)

subscribing


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## Weightless (May 5, 2005)

Sweet. We can now get a set of DIYMA ribbon tweet and driver. Thats what I'm talking about.


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## Ludemandan (Jul 13, 2005)

I have a 94 Prelude with tweeter grills in the dash and they have plenty of room in there. I'll bet I could fit up to a 2"x4" ribbon back there with a minimum of rigging, if that's what you come up with. Of course, I don't know if that helps anyone else...

BTW, I'm pretty new to serious car audio, and I'm learning fast, but I'm certainly no hi-fi conneseur (sp?) yet. If your tweeters ended up in my car, I wouldn't be able to give you a highly educated critique.  

Dan


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## 10K2HVN (Mar 8, 2005)

SQ_Express said:


> Sweet. We can now get a set of *DIYMA* ribbon tweet and driver. Thats what I'm talking about.


"DIYMA" - I like that!  

"DIYMA Audio"


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## 87DXHatch (Jun 25, 2005)

10K2HVN said:


> SQ_Express said:
> 
> 
> > Sweet. We can now get a set of *DIYMA* ribbon tweet and driver. Thats what I'm talking about.
> ...


Do-It-Yourself Mobile Audio Audio? Kind of like a RAID array or a PIN number? :lol:


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## 10K2HVN (Mar 8, 2005)

87DXHatch said:


> 10K2HVN said:
> 
> 
> > SQ_Express said:
> ...


i saw the problem with that before i posted, but if you were to consider "DIYMA" as a single word, its still kinda catchy...

it could also be seen as "Do-It-Yourself Mobile Acoustics Audio"


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## hcbassplay (Jun 19, 2005)

Don't worry guys, I'm on top of this... I'll have some type of prototype pics by this weekend


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## epifant (Jul 26, 2005)

Sweet! What kind of physical dimentions are we talking about?


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## hcbassplay (Jun 19, 2005)

How's bout this guys....

1.875" mounting hole
2.25" flange diameter
.093" flange thickness
1.375" mounting depth

Clamping will be from rear so front flange stays clean looking

visible ribbon area will be 1" square

Outboard impedance matching transformer 3"x3"x1"


Don't get too excited though because I havent sound tested them yet... this is just a mechanical prototype, and even though I have a very powerful neo magnet, I'm not sure it's size of 1"x1"x.5" will be enough to provide a magnetic field with enough power. I may have to use one magnet on each side or switch to a larger magnet. I really don't know yet since this is only a mockup that will possibly turn in to a working model in a couple of weeks.


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## epifant (Jul 26, 2005)

how far from the driver can the MT be mounted?


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## Weightless (May 5, 2005)

If it works, the dimensions sound sweet. I like the idea of the rear mount with the clean face. Good luck with the testing...

Justin


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## aaron (Apr 8, 2005)

how are the ribbons coming along?


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## hcbassplay (Jun 19, 2005)

I'm chippin away at them.... my boss has had me doing nothing but machining for the past two weeks so every time I think about going back in to the shop on the weekend just to do more machining I get a feeling of dread. I WILL get these done guys, I promise. That they'll sound good and actually work, I can't promise though.


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## mitchyz250f (May 14, 2005)

Any update on the ribbons?


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## mikemcus (Jul 15, 2005)

Yes, update please.


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## hcbassplay (Jun 19, 2005)

I started to fiddle around with them, but now that npdang has dropped the prices so low on the LCY's, I just don't see that I can really build them and do anything but break even. I may consider still looking at them just for people that have space concerns, if enough people seem interested I will dig back in... I will pull out my box of parts and see if I can get something working for you guys...


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## npdang (Jul 29, 2005)

You should definitely do it... LCY prices are going back up soon .. just a few pairs left to sell.


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## Weightless (May 5, 2005)

any update yet?


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## demon2091tb (May 30, 2005)

Any updates available, or has this dropped off the face of the earth.......

How could someone go about say building a 4' Ribbon  But VERY cost effecient.

Instructions would be awesome. Would be for use in a HT


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## Weightless (May 5, 2005)

updates? TTT


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## nelsondog (May 10, 2006)

If the cost of the magnets is an issue, have a look on eBay. Lots of shapes and sizes and seem to be very reasonably priced.


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## legend94 (Mar 15, 2006)

anything ever come together?


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