# Will--The 8's race is on!



## Mic10is

New ES Audio Neo8




















and they should fit nicely here once some extra metal is removed



















Thus the race to see who can install their 8s first is on!!


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## nextproject

Subscribed!


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## ZapcoTravis

Mic are you doing these sealed or AP ?
What size enclosure is suggested for these ?


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## Mic10is

I only do IB


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## Freudie2

Mic10is said:


> I only do IB


So you are cutting holes out of the floor?

Not a slam, just curious as I went through this process with my truck this past summer (i.e. to cut or not to cut). I decided I'd rather build large fiberglass pods and deal with a bit of reduced foot room. Cutting into the floor for midbass drivers is a bit "extreme" in my opinion. Always intrigued when I see guys state "Oh just install them AP style". OK...you go right ahead an cut that floor pan, weld in a proper vent, deal with water issues, and hack up your OEM carpet (which is anything but cheap to replace when you go to sell the car).

Am I missing something or are some of you guys really OK with cutting carpet and floor panels? I had to put 10lbs of **** in a 1 lbs bucket just to fit my 2118h's and I didn't cut a single piece of metal. Those new ES drivers look huuuuge if you aren't building a pod.


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## benny z

Mic10is said:


> I only do IB



#thumbsup


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## oabeieo

Subbed .

Wow what a sick driver . 

I want a set asap.


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## Mic10is

Ive been building competition cars for well over 15 years. Metal being cut isnt structural metal by any means. Majority of vehicles have cavities that provide additional depth for drivers. From there may can vent directly into the chassis or externally. 

These drivers arent any bigger than the majority of 8s on the market already. JL ZR800 are 3.4" deep. HAT L8 is 3.7" deep. JBL were 3.8

Carpet can be found pretty easily from an auto recycle, forums, ebay...or directly from an OEM fabric supplier and just put carpet back in. Carpet kits are only a couple hundred


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## Freudie2

Mic10is said:


> Ive been building competition cars for well over 15 years. Metal being cut isnt structural metal by any means. Majority of vehicles have cavities that provide additional depth for drivers. From there may can vent directly into the chassis or externally.
> 
> These drivers arent any bigger than the majority of 8s on the market already. JL ZR800 are 3.4" deep. HAT L8 is 3.7" deep. JBL were 3.8
> 
> Carpet can be found pretty easily from an auto recycle, forums, ebay...or directly from an OEM fabric supplier and just put carpet back in. Carpet kits are only a couple hundred


Must be different options for cars vs trucks. Not a single cavity in my truck to use. I would have had to cut a floor pan, then weld in a small box, then add vents/etc. Silly for such little gain. Agree on it not being structural, but I'd rather deal with a large pod versus the aforementioned damage. I imagine most would which is why you don't see 8" + drivers in most vehicles kick areas.

Where are you finding cheap oem carpets? OEM vs aftermarket is drastically different (read awful fitting). OEM carpet for modern vehicles is pricey.

In short: I wish we had better options as I HATE door speaker installs. Floor for cosmetics? Sure. For reality: Bust out the fiberglass and get a pod building I say.

I remember Earl Z's BMW in the 90's (or was it 80's?). Tore that car up to hell to fit those front subs. Bigger balls than me, especially for what that vehicle cost back in the day. Was more of a rolling stereo than an actual car when he was done.


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## benny z

no guts, no glory.


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## Mic10is

Freudie2 said:


> Must be different options for cars vs trucks. Not a single cavity in my truck to use. I would have had to cut a floor pan, then weld in a small box, then add vents/etc. Silly for such little gain. Agree on it not being structural, but I'd rather deal with a large pod versus the aforementioned damage. I imagine most would which is why you don't see 8" + drivers in most vehicles kick areas.
> 
> Where are you finding cheap oem carpets? OEM vs aftermarket is drastically different (read awful fitting). OEM carpet for modern vehicles is pricey.
> 
> In short: I wish we had better options as I HATE door speaker installs. Floor for cosmetics? Sure. For reality: Bust out the fiberglass and get a pod building I say.
> 
> I remember Earl Z's BMW in the 90's (or was it 80's?). Tore that car up to hell to fit those front subs. Bigger balls than me, especially for what that vehicle cost back in the day. Was more of a rolling stereo than an actual car when he was done.


In case you werent familiar with some of my cars  Im not shy about cutting. the sub vents to the outside through a custom protective membrane.




































http://www.cardomain.com/ridepost/1391084/630937/1990-acura-integra/


carpet in my BMW was replaced twice at a cost of about $75-$125ea purchased from guys on bimmerforums. BMW carpet has 3" of foam on the bottom. its heavy and VERY expensive if purchased new


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## benny z

hah! dude i've seen pics of that car quite a few times and never realized it was yours.

- fellow bimmerforumser


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## Mic10is

benny z said:


> hah! dude i've seen pics of that car quite a few times and never realized it was yours.
> 
> - fellow bimmerforumser


I have always said the one big thing I will miss about having a BMW was using bimmerforums to help solve issues.
You could literally find out any info about what modifications can be done, how to do a repair, interchangeable parts etc...just by searching on Bimmerforums. 

Honda/Acura forums are Ok at some things but miss out on a ton of possible mods and ideas

the worst was when we had a Lancer. those forums were useless....literally questions like Can I swap seats out of an LS into an ES...
a radio tutorial that said you have to take the entire underside of the dash apart to install a simple ido din radio....


So a forum for people with expensive luxury cars, take apart and do more things to their cars than forums with significantly cheaper vehicles :laugh::laugh:
I think I got dumber reading those forums.


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## oabeieo

Does the neo have a shorting ring and a copper sleeve? Or cap? 

How about fs , mic have you measured it?

Thx 
Andy


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## #1BigMike

oh my my my...

Will these be installed by th NC meet?


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## Mic10is

Full Copper pole sleeve and aluminum shorting ring. 3.6 mounting depth. Fo 67 Hz
Qts .332
Qms 5.5
Qes .353
Vas 20 L
Sd 220 CM2
Splo 94.4

coil overhang one way is 5.5mm


Possible they may be installed by NC meet unlikely they'll be playing


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## Brian_smith06

Oh my


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## mbradlawrence

Was/am a fanboy of the e90 and f30post sites. It's because of them that I picked up this car audio addiction that is becoming more expensive than crack! Without those sites I never would have dreamed of pulling door panels off, much less pulling wires into doors .....,,


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## fullergoku

They look great Mic!!!


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## oabeieo

Mic10is said:


> Full Copper pole sleeve and aluminum shorting ring. 3.6 mounting depth. 95db 1w/1m. Fo 65hz qts .24 3.5mm coil overhang. Treated M roll surround
> 
> 
> Possible they may be installed by NC meet unlikely they'll be playing


Dood that is so the one.


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## LumbermanSVO

So, if space weren't an issue, and using Audax7's, would you go 8's or 10's?


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## Mic10is

No replacement for displacement. But im very big on not losing basic functionality in my cars these days.


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## sqnut

Does the midrange in kicks help with stage depth? Any reason the mid is below the woofer instead of above it? Just curious.


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## benny z

sqnut said:


> Does the midrange in kicks help with stage depth? Any reason the mid is below the woofer instead of above it? Just curious.



Guessing there's a better line of sight to the midrange with it lower.


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## Mic10is

benny z said:


> Guessing there's a better line of sight to the midrange with it lower.


What He said. Plus it keeps the mid farther away to increase pathlengths. that was a Thiel 3" coincidental point source. REALLY nice speaker. I wish I could still get them


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## benny z

Looks kinda familiar lol










Looks like you vented the midrange into the rocker rails? And the midbass to the crush zone/fender?


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## edzyy

2nd gen tsx?


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## Mic10is

benny z said:


> Guessing there's a better line of sight to the midrange with it lower.





edzyy said:


> 2nd gen tsx?


2006. 1st Gen


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## edzyy

Mic10is said:


> 2006. 1st Gen


Oh nice. What do you have planned for the trunk? 15's IB?


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## bigbubba

I know I'm a little late to this but where did you get these? I'm guessing these are Eric's new 8". 

You mentioned the race to see who gets theirs installed first. How many of these are out there? I've not seen them even being available.


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## lsm

oabeieo said:


> Subbed .
> 
> Wow what a sick driver .
> 
> I want a set asap.


You say that about every new driver that gets posted :laugh:


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## Mic10is

bigbubba said:


> I know I'm a little late to this but where did you get these? I'm guessing these are Eric's new 8".
> 
> You mentioned the race to see who gets theirs installed first. How many of these are out there? I've not seen them even being available.


ES Audio aka Eric Stevens Audio. Will has a pair of the ferrite motor version...check a few posts down from mine
Contact Eric directly for them



trunk will be 3 10s IB in rear deck


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## thehatedguy

Knows what he needs to have now.


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## win1

Looks nice


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## oabeieo

lsm said:


> You say that about every new driver that gets posted :laugh:



The sad part is I will actually buy them .

The wife is beyond frustrated with my speaker testing addiction.

It really does excite me like no other. Since I quit using meth 25years ago it's the only way I can get a rush. Getting that package in the mail .. Oooooo than opening the box ( that's a ritual these days) and than me and my sons talk about them and look at them and touch and feel all there sexy little curves. 

I just got a set of 2118H and have no use for them. I played them for a day and now they will sit in my room until I get a itch for them. 

But seriously these new drivers make my blood pump and my brain tickle.


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## danno14

> when you go to sell the car...


Believe it or not, some people are more than willing to buy such a creation, and gratefully!

Keep on Mic


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## Horsemanwill

lol it's not a race Mic lol
you'll have yours in way before i have mine


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## Mic10is

Horsemanwill said:


> lol it's not a race Mic lol
> you'll have yours in way before i have mine


Its definitely a race...If I get mine in before mid summer, i''l be really lucky at this point. crazy busy with work


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## Patrick Bateman

Mic10is said:


> What He said. Plus it keeps the mid farther away to increase pathlengths. that was a Thiel 3" coincidental point source. REALLY nice speaker. I wish I could still get them











This is the Thiele coincident. Years ago you could buy these (briefly) for car audio









This is the SB Acoustics 2.5"

They have a lot in common. The Thiel isn't a "true" coax; basically it's a 3" midrange with a 1" dome that's affixed to the cone in such a way that it should 'decouple' and act like a tweeter at high frequency. SB does something similar with their 2.5"; it almost behaves like a coax. You can see this in the frequency response graphs; the rising response at high frequency indicates that the dome that's glued to the cone has decoupled. At high frequency it behaves like a 1" tweeter with a big neo motor.

This probably sounds hopelessly low-tech, but it actually works really nicely. Fostex does the same thing. Despite all of my experiments with coaxes and Synergy horns, I still think a good full range gets you 90% of the same performance with a lot fewer headaches.


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## Patrick Bateman

Mic, if you're curious about the SBs, I posted some pics of the waveguides I printed for mine: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/3601018-post599.html


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## JoshHefnerX

I'm bumping this...

Any specs or dimensions published for these ES 8's?


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## Mic10is

Full Copper pole sleeve and aluminum shorting ring. 3.6 mounting depth. Fo 67 Hz Qts .332 Qms 5.5 Qes .353 Vas 20 L Sd 220 CM2 Splo 94.4 coil overhang one way is 5.5mm

3.6"deep.


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## JoshHefnerX

Mic10is said:


> Full Copper pole sleeve and aluminum shorting ring. 3.6 mounting depth. Fo 67 Hz Qts .332 Qms 5.5 Qes .353 Vas 20 L Sd 220 CM2 Splo 94.4 coil overhang one way is 5.5mm
> 
> 3.6"deep.


Thanks, how about outside diameter and mounting hole diameter?


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## bigbubba

From the front that speaker it looks a lot like the JBL 2118.

Has anyone got these installed yet?


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## Mic10is

bigbubba said:


> From the front that speaker it looks a lot like the JBL 2118.
> 
> Has anyone got these installed yet?


youre a funny funny funny guy

I have have something done by end of July


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## jpeezy

Patrick Bateman said:


> This is the Thiele coincident. Years ago you could buy these (briefly) for car audio
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the SB Acoustics 2.5"
> 
> They have a lot in common. The Thiel isn't a "true" coax; basically it's a 3" midrange with a 1" dome that's affixed to the cone in such a way that it should 'decouple' and act like a tweeter at high frequency. SB does something similar with their 2.5"; it almost behaves like a coax. You can see this in the frequency response graphs; the rising response at high frequency indicates that the dome that's glued to the cone has decoupled. At high frequency it behaves like a 1" tweeter with a big neo motor.
> 
> This probably sounds hopelessly low-tech, but it actually works really nicely. Fostex does the same thing. Despite all of my experiments with coaxes and Synergy horns, I still think a good full range gets you 90% of the same performance with a lot fewer headaches.


looks like a fountek or mark audio.


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## jpeezy

sqnut said:


> Does the midrange in kicks help with stage depth? Any reason the mid is below the woofer instead of above it? Just curious.


in one of vance dickinson's loudspeaker cookbooks, he goes over polar tilt, when tweeter is mounted below the woofer, and its axis is on the same plane. I've used this setup in many clients cars for 20+ years, works every time. i used to demo the clients cars in a dark install bay or with a blindfold,just so they wouldn't see the tweeter down at floor.


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## jpeezy

pg. 149 goes over speaker placement.,this is actually so cool this is the entire cookbook in pdf, a long, math heavy, technical read but a great resource

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B_l...NmYi00YWNmLTlmY2ItZTU0MTRhMzdkYTAy/edit?pli=1


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## truckguy

Mic10is said:


> youre a funny funny funny guy
> 
> I have have something done by end of July


How is this build coming along? Looking for impressions on the ES audio gear.


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## thehatedguy

I'll have music before those busters will it seems.,,Eric's wasting speakers on you slow pokes. :}


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## oabeieo

bigbubba said:


> From the front that speaker it looks a lot like the JBL 2118.
> 
> Has anyone got these installed yet?


Except the jbl has 1/4th the xmax and no copper and resonates an oactave higher


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## Mic10is

truckguy said:


> How is this build coming along? Looking for impressions on the ES audio gear.


Ive listened to the 8s and my 6s on a test bench for a couple hours. the 8s sound freaking amazing. really great midrange detail and clarity. midbass is snappy and defined. comparable to the JBL, with more midbass potential.

the 6s I have I honestly didnt care for at all when I 1st listened to them. I AB'd them versus my 6Nd430 and they werent even close.
I talked with Eric about it and he said give them time to break in, so I left them playing for around 36hours straight. 
when I was passing through the garage one night I actually stopped bc I really liked what I heard.
Midrange had opened up. they had some warmth to the sound. totally different sounding speaker.

I really doubt I can fit the 8 without doing more modifications than I have time to do.
so will likely do dual 6 setup.

just need more time in the day


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## bigbubba

Mic, What are your thoughts on what type of enclosure size these would work best in. I know you prefer IB but if they were to be in a sealed enclosure what size would work? Currently I am using the Beyma 8g40 8's and have a set of the JBL 2118. The kick pods they are in are somewhat sealed but are vented into the frame rail.


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## oabeieo

Mic10is said:


> Ive listened to the 8s and my 6s on a test bench for a couple hours. the 8s sound freaking amazing. really great midrange detail and clarity. midbass is snappy and defined. comparable to the JBL, with more midbass potential.
> 
> the 6s I have I honestly didnt care for at all when I 1st listened to them. I AB'd them versus my 6Nd430 and they werent even close.
> I talked with Eric about it and he said give them time to break in, so I left them playing for around 36hours straight.
> when I was passing through the garage one night I actually stopped bc I really liked what I heard.
> Midrange had opened up. they had some warmth to the sound. totally different sounding speaker.
> 
> I really doubt I can fit the 8 without doing more modifications than I have time to do.
> so will likely do dual 6 setup.
> 
> just need more time in the day



Mic,

would you mind posting up a pic of the 6s? 
Are they full copper and triple roll ? 

I have the 6nd430 as well (awesome driver) 
Where does this 6 sound good? Is it in the midrange (above250) or does it want to be a midbass lik the 6NDxxx. 

Thanks in advance . Do u have specs on the 6?


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## Mic10is

I'm waiting on specs on 6s from Eric. They are essentially final sample speakers.
I can post pics later


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## Elgrosso

Mic10is said:


> Ive listened to the 8s and my 6s on a test bench for a couple hours. the 8s sound freaking amazing. really great midrange detail and clarity. midbass is snappy and defined. comparable to the JBL, with more midbass potential...


Cool, I'm waiting for them next month!



bigbubba said:


> Mic, What are your thoughts on what type of enclosure size these would work best in. I know you prefer IB but if they were to be in a sealed enclosure what size would work? Currently I am using the Beyma 8g40 8's and have a set of the JBL 2118. The kick pods they are in are somewhat sealed but are vented into the frame rail.


Curious too here!
I started to cut my door panels to prepare for some small enclosures, again (5th pair ).
For the es 8" or some others like beyma/b&c/faital, I'll try to build something easily adaptable with a faceplate for future tests. Maybe even 2x6".
As I really don't think my inner skins will accept the 8" effect, the td6h are already too strong, get all sort of resonances.
Sometime I wonder if I should just get weld a thick steel panel there...


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## Mic10is

Nothing amazing to look at, but they sure sound good after they get broken in


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## Elgrosso

Thx! Ok so if I go with ferrite I'd rather make some room...


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## oabeieo

Thx for posting pics.
 

So it's big. I think I'll have the room tho, I got the 6ND in now and have about 1/2" left or so. And if not I'll frikkin make the room.


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## Mic10is

comparison to 6nd430


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## oabeieo

Bumped back plate, nice. 
Looks like a really big coil based on where cone hits spider,
And a pole vent , not sure exactly how that would affect the Q, isn't a bigger hole mean a lower Q? And for cooling but besides that,

I'm guessing mid Q ....can't wait to see specs.


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## oabeieo

Oh more pics  oh dood that's perfects idea by side. 
I totally have the room. Easy . It looks like it will work very well. Thx for postin those


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## bigbubba

Mic10is said:


> Ive listened to the 8s and my 6s on a test bench for a couple hours. the 8s sound freaking amazing. really great midrange detail and clarity. midbass is snappy and defined. comparable to the JBL, with more midbass potential.
> 
> the 6s I have I honestly didnt care for at all when I 1st listened to them. I AB'd them versus my 6Nd430 and they werent even close.
> I talked with Eric about it and he said give them time to break in, so I left them playing for around 36hours straight.
> when I was passing through the garage one night I actually stopped bc I really liked what I heard.
> Midrange had opened up. they had some warmth to the sound. totally different sounding speaker.
> 
> I really doubt I can fit the 8 without doing more modifications than I have time to do.
> so will likely do dual 6 setup.
> 
> just need more time in the day



Mic,
when you did your break in on the 8's, what process did you use, enclosure, music or pink noise, volume? I've never broke a set in first. I just put them in and let them go.


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## Mic10is

Pink noise at around 80db .put on repeat and let play for several hours then just turned on radio and let it play overnight.
I also did sweeps 100hz to 500hz on repeat til became annoying to hear in house...so couple hours at most


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## slvrtsunami

Subbed.

Any more listening impressions? I was thinking about 8's in the floor as well!!


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## Huckleberry Sound

Thump!!!


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## drinkchamp

Beautiful 

Off topic, but is there space for 10's upfront in that gen TSX?


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## MARLEYMARL

So how do u like the sound of the 8G40s? Are you using them with HLCDs?


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