# NEW PPI PC3.65C Review!



## rexroadj

Ok, there here! I unwrapped them and will give you a summation of my first impressions based on looks and feel alone.....

First thing I noticed is that the midbass feels like it has 0 excursion and the cone is flimsy to the touch. It really doesnt move up and down with the hand at all (not like its blown or anything) I am not going to lie....This scares the crap out of me that this set will not produce anywhere near the volume that I am going to want/need! They are however super sexy looking! 

Next thing noticed was the midrange was TINY! I swear its probably only slightly larger then something like the dyn 102 tweet or something.....(maybe a little bigger) This to me could be the make or break of the system, the tweeter looks like any other that I have put through the mill, but again kinda sexy! I just love copper! 

The xovers appear to be extremely well built and are about the average size one would expect with a three way set perhaps even on the smaller size! (I realize this is also the exact same xover that goes with the two way) Its also got a little weight to it too! 

I will probably start off the process bridged off my human reign hru.4 which is obviously a ton of power for this set but its the way its setup at this exact moment. I will keep it really tame for now. I will then try it out off of two channels from the hru.4 and bridge the other two channels to my sub. For the begining of the test there will be no sub. I do plan on trying it out two way first then three way so it will be somewhat of a double review.

I dont know how long it will take me to get this thing up and running but will hope to add some comments on the sound tonight! Stay tuned!!!!


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## mmiller

The set looks really nice..... Grizz told me it is a solid set.. I cant wait to hear the results..


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## jlohrenz

I've got mine installed...did it this weekend. I'll see if I can get pics up sometime soon. They sound nice however I didn't have my sub setup yet, so I'm not going to judge them. I also need to figure out how low I want to go with these before I crossover to my 12" Sub.

My only complaint so far is with the crossover. The screw based terminals look nice, but the ends must not be tapered because there were many times when I had the screw completely tightened and my 16ga speaker wire slipped right out. (yes, I ensured that the end was into the terminal far enough.) Simply repositioning the wire usually worked. That was my 'only' frustration.

The small 2.5" mid was also a plesant suprise. I wasn't sure what kind or how much sound would come out of this little guy but it is very impressive.

My testing will be a bit sketchy at first as this is a complete new install (DQXS w/ JL Audio Amps) so right now I'm running everything completely flat and the default crossover is sending everything @ 100Hz and above to the components and everything at that or below to the sub.

-J


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## rexroadj

Well my first results......I have the midrange mounted on my dash in the stock locations and the tweeters in the a-pillars (off axis) the midbas..........well I will get into that. The one I installed was in the stock door location in a 3/4" birch (resin covered) baffle and is very well sealed/dampend. I am completely shocked with how incredibly nice the midrange is. The sound that pumps out of those little babies is insane! The tweets are also very appealing. Extremely detailed and accurate with its sound reproduction. I would be willing to pay the same price I did on the set for just the midrange/tweet/xover. I tested the **** out of these puppies! I started out bridged with the passives. I had one ppi midbass on the drivers side and one jbl gti608 on the other. I did this because when I got the first side installed (drivers) I decided to crank it up and see if it was even going to be worth continuing the process (my time is very important to me) I opted to drop the ppi midbass. It sounded extremely nice but just could not play anywhere near low enough in my current setup. Could you work around it with a different setup....ABSOLUTELY! The mid is VERY nice sounding (think mb quart q) It had a ton of snap and was extremely articulate. It just could not dig down to where I am used to and to how the rest of my system is setup with similar volume. Had I kept the art sq8s in my truck I think it would have been a flawless match. Before anyone jumps ship on this set because of what I have said keep in mind a few things.......#1 I listen to things at a completely unhealthy and unrealistic level. #2 I am not in the situation to redo the rest of my system around this (not that it would take a whole hell of a lot, I did just build a custom ported center console for my 12 and this set aint gonna fit it as is) #3 In a really nice and quite vehicle with smaller doors or something that can contain a small enclosure these midbass's would surely fit the bill and impress the whole way! The set as a whole didnt really lack anything in the volume arena and did handle the power quite well. 
I then decided to just go with the jbl midbass all around. I then hooked up the set to just one channel per side (140 a set). Suprisingly enough there was very little if anything lost? I still was not getting what I wanted from the midbass so I decided to run the tweet/midrange off the passives and the midbass off its own set of channels from the amp. Thats 140 to each set of midrange/tweets and 140 to each midbass..... WOW!!! WHAT A FRIGGING SOUND! I still think the passives are extremely nice! Just not going to work with the jbl mid and the ppi mid isnt going to fit in very well. Right now I am still tweaking the amps xover/gain, etc...... to continue to dial it in. I am loving the combo to this point. I will continue to update! I will not bother to comment on the 2 way setup since I will not be using the midbass at all.


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## rexroadj

Ok.....I have to add a few more rants!!!! WHAT THE HELL IS THE DEAL WITH THE MANUAL.....or should I say lack there of. It talks about all the great features and technology of the set BUT it says nothing of the mounting of the tweeters!!!! The ball was dropped when it came to the mounting hardware and the odd frigging size of the cups! I hate when any of my hole saws dont work (I own tons of them!) I suppose its just laziness? I am not going to fight with the holes...I am just going to use my jbl tweeters since the hole is already cut for it. I might just screw it and go back to my jbl two ways but since its wired for it I might just go active off the amp? I do love the sound of the set, I am just not sure if I can justify keeping it without the use of the midbass and probably the tweeter? Despite my complaints and it not exactly fitting into my plans (didnt buy them assuming that they would) I still think that the set would be impossible to beat for the $. I think this will easily become the next forum boner! The minute people get the ignorant thought of epsilon just rebadging lower end brands of course. I also must admit I did 0 processing. No time alignment, no eq, etc..... I think with a little bit of tweaking it could be an insane bargain!


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## jimmy2345

Doesn't sound like anything good came out of this.


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## rexroadj

Thats not really the case....I found the tweeter mounts to be a tad annoying, there was no instructions on the installation (not that it was really needed, just found it odd that there was none?) The midbass just didnt fit my setup. All in all its a pretty damn nice set. Again for the $ you cant do better in the 3way arena for a ready made kit, although I would put it up against most any diy set in the same $ bracket, since power/volume was always an issue with raw drivers (in that price!).


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## rexroadj

Also I cant say this enough....The midrange alone is worth the price. When you take into account how small this thing is and how easy it is to instal. You can put it almost anywhere you can put a tweeter and it covers a wide band of frequencys. If they sold this thing by itself it would flood this forum overnight!


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## NSTar

LOL, I actually bought one of these... I was looking to purchase the 2.5" but couldn't find it. I wanted to use it for my center channel.


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## alachua

Grizz stated that he will be ordering stand alone midranges to sell in the future.


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## EricP72

I wonder how that 2.5" would measure up to the pioneer stage 4 2.5"? and then how would they measure up to my peerless 3.5" fullrange. How much was the set? and i didnt see anything in your review about the sq of the tweeter. was it airy like the alpine spx pro tweeter? I was just looking at that set and wished it came with a 8" version of that midbass, then I saw that ppi has a 8" driver that might fit the bill. do you have any seat time with the art 8" driver? if so do you think it could pull midbass duty say x-over @ 300hz and 60hz?


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## rommelrommel

One thing appealing about the 2.5 is that I could use it in my factory dash cutouts and get it mostly on axis I think... Any thoughts on their ability to go tweeterless?


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## jlohrenz

Well I'm still tweaking my setup, but I have to say that this 3-way setup sounds outstandingly well.

I can't wait to hear it sing once I get everything tuned in properly.

My setup:

Factory Dec (300C Nav System)
Audio Control DQXS
JL Audio XD400/4
PPI PC3.65C's in front (2.5 in dash, tweet in door near A-Pillar, 6.5" in factory door location)
PPI PC2.65C in rear (tweet and 6.5" side by side in factory location)
JBL GTO1214D in a BassForms sub box designed for my car
JL Audio 250/1 for sub @ 2Ohms.

My only 'fun' issue is resolving some alternator whine. I thin it is coming from the PAC-Audio integration kit to give me RCA outs from my factory deck.


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## rexroadj

manish said:


> I wonder how that 2.5" would measure up to the pioneer stage 4 2.5"? and then how would they measure up to my peerless 3.5" fullrange. How much was the set? and i didnt see anything in your review about the sq of the tweeter. was it airy like the alpine spx pro tweeter? I was just looking at that set and wished it came with a 8" version of that midbass, then I saw that ppi has a 8" driver that might fit the bill. do you have any seat time with the art 8" driver? if so do you think it could pull midbass duty say x-over @ 300hz and 60hz?


I have not heard the pioneer set, in my experience it would hold up all day to the peerless without ?. I dont get into things like "airy", etc... in my descriptions because they are just opinions and I try not to dive into things like that to much. I dont think people care if I say it sounds airy. I would say it was lively if I had to give a description (not to be confused with bright....it was not bright!) Does it sound like a scan rev. (I had the alpine f1 versions) NO of course not. But since one tweeter cost more then the whole set...... It would also be VERY hard to tell how it sounded with the midrange less then 2"s away on my dash. As a set they sounded fantastic, as good as any other three way set combo I have used (aside from the f-1 and helix/brax). I saw your post on my review of the sq 8s......if you read the review you will see that I definitely had some seat time with them  Extremely nice subs....they are extremely musical so I would not be at all suprised if they could work as midbass. They dont need a ton of power, I am pretty sure they can play IB, honestly from 300 down in big doors (hmm I have big doors?) you might have a serious front stage! I would check with grizz though. Shoot him a pm. He is one of the easiest and most honest guys in the buisness to get hold of. I dont know how often if at all he checks in to my cheesy reviews. I might try that set with those subs as mids!


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## rexroadj

rommelrommel said:


> One thing appealing about the 2.5 is that I could use it in my factory dash cutouts and get it mostly on axis I think... Any thoughts on their ability to go tweeterless?


Funny you should mention the tweeterless thing.....I was thinking about that last night. I have the tweets out right now so I might just try it out I think that it might work out somewhat? I will get back to you!


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## rexroadj

I think on a budget the new ppi line/soundstream could put you in contention in the sq arena. For example.....this 3way set with the art sq8s and say something like the soundstream ref 4.920 running the whole thing would be an absolutely perfect setup that would run insanely well together. It really seams like the 8s (12" model I assume is the same) and the 3ways were definitely meant to run together. I think building a system out of those two together would yield a seamless transition between mids/subs and sound absolutely perfect. Take that into account with the fact that you dont need a ton of power and you have what people have been asking for for a very long time. Little power and flawless sq! I mention the ref amps because having owned them I would put them in my top 5 amps of all time! I absolutely love them. I think the 4.920 is like no other in the price range. SO MUCH clean power with options up the azz! I think that the power of that amp would run the components perfect and pound the piss out of the subs.....in fact I would probably run the 8s at 8ohm each per channel bridged at 4ohms might be a little much for them at 450watts. Add that up and its a pretty cheap amazing sounding setup with a super easy install! All things said I think ppi has really done a great job putting this line together (although the 8s are art and 3ways are powerclass, despite what grizz wanted


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## jonnyanalog

the one thing about this set that brings up red flags for me is the open cell foam on the back of the midbass. It seems like this driver will end up in the door for the vast majority of the time. I see these being damaged by moisture relatively easily seeing as how an open cell foam would act like a sponge. 
Thanks for the review; I think the star of this set has to be the 2.5" midrange.


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## EricP72

rexroadj said:


> I have not heard the pioneer set, in my experience it would hold up all day to the peerless without ?. I dont get into things like "airy", etc... in my descriptions because they are just opinions and I try not to dive into things like that to much. I dont think people care if I say it sounds airy. I would say it was lively if I had to give a description (not to be confused with bright....it was not bright!) Does it sound like a scan rev. (I had the alpine f1 versions) NO of course not. But since one tweeter cost more then the whole set...... It would also be VERY hard to tell how it sounded with the midrange less then 2"s away on my dash. As a set they sounded fantastic, as good as any other three way set combo I have used (aside from the f-1 and helix/brax). I saw your post on my review of the sq 8s......if you read the review you will see that I definitely had some seat time with them  Extremely nice subs....they are extremely musical so I would not be at all suprised if they could work as midbass. They dont need a ton of power, I am pretty sure they can play IB, honestly from 300 down in big doors (hmm I have big doors?) you might have a serious front stage! I would check with grizz though. Shoot him a pm. He is one of the easiest and most honest guys in the buisness to get hold of. I dont know how often if at all he checks in to my cheesy reviews. I might try that set with those subs as mids!


thanks that reply was the detail i needed. I think i found my next purchase. i can now justify going with smaller amps like a pair of kenwood xr-4s to run active and a pair of kenwood xr-1s to run my subs. I will def hit up grizz to see what he thinks as i couldnt find the freq specs anywhere. how much is the 3 way set and that sub?


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## rexroadj

jonnyanalog said:


> the one thing about this set that brings up red flags for me is the open cell foam on the back of the midbass. It seems like this driver will end up in the door for the vast majority of the time. I see these being damaged by moisture relatively easily seeing as how an open cell foam would act like a sponge.
> Thanks for the review; I think the star of this set has to be the 2.5" midrange.


After seeing/touching that foam....I really dont think it will act as a sponge although that would be the first thought about it. It does not seem like it would hold moisture (material feels more like plastic but soft like foam I think it would bead up and fall right off but I dont know that for a fact. I just did some more listening to my jbl set with the midrange popped in (active mid, ppi passives on the midrange and tweet) It is a most worthwhile addition to my truck I can say that for sure.......Again, and I cant stress this enough....If I did a little work I could have done a lot more with this set. I was just fiddling with it by litterally dropping it in. The midbass does dig low, just not as much output there as I am used to. I just got done doing a custom center console ported for a 12 and I cant really high pass it at 100 or so at this point.


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## rexroadj

manish said:


> thanks that reply was the detail i needed. I think i found my next purchase. i can now justify going with smaller amps like a pair of kenwood xr-4s to run active and a pair of kenwood xr-1s to run my subs. I will def hit up grizz to see what he thinks as i couldnt find the freq specs anywhere. how much is the 3 way set and that sub?


I would definitely recommend this set! I think that setup would work fine!


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## alachua

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum.../70931-new-ppi-art-series-25.html#post1085976

That is a link to the FR graphs of all speakers in this component set.


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## jonnyanalog

rexroadj said:


> After seeing/touching that foam....I really dont think it will act as a sponge although that would be the first thought about it. It does not seem like it would hold moisture (material feels more like plastic but soft like foam I think it would bead up and fall right off but I dont know that for a fact. I just did some more listening to my jbl set with the midrange popped in (active mid, ppi passives on the midrange and tweet) It is a most worthwhile addition to my truck I can say that for sure.......Again, and I cant stress this enough....If I did a little work I could have done a lot more with this set. I was just fiddling with it by litterally dropping it in. The midbass does dig low, just not as much output there as I am used to. I just got done doing a custom center console ported for a 12 and I cant really high pass it at 100 or so at this point.


Thats cool. I'm sure they must have coated it to help it repel moisture.


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## nismos14

What other three way systems have you heard?


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## rexroadj

alpine f-1 (scans), loved em! just to bulky for the truck. oz audio matrix elite 380cs..damn fine set, very lively and you couldnt push them to there limits regardless of how hard i tried! dyn 362?(8") forget the model# it was a LONG time ago, ran them active and they were phenominal just didnt want a million big amps to run them as they required. i think the last 3ways I had in were the Helix......absolutely stunning midrange and highs..... ran them active from a pair of new ss ref amps. there were a few hodge podge 3ways in there as well....(morel, ads,etc....) i wanted to go really simple and slim down on the power so here i am today! I was really happy with just the gti's running off the passives. I am going to tinker with just the jbl as a 2 way active vs. this current setup. I may end up getting rid of the whole ppi 3way set. we'll see!


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## NSTar

Has the 2.5" got out yet? It's a great small mid for center channel... I might do 4 of them for centers... good idea?


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## rexroadj

I honestly have not had the time to take them out (or bypass them to see how it is just as a two way) I love my setup as is right now but if I can down size and take them out then that would be even better (keepin' it simple). To answer your question......WHY 4??????? one or maybe if needed two but there would be no real need/benefit for 4 that I can think of as a center. 
They are amazing midrange drivers though, thats for damn sure!


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## NSTar

rexroadj said:


> I honestly have not had the time to take them out (or bypass them to see how it is just as a two way) I love my setup as is right now but if I can down size and take them out then that would be even better (keepin' it simple). To answer your question......WHY 4??????? one or maybe if needed two but there would be no real need/benefit for 4 that I can think of as a center.
> They are amazing midrange drivers though, thats for damn sure!


4 because I have room for them  But I don't have room for something larger than 3"  

It would be in a row. I might just do two with a tweet in the middle.... Or I might do a different location with a larger mid and tweet on the armrest. 

I have to agree, a pretty nice 2.5"

edit: after listening for a while..it needs a larger mids to compliment it. Since I'm using the ms8, a 3way center or better is required. This would work great on other applications.


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## cirodias

good review!

congratz


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## rexroadj

OK, The midrange are out! I have the truck re tuned and active off my HRU.4 They will be up for sale! I hate to sell them because they are some of the easiest to install and best sounding midrange I have ever used. I know they might be a ***** to get again if I choose too  But I dont have a use for them anymore. I am good with the two way active. I am going to add a center and rears so I think I can fiddle enough to make up for anything. The xovers are available as well. I am going to offer everything up to the person who bought the midbass and tweets, if he declines I will put up a price for them.


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## nismos14

pm me the price on the midranges if he declines, please.


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## rexroadj

ok, they are sold pending payment. If it falls through I will let everyone know.
Thanks
I do have a BNIB JBL P1024 sub for sale if anyone is interested in that! I will post to the classifieds soon. $120 shipped Straight from JBL!


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## blackedoutavy

I plan on running this component set with the SQ 8s on a ref 4.920 and the 2 way set on a ref 2.370 in the rear. What do you think it will sound like? I already have 4 DB drive platinum wd 12s on a Stetsom 7k2d, do you think they can keep up?


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## rexroadj

Hmmm, it was a great sq setup that would sound great until you mentioned the 4 12s with gobs of power. I dont mean that it will sound bad, just two different things going on at the same time. SPL and SQ. The ss ref amps are awesome and will run the **** out of anything and do so with extreme clarity. The ppi 8s are fantastic sounding subs, but make no mistake, these are subs not midbass drivers. They can play super low (maybe lower then any 8 I have used) so I am not sure where they fit into the equation with the 3way set (6.5 midbass) and then 12" subs. Unless your running the 4 12s from like 50-60 down and are adding the 8s up front for more impact? To answer your question directly.....NO those comps will NEVER keep up with 4 12's or any spl type setup. They are not crazy loud performers, they do however sound GREAT at moderate levels. If you are keeping the 4 12's on a switch or something and the 3ways, rears and 8s as everyday or normal listening then I would say it would be a perfect combo and you should have some pretty incredible listening results!


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## blackedoutavy

Ok, I plan on doing sort of a hybrid setup. There is not way I can ride around listen to my 12s full tilt all day, Mid 150's is kind of loud to do that. I do have a pac lc-1 that i can turn my subs all the way off with. So should i try and build an enclosure in my doors or modify my factory console to fit an enclosure.

I have a 2004 Chevy Avalanche.


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## rexroadj

That makes a lot more sense! As I said, running the components and 8sq's off those amps should sound awesome! If you have a processor with different memory settings you could try to xover the 3ways hight (100-120) with the 8s taking over at the same point down to say 50 or so and then let the 12s take over (turned down a lot of course) and see what kind of impact you might get with that? Keep me posted to your install and results!


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## blackedoutavy

Cool man, i will keep you posted, I'll probably start after the holidays sometime. You think sealed or ported with the 8s?


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## rexroadj

I would port them. They are not big boomers. I would port on the higher side. I ran a pair ported to about 28 and it was WAY to low for those. I would shoot for 35ish at least. Sealed is not going to give much by way of volume if you plan on running these as subs without the 12s going. If your running the twelves at the same time then sealed in the console might do ok? I would shoot for ported though. They do sound nice thats for sure.


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## jmacdadd

nismos14 said:


> What other three way systems have you heard?


I had a Swiss Audio 3-way component set with passive crossover that sounded amazing (to me). 

5.25" Midbass
4" Midrange
.5" Tweeter

I put the midbass in the doors, the midrange in the kick panels and tweeters in the pillars. Ran the set from an Art Series A300.

I bought the set of eBay NIB for $80 shipped. 

This PPI set-up is crazy since the mid is so small and can mount virtually anywhere, but I cannot get over the bullet appearance of the midbass...never been a fan of that style speaker...I like a traditional cone on my speakers.

To each his (or her) own!


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## trojan fan

jmacdadd said:


> I had a Swiss Audio 3-way component set with passive crossover that sounded amazing (to me).
> 
> 5.25" Midbass
> 4" Midrange
> .5" Tweeter
> 
> I put the midbass in the doors, the midrange in the kick panels and tweeters in the pillars. Ran the set from an Art Series A300.
> 
> I bought the set of eBay NIB for $80 shipped.
> 
> This PPI set-up is crazy since the mid is so small and can mount virtually anywhere, but I cannot get over the bullet appearance of the midbass...never been a fan of that style speaker...I like a traditional cone on my speakers.
> 
> To each his (or her) own!



Swiss Audio?.....really!!!


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## Audio_Adrenaline

...The Crossovers look Knarly . What Country are these things assembled in? I don't know much yet but, I learn something new every week...


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## rexroadj

The xovers are really great and compliment the set extremely well (not a fan of the set screw setup on them but its pretty common). I honestly didnt really pay attention to where it was made. That would be a great ? for Grizz. I noticed lately that this review is on the home page for the forum.....I still love seeing the pics of these....They are so F'ing sexy! I love copper I hate how I started out the review though.... It starts out very negative and that is just not the experience I had with them. I wish I had taken the time to do a better install for that particular set instead of a drop and play scenario (I didnt practice what I preach at all I think putting those midbass in a sealed enclosure would have yielded much better results and greater power handling (I am a power freak, for better or worse) The set was extremely detailed and provided a spectacular sound! For the money you absolutely cannot get a better 3way set (I would put it into the catagory of twice its retail actually). I would love to try out the SS version of this set. The tweets are completely different (although I thought these were actually quite nice) and the midbass seems a tad beefier too? The midrange is exactly the same, which is a GREAT thing. If they offered stock options on just the midrange alone I would buy into it! So tiny and so amazing. The last few years (in my opinion) SS and now PPI has really started to hit some home runs. This 3way set, the art 8s, the ss ref amps, etc..... are awesome, affordable, and most important sound incredible. Despite me being a power junky I love that they have offered lines that just dont need much power. You can easily run these three ways and two 8s or one 12 off a soundstream ref 4.920 and it would be a match made in heaven! I love that! I think its what the vast majority of the market is looking for anyway so I think they are going to do really well with it. I would recommend the 3ways and the art subs (I think they are called powerclass in the 2011 lineup) in a heartbeat to anyone that is willing to do a very good install. You get out what you put in, in this case especially!


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## Vitty

I am debating this set or the SS RF3.6c which is what I think you were referring to in the above post. They will be going in my 07 escalade. Tweeter location in the A pillar, midrange in the center of the dash, and the 6.5 in the door. Would love to hear your opinion on how that type of setup would sound. Amp is as of yet undecided but would be determined by the set of components I go with.


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## rexroadj

I am a little confused as to what exactly your talking about for a setup? Would you just run the set as a two way setup but take one of the midranges for a center channel? Or are you talking about putting the midranges on the dash (both, one on left one on right) but essentially centered between the tweeter and midrange? Either is fine....as long as your not talking about running one comp set as a three way and putting the one midrange on the dash and running the other side as just a two way....that would be VERY BAD! If you have a diagram as to what exactly your refering to that would help. I would really like to try out the new SS set.


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## Vitty

rexroadj said:


> I am a little confused as to what exactly your talking about for a setup? Would you just run the set as a two way setup but take one of the midranges for a center channel? Or are you talking about putting the midranges on the dash (both, one on left one on right) but essentially centered between the tweeter and midrange? Either is fine....as long as your not talking about running one comp set as a three way and putting the one midrange on the dash and running the other side as just a two way....that would be VERY BAD! If you have a diagram as to what exactly your refering to that would help. I would really like to try out the new SS set.


Essentially I only have room for 1 midrange speaker and it has to go dead center of the dash. My thought was to buy the PPI pc3.65c and run it as a 2 way and then use the midrange for a center channel. Then by a matching pc3.65c for the other side and run it as a two way as well, thus ditching the midrange for that set. Perhaps this is not what I should do. Maybe I should run 2 way components and then just purchase a separate center channel speaker? I don't really know. Perhaps you can shed some light on it for me. Appreciate your time.


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## rexroadj

I am not sure I follow still... sorry. If you purchase a pc3.65c 3way component set you will have two tweeters, two midranges and two midbass. Your saying you can only use the tweeters and midbass for the front left and right of your vehicle correct? (midbass in the doors and tweets in the a-pillars)Thus leaving you two midrange drivers.....One of which you could use as a center channel leaving you with one extra midrange driver. If this is correct then I dont understand why you would need two sets? Am I close?


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## AudioBob

It is quite common to do exactly what you are wanting to do as many stock systems with center channels are configured exactly that way. A two-way system in door/a-pillar and a small midrange for a center channel speaker. You should be able to run the midrange in the center full range to help raise the stage and center the image. The crossovers on the PPI set can be used for either a two-way or three-way set up so you will only use them on your left and right sides and run the center off of a dedicated channel like the stock amplifier.


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## Vitty

Oh yeah, man I must be tired. I only need to buy one set. Correct, I can only use the tweets and midbass in the front left and right. That leaves me with 2 midrange drivers, one of which I was hoping to use as the center channel. Would this setup work or am I better off going a different direction?


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## rexroadj

Vitty said:


> Oh yeah, man I must be tired. I only need to buy one set. Correct, I can only use the tweets and midbass in the front left and right. That leaves me with 2 midrange drivers, one of which I was hoping to use as the center channel. Would this setup work or am I better off going a different direction?


NO that should be great! I would NOT run the midrange "full range"!!!!
Make sure you have the ability to control the xover frequencys....bandpass, maybe between 400-10khz or so? Definitely not full range, it wont handle that in any way shape or form.
For my consultation fee you can send me the left over midrange  J/K


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## AudioBob

rexroadj, you are right about full range as I was figuring that the center channel in his car that is currently there from the factory would be crossed over in say the 400-500hz on up range. That is how the factory systems in most cars are configured because they use small drivers. If not, you are correct that a true full range signal would destroy that driver in a hurry.:worried: I don't think that it would be an issue to run it without a high end filter as it would just naturally roll off pretty high due to the fact that it is a 2'' driver.


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## rexroadj

AudioBob said:


> rexroadj, you are right about full range as I was figuring that the center channel in his car that is currently there from the factory would be crossed over in say the 400-500hz on up range. That is how the factory systems in most cars are configured because they use small drivers. If not, you are correct that a true full range signal would destroy that driver in a hurry.:worried: I don't think that it would be an issue to run it without a high end filter as it would just naturally roll off pretty high due to the fact that it is a 2'' driver.


Yeah, I knew/assumed thats what you meant... I just didnt want the guy to try it if he was not on the same page... I did try the midrange running free on the high end, and despite the fact its only a 2.5" driver.....I wouldnt trust it there either. I would say 10k is about the max I would go with it if you have any significant power to it. Which to me still puts it as a GREAT center channel if it were to be used with a bandpass filter.


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## AudioBob

I think that you would know since you have actually ran them before. I ran a pair of 2" small peerless and CDT speakers that way and they were nice, but one set was poly with an aluminum dust cap and one set was treated paper.

I was contemplating running either the PPI or the SoundStream set in my Lexus. I was going to run the mid in the door and the 2.5" and tweeter in the stock location on the dash, which is not a huge obstacle. I would have to fabricate a bracket because the factory sound system is configured with just a tweeter there. The Mark Levinson system has a mid and a tweeter on the dash so there is room there. 

I opted to try a two-way system with the mid in the door and the tweeter in the dash location. My factory system also has a center channel in the dash so I will have to work to blend it in and try to get the best stereo separation and center image that I can. I think that I am like you in that I like to try to keep it as simple as possible. 

Are you still liking your Boston SPZ's??? I ran the Boston Pro Series back in the early 90's in a competition car and I absolutely loved them. I also was running all SoundStream DII series amplifiers. I had a center channel in my car in 1990 using a Boston Pro 4.2 set with an Audio Control ESP-3. It was a lot of work removing the entire dash and fabricating brackets and etc... but it was well worth it in the end. I am going to run a Polk MM6501 set in this car just because I want to try something different.


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## rexroadj

AudioBob said:


> I think that you would know since you have actually ran them before. I ran a pair of 2" small peerless and CDT speakers that way and they were nice, but one set was poly with an aluminum dust cap and one set was treated paper.
> 
> I was contemplating running either the PPI or the SoundStream set in my Lexus. I was going to run the mid in the door and the 2.5" and tweeter in the stock location on the dash, which is not a huge obstacle. I would have to fabricate a bracket because the factory sound system is configured with just a tweeter there. The Mark Levinson system has a mid and a tweeter on the dash so there is room there.
> 
> I opted to try a two-way system with the mid in the door and the tweeter in the dash location. My factory system also has a center channel in the dash so I will have to work to blend it in and try to get the best stereo separation and center image that I can. I think that I am like you in that I like to try to keep it as simple as possible.
> 
> Are you still liking your Boston SPZ's??? I ran the Boston Pro Series back in the early 90's in a competition car and I absolutely loved them. I also was running all SoundStream DII series amplifiers. I had a center channel in my car in 1990 using a Boston Pro 4.2 set with an Audio Control ESP-3. It was a lot of work removing the entire dash and fabricating brackets and etc... but it was well worth it in the end. I am going to run a Polk MM6501 set in this car just because I want to try something different.


I am interested in the SS 3way setup. The tweeter has me intrigued and the midrange is the same (great decision there and the midbass I believe has a little more excursion capability so I think it would be a moderate or possible upgrade over the ppi set (to me anyway). In a vehicle like a lexus I think the ppi set could really shine. Sounds like the stock locations would actually be perfect for them. I am pretty sure the set (xover etc) was designed for that placement exactly. 
I am still loving my SPZ's! I still have a LOT of work left to do with my install to get them prime. I am finishing my ported center console for my BA G510 today (hopefully). Its been built and tested with pretty good results so I have to finish making it pretty! 

WOW you were doing a center channel WAY before it was cool or common! GOOD for you! I am sure it was an assload of work (better you then me The rest of the setup was pretty killer too!
Let me know how the polk's work out. They seem like EXCELLENT comps and have been getting some really rave reviews.


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## AudioBob

When you have a certain Grand National sitting next to you in the judging lanes, you better do something unique to get some attention. At one point on IASCAs' judging sheet you received extra points for using processors. However, there were some purists out there that thought that processing was a band-aid and did not want to use it.

When I first decided to do the center channel I took some depth measurements and realized that I would have to slightly modify a/c duct work. I actually went through two dashes getting it right. Fortunately, they were not too expensive from the local pick and pulls because there were a lot of totaled Mustangs that were in like new condition!!!


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## asat11

Rexroad, have you ever heard the Pioneer PRS 720's? How would these compare? Thinking about these two setups....


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## rexroadj

I owned the prs set for a very short time. I was not a fan but I didnt give them much of a shot.... Lacking install locations and didnt get a chance to go active on it so my opinion is not exactly an acceptable one. The set had some legit potential though... As far as a comparison???? I dont think there is one.... First of all as a three way setup vs. two way there are going to be some clear distinctions..... (in my particular install). The PPI midbass is no where near as robust as the PRS..... The tweeters are a big difference also....being metal vs. soft.... I actually like metal dome tweeters because of my install location being pretty off axis. The PRS tweets did NOTHING for me... but then again I think active would have helped a great bit...I also assume being more on axis would yeild different results... I will say this, the midrange that comes with the PPI set is worth the retail price alone...this makes the set IMO. I also think that the xovers are well designed (although I HATED the terminals on it)..... Sorry I cant be of more help with your comparison...I really didnt do either set justice as far as time and or install plan... I would like to have time with both sets again


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## asat11

Gonna put them in a 96 Saturn SL2 Front doors and A pillars, power is a fosgate power 500a2, also have another power 500 running 2 10" Diamond M5 Subs. Sound deadened the trunk, rear deck and doors with 45 mil EPDM, replacing some Diamond M5 6" components that have seen better days.... The M5's seem to have lost alot of the tight mid bass they had when I had them in a 01 New Beetle.... looking to regain SQ - I can live with a bit less volume if I gain clarity and articulation, but I do like a great song loud.,... mostly rock and any kind of great guitar work....


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## isteb

i actually lusted for it.. until soundstreams rf3.6c's came out.. looks like a carbon copy or exact copy of ppi's 3.65c *sigh


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## rexroadj

The midrange is the only thing shared actually


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## onefaststang

So what are the actual differences between the 2 sets?


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## rexroadj

The xover points are different (I think) and you cant run the 3way as a two way, the midbass is completely different...Grizz talked about all the differences but I dont recall all of them, and the tweets are a great deal larger and different materials.. Cosmetically they are moderately similar. I would love to try them out personally, as the PPI set was INCREDIBLY impressive, especially for the cost!


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## onefaststang

I would like to try a set of either by I'm not sure which. I love the copper color of the ppi set but have read the mid bass is lacking.


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## moparbar

Awesome,
I am also thinking of installing this system in my '04 dodge ram. Do you think it's possible to mount the midrange in the door above the switches (behind where the side mirror mounts)? Do you think the imaging would be any better?


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## onefaststang

I emailed grizz on the differences between the 2 sets. The only real difference between them is the tweeter. The rest is just cosmetics. I ordered a set of the ppi's. Maybe I can instal them in the next couple weeks. I plan to try the mid and tweet in the factory mach 460 sail panel in my mustang. With a little work of course.


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## rexroadj

onefaststang said:


> I emailed grizz on the differences between the 2 sets. The only real difference between them is the tweeter. The rest is just cosmetics. I ordered a set of the ppi's. Maybe I can instal them in the next couple weeks. I plan to try the mid and tweet in the factory mach 460 sail panel in my mustang. With a little work of course.


? I could have swore that the midbass was a bit different... More xmax or something to that degree? I will have to look up what he said before.... Eitherway....The ppi set is great!


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## onefaststang

From what he told me the ss has a cast basket and different heatsink (magnet) shape but the drivers perform the same.


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## 91dime

What kind of mounting options do you have with the tweeters from this set?


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## rexroadj

If I remeber correctly it was only flush mount and the setups for it were terrible! (metal clips that go in the back?)
I didnt use them...I made my own...


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## tonynca

I'm thinking of picking up a set of these to replace my PPI 365cs. Do you think it's an upgrade?


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## Darth SQ

LMAO!
I have three sets of these and I still don't know what they sound like mounted. 


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## rton20s

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> LMAO!
> I have three sets of these and I still don't know what they sound like mounted.
> 
> 
> Bret
> PPI-ART COLLECTOR


And now you're going to have to buy three sets of these to replace them...
Precision Power Intros First Car Audio Speakers With AMT Tweeter | ceoutlook.com


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## tonynca

Wrong link dude

http://www.ceoutlook.com/2014/01/03...os-first-car-audio-speakers-with-amt-tweeter/

Those are ugly as hell though


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## rton20s

tonynca said:


> Wrong link dude



No. It isn't. The link I posted to was to a press release about the new Precision Power "Power Class" 3 way components with AMT Tweeter.


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## Darth SQ

Lol!
Don't do this to me. ><
Wow...they've changed everything in the set.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## AAAAAAA

The midrange in that set looks huge. Would be hard to install.


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## tat2bass

Looks like a normal size mid to me. It is an ugly ass set though. I loved the look of the previous set. And I wonder why they moved away from using the neo motors


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## mrgreenjeans71

Do these passive x-overs have more than one set of inputs? If I got a set, I'd like to power the tweets and mids separately from the woofers, using a 4 channel amp.


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## DougJones

I have a set sitting in the box. The x-overs have only one input. I'll be going active myself.


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## namesmeanlittle

rolls eyes... so putting your adverge home usage tower speakers works well in a car, glad your happy. They look like your adverge old school style build with paper cones and small magnets. Good way to build speakers, also looks like your mid has a 1.5 in coil on it that would explain power handling. things should have high sensitivity, it should only take 5-10 watts to run that.


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## nismos14

namesmeanlittle said:


> rolls eyes... so putting your adverge home usage tower speakers works well in a car, glad your happy. They look like your adverge old school style build with paper cones and small magnets. Good way to build speakers, also looks like your mid has a 1.5 in coil on it that would explain power handling. things should have high sensitivity, it should only take 5-10 watts to run that.


 u mad about something?   :laugh:


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## carztoon1

has anyone tested the new set, im interested in these. i wonder how they would sound on the charger.?


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## and_elli

carztoon1 said:


> has anyone tested the new set, im interested in these. i wonder how they would sound on the charger.?


Here you go.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...s-new-pc-65c3-3-way-components-just-came.html


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## Darth SQ

I am going to post this in all the related threads so please forgive me if you've already read this. 
This post is for anyone that is using the PPI PC3.65C 3way set that I am using.
And before anyone asks, I don't know if the following applies to the new PC3.65C set with the AMT tweeter.
Before installation, I always test speaker operation to confirm everything's working properly.
During this test, I discovered that the 2.5 midrange is 180 out of phase from the factory.
It's that way on all four sets I own so it's not a one time production line mistake. 
I called up my friend Grizz Archer who when working at Epsilon (PPI) designed this 3way set to see what he had to say.
He confirmed that what I found was correct and the reason for it was because of the way the passive crossover that comes with the set operates.
He said the phase flip was purposefully designed in because the majority of consumers don't read the installation directions and would've wired the mid wrong.
Now why this is important is because if you are going to run the 3way set active like I am, the wiring on the mid needs to be flipped to get it back in phase. 
The easiest way to tell a speaker's status is to use a 1.5 volt battery (my preference) and send positive to positive and negative to negative which will move the cone forward if it's correct.
I got a little into the weeds with this but it seemed like something that needed to be posted.
So always check your speakers before installation. 


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## All-Or-Nothing

Can the 2.5 mids be bought separately?????


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## Darth SQ

All-Or-Nothing said:


> Can the 2.5 mids be bought separately?????


Well the 2.5 set has been discontinued by Epsilon in lieu of this new set.
Maybe [email protected] has some still lying around that PPI wants to get rid of.....who knows. :shrug:


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## mikelycka

man I think I might grab the set on ebay for $150


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## TwistofKane

I'm interested in putting a set of these in a 2014 Tundra. Would the mids work mounted into the factory dash speaker location with the tweeters mounted in the sails? Or would I be better to run a pair of PPI 356CS in the doors?


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## vwjmkv

i realize this thread is a bit old, but i have the 2.5" PPIs, how low can they hi-passed?


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## onefaststang

I removed mine for a set of jbl ms-62c. Sound better and they look like better construction.


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## JetBlackE36

These certainly look killer!


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