# NEW Minidsp c-dsp 6x8



## Elgrosso

miniDSP in a BOX : C-DSP 6x8

Sweeeet


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## etroze

Holy hell that's a steal


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## hot9dog

From the outside it's a ppi/soundstream... but what about the inside???? Hmm mmmmm this COULD be a very interesting piece. I love my soundstream synthesis when I had it... this one says that it has a volume control and IR remote. ... hmm... I hope minidsp worked a little magic on the inside to improve what was done before!


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## Jon225

Anyone find pics of the 2 remotes. Looks pretty interesting.


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## fcarpio

About time.


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## Elgrosso

There's a drawing of the remote in the manual, I guess it looks like their regular VOL-fp box.
The DSP itself seems to have same specs than DEQ8 (?)


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## slowsedan01

Oh SNAP. Looks exactly like the PPI/SS units. I'm sure they had to wait until the contract period or non compete expired before they could offer this. I'm in.


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## Babs

Well well well!! 
This looks rather juicy!

Item Description
Digital Signal Processor 172MHz, 28/56bit 
Digital Signal Processor, ADAU1445
Control Driverless USB 2.0 control interface for control from Windows or Mac OS X
Audio inputs 4 x High level (Terminal Block) - Max 8 Vrms
4 x low level Unbalanced (RCA) inputs - Max 4 Vrms
Audio outputs 8 x outputs on RCA connector - Max 2Vrms 
ADC/DAC Resolution 24-bit, 48 kHz
Digital Audio input 1 x SPDIF on RCA connector, transformer isolated Asynchronous sample Rate converter for signal 44.1 to 192 kHz
Wired external Remote External wired remote for control of active preset, master volume and master mute; LED indication of master volume and active preset. Provides power and data connection to the external remote via RJ11 cable.
microSD Card Allows setup and firmware upgrade of the unit offline without a laptop
Power supply Isolated DC-DC conversion for Car Audio environment
Dimensions (H x W x D) mm 41 x 205 x 122 mm
Enclosure Powder coated metal enclosure with removable mounting brackets


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## vwjmkv

i think MiniDSP just got a new customer! and i thought i wanted to get a Mosconi 6to8, or Arc DSP


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## 1996blackmax

It's nice to have another alternative!


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## rton20s

I've been very pleased with my 6to8 V8 and will not be switching, but this looks like it may be the new value leader.


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## 1fishman

The price is right for sure. 

Looks more like a 4 to 8, than a 6 to 8. 

Edit ;
I got this remote today from Mini DSP for a DEQ. 8. I'm hoping the one that comes with this c- DSP is in a case with a knob...


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## canuckaudio

Looks like a good option for someone like me who wants an inexpensive DSP, but it's a little different than the PEQ.8 .....doesn't have a graphic eq (just the parametric), and the output voltage is lower. The "custom biquad programming" seems interesting (in the manual).


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## AngryHog

Jon225 said:


> Anyone find pics of the 2 remotes. Looks pretty interesting.


I'm pretty sure it only comes with the wired remote. It has a learning capability to utilize an existing infrared remote you may already have. Talks about it in the manual (available on their site). I was just days away from pulling the trigger on one of their larger units and adapting it for the car. This may just be what I'm looking for. Would like to see an actual picture of the wired remote though.

-AngryHog


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## drop1

canuckaudio said:


> Looks like a good option for someone like me who wants an inexpensive DSP, but it's a little different than the PEQ.8 .....doesn't have a graphic eq (just the parametric), and the output voltage is lower. The "custom biquad programming" seems interesting (in the manual).


Is it parametric only or does it act like some of the other models where as it accepts plugins?


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## aj2thec

Hi All,

I just got the email too. Great timing as I'm about to bin my PS8 due to the never ending issues with it.

I've been out of the game a while - would anyone care to comment on the pros and cons of this unit vs something like the PS8 or BitOne?


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## TwistdInfinity

I was about to get an android tablet to install, think I'll get windows now for real time control oh yeah! 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## slowsedan01

TwistdInfinity said:


> I was about to get an android tablet to install, think I'll get windows now for real time control oh yeah!
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Now you're on to something. I was just reading the manual, and it seems as long as the tablet can support Adobe Air and Adobe Flash programs and you can get the USB to operate in host mode on the tablet that it might work...


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## ggk

It even has a turn on delay to get rid of amp pop built in to the remote turn on.


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## Hillbilly SQ

This looks like a great no-nonsense dsp. You don't have to spend big money to play with the big boys. I'll keep this processor in the back of my mind in case my 88r starts having problems, but should be in the clear with my particular unit. On the biquad calculator, I never could figure it out. Never put much time into trying to figure it out though. I have a pair of 2x4's that served me well for over a year.


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## Kevin K

Will be interesting to see the plugins available for this particular unit.


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## fcarpio

hot9dog said:


> From the outside it's a ppi/soundstream... but what about the inside???? Hmm mmmmm this COULD be a very interesting piece. I love my soundstream synthesis when I had it... this one says that it has a volume control and IR remote. ... hmm... I hope minidsp worked a little magic on the inside to improve what was done before!


I emailed MiniDSP about this and their answer was that their version has much higher quality components. Their other versions are very good, just not as good.


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## BowDown

Awesome. If I didn't have a helix I would jump on it. 

Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


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## hot9dog

fcarpio said:


> I emailed MiniDSP about this and their answer was that their version has much higher quality components. Their other versions are very good, just not as good.


Very cool! This opens the door now for minidsp, I see this company evolving as time goes by into a heavy hitter. Good for them! The best thing that I liked about my Synthesis, was how easy it was to use the software. It was very straightforward and it made sense. I had great results with the advanced menu for the crossover.


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## Gannz

In for one.


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## BlueGhost

I don't see anything that lets you toggle between inputs, I'm guessing this is something that could be done using presets? Could I set up the presets so that Preset 1 = SPDIF, Preset 2 = RCA IN 1&2, Preset 3 = RCA IN 3&4?

If this were out a year ago, I might have gone with it instead of the DSP-88R.


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## Babs

If this has the same EQ setup as the typical MiniDSP, there's already an EQ match in Room EQ Wizard for doing auto-EQ trims geared to plug into the MiniDSP program. Bam! 

Anyone mess with the software tool? 
I wonder if it's anywhere near as slick as the Helix V3 tool which is damn good.
I guess you gotta sign in on an account to download it.


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## beerdrnkr

It'd be great if it had de-equalization for a stock hu. 

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk


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## Babs

beerdrnkr said:


> It'd be great if it had de-equalization for a stock hu.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk



Helix DSP tool now has input EQ


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## crazhorse

The ppi deq8 has 31 band input eq left/right and 6 band parametric output... I guess we are high and dry getting any sort of updates....


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## Lycancatt

keep in mind the ppi 88r was just a mini dsp 4x8 and really built quite badly..so I hate to say it, but I'm very skeptical of this units ability to improve on that.

also, with that 2v max output, most people will need a line driver to keep system noise down and volume up..which adds around another $150 or so to get at least 6 channels of line driver..so I dunno how budget friendly this really is.


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## Duncanbullet

BowDown said:


> Awesome. If I didn't have a helix I would jump on it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G928V using Tapatalk


Same here, actually i just sold my miniDSP 2x4 about a week ago lol

Looks like a great item, i knew i was happy with my 2x4. and if it wasnt for me being a psychoacoustic maniac, i would still have it.


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## 1fishman

Lycancatt said:


> keep in mind the ppi 88r was just a mini dsp 4x8 and really built quite badly..so I hate to say it, but I'm very skeptical of this units ability to improve on that.
> 
> also, with that 2v max output, most people will need a line driver to keep system noise down and volume up..which adds around another $150 or so to get at least 6 channels of line driver..so I dunno how budget friendly this really is.


I think you have that wrong. The PPI DEQ.8 is Mini DSP based. 
The 88R is from another company with at least 3 or 4 clones.


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## AngryHog

BlueGhost said:


> I don't see anything that lets you toggle between inputs, I'm guessing this is something that could be done using presets? Could I set up the presets so that Preset 1 = SPDIF, Preset 2 = RCA IN 1&2, Preset 3 = RCA IN 3&4?
> 
> If this were out a year ago, I might have gone with it instead of the DSP-88R.


This is an issue for me also. I really want the ability to select multiple inputs (1 for my stock system in, like I do now on a 360.2, 1 for the SPDIF for the Rhaspberry Pi I'm about to run at 24-bit, 1 each for a pair of RCA's to the front and back of the car for the average schmoe who wants to play something off their phone, etc). Having to use up my presets in order to simulate this (as you suggested) kills some of the appeal to me. I still want different presets also (time alignment centered on the driver, another for the passenger, one for RTA, etc)

-AngryHog


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## Lycancatt

1fishman said:


> I think you have that wrong. The PPI DEQ.8 is Mini DSP based.
> The 88R is from another company with at least 3 or 4 clones.



you may be right on this, I just know the 88r was absolutely horrid and I thought it was minidsp based and didn't want anyone else to buy one.


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## TwistdInfinity

So just to clarify, when they say it has real time control via it's driverless USB interface, is this any different to the way the normal miniDSP products work?

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## rton20s

Lycancatt said:


> you may be right on this, I just know the 88r was absolutely horrid and I thought it was minidsp based and didn't want anyone else to buy one.


1fishman is correct. The PPI DEQ.8 and Soundstream Synthesis were MiniDSP based. The PPI DSP-88R and Soundstream Harmony come from some other Chinese company.


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## 1996blackmax

I bought the remote for my DEQ.8 from miniDSP. With it, the unit has the ability to switch to the digital input. It also lets you pick from four sound presets. I would think that it's the same with this unit.


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## Big T

Lycancatt said:


> keep in mind the ppi 88r was just a mini dsp 4x8 and really built quite badly..so I hate to say it, but I'm very skeptical of this units ability to improve on that.
> 
> 
> 
> also, with that 2v max output, most people will need a line driver to keep system noise down and volume up..which adds around another $150 or so to get at least 6 channels of line driver..so I dunno how budget friendly this really is.



The 88R has nothing to do with MiniDSP. The DEQ8 was and was a very nice peice


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## 1996blackmax

Agreed....the DEQ.8 is a very nice piece. I'm very happy with my unit.


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## Lanson

rton20s said:


> 1fishman is correct. The PPI DEQ.8 and Soundstream Synthesis were MiniDSP based. The PPI DSP-88R and Soundstream Harmony come from some other Chinese company.



And if you guys recall, the DEQ.8 internally is built with components of lower quality than a MiniDSP. We can assume that this unit has the same quality as the other MiniDSP's but I'd like to see the guts to be sure. 

That said, its between this and the Core-1 for my next two builds. And this is winning the money and brand battle so far. 

But also, 2v... that's what the MS-8 runs and its not been a problem (for me at least.) So I'm not worried about that.


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## Big T

fourthmeal said:


> And if you guys recall, the DEQ.8 internally is built with components of lower quality than a MiniDSP. We can assume that this unit has the same quality as the other MiniDSP's but I'd like to see the guts to be sure.
> 
> That said, its between this and the Core-1 for my next two builds. And this is winning the money and brand battle so far.
> 
> But also, 2v... that's what the MS-8 runs and its not been a problem (for me at least.) So I'm not worried about that.



Incorrect. They used higher grade components than the off the shelf MiniDSP. The processor was one upgrade they did. But there were several others.


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> Incorrect. They used higher grade components than the off the shelf MiniDSP. The processor was one upgrade they did. But there were several others.


So I understand, you are saying the DEQ.8 used higher grade components than MiniDSP? Because that's what I was contending.

There were a few threads about that and in the end, it was proven that the MiniDSP has superior components inside.


Now, if you were saying that this new MiniDSP has better guts, well that's just gravy points and a great thing.


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## rton20s

fourthmeal said:


> So I understand, you are saying the DEQ.8 used higher grade components than MiniDSP? Because that's what I was contending.
> 
> There were a few threads about that and in the end, it was proven that the MiniDSP has superior components inside.
> 
> 
> Now, if you were saying that this new MiniDSP has better guts, well that's just gravy points and a great thing.


I was hoping for some clarity on that as well. The previous post someone made regarding an email from MiniDSP had to many "theirs" and not enough specific names for me to make heads or tails of it.  I didn't bother to ask a follow up though, as it doesn't really affect me.


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## Lanson

I wonder if they'd consider the 10 channel version in the future.


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## rton20s

fourthmeal said:


> I wonder if they'd consider the 10 channel version in the future.


And maybe adding some upmixing for a center channel?


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## hot9dog

The synthesis / deq8 had inferior components compared to the other minidsp products in their catalog. it didn't mean that those units sold by Epsilon were crap.. far from it, they sounded great and were a great value at the time.
BUUUUTTTT.....it was proven that the Epsilon units did not have the resolution that the minidsp products did. That's why when I first saw this thread, my first question was towards the internal components used for this new offering...but it looks like they did revamp the internals. The lower voltage was never an issue for me when I used the Synthesis, the signal was clean and never had volume ratio issues.


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## Lanson

rton20s said:


> And maybe adding some upmixing for a center channel?


I wonder if you can use a plugin to do center with this one, actually. That's the appeal of MiniDSP, you can use all sorts of plugins. At least that's what I understand, I've not used one before.


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## Gannz

MiniDEQ 2x8 > DEQ.8/Synthesis > MiniDEQ 2x4

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/technical-advanced-car-audio-discussion/164475-processor-advice-2.html#post2121039

Safe to assume the 6x8 falls between the 2x8 and DEQ.8 as far as the quality of the internal components?


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## Lanson

Gannz said:


> MiniDEQ 2x8 > DEQ.8/Synthesis > MiniDEQ 2x4
> 
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...on/164475-processor-advice-2.html#post2121039
> 
> Safe to assume the 6x8 falls between the 2x8 and DEQ.8 as far as the quality of the internal components?



We can grab the specs of each from their site, and compare them directly. But this one looks awesome so far, by the PDF's I've read.


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## Big T

hot9dog said:


> The synthesis / deq8 had inferior components compared to the other minidsp products in their catalog. it didn't mean that those units sold by Epsilon were crap.. far from it, they sounded great and were a great value at the time.
> 
> BUUUUTTTT.....it was proven that the Epsilon units did not have the resolution that the minidsp products did. That's why when I first saw this thread, my first question was towards the internal components used for this new offering...but it looks like they did revamp the internals. The lower voltage was never an issue for me when I used the Synthesis, the signal was clean and never had volume ratio issues.



Incorrect. Ryan upgraded several items for the Deq8 and Synthisis like the processor so it would be higher quality as the base product it was designed off of. 
They already built these for another company but he made several upgrades. I would like to think MiniDSP kept them for their production unit


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## Hillbilly SQ

Lycancatt said:


> you may be right on this, I just know the 88r was absolutely horrid and I thought it was minidsp based and didn't want anyone else to buy one.


Either you got a bad unit or the install was crap. My 88r is flawless with no strange quirks whatsoever. Maybe I got an updated version with the flaws ironed out or just got lucky? I know several people personally (as in met in person, known for years, and trust) that run the 88r/have run the 88r and not a single one of them has had problems. I also know for a fact that they're competent installers.


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## Hillbilly SQ

And as for the comments about needing a linedriver with 2v outputs, you shouldn't have to worry about having much of a noise floor if you stick with at least decent quality gear. Anyone remember what the purpose of an amp gain is for?


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## hot9dog

Big T said:


> Incorrect. Ryan upgraded several items for the Deq8 and Synthisis like the processor so it would be higher quality as the base product it was designed off of.
> They already built these for another company but he made several upgrades. I would like to think MiniDSP kept them for their production unit


It was already proven that the epsilon units were of lesser resolution than the minidsp offerings at the time, but as I said... that wasn't a bad thing.


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## Big T

I don't know where you got your information. But you should verify it first. I know for a fact it was upgraded. How can you compare it to the original board. You don't know who They built it for to compare it. It wasn't listed any where on their page.


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## Hillbilly SQ

Big T said:


> Incorrect. Ryan upgraded several items for the Deq8 and Synthisis like the processor so it would be higher quality as the base product it was designed off of.
> They already built these for another company but he made several upgrades. I would like to think MiniDSP kept them for their production unit


Any proof about the Epsilon units being upgraded other than what Ryan told you? I'm not doubting you, just skeptical about a company that has so many turds in their lineup. You really have to be careful and take what a company rep says with a grain of salt. If I hadn't of gotten such a good deal on my 88r I wouldn't have bought it, and had actually sworn off everything that has to do with Epsilon.


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## Big T

Ryan is not my company rep. He is my friend.. He tells us what's going on. As team members we hear a lot of what goes on behind the scene. 
I am pretty sure it's the same board (or pretty close)in the MiniDSP version


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## hot9dog

First initial design by minidsp, epsilon spearheaded the project to get it to the marketplace, epsilon made revision changes to the internal components. ..those changes made the released version a lesser resolution than the minidsp offerings at the time, epsilon contract ended with minidsp, minidsp revamped the board and released controller board option. But as I said... those comprised design decisions by epsilon were not a make or break thing. The units were still very good.


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## Big T

No. They already private labels them. Epsilon came in and made changes to upgrade what they already made to produce these. 
MiniDSP already made the remote board before Epsilon was involved. I have 2 of the 3 samples remote boards that was sent to Epsilon. Sells wasn't great so epsilon didn't make the investment to order the remotes and tool for a housing. 
They won't tell you at MiniDSP who else they build for because the ant contractually obligated not to. So you can't say it's not as good. How can you know. I however know the upgrades were done because Ryan was extremely excited when he got to do a DSP and was telling up what all was going into it. 
Technically they did not have an option at the time for car audio that wasn't priva liable for someone else


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## Big T

But I am excited about this and think it will be a great peice


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## hot9dog




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## slowsedan01

Heard back from Minidsp about running the software on a Windows tab. They're willing to send me the download link for the C-DSP software to try on a Win tab, only problem is I don't have one. 

Does anyone reading have a Win tab and would be willing to try installing the software to see if it works?


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> Incorrect. Ryan upgraded several items for the Deq8 and Synthisis like the processor so it would be higher quality as the base product it was designed off of.
> They already built these for another company but he made several upgrades. I would like to think MiniDSP kept them for their production unit



What you are saying isn't congruent with the actual photos taken of each unit's internals though. The chipset and all that are lower grade in the DEQ.8. This is photographed fact.


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## Big T

How is it photographic fact. Who's DSP was the other board?


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> How is it photographic fact. Who's DSP was the other board?


How perfect it is that the post number is #42

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/2121039-post42.html

The important tidbit:

"- DAC Asahi Kasei Microsystems AK4440EF - 93dB THD, 105dB Dynamic Range, 48Khz Sampling Rates.
- ADC Asahi Kasei Microsystems AKM5386 - 96dB THD, 110dB Dynamic Range, 48Khz Sampling Rates.
While in the 2x8 they use:
- DAC/ADC Cirrus logic CS42528 - 100dB THD, 114dB Dynamic Range, 96Khz Sampling Rates.
(as a reminder: 3dB difference is twice more or less efficient... 114dB is 8 times more efficient than 105dB, with twice the samplig rate it is not a gap but an abyss between these chips!)

They advertised the Soundstream and PPI DSP with all technical specifications of the DAC/ADC embedded in the 2x8 board, but in fact they put more cheaper components... A scam really.
@DonutHands: since you own a PPI DEQ-8, I urge you to open your DSP and confirm the reference of the DAC/ADC I have in my own copy.

The DSP chip is the same Analog devices SigmaDSP ADAU1445, but it run at 48Khz Sampling Rates in the Soundstream and PPI (same as the 8x8 board) and at 96Khz Sampling Rates in the 2x8.
That's why you have some limitations in the Soundstream and PPI you don't have on the 2x8, such as:
- Level Setting in 0.5dB step, while it is 0.1dB step in the 2x8.
- Delay in 0.02ms step, while it is 0.01ms step in the 2x8."


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## Big T

Again. Where are you getting your misinformation. 
And you have never stated what brand DSP that comes from and also the info isn't correct. The DEQ8 has a 96kHZ sampling rate where as states 48 above.

BTW. I think the post above is talking about MiniDSPs 2X8 which isn't their car stuff. Compare apples to apples


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> Again. Where are you getting your misinformation.
> And you have never stated what brand DSP that comes from and also the info isn't correct. The DEQ8 has a 96kHZ sampling rate where as states 48 above.
> 
> BTW. I think the post above is talking about MiniDSPs 2X8 which isn't their car stuff. Compare apples to apples


Bud that's never what I said or meant and I don't know why this is even a thing, as we don't have enough info on the new one yet. I meant that the model of MiniDSP that was out while the DEQ.8 was out had superior components.

Apples to apples, we don't have that yet because nobody's popped the cover of this new one, that I know of. All we can glean from right now is the data sheet, let's see if we can pull useful info:

Digital Signal Processor
172MHz, 28/56bit Digital Signal Processor, ADAU1445

ADC/DAC Resolution
24-bit, 48 kHz

Hardware
110dB SNR ADC IC & DAC



edit this thread tells a lot
http://www.minidsp.com/forum/hardware-support/10585-support-for-a-dsp-that-is-minidsp-based

Mbquart1 is an alias of BigT


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## Big T

Your saying the one they had out at the time was superior. Which is false. Not talking about the new one. The DEQ8 was an upgraded version of what they made at the time. Apples to apples. Nothing to do with this one. But you keep posting incorrect specs about the DEQ8 and specs on their non car boards. You don't compare car audio to home audio equptment. The other products MiniDSP made for automotive use at the time had inferior parts


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## Big T

Let's start over. The DEQ 8 is built off a platform they use for Private label DSP. It was already in production for other companies. 
Ryan did several upgrades to the board to make it better than the ones they had. That's why they had a couple
Of remotes in stock and made runs on them sometimes because they are used with the private label stuff.. That's what I am saying. You compare to that. Not their home equptment


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## Hillbilly SQ

The way I see it the only way we'll know which unit is "better" is for a third party to evaluate each board. Otherwise, we're beating a dead horse. I still won't believe the Epsilon version is upgraded until I see documented proof from a reliable third party. After what they did to the PPI and Soundstream brand name I just can't see them upgrading anything if the average customer won't be able to tell a difference.


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> Your saying the one they had out at the time was superior. Which is false. Not talking about the new one. The DEQ8 was an upgraded version of what they made at the time. Apples to apples. Nothing to do with this one. But you keep posting incorrect specs about the DEQ8 and specs on their non car boards. You don't compare car audio to home audio equptment. The other products MiniDSP made for automotive use at the time had inferior parts



At the time, MiniDSP had no automotive use products and per that thread you were in as Mbquart1, they admitted that in the thread, that while they haven't made anything for car audio yet, some people (like ZeblodS) have adapted units anyway, made cases for them and power supplies, etc and did it DIY. So it is impossible for us to even compare a MiniDSP product that was or wasn't made for the car. All we can compare is the 2x8 which has many times been said to be the "match" to the DEQ.8. At no point was any other DSP by MiniDSP compared to or against the DEQ.8. edit: and I'm not talking about OEM or non-branded products, I'm talking about products that you could go on to MiniDSP's website and purchase. Prior to this new unit, nothing like it existed so that's why I used the 2x8 as comparison, and indeed why ZeblodS did as well. 

And as far as posting incorrect specs, I'm simply providing a thread where the research was done by someone else, who sat both boards side by side and created the comparison. 

If you want to be argumentative about simple facts and photographs, I want no part of it and I'll say you win, just because it isn't worth my time to try and be helpful, only for someone who wants to argue. 



On to the "new" one
But now that this new unit's basic specs are published by MiniDSD, we know it is more on-par with the DEQ.8 in as far as sampling rate and bit depth. That probably explains the price point being what it is. That said, it still looks to be a great unit. I'd like to see the guts of the Core-1 and what DSP, sample rate, and bit depth it operates with. Very limited info there.


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## Lanson

Hillbilly SQ said:


> The way I see it the only way we'll know which unit is "better" is for a third party to evaluate each board. Otherwise, we're beating a dead horse. I still won't believe the Epsilon version is upgraded until I see documented proof from a reliable third party. After what they did to the PPI and Soundstream brand name I just can't see them upgrading anything if the average customer won't be able to tell a difference.



Exactly, literally until we start pulling cases and "voiding warranty" (heh), we'll not know. Nice thing about the new MiniDSP unit, it probably doesn't have a void warranty sticker on the case, because you're supposed to get into the case to pull jumpers to engage and disengage features. So, that's nice. But the Core-1 will most likely be a warranty-breaker to pop into and compare further.


edit: I think I'm going to email them and try to extract info, and see if anything can be learned about it.


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## DS-21

Big T said:


> No. They already private labels them. Epsilon came in and made changes to upgrade what they already made to produce these.
> *** for car audio that wasn't priva liable for someone else



Can you provide a link to this mysterious other private label product or products?


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## Lanson

For the record and total clarity, I was never speaking about private label products (quite frankly didn't know about them or care.) Only MiniDSP branded and sold products. 

I think that's where all of this got off on the wrong foot. At any rate, it is good to learn the "ins'.


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## hot9dog

Ok... I've had my coffee this morning. There seems to be request to compare "apples to apples"... and thats what has been done. The sole purpose of a DSP is manipulate the signal to the operators commands. The circuit board and it's components are ignorant to the fact of where it is being used (home, studio or car environment ) signal in...signal out. That's it. Don't get me wrong BigT... I'm not trying to get into a pissing contest with you (I don't have to time for hypocrisy )... I just know for a fact that the epsilon units were of a lesser resolution than the minidsp units that were sold "during that time ".


----------



## Big T

fourthmeal said:


> At the time, MiniDSP had no automotive use products and per that thread you were in as Mbquart1, they admitted that in the thread, that while they haven't made anything for car audio yet, some people (like ZeblodS) have adapted units anyway, made cases for them and power supplies, etc and did it DIY. So it is impossible for us to even compare a MiniDSP product that was or wasn't made for the car. All we can compare is the 2x8 which has many times been said to be the "match" to the DEQ.8. At no point was any other DSP by MiniDSP compared to or against the DEQ.8. edit: and I'm not talking about OEM or non-branded products, I'm talking about products that you could go on to MiniDSP's website and purchase. Prior to this new unit, nothing like it existed so that's why I used the 2x8 as comparison, and indeed why ZeblodS did as well.
> 
> And as far as posting incorrect specs, I'm simply providing a thread where the research was done by someone else, who sat both boards side by side and created the comparison.
> 
> If you want to be argumentative about simple facts and photographs, I want no part of it and I'll say you win, just because it isn't worth my time to try and be helpful, only for someone who wants to argue.
> 
> 
> 
> On to the "new" one
> But now that this new unit's basic specs are published by MiniDSD, we know it is more on-par with the DEQ.8 in as far as sampling rate and bit depth. That probably explains the price point being what it is. That said, it still looks to be a great unit. I'd like to see the guts of the Core-1 and what DSP, sample rate, and bit depth it operates with. Very limited info there.



Yes they did. They they make DSPs for a couple of companies....that's why they have the controllers and where Ryan got the base board. 
As far as what they did to the PPI name. That was DEI. Epsilon has come a long way to bring them back. They some of the best components out.


----------



## Big T

I am not trying to get into a pissing contest either. Just defending the facts


----------



## Big T

fourthmeal said:


> For the record and total clarity, I was never speaking about private label products (quite frankly didn't know about them or care.) Only MiniDSP branded and sold products.
> 
> I think that's where all of this got off on the wrong foot. At any rate, it is good to learn the "ins'.



Exactly. Misunderstanding... Lol. As far as the other private labels. Ryan told me a couple but I can't remember. When I had asked MiniDSP who they made them for so I could order remote, They said they were contractually obligated not to tell. Again sorry about the rant.


----------



## Gannz

Mine shipped. ETA is Monday the 5th. I'll open what I can without voiding the warranty and take pics when it arrives.


----------



## Lanson

OK so moving forward, aside from Private Label stuff which won't matter because you can't buy it anyway, we have a "new" unit from MiniDSP with their own name on it, and I think most importantly, their undivided full support because it isn't "OEM".

We know it specs about the same as the DEQ.8 in as far as chipset frequency, sampling rate, and bit depth.


Is this the appropriate thread to now compare this unit vs. the Core-1? Or is that for another thread? I've pulled their specs from their video and screen-snipped them, for comparison.


----------



## Big T

Fourthmeal. Sent
You a PM


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

What I'm most interested in is how the wired remote looks on the 6x8. As long as it's in a case and not just a raw board...


----------



## DS-21

Big T said:


> Exactly. Misunderstanding... Lol. As far as the other private labels. Ryan told me a couple but I can't remember.



I call BS, simply based on the fact that if anyone had a similar DSP on the market _it would have been discussed here._


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Could be units that are isolated to specific regions and hard to get outside of that region.


----------



## Big T

Sorry guess you missed it


----------



## Gannz

Hillbilly SQ said:


> What I'm most interested in is how the wired remote looks on the 6x8. As long as it's in a case and not just a raw board...


+1. Based on the crude drawing in the PDF it looks like it's in a case. I'll post pics of the remote on Monday also.


----------



## Big T

Hillbilly SQ said:


> Could be units that are isolated to specific regions and hard to get outside of that region.



That could be.. I don't think it was what I would call a high end brand that Ryan told me. It wasn't a really cheesy one either tho..


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

When DS-21 shows up to the party it's time for spectators to kick back and grab the :snacks:


----------



## Big T

Gannz said:


> +1. Based on the crude drawing in the PDF it looks like it's in a case. I'll post pics of the remote on Monday also.



Yes. It looks like it's in a case. But the volume LEDs look diffrent than ours


----------



## Lanson

I was going to say the same of Victor_Inox but since he's banned I guess he won't be joining in.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Either way, I and most likely a lot of others appreciate Gannz being the guinne pig.


----------



## Big T

I want to order one after finals for my work truck and get rid of my Symmetry. Lol. Wonder if we could flash it with the DEQ 8 firmware and get it to run its software and have the 31 band graphic also

Also do you have to buy the plug in also?


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

fourthmeal said:


> I was going to say the same of Victor_Inox but since he's banned I guess he won't be joining in.


I knew this place seemed a little more peaceful lately but just couldn't put my finger on the reason:laugh:


----------



## hot9dog

fourthmeal said:


> I was going to say the same of Victor_Inox but since he's banned I guess he won't be joining in.


Oh wow. .... was away for a couple of days and I miss everything. ... the back story must be interesting! Lol


----------



## 1fishman

The Remote looks good, nice small black box.
I couldn't transfer the photo with my phone.


----------



## iamstubb

A lot happens when you are out for a bit. I just saw this in a mini-DSP newsletter as I was going to order a couple unbalanced boxes for a new build. Now I have to change my plan to get this. I have been running 2 2x4 unbalanced in my installation. Now I will try this and report back. Anyone interested in used but excellent condition 2x4's?


----------



## 1fishman

Hillbilly SQ said:


> What I'm most interested in is how the wired remote looks on the 6x8. As long as it's in a case and not just a raw board...


It does look nice, in a case/box 4 buttons and knob. 
I'd love to get that box and knob for my DEQ. 8 remote board.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

1fishman said:


> It does look nice, in a case/box 4 buttons and knob.
> I'd love to get that box and knob for my DEQ. 8 remote board.


Where can I find pics of the remote? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## 1fishman

I think I figured it out.


----------



## teldzc1

1fishman said:


> I think I figured it out.



I really wish something like this was available for the Helix.


----------



## Hanatsu

Was about to start a thread about it, you beat me to it!

I will most likely get one soon and test it extensively.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

1fishman said:


> I think I figured it out.


Cheers mate. Doesn't load on tapatalk so I had to jump over to the Web page, but yeah looks good! 
It's a little big I think to fit in the spare tray thing underneath my climate controls on a gen 4 Subaru Legacy though. Might look into a custom faceplate. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Big T

1fishman said:


> I think I figured it out.



Cool. Where did you find it


----------



## Babs

teldzc1 said:


> I really wish something like this was available for the Helix.



Director yo 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## iamstubb

This looks pretty powerful. 6 input and 6 output PEQ filters each channel, with matrix for mixing and summing channels and lots of crossover options. Time delay input/output gain and inversion. Looks a lot more powerful than the mini 2x4 and way more capability than the DEQ8 had. I like the preset/remote option as well. I also like the remote options. I am looking forward to using this.


----------



## 1fishman

Big T said:


> Cool. Where did you find it


They emailed me the photo yesterday. 

I the week after I ordered the remote board only for the DEQ.8. I wounder how much it would have cost to get the complete one with the case.


----------



## Big T

Don't know. Would like to see if they interchange.


----------



## Weigel21

Not sure I like the (4) analog inputs and (1) digital stereo input for the total of (6) inputs.


----------



## Weigel21

fourthmeal said:


> I was going to say the same of Victor_Inox but since he's banned I guess he won't be joining in.


Really? Somewhat of a shame. He contributed useful information, though I'll admit it seemed half of his posting was trolling another member.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Weigel21 said:


> Really? Somewhat of a shame. He contributed useful information, though I'll admit it seemed half of his posting was trolling another member.


Try and keep posts on topic guys. 

1fishman, do you by any chance have the dimensions of the remote plate? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Weigel21 said:


> Not sure I like the (4) analog inputs and (1) digital stereo input for the total of (6) inputs.


Yes, I would prefer to have 2 digital inputs, one from head unit and one from my tablet hmm

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Kriszilla

I wish this had subwoofer level control along with main volume on the remote. If it did, I'd be all over it. That's the downside of running 3 subs with 2 amps. *grumbles in the corner*


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Kriszilla said:


> I wish this had subwoofer level control along with main volume on the remote. If it did, I'd be all over it. That's the downside of running 3 subs with 2 amps. *grumbles in the corner*


Replace your 2 amps with 1 big amp, or 2 amps that are strappable with a master/slave config and a sub level remote dial like my hertz hp1kd? 

And I just realised the digital input is coax? There goes my optical outputs from tablet and head unit, without adding ANOTHER adapter into my system. Damn 

Edit: So most miniDSP boards have an I2S bus on it right? Is there an input port on this to accept I2S from say, a miniDIGI? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Lanson

I've emailed MiniDSP about whether or not this unit will accept a center / surround plugin. That will make a difference as to if it can truly replace the MS-8 in some builds.


----------



## redit

slowsedan01 said:


> Heard back from Minidsp about running the software on a Windows tab. They're willing to send me the download link for the C-DSP software to try on a Win tab, only problem is I don't have one.
> 
> Does anyone reading have a Win tab and would be willing to try installing the software to see if it works?


The software works on $68 HP Stream 7 tablet from Groupon. I bought one last week (on the suggestion of PB in this thread) and used one of these to connect it to a miniDSP 2x4. Works great.


----------



## 1fishman

TwistdInfinity said:


> Try and keep posts on topic guys.
> 
> 1fishman, do you by any chance have the dimensions of the remote plate?
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


No, i don't have dimensions. But i'd estimate 3.25-3.5" long, by 1.5" tall.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

redit said:


> The software works on $68 HP Stream 7 tablet from Groupon. I bought one last week (on the suggestion of PB in this thread) and used one of these to connect it to a miniDSP 2x4. Works great.


I'm still interested in their real time claim. I haven't used my miniDSP software at home for a while but I remember it being a case of making changes and hitting apply? Then it uploads to the unit. 

I'm hoping for real time when I make a change to say the EQ and I hear it change instantly, like with my h701 controlled via touch screen head unit. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## YukonXL04

So when using this new dsp with the remote, do you have to control the volume from the remote or can you still control volume with your radio. In my case a aftermarket double din. Also can you run front and sub into it, and still control sub level from the radio?


----------



## Weightless

MiniDSP is real time adjustments. No need to apply to send config.

And yes, you can use the volume control from your hu.


----------



## Big T

YukonXL04 said:


> So when using this new dsp with the remote, do you have to control the volume from the remote or can you still control volume with your radio. In my case a aftermarket double din. Also can you run front and sub into it, and still control sub level from the radio?



Yes to both. The reason for the volume control is mostly for factory HU that have bass boost at low volume. You set it up and use the DSPs volume so the bass doesn't change with the volume.. With the aftermarket HU you won't need that cause they don't have that volume EQ.

As far as the sub, what ever channel you connect the sub input to, you will route that channel to the sub out channel. Should work fine.


----------



## Lanson

Well MiniDSP has not emailed me back yet about center/surround abilities, so hopefully one of you guinea pigs will be able to tell me soon.

I have a build hinging on that ability for a friend.


----------



## Big T

You can route left and right inputs to a single output to get a summed center. Although derived would be better


----------



## Elgrosso

fourthmeal said:


> Well MiniDSP has not emailed me back yet about center/surround abilities, so hopefully one of you guinea pigs will be able to tell me soon.
> 
> I have a build hinging on that ability for a friend.


Do you mean using their center/rearfill plugin and the 6x8 plugin in the same time on the same device?


----------



## dwaleke

Elgrosso said:


> Do you mean using their center/rearfill plugin and the 6x8 plugin in the same time on the same device?


The 6x8 plugin should have matrix routing option. Where you can add L/R together and output as C.

I haven't seen it yet though.


----------



## Elgrosso

dwaleke said:


> The 6x8 plugin should have matrix routing option. Where you can add L/R together and output as C.
> 
> I haven't seen it yet though.


Ha ok, yes it does:


I thought about their other plugin:
http://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/Product Brief-Rear-Center channel plug-in.pdf
That could be used with another 2x4

Btw, go it yesterday!





Too busy to install it soon but I might open it to see the board, not that I could "read" it, but maybe someone here…


----------



## teldzc1

Can that remote toggle between main and sub volume?


----------



## Lanson

Got an email back from MiniDSP, it does do center/surround.

MS-8 veterans looking for an alternative, meet it!


----------



## Elgrosso

teldzc1 said:


> Can that remote toggle between main and sub volume?


Probably not, but not sure. Could certainly switch between different sub settings.



fourthmeal said:


> Got an email back from MiniDSP, it does do center/surround.
> 
> MS-8 veterans looking for an alternative, meet it!


Yeah? Cool!
Do you have more details?


----------



## vwjmkv

Elgrosso said:


> Ha ok, yes it does:
> 
> 
> I thought about their other plugin:
> http://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/Product Brief-Rear-Center channel plug-in.pdf
> That could be used with another 2x4
> 
> Btw, go it yesterday!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too busy to install it soon but I might open it to see the board, not that I could "read" it, but maybe someone here…


looks pretty nice, how's the build quality? 
let us know how you like it compared to a BitOne or Mosconi 6to8v8


----------



## Lanson

Elgrosso said:


> Yeah? Cool!
> Do you have more details?



Not sure what you mean, except you made a post just before mine explaining what the MiniDSP people wrote in their email, that you can matrix channels together to create center and surround.


----------



## 1996blackmax

Very nice....looks like this will be for me when I pass my car down along with all its gear to my daughter.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

So the user manual shows in the software that there are two spdif inputs but there is physically only one on the unit, why is this? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## dwaleke

TwistdInfinity said:


> So the user manual shows in the software that there are two spdif inputs but there is physically only one on the unit, why is this?


I saw the same think. Maybe an internal header?


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Yeah that could be right, as it does only accept stereo pcm, but strange way to display it as spdif 1 and 2, not left and right 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## slowsedan01

Oddball question: If the C-DSP and Massive Core--1 were the same price which one would you guys get? Obviously they aren't, but if they were, which would you say has the advantage?


----------



## jpswanberg

slowsedan01 said:


> Oddball question: If the C-DSP and Massive Core--1 were the same price which one would you guys get? Obviously they aren't, but if they were, which would you say has the advantage?


Considering I would never own anything Massive, the answer for me is easy. Others? Who knows. JPS


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Steak House said:


> One difference I do see is the DEQ-8 has a 31 Band Graphic EQ vs a second set of parametric EQs for the C-DSP. With the 31 Band Graphic I was able to use a signal generator and balance each of the 31 bands to the center of the windshield - this resulted in a nice SQ improvement. I'm not sure how difficult/possible that would be with the 6 band parametric on the input side. (noob alert)


I honestly think this is a Ford vs Chevy kind of thing. I prefer a good parametric eq most of the time, but do agree that there are situations where a graphic eq would work better. The big thing I've noticed with my install is if you use a scalpel approach with the peq you'd be shocked at how few bands are actually needed to get everything centered up. I've heard a few systems that were so processed that the life was completely sucked out of the sound. If you can get everything centered while maintaining that richness in the sound you're on the right track. I do like the graphic/parametric hybrid eq the 88r has. I also miss having a separate eq for each input and output.


----------



## Lanson

slowsedan01 said:


> Oddball question: If the C-DSP and Massive Core--1 were the same price which one would you guys get? Obviously they aren't, but if they were, which would you say has the advantage?



They are VERY close, right now. The Core-1 is $349 with coupon code, and this one is $275 + $20 shipping to the states. MiniDSP is from Hong Kong, and the Core-1 is from the states and ships free.

Core-1 can't do Center channel
Core-1 uses what I believe is a slightly lesser DAC and DSP processor set (would love to compare these specs with experts in the field to confirm)
Core-1 has a much better remote out system
Core-1 has better voltage control to protect your gear
We don't know if Massive Audio will support the unit or not yet (I mean like forums, enhance the product routinely, etc), but MiniDSP is always evolving and improving.
Core-1 looks better to me, and it looks smaller for what it is worth.
C-DSP has a remote, Core-1 uses the bass knob with extra buttons to do the same thing. That's a toss-up I think.
Both look easy to use
MiniDSP has BiQuads, not sure the Core-1 can do that. And with that, MiniDSP can then work with room equalization programs to work like a long-way-around auto-calibrate.


Can anybody else think of things valuable in the comparison between the two? Right now, the price is almost the same so...


----------



## slowsedan01

fourthmeal said:


> They are VERY close, right now. The Core-1 is $349 with coupon code, and this one is $275 + $20 shipping to the states. MiniDSP is from Hong Kong, and the Core-1 is from the states and ships free.
> 
> Core-1 can't do Center channel
> Core-1 uses what I believe is a slightly lesser DAC and DSP processor set (would love to compare these specs with experts in the field to confirm)
> Core-1 has a much better remote out system
> Core-1 has better voltage control to protect your gear
> We don't know if Massive Audio will support the unit or not yet (I mean like forums, enhance the product routinely, etc), but MiniDSP is always evolving and improving.
> Core-1 looks better to me, and it looks smaller for what it is worth.
> C-DSP has a remote, Core-1 uses the bass knob with extra buttons to do the same thing. That's a toss-up I think.
> Both look easy to use
> MiniDSP has BiQuads, not sure the Core-1 can do that. And with that, MiniDSP can then work with room equalization programs to work like a long-way-around auto-calibrate.
> 
> 
> Can anybody else think of things valuable in the comparison between the two? Right now, the price is almost the same so...


Good analysis so far fourthmeal. A few more items of comparison:

C-DSP has a digital input. Core-1 does not.
Core-1 supports APTX Bluetooth streaming via the seperate bluetooth dongle. C-DSP does not.
Core-1 uses dual Analog Devices DSP chips with TI NE5532 Opamps. Not sure what's in the C-DSP.
Core-1 has some automated logic for calculating time delay values based on measurements.

On paper it seems like the Core-1 might have a slight advantage. The only thing that concerns me is the long term support of the unit from Massive.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Steak House said:


> Which one is the Ford than? It's the better one.


Depends which unit is more reliable over time. That's the Ford. The Chevy MIGHT handle better though


----------



## Arete

So this DSP will support a 4 way active system correct? Sub, midbass, midrange, and tweeter? 

Do you guys suspect this would be a good DSP for a person that is new to processors and tuning? 

I'm likely going to start with a 2 way... midwoofer, tweet, and subs but down the road will likely add the dedicated mid range to the setup once I have some tuning experience under my belt. 

What seem to be the most apparent limitations of this DSP? I'm not very knowledgeable when it comes to processors so looking at the specs isn't going to tell me much. It likely won't be until I get my feet wet and start messing with one that I will truly understand many of the pros and cons of these units. So right now I'm going on reviews and opinions... 


Would something like the Helix DSP be significantly more user friendly and give me features that are crucial with tuning? I mention this unit because right now it does seem to be the forum favorite....


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

So, I see voltage control on the Core-1 to protect your gear. What's that all about? And a bass knob on the remote makes a lot more sense to me than having two volume knobs as long as you're running a source that doesn't pull bass out as the volume goes up. To me, the Core-1 is sounding like it makes more sense at this point.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Arete said:


> So this DSP will support a 4 way active system correct? Sub, midbass, midrange, and tweeter?
> 
> Do you guys suspect this would be a good DSP for a person that is new to processors and tuning?
> 
> I'm likely going to start with a 2 way... midwoofer, tweet, and subs but down the road will likely add the dedicated mid range to the setup once I have some tuning experience under my belt.
> 
> What seem to be the most apparent limitations of this DSP? I'm not very knowledgeable when it comes to processors so looking at the specs isn't going to tell me much. It likely won't be until I get my feet wet and start messing with one that I will truly understand many of the pros and cons of these units. So right now I'm going on reviews and opinions...
> 
> 
> Would something like the Helix DSP be significantly more user friendly and give me features that are crucial with tuning? I mention this unit because right now it does seem to be the forum favorite....


I think this would be a great unit to start with. It will do everything you need to do. I'm not familiar with the Helix unit but I don't see any "good" reason to pay more for it if something less than half the price will do what you need. Reliability shouldn't be a factor because even the most expensive processors can have issues.


----------



## Arete

Hillbilly SQ said:


> I think this would be a great unit to start with. It will do everything you need to do. I'm not familiar with the Helix unit but I don't see any "good" reason to pay more for it if something less than half the price will do what you need. Reliability shouldn't be a factor because even the most expensive processors can have issues.


Thank you sir! Being that I don't know a whole lot about processors I guess my main concern would be what I may be missing from the more expensive units. Cost doesn't always hint toward a feature rich device but sometimes it does. I don't want to get the Minidsp and then find out later I'm missing an integral feature of the tuning tool kit. 

So from what you've read thus far about the device you don't see it missing any features that may be important? or worth the extra coin that many of the other DSPs cost?


----------



## slowsedan01

Hillbilly SQ said:


> So, I see voltage control on the Core-1 to protect your gear. What's that all about? And a bass knob on the remote makes a lot more sense to me than having two volume knobs as long as you're running a source that doesn't pull bass out as the volume goes up. To me, the Core-1 is sounding like it makes more sense at this point.


You have to use the Core 1 as the trigger for the remote output to your amps. If it detects that voltage falls below 10v it will shut down the remote output so your amps won't operate in a low voltage condition.


----------



## Elgrosso

Few pics guys, I'll let the more knowledgable describe it. Not a surprise, it looks like the Deq8 (http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/2126488-post20.html):











DEQ8:


----------



## Kriszilla

Interesting. What's that connector touching the SPDIF input?


----------



## dwaleke

I was hoping for something on par with the 2x8/8x8 platform. Too bad this uses lower performing components.

Well I bought it so might as well use it.


----------



## Gannz

Still a great deal IMO even though it looks to be identical to the DEQ.8/Synthesis. The DEQ.8 sells used for $200-250 on the forum. That's without the warranty, remote, or updates/support you get with the C-DSP.


----------



## Lanson

Steak House said:


> So much for this having higher quality components than the DEQ-8...
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for posting.


To be fair, we were originally talking about the other MiniDSP products in that particular comparison. I expected this unit to be pretty much exactly the DEQ.8. 


NOT that this is a bad thing for the price, IMO.


----------



## Big T

So my suspicions were right. It's made from the leftover DEQ8s they had already built that PPI never ended up ordering


----------



## Lanson

Steak House said:


> No mate - that was not a shot at you. On the first page fcarpio emailed Minidsp and they claimed this had higher quality components than the PPI/Soundstream.



oOh, I see now!

Whoops on them, I guess!


----------



## Darth SQ

Big T said:


> You can route left and right inputs to a single output to get a summed center. Although derived would be better


Ya think? 
This is a problem I have with a number of dsps.
IMO a summed center narrows the stage.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


----------



## Big T

But you do it right and you don't need center

We used the ms8s logic 7 for center and rear. A little aiming and a little time and the car and truck sound better without center


----------



## Elgrosso

Kriszilla said:


> Interesting. What's that connector touching the SPDIF input?


It's just for one screw for the front panel.

I can't say anything about the components, but I'm just glad they made a car box ready with everything power remote etc, and probably some future updates for the plugins. (Maybe the rear fill/surround one, sharc or why not dirac one day?)


----------



## Darth SQ

Big T said:


> But you do it right and you don't need center
> 
> *We used the ms8s logic 7 for center and rear. A little aiming and a little time and the car and truck sound better without center*


Gee that sounds familiar. 


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


----------



## Lanson

I did well with a center, but it was a big one with a relatively low cross point, and was a two-way design.

But I agree, deriving would be better. Logic7 is going to be superior to a summation


----------



## Big T

Mine was a 2 way crossed at 180. I still use the Logic 7 for rear. But after we got everything aimed and timed the center hurt more than it helped


----------



## Darth SQ

Big T said:


> Mine was a 2 way crossed at 180. I still use the Logic 7 for rear. But after we got everything aimed and timed the center hurt more than it helped


I wonder Ed if the remote will interface with the Soundstream Synthesis and if it can be bought separately.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


----------



## 1996blackmax

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> I wonder Ed if the remote will interface with the Soundstream Synthesis and if it can be bought separately.
> 
> 
> Bret
> PPI-ART COLLECTOR


I was wondering the same thing.


----------



## Big T

I would almost bet it would. I wonder if the DSP would run on the DEQ software to get the 31 band eq


----------



## Lanson

Big T said:


> Mine was a 2 way crossed at 180. I still use the Logic 7 for rear. But after we got everything aimed and timed the center hurt more than it helped


I think that's where the difference lies. With a relatively large center like an RS125-4, I was able to cross about 95Hz @ 24dB/oct. This is where the center became "worth it".


----------



## vwjmkv

I'm still looking around for a good DSP. I've noticed that Mosconi and Audison have nice looking controllers. the BitOne has the controller included. the other DSPs I'm looking into the controllers are a separate ~$50-$100 purchase. 

with the being said, i noticed that the Helix DSP and this new MiniDSP controllers are, at least in the pictures kind of ugly and look cheap. 

is that just me?


----------



## Darth SQ

vwjmkv said:


> I'm still looking around for a good DSP. I've noticed that Mosconi and Audison have nice looking controllers. the BitOne has the controller included. the other DSPs I'm looking into the controllers are a separate ~$50-$100 purchase.
> 
> with the being said, i noticed that the Helix DSP and this new MiniDSP controllers are, at least in the pictures kind of ugly and look cheap.
> 
> is that just me?


Yeah very bare bones no fluff and no form put into it.
I think Ed's approach to making it aesthetically pleasing was impressive. 
Maybe he'll post a pic.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


----------



## Babs

vwjmkv said:


> I'm still looking around for a good DSP. I've noticed that Mosconi and Audison have nice looking controllers. the BitOne has the controller included. the other DSPs I'm looking into the controllers are a separate ~$50-$100 purchase.
> 
> with the being said, i noticed that the Helix DSP and this new MiniDSP controllers are, at least in the pictures kind of ugly and look cheap.
> 
> is that just me?



Looks be deceiving there. The Helix DSP and DSP Pro are easily arguably about as good as you can ask for. They're no fluff and minimalistic in typical Spartan German fashion, but extremely well put together solid chassis. Fear not with Helix. The standard 2-knob remote isn't exactly fancy, but gets it done. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## 1996blackmax

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> Yeah very bare bones no fluff and no form put into it.
> I think Ed's approach to making it aesthetically pleasing was impressive.
> Maybe he'll post a pic.
> 
> 
> Bret
> PPI-ART COLLECTOR


I think he did a very good job with the remote cover. I ended up getting two from him as I have two remotes for the DEQ.8.


----------



## Gannz

No doubt the Mosconi and Bitone have much nicer remotes. The Helix DSP Pro also has a sweet remote. The price is also much higher on all three of those units vs. the C-DPS. 

We all have various priorities/needs but, for me, I don't need the volume control and I prefer a stock look so my remote won't ever be visible. I'll just need to have occasional access to the presets. I'm just happy it actually has a case. LOL


----------



## Big T

The wife's car


----------



## Gannz

I can fit the remote in my ash tray but I already have my sub gain there. The C-DSP remote is 3.5" W x 1.5625" T x 1.25" D BTW. I don't see any way to do it with the software but I know some DSP remotes can be set to control either the system volume or sub gain. Anyone know if it's possible to use the C-DSP volume control to control the sub gain?


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Thanks for the heads up on remote size! 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Wooptido

Just ordered one yesterday. Kinda surprised but they say it will be here Friday from Hong Kong. I’ve got the Rastafari mail mon though… he’s always late so I’ll probably get it next week. I’ll let you guys know how it works out.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Both of my dealings with them have been fast shipping with them as well. One day to fly over to the states and then regular mail to where it has to go.


----------



## Gannz

FYI, Mine came FedEx and had to sign for delivery.


----------



## freemars

Sorry if this is a super noob question, but does anyone know if the C-DSP 6x8 does any sort of de-equalization of a factory signal? 

I couldn't find the answer on the MiniDSP site or in the manual. I am looking to put this into a 2011 F150 SuperCrew, retain the factory deck (non-Sony w/Sync) and go 2-way active with sub. I am super new to DSPs and trying to compare it to options like the 360.3 or Cleansweep.


----------



## dwaleke

freemars said:


> Sorry if this is a super noob question, but does anyone know if the C-DSP 6x8 does any sort of de-equalization of a factory signal?
> 
> I couldn't find the answer on the MiniDSP site or in the manual. I am looking to put this into a 2011 F150 SuperCrew, retain the factory deck (non-Sony w/Sync) and go 2-way active with sub. I am super new to DSPs and trying to compare it to options like the 360.3 or Cleansweep.


It does not. Everything you do with the Minidsp is done manually.

Feed your test signals through your headunit and then you can EQ out what the factory has done by adjusting the Minidsp to achieve your target curve.


----------



## freemars

dwaleke said:


> It does not. Everything you do with the Minidsp is done manually.
> 
> Feed your test signals through your headunit and then you can EQ out what the factory has done by adjusting the Minidsp to achieve your target curve.


Thanks for the reply. 

I have read some factory head units apply EQ based on volume. Do you know if you can address this using the C-DSP? Now, that I typed that out, I am guessing this is what the volume on the C-DSP would be for? Set the factory volume, leave it alone and control system volume with the C-DSP?


----------



## Big T

Exactly


----------



## Wooptido

Thanks Hillbilly! Thanks for the heads up Gannz!


----------



## Alextaastrup

Did anybody try to program volume control based on different ear frequency sensitivity at various volumes? Like loudness... Or even better.


----------



## ricren

This unit would be perfect for me if there was an optical input instead of coaxial. I wonder how difficult would be to hack an optical receiver in there. 
A subwoofer level knob would be nice too. 
Right now I use a Rockford 360.3 and I think that it has the best minimalist control of the low priced units.


----------



## wlbolton

Gannz said:


> FYI, Mine came FedEx and had to sign for delivery.


Because the unit is so new, the verdict is still out on the Mini DSP-C 6x8 Processor. I am soliciting your feedback about the unit. I am interested in integrating this unit into my factory system which is a 2006 Acura TL. I will retain the Center speaker (used for Navigation) and the Rear speakers (used for rear fill), however, I will be adding the below equipment:

Image Dynamic 6.5 Components
Image Dynamic Sub-Woofer
Precision Power -4- Channel Amp (P900.4)
Precision Power Mono Block Amp P1000.1)

My initial intent is to utilize High level inputs from the Head Unit to the Mini DSP-C and run the components Active, using the Mini DSP-C to set crossover points.

Input 1 - Tweeters > Output 1/2
Input 2 - Mid's > Output 3/4
Input 3 - Sub-Woofer > Output 5

The Acura TL Head Unit only outputs 1v. Will this create a problem for the Mini DSP-C?

Will I need a Line Driver to increase the Head Unit output?

Are there any advantages/disadvantages using High level inputs versus low level?

In your professional opinion, what would be a better buy, the Precision Power DEQ-8 at $235.00 or the Mini DSP-C at $295.00, taking into consideration future upgrades?

Thank you in advance and any insight you can provide will be greatly appreciated.

Sincerely,

Wayne


----------



## 1996blackmax

Is the center channel speaker only for navigation? In my case it is not, so it took away from the overall sound of the system. I ended up feeding the center channel signal into one of the inputs on the DEQ. I did this so that I could use the EQ & time alignment functions with it. Now the center channel speaker blends in much better.

As for future upgrades, I would go with the Mini DSP unit. There really is no support for the DEQ.8 from PPI. Mini DSP was nice enough to get us the remote controls & software for our DEQ.8 units.


----------



## slowsedan01

wlbolton said:


> Because the unit is so new, the verdict is still out on the Mini DSP-C 6x8 Processor. I am soliciting your feedback about the unit. I am interested in integrating this unit into my factory system which is a 2006 Acura TL. I will retain the Center speaker (used for Navigation) and the Rear speakers (used for rear fill), however, I will be adding the below equipment:
> 
> Image Dynamic 6.5 Components
> Image Dynamic Sub-Woofer
> Precision Power -4- Channel Amp (P900.4)
> Precision Power Mono Block Amp P1000.1)
> 
> My initial intent is to utilize High level inputs from the Head Unit to the Mini DSP-C and run the components Active, using the Mini DSP-C to set crossover points.
> 
> Input 1 - Tweeters > Output 1/2
> Input 2 - Mid's > Output 3/4
> Input 3 - Sub-Woofer > Output 5
> 
> The Acura TL Head Unit only outputs 1v. Will this create a problem for the Mini DSP-C?
> 
> Will I need a Line Driver to increase the Head Unit output?
> 
> Are there any advantages/disadvantages using High level inputs versus low level?
> 
> In your professional opinion, what would be a better buy, the Precision Power DEQ-8 at $235.00 or the Mini DSP-C at $295.00, taking into consideration future upgrades?
> 
> Thank you in advance and any insight you can provide will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Wayne


Fellow Jacksonvillian here! Yes the C-DSP is new, but miniDSP has been around a long time and alot of guys have used the other DSP boards that they make including me. miniDSP was even the OEM for the DEQ-8. I would say considering the DEQ-8 has been discontinued and there's no support any longer from PPI that the C-DSP is the way to go.

The concern I would have about using the Acura pre-outs is I think that some of them have balanced outputs, so I would double check that the C-DSP can accept a balanced signal. 1V would be fine. I'm running a modified OEM Honda Accord deck that's putting out 2v peak to peak at full volume and I have no noise. I would try to keep the DSP close to the deck though so you lessen the opportunity to introduce noise through a long cable run.


----------



## Wooptido

My C-DSP came in this week and I finally got some time to work on it. The setup definitely takes some time and several passes. It’s easily to get ear fatigue comparing settings. 
The DEQ 8 software does also work which is nice option. Personally I like the graphic EQ from the DEQ 8 because I’m not used to a parametric yet. 
I don’t like the volume knob on the remote. There’s no visual confirmation of where the volume is. The instructions show an LED scale but it’s not there on mine. I’d prefer to leave it off and just use my Pioneer remote but then you lose the configuration buttons. Still new to this though so there may be some options that will make it work for me.


----------



## PorkCereal

Really interested to see how well this thing works out. I'm wanting to use one of these to pull a signal off my stock Sony amp.


----------



## Gannz

Finally got around to installing mine. Couldn't be happier. I read the posts/polls/advise regarding a DSP being a great way to improve SQ but in the back of my mind I'm thinking... how much of a difference can it really make? I'm not a doubter any more. LOL Completely took away the harshness/fatigue I was getting from the highs and raised my stage height even with stock speaker locations. I can use more amp now and play it louder without having to severely EQ the highs.

And, I haven't even started to fiddle with REW or the PEQ (using the GEQ, did the TA based on physical measurements and calculations, set the crossovers based on driver specs and the slopes based on general recommendations).

I'm going to get a mic and figure out REW, PEQ, and also experiment with physical placement of the front drivers.

Anyone know if I can use my Audyssey mic with REW?


----------



## emilime75

Your best bang for the buck will probably be the Minidsp UMIK. You'll get a call file with it and it works well with REW.


----------



## Gannz

Thanks. Considering that or the Dayton iMM6 if the Audyssey won't work. Was reading that I shouldn't use the mic port on my laptop with REW and that's the only way I can hook up the Audyssey. But, the Dayton also uses a 3.5mm connection so maybe the Audyssey on my Android with an RTA app? Or, if anyone has a used UMIK they'd want to part with...


----------



## emilime75

The problem with the Audyssey or any other random mic is that you don't know how accurate it is. When using the Audyssey mic with the device (AV reciever) that it came with is fine because a cal file is part of the Audyssey software to account for any anomalies in that mic.

This is why you want to use a mic that you know is very accurate or one that you have a calibration file for that you can load into the measurement software you intend to use, in this case REW. 

With an unknown mic, you'll get inaccurate measurements and end up trying to fix things that aren't actually there.

Measuring and comprehending the results from those measurements is not a trivial thing. If you really want to get into this, do yourself a favor and start with something that's useable...then read, read, read.


----------



## Gannz

10-4. Thanks. I was thinking a mic is a mic is a mic. Should have known better. LOL


----------



## iamstubb

The iMM6 is less than $20 and you can download a calibration file specific for the mic from their website based on serial number. If you have a laptop that uses 1 jack for headphones/mic in combination, then you are set. If not, then you may need a splitter, but these are also cheap on Amazon.


----------



## Gannz

Thanks. I blew my budget about $1500 ago so I wouldn't mind saving a few bucks and getting it faster if it's going to work as well, or close to it, as the UMIK. My laptop does have separate jacks for the mic/headphone. So, this...

Amazon.com: StarTech MUYHSFMM 3.5mm 4 Pin to 2x3 Pin 3.5mm Headset Splitter Adapter - F/M: Electronics

Plus this...

Amazon.com: StarTech.com MUHSMF2M 2m 4 Position TRRS Headset Extension Cable: Electronics

... is what I need?


----------



## iamstubb

Gannz said:


> Thanks. I blew my budget about $1500 ago so I wouldn't mind saving a few bucks and getting it faster if it's going to work as well, or close to it, as the UMIK. My laptop does have separate jacks for the mic/headphone. So, this...
> 
> Amazon.com: StarTech MUYHSFMM 3.5mm 4 Pin to 2x3 Pin 3.5mm Headset Splitter Adapter - F/M: Electronics
> 
> Plus this...
> 
> Amazon.com: StarTech.com MUHSMF2M 2m 4 Position TRRS Headset Extension Cable: Electronics
> 
> ... is what I need?


That's it. If you have an auxiliary input for you system, then you will want a cable to connect that to the mic as well. That setup makes doing sweeps in REW very easy. You will like the results one you get to doing some serious tuning.


----------



## str8shot

Has anyone determined if the software for the c-dsp will allow REW imports?

The software for the DEQ.8 was missing that feature.

From what I understand, the only difference (unless the above is true - accepts REW imports) between this and the DEQ.8 is the parametric EQ on the inputs vs the DEQ.8 31 frequency graphic EQ.

Correct?


----------



## axipher

str8shot said:


> Has anyone determined if the software for the c-dsp will allow REW imports?
> 
> The software for the DEQ.8 was missing that feature.
> 
> From what I understand, the only difference (unless the above is true - accepts REW imports) between this and the DEQ.8 is the parametric EQ on the inputs vs the DEQ.8 31 frequency graphic EQ.
> 
> Correct?


According to the manual: https://minidsp.com/images/documents/C-DSP 6x8 User Manual.pdf

Page 28 says that it does support importing from REW.


----------



## Wooptido

Finally able to put some time into my setup. I tried to do the front first and wasn’t thinking when I turned my head unit cross over off… blew one of my rear speakers on the way in to work. Needless to say I had to wait for the new ones to come in. Talk about feeling stupid... 
The DSP definitely does make things sound better and less harsh as Gannz said. Just takes a bit of time to adjust everything once you start making EQ adjustments. Very cool how quickly the time alignment makes a difference though! I haven’t added the subs yet just front and rear. I’ll try to make some time this weekend to see how that goes.


----------



## Lanson

I think you can also load DEQ.8 software on it.


----------



## Wooptido

You can run DEQ 8. That's what I am running. I more used to the Graphic EQ so it was the easiest for me. Big T was asking earlier in the thread so I checked to answer his question... and liked it a little better.


----------



## Big T

Woo Hoo. Now I know I can use them. Just didn't like the idea of no 31 band. Lol


----------



## Wooptido

LOL!


----------



## crazhorse

I wanted to try the c-dsp software with my deq8 is the only place to get it is with the dsp itself ? Cant find a download on their site...


----------



## crazhorse

Thought so... oh well


----------



## Big T

Get someone who has it downloaded to send you a copy


----------



## Wooptido

PM me your email address Craz


----------



## Wooptido

Hey, are you guys RTA’ing to one of the standard curves or just using that as a starting point? I’m not sure if I need a different Mic or what but it doesn’t sound very good trying to make it a perfect curve… I’m using the Dayton Audio iMM-6 with the calibration file. I don’t want to buy the UMIK-1 if I’m going to have the same experience but if that’s the missing element then it would be worth it… I have things sounding pretty dang good with my own tweaking but it makes me wonder if it could be better


----------



## Gannz

Wooptido said:


> Hey, are you guys RTA’ing to one of the standard curves or just using that as a starting point? I’m not sure if I need a different Mic or what but it doesn’t sound very good trying to make it a perfect curve… I’m using the Dayton Audio iMM-6 with the calibration file. I don’t want to buy the UMIK-1 if I’m going to have the same experience but if that’s the missing element then it would be worth it… I have things sounding pretty dang good with my own tweaking but it makes me wonder if it could be better


I'm using the imm6 also. I think it's doing the job but I don't have anything else to compare it to. I'll try to see if I can borrow someones UMIK-1 tomorrow and check it against the imm6.


----------



## Gannz

I'm pretty happy with the unit so far. I'm a complete noob so I'm sure the more I learn/experiment the better I can get my tune.

Couple things I have noticed that I'm not happy with... there is a fair bit of noise. White/static that I can hear from the fronts when the HU is muted. Does that have to do with the relatively low output? I'm using the same RCA's as I was pre-DSP and I didn't have that noise before. Can this be corrected and/or should I even worry about it?

Bigger issue is I now have an alternator whine. Never had it before installing the C-DSP. RCA's are nowhere near the main power feed. How can I troubleshoot/correct this?


----------



## 1996blackmax

Where did you ground the DSP unit?


----------



## Gannz

Tied it into the head unit harness ground. Ground it directly to the chassis instead?


----------



## axipher

Gannz said:


> Tied it into the head unit harness ground. Ground it directly to the chassis instead?


I would give the chasis ground a try for sure. Sometimes the ground wire in the factory harness might have a lot of other electronics on it which can cause some noise which the more sensitive DSP might pick up.


----------



## Big T

Also may have the gain to high


----------



## Gannz

Changed the ground to the chassis. Still have the white noise and alt whine. 

Don't think it's the gains. I'm not a precise meter setter on the gains but I set the HU volume to 75% and adjusted the amp gains by ear. I did go up a little on the mids since installing the DSP but went down on the tweeters. It's a 100x4 JBL and the mid gains are set to about 50% and the tweeters about 30%. Before the DSP they were bandpassed at the amp at about 33%.

I haven't increased the gains at all on the DSP. I cut the output on the L Mid by 2 db and the R Tweet by 1 db when level matching.

But, just to be sure I turned them down and still have the alt whine.

Any other ideas?


----------



## Big T

What about the input level on the dsp


----------



## Gannz

All inputs at 0 db on the DSP.


----------



## beerdrnkr

Just received mine a couple of days ago. Very quick shipping! I had the DEQ8 in my Subaru and it was a great unit but I sold it once I traded in my car. I used a 3sixty.3 in my new truck but I received it through a trade and the outputs ended up being bad and blowing my tweeters. I'll install this new mini-dsp next week and compare it to the DEQ8. I really love that it has the controller and hi-level inputs considering I'm using the stock hu in my truck.


----------



## ninetysix

Very happy with my 6x8 so far, I'm using it for 3 way active between 2x alpine type R 8" subs on the floor up front, Boston spz60 mids and spz tweets. 4x100 Boston class a/b amp for the mids and tweets, and 2 soundsteam Picasso nano 450w mono class D amps, one for each frontsub.

It replaced a minidsp 2x4 balanced that I was using to cross+eq the subs and the previously passive components. I was having some noise issues with the 2x4, but the problem was most likely with the minidc or perhaps even a slight ground loop, if not the butchered rca leads into phoenix terminals... Powered by a 12v lithium battery it was clean as a whistle, but with the minidc off the cars 12v I would get intermittent weird switch mode power supply kinda noises, like having a hearing test. I switched to a meanwell 15w dc-dc isolating power supply and it was better, but occasionally it would still pop up without any apparent cause.

Enter the c-dsp 6x8.... And its clean! Spent a while with my ear against the tweeter, starting the engine flashing high beams etc... And I just can't find any noise  

And now that I have a dedicated volume knob + spdif in, I'm making the leap to a tablet headunit. I'll probably leave the headunit in still just for radio with a different preset to switch between analogue inputs and spdif, until I can sort out a reliable radio receiver for the tab. Picked up a $20 PCM2704 USB DAC with coax out and so far off the laptop it's even cleaner still. The signal seems to be effectively a lot stronger too, with spdif the input meter gets closer to 0 but never above while the rca from my head unit was hard to find the right balance of not going over 0 and also not having to crank the amp gains because it just wasn't loud enough. 

For some reason the output to my mids runs a bit hotter than the subs or tweets, occasionally getting past 0 so I've got them on -2dB and upped the gains ever so slightly on the amp.


Cheers


----------



## Skippman

ninetysix said:


> Very happy with my 6x8 so far, I'm using it for 3 way active between 2x alpine type R 8" subs on the floor up front, Boston spz60 mids and spz tweets. 4x100 Boston class a/b amp for the mids and tweets, and 2 soundsteam Picasso nano 450w mono class D amps, one for each frontsub.
> 
> Enter the c-dsp 6x8.... And its clean! Spent a while with my ear against the tweeter, starting the engine flashing high beams etc... And I just can't find any noise
> 
> And now that I have a dedicated volume knob + spdif in, I'm making the leap to a tablet headunit. I'll probably leave the headunit in still just for radio with a different preset to switch between analogue inputs and spdif, until I can sort out a reliable radio receiver for the tab. Picked up a $20 PCM2704 USB DAC with coax out and so far off the laptop it's even cleaner still. The signal seems to be effectively a lot stronger too, with spdif the input meter gets closer to 0 but never above while the rca from my head unit was hard to find the right balance of not going over 0 and also not having to crank the amp gains because it just wasn't loud enough.
> 
> For some reason the output to my mids runs a bit hotter than the subs or tweets, occasionally getting past 0 so I've got them on -2dB and upped the gains ever so slightly on the amp.
> 
> 
> Cheers


Incoming n00b questions. 

I'm running an Android based head unit right now with possibly the worlds worst internal DAC. My goal is to bypass that and use a DSP to control the audio environment. The C-DSP 6x8 is on my short list for a lot of reasons, but cost being a big one.

If I use the same PCM2704 that you're using I'm assuming it's driverless as you're going to be using it with a tablet. Is that correct?

It should pump out two channel stereo only via this adapter due to a limitation of the Android OS. Is that also correct?

And if the above two statements are true, I can adjust the fade on the speakers using the DSP so that it biases to the front of the vehicle for better staging, regardless of the fact that the head unit is only outputting 2 channel stereo via the USB DAC?


----------



## SPLEclipse

Yes, you can adjust the individual levels of each speaker with the DSP. Although unrelated to your question, I'm able to adjust the overall volume of the digital USB stream (to the DAC) with my Nexus 7, and some other digital sources are capable of this as well.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Not all driverless USB chips work on all tablets either I've found.

Prett sure fading on the head unit would not work either. As you said it will only output in stereo. Any fading control will have to be from the dsp end. 

Keep in mind that Android tablets only output at 16/44 I think it is, but if you download USB audio player pro it has a usb driver built into the app that can allow your usb audio chip to output at it's full potential.

My car has just been in a prang, and if it's a write off I'll likely also go a tablet and the c dsp route. However I am thinking a Windows tablet might be the go so I can control the dsp from the tablet and have less headaches with drivers. 

I was thinking the miniSTREAMER from tablet the into c dsp would be good but realised the miniSTREAMER only does optical not coaxial spdif out... Any idea how I could get the I2S data from the miniSTREAMER to the c dsp? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Skippman said:


> Incoming n00b questions.
> 
> I'm running an Android based head unit right now with possibly the worlds worst internal DAC. My goal is to bypass that and use a DSP to control the audio environment. The C-DSP 6x8 is on my short list for a lot of reasons, but cost being a big one.


From what I read about a few android head units (joying etc) if you use a USB DAC it will only output sound from media files, Google maps or streaming services which android natively handles. The radio and I think CD/DVD will only work thru the built in awful DAC 



> If I use the same PCM2704 that you're using I'm assuming it's driverless as you're going to be using it with a tablet. Is that correct?


I'm actually using it with a phone (see my thread in the car pc forum) but yeah basically any USB DAC will work natively from lollipop onwards, and can be made to run in KitKat with a little effort. There's a thread on head-fi with many that people have had success with. I've also used a behringer uca202 which outputs optical or high quality RCA analogue stereo (only 1Vrms tho I think)



> It should pump out two channel stereo only via this adapter due to a limitation of the Android OS. Is that also correct?


Yes 2 channel spdif lossless, I don't think android can do DTS/DD 5.1



> And if the above two statements are true, I can adjust the fade on the speakers using the DSP so that it biases to the front of the vehicle for better staging, regardless of the fact that the head unit is only outputting 2 channel stereo via the USB DAC?


Fading the output within the head unit may have no effect on the output of the DAC for the reasons above, but don't quote me on that  but with the c-dsp or minidsp 2x4 or basically any kind of DSP you only need 2 channels which you can then route where ever you want, ie 2 channels to front tweeters, 2 channels to front mids, 2 channels to rear speakers and 1 channel (outputting both left and right signals) to sub. You can individually adjust the volume of each and every output as well as time alignment to achieve awesomeness. You can use 4 channels in and route them accordingly so you can adjust fade from the head unit while driving, but with the 4 presets on the c-dsp you could set them up for various scenarios (like spdif in, analogue in, no rear fill, no sub).


Cheers


----------



## ninetysix

SPLEclipse said:


> Yes, you can adjust the individual levels of each speaker with the DSP. Although unrelated to your question, I'm able to adjust the overall volume of the digital USB stream (to the DAC) with my Nexus 7, and some other digital sources are capable of this as well.


I'm using my c-dsp as my volume control but adjusting android system/media volume works too. I've had to leave mine about 2-3 clicks from full as the input meter shows it occasionally going over 0, which my laptop with the same DAC doesn't do


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Not all driverless USB chips work on all tablets either I've found.
> 
> Prett sure fading on the head unit would not work either. As you said it will only output in stereo. Any fading control will have to be from the dsp end.
> 
> Keep in mind that Android tablets only output at 16/44 I think it is, but if you download USB audio player pro it has a usb driver built into the app that can allow your usb audio chip to output at it's full potential.
> 
> My car has just been in a prang, and if it's a write off I'll likely also go a tablet and the c dsp route. However I am thinking a Windows tablet might be the go so I can control the dsp from the tablet and have less headaches with drivers.
> 
> I was thinking the miniSTREAMER from tablet the into c dsp would be good but realised the miniSTREAMER only does optical not coaxial spdif out... Any idea how I could get the I2S data from the miniSTREAMER to the c dsp?
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Both my USB DACs worked straight away driverless on my win7 and win8 laptops, wouldn't a windows tab be the same? I assume no otg would be necessary either


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I was referring to the android tablets having driver issues. Not all usb audio chips work on all Android tabs and phones even if they say they are driverless.

I would prefer to use an android tab as they have much better front end programs for use in the car, but most dsp's need a Windows program to configure them so it might be easier to use a Windows tab, and then I can add heaps of other devices without worrying if the drivers will work or not

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

Oh yeah I actually helped someone put a head unit in one of those cars lol 

Edit: No idea how this ended up here, this was meant for something else haha

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

What? How did I miss this?! Thanks! And it's cheaper than the other one too. This only does 24/96 whereas the other is 24/192 but I don't have any music higher than 96 so no worries for me there 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> I was referring to the android tablets having driver issues. Not all usb audio chips work on all Android tabs and phones even if they say they are driverless.
> 
> I would prefer to use an android tab as they have much better front end programs for use in the car, but most dsp's need a Windows program to configure them so it might be easier to use a Windows tab, and then I can add heaps of other devices without worrying if the drivers will work or not
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Ah right I'm with ya.

Hopefully one day somebody will put together an android app for it, should be compatible seeing it uses adobe air. It sucks not being able to tweak on the go.

I figure if you've got a nexus/aosp based tablet or phones running lollipop or better, and using one of the many proven DACs then you can't go wrong  cept for the lowly 16/44.1


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## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> Ah right I'm with ya.
> 
> Hopefully one day somebody will put together an android app for it, should be compatible seeing it uses adobe air. It sucks not being able to tweak on the go.
> 
> I figure if you've got a nexus/aosp based tablet or phones running lollipop or better, and using one of the many proven DACs then you can't go wrong  cept for the lowly 16/44.1


Yeah I researched for ages on the best value for money 24/96 USB to Optical receiver and came up with the HiFiMeDIY Sabre U2 and then when I plugged it into my Alpine PXA-H701 DSP it was all crackly and stuff, then I realised the 701 didn't support that rate! The Sabre was upsampling the android 16/44 to 24/96. Using UAPP it could change the output sampling rate to that of the file played which worked, but it meant I couldn't play spotify etc.

Anyhow that's a bit OT from the C-DSP thread sorry!

Is anyone with the C-DSP remote able to tell me if the remote unit is a box, or just a faceplate? The little cubby where I thought it might fit is too small, so I might be able to 3D print a custom faceplate to fit it all in plus another button I want to mount


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Yeah I researched for ages on the best value for money 24/96 USB to Optical receiver and came up with the HiFiMeDIY Sabre U2 and then when I plugged it into my Alpine PXA-H701 DSP it was all crackly and stuff, then I realised the 701 didn't support that rate! The Sabre was upsampling the android 16/44 to 24/96. Using UAPP it could change the output sampling rate to that of the file played which worked, but it meant I couldn't play spotify etc.
> 
> Anyhow that's a bit OT from the C-DSP thread sorry!
> 
> Is anyone with the C-DSP remote able to tell me if the remote unit is a box, or just a faceplate? The little cubby where I thought it might fit is too small, so I might be able to 3D print a custom faceplate to fit it all in plus another button I want to mount


It is a box, no brackets or anything. Don't have it on hand but it's about 80x40x40mm with an RJ11 socket on the side

I'm hoping to mount mine next to the phone I'm using as a head unit in a custom fascia that will sit over a single din slot, rather than in it as such. Probably gonna look about as ghetto as the rest of my setup, bit hey function over form 


Not my photo but here's one, can't believe minidsp don't have one on their website


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## frankmehta

Has anyone used a MiniStreamer with an Android device, using USB OTG?!


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## TwistdInfinity

Hi frank, on the miniSTREAMER page click on reviews. The first review says he used it on a Samsung note 3

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ImK'ed

Hope this isnt another forum boner....


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## frankmehta

TwistdInfinity said:


> Hi frank, on the miniSTREAMER page click on reviews. The first review says he used it on a Samsung note 3
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Thanks a zillion! I bought the miniStreamer and the C DSP 6*8 combo.


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## TwistdInfinity

Let us know your results frank. What Android device are you using? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## frankmehta

It's an Android 4.4.2 head unit with a custom firmware which is rooted, so I can take full advantage of the xposed framework to get a completely digital signal from the head unit to the miniStreamer to the CDSP. 
Then time alignment, crossover, eq removal etc. 
Also, I'd love to go active, since I have a pair of Illusion Audio CH-1 horns lying unused at home.


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## TwistdInfinity

Keep me posted will you? Very keen 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## frankmehta

Will open a thread here if I get the time.


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## PsyCLown

So I recently got an Audison Bit One and am contemplating getting one of these to replace the Bit One in a few months time - the Bit One has a few issues, like the tweeter hiss and some occasional morse code and and and - just the remote which comes with the C-DSP isn't as pretty as the Bit One remote  Or as functional, I wonder if they would ever considering making an upgraded remote?

I wonder if you are able to use plugins so that you can have more EQ points as opposed to the 6 input and 6 output per channel?


Also provided your music is 16/48 at best, would it really be beneficial to purchasing a USB to Coax / Digital adapters which supports 24/96 or greater? I don't really think so?


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## Kpg2713

Couldn't help but to pick one up. I'm excited to incorporate this into my new Fiat Abarth build.


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## beerdrnkr

Have the unit installed and it's sounding great. 0 noise floor issues very straight forward and easy to navigate and the controller is solid and switches presets quickly. Really happy with this unit. I just wish it had a graphic eq instead of PEQ's. 



















Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk


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## Big T

Download the PPI version of software. I think someone tested it and it works


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## beerdrnkr

I'll try that out. I did it before but it said I had to update the deq8 firware. 

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk


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## Lanson

So I bought one, got it delivered to me amazingly fast, but once I opened the box I realized I might have a problem. How the heck do you integrate the remote so it looks right in a dash? Right now, I'm thinking of cutting a hole and then making a very sleek trim panel, very carefully. I really wish I had a 3D printer right about now, that's for damn sure. Pics of what I'm working on:




















Not really sure how to make that right.


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## ricren

The remote is the only thing that is stopping me from purchasing this unit. It's too big and laking features. The guys from MiniDSP have a very nice product, but they do not have the experience designing products for the car environment where space in the dash is premium. The Rockford people do know better. The 360.3 have a very nice remote. Small and with programmable controls (volume and sub level encoder controls plus a few extras). Check it out, it's a clever design.


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## Big T

After the issues I had with my 360.2s. I don't trust Rockford. Lol. The Symmetry was killer. I like the remotes the Mini has


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## Lanson

Yeah I also had 360.2 issues, and the circle of trust was definitely bent if not broken, with RF and processors. 


Ironically perhaps, the best processor I've ever used was the Kenwood X4R amp.


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## axipher

I'm liking my MiniDSP 6x8 except for two pretty major things:
- the lack of the volume LED's that the product is advertised is a real bummer, having indication of current volume level would be great
- I get a pretty loud random click when pausing or changing songs on the SPDIF input, almost like the MiniDSP can't handle then sudden change in the audio stream or something (I'm no expert on how the SPDIF audio stream is actually sent)


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## TwistdInfinity

Anyone game enough to open up the remote and see if it would be possible to make a custom, smaller enclosure for it?


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## Big T

It's the same remote that came with the PPI DEQ8


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## Lanson

I'm going to need help integrating that to the double-din console I have for this Vette. That console costs a ton, and I can't afford to f-it up. Also, making rectangle holes perfectly is damn near impossible with the tools at my disposal. I'm hoping I can disassemble the remote and/or just leave it in somewhere hidden and install a large remote volume knob (just the knob) and a couple circular toggle switches. Circle holes are easier to make.


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## Big T

You can unsolder the Rotary encoder for the volume remote locate it. The front buttons are soldered to the board they can be removed and relocated or replace with brown buttons if you're extremely good at soldering. That's what I did in my truck except I use Touch sensing buttons instead of round pushbuttons


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> You can unsolder the Rotary encoder for the volume remote locate it. The front buttons are soldered to the board they can be removed and relocated or replace with brown buttons if you're extremely good at soldering. That's what I did in my truck except I use Touch sensing buttons instead of round pushbuttons


I'm not a soldering expert, especially with regard to micro-soldering but I am bold enough to try.

Besides, I think new remotes are only ~$20 right?

What do you think about a volume knob device (like the JL one) BEFORE the MiniDSP, acting as a pre-amp? The only thing I can think of as a negative is it might not sound as good as the volume knob built-in to the remote.


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## Big T

Are you using an OEM head??


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## Lanson

Big T said:


> Are you using an OEM head??


We spent the big money to have a double din dash made, and it is getting an Appradio4.

edit: I anticipate you're going to say, don't worry just use the head unit for volume. Yes of course this is possible. I just like the idea of swapping EQ settings for different conditions. Example, I planned on creating one for targa top up, vs. down, etc.


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## ANDRESVELASCO

My first post here. God Bless this forum (and minidsp people too!) Searching here, it seem a very solid dsp option for the money... I want to try...

The thing is:
* I want to keep my stock HU.
* I want BT streaming from my phone (no bt phone call needed. Just music).
* I plan to use this cheap 12v universal BT to RCA dongle. (very good reviews).
* Audiocontrol The Epicenter is "a must have" for me... 

My current plan is this: 

1.- Install the epicenter before dsp, (using the newest "Plus" version, that has a RCA´s aux In/out), and then connect it to the dsp through its RCA aux input. (no need to conect any "main" source to the epicenter, neither speaker level nor low input, as I need to apply the epicenter efect just to streaming music). The dsp can be feeded "mainly" from my HU through speaker level inputs to get radio/cd sources and of course, aux source).

2.- Connecting the BT dongle to the epicenter´s RCA aux in.

3.- Using the epicenter remote to control the bass volume, and the minidsp remote to control master volume and presets.

My question is...

¿Can I Select the input source from the minidsp remote? 

if it is not posible...

¿have c-dsp minidsp input source self-selection when music starts playing from aux source?

Thank´s in advance!

(An observation: The easiest way to get BT music streaming is through my stock HU, but I´m pretty sure it degrades the "in self degraded" mp3 files I play... so I think is a better idea to stream directly from the epicenter, skipping this head unit process.. or I missing something here???)


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## BlueGhost

If you don't already have an Epicenter, you really don't need one. The C-DSP has an EQ on the input side, so you could do anything the epicenter does other than sub level. Sub level could be handled by an amp with remote level control or a remote level control placed between the C-DSP and sub amp.

From my understanding of the C-DSP, you would need one preset per input and then switch inputs by selecting presets. You could get around that by summing the BT and head unit inputs, as long as you never play them at the same time.

For bluetooth I would look for a BT dongle with SPDIF coaxial out and go directly to the coaxial input on the C-DSP.


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## Lanson

I was spending a while trying to figure out why you'd want an Epicenter once you have a MiniDSP as well!


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## ANDRESVELASCO

Hi BlueGhost. Thanks for your answer!, it´s great to know that you can have each preset attached to a particular source! I have not used yet any dsp device, and used to think that presets was just for eq/xover/time settings...

By the other hand, about the epicenter processor... I´m pretty sure that any dsp can not do what epicenter (and others bass creators, like kicker SHOKwave) does... Lot of people think epicenters kind processors are just low freqs "enhancers", but it is not. The Epicenter actually "adds" new sub bass notes to your music when they dont have -because originally they don´t have them (like in most old rock music) or because an extreme compression in some mp3 files-. 

Of course this is not the best way to get "pure audiophile sound", but it is really fun and enjoyable... Once you use one, it is really hard to keep away. (Some people says it could sound terrible with R&B´s or rap songs... but it is because a wrong "sweep"/levels calibration. In the classic version of the epicenter, that were controled (sweep / Level) with knobs from the main unit, but in the newer "plus" version they sloved this by including those controls directly from the remote (ARC-3). 

Finally... I would sweat if I could get an optical input on the epicenter... but these guys of AudioControl are a little "conservators" in adopt digital technologies in their products line... sadly...


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## ANDRESVELASCO

forgot mention that Epicenter serves also as a hi quality line driver, so at least "theoretically", it should deliver a strongest/clearest signal to the dsp input than my stock HU could do.


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## Big T

Actually the epicenter doesn't Add them, it restores them. Resonance of the missing frequencies are detectable in higher octaves. The Epicenter detects the resonances and restores them. At least that's how AudioControl explained it to me in the late 80s. Loved mine I had


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## TwistdInfinity

Big T said:


> Actually the epicenter doesn't Add them, it restores them. Resonance of the missing frequencies are detectable in higher octaves. The Epicenter detects the resonances and restores them. At least that's how AudioControl explained it to me in the late 80s. Loved mine I had


This makes sense. I think it would work better on real recorded music, as instruments naturally have higher and lower octaves of whatever note they are playing. 

Electronic music would not likely have these higher and lower octaves of the bass present, but even in poor mp3's of electronic / hip hop music there is usually enough bass present anyway. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

But to stay on topic, and I'm sorry if it's been answered already;

The PEQ's, are they available at fixed frequencies only? And would the 6 input PEQ bands and 6 per output band be enough to really fine tune a system? 

I plan to use it hand in hand with REW though, which I believe can make use of the advanced filter settings which you can import straight from REW? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Big T

The center freq. for each are adjustable to any Freq you want Also the q for each is adjustable.


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## Big T

If you want more control you can download the PPI version that has a 31band on the input and 6 bands on each output


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## rton20s

Not that it will save anyone any money ($308 vs $275), but Madisound is now carrying the C-DSP 6x8. I saw in on their site the other day, so I thought it might be worth mentioning here. 

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/new-products/minidsp-cdsp-6x8-digital-signal-processor/


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## Lanson

rton20s said:


> Not that it will save anyone any money ($308 vs $275), but Madisound is now carrying the C-DSP 6x8. I saw in on their site the other day, so I thought it might be worth mentioning here.
> 
> https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/new-products/minidsp-cdsp-6x8-digital-signal-processor/


They also added Minidsp goodies like the mic and stuff. 

Considering they are *probably* shipping from their USA office and not Hong Kong, that might help someone out. But my MiniDSP arrived in days (like 3) and shipping was $20, so despite being across the world, it was REALLY fast and in perfect condition.


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## rton20s

fourthmeal said:


> They also added Minidsp goodies like the mic and stuff.
> 
> Considering they are *probably* shipping from their USA office and not Hong Kong, that might help someone out. But my MiniDSP arrived in days (like 3) and shipping was $20, so despite being across the world, it was REALLY fast and in perfect condition.


I had the same thoughts. It could be a matter of convenience for someone who happened to be ordering other products from Madisound at the same time. Otherwise, I would probably go straight to the source. Seems everyone's account of dealing with MiniDSP that I have seen have been similar to yours.


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## Lanson

Yeah, I'm happy! I got the mic kit too, it looks like it is made very well, and I can't want to use it.


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## Big T

I got the UIMK1 Mike and use it with REW. Works great. But I still prefer the good ok Audiocontrol


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## TwistdInfinity

I have a behringer ecm8000 mic which looks exactly the same as the umik 1 except it's XLR not usb. I then bought a mic mate XLR to usb adapter. I'm tossing up whether I sell this combo for the more convenient umik 1, but then I can't use it for Holm impulse response measurements with a feedback loop (something else I have to buy) if I want to try this later on 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Big T

I had a behringer that came with my term lab RTA and it was not even close to liner. Also it didn't have ant calibration files. Did yours?


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## TwistdInfinity

The ecm8000 is supposed to be very linear (it's well recommended in diy home audio threads and behringer even advertise it as ultra-linear) but did not come calibrated unfortunately. The calibration of the umik is a big plus 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Lanson

Playing with the plugin on my laptop before actually hooking up the processor itself (I'm weeks away in fabrication), I really dig the power! PEQ abilities are insane, especially the shelves, You can put those points ANYWHERE, which means it can be far more powerful than a 31 band GEQ assuming we're talking pass-band type logic of a 3-way setup for most of us. Very, very impressive. You theoretically could parallel multiple units if you had a mega-system that needed more drivers (like 4-way front, 2-way rear, 2-way center, etc.) So trick! Plus even though it doesn't have a "de-EQ" feature, it sorta actually does. Because you can run EQ on the input, AND EQ on the output. That means if you needed to de-EQ a source, you'd need to find a way to get a reading of the response but once you had it, you could create a compensation curve and zero it out.

So far, very impressed, enjoying playing with the plugin. Remember you can DL it before you buy so you can play before you pay. lol.


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## ninetysix

That's play after pay  can't download the plugin till you shell out out for it. Or at least I couldn't


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## TwistdInfinity

Yeah plug in download becomes available on your profile after purchase. At least it did for my 2x4 in the house 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## rton20s

fourthmeal said:


> You theoretically could parallel multiple units if you had a mega-system that needed more drivers (like 4-way front, 2-way rear, 2-way center, etc.)


Except your center won't be properly processed. Unfortunately the processing for a proper center is slightly more complicated than the summing available on most DSPs. I believe right now, MS8 and H800 are your only options if you want to do a center correctly. 

Still, the capabilities of this unit at the current price point seem pretty outstanding!


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## Lanson

rton20s said:


> Except your center won't be properly processed. Unfortunately the processing for a proper center is slightly more complicated than the summing available on most DSPs. I believe right now, MS8 and H800 are your only options if you want to do a center correctly.
> 
> Still, the capabilities of this unit at the current price point seem pretty outstanding!


Agreed, it isn't the same. But just sayin' you can parallel these things indefinitely, for tons of channels if you needed it. They are so flexible that you could have a single processor to handle nothing but sub channels for instance.


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## Lanson

ninetysix said:


> That's play after pay  can't download the plugin till you shell out out for it. Or at least I couldn't


I was not aware of that, I just clicked the hotlink in the manual and dl'd the plugin.

Edit just realized I did so on the laptop that I ordered the unit, so it auto-logged in. I see! Well I suppose someone could dropbox the file or something.


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## TwistdInfinity

fourthmeal said:


> I was not aware of that, I just clicked the hotlink in the manual and dl'd the plugin.
> 
> Edit just realized I did so on the laptop that I ordered the unit, so it auto-logged in. I see! Well I suppose someone could dropbox the file or something.


Wink wink  

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## iamstubb

fourthmeal said:


> Agreed, it isn't the same. But just sayin' you can parallel these things indefinitely, for tons of channels if you needed it. They are so flexible that you could have a single processor to handle nothing but sub channels for instance.


I parallel'd 2 2x4's front to back and that went smoothly. Rear is managing the sub and rear deck (which is downplayed quite a bit, admittedly) But I guess if you were processing for surround sound with a center that would still be a challenge. People think I have a center channel because the miniDSP is dialed in so well and are surprised when I tell them there isn't one.

Please don't dropbox their software. They ask a fair price.


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## TwistdInfinity

Getting a copy of the software is just so we can test it out and see if we like the feel of it before committing to the purchase. I don't think it'd do much good to anyone else anyway? 

A competitor brand could easily just buy one if they really wanted to steal design concepts. 

Yesterday for example I downloaded the kicker, rainbow and mosconi dsp apps to see if I liked them before I decide whixh dsp to upgrade to. 

How are you powering the 2x4's?

The C DSP is missing a few things I would like so I'm thinking I could make a custom setup using their other cards, just wondering best way to power it

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## iamstubb

MiniDSP sells an isolated DC power adapter for $12 bucks. I bought two then realized that one supplies enough power for two boxes. The adapter also has a 100 mA delayed remote trigger that I use to turn on the amps after the 2x4's power up. I don't think it can power the 2x8/8x8.

Cheers!


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## Lanson

Well in the case of the Mini DSP 6x8, there's no plugin to buy, so I'm not trying to cheat out MiniDSP at all. Literally I just think people should be able to play with it off-line to decide if they like they like it. You can do this with the Core-1 for instance.

But I don't like being "that guy" so if Minidsp doesn't like it, I won't do it.


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## rton20s

They have been pretty responsive to customer requests. I wonder if someone were to email them, if they would allow them to download the software to test. Or possibly, just make it available to the public. Like almost every other manufacturer out there does.


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## Lanson

rton20s said:


> They have been pretty responsive to customer requests. I wonder if someone were to email them, if they would allow them to download the software to test. Or possibly, just make it available to the public. Like almost every other manufacturer out there does.


I agree, customer service is really good. I emailed in the morning and got an answer in the evening, which is completely acceptable.


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## TwistdInfinity

They reply pretty quickly to requests for an android control app haha. Answer is always no from what I've seen in the forums over the last few years though 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## wlbolton

For the Subject Matter Experts (SME) - I have a 2006 Acura TL and the HU outputs less than 1 volt. More importantly, the output is a balanced signal. Because I am in the middle of my install, I currently have the Audio Control Matrix that will be utilized as a Line Driver to boost the signal input. Because the HU incorporates BT for the phone in addition to Navigation, it is very unlikely the HU will be replaced. Probably more for cosmetics reasons though. For anyone familiar with the unit, please provide your input on the following:

(1) Does the unit allow for balanced and unbalanced inputs?

(2) If I was to forgo using the Audio Control Matrix, will the signal be strong to
obtain the desired results just using the MiniDSP C-DSP?

The input will be coming from the front left/right and sub-woofer speaker wires (pre-amp) which have been converted to RCA.


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## iamstubb

wlbolton said:


> For the Subject Matter Experts (SME) - I have a 2006 Acura TL and the HU outputs less than 1 volt. More importantly, the output is a balanced signal. Because I am in the middle of my install, I currently have the Audio Control Matrix that will be utilized as a Line Driver to boost the signal input. Because the HU incorporates BT for the phone in addition to Navigation, it is very unlikely the HU will be replaced. Probably more for cosmetics reasons though. For anyone familiar with the unit, please provide your input on the following:
> 
> (1) Does the unit allow for balanced and unbalanced inputs?
> 
> (2) If I was to forgo using the Audio Control Matrix, will the signal be strong to
> obtain the desired results just using the MiniDSP C-DSP?
> 
> The input will be coming from the front left/right and sub-woofer speaker wires (pre-amp) which have been converted to RCA.


The 6x8 takes unbalanced high or low level inputs. The miniDSP 2x4 takes balanced or unbalanced inputs. That is what I am currently using now. If those front leads have a full signal and those are all you are using, then the 2x4 balanced is a better choice. Then only the DSP with high quality components are all that is dividing your signal and you can choose the exact crossover points to optimize the sub and speaker signal. The 2x4 has a 2.1 software interface you can use to do just that. It can take the 2 Ch input and output 2 channels and a stereo or summed mono sub output. I can attest it works great for matching the roll off of the mids with the sub, as well as letting you band-pass the sub to get it to work efficiently. That way you can let the system characteristics determine the best crossover point.

Is the 1 volt output the balanced signal? The input sensitivity for the 2x4 can be set to 1.8V or 4V balanced so your signal is right in there. Output is 4V for balanced signals. The 6x8 input is 4V or 8V and 2V max output.


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## Darth SQ

rton20s said:


> Except your center won't be properly processed. Unfortunately the processing for a proper center is slightly more complicated than the summing available on most DSPs. I believe right now, MS8 and H800 are your only options if you want to do a center correctly.
> 
> Still, the capabilities of this unit at the current price point seem pretty outstanding!


The above cannot be overemphasized.
The center processing plug in made available for this unit is a compromise that no one would be satisfied with.
It costs serious money to buy licensing rights to PL2 or L7 and so far MiniDSP has not stepped up to the plate for it thus offering a generic bandaid in the form of L+R making for one narrow soundstage and confused imaging.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


----------



## axipher

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> The above cannot be overemphasized.
> The center processing plug in made available for this unit is a compromise that no one would be satisfied with.
> It costs serious money to buy licensing rights to PL2 or L7 and so far MiniDSP has not stepped up to the plate for it thus offering a generic bandaid in the form of L+R making for one narrow soundstage and confused imaging.
> 
> 
> Bret
> PPI-ART COLLECTOR


Have you played with the Rear/Center plugin? I have an extra 2x4 that I was thinking of installing alongside my 6x8 with the rear/center plugin to run two rear deck speakers and a center channel in the top middle of my dash aiming up at the windshield.

I wasn't sure how well it would work. I was thinking that output #1 would be the center channel as summed L+R with a band pass crossover around the typical voice range of frequencies on a 3" driver.

Then the output #2 rear channel would be L-R to a mono block amp to push two rear deck speakers.


----------



## Big T

The 6x8 should accept balanced inputs. I haven't played with one but I am 90% sure it's the same as the DEQ8 and it did.


----------



## Big T

If by balanced you mean diffrential


----------



## ninetysix

wlbolton said:


> For the Subject Matter Experts (SME) - I have a 2006 Acura TL and the HU outputs less than 1 volt. More importantly, the output is a balanced signal. Because I am in the middle of my install, I currently have the Audio Control Matrix that will be utilized as a Line Driver to boost the signal input. Because the HU incorporates BT for the phone in addition to Navigation, it is very unlikely the HU will be replaced. Probably more for cosmetics reasons though. For anyone familiar with the unit, please provide your input on the following:
> 
> (1) Does the unit allow for balanced and unbalanced inputs?
> 
> (2) If I was to forgo using the Audio Control Matrix, will the signal be strong to
> obtain the desired results just using the MiniDSP C-DSP?
> 
> The input will be coming from the front left/right and sub-woofer speaker wires (pre-amp) which have been converted to RCA.


Why not use a rca to spdif converter? If you install it right next to the factory head unit you likely won't have any noise issues from the 1v signal. 

Although it can only take 2 channels in. Do you get full range from the front left and right, or does the factory head unit apply hpf/lpf before the amps?

Edit: for all the reasonably priced analogue to spdif converters I've seen you'll need to convert to unbalanced but I don't think that's too tricky


----------



## rton20s

axipher said:


> Have you played with the Rear/Center plugin? I have an extra 2x4 that I was thinking of installing alongside my 6x8 with the rear/center plugin to run two rear deck speakers and a center channel in the top middle of my dash aiming up at the windshield.
> 
> I wasn't sure how well it would work. I was thinking that output #1 would be the center channel as summed L+R with a band pass crossover around the typical voice range of frequencies on a 3" driver.
> 
> Then the output #2 rear channel would be L-R to a mono block amp to push two rear deck speakers.


I don't recall all of the details, but I did enough reading up on PL2 and L7 that I made the determination that if I wasn't going to use an MS-8 or H800, then I wouldn't even attempt a center channel. If you want to do true surround with a center channel, those two are your only real 12v options, as far as I know. 

And Bret hit the nail on the head. It is all about paying for the licensing. As I understand it, many of today's processors have the ability in the chipsets to do the processing, but it is not enabled due to the cost of the licensing fee.


----------



## wlbolton

rton20s said:


> I don't recall all of the details, but I did enough reading up on PL2 and L7 that I made the determination that if I wasn't going to use an MS-8 or H800, then I wouldn't even attempt a center channel. If you want to do true surround with a center channel, those two are your only real 12v options, as far as I know.
> 
> And Bret hit the nail on the head. It is all about paying for the licensing. As I understand it, many of today's processors have the ability in the chipsets to do the processing, but it is not enabled due to the cost of the licensing fee.





Big T said:


> The 6x8 should accept balanced inputs. I haven't played with one but I am 90% sure it's the same as the DEQ8 and it did.


Big T, I did a lot of research and was looking for the Precision Power DEQ-8 for that specific reason. It has been reported the MiniDSP C-DSP 6X8 is the same Sound Processor. I actually contacted MiniDSP and was advised the unit does accept both balanced and unbalanced inputs. Because of their no exchange/refund policy, I did not want to take the chance without being 100 percent sure.


----------



## wlbolton

iamstubb said:


> The 6x8 takes unbalanced high or low level inputs. The miniDSP 2x4 takes balanced or unbalanced inputs. That is what I am currently using now. If those front leads have a full signal and those are all you are using, then the 2x4 balanced is a better choice. Then only the DSP with high quality components are all that is dividing your signal and you can choose the exact crossover points to optimize the sub and speaker signal. The 2x4 has a 2.1 software interface you can use to do just that. It can take the 2 Ch input and output 2 channels and a stereo or summed mono sub output. I can attest it works great for matching the roll off of the mids with the sub, as well as letting you band-pass the sub to get it to work efficiently. That way you can let the system characteristics determine the best crossover point.
> 
> Is the 1 volt output the balanced signal? The input sensitivity for the 2x4 can be set to 1.8V or 4V balanced so your signal is right in there. Output is 4V for balanced signals. The 6x8 input is 4V or 8V and 2V max output.


Iamstubb, Thanks for the insight, very informative. The HU does provide a flat signal from the front channels. The current install includes the following:

Image Dynamics XS 6.5 Components
Image Dynamics 12" Sub-woofer (dual voice)
Audio Control Matrix Line Driver
Precision Power P900.4
Precision Power P1000.1 (mono block)

The P1000.1 will be configured for 2 ohm load for the sub. The P900.4 will be configured to run components active. If the desire results are not achieved, I will run components passive and bridge the P900.4. Would love to incorporate a Sound Processor into the mix for precise crossovers points.

Your thoughts?


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## bugsplat

I'm one who can sing the C-DSP's praises. Truly an amazing unit for a very reasonable price. Shipping took 2 days to central Texas which just blew my mind. Customer service has been very quick to answer my questions usually within 8 hours. I could not be happier with it. After my drive to work in the morning I can make changes offline via an microsd card while at work, load up the changes before my drive home to test, then plug in via USB to my laptop at home to make final changes. My ONLY wish is a volume indicator on the remote. Not a big deal but if I had to pick something......


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## TwistdInfinity

The manual says it has master volume indication lights on the remote unit. Supposed to be shown using yellow, green and red lights behind the miniDSP logo on the remote from the looks of it. Does this not work? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## axipher

TwistdInfinity said:


> The manual says it has master volume indication lights on the remote unit. Supposed to be shown using yellow, green and red lights behind the miniDSP logo on the remote from the looks of it. Does this not work?
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Final model they release doesn't have the volume LED's, they plan to update the literature soon.


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## TwistdInfinity

Oh that sucks, the master volume display is definitely needed IMHO

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## axipher

TwistdInfinity said:


> Oh that sucks, the master volume display is definitely needed IMHO
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


I was a little disappointed by the lack of volume indication since I want to go headless, but controlling volume of my Airport from my tablet or iPhone has been perfectly fine thus far.


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## bugsplat

axipher said:


> Final model they release doesn't have the volume LED's, they plan to update the literature soon.


Wish they would update the hardware instead


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## TwistdInfinity

I plan to add a tablet when I buy a new car soon. I will be adding it to the existing stereo and having the stock head unit high levels going into the dsp, and the tablet into the dsp via spdif. 
It'd be handy to have master volume display so if the stock stereo is turned down for whatever reason and the dsp is turned up to compensate that when switching to spdif input I don't blast my ear drums 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## axipher

TwistdInfinity said:


> I plan to add a tablet when I buy a new car soon. I will be adding it to the existing stereo and having the stock head unit high levels going into the dsp, and the tablet into the dsp via spdif.
> It'd be handy to have master volume display so if the stock stereo is turned down for whatever reason and the dsp is turned up to compensate that when switching to spdif input I don't blast my ear drums
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


I use the input gain on the MiniDSP to solve this issue then just use the MiniDSP remote to control volume.

So right now with my Alpine head unit hooked up and a Raspberry Pi feeding the Coax input, I have the Alpine at -10 dB on the input side so both the sources are the same volume level.

First step was figuring out which source was the quietest using the same -3 dB pink noise. I don't remember exactly what level I got from everything, but the Coax was by far the lowest so I had to drop the Alpine's input gain until they matched. Luckily my Alpine also let's me set individual gains for all the sources on it (Radio, CD, USB, BT, Aux) so I took the time to set those once before already.

So as long as they all match without changing their volume dials, then you just have to get used to only using the MiniDSP remote to control system volume.

Also important to note that you shouldn't assume your equalizer settings on the output channels are good for all your inputs so you could also spend some time setting the PEW on the input channels to try to flatten them out or at least get them close to each other so that your output equalizers won't sound weird going form one source to another when changing presets.



The MiniDSP will sound as amazing as the time you are willing to put in to tuning it.


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## TwistdInfinity

Yeah, what I'm worried about is what you mentioned, that it's fine as long as the volume dials aren't touched. I don't trust my girlfriend to not touch it when she drives the car haha.

Do you find the 6 PEQ bands on each output channel, plus the 6 overall for each input is enough? 

I think if I'm not happy with it I'll do some REW biquad filter work and upload it that way

Edit: I guess that means steering wheel volume controls will be useless too, hmm. And how to make the steering wheel change-track/seek controls work on both stock head unit and tablet... But that's not a problem to discuss in this thread 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## axipher

TwistdInfinity said:


> Yeah, what I'm worried about is what you mentioned, that it's fine as long as the volume dials aren't touched. I don't trust my girlfriend to not touch it when she drives the car haha.
> 
> Do you find the 6 PEQ bands on each output channel, plus the 6 overall for each input is enough?
> 
> I think if I'm not happy with it I'll do some REW biquad filter work and upload it that way
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


So far the 6 PEQ bands on each output channel has been enough for me, the signal form my Alpine really doesn't differ much at all from the Airplay box, well not enough to notice a difference when playing the same song from either. Once I go full 3-way front stage then I'll do everything properly.

I'm still getting used to REW and just using the 6 PEQ's as settings. I haven't tried using REW biquad filters yet, still need to search the net for a good tutorial on that.


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## TwistdInfinity

Yeah, I watched YouTube videos to work it out, not as hard as I thought it'd be actually.

I think having 3 way front will actually mean the 6 PEQ channels per output will be almost enough as it means I get 23 PEQ bands through the whole frequency range (6 for tweeters, 6 for mid range, 6 for mid bass and 5 for sub [I think I read somewhere it's reduced to 5 bands if it's a sub channel?]). 

The only way I see it not being enough is if I have to make a lot of little changes to balance left and right driver EQ's to get them matching first

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> I plan to add a tablet when I buy a new car soon. I will be adding it to the existing stereo and having the stock head unit high levels going into the dsp, and the tablet into the dsp via spdif.
> It'd be handy to have master volume display so if the stock stereo is turned down for whatever reason and the dsp is turned up to compensate that when switching to spdif input I don't blast my ear drums
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


The volume stays where you left it on each of the 4 presets, which is kind of good and bad at the same time.

Volume indication really would have been worth the price of a few LEDs :worried:

What I would really like is a way of setting default volume each time the unit is turned on like my av receiver in the lounge room. Also be nice to have that when switching profiles, I've already had a few pants pooping moments with that.

Oh and if tuning in real time with a laptop and music playing, be very careful when adjusting output levels  especially when the mute isn't working on the remote, and when in mute mode you can't adjust volume till you unmute


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## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> 6 for tweeters, 6 for mid range, 6 for mid bass and 5 for sub [I think I read somewhere it's reduced to 5 bands if it's a sub channel?]).


I've still got 6 peqs on my stereo sub outputs, they are just outputs like all the others


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## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> I've still got 6 peqs on my stereo sub outputs, they are just outputs like all the others


Ah that might be the kicker or other dsp then. I've tried out about 6 different t dsp softwares over the weekend 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Edit: I guess that means steering wheel volume controls will be useless too, hmm. And how to make the steering wheel change-track/seek controls work on both stock head unit and tablet... But that's not a problem to discuss in this thread
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Easy, go headless all the way


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## TwistdInfinity

Well I can use just the tablet and add an fm tuner and external CD drive to it (though CD's will be rarely used so might not bother with that), but the stock head unit will still be there so seems silly not to utilise it.

Ill work something out I'm sure! 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

Perhaps a changeover switch from the steering wheel controls to either the stock unit or a joycon exr or similar


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## Lanson

The MiniDSP remote is also an IR receiver, and you can program IR outputs to, say, your steering wheel controls for instance.


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## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> The MiniDSP remote is also an IR receiver, and you can program IR outputs to, say, your steering wheel controls for instance.


Could you elaborate on the setup you're suggesting here?


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## TwistdInfinity

Yes that's pretty intriguing 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Lanson

ninetysix said:


> Could you elaborate on the setup you're suggesting here?


I'm only suggesting this in theory but isn't there usually a device (from PAC or something) that should be able to take factory wheel controls and convert them to IR. Well the MiniDSP remote accepts IR inputs. I'm not 100% certain it would work, but it seems like it would be able to.

edit: Yeah the SWI-X unit, that should do it.


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## bugsplat

I run headless with the c-dsp. Works fine.


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## ninetysix

bugsplat said:


> I run headless with the c-dsp. Works fine.


Got a build log on that?


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## axipher

TwistdInfinity said:


> Yeah, I watched YouTube videos to work it out, not as hard as I thought it'd be actually.
> 
> I think having 3 way front will actually mean the 6 PEQ channels per output will be almost enough as it means I get 23 PEQ bands through the whole frequency range (6 for tweeters, 6 for mid range, 6 for mid bass and 5 for sub [I think I read somewhere it's reduced to 5 bands if it's a sub channel?]).
> 
> The only way I see it not being enough is if I have to make a lot of little changes to balance left and right driver EQ's to get them matching first
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk





ninetysix said:


> I've still got 6 peqs on my stereo sub outputs, they are just outputs like all the others


There is a Sub specific option you can select on PEQ and if you select it, then you lose PEQ 6.

From the manual:

Filter type: Selects the type of filter:
PEAK: Create a dip or a peak in the frequency response.
LOW_SHELF: Reduce or increase part of the frequency spectrum below a given frequency.
HIGH_SHELF: Reduce or increase part of the frequency spectrum above a given frequency.
SUB_EQ: Create a dip or a peak in the frequency response at low frequencies (10 to 50 Hz). This filter type is similar to PEAK but gives more accurate results for low frequencies. Note that activating any SUB_EQ filter reduces the number of available filters on that channel from six to five.





ninetysix said:


> The volume stays where you left it on each of the 4 presets, which is kind of good and bad at the same time.
> 
> Volume indication really would have been worth the price of a few LEDs :worried:
> 
> What I would really like is a way of setting default volume each time the unit is turned on like my av receiver in the lounge room. Also be nice to have that when switching profiles, I've already had a few pants pooping moments with that.
> 
> Oh and if tuning in real time with a laptop and music playing, be very careful when adjusting output levels  especially when the mute isn't working on the remote, and when in mute mode you can't adjust volume till you unmute


I got use to always reducing my volume before I turn the car off because starting speakers at full volume in below freezing is never good 





fourthmeal said:


> I'm only suggesting this in theory but isn't there usually a device (from PAC or something) that should be able to take factory wheel controls and convert them to IR. Well the MiniDSP remote accepts IR inputs. I'm not 100% certain it would work, but it seems like it would be able to.
> 
> edit: Yeah the SWI-X unit, that should do it.


I might have to look in to that, I'm I'm not mistaken though, I would need some sort of IR transmitter aimed at the IR input on the front of the MiniDSP remote right?


----------



## bugsplat

ninetysix said:


> Got a build log on that?


I don't have a nice graphic layout like some people here but I can write it up.

Samsung Galaxy S5
to
Bluetooth 4.0 APTX to Coax SPDIF
to
Minidsp C-DSP
to
PPI i520.4 & RF 300.1 & RF 325.1

Drivers are 
Audio Physics RAM3A
Silver Flutes 6.5 Sealed
JBL GTO 6.5
Tso/Tsu? "shoe" sounding name 10" Sealed


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## bugsplat

axipher said:


> I might have to look in to that, I'm I'm not mistaken though, I would need some sort of IR transmitter aimed at the IR input on the front of the MiniDSP remote right?


Any IR remote will work. Old head unit remote, old TV remote, phone with IR transmitter, new cheap universal remote. The way the unit works is you press a button on the remote and select the task via the GUI to assign it. Any button can be assigned. If you wanted you could make the "POWER" button be the mute button. System remembers what you assigned it as not what the button says on the face.


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## axipher

bugsplat said:


> Any IR remote will work. Old head unit remote, old TV remote, phone with IR transmitter, new cheap universal remote. The way the unit works is you press a button on the remote and select the task via the GUI to assign it. Any button can be assigned. If you wanted you could make the "POWER" button be the mute button. System remembers what you assigned it as not what the button says on the face.


I was referring to integrating Steering wheel controls, and looking back, it looks like that SWI-X model fourthmeal mentioned might work great.


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## ANDRESVELASCO

This miniDSP C-DSP looks pretty good, and its specs are amazing... Except this one: It has only 2v output (max). It is less than a mediocre aftermarket HU can do... 

So, my two questions are: 

1) Does this affects in some way its overall performance, when comparing with others dsp (ie. 3.sixty is 8v max)?

2) Can a good Line Driver (as Audiocontrol Matrix) help in any way, or it would not be relevant? 

Thanks in advance!


----------



## bugsplat

ANDRESVELASCO said:


> This miniDSP C-DSP looks pretty good, and its specs are amazing... Except this one: It has only 2v output (max). It is less than a mediocre aftermarket HU can do...
> 
> So, my two questions are:
> 
> 1) Does this affects in some way its overall performance, when comparing with others dsp (ie. 3.sixty is 8v max)?
> 
> 2) Can a good Line Driver (as Audiocontrol Matrix) help in any way, or it would not be relevant?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


I had zero issues to my amps. I went from an 8v out to a 2v out and didn't hear a difference.


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## Lanson

Thought about adding a Victory Sonics tube pre-amp, but overall I think it would just be an add-on to think of later, not important to have the higher voltage preamp. Besides, I've used a bunch of MS-8's and that 2V output has never been a problem.


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## ninetysix

axipher said:


> ...From the manual....


Well ain't that a thingy dingy :blush: I might have to read it again...

I'm only using 3 PEQs on my sealed alpine 8s any way, a linkwitz transform, another to fix a little peak at 45hz and a high shelf above 100hz (crossover is 80/24db LR) for a better transition to the mids.


----------



## ninetysix

ANDRESVELASCO said:


> This miniDSP C-DSP looks pretty good, and its specs are amazing... Except this one: It has only 2v output (max). It is less than a mediocre aftermarket HU can do...
> 
> So, my two questions are:
> 
> 1) Does this affects in some way its overall performance, when comparing with others dsp (ie. 3.sixty is 8v max)?
> 
> 2) Can a good Line Driver (as Audiocontrol Matrix) help in any way, or it would not be relevant?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


I think it _could_ come down to minidsp originally making products for home theatre and therefore being far more conservative with their ratings. Coming from a JVC arsenal with good clean 5v outputs to first a minidsp 2x4 balanced then the c-dsp I only had to turn the gains up a fraction, less than a volt as indicated by the dial on the amps.

So it's a non issue IMO. Go SPDIF if you can though


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## TwistdInfinity

The 2v pre outs had me worried bit at first too but I read enough people were using it fine with no issues that I figured it'll be worth the risk. I don't understand though, some of their other products have 4v pre outs I think. 


Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> The 2v pre outs had me worried bit at first too but I read enough people were using it fine with no issues that I figured it'll be worth the risk. I don't understand though, some of their other products have 4v pre outs I think.
> 
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


The 2x4 balanced and 4x10HD can only do 2VRMS unbalanced, but 4 or even 8VRMS for balanced outputs. Not such an issue in home theatre I guess


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Yeah, just be mindful of where you run your RCA's and it should be fine 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

And even less of an issue with the DSP installed near the amps with short rca leads. The c-dsp can still happily take 4v in before dropping it to a mere 2v out


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## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> And even less of an issue with the DSP installed near the amps with short rca leads. The c-dsp can still happily take 4v in before dropping it to a mere 2v out


Any issues with running a 3 meter usb from C DSP in boot up to front seats? I know some things are picky about long USB cables 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

So far, no. I've got a 3m extension on the ~1.5m lead running thru the ski pass through (ie very temporary) and haven't had any issues, even with a little tuning on the go with a laptop on the passenger seat... When stopped at a red light, of course


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## LaydSierra

A few off topic questions but I'm considering this DSP for my Mega Cab. Would it be best to run front & rear from the non OEM deck to the inputs & then handle sub output with my amp gain control? If I use outputs 1-6 for the front 3 way how would I sum(L-R) or whatever the rear signals to output 7? Then just sum all 4 inputs together for output 8 for sub? Sorry if I'm over thinking this as it's my first standalone, all digital DSP.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## Alextaastrup

Steak House said:


> What bluetooth module did you use bugsplat?


Bluetooth (even APTX) will destroy the whole idea of SQ music listnening in the car. It is not even CD quality. Wi-fi Wireless - ok solution for Hi-res files.
But for mp3 APTX is ok.

Another comment regarding built-in DAC in Samsung phones. It is not the best solution. I use external sound Card and then - to digital input to the processor. it's better, but not Wireless.


----------



## Silvercoat

I know I am not the biggest fan of the wireless option if a wired option is easy enough to do. My biggest concern with these setups is having 1 volume control. I know most things do not adjust volume over optical. I suppose the SWI-X > IR > miniDSP would technically work but I just wish there was a better wired way considering. Steering wheel control and signal volume control are my biggest issues with a wired tablet install. I wish some of the DSP had volume control inputs on their remotes so I could do steering wheel and volume knob audio control.(I like having both)


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## ANDRESVELASCO

Alextaastrup said:


> Bluetooth (even APTX) will destroy the whole idea of SQ music listnening in the car. It is not even CD quality. Wi-fi Wireless - ok solution for Hi-res files.
> But for mp3 APTX is ok.
> 
> Another comment regarding built-in DAC in Samsung phones. It is not the best solution. I use external sound Card and then - to digital input to the processor. it's better, but not Wireless.


I'm agree with you. 

After a Long 2 non-sleeping researching nights - you know what I mean-, I could find that, even through aptX BT, bluetooth is a "compressed" protocol... So no matter what gears do you use, it will be always some "information loss" with bluetooth. 

The good thing is that with aptX, this compression is almost non detectable by humans ears... At least you have this .1% "golden ears" that greek mithology says... 

But anyway... Who cares!!... As an SQ obsessed as some of you, I just want only THE BEST to get the highest "lossless" sound reproduction. And this is only posible with a wired transmition. (digital through usb, of course) (or may be through wifi streaming as Alextaastrup said). 

At the begining, I was a little worried to depending of a wired connection to play my phone stored music, but then, I realised that anyway, I always run usb wired to charge my battery... So... Nothing is really changing! 

Just my 5 cents...


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## Lanson

Depends on the tablet of course but you might want to research "Joycon"



Silvercoat said:


> I know I am not the biggest fan of the wireless option if a wired option is easy enough to do. My biggest concern with these setups is having 1 volume control. I know most things do not adjust volume over optical. I suppose the SWI-X > IR > miniDSP would technically work but I just wish there was a better wired way considering. Steering wheel control and signal volume control are my biggest issues with a wired tablet install. I wish some of the DSP had volume control inputs on their remotes so I could do steering wheel and volume knob audio control.(I like having both)


----------



## Lanson

Steak House said:


> OK (Bluetooth Sucks) - let me ask this question - has anyone A/B'd the high level inputs (OEM Speaker Level Out in my case) vs. an all digital connection (coax SPDIF in this case) on these units?
> 
> I'm more or less stuck with my Uconnect 8.4A - I think it sounds great with the high level inputs - but am curious if much is to be gained sound quality wise if I were to drop in a tablet with digital connection.


Its a great question. Since I have the same setup as you, one of us will likely found out first and have to share what we find. (15 Durango R/T)

What would really be cool though is to see if it could be tapped in somewhere internally, digitally. Of course the steering wheel controls and head unit control would be useless. That might suck pretty bad.


----------



## ninetysix

Alextaastrup said:


> Bluetooth (even APTX) will destroy the whole idea of SQ music listnening in the car. It is not even CD quality. Wi-fi Wireless - ok solution for Hi-res files.
> But for mp3 APTX is ok.
> 
> Another comment regarding built-in DAC in Samsung phones. It is not the best solution. I use external sound Card and then - to digital input to the processor. it's better, but not Wireless.


Yeah I'm gonna second that, seeing a $20 usb DAC can give bit perfect output over spdif. It would burn me up knowing I'm spending au$24 a month on tidal HiFi and about au$40 a month on 4g data just to step on the signal before it goes into the DSP :surprised:

I know charging a phone can be near impossible with a usb DAC plugged in, but before I got the battery bypass figured out on the nexus 5 I was using my nexus 6p to stream flac/tidal and even with navigation on it really only used a few percent battery for each 45 minute journey to and from work.


----------



## ANDRESVELASCO

ninetysix said:


> I know charging a phone can be near impossible with a usb DAC plugged in, but before I got the battery bypass figured out on the nexus 5 I was using my nexus 6p to stream flac/tidal and even with navigation on it really only used a few percent battery for each 45 minute journey to and from work.


Or you can spend 1.60 us dlls on this Amazon.com: Micro USB Host OTG Cable with Micro USB Power for Nexus 10 9 7 6P 5X 4 Player & Samsung Galaxy 6 6+ Edge 5 V 4 IV 3 III: Cell Phones & Accessories and have both data transmition and charging


----------



## ninetysix

ANDRESVELASCO said:


> Or you can spend 1.60 us dlls on this Amazon.com: Micro USB Host OTG Cable with Micro USB Power for Nexus 10 9 7 6P 5X 4 Player & Samsung Galaxy 6 6+ Edge 5 V 4 IV 3 III: Cell Phones & Accessories and have both data transmition and charging


Have you personally been able to get a phone to charge while connected to a usb DAC via otg? Because it's largely considered very difficult. Charging is disabled in android with otg connected, even wireless qi charging I think. The only way I've heard of it being possible is on a 2013 nexus 7 with Timur's kernel.

I wanted a headless setup with a phone installed in the din slot and I didn't want a lithium battery hiding in there under the hot Australian sun (it's going to be over 100°f for the next few days here) so the battery had to go


----------



## ANDRESVELASCO

ninetysix said:


> Have you personally been able to get a phone to charge while connected to a usb DAC via otg? Because it's largely considered very difficult. Charging is disabled in android with otg connected, even wireless qi charging I think. The only way I've heard of it being possible is on a 2013 nexus 7 with Timur's kernel.
> 
> I wanted a headless setup with a phone installed in the din slot and I didn't want a lithium battery hiding in there under the hot Australian sun (it's going to be over 100°f for the next few days here) so the battery had to go


Too hot!... 

Actually, this is what I use (Nexus 7 with timur's)...

We should open this like a New thread


----------



## Lanson

Well,.... I'm mad.

I just got an invoice from Fedex from MiniDSP.... yeah... I owe customs duty apparently. To the tune of like $23! 

So yeah, buy from ****ing Madisound dude!


----------



## Big T

fourthmeal said:


> Well,.... I'm mad.
> 
> I just got an invoice from Fedex from MiniDSP.... yeah... I owe customs duty apparently. To the tune of like $23!
> 
> So yeah, buy from ****ing Madisound dude!



Odd I didn't have anything like that when I ordered the remotes and until-1...


----------



## TwistdInfinity

What? We don't have to pay customs tax unless it's over 1k in Australia 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Silvercoat

fourthmeal said:


> Its a great question. Since I have the same setup as you, one of us will likely found out first and have to share what we find. (15 Durango R/T)
> 
> What would really be cool though is to see if it could be tapped in somewhere internally, digitally. Of course the steering wheel controls and head unit control would be useless. That might suck pretty bad.


From my last understanding, most of the Crysler based upgraded sound systems use some 2-Channel balanced wacky input. I remember using the aftermarket harnesses on some of these systems and they only had 2ch input. You might be able to get something a bit better there as opposed to going after the factory amp.


----------



## axipher

Big T said:


> Odd I didn't have anything like that when I ordered the remotes and until-1...


I had to pay $58 CAD in duties on top of the $40 shipping on my MiniDSP 6x8, that's all I ordered to Canada. I've just gotten used to paying duties/import fees/brokerage fees/etc.


----------



## Lanson

Silvercoat said:


> From my last understanding, most of the Crysler based upgraded sound systems use some 2-Channel balanced wacky input. I remember using the aftermarket harnesses on some of these systems and they only had 2ch input. You might be able to get something a bit better there as opposed to going after the factory amp.


Shoot it is full surround, Beats Audio and all that. NO telling whats going on. Thats why in another thread I was asking about ways to measure electrical outputs in REW or similar


----------



## bugsplat

Got my unit in the USA without paying anything. Odd.


----------



## Lanson

bugsplat said:


> Got my unit in the USA without paying anything. Odd.


Oh it came from the shipper Fedex, about two weeks after the unit was delivered. So you will likely get one or already have and ignored it


----------



## bugsplat

fourthmeal said:


> Oh it came from the shipper Fedex, about two weeks after the unit was delivered. So you will likely get one or already have and ignored it


DOH!


----------



## axipher

bugsplat said:


> DOH!


Or you don't get it in the mail, and 3 months later you get a letter from a creditor agency about a past due bill that may affect your credit score if you don't pay it right away.

I just make a habit with any package with a tracking number to call the shipper myself and double check there are not fees owing on the package.


----------



## Lanson

Exactly! It can be a ****ing mess, and since nobody on here actually said there was Customs to pay, I didn't calculate it in my budget for the item. If I did, I would have purchased from Madisound, since I already had speakers coming from them anyway. 

FYI I also bought the mic kit, so not sure if that changes things or whatever, but it is what it is.

And yeah, you gotta pay it.


----------



## dmb1650

fourthmeal said:


> Exactly! It can be a ****ing mess, and since nobody on here actually said there was Customs to pay, I didn't calculate it in my budget for the item. If I did, I would have purchased from Madisound, since I already had speakers coming from them anyway.
> 
> FYI I also bought the mic kit, so not sure if that changes things or whatever, but it is what it is.
> 
> And yeah, you gotta pay it.


I plan to buy mine in the near future. From Madisound my total with shipping would be $408. Did you end up paying more than this? I realize shipping cost vary by location. I don't have any other items to buy from Madisound.

Even if Madisound is slightly more expensive would I gain any additional customer support if I have any warranty claims or such.


----------



## Lanson

I paid $365 incl. shipping. So that you have add the Customs ~$23, and I'm at ~$388.

So yeah, I'm slightly ahead even with customs this time. But I believe that's just because the mic was a little cheaper when bundled at purchase time w/ the DSP.

But I don't like the concept of Customs, especially when I didn't expect it.


----------



## axipher

fourthmeal said:


> Exactly! It can be a ****ing mess, and since nobody on here actually said there was Customs to pay, I didn't calculate it in my budget for the item. If I did, I would have purchased from Madisound, since I already had speakers coming from them anyway.
> 
> FYI I also bought the mic kit, so not sure if that changes things or whatever, but it is what it is.
> 
> And yeah, you gotta pay it.


MiniDSP C: $275 USD
Shipping: $20 USD
FEDEX: $58.93 CAD or $45 US

Total: $340 US or $440 CAD

So even in the end, I'm still getting a much better DSP for that price than any of the other options out there in my opinion.


----------



## bugsplat

Wife came up to me last night....

"You know you got a bill from FedEx?"

SON-OF-#^%^#$%@%^$

That does not change my mind of the C-DSP, I still love it and think its a great value, but I would have liked to included that into my total budget.


----------



## ninetysix

Is that state or federal? Either way, an oppressive regime


----------



## Big T

Actually. Did any of you agree with FexEx that you would pay anything...??
They may not be able to force you to pay it...


----------



## bugsplat

Big T said:


> Actually. Did any of you agree with FexEx that you would pay anything...??
> They may not be able to force you to pay it...


I had no idea such a charge existed. My unit showed up 2 days after ordering with basic shipping. 2 DAYS! It had to be local. I came home and found the package on my front step. Never talked to anyone.


----------



## 1fishman

I don't understand customs. It seems that charges are random. I've never noticed a charge before and bought many items from all over. Does anyone know the actual way customs supposed to work in the USA?


----------



## Lanson

Big T said:


> Actually. Did any of you agree with FexEx that you would pay anything...??
> They may not be able to force you to pay it...


You automatically agree to any and all Customs, when you make a purchase like this, apparently. Because they are Duties to this country. Fedex is merely the carrier for these fees. You MUST pay them.


----------



## Lanson

bugsplat said:


> Wife came up to me last night....
> 
> "You know you got a bill from FedEx?"
> 
> SON-OF-#^%^#$%@%^$
> 
> That does not change my mind of the C-DSP, I still love it and think its a great value, but I would have liked to included that into my total budget.


LOL, I'd say I told you so but I think its better just to say, bet you're glad you knew before she told you. LOL.


----------



## RMF419

Would this sum channels from an oem factory amp, or would I need something to do the summing for it first coming directly from a oem amp.


----------



## Big T

It will sum


----------



## bugsplat

fourthmeal said:


> LOL, I'd say I told you so but I think its better just to say, bet you're glad you knew before she told you. LOL.


I knew it was coming, just didn't think it would be 8 hours later. 

I love the unit. Does everything I could possible want. I did go headless as the headunit was just a means to connect my phone to the DSP. Head unit is gone and I could not be happier. Makes new passengers do a double take on their first ride and even trying to explain it gets them lost but its a great solution and thieves think twice if its worth it no having a headunit.


----------



## ninetysix

bugsplat said:


> I knew it was coming, just didn't think it would be 8 hours later.
> 
> I love the unit. Does everything I could possible want. I did go headless as the headunit was just a means to connect my phone to the DSP. Head unit is gone and I could not be happier. Makes new passengers do a double take on their first ride and even trying to explain it gets them lost but its a great solution and thieves think twice if its worth it no having a headunit.


So are you using your daily phone as the hu? Just plug it in and fumble with it or cradle it?


----------



## bugsplat

ninetysix said:


> So are you using your daily phone as the hu? Just plug it in and fumble with it or cradle it?


I have a window suction cup cradle the phone drops into. Bluetooth APTX to Digi-Coax runs to the DSP. BT link only takes about 0.5 seconds after I start the engine. Google Play Music, calls, Google Maps, Local FLAC files all play from my phone. My 5K collection of CD's has been converted to FLAC files. No need for CD any more. All radio stations can be played from my cell. Everything I need is on my phone.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Elgrosso said:


> Ha ok, yes it does:
> 
> 
> I thought about their other plugin:
> http://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/Product Brief-Rear-Center channel plug-in.pdf
> That could be used with another 2x4
> 
> Btw, go it yesterday!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too busy to install it soon but I might open it to see the board, not that I could "read" it, but maybe someone here…


What are the dimensions of the remote? Trying to work out where I could put it

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## motomech

Sub'd


----------



## RMF419

Big T said:


> It will sum


Thank you very much.


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> What are the dimensions of the remote? Trying to work out where I could put it
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


41mm W x 88.5mm L x 37mm D


----------



## Babs

Nice!!! K so how do these sound?


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Babs said:


> Nice!!! K so how do these sound?
> 
> 
> Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


What, like that's even important? Haha 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> 41mm W x 88.5mm L x 37mm D


Cheers! 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

No worries mate

I think it's safe to say that the minidsp c-dsp 6x8 sounds like.... Nothing! No noise, no coloration, signal comes out as clean as it went in.

I've read about pretty much every other DSP on the market having a somewhat significant flaw here or there.... The only problem I've had has been the mute not always working (very low on my care-factor list) and we're on software revision 1.0


----------



## Snake

Just got mine today. Ordered it late last Thursday so it didn't ship until Monday. Four days shipping isn't bad considering it came from Hong Kong. Opened it up and all I can say is 

WOW! Build quality is great. Much better than the flashy looking thin aluminum plates mounted on a extruded aluminum bracket. I had a pioneer amp and the rattles from the metal was very annoying. Would almost say the enclosure is made better than my JL Slash amp. The whole thing is made of heavy duty powder coated steel. Not flimsy steel either. It's pretty stiff and feels rock solid. Haven't hooked it up yet so I can't comment on what's inside, but if it's anything like the outside, it's going to be an amazing unit.

One little gripe I have is one of the pins on the high level inputs was bent out of the box to the point of the terminal block not attaching. Not a huge deal being I can just bend it back and I don't plan on using high level inputs.


----------



## RaceShowDrive

I have run the PPI DEQ8 version of this for the past year and have zero complaints.


----------



## 99cobra09

How can you run the 3 headunit outputs (front/rear/sub) to the dsp that only accepts (front/rear) or just 2 pairs of inputs? Or am i missing something?


----------



## ninetysix

99cobra09 said:


> How can you run the 3 headunit outputs (front/rear/sub) to the dsp that only accepts (front/rear) or just 2 pairs of inputs? Or am i missing something?


You are. It has 4 rca inputs and one spdif input, which is 2 channels


----------



## Snake

You technically have 6 channels of input (3 stereo inputs) since the spdif carries the right and left channel down 1 cable. However the spdif is a digital input while the rca is analog, so you can use eithet the rca's or the spdif at one time. Not sure if you actually can run both, but there would probably be issues with delays in the signals. I will use the rear and sub channels on my headunit for the rca inputs and have a usb to spdif converter that I use with my phone on the spdif in. Haven't actually used the spdif in yet since today was the first day I started the installation process.


----------



## ninetysix

That said, 2 channels in is plenty  maybe 3 if you want to control sub volume from head unit... But I can't see why anybody would need to feed rear channels into a DSP, unless maybe you were specifically using them for say midbass drivers so you could fade back and forward from the head unit to adjust levels on the go.

Meh, use spdif if you can, route it out thru up to 8 channels and enjoy


----------



## PorkCereal

ninetysix said:


> That said, 2 channels in is plenty  maybe 3 if you want to control sub volume from head unit... But I can't see why anybody would need to feed rear channels into a DSP, unless maybe you were specifically using them for say midbass drivers so you could fade back and forward from the head unit to adjust levels on the go.
> 
> Meh, use spdif if you can, route it out thru up to 8 channels and enjoy


With Some stock amps it's better to pull rear signals due to active front and passive rear. I know my pos Sony was that way. Other than that, you're correct.


----------



## 99cobra09

So the sub output off the radio can be hooked up with a y connector to the spdif input and can be set to let's say channel 7/8 on the dsp output for just the sub?


----------



## ninetysix

99cobra09 said:


> So the sub output off the radio can be hooked up with a y connector to the spdif input and can be set to let's say channel 7/8 on the dsp output for just the sub?


Nah no y-connectors necessary. Does your head unit have spdif out? As in digital, usually fibre optic sometimes coax cable. The minidsp can only take coax spdif

If you don't have that but have analogue RCAs you can hook your front left and right into channel 1 and 2, and your sub output into channel 3 (or 3 and 4 if it's a stereo signal).

For say an active 2 way plus sub and rear fill you would rout input 1 (left) to outputs 1, 3 and 5. Input 2 (right) to 2, 4 and 6. input 3 to output 8. 1&2 left and right mids, 3&4 left and right tweets, 5&6 rear fill and 8 for sub. Set crossovers, get your gains right, take measurements if you can, eq, time alignment and you're looking good.

Just watch out for any symptoms of OCD, or at least learn to hide them


----------



## t3sn4f2

ninetysix said:


> Nah no y-connectors necessary. Does your head unit have spdif out? As in digital, usually fibre optic sometimes coax cable. *The minidsp can only take coax spdif*


Just to add. Just because the physical plug is the same style as what is known to most as an "RCA plug", doesn't mean that it is compatible with all signals that run on those types of cable. Like ninetysix mentioned, that s/pdif rca connector on the DSP is for digital audio signals in the "s/pdif" format. The line level "RCA outputs" on your head unit are traditional analog outputs that are only compatible with analog inputs.

Also you should never use a Y-adapter to recombine or "sum" a pair of analog outputs as it can damage your output section.

Why Not Wye?


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

I haven't been keeping up with this thread so have a couple refresher questions. I'm probably about to buy one of these units because something strange happened to one of my old 2x4's that's been through hell and back getting run harder than it probably should have (input and output shortcomings). I've been happy with the product overall though. 

The minidsp plug-in for the 6x8 only has 6 peq bands per output correct? Nothing on the input side? I remember someone saying there's a download for the deq8 version on the minidsp site but couldn't find it when looking the other day. The 31 band graphic sure would be nice to have for final curve shaping.


----------



## ninetysix

Hillbilly SQ said:


> I haven't been keeping up with this thread so have a couple refresher questions. I'm probably about to buy one of these units because something strange happened to one of my old 2x4's that's been through hell and back getting run harder than it probably should have (input and output shortcomings). I've been happy with the product overall though.
> 
> The minidsp plug-in for the 6x8 only has 6 peq bands per output correct? Nothing on the input side? I remember someone saying there's a download for the deq8 version on the minidsp site but couldn't find it when looking the other day. The 31 band graphic sure would be nice to have for final curve shaping.


No, it has 6 bands on all outputs and all inputs, including spdif.


----------



## Big T

The deq8 software is on PPIs site. Not minidsps


----------



## LaydSierra

What's the point of the input channel eq?

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

LaydSierra said:


> What's the point of the input channel eq?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


If your source was a factory head unit with EQ settings for the factory speakers that can't be turned off, you could "de-eq" it at the input.

Another use is for applying a house curve once you get your drivers sufficiently flat via the output eq. I think.


----------



## LaydSierra

ninetysix said:


> If your source was a factory head unit with EQ settings for the factory speakers that can't be turned off, you could "de-eq" it at the input.
> 
> Another use is for applying a house curve once you get your drivers sufficiently flat via the output eq. I think.


Hmm...didn't think about that. I guess it would work well to use the input EQ after setting the crossovers to cut the largest peaks. Then use REW or RTA to finalize each driver. 

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

If it has 6 bands of peq per input that's even better. I can do way more with 6 bands of mono peq than I can with 31 bands of graphic. I like to use the output eq for l/r eq and taming oddball quirks from the speakers. Then use the input eq for a nice pleasant house curve.


----------



## Pantani23

What USB to SPDIF options are you guys using from your phone/tablet source to the C-DSP 6x8? What are the recommended ones? Are there any things I should be aware of when choosing?


----------



## Alextaastrup

Samsung Galaxy S4 - miniUSB OTG cable External DAC with minitoslink out (Meridian). Works pretty well (up till 192/24). Does not require extra power supply (USB powered).


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Alextaastrup said:


> Samsung Galaxy S4 - miniUSB OTG cable External DAC with minitoslink out (Meridian). Works pretty well (up till 192/24). Does not require extra power supply (USB powered).


C DSP won't take toslink spdif in though, just coax spdif. 

I'll try the mini streamer I think 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

I'm using a generic (muse copy?) PCM2704 USB DAC connected to an android phone, very low power consumption and works great up to 16/48 tho my source material is basically all 16/44.1


----------



## Pantani23

Well I've just joined the club. Just ordered my 6x8, mic, and miniStreamer!


----------



## ninetysix

Pantani23 said:


> Well I've just joined the club. Just ordered my 6x8, mic, and miniStreamer!


Excellent choice  I'm keen to hear how the ministreamer works on a phone/tab (android right?) And especially how it goes with USB audio player pro with a 24/96 source. Cheers


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I'm still sad/angry/annoyed this doesn't take optical input. I've got heaps of optical cables laying around and I went and bought a hifimediy sabre u2 usb to optical thing for my old dsp 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## BassMechanic308

I'm hoping to buy mine here soon. I want it bad...


----------



## jcmusika

Just got mine in the mail before Christmas and installed it on my truck
I like to say it is quiet and does not color the sound, I think!

I had installed on a new build, using the new Zapco ST series amps and using an IPAD as a source. 3 way fronts, (tweets, mid, lower mids ) and a Sub. all controlled by 6x8. 
I have not yet fully tuned it, however, I do own a 2x4 installed on another vehicle, (2 way fronts).

I really like the MiniDSP 2x4 and I think the 6x8 will be equally as good or better, all depending on how I can get the tuning done


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Great feedback! I always hear how the miniDSP's do not colour the sound, and I have a 2x4 in my home setup which I can attest to. 

My question is how good is it when it's the only analogue output in the chain? As I'll be running a usb streamer to the C DSP, the sound will wholly rely on the DAC of the C DSP. I still think it'd going to be great though

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> ....My question is how good is it when it's the only analogue output in the chain? As I'll be running a usb streamer to the C DSP, the sound will wholly rely on the DAC of the C DSP. I still think it'd going to be great though....


I can't see the downside to that  and I can't imagine a situation where D-A-D-A could ever be more ideal than D-D-D-A. 

The 6x8 still worked very well using my now retired JVC deck or a UCA202, but the "workflow" is sweet as a peach with spdif, if nothing else


----------



## ninetysix

jcmusika said:


> I really like the MiniDSP 2x4 and I think the 6x8 will be equally as good or better, all depending on how I can get the tuning done


Definitely superior to a 2x4, which ain't bad. Having 6 EQs per channel instead of 5 made a big difference to my setup. UI is much nicer too, less changing pages and easier to link XO or EQ settings between channels.

Just be careful if you're adjusting output levels in real time by typing the number into the box instead of dragging the slider or highlighting the box and using the up/down arrows. I think I accidentally typed a letter into the box and it shot up to +20dB or something silly... Scared the crap out of me


----------



## rton20s

jcmusika said:


> Just got mine in the mail before Christmas and installed it on my truck
> I like to say it is quiet and does not color the sound, I think!
> 
> I had installed on a new build, using the new Zapco ST series amps and using an IPAD as a source. 3 way fronts, (tweets, mid, lower mids ) and a Sub. all controlled by 6x8.
> I have not yet fully tuned it, however, I do own a 2x4 installed on another vehicle, (2 way fronts).
> 
> I really like the MiniDSP 2x4 and I think the 6x8 will be equally as good or better, all depending on how I can get the tuning done


Which of the Zapco ST series and which models are you using? ST-X, ST-D, or the newest ST-D BT?


----------



## jcmusika

rton20s said:


> Which of the Zapco ST series and which models are you using? ST-X, ST-D, or the newest ST-D BT?



I have the ST-4X SQ which drives my Mids and tweets, and ST-4X P configured as bridged to run my 6.5 mid bass

IMO, they sound good.


----------



## jcmusika

ninetysix said:


> Definitely superior to a 2x4, which ain't bad. Having 6 EQs per channel instead of 5 made a big difference to my setup. UI is much nicer too, less changing pages and easier to link XO or EQ settings between channels.
> 
> Just be careful if you're adjusting output levels in real time by typing the number into the box instead of dragging the slider or highlighting the box and using the up/down arrows. I think I accidentally typed a letter into the box and it shot up to +20dB or something silly... Scared the crap out of me


you got that right, i used the slider and accidentally hit +20. scared the crap out of me !. 
to be safe, type the settings you desire


----------



## TwistdInfinity

jcmusika said:


> you got that right, i used the slider and accidentally hit +20. scared the crap out of me !.
> to be safe, type the settings you desire


He said that if you accidentally type a letter it goes to +20 so I'd say to be sage use the up down arrows lol

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

I'm not 100% it was a letter that did it, but i don't care to find out again lol. Definitely keys are the safest option when working live. Probably easiest any way when using a laptop with a track pad. Tab, up/down etc. Same for setting delay.

I'm also very careful when changing the hpf value for my tweeters. Haven't been running active for long and I haven't bothered to put a cap on for safety.


----------



## Lanson

ninetysix said:


> I'm not 100% it was a letter that did it, but i don't care to find out again lol. Definitely keys are the safest option when working live. Probably easiest any way when using a laptop with a track pad. Tab, up/down etc. Same for setting delay.
> 
> I'm also very careful when changing the hpf value for my tweeters. Haven't been running active for long and I haven't bothered to put a cap on for safety.


I like using HPF on my amp for that too. Sure, it is only ~500hz on most amps but that can keep a tweeter alive if you slip on a dial.


----------



## juiceweazel

ninetysix said:


> Nah no y-connectors necessary. Does your head unit have spdif out? As in digital, usually fibre optic sometimes coax cable. The minidsp can only take coax spdif
> 
> If you don't have that but have analogue RCAs you can hook your front left and right into channel 1 and 2, and your sub output into channel 3 (or 3 and 4 if it's a stereo signal).
> 
> For say an active 2 way plus sub and rear fill you would rout input 1 (left) to outputs 1, 3 and 5. Input 2 (right) to 2, 4 and 6. input 3 to output 8. 1&2 left and right mids, 3&4 left and right tweets, 5&6 rear fill and 8 for sub. Set crossovers, get your gains right, take measurements if you can, eq, time alignment and you're looking good.
> 
> Just watch out for any symptoms of OCD, or at least learn to hide them


That's my OCD issue LOL. I have 3 sets of RCA's out of my deck & even though I know I don't NEED to run all of them to the mini, I really want to.

I also feel they should allow us to download & play with the software before buying. Obviously the big boys like RF have a pretty looking app & it makes it initially easier for those of us that have not made the leap of faith yet.
I'm close to buying but not 100% sure yet.

Can an iPad mini control this unit? Ideally it would. I got 1 for Xmas & haven't decide if I'll use it or trade it for something else.


----------



## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> I like using HPF on my amp for that too. Sure, it is only ~500hz on most amps but that can keep a tweeter alive if you slip on a dial.


That'll do the trick, thanks mate


----------



## ninetysix

juiceweazel said:


> That's my OCD issue LOL. I have 3 sets of RCA's out of my deck & even though I know I don't NEED to run all of them to the mini, I really want to.
> 
> I also feel they should allow us to download & play with the software before buying. Obviously the big boys like RF have a pretty looking app & it makes it initially easier for those of us that have not made the leap of faith yet.
> I'm close to buying but not 100% sure yet.
> 
> Can an iPad mini control this unit? Ideally it would. I got 1 for Xmas & haven't decide if I'll use it or trade it for something else.


PM me your email, I'll send you the install file if you like. That's a negative on the iPad unfortunately, even tho the DSP connection uses adobe air so there's no technical reason why minidsp haven't made iOS and android apps :mean:

The Mrs won the latest iPad mini 4g 64gb at her work Xmas party a year ago, sold it the next day for like au$750 :laugh:


----------



## ninetysix

*Tuning mic position, sub EQ*

Just to mix things up a bit, lets talk tuning. This is a fairly broad subject, but here seems like as good a place as any. It's specific enough to the 6x8 so here goes.

So in my car I've been tuning my setup with a umik-1 using REW with pink noise & RTA. I've got my 3 way fronts (alpine type R 8" in sealed boxes on the floor, boston spz60 running coax in the doors) working quite well by holding the mic with the usb cable basically in my ear pointing at the drivers being measured. I'm using the on axis calibration file. RTA set to 1/48 RTA mode, 32 averages, and I take a few measurements moving the mic around just slightly and then average those together. I then smooth it to 1/6 or 1/12 before EQ.

When it comes to the sub (alpine type R 12", sealed in about 1 cube and sealed up against the skipass with polystyrene) if I'm doing the left side I untick the right channel input to my summed sub output (im using channel 8 for sub, with spdif 1+2 routed into it) otherwise the sub measures a good 3dB higher than where I want it to be relative to just the left 8. Makes sense right? somebody stop me if I've got it wrong.

So when measuring the sub I've still been pointing the mic roughly towards my front left speakers. I do get fairly different readings pointing it towards the sub behind me or from the right ear pointing to the right speakers. So I EQ the sub to where I want it, then unmute the left 8 (which I've also already EQ'd) and run the RTA with Pink PN and no averaging to get my XO point, TA and phase all set right with a flat transition from sub to mid. Once happy I'll go back to regular pink noise, 32 averages and confirm i'm happy then move on to the midrange and then tweeter.

Then on to the right side, and the sub doesn't look bad, but not quite as good as on the left side seeing it's already EQ'd there. Should I EQ the sub with the mic pointing at it? I tried that and couldn't get the transition to look or sound right with the mid playing as well.

What I'm going to try next is using the 90 degree calibration file and hold the tip of the mic near my left ear and pointing straight down. I'm also thinking of using outputs 7 and 8 both for the sub (7 currently unused) and EQ'ing both sides individually, and running the pair into the amp where it will be summed to mono.


I'd appreciate some feedback on my workflow, I know there are many guides out there but nothing that really seems like the idiots holy bible of DSP tuning. I also need to limit my time spent out in the car experimenting due to poor WAF :blush:

Cheers


----------



## juiceweazel

ninetysix said:


> PM me your email, I'll send you the install file if you like. That's a negative on the iPad unfortunately, even tho the DSP connection uses adobe air so there's no technical reason why minidsp haven't made iOS and android apps :mean:
> 
> The Mrs won the latest iPad mini 4g 64gb at her work Xmas party a year ago, sold it the next day for like au$750 :laugh:


Wait not even Android? What the hell! Nice score on your iPad lol. Looks like I'll have to trade the iPad in for a cheap Windows tablet or does it have to be a lap top?


----------



## rton20s

juiceweazel said:


> Wait not even Android? What the hell! Nice score on your iPad lol. Looks like I'll have to trade the iPad in for a cheap Windows tablet or does it have to be a lap top?


I would think a Windows Tablet as cheap as the $80 HP Stream from Groupon would be sufficient.


----------



## ninetysix

hmmm, got me thinking about using a windows tab for my headless setup now...

anyway if anybody wants a copy of the c-dsp software, I've put it in my google drive on the following link:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3o1iRwDPN3TTzJqbHN6LUFKNXM/view?usp=sharing


Can't see any reason why minidsp would object, its not like a paid plugin for say a 2x4... might only help people who are sitting on the fence to click buy now


----------



## LaydSierra

Sorry bud, just sent you a PM before I saw your last post lol

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


----------



## juiceweazel

rton20s said:


> I would think a Windows Tablet as cheap as the $80 HP Stream from Groupon would be sufficient.


I'll have to check that out, thanks for the recommendation.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Just ordered mine. I didn't see the plug-in for it though. Am I missing something? I'm sure it's there for download somewhere.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

I just downloaded the deq8 software. I guess the graphic on the input side would do as good or better for final shaping and use the peq on the output side for the really big cuts if needed.


----------



## Big T

Yea. I don't think I would like not having the 31geq


----------



## troutspinner

Big T said:


> Yea. I don't think I would like not having the 31geq


The parametric EQ on the input side isn't bad. When you first see it you think ew, I am not going to have the same control as I did with the 31 GEQ. After playing with it a bit you'll see that you actually have more control because you can control shells, slopes, etc. Giving you more finite control than a GEQ can offer.


----------



## Big T

That's why you have them on the output. Lol


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

Big T said:


> That's why you have them on the output. Lol


That's assuming you don't go overboard trying to tune every little bump out with the rta. Lucky for me my frontstage is pretty well behaved so only have a few specific places where the stage skews. I tune by ear with the guy counting to 25, in/out of phase, and frequency centered pink noise. If I can't hear anything that sounds "off" with the pink noise tracks I don't worry about what an rta might say...I'm not set up to rta or have a mic and am in no hurry to do it. I trust my ears and now that I've learned how to properly set time alignment and phase it's all come together nicely. I also center the noise tracks outside of the passband until I can't hear them anymore.


----------



## Lanson

What's the Q of the GEQ's controls? Because a 31 band with narrow Q can end up with ripples you can't fix, and wide Q can end up screwing up more than the band intended. in fact, it is guaranteed to do that. 

I also like the idea of a GEQ / PEQ hybrid input / output, but if the GEQ's Q is fixed...it might not be nearly as good as a PEQ to start with.


----------



## bugsplat

I can speak for fat-fingering a character into the fields. I tried a "." and the value jumped to +20. Scared the %$&* out of me and I lost a 6.5 mid-woofer from it. Its now making a buzzing sound at high volumes . Don't type in the value, use the slider or +- arrows.

Love the device. The wording on the remote bugs me. "Minidsp" is written one way while the preset numbers are 45* from that. Which way is up. AARRRGHHHH MY OCD! Every night I pray for an android app


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

If the lines are accurate I pegged the q at around 4.5.


----------



## Lanson

Steak House said:


> I'm not sure how accurate these lines compare to the sound actually coming out of the unit - but this is my GEQ for the left channel. Basically I played a test tone for each frequency and adjusted it to the center of my windshield using the left and right GEQs of each input channel. Hence the right GEQ is a mirror image of what you see here.



Oh nice!

In that case yeah, I might swap over to the PPI software then.

I haven't yet wired up and fired up my MiniDSP though. It is just sitting, waiting, like the rest of my build, for the crappy weather to clear up and the short days to get longer.


----------



## troutspinner

Big T said:


> That's why you have them on the output. Lol


If that is how you are using it you're making your life more difficult. Use the individual output PEQ for correcting individual speakers. Use the inputs to shape your overall sound.


----------



## Big T

troutspinner said:


> If that is how you are using it you're making your life more difficult. Use the individual output PEQ for correcting individual speakers. Use the inputs to shape your overall sound.



Correct. That's what we like a GEQ for..

PEQ for correction and GEQ for shaping


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Wow I would have thought PEQ would be better for shaping, giving you the ability to add a shelf etc to slowly lower everything after the mid bass 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Big T

I guess everyone has their one way lol


----------



## troutspinner

TwistdInfinity said:


> Wow I would have thought PEQ would be better for shaping, giving you the ability to add a shelf etc to slowly lower everything after the mid bass
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


You are correct. Rather than creating a similar gain or decrease say at two close frequencie with a drop in between with a GEQ, you can create a smooth relationship with the two with PEQ.


----------



## ninetysix

I've done pretty well using REW to auto eq, dropping 6dB from 100-200 and a slight taper off from 5k, and although I'm yet to do the right side.... My left ear is very happy :blush: all on the output side so far, just a few little peaks here and there that I'm sure the input eq can help with, tho I wonder if I'd be able to tell the difference...


----------



## TwistdInfinity

That's what I think people keep forgetting. How it can integrate with REW and make biquad filters or whatever they are which gives about 4000 adjustments per channel.

Buy a umik 1, load it up, take measurements of each channel, do what you need to do in REW to make them all look the same then upload the filters to the C DSP 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Big T

TwistdInfinity said:


> That's what I think people keep forgetting. How it can integrate with REW and make biquad filters or whatever they are which gives about 4000 adjustments per channel.
> 
> Buy a umik 1, load it up, take measurements of each channel, do what you need to do in REW to make them all look the same then upload the filters to the C DSP
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk



OK. So that's something I haven't seen anyone confirm yet... The 6x8 will integrate with REW???


----------



## ninetysix

Of course. Even a minidsp 2x4 can.

If you open up REW's auto-EQ tab you'll see the radio button "minidsp"


----------



## Big T

So that brings up the question. Will the PPI software?


----------



## ninetysix

I haven't used it, but the screen shots I've seen look basically like the same program except for the GEQ on the inputs. Thing is, any EQ can work with REW. If it can't directly take the EQ file then REW can give you the values to manually punch in, and give you a prediction of how it should perform.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

troutspinner said:


> You are correct. Rather than creating a similar gain or decrease say at two close frequencie with a drop in between with a GEQ, you can create a smooth relationship with the two with PEQ.


That's why I prefer a peq for the big stuff but a graphic still has its place. peq on the input side will keep you from wasting tons of bands on the output side for the big smooth cuts and shelving. I also have a 13 band mono graphic in the headunit. Can someone point me in the direction of the plug-in with the peq on the input side? I couldn't find it on the mini website.


----------



## troutspinner

Big T said:


> So that brings up the question. Will the PPI software?


REW will not give you the file that you can directly import to the DEQ.8 but it will show the values to input manually.

This is how I tuned my system, sweep individual speakers (hanatsu's method) average and have REW give you the correction values and then manually enter the values into the channel. After doing each speaker, set delay and level again. After that, GEQ the input to get the sound shape you want...if needed.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

troutspinner said:


> REW will not give you the file that you can directly import to the DEQ.8 but it will show the values to input manually.
> 
> This is how I tuned my system, sweep individual speakers (hanatsu's method) average and have REW give you the correction values and then manually enter the values into the channel. After doing each speaker, set delay and level again. After that, GEQ the input to get the sound shape you want...if needed.


Can you link to hanatsus method? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## troutspinner

Just do a search on this forum, the post is on this site. I'd do it but I'm on a phone right now.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

troutspinner said:


> Just do a search on this forum, the post is on this site. I'd do it but I'm on a phone right now.


Yeah I generally only access from tapatalk and the search never works

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## troutspinner

TwistdInfinity said:


> Yeah I generally only access from tapatalk and the search never works
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk



Here you go. I decided to grab the computer. Phones are getting old to me...or maybe I am just getting old. 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...first-timers-guide-measuring-your-system.html


----------



## TwistdInfinity

troutspinner said:


> Here you go. I decided to grab the computer. Phones are getting old to me...or maybe I am just getting old.
> 
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...first-timers-guide-measuring-your-system.html


Thank you very much! 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

Bought mine with a miniStreamer and Umik-1 today. $400 with shipping which came out to be $605 Aus dollars, damn our crap dollar right now!


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Bought mine with a miniStreamer and Umik-1 today. $400 with shipping which came out to be $605 Aus dollars, damn our crap dollar right now!


My 2nd 6x8 should be on a FedEx truck for delivery tomorrow with 2x ministreamers  the Mrs car will benefit greatly from it, plus I'm secretly planning on dropping in a set of 7" scanspeak illuminators in the back doors for midbass duty 

I think the AUD was at about .69 when I ordered, and two days earlier it was .72  only added up to about 15 bucks extra, which hurts... But my long service leave ends on Feb 1st so I really need it here asap to have any chance of getting it dialled in sometime this year.


Edit: you've been active in this thread for yonks mate! Shoulda got on board while the going was good


----------



## Staffordshire

sorry for a noob question but could anyone tell me if 6x8 you can put in 2 in and have all 8 outs? i mean can you have 2rca in dsp and use all 8 out or do you need splitters and connect all 6in?


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Haha I know I know, didn't expect the AUD to take such a big dive!

So I'm setting up the software now ready to go. Can anyone tell me which is the SPDIF inputs is Left and which is Right channel???  (yes it's one physical spdif input but it has left and right channel in the stream which the software splits into seperate SPDIF channels for tuning/routing etc)


----------



## ninetysix

Staffordshire said:


> sorry for a noob question but could anyone tell me if 6x8 you can put in 2 in and have all 8 outs? i mean can you have 2rca in dsp and use all 8 out or do you need splitters and connect all 6in?


You could use one input (rca line in or a single channel of spdif) and route it through all 8 outputs any which way you want, if you wanted to that is.


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Haha I know I know, didn't expect the AUD to take such a big dive!
> 
> So I'm setting up the software now ready to go. Can anyone tell me which is the SPDIF inputs is Left and which is Right channel??? (yes it's one physical spdif input but it has left and right channel in the stream which the software splits into seperate SPDIF channels for tuning/routing etc)


We'll be kicking ourselves when it gets back up to a Buck 20 :laugh:

The pcm2704 dac I'm using now has left as spdif 1 and right as spdif 2.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Yeah I felt like 1 would be left. And I can't imagine any would be different from yours, spdif is a standard after all

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Hillbilly SQ

So, I tried the PPI software and it wouldn't work with the 6x8. Then I found the 6x8 software they put in my downloads and it works like a charm. And the level increments are super tight in .1db steps. Time alignment is tighter than I originally thought too.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Hillbilly SQ said:


> So, I tried the PPI software and it wouldn't work with the 6x8. Then I found the 6x8 software they put in my downloads and it works like a charm. And the level increments are super tight in .1db steps. Time alignment is tighter than I originally thought too.


That's interesting, most people have reported the ppi deq.8 software working

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## bugsplat

Staffordshire said:


> sorry for a noob question but could anyone tell me if 6x8 you can put in 2 in and have all 8 outs? i mean can you have 2rca in dsp and use all 8 out or do you need splitters and connect all 6in?


Yes. 2 RCA's from your headunit is all you need to run all 8 outputs. 

Technically you can just use one RCA. In the software you assign which channels you want linked to what input. You can assign all 8 channels to one input.


----------



## Staffordshire

thank you ppl


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Has anyone tested the RCA outputs to see if it clips at higher volume settings at all?

We've got an Oscilloscope at work I could try and use I guess, but hopefully someone has been able to confirm yay or nay to full clean signal.


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Has anyone tested the RCA outputs to see if it clips at higher volume settings at all?
> 
> We've got an Oscilloscope at work I could try and use I guess, but hopefully someone has been able to confirm yay or nay to full clean signal.


I don't have access to an o-scope so I've been relying on the input/output meters in the software to determine if the signal is clipping. I assume anytime the level gets higher than zero (and turns red) you're driving it too hard, somebody correct me if I'm wrong. 

I think the signal out of the minidsp is stronger than what you would get out of a car head unit that specifies 2V rcas. Most of my gain knobs are set to 4V or higher (as in anti clockwise).

I've noticed my spdif input meters often go a little above 0, so I've set the levels to -1 just incase. I've also got most of my outputs on about -3, as even with some serious EQ cutting it can get to or even past zero. Because there's no volume level indication I've tried to tune for the max volume setting being loud enough for some of the quieter flacs/wavs I have. In the bad old days of head units I'd always aim for 75%, as my last one would produce some serious hiss once you got past 40 out of 50 with a track on pause.

Nothing of the sort with the 6x8.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I'll be damn annoyed if I have any noise at all whilst on pause at any volumes, as that is something I loved with my Alpine W502 -> H701 via optical setup. Nil noise.

Hopefully I get time to test the outputs on the O-scope once I've got my unit!


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> I'll be damn annoyed if I have any noise at all whilst on pause at any volumes, as that is something I loved with my Alpine W502 -> H701 via optical setup. Nil noise.
> 
> Hopefully I get time to test the outputs on the O-scope once I've got my unit!


I'm quietly confident any noise you might encounter would be coming from down stream of the 6x8. Even with isolated dc-dc supplies I couldn't get a noiseless signal out of many head units I tried or even a 2x4 balanced, though the 2x4 was fine if powered by a separate 12v battery and fed from a uca202 connected to a phone. All my troubles disappeared the day my 6x8 arrived


----------



## bugsplat

I have a tiny bit of hiss at high vol but I'm 99% sure its coming from my $19.95 amazon special BT to SDPIF no-name converter. Its already on the chopping block for this weekend. I have not noticed any clipping but I have the input gain set to -17db. I can't stand listening to louder than that so I set the gain there to keep the vol from blasting me because of the lack of vol indicator. 

While I'm on the volume topic I'd like to register a complaint so listen up Minidsp. The volume levels for each preset are independent which I don't like. If i'm easy listening one morning on Pre-1 and switch to Pre-2, the vol changes to what you had it at last time you were on that preset many times BLASTING at the metal I had on the day before. Not a way to start your 6am drive to work. The Vol levels do not carry over. If you're not going to give us a visible vol meter on the remote at least tie all the vol level presets together.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

bugsplat said:


> The Vol levels do not carry over. If you're not going to give us a visible vol meter on the remote at least tie all the vol level presets together.


Surely that is something they could fix with a firmware update? We'd be best off starting a thread about it over at the miniDSP site, or emailing them directly 


Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## bugsplat

TwistdInfinity said:


> Surely that is something they could fix with a firmware update? We'd be best off starting a thread about it over at the miniDSP site, or emailing them directly
> 
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


I'm sure its an easy fix. Give me enough time and I can find and wrote a solution. Its not a deal killer by any means. I have gotten used to it and turn the volume down all the way before I switch. It would be nice to have it fixed on the next firmware though. I may send them an email when I get time.


----------



## ninetysix

I suggested to them it would be nice for the preset led to flash while muted, and turning they knob while muted would unmute it and start from minimum volume, like my old head unit did.

Be really nice to have a default volume setting for every time you turn the unit on or change presets, my 8 year old Yamaha AV receiver does that and it's very handy.


----------



## ninetysix

Damn, can't get the ministreamer to work with my nexus 6P  it lights up and my AV receiver says it's getting a 48kHz signal, but all sound sill comes through the phones speaker, and UAPP says it didn't detect it but Linux did, so try rebooting... No help. Definitely works from my laptop though, and the same otg cable detects a uca202 just fine... Maybe it's specific to my phone, as others have confirmed it working on android.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Oh damn! Yeah it's definitely been confirmed on some devices. Are you running Android 5.x?

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Marshmallow 6.0.1 on my nexus... Which may be the issue, my other coax DAC played in mono but uapp sorted that out. I'll give it a shot on a lollipop device, fingers crossed


----------



## ninetysix

Confirmed no good even with a powered hub, and also no good on my nexus 5 head unit in the car running lollipop. Hopefully the uapp developer can sort it out one day.

I only bought the ministreamer because it could do 24/96, even tho I only have two eagles albums in 24/96... And I've seen the results of many double blind studies that show basically nobody can identify 16/44.1 over anything higher, but I guess it hurts to burn au$100 on two of them :blush:


----------



## TwistdInfinity

The C DSP only has an internal sample rate of 48khz anyway. I bought it just as convenience when buying the C DSP. I already have a Hifimediy sabre u2 usb to optical card, just a shame the C DSP only takes coax spdif. I wonder if I could replace the receiver chip with a toslink one... 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

Let's not go crazy now  This dac looks pretty good for au$9. Another $2 for  one with an aluminium case


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Got my delivery today, woo! 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

bugsplat said:


> I have a tiny bit of hiss at high vol but I'm 99% sure its coming from my $19.95 amazon special BT to SDPIF no-name converter. Its already on the chopping block for this weekend. I have not noticed any clipping but I have the input gain set to -17db. I can't stand listening to louder than that so I set the gain there to keep the vol from blasting me because of the lack of vol indicator.
> 
> While I'm on the volume topic I'd like to register a complaint so listen up Minidsp. The volume levels for each preset are independent which I don't like. If i'm easy listening one morning on Pre-1 and switch to Pre-2, the vol changes to what you had it at last time you were on that preset many times BLASTING at the metal I had on the day before. Not a way to start your 6am drive to work. The Vol levels do not carry over. If you're not going to give us a visible vol meter on the remote at least tie all the vol level presets together.


Why not just tune to an equal loudness curve where all frequencies are the same volume to your ears? That's what I do and feel no need to have multiple presets for different kinds of musicI do this because my truck is quite the whore when it comes to fellow enthusiasts getting seat time in it and you never know what they're going to throw at it. Equal loudness curve gives everything an equal chance to sound like it did when it was mastered in the studio


----------



## bugsplat

Hillbilly SQ said:


> Why not just tune to an equal loudness curve where all frequencies are the same volume to your ears? That's what I do and feel no need to have multiple presets for different kinds of musicI do this because my truck is quite the whore when it comes to fellow enthusiasts getting seat time in it and you never know what they're going to throw at it. Equal loudness curve gives everything an equal chance to sound like it did when it was mastered in the studio


I don't use my presets for different Freq levels, I use it for different seat locations. Pre1=Driver side, Pre-2=Center, Pre-3=Passenger, Pre-4=Only Xover set. Each preset has a different Gain and TA for the location. If I try to change Presets in the middle of a song it will BLAST at the last used Vol when I was on that preset. It would be nice to make the switch and the vol stayed the same so I can hear the sound location shift. Its a cool toy to play with but it requires all the presets to be on the same vol first.


----------



## BlueGhost

bugsplat said:


> I don't use my presets for different Freq levels, I use it for different seat locations. Pre1=Driver side, Pre-2=Center, Pre-3=Passenger, Pre-4=Only Xover set. Each preset has a different Gain and TA for the location. If I try to change Presets in the middle of a song it will BLAST at the last used Vol when I was on that preset. It would be nice to make the switch and the vol stayed the same so I can hear the sound location shift. Its a cool toy to play with but it requires all the presets to be on the same vol first.


That is disappointing to find out, I expended it to be a master volume. If you are using presets to switch between sources, RCA to SPDIF, this would be bad too.


----------



## ninetysix

I suppose this is more REW specific than c-dsp, but it might save ya'll a lot of headache. If you're measuring with REW, make sure your dac/soundcard is set to 16/48 under playback devices in windoze, weird s#!t happens when its on 16/44! Any time I ran a sweep I was getting a weird pulsating noise towards the end of the sweep (whether it was 30-5000 for a mid or 1000-20000 for a tweeter).


----------



## jgscott

I just read this whole thread last night. A few pages back there was a comparison and debate about the difference in quality and internal components of the Mini 6x8 vs the PPI dep.8 vs the Soundstream DSP. 

Was there ever a conclusion about which was best and why? Or did I miss it? I am about to order one, and want to order the best one. Thanks.


----------



## troutspinner

jgscott said:


> I just read this whole thread last night. A few pages back there was a comparison and debate about the difference in quality and internal components of the Mini 6x8 vs the PPI dep.8 vs the Soundstream DSP.
> 
> Was there ever a conclusion about which was best and why? Or did I miss it? I am about to order one, and want to order the best one. Thanks.


The DEQ.8 and Soundstream are no longer in production, I would go with the one that is for support and warranty.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Took the remote apart, seeing if I might be able to locate it down here:


But the remote cable connection is on the side. Seriously why is the case so deep when it's only got this inside of it?

Oh well at least if I put it up here I can mount the stripped out sub amp remote volume control next to it on a custom faceplate. 


Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

Hah, that's pretty lame! I might try cutting the back and sides off once I work out where to put it.

Looks like a 4th gen legacy, are you running 3 way front?


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> Hah, that's pretty lame! I might try cutting the back and sides off once I work out where to put it.
> 
> Looks like a 4th gen legacy, are you running 3 way front?


Yeah, 3 way hertz mille set, 2nd Gen. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Yeah, 3 way hertz mille set, 2nd Gen.
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Nice. Got any pics of the setup? The Mrs wagon is running the current MLK 165.3 legend 2 way set. Currently got the tweets in the kicks as with the passives and no DSP it sounded best to me. Now with a DSP and running active I'll experiment a bit more with tweeter placement.

Got a set of tang band w6 1139si 6.5" subs on the way, I recon I can get 3-4L sealed in the rear doors with a mix of marine ply and PVC pressure pipe. If it doesn't work out at least it won't cost much.

This is how I sealed the doors up, tho I went over the seams with no more gaps and put a layer of hush mat over the steel after the photo was taken.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> Nice. Got any pics of the setup? The Mrs wagon is running the current MLK 165.3 legend 2 way set. Currently got the tweets in the kicks as with the passives and no DSP it sounded best to me. Now with a DSP and running active I'll experiment a bit more with tweeter placement.
> 
> Got a set of tang band w6 1139si 6.5" subs on the way, I recon I can get 3-4L sealed in the rear doors with a mix of marine ply and PVC pressure pipe. If it doesn't work out at least it won't cost much.
> 
> This is how I sealed the doors up, tho I went over the seams with no more gaps and put a layer of hush mat over the steel after the photo was taken.


Yeah nice, I'll pm you some photo bucket links so as not to go too OT of the thread. 

Am enjoying the first day of listening with my miniDSP in. I've a really got my mid range pods and subs out right now so running in 2 way front only mode with zero level settings, gains all min, no EQ and it sounds amazing already 

Can't wait to give it some real tuning time with REW and the umik. 

And I'm using both usb to spdif into the miniDSP and a 3.5mm to rca into 2 of the low level inputs. The Aux in has some noise but nothing on the spdif in

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

When I run the uca202 DAC into the analogue inputs I get some hiss that goes up with the volume knob cranked and nothing playing, but zero with spdif.


----------



## DavidRam

I have the minidsp 6x8 and I am wondering how to connect my phone or pc directly to the dsp to use them as the source... Can someone enlighten me please?

Btw, it's Android and/or Windows.

Thanks!


----------



## ninetysix

DavidRam said:


> I have the minidsp 6x8 and I am wondering how to connect my phone or pc directly to the dsp to use them as the source... Can someone enlighten me please?


Apple, android?


----------



## DavidRam

ninetysix said:


> Apple, android?







Oops, that info might have been important! Lol. It's android on the phone and tablet can be android or Windows. I don't do Apple.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I use a usb to spdif audio card

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Snake

You can't stream audio over usb to the 6x8, so you need a aux to rca cable. or usb to spdif converter.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Yeah it seems a little strange they didn't add usb streaming since they have multiple devices that allow it, couldn't have been that hard?

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

... Who would buy the next version if they gave us everything first time around 


I use a Cheap PCM2704 usb DAC from my android device to my 6x8, clean as a whistle. I use the same DAC into a laptop for tuning & music too


----------



## Velozity

TwistdInfinity said:


> Took the remote apart, seeing if I might be able to locate it down here:
> 
> 
> But the remote cable connection is on the side. Seriously why is the case so deep when it's only got this inside of it?
> 
> Oh well at least if I put it up here I can mount the stripped out sub amp remote volume control next to it on a custom faceplate.
> 
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk




Excellent. I was hoping someone would post pics of the remote board. I haven't ordered mine yet. Looks like there are provisions on that board for the volume LEDs but they didn't populate it. I guess that explains why it's shown with LEDs in the owner's manual.


----------



## DavidRam

Thanks for the replies!

So I would need a dac and obviously an spdif coax cable, and it should be plug and play??Also, I will using this for flac files if that makes any difference, so I'll need to make sure the dac is compatible with 192kHz...



*Edit: Now that I think about it, is there a hi res media player that will function as a dac and plug directly into the spdif input???*


----------



## TwistdInfinity

DavidRam said:


> Thanks for the replies!
> 
> So I would need a dac and obviously an spdif coax cable, and it should be plug and play??Also, I will using this for flac files if that makes any difference, so I'll need to make sure the dac is compatible with 192kHz...
> 
> 
> 
> *Edit: Now that I think about it, is there a hi res media player that will function as a dac and plug directly into the spdif input???*


Are your FLAC files actually 24/192 though? Unless you download them from high res music stores they are likely just CD's ripped into Flac which are still only 16/44

This DAC accepts all inputs but has an internal rate of 24/48 so it down samples higher rate audio. 

95 percent chance you wouldn't notice the difference between a CD Flac file and an actual high res file in a moving vehicle anyway, that's why I still went for the C DSP even though I've got high res files 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

Can you pick the high res file over 16/44.1 in a double blind test? I'm not really convinced anybody can


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> Can you pick the high res file over 16/44.1 in a double blind test? I'm not really convinced anybody can


At home with my headphones on usually yes. In a car definitely not haha

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

I think an ABX test is in order


----------



## t3sn4f2

ninetysix said:


> I think an ABX test is in order


mmm hmmm.

AES E-Library: Audibility of a CD-Standard A/D/A Loop Inserted into High-Resolution Audio Playback



"[Engineering Report] Claims both published and anecdotal are regularly made for audibly superior sound quality for two-channel audio encoded with longer word lengths and/or at higher sampling rates than the 16-bit/44.1-kHz CD standard. The authors report on a series of double-blind tests comparing the analog output of high-resolution players playing high-resolution recordings with the same signal passed through a *16-bit/44.1-kHz “bottleneck.”* The tests were conducted for over a year using different systems and a variety of subjects. The systems included expensive professional monitors and one high-end system with electrostatic loudspeakers and expensive components and cables. The subjects included professional recording engineers, students in a university recording program, and dedicated audiophiles. The test results show that the CD-quality A/D/A loop was undetectable at normal-to-loud listening levels, by any of the subjects, on any of the playback systems. The noise of the CD-quality loop was audible only at very elevated levels."

Mind you, this experiment is known to be technically much more degrading to signal quality than what the C-DSP is doing. In this experiment the signal is re-digitized (supposedly a lossy process), then down converted once in digital form, and finally converted back to analog. The high rez to C-DSP interface would be a cleaner process since it skips the ADC stage all together. And even without that advantage, the experiment was completely transparent. Oh, and they weren't using some $100K ADC/DAC either.


----------



## ninetysix

t3sn4f2 said:


> mmm hmmm.
> 
> AES E-Library: Audibility of a CD-Standard A/D/A Loop Inserted into High-Resolution Audio Playback
> 
> 
> 
> "[Engineering Report] Claims both published and anecdotal are regularly made for audibly superior sound quality for two-channel audio encoded with longer word lengths and/or at higher sampling rates than the 16-bit/44.1-kHz CD standard. The authors report on a series of double-blind tests comparing the analog output of high-resolution players playing high-resolution recordings with the same signal passed through a *16-bit/44.1-kHz “bottleneck.”* The tests were conducted for over a year using different systems and a variety of subjects. The systems included expensive professional monitors and one high-end system with electrostatic loudspeakers and expensive components and cables. The subjects included professional recording engineers, students in a university recording program, and dedicated audiophiles. The test results show that the CD-quality A/D/A loop was undetectable at normal-to-loud listening levels, by any of the subjects, on any of the playback systems. The noise of the CD-quality loop was audible only at very elevated levels."
> 
> Mind you, this experiment is known to be technically much more degrading to signal quality than what the C-DSP is doing. In this experiment the signal is re-digitized (supposedly a lossy process), then down converted once in digital form, and finally converted back to analog. The high rez to C-DSP interface would be a cleaner process since it skips the ADC stage all together. And even without that advantage, the experiment was completely transparent. Oh, and they weren't using some $100K ADC/DAC either.


Damn pay wall. Sounds interesting but I'm not parting with 20 bucks to see it play out.

I found this survey to be very interesting and I'll have a go at it myself when I've got the time. Won't bother in the car, but my KRK studio monitors should give me a fighting chance at guessing correctly


----------



## havs54

First post but here we go. I have a 2009 F-150 running off of stock sync system (non-sony).

I run the following:
Front Stage: Focal PS165's powered by Zapco AG360.4
Rear Stage: Stock speakers run off of head Unit
Subwoofer: Sundwn SD-2 10" powered by PPI Art 600.2

To run active with the C-DSP, do I need a Ministreamer or like device to give the C-DSP a clean signal? I plan on using an Ipod connected via USB to sync. My goal is to have the best possible SQ while retaining stock sync functions. Regarding that, would I need to use the C-DSP remote or could I retain the stock volume knob?

Any help is appreciated.


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## havs54

A PAC AOEM-FRD-24 connects to the sync system and provides two pairs of RCA jacks. Thge Zapco 360 is connected through a SLDIN.T and the PPI is connected through RCA's


----------



## ninetysix

To run "active" it doesn't matter how you get the signal into the minidsp, but I would recommend keeping the signal chain as simple and as digital as possible. There are lots of DACs with spdif output that are compatible with an iDevice, as well as docks like the pure i-20 that can put out coax spdif straight to the c-dsp. You would have to use the minidsp remote in that case.

I don't know much about sldin.t or your sync system, but to me it sounds like anything other than spdif into the DSP and rca out to amps is going to be less than ideal


----------



## ninetysix

Just to clarify my previous post, if you're listening to lossless audio from your iPod then a DAC/dock with spdif straight to the DSP is going to be the absolute best possible setup, but you could also run the RCA's from your PAC integration unit into the c-dsp and use a different preset to switch between spdif and rca inputs, but you'll still need to use the volume knob as far as I can tell unless you don't use spdif and just run everything thru the OEM system


----------



## havs54

ninetysix said:


> To run "active" it doesn't matter how you get the signal into the minidsp, but I would recommend keeping the signal chain as simple and as digital as possible. There are lots of DACs with spdif output that are compatible with an iDevice, as well as docks like the pure i-20 that can put out coax spdif straight to the c-dsp. You would have to use the minidsp remote in that case.
> 
> I don't know much about sldin.t or your sync system, but to me it sounds like anything other than spdif into the DSP and rca out to amps is going to be less than ideal


Thanks for the help,

So basically I should find a DAC that would take RCA in from head unit and convert it to SPDIF out before going into C-DSP?


----------



## ninetysix

havs54 said:


> Thanks for the help,
> 
> So basically I should find a DAC that would take RCA in from head unit and convert it to SPDIF out before going into C-DSP?


Nah definitely no point doing that, just run the rca straight into the DSP.

But bypassing the head unit and running spdif straight from your iPod into the DSP may give you a cleaner signal. Point is you can do both


----------



## havs54

ninetysix said:


> Nah definitely no point doing that, just run the rca straight into the DSP.
> 
> But bypassing the head unit and running spdif straight from your iPod into the DSP may give you a cleaner signal. Point is you can do both


I'll try just RCA's first then if I'm not satisfied go the other route. Regardless, thanks for the input and if anybody has other solutions throw it my way.


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## LumbermanSVO

I'd suggest doing what I did, use the Apple Lightning to to HDMI Dongle and an audio stripper/de-embedder with an SPDIF output. With this you get a digital signal from your iOS device to the processor.

See here: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/build-logs-project-install-gallery/245937-old-bronco.html


----------



## jcmusika

LumbermanSVO said:


> I'd suggest doing what I did, use the Apple Lightning to to HDMI Dongle and an audio stripper/de-embedder with an SPDIF output. With this you get a digital signal from your iOS device to the processor.
> 
> See here: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/build-logs-project-install-gallery/245937-old-bronco.html


what product did you use for audio stripper/de-embedder with SPDIF ?


----------



## LumbermanSVO

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009KAU0WO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00


----------



## ryanougrad

Anyone had luck with a digital coax switch so they can run two sources over digital to the c-dsp?


----------



## cjbrownco

havs54 said:


> First post but here we go. I have a 2009 F-150 running off of stock sync system (non-sony).
> 
> I run the following:
> Front Stage: Focal PS165's powered by Zapco AG360.4
> Rear Stage: Stock speakers run off of head Unit
> Subwoofer: Sundwn SD-2 10" powered by PPI Art 600.2
> 
> To run active with the C-DSP, do I need a Ministreamer or like device to give the C-DSP a clean signal? I plan on using an Ipod connected via USB to sync. My goal is to have the best possible SQ while retaining stock sync functions. Regarding that, would I need to use the C-DSP remote or could I retain the stock volume knob?
> 
> Any help is appreciated.


I hope you have better luck with your factory head unit than I did. I have the same truck and I had a very noisy unit. I tried different amp/speaker combinations, changed my rca's, changed my ground several times, and finally figured out the factory head unit was the problem. I ended up installing an 80PRS and the difference in sound quality was night and day. I am sure any decent aftermarket deck would have been an improvement. Just thought I would share that in case you are having the same problem.


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## chuyler1

Is there software for the C-DSP that can configure a center channel?


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## ninetysix

I don't believe so, but perhaps worth emailing minidsp about even if only as a suggestion


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## TwistdInfinity

Centre channel is achieved just by summing a left and right input into a single output. There's no tricky processing to make it a true centre channel, it'll just be a mono channel of left + right. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

My bad, I thought there would be more to it than that :blush:


----------



## rton20s

TwistdInfinity said:


> Centre channel is achieved just by summing a left and right input into a single output. There's no tricky processing to make it a true centre channel, it'll just be a mono channel of left + right.
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


There is much more to proper center channel steering. This is probably a good place to start. 

Welcome Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity


----------



## chuyler1

Yeah, it's more than just L+R. You have to also subtract signal from your actual L and R or you lose stereo separation. But if you only want to do that to certain frequencies that the center channel can handle you have to account for that as well. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

Yeah I realise this, I did mention that it won't do the 'tricky processing' and it'll just be summed left and right... 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

Just got my nexus 7 2013 lte model, can confirm MiniStreamer works on it with Android 5.1.1. No external power required. Spotify etc all work, not just when using UAPP 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Hanatsu

Too lazy to check.

Anyone knows if the this Mini c-dsp use the same chassis as the old Helix P-DSP. They look similar.


----------



## motomech

Hanatsu said:


> Too lazy to check.
> 
> Anyone knows if the this Mini c-dsp use the same chassis as the old Helix P-DSP. They look similar.


this is the minidsp c-dsp 6x8


----------



## StevenSeagull

I am on the fence on purchasing this unit, and had a few questions for anyone that has been running the unit for some time now. In addition to a few questions of my own for anyone in general.

What pros/cons(issues) have you experienced with the unit?

I am located in the US (IL), it looks like the duties paid to have this shipped were in the range of $25.00. Did anyone pay more than $25.00? Even with this fee (assuming it was not more for some people), this still appears to be cheaper than even going with the US distributor.

My setup will consist of a windows tablet and some form of USB to SPDIF. If I order this unit I will go with the Muse USB DAC PCM2704 like previously mentioned. My question is would it be better to locate the Muse unit close to the DSP and run the USB cable throughout the vehicle to the Muse unit or locate the MUSE unit near the tablet and run a long RCA cable for the SPDIF input?

In regards to the quality of music files, will I be able to play a wide range of MP3 files (variable, 192kbps, 320kbps) through the configuration mentioned above?

Would I be able to run a single RCA to the SPDIF input in order to output to 6 channels (mids/tweeters/subwoofers)? Would I lose quality with this configuration? What cable would I need for this, is there any in particular that I need considering the SPDIF input or is this a standard RCA cable, will I need a cable rated at a certain impedance? Could anyone recommend a cable for this portion of the install or what I should consider when purchasing?

Would anyone recommend any other DSPs over the Minidsp unit and for what reasons in particular? From what I have read this appears to be a good value unit, with not much else within this price range that has the same track record according to the SS & PPI units.


----------



## ninetysix

StevenSeagull said:


> What pros/cons(issues) have you experienced with the unit?


so far only complain is the mute button not working, and while in the non-functioning mute state you can't turn it down until you un-mute it. When you change presets it stays on whatever volume you had it on last time which can make for some loud surprises, ideally you could set an initial volume to be safe. That's it for complaints.



> My setup will consist of a windows tablet and some form of USB to SPDIF. If I order this unit I will go with the Muse USB DAC PCM2704 like previously mentioned. My question is would it be better to locate the Muse unit close to the DSP and run the USB cable throughout the vehicle to the Muse unit or locate the MUSE unit near the tablet and run a long RCA cable for the SPDIF input?


Ultimately it might not make any difference, but you're much more likely to have signal issues with a longer USB cable than with a longer spdif coax cable. 16ft is the limit for USB, 33 feet for spdif. 



> In regards to the quality of music files, will I be able to play a wide range of MP3 files (variable, 192kbps, 320kbps) through the configuration mentioned above?


It will act as a sound card with a maximum bit depth/rate of 16/48 so it will happily play lossless flac/cd/dvd quality audio as well as lossy mp3s.



> Would I be able to run a single RCA to the SPDIF input in order to output to 6 channels (mids/tweeters/subwoofers)? Would I lose quality with this configuration? What cable would I need for this, is there any in particular that I need considering the SPDIF input or is this a standard RCA cable, will I need a cable rated at a certain impedance? Could anyone recommend a cable for this portion of the install or what I should consider when purchasing?


Yep just one coax cable from the usb sound card to the DSP. That will give you left and right in to the DSP which you can then route to up to 8 outputs of your choosing. I'm using mine for a pair or tweeters, a pair of 3.5" mids, a pair of 7" midbass and a pair to my sub amp (single amp & sub, but I feed it left and right for a stronger signal, not essential tho).

Ideal cable would be a length of RG6 coax, tho I'm currently using a single rca cable that I stripped off from a "premium" RGB component video cable. I'll use RG6 when I get around to tidying (and finishing) my install.



> Would anyone recommend any other DSPs over the Minidsp unit and for what reasons in particular? From what I have read this appears to be a good value unit, with not much else within this price range that has the same track record according to the SS & PPI units.


No. But I may be biased


----------



## StevenSeagull

ninetysix said:


> so far only complain is the mute button not working, and while in the non-functioning mute state you can't turn it down until you un-mute it. When you change presets it stays on whatever volume you had it on last time which can make for some loud surprises, ideally you could set an initial volume to be safe. That's it for complaints.


Is there anything wrong with setting the DSP at a specific volume level and leaving it at that, then adjusting the volume through the Windows device master volume? Or is it better to have the Windows master volume set to a certain percentage (100% or what percentage) and adjusting the volume on the DSP?

@ninetysix thanks a lot for the follow up.


----------



## ninetysix

I believe that you lose resolution on an spdif signal by sending it at anything other than full volume, not sure how true or noticeable that is.

Cheers


----------



## iskone

Forgive me if I'm repeating a question that's been answered. Can the remote be used to switch rthe source? I know it can change some presets, would those presets be where I would set the source? I want to keep my oem hu, use the speaker level inputs and also run an usb to spdif from my phone.


----------



## ninetysix

Yes, inputs and outputs can be routed any way you like on each preset


----------



## EmptyKim

iskone said:


> Forgive me if I'm repeating a question that's been answered. Can the remote be used to switch rthe source? I know it can change some presets, would those presets be where I would set the source? I want to keep my oem hu, use the speaker level inputs and also run an usb to spdif from my phone.


Yes. That is configured in the "routing" sections of the each config.


----------



## iskone

Nice. Thus is a sweet unit!


----------



## Jscoyne2

fourthmeal said:


> Exactly! It can be a ****ing mess, and since nobody on here actually said there was Customs to pay, I didn't calculate it in my budget for the item. If I did, I would have purchased from Madisound, since I already had speakers coming from them anyway.
> 
> FYI I also bought the mic kit, so not sure if that changes things or whatever, but it is what it is.
> 
> And yeah, you gotta pay it.


If purchased from madisound, how do you get access to the software for the c-dsp? im still lost on that subject. I dont see a DL link minidsps website for the plug in.


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> If purchased from madisound, how do you get access to the software for the c-dsp? im still lost on that subject. I dont see a DL link minidsps website for the plug in.


It doesn't really matter where you get it from, and if it makes it any easier I've got it hosted on my Google drive.


----------



## ninetysix

I just checked and version 1.1 of the software is out, came out a month ago. Be nice if I got an email? here's the link.



> rev 1.1 / Feb 26th 2016
> 
> - Adding support for filter on gain input dialog box to prevent NaN value. - Firmware upgrade file to remove some potential gain level mismatch between remote and DSP. Make sure to restore both the DSP remote and firmware remote. See zip file steps and user manual for more info.
> 
> rev 1.0 / Sept 30th 2015
> - Initial release


----------



## ANDRESVELASCO

Babs said:


> Well well well!!
> 
> Item Description...
> Audio outputs 8 x outputs on RCA connector - Max 2Vrms


I'm interested in get this dsp, but I have 2 concerns. May be you guys can help me. 

1) Max output is 2v rms... It seems too low! (poor signal strength=noise). Any time I have had the chance to listen a system with low strength signal HU (2-2.5v),and then try with a hi volt (4-5v) HU, the difference in clarity is HUGE. Same gears, even same HU's brands... Just output strength difference. ¿Does this affect the overall performance of this unit? If not.. ¿Why not? 

2) Does it makes any difference if I run this DSP with a low volts (2-2.5v) source than with a hi curren output(4-5v)? Or finally, internal dac and electronics do the same with one or the other? 

3) should a Line driver (a good one, AC Matrix i.e) be a good idea to add before Amps to this dsp system (specially for subs)? Or would no make any difference in SQ?


----------



## ninetysix

ANDRESVELASCO said:


> I'm interested in get this dsp, but I have 2 concerns. May be you guys can help me.
> 
> 1) Max output is 2v rms... It seems too low! (poor signal strength=noise). Any time I have had the chance to listen a system with low strength signal HU (2-2.5v),and then try with a hi volt (4-5v) HU, the difference in clarity is HUGE. Same gears, even same HU's brands... Just output strength difference. ¿Does this affect the overall performance of this unit? If not.. ¿Why not?


Don't worry about the volts, minidsp have kinda shot themselves in the foot by rating their outputs at 2v. I went from a JVC arsenal with 5v outputs to a 2x4 then a 6x8 and only had to up my gains just a fraction. Had a clarion dxz785usb before that with 6v outputs and the output was pretty similar to the JVC. I also recently put in an alpine cde153bt just for am/fm radio and hands free calls, that has 2v outputs and they are nowhere near as strong as the 2v on the 6x8. With the alpine connected to the 4v inputs of the 6x8 i have to have about +10dB on the inputs to get them close to maxing out with the head unit on full volume (i normally back it off a little till i find the noise floor).

I haven't measured anything with a meter, but I can say that basically all of my gain knobs are nowhere near 2v, typically a little above 4v (as in counterclockwise of the 4v setting). I have a pdx-f6 for my 8ohm 3.5" mids and 4ohm tweets and those gains are all the way down, 6.5v setting from memory though it's a lot more amp than they need.

I think that comes down to minidsp not being a car audio specific company. 

I do however have my DSP in the trunk so my rca patch leads are 1.2m at the longest, so there's very little opportunity for any noise to get on board. Using spdif helps a lot here too as there is no noise being fed in to the DSP which can only make things worse, just 1s and 0s.


> 2) Does it makes any difference if I run this DSP with a low volts (2-2.5v) source than with a hi curren output(4-5v)? Or finally, internal dac and electronics do the same with one or the other?


The analogue inputs on the 6x8 are rated for 4v so you would want as strong a signal as you can get, if you have something that can over drive it then you can always back the head unit volume down. I've had best results using an spdif card from my phone straight to the DSP, and only use analogue for radio.


> 3) should a Line driver (a good one, AC Matrix i.e) be a good idea to add before Amps to this dsp system (specially for subs)? Or would no make any difference in SQ?


You won't need a line driver. The output is easily strong enough to avoid the noise floor in any car. Especially with subs


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Don't worry about the volts, minidsp have kinda shot themselves in the foot by rating their outputs at 2v. I went from a JVC arsenal with 5v outputs to a 2x4 then a 6x8 and only had to up my gains just a fraction. Had a clarion dxz785usb before that with 6v outputs and the output was pretty similar to the JVC. I also recently put in an alpine cde153bt just for am/fm radio and hands free calls, that has 2v outputs and they are nowhere near as strong as the 2v on the 6x8. With the alpine connected to the 4v inputs of the 6x8 i have to have about +10dB on the inputs to get them close to maxing out with the head unit on full volume (i normally back it off a little till i find the noise floor).
> 
> I haven't measured anything with a meter, but I can say that basically all of my gain knobs are nowhere near 2v, typically a little above 4v (as in counterclockwise of the 4v setting). I have a pdx-f6 for my 8ohm 3.5" mids and 4ohm tweets and those gains are all the way down, 6.5v setting from memory though it's a lot more amp than they need.
> 
> I think that comes down to minidsp not being a car audio specific company.
> 
> I do however have my DSP in the trunk so my rca patch leads are 1.2m at the longest, so there's very little opportunity for any noise to get on board. Using spdif helps a lot here too as there is no noise being fed in to the DSP which can only make things worse, just 1s and 0s.
> 
> The analogue inputs on the 6x8 are rated for 4v so you would want as strong a signal as you can get, if you have something that can over drive it then you can always back the head unit volume down. I've had best results using an spdif card from my phone straight to the DSP, and only use analogue for radio.
> 
> You won't need a line driver. The output is easily strong enough to avoid the noise floor in any car. Especially with subs


Ive read all the pages but didnt take notes. How would one connect an ipod to digital coaxial out to the c-dsp

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Ive read all the pages but didnt take notes. How would one connect an ipod to digital coaxial out to the c-dsp
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Assuming you have a compatible spdif adaptor for a iPod/iPhone, you connect a single rca cable between the adaptor and the spdif input on the 6x8. Go into the configuration software and route digital 1 and 2 (Left and right) to your outputs as required, done.

As mentioned (possibly even on this page still) it doesn't really matter what rca cable you use, though RG6 quad shield would be most ideal.


----------



## ninetysix

Oh and if you meant how do you get spdif out of an iPod in the first place, well if it's an older one then a dock like the pure i-20 will work but if it's newer then your only option is a lightning to HDMI output with a HDMI spdif extractor, mentioned here a few pages back. Flame suit on, but I think android is vastly superior here


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Oh and if you meant how do you get spdif out of an iPod in the first place, well if it's an older one then a dock like the pure i-20 will work but if it's newer then your only option is a lightning to HDMI output with a HDMI spdif extractor, mentioned here a few pages back. Flame suit on, but I think android is vastly superior here



I have no preference for apple. Honestly i ****ing hate them and itunes is a joke but they make good ipods and that has always been my go-to source, i could go on and on about the reasons why i hate apple but they do make great UI for ipods/iphones. Terrible everything IMO, Terrible UI for itunes as well.

UI for Android has never been that great. Android does everything right except have a clean interface, atleast in my opinion. If you have proof of otherwise, id love to see.

I keep my ipod in my car at all times, Its just sits in its cubbyhole, connected to my headunit. Chillin. 


What are my options with android hardware wise/ app wise/ and adapter wise, if i wanted to go headunitless


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Oh and if you meant how do you get spdif out of an iPod in the first place, well if it's an older one then a dock like the pure i-20 will work but if it's newer then your only option is a lightning to HDMI output with a HDMI spdif extractor, mentioned here a few pages back. Flame suit on, but I think android is vastly superior here


would something like this work??

android phone to










to this. http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-105...8&pi=SL75&qid=1363636847&ref_=mp_s_a_1&sr=8-1

and that to the c-dsp?


----------



## ANDRESVELASCO

ninetysix said:


> Don't worry about the volts, minidsp have kinda shot themselves in the foot by rating their outputs at 2v. I went from...


Thnks for feedback


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> I have no preference for apple. Honestly i ****ing hate them and itunes is a joke but they make good ipods and that has always been my go-to source, i could go on and on about the reasons why i hate apple but they do make great UI for ipods/iphones. Terrible everything IMO, Terrible UI for itunes as well.
> 
> UI for Android has never been that great. Android does everything right except have a clean interface, atleast in my opinion. If you have proof of otherwise, id love to see.
> 
> I keep my ipod in my car at all times, Its just sits in its cubbyhole, connected to my headunit. Chillin.
> 
> 
> What are my options with android hardware wise/ app wise/ and adapter wise, if i wanted to go headunitless


I have an iPhone for work but my daily ride is a nexus 6p. I just can't get past the concept of no back button, no gesture keyboard by default (tho Swiftkey is an option now) and I don't like how it handles notifications - tho they work well from the lock screen. I'd be curious to see what an iPhone with a custom ROM would be like, but not on my work supplied phone. Otherwise there are lots of things the iPhone does very well, but it's really just not made for people like me. I like customising my nav keys, having the torch come on by long pressing the power button with the screen off, laying out my notification bar setting tiles exactly the way I like them and a whole bunch more things I won't mention because we're way off topic :blush: sorry folks.

I figure your best option is to pony up for the HDMI-spdif extractor and keep on being happy with your setup?

Otherwise a small android tablet works great for headless, specifically the 2013 nexus 7 if you can find one. Getting a bit long in the tooth now tho, not sure how good they run marshmallow tho really KitKat is about all you need.

I still listen to am&fm quite a lot so I stuck with a cheap head unit and my daily phone in a dock with USB audio. It's much easier with a 5.5" screen, but still not a walk in the park. I typically start the car, pick an album or playlist in tidal then hit the road. Or just pickup where I left off last time. UAPP loads up the instant I plug my spdif card in, though it's ui is pretty clunky compared to tidal

I use a joycon exr for steering wheel controls for pause play skip and I've been meaning to set up a button to search for albums or tracks by voice, shouldn't be too hard with the tasker app. I've had lots of luck with a $7 pcm2704 USB spdif card, though there's better out there (in theory at least).


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> would something like this work??
> 
> android phone to
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> to this. http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-105...8&pi=SL75&qid=1363636847&ref_=mp_s_a_1&sr=8-1
> 
> and that to the c-dsp?


Nah not necessary for android, only iPhone/pod needs the HDMI step. Android just needs a USB on the go cable ($2?) and your choice of USB spdif card. There's a thread on head-fi forums about dacs/cards that people have successfully used.

That's why I donned the flame suit and said what I said  cheap and easy, tho limited to 16/48 audio (about as good as the minidsp 6x8 can do anyway) but a $10 app bypasses that and the sky is the limit.


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Nah not necessary for android, only iPhone/pod needs the HDMI step. Android just needs a USB on the go cable ($2?) and your choice of . There's a thread on head-fi forums about dacs/cards that people have successfully used.
> 
> That's why I donned the flame suit and said what I said  cheap and easy, tho limited to 16/48 audio (about as good as the minidsp 6x8 can do anyway) but a $10 app bypasses that and the sky is the limit.



Would you mind finding that link, Im not exactly sure what im looking for. 

What app do you refer too?

and is it even worth going all digital?


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Would you mind finding that link, Im not exactly sure what im looking for.
> 
> What app do you refer too?
> 
> and is it even worth going all digital?


Thread here:
Android phones and USB DACs

Just bear in mind not all DACs have digital out as well as line/headphone out, and fewer still have coax spdif (optical much more popular). 

This is the spdif card I've got:

PCM2704 USB DAC to s PDIF Sound Card Decoder Board 3 5mm Analog Output | eBay

This is the app:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.extreamsd.usbaudioplayerpro


And yes I think digital is very worth it.


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Thread here:
> Android phones and USB DACs
> 
> Just bear in mind not all DACs have digital out as well as line/headphone out, and fewer still have coax spdif (optical much more popular).
> 
> This is the spdif card I've got:
> 
> PCM2704 USB DAC to s PDIF Sound Card Decoder Board 3 5mm Analog Output | eBay
> 
> This is the app:
> 
> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.extreamsd.usbaudioplayerpro
> 
> 
> And yes I think digital is very worth it.


So you just use a micro usb to usb cord into that card, and use the digital out to the c-dsp? No other fiddling? 


Whats so special about the app? Are there certain settimgs on it I have to check or?

And thank you for your effort.

Sent from my camry using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> So you just use a micro usb to usb cord into that card, and use the digital out to the c-dsp? No other fiddling?
> 
> 
> Whats so special about the app? Are there certain settimgs on it I have to check or?
> 
> And thank you for your effort.
> 
> Sent from my camry using Tapatalk


Just an on the go lead, micro USB (or type c for the nexus 6) for basically all android phones and female type a USB on the other end. Looks like this:










The app lets you go above 16/48 if you feel you need to, and is great for playing lossless files. It bypasses androids audio system completely and talks directly to the sound card. You can use it to stream tidal too.

A while ago I could only get mono out of my phone for some reason and this app fixed that, but only for stuff played thru the app. Google must have fixed the issue as it's no longer present so I just use tidal app, you may not need it.


----------



## iskone

It's anybody in this thread using an Android Auto head unit and getting a digital signal out to their dsp?
I've been looking all over, here, xda, the Chinese manufacturers, etc. Nothing so far.


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Just an on the go lead, micro USB (or type c for the nexus 6) for basically all android phones and female type a USB on the other end. Looks like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The app lets you go above 16/48 if you feel you need to, and is great for playing lossless files. It bypasses androids audio system completely and talks directly to the sound card. You can use it to stream tidal too.
> 
> A while ago I could only get mono out of my phone for some reason and this app fixed that, but only for stuff played thru the app. Google must have fixed the issue as it's no longer present so I just use tidal app, you may not need it.


That silver box on the otherside of the digital outputs, doesnt look like a usb? Does that plug into the on the go lead?

What do you mean google fixed that o_o?

Does that app play music thats on my phone?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> That silver box on the otherside of the digital outputs, doesnt look like a usb? Does that plug into the on the go lead?
> 
> What do you mean google fixed that o_o?
> 
> Does that app play music thats on my phone?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


The micro USB on the left of the picture goes into the phone, leaving you with a standard USB socket hanging off the phone, you can plug anything into that like a mouse, memory stick, camera, hard drive or USB sound card.

So if you get a USB sound card like this:










You need an A to B USB cable to plug that in to either a PC or phone, same lead that comes with the 6x8. That goes between the sound card and the otg lead in the phone, then a single rca between the coax out on the sound card and the coax in on the 6x8 and you're good to go.

With android lollipop or newer it's as if you just plugged headphones in, no sound comes thru the phones speaker it all goes thru the sound card now, all notifications, ringing, YouTube, tidal or whatever.


I mean Google must have patched the USB audio issue causing my phone to output mono in the earlier release of marshmallow.

The app can play basically any format you have on your phone, but if you have a tidal account you can use that to stream audio too. That app can let you fix the output bit rate at the sources native rate, typically 44.1khz for most flac or tidal where android fixes it at 48khz. In theory it might be better to not have it scaled before going into the dsp (where it probably gets rescaled again) but it's probably not a big deal.

Also if you run the otg lead into a 4 port usb hub you can plug a memory stick and the sound card in and play off external storage. If you want steering wheel controls (very handy because using the phone while driving is a pain) you can also plug a joycon exr into the hub and that connects to the wire that previously went to the OEM head unit for the buttons on the wheel.


Cheers


----------



## ninetysix

iskone said:


> It's anybody in this thread using an Android Auto head unit and getting a digital signal out to their dsp?
> I've been looking all over, here, xda, the Chinese manufacturers, etc. Nothing so far.


I looked into it and found that basically all of them could use an external sound card, but only for use with an app that plays audio such as Google music, tidal, Spotify etc... The radio, CD player built into the unit can only output thru the built in DAC via the rca outputs that sound like ass :uneasy:


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> The micro USB on the left of the picture goes into the phone, leaving you with a standard USB socket hanging off the phone, you can plug anything into that like a mouse, memory stick, camera, hard drive or USB sound card.
> 
> So if you get a USB sound card like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need an A to B USB cable to plug that in to either a PC or phone, same lead that comes with the 6x8. That goes between the sound card and the otg lead in the phone, then a single rca between the coax out on the sound card and the coax in on the 6x8 and you're good to go.
> 
> With android lollipop or newer it's as if you just plugged headphones in, no sound comes thru the phones speaker it all goes thru the sound card now, all notifications, ringing, YouTube, tidal or whatever.
> 
> 
> I mean Google must have patched the USB audio issue causing my phone to output mono in the earlier release of marshmallow.
> 
> The app can play basically any format you have on your phone, but if you have a tidal account you can use that to stream audio too. That app can let you fix the output bit rate at the sources native rate, typically 44.1khz for most flac or tidal where android fixes it at 48khz. In theory it might be better to not have it scaled before going into the dsp (where it probably gets rescaled again) but it's probably not a big deal.
> 
> Also if you run the otg lead into a 4 port usb hub you can plug a memory stick and the sound card in and play off external storage. If you want steering wheel controls (very handy because using the phone while driving is a pain) you can also plug a joycon exr into the hub and that connects to the wire that previously went to the OEM head unit for the buttons on the wheel.
> 
> 
> Cheers


Wow, thanks for all the detail. Much appreciated

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Has anybody updated to 1.1 yet? It seems like the mute works fine now  however it didn't straight after the update, it actually did the opposite, got louder on mute. I reset my config to default then all was well. A nice little touch is that the volume display in the software while connected now updates as you turn the knob, I used to have to turn the knob then mute/unmute to see what volume I had it set to.

Another thing I've noticed is I no longer need to tame my outputs with -6dB. With no eq and my levels on spdif in set to 0 and my outputs set to 0, if I play a -12dB sine wave I actually get -12dB on my outputs. Previously it would have been much closer to 0dB.

There's nothing in the changelog about that but it's a night and day difference in my opinion. I now have absolutely nothing to complain about with the c-dsp


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Ah that's awesome, I was wondering why I had to put all my spdif outputs to -12dB! Will update very soon 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## havs54

Got the C-DSP installed in my F-150 via just an RCA cable for now. Will be installing a Nexus 7 soon to get an all digital out. All I have adjusted is the crossover points until I get it fully dialed in but it sounds pretty damn good for no equalizer adjustments or RTA. I just started playing around with Room EQ wizard and it's gonna be a process to get it set up to my liking. 

I've been reading this thread: diymobileaudio.com/forum/how-articles-provided-our-members/163234-first-timers-guide-measuring-your-system

Any other links to get me started on my road to Musical Heaven?


----------



## EmptyKim

havs54 said:


> Got the C-DSP installed in my F-150 via just an RCA cable for now. Will be installing a Nexus 7 soon to get an all digital out. All I have adjusted is the crossover points until I get it fully dialed in but it sounds pretty damn good for no equalizer adjustments or RTA. I just started playing around with Room EQ wizard and it's gonna be a process to get it set up to my liking.
> 
> I've been reading this thread: diymobileaudio.com/forum/how-articles-provided-our-members/163234-first-timers-guide-measuring-your-system
> 
> Any other links to get me started on my road to Musical Heaven?


This is what I used as a guide:

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...44455-quick-tip-using-auto-eq-roomeq-rew.html


----------



## ninetysix

Definitely check out jazzi's tuning guide once you have a feel for using rew, taking measurements and get your head around the auto eq function. Then you can play with house curves with crossovers enabled.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...1-jazzis-tuning-companion-room-eq-wizard.html

Make sure you get the latest version (4.2 I think) which may not be in the first post


----------



## bugsplat

hmmmmm will have to keep an eye on 1.1. I have a good thing going right now, not sure if I want to risk changing something and having to re-tune.


----------



## ninetysix

bugsplat said:


> hmmmmm will have to keep an eye on 1.1. I have a good thing going right now, not sure if I want to risk changing something and having to re-tune.


You could always downgrade to v1.0 if it doesn't work out, the firmware files are in the zip files for both releases (link to both posted on previous page). It seems like config files created in v1.0 work in v1.1


----------



## havs54

Thanks for the help.

Quick question regarding gains, I have my Midbass drivers set on one side of my Zapco 360.4 and my tweeters on the other. How important is the gains step in Hanatsu's guide? Could I do it by ear or should I go through his process?

Regarding the EQ curve, is the goal to make you setup as close to the house curve as possible?


----------



## Hanatsu

Ordered a cdsp now. My Helix P-dsp went completely dead on left chan now.


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk.


----------



## iskone

ninetysix said:


> I looked into it and found that basically all of them could use an external sound card, but only for use with an app that plays audio such as Google music, tidal, Spotify etc... The radio, CD player built into the unit can only output thru the built in DAC via the rca outputs that sound like ass :uneasy:


You talking about the Chinese units? I reached out to a few different manufacturers and didn't have much luck either. I do like the features built into some of those units but digital out is of course a deal breaker. 

Do you know if any of the big names are offering digital out? Pioneer doesn't look like they will. Alpine I haven't looked at yet, maybe they're is an ai-net to toslink available now? 

I'll get back on my search this weekend.


----------



## ninetysix

iskone said:


> You talking about the Chinese units? I reached out to a few different manufacturers and didn't have much luck either. I do like the features built into some of those units but digital out is of course a deal breaker.
> 
> Do you know if any of the big names are offering digital out? Pioneer doesn't look like they will. Alpine I haven't looked at yet, maybe they're is an ai-net to toslink available now?
> 
> I'll get back on my search this weekend.


I think you're SOL on all fronts there :worried:

As far as I can tell the best options for digital out are car PC, tablet, phablet or phone. In that order.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

My Alpine W502EV which I just took out has toslink out. You could always get a toslink to Coax spdif changer. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## iskone

I have looked at the carpc options and so far I'm not in. But it may be the best option in the long run, but also the most costly. A carpc optioned the same as the Chinese boxes comes in at around $1000, retail. I would like to run the cdsp software right the head unit though.

I had a W505 but I don't think it had toslink. I may go back to Alpine if I decide Android isn't quite there yet.


----------



## ninetysix

havs54 said:


> Thanks for the help.
> 
> Quick question regarding gains, I have my Midbass drivers set on one side of my Zapco 360.4 and my tweeters on the other. How important is the gains step in Hanatsu's guide? Could I do it by ear or should I go through his process?
> 
> Regarding the EQ curve, is the goal to make you setup as close to the house curve as possible?


I'm not really familiar with hanatsu's guide, but I usually start off setting them by ear. I do all my measurements with the master volume set to about -18dB, or a click lower. If you have ample power for all of your drivers I'd imagine somewhere between the 2V and 4V setting would be about right - or much less for tweeters, but you can check with a DMM to be extra safe. Your ears should be able to tell you if something isn't right

If you're using house curves to auto-eq then yes, the idea is to get the measurement to match the curve. If you're using jazzi's spread sheet then you can tell it precisely what you want each driver to achieve. If a measurement is high or low across the board then you can fine tune the gain rather than making across the board cuts or boosts. One side may measure louder than the other, in that case I set the gain for the quieter side then reduce the level on the output for the louder side, then eq it.

Many ways to skin a cat


----------



## ninetysix

iskone said:


> I have looked at the carpc options and so far I'm not in. But it may be the best option in the long run, but also the most costly. A carpc optioned the same as the Chinese boxes comes in at around $1000, retail. I would like to run the cdsp software right the head unit though.
> 
> I had a W505 but I don't think it had toslink. I may go back to Alpine if I decide Android isn't quite there yet.


Maybe check out a windows tablet if android isn't doing it for you.

Though if tuning while driving is a prerequisite, I don't think anything will do the trick. The software is fiddly enough on a 15" laptop while parked.

I imagine other DSPs that come with a fully featured remote would be ok for tweaks here and there. On my old JVC head unit I could adjust TA, eq or balance/fade pretty much without taking my eyes off the road. Now I have no choice but to drive safely


----------



## iskone

I'm looking at some other carpc stuff now that looks promising.
I don't want to tune on the road just thought it would come in handy when I don't have my laptop.

For me it's probably
1) Digital out
2) native streaming
3) can bus
4) odb ii 
5) nav


This looks doable so far.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/nexus-7/general/discussion-tips-nexus-7-car-tablet-t3185727


----------



## havs54

ninetysix said:


> I'm not really familiar with hanatsu's guide, but I usually start off setting them by ear. I do all my measurements with the master volume set to about -18dB, or a click lower. If you have ample power for all of your drivers I'd imagine somewhere between the 2V and 4V setting would be about right - or much less for tweeters, but you can check with a DMM to be extra safe. Your ears should be able to tell you if something isn't right
> 
> If you're using house curves to auto-eq then yes, the idea is to get the measurement to match the curve. If you're using jazzi's spread sheet then you can tell it precisely what you want each driver to achieve. If a measurement is high or low across the board then you can fine tune the gain rather than making across the board cuts or boosts. One side may measure louder than the other, in that case I set the gain for the quieter side then reduce the level on the output for the louder side, then eq it.
> 
> Many ways to skin a cat


Thanks for the help

So I've decided to go with a Nexus 7 in my truck out via OTG to this:

http://www.amazon.com/Signstek-Coax...ds=dac+coax+spdif&refinements=p_72:2661618011 

I should be good to go using Spotify as my main player correct?


----------



## ninetysix

havs54 said:


> Thanks for the help
> 
> So I've decided to go with a Nexus 7 in my truck out via OTG to this:
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Signstek-Coax...ds=dac+coax+spdif&refinements=p_72:2661618011
> 
> I should be good to go using Spotify as my main player correct?


Do you have a Spotify premium account? You can set it to "extreme quality" which is 320kbps, which is petty good.... Like a good mp3. Free version is 160kbps, which.... Isn't great.

But I like tidal HiFi, CD/flac quality 16 bit 44.1khz (1440kbps I think). Otherwise start building up a flac collection, and use either USB audio player pro or I think the onkyo music player app isn't bad


----------



## havs54

ninetysix said:


> Do you have a Spotify premium account? You can set it to "extreme quality" which is 320kbps, which is petty good.... Like a good mp3. Free version is 160kbps, which.... Isn't great.
> 
> But I like tidal HiFi, CD/flac quality 16 bit 44.1khz (1440kbps I think). Otherwise start building up a flac collection, and use either USB audio player pro or I think the onkyo music player app isn't bad


Nothing but extreme quality. I listen to a lot dubstep/trap/rap so Spotify is great for that. I read a lot of reviews of both and people were complaining that tidal is missing a ton of artists...and it's 20/month vs 5 for spotify. Regardless I've done a ton of research on 320kbps vs flac in a car environment and what I've found is that the difference is too narrow to worry about. Now one day I may get the urge to try but I have quite a bit to do equipment wise before I get to that point


----------



## strohw

Hmm didn't know about the $5 for premium, thought it was $10. Looked it up and it's $5 for students? I'm one of those people who is pretty ehh about spotify. Even at the 320kbps setting, a fair number of songs sound pretty poo. I can directly compare songs in their catalog vs 320/flac files on my device and hear a difference immediately. I love their huge content though.


----------



## ninetysix

Yeah fair point tidals catalogue isn't exactly up there with the bigger names in streaming, it's probably around Google play's level. Still I'm quite happy with it, hardest part is deciding what to listen to. Pandora and Google play (and I assume Spotify) are great at making your mind up for you based on history, something tidal needs to work on.

As far as lossless vs lossy sources... I agree that the difference is slight (as possibly a topic for a different thread) but on certain songs it's very obvious, and is worth going to the extra effort for, on basically any sound system at any stage of completion. We tend to go to petty extreme lengths for minuscule improvements, and lossless is one that doesn't require any elbow grease or fibreglass.

If you don't have any .flac tunes, get some and have a good listen, get something you're familiar with. Old music can sound new again.



> I've done a ton of research on 320kbps vs flac in a car environment and what I've found is that the difference is too narrow to worry about.


Research? Why not just do some listening and make your own mind up. There are douche bags on both sides of the topic, especially one so subjective.


----------



## havs54

ninetysix said:


> Yeah fair point tidals catalogue isn't exactly up there with the bigger names in streaming, it's probably around Google play's level. Still I'm quite happy with it, hardest part is deciding what to listen to. Pandora and Google play (and I assume Spotify) are great at making your mind up for you based on history, something tidal needs to work on.
> 
> As far as lossless vs lossy sources... I agree that the difference is slight (as possibly a topic for a different thread) but on certain songs it's very obvious, and is worth going to the extra effort for, on basically any sound system at any stage of completion. We tend to go to petty extreme lengths for minuscule improvements, and lossless is one that doesn't require any elbow grease or fibreglass.
> 
> If you don't have any .flac tunes, get some and have a good listen, get something you're familiar with. Old music can sound new again.
> 
> 
> 
> Research? Why not just do some listening and make your own mind up. There are douche bags on both sides of the topic, especially one so subjective.


I plan on getting flac files eventually but in the meantime 320kbps is sufficent for me. I was referring to numerous scientific studies that show that above 320kbps it is very difficult to discern the difference. Now will it make a difference to my ears? Who knows but as a guy that is used hearing very subpar sound quality (128-256kbps) 320 sounds amazing to me. 

What are some good sites for buying flac files?


----------



## ninetysix

havs54 said:


> I plan on getting flac files eventually but in the meantime 320kbps is sufficent for me. I was referring to numerous scientific studies that show that above 320kbps it is very difficult to discern the difference. Now will it make a difference to my ears? Who knows but as a guy that is used hearing very subpar sound quality (128-256kbps) 320 sounds amazing to me.
> 
> What are some good sites for buying flac files?


Aye, it's true, just knowing you're listening to a flac does bring out extra detail in a song :laugh:

Nah but seriously, I've done some research too and at least it is possible for some people to pick the flac over 320 on certain tracks with a reasonable probability that they weren't guessing. And dollars spent didn't really influence it.

I found the studies comparing CD/flac (44.1khz) audio to DVD/bluray (96khz+) audio very interesting, where basically nobody could correctly pick the difference. The statistics showed a high probability of guessing and most were not confident of their selections, and the few that nailed it and were confident had some of the cheaper gear in the study.


Not sure where you can _legitimately_ obtain flacs to be honest, but if you have CDs you can rip them into flac, tho not all CDs are created equally. The other option is you can get a month trial of tidal HiFi for free (or at least you could when I joined a few months ago). It's pretty heavy on the data if you're streaming, but you can save tracks for offline listening on your WiFi at home to listen to later. I think it can work out to about 400mb per hour, which isn't so eye watering these days with unlimited 4g plans.


----------



## Skelshy

I can easily hear mp3 with very specific tracks where hihats or cymbals (SP?) are very prominent. Otherwise, no chance in a car.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


----------



## Hanatsu

That kind of distortion is normal with lower bitrate mp3s. Higher 256k+ should be ok.


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk.


----------



## Hanatsu

Dunno if this have been mentioned already. The remote volume control, I assume it works in the digital domain by reducing bit depth. What bit depth does it operate in at 0dBFS then? 16/24bit?


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk.


----------



## ninetysix

Hanatsu said:


> Dunno if this have been mentioned already. The remote volume control, I assume it works in the digital domain by reducing bit depth. What bit depth does it operate in at 0dBFS then? 16/24bit?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk.


I don't know, but I recon [email protected] would be able to help you


----------



## t0n33

I'm excited my c-dsp and umik arrive Wednesday! I've been reading up on hanatsu and other's setup threads and I think I know what to expect! 

has anyone tried to mod the remote to see if the LED traces on the volume knob remote work but are just missing?


----------



## Rtsr21

I'm getting a white/pink noise hum that does not change with the volume, the grounds are good, any tips on what to check next?


----------



## t3sn4f2

Hanatsu said:


> Dunno if this have been mentioned already. The remote volume control, I assume it works in the digital domain by reducing bit depth. What bit depth does it operate in at 0dBFS then? 16/24bit?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk.


Going off the spec sheet resolution specs, which coincide with the native known sample rate, it looks like 24bits.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Rtsr21 said:


> I'm getting a white/pink noise hum that does not change with the volume, the grounds are good, any tips on what to check next?


Try other grounding points on everything and check interconnect integrity.


----------



## Rtsr21

Yes I have, never had hum before installing the dsp.


----------



## Kpg2713

Rtsr21 said:


> Yes I have, never had hum before installing the dsp.


Something needs better grounding... Recheck?


----------



## Rtsr21

Ok ill go through them again, what about gain structure, I was able to turn the gains up more, after installing the dsp.


----------



## ninetysix

Rtsr21 said:


> Ok ill go through them again, what about gain structure, I was able to turn the gains up more, after installing the dsp.


Is the noise there if you disconnect the rca cables from the DSP to your amp? What about if you hook up a phone or laptop with either a USB sound card or 3.5mm to rca lead straight into the amp(s)?

Just how much did you turn up the gains? I'd recommend flashing the DSP with the v1.1 update before adjusting your input/output levels and gains. Make sure you have some head room (but not too much) on your inputs and outputs.


----------



## t3sn4f2

ninetysix said:


> Is the noise there if you disconnect the rca cables from the DSP to your amp? What about if you hook up a phone or laptop with either a USB sound card or 3.5mm to rca lead straight into the amp(s)?
> 
> Just how much did you turn up the gains? I'd recommend flashing the DSP with the v1.1 update before adjusting your input/output levels and gains. Make sure you have some head room (but not too much) on your inputs and outputs.


And dont forget to use muting plugs on inputs when checking component hiss.


----------



## ninetysix

Also is the DSP installed near your head unit or near your amps? Either is fine but maybe try grounding everything (hu, DSP, amps) from the one point


----------



## ninetysix

t3sn4f2 said:


> And dont forget to use muting plugs on inputs when checking component hiss.


I've had some cheeky amps that just went dead silent with muting plugs in, but noisy with either a head unit, DSP or laptop hooked up to it. Turned out to be a bad amp as replacing it cleaned it right up. Might have been something to do with the smoke that came out of it when I wired it up wrong to my 2x4 balanced :blush:


----------



## t3sn4f2

System hiss is the worst, right up there with rattles and resonances.


----------



## Rtsr21

When I unplug the rca's from the dsp output, the hiss goes away, so what does that tell me?


----------



## ninetysix

Rtsr21 said:


> When I unplug the rca's from the dsp output, the hiss goes away, so what does that tell me?


Not necessarily a whole lot just yet... Amps can mute their output when they don't detect a signal. 

Try hooking an external battery powered source directly to the amp, phone or laptop and don't have either one on charge. You might need to use the crossover on your amp or a passive if you have one laying around, don't wanna fry a tweeter.

Play something, If it's still the same then maybe you have your gains up too high.

If it's now a lot better, try reconnecting the amp to the DSP and connect the external source to the dsp input and see if it's any different. That could at least tell you if and maybe where you could have a ground loop causing hum.

Or try put everything back the way it was. If you roughly have it tuned to sound about right up loud, get it cranking and have a look at your input and output meters, they shouldn't ever go over 0dB but if they never go higher than say -10dB then you have some head room you should use up before cranking up the gains on the amp.


----------



## t0n33

ninetysix said:


> I'd recommend flashing the DSP with the v1.1 update before adjusting your input/output levels and gains. Make sure you have some head room (but not too much) on your inputs and outputs.


I'm trying to get setup ahead of receiving my c-dsp next week. I'm going to hook up my 2015 Honda Accord LX stock hu to the high inputs, and also a USB sound card from my Android phone via spdif. 

I'm thinking I'll use the input PEQ on 1-2 to correct for the factory hu fixed bass roll-off. I've seen people say they use the input eq for house eq, but i'm thinking I want those to correct my hu input, then use the output eq for tuning including house eq. does that sound right?

should I cut with the input eq instead of boost the 15db missing bass to avoid clipping the input, or can I just be sure to meter the dsp input gain after applying the eq?


----------



## ninetysix

t0n33 said:


> I'm trying to get setup ahead of receiving my c-dsp next week. I'm going to hook up my 2015 Honda Accord LX stock hu to the high inputs, and also a USB sound card from my Android phone via spdif.
> 
> I'm thinking I'll use the input PEQ on 1-2 to correct for the factory hu fixed bass roll-off. I've seen people say they use the input eq for house eq, but i'm thinking I want those to correct my hu input, then use the output eq for tuning including house eq. does that sound right?
> 
> should I cut with the input eq instead of boost the 15db missing bass to avoid clipping the input, or can I just be sure to meter the dsp input gain after applying the eq?


It's handy to use the inputs for fine tuning, but not essential. Use jazzi's spread sheet and you can eq your outputs to match a house curve. And you could still tweak the input eq a little in addition to de-eq'ing if necessary.

I didn't notice my input meter going any higher with an EQ boost on the input, but it will come out hotter on the other end. Give it a shot, with no crossover and no eq on an output and not connected to an amp. If you have all your levels set correctly and play a -12dB sine sweep with the remote on full volume your output meter should stay flat on -12dB throughout.

Or at least I think that's how it works


----------



## t0n33

ninetysix said:


> It's handy to use the inputs for fine tuning, but not essential. Use jazzi's spread sheet and you can eq your outputs to match a house curve. And you could still tweak the input eq a little in addition to de-eq'ing if necessary.
> 
> I didn't notice my input meter going any higher with an EQ boost on the input, but it will come out hotter on the other end. Give it a shot, with no crossover and no eq on an output and not connected to an amp. If you have all your levels set correctly and play a -12dB sine sweep with the remote on full volume your output meter should stay flat on -12dB throughout.
> 
> Or at least I think that's how it works


that makes sense to me to watch the sweep on the output meter for clipping, thanks!

I'll search around for jazzi's sheet too, thanks!


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I find the output eq's are best for matching each driver pair, then the input EQ I use for my overall slope 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Rtsr21

ninetysix said:


> Is the noise there if you disconnect the rca cables from the DSP to your amp? What about if you hook up a phone or laptop with either a USB sound card or 3.5mm to rca lead straight into the amp(s)?
> 
> Just how much did you turn up the gains? I'd recommend flashing the DSP with the v1.1 update before adjusting your input/output levels and gains. Make sure you have some head room (but not too much) on your inputs and outputs.


Ok got done doing some stuff to it, what I have found is the when I hook up an external source to the amp's the hiss is gone.

When it is hooked up to the dsp and I turn the *gains down* the hiss is gone. I used the smd dd1 to set the gains, the same way before the dsp.

I think I have 1.1 I will have to wait till the laptop comes back.


----------



## t0n33

TwistdInfinity said:


> I find the output eq's are best for matching each driver pair, then the input EQ I use for my overall slope
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


thanks for the help! I may just end up needing to apply two unique house curves; one for the OEM HU input that also corrects the bass roll-off, and one for the digital from my phone sound card with just the house eq...


----------



## Hanatsu

I got my unit in the car now...

Only complaint so far, the damn T/A control is worthless. When you press up/down it sometimes just goes away and the control box doesn't respond.

I like the design of the box though. Fits well into my system.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Your output EQ shouldn't change between different presets (HU and digital preset) as you're correcting each speaker within your system. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## t0n33

TwistdInfinity said:


> Your output EQ shouldn't change between different presets (HU and digital preset) as you're correcting each speaker within your system.
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


right, that's why I was wondering if I might apply my house eq on the output along with the speaker corrections so I don't have to setup different input roll-off correction + house eq on each input type.


----------



## ninetysix

Hanatsu said:


> I got my unit in the car now...
> 
> Only complaint so far, the damn T/A control is worthless. When you press up/down it sometimes just goes away and the control box doesn't respond.
> 
> I like the design of the box though. Fits well into my system.


Can't say I've ever experienced that issue. Tidy install


----------



## TwistdInfinity

t0n33 said:


> right, that's why I was wondering if I might apply my house eq on the output along with the speaker corrections so I don't have to setup different input roll-off correction + house eq on each input type.


Ah yeah, if you didn't want to adjust the curve you're using on the input sides you could you do that I guess. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## t0n33

TwistdInfinity said:


> Ah yeah, if you didn't want to adjust the curve you're using on the input sides you could you do that I guess.
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


I do see how it's probably easier to keep the output eqs setup for speakers flat and separate from the house eq. maybe it's worth the extra work getting them set on both input devices. thanks!


----------



## EmptyKim

Hanatsu said:


> I got my unit in the car now...
> 
> Only complaint so far, the damn T/A control is worthless. When you press up/down it sometimes just goes away and the control box doesn't respond.
> 
> I like the design of the box though. Fits well into my system.


I type the value i want into the box.


----------



## havs54

EmptyKim said:


> I type the value i want into the box.


No complaints about it so far here


----------



## havs54

I took up the free trial of Tidal since Saturday and I'm fully considering the switch. Song selection is great so far and SQ is phenomenal. From what I've gathered, there may not be much of a difference between 320 and FLAC but it appears that Spotify isn't streaming 320 on all of it's songs. I've noticed some huge differences in songs and it's completely worth the jump up in cost. I'm gonna get a 200gb SD for my nexus when I go that route and download all my songs offline. I'm finding myself listening to music more often throughout the day than I did on Spotify.


----------



## Scocuddie1

Has anyone had any troubles getting the C-DSP to turn on?

When I initially installed the unit, a faint white light illuminated from the SD Slot, which I thought meant the unit was powered on. Now, the light doesn't come on, and the unit is unable to connect to my PC. I've checked all connections, and all seem fine. Possibly a bad unit?


----------



## ninetysix

Lodge a support ticket on minidsp.com


----------



## ninetysix

havs54 said:


> I took up the free trial of Tidal since Saturday and I'm fully considering the switch. Song selection is great so far and SQ is phenomenal. From what I've gathered, there may not be much of a difference between 320 and FLAC but it appears that Spotify isn't streaming 320 on all of it's songs. I've noticed some huge differences in songs and it's completely worth the jump up in cost. I'm gonna get a 200gb SD for my nexus when I go that route and download all my songs offline. I'm finding myself listening to music more often throughout the day than I did on Spotify.


Alls well that ends well


----------



## drcasper

hi guys.. a few dumb questions. i am connecting this with my OEM hu using the high level inputs vrms on the c. do i need to hookup all 8 wires (Fl+FL-FR+FR-RL+RL-RR+RR-) into the c unit? i will be doing a 2way active component set frontage with no rear fill. also, i got a set of Image dynamics ctx 6.5cs. does anyone know what x-over configuration to start with this set?.. 

thank you

OEM HU > c 6x8 > Alpine pdx-v9 > 1x sundown sa-8v3 sub (1chan), and a 2way ID ctx 65cs component active (4chann)


----------



## ninetysix

drcasper said:


> hi guys.. a few dumb questions. i am connecting this with my OEM hu using the high level inputs vrms on the c. do i need to hookup all 8 wires (Fl+FL-FR+FR-RL+RL-RR+RR-) into the c unit? i will be doing a 2way active component set frontage with no rear fill. also, i got a set of Image dynamics ctx 6.5cs. does anyone know what x-over configuration to start with this set?..
> 
> thank you
> 
> OEM HU > c 6x8 > Alpine pdx-v9 > 1x sundown sa-8v3 sub (1chan), and a 2way ID ctx 65cs component active (4chann)


4 channels in would be handy as you could use front LR for the components and rear LR for the sub and fade the OEM hu back and forth to adjust the sub level if you wish. Not essential though if running all 8 wires to the DSP would be a pain. All you really need is one full range left and right pair.

I'm not hugely familiar with any of the drivers, but I would say start by crossing the sub and mids at 80Hz LR4 and the mid to tweeters at around 3000-3500Hz LR4 and see how it sounds and measures. If the tweeters can play lower without unacceptable distortion then go as low as you can till it don't sound good.

Be sure to stop at the point you feel it sounds best and don't worry too much about arbitrary numbers that other people swear by


----------



## Jscoyne2

How do you implement more than 6 biquads?

if i go into REW and let it auto eq, when it gives me more than 6 filters. How do i implement that into the cdsp?


----------



## Hanatsu

Jscoyne2 said:


> How do you implement more than 6 biquads?
> 
> if i go into REW and let it auto eq, when it gives me more than 6 filters. How do i implement that into the cdsp?


It's not supposed to. You need to choose "MiniDSP" as processing unit in the autoEQ tab.


----------



## Mlarson67

Anybody else have noise issues during power up of the unit? My sub makes a motorboat noise and my front stage makes an odd noise for about three seconds. Also have some hiss when paused. Have tried lowering the input gains and lowering amp gains to no avail


----------



## EmptyKim

Mlarson67 said:


> Anybody else have noise issues during power up of the unit? My sub makes a motorboat noise and my front stage makes an odd noise for about three seconds. Also have some hiss when paused. Have tried lowering the input gains and lowering amp gains to no avail


No. Mine doesn't have any noise


----------



## Scocuddie1

Scocuddie1 said:


> Has anyone had any troubles getting the C-DSP to turn on?
> 
> When I initially installed the unit, a faint white light illuminated from the SD Slot, which I thought meant the unit was powered on. Now, the light doesn't come on, and the unit is unable to connect to my PC. I've checked all connections, and all seem fine. Possibly a bad unit?



To follow up with my issue, I seem to have received a dead unit. All my connections are good, yet the unit does not power on. 

I've been trying to get it to power on for the last 4 days, and nothing. I wish they would send me another unit...I might have to move onto another manufacture unfortunately.


----------



## ninetysix

Scocuddie1 said:


> To follow up with my issue, I seem to have received a dead unit. All my connections are good, yet the unit does not power on.
> 
> I've been trying to get it to power on for the last 4 days, and nothing. I wish they would send me another unit...I might have to move onto another manufacture unfortunately.


Have you checked with a multimeter? 12vdc between power in and ground terminal, and 12vdc between remote in and ground terminal? That's really about as far as I would go before declaring it a dead unit.

If the unit doesn't light up, remote doesn't light up and you can't connect to it with the config software, you need a new one.

It's rotten luck to get a dud, but I'm sure the replacement will give you years of service


----------



## Scocuddie1

ninetysix said:


> Have you checked with a multimeter? 12vdc between power in and ground terminal, and 12vdc between remote in and ground terminal? That's really about as far as I would go before declaring it a dead unit.
> 
> If the unit doesn't light up, remote doesn't light up and you can't connect to it with the config software, you need a new one.
> 
> It's rotten luck to get a dud, but I'm sure the replacement will give you years of service


Yeah, multimeter was used to check 12vdc between power and ground and remote. Unit LED does not light up, remote doesn't light up, and software has been re-downloaded a few times and no luck.

I really hoping for a replacement as I've been very excited to use this, but no offer just yet from minidsp.


----------



## Jscoyne2

So is it cheaper to get one from madisound or from the minidsp site plus customs

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## EmptyKim

Jscoyne2 said:


> So is it cheaper to get one from madisound or from the minidsp site plus customs
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


I haven't had to pay customs...

How long after did people get billed by FedEx? Mine came with a FedEx slip with something about customs but the amount was $0.


----------



## Jscoyne2

EmptyKim said:


> I haven't had to pay customs...
> 
> How long after did people get billed by FedEx? Mine came with a FedEx slip with something about customs but
> 
> Maybe you don't pay anymore?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## brumledb

Jscoyne2 said:


> EmptyKim said:
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't had to pay customs...
> 
> How long after did people get billed by FedEx? Mine came with a FedEx slip with something about customs but
> 
> Maybe you don't pay anymore?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't bought anything from Minidsp but I have bought stuff from other overseas vendors and receive a bill from Fedex ~2 months afterwards.
Click to expand...


----------



## EmptyKim

I'll post here if I get an invoice from fedex for customs. I ordered 2/25/16, delivered a few days after... Maybe 3/1.


----------



## Jscoyne2

Still looking into it but apparently there is a 138% customs tax on peanuts

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

whats the measurements of the c-dsp


----------



## t0n33

Jscoyne2 said:


> whats the measurements of the c-dsp


the product brief PDF says 
41 x 205 x 122 mm

at https://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/Product Brief-CDSP 6x8.pdf


----------



## t0n33

I've had my c-dsp two weeks now, and I'm loving it! I was excited to discover i can use both the speaker level and spdif digital inputs on the same dsp preset. that makes it really easy for me since when I'm feeling lazy I can use the stock Accord hu Bluetooth or usb source, then, I can just turn the hu off, disconnect BT, and use my Nexus 6 with a USB OTG cable into a cheap box with coaxial spdif output into the c-dsp.

I setup the c-dsp input eq to correct for the factory hu bass roll off, and add a bit of house curves, and use the output eqs to flatten my speaker response with PEQ determined in REW and the umik-1. (thanks for the guide, hanatsu!) I also adjusted ta by ear using pink noise and the Doppler sweep method I read about here too. so cool!

this is an impressive amount of power for correction and control vs the audiocontrol lqc-1 I was using before. thanks to everyone here for sharing your experience and expertise! KeepHopeAlive for paving the way for me to tear into my 2015 Accord!

one of these days I'll have to throw my photos into a build log post...


----------



## Alextaastrup

What is a limit in time alignment?


----------



## ninetysix

I think it's a good 6 meters, more than double the limit for the 2x4. Enough for a limousine


----------



## Hanatsu

15ms


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk.


----------



## Lanson

Anybody getting massive turn-off pop? I'm still in the process of building my setup (so the head unit isn't installed) but I'm clearly doing something wrong here.

I have a 12v switch wire coming from a 12v source, that goes to the C-DSP and then I have the remote-out from the DSP to a 12V relay, which then runs to the remote-in on 3 JL amps, and an LED lighting controller.

There's no turn-ON pop at all, but when I disconnect my 12v source I get a wicked turn-off pop. Is this happening because I've got it rigged without a head unit, or do others get a turn-off pop on the C-dsp?


----------



## Jscoyne2

fourthmeal said:


> Anybody getting massive turn-off pop? I'm still in the process of building my setup (so the head unit isn't installed) but I'm clearly doing something wrong here.
> 
> I have a 12v switch wire coming from a 12v source, that goes to the C-DSP and then I have the remote-out from the DSP to a 12V relay, which then runs to the remote-in on 3 JL amps, and an LED lighting controller.
> 
> There's no turn-ON pop at all, but when I disconnect my 12v source I get a wicked turn-off pop. Is this happening because I've got it rigged without a head unit, or do others get a turn-off pop on the C-dsp?


Would some kind of diode help? I know your supposed to run a diode between 85 and 86 when using a relay with a HU


----------



## EmptyKim

No turn off pop for me. Although I am not using remote out. Only remote in. 

I have:
- 12+: From battery
- 12-: To chassis
- 12 remote in: From switched source (relay)
- 12 remote out: Not connected


----------



## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> Anybody getting massive turn-off pop? I'm still in the process of building my setup (so the head unit isn't installed) but I'm clearly doing something wrong here.
> 
> I have a 12v switch wire coming from a 12v source, that goes to the C-DSP and then I have the remote-out from the DSP to a 12V relay, which then runs to the remote-in on 3 JL amps, and an LED lighting controller.
> 
> There's no turn-ON pop at all, but when I disconnect my 12v source I get a wicked turn-off pop. Is this happening because I've got it rigged without a head unit, or do others get a turn-off pop on the C-dsp?


I was getting a massive turn off pop every time when I was running a pair of soundstream Picasso nano 450w mono amps for a pair of 8" front subs, but the pop disappeared when I switched to alpine & pioneer amps. The SS amps were nice but they certainly are cheap, but JL amps are not.

Have you tried running the remote out direct to the 3 amps and then to the relay so the relay is only switching the lighting setup? Can't really think of a good reason why it would help, but I'm sure the remote out on the minidsp could handle it. Maybe even try running the 12v wire into the DSP then to the relay with the DSP remote out only doing the amps? Maybe the DSP doesn't like switching relays...

Do you get pop if you take the minidsp out of the equation all together, like with a USB sound card hooked straight up to the amps?


----------



## LumbermanSVO

I had turn off pop at first, and it went away by itself.


----------



## Lanson

I'll try running it in parallel OR I suppose I can relay directly from the head unit (when the head unit is installed.)


----------



## Hanatsu

fourthmeal said:


> Anybody getting massive turn-off pop? I'm still in the process of building my setup (so the head unit isn't installed) but I'm clearly doing something wrong here.
> 
> I have a 12v switch wire coming from a 12v source, that goes to the C-DSP and then I have the remote-out from the DSP to a 12V relay, which then runs to the remote-in on 3 JL amps, and an LED lighting controller.
> 
> There's no turn-ON pop at all, but when I disconnect my 12v source I get a wicked turn-off pop. Is this happening because I've got it rigged without a head unit, or do others get a turn-off pop on the C-dsp?


I get a massive turn ON pop from left channel for some reason. I'll put a delay circuit between remote in/out on the relay to see if it fixes it.


----------



## Lanson

I suppose what I could do is just have the head unit (when installed) power up the relay for lighting, and the DSP and the amps all at the same time, and that should shut down the amps before the processor (which I think is the issue.)


----------



## Lanson

This might be handy for anybody in the future... the MiniDSP manual for this product doesn't mention it, but the PPI version does:

"REM OUT: A delayed version of the REM IN is available as a REM OUT signal to trigger some amplifiers or external piece of equipment after a 2 second delay. It provides 12V @ 10mA."

So, 10mA.

That's not a lot, so I think what I will do is have the head unit (which just got mounted finally, woo hoo!) wired up and installed this weekend, and I'll just use a relay at the head unit's output point straight to all the gear as one.

Oh also while searching through MiniDSP/DEQ.8 stuff, I learned there were versions of home 2x8 boards that had atrocious turn-off pop. Some solutions presented themselves (like a cap in-line) so I have some options.


----------



## EmptyKim

fourthmeal said:


> This might be handy for anybody in the future... the MiniDSP manual for this product doesn't mention it, but the PPI version does:
> 
> "REM OUT: A delayed version of the REM IN is available as a REM OUT signal to trigger some amplifiers or external piece of equipment after a 2 second delay. It provides 12V @ 10mA."
> 
> So, 10mA.
> *
> That's not a lot, so I think what I will do is have the head unit (which just got mounted finally, woo hoo!) wired up and installed this weekend, and I'll just use a relay at the head unit's output point straight to all the gear as one.
> *
> Oh also while searching through MiniDSP/DEQ.8 stuff, I learned there were versions of home 2x8 boards that had atrocious turn-off pop. Some solutions presented themselves (like a cap in-line) so I have some options.


Let us know if this fixes your issue. Hope it does.


----------



## Jscoyne2

EmptyKim said:


> Let us know if this fixes your issue. Hope it does.


30A Automotive Relay
(275-0226) Specifications Faxback Doc. # 38002

Contacts: .................................................... SPST / N.O.

Rating: .................................................... 30A at 12 VDC

Coil Rating: ..................................... 12 VDC,* 160 mA*, 66 Ohms

it takes .025ma to activate.


----------



## Jscoyne2

The inputs on the c-dsp for the low levels is 4vrms. if you have a headunit with more than that do you turn up the volume till you see the input meter on the software go in the red and thats the highest volume level you can use on your HU?


----------



## ninetysix

I would be surprised if the remote out on the cdsp was only 10mA. The minidc isolator for 2x4 kits can put out 100mA, tho other than examining the PCB or asking devteam, who knows what it actually is. What ever it is, it's enough to trigger several amps (I had 5 at one stage)

A 30A relay sounds awful big if you're concerned about overloading the HU or DSP remote output, perhaps it would be better to wire such a relay direct to your ignition 12V with an inline switch?


----------



## Lanson

I am still in the middle of my build but I was able to alleviate the turn-off pop by routing differently. The C-DSP no longer turns on / off the amps, and I moved the jumper back to the original position where the C-DSP does not send a turn-on signal. Instead, I ran the head unit's remote out to a relay (standard typical 12V car audio type I had on hand) and that has an output that splits to the C-DSP on one branch, and the other runs to the amp rack to power the lighting, and 3 amps. This so far has worked flawlessly.


----------



## Elgrosso

Quick questions guys, where do you adjust your input gain?
I have mine at -12db since the beginning.
Wanted to keep a lot of headroom for big boosts on output, also to get rid of an issue on the istreamer.
But finally I mostly cutted so I could put it back to maybe -3/-1db?
Don't really need it it's loud enough now.
But just not sure if it changes something on the resolution .

When I lower the volume on the phone (specific to istreamer) I can clearly hear the losses.
But with volume at 95% max on phone I don't think I lose anything with the cdsp input so low, it sounds like what I'm used to.

(Phone > digit to istreamer > analog to APL > digit to C-dsp)


----------



## Hanatsu

0dB on input on mine. Everything less is just attenuation of input signal.

In the digital domain you reduce bit depth to adjust volume. Since it operate in 24bit it doesn't matter really.


----------



## Elgrosso

Ok thx, since the dsp is fed digital by the APL I'm fine then.
But I'll put them back to 0.


----------



## ninetysix

Elgrosso said:


> ...(Phone > digit to istreamer > analog to APL > digit to C-dsp)


What's the APL?

Either way, if your istreamer is outputting analogue rca line level signal, why not just run that straight into the DSPs analogue input?


----------



## Lanson

Is anybody else's 6x8 staying on after you shut down your system? I have noticed that it is mildly warm pretty much all the time, even after the car has sat overnight powered down.

I wonder if I got a jumper out of place.


----------



## Elgrosso

ninetysix said:


> What's the APL?
> 
> Either way, if your istreamer is outputting analogue rca line level signal, why not just run that straight into the DSPs analogue input?


It's this guy: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...l1-advanced-dsp-eq-phase-correction-unit.html
I plan to remove the istreamer soon to simplify the setup.


----------



## EmptyKim

fourthmeal said:


> Is anybody else's 6x8 staying on after you shut down your system? I have noticed that it is mildly warm pretty much all the time, even after the car has sat overnight powered down.
> 
> I wonder if I got a jumper out of place.


Mine is cold to the touch after sitting overnight


----------



## Elgrosso

fourthmeal said:


> Is anybody else's 6x8 staying on after you shut down your system? I have noticed that it is mildly warm pretty much all the time, even after the car has sat overnight powered down.
> 
> I wonder if I got a jumper out of place.


I checked it the few first days with the new amps, working or not, never noticed higher than external (or trunk) temperature.


----------



## Lanson

It isn't that the warm is bothering because it is warm, but that it is warm when the car's system is off and has been overnight.

Means the darn thing isn't switching off when the head unit commands it.


----------



## ninetysix

Elgrosso said:


> It's this guy: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...l1-advanced-dsp-eq-phase-correction-unit.html
> I plan to remove the istreamer soon to simplify the setup.


What are you actually using the APL for? How will you connect your phone without the istreamer?


----------



## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> It isn't that the warm is bothering because it is warm, but that it is warm when the car's system is off and has been overnight.
> 
> Means the darn thing isn't switching off when the head unit commands it.


I've never noticed mine getting warm, but I'd suggest measuring the volts on all the terminals on the unit with the car off. Also check current draw on the 12V in to the dsp then maybe lodge a ticket with minidsp with that into.


----------



## Elgrosso

ninetysix said:


> What are you actually using the APL for? How will you connect your phone without the istreamer?


It's kind of an auto eq based on fir, really nice device, sort of ms8 under steroid. 

Since I can now go full digital I want to try.
There are few solutions ready to test:
- nuforce icon ido, to send coaxial, just waiting for a 6.5v regulator (does not work with only 5v/usb). Will have to check if it charges the phone.
- airport express is already in the trunk, send optical to the apl, it works but for now I don't really need it. i'll test only later once the system is tuned, to see if it's ok for real life use (wifi connection delay, drop out etc).
I had a rainbow dsp for few weeks and it worked fine through airplay, wanna see if it's the same.
- waiting for a peachtree x1 to send coax directly from the phone, without added power source
- could also try the hdmi thing if needed, or few others


----------



## LumbermanSVO

Elgrosso said:


> It's kind of an auto eq based on fir, really nice device, sort of ms8 under steroid.
> 
> Since I can now go full digital I want to try.
> There are few solutions ready to test:
> - nuforce icon ido, to send coaxial, just waiting for a 6.5v regulator (does not work with only 5v/usb). Will have to check if it charges the phone.
> - airport express is already in the trunk, send optical to the apl, it works but for now I don't really need it. i'll test only later once the system is tuned, to see if it's ok for real life use (wifi connection delay, drop out etc).
> I had a rainbow dsp for few weeks and it worked fine through airplay, wanna see if it's the same.
> - waiting for a peachtree x1 to send coax directly from the phone, without added power source
> - could also try the hdmi thing if needed, or few others


Mine APL-1(arrives tomorrow) will get signal from a Lightning to HDMI adaptor and HDMI audio extractor with digital out. From the APL-1 it'll go digital to my PPI DEQ.8, the predecessor to the 6x8.


----------



## lucas569

you guys buy the UMIK-1 as well?


----------



## Jscoyne2

lucas569 said:


> you guys buy the UMIK-1 as well?


I did

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

Yes. 10 chars


----------



## EmptyKim

lucas569 said:


> you guys buy the UMIK-1 as well?


Yes.


----------



## wooblexXx

Hi everyone 
I'm french so sorry for the way i'm writing i'll do my best. 

In france the minidsp cdsp is not so popular against helix dsp pro, rf 360.3 etc so i'd like to ask you guys some questions about the cdsp. 
I'd like to run a full active 3w system + subwoofer in a sq installation. 

1) For those who bought the cdsp on the minidsp webshop,(from hong kong) did you have to pay some custom charges?? I don't want to have to pay more than buying it in france...

2) i've read all the thread here but i wanna know, did the ppi deq.8 software work with the c-dsp?? Because i believe it is a lot more interesting! 

3) what's actually the real voltage on the rca outputs? I can read 2v on the datasheet but it's maybe more now... 

4) which dsp in the same price range and capabilities would you recomme d? Or the c-dsp is the best for the money? 

Thanks for your answers


----------



## ninetysix

wooblexXx said:


> Hi everyone
> I'm french so sorry for the way i'm writing i'll do my best.
> 
> In france the minidsp cdsp is not so popular against helix dsp pro, rf 360.3 etc so i'd like to ask you guys some questions about the cdsp.
> I'd like to run a full active 3w system + subwoofer in a sq installation.
> 
> 1) For those who bought the cdsp on the minidsp webshop,(from hong kong) did you have to pay some custom charges?? I don't want to have to pay more than buying it in france...
> 
> 2) i've read all the thread here but i wanna know, did the ppi deq.8 software work with the c-dsp?? Because i believe it is a lot more interesting!
> 
> 3) what's actually the real voltage on the rca outputs? I can read 2v on the datasheet but it's maybe more now...
> 
> 4) which dsp in the same price range and capabilities would you recomme d? Or the c-dsp is the best for the money?
> 
> Thanks for your answers


1 will vary from country to country. Ever had to pay tax on something you've bought from Hong Kong that's around the US$275 mark? Can you even buy a minidsp locally in France?

2 many have reported using the PPI software to get 31 band eq. But you can take my parametric from my cold dead hands.

3 better question is what is the real usable voltage of most car audio hardware that lists 4, 6 or 8v outputs? Either way, minidsp 2v is plenty.

4 it is very good value for a very good product.


----------



## wooblexXx

Thank you for your reply. 

Don't understand about the software. You made your own soft?? I think i'll try different soft. 31eq band can be very useful...

I can buy it in france, but it's 10% more expensive... That's not a huge difference. 
I'll ask the french c-dsp owner i know in france just to know more about it. 

For hu voltage i will drive this dsp from a eclipse 8445 with 8v rca outputs, i'm just wondering, if the voltage is upper than 2v maybe it can create distorsion or something else...?


----------



## t3sn4f2

wooblexXx said:


> Thank you for your reply.
> 
> Don't understand about the software. You made your own soft?? I think i'll try different soft. 31eq band can be very useful...
> 
> I can buy it in france, but it's 10% more expensive... That's not a huge difference.
> I'll ask the french c-dsp owner i know in france just to know more about it.
> 
> *For hu voltage i will drive this dsp from a eclipse 8445 with 8v rca outputs, i'm just wondering, if the voltage is upper than 2v maybe it can create distorsion or something else...*?


Only if you set the head unit master volume past the setting where it is outputting 2 volts. The difference in dB between 2 and 8 volts is 12dB. Typical master volume range is 70dB. So you'll still have 58dB of range to comfortably find a master volume setting you like. 

You can use the extra 12dB of gain for recording that are lower in level than the norm. Or for ones that are VERY dynamic. Like classical, where you only have a few loud peaks sometimes and the rest is lower in level. 

The input will clip if you use that extra gain for that type of music, but it will more than likely not be audible since those clipped peak come and go so fast your ears won't pick up that distortion.


----------



## ninetysix

wooblexXx said:


> Thank you for your reply.
> 
> Don't understand about the software. You made your own soft?? I think i'll try different soft. 31eq band can be very useful...
> 
> I can buy it in france, but it's 10% more expensive... That's not a huge difference.
> I'll ask the french c-dsp owner i know in france just to know more about it.
> 
> For hu voltage i will drive this dsp from a eclipse 8445 with 8v rca outputs, i'm just wondering, if the voltage is upper than 2v maybe it can create distorsion or something else...?


I've only ever used the c-dsp software by minidsp. But others have said the software for the similar PPI dsp works and the only real difference is 31 band eq, I think. 

As for the volts, remember only the outputs are rated to 2V, the inputs are rated to 4V. Try playing a 0dB test tone thru it from a CD or usb stick and watch the input meters to see what volume setting gets the meter up to 0dB then back it off a click.

It would be useful to have that extra headroom as stated above, I've got some chesky albums on flac and they are about 8dB quieter than anything else I have. I really should try normalising them,


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> I've only ever used the c-dsp software by minidsp. But others have said the software for the similar PPI dsp works and the only real difference is 31 band eq, I think.
> 
> As for the volts, remember only the outputs are rated to 2V, the inputs are rated to 4V. Try playing a 0dB test tone thru it from a CD or usb stick and watch the input meters to see what volume setting gets the meter up to 0dB then back it off a click.
> 
> It would be useful to have that extra headroom as stated above, I've got some chesky albums on flac and they are about 8dB quieter than anything else I have. I really should try normalising them,


Should that test tone be freq specific per drive 50hz for bass. 1000 for midrange, ect

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## Lanson

lucas569 said:


> you guys buy the UMIK-1 as well?


Yes, great mic when you factor the calibrated file for that exact serial number.

Don't forget to DL your mic's cal file from Minidsp's website.

Oh and btw, fixed the "always warm" issue. It was a jumper in the unit. That jumper needs to be switched to enable "remote in", else it just auto turns on when you apply constant 12V. Went in, swapped the jumper, and then tested overnight. All good.


----------



## wooblexXx

Does someone use ppi software everyday? 
The only difference is the 31 band eq? 

I think i'll buy the mic too of course and so have to work for a long time in REW!! I watched the tutorial you linked a few pages before thanks.


----------



## Jscoyne2

When matrixing for your sub channel. How do you make a mono signal for the sub? Do you send both L and R signal combined to both the left and the right. As in. Left get l plus r and right gets l plus r?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> When matrixing for your sub channel. How do you make a mono signal for the sub? Do you send both L and R signal combined to both the left and the right. As in. Left get l plus r and right gets l plus r?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


I use two outputs for my sub, one left signal one right and run the pair into the mono amp where it is down mixed. I had a spare channel as I only have 7 speakers. I find I need less gain on the sub amp this way, and have much more headroom in the outputs. Mixing two channels to one output = +3dB, I think.

When I'm measuring all drivers on the left side, I mute the right midbass, midrange, tweeter and the "right sub" for my overall measurement for the final house curve that I apply to my input eq.


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Should that test tone be freq specific per drive 50hz for bass. 1000 for midrange, ect
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Yeah, or you could use a slow sweep or maybe pink noise. But for this part you're really just level matching the input before the individual driver outputs


----------



## Elgrosso

wooblexXx said:


> Hi everyone
> I'm french so sorry for the way i'm writing i'll do my best.
> 
> In france the minidsp cdsp is not so popular against helix dsp pro, rf 360.3 etc so i'd like to ask you guys some questions about the cdsp.
> I'd like to run a full active 3w system + subwoofer in a sq installation.
> 
> 1) For those who bought the cdsp on the minidsp webshop,(from hong kong) did you have to pay some custom charges?? I don't want to have to pay more than buying it in france...
> 
> 2) i've read all the thread here but i wanna know, did the ppi deq.8 software work with the c-dsp?? Because i believe it is a lot more interesting!
> 
> 3) what's actually the real voltage on the rca outputs? I can read 2v on the datasheet but it's maybe more now...
> 
> 4) which dsp in the same price range and capabilities would you recomme d? Or the c-dsp is the best for the money?
> 
> Thanks for your answers


Hey another frenchy here, welcome!


----------



## Jscoyne2

Safe to pull power/ ground from my sub amp for the c-dsp? Easier to wire/ neater. Or is there risk of noise that way? Should I just run it from my dist block?

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Safe to pull power/ ground from my sub amp for the c-dsp? Easier to wire/ neater. Or is there risk of noise that way? Should I just run it from my dist block?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


There won't be any danger of damaging anything, worst case you might get a ground loop causing a hum. But most likely it will work fine, suck it and see


----------



## tRidiot

Ordered one... should be here tomorrow.


----------



## Jscoyne2

The power/ground/remote terminal is one finicky lil *****. Jesus. 

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


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## TwistdInfinity

Really? I didn't have a problem. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Jscoyne2

TwistdInfinity said:


> Really? I didn't have a problem.
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


It just doesnt have any real bite to it. I could pull a wire out really easily. And I dont like having the power/ground RIGHT next to eachother. One itty bitty stray strand and the whole thing goes bust.


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## ninetysix

Me neither. You have to use the right size terminal driver though, and don't do it up too tight. It helps to squeeze the sides of the plug to stop them deforming, same with Phoenix terminals


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> It just doesnt have any real bite to it. I could pull a wire out really easily. And I dont like having the power/ground RIGHT next to eachother. One itty bitty stray strand and the whole thing goes bust.


Definitely pull the fuse for the dsp while you terminate that, and don't strip back too much insulation. You don't wanna be able to see any copper once it's in. If it's a finely stranded wire you could twist it before inserting, helps to reduce the likelihood of any stray stands but you'll have to lay & tie the cable so it can't untwist. Won't hurt to check it's still tight in a few days/weeks time. Untwisted is better though, and if you wanna be really safe use crimp on boot lace ferrules. With the right size driver mine are easily tight enough to not pull out


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## TwistdInfinity

I put an inline fuse on my power wire. What thickness wire did you use? 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> Definitely pull the fuse for the dsp while you terminate that, and don't strip back too much insulation. You don't wanna be able to see any copper once it's in. If it's a finely stranded wire you could twist it before inserting, helps to reduce the likelihood of any stray stands but you'll have to lay & tie the cable so it can't untwist. Won't hurt to check it's still tight in a few days/weeks time. Untwisted is better though, and if you wanna be really safe use crimp on boot lace ferrules. With the right size driver mine are easily tight enough to not pull out


Should I have the dsp fused? I just have it wired directly to sub amp.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> There won't be any danger of damaging anything, worst case you might get a ground loop causing a hum. But most likely it will work fine, suck it and see


Oh hmm I wonder if this is the cause of my alt whine 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

TwistdInfinity said:


> Oh hmm I wonder if this is the cause of my alt whine
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


I pulled directly from sub amp. No issues.


Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Jscoyne2 said:


> I pulled directly from sub amp. No issues.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Damn, I hate trying to track down alt whine. Specially cause some days it's not there... 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

TwistdInfinity said:


> Oh hmm I wonder if this is the cause of my alt whine
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


How To - Car Stereo - In Pursuit of a Noise-Free System: The Ten Commandments of Noise Prevention


Alternator Whine

To me, alternator whine is the most annoying form of noise. For those of you who are lucky enough never to have been exposed to alternator whine, it sounds like a miniature siren that rises in pitch with the speed of the engine. Alternator whine is almost always caused by a ground loop. The following steps will aid you in locating and correcting a ground loop problem.

Verify that all levels are set properly. (Click here for related article.)
With the system turned off, unplug the RCA inputs to the amplifier.
Start the vehicle and turn the system on. If the noise is gone go to step 8. If the noise is still present, it is coming from the amp or the speaker wiring. Continue.
Turn the system off and disconnect the speaker harness.
Start the engine and verify that no noise is present. In a few rare instances, I have actually heard speakers reproduce noise without being connected to an amplifier. This noise was being induced by power cables that were very close to the speaker wire. If you do have this type of noise, reroute the appropriate speaker lead and go to step 3.
With the speaker harness still disconnected, check to make sure there are no shorts between the speaker leads and the chassis of the vehicle. A shorted negative speaker lead will create a ground loop by establishing a second audio ground reference point. If you do have a short, trace the wire out and repair it then go to step 3.
With the RCA inputs and speaker harness still disconnected from the amplifier, use your VOM to measure from the shield of the RCA jacks on the amp to the chassis of the vehicle. This reading should not be a direct short (100 ohms or more is acceptable.) If this reading does indicate a direct short, you might have a defective amp and should contact the manufacturer for verification.(Note that there are a few "inexpensive" amps or boosters on the market that have their audio ground and electrical ground commoned internally. For units of this type, the information in this article will be of very little value.)
If youve made it here, you know that the amplifier and speaker wiring are okay.
Connect the accessories in front of the amp (crossovers, equalizers, etc.) one at a time and check for alternator whine. When each device is tested, there should be nothing plugged into the input of that device. In this way, we will work toward the source unit piece by piece. Be sure to turn the system power off before connecting or disconnecting any cables or accessories.
Repeat step 9 until all accessories have been tested.
If a particular accessory is causing noise, try disconnecting its power ground wire. Go to step 9.
Now its time to connect the source unit. Do that now and test for noise.
If noise is present, try unplugging the antenna. If the noise goes away, you will need to use an antenna isolator. This little gismo opens the shield wire of the coax to eliminate the ground loop caused by the ground at the antenna.
If you still have noise, try connecting the source units ground wire in another location, preferably as close to the source unit as possible.
Does the noise vary in amplitude when you adjust the volume control? If it does, the problem is probably power line related and not a ground loop. If this is the case, run the source units B+ (yellow) wire directly to the positive terminal of the battery. If this doesnt do the trick, you will probably have to use a power line filter on the source units B+ (Yel) and Ignition (Red) wires.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Jscoyne2 said:


> Should I have the dsp fused? I just have it wired directly to sub amp.


I wasn't sure if the dsp had its own internal fuse or not so I fused my wire which is rated for 7.5 amps with a 5 amp inline fuse 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

TwistdInfinity said:


> I wasn't sure if the dsp had its own internal fuse or not so I fused my wire which is rated for 7.5 amps with a 5 amp inline fuse
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Hm. Not a bad idea. Might have to make a run to radio shack tomorrow


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Should I have the dsp fused? I just have it wired directly to sub amp.


Dude! Give yourself a clip over the ear  that is not safe. What size fuse is on the cable to your sub amp, 60-150A? Unless you use the same size power cable for your sub as you did for the dsp (impossible even with a boot lace ferrule to reduce the size) then if you get a short the much smaller cable to the dsp will burn without popping the fuse, and easily starting a fire.

Any time you break gauge you need a fuse.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Jscoyne2 said:


> How To - Car Stereo - In Pursuit of a Noise-Free System: The Ten Commandments of Noise Prevention
> 
> 
> Alternator Whine
> 
> To me, alternator whine is the most annoying form of noise. For those of you who are lucky enough never to have been exposed to alternator whine, it sounds like a miniature siren that rises in pitch with the speed of the engine. Alternator whine is almost always caused by a ground loop. The following steps will aid you in locating and correcting a ground loop problem.
> 
> Verify that all levels are set properly. (Click here for related article.)
> With the system turned off, unplug the RCA inputs to the amplifier.
> Start the vehicle and turn the system on. If the noise is gone go to step 8. If the noise is still present, it is coming from the amp or the speaker wiring. Continue.
> Turn the system off and disconnect the speaker harness.
> Start the engine and verify that no noise is present. In a few rare instances, I have actually heard speakers reproduce noise without being connected to an amplifier. This noise was being induced by power cables that were very close to the speaker wire. If you do have this type of noise, reroute the appropriate speaker lead and go to step 3.
> With the speaker harness still disconnected, check to make sure there are no shorts between the speaker leads and the chassis of the vehicle. A shorted negative speaker lead will create a ground loop by establishing a second audio ground reference point. If you do have a short, trace the wire out and repair it then go to step 3.
> With the RCA inputs and speaker harness still disconnected from the amplifier, use your VOM to measure from the shield of the RCA jacks on the amp to the chassis of the vehicle. This reading should not be a direct short (100 ohms or more is acceptable.) If this reading does indicate a direct short, you might have a defective amp and should contact the manufacturer for verification.(Note that there are a few "inexpensive" amps or boosters on the market that have their audio ground and electrical ground commoned internally. For units of this type, the information in this article will be of very little value.)
> If youve made it here, you know that the amplifier and speaker wiring are okay.
> Connect the accessories in front of the amp (crossovers, equalizers, etc.) one at a time and check for alternator whine. When each device is tested, there should be nothing plugged into the input of that device. In this way, we will work toward the source unit piece by piece. Be sure to turn the system power off before connecting or disconnecting any cables or accessories.
> Repeat step 9 until all accessories have been tested.
> If a particular accessory is causing noise, try disconnecting its power ground wire. Go to step 9.
> Now its time to connect the source unit. Do that now and test for noise.
> If noise is present, try unplugging the antenna. If the noise goes away, you will need to use an antenna isolator. This little gismo opens the shield wire of the coax to eliminate the ground loop caused by the ground at the antenna.
> If you still have noise, try connecting the source units ground wire in another location, preferably as close to the source unit as possible.
> Does the noise vary in amplitude when you adjust the volume control? If it does, the problem is probably power line related and not a ground loop. If this is the case, run the source units B+ (yellow) wire directly to the positive terminal of the battery. If this doesnt do the trick, you will probably have to use a power line filter on the source units B+ (Yel) and Ignition (Red) wires.


Haha cheers! Will likely take me a day to track it down 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> I put an inline fuse on my power wire. What thickness wire did you use?
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


I used 0.75mm² wire like this that often ends up in the bin at work. Tapped off an amp with an inline fuse holder with the supply side cut as short as possible so the fuse holder is sticking out of the amp terminal and there is effectively no accessible unfused wire that could allow a dangerous fault current to burn it.

That's in my car, in the Mrs legacy I got lazy and tapped into the permanent 12v supply to the head unit (the dsp is tucked in behind the hu) and the same ground too. Perhaps not ideal, but safe because the head unit supply is already fused, and no noise issues to speak of.


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> I wasn't sure if the dsp had its own internal fuse or not so I fused my wire which is rated for 7.5 amps with a 5 amp inline fuse
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Even if it does have an internal fuse, that does nothing to protect the cable from burning if it's shorted before the dsp.


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> Oh hmm I wonder if this is the cause of my alt whine
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Do you get whine only when using your head unit as a source? What about when using spdif from your phone/tab? Did you go headless in the end?


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> Do you get whine only when using your head unit as a source? What about when using spdif from your phone/tab? Did you go headless in the end?


It's there with no source attached, with aux into dsp as source or with spdif from MiniStreamer into dsp as source.

At least that narrows it down to either the dsp or the interconnects between it and the amps, or a ground loop with the amps 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> It's there with no source attached, with aux into dsp as source or with spdif from MiniStreamer into dsp as source.
> 
> At least that narrows it down to either the dsp or the interconnects between it and the amps, or a ground loop with the amps
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


Never had any noise issues before you installed the minidsp?

Where is it located? Where did you tap in for power? Where are your amps, and where are they grounded? As I said mine is crammed in behind the head unit and tapped into the head unit power & ground, my amps are under the seats and grounded with a lug under the seat bolts on both sides.


----------



## t0n33

ninetysix said:


> Dude! Give yourself a clip over the ear  that is not safe. What size fuse is on the cable to your sub amp, 60-150A? Unless you use the same size power cable for your sub as you did for the dsp (impossible even with a boot lace ferrule to reduce the size) then if you get a short the much smaller cable to the dsp will burn without popping the fuse, and easily starting a fire.
> 
> Any time you break gauge you need a fuse.


Good tip, that makes sense. Thanks! I need to install the inline fuse holder I bought for between the amp and c-dsp.


----------



## Jscoyne2

Unfortunately I do seem to have a fair bit of hiss from my tweeters now. Concequences of that noise floor I guess :/

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Unfortunately I do seem to have a fair bit of hiss from my tweeters now. Concequences of that noise floor I guess :/
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


As in you needed to crank the amp gains to get the desired output level?


----------



## Jscoyne2

ninetysix said:


> As in you needed to crank the amp gains to get the desired output level?


Yea

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## ninetysix

Jscoyne2 said:


> Yea
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


Running active right? What does your tweeter output meter indicate when either listening to loud music or playing a -3dB 5-20kHz sweep with the volume cranked? Might need earplugs


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Oh yeah I forgot to mention. With the newer firmware loaded I went through with the oscilloscope and tested the outputs of the dsp. 

I can confirm that as soon as the output channel meters go above 0dB it's clipping the signal. 

I suggest that you disconnect your rca's from your amps, then find some 0dB test tones at a frequency within each of your output channels that's not attenuated and crank your volume to max and check to make sure the output isn't going above 0dB. If it is, there's a possibility you're sending a clipped signal to your amps when you crank it right up

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

Im having nothing but issues using this. Not because of the Dsp itself but just i cant get the car to sound right. This is beyond frusterating


----------



## wooblexXx

Jscoyne2 said:


> Im having nothing but issues using this. Not because of the Dsp itself but just i cant get the car to sound right. This is beyond frusterating


What's your method for audio settings?? 
All with mic and rew? 
I hope you understand me guys ^^


----------



## wooblexXx

Hi everyone 

Can you tell me the dimensions of the cdsp remote please? And what is the color of the led preset selection on the remote? 

I have to know this for thinkig a nice integration 


Thanks

Some pics when everything will be done


----------



## ninetysix

Search this thread it has been covered in great detail. LEDs are blue

Cheers


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Haha yeah I'm pretty sure I asked about the dimensions at one point too. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## TwistdInfinity

ninetysix said:


> 41mm W x 88.5mm L x 37mm D


 the tapatalk search function actually works now! 

And LED's are easy to change if you have a soldering iron 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## TwistdInfinity

wooblexXx said:


> What's your method for audio settings??
> All with mic and rew?
> I hope you understand me guys ^^


Hi mate, probably best to cover this in a different thread. Check out hanatsu's guide for measuring a system

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Jscoyne2

wooblexXx said:


> Hi everyone
> 
> Can you tell me the dimensions of the cdsp remote please? And what is the color of the led preset selection on the remote?
> 
> I have to know this for thinkig a nice integration
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Some pics when everything will be done


Cuz searching sucks :3

















Its 1in x3.5x1.5


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I took my remote apart at one point also. I'm looking to make a common face plate with my sub amp remote level controller. Going to model something and get it 3D printed. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Big T

Didn't a couple people get the DEQ-8 software to work on the 6X8?


----------



## Jscoyne2

Yea but parametric is better

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk


----------



## Big T

Yea and it has that on the inputs. I have a buddy trying to get it to. But the DEQ software doesn't finish connecting but the Mini does. Any ideas?


----------



## ninetysix

Maybe minidsp quietly disabled any cross compatibility with the 1.1 update. Maybe you could downgrade to 1.0 (the firmware in the DSP, not the windows software) if it lets you


----------



## Big T

He has 1.0 now. Oh well


----------



## wooblexXx

Thank you everyone!!


----------



## Elgrosso

Rhaaaa impossible to sync!
Someone had this issue?

I received a 2x4 and I played with both for few days, was ok.
Then today I tried a usb hub, to have only one cable for everything (6x8/2x4/apl).
Worked fine for few hours, I know I couldn't sync both in the same time so I didn't even try.
But at one moment the cdsp just refused to sync again, the 2x4 still syncs.
Cdsp unit seems freezed, impossible to play anything, remote stuck on preset 3.
Tried hard/soft reset, other power, fuse, other cables, other laptop, uninstall/reinstall plugin.
Nothing worked.

I've sent them a request, but if anyone knows?


----------



## Jscoyne2

Elgrosso said:


> Rhaaaa impossible to sync!
> Someone had this issue?
> 
> I received a 2x4 and I played with both for few days, was ok.
> Then today I tried a usb hub, to have only one cable for everything (6x8/2x4/apl).
> Worked fine for few hours, I know I couldn't sync both in the same time so I didn't even try.
> But at one moment the cdsp just refused to sync again, the 2x4 still syncs.
> Cdsp unit seems freezed, impossible to play anything, remote stuck on preset 3.
> Tried hard/soft reset, other power, fuse, other cables, other laptop, uninstall/reinstall plugin.
> Nothing worked.
> 
> I've sent them a request, but if anyone knows?


Idk if itll be any help but check the minidsp forumd


----------



## ninetysix

Elgrosso said:


> Rhaaaa impossible to sync!
> Someone had this issue?
> 
> I received a 2x4 and I played with both for few days, was ok.
> Then today I tried a usb hub, to have only one cable for everything (6x8/2x4/apl).
> Worked fine for few hours, I know I couldn't sync both in the same time so I didn't even try.
> But at one moment the cdsp just refused to sync again, the 2x4 still syncs.
> Cdsp unit seems freezed, impossible to play anything, remote stuck on preset 3.
> Tried hard/soft reset, other power, fuse, other cables, other laptop, uninstall/reinstall plugin.
> Nothing worked.
> 
> I've sent them a request, but if anyone knows?


Any chance there's some crud in the USB socket of the 6x8?

By soft reset do you mean reloading the firmware with a micro SD card? If you currently have version 1.1, maybe try downgrade to 1.0 then upgrade back to 1.1

Does the dsp show up in device manager when connected to a PC?


----------



## Elgrosso

Jscoyne2 said:


> Idk if itll be any help but check the minidsp forumd


Checked, there's a bunch of threads like that but about older units.




ninetysix said:


> Any chance there's some crud in the USB socket of the 6x8?
> 
> By soft reset do you mean reloading the firmware with a micro SD card? If you currently have version 1.1, maybe try downgrade to 1.0 then upgrade back to 1.1
> 
> Does the dsp show up in device manager when connected to a PC?


Crud? Good idea I'll check

Soft reset through the plugin, to factory default.
Hard with the button on the unit.
I don't have anything like the device manager on mac, but I'll check on // desktop if it comes up.
And yeah I could try the downgrade/upgrade! Let's find an sd card...
Thx!


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Yeah my first thought is to try the SD card upgrade 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## Elgrosso

Do you guys have the old v1? 
I tried with 1.02, nothing changed.
Ports are cleaned.
Does not appear on "device manager" on a surface tablet (win8 I think?)


----------



## Elgrosso

Fixed!
*The minidsp guys are awesome!
*They responded in an hour with a special firmware to unlock the boot.

Good to know, I quote:
"_Please note that only one device can be connected PC at the same time when you are using the software, that is, when using minidsp 2×4 plugin, only connect minidsp 2×4 hardware to PC using USB, don’t connect CDSP hardware to the PC, otherwise the mindsp 2×4 will also load the data to CDSP which messed up the DSP bootup process and caused it being not recognized by the PC. The same principle also applies to CDSP plugin._"


----------



## Lanson

They are awesome as long as you are mindful of the time zone difference involved. I stayed up late one night and got all my answers in rapid-fire to solve my issues (firmware upgrade killed output, and I had that issue with the jumpers and the unit staying live all the time...both fixed.)


----------



## MicroD

I have had my C-DSP installed for around a month or two now, and it has been working great. Until the last Tuesday. I drove to the store, everything working fine, but when I left the store, the C-DSP appeared to be dead. It is wired to a fused (1A) constant power, ground to chassis, 12v remote turn on (in), remote out to amps as well. I checked and everything has the correct power still and no fuses are blown, but I can't get the C-DSP to do anything. I can't connect to it via usb with my laptop either. 

I have tried contacting miniDSP on their website support, and it has been a week without hearing from them at all. I've also posted to their forum without hearing anything.

Anyone have any advice or things to try? The reset button on the back doesn't do anything either.


----------



## bnae38

You can open it and see if the coil shorted to the ground via under it?


----------



## bnae38

Bought this one knowing it was bad, unfortunately it would still not boot after repairing it.. I sent it in to Mini.


----------



## ninetysix

MicroD said:


> I have had my C-DSP installed for around a month or two now, and it has been working great. Until the last Tuesday. I drove to the store, everything working fine, but when I left the store, the C-DSP appeared to be dead. It is wired to a fused (1A) constant power, ground to chassis, 12v remote turn on (in), remote out to amps as well. I checked and everything has the correct power still and no fuses are blown, but I can't get the C-DSP to do anything. I can't connect to it via usb with my laptop either.
> 
> I have tried contacting miniDSP on their website support, and it has been a week without hearing from them at all. I've also posted to their forum without hearing anything.
> 
> Anyone have any advice or things to try? The reset button on the back doesn't do anything either.


You lodged a ticket right? If so I'd do it again, they have always been quite prompt for me


----------



## MicroD

Yeah, I have a support case ID #. Hopefully they will respond soon. I will try submitting another ticket I guess. I will open it up later to take a look inside.


----------



## MicroD

bnae38 said:


> You can open it and see if the coil shorted to the ground via under it?


This is the problem exactly I believe! I did not remove the coil, but when testing for continuity on the bottom of the board between the contact the coil is connected to and the other contact that it is not supposed to be connected to I get a short. The bottom of the board has a strange residue on it that is patterned like the circuitry. I suppose a short between ground and 12V+ would create some issues.

Customer support replied to me finally and asked if the board had any power at all or if the LED was turning on. Hopefully they will replace the unit for me under warranty. Seems an obvious design flaw. 

Thanks for the help!


----------



## t0n33

MicroD said:


> This is the problem exactly I believe! I did not remove the coil, but when testing for continuity on the bottom of the board between the contact the coil is connected to and the other contact that it is not supposed to be connected to I get a short. The bottom of the board has a strange residue on it that is patterned like the circuitry. I suppose a short between ground and 12V+ would create some issues.
> 
> Customer support replied to me finally and asked if the board had any power at all or if the LED was turning on. Hopefully they will replace the unit for me under warranty. Seems an obvious design flaw.
> 
> Thanks for the help!


Very interesting. Thanks for sharing! I wonder if that could use some proactive action on other working boards. Maybe slide in some electrical tape or hot glue through the hole. No doubt there must be some movement on that coil when the subs get to shaking some air!

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## bnae38

I used kapton tape, yup .

I let the company know awhile back before sending it in, hopefully they take corrective action.


----------



## Lanson

Are the PPI and Soundstream variants known to have the same failure mode?


----------



## PUREAUDIO

Very good info in this thread.


----------



## bnae38

edit: nm.. lol


----------



## t0n33

bnae38 said:


> I used kapton tape, yup .
> 
> I let the company know awhile back before sending it in, hopefully they take corrective action.


Cool!

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## geshat00

I don't think so...

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Tapatalk


----------



## MicroD

bnae38 said:


> Should add, there is a thick gap pad holding the coil down from the top cover. So it is pressed against the board.


Mine does not have any pad on top of the coil, but it does have a rubber pad on top of the heat sink nearby. I'll definitely be using some kapton tape and sliding in between the board and this coil when they hopefully replace my unit. All they would have to do is mount the coil slightly higher off the board when soldering it in place. 

I believe they are somewhat aware of the problem because one side of the coil had some white silicone rubber near the bottom, but the failure happened on the other side of the coil. 


Here are a couple pictures of the other side of the board. The white residue seems to be patterned like one of the layers of the pcb, probably where the 12V+ runs. This leads me to believe that the short created by the coil grounding out has ruined the entire board.

This is the bottom of the board in the area where the coil is. Probing the area with the red line gives a direct short.


----------



## Majik

I'm currently running a CD7200mkii with 8v preouts. Would the 2v outputs from this Mini DSP 6x8 degrade my signal strength or quality and cause more noise floor/hissing than what I'm used to...since I would need to turn my gains up more? Is the added processing power worth the trade-off? I'm one of those that actually prefers the added ambiance of rear fill, and that is my only reason for entertaining the idea of adding a Mini DSP. Right now I'm running a 3-way active (2-way + sub) from the CD7200 with no way to add rear fill without screwing up T/A.


----------



## bnae38

MicroD said:


> Mine does not have any pad on top of the coil, but it does have a rubber pad on top of the heat sink nearby.



You are correct, I assumed it was on the coil. Derp.. I'll edit that entry.


----------



## bnae38

Sorry about the gap pad thing. Lol, I never looked to see where it lined up, I had better things to do. Assumed it was on the coil. Duh.

Mine had a ground network burnt open. See where it says r187 on the 2nd pic from earlier? It is bubbled up and opened at some point in that 1.5". The frickin' weird part, is that the ground network is burnt open from the shorting point to the rest of the ground network on the pcb. I would of expected it to blow open from the shorting point to the ground terminal.  Also odd is that D1 (I assume backwards power protection) was not torched...

I could only assume the chassis provided a more solid ground than the ground terminal did when the first user hooked it up. Beyond that, I was baffled.

All supplies checked out. There is a p-fet making 1.8v for the audio dsp too. Oscillators fine etc. But the main micro-controller was not firing up, it's reset to the audio dsp was low. I2C was not toggling. I tried updating firmware and the recovery firmware with no success. So I sent it in....

Below is where i jumpered the blown open ground network:












Edit: the white stuff is likely just flux residue.. Wouldn't worry about that.

Pull the coil up and see if you can get the short to go away. From there, you can check if anything burnt open. 



MicroD said:


> Mine does not have any pad on top of the coil, but it does have a rubber pad on top of the heat sink nearby. I'll definitely be using some kapton tape and sliding in between the board and this coil when they hopefully replace my unit. All they would have to do is mount the coil slightly higher off the board when soldering it in place.
> 
> I believe they are somewhat aware of the problem because one side of the coil had some white silicone rubber near the bottom, but the failure happened on the other side of the coil.
> 
> 
> Here are a couple pictures of the other side of the board. The white residue seems to be patterned like one of the layers of the pcb, probably where the 12V+ runs. This leads me to believe that the short created by the coil grounding out has ruined the entire board.
> 
> This is the bottom of the board in the area where the coil is. Probing the area with the red line gives a direct short.


----------



## ninetysix

Majik said:


> I'm currently running a CD7200mkii with 8v preouts. Would the 2v outputs from this Mini DSP 6x8 degrade my signal strength or quality and cause more noise floor/hissing than what I'm used to...since I would need to turn my gains up more? Is the added processing power worth the trade-off? I'm one of those that actually prefers the added ambiance of rear fill, and that is my only reason for entertaining the idea of adding a Mini DSP. Right now I'm running a 3-way active (2-way + sub) from the CD7200 with no way to add rear fill without screwing up T/A.


This has been covered a few times in this thread, but in short there is nothing wrong with the output voltage of the 6x8. If I set my gains with a DMM playing a 0dB signal, and shoot for rated power all of my gains are well below the 4v setting. Make what you will of that.

Spdif makes for an awesome gain structure if you're that way inclined


----------



## ninetysix

MicroD said:


> Mine does not have any pad on top of the coil, but it does have a rubber pad on top of the heat sink nearby. I'll definitely be using some kapton tape and sliding in between the board and this coil when they hopefully replace my unit. All they would have to do is mount the coil slightly higher off the board when soldering it in place.
> 
> I believe they are somewhat aware of the problem because one side of the coil had some white silicone rubber near the bottom, but the failure happened on the other side of the coil.
> 
> 
> Here are a couple pictures of the other side of the board. The white residue seems to be patterned like one of the layers of the pcb, probably where the 12V+ runs. This leads me to believe that the short created by the coil grounding out has ruined the entire board.
> 
> This is the bottom of the board in the area where the coil is. Probing the area with the red line gives a direct short.


May I ask you guys having this issue when you purchased your 6x8s? Not sure if there is any manufacturing date or batch info on the box... I bought mine last October, about a month after it came out iirc and no trouble thus far, but I'm tempted to whip out the hot glue gun


----------



## bnae38

ninetysix said:


> but I'm tempted to whip out the hot glue gun


I would.


----------



## MicroD

Bought mine in April 2016. It was from a US reseller though (Madisound), not straight from MiniDSP. Madisound said they couldn't help with warranty claims, but told me they haven't heard of any problems with these units an likely it was user error that fried it. I disagreed and thanked them for the advice. I don't see any date code anywhere. 

I am hesitant to do any solder work on the board and have them deny my warranty. I am trying to wait and see if MiniDSP will ask me to send the board into them. I liked this product when it worked, but so far customer service is below what I expect. 

Do you think I should share the information about the coil being shorted to ground with them or not?


----------



## bnae38

MicroD said:


> Do you think I should share the information about the coil being shorted to ground with them or not?


Depends.

I wouldn't admit to opening it if you plan on sending it in..


----------



## bnae38

Have you lifted up on the coil to see if the short goes away?


----------



## ninetysix

Does your c-dsp have a sticker over the screws saying void if broken? Mine doesn't, and the manual shows that you'll need to open it to change the jumpers to disable remote power on.

When I had trouble with a 2x4 and made it clear I was happy to fault find they had me pulling it to bits so I doubt very much they are looking for reasons to void your warranty. Apart from delays in getting back to me I've only had very positive dealings with tech support.

That's pretty lame that madisound don't provide warranty, are you going to have to pay to send it to Hong Kong? Sounds pretty grey market if so :mean:


----------



## bnae38

Good point, forgot about jumpers. With that in mind, I'd give them all the info.


Good support from them in the past too, strange that you're not getting the same.


----------



## MicroD

I went back to MadiSound's website and looked at their return policy. It seems like they should be handling the warranty claim from what their policy states. I sent them an email explaining what their phone tech support person told me, and how that didn't seem to fit what their website said. I asked if they could please help me resolve the problem, so I'll see what they say.



> Return Policy
> 
> Our products have a one year warranty against manufacturer defects. Return the defective item(s) to us with a complete explanation of the problem. Please include your contact information with a daytime phone number (or email address) to reach you for additional information.
> 
> Products received in damaged condition must be reported immediately, and the original shipping carton should be retained for inspection.
> 
> Package returns carefully, manufacturers will not warranty damaged products. We handle most warranty claims directly, and will usually exchange defective units within two weeks of return.


----------



## ninetysix

I can understand if they want you to contact minidsp for tech support, they know the product. But if they (hurry up and) declare it dead and in need of RMA, surely you take it back to where you got it


----------



## MicroD

Sorry for the delay in letting you all know what happened with my CDSP. MiniDSP was quite helpful once they finally responded to my ticket. I let them know that the coil was shorted to the board. They immediately said they would send me a new unit and they flew one over to me from Hong Kong. 

I cracked open the new board and it looks like they have fixed the problem. The coil is mounted higher away from the board and they put the white silicone rubber in the middle of the coil to ensure that it can't touch the board. 

Thanks to everyone who helped me figure this out. I'd really recommend anyone who has a CDSP open it up and insulate the coil from the board with some electrical or kapton tape, or get out the soldering iron and remount the coil a bit higher. It is a bit of a pain, but better than smoking your board and driving in silence for a few weeks!:laugh:


----------



## bnae38

Good news, very cool.


----------



## Nocturnus

Without going through all the pages here, is this unit better than the PPI/SS units? I had the PPI and had motor noise that the unit was injecting (with or without inputs connected), I have a replacement SS unit that I have not connected yet, but am this week for testing.

Thanks.


----------



## ninetysix

Nocturnus said:


> Without going through all the pages here, is this unit better than the PPI/SS units? I had the PPI and had motor noise that the unit was injecting (with or without inputs connected), I have a replacement SS unit that I have not connected yet, but am this week for testing.
> 
> Thanks.


In a word, yes. That's what you will find people saying in this thread who have used both.


----------



## Nocturnus

Cool deal. I'll give the SS a try since I got it. If not back to my AudioControl gear till I can order the DSP.



ninetysix said:


> In a word, yes. That's what you will find people saying in this thread who have used both.


----------



## Ride154

subd!


----------



## TwistdInfinity

I'm out of the club. Got suckered into a Helix P Six DSP MKII. Couldn't resist a six channel amp and dsp in one. 
Still think the miniDSP C DSP is the best value dsp out there right now though, and the software was super easy to use 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## MicroD

I could use a little help getting my c-dsp set up now that I have a working one! Let me know if I have something screwed up, it is entirely possible. 

Here is what I've done so far:

I found my max clean volume coming from my receiver using a scope.
Hooked up the signal to my c-dsp and found the max receiver volume that brought the input meters on the c-dsp to -10db.
Set the output gains (9.7) to bring the output meter to 0db
Verified the signal was not clipping at the max level (still clean)
Hooked up amps (without speakers) and turned up gains until I saw clipping on the scope, then turned them down a bit.
Hooked up speakers and noticed 2 problems right away.


There is a very noticeable hiss present at all times. It is the same volume regardless of the receiver volume, it even happens when the receiver is off. Could this be a problem with my C-DSP gains or even amp gains? 
I have a 4 channel JL Audio XD400 bridged to the front left and right component speakers, and a JL Audio JX500 running the 10" JL sub (10W1v3-4). The full range speakers overpower the sub at the current gain settings. I have read that you shouldn't turn down the gain on the full range amp to allow the sub to be heard, but I'm not sure why. For example, my max clean volume on the receiver is vol45. At vol25 everything is very loud and I can hear the sub, but it is not very full, and I just want the option more bass. What is the best way to accomplish this?


----------



## ninetysix

MicroD said:


> I could use a little help getting my c-dsp set up now that I have a working one! Let me know if I have something screwed up, it is entirely possible.
> 
> Here is what I've done so far:
> 
> I found my max clean volume coming from my receiver using a scope.
> Hooked up the signal to my c-dsp and found the max receiver volume that brought the input meters on the c-dsp to -10db.
> Set the output gains (9.7) to bring the output meter to 0db
> Verified the signal was not clipping at the max level (still clean)
> Hooked up amps (without speakers) and turned up gains until I saw clipping on the scope, then turned them down a bit.
> Hooked up speakers and noticed 2 problems right away.
> 
> 
> There is a very noticeable hiss present at all times. It is the same volume regardless of the receiver volume, it even happens when the receiver is off. Could this be a problem with my C-DSP gains or even amp gains?
> I have a 4 channel JL Audio XD400 bridged to the front left and right component speakers, and a JL Audio JX500 running the 10" JL sub (10W1v3-4). The full range speakers overpower the sub at the current gain settings. I have read that you shouldn't turn down the gain on the full range amp to allow the sub to be heard, but I'm not sure why. For example, my max clean volume on the receiver is vol45. At vol25 everything is very loud and I can hear the sub, but it is not very full, and I just want the option more bass. What is the best way to accomplish this?


First up, and it may make no difference... But if your max clean signal to the DSP reads -10dB, I would turn the input gain up by about 9dB rather than the output. Did you test that with a tone?

It sounds to me like the Max clean power from your amp is far too much power. Wouldn't hurt to check your amps output voltage with the speakers disconnected to get an idea of just how much power you're sending to them. If you hook your head unit RCA's straight to the amp, bypassing the DSP do you get the same hiss or less? 

If you have a mic, try run a sweep of just the sub and just each side of your components all with the master volume set at the same value. See how well they match up. The other option is to turn the gains down some until it sounds good and balanced.


----------



## TwistdInfinity

Firstly: don't set gains using a scope with speakers disconnected. I tried this recently and found that when I connected my speakers back up and ran the same tone that the amp was going into clipping. Adding a load changed where the amp clips. I ended up having to turn the gains down, then run very brief tone bursts and gradually turn up the gain till I saw the signal start to flatten then back off till it was perfect sine wave. This was safe for me to do since my amps were not capable of over powering my subs and speakers. If your amp is a lot more powerful then use caution. 

Secondly, my C DSP also had a slight noise floor problem (hiss) but it didn't worry me cause as soon as the volume was turned up to even a low listening level I couldn't notice it. One of the installers over here said he won't use mini dsp products because of their noise floor, but I don't see it as a problem for 99 percent of people unless you're competing. 

And for all other c dsp users, I have checked on the scope and the output channel power meters are clean from 0dB and down. The instant it goes above 0.00dB it's starting to clip, and you don't want to amplify a clipped signal. Imagine also of your amp was also clipping. A clipped clipped signal... 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


----------



## MicroD

ninetysix said:


> First up, and it may make no difference... But if your max clean signal to the DSP reads -10dB, I would turn the input gain up by about 9dB rather than the output. Did you test that with a tone?
> 
> It sounds to me like the Max clean power from your amp is far too much power. Wouldn't hurt to check your amps output voltage with the speakers disconnected to get an idea of just how much power you're sending to them. If you hook your head unit RCA's straight to the amp, bypassing the DSP do you get the same hiss or less?
> 
> If you have a mic, try run a sweep of just the sub and just each side of your components all with the master volume set at the same value. See how well they match up. The other option is to turn the gains down some until it sounds good and balanced.


I wasn't very clear when I said that my max clean signal to the DSP reads -10db. My max clean signal to the DSP reads quite a bit higher than this. I didn't note the meter reading at the max clean volume setting (56/60) from the receiver. I had read that it was a good idea to use the either max clean receiver vol setting (56/60 in my case) OR what it took to give a -10db meter reading (receiver vol 45) whichever was lowest. https://www.minidsp.com/forum/hardware-support/12083-correct-way-to-gain-match-components#forumtop 

I can check the voltage coming from the amps in the morning. I can't really bypass the DSP as I'm using high level inputs from the factory stereo. I also don't have a mic unfortunately. Trying to learn as I go on this one, thanks for the patience.


----------



## ninetysix

MicroD said:


> I wasn't very clear when I said that my max clean signal to the DSP reads -10db. My max clean signal to the DSP reads quite a bit higher than this. I didn't note the meter reading at the max clean volume setting (56/60) from the receiver. I had read that it was a good idea to use the either max clean receiver vol setting (56/60 in my case) OR what it took to give a -10db meter reading (receiver vol 45) whichever was lowest. https://www.minidsp.com/forum/hardware-support/12083-correct-way-to-gain-match-components#forumtop
> 
> I can check the voltage coming from the amps in the morning. I can't really bypass the DSP as I'm using high level inputs from the factory stereo. I also don't have a mic unfortunately. Trying to learn as I go on this one, thanks for the patience.


Interesting thread in your link there. I haven't looked at the minidsp forums for a long time, good to see some healthy 6x8 technical discussion 

It sounds like you should be all set on your source and input side, but as TwistedInfinity suggested, you may have way too much gain on your amp especially if you have noise problems. I don't see the need to tune for maximum power if it's way too much for your sub to keep up with.


----------



## ninetysix

TwistdInfinity said:


> I'm out of the club. Got suckered into a Helix P Six DSP MKII. Couldn't resist a six channel amp and dsp in one.
> Still think the miniDSP C DSP is the best value dsp out there right now though, and the software was super easy to use
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


All the best with the helix mate :thumbsup:


----------



## Landshark77

Once the gains are set with head unit, c-dsp and amp, how does the remote control factor into all of this? Is the remote the primary volume control now? Personally I'd rather use the volume on my headunit and the remote for changing configs.


----------



## juiceweazel

Landshark77 said:


> Once the gains are set with head unit, c-dsp and amp, how does the remote control factor into all of this? Is the remote the primary volume control now? Personally I'd rather use the volume on my headunit and the remote for changing configs.


Ditto. What's the point of a volume knob on the deck & if I chose, to use my steering wheel volume control?


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## geshat00

The response changes... I think an RTA has shown this

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Tapatalk


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## Lanson

What you can do about that is set one config for high volume and another for lower. 

BTW I also had significant hiss with XD amps and the MiniDSP, and in the end I just had to lower the gains on the amps (tweeter and mid amps) and just boost in the software. I had no issues once I did that.


----------



## ninetysix

Landshark77 said:


> Once the gains are set with head unit, c-dsp and amp, how does the remote control factor into all of this? Is the remote the primary volume control now? Personally I'd rather use the volume on my headunit and the remote for changing configs.


I recall devteam over on the minidsp forums saying you don't have to use it at all, and if you wish you can set the volume to max then disconnect it if you don't want it at all. Obviously you'll need it to change presets, that makes it tricky to not accidentally adjust the volume when pressing the buttons though.


----------



## ninetysix

juiceweazel said:


> Ditto. What's the point of a volume knob on the deck & if I chose, to use my steering wheel volume control?


PAC make a steering wheel interface that spits out IR pulses, so you could stash that under the dash somewhere with the IR blaster taped over the IR receiver on the remote. There's more detail on it a couple pages back in this thread


----------



## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> What you can do about that is set one config for high volume and another for lower.
> 
> BTW I also had significant hiss with XD amps and the MiniDSP, and in the end I just had to lower the gains on the amps (tweeter and mid amps) and just boost in the software. I had no issues once I did that.


Sounds like you had too much "headroom" on your outputs. You want your output meters to get pretty close to 0dB when feeding it a 0dB signal before setting your gains. Any amp will hiss with too much gain


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## juiceweazel

They've thought of just about everything. Man next you're going to tell me that CD's are almost obsolete.... er wait....


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## EmptyKim

ninetysix said:


> I recall devteam over on the minidsp forums saying you don't have to use it at all, and if you wish you can set the volume to max then disconnect it if you don't want it at all. Obviously you'll need it to change presets, that makes it tricky to not accidentally adjust the volume when pressing the buttons though.


This is how I've had mine hooked up. Volume is just set to max on the MiniDSP, the remote is disconnected and I used the OEM head unit volume knob.


----------



## Landshark77

ninetysix said:


> I recall devteam over on the minidsp forums saying you don't have to use it at all, and if you wish you can set the volume to max then disconnect it if you don't want it at all. Obviously you'll need it to change presets, that makes it tricky to not accidentally adjust the volume when pressing the buttons though.


Thats my plan. 

Been tuning like a madman with the C-DSP for the past two days.
It takes some time but I think I have a good baseline to start working from.

I'm planning on setting up a couple good configs now that I know what I'm working with. My tweets are pretty solid flat response wise, the mids are +/- 5db off baseline at points, a bit harder to get as flat of a response.


----------



## Landshark77

Which is the proper way to use time alignment on the C-DSP.

Minidsp site says to take length in inches/13.5=milliseconds

another site people use:

tracerite.com/calc.html gives me completely different numbers to input

My numbers using the minidsp formula, do these seem right?

2.79 ms driver tweeter
3.85 ms passenger tweeter
3.5 ms driver mids
4.58 ms passenger mids


----------



## ninetysix

Landshark77 said:


> Which is the proper way to use time alignment on the C-DSP.
> 
> Minidsp site says to take length in inches/13.5=milliseconds
> 
> another site people use:
> 
> tracerite.com/calc.html gives me completely different numbers to input
> 
> My numbers using the minidsp formula, do these seem right?
> 
> 2.79 ms driver tweeter
> 3.85 ms passenger tweeter
> 3.5 ms driver mids
> 4.58 ms passenger mids


I set it to display in centimeters, more meaningful than milliseconds to me. The speaker furthest away should be the least delayed (or shortest distance) and your closest should be the most delayed (or longest distance).


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## TwistdInfinity

I use milliseconds for all my delay settings. Just play a tone in the frequency range of the drivers you're trying to align and start delaying the closest one until it's centered. 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Landshark77

ninetysix said:


> I set it to display in centimeters, more meaningful than milliseconds to me. The speaker furthest away should be the least delayed (or shortest distance) and your closest should be the most delayed (or longest distance).


So it looks like all of my measurements are reversed because the farthest speaker, passenger mid,has the longest delay 4.58 ms.

I ended up using tracerite to calculate time delay and here are the new numbers

Left Tweet 1.75ms 
Right Tweet .66ms
Left Mid 1.1ms
Right Mid 0ms

This seems to make more sense no delay on farthest speaker and most dealt on closest.

I also am going to try the time delay by ear method mentioned above and compare results.


----------



## Ride154

Hi Guys, yesterday i found something interesting for the iphone to c-dsp user. Lightning cable in spdif/coax out. 

http://www.matrix-digi.com/en/products/5/index.html

Hmmmm ... as you read on you'll also need a lightning to usb camera cable. Another 35 euro


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## t3sn4f2

Ride154 said:


> Hi Guys, yesterday i found something interesting for the iphone to c-dsp user. Lightning cable in spdif/coax out.
> 
> USB-SPDIF - MATRIX
> 
> Hmmmm ... as you read on you'll also need a lightning to usb camera cable. Another 35 euro


Only problem with those is that you can't charge the device while using it.


----------



## Elgrosso

Ride154 said:


> Hi Guys, yesterday i found something interesting for the iphone to c-dsp user. Lightning cable in spdif/coax out.
> 
> USB-SPDIF - MATRIX
> 
> Hmmmm ... as you read on you'll also need a lightning to usb camera cable. Another 35 euro


Nice find! The small size should help to install it.




t3sn4f2 said:


> Only problem with those is that you can't charge the device while using it.


This should help: Lightning to USB 3 Camera Adapter - Apple

I use it with the peachtree x1 since few weeks and it's fine (wanted to test optical to the APL too):
X1 24/192 USB to SPDIF Converter | Peachtree Audio

I'm always tuning and changing stuff so I never really compared everything "cleanly" but honestly I didn't hear any improvements over the analog istreamer.
so I still didn't take time to install it properly in the dash, still laying around:


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## t3sn4f2

Elgrosso said:


> Nice find! The small size should help to install it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This should help: Lightning to USB 3 Camera Adapter - Apple
> 
> I use it with the peachtree x1 since few weeks and it's fine (wanted to test optical to the APL too):
> X1 24/192 USB to SPDIF Converter | Peachtree Audio
> 
> I'm always tuning and changing stuff so I never really compared everything "cleanly" but honestly I didn't hear any improvements over the analog istreamer.
> so I still didn't take time to install it properly in the dash, still laying around:


Nice find, had no idea they came out with one of those. Do you know if it'll work with an iphone, like the old one does on recent iOS? They don't label it being compatible like they do the older adapter, but i'm wondering if it could just a web page description over site.


----------



## MicroD

I ended up checking the voltage on the amps and they were well below what the manufacturer recommends for optimal outputs. I checked the signals with a scope while the speakers were hooked up and they were nice round peaks as well. 

The hiss noise was from the outputs on the dsp turned up too much. I lowered them back down and the noise went away. Even at full volume now, the meter on the output reads around -8db. I tried turning the gains down on the amps, but the hiss did not change at all. I guess that is just how it needs to be for my setup. Sounds really great now.

I currently have Y RCA splitters (1male to 2female) going from Ch1 on the DSP and feeds Ch1 and Ch2 that are bridged on the amp. Would it be better to use Ch1 and Ch2 on the DSP and feed into the amp directly? Or would that not matter?


----------



## Elgrosso

t3sn4f2 said:


> Nice find, had no idea they came out with one of those. Do you know if it'll work with an iphone, like the old one does on recent iOS? They don't label it being compatible like they do the older adapter, but i'm wondering if it could just a web page description over site.


The lightning adapter? Sure I used it with an iphone6 and few ipads.


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## TwistdInfinity

You can bridge from the dsp directly if you wanted to and had the channels free. I noticed an improvement in my sub stage when I combined channels 7 and 8 and fed both into my sub amp. 

I was able to reduce the gain by half which is always good 

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk


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## Velozity

TwistdInfinity said:


> You can bridge from the dsp directly if you wanted to and had the channels free. I noticed an improvement in my sub stage when I combined channels 7 and 8 and fed both into my sub amp.
> 
> I was able to reduce the gain by half which is always good
> 
> Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk




+1. Use the input mixer to combine the signals.


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## Mlarson67

Has anyone else done the most recent firmware upgrade off minis website? I did it this past weekend and all my gains say they are the same in the software but I have half as much volume as compared to before I did the firmware upgrades


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## t0n33

Mlarson67 said:


> Has anyone else done the most recent firmware upgrade off minis website? I did it this past weekend and all my gains say they are the same in the software but I have half as much volume as compared to before I did the firmware upgrades


I haven't, I just noticed it today after they emailed about unrelated products. It would be nice if there was a way to subscribe to firmware/software updates. The last two updates aren't things that i notice, so im inclined to skip them...

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

If anybody is in the market for a good quality asynchronous usb to coax spdif adaptor compatible with Android via OTG/UAPP I can confirm that a SMSL X-USB XMOS works straight away from my Nexus 6P with 16/44 tidal and 24/96 flac.

Sure, it's about 10 times the price of a PCM2704, but it'll save you worrying about whether you can hear any jitter


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## ugnlol

If they only had a BT connection and a app that allowed you to tune it with a smartphone.
The chance of me booting up a laptop just to adjust 10khz up or down half a db is kinda small


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## DavidRam

*Are any of you guys using a separate IR remote control with your C-DSP??*


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## ninetysix

That's a rather bold statement 

No, why, ain't she working?


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## DavidRam

ninetysix said:


> That's a rather bold statement
> 
> No, why, ain't she working?


Is that referring to my post or the previous?


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## ninetysix

DavidRam said:


> Is that referring to my post or the previous?


Yes you sir


----------



## DavidRam

ninetysix said:


> Yes you sir


Oh, cool.

My dsp remote is fine, but I was thinking of getting a remote to place more conveniently as I will be using the volume on the remote exclusively with my new DAP set-up...
The dsp remote is mounted permanently under my steering wheel atm. 

According to the MiniDSP guys, it will work with most universal remotes...


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## ninetysix

It should work with absolutely any remote with enough buttons on it. Have a look in the c-dsp software to train the receiver to your remote


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## DavidRam

ninetysix said:


> It should work with absolutely any remote with enough buttons on it. Have a look in the c-dsp software to train the receiver to your remote


Good idea... I read through it briefly and it looks pretty easy... Maybe one of those mini remotes would be good...


----------



## ccclapp

beerdrnkr said:


> It'd be great if it had de-equalization for a stock hu.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk


Does anyone know if minidsp can de-equalize and "sum" non-full-ranke inputs from a HU?

Thanks


----------



## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> Does anyone know if minidsp can de-equalize and "sum" non-full-ranke inputs from a HU?
> 
> Thanks


Minidsp has input eq which should help to de equilize and you can sum any input with any input.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


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## strohw

You get 6 bands per input and 6 per output to do whatever you need to do.


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## ccclapp

piyush7243 said:


> Minidsp has input eq which should help to de equilize and you can sum any input with any input.


Thanks for the reply. I'm just confirming what you said:

1) Summing Inputs: If my Bose HU sends non-fullrange signals (for front, rear, subs) to its amp and I feed those non-fullrange outputs into the C-DSP I can "sum" them together to yield fullrange input L&R signals. Is that correct?

2) Further, if my Bose HU is doing additional EQ I can also neutralize that from the input?

Thus #1 gives me a full range input signal and #2 removes other EQ from that input signat, so together I gace a clean, fullrange L&R input.

3) With that now-clean fullrange L&R input does C-dsp then allow me to apply whatever out-put DSP I want?

If what I describe is correct, does the minidsp have separate input/output processing steps A. to yield clean input and B. to then correct for my listening environment? Is this described in their documentation I can read more about?

Thanks!!! and I dont bean to beat a dead horse...just trying to fully understand.


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## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> Thanks for the reply. I'm just confirming what you said:
> 
> 1) Summing Inputs: If my Bose HU sends non-fullrange signals (for front, rear, subs) to its amp and I feed those non-fullrange outputs into the C-DSP I can "sum" them together to yield fullrange input L&R signals. Is that correct?
> 
> 2) Further, if my Bose HU is doing additional EQ I can also neutralize that from the input?
> 
> Thus #1 gives me a full range input signal and #2 removes other EQ from that input signat, so together I gace a clean, fullrange L&R input.
> 
> 3) With that now-clean fullrange L&R input does C-dsp then allow me to apply whatever out-put DSP I want?
> 
> If what I describe is correct, does the minidsp have separate input/output processing steps A. to yield clean input and B. to then correct for my listening environment? Is this described in their documentation I can read more about?
> 
> Thanks!!! and I dont bean to beat a dead horse...just trying to fully understand.



1)Yes you can
2)you can neutralize by using input eq. Dsp has input n output eq so you can neutralize n them eq accordingly
3)yes as above

Given above

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


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## ccclapp

piyush7243 said:


> 1)Yes you can
> 2)you can neutralize by using input eq. Dsp has input n output eq so you can neutralize n them eq accordingly
> 3)yes as above
> 
> Given above


FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Check the doc n plugin guide for more info

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


----------



## ccclapp

piyush7243 said:


> Check the doc n plugin guide for more info
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


...on the minidsp site or on this site? I assume you mean on minidsp site. 
Thanks for your help!


----------



## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> ...on the minidsp site or on this site? I assume you mean on minidsp site.
> Thanks for your help!


Yes minidsp site

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


----------



## ccclapp

piyush7243 said:


> Yes minidsp site
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


Sorry to post again. I am not seeing any meaningful info about INPUT processing on their site. I've written to tech support to help. Its not clear which plugin I would use (need 3x2=6 inputs). They dont even list any plugins for the C DSP. Maybe I should just spend the $10 and gut plugin for 10x10 dsp and look at its manual.

My guess input processing is not well described, since its only real application is bad car HU's.

Any good guides you know of dealing with input processing?

Also, a given plug is best for input processing but another is best for output processing, can one use 2 or are we limited to single plugins per config?

Thanks once again!


----------



## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> Sorry to post again. I am not seeing any meaningful info about INPUT processing on their site. I've written to tech support to help. Its not clear which plugin I would use (need 3x2=6 inputs). They dont even list any plugins for the C DSP. Maybe I should just spend the $10 and gut plugin for 10x10 dsp and look at its manual.
> 
> My guess input processing is not well described, since its only real application is bad car HU's.
> 
> Any good guides you know of dealing with input processing?
> 
> Also, a given plug is best for input processing but another is best for output processing, can one use 2 or are we limited to single plugins per config?
> 
> Thanks once again!


There is only one plugin for cdsp . the input n output eq have three exact same functionality. Don't buy any other plugin. Wait for a day n support should respond

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


----------



## ccclapp

piyush7243 said:


> There is only one plugin for cdsp . the input n output eq have three exact same functionality. Don't buy any other plugin. Wait for a day n support should respond
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


...so if the HU is applying delays to its F/R/Sub outputs, I can measure these in REW and apply FIR/Timing filters to INPUTS, or am I limited to 6 graphic EQ adjustments per Input?

You must be sorry you are the resident expert here ;-)
On the other hand, I would think many others will be interested in C DSP's ability to work with OEM HU's...that has been one of the biggest stumbling blocks I've seen on other forums where the HU does so much: Nav, XM, iPhone FM and can never be replaced.


----------



## ninetysix

ccclapp said:


> ... need 3x2=6 inputs ...


You are aware there are only 4 analogue inputs on the 6x8 right?


----------



## ninetysix

ccclapp said:


> ...so if the HU is applying delays to its F/R/Sub outputs, I can measure these in REW and apply FIR/Timing filters to INPUTS, or am I limited to 6 graphic EQ adjustments per Input?
> 
> You must be sorry you are the resident expert here ;-)
> On the other hand, I would think many others will be interested in C DSP's ability to work with OEM HU's...that has been one of the biggest stumbling blocks I've seen on other forums where the HU does so much: Nav, XM, iPhone FM and can never be replaced.


No FIR on the 6x8, no delay on inputs, only outputs.


----------



## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> ...so if the HU is applying delays to its F/R/Sub outputs, I can measure these in REW and apply FIR/Timing filters to INPUTS, or am I limited to 6 graphic EQ adjustments per Input?
> 
> You must be sorry you are the resident expert here ;-)
> On the other hand, I would think many others will be interested in C DSP's ability to work with OEM HU's...that has been one of the biggest stumbling blocks I've seen on other forums where the HU does so much: Nav, XM, iPhone FM and can never be replaced.


No issues I love to help while I can. We deal with minidsp on daily basis.

Delays can only be applied on output. On input you can only apply 6 parametric bands per channel exactly Like output channels. Mind you The input channels are limited to 4,either speaker level or rca. It works very well with speaker level inputs. I have installed these in lit of cars n some with speaker level inputs and it works great

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


----------



## ccclapp

ninetysix said:


> You are aware there are only 4 analogue inputs on the 6x8 right?


Ah, right! I was thinking that meant 4 L and 4 R. So we only have 2L + 2R? The potential limitation of that is whether the HU sends fullrange or non-fullrange signal to its amp for Front/Rear/Sub. I it takes all 3 for me to end up with a full range signal, this will be an issue. If not, its ok.


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## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> Ah, right! I was thinking that meant 4 L and 4 R. So we only have 2L + 2R? The potential limitation of that is whether the HU sends fullrange or non-fullrange signal to its amp for Front/Rear/Sub. I it takes all 3 for me to end up with a full range signal, this will be an issue. If not, its ok.


If you have 3 inputs coming from hu with 3 different signals then I am afraid you can't use it. Or send subwoofer signal directly to amp.


Or you can use a y cable in case of rca inputs

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


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## ninetysix

There are other DSPs on the market with 6 or more inputs, for possibly quite a lot more money but also potentially a better product. If you've already clicked buy now I suppose a cheap fix could be to purchase a minidsp 2x4 to use purely to sum 4 channels into two, put those two into the c-dsp along with the remaining two channels but its not exactly ideal or cheap.

Edit: scratch that, 2x4 is 2 in 4 out, forget I said anything


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## ccclapp

Both of you are being incredibly helpful! Let me back up so I dont confuse/complicate things more than necessary

My Chevy SS (Holden Commodore VS) has a decent Bose HU which (I believe!!) sends F/R/Sub L&R line level outputs to its amp. No one seems to know if the HU or the amp does the EQ and no one seems to know if the 3 signal pairs are full range or limited range. Thus I am trying to plan for 1) creating a full range stereo signal by Summing enough signals to end up full range stereo. This may mean 1, 2, or 3 sets of L&R inputs...TBD. Also, the HU may be sending to F/L/Sub with delays...TBD??? It sounds like the conclusion here is its impossible to know if the C DSP can handle A) the required inputs and B) if there are timing issues (would not want to sum signals with different delays).

However (if I understand correctly) If I discover that any 2 LR pairs together cover the full signal range, I suppose I can NOT sum them (keep them separate) and then send to the corresponding new speakers via either the Bose or another amp. Then I would rely on REW measurements and output filters along with active X-overs to correct for the listening environment. However, I prefer to use less vs more DSP output processing and rely more on installing acoustic dampening/treatments...BUT if my input signal is not clean, that wont help much.

It looks like I should proceed with my install and try to better understand what Bose HU is doing and then decide if C dsp will cut it.

nintysix, I see you are in Australia. Do you hear anything relevant about the Bose in the Commodore VS to give any hints??

piyush7243: You say you oftern use C dsp on the speaker level output from the amp. Wont that always be worse than grabbing before the amp?

Thanks guys!


----------



## ccclapp

Is there a way to test/measure/compare the line level signals being sent by the HU for F/R/sub going into amp to determine if they are full-range and/or have delays? Since they connect through the amp and to different speakers I cant measure with REW unless I do lots of disconnect/reconnect


----------



## ninetysix

ccclapp said:


> Both of you are being incredibly helpful! Let me back up so I dont confuse/complicate things more than necessary
> 
> My Chevy SS (Holden Commodore VS) has a decent Bose HU which (I believe!!) sends F/R/Sub L&R line level outputs to its amp. No one seems to know if the HU or the amp does the EQ and no one seems to know if the 3 signal pairs are full range or limited range. Thus I am trying to plan for 1) creating a full range stereo signal by Summing enough signals to end up full range stereo. This may mean 1, 2, or 3 sets of L&R inputs...TBD. Also, the HU may be sending to F/L/Sub with delays...TBD??? It sounds like the conclusion here is its impossible to know if the C DSP can handle A) the required inputs and B) if there are timing issues (would not want to sum signals with different delays).
> 
> However (if I understand correctly) If I discover that any 2 LR pairs together cover the full signal range, I suppose I can NOT sum them (keep them separate) and then send to the corresponding new speakers via either the Bose or another amp. Then I would rely on REW measurements and output filters along with active X-overs to correct for the listening environment. However, I prefer to use less vs more DSP output processing and rely more on installing acoustic dampening/treatments...BUT if my input signal is not clean, that wont help much.
> 
> It looks like I should proceed with my install and try to better understand what Bose HU is doing and then decide if C dsp will cut it.
> 
> nintysix, I see you are in Australia. Do you hear anything relevant about the Bose in the Commodore VS to give any hints??
> 
> piyush7243: You say you oftern use C dsp on the speaker level output from the amp. Wont that always be worse than grabbing before the amp?
> 
> Thanks guys!


Heheh, your Chevy would be based on a VE or VF Commodore, VS was around 1995-97 and looks like this:










That said, sorry I can't help to much with the Commodore Bose setup but it does appear to be an option here in Oz so maybe try some Aussie Commodore forums, justcommodores is one I know of and I'm fairly sure many have gone all out with their setups.

Be sure to refer to it as a "dunnydoor" it'll be a great ice breaker


----------



## metanium

I know the the 2x4 comes in balanced or unbalanced versions, but does the C-DSP handle both? Will the C-DSP accept 2-wire balanced low-level signal from my factoy HU? Aren't high-level signals themselves balanced?


----------



## piyush7243

ccclapp said:


> Both of you are being incredibly helpful! Let me back up so I dont confuse/complicate things more than necessary
> 
> My Chevy SS (Holden Commodore VS) has a decent Bose HU which (I believe!!) sends F/R/Sub L&R line level outputs to its amp. No one seems to know if the HU or the amp does the EQ and no one seems to know if the 3 signal pairs are full range or limited range. Thus I am trying to plan for 1) creating a full range stereo signal by Summing enough signals to end up full range stereo. This may mean 1, 2, or 3 sets of L&R inputs...TBD. Also, the HU may be sending to F/L/Sub with delays...TBD??? It sounds like the conclusion here is its impossible to know if the C DSP can handle A) the required inputs and B) if there are timing issues (would not want to sum signals with different delays).
> 
> However (if I understand correctly) If I discover that any 2 LR pairs together cover the full signal range, I suppose I can NOT sum them (keep them separate) and then send to the corresponding new speakers via either the Bose or another amp. Then I would rely on REW measurements and output filters along with active X-overs to correct for the listening environment. However, I prefer to use less vs more DSP output processing and rely more on installing acoustic dampening/treatments...BUT if my input signal is not clean, that wont help much.
> 
> It looks like I should proceed with my install and try to better understand what Bose HU is doing and then decide if C dsp will cut it.
> 
> nintysix, I see you are in Australia. Do you hear anything relevant about the Bose in the Commodore VS to give any hints??
> 
> piyush7243: You say you oftern use C dsp on the speaker level output from the amp. Wont that always be worse than grabbing before the amp?
> 
> Thanks guys!


I could have typed wrong. What I meant was that cdsp to be used between hu n amp by either balanced or unbalanced signal from hu


metanium said:


> I know the the 2x4 comes in balanced or unbalanced versions, but does the C-DSP handle both? Will the C-DSP accept 2-wire balanced low-level signal from my factoy HU? Aren't high-level signals themselves balanced?


It supports both unbalanced (rca) and balanced inputs but only one can be used at a time

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk


----------



## alligatorman

Pantani23 said:


> What USB to SPDIF options are you guys using from your phone/tablet source to the C-DSP 6x8? What are the recommended ones? Are there any things I should be aware of when choosing?


Bro on minidsp forum recommended this. I ordered one but don't have it yet.
Https://www.amazon.com/SMSL-X-USB-Converter-Digital-Interface/dp/B01241CZV4


----------



## alligatorman

t0n33 said:


> I've had my c-dsp two weeks now, and I'm loving it! I was excited to discover i can use both the speaker level and spdif digital inputs on the same dsp preset. that makes it really easy for me since when I'm feeling lazy I can use the stock Accord hu Bluetooth or usb source, then, I can just turn the hu off, disconnect BT, and use my Nexus 6 with a USB OTG cable into a cheap box with coaxial spdif output into the c-dsp.
> 
> I setup the c-dsp input eq to correct for the factory hu bass roll off, and add a bit of house curves, and use the output eqs to flatten my speaker response with PEQ determined in REW and the umik-1. (thanks for the guide, hanatsu!) I also adjusted ta by ear using pink noise and the Doppler sweep method I read about here too. so cool!
> 
> this is an impressive amount of power for correction and control vs the audiocontrol lqc-1 I was using before. thanks to everyone here for sharing your experience and expertise! KeepHopeAlive for paving the way for me to tear into my 2015 Accord!
> 
> one of these days I'll have to throw my photos into a build log post...


How would you describe the sound character changing from analog to digital input?


----------



## t0n33

alligatorman said:


> How would you describe the sound character changing from analog to digital input?


Well, in my case I'm using speaker level analog inputs that have factory Honda bass roll-off. Digital direct from my phone doesn't need the source eq corrected, and had an audibly lower noise floor. I mainly hear the differences when parked with no road noise to compete with...


----------



## Erroon

Anyone have a used or broken 6x8 they'd like to sell to a broke highschooler?


----------



## Daveo

Trying to figure this thing out, the instructions are vague but when and how is the digital input used? 

It looks like to me, you can use multiple inputs also?


----------



## ninetysix

Yes you can, but it doesn't necessarily mean you should. Start with the routing page in the c-dsp software, check the outputs that you want to receive the signal from spdif, ie 1 & 2 for L & R midbass, 3 & 4 for L & R midrange, 5 & 6 for tweeters, 7 & 8 for sub.


----------



## dannyb

Hi, literally just found out about this device, im tapping one channel (left and right) into an Audiocontrol lc2i, so, from there into the C-DSP 6x8, and from there i use rca's in to my 4 channel + 1 mono Alpine pdxv9 to drive a sub, full range rear coaxials and front full range components?

Also does any one know of some good cheapish oscilloscope software that i can use for my gains once i get this and the mic?

What gauge wire have you used to connect to the battery and also what size inline fuse?

Is there anything else i need to get before i delve in?


----------



## dannyb

Apart from TIDAL obviously.


----------



## t0n33

dannyb said:


> Hi, literally just found out about this device, im tapping one channel (left and right) into an Audiocontrol lc2i, so, from there into the C-DSP 6x8, and from there i use rca's in to my 4 channel + 1 mono Alpine pdxv9 to drive a sub, full range rear coaxials and front full range components?
> 
> Also does any one know of some good cheapish oscilloscope software that i can use for my gains once i get this and the mic?
> 
> What gauge wire have you used to connect to the battery and also what size inline fuse?
> 
> Is there anything else i need to get before i delve in?


The 6x8 can accept speaker level inputs, so you could consider ditching the lc2i. I don't recall what size fuse i used, maybe 3amp in line with maybe 16guage power wire off my amp, but it's pretty small, i think the manual lists power consumption.


----------



## dannyb

In that case I can just use the ground and the power that's already attached to the battery straight to the DSP saving me a job, and might even make some money back.


----------



## ninetysix

I use a 2a fuse on both my c-dsp's with roughly 18 gauge wire, haven't popped a fuse yet


----------



## dannyb

So i ordered last night, got the c-dsp and the umik. I gotta admit im not sure what ive got myself into, had a look at the dsp software and rew and its blown my mind. I havent got any idea of where to start, looking for a noddy guide to get me started.


----------



## rton20s

dannyb said:


> So i ordered last night, got the c-dsp and the umik. I gotta admit im not sure what ive got myself into, had a look at the dsp software and rew and its blown my mind. I havent got any idea of where to start, looking for a noddy guide to get me started.


This may be a good place for you to start...
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/technical-advanced-car-audio-discussion/206881-jazzis-tuning-companion-room-eq-wizard.html


----------



## ninetysix

Jazzi's spreadsheet is mandatory  but look at Hanatsu's guide it has a lot of very good info on how to measure with the mic and how to use REW.

Basically if it's not in jazzi's, Hanatsu's or this thread... You don't need to know it


----------



## Velozity

rton20s said:


> This may be a good place for you to start...
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/technical-advanced-car-audio-discussion/206881-jazzis-tuning-companion-room-eq-wizard.html





ninetysix said:


> Jazzi's spreadsheet is mandatory  but look at Hanatsu's guide it has a lot of very good info on how to measure with the mic and how to use REW.
> 
> Basically if it's not in jazzi's, Hanatsu's or this thread... You don't need to know it




Definitely look up and subscribe to those threads mentioned above. Also read all the information on MiniDSP's website and download the tutorials. It is necessary when/if you get ready to delve into the advanced programming features involving biquads. 

I really love this processor. It does everything right and doesn't get in the way. The recent firmware update that lets the controller volume step in 1.5dB increments instead of 3dB is totally needed if you plan to use your controller for main system volume. I only wish they would step it in 0.5dB increments instead. Aside from that the only other wish list item I have for this piece is to upgrade to 24/96 internal processing like the Helix Pro and PS8.


----------



## dannyb

Thanks for the links.

Just had quick gloss over Hanatsu's guide and that's exactly what I need to get me started. Couldn't quite work out Jazzi's spreadsheet, sure that'll become clearer in due course. 

Here's what i installed the other week. In my MK 3 Ford Mondeo Estate

In the front 

Pioneer TS-E171Ci - 17cm 6.5" 2 Way Components Speaker 
Maximum output power 260 Watt
RMS 60 Watt, 4Ω, Frequency response 27 - 44,0000 Hz
Sensitivity 88 dB
The crossovers on these are hardwired in. Really dont want to take the woofers out to disconnect these to isolate the tweeters as they are a pain in my ass. (use butyl rubber to seal the speakers to the adapter rings)

In the rear

Pioneer TS-E1702is - 17cm 
Maximum input power 280 Watt
RMS 60 Watt, 4Ω, Frequency response 30 – 32,000 Hz
Sensitivity 87.5 dB
I installed these for the sake of completeness and for my passengers, guessing ill be using these for infill in the midrange when its just us two in the front and have another preset for when ive got people in the back?

Behind the passenger seat

TS-SWX2502 10" Shallow-Mount Pre-Loaded Enclosure
Max. Music Power 1,200 Watt
RMS 300 Watt, 4Ω, Frequency Response 20 Hz to 200 Hz
Sensitivity 89 dB

Under the passenger seat

Alpine PDX-V9

The head unit is stock but its a bit crap tbh, and i cant change it as it has my ac controls in it, so i have no problem going directly off my phone. 

Just wanna get the best sound stage I can with what I've bought. Got a feeling I've come to the right place.

Any advice/steers/headups is greatly appreciated.


----------



## ninetysix

dannyb said:


> Thanks for the links.
> 
> Just had quick gloss over Hanatsu's guide and that's exactly what I need to get me started. Couldn't quite work out Jazzi's spreadsheet, sure that'll become clearer in due course.


The idea with jazzi's sheet is once you know what you want your frequency response to look like, it can create house curve files that you load in to REW to auto EQ your measured response into your desired response. Knowing what you want is the tricky part.



> Here's what i installed the other week. In my MK 3 Ford Mondeo Estate
> 
> In the front
> 
> Pioneer TS-E171Ci - 17cm 6.5" 2 Way Components Speaker
> Maximum output power 260 Watt
> RMS 60 Watt, 4Ω, Frequency response 27 - 44,0000 Hz
> Sensitivity 88 dB
> The crossovers on these are hardwired in. Really dont want to take the woofers out to disconnect these to isolate the tweeters as they are a pain in my *arse*. (use butyl rubber to seal the speakers to the adapter rings)
> 
> In the rear
> 
> Pioneer TS-E1702is - 17cm
> Maximum input power 280 Watt
> RMS 60 Watt, 4Ω, Frequency response 30 – 32,000 Hz
> Sensitivity 87.5 dB
> I installed these for the sake of completeness and for my passengers, guessing ill be using these for infill in the midrange when its just us two in the front and have another preset for when ive got people in the back?
> 
> Behind the passenger seat
> 
> TS-SWX2502 10" Shallow-Mount Pre-Loaded Enclosure
> Max. Music Power 1,200 Watt
> RMS 300 Watt, 4Ω, Frequency Response 20 Hz to 200 Hz
> Sensitivity 89 dB
> 
> Under the passenger seat
> 
> Alpine PDX-V9
> 
> The head unit is stock but its a bit crap tbh, and i cant change it as it has my ac controls in it, so i have no problem going directly off my phone.
> 
> Just wanna get the best sound stage I can with what I've bought. Got a feeling I've come to the right place.
> 
> Any advice/steers/headups is greatly appreciated.


I fixed your spelling 

To be honest you're going to be fairly limited in what you can achieve by retaining the passive crossovers and only using 5 or 6 of your 8 outputs. But it's a good start and you can always dig the speakers out when your confidence is up, maybe add another small amp just for the rears - or leave them on the head unit only.

You'll want an spdif card for your phone, plenty of options be it Android or iPhone, some options better than others but it's quite possible that any of them would be an improvement over the factory headunit.


----------



## dannyb

Thaks for the info.

I could measure the tweeters by disconnecting the woofers and measure the woofers by disconnecting the tweeters right? Or could I just apply a filter? 

I find the tweeters on these components a little bright.


----------



## dannyb

I was just gonna use a 3.5 mm jack to RCA from my phone in to the DSP. No good?


----------



## dannyb

Top tip as i have a Pioneer Gmd 1004 spare that i could use to run the the rears, in bridged mode they'll put out 90 watts rms so plenty of headroom to drive the rears. 

So I'll just get rid of the passive cross over entirely then and use the dsp.

Funny cause a month ago I didnt know a single thing about car audio and here i am.


----------



## HKSone

dannyb said:


> I was just gonna use a 3.5 mm jack to RCA from my phone in to the DSP. No good?


Best to use the digital SPDIF connection on the minidsp for sound quality. You need an otg cable to link your phone then USB into a converter like this https://www.amazon.com/USB-DAC-PCM2704-Optical-Converter/dp/B0093KZTEA/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8


----------



## HKSone

I'm using a carpc for my setup and I just received my minidsp 6x8. Unfortunately I have optical spdif outputs but won't be able to use it. Therefore, I have been trying to find a usb to spdif coaxial converter. Anyone have the ministreamer that can confirm if I am able to use my main windows volume control? Or can recommend a quality 24bit/192 usb to coaxial spdif that will allow me to retain the main windows volume control? Its essential that I retain the windows volume I don't want to rip up all my panels again to run my remote wire.


----------



## t0n33

HKSone said:


> Best to use the digital SPDIF connection on the minidsp for sound quality. You need an otg cable to link your phone then USB into a converter like this https://www.amazon.com/USB-DAC-PCM2...0093KZTEA/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8


Ive been happy with one of these $10 eBay dac boxes with the same chipset and usb otg and spdif cable with my Nexus 6... Search for "http://m.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=P...usb+dac+aluminum&sqp=pcm2704+usb+dac+aluminum PCM2704 USB DAC aluminum"


----------



## ninetysix

dannyb said:


> I was just gonna use a 3.5 mm jack to RCA from my phone in to the DSP. No good?


I think most phones when used with a 3.5mm to rca lead will output under 1v RMS, so your signal to noise ratio would not be great. Plus it's an extra digital to analogue conversion which can be avoided altogether by using spdif.


----------



## ninetysix

HKSone said:


> I'm using a carpc for my setup and I just received my minidsp 6x8. Unfortunately I have optical spdif outputs but won't be able to use it. Therefore, I have been trying to find a usb to spdif coaxial converter. Anyone have the ministreamer that can confirm if I am able to use my main windows volume control? Or can recommend a quality 24bit/192 usb to coaxial spdif that will allow me to retain the main windows volume control? Its essential that I retain the windows volume I don't want to rip up all my panels again to run my remote wire.


Yes you can control volume with a ministreamer In windows, but it's not ideal unless you leave it at 100% most of the time 

I would recommendd a CM6631A spdif card. Pretty cheap, asynchronous and proven jitter free.


----------



## HKSone

ninetysix said:


> Yes you can control volume with a ministreamer In windows, but it's not ideal unless you leave it at 100% most of the time
> 
> I would recommendd a CM6631A spdif card. Pretty cheap, asynchronous and proven jitter free.



Can you tell the difference in sq if you don't leave the windows volume at 100%?

Is this the unit? 

New Version CM6631A USB to SPDIF Coaxial Optical 24bit 192kHz Sound Card DAC | eBay

and you can confirm this unit also allows windows volume control? Thanks bud.


----------



## ninetysix

HKSone said:


> Can you tell the difference in sq if you don't leave the windows volume at 100%?
> 
> Is this the unit?
> 
> New Version CM6631A USB to SPDIF Coaxial Optical 24bit 192kHz Sound Card DAC | eBay
> 
> and you can confirm this unit also allows windows volume control? Thanks bud.


I've only ever used the volume control on my c-dsp remote so I can't really comment on that. This link is worth a look though.

Every spdif card I've used with windows or Android USB audio player pro has been able to control volume in software.

This is the card I bought. might not be any difference but it looks exactly the same as the version that tested well in this link, for what it's worth.

I'm only recommending that card because you're using windows and therefore won't have any driver issues (tho the cd that came with mine didn't work, the seller sent me a link to the driver package which I otherwise couldn't find on the internet) but for anybody running an Android source it's a pain in the neck that the more expensive SMSL X-USB XMOS avoids entirely.


----------



## ninetysix

So I discovered the cause of the AM radio (yes, I listen to our national broadcaster from time to time) interference in an 05 Legacy that made it unusable. Like almost completely drowned out with switch mode power supply noise, exactly like the kind in the video: 

https://youtu.be/bEynqN_3V1Q

It was bad any time the car was running, but everything off and parked, not so bad... But flash the high beams and it goes crazy  it doesn't have HID lights if that matters, and all my grounds are definitely good, antenna ground good, new antenna cable, switched in glass for whip antenna, tried power and ground from the amps to head unit and dsp, no difference. If i muted the dsp and just played thru the rear factory speakers wired to the head unit, it was just as noisy. 

But moving my amp trigger wire from the dsp remote out terminal to remote in (so wired in parallel with the head unit trigger wire) and bingo, no noise. No turn on/turn off pop either. 

Maybe the remote out power supply on the dsp was overloaded?


----------



## DavidRam

ninetysix said:


> I've only ever used the volume control on my c-dsp remote so I can't really comment on that.


I have been using my C-DSP remote volume since I retired my HU and started using a DAP for signal, and you were right, it works very well. 

I even went as far as to make it a little prettier and easier to grab/turn with some aluminum.  
The remote is on the right mounted behind the panel...
https://postimg.org/image/470wlo1w5/


----------



## HKSone

ninetysix said:


> I've only ever used the volume control on my c-dsp remote so I can't really comment on that. This link is worth a look though.
> 
> Every spdif card I've used with windows or Android USB audio player pro has been able to control volume in software.
> 
> This is the card I bought. might not be any difference but it looks exactly the same as the version that tested well in this link, for what it's worth.
> 
> I'm only recommending that card because you're using windows and therefore won't have any driver issues (tho the cd that came with mine didn't work, the seller sent me a link to the driver package which I otherwise couldn't find on the internet) but for anybody running an Android source it's a pain in the neck that the more expensive SMSL X-USB XMOS avoids entirely.


I read through the the discussion about volume controls and it is preferred to have digital volume on the device at 100% but not much verification if it's a big difference in sound quality. I guess I will have to test it myself. 

Also on some other forum regarding a usb-digital coaxial converter that windows volume was not adjustable but the sound player program (i.e. spotify, windows media player) was able to adjust the volume. So you remember that the windows volume button was adjustable?


----------



## ninetysix

HKSone said:


> I read through the the discussion about volume controls and it is preferred to have digital volume on the device at 100% but not much verification if it's a big difference in sound quality. I guess I will have to test it myself.
> 
> Also on some other forum regarding a usb-digital coaxial converter that windows volume was not adjustable but the sound player program (i.e. spotify, windows media player) was able to adjust the volume. So you remember that the windows volume button was adjustable?


I haven't met an spdif card that couldn't adjust volume through software, I can only image it was a driver limitation for those that couldn't?

That said, there are a few options to allow you to control volume through the c-dsp other than using the knob itself. Easiest being an infrared red remote, or a PAC steering wheel control adaptor that can blast IR signals to the remote which can be tucked under the dash or in the trunk.


----------



## dannyb

How are you guys charging your tablet or phone when attached to an otg cable?


----------



## t0n33

dannyb said:


> How are you guys charging your tablet or phone when attached to an otg cable?


I don't charge while playing spdif, i use Bluetooth if i need to quick charge. I did order a usb-c otg charge splitter that I'll try to charge+dac when my new pixel phone arrives in a few weeks...


----------



## Daveo

Im a total newb when it comes to a dsp, is there any tutorials to help with tuning this thing? I'd sure hate to run a bunch of bass to my tweeters! I have a pretty good idea of whats going on but dont totally understand it...


----------



## t0n33

Daveo said:


> Im a total newb when it comes to a dsp, is there any tutorials to help with tuning this thing? I'd sure hate to run a bunch of bass to my tweeters! I have a pretty good idea of whats going on but dont totally understand it...


Yeah, scroll back to 9/30 posts in this thread for starters. To be safe you can leave your tweeters disconnected while you learn to set crossovers on your woofers


----------



## HKSone

ninetysix said:


> I haven't met an spdif card that couldn't adjust volume through software, I can only image it was a driver limitation for those that couldn't?
> 
> That said, there are a few options to allow you to control volume through the c-dsp other than using the knob itself. Easiest being an infrared red remote, or a PAC steering wheel control adaptor that can blast IR signals to the remote which can be tucked under the dash or in the trunk.


You're right it is most likely a driver issue, because of that I decided to buy the asus u7 usb sound card since there should be more software/driver support and it has the coaxial spdif output that I need. It is more expensive then the usb-spdif converter you recommended but I also didn't not want to wait too long for the one in china to arrive. The asus u7 also does 24bit/192 so the quality shouldn't be any different. Do you think the quality of this unit is similar to the converter you recommended? https://www.asus.com/us/Sound-Cards/Xonar_U7/


About the infrared remote how does it connect to the minidsp? Does it connect to the Ethernet/telephone port on the minidsp then converts to infrared? and does it replace the stock minidsp remote? 
Thanks.


----------



## ninetysix

HKSone said:


> You're right it is most likely a driver issue, because of that I decided to buy the asus u7 usb sound card since there should be more software/driver support and it has the coaxial spdif output that I need. It is more expensive then the usb-spdif converter you recommended but I also didn't not want to wait too long for the one in china to arrive. The asus u7 also does 24bit/192 so the quality shouldn't be any different. Do you think the quality of this unit is similar to the converter you recommended? https://www.asus.com/us/Sound-Cards/Xonar_U7/
> 
> 
> About the infrared remote how does it connect to the minidsp? Does it connect to the Ethernet/telephone port on the minidsp then converts to infrared? and does it replace the stock minidsp remote?
> Thanks.


The xonar u7 is a very nice card on all fronts. Good for spdif (optical or coax), good analogue line out and good headphone amp. Just a shame it wouldn't put out spdif over android 

Have a look through the c-dsp manual, it's all in there. Essentially the remote itself has a IR receiver and you can program any old remote for volume up & down, mute and the 4 presets. Even if tucked up under the dash it still should be able to receive IR commands from a remote.

Another option is one of these to use steering wheel buttons:

Pac-Audio.com Product Details | iPod Integration for your car and More by Pac-Audio - Connecting you to the future


----------



## alligatorman

dannyb said:


> How are you guys charging your tablet or phone when attached to an otg cable?


Qi-Infinity 2A wireless charger on my S7.


----------



## HKSone

ninetysix said:


> The xonar u7 is a very nice card on all fronts. Good for spdif (optical or coax), good analogue line out and good headphone amp. Just a shame it wouldn't put out spdif over android
> 
> Have a look through the c-dsp manual, it's all in there. Essentially the remote itself has a IR receiver and you can program any old remote for volume up & down, mute and the 4 presets. Even if tucked up under the dash it still should be able to receive IR commands from a remote.
> 
> Another option is one of these to use steering wheel buttons:
> 
> Pac-Audio.com Product Details | iPod Integration for your car and More by Pac-Audio - Connecting you to the future


I got everything connected and tested the Xonar u7 without the minidsp connected and sound quality is good but the output is really low (1v preamp outputs) so I had to turn my amp gain up a lot. I wouldn't be comfortable using it that way because my amps run hot already and turning the gain higher can cause unwanted problems. 

I then connected the minidsp into the equation using spdif out and the output is a lot better now allows me to turn down the amp gains. I have basic tuning such as xover and a little eq. I might be detecting sound jitter but i'm still not sure if its the cd, because its a dj mixed cd. On the other hand, I wasn't hearing it before so it might be jitter. Sound quality is better overall but I still think as of now before fully tuned that my basic 10 year old cd alpine unit using its internal 50x 4 amp with 4v output to sub amp has better sound quality. Will be fully tuning it soon..

Another problem I'm having is that I wasn't able to use the remote at all. The preset light comes on but I am unable to adjust the volume, mute and presets. I do have the usb connected to the minidsp and I've read that I won't able to change the presets on the remote if I have the usb connected. In the software it looks like the volume is stuck on -6 db and I also seen it on 0 db as well. I wasn't too concerned since I use my PC for volume control but I still want my remote to work correctly in case if I change the setup. What is the max volume db on the minidsp that will give me idea if i'm close to max volume?

Hopefully I can get this dialed down or I'd be pissed after spending so much more for this setup time and money. lol


----------



## Elgrosso

HKSone said:


> ...
> Another problem I'm having is that I wasn't able to use the remote at all. The preset light comes on but I am unable to adjust the volume, mute and presets. I do have the usb connected to the minidsp and I've read that I won't able to change the presets on the remote if I have the usb connected. In the software it looks like the volume is stuck on -6 db and I also seen it on 0 db as well. I wasn't too concerned since I use my PC for volume control but I still want my remote to work correctly in case if I change the setup. What is the max volume db on the minidsp that will give me idea if i'm close to max volume?
> 
> Hopefully I can get this dialed down or I'd be pissed after spending so much more for this setup time and money. lol


Once any computer connected the volume knob should still work, but not the presets (mute I don't remember).
Did you update it?
And Max volume should be 0db


----------



## HKSone

Elgrosso said:


> Once any computer connected the volume knob should still work, but not the presets (mute I don't remember).
> Did you update it?
> And Max volume should be 0db


No, I haven't done any firmware updating. 0db is max volume, what about the minimun starting volume? Is there a way to tell what current firmware version are on the devices? When updating should I update both the minidsp unit and the remote at the same time or one at a time? These are the instructions that were on the plugin files to update both the main unit and remote. 

Firmware upgrade procedure (for both device main board and remote panel):

1. Power off the device.
2. Connect the device and the Small Remote Panel using the straight through telephone cable.
3. Copy the two firmware files (upgrade.hex and panel.cfg) into SD card.
4. Insert the SD card into the SD card slot of the device.
5. Power on the device.
6. After around 10 seconds, all four LEDs on the preset buttons of the Remote Panel will turn on.
7. The device is updating, wait until one of the Preset button's blue LED turn on again, this take around an extra 20 seconds.
8. Take away the SD card, delete the firmware files if they are not being deleted.
9. Power cycle the device. (i.e. Power off the device and then power it on again.)


----------



## Elgrosso

HKSone said:


> No, I haven't done any firmware updating. 0db is max volume, what about the minimun starting volume? Is there a way to tell what current firmware version are on the devices? When updating should I update both the minidsp unit and the remote at the same time or one at a time? These are the instructions that were on the plugin files to update both the main unit and remote.


I don't remember anything to do with the remote during the update, but mine always worked.
-72db is the minimum volume setting, and for the software version, must be somewhere in the top menu.


----------



## HKSone

The remote most of the times worked but sometimes it still does not work and I think it's because I have the minidsp usb cord hooked up to my pc at all times causing it not to respond. At times that it did not work, I tested it by unplugging the usb cord, then it works again. It's not a big deal for me since I use my pc for volume control.

Finished my install I'm happy for now but I still want more improvements with SQ as I am not totally satisfied; hopefully more tuning by someone more experience can fix it. I will have it looked at by someone soon. Check out my install, there a video included as well. 

98 Lexus GS400 Carputer audiophile install - MP3Car.com


----------



## t0n33

HKSone said:


> The remote most of the times worked but sometimes it still does not work and I think it's because I have the minidsp usb cord hooked up to my pc at all times causing it not to respond. At times that it did not work, I tested it by unplugging the usb cord, then it works again. It's not a big deal for me since I use my pc for volume control.
> 
> Finished my install I'm happy for now but I still want more improvements with SQ as I am not totally satisfied; hopefully more tuning by someone more experience can fix it. I will have it looked at by someone soon. Check out my install, there a video included as well.
> 
> 98 Lexus GS400 Carputer audiophile install - MP3Car.com


Looks good! Yeah, pretty sure the manual says the remote doesn't work while usb is connected too. Do you have a touchscreen up front that you run the DSP software on? That's cool! I mostly set mine with a laptop, mic, and REW then leave it alone.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


----------



## HKSone

t0n33 said:


> Looks good! Yeah, pretty sure the manual says the remote doesn't work while usb is connected too. Do you have a touchscreen up front that you run the DSP software on? That's cool! I mostly set mine with a laptop, mic, and REW then leave it alone.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


I do remember that I read that it did said with the USB connected, the presets won't work but it did not mention if the volume will work or not. Yes sir, I do all my programming on the touchscreen monitor but with external mouse and keyboard of course. Although, I do remote into the system so I can also tune with my desktop with a bigger screen sometimes. I can do unlimited things with this since it runs windows 10.  Unfortunately, the minidsp program only displays correctly with 720p and higher; a lot of parts are cut off with lower resolutions. Thanks for the comment!


----------



## bnae38

https://www.minidsp.com/forum/suggestion-box/12294-c-dsp-6x8-subwoofer-level-control?start=15#28952


----------



## ninetysix

bnae38 said:


>


Precisely my response


----------



## bnae38

ninetysix said:


> Precisely my response


Begged for it, then gave up and sold mine lol. Oh well..


----------



## t0n33

bnae38 said:


> https://www.minidsp.com/forum/suggestion-box/12294-c-dsp-6x8-subwoofer-level-control?start=15#28952


Awesome!


----------



## lazzer408

Has anyone tried the PEQ.8 software on the C-DSP 6x8? I'm shopping for a DSP but the 6x8's 6 band EQ sort of defeats the purpose of a DSP. Like having an i7 CPU to do basic math.


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> Has anyone tried the PEQ.8 software on the C-DSP 6x8? I'm shopping for a DSP but the 6x8's 6 band EQ sort of defeats the purpose of a DSP. Like having an i7 CPU to do basic math.


Yeah 6 biquads, what a piece of junk.


----------



## lazzer408

ninetysix said:


> Yeah 6 biquads, what a piece of junk.


Is that sarcastic?


----------



## ninetysix

Yes  didn't mean to be rude.

But I think you underestimate what 6 biquads per input and output can do. I would not willingly swap that for a 31 band eq


----------



## Lanson

lazzer408 said:


> Has anyone tried the PEQ.8 software on the C-DSP 6x8? I'm shopping for a DSP but the 6x8's 6 band EQ sort of defeats the purpose of a DSP. Like having an i7 CPU to do basic math.


LMAO, trust me, with REW or other smart software, the PEQ control is vastly superior. On top of 6 PEQ's (which can go anywhere and pretty much do anything, including add on top of each other), you have an additional input PEQ which can help with fine-tuning.

Take REW and use the auto-eq function, give it a limit of the frequency range you want to affect, and a limit of 6 PEQ functions. You'll find it will usually not even use all 6 to get a desired result. Usually it will work with 2 or 3. It is more than enough.

edit: Remember that's 6 biquads PER channel, x 8 channels, plus 2 more for input. With a single midbass channel running from, say, 60hz up to 600hz, you can put 6 biquads in that narrow range which can change the response dramatically. Even with extreme cuts, you'll probably only use 2 or 3 of those 6 for that range.

edit: here's one in action, in a recent build of mine 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVAxqEijdcU


----------



## Velozity

MiniDSP just keeps on getting better! I love how they developed a new feature based on feedback from their forums. The 6x8 is an excellent value with excellent mfg. support. I think I'll get another one for my 350Z re-build.


----------



## ninetysix

I suppose you could say the c-dsp has a 60 biquad band EQ 

The only good use I can think of for a 31 band EQ would be to easily make final adjustments by ear to your input EQ after you've got your output PEQs set. 

Though I've often found that I didn't need to use the input EQ after getting the outputs just right. de-EQing an OEM unit is another matter, but if your 20-20000hz measurements don't match the house curve then you likely need to revisit your output EQ/level/TA.


----------



## Lanson

If they added center/surround algorithm plugins (even at an extra cost, understanding the licenses and such), I'd probably just use them 100% for now on and kick all other processors to the curb.


----------



## dgage

Can someone explain the process for how the new volume controls work, meaning, how do you switch between them? Looked on the MiniDSP site but couldn't find any mention of actual functionality. Thanks.


----------



## t0n33

dgage said:


> Can someone explain the process for how the new volume controls work, meaning, how do you switch between them? Looked on the MiniDSP site but couldn't find any mention of actual functionality. Thanks.


Sure, it's in the text file in the upgrade zip file.

Hold preset 1 & 2 buttons for a second or two. LEDs 1 & 2 will be lit indicating knob controls master volume. Press 4, lights will change to 1 blinking & 2 solid indicating knob controls ch 8 volume. Press 4 again to cycle to lights 1&2 blinking, indicating knob controls ch 7&8 volume. Press 4 to repeat cycle. Press and hold 1 & 2 to go back to normal preset control.

I tried it today on my drive home. Pretty cool to have it added, and it works!


----------



## lazzer408

I don't know what a bi-quad is. All I see are 6 bands. I have 13 now and it's not enough.


----------



## ninetysix

So can you switch to sub volume, adjust it then switch back to master volume and the sub will stay at that same level relative to master volume?

I'm curious if it does it by adjusting the level of the sub outputs


----------



## dgage

t0n33 said:


> Sure, it's in the text file in the upgrade zip file.
> 
> Hold preset 1 & 2 buttons for a second or two. LEDs 1 & 2 will be lit indicating knob controls master volume. Press 4, lights will change to 1 blinking & 2 solid indicating knob controls ch 8 volume. Press 4 again to cycle to lights 1&2 blinking, indicating knob controls ch 7&8 volume. Press 4 to repeat cycle. Press and hold 1 & 2 to go back to normal preset control.
> 
> I tried it today on my drive home. Pretty cool to have it added, and it works!


Thanks sir! Exactly what I wanted to know.


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> I don't know what a bi-quad is. All I see are 6 bands. I have 13 now and it's not enough.


Do you have a tuning mic? If you have some measurements in REW (and that means 6 to 8 with the mic moved slightly each time and averaged together) of your drivers playing individually you can load them up, click on the EQ button and select minidsp as your eq.

Specify what kind of driver it is and roughly how you want it to look, or better yet load a house curve file (check out jazzi's excel spreadsheet for more info on that). Tell it what frequency range to adjust, set the level so that you're mostly just cutting rather than boosting and hit go.

The predicted response is typically very accurate.


----------



## lazzer408

ninetysix said:


> Do you have a tuning mic? If you have some measurements in REW (and that means 6 to 8 with the mic moved slightly each time and averaged together) of your drivers playing individually you can load them up, click on the EQ button and select minidsp as your eq.
> 
> Specify what kind of driver it is and roughly how you want it to look, or better yet load a house curve file (check out jazzi's excel spreadsheet for more info on that). Tell it what frequency range to adjust, set the level so that you're mostly just cutting rather than boosting and hit go.
> 
> The predicted response is typically very accurate.


Yes I have a mic and REW. What's the house curve?


----------



## Lanson

lazzer408 said:


> Yes I have a mic and REW. What's the house curve?


I'll take point on this question, by referring you to this awesome thread

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...first-timers-guide-measuring-your-system.html

And I'll go find Jazzi's companion thread
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...1-jazzis-tuning-companion-room-eq-wizard.html

And there's one floating around about house curves, take a look around.

BTW, a biquad is a bi-quadratic function. This amazing youtube video made the concept pop into my head perfectly
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnpkBE4kJ6Q

Once you understand it, you'll be unstoppable.


----------



## t0n33

ninetysix said:


> So can you switch to sub volume, adjust it then switch back to master volume and the sub will stay at that same level relative to master volume?
> 
> I'm curious if it does it by adjusting the level of the sub outputs


Yes, I think that's how it works. I assume after a power off it reverts to the preset level, but now that I write that it makes me wonder if it can store/restore the sub level just like it does master volume after power cycle.


----------



## ninetysix

Jazzi and Hanatsu have done some awesome work right there 

If the house curve concept is new to you, you can worry about it later. Just have a go at auto EQing some of your previous measurements with minidsp selected. Though it does work best with a house curve for the driver in question with crossovers enabled and the driver playing it's passband plus about an octave either side of the crossover points.

But whatever dsp you buy or don't buy, using house curves is basically mandatory if you're running your drivers active. Deviating from a true linkwitz-riley crossover roll off (regardless of what crossover you're actually using) can make for a nasty transition from driver to driver. It also makes it much easier to get the drivers correctly in phase.


----------



## ninetysix

t0n33 said:


> Yes, I think that's how it works. I assume after a power off it reverts to the preset level, but now that I write that it makes me wonder if it can store/restore the sub level just like it does master volume after power cycle.


Thanks, I'll check it out.

That's something I wish it wouldn't do. Often while trying to forget the day I spent at work I've got it cranked till I pull up in my driveway, then the next morning it wakes everybody up at 6am 

My AVR in the house has a default power on volume I've got set to -40dB which means you never get a surprise when turning it on.

While I'm at it, it would be nice if they had a filter on the volume control, sometimes one imperfect click of the volume knob can adjust it by 30dB either way, like it's bouncing on the contact and registering each and every impulse as a true command... Nobody can turn the knob that quick


----------



## Lanson

Yep, think of the house curve as your targeted ideal response, instead of a ruler-flat response. You can use it for almost anything and everything. We don't want a purely flat response in the car typically...it is a boring sound!


----------



## lazzer408

I understand is how to look at an RTA (or a sweep) and adjust the EQ accordingly. I watched the video and understand how the filters work but that knowledge seems more suited to an engineer then an end user. Take Microsoft Windows for example. I don't need to understand programming code or CPU architecture to use it. I just point and click. That's what I liked about the DSP88R, DSP8, or DEW.8. Very easy to use. Point and click. That was close enough for me. Another analogy would be if one were trying to understand how to connect their home theater system and was provided the answer "learn electronics and how to design an amplifier and you'll be unstopable". That would be true, but that's significantly more involved.

That said, I understand the C-DSP is a very powerful tool when used in conjunction with measurement software that can provide compatible data.

How many bands of EQ does the C-DSP actually have?


----------



## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> Yep, think of the house curve as your targeted ideal response, instead of a ruler-flat response. You can use it for almost anything and everything. We don't want a purely flat response in the car typically...it is a boring sound!


Plus if you try to get each driver ruler flat across and beyond it's passband, then enable crossovers and do the rest with input EQ and levels... Well you run out of EQ pretty quickly!


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> I understand is how to look at an RTA (or a sweep) and adjust the EQ accordingly. I watched the video and understand how the filters work but that knowledge seems more suited to an engineer then an end user. Take Microsoft Windows for example. I don't need to understand programming code or CPU architecture to use it. I just point and click. That's what I liked about the DSP88R, DSP8, or DEW.8. Very easy to use. Point and click. That was close enough for me. Another analogy would be if one were trying to understand how to connect their home theater system and was provided the answer "learn electronics and how to design an amplifier and you'll be unstopable". That would be true, but that's significantly more involved.
> 
> That said, I understand the C-DSP is a very powerful tool when used in conjunction with measurement software that can provide compatible data.
> 
> How many bands of EQ does the C-DSP actually have?


You really don't have to learn anything. Use jazzi's sheet to determine how you want your response to look with your choice of crossovers, it creates house curve files you load into REW.

Take (several) measurements of each driver, then one driver at a time you load the house curve for that driver, click the EQ tab, tell it what range to fix and hit the calculate button. It creates an EQ file that you import directly into the minidsp software.

Done. Frequency response and levels all sorted in one fell swoop  I think you'll find the software is quite easy to use. Here's a link to an earlier version of the software if you wish to play around with it. The UI hasn't changed with newer versions.


----------



## Lanson

lazzer408 said:


> I understand is how to look at an RTA (or a sweep) and adjust the EQ accordingly. I watched the video and understand how the filters work but that knowledge seems more suited to an engineer then an end user. Take Microsoft Windows for example. I don't need to understand programming code or CPU architecture to use it. I just point and click. That's what I liked about the DSP88R, DSP8, or DEW.8. Very easy to use. Point and click. That was close enough for me. Another analogy would be if one were trying to understand how to connect their home theater system and was provided the answer "learn electronics and how to design an amplifier and you'll be unstopable". That would be true, but that's significantly more involved.
> 
> That said, I understand the C-DSP is a very powerful tool when used in conjunction with measurement software that can provide compatible data.
> 
> How many bands of EQ does the C-DSP actually have?


When we talk about bands of EQ, that's not really how it goes. Yes, it has 6 "bands", but those aren't bands, they are as we mentioned, the biquads. They go at any frequency, at any slope and any cut or boost, can overlap and they can also shelve instead of create a dip or hump. So it is 6 "bands" but that's just within the pass-band of that particular channel you're working with. You can make 6 "adjustments" more like, to the response, per channel. And those adjustments are nearly infinite in their ability to tweak, so it is nearly infinite control per channel. You need an ultra-wide cut across, but need one spot cut heavily too? That's just two of your 6. Like I said, and I showed in my video (the Vette), you'll very likely only use 2 or 3 of the biquads per channel output, so there's tons of processing ability remaining. The "bands" don't matter, you just decide where the cut or dip needs to go (frequency), set the peak or dip, and set the Q of that, as in how wide or narrow. So, like a PEQ but if you wanted one at 600hz, and then needed another one at 650hz, that's just fine. Four to go! The REW software auto-determines how those need to be set up, test it now with REW in a practice environment, you'll see it before you buy.

edit: You'll find RTA 31 band EQ'ing (like the old-school red dot type) is completely behind the times compared with biquad parametric type control. Need to cut a super-narrow band because of some vehicle shaping causing it? You can do that. Need to fix a shallow but wide issue across an octave or two? No problem. A 31 band can create a bunch of dips and peaks but a powerful biquad setup can make it SO smooth, comparatively.


----------



## lazzer408

Here's a sweep of my car. No EQ. No TA. I'm sure much of this is comb filtering. But just as an example, how would a C-DSP smooth this with only 6 bands?


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> Here's a sweep of my car. No EQ. No TA. I'm sure much of this is comb filtering. But just as an example, how would a C-DSP smooth this with only 6 bands?


That's remarkably flat for no processing.

Are you running active or passive? How many drivers, like 2 way plus sub or 3 way plus sub?

As has been said already, you need to look at one driver at a time. The dsp has 8 output channels, so use them. If your setup was a sub and a set of passive 2 way components off a 2 channel amp, then maybe you would be better off with a 31 band EQ. Or buying a 4 channel amp while you've got your wallet out, and ditching the passives.

But assuming you're going to use at least 6 of the 8 outputs, measure just the sub in its passband. If your low pass is 80hz, I usually measure about 5-300Hz with two sweeps in REW. Then midbass, say they run 80 to 350hz I measure 40-1000hz. For mids running 350-4000Hz measure 150-9000Hz, then measure tweeters from about 2k-24k.

Now you've got 6 measurements plus one for the sub. Each of the 8 outputs has 6 fully independent biquads, so you auto EQ each of them and you might just find when played together it's pretty well spot on. If you've still got issues, use the input EQ to fine tune.


----------



## Lanson

First concern is, do you want it flat, really? Most target curves are a gentle slope downward. Otherwise looks like a great starting point. Remember, the 6 biquads are per channel. If you have a 3-way system + sub, that's potentially 6 x 4 = 24 points of control across per side. I think first thing I would do is get close to your target curve (not a flat line) with just level matching, and THEN let REW get to business with the C-DSP


----------



## lazzer408

ninetysix said:


> That's remarkably flat for no processing.
> 
> Are you running active or passive? How many drivers, like 2 way plus sub or 3 way plus sub?


I have 8" woofers in the door, 1" domes in the factory pod (by the side-view mirrors), 6x9s in the rear deck, and two 8" subs in a ported box in the trunk. Fronts and rears are both 2-way passive. I tried half a dozen front woofers before finding some that worked well as a 2-way. Front crossovers I built. Nothing too fancy. 3.5k at 12dB/oct. Slight -3dB correction at 6k. Low end response doesn't roll off like in the graph. To my ears, it's pretty flat down to 30hz.

I tuned the system by ear before I swept it. I got pretty close.


----------



## lazzer408

fourthmeal said:


> First concern is, do you want it flat, really? Most target curves are a gentle slope downward. Otherwise looks like a great starting point. Remember, the 6 biquads are per channel. If you have a 3-way system + sub, that's potentially 6 x 4 = 24 points of control across per side. I think first thing I would do is get close to your target curve (not a flat line) with just level matching, and THEN let REW get to business with the C-DSP


Yes. I want it flat. Any curve in response was done on the mixing board when the music was recorded.


----------



## Lanson

lazzer408 said:


> Yes. I want it flat. Any curve in response was done on the mixing board when the music was recorded.



That's.....not how in car power response works. Edit: Or your ears.

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/acoustic-basis-harman-listener-target-curve

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/stu...going-here-flat-response-sounds-terrible.html


----------



## bnae38

Reflections/ small size of car boost perceived loudness of higher frequencies substantially. Pretty sure you'll want a downward slope. Flat response sounds good in a large room.


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> I have 8" woofers in the door, 1" domes in the factory pod (by the side-view mirrors), 6x9s in the rear deck, and two 8" subs in a ported box in the trunk. Fronts and rears are both 2-way passive. I tried half a dozen front woofers before finding some that worked well as a 2-way. Front crossovers I built. Nothing too fancy. 3.5k at 12dB/oct. Slight -3dB correction at 6k. Low end response doesn't roll off like in the graph. To my ears, it's pretty flat down to 30hz.
> 
> I tuned the system by ear before I swept it. I got pretty close.


Is your intention to keep the passives on the fronts? It would be an awful shame to have a pair of channels doing nothing.


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> Yes. I want it flat. Any curve in response was done on the mixing board when the music was recorded.


I don't even like it that flat in an acoustic environment far more ideal than a car.

Pretty sure the mixing board doesn't take engine noise, exhaust noise and road noise into account, buy hey it's a democracy


----------



## lazzer408

I aim for flat, or as flat as I can get, frequency response at the drivers listening position. This would account for the/most/some environmental impacts. A car is a disaster for audio reproduction. If I need to add some personal adjustments later, I can use a simple method like the headunit's adjustments, or a 6 band EQ. 

My first reason for needing the DSP is time alignment. I'm keeping the factory radio which happens to have a flat response over a line-level differential pair. Lucky me.

The second reason is for EQ functions. Seems a waste to only have 6 bands. Maybe I can combine a few outputs to give me 12 bands each (L&R) on the fronts, 6 on the rears, and 6 on the subs.


----------



## Elgrosso

It is flat indeed, especially without EQ, but still with this scale there is 20db variation around 500HZ and 5 to 10db everywhere.
Did you measure all drivers including rears? 

But I kind of understand your point about flat (I like flatter than most here).
As I don't think I’m that different than other buddies it must be a mix of personal preference and car effect.


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> I aim for flat, or as flat as I can get, frequency response at the drivers listening position. This would account for the/most/some environmental impacts. A car is a disaster for audio reproduction. If I need to add some personal adjustments later, I can use a simple method like the headunit's adjustments, or a 6 band EQ.
> 
> My first reason for needing the DSP is time alignment. I'm keeping the factory radio which happens to have a flat response over a line-level differential pair. Lucky me.
> 
> The second reason is for EQ functions. Seems a waste to only have 6 bands. Maybe I can combine a few outputs to give me 12 bands each (L&R) on the fronts, 6 on the rears, and 6 on the subs.


Is that measurement you posted earlier from just one side or both? Got any single driver measurements, with crossover applied?


----------



## lazzer408

Elgrosso said:


> It is flat indeed, especially without EQ, but still with this scale there is 20db variation around 500HZ and 5 to 10db everywhere.
> Did you measure all drivers including rears?
> 
> But I kind of understand your point about flat (I like flatter than most here).
> As I don't think I’m that different than other buddies it must be a mix of personal preference and car effect.


I placed the mic at the driver's head position. Smoothing was 1/12th. I forget if I mentioned that. Time alignment will likely smooth it out a bit.

I prefer flat. I didn't 25 years ago. As I began to use better equipment, I broke free from using an EQ. Personal preference is definitely one factor that can not be calculated. Even myself. From one day to the next I find myself making adjustments.


----------



## Elgrosso

lazzer408 said:


> I placed the mic at the driver's head position. Smoothing was 1/12th. I forget if I mentioned that. Time alignment will likely smooth it out a bit.
> 
> I prefer flat. I didn't 25 years ago. As I began to use better equipment, I broke free from using an EQ. Personal preference is definitely one factor that can not be calculated. Even myself. From one day to the next I find myself making adjustments.


1/12th should be pretty revealing, but you mean 1 point of measurement? With or without rearfill, both sides etc?
I don't know about others, but when I used to measure everything at once it looked pretty good 

Yeah maybe age is another factor for the flat thing. Although I’d say that while aging I appreciate more and more the sub. But not loud, just where it needs to be. (hearing compensation? )
Also, I definitely don't care as much as before about how the curves looks like now... the target, flat or not, is just a tool, not my goal


----------



## ninetysix

lazzer408 said:


> ... From one day to the next I find myself making adjustments.


You might prefer a DSP with a fully featured remote if you like tweaking things on the go, c-dsp is laptop only for tuning


----------



## Lanson

Not hearing compensation, its a natural thing since our ears have lower sensitivity in the lower frequencies. Fletcher Munson curve I believe its called.

Anyway, aside from the way you want your house curve to look like, I'm going to assume you measured from more than one point of measurement. If you haven't, you aren't getting the complete picture and then I would urge you to re-read the excellent article put together by Hanatsu on the subject of measuring points. 

Once we get a REAL average of the listening position, we can move forward. You'll be able to see what the expected result of the C-DSP will be, before purchasing. 

There seems to be a few fundamental flaws that need to be worked out first, in your plan though. For one, a passive 8" and 1" combo doesn't make sense in an active crossover environment. So that may need to be redone from the ground up. You will be able to take advantage of extremely steep slopes with the C-DSP, in an active arrangement. This will also increase the amount of taps (biquad points) by double, which is important potentially.


----------



## Velozity

The MiniDSP is certainly powerful enough to tame the curve lazzer posted. Here is my system measured before and after EQ, with psychoacoustic smoothing applied. The red line is with crossovers but without T/A or EQ. The green line is after T/A and output EQ to level match the drivers, and a house curve on the input EQ. After driving with it for a while I decided to tune again so the blue line is from my most recent setting with some changes to my input EQ and adding some biquads in the form of all-pass filters. I still have a few more tweaks to make but overall I'm happy with what this processor can do.

By the way, my system does not have tweeters .


----------



## lazzer408

Elgrosso said:


> 1/12th should be pretty revealing, but you mean 1 point of measurement? With or without rearfill, both sides etc?


Yes just one mic at the drivers seat with all speakers playing. Rear level is -6dB lower then fronts.


----------



## Lanson

lazzer408 said:


> Yes just one mic at the drivers seat with all speakers playing. Rear level is -6dB lower then fronts.


You need to re-measure, you need an average of a reasonable space. You have two ears, and you move in the vehicle.

I used the method explained by Hanatsu and have had EXCELLENT results. Remember, the slightest movement of the head changes the response dramatically in a vehicle, at the mid-higher range. So, running REW with an AVERAGE response graphed is key. And the amount of mic sweeps relative left ear to right ear also matters. Like I said, Hanatsu had a great article on this.

edit, specifically this post

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/2097925-post16.html


----------



## ninetysix

fourthmeal said:


> You need to re-measure, you need an average of a reasonable space. You have two ears, and you move in the vehicle.


And only _one driver_ or _one passive pair_ at a time


----------



## t0n33

t0n33 said:


> Yes, I think that's how it works. I assume after a power off it reverts to the preset level, but now that I write that it makes me wonder if it can store/restore the sub level just like it does master volume after power cycle.


My assumption was wrong, I confirmed, the sub level does get saved just like the master volume to persist and resume across power cycles where it was left. 

And a good surprise, it also remembers which sub out configuration you choose, so next time you power up and hold 1 & 2, it goes directly to the previous choice, eg subs on 7 & 8 for me, no messing with button 4 again. Then hold 1 & 2 again to jump back to master volume. Rinse and repeat! Nice! The added control is great, wish it had the level indicator LEDs the original manual showed, but still cool. I do wish the LEDs would stop flashing on sub adjust mode, it's a bit distracting in the dark to leave on like I'd like to do.

I think it adjusted the channel level, and I can't tell if the sub knob max is the preset level, or the actual max output of the channel. Should be easy to test.

Overall, I'm thrilled to have bought from minidsp company that continues to improve their product! Maybe there is hope for a fletcher Munson curve compensation multiplier setting with the master volume knob!


----------



## t0n33

t0n33 said:


> My assumption was wrong, I confirmed, the sub level does get saved just like the master volume to persist and resume across power cycles where it was left.
> 
> And a good surprise, it also remembers which sub out configuration you choose, so next time you power up and hold 1 & 2, it goes directly to the previous choice, eg subs on 7 & 8 for me, no messing with button 4 again. Then hold 1 & 2 again to jump back to master volume. Rinse and repeat! Nice! The added control is great, wish it had the level indicator LEDs the original manual showed, but still cool. I do wish the LEDs would stop flashing on sub adjust mode, it's a bit distracting in the dark to leave on like I'd like to do.
> 
> I think it adjusted the channel level, and I can't tell if the sub knob max is the preset level, or the actual max output of the channel. Should be easy to test.
> 
> Overall, I'm thrilled to have bought from minidsp company that continues to improve their product! Maybe there is hope for a fletcher Munson curve compensation multiplier setting with the master volume knob!


I was wrong again. While it does remember the sub mode you selected, when you exit select mode, the knob stays in sub level adjust INSTEAD of master volume. You have hold 1 &2 and use 4 to cycle back to adjust volume again. On the plus side, this means you can stop the flashing during sub adjust, but it's not as convenient as I thought to do both volume and sub levels


----------



## Lanson

ninetysix said:


> And only _one driver_ or _one passive pair_ at a time


Exactly!

Although I will add this comment, I've had success in using an MS-8's "total response" when doing sweeps and measuring in REW, which aided me in tuning up the MS-8's 31 band EQ. I had to average the difference between left and right when I adjusted the band, but acoustically, it worked GREAT and sounds great too. It measures fairly well, too, but that's not important.


----------



## ninetysix

I guess it's pretty cool that with a mic, REW and the correct measurements you can see exactly what the product can do for you, before opening your wallet. Something minidsp could well use as marketing.


----------



## ninetysix

On another topic... I've picked up a NanoAVR HD for my home hi-fi setup, so all my sources need to be HDMI. Previously I would stream tidal from either a laptop or my phone through a SMSL spdif card.

I picked up a Chromecast 2 (hdmi version, not audio) and it seems to do a great job. Using the tidal app it automatically sets the sampling rate to 44.1kHz, something that could only be done with USB audio player pro with a usb device. To be frank, the UI on UAPP sucks compared to tidal, though I appreciate the developers efforts. It's also a pain not to be able to hear notifications, navigation alerts or be able to charge at the same time.

So that got me thinking about using a Chromecast with a HDMI audio stripper (under $20 to about $60 on eBay) to supply coax spdif to my c-dsp. Whether or not it steps on the signal remains to be seen, but at that price it's worth a shot 

I have a meanwell isolated dc-dc 12 to 5V 3A power supply to power the Chromecast and hdmi stripper, and the Chromecast happily connects to my phone's hotspot while also casting to it. iOS users might not be quite so lucky, but I think there might be other ways around that.

Will post an update once the hdmi stripper arrives.


----------



## Will_D

I'm trying to install my new C-DSP and am having a brain fart when trying to figure out the remote in/out. I'm using hi-level inputs and have the C-DSP powered from a fused line off of my distribution block. Do I need a remote turn on at all? 
If I want to use the Remote out to turn on 2 amps do I need a remote turn on then, along with moving the jumper inside the unit?


----------



## ninetysix

To be fair the manual really didn't explain much about the remote jumper.

Do you have a remote wire from your head unit?

If so, just wire that to the remote in terminal, don't touch the jumper and wire the remote out from the dsp to your amps. I don't use the remote out though, i just run the remote wire from the head unit (or ignition if unavailable) to the dsp and amps in parallel as it was causing a noise issue in both of my c-dsp equipped cars.

Moving the jumper is only required if you want the dsp to turn on when it gets 12v on the power terminals, which isn't what you want with it powered from your d-block


----------



## Will_D

ninetysix said:


> To be fair the manual really didn't explain much about the remote jumper.
> 
> Do you have a remote wire from your head unit?


Couldn't agree more about the manual being pretty useless when it comes to the general install. 
I'm using my factory head unit, 2016 F150 (Sync, Non-Sony), so I'll have to run a remote turn on from a keyed power fuse. I'll go ahead and just run the remote turn on straight to the amps and not worry about the remote out on the DSP.


----------



## oliverlim

Is there any updates on a revised New model that will accept fir eq?


----------



## cadeet

Quick question about t/a & eq'ing. I have inputs 3&4 running out of 7&8. This goes to my single dual voice coil sub. When imputing any t/a or eq settings for the sub, do I need to add it to both output channels (7&8)? For example, if I add 3ms delay, do I need to input 3ms into 7&8? And if I have -5db @ 40hz, do I input that into both as well? Or would it be 1.5ms & -2.5db in each?


----------



## ninetysix

cadeet said:


> Quick question about t/a & eq'ing. I have inputs 3&4 running out of 7&8. This goes to my single dual voice coil sub. When imputing any t/a or eq settings for the sub, do I need to add it to both output channels (7&8)? For example, if I add 3ms delay, do I need to input 3ms into 7&8? And if I have -5db @ 40hz, do I input that into both as well? Or would it be 1.5ms & -2.5db in each?


I apply the same delay and and EQ (you can link EQ adjustments together in the software) to both channels for my sub channels 7&8.


----------



## Lanson

cadeet said:


> Quick question about t/a & eq'ing. I have inputs 3&4 running out of 7&8. This goes to my single dual voice coil sub. When imputing any t/a or eq settings for the sub, do I need to add it to both output channels (7&8)? For example, if I add 3ms delay, do I need to input 3ms into 7&8? And if I have -5db @ 40hz, do I input that into both as well? Or would it be 1.5ms & -2.5db in each?


IMO the smartest thing to do would be just use channel 7 and leave 8 mute. You can clone channels, but there's no need with a sub. You can use a y cord from the processor to the amp if you need to, but most amps don't care.


----------



## ninetysix

My alpine sub amp needs to have two rcas plugged into it, either two channels or one channel with a Y-adaptor according to the manual.

I can't tell any difference between using a Y-adaptor and using a pair of rcas from two channels, other than visually my rcas are of a far higher quality than the Y-adaptor adaptor that I found in a junk pile on a construction site.

My Alpine seems to do a good job of summing the channels too, I route L to 7 and R to 8 either from an spdif source or the stereo rca pair from my headunit. 

I would say go with convenience, which ever setup doesn't require new parts to be purchased. With a Y-adaptor, the 8th channel will likely end up doing nothing though as there isn't much you can do with it in most setups and no centre channel plugins for the c-dsp.


----------



## t0n33

Fwiw, On my cheap 5 channel amp I benefited from the additional gain running both channel 7 and 8 into my amp's stereo RCA sub inputs rather than just one input and using the amp's sub mono switch.


----------



## Elgrosso

For few weeks I used dual sub and dual midbass channels just because I didn't bother to buy some Y cables (so 2xsub, 2xLM & 2xRM bridged, and 2highs).
Now I have the Y... but I keep using the same setup 
Looks cleaner in the trunk, looks cleaner in the plugin (all around 0db out to match the horns). And I’m just so used to duplicate all settings.
I know it's idiotic 

Also the sub like that it’s easier to tune with APL/Dirac that wants only 2ch full range. So one sub channel is L, other is R in routing.

Another thing, I once tried to use 12 PEQS per driver.
By splitting the bandpass in 2, with a super steep slope, that summed into the amp.
6+6 PEQS each, and it worked! I think it could work very well on a long FR band.


----------



## cadeet

Yeah my Pioneer AVH-4100nex head unit sends outL&R for the sub & my Pioneer GM-D9605 amp has L&R for the sub as well. So I was assuming the two channels were just summed in the amp.


----------



## packmule

I'm considering a MiniDSP 2x4 or C-DSP for my simple system, but I have a few questions. Here's what I have:


1999 Subaru Legacy wagon
JVC KD-R520 head unit, front+rear 2.5v pre-outs
Precision Power PC2300 (2x75, 4 ohm)
Diamond Audio Hex DA6.6 passive components (woofer in stock lower door location, tweeters in stock sails)
Single sub / mono amp TBD (likely a Type R 12 @ 2 ohm & PPI P1000.1)

Questions:


Are there advantages or disadvantages to applying EQ to the input vs output? 
My front stage is passive and will stay that way for the time being. My tweeters and woofers aren't co-located, so is it a waste of time to time align my front stage as is? I could relocate the tweets to lower in the door, but I wonder how that would affect the stage height / image. 
Given my simple 2.1 system, I think a 2x4 and DC Isolator would do the trick rather than the more full-featured C-DSP. Two channels in, L+R+Sub out. Am I missing something besides the increased flexibility and processing power of the C-DSP?
Some posts on DYIMA mention the lower 2v max pre-out voltage as a weakness. As long as I dial in my gain structure correctly with a scope, voltmeter and REW, what am I missing? My HU doesn't supply a hot output voltage...


----------



## N3ost

IS this something me as a person new to DSP (not car audio) should attempt? I am tech savvy but don't want to get over my head with a device I am not going to be able to use. 

My setup is not all that atypical components up front from factory source 
4 Sundown audio SA 8 V3 in the hatch. two amps technically need 5 channels only.


----------



## dcfis

What kind of noise?



ninetysix said:


> To be fair the manual really didn't explain much about the remote jumper.
> 
> Do you have a remote wire from your head unit?
> 
> If so, just wire that to the remote in terminal, don't touch the jumper and wire the remote out from the dsp to your amps. I don't use the remote out though, i just run the remote wire from the head unit (or ignition if unavailable) to the dsp and amps in parallel as it was causing a noise issue in both of my c-dsp equipped cars.
> 
> Moving the jumper is only required if you want the dsp to turn on when it gets 12v on the power terminals, which isn't what you want with it powered from your d-block


----------



## chuyler1

So I've had this C-DSP sitting in my office for almost a year. I need to get it installed but I have some questions...

1) What is the best solution for getting bluetooth audio from my iPhone into the unit, assuming I use the remote for volume. I have a Himbox HB01 right now wired into my factory radio. I was thinking putting it directly into the C-DSP instead, but then I noticed the SPDIF connection and figured someone on here likely has a better solution. I'm not opposed to a hard line into the SPDIF instead of Bluetooth...if that is an option. 

2) I have the a MS8 in my other vehicle, so I have those headphones it came with. Can they be used for tuning the C-DSP? I also have a ECM8000 and a MXL Mic Mate USB adapter. It's a bit cumbersome but I can use that as well, I've just never had much luck with getting good results from it, which was partly why I just went with the self tuning MS8 in my daily driver.


----------



## EmptyKim

chuyler1 said:


> So I've had this C-DSP sitting in my office for almost a year. I need to get it installed but I have some questions...
> 
> 1) What is the best solution for getting bluetooth audio from my iPhone into the unit, assuming I use the remote for volume. I have a Himbox HB01 right now wired into my factory radio. I was thinking putting it directly into the C-DSP instead, but then I noticed the SPDIF connection and figured someone on here likely has a better solution. I'm not opposed to a hard line into the SPDIF instead of Bluetooth...if that is an option.
> 
> 2) I have the a MS8 in my other vehicle, so I have those headphones it came with. Can they be used for tuning the C-DSP? I also have a ECM8000 and a MXL Mic Mate USB adapter. It's a bit cumbersome but I can use that as well, I've just never had much luck with getting good results from it, which was partly why I just went with the self tuning MS8 in my daily driver.


1. Not sure. There are guys that have for sure done this. You can probably find a bluetooth adapter with coaxial out. I would think. For "hard line" there are many that have done this with the Apple Lightning to USB 3 camera adapter and a USB to Coax adapter. 

2. I think people have used EMC8000 mics. Most use Dayton MIC or the UMIK-1 from minidsp.


----------



## ricren

Where did you guys bought the 6x8? Madisound? MiniDSP web page? The miniDSP page is cheaper but says nothing about shipping delay. Any suggestion on where to buy it?
thanks.


----------



## EmptyKim

ricren said:


> Where did you guys bought the 6x8? Madisound? MiniDSP web page? The miniDSP page is cheaper but says nothing about shipping delay. Any suggestion on where to buy it?
> thanks.


I bought mine from miniDSP. Shipping was pretty fast. Ordered 2/25/16, delivered 2/29/16.


----------



## ricren

EmptyKim said:


> I bought mine from miniDSP. Shipping was pretty fast. Ordered 2/25/16, delivered 2/29/16.


HI, thanks for your answer. Did you choose the $20 shipping charge?


----------



## chuyler1

I ordered directly from MiniDSP website, but that was a year ago.


----------



## EmptyKim

ricren said:


> HI, thanks for your answer. Did you choose the $20 shipping charge?


Yes.


----------



## ricren

ok, thanks.


----------



## tRidiot

I ordered direct as well and paid the $20 and had it within a week.


----------



## ricren

Good to know. Thanks.


----------



## t0n33

I noticed a new minidsp cDSP 8x12 on their website yesterday. Priced at $499 but sounds like they upgraded quality added features for proper center channel and rear fill sum and differences. Neato  https://www.minidsp.com/products/car-audio-dsp/c-dsp-8x12

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


----------



## chuyler1

Nice, I could definitely make use of a center channel option.


----------



## ricren

Says nothing about what ADC/DAC are using. No mention about plug in compatibility.


----------



## dgage

ricren said:


> Says nothing about what ADC/DAC are using. No mention about plug in compatibility.


I wasn't sure by reading but if you're thinking the center and rear capabilities are going to be available on the 6x8, I don't have inside knowledge but I doubt we'll see those capabilities trickle down. As with the 2x4 and 2x4 HD, the additional capabilities are usually due to upgrading the processing chip. The 6x8 has a 172MHz 28/56 bit processor while the 8x12 has a 400MHz 32bit Sharc Floating point processor so there is definitely a disparity in the processing power available.


----------



## ricren

True, but center and rear fill extraction are processes that need very few DSP resources. They could do it if they want, but I also do not see it coming.


----------



## stixzerjan

Hi guys, i just have a question. Let say you run your Rew auto Eq and fill up the numbers. Example 1 channel, u use up to 4 filters. If its doesnt sound right yet, are you going to measure again with the 4 filters ON? If rew giving you another 4 filters, how are we going to input it into our dsp? Cos minidsp only have 6 filters per channel

Sent from my ASUS_Z00AD using Tapatalk


----------



## Elgrosso

Ha no if you do that the new filters will be «*fake*»  (based on inexistent response
). If you want to stack filters you can use input and output EQ.

But if you use the right setting in REW (in EQ tab, top right) the autoEQ should be able to use up to 6 PEQS.


----------



## Swaglife81

I really like the price point on this dsp vs the competition. Seems in reviews the cheaper DSPs from PPI, Cadence, Audio Control guys are having issues and bugs. Is the mini that diamond in the rough dsp for the $300 or less range. I'm budgeted and can't really go all out on a dsp with everything I have planned with my car and non acoustic mods/maintenance. I'm spending around 5K with the audio, tires, wheels, etc all together so $300 is about my limit on a dsp.

How is the software. I love the look and setup of Helix software, it's perfect in my eyes. Does minidsp have a good, intuitive well thought out software ?


----------



## rton20s

For the money, you aren't likely to find a better option new. If you are willing to look at used, you might find some decent options in your price range.


----------



## UncleHungry

I didn’t see If anybody answered this for sure but the 8x12 definitely does rear L-R. I did it yesterday.


----------



## wooblexXx

Hi everyone. 
I bought this c-dsp a year earlier, and i'm just planning to install it in the coming weeks. Do you have any useful advice for its installation? I've seen some issues about a coil in the dsp but do i need to fix it or is there somethong to verify inside the box?? 

Thanks for your help (from France  )


----------



## bnae38

wooblexXx said:


> Hi everyone.
> I bought this c-dsp a year earlier, and i'm just planning to install it in the coming weeks. Do you have any useful advice for its installation? I've seen some issues about a coil in the dsp but do i need to fix it or is there somethong to verify inside the box??
> 
> Thanks for your help (from France  )


I made the pics. I would open it and add a piece of kapton. Pretty simple.


----------



## wooblexXx

Thanks but your pics are not available anymore :/
May you post it again please ?

Other advices ? For example do i need to update the cdsp or anything else ?? I was very busy this year due to my job so i didn't follow the topic, and in France nobody has this dsp oO

Thankss


----------



## bnae38

wooblexXx said:


> Thanks but your pics are not available anymore :/
> May you post it again please ?
> 
> Other advices ? For example do i need to update the cdsp or anything else ?? I was very busy this year due to my job so i didn't follow the topic, and in France nobody has this dsp oO
> 
> Thankss


https://imgur.com/a/DM7dJ
That's all I would do, don't need to unsolder it though


----------



## wooblexXx

Thank you it works well for the pics.

Your coil did a short circuit before you placed the kapton ?

So you advise me to dismantle the coil, place few electrical insulator like on your pics, replace the coil and that's it ?

EDIT: ok i can do it without unsoldering the coil that's a good thing ! 

What about the update of the dsp ? I know the subwoofer level has been introduced in an update so how can i do ? 

I'm sorry if i'm asking too much questions but like i said i can't find help anywhere else and i dont understand everything so i have to double check with you ^^

Thanksss


----------



## bnae38

Correct, just place a piece of kapton under it. It's high temp and fairly durable. Spools are cheap enough on amazon.. Just don't buy super thin. I edited that post like 4x.. sorry. No need to remove, gently bend it up and slip tape under.

Mini can hook you up with software to update, just email support if you're unable to find it elsewhere. They'll grant you access for free.


----------



## wooblexXx

Hi here are some pics of the guts of my cdsp. I seem to have the corrected version whith this white glue a the center of the coil. Can you confirm it ? I really prefer not to modify this if i have not to do it.
But in fact the coil is really close to the board.
At the back of the board there is enough space from the chassis of the dsp i think

Then for the upgrade, it's written on minidsp website that the sd card deserves to upgrade the unit without a laptop, but it looks like i have to have one because when i plugged the dsp to my laptop, nothing happened :/

Thanks !!


----------



## wooblexXx

I saw on minidsp forum that the micro sd card is needed to update the cdsp there isn't an other way.
Is there any caracteristic to respect about the choice of the micro sd card ? 2go is enough ? I saw that the firmware was cery light but i prefer to ask. 

Can someone check out the pictures i sent in my previous message to tell me if i have the '' right'' version of the cdsp please.
Thank you


----------



## Jairow

I just received my cdsp and it's installed already. I might work on it this weekend to do some cable management. If I do I'll take a picture of the inside and post it here for your reference. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## wooblexXx

Thank you  but some people know this here... But they don't answer... I take 2 minutes ^^


----------



## wooblexXx

Jairow said:


> I just received my cdsp and it's installed already. I might work on it this weekend to do some cable management. If I do I'll take a picture of the inside and post it here for your reference.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hello ?
Have you been able to do some pics of your cdsp ??

Thank you


----------



## Jairow

No, sorry. Have to take out my back seat and just haven't had an opportunity to do that. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Jairow

Ok, here are some pics of the inside of my mini dsp 6 x 8




















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## bnae38

wooblexXx said:


> Hi here are some pics of the guts of my cdsp. I seem to have the corrected version whith this white glue a the center of the coil. Can you confirm it ? I really prefer not to modify this if i have not to do it.
> But in fact the coil is really close to the board.
> At the back of the board there is enough space from the chassis of the dsp i think
> 
> Then for the upgrade, it's written on minidsp website that the sd card deserves to upgrade the unit without a laptop, but it looks like i have to have one because when i plugged the dsp to my laptop, nothing happened :/
> 
> Thanks !!



Sry for not getting back to you, yeah looks like it's glued off the surface of the board and wont have an opportunity to rub/short to the via.

Seems ok to me


----------



## bnae38

Jairow said:


> Ok, here are some pics of the inside of my mini dsp 6 x 8
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Cool, would appear to me they've taken care on the newer units to avoid the shorting problem.


----------



## wooblexXx

Ok it's not the same for your unit and mine but i'll try like this 
Do you know what the pins on the board are made for ?? There are few connectors not plugged... Maybe we can add some features


----------



## wooblexXx

At the bottom of your first picture for example


----------



## bnae38

wooblexXx said:


> Ok it's not the same for your unit and mine but i'll try like this
> Do you know what the pins on the board are made for ?? There are few connectors not plugged... Maybe we can add some features


Probably programming or factory test.


----------



## hockeythug

So I just got mine and was reading up on REW and was going through some guides. Is it still correct that up to two of the filters will be manual for crossovers? Or was REW updated since Hanatsu's guide? That part was the only confusing part for me.


----------



## Elgrosso

Hey! Wifi dongle for the 6x8 and few others lile 2x8, I might try soon: https://www.minidsp.com/products/accessories/wi-dg


----------



## 89grand

Elgrosso said:


> Hey! Wifi dongle for the 6x8 and few others lile 2x8, I might try soon: https://www.minidsp.com/products/accessories/wi-dg


That's pretty cool, but just plugging in a USB is free.


----------



## GreatLaBroski

Elgrosso said:


> Hey! Wifi dongle for the 6x8 and few others lile 2x8, I might try soon: https://www.minidsp.com/products/accessories/wi-dg


Super cool for home use, and also might be a hell of a useful thing for people with iPad dashes if it works with iOS over wifi.


----------



## Theslaking

89grand said:


> That's pretty cool, but just plugging in a USB is free.


So is beating a stick off a rock and singing, but you still have a radio. 

There's always a price for usefulness and convenience.

I was sick of running a cable on the outside of my car from the trunk. I just ripped apart my car to run the cable up the center console. A month to soon. SMH. Also you can use Alexa on your phone (I assume since its Alexa compatible) to change presents and such. That's pretty nifty.


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## Elgrosso

Yeah less wires always a good thing.
Got some issues with usb cable extension and right now I don’t have much room to move my laptop around during tuning. This will help, as soon as it’s fast and stable, I’ll see.


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## piyush7243

Imo a very good option to tune wirelessly. Helps with the movement and minidsp software has always been great. Least possible bugs I have ever seen in aNy dsp software

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk


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## CAudio

How do I determine if I have the upgraded C-DSP where the coil is protected from short circuit? 
My unit was ordered 22 October, 2016.

Thank you


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## Theslaking

If you bought it after I posted I got mine upgraded in this thread then you have the new one


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## CAudio

Theslaking said:


> If you bought it after I posted I got mine upgraded in this thread then you have the new one



I bought mine in 2016...


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## bnae38

CAudio said:


> How do I determine if I have the upgraded C-DSP where the coil is protected from short circuit?
> 
> Thank you


I posted the pics from that years ago, dont think it's something to worry too much about. The coil appears to be elevated off the board in your unit.


The enameled wire actually rubbed on a large gold plated via on the pcb and wore through and shorted out on the unit i had (and a handful of others in the field). 

If you're really concerned, buy some red rtv and glue it in place (elevated off the pcb).


Actually, it looks like yours is glued up off the pcb, think you're in good shape .


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## CAudio

Has anyone compared the C-DSP to the Helix DSP or similar? Does it have any downfalls? The low-ish output voltage I do not consider to be a downfall. Are there any known deficiencies at this point? Thanks.


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## SkizeR

CAudio said:


> Has anyone compared the C-DSP to the Helix DSP or similar? Does it have any downfalls? The low-ish output voltage I do not consider to be a downfall. Are there any known deficiencies at this point? Thanks.


Processors can do so many things and different cars can require different pieces of equipment, so it's usually hard to answer which one is better off of such a generalized question. That said, I have swapped a cdsp for a pro mk2 in a car, both with quick tunes and there was a pretty significant difference.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## CAudio

SkizeR said:


> Processors can do so many things and different cars can require different pieces of equipment, so it's usually hard to answer which one is better off of such a generalized question. That said, I have swapped a cdsp for a pro mk2 in a car, both with quick tunes and there was a pretty significant difference.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk




Can you elaborate further please?


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## SkizeR

CAudio said:


> Can you elaborate further please?


Overall clarity was better. Dynamics were better. We were able to push the system much harder in this case since the helix has a ton of headroom depending on your gain structure. You can cut the amp gains way down since its 8v vs 2v to have a lower noise floor if your amps have some noise.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## GreatLaBroski

SkizeR said:


> Overall clarity was better. Dynamics were better. We were able to push the system much harder in this case since the helix has a ton of headroom depending on your gain structure. You can cut the amp gains way down since its 8v vs 2v to have a lower noise floor if your amps have some noise.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Are we talking about the C-DSP 6x8 (which has an inferior DAC to the Helix), or the C-DSP 8x12 V2 which has the same DAC as the Helix?

EDIT: I do realize what thread I'm in, but I wanted to be clear. Also I do agree that the C-DSP 6x8's DAC, while unoffensive, isn't on the same level as the Helix or C-DSP 8x12 v2.


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## SkizeR

GreatLaBroski said:


> Are we talking about the C-DSP 6x8 (which has an inferior DAC to the Helix), or the C-DSP 8x12 V2 which has the same DAC as the Helix?
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: I do realize what thread I'm in, but I wanted to be clear. Also I do agree that the C-DSP 6x8's DAC, while unoffensive, isn't on the same level as the Helix or C-DSP 8x12 v2.


I actually cant see what thread I'm in since I'm on Tapatalk and it doesnt show the full title, but 6x8. The difference was pretty drastic tbh

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## GreatLaBroski

SkizeR said:


> I actually cant see what thread I'm in since I'm on Tapatalk and it doesnt show the full title, but 6x8. The difference was pretty drastic tbh
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Yeah I had both of the C-DSPs on hand at the same time. Since the Helix and C-DSP 8x12 v2 effectively have the same DAC chip, I'll assume they sound extremely similar.

I could tell a difference between the 6x8 and 8x12 v2. It was more pronounced on higher-end gear. Crisper more articulate highs, and overall more transparent and clearer. Better dynamics. That's not to say the 6x8 sounded "bad", it sounds good. Very neutral and unoffensive. I like its sound. But the better DAC sounds better.


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## Theslaking

I agree that the 8x12 is noticably better but at the 6x8's price point I don't believe you can top it. The 6x8 isn't bad but it's just not in the same category as a Helix.


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## GreatLaBroski

Theslaking said:


> I agree that the 8x12 is noticably better but at the 6x8's price point I don't believe you can top it. The 6x8 isn't bad but it's just not in the same category as a Helix.


I agree here. The 6x8 sounds nice, I liked it enough to buy it twice. I'd doubt you would hear the difference if you have a more budget-oriented system. It's only when you bring in really high-quality stuff across the whole signal chain that you can start to really notice.


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## CAudio

I thought sound is similar based on the fact that there are only a few DAC chips on the market. I have Nak headunit, Scan- Speak Drivers, Zapco and Nak amps. Looks like I will need to upgrade. The only disappointment is that the 6x8 has 4 RCA low level inputs (front and rear), which marched the Pre-amp outputs on the Nak perfectly (no sub level output). 

Thank you for explaining to me the differences in the DAC chips. This makes sense.


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## JH1973

GreatLaBroski said:


> Theslaking said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree that the 8x12 is noticably better but at the 6x8's price point I don't believe you can top it. The 6x8 isn't bad but it's just not in the same category as a Helix.
> 
> 
> 
> I agree here. The 6x8 sounds nice, I liked it enough to buy it twice. I'd doubt you would hear the difference if you have a more budget-oriented system. It's only when you bring in really high-quality stuff across the whole signal chain that you can start to really notice.
Click to expand...

I won both IASCA and MECA novice class at a 2018 SQ event with my CDSP 6x8 so it can't be that bad and quite frankly,I love the way my Sentra sounds.Haven't touched the tune since a few months before that event.If it's not broke then don't fix it.


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## alligatorman

Nvm.


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## lucas569

Can anyone give me some pointers. My 1st DSP (6x8) ever and I’m having some minor set up issues.
My sub bass speaker doesn’t seem to be working.
I have channels 7 & 8 for the sub. They are linked together.
I only ran one set of RCA’s to input 1 & 2
Where should I start to trouble shoot? So far I checked fuses and all connections. Made sure amp was properly set up. Wires are good etc 

still no sound. Any advice ?


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## alligatorman

Does it work when you bypass the DSP?
Is Ch 7+8 muted?


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## lucas569

7+8 are not muted. Does not work when bypassed


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## ckirocz28

lucas569 said:


> Can anyone give me some pointers. My 1st DSP (6x8) ever and I’m having some minor set up issues.
> My sub bass speaker doesn’t seem to be working.
> I have channels 7 & 8 for the sub. They are linked together.
> I only ran one set of RCA’s to input 1 & 2
> Where should I start to trouble shoot? So far I checked fuses and all connections. Made sure amp was properly set up. Wires are good etc
> 
> still no sound. Any advice ?


Is it routed properly on the routing tab?
On the left are inputs and across the top are outputs, you would want "Input 1" and "Input 2" routed to "Output 7" and "Output 8" to get a summed mono signal for your subwoofer amp. Similar to what I have done and circled in this screenshot, ignore the other stuff.


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## lucas569

Sweet that may be it!!!!! Been at it all night. Hit it again Friday. Muggy as hell tonight


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## ckirocz28

lucas569 said:


> Sweet that may be it!!!!! Been at it all night. Hit it again Friday. Muggy as hell tonight
> View attachment 274939


Don't forget to lower the level on the routing tab to about -6 db on all 4 buttons so it sums to 0 db. (right click on each button to get the level and inversion settings)

Sent from my SM-G935U using Tapatalk


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## lucas569

Odd it won’t right click on the buttons


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## ckirocz28

lucas569 said:


> Odd it won’t right click on the buttons


Left click turns them on and off, right? Mine's a C-DSP 8x12, the plugin may be somewhat different. Read your user manual to see how to configure the routing tab.

Sent from my SM-G935U using Tapatalk


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## lucas569

correct.... i must not have all the features i cant set the db like you can


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## lucas569

does this look correct?


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## ckirocz28

lucas569 said:


> does this look correct?
> View attachment 274941


That looks correct.

Sent from my SM-G935U using Tapatalk


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## ckirocz28

lucas569 said:


> correct.... i must not have all the features i cant set the db like you can


You may wan't to reduce the input level, if possible, to avoid clipping that subwoofer signal, then increase your mid and high outputs by the same amount to compensate for the loss.

Sent from my SM-G935U using Tapatalk


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## ckirocz28

Double post.


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## alligatorman

Gotta say I love being able to control the sub channels 7+8 by remote on the new v1.4 update!!
This thing rocks for such a cheap product.


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## drcasper

anyone here from the SWFL area (near ft myers) that could help me setup the minidsp ? :/


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## fackamato

Can anyone comment on the background noise / hiss? Is there any? Or is it 100% quiet with gain all the way turned up on the output into amps? Thanks


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## lithium

I have a small bit but i think it's amp gain. I've seen some guys add a second dsp chassis ground to alleviate it. I can mute the dsp by pressing down on the remote volume knob and its silent. In my last car, using just the digital inputs with the analog inputs muted resulted in zero noise.

Generally I've used this dsp in my last two cars for about 5 years. Its pretty noise free and I haven't had issues with it. For the money it's pretty good but you could also grab a used helix or cdsp 8x12 for about the same money.


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## Carlos Glz

Ayuda compre un DSP C-DSP 6X8 usando el problema es que no tengo el software, no tengo nada ni un numero, alguien me lo puede enviar????


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