# Helix DSP Software - Tips, Tricks, Oddities and Annoyances



## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

As some of you know, I don't love the Helix software... Buuuuut, I know the Helix has amazing capabilities, so I'm in this for the long haul and to learn how to use it to it's fullest.

Maybe we can do some Q&As, share some little hidden features, ***** about what bothers you, discuss some ways Helix could improve it, etc..


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

I wish when you changed to parametric and used a completely different freq that would be dynamic and show on the top off all filters. So if I use say the 30 hz band for my tweeter but it's set to 5k or so it would show for later reference. And like jl does you could re order them. The software feels like old linux stuff. A little clunky but it serves it purpose.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Doug, video. Reminder. K-fest?


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> Doug, video. Reminder. K-fest?


I. Don't. Speak. In. Code.


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

I's like to know more about using the All-Pass-Filter.

Should/can it be used to fix a null in a drivers side lower-door midbass speaker..if so, how to apply the APF...


and YES SOME VIDEOS would be fantastic !!!!!!


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

I don't think it will fix a null on a single driver. Only between 2 drivers where phase is causing a null. If you turn on the all pass filter in the settings it shows what it does to phase when you apply it.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

all pass filters will not fix nulls on single speakers


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## dobslob (Sep 19, 2011)

DavidRam said:


> I. Don't. Speak. In. Code.


Nick and I plan on making some videos in the next few weeks helping to make the software easier to use for those who don't quite get it or aren't that comfortable with it.

We will also be with the guy who does all of the software work, so any wants, needs, or issues will be easier for me to discuss with them than normal. Please feel free to post them here and I will make it a part of our meetings.


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

dobslob said:


> DavidRam said:
> 
> 
> > I. Don't. Speak. In. Code.
> ...


Sweet. I'm pretty familiar with the software but I'm sure the videos will help me tremendously. On the xda forums people sometimes will get a pool of money going for videos to be made or bootloaders to be unlocked. I thought of doing something similar to see if nick or someone could make a series of tuning videos. His video of using the eq function in rew was great but maybe some videos like what Kyle did. Sorry if this is too off topic.


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## dobslob (Sep 19, 2011)

Mahapederdon said:


> Sweet. I'm pretty familiar with the software but I'm sure the videos will help me tremendously. On the xda forums people sometimes will get a pool of money going for videos to be made or bootloaders to be unlocked. I thought of doing something similar to see if nick or someone could make a series of tuning videos. His video of using the eq function in rew was great but maybe some videos like what Kyle did. Sorry if this is too off topic.


It's right on topic. Thank You. We want to know what people want from us and from our products.

Keep it coming!


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

Mahapederdon said:


> Sweet. I'm pretty familiar with the software but I'm sure the videos will help me tremendously. On the xda forums people sometimes will get a pool of money going for videos to be made or bootloaders to be unlocked. I thought of doing something similar to see if nick or someone could make a series of tuning videos. His video of using the eq function in rew was great but maybe some videos like what Kyle did. Sorry if this is too off topic.



^^^^^ THIS !!


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## Redliner99 (Mar 26, 2018)

dobslob said:


> It's right on topic. Thank You. We want to know what people want from us and from our products.
> 
> 
> 
> Keep it coming!




What is the reason for when you update software you can't load previous tunes? Was told from a friend he had to start all over and his previous 8 setups are useless now 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

I've been able to update and keep tunes but last time I updated I was having weird subwoofer issues. So I reset and started from scratch. I was never sure if it was from me updating or just a fluke.

We are supposed to uninstall the previous version right? I noticed when I install a new version the old one still shows up in the program list.

My previous post asking for dynamic freq when using parametric is actually already in there. It shows below the eq band. Must of missed it.


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## dobslob (Sep 19, 2011)

Redliner99 said:


> What is the reason for when you update software you can't load previous tunes? Was told from a friend he had to start all over and his previous 8 setups are useless now
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You can update and retain tunes. Starting with 4.50 it even showed as it was saving them. Earlier versions it was hit or miss if I could find them after clicking to save. I tested it with the software released today and it does allow you to auto save them and reload.

You have always been able to save on your own and reload the saved settings.


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

Redliner99 said:


> What is the reason for when you update software you can't load previous tunes? Was told from a friend he had to start all over and his previous 8 setups are useless now
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


thats fake news


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## jdunk54nl (Apr 25, 2015)

I would like user selectable bands on where to input REW EQ' filters when hitting the r keyboard shortcut. That way we could import more than once, and save the first and last band for shelf filters. 

Also re-organize/sort the bands by frequency option after import


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

^^^
+1 for this. Although it's probably not easy to implement.


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

New Setup_ATF_DSP_PC-TOOL_4-52a.exe, (beta) just released today. Looks to have some improvements for the Helix....

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/dsp-pc-tool/dsp-pc-tool-version-4/


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## Redliner99 (Mar 26, 2018)

miniSQ said:


> thats fake news




That's coming from someone who has tuned probably 50 or more helix setups and specifically told me update the newest one and never update again because he has had numerous numerous problems. But If that issue has been addressed with the brand new update I'm sure he will be happy about that 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Lou73 (Feb 22, 2019)

tjk_bail said:


> New Setup_ATF_DSP_PC-TOOL_4-52a.exe, (beta) just released today. Looks to have some improvements for the Helix....
> 
> https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/dsp-pc-tool/dsp-pc-tool-version-4/


I thought that update was from January? hhmm


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

Lou73 said:


> I thought that update was from January? hhmm




I downloaded version 4-50a back in April this year, and then downloaded version 4-51a in June this year. This latest version is 4-52a. I think the German website uses a date format as dd/mm/yyyy


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

I dont want this thread to die... as I would love to see updated 'How to tune' videos done in the style that Kyle has on youtube.

This is my wishlist. Would like to see a complete tune, from start to finish. Maybe brush over the basics, because the basic tuning is all over the place on here, would really like to see a focus on the "Fine Tuning Process"

I mean the Tuning of 'Your (whoever does the video) system', without all the "your system may be different" talk, just show how you fined tuned your system. (hoping you have a 3-way+sub) How you manage (eq, t/a,crossovers) the nulls, phase problems, t/a, REW and all the other stuff that comes into play when tuning a system and getting it ready for a competition or Client.

Thats my wishlist, please feel free to add or subtract to this list.....


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

I can promise you this, i (and doug) will be doing videos on how to work the software. Everything about it. What i will probably not be doing is HOW to tune videos. Sorry, but there is just way to much to go over in a few videos and it will only create more questions than it will answer like my last videos did and frankly, more questions is the last thing i need right now.


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

SkizeR said:


> I can promise you this, i (and doug) will be doing videos on how to work the software. Everything about it. What i will probably not be doing is HOW to tune videos. Sorry, but there is just way to much to go over in a few videos and it will only create more questions than it will answer like my last videos did and frankly, more questions is the last thing i need right now.




Would be VERY GREATFULL and HIGHLY APPRECIATED for the Helix Videos!!


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## ErinH (Feb 14, 2007)

Unfortunately, car audio is harder than home audio. In a home, you buy a good speaker, you put it in a decently treated room and you only really have to worry about what happens below the schroeder frequency. And in a home, the reflections can actually _increase_ the system performance through providing a larger sense of space. In a car, you can buy excellent speakers but you still have to set them up with crossovers that not only protect the drivers from yourself but also combine to create a smooth response in the crossover region on and off axis. And then there's the effects the car has such as comb filtering (alternating peaks and nulls due to reflections), corner loading, 'baffle' step (where the 'baffle' would be a pillar, a door, etc ... which in many ways in car audio is akin to corner loading) and on top of all of that you have to deal with a wider bandwidth of problems because the schroeder frequency is about 100-200hz higher than it is in a home. A single issue in response can be caused by any number of things and if you don't understand what's causing them there's no amount of tutorials that someone can provide on "how to tune (EQ)" that will get you to a place of really understanding the problem and getting the best possible result you can from your system. So, I think the best one could hope to provide and be provided is a tutorial than explains these particular things; how to recognize them and methods on how to go about correcting them.


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## tonynca (Dec 4, 2009)

Excellent breakdown ErinH. It is exactly what I observe when I'm tuning a car.


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

ErinH said:


> Unfortunately, car audio is harder than home audio. In a home, you buy a good speaker, you put it in a decently treated room and you only really have to worry about what happens below the schroeder frequency. And in a home, the reflections can actually _increase_ the system performance through providing a larger sense of space. In a car, you can buy excellent speakers but you still have to set them up with crossovers that not only protect the drivers from yourself but also combine to create a smooth response in the crossover region on and off axis. And then there's the effects the car has such as comb filtering (alternating peaks and nulls due to reflections), corner loading, 'baffle' step (where the 'baffle' would be a pillar, a door, etc ... which in many ways in car audio is akin to corner loading) and on top of all of that you have to deal with a wider bandwidth of problems because the schroeder frequency is about 100-200hz higher than it is in a home. A single issue in response can be caused by any number of things and if you don't understand what's causing them there's no amount of tutorials that someone can provide on "how to tune (EQ)" that will get you to a place of really understanding the problem and getting the best possible result you can from your system. So, I think the best one could hope to provide and be provided is a tutorial than explains these particular things; how to recognize them and methods on how to go about correcting them.


This is the biggest hurdle when trying to teach this stuff.
Teaching someone how to spot what the actual issue is. 
Everything has an impact on frequency response, so most often people just reach for the eq even when it's not the answer. 
It's so hard to explain through text how to hear a ta or phase issue.


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

ErinH said:


> Unfortunately, car audio is harder than home audio. In a home, you buy a good speaker, you put it in a decently treated room and you only really have to worry about what happens below the schroeder frequency. And in a home, the reflections can actually _increase_ the system performance through providing a larger sense of space. In a car, you can buy excellent speakers but you still have to set them up with crossovers that not only protect the drivers from yourself but also combine to create a smooth response in the crossover region on and off axis. And then there's the effects the car has such as comb filtering (alternating peaks and nulls due to reflections), corner loading, 'baffle' step (where the 'baffle' would be a pillar, a door, etc ... which in many ways in car audio is akin to corner loading) and on top of all of that you have to deal with a wider bandwidth of problems because the schroeder frequency is about 100-200hz higher than it is in a home. A single issue in response can be caused by any number of things and if you don't understand what's causing them there's no amount of tutorials that someone can provide on "how to tune (EQ)" that will get you to a place of really understanding the problem and getting the best possible result you can from your system. So, I think the best one could hope to provide and be provided is a tutorial than explains these particular things; how to recognize them and methods on how to go about correcting them.




I understand your logic...but you have a life-time of experience of installation and tuning, and you have a deep understanding of the acoustic world and its seemingly infinate variations. I'm just a weekend tuner who is trying to get the most out of my 'expensive' truck stereo. Thats why I'm on this "due-it-yourself' forum reading the threads and trying to understand as much as I can from y'all who has made it your profession. I have read what seems like a million threads, trying to find answers to my tuning problems, a lot of the time the reply's to questions are not answered or they are just plain 'ol opaque, or to vague. Or I get lost in the technical jargon, as it just gets to deep for me to understand.

I was a 3rd teir software tech (deepest level, next level was software developement) (retired) for a 'Time&Attendance' Company that served high end Hotel Resorts and Casino's. When a Client called in for support, they didn't want to know how the software was written or the Boolean used to make the calculation, they wanted to know how to fix thier problem, so our company made video's on how to fix their problems in the T&A software. The video's proved to be a much superior understandable answer over a written tutorial that would state click here, find this, uncheck that.....the written words could be interpreted in a wide variety, long and complicated. The video's were straight foward, precise and easily understood. It can take 100 pages of written tutorial to do the same thing as a 15 minute video, and the video would ALWAYS prove to be more understandable to the user. And MOST (i'd make a bet that 70% percent) of us here on diymobileaudio.com are a novice weekend tuner, and will never get much beyond novice, we just want to know how to tune our system from the best... and thats You, SkizeR, and a some others...

Erin, you said "A single issue in response can be caused by any number of things and if you don't understand what's causing them there's no amount of tutorials that someone can provide on "how to tune (EQ)" that will get you to a place of really understanding the problem and getting the best possible result you can from your system." 

THIS is why I would like to see a complete tune, from start to finish on video. To see, hear and understand how you 'find' and work through this type of problem, and other problems. The best vid's are the ones that have problems with tuning, and show the process of finding the prob's, then fixing the problems. A video will let us see what the problem your having is, and the steps you take to fix it....A video is so much better than a brief typed explaination in a thread.....

I am amazed at the number of people on this website who has a vast and deep knowledge of the acoustic world, a bunch of very intelligent people. For me, I have a difficult time wrapping my brain around the techy & deep side of it.. .not sure why,.... but I just can't for some unknown reason,... and I've tried, and I've tried,......but I haven't given up yet.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

miniSQ said:


> thats fake news




I've had glitches like this. Update software. Software says old files not compatible until updated. Attempts to update old files then doesn't work right anymore software never fully loads up until I do full hard reset. Among other weird glitches including not loading a new profile slot until I switched to a different computer with Windows 7 to Windows 10, and settings not taking affect on a save after I exit and return to software. I even uninstalled reinstalled. Otherwise there's these small quirks you don't know about until you just know about them from someone on the internet or you finally figure it out. Would be nice if the company make a video at some point? There's that big tuning guide PDF which I've read and reference but the software is clunky compared to other competitors. If it stays clunky and unintuitive then more explanation is necessary I feel.

Not that were entitled to anything but doing a start to finish how to video (Step 1, Step 2...) that has coherent audio and visuals (which has already been declined above) would be excellent.

More on auto EQ.

A feature to auto transfer results from REW rather than having to type them all in forever if that's not a feature. That's the most frustrating thing to do, especially when it was *something* like you can't hit the "next" arrow key like you do with tab key to change fields. There's probably a shortcut for this somewhere in all these diyma threads but even with that it would remain tedious.

The resolution doesn't work right on certain laptop screens it won't adjust correctly and then you can't hit certain buttons.

On a similar note - there's opportunity for Helix to clearly present what the difference in actual hardware aside from the obvious less inputs/output ports? Are there different DACs or processors in some units over others in the lineup? Would be nice to have more clarity revolving around this as last time I tried to compare on the website something about this wasn't clear but I can't remember now. I liked the Helix pro mk2 dsp. Is there an equivalent in a smaller form factor with less outputs or am I losing something sound quality wise? I have to spend a lot of time searching through pages of forums to find out things like this and i still won't be sure end of day.

Overall I personally would still pick it over competitors but the threshold of understanding to use the GUI is way too high as opposed to competition especially when the info is a little here and a little there people will choose something else for simplicity. I just happened to be in a unique stage of life where I could stare at it all day (and frustrating still not understand). But in this period of life if I was a newcomer I could never pull that off between work and life in general. Maybe I'll have time again in the future but I'll watch whatever's put out because it's interesting to me.

This is all on my phone so forgive the typos or potential lack of clarity 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

The more I read about the Helix, the more I realize that I don't know ****!!!  :blush:


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

But ya definitely grateful and excited to see whatever's content is put out. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

DavidRam said:


> The more I read about the Helix, the more I realize that I don't know ****!!! <img src="http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/images/smilies/frown.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Frown" class="inlineimg" /> <img src="http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/images/smilies/redface.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Blush" class="inlineimg" />


Its just a dsp with some bells and whistles.

It does 4 things. Frequency, routing, time and volume.


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## JamesRC (Sep 18, 2017)

Two items on my wishlist:



1) I have the gen 1 Helix DSP. I've always had a difficult time knowing if I was editing preset 1 or preset 2, and if I was saving to preset 1 or preset 2. 



2) I like the auto-EQ feature. I was able to change my EQ curve and thought I'd saved it, but I wasn't able to reload it. I'd like that to be more straight-forward.



Aside from those two things, I honestly don't find the software very difficult to use.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

drop1 said:


> Its just a dsp with some bells and whistles.
> 
> It does 4 things. Frequency, routing, time and volume.


your missing a few.. Phase, source switching, RTA, etc..


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## Redliner99 (Mar 26, 2018)

DavidRam said:


> The more I read about the Helix, the more I realize that I don't know ****!!!  :blush:




It's crazy how much better it is and how much more it can do than my bit ten 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

SkizeR said:


> drop1 said:
> 
> 
> > Its just a dsp with some bells and whistles.
> ...


I classify phase as a type of time. Fair game on the rest


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

I just realized that I do not know how to save a second tune so it's accessible from the director...

Can anyone tell me how, plz?


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## Bnlcmbcar (Aug 23, 2016)

DavidRam said:


> I just realized that I do not know how to save a second tune so it's accessible from the director...
> 
> Can anyone tell me how, plz?


Click Save & Store then select a slot other than #1 or #2.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Bnlcmbcar said:


> Click Save & Store then select a slot other than #1 or #2.


Thank you!

What is slot #2 for?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

DavidRam said:


> I just realized that I do not know how to save a second tune so it's accessible from the director...
> 
> 
> 
> Can anyone tell me how, plz?


You cant. There was a glitch with it and someone was exploiting it to claim AF kept damaging their gear. They just blocked preset 2 if you have a director as sort of a brute force "screw you, guy" type response lol. This was years ago

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Bnlcmbcar (Aug 23, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> You cant. There was a glitch with it and someone was exploiting it to claim AF kept damaging their gear. They just blocked preset 2 if you have a director as sort of a brute force "screw you, guy" type response lol. This was years ago


That’s funny! Helix shut him up I guess.

I remember when we lost the ability to do so after a certain firmware update for the Director. I always assumed it was Helix sacrificing space on the Helix to incorporate other features/options.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

drop1 said:


> I classify phase as a type of time. Fair game on the rest


fine, polarity


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

SkizeR said:


> You cant. There was a glitch with it and someone was exploiting it to claim AF kept damaging their gear. They just blocked preset 2 if you have a director as sort of a brute force "screw you, guy" type response lol. This was years ago
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Gotta love the German way of taking care of difficult people


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## EmoJackson (Aug 13, 2018)

SkizeR said:


> You cant. There was a glitch with it and someone was exploiting it to claim AF kept damaging their gear. They just blocked preset 2 if you have a director as sort of a brute force "screw you, guy" type response lol. This was years ago
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Funny, since I asked you this same question last week.

Is there a key command that quickly clears or resets the eq to back to flat?


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

EmoJackson said:


> Funny, since I asked you this same question last week.
> 
> Is there a key command that quickly clears or resets the eq to back to flat?


Bottom left, I think it says RST or something like that... It will verify that you want to do that.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> You cant. There was a glitch with it and someone was exploiting it to claim AF kept damaging their gear. They just blocked preset 2 if you have a director as sort of a brute force "screw you, guy" type response lol. This was years ago
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


****ing Nazis! Lol


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## jsolo53 (Dec 8, 2015)

SkizeR said:


> You cant. There was a glitch with it and someone was exploiting it to claim AF kept damaging their gear. They just blocked preset 2 if you have a director as sort of a brute force "screw you, guy" type response lol. This was years ago
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Does this block also happen with a URC3?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

jsolo53 said:


> Does this block also happen with a URC3?


nope


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

DavidRam said:


> ****ing Nazis! Lol


arent you from germany? lol


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## EmoJackson (Aug 13, 2018)

DavidRam said:


> Bottom left, I think it says RST or something like that... It will verify that you want to do that.


Excellent! Thanks you! I'll give that a shot.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> arent you from germany? lol


Yes, born and raised... That's why I'm comfortable saying that. Lol


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

EmoJackson said:


> Funny, since I asked you this same question last week.
> 
> 
> 
> Is there a key command that quickly clears or resets the eq to back to flat?


The reset button top left in the main tab. Click reset then a dialogue box will appear with different options to reset. Output eq is what you are looking for. If you want to reset just one channel, look bottom left.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Patriot83 (May 10, 2017)

DavidRam said:


> Yes, born and raised... That's why I'm comfortable saying that. Lol


And from a incredibly cool little german town at that


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Alright, I thinking I am figuring out what the PEQ doesn't like when typing... 

It doesn't like "enter" or "backspace". 

What seems to work is "delete" rather than "backspace", and "tab" rather than "enter".

Also, when you tab down and it's highlighted, don't expect it to take whatever digits you just start typing in, as there is a keyboard hopscotch game needed to make that happen! :laugh:


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

I started a thread but I should have just asked here. 

My input eq is bound to stereo pairs. How do o make it so each channel has its own input eq?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

I use tab and backspace all the time without issues...


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## ajt976 (Feb 27, 2019)

DavidRam said:


> Alright, I thinking I am figuring out what the PEQ doesn't like when typing...
> 
> It doesn't like "enter" or "backspace".
> 
> ...


I noticed this while playing with the demo as well. It did not take my values upon "tab" even though it advanced to the next input (next is used loosely here, it seems the tab index is all over the place). I had to "enter" on each value to get it to set, and then just clicked in the next input to advance rather than "tab".

I didn't have issues with "backspace" or "delete"


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

Can you copy a whole channel with the helix? Level, ta and eq? 

If not can you copy just the eq for the entire channel?


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> I use tab and backspace all the time without issues...





ajt976 said:


> I noticed this while playing with the demo as well. It did not take my values upon "tab" even though it advanced to the next input (next is used loosely here, it seems the tab index is all over the place). I had to "enter" on each value to get it to set, and then just clicked in the next input to advance rather than "tab".
> 
> I didn't have issues with "backspace" or "delete"


Like most of the Helix issues, it seems they are inconsistent and not universal... 

Delete works fine, but if I backspace, enter a number and then tab to the next input, it changes the number to zero.


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

Does anybody know why sometimes the phase slider is greyed out? It happened after I updated the software. At least that's when I noticed it. I wanted to play with phase of my midbass drivers and they are the 2 it won't let me play with. Output c and d.

Edit. The pic doesn't show really well it its a little more grey and it doesn't move.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

While I think the Helix is brilliant for what it's capable of I still think the minidsp software is far superior. You're also not looking at nearly as much on one page with the minidsp 6x8 or even 8x12. I do miss not being able to just tab over and enter values without having to use the touchpad on the laptop. It stumbles on q and gain if you want to go past the whole number. If Helix could get the software to run as smooth as the minidsp software they would be the perfect processor for a balance between value and function. Also wish the pages in the eq software were less crowded. Just putting gains, crossovers, t/a, etc on a separate page and eq on its own page would make a big difference. BUT it's worlds better from the shades of gray the new PS-8 pro has so I guess Helix has that going for it. That's actually what pushed me to get the Helix over the new PS-8. 

If Helix could have a few different options on how the software is laid out that would be great. Not everyone wants nearly everything crammed onto the same page. You can do that on other types of electronics like depth finders. Why not car audio processors?


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

^^^ if you click main more than once it's cycles through different layouts on the main eq screen.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Mahapederdon said:


> Does anybody know why sometimes the phase slider is greyed out? It happened after I updated the software. At least that's when I noticed it. I wanted to play with phase of my midbass drivers and they are the 2 it won't let me play with. Output c and d.
> 
> Edit. The pic doesn't show really well it its a little more grey and it doesn't move.


It is only available on certain designated output types. It is also NOT PHASE. It is an all pass filter. Do not use it unless you *really* know what its doing

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> Mahapederdon said:
> 
> 
> > Does anybody know why sometimes the phase slider is greyed out? It happened after I updated the software. At least that's when I noticed it. I wanted to play with phase of my midbass drivers and they are the 2 it won't let me play with. Output c and d.
> ...


So I shouldn't use any of the sliders in pointing at? I was under the impression these were preferred over using the time function to dial in phase after entering all my measured distance.

Edit. Thanks SkizeR. I found an older thread where you explained the phase slider more in depth.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

Mahapederdon said:


> ^^^ if you click main more than once it's cycles through different layouts on the main eq screen.


That makes a HUGE difference for my eyes. Those who wear bifocals can probably relate.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Hillbilly SQ said:


> While I think the Helix is brilliant for what it's capable of I still think the minidsp software is far superior. You're also not looking at nearly as much on one page with the minidsp 6x8 or even 8x12. I do miss not being able to just tab over and enter values without having to use the touchpad on the laptop. It stumbles on q and gain if you want to go past the whole number. If Helix could get the software to run as smooth as the minidsp software they would be the perfect processor for a balance between value and function. Also wish the pages in the eq software were less crowded. Just putting gains, crossovers, t/a, etc on a separate page and eq on its own page would make a big difference.


I agree with this 100%.

MiniDSP software is much more modern and user-friendly, while Helix seems to be just getting used to the concept of Microsoft windows! Lol


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

*Can someone post how to set-up rear fill in the Helix?? Some sort of brief step by step?*

That +/- **** still confuses the hell out of me... Screen shots would be nice


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## ajt976 (Feb 27, 2019)

DavidRam said:


> *Can someone post how to set-up rear fill in the Helix?? Some sort of brief step by step?*
> 
> That +/- **** still confuses the hell out of me... Screen shots would be nice <img src="http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" /> <img src="http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" />


Skizer had a thread on it a while back with screen shots and the works.

I'll see if I can find it real quick.

ETA: Here is the guide I used - https://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/#/topics/307730

Side note, searching on the mobile site blows...


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

ajt976 said:


> Skizer had a thread on it a while back with screen shots and the works.
> 
> I'll see if I can find it real quick.
> 
> ...


Cool, thanks! I forgot about that thread...


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## Redliner99 (Mar 26, 2018)

ajt976 said:


> Skizer had a thread on it a while back with screen shots and the works.
> 
> I'll see if I can find it real quick.
> 
> ...




Type in what your looking for with diymobileaudio in google it works way better 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Who's using autoEQ??


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

DavidRam said:


> Who's using autoEQ??


I've used it quite a bit. Just not their curve. It works ok. You have to touch up but you have to do that using REW too.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

drop1 said:


> I've used it quite a bit. Just not their curve. It works ok. You have to touch up but you have to do that using REW too.


True. I'd like to learn how to use it and compare its results to REW's...

Are you able to load a house curve file into it, like Harman's or Crutchfield's or do you have to set it manually? 

What's the process for using the autoEQ function?


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

DavidRam said:


> drop1 said:
> 
> 
> > I've used it quite a bit. Just not their curve. It works ok. You have to touch up but you have to do that using REW too.
> ...


I don't use the actual auto eq. 

My process is to use the dots on the curve channel to draw in my curve. I havent found a way to easily recall it so I draw my curve on paper incase I need it later.

The play pink noise, click "start measurement" and move the mic ear to ear until the graph stops moving. Then hitbset to eq and that channel is done. .


There is the actual auto eq. It does the cycle over and over but I havent found the results to be any better or worse. 

REW is better. Much better at hitting target curves and goes about it in a completely different way.

Helix auto eq will not change the factory eq points . REW does.

The big thing I like about using the helix tuner is by all the eq points staying the same, its super easy to adjust frequency that are pulling the sound left or right. 
You just reduce that frequency a touch on one channel and boost it a touch on the other. 

You can also set the range in the helix eq. Say 25 to 80 for subs, 80 to 2000 for mids, 2000 to 20000 for tweeters and such. 

I really wish helix had a global 31 band eq at the end if the chain for mono eqing. Life would be so much easier!


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## JamesRC (Sep 18, 2017)

DavidRam said:


> Who's using autoEQ??



I do. I actually haven’t had much luck with REW. It’s autoEQ is always pretty far off for me. From what I’ve read though, EQ will be much easier once I have my 3-way installed. 



DavidRam said:


> Are you able to load a house curve file into it, like Harman's or Crutchfield's or do you have to set it manually?
> 
> 
> 
> What's the process for using the autoEQ function?



You can enter it, and even save it, but I can’t get the software to load the curve after I save it. I’m just using the JBL curve, so it isn’t too hard to enter it back in. 



drop1 said:


> I really wish helix had a global 31 band eq at the end if the chain for mono eqing. Life would be so much easier!



That would be awesome! Just flatten everything out and use a master for the curve. I don’t know how feasible that is on the processor (EQ’ing every speaker twice), but it would be so simple on the user end.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

JamesRC said:


> I do. I actually haven’t had much luck with REW. It’s autoEQ is always pretty far off for me. From what I’ve read though, EQ will be much easier once I have my 3-way installed.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So you just enter it manually?

I do pretty good with REW, but I'm on a serious mission of learning and using the Helix program to the max... Also, I'd like to compare the results to REWs.


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

DavidRam said:


> JamesRC said:
> 
> 
> > I do. I actually haven’t had much luck with REW. It’s autoEQ is always pretty far off for me. From what I’ve read though, EQ will be much easier once I have my 3-way installed.
> ...


The biggest hang up with the helix eq is that it does not change the factory eq starting points or the q. Rew does. It goes to the exact problem frequncy and changes the q to the appropriate number.


If helix would allow the auto eq to change frequcies and adjust q it would be fantastic!


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

drop1 said:


> The biggest hang up with the helix eq is that it does not change the factory eq starting points or the q. Rew does. It goes to the exact problem frequncy and changes the q to the appropriate number.
> 
> 
> If helix would allow the auto eq to change frequcies and adjust q it would be fantastic!


Wait, what, are you serious? That's a big negative... Well, I don't think I can improve on my REW results with those kinds of limitations.


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## Mahapederdon (Aug 19, 2016)

Yep. Q and frequency are set. It's auto eq graphic only.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Mahapederdon said:


> Yep. Q and frequency are set. It's auto eq graphic only.


Well, forget that then... That's unfortunate.


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

DavidRam said:


> Mahapederdon said:
> 
> 
> > Yep. Q and frequency are set. It's auto eq graphic only.
> ...


Dont get caught up on pretty graphs. Earlier I took 30 minutes to manually tune with the preset eq points and q's. It sounds fuller and better than anything REW has ever given me and barely took longer than other methods of "auto eqing".
It's easy to get caught up on pretty pictures but it's only the sound that matters.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

drop1 said:


> Dont get caught up on pretty graphs. Earlier I took 30 minutes to manually tune with the preset eq points and q's. It sounds fuller and better than anything REW has ever given me and barely took longer than other methods of "auto eqing".
> It's easy to get caught up on pretty pictures but it's only the sound that matters.


You just tried this today?


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## EmoJackson (Aug 13, 2018)

Anyone know of a way to look at the error warning that comes up on the director screen? I've only seen it a couple times but can't seem to find the problem. Then the next time I start up it's gone.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

DavidRam said:


> *Can someone post how to set-up rear fill in the Helix?? Some sort of brief step by step?*
> 
> That +/- **** still confuses the hell out of me... Screen shots would be nice


Bumping this up again... I just tried and couldn't figure it out. 

I can't figure out how to set the routing. Anyone?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

DavidRam said:


> Bumping this up again... I just tried and couldn't figure it out.
> 
> 
> 
> I can't figure out how to set the routing. Anyone?


I made a thread for this specifically. I would link it but I'm on my phone. Search

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> I made a thread for this specifically. I would link it but I'm on my phone. Search
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk



Thanks!! It took me a while, but I found your thread: 

https://www.diymobileaudio.com/foru...iscussion/307730-how-rear-fill-helix-dsp.html

You da man!


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## CBS13WRX (Mar 5, 2013)

How do I make it display larger on my mother loving tablet??? Surface Pro 6.. I am still on 3.4 Brax NOX4DSP.


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## BigAl205 (May 20, 2009)

CBS13WRX said:


> How do I make it display larger on my mother loving tablet??? Surface Pro 6.. I am still on 3.4 Brax NOX4DSP.


I had the same problem, with it not showing up on my HD widescreen. I downloaded the beta version, and it resizes just fine

https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/dsp-pc-tool/dsp-pc-tool-version-4/


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## SlvrDragon50 (Apr 10, 2017)

DavidRam said:


> Bumping this up again... I just tried and couldn't figure it out.
> 
> I can't figure out how to set the routing. Anyone?


If you never found it: 
https://www.diymobileaudio.com/foru...iscussion/307730-how-rear-fill-helix-dsp.html

Edit: oh nevermind. I skipped over where you found it haha.

This is my plan for this week as well!


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## CBS13WRX (Mar 5, 2013)

BigAl205 said:


> I had the same problem, with it not showing up on my HD widescreen. I downloaded the beta version, and it resizes just fine
> 
> https://www.audiotec-fischer.de/en/dsp-pc-tool/dsp-pc-tool-version-4/


Al I am still on version 3.. and using the Brax NOX4DSP which is not supported in version 4. I was hoping to dig up some old work arounds for version 3. Thanks, for the input if I ever upgrade to version 4.


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## BigAl205 (May 20, 2009)

CBS13WRX said:


> Al I am still on version 3.. and using the Brax NOX4DSP which is not supported in version 4. I was hoping to dig up some old work arounds for version 3. Thanks, for the input if I ever upgrade to version 4.


I see. I just bought this Helix from Erin and have only been playing around with the software to get acquainted. It's all new to me.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Anyone know what this hazard (exclamation point) icon on the Helix Director means?

Separately (or maybe not) my adjustments aren’t saving again after powering off and back on. Updated everything to latest versions and same story. Yes I am both loading and saving against the load file. It did work briefly after that update. Maybe it was because I loaded a previous save file and it didn’t like that? My next step is to reset the whole thing and start from scratch.

Every time I try to give this thing a chance it has another seeming glitch. Really tired of it and almost giving up on it to be honest. It’s like you have to know weird quirks you have to dig for somewhere deep online otherwise you’re out of luck. For example, why you can’t use slot #2. I don’t believe this is clearly mentioned anywhere except randomly on DIYMA. I want it to work but ughkh

Starting to read up on various materials / threads for the MiniDSP with Dirac live


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## PaperLion (Aug 15, 2019)

Pretty sure I'm currently using slot 2.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

PaperLion said:


> Pretty sure I'm currently using slot 2.




https://www.diymobileaudio.com/foru...ctor-preset-loading-issue.html#/topics/412593

If I remember what I read correctly, the company updated the software to block out the slot for something weird like people were playing with a vulnerability in the software to claim there’s was broken? Blocking slot 2 prevents that vulnerability or something.

I guess I’ll try this tomorrow. I’m also just gonna reset the thing anyways now that I pulled it out of my car. https://www.diymobileaudio.com/foru...-director-preset-question.html#/topics/407565

Still don’t know what the hazard is. I think I used to know ...



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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Did a full reset. Everything updated.

Hazard comes and goes although I haven’t seen it for the last couple hours.

Settings sometimes persist, usually save and store isn’t persisting. Currently items in the Signal management tab. 

If you have a button labeled save and store it should honestly just be that straightforward.


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## EmoJackson (Aug 13, 2018)

01LSi said:


> Did a full reset. Everything updated.
> 
> Hazard comes and goes although I haven’t seen it for the last couple hours.
> 
> ...


I also get the exclamation point when starting my 2012 Ram sometimes. My helix also has trouble connecting sometimes as if the remote trigger isnt working. Anyone have a solution for this?

I'm using the remote turn on from the PAC AmpPRO AP4-CH41 to the Helix, then helix remote turn on for my Amps.


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## Firefighter9 (Sep 23, 2015)

Quick question. How do I make the software full screen? I hit maximize and the bottom portion is cut off. Even when it’s not maximized the bottom part is cut off.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Firefighter9 said:


> Quick question. How do I make the software full screen? I hit maximize and the bottom portion is cut off. Even when it’s not maximized the bottom part is cut off.


What size screen do you have? Maximize should do it... Otherwise, you might be in another layout mode: click the "Main" tab and it changes the layouts.


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## dobslob (Sep 19, 2011)

Are you using 4.52a? It should autosize to the computer's settings. Other versions were not as consistent at doing that. If you are on 4.52 and seeing this right click on the desktop icon and click on Properties and then Compatibility and try the options they offer there.


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## Firefighter9 (Sep 23, 2015)

dobslob said:


> Are you using 4.52a? It should autosize to the computer's settings. Other versions were not as consistent at doing that. If you are on 4.52 and seeing this right click on the desktop icon and click on Properties and then Compatibility and try the options they offer there.


I am using 4.52 non of the compatibility options worked. Laptop is a running windows 10 pro. Screen appears to be 1366x768.


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## EmoJackson (Aug 13, 2018)

Anyone have suggestions for my connection issue?

Director will sometimes not connect and start in DEMO mode, sometimes I'll get very faint sound from the left channel only. I'll switch sound setup and then the volume will adjust to normal. Regardless of how I select the DSP startup it happens about every 1 in 20 startups.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

EmoJackson said:


> Anyone have suggestions for my connection issue?
> 
> 
> 
> Director will sometimes not connect and start in DEMO mode, sometimes I'll get very faint sound from the left channel only. I'll switch sound setup and then the volume will adjust to normal. Regardless of how I select the DSP startup it happens about every 1 in 20 startups.


Not sure, never had connection issues. Maybe try a new usb?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Here is something else I am not sure about... In the Helix Director there is a digital volume and the main volume. I currently have the digital volume at full volume, and I use the "main volume" as my main volume. I never touch the digital volume, and I am not even sure what it's there for... 

Is that wrong??


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## Redliner99 (Mar 26, 2018)

DavidRam said:


> Here is something else I am not sure about... In the Helix Director there is a digital volume and the main volume. I currently have the digital volume at full volume, and I use the "main volume" as my main volume. I never touch the digital volume, and I am not even sure what it's there for...
> 
> 
> 
> Is that wrong??




I run mine the same way but since I'm using the HEC I turn the HEC volume all the way up as well as digital and use master 


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Redliner99 said:


> I run mine the same way but since I'm using the HEC I turn the HEC volume all the way up as well as digital and use master
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



I assumed that is the right way to do it, but I am still trying to track down this ****ing noise issue...


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## Bnlcmbcar (Aug 23, 2016)

I run mine the same way as well. iOS volume at 100%, HEC Digital volume at 100%, and then use Director Master volume to adjust.


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

DavidRam said:


> Here is something else I am not sure about... In the Helix Director there is a digital volume and the main volume. I currently have the digital volume at full volume, and I use the "main volume" as my main volume. I never touch the digital volume, and I am not even sure what it's there for...
> 
> Is that wrong??



I use the Optical in from my GM650 interface to the Helix. The 'Digital in' is used for external devices... like a dedicated external CD drive, ect, ect. If you have your head unit plugged into the Helix Optical port, then the only input control you have is through the Main input. The Digital tab input has no Input from your HeadUnit. I completely removed all the Left & Rights/input from the "Digital Input Fields".. they have no effect if they are selected or not selected...as they are not used unless a 2nd optical digital source is plugged in...

Like to know why I cant use Input EQ when using optical.... I mean it only works with RCA input.. and that sucks.....


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

tjk_bail said:


> I use the Optical in from my GM650 interface to the Helix. The 'Digital in' is used for external devices... like a dedicated external CD drive, ect, ect. If you have your head unit plugged into the Helix Optical port, then the only input control you have is through the Main input. The Digital tab input has no Input from your HeadUnit. I completely removed all the Left & Rights/input from the "Digital Input Fields".. they have no effect if they are selected or not selected...as they are not used unless a 2nd optical digital source is plugged in...
> 
> Like to know why I cant use Input EQ when using optical.... I mean it only works with RCA input.. and that sucks.....


Thanks.

You don't have input EQ on optical and coax because you shouldn't/don't need it with digital connections.


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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

I would have bought the Helix DSP Pro MK2 a few months back. But the lack of feature like Zapco's VSEQ Filter & Audio Control AccuBASS technology steers me away. For a unit that is suppose to help with factory integration that is an oversight. As far as the software goes, I did not find anything too cryptic about it.


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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

dobslob said:


> Nick and I plan on making some videos in the next few weeks helping to make the software easier to use for those who don't quite get it or aren't that comfortable with it.
> 
> We will also be with the guy who does all of the software work, so any wants, needs, or issues will be easier for me to discuss with them than normal. Please feel free to post them here and I will make it a part of our meetings.




Did these videos ever get made??? If so, can a link be posted? If not, are they still on the schedule for a release date sometime in the future?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

evo9 said:


> I would have bought the Helix DSP Pro MK2 a few months back. But the lack of feature like Zapco's VSEQ Filter & Audio Control AccuBASS technology steers me away. For a unit that is suppose to help with factory integration that is an oversight. As far as the software goes, I did not find anything too cryptic about it.


Ummm, it has all of that and more lol. Doug, let's make some videos

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

SkizeR said:


> Ummm, it has all of that and more lol. Doug, let's make some videos
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


From the senior source.



> Hi Doug,
> One last question on DSP pro MK2. How does it deals with the OEM factory stereos that boost low frequencies at low volume? Then reduce low frequencies at high volume?
> 
> 
> ...


If it cant be done within the software I'm not interested. So I'm taking the source words over the sales man.





.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

evo9 said:


> From the senior source.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Maybe I'm misunderstanding what vseq means? I figured it meant variable shelf eq filter. If so, it has it. It also doesnt need something like accubass since it has shelf filters on the inputs. The new offerings have something like it though

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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

SkizeR said:


> Maybe I'm misunderstanding what vseq means? I figured it meant variable shelf eq filter. If so, it has it. It also doesnt need something like accubass since it has shelf filters on the inputs. The new offerings have something like it though
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk




The two brand I mention has a function in their software to deal with OEM system like mine. I don't want to have an optional sub-display so that rules out the Helix unit.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

evo9 said:


> The two brand I mention has a function in their software to deal with OEM system like mine. I don't want to have an optional sub-display so that rules out the Helix unit.


I'm just trying to understand what you mean. I've used all 3 units and can tell you that the helix does everything the others do, and more for OEM integration. What is vseq? Also, the option display is.... optional lol. Not trying to sell you anything. Just trying to clear up confusion. 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## jdunk54nl (Apr 25, 2015)

here is from Zapco's website.

VSEQ



Over these past 10 years car makers have made it more difficult to change out the factory stereo. 

Unfortunately, the factory stereos leave much to be desired and drivers want to improve the sound systems with new amps and speakers. But even after adding new amps and speakers problems exist because the car makers often equalize the stereos. The most common issue is that car makers roll off the bass frequencies at high volume to protect their equipment. The VSEQ allows you the correct for that factory bass roll-off seamlessly with a graduated change. The VSEQ puts the frequencies back at the same volume the factory has removed them by digitally reading when the change starts and when it stops.


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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

jdunk54nl said:


> here is from Zapco's website.
> 
> VSEQ
> 
> ...




I'm glad you put this information for him, because I wasn't going to. As I've said before, I'm going to take the word from the top than the middle. I wanted to run either the Helix or Mosconi units. After going thru both units software & manual, and not finding what I was looking for. I called/email both company for more information. I was advise to use the optional control panel volume control to over come the OEM bass roll-off.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Doug must have misunderstood your question, because it 110% has shelf filters, parametric eq, and signal delay available for the analog inputs. I'd post a screenshot but I'm away right now. What the helix doesnt do, is variable volume eq. I dont think any processor truly does this. I'm pretty sure the zapco just uses a static shelf filter as well since theres no real way for a dsp to know what volume setting your radio is on. 

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## tjk_bail (Feb 2, 2012)

....So.... whats the word on those videos??


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

tjk_bail said:


> ....So.... whats the word on those videos??


Havent been made

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

SkizeR said:


> Doug must have misunderstood your question, because it 110% has shelf filters, parametric eq, and signal delay available for the analog inputs. I'd post a screenshot but I'm away right now. What the helix doesnt do, is variable volume eq. I dont think any processor truly does this. I'm pretty sure the zapco just uses a static shelf filter as well since theres no real way for a dsp to know what volume setting your radio is on.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk




Pointless for me at this stage! I already bought one of the competing brand that meets my needs.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

evo9 said:


> Pointless for me at this stage! I already bought one of the competing brand that meets my needs.


That's fine. Just clearing up misinformation..

Here ya go 























Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Well, I gave up on the Helix, sold it and ordered a MiniDSP w/DL... I feel a weight lifted! Lol

Seriously, the Helix is a fantastic dsp in the right hands. Unfortunately, my hands were the wrong hands from the beginning.


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## jtrosky (Jul 19, 2019)

DavidRam said:


> Well, I gave up on the Helix, sold it and ordered a MiniDSP w/DL... I feel a weight lifted! Lol
> 
> Seriously, the Helix is a fantastic dsp in the right hands. Unfortunately, my hands were the wrong hands from the beginning.


Nothing wrong with that! 

Its no different than some people like Ford and others like Chevy - you have to go with what works for you. 

I actually REALLY like the Helix DSP hardware and it's software interface. However, I'm NOT a fan of their sales "strategy" (no online sales, MAP pricing, telling you who you can and can't buy from, etc) - and it may even sway my decision when it comes time to replace my DSP.3. Their sales "policies" may cause me to decide to go with something like MiniDSP, simply because I can go online and get current, up-to-date pricing quickly and easily and then actually buy their stuff online quickly and easily. No need to sneak around and buy from other countries in order to be able to purchase it online, keep costs down, etc. However, purchasing online from other countries allowed me to get the same products for 20% - 50% less money, which is significant enough to make it worthwhile for me.

The MiniDSP DiracLive is interesting too.

Really curious to hear how things go with your MiniDSP and DiracLive.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

jtrosky said:


> Nothing wrong with that!
> 
> Its no different than some people like Ford and others like Chevy - you have to go with what works for you.
> 
> ...


Hey, you didn't mention Chrysler! Lol

I agree with everything you said about the Helix sales strategy, too... I think there are a couple guys that are happy I moved on, so I will stop my bitching and STFU!


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