# Replacing a Rockford punch 150 with a pioneer D8604



## WinWiz (Sep 25, 2013)

My RF Punch 150 (the original Punch from 1988 -not the HD version) finally gave up. I used it to power my SB17NRX woofers in an active 2 way setup. So I replaced the old Punch with a more recent underated amp the D8604.
Im old and works in noisy areas so my ears are worn, mainly in the high freq. range.
My initial impression is that the new amp improved the SN ratio, sound is very clean, but the the old Punch somehow did seem to make the woofers.. well more "punchy".
I didn't use the bass boost funktion on the old Punch so I wonder what made the old amp sound more "punchy" Is it because the new amp I class D?


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## SlvrDragon50 (Apr 10, 2017)

Have you messed around with the filters at all? I have the D8604, and I did find my system didn't have that much midbass, but I didn't have anything to compare to since it was my first amp. Since deadening my doors, I did find midbass to improve.


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## dumdum (Feb 27, 2007)

Potentially a slightly different characteristic as not all amps sound the same in terms of dynamics... otherwise everyone would use 100 dollar amplifiers and zapco wouldn’t sell anything


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## WinWiz (Sep 25, 2013)

SlvrDragon50 said:


> Have you messed around with the filters at all? I have the D8604, and I did find my system didn't have that much midbass, but I didn't have anything to compare to since it was my first amp. Since deadening my doors, I did find midbass to improve.


 My doors are deadened and sealed. I run active 2 way + sub. Crossovers are handled by my pio 80prs, so I don't use the high/low pass function of the D8604. Except for the levels, I'm using the same settings now as I did with the old Amp. I don't believe the woofers played at a higher volume with the old Rockford. Don't really know the words to describe the sound difference. I know this probably sound like nonsense but the Rockford had a more "analog like" sound. Maybe I should try adjusting my housecurve...


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## SlvrDragon50 (Apr 10, 2017)

WinWiz said:


> My doors are deadened and sealed. I run active 2 way + sub. Crossovers are handled by my pio 80prs, so I don't use the high/low pass function of the D8604. Except for the levels, I'm using the same settings now as I did with the old Amp. I don't believe the woofers played at a higher volume with the old Rockford. Don't really know the words to describe the sound difference. I know this probably sound like nonsense but the Rockford had a more "analog like" sound. Maybe I should try adjusting my housecurve...


I'm not sure what to say then. Might just be different amp characteristics that you might be able to remedy with tuning? I do find my system to sound pretty bright. I am using passive crossovers with my tweeters set to -2 dB.

I've been looking into higher end D class amps recently, and it seems like the top tier ones like MMATS do sound pretty comparable to Zapcos.


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## WinWiz (Sep 25, 2013)

Turns out the lacking sound was due to install error. Woofer in right front door was mounted so that inward incursion caused the tinsel wires to touch the metal door frame, causing a short. Now that I fixed that I'm very pleased with the d8604?
I'm also certain this error caused the old Rockford to blow it's internal fuses, so after 32 years in service the made in USA amp is still rocking. That's very impressive!


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## metanium (Feb 2, 2007)

WinWiz said:


> .....the old Punch somehow did seem to make the woofers.. well more "punchy". I didn't use the bass boost funktion on the old Punch so I wonder what made the old amp sound more "punchy" Is it because the new amp I class D?
> ..... I don't believe the woofers played at a higher volume with the old Rockford. Don't really know the words to describe the sound difference. I know this probably sound like nonsense but the Rockford had a more "analog like" sound. Maybe I should try adjusting my housecurve...





WinWiz said:


> Turns out the lacking sound was due to install error. Woofer in right front door was mounted so that inward incursion caused the tinsel wires to touch the metal door frame, causing a short. Now that I fixed that I'm very pleased with the d8604?
> I'm also certain this error caused the old Rockford to blow it's internal fuses, so after 32 years in service the made in USA amp is still rocking. That's very impressive!


I'm glad this worked out for you. I too find that the old RF's have a certain sound and ability to make my speakers move that I haven't been able to replicate with newer, higher wattage Class D amps. I'm in the process of rebuilding using my all-time favorites, the Punch trans-ana DSM series.


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