# 1000 watt RMS @ 2OHM??????????



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Ok, so Posted this thread yesterday

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diy-mobile-audio/54667-pre-amp-question-ohm-question.html

I'm still waiting for a response to my ending question, but in searching the internet, a new question arose. Being as I need a 2 ohm stable amp, as opposed to my original idea of 1 ohm stable, (see previous thread) and my sub is 2000w with 1000 rms, does anyone know of an amp that does 1000 rms @ 2ohm? Everything I seem to look at is under a thousand at 2 ohm, and way over at one, which makes sense, but if i really do need a 2 ohm stable amp, where can I find one with 1000 watts rms? Thanks, Brian


----------



## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

You really don't need 1000 watts for any sub, but the Alpine PDX-1.1000 will do it.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

I figure if it can take a thousand, why not put a thousand to it? Go big or go home, right?


----------



## azngotskills (Feb 24, 2006)

briansoeth said:


> Go big or go home, right?


or you can go to Car Audio at CarAudio.com http://audioforum.termpro.com/index.html or Soundpressure.com Forum - Powered by vBulletin and get your answer...these forums are know for having great SPL sections


----------



## falkenbd (Aug 16, 2008)

something you need to keep in mind is, the difference between 500 watts and 1000 watts is 3db of headroom...

also, you could put 250 watts on the same sub in a great box and get better results than 1000 watts in a pre-fab box...


----------



## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

Your enclosure will definitely make a big difference. RMS ratings are a decent gauge of what a driver can take, but I rarely follow it. Lots of other things factor into power handling, especially with subs. Like falken said, you'll notice a bigger difference between a prefab box and a box built with specific intent for your application than you will from pumping another 500 watts to your sub. 

As far as amp suggestions, if you want something that does [email protected], the older Alpine MRD-M1005 will, and can be found pretty cheap used. I ran these amps for a long time with no problems. A little above your power requirements but still a great amp is the Phoenix Gold Tantrum 1200.1. It usually does closer to 1400w and will do it at either 2 OR 4 ohms, giving you flexibility later on. I see them go for $250 all the time.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

The guy I bought the sub from works at a car audio place in Racine WI, and had the sub in some custom box he built, so I'm not to sure what I should look for as far as figuring out if it's a good box or not.


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

Sundown SAZ1500D will do it, or close enough to it plus it is 1 ohm stable if you ever upgrade subs or add another. Plus it is just a beast.


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

azngotskills said:


> or you can go to Car Audio at CarAudio.com http://audioforum.termpro.com/index.html or Soundpressure.com Forum - Powered by vBulletin and get your answer...these forums are know for having great SPL sections


I don't know, the SPL section here is starting to come along. And at least here he will get some decent guidance toward a more even sounding system. He sounds like the beginner that predominately we all started out as.


----------



## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

SAZ-1500D - Google Product Search


----------



## Genxx (Mar 18, 2007)

cubdenno said:


> I don't know, the SPL section here is starting to come along. And at least here he will get some decent guidance toward a more even sounding system. He sounds like the beginner that predominately we all started out as.


I must be getting old because I never started out with a ton of power and a bazzilion subs. 

Times have changed I guess.

To the OP.

Do some searching, reading and gain a little knowledge. Decide what you are trying to achieve then formulate a question to get the help to your get the answer.

We can sit here and waste listing all the amps that will do it but you can search or google and get the same answers.


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

a$$hole said:


> SAZ-1500D - Google Product Search


Sorry I don't get it? The power [email protected]@12.5 volts is close. Mine does [email protected] ohms. Can usually get a used one for about 350 bucks. They are a decent product. he could go cheaper and get a Cadence.

GenXX,

what I was referring to was he sounds like either a teenager or early 20's. So bass is most likely first and foremost on his mind. Mind you this is a blind ASSUMPTION I could be wrong. I am 37. True most of the people I saw starting out when I was young had 6X9's EQ/boosters, those wedge pioneer TSX speakers on their rear deck and kicker boxes with the passive radiator. But subs always seemed to follow. By the 90's subs dominated. And when I was young you could't get a kilowatt amp for 200 bucks. Hell I was in highschool and had two 10's. Powered by a RF punch 45. Now days dear lord what I could have with the money I spent on just that stuff. 

It seems though that a lot of posters who may very well be from the other sites who inquire about issues that a lot on here think are stupid or just SPL oriented get kind of dickish. Yes this is a SQ oriented site. But how do you steer them in the right direction if they are turned away or people are blatently rude to them. Hell I saw one guy on a thread ridiculed because of his component selection. Granted he appears to be not so well liked, but that is still low.


----------



## kryptonitewhite (May 9, 2008)

I'm selling my Lanzar OPTI2000D that does 1100 RNS @ 2 ohm, I am currently running my Fi IB3 18" single 2ohm coil with it. $250 [email protected]

Just got it 4 months ago has 3 year warranty.


----------



## djknowledge (Feb 12, 2009)

if you are lookin for an amp that is 1000 rms just look at most old rockford amps....for ex thizs rockford power bd1000a is exactly 1000 watts rms at 2 ohm....even tho they are underrated and you are probably going to get more like 1200.....but nevertheless....even if you double from 500 to 1000 rms you are not going to get double the output as most people believe. if you want to get another high quality amp look at the orion d2400....it is stable down 1 ohm and is 1200 rms at 1 ohm. also any class d amp will play at full power at 2 ohm all you have to do is adjust the gain as an amp is pretty much a gain device. try searching rockford amp in ebay.....than click on car electronics on the left hand side.....then amps.....and finally mono or stereo or wuteva you are lookin for and it should narrow it down for you....below are a couple of links

ROCKFORD FOSGATE Power bd1000a Amp 1000 Watts Used - eBay (item 180328701594 end time Feb-20-09 13:32:04 PST)


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Well, cubdenno is right. I am early twenties. Ha ha. I used to have a mid level eclipse deck, a 100 watt 2 channel kicker amp powering stock speakers, and a 300 watt mono kicker amp powering a 12" L5. It sounded great, or so I thought, even with just the stock speakers. The bass was very loud, but I was still able to hear the music just fine. This was when I was 16. Fast forward to now and I have slightly nicer equipment. Unfortunately the deck is a downgrade, due to money issues, but the rest is an upgrade. In case you didn't click on the link at the top leading to my original posting, here is a copy from that post of what I now have.

Kenwood KDC 138
• CD player with built-in MOSFET amplifier (22 watts RMS/50 peak x 4 channels)
• low-pass filter and subwoofer level control
• inputs: front-panel auxiliary input
• outputs: one set of preamp outputs (can be switched to subwoofer mode)

Alpine SPS 600
• 6-1/2"/6-3/4" 2-way speakers (pair)
• power range: 2-80 watts RMS (240 watts peak power)
• frequency response: 70-22,000 Hz
• sensitivity: 88 dB

Alpine SPS 609
• 6"x9" 3-way speakers (pair)
• power range: 2-85 watts RMS (260 watts peak power)
• frequency response: 65-23,000 Hz
• sensitivity: 90 dB

Infinity 475A
• 4-channel car amplifier
• 75 watts RMS x 4 at 4 ohms (90 watts RMS x 4 at 2 ohms)
• 180 watts RMS x 2 at 4 ohms in bridged mode
• preamp-level inputs and outputs

Kicker 04S15L7-4
• 15" subwoofer with dual 4-ohm voice coils 
• dual 4-ohm voice coils for wiring flexibility 
• frequency response 18-100 Hz 
• power range 75-1,000 watts RMS (500 watts per coil) 
• peak power handling 2,000 watts 
• sensitivity 88.5 dB 

As you can see I'm missing an amp for the sub. Since the first system, I have learned a little about ohms, watts, watts rms, installation ect. and apart from amps, I have at one point or another installed the other other items into vehicles. I am going to try doing it all myself this time to save money, and therefore became a member on this site. I looked at a few others and everyone here knows by far the most, and is the most friendly and helpful. Since my sub is 1000 rms, I figured I should get a thousand, being as I want lots of bass. But I read above that the box has a lot to do with it. Something about headroom. The L7 came in a custom box, but apart from outer measurements, I have no idea what specs the box is. So what amp would you guys suggest then? Also I'm gonna need a line level converter. Can I get away with just one being as the deck has a set of sub pre outs so I can control bass with the deck, and the converter I buy can be used with the other amp? Or am I not understanding how they work properly? And last question, for this post at least, there are a million of them on ebay from one dollar to fifty. Do I need expensive ones, or are they all pretty much the same thing? Again, thank you to everybody who is helping out. I really appreciate. You guys are saving me hundreds of dollars. Thanks, Brian


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Well I just read my other posting, which I should have done first, and cubdenno had replied answering my line level converter question. If I understood it correctly, I need to get three sets of rca's therefore 2 line converters or one with four sets. Unfortunate about the box though. The guy I bought it from installs car audio professionally so I hope he knew what he was doing. He upgraded from what he sold me to dual 15" L7's, the newest ones. When I bought it, he unplugged the wire from his twin l7's and plugged it into mine and it sounded really good. Hopefully it's a good sign. Thanks again, Brian


----------



## br85 (May 2, 2008)

The reason we kinda go a bit funny with such powerful amps around here is that, since a balanced system usually can't produce a flat 110 db (in most cases), we don't really ever want or need our sub to pass 120 db, or our system is just boom. It is pretty easy for most subs to hit 120db above 30hz in most cars without massive amounts of power.

Also, at that volume, no matter how deadened your car is, more than 120db is going to be more shake and rattle than sound anyway, so it's just not sq in anyone's language.

disclaimer: I have a 1000W and gain set I have to have it more than -12db on my HU before I can even hear my front stage  so I will be upgrading my sub (ns18) and downgrading to a 250-500W amp to save my poor alternator and battery. SO unnecessary, please take heed from someone who's been there, 1000W is a lot of wasted money, heat, power, and battery/alternator life cycle.




Also, I should mention that any sub that is rated to 1000W is likely to be a 999.56W heater-coil and a 440mW subwoofer when you stick that much power on it. Guh.


----------



## falkenbd (Aug 16, 2008)

you have 1 full range output on your deck. don't get a LOC - get a decent crossover/eq.

you can get a little 1/2 din EQ that will take 1 input and split it into a low passed sub output and a hi passed output, and you'd get like 3-7 bands of EQ. Take a look at the classifieds here, I'm sure something pretty cheap would pop up...


----------



## kryptonitewhite (May 9, 2008)

br85 said:


> The reason we kinda go a bit funny with such powerful amps around here is that, since a balanced system usually can't produce a flat 110 db (in most cases), we don't really ever want or need our sub to pass 120 db, or our system is just boom. It is pretty easy for most subs to hit 120db above 30hz in most cars without massive amounts of power.
> 
> Also, at that volume, no matter how deadened your car is, more than 120db is going to be more shake and rattle than sound anyway, so it's just not sq in anyone's language.
> 
> ...


what if a guy were to tune lower and use a larger enclosure for a flatter/wider frequency responce curve and better efficiency?


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

falkenbd said:


> you have 1 full range output on your deck. don't get a LOC - get a decent crossover/eq.
> 
> you can get a little 1/2 din EQ that will take 1 input and split it into a low passed sub output and a hi passed output, and you'd get like 3-7 bands of EQ. Take a look at the classifieds here, I'm sure something pretty cheap would pop up...


I totally missed thinking about that option as well. Unless he doesn't have room in his dash. Plus part of why I agreed with the LOC, is to keep the ability to fade. Once he starts to buy more things, he might as well sell head unit, buy a little more expensive one. Or take a couple of Fukitols, and just run rca out to Infinty and then use outputs to go to Sub amp like Cajunner said. Lot's of possibilities.

As for 1000 watt amps on subs, I see a lot of Zapco 1100's, PDX1000, Audison 1.900's in the sigs on here. Hell Big Red can hit damn near a 150 on the TL and he is SQ. There is no reason to be ashamed of wanting to jam out to your music at whatever volume you like. Just make sure it is not JUST bass. You will eventually want to hear the words as well. And remember to take all advice, here, another forum, the local salesguy and friends with a grain of salt. We are not you. Your musical tastes are different. you could spend 20000 on an instal and equipment for a hypothetical best SQ car and not be happy because all you really wanted was comething clear sounding that could also rattle the filling in your best friends head sitting next to you in the passenger seat.

Tuning low in a car and going bigger on the enclosure does not necessarily increase efficiency. But it can. Tuning higher gives you an increase, bump or in some cases a spike at a particular frequency. the goal is to find that happy medium. Where you get efficiency, box size and low frequency extension that you can live with. Also remember that your musical tastes will change over time. You will add more to your playlist, often because there is one thing you want to hear in a particular song. I love to hear the strings plucked on Holly Cole Trio I can see clearly now. Or a fat bass guitar on Junior Wells Sweet Sixteen. the choir in Steelhearts G2BA. And occasionally the guilty pleasure of selecting the SPL setting on the c701 and turn up Down Incognito by Winger. Yeah I said it.. .Winger.


----------



## falkenbd (Aug 16, 2008)

cubdenno said:


> I totally missed thinking about that option as well. Unless he doesn't have room in his dash. Plus part of why I agreed with the LOC, is to keep the ability to fade. Once he starts to buy more things, he might as well sell head unit, buy a little more expensive one. Or take a couple of Fukitols, and just run rca out to Infinty and then use outputs to go to Sub amp like Cajunner said. Lot's of possibilities.


I don't think he has fader control now with a 4 channel running his 4 speakers.

Some of those 1/2 din EQs might have a fader on them as well...


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

So if I were to get something like this

Pyle 7BD 1/2 DIN EQ W Bass Boost

Then I wouldn't have to get a line level converter? As far as room goes, the stock stereo is a double din, the aftermarket a single. The dash kit has an empty cubby underneath the HU. I guess I could put it there if I can figure out how to do it.


----------



## br85 (May 2, 2008)

kryptonitewhite said:


> what if a guy were to tune lower and use a larger enclosure for a flatter/wider frequency responce curve and better efficiency?


Better efficiency means NOT needing as much power to get the desired SPL. And beware of making a large box and sending the qtc too low. Many subs are prone the mechanical failure if they are fed too much power with a low qtc. I can't stress it enough. NO ONE into sq needs 1000W for a sub/subs.


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

BR85 is correct, incorrectly boxing your woofer can be detrimental to the life span of your sub. Over excursion is a killer.

As for the 1000 watt thing, I have to respectfully disagree. What about the Speakerworks Grand National. It had 2 1000 watt amps on the substage. Won a couple or so SQ championships. To listen to 90-110db in a car odds are you are not going to need 1000 watts on a sub. Am pretty sure that there are other soundoff champs that have a 1000 watt rig on their substage and they are of course SQ oriented. Just doesn't mean they use it all the time.


----------



## thephallicphantom (Jan 11, 2009)

MTX 81000d or 1501d will put out 1000+ @ 2 ohms, nice bang for the buck amps


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

So if I get an equalizer like the one I mentioned above it will eliminate the need for line level converters?


----------



## br85 (May 2, 2008)

cubdenno said:


> BR85 is correct, incorrectly boxing your woofer can be detrimental to the life span of your sub. Over excursion is a killer.
> 
> As for the 1000 watt thing, I have to respectfully disagree. What about the Speakerworks Grand National. It had 2 1000 watt amps on the substage. Won a couple or so SQ championships. To listen to 90-110db in a car odds are you are not going to need 1000 watts on a sub. Am pretty sure that there are other soundoff champs that have a 1000 watt rig on their substage and they are of course SQ oriented. Just doesn't mean they use it all the time.


I'm not saying having 1000W amp is going to be detrimental for sq. Simply that USING 1000W on a substage is going to be detrimental on both the sq and on your wallet/alternator/battery. WAY better things to spend your hard earned on as far as increasing sq is concerned (esp for competition). Waveguides, better source units, better dsp, better baffling for midbass, and aesthetics (yep, what you see is likely to influence how good you think it sounds, both for your own personal satisfaction, and for points with comp. judges). After you've "perfected" ALL that, and you still have money to throw around, sure, knock yourself out with 1000W amp and enjoy sopme VBA now and again.


----------



## kid red (Jan 10, 2009)

The Arc Audio KS 1000.1 will do 1000w at 2ohm.


----------



## 8675309 (Jan 8, 2007)

I want 1000 watts at 16 ohms


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

So is that equalizer gonna work?


----------



## tyroneshoes (Mar 21, 2006)

Kenwood x1r


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

briansoeth said:


> So is that equalizer gonna work?


It should . Will look tomorrow when I am at work.


----------



## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

I ran an alpine ere g190 and that worked well, has a parametric for the sub as well as crossovers, sub level, fader, and a few high EQs. It is half DIN or something though, pretty long.

I might have a Dokken CD around here. Bullets to spare? lol

I had some cars with four 10s IB, wanted a little more so I did four 12s in this one. They are on a kicker at 420rms, it shakes stuff. I can clip the amp since the subs will take about 50% more power, but I think it is well above SQ since I can't even hear the highs in all four doors before it clips. Mind you they are EQ'ed to put out 20Hz and up pretty close to flat response, far from SPL tuning as they will go much louder at 50Hz if I take the EQ off and raise the 50Hz LP. So yeah, next try is going to be pair of 15s on 350rms but have more amp if I need. Starting to think I will end up running what I did in the early 90s with less changes than I thought.


----------



## falkenbd (Aug 16, 2008)

briansoeth said:


> So if I were to get something like this
> 
> Pyle 7BD 1/2 DIN EQ W Bass Boost
> 
> Then I wouldn't have to get a line level converter? As far as room goes, the stock stereo is a double din, the aftermarket a single. The dash kit has an empty cubby underneath the HU. I guess I could put it there if I can figure out how to do it.


i wouldn't get that particular one. but that is the right idea. 

you want with a sub output with adjustable low pass filter and high pass filter on the others outputs


This one here has it all Clarion EQS746 Equalizers Sound Processors Car Audio and Video - Sonic Electronix this link is just for reference, I'm not saying to buy it there...

50 hz or 90 hz crossover. you get fader between the front and rear, and sub level control. as well as a 7 band graphic EQ.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

So as far as an amp goes, I would wire in 2 ohm. Is it even possible to wire in 1 ohm with out 2 subs? Either way I found a good deal on this amp

Kenwood KAC-X810D Reviews

from a friend of mine. It can do 800 rms @ 2 ohm, and 1000 rms @ 1 ohm? Think it's worth getting, or am I gonna wish I got something bigger? Keeping in mind I want lots of bass. Thanks guys, I can't wait to take and post pictures when it's done!


----------



## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

I like the Kenwoods for the price, though some don't put out rated power which is typical for cheaper amps. But at 800rms a 100 more is not going to make much difference, and the pricing is good on them. They seem to hold up better than other cheap amps.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

But is it physically possible to wire it at 1 ohm with only 1 sub?


----------



## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

briansoeth said:


> But is it physically possible to wire it at 1 ohm with only 1 sub?


Sure just get a DVC 2 ohm, like an alpine type r 1222d, and parallel for 1 ohm.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Well, Here's my sub, Kicker 04S15L7-4, It's DVC with 1000 wrms and my amp is 1000 wrms @ 1ohm stable, so it should work just fine then huh?


----------



## sotelomichael (Dec 2, 2008)

I sold a kicker zx1000.1 on another forum, it does 1000w RMS @ 2ohm. That would fit your need. But if you feel like getting some more head room, I've got a phoenix gold xenon 1200.1 that is stable @ 1 2 3 or 4 ohms. These amps do around 1400 watts.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Well I got this amp Kenwood KAC-X810D Reviews which does 1000 @ 1 ohm, so I should be able to wire to one ohm, right?


----------



## kevismyhandle (Jan 1, 2007)

look in to JBL GTO14001. stable @ 2 ohms.


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

briansoeth said:


> Well, Here's my sub, Kicker 04S15L7-4, It's DVC with 1000 wrms and my amp is 1000 wrms @ 1ohm stable, so it should work just fine then huh?


The answer is no. Your sub is a dual 4 ohm VC sub. You can wire it stereo @ 4 ohms, series @ 8 ohm or parallel @ 2ohms. If you have two of them you could.

Seriously though, if you have the Kenwood amp run it and don't worry about it. the difference between the power out put of 2 or 1 ohm, you are not really going to notice. Plus you will not be killing the amp. I would just research the best design you can get to make an enclosure to house your sub. And run with it.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Gotcha. I'll just do that then. Thanks again. I'm just waiting for my cap and equalizer to come then I can start hooking up. Actually, I just thought of a question. I was going to use the cap, 2.4 farad, for the mono amp, being as I previously had the four channel hooked up with no cap and everything was fine. Am I able to hook two amps up to one cap, or should I just stick with what I planned? Thanks


----------



## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

More caps the better IMO, though caps are a whole 'nother thread, but if you are going to use them I'd say put them all in.


----------



## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

Alpine MRP-M1000 (mrpm1000) Mono Subwoofer Amps Car Amplifiers Car Audio and Video - Sonic Electronix

ive used this with a 12 w7

and sometimes u really dont need 1000rms on a subwoofer beacuase in sq the driver with the smallest frequency range is the subwoofer and also most times the subwoofer is soft and subtle so 1000rms isnt neccisarily needed as music is dynamic and only draws as much power as needed and ur subwoofer wont draw 1000rms if its at a low volume

but the extra power gives u extra headroom


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

It won't matter really as the cap will actually supply both amps, your lights, your radio, your wipers... get my point? The cap is part of your electrical system when installed just like your battery or alt.. Try to install it as close to your sub amp as possible.I used to be a big fan of caps when i was younger but with these kilowatt+ systems out there, you really need an extra battery/bigger alt. I am pushing about 2200 watts and I slapped in a 2 farad cap and no change I have dimming.


----------



## briansoeth (Feb 17, 2009)

Alright, well I don't think I can do my cap like that, simply because I don't know how.  I was just going to put it in between the mono amp and battery, but was wondering if I can connect two amps to it. Either way, I put the stereo in last weekend with no problems, and tomorrow with be the 4 channel amp and speaker. Still waiting for an equalizer, and as soon as I get one, I can put the other amp and sub in. If anyone has a link to a diagram of how to bridge the amp it ould be appreciated. I believe I know how, but an extra look can't hurt. Thanks, Brian


----------



## Luke352 (Jul 24, 2006)

Audiosystem F2>500 does 2 x 230rms @ 4 ohm or bridged it will do 800rms x 1 @ 4 ohm and 1200rms @ 2 ohm bridged. I run two of them one powers my midbass the other my sub.


----------



## hernanrod (Jun 4, 2008)

phoenix gold xenon x1200.1

1200 watts @ 1, 2 and 4 ohms


----------



## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

briansoeth said:


> Alright, well I don't think I can do my cap like that, simply because I don't know how.  I was just going to put it in between the mono amp and battery, but was wondering if I can connect two amps to it. Either way, I put the stereo in last weekend with no problems, and tomorrow with be the 4 channel amp and speaker. Still waiting for an equalizer, and as soon as I get one, I can put the other amp and sub in. If anyone has a link to a diagram of how to bridge the amp it ould be appreciated. I believe I know how, but an extra look can't hurt. Thanks, Brian


If you hook up the cap like you are supposed to, all your equipment will be running off the cap.


----------



## MidnightG35X (Feb 5, 2009)

Eclipse DA6213 will do 1100x1 at 2 Ohm, 1000x1 at 4 ohm also


----------

