# Alpine PXA-H800 Processor Discussion Thread



## Salad Fingers

So I was at the MERA Knowledgefest the last couple of days and a certain high profile Alpine employee was there for some of the trainings. At the end of one of them I asked when the new PXA-H701 was coming out. His response "soon enough". I about ****, because I was just kidding!!! After it was over, I approached him for more info, but he said he had already told me too much. Afterwards, I met him down in the exhibition hall and tried once more for some information. I got way more than I ever expected. Basically, it's going to be very similar, with some really cool improvements, in the same basic price range, and will indeed have an optical in. After he told me the optical part, I had to ask if that meant a resurgence in optical outs for the screens and/or head units. He told me that it wouldn't make much sense to produce a high end processor with an optical in and not offer a head unit with an optical out. It should also either include or have the option of a separate single din controller, much like the RUX-C701.

SO, there you go. I have a feeling that I'll be getting in trouble for this somehow, but I also feel like I should share this incredibly exciting news with you guys. I know there is probably a better suited area for this, but I wasn't sure what it was and because this section gets much more traffic, I thought it would be seen. Thanks, and I hope you are as excited as I am!!!


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## Salad Fingers

Oh yea, targeted for first quarter of 2011!!!!


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## rakisto

sounds exciting! about time.


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## SneakyCyber

WOW great maybe I will hold off on the MS8 and stick with the alpine setup.

(edit: This is in reference to a setup I posted on the DIYaudio page I will post a build log here when I am closer to completion)


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## wdemetrius1

That great news! I'm happy to hear that they appear to be going back to putting out higher quality units, compared to what they have been putting out lately. That's coming from an Alpine fan.


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## ALL4SQ

Glad to hear Alpine is coming out with as processor that doesn't lock out the user like Imprint and doesn't cost to much. 

I guess I can stop buying used H701's now.


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## titansfan

I guess I can stop buying used H701's now. :D[/QUOTE said:


> Nothing wrong with that. I'm still using mine, and I have a new ms-8 sitting in my spare room. The H701 is still my favorite processor.


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## Toys7505

Maybe the Bitone and the MS8 have kicked Alpine in the @$$ and are now taking the offensive to produce and put out something to match or rival their competition. I wish Alpine would go back to high quality products like the F1 line or similiar (i.e. CDA-7949 era). If, and when it does come out, hopefully it will be compatible with previous Alpine HU's......


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## TREETOP

This is good news especially considering they've done away with active capable head units.
I expect they'll release more info at CES in January. Any bets on whether we'll hear more sooner than that?


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## nineball

TREETOP said:


> This is good news especially considering they've done away with active capable head units.
> I expect they'll release more info at CES in January. Any bets on whether we'll hear more sooner than that?



considering the ms-8 thread on here was started 3 years before it was released i'd say that is a safe bet.


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## Salad Fingers

nineball said:


> considering the ms-8 thread on here was started 3 years before it was released i'd say that is a safe bet.


I don't think that is going to happen. I've been selling Alpine for years, and they are so secretive about upcoming releases that I know on more than one occasion I have had a CUSTOMER tell me about a new product. Be expecting to see it first quarter of 2011...


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## mmiller

Thank you Jesus!!!!!!!!!!


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## SneakyCyber

I talked to my sales rep in Toledo, He talked to Alpine and they wont know anything Firm until they meet in California in December for the Rep conference. It will likely show up at CES in January and we will see it in stores March and maybe as late as June.. I hope its sooner then that I am salivating at the news.. Although I do have to save up the money to buy one.. I am expecting retail at 700 real world around 600. On par with the MS-8


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## I800C0LLECT

Gewd times 

It's hard to to put all my eggs in the P99 when a "multimedia" double din + H701 would be easier to sell to the wife


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## bmwproboi05

man i just ordred the bit one :/


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## SneakyCyber

I am looking at upgrading my 9886 to 9887 to tide me over until the new imprint comes out.


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## evo9

Fingers crossed hoping for 3 pairs of RCA out on the front channel. It would be nice if they release this HU in the USA Alpine*-*Mobile Media Stations*-*IVA-D511R 

It has optical out via the KWE-610A cable. Plus adjustable illumination to match one's car interior.



.


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## SneakyCyber

Why cant you have it shipped here?


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## Mirage_Man

Well this is interesting news. I was just on the phone the other day with Alpine CS about another matter and I mentioned how I was really disappointed in Alpine for not offering a more user tweak-able like the H701 anymore. Or for that matter the fact that none of the new HU's having optical outputs. The guy said that's what the imprint modules were for . Well obviously he just doesn't understand our mentality . Anyway, I'm glad to hear the news except I just sent my H701 off to have Matt R modify it.


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## bmwproboi05

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-member-build-logs/90965-iasca-sqi-rookie-build.html


guy said he has a "Alpine PHA-H701 (yet to be released to the public)"


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## evo9

bmwproboi05 said:


> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-member-build-logs/90965-iasca-sqi-rookie-build.html
> 
> 
> guy said he has a "Alpine PHA-H701 (yet to be released to the public)"


He said on shopping list!







.


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## SneakyCyber

Ya I wish I was that lucky NO ONE has one yet. That I know of


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## Mic10is

What I heard from some guys who talked to Steve Brown at MERA it really wont be much like the H700/701 at all. Its an upgraded version of Imprint that fixes many of the auto tune features that the original version has. It will have some, but limited ability for the user to make fine adjustments.


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## Mirage_Man

Mic10is said:


> What I heard from some guys who talked to Steve Brown at MERA it really wont be much like the H700/701 at all. Its an upgraded version of Imprint that fixes many of the auto tune features that the original version has. It will have some, but limited ability for the user to make fine adjustments.


So much for that .


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## n_olympios

Although I'd love to get my hands on a PXA-H700/1 replacement just for the sake of it, you guys have to understand that most people DON'T care to tune the car themselves, we're a minority in the car audio market. 

Let's not forget that the H700 did have auto-EQ and auto-TA, as did most upmarket Pioneer units, as did the F#1 (both generations). Did they work? Did they f*ck. Nowadays though, with modern algorithms, readily available chipsets and careful software design, it's much easier to auto-tune (and sound right). The Audyssey software found in Imprint, Audison's implementation in the BitOne and the DSP/Logic7 in MS-8 are all great examples of that. Some may be more capable than the others, but they all share the same basic concept. 

Let's hope I'm 100% wrong though, and the new Alpine processor, aside of its auto features, has an all-out manually tunable environment. :blush:


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## CBRworm

It's about time. I've been running my W200/H701 way too long...


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## ChiTownSQ

Im not getting rid of my 700 and my 701 yet.....


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## Salad Fingers

Mic10is said:


> What I heard from some guys who talked to Steve Brown at MERA it really wont be much like the H700/701 at all. Its an upgraded version of Imprint that fixes many of the auto tune features that the original version has. It will have some, but limited ability for the user to make fine adjustments.


Interesting, that is not the impression he gave me at all. He was very apprehensive about divulging any information and everything I wrote was pretty much me saying/asking and him responding. He didn't really volunteer a ton on info. I guess we wont know what it's going to be until it's out or at least announced, so lets just keep our fingers crossed for the picture that was painted to me!!!!!


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## nubz69

Toys7505 said:


> Maybe the Bitone and the MS8 have kicked Alpine in the @$$ and are now taking the offensive to produce and put out something to match or rival their competition. I wish Alpine would go back to high quality products like the F1 line or similiar (i.e. CDA-7949 era). If, and when it does come out, hopefully it will be compatible with previous Alpine HU's......


Considering processors account for about 1% of the market I doubt that MS-8 and bit one sales have caused them to come out with something new. I think it may be the fact that the imprint processor, which is great in theory, works poorly in real life.


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## Mic10is

Salad Fingers said:


> Interesting, that is not the impression he gave me at all. He was very apprehensive about divulging any information and everything I wrote was pretty much me saying/asking and him responding. He didn't really volunteer a ton on info. I guess we wont know what it's going to be until it's out or at least announced, so lets just keep our fingers crossed for the picture that was painted to me!!!!!


I'll put it to you the way I was told by someone who works for another company who has a great processor coming out . hopefully next year.

When a company like Zapco or Arc Audio or any smaller company releases a new product and they get 2000 in sales in a year-thats awesome for them.
A company like ALpine Japan releases a product and they dont get near 2000 in sales a quarter--that means it gets discontinued.

There is virtually no market for processors like the H700/701, P9D9, Bitone etc...in the good ole USA.
that stuff simply doesnt sell bc the average and even above average consumer has no clue on how to tune a car.

but Products like Imprint, and MS8 that can make a big improvement in sound for not a ton of money does have a market.

Another pretty easy way to tell is look at the international websites.
Alpine has nothing on Alpine Japan's website about a new processor even close to the H701.

I had my H700 a full year before it was released in the US bc I had my mom in Japan ship it to me. It had already been out for a half a year in Japan when I got it.

I would be VERY surprised if any Japanese company released a product in the US before releasing it in Japan 1st.


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## xpsvwino

Check out the PKG-H701s on Alpine Japan's website.


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## xpsvwino

xpsvwino said:


> Check out the PKG-H701s on Alpine Japan's website.


PKG-H701S


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## Mic10is

huh, apparently my source was wrong...

I dont see a much if any differences between the original and new version


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## doitor

It looks like it's the same piece but that model is for the combo deal (H701 + C701)

PKG-H701's as in Package 701's.

PKG-H701S | ƒ}ƒ‹ƒ`ƒ�ƒfƒBƒAƒ}ƒl�[ƒWƒƒ�[ | ƒwƒbƒhƒ†ƒjƒbƒg | ALPINE Japan

PXA-H701 alone.

PXA-H701 | ƒ}ƒ‹ƒ`ƒ�ƒfƒBƒAƒ}ƒl�[ƒWƒƒ�[ | ƒwƒbƒhƒ†ƒjƒbƒg | ALPINE Japan

RUX-C701 alone.

RUX-C701 | ƒ}ƒ‹ƒ`ƒ�ƒfƒBƒAƒ}ƒl�[ƒWƒƒ�[ | ƒwƒbƒhƒ†ƒjƒbƒg | ALPINE Japan

J.


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## n_olympios

Indeed, there's nothing new about that. It's the same ol' unit.


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## evo9

xpsvwino said:


> PKG-H701S




Wrong Einstein! 
PKG-H701S is the, PXA-H701 & RUX-C701 package together as one. Hence the "PKG". I have a PKG-H701S sitting in my closet for the past 5 months. 





.


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## Salad Fingers

Yea, I don't think that is what he was talking about.


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## SneakyCyber

Keep an eye on the Alpine USA website there releasing the 2011 preview on January 6th


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## mmiller

yup if they have anything it will be at CES!


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## Mirage_Man

Bump for any news from CES on this?


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## rakisto

come on someone update about CES! haha.. i'm stuck in indiana for work otherwise i'd be all over the alpine exhibit @ CES!


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## nepl29

keep checking on this link regurlarly Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.


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## Salad Fingers

My boss is out there right now, but through a little investigative work I've been able to find some fun info. You'll have to read both to learn all that there is to know at this very moment, but we'll have more info soon enough! PXA-H800 has digital in and an independant controller. Here is a bulk of the info...

http://www.virtualpressoffice.com/p...eToDisableHistory=Y&menuName=Home&sId=&sInfo=

http://www.virtualpressoffice.com/p...omOtherPageToDisableHistory=T&menuName=Events

...and here is a pic I took from the Mobile Electronics magazine that came in yesterday...










...and the song that came to mind as I'm reading all of this stuff "When the **** Goes Down", because it appears **** is going down!!!!!!!!!!


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## Salad Fingers

The INA-910 looks like it is going to be freaking sweeeet. Built in bluetooth, built in HD Radio, first unit to work with a yet to be released SiriusXM module that plugs in with one connection, full control of Pandora with album art, digital out to the PXA-H800, and built in "three 4-volt pre-amp outputs, 7-band EQ, time correction, crossover, and a 24-bit Burr-Brown Digital-to-Analog converter"... ALL OUT OF THE BOX!!!!!


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## Salad Fingers

Controller part number will be RUX-C800 per this...

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...axieQB&usg=AFQjCNGl44UEYbtLEmaSkUXZIy8FFd9uaw


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## ErinH

^ ROAD EQ... finally, their F1 technology seems to be trickling down...

sub'd for further information.



> The PXA-H800 will be available in April for $699.95 MAP.


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## Salad Fingers

bikinpunk said:


> ^ ROAD EQ... finally, their F1 technology seems to be trickling down...
> 
> sub'd for further information.


Fuuuuuuck, in my giddiness I didn't even see that. Damn, I have also been waiting and wondering what happened to that technology. **** yea, the **** is going down in an even greater way than I had originally thought.


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## badmotorscooter

I will be at the show shortly. If I get a chance to stop by Alpine I will throw some info in this thread.


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## ErinH

The real question is... how long will it take for them to actually have this stuff out on the market? Knowing alpine, we all will have a very long time to save up our money to try the new toys...


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## beachboy

hear from my dealer in singapore the H800 will be available around april. 

waiting to see more spec from H800


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## rakisto

EDIT* travis posted already. lol me fail


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## Salad Fingers

bikinpunk said:


> The real question is... how long will it take for them to actually have this stuff out on the market? Knowing alpine, we all will have a very long time to save up our money to try the new toys...


I thought the same, maybe we'll see this stuff by 2013!!!!!!


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## chefhow

That isn't a replacement for the H701 it's a beefed up Imprint like everyone was speculating. Very disappointing, but not surprised.


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## [email protected]

Ya, 3 sets of outputs are weak, the H701 had 4


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## beachboy

BeatsDownLow said:


> Ya, 3 sets of outputs are weak, the H701 had 4


only 3 out put ? i guess i will go and buy ms8 instead of waiting for his...


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## [email protected]

.......


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## Salad Fingers

Do we know only 3 for sure? It said 3 pairs out of the 910, but not much info I've seen yet on the H800... or did I miss it?


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## [email protected]

Salad Fingers said:


> Do we know only 3 for sure? It said 3 pairs out of the 910, but not much info I've seen yet on the H800... or did I miss it?


Reading over me again today, sorry. You were talking about the 910


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## chefhow

Even if it's 4 outputs it's still very limited in it's eq according to the pic. Is it auto T/A or can it do manual as well? The pic of the mag is very discouraging.


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## beachboy

BeatsDownLow said:


> Reading over me again today, sorry. You were talking about the 910


still have hope........


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## Salad Fingers

chefhow said:


> Even if it's 4 outputs it's still very limited in it's eq according to the pic. Is it auto T/A or can it do manual as well? The pic of the mag is very discouraging.


Well, I took a better look at the magazine. You may not be able to see it in the pic I posted, but there is a DTS and Dolby DD logo up at the top corner of the unit. That would tell me that it at least has a center channel out, right? The only thing it says it "User Customization" which could mean anything. I would imagine that if the 910 already has manual 7 band eq, T/A, and crossovers, that the ones on the H800 would be more extensive.


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## Salad Fingers

...plus the RoadEQ is a nice surprise!


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## BowDown

RoadEQ?


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## ErinH

BowDown said:


> RoadEQ?


Alpine DVI-F900 and PXI-H990 Review - Source Unit Reviews - Car Audio and Electronics


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## badmotorscooter

Sorry guys, no Alpine booth at the show. They only had meeting rooms and I doubt I was on the invite list. However Cadence had a 36" aluminum speaker, hung on a cherry picker.


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## rain27

So, the auto eq is essentially the same as the old version of Imprint?


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## minibox

Released only years after the bitone and does less than other comparably priced units, great job Alpine!


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## Wheres The Butta

road EQ is really cool, I've never even heard of that before...


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## s4turn

yes that does look like a nice feature.

I was actually thinking of having another EQ preset when driving with the h701


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## beachboy

anyone know how many output port for this H800? cant find much info from alpine website.


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## Mic10is

PXA-H800 Audio Processor » Alpine Underground

has end user tuning and adjustability


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## Salad Fingers

I zoomed in like a MF and i looks like:

-New ImprintEQ signal tuning technology
-RoadEQ processing (can't make out the other stuff)
-6 ch high/low voltage inputs for both OEM and aftermarket installation
-4 x (something) 24 bit (something) D/A converter 
-2 x 32 bit floating (something) DSP
-8 (I think 8) channel full range 4V pre outs
-2 x optical input (INA-W910 AND older 160G AppleT TV optical in!!!!)
-S/N 105db/110db (Analog/digital)
-165 (or 105?) band Graphic EQ or 65 (or 55?) band Parametric EQ

also under the display (which is quite nice looking) it looks like it has to be used in all systems for full control, even Ai-Net and that to Imprint you have to connect a PC.


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## jim walter

Hi Guys,

A few quick corrections on things.

Fully Manual Tuning built-in ... a la F#1 Status and H701
Dual Optical Input + Ai-Net Input + Ai-Net Aux
Ai-Net Connection to INA-W910 - Preset, Sub Level and Balance/Fader

Tuning is done via the new RUX or the PC Software

6CH Input (RCA or SPK Input - Up to 10V Input) / 8CH Fully Active Output (4V Output)
- In fact, our CES Demo Car is running an 8CH Active 4-way setup w 2x1" TW, 2x5" Mid, 2x8" Front Sub, 4x12" Rear Subs)

Improvements over the H700:
Huge Signal-to-Noise Improvement - 110 Digital / 105 Analog
Increased Channel Separation - 90dB
Significantly More Powerful Manual Tuning 
(+/-12dB for all bands vs. 9dB)
10 Band Parametric for Front Rear and Center (vs 5)
5 Band Parametric for Sub (vs 2)
Includes ability for 36dB XO Slopes
-24dB to 0 Level Control (vs -10dB)

Yes, it has ImprintEQ built in, however this is a totally new tuning process compared to the previous Imprint It is significantly more detail in its resolution/measurements, especially in the mid and LF range. This allows us to tune that area with a lot more detail and accuracy. On top of that, you guys will be able to choose from 3 Alpine defined target curves, as well as set your own target curves (drag and drop in the PC software) to auto-tune to your tastes. You'll be able to tune to your taste, either by full manual tuning, auto-correction or auto-correction + your own manual turning.

It is designed to work in both OEM and ultra-high end AFT system, with the ability to manually or automatically to satisfy pretty much any tweakophile.

More to come later ... 

Jim (from Vegas)


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## Mic10is

jim walter said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> A few quick corrections on things.
> 
> Fully Manual Tuning built-in ... a la F#1 Status and H701
> Dual Optical Input + Ai-Net Input + Ai-Net Aux
> Ai-Net Connection to INA-W910 - Preset, Sub Level and Balance/Fader
> 
> Tuning is done via the new RUX or the PC Software
> 
> 6CH Input (RCA or SPK Input - Up to 10V Input) / 8CH Fully Active Output (4V Output)
> - In fact, our CES Demo Car is running an 8CH Active 4-way setup w 2x1" TW, 2x5" Mid, 2x8" Front Sub, 4x12" Rear Subs)
> 
> Improvements over the H700:
> Huge Signal-to-Noise Improvement - 110 Digital / 105 Analog
> Increased Channel Separation - 90dB
> Significantly More Powerful Manual Tuning
> (+/-12dB for all bands vs. 9dB)
> 10 Band Parametric for Front Rear and Center (vs 5)
> 5 Band Parametric for Sub (vs 2)
> Includes ability for 36dB XO Slopes
> -24dB to 0 Level Control (vs -10dB)
> 
> Yes, it has ImprintEQ built in, however this is a totally new tuning process compared to the previous Imprint It is significantly more detail in its resolution/measurements, especially in the mid and LF range. This allows us to tune that area with a lot more detail and accuracy. On top of that, you guys will be able to choose from 3 Alpine defined target curves, as well as set your own target curves (drag and drop in the PC software) to auto-tune to your tastes. You'll be able to tune to your taste, either by full manual tuning, auto-correction or auto-correction + your own manual turning.
> 
> It is designed to work in both OEM and ultra-high end AFT system, with the ability to manually or automatically to satisfy pretty much any tweakophile.
> 
> More to come later ...
> 
> Jim (from Vegas)


thanks for clarification. biggest question--can you use a non-alpine head unit with it without ridiculous floor noise? or without having to use the controller for volume?


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## jim walter

Mic10is said:


> thanks for clarification. biggest question--can you use a non-alpine head unit with it without ridiculous floor noise? or without having to use the controller for volume?


You're welcome!

HU - Yes, the Analog Input side is significantly improved vs the H700. 

Volume - No, the volume is controlled either via Ai-Net of via the RUX


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## Mic10is

jim walter said:


> You're welcome!
> 
> 
> 
> Volume - No, the volume is controlled either via Ai-Net of via the RUX



grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

thanks for the info tho.

Is volume controlled just like on the H-700? Where you set the Head unit volume and then use the RUX to control it? but really you can just turn up the volume on the RUX and use the head unit volume anyways?


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## evo9

jim walter said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> A few quick corrections on things.
> 
> Fully Manual Tuning built-in ... a la F#1 Status and H701
> Dual Optical Input + Ai-Net Input + Ai-Net Aux
> Ai-Net Connection to INA-W910 - Preset, Sub Level and Balance/Fader
> 
> Tuning is done via the new RUX or the PC Software
> 
> 6CH Input (RCA or SPK Input - Up to 10V Input) /* 8CH Fully Active Output (4V Output)*
> - In fact, our CES Demo Car is running an 8CH Active 4-way setup w 2x1" TW, 2x5" Mid, 2x8" Front Sub, 4x12" Rear Subs)
> 
> Improvements over the H700:
> Huge Signal-to-Noise Improvement - 110 Digital / 105 Analog
> Increased Channel Separation - 90dB
> Significantly More Powerful Manual Tuning
> (+/-12dB for all bands vs. 9dB)
> 10 Band Parametric for Front Rear and Center (vs 5)
> 5 Band Parametric for Sub (vs 2)
> Includes ability for 36dB XO Slopes
> -24dB to 0 Level Control (vs -10dB)
> 
> Yes, it has ImprintEQ built in, however this is a totally new tuning process compared to the previous Imprint It is significantly more detail in its resolution/measurements, especially in the mid and LF range. This allows us to tune that area with a lot more detail and accuracy. On top of that, you guys will be able to choose from 3 Alpine defined target curves, as well as set your own target curves (drag and drop in the PC software) to auto-tune to your tastes. You'll be able to tune to your taste, either by full manual tuning, auto-correction or auto-correction + your own manual turning.
> 
> It is designed to work in both OEM and ultra-high end AFT system, with the ability to manually or automatically to satisfy pretty much any tweakophile.
> 
> More to come later ...
> 
> Jim (from Vegas)




So, if I want to run a 5.1 system. I will still have to use the bitone to run a 3 way front active.:disappointed: :disappointed: 




.


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## jim walter

evo9 said:


> So, if I want to run a 5.1 system. I will still have to use the bitone to run a 3 way front active.:disappointed: :disappointed:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I don't see how you're doing that right now with 3-way front active, plus the need for Center, RL, RR and Sub ... by my count thats 6+3+.1 ... there's 8CH of output on the BitOne, no?


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## evo9

jim walter said:


> I don't see how you're doing that right now with 3-way front active, plus the need for Center, RL, RR and Sub ... by my count thats 6+3+.1 ... there's 8CH of output on the BitOne, no?




Full range front from PXA-H800 into bitone. Thats what I was doing with the IVA-W505 & PXA-H701. 





.


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## jim walter

Or you can use two H800s in that manner.  Better Channel Separation, especially for that critical front stage.


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## evo9

jim walter said:


> Or you can use two H800s in that manner.  Better Channel Separation, especially for that critical front stage.



Are you saying they are strappable like the last genration PXI-H990 F#1 processor?? If that is the case, I would say we have a winner here!!






.


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## chefhow

And an arrival date of?


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## Mirage_Man

A couple questions...

#1 Will the H800 accept an optical input from other Alpine head units like the W505, W200 etc..?

#2 If it will accept the optical in from older HU's I assume that the C801 controller can be used for all functions but will those older HU's be able to control it via ainet and their UI or is the W910 the only HU capable of that?


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## ErinH

jim walter said:


> 10 Band Parametric for Front Rear and Center (vs 5)
> 5 Band Parametric for Sub (vs 2)
> Includes ability for 36dB XO Slopes
> -24dB to 0 Level Control (vs -10dB)


Jim, thanks for dropping in. 
I have a couple questions as well:

Will the 800 also have graphic eq? If so, can it be used in conjunction with the parametric or will you have to choose one like the 701?
Are the crossover points 1/3 octave or something else? You mentioned pc setup...do we have the luxury to manually type in desired crossover points?
With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?


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## ekrunch

Man I'm stoked! I love my IXA-W407/DHA-S690 and PXA-H701/RUX-C701 setup, but I'll be REALLY happy to have a cleaner processor and still keep my up front controller. 

Please tell me it has a spectrum analyzer like the C701 does! I mean come on, the Alpine "dancing EQ" is a classic and I would hope they'd continue that tradition.


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## chefhow

ekrunch said:


> Man I'm stoked! I love my IXA-W407/DHA-S690 and PXA-H701/RUX-C701 setup, but I'll be REALLY happy to have a cleaner processor and still keep my up front controller.
> 
> Please tell me it has a spectrum analyzer like the C701 does! I mean come on, the Alpine "dancing EQ" is a classic and I would hope they'd continue that tradition.


Does the W407 have an optical out?


----------



## BurntCircuits

jim walter said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> A few quick corrections on things.
> 
> Fully Manual Tuning built-in ... a la F#1 Status and H701
> Dual Optical Input + Ai-Net Input + Ai-Net Aux
> Ai-Net Connection to INA-W910 - Preset, Sub Level and Balance/Fader
> 
> Tuning is done via the new RUX or the PC Software


Thanks for the update Jim!

Is the Ai-Net compatable with older Alpine units (W505) & is the PC connection USB or serial?


----------



## pyropoptrt

bikinpunk said:


> Jim, thanks for dropping in.
> I have a couple questions as well:
> 
> Will the 800 also have graphic eq? If so, can it be used in conjunction with the parametric or will you have to choose one like the 701?
> Are the crossover points 1/3 octave or something else? You mentioned pc setup...do we have the luxury to manually type in desired crossover points?
> With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?


I would like to know this information as well


----------



## jacampb2

Ok, this is the first Alpine product that has piqued my interest in a long time. I also have a few questions-- 

1)It is still DTS/DD capable, correct? From the logo's on it, it appears so, but I don't see it actually confirmed yet.

2)Optical input, is it still S/Pdif via Toslink, or is it proprietary?

3)Can the PC software do anything but tuning? I.e., can the pc software be used for direct control, or can a plugin be written that allows control via the PC interface. To clarify, I am thinking of we carputer folks who have a permanent PC residing in the install and want to minimize the the amount of controllers and other hardware crammed in our dash. 

I for one have my carputer almost completed and was planning on using an older processor for audio duties. I might be swayed toward an Alpine solution if the above are possible/planned. I have been toying with the idea of a H700 and the RS232/AiNet interface that has been developed over at Mp3Car-- current technology and a manufacture supported product would be awesome though. 

Thanks,
Jason


----------



## Salad Fingers

jacampb2 said:


> To clarify, I am thinking of we carputer folks who have a permanent PC residing in the install and want to minimize the the amount of controllers and other hardware crammed in our dash.
> 
> I for one have my carputer almost completed and was planning on using an older processor for audio duties.


Why not use a Bit One?


----------



## jacampb2

Salad Fingers said:


> Why not use a Bit One?


No DD/DTS, just simulated surround from what I understand. On the rare occasion we watch a movie in the car, I want the availability of DD or DTS.


----------



## BigRed

from what I understand from speaking to Jim yesterday, here are the differences

imprint ability with target curves adjustable
better s/n
must use the rux controller for full functionality regardless of deck
2 optical inputs
eq and peq cannot be used simultaneously just like the 701


----------



## tusk

Subscribed for updates... gonna have to start pinching pennies now...


----------



## Mirage_Man

Spoke with a tech at Alpine this AM. As already posted, to control the unit the C800 will have to be employed. As to whether or not it has standard optical digital connections was unknown.


----------



## ekrunch

They say a picture is worth a thousand words, so here's 3,000 words about the new processor. Straight off of the wall at CES. 



























And to the poster who asked, no, the IXA-W407 does not have a digital output.


----------



## ReloadedSS

Thanks for the pics. Looks like Alpine went with Wolfson DACs instead of Burr-Brown on this one.


----------



## kyheng

Why? BB are not the best, it maybe, but depending on the cost, cirucit design....
No doubt that Alpine F#1, Pioneer ODR uses BB's DAC, but recent DSP/Hu start using other brands like Bit1 using Wolfson's Codec.
Maybe Alpine latest using WM8740 or 8741?
The built in DSP are more important, because data go thru it first before reaches DACs... Using Sharc would be great.....


----------



## subwoofery

Mic10is said:


> grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
> 
> thanks for the info tho.
> 
> Is volume controlled just like on the H-700? Where you set the Head unit volume and then use the RUX to control it? but really you can just turn up the volume on the RUX and use the head unit volume anyways?


lol, and you were the one telling us that there wouldn't be any replacement for the H701 since Japan doesn't have anything... pfff...  
Just kidding... subscribed 

Kelvin


----------



## TokoSpeaker

It looks better than before


----------



## Salami

bikinpunk said:


> [*]Will the 800 also have graphic eq? If so, can it be used in conjunction with the parametric or will you have to choose one like the 701?
> 
> [*]With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?
> [/LIST]


Part of your questions.

165 band graphic EQ or 55 band parametric. 

If this is per channel, that would be pretty damn good, eh?


----------



## n_olympios

LOL too good to be true, yeah.


----------



## vidizzle

so from what is known about the h800.. what advantages would it have over the h701?

if i have a h701, would it be justifiable to get the new unit when it is released?


----------



## ReloadedSS

kyheng said:


> Why? BB are not the best, it maybe, but depending on the cost, cirucit design....
> No doubt that Alpine F#1, Pioneer ODR uses BB's DAC, but recent DSP/Hu start using other brands like Bit1 using Wolfson's Codec.
> Maybe Alpine latest using WM8740 or 8741?
> The built in DSP are more important, because data go thru it first before reaches DACs... Using Sharc would be great.....


Can't say why they went for Wolfson instead of BB; I know Kenwood went with Wolfson for their Excelon decks in the past few years. I'm not an engineer, but by reputation I thought BB were as good or better than any other D/A conv out there.


----------



## subwoofery

vidizzle said:


> so from what is known about the h800.. what advantages would it have over the h701?
> 
> if i have a h701, would it be justifiable to get the new unit when it is released?


Jim has posted a comparison already about the differences. 

However you're the only one that can tell if those differences are good enough to buy the new processor. 

Kelvin


----------



## raamaudio

I just put two H800's on preorder through a connection I have, does not mean I will get it any faster than others, just one of the first batch and I cannot do this for other guys here, would if I could. 

I just want to make sure I get one as soon as possible because I am looking for the best way to tune Vettes for my audio packages and my truck sure could use one

Rick


----------



## masswork

kyheng said:


> Why? BB are not the best, it maybe, but depending on the cost, cirucit design....
> No doubt that Alpine F#1, Pioneer ODR uses BB's DAC, but recent DSP/Hu start using other brands like Bit1 using Wolfson's Codec.
> Maybe Alpine latest using WM8740 or 8741?
> The built in DSP are more important, because data go thru it first before reaches DACs... Using Sharc would be great.....


Agree... 
can't really tell the difference between BB's DAC or Wolfson, or AKM... sounds very much alike to me these days.

So, H800 is Sharc based?
Thought Alpine loves those TI's TMxx?


----------



## AAAAAAA

For volume manipulation using OTHER HU's....

I don't get why manufacturers of these fantastic sound processors with digital inputs can't just use an RCA input to control their volume. How hard would that be? Digital input for the music, but still have one rca go from deck to processor where the processor controls volume depending on the rca voltage input. So simple.....

Seems like an easy way to make it compatible with any HU that has optical out.... no?


----------



## kyheng

AD's Sharc DSP, TI's Aureus DSP is something nice to have for HUs implementations, but then the cost of such DSP are not cheap..... 
From my point of view, after owning the P9 combo and gathering the review from others, the DSP plays a very important role on active HUs/DSPs.... DAC won't come first.... 
For this new Alpine PXA, it is something like downgrading PXA-H900 and an upgrade of PXA-H700/701.... So if 800 were to using better DSPs, then they may use other brand's DAC to reduce the cost... Who willing to buy a DSP if it cost $1000? Bit1 and JBL cost <$700, so Alpine should be there also in order not to lost its consumers....


----------



## Salad Fingers

kyheng said:


> Bit1 and JBL cost <$700, so Alpine should be there also in order not to lost its consumers....


Bit One MSRP is $999.99


----------



## kyheng

But who will sell at that price? Put the MSRP then actual sell lower is a good way on doing business.....


----------



## chefhow

Remember that the Bit1 and MS8's controllers were included. The pics of the H800 are showing that the controller is separate and an extra cost. I wouldn't be surprised if it was in the $1000 range for the entire package.


----------



## nar93da

On CAE site they have the RUX Controller MSRP-$250 and Processor at $700. So looks like they won't be sold together.

http://caraudiomag.com/articles/alpine-ces-2011


----------



## Salad Fingers

kyheng said:


> But who will sell at that price? Put the MSRP then actual sell lower is a good way on doing business.....


That is besides the point. You made this inaccurate statement (since the only real way to have an apples to apples comparison is to use MSRP)...



kyheng said:


> Bit1 and JBL cost <$700


...and the MSRP for the Bit One is $999 and MS-8 is $799. I'm just trying to keep the information accurate, no intentions of being rude or anything.


----------



## Mic10is

nar93da said:


> On CAE site they have the RUX Controller MSRP-$250 and Processor at $700. So looks like they won't be sold together.
> 
> Alpine at CES 2011 - Events - Car Audio and Electronics


Dammit you beat me to it!!!

_Pricing and Availability
The PXA-H800 will be available in April for $699.95 MAP. The RUX-C800 will also be available in April for $249.95 MAP_


----------



## ErinH

> •Road EQ, which automatically corrects for external noise in real time


does this mean we can expect a decrease in the "how much deadener do I need", threads?


----------



## TokoSpeaker

Is there anybody who want to help me to get these NEW PXA?

Thank you.


----------



## kyheng

Salad Fingers said:


> That is besides the point. You made this inaccurate statement (since the only real way to have an apples to apples comparison is to use MSRP)...
> 
> 
> 
> ...and the MSRP for the Bit One is $999 and MS-8 is $799. I'm just trying to keep the information accurate, no intentions of being rude or anything.


You are right on this.... Anyway MSRP is just suggested retail price, some may sell it at that price but some won't. For me, I'll get the seller that can give me the best deal....


----------



## ekrunch

bikinpunk said:


> does this mean we can expect a decrease in the "how much deadener do I need", threads?


HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

No chance of that.


----------



## masswork

bikinpunk said:


> does this mean we can expect a decrease in the "how much deadener do I need", threads?


You know... "reducing" road noise by increasing signal... hmmmm

Somehow i still prefer "passive method" for killing noise.


----------



## masswork

Mic10is said:


> Dammit you beat me to it!!!
> 
> _Pricing and Availability_
> _The PXA-H800 will be available in April for $699.95 MAP. The RUX-C800 will also be available in April for $249.95 MAP_


Hey, that's cheap 
So, who will be the first reviewer? Erin? Kyheng?


----------



## kyheng

I'll give it some time, when the price drops... But maybe I won't buy also as I'm a Pioneer die hard fan... Just happen that I can get my hands to service manuals on H900, 700/701 and others.... So, I can have some views on each DAC used....


----------



## ErinH

Link with picture of processor and controller
Alpine PXA-H800 | Cars´n Audio Magazine


----------



## pankrok

701 + imprint + better dsp + improved analog stage = (almost) want it

will there be centrafuse plugin for control over car pc?????

in such case keep 3 pcs for me

(subscribed)


----------



## Mirage_Man

The question I have now is will this sound better than my Matt Roberts modified 701? It obviously has more tweakability but will that trumph Matt's magic?


----------



## JayinMI

Sounds like (for the CarPC crowd) someone needs to hack Ai-Net and make a USB adapter to volume/EQ/etc can be controlled via plug in. 

I liked my PXA-H701/RUX-C701 combo very much...But for the price I can't beat my BitOne.1 ($50 in raffle tickets!) 

Jay


----------



## ekrunch

Mirage_Man said:


> The question I have now is will this sound better than my Matt Roberts modified 701? It obviously has more tweakability but will that trumph Matt's magic?


Good question. I'm holding on to mine for just a little while longer until we find out. 

My main issue with the 701 was the analog input section. The 701 sucked at that and Matt's normal mod doesn't address it. My problem has been that there was no head unit with optical out and full digital iPod control via USB (not the older analog implementations). I run a changer with my 701 via optical and the difference is night and day, but the iPod with all of my CDs ripped in 400kbps AAC is just too convenient to pass up on. Now with the new double DIN head unit coming out that has optical, a modded 701 might be a great choice, especially considering that it's not clear as to whether or not the 800 will do Dolby Digital/DTS.

Another thing to consider is that the new processor will require the controller. The new double DIN unit will probably control the 701 completely, just like my IXA-W407 does. For those who don't want to run the controller, the 800 is a bad choice since it has been noted that you cannot control all of the features without the controller, even with the new head unit.


----------



## dh8009

ekrunch said:


> Another thing to consider is that the new processor will require the controller. The new double DIN unit will probably control the 701 completely, just like my IXA-W407 does. For those who don't want to run the controller, the 800 is a bad choice since it has been noted that you cannot control all of the features without the controller, even with the new head unit.


Good point. I just read that on the Car Audio Magazine.websiteAlpine at CES 2011 - Events - Car Audio and Electronics


----------



## ErinH

ekrunch said:


> For those who don't want to run the controller, the 800 is a bad choice since it has been noted that you cannot control all of the features without the controller, even with the new head unit.


Well, technically, you don't get all the features of the 700/701 without the controller, either. One being auto t/a. May be a couple other small settings as well, but that's one I can say for sure. 
So, when we say that the 800 can't be used fully without the controller, just how fully are we saying?


----------



## subwoofery

ekrunch said:


> Another thing to consider is that the new processor _*will require*_ the controller. The new double DIN unit will probably control the 701 completely, just like my IXA-W407 does. For those who don't want to run the controller, the 800 is a bad choice since it has been noted that you cannot control all of the features without the controller, _*even with the new head unit*_.


The processor and its controller are sold separately yet the controller is needed to take full advantage of its feature. I find it strange... almost stupid... 
Unless they wanted to have to processor available for a lower price ; leaving the controller for those that wants more adjustability. 

Kelvin


----------



## Mic10is

H-700 and RUX were sold separately as well.

from what Ive read, tuning on the 800 can be done with controller OR PC. So you dont NEED the rux for functionality.

also looking at the pics, it says DTS on it


----------



## ekrunch

bikinpunk said:


> Well, technically, you don't get all the features of the 700/701 without the controller, either. One being auto t/a. May be a couple other small settings as well, but that's one I can say for sure.
> So, when we say that the 800 can't be used fully without the controller, just how fully are we saying?


Good point.  I've never used that one I hadn't noticed.  The W407's control of the 701 is excellent though. I really don't use my controller as more than a quick way to change presets these days.



subwoofery said:


> The processor and its controller are sold separately yet the controller is needed to take full advantage of its feature. I find it strange... almost stupid...
> Unless they wanted to have to processor available for a lower price ; leaving the controller for those that wants more adjustability.


You're probably right on the money. Maybe the PC software will let you set the curves you want and you can just change them with the head unit. That's another possibility. Maybe you don't need the controller if you use the PC? I think it's probably for those who want great sound but are happy with the IMPRINT curves and don't want to tweak things too much. Who knows?


----------



## Mic10is

does noone read anymore???
From CAE review of new Alpine products...link has been posted a few times already above



_•User Customization, which gives the user the option to customize the sound via manual or automatic settings – *Using either the RUX-C800 controller (sold separately) or a PC with the included tuning software, manual, target curve and post process tuning can be made.* The user can customize the sound traditionally by hand or automatically tune it to a desired response, while also allowing for full adjustment for fine tuning afterwards._


----------



## subwoofery

Mic10is said:


> H-700 and RUX were sold separately as well.
> 
> from what Ive read, tuning on the 800 can be done with controller OR PC. So you dont NEED the rux for functionality.
> 
> also looking at the pics, it says DTS on it


Totally forgot that the RUX was sold separately from its processor as well. :blush: 

Kelvin


----------



## mikey7182

I think the confusion came from Jim's reply to Mic's question about non-Alpine HUs. Basically if you're using a factory HU or some other non-Alpine HU, you'll need the RUX to control volume. The only reason you'd use a laptop instead of the RUX (other than preference) is if you had an Alpine HU with Ai-Net to control the volume; otherwise, it appears the RUX is required, which isn't any different than the H700/701. It would be nice if the analog inputs from a factory HU could control the volume and just use the laptop to tune...


----------



## Salad Fingers

ekrunch said:


> My main issue with the 701 was the analog input section. The 701 sucked at that and Matt's normal mod doesn't address it. My problem has been that there was no head unit with optical out and full digital iPod control via USB (not the older analog implementations). I run a changer with my 701 via optical and the difference is night and day, but the iPod with all of my CDs ripped in 400kbps AAC is just too convenient to pass up on. Now with the new double DIN head unit coming out that has optical, a modded 701 might be a great choice, especially considering that it's not clear as to whether or not the 800 will do


You can pic up an older 160 gb Apple TV on eBay/craigslist for around $100-$125. It has optical out (700/701 has three optical in, and the 800 will have a pair of them), and with a component to composite video converter, a power inverter, and an aux in on a screen, you have 160 gigs of music and videos with 100% digital sound quality and a sick GUI/software to use/look at!! I've been really looking at this for a little while now. Hell, new Lilliput monitors have the option of HDMI in, so that would axe the coverter you'd be using on a DDIN aux video in. I'm going to be doing something along these lines in my truck.


----------



## n_olympios

Mic10is said:


> H-700 and RUX were sold separately as well.


Actually, the PXA-H70*0* was sold as a combo. It was the PXA-H70*1* and RUX-C70*1* that were sold separately. But, since they're the same units, this is just me being silly.


----------



## Salad Fingers

Mic10is said:


> H-700 and RUX were sold separately as well.


Not to nit pick or call you out or anything, but the H700/C700 was a package with them together in the same box. The H701/C701 were sold separately.


----------



## Salad Fingers

n_olympios said:


> Actually, the PXA-H70*0* was sold as a combo. It was the PXA-H70*1* and RUX-C70*1* that were sold separately. But, since they're the same units, this is just me being silly.


You beat me by a few seconds!!


----------



## t3sn4f2

I'm really liking the new INA. It's appears to have had the analog output section improved which would make it a higher quality volume controlled source that is great for the MS-8.


----------



## t3sn4f2

And look at the bad ass dash kits they are coming out with.

Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.


----------



## ErinH

^ I'm interested in this as well... just not seeing anything other than the Camaro (and whatever you've posted).


----------



## ErinH

anyone have access to the links toward the bottom right
Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.


----------



## ErinH

masswork said:


> Hey, that's cheap
> So, who will be the first reviewer? Erin? Kyheng?


We'll see. I don't have any connections with anyone regarding Alpine so I'm sure I won't be getting one early enough to warrant putting up a review. I imagine by the time I get my hands on one, someone will have put one up. But, we'll see. Plus, I don't really have the disposable income I once had... babies are expensive! 

If I can get one early enough, then I'll try to do a thorough review based on my experience with other DSPs and put it up here. I actually really enjoying doing reviews ...so, I'll see what I can do.


----------



## Salad Fingers

Found this nice large image, thought others would appreciate it...


----------



## Salad Fingers

Whoever said that they hope it has a spectrum analyzer on it, I'm going to have to second that in a major way. I really adds to the awe of an amazing system to see those bars dancing up and down.


----------



## ReloadedSS

Salad Fingers said:


> Whoever said that they hope it has a spectrum analyzer on it, I'm going to have to second that in a major way. I really adds to the awe of an amazing system to see those bars dancing up and down.


Yup, I miss that on my long departed ERA-G320. Might be only for "cool" factor, but it's neato.


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> ^ I'm interested in this as well... just not seeing anything other than the Camaro (and whatever you've posted).


Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.


----------



## bfb1963

I wonder how the optical in is handled. Is it selectable? Or like the 700 is it prioritized?

I run a HU and a carputer, but never could have them sending signal simultaneously to the 700 without it prioritizing to the HU signal in. I had to run an MJS optical switch instead.


----------



## t3sn4f2

bfb1963 said:


> I wonder how the optical in is handled. Is it selectable? Or like the 700 is it prioritized?
> 
> I run a HU and a carputer, but never could have them sending signal simultaneously to the 700 without it prioritizing to the HU signal in. I had to run an MJS optical switch instead.


The remote has a source button on it.


----------



## Salad Fingers

Also, I think the lights to the right of the power light in the center of the unit put the question of DTS and DD to rest...


----------



## Salad Fingers

bfb1963 said:


> I wonder how the optical in is handled. Is it selectable? Or like the 700 is it prioritized?
> 
> I run a HU and a carputer, but never could have them sending signal simultaneously to the 700 without it prioritizing to the HU signal in. I had to run an MJS optical switch instead.


As I remember, with the C700/C701 display you could select the input.


----------



## rexroadj

How the hell have I missed this thread? I have been an alpine hater for a long time now (since the fall of the F#1). I tried the 505/701/872/bt/dvd changer, etc.... and absolutely hated every part of it, except the cosmetics of the screen/ipod etc.. (to be fair I went straight the last f#1 to this setup, not a fair comparison in my estimation, and far away from my drz9255 setup before the f1). Am I the only one that see's a lot of similarity to the F#1 Processor? I am super excited about this! I might even break down and try the IVA-W910, unless they happen to figure out a way to charge an obscene amount for any additional accessorys and have to run power etc... to every one of them as well. Another thing I hated about them, it was just an unecessary PITA. I imagine this would be very hard to do considering everything is internal to the headunit! I am intrigued and interested in giving them another shot now....Would have never guessed I would see this day?


----------



## bfb1963

Salad Fingers said:


> As I remember, with the C700/C701 display you could select the input.


Never ran the remote, only the HU.


----------



## Hoot

It appears Alpine is not going to reveal the msrp of the INV-w910 until they blow out all of their 2010 w900BTs, which they currently have just discounted $150 now to $999. While the new w910 will likely be more, it probably won't be much more, even with all the built in stuff like SiriusXM and HD radio, and will likely be a far better value. 

Q: Has it been determined if any/all of the older Alpine touchscreens with Ai-net and optical out will work with the H800? Even if they might work, if one wants bluetooth, XM/Sirius and/or HD radio then unless the new w910 is $1300+, the w910 might still be the best choice given all the older units require pricey add-ons. If they announce a $1200 or less price tag for the w910, there will be a lot of cheap alpine touchscreens and add-on gear for sale out there very soon.

Curious about a couple things with the w910... I think it was asked, but not sure I saw an answer... will the w910 optical be proprietary and cost $130 bux like with the w505, or will it be basic toslink?

Just looking at the following H800 features, alone, it would appear to me that the H700 and H701s are far less capable than the new unit by a long shot:

*10 Band Parametric EQ On Front, Rear and Center channel* (vs 5 on H701)

*5 Band Parametric EQ For Subwoofer* (vs 2 on H701)

*36dB XO Slopes*

*Huge Signal-to-Noise Improvement* 110 Digital / 105 Analog

Anyone have the signal-to-noise ratio figure handy on the 701? What were crossover slopes was the 701 capable of? It would seem the above improvements alone would justify buying the newer piece for *anyone* interested in an alpine processor.

Lastly, one question about the w910 - says it can run Pandora through an iPhone...think this is exclusive to the iPhone, and marketing agreements require Alpine to advertise only iPhone compatibility, or think a Blackberry or Android Pandora feed would work? Or maybe it is actually an apple software issue that allows only the iPhone to work?


----------



## n_olympios

The PXA-70X had 6/12/18/24/30 dB slopes on the crossover and a s/n ratio of 100dB (the manual doesn't mention a separate figure for analog/digital).


----------



## Hoot

Ok, so 6db greater slopes are possible with the H800 and 5-10db less noise than the h701.

On another note... from a Feb 6th Alpine press release: "It [the HC800] has 4V outputs and a new input architecture that allows for use of the car’s factory radio volume control while maintaining fidelity."

Okay, why wouldn't optical-out cd players like the Eclipse CD8053 (others?) now be able to take advantage of this "new input architecture?" Seems like someone asked about this but the question's answer seemed to suggest controlling volume from an non-Alpine head unit wasn't possible without excessive noise issues?


----------



## Salad Fingers

Hoot said:


> Ok, so 6db greater slopes are possible with the H800 and 5-10db less noise than the h701.
> 
> On another note... from a Feb 6th Alpine press release: "It [the HC800] has 4V outputs and a new input architecture that allows for use of the car’s factory radio volume control while maintaining fidelity."
> 
> Okay, why wouldn't optical-out cd players like the Eclipse CD8053 (others?) now be able to take advantage of this "new input architecture?" Seems like someone asked about this but the question's answer seemed to suggest controlling volume from an non-Alpine head unit wasn't possible without excessive noise issues?


I've been wondering how volume wouldn't be dependent on input this entire time. Maybe you would need the display or W910 to control the H800 volume, but not volume in general. Maybe I'm forgetting something, but this is where my mind has been since the issue was brought up. 

Also, CD8053 optical out? I don't remember that being the case. Maybe I'll have to crack open the new one I have at the house and take a look.


----------



## n_olympios

Hoot said:


> Seems like someone asked about this but the question's answer seemed to suggest controlling volume from an non-Alpine head unit wasn't possible without excessive noise issues?


With a digital signal but without an Ai-Net equipped Alpine unit, the only way to control the volume is via the RUX-C800 controller. If you want to feed the H800 with an analog signal (say from the stock HU), then you can probably use the HU's volume, but the processor's volume would have to be maxxed at all times; thus introducing more noise (probably). 

All of this is guesswork, since all we've seen are photos and specs.


----------



## ErinH

^ I'd bet you're right.
I'd imagine it works the same as the h701 in this regard:
1) AI-net capable headunit connected = volume control with headunit (source)
2) Non AI-net headunit yields the following two scenarios:
a) Digital connection= volume control with controller
b) Analog connection= volume control with source

With analog (rca) input, on the h701, you could just set the c701 volume to whatever you want and then do the rest of the volume control from the headunit you used. Same story with most all other processors (bit1, ms8, etc).

However, I can't remember if you have to leave the c701 controller plugged into the h701 all the time or if you can just set the volume and then disconnect it. Seems like the latter is true. Just been a while since I've owned the setup.


----------



## Mic10is

bikinpunk said:


> ^ I'd bet you're right.
> I'd imagine it works the same as the h701 in this regard:
> 1) AI-net capable headunit connected = volume control with headunit (source)
> 2) Non AI-net headunit yields the following two scenarios:
> a) Digital connection= volume control with controller
> b) Analog connection= volume control with source
> 
> With analog (rca) input, on the h701, you could just set the c701 volume to whatever you want and then do the rest of the volume control from the headunit you used. Same story with most all other processors (bit1, ms8, etc).
> 
> However, I can't remember if you have to leave the c701 controller plugged into the h701 all the time or if you can just set the volume and then disconnect it. Seems like the latter is true. Just been a while since I've owned the setup.


from what I remember when I did it, you had to leave it connected.

also when using a non-ainet head unit w digital input, when you switched sources, you had to redo the inputs thru the RUX.
So when I ran my Denon w/ the H700, for CDs I'd have to go in and select digital. if I switched to XM I had to select analog...made for an annoying drive to Lousville that year


----------



## n_olympios

No, you don't have to have the controller connected in the H70X. It doesn't reset the volume when switched on/off, it remembers the last setting.


----------



## BigRed

keep in mind according to alpine, you will need the rux controller for full functionality regardless of deck with the H800 processor


----------



## n_olympios

Correct.

... or a connection to a pc.


----------



## ErinH

BigRed said:


> keep in mind according to alpine, you will need the rux controller for full functionality regardless of deck with the H800 processor


Right, but as was stated earlier, this is the same story for the h700/701. However, the only benefit is you get auto t/a. So, I think it depends on what you do/don't get with the controller that will determine if someone wants to buy it, too, or not.

Of course, it's really nice to have the controller (c701), regardless if you have an ai-net headunit or not. I'm sure this will be the same story.

Until we hear back from Alpine or get further specs... it's a guess.


----------



## JDM_Ej

Excited... can't wait to see full specs and a manual.


----------



## kustomkaraudio

You also get full function from PC hook up, so if you have headunit you dont need the RUX. Bye the way H800 will also work with W505 for anybody that has one.


----------



## mikey7182

Some good points have been made. It would be cool to keep the factory headunit and do an analog in to the processor, so long as the factory HU would allow me to keep volume control and everything from the HU. Then I could decide if I wanted to pick up the controller to tune on the go, or just stick with a PC tune. I could also do a separate IN from an iPod, etc. What would be REALLY cool is if manufacturers start allowing "PC tuning" to be done from an Android tablet, iPad, or other device. Then you can use the tablet as your only source with full control of the processor right from the dash. Stream Pandora, your iTunes, etc.


----------



## pankrok

kustomkaraudio said:


> You also get full function from PC hook up, so if you have headunit you dont need the RUX. Bye the way H800 will also work with W505 for anybody that has one.


FULL function = volume + sub + source control????


----------



## t3sn4f2

pankrok said:


> FULL function = volume + sub + source control????


What benefit would that give?


----------



## n_olympios

Let me translate Pankrok's question for you guys, since I was at his home the other day and we were discussing this. 

"Will the W505 be able to control the volume, sub level and source selection on the H800, without the RUX controller?"


----------



## Hoot

KustomKarAudio is an Alpine dealer, I believe, so I'm thinking if he says the h800 works with the w505, then at least all basic features will work (minus perhaps auto-TA, like with the H701, as bikinpunk points out). I don't think anyone has identified anything other than auto-TA that having the RUX is required to perform. Is this right? 

It also might be that when using an an older touchscreen HU, perhaps some of the newer H800 features won't be available without the RUX? RoadNoiseEQ, for example? 

I have a question, as I've never used one of the touchscreen Alpines before (though, I would like to)... is the software that makes it possible to use an IVA or INA Alpine headunit with the H701 reside in the headunit, itself, or in the H701? Seems like it would likely be in the head unit. If this is so, then it would appear that the latest w910 would likely be the only HU to, by itself, be capable of controlling most, if not all, of the H800 features (particularly the newer ones like maybe even additional PEQ points)? Anyone want to take a guess at this given how the w200, w205 and w505 operate with the H701?

BTW, KustomKarAudio... your like-name shop here in Boulder appears to have bit the dust - tried to stop by the other day and could not find the place; again, I think it tanked.  Did you, or any of your shop guys, go to CES?


----------



## kustomkaraudio

Yeah we were at CES , actually a great show and I turned 40 while in Vegas.. The features that are accesible from the headunit was limited intentionally. There is still a good amount of people that want a good sounding car, but don't want to tweak it, and a few retailers that don't want customers messing with the settings . You are correct, the software does reside in the deck to run the proc. The W505 was unique in the fact that it was last deck that will control the H701, and would also control the new little h100 proc . So it has the correct control software. So regardless of headunit you will need a RUX or PC hook up to access full function ( imprint , road eq, TA, and advanced crossover , and system configuration ) And yes the W505 will control volume balance, fade, sub level,and source, but remember those are sources that are input into the headunit ( aux in, sat radio, etc. ) BTW if any body wants to run the dvd changer (dha 690 ? ) snatch one up because they are discoed. Yeah I did not hear about the other Kustom Kar in boulder going out , sad , maybe a sign of the times.


----------



## pankrok

any idea of what pc will be abel to control over the h800?
only settings or also volume/sub/presets?
in other words could a carpc be used as the headunit without the need of RUX or should we try out this solution?


----------



## Salad Fingers

^^^Hey pankrok, I see you have a CX-7, any interest in some a pillars that are built to house a Hybrid L3 and L1 tweet in them? They are just sitting in a box in my garage and I'd like to get them out of the way and recoupe some of the funds spent on them. Sorry to be off topic.


----------



## dh8009

I was at a shop new years weekend and was told that optical out of the 910 would send iPod signal into the h800. Does anyone know if this is true? I thought I had read that some head units only send CD audio through optical. Dont know if that research is correct though. I'm a newbie and sometime all this information is a bit overwhelming.


----------



## jim walter

iPod audio is sent via Optical to the DACs in the H800. I'm checking to see if HD Radio would be as well ... not that it matters as much, but it'd be neat if it did.

Jim


----------



## n_olympios

Hi Jim, thanks for your input. While you're at it, could you please ask the same (iPod signal through digital) about the W505+H701? I know it's not supposed to, but it'd be good to hear it from an Alpine representative.


----------



## jim walter

I'm going to guess no on that, but I'll confirm as well.

Jim


----------



## Notloudenuf

How easily will this new processor interface with my 9887? I'd love to be able to add this on without a lot of heartburn.


----------



## Hertz5400LincolnLS

Notloudenuf said:


> How easily will this new processor interface with my 9887? I'd love to be able to add this on without a lot of heartburn.


From what I've read, the 9887 won't control the succesor to the H701.


----------



## kyheng

With a processor that accepts digital input, I'll search for good transport HUs which supporting bus inputs for add ons... Have to know that, those HUs with good transport won't support iPod, USB......


----------



## pankrok

Salad Fingers said:


> ^^^Hey pankrok, I see you have a CX-7, any interest in some a pillars that are built to house a Hybrid L3 and L1 tweet in them? They are just sitting in a box in my garage and I'd like to get them out of the way and recoupe some of the funds spent on them. Sorry to be off topic.


[offtopic mode] thanks mate but a-pillars is the last thing I am in need now! [/offtopic mode]


----------



## Hoot

Jim, that is fantastic news about the DAC from the H800 being used for iPod playback (astounding, really). Looking forward to hear if this is true for the H701, as well, and for playback of HD radio on the w910. Jim, can you clarify what the w910 + H800 will not be able to do without the RUX controller?

And so, with regard to the optical out, if HD radio gets to use the H800 dac, but perhaps no to ipod dac bypass using the w505/h701, I would really have a hard time justifying a purchase of the older gear, even it it meant saving a lot of money. The new system already seems quite a step up over the old system in so many ways, and getting to use the H800 DAC for all digital sources would be the topper, even if I had to buy the $250 RUX. Ultimately, despite that the newer system would be soooo much more money (prolly $2000 msrp for all 3 new pieces versus maybe $800-$900 or so for the w505/c701/h701), we're talking a quantum leap, here - doesn't everyone agree?

Jim, if HD radio playback means get to use the Wolfson DACs in the H800, would this be true for Satellite radio, as well? Thanks for poppin' in.

KustomKarAudio, happy 40th!


----------



## Hoot

Mirage_Man said:


> The question I have now is will this sound better than my Matt Roberts modified 701? It obviously has more tweakability but will that trumph Matt's magic?


What improvement do you hear in your h701's mod? Here's what you know the H800 is going to give you:


More tuning ability - 10 vs 5 bands of parametric eq in main channels and 5 vs 2 bands of parametric eq in sub channel.

The ability to slope your crossover at 36db max vs 30db max

5-10db higher signal-to-noise ratio depending on your source
Do these benefits trump your modded H701? Are there even other benefits offered by the H800? Not sure on the latter question, and only a side-by-side with your h701 might give your your answer, but seems like even a modded H701 would be hard-pressed to best the advantages the new H800 seems to offer.


----------



## jim walter

Keeping the iPod straight digital all the way to the DAC was a big push for us with this guy, we're definitely happy with it.

No answer from Japan yet on the H701 doing it, but I'm pretty certain it doesn't. I just want the final answer for you.

The H800 is 100% functional on its own, without the RUX ... however, you'll need to use a PC to tune it. Once tuned, via manual or automatic over the PC, you can save up to 6 preset tunes. Once you disconnect from the PC, the presets are saved in the H800 and the W910 will be able to adjust:
1) Presets - need to be saved from the PC Software
2) Balance/Fader - pressing the "speaker" soft button on the Audio screen of the W910 will bring you to the balance fade screen
3) Sub Level

That's it without the RUX. The real intention (and it won't ring true with most here as we are crazy tweakophiles) was to give the installer/shop the ability to tune the car, set the various presets and give the customer the control he needs without the ability to change the tune, so doesn't come back and say "I didn't touch anything but my tweeters are blown...and the shop[or mfg] is stuck with the bill" or something along those lines when you give them too much control of everything.

To answer a few of the volume-related questions. We've done our best on this guy to _REALLY _clean up the analog side of things. The ideal situation is to run a RUX when using RCA (hi or low level) in, but the input stage will take 0.1 to 10V, so you could easily use your factory or AFT HU volume to control things. If you feel the sound is noisy (it won't be), go ahead and grab a RUX and flush it in somewhere if you're feeling crafty, but 99% of installs will not need it. 

Adding the RUX gives you all the control you all know and want, so it's worth the expense really ... just to be able to tweak with things  It really depends on your install and your OCD level.

Jim


----------



## Hoot

Jim, for someone who has never tuned with a PC, do just bring your laptop inside the car and tune with the software and a mic? You then perhaps load the settings via USB, or a memory card?

Also, is the new RUX controller smaller than a single DIN and thus could be placed many different places? Maybe even above or below a double-din should space allow? It has very little physical depth to it, correct?

Two other questions, if I may: 


Will any of the new 2011 Alpine single-din CD or media players have optical out and be able to work with the RUX/H800 combo?

Will only the iPhone control Pandora from the w910, or other new Alpine Pandora-cable units, or will one be able to stream Pandora from an Android or Blackberry device, as well?
Thanks so much, again....


----------



## mikey7182

Great answers from Jim! I too am curious about the Pandora functionality as I have a DroidX. I have been holding off on switching over to the iPhone, but now that Verizon has picked it up, I may make the switch unless more manufacturers start offering Android support as well.


----------



## Rexrode

Hoot, good thing you waited huh?


----------



## t3sn4f2

Is Pandora streamed over Bluetoof, USB, or lineout on Alpine compatible head units?

If it's anything but USB then I would not worry about how it leaves the W910. Not that it's gonna sound bad, but bluetoof compression and the added DA/AD of line out is going to ruin the ideology of digital out to the processor.


----------



## n_olympios

Perhaps the thread title should be changed to be more relevant (now that we have a name for it).

I don't know about you guys, but I'm very glad we now have an Alpine rep available on the forum.  

Perhaps JBL's Andy Wehmeyer was a good influence?  Let's hope other companies join in as well.

Jim, thanks once more for the input!


----------



## Hoot

Rexrode said:


> Hoot, good thing you waited huh?


Perhaps, Rex, you are right; however... we still need to see what the w910 is going to sell for first, right? 

With the w910 having built-in functionality of Bluetooth, Nav, HD radio, Satellite and Pandora (I think it has all of that built-in, or at least it has much of that built in), not to mention the built in crossovers, eq and time alignment for guys wanting an in-between prior to being able to afford the H800, the w910 still might command a hefty price.

If the w910 msrp is steep, then perhaps the w505/h701 might be a better in-between alternative for someone like myself.


----------



## pankrok

great input Jim!
how come not 24/96? is it too early for alpine to "follow" audison?
and I guess not a chance for using usb as audio input to the unit (carpc issue again!)


----------



## subwoofery

pankrok said:


> great input Jim!
> how come not 24/96? is it too early for alpine to "follow" audison?
> and I guess not a chance for using usb as audio input to the unit (carpc issue again!)


Feel it's not really polite to say things like "why didn't you do like ...(brand name)..."

Jim is kind enough to hang around and give inputs about his opinions and about what he knows. 
Don't take it personally, other posters did/do that as well. Just saying...  

Again thanks Jim for being part of the forum. 

Kelvin


----------



## jim walter

Hoot said:


> Jim, for someone who has never tuned with a PC, do just bring your laptop inside the car and tune with the software and a mic? You then perhaps load the settings via USB, or a memory card?
> 
> Also, is the new RUX controller smaller than a single DIN and thus could be placed many different places? Maybe even above or below a double-din should space allow? It has very little physical depth to it, correct?
> 
> Two other questions, if I may:
> 
> 
> Will any of the new 2011 Alpine single-din CD or media players have optical out and be able to work with the RUX/H800 combo?
> 
> Will only the iPhone control Pandora from the w910, or other new Alpine Pandora-cable units, or will one be able to stream Pandora from an Android or Blackberry device, as well?
> Thanks so much, again....


If you are doing ImprintEQ, it will tell you where to place the mic, you'll place the mic and then exit the car while it chirps, beeps and tunes itself to happiness .

Manual tune, you'll adjust the parameters on the screen and then listen to it on the fly.

The RUX is 16mm x 161mm x 40mm and will come with a "flush cup" that will allow you to either flush or mold it in, as well as surface mount if you want.

No Optical out in the line for 2011 outside of the W910.

The W910 does not do A2DP streaming, so it will not stream BT from Android or RIM. You'd need do run an AUX-In line to the processor (or HU) to get the audio in via RCAs. Any of our other HU's with a KCA-400BT attached will stream over BT from either of those platforms.




mikey7182 said:


> Great answers from Jim! I too am curious about the Pandora functionality as I have a DroidX. I have been holding off on switching over to the iPhone, but now that Verizon has picked it up, I may make the switch unless more manufacturers start offering Android support as well.


For Music and Internet Radio, there is nothing better for you than the iphone ... I begrudgingly switched after two years of being a Droid and BB lover....it's just easier. As a phone, thats a topic for a different day, but now that Verizon has it .. its gonna pretty hard to look away from for most.



t3sn4f2 said:


> Is Pandora streamed over Bluetoof, USB, or lineout on Alpine compatible head units?
> 
> If it's anything but USB then I would not worry about how it leaves the W910. Not that it's gonna sound bad, but bluetoof compression and the added DA/AD of line out is going to ruin the ideology of digital out to the processor.


Over USB, I know for a fact that we run digital out of the iPhone to the DACs of our HU's ... I'd imagine it'd pass to the DACs in the H800, but like HD Radio .. I'm waiting on the final, final answer about where the D->A takes place.





n_olympios said:


> Perhaps the thread title should be changed to be more relevant (now that we have a name for it).
> 
> I don't know about you guys, but I'm very glad we now have an Alpine rep available on the forum.
> 
> Perhaps JBL's Andy Wehmeyer was a good influence?  Let's hope other companies join in as well.
> 
> Jim, thanks once more for the input!


You're all welcome. I'm happy to be here as I'm a DIYer from the start, much like a lot of us in this industry. I'm not tech support, so I can't answer random complaints and stuff, but tweako stuff like this is right up my alley


----------



## BamaJohn

Subscribed. :lurk:

Excellent thread. Thank you, Jim Walter, for your input to this forum and the extraordinary access to the engineering and design behind the scenes! I may not be able to make use of it all immediately, but I *love* reading up on it. I've been waiting for a good integrated head unit / processor solution to come along...one that works well with my iPhone 4. Integrating the "easy mode" of the Imprint process with manual tweakability is exactly what I've been hoping for. One question: can you expand on the options for time alignment that are available in the H800?


----------



## ErinH

Jim, not sure if you saw this list of questions or not, so I'm quoting myself.
I also sent you a PM with a couple questions. I know you're busy, so if you don't have time to answer, I understand.

Thanks again for your input to this thread.

- Erin



bikinpunk said:


> Jim, thanks for dropping in.
> I have a couple questions as well:
> 
> Will the 800 also have graphic eq? If so, can it be used in conjunction with the parametric or will you have to choose one like the 701?
> Are the crossover points 1/3 octave or something else? You mentioned pc setup...do we have the luxury to manually type in desired crossover points?
> With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?


----------



## Salami

bikinpunk said:


> Will the 800 also have graphic eq? If so, can it be used in conjunction with the parametric or will you have to choose one like the 701?



Ahem.

165 band graphic EQ or 55 band parametric. Info is on the data card in the picture posted.


----------



## Mic10is

31 band on 5 outputs? Front, rear and Center? 10 on Sub?


----------



## ErinH

Salami said:


> Ahem.
> 
> 165 band graphic EQ or 55 band parametric. Info is on the data card in the picture posted.


Then go to 2nd part of same question.


----------



## Salami

bikinpunk said:


> Then go to 2nd part of same question.


And go to part one of my response.  

There is this tiny word: or

This normally means one or the other but not both.


----------



## Salad Fingers

Digital out on iPod and CD/DVD (possibly HD) with the W910, so then it will send these sources out to anything, not just the H800? Right? So if I used a W910 to a Bit One, and used the new Audison Voce amps when they are released, then I could have digital all the way to the amps?


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> Jim, not sure if you saw this list of questions or not, so I'm quoting myself.
> I also sent you a PM with a couple questions. I know you're busy, so if you don't have time to answer, I understand.
> 
> Thanks again for your input to this thread.
> 
> - Erin


I got your PM while at CES on Tapatalk .. I'll go back to it now that I'm on a real computer.



BamaJohn said:


> Subscribed. :lurk:
> 
> Excellent thread. Thank you, Jim Walter, for your input to this forum and the extraordinary access to the engineering and design behind the scenes! I may not be able to make use of it all immediately, but I *love* reading up on it. I've been waiting for a good integrated head unit / processor solution to come along...one that works well with my iPhone 4. Integrating the "easy mode" of the Imprint process with manual tweakability is exactly what I've been hoping for. One question: can you expand on the options for time alignment that are available in the H800?


You're welcome  Time alignment is 0 to 20ms in 0.05ms steps for all 8CH



Mic10is said:


> 31 band on 5 outputs? Front, rear and Center? 10 on Sub?


Correct. In 8CH 4-way mode, it would be 31Graphic (10Parametric) x6 and 10Graphic (5Parametic) x2 .. I'm pretty sure. I'll have to jump in the car and check tonight.

It is Graphic or Parametric EQ, not both.


----------



## jim walter

Salad Fingers said:


> Digital out on iPod and CD/DVD (possibly HD) with the W910, so then it will send these sources out to anything, not just the H800? Right? So if I used a W910 to a Bit One, and used the new Audison Voce amps when they are released, then I could have digital all the way to the amps?


Without actually testing it with those specific products, I'm not going to sign that one in blood .. but yes, that's the plan.


----------



## Salad Fingers

jim walter said:


> I'll have to jump in the car and check tonight.


Anyone else catch that? This bastard has one in his car!!! Haha, hey I guess I should thank you as well. I'm curious, and I may have missed this, but what is your position there at Alpine? I really want the shop I work at to become a dealer again, but the rep for our area SUCKS and the people at the CES booth apparently weren't too interested in pursuing my boss' business. Question, since you have it in your car, does the RUX have a spectrum analyzer on it like the C700/C701 did? Is it any different looking if so? Thanks again, and I really hope we are a dealer this year!


----------



## Salad Fingers

jim walter said:


> Without actually testing it with those specific products, I'm not going to sign that one in blood .. but yes, that's the plan.


----------



## jim walter

Salad Fingers said:


> Anyone else catch that? This bastard has one in his car!!! Haha, hey I guess I should thank you as well. I'm curious, and I may have missed this, but what is your position there at Alpine? I really want the shop I work at to become a dealer again, but the rep for our area SUCKS and the people at the CES booth apparently weren't too interested in pursuing my boss' business. Question, since you have it in your car, does the RUX have a spectrum analyzer on it like the C700/C701 did? Is it any different looking if so? Thanks again, and I really hope we are a dealer this year!


 Lucky me ... its a very early unit ... so a lot of functionality is bassackwards on it, but it gets the job done for now. I'm not seeing any notes for "graphics" in the Owner's Manual, so I'm going to guess it won't be in there. I'm a geek for the EQ or the VU meters as well 

I'm in Product Planning at Alpine in the Audio / Sound System Business group. I did the M2000 2kW amp, KTP-445 miniamp, some Bluetooth stuff etc but my two things of merit lately were the new Thin subs and the 2010 Type R re-design. 

Sorry your rep isn't doing it for you.. if you want, I can put you in touch with a regional manager in the area you could talk to about it? Keep names out of the thread please, just PM's in necessary.


----------



## Salad Fingers

jim walter said:


> Keep names out of the thread please, just PM's in necessary.


Half the name was typed, and then I realized it wouldn't be cool to throw someone under the bus like that and decided to be vague. I'll PM you, and we'll see what we can do. Thanks again for the help here!


----------



## jkrob21

Good info coming from Jim here. I too am a dealer that has recently been selling other gear over Alpine for the last year. Price point vs feature has made Alpine a hard sell. But with the new goods, a great processor and a DD HU with several nice features built in I'd say Alpine is back in the game. Provided the new units work as stated. 

A DD HU with built in NAV, IPOD/IPHONE, BT, HD RADIO, plus digital out or 4 volt out, plus some processing built in is a nice addition to the Alpine family IMO. I love that Alpine finally decided that a nice processor is not a dead art. It's a shame it took Audison, JBL, and others to prove that we still want more control over our sound.


----------



## vidizzle

any plans for a single din hu similiar to that of the dd?
im guessin 2012?


----------



## Salad Fingers

Not much, but more than we've had yet @ :45

YouTube - 2011 CES Alpine Demo Car (Short Clip)


----------



## Salad Fingers

Oh yea Jim, another question that has been lost in all of the excitement... Can two of the H800's be tied together like the H990's did? If so, with a single RUX? This would be ultimate tits...


----------



## St. Dark

Hoot - you could run the digital out of an Eclipse (IIRC several of the Commander-capable units had coax digital out, so you'd need to convert to optical) into the 'H800 or any other DSP with digital in, but you'll always need an external volume control. The digital out is a "fixed" output- basically what is on the disc. Eclipse didn't put a digital volume control on their pieces.
The only way I know of off of the top of my head to get a variable digital out- so you can use the headunit's volume but feed all sources digitally into whatever digital processor you want - in the car world is to put the Mobridge DA1000 on a compatible MOST car and feed that to the processor of your choice. Otherwise, with a digital in, you either have to go with a package where the head sends commands to the volume control inside the processor through a data bus (such as AiNet) or else use the volume control that the processor provides.
Even in your example of running digital into a Bit One and out to a Thesis (or Voce; or for that matter any digital source other than from a DA1000), you have to control volume ect through the DRC via the AC link cable.

And no, unfortunately, I can confirm that the 'W500 does NOT feed a digital out from the iPod/USB interface.


----------



## bbfoto

Hey Jim,

I'm really stoked that you're here to represent Alpine on the forum! Thanks for all the awesome information you've supplied. Like everyone else, I have a few questions as well. 

1. Is the calibration microphone included with the PXA-H800, sold separately, or does it come only with the purchase of the RUX-C800?

2. Does the calibration microphone plug directly into the H800 processor brain, or only into the RUX-C800 controller just like the H700/C701?

3. What does the calibration microphone plug into when using a PC to do the Auto-Tune?

4. Will there be tuning/control software available for Apple/MacOS computers? Will Windows 7 be supported?

5. Regarding digital files from a USB-connected iPhone/iPod/iPad, does the INA-W910 head unit and/or H800 processor read the raw digital files directly from the internal hard drive or flash memory as a USB Mass Storage Device, completely bypassing any DAC or processing within the i-device? IOW, does it access the audio files just as if a USB thumb drive or hard drive were attached?

6. If so, are all audio files and formats (both compressed MP3s AND Apple Lossless files) handled in the same way...e.g.All Digital/Analog Conversion & Processing happens only within the W910 or H800?

7. Are any Lossless Audio file formats such as FLAC or Apple Lossless supported through a connected USB thumb drive or portable HDD?

Sorry for the barrage of questions, but enquiring minds want to know, LOL!

TIA!


----------



## St. Dark

All of the USB-based Alpines pull digital directly from whatever is plugged into them (iPod, thumb drive, et cetera).

All of the ones I've played with handle Apple Lossless (including the 'W505 and 'W900, so we should be good!). And Jim previously mentioned that (unlike it's predecessors...grrr!) the new one WILL pipe the feed from the USB through the digital out!

The other questions...I'd suspect the mic plugs into the processor, as that seems always the case...the rest, I await answers as eagerly as you!


----------



## t3sn4f2

bbfoto said:


> 5. Regarding digital files from a USB-connected iPhone/iPod/iPad, does the INA-W910 head unit and/or H800 processor read the raw digital files directly from the internal hard drive or flash memory as a USB Mass Storage Device, completely bypassing any DAC or processing within the i-device? IOW, does it access the audio files just as if a USB thumb drive or hard drive were attached?
> 
> 6. If so, are all audio files and formats (both compressed MP3s AND Apple Lossless files) handled in the same way...e.g.All Digital/Analog Conversion & Processing happens only within the W910 or H800?


Not Jim but 

5. It does not matter. A digital bit stream from a file or a digital bit stream from a decoded file from the codec is still going to go out of the head unit without processing. IOW the iDevice does not processes the decoded file in any way and the stream would be identical to the digital stream that would come out a head unit codec if _it_ were to do the file decoding. 

6. There is no other way of sending audio out a _digital_ only serial port (ie USB). And since the only hardware interface between the iDevice and the head unit is a USB plug, then it can't be any other way.

All this only being true if you disable any EQ setting in the iDevice since that is a form of digital processing that will _probably_ still be active in these type of interfaces.


----------



## jim walter

bbfoto said:


> Hey Jim,
> 
> I'm really stoked that you're here to represent Alpine on the forum! Thanks for all the awesome information you've supplied. Like everyone else, I have a few questions as well.
> 
> 1. Is the calibration microphone included with the PXA-H800, sold separately, or does it come only with the purchase of the RUX-C800?
> 
> 2. Does the calibration microphone plug directly into the H800 processor brain, or only into the RUX-C800 controller just like the H700/C701?
> 
> 3. What does the calibration microphone plug into when using a PC to do the Auto-Tune?
> 
> 4. Will there be tuning/control software available for Apple/MacOS computers? Will Windows 7 be supported?
> 
> 5. Regarding digital files from a USB-connected iPhone/iPod/iPad, does the INA-W910 head unit and/or H800 processor read the raw digital files directly from the internal hard drive or flash memory as a USB Mass Storage Device, completely bypassing any DAC or processing within the i-device? IOW, does it access the audio files just as if a USB thumb drive or hard drive were attached?
> 
> 6. If so, are all audio files and formats (both compressed MP3s AND Apple Lossless files) handled in the same way...e.g.All Digital/Analog Conversion & Processing happens only within the W910 or H800?
> 
> 7. Are any Lossless Audio file formats such as FLAC or Apple Lossless supported through a connected USB thumb drive or portable HDD?
> 
> Sorry for the barrage of questions, but enquiring minds want to know, LOL!
> 
> TIA!


The Mic comes with the H800 and plugs into the H800 itself, you do not need a RUX to ImprintEQ, AutoTCR or RoadEQ the system (but you can use it if you don't want to use the PC).

Windows 7 is supported, Mac OS is not.

No FLAC, OGG or any of the other niche formats ... we tried, trust me. I think the rest of your questions were answered below by others.


----------



## St. Dark

Jim-
someone asked this, but I missed if you said:

can you run a pair of them, like with the 'H990s?


----------



## jim walter

St. Dark said:


> Jim-
> someone asked this, but I missed if you said:
> 
> can you run a pair of them, like with the 'H990s?


No, you can not run a pair of them in series like F#1. You could run a set of them separate, but you'd have to control the volume/input via RCA or SPK level input, not via the RUX as it can only attach to one. Steve and I were thinking of how to do this as well (for something really silly) and that's about all we've come up with. We'll keep brainstorming for a way to get some kind of AINET control of them with Optical in ... but I kinda doubt it. 

Since the analog side is actually really, really clean this time around .. you could still pull it off in an SQ setup, especially if you've got a deck/soundcard with a really good DAC to feed it with.


----------



## vidizzle

any plans for single din unit to work with the h800?


----------



## bbfoto

Thank you everyone for the answers to my all of my long-winded questions!

I was curious about the USB connection because some USB iPod docks just take the Analog Line Out from the iDevice through the 31-pin dock connector.

USB connectors have 5 contacts (the outer metal plug casing and 4 internal contacts). Two contacts for +&- 5 volt power, and Three contacts for analog audio signal just like headphones...1 common (-) and 1 of each for L & R (+).

Or am I wrong? Wouldn't be the first time, LOL.


----------



## evo9

jim walter said:


> Lucky me ... its a very early unit ... so a lot of functionality is bassackwards on it, but it gets the job done for now. I'm not seeing any notes for "graphics" in the Owner's Manual, so I'm going to guess it won't be in there. I'm a geek for the EQ or the VU meters as well
> 
> *I'm in Product Planning at Alpine in the Audio / Sound System Business group.* I did the M2000 2kW amp, KTP-445 miniamp, some Bluetooth stuff etc but my two things of merit lately were the new Thin subs and the 2010 Type R re-design.
> 
> Sorry your rep isn't doing it for you.. if you want, I can put you in touch with a regional manager in the area you could talk to about it? Keep names out of the thread please, just PM's in necessary.





vidizzle said:


> any plans for a single din hu similiar to that of the dd?
> im guessin 2012?
> 
> 
> any plans for single din unit to work with the h800?





Jim, with that said............ Why did the North American market not get a verison of the IVA-D511R? Alpine*-*Mobile Media Stations*-*IVA-D511R. Some of us could really use a good single din with a sub-display. 







.


----------



## t3sn4f2

bbfoto said:


> Thank you everyone for the answers to my all of my long-winded questions!
> 
> I was curious about the USB connection because some USB iPod docks just take the Analog Line Out from the iDevice through the 31-pin dock connector.
> 
> USB connectors have 5 contacts (the outer metal plug casing and 4 internal contacts). Two contacts for +&- 5 volt power, and Three contacts for analog audio signal just like headphones...1 common (-) and 1 of each for L & R (+).
> 
> Or am I wrong? Wouldn't be the first time, LOL.


Nope, imposible.

Universal Serial Bus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If a "USB" plug is somewhere inline between the iDevice and the headunit and IT IS THE ONLY plug that connects those two devices, then there is no way the audio interface can be analog since there are no pins to carry that type of signal (as can be seen in the pin diagrams in the link above).

If the inteface is something like Alpine Fullspeed where there is something other then a USB plug (ie the minidin plug on the headunit). Which are used for analog line out PLUS some type of data inteface to control the iDevice and display information about the music on the head unit display.


----------



## ErinH

Jim, a couple questions that seem to get buried in this thread:


Are the crossover points 1/3 octave or something else? You mentioned pc setup...do we have the luxury to manually type in desired crossover points?
With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?
Are the crossovers L-R, BW, or none of the above? 
Do you guys employ the use of shelf filtering in this new processor?
When a crossover is not used does it act as an all pass filter sans phase shift? 
You've mentioned the T/A increments are 0.05ms. Is that hardcoded to the software already? Is it at all possible to make the adjustments in smaller scale (ie: 0.02ms)? The reason I ask, is because some units I've used allow for more fine tuning here and I've found it to be quite useful. 


Hope I haven't driven you nuts with the above. I'm sure I can think of more, but I'll shuttup for now.


----------



## Thrill_House

Heres another question for you, will my DVA-9861 be compatable with it, meaning will it funtion in much the same way it does now when hooked up to the h701, ie CD/DVD audio going over the toslink and all other audio sources such as IPOD/Tuner/CD changer be sent over the ainet and also will I still be able to control balance/fade/subwoofer control from the headunit?


----------



## CLK63DK

St. Dark said:


> ... - in the car world is to put the Mobridge DA1000 on a compatible MOST car and feed that to the processor of your choice. Otherwise, with a digital in, you either have to go with a package where the head sends commands to the volume control inside the processor through a data bus (such as AiNet) or else use the volume control that the processor provides.
> Even in your example of running digital into a Bit One and out to a Thesis (or Voce; or for that matter any digital source other than from a DA1000), you have to control volume ect through the DRC via the AC link cable.


Especially this is very interesting in todays cars!! MoBridge states that the DA1000 only works with the Bit1, but as there are this Alpine, the RF and other new Processors on the way, it would be very very nice to get some alternatives to the Bit1!!


----------



## Savenlid

Can this H800 receive anything else but 16bits/44.1Khz PCM on its digital input ?

As for example 24bits/96Khz ?


----------



## St. Dark

CLK - I don't recall seeing where Mobridge says that the DA1000 ONLY works with the Bit1. I know they've said they worked with ElettroMedia to ensure the two would work together and thus capitalized on the popularity of the B1 (Matt Severaid at Mobridge was actually with EM USA prior to working at Mobridge; and EM USA's "parent company" distributes Mobridge). 
As far as I can tell, the DA1000 puts out a variable digital signal (controlled by the radio's volume knob) and that's it...not sure how it could have any specific information tailored to the B1 (which has standard fiber and coax inputs) since it does not have any additional connections to it other than the TosLink. I suspect it would work fine with an Alpine, Zapco or any other processor with digital in. You should be good to go! And, if you do have a CLK63, the Mobridge piece should work for you to get digital into the Alpine (put one in a Black and it did great).

Savenlid- it has Dolby Digital and dts processing, so it can handle DVD bitstreams. Alpine is typically good about that.


----------



## Salad Fingers

This might sound stupid, but is there an advantage to using digital optical to digital coax?


----------



## t3sn4f2

Salad Fingers said:


> This might sound stupid, but is there an advantage to using digital optical to digital coax?


In regard to SQ? No.

From post #11 to the end of the thread.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-sq-forum-technical-advanced/95563-digital-output-bypasses-dac-2.html


----------



## Thrill_House

Thrill_House said:


> Heres another question for you, will my DVA-9861 be compatable with it, meaning will it funtion in much the same way it does now when hooked up to the h701, ie CD/DVD audio going over the toslink and all other audio sources such as IPOD/Tuner/CD changer be sent over the ainet and also will I still be able to control balance/fade/subwoofer control from the headunit?


Anyone?


----------



## BowDown

Pricing on this unit?


----------



## Thunderplains

Salad Fingers said:


> This might sound stupid, but is there an advantage to using digital optical to digital coax?


If it matters, light is faster than electrical signals


----------



## bradsk88

Jim - sorry this is kinda off topic, but I'm just wondering if I'm witnessing the crest of a wave moving in my favour.

When I bought my F#1 status 9-series system for the outlandish price that it was, the marketing stated that IONbus was Alpine's revolutionary new technology that was replacing AI-net and would be compatible with future technology.

But it seems like it got completely pushed aside.

Are there any plans to reintroduce IONbus peripherals? Or was I the victim of wishful thinking from engineers?


----------



## n_olympios

Thunderplains said:


> If it matters, light is faster than electrical signals


Exactly how _long_ is your car?


----------



## bradsk88

n_olympios said:


> Exactly how _long_ is your car?


About 19 million feet long. It's European


----------



## ErinH

Thunderplains said:


> If it matters, light is faster than electrical signals


yea, but even if it did matter it wouldn't... all the signal is traveling down one cable and then being split up at the processor. 



bradsk88 said:


> About 19 million feet long. It's European


so, it's about 3 feet wide?


----------



## Wheres The Butta

so your car is kind of like a top fuel dragster on viagra?


----------



## pankrok

bd5034 said:


> so your car is kind of like a top fuel dragster on viagra?


I dont really think that h800 has so good road eq to deal with your cars noise 
:laugh::laugh:


----------



## n_olympios

bikinpunk said:


> yea, but even if it did matter it wouldn't... all the signal is traveling down one cable and then being split up at the processor.


Not only that, but the signal gets into all this trouble to get there fast and then we use time delay. Oh the irony.


----------



## donkeypunch22

bikinpunk said:


> Jim, a couple questions that seem to get buried in this thread:
> 
> 
> Are the crossover points 1/3 octave or something else? You mentioned pc setup...do we have the luxury to manually type in desired crossover points?
> With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?
> Are the crossovers L-R, BW, or none of the above?
> Do you guys employ the use of shelf filtering in this new processor?
> When a crossover is not used does it act as an all pass filter sans phase shift?
> You've mentioned the T/A increments are 0.05ms. Is that hardcoded to the software already? Is it at all possible to make the adjustments in smaller scale (ie: 0.02ms)? The reason I ask, is because some units I've used allow for more fine tuning here and I've found it to be quite useful.
> 
> 
> Hope I haven't driven you nuts with the above. I'm sure I can think of more, but I'll shuttup for now.


Jim,
Answers to Bikini's questions would be greatly appreciated. Also, do the parametric filters allow you to choose any frequency, or do you have to choose from a set list? 

Thanks!


----------



## jim walter

Jim, a couple questions that seem to get buried in this thread:

1. Are the crossover points 1/3 octave or something else? You mentioned pc setup...do we have the luxury to manually type in desired crossover points?
_
1/6 Octave - No, its a drop down menu. See attached pic_

2. With the parametric, what is the bandwidth (q) adjustable from?
_
0.5/1.0/1.5/2.0/2.5/3.0/4.0/5.0
20 to 20kHz for the FRLC channels 1/6 octave
20 to 200Hz for the SUB 1/6 octave_

3. Are the crossovers L-R, BW, or none of the above?

_Don't know ... I'll check._

4. Do you guys employ the use of shelf filtering in this new processor?

_No, but the PEQ (1/6 octave, 0.5-5.0Q) is more than capable of most any shelving you're likely to need._

5. When a crossover is not used does it act as an all pass filter sans phase shift?

_Yes._

6. You've mentioned the T/A increments are 0.05ms. Is that hardcoded to the software already? Is it at all possible to make the adjustments in smaller scale (ie: 0.02ms)? The reason I ask, is because some units I've used allow for more fine tuning here and I've found it to be quite useful.
_
It is fixed at 0.05ms via the measurement (distance) adjustment. Again, see screen cap 2._


----------



## ErinH

Thanks for the information. Very much looking forward to seeing this product in action and hopefully getting a thorough review. The screenshots are a great help.
I like that you have the ability to mute a channel right on the software. That's sweet. Something I forgot the bitone does and I take advantage of fully (to help align speakers on the same side).


----------



## nasa01

Hi,

Brand new member... I wanted to find some more info about this new product. Reading through the thread I noted some of these questions were asked, but I didn't see an answer.
A little background -- I have a carpc, the audio of which is feed out to a DAC via optical spdif. The DAC is fairly old and I would love to find something to replace it with. So on to my questions:

1. Will this accept PCM data over optical spdif?
1a. if so, will it be able to handle 5.1 audio?
2. Will this device act as a USB soundcard?
3. What prevents this from handling other audio formats (beyond mp3) especally since they some are with out license fees (ie: ogg, flac)
4. Pankrok asked, and I guess I will repeat...
"could a carpc be used as the headunit without the need of RUX"


Thanks in advance.


----------



## Stearnzy

nasa01 said:


> Hi,
> 
> Brand new member... I wanted to find some more info about this new product. Reading through the thread I noted some of these questions were asked, but I didn't see an answer.
> A little background -- I have a carpc, the audio of which is feed out to a DAC via optical spdif. The DAC is fairly old and I would love to find something to replace it with. So on to my questions:
> 
> 1. Will this accept PCM data over optical spdif?
> 1a. if so, will it be able to handle 5.1 audio?
> 2. Will this device act as a USB soundcard?
> 3. What prevents this from handling other audio formats (beyond mp3) especally since they some are with out license fees (ie: ogg, flac)
> 4. Pankrok asked, and I guess I will repeat...
> "could a carpc be used as the headunit without the need of RUX"
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance.


from what I know about this device from all my question asking at ces is that audio singal over optical weather from a home dvd or computer should work fine, and it will do 5.1 you wont be able to put any audio down to the processor through usb, and i suppose you could run the carpc as a controler but youwould have to load the program every time and connect to the proccesor and conroling volume would be a pain, as it would be a small slide bar in the software


----------



## Stearnzy

If this proccessor works it will take over everything that is out there. bye bye bit one, pxah701, ms8


----------



## t3sn4f2

Stearnzy said:


> If this proccessor works it will take over everything that is out there. bye bye bit one, pxah701, ms8


MS8? _Maybe_ for non multi-channel (ie center channel based) setups.


----------



## Stearnzy

t3sn4f2 said:


> MS8? _Maybe_ for non multi-channel (ie center channel based) setups.


i have a ms8 and its nothing special to me sure it can tune a sytem well, but no real controll after that, i had to tune my car 3 times on one 3hr drive so that it could be used and then had to retune it for the competition i was entering.

I have used the ms8, F#1, Pxa-h701 and h700 and a bitone 

The new PxaH800 has assignable inputs and outputs 8ch each

but unlike the ms8, the alpine piece will let you play with the settings (time correction, xovers, and eq) after you imprint it, as well as stil being able to utilise the road eq


----------



## nasa01

Stearnzy said:


> from what I know about this device from all my question asking at ces is that audio singal over optical weather from a home dvd or computer should work fine, and it will do 5.1 you wont be able to put any audio down to the processor through usb, and i suppose you could run the carpc as a controler but youwould have to load the program every time and connect to the proccesor and conroling volume would be a pain, as it would be a small slide bar in the software


If I can send PCM data over optical, then I can set the volume one on the device and control volume via the carpc (that is how I do it now). And I could use any software to control the volume (not neccessary to use thiers) - similar to how I do it know (just set the volume on the box and leave it). I could use their software to configure things and then use a standard frontend to run on a day-to-day basis... No head unit (would be nice)!


----------



## Salami

Stearnzy said:


> i have a ms8


You appear to have missed the point of the post you quoted. We all know what the MS-8 can and can't do.

The MS-8 is probably the best for a system with a center/multi-channel system. 

The Alpine looks like it will kick every bodies ass in a two channel system.


----------



## Stearnzy

the new alpine is able to have a center channel and with the assailable inputs like the ms8 i dont see why the new alpine piece wont be able to surpass what the ms8 dose, hey im just exited as a huge fan of F#1 and the pxa-h701 i just hope that it dose all that they say it dose cause it would be a shame if i have to kick my alpine rep and everyone else i talked to at CES in the nuts


----------



## Thrill_House

Thrill_House said:


> Heres another question for you, will my DVA-9861 be compatable with it, meaning will it funtion in much the same way it does now when hooked up to the h701, ie CD/DVD audio going over the toslink and all other audio sources such as IPOD/Tuner/CD changer be sent over the ainet and also will I still be able to control balance/fade/subwoofer control from the headunit?


Still no answer?


----------



## t3sn4f2

Stearnzy said:


> the new alpine is able to have a center channel and with the assailable inputs like the ms8 i dont see why the new alpine piece wont be able to surpass what the ms8 dose


PLII Music or any other multichannel codec were not develop exclusively for the unique car environment the way the the MS-8's special Logic7 processing was. I'm sure the H800 does something to augment the based decoding but nothing like the MS-8 does. It's specialty seems to be more geared toward stereo with its Audessy Imprint tech.


----------



## rain27

Unless the Alpine unit has dramatically improved their auto tune function (Imprint), it shouldn't be compared to the MS-8. It should be compared to other manual tune units.


----------



## Stearnzy

t3sn4f2 said:


> PLII Music or any other multichannel codec were not develop exclusively for the unique car environment the way the the MS-8's special Logic7 processing was. I'm sure the H800 does something to augment the based decoding but nothing like the MS-8 does. It's specialty seems to be more geared toward stereo with its Audessy Imprint tech.


I can see your argument with this but there is also the other great argument of weather to use a center at all


----------



## Stearnzy

rain27 said:


> Unless the Alpine unit has dramatically improved their auto tune function (Imprint), it shouldn't be compared to the MS-8. It should be compared to other manual tune units.


i think your totally wrong if you use the imprint in 3 way mode it works amazing, now it isnt perfect either i had to play with it for hours to find out how to manipulate my xover so that it sounded the way i wanted especially on sub bass as well the lack of adjustable after imprinting , but with the ms8 i had to do many of the same things and the sub control wasn't a true sub control and i found i couldn't get the adjustment to work well in my cars, although you could eq after tuning, hopefully if the alpine piece works you can change time corection xovers and eq after the tune so you can make all the fine adjustments you need to after the fact, casue lets face it a computer assumes what you want to hear but it cant know exactly what to change they get confused with stuff too just like us


----------



## Stearnzy

Thrill_House said:


> Still no answer?


according to everyone i talked to you will be able to use your deck for basic control as well as switching between processor presets


----------



## t3sn4f2

Stearnzy said:


> I can see your argument with this but there is also the other great argument of weather to use a center at all


I'm not aware of that argument.

This is not a room in a house, it's an offset listening position of which each driver has it's own unique space that mangles the sound in it's own way. And at more then one source per side from multiple speaker location.


----------



## Stearnzy

t3sn4f2 said:


> I'm not aware of that argument.
> 
> This is not a room in a house, it's an offset listening position of which each driver has it's own unique space that mangles the sound in it's own way. And at more then one source per side from multiple speaker location.


but in a house your not totaly aligned either thats why they make these auto tuners to time correct and level adjust for where you are sitting in a room, yes you are closer to the speakers in a car but when you set up a denon auto tune system you dont have to be in the center for it to work so adapting it for a car isnt far fetched


----------



## rain27

Stearnzy said:


> i think your totally wrong if you use the imprint in 3 way mode it works amazing, now it isnt perfect either i had to play with it for hours to find out how to manipulate my xover so that it sounded the way i wanted especially on sub bass as well the lack of adjustable after imprinting , but with the ms8 i had to do many of the same things and the sub control wasn't a true sub control and i found i couldn't get the adjustment to work well in my cars, although you could eq after tuning, hopefully if the alpine piece works you can change time corection xovers and eq after the tune so you can make all the fine adjustments you need to after the fact, casue lets face it a computer assumes what you want to hear but it cant know exactly what to change they get confused with stuff too just like us


The MS-8 allows for tuning the eq after auto tune as well (31 bands). And if the MS-8 gets the time alignment correct (which it does), why would you want to tweak it? And why would you want to adjust the crossovers after the auto tune when you could do it prior?


----------



## jim walter

t3sn4f2 said:


> PLII Music or any other multichannel codec were not develop exclusively for the unique car environment the way the the MS-8's special Logic7 processing was. I'm sure the H800 does something to augment the based decoding but nothing like the MS-8 does. It's specialty seems to be more geared toward stereo with its Audessy Imprint tech.


The H800 does not use Audyssey tech this time around, this is our new ImprintEQ developed by our Japan HQ team. It has significantly more resolution, especially in the mid and lower bass, plus it has user definable/adjustable target curves. 

The H800 also has Euphony, which acts similarly to Logic7 in that it can create surround sound from a 2ch source.


----------



## jim walter

rain27 said:


> Unless the Alpine unit has dramatically improved their auto tune function (Imprint), it shouldn't be compared to the MS-8. It should be compared to other manual tune units.


We have, significantly. See above. Plus, now we offer manual adjustment after the tune to allow users to further customize past even their self-defined target curves to shift the center image, add some low end shelving, etc etc ... its has quite a bit more power than our previous renditions of Imprint ever had.


----------



## rain27

jim walter said:


> We have, significantly. See above. Plus, now we offer manual adjustment after the tune to allow users to further customize past even their self-defined target curves to shift the center image, add some low end shelving, etc etc ... its has quite a bit more power than our previous renditions of Imprint ever had.


This is great news!


----------



## jim walter

Stearnzy said:


> according to everyone i talked to you will be able to use your deck for basic control as well as switching between processor presets


Ai-Net units will control Presets, nothing more. This is a new platform different from the H700/701, more like the F#1 sans firewire ... so the control lingo is a bit different. For most users, this control will be sufficient after the initial tune is complete and a few presets are saved. For the tweakos amongst us, the RUX can be tucked away and used as necessary to adjust on the fly.


----------



## jim walter

Stearnzy said:


> hopefully if the alpine piece works you can change time corection xovers and eq after the tune so you can make all the fine adjustments you need to after the fact, casue lets face it a computer assumes what you want to hear but it cant know exactly what to change they get confused with stuff too just like us


Exactly the feedback we got after some years of Imprint in the field ... the computer was assuming too much. Now, we are giving you guys the ability to adjust the target curve and let the computer voice it to your preference. 

For example, if you find a tune that just sounds amazing .. you can save that target curve on the computer. Then, go tune another car with that same "target" curve you saved .. basically proving that your target is rock solid. You can then save that as your "house/shop" curve that you'll voice all of your cars to sound like. This is going to be fun for the nitpicky tuners amongst us that can now create a standard "voicing" that they can set all of the cars they work on to sound like. Again, you can adjust from there to yours or your customers tastes .. but you'll find a good baseline that you know will work for you to simplify future tunes/installs.


----------



## Mirage_Man

jim walter said:


> Ai-Net units will control Presets, nothing more. This is a new platform different from the H700/701, more like the F#1 sans firewire ... so the control lingo is a bit different. For most users, this control will be sufficient after the initial tune is complete and a few presets are saved. For the tweakos amongst us, the RUX can be tucked away and used as necessary to adjust on the fly.


When you say it "will control presets, nothing more "do you mean they won't control volume or source either .


----------



## jim walter

Your source is selected by the HU regardless, unless you are using the AUX+ via the second AI-NET jack on the H800. Still, I'd imagine that it would control that as well but I'll double confirm it.

Volume is obviously controlled.


----------



## pankrok

filters are IIR type ?

what about analog part after the DACs?
are these driven by opamps or ics? is type of these disclosable?


----------



## t3sn4f2

jim walter said:


> The H800 does not use Audyssey tech this time around, this is our new ImprintEQ developed by our Japan HQ team. It has significantly more resolution, especially in the mid and lower bass, plus it has user definable/adjustable target curves.
> 
> *The H800 also has Euphony, which acts similarly to Logic7 in that it can create surround sound from a 2ch source.*


Nice! You guys might want to throw that into the product literature as a strong point, that should be a good selling point now a days with all the newer cars starting to have center channels built in.

Will the Imprint autotune for that multichannel mode as well, for all channels independently that is?


----------



## Hoot

I think it is pretty cool that Alpine is modeling this to help dealers/shops better serve their customers who are not into the nitty gritty details, but just want better sound; particularly, because at the same time they are not stripping away the ability for DIYers to do all their own nitpik tuning, themselves, with the very same equipment - NICE.


----------



## Thrill_House

Stearnzy said:


> according to everyone i talked to you will be able to use your deck for basic control as well as switching between processor presets


So does that mean I will still be able to control balance, fade and sub control from the headunit?


----------



## Stearnzy

rain27 said:


> The MS-8 allows for tuning the eq after auto tune as well (31 bands). And if the MS-8 gets the time alignment correct (which it does), why would you want to tweak it? And why would you want to adjust the crossovers after the auto tune when you could do it prior?


Is that why i had to re-tune my 2 cars at least 5 times each to get it to sound right so i could compete. the ms8 dose not always get time alignment correct the center and left imaging was always the issue i had, and to fix it i acctualy had to trick it by turning my head more than what it wanted me to just like in imprint, if you put the mic in different locations than what it tells you it will change the overall outcome of the tune


----------



## Stearnzy

jim walter said:


> Ai-Net units will control Presets, nothing more. This is a new platform different from the H700/701, more like the F#1 sans firewire ... so the control lingo is a bit different. For most users, this control will be sufficient after the initial tune is complete and a few presets are saved. For the tweakos amongst us, the RUX can be tucked away and used as necessary to adjust on the fly.


that's kind of what i was sayin and yes a rux is an amazing tuning tool, probably the one thing i like about the 701 over f#1 to be able to sit in your seat that your tuning for and just have a small controller in your hand making adjustments rather that having your laptop on your lap or console blocking speaker information its so nice and i find you can relax better while tuning by using it.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Stearnzy said:


> i think your totally wrong if you use the imprint in 3 way mode it works amazing, now it isnt perfect either i had to play with it for hours to find out how to manipulate my xover so that it sounded the way i wanted especially on sub bass as well the lack of adjustable after imprinting , but with the ms8 i had to do many of the same things and the sub control wasn't a true sub control and i found i couldn't get the adjustment to work well in my cars, although you could eq after tuning, *hopefully if the alpine piece works you can change time corection xovers and eq after the tune so you can make all the fine adjustments you need to after the fact, *casue lets face it a computer assumes what you want to hear but it cant know exactly what to change they get confused with stuff too just like us


I think this would be pretty hard to do. The auto tuning takes into account all the setting before it runs along with what it measures during. Then it calculates and create the final filter. If a slope, TA, or crossover point is changed after wouldn't it then have to go through the complete calibration process for each change each and every time (think of the time you'd have to wait each time you pressed a button)? 

Or even more complicated, it might need to remeasure with the mics in order to compensate for the new acoustic phase change at the crossover point of the tweeter. You change the slope or crossover frequency, that then changes the phase of the tweeter at its crossover point, and then the TA need to be changed on the tweeter to realign it in that area. Or at least that is how I understand that it works, I could be wrong though.

Seems to me like EQ, tone, and saved curves would not affect things like this so they can be changed after cal without affecting the final filter.


----------



## Hoot

Seems like the more we hear from Jim about the new H800, the more intreiging the piece seems to be. Jim, when you get a moment, it would be great to have you weigh in on a thread a posted about the w910 a couple days ago:

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...in-w910-touchscreen-info-question-thread.html


----------



## jim walter

Hoot said:


> Seems like the more we hear from Jim about the new H800, the more intriguing the piece seems to be. Jim, when you get a moment, it would be great to have you weigh in on a thread a posted about the w910 a couple days ago:
> 
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...in-w910-touchscreen-info-question-thread.html


Wish granted


----------



## PavelN

jim walter, can H800 be controlled by vehicle hub VPA-B222R? If not, will there soon be a hub that can control it? thank you.


----------



## Mic10is

RUX-C800 pic1 » Alpine Underground
RUX-C800 pic2 » Alpine Underground


----------



## ErinH

Jim, an additional question:
I assume this unit will have a usb port since it is PC compatible... (or, is it something else like the h900?).... regardless... do you guys plan to allow for future FW upgrades on this particular unit?
I know it could be seen as a 'shoot yourself in the foot' theme from a mfg's standpoint, but it's nice for me to know that a company has the ability to send out upgrades on their products. Even if the upgrade was a minimal fee for new s/w GUI or perks. 
There are, however, a few companies that have this ability, though they do not make use of it. Stinks.


----------



## jim walter

PavelN said:


> jim walter, can H800 be controlled by vehicle hub VPA-B222R? If not, will there soon be a hub that can control it? thank you.


I do not know. I'll confirm that for you. At this time, there are no plans for a new VHUB that I know of


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> Jim, an additional question:
> I assume this unit will have a usb port since it is PC compatible... (or, is it something else like the h900?).... regardless... do you guys plan to allow for future FW upgrades on this particular unit?
> I know it could be seen as a 'shoot yourself in the foot' theme from a mfg's standpoint, but it's nice for me to know that a company has the ability to send out upgrades on their products. Even if the upgrade was a minimal fee for new s/w GUI or perks.
> There are, however, a few companies that have this ability, though they do not make use of it. Stinks.


The H800 has a USB B connector (the square printer cable style one) and comes with a 5m cable. We chose this connector since this is what we found was the easiest for anyone to get their hands on in a 5m distance (in the event you lose or break your supplied cable, which everyone does).... A few years back, we had to use online vendors to find 5m A-mini A cables when we were doing H650/660/100 installs. Again, we learned from our experience here.

This port is for both tuning (PC Control) as well as FW updates. We will be offering some software updates in the future for this product with certainty. I know .. shocking ... it almost seems like we were listening to you guys for the past few years


----------



## ErinH

jim walter said:


> This port is for both tuning (PC Control) as well as FW updates. We will be offering some software updates in the future for this product with certainty. I know .. shocking ... it almost seems like we were listening to you guys for the past few years


took the words outta my mouth. 


I agree on the 'B' cables. Everyone has a printer they can steal the cable from.


----------



## NikitaDrako

Hi boys, already presented myself in the w910 thread.
Jim, how will the RoadEQ work?
I mean, there is the need of a microphone for that, isn't? will it be connected to the same input as the mic used for imprint settings?

Edit: forgot to ask... If I use cda 117 will I have the same controll features as would from w910?


----------



## ErinH

Jim, the more questions you are, the more I'll keep asking. lol. 


Just curious... do you guys foresee the ability to make a tuning app for something like the iphone/itouch or even the ipad? As an owner of the iPad, I'd LOVE the ability to tune with this. The ipad does have a usb out via the camera kit that might work well enough to control the GUI of the h800. Not sure of any other compatibility pitfalls... just something I was wondering.


----------



## CLK63DK

Hello Jim & All....

Now I have to put a question in also. Can the H800 handle a digital signal with different attenuation, for us that has an OE headunit with digital 44.1 Pre-out?

thanks.


----------



## t3sn4f2

CLK63DK said:


> Hello Jim & All....
> 
> Now I have to put a question in also. Can the H800 handle a digital signal with different attenuation, for us that has an OE headunit with digital 44.1 Pre-out?
> 
> thanks.


Are you referring to a MoBridge type digital preamp device for OEM MOST systems? It should work fine since the signal leaving those device is still a standard S/PDIF digital output which is compatible with the H800 and the only difference in them would be that the digital samples would have been divided by a given number in order to bring down the level of each sample equally.

That's why Mobridge calls it a preamp.


----------



## CLK63DK

t3sn4f2 said:


> Are you referring to a MoBridge type digital preamp device for OEM MOST systems? It should work fine since the signal leaving those device is still a standard S/PDIF digital output which is compatible with the H800 and the only difference in them would be that the digital samples would have been divided by a given number in order to bring down the level of each sample equally.
> 
> That's why Mobridge calls it a preamp.


Thanks for your reply.

But - yes and no. Not all processors work well with the Mobridge like solutions (eg. the 701), since they cant handle the digital signal when it is at a reduced sound level (16 bit problem), hence my question.


----------



## s4turn

not sure if this has been asked, but can you play audio files via USB to the Proc?

id love to get my hands on a h800, but i think the pricing may be out of my league!


----------



## t3sn4f2

CLK63DK said:


> Thanks for your reply.
> 
> But - yes and no. Not all processors work well with the Mobridge like solutions (eg. the 701), since they cant handle the digital signal when it is at a reduced sound level (16 bit problem), hence my question.


Hmmm, good to know, thanks.


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> Jim, the more questions you are, the more I'll keep asking. lol.
> 
> 
> Just curious... do you guys foresee the ability to make a tuning app for something like the iphone/itouch or even the ipad? As an owner of the iPad, I'd LOVE the ability to tune with this. The ipad does have a usb out via the camera kit that might work well enough to control the GUI of the h800. Not sure of any other compatibility pitfalls... just something I was wondering.


I was just talking about this today with Steve and some of the installers ... the real answer to you question is sadly no. We'd love to have it, but since the communication must be done via USB ... it'd be complicated. You'd need to make a dongle that would authenticate with the unit, then received BT or WiFi signals to be controlled via an iPad ... plus you'd need an app.

Anyone with serious programming skills that actually believes they could do this ... PM me, we could pitch it to mgmt here. Chances are slim, but I'd push from my side to try for it. 

Jim


----------



## jim walter

s4turn said:


> not sure if this has been asked, but can you play audio files via USB to the Proc?
> 
> id love to get my hands on a h800, but i think the pricing may be out of my league!


No sir, that's for USB control via the PC app or updating the firmware of the unit.


----------



## subwoofery

jim walter said:


> I was just talking about this today with Steve and some of the installers ... the real answer to you question is sadly no. We'd love to have it, but since the communication must be done via USB ... it'd be complicated. You'd need to make a dongle that would authenticate with the unit, then received BT or WiFi signals to be controlled via an iPad ... plus you'd need an app.
> 
> Anyone with serious programming skills that actually believes they could do this ... PM me, we could pitch it to mgmt here. Chances are slim, but I'd push from my side to try for it.
> 
> Jim


Making a tuning app for iTouch/iPhone/iPad would be really strong point to sell more processor. Being the first one to do it is also a + 

Kelvin


----------



## Hoot

subwoofery said:


> Making a tuning app for iTouch/iPhone/iPad would be really strong point to sell more processor. Being the first one to do it is also a +
> 
> Kelvin


And Android and even Blackberry, as well.


----------



## jim walter

Hoot said:


> And Android and even Blackberry, as well.


Completely agree ... I just know its not in the cards on our side right now. Anyone with a solid idea, feel free to pitch it my way. I work in the Product _Planning _Group here - ie evaluating potential projects, technologies etc etc ... I'd love to hear from someone that thinks they could do this.

Jim


----------



## xpsvwino

Jim,
Thanks for all of your wisdom.
Could you please let us know :bowdown:to what extent the CDA-117 will be able to manipulate the h800 and if you can operate it without the controler?

Thanks for your help,
Gary


----------



## Salad Fingers

xpsvwino said:


> manipulate


Hehe


----------



## n_olympios

Dirty focker.


----------



## Brian NS

Holding off picking up a used PXA-H701 until more info on the PXA-H800 comes out.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Brian NS said:


> Holding off picking up a used PXA-H701 until more info on the PXA-H800 comes out.


More info?! $hit, If I were you I'd only hold off because it's not available yet.  

No comparison between the two IMO.


----------



## minibox

The H-650 was probably the worst car audio purchase I've ever made and, regrettably, soon followed by the second worst, the 9887 imprint combo. 
From what I'm reading about this new unit it sounds like Alpine is finally getting it right but forgive me if I'm still a bit skeptical.


----------



## n_olympios

Brian NS said:


> Holding off picking up a used PXA-H701 until more info on the PXA-H800 comes out.


This is a weird way to handle things IMO. If you need an audio processor now, get a used H701 and do your job until the H800 is out and available, then you'll get all the info you can get. Then you can make the change, without losing any money since I doubt the H701 prices will go down considerably, just because the new processor is out. Besides, the prices on the H701 are very good now.


----------



## NikitaDrako

any info regarding the roadEQ?


----------



## Stearnzy

Question for Jim

I think i remember talking to our rep at ces and he was talking about strapping 2 h800 together to get 16 adjustable outputs, do you know if you can do this?


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> any info regarding the roadEQ?


Hi Nikita,

The RoadEQ will use the tuning mic (needs to be kept plugged), that you place:
a) In-Ceiling above driver
b) Driver's visor
c) Rear View Mirror area

You'll measure the sound characteristics of the car parked and off with everything closed (or the condition you want it to EQ for). 

1) Place the mic in the car
2) Measure the car
3) Set RoadEQ Level - 1/2/3

Jim


----------



## jim walter

Stearnzy said:


> Question for Jim
> 
> I think i remember talking to our rep at ces and he was talking about strapping 2 h800 together to get 16 adjustable outputs, do you know if you can do this?


No, this cannot be done with one RUX.

The only way to do this would be on the analog side of things, run two sets of RCA inputs to them and tune them independently. You could run this off any deck, but would have no adjustment of them other than varying the input level (volume) via your HU pre-outs.

Jim


----------



## jim walter

minibox said:


> The H-650 was probably the worst car audio purchase I've ever made and, regrettably, soon followed by the second worst, the 9887 imprint combo.
> From what I'm reading about this new unit it sounds like Alpine is finally getting it right but forgive me if I'm still a bit skeptical.


I can understand you were upset with the H650, being you were only allowed to have Imprint tuning, but how could you lump the 87 in there too? That was an awesome HU that had some of the best tuning options this side of a P9 and great SQ as well.


----------



## xpsvwino

Jim,
Thanks for all of your wisdom.
Could you please let us know to what extent the CDA-117 will be able to manipulate the h800 and if you can operate it without the controler?

Thanks for your help,
Gary


----------



## jim walter

xpsvwino said:


> Jim,
> Thanks for all of your wisdom.
> Could you please let us know to what extent the CDA-117 will be able to manipulate the h800 and if you can operate it without the controler?
> 
> Thanks for your help,
> Gary


Basic control - same as the other HUs. Yes, it can be run without a RUX, tuning will need to be done via PC. There is no need for the RUX unless you want to tweak on the fly.


----------



## NikitaDrako

jim walter said:


> Hi Nikita,
> 
> The RoadEQ will use the tuning mic (needs to be kept plugged), that you place:
> a) In-Ceiling above driver
> b) Driver's visor
> c) Rear View Mirror area
> 
> You'll measure the sound characteristics of the car parked and off with everything closed (or the condition you want it to EQ for).
> 
> 1) Place the mic in the car
> 2) Measure the car
> 3) Set RoadEQ Level - 1/2/3
> 
> Jim


Thanks Jim!
So the tunning mic won't be the one from ktx-100? And, from this positions positions I can notice that the roadEQ will be basically for the driver, right? can it be tunned for the car center, for an instance?


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> Thanks Jim!
> So the tunning mic won't be the one from ktx-100? And, from this positions positions I can notice that the roadEQ will be basically for the driver, right? can it be tunned for the car center, for an instance?


The first two positions focus on the driver, the rear view placement would be for the car center. You could theoretically place it near anywhere you wanted the EQ to be "focused". 

The mic is different than the old H100 tuning mic. It is included with the H800 so you don't have to worry about purchasing anything. 

Jim


----------



## Thunderplains

Jim,

Don't know if this has been asked, but how does the new 800 compare to the older holy grail F#1 H900?


----------



## jim walter

Thunderplains said:


> Jim,
> 
> Don't know if this has been asked, but how does the new 800 compare to the older holy grail F#1 H900?


We are waiting until we get out Pre-Production piece in here with all the final tweaks in it before we benchmark it (SQ wise - Freq Resp, S/N, THD, etc) .. but we're looking pretty good on paper to stand side by side with it.

Tuning & System expansion, the H900 will have pretty much any and everything beat ... but for a real world system, I think we have something to hang out hats on with the new H800.

Jim


----------



## n_olympios

Hmm, I'd like to know that as well, being an H900 user. 

Edit: I was too late. :laugh:


----------



## Booger

Jim,

Will there be a 'limited edition Chrome and Yellow series"???

THEN YOU COULD "AUTOGRAPH" ONE FOR ME!!!!! hahahahaha 

SIGNED ONES ALWAYS SOUND "BETTER" AND COST MORE.....lol


----------



## jim walter

Booger said:


> Jim,
> 
> Will there be a 'limited edition Chrome and Yellow series"???
> 
> THEN YOU COULD "AUTOGRAPH" ONE FOR ME!!!!! hahahahaha
> 
> SIGNED ONES ALWAYS SOUND "BETTER" AND COST MORE.....lol


You know we only do
black and yellow
black and yellow 
black and yellow 
black and yellow ....

You know how it is


----------



## Booger

Fo Sho!

Can you sign my THIN TYPE R WOOFERS?????

I Will pay you cause they will bump harder after you "autograph" them!!!! lololololol


----------



## jim walter

Booger said:


> Fo Sho!
> 
> Can you sign my THIN TYPE R WOOFERS?????
> 
> I Will pay you cause they will bump harder after you "autograph" them!!!! lololololol


Alright Booger .. we've got to get back to the topic at hand here ... don't want to close this guy down now do we :laugh:


----------



## jim walter

So, I just got my first sample of a fully functional PC App for the H800 this morning. We're at 99% right now with this .. and I have to say I like it.

Here's a couple of screen caps

CYA NOTE: This is still not final-final software, so the one you see might change when it comes to market.


----------



## ErinH

nice...

I see you guys are using multeq (assumedly for imprint)... curious if you considered using dynamic eq as well (iow: a volume dependent EQ that can be either done automatically via imprint or even custom tailored). I ask this question because there is another bit of hardware out there that allows for this in the car audio realm, however, that DSP's controller has to be used in order to control that feature via volume. The problem with that is simply having two different sources (much like would be the case if one only bought the h800/c800 and used it with a non-ai-net headunit). With the way the w910+h800 sync, the need for a separate volume control would be mitigated, and quite honestly would definitely be a HIGH factor in many's purchase decision.


On another note, would it be possible for you to show us what the EQ screen looks like? Just for curiousity's sake. 

Again, I really appreciate you being here to answer these questions. 

- Erin


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> nice...
> 
> I see you guys are using multeq (assumedly for imprint)... curious if you considered using dynamic eq as well (iow: a volume dependent EQ that can be either done automatically via imprint or even custom tailored). I ask this question because there is another bit of hardware out there that allows for this in the car audio realm, however, that DSP's controller has to be used in order to control that feature via volume. The problem with that is simply having two different sources (much like would be the case if one only bought the h800/c800 and used it with a non-ai-net headunit). With the way the w910+h800 sync, the need for a separate volume control would be mitigated, and quite honestly would definitely be a HIGH factor in many's purchase decision.
> 
> 
> On another note, would it be possible for you to show us what the EQ screen looks like? Just for curiousity's sake.
> 
> Again, I really appreciate you being here to answer these questions.
> 
> - Erin


Hi Erin,

Once again, I have to reiterate that this is not using Audyssey tuning, rather our own proprietary tuning that allows for customer defined target curves and after the fact adjustment. However, it looks like you found some of our leftover slop from the original development.. that'll be ImprintEQ for production (realize we started development on this guy many moons ago before we had enough market feedback to determine the need to do our own tuning algorithm). Thanks for being a beta tester! 

The RoadEQ is effectively a dynamic EQ, in that it actively EQ's the signal with reference to a quiet cabin to achieve a consistent sound regardless of cabin noise. Not sure which piece you are talking about, but you don't have to be shy, just type the name in here. 

Here is a shot of the EQ


----------



## ErinH

jim walter said:


> Hi Erin,
> 
> Once again, I have to reiterate that this is not using Audyssey tuning, rather our own proprietary tuning that allows for customer defined target curves and after the fact adjustment. However, it looks like you found some of our leftover slop from the original development.. that'll be ImprintEQ for production (realize we started development on this guy many moons ago before we had enough market feedback to determine the need to do our own tuning algorithm). Thanks for being a beta tester!
> 
> The RoadEQ is effectively a dynamic EQ, in that it actively EQ's the signal with reference to a quiet cabin to achieve a consistent sound regardless of cabin noise. Not sure which piece you are talking about, but you don't have to be shy, just type the name in here.
> 
> Here is a shot of the EQ


Cheers for the feedback, Jim!
I'm sorry for making that mistake... I do recall you saying that previously but was thrown by the multEQ lablel. 

I imagined RoadEQ was somewhat similar... I just view the two differently. Whereas with RoadEQ you're adjusting levels/FR based on road noise and with dynamicEQ, you're changing the curve based on the listener's hearing (ie: fletcher munson/equal loudness). In regards to how they differ in the use, well, for competitors, the roadEQ wouldn't really help as there is no correlating road noise to compensate for. Rather, we're in a parked car. Of course, competitors are a niche market, I know... but I do see the carry-over from "parked" to "driving" dynamicEQ plausible. Not sure if that helps relay my case any better, though.  


The specific brand is Audison. They use the dynamicEQ to allow for a somewhat 'automatic' curve, or the user can go in with the use of a 31band equalizer and shape an upper and lower volume bounds FR. Use of this feature is only available via the DRC controller, though. 

So, for example, let's say you want to mimic the fletcher munson curve (for pure example). The goal here is to take some of the sharpness out of the area your hearing is most sensitive to at high volumes, while at low volumes, you boost the frequencies you're least sensitive to:

At low volumes you will have a 15dB uprise starting at 300hz and going to 20hz, you want a boosted top end starting at 10khz and want the rest of the system to play relatively flat. 
At high volumes, you want the low end and high end to be a relatively flat while you want to notch out 2-5khz, with 4khz being the largest notch.

Now that you know your target low and high, you simply go to the bitone software, turn on dynamicEQ, click on the 'low volume' setting and shape the equalizer curve to your desired tastes; boosted low end from 200hz down to 20hz and boosted high end from 10-20khz. Done there.
Then, on the 'high volume' setting, you keep the equalizer curve relatively flat, except you drop 2-5khz a few dB, notching it out to mimic the F-M curve (posted below for illustration).
You save the settings, and then you're done. Now whenever you use the volume, the software interpolates the curve between your low and high volume settings. 

Of course, the above example is based on published f-m curves. As an end user, I would appreciate the ability to make the curve whatever I want (as the audison softare permits).
I hope that wasn't too wordy. :blush:


F-M Curve (posted in large resolution for others who are curious):


----------



## EEB

What is the dimensions of the H800?


----------



## jim walter

EEB said:


> What is the dimensions of the H800?


8.5" x 6.75" x 2"


----------



## jim walter

Hey Erin,

I see the point there .. but but but ... the reality is, most everyone here will voice/EQ their cars at their preferred listening level. The tuning tweaking process is usually quite iterative in that we hear something we don't like and go back and tweak it. Rarely are we voicing at such quiet levels that we need to actively add in f-m (or any user defined) EQ to get it to sound the same at the higher levels. The only real variable is actually the environment .. most of us tune parked, without road noise. The RoadEQ attempts to eliminate that variable.

Just my take on things ...
Jim


----------



## ErinH

I understand. You're really only pandering to a small crowd with that feature, but I definitely think it's a cool one. Just from a 'linearity' perspective, that's why I view something like dynamicEQ so beneficial. 

It would be interesting to see how external pink noise or any external sound source might work to manipulare the RoadEQ. Maybe one could make an inverse of the desired curve and use that to shape the roadEQ curve???... No idea how RoadEQ works in this regard, though.
Not saying it's needed, but my mind is just wandering right now...


----------



## Melodic Acoustic

Jim,

Maybe I missed it and please forgive me if I did, as i don't want the questions to be redundant by any means.

From looking over the screen shots and over the info very quick posted in this thread, can the new h800 output channels be configure like the below or anything in the below matter:


*Channels 1-2:* tweeter or wide-band

*Channels 3-4:* mid-bass 

*Channels 5-6:* rears

*Channel 7:* center

*Channel 8:* sub-woofer

or more simple

*Channels 1-2:* tweeter or wide-band

*Channels 3-4:* mid-bass

*Channel 5:* center

*Channel 6:* subwoofer

Basically either a 2 way front stage with center/rears and subwoofer/s

or

2 way front stage with Center and Subwoofer.


----------



## Matt R

Looks good, lets see the guts?!?!

Matt


----------



## planbdc

Pictures of the guts would be great, also how about power requirements? I'm figuring 20 amps tops?


----------



## sygnal

@ jim

when is this coming to Asia?


----------



## jim walter

planbdc said:


> Pictures of the guts would be great, also how about power requirements? I'm figuring 20 amps tops?


Power consumption is much lower than that .... Like 3A tops. I don't have my computer with me. I'll look it up tomorrow.


----------



## jim walter

sygnal said:


> @ jim
> 
> when is this coming to Asia?


I'd imagine May/June. Where specifically in Asia?


----------



## jim walter

Matt R said:


> Looks good, lets see the guts?!?!
> 
> Matt


I don't have one ... The only working one in the US is in the Camaro. I'll check and see if I can find a pic tomorrow though.


----------



## sygnal

jim walter said:


> I'd imagine May/June. Where specifically in Asia?


thailand and philippines jim,so may or june thx jim


----------



## teamelite

jim walter said:


> I don't have one ... The only working one in the US is in the Camaro. I'll check and see if I can find a pic tomorrow though.


Jim are you refering to the camaro at CES?


----------



## NikitaDrako

Jim, I've just seen the software pics and now I have another question!
I might have lost something in this thread, but from what I've seen in the second pic, we'll be able to do a full 11ch. eq?
So this mean I can control independently a 2way kit in the front and in the back?
Or even a 3 way in the front and a full-range in the back?
That sounds wonderfull!
Am I correct? anyone can answer, surely!


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> Jim, I've just seen the software pics and now I have another question!
> I might have lost something in this thread, but from what I've seen in the second pic, we'll be able to do a full 11ch. eq?
> So this mean I can control independently a 2way kit in the front and in the back?
> Or even a 3 way in the front and a full-range in the back?
> That sounds wonderfull!
> Am I correct? anyone can answer, surely!


8CH of EQ, there are only 8 outputs. 31 Band x6CH + 10 Band x2CH (Sub)

You could to 3-way in the front and full range in the back, using the Sub channels to run the mid-bass/front subs and CH5/6 for the rears. Full EQ on all channels, all independently time aligned and balanced.


----------



## jim walter

teamelite said:


> Jim are you refering to the camaro at CES?


Yessir. It's back here at Alpine now.


----------



## jim walter

sygnal said:


> thailand and philippines jim,so may or june thx jim


Typically you guys are 1-2 months behind us .. so I'd say June to be safe.

Jim


----------



## Mic10is

Random question---what prompted a release in the US before other countries? Typically Alpine Japan released a product almost a full year in advance before it comes to the US.

SO why here 1st?


----------



## jim walter

Mic10is said:


> Random question---what prompted a release in the US before other countries? Typically Alpine Japan released a product almost a full year in advance before it comes to the US.
> 
> SO why here 1st?


I've seen this posted here before, and its simply untrue ... can you name a specific product that was released in Japan before it was here?

We launch in the US and Japan at the same time for common products, while the rest of Asia and (sometimes) EU have to wait until we fill in our channels a bit before they get theirs.


----------



## jim walter

H-Audio Inc. said:


> Jim,
> 
> Maybe I missed it and please forgive me if I did, as i don't want the questions to be redundant by any means.
> 
> From looking over the screen shots and over the info very quick posted in this thread, can the new h800 output channels be configure like the below or anything in the below matter:
> 
> 
> *Channels 1-2:* tweeter or wide-band
> 
> *Channels 3-4:* mid-bass
> 
> *Channels 5-6:* rears
> 
> *Channel 7:* center
> 
> *Channel 8:* sub-woofer
> 
> or more simple
> 
> *Channels 1-2:* tweeter or wide-band
> 
> *Channels 3-4:* mid-bass
> 
> *Channel 5:* center
> 
> *Channel 6:* subwoofer
> 
> Basically either a 2 way front stage with center/rears and subwoofer/s
> 
> or
> 
> 2 way front stage with Center and Subwoofer.


Yes.

Your system options on the opening setup are as follows:
Front 2Way + Rear + Sub
Front 3Way + Sub
Front 3Way + Rear
Front 2Way + Rear + Center + Sub


----------



## Mic10is

jim walter said:


> I've seen this posted here before, and its simply untrue ... can you name a specific product that was released in Japan before it was here?
> 
> We launch in the US and Japan at the same time for common products, while the rest of Asia and (sometimes) EU have to wait until we fill in our channels a bit before they get theirs.


H-700 was in Japan before US.
I had my mom send me one almost a full year before it came out in the US.

I remember talking to Steve Brown at the 03 IASCA Finals ( I think, maybe 02) about the analog noise, and he said that when it gets released in the US that they will fix it....they didnt
only difference was RUX illumination colors.


Wasnt F1 released in Japan 1st?


----------



## evo9

jim walter said:


> So, I just got my first sample of a fully functional PC App for the H800 this morning. We're at 99% right now with this .. and I have to say I like it.
> 
> Here's a couple of screen caps
> 
> CYA NOTE: *This is still not final-final software, so the one you see might change when it comes to market*.




Picture below is suggesting 5 pairs of output + 1 centre RCA's. What I see is 3-way front active in a 5.1 configuration. Would be nice if this is indeed true.












.


----------



## Melodic Acoustic

jim walter said:


> Yes.
> 
> Your system options on the opening setup are as follows:
> Front 2Way + Rear + Sub
> Front 3Way + Sub
> Front 3Way + Rear
> *Front 2Way + Rear + Center + Sub*


And we have a winner. Put me down for 2 H800


----------



## subwoofery

evo9 said:


> Picture below is suggesting 5 pairs of output + 1 centre RCA's. What I see is 3-way front active in a 5.1 configuration. Would be nice if this is indeed true.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


If you look closely, some channels have been disabled. Meaning 8 channels out max. 
It has 8 outputs... Similar to the MS-8. If you need 3-way front in a 5.1 then you need a passive Xover between the midrange and the tweeter. 

Kelvin


----------



## skywolf75

jim walter said:


> I'd imagine May/June. Where specifically in Asia?


Hi Jim,
Pardon my interruption. How about Singapore? Can't wait to get my hands on the H800.


----------



## jim walter

skywolf75 said:


> Hi Jim,
> Pardon my interruption. How about Singapore? Can't wait to get my hands on the H800.


Most likely the same (June). You are all part of the Asia-Pacific Region, which is separate from Japan, so you should follow pretty soon after US and Japan. I'll have to see what production numbers are for the first lot ... then I can see where things will go and when. That's not until March though when all QC approvals are complete.


----------



## planbdc

Sign me up for one, Jim!!!! Thanks for all of your help, and info!

Also, where the heck can we pre-order one of these things?


----------



## Booger

Love the screen shots Jim!!

Thanks


----------



## roxj01

Any chance of a DIYMA group buy ?


----------



## jim walter

roxj01 said:


> Any chance of a DIYMA group buy ?


Not a chance. Head to your local authorized dealer and support their business please.


----------



## subwoofery

jim walter said:


> Not a chance. Head to your local authorized dealer and support their business please.


That's actually good that you are doing this and I understand your point of view - Manufacturers need dealers to stay in business. 

Kelvin


----------



## planbdc

Are there any dealers, or does anyone know any dealers that would be willing to start a preorder thread?? I know somewhere in a previous post someone stated that they had preorderd 2 units.


----------



## subwoofery

planbdc said:


> Are there any dealers, or does anyone know any dealers that would be willing to start a preorder thread?? I know somewhere in a previous post someone stated that they had preorderd 2 units.


Yes it was in this thread, just PM him. 

Kelvin


----------



## jim walter

subwoofery said:


> Yes it was in this thread, just PM him.
> 
> Kelvin


Orders are open, no need to preorder. Walk into any store and order one through them, Probably just put down a deposit.


----------



## planbdc

The problem for me is that I live in a remote area of my state, closest alpine dealer is 2+hrs away, are there any Internet dealers?


----------



## jim walter

planbdc said:


> The problem for me is that I live in a remote area of my state, closest alpine dealer is 2+hrs away, are there any Internet dealers?


Crutchfield is an authorized online retailer that could ship to you.


----------



## n_olympios

So realistically for Europe we're looking at the end of the year before it's available, right?


----------



## jim walter

n_olympios said:


> So realistically for Europe we're looking at the end of the year before it's available, right?


Doubt it. Remind me on Monday and I'll call to out alpine Europe offices and ask what their plan is. Where are you specifically ?


----------



## n_olympios

Greece. Summer 2012 more probable then? 

Thanks Jim!


----------



## St. Dark

Jim-
with regards to tuning- did you retain the "bass focus" feature, where you could adjust time delays on more than one driver at a time?

Similarly, can you switch between adjusting more than one output channel's EQ simultaneously and then individually, without losing or overwriting what has already been done to a given channel? AudioControl allows this, yet so few other DSPs do. 
Thanks!


----------



## Matt R

Hey Jim, how about those pics of the guts?

Not sure if it's already been discussed but, what dsp chip and dac chips are in the new piece?

Matt


----------



## NikitaDrako

jim walter said:


> Doubt it. Remind me on Monday and I'll call to out alpine Europe offices and ask what their plan is. Where are you specifically ?


Hey Jim, do you know about Switzerland or Germany?
I live in Brazil and we're actually without a organized alpine representative, by april I'll be at Basel, Swizterland and Colone, germany, if I could buy it there would be great!


----------



## CLK63DK

Official Europe introduction will be at the AMICON fair in Leipzig, Germany in April.
(According to Alpine Europe...)


----------



## iasca judge

I can't wait to get this piece in, I am tired of trying to locate a good H701.


----------



## jim walter

Matt R said:


> Hey Jim, how about those pics of the guts?
> 
> Not sure if it's already been discussed but, what dsp chip and dac chips are in the new piece?
> 
> Matt


Quad (4) Wolfson K-Rank 24-bit Sigma Delta D/A's
Dual (2) 32-bit floating-point DSP's

Edit - added a pic of the DACs I got from Japan. I can't say its final as the sample that is broken here has rivets to hold it closed!


----------



## jim walter

CLK63DK said:


> Official Europe introduction will be at the AMICON fair in Leipzig, Germany in April.
> (According to Alpine Europe...)


Yes sir, that is the plan.


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> Hey Jim, do you know about Switzerland or Germany?
> I live in Brazil and we're actually without a organized alpine representative, by april I'll be at Basel, Swizterland and Colone, germany, if I could buy it there would be great!


Alpine Latin and South America ship out of here in Torrance, so I'd imagine you'd be able to order as soon as we have them. Alpine Europe is scheduled to be right behind us though, so you'll be good either way.


----------



## jim walter

St. Dark said:


> Jim-
> with regards to tuning- did you retain the "bass focus" feature, where you could adjust time delays on more than one driver at a time?
> 
> Similarly, can you switch between adjusting more than one output channel's EQ simultaneously and then individually, without losing or overwriting what has already been done to a given channel? AudioControl allows this, yet so few other DSPs do.
> Thanks!


I can't do it on the software I have here, as it keeps crashing as I try and select more than one channel. That said, my build is from Sept ... since the latest Jan build won't load right now. I'll have to double check with Japan to be sure of the real answer for you.

Jim


----------



## NikitaDrako

jim walter said:


> Alpine Latin and South America ship out of here in Torrance, so I'd imagine you'd be able to order as soon as we have them. Alpine Europe is scheduled to be right behind us though, so you'll be good either way.


Jim, I know it's really off topic, but do you know anything about brazil's representative? 
Last time I called them they said they wouldn't be importing alpine so soon.
Thanks!


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> Jim, I know it's really off topic, but do you know anything about brazil's representative?
> Last time I called them they said they wouldn't be importing alpine so soon.
> Thanks!


Not a clue to be honest .. sorry.


----------



## BamaJohn

Jim, just a tad off the topic here, but I just found the Car Audio magazine article about the Camaro with the 910/H800 system at CES. Will that car be making the rounds in the US at all? Is there a schedule, if so? I'd love to see/hear it in person! 

I'm also curious about the kickpanel work--was there a lot of extensive work required behind the cutout to make room for the 8", or is there a good bit of space in that part of the Camaro body?


----------



## jim walter

BamaJohn said:


> Jim, just a tad off the topic here, but I just found the Car Audio magazine article about the Camaro with the 910/H800 system at CES. Will that car be making the rounds in the US at all? Is there a schedule, if so? I'd love to see/hear it in person!
> 
> I'm also curious about the kickpanel work--was there a lot of extensive work required behind the cutout to make room for the 8", or is there a good bit of space in that part of the Camaro body?


It will be making it's rounds like may of the past demo vehicles have. All of the details are being worked out this month so I should have a schedule by March-ish. I know its heading to DUB LA in march and Camaro5Fest in April so far bit there are a lot of other shows on the plate right now that are being decided on.

If you're ever in LA I would be happy to demo it, same goes for anyone on here ... You just have to bring me sone Kings Hawaiian! . Just kidding ... But I'd eat it if you brought it lol


Regarding the kicks, they were quite a bit of work. Those are 1/4" plate steel enclosures welded in and seam sealed in there .... About 0.15ft per sub and they sound great in there w ~350-400w each off the sub channel on the new V60 amps.


----------



## Mirage_Man

jim walter said:


> It will be making it's rounds like may of the past demo vehicles have.


Any chance it will be at Spring Break Nationals?


----------



## NikitaDrako

jim walter said:


> Not a clue to be honest .. sorry.


Wow!!! 
Just called AV2, alpine's representative for Brazil, to check prices and availability of products.
CDA-117 for U$1250,00
H800 - expected for U$2000,00
no way I'm buying it here!


----------



## pankrok

Jim , judging from the screen shots, pc software is able to control master volume/balance/sub so should I be excited that it is almost confirmed that a car pc has full control of H800?!?!?!?!?!


----------



## tnbubba

I take it this new unit is compatible with the "older" alpines with ai-net?


----------



## Thrill_House

So would I now be able to walk into an Alpine dealer up here in Toronto Canada and pre-order this unit?


----------



## jim walter

Thrill_House said:


> So would I now be able to walk into an Alpine dealer up here in Toronto Canada and pre-order this unit?


You'd tell your salesman at your authorized dealer and he'd order one through his rep for you, so effectively yes.


----------



## jim walter

pankrok said:


> Jim , judging from the screen shots, pc software is able to control master volume/balance/sub so should I be excited that it is almost confirmed that a car pc has full control of H800?!?!?!?!?!


Don't know for sure. I know that we just got two new samples and rux's here last night so I'm pitching to let them have me install and test it in my Jeep ... I'll report back w the results ...fingers crossed


----------



## JDM_Ej

tnbubba said:


> I take it this new unit is compatible with the "older" alpines with ai-net?


I could be wrong, but in my (professional) experience, its rarely backwards compatible... It may partially work but probably not 100%.


----------



## tnbubba

yea i'd like to know as I';m seeling all my head units..
and was going to buy the 305 till I realized the imprint with the 305S wont let me turn a way the way I need!


----------



## NikitaDrako

we passed thru this about W910, but will cda-117 be able to transfer Ipod's data to h800's dacs?


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> we passed thru this about W910, but will cda-117 be able to transfer Ipod's data to h800's dacs?


No. The 117 is analog out, you'd need an HU with digital out. Even then, you'll need uses that output to pass the iPod signal via digital ... Like the W910.


----------



## jim walter

tnbubba said:


> yea i'd like to know as I';m seeling all my head units..
> and was going to buy the 305 till I realized the imprint with the 305S wont let me turn a way the way I need!


The H800 will work with the 305/305S in limited capacity (sound q and audio 100%, but limited control), you'll need an RUX for full control on the go ... or a pc for the first time setup and you'll be good to go with just the deck and processor.


----------



## NikitaDrako

jim walter said:


> No. The 117 is analog out, you'd need an HU with digital out. Even then, you'll need uses that output to pass the iPod signal via digital ... Like the W910.


So the only way of deconding ipod @ h800 will be the w910, or any HU with digital (toslink) out would do it?
for an instance, a pioneer DVD with optical output would deliver it to be processed?
I know it's another brand, but w910 won't come for less than U$ 3000.00 here in brazil


----------



## SSSnake

Jim,

Will Alpine be offering a single DIN HU with optical out this year? Also, will the control SW on the H800 run on a MAC as well as PC? If so, an IPAD in the car is looking very promising...

Charles


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> So the only way of deconding ipod @ h800 will be the w910, or any HU with digital (toslink) out would do it?
> for an instance, a pioneer DVD with optical output would deliver it to be processed?
> I know it's another brand, but w910 won't come for less than U$ 3000.00 here in brazil


I don't know how the Pioneer handles digital out for iPod, if it does it at all... so I can't help out with that one.


----------



## t3sn4f2

NikitaDrako said:


> So the only way of deconding ipod @ h800 will be the w910, or any HU with digital (toslink) out would do it?
> *for an instance, a pioneer DVD with optical output would deliver it to be processed?*I know it's another brand, but w910 won't come for less than U$ 3000.00 here in brazil


Sounds like that will work. Works with the bitone.


----------



## jim walter

SSSnake said:


> Jim,
> 
> Will Alpine be offering a single DIN HU with optical out this year? Also, will the control SW on the H800 run on a MAC as well as PC? If so, an IPAD in the car is looking very promising...
> 
> Charles


No 1DIN optical here in the US for this year. 

No. XP/Vista/Win7 only.
Still, an iPad in the car feeding it via optical input with a RUX for control would be an awesome system ... Being Mac compatible wouldn't affect the iPad integration.


----------



## jim walter

t3sn4f2 said:


> Sounds like that will work. Works with the bitone.


And there you go. Thanks t3.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Here's particular Pioneer DVD unit I was talking about. Being used with a large capacity USB hard drive to his bitone. 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/classifieds/91004-pioneer-avh-p4100dvd-double-din-like-new-digital-out.html


----------



## SSSnake

Thanks Jim.

I was hoping to forgo the RUX and use the IPAD as the control interface. Also, I don't think the IPAD has an optical out.

Hmm, the H-800 may push me back into the Car PC arena.


----------



## t3sn4f2

SSSnake said:


> Thanks Jim.
> 
> I was hoping to forgo the RUX and use the IPAD as the control interface. Also, I don't think the IPAD has an optical out.
> 
> Hmm, the H-800 may push me back into the Car PC arena.


No optical out, but there are a number of adapters that will make it happen. All of different qualities, prices, and glitch free functionality.

Best SQ one out now (if there even is a _better _ SQ digital source) is a Cypher Labs "AlgoRhythm Solo"

"Key features include:


•Wolfson Microelectronics™ digital-to-analog converter
•Decryption of the Apple USB output (not a "pass through" of the line-out)
•*Asynchronous mode USB to SPDIF conversion*
•The Cypher Labs AlgoRhythm Solo streams bit-perfect digital audio from Apple iPad™, iPhone® or iPod® devices to headphone amplifiers and powered speakers using Apple USB Audio for superior audio quality
•The Cypher Labs AlgoRhythm Solo communicates using Apple’s proprietary iPod Accessory Protocol (iAP) over USB
•Authentication of the accessory to the iPod is performed using the Apple authentication coprocessor
•10 configurable timers and 3 clock chips allow maximum flexibility in controlling digital timing, which means the device produces extremely low jitter - far below human hearing
•1/8” stereo analog output and RCA digital output
•Li-Ion battery - AC switching is totally isolated
•Portable design with short and clean signal paths
•Connects to home and portable headphone amplifiers and DACs
•USB-A docking cable included
•AC adapter and power cable included (international adapters widely available)
•Designed to match in size and audio character with the ALO RxMK II headphone amp 
•Available in black or silver. Sounds fantastic!
•Designed and assembled in the USA"

I'd mod it by relocating the Li-Ions batteries to the outside of the case and mounting a mini 12v fan over them, same for the iPad. Don't want those batteries exploding and ruining everything.


----------



## ErinH

SSSnake said:


> Thanks Jim.
> 
> I was hoping to forgo the RUX and use the IPAD as the control interface. Also, I don't think the IPAD has an optical out.
> 
> Hmm, the H-800 may push me back into the Car PC arena.


Apple iPad Camera Connection Kit - Apple Store (U.S.)
+
CES00022S1 SIIG CE-S00022-S1 USB SoundWave 7.1 Pro, Virtual 7.1-Channel Surround Sound USB Audio Adapter with Optical S/PDIF Out, RoHS Compliant


----------



## SSSnake

T3/Erin,

Thanks for the suggestions. If the Citrix Receiver SW acts as a windows host instead of a termial/desktop interface that might put the IPAD back on my list. 

Erin, 

Does the SIIG work with an IPAD through the adaptor you listed? The documentation indicates it is a Windows device.

Charles


----------



## ErinH

I'm sorry. I didn't have time to find a link to anything other than that. I was just suggesting a usb/optical adapter to do the job and grabbed the first link I found. I can test this myself tonight if you'd like, with my turtle beach usb/optical adapter and camera kit.


----------



## SSSnake

Erin,

Thanks! I didn't know if you first hand experience with this one or not. There are three hurdles for me going IPAD in the Caddie. Driver Information Center functionality would be lost (at least if I can't figure out a work around), there doesn't appear to be a Windows host for IPAD (Citrix Receiver is really a terminal program), and then the least of which is the optical issue. It sure would be nice to have that gorgeous dispaly and all of the the IPAD use interface goodies right smack in the middle of my dash. It would also open up space to do a proper enclosure for the center channel.

Charles


----------



## darinof

jim walter said:


> No 1DIN optical here in the US for this year.


Hi Jim
Is there any Alpine 1din optical that transfer Ipod's data to h800's dacs even if it is sold outside US?


----------



## Shazzz

Forgive the real quick HiJack but while you all are waiting for the H800 will somebody in Japan PLEASE bring me an X088!!! Apparently this HU has the H800 built into it and then some. Damn where's Steve Browns number when you need it?


----------



## ErinH

Jim, can the software GUI be resized for use on both standard sized displays and net book sized displays? The bit one and zapco software both are a fixed resolution and do not allow for a native fit to net book so the user has to stretch out the net book resolution and then scroll the entire window to see all DSP options. Kind of annoying... Just wondered if you guys allow for the h800 software to all fit within both types of screen reolutions. 
Make sense? 

Also, you got pm.


----------



## sygnal

hi jim

what do you think of 9887 and h800 combo?

upon setting and tuning the h800 on laptop done when i want to fine tune it can i use my 9887 "the 9887 procesing capabity"? with out changing the set up i made from h800 via my laptop?


----------



## jim walter

Shazzz said:


> Forgive the real quick HiJack but while you all are waiting for the H800 will somebody in Japan PLEASE bring me an X088!!! Apparently this HU has the H800 built into it and then some. Damn where's Steve Browns number when you need it?


I'll fire one up this week to be sure, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't. One thing is for sure, that deck is a beast


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> Jim, can the software GUI be resized for use on both standard sized displays and net book sized displays? The bit one and zapco software both are a fixed resolution and do not allow for a native fit to net book so the user has to stretch out the net book resolution and then scroll the entire window to see all DSP options. Kind of annoying... Just wondered if you guys allow for the h800 software to all fit within both types of screen reolutions.
> Make sense?
> 
> Also, you got pm.


It is fixed resolution. Here is a shot of it at 1280x800 on my laptop. Something neat about this is that it is tiled ... so, if you've got a nice 1680x1050 or larger display, you can tile the windows and tune between windows (like TCR and PEQ) while seeing everything at the same time. Unlikely for most shops, I know .. but 22" displays were like $100 during black friday, so you never know.


----------



## jim walter

sygnal said:


> hi jim
> 
> what do you think of 9887 and h800 combo?
> 
> upon setting and tuning the h800 on laptop done when i want to fine tune it can i use my 9887 "the 9887 procesing capabity"? with out changing the set up i made from h800 via my laptop?


If you plan on connecting via the RCA PreOuts to the 6CH RCA Inputs on the H800 ... then you are good to go. You'll get the tweakability with the 87 on the front end, with the bulk of the tuning going on in the H800.


----------



## sygnal

jim walter said:


> If you plan on connecting via the RCA PreOuts to the 6CH RCA Inputs on the H800 ... then you are good to go. You'll get the tweakability with the 87 on the front end, with the bulk of the tuning going on in the H800.


thats good to hear! will just wait for the release here thx jim! oh another can the old d300 handle the h800? like the h700,i mean can the d300 control the h800?


----------



## jim walter

sygnal said:


> thats good to hear! will just wait for the release here thx jim! oh another can the old d300 handle the h800? like the h700,i mean can the d300 control the h800?


No problem. 

No go on the D300. Just basic limited controls instead of "processor control".


----------



## skywolf75

Hi Jim, can you advise on the dimensions of the H800?


----------



## planbdc

jim walter said:


> 8.5" x 6.75" x 2"


Was already posted.


----------



## NikitaDrako

jim walter said:


> If you plan on connecting via the RCA PreOuts to the 6CH RCA Inputs on the H800 ... then you are good to go. You'll get the tweakability with the 87 on the front end, with the bulk of the tuning going on in the H800.


What about CDA-117?
Will the use of h100 + h800 do any good?


----------



## ErinH

jim walter said:


> It is fixed resolution. Here is a shot of it at 1280x800 on my laptop. Something neat about this is that it is tiled ... so, if you've got a nice 1680x1050 or larger display, you can tile the windows and tune between windows (like TCR and PEQ) while seeing everything at the same time. Unlikely for most shops, I know .. but 22" displays were like $100 during black friday, so you never know.


Okay. Not prime use for a netbook, then, unless one resizes the netbook's window itself. Not a huge issue, but I was just hoping there would be a way to change the native resolution of the program itself rather easily. 
It may not seem a big deal, but if you guys ever consider a software upgrade, that's one I'd be investing time in, personally. While it may seem arbitrary, you find it quite cumbersome once you actually plop the software on to a limited resolution computer such as a netbook. Netbooks are being used a lot now for DSP and RTA use due to their portability. It's nice to squeeze everything in to one screen and control all the feeatures like that rather than scrolling.
Then again, I'll just have to see what features you "lose" when the GUI is cropped on a netbook display (typical res @ 1024x680). The audison software chops off the EQ sliders. Maybe your software is only clipped in an area that might not be necessary for certain tuning. I'll just have to wait and see myself, though, how it looks on 1024x680. 

Thanks for the answer. 

- Erin


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> What about CDA-117?
> Will the use of h100 + h800 do any good?


Pretty much the same ... You'll get the tweakability of the H100 in-HU control for on the fly adjustments, but do 98% of the core tuning w the H800 and PC.


----------



## subwoofery

bikinpunk said:


> Okay. Not prime use for a netbook, then, unless one resizes the netbook's window itself. Not a huge issue, but I was just hoping there would be a way to change the native resolution of the program itself rather easily.
> It may not seem a big deal, but if you guys ever consider a software upgrade, that's one I'd be investing time in, personally. While it may seem arbitrary, you find it quite cumbersome once you actually plop the software on to a limited resolution computer such as a netbook. Netbooks are being used a lot now for DSP and RTA use due to their portability. It's nice to squeeze everything in to one screen and control all the feeatures like that rather than scrolling.
> Then again, I'll just have to see what features you "lose" when the GUI is cropped on a netbook display (typical res @ 1024x680). The audison software chops off the EQ sliders. Maybe your software is only clipped in an area that might not be necessary for certain tuning. I'll just have to wait and see myself, though, how it looks on 1024x680.
> 
> Thanks for the answer.
> 
> - Erin


WOOT... Out of topic but you're a Mod now?  

Kelvin


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> Okay. Not prime use for a netbook, then, unless one resizes the netbook's window itself. Not a huge issue, but I was just hoping there would be a way to change the native resolution of the program itself rather easily.
> It may not seem a big deal, but if you guys ever consider a software upgrade, that's one I'd be investing time in, personally. While it may seem arbitrary, you find it quite cumbersome once you actually plop the software on to a limited resolution computer such as a netbook. Netbooks are being used a lot now for DSP and RTA use due to their portability. It's nice to squeeze everything in to one screen and control all the feeatures like that rather than scrolling.
> Then again, I'll just have to see what features you "lose" when the GUI is cropped on a netbook display (typical res @ 1024x680). The audison software chops off the EQ sliders. Maybe your software is only clipped in an area that might not be necessary for certain tuning. I'll just have to wait and see myself, though, how it looks on 1024x680.
> 
> Thanks for the answer.
> 
> - Erin


I think I misunderstood you before. That resolution I was showing was on a 1280x800 screen and you can see that it is quite a bit smaller than that. I think it'll be perfect for netbooks as the actual resolution of the PC Software is right about 1024x600. Here are two screen caps of my screen resolution set at different settings to show the fitment for you. 

Height to 600 pixels to show the fitment (so 680 vertical will be perfect)

Width at 1024 - a perfect fit widtwise

Last one is a 1680x1050 display (Samsumg 2253BW) with 4 windows tiled on the screen, showing how you can how almost all of you info on the screen simultaneously. 

As I said before, this is beta software .. so small details may change, but I'm pretty certain we've got a great setup for portables/netbooks here.


----------



## pankrok

the only problem will be in case of car pc were 800x480 is the limit of a 7" monitor. 
in case of 8" wide screen 1024x600 is possible


----------



## ErinH

jim walter said:


> I think it'll be perfect for netbooks as the actual resolution of the PC Software is right about 1024x600. Here are two screen caps of my screen resolution set at different settings to show the fitment for you.


That's excellent news! I'm pumped. Seriously... I wanna go run laps outside now just to get the excitement out.  
I understand what you mean about putting all 4 "major screens" (as I'll call them) on the same view pane. I think for an initial setup, that's great. IE: At my house, I would use my 22" samsung to set up the basics. Then, for finer tuning inside the car, I'd use the netbook. 
I really like what you guys have done here, regarding this. I think that is a great move for the user-friendly/tuning-friendly environment. 

BTW, you've got return PM.


----------



## raamaudio

Netbook will be perfect then as I have one strictly used for running EFI live in on my Duramax and LS Vette engine, trans, etc....., I plan to have the processor in both rides

Rick


----------



## sygnal

jim walter said:


> No problem.
> 
> No go on the D300. Just basic limited controls instead of "processor control".


much better the 9887 h800 combo?


----------



## tnbubba

stoopid azz question here..
does this replace the imprint?? or is a modified imprint on the way too?
I have a 305s but cant use the imprint because the bass/mid bass crossover freq is limited to 200hz, so if I want to do a front only 3 way active system. at say 0-700, 700 - 5.6K, 5.6K up the imprint won't do it.


----------



## t3sn4f2

tnbubba said:


> stoopid azz question here..
> does this replace the imprint?? or is a modified imprint on the way too?
> I have a 305s but cant use the imprint because the bass/mid bass crossover freq is limited to 200hz, so if I want to do a front only 3 way active system. at say 0-700, 700 - 5.6K, 5.6K up the imprint won't do it.


It comes with an improved version.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1197707-post75.html
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1209386-post262.html
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1209389-post263.html
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1209396-post266.html


----------



## skywolf75

planbdc said:


> Was already posted.


Noted with thanks. My eyes must be blinded when I asked.


----------



## NikitaDrako

Hey,
Does someone knows about w910's release date?


----------



## planbdc

Direct from Alpine's website

alpine-usa.com/company/press/general/2011/alpine-electronics-introduces-the-ina-w910-audiovideonavigation-system/

"Pricing and Availability
*The INA-W910 will be available for in May, price is TBA. *The INA-W900BT is currently available for regular MAP of $1,149.95 or at a promotional MAP of $999.95 at participating U.S. retailers through March 2011. The PXA-H800 will be available in April for $699.95 MAP. All Alpine products will be available at authorized Alpine dealers. Please visit alpine-usa.com Alpine Electronics of America, Inc. to locate a retailer. The SXV100 will be available at retail for $69.99 in March 2011 through SiriusXM’s distribution channel."


----------



## tnbubba

that still doesn't tell me what the freq x/o ranges are gonna be..and I'm not seeing a manual yet. I mean they could raise the midbass/mid rang to 500 hz.. that's not gonna do me a lot of good. I guess my system will stay in limbo until more info is out.. hare driving around with HU or tunes no tunes..


----------



## St. Dark

jim walter said:


> I can't do it on the software I have here, as it keeps crashing as I try and select more than one channel. That said, my build is from Sept ... since the latest Jan build won't load right now. I'll have to double check with Japan to be sure of the real answer for you.
> 
> Jim


I'd be extremely appreciative if the desire from the field for such flexibility could be communicated to them.
Thanks!


----------



## jim walter

tnbubba said:


> stoopid azz question here..
> does this replace the imprint?? or is a modified imprint on the way too?
> I have a 305s but cant use the imprint because the bass/mid bass crossover freq is limited to 200hz, so if I want to do a front only 3 way active system. at say 0-700, 700 - 5.6K, 5.6K up the imprint won't do it.



Looks like you'll be good to go this time around 

Jim

CYA Note: Specs are not final, blah blah ... but this is what I've got in the H800 in the truck right now as well on v.993 software, so I'm pretty confident in the above.


----------



## jim walter

St. Dark said:


> Jim-
> with regards to tuning- did you retain the "bass focus" feature, where you could adjust time delays on more than one driver at a time?


You can lock L+R together for TCR. Also, you can adjust and or all of them on the screen (or the RUX, just push channel) without needing to save them or write over a preset to listen to you change. On the PC, you can click the + or -, drag the slider, or input a distance value directly for each channel.



St. Dark said:


> Similarly, can you switch between adjusting more than one output channel's EQ simultaneously and then individually, without losing or overwriting what has already been done to a given channel? AudioControl allows this, yet so few other DSPs do.
> Thanks!


Again, you can lock L+R of each "set" of channels 1/2, 3/4 etc. You can do on the fly adjustments without overwriting your previous presets (in both RUX or PC mode), you'll just call up the old preset to get back to where you were. Similarly, you can export presets (and their respective tuning parameters) to the PC to save them if you run out of preset space in the unit (6 presets). That way, you can call back in old presets/tunes ... or if you ever have to exchange or service your unit, just reload the exported preset and you're tuned in 10 seconds (cool for shops that do similar systems in car ... gets you a good baseline tune to tweak from).

I've only had it installed for two days now, but I'm VERY impressed with it so far. I just got a new link to a software update (v.998), so we are getting really close to approval now. If there are any more questions, feel free to ask and I'll test it out for you.

Jim


----------



## tnbubba

sweet.. saving up now!!!!

thanks JIM!


----------



## St. Dark

Jim 
good to hear on the Time Correction.

Let me restate on the EQ, though. On the 'H900, if you tune the Left Front channel the way you want it, then tune the Right Front channel to get a similar acoustic curve the listening postion...but then want to EQ the Left and Right simultanously to adjust for tonality...when you select them both, the processor flattens both channels out. All the previous adjustments done to the two channels independently are gone.
Similarly, when you try this on the 'H990, upon "grouping" the two channels together, you are forced to either copy the left settings to the right channel, or vice versa. Again, the different setting already applied to the two channels to get them to sound the same, gets lost.
It would be really nice to be able to keep any setting already applied to a given channel (both time and EQ) while then adjusting it as part of a group.


----------



## jim walter

This works the same way as those did, they've got to be matched to move "linked". It will prompt you to choose which curve to use for the linked channels if they are not balanced when linking them.

..... but, I've got an idea! If you have two H800s and cascade them, you can do it.

I do understand your request though, it'd be neat for sure and I can feed that back as a request for future updates but it won't work like that from the get go.


----------



## maxxx

Jim, do you expect an updated version of the VPA-B222 in order to control the H800?


----------



## si in oc

Woot


----------



## RAzZin

Honestly without new head units with optical out the applicability and high demand on H800 is doubtful...

Currently there are 3 groups of alpine HUs with digital out:

- old dvd models - good for those who listen CDs, almost useless for ipod or hdd lovers;
- IVA-**** media stations with touch screens - awfull interface, compared to IPAD\androind pads all car touchpad head units (not only alpine, all manufacturers) look like something from the 20th century - slow reactions, bad screens, etc.
- New 2din HU - I doubt it's touchscreen interface is much better than the old one, so..


Some people will be ready to buy something from units listed above, some - very low numbers though - will use CarPC as a HU (or home audio media players). But a huge % of people who would like to use 1din HUs with up-to-date ipod\hdd support and good user interface willing to create a strong SQ system are unable to do that <_< Why? I really doubt that adding a digital out to 117 or x305 hu's is very expensive, bringing these 2 units modifications with digital out on market on msrp around 600-650$ (without ability to control the H800, just optical out) would create 2 bestsellers and seriousely boost the sales of H800 - such 1500-1900$ system would deliver very good SQ and tuning capabilities with very low nuber of competitors on market (as Pioneer's ODR line is way more expensive). Why Alpine isn't thinking of such development line?

Thnak you in advance for comments.


----------



## blusky4u

I'm looking forward to the new Alpine PXA-H800 and the PXA-H800 In-Dash Controller set up. Its about time. I'm currently running the PXA-H701 and the RUX-C701 in my car and over this past year I've been noticing a few little glitches here and there. I think its just because its old and its been in 2 different car systems. My main complaint is I cannot do any real adjustments on the fly. I have to pull over if I want to do any adjustments thats outside of the preset modes. Don't get me wrong I do love my system but I see some places where it could of been improved upon and I think the new Alpine PXA-H800 and the PXA-H800 equipment Alpines deffenately put the frosting on the cake this time. From what I've seen its really nice equipment!!! Now the hard parts waiting until they become available. I hate to admit it but I've been thinking allot about "Old School vs. New School" Been a topic before I know.


----------



## planbdc

Razzin makes some good points in his post, i agree that there is need for a single din with everything he listed. Hope Alpine is listening.....


----------



## evo9

RAzZin said:


> Honestly without new head units with optical out the applicability and high demand on H800 is doubtful...
> 
> Currently there are 3 groups of alpine HUs with digital out:
> 
> - old dvd models - good for those who listen CDs, almost useless for ipod or hdd lovers;
> - IVA-**** media stations with touch screens - awfull interface, compared to IPAD\androind pads all car touchpad head units (not only alpine, all manufacturers) look like something from the 20th century - slow reactions, bad screens, etc.
> - New 2din HU - I doubt it's touchscreen interface is much better than the old one, so..
> 
> 
> Some people will be ready to buy something from units listed above, some - very low numbers though - will use CarPC as a HU (or home audio media players). But a huge % of people who would like to use 1din HUs with up-to-date ipod\hdd support and good user interface willing to create a strong SQ system are unable to do that <_< Why? I really doubt that adding a digital out to 117 or x305 hu's is very expensive, bringing these 2 units modifications with digital out on market on msrp around 600-650$ (without ability to control the H800, just optical out) would create 2 bestsellers and seriousely boost the sales of H800 - such 1500-1900$ system would deliver very good SQ and tuning capabilities with very low nuber of competitors on market (as Pioneer's ODR line is way more expensive). Why Alpine isn't thinking of such development line?
> 
> Thnak you in advance for comments.



Don't you guys east of the Atlantic gets the Alpine IVA-D511R advance single din unit? It is us North Americans that don't get an advance Alpine single din unit. That question was asked at least twice in this thread & Jim has failed to answer!!! I would buy the IVA-D511R if it was available in the US, along with the PXA-H800. *But I guess I'll keep what I have and wait for the NEW STRAPPABLE Bitone to come.* 





.


----------



## evo9

planbdc said:


> Razzin makes some good points in his post, i agree that there is need for a single din with everything he listed. Hope Alpine is listening.....


They dont unfortunately








.


----------



## RAzZin

evo9 said:


> Don't you guys east of the Atlantic gets the Alpine IVA-D511R advance single din unit? It is us North Americans that don't get an advance Alpine single din unit. That question was asked at least twice in this thread & Jim has failed to answer!!! I would buy the IVA-D511R if it was available in the US, along with the PXA-H800. *But I guess I'll keep what I have and wait for the NEW STRAPPABLE Bitone to come.*
> 
> .


It's with touchscreen again.. fail for me imho, unless car HU's interface and usability comes close to apple\android pads it's a lousy way of development.


----------



## St. Dark

RAzZin - keep in mind, we just, in these very halls, reaffirmed that with a quality preamp stage on ouputting piece of gear, there is negligible difference in analog back to digital versus straight digital these days.
Admittedly, if I was running a single DIN iPod radio, I'd prefer digital out...but for the vast majority of systems, running analog out will yield comparable results. 


evo- strappable B1? You heard this from a reliable source? We may actually see the day that Larry F doesn't burst into apoplexy at the suggestion of running two of them? *L*


----------



## jim walter

maxxx said:


> Jim, do you expect an updated version of the VPA-B222 in order to control the H800?


Hi Maxxx, 

The V-Hub will control Volume, Balance, Fader and Sub but no presets. There will be no updated VHub or update for it.

Jim


----------



## jim walter

RAzZin said:


> Honestly without new head units with optical out the applicability and high demand on H800 is doubtful...
> 
> Currently there are 3 groups of alpine HUs with digital out:
> 
> - old dvd models - good for those who listen CDs, almost useless for ipod or hdd lovers;
> - IVA-**** media stations with touch screens - awfull interface, compared to IPAD\androind pads all car touchpad head units (not only alpine, all manufacturers) look like something from the 20th century - slow reactions, bad screens, etc.
> - New 2din HU - I doubt it's touchscreen interface is much better than the old one, so..
> 
> 
> Some people will be ready to buy something from units listed above, some - very low numbers though - will use CarPC as a HU (or home audio media players). But a huge % of people who would like to use 1din HUs with up-to-date ipod\hdd support and good user interface willing to create a strong SQ system are unable to do that <_< Why? I really doubt that adding a digital out to 117 or x305 hu's is very expensive, bringing these 2 units modifications with digital out on market on msrp around 600-650$ (without ability to control the H800, just optical out) would create 2 bestsellers and seriousely boost the sales of H800 - such 1500-1900$ system would deliver very good SQ and tuning capabilities with very low nuber of competitors on market (as Pioneer's ODR line is way more expensive). Why Alpine isn't thinking of such development line?
> 
> Thnak you in advance for comments.


Thanks for the comments. 

I couldn't disagree with you more on a lot of them, but I understand where your enthusiasm is driving your comments. 

Unfortunately, adding digital output to something isn't as easy as soldering a post onto a board and we would be taxing every other purchaser of the unit (that has no intentions of using a processor) with the cost of a digital out, not something the market is willing to accept.

You state that the interface is archaic ... and I agree 100%, but it is easy and safe to use while driving with minimal distraction and large, clear text. The fact is, unless it is an iPAD, a user cannot control a 3.5" or 4" screen quickly at a glance from an arms-reach away. The screen must be fixed mounted and non-intertia type to be able to cleanly and accurately control it for the user (unless there is some MMI/iDrive feedback style control). The HU may not looks the greatest (we, as well as other manufacturers are making some strides here though .. with a long way to go yet) ... but they offer a functional and safe user interface to the customer.


----------



## jim walter

evo9 said:


> Don't you guys east of the Atlantic gets the Alpine IVA-D511R advance single din unit? It is us North Americans that don't get an advance Alpine single din unit. That question was asked at least twice in this thread & Jim has failed to answer!!! I would buy the IVA-D511R if it was available in the US, along with the PXA-H800. *But I guess I'll keep what I have and wait for the NEW STRAPPABLE Bitone to come.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I still haven't gotten a reply if the 511R is dig out ... if you're feeling frisky, head over to the Japan or EU website and download the manuals ... they'll have the details in there.

We don't carry the 1DIN over here, that was based on market feedback. If you feel otherwise, let your local authorized dealer know that you want one .. get the movement going and if there is demand for it, we'll bring it over in a heartbeat.


----------



## evo9

St. Dark said:


> RAzZin - keep in mind, we just, in these very halls, reaffirmed that with a quality preamp stage on ouputting piece of gear, there is negligible difference in analog back to digital versus straight digital these days.
> Admittedly, if I was running a single DIN iPod radio, I'd prefer digital out...but for the vast majority of systems, running analog out will yield comparable results.
> 
> 
> evo- strappable B1? You heard this from a reliable source? We may actually see the day that Larry F doesn't burst into apoplexy at the suggestion of running two of them? *L*



I was talking to the man the other day, & express my need for another pair of output. He said get inline you & everybody else. The word used to describe the future of the BitOne is STACKABLE!!!! Then he goes on to mention a few things in the works. Netbook & iPad users will be happy to know their needs are being looked at. 





.


----------



## kustomkaraudio

For those that want single din, you could try hunting down a IVA- d106. Its a flip out ( but nothing says you gotta have the screen up ) It has optical out, and processor control. If you add a BT 400 and a 433iv cable , you get 5volt charge for newer iphones. Just a thought.


----------



## evo9

kustomkaraudio said:


> For those that want single din, you could try hunting down a IVA- d106. Its a flip out ( but nothing says you gotta have the screen up ) It has optical out, and processor control. If you add a BT 400 and a 433iv cable , you get 5volt charge for newer iphones. Just a thought.


The simple fact that it does not have a sub-display kept me from buying it. Clarion, Kenwood & Pioneer thought otherwise with their single din units. 



.


----------



## evo9

jim walter said:


> I still haven't gotten a reply if the 511R is dig out ... if you're feeling frisky, head over to the Japan or EU website and download the manuals ... they'll have the details in there.
> 
> We don't carry the 1DIN over here, that was based on market feedback. If you feel otherwise, let your local authorized dealer know that you want one .. get the movement going and if there is demand for it, we'll bring it over in a heartbeat.




I have already looked thru the manual in detail. The only reason why I have not imported one, has to do with region 1 coding. If Alpine USA can make it play region 1 DVD's let me know, I'll get one over. 

As for market feedback; I find it hard to believe everybody has a double din opening in their dash! I am sure someone with a classic Chevelle, is gonna modify their dash for a double din. You guys were on the right track with the IVA-D310. But quickly went back stone age with the IVA-D106. If that market feedback was based on the IVA-D106, that would explain alot. 






.


----------



## vidizzle

evo9 said:


> I have already looked thru the manual in detail. The only reason why I have not imported one, has to do with region 1 coding. If Alpine USA can make it play region 1 DVD's let me know, I'll get one over.
> 
> As for market feedback; I find it hard to believe everybody has a double din opening in their dash! I am sure someone with a classic Chevelle, is gonna modify their dash for a double din. You guys were on the right track with the IVA-D310. But quickly went back stone age with the IVA-D106. If that market feedback was based on the IVA-D106, that would explain alot.
> 
> 
> .



i agree with this.. having owned the d310 and now the 106 it feels like a step back ...the d310 was a much better looking unit only problem was the miles and miles of wiring and they did get that right with the 106 but regardless it still feels like a step back... as i myself looked into importing 1 from japan or england but the encoding also was the problem.. if that was available in the US it deffinitely wouldve sold a lot more


----------



## planbdc

Jim

I know this may have been already asked, and i have tried searching this thread to no avail :-(
So here it is: What cable/connectors will be required to connect the INA-W910 to the PXA-H800 digitally?

Thanks for your input!!


----------



## jim walter

planbdc said:


> Jim
> 
> I know this may have been already asked, and i have tried searching this thread to no avail :-(
> So here it is: What cable/connectors will be required to connect the INA-W910 to the PXA-H800 digitally?
> 
> Thanks for your input!!


KWE-610A and the supplied AINET 5Meter long cable.


----------



## t3sn4f2

jim walter said:


> KWE-610A and the supplied AINET 5Meter long cable.



Props to Alpine for going with fiber instead of coax.


----------



## bfb1963

evo9 said:


> I have already looked thru the manual in detail. The only reason why I have not imported one, has to do with region 1 coding. If Alpine USA can make it play region 1 DVD's let me know, I'll get one over.
> 
> As for market feedback; I find it hard to believe everybody has a double din opening in their dash! I am sure someone with a classic Chevelle, is gonna modify their dash for a double din. You guys were on the right track with the IVA-D310. But quickly went back stone age with the IVA-D106. If that market feedback was based on the IVA-D106, that would explain alot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


If you clone your DVD with AnyDVD so it is region free or region specific then would this HU be workable for you? Would it still work in the USA for HD, terrestrial, and Sirius radio?


----------



## evo9

bfb1963 said:


> If you clone your DVD with AnyDVD so it is region free or region specific then would this HU be workable for you? Would it still work in the USA for HD, terrestrial, and Sirius radio?




Nooooo, I am not gonna go thru the clone process. That's a waste of time & material. There is no sat radio option. HD radio might be a shot in the dark.

http://www.alpine-electronics.co.uk...audio_manuals/IVA-D511RB/OM_IVA-D511RB_EN.pdf






.


----------



## jim walter

evo9 said:


> Nooooo, I am not gonna go thru the clone process. That's a waste of time & material. There is no sat radio option. HD radio might be a shot in the dark.
> 
> http://www.alpine-electronics.co.uk...audio_manuals/IVA-D511RB/OM_IVA-D511RB_EN.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Use a DVD changer, problem solved. 

If you're so stuck on optical and SQ...what are you doing listening to SAT.


----------



## blusky4u

Does anybody have any idea just what the Audison Bit One Processor costs? Has anybody heard anything about the new JBL processor thats out now too? I said it before and I'll say it again that I've been tossing around the "Old School vs. New School" and I've been eye balling the JBL processor as well as the Arc Audio EQ and their Crossover and getting rid of my Alpine processor all together. But now that I've gotten the news on the new Alpine thats soon to be released I've got allot to consider and think about.


----------



## t3sn4f2

blusky4u said:


> Does anybody have any idea just what the Audison Bit One Processor costs? Has anybody heard anything about the new JBL processor thats out now too? I said it before and I'll say it again that I've been tossing around the "Old School vs. New School" and I've been eye balling the JBL processor as well as the Arc Audio EQ and their Crossover and getting rid of my Alpine processor all together. But now that I've gotten the news on the new Alpine thats soon to be released I've got allot to consider and think about.


All that info. is on this site, and then some.


----------



## raamaudio

A bit of fuel to the fire, there is another processor in the works. The engineering team is headed up by quite a famous engineer..........it might be awhile so I am probably still going to run a couple of H800s in my systems until then, if they in fact come out sometime before to long

And, some new speakers that are probably going to be quite surprising for the cost

Rick


----------



## xpsvwino

raamaudio said:


> A bit of fuel to the fire, there is another processor in the works. The engineering team is headed up by quite a famous engineer..........it might be awhile so I am probably still going to run a couple of H800s in my systems until then, if they in fact come out sometime before to long
> 
> And, some new speakers that are probably going to be quite surprising for the cost
> 
> Rick


In the works by who?
Don't be a tease:surprised:


----------



## ErinH

raamaudio said:


> A bit of fuel to the fire, there is another processor in the works. The engineering team is headed up by quite a famous engineer..........it might be awhile so I am probably still going to run a couple of H800s in my systems until then, if they in fact come out sometime before to long
> 
> And, some new speakers that are probably going to be quite surprising for the cost
> 
> Rick


lemme guess...
Arc/Zeff

you put it out there...


----------



## Mic10is

bikinpunk said:


> lemme guess...
> Arc/Zeff
> 
> you put it out there...


Software for it and Pc interface is actually pretty cool. Fred let me play with it briefly at MECA finals.
Lots of potential for it.
If It comes out anytime this year I would get it.


----------



## n_olympios

t3sn4f2 said:


> Props to Alpine for going with fiber instead of coax.


And the advantage of one over the other is...?

Apart from the proprietary connector and extremely expensive Alpine cable needed, of course... 

My apologies Jim, but that's a fact.


----------



## t3sn4f2

n_olympios said:


> And the advantage of one over the other is...?


Optical electrically isolates the two components. That is the only _possible_ sonic advantage.



n_olympios said:


> Apart from the proprietary connector and extremely expensive Alpine cable needed, of course...
> 
> My apologies Jim, but that's a fact.


I'll take it as that comment is meant for Alpine and not me since I did only say "going with _fiber_".


----------



## n_olympios

t3sn4f2 said:


> Optical electrically isolates the two components. That is the only _possible_ sonic advantage.


A kind of moot point though, since the AiNet connection is still there. 



t3sn4f2 said:


> I'll take it as that comment is meant for Alpine and not me since I did only say "going with _fiber_".


Yes sir.


----------



## tnbubba

fiber ick!!!
copper is fine for short rind in cars..
and if the fiber is not absolutely perfect on the ends and connections..its screws up!
great for running across oceans floors..
what wrong with plain aesbu connections?


----------



## raamaudio

I have modified several HU, Processors, etc that had fiber optics inputs or outputs to use the SPDIF that fed them, it was pretty easy. Then I used some moderate cost, very good quality digital coax cables.


----------



## blusky4u

Thank you!


----------



## planbdc

Jim

I heard from a source that the H800 release has been pushed back to May, any confirmation of this?

Thanks


----------



## jim walter

planbdc said:


> Jim
> 
> I heard from a source that the H800 release has been pushed back to May, any confirmation of this?
> 
> Thanks


Not at all. Things are actually (for once!) ahead of schedule. I just got v1.00 software for the PC and H800 and I'm in the bay this coming week helping with some of the final tests on it. 

Also, I've got some updates coming on compatibility etc for all legacy stuff coming as well. I'll get it posted up as soon as I get the final charts.

Jim


----------



## S_rangeBrew

jim walter said:


> *The H800 does not use Audyssey tech *this time around....


Too bad, that was the main feature that made Alpine my only choice for in-car EQ.



> ....this is our new ImprintEQ developed by our Japan HQ team. It has significantly more resolution, especially in the mid and lower bass, plus it has user definable/adjustable target curves.


Should have just upgraded to MultiEQ XT32 and thrown in a "basshead" curve.

However, the market dictates what it dictates, and it's pretty obvious from the comments in this forum that many users didn't appreciate or understand the Audyssey version of Imprint at all. The lack of documentation didn't help much either.

Good luck with the new stuff.


----------



## laalves

Great thread. Very much looking forward to this processor for a possible upgrade to my system, replacing the PXA-H100. I wonder what level of control the 407 will have over the H800 since it can control the H701.

Adding the separate controller may be an option, particularly if the knob on it is a volume knob, which I much prefer to the up/down keys of the 407.


----------



## raamaudio

I just bought a P9 system yesterday, a deal I could not let get away, probably not ever going to use it but never had one, now I will for a while at least. 

I really want to play with this new Alpine unit, I am sure to like it a great deal and then the Arc when it comes out, will certainly be interesting to see the differences between them

Rick


----------



## Salad Fingers

I have a CDE-100 in my car, I wonder if I can control the time alignment and crossovers on the H800? Jim, will my CDE-100 do full function control of the H800?












:laugh:


----------



## subwoofery

raamaudio said:


> I just bought a P9 system yesterday, a deal I could not let get away, probably not ever going to use it but never had one, now I will for a while at least.
> 
> I really want to play with this new Alpine unit, I am sure to like it a great deal and then the Arc when it comes out, will certainly be interesting to see the differences between them
> 
> Rick


Any link to the Arc unit news? 

Kelvin


----------



## raamaudio

They are keeping a pretty tight lid on it, Robert Zeff and his crew are deep into the software, the hard part, and the file is HUGE! I expect some great results with the time they are putting into this. 

That is just slightly less than I know, which is not much

Rick


----------



## subwoofery

Thanks Rick 

Kelvin


----------



## diamondjoequimby

I know its kinda selfish but any idea if recent events in Japan are going to delay this much?


----------



## xx24xx

The earthquake and tsunami had the biggest impact on the north side of Japan. I seriously doubt it had or will have any effect on production. Also keep in mind that Japan is prepared for things like this. Earthquakes are NOTHING new to them.

I know this isn't related, but my condolences go out to all that have been affected by the natural disaster.


----------



## laalves

Although this is a bit offtopic, I would love to see a software update to the Alpine media stations (particularly my own iXA-W407!) to include:

1 - ABC scroll function (like the iPhone/iPod Touch) to search the songs/artis/albums;

2 - Apple Genius mixes support;

3 - Virtual keyboard to search names in the song database of the iPod.,

All these are iPod functions that would greatly enhance the Alpine media station functionality.

These, combined with the new H800 would be heaven!

If software updates are not possible, at least the 2011+ models should all come with these features.


----------



## laalves

@Jim Walter:

Does the PXA-H800 take audio input via Ai-Net, just like the PXA-H100? That would give me a drop in installation to replace my PXA-H100.


----------



## jim walter

laalves said:


> @Jim Walter:
> 
> Does the PXA-H800 take audio input via Ai-Net, just like the PXA-H100? That would give me a drop in installation to replace my PXA-H100.


Yes, it is a drop in replacement. I did this with a W900 and H100 --> H800, no issues at all, just swap the RCAs and change the wiring harness.


----------



## laalves

Well, the upgrade prospect is looking even better then! Thanks Jim! Any idea on European availability?


----------



## xpsvwino

Jim,
How's the testing going?

G


----------



## Juice75

Hi Jim - I know a few have said it, but I wanted to repeat...thanks for taking the time to provide us with so much information on the H800.

I definitely have the H800 in my "want" list now. Pair that up with an X305S (stuck with single din for now), and hope that will tide me over for awhile.


----------



## NikitaDrako

Hey guys
Long time I don't come by...
Jim, do you know anything about RoadEQ vehicles compatibility?
For an instance, Toyota's Fielder are not available at US or europe, but were in Brazil and Japan. will it have support?
By the end of april will it be on the market? I'll probably have a trip around US by then. lol


----------



## skywolf75

Quick qn. Can I connect the RCA aux-out from a roof mount DVD player and to the Ai-Net Aux-in function on the H800, using KCA-121B?


----------



## jim walter

skywolf75 said:


> Quick qn. Can I connect the RCA aux-out from a roof mount DVD player and to the Ai-Net Aux-in function on the H800, using KCA-121B?


Yessir


----------



## jim walter

NikitaDrako said:


> Hey guys
> Long time I don't come by...
> Jim, do you know anything about RoadEQ vehicles compatibility?
> For an instance, Toyota's Fielder are not available at US or europe, but were in Brazil and Japan. will it have support?
> By the end of april will it be on the market? I'll probably have a trip around US by then. lol


RoadEQ is not Pre-programmer or vehicle specific, it is actually measured during the install and the mic is placed in the car for real-time EQ. This eliminates variables from car-to-car, for example if it was preprogrammed but the car had different tires on it that made extra noise.


----------



## ErinH

Jim, I sent you a follow up PM. Not sure if you've seen it already but wanted to let you know. 

Thanks


----------



## skywolf75

jim walter said:


> Yessir


Thank you for the prompt reply, Jim.
If the changer is also available, will it be sacrificed for the aux-in?


----------



## kustomkaraudio

Hey Jim Did you get a W-910 to test with the H-800 ?


----------



## laalves

Hi Jim,

In all the photos of the PXA-H800, there seems to be missing the Guide Control input for the KCE-900E interface to mix the Nav voice coming from the NVE-M300P.

How does the PXA-H800 deal with this?


----------



## jim walter

laalves said:


> Hi Jim,
> 
> In all the photos of the PXA-H800, there seems to be missing the Guide Control input for the KCE-900E interface to mix the Nav voice coming from the NVE-M300P.
> 
> How does the PXA-H800 deal with this?


There is an RCA on the molex power connector. On the W910 it has a Nav mix out wire that connects to the wire next to this RCA on the molex. Regarding the M300, I'm not sure it it's needed or not. I'll check for you.


----------



## SSSnake

Any updates to release date info?


----------



## robdridan

Jim, my 701 had bad noise habits, particularly with DD 5.1 processing, a fair bit less in DTS 5.1. Stereo wasnt too bad but still discernible. When i complained to Alpine Australia about the noise they didn't care whatsover. 

I'm thinking the noise when using dolby 5.1 was more a processing issue than simply a signal to noise thing? Is this improved on the 800??


----------



## sidewalk

Did you use a single point of ground for the signal processor and head unit?


----------



## robdridan

sidewalk said:


> Did you use a single point of ground for the signal processor and head unit?


No I didn't- the processor was in the back of the car and away from power cables etc. I don't think that was the issue (but happy to be taught otherwise if thats the case), as stated the noise was really bad for Dolby digital 5.1, so it was a change in noise when the format changed from 2 channel to Dolby. DTS wasn't as bad, but Dolby was terrible to the point of embarrassing given the $$ spent on the rest of the system so i never used it.

When you turned the volume down to zero the noise went away completely, as soon as it started processing the signal form the head unit at volume 1, noise came on thick and strong.


----------



## Petter

Here's a couple of very tiny screenshots, posted by Alpine Sweden showing the tuning software for the H800. And they are not going to post them in any larger sizes they say. 

Bilstereoforum - Sveriges största forum för bilstereo - View Single Post - Alpine 2011


----------



## ErinH

I believe you can find those same images in this thread, posted by Jim. No?


----------



## Petter

If so I'm sorry I missed them.



bikinpunk said:


> I believe you can find those same images in this thread, posted by Jim. No?


----------



## BamaJohn

Jim, suppose I have some 24-bit / 96 kHz FLAC files. Would it work to burn those to DVD-Audio format and play in the W910? I'm not here to debate whether or not 24/96 is or isn't an audible improvement in the typical car system, I'm just curious if the W910 / H800 would make full use of the increased amount of music data.

Thanks for all the info here!


----------



## highly

SSSnake said:


> Any updates to release date info?


 How's that April release date looking?


----------



## n_olympios

Highly unlikely. :lol:


----------



## highly

:facepalm:


----------



## SSSnake

Not so hot Todd. 

If the MS-8 was treating me well I wouldn't care. About to RMA. I think I got a dud 

I do want to say the customer service has been excellent. Andy has taken quite a bit of time to help.


----------



## sidewalk

Well, it seems like according to Alpine Japan's website, the factory is fine. But Japan in general does still have rolling blackouts. The real Alpine issue is their distribution center sounds like it got wiped out by the tsunami (distribution right on the coast for ship loading/etc.)

So, wait and see I guess.


----------



## planbdc

Most of Alpine's US bound products are not made in Japan anyway!


----------



## sidewalk

I'd imagine a lot of their parts are though? *shrug* Maybe not!


----------



## highly

With any luck Jim will chime in with some good news...


----------



## jim walter

highly said:


> With any luck Jim will chime in with some good news...


_I'll chime in, but it isn't with good news ... _

We are working through one last issue found in testing. That bug was found on the day of the incident in Japan. As our website/press releases have said, the Iwaki, Japan facility has been closed up until last yesterday. So, before the quake, we had some delays .. and now with it, we expect some more before we get back running. 

All that said, we took the cautious route as of last week and have delayed the "official" intro to MERA, where we are planning on doing a full class/training a la Andy and Larry. The MERA crowd (along with you guys) are the exact market for a product like this and we're focusing on a few key intros at that show to make it a strong showing for us.

Sorry to all of those that have PM'd me over the past few weeks, I've been out on the road at our trainings ... and I wasn't really ready to answer the questions about samples/timings/etc etc. This whole situation is a bit of a downer for all of us here, especially those with family back in Northern Japan (not me).

_With some good news ..._ 
I have it up and running in my Jeep, and it sounds incredible. ImprintEQ is changed significantly for the better, it is actually louder than my RTA/Ear-tuned setup ... not like Imprint of old where you had to turn the gains way down, etc. I still prefer my own tune, like many of you will, but playing with the post-processing is nice to tailor it to taste. In a non-active 2-way 6.5" front stage, the center image is dead on ... and time correction is excellent. For my tastes (being a front stage only guy), I found that ImprintEQ added a bit more rear fill than I like, but a simple -4dB on that setting takes care of that. Overall balance of the sound is really nice, specifically the bass is much more linear and balanced sounding vs. last-gen.


That's about it .. let me know if you guys have any questions.

Thanks
Jim


----------



## chevbowtie22

How about the 910? Are we looking at delays for that too?


----------



## jim walter

chevbowtie22 said:


> How about the 910? Are we looking at delays for that too?


Im pretty sure we're fine on the W910


----------



## ErinH

Jim, sorry to hear of the delay. I sent you a pm a couple days ago. If you get a chance, let me know what you think.

Take care.

- Erin


----------



## highly

Jim-

Thank you for your candid honesty about the situation. Though I am sorry to hear that the product will be delayed, I'm certain that we all would rather wait for things to be completely squared away before it gets into everyone's hands. It's good for those of us who have installs in the works whose design decisions may hinge on the H800's availability to know where things stand. Again, thanks!

-Todd


----------



## sidewalk

Firmware updates, (woohoo) hopefully this product has a long life cycle planned


----------



## wrmathis

when is the W910 suppose to be released?


----------



## planbdc

Hey Jim

I am sure you are busy as heck (due to the unfortunate occurrences in japan) but I was wondering if you had and inkling or could hint to the approximate release date of the H800 (hopefully all of those bugs are getting worked out) maybe the H800 will be released at the same time as the w910????

I hate to ask this but I have been pestering my local alpine dealer to no end and they claim they haven't heard anything other than April!

Hopefully you can tell us something!!! We are eager for the release!

Thanks


----------



## rublik

Caled my local distributor in Malaysia and was told the H800 will be released here around early May.

There is already details of the H800 at Alpine Asia website:

PXA-H800


----------



## ErinH

I'm hoping I can get one of these to review and share here and on other sites. I've been itching to write a review on a product for a while and this sucker definitely looks worth the time to pursue. Hopefully we can work something out. Otherwise, I'll be accepting donations to buy one, lol. (j/k)


----------



## subwoofery

bikinpunk said:


> I'm hoping I can get one of these to review and share here and on other sites. I've been itching to write a review on a product for a while and this sucker definitely looks worth the time to pursue. Hopefully we can work something out. Otherwise, I'll be accepting donations to buy one, lol. (j/k)


Try to get your hands on the Mosconi DSP 6to8 too for a Monster VS  

Kelvin


----------



## ErinH

^ I've been meaning to contact someone about that, just forgot who it is. I've been busy a lot lately with other projects...


----------



## Thrill_House

rublik said:


> Caled my local distributor in Malaysia and was told the H800 will be released here around early May.
> 
> There is already details of the H800 at Alpine Asia website:
> 
> PXA-H800


 Hey it says on the site that the time correction can be adjusted from 0 - 20ms in 5ms increments, is this correct? If so then that doesnt sound like a very big range, thats only 4 increments by what there saying.


----------



## subwoofery

Thrill_House said:


> Hey it says on the site that the time correction can be adjusted from 0 - 20ms in 5ms increments, is this correct? If so then that doesnt sound like a very big range, thats only 4 increments by what there saying.


? Here's what I read "_8 channel auto/manual digital time correction (0 to 20ms, 0.05ms steps)_" 

You need to put your glasses on mate... 

Kelvin


----------



## Thrill_House

subwoofery said:


> ? Here's what I read "_8 channel auto/manual digital time correction (0 to 20ms, 0.05ms steps)_"
> 
> You need to put your glasses on mate...
> 
> Kelvin


Buddy it says right on there and I quote : "Up to 8 channels can be corrected automatically or manually, from 0 to 20ms in 5ms steps." I dont need glasses, Alpine needs to fix there information on the Alpine Asia site.


----------



## rublik

Thrill_House said:


> Buddy it says right on there and I quote : "Up to 8 channels can be corrected automatically or manually, from 0 to 20ms in 5ms steps." I dont need glasses, Alpine needs to fix there information on the Alpine Asia site.


Sorry, but u are wrong. Its clearly indicated at alpine asia website (copy and paste):

8 channel auto/manual digital time correction (0 to 20ms, 0.05ms steps)


----------



## Petter

The Specifications in the ingress states 0.05ms but the Imprint section reads 5ms. Thank god at least the specs are correct. 

So Alpine do need to correct the information at the Imprint section. 




rublik said:


> Sorry, but u are wrong. Its clearly indicated at alpine asia website (copy and paste):
> 
> 8 channel auto/manual digital time correction (0 to 20ms, 0.05ms steps)


----------



## rublik

Petter said:


> The Specifications in the ingress states 0.05ms but the Imprint section reads 5ms. Thank god at least the specs are correct.
> 
> So Alpine do need to correct the information at the Imprint section.


You r right


----------



## Unrealistic

hi.
Don't know if this is mentioned before?,
but the new catalog 2011-2012 is online!
I also found a pricelist from Swiss.


----------



## tnbubba

I know Jim read's here somewhat.. but what i wanted to voice is my total DISPLEASURE in Alpines USA customer support..I have called 4x and I cannot get a straight forward answer for customer service and the last guy I told very politely sir" I have asked you the same questions 3x and you have not answered it." the question is please list me all the file formats that the IDA-305S will play from an Ipod Classic! I have yet to receive an straight forward answer ..MY 305 will not play FLAC, WAV or any other lossless file I can load on it. BEFORE I purchased this unit I called Alpine customer support and they said IF the IPOD would play IT then the ALPINE would play it.. and yea I was aware that the flash or HDD limitations were limited to MP#, AAC and MMA.

just letting you know all I got was politicians type answers to a simple yes/ no/ gimme a list question.. not once but 4x..

so what is the truth?


----------



## bradsk88

tnbubba said:


> I know Jim read's here somewhat.. but what i wanted to voice is my total DISPLEASURE in Alpines USA customer support..I have called 4x and I cannot get a straight forward answer for customer service and the last guy I told very politely sir" I have asked you the same questions 3x and you have not answered it." the question is please list me all the file formats that the IDA-305S will play from an Ipod Classic! I have yet to receive an straight forward answer ..MY 305 will not play FLAC, WAV or any other lossless file I can load on it. BEFORE I purchased this unit I called Alpine customer support and they said IF the IPOD would play IT then the ALPINE would play it.. and yea I was aware that the flash or HDD limitations were limited to MP#, AAC and MMA.
> 
> just letting you know all I got was politicians type answers to a simple yes/ no/ gimme a list question.. not once but 4x..
> 
> so what is the truth?


Use apple lossless


----------



## diamondjoequimby

bradsk88 said:


> Use apple lossless


This.

and...

http://vault.alpine-usa.com/products/documents/OM iDA-X305S English.pdf

pg. 19. MP3, AAC, WMA.


----------



## t3sn4f2

I don't see where it says that ALAC is supported, only AAC.


----------



## RAzZin

tnbubba said:


> I know Jim read's here somewhat.. but what i wanted to voice is my total DISPLEASURE in Alpines USA customer support..I have called 4x and I cannot get a straight forward answer for customer service and the last guy I told very politely sir" I have asked you the same questions 3x and you have not answered it." the question is please list me all the file formats that the IDA-305S will play from an Ipod Classic! I have yet to receive an straight forward answer ..MY 305 will not play FLAC, WAV or any other lossless file I can load on it. BEFORE I purchased this unit I called Alpine customer support and they said IF the IPOD would play IT then the ALPINE would play it.. and yea I was aware that the flash or HDD limitations were limited to MP#, AAC and MMA.
> 
> just letting you know all I got was politicians type answers to a simple yes/ no/ gimme a list question.. not once but 4x..
> 
> so what is the truth?


dude, mine x305 (not 305S even) plays alac and wav from ipod classic without any problems.. maybe u have a trouble hu?


----------



## tnbubba

that was my point to the Idiots at Alpine customer service.. The manual does not spell that out well as fat a s Ipod goes.. but It does for the flash/hdd. NO ONE could tell or list me the file types the unit supported and weather it would play full wave files..
I even had one guy( the ******* that hung up on me) say that I tunes compressed the .wav files to load them to the IPOD! I'm gonna try a neighbors new ipod this weekend. My point was Apine customer service SUCKS! 
Yea that was my thought I had a glitchy HU and that was what I was trying to figure out! my point was somebody at Alpine needs to educate the staff on AUDIO!


----------



## pankrok

alac is supported on 505's through ipod classic so i see no reason not to valid for everything else. in any case its ipod that makes the decoding not alpine. 

offcourse lossless or not when you are using a 701 all these follow the ainet path to the processor and generally sucks (comparing to the cd that goes through optical without unnecessary conversions)
so 800 looks as if it is much better on its analog input, in 2 months (?) we should know!


----------



## cpcustoms

BamaJohn said:


> Jim, suppose I have some 24-bit / 96 kHz FLAC files. Would it work to burn those to DVD-Audio format and play in the W910? I'm not here to debate whether or not 24/96 is or isn't an audible improvement in the typical car system, I'm just curious if the W910 / H800 would make full use of the increased amount of music data.
> 
> Thanks for all the info here!


Jim,

Any word on this? Im interested because i have a CarPC that is running the AUDIOTRAK PRODIGY HD2 ADVANCE DE sound card that has a TOSLINK Optical out, the sound card outputs up to 24Bit/192KHz through the optical out. So im wondering if the H800 would be able to keep up with that or if i might have any problems with it being compatible. I was also wondering if the H800 will accept the SPDIF signal from the sound card through a regular TOSLINK cable. Info on this would be greatly appreciated. And thanks for all your replies Jim! Im sure i speak for everyone when i say it is Greatly appreciated.


----------



## fish

Jim,

What "tweakability" is dismissed/available after the auto-equalization?


----------



## St. Dark

t3sn4f2 said:


> I don't see where it says that ALAC is supported, only AAC.


I think Apple Lossless files still show up as .aac while on a computer, and that Alpine is referring to format extensions rather than names; and that that is probably the root of much confusion!

Now, it's also quite possible that I'm wrong above, but I will say I use a 4yr old nano, and have Dark Side and Moving Pictures both on there in Lossless from the MoFi releases. Never had an Alpine balk at 'em yet.


----------



## laalves

t3sn4f2 said:


> I don't see where it says that ALAC is supported, only AAC.


While that is true, I can give you the example of my iXA-W407BT for which the manual does not mention ALAC (or by other words, "Apple Lossless" either), just AAC. And yet it plays my ALAC files happily with no trouble at all. In fact, I just use ALAC for my CD rips or purchased FLAC or WMA Lossless conversions.


----------



## 2way+sub

All Alpine with usb connection can read MP3/WMA/AAC from HD or pendrive...
with ipod also ALAC and WAV.


----------



## t3sn4f2

St. Dark said:


> *I think Apple Lossless files still show up as .aac while on a computer, and that Alpine is referring to format extensions rather than names; and that that is probably the root of much confusion!*
> 
> Now, it's also quite possible that I'm wrong above, but I will say I use a 4yr old nano, and have Dark Side and Moving Pictures both on there in Lossless from the MoFi releases. Never had an Alpine balk at 'em yet.


I think you're right. AAC and ALAC do both have the same .M4A file extension.


----------



## fish

fish said:


> Jim,
> 
> What "tweakability" is dismissed/available after the auto-equalization?


Bump for this question. ^ 

Is this still coming out this month?

And another thing, when will be able to view the manual?


----------



## xpsvwino

Training and release in August.
G


----------



## SouthSyde

xpsvwino said:


> Training and release in August.
> G


dang, its delayed 5 months...


----------



## planbdc

xpsvwino said:


> Training and release in August.
> G


where did you get your information??? from a credible source???


Can you confirm any of this jim??


----------



## jim walter

planbdc said:


> where did you get your information??? from a credible source???
> 
> 
> Can you confirm any of this jim??


I posted this information here earlier.

We've postponed the release to August as we are making some final adjustments for our market.

Thanks,
Jim


----------



## Thrill_House

jim walter said:


> I posted this information here earlier.
> 
> We've postponed the release to August as we are making some final adjustments for our market.
> 
> Thanks,
> Jim


 Any possibility it could still get released earlier?


----------



## planbdc

A bit disappointing, but thanks for the info Jim!!


----------



## Booger

Come on November!!! LOL!

Sorry guys, this H800 HAS TO BE RIGHT.


----------



## RHI-SEE

agreed its a bit dissapointing. But i to would rather it be right the first time.

Also, it may have been posted in here it may not off (there is alot of pages)
but does anybody no the dimensions of the C800 controller?

EDIT: nevermind.
http://www.alpine-electronics.co.uk/products/product-singleview/processors/rux-c800.html


----------



## robdridan

Given that its advertised in full on the UK Alpine site - does this mean it's already for sale over there but not the rest of the world ???? I noticed the ina-910 is also listed there already !!!


----------



## evo9

Alpine PXA-H800NR & INA-W910NR!


NR = Never Ready. I really hate went mfg put someting forward and cant deliver on time. Denon comes to mind in the advertise & NR dept.



.




.


----------



## Salad Fingers

evo9 said:


> Alpine PXA-H800NR & INA-W910NR!
> 
> 
> NR = Never Ready. I really hate went mfg put someting forward and cant deliver on time. Denon comes to mind in the advertise & NR dept.
> 
> 
> .


I'm going to have to agree with this. How can you have a demo car with a working, functioning unit in it the first week in January, but still working out the "bugs" in May, not to be released until, allegedly, November? It's like they came up with an idea in November of last year, decided what it should have/do, and slapped out a prototype for CES 1-2 months later. Why not just keep it under the rug until after the bugs are figured out? Show it at CES 2012 and have them ready to ship out right then. That's how I would do it. I understand creating a buzz, but ****. I remember seeing a picture of an alarm remote DEI was "coming out with" in a magazine like 6 or 7 years ago and I still haven't seen it. It's frustrating. However, I still love Alpine!


----------



## rexroadj

Really!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have been a very vocal alpine hater for the last decade or so (sorry, but have not been a fan since about 10yrs ago!)....but even I cant get pissed about this! EVERY company does this.....EVERY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You people frigging kill me!
MS-8....how long was it that it went from being in a winning car, to here, then finially release???? They were not the first, not the only, and wont be the last. GET OVER IT! 
Its the way it is, better learn to let it go. 
Not a company alive that has not gone through the same situation. The marketing dept. gets on the production dept about expected dates so they can get to work on there end..... Then the sales guys get involved......BUT, they dates they were given (because they were pressed to come up with "a date") are not exact..... Lets not forget about some of the global freakish things that have come up too! 
Jim.....correct me if I am wrong, but I think I have been around that block enough to know how that process goes


----------



## CLK63DK

hello Guys,

Deliveries in Europe has started! First feedback is (naturally) very positive


----------



## RAzZin

CLK63DK said:


> hello Guys,
> 
> Deliveries in Europe has started! First feedback is (naturally) very positive


any proof? Can't find it being sold anywhere..


----------



## n_olympios

rexroadj said:


> Really!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I have been a very vocal alpine hater for the last decade or so (sorry, but have not been a fan since about 10yrs ago!)....but even I cant get pissed about this! EVERY company does this.....EVERY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You people frigging kill me!
> MS-8....how long was it that it went from being in a winning car, to here, then finially release???? They were not the first, not the only, and wont be the last. GET OVER IT!
> Its the way it is, better learn to let it go.
> Not a company alive that has not gone through the same situation. The marketing dept. gets on the production dept about expected dates so they can get to work on there end..... Then the sales guys get involved......BUT, they dates they were given (because they were pressed to come up with "a date") are not exact..... Lets not forget about some of the global freakish things that have come up too!
> Jim.....correct me if I am wrong, but I think I have been around that block enough to know how that process goes


It's, as you say, the same with every company out there. The only difference with Alpine in this case and, with JBL and the MS8, is that they were kind enough to let us know of their new units before those came out.


----------



## mobeious

Alpine PXA-H800 - IMPRINT® Audio Processor | Pacific Stereo
http://pacificstereo.com/alpine-rux-c800.html


----------



## evo9

rexroadj said:


> Really!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I have been a very vocal alpine hater for the last decade or so (sorry, but have not been a fan since about 10yrs ago!)....but even I cant get pissed about this! EVERY company does this.....EVERY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You people frigging kill me!
> MS-8....how long was it that it went from being in a winning car, to here, then finially release???? They were not the first, not the only, and wont be the last. GET OVER IT!
> Its the way it is, better learn to let it go.
> Not a company alive that has not gone through the same situation. The marketing dept. gets on the production dept about expected dates so they can get to work on there end..... Then the sales guys get involved......BUT, they dates they were given (because they were pressed to come up with "a date") are not exact..... Lets not forget about some of the global freakish things that have come up too!
> Jim.....correct me if I am wrong, but I think I have been around that block enough to know how that process goes




Pioneer does a better job of announcement to release on their products. I'll will say they are slow at getting you the latest greatest features. But they normally deliver at promised time.



.


----------



## Salad Fingers

rexroadj said:


> Really!!!!!!!!!!!!! Really!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I have been a very vocal alpine hater for the last decade or so (sorry, but have not been a fan since about 10yrs ago!)....but even I cant get pissed about this! EVERY company does this.....EVERY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You people frigging kill me!
> MS-8....how long was it that it went from being in a winning car, to here, then finially release???? They were not the first, not the only, and wont be the last. GET OVER IT!
> Its the way it is, better learn to let it go.
> Not a company alive that has not gone through the same situation. The marketing dept. gets on the production dept about expected dates so they can get to work on there end..... Then the sales guys get involved......BUT, they dates they were given (because they were pressed to come up with "a date") are not exact..... Lets not forget about some of the global freakish things that have come up too!
> Jim.....correct me if I am wrong, but I think I have been around that block enough to know how that process goes


Dude what is your problem? Why are you always so confrontational? My point was exactly what you're saying, that many companies do this. I cited DEI, you cited JBL. In both cases, they were much more extreme than what is happening (at least so far) with this Alpine product. It's retarded. As for your proclamation that "EVERY" company does this, I call ********. Look at Apple. They don't even hint at an idea until it is presented in a keynote. They tell you what the product is, show you what it looks like and how it works (many times with the product in hand), and even tell you the price. They also announce the release date (usually being either that day or within a week or two). You know what happens after that? They release the mother ****er ON THAT DAY! No "we're working on the bugs", because they waited until AFTER they fixed the major bugs before telling everyone about they're cool new product and then stringing the public along for years. That's how you do business. The Apple haters can balk and talk trash as much as they want, but thats just how they work and I wish more companies would take after it. So, Rex, Mr. Knowitall keyboard commando that I don't even think is in the industry, just chill the **** out man! I don't know if you have seen who started this thread so many months ago, but it was ME. So it's my thread and I'll whine if I want to!!! (the last part was sang in the tune of "it's my birthday and I'll cry if I want to"). Anyways, I hope you dont feel attacked (even though you did kind of attack me and the other guy) and all I'm trying to say is to chill out! We all just want this piece to be released so we can get our hands on it and play like little kids. It's like we're 10 years old and Santa (Jim) is telling us that Chrismas toy production is running behind and it will be a few more months instead of Dec. 25. IT SUCKS!!!!


----------



## rexroadj

OK SO continue to cry if you want to...Dont give a ****! YOU are not the only one that has been bitching about this...... FEW understand what really goes on behind close doors. I am not in this specific field anymore...been over a decade in fact. BUT business is business and there are few differences across the board. I have A TON of VERY direct experience there...You dont have to like it or agree with it to be true either...

Now...Not sure why you feel "attacked' but its kind of pathetic if you ask me. I dont give a **** what who's thread it is... the minute you post it, its public. You can also call me a know-it-all if you like... Again...Business....I know! 

I personally find this discussion about the release date being pushed back a completely rediculous one. SOOOOO many end up having to do the same thing, it is what it is. DEAL WITH IT. Go change your tampon and chill out yourself!

My first post was NOT confrontational. This one maybe? But the first one....NO. This one is only because your panty's were clearly in a bunch.
I didnt quote you, or the "other guy" so do you just have a guilty conscience? Like I said..this is an OLD discussion about new alpine products taking longer to put out production rather then what was originally mentioned..... JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE! 
Except Alpine has a pretty legit excuse..... Japan almost became an underwater country!


----------



## robdridan

I'm interested to know what the bugs are that need sorting. Is it in the software or the actual unit itself. Given that its released in part of the world but requires fixes elsewhere, is it fair to assume that the early releases (or on time releases) may have issues? Does this unit have upgradeable firmware?

On another note, with most alpine products being identical and made in the same factory, it always leaves me a bit frustrated with the massive price differences for alpine gear sold here in australia. Love to know the excuse this time now that our dollar is higher in value than the US dollar...


----------



## Petter

I second that!

In Sweden, the prices for the new units C800, H800 and D800 are between 35-90% more expensive then in USA. Although some differences can be explained with the 25% VAT we have here, the 30-50% higher price point then Germany can not be explained with VAT as it's almost on the same level.

It feels like getting skimmed. And our currency are wicked strong compared to USD, GBP and Euro which are in something like free fall.




robdridan said:


> On another note, with most alpine products being identical and made in the same factory, it always leaves me a bit frustrated with the massive price differences for alpine gear sold here in australia. Love to know the excuse this time now that our dollar is higher in value than the US dollar...


----------



## RHI-SEE

as to the person who posted the 2 links above.
the 'pacific sound' or whatever it is, states that it is still in pre order. not actual ordering.


----------



## kyheng

Well, if we can get the H800 now with the bugs are still not fixed, will be a good move? I don't think so....
Audison's Bit1 showed a very good example for this.....
As for the price, I would just wait for a while as it will come down later on....


----------



## CLK63DK

Petter said:


> I second that!
> 
> In Sweden, the prices for the new units C800, H800 and D800 are between 35-90% more expensive then in USA. Although some differences can be explained with the 25% VAT we have here, the 30-50% higher price point then Germany can not be explained with VAT as it's almost on the same level.
> 
> It feels like getting skimmed. And our currency are wicked strong compared to USD, GBP and Euro which are in something like free fall.


Petter,
Dont forgt EU import duties + much higher distribution cost in Europe compared to US + You do business via an expensive trade which is not the case in US.

It is the same in all trades...


----------



## CLK63DK

RAzZin said:


> any proof? Can't find it being sold anywhere..


Razzin
Proof like you dont belive me!? Fool...

See the German forums + call Fortissimo in germany, he can deliver it to you!
From the shop


----------



## RAzZin

CLK63DK, I didn't say I don't belive u, it's just weird to hear from Alpine representative that sales in USA are delayed, sales in Europe are to start even later than in USA, and read you claiming it's already on sale in Sweden..

Thanks for the pic, though, it's enough for me to prove sales have been already started, I hope some official explanation from Alpine will be given  Personally I'm ready to order H800 in late May to replace my current H700 but ofc I don't wanna receive a unit with some beta software full of bugs..


----------



## robdridan

Hmm what happened to Global Market ?? Or is that something the car audio industry forgot to catch up with...... Correct me if I'm wrong- doesnt it all come out the same factory in china now ???


----------



## n_olympios

Yeah but Europe is premium.


----------



## CLK63DK

RAzZin said:


> CLK63DK, I didn't say I don't belive u, it's just weird to hear from Alpine representative that sales in USA are delayed, sales in Europe are to start even later than in USA, and read you claiming it's already on sale in Sweden..
> 
> Thanks for the pic, though, it's enough for me to prove sales have been already started, I hope some official explanation from Alpine will be given  Personally I'm ready to order H800 in late May to replace my current H700 but ofc I don't wanna receive a unit with some beta software full of bugs..


No harm, maybe EU got the container faster.

Try to contact Bat Electronics in Kiev (sorry, it is Ukraine, I dosent know the Russian guys) to hear if they got it.
Else you can order it from Fortissimo in Germany (or Car-Systems or...) 
Home - Fortissimo Online-Shop

I will not use the Alpine myself, but I had it reserved and gave up my reservation friday in favour of a BRAX NOX 4 DSP.


----------



## ErinH

Someone in Sweden wanna send me one?


----------



## n_olympios

Ah but would you be able to contwol it vidout being able to wead or speak svedish ya? 

:laugh:


----------



## CLK63DK

bikinpunk said:


> Someone in Sweden wanna send me one?


Sure, but if it is so urgent, then write to Frank at Fortissimo - he got them for sale..
If you got Pay Pal or wire the money in advance, then I'm sure you can do business


----------



## ErinH

I don't live in Sweden so I have no idea how to get a hold of him...


----------



## CLK63DK

bikinpunk said:


> I don't live in Sweden so I have no idea how to get a hold of him...


Hmmm, I guess that you had to go and get fresh pants instead of reading all posts when you saw we can get it in Europe  

What you could do is to send an email to this shop Home - Fortissimo Online-Shop (in Germany) and ask if you can buy one via him.

Price is 699€ (incl 19% TAX)

// Chr,


----------



## evo9

CLK63DK said:


> No harm, maybe EU got the container faster.
> 
> Try to contact Bat Electronics in Kiev (sorry, it is Ukraine, I dosent know the Russian guys) to hear if they got it.
> Else you can order it from Fortissimo in Germany (or Car-Systems or...)
> Home - Fortissimo Online-Shop
> 
> I will not use the Alpine myself, but I had it reserved and gave up my reservation friday in favour of a *BRAX NOX 4 DSP*.


Link to the BRAX NOX 4 DSP please. MFG web page and owners manual would be nice.




.


----------



## CLK63DK

evo9 said:


> Link to the BRAX NOX 4 DSP please. MFG web page and owners manual would be nice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


Too early, they are not yet produced (this month though), but here you can practice your German and see a test of the regular analouge version: http://www.audiodesign.de/downloads/testberichte2011/NOX4.pdf NOX 4.

The one I go for has an SP-dif input and a full functional 6 ch. DSP integrated.

My solution is either 2 of these or 1 + an PDX 1.1000

To be decided during the next month.


----------



## RAzZin

is that an amplifier with built-in DSP? I'm sure the price would be "a bit" higher than alpine unit than


----------



## highly

bikinpunk said:


> Someone in Sweden wanna send me one?


You'll be closing in on 1300-1400 USD by the time you get it to your house and that is IF you don't get raped at Customs. You really want one THAT bad? 

...still waiting patiently...
-Todd


----------



## n_olympios

CLK63DK said:


> Too early, they are not yet produced (this month though), but here you can practice your German and see a test of the regular analouge version: http://www.audiodesign.de/downloads/testberichte2011/NOX4.pdf NOX 4.


Or check the lesser-specced but similarly engineered Helix C-DSP.


----------



## ErinH

highly said:


> You'll be closing in on 1300-1400 USD by the time you get it to your house and that is IF you don't get raped at Customs. You really want one THAT bad?
> 
> ...still waiting patiently...
> -Todd


nah. just exploring the options. truthfully, I'd be scared of it turning in to another bitone episode all over again.


----------



## CLK63DK

RAzZin said:


> is that an amplifier with built-in DSP? I'm sure the price would be "a bit" higher than alpine unit than


you think so   (2000€)

But there is 2 DSP alternatives. C-DSP and P-DSP

See some info here: Audiotec Fischer GmbH | German Car Hifi | Brax -- Helix -- G-Control : Start


----------



## CLK63DK

n_olympios said:


> Or check the lesser-specced but similarly engineered Helix C-DSP.


Have seen it, but I like the "all in one" design of the NOX 4DSP.

I installed a PP50DSP last week in my GF's mini, and after a few hours playing around with DSP, apectrum analyzer and PC, I must say that this is impressive.

Install will be posted


----------



## CLK63DK

bikinpunk said:


> nah. just exploring the options. truthfully, I'd be scared of it turning in to another bitone episode all over again.


Hmm, maybe I'm naive, but I think that even minor SW problems in an Alpine product must be muss less critical than in an Italian product.. (sorry B1 fans, I tried it and gave up after 8 SW updates and plenty of time wasted)

I'm sure that if we dident had this expirience with B1 we would not be so sceptical to the Alpine product.

I have now heard 3 cars with the PXA-H800 (all in "hifi-mode"), and dident expirience any problems at all, so lets see when the product feedback comes from more users.


----------



## pankrok

as far as I know, there will be brax dsp indepented without amplifier later this year (similarly as done with helix dsp , first with amp and later stand alone versions)


----------



## Petter

It's not the same in all trades.
We do not only have the highest prices within EU, we are even higher priced then the most expensive non-EU countries like Norway and Switzerland when it comes to Alpine units.

Basically everything is more expensive in Norway (non EU) then in Sweden but for a lot of Alpine components it's the opposite, which is beyond logical considering a McFeast & Co. cost $18 in Norway and a basic 10" pizza easily goes for $20... 

We do have a 4,5% import duty and 25% VAT here but that do not make up for the 30-50% difference in price between Germany and Sweden.
Especially as we both are on the same european market, with more or less the same tax system and the shipping is not expensive considering an insured package from DE and SE delivered to the door is $15 for 2kg and $45 for 20kg.

We are standing here with our pants down while someone else is having fun. 






CLK63DK said:


> Petter,
> Dont forgt EU import duties + much higher distribution cost in Europe compared to US + You do business via an expensive trade which is not the case in US.
> 
> It is the same in all trades...


----------



## subwoofery

The NOX 4 seems like an impressive amp but really really really inefficient @ 43.5%. I'd rather buy the stand alone unit than the NOX 4 DSP. 
My opinion of course  

Kelvin


----------



## RHI-SEE

forgive me for sounding silly, but i dont understand how these can be for sale in one part of the world and not in the rest? are these 'bugs' immunine to sweedish tuners?


----------



## ErinH

^ I wondered the same. Which is why I made the 'bitone' comment. Back when the US was working out the bugs with that product, the AUS rep on another forum was assuring everyone there were no issues (and calling me a liar about my issues, in the process). About a month later he was backpeddling.

Now, not that I'm saying the Alpine situation is the same or will be but it does seem odd, to say the least.
Who knows, maybe they had trouble with Swedish to English translations in the software.


----------



## CLK63DK

SW.
hmm, maybe we already had the HW in Europe and the latest SW was flashed in Europe. It would save some time in transport.

But again, for me, any SW bug in a Japanese product is relative compared to a SW bug in an Italian product... I just have more trust in the Japanses developers.

AMP.
It is new to me that the sound quality of an Amplifier is judged on basis of the efficiancy!?
Since when was that used? And since when should that be a guideline for buying an amplifier?

Distribution.
Petter, it is clear that we cant explain all the price diffrence with general market situations.
We have also distribution uplifts. I know the US dealers will cry now, but the margin structure in Sweden (& Norway) is anything but healthy.
25% Vat​40% Dealer margin​5 - 7% dealer year end bonus​5 - 7% marketing cost​25% wholesaller margin​40% distributor margin​10% fright, Service & marketing cost​
This is not unusual!

have a great day all (it is morning here now)


----------



## Joe0428

Are there any online retailers that sell these types of DSP? Never can seem to find stuff like this but on Woofersetc.


----------



## deepsky

I've read the manual and I don't see where you can easily switch between the discrete 5.1 aux input and utilizing the rf and lf aux inputs for surround processing in the h800. Is there a way to do this? My factory head unit has DVD-A with 5.1 out, but when it plays stereo material I would want the h800 to use its Euphony or DPL2 to process it.


----------



## St. Dark

kyheng said:


> As for the price, I would just wait for a while as it will come down later on....


You know, since the Bit One got cheaper...

Not sayin' don't wait until it's out for a few weeks so you can see if it does what you want. But I don't know that I'd hold out hope it will get cheaper.


----------



## strakele

Hate to add another "will this work with xxxxx" post, but what kind of control would I have over the H800 with my CDA-9884? More, less, same as I had with the H100? I only have a single DIN opening so I don't really have anywhere for the RUX to go, so it'd be great if I had more than volume and source control through the head unit.


----------



## highly

From what I have gathered thus far, and I hope not to offend in saying this.
As with most other Alpine headunits it appears you would have full control over all of the functions of the H800. 



With a PC. 



Otherwise the most scenarios appear to be limited to tone, balance, and preset if your headunit supports tuning with the H700/H701. The RUX is not necessary if tuning on the fly is not necessary to you as an individual.

Hope that helps bring clarity based on what I have read thus far.

-Todd
Not an Alpine Rep


----------



## ErinH

personally, I've always dug seeing a single din unit paired with the c701 in dash installs. Always looks slick. 

I just wonder what deck(s) would most match the c800, given that the aesthetics have changed quite a lot.


----------



## ReloadedSS

bikinpunk said:


> personally, I've always dug seeing a single din unit paired with the c701 in dash installs. Always looks slick.
> 
> I just wonder what deck(s) would most match the c800, given that the aesthetics have changed quite a lot.


I'd like to know this as well. Because there are decks from other manufacturers that I like and have the features I want, and bolting the x800 to them would give me the control and essque I'm looking for. I think.


----------



## deepsky

deepsky said:


> I've read the manual and I don't see where you can easily switch between the discrete 5.1 aux input and utilizing the rf and lf aux inputs for surround processing in the h800. Is there a way to do this? My factory head unit has DVD-A with 5.1 out, but when it plays stereo material I would want the h800 to use its Euphony or DPL2 to process it.


Could someone please find out about this? It is a deal breaker for me, and I want to get my install project going asap. Thanks!!!


----------



## Petter

Alpine Switzerland/Horn Dist. have published a video on the H800 and D800.
Dont know if it have been posted already so here it is.
More sale then tech unfortunately.

YouTube - Alpine PXA-H800 & IVA-D800 Premium Sound System


----------



## ErinH

I actually was going to source one from a vendor who put up a classifieds ad here. We agreed to a price and then he renigged because his agreed upon price was too low. That said, I suppose I'll be waiting this one out. Was hoping to get one in and write up a thorough review but will have to wait 'til it hits our shores.


----------



## n_olympios

Today I saw the new Alpine catalogs and couldn't find a single difference (on paper, anyway) between the IVA-D511R and the new IVA-D800R, apart from the copper chassis and the silver details in the former's fascia. I couldn't help but wonder why the need for two so similar headunits...


----------



## deepsky

deepsky said:


> Could someone please find out about this? It is a deal breaker for me, and I want to get my install project going asap. Thanks!!!


Okay, I found the installation manual on the UK site. I can add another analog stereo input, but this raises another question for you experts. Can I split the front right and front left outputs of the factory head unit, and use those for another stereo input without affecting the quality of the signal chain? This way I could change between full discrete 5.1, and stereo for upmixing easily. Thanks!


----------



## druuzy

Does alpine make a processor that has three front outputs? I have the f1 3 ways, spx-z18t with f1 4chan and want to go fully active.. any thoughts?


----------



## RAzZin

druuzy said:


> Does alpine make a processor that has three front outputs? I have the f1 3 ways, spx-z18t with f1 4chan and want to go fully active.. any thoughts?


H800 has 4 pairs of outs, doesn't it? 3-way front + sub, all active. Same works for H700\701.


----------



## n_olympios

As said above, although you'll need an extra pair of amplifier channels as well (or two pairs, if you want a sub too).


----------



## druuzy

I just read up on the h800.. I want one. are they being distributed in the US? couldnt find it on the us site. maybe I should read more of this thread. The 701 only has two front outs. front1, front2, rear, center/sub, sub.


----------



## druuzy

and I understand I would need another amp.. I have a treo ssx400.1 on treo te 10. I thought I would pick up a ssx100.2 for 3 way subs, and run the full f1 4 chan to the mids and tweets. Thoughts?


----------



## n_olympios

druuzy said:


> maybe I should read more of this thread.


Maybe you should indeed.


----------



## RAzZin

druuzy said:


> The 701 only has two front outs. front1, front2, rear, center/sub, sub.


lol

Just use outs named rear as woofer ones ;-) It's only labels and you can use these in the way you want.

On H800 the labels will be the same


----------



## druuzy

thanks, I needed that. But I know I cant do it how i sit with just a 9887.. I really just wish I had the rest of the f1 system..


----------



## n_olympios

No, you can't because the 9887 is only 2way+sub capable. There is no Alpine HU with integrated 4way active crossover, only their processors have that, so you either choose a processor (be it the older H700/701 or this, when it's available) along with a suitable HU or go for another HU altogether, such as the Pioneer P99RS or a used Clarion HX-D2.

You can of course use the 9887 as the HU and feed the processor with a stero signal from it, but it will be analog. According to this very thread, the analog section in the new H800 is much better than the one in the H700/701, but still it would be better to use a HU with a digital output really, and feed that to the processor.


----------



## RAzZin

or just use an alpine CD Changer (which is way cheaper than a HU) with digital out + 700\701.


----------



## robdridan

Jim, can you enlighten us as to why this processor is available in Europe and not the rest of the world- what is the issue that requires 5 months of delay ?


----------



## rublik

Its already available in Indonesia and will be availbale in Malaysia in 1 -2 weeks time


----------



## RHI-SEE

Ill ask again, how is it that it can be available is some countries and not others. Im in Australia (not that far away from indonesia) and we havent heard anything


----------



## deepsky

Anyone order one from Tokospeaker? Are they a good place to order from if in the US?


----------



## ErinH

deepsky said:


> Anyone order one from Tokospeaker? Are they a good place to order from if in the US?


I tried ordering from them. We agreed to a one-time price because they have zero feedback and I was willing to be the guinea pig and send them more business if I had good luck. I wanted to write a review and played the angle that if I did and they were the only one selling it, then it'd be easy to recommend them. A win/win for us both. He agreed to the price I offered and confirmed the price twice, once in email and PM. 
He then withdrew the offer and said shipping was more than he figured. Asked me to pay about $160 _more_ than our agreed upon price. I offered $25 extra and he declined... By not responding to me anymore. I emailed two or three times afterward and he wouldn't budge off his new price. *So, that's my experience and why I wouldn't recommend them. *. Dude gave me the run around and it pisses me off. He could have at least said "no" to my offer but he didn't even reply, though I know he got the email. 

I'll be happy to send you our email convo. I was going to put it up in the feedback section but didn't feel like creating the drama. My email is hardisj at gmail dot com.


----------



## deepsky

Wow, too bad. Anywhere else to order from yet?


----------



## kyheng

Being an Asian, to post something out, the postage fees are quite high.... And sometimes we have to pay tax also.... So, even I'm stay next to them, I found it not worth as the price are almost same as what I can get in own country.... Suggest to wait and see..... New "unknown" product is best to have warranty.....


----------



## fish

bikinpunk said:


> I tried ordering from them. We agreed to a one-time price because they have zero feedback and I was willing to be the guinea pig and send them more business if I had good luck. I wanted to write a review and played the angle that if I did and they were the only one selling it, then it'd be easy to recommend them. A win/win for us both. He agreed to the price I offered and confirmed the price twice, once in email and PM.
> He then withdrew the offer and said shipping was more than he figured. Asked me to pay about $160 _more_ than our agreed upon price. I offered $25 extra and he declined... By not responding to me anymore. I emailed two or three times afterward and he wouldn't budge off his new price. *So, that's my experience and why I wouldn't recommend them. *. Dude gave me the run around and it pisses me off. He could have at least said "no" to my offer but he didn't even reply, though I know he got the email.
> 
> I'll be happy to send you our email convo. I was going to put it up in the feedback section but didn't feel like creating the drama. My email is hardisj at gmail dot com.



Depending on how long it takes for the H800 to show up for sale in the states, that could've been a bad business move on his part. Especially considering all the positive attention you gave the MS-8 (IMO).


----------



## rexroadj

To bad also, because perhaps, A FEW OF US could have been included in the deal to save some money for shipping and giving the guy a few more sales?
Shame on you for not trying to make a larger purchase.... Maybe it would have made things go a little smoother (J/K of course..............well kinda


----------



## droth

Just recieved my PXA H800 today from tokospeaker  . Thus far been very good to deal with, freight charge reasonable.


----------



## Mic10is

droth said:


> Just recieved my PXA H800 today from tokospeaker  . Thus far been very good to deal with, freight charge reasonable.


Pics or it never happened


----------



## droth

Mic10is said:


> Pics or it never happened


Hopefully pic attached, box corners got bit damaged


----------



## Salad Fingers

n_olympios said:


> Today I saw the new Alpine catalogs and couldn't find a single difference (on paper, anyway) between the IVA-D511R and the new IVA-D800R, apart from the copper chassis and the silver details in the former's fascia. I couldn't help but wonder why the need for two so similar headunits...


Dude, those are sick! Makes me excited about what might be released over here soon enough. The IVA-DXXX line has been way behind the competition for years.


----------



## ErinH

rexroadj said:


> To bad also, because perhaps, A FEW OF US could have been included in the deal to save some money for shipping and giving the guy a few more sales?
> Shame on you for not trying to make a larger purchase.... Maybe it would have made things go a little smoother (J/K of course..............well kinda


You can always contact him yourself to set up a group buy.  
He asked if I'd be able to do that (outside of our agreed upon price) but I don't have the time to organize that due to all the klippel and other testing I've already got on my plate... Much less the fact that I'm in NM all this week. 

Like I said, it wasn't so much the price, but the fact that he agreed to a price and then came back OT only asking for more... But over $_150 more_ than he agreed to. 
Regardless if I would have been willing to pay that initially, I don't do business with people who recant on such a large scale. Much less can't even simply reply with a "no". Aggravating. 

Anyway, someone asked and that was my experience. I'm sure others won't have an issue but that put me off. 
Go ahead and organize that GB. Think he said it would be about $1035 + shipping, IIRC. Maybe you can get enough folks to knock it down. Good luck!

Erin


----------



## ErinH

fish said:


> Depending on how long it takes for the H800 to show up for sale in the states, that could've been a bad business move on his part. Especially considering all the positive attention you gave the MS-8 (IMO).


Honestly, that's exactly what I thought. Figured I could get it a bit cheaper since no one has given him feedback and if all went well, I'd write up a review and send him the business. Apparently he thought it would be a good look but he either had a change of heart or didn't factor in shipping. Such is life. 
I was a bit weary of the fact that other countries have it before we do so took it as nature's way of Keeping me from a face palm moment. Lol.


Edit:
Let me note that I asked for his PP addy after we agreed to $xxx. The next day he asked for more. So, I was ready to send payment. Hell, I had already transferred funds over from my checking account. That's why I'm so bitter (yea, I admit it).


----------



## evo9

droth said:


> Hopefully pic attached, box corners got bit damaged




Pretty beat up box you have there. Was it not double boxed before shipping??



.


----------



## droth

evo9 said:


> Pretty beat up box you have there. Was it not double boxed before shipping??
> 
> 
> 
> .


No just wrapped, on the plus side contents of box have plenty of packaging so were unharmed.
Pretty much only option here to get from asia, as doubt it will ever come to New Zealand (and if it does will be priced extremely high)


----------



## Unrealistic

Woo! Mine was delivered yesterday. 
I replaced my heavily modified 701 and boy, what a difference.
Although I have never heard a F1 in my car so cannot compare, the upgrade from my 701 to this is HUGE!


----------



## deepsky

Did you order from Tokospeaker as well? Is there a way to switch from 5.1 analog input to just the fl and fr inputs for surround processing of stereo? Thanks.


----------



## subwoofery

Unrealistic said:


> Woo! Mine was delivered yesterday.
> I replaced my heavily modified 701 and boy, what a difference.
> Although I have never heard a F1 in my car so cannot compare, the upgrade from my 701 to this is HUGE!


Really unrealistic  

What kind of differences really? Did you re-enter your parameters/same settings and listen? 

Kelvin


----------



## deepsky

Any reviews of the Euphony processing? Better than Dolby Pro Logic 2?


----------



## RAzZin

Unrealistic said:


> Woo! Mine was delivered yesterday.
> I replaced my heavily modified 701 and boy, what a difference.
> Although I have never heard a F1 in my car so cannot compare, the upgrade from my 701 to this is HUGE!


could you tell what HU you are using and what is the connection type (analog\optical)?


----------



## RHI-SEE

is that tokospeaker out of indonesia is it? that box that somebody received previously, that is in TERRIBLE condition. for the H800 + RUX C800 is $1092 Australian Dollars. 
Still no reply from Jim tho? just busy? Here is Australia we atleast have MINIMAL info on our alpine website (Alpine Electronics of Australia) which i guess is better than the US site.
I still cannot understand that it has Bugs in one country and not in others. or is indonesia/europe selling processors that have issues and just dont care?


----------



## Unrealistic

deepsky said:


> Did you order from Tokospeaker as well


No, I ordered via the normal channels. (I'm in Europe)


deepsky said:


> Is there a way to switch from 5.1 analog input to just the fl and fr inputs for surround processing of stereo? Thanks.


I don't know. I use the processor via the digital in.
Apart from the PC connection it seams to function like the 701 processor.
It can be used on the analog in, but I have no experience with that.
Does the manual say anything about that?



subwoofery said:


> Really unrealistic
> What kind of differences really? Did you re-enter your parameters/same settings and listen?
> Kelvin


It is more open sounding and more detailed, especially in the lows.
Mind you: this is compared to a serious modified 701, with a really clean analogue part!
No clicks, buzz etc when changing volume and most setting.
Only when you adjust alot of TA in one time, or phase, you can hear a click.


----------



## rexroadj

bikinpunk said:


> You can always contact him yourself to set up a group buy.
> He asked if I'd be able to do that (outside of our agreed upon price) but I don't have the time to organize that due to all the klippel and other testing I've already got on my plate... Much less the fact that I'm in NM all this week.
> 
> Like I said, it wasn't so much the price, but the fact that he agreed to a price and then came back OT only asking for more... But over $_150 more_ than he agreed to.
> Regardless if I would have been willing to pay that initially, I don't do business with people who recant on such a large scale. Much less can't even simply reply with a "no". Aggravating.
> 
> Anyway, someone asked and that was my experience. I'm sure others won't have an issue but that put me off.
> Go ahead and organize that GB. Think he said it would be about $1035 + shipping, IIRC. Maybe you can get enough folks to knock it down. Good luck!
> 
> Erin




Yeah.... Clearly my sarcasm was not clear enough.... More smileys next time
I said I was kidding.....Kinda.... only because after writing it I thought "hey, maybe that would have helped everyone out?" I also started thinking....maybe you just wanted to be the first reviewer? 
BUT mostly I was just kidding! I would have done the EXACT same thing as you! Its not about the $ as much as it is the principle! What he did was 100% shady, PERIOD! The price also seems pretty expensive? I have been quoted way less via my local shop when they come in. I would much rather give them the business and wait, personally.

So again...wasnt throwing daggers. Just a piss poor attempt at some humor


----------



## ErinH

rexroadj said:


> Yeah.... Clearly my sarcasm was not clear enough.... More smileys next time
> I said I was kidding.....Kinda.... only because after writing it I thought "hey, maybe that would have helped everyone out?" I also started thinking....maybe you just wanted to be the first reviewer?
> BUT mostly I was just kidding! I would have done the EXACT same thing as you! Its not about the $ as much as it is the principle! What he did was 100% shady, PERIOD! The price also seems pretty expensive? I have been quoted way less via my local shop when they come in. I would much rather give them the business and wait, personally.
> 
> So again...wasnt throwing daggers. Just a piss poor attempt at some humor


I saw the "j/k" but the "kinda" threw me. 

I just sent another email. Maybe me and the seller can work something out but I'm not holding my breath. They could certainly benefit from it if they're the only ones selling it to us...


----------



## RHI-SEE

droth said:


> Just recieved my PXA H800 today from tokospeaker  . Thus far been very good to deal with, freight charge reasonable.


Does Everything work correctly? all the Pc tuning work fine. Software of the unit and also the PC software work well?
Contemplating it but am keen to hear more of your thoughts first.

Also, re-asking my previous post if anybody knows



RHI-SEE said:


> is that tokospeaker out of indonesia is it? that box that somebody received previously, that is in TERRIBLE condition. for the H800 + RUX C800 is $1092 Australian Dollars.
> Still no reply from Jim tho? just busy? Here is Australia we atleast have MINIMAL info on our alpine website (Alpine Electronics of Australia) which i guess is better than the US site.
> I still cannot understand that it has Bugs in one country and not in others. or is indonesia/europe selling processors that have issues and just dont care?



Tokospeaker
H800 - AUD$764.23
C800 - AUD$328.09

Incar Magazine released here in Aus ( I beleive these prices came from Alpine Aus)
Dont have seperate price, but H800 + RUX-C800 = AUD$1299


----------



## Unrealistic

RAzZin said:


> could you tell what HU you are using and what is the connection type (analog\optical)?


I am using an IVA-W505R, but hoping to replace this with the INA-W910R soon...


----------



## deepsky

Reviews of the Euphony yet? How long did the Tokospeaker take to ship to US?


----------



## 2way+sub

Unrealistic said:


> I am using an IVA-W505R, but hoping to replace this with the INA-W910R soon...


me too...but at the end is the same HU finally with NAV & BT built-in
hope to a better DAC because all my cd are ripped into a 160GB Ipod (ALAC of course) and as i read no digital out for Ipod :mean:


----------



## Unrealistic

I will receive the 910 tomorrow and I will test the digital iPod connection.
Prepare to be disappointed! :-(


----------



## jim walter

Unrealistic said:


> I will receive the 910 tomorrow and I will test the digital iPod connection.
> Prepare to be disappointed! :-(


I have confirmed it does not work with iPod. 

My previous 910 didn't but I understood it to be an issue with that sample level, but the reality is that the spec never included it, contrary to what we were to understand here. In the end, we are a tad disappointed, but the 910 truly does sound MUCH better than the 900 it replaces. All the guys that have swapped them have made the same comments. That together with the improved analog inputs of the H800 will still make for a damn fine system.


----------



## laalves

jim walter said:


> I have confirmed it does not work with iPod.
> 
> My previous 910 didn't but I understood it to be an issue with that sample level, but the reality is that the spec never included it, contrary to what we were to understand here. In the end, we are a tad disappointed, but the 910 truly does sound MUCH better than the 900 it replaces. All the guys that have swapped them have made the same comments. That together with the improved analog inputs of the H800 will still make for a damn fine system.


Thanks for clearing this one up, Jim, although indeed is disappointing. 

Another bit of info, pls: you said somewhere above that the audio section in the INA-W910 is the same as in the IVA-D800. Do we find the same audio section in the IVA-D511R/RB as well?

Looking at the specs in the manuals, the D800 has exactly the same as the D511, although Alpine says that finer components were used in the D800, when compared to the D511 as well as the copper plated housing.

Is there a list of the tweaks that were actually made to the D800? Here in Europe RRP is 850€ for the D511 and 1000€ for the D800 so it would be useful to know these things since a A/B comparison is quite difficult to do in car audio, unless differences are huge.


----------



## ErinH

It seems this may have been covered but I'm not sure...

Can anyone confirm that this will work with older alpine media units like that 505 or 200/205? I know the h800 can't be controlled by these units, but I'd like to know if the basic controls such as presets and subwoofer can be controlled via these units. 
Furthermore, I assume the digi out of the older units still works with the 800 and you can control digital volume with those decks as long as you are also using ainet. 

I'm pretty sure the above answers are "yes" but just wanting to verify. I ordered the h800 and have a w200 in my wife's car I can use if so. 

Erin


----------



## highly

Unless something has changed in the development process (possible), this is the case from what I have read. Interested to see the more official answer!

Saddened by the loss of digital through on the 910. That just ate the only justifiable reason for me to upgrade my W505/M300 (besides the stupid 1.5" long non-right-angle RGB cable to the M300) unless the CD transport is vastly superior.


----------



## RHI-SEE

forgive me for sounding silly, are we talking about digital connection from ipod to unit, or the W910 to the H800?

Also, i see Jim has posted. Jim, Reasons for this unit being released in some countries and not others?


----------



## ErinH

iPod and head unit dac bypass and routing signal digitally directly to the processor.


----------



## RHI-SEE

bikinpunk said:


> iPod and head unit dac bypass and routing signal digitally directly to the processor.


Cheers.

you said you have already ordered a H800. was that via tokospeaker?


----------



## ErinH

Yes.


----------



## 2way+sub

bikinpunk said:


> It seems this may have been covered but I'm not sure...
> 
> Can anyone confirm that this will work with older alpine media units like that 505 or 200/205? I know the h800 can't be controlled by these units, but I'd like to know if the basic controls such as presets and subwoofer can be controlled via these units.
> Furthermore, I assume the digi out of the older units still works with the 800 and you can control digital volume with those decks as long as you are also using ainet.
> 
> I'm pretty sure the above answers are "yes" but just wanting to verify. I ordered the h800 and have a w200 in my wife's car I can use if so.
> 
> Erin


in italian but simple


----------



## robdridan

Forgive me for being critical, but having bought numerous (thats being modest) Alpine products over the years I think I'm entitled to this comment. 

Jim- your comments and advice here are very much appreciated, you obviously watch the forums and pop up with some info to offer, but why do you not answer the very reasonable question "why is this being sold in some parts of the world but not US and Aus etc" What is the bug that needs 5 months to fix??? It leaves a little bit of uncertainty.........


----------



## kyheng

^Well, being a seller, it is greatly depending on the sales figures... Just say if a new equipment can only sell <100 in your area, they won't bring it in fast compare to places with higher sales volume. Just like the JDM products......


----------



## RHI-SEE

kyheng said:


> ^Well, being a seller, it is greatly depending on the sales figures... Just say if a new equipment can only sell <100 in your area, they won't bring it in fast compare to places with higher sales volume. Just like the JDM products......


I understand what your saying here, an no offence to you being in malaysia.
but how would the likes of Indonesia and Malayasia, sell more units than the likes of the US and Aus/NZ


----------



## jim walter

robdridan said:


> Forgive me for being critical, but having bought numerous (thats being modest) Alpine products over the years I think I'm entitled to this comment.
> 
> Jim- your comments and advice here are very much appreciated, you obviously watch the forums and pop up with some info to offer, but why do you not answer the very reasonable question "why is this being sold in some parts of the world but not US and Aus etc" What is the bug that needs 5 months to fix??? It leaves a little bit of uncertainty.........


Nothing "showstopping" that should stop any of you from importing it if you are anxious. Acoustically, it is perfect, just some minor UI bugs. The delay comes from our QA testing/validation process. All units globally will get this update (USB) but we have chosen to wait for it before we go to market.


----------



## ET328

I will order PXA-H800 next monday but I have few questions:

- Is the PC-software available for download? 
- Does the software work and have usb-drivers for 64bit Windows 7? 
- Does the PXA-H800 have a output mute circuit when no input signal is detected? I.e. between songs or when HU volume is set to min. I think some DSP's have this circuit.
- Is the RoadEQ/Calibration mic available separately?
- Does the RoadEQ actually work? I have tried to search user comments about it but nobody seems to use it (with the older units that already have it).


----------



## kyheng

RHI-SEE said:


> I understand what your saying here, an no offence to you being in malaysia.
> but how would the likes of Indonesia and Malayasia, sell more units than the likes of the US and Aus/NZ


This, I not sure about Indonesia... But till today, I don't have much news when it will hit Malaysia. But my local shop that being an Alpine dealer do went for the product training already. 
If not mistaken, Singapore is the first in South East Asia.....
Even there's not much sales on Pioneer ODRs also.


----------



## RHI-SEE

jim walter said:


> Nothing "showstopping" that should stop any of you from importing it if you are anxious. Acoustically, it is perfect, just some minor UI bugs. The delay comes from our QA testing/validation process. All units globally will get this update (USB) but we have chosen to wait for it before we go to market.


So the units already out in circulation, how will they get the update? 
I say this so that, if i were to import a unit, then they get released with the newer software, how do i upgrade the software of my unit? through a website that can be uploaded to the unit via PC?

Also, I honestly do no mean to be rude as you have provided alot of good info for us, but you did not really answer the question on WHY it was released in those few countries and not the rest. i understand what you say about not releasing to the likes of the US and Aus, but what happend with Europe and indonesia etc. Were alpine global just under the impression "who cares about europe etc?"

Just stating again, i mean NO dis-respect by this, Im just trying to get the facts as im sure others are aswell


----------



## deepsky

I have found both manuals on the UK Alpine website for download.

Jim, or someone who can confirm, can I use the two front channels of a 5.1 line level input to utilize the Dolby Pro Logic II and Euphony processing? If I use my head unit for 5.1, I want to use that, but for stereo sources I would like to use surround processing. Thanks!


----------



## wdemetrius1

2way+sub said:


> in italian but simple


Am I the only one that does not see anything in the link?


----------



## jim walter

deepsky said:


> I have found both manuals on the UK Alpine website for download.
> 
> Jim, or someone who can confirm, can I use the two front channels of a 5.1 line level input to utilize the Dolby Pro Logic II and Euphony processing? If I use my head unit for 5.1, I want to use that, but for stereo sources I would like to use surround processing. Thanks!


As I read this, you are asking if you can use the RCA inputs to run stereo into the H800 and will it process with Euphony or DPLII. 

Yes, it will.


----------



## deepsky

Thanks Jim, will it also allow 5.1 in through the processor without Euphony or DPLII, if and when I want to listen to discrete DVD-A from the head unit? Just want to be clear on this.


----------



## 2way+sub

2way+sub said:


> in italian but simple


now will go


----------



## evo9

jim walter said:


> Nothing "showstopping" that should stop any of you from importing it if you are anxious. *Acoustically, it is perfect, just some minor UI bugs. The delay comes from our QA testing/validation process. All units globally will get this update (USB) but we have chosen to wait for it before we go to market.*



And you early buyers better believe this. Or else, you will end up with a first generation NVE-P1 dock unit. You know that one that has a USB port, but cant be updated by the end user. Even though it was promised to initially. 





.


----------



## evo9

RHI-SEE said:


> *So the units already out in circulation, how will they get the update?* I say this so that, if i were to import a unit, then they get released with the newer software, how do i upgrade the software of my unit? through a website that can be uploaded to the unit via PC?
> 
> Also, I honestly do no mean to be rude as you have provided alot of good info for us, _*but you did not really answer the question on WHY it was released in those few countries and not the rest*._ i understand what you say about not releasing to the likes of the US and Aus, but what happend with Europe and indonesia etc. Were alpine global just under the impression "who cares about europe etc?"
> 
> Just stating again, i mean NO dis-respect by this, Im just trying to get the facts as im sure others are aswell





jim walter said:


> Nothing "showstopping" that should stop any of you from importing it if you are anxious. *Acoustically, it is perfect, just some minor UI bugs. The delay comes from our QA testing/validation process.   All units globally will get this update (USB) but we have chosen to wait for it before we go to market.*





He answered you question. Look again! At this point we are being lead to believe the quality control is higher in the regions of North America, Australia & New Zealand 




.


----------



## CLK63DK

Grr - ebay had it, but I missed to inform before it was too late :-(

Alpine PXA H800 mit RUX bei eBay.de: Kondensatoren Equalizer (endet 05.05.11 22:12:43 MESZ)


----------



## St. Dark

deepsky said:


> Thanks Jim, will it also allow 5.1 in through the processor without Euphony or DPLII, if and when I want to listen to discrete DVD-A from the head unit? Just want to be clear on this.


If you are feeding in analog inputs, whatever goes in will pass through.
If you don't want the radio to process a signal, turn it off and turn on the Euphony, DPLII or what have you.
When you do want it, turn it back on and defeat the Euphony/DPLII on the H800. There's two of your presets, and you still have four left!


----------



## robdridan

Thanks for your reply Jim, I'm sure its frustrating having all these questions fired at you. As for being anxious to buy the unit- I think its a case of its been advertised as "coming soon" for quite a while now, and the 701 has long passed its use by date now with people having to modify them to get the results they should have got in the first place. 

When you see a solution to what you want/need for your system and its put into demo cars and then offered for sale in other parts of the world, you just wonder why there's no consistency in this "global" market for a company that has been in the game for so long now.

I have sent emails to Alpine Aus asking about a release date- they have never answered a single email sent on this or any other product question i have sent them in the last few years........not one!! So naturally you begin to wonder about customer care. So letting you know Jim that it is good to see you take time to answer these forums, thank you.


----------



## RHI-SEE

evo9 said:


> He answered you question. Look again! At this point we are being lead to believe the quality control is higher in the regions of North America, Australia & New Zealand
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .



Thank you. It had been a long day and my brain wasnt quite on it's highest level. 

Any news on if it is still an expected release of August, any changes?


----------



## wdemetrius1

2way+sub said:


> now will go




Thanks.


----------



## droth

ET328 said:


> I will order PXA-H800 next monday but I have few questions:
> 
> - Is the PC-software available for download?
> - Does the software work and have usb-drivers for 64bit Windows 7?
> 
> 
> Haven't been able to find it for public download at this point.
> No doesn't work with 64 bit, drivers are unsigned so it won't even load. Hopefully this is one of the "bugs" being fixed.


----------



## kanez

Hey guys, great thread on the upcoming processor.
Would like to upgrade to this processor on specs alone. Looks good.

Kinda gleaned over this long thread and if it has been asked and answered, my apologies.

Wondering if anyone knows if this H800 can control an Alpine Changer connected to its ainet port with the connected RUX alone?

I had upgraded to the H701/RUX which I bought thinking that I could keep all my Alpine gear(multiple changers, 410c etc) aft of my Alpine HU which to my suprise did not work after I replaced it with a non Alpine DVD HU.

So instead had to get an Alpine DVD HU in order to keep my peripherals when integrating the H701/RUX.

Would still like to get the other non Alpine DVD HU in, but not a deal breaker.

Thanks


----------



## Thrill_House

droth said:


> ET328 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I will order PXA-H800 next monday but I have few questions:
> 
> - Is the PC-software available for download?
> - Does the software work and have usb-drivers for 64bit Windows 7?
> 
> 
> Haven't been able to find it for public download at this point.
> No doesn't work with 64 bit, drivers are unsigned so it won't even load. Hopefully this is one of the "bugs" being fixed.
> 
> 
> 
> Man that better be one of the fixes coming because if not that then is going to be a huge problem for me and im sure many other people. To be honest that pisses me off a bit because why the hell would any product designed within the last year thats meant to work with a windows based computer not offer 64 bit support!?
Click to expand...


----------



## ErinH

Anyone happen to have an h701/c701 they'd be willing to ship to me and let me keep for about a week or two in order to test it against the h800 via RightMark? 
I have a bitone and plan to test that to see how the h800 compares but it would be great to have the h701/c701 to test as well.

I can cover one way shipping but would ask that the sender cover the other way or maybe someone here would be willing to PP some money to help out with the shipment?
Personally I'm not as interested in the measurements but it would be nice to have for the review.


----------



## pyropoptrt

bikinpunk said:


> Anyone happen to have an h701/c701 they'd be willing to ship to me and let me keep for about a week or two in order to test it against the h800 via RightMark?
> I have a bitone and plan to test that to see how the h800 compares but it would be great to have the h701/c701 to test as well.
> 
> I can cover one way shipping but would ask that the sender cover the other way or maybe someone here would be willing to PP some money to help out with the shipment?
> Personally I'm not as interested in the measurements but it would be nice to have for the review.



I can send you a h701 to play with. Don't have a controller for it though


----------



## ErinH

k, that may work. I'd need the controller for volume control. I plan to take the digi signal out.


----------



## pyropoptrt

Erin, are you testing the specs of popular processors out there? Might be interesting to throw the old school Sony ES headunit and processor combo in for testing as well.


----------



## SouthSyde

pyropoptrt said:


> Erin, are you testing the specs of popular processors out there? Might be interesting to throw the old school Sony ES headunit and processor combo in for testing as well.


c90 and 4000x? that would be nice!


----------



## ErinH

pyropoptrt said:


> Erin, are you testing the specs of popular processors out there? Might be interesting to throw the old school Sony ES headunit and processor combo in for testing as well.


Well, I was just going to do the alpine vs. alpine and the bit1 because they're more popular and readily accessible and widely used.
I'm down for testing the Sony but is it as easily available as the others? If not, there may not be much need in doing it other than as a reference.


----------



## vidizzle

whats the average price would it cost to have it shipped to u from 33028? if its not too bad i wont mind chipping in my rux for the 701 for the test as i think i can goo without it for a few weeks.. i just dont got the microphone for it though..

but its the least i could do after the amount of pm's ive sent u

atleast this way you could use it with pyropoptrt's 701...


----------



## ET328

droth said:


> No doesn't work with 64 bit, drivers are unsigned so it won't even load. Hopefully this is one of the "bugs" being fixed.


I hope standalone mode still works with 64-bit systems. My home PC is 64-bit and I'd use that for tweaking, my laptop is Win7 32-bit so that is not a problem.


----------



## droth

ET328 said:


> I hope standalone mode still works with 64-bit systems. My home PC is 64-bit and I'd use that for tweaking, my laptop is Win7 32-bit so that is not a problem.


Nope v1.000 won't run at all on 64bit , I've had to dual boot with 32 bit to run it.


----------



## ET328

droth said:


> Nope v1.000 won't run at all on 64bit , I've had to dual boot with 32 bit to run it.


Have you tested in XP compatibility mode or under Virtual PC (or VMware player) ? Does it still install but just won't run after installation in 64bit or is the whole installation cancelled at the time it tries to install usb-drivers?


----------



## droth

ET328 said:


> Have you tested in XP compatibility mode or under Virtual PC (or VMware player) ? Does it still install but just won't run after installation in 64bit or is the whole installation cancelled at the time it tries to install usb-drivers?


No go with XP compatability, didn't try virtual PC. Installs without error but crashes when run. When installed on 32 bit get the windows message asking whether to install unsigned driver and software runs fine. Document that came with processor says windows 7 (32bit)


----------



## RHI-SEE

Has anybody had any trouble contacting tokospeaker?
i have tried emailing them twice in a week and not received any responses.
Due to the fact, in the checkout stage, you can only select one of 3 countries (not australia)

Also, I am by far no computer genius. as to the above talk of "64bit" etc, how do i check if my laptop is compatible?

If anybody knows, it is a HP DV7 2206TX


----------



## s4turn

yeah Im sure he will deliver to Aus, he worked out postage for me to New Zealand


----------



## kyheng

droth said:


> No go with XP compatability, didn't try virtual PC. Installs without error but crashes when run. When installed on 32 bit get the windows message asking whether to install unsigned driver and software runs fine. Document that came with processor says windows 7 (32bit)


Is simple to check on this, go to "Start", right click "computer" and select "properties".
Then on "System tye", it will show either 32 or 64.


----------



## RHI-SEE

kyheng said:


> Is simple to check on this, go to "Start", right click "computer" and select "properties".
> Then on "System tye", it will show either 32 or 64.


Thanks heaps mate.
32bit.
i new that page existed, just never new how to get there so thanks again.

hopfully tokospeaker will get back to me and i can get the project underway.


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## n_olympios

kanez said:


> Wondering if anyone knows if this H800 can control an Alpine Changer connected to its ainet port with the connected RUX alone?


Where would you get the Play/pause/RW/FF/Eject buttons though? It's a no go, you've got to have a HU.


----------



## kanez

So I guess there's no difference as with the H701/RUX in regards with a changer.

Was hoping though.

Anyway, thanks.


----------



## RAzZin

the sound difference between 701 and 800 should be enough to buy the new one


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## nepl29

Can somebody please upload software? I would like to get a feel for it.


----------



## St. Dark

kanez said:


> So I guess there's no difference as with the H701/RUX in regards with a changer.
> 
> Was hoping though.
> 
> Anyway, thanks.


Correct. The HU is the "controller" or "gateway" in AiNET, as with most aftermarket databus systems.

If you dig around, Alpine has had CD changer controllers in the past that look like RF modulated controllers but with a pair of RCA outputs. Cannot think of any of the model numbers, and it has been a number of years, so I'm probably sending you on a wild goose chase, but they do exist. Although, at that point, you will be getting up there in the outboard controller count.


----------



## rublik

The H800 has arrived at the dealers in Malaysia yesterday. Its around US750.

Just found out that Alpine has some stupid plan to bring in the INA-W900E (latest model in Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Australia) without digital output.

They will be releasing the INA-W910R in Europe with digital output. Why can't they just release a double din unit with bluetooth and good gps with digital output in Asia?


----------



## ErinH

mine's out for delivery. Hope to get it on the bench and take some pictures tonight and maybe even start testing it with RightMark (with Frank's help). I'll start writing up a review this week and try to post it up soon for those who would like more details/pictures.
Jason's sending out his h701 for me to compare in size to against the h800 and I'll do the same with the bit1, though the specs show that the h800 is pretty large.


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## ET328

Moderator please change the title of this thread to Alpine PXA-H800.


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## ErinH

ET328 said:


> Moderator please change the title of this thread to Alpine PXA-H800.


Agreed. Done.


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## pyropoptrt

bikinpunk said:


> Well, I was just going to do the alpine vs. alpine and the bit1 because they're more popular and readily accessible and widely used.
> I'm down for testing the Sony but is it as easily available as the others? If not, there may not be much need in doing it other than as a reference.


I might know where to find the Sony C90 - 4000X combo


----------



## AccordUno

for all of you running 64 bit Windows 7, just get the XPMode add on to run it as a 32bit. it comes with a free XP license. I use it for debugging my code on a 32 bit box.. Works great.. So, how many of these processors are now stateside?


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## ErinH

Got mine in. Unfortunately, the software CD is not in the box. :/
Luckily, I've got the c800 to do until I can get the software from the seller.

Or, maybe one of you guys who has it already can upload and send me a copy of the exe file? I'd certainly appreciate it.

Here's some pictures:




























































































I'll see what I can do about getting some guts pictures soon...


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## t3sn4f2

So perrrty!


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## thewatusi

bikinpunk said:


> Here's some pictures:


Looks like a real POS. Since you're a nice guy, I'll let you ship it to me and I'll take it off your hands for you.


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## n_olympios

Yum! 

Both seem more compact than the H701 combo. Especially the controller is much slimmer, that'll help flush installations.


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## wdemetrius1

bikinpunk said:


> Got mine in. Unfortunately, the software CD is not in the box. :/
> Luckily, I've got the c800 to do until I can get the software from the seller.
> 
> Or, maybe one of you guys who has it already can upload and send me a copy of the exe file? I'd certainly appreciate it.
> 
> Here's some pictures:
> 
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> 
> I'll see what I can do about getting some guts pictures soon...




BEAUTIFUL!!!


----------



## RHI-SEE

is that cable in the pic with the RUX controler, the PC cable, or an extension cable for the RUX controller?

Im sure hoping its the extension cable


----------



## ErinH

extension cable.

the old school ai-net style cable for the controller is now gone. Looks more _like _an hdmi cable (but it is NOT that type).


----------



## ecbmxer

Pretty sweet. Great now there's something else I want...


----------



## pankrok

the warranty sticker is stupity fixed on the processor.
how on earth could somebody install and show this unit properly without removing it????
couldnt be just a sticker on the bolts????


----------



## ErinH

the warranty sticker is no match for a blow dryer and patience...


----------



## pankrok

+ alcohol , but this is not the point.
should you need service in warranty terms you wont get it for free without the sticker.


----------



## ErinH

question... is anyone here running this with their w505 and can GUARANTEE the digital output works?
I saw the compatibility list that came with the 800 and it shows the kwa-610a works with the 20x headunits but has an "X" for the w502 unit. Next to this it says there is a workaround available and says to contact the dealer. Found that odd.
I should be getting the w505 myself tomorrow but thought someone here may be able to comment on this already...


----------



## ErinH

pankrok said:


> + alcohol , but this is not the point.
> should you need service in warranty terms you wont get it for free without the sticker.


don't need alcohol if you do it right. but, that's not the point either.

Yes, I see what you're saying. personally it's not an issue for me but I understand your concern. Who's to say all have the sticker here, though. 
Plus, if you remove it, you can always put it back on when you send it in.


----------



## highly

Back to the W505? I thought you were all about the other brand BT model you had been working with. Just going back for the optical+volume control or are there other reasons?

BTW, if you need a 505 optical cable drop me an email.

-Todd


----------



## ET328

How fast does the pxa-h800 switch between user memories? Pxa-h701 takes a long time, I hope 800 is much faster. 

Are all adjustments (via PC) in real time? 

Does the PXA-H800 have a fully adjustable graphic (or parametric) EQs for each channel or are some channels (for example front) using the same EQ and only delay and crossover are adjustable per channel?


----------



## ErinH

highly said:


> Back to the W505? I thought you were all about the other brand BT model you had been working with. Just going back for the optical+volume control or are there other reasons?
> 
> -Todd


Yep, exactly. Plus the preset switching and sub control is a bit more convenient.
I do love the pioneer, but the connectivity between the alpine/h800 prompted me to switch back.
I'm keeping an eye out on the w910, though. The w505 nav isn't too hot and BT is add on. Right now I'm just rocking the deck and ipod until I figure out what I want to do (maybe even see about getting the w505 modded?).


----------



## ErinH

ET328 said:


> How fast does the pxa-h800 switch between user memories? Pxa-h701 takes a long time, I hope 800 is much faster.
> 
> Are all adjustments (via PC) in real time?
> 
> Does the PXA-H800 have a fully adjustable graphic (or parametric) EQs for each channel or are some channels (for example front) using the same EQ and only delay and crossover are adjustable per channel?


Not sure about the first two yet, but it seems the front1 g-eq is grouped for tweeter & mid like the 701 was.


----------



## highly

P1 nav adds bluetooth....


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## n_olympios

My W505R digital output works (into the F#1 status processor - H900). 

The warranty sticker will be hidden behind the flush trim.


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## ErinH

highly said:


> P1 nav adds bluetooth....


the guy I got the 505 from sent the bb2 with it. We'll see how that goes... not expecting much, though. Heck, I'll probably wind up putting the BB2 on ebay as soon as I get it. I don't need navi.

E-mail sent.


I'm working on getting the review up. Currently messing with RightMark to get some specs. 
Off the top, the problem I have is:

Gain for both levels and EQ can only be adjusted in 0.5dB increments. Same as 701. Bit1 allows 0.2dB increments.
Time Alignment steps is in 0.05ms. Same as 701. Bit1 allows for 0.02ms.

these aren't deal breakers and I knew it going in. However, I just feel like the ball was dropped in these regards. With a new overhaul of the DSP, I think/wish Alpine had given us more fine tuning increments. 

On the flip side, I'm really curious/excited about the Imprint + manual tuning afterward and also the RoadEQ.
RoadEQ is a real-time process. So, it's making adjustments while you're driving which should mean that speeds and surfaces will prompt the processor to re-equalize the output depending on these factors. That seems pretty badass to me.


----------



## ErinH

n_olympios said:


> My W505R digital output works (into the F#1 status processor - *H900*).


but that's not the h800 processor... could be different.
Again, I'm looking for someone to confirm the w505 digital + h800 if they can.



n_olympios said:


> The warranty sticker will be hidden behind the flush trim.


The warranty sticker will be hidden by my car seat. lol.


----------



## Unrealistic

bikinpunk said:


> but that's not the h800 processor... could be different.
> Again, I'm looking for someone to confirm the w505 digital + h800 if they can.
> 
> 
> 
> The warranty sticker will be hidden by my car seat. lol.


I had the 505 with the 610 optical cable to the h800.
Works perfect, only no processor control other than volume, fader, balance, presets and sub boost level


----------



## ET328

bikinpunk said:


> RoadEQ is a real-time process. So, it's making adjustments while you're driving which should mean that speeds and surfaces will prompt the processor to re-equalize the output depending on these factors. That seems pretty badass to me.


Yes, I'm also waiting how RoadEQ works, in theory it sounds perfect but we'll see. I still remember how badly a Blaupunkt head unit with similarly advertised function worked, but that was early days without DSPs etc. 

I'm also looking forward how Euphony works and what could be done with it's custom modes. Maybe I can now bypass Audiocontrol ESP-2 and still get great stereo separation (with factory speaker positions).

Now the only thing is: when will my unit arrive...


----------



## ErinH

Unrealistic said:


> I had the 505 with the 610 optical cable to the h800.
> Works perfect, only no processor control other than volume, fader, balance, presets and sub boost level


That's good to know. I wonder what the sheet I read was talking about...


----------



## n_olympios

bikinpunk said:


> but that's not the h800 processor... could be different.


Erm... How could it be different? You said you wanted to check if the W505 outputs a digital signal, well it does. No matter what device you plug in at the other end.


----------



## ErinH

I know the 505 outputs digital (I used to own it and did a review for it here). I was asking if, for some reason, it might not have worked with the h800. The h800 'cheat sheet' I have clearly states the kwa-610a does not work with the iva-w502, which I thought was similar in model to the w505 (just the euro version?). That's why I asked the question... it threw me. But, it's been resolved by the other guy.


----------



## n_olympios

I see. The difference between the W502 and W505 is that the latter has the BlackBird 2 dock which the former doesn't. Perhaps the W502 has a regular optical output instead of the proprietary electrical plug? I doubt it, but will check. 

You can identify european models by the R after the digits on the model number.


----------



## ErinH

maybe so. it may not have optical at all, though, because the sheet also lists units that use standard toslink and states "toslink" as the digital connection. 

If you look at this picture, though, it looks to have the same type digital out. Maybe it's just a mess up on the sheet. Or, maybe there's something terribly odd with the 502...

Alpine iVA-W502 2DIN 7" Screen - sgCarStore


----------



## kanez

St. Dark;Although said:


> Yup, would be too crowded along with the HU and the RUX controller.
> 
> Thanks though as now I know it's workable, but not exactly like I had hoped.


----------



## kanez

This units looking even better than those initial release pics.

I thought it was a plastic outer casing on the H800, but now seeing it in your pics it is extruded aluminum.

Niiiice touch!!!


----------



## SSSnake

> Well, I was just going to do the alpine vs. alpine and the bit1 because they're more popular and readily accessible and widely used.


Erin,

Are you interested in adding a Behringer DCX 2496 to the list? IMO - this is an excellent processor that does not get enough attention. Great flexibility, good SNR, can be auto EQd with the help of external software, TA, PEQ, GEQ, phase adjustments, and dynamic EQ all in one package (although admittedly not a car friendly package). I am about to buy a second one. I can give it up for a while if you are interested in testing...

Charles

BTW - I forgot to mention that the EvisionElec kit is now only $99. It wasn't a bad deal before but it is a great one now...


----------



## t3sn4f2

SSSnake said:


> Erin,
> 
> Are you interested in adding a Behringer DCX 2496 to the list? IMO - this is an excellent processor that does not get enough attention. Great flexibility, good SNR, can be auto EQd with the help of external software, TA, PEQ, GEQ, phase adjustments, and dynamic EQ all in one package (although admittedly not a car friendly package). I am about to buy a second one. I can give it up for a while if you are interested in testing...
> 
> Charles
> 
> BTW - I forgot to mention that the EvisionElec kit is now only $99. It wasn't a bad deal before but it is a great one now...


I'd be nice to test one with the kit in place. 

Erin, do you have the gear to be able to test the balanced outputs from the DCX? IIRC you r card only has unbalanced inputs. Also, if I'm not mistaken, the DCX only accepts AES/EBU digital inputs as apposed to S/PDIF. You'd have to check your card to see if it can be set to the digital formats. I think you also need a way to converter the coax digital out from your card to balanced XLR.


----------



## ErinH

Sounds like a bit more work than I'm prepared for just yet. I can save the test results and test the dcx at a later time, though.


----------



## ecbmxer

It's a real shame they didn't add the ability to have full control of this thing from the W900 and the new W910 unit. You would think this would be possible with Alpine's top of the line stuff. They should have added full control of the final Imprint tune from the computer and HU in the basic H100 model also though.

The road EQ seems interesting, but I wonder if it would overcorrect things if you had a bunch of loud noise (horns, construction sounds, or whatever). Or maybe it only makes small corrections to help with basic tire/road noise.


----------



## SSSnake

> Sounds like a bit more work than I'm prepared for just yet. I can save the test results and test the dcx at a later time, though


No problem. I have just been pleasantly surprised. This thing far outperforms my old 701 in every area except size. For those interested, Envision Elec kit was great and I give it 5 out of 5 stars! 

Maybe something for next year's GTG. I sure hate that I missed this year's event. Working proposals sux.


----------



## Unrealistic

SSSnake said:


> BTW - I forgot to mention that the EvisionElec kit is now only $99. It wasn't a bad deal before but it is a great one now...


I can confirm the quality of the Behringer.
I had a deq between the headunit and 701 and this was great.
I did the eq on the deq and the crossover on the 701.
Only stopped using it because I listen a lot of iPod and this doesn't go through the deq.

For someone who's interested: I still have the Envisionelec 12v power supply...


----------



## ErinH

So, early test results tell me the H800's analog inputs are _*KILLER*_. 
Yea. Seriously.

full test results coming tonight. 
Thanks to Jason for sending the H701/C701 combo and Frank for helping me out with RightMark.

- Erin


----------



## t3sn4f2

Unrealistic said:


> I can confirm the quality of the Behringer.
> I had a deq between the headunit and 701 and this was great.
> I did the eq on the deq and the crossover on the 701.
> *Only stopped using it because I listen a lot of iPod and this doesn't go through the deq.*
> 
> For someone who's interested: I still have the Envisionelec 12v power supply...


Check out the Pure i-20 digital iDevice dock. Gives you a bit perfect coax or toslink output from the iPod before the DAC stage. $99 only and all you need is a regulated DC to DC converter of the appropriate rating. I just got mine and it works great. It literally powers on, syncs, and is outputting audio before you can reach over to unpause the ipod. Whatever was on the ipod before you dock it will still be there when docking. All that happens is the volume adjustment goes away from the media app's task bars. Also comes with IR remote (cheap one though) and digital volume control that is defeated when volume is set to full. So you go back to bit perfect on the S/PDIF output.

Use a dock connector extention cable to run to the hidden dock in the dash. I'd use a quality one of no more then a couple feet.


----------



## Unrealistic

t3sn4f2 said:


> Check out the Pure i-20 digital iDevice dock. Gives you a bit perfect coax or toslink output from the iPod before the DAC stage. $99 only and all you need is a regulated DC to DC converter of the appropriate rating. I just got mine and it works great. It literally powers on, syncs, and is outputting audio before you can reach over to unpause the ipod. Whatever was on the ipod before you dock it will still be there when docking. All that happens is the volume adjustment goes away from the media app's task bars. Also comes with IR remote (cheap one though) and digital volume control that is defeated when volume is set to full. So you go back to bit perfect on the S/PDIF output.
> 
> Use a dock connector extention cable to run to the hidden dock in the dash. I'd use a quality one of no more then a couple feet.


That sounds really good.
Does the connection to the headunit work?
Eg can you control the ipod from the headunit?


----------



## t3sn4f2

Unrealistic said:


> That sounds really good.
> Does the connection to the headunit work?
> Eg can you control the ipod from the headunit?


Nope, only from the iDevice. Exactly like you normally would (even voice control) or from the remote, which is very limited IME.


----------



## hdrugs

will this run accepting digital from car pc?


----------



## t3sn4f2

hdrugs said:


> will this run accepting digital from car pc?


Yes, as long as you know how to set up a properly configured standard S/PDIF output from your media player and device of choice.

I recommend doing master volume control from the Alpine controller though.


----------



## Lancer

rublik said:


> The H800 has arrived at the dealers in Malaysia yesterday. Its around US750.
> 
> Just found out that Alpine has some stupid plan to bring in the INA-W900E (latest model in Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Australia) without digital output.
> 
> They will be releasing the INA-W910R in Europe with digital output. Why can't they just release a double din unit with bluetooth and good gps with digital output in Asia?


Hi!

May i know where i can get the H800 at that price? Have been asking around and was quoted more than usd 1300. 

Thanks!


----------



## ErinH

Guys, as far as reviews go, I plan to start mine up this weekend. A bit here and there while the kid is taking naps. 

I know most questions seem to have been answered regarding specs. However, is there certain aspects of the H800/C800 you guys would like to see discussed? Are there any specific questions relating to the software/tunability? 
I'll try to cover as many bases as I can but if there's anything someone might like to know more on, let me know here and I'll try to cover it in the review.

I have measurements of the H800 vs. H701 vs. Bit1 coming in about an hour. But, the full review of the H800 won't be done for a few days at best.

- Erin


----------



## robdridan

Love to know your thoughts on the auto eq and time alignment- just how accurate is the auto process and what adjustments are needed afterward in manual mode


----------



## Mic10is

bikinpunk said:


> Guys, as far as reviews go, I plan to start mine up this weekend. A bit here and there while the kid is taking naps.
> 
> I know most questions seem to have been answered regarding specs. However, is there certain aspects of the H800/C800 you guys would like to see discussed? Are there any specific questions relating to the software/tunability?
> I'll try to cover as many bases as I can but if there's anything someone might like to know more on, let me know here and I'll try to cover it in the review.
> 
> I have measurements of the H800 vs. H701 vs. Bit1 coming in about an hour. But, the full review of the H800 won't be done for a few days at best.
> 
> - Erin


Id like to know, how well the analog inputs work--any floor noise or any other noise? Zipper noise? pops, clicks? anything when changing settings using the RUX

Please also test the H800 with a NON-ainet head unit with analog input and digital input.
and report if there is any noise.

also, if the RUX volume control can be set and left and the head unit volume control can be used (you can do this on an H700/01)

Then, please send me your unit to verify everything in triplicate...
oh and before next weekend


----------



## t3sn4f2

Mic10is said:


> Id like to know, how well the analog inputs work--any floor noise or any other noise? Zipper noise? pops, clicks? anything when changing settings using the RUX
> 
> Please also test the H800 with a NON-ainet head unit with analog input and digital input.
> and report if there is any noise.


To expand on this if I may. Any pops when cycling the digital source's power or when changing or pausing/play tracks (ie anything weird with digital syncing)?


----------



## rublik

Lancer said:


> Hi!
> 
> May i know where i can get the H800 at that price? Have been asking around and was quoted more than usd 1300.
> 
> Thanks!


U can try at CV Auto Uptown Damansara


----------



## RHI-SEE

Erin,
I am keen to no as much as possible about the RoadEQ.
Mine should be here in no longer than a week so i will test mine then, just curious to see how you interpret it.


----------



## ErinH

Mic10is said:


> Id like to know, how well the analog inputs work--any floor noise or any other noise? Zipper noise? pops, clicks? anything when changing settings using the RUX
> 
> Please also test the H800 with a NON-ainet head unit with analog input and digital input.
> and report if there is any noise.
> 
> also, if the RUX volume control can be set and left and the head unit volume control can be used (you can do this on an H700/01)
> 
> Then, please send me your unit to verify everything in triplicate...
> oh and before next weekend


this thread might help:
Bikinpunks Product Review Forum - DIYMA.com


----------



## ET328

My PXA-H800 arrived today 

So far I have only tested the software. As said earlier, it does not run under 64bit Windows. It works under Virtual PC but only in standalone mode. Alpine's USB-driver installs under Virtual PC but that does not help since the main OS does not install/support it (unless there is some way to bypass this and give the virtual machine direct access to the port?). 

Driver.inf (inside installation directory/drivers) has parts for 64bit OS but the actual driver is only for 32bit.

I'll try to install the H800 to my car later today. It replaces PXA-H701 so basic installation should go quickly...


----------



## ET328

And it begins  Looks like the PXA-H800 will not turn on in standalone. I.e. you have to connect AI-net, RUX or PC (with Soundmanager running, USB connection is not enough) to make it wake up. Remote lead will not turn it on, but it does turn it off.

Am I missing something?


----------



## laalves

I'm afraid that's by design, IAW the manual. With a non Ai-Net HU, you need the RUX. See the installation manual, Note *1 page 12 or Note *1 page 14 or Note *1 page 15. Like insurance policies, you need to read the small letters in Alpine manuals.


----------



## ET328

laalves said:


> I'm afraid that's by design, IAW the manual. With a non Ai-Net HU, you need the RUX. See the installation manual, Note *1 page 12 or Note *1 page 14 or Note *1 page 15. Like insurance policies, you need to read the small letters in Alpine manuals.


Great... Will this stupid thing then turn on via the remote lead or do I have to manually turn it on via RUX? Sounds silly that I have to buy RUX just to make the unit power up, I have no other use for it.


----------



## rexroadj

ET328 said:


> Great... Will this stupid thing then turn on via the remote lead or do I have to manually turn it on via RUX? Sounds silly that I have to buy RUX just to make the unit power up, I have no other use for it.


x2! I dont want the rux either. I may run the new w910 but when I get to play with it I may hate it like the last 10yrs worth of decks and will go with something else. I should be able to set it with my laptop and call it a day. I think this really really sucks and is piss poor! This is typical Alpine MAKING you have to get a thousand accesories to get anything done.


----------



## ErinH

that's odd... we didn't have to use an alpine deck when we used the h701. You could even set the processor up and unplug the c701 and never use it again.

I haven't tried yet or looked in the manual, but surely you don't have to have ai-net connected or the c800 connected. :/


----------



## laalves

rexroadj said:


> x2! I dont want the rux either. I may run the new w910 but when I get to play with it I may hate it like the last 10yrs worth of decks and will go with something else. I should be able to set it with my laptop and call it a day. I think this really really sucks and is piss poor! This is typical Alpine MAKING you have to get a thousand accesories to get anything done.


Agree. This is totally lame, particularly comparing with competing processors that once setup won't need anything else. Even the H650 and H660 were accessory-free.

When I learned I needed to get a KCE-900E (a device whose primary function was never intended to be this "audio split" one when it was designed many moons ago) to have the nav voice with the H100 I couldn't believe it. Even now with the H800 a KCE-900E is still needed. Unbelievable. As if it were impossible to put a RGB plug/socket into the the processors housings or do it in a simple and better way which would be to do the mixing in the HU itself and then to have it sent to the processor via Ai-Net as everything else. I simply don't get this level of perpetuated afterthought.


----------



## rexroadj

Its what they do and always have. Its extortion!


----------



## rexroadj

It better be ONE HELL of a processor otherwise the RF-363 just went up a peg in my book (on paper?)


----------



## St. Dark

Erin - Bit One has .2dB EQ adjustments, but .5dB output level adjustments.


RoadEQ (forgot who asked) SHOULD be very reactive. On the F1 stuff, it operated at 48k, and had three setting levels. So a horn, or construction noise, might trigger it, but if they did it would stop reacting as the noise vanished. 
Versus the really old radios (Blau, Alpine once on a high end tape deck, various others) that looked at low frequency information and had s l o o o o w reaction times. This assumes that the H800 operates similarly to the H990; I don't know for sue that that is the case.





kanez said:


> Yup, would be too crowded along with the HU and the RUX controller.
> 
> Thanks though as now I know it's workable, but not exactly like I had hoped.



Or, :headslap:, IF you have a video screen, do the DHA-S690 DVD changer. Even if you never use DVDs, it has the optical out and all you need is the IR eye and a remote to control it. Your screen will show you track info and such.


----------



## Mic10is

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*

More info needed on this supposed, non ainet does not turn the unit on (without RUX), as posted in another thread


----------



## jim walter

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



Mic10is said:


> More info needed on this supposed, non ainet does not turn the unit on (without RUX), as posted in another thread


I'm checking on the official spec on this, as well as functional testing. 

Will report back when I find something.
Jim


----------



## jim walter

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*

Confirmed. There needs to be a RUX in the system to allow for remote on.

This is a firmware spec, something that theoretically could be modified. As we are making some changes over here for our market spec, I'll investigate if this could be change for you non-AINetters our there


----------



## ErinH

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*

Interesting. Thanks for confirming. 

Jim, for those who sprung for the EU version, will the updates be as easily available to those who purchased US spec units? 
Is this something that can be downloaded from the site easily or will it have to be done via dealer? Hoping for the former.


----------



## jim walter

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*

It will be availible to all other markets. It will be a download from each country's support site and installed via USB using the PC Software that you use to tune the unit.

Jim


----------



## ErinH

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



jim walter said:


> Confirmed. There needs to be a RUX in the system to allow for remote on.


double confirmed.

I just tried to power the h800 up by itself with only remote in from the power supply. No dice. When I hit a button on the c800 or if I connect and load the software, however, it turns on.


----------



## jim walter

laalves said:


> Agree. This is totally lame, particularly comparing with competing processors that once setup won't need anything else. Even the H650 and H660 were accessory-free.
> 
> When I learned I needed to get a KCE-900E (a device whose primary function was never intended to be this "audio split" one when it was designed many moons ago) to have the nav voice with the H100 I couldn't believe it. Even now with the H800 a KCE-900E is still needed. Unbelievable. As if it were impossible to put a RGB plug/socket into the the processors housings or do it in a simple and better way which would be to do the mixing in the HU itself and then to have it sent to the processor via Ai-Net as everything else. I simply don't get this level of perpetuated afterthought.


The 900E does not need to be used for the INA-W9xx units. This is b/c the Nav is built in and mixed internally now, vs the external nav device from before.


----------



## Mic10is

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



jim walter said:


> Confirmed. There needs to be a RUX in the system to allow for remote on.
> 
> This is a firmware spec, something that theoretically could be modified. As we are making some changes over here for our market spec, I'll investigate if this could be change for you non-AINetters our there


Thank you. This would be very beneficial. I have had the H700 since I imported it into the US and have also been sitting on a Denon DCT1 that I couldnt use for years.
Based on the specs and reviews of the H800, I would love to continue my support of Alpine product---but I really want to use this Denon as well


----------



## jim walter

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



Mic10is said:


> Thank you. This would be very beneficial. I have had the H700 since I imported it into the US and have also been sitting on a Denon DCT1 that I couldnt use for years.
> Based on the specs and reviews of the H800, I would love to continue my support of Alpine product---but I really want to use this Denon as well


Money-wise it doesn't make sense, but the product is 100% ready for you right now, as is. You'll just need to have a RUX tucked away somewhere in the car and plugged in to allow the system to work. Later, if/when we update the software, you can sell the RUX.

Jim


----------



## Mic10is

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



jim walter said:


> Money-wise it doesn't make sense, but the product is 100% ready for you right now, as is. You'll just need to have a RUX tucked away somewhere in the car and plugged in to allow the system to work. Later, if/when we update the software, you can sell the RUX.
> 
> Jim


Nah, its easier to tune via RUX in traffic than via laptop:2thumbsup:


----------



## Thrill_House

So just to confirm, if you have the h800 hooked upto and alpine headunit via ainet it will power up without needing the RUX to be plugged in or does the RUX always need to be hooked up to the unit it for it to power on?


----------



## Mic10is

Thrill_House said:


> So just to confirm, if you have the h800 hooked upto and alpine headunit via ainet it will power up without needing the RUX to be plugged in or does the RUX always need to be hooked up to the unit it for it to power on?


Just like the H700/01 it turns on via AInet


----------



## rublik

Do u need the optical cable KWE-610A to connect the INA-W910 with the H800?

Can u just buy a local optical cable?

Thanks


----------



## ErinH

apparently, yes, that is the cable you need. the w910 doesn't have standard toslink out.


----------



## jim walter

rublik said:


> Do u need the optical cable KWE-610A to connect the INA-W910 with the H800?
> 
> Can u just buy a local optical cable?
> 
> Thanks


Yes. KCE-610A will be needed. 

Yes, there is a Panasonic part that is the same if you can locate it.


----------



## ErinH

Since my review is going to be a few days further out than I thought, I figured I'd mention one thing I like: the software GUI fits perfectly fine on my dell netbook with resolution set to 1024x600. :thumbsup:


----------



## evo9

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



jim walter said:


> Money-wise it doesn't make sense, but the product is 100% ready for you right now, as is. * You'll just need to have a RUX tucked away somewhere in the car* and plugged in to allow the system to work. Later, if/when we update the software, you can sell the RUX.
> 
> Jim





Would be even nicer tucked under the IVA-D800R in a double din dash!







.


----------



## ET328

I have now tested the PXA-H800 with my PC-speakers and external amp. Some things I have noticed: 

I "tested" the RoadEQ, it seems to react only to low frequency noise and the effect is not very big (but there was no subwoofer in my system). I made noise with a hair dryer and that raised sound level and made it contain more bass, it also sounded like it added a little compression. I also tested with noise with just treble sounds but that did not effect music's treble content. RoadEQ reacts fast and does not overcompensate the noise. After the noise is gone, you barely have time to notice when it adjusts levels/corrections back to normal. I think I will work fine in car environment where noise levels don't change that quicly and there are many noise sources.

Euphony, I think I will be using it and Audiocontrol ESP-2 is gone from my system. Euphony's custom mode offers ways to adjust stereo width, depth and center (works fine without separate center speaker). I think that the end result will be very good and adjustments allow you to tone down the surround effect. 

Question: I'm using analog aux-1 input. When I select Euphony or Pro Logic, sound levels drop about 9dB when compared to stereo-mode (this is with Euphony outputs set to max). There is no adjustment for this, only adjustment that works is for PCM-mode and that just changes stereo-mode soundlevel. So to "fix" this, I have to drop PCM level 9dB so that stereo sound is set to lower level. Is there an adjustment for Euphony and Pro Logic that works with aux-1 analog mode?


----------



## ET328

Sound Manager software is now fully working inside Virtual PC in Windows 7 64-bit. 

You just need to install the Sound Manager software inside Virtual PC, select 'connect' for the unknown device from Virtual PC's USB-menu and let Virtual PC install the driver.

Now I need to figure out how to enable USB passthru also when you start Sound Manager in seamless mode, i.e. directly to Win7 desktop. 
Edit: Found it: that is available when you start the program and right click it's taskbar icon. 

VMware Player with XP VM also allows the software to run and use usb-drivers.


----------



## asawendo

Did anyone notice a small "digital artifact" when using graphic eq especially in low bass section? It sound like a soft rattle... It's gone when I push defeat on. By the way I am using non ai net head unit which is sound monitor cdt 450x and sony cdx c90

Best Regards

Wendo


----------



## laalves

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



evo9 said:


> Would be even nicer tucked under the IVA-D800R in a double din dash!


Fully agree! I have even made a cardboard mockup with the photos of both to see how they would look in place of the W407BT I currently have (see the attached photos, the fascia fabrication and leather upholstering is my doing, as is as the iPod KTX-i550D drawer-disguised-as-OEM-CD-holder.

Aesthetically, the my double DIN unit install beats that configuration hands down due to the uncluttered looks, but ergonomically the D800R would be perfect since it would be almost at eye level in my car, whereas the double DIN forces me to look down, and to the right due to my right hand holding the wheel being in front of the left part of the screen.

A raised screen would preclude all those ergonomical problems, but the 1 inch "nose" sticking out and the button-clutter is making me having serious second thoughts about changing.


----------



## St. Dark

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



jim walter said:


> Confirmed. There needs to be a RUX in the system to allow for remote on.
> 
> This is a firmware spec, something that theoretically could be modified. As we are making some changes over here for our market spec, I'll investigate if this could be change for you non-AINetters our there



That would definitely be worth your (Alpine USA) while, as you will sell more of them that way (and keep it more price competitive versus the Bit One). I was talking with Jason K this past Wed and Thurs, and he said the same thing as far as waiting until the next firmware was ready to roll before bringing them into North America. 
I also lobbied for being able to switch between individual channels and L & R combined at will without losing any previous settings on EQ and TC. If they're doing new firmware anyway, might as well go ahead and make the machine that much easier to tune...*G*


----------



## SouthSyde

ET328 said:


> I have now tested the PXA-H800 with my PC-speakers and external amp. Some things I have noticed:
> 
> I "tested" the RoadEQ, it seems to react only to low frequency noise and the effect is not very big (but there was no subwoofer in my system). I made noise with a hair dryer and that raised sound level and made it contain more bass, it also sounded like it added a little compression. I also tested with noise with just treble sounds but that did not effect music's treble content. RoadEQ reacts fast and does not overcompensate the noise. After the noise is gone, you barely have time to notice when it adjusts levels/corrections back to normal. I think I will work fine in car environment where noise levels don't change that quicly and there are many noise sources.
> 
> Euphony, I think I will be using it and Audiocontrol ESP-2 is gone from my system. Euphony's custom mode offers ways to adjust stereo width, depth and center (works fine without separate center speaker). I think that the end result will be very good and adjustments allow you to tone down the surround effect.
> 
> Question: I'm using analog aux-1 input. When I select Euphony or Pro Logic, sound levels drop about 9dB when compared to stereo-mode (this is with Euphony outputs set to max). There is no adjustment for this, only adjustment that works is for PCM-mode and that just changes stereo-mode soundlevel. So to "fix" this, I have to drop PCM level 9dB so that stereo sound is set to lower level. Is there an adjustment for Euphony and Pro Logic that works with aux-1 analog mode?


so hows the autotune?


----------



## ErinH

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



St. Dark said:


> That would definitely be worth your (Alpine USA) while, as you will sell more of them that way (and keep it more price competitive versus the Bit One). I was talking with Jason K this past Wed and Thurs, and he said the same thing as far as waiting until the next firmware was ready to roll before bringing them into North America.
> I also lobbied for being able to switch between individual channels and L & R combined at will without losing any previous settings on EQ and TC. If they're doing new firmware anyway, might as well go ahead and make the machine that much easier to tune...*G*


I have no idea how long it would take or what these guys are paid, but I'd be happy to toss in $100 for the coder to give us 0.01dB increments in gain and EQ and 0.01ms in t/a. 

I'm half serious.


----------



## xpsvwino

Can anyone confirm it the road eq will work to muffle the sounds of a nagging wife?





ET328 said:


> I have now tested the PXA-H800 with my PC-speakers and external amp. Some things I have noticed:
> 
> I "tested" the RoadEQ, it seems to react only to low frequency noise and the effect is not very big (but there was no subwoofer in my system). I made noise with a hair dryer and that raised sound level and made it contain more bass, it also sounded like it added a little compression. I also tested with noise with just treble sounds but that did not effect music's treble content. RoadEQ reacts fast and does not overcompensate the noise. After the noise is gone, you barely have time to notice when it adjusts levels/corrections back to normal. I think I will work fine in car environment where noise levels don't change that quicly and there are many noise sources.
> 
> Euphony, I think I will be using it and Audiocontrol ESP-2 is gone from my system. Euphony's custom mode offers ways to adjust stereo width, depth and center (works fine without separate center speaker). I think that the end result will be very good and adjustments allow you to tone down the surround effect.
> 
> Question: I'm using analog aux-1 input. When I select Euphony or Pro Logic, sound levels drop about 9dB when compared to stereo-mode (this is with Euphony outputs set to max). There is no adjustment for this, only adjustment that works is for PCM-mode and that just changes stereo-mode soundlevel. So to "fix" this, I have to drop PCM level 9dB so that stereo sound is set to lower level. Is there an adjustment for Euphony and Pro Logic that works with aux-1 analog mode?


----------



## ET328

SouthSyde said:


> so hows the autotune?


With PC-speakers and in home environment it worked fine but the end result sounded bad. Microphone was placed 2 feets in front of the speakers. But you should not draw any conclusions of this quick "test". Time correction measurement worked fine.


----------



## ET328

xpsvwino said:


> Can anyone confirm it the road eq will work to muffle the sounds of a nagging wife?


Yelling at the microphone didn't do much, so I guess it won't work for nagging wife either. Unless there is some secret settings menu for it, maybe something like this: you just upload a sample of the nag and the system completely removes it. It would make this DSP very popular


----------



## mattyjman

Okay, dumb question here. But I see that the H800 doesn't accept a regular sized toslink digital input. I have a Toslink Out that would go into this unit, so is this incompatible because of the digital wire, or will it only accept a proprietary alpine signal?


----------



## ErinH

it's standard toslink input.


----------



## mattyjman

^thanks... told you it was dumb


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> it's standard toslink input.


Correct. 

The only time you'll need the special cable is when connecting an Alpine W505 or W910.


----------



## rublik

Does it make a lot of difference by using optical compared to AiNet?


----------



## highly

I think Erin just posted F/R and distortion measurements of the H701 v H800 v Bitone.1 HERE


----------



## ecbmxer

rublik said:


> Does it make a lot of difference by using optical compared to AiNet?


Seems like they are actually fairly comparable, which is great for me since I just bought a INA-W900BT rather than waiting for the 910BT with optical.


----------



## ErinH

ecbmxer said:


> Seems like they are actually fairly comparable, which is great for me since I just bought a INA-W900BT rather than waiting for the 910BT with optical.


The specs certainly look like one wouldn't be missing a lot by going with the ai-net over optical. However, I know some people like the idea of "one less DAC".

Additionally, Jim keeps saying that the w910 has been upgraded with SQ in mind. So, if it is indeed better than the w900 in this regard, then it may be worth the upgrade for that alone, regardless of digital output. Remember, you're limited by the worst component. Will it be an audible difference? I don't care to discuss that personally. I did do the measurements, though, for a reason. 
I'll post up data of the w910 vs. the w505 since that's what I have on hand. If you are really interested, I could test the w900 for you to compare to the w910. But, again, I don't know how much faith you put in specs.


----------



## RAzZin

btw is the H800 already available in US online stores? Or in Europe only atm?


----------



## ErinH

I think Jim said earlier that it wouldn't be here until around August. I sourced mine from EU market.


----------



## RAzZin

well some traders might bring it to their US warehouses from Europe to have few units in stock reducing delivery time


----------



## ErinH

I just know what was mentioned here.

There can be group buys worked out if people want one, I suppose.


----------



## ErinH

Jim,
I'd appreciate your input on this:
For roadEQ, where do you suggest putting the mic? 

The problem I'm having with the install is that I'm not a "set it and forget it" guy. If I install the mic at the visor for the roadEQ it's hard for me to move it to the seat for Imprint testing. Therefore, I wonder if the differences would be negligible if I were to move the mic closer to the seat for RoadEQ. I assume RoadEQ is mostly effective for frequencies below 500hz and therefore the location of the mic isn't primarily as important as it is for Imprint. 
I'm considering even installing the mic somewhere near the headrest or the b-pillar. 

Anyway, just curious if you guys did any testing with mic placement and maybe some insight in to the process of the adjustments might help to determine non-optimal install locations.


----------



## Nathan_C

To all the Australian posters, we are similar to Jim in that we are awaiting the final adjustments to be made prior to release. I don't want to give a specific date as these things can change pretty quickly but rest assured it will be out the door the moment it gets the tick of approval. The pricing will be $899 for the H800 and $299 for the C800 controller. There will also be a package with the new D800 AV screen. 

Check out www.alpine.com.au early June for our latest Solutions Catalogue with all the details and pricing on these and other models.


----------



## RHI-SEE

Got mine today from tokospeaker. 
All double boxed so the h800 box and the c800 box sustained no damage.
I hope to get it installed in a few days and then let the fun begin.


----------



## ErinH

Mines in the car and I have a bad RCA I now have to replace. Grrr...

Oh, well. Such is (install) life. 
My w910 will he here Friday so it's going to be a mad weekend.


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> Mines in the car and I have a bad RCA I now have to replace. Grrr...
> 
> Oh, well. Such is (install) life.
> My w910 will he here Friday so it's going to be a mad weekend.


Erin, if you want we can try and set up an RMAA on the RCA outputs of your INA with a setup condition for absolute values. It'll mainly involve running a bunch of trials while moving around cables and stuff like that. 

I think it would be best to test the outputs at the highest possible headunit volume (with defeat on). And since your sound card's inputs are fairly sensitive, we'd need to put a cheap (but good) pot in-line with the outputs or better yet a voltage divider with some precision resistors. (they should be mounted as close to the load as possible not the sources, ie shortest cable you can on the soundcard input cableside of the pot.)

You can get an inexpensive Alps for a few bucks at this shop. Just page search the part number below.

RK0971221Z05 

It should be a good quality piece that won't get in the way of the results. We would still test it though on a high rez loopback with a slight dB attenuation and compare it to the straight loopback. With it you can pretty much test any head unit setting .5 volts to whatever the INA's max RMS output is. We'll then have an idea of how more realistic head unit volume settings measure instead of the never used MAX volume.

Your soundcard has an input impedance of 10Kohms _minimum_ so a 10K rating on the pot is just right.

The page has a lot of good info on how to wire it up.


----------



## ErinH

I'd like to do that but to be honest I'm more just interested in how it compares to the w505 and z110bt I've had before. 
I'm really not trying to blow you off. Just saying that I'm on a tight schedule so I don't think I'll be able to do that in the time I need to.



Jim, I don't see it covered here. Does the h800 have balanded outputs, by chance? Balanced differential? Standard RCA?


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> I'd like to do that but to be honest I'm more just interested in how it compares to the w505 and z110bt I've had before.
> I'm really not trying to blow you off. Just saying that I'm on a tight schedule so I don't think I'll be able to do that in the time I need to.
> 
> 
> 
> Jim, I don't see it covered here. Does the h800 have balanded outputs, by chance? Balanced differential? Standard RCA?


I hear ya. Well in the future we can do it once install, it'll give everyone a more real world result as well. Plus I'm sure you'd love to see if that AiNET from path for the iPod is _still_ as clean as the optical lead for the CD once installed in a car. For the H800 outs that is.


----------



## pankrok

as soon as you receive you 910 pls check if ipod can pass fully digital to the processor


----------



## t3sn4f2

pankrok said:


> as soon as you receive you 910 pls check if ipod can pass fully digital to the processor


It can't, according to Jim from alpine and some independent test. I forget which thread it's on but that latest development is not more then a week old, so you should be able to find the details very easily it you want.


----------



## ErinH

t3sn4f2 said:


> It can't, according to Jim from alpine and some independent test. I forget which thread it's on but that latest development is not more then a week old, so you should be able to find the details very easily it you want.


Yep. And someone else here checked himself and found this to be true.


----------



## ErinH

Alright, guys... to those of you who have been using the h800/c800 help me out...

Have you figured out a way to control individual _SPEAKERS _for the EQ using the controller? 

I can switch to L/R control by holding down "channel" but am stuck with 31 band _per side_ on the controller. I can also control each speaker individually on all other settings (x-over, t/a) but for some reason it won't work like that for the EQ. 

However, when I plug in the laptop I can get full control of each speaker individually. 

I'm hoping it's not a firmware issue. Maybe I'm just missing something here...


----------



## harryharry

I have just bought the H800 and have connected it to a car pc. The sound is very good. Much better than my Pioneer double din player. The processor accepts 44,1kHz, 48kHz and 96kHz in both 16bit and 24bit resolution. I have connected it via TosLink (optical cable). To control the volume I use the RUX800 but it is possible to control the volume via the Alpine software on the PC too. (A clever programer could create a volume control in Windows to avoid the use of the RUX800)

Do anyone know what the internal clock speed is on the processor. Is it the source clockspeed or something else?


----------



## t3sn4f2

harryharry said:


> I have just bought the H800 and have connected it to a car pc. The sound is very good. Much better than my Pioneer double din player. The processor accepts 44,1kHz, 48kHz and 96kHz in both 16bit and 24bit resolution. I have connected it via TosLink (optical cable). To control the volume I use the RUX800 but it is possible to control the volume via the Alpine software on the PC too. (A clever programer could create a volume control in Windows to avoid the use of the RUX800)
> 
> Do anyone know what the internal clock speed is on the processor. Is it the source clockspeed or something else?


Should be 48kHz, as that's what all other processors I've seen out there run at. 

I'd love to run some test on the sample rate converter in one of this, maybe an MiniDigi ASRC modules would do a little better then whatever the H800 has inside now to up-convert from 44.1 to 48kHz.


----------



## highly

harryharry said:


> To control the volume I use the RUX800 but it is possible to control the volume via the Alpine software on the PC too. (A clever programer could create a volume control in Windows to avoid the use of the RUX800)
> 
> Do anyone know what the internal clock speed is on the processor. Is it the source clockspeed or something else?


I was pretty sure that someone developed a basic AI-net capable hardware/software solution for the PC on the H700/701. I would expect the AI-net compatibility for volume would remain intact...

Just a thought.


----------



## pankrok

it is not Ainet in this case, he is using the usb cable (correct me if I m wrong) 

this ainet interface for 701 should work fine but the case is very old and required pcbs which I do not if will be available (+ that require a proper plugin)

if you find solution for this and 800 trully accepts 24/96 signal I will be greatful to hear the news!


----------



## highly

pankrok said:


> it is not Ainet in this case, he is using the usb cable (correct me if I m wrong)


You are correct, he is postulating that the USB connection and software could be used. He appears to actually be using the C800 currently, however.



pankrok said:


> this ainet interface for 701 should work fine but the case is very old and required pcbs which I do not if will be available (+ that require a proper plugin)


Yes, but I believe it is a valid alternative to allow volume control without the use of the H800 or the USB/tuning software. this would allow volume control from whatever he is using as a native CarPC interface. This seems to me a reasonable benefit.



pankrok said:


> if you find solution for this and 800 trully accepts 24/96 signal I will be greatful to hear the news!


Only presenting possible options that may not have been considered. I don't use a CarPC as source so it's not something I would actively pursue. Since the AiNet interface already exists I would probably look in that direction if I did. Minor software tweaks or bus monitoring would be cake as most of the hard work is already done, and the integration aspect is always an important point for me. It may be a long way to go for just volume control, though, as the 800 is not (as far as we know) configurable over AiNet as the H700/701 was. A pity, but for carpc use the USB/software route is clearly superior for that control function. AiNet just seems more reasonable for volume control as you would not have to swap apps every time you wanted to change the volume.

Just my opinion which as a non-carpc user is probably of no consequence to anyone.

-Todd


----------



## t3sn4f2

What good is a high resolution format going into a processor that is going to down-sample to 48kHz? Sure you'll get a 24bit digital noise floor advantage on the analog outputs of the H800 versus a 16bit, but that's not going to be audible with music since the noise floor in ANY recording is many tens of decibels louder then the noise floor of even a 16bit CD format. Plus you would need to have the volume set to max for that to even be a consideration. And don't forget the 24bit formats gets bumped back down even more on the analog outputs which for this processor is something like 20bits of noise performance.

High rez formats and players, for those that think they hear a difference, will only have the potential to come to light is there is only a source, preamp, and amp in the signal chain. And only those components can have a dynamic range great then a CD format. Any processor will negate that when it again down-converts the sample rate like they do in studios when finalized a CD.

And no every little bit doesn't help in this case. A high resolution recording with a background noise floor of -60dB will not get any quieter if the analog output noise drops from -96dB to -115dB. It's simply a summation of music powers. -60dB plus -90dB equals ~-60dB, so how is something going to get quieter with a lower background noise when it never got noisier in the first place.


----------



## harryharry

pankrok said:


> it is not Ainet in this case, he is using the usb cable (correct me if I m wrong)
> 
> this ainet interface for 701 should work fine but the case is very old and required pcbs which I do not if will be available (+ that require a proper plugin)
> 
> if you find solution for this and 800 trully accepts 24/96 signal I will be greatful to hear the news!


The H800 supports 24/96 via toslink. 

If the internal sample rate is 48kHz it might be better to convert 44.1 kHz to 48kHz before I send it from the CarPC. I will test this. (Anyway if the conversion is done using good algoritms it can be very difficult to hear the difference when up-converting.)


----------



## pankrok

Supports hires by downsampling? Hope not. As helix already supports 24/192 formats I hope that alpine clock is 96 . sure about 48?


----------



## ErinH

t3sn4f2 said:


> Erin, if you want we can try and set up an RMAA on the RCA outputs of your INA with a setup condition for absolute values. It'll mainly involve running a bunch of trials while moving around cables and stuff like that.
> 
> I think it would be best to test the outputs at the highest possible headunit volume (with defeat on). And since your sound card's inputs are fairly sensitive, we'd need to put a cheap (but good) pot in-line with the outputs or better yet a voltage divider with some precision resistors. (they should be mounted as close to the load as possible not the sources, ie shortest cable you can on the soundcard input cableside of the pot.)
> 
> You can get an inexpensive Alps for a few bucks at this shop. Just page search the part number below.
> 
> RK0971221Z05
> 
> It should be a good quality piece that won't get in the way of the results. We would still test it though on a high rez loopback with a slight dB attenuation and compare it to the straight loopback. With it you can pretty much test any head unit setting .5 volts to whatever the INA's max RMS output is. We'll then have an idea of how more realistic head unit volume settings measure instead of the never used MAX volume.
> 
> Your soundcard has an input impedance of 10Kohms _minimum_ so a 10K rating on the pot is just right.
> 
> The page has a lot of good info on how to wire it up.


I may be game. Is all I need the part you listed and some RCAs patched off it? If so, that part is only a few bucks. I'll order it today and have it for when I test the P99.


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> I may be game. Is all I need the part you listed and some RCAs patched off it? If so, that part is only a few bucks. I'll order it today and have it for when I test the P99.


Yeah, look at the bottom of the page in the last link I sent and you'll see a diagram of how to wire it. Don't forget to do a highrez loopback with out with that part before anything to test that it is only attenuating and nothing more (ie screwing the signal somehow). No more then a couple dB below rightmarks -1dB optimum though. Just enough to introduce the pots and cables electrical properties into the signal chain.

And again, pot to load cable should be as short as possible and all cables should be of very good quality like your car's RCAs.


----------



## ErinH

think radio shack would carry these?

Edit: Yep
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062357#

So, the pot is all I need? No knob for adjustments or anything? 
I need two, though, correct? One for each left and right? If so, I'm swingin by RS today.

google is my friend...


> Use a stereo audio taper potentiometer for building an In-Line Volume Control. Split some audio cables in half and wire them to the pot as shown above. *An audio cable is required for each of the stereo potentiometer sections, (one for the Left channel, and one for the Right channel).*
> *The inexpensive stereo pots and audio cables from Radio Shack work well for making this "Passive Preamp Tester".*
> If using this In-Line Volume Control still yields you enough "headroom" (meaning you can still turn the system up louder than you need), then you can get even better performance by using a Goldpoint Level Control box (passive preamp).


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> think radio shack would carry these?
> 
> Edit: Yep
> 10K-Ohm Audio-Taper Potentiometer - RadioShack.com
> 
> So, the pot is all I need? No knob for adjustments or anything?
> I need two, though, correct? One for each left and right? If so, I'm swingin by RS today.
> 
> google is my friend...


No knob, the shaft is all you need like in an amp gain with the little pots.

I can't comment on that one, dunno if the 20% tolerance is a bad thing for this app, or really for any quality signal manipulation period. If it's just a resistant tolerance and does not add noise, then since it's a mono pot, you can adjust them to come together at the same attenuation. You'll now for sure what you have with the loopback test. 

Just remembered that they alway recommend a lower value then the load. In you case that is the same as these pots, and IF that tolerance also applies to the value then you could be looking at a resistance swing from 8k ohm (which isn't bad) to a peak of 12k ohm (which would put it into the zone they don't recommend.

Try it out and see what you get.


----------



## ErinH

Well, RS's site shows 5k pots, too, so would that be recommended over the 10k version?


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> Well, RS's site shows 5k pots, too, so would that be recommended over the 10k version?


I'm pretty sure it will work, might wanna ask someone else to make sure.


----------



## t3sn4f2

I'd get and wait for the alps though.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Voltage Dividers and Attenuators


----------



## asawendo

bikinpunk said:


> Alright, guys... to those of you who have been using the h800/c800 help me out...
> 
> Have you figured out a way to control individual _SPEAKERS _for the EQ using the controller?
> 
> I can switch to L/R control by holding down "channel" but am stuck with 31 band _per side_ on the controller. I can also control each speaker individually on all other settings (x-over, t/a) but for some reason it won't work like that for the EQ.
> 
> However, when I plug in the laptop I can get full control of each speaker individually.
> 
> I'm hoping it's not a firmware issue. Maybe I'm just missing something
> here...


Yeah Erin 

I wondering about that, is it limitation from the RUX itself or is it firmware issue?! Maybe I can explore this to fulfill my curiousity. Since I have two PXA H800 already.

Also from reading the user manual, it is stated you can not set imprint from RUX. You only can do that by using pc or laptop. But for Road EQ feature you can!


----------



## ErinH

looks like I've got a bad RCA output on mine... 

Swapping over rca's proved this true because it follows the same pre-out (Channel 4). A GLI doesn't help it. I built new RCAs and had the same issue. I've contacted TokoSpeaker about getting it replaced. We'll see what happens. He said he's an authorized dealer so hopefully it shouldn't be too much trouble.


*Edit: I may have jumped the gun. It may very well be the ai-net cable.*
When I switch the source to CD (which, I'm running optical out) the noise is not there at all. Switch back to analog (ipod, radio) it's there and loud.
Unfortunately I don't have another ai=net cable to swap out so I'll have to wait until I can get one.


----------



## highly

Hope it's the AI-net cable, but it sounds like it is by your explanation. 

Good luck!

-T


----------



## ErinH

yea. who knows... grrrrrr....

wish I had a spare one to run on the outside instead of ripping up the carpet.


----------



## ErinH

Looks like the entire right stage pre-amps are messed up. With every channel's settings set wide open I get the buzz on each of the Right channel preouts (channels 2, 4, 6, 8) when I used a known speaker and connected the amplifier rca input to each of the h800's outputs. Oddly enough, the subwoofer preout (ch 7) buzzes, too. I'm wondering if the right channels are in a pair on the board and 7/8 are paired together, thus giving me buzz in all but the left channels.
I've used two different ai-net cables now and get the same results. I've checked all the settings I can to see if there's something I'm missing but it looks good to go. Out of the car I get the same result. 
When I switch the source to CD the noise stops entirely. It's somewhere in the analog chain and is only on the right stage and subwoofer pre-outs. I've done all the troubleshooting I can; I can't determine that it could be anything other than the unit itself. Go figure, right? 

I contacted TokoSpeaker about this and he's asked me to send it to Alpine in Indonesia for warranty but I don't speak Indonesian and have no idea how to go about explaining the issue and getting information for returning it. 
He said he's an authorized dealer when I asked so hopefully he can take care of me. 

I'll keep you guys posted...

Edit:
Reset the unit. All was fine... no noise. UNTIL I set the DSP back up. As soon as I set it up as a 3-way+Sub I got the noise back in the same channels again.

I swear to all that is holy... I'm quitting car audio. 
(watch the F/S threads if you think I'm kidding...)


Edit #2:
Since I had a 701 on hand I figured I'd see how it did in the car. Dropped it in, using the same ai-net cable and it works fine. No noise at all even with the gains MAXED out. 
So, on the bright side... the h701 sure does sound nice. 



I hope you other early adopters aren't having the same issue.


----------



## doitor

bikinpunk said:


> I swear to all that is holy... I'm quitting car audio.


Oh you copy cat.
On a serious note, man that sucks.

J.


----------



## ET328

About that Euphony level difference, it's not like I wrote earlier (I was testing with master volume set to max). 

Instead it's like this: master volume does not raise output level after -10dB when you are in Euphony or Pro Logic mode. Adjustment still works but the actual output level stays the same between -10 and 0. In stereo and rear fill modes it works correctly. 

Is this a bug or weird design feature?


----------



## doitor

I'll wait for the PXA-H800.1

J.


----------



## ErinH

doitor said:


> I'll wait for the PXA-H800.1
> 
> J.


I actually lol'd.


On that note, mine is boxed up and going back to the dealer today. He's been helpful with getting this resolved. Hopefully the turnaround time isn't too long.


----------



## rain27

bikinpunk said:


> I swear to all that is holy... I'm quitting car audio.
> (watch the F/S threads if you think I'm kidding...)


Waiting patiently for the sale threads, although I doubt I'll see them.

But if you figure out how to quit car audio, please give me some advice on how to do that too please.


----------



## ET328

Again in Euphony mode: when you adjust balance, for example to R2, you must keep master volume under -12.5. If you raise master volume to -10, you will notice that balance shifts to 0 position (in output level, not the adjustment value). Also sounds like fader also resets to 0 if you adjust master volume to 0. In stereo-mode this works as it should.


----------



## highly

So besides the volume dependent stage repositioning 'feature', how does the Euphony bass management and center channel steering fare? Have you been able to listen to it loud and long enough to get a feel for how well it performs its intended duties?

-Todd


----------



## ErinH

rain27 said:


> Waiting patiently for the sale threads, although I doubt I'll see them.


I'm operating in stealth mode.


----------



## highly

So your wife doesn't know you're working on the car again?


----------



## ET328

highly said:


> So besides the volume dependent stage repositioning 'feature', how does the Euphony bass management and center channel steering fare? Have you been able to listen to it loud and long enough to get a feel for how well it performs its intended duties?


I just got RUX today and did a quick install replacing H701 so I have no solid info how Euphony performs. I'll have to spend some time to adjust the system first.


----------



## highly

ET328 said:


> I just got RUX today and did a quick install replacing H701 so I have no solid info how Euphony performs. I'll have to spend some time to adjust the system first.



:snacks:


Thanks!


----------



## RHI-SEE

apparently the software for the bug preventing it from being released in the US and Aus/NZ was released overnight here in Australia and alpine australia are now taking orders for the H800. 
Just what i heard. 
Also, apparently i cannot receive the update for mine via Alpine Australia, i have to get it through whom i purchased it from (tokospeaker)


----------



## skywolf75

RHI-SEE said:


> apparently the software for the bug preventing it from being released in the US and Aus/NZ was released overnight here in Australia and alpine australia are now taking orders for the H800.
> Just what i heard.
> Also, apparently i cannot receive the update for mine via Alpine Australia, i have to get it through whom i purchased it from (tokospeaker)


You mean there is an patch for the H800 firmware or the sound manager?


----------



## RAzZin

highly said:


> So your wife doesn't know you're working on the car again?


lol


----------



## ErinH

RHI-SEE said:


> apparently the software for the bug preventing it from being released in the US and Aus/NZ was released overnight here in Australia and alpine australia are now taking orders for the H800.
> Just what i heard.
> Also, apparently i cannot receive the update for mine via Alpine Australia, i have to get it through whom i purchased it from (tokospeaker)


that's good to know.

when you get it, could you post it up on rapidhsare and send the link?


----------



## ET328

asawendo said:


> Did anyone notice a small "digital artifact" when using graphic eq especially in low bass section? It sound like a soft rattle... It's gone when I push defeat on. By the way I am using non ai net head unit which is sound monitor cdt 450x and sony cdx c90


I think I just noticed it with parameter eq. Bass sound modulates higher artifacts, you can easily hear it with songs that contain solo bass guitar or similar sections. 

I noticed it with this song: YouTube - Nu Shooz - I Can't Wait
First 10 seconds contain just the sound that brings out the problem. 

I'll have to check and verify that the problem really is in H800. But if it is, then this is a major problem!


----------



## AVIDEDTR

doitor said:


> I'll wait for the PXA-H800.1
> 
> J.


I'll wait for the PS8 - TYVM


----------



## Nathan_C

RHI-SEE said:


> apparently the software for the bug preventing it from being released in the US and Aus/NZ was released overnight here in Australia and alpine australia are now taking orders for the H800.
> Just what i heard.
> Also, apparently i cannot receive the update for mine via Alpine Australia, i have to get it through whom i purchased it from (tokospeaker)


 Hi All,
Just to clarify, there has been no firmware update in the Australian model that will be released today. The update spoken about will be available to all customers as per usual when it does get released. 

Nathan
Alpine Australia


----------



## highly

ET328 said:


> I think I just noticed it with parameter eq. Bass sound modulates higher artifacts, you can easily hear it with songs that contain solo bass guitar or similar sections.
> 
> I noticed it with this song: YouTube - Nu Shooz - I Can't Wait
> First 10 seconds contain just the sound that brings out the problem.
> 
> I'll have to check and verify that the problem really is in H800. But if it is, then this is a major problem!


Great freaking 'period' track. Thanks for that. 

Oh, and sorry to hear of the new biton...err H800 problem. 

Bet this one does it too, then?


----------



## ryyo

highly said:


> Great freaking 'period' track. Thanks for that.
> 
> Oh, and sorry to hear of the new biton...err H800 problem.
> 
> Bet this one does it too, then?


Just saw her in concert on Saturday


----------



## ErinH

my h800 went out today for return/warranty. Hopefully the replacement works better...


----------



## kyheng

That's bad.....


----------



## ET328

highly said:


> Oh, and sorry to hear of the new biton...err H800 problem.
> 
> Bet this one does it too, then?


Yes, that one is even worse! 

I did more testing: I burned an audio-CD with 10 second samples of both songs and carried my home CD-player (Sony X33ES) to my car. I hooked it with analog and digital cables. The problem is present with both signal types and it's there always when graphic eq or parametric eq is switched on. No need to adjust them, it happens even in 0 positions. Problem disappears as soon as you switch the eq off, you don't have to use DSP's defeat/bypass setting.

I'll try to find a way to record this and upload samples somewhere. 

So, is this a DSP-software bug or is the hardware flawed? Or should I look the user manual for small print saying not to listen bass tracks while using the eq...


----------



## ErinH

^ disconcerting at best...

Like I said, I hope mine works fine afterward. This will be the last time I become an early adopter. Should've learned my lesson with the bit1 but alas, I didn't. Shame on me.

What I did hear I really liked. But, I just paid $50 to ship this thing back to Indonesia for warranty. I hope there's not a need to do so again.


----------



## ET328

I have now uploaded .wav samples of the EQ problem. I hope these are downloadable without problems or file limits. These were recorded with laptop build-in soundcard and source file was originally mp3, so don't expect perfect quality. PXA-H800 was in stereo mode, signal via digital input, tcr was on.

EQ Off:
PXA-H800-EQ-Off.wav

Graphic EQ on, all settings at 0 db:
PXA-H800-EQ-On.wav

Graphic EQ on, 50Hz setting at +12 db:
PXA-H800-EQ-On-12dB.wav

The ultimate processor with sound quality of the highest standard....?


----------



## ErinH

Honestly, I couldn't hear a difference between eq off and +12dB. Maybe I suck at hearing or maybe this laptop's speakers suck...

I will say that if you're noticing the issue at +12dB then that's likely much more attributed to the fact that you're losing headroom ... you're sending your amp the boosted signal. Alpine may or may not attenuate other channels to counter for this like someone said they do with their single din units such as the 9887. Not sure what the EQ On setting alone does, though...


----------



## ET328

Try again, I can hear the problem even with my laptop speakers. Try with headphones and once you notice it, you will hear it also with speakers. It's not a headroom problem.


----------



## highly

Wow. That's definitely unacceptable. Clearly there is a problem here, but at least this one sounds like it might be in the realm of being fixed in software unlike the problems Erin was experiencing. Definitely some bugs here that need to be sorted out. I find it hard to believe that Alpine would be shipping these anywhere with issues like this still evident.

Agreed, and when Erin relistens he will too.


----------



## ErinH

Yea. I listened again with the volume a bit higher. sucks, dude. I didn't notice an issue with mine. but, then again, I didn't critically listen, either.


I was assured the problem with the US version that was keeping it from being sent out was not an issue with the product itself. Had that not been the case I would not have purchased one yet. Not so sure that's the case now, but if it is, I hope alpine has realized these bugs in the meantime so the US releases don't have these issues.


----------



## Hiace200

Somebody selling alpine pxa-h800 together with rux-c800 at only $4,500-HKD in Hongkong.

http://www.28car.com/par_dsp.php?h_id=163759&h_vw=y


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> I have now uploaded .wav samples of the EQ problem. I hope these are downloadable without problems or file limits. These were recorded with laptop build-in soundcard and source file was originally mp3, so don't expect perfect quality. PXA-H800 was in stereo mode, signal via digital input, tcr was on.
> 
> EQ Off:
> PXA-H800-EQ-Off.wav
> 
> Graphic EQ on, all settings at 0 db:
> PXA-H800-EQ-On.wav
> 
> Graphic EQ on, 50Hz setting at +12 db:
> PXA-H800-EQ-On-12dB.wav
> 
> The ultimate processor with sound quality of the highest standard....?


Is the problem sound the increased white noise type sound from the left speaker?


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> Is the problem sound the increased white noise type sound from the left speaker?


Yes, additional white noise that modulates in tune of the bass sounds on both speakers/channels. Time correction skews the stereo image, I forgot to switch it off before I recorded the samples.

Here is the last sample with lowered bass and raised treble:
PXA-H800-EQ-On-12dB-mod.wav


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> Yes, additional white noise that modulates in tune of the bass sounds on both speakers/channels. Time correction skews the stereo image, I forgot to switch it off before I recorded the samples.
> 
> Here is the last sample with lowered bass and raised treble:
> PXA-H800-EQ-On-12dB-mod.wav


K, and just to be clear, it doesn't go away completely either when you defeat correct? Just goes back to the amount it was originally, ie bass still modulates white noise just at a lower amount.


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> K, and just to be clear, it doesn't go away completely either when you defeat correct? Just goes back to the amount it was originally, ie bass still modulates white noise just at a lower amount.


There is no white noise (or bass modulation of noise) when EQ is switched off. EQ just somehow "creates" it, even when it's adjustments are at 0dB positions. 

I'll try next with test tones, burst signals and drum tracks.


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> There is no white noise (or bass modulation of noise) when EQ is switched off. EQ just somehow "creates" it, even when it's adjustments are at 0dB positions.
> 
> I'll try next with test tones, burst signals and drum tracks.


oh oh, you're worrying me now. I can clearly hear it on the eq off track on my pc with a very good soundcard and headphones.


----------



## t3sn4f2

What track and album specifically is that? I'm going to try and download it and see if it is in the original as well. Maybe the H800 is adding it even with the eq off, just at a lower level.


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> oh oh, you're worrying me now. I can clearly hear it on the eq off track on my pc with a very good soundcard and headphones.


Oh yes, I just listened with headphones and it's there.. But I'm not sure if it's H800 doing it or the laptop's soundcard. Also the original mp3 has a little bit of the same problem.


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> Oh yes, I just listened with headphones and it's there.. But I'm not sure if it's H800 doing it or the laptop's soundcard. Also the original mp3 has a little bit of the same problem.


Well I'm assuming it's lisa lisa "I wonder if I take you home" but in the rerecorded version I found, it did not have the hiss. Dunno if the original has it.


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> What track and album specifically is that? I'm going to try and download it and see if it is in the original as well. Maybe the H800 is adding it even with the eq off, just at a lower level.


Lisa Lisa & Cult Jam - I Wonder If I Take You Home

I uploaded the original 8 second sample here (made to wav from 320k mp3)
Original_sample.wav


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> Lisa Lisa & Cult Jam - I Wonder If I Take You Home
> 
> I uploaded the original 8 second sample here (made to wav from 320k mp3)
> Original_sample.wav


K so the original is completely clean, same as the other versions I heard. It appears the DSP is doing it regardless of the settings. Just by simply running it through the H800.


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> K so the original is completely clean, same as the other versions I heard. It appears the DSP is doing it regardless of the settings. Just by simply running it through the H800.


Or laptop's buildin soundcard is doing it. I'll verify this and check H800's signal output with headphones. And I'll do the same bass tests with my H701.


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> Or laptop's buildin soundcard is doing it. I'll verify this and check H800's signal output with headphones. And I'll do the same bass tests with my H701.


I thought about that, but I thought the reason you recorded the output with the soundcard in the first place was that you heard the noise in the normal setup?


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> I thought about that, but I thought the reason you recorded the output with the soundcard in the first place was that you heard the noise in the normal setup?


When listening in my car I only heard the noise with EQ on (that is my normal setup). So I thought it disappeared with EQ off and because of it didn't try EQ off with higher output levels.


----------



## t3sn4f2

ET328 said:


> When listening in my car I only heard the noise with EQ on (that is my normal setup). So I thought it disappeared with EQ off and because of it didn't try EQ off with higher output levels.


Test it out anyway then, but if you heard the noise in the car that is not there in the origianl recording (as we've determined) and the soundcard was not in the signal chain then, it can't possibly be the soundcard. Has to be the H800.

By the way, what input option (ie digital, ainet, etc.)were you using with when you got these results. I forget.

I'd be interested to see an RMAA THD run of 80Hz or so at -1dB instead of the default 1kHz at -3dB. We could possible see a big jump in the noise floor compared to the regular test. 

Erin, you game when you get yours back?


----------



## ET328

I was using digital input when I recorded those WAVs. Normally I use analog input, noise problem is the same with both. 

Tomorrow I will remove H800 from my car and do measurements with sine tones, burst tones and check signal spectrum with TrueRTA.


----------



## Pulse-R

Some early Behringer DCX's had the same problem - it was a firmware fix for them. Hopefully not in the new-released H800
(since I got mine today local purchase in Australia)


----------



## ET328

I'm now testing the H800 with my home stereo system. Still using the same Lisa Lisa 8 second sample... I can now easily and very quickly compare sound quality between CD-player's analog output and H800's front channel (CH3&4) output. CD-player is feeding digital signal to H800. Listening is done with headphones. H800 is powered with 12V 7.2A battery, like the one used inside UPS.

Looks like it goes like this: 
There is no noisefloor problem when H800 is on (i.e. defeat off). There is no difference in sound quality between direct sound from the CD-player and sound via H800. Putting H800 to defeat on makes no difference. 

Switching on and adjusting time correction (TCR) makes no difference, all is still fine.

But when you go to x-over and switch HPF on (for example 20Hz, 36dB) it causes pumping noisefloor. That is the low level noise that was in the EQ off sample I posted yesterday. Only 6dB filter step is clean, all others have the problem. 

GEQ & PEQ causes major noisefloor issues.

More tests later...


----------



## ET328

Switched to sine waves: 180Hz - 30Hz causes major white noise artifacts with EQ on, but 20Hz causes very weird middle range tone.


----------



## ErinH

is your issue like a buzzing noise?
is it on all channels? You'll have to open up the filters (or turn defeat on) to find out this.


I had all sorts of issues out of the 2, 4, 6, 7, & 8 channels. Which is why I sent mine back...


----------



## ET328

Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ off:
H800_20Hz_Eq_OFF.png

Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ on:
H800_20Hz_Eq_ON.png

Wav file, 20Hz, 2 seconds EQ off, 2 seconds EQ on:
20hz_Eq_OFF-ON.wav


----------



## subwoofery

ET328 said:


> Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ off:
> H800_20Hz_Eq_OFF.png
> 
> Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ on:
> H800_20Hz_Eq_ON.png
> 
> Wav file, 20Hz, 2 seconds EQ off, 2 seconds EQ on:
> 20hz_Eq_OFF-ON.wav


Ok... Now that is ugly  

Kelvin


----------



## ET328

I switched testing my old PXA-H701 and there are no problems when tested with the same signals and setup. Very clean results and switching EQ on makes no difference in noise floor.

Makes me wonder why, oh why, did I decide to "upgrade"...


----------



## ET328

bikinpunk said:


> is your issue like a buzzing noise?
> is it on all channels? You'll have to open up the filters (or turn defeat on) to find out this.


No buzzing noises, all channels are silent.


----------



## ErinH

interesting. 

sucks, man. I hear you on "upgrading".


----------



## Petter

Not pretty. 

How does it look like if you with EQ ON set the 20hz band to -20dB? Are the hiss/jitter freq or amp dependant?
Or with EQ On and flat but set the sinus to 1k?




ET328 said:


> Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ off:
> H800_20Hz_Eq_OFF.png
> 
> Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ on:
> H800_20Hz_Eq_ON.png
> 
> Wav file, 20Hz, 2 seconds EQ off, 2 seconds EQ on:
> 20hz_Eq_OFF-ON.wav


----------



## asawendo

ET328 said:


> Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ off:
> H800_20Hz_Eq_OFF.png
> 
> Picture of TrueRTA spectrum, 20Hz sine tone, EQ on:
> H800_20Hz_Eq_ON.png
> 
> Wav file, 20Hz, 2 seconds EQ off, 2 seconds EQ on:
> 20hz_Eq_OFF-ON.wav


Yeah definitely the same problem, I have two Alpine PXA H800 and one of them very clean the other have noise problem like your samples records


----------



## Petter

Intresting. 
Can it be some bad compression artefacts from RoadEQ interference?

Limited to a certain batch in serialnumber or really poor yield of DSPs?
They somehow slipped through QC process. 




asawendo said:


> Yeah definitely the same problem, I have two Alpine PXA H800 and one of them very clean the other have noise problem like your samples records


----------



## robdridan

Jim.... are you out there ? Can you comment on what these guys are finding- given you stated "Acoustically, it is perfect, just some minor UI bugs" this seems to be in contradiction to what is being found. I'm so keen to buy this product, but concerned about noise issues after the trouble i had with my 701


----------



## ET328

asawendo said:


> Yeah definitely the same problem, I have two Alpine PXA H800 and one of them very clean the other have noise problem like your samples records


What firmware version do you have on those H800s? Are both the same version? 

Version is shown when you start the Sound manager software or via Option-menu. I have version 1.001, Sound manager is 1.000.


----------



## ET328

Petter said:


> Can it be some bad compression artefacts from RoadEQ interference?


RoadEQ was not ON. But since it also operates at bass frequencies, I assume it will also add another layer of bass modulation noise... I'll check it.


----------



## ET328

Petter said:


> How does it look like if you with EQ ON set the 20hz band to -20dB? Are the hiss/jitter freq or amp dependant?
> Or with EQ On and flat but set the sinus to 1k?


The 20Hz sample wav was made with G.EQ on, I noticed that P.EQ doesn't cause so severe 1-2Khz weird tones. If I use 20Hz sine tone and adjust 20Hz P.EQ setting, digital hiss seems to be about the same but the adjustment changes the amount of weird tones. Digital hiss is lower the higher frequency you go, i.e. at 30Hz it is very bad, 150Hz pretty good.

I can't hear any problems with 1Khz tone, sounds like frequency has to be 250Hz or lower. But I haven't checked signal spectrum.


----------



## asawendo

ET328 said:


> The 20Hz sample wav was made with G.EQ on, I noticed that P.EQ doesn't cause so severe 1-2Khz weird tones. If I use 20Hz sine tone and adjust 20Hz P.EQ setting, digital hiss seems to be about the same but the adjustment changes the amount of weird tones. Digital hiss is lower the higher frequency you go, i.e. at 30Hz it is very bad, 150Hz pretty good.
> 
> I can't hear any problems with 1Khz tone, sounds like frequency has to be 250Hz or lower. But I haven't checked signal spectrum.


I tried to boost G.Eq in 20 and 30 Hz by 9db and the noise problem getting worse.... Also tried to swap PXA H800 with H701 with the same setting and the problem was gone.


----------



## Petter

What if you do enable it but without connecting the REQ mic and then run the 20Hz test. Do the RTA curve look the same as with REQ Off?
Or even better feed the REQ mic with the 20 or 30Hz tone and measure the noise on the output. 

I'm thinking something like bad internal wiring or poor smd soldering causing the H800 to compensate based on the signal itself instead on REQ input sounds. Does this make sense? Nothing else does 



ET328 said:


> RoadEQ was not ON. But since it also operates at bass frequencies, I assume it will also add another layer of bass modulation noise... I'll check it.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Why are people still trying to troubleshoot this thing? 

We already determined more then a few must be broke as ****, what more do we need to know?


----------



## ErinH

^ I spent 4 hours and finally came to the realization that mine was DOA. Off it went.

No idea what will happen if the replacement is the same story. Sounds like it'll be a return for refund... I know I don't want this and I'm sure the dealer doesn't either.


----------



## t3sn4f2

bikinpunk said:


> ^ I spent 4 hours and finally came to the realization that mine was DOA. Off it went.
> 
> No idea what will happen if the replacement is the same story. Sounds like it'll be a return for refund... I know I don't want this and I'm sure the dealer doesn't either.


Hopefully it's a firmware fix, but man that is unlikely since a problem _this_ big could not have sneaked past into production. Hopefully it did though or there's gonna be an H800.1 soon.


----------



## ET328

Petter said:


> What if you do enable it but without connecting the REQ mic and then run the 20Hz test. Do the RTA curve look the same as with REQ Off?
> Or even better feed the REQ mic with the 20 or 30Hz tone and measure the noise on the output.
> 
> I'm thinking something like bad internal wiring or poor smd soldering causing the H800 to compensate based on the signal itself instead on REQ input sounds. Does this make sense? Nothing else does


I'll test RoadEQ but just for the noise i.e. if it adds even more white noise. I think that RoadEQ has nothing to do with this problem. It's a DSP problem, if this is not happening with all units, then there are units with different firmware or bad DSP chip patch or with different DSP revision that needs code changes.


----------



## ET328

t3sn4f2 said:


> We already determined more then a few must be broke as ****, what more do we need to know?


I'd still like to know what firmware version is used in those problem free units. Are all v1.001 and it's just bad luck if you get a broken one? Maybe these units are made by several production plants and one is producing bad units?


----------



## evo9

robdridan said:


> Jim.... are you out there ? Can you comment on what these guys are finding- given you stated "Acoustically, it is perfect, just some minor UI bugs" this seems to be in contradiction to what is being found. I'm so keen to buy this product, but concerned about noise issues after the trouble i had with my 701


 He is in duck and run mode at this point! I am sure his answer to the Erin will be............................................ you should have waited for the USA version. I cant comment on the version you got.






.


----------



## ErinH

I contacted him before I purchased mine... I'd certainly hope his reply wouldn't be as such...


----------



## SAM77H

and I thought the 800 would be the nail in bitones coffin...........
I didnt expect this but am glad I have held off for now.


----------



## bee200sx

I'm not sure if this has been asked, but is this issue with the noise limited to a few ppl or is everyone who has the H800 having the same issue.


----------



## Pulse-R

Mine has same problems as listed.

Back it goes


----------



## ErinH

interesting...

Where did you get yours?

Sounds like we're all in the same boat.


----------



## bee200sx

so the best way to identify the noise is by using 20hz test tone? Is it really obvious?


----------



## ET328

bee200sx said:


> so the best way to identify the noise is by using 20hz test tone? Is it really obvious?


At 20Hz it's very obvious with G.EQ on. At that frequency it's not just white noise, it's also weird midrange tones. Listen to the samples I have uploaded.


----------



## ET328

I just reset the unit, it didn't help with the bass white noise problem.

But looks like Euphony works now correctly i.e. max volume is not 10dB lower than in stereo mode, volume adjusts to 0dB (previously adjusting after -10dB didn't have any effect to output level) and balance stays in correct position even when volume is adjusted to 0dB. 

I also tested with RoadEQ, it has no effect to the white noise. I.e. no noise when RoadEQ is on, not even when you yell at the microphone and RoadEQ adjusts sound levels.


----------



## Petter

All that's left in this mess is to hear what alpine says about it. 
It's a bit worrying that there quite a few even though not all with these symptoms.


----------



## mmiller

I really hope that you guys are taken care of.....


----------



## robdridan

I still want to hear the "acoustically its perfect" definition.


----------



## bee200sx

so any other reports on units sold locally ie from Australia or America via distributors having the same noise issue? Or is it limited to those who purchased the very first batch?


----------



## nomed

For those who spend 1000$ for the unit, eat your hands :
2011 Alpine PXA-H800 Audio Processor Replace PXA-H701 | eBay


----------



## subwoofery

nomed said:


> For those who spend 1000$ for the unit, eat your hands :
> 2011 Alpine PXA-H800 Audio Processor Replace PXA-H701 | eBay


^ even at that price I wouldn't buy it until they fix the HUGE bug... :worried:

Kelvin


----------



## ErinH

nomed said:


> For those who spend 1000$ for the unit, eat your hands :
> 2011 Alpine PXA-H800 Audio Processor Replace PXA-H701 | eBay


what's scary is...
Imagine buying that and having the same issue most of us are now having. Is that ebay place going to replace your h800 or get it taken care of under warranty? Typically no. I'd certainly ask them about their status as an alpine dealer and the ability to help me out should the unit be bad.

Personally, when I'm buying something new like this, I go the authorized route. If I want to wait a few months/year for things to settle then un-authorized is less of a concern. I do know a LOT of poeple were left with $600-700 holes in their pockets when the bitone catastrophe hit. 

Buyer beware, that's all I'm saying...


----------



## nomed

bikinpunk said:


> what's scary is...
> Imagine buying that and having the same issue most of us are now having. Is that ebay place going to replace your h800 or get it taken care of under warranty? Typically no. I'd certainly ask them about their status as an alpine dealer and the ability to help me out should the unit be bad.
> 
> Personally, when I'm buying something new like this, I go the authorized route. If I want to wait a few months/year for things to settle then un-authorized is less of a concern. I do know a LOT of poeple were left with $600-700 holes in their pockets when the bitone catastrophe hit.
> 
> Buyer beware, that's all I'm saying...


I have no intentions of buying or recommend to buy this unit.
I have only pointed alternative price tag.

This is why I use carpc as source and dsp. One issue and format\restore will cure it. hehehe
The only problem with it is lack of auto tuning vst plugin....


----------



## nomed

BTW
They do offer warranty. I wonder if they aware of the bug in their product... :laugh: 



Code:


All products will have one year sent back warranty.

All products are brand new and factory sealed

All products are fully checked and inspected before shipping out.

Payment Method

By PayPal. (by e-check, credit card )

Please verify your Paypal Account and confirm your detail shipping address when making payments.

Products will be held normally for 3 days after payment is received by Paypal.

Products will be sent after all the payments are cleared.

By Bank Transfer

As we are 99% positive seller, we are happy to accept bank deposit with more discounts for buyers. Please ask for details.


----------



## robdridan

I think if Alpine dont start offering some explanation of whats going on with this unit and how/when the issues are going to be fixed they wont be able to sell many of them at any price- I was all ready to buy new head unit/processor/speakers etc and currently dont wont any part in car audio install. Its either full in or full out for me. 

I rang my local authorised dealer, they quoted me a good price for this unit but also suggested i get a Bit One instead- not a good rap for Alpine from the main Alpine dealer in town. My perefence is to get a processor that integrates with head unit rather than a unit that is completely independent. 

So........Alpine reps.......whats going on please ???


----------



## ErinH

I'd certainly like to hear from Alpine regarding this. Especially if the US holdoff has anything to do with what I'm experiencing.
To say I'm disappointed would be an understatement. To say I'm surprised however, would be an overstatement.

The more I deal with car audio ****, the more I want to buy a Rane and call it a day.


----------



## ET328

bikinpunk said:


> I'd certainly like to hear from Alpine regarding this. Especially if the US holdoff has anything to do with what I'm experiencing.
> To say I'm disappointed would be an understatement. To say I'm surprised however, would be an overstatement.
> 
> The more I deal with car audio ****, the more I want to buy a Rane and call it a day.


But you haven't even yet experienced the noise problem, I think your unit was broken in a different way. 

I'm a little baffled why there is so little user output about this problem. It's not very difficult to test, just use 20 or 30Hz tone. I sure would like to know if this happens with all units or just with one patch.

Lately I have been watching this, for some odd reason it seems to give me some comfort to the H800 situation:
Sony Releases Stupid...


----------



## ErinH

well, frankly, since I didn't test for the same problem you did, I don't know I didn't have it.

The issue I had sounds somewhat similar to other complaints. I didn't just have alt whine... I had a very annoying buzz from the channels. No white noise like I believe you said yours had(has), though. 

I hope the replacements fare better. Otherwise, this will be my last hoorah with Alpine ever. This is certainly the last time I become an early adopter regardless of what anyone - rep or enthusiast - says. Fool me once ... Fool me twice ...


----------



## masswork

So, your replacement has not arrive yet???


----------



## Thrill_House

nomed said:


> For those who spend 1000$ for the unit, eat your hands :
> 2011 Alpine PXA-H800 Audio Processor Replace PXA-H701 | eBay


Hahaha, guess who just bought it  Let hope it doesnt turn out to be pos otherwise it might be going back up on fleebay!


----------



## SSSnake

> The more I deal with car audio ****, the more I want to buy a Rane and call it a day.


Come on over to the dark side...  Behringer DCX 2496 FTMFW!


----------



## Thrill_House

SSSnake said:


> Come on over to the dark side...  Behringer DCX 2496 FTMFW!


DBX drive rack pro is another nice option if you are going to go the pro audio route, and you can pick them up for not to much $$$.


----------



## ErinH

don't tempt me...


----------



## masswork

Erin, you have a PM


----------



## SpeedFerret

I am in the UK and got the Alpine rep to send one of these units over 2 weeks ago to my installer. 

I've emailed my installer the comments on the EQ stuff. He is going to speak to the Alpine rep on Monday to find out what's going on. 

My installer said he would bench test the unit and if experiencing the same problems, would send the unit back and install the Audison Bit1.1 unit.

Will let you know how I get on with the bench test next week and any comments coming back from the Alpine rep.

My installer also had a SWRT-10 shallow sup from the Alpine rep for building an enclosure to hawk round the dealerships. Might put this in my rear shelf depending on the verdict.


----------



## Petter

Thanks speedferret

Please ask your installer for the serial number of your unit as well. Might be handy to track the serial range for both faulty and non-faulty units.


----------



## nomed

Any update?


----------



## ET328

nomed said:


> Any update?


Nothing here. My local dealer has asked Alpine Europe, still no reply. I also wrote to German Alpine support board, no reply from Alpine. And Alpine guys that were here earlier, also seem to have disappeared. I wonder why...?


----------



## ErinH

I sent mine back to Tokospeaker about 2 weeks ago. Shipping estimate was 6-10 days. Not sure if he's received it, though I know he knew it was coming and he asked what the issue specifically was so he could relay that to Alpine.
I haven't heard back from him yet, but this site has been down off and on a lot lately. Hope to hear from him soon.


----------



## nomed

I do not like the smell of this...


----------



## ErinH

^ neither do I. Had I known this was going to happen, I would have just bought a Rane. No joke.
On the flipside, having the ability to have digital volume control with the headunit and have some alpine ai-net syncing is nice. Pros and cons. once this h800 gets resolved, I'm sure I'll feel more satisfied. for now, however, I'm still in "WTF, ALPINE?!" mode.


----------



## nomed

bikinpunk said:


> ^ neither do I. Had I known this was going to happen, I would have just bought a Rane. No joke.
> On the flipside, having the ability to have digital volume control with the headunit and have some alpine ai-net syncing is nice. Pros and cons. once this h800 gets resolved, I'm sure I'll feel more satisfied. for now, however, I'm still in "WTF, ALPINE?!" mode.


bikinpunk, are you speaking of Rane SL4 or other one? And how can they help with 4WAY setup?


----------



## Petter

I read you post over at alpines extranet and the silence there is scary.
Alex the mod usually responds very quick but not in your thread.

I really hope that what ever the problem, it can be fixed with an user installable firmware update.





ET328 said:


> Nothing here. My local dealer has asked Alpine Europe, still no reply. I also wrote to German Alpine support board, no reply from Alpine. And Alpine guys that were here earlier, also seem to have disappeared. I wonder why...?


----------



## pyropoptrt

nomed said:


> bikinpunk, are you speaking of Rane SL4 or other one? And how can they help with 4WAY setup?


bikinpunk is talking about the Rane RPM88


----------



## nomed

pyropoptrt said:


> bikinpunk is talking about the Rane RPM88


I was hoping that he is not. RPM88 is too big for car DSP.

How long till 3SIXY.3 arrive?


----------



## ErinH

yep. the rpm88. a lot of money, but you can find decent deals on them now and again. when you figure up the amount some of us have spent to have this sent to us, then sent back, the Rane isn't too far off...

just sayin'.


----------



## nomed

emm emm, CARPC with good/high end 8 channel sound card and bunch of vst plugins. emm emm


----------



## rexroadj

nomed said:


> I was hoping that he is not. RPM88 is too big for car DSP.
> 
> How long till 3SIXY.3 arrive?


I believe they put it off again till April 2012???????




I am not going to go crazy till these problems exist in the usa release.....thats why I'm waiting.
But I feel like my arm is twisted now to get the h800 cause I dont want to wait another year! Although I am glad if they can get all the bugs worked out first? 
Maybe I will go Brax processor like the rest of my new system build?


----------



## robdridan

Alpine's silence will do them harm not good, about time the Alpine reps who have been on this particular thread make an effort to explain what is being done to look into this issue. Otherwise we can only assume they are happy to sell equipment with faults. Jim ???????


----------



## Nathan_C

robdridan said:


> Alpine's silence will do them harm not good, about time the Alpine reps who have been on this particular thread make an effort to explain what is being done to look into this issue. Otherwise we can only assume they are happy to sell equipment with faults. Jim ???????


 Hi All.

As we are now selling the product, I thought I would remark on behalf of Alpine Australia. We are assessing the issues discussed here and putting together the information so we can rectify any issues with the product. The unit installed in our test car does not have these issues so we are still yet to replicate the issue in person to determine the severity or cause.

If a fault is detected be rest assured it will be rectified via an update if possible. I would also recommend trying different settings and EQ's as some faults may be affecting only certain functions on the product. This will also assist us in identifying an issue. 

The SQ from this unit is astonishing so I hope that any bugs that do exist are not going to take away from the fact this is a truly remarkable product.


----------



## hdrugs

hey all i'm wondering what to do to unlock left and right channel lock in tcr when i time allign its does both left and right


----------



## ET328

Nathan_C said:


> I would also recommend trying different settings and EQ's as some faults may be affecting only certain functions on the product.


What firmware version does your car's H800 have? 

I have used the reset button, then done just speaker and input selection and then switch G.EQ ON and the noise is there. It's always the same: Xover with LF HFP causes a little noise and EQ causes major noise. So what else is there to do? I think I have tried every variation of the setup and it makes no difference to the problem.

Is there a better way to reset the unit that would erase internal memory completely?


----------



## hdrugs

everytime i've removed the negetive from my battery the rux loses all its presets maybe that'll work


----------



## ET328

hdrugs said:


> everytime i've removed the negetive from my battery the rux loses all its presets maybe that'll work


It doesn't lose all presets, it just loses basic setup i.e. speaker and input (and it does the same thing when you press reset-button). After you have done setup, old presets are still there available via preset menu.

(PXA-H701 is better at this: it just resets volume/fader/balance/sub and goes to dsp-bypass mode after battery power is disconnected. So you just need to press memory button and you are back in business)


----------



## SpeedFerret

SpeedFerret said:


> I am in the UK and got the Alpine rep to send one of these units over 2 weeks ago to my installer.
> 
> I've emailed my installer the comments on the EQ stuff. He is going to speak to the Alpine rep on Monday to find out what's going on.
> 
> My installer said he would bench test the unit and if experiencing the same problems, would send the unit back and install the Audison Bit1.1 unit.
> 
> Will let you know how I get on with the bench test next week and any comments coming back from the Alpine rep.
> 
> My installer also had a SWRT-10 shallow sup from the Alpine rep for building an enclosure to hawk round the dealerships. Might put this in my rear shelf depending on the verdict.



Just to give you an update. My installer spoke to the Alpine agent about this issue. As far as Alpine UK are concerned they are not aware (officially) that there is a problem. (They would say that though). 

My installer is puting the kit into my car next week (the interior was being dynomatted this week). He will test for this issue probably Tuesday of next week and will advise you of his findings etc.

Cheers,


----------



## orakulo

Hey does anyone know where I can get one in USA?

Thanks guys


----------



## hdrugs

overall after a couple of days of using this unit i like it alot

i got the model the released in australia, which im not sure if its any different from the model which was released earlier from the rux i have access to all the tuning tools i'll need

the good
Good signal quality
time alignment and overall simplexity 
crossover + eq flexibility 
voltage and temp display 

the bad
random noises on "right" mid channel might be my imagination
noises when using eq which goes away
needs usb software support


----------



## robdridan

Nathan_C said:


> Hi All.
> 
> As we are now selling the product, I thought I would remark on behalf of Alpine Australia. We are assessing the issues discussed here and putting together the information so we can rectify any issues with the product. The unit installed in our test car does not have these issues so we are still yet to replicate the issue in person to determine the severity or cause.
> 
> If a fault is detected be rest assured it will be rectified via an update if possible. I would also recommend trying different settings and EQ's as some faults may be affecting only certain functions on the product. This will also assist us in identifying an issue.
> 
> The SQ from this unit is astonishing so I hope that any bugs that do exist are not going to take away from the fact this is a truly remarkable product.


Nathan, thanks for your reply. I understand one of the guys on this forum has an Aus release unit with this issue and its heading back for warranty so maybe it can be officially investigated that way. My concern is- if its noise related i cant see how a firmware update will rectify this, sounds more like a hardware/processor issue rather than software related???? So "if possible" remedy of updating firmware is still a concern to me for now, particularly after spending $1200 on getting the 701 and rux only to have noise when processing D.D. 5.1 and Alpine aus were not caring at all. 

The 701 was the first Alpine piece i had bought made in china and with that sort of $$$ was a let down. I'm hoping like hell this issue is investigated fully and resolved. I'm planning a massive install so wont commit buying any gear other than the 3 pdx amps i have already bought. But rest of my plans centre around the h800 and ina-910 head unit if this is rectified. 

Watching this forum post with massive interest- has anyone got a good news story to tell for this product other than ones installed in Alpine demo cars ???


----------



## robdridan

hdrugs Can you detail a bit more what you mean by noises when using eq which goes away? I'm assuming there is noise when doing the adjustments but then the noise stops when adjustments are complete.

And the random noises on R mid channel- still there ???


----------



## ErinH

hdrugs said:


> the bad
> random noises on "right" mid channel might be my imagination


This is the exact reason I sent mine back.
Have you tried the other right channels and opened up the crossover point so you can hear the entire bandwidth? Once I did that, I realized the noise was on all the right channels and the subwoofer channel as well. 




On another note, was anyone able to figure out how to control each speaker on the EQ via the controller? I was only able to use L/R eq for all channels combined (IOW, 31 band eq per side instead of per channel). No idea why... the 701 made this extremely easy. 
The odd thing is I"m able to set parameters for all the other settings such as t/a and x-over for each channel. Just not with eq.


----------



## Thrill_House

bikinpunk said:


> This is the exact reason I sent mine back.
> Have you tried the other right channels and opened up the crossover point so you can hear the entire bandwidth? Once I did that, I realized the noise was on all the right channels and the subwoofer channel as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note, was anyone able to figure out how to control each speaker on the EQ via the controller? I was only able to use L/R eq for all channels combined (IOW, 31 band eq per side instead of per channel). No idea why... the 701 made this extremely easy.
> The odd thing is I"m able to set parameters for all the other settings such as t/a and x-over for each channel. Just not with eq.


 I purchased mine from an ebay seller from China, I hope to god that mine is not doomed from the start as well, we will see when the thing finally arrives sometime in July.


----------



## hdrugs

bikinpunk said:


> This is the exact reason I sent mine back.
> Have you tried the other right channels and opened up the crossover point so you can hear the entire bandwidth? Once I did that, I realized the noise was on all the right channels and the subwoofer channel as well.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On another note, was anyone able to figure out how to control each speaker on the EQ via the controller? I was only able to use L/R eq for all channels combined (IOW, 31 band eq per side instead of per channel). No idea why... the 701 made this extremely easy.
> The odd thing is I"m able to set parameters for all the other settings such as t/a and x-over for each channel. Just not with eq.



hmmm i haven't explored that far yet, my best guess is is to hold channel down and if that doesn't offer individual eq, then it's a waiting game for alpine to fix things up


----------



## ErinH

when I held the channel button down, it would switch from L+R to L/R. I expected it to do that, but expected me to be able to access each channel individually rather than only eq'ing a side.


----------



## Unrealistic

bikinpunk said:


> On another note, was anyone able to figure out how to control each speaker on the EQ via the controller? I was only able to use L/R eq for all channels combined (IOW, 31 band eq per side instead of per channel). No idea why... the 701 made this extremely easy.
> The odd thing is I"m able to set parameters for all the other settings such as t/a and x-over for each channel. Just not with eq.


I believe front has 2 eqs (L+R), rear also and than center and sub.
When you choose 3-way + sub this gives you 3 eqs. (F-L + F-R + SUB)
I am thinking about selecting 2-way + rear + sub.
This would give 5 eqs (F-L + F-R + R-L + R-R + SUB)
but i think DTS / DD wont work anymore.
This is no problem for me because I only play 2.0 music.
Mids on Rear and tweeters + kicks on Front would also give you seperate bands for all speakers but makes adjusting a bit confusing... :laugh:


----------



## evo9

So by the looks of things. This pxa-h800 will be ready around CES 2012. About the same time they show off the pxa-h9** which will be ready around CES 2013. About the same time they show off the pxa-h10***, which will be............. You guys get the point:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:


----------



## deepsky

Hey guys, my installer has my h800 installed, but there was no setup CD in the package. Can you guys help me out with getting a copy, or download? Thanks.


----------



## RHI-SEE

deepsky said:


> Hey guys, my installer has my h800 installed, but there was no setup CD in the package. Can you guys help me out with getting a copy, or download? Thanks.


Unsure where you purchased yours from,
But for us who bought through tokospeaker, he had to burn copies of the discs to send with the products, or he uploaded a link. maybe Erin can help you with this as i believe he probly has the link?


I have experianced a new issue with the H800. One which you guys have not discovered............. BUM BUM BUMMMMMMMMMMMm.


It relates back to the failure of the unit being able to turn on without the Rux controller, pc or Ai-net cable attatched.
How do users whose cable snaps during a show, continue to listen to music on the way home? o wait, THEY DONT!!!
At first, the issue didnt worry me that you needed a RUX controller attatched. as i has purchased the rux, but now that it will not connect to the h800, im left up **** creek for however many weeks it takes me to send the unit back to indonesia, get it repaired, and sent back to me. Im guessing the same amount of time until Christmas??? (sarcasticly yes, but also not)
For the time being, i have to take my laptop with me wherever i go just to power the unit up, until i have time to put my old PXE-H660 in.

All i can say is this, F*CKKKKK.


----------



## soundboy

Hey..

I have not read all this 39pages, is a lot...! 

But have I understand right, the noise-case came from when use H800/Rux-c800 alone with analog signal input?? Or are also talking about when use headunit with Ai-net and optical input too? 

If mane use the mediastation IVA-D800 with optical out to H800 are the noise problem gone? 

Works IVA-D800 with H800 in the same way some headunit/Ai-Net with H701, can see all meny fra H800 into screen D800 or most always used Rux product?


----------



## ET328

soundboy said:


> But have I understand right, the noise-case came from when use H800/Rux-c800 alone with analog signal input?? Or are also talking about when use headunit with Ai-net and optical input too?


The bass modulated white noise is there also with optical input. And I'm pretty sure it's there also with ai-net. It's a DSP-chip or code problem, not input or output stage. H800 is very clean (no matter what input is used) if you don't use EQ or X-over.


----------



## soundboy

ET328 said:


> The bass modulated white noise is there also with optical input. And I'm pretty sure it's there also with ai-net. It's a DSP-chip or code problem, not input or output stage. H800 is very clean (no matter what input is used) if you don't use EQ or X-over.


Ok, I see... So is best to wait about the product to this problem will be fix from Alpine....
I have got the offer of D800R/H800/C800 brand new... I have never had a Alpine headunit/dsp before..


----------



## ErinH

any of you guys who sent yours back to TokoSpeaker here from him yet? I've PM'd him twice in the past week and haven't heard anything back yet. My tracking # says 'delivered abroad', and judging by the date, I can only assume it means it was actually delivered to him a couple days ago, but he still hasn't responded to my PM's asking if he had seen it yet. 
Hope the dude didn't up and leave with all the issues.  
Dude may not be able to get on here due to the issues with the site last week...





USPS said:


> *Detailed Results:
> 
> Shipped to:
> MRS. ERFINA SITI NURYANTI
> JALAN KENJERAN NO. 527
> SURABAYA, EAST JAVA
> INDONESIA 60114
> 
> *
> 
> *Delivered Abroad, June 17, 2011, 12:08 pm, INDONESIA*
> Into Foreign Customs, June 11, 2011, 7:36 am, INDONESIA
> Arrived Abroad, June 09, 2011, 10:55 am, INDONESIA
> International Dispatch, June 05, 2011, 9:47 pm, ISC MIAMI FL (USPS)
> Arrival
> Acceptance, June 01, 2011, 8:49 am, HUNTSVILLE, AL 35816
> Electronic Shipping Info Received, June 01, 2011


----------



## bkjay

This may not be good. I hope I am wrong.


----------



## bkjay

No response from Alpine no response from seller, seems like they are in Oh-****! mode.


----------



## rain27

Was there an expressed warranty implied by Tokospeaker to begin with?


----------



## ErinH

Yes. I specifically asked if he was an authorized alpine dealer and he said yes; a 1-year warranty covered through alpine.
He's mentioned that it'll go back to Alpine. He asked me to send the unit+warranty card and he'd take care of it. 

Like I said, he just got it 2 days ago but the worrisome part is that he's not responded to the 2 PM's I've sent during the week. Hopefully the site issues is the reason why he didn't/wasn't able to. I was just wondering/hoping someone else here had contact with him.


----------



## ErinH

Oh, and don't let me forget to let loose with a rant I've been holding back on regarding Alpine and this issue. Not enough time right now but I have a few things I'd like to get off my chest regarding the way these companies "test" their products before release.


----------



## BigRed

I don't like how Jim has avoided this thread and direct questions like the plague. Man up dude. If you don't have an answer, just say you don't have an answer, but the silence can only lead to negative conclusions really.

there! my rant for the day


----------



## Nathan_C

Can you guys tell me if the noise you are hearing comes from all forms of EQ or is it just one type of EQ? Does Parametric EQ have the noise?


----------



## t3sn4f2

BigRed said:


> I don't like how Jim has avoided this thread and direct questions like the plague. Man up dude. If you don't have an answer, just say you don't have an answer, but the silence can only lead to negative conclusions really.
> 
> there! my rant for the day


He's probably waiting for the appropriate response from "corporate" (that's what she said ). Since he is a speaker guy at Alpine anyway, not an "Alpine full product line rep" (from what I understand). So it might be a little more to ask of him to do so. 

He could be protecting his ass and doing the right thing. Not commenting about something serious that he has nothing to do with.

Yes, I tend to be like a teacher and start everyone with an "A" till they do otherwise to mess it up.........the glass half full thing.


----------



## ErinH

Nathan_C said:


> Can you guys tell me if the noise you are hearing comes from all forms of EQ or is it just one type of EQ? Does Parametric EQ have the noise?



The problem I had was a buzzing noise in the following channels:
2, 4, 6, 7, 8.

I never got a chance to put the spectrum analyzer to it to measure the channels. I wish I had so I could pinpoint the frequency(ies) the noise was at.

There was not a problem with the left channels (1, 3, 5) at all, which was very odd. I tried different amps, and speakers. Same issue with the channels listed. The problem was there when I was using ai-net, listening to an analog source such as radio or iPod. I tried a different ai-net cable and still had the same problem. However, when I'd switch the source to CD (I'm using the optical cable from w910 to h800) the noise was gone entirely, so it seems to be only in the analog domain. 

It didn't seem to matter if I used EQ or not, the noise was still there.

I reset the unit and had no issues. Then I plugged in the h800 to the laptop to set it up and the noise came back immediately, before I even got to the EQ part; just after I did the initial setup. 

Additionally, the noise was volumetric. I've NEVER had noise that increases with volume but this certainly did. It caused alt whine but even when the engine was off, the buzz was still there. Sounded like fluorescent lighting ... bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzttttttttttt.


Mine came from Indonesia; I assume Alpine of Japan handles this market?

Edit:
Forgot to say that the problem occurred with both the w505 and the w910 decks.


----------



## BigRed

jim walter said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> A few quick corrections on things.
> 
> Fully Manual Tuning built-in ... a la F#1 Status and H701
> Dual Optical Input + Ai-Net Input + Ai-Net Aux
> Ai-Net Connection to INA-W910 - Preset, Sub Level and Balance/Fader
> 
> Tuning is done via the new RUX or the PC Software
> 
> 6CH Input (RCA or SPK Input - Up to 10V Input) / 8CH Fully Active Output (4V Output)
> - In fact, our CES Demo Car is running an 8CH Active 4-way setup w 2x1" TW, 2x5" Mid, 2x8" Front Sub, 4x12" Rear Subs)
> 
> Improvements over the H700:
> Huge Signal-to-Noise Improvement - 110 Digital / 105 Analog
> Increased Channel Separation - 90dB
> Significantly More Powerful Manual Tuning
> (+/-12dB for all bands vs. 9dB)
> 10 Band Parametric for Front Rear and Center (vs 5)
> 5 Band Parametric for Sub (vs 2)
> Includes ability for 36dB XO Slopes
> -24dB to 0 Level Control (vs -10dB)
> 
> Yes, it has ImprintEQ built in, however this is a totally new tuning process compared to the previous Imprint It is significantly more detail in its resolution/measurements, especially in the mid and LF range. This allows us to tune that area with a lot more detail and accuracy. On top of that, you guys will be able to choose from 3 Alpine defined target curves, as well as set your own target curves (drag and drop in the PC software) to auto-tune to your tastes. You'll be able to tune to your taste, either by full manual tuning, auto-correction or auto-correction + your own manual turning.
> 
> It is designed to work in both OEM and ultra-high end AFT system, with the ability to manually or automatically to satisfy pretty much any tweakophile.
> 
> More to come later ...
> 
> Jim (from Vegas)


he seems to know alot about this product for being a speaker guy


----------



## ErinH

should I re-quote the "signal to noise" portion and put 

> 0dB. 





*gotta find some way to find comedy in this friggin' fiasco*


----------



## ErinH

short version of my rant:

How the hell do these products wind up to the masses and when the mfg gets wind they say "we didn't have that problem"?
Well, what the ****, guys? How about you let some real people 'beta' test these things instead of having your employees throw them in the car and be all smiles.

Okay, so maybe they do have beta testers... but it blows my mind that a product like this can hit the market and then we have 5 people on here (maybe more) alone that all have the same/similar issues and the companies' response is "oh, sorry about that. we'll look in to it". Makes you wonder how many other people unknowingly have the problem (don't make the argument that if they don't know, there's nothing wrong).
I mean, seriously... I've worked in Quality Control for a Fortune 500 (might as well be Fortune 5) company. This stuff isn't rocket science (ironically, what I do for a living now)... you make a new product, you beta test it. You go outside your factory floor and grab people. You toss out products to people on your team or you find people in a niche market that would know the product in and out and you supply them with the product and say "here you go. break it.". Then you go from there. 
Again, I'm not going to pretend to know what goes on @ Alpine but I can't get over the fact that we have people on this forum with a problem that should have been caught before the packaging was even designed.




I'm still holding back from saying how I really feel about this. Being a mod and all, I gotta keep my posts in check and respectful but ****, how in the ****ing hell does this kind of stuff happen? They should make a mental note: Next time I (a mfg) want to release a product, I'll contact some people on DIYma to test it for us so we don't have to run clean-up while we screw the most loyal customers we have (those who early adopted).

I bought the damn w910 just to mate with the h800. Now I've got a fancy expensive deck and rockin' the 701 again. Well, woo-hoo for progress. 
I should have stuck with the bit1. Hell, I should have stuck with my old Sony deck and 2 band EQ. I enjoyed the music more then because I wasn't stressing about what the hell is going to happen to the $800 processor I bought because it was supposed to be all that and a bag of sunflower chips and now it's sitting somewhere in ****ing Indonesia *hopefully* being replaced with *hopefully* a version of the DSP that doesn't have the same issue again so I *hopefully* won't have to pay another $50 to send it back so that it *hopefully* won't happen a third time. I smell audison bit1 all over again. I should have learned my lesson then but nooooooooo. I got giddy about this new fangled toy, thought it would really help me get some benefits and hear some things I hadn't been able to realize but nope. 
This is the part where I am the one taking mental note: never, ever, ever buy a new product unless someone's let me demo it first. Regardless of how reputable the company is supposed to be or how much hype there is surrounding the product. Cynicism is usually my forte; I slipped and now I (along with others) are paying. To all those who aren't having this issue: congrats (btw, you might wanna do some checking just to make sure ). For my brothers in alpine-stronghold-arms: stay strong. We can all get through this and dump them on ebay once we get the returned product. I'm half serious. 

One last time....
****!


Ooops, that was supposed to be the short version. Oh well. 


Edit: Wow. That was actually therapeutic. With that, I call it a night and bid adieu to my Alpine woes (for now). I may have a change of heart tomorrow so someone better quote me before I delete my own post.


----------



## Mic10is

if its all that and a bag of sunflower chips....i'll pass---not a fan of sunflower chips or seeds...actually I dont even know wtf a bag of sunflower chips are


----------



## Wheres The Butta

Mic10is said:


> if its all that and a bag of sunflower chips....i'll pass---not a fan of sunflower chips or seeds...actually I dont even know wtf a bag of sunflower chips are


I think he meant sun chips? They're actually not bad.











My condolences to all the people going through this b.s., hopefully it's resolved sooner rather than later.


----------



## bassfromspace

bikinpunk said:


> short version of my rant:
> 
> How the hell do these products wind up to the masses and when the mfg gets wind they say "we didn't have that problem"?
> Well, what the ****, guys? How about you let some real people 'beta' test these things instead of having your employees throw them in the car and be all smiles.
> 
> Okay, so maybe they do have beta testers... but it blows my mind that a product like this can hit the market and then we have 5 people on here (maybe more) alone that all have the same/similar issues and the companies' response is "oh, sorry about that. we'll look in to it". Makes you wonder how many other people unknowingly have the problem (don't make the argument that if they don't know, there's nothing wrong).
> I mean, seriously... I've worked in Quality Control for a Fortune 500 (might as well be Fortune 5) company. This stuff isn't rocket science (ironically, what I do for a living now)... you make a new product, you beta test it. You go outside your factory floor and grab people. You toss out products to people on your team or you find people in a niche market that would know the product in and out and you supply them with the product and say "here you go. break it.". Then you go from there.
> Again, I'm not going to pretend to know what goes on @ Alpine but I can't get over the fact that we have people on this forum with a problem that should have been caught before the packaging was even designed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm still holding back from saying how I really feel about this. Being a mod and all, I gotta keep my posts in check and respectful but ****, how in the ****ing hell does this kind of stuff happen? They should make a mental note: Next time I (a mfg) want to release a product, I'll contact some people on DIYma to test it for us so we don't have to run clean-up while we screw the most loyal customers we have (those who early adopted).
> 
> I bought the damn w910 just to mate with the h800. Now I've got a fancy expensive deck and rockin' the 701 again. Well, woo-hoo for progress.
> I should have stuck with the bit1. Hell, I should have stuck with my old Sony deck and 2 band EQ. I enjoyed the music more then because I wasn't stressing about what the hell is going to happen to the $800 processor I bought because it was supposed to be all that and a bag of sunflower chips and now it's sitting somewhere in ****ing Indonesia *hopefully* being replaced with *hopefully* a version of the DSP that doesn't have the same issue again so I *hopefully* won't have to pay another $50 to send it back so that it *hopefully* won't happen a third time. I smell audison bit1 all over again. I should have learned my lesson then but nooooooooo. I got giddy about this new fangled toy, thought it would really help me get some benefits and hear some things I hadn't been able to realize but nope.
> This is the part where I am the one taking mental note: never, ever, ever buy a new product unless someone's let me demo it first. Regardless of how reputable the company is supposed to be or how much hype there is surrounding the product. Cynicism is usually my forte; I slipped and now I (along with others) are paying. To all those who aren't having this issue: congrats (btw, you might wanna do some checking just to make sure ). For my brothers in alpine-stronghold-arms: stay strong. We can all get through this and dump them on ebay once we get the returned product. I'm half serious.
> 
> One last time....
> ****!
> 
> 
> Ooops, that was supposed to be the short version. Oh well.
> 
> 
> Edit: Wow. That was actually therapeutic. With that, I call it a night and bid adieu to my Alpine woes (for now). I may have a change of heart tomorrow so someone better quote me before I delete my own post.


The same could be said for JBL.


----------



## subwoofery

bassfromspace said:


> The same could be said for JBL.


 Why? The product works. Just not to the level of some DIYers... 
Also feel that the MS-8 is a processor ; which means that you have to play with it in order to unlock it's full potential - even though it was supposed to be a plug and play one 
If Gary Biggs can win some comps with it, I'd just say one thing: User's error 

The lack of midbass is either a user's error or they never heard a good tuned system (midbass aren't overpowering anything). 

I don't feel you can put JBL in the same bag as Alpine... especially comparing those 2 products... 

Kelvin


----------



## ET328

Nathan_C said:


> Can you guys tell me if the noise you are hearing comes from all forms of EQ or is it just one type of EQ? Does Parametric EQ have the noise?


Bass modulated white noise is there when you switch one of the EQs on, at default settings noise is lower with P.EQ but when you adjust it (it requires just a change of Q-value of 1st frequency, all still at 0dB setting), the noise gets louder and almost at the same level as with G.EQ. 

Just to rule out that this happens only when there is solo bass signals, I also tested with a signal that contained 40Hz and 1Khz tones mixed together. The noise was still there. So it effects music all the time (or maybe not if you listen only violin concerts...).

And now I'm wondering if RoadEQ actually does any frequency specific EQ since it causes no additional white noise. Since all other functions that effect tone spectrum seem to do it, then surely RoadEQ should also do it? So is it just raising signal levels? Or are they using different DSP chip for it and only one DSP is causing noise problems? I'll try to find a way to measure it...


----------



## RHI-SEE

Erin,
I too have not heard back from tokospeaker about getting my unit sent back through warrenty. 
Its a little disturbing as when i was talking to him about purchasing the unit originally, the PM's were on rapid fire. he responded almost straight after i had hit the send button.
I surely hope there is a reason behind this and he is not in run and hide mode.

Also, somebody mentioned about The japan spec for warrenty, Here is Australia, *APPARENTLY* any warrenty claim, the unit will be sent to to japan to be rectified. Thats the word through the grape vine.


----------



## BigRed

subwoofery said:


> Why? The product works. Just not to the level of some DIYers...
> Also feel that the MS-8 is a processor ; which means that you have to play with it in order to unlock it's full potential - even though it was supposed to be a plug and play one
> If Gary Biggs can win some comps with it, I'd just say one thing: User's error
> 
> The lack of midbass is either a user's error or they never heard a good tuned system (midbass aren't overpowering anything).
> 
> I don't feel you can put JBL in the same bag as Alpine... especially comparing those 2 products...
> 
> Kelvin


Let's not forget Andy W. Took it on the chin on this forum the whole time jbl had delayed shipping and has answered all questions or criticisms about the product

Seems to me that the "alpine speaker guy employee" has vanished once the coin didn't flip shiny in this thread. That's slightly disappointing

It is what it is


----------



## highly

subwoofery said:


> Why? The product works. Just not to the level of some DIYers...
> Also feel that the MS-8 is a processor ; which means that you have to play with it in order to unlock it's full potential - even though it was supposed to be a plug and play one
> If Gary Biggs can win some comps with it, I'd just say one thing: User's error
> 
> The lack of midbass is either a user's error or they never heard a good tuned system (midbass aren't overpowering anything).
> 
> I don't feel you can put JBL in the same bag as Alpine... especially comparing those 2 products...
> 
> Kelvin


Agreed.

The MS-8 did all it was _supposed _to do. The problem was that we are not its intended market and our expectations (center image in the center of the car, for instance) wasn't part of its design plan. Sure, you can fool it (sometimes very effectively!) to give you what you want, but that wasn't it's design goal. Same can be said for phase-based steering. The intended audience is rather unlikely to run in phase/out of phase technical tracks through it, and if it incorrectly steers to the rear on them they tend to look at the effect as 'cool'. I won't say I never had a problem with mine, but the problems I did have were usually minor and related more to my unrealistic expectations of it than anything else. The only thing I had seen that I would call a bug would be that it would sometimes drop protection to the drivers and some experienced driver failure as a result, though I can't imagine how they could correct that and still provide the system flexibility it offers.

The MS-8 is no less a bad-ass technological marvel for not fitting our expectations (in my opinion, of course....).

-T


----------



## highly

On a related note, I've begun a thread on the aging 700/701s that may be starting to fail HERE.

I thought there was a chance that the conversation might spark some responses and didn't want to derail this thread.

-T


----------



## ErinH

RHI-SEE said:


> Erin,
> I too have not heard back from tokospeaker about getting my unit sent back through warrenty.
> Its a little disturbing as when i was talking to him about purchasing the unit originally, the PM's were on rapid fire. he responded almost straight after i had hit the send button.
> I surely hope there is a reason behind this and he is not in run and hide mode.
> 
> Also, somebody mentioned about The japan spec for warrenty, Here is Australia, *APPARENTLY* any warrenty claim, the unit will be sent to to japan to be rectified. Thats the word through the grape vine.


I just sent him an email and posted in his f/s thread here. I hope we hear something back regarding this. 2 weeks without communication is a bit scary. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt but am still a bit concerned.

The troubling part to me is: when we get it back, what happens if the issue is still there? 

I asked Toko about just flat out returning it for my money back. Since he's an authorized dealer this shouldn't be an issue. His reply was not in regards to the return; he just asked what was wrong with the unit so he could tell Alpine when he received it. 

I dunno... this whole ordeal is just a huge mess and learning lesson.


Yes, I'm bitter. Sue me.


----------



## rain27

BigRed said:


> Let's not forget Andy W. Took it on the chin on this forum the whole time jbl had delayed shipping and has answered all questions or criticisms about the product
> 
> Seems to me that the "alpine speaker guy employee" has vanished once the coin didn't flip shiny in this thread. That's slightly disappointing
> 
> It is what it is


I agree. Andy W. has provided unheard of support for the MS-8 and has gone out of his way to try and make everyone happy with their purchase.


----------



## nomed

Remind me a song 




:laugh:


----------



## deepsky

Thanks to droth for the setup software link. Now I need the other disc, the one for the Imprint EQ setup. There was no discs in the package! What's up with that? If anyone could help me out with that, thanks!!!


----------



## rexroadj

Just curious.....How many people that are having issues with the product ordered from toko? Also, were all of them missing the software? Has anyone been able to confirm with alpine that Toko is authorized?


----------



## deepsky

I ordered from Toko, and he *was* great, but how can a product be shipping that requires two setup discs not come with them? I'm getting the feeling that Alpine is incompetent. I hope not, but this isn't looking good.


----------



## ErinH

well, I do wonder if this unit doesn't come with the disc. maybe it's installer given only?


----------



## rexroadj

I'm more curious as to what TOKO is selling first....then alpine?
I am glad I didnt jump the gun on ordering from over seas just to get it early, not that I dont feel bad for what ya'll are going through, I just felt like something was odd about the release of it and the way they did it? I had a feeling something was "off" but I didnt see this per say.


----------



## Petter

Manual, microphone and two CDs are supposed to be included according to the PDF-manual of the H800.


----------



## ErinH

figured I'd drop this here...

Since TokoSpeaker has not replied to any of my messages/emails in the past week I called my credit card company and started the process of a chargeback. At this point, I just want my money back and since he's not responding, this seemed to be my only course of action.

If he gets back in touch with me, I'll update the thread. If you guys hear back, lmk. I can understand a few days of no contact, but when he's got an $800 item of mine and stopped all correspondence, that's disconcerting.

+1 for keeping all emails and PMs along with getting tracking #'s for shipped items.

- Erin


----------



## rexroadj

wow, thats all kinds of ****ed up that it has come to that!!! Sucks, what a frigging hassle. Thank god you have all the contact between you.
I hope/assume that his vendor tag has been removed? Have you tried to bridge the gap between Alpine and Toko? If they are legit then alpine should step in.


----------



## ErinH

Well, truth be told, I didn't want to go that far but the fact that he's stopped replying when he had been a frequent replier really scares me. I don't have $5 tied up in this.... we've all got a good deal more. If he comes back and says he was out of pocket and couldn't reply then it's squashed and we'll continue. But I just felt like this was the only leverage I had. After sending him multiple messages without reply it was pretty much my 'let's see if this helps'.

At this point, I'd be happy to return everything and take a return minus shipping just so I can walk away.


----------



## Thrill_House

bikinpunk said:


> Well, truth be told, I didn't want to go that far but the fact that he's stopped replying when he had been a frequent replier really scares me. I don't have $5 tied up in this.... we've all got a good deal more. If he comes back and says he was out of pocket and couldn't reply then it's squashed and we'll continue. But I just felt like this was the only leverage I had. After sending him multiple messages without reply it was pretty much my 'let's see if this helps'.
> 
> At this point, I'd be happy to return everything and take a return minus shipping just so I can walk away.


Man am I ever glad I didnt purchase my unit from Toko, lets hope the seller I bought it from in China is good to his word to provide warranty for my h800 should I experience the same problems with the unit. :laugh:  On a side note im very sorry to hear all the trouble you had to go through with this man it really sucks, I can see how this would really frustrate the crap out of you and make you want to just walk away from Car audio for good.


----------



## ErinH

^ I hope for your sake you're right. 

I hope USA gets/doesn't have this problem with their release, though, I probably won't know because I think this is my last hoorah with alpine. My w910 is going back this week. If anyone is interested in it, LMK. I paid $1k authorized and would take that. Otherwise it's going back and I get my $1k back from the dealer.


----------



## RHI-SEE

I Never new there was 2 discs for the software?
Toko burned me a copy of the disc he had as he was givin 1 disc for all the units he received, i have seen a new unit arrive @ an australian shop and it too only had 1 disc although each box did have its own software from Alpine.

My issue with toko is that my warrenty claim, is not his problem nor Alpines issue, It was mine and my installers fault so all he needs to be is a middle man for me.

Still interested to hear from Jim (USA) and Nathan (Aus) as to what we can do. do we have a leg to stand on?


----------



## Petter

On tokospeaker.com they state they are closed 14-30 june and opens again on july 1st. 

Hope that's all that is about not getting back to you so it's not any serious.


----------



## ET328

RHI-SEE said:


> I Never new there was 2 discs for the software?
> Toko burned me a copy of the disc he had as he was givin 1 disc for all the units he received, i have seen a new unit arrive @ an australian shop and it too only had 1 disc although each box did have its own software from Alpine.


My unit came with 2 discs, one with software and the other with 1 (or was it 2) audio tracks. The audio disc is used only if you connect to an OEM-system and want to calibrate it's frequency response to flat. Both discs looked like they were factory packed, so it's very weird that some units don't have them.


----------



## Unrealistic

I have tested the noise problem described here.

I do have some extra sounds when I do the following:
Switching on the G-EQ, and playing Emma track 22 20-80Hz.
On the right speakers a whistling, weezing sound is heard, and when the testtone hits 30?Hz it changes to crisping.
When the tone is even higher (35Hz?) is it completely gone.
With the EQ set to OFF or set to P-EQ I don't have any issues.

I have bought my processor through the normal channels in The Netherlands.
Maybe because we have left-hand-drive cars, or maybe because it only occurs under certain circumstances, I didn't notice this before.

For me this is no ground to send the unit back. I have the processor almost 8 weeks in my car and the only thing I notice is the great improvement in sound quality overall.
When someone hears these sounds with normal use / listening I can understand that they would want to return the unit.


----------



## deepsky

ET328 said:


> My unit came with 2 discs, one with software and the other with 1 (or was it 2) audio tracks. The audio disc is used only if you connect to an OEM-system and want to calibrate it's frequency response to flat. Both discs looked like they were factory packed, so it's very weird that some units don't have them.


Any chance someone could up this somewhere where those of us without could download them? It would be much appreciated!


----------



## stereo_luver

bikinpunk said:


> well, I do wonder if this unit doesn't come with the disc. maybe it's installer given only?


THAT would be total BS. Why would other mfg's give you the install/set-up disc for OEM and not Alpine?

Chuck


----------



## ArG218

Petter said:


> On tokospeaker.com they state they are closed 14-30 june and opens again on july 1st.
> 
> Hope that's all that is about not getting back to you so it's not any serious.


Toko speaker.com is on Summer Holiday. I chat with him before he left last week..


----------



## deepsky

An initial report on my unit. This is in a totally new install on a 2011 Infiniti M56X. I'm using the bose head unit which does DVDA. I'm also using JL Audio amps and Morel speakers. So far this thing sounds wonderful. I need to do a lot more tuning, but so far I like the sound. The menu is pretty confusing, many menu items are similar, and you basically need to memorize where things are as it isn't intuitive. One big thing I don't like is that the presets do not allow you to change input modes. So far I have to go into the input mode, and switch between 2 channel input and 5.1 channel inputs, which require a power cycle to do. Can't change while you're driving. I have yet to hear the noise that others are bothered with. I just haven't heard it yet, maybe it's there. So far, it isn't such that I'd live without it for repair, I hope it can be fixed via software update.
I'm pretty happy with the surround processing modes on the unit. Both Dolby II and Euphony are interesting. I don't like that Euphony seems to spread center material like vocals to all channels, I prefer the Dolby where they are centered up front. 

I still need the audio setup CD that DID NOT come with the unit. Sure would be thankful to someone for posting it!


----------



## ET328

deepsky said:


> I still need the audio setup CD that DID NOT come with the unit. Sure would be thankful to someone for posting it!


Here, 22MB. Unzip and burn with Imgburn:
Setupdisc.zip


----------



## Thrill_House

deepsky said:


> An initial report on my unit. This is in a totally new install on a 2011 Infiniti M56X. I'm using the bose head unit which does DVDA. I'm also using JL Audio amps and Morel speakers. So far this thing sounds wonderful. I need to do a lot more tuning, but so far I like the sound. The menu is pretty confusing, many menu items are similar, and you basically need to memorize where things are as it isn't intuitive. One big thing I don't like is that the presets do not allow you to change input modes. So far I have to go into the input mode, and switch between 2 channel input and 5.1 channel inputs, which require a power cycle to do. Can't change while you're driving. I have yet to hear the noise that others are bothered with. I just haven't heard it yet, maybe it's there. So far, it isn't such that I'd live without it for repair, I hope it can be fixed via software update.
> I'm pretty happy with the surround processing modes on the unit. Both Dolby II and Euphony are interesting. I don't like that Euphony seems to spread center material like vocals to all channels, I prefer the Dolby where they are centered up front.
> 
> I still need the audio setup CD that DID NOT come with the unit. Sure would be thankful to someone for posting it!


Out of curiosity where did you purchase your unit from?


----------



## ErinH

ArG218 said:


> Toko speaker.com is on Summer Holiday. I chat with him before he left last week..


wish I had known that beforehand. :/


----------



## ET328

deepsky said:


> I have yet to hear the noise that others are bothered with. I just haven't heard it yet, maybe it's there.


Have you tested with 20-50Hz tones? Or with this short sample: Original_sample.wav


----------



## deepsky

Thanks so much for the setup disc. I don't understand why they didn't put that on the other disc. I did buy it from Tokospeaker. I'll check for the sound, probably this weekend when I have more time for testing. Thanks again!!!


----------



## Petter

What serial number do these units have?


----------



## ET328

I posted again to the German Alpine Extranet message board and few hours later my message (quoted below) was deleted. Of course still no reply to the actual problem, but at least someone is reading the message board... 

_"No reply from Alpine and my local importer/dealer is also clueless and just tells me to reset the unit. But that does not help.
I thought Alpine was a reputable manufacturer that would at least answer. But no, Alpine seems to have gone into hiding mode in all forums and forms. So no one should buy an Alpine PXA-H800 since it's pure luck if you happen get a 100% working one. I'll try to get my money back and never buy another Alpine unit again!"
_


----------



## ErinH

ET328 said:


> I'll try to get my money back and never buy another Alpine unit again!"
> [/I]


this is pretty much the route I'm going. I won't say I won't try the h800 again but it certainly won't be for a while. Wonder if I should do my review now? It'd be easy and quick to write up the following:

"Well, this unit is great... when it doesn't make buzzing fly noises... which is all the time... so this unit by default just sucks".


Yep. Still bitter.


----------



## rain27

So is anyone happy with their H800? Does the auto tune work well?


----------



## evo9

rain27 said:


> So is anyone happy with their H800? Does the auto tune work well?




Suffering from mental density:wacko::clown:






.


----------



## deepsky

I haven't tried autotune yet, hopefully over the weekend. If the bugs get worked out, it sure sounds good.


----------



## ///Alpine

bikinpunk said:


> yep. the rpm88. a lot of money, but you can find decent deals on them now and again. when you figure up the amount some of us have spent to have this sent to us, then sent back, the Rane isn't too far off...
> 
> just sayin'.


I can get some information about a seller you purchased it?
Thanks


----------



## highly

///Alpine said:


> I can get some information about a seller you purchased it?
> Thanks


I don't think Erin has, but you never know with that man...
One for sale RIGHT HERE. It isn't mine, but it's being sold by a great guy!

Good luck!


----------



## n_olympios

I can't help but wonder whether it was better in the older days, with no internet, no company reps and no sneak previews. 

At least then we didn't have to anticipate for new products to become available, and when they finally did but were bugged, we never knew.


----------



## kyheng

But people's expections, marketing gimmick, getting back market share will prevent this from happening.... Sad but true.... 
Sometimes even a particular brand intentionly "leak" it out just to create huhas.....
Anyway, I got a friend's friend install H800 on authorised audio shop which don't have any problem....
Is H800 not for DIYers? I don't know....


----------



## t3sn4f2

n_olympios said:


> I can't help but wonder whether it was better in the older days, with no internet, no company reps and no sneak previews.
> 
> At least then we didn't have to anticipate for new products to become available, and when they finally did but were bugged, we never knew.


Does you guys remember these subs from Klipsch in the early 90's?

SW-12

They were highly regarded for home theater use and top of the line from Sound Advice (ie twetter), next to Velodyne back then.

After having heard one at my brothers house I decided to get one for myself. When I got it home, BNIB, the voil coil have a nasty voil coil rub. I went through THE ENTIRE STOCK of the South Florida area stores and they all had the same issue. After the third, I stopped taking them home, the sale's guy and I just opened up the boxes right there in the store and tested them.

Never did end up getting one.

I bet no one ever heard of that. I wonder if there would have been an internet back then if they would have ever even come out with the SWII.


----------



## 14642

nomed said:


> emm emm, CARPC with good/high end 8 channel sound card and bunch of vst plugins. emm emm


I'm almost thinking that i'd like to start a little workgroup here to help steer some of you hardcore DIY/DSPers into something that better suits your wishes. I've been using a CarPC for years as an R&D tool and despite the usual hassles one can expect from a PC, the audio is geat and the tweaking is fun. 

What you won't get is a reliable turn it on, turn it off 100000 times with no issues system, but you also won't be stymied by a product manager's dilemma--build a product that can be a business AND meet the needs of hard core enthusiasts. 

I probably have 400 hours in the installation of amps speakers, wires, dynamat--all of the regular stuff in the car--and an additional couple hundred in the PC/Monitor/Soundcard/Power Supply/Control Knob/TouchPad, etc. I'm no programmer, just an amalgamator of other peoples' hacks. Someone who's a programmer would have a more reliable system than mine. 

I'd be happy to contribute what I can to the "audio processing" part of this project and it would be nice if there was an exprt programmer who'd also engage to help with general setup and configuration questions. 

Doing a carPC can be far more expensive and annoying than dealing with a factory rep who either doesn't care, doesn't know or isn't empowered to help, BTW.


----------



## highly

That's an offer that is rather difficult to ignore...

So what environment do you prefer to set up your CarPC (Windows, Mac, or Linux)? What functions do you allot it (Are you running a processor for the audio or an all-in-one device for source/routing/processing)? I would suspect that the fewer functions you expect the machine to provide, the more inherent stability could be maintained. 

I do not currently run a PC in the car, but that doesn't mean that I haven't played with one towards that end. Nothing ready for prime time yet; not until it surpasses what I can do with a standalone processor. 

I'm interested in the pretense for certain and would imagine there are others as well. MP3car.com and the like have many how-to threads on just this thing, but most seem to lean towards a single box solution. I don't really feel that is an optimal expectation when there are so many available headunits that do their respective jobs so darned well.

I'm interested to hear more about your setup!

-Todd


----------



## nirschl

Andy Wehmeyer said:


> I'm almost thinking that i'd like to start a little workgroup here to help steer some of you hardcore DIY/DSPers into something that better suits your wishes. I've been using a CarPC for years as an R&D tool and despite the usual hassles one can expect from a PC, the audio is geat and the tweaking is fun.
> 
> What you won't get is a reliable turn it on, turn it off 100000 times with no issues system, but you also won't be stymied by a product manager's dilemma--build a product that can be a business AND meet the needs of hard core enthusiasts.
> 
> I probably have 400 hours in the installation of amps speakers, wires, dynamat--all of the regular stuff in the car--and an additional couple hundred in the PC/Monitor/Soundcard/Power Supply/Control Knob/TouchPad, etc. I'm no programmer, just an amalgamator of other peoples' hacks. Someone who's a programmer would have a more reliable system than mine.
> 
> I'd be happy to contribute what I can to the "audio processing" part of this project and it would be nice if there was an exprt programmer who'd also engage to help with general setup and configuration questions.
> 
> Doing a carPC can be far more expensive and annoying than dealing with a factory rep who either doesn't care, doesn't know or isn't empowered to help, BTW.


Nice!





highly said:


> That's an offer that is rather difficult to ignore...
> 
> So what environment do you prefer to set up your CarPC (Windows, Mac, or Linux)? What functions do you allot it (Are you running a processor for the audio or an all-in-one device for source/routing/processing)? I would suspect that the fewer functions you expect the machine to provide, the more inherent stability could be maintained.
> 
> I do not currently run a PC in the car, but that doesn't mean that I haven't played with one towards that end. Nothing ready for prime time yet; not until it surpasses what I can do with a standalone processor.
> 
> I'm interested in the pretense for certain and would imagine there are others as well. MP3car.com and the like have many how-to threads on just this thing, but most seem to lean towards a single box solution. I don't really feel that is an optimal expectation when there are so many available headunits that do their respective jobs so darned well.
> 
> I'm interested to hear more about your setup!
> 
> -Todd




Agreed. I think this subject has "sticky" potential if experienced and knowing folk are willing to contribute. 

Mod's, what say ya? 

Cheers


----------



## masswork

Andy Wehmeyer said:


> I'm almost thinking that i'd like to start a little workgroup here to help steer some of you hardcore DIY/DSPers into something that better suits your wishes. I've been using a CarPC for years as an R&D tool and despite the usual hassles one can expect from a PC, the audio is geat and the tweaking is fun.
> 
> What you won't get is a reliable turn it on, turn it off 100000 times with no issues system, but you also won't be stymied by a product manager's dilemma--build a product that can be a business AND meet the needs of hard core enthusiasts.
> 
> I probably have 400 hours in the installation of amps speakers, wires, dynamat--all of the regular stuff in the car--and an additional couple hundred in the PC/Monitor/Soundcard/Power Supply/Control Knob/TouchPad, etc. I'm no programmer, just an amalgamator of other peoples' hacks. Someone who's a programmer would have a more reliable system than mine.
> 
> I'd be happy to contribute what I can to the "audio processing" part of this project and it would be nice if there was an exprt programmer who'd also engage to help with general setup and configuration questions.
> 
> Doing a carPC can be far more expensive and annoying than dealing with a factory rep who either doesn't care, doesn't know or isn't empowered to help, BTW.


This is very interesting.
I'm curious of what audio card support 8 independent channel (for 3 way + sub all active), and how are we going to deal with boot-time issue ?

Btw i'm a programmer myself, and is very interested to take part of this small workgroup if i may 
In my car, i'm using a heavily modded minidsp.


----------



## highly

I have a Focusrite Saffire firewire for it's support in Linux. 8 fully independent outputs of studio quality audio outside of the PC chassis for better isolation.

There are many, many others.

I think someone should start a thread and link back before we clutter things up here.
Andy?

-Todd


----------



## SSSnake

> I'm almost thinking that i'd like to start a little workgroup here to help steer some of you hardcore DIY/DSPers into something that better suits your wishes. I've been using a CarPC for years as an R&D tool and despite the usual hassles one can expect from a PC, the audio is geat and the tweaking is fun.


Now this truly sux. After pulling my CarPC and purchasing an MS-8 working with it for a long time and then adding dual Behringer DCXs to the equation, Andy will now help on CarPCs.  Actually I think it is a great idea! Just not up for another project right now.


----------



## Petter

From what I understand of the last post from the admin of alpines extranet, Alpine Japan is working on a solution which will be delivered as a FW update to download. 

I'm not that good in german so perhaps some german speaking member can translate it properly


----------



## nomed

Week past and no update?


----------



## Ale555

An update will be available in september, that´s what they say to us germans.
The GEQ has an issue that needs to be fixed.


----------



## rexroadj

Ale555 said:


> An update will be available in september, that´s what they say to us germans.
> The GEQ has an issue that needs to be fixed.


Hey German! (I am a large portion German
Have you had any play time with the helix P-dsp?
Not to thread jack


----------



## ET328

Ale555 said:


> An update will be available in september, that´s what they say to us germans. The GEQ has an issue that needs to be fixed.


It makes me a "little" worried that Alpine mentions issues just with Graphic EQ.
But parametric EQ and X-over also have the same problems making the unit pretty much useless for anything else than time correction. So currently it's just a very expensive door stopper... Or is my unit the only one with those extra problems?


----------



## Ale555

You have that "huge" problem with the GEQ, some people said that they have the same thing on the PEQ, too. But barely audible. That means you´d have to mute Sub, Kick and Tweets and let only a midrange play and have a pure Bass-Signal to recognize it.
So it is there but not a real problem.
No problems in Xover heard until now. Maybo call Harri Hellmann and give them the serial number to check if there is a problem? (Alpine germany asked some guys for serial numbers, but I don´t know why exactly.

@rexroadj: Yes, I had o set up the "DemoCar" for the release over here. So I´m playing with it since April.  SO far: I will install that in my car, too.


----------



## ET328

Ale555 said:


> You have that "huge" problem with the GEQ, some people said that they have the same thing on the PEQ, too. But barely audible. That means you´d have to mute Sub, Kick and Tweets and let only a midrange play and have a pure Bass-Signal to recognize it.
> So it is there but not a real problem.


I don't use GEQ, I use PEQ and X-over. But I guess car hifi (at least Alpine's) has now days much lower audio quality standards. So a problem with PEQ & X-over that can be heard with normal music, and without those sub/kick/tweets-tweaks you mentioned, is actually not a real problem. I'm just used to higher audio standards and with the PXA-H800 I'll just have to lower my standards.

But I'll contact audio Hellmann again and probably once again get those useless instructions to reset the box.


----------



## senior800

rexroadj said:


> Hey German! (I am a large portion German
> Have you had any play time with the helix P-dsp?
> Not to thread jack


I attempted to order a c-dsp a few days ago and they just came back saying it's not actually available until the end of July. 

I found no reviews or any forum information on them. Just took the plunge.


----------



## Petter

I like that they will offer a Bluetooth Interface for smartphone control to add to it. 





senior800 said:


> I ordered a c-dsp a few days ago and they just came back saying it's not actually available until the end of July.
> 
> I found no reviews or any forum information on them. Just took the plunge.


----------



## senior800

Following on from my c-dsp I have just ordered a British pxa-h800 but with the guarantee of a cash refund should it have this problem.

Gives me something to try in the few week wait for the c-dsp if it doesn't work and if it does then great and I will build my system around it.

collecting tomorrow so will update later in the week.

Just to confirm it will be doa if it has the problem and not develop it over time?


----------



## Mic10is

senior800 said:


> Following on from my c-dsp I have just ordered a British pxa-h800 but with the guarantee of a cash refund should it have this problem.
> 
> Gives me something to try in the few week wait for the c-dsp if it doesn't work and if it does then great and I will build my system around it.
> 
> collecting tomorrow so will update later in the week.
> 
> Just to confirm it will be doa if it has the problem and not develop it over time?


difference between C-DSP and P-dsp?
need more info


----------



## Ale555

ET328 said:


> I don't use GEQ, I use PEQ and X-over. But I guess car hifi (at least Alpine's) has now days much lower audio quality standards. So a problem with PEQ & X-over that can be heard with normal music, and without those sub/kick/tweets-tweaks you mentioned, is actually not a real problem. I'm just used to higher audio standards and with the PXA-H800 I'll just have to lower my standards.
> 
> But I'll contact audio Hellmann again and probably once again get those useless instructions to reset the box.


No, what you talk about is not what I meant. If it is so obvious it has nothing to do with the know issue I mentioned.

About Helix: Someone open a new thread with questions? I may have some of the infos you may search for (C-DSP vs. P-DSP etc.)..


----------



## rexroadj

Ale555 said:


> No, what you talk about is not what I meant. If it is so obvious it has nothing to do with the know issue I mentioned.
> 
> About Helix: Someone open a new thread with questions? I may have some of the infos you may search for (C-DSP vs. P-DSP etc.)..


I will do it now and add a link!


----------



## rexroadj

A fine gentleman already beat me to it 
Here is the link!


http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...3-helix-dsp-whos-got-answers.html#post1364282


----------



## n_olympios

senior800 said:


> I attempted to order a c-dsp a few days ago and they just came back saying it's not actually available until the end of July.





Ale555 said:


> An update will be available in september, that´s what they say to us germans.


We're hungry for audio stuff here and everyone in the industry is out on summer vacation, now isn't that unfair.


----------



## ReticulatingPigeonElf

n_olympios said:


> We're hungry for audio stuff here and everyone in the industry is out on summer vacation, now isn't that unfair.


hah, you're tellin me - they sure picked a swell time to delay stuff.


----------



## Ale555

We have very short summers in germany (not like in greece), that´s why we have to use that time pretty intense. So not one person is working over here in July and August.


----------



## billg71

ET328 said:


> ... Lately I have been watching this, for some odd reason it seems to give me some comfort to the H800 situation:
> Sony Releases Stupid...


ROFLMAO!!  I should spend more time on The Onion...


Thanks for posting this, I needed a good laugh.

I'm still working my way through this thread, got interested after Erin said something about it yesterday. 

Hope Alpine does right by you guys.

Bill


----------



## t3sn4f2

Ale555 said:


> We have very short summers in germany (not like in greece), that´s why we have to use that time pretty intense. So not one person is working over here in July and August.


We have more than enough over here. Take as much as you want, please!


----------



## Ale555

In europe the update will most likely be released in this Week! 
And it will cure the GEQ Problem...


----------



## ET328

Ale555 said:


> In europe the update will most likely be released in this Week!
> And it will cure the GEQ Problem...


Update is out! I'll test and report back later today...


----------



## Ale555

Like written...Even the Beta Version cured the problem. 
I had done one of the beta tests And it worked.

I made a before&after check And also stressed the GEQ afterwards (every Band +12 Next -20 Next +12 ...) And Even then it worked properly (it sounded ****, yes... ).

(BTW: Sorry for the typo, but my phone thinks there Must Be more capitals...)


----------



## bee200sx

So how do we get a copy of the update? Via alpine website or only through dealers?


----------



## ET328

And it works!!! I'll do more tests but sounds like it's now perfectly clean in GEQ, PEQ and X-over. 

But why was Alpine not more open about this? It sure would have made much better impression than this silent treatment. 

Update is available here:
alpine-extranet.de Thema anzeigen - Bass noise problems with PXA-H800


----------



## Ale555

alpine-extranet.de • Foren-Übersicht then go to "Soundprozessoren" And Hit "Bass Noise Problems with PXA-H800", they Guy "tscheche" is the Costumer Support Guy. So that is Safe. 

Beware: All Personal Data will Be Lost with that update, so make a copy ob your HDD to Upload it again later.


----------



## Ale555

It is Not Silent in Germany. And that Guy And Forum is Alpine Germany , Not europe. Every Country has to take Care by it's own!


----------



## ET328

Ale555 said:


> It is Not Silent in Germany. And that Guy And Forum is Alpine Germany , Not europe. Every Country has to take Care by it's own!


Where was all this action in Germany? In some closed dealer message board? It sure was silent in that Alpine Extranet board where I posted about this problem.


----------



## bee200sx

thanks for the link guys


----------



## senior800

Just installing it thanks.

Will see if it works on a British bought unit.


----------



## senior800

Works a treat. Thank you! 

Still a few things I don't like about it. (such as the software not working on my Windows 7 64 bit laptop (anybody else have this problem?)

But looks like I will stick with it now.

Sadly can't check the alternator whine as my car is nowhere near ready, but hopefully that has been sorted.


----------



## ET328

senior800 said:


> Still a few things I don't like about it. (such as the software not working on my Windows 7 64 bit laptop (anybody else have this problem?)


It works if you setup Virtual PC and install the software and drivers there. I wrote about it earlier, in message #779: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1321433-post779.html


----------



## ErinH

I should be receiving mine back from Toko soon. Not sure what I"m going to do with it, though, since I've already moved on to the p99.


----------



## asawendo

Hey this is quite interesting, why it took so long to cure this problem, especially for Alpine international version?!


----------



## KaLaNG0

Awesome Thread


----------



## Thrill_House

My unit just shipped out today, finally, so when I get it the first thing I do will be to run that update before it even gets installed in the car!


----------



## Ale555

ET328 said:


> Where was all this action in Germany? In some closed dealer message board? It sure was silent in that Alpine Extranet board where I posted about this problem.


for example: Ein klein wenig vom neuen Alpine DSP.....mit Foto • Klangfuzzis.de


----------



## ET328

Ale555 said:


> for example: Ein klein wenig vom neuen Alpine DSP.....mit Foto • Klangfuzzis.de


Did I miss the post or was there actually anyone from Alpine? Or are all just regular users & some dealers? How did you get the beta version?


----------



## Ale555

Well, some guys don´t run around with a sign where they work.  But anyway...
As I know the guys at Alpine quite some years and they know they get a fast and qualified feedback (and I know what I do with a DSP unlike some other guys over here...) I was asked if I can check that.

BTT: The ones over here who made the update are all happy now, even the one´s who really tried to make it uneasy for the processor... 
Did anyone try if it works on an "overseas" unit?


----------



## ErinH

I just wonder if this fixes the other issues that I and others were having (ie: alt whine/bad channels). 
If so, and in addition, I wonder what happened to the units that were sent back to the Alpine networks in their original countries.... wonder if they were given a fresh flash or replaced or...


----------



## ecbmxer

Wow this is good news. Now that this is fixed, does anybody have thoughts on how the Imprint tune on this unit sounds? Hopefully way way better than the old Imprint with good sub bass and midbass.


----------



## ErinH

Toko has gotten mine back from Alpine Indonesia. This is the reply:


> Alpine Indonesia has repaired your PXA-H800.
> It is just a matter of setting, don't have a serious problem there.



I'm thinking "what setting?!"

Do they mean a f/w setting or what? Either way, it sounds like the problem's been resolved. Sucks that it took 2 months. I've already moved on to the p99 so I have no use for the h800/c800 any more. May put it up on ebay and wash my hands of it or keep it for use later. I've asked Toko if he would be willing to do a full refund, given the troubles I've had and the fact that I don't have a use. We'll see. I do know this is the last time I trust any piece of equipment's first run.


----------



## evo9

bikinpunk said:


> Toko has gotten mine back from Alpine Indonesia. This is the reply:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking "what setting?!"
> 
> Do they mean a f/w setting or what? Either way, it sounds like the problem's been resolved. Sucks that it took 2 months. I've already moved on to the p99 so I have no use for the h800/c800 any more. May put it up on ebay and wash my hands of it or keep it for use later. I've asked Toko if he would be willing to do a full refund, given the troubles I've had and the fact that I don't have a use. We'll see. I do know this is the last time I trust any piece of equipment's first run.



Wise move would be ebay!





.


----------



## evo9

bikinpunk said:


> Toko has gotten mine back from Alpine Indonesia. This is the reply:
> 
> Alpine Indonesia has repaired your PXA-H800.
> It is just a matter of setting, don't have a serious problem there.
> 
> 
> .


B/S they dont want to admit to their f-up. Best to put the blame on the customer.






.


----------



## ecbmxer

bikinpunk said:


> Toko has gotten mine back from Alpine Indonesia. This is the reply:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm thinking "what setting?!"
> 
> Do they mean a f/w setting or what? Either way, it sounds like the problem's been resolved. Sucks that it took 2 months. I've already moved on to the p99 so I have no use for the h800/c800 any more. May put it up on ebay and wash my hands of it or keep it for use later. I've asked Toko if he would be willing to do a full refund, given the troubles I've had and the fact that I don't have a use. We'll see. I do know this is the last time I trust any piece of equipment's first run.


Let me know if it comes back good and you're trying to unload it. Although I know you paid a bit of a premium to get it first in the US, so you may want more than I can really shell out. Did you actually get rid of the W910 already? If not you should at least hook it up with the H800 and see what it's like.


----------



## ErinH

the w910 is gone. however, I do own a w505 and an optical cable.

if you're interested, shoot me an offer for the set. toko has offered to take the combo back but if someone here wants it for close to what I'd get back, I'd be happy to pass it on rather than send it back.


----------



## robdridan

We'd all appreciate if you could take the time to hook it up and test it again ???? Love to know if the issue has been resolved.


----------



## TokoSpeaker

Dear Friends,

For this processor Alpine H800, as a seller responsibility, we are willing to buy this unit back from Mr. Erin.

For the noise problem, actually there are a solving problem software that we can download it free from Alpine Germany.

alpine-extranet.de • Thema anzeigen - Bass noise problems with PXA-H800
_Here the software update for the PXA-H800 which the bass noise problems on the PXA-H800 can dissolve. Simply restart the PC software and connect the PC to the PXA-H800. Then under Options, select item and selecting the file software download V1003_Main_10AP_Bin_CRC.bin (unpack first the. Zip). Then start the update. Takes about 10 minutes. 
Important: Ensure stable power supply -> no power outage on a PC or PXA-H800 WHILE the transfer. 
. Note: save before user data, because they are lost as new PXA-H800 processor software version is displayed then 1003._

And many customers have tried to install this software and it works well.

If we do any mistakes regarding to this unit, we would like to apologize before.
As a shop or seller, we give our responsibility and we give our best services for our customer.

Thank you.

Best Regards,

TokoSpeaker.com
Featured Products | TokoSpeaker, Toko Speaker, Car Audio, Audio Mobil, Speaker, Tweeter, Midrange, Subwoofer, Capacitor, Resistor, Inductor, Audio


----------



## ErinH

^ thank you for being a responsible seller.


I hate that all this crap has happened. You've been great to deal with. I think Alpine should refund you guys for all the headaches their product has caused you. But, we know that won't happen....


----------



## ET328

bikinpunk said:


> I'm thinking "what setting?!"
> Do they mean a f/w setting or what? Either way, it sounds like the problem's been resolved.


I still think that your unit was broken and software update did not fix it. All other users report of white noise with bass sounds but yout problem was different. 

But then there is this weird thing, why did some users notice the noise also with P.EQ and some did not? Sadly no one answerer to my firmware version question. Now I noticed, that some user had fw version 1.000, but my unit had 1.001. So did Alpine release even more buggy firmware after the initial version and I was one of the "lucky" ones that had it? This latest fw version is 1.003.


----------



## Nathan_C

Hi Guys,

To the Alpine Australia customers, we have tested the unit with the new patch and can confirm the resolution of the audio issue. It will be available for download once we have created the instructions for implementation. The dealer absolutely loves the unit and has been enjoying it without the patch but is looking forward to playing with it a little more with the firmware.


----------



## YellowC4S

Will the H800 work with the Mobridge DA1000 and will it decode the DD/DTS bitsream from an Audi S5 with B&O?


----------



## Ale555

YellowC4S said:


> Will the H800 work with the Mobridge DA1000 and will it decode the DD/DTS bitsream from an Audi S5 with B&O?


The question Must Be if the MoBridge can work with the DTS Signal, the H800 can.
The only Unit where I *Know* the DA Works with is the Audison DSPs (As they are Partners in europe). The DA works in the Audi for sure, One guy has it in His Audi allready. He wanted to check if it Works with the Helix DSP.


----------



## Nathan_C

Hi Guys,

Here is the Alpine Australia link to the update software including install instructions.

Alpine Electronics of Australia

Nathan
Alpine Australia


----------



## TokoSpeaker

Alpine Customer Service is excellent.

Thank you for sharing this software V1.003.
Thank you for your help, Mr. Nathan.


----------



## ET328

TokoSpeaker said:


> Alpine Customer Service is excellent.


I would not use those words. I have seen excellent customer support and Alpine's actions (denial and silence) in this case were far from it.


----------



## skywolf75

Nathan_C said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> Here is the Alpine Australia link to the update software including install instructions.
> 
> Alpine Electronics of Australia
> 
> Nathan
> Alpine Australia


Is this update meant for all countries, or only for Australia?


----------



## nomed

I do not think that H800 have integrated GPS and zone protection like DVD .


----------



## Valkyrie

skywolf75 said:


> Is this update meant for all countries, or only for Australia?


That's the same file that Alpine Aus got from Alpine Germany, so looks like it's a non-region and/or non-language specific firmware update.

Cheers,


----------



## ET328

Another bug, that I talked about earlier, but now I have done better testing:

With master volume set to 0dB (or somewhere between -14 and 0), Euphony or Pro logic switched ON, and you adjust P.EQ or G.EQ to +dB values, H800's output volume is lowered. 

This does not happen in stereo mode or rear fill mode. So you get much lower output levels with Euphony & Pro Logic and EQ adjustment works in a silly way unless you lower master level before adjustment. 
This may not be a big deal with Alpine HU's but when using car OEM HU and volume control (i.e. H800 set to max vol) this sure is an annoying "feature".

So when will Alpine fix this?


----------



## Ale555

ET328 said:


> With master volume set to 0dB (or somewhere between -14 and 0), Euphony or Pro logic switched ON, and you adjust P.EQ or G.EQ to +dB values, H800's output volume is lowered.


Think about it...if you force the unit to put out max level and then you want "even more" by using + in EQ this can only work with lowering the volume of the other Bands.


----------



## ET328

Ale555 said:


> Think about it...if you force the unit to put out max level and then you want "even more" by using + in EQ this can only work with lowering the volume of the other Bands.


I still think it's a firmware bug. It doesn't check sound levels, it just lowers output level (and makes master volume's 12-0dB range useless) no matter what EQ frequency you adjust to + values. 

If this is a design feature, then why does it not do the same in stereo and rear fill modes? In those modes you just get overload if you adjust EQ way too much (that usually requires stacked EQ bands) and that is the correct way to do it.


----------



## s4k4zulu

looks like its moving along good..i will give it few more months before i jump on one


----------



## ET328

I finally installed the PXA-H800 back to my car... And sounds like the H800 has much lower internal dynamic range (or something) than the H701. Output clips (with loud cracking noises vs. H701's soft clipping) at much earlier stage. So I get much lower clean output with the H800 than what I get with H701. Input level adjustment does not help, total usable volumerange is still much lower than with H701. 

This is with a system where H800's volume is set to max and oem head unit controls volume.


----------



## asawendo

ET328 said:


> I finally installed the PXA-H800 back to my car... And sounds like the H800 has much lower internal dynamic range (or something) than the H701. Output clips (with loud cracking noises vs. H701's soft clipping) at much earlier stage. So I get much lower clean output with the H800 than what I get with H701. Input level adjustment does not help, total usable volumerange is still much lower than with H701.
> 
> This is with a system where H800's volume is set to max and oem head unit controls volume.


Have you try to readjust your H800 input and output gain setting? Also have you notice the small icon like blinking speaker on your RUX lcd screen when the output clips?


----------



## ET328

asawendo said:


> Have you try to readjust your H800 input and output gain setting? Also have you notice the small icon like blinking speaker on your RUX lcd screen when the output clips?


H800's gain adjustments do not help, H800 just does not take in and output as much signal as the H701 does. This problem is mostly noticeable with EQ on. For example if you put +9dB at 50Hz (yes, I know, a whopping 9dB), H800 starts to make cracking noises when H700 still outputs clean signal in the same system and listening level. It could very well be, that H700's output is also clipping at that point, but since it does it so cleanly, you don't notice it. But with H800 you surely notice it..

That small output clipping icon usually appears a little late, you already get bad sound breakups before it appears. Input overload does not cause similar cracks, it just clips.

I installed a line driver (my amp does not have input level adjustment) after the H800 and now I get enough gains before this problem arrives. But now there's noise floor problem, I'll have to make a compromise between max output level and noise floor. This, of course, is mainly because in my system H800's volume control is not used.


----------



## n_olympios

Why would you need so much output voltage anyway?


----------



## ET328

n_olympios said:


> Why would you need so much output voltage anyway?


I'm still using my car's original multichannel amplifier and that is designed to take high level (balanced) input. H701's output was just enough for my listening levels.


----------



## asawendo

ET328 said:


> H800's gain adjustments do not help, H800 just does not take in and output as much signal as the H701 does. This problem is mostly noticeable with EQ on. For example if you put +9dB at 50Hz (yes, I know, a whopping 9dB), H800 starts to make cracking noises when H700 still outputs clean signal in the same system and listening level. It could very well be, that H700's output is also clipping at that point, but since it does it so cleanly, you don't notice it. But with H800 you surely notice it..
> 
> That small output clipping icon usually appears a little late, you already get bad sound breakups before it appears. Input overload does not cause similar cracks, it just clips.
> 
> I installed a line driver (my amp does not have input level adjustment) after the H800 and now I get enough gains before this problem arrives. But now there's noise floor problem, I'll have to make a compromise between max output level and noise floor. This, of course, is mainly because in my system H800's volume control is not used.


I see Bro, because you are not the only one having this issue. I solved this problem by readjusting my power amp gain. Also I can confirmed the H701 have higher clean output before clipping than H800. 

Best Regards

Wendo


----------



## Thrill_House

Just got my H800 and C800 today, cant wait to test them out. Will report back!


----------



## ET328

Does anyone know who I should contact at Alpine about that Euphony output level bug? I mean a person that would actually do something about it.

Looks like German Alpine Extranet just deleted my post. I guess it's once again denial and silence treatment by Alpine's technical support.

Problem is this:
With master volume set to 0dB (or somewhere between -12 and 0dB), Euphony or Pro logic switched ON, and you use P.EQ or G.EQ with +dB values, H800's output volume is lowered.

For example: set master volume to 0, start without EQ, switch Euphony ON, set G.EQ or P.EQ ON, adjust one EQ band to +12dB, output level is now also lowered by 12dB. And now master volume control does nothing if adjusted between -12 and 0 dB. Balance also does not work correctly, channel output levels are the same unless you lower master volume below -12dB. Also output levels in x-over setting only have effect after -12 value. 

I'm using 0dB setting because I use my car's head unit to adjust volume. This does not happen in stereo mode or rear fill mode, in those modes everything works as it should.


----------



## ecbmxer

Seems to me that it is designed to be like this so that if you set your amp levels with the EQ flat (all zero), then boost some frequencies afterwards, your not going to clip your amp since you previously set it at 0dB of boost. Can't you just do all your adjustments and then turn up the volume more if needed?


----------



## ET328

ecbmxer said:


> Seems to me that it is designed to be like this so that if you set your amp levels with the EQ flat (all zero), then boost some frequencies afterwards, your not going to clip your amp since you previously set it at 0dB of boost. Can't you just do all your adjustments and then turn up the volume more if needed?


But it doesn't do it in stereo-mode. Surely it should do it in that mode also if it's a feature and not a bug? If it's a feature, then balance should still work correctly. It also sounds like it limits output on just those channels where you adjust the EQ to + values, so master volume between -12 and 0dB still raises output of other channels. So fader and sub adjustment don't keep their settings. 

Sure I can adjust everything for example at -30dB level, then raise master volume until problems appear and then turn up amp gains to compensate lower output. But then I get lower dynamic range/higher noise floor than in stereo mode.


----------



## t3sn4f2

I think it's a feature needed when a .1 channel setup is active. Something about the extra dynamic range (ie gain) the .1 channel needs. IIRC the article below explains this.

The Misunderstood 0.1 LFE Channel in 5.1 Digital Surround Sound


----------



## AWC

ET328 said:


> I still think that your unit was broken and software update did not fix it. All other users report of white noise with bass sounds but yout problem was different.
> 
> But then there is this weird thing, why did some users notice the noise also with P.EQ and some did not? Sadly no one answerer to my firmware version question. Now I noticed, that some user had fw version 1.000, but my unit had 1.001. So did Alpine release even more buggy firmware after the initial version and I was one of the "lucky" ones that had it? This latest fw version is 1.003.


Is all of your noise introduced after the auto-tune was ran? (too many pages, can't find it) I ask this because alot of what you are describing is very similar to many of the issues you run up against trying to get imprint perfected on both the 9887 and the H650. If so, I have solutions for alot of these issues.


----------



## ET328

AWC said:


> Is all of your noise introduced after the auto-tune was ran? (too many pages, can't find it) I ask this because alot of what you are describing is very similar to many of the issues you run up against trying to get imprint perfected on both the 9887 and the H650. If so, I have solutions for alot of these issues.


I haven't used autotune. Bass modulated noise was there when you switched EQ on. But that problem was solved by the software update. This Euphony thing is a different matter.


----------



## asawendo

ET328 said:


> I haven't used autotune. Bass modulated noise was there when you switched EQ on. But that problem was solved by the software update. This Euphony thing is a different matter.


I find it out if we are using dolby digital and dts the rear channel of H800 is more powerful than H701 (with the same identical gain, x-over, eq, ta) But this powerful output level will reduced significantly when we are using euphony. I try to understand this phenomenom because maybe euphony work with very different alghorithma. I need confirmation about this. Thx

Best regards

Wendo


----------



## n_olympios

My apologies if this has been answered already: is it true that when you connect a digital source to it, control via AINET is not possible?


----------



## asawendo

n_olympios said:


> My apologies if this has been answered already: is it true that when you connect a digital source to it, control via AINET is not possible?


It depend on a selected Alpine Head Unit you are using. For your info any digital source via optical / toslink actually bypassing analog output from ainet. Please CMIIW.

Best Regards

Wendo


----------



## Thrill_House

So I finally got my unit setup at home for the first time and I must say my initial impressions of this unit are very good, I currently have it running optically and it sounds fantastic! There was the initial noise issue that people spoke of but the fw update completely took care of that problem and now I have crystal clear sound from this unit. I cant wait to get it setup in the car and really give it a workout! BTW on a sidenote, I really like the RUX controller for this unit!


----------



## ET328

Thrill_House said:


> So I finally got my unit setup at home for the first time and I must say my initial impressions of this unit are very good, I currently have it running optically and it sounds fantastic! There was the initial noise issue that people spoke of but the fw update completely took care of that problem and now I have crystal clear sound from this unit. I cant wait to get it setup in the car and really give it a workout! BTW on a sidenote, I really like the RUX controller for this unit!


If possible in your home setup, test with Euphony and settings similar I mentioned in message #1099.


----------



## basicxj

I'm going to keep this unit on my radar as a possible integration solution with my factory NAV/Dynaudio system and hope all the bugs get ironed out via firmware updates from Alpine. I was looking through the owner's manual here (for prospective PXA H800 owners to read):

http://www.alpine.com.pl/fileadmin/user_upload/manuals/car_audio_manuals/RUX-C800/OM_RUX-C800_EN.pdf

I noticed this version of the owner's manual doesn't come with the usual connections and installation section, and was wondering if owners of this unit who've already done the install could confirm that there is a separate installation manual available in the box...or for download. Anyone???


----------



## n_olympios

Why use the polish version of Alpine's site? 

Anyway, here's the installation manual (usually indentifiable by the IM prefix in the filename).


----------



## basicxj

n_olympios said:


> Why use the polish version of Alpine's site?
> 
> Anyway, here's the installation manual (usually indentifiable by the IM prefix in the filename).


Excellent point (was the only link "the google" brought up for me) and thank you.


----------



## ecbmxer

Man, I've been looking through that H800 manual and that processor seriously does it all! So many options, especially like how you can draw your own curve you can choose to just let it auto time align your stuff then EQ it manually. They should take some of this technology (really just options and software) and put it into a new H100 Imprint processor and sell it for around $200 instead of the $120 or so they go for now. I'm going to hold off and eventually have to get one of these H800s it would seem.


----------



## Thrill_House

Ok so I finally got the unit installed and running in my car tonight but I have a couple of questions that hopefully someone here knows how to answer. One is how come in 3way plus sub mode I can go in and turn the tweets, subs and midbass drivers on and off but the midrange's are set to permenatley on without the option to change it. And the second question is how do I get the subwoofer control to work through my h.u. (dva-9861ri), I currently only have balance/fade/volume but my sub control is gone? I cant seem to enable it in the h.u.'s menu either.


----------



## musicfan

Well, I have my ina-w910 HU installed, I have my 7 channels of amplification installed, and I'm in the final stages of installing my 6 speakers & sub. Any updates on when this thing will finally be available for purchase from authorized dealers in the US?

Anyone want to loan me an H701 until then?


----------



## RHI-SEE

musicfan said:


> Well, I have my ina-w910 HU installed, I have my 7 channels of amplification installed, and I'm in the final stages of installing my 6 speakers & sub. Any updates on when this thing will finally be available for purchase from authorized dealers in the US?
> 
> Anyone want to loan me an H701 until then?



If you really want one and they are not available yet, I do recomend Tokospeaker.
His communication has been fantastic with me and his gone out of his way to help me. 

Still cant believe it isnt available in the US yet.


----------



## Pambs

When will this be availiale? is there a final price after all?


----------



## ET328

Does anyone know: what Alpine head units are compatible to control the PXA-H800? I have seen the Italian compatibility pdf that was posted earlier, but I'm more interested if older models also work as long as they have ai-net connector?


----------



## ecbmxer

I would also like to know AI head unit compatibility.


----------



## Thrill_House

Ive got my H800 running off an older unit, DVA-9861ri through ainet and optical. The only thing I lost was my sub control, otherwise it works the same as it did when it was connected to the H701.


----------



## ecbmxer

So you can get to all the EQ bands, etc through the HU? Nice. But kinda weird you lost sub control.


----------



## Thrill_House

ecbmxer said:


> So you can get to all the EQ bands, etc through the HU? Nice. But kinda weird you lost sub control.


No no, you do not have access to any of the processors functions, for that you will still either need a laptop of the RUX controller. You only retain very basic controls, ie: balance, fade, defeat and on some decks sub control.


----------



## wdemetrius1

musicfan said:


> Well, I have my ina-w910 HU installed, I have my 7 channels of amplification installed, and I'm in the final stages of installing my 6 speakers & sub. Any updates on when this thing will finally be available for purchase from authorized dealers in the US?
> 
> Anyone want to loan me an H701 until then?




Concerning availability, the last I have heard is CES next year...


----------



## ecbmxer

Thrill_House said:


> No no, you do not have access to any of the processors functions, for that you will still either need a laptop of the RUX controller. You only retain very basic controls, ie: balance, fade, defeat and on some decks sub control.


Oh well that sucks. Weird that with the H701 you can still have full control but not with the newer processor.


----------



## highly

ecbmxer said:


> Oh well that sucks. Weird that with the H701 you can still have full control but not with the newer processor.


There's actually a thread that gets into why they made that choice somewhere on the forum...



wdemetrius1 said:


> Concerning availability, the last I have heard is CES next year...


That puts it 'right on time' based on Alpine's regularly scheduled rollout delay doesn't it?


----------



## acidbass303

my H800 just came to me today and i am excited about it. Slight problem, the calibration mic, i couldnt find it in the box.  i will try to contact the seller about it. But i wanted to know if the mic from H701 is similar to h800's mic and can it be used with it? From the pictures they look pretty identical.


----------



## Pambs

where did u get it from and how much if i may ask?
thank you


----------



## senior800

It's a little crappy mic, the same you get with every dsp.

Plastic, very long cable and a 3.5mm jack.


----------



## acidbass303

Pambs said:


> where did u get it from and how much if i may ask?
> thank you


I got it shipped from Singapore. The price, has been PMed to you.


----------



## t3sn4f2

senior800 said:


> It's a little *crappy mic*, the same you get with every dsp.
> 
> Plastic, very long cable and a 3.5mm jack.


http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-sq-forum-technical-advanced/21620-alpine-h650-mic.html


----------



## acidbass303

t3sn4f2 said:


> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-sq-forum-technical-advanced/21620-alpine-h650-mic.html


Thanks, but the mic that comes with h800 looks more like a collar mic and interestingly it is pretty similar to the h701's mic from the pictures i have seen online.


----------



## t3sn4f2

acidbass303 said:


> Thanks, but the mic that comes with h800 looks more like a collar mic and interestingly it is pretty similar to the h701's mic from the pictures i have seen online.


Yeah I figured it wasn't the same. My post was more to show that units like this, that don't have an auto tune as an after thought, will need to come with a quality mic.


----------



## amomacko

I have been patiently waiting for Alpine to release the H800 here in North America. I called Alpine USA today to ask what the target release date was. All they would tell me is this fall.  When I ask which month this fall all I got was late fall - yikes!

Perhaps if Jim Walter is around he could provide an updated availability date.


----------



## acidbass303

The seller was very cooperative, the mic is en route to me now, will take a couple of days at maximum.

I am also waiting for my w910 to arrive but till then i will be using my current HU (non alpine and no Ai net), and i didnt get the RUX C800 for this reason. is there any way to get the H800 to power up without having to use the sound manager software on PC? i cant figure out why did alpine change this one from h701, you could tune and remove the remote, the unit would power on normally. Please do share if anyone has worked out a way to get past this, i cant wait till the w910 arrives to test this DSP out. Thanks.


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

just received my H800 and rux controller last night
2 minor annoying things i have found thus far, the rux isnt standard DIN size, it is actually shorter than my 9887 so will require some mods to my fascia kit, and the whole sound manager software not working on windows 7 64bit, lucky i have a spare old laptop with XP on it that i was able to install it on, though only possibly issue i can forsee is that the old laptop only has USB 1.0, so hopefully it will be ok connecting to the H800.

everything else looks great, had a play with the software and it is very easy to use, cant wait to get this fitted.


----------



## Bollwerk

Considering how common 64-bit Windows 7 is, having the software not work on it is a major oversight.


----------



## ReloadedSS

Bollwerk said:


> Considering how common 64-bit Windows 7 is, having the software not work on it is a major oversight.


Qft. A deal breaker for me, as all my machines run win7 64-bit.


----------



## robdridan

I am amazed Alpine USA still hasn't released this. Maybe Jim has found more bugs than anyone else to fix ? Doesn't seem like a "global" company by any standards. For Australia to get something before the USA is unheard of.....


----------



## RHI-SEE

acidbass303 said:


> The seller was very cooperative, the mic is en route to me now, will take a couple of days at maximum.
> 
> I am also waiting for my w910 to arrive but till then i will be using my current HU (non alpine and no Ai net), and i didnt get the RUX C800 for this reason. is there any way to get the H800 to power up without having to use the sound manager software on PC? i cant figure out why did alpine change this one from h701, you could tune and remove the remote, the unit would power on normally. Please do share if anyone has worked out a way to get past this, i cant wait till the w910 arrives to test this DSP out. Thanks.


There was talk of being able to Chop up an Ai-net Cable and make the trigger wire power on normal 12v as the trigger wire. Not sure if it has been done yet but it might be something worth looking into.


----------



## ET328

RHI-SEE said:


> There was talk of being able to Chop up an Ai-net Cable and make the trigger wire power on normal 12v as the trigger wire. Not sure if it has been done yet but it might be something worth looking into.


I'm pretty sure it will not work. An adapter that supplies 12V and simulated ai-net bus did not wake up my H800.


----------



## ET328

ReloadedSS said:


> Qft. A deal breaker for me, as all my machines run win7 64-bit.


It works in Virtual PC (and probably also in VMWare).


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

ET328 said:


> It works in Virtual PC (and probably also in VMWare).


are you able to provide instructions on how to get this to work?
i would prefer to use my current laptop to tune anyway

have no experience in Virtual PC, but do work in IT so could probably figure it out with a decent set of instructions


----------



## ET328

2LOUD2OLD said:


> are you able to provide instructions on how to get this to work?
> i would prefer to use my current laptop to tune anyway
> 
> have no experience in Virtual PC, but do work in IT so could probably figure it out with a decent set of instructions


Here is a post I wrote earlier:
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1321433-post779.html

First you need to install Virtual PC, (if your Win7 edition supports it)
Windows Virtual PC: Home Page

If it does not support, then VMWare Player, but then you also need XP installation CD
Create an XP Mode for Windows 7 Home Versions & Vista - How-To Geek


----------



## ecbmxer

So you cannot use this thing w/o either an AInet HU or having the RUX controller, despite the fact that it has stand alone software and can be tuned via a computer? That's crazy.


----------



## acidbass303

ecbmxer said:


> So you cannot use this thing w/o either an AInet HU or having the RUX controller, despite the fact that it has stand alone software and can be tuned via a computer? That's crazy.


Sadly yes 
I wish alpine guys do something about it. H701 is back in the car for now..


----------



## highly

ecbmxer said:


> So you cannot use this thing w/o either an AInet HU or having the RUX controller, despite the fact that it has stand alone software and can be tuned via a computer? That's crazy.


From Alpine's standpoint WE (clued-in endusers) are the minority. Most people have no idea what an H800 is/does and how to use it and will have it installed and tuned by the shop. To make life easier for the shops, access to 'screw things up' has been made slightly less accessible to the end user. If you spring for the RUX you can do nearly everything the software does. If not, there's the laptop. For the rest of the world, it gets installed, sounds great, and 'just works'.

I agree, that isn't optimal for us. I'd rather they put a PIN number to access settings over AInet. Then if the PIN is not set it acts as the 700/701 did. For shops they can set the PIN and it locks the menus out from the end user. End user buys a RUX and the RUX has full access. End user signs a waiver, shop gives them the PIN. It would have the side benefit of locking down your tune for the really paranoid competitor. No pin, no play.

They didn't do that, though.

<shrugs>


----------



## ET328

highly said:


> Most people have no idea what an H800 is/does and how to use it and will have it installed and tuned by the shop. To make life easier for the shops, access to 'screw things up' has been made slightly less accessible to the end user.


But now people that have car's OEM head unit need to have also RUX installed somewhere, otherwise H800 will not turn on. So your theory is a little flawed in this regard, Alpine actually made things worse in this case.


----------



## highly

ET328 said:


> But now people that have car's OEM head unit need to have also RUX installed somewhere, otherwise H800 will not turn on. So your theory is a little flawed in this regard, Alpine actually made things worse in this case.


Yeah, no explanation for the stupid power-on issue. Oh, and it's not my theory; it is a reiteration of the intent as explained by our currently MIA Alpine rep earlier in this very thread.

Read it here for yourself

You will also note that Jim indicates that the unit is "100% functional without the RUX". We see how that worked out.


----------



## ET328

highly said:


> You will also note that Jim indicates that the unit is "100% functional without the RUX". We see how that worked out.


Yes, but the H800 has not been released in USA, I read somewhere that they may fix this with firmware. So Jim could still be right...


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

ET328 said:


> Here is a post I wrote earlier:
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1321433-post779.html
> 
> First you need to install Virtual PC, (if your Win7 edition supports it)
> Windows Virtual PC: Home Page
> 
> If it does not support, then VMWare Player, but then you also need XP installation CD
> Create an XP Mode for Windows 7 Home Versions & Vista - How-To Geek


Awesome, thanks for that, worked a treat in VMWare Player, next step will be to install the H800 in the car


----------



## eviling

their are other VM ware programs, but not many support external instalitons, at leas tthe free ones, the virtual hard drive isn't accessorible or rather isn't a readable format in windows. VMware how ever the real thing does have a readable virtual hard drive, they also don't support external plug ins like thumb drives, i do believe VMware does though. its been awhile since ive used it, but it's not cheap software, be easier to just run a dual boot PC.


----------



## ET328

eviling said:


> their are other VM ware programs, but not many support external instalitons, at leas tthe free ones, the virtual hard drive isn't accessorible or rather isn't a readable format in windows. VMware how ever the real thing does have a readable virtual hard drive, they also don't support external plug ins like thumb drives, i do believe VMware does though. its been awhile since ive used it, but it's not cheap software, be easier to just run a dual boot PC.


VMware Player is free and allows to create and run virtual machines.


----------



## eviling

ET328 said:


> VMware Player is free and allows to create and run virtual machines.


not VMware player, VMware. well, it's VMware work station, the curren verstion is 7, or at least the verstion ive been running. ive never used vmware player, but ive used virtual box, which is another free Virtual machine software. but with virtual box, you cant do much inside the VM.


----------



## oldno7brand

Will the H-800 work with the CDA-7949 (I know it's a dinosaur but I love it)
Currently have an aging ERAG-320 (Literally since 1997) scary I know

I was on the fence thinking about going with the old PXA-H600 or the Audison Bit one.... 

But if this will work I like this better.... down the road upgradibility.... and what I need now.... lots of adjustability and a good D/A.
I like that it has 24 bit converters and DTS and Dolby etc.

Plus the RUC would fit right in where my ERAG display is currently.
All I would need to do is change the LED out in the button to green lol

Am I nuts?...probably would give my 7949 a heart attack on AI net


----------



## eekern

FYI PXA-H800 delayed til next spring


----------



## bginvestor

eekern said:


> FYI PXA-H800 delayed til next spring


Really? I was keeping a eye on this one since I have a IDA-X305s..


----------



## evo9

eekern said:


> FYI PXA-H800 delayed til next spring




I knew it was a POS! 


Maybe by next spring along with the patches being applied, they apply some more rca inputs & outputs. 



.


----------



## ErinH

eekern said:


> FYI PXA-H800 delayed til next spring


Not surprised at all.


----------



## Petter

Delayed in US only or will sales be halted everywhere?
And what about those already on the market in Europe and Asia? Pull backed or will the poor buyers sit there with a crappy unit?


----------



## Thrill_House

Im loving the unit I got from asia, no problems to speak of and the sound is fantastic!


----------



## acidbass303

Love mine a lot.

But i am liking PL II more than euphony..
I guess the euphony thing takes time to get used to. Still haven't tried the roadEQ feature.
And oh, the AutoTCR bit is really screwed, it always ends up delaying my fronts by 20ms! Manual TCR with distance measurement is perfect.


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

i also love mine, instantly made the system sound better and now that i have added a CHA-S624 changer for its optical out it is sound even better again 

don't understand why it is being delayed in the US very odd


----------



## eviling

hmm thats funny the .3 is gonna be a spring release as well it seems. i wonder why two 99% done sound processors are waiting several months to release? :-\ really ****ing up my plans


----------



## Booger

I am hearing 2013....


----------



## Petter

Especially since one of them is being sold outside US so it appears to 100% done there. 

So could it be some IP problem they have ran into in the US?



eviling said:


> hmm thats funny the .3 is gonna be a spring release as well it seems. i wonder why two 99% done sound processors are waiting several months to release? :-\ really ****ing up my plans


----------



## The Tube Doctor

We've got them here in Hong Kong. 
I'll be bringing a couple of them up to Beijing next month for 
some installs. (HAT, Mosconi, Morel & RaySat)
Curious that the USA is delaying official release.............


----------



## 00flash00

hi boys.

i need help. i have ALPINE showcar in slovakia. i have IVA-d800r , pxa-h800, rux-c800, nve-m300, tue, 400bt, and more.
My problem is navigation guide sound. Today buy KCE-900e but i have no diagram for connection for this.

I connect *rgb out* in nve to navigation input in kce-900e next connect *remote out* in IVA-D800R to remote in in KCE-900E
*Guide control and display control and guide output and NTSC video output in KCE-900e not connected*
In RUX-C800 i switch NAVI MIX SETUP to ON

but sound in navigation no work
Its my connection OK?

btw: this is my car 
www.audio.sk/?page=article&id=339


----------



## Ale555

Obviously you will have to connect the guide. RTFM...


----------



## acidbass303

00flash00 said:


> hi boys.
> 
> i need help. i have ALPINE showcar in slovakia. i have IVA-d800r , pxa-h800, rux-c800, nve-m300, tue, 400bt, and more.
> My problem is navigation guide sound. Today buy KCE-900e but i have no diagram for connection for this.
> 
> I connect *rgb out* in nve to navigation input in kce-900e next connect *remote out* in IVA-D800R to remote in in KCE-900E
> *Guide control and display control and guide output and NTSC video output in KCE-900e not connected*
> In RUX-C800 i switch NAVI MIX SETUP to ON
> 
> but sound in navigation no work
> Its my connection OK?
> 
> btw: this is my car
> AUDIO International Slovakia - Alpine, Magnat, DLS, Heco, Bernstein, Tannoy, Oehlbach, StandAudio


BTW, thats a sexy install!


----------



## 00flash00

procesor no have guide connect  where connect the guide output from kce-900?


----------



## droth

Have a very simialar setup myself, on the processor harness is a NAVI audio RCA. Connect that to the guide out on the 900 and it works.


----------



## 00flash00

I do not understand. the processor will not get. The processor is not have input for navigation. One side give of the guide out in KCE-900 and the other side where I connect?


----------



## droth

The RCA input for nav on processor is in wiring harness (with power, remote etcwires) not on acutal processor.


----------



## 00flash00

I unfortunately do not see the wiring harness, the processor in my ceiling. wiring harness probably does not extend to the ceiling to the radio. It is not another option?


----------



## ErinH

droth said:


> The RCA input for nav on processor is in wiring harness (with power, remote etcwires) not on acutal processor.


Yep.


----------



## RHI-SEE

you need to connect the RCA to the port on the wiring harness and connect the guide wire. I have the exact same setup. 
there is no way around it. you need to get to the wiring harness.


----------



## basicxj

Thrill_House said:


> Im loving the unit I got from asia, no problems to speak of and the sound is fantastic!


Do you mind if I ask which vendor?


----------



## vaernes

I bought one on Ebay from Hong Kong. Happy with the sound, but I need to fiddle around with it more and lower the gain on my amp before making any serious remarks The guy is still selling them on Ebay I think.

Anyone now how to get a KWE-610A? Or an alternative cable?


----------



## basicxj

vaernes said:


> I bought one on Ebay from Hong Kong. Happy with the sound, but I need to fiddle around with it more and lower the gain on my amp before making any serious remarks The guy is still selling them on Ebay I think.



I saw that listing, with the RUX controller as an option for extra charge. I was wondering if the seller was legit, seeing as how most of his feedback comes from selling light bulbs.

Normally I would purchase local through an authorized retailer, but it seems the North American market won't be seeing any of these any time soon.



vaernes said:


> Anyone now how to get a KWE-610A? Or an alternative cable?


Amazon.com: Alpine KWE-610A Optical Fiber Cable: Electronics

While I can't say that the price is attractive, Amazon retailer Pacific Stereo seems to have one available.


----------



## ErinH

I've actually been meaning to list my kwa optical cable here but haven't had a chance. Going to ask $85 shipped. If anyone is interested, LMK.


----------



## basicxj

Anyone using the PXA-H800 as an OEM interface with a Bluetooth-equipped factory head unit? 

After reading about the JBL MS-8's delay and the effect of that delay on phone calls made through OEM units via Bluetooth ( resulting in a digital echo), I was just wondering if anyone has noticed a similar delay of the signal after it's been piped through the PXA-H800. At this stage I understand that will boil down to European/Asian users (or those who've imported one of these processors).


----------



## acidbass303

basicxj said:


> Anyone using the PXA-H800 as an OEM interface with a Bluetooth-equipped factory head unit?
> 
> After reading about the JBL MS-8's delay and the effect of that delay on phone calls made through OEM units via Bluetooth ( resulting in a digital echo), I was just wondering if anyone has noticed a similar delay of the signal after it's been piped through the PXA-H800. At this stage I understand that will boil down to European/Asian users (or those who've imported one of these processors).


I havent tried any other HU (OEM or aftermarket) but no problems with ina-w910bt so far..


----------



## RHI-SEE

I Do Recomend tokospeaker.
His communication was fantastic and helped me out when i had an issue with mine (my own fault)


----------



## ET328

Could someone with a KCE-900 please measure what voltage is used in the Guide wire? 
Does anyone know what function that Guide wire actually has? There is on/off setting for navi mixing so why is the wire needed? Does it allow guide audio to be heard if master volume is adjusted to minimum setting?


----------



## Thrill_House

basicxj said:


> Do you mind if I ask which vendor?


I bought it from a chinese vendor on ebay. I also but the RUX from him as well.


----------



## ET328

What H800's volume levels (displayed by the PC control program or HU) are you using when you have your system set at normal or high output listening levels?


----------



## deepsky

I have recently hooked up my front left and right channels via RCA splitters to one of the Alpine analog AI-net inputs via an Alpine adapter. This is to correct a design flaw in the implementation of the processor, in which you should be able to easily switch between 5.1 and stereo on the primary Aux input, but instead have to do a setup change, and cycle to power to do so. 

The level from my head unit was too high, so I am using 12dB attenuators. This setup seems to work well, there does not seem to be any clipping of the signal at this level, yet there is a distortion in the low mid-range at a certain frequency. The organ opening of Green Onions by Booker T and the MG's hits it right on the head. I have tried even more attenuation, and it doesn't help. I believe this is a similar issue to that which affected the unit on the main Aux input, that was fixed with a firmware update, but this is even more apparent. Can anyone else check this?


----------



## ET328

One more bug or "feature" is the input level adjustment: only low/high selection effects to the input overload indicator, adjusting variable input level setting seems to have no effect to it.

But could someone (if there still are other H800 owners than me...) please tell what H800's volume levels (displayed by the PC control program or HU) are you using when you have your system set at normal or high output listening levels?


----------



## acidbass303

ET328 said:


> One more bug or "feature" is the input level adjustment: only low/high selection effects to the input overload indicator, adjusting variable input level setting seems to have no effect to it.
> 
> But could someone (if there still are other H800 owners than me...) please tell *what H800's volume levels (displayed by the PC control program or HU) are you using when you have your system set at normal or high output listening levels?*


22-26 volume on W910


----------



## ET328

acidbass303 said:


> 22-26 volume on W910


Could you please check what dB value PC control program's volume slider shows when you have 22 volume setting? W910 has a volume scale of 0-35, but how that corresponds to dBs is a mystery to me.

Since you have the W910, there is also another thing that I'm very interested to know. How does navigation volume adjustment work in your system: if you adjust W910's main volume to a low value (1-3) or zero, do you still hear navi guidance? If you do hear it, does W910's nav.mix adjustment (0-15) have any effect to it or just H800's nav.mix adjustment (-10 - +10) ?


----------



## asawendo

ET328 said:


> One more bug or "feature" is the input level adjustment: only low/high selection effects to the input overload indicator, adjusting variable input level setting seems to have no effect to it.
> 
> But could someone (if there still are other H800 owners than me...) please tell what H800's volume levels (displayed by the PC control program or HU) are you using when you have your system set at normal or high output listening levels?


Mine set at 20-25 Bro


----------



## musicfan

ET328 said:


> W910 has a volume scale of 0-35, but how that corresponds to dBs is a mystery to me.


On the RCA outputs, the w910 is clean up to 31, and starts clipping at 32. Not sure if the same is true of the ai-net output.


----------



## ET328

ET328 said:


> Since you have the W910, there is also another thing that I'm very interested to know. How does navigation volume adjustment work in your system: if you adjust W910's main volume to a low value (1-3) or zero, do you still hear navi guidance? If you do hear it, does W910's nav.mix adjustment (0-15) have any effect to it or just H800's nav.mix adjustment (-10 - +10) ?


Anyone? I'm still very interested to know how this works with the W910. With my oem-system setup this does not work correctly and I just wonder if it's just another H800 bug or does an Alpine HU handle this differently?


----------



## RHI-SEE

I Will attempt to answer your question tho it may be wrong. I Have the D800 unit connected through optical/ai-net to the H800.

When the Volume is turned down on say, radio, to 1-3, and i come up to a speed camera, the navi volume is all the same. When i turn down the volume in NAV on my headunit, the beeping saying im approaching the speed camera varies with that volume, but the beeping saying that im exceeding the speed limit, is controlled by navi-mix via the H800.

Hopefully that is an answer you were after? i tried to decipher the question as best i could


----------



## ET328

RHI-SEE said:


> I Will attempt to answer your question tho it may be wrong. I Have the D800 unit connected through optical/ai-net to the H800.
> 
> When the Volume is turned down on say, radio, to 1-3, and i come up to a speed camera, the navi volume is all the same. When i turn down the volume in NAV on my headunit, the beeping saying im approaching the speed camera varies with that volume, but the beeping saying that im exceeding the speed limit, is controlled by navi-mix via the H800.
> 
> Hopefully that is an answer you were after? i tried to decipher the question as best i could


Thanks for your reply. Sorry, but I'm still a little confused about this... When you say "the navi volume is all the same", what does that mean? Does that mean that the navi guidance is also heard at that same (very low) level? What happens if you turn main volume to 0, is navi guidance muted?

My problem is that there appears to be no setting for navi guidance minimum volume. If I turn the main volume to 0, sound via the guide input is also adjusted and drops to 0 level. And it should not be that way. So it appears that the only way to get navi guidance in this case is to mix it after H800's output with analog mixing. But that solution has problems since H800's output effects mix balance at higher volumes. I haven't tested what happens if I do analog mixing and also split navi audio to the guide input. Maybe front channel TA-delay is small enough and I get no weird echo sounds in navi guidance.


----------



## deepsky

deepsky said:


> I have recently hooked up my front left and right channels via RCA splitters to one of the Alpine analog AI-net inputs via an Alpine adapter. This is to correct a design flaw in the implementation of the processor, in which you should be able to easily switch between 5.1 and stereo on the primary Aux input, but instead have to do a setup change, and cycle to power to do so.
> 
> The level from my head unit was too high, so I am using 12dB attenuators. This setup seems to work well, there does not seem to be any clipping of the signal at this level, yet there is a distortion in the low mid-range at a certain frequency. The organ opening of Green Onions by Booker T and the MG's hits it right on the head. I have tried even more attenuation, and it doesn't help. I believe this is a similar issue to that which affected the unit on the main Aux input, that was fixed with a firmware update, but this is even more apparent. Can anyone else check this?


Can anyone check this out for me? Either my unit is bad, or there is a flaw that Alpine needs to address. Thanks!


----------



## Spectral

Hello, nice thread, many useful info tq guys


----------



## ET328

ET328 said:


> Thanks for your reply. Sorry, but I'm still a little confused about this... When you say "the navi volume is all the same", what does that mean? Does that mean that the navi guidance is also heard at that same (very low) level? What happens if you turn main volume to 0, is navi guidance muted?
> 
> My problem is that there appears to be no setting for navi guidance minimum volume. If I turn the main volume to 0, sound via the guide input is also adjusted and drops to 0 level. And it should not be that way. So it appears that the only way to get navi guidance in this case is to mix it after H800's output with analog mixing. But that solution has problems since H800's output effects mix balance at higher volumes. I haven't tested what happens if I do analog mixing and also split navi audio to the guide input. Maybe front channel TA-delay is small enough and I get no weird echo sounds in navi guidance.


Still interested to know how navi guidance works at 0 or low volume levels with the W910 and should I add this to H800's bug list..


----------



## RHI-SEE

Not to sure sorry.


----------



## Mr12voltwires

ET328 said:


> Could someone with a KCE-900 please measure what voltage is used in the Guide wire?
> Does anyone know what function that Guide wire actually has? There is on/off setting for navi mixing so why is the wire needed? Does it allow guide audio to be heard if master volume is adjusted to minimum setting?


I want to say the guide wire is 5V, but give /////Alpine tech support a call to make sure. I know it's to tell an older /////Alpine H/U that there's a navi attached to it. Early Alpine navigation (N751 & 851) systems had them. I needed a KCE-900 for my W505 in order for the B200's audio to go through the 505 properly.

I went through my archives and couldn't come up with a wiring diagram, only a product description:
KCE-900E = Audio/Video Adapter for NVE-N851A/NVE-N852A to Interface with PXA-H900 to enable Navi MIX Function


----------



## ET328

Mr12voltwires said:


> I want to say the guide wire is 5V, but give /////Alpine tech support a call to make sure. I know it's to tell an older /////Alpine H/U that there's a navi attached to it. Early Alpine navigation (N751 & 851) systems had them. I needed a KCE-900 for my W505 in order for the B200's audio to go through the 505 properly.


I already have done some testing and with the H800 that wire with 5V connected mutes navi guide RCA-input (when the input is already enabled via RUX or PC software). I haven't yet checked if it reverses operating behaviour if RUX/PC guide input setting is set to disabled. So it doesn't send signals to the HU, it's only for DSP's guide input control. And looks like it doesn't solve navi audio mixing problems with low/zero volume levels


----------



## drivensteven

Can the H800 decode 5.1 surround from the optical out of a Sony Playstation 3 playing a DVD/bluray disc/PS3 game? 

Does anyone tried it on H701 as well?

Thanks.


----------



## ecbmxer

This is the only thread I've seen talking about the Alpine NAV guide wire. I have an H100 that also has a guide input and I've wondered what it really does. At first I thought that was the only method that nav voice prompts were sent to the processor (not true?). What happens if you don't connect it up at all? (assuming you have a W900/910 w/ guide output) 

So what I am understanding is that if you were to get another processor instead of the H800, there would be no use for the guide wire at all from the W900? It's only when two alpine units are connected together, right?


----------



## acidbass303

Any ideas about the orientation/ direction of the H800's mic when imprint auto eq tuning? Should it placed horizontally or vertically? (on a tripod). Does it have any effect?


----------



## asawendo

drivensteven said:


> Can the H800 decode 5.1 surround from the optical out of a Sony Playstation 3 playing a DVD/bluray disc/PS3 game?
> 
> Does anyone tried it on H701 as well?
> 
> Thanks.


Yes it can Bro! I already use both H800 and H701 with my blueray Sony PS3 and it sound terrific for 5.1 optical input.


----------



## maKe|

Uhh, can someone clarify a few things for me.

I asked from my dealer that will H800 work with my 7998R through optical out and using Ai-net connection so I can retain volume/bal/fad/sub phase and level controls using the HU. All the tuning would be done using laptop (no rux) and when it's done the computer gets plugged off and I use only the HU for basic purposes mentioned above.

Even Alpine and he did not know would it work, so I have to buy a H800 and find out myself lol. Sounds pretty fishy that even Alpine don't know the answer.


----------



## hdrugs

my h800 is non updated

i got alternator whine

test done
changed ground (whines)
removed rca (no whine)
run h800 without engine running (no whine)

i might try changing ground once a again and then try running a shorter ground

if anyone else has had this problem what did u try and did it work?


----------



## hdrugs

sorry for double post

i changed the ground again prob was still there

i changed the rca's around out of all my rca's there was only one set which didn't whine (home built rca)

the other 3 sets whine 

sony pair
stinger pair 
another home built pair

no matter what combination theres only one set which doesn't whine anyone know whats up?


----------



## joselmartinez

hdrugs said:


> sorry for double post
> 
> i changed the ground again prob was still there
> 
> i changed the rca's around out of all my rca's there was only one set which didn't whine (home built rca)
> 
> the other 3 sets whine
> 
> sony pair
> stinger pair
> another home built pair
> 
> no matter what combination theres only one set which doesn't whine anyone know whats up?


Try to Ground the RCA'S and the chasis of HU, DSP and AMP.


----------



## hdrugs

i'll try it when i wake up in the morning because i saw another tread on the forums about this using a wire wrapped around the rca plugs


----------



## evo9

Any word on when this pile is going to be released in the USA?





.


----------



## Thrill_House

maKe| said:


> Uhh, can someone clarify a few things for me.
> 
> I asked from my dealer that will H800 work with my 7998R through optical out and using Ai-net connection so I can retain volume/bal/fad/sub phase and level controls using the HU. All the tuning would be done using laptop (no rux) and when it's done the computer gets plugged off and I use only the HU for basic purposes mentioned above.
> 
> Even Alpine and he did not know would it work, so I have to buy a H800 and find out myself lol. Sounds pretty fishy that even Alpine don't know the answer.


 Most likely all you will have is defeat/balance/fade if you use it with that h/u. I have a DVA-9861ri which is a much newer Alpine head unit and even it only does defeat/balance/fade but no sub control, which sucks I must admit.


----------



## Unrealistic

evo9 said:


> Any word on when this pile is going to be released in the USA?


Yes, it is a real pile, NOT! 
I've replaced my H701 with the H800 and it just rocks!
Everybody is trying to fault it and I admit, it has some issues.
But it is still a VERY nice processor. 

I am using it with the INA-W910 and the navigation and bluetooth work perfectly...
For control you really need the RUX, but I like it that way.


----------



## ET328

Unrealistic said:


> I am using it with the INA-W910 and the navigation and bluetooth work perfectly...


Could you please answer to this: if you adjust W910's main volume to zero, do you still hear navi guidance? If you do, have you found a setting that controls how loud guidance audio is when the main volume is set to zero? Navi mix seems to adjust just guidance volume vs. music volume but there is no separate setting for guidance minimum volume.


----------



## Unrealistic

ET328 said:


> Could you please answer to this: if you adjust W910's main volume to zero, do you still hear navi guidance? If you do, have you found a setting that controls how loud guidance audio is when the main volume is set to zero? Navi mix seems to adjust just guidance volume vs. music volume but there is no separate setting for guidance minimum volume.


hmm, I'm not sure.
I will test this and get back to you.
Currently I have disabled the nav voice because I like the music better :roll eyes:


----------



## acidbass303

I have my center speaker disconnected at the moment, the enclosure needs to be redone. In the mean while, when i switch to Dolby prologic II or Euphony, the sub output just vanishes totally! It wasnt so with the center speaker on. Any workarounds or ideas? The bass is fine on Stereo and rear fill modes.
Thanks.


----------



## Unrealistic

hmm, I have tried this but It wouldn't work at all.
I am wondering if I ever have had the navi voice...?
Most of the time I would just look at the navi, while listening music.
Maybe I haven't even used the navi voice on the W910...

Sorry to say that I cannot test this more for you.
I am testing another head unit the replace the W910.
This is mostly because of the difficult iPod control and the lack of digital output from the iPod.



ET328 said:


> Could you please answer to this: if you adjust W910's main volume to zero, do you still hear navi guidance? If you do, have you found a setting that controls how loud guidance audio is when the main volume is set to zero? Navi mix seems to adjust just guidance volume vs. music volume but there is no separate setting for guidance minimum volume.


----------



## Thrill_House

Unrealistic said:


> Yes, it is a real pile, NOT!
> I've replaced my H701 with the H800 and it just rocks!
> Everybody is trying to fault it and I admit, it has some issues.
> But it is still a VERY nice processor.
> 
> I am using it with the INA-W910 and the navigation and bluetooth work perfectly...
> For control you really need the RUX, but I like it that way.


Yeah I really love this processor as well, there are some issues with it for sure but they are minor and dont really impede its performance imo. The sound that this produces is just fantastic and there is like zero noise floor as well which is great!


----------



## wdemetrius1

I just quickly read another post, but is the controller still needed when using the w910?


----------



## subwoofery

wdemetrius1 said:


> I just quickly read another post, but is the controller still needed when using the w910?


Not if you plan to use a computer. If not, then yes, the controller is still needed. 

Kelvin


----------



## audioanamoly

Hey everyone! I am new to this forum even though I have been an installer for almost 22 years...I know thats sad! I have been out of the loop for e few years and haven't read this whole thread, but I am curious as to what the "issues" are with the 800 and has everyone here heard the same I have about a release date in the U.S. being "middle of November"? I am getting ready to "pre-order" the proccessor/controller to replace a audio control DQXS/DDC so any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

audioanamoly said:


> Hey everyone! I am new to this forum even though I have been an installer for almost 22 years...I know thats sad! I have been out of the loop for e few years and haven't read this whole thread, but I am curious as to what the "issues" are with the 800 and has everyone here heard the same I have about a release date in the U.S. being "middle of November"? I am getting ready to "pre-order" the proccessor/controller to replace a audio control DQXS/DDC so any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks


I haven't had a single issue with mine and love it.
Have recently been using a bitone and a P99 in mates' cars and I believe the H800 is the far superior unit


----------



## ErinH

2LOUD2OLD said:


> I haven't had a single issue with mine and love it.
> Have recently been using a bitone and a P99 in mates' cars and I believe the H800 is the far superior unit


I believe my test data shows the p99 to perform better than the h800 fed an optical signal.


----------



## audioanamoly

Thanks 2LOUD, I'm sure it's a "class a" processor. I have just seen the word "issues" come up a couple of times in this thread so I was just curious as to what those posts were in regard to. I'm very excited to get my hands on one


----------



## drivensteven

asawendo said:


> Yes it can Bro! I already use both H800 and H701 with my blueray Sony PS3 and it sound terrific for 5.1 optical input.


^^^ Yeah...I'm using it as well. Awesome digital 5.1 surround sound!


----------



## ET328

audioanamoly said:


> Thanks 2LOUD, I'm sure it's a "class a" processor. I have just seen the word "issues" come up a couple of times in this thread so I was just curious as to what those posts were in regard to. I'm very excited to get my hands on one


*Issues: *
- the first firmware had very bad bass modulated noise problems but that was later fixed. Spectrum pics: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1333473-post881.html

- when using Euphony or Pro Logic, balance & fader adjustments are overrun with high main output levels (over -12dB) and also EQ adjustment effects maximum volume. This is clearly a bug, but nobody seems to care about it. Issue description in this post: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1373745-post1099.html

- input overload indicator/setting doesn't function correctly/in a logical way. There is high and low setting and only those have effect to the indicator. Adjusting variable input level setting doesn't have any effect to overload (but it still adjusts volume).

- the unit doesn't turn on without RUX-controller or Alpine HU connected (or PC control software).

- setup is reset if you disconnect backup power lead/power connector.

- navigation audio mixing does not work correctly, but once again looks like nobody else but me cares about it.


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

bikinpunk said:


> I believe my test data shows the p99 to perform better than the h800 fed an optical signal.


ahh but the P99 is a PITA to use 

ease of use is a pretty big factor for me, the menus of the P99 just make no sense, why the hell should you have to go through multiple menus just to pause?
lack of multiple presets is a pretty big fail, only having presets for the TA and EQ is pretty annoying and there is no master preset.
the TA just makes no sense, when I want to delay the right side, I have to adjust the left side, just weird. yes I know the reasoning but it is just not logical or natural.


----------



## jcollin76

Nah, once you get some seat time with it, is pretty easy to navigate.


----------



## co_leonard

2LOUD2OLD said:


> why the hell should you have to go through multiple menus just to pause?


That's weird... to pause playback on my P99, I just press the "DF" button on the remote.


----------



## ErinH

2LOUD2OLD said:


> ahh but the P99 is a PITA to use
> 
> ease of use is a pretty big factor for me, the menus of the P99 just make no sense, why the hell should you have to go through multiple menus just to pause?
> lack of multiple presets is a pretty big fail, only having presets for the TA and EQ is pretty annoying and there is no master preset.
> the TA just makes no sense, when I want to delay the right side, I have to adjust the left side, just weird. yes I know the reasoning but it is just not logical or natural.


I felt the same way until I actually owned it. Now it's easy to roll through. Easier to me than the h800 controller and h701 controller. 

It's all based on what you're used to.

Neither are as easy to navigate as a unit with PC controls... but then again, neither need a PC to control them at that level.


----------



## ErinH

ET328 said:


> *Issues: *
> - the first firmware had very bad bass modulated noise problems but that was later fixed. Spectrum pics: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1333473-post881.html
> 
> - when using Euphony or Pro Logic, balance & fader adjustments are overrun with high main output levels (over -12dB) and also EQ adjustment effects maximum volume. This is clearly a bug, but nobody seems to care about it. Issue description in this post: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1373745-post1099.html
> 
> - input overload indicator/setting doesn't function correctly/in a logical way. There is high and low setting and only those have effect to the indicator. Adjusting variable input level setting doesn't have any effect to overload (but it still adjusts volume).
> 
> - the unit doesn't turn on without RUX-controller or Alpine HU connected (or PC control software).
> 
> - setup is reset if you disconnect backup power lead/power connector.
> 
> - navigation audio mixing does not work correctly, but once again looks like nobody else but me cares about it.


Yes.

and, while I'm happy they resolved these issues (or at least, I'm told they did), the whole issue left such a sour taste in my mouth that I have sworn off alpine products for any foreseeable future. 

the thing that concerns me is I was told the foreign versions were fine to use. then when the problems started cropping up with those pieces, the US version release data was pushed back indefinitely. regardless if the units now work, it all just seems a bit odd/shady/off/whathaveyou and I will no longer be placing my money in to this company. Thus, I sold off my w910 after having it for about 3 weeks. 

My $.02. Like I said, I'm glad others aren't experiencing what I did, but that doesn't make what I experienced any less of a huge PITA.

- Erin


----------



## audioanamoly

Thanks for the info ET328 and bikinpunk. I just pre-ordered the h800 and c800 a couple of days ago after I sold my DQXS/DDC so I hope the "issues" have been resolved.


----------



## Heath

Bad news guys. This processor has been cancelled by Alpine.


----------



## madmaxz

Where did you hear that?


----------



## eviling

he's trolling.


----------



## evo9

Heath said:


> Bad news guys. This processor has been cancelled by Alpine.




Funny................ I saw my local Alpine dealer yesterday. I asked if he heard of a release date for the USA. He said, he could NOT get at straight answer from Alpine. They were talking under their breath on the subject of this ill conceived processor.




.


----------



## eviling

probobly gonna wait for the next batch of goodies of 2012.


----------



## ErinH

eviling said:


> probobly gonna wait for the next batch of goodies of 2012.


lol. I hope you're not waiting on alpine. This was supposed to be released May 2011 (this year). Got pushed back until late this year and still nothing. 

On top of that, there are about 3-4 other companies with DSP's that should have been released by now according to their own original release target dates.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> lol. I hope you're not waiting on alpine. This was supposed to be released May 2011 (this year). Got pushed back until late this year and still nothing.
> 
> On top of that, there are about 3-4 other companies with DSP's that should have been released by now according to their own original release target dates.


yeah i know, the .3 from RF was pushed back indef. but they did some seriouse revsions, idk wtf alpine has up their sleeves, maybe an american version with 10 outputs!  haha i said that to someone hopefully but i doubt it, thier probobly just having production issues.


----------



## audioanamoly

Well I sure hope they are not scratching it from production, I'm already pre-paid on one!


----------



## audioanamoly

Well I just spoke to Chris @ Alpine and he stated very clearly that as far as he knows, they are NOT scrapping it. They are correcting a problem they were having with losing all the settings when power was disconnected. Meaning, you would have to re-tune from scratch after power was lost. He says they are still saying "November" for release. As to "when in november?"... he didn't know. I would say late November maybe December would be my very "hopeful" assumption.


----------



## evo9

audioanamoly said:


> Well I just spoke to Chris @ Alpine and he stated very clearly that as far as he knows, they are NOT scrapping it. They are correcting a problem they were having with losing all the settings when power was disconnected. Meaning, you would have to re-tune from scratch after power was lost. He says they are still saying "November" for release. As to "when in november?"... he didn't know. I would say late November maybe December would be my very "hopeful" assumption.



Not to be a smart ass but............2011 or 2012???





.


----------



## ET328

audioanamoly said:


> Well I just spoke to Chris @ Alpine and he stated very clearly that as far as he knows, they are NOT scrapping it. They are correcting a problem they were having with losing all the settings when power was disconnected. Meaning, you would have to re-tune from scratch after power was lost. He says they are still saying "November" for release. As to "when in november?"... he didn't know. I would say late November maybe December would be my very "hopeful" assumption.


You don't lose all settings, you just lose basic setup (output and input channel setup, it's a quick job to set those). All presets are still there once you have redone the setup (but output channel setup has to be identical to the old one).


----------



## eviling

audioanamoly said:


> Well I just spoke to Chris @ Alpine and he stated very clearly that as far as he knows, they are NOT scrapping it. They are correcting a problem they were having with losing all the settings when power was disconnected. Meaning, you would have to re-tune from scratch after power was lost. He says they are still saying "November" for release. As to "when in november?"... he didn't know. I would say late November maybe December would be my very "hopeful" assumption.


wow they really think they'll release it than? i doubt it, but would certainly be nice, would be nice if the RF finily came the **** out though :mean:


----------



## audioanamoly

thanks for clearing that up ET328.


----------



## xx24xx

I have reason to believe Alpine will have a lot of explaining to do at CES in Jan '12, or at least a release date we can hold them to. It will also be interesting to see how far other companies are pushing along in the same market. Arc Audio is for sure on my list.


----------



## mmiller

I'm excited to see the arc piece as well. I seem to remember years ago company's announcing new products, and taking 2 years before they came out... or never at all, remember the one Image dynamics advertised for like 3 years that never came out. 

It was the ID One wasn't it?


----------



## eviling

xx24xx said:


> I have reason to believe Alpine will have a lot of explaining to do at CES in Jan '12, or at least a release date we can hold them to. It will also be interesting to see how far other companies are pushing along in the same market. Arc Audio is for sure on my list.


the rumors i've been hearing latley seem to point as nov-dec release dates for both the RF and the alpine units, but i'm not sure on sources. we all hear these rumors. wishful thinking most likley. ive decided to take a higher road. 

M-AUDIO - Delta 1010LT - 10-In/10-Out PCI Virtual Studio

custom processing:laugh: anybody?


----------



## xx24xx

I read from the Arc Audio FB page that they will start releasing features of the MS8 on December 19th. They also confirmed they have finalized the products housing. They are coming very close to announcing a release date. I'm willing to bet a lot of details will be released at CES '12 for both Arc and Alpine. Man... I wish I could go. 

Oh and their new KS 2500.1 will be available early '12 too. Amp porn FTW!


----------



## pyropoptrt

xx24xx said:


> I read from the Arc Audio FB page that they will start releasing features of the *PS8* on December 19th. They also confirmed they have finalized the products housing. They are coming very close to announcing a release date. I'm willing to bet a lot of details will be released at CES '12 for both Arc and Alpine. Man... I wish I could go.
> 
> Oh and their new KS 2500.1 will be available early '12 too. Amp porn FTW!


fixed


----------



## n_olympios

Thank you for that, pyropoptrt! I read the above post in my email notification earlier today and thought "something weird is going on here". 

Damn them companies and their lack of imagination when it comes to product naming.


----------



## Vitty

Can anyone shed some light on how well the auto-tune (imprint) works compared to an MS-8?


----------



## eviling

Vitty said:


> Can anyone shed some light on how well the auto-tune (imprint) works compared to an MS-8?


don't think you're gonna wanna spend the 800$ on this piece just to use auto tune. i think the ms-8 has it beat, and the new "ms8" will have it beat on auto as well. the rocker fosgate would probably also do a decent auto tune, they put some time into it from what I hear.


----------



## Vitty

What is the new MS-8?


----------



## t3sn4f2

eviling said:


> *don't think you're gonna wanna spend the 800$ on this piece just to use auto tune*. i think the ms-8 has it beat, and the new "ms8" will have it beat on auto as well. the rocker fosgate would probably also do a decent auto tune, they put some time into it from what I hear.


Why not?  Imprint is no joke and it has been updated on the H800. It's not like you're paying $800 for just an auto tune unit like the MS-8.


----------



## eviling

Vitty said:


> What is the new MS-8?


i dont know, i heard somebody call it the ps8 or something but who knows, rumor mills are saying they have the chasie worked out. and are working on developing it and should have something for CES2012.


----------



## Stearnzy

I definitely not surprised that the h800 hasn't come out yet, alpine has always been wrong on there release dates, if they give a release date then it probably means next year, the only stuff that comes out on time is the stuff that no one knows about before ces and they are already producing


----------



## ErinH

eviling said:


> i dont know, i heard somebody call it the ps8 or something but who knows, rumor mills are saying they have the chasie worked out. and are working on developing it and should have something for CES2012.


There is no new ms-8. 

The ps-8 is Arc's processor. It's notching like the ms-8.


----------



## acidbass303

Vitty said:


> Can anyone shed some light on how well the auto-tune (imprint) works compared to an MS-8?


Ms8 still is the king of auto-tune. That thing is a genius, tunes in a couple of minutes what other processors take much longer, and does it really well. Having said that, H800 offers a little more user controlabilty especially in the time alignment department (although we have never heard anyone with MS8 having issues with time alignment). The availability of optical inputs is another plus on the H800. 
I haven't had too much success using H800's autotune, but when tuning manually, it is a very very capable processor and i am loving it. Still haven't tried the RoadEQ feature yet.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> There is no new ms-8.
> 
> The ps-8 is Arc's processor. It's notching like the ms-8.


ahh see this is why i said I wasn't sure about it. i must of missread the post, they must of done the same thing id id. lol and the cycles continues, now somebodys gonna read my post and think it's a true rumor :laugh:


far as auto tune vs manual vrs hybrid, the biggest hindge for me when i had an ms-8 was not being to hear the different slopes and cross over points instantly because changing the cross over points and slopes changes the T\A so ms-8 didnt let you change them once it calibrated. i did hear their is a code you can put into the ms-8 to unlock these things but it's extremeley hard to get ahold of, ive knowen people who had direct inside connections with JBl who still coudln't get ahold of this code.


----------



## pionkej

eviling said:


> ahh see this is why i said I wasn't sure about it. i must of missread the post, they must of done the same thing id id. lol and the cycles continues, now somebodys gonna read my post and think it's a true rumor :laugh:
> 
> 
> far as auto tune vs manual vrs hybrid, the biggest hindge for me when i had an ms-8 was not being to hear the different slopes and cross over points instantly because changing the cross over points and slopes changes the T\A so ms-8 didnt let you change them once it calibrated. i did hear their is a code you can put into the ms-8 to unlock these things but it's extremeley hard to get ahold of, ive knowen people who had direct inside connections with JBl who still coudln't get ahold of this code.


What is the point of saying stuff like this other than hearing yourself talk? Why would you want a "top secret" code that defeats the purpose of the MS8? Part of the reason MS8 works so well is how it uses T/A to adjust and match phase at the crossover point. Change the point or the slope and it needs to be adjusted. So even if you DID have this code (that I have never heard of) and COULD make these changes, they wouldn't be an A/B comparison and therefore stupid to even want IMHO.


----------



## ELNA

hello ,

i just bought a used PXA-H800 and don`t have an installation CD ... could some one be kind enough to give me a download link for the software or upload an image file somewhere ?

i am so mad cause can not fiind the software anyware ... just got it tonight and can`t do a thing ...


----------



## eviling

pionkej said:


> What is the point of saying stuff like this other than hearing yourself talk? Why would you want a "top secret" code that defeats the purpose of the MS8? Part of the reason MS8 works so well is how it uses T/A to adjust and match phase at the crossover point. Change the point or the slope and it needs to be adjusted. So even if you DID have this code (that I have never heard of) and COULD make these changes, they wouldn't be an A/B comparison and therefore stupid to even want IMHO.


i'm not talking nore am i hearing anything when i post.  but thanks for bashing me unprovoked. and we all know why these things are locked, i'm just saying the code would be nice for those who wish to tweak things, let them also deal with the fall out.


----------



## ELNA

is there a way of using antEQ without that imprint EQ ?

just tried the imprint eq in my house cause i haven`t had the time to set the pxa in my car and it sounds horible ... i like my manual eq better but i would like antEQ because my oem radio has factory EQ`ing .

it seems i can not activate the antEQ without imprint EQ ... 

why did they not use Audyssey with the H800 ? this imprint really sucks ... i have an onkyo reciever with audyssey and it gives great results ...


----------



## starboy869

I'm seriously thinking about getting one.


----------



## ernperkins

On the PXE-H650 and H660: Imprint = AntiEQ + Audyssey Multi-EQ. I thought it was the same on the H800.


----------



## ELNA

On the PXA-h800 there is no Audyssey Multi-Eq it is their own Imprint EQ ... i think it is the same ... it doesn`t say Audyssey anywhere look in the manual .... no Audyssey logo on the box or anywhere ...

can you deactivade Mutli Eq in the PXE-H650 and H660 but still keep AntiEQ active ?


----------



## t3sn4f2

ELNA said:


> *On the PXA-h800 there is no Audyssey Multi-Eq it is their own Imprint EQ ... i think it is the same ... *it doesn`t say Audyssey anywhere look in the manual .... no Audyssey logo on the box or anywhere ...
> 
> can you deactivade Mutli Eq in the PXE-H650 and H660 but still keep AntiEQ active ?


Correct, it is their own auto EQ. Nothing to do with Audyssey this time around. Jim Walters talks about it somewhere in this thread.


----------



## The A Train

Any updates on this? My H660 is decent, but I just dont have the freedom that I want with it. Im tempted to jump on the 2X8 miniDSP...


----------



## ErinH

If you don't need ainet interface and you can get by without having to use a controller (ie: you don't mind being restricted by a laptop), you don't need 5.1, and you don't need or want auto tune... In other words, you want a standard use DSP ... Skip this piece and go with the helix pdsp. It is a much better processor in regards to DSP features.


----------



## subwoofery

bikinpunk said:


> If you don't need ainet interface and you can get by without having to use a controller (ie: you don't mind being restricted by a laptop), you don't need 5.1, and you don't need or want auto tune... In other words, you want a standard use DSP ... Skip this piece and go with the helix *pdsp*. It is a much better processor in regards to DSP features.


And with a little luck, you might have your car-specific setup ready to be used with your P-DSP as a baseline 

Kelvin


----------



## co_leonard

My H800 is version 1.001.

My mid-left output has no sound, and outputs a hissing sound. Anyone experience a silent but hissing sound from one of the H800 outputs?


----------



## co_leonard

2LOUD2OLD said:


> ahh but the P99 is a PITA to use
> 
> ease of use is a pretty big factor for me, the menus of the P99 just make no sense, why the hell should you have to go through multiple menus just to pause?
> lack of multiple presets is a pretty big fail, only having presets for the TA and EQ is pretty annoying and there is no master preset.
> the TA just makes no sense, when I want to delay the right side, I have to adjust the left side, just weird. yes I know the reasoning but it is just not logical or natural.


Just press the DF button on the remote to pause. 

I've had mild success tuning my P99RS. Yes, there is a steep learning curve but I'd you're familiar with tuning the P80 or P90, tuning the P99 is actually straightforward.


----------



## starboy869

Alpine AUSSIE has updated firmware upgarades. 

so damn tempted....


----------



## Thrill_House

starboy869 said:


> Alpine AUSSIE has updated firmware upgarades.
> 
> so damn tempted....


The update has been around for ages, stop debating and just buy the darn thing, you will love it!


----------



## co_leonard

ET328 said:


> Here is a post I wrote earlier:
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1321433-post779.html
> 
> First you need to install Virtual PC, (if your Win7 edition supports it)
> Windows Virtual PC: Home Page
> 
> If it does not support, then VMWare Player, but then you also need XP installation CD
> Create an XP Mode for Windows 7 Home Versions & Vista - How-To Geek


Tried vmware player running winxp over windows7 x64. Can't get vmware to recognize the H800 when plugged in to the laptop's USB port. Tried all ports, no luck. 

Any tips?


----------



## ET328

co_leonard said:


> Tried vmware player running winxp over windows7 x64. Can't get vmware to recognize the H800 when plugged in to the laptop's USB port. Tried all ports, no luck.
> 
> Any tips?


Have you selected "Connect (disconnect from host)" in VMWare VM-menu's removable devices? H800 should be available there with unknow device, serial device or something like that. USB devices are not (thru)connected to the virtual machine unless you do that.


----------



## acidbass303

ET328 said:


> Have you selected "Connect (disconnect from host)" in VMWare VM-menu's removable devices? H800 should be available there with unknow device, serial device or something like that. USB devices are not (thru)connected to the virtual machine unless you do that.


Exactly, on my system it shows as Maxim USB audio device. It is in the lower right corner when running in windowed mode( not full screen)


----------



## co_leonard

@ET328 - nope, when I plug the H800 into the laptop's USB port, it doesn't show up at all even on the taskbar tray of Win7x64. So it also doesn't show up in the VMware USB device choices. 

Although the laptop's built-in fingerprint scanner and webcam and my external hard drive all show up on VMware's choices, so I can disconnect it from the host for VMware to use. 

The H800 works fine with another laptop running Win7x32 but sadly, it doesn't show up at all as a USB device on my Win7x64 laptop when it is plugged in. 

By the way, my laptop is running Win7x64 Home Premium, not the Professional Edition. 

Any tips?



@Acidbass303 - yup that's what I was looking for when I plug the H800 USB into my Win7x64 laptop. Is your laptop also running Win7x64 Home Edition?


----------



## acidbass303

co_leonard said:


> @ET328 - nope, when I plug the H800 into the laptop's USB port, it doesn't show up at all even on the taskbar tray of Win7x64. So it also doesn't show up in the VMware USB device choices.
> 
> Although the laptop's built-in fingerprint scanner and webcam and my external hard drive all show up on VMware's choices, so I can disconnect it from the host for VMware to use.
> 
> The H800 works fine with another laptop running Win7x32 but sadly, it doesn't show up at all as a USB device on my Win7x64 laptop when it is plugged in.
> 
> Any tips?
> 
> @Acidbass303 - yup that's what I was looking for when I plug the H800 USB into my Win7x64 laptop. Is your laptop also running Win7x64?



Yes mate, Window 7 Home premium x64. Its strange, it works totally fine with my VM. try Running the VM first and when the Windows XP has loaded then try connecting the H800.

Or try reinstalling the H800 manager in windows xp VM. BTW i also installed my H800 manager on the Windows7. Try it, may be that will help?


----------



## audioanamoly

I have a mint/almost BNIB (still has protective plastic on the controller and processor) PXA-H/RUX-C800 COMBO for sale with the latest software update installed. PM me if anyone is interested. I'm in the process of posting the add. It will be up shortly.


----------



## bass mechanic

Hey everyone, this is my first post here. 
i would like to know if anyone can direct me to a link on this site where i can learn about what is the latest and greatest in the world of DSP and SQ.
i read all 52 pages of this because i have been looking to buy the H800. i have talked to people on the inside of alpine corporate and have confirmed this unit will be released to the US within the next 30 days.
at this point i am looking to put a system in my 2012 corvette Z06 centennial edition. i had a system in my 2008 that consisted of the Kenwood DNX9980HD jl amps and speakers/ subs.
i took everything out of my old car and am looking to start fresh but building off the concepts i used in the last build.
i feel like a 90,000 car is worth of whatever the top of the line technology is these days.
i had been an installer in a previous life about 10 years ago. did some very high end systems and have more or less been a hobby for the past 10 years so i am not as much in the know as i used to be.
i wonder if anyone can point me to some threads or just educate me in general what direction i need to be looking.
i will be at CES in 3 weeks for just friday. i plan to take that time to find out what is up and coming. but i want to know whats available now so i have the tools necessary to talk intelligently about what is here and now.
this way i can find out what is up and coming with respect to currently technology.

what i do know is that i want to put the latest and greatest in signal processing in my Vette. i have a center speaker that i would like to use and i want 5.1 with all the goodies.
navigation is important to me, i think garmin has the market and with the kenwood having it built in is hard to beat, should i persue alpine?
is their navigation up to par with kenwood?
i have had 3 of the past top of the line navigation receivers from kenwood, i feel they have some room for improvement in the speed department.
otherwise they have some pretty decent DSP and adjustability.
the contacts at alpine keep telling me to just wait till after CES and i plan to before making a decision.
thanks


----------



## co_leonard

acidbass303 said:


> Yes mate, Window 7 Home premium x64. Its strange, it works totally fine with my VM. try Running the VM first and when the Windows XP has loaded then try connecting the H800.
> 
> Or try reinstalling the H800 manager in windows xp VM. BTW i also installed my H800 manager on the Windows7. Try it, may be that will help?


Finally got it working! 

H800 software running in WinXP Pro x32 running in VMWare Player running in Windows 7 Home Premium x64 on my HP DV6-6168TX laptop. 

All I had to do was unplug the USB adaptor of my wireless mouse. Then Windows 7 reported the H800 as an"unidentified device" but XP Pro in VMWare reported it as "Maxim USB Device" just like you said. 

I ran the H800 software and it worked just fine. Thanks!


----------



## quickaudi07

When is this unit going to be out in US?


----------



## 00flash00

Hi boys, i have problem pxa-h800 sound source. I listen DVD disc witch clips in Dolby Digital sound. Then select in source menu radio or BT play or TV and I have no sound!!!! I must rotary volume down - up, down - up and then sound listen. I hava optical connection iva-D800 to pxa-h800
Pxa-h800 digital sound switch problem - YouTube


----------



## acidbass303

co_leonard said:


> Finally got it working!
> 
> H800 software running in WinXP Pro x32 running in VMWare Player running in Windows 7 Home Premium x64 on my HP DV6-6168TX laptop.
> 
> All I had to do was unplug the USB adaptor of my wireless mouse. Then Windows 7 reported the H800 as an"unidentified device" but XP Pro in VMWare reported it as "Maxim USB Device" just like you said.
> 
> I ran the H800 software and it worked just fine. Thanks!


Glad to know that it works for you now


----------



## co_leonard

Ok, now I've got my H800 running 4-way full-active, with tweeters, midranges, midbasses and a mono subwoofer. All RCA cables are 1-meter long and are brand new. I also tested each one to ensure continuity. Got one RCA output of my head unit connected to AUX1 of the H800. All tuning is done from the laptop.

Left and right tweeters, left and right midbasses and the mono subwoofer work just fine. But only the right midrange output works. There's no sound coming from the left midrange, just an audible hiss. And there's a crackling noise whenever I blow the horn, like a long RCA cable plugged into a working amp but left hanging - unconnected to the head unit. 

I tried swapping RCA cables and swapping amps. Same result. There's obviously something amiss with my H800. 

My question is: will updating the firmware from version 1.001 to the latest 1.003 fix this?


----------



## ET328

co_leonard said:


> There's no sound coming from the left midrange, just an audible hiss. And there's a crackling noise whenever I blow the horn, like a long RCA cable plugged into a working amp but left hanging - unconnected to the head unit.
> 
> My question is: will updating the firmware from version 1.001 to the latest 1.003 fix this?


Have you tried swapping cables between left and right midrange outputs? Is right midrange then muted/hissing? Have you tried resetting the processor?
Sounds like you have a bad processor. I recall that bikinpunk had similar problem, search earlier posts in this thread.

As far as I know, the firmware does not fix this, it only fixes bass modulated white noise that it heard in all channels with certain bass test tones and music.

Btw. if you upgrade the firmware, use 32 bit Windows. USB is disconnected few times during the upgrade and requires you to reconnect it via VM menu everytime that happens.


----------



## co_leonard

ET328 said:


> Have you tried swapping cables between left and right midrange outputs? Is right midrange then muted/hissing? Have you tried resetting the processor?
> Sounds like you have a bad processor. I recall that bikinpunk had similar problem, search earlier posts in this thread.
> 
> As far as I know, the firmware does not fix this, it only fixes bass modulated white noise that it heard in all channels with certain bass test tones and music.
> 
> Btw. if you upgrade the firmware, use 32 bit Windows. USB is disconnected few times during the upgrade and requires you to reconnect it via VM menu everytime that happens.


Yup, I tried swapping RCA cables and swapping amps. Same result. Left midrange output seems to be kaput. Sad, because I was all set to tune it the other night.

The local distributor has three H800s. I'll borrow the other one and post the results here. 

Thanks for the tip regarding using 32-bit Windows on the firmware upgrade.


----------



## quickaudi07

Have you guys seen this? I'm really hoping it will be out soon in US.

Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.

Thanks for any feed back.


----------



## t3sn4f2

never mind, I didn't bother to look at the date either.


----------



## 00flash00

hi boys, please update pxa-h800 sound manager but i lost my CD. Thank you


----------



## audioanamoly

Quick question, has anybody else had an issue with trying to set up a 3-way+sub on the output set up menu of the RUX 800? It allows me to select the 3-way+sub output, saves the settings, but then will not allow me to make any x-over/TA/EQ adjustments from the controller. It just skips the midrange altogether when scrolling through speakers. Does this have to be done via pc only? I'm confused.


----------



## audioanamoly

audioanamoly said:


> Quick question, has anybody else had an issue with trying to set up a 3-way+sub on the output set up menu of the RUX 800? It allows me to select the 3-way+sub output, saves the settings, but then will not allow me to make any x-over/TA/EQ adjustments from the controller. It just skips the midrange altogether when scrolling through speakers. Does this have to be done via pc only? I'm confused.


Nevermind, I figured it out


----------



## Limster

Can i connect 6 channel preout from hu to h800 and ainet connected as well? So that i can get 5.1 sound without using optical or rather no optical output from my HU.


----------



## co_leonard

Limster said:


> Can i connect 6 channel preout from hu to h800 and ainet connected as well? So that i can get 5.1 sound without using optical or rather no optical output from my HU.


Hmm... What's your head unit?


----------



## Limster

My HU is IVA-W520E... no Optical cable output.

Will using preout direct to H800 using good interconnectors reduce "ssss" noise. Its very low but perhaps im sensitive.


----------



## Thrill_House

Limster said:


> Can i connect 6 channel preout from hu to h800 and ainet connected as well? So that i can get 5.1 sound without using optical or rather no optical output from my HU.


There is no way to extract 5.1 surround sound with out the use of digital toslink cable.


----------



## Thrill_House

Limster said:


> My HU is IVA-W520E... no Optical cable output.
> 
> Will using preout direct to H800 using good interconnectors reduce "ssss" noise. Its very low but perhaps im sensitive.


Why not just use the ainet connection from the hu to the H800, it may not be good as using the toslink but its still a hell of a lot cleaner then using the RCA inputs.


----------



## quickaudi07

Hey guys, quick question, 

I have a eye on H800, how would I connect that unit from my HU?

I will be using RCA's for now, but do i use just left and right channel like on JBL MS-8? or will i use all 6 inputs FL+FR, RL+RR +sub?

Little confused and I would like to make sure i have everything in place to connect to my new unit once i get it. 

Thanks in advance.


----------



## cpcustoms

So, I just wanted to raise the question...

Why did Alpine decide to get me all excited by making a Nav unit with the ability for DVD-A playback of 24/96k encoding and put a digital optical out on the unit... and then make the H-800 to accept the digital optical in for beautiful SQ tuning... and then really bum me out when i read the manual and it states this about the encoding of the optical line:

"The audio signals recorded on the disc are converted to 48 kHz/16 bit (for DVDs) or 44.1 kHz (for Video CDs and CDs) linear PCM audio signals for output."


I might as well just play a normal CD with that encoding coming out the back.

Now ive heard different conflicting things about the Bandwidth limits of optical transfer cables, some say they max out at 16 bit, other specs say they max out at the transfer of 24 bit. But if they were going for a new generation of "sound quality" pieces (which im glad they are FINALLY coming back to that at least somewhat in the USA. but why make it have the ability for DVD-A playback and Digital out with such a letdown on the actual output stage of the deck and the subsequent input stage of the H-800? If it truly is for the limitations of optical, then why not digital coax? It could have had GREAT inductive noise resistance and transferred the true 24/96. Just some thoughts for Alpine USA... Maybe someday i can actually use my car with the same Hi-Res recordings as my HT system? hint hint...

And anyone know what the deal is with their Proprietary optical cable? is it just so that you are forced to buy theirs? or is there a converter to regular toslink or an even better 3.5mm mini optical jack? I would rather get a higher end optical cable to run between the units if i decide to get them.


----------



## pankrok

Proprietary cable of alpine is just an optical cable with digital to toslink adapter on one edge. Is exactly same as pioneer which has in contrast adaptor on both edges.
The problem is that this adaptor operates at 2.5v while all other toslink transmitters operate at 5v. The transmitter can be removed from cable and fixed on another but this means that you will have to slightly modify your cable as it doesnot accept standard toslink plug (need to cut part of the plug).
Toslink limitations are at least 24/96 and really I do not know what people are thinking when using 24bit dacs but downgrading signal to 16bit. Looks stupit to me.


----------



## t3sn4f2

All mobile and pretty much all home DSP's run at 48kHz sample rate (except for maybe something coming out or out from audison, and who knows about home stuff). Anyways, that is the reason why the unit down converters to 48kHz. The only way to get that high a resolution resolved would be to have a DVD-A player play and output that signal to an analog preamps and onto the amp and speakers. 

But guess what, none of it matters since the H800 only has ~17-19bit resolution potential on the analog output side. IOW, it doesn't matter if you have a digital player with a 192kHz/24bit disc playing. It's still going to be severely truncated by the analog output. You don't have to worry though since 16bit is more then you will ever need out of a fixed level source and more than the most dynamic car audio system can appreciate. And who cares about high sample rates when it is a scientific fact that a 44.1kHz sample rate can sample or reproduce any analog wave form exactly up to the limits of the human auditory system.

Also using a 24bit DAC chip come with the benefits that it is a better technology platform simply because it's newer. Much like a modern 5 mega pixel camera take much better photographs than a 10 year old 5 mega pixel camera.


----------



## kyheng

Sometimes I like marketing gimmick.... As people will be misleaded and believe that over sampling are good....


----------



## pankrok

if you cannot hear the difference between hires recordings and traditional 16/44.1 doesnot mean that it doesnt exists but for sure you are a lucky guy that will not have to waste money on expensive stuff.
if 44.1KHz was enough for audible sounds then there shouldnt be a difference when you hear same recording (recorded in 24/96 or higher) in native sampling freq and downsampled in 16/44.1 or 48 but there is.
for the moment that we talk about 24bit dacs, 31 eq bands per channel and all this stuff I assume that we want to take 99% of what exists in the original recording. if 95% is ok then why bother with H800? H100 is more than enough and much much cheaper and far more easy to handle for everybody. 
not even toslink is necessary , maybe a decent interconnect cable (as long as 5 meters long).

in the question where am i suppose to find hires recordings just accept that exist.
in the next question who am i suppose to reproduce it answer is carpc. 
i havent done anything yet because i cannto solve all the problems that arise with the carpc (not even sure which processor to choose )


----------



## kyheng

It is a busted myth on the recordings..... Is just some of us trying the best to deny it....


----------



## highly

Blind testing indicates very few people can reliably discern the difference in competently _compressed _ bitrates beyond 256KBs. If you are seriously considering a carpc to get beyond 16/48 then there is no need for a processor at all. A decent PC with external sound output (firewire to an Echo AudioFire 12, for instance) would give you all the channels you could wish for with the highest possible studio grade sound quality. The software exists to make the hardware tolerable. Boot times can be made reasonable. If that level of inaudible perfection is your goal, there are plenty of ways to reach it now, today. No need for you to wait for an H800 or any other processor for that matter. This is _DIY_ mobile audio, after all...

Not Machina Dynamica...

I'd just be happy to see an integrated product that does 16/48 well and is free of bugs and artifacts and is released when it's promised. THAT would be a boon for the car audio community for sure.


----------



## pankrok

you might be right about sound card comparing to car dsp 

you might be also wrong about blind tests
it depends on the test system.
in a well tuned home audio system it was difficult to understand (nearly impossible) flac from cd files but the difference between mp3 and flac was clearly audible and also standard to high resolution (even if it was just upsampling).
there is also audible difference when playing same song from ipod between alac file and 320kpbs on my system and it is not that i want to hear the difference.
if you try it in boom box then it just doesnot worth the time to spend.

there is also the case of people who clearly do not understand even in the first case. 
the best test ever made was to sample in the same track the same song in 2 formats (320 and lossless). there were 5 changes in the 4 minute track and most of the people succeded to find only 2-3. 

(by the way my problem with car pc is mainly the display , 500 euro for a transflective 8" monitor on 800x480 which is not even capacitive is not a bargain)


----------



## highly

That test checks the ear's ability to hear _change _and is not a good test of the _format_. The ear is very good at hearing change. Try a CD with 10 songs, some of which were compressed. Find the songs that went through the compression process. Use any system you like. This way you are not listening for change, you are listening to music that has the artifacts of compression present (or a bitrate of less than 16/48) and it is those artifacts that you are in search of. If you can't hear them then it doesn't matter. Most could not hear it with a reliability that indicated it mattered. In a car the chances go down significantly. 

And I agree that a competent carpc is expensive...but you aren't going to see 24/96 from source to output cheap in any market no matter home, car, or other. At the high end you have to pay to play I am afraid.

Why not a carpc that is only for processing? Use a 24/96 capable headunit and do the processing in a computer. Then there is no display needed at all. Oh, right. There are few if any sources that even output 24/96...

You see the problem. Even if the material is there, the gear isn't up to that level for in-car audio because the demand can't support the production. Certainly not at the price point most people are comfortable with.


----------



## pankrok

logitech squeezybox outputs 24/96 and with some mods on the clock it beats any cdp up to eur 2000 (if not more) but there is the problem of control in the car (that allows also to drive) and to have FM/dab radio in the same time (beceuse in the car many times you need radio)
this is why I am still stuck with the ipod (which doesnot give digital out to the processor through alpine headunit) because is the best compromise between sq and flexibility in the car enviroment - there wouldnt be a reason for me to stick with it at home.

about testing yes you are right you can hear the difference easier when there is change but this what makes the test more funny because a lot of people either could not detect the point of difference or believed that that it playing mp3 instead of lossless.

anyway problem still is that alpine has not yet to come out with a fully operational processor as users claim and nobody sees the end of this story. 
I understand that is just better than 701 , using todays digital filters and not "analog" ones of the recent past.

Im still not sure if the difference from c-dsp is small enough to compromise with it gaining easier control from headunit (when using optical in) and I m still waiting.


----------



## bombzombie

********ATTENTION*******

Crutchfield is taking pre-orders on Alpine's PXA-H800!!

Alpine PXA-H800 Digital sound processor at Crutchfield.com


I bought mine on a trip to Germany. It will be nice for folks to be able to buy it through a local vendor who has a well-known reputation for making things right. 

To me, the combo of Road EQ and MediaExpander+ are the features that set this unit apart from the MS8 and the Bit One if you already have an Alpine HU with primary control capability. But all provide very good sound when properly tuned. Just happy to see more high-end stuff starting to be available in the good 'ol U.S. of A. again.


----------



## Se7en

Not be completely lame, but from what I've read, although it will accept speaker level inputs from an OEM source, I haven't seen anything regarding signal summing/clean up similar to what the Bit One or MS8 do.

Does anyone off the top know how this is handled?

Thanks!


----------



## bombzombie

Se7en said:


> Not be completely lame, but from what I've read, although it will accept speaker level inputs from an OEM source, I haven't seen anything regarding signal summing/clean up similar to what the Bit One or MS8 do.
> 
> Does anyone off the top know how this is handled?
> 
> Thanks!


My install doesn't use those functions per se because of the true center channel, the T/A and independent measurements that I like to perform. I have heard systems with the Bit One in roommate's Porsche boxster and an MS8 in a BMW 5-series. In every case, to me, all performed well when calibrated and brought a level of increased realism. But sorry I can't help with regards to an OEM source. I ditched the Tundra radio while driving it off the lot. Turned it off and immediately headed over to stereo shop to put a W205 in at the time.


----------



## 00flash00

Stupid procesor PXA-H800???? Because you must have analog cables and optical cable because you have only optical cable then no correct signal analog source(BT, RADIO, DVB-T ...) You switching digital sound (DVD/CD) to analog sound (BT, RADIO, DVB-T ...) you have no NO SOUND must volume down to 00 and thned volume up and sound is correct. Is amazing situacion PXA dont have reduction analog signal to optical(digital) signal. No good switch sound ANALOG -> DIGITAL ... is stupid ...
i have pxa-h800 + rux C800 + iva-d800. NOW conected in IVA to PXA only optical cable.
I have to dismantle the ceiling again. install analog cable back


----------



## pankrok

it is same as with pxah701
you need both connections imperatively


----------



## 00flash00

oh my got, alpine ingeeniring, h800 is model 2011 and no correction ... alpine alpine ... premium product with problems


----------



## kyheng

Well, Audison's Bit1, JBL's MS-8 also having problems....


----------



## saleen_1985

I just talked to Alpine Rep here in US and the H800 will be available for sale here in US sometime in April


----------



## ernperkins

Did he specify what year?


----------



## quickaudi07

I think we are all getting some bootleg info. I heard alpine will be shipping them out this month. I even called alpine and they said this month as well. I'm about to gave up on the unit and cancel my order....

Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


----------



## bammba

Hi

I have connected an IVA W520 to a PXA-H800 with an Ai-NET cable.
-	Defeat mode is set to off
-	System switch is set to EQ/DIV
-	I can hear sound from speakers 

The issue is that when selecting: SETUP => AUDIO SETUP => A.PROCESSOR on the W520 I do not have any options displayed on screen and I cannot control any option on the H800 from the head unit.

Is there anything I am missing? What should I do in order to see the setting items of the sound processor?


----------



## jim walter

Check your Owners Manual, but I am not sure the W520 has A. Proc control for the H800. 

You may only have basic functions like present fade and balance. 

Jim


----------



## Thrill_House

jim walter said:


> Check your Owners Manual, but I am not sure the W520 has A. Proc control for the H800.
> 
> You may only have basic functions like present fade and balance.
> 
> Jim


Hey jim on semi related note, do you know if though future firmware updates that i may regain my hu subwoofer control on my dva-9965? Why is it that balace and fade still can be contolled the hu but not sub control anyway?


----------



## claytonzmvox

tokospeaker 
Anyone know this store? is reliable? I can buy without fear? thank you guys!


----------



## quickaudi07

claytonzmvox,

It looks like they are very solid, i seen people buy product from them all the time...
contact them and they will get back to you right away... good guys .


----------



## claytonzmvox

quickaudi07 said:


> claytonzmvox,
> 
> It looks like they are very solid, i seen people buy product from them all the time...
> contact them and they will get back to you right away... good guys .


Tank you friend. E acompanhando este maravilhoso tópico


----------



## quickaudi07

claytonzmvox said:


> Tank you friend. E acompanhando este maravilhoso tópico


No problem, Sorry I don't speak Spanish, but i do speak Polish


----------



## nepl29

quickaudi07 said:


> No problem, Sorry I don't speak Spanish, but i do speak Polish


Thats Portuguese


----------



## quickaudi07

nepl29 said:


> Thats Portuguese


**** Even Better  lol


----------



## Thrill_House

In case anyone is interested the seller i bought my h800 from on ebay in july has a unit up for sale on ebay again: http://item.mobileweb.ebay.ca/viewitem?itemId=320832185060&index=3&nav=SEARCH&nid=31859808439


----------



## bombzombie

Bought mine from the same folks around $600 including shipping. Good folks.


----------



## Thrill_House

bombzombie said:


> Bought mine from the same folks around $600 including shipping. Good folks.


Yeah great guy to deal with.


----------



## Limster

Hi, yesterday i tried the imprint tuning but it seems to cut most bass and the sound is very much "muddy". 

My intention is to use midbass to drive most of 40 to 3.2k hz (active cross setting), tweeter drive 3.2k to 20k. Back speaker drive 100 to 20k (coaxial).

According to manual, "reference" curve is the best and with imprint i cant bring my bass to +12db (max is +6db) 

Do you reset all EQ to flat before tuning or leave the EQ to preset?

I have also tried changing the crossover for front low to 31.5hz from 63hz but bass still the same. I'm quite disappointed with imprint after spending so much to do up my system. the only thing good is the Auto TCR. By the way i do not have a subwoofer.

Anyone experienced this?


----------



## ELNA

Same here the IMPRINT sucks ! i have an ONKYO with Audyssey and IT sounds great after auto EQ ! the H800 IMPRINT might sound good if you are deaf ...


----------



## claytonzmvox

my equipment arrives in a few days I hope to enjoy the device. and start posting my impressions of the PXA


----------



## Pulse-R

Put in my H800 last week.
Compared to my old modded H701, the H800 is much better in clarity and much less noise.
i.e. more microdynamics/detail and blacker between the instruments.

good upgrade.


----------



## rain27

So does anyone actually like the Imprint tune? 

I figured once the MS-8 hit the market there would be competition soon after, but it doesn't look like anyone is getting it right.


----------



## eviling

rain27 said:


> So does anyone actually like the Imprint tune?
> 
> I figured once the MS-8 hit the market there would be competition soon after, but it doesn't look like anyone is getting it right.


I think the only one whos really trying is rockard fosgate, and they are really more focused on offering ms-8's features but with more options, at least thats how it always felt, but they havnt released any data on it in so long i can't speculate, it might even end up with out an auto tune, who knows maybe thats the problem theyve been having thats holding it up.


----------



## hilander999

I also have 2 home theator setups with ONKYO receivers and POLK speakers, both with Audyssey and they both sound amazing, so when I found out that ALPINE was using the same technology I jumped on the bandwagon and got a PXE-H660 and went all POLK MM for the car too. I can't say enough about how good this combo sounds.

I would really like to hear opinions about the new RoadEQ feature (active noise cancelling). Does it do what it should? does it mess up the sound stage?

This is the one feature that is pushing me to upgrade to the new procesor once it is released here in the USA. However, if that feature is not living up to expectations, I will just keep what I have untill something spectacular comes along.

I still don't understand why they would ditch Audyssey when it works so well, although I'm sure it comes with a price tag for every unit they sell. Reminds me of Windows...


----------



## acidbass303

The imprint is just ok to get a good start, the good thing is that you can use imprint tune as a baseline and modify it according to your taste/needs, you can use GEQ or PEQ after the imprint EQ and that's a pretty good thing IMO since you get the ability to tweak the tune. My biggest gripe with imprintEQ is the midbass suck out and weird time alignment. The rest sounds pretty good for a start.


----------



## rain27

acidbass303 said:


> The imprint is just ok to get a good start, the good thing is that you can use imprint tune as a baseline and modify it according to your taste/needs, you can use GEQ or PEQ after the imprint EQ and that's a pretty good thing IMO since you get the ability to tweak the tune. My biggest gripe with imprintEQ is the midbass suck out and weird time alignment. The rest sounds pretty good for a start.


I would have said that Imprint was still useful if they at least got the time alignment right, but I guess that didn't work out either.


----------



## kyheng

To get a "perfect" TA, you need to ensure driver placements are "perfect"... Else, it won't help much....


----------



## ErinH

kyheng said:


> To get a "perfect" TA, you need to ensure driver placements are "perfect"... Else, it won't help much....


If your driver placements are "perfect" you won't need t/a. No one in car audio can achieve this (realistically). 
So it's a moot point.


----------



## claytonzmvox

sure, the environment inside the car is not the best, impossible to exist the term hi-fi car audio!! hi-fi only in my home with my home teather!! this is my opnion!!


----------



## bassfromspace

bikinpunk said:


> If your driver placements are "perfect" you won't need t/a. No one in car audio can achieve this (realistically).
> So it's a moot point.


I think "optimal" is the word he was looking for.


----------



## hilander999

RoadEQ

Has anyone used it, and how well does it mask outside noise?


----------



## subwoofery

kyheng said:


> To get a "perfect" TA, you need to ensure driver placements are "perfect"... Else, it won't help much....


Apparently Andy Wehmeyer doesn't seem to think so... He states that angling is unecessary if you use drivers in their passband. EQ and T/A work great no matter where your drivers are. Different locations just require more EQ than others 

Kelvin


----------



## ErinH

subwoofery said:


> Apparently Andy Wehmeyer doesn't seem to think so... He states that angling is unecessary if you use drivers in their passband. EQ and T/A work great no matter where your drivers are. Different locations just require more EQ than others
> 
> Kelvin


That should probably read "when used in their pistonic range". 
IE: Before the onset of beaming.


----------



## kyheng

bikinpunk said:


> If your driver placements are "perfect" you won't need t/a. No one in car audio can achieve this (realistically).
> So it's a moot point.


Yeah, you are right, that's why some really good installers charge expensive, because they can get the near "perfect" placements....


subwoofery said:


> Apparently Andy Wehmeyer doesn't seem to think so... He states that angling is unecessary if you use drivers in their passband. EQ and T/A work great no matter where your drivers are. Different locations just require more EQ than others
> 
> Kelvin


Well, for a 2-way front + sub setup, place the tweeter at rear, then use TA to adjust it, if TA can solve this, I'll praise that person like a god.....
With or without TA, even you change the direction slightly already can change the whole stage...


----------



## subwoofery

kyheng said:


> Yeah, you are right, that's why some really good installers charge expensive, because they can get the near "perfect" placements....
> 
> Well, for a 2-way front + sub setup, place the tweeter at rear, then use TA to adjust it, if TA can solve this, I'll praise that person like a god.....
> With or without TA, even you change the direction slightly already can change the whole stage...


Your post doesn't make sense and here's why: Well, for a 2-way *front* 
Why place a tweeter at the *rear* in a *FRONT* 2-way system? 
You've been on the forum for a really long time and I'm sure you know how humans hear/detect sound - in this case, high frequencies. 
I'm not stupid and am sure you're not either and therefore, I really don't understand the purpose of your reply... 

Kelvin


----------



## kyheng

For sure I know what I'm posting, just you don't understand it, not to insult you by any means, the fact is, you don't understand what I mean in the first place...
By putting the tweeter at rear(that's abit extreme), is just an example in case someone still trying to say placement does not affect the sound stage.


----------



## quality_sound

co_leonard said:


> Finally got it working!
> 
> H800 software running in WinXP Pro x32 running in VMWare Player running in Windows 7 Home Premium x64 on my HP DV6-6168TX laptop.
> 
> All I had to do was unplug the USB adaptor of my wireless mouse. Then Windows 7 reported the H800 as an"unidentified device" but XP Pro in VMWare reported it as "Maxim USB Device" just like you said.
> 
> I ran the H800 software and it worked just fine. Thanks!


How did you get VMware on Home Premium? I went to Microsoft's page and it wouldn't even let me DL VMware because I'm on Home Premium. 

It would be great to not have to use my old laptop for tuning.


----------



## subwoofery

kyheng said:


> For sure I know what I'm posting, just you don't understand it, not to insult you by any means, the fact is, you don't understand what I mean in the first place...
> By putting the tweeter at rear(that's abit extreme), is just an example in case someone still trying to say placement does not affect the sound stage.


That's extreme alright... Posting such example just to prove that you don't agree and that you're not wrong is extreme too you know?  

DIYers that knows how we can detect frequencies will never put "primary tweeters for the FRONT stage" behind them... But you know we can put tweeters behind you for rear fill - midbasses can also but used behind you <-- regarding the latter, T/A helps integrate rear midbasses to the front stage creating the "cone of confusion" Jeff has been discussing about... Without T/A, cone of confusion cannot be achieved... Most will agree that it is not an "optimal" location yet can be made to be a GREAT location. 

Kelvin 

PS: Be glad to continue in another of those numerous T/A threads


----------



## ET328

quality_sound said:


> How did you get VMware on Home Premium? I went to Microsoft's page and it wouldn't even let me DL VMware because I'm on Home Premium.
> 
> It would be great to not have to use my old laptop for tuning.


You are mixing Virtual PC and VMWare... VMware Workstation (or free Player) is made by VMWare and is downloadable from here: VMware Player 4.0


----------



## quality_sound

Ahhhhh, ok. I'm DLing VMware Player now. Thanks.

edit: any idea where I can get a copy of XP now? lol


----------



## rr14

Could you guys please tell me how much is the cheapest we can get the h800 at the moment?
Thanks


----------



## quickaudi07

Good luck trying to find one.  from 1000$ to 1200+

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk


----------



## kyheng

Got 1 set selling for $900... But with postage, it will be ~$1100-1200... Better buy from tokospeaker...


----------



## quality_sound

kyheng said:


> Got 1 set selling for $900... But with postage, it will be ~$1100-1200... Better buy from tokospeaker...


I hope you're not talking about mine. I can't see his location but if he's in the US shipping will be less than $40.


----------



## quickaudi07

kyheng said:


> Got 1 set selling for $900... But with postage, it will be ~$1100-1200... Better buy from tokospeaker...


Get qouted me before 1200$+ I would love to get it. I just don't think its worth it. 

I'm waiting till march if nothing comes out, than f it I will run everything of my head unit. 

Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


----------



## kyheng

quality_sound said:


> I hope you're not talking about mine. I can't see his location but if he's in the US shipping will be less than $40.


His location is Indonesia.... Next to my country...


----------



## trumpet

The PXA-H800 and the RUX-C800 are in the latest Crutchfield catalog.


----------



## Thrill_House

trumpet said:


> The PXA-H800 and the RUX-C800 are in the latest Crutchfield catalog.


This has already been discussed, its for pre-order only, they dont have any actual stock on the units.


----------



## trumpet

Thrill_House said:


> This has already been discussed, its for pre-order only, they dont have any actual stock on the units.


This is the first time I've seen it in their print catalog. I know it's been on the web site.


----------



## hilander999

Just have to give ALPINE the time to get the bugs out first.

It's sad that they use other countries for beta testing an $800 processor...

Last thing I saw on a release date was April, but I'll believe it when I see it.


----------



## sneh2j00

The H800 has been out here in Australia for ages.. Theres even a firmware update to fix some bugs available. Its good to see that we get something before the US & A for once.. usually we are months behind 

They retail for $899 AUD but can be had for around $740ish AUD.



I'm tossing up between this and a bitone which I can get for a little less.


----------



## Bollwerk

This seems to indicate the PXA-H800 should be out this month in North America. Color me skeptical, but I'll believe it when I see it.


----------



## mattex

sneh2j00 said:


> The H800 has been out here in Australia for ages.. Theres even a firmware update to fix some bugs available. Its good to see that we get something before the US & A for once.. usually we are months behind
> 
> They retail for $899 AUD but can be had for around $740ish AUD.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm tossing up between this and a bitone which I can get for a little less.


Been using it for 3 months in my system.

Awesome bit of kit.


----------



## bbfoto

mattex said:


> Been using it for 3 months in my system.
> 
> Awesome bit of kit.


Hey mattex,

Where did you pick up your H-800 in Brisbane, preferably Alpine-Authorised? I'm going to visit my sister & aunt & uncle in Brisbane in late September/early October while on holiday. They're in Wishart & Broad Beach Waters. Also going to Lennox Head, Byron Bay, then Bondi to raise hell with my mates, and also St. Ives/Sydney. If the H-800 is not out here in the States by then, I reckon I'd be smart to pick one up there. The dollar isn't too different at the moment.


----------



## quickaudi07

I have called Alpine few times already and i'm sure they are sick of me asking them when is this going to be out.
From my understanding in March that's what everyone told me. 

But who knows, i lost trust in alpine and their dates!


----------



## gasongasoff

Bollwerk said:


> This seems to indicate the PXA-H800 should be out this month in North America. Color me skeptical, but I'll believe it when I see it.


I hope you're right. If this thing doesn't cause the Airplane Noise of Death, I might dump my MS-8.


----------



## quickaudi07

gasongasoff said:


> I hope you're right. If this thing doesn't cause the Airplane Noise of Death, I might dump my MS-8.


I think you should do it now, do it faster than later 
MS-8 will go down on the price like crazy when this hits the market!


----------



## mattex

bbfoto said:


> Hey mattex,
> 
> Where did you pick up your H-800 in Brisbane, preferably Alpine-Authorised? I'm going to visit my sister & aunt & uncle in Brisbane in late September/early October while on holiday. They're in Wishart & Broad Beach Waters. Also going to Lennox Head, Byron Bay, then Bondi to raise hell with my mates, and also St. Ives/Sydney. If the H-800 is not out here in the States by then, I reckon I'd be smart to pick one up there. The dollar isn't too different at the moment.


Sounds like a cool trip, I work in Byron Bay, best spot in Australia!

Northfield Moorooka supplied and installed the H800. They are located just south of Brisbane and are a authorised Alpine dealer. Look them up I'm sure they'll help you out. They have one installed in a Mazda CX9 demo vehicle, worth a listen when you're there.


----------



## 1edgekilla

this may be stupid and have already been answered but with over 50 pages to search and read through there is no way im doing that so i apologize in advance but what HU's currently available in the US will the H800 work with? I'm hoping for the IVA-800 to release in the US otherwise.


----------



## kyheng

Full control you mean? Nope, there's not.... Partial control yes....


----------



## 1edgekilla

kyheng said:


> Full control you mean? Nope, there's not.... Partial control yes....


Ok so what about partial control...

and I had seen talk about the IVA-800 coming to the U.S.... any info on that?


----------



## evo9

1edgekilla said:


> this may be stupid and have already been answered but with over 50 pages to search and read through there is no way im doing that so i apologize in advance but what HU's currently available in the US will the H800 work with? I'm hoping for the IVA-800 to release in the US otherwise.



Read >> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...e-iva-800-iva-d511-usa-ready-group-buy-2.html


My local dealer was at CES & voiced is opinion on the lack of a flip up to go with the H800 & controler. He said one of the Alpine F1 guy he knew said to him there will be a flip up for the USA market. But as soon as he could asked when, someone pulled the guy away for question on something else. We can only hope we at least get the IVA-d511. But the IVA-D800 would be nicer. At the moment the only HU in the USA market that can control the H800 is the INA-W910.





.



.


----------



## 1edgekilla

evo9 said:


> Read >> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...e-iva-800-iva-d511-usa-ready-group-buy-2.html
> 
> 
> My local dealer was at CES & voiced is opinion on the lack of a flip up to go with the H800 & controler. He said one of the Alpine F1 guy he knew said to him there will be a flip up for the USA market. But as soon as he could asked when, someone pulled the guy away for question on something else. We can only hope it we at lest get the IVA-d511. But the IVA-D800 would be nicer. At the moment the only HU in the USA market that can control the H800 is the INA-W910.




ahh thank you evo... i however am not familiar with the D511... is there any thread or site that compares it with the D800... curious to know what it has to offer just in case that's the only option we get.

Chris


----------



## kyheng

This you need to ask the Alpine experts... But as far as I know on this "partial" control, it is more on bass and volume.... Setting crossover , TA and others, you need the RUX or PC...


----------



## bombzombie

I gave up on the PXA-H800. Sold mine to a buddy in Europe. There was no sonic benefit beyond my MRA-F350. The H800 was mated to an INA-NAV20, and it gave control of center width, T/A, parametric EQ, Road EQ, X-over and Level. 

In the end, I noticed marginal benefit for the amount of work that it took to get it, install it and set it up. The part that I needed the computer for was the Imprint. And the result in my '08 Tundra crewmax was pathetic in my honest opinion. In my mind, considering that I have owned Alpine HUs for the last 20 years and every single double din and theater amp and processor at some point. The H701 is still the pinnacle of processing. To me, there was no advantage in upgrading from the H701 to the H800. Zero. Imprint just doesn't make good sound. Bass is always too attenuated for starters, midrange too strong...etc. I could go on all day long. There are no other features that the H800 offers the audiophile that the H701 will not perform as well sonically. That's my opinion and the plain and short of how I see it. But as they say YMMV.


----------



## quality_sound

No zipper noise is reason enough for me.


----------



## evo9

1edgekilla said:


> ahh thank you evo... i however am not familiar with the D511... is there any thread or site that compares it with the D800... curious to know what it has to offer just in case that's the only option we get.
> 
> Chris


They are basically the same unit. The D800 is copper chassis & better innards. Stuff like premium Elna & Nichicon capacitors. 

http://www.alpine.com.au/showProduct.php?pid=7




It would be nice if Mr. Jim Walter could shine some light on this. If he is not at liberty say anything at this time. Maybe a good thing comes to those who wait comment would set my mind at ease. 




.


----------



## quality_sound

I'm going to just go with the D106 (I know it's outdated but I want a single DIN screen with a knob) and will upgrade to a D800 if it comes to the US. I'm really just sick of waiting and having my interior in my garage.


----------



## quickaudi07

quality_sound said:


> I'm going to just go with the D106 (I know it's outdated but I want a single DIN screen with a knob) and will upgrade to a D800 if it comes to the US. I'm really just sick of waiting and having my interior in my garage.


I hope everything works out for you man, you have been working on your car for some time now, get this **** done finally !


----------



## 1edgekilla

as much as I would love to wait on the H800... I really don't have the money right now anyway... there's a possibility I will change my mind and wait on a HU that allows full control of the H800 but for now I think im going to pick up an H701 and C701 and combine it with a double din such as the W502 or 505 if I can find one.


----------



## quality_sound

1edgekilla said:


> as much as I would love to wait on the H800... I really don't have the money right now anyway... there's a possibility I will change my mind and wait on a HU that allows full control of the H800 but for now I think im going to pick up an H701 and C701 and combine it with a double din such as the W502 or 505 if I can find one.


So why not pick up an H800 and C800? It would be exactly the same as what you're looking at now and you can even run it with your OEM HU (instead of paying for a W502 or W505) to mitigate some of the cost of the H800 and leave the possibility open for a new HU down the line.


----------



## quickaudi07

quality_sound said:


> So why not pick up an H800 and C800? It would be exactly the same as what you're looking at now and you can even run it with your OEM HU (instead of paying for a W502 or W505) to mitigate some of the cost of the H800 and leave the possibility open for a new HU down the line.


Are you still selling yours? i send you PM and didn't get anything back from you.


----------



## jim walter

As far as I know, there are no plans to bring it here.


----------



## 1edgekilla

jim walter said:


> As far as I know, there are no plans to bring it here.


go figure.


----------



## bombzombie

I believe Jim here. When I was going through my saga trying to upgrade to the MRA-D550 theater amp, one Alpine tech support suggested I just order a H800 from either Europe or Taiwan. And I did. Despite all of the rumors to the contrary about the H800 eventually being released here, I know of nobody in the US who has a unit that they did not obtain this way.

Further, as some, noticed with Alpine's latest product launch in January. The A designation (iDA, iXA, CDA, INA, IVA, etc...) radios are gone. They no longer exist and future plans to make any appear non-existent. This leads me to believe that Alpine will no longer support high-end car integrated head unit processing. 

I'm not sure if that means they will never release a PXA-H800 / controller combo in the U.S. or not. But what I (or rather we) do know is that people have been talking about this unit since January of 2011, or earlier I recall correctly. For me personally, I stand by my statement that I can hear no sonic distinction between the H701, my MRA-F350 or the once possessed - now sold - H800, and thus, I have moved on.

Whether or if it is ever released in the U.S., I believe the difficulties in getting it to work properly have been well-documented herein and the marginal distinctions in sound quality remove the value of adding this unit to me.


----------



## quickaudi07

When the hell is H800 going to be out? I'm waiting just like thousands of other people... 

Alpine website if full of ****, what about any other car audio controllers ?


----------



## ErinH

jim walter said:


> As far as I know, there are no plans to bring it here.


Wow. To clarify, are you speaking about the h800?


----------



## Thrill_House

jim walter said:


> As far as I know, there are no plans to bring it here.


If thats the case then alpine should really remove any mention of it from there u.s. website.


----------



## jim walter

bikinpunk said:


> Wow. To clarify, are you speaking about the h800?


No. That was reference to the 1DIN flip out D800


----------



## jim walter

Thrill_House said:


> If thats the case then alpine should really remove any mention of it from there u.s. website.


There is no mention of the D800 on our USA website. The H800 will be launching as released at CES this year and is listed on our website.


----------



## Thrill_House

jim walter said:


> There is no mention of the D800 on our USA website. The H800 will be launching as released at CES this year and is listed on our website.


Ohh ok, i thought you meant the h800 was not be released over here. My appolgies.


----------



## bombzombie

Thrill_House said:


> If thats the case then alpine should really remove any mention of it from there u.s. website.


There is only one reference to the PXA-H800.

Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.

It is referenced twice within the paragraph as the ultimate sound upgrade. Further the website sayeth not.


----------



## Thrill_House

bombzombie said:


> There is only one reference to the PXA-H800.
> 
> Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.
> 
> It is referenced twice within the paragraph as the ultimate sound upgrade. Further the website sayeth not.


Its also mentioned under the company section under the factory integration release.


----------



## ErinH

jim walter said:


> No. That was reference to the 1DIN flip out D800


Man, I was about to freak out. lol.

Jim, are there any plans to add more processing capability to the h800? I'm honestly a bit saddened that we're still only given the same features (in terms of standard dsp; not surround, roadeq, etc) that the previous units have had. I'd like to see more user adjustable Q variability, more bands per p-eq (or something like the paragraphic that many units such as Mosconi, Helix, and Arc employ).

I can go on and on. I'll stop. Just something I would love to see Alpine do.


----------



## bombzombie

Thrill_House said:


> Its also mentioned under the company section under the factory integration release.


True, true and very true, sir. It did not come up when I used the website general search function.

Alpine Electronics of America, Inc.


----------



## bombzombie

bikinpunk said:


> Man, I was about to freak out. lol.
> 
> Jim, are there any plans to add more processing capability to the h800? I'm honestly a bit saddened that we're still only given the same features (in terms of standard dsp; not surround, roadeq, etc) that the previous units have had. I'd like to see more user adjustable Q variability, more bands per p-eq (or something like the paragraphic that many units such as Mosconi, Helix, and Arc employ).
> 
> I can go on and on. I'll stop. Just something I would love to see Alpine do.


+1 me too!!


----------



## hilander999

bikinpunk said:


> Man, I was about to freak out. lol.
> 
> Jim, are there any plans to add more processing capability to the h800? I'm honestly a bit saddened that we're still only given the same features (in terms of standard dsp; not surround, roadeq, etc) that the previous units have had. I'd like to see more user adjustable Q variability, more bands per p-eq (or something like the paragraphic that many units such as Mosconi, Helix, and Arc employ).
> 
> I can go on and on. I'll stop. Just something I would love to see Alpine do.


Where did you see that they are not including the RoadEQ feature?

Thats the only real deciding factor for me to upgrade from the h660.
All the other features listed certainly make it much better then the h660, but there's nothing I can't "live without" other then the possibility to lower outside noise since my magnaflow exaust is'nt exactly quiet.


----------



## ErinH

hilander999 said:


> Where did you see that they are not including the RoadEQ feature?
> 
> Thats the only real deciding factor for me to upgrade from the h660.
> All the other features listed certainly make it much better then the h660, but there's nothing I can't "live without" other then the possibility to lower outside noise since my magnaflow exaust is'nt exactly quiet.


I didn't say that.
I was saying, the dsp capability itself regarding the manual tune adjustments is the same as the h701. 31 band graphic or 10 band parametric (though, you can layer the p-eq bands this time which is nice) and the overall attenuation increments along with t/a increments are the same as the h701. there may be a small nuance here or there, but for the most part, it's the same.

that doesn't include the roadEQ and auto tune features. again, just the manual tune aspect.


----------



## hilander999

bikinpunk said:


> I didn't say that.
> I was saying, the dsp capability itself regarding the manual tune adjustments is the same as the h701. 31 band graphic or 10 band parametric (though, you can layer the p-eq bands this time which is nice) and the overall attenuation increments along with t/a increments are the same as the h701. there may be a small nuance here or there, but for the most part, it's the same.
> 
> that doesn't include the roadEQ and auto tune features. again, just the manual tune aspect.


OK, that makes more sense. The way you (quoted it) made it seem as if they dropped those features from the USA release which is what baffled me. lol


----------



## claytonzmvox

someone thinks mosconi processors and the new arc audio better than the alpine? I just buy the PXA H800 but I'm thinking of selling it and buying mosconi!!


----------



## bombzombie

hilander999 said:


> OK, that makes more sense. The way you (quoted it) made it seem as if they dropped those features from the USA release which is what baffled me. lol


And to clarify further hilander since I, at one time had and used the H800....the Road EQ in my humble opinion is no saving grace.

It is not what I originally thought it was - an active noise cancellation system - and thus, I was disappointed when I didn't get the anticipated noise cancellation.

It is simply a electronic means of equalizing the sound to approximate a baseline. That is, we took my truck to a garage and ran a test track in the peace and quiet....the system measured the sound without the road or engine noise. Later, when turned on, it makes equalization adjustments to the music to compensate for the engine and road noise to cover up the extraneous noise the processor knows is not the music.

It's a nice idea but in practice, I was unimpressed in my truck. I thought I was getting an active noise cancellation system to cancel out those noises. I didn't notice any real differences and we tried the setup three times. Others may have different luck, but I just thought you should know what you are actually buying.


----------



## bbfoto

bombzombie, thanks for taking the time to post your experience with the RoadEQ functionality. Good info.


----------



## quickaudi07

I would like to share little video of this unit.

Alpine PXA-H800 Digital sound processor at Crutchfield.com


----------



## supernova7

there is just so many pages on this thread :dizzy:

just quick question if someone can clarify please

i have a pxa h800 and im looking at the iva d106
it has optical to go to pxa with standard optical cable?
will i have volume control via the ai-net
and will it support an ipod at the same time with ipod control on screen?

or if anyone has a better suggestion for a single din unit with optical, ai-net and ipod support under 1k please let me know 

thanks :juggle:


----------



## evo9

Crutchfield said:


> Item# 500PXAH800
> 
> Be the first to write a review
> 
> 
> *PRE-ORDER Ship date uncertain*
> 
> 
> 
> *Reserve yours risk-free*
> 
> 
> Email me when available
> 
> Free
> 
> Crutchfield lifetime tech support
> 
> 
> Free
> 
> Shipping
> 
> 
> 
> Your price $699.99



What a joke! 










.


----------



## TokoSpeaker

We can sell the same price for Alpine Processor Pxa H800.
If organize in bulk order, it can save more money on shipping cost.

Thank you.


----------



## supernova7

a guy is selling them on ebay . ca like $610 can shipped


----------



## kyheng

2011 Alpine PXA-H800 5.1 DTS Audio Processor Latest Version Replace PXA-H701 | eBay
$610 shipped....


----------



## ErinH

^ I've never seen him advertise the c800.... have you?
A lot of folks here would need that.


As an aside, I've dealt with Toko and can vouch for him.


----------



## Thrill_House

supernova7 said:


> there is just so many pages on this thread :dizzy:
> 
> just quick question if someone can clarify please
> 
> i have a pxa h800 and im looking at the iva d106
> it has optical to go to pxa with standard optical cable?
> will i have volume control via the ai-net
> and will it support an ipod at the same time with ipod control on screen?
> 
> or if anyone has a better suggestion for a single din unit with optical, ai-net and ipod support under 1k please let me know
> 
> thanks :juggle:


If you use the ainet cable then you will still have your volume control and im pretty sure you get to retain your sub control as well.


----------



## Thrill_House

supernova7 said:


> a guy is selling them on ebay . ca like $610 can shipped


I bought my h800 and c800 from that guy, he is awesome to deal with.


----------



## quality_sound

Thrill_House said:


> If you use the ainet cable then you will still have your volume control and im pretty sure you get to retain your sub control as well.



Sub control depends on the unit used.


----------



## bombzombie

Thrill_House said:


> I bought my h800 and c800 from that guy, he is awesome to deal with.


Same here. No problems whatsoever.


----------



## kyheng

bikinpunk said:


> ^ I've never seen him advertise the c800.... have you?
> A lot of folks here would need that.
> 
> 
> As an aside, I've dealt with Toko and can vouch for him.


I hate you, haha... Yup, from the begining till today, he is only selly H800 and no C800..
Also, he do sell other Alpine DD HUs also, but don't know why now he don't list them in Ebay anymore....
As for Toko, I'm pretty sure he is a good seller....


----------



## quickaudi07

How much did you guys pay with shipping ?

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk


----------



## Thrill_House

kyheng said:


> I hate you, haha... Yup, from the begining till today, he is only selly H800 and no C800..
> Also, he do sell other Alpine DD HUs also, but don't know why now he don't list them in Ebay anymore....
> As for Toko, I'm pretty sure he is a good seller....


He does in fact sell the c800 as well, if you msg him on ebay hhe will get it for you. I got mine from him this way.


----------



## pionkej

You can still tune the H800 with a laptop sans c800 correct? It would be like the Zapco DC series without the RLC. 

I've never much cared for the single din controller for an external processor, so I don't think that would be a big priority for me anyways. 

Also, is there a list of what Alpine H/U control the H800 and to what level? I still wouldn't care to tune from the head unit if I got one, simply control volume, fader, and switch presets (if that is even an option).


----------



## Thrill_House

quality_sound said:


> Sub control depends on the unit used.


True, i have the compatability list at home and iirc that is one of the units that supports sub level control.


----------



## Thrill_House

pionkej said:


> You can still tune the H800 with a laptop sans c800 correct? It would be like the Zapco DC series without the RLC.
> 
> I've never much cared for the single din controller for an external processor, so I don't think that would be a big priority for me anyways.
> 
> Also, is there a list of what Alpine H/U control the H800 and to what level? I still wouldn't care to tune from the head unit if I got one, simply control volume, fader, and switch presets (if that is even an option).


The only units that give you full and complete control of the h800 are the w910 and the d800. Everything else is basic control.


----------



## quality_sound

pionkej said:


> You can still tune the H800 with a laptop sans c800 correct? It would be like the Zapco DC series without the RLC.
> 
> I've never much cared for the single din controller for an external processor, so I don't think that would be a big priority for me anyways.
> 
> Also, is there a list of what Alpine H/U control the H800 and to what level? I still wouldn't care to tune from the head unit if I got one, simply control volume, fader, and switch presets (if that is even an option).


As long as you have an Ai-Net HU to connect, yes. The H800 MUSH have the C800, an Ai-Net HU, or the H800 connected to power up.


----------



## quality_sound

Thrill_House said:


> The only units that give you full and complete control of the h800 are the w910 and the d800. Everything else is basic control.


I didn't think the D800 had full control. It's been a while since I looked at the list though.


----------



## Thrill_House

quality_sound said:


> I didn't think the D800 had full control. It's been a while since I looked at the list though.


I will check the pdf again when i get a second, it would be pretty silly though if the companion hu for the h800 could not control all its functions.


----------



## ErinH

Thrill_House said:


> The only units that give you full and complete control of the h800 are the w910 and the d800. Everything else is basic control.


The 910 absolutely does not give you complete control. I owned these two last year. Though the 910 does control the h701. Jim covered this somewhere.


----------



## 1edgekilla

bikinpunk said:


> The 910 absolutely does not give you complete control. I owned these two last year. Though the 910 does control the h701. Jim covered this somewhere.


Could there be a misunderstanding where the newer released H800's can be controlled via the 910? If so that would be sick I'd go buy it tomorrow!


----------



## Thrill_House

bikinpunk said:


> The 910 absolutely does not give you complete control. I owned these two last year. Though the 910 does control the h701. Jim covered this somewhere.


Seriously? Well that sure sucks bawls, i was under the impression that the 910 did do full control, i sure hope the d800 at least does then if thats the case.


----------



## subwoofery

1edgekilla said:


> Could there be a *misunderstanding* where the newer released H800's can be controlled via the 910? If so that would be sick I'd go buy it tomorrow!


NOPE... 

Kelvin


----------



## bombzombie

bikinpunk said:


> The 910 absolutely does not give you complete control. I owned these two last year. Though the 910 does control the h701. Jim covered this somewhere.


x2

I owned them as recently as 3 months ago. There is no unit that is fully capable of controlling the H800 without either the RUX or a computer setup. Period.

If you want headunit control, you had better stick with your H701. The H800 with the 910 permits, as I recall, sub level adjustments and changes to presets. It is very limited. If you are the type that likes to play around with things at random, you're either going to need to get the RUX or keep a laptop in your ride.


----------



## Kobayashi2B

Hi. Prior to joining diyma, i've read half of this 58pages thread on the h800. My 1st unit was a flop as it showed all signs of a defective unit (even updated its fw to 1.003 but did not resolve it - clearly a hardware problem than software). I was suppossed to give up on this processor and just change my head unit with a P99 but the 2nd unit we installed just did the trick. Its fw is 1.001 and shows no signs of noise, distortion nor whinning sounds. It just made my factory HU sound sweet (the stock SQ was no good but this processor surely beefed it up). For me, money well spent.


----------



## Kobayashi2B

Got a noob question though... We connected it via a rca to ainet cable to the processor and this had a cleaner and louder output rather than just direct rca cable to processor. Why does the ainet conversion cable sound better? Tia.


----------



## quality_sound

Fixed input Voltage.


----------



## kyheng

Fixed or not, I don't know... Have to check out the circuit design first.... 
This is just like Pioneer stuffs, using ux-in the sound are not that good, but once using IP-Bus stuffs, it will sound better....


----------



## quality_sound

Erin said it was fixed when he did his testing of the H800, the B1.1 and the H701.


----------



## maxxx

Is there a way for my iPhone 4s to control the h800?


----------



## quality_sound

Hahahahahahahaha :laugh::laugh:


Sorry, I meant "no".


----------



## s4k4zulu

quality_sound said:


> Hahahahahahahaha
> 
> 
> Sorry, I meant "no".


Lmao. Be niceeee


----------



## quality_sound

Better?


----------



## quickaudi07

TokoSpeaker said:


> We can sell the same price for Alpine Processor Pxa H800.
> If organize in bulk order, it can save more money on shipping cost.
> 
> Thank you.


Is anyone interested in group buy? If anything count me in....


TokoSpeakers can you please provide with a number of people we need to have to buy that unit, and how much would it be?

I need the controller with that unit as well.

Thank You


----------



## TokoSpeaker

Dear Sir,

Thank you for your interest.

I have no limitation on the quantity.
But for sure, you can also check the shipping cost from USA to Indonesia.
It is almost the same.

I usually use TNT Company, because they offer a good shipping rate.
Normally, I can get 40% discount for shipping cost.

Just an example :
- Shipping cost for 20 kg is around USD 200.00.
For one Alpine PXA H-800 approximately 4-5kg.

I am not taking profit on the shipping cost. It is yours.

Because I do mean to help you all in Diyma.com, who interested to buy Alpine PXA H800 and Alpine RUX C800.

Money is not everything for me.
But our friendship is more important for me.


Thank you.

Best Regards,

Mr. David


----------



## quickaudi07

Mr.Dave 

So how much would it be a tottal amount for the H800 and RUX C800?

I'm sure we all would like to know the amount that we are looking forward to spend.

Thanks

Mario


----------



## quickaudi07

All,
I have a quick question, if I get the unit from another country, will US updates (software/frame-ware) work with the unit once US versions gets released?
Or will I have to download and update everything from foreign country?

Please let me know I'm about to put my order in.

Thank You

Mario


----------



## minbari

depends if the hardware changes between then and now. it will also depend on if they hardcode a country code into the hardware. it may only accept firmware from the country of origin. (although this is not likely, I have seen products like this)


----------



## claytonzmvox

TokoSpeaker said:


> Dear Sir,
> 
> Thank you for your interest.
> 
> I have no limitation on the quantity.
> But for sure, you can also check the shipping cost from USA to Indonesia.
> It is almost the same.
> 
> I usually use TNT Company, because they offer a good shipping rate.
> Normally, I can get 40% discount for shipping cost.
> 
> Just an example :
> - Shipping cost for 20 kg is around USD 200.00.
> For one Alpine PXA H-800 approximately 4-5kg.
> 
> I am not taking profit on the shipping cost. It is yours.
> 
> Because I do mean to help you all in Diyma.com, who interested to buy Alpine PXA H800 and Alpine RUX C800.
> 
> Money is not everything for me.
> But our friendship is more important for me.
> 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> Mr. David


I'm from Brazil and bought my PXA + RUX with David's great to TOKOSPEAKER new friend, and vendor recommended complete peace of mind!!


----------



## claytonzmvox

quickaudi07 said:


> All,
> I have a quick question, if I get the unit from another country, will US updates (software/frame-ware) work with the unit once US versions gets released?
> Or will I have to download and update everything from foreign country?
> 
> Please let me know I'm about to put my order in.
> 
> Thank You
> 
> Mario


who can speak a bit about it is the staff tokospeaker. they sell to the world. I hope this answer too!!


----------



## GVTrini07

I am from Trinidad in the Caribbean. Bought my H800 and Rux from Toko. Had it shipped to a buddy from Malaysia ($8.00 shipping cost) and he hand carried it for me. Firmware updated perfectly. No real issues with the unit so far. Tokospeakers was very accomodating shipping to someone other than myself and good to deal with. Answers emails promptly!


----------



## quickaudi07

Do you guys know what are the difference between AUD and US version of software or hardware its self?

I have contacted Alpine directly and support tech told me to wait on the US version, US version is going to be perfect! without any issues like other countries have experienced it. 

I'm just wondering whats the big deal between other countries and US model.

Should I just get that peace of my last puzzle and call it a day?


----------



## quickaudi07

GVTrini07 said:


> I am from Trinidad in the Caribbean. Bought my H800 and Rux from Toko. Had it shipped to a buddy from Malaysia ($8.00 shipping cost) and he hand carried it for me. Firmware updated perfectly. No real issues with the unit so far. Tokospeakers was very accomodating shipping to someone other than myself and good to deal with. Answers emails promptly!


Thank you for the kind works, I don't have extra 200-300US $ (I do but don't really want to spend on shipping).
Last time i was quoted by Toko, was 1300+ US $....


----------



## hilander999

quickaudi07 said:


> Do you guys know what are the difference between AUD and US version of software or hardware its self?
> 
> I have contacted Alpine directly and support tech told me to wait on the US version, US version is going to be perfect! without any issues like other countries have experienced it.
> 
> I'm just wondering whats the big deal between other countries and US model.
> 
> Should I just get that peace of my last puzzle and call it a day?


Alpine is clearly using other countries as beta testers for a new product.

It would be like purchasing a new version of Microsoft WINDOWS before the first service pack, not something you want to do if you can afford to wait for them to get the bugs out of the system first.


----------



## quickaudi07

I understand, thank you....


----------



## quality_sound

hilander999 said:


> Alpine is clearly using other countries as beta testers for a new product.


Or it could just be that Americans are whiny bitches that can't accept the fact that they might have to do a software upgrade after purchase...


----------



## hilander999

quality_sound said:


> Or it could just be that Americans are whiny bitches that can't accept the fact that they might have to do a software upgrade after purchase...


Americans expect **** to work out of the box.

Very few people will understand that this is more of a computer then anything else, and being such will require firmware upgrades to fix bugs, which "SHOULD" have been handled before releasing the product in the first place.

Just so you understand, name calling is never a good idea and says more about you then anything else you will ever say. Having said that, the term "Spoiled Brats" is probably a better description of those "Whiny Americans".


----------



## quality_sound

Being an American, and in the military, I'm free to call us whatever I choose. Americans, as a whole, are an entitled, lazy, whiny group of people. That is however, a subject for another time and place.

Yes, as a computer product it will, from time to time, require some work on the user's end. That need for updates sin't limited to this product, or computer products in general.


----------



## quickaudi07

I'm so fed up of waiting for this unit, I just want it and that's it, I have talked to Alpine, no actual release date yet, but they said it could be sometime this month, or next month! Its like WTF are they doing, just release the damn product in US and call it day, software and update are available from other country of Alpine, if needs to be.
I'm sure threes so many ppl just waiting for that unit to be released. 

Why is Alpine so lame on dates? Kenwood DNX9990hd will be out next month and when I talked to the support ppl, they said and they could bet there money on it.. Why can't Alpine do the same?


----------



## subwoofery

quickaudi07 said:


> I'm so fed up of waiting for this unit, I just want it and that's it, I have talked to Alpine, no actual release date yet, but they said it could be sometime this month, or next month! Its like WTF are they doing, just release the damn product in US and call it day, software and update are available from other country of Alpine, if needs to be.
> I'm sure threes so many ppl just waiting for that unit to be released.
> 
> Why is Alpine so lame on dates? Kenwood DNX9990hd will be out next month and when I talked to the support ppl, they said and they could bet there money on it.. Why can't Alpine do the same?


Just buy what's out already: DPS 6to8, P-DSP, C-DSP 
Or wait for Zapco or Arc Audio to release theirs... 

^ good times for solid processors. 

Kelvin


----------



## quickaudi07

I would interested in the Arc Audio, but its not released yet, and I did some research today and it Arc Audio will be announcing a date a release.


----------



## rugdnit

quickaudi07 said:


> I would interested in the Arc Audio, but its not released yet, and I did some research today and it Arc Audio will be announcing a date a release.


Definitely leaning heavily towards the PS8.


----------



## quickaudi07

do you guys may heard of a price point for that unit? also when will it be released?
I'm also looking in to the controller for it as well, I just hope Alpine wont make up their minds and start releasing it before Arc does lol

I need to cancel my order to get my money back for H800.... 
Darn it, why is everything have to be so damn complicated!


----------



## claytonzmvox

how to connect kca420i PXA H800 + + ivaD310. I have full control of iPod through the head unit.
Use all connected by Ainet. HU> Fiber Optics> PXA>
D310 brain> Ainet> PXA
KCA420I DIRECT CONNECTED WITH THE CABLE Ainet PXA H800.

SORRY, BUT I AM NOT GOOD IN ENGLISH!! RSRSRSRSRSRS


----------



## Thrill_House

claytonzmvox said:


> how to connect kca420i PXA H800 + + ivaD310. I have full control of iPod through the head unit.
> Use all connected by Ainet. HU> Fiber Optics> PXA>
> D310 brain> Ainet> PXA
> KCA420I DIRECT CONNECTED WITH THE CABLE Ainet PXA H800.
> 
> SORRY, BUT I AM NOT GOOD IN ENGLISH!! RSRSRSRSRSRS


Just hook the d310 to the "hu ainet" connection on the processor and the KCA-420i to the other ainter input on the processor and you are done. I have the KCA-420i hooked up to my h800 this way and it works fine.


----------



## YellowC4S

hilander999 said:


> Americans expect **** to work out of the box.
> 
> ".


If that is the case then why do americans buy american made cars?


----------



## hilander999

> Originally Posted by hilander999
> Americans expect **** to work out of the *box*.





YellowC4S said:


> If that is the case then why do americans buy american made cars?


If your buying your cars out of a box, then you have issues. :laugh:


----------



## YellowC4S

Only have issues with american made cars...maybe if they were made in boxes though...nah...they still wouldn't be worth ****.


----------



## hilander999

You have to buy the right American made car.

Garbage is garbage, no matter what country it comes from, and yes there are plenty of crap cars made both in this country and abroad. You get what you pay for, no more.

Go test drive a new Charger or Challenger and you will know what a great American made car feels like, providing of course you go for broke and drive the HEMI, not the v6 version.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-34Fdtg1dI


----------



## subwoofery

hilander999 said:


> You have to buy the right American made car.
> 
> Garbage is garbage, no matter what country it comes from, and yes there are plenty of crap cars made both in this country and abroad. You get what you pay for, no more.
> 
> Go test drive a new Charger or Challenger and you will know what a great American made car feels like, providing of course you go for broke and drive the HEMI, not the v6 version.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-34Fdtg1dI


I rent a lot of cars due to my work... Drove a charger and hated it (V8 version). 
Challenger was better but not that good either compared to German made ones. Handling and comfort wise. 

Just saying. 

Kelvin


----------



## YellowC4S

Don't want to hijack the thread but IMO, it's like this. We do a lot of great things in this country but we don't do:
Cars
TV's or
VCR's

I would take almost anything coming out of Germany used over a new chrysler any day of the week and probably twice on Sunday's.


----------



## claytonzmvox

Thrill_House said:


> Just hook the d310 to the "hu ainet" connection on the processor and the KCA-420i to the other ainter input on the processor and you are done. I have the KCA-420i hooked up to my h800 this way and it works fine.


Thank you friend, my ipod was discharged, after I load it, it worked perfectly. sorry pessoal.rsrsrsrsrsrswrs:surprised:


----------



## quickaudi07

subwoofery said:


> I rent a lot of cars due to my work... Drove a charger and hated it (V8 version).
> Challenger was better but not that good either compared to German made ones. Handling and comfort wise.
> 
> Just saying.
> 
> Kelvin


I agree with you Kelvin,
German cars are nice, great handling, nice looking curves and so on, I had to take my Audi for a recall today and they provided me with rental which is 2012 A4 Quattro and the car had only 48m when i got it. 
Its a nice ride and you do get what you pay for! but on the other hand, German cars are so expensive its not even funny, parts are a killer! but again, if you cant afford a car like that, than please don't buy it. Everything is double or triple the price!
I had 1 American car and I said never again... But since now I have a family ~ I might need to consider of getting Toyota, or Jeep, as a family car, but I'm still keeping my Audi


----------



## quickaudi07

BTW this Audi has a 3 way front stage with center channel. Its not bad for stock sound system, but i wouldn't trade it for what I have.....


----------



## quality_sound

I thought the B&O in my '11 A4 Avant blew goats. Not as bad as some cars, but I though the base setup in my '10 M3 was better.


----------



## quickaudi07

Anyone heard of release date on this unit?? I called Alpine today and some tech told me that it will be out in June! 

Does anyone have any info or input?


----------



## Driven Audio Tony

As with any high-tech device, it will ship when it ships.. it's about a year late, so I would not hold your breath 

If your in a hurry for something I'd choose another processor that is shipping.


----------



## asawendo

I do now what happened in US Version, but for International version after 2 major updates my Alpine PXA H800 working flawlessly without any identified problem. 

Best Regards

Wendo


----------



## claytonzmvox

asawendo said:


> I do now what happened in US Version, but for International version after 2 major updates my Alpine PXA H800 working flawlessly without any identified problem.
> 
> Best Regards
> 
> Wendo


can post the latest update to the PXA? My equipment was purchased in tokospeaker, then it must be equal to its equipment.


----------



## acidbass303

asawendo said:


> I do now what happened in US Version, but for International version after 2 major updates my Alpine PXA H800 working flawlessly without any identified problem.
> 
> Best Regards
> 
> Wendo


The latest H800 firmware is v1.003, mine is running the same version and still it loses its settings etc if the power wire/harness is unplugged for even a second...



claytonzmvox said:


> can post the latest update to the PXA? My equipment was purchased in tokospeaker, then it must be equal to its equipment.


http://www.alpine-europe.com/support/firmware-update/pxa-h800-firmware-update.html


----------



## quality_sound

Weird, mine doesn't do that. I'll check the software version tomorrow.


----------



## claytonzmvox

I was researching and found that latest version is v1.003, but now I was thinking about keeping this response settings. in my case is just the noise that is disturbing!!


----------



## quickaudi07

claytonzmvox said:


> I was researching and found that latest version is v1.003, but now I was thinking about keeping this response settings. in my case is just the noise that is disturbing!!


What noise are you getting, is it a ground noise?


----------



## claytonzmvox

Yes, a background noise, different from the normal noise or interference caused by wiring of power cables, is a metallic noise. Here in Brazil some friends that use the PXA, said that noise is. And updating the program removes the noise.


----------



## asawendo

acidbass303 said:


> The latest H800 firmware is v1.003, mine is running the same version and still it loses its settings etc if the power wire/harness is unplugged for even a second...
> 
> 
> 
> Alpine.com - PXA-H800 Firmware Update


Bro if you unplugged the device then the hardware is reset but if you follow up the procedure like this

Go to setting like it used to be for example 2 way + Sub or 3 way + Sub (do not change your setting and then follow the setup until it say turn off acc

Just do that and then go to preset and call your memory it will recalled to your previous memory.


----------



## asawendo

claytonzmvox said:


> Yes, a background noise, different from the normal noise or interference caused by wiring of power cables, is a metallic noise. Here in Brazil some friends that use the PXA, said that noise is. And updating the program removes the noise.


I'm using 1.003 firmware like yours 

Go to setting find input setting turn off what you don't need including digital input. Maybe that can help. Thx


----------



## quality_sound

asawendo said:


> Bro if you unplugged the device then the hardware is reset but if you follow up the procedure like this
> 
> Go to setting like it used to be for example 2 way + Sub or 3 way + Sub (do not change your setting and then follow the setup until it say turn off acc
> 
> Just do that and then go to preset and call your memory it will recalled to your previous memory.


He shouldn't have to. Mine doesn't do that. Even disconnected it will retain it's settings.


----------



## asawendo

quality_sound said:


> He shouldn't have to. Mine doesn't do that. Even disconnected it will retain it's settings.


Yeach mine always retained all memory right now (after firmware update) but I always do that before firmware update.


----------



## Bartbx

Goodevening,

the early version of the PXH800 did forget its settings, this was cured by the second firmware update, it will ask you to confirm your speaker setup but it will remember the other settings. This confirmation is asked as part of a safety procedure to save tweeters in all active systems. The noise can also come from the setting where you have to choose hi/low input level. I have installed quiet a few pxh800 already in all kind of setups, optical input, speaker input,ai-net and different output systems and have not yet encountered one problem of any kind. Please reset your unit after installation and prior to any programming. Sometimes there can be some processor "pollution" during installation and then you start with a clean install.


----------



## acidbass303

asawendo said:


> Bro if you unplugged the device then the hardware is reset but if you follow up the procedure like this
> 
> Go to setting like it used to be for example 2 way + Sub or 3 way + Sub (do not change your setting and then follow the setup until it say turn off acc
> 
> Just do that and then go to preset and call your memory it will recalled to your previous memory.


Thanks for the tip bro. Its funny that they didn't mention it in the manual. Otherwise my thoughts were the same as this:



quality_sound said:


> He shouldn't have to. Mine doesn't do that. Even disconnected it will retain it's settings.



Sir, do you have to go through the stated procedure of selecting a speaker output system and then recalling the preset or does your unit retain all the settings and doesn't require any recalling of presets etc?




Bartbx said:


> Goodevening,
> 
> the early version of the PXH800 did forget its settings, this was cured by the second firmware update, it will ask you to confirm your speaker setup but it will remember the other settings. This confirmation is asked as part of a safety procedure to save tweeters in all active systems. The noise can also come from the setting where you have to choose hi/low input level. I have installed quiet a few pxh800 already in all kind of setups, optical input, speaker input,ai-net and different output systems and have not yet encountered one problem of any kind. Please reset your unit after installation and prior to any programming. Sometimes there can be some processor "pollution" during installation and then you start with a clean install.


Thanks a lot for the in-depth detail. I will definitely try this the next time I encounter such a situation. It would have really helped if they (Alpine) mentioned it in the manual or the press release. I have a question, how are you guys finding the ImprintEQ? I think the Autotune is pretty decent on this one. Can someone share tips for ideal/best mic locations and levels? ( At one place in the manual it says the mic should be at the ear level and at another place it says to go for shoulder level).
Thanks for the input guys.


----------



## quality_sound

I'll check tomorrow but I think I might have to redo the output setup.


----------



## Bartbx

I'm sure you"ll find the correct setup and have fun with your processor, we at least do.The fact about it not or not clear beiing mentioned in the manual , well most of the time manual's are made by specialist who have develloped a product, they know it so well they forget to mention small things that our obvious, at least for them. Discussion treads like this are very helpfull t have feedback or tips from other users.

The question about the Imprint and auto-tune, I never use it. With the fisrst and second one we tried that feature and it sounded rare and ok better than without Imprint, we then tuned the cars manually and it was much better. Don't forget that sound is subjective, everybody prefers other colouring, more frontstage or more rear fill, etc... This is typical a product that you can buy in five minutes and have weeks, months or even years of pleasure with, finding new settings, new combinations and please do experiment with it. Not satisfied, just start over, in one car we nearly spend a week trying out different x-ver points,combinations of 2 channel or 3 channel stereo, etc... Just save them on a laptop and share your findings. I personally like the multichannel setup, try it out, set the pcm mode to 3 channel and listen to your cd's in stereo + center channel mode. Use MX expander when listening to MP3 or Ipod they will sound richer. Greetings from Belgium.


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## Bartbx

One thing about mic placement. I've a 80 page pdf file , from inside Alpine, where they explain every little feature of this phx-800. Please make sure you point your mic upwards, so direct it to the ceeling of your car. DON'T POINT FORWARDS, this is the most common mistake with IMPRINT, a second tip is turn of all amplifier x-overs, bassboost etc.... l. Imprint has to be able to make influence on different settings of your system. Thirth suggestion is place your mic on earlevel and remove the headrests .In some cases his can make a huge improvement in the tuning proces. I'll try to post the parts of the pdf that are usefull for the users of this system.


----------



## asawendo

Bartbx said:


> One thing about mic placement. I've a 80 page pdf file , from inside Alpine, where they explain every little feature of this phx-800. Please make sure you point your mic upwards, so direct it to the ceeling of your car. DON'T POINT FORWARDS, this is the most common mistake with IMPRINT, a second tip is turn of all amplifier x-overs, bassboost etc.... l. Imprint has to be able to make influence on different settings of your system. Thirth suggestion is place your mic on earlevel and remove the headrests .In some cases his can make a huge improvement in the tuning proces. I'll try to post the parts of the pdf that are usefull for the users of this system.


Please Post it Bro it will be useful for us to learn. Thank you very much!


----------



## bigguy2010

I read about this new processor on the Alpine website. Didn't find anything else new. Does anyone know if they're coming out with any other new amplifiers? Or just PDX still?


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## acidbass303

Bartbx said:


> One thing about mic placement. I've a 80 page pdf file , from inside Alpine, where they explain every little feature of this phx-800. Please make sure you point your mic upwards, so direct it to the ceeling of your car. DON'T POINT FORWARDS, this is the most common mistake with IMPRINT, a second tip is turn of all amplifier x-overs, bassboost etc.... l. Imprint has to be able to make influence on different settings of your system. Thirth suggestion is place your mic on earlevel and remove the headrests .In some cases his can make a huge improvement in the tuning proces. I'll try to post the parts of the pdf that are usefull for the users of this system.



It would be very nice and very helpful of you if you do post the insider tips for auto tuning. I remember the same thing happening with my H650 when I had it, the user manual was very ambiguous but a very helpful gentleman on this very forum ( Mr Greg Barnes aka The Baron Groog) sent me a very similar alpine insider guide for tuning and it helped a lot! The H800's manual specifically states that mic orientation is not important and has no effect but there you go, as you stated , it should be placed vertically.. And i will definitely try it with the headrests removed and at the ear level. Thank you very much for your tips mate, really looking forward to the parts of the PDF that you will post up.


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## Bartbx

I'm trying to find out how I can select the pages from the PDF file that are usefull and how to post them here. If anybody can give me some advise on this, I"ll post them as soon as possible. I'll start with the Imprint instructions, they are a step by step guide illustrated with pictures, written in english and there are some very usefull explanations on the technology and how they work.


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## Bartbx

@Bigguy, there will be some new amps coming out, one very nice one the PDX-V9 will be a brand new 5 channel amp. The RMS value for this one 4 x 100+ 1 x 500 at 14,4V and between 2/4Ohms. In the MRX range there will be the MRX-F65, 4 x 110w( 4 Ohm). On the belgian website you can downoad the 2012 catalogue with all the forseen new comings. Greetz.


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## quality_sound

Bartbx said:


> I'm trying to find out how I can select the pages from the PDF file that are usefull and how to post them here. If anybody can give me some advise on this, I"ll post them as soon as possible. I'll start with the Imprint instructions, they are a step by step guide illustrated with pictures, written in english and there are some very usefull explanations on the technology and how they work.


If you want to email the pdf to me and tell me what pages you want I can post them for you.


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## bigguy2010

Bartbx said:


> @Bigguy, there will be some new amps coming out, one very nice one the PDX-V9 will be a brand new 5 channel amp. The RMS value for this one 4 x 100+ 1 x 500 at 14,4V and between 2/4Ohms. In the MRX range there will be the MRX-F65, 4 x 110w( 4 Ohm). On the belgian website you can downoad the 2012 catalogue with all the forseen new comings. Greetz.




Thank you ! I thought they had something coming out this year. I'll keep an eye on their website over the next few months.


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## quickaudi07

Get your hands on it before its gone!

Search results for: 'alpine h800'


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## Bartbx

Ok, I succeeded in splitting the pdf file into several parts, can anyone give me a clue how to get them in this topic. I tried copy,cut and paste but I can't insert them here.I'm sure I'm doing something wrong.


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## quickaudi07

Bartbx said:


> Ok, I succeeded in splitting the pdf file into several parts, can anyone give me a clue how to get them in this topic. I tried copy,cut and paste but I can't insert them here.I'm sure I'm doing something wrong.


Once you reply, click on "Go Advanced" 
you will see this 
Attach Files
Valid file extensions: bmp doc gif jpe jpeg jpg pdf png psd txt zip

just click on that and select the file that you want to upload ...

Enjoy!


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## Bartbx

Can someone try this link. It should give the explanation and instruction on the Imprint module.Zippyshare.com - 35_pdfsam_pxha800uitleg.pdf


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## acidbass303

Bartbx said:


> Can someone try this link. It should give the explanation and instruction on the Imprint module.Zippyshare.com - 35_pdfsam_pxha800uitleg.pdf




Works like a charm............thank you so much for the share mate!
Cheers!


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## Bartbx

I hope this document can help lots of users in better understanding and easier use of the sytem. I'll post the rest of the interesting pages in seperate stages so you don't have to read everything but only the part you're interested in.All the credits for making this document go to Alpine.


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## quickaudi07

New toy has arrived 









Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


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## claytonzmvox

Bartbx said:


> Can someone try this link. It should give the explanation and instruction on the Imprint module.Zippyshare.com - 35_pdfsam_pxha800uitleg.pdf


thanks for the guide my friend!!


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## kobiejohn

Ours just showed up, not sure how to post pictures.


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## Petter

Alpine Europe have released two different but new firmwares.
1.100 and 2.100 depending on AI-NET usage or not.

Alpine*-*PXA-H800 & RUX-C800 (V1.100 / V2.100) Firmware Update

_The fixes are:
Cancel residual DSP noise
Save System Settings in Preset after lost battery or disconnected Ai-Net
Improved Preset data back up and restore (Navi mix setting (ON/OFF), guidance mix levels and Imprint settings are stored in Preset)
Subwoofer level adjustment for older Ai-NET units
Higher woofer level for DD and dts
Higher level for Navi Mix
New Sound Manager Software_


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## Thrill_House

quickaudi07 said:


> New toy has arrived
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


Love it!


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## quality_sound

Petter said:


> Alpine Europe have released two different but new firmwares.
> 1.100 and 2.100 depending on AI-NET usage or not.
> 
> Alpine*-*PXA-H800 & RUX-C800 (V1.100 / V2.100) Firmware Update
> 
> _The fixes are:
> Cancel residual DSP noise
> Save System Settings in Preset after lost battery or disconnected Ai-Net
> Improved Preset data back up and restore (Navi mix setting (ON/OFF), guidance mix levels and Imprint settings are stored in Preset)
> Subwoofer level adjustment for older Ai-NET units
> Higher woofer level for DD and dts
> Higher level for Navi Mix
> *New Sound Manager Software*_


Does it work with Windows newer than XP now???


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## Bartbx

Always did, I'm running it on a regular Windows 7 base on a 32 bit laptop and it works fine. Also have it running on a 64 bit laptop under a virtual 32 bit windows XP and also this works fine. A client of mine made this for me. So whatever computer you have, you can make it work. The reason why Alpine didn't foresee using it on newer 64 bit laptops is not clear to me.


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## dtbrown

I'm wondering if this pxa-h800 will sound better than the pxa-h100 that I currently have? I use only the tuning with the mic because it's better than how I can ever tune it by ear. I called alpine a couple weeks ago and they didn't have an exact answer because they didn't have a pxa-h800 to play with yet.


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## Bartbx

I set up a car with the autoeq and saved that to one preset and then tuned it again using my ears and a RTA analyser saved that to another preset. Then I let several people listen to it, they didn't know what they were listening at, and asked which settng they would choose, preset 1 or the second one. Every single one of them choose preset 2. This was also my findings about the imprint in the PXH800, I must say this was before I got the extra info I posted above. I placed the mic horizontal and afterwards it was made clear to place it vertical. Concerning the H100, I always liked the solution it gave in various vehicles. So try it, give it a few go's and listen to it. I tend to skipp the autotune and directly tune it manually.


----------



## quality_sound

Bartbx said:


> Always did, I'm running it on a regular Windows 7 base on a 32 bit laptop and it works fine. Also have it running on a 64 bit laptop under a virtual 32 bit windows XP and also this works fine. A client of mine made this for me. So whatever computer you have, you can make it work. The reason why Alpine didn't foresee using it on newer 64 bit laptops is not clear to me.


My Win7 is 64-bit and I really didn't want to load an entire second OS just to run ONE program. That's a bit silly for a program written in the last few years. 

If you have some tips to not chew up a ton of space with the virtual XP I'll take whatever tips you can give me.


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## quickaudi07

quality_sound said:


> My Win7 is 64-bit and I really didn't want to load an entire second OS just to run ONE program. That's a bit silly for a program written in the last few years.
> 
> If you have some tips to not chew up a ton of space with the virtual XP I'll take whatever tips you can give me.


Join the club bro!!!

Since i got my H800 yesterday, I had a older laptop laying around Compaq nx6325, and I just re installed windows xp on it lol.....

That's the only way to do it, there is no other way around it,

If you need a copy, let me know 

Mario


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## quality_sound

I actually have an OOOOOOOLD (like 10 or 11 years) Compaq Presario that has XP on it but it's sooooooooooo slow. I almost want to get a netbook but that's even more stupid than it not running natively on a 64-bit system.


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## quickaudi07

I know this may sound stupid, but see if you could get some kind of referb laptop with xp on it, I'm sure Ebay has them for good price.
You dont need anything special or powerful, the software its self takes about 250mb


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## Thrill_House

Petter said:


> Alpine Europe have released two different but new firmwares.
> 1.100 and 2.100 depending on AI-NET usage or not.
> 
> Alpine*-*PXA-H800 & RUX-C800 (V1.100 / V2.100) Firmware Update
> 
> _The fixes are:
> Cancel residual DSP noise
> Save System Settings in Preset after lost battery or disconnected Ai-Net
> Improved Preset data back up and restore (Navi mix setting (ON/OFF), guidance mix levels and Imprint settings are stored in Preset)
> Subwoofer level adjustment for older Ai-NET units
> Higher woofer level for DD and dts
> Higher level for Navi Mix
> New Sound Manager Software_


I finally get my sub level back, yay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## acidbass303

Petter said:


> Alpine Europe have released two different but new firmwares.
> 1.100 and 2.100 depending on AI-NET usage or not.
> 
> Alpine*-*PXA-H800 & RUX-C800 (V1.100 / V2.100) Firmware Update
> 
> _The fixes are:
> Cancel residual DSP noise
> Save System Settings in Preset after lost battery or disconnected Ai-Net
> Improved Preset data back up and restore (Navi mix setting (ON/OFF), guidance mix levels and Imprint settings are stored in Preset)
> Subwoofer level adjustment for older Ai-NET units
> Higher woofer level for DD and dts
> Higher level for Navi Mix
> New Sound Manager Software_


Cheers for the heads up mate!


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## acidbass303

quality_sound said:


> My Win7 is 64-bit and I really didn't want to load an entire second OS just to run ONE program. That's a bit silly for a program written in the last few years.
> 
> If you have some tips to not chew up a ton of space with the virtual XP I'll take whatever tips you can give me.


Not sure about the space it takes but, Vmware running XP under windows 7 64-bit gets the job done pretty good.


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## Thrill_House

So i ran the correct update and i still dont have sub level control, wtf!!_


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## quickaudi07

Thrill_House said:


> So i ran the correct update and i still dont have sub level control, wtf!!_


As I stated before I had a chance to play with my unit at home, and without upgrading software I had sub level control, I forgot how i did it, but it was there, when i get a chance maybe tonight I will make a video of it and post it up here to help you out... 

Mario


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## Thrill_House

quickaudi07 said:


> As I stated before I had a chance to play with my unit at home, and without upgrading software I had sub level control, I forgot how i did it, but it was there, when i get a chance maybe tonight I will make a video of it and post it up here to help you out...
> 
> Mario


So I did get the sub level control working, I just didnt realize that its not through the rux and not through the actual headunit itself which is fine. What headunit are you running with your h800?


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## quickaudi07

Thrill_House said:


> So I did get the sub level control working, I just didnt realize that its not through the rux and not through the actual headunit itself which is fine. What headunit are you running with your h800?


I didnt have a chance to install it yet. But i just got Kenwood DNX9990HD

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk


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## 2LOUD2OLD

Thrill_House said:


> So I did get the sub level control working, I just didnt realize that its not through the rux and not through the actual headunit itself which is fine. What headunit are you running with your h800?


which one is it? you said *not *through rux and *not *through headunit, what does that leave?


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## n_olympios

For those of you running Win7 64bit, doesn't "compatibility mode" do the trick? It usually does for me (although I haven't tried installing this particular software).


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## ET328

n_olympios said:


> For those of you running Win7 64bit, doesn't "compatibility mode" do the trick? It usually does for me (although I haven't tried installing this particular software).


No. The problem is that PXA-H800's USB drivers do not work/install in 64 bit systems and Sound Manager crashes without them.

It's a mystery why Alpine didn't compile 64bit drivers, the software package that was used to make the drivers seems to support 32 and 64 bits.


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## Thrill_House

2LOUD2OLD said:


> which one is it? you said *not *through rux and *not *through headunit, what does that leave?


Whoops sorry, bad engrish on my part, I meant it does work though the rux and NOT through the headunit.


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## quickaudi07

I have installed on xp 32 bit and it works fine, 

but thats kind of odd that it wont work on win7


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## ET328

quickaudi07 said:


> but thats kind of odd that it wont work on win7


It works fine in 32bit Windows 7.


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## quickaudi07

I will need to try it

Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


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## quickaudi07

looks like a long night of trying to figure it out before the install.

Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


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## quality_sound

I just wish it ran on 64-bit Win7 so I didn't have to fork out even more money for VMware or use my 11-year old Compaq that barely runs.


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## 2LOUD2OLD

quality_sound said:


> I just wish it ran on 64-bit Win7 so I didn't have to fork out even more money for VMware or use my 11-year old Compaq that barely runs.


umm VMWare Player is free


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## quality_sound

Ahhhh, I didn't see that one before. All I saw was VMware Workstation so I DL'd the trial version. DL'ing Player now and I found a pre-reg version of XP to run as well so HOPEFULLY I'll have it up and running on my Toshiba today or tomorrow.


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## Reginaldocm

Acompanhando

e

RIPA


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## claytonzmvox

Petter said:


> Alpine Europe have released two different but new firmwares.
> 1.100 and 2.100 depending on AI-NET usage or not.
> 
> Alpine*-*PXA-H800 & RUX-C800 (V1.100 / V2.100) Firmware Update
> 
> _The fixes are:
> Cancel residual DSP noise
> Save System Settings in Preset after lost battery or disconnected Ai-Net
> Improved Preset data back up and restore (Navi mix setting (ON/OFF), guidance mix levels and Imprint settings are stored in Preset)
> Subwoofer level adjustment for older Ai-NET units
> Higher woofer level for DD and dts
> Higher level for Navi Mix
> New Sound Manager Software_


and for those who use both types of connection? I use Ainet and optical fiber for use in a connected kca420i PXA.


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## Thrill_House

claytonzmvox said:


> and for those who use both types of connection? I use Ainet and optical fiber for use in a connected kca420i PXA.


You need version 2.1


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## claytonzmvox

I'm using a ivad310 alpine HU, would be the same firmware in this case? in my signature is wrong!!


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## Bollwerk

Bartbx said:


> Can someone try this link. It should give the explanation and instruction on the Imprint module.Zippyshare.com - 35_pdfsam_pxha800uitleg.pdf


I take it this document is from outside the US. Some of the spelling and grammar are clearly not from a native English speaker. =)

Thanks for posting though. Great info!


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## Reginaldocm

Do not know if you guys are having the same problems with respect to integration with other Alpine head units, because even with the IVa D800C has no way to complete control on the screen of the DVD, before I even used a DVD + D105R PXA H701 and did all adjustments atrazes D105's screen without the nescessidade RUX, Alpine apparently forcing the sale was married, because without RUX not give to make small adjustments at any time, always has a nescessidade nootbook, in the absence of RUX , dirty


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## acidbass303

Just updated my H800. Was a success. BTW, did anyone else notice an increase in the bass output with the new update?

Secondly i was wondering, where I can get the replacement H800 mic from? I am thinking of getting another one and install it permanently for the RoadEQ..


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## acidbass303

Reginaldocm said:


> Do not know if you guys are having the same problems with respect to integration with other Alpine head units, because even with the IVa D800C has no way to complete control on the screen of the DVD, before I even used a DVD + D105R PXA H701 and did all adjustments atrazes D105's screen without the nescessidade RUX, Alpine apparently forcing the sale was married, because without RUX not give to make small adjustments at any time, always has a nescessidade nootbook, in the absence of RUX , dirty


Currently no headunit in the Alpine lineup gives full control of H800. So its either RUX or the PC at the moment.


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## quickaudi07

acidbass303 said:


> Just updated my H800. Was a success. BTW, did anyone else notice an increase in the bass output with the new update?
> 
> Secondly i was wondering, where I can get the replacement H800 mic from? I am thinking of getting another one and install it permanently for the RoadEQ..


I think any mike should do the trick, just make sure you have 3.5 mm jack input.

Alpine Mic NVE-P1 IVA-W203 PMD-B200 TME-M740BT Bluetooth Microphone | eBay


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## acidbass303

quickaudi07 said:


> I think any mike should do the trick, just make sure you have 3.5 mm jack input.
> 
> Alpine Mic NVE-P1 IVA-W203 PMD-B200 TME-M740BT Bluetooth Microphone | eBay



Thank you very much for the link. Indeed it looks pretty similar to the mic that came with H800.


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## quickaudi07

Not a problem,


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## quickaudi07

After looking at the manual of the unit I came across this...









That means it will work on any 32 bit system.


Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk


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## Bartbx

On the subject of changing the mic, it doesn't do the trick when you replace the mic with another type, even if it looks the same. You can just order a second correct one with Alpine. Just use the servicedepartment of your local importer, they can supply the parts, the commercial department can't deliver.


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## acidbass303

Bartbx said:


> On the subject of changing the mic, it doesn't do the trick when you replace the mic with another type, even if it looks the same. You can just order a second correct one with Alpine. Just use the servicedepartment of your local importer, they can supply the parts, the commercial department can't deliver.


Thanks for that, I have contacted local alpine dealer, lets see what happens.

Weird thing is going eversince I updated my H800 yesterday. On starting the car, the H800 simply refuses to turn on. I have the rux connected as well as the Ai-net from w910. The HU turns on but the processor and consequently the amps dont turn on. The w910 menus behave as there is no processor connected. Eventually i have to turn off the acc and restart multiple times and randomly it turns on. And when turned on, works normally. It is pretty annoying. I have tried resetting the unit many times but it just keeps on happening. It happened a very few times before the update but now it is like 4 out 5 restarts. Really looking forward to some tips/solutions to sort this out.


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## quality_sound

I don't think it's related to the update if it was doing it before. Mine NEVER does that.


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## quickaudi07

OH crap, it looks like some of us may have some serious issues with H800, I don't know if I should update my software or not...


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## quality_sound

If it works, I wouldn't. At least not until we find out if it's a software issue or not. By the same token, he had this issue before the update so don't jump right to "the H800s are flawed".


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## Thrill_House

quality_sound said:


> I don't think it's related to the update if it was doing it before. Mine NEVER does that.


Yeah, mine neither, it sounds like an isolated incident with that particular unit.


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## acidbass303

Yeah, may be my bad luck..oh well


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## Bartbx

Unfortunately it isn't an isolated problem. I've one customer who has the identical the same problem, the PXH800 isn't updated but has the same thing happening. One time out of maybe twenty it doesn't start up and you have to turn of the car and restart and then it works fine. We haven't figured out the reason for this yet, I'm thinking that the voltage drop causes the PXH800 to behave like this. Only one customer with a Hyundai suffers with this problem, never had it with one of the others. In the past we had some Clarion radio's that did curious things in certain cars, not working while engine was turning, working well with turned off engine. The same radio in another car no problem, other radio in the first car, not a problem. Reason folowing to Clarion, the circuits of some radio's couldn't handle the changing in voltage while the engine was running.... With the PXH800 I'm going to use a relay to switch the amp, maybe in certain cases we use to much current out of the PXH to turn on the amp and this causing the system to fail..... Problem will be found and solved, only they have to find out what happens....


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## acidbass303

Bartbx said:


> Unfortunately it isn't an isolated problem. I've one customer who has the identical the same problem, the PXH800 isn't updated but has the same thing happening. One time out of maybe twenty it doesn't start up and you have to turn of the car and restart and then it works fine. We haven't figured out the reason for this yet, I'm thinking that the voltage drop causes the PXH800 to behave like this. Only one customer with a Hyundai suffers with this problem, never had it with one of the others. In the past we had some Clarion radio's that did curious things in certain cars, not working while engine was turning, working well with turned off engine. The same radio in another car no problem, other radio in the first car, not a problem. Reason folowing to Clarion, the circuits of some radio's couldn't handle the changing in voltage while the engine was running.... With the PXH800 I'm going to use a relay to switch the amp, maybe in certain cases we use to much current out of the PXH to turn on the amp and this causing the system to fail..... Problem will be found and solved, only they have to find out what happens....


Wow, thats encouraging, not being the only one having the issue. I have installed a SPDT relay on the amp turn on wire from the H800. Plus the H800 gets its power from the stinger capacitor i have installed. So after reading your post, I will try to measure the average voltage from the battery, note the fluctuations in the voltage and may be even supply the h800 directly from the battery. I hope it gets resolved because otherwise the processor sounds awesome.


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## Bartbx

In the Hyundai the PXH800 gets its power directly from the battery on a distribution block and 1awg cable, so sufficient power there. But it's rare that it only happens from time to time, I've been trying to have this problem occur in my workshop so that we could measure some things but it only happens at moments you don't have any equipment by hand.... The Alpine technician couldn't think of a reason why this only happens once in a while..... In the meantime we can only think that it still is a computer and those things can behave strangly sometimes ..... Time will ive the answer.


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## acidbass303

Bartbx said:


> In the Hyundai the PXH800 gets its power directly from the battery on a distribution block and 1awg cable, so sufficient power there. But it's rare that it only happens from time to time, I've been trying to have this problem occur in my workshop so that we could measure some things but it only happens at moments you don't have any equipment by hand.... The Alpine technician couldn't think of a reason why this only happens once in a while..... In the meantime we can only think that it still is a computer and those things can behave strangly sometimes ..... Time will ive the answer.


Since it is happening quite frequently with my unit, can I measure or note something that might help you to figure out the problem?


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## mr sideways

without reading all the 63 pages what is the general view on the H800?
i am currently using the H701, so is it worth upgrading?


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## quickaudi07

I didn't installed mine yet, but it powers on without any problems for me, I'm using it at home just for testing before my installation.
I'm using 12v 3amp external power supply and it powers on everything i hit the power button.
On top of that, my HU unit has a remote out for the amps, and thats what I will use to power up PXA, HU has a delay point in while i start my car, I hope i wont have these kind of issues with mine... Have my finges crossed.

I guess good thing is, I have waited and got it from Authorized Dealer.


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## quality_sound

I think you'll be fine. Mine powers up from the remote turn on from the Ai-Net feed from the D800. Then the H800 turns the amps on. Main power is from the main distro block for the amps and is an 18 gauge. Nothing fancy at all.


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## Bartbx

I'm sure we'll find the reason sooner or later. Just hoping the install will do this trick at moment I'm capable of measuring some things. Thanks for the offer of measuring but I have several PXH800, only one is misbehaving with a client. I haven't tried swapping it with another unit. Problem could also be inside Ai-net not triggering the device. In general I'm quiet pleased with these PXH800 units, in the whole year we're selling them we haven't had one brakedown or other failure yet. Sound quality is very good and the price is correct. I threw out several 3sixties because of the stupid bluetooth problems and especially because of their noise level.


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## acidbass303

Perhaps my H800 has had a change of heart, in the past 24 hours, not even a single power up issue


----------



## Z-Roc

will these work with cda 7990 model let me know


----------



## BrianG

Z-Roc said:


> will these work with cda 7990 model let me know


Z-Roc, the CDA-7990 is not on the list of compatible head units. You could use the PXA-H800, but I'm pretty sure you would have to use the RUX-C800 to control all the functions of the PXA-H800.


----------



## quality_sound

You'll have to use the RUX with ANY HU. NOTHING has full control of the H800, not even the D800 and t was designed from the ground up as the companion HU to the H800. 

Basically, as long as it's an Ai-Net HU, you're good to go. Just know you might lose something like sub control.


----------



## BrianG

quality_sound said:


> You'll have to use the RUX with ANY HU. NOTHING has full control of the H800, not even the D800 and t was designed from the ground up as the companion HU to the H800.
> 
> Basically, as long as it's an Ai-Net HU, you're good to go. Just know you might lose something like sub control.


Right. I didn't see the 7990 on any list for the PXA-H800, so I'm not sure how much/many of the features it would control.


----------



## divinetong

Hi all, I was wandering if this PXA-H800 will work on a Volvo S40 2006 model, with the MOST media system. my car is got an optic fiber wiring system. Thanks everyone for the great research and infos I have read on this forum.


----------



## quickaudi07

divinetong said:


> Hi all, I was wandering if this PXA-H800 will work on a Volvo S40 2006 model, with the MOST media system. my car is got an optic fiber wiring system. Thanks everyone for the great research and infos I have read on this forum.


You will need a RUX -C800 controller for this unit to work.


----------



## madmaxz

What happened to having close to full control over the h800 from the w910 that's why I got both... Well i got the w910 8 months ago but based that decision on being able to control the h800... Sucker..


----------



## quality_sound

Nope. Like I said, not even the D800 has control over it. All I can do is access the presets and the sub-level control. Everything else is through the RUX. You'd think with the multimedia units like the W910, or at least the D800, you'd have more control from the HU but alas, no.


----------



## divinetong

quickaudi07 said:


> You will need a RUX -C800 controller for this unit to work.


Cheers quickadi07, do you think there will a massive imprvement in the sound output? I ask this because I have the premium sound system with some Alpine speakers and sub woofer. Thank you.


----------



## Bollwerk

If you don't need to fiddle with the settings on a daily basis, you can opt for controlling the PXA-H800 with a laptop through the USB connection. 
You can do the initial setup or tweak it now and then without needing to buy the RUX-C800. 
Just need a laptop with 32-bit Windows, as has been mentioned previously.


----------



## 14642

Of course, I'm no expert on the alpine piece, but if it's a voltage problem that interupts the boot-up, you can trouble shoot that by using an alternate power source. try a back-up battery for +12V and GND and trigger the unit with the remote. You'll need to tie the ground of the battery to chassis ground. If that fixes it, then you'll know it a drop in voltage on +12V that causes the problem. If not, then try connceting the REM in terminal to the back up battery. 

So, it seems to me that one of two things may be happening--1) Quick drop in voltage on +12V causes a boot issue or, 2) quickly cycling the remote in line during boot up causes the problem. Since it's intermittent, I'd bet it's the 12V line.


----------



## claytonzmvox

I'm starting to get worried about the PXA H800, many complaining about bugs in the device. I think I'll buy a mosconi. rsrsrssrrsrs


----------



## quickaudi07

Just installed mine today and no problems at all, love that unit now its time for tuning! Can't wait

Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ET328

Has anyone tested if the latest firmware allows H800 to wake up via ACC-wire when H800 is in standalone mode without ai-net and RUX is disconnected?


----------



## n_olympios

claytonzmvox said:


> I'm starting to get worried about the PXA H800, many complaining about bugs in the device. I think I'll buy a mosconi. rsrsrssrrsrs


I don't think the Mosconi will be completely bug-free either. Let's hope it is, but I doubt it.


----------



## Ale555

It definitely is Not Bug-Free...


----------



## epatmd

Comparison of Bit one to PXE-h800:

Mobile Electronics AU | Articles | Alpine PXA-H800 vs Audison BitOne Processors Compared


----------



## bass mechanic

i have a question:

since the Pxa-h800 has 6 inputs on it. 
do you still retain the use of the balance/fade functions and can you still adjust the subwoofer volume from your head unit?
or does it simply sum all 3 left and right channels together making a pair of stereo inputs to the input stage?

i assume that you could still adjust the bass/ treble or eq at the head unit once everything is all set for ease of use.
obviously adjusting the eq at the processor would likely be a better way of doing that.

also has anyone confirmed if there will actually be a problem with the bluetooth if your head unit has bluetooth and issues with delay that has been added to the system causing echo for the phone conversation.
i know the MS-8 has addressed this issue with a signal wire that defeats the time delay when the phone is in use.
thanks!


----------



## quality_sound

You can configure it in many ways, but I'm pretty sure it will just sum the inputs. I'd have to look at the manual again to make sure. You can DL the manual on either the Australian or UK site, I forget which.


----------



## madmaxz

My h800 seems to work good. Haven't had any issues so far. I'm wondering why I can't get a normal amount of output to the front (3 way active) unless road eq is on. I seriously lose 50% of my output if I turn road eq off.


----------



## dtbrown

Anyone know if any new upcoming head units will be compatible with the pxa-h800 or will it just continue to be just the controller unit or the ina-w900 as the only option?


----------



## Bartbx

No there will be only the new CDA-137Bti( same as a CDA117Ri but with built in bluetooth), the known 910,iva-D800R and the 117 that will be compatibel, unfortunately none of the new cool doubledin machines will have optical out. Reason? No idea, but some do have a eq and some other cool features onboard. I hoped that the new 8 inch doublebeldin INE-W928R would have had optical out but for some reason they didn't include this, only reason I can think of is the cost, 98% of the people who buy these products do it because of the navigation and they will never use the more advanced features.....

I see it in my shop everyday,they want " some" sort of screen in the car , it is allowed to play radio, sometimes even Cd but it MUST HAVE Usb and some sort of MP3. Do you want optical output , sir ? What????? No I want to hook it up to my Oem speakers...they sound excellent, I paid *****euros on it, it's from Bose ......, the car salesman told me it's highend.:worried::surprised:
Ok, these things do all what you want. For the other 2% of customers we go to the ivaD800,CDA117, the 900 and in future the CDA137BTi or a combo with the RUX controller. These are just economical decissions made by companies, why built expensive state of the art devices if you can't sell enough of them to break even? That's the reason we don't see these high end stuff like F1, Sony system, Clarion or original ODR anymore. The markets have changed and the products follow the market.Look at Clarion, their highest model ( not their high-end unit) costs only 149 euro, they just don't sell, but they continue their course of cheap looking headunits. Price range from 69 euro up to 149 euro , divided by 4-5 models.


----------



## Bartbx

@Madmaxz , you have several options in controlling your volume first in multichannel mode you can adjust every sort of source ( DVD, Dolby Digital , MP3,....), than you have level control in your Xover settings, next you can look in the input setup and choose high and low input voltage. I'm sure you'll find the correct settig, there won't be volume loss if you configure everything right. The roadeq functions mainly increases volume based on ambient noise coming from the road, wheels , etc.... I'm a big Alpine fan but Roadeq and the Imprint just don't do it for me, for the rest wonderfull app with great soundquality achievable and easy to use.


----------



## dtbrown

I have the U.S version of the 117 and love it. I just wanted the 800
To have another integration optioms with a head unit. I wonder if the CDs-137bti will be available in the states? Thanks for reply. 



Bartbx said:


> No there will be only the new CDA-137Bti( same as a CDA117Ri but with built in bluetooth), the known 910,iva-D800R and the 117 that will be compatibel, unfortunately none of the new cool doubledin machines will have optical out. Reason? No idea, but some do have a eq and some other cool features onboard. I hoped that the new 8 inch doublebeldin INE-W928R would have had optical out but for some reason they didn't include this, only reason I can think of is the cost, 98% of the people who buy these products do it because of the navigation and they will never use the more advanced features.....
> 
> I see it in my shop everyday,they want " some" sort of screen in the car , it is allowed to play radio, sometimes even Cd but it MUST HAVE Usb and some sort of MP3. Do you want optical output , sir ? What????? No I want to hook it up to my Oem speakers...they sound excellent, I paid *****euros on it, it's from Bose ......, the car salesman told me it's highend.:worried::surprised:
> Ok, these things do all what you want. For the other 2% of customers we go to the ivaD800,CDA117, the 900 and in future the CDA137BTi or a combo with the RUX controller. These are just economical decissions made by companies, why built expensive state of the art devices if you can't sell enough of them to break even? That's the reason we don't see these high end stuff like F1, Sony system, Clarion or original ODR anymore. The markets have changed and the products follow the market.Look at Clarion, their highest model ( not their high-end unit) costs only 149 euro, they just don't sell, but they continue their course of cheap looking headunits. Price range from 69 euro up to 149 euro , divided by 4-5 models.


----------



## Bartbx

Don't know but if you have the 117, stick to it and add the PXH800 and the RUX controller, lots of fun and enjoyment guaranteed. If you want bluetooth you can add the KCE400BT and way to go.


----------



## quality_sound

Bartbx said:


> No there will be only the new CDA-137Bti( same as a CDA117Ri but with built in bluetooth), the known 910,iva-D800R and the 117 that will be compatibel, unfortunately none of the new cool doubledin machines will have optical out. Reason? No idea, but some do have a eq and some other cool features onboard. I hoped that the new 8 inch doublebeldin INE-W928R would have had optical out but for some reason they didn't include this, only reason I can think of is the cost, 98% of the people who buy these products do it because of the navigation and they will never use the more advanced features.....
> 
> I see it in my shop everyday,they want " some" sort of screen in the car , it is allowed to play radio, sometimes even Cd but it MUST HAVE Usb and some sort of MP3. Do you want optical output , sir ? What????? No I want to hook it up to my Oem speakers...they sound excellent, I paid *****euros on it, it's from Bose ......, the car salesman told me it's highend.:worried::surprised:
> Ok, these things do all what you want. For the other 2% of customers we go to the ivaD800,CDA117, the 900 and in future the CDA137BTi or a combo with the RUX controller. These are just economical decissions made by companies, why built expensive state of the art devices if you can't sell enough of them to break even? That's the reason we don't see these high end stuff like F1, Sony system, Clarion or original ODR anymore. The markets have changed and the products follow the market.Look at Clarion, their highest model ( not their high-end unit) costs only 149 euro, they just don't sell, but they continue their course of cheap looking headunits. Price range from 69 euro up to 149 euro , divided by 4-5 models.


So add an optical output. There is a thread here on how to do it.


----------



## Bartbx

Those new units are normally coming end of june-july. Let's wait and see, but adding an optical out could be a possibility. But than you still would have to use the RUX to control the system, the only thing you would have would be the bigger screen. There won't be any software inside the new unit that could control the PxH800. And would that be worth the trouble...? Not for me. Oh yes, the foreseen price would be around 1399 euro for the 8" unit.


----------



## n_olympios

Bartbx said:


> Those new units are normally coming end of june-july. Let's wait and see, but adding an optical out could be a possibility. But than you still would have to use the RUX to control the system, the only thing you would have would be the bigger screen.


You don't have to use the RUX for volume control, you can run the analog signal along with the digital one into the H800 and then you can use your HU's volume.

Edit: for total control, only the "tweakers" will need the RUX. For most "tune it once and leave it" users, a laptop will do just fine.


----------



## Bartbx

Yes and you can turn defeat on/off, balance/ fader and control subvolume and that's about it. I meant control over the rest of the PXH800....I asked t a guy from Alpine europe, why they didn't allow for example the W910 to control everything and his only answer was that there would be to much information on the screen..... Suggestions for updates from my point of view would be, make it possible to give a name to your presets, give some sort of bass/trebble adjustment and signal summing abilities for connection to oem-units.


----------



## quickaudi07

That's why I got a controller with my H800


----------



## claytonzmvox

I am having great difficulty with the PXA, I can not bring up the configuration of the mid front, because it appears to me only high `` front'' and `` low'' front and subwoofers. I setup the PC and the rux, but does not appear in the same way the mid front. what I did wrong?
I use 3 way + sub and is configured this way.

excuse the English, but that is what I do!!


----------



## n_olympios

http://www.alpine.uk.com/fileadmin/user_upload/manuals/car_audio_manuals/PXA-H800/OM_PXA-H800_EN.pdf

Page 13, speaker setup. You need to choose either System 2 or System 3, depending on your setup.


----------



## ELNA

For those of you who are wondering if there are any bluetooth issues i have bluetooth on my OEM HU and there seems to be no problem with voice delay :worried: at least that is what everybody i`ve talked to say

i have a pxa-h800 and updated firmware


----------



## quality_sound

Good point. I was running the 400BT module with my d800 and h800 and it sounded great. No echo or anything.


----------



## 1edgekilla

been off here for a while guys but read up as best i could... couple quick questions though just for verification... Cheapest place to get the Processor and Controller shipped? Best HU to integrate it with as far as being able to have volume control from HU as well as IPOD compatibility on HU?

ina hurry so hope this all made sense...


----------



## quickaudi07

1edgekilla said:


> been off here for a while guys but read up as best i could... couple quick questions though just for verification... Cheapest place to get the Processor and Controller shipped? Best HU to integrate it with as far as being able to have volume control from HU as well as IPOD compatibility on HU?
> 
> ina hurry so hope this all made sense...


Search results for: 'h800'

This is where i got mine from, I have Kenwood DNX9990HD HU connected to the processor and it sounds great!.

I also have C800 Controller with it, very nice peace!.

Also I'm sure there is ton of Alpine Dealers on here, just contact them and they should hook you up with a better price. I got mine ordered when it was X-Mas time with 20% off... I spend 750$ for complete kit combo.


----------



## Bollwerk

Learned something very disturbing from the Alpine Facebook page.
Alpine is dropping optical/digital output from all head units for 2012.
I looked around at other company's head units and I couldn't find a single new/current model with optical output.

Anyone else run into this, or care?

Personally, optical output from a DVD head unit is a big deal, since I have quite a few concert DVDs that I like listening to in 5.1.
But I imagine I'm in a very small group on this.

Nevertheless, it seems odd that the PXA-H800 has optical (and AI-Net) inputs, when Alpine is dropping both in all of the new head units.


----------



## Thrill_House

Bollwerk said:


> Learned something very disturbing from the Alpine Facebook page.
> Alpine is dropping optical/digital output from all head units for 2012.
> I looked around at other company's head units and I couldn't find a single new/current model with optical output.
> 
> Anyone else run into this, or care?
> 
> Personally, optical output from a DVD head unit is a big deal, since I have quite a few concert DVDs that I like listening to in 5.1.
> But I imagine I'm in a very small group on this.
> 
> Nevertheless, it seems odd that the PXA-H800 has optical (and AI-Net) inputs, when Alpine is dropping both in all of the new head units.


Old news man sorry to say, thats Alpine for you.


----------



## bass mechanic

i have a question for the experts..

so i have a 2012 corvette Z06 i plan to install the PXAh800 into
the layout will use only factory speaker locations
i will be using rear stereo, subwoofer and the center channel outputs
that leaves a high and low output for the front speakers.

if you haven't seen a modern day corvette the front layout is like this
2 tweeters on the dash pointing off the bottom of the W/S
2 3" midrage speakers at the top of the doors 
2 10" woofers at the bottom of the door (these replaced with a pair of JL zr800 8" component drivers)

now for the question.
since i only have 2 channels per side to play with giving me 4 total channels up front (not counting center)
using a 4 channel amp
i will use 2 channels for the low obviously the 8" in the door
i could use the other 2 channels for high pass output to run either a 3.5" midrange and run the tweeter with a passive xover for the tweets on the dash,

or run a 6 channel amp bridging the input of 2 channels per side using the amps electronic xover for the tweet and 3.5 midrange.

or scrap the dash tweets all together and run a 2 way 3.5" coaxial in the top of the door.

here is my dilemma, i want to be able to time align the system with the processor but if i tie the mid and tweet to the same channel ill loose the ability to align between the 2 separate speakers.
if i make the mid/tweet coaxial i end up moving my sound stage further back and would prefer to keep the highs up on the dash where they were originally, since ill be using a center i feel like having the tweets on the dash will work best.

someone told me that the PXA-h800 could actually align the tweet and mid accurately even though they are located in different positions and connected to the same channel.
if thats not true will it align to a compromise between the 2 locations?

i hate to give up the tweets because i know having them together in the same location will solve the time alignment issue, but i am OCD about using a speaker (tweet) location on the dash that the manufacturer left for me.
i can't bring myself to have an empty tweeter location on the dash not in use.

what would some of you do?


----------



## quality_sound

I'd run the tweeter and mid passive off the same channels. Though, I think you can run a 3-way front, center, and single sub. My car is on a boat so I can't confirm this.


----------



## bass mechanic

quality_sound said:


> I'd run the tweeter and mid passive off the same channels. Though, I think you can run a 3-way front, center, and single sub. My car is on a boat so I can't confirm this.


nope you cannot run 3 way with a center and i also do not want to give up the rear speakers.
i had considered running 3 way up front then the rears and running the subs off the HU sub out but then i loose surround and i don't know how the DTA will work out in this configuration


----------



## Bollwerk

Anyone aware of any 2012 double DIN DVD head units from any company with digital output?
I can't find one.
Looks like I might be stuck buying a 910 if I can't find one.


----------



## quickaudi07

Bollwerk said:


> Anyone aware of any 2012 double DIN DVD head units from any company with digital output?
> I can't find one.
> Looks like I might be stuck buying a 910 if I can't find one.


Not that i could think of, I know Alpine w910, was the latest model with optical output...

I know Kenwood has never made one, that i know of.


----------



## BigRed

U can run 3 way with a center as long as u run mono sub. All day long


----------



## madfonzy

Bollwerk said:


> Anyone aware of any 2012 double DIN DVD head units from any company with digital output?
> I can't find one.
> Looks like I might be stuck buying a 910 if I can't find one.


Pioneer do, I have AVH-4350. It's a coaxial digital output though so you will need digital coaxial to optical convertor. It works a treat!

I have the RCA also plugged into my PXA-H800. When I switch between digital and AUX I honestly cannot tell the difference.


----------



## claytonzmvox

now everything is fine, but a doubt still remains. when I enter the front mid speaker setup is not accessible. why? use a set of active 3-way plus subwoofer and why this happens?. I upgraded and everything sounds perfect, except this hurdle configuration. sorry bad english again.


----------



## quickaudi07

madfonzy said:


> Pioneer do, I have AVH-4350. It's a coaxial digital output though so you will need digital coaxial to optical convertor. It works a treat!
> 
> I have the RCA also plugged into my PXA-H800. When I switch between digital and AUX I honestly cannot tell the difference.


When I first got my PXA H800, i got it plugged in to my computer so i could play around with the software and see how it works. Well long story make it short, i have not notice anything in sound quality, it seemed the same to me.


----------



## quality_sound

claytonzmvox said:


> now everything is fine, but a doubt still remains. when I enter the front mid speaker setup is not accessible. why? use a set of active 3-way plus subwoofer and why this happens?. I upgraded and everything sounds perfect, except this hurdle configuration. sorry bad english again.


During the initial setup of the 3-way, because it's a 3-way the mid is, by default, always on. You have the option for the "tweeter" channels to be full-range or tweeter channel (this just sets the crossover initially so you don't damage them on accident) and to turn the "midbass" channels on and off. What I did was run the "mid channels" to the midbasses and vice versa. Now I have one preset for a 2-way front (the "midbass channels are off so the mids that are connected to those outputs, do not play) or a 3-way front with the mids turned on.


----------



## Bollwerk

madfonzy said:


> Pioneer do, I have AVH-4350. It's a coaxial digital output though so you will need digital coaxial to optical convertor. It works a treat!
> 
> I have the RCA also plugged into my PXA-H800. When I switch between digital and AUX I honestly cannot tell the difference.


Unfortunately, that unit is not sold in the US. =(


----------



## kartunesauto

Finally have the Porsche done, z110, pxa-h800, two Alpine PDX V9's and a F4.
SPX-z18t in dash doors, spx 4" in back 13w5 in back 6w3 in front sub box.
Had to use an RTA to set and eq each channel, the imprint doesn't like the front woofer /rear sub setup so it has to be set manually to get it right. All active no passives, Sounds amazing. I highly recommend this processor. The software could use an rta function with the ability to overlay the eq manually. Used the new V9"s on left and one for the right, as they have a band pass setting for the tweeter /mids.F4 bridged to midbass 2672 watts. Now all I need is a new headunit with optic out, Alpine needs to build at least one new unit with optic output, till then I'll keep the Pioneer.


----------



## acidbass303

kartunesauto said:


> Finally have the Porsche done, z110, pxa-h800, two Alpine PDX V9's and a F4.
> SPX-z18t in dash doors, spx 4" in back 13w5 in back 6w3 in front sub box.
> Had to use an RTA to set and eq each channel, the imprint doesn't like the front woofer /rear sub setup so it has to be set manually to get it right. All active no passives, Sounds amazing. I highly recommend this processor. The software could use an rta function with the ability to overlay the eq manually. Used the new V9"s on left and one for the right, as they have a band pass setting for the tweeter /mids.F4 bridged to midbass 2672 watts. Now all I need is a new headunit with optic out, Alpine needs to build at least one new unit with optic output, till then I'll keep the Pioneer.


Alpine INA-w910? It has optical output.


----------



## Reginaldocm

This segunga and Tuesday was held the 1st stage of EMMA in Brazil, the car champion in category 7 channels master used all IVA D800C PXA H800 + connection via optical fiber and Ai-NET

I managed a 3rd place in the category up to 11,000 real


----------



## kartunesauto

acidbass303 said:


> Alpine INA-w910? It has optical output.


Since I own a shop, prefer to have a unit that I can sell to a customer to do this.


----------



## kartunesauto

Reginaldocm said:


> This segunga and Tuesday was held the 1st stage of EMMA in Brazil, the car champion in category 7 channels master used all IVA D800C PXA H800 + connection via optical fiber and Ai-NET
> 
> I managed a 3rd place in the category up to 11,000 real




Alpine needs to sell a unit with optic out in the USA.
Seems they took two steps forward and one step back on the sound quality priority. Still playing with the Euphony, kinda liking it.


----------



## quickaudi07

kartunesauto said:


> Since I own a shop, prefer to have a unit that I can sell to a customer to do this.


I'm sure as many others, not all shops have high end stuff, there few shops near my house and none of them knew what is active setup. Go figure !

On the other hand there are people that will spend the money to have the best SQ sound system, and some just want regular boom boom to keep them happy.

I have spend ton of money on my sound system and i'm not even done yet. I cant just imagine a shop doing everything for me, It would cost me more than my Audi is worth.

What I'm trying to say by that, yes i agree with you all optical would be nice to have on not only Alpine head units but Kenwood or other brands. It looks like some people wish they could afford a system that i have in my car, but its so expensive that they will go with lower end stuff to keep them happy.

High end system is not for everyone, there are people that wish they could have it, and some wish they never spend that kind of money. To me this is a hobby that I truly love and enjoy..... This is my first SQ build and I love it.. 

ON the other hand, I took my pc and hooked it up in the car with optical out to PXA H800, and didn't really notice any difference in sound quality, unless i'm missing something.


----------



## bass mechanic

reguarding digital optical, would i be correct to assume that if you hooked a portable DVD player to the processor you could have full 5.1 DTS?
i assume you have to use the built in volume control to adjust volume?


----------



## claytonzmvox

honestly I'm really enjoying the PXA, do not have much intimacy with the time alignment of the alpine, but I'm trying. regulei all for auto tcr and still can not set the stage the way I want. I put the prints on the PXA.


----------



## eviling

does cruchfield really have this unit in stock?


----------



## quickaudi07

eviling said:


> does cruchfield really have this unit in stock?


Call them!


----------



## quickaudi07

claytonzmvox said:


> honestly I'm really enjoying the PXA, do not have much intimacy with the time alignment of the alpine, but I'm trying. regulei all for auto tcr and still can not set the stage the way I want. I put the prints on the PXA.


Same here, I really like my unit, no problem like others have stated. 
Everything works like it should. I just got another amp for front stage active setup, cant wait to hook everything up and see how it sounds


----------



## BrianG

eviling said:


> does cruchfield really have this unit in stock?


Yes, Crutchfield was out of stock on them for a while, but they have had them since April 17th.


----------



## eviling

BrianG said:


> Yes, Crutchfield was out of stock on them for a while, but they have had them since April 17th.


oh...i didnt even know they "officialy" hit the shelf  i just got tired of checking up on these damn processors. not to mention when you have no money to spend. you genralyd ont look for ways to spend it haha


----------



## BrianG

I kept an eye out, too. I looked on Alpine's USA sight and made a note of authorized dealers. Several weeks ago, I looked on Audio Jam's website and they said that they were in stock. I ordered up the PXA-H800, the RUX controller, and the optical cable. When I pressed the order button, I got an error. I reloaded the site and the items were still in my cart.....so I tried to order again.....same thing. I gave up. The next morning, I looked at my credit card online, and there were two pending payments. I immediately got in ouch with them. They guy that I talked to did some checking and said that they did not have the item in stock and that was what caused the error.

He took the pending payments off my credit card and said they would call me when they got them in stock. He talked to Alpine and did not know when they would be available. Soon after, I saw that Crutchfield was out of stock but had a tentative ship date o Apr 18. I kept looking on their site and when I got home from work on the 17th, they showed they had them in stock. I ordered my three items from them and they shipped them right out. I was very pleased.

The guy at Audio Jam had no idea of what I was talking about. 

Now I just have to get the time to hook the thing up. I've already fired it up and programmed it from a PC. I've been working out of town, but I should have time and decent weather tomorrow morning. I have to use my old laptop for progrmming because of the software only working on 32 bit systems. Oh well....


----------



## BrianG

I got the PXA-H800 hooked up this morning and then took a drive to check it out.

The H800 is replacing my H701. I have the INA -W910 for a head unit. I'm using a PDX-4.150 for the fronts and rears. I'm using a PDX-1.1000 for the subs.

Before swapping out the processors, I copied down all of my settings from the H701 and programmed them into the H800. When I got the H800, I hooked it up in the house and programmed it with a laptop. But I guess the unit sat too long and it lost its presets. So after programming everything, I went for a little spin around town. 

From my short time listening to the thing, here are my first impressions: The bass seems a lot louder than the H701.....and the fronts and rears seem less loud. Not a lot less, but noticeably less. I think I am going to have to go back and set my gains again. I will take a look at the sine wave and voltage with the gains as is with the 800 in the 701's place. 

With the 701, I was getting 25 volts from the 4.150, playing 1000Hz. I was getting 75 volts from the 1.1000, playing 50Hz. If my ears are not lying to me, I think that I will see some clipping on the 1.1000 and am going to see a bit less than the 25 volts on the 4.150.

I listened to some familiar music and the thing sounds great. FWIW it has the 1.100 version firmware. When I listened to any bass heavy songs, I had to turn the sub level down to zero. Th sound quality is definitely there. I am going to have to do a bit of tweaking after I get the amp gains set again. 

But so far, I am pleased with the sound and the unit. I did not have time to mess with the Imprint tuning or the RoadEQ. I will do this sometime in the upcoming week. Someone brought up the idea of buying an extra microphone for Imprint while keeping the other one mounted for RoadEQ. That sounds like a solid idea. The microphone looks like the one that came with the INA-W910. This week I will dig the microphone from the 800 out of the box and compare it to the BT microphone on the INA-W910. 

I am also curious about the Euphony thing, too. The manual isn't very specific about it and I couldn't find a lot about it on the web. Everything I've found basically says it makes music sound “better” or “more natural”....stuff like that. I'm a pretty skeptical person, but I'm willing to check it out. I just wish I completely understood the Euphony controls on the Sound Manager.

Also this week, I will pull my truck into the shop after work and check for noise from the unit. We have a large building I can pull my truck into so it will be quiet. I should also try out the Imprint then, too.

I'll try to post back later in the week, after I spend some more time with the unit.


----------



## Limster

Is there any other way to get bass without hooking up a sub after performing Imprint? Also theoretically to prevent colouring the pure sound, all MX expander and roadEQ should be turn off?


----------



## Bollwerk

acidbass303 said:


> Alpine INA-w910? It has optical output.


Crutchfield support told me that the INA-W910 has been discontinued by Alpine, presumably due to impending shipments of the new 2012 units, which all supposedly lack any kind of optical/digital output (according to Alpine rep on Facebook).


----------



## BrianG

I did some gain setting on my amplifiers.

To mu surprise, the sub amp was not clipping. I now have a lot more bass than I did with the 701. That makes me wonder if I had something set incorrectly with the 701. I now have to cut the bass way back. Handy presets makes that easy. I turned up the gains on the front stage and everything sounds great. I left the rears where they were. I turn those down anyways.

I did some listening and the thing is dead quiet with a zero bit track. I could only hear the fan on the back of my head unit. I was pretty pleased about that. I know that the 800 had some noise issues before the US release. 

The microphone is similar to the other Alpine BT microphone I have. I looked around online for a replacement mic for the 800 but I haven't found one yet. The 800 mic seems to be more omnidirectional than the BT mic. 
I haven't gotten time to do the Imprint tuning or play with the RoadEQ yet. I hope I can get to that after work or maybe this weekend.

Alpine says that the Imprint has been totally reworked from the previous Audyssey versions. There were some things that I liked with Audyssey and there were some things that I did not like. 

What have you guys found with the new Imprint setup? And have you guys used the custom curve editor for the Imprint, and how did you go about setting it up or arrive at your target custom curve?

I will post more later, after I've run the Imprint and have fiddled with it for a while.


----------



## Blackbutter

2 questions For the people who already have it!

1 What happen if connect de pxa h800 via toslink to a hu like 9861, when the owner manual says that you cannot connect ai net way... how fix it?

Are you able to move the volume, fader, balance only with a optic cable between this for for solve this, or you MUST have the rux-800 

2 Is possible to read and move ipod on the h.u. and then send this signal for optical way?


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

Blackbutter said:


> 2 questions For the people who already have it!
> 
> 1 What happen if connect de pxa h800 via toslink to a hu like 9861, when the owner manual says that you cannot connect ai net way... how fix it?
> 
> Are you able to move the volume, fader, balance only with a optic cable between this for for solve this, or you MUST have the rux-800
> 
> 2 Is possible to read and move ipod on the h.u. and then send this signal for optical way?


you can definitely connect both ainet and optical. my setup is slightly different in that I have ainet from my 9887 to H800 but then have my CHA-S624 changer connected to H800 via optical. 
so simple answer connect both

not sure about your 2nd question sorry, I dont have an ipod


----------



## therover1991

im thinking about getting the pxah800. I have the cda117 right now with the ai-net. Would it be better to hook it up like this to have control of the pxa from the headunit, or should I just run the rca cables and get the rux as well?


----------



## quality_sound

Without the C800 you will have no control of the H800. I have the D800 which was designed from the outset for be the HU of choice for the H800 and you need the C800 for that as well.

I know this is the second or third time I've said this in this thread. I understand it's 66 pages but these redundant questions are getting out of hand.


----------



## hilander999

quality_sound said:


> Without the C800 you will have no control of the H800. I have the D800 which was designed from the outset for be the HU of choice for the H800 and you need the C800 for that as well.
> 
> I know this is the second or third time I've said this in this thread. I understand it's 66 pages but these redundant questions are getting out of hand.


Only 3 times in 66 pages is outstanding. 

I would have expected it to be much higher.


----------



## quality_sound

And I KNOW it would be too much to expect people to RTFM...


----------



## evo9

Hey Paul,
Is there any lag when switching from any of the PXA-H800 6 presets via the D800? I finally got around to installing my D800. It is mated to the PXA-H701 at the moment. But has about 5 seconds or more lag when selecting the presets.


----------



## quality_sound

There is a little. I didn't think it was 5 seconds though. I won't see my car again until mid-June and I'll check then, but I remember it only being a couple of seconds and my presets change it from a 2-way to a 3-way.


----------



## evo9

Thanks! I have a H800 on the way.


----------



## quality_sound

Nice! I've really enjoyed mine. Once you get used to the C800 it's REALLY easy to make adjustments.


----------



## quickaudi07

Yes it is, but its even easier with a laptop , to bad they didn't make a Bluetooth compatible but oh well, you cant have everything !


----------



## acidbass303

quickaudi07 said:


> Yes it is, but its even easier with a laptop , to bad they didn't make a Bluetooth compatible but oh well, you cant have everything !


But the c800 lets you make adjustments on the fly, plus its a lot easier to manage than having to carry a laptop around (especially when the newer 64-bit OS laptops cant run the sound manager).


----------



## quality_sound

quickaudi07 said:


> Yes it is, but its even easier with a laptop , to bad they didn't make a Bluetooth compatible but oh well, you cant have everything !



Not when you're driving or away from home.  

BT would have been nice, as would a tuning APP. I mean if it can run on XP, it can run on a smartphone.


----------



## n_olympios

Blackbutter said:


> 2 Is possible to read and move ipod on the h.u. and then send this signal for optical way?


No, the iPod signal is transfered via analog AiNet only. Neither of the digital output Alpine HU's can extract the digital signal from the iPod anyway. Bummer eh?


----------



## someyoungguy

is the w910 compatible via ai-net, at least some of its basic functions ? planning for analog via ai-net and optical via kwe-610a.


----------



## acidbass303

someyoungguy said:


> is the w910 compatible via ai-net, at least some of its basic functions ? planning for analog via ai-net and optical via kwe-610a.


Indeed it is. You can control volume with your w910, change subwoofer level and select any of the 6 presets you save on H800. Thats about it.


----------



## bass mechanic

acidbass303 said:


> Indeed it is. You can control volume with your w910, change subwoofer level and select any of the 6 presets you save on H800. Thats about it.


when you say volume control are you saying that essentially your head unit volume (preout on AInet) is maxed or fixed and you end up controlling the output volume on the PXA-h800?

or are you still controlling the head units volume?

speaking of course using the volume buttons on the W910


----------



## acidbass303

bass mechanic said:


> when you say volume control are you saying that essentially your head unit volume (preout on AInet) is maxed or fixed and you end up controlling the output volume on the PXA-h800?
> 
> or are you still controlling the head units volume?
> 
> speaking of course using the volume buttons on the W910


When w910 is connected to the H800 via the Ai-Net cable, the volume controls on the w910 control the volume output of the h800. So they dont remain two separate controls, instead the w910 becomes the master controller of the volume output. If you run the sound manager software connected to the H800 and raise and lower the volume on the w910, you can see the volume output of the h800 changing accordingly.


----------



## bass mechanic

acidbass303 said:


> When w910 is connected to the H800 via the Ai-Net cable, the volume controls on the w910 control the volume output of the h800. So they dont remain two separate controls, instead the w910 becomes the master controller of the volume output. If you run the sound manager software connected to the H800 and raise and lower the volume on the w910, you can see the volume output of the h800 changing accordingly.


Very cool! too bad the W910 is such a POS as far as a navigation unit and from a GUI perspective.
now if the new 2012 units had AInet alpine would really have something special on their hands.


----------



## maxxx

Is there any smartphone (e.g. windows or android phone?) that can run the software to control this processor, similar to a laptop?


----------



## quickaudi07

Not that I know off, but if you do find something please post it here


----------



## 00flash00

holly ****, i updated h800 to version 1.100 and restore my preset setting but now is subwoofer rumbling horribly. OMG, in my iva-d800 have sub level 0. I must automatic calibration again? ****in update. no one else has problems after update to 1.100???????
thanks


----------



## quickaudi07

00flash00 said:


> holly ****, i updated h800 to version 1.100 and restore my preset setting but now is subwoofer rumbling horribly. OMG, in my iva-d800 have sub level 0. I must automatic calibration again? ****in update. no one else has problems after update to 1.100???????
> thanks


Look up in the thread, others have some issues and this i think it was already talked about. just go up few page and read up


----------



## 00flash00

i see forum back, but What is the solution? I found the option in rux-sound adjustment-x-over menu here switch to subwoofer(pressing chanel in rux) and up SUB dB to -11.0dB but it seems to me that it is no longer sound as good as before!!!!!

Any solution for this problem?


----------



## quickaudi07

do you have older version for frameware saved? can you roll back and put your old revision of back on.


----------



## David Z

Greetings. My PXA-H800/RUX-C800 combo should be arriving in the mail tomorrow. I've been reading up on it on the internets and been looking through the PDF manuals. I've got a couple questions that I didn't see asked/answered in these 67 pages:

1) My head unit puts out 4+ volts with a 1 kHz 0 dB test tone. Should I use the "High" (7V max) or "Low" (2V max) "AUX Gain" input levels on the H800? I would think it obvious to use the high setting, but I figured that might be intended for low impedance speaker level inputs instead of high impedance line level inputs or something.

2) I'll give the auto-tune a try, but the instructions don't seem to show what level to set the head unit or H800 volume to. Should I set the H/U to a "reasonable" volume or max unclipped volume? Does the H800 then automatically set itself to the proper volume for the auto tune or what?

Thanks


----------



## quickaudi07

There are few things that i really like about this unit,
First of, if your Hu unit clips at high volume, it will show you a worning sign on the controller.
Second, I haven't done auto tune yet, still in process of a build.
3rd, I use RCA from HU unit and put them in ch1 and ch2, and call it a day.

The rest is time for tuning


----------



## quality_sound

I have never seen a clipping indicator on the C800 but my D800 is connected with Ai-Net so I might never see it.


----------



## geogena

I had my H800 installed with W502E via Ainet, running 3 way full active and Volume, Sub level control and H800 presets in HU are working perfectly.


----------



## claytonzmvox

Blackbutter said:


> 2 questions For the people who already have it!
> 
> 1 What happen if connect de pxa h800 via toslink to a hu like 9861, when the owner manual says that you cannot connect ai net way... how fix it?
> 
> Are you able to move the volume, fader, balance only with a optic cable between this for for solve this, or you MUST have the rux-800
> 
> 2 Is possible to read and move ipod on the h.u. and then send this signal for optical way?


is possible to use the ipod via Ainet. use the kca420+ ivad310 + pxah800+ rux C800.the rux C800 does not interfere with anything and the iPod is usually controlled by the player!!


----------



## oca123

....


----------



## oca123

This might have been discussed before, but I searched and couldn't come up with anything.
I got a hold of a PXA-H800. I installed the software and hooked it up to my computer, poked around a bit, and briefly went through the manual.

I would like to install it in my car to see what it sounds like, but I noticed in the manual (and in the software) that it is limited to the following input schemes on its set of speaker-levle inputs:
- L&R and 2 stereo aux inputs OR
- FL, FR, RL, RR and 1 stereo aux input OR
- 5.1 input (FL C FR RL RR Sub)

The issue is that my factory system is an active 3-way already, so in order to get a full range stereo signal, I need to sum at least 6 channels. If I want to retain rear parking distance control, I would need to sum 8 (by adding the rear mids to the mix and setting the music fader to all front when playing the test CD)

-> I couldnt find any indication that the H800 would even support summing my front channels (front high, front mid, front low) so I can use the stock HU as a source (mainly for nav, phone etc.)

-> Regardless of the above, since the H800 only has 6 speaker level inputs and that I would need at least 8 to keep the parking distance tones, what would be a cheap and easy way to sum them before feeding them to the H800?

-> I believe (or maybe I was dreaming) that I read somewhere that you could have a digital source (say, my ipod via i20 dock into optical in) and control its volume using the stock HU volume control, where the H800 would detect the change of volume on the stock HU channel and apply it to the digital channel. This sounds impossible to me for various reasons, so can someone confirm?
Thinking back about it, the only way I can see this working is if the signal from the HU is an analog version of the digital signal, then the H800 could use the difference between both to compute the volume change?

-> The Alpine software works flawlessly using XP Mode under Windows 7 64 bits. Since XP Mode is basically a XP VM for MS Virtual PC I'm guessing it would work fine with Virtual PC if you had the patience to create a VM and install an OS on it, etc.


----------



## quality_sound

I'm trying it now but it looks like you have to have Premium or Ultimate and not Home. I lied and told Microsoft it was Premium and it passed the verification so we'll see.


----------



## quickaudi07

quality_sound said:


> I have never seen a clipping indicator on the C800 but my D800 is connected with Ai-Net so I might never see it.


I will take a fast video of it to show you, but make sure you have your speakers on the computer down! lol

There is a indication that will flash..... on the low left bottom corner


----------



## quality_sound

Werd


----------



## eviling

just talked to my local RF dealer and he said he's on thw aiting list him self for the .3, i don't think i'm gonna wait for it idk, how has the 800 turned out? were all the problems solved with the US relase were their never any problems. i haven't followed this unit in a long time so idk. my only quarum is the control unit but i shoudln't need it, with RCA inputs i can control volume via what ever it comes from right? in my case would be a computer. i just wanna make sure i'm in the clear ^_^ and i only need a right and left feed correct?


----------



## oca123

OK, so I installed the H800 in my car. I left the OEM side disconnected for now as I still don't know how to connect it to the H800 (there are a minimum of 6 channels to reconstruct a full range stereo signal coming out of my stock amplifier)

Now this might piss off some people - but what the heck.
2 days ago, I had a CarPC. Not a cheapass car PC made out of spare parts either. This was a "black box" type computer, with firewire, a studio sound card that is able to handle 10x10 at 24/96 and yes, that is 10 analog outputs.
I even forked over the $700-ish to get an 8'inch transflective touch screen which I mounted in the trunk (used it here and there for minor tuning, but mainly had it displaying FFT visualizations etc)

I initially started with FIR filters for crossovers. I implemented delays, eq'ed each driver independently, then the system as a whole, using VST plugins in Plogue. I even got some 24/96 recordings.
I could never get the system to sound right. It got so bad that I got into digital room correction, thinking that I could fix the impulse response the same way someone would do it in, say, their living room.
The thing is, the impulse response in a car is dominated by early reflections and it is very hard with the current paid and free DRC tools available to us to make sense of that and perform any meaningful correction in the time domain.
I had professionals chime in and tune it. Eventually, it started to sound OK.

So there I am, driving around with thousands of dollars worth of a clunky computer processing sound with massive lag, a 20 second boot time, and I find myself not enjoying the music.

Now, I've heard the Alpine Imprint stuff before. Why they called whatever the H800 is doing ImprintEQ is beyond me, because it sounds nothing like any previous of ImprintEQ.
In 5 minutes, my car as good or even better than it ever did while I had a carputer in there. It's also nice not to have to use a bluetooth keyboard with keys mapped to MIDI events to control the volume. It's nice that the preouts are at 4V.

Anyway - props to Alpine, the H800 sounds great, the noise floor is great, and it's definitely not the headache a carputer is.

Now if only I could figure out how to interface my OEM system with the H800.... If someone could chime in and help, I would appreciate it. The OEM system is the Bentley 12-speaker premium system (not the NAIM one) which has 3-way active in front doors, and 3-way active in backseat. Do I need to sum the signal into an RCA pair before I send it to the H800?


----------



## oca123

quality_sound said:


> I'm trying it now but it looks like you have to have Premium or Ultimate and not Home. I lied and told Microsoft it was Premium and it passed the verification so we'll see.


I installed it on my tabletPC (Samsung Series 7 Slate) and it has W7 64 Professional.
You basically start XP Mode, put the Alpine CD in and install the software.
To connect to the processor, click USB at the top, and attach the "Unknown Device" and start the Sound Manager software.
I'm pretty sure there's a way to automate this so you can launch the H800 software from the W64 desktop and it starts XP mode, attaches the devices and launches Sound Manager.


----------



## timmay77

I read every post in this thread..... WOW.....

Just picked up an H800 as a gift from some very close friends.

I am currently running the W910 with an H701. 

3 way active front, sub, and my rear speakers on the center channel with the time delay set all the way up. Can I basically do the exact same thing with the H800? I know you can run 3 way with sub, but I would like to retain my rears.....


----------



## quality_sound

oca123 said:


> I installed it on my tabletPC (Samsung Series 7 Slate) and it has W7 64 Professional.
> You basically start XP Mode, put the Alpine CD in and install the software.
> To connect to the processor, click USB at the top, and attach the "Unknown Device" and start the Sound Manager software.
> I'm pretty sure there's a way to automate this so you can launch the H800 software from the W64 desktop and it starts XP mode, attaches the devices and launches Sound Manager.


I had to upgrade from Home Premium so I could use the XP emulator but it wasn't too expensive. My household goods finally got here from Germany so I can install the software and see how it works on something that's NOT 11 years old. lol
Now I just need my car and I can start playing with it again.


----------



## oca123

timmay77 said:


> I read every post in this thread..... WOW.....
> 
> Just picked up an H800 as a gift from some very close friends.
> 
> I am currently running the W910 with an H701.
> 
> 3 way active front, sub, and my rear speakers on the center channel with the time delay set all the way up. Can I basically do the exact same thing with the H800? I know you can run 3 way with sub, but I would like to retain my rears.....


Yeah, you can, though the maximum delay in the H800 is 20ms I believe. Add that to the delay given to the speaker closest to you, if you set things up that way.

I respectfully would like to point out that the signal going to the center channel is not the kind that you want for rear fill. I say this because I used to use the center channel signal for rear fill (sum of L+R) until one day I tried to use the proper L-R signal.


----------



## oca123

quality_sound said:


> I had to upgrade from Home Premium so I could use the XP emulator but it wasn't too expensive. My household goods finally got here from Germany so I can install the software and see how it works on something that's NOT 11 years old. lol
> Now I just need my car and I can start playing with it again.


Yeah, the car would be nice.

I just did the move from Europe as well. The shipping agent I used was also specialized in military relocation. Long story short - they broke a french antique mirror valued at $7000+ and lost a box that contained a broken MS8, a few amps, two MS8 binaureal microphones, and a lot of little connectors and cables and stuff I use for my car audio hobby. It's been almost a year, but every weekend, I find myself looking for something that I know was in that box. Fortunately, the mirror was properly insured, but I put the box value at $10 like an idiot. Oh well.


----------



## timmay77

oca123 said:


> Yeah, you can, though the maximum delay in the H800 is 20ms I believe. Add that to the delay given to the speaker closest to you, if you set things up that way.
> 
> I respectfully would like to point out that the signal going to the center channel is not the kind that you want for rear fill. I say this because I used to use the center channel signal for rear fill (sum of L+R) until one day I tried to use the proper L-R signal.


I completely agree, but I am running a Hybrid Audio L831 front stage. I just don't have enough channels.

1 & 2 - L1 tweets
3 & 4 - L3 mids
5 & 6 - L8 mid bass
7 - (mono) sub
8 - Center for..... Rears.....?

I am sincerely open to any better suggestions......


----------



## oca123

Actually, I take that back, I am looking at the sound manager now and I don't see the option to do 3-way front with sub and center channel.

You can do 3-way front with rears and no sub, or 2-way front with rears and sub and center channel.

Basically there is no option to do a mono rear (I think sometimes it's called Surround Back) so you need 2 channels for rear and 6 channels for front = 8 channels.

Your only option would be external crossovers to make it a 2-way front. You could otherwise derive rear using a mini-dsp, and bridge fronts for center (google bridged stereo center channel) but thats a PITA.


Also for those using Virtual PC/XP Mode: BE VERY CAREFUL if you try to UPDATE THE FIRMWARE. The H800 will disconnect/reconnect several times during the update process. You will need to keep a close eye on things and make sure you click USB/Attach Unknown Device when it disconnects, as Virtual PC will not connect it automatically. Mind the little caption on the right that says "Release" - if it says "Release" do not click.

That may also hold true for VMWare, though I'm not sure b/c I haven't tried.



timmay77 said:


> I completely agree, but I am running a Hybrid Audio L831 front stage. I just don't have enough channels.
> 
> 1 & 2 - L1 tweets
> 3 & 4 - L3 mids
> 5 & 6 - L8 mid bass
> 7 - (mono) sub
> 8 - Center for..... Rears.....?
> 
> I am sincerely open to any better suggestions......


----------



## subwoofery

timmay77 said:


> I completely agree, but I am running a Hybrid Audio L831 front stage. I just don't have enough channels.
> 
> 1 & 2 - L1 tweets
> 3 & 4 - L3 mids
> 5 & 6 - L8 mid bass
> 7 - (mono) sub
> 8 - Center for..... Rears.....?
> 
> I am sincerely open to any better suggestions......


If you have the space, install the H800 for 3-way front + sub and use the H701 for your rears  

Kelvin


----------



## quality_sound

oca123 said:


> Yeah, the car would be nice.
> 
> I just did the move from Europe as well. The shipping agent I used was also specialized in military relocation. Long story short - they broke a french antique mirror valued at $7000+ and lost a box that contained a broken MS8, a few amps, two MS8 binaureal microphones, and a lot of little connectors and cables and stuff I use for my car audio hobby. It's been almost a year, but every weekend, I find myself looking for something that I know was in that box. Fortunately, the mirror was properly insured, but I put the box value at $10 like an idiot. Oh well.


Yeah, I can't complain. The Germans really packed everything well for the most part. Only casualty was my flying millenium flacon and some detailing supplies that were still damp and my wheel detailing brushes got moldy.  I cleaned them up but I'll order new stuff. All my electronics came though fine, probably because I boxed them in their original boxes ahead of time, and nothing is missing.

I'm hoping to pick my car up Monday, Tuesday at the latest and get the D800 back in.


----------



## timmay77

subwoofery said:


> If you have the space, install the H800 for 3-way front + sub and use the H701 for your rears
> 
> Kelvin


LOL. The H701+RUX is getting moved to my 2001 525iT (Touring), the winter beater.


----------



## KenB129

Does the PXA-H800 have to be programmed with the software to work? My new HU works fine but when the processor is inline there is no sound. My installer doesn't have a 32 bit PC to install software to try it and just last night I upgraded mine to Win 7 64 bit Home Premium.

I read this whole thread quite a while back but don't remember... can I use compatibility mode to get the Alpine software to run on a 64 bit pc?


----------



## quality_sound

The software is to control the H800 from a computer. The firmware is loaded on the H800 when you get it. 

Compatibility mode on home premium won't work, you have to upgrade. I did it through Amazon. $77 and you're good to go. Then you DL Windows XP Mode from Microsoft (free) and you're good to go. 

If you're not getting sound make sure the mode switch on the HU was flipped to eq/div and if you're running optical, that the cable isn't kinked or broken.


----------



## oca123

I know that there is at least one or two torrents that are for a VMware Player image of Windows XP, ready to go... just download and start. I downloaded one a while back to use some Amiga/Atari emulators to play some old games. Worked great.



> Yeah, I can't complain. The Germans really packed everything well for the most part. Only casualty was my flying millenium flacon and some detailing supplies that were still damp and my wheel detailing brushes got moldy. I cleaned them up but I'll order new stuff. All my electronics came though fine, probably because I boxed them in their original boxes ahead of time, and nothing is missing.


You are a bit more organized than I am. We packed up most stuff, but then on the day the movers came, we were not ready, so they packed up the rest for us. I have to admit these f.ckers were fast. In a day, they had packed up half of a 6000sq ft manor, inventoried and loaded up on a truck.
On the flipside, strikes at the Marseilles harbor in France caused our shipment to take 4 months to get to us. 


I noticed that if doing a 3-way front, the ImprintEQ auto-tune seems to pick the average time delay between the drivers on each side and applies it to all three. So for example, if your tweeter has a delay of 18ms, your mid 17ms, and midbass 14ms, when auto-eq is done, the time correction will be 16.3ms for all three. Kinda sucks.

Does anyone know why the "Before" and "After" freq response graphs show nothing below 100Hz?


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> The software is to control the H800 from a computer. The firmware is loaded on the H800 when you get it.
> 
> Compatibility mode on home premium won't work, you have to upgrade. I did it through Amazon. $77 and you're good to go. Then you DL Windows XP Mode from Microsoft (free) and you're good to go.
> 
> If you're not getting sound make sure the mode switch on the HU was flipped to eq/div and if you're running optical, that the cable isn't kinked or broken.


The installer said the switch was flipped and the cable should be fine. Alpine told him it should work out of the box, but to program it anyway. I'm out of town and will have to wait a bit to try it out.


----------



## funky77

I'll change my H701 to H800 at the weekend. I hope for improvement in sound quality.


----------



## Bartbx

@ Ken, you don't have to program the H800 but you MUST define your speaker layout-setup. This is meant as a protectionsystem for tweeters in all active systems. After you confirm your tweeters are protected by selecting one of the active setup's or that there is a passive filter installed the sound will turn on. When using a W910 and an optical cable you must activate the optical out in the menu of the W910.


----------



## KenB129

Bartbx said:


> @ Ken, you don't have to program the H800 but you MUST define your speaker layout-setup. This is meant as a protectionsystem for tweeters in all active systems. After you confirm your tweeters are protected by selecting one of the active setup's or that there is a passive filter installed the sound will turn on. When using a W910 and an optical cable you must activate the optical out in the menu of the W910.


You'd think Alpine would have told this to the installer... Not that it would matter since he didn't have a pc to install the software, but at least I wouldn't be wondering if I had to return it. Thanks.


----------



## Shinju

I know you can use the RUX-c700 with the h701 but can you use the RUX-c701 with the h800?

The RUX-c800 is kinda fuggly imo. I am going to be switching from a 701 to a 800 to eliminate zipper noise from the AI-net voltage step up from the source unit.


----------



## quality_sound

KenB129 said:


> You'd think Alpine would have told this to the installer... Not that it would matter since he didn't have a pc to install the software, but at least I wouldn't be wondering if I had to return it. Thanks.


It's all in the manual. Alpine can't tell every installer every detail of every product they make, particularly one that isn't on sale in a given country. Your installed should have just RTFM.


----------



## oca123

quality_sound said:


> It's all in the manual. Alpine can't tell every installer every detail of every product they make, particularly one that isn't on sale in a given country. Your installed should have just RTFM.


:laugh: yuuuup


Can some of you guys post screenshots of the freq. and impulse response before/after graphs when you use the automatic measurement function?
I'm going to run a full 6 position calibration tonight or tomorrow. 
Would any of you be interested if I also took measurements and posted them here? I am thinking freq. response, impulse response (front+sub only, no rears) and maybe RT60?

The reason for this is, I have run the automatic calibration a few times, and I'm pretty sure what it's doing is have the computer generate FIR filters by taking the difference between the measured frequency response and the target curve, time aligning the speakers (though it looks like it's doing a poor job at that) and also adding some time-domain correction. 
I think possibly all of the time-domain correction (t/a, impulse response filtering) is based off the 1st measurement, and the freq. response is based off of the average of all 6 measurements, with measurements in the "sweet spot" being given more weight.

However I suspect Alpine is being very conservative with the filters that are being generated.

From what I understand, the thoroughness of FIR filters depends on their length. The longer the filter, the more correction points it can have, especially at lower frequencies - think of it as a graphic equalizer with a band every 1/n octave. The problem with FIR filters is that they take a lot of processing power to apply, and when you add time-domain correction into the mix, the length of these filters grows exponentially.

Anyway - I suspect the filters used by the H800 are not very long because the correction below 100Hz seems lacking. Also, I believe the software is not applying any boost, but rather only cutting, and therefore, I think Alpine was very conservative and limited it to applying up to -x dB of correction (maybe -6db) to avoid volume issues.

Apart from just curiosity, I am wondering if it wouldn't be beneficial to tweak amplifier gains to get as close to the target curve as possible before running the auto EQ.


----------



## bbfoto

^ Thanks for all that info oca123! Good stuff. I'd be interested in your measurements if you're willing to post them up. Thanks again.


----------



## oca123

bbfoto said:


> ^ Thanks for all that info oca123! Good stuff. I'd be interested in your measurements if you're willing to post them up. Thanks again.


Well, something came up today, but I'll get to it 
Did you by chance sell me some Canton speakers on eBay about a year ago? Your username looks familiar.


----------



## ace2u

Maybe this has been answered, maybe it hasn't.

With this take a 4 high input to RCA and make a 6 output?


----------



## oca123

If you mean front left, front right, rear left, rear right, yes.

If you mean front left high, front left low, front right high, front right low, I don't know, there is nothing in the manual, and I would love to find out.

In any case, the manual explains the input options - http://www.alpine.uk.com/fileadmin/...car_audio_manuals/PXA-H800/OM_PXA-H800_EN.pdf


----------



## bbfoto

oca123 said:


> Well, something came up today, but I'll get to it
> Did you by chance sell me some Canton speakers on eBay about a year ago? Your username looks familiar.


Nope, never sold any Canton stuff. No worries on the measurements, free time seems to be at a premium for me these days as well.


----------



## ace2u

oca123 said:


> If you mean front left, front right, rear left, rear right, yes.
> 
> If you mean front left high, front left low, front right high, front right low, I don't know, there is nothing in the manual, and I would love to find out.
> 
> In any case, the manual explains the input options - http://www.alpine.uk.com/fileadmin/...car_audio_manuals/PXA-H800/OM_PXA-H800_EN.pdf


Yeah, I have Front Right, Front Left, Right Rear, and Left Rear. But will this be able to take High-output to RCA into the RCA jack on the input side? By this I mean using one of these as an input. JL Audio XD-CLRAIC2-SW 2-channel speaker output converter (bare speaker wires to male RCAs) at Crutchfield.com


----------



## Shinju

Just pulled the Trigger on the H800 and c800, lets see how well it stacks up to the h701.


----------



## oca123

> Yeah, I have Front Right, Front Left, Right Rear, and Left Rear. But will this be able to take High-output to RCA into the RCA jack on the input side? By this I mean using one of these as an input. JL Audio XD-CLRAIC2-SW 2-channel speaker output converter (bare speaker wires to male RCAs) at Crutchfield.com


Yes it can take FL, FR, RL, RR high level inputs on its RCA jacks. It actually comes with RCA cables with one end that is stripped and ready to connect to a factory amplifier. IIRC these high-levle inputs can take 7V.
You don't even need to buy the JL cable you link to, again the H800 comes with them.




Shinju said:


> Just pulled the Trigger on the H800 and c800, lets see how well it stacks up to the h701.


I guess that would depend on the weapon used. I believe that in most cases the C800 would be blown to pieces, but the H800 might or might not hold up. I know that I shot a WD hard drive with an M82 .50 cal rifle once and it made a clean hole right through it.
:drunk:


----------



## Shinju

oca123 said:


> Yes it can take FL, FR, RL, RR high level inputs on its RCA jacks. It actually comes with RCA cables with one end that is stripped and ready to connect to a factory amplifier. IIRC these high-levle inputs can take 7V.
> You don't even need to buy the JL cable you link to, again the H800 comes with them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I guess that would depend on the weapon used. I believe that in most cases the C800 would be blown to pieces, but the H800 might or might not hold up. I know that I shot a WD hard drive with an M82 .50 cal rifle once and it made a clean hole right through it.
> :drunk:



I just used a 22 cal and it only put a small dent in the shell!  Maybe I will try some thermite?!


----------



## oca123

Shinju said:


> I just used a 22 cal and it only put a small dent in the shell!  Maybe I will try some thermite?!


i think you mean tannerite?

I was going to take some measurements yesterday, but it looks like I damaged my sub. I am taking this opportunity to change some stuff in my system and so I will not be able to take measurements for another week or so.

I am getting a Phoenix Gold Elite.4 amp, and a Phoenix Gold Elite.1 class D amp. Not sure on what subwoofer(s) yet. Going to make a post in the right section for that


----------



## KenB129

The installer got the processor working and tonight I hooked up the mic and let it do it's thing. I had to turn up the input on my for the front and rears from about 10PM to 2PM because it kept saying that the volume level was too low. It finally finished calibration and said it couldn't detect the subwoofer. Unfortunately the subwoofer is already turned all the way up, so I'm not sure what to do about that. The sound with the imprint turned on is horrendous, the speakers sound like little transitor radios and there is absolutely no bass, which I'm guessing is due it not detecting the sub.

Also, for some reason the processor isn't detecting the optical input. I know it's hooked up because I saw the installer connect it to the HU and I verified myself that it's plugged into the processor.

I also can't seem to locate the mode switch on the HU to make sure it's set to eq/div. I guess it's time to read that flippin manual.

Any ideas?


----------



## oca123

I think there might be some confusion between (speaker-level or line input level into H800) and (microphone input level)

Also, I think your subwoofer is not detected because it is simply too loud. When imprint runs sweeps on mine, it is not that loud.


----------



## KenB129

oca123 said:


> I think there might be some confusion between (speaker-level or line input level into H800) and (microphone input level)
> 
> Also, I think your subwoofer is not detected because it is simply too loud. When imprint runs sweeps on mine, it is not that loud.


There is definitely some confusion here... The only thing going into the H800 is the AI-NET and optical cables. As I was reading the manual last night I noticed that I only had options for Aux 1 & Aux 2 in the setup screen. The options for Aux HU and optical inputs were grayed out.

As far as the subwoofer being too loud, I couldn't hear it all when it ran the sweeps. I also read in the manual something about turning off the low pass filter but it was way too late last night to try it.


----------



## KenB129

OK, I figured a few things out... My optical link is indeed working. I thought I turned it off and on while playing a CD but it must have been the radio because now it's turning sound off and on when playing a CD. Problem 1 solved.

I found my subwoofer. The installer put the rca outputs into positions 1-6, but I have full range fronts so I moved the rcas to 3-8 and everything sounded better, including the bass.

I started calibration again with my amp inputs in their normal positions and the calibration completed with no errors and mostly sounds very good, with the exception of the bass. The bass is pretty much overpowering and when I reduce the sub output it just doesn't sound right then either. I turned off the low pass filter and suspect that might have something to do with. Also, I noticed distortion in the sub and when I turned the filter back on it went away but so did some of the bass above 50hz, my current setting.

Does the imprint go any lower than 90hz for measurement? The graph showed that it only goes down to 90 but now sure if it's just the display or not. Should I turn down the sub and recalibrate? I also only calibrated from one position, not sure how much difference that makes.


----------



## Shinju

I just got mine installed, I have to say for my initial test run this is a pretty damn good processor and more advance then the 701.

Still trying to figure things out, I have lost all subwoofer control from the HU (trying to track down how to control the level now) and trying to figure out how to bypass all that DTS and Dolby PII stuff.

My biggest gripe is the preset Call/Store feature not a very well planned out system but it does work as its intended. and the Auto tune features are meh at best.

I got a focused tune now I need to take it and start going for tonality and image/depth.


----------



## KenB129

Shinju said:


> I just got mine installed, I have to say for my initial test run this is a pretty damn good processor and more advance then the 701.
> 
> Still trying to figure things out, I have lost all subwoofer control from the HU (trying to track down how to control the level now) and trying to figure out how to bypass all that DTS and Dolby PII stuff.
> 
> My biggest gripe is the preset Call/Store feature not a very well planned out system but it does work as its intended. and the Auto tune features are meh at best.
> 
> I got a focused tune now I need to take it and start going for tonality and image/depth.


You should be able to control you sub level and fader from HU, not much else. Hit your audio button and then the little speaker icon on the left side to bring up the screen.

I believe the DTS and and Dolby PII stuff are options that are turned off by default, so if you didn't turn them on all is well.


----------



## Shinju

KenB129 said:


> You should be able to control you sub level and fader from HU, not much else. Hit your audio button and then the little speaker icon on the left side to bring up the screen.
> 
> I believe the DTS and and Dolby PII stuff are options that are turned off by default, so if you didn't turn them on all is well.



The DTS and D PII was turned on by default for me after a reset. I just used the lap top to get into the processor and turned it all off.

I just came from a 701 and made no changes on my cda-9886 and now the subwoofer control is gone I can do fade and balance thats it. (Running AI-Net of course).

With the 701 I was able to control the sub level output from the deck from the get go. Even going into the imprint option on the deck the subwoofer option is locked out.


----------



## KenB129

Are your speakers setup properly (initial setup for processor) and the connections correct? This one got me right away when it couldn't detect my subwoofer with imprint, nor could I control it from the HU. The rcas were hooked up to the wrong outputs on the processor.


----------



## quickaudi07

In the setup you could select the channels of your sub, see if they are unchecked, to get the controll back for your sub level.


----------



## Shinju

I am sure its just a setting, I am playing with the H800 in offline mode via laptop. I have a 3 way + set up. I am currently in system 1 (4.2ch) That might be my issue.

I am going to handwrite all of my settings and redo them offline in the system 2 (2.2ch) setting and see if that sets it right since that one is the true 3 way + sub config.


----------



## timmay77

Just finished setting everything up. Very nice unit. I too am having a problem with my bass being completely overpowering. I ran the full Imprint set up twice, the second time I turned my sub gain up to 3/4, then backed it off when it was finished, my bass is still way too loud.


----------



## jim walter

Check your crossover setting on the sub. In my case, I have found it running my subs (2 8s) too high for my tastes and I had to set the XO lower and re-run the tune.

Jim


----------



## timmay77

Thanks Jim

I set my crossovers BEFORE running Imprint. I called Alpine support, they told me to set all of my crossovers flat except for the tweeter, run Imprint, then reset my crossovers. They said Imprint was compensating for the cut frequencies by boosting those that were missing?

I'm doing what they said right now.


----------



## timmay77

That was a waste of an hour. I'm at the point where I may pull the H800 and put my H701 back in. This is ridiculous, even Alpine doesn't know how to use this thing...... I guess I will call them back and listen to them scratch their heads again through the phone.


----------



## matdotcom2000

What problems are you having??? I am considering this unit over the 360.3..


----------



## timmay77

As stated above, I've run Imprint 5 times now, following Alpine's instructions, and my sub bass is so over powering you can't even listen to the system at half volume. The gains on my sub amp are at 0 and the sub level is 0 on my HU. Super frustrated. I wasted 7 hours today trying to tune this stupid thing.


----------



## quality_sound

Why not just set it by ear like you did with the 701?


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## timmay77

quality_sound said:


> Why not just set it by ear like you did with the 701?


Because I am sure Imprint is better at it than I am, once it works correctly. The technology is there for a reason, it just needs to fricken work correctly. If I'm going to do that, I might as well just put the 701 back in.......


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## quality_sound

Even with the exact same settings the 800 will sound better than the 701. That alone is worth it. TBH, I have never been a huge fan of the Imprint algorithm.


----------



## Shinju

I love this piece I really do, I am having a very fustrating time trying to figure out why I have no subwoofer level control.

I am using a CDA-9886 via AI-Net to the h800 I am in system config 2 (2.2ch) 3 way + sub/subs. According to Alpine Tech and the instructions that all subwoofer control is taken away from the deck and is now ONLY controlled VIA the RUX-c800.

When I press the rux knob in I get the subwoofer level and when I turn it up it makes no change in the level of the subwoofer output. I have tried everything from running rca's from channel 7 and or 8 (combind too) and nothing. My sub output is very hot like other have stated.

My rux is ver 2.0 my h800 is ver 1.0 not sure if this has anything to do with my issue but I am putting it out there anyway.


----------



## quality_sound

Some HUs get sub control, some don't. There's a chart somewhere in this thread that lays all of that out. 

I love mine as well but I'm half-tempted to run the new INA-920 simply because it does most of the stuff I use the 800 (t/a, but no 5.1, and 9 band PEQ) for and has BT and Nav built-in. Then my brain kicks in and reminds me that no one ever calls and my TomTom's nav is better and upgradable. lol Still, I may decide to go that way just for simplicity. If it had Ai-net I'd have already ordered one.

edit: Just looked at the 920 on Crutchfield and according to them it IS compatible with the H800... Hmmm... Not sure how as it has no Ai-Net, nor optical output. Time to send an email.


----------



## timmay77

I finally figured out that you can adjust the dB levels in the crossover, so I can turn down my subs after tuning with Imprint. It's crap that I should HAVE to do that, but it is what it is. I did however use the auto time correction, which worked pretty well. I am going to break out the TrueRTA software and make the EQ adjustments myself, save it, then run Imprint and compare the 2.


----------



## KenB129

My Imprint woes continue. I've tried the autotune many times yet every time the results are unsuitable. The last time I tuned the driver's side seat in all positions, the only thing I didn't do is remove the headrests and I can certainly try that. It's also possible that I don't understand what Imprint is trying to do.

With the time alignment, volume adjustment, and EQ adjustment for each channel I expected my soundstage to move forward and for the speakers to mostly disappear and get better imaging. Every time I run it, the soundstage becomes wider, and the right speakers totally disappear, but the left front sounds like it's coming right from there. For voices and such, there is no localization at all, I cannot tell where the voice is coming from, although a bit comes from the left. I expected the voice and all mono sounds to be somewhat in front of me.

I didn't notice that the right speakers are way louder than left but I didn't measure SPL levels yet. I entered in manual time alignment data today and it doesn't do much for the staging either, but both levels are the same. To manually tune, do I have to set the channel levels also?

I'm not even hitting the EQ part yet. I just got a mic and preamp and such and am learning how to use it all. I took measurements of both channels with and without Imprint turned on and all look different but just as bad. I'm talking differences as much as 5-10db at some frequencies. I loaded a calibration file for the mic and it's not flat when measuring nothing, although I'm not sure it would be. Another thing to note is that even with using the midrange compensation target curve, Imprint still makes it very bright sounding.


----------



## quality_sound

timmay77 said:


> I finally figured out that you can adjust the dB levels in the crossover, so I can turn down my subs after tuning with Imprint. It's crap that I should HAVE to do that, but it is what it is. I did however use the auto time correction, which worked pretty well. I am going to break out the TrueRTA software and make the EQ adjustments myself, save it, then run Imprint and compare the 2.


These are the level controls we were talking about earlier when you said you didn't have any volume. I agree, that it kind of defeats the purpose, but at least it beats having to turn it UP like the original Imprint algorithm. 



KenB129 said:


> My Imprint woes continue. I've tried the autotune many times yet every time the results are unsuitable. The last time I tuned the driver's side seat in all positions, the only thing I didn't do is remove the headrests and I can certainly try that. It's also possible that I don't understand what Imprint is trying to do.
> 
> With the time alignment, volume adjustment, and EQ adjustment for each channel I expected my soundstage to move forward and for the speakers to mostly disappear and get better imaging. Every time I run it, the soundstage becomes wider, and the right speakers totally disappear, but the left front sounds like it's coming right from there. For voices and such, there is no localization at all, I cannot tell where the voice is coming from, although a bit comes from the left. I expected the voice and all mono sounds to be somewhat in front of me.
> 
> I didn't notice that the right speakers are way louder than left but I didn't measure SPL levels yet. I entered in manual time alignment data today and it doesn't do much for the staging either, but both levels are the same. To manually tune, do I have to set the channel levels also?
> 
> I'm not even hitting the EQ part yet. I just got a mic and preamp and such and am learning how to use it all. I took measurements of both channels with and without Imprint turned on and all look different but just as bad. I'm talking differences as much as 5-10db at some frequencies. I loaded a calibration file for the mic and it's not flat when measuring nothing, although I'm not sure it would be. Another thing to note is that even with using the midrange compensation target curve, Imprint still makes it very bright sounding.


This SCREAMS of a phase problem. Have you double-checked that? Imprint should be trying to give you a solid stage in the middle of the dash. If it's all pinned to the left then either something is out of phase or you have some channel swapped.


----------



## KenB129

I know the channels aren't swapped, I can isolate any channel without another playing.

I thought about a phase issue, but with imprint turned off I can place my head in center between speakers and vocals and mono material is dead center and imaging is excellent. If I go off to the side it follows as it should. I know what out of phase sounds like and I don't get that at all. It's certainly possible that one tweeter or mid is out of phase and I just don't hear it when imprint is off. A pro installed the speakers and he does very good work, but at this point I'm going to have to learn how to get into the doors and do these things myself. I can easily verify amp connections and the tweeters, but the mids require door removal.

I do get the impression that imprint is _trying _to get the stage correct, because on some CDs the voice goes upfront a little bit, but most of the time it cannot be localized at all.


----------



## Shinju

KenB129 said:


> I know the channels aren't swapped, I can isolate any channel without another playing.
> 
> I thought about a phase issue, but with imprint turned off I can place my head in center between speakers and vocals and mono material is dead center and imaging is excellent. If I go off to the side it follows as it should. I know what out of phase sounds like and I don't get that at all. It's certainly possible that one tweeter or mid is out of phase and I just don't hear it when imprint is off. A pro installed the speakers and he does very good work, but at this point I'm going to have to learn how to get into the doors and do these things myself. I can easily verify amp connections and the tweeters, but the mids require door removal.
> 
> I do get the impression that imprint is _trying _to get the stage correct, because on some CDs the voice goes upfront a little bit, but most of the time it cannot be localized at all.




Me personally never would use autotune it doesnt do what you and your own ear can accomplish.

I set my own x-over points and time.corr units, I know most want to plug and play and go but maybe you should try to tune it yourself and see if you cannot dial it in better.

Imprint is a good gimmik tool for the masses but it sounds like you want more then it can do.




My delima is trying to decide if I want to ditch AI-net and just go 2 channel input. I am not seeing any benifit from using AI-net since I cannot control the subwoofer level from the deck anymore (let alone from the RUX-c800). 

I do not have a source unit that has optical so that is out. IF by doing the 2 channel input yeilds better results then I am going to get the new CDE-HD138BT since it has some nice built in stuff that my CDA-9886 doesnt with out buying 200+ dollars in accesories.


----------



## KenB129

Shinju said:


> Me personally never would use autotune it doesnt do what you and your own ear can accomplish.
> 
> I set my own x-over points and time.corr units, I know most want to plug and play and go but maybe you should try to tune it yourself and see if you cannot dial it in better.
> 
> Imprint is a good gimmik tool for the masses but it sounds like you want more then it can do.


Well I'm going to verify phase and then try imprint again, this time with the headrests off as suggested here and on another forum. I live on a busy road and even in garage roadnoise is quite apparent. I will drape as many blankets over my vehicle as I can to see if that helps.

Before the processor was put inline I used the head unit and guessed at time correction values and it sounded really good. This time I measured distances and got them spot on and it's not impressive at all. Maybe the HU adjusted volume based on distance, I never looked into that.

Does manual tuning involve more than distance, volume, and EQ? It might be time to get out those old acoustics books...


----------



## Shinju

KenB129 said:


> Well I'm going to verify phase and then try imprint again, this time with the headrests off as suggested here and on another forum. I live on a busy road and even in garage roadnoise is quite apparent. I will drape as many blankets over my vehicle as I can to see if that helps.
> 
> Before the processor was put inline I used the head unit and guessed at time correction values and it sounded really good. This time I measured distances and got them spot on and it's not impressive at all. Maybe the HU adjusted volume based on distance, I never looked into that.
> 
> Does manual tuning involve more than distance, volume, and EQ? It might be time to get out those old acoustics books...



I have access to a RTA but you can most def do this by ear alone.


----------



## quality_sound

KenB129 said:


> I know the channels aren't swapped, I can isolate any channel without another playing.
> 
> I thought about a phase issue, but with imprint turned off I can place my head in center between speakers and vocals and mono material is dead center and imaging is excellent. If I go off to the side it follows as it should. I know what out of phase sounds like and I don't get that at all. It's certainly possible that one tweeter or mid is out of phase and I just don't hear it when imprint is off. A pro installed the speakers and he does very good work, but at this point I'm going to have to learn how to get into the doors and do these things myself. I can easily verify amp connections and the tweeters, but the mids require door removal.
> 
> I do get the impression that imprint is _trying _to get the stage correct, because on some CDs the voice goes upfront a little bit, but most of the time it cannot be localized at all.


It's not unheard of for a driver to be marked incorrectly. Definitely let us know what you find after you get in and verify polarity with a AA battery.


----------



## eviling

just put in my order. looks like im running an alpine h800  tehe.


----------



## Shinju

Shinju said:


> I have access to a RTA but you can most def do this by ear alone.





quality_sound said:


> It's not unheard of for a driver to be marked incorrectly. Definitely let us know what you find after you get in and verify polarity with a AA battery.


Also make sure you don't have a 180 phase turned on my accident in the processor, pretty easy to make that mistake. 

Are you interfacing the h800 with a laptop or the rux? If you are only using tue rux I highly recommend interfacing with a laptop make things much easier.


----------



## EtaZeta

I have been round and round with the H800 but I am getting somewhere now. My F150 Sony system puts out a high, mid, and low signal and EQs the hell out of it. I had a Cleansweep with summing interface laying around so I threw that between the HU and the H800. Solved that problem.

I quickly ran ImprintEQ this afternoon and selected the "ALL" position. Took three measurements from front center, rear center, and driver seat. While the quality was nice the staging was extremely rear heavy. From the driver seat I could hear the rear speakers over the front. I have verified that all front, rear, left, and right is accurately hooked up. I will play with it some more.

One thing I would love to see is some other's target curves. For now I am simply choosing REFERENCE. I would think with a target curve it could get better. I am decent with the installation side of car audio but am self-admittedly dumb with tuning and staging. I do like rear fill, personal preference I know. I also found it helped to drop my sub amp gain by 25% prior to Imprint then bump it back afterwards. I like a little more prominent bass than Imprint does apparently.

All in all this is a nice piece. I am using the C800 as well because otherwise, with factory HU, the H800 refused to even power up. Only powers up if laptop or H800 is connected.

Another thread on tuning this thing would be nice so we don't have 70+ "when will it ship" pages.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> It's not unheard of for a driver to be marked incorrectly. Definitely let us know what you find after you get in and verify polarity with a AA battery.


There's definitely something not right and I never noticed it before the HU and 800 got installed. Even with the 800 bypassed, if I place my head in center with mono material the voice come from both sides instead of in the middle. Turning my head does't give that phasey effect. Same with the rears. I did have a bit of time to listen to each mid/tweeter combo and cannot hear anything going on with the phase. 

I did notice that the Rear R channel does seem phasey when it's the only channel on. If I have head forward it sounds like it should, but if I turn head to right it becomes a wall of sound. This doesn't explain why my fronts sound the way they do though.

Is it safe to use the AA battery with my tweeters inline? The crossover is located in the door so hooking up the battery will zap both of them.


----------



## quality_sound

EtaZeta said:


> I have been round and round with the H800 but I am getting somewhere now. My F150 Sony system puts out a high, mid, and low signal and EQs the hell out of it. I had a Cleansweep with summing interface laying around so I threw that between the HU and the H800. Solved that problem.
> 
> I quickly ran ImprintEQ this afternoon and selected the "ALL" position. Took three measurements from front center, rear center, and driver seat. While the quality was nice the staging was extremely rear heavy. From the driver seat I could hear the rear speakers over the front. I have verified that all front, rear, left, and right is accurately hooked up. I will play with it some more.


Is that how Imprint wants you to measure? I thought it was just around the driver's head area but I'm not 100% on that. If it just wants the head area that might be the problem.



> All in all this is a nice piece. I am using the C800 as well because otherwise, with factory HU, the H800 refused to even power up. Only powers up if laptop or H800 is connected.


yep, says so in the manual. 



> Another thread on tuning this thing would be nice so we don't have 70+ "when will it ship" pages.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


Tuning is tuning no matter the tool.


----------



## quality_sound

KenB129 said:


> There's definitely something not right and I never noticed it before the HU and 800 got installed. Even with the 800 bypassed, if I place my head in center with mono material the voice come from both sides instead of in the middle. Turning my head does't give that phasey effect. Same with the rears. I did have a bit of time to listen to each mid/tweeter combo and cannot hear anything going on with the phase.


I'd still verify, just to make sure. 



> I did notice that the Rear R channel does seem phasey when it's the only channel on. If I have head forward it sounds like it should, but if I turn head to right it becomes a wall of sound. This doesn't explain why my fronts sound the way they do though.


Sure it does. The process hears everything, including small phase issues you don't. The MS-8 does too and every time it's been suggested to check phase, it was a phase problem.



> Is it safe to use the AA battery with my tweeters inline? The crossover is located in the door so hooking up the battery will zap both of them.


Oh yeah. It's only 1.5V. I test mine without even the crossover inline, just straight to the tweeter. Back in the day, I needed to kill a Kicker ND25a tweeter so I connected it to a ZR600 bridged and HAMMERED on it with some bass mechanic for about 35 seconds before it finally died. 1.5V from a battery won't hurt anything.


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> It's not unheard of for a driver to be marked incorrectly. Definitely let us know what you find after you get in and verify polarity with a AA battery.


There's definitely something not right and I never noticed it before the HU and 800 got installed. Even with the 800 bypassed, if I place my head in center with mono material the voice come from both sides instead of in the middle. Turning my head does't give that phasey effect. Same with the rears. I did have a bit of time to listen to each mid/tweeter combo and cannot hear anything going on with the phase. 

I did notice that the Rear R channel does seem phasey when it's the only channel on. If I have head forward it sounds like it should, but if I turn head to right it becomes a wall of sound. This doesn't explain why my fronts sound the way they do though.

Is it safe to use the AA battery with my tweeters inline? The crossover is located in the door so hooking up the battery will zap both of them.


----------



## KenB129

KenB129 said:


> There's definitely something not right and I never noticed it before the HU and 800 got installed. Even with the 800 bypassed, if I place my head in center with mono material the voice come from both sides instead of in the middle. Turning my head does't give that phasey effect. Same with the rears. I did have a bit of time to listen to each mid/tweeter combo and cannot hear anything going on with the phase.
> 
> I did notice that the Rear R channel does seem phasey when it's the only channel on. If I have head forward it sounds like it should, but if I turn head to right it becomes a wall of sound. This doesn't explain why my fronts sound the way they do though.
> 
> Is it safe to use the AA battery with my tweeters inline? The crossover is located in the door so hooking up the battery will zap both of them.


I think it's safe to eliminate phase as an issue. Instead of just putting head in middle of speakers from the front seat, I put on both mono and stereo music and climbed into the back seat. I leaned forward and put my head into a nearfield listening position with the fronts and all voices and such were dead center. I leaned back to try to do the same with the rears and couldn't get all the way back,yet it sounded even better than the front. It sounded very, very good and for once I enjoyed the music. This was all done with the processor bypassed.

I do know the the acoustics inside my vehicle suck, but doesn't it for _all_ vehicles? I guess it's back to fiddling with the processor.


----------



## quality_sound

If you sat in the front middle and it wasn't centered, there's something going on. I wonder if a channel or channels are inverted right out of the OEM HU.


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> If you sat in the front middle and it wasn't centered, there's something going on. I wonder if a channel or channels are inverted right out of the OEM HU.


I'm using the INA-W910. 

What I'm curious about is if the imprint can be tweaked or if it's totally manual? I think something is off in the time correction but if I go enter manual settings the imprint shuts off. This is using the RUX and not a pc, although I just messed with it at lunchtime so I may have done something wrong.


----------



## quality_sound

I'd have to check the manual to know for sure. I haven't used Imprint on mine.


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> I'd have to check the manual to know for sure. I haven't used Imprint on mine.


I don't think there's anything in the manual about that, although I will go back and check. I know that many pages ago in this thread somebody posted a guideline about using imprint which implied it could be tweaked, but I haven't seen it.


----------



## acidbass303

KenB129 said:


> I don't think there's anything in the manual about that, although I will go back and check. I know that many pages ago in this thread somebody posted a guideline about using imprint which implied it could be tweaked, but I haven't seen it.



Once the imprint has done its thing, you can tweak everything from time alignment to eq (GEQ or PEQ) However the range of maximum cut or boost in EQ is reduced to 6dbs post imprint. Other than pretty much everything is tweakable.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


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## KenB129

Great, I will have to see what I can do on that alignment. Thanks.


----------



## eviling

I can't wait for my h800 tehe. I really hope o don't run into any issues I got mine off eBay but under warrenty for 540$ seemed like a decent price.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


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## adrockthemc

I just bought the PXA-H800 to pair with my Kenwood DNX9990HD and from my initial impressions it seems to be quite feature rich. I haven't played with the Imprint or RoadEQ but I will let you all know how it goes. I read somewhere on here that the RoadEQ was _not[_ active noise cancellation but it must be, at least in some capacity. Since it requires the mic to be attached it must be doing some active DSP. In any case I seem to be having the same problem that acidbass303 is having:



acidbass303 said:


> Thanks for that, I have contacted local alpine dealer, lets see what happens.
> 
> Weird thing is going eversince I updated my H800 yesterday. On starting the car, the H800 simply refuses to turn on. I have the rux connected as well as the Ai-net from w910. The HU turns on but the processor and consequently the amps dont turn on. The w910 menus behave as there is no processor connected. Eventually i have to turn off the acc and restart multiple times and randomly it turns on. And when turned on, works normally. It is pretty annoying. I have tried resetting the unit many times but it just keeps on happening. It happened a very few times before the update but now it is like 4 out 5 restarts. Really looking forward to some tips/solutions to sort this out.


I do not have a RUX-C800 but, for whatever reason, it will not turn on without the computer attached. Does anyone know if the RUX-C800 or alpine H/U is necessary for the unit to activate or can it operate in a stand alone state? Acidbass seems to think it is a voltage issue or is it some setting in the software?


----------



## eviling

It shouldn't need the ru

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


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## acidbass303

adrockthemc said:


> I just bought the PXA-H800 to pair with my Kenwood DNX9990HD and from my initial impressions it seems to be quite feature rich. I haven't played with the Imprint or RoadEQ but I will let you all know how it goes. I read somewhere on here that the RoadEQ was _not[_ active noise cancellation but it must be, at least in some capacity. Since it requires the mic to be attached it must be doing some active DSP. In any case I seem to be having the same problem that acidbass303 is having:
> 
> 
> 
> I do not have a RUX-C800 but, for whatever reason, it will not turn on without the computer attached. Does anyone know if the RUX-C800 or alpine H/U is necessary for the unit to activate or can it operate in a stand alone state? Acidbass seems to think it is a voltage issue or is it some setting in the software?


Hi there, since you are not using an Alpine Ai-net headunit you have to get a rux-c800 to run the h800 in the stand alone mode or get an alpine HU instead of the kenwood but I really like the added ease c800 offers...on the fly changes etc.

As far as my issue is concerned, I have found that if I dont turn on my system right after starting the car and delay it by like a couple of minutes then 8 out of 10 times (appx) I dont face the problem... Pretty strange...But I am hoping that there will be a solution soon..

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


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## acidbass303

eviling said:


> It shouldn't need the ru
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


He is using a kenwood HU, with that he will need the rux mate.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


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## eviling

**** than looks like I need to buy me an rux ugh or switch to an alpine head unit but I already have to much invested in my cars computer and its about to go in extremley soon. Maybe even this weekend lol I've been holding off till I ordered the last part but looks like I need one more part yet again lol sigh 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


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## adrockthemc

Yeah, that is the same conclusion that I came up with after uselessly searching the web. I ordered the RUX from amazon yesterday. Thanks for the help though.

I can get it to turn on with my laptop in the meantime and spent some considerable time dialing it in today. I followed the directions in the ImprintEQ pdf that someone posted earlier and then proceeded to start the imprint process. I took great care to make sure the area i used for testing was completely silent and I think it helps that the car is covered top to bottom in dynamat. I also turned off the high pass filter on my speaker amp, turned the LP filter on my mono amp to the max, and turned off the DSP on the Kenwood DNX-9990HD H/U. 

It took a while but I think the results are much better than other people are experiencing. It sounds very good to me but, I am very new at this. 

Here are my crossover settings:
http://imgur.com/tNpU7

Here is the post imprintEQ run:
http://imgur.com/7a01U

It looks like it cleaned up the impulse response quite a bit. 
Then it was time to put it to the test. Using a RTA program called 'REW' (it's free!!), a behringer ecm8000 flat mic, the mic mate xl, and a pink noise program on my ipod i measured the result of the equalizer. Below is that result

room ambient noise (as a reference) :
http://imgur.com/BNaVG

Vehicle eq (post imprint run):
http://imgur.com/VtPhk

From the graph it looks like there is a spike at about 1.2k and a dip from about 80-130Hz. I adjusted this by hand using the graphic equalizer and this is my result

Post ImprintEQ and self correction:
http://imgur.com/5zEW0

Next i ran the auto TCR function by placing the mic about 8in from the driver's side headrest and got this result

Auto_TCR_Result

Here it looks like this didn't work too well. It basically maxed out the TCR on each speaker. I was hoping that it would lengthen the driver's side and shorten the passenger's side to make more of an even sound stage for the driver but it did not. I will have to research this further when I get more time. 

In any case the result is quite fantastic. It sounds much better than it did before the PXA so I am quite pleased with my purchase. It should be even better with the RUX. I hope this answers any questions anyone has. Everyone says it sounds great but since that is very subjective I thought some actual hard data would help clarify some.


----------



## quality_sound

Why was that surprising? The manual clearly states that you MUST use the RUX when using a non-Alpine HU.


----------



## Shinju

adrockthemc 

Are you running a 3 way front (no rear fill) + sub?

Or are you doing a 2way front + rear fill + sub?


Reason I ask if you are indeed running a 3 way you have it on the wrong system setting and you are not going to get an accurate autotune. I ran into this same issue with my 3way + sub when I was on that setting it was not adjusting correctly.

If you are running a 3 way + sub no real fill do system config 2 2.2 that is the setting for a true 3 way front + sub.

If infact you are running a 2 way front + rear fill + sub then ignore me


----------



## adrockthemc

quality_sound said:


> Why was that surprising? The manual clearly states that you MUST use the RUX when using a non-Alpine HU.


@quality_sound: *sigh* that RTFM always gets me.



Shinju said:


> adrockthemc
> 
> Are you running a 3 way front (no rear fill) + sub?
> 
> Or are you doing a 2way front + rear fill + sub?
> 
> 
> Reason I ask if you are indeed running a 3 way you have it on the wrong system setting and you are not going to get an accurate autotune. I ran into this same issue with my 3way + sub when I was on that setting it was not adjusting correctly.
> 
> If you are running a 3 way + sub no real fill do system config 2 2.2 that is the setting for a true 3 way front + sub.
> 
> If infact you are running a 2 way front + rear fill + sub then ignore me


Yeah I am running 2 way front, rear fill, mono sub in the back. If I bi-amped i could ditch the passive crossover that came with my component front speakers but lack of space and $$ has prevented that from happening. 

I am still learning how to use REW so I could be mis-using it. If i get better results or more readable results I will post them. The results I am seeing do look consistent with what I am looking for but it's been a few years since I broke open a book on Fourier transforms and time domain/frequency domain analysis. 

Currently I'm using:
Kenwood DNX9990HD Head unit
Alpine PXA-H800 sound processor
Alpine MRX-F30 4 ch amp
Alpine MRP-F450 Mono amp
Alpine 10" type R sub
Polk Audio DXI6500 component 6.5" front speakers
Polk Audio DXI650 Coaxial 2 way speakers for rear fill. 

I picked the crossover points based on the speaker's frequency response given in the manual. 

I figured it would be better to blow the majority of my cash on quality sound input to the amp rather than high $$ amp and speakers. 

Giving crap signal to expensive amps and speakers would only result in clean sounding crap. 

Some Focal speakers would be sweet though


----------



## eviling

is RTFM read the ****ing manual? because thats what i got out of it lol uhm just got my h800 yesterday. heavier than i expected. man i love me some alpine lol this thing is a quality piece, unlike the 701 which felt like a toaster this thing accualy feels like a high end electronic lol seems to follow the styling of the PDX amp's i bet it would pair really nicley with them.  

I ordered my RUX yesterday -_- i completly forgot it needed it and when i was making my final choice between that, the helix unit or an ms-8 again, i was like well at least the alpine is the cheapest solution...lol i thought wrong -_- could of got the ms-8. cant find anybody besides cruchfield with the helix though and they want like 800? i thought it was supposed to retail 600 maybe 700. that ****s crazy. 

I like that it comes with velcrow  nifty. the mic also seems to be a decent quality piece, maybe i will try out the auto tune and see how i like it. i never really planned on using it with this choice, if anything the 3sixty.3 was the auto tune of choice from what i heard but i havnt heard any reviews on it yet. but ive heard allot of software problems right out of the gate. which is why i chose to go with this unit instead. because i knew its been out for 2 years getitng bugs worked out in other countrys so im hoping we have it all worked out by now


----------



## adrockthemc

eviling said:


> is RTFM read the ****ing manual? because thats what i got out of it...


Sure is. It's basically what technicians say behind every client's back. ha!

In any case, I got my RUX in today and sure enough it fixed the issue. It's a bummer that it won't operate in 'stand alone mode' but oh well. 

Also, I am very pleased with the way the ImprintEQ worked for me. My system sounds very nice even though I'm using base model amps with mid-model speakers. I wonder why some of the other people on this thread had trouble with it? 

Anywho, IMHO, the PXA-H800 (or any other good sound processor) is where you should start your SQ build rather than a finishing touch.


----------



## quality_sound

With the C800 IS stand-alone mode. I think there should be a third mode where you don't need it though. Then again, didn't the 701 need the C701 or an Alpine HU to power up as well?


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> With the C800 IS stand-alone mode. I think there should be a third mode where you don't need it though. Then again, didn't the 701 need the C701 or an Alpine HU to power up as well?


the 701 did not, the 700 origonaly did but i dont think either did in the end because i ended up with a 700 not a 701 like i thought once and it worked fine with out the remote i think i forget if i tried it with out it or not. idk i got confused with the whole thing. but i was bumbed when if ound out it needed the remote, i completley forgot when i made the order souly based on cheapest option...little did i realise  least i feel like i got more than i would foor 700$ for the helix which is a tiny box


----------



## ErinH

The helix is the better processor IF you're looking to just go with a straight up system layout (ie: no 5.1) and you don't need roadEQ. 

Given most people's needs on this site, the h800 truthfully isn't a very good processor due to the limitations of the DSP features. Especially compared to the helix or mosconi pieces. And I've owned all three.


----------



## bigfastmike

Can the Alpine be used to run active fronts, rear fill coax, and subs off Kenwood hu? 

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


----------



## bbfoto

^RTFT or RTFM 

But honestly, welcome to DIYMA, Mike.


----------



## n_olympios

eviling said:


> the 701 did not, the 700 origonaly did but i dont think either did in the end because i ended up with a 700 not a 701 like i thought once and it worked fine with out the remote i think i forget if i tried it with out it or not. idk i got confused with the whole thing.


There was no need to be confused, they are exactly the same equipment. The only difference was the packaging (ok, button colour as well). Initially Alpine made the 700 as a one box solution for everyone. Later on, when they introduced their 1-DIN and 2-DIN screens that had the capability to setup the processor themselves through their graphical environment, the need for the RUX controller became redundant. Thus, they decided to put them in separate boxes and sell them as individual units, hence the 701 combo was born.


----------



## matdotcom2000

bikinpunk said:


> The helix is the better processor IF you're looking to just go with a straight up system layout (ie: no 5.1) and you don't need roadEQ.
> 
> Given most people's needs on this site, the h800 truthfully isn't a very good processor due to the limitations of the DSP features. Especially compared to the helix or mosconi pieces. And I've owned all three.


Ok you have to justify that statement???? In what way.. The H800 has adjusting the eq is in 0.5 steps and more crossover points (to 36db) than both the mosconi and helix??

I wonder out of the 3 who has the better RCA inputs.. I kinda wanna through the 360.3 out there too.


----------



## ErinH

EQ adjustability and non-fixed crossovers. 

Indeed the helix's downfall is the 1db increments. Thats crap. That's why I don't run that unit anymore. But I still preferred it over the h800 for my application. The helix does have adjustable phase on the sub which is cool.


----------



## quality_sound

bigfastmike said:


> Can the Alpine be used to run active fronts, rear fill coax, and subs off Kenwood hu?
> 
> Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2


Yep. And set up like this you can run stereo subs or a mono sub and a center channel.


----------



## quality_sound

Erin - I think the sub phase was left out because it's typically the farthest driver from the listening position and won't need much TA.


----------



## pionkej

quality_sound said:


> Erin - I think the sub phase was left out because it's typically the farthest driver from the listening position and won't need much TA.


Phase adjustment and time alignment are not the same thing.


----------



## oca123

adrockthemc said:


> Next i ran the auto TCR function by placing the mic about 8in from the driver's side headrest and got this result
> 
> Auto_TCR_Result
> 
> Here it looks like this didn't work too well. It basically maxed out the TCR on each speaker. I was hoping that it would lengthen the driver's side and shorten the passenger's side to make more of an even sound stage for the driver but it did not. I will have to research this further when I get more time.


I'm pretty sure ImprintEQ does TCR on its own and that the manual states that you should not run Auto TCR after Imprint.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> EQ adjustability and non-fixed crossovers.
> 
> Indeed the helix's downfall is the 1db increments. Thats crap. That's why I don't run that unit anymore. But I still preferred it over the h800 for my application. The helix does have adjustable phase on the sub which is cool.


step 1 - get out car
step 2 open trunk
step 3 - flip wires on exterior of sub enclosure. :mean:

not a selling point for me on the helix  i reallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllly considered every and i mean EVERYthing on the market. i had a sound card, i played with some custom software found it to much overhead and far to complex for me. i looked into the differences in the helix, the 3sixty.3, the .2, the 701, the ms8, helix c and p (the c is not gone i guess it didn't have a real market) the things I LIKED about the helix were 

1- size
2- potts can be added for both bass control knob and volume control
3- SIZE

i liked the ms-8 for just being easy but obviously, it has bass issues really hard to tune certain setups i found allot of trouble with my gti, probobly does better with sealed sub enclosures, i think it would work a little better but i never got a chance to try that out. It also never got 100% their with the tune and didn't really let me do much TOO the final tune which is why i really wanted to venture out and try some other stuff. 

the alpine I liked because it's alpine and of course their just sexy  it's a proven system, it has experience, far more followers so easy info to get ahold of (hesne this thread) and it was designed for MY application, the 3sixty.3 had all the same perks and didn't reaquire the external hand controller whitch is why it was my first runner for a year and a half. the software ended up being problamatatic (from the few people ive heard who have it, have had issue with the software, i don't know the real problems but i'd rather not find out  ) 



the bit1 and the masconi just lost to me becasue masconi makes their **** far to hard to get ahold of, as well does audison. nobody knows how to use it, and its expensive and under developed from what it was supposed to be because masconi enegneers cut allot of corners from what i heard as far as R&D and jusqt left allot out that the designer of the unit had intended.



these were the things I perosnaly found importent to me, i mean i also looked into who has mroe options, incriments of control, outputs, inputs, types of inputs. looks of course also but they really dont matter you dont really have to match your setup with the processor, because you can hide it anywhere they're so damn small  so thats just my round up and how i felt about them all so i don't wanna hear well..you didn't consider this..yes. yes i did


----------



## subwoofery

matdotcom2000 said:


> Ok you have to justify that statement???? In what way.. The H800 has adjusting the eq is in 0.5 steps and more crossover points (to 36db) than both the mosconi and helix??
> 
> I wonder out of the 3 who has the better RCA inputs.. I kinda wanna through the 360.3 out there too.


Information for all to see  
BitOne TenD VS H800

Kelvin


----------



## pionkej

See my thoughts below:



eviling said:


> step 1 - get out car
> step 2 open trunk
> step 3 - flip wires on exterior of sub enclosure. :mean:
> 
> *Um, that's a polarity swap, not a phase flip. With a polarity swap, the cone moves in with voltage instead of out in but the phase remains the same. With a phase flip...the phase is flipped. Not the same.*
> 
> not a selling point for me on the helix
> 
> *You also realize helix will adjust phase in 22.5-degree phase shifts and not just 180-degree phase swaps? You realize this is important for blending since most people run different crossover points and orders between the sub and midbass which means there is a phase disconnect there?*
> 
> i reallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllly considered every and i mean EVERYthing on the market. i had a sound card, i played with some custom software found it to much overhead and far to complex for me. i looked into the differences in the helix, the 3sixty.3, the .2, the 701, the ms8, helix c and p (the c is not gone i guess it didn't have a real market) the things I LIKED about the helix were
> 
> 1- size
> 2- potts can be added for both bass control knob and volume control
> 3- SIZE
> 
> i liked the ms-8 for just being easy but obviously, it has bass issues really hard to tune certain setups i found allot of trouble with my gti, probobly does better with sealed sub enclosures, i think it would work a little better but i never got a chance to try that out. It also never got 100% their with the tune and didn't really let me do much TOO the final tune which is why i really wanted to venture out and try some other stuff.
> 
> the alpine I liked because it's alpine and of course their just sexy  it's a proven system, it has experience, far more followers so easy info to get ahold of (hesne this thread) and it was designed for MY application, the 3sixty.3 had all the same perks and didn't reaquire the external hand controller whitch is why it was my first runner for a year and a half. the software ended up being problamatatic (from the few people ive heard who have it, have had issue with the software, i don't know the real problems but i'd rather not find out  )
> 
> the bit1 and the masconi just lost to me becasue masconi makes their **** far to hard to get ahold of, as well does audison. nobody knows how to use it, and its expensive and under developed from what it was supposed to be because masconi enegneers cut allot of corners from what i heard as far as R&D and jusqt left allot out that the designer of the unit had intended.
> 
> *Seriously, I got my 6to8 months ago by sending a simple PM to member here. It WASN'T hard at all and WASN'T expensive (or at least any more so than anything else you mentioned is priced). I'd also love to hear where that statement about the engineers ignoring the designer came from, because until I see if from somewhere reputable, I'm going to assume it's just you talking out your ass.*
> 
> these were the things I perosnaly found importent to me, i mean i also looked into who has mroe options, incriments of control, outputs, inputs, types of inputs. looks of course also but they really dont matter you dont really have to match your setup with the processor, because you can hide it anywhere they're so damn small  so thats just my round up and how i felt about them all so i don't wanna hear well..you didn't consider this..yes. yes i did
> 
> *I don't fault you for choosing the H800, but the reasons your gave seem pretty, well, stupid. I didn't see you mention the 5.1 processing or RoadEQ as selling points. What I did see you mention was that it's "sexy" and "proven" (even though Bikinpunk returned his because it had noise issues early on, which isn't different, to me, than the early issues with the Mosconi, Helix, or the 3sixty.3 that you mentioned). Again, nothing wrong with the H800, but I don't think it deserves to be treated like it's the "king" of all the current processors since they all have slight differences that may work better for different people.*


----------



## quality_sound

pionkej said:


> Phase adjustment and time alignment are not the same thing.


Time alignment only exists to put drivers back in phase. Are you thinking of the 180 degree polarity reversal adjustment?


----------



## pionkej

quality_sound said:


> Time alignment only exists to put drivers back in phase. Are you thinking of the 180 degree polarity reversal adjustment?


That's not exactly accurate. Here is something I typed elsewhere:


> Erin,
> 
> I'm glad you seem to have had good results so far with this approach. I got the idea for this from an VERY similar style of setting T/A on DIYMA. The difference is that with "my" approach, you set the T/A at the actual crossover point of the speakers. The thread I lifted the idea from simply states to remove the crossover and play a tone at a point both speakers can cover (1000hz for midbass to midrange for example). The problem with this idea is that crossovers themselves apply a phase shift and you potentially undo the work done the minute XO's are applied.
> 
> I will also say this is an ideal method, to me, if you DON'T have the ability to adjust both delay (T/A) and phase (via all-pass filters of metered phase adjustment) seperately. I'll explain why:
> 
> The purpose of T/A is not to match phase in principle, but to match speaker group delays. For example, your midrange is in your kicks and your midbass in your doors. Your left midbass is 8.6" closer to the center of your head than the midrange. You need to add 0.64ms of delay to match the acoustic centers. You are also using 18db slopes and your -6db point is at 480hz (but you underlap to get there) so you get .1ms of delay difference there as well. You are now at 0.74ms of delay so the GROUP DELAY of the two drivers is equal (note that this is what Erin was finding previously using impulse response measurements).
> 
> The problem is that the crossover chosen (overlapping, underlapping, or using various types/slopes), the enclosure used, and the surrounding environment (car in this case) can cause the phase to shift as well. This is what phase adjustment is for. An all-pass filter adjusts the phase on the low-pass side of a speakers frequency range without adjusting the magnitude. Variable phase adjustment (dial going from 0-180, or adjusting in 5/10/15/etc. steps) is simply an easily adjustable all-pass filter. The problem is, equipment that has this ability is few and far between. Most will perform the standard 0-180 swap. Beyond that, I know that PPI had an external unit that could do this (but was prone to noise from what I've read), some O/S amps could (no idea which), the Helix can do it on the sub channel (in like 22db steps), the new Zapco DSP software shows it can on all channels (in 45degree steps), the PS8 lists that it can use all-pass filters (user set phase adjustment), and several of the pro-audio pieces can do it (DCX2496 and RPM88 come to mind). So, ideally, you would set all speakers so their group delay was matched and use phase shaping to match the phase of both speakers at the crossover point. The problem is that, like mentioned above, options of doing so are few and far between.
> 
> So what did Erin do then? He matched the phase at the crossover point and said "damn the group delay".  I say that in jest since the net change on his midbass to midrange was only 0.22ms. It's my opinion that it's better to have a smooth phase transition at the crossover point than it is to worry about a .22ms delay between the two speakers everyone else. What does that last sentence mean? It means that everywhere beyond the crossover point his drivers are out of sync by 0.22ms and, yes, I still think this is the lesser of two evils if you don't have access to phase adjustment independent of time alignment.
> 
> **Note, I had previously asked myself why the Helix processor only had this feature available on the subwoofer channel. The answer, in my opinion, relates to ITD vs. ILD and physical wavelength. First, as we transition to the ILD range, phase and time become less important. This occurs as frequency increases. Another factor is the length of the wave itself. As the wavelength becomes shorter (which happens when frequency increases), the environment can affect the systems phase response (via reflections) much more easily. If you have an omnimic (other equipment may be able to do this too), you can verify point #2. If you check the phase of your sub(s) and move the mic around, the phase will change very little, possibly not at all. Now perform this on your midbass/midrange and tweeter. You will see that at around 1000hz or so the phase starts to go crazy and it will vary greatly by moving your mic even the slightest amount. Basically, there is a definite benefit to being able to match phase from sub to midbass/midrange and from midbass to midrange (if running a 3-way system) but not much beyond that.


----------



## eviling

pionkej said:


> See my thoughts below:


I appriciate that you took the time to help point out things that would also be a plus for this unit, but like i said at the bottom, that wasn't intended as a true comparason but a couple end thoughts when i made my final desician, after already considering many of the others. the reason i didn't mention the on the fly tuning as a plus is because i don't tune on the road, i find it completley dangeriouse, perhaps this interface is capable of doing it with one hand with out looking, true. but ive never done it so it was never in my mind as a must. granted ive heard its a good way to get a tune, i just don't think it's safe at all, ive hit to many things in my driving years to not know better. 

some of your other thoughts are true, and yes i knew they did incrimental phase shifting not jsut 180, but i was just beingt he smart ass that i am, because i don't feel an ear is gonna pick those kind of things up. maybe if your trying to tweak your system into perfection after doing it for years..sure but for general use such a feature is pretty useless and i could see why it woudln't be a priority to alpine to mentain this as i'm sure they chose to include something else and focus on soemthing that was more importent. 

far as it being a defective unit out the door, my point was alpine has the experience with the 700\701, and it's predasesors, in fact i believe alpine has had at least 10 similer processors in this market area over the years, perhaps i'm a bit off might be 6 or 8 idk. but their are a bunch is my point and they have been working on things for years. the h800 has been out for a year and a half to general public if you wanted one like bik, but he faced the beta testing. i'm presuming they've done SOMETHING since than before releasing in american market that fixed these problems, i never really read back to find that out because i believed the odds were high that they fixed some stuff and i was confortible with that risk, theirs a risk of a defect in every electronic you buy, their inherently fragile in their very nature.


----------



## quality_sound

pionkej said:


> That's not exactly accurate. Here is something I typed elsewhere:


Andy typed out a great post in another thread that really gets into phase and time alignment. I'll see of I can find it again and link it here.


----------



## oca123

I could be wrong, but I think that to most of us here, time alignment stands for delaying the signal going to a speaker to make the reproduced sound arrive at our ears at the same time as the sound produced by another speaker.
After doing this many times we eventually forget that we're only doing this for the crossover point, since speakers themselves are not "time aligned" in that they introduce linear phase shift or group delay.

in other words, with our delays, what we do is play with time of arrival, which in turn affects the phase of the signal, and we do this to obtain as much of a linear phase shift as possible at the crossover point. the speakers, due to their nature, are not time-aligned anyway and will introduce phase shift.


----------



## Shinju

I see a lot of confusion between the difference of mechanical phase and acoustic phase.


----------



## eviling

oca123 said:


> I could be wrong, but I think that to most of us here, time alignment stands for delaying the signal going to a speaker to make the reproduced sound arrive at our ears at the same time as the sound produced by another speaker.
> After doing this many times we eventually forget that we're only doing this for the crossover point, since speakers themselves are not "time aligned" in that they introduce linear phase shift or group delay.
> 
> in other words, with our delays, what we do is play with time of arrival, which in turn affects the phase of the signal, and we do this to obtain as much of a linear phase shift as possible at the crossover point. the speakers, due to their nature, are not time-aligned anyway and will introduce phase shift.


I was only able to some what follow this lol it feels like your missing a few things to help dumb these concepts down

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


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## timmay77

Well, magically, my HAT L1V2's are blown. It's amazing that they were fine when I installed the H800, and now are destined for the junk pile. So far, I am not very happy with the H800. My H701 never chewed up my tweeters.....

W910
H800 + C800
PDX4.150 - HAT L3's and L8's
PDX-5 - HAT L1's and rear fill (Alpine type S 5.25") (sub channel not used)
Memphis 16-MCD1000d - 2 Alpine type R 12's

My L1's and L3's are crossed over on the H800 on channels 1&2 to play 160hz-20khz. I have an Audio Control 2XS with a custom made chip so the L3's are the low pass playing up to 5.5khz, and the L1's are the high pass playing 5.5khz-20khz. My L8's are playing on channels 3&4, 50hz-160hz, and the subs are on channels 7&8, 20hz-50hz. The rear fill is playing channels 5&6, 90hz-20khz.

Any suggestions on how my tweeters blew?


----------



## timmay77

eviling said:


> ive played L3's, and ive used allot of hybrid gear, none of his mids except the l4's can play that low and thats BOTTOM BOTTom that i'd even play those, or any mids. i beleive scott ran some L4se's down to like 160 but i might be mistaken. idk what he even runs these days, i think he does the iasca thing not meca though. I dont know of any mids that size that play that low man. idk about tweeters, you did mention a passive cross over, so are your bi-amping this cross over because maybe thats your problem, depending on how that cross over you descibed works.
> 
> but far as the L3's, i played with em last fall before i tore my system out. i had a pair laying around..i forget i think i picked em up in a trade for some reason. but anyways, i found they did play pretty low for their size but somwhere in like 350 i felt it wasn't to great, so i'd start their.


?????

Huh?

I have no issues with the L3's. They play fantastic at my crossover points. My points were suggested to me by several people, including Scott at HAT....

My problem is my blown L1's.....


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## quality_sound

I don't see how the H800 caused the tweeters to blow. Even if it had a MASSIVE EQ boost the frequencies they are playing wouldn't ever send enough signal to them to cook the coils. Are you sure you don't have some RCAs swapped somewhere?


----------



## timmay77

quality_sound said:


> I don't see how the H800 caused the tweeters to blow. Even if it had a MASSIVE EQ boost the frequencies they are playing wouldn't ever send enough signal to them to cook the coils. Are you sure you don't have some RCAs swapped somewhere?


Positive. I double checked and triple checked. When I installed the H800, I removed the H701. That was the only difference. That's why I am chalking it up to the H800.


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## quality_sound

That's WAY premature and likely coincidence. Have you looked at the amp that's driving them? Maybe the outputs went? I'm not saying it CAN'T be the H800 just that it's very unlikely.


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## timmay77

quality_sound said:


> That's WAY premature and likely coincidence. Have you looked at the amp that's driving them? Maybe the outputs went? I'm not saying it CAN'T be the H800 just that it's very unlikely.


Yes. Hooked up a spare set of tweeters. Everything is working correctly. Popped in my test tones, crossover is working correctly. I had everything set up to tune the car, including my TruRTA set up. Wasn't getting anything in the tweeter range. I found out why!


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## timmay77

In a recent email exchange with Scott, he mentioned something about PPTC's? Some sort of inline fuses to protect the tweeters? I am having a hard time finding them on the Parts-Express website where he suggested I look.

Any help?


----------



## Shinju

timmay77 said:


> Yes. Hooked up a spare set of tweeters. Everything is working correctly. Popped in my test tones, crossover is working correctly. I had everything set up to tune the car, including my TruRTA set up. Wasn't getting anything in the tweeter range. I found out why!


Do you have any inline tweeter protection? Sounds like your amplifier spiked and toasted them.

I have never heard of a processor being the main culprate of blowing a speaker unless it was user error. Unless the Processor spiked some sort of preamp voltage then I do not see how this could be possible.

I run tweeter protection on my Imagine's and even Scott suggested to anyone using his tweeters in any of this sets to research some sort of protection.

I have the part numbers for the Dayton Pro Audio caps that I use for mine a 30.00 dollar investment can save you 500+ in burnt tweeters.


_ive played L3's, and ive used allot of hybrid gear, none of his mids except the l4's can play that low and thats BOTTOM BOTTom that i'd even play those, or any mids. i beleive scott ran some L4se's down to like 160 but i might be mistaken. idk what he even runs these days, i think he does the iasca thing not meca though. I dont know of any mids that size that play that low man. idk about tweeters, you did mention a passive cross over, so are your bi-amping this cross over because maybe thats your problem, depending on how that cross over you descibed works.

but far as the L3's, i played with em last fall before i tore my system out. i had a pair laying around..i forget i think i picked em up in a trade for some reason. but anyways, i found they did play pretty low for their size but somwhere in like 350 i felt it wasn't to great, so i'd start their. _


I am going to call shinanigans on this, I have my L3's running at 110hz - 9k and they play with out any issues at all. This was suggested by Bill Pleasent of HAT and who is also my neighbor and good friend and LONG time HAT competitor and professional reach a round master! 


Again my ONLY issue with the H800 is the fact that I cannot control my Sub Level Via Rux or my deck, Otherwise I am pretty happy with it.


----------



## Shinju

timmay77 said:


> In a recent email exchange with Scott, he mentioned something about PPTC's? Some sort of inline fuses to protect the tweeters? I am having a hard time finding them on the Parts-Express website where he suggested I look.
> 
> Any help?



If you are only running one set of tweeters you will need 2 of each of these.

I run mine on the + side but they are non polarity so you can do it in the - side as well.

I will try and find my photos of these.

027-440 DAYTON AUDIO DMPC-30 30UF 250V POLYPROPYLENE CAPACITOR 

027-450 DAYTON AUDIO DFFC-0.01 0.01UF 400V BY-PASS CAPACITOR


----------



## timmay77

Shinju said:


> Do you have any inline tweeter protection? Sounds like your amplifier spiked and toasted them.
> 
> I have never heard of a processor being the main culprate of blowing a speaker unless it was user error. Unless the Processor spiked some sort of preamp voltage then I do not see how this could be possible.
> 
> I run tweeter protection on my Imagine's and even Scott suggested to anyone using his tweeters in any of this sets to research some sort of protection.
> 
> I have the part numbers for the Dayton Pro Audio caps that I use for mine a 30.00 dollar investment can save you 500+ in burnt tweeters.
> 
> 
> _ive played L3's, and ive used allot of hybrid gear, none of his mids except the l4's can play that low and thats BOTTOM BOTTom that i'd even play those, or any mids. i beleive scott ran some L4se's down to like 160 but i might be mistaken. idk what he even runs these days, i think he does the iasca thing not meca though. I dont know of any mids that size that play that low man. idk about tweeters, you did mention a passive cross over, so are your bi-amping this cross over because maybe thats your problem, depending on how that cross over you descibed works.
> 
> but far as the L3's, i played with em last fall before i tore my system out. i had a pair laying around..i forget i think i picked em up in a trade for some reason. but anyways, i found they did play pretty low for their size but somwhere in like 350 i felt it wasn't to great, so i'd start their. _
> 
> 
> I am going to call shinanigans on this, I have my L3's running at 110hz - 9k and they play with out any issues at all. This was suggested by Bill Pleasent of HAT and who is also my neighbor and good friend and LONG time HAT competitor and professional reach a round master!
> 
> 
> Again my ONLY issue with the H800 is the fact that I cannot control my Sub Level Via Rux or my deck, Otherwise I am pretty happy with it.


LOL. I don't SERIOUSLY think my H800 blew my tweeters, it's just my luck though. My system sounded great and worked perfectly until I installed the H800, now I am having all kinds of problems. Damn the luck....

I do not have inline protection, that is what my last post was about. Asking for help finding some. Scott suggested it, so I am going to buy it. I just need some key terms to search for, or some help if possible. Scott stated they could be had on Parts-Express for $1.50 a pop, which sounds great, I just can't find them!

EDIT: Scott just sent me this link:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=071-258


----------



## Shinju

timmay77 said:


> LOL. I don't SERIOUSLY think my H800 blew my tweeters, it's just my luck though. My system sounded great and worked perfectly until I installed the H800, now I am having all kinds of problems. Damn the luck....
> 
> I do not have inline protection, that is what my last post was about. Asking for help finding some. Scott suggested it, so I am going to buy it. I just need some key terms to search for, or some help if possible. Scott stated they could be had on Parts-Express for $1.50 a pop, which sounds great, I just can't find them!
> 
> EDIT: Scott just sent me this link:
> 
> Raychem/TE Connectivity RXE075 0.75A Polyswitch 071-258


These are what I made and use.

Picture is crappy but they are installed now so this is the best shot I have.


----------



## eviling

Installed my h800 today and my amps. Still need to finish wiring and install the computer and mount the mids and tweeters. Need pods for mids so they'll take awhile so this will be awhile before I get to test it out 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## timmay77




----------



## eviling

ooo nice. i was thinking of wheather i should mount mine, the mounting does look easy and small so it can work in allot of places i jsut don't know :\ a place like that would be perfect.


----------



## 2LOUD2OLD

Shinju said:


> Again my ONLY issue with the H800 is the fact that I cannot control my Sub Level Via Rux or my deck, Otherwise I am pretty happy with it.


you can control sub level via the RUX, perhaps you are still running an old version of the firmware for either the H800 or the RUX? I only got sub level after doing the latest firmware updates, you just need to press the dial in on the RUX to get to sub level


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> ooo nice. i was thinking of wheather i should mount mine, the mounting does look easy and small so it can work in allot of places i jsut don't know :\ a place like that would be perfect.


It's bigger than it looks. It's basically a DIN footprint. Well, not quite, but close.


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## timmay77

I was surprised how much smaller it was than the RUX controller for the H701. Very glad though, I really wanted to mount it in the location it is in now.


----------



## Shinju

2LOUD2OLD said:


> you can control sub level via the RUX, perhaps you are still running an old version of the firmware for either the H800 or the RUX? I only got sub level after doing the latest firmware updates, you just need to press the dial in on the RUX to get to sub level



I have upgraded the firmware on the RUX from 1.0 to 2.0, the h800 is still at 1.0 as I have heard there was some issues with 2.0 on the processor?

Can anyone elabrate on this?

Also I have my Controller dash mounted like the 701 I had, I am using the 701
DIN kit as well, for the most part it works a little smalller then the c701 but works just as good!


----------



## timmay77

Does anyone know the update differences on the RUX and the H800?


----------



## EtaZeta

So I am driving along today and my entire system shuts down (yes I was running it loud, but not excessive or maxed). My H800 remote out controls all other components so when everything shut down I figured it was the remote out or at least something H800 related. 

Got home and checked the fuse at the battery - good. Checked fuses in the distro block - good. All connections looked good. So I turned the key back on and everything was still off. I hit the button on the RUX and everything lit up. Only problem was all settings were lost. I will have to start from scratch on the H800. No big deal as I haven't started tuning until this weekend.

But the big question - why would the H800 oddly shut off and lose all stored data???


----------



## eviling

EtaZeta said:


> So I am driving along today and my entire system shuts down (yes I was running it loud, but not excessive or maxed). My H800 remote out controls all other components so when everything shut down I figured it was the remote out or at least something H800 related.
> 
> Got home and checked the fuse at the battery - good. Checked fuses in the distro block - good. All connections looked good. So I turned the key back on and everything was still off. I hit the button on the RUX and everything lit up. Only problem was all settings were lost. I will have to start from scratch on the H800. No big deal as I haven't started tuning until this weekend.
> 
> But the big question - why would the H800 oddly shut off and lose all stored data???


back up your tunes


----------



## EtaZeta

eviling said:


> back up your tunes


You mean lower the volume? Nah, couldn't have been that as it was loud but nowhere near being an issue. And if it shut down due to volume I would think it would just shut off. Not completely reset.


----------



## eviling

EtaZeta said:


> You mean lower the volume? Nah, couldn't have been that as it was loud but nowhere near being an issue. And if it shut down due to volume I would think it would just shut off. Not completely reset.


No.back up your settings to a computer

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


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## EtaZeta

Oh yeah yeah, I gotcha. I definitely plan to do that. I read in this tread that with a loss of 12v power the settings vanish. So I am inclined to think that's what happened. However, all wires are in tact and solid. Plus I didn't do a single thing to it - it shut off, I killed the truck, cranked back up and it was fine. Leads me to believe there was something internal.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## Shinju

Just an FYI to anyone running this Piece and has mismatched firmware versions IE the RUX or h800.

You need to have them match for total functionality rather its ver 1.0 on both or 2.0 on both. You cannot have ver 1.0 on the rux or 2.0 on the processor or vice versa it will not function correctly and you will get false positives like lack of subwoofer control and or tuning issues using the RUX.

This is something that is not mentioned in the manual at least not that I saw. And this myth about version 2.0 on the processor being messed up and not sounding correctly I did not have this problem in fact with ver 2.0 it actually sounds more dynamic and tonality got a little better and I haven’t touched the EQ on ver 1.0 or 2.0 yet just crossover points that have remained the same.

My sub bass as some have mentioned being week from 25hz and below with ver 2.0 again I did not witness this issue I test 20hz with IASCA disc tracks 5 and 6 and both of them are 20hz and below and were felt and played just fine like my 701 but with more definition.

Now that I got all my ducks in a row it’s time to bust out my Coustic RTA-33 and do some EQ work!

Oh and here is a shot of my c800 install.


----------



## quality_sound

Is the update on Alpine USA's site or are we still getting it from the UK or Australia?


----------



## Shinju

quality_sound said:


> Is the update on Alpine USA's site or are we still getting it from the UK or Australia?


I am using the provided updates that were packed in the software alpine provided for the PC to h800 tuning program.

I have not downloaded anything from the net.


----------



## quality_sound

Ah. Mine was purchased before they were available here so I don't have that software. Hmm...


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## Shinju

I can extract it off the disc and upload it or email it if you like, BUT I am not responsible for any errors that might happen while you flash your RUX and h800.

Not saying anything will happen but gotta put that disclamer out!


----------



## evo9

quality_sound said:


> Is the update on Alpine USA's site or are we still getting it from the UK or Australia?


Australia! They have them on the support page.


----------



## quality_sound

Shinju said:


> I can extract it off the disc and upload it or email it if you like, BUT I am not responsible for any errors that might happen while you flash your RUX and h800.
> 
> Not saying anything will happen but gotta put that disclamer out!


Can you just shoot me the exact revision numbers? Then I can check mine and see which version I have. I know it's been update onced already. 



evo9 said:


> Australia! They have them on the support page.


That's what I figured. I'll give it a look and see.


----------



## eviling

heh, mine only came with a sound disk and the software. did somebody say something about a disk for firmware updating? :\ i got disk version 1 which has 1.00 and 2.100 software on it. it also had it for different langages, so idk maybe i got an older one?


also the software keeps crashing, does it want the h800 plugged in when you run the software or what? I thought it might be because i have buisness windows on my main computer so i went to the tablet that i plan on calabrating the unit with and the tablet crashes the software too :\


----------



## Shinju

eviling said:


> heh, mine only came with a sound disk and the software. did somebody say something about a disk for firmware updating? :\ i got disk version 1 which has 1.00 and 2.100 software on it. it also had it for different langages, so idk maybe i got an older one?
> 
> 
> also the software keeps crashing, does it want the h800 plugged in when you run the software or what? I thought it might be because i have buisness windows on my main computer so i went to the tablet that i plan on calabrating the unit with and the tablet crashes the software too :\



Thats the only firmware updates for the US models and they are current. And I can load up the sound manager on my Lanovo notebook with out it being attached to the unit no problem and I can also change settings and whatnot and save to a file so that I can load it up on the processor when I do attach it. 

Sounds like you need to uninstall and start over.


----------



## eviling

Shinju said:


> Thats the only firmware updates for the US models and they are current. And I can load up the sound manager on my Lanovo notebook with out it being attached to the unit no problem and I can also change settings and whatnot and save to a file so that I can load it up on the processor when I do attach it.
> 
> Sounds like you need to uninstall and start over.


yes but im no amature with a computer, ive already uninstalled and updated all my drivers on both computers, uninstallled restarted and retried in both systetsm and even redoanloded it from the disk several times and re transfered it to my hard drive for the tablet. the tablet is windows 7 home premium and the computer is 7 buisness but both crash on load :\ weirdest thing. ive never seen a healthy program act like this. 









just found out why. the one thing both computers have in common, 64 bit operasting system, this is a true bumble **** kind of moment for alpine. seriouse are you kidding me your not 64 bit compatable? what is it 2001? what the ****, i dont wanna run VMware to run this, and its a massive pain int he ass to import, install software into a VM envirment, i really don't wanna **** with it.





quickaudi07 said:


> After looking at the manual of the unit I came across this...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That means it will work on any 32 bit system.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk



RTFM lol I fail'd at that



this is the kind of pain in the ass i'm talkking about, just to set this up to run this program i have to do alllllll this becasue i dont have an iso i'm pulling it off a disk, i have to install the vircual machine, i have to run it. fortunatly VMware is pretty foward, its been awhile since ive played with it lol but you can tether USB devices through the software into that envirment which should make getting the software inside pretty easy, rather than editing files in the virtual machine folders.










for those who don't know, that VM software is free and easy to get - 

https://my.vmware.com/web/vmware/free#desktop_end_user_computing/vmware_player/4_0


you can get the imgburn software for free its freeware, for the benefit of techys  its nifty software. you can take any disk and rip a file into an iso and many other things including creating disks from iso's (if your not on windows 7 this is nifty)


----------



## quality_sound

If you have 7 Pro it has the emulator built in. I upgraded from home premium to get it and now it runs great.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> If you have 7 Pro it has the emulator built in. I upgraded from home premium to get it and now it runs great.


I have home premium on my tablet which is what i would use to tune it since its mobile.


----------



## quality_sound

Yeah, you'd have to upgrade. Home premium won't do it but you can get the upgrade from Amazon for $80. Piece of cake.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> Yeah, you'd have to upgrade. Home premium won't do it but you can get the upgrade from Amazon for $80. Piece of cake.


so i pay 80$# to use it when i can just use the hand controller to do it? **** it. i might even sell it, RF finily made some shipments, this thing pisses me off that it's not 64 bit compatable. but i'll at least give it a chance first.


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> so i pay 80$# to use it when i can just use the hand controller to do it? **** it. i might even sell it, RF finily made some shipments, this thing pisses me off that it's not 64 bit compatable. but i'll at least give it a chance first.


Yeah, it stupid that it's not 64-bit compatible. It it's whatever. I have hundreds, if not thousands of dollars of old wire in my garage do $80 for a program upgrade isn't really a big deal. Plus, the software is a bit more flexible and a lot faster.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> Yeah, it stupid that it's not 64-bit compatible. It it's whatever. I have hundreds, if not thousands of dollars of old wire in my garage do $80 for a program upgrade isn't really a big deal. Plus, the software is a bit more flexible and a lot faster.


well that must be nice to have so much money. must be nice to be rich but we all don't have stock of scrap wire for rainy days.


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> well that must be nice to have so much money. must be nice to be rich but we all don't have stock of scrap wire for rainy days.


 Dude, no reason to get all pissy. That was all accumulated over years, maybe a decade or more. The point was we ALL have excess stuff from old builds that is essentially thrown away or gear that we try then sell for a loss. In the grand scheme of things, $80 shouldn't be a deal breaker. 

Sheesh...


----------



## eviling

I'm just annoyed that I went with this unit and in not happy with my decission yet. I knew I wouldn't like this unit blah should of waited for rf unit

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> I'm just annoyed that I went with this unit and in not happy with my decission yet.* I knew I wouldn't like this unit* blah should of waited for rf unit
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


And that's why you don't like it. The 64-bit issue and need for the RUX with an OEM HU has been well-documented. Even since before I got mine. It is annoying but the processor in and of itself is great. You don't NEED the software since you have the RUX, it's just faster.


----------



## Shinju

eviling said:


> I'm just annoyed that I went with this unit and in not happy with my decission yet. I knew I wouldn't like this unit blah should of waited for rf unit
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


kind of a rushed assessment on this unit since you haven't even powered up and played with it in a live built yet.

A lot of these processor PC software are designed for 32bit as it is far easier to program for and most non PC savvy folks run 32bit for easier compatibility.

Also sit back and relax man you seen to take things far to personally, no one here is attacking you or pushing their clout in your face. Imo finish your build play with the processor in a real sitting and report back.


----------



## eviling

this build has taken allot of stress one me and taken many months to accumlate funds for stuff so it's very annoying to have to invest more money and more money and more money after awhile. i suppose car audio is just getting to me. my intends are not to pick fights


----------



## timmay77

eviling said:


> this build has taken allot of stress one me and taken many months to accumlate funds for stuff so it's very annoying to have to invest more money and more money and more money after awhile. i suppose car audio is just getting to me. my intends are not to pick fights


Any time you plan out car/stereo projects, figure your budget, then double it. That's what it ALWAYS costs. I never keep receipts for my car, I'd cry if I did.....


----------



## quality_sound

Exactly. I EASILY spend more on wiring and accessories than I plan on. It's frustrating and sometimes I want to quit but at that point I just take a week off, relax, and get back to work.


----------



## EtaZeta

I think I'm abandoning this unit and going Bitone. The Imprint sounds decent but cuts my volume in half. Plus the Bitone would replace my H800 and my need for the Cleansweep. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## quality_sound

So stop using imprint and tune the H800 like you would the Bit1. Having owned both I will tell you the H800 is a MUCH better sounding unit.


----------



## EtaZeta

quality_sound said:


> So stop using imprint and tune the H800 like you would the Bit1. Having owned both I will tell you the H800 is a MUCH better sounding unit.


I don't disagree with you at all. And I may not do the Bitone either. My biggest issue with the H800 has been volume reduction. Last night I was playing with levels and with everything near max it just wasn't that loud. Bypassed the H800 and half volume is too much. So I know the power exists and my system is capable. 

And yes I have adjusted the input sensitivity, the multi channel output, and the AUX gain levels. It just seems to reduce volume. And IMPRINT is even worse. 

To your comment about tuning, I have been looking for someone in Louisiana to help me with that. I refuse to take it to a shop because I know what will happen. They'll tune it while I browse the store for three hours, then $300 later I have a tuned vehicle that sounds good to them, hopefully to me, and I have learned nothing from it. 

Maybe I should just do an MS-8. Honestly my level of frustration is high enough to donate my gear to some lucky kid and put my Jawbone Big Jambox on the f'n dash.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


----------



## quality_sound

If I was in southern LA I'd give you a hand. I'm visiting my girlfriend in NW LA. If you can make it out to the Texas GTG/comp I'm sure we can get it sorted out and get you a good base tune.


----------



## EtaZeta

quality_sound said:


> If I was in southern LA I'd give you a hand. I'm visiting my girlfriend in NW LA. If you can make it out to the Texas GTG/comp I'm sure we can get it sorted out and get you a good base tune.


When is that?


----------



## quality_sound

I'd have to look. There's a thread in the get togethers forum.


----------



## 00flash00

Hi my friend

I need you help for connection for my NVE-M300P to PXA-H800 to IVA-D800
now a have this connection-
NVE is connected to KCE-900E then is connected to IVA. Into KCE is connected to "guide output" rca from procesor. That is all? Or must connect any remote cable from procesor?

Thank you ... I have big instalation, but sound in navigation is my big problem ... Now in rux setting is NAV OFF but i have route navigation quiets my sound ... What is this? NAV off is off so why the music quiets me? Its anywhere option for NAV MUTE?


----------



## timmay77

EtaZeta said:


> I don't disagree with you at all. And I may not do the Bitone either. My biggest issue with the H800 has been volume reduction. Last night I was playing with levels and with everything near max it just wasn't that loud. Bypassed the H800 and half volume is too much. So I know the power exists and my system is capable.
> 
> And yes I have adjusted the input sensitivity, the multi channel output, and the AUX gain levels. It just seems to reduce volume. And IMPRINT is even worse.
> 
> To your comment about tuning, I have been looking for someone in Louisiana to help me with that. I refuse to take it to a shop because I know what will happen. They'll tune it while I browse the store for three hours, then $300 later I have a tuned vehicle that sounds good to them, hopefully to me, and I have learned nothing from it.
> 
> Maybe I should just do an MS-8. Honestly my level of frustration is high enough to donate my gear to some lucky kid and put my Jawbone Big Jambox on the f'n dash.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


I haven't had any of these issues. Seems odd, almost like a setting is off somewhere. There are so many level/volume settings, I wouldn't be surprised!


----------



## TitanCCBT3

Eta Zeta. Any progress with your setup? I have been having similar issues with imprint as well. Sound is bass heavy and decreased volume. I have been tuning by ear with some success. I am also using it as a oem integration unit although I recently put my cleansweep and audio control LC6 back in ( not together) as a LOC then into the Pxa h800. All that accomplished was a little more noise. Let me know if you find someone to tune the Pxa h800. I'm in your vicinity , south of the lake


----------



## oca123

KenB129 said:


> A pro installed the speakers and he does very good work, but at this point I'm going to have to learn how to get into the doors and do these things myself. I can easily verify amp connections and the tweeters, but the mids require door removal.
> 
> I do get the impression that imprint is _trying _to get the stage correct, because on some CDs the voice goes upfront a little bit, but most of the time it cannot be localized at all.


You really shouldn't have to. I think you said you had a mic and preamp... in that case, I would learn how to run sweeps with something like Holmimpulse (free) - its very educational. Look at the resulting impulse response, it will tell you which drivers are in phase/out of phase, and it also helps with time alignment. If you tweak on it for a couple of hours you will also figure out how to plot the phase throughout your system, and you can also measure THD, etc. (though remember you're measuring total distortion, including microphone distortion)

It could be the way your speakers are aimed causing comb filtering, but I really don't know much about that.

I am having issues with imprint, too. It worked flawlessly the first time I ran it, but we're tinkerers here and I moved things around and now I can't get it to sound right at all. Voices sound metallic, and imaging sucks. Also I can't figure out why it does T/A the way it does and why it won't align individual components of a 3-way system individually but rather assigns the same delay to all speakers on the left channel and all speakers on the right channel.

Technically imprint should be able to do more than any of us can do manually since it uses FIR filters that look like they may be doing something in the time domain as well.


----------



## oca123

timmay77 said:


> I haven't had any of these issues. Seems odd, almost like a setting is off somewhere. There are so many level/volume settings, I wouldn't be surprised!


I had a similar issue with a BitOne, and that was because it was not getting enough juice. What voltage is your H800 showing?


----------



## oca123

eviling said:


> I have home premium on my tablet which is what i would use to tune it since its mobile.


I have a samsung slate 7 that came with windows business, but I find it hard to tune it using a stylus.

Regardless no need to ugprade if you have home premium. From your screenshots it looks like you wouldn't have too much of an issue popping on the pirate bay and getting a VMWare Player image with XP on it.


----------



## oca123

eviling said:


> this build has taken allot of stress one me and taken many months to accumlate funds for stuff so it's very annoying to have to invest more money and more money and more money after awhile. i suppose car audio is just getting to me. my intends are not to pick fights


Invest? Puuh-lease  We're not the wife! Our equipment does not appreciate as far as I know... this is an expense. Investment is what you call it in front of your wife! Get ya **** right homeboy!

Seriously though - it's a great processor. For 2.1 stereo, it's blah, but if you wanna dabble with DTS, dolby, etc. it's got tons of cool settings.


----------



## quality_sound

oca123 said:


> I have a samsung slate 7 that came with windows business, but I find it hard to tune it using a stylus.
> 
> Regardless no need to ugprade if you have home premium. From your screenshots it looks like you wouldn't have too much of an issue popping on the pirate bay and getting a VMWare Player image with XP on it.


Not true. I had home premium and it wouldn't run the emulator. I HAD to move to W7 Professional. If you have a 32-bit system then you can be on whichever OS you want though.


----------



## Thomasb1

Hi,
I have a question about running the pxa-h800 + iva-d310. No Rux. I assume I would do setup with a laptop. After the laptop is removed, how much control over the h800 is available via the d310 screen and controls? Is it a similar level of control as you have on a h701, or is the d310 too old to adjust the h800 via the d310 touchscreen interface?
Thanks.


----------



## matdotcom2000

I have been debating to either get a h800 or a dsp6 for my beamer to run an analog line... based strictly on sound quality.. What would you do.. I am not worried about flexability, crossovers, size, usability, just strictly sound what would you choose???


----------



## oca123

quality_sound said:


> Not true. I had home premium and it wouldn't run the emulator. I HAD to move to W7 Professional. If you have a 32-bit system then you can be on whichever OS you want though.


VMWare, not Virtual PC. VMWare Player will run on windows 7 home edition.


----------



## n_olympios

Thomasb1 said:


> Hi,
> I have a question about running the pxa-h800 + iva-d310. No Rux. I assume I would do setup with a laptop. After the laptop is removed, how much control over the h800 is available via the d310 screen and controls? Is it a similar level of control as you have on a h701, or is the d310 too old to adjust the h800 via the d310 touchscreen interface?
> Thanks.


Volume, sub volume, Defeat, preset selection. I think that's it (via AiNet of course).


----------



## quality_sound

oca123 said:


> VMWare, not Virtual PC. VMWare Player will run on windows 7 home edition.


Ahhhh, yes it will. I tried it and didn't care for it. Maybe it's my laptop but I found it slow and a ***** to set up. Virtual PC was a piece of cake.


----------



## TitanCCBT3

Looking for some help/opinions

Current setup is factory HU with PXA H800 as oem integration going to pdxF4 in 2way mode (front) supplying Polk audio MM 6501 components. The rears are 6501's as well bi amped with pdxV9 with single polk audio mm 10 inch sub. My main question is should I use a LOC prior to the pxah800 or go directly into the Pxa, will the added component add more noise and is it needed? Also is it better to run the front stage biamped active or should I bridge the pdxf4 and use the passive crossovers. Any thoughts on good crossover settings for the pxah800 ? I keep changing things around and seemed to have muddied everything up. Any advice would be greatly appreciated


----------



## quality_sound

I'd run the LOC. If you're concerned about the time, try letting Imprint do it's thing. I'd run the front active.


----------



## TitanCCBT3

Thanks for the advice. Do you think there is a sizable difference between factory HU and aftermarket HU ? I am contemplating getting aftermarket HU but really like the function and stock features of current setup, besides no one wants to steal what ihave now.


----------



## bgalaxy

My 800 and controller just came in on Friday. Sadly I still have a few projects in front of putting it in


----------



## quality_sound

TitanCCBT3 said:


> Thanks for the advice. Do you think there is a sizable difference between factory HU and aftermarket HU ? I am contemplating getting aftermarket HU but really like the function and stock features of current setup, besides no one wants to steal what ihave now.


If you're running. A good quality LOC like an Audio Control piece would greatly help. Realistically, if you can run anything with Ai-Net or an Alpine with optical it will help a lot. If you're running RCA inputs the it won't make a huge difference.


----------



## eviling

oca123 said:


> Invest? Puuh-lease  We're not the wife! Our equipment does not appreciate as far as I know... this is an expense. Investment is what you call it in front of your wife! Get ya **** right homeboy!
> 
> Seriously though - it's a great processor. For 2.1 stereo, it's blah, but if you wanna dabble with DTS, dolby, etc. it's got tons of cool settings.


a personal investment :X


----------



## chiragh

*i just got H800 ... which will be used with w502 

But point is am unable to switch it on , both Ai net cable + optical cable is attached !! 

My version is V1.003 and the software which i have is V1.100 . 

I downloaded V1.003 from Australian website 

when i tried upload V1.003 over V1.100 i nothing happens after disconnecting USB and the software asks for upgrade again !! 

I reset Head and H800 , but no use 

What could be the flaw ? *


----------



## soundcontrol

I was a huge Alpine fan for years but recently feel they leave much to be desired in the HU market these days. At one time I really wanted the H701 but having to get the remote separate along with the price increase when it was discontinued made it a distant memory. When I sold my CDA-7995 and went with a newer Kenwood Excelon unit I continued to look for my next new processor and was excited about the new H800 until I saw the price along with the remote being sold separate.

I then started looking at the PXE600 which had awful reviews then the PXE660 which fared much better. I then saw the RF 360 and 360.2 and that was what really peaked my interest.

Went with the 360.2 and have to say I was amazed. Very easy to use, a ton of audio features, very easy to setup and tweak. New or used the price is well worth what you get. I got mine used off ebay for $150ish shipped. 

The 360.3 seems to be even better with some nice little upgrades as well. Its great having an eq like this that uses your radio volume control and not off the remote of the newly installed eq. At this time I'd have to say Alpine just doesn't do it for me anymore with what they currently offer.


----------



## quality_sound

soundcontrol said:


> I was a huge Alpine fan for years but recently feel they leave much to be desired in the HU market these days. At one time I really wanted the H701 but having to get the remote separate along with the price increase when it was discontinued made it a distant memory. When I sold my CDA-7995 and went with a newer Kenwood Excelon unit I continued to look for my next new processor and was excited about the new H800 until I saw the price along with the remote being sold separate.
> 
> I then started looking at the PXE600 which had awful reviews then the PXE660 which fared much better. I then saw the RF 360 and 360.2 and that was what really peaked my interest.
> 
> Went with the 360.2 and have to say I was amazed. Very easy to use, a ton of audio features, very easy to setup and tweak. New or used the price is well worth what you get. I got mine used off ebay for $150ish shipped.
> 
> The 360.3 seems to be even better with some nice little upgrades as well. Its great having an eq like this that uses your radio volume control and not off the remote of the newly installed eq. At this time I'd have to say Alpine just doesn't do it for me anymore with what they currently offer.


The controller was separated because when the 700 was out people complained about getting the controller and not using it so Alpine decided to separate them. It makes sense because you don't NEED it unless you're running a non-Ai-Net HU. 

I will agree that Alpine is kind of losing it's way. Now, if they integrate EVERYTHING with USB we could be in for some very cool things. 

FWIW, for what I paid for my H800, if the PS8 was out, I'd be using that. Not that I dislike the H800 at all, but I LOVE that the PS8 will let me use whatever HU I want and run it through RCA and still have it sound amazing.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> The controller was separated because when the 700 was out people complained about getting the controller and not using it so Alpine decided to separate them. It makes sense because you don't NEED it unless you're running a non-Ai-Net HU.
> 
> I will agree that Alpine is kind of losing it's way. Now, if they integrate EVERYTHING with USB we could be in for some very cool things.
> 
> FWIW, for what I paid for my H800, if the PS8 was out, I'd be using that. Not that I dislike the H800 at all, but I LOVE that the PS8 will let me use whatever HU I want and run it through RCA and still have it sound amazing.


that all sounds so nice of them but really of course they'd seperate them, it only gives them a chance to gauge your pockets twice.  i still dont have my darn system up..ugh i hate my life.


----------



## n_olympios

eviling said:


> that all sounds so nice of them but really of course they'd seperate them, it only gives them a chance to gauge your pockets twice.  i still dont have my darn system up..ugh i hate my life.


That's not true. The price of the PXA-H701 and RUX-C701 combo was the same as what the PXA-H700 was sold for. 

And stop hating your life, it won't do you any good. Instead of hanging around in here, go out and make your system work. Now!


----------



## soundcontrol

Not sure about the H800 but previous models only worked with ai-net indash monitors, not any indash ai-net radio. Id imagine there were more people needing the remote then not. Also the remote cost more then most headinits and obviously was little more then a display wire remote. I agree it was another way of increased profits.


----------



## quality_sound

soundcontrol said:


> Not sure about the H800 but previous models only worked with ai-net indash monitors, not any indash ai-net radio. Id imagine there were more people needing the remote then not. Also the remote cost more then most headinits and obviously was little more then a display wire remote. I agree it was another way of increased profits.


I've seen people run it with non-monitor HUs.


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> that all sounds so nice of them but really of course they'd seperate them, it only gives them a chance to gauge your pockets twice.  i still dont have my darn system up..ugh i hate my life.


Nope. See the reply above.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> I've seen people run it with non-monitor HUs.


yeah the functons that are in the RUX are just in the head unit for those head units. i should get one. :mean: **** this carputer.


----------



## soundcontrol

I will double check but most of the features arent acessable from the features menu on the Alpine Ai-net units. I remember reading on the h701 that it must be used with DVA model cdplayers or indash monitors.


----------



## tokapaho

It's all described in the Sound Manager Manual. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## chiragh

chiragh said:


> *i just got H800 ... which will be used with w502
> 
> But point is am unable to switch it on , both Ai net cable + optical cable is attached !!
> 
> My version is V1.003 and the software which i have is V1.100 .
> 
> I downloaded V1.003 from Australian website
> 
> when i tried upload V1.003 over V1.100 i nothing happens after disconnecting USB and the software asks for upgrade again !!
> 
> I reset Head and H800 , but no use
> 
> What could be the flaw ? *




Any help here ????


----------



## jim walter

quality_sound said:


> . Not that I dislike the H800 at all, but I LOVE that the PS8 will let me use whatever HU I want and run it through RCA and still have it sound amazing.


Just casually reading the thread here looking for feedback and I'd like to ask you to elaborate on that comment. 

How will the PS8 benefit you in an analog situation?

Thanks in advance for the feedback
Jim


----------



## vaernes

chiragh said:


> Any help here ????


If the PXA-H800 does not start up, you might have to set it up with a computer via USB connection. If you don´t have the RUX-C800 controller, then you must use a computer runnning the software each time power is disconnected. I ended up buying the RUX controller.


----------



## n_olympios

soundcontrol said:


> I will double check but most of the features arent acessable from the features menu on the Alpine Ai-net units. I remember reading on the h701 that it must be used with DVA model cdplayers or indash monitors.


Although this thread is about the H800 and not the H700/701, I'll say this: AiNet HU's with an option of "external processing" (aka most of them) were able to control the H701 by themselves (I mean without the RUX controller). All options were available, although not in a graphical way as in the monitors. 

When I had the H701 I used several non-monitor AiNet HU's to control it (last one of which was my beloved DVA-9861Ri) and never bothered with the controller (although it was conveniently velcroed in the glovebox).


----------



## jim walter

chiragh said:


> Any help here ????


Have you initialized the unit?

You need to enter the system layout and aux in type to set the I/O's before the H800 will work. After that, you save it and will need to cycle inhibition. From there, you should have some sound.

I'd recommend tuning via PC as it the most visual and gives you the big system picture. 

Jim


----------



## latour

Hi Guys,

I have just gotten the PXA-H800 with controller. I'm now going thru the manual before hooking it up to the system.

I would like to seek some advice from you guys on hooking up the HU to the H800. I have a Pioneer AVH-P4350 (4300 in the US) with 3 pairs of outputs (Front output, Rear output and Subwoofer output). 

Which RCA input pattern should I be selecting for a 3-way active setup + subwoofer?

The shop that sold me the P800 told me that only a pair of RCA is required to connect both the HU and H800 together which confuses me. 

I can hook up the Front output of the HU to the H800 and how are the subwoofer signals are carried across if only a pair of RCA is required.

My setup:

- Pioneer AVH-P4350DVD
- Alpine PXA-H800 + CUX
- 2 x Rockford Fosgate T600-4
- Focal KRX3
- 1 x Rockford Fosgate P2 Subwoofer

Thank you for reading.


----------



## tokapaho

Your Pioneer provides the H800 with the full-range stereo info it needs. It will then separate the signal into whatever output you want, it will do your fading and sub signal from the 2 channel input from your Pioneer (I assume you're not doing a 5.1setup). You will then use the commander for all your settings. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## quality_sound

jim walter said:


> Just casually reading the thread here looking for feedback and I'd like to ask you to elaborate on that comment.
> 
> How will the PS8 benefit you in an analog situation?
> 
> Thanks in advance for the feedback
> Jim


Hey Jim, 

It's not so much that it'll help, but it won't hinder. I don't HAVE to use a specific type of HU (which Alpine oh-so-smartly decided to stop making just before releasing an Ai-Net processor ) or a stand-alone controller to even get it to turn on. Plus, with how good it sounds on the analog inputs, I see ZERO reason to run optical which is also a plus because I won't have to run optical AND analog to get sound from all sources. Just one set of RCAs and you're done. 

That's not to say I don't love the H800. I'm actually putting it in my truck right now. I'm just saying the PS8 is MILES easier to integrate into ANY system and wasn't already handicapped by being tied into a control system that was discontinued before it ever hit stores. 

I will say this, the PS8s analog input is orders of magnitude better than the H800's. Ai-Net is good. Optical is great, RCA...eh. Erin's measurements back that up. Gary Springgay's review of the PS8 also verifies how good the PS8 analog input it. 

Paul


----------



## quality_sound

vaernes said:


> If the PXA-H800 does not start up, you might have to set it up with a computer via USB connection. *If you don´t have the RUX-C800 controller, then you must use a computer runnning the software each time power is disconnected. I ended up buying the RUX controller.*


I never did. Maybe it's because I'm running a D800, but it always fired right up after battery disconnect for me.


----------



## quality_sound

latour said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I have just gotten the PXA-H800 with controller. I'm now going thru the manual before hooking it up to the system.
> 
> I would like to seek some advice from you guys on hooking up the HU to the H800. I have a Pioneer AVH-P4350 (4300 in the US) with 3 pairs of outputs (Front output, Rear output and Subwoofer output).
> 
> Which RCA input pattern should I be selecting for a 3-way active setup + subwoofer?
> 
> The shop that sold me the P800 told me that only a pair of RCA is required to connect both the HU and H800 together which confuses me.
> 
> I can hook up the Front output of the HU to the H800 and how are the subwoofer signals are carried across if only a pair of RCA is required.
> 
> My setup:
> 
> - Pioneer AVH-P4350DVD
> - Alpine PXA-H800 + CUX
> - 2 x Rockford Fosgate T600-4
> - Focal KRX3
> - 1 x Rockford Fosgate P2 Subwoofer
> 
> Thank you for reading.



The H800 will create it's own sub output. If you want to keep the Pioneer's sub control you'll have to connect those RCAs to the input.


----------



## latour

Thanks Guys! Appreciate the valuable advice.


----------



## chiragh

jim walter said:


> Have you initialized the unit?
> 
> You need to enter the system layout and aux in type to set the I/O's before the H800 will work. After that, you save it and will need to cycle inhibition. From there, you should have some sound.
> 
> I'd recommend tuning via PC as it the most visual and gives you the big system picture.
> 
> Jim


*
It was the error with V1.100 Software which i download from Alpine website !! 

I used version V1.000 and worked in 2 mins. *

There is no hissing or grounding noise !!


----------



## quality_sound

Does anyone have an issue where optical works fine but Ai-net volume is all but non-existent? In my MINI I ran Ai-net only and it was great but optical didn't (cable issue) but now optical is fine but Ai-net is wonky. Thoughts?


----------



## quality_sound

Nevermind. I'm a dumbass. I swear to god, one day I'm gonna remember to flip those ****ing switches... LMAO

Being on the jokes. I deserve them. lol


----------



## zaytserr

Hi all. Can a tablet such as the Nexus 7 or even a Samsung Galaxy S3 be connected to teh PDXA-H800 via one of the optical inputs? I only ask because I have not been able to find any inof on this matter despite my searches of this thread. I currently have a Nexus 7 that has been rooted with a custom kernel on it to allow for digital audio out to a USB Host Cable - Turtle Beach Micro Advantage 2 soundcard which has an optical output. 

I am trying to bypass a head unit and analoge signals all together using a an alpine MRA-D550 theater amplifier. I have been in and out of car audio for years so I am not up to speed on current hardware and I hate cd players , but I also hate crappy mp3 qualtiy. Most of my music will be Flac or Lossless audio files on an external hard drive. If I cannot use the PXA-H800, what are my options.? Bit One, Bit Ten, possibly the 3sixty.3? My last system was a mac mini connected to an Alpine pxe-h650 which sucked in terms of volume. I currently just connect my phone or table to the pxe-h650 which still sucks in terms of sound quality and how loud it can get. Thanks for your time.


----------



## zaytserr

Hi all. I have a question that may have been answered already but I could not find the answer to when searching this thread. Can a tablet or phone be connected to one of the PXA-H800's opticall inputs? I currently have a Nexus 7 tablet that has been rooted and has a cutsom kernel and can output usb audio into a turtle beach micro advantage soundcard with optical output. Also apparently the Galaxy S3 has this feature buit in. Any info is greatly appreciated, although knowing how Alpine operates I imagine the optical inputs only talk to Alpine head units. If I cannot use this processor, what would be some recommendations, bit one, bit ten, or 3sixty.3? Thank you for your time.


----------



## oca123

Hi,

Optical inputs are standard. I think the physical connector is standard Toslink. My H800 gets an optical signal from a Pure I20 dock, and it works perfectly fine. Sound quality using optical is not much different than when using line-out from a device that has a decent DAC, over a good quality aux cable. Optical has the advantage of giving you the best SNR and volume right out of the box, I guess, where Aux takes a little bit of messing around with gains to get there.

BitOne's optical input is also standard, though I've had it crap out a few times. BitTen I heard is also standard toslink. 3sixty.3 I have no idea, but you can google it.


----------



## oca123

quality_sound said:


> Hey Jim,
> 
> It's not so much that it'll help, but it won't hinder. I don't HAVE to use a specific type of HU (which Alpine oh-so-smartly decided to stop making just before releasing an Ai-Net processor ) or a stand-alone controller to even get it to turn on. Plus, with how good it sounds on the analog inputs, I see ZERO reason to run optical which is also a plus because I won't have to run optical AND analog to get sound from all sources. Just one set of RCAs and you're done.
> 
> That's not to say I don't love the H800. I'm actually putting it in my truck right now. I'm just saying the PS8 is MILES easier to integrate into ANY system and wasn't already handicapped by being tied into a control system that was discontinued before it ever hit stores.
> 
> I will say this, the PS8s analog input is orders of magnitude better than the H800's. Ai-Net is good. Optical is great, RCA...eh. Erin's measurements back that up. Gary Springgay's review of the PS8 also verifies how good the PS8 analog input it.
> 
> Paul


I'd been waiting for the PS8, even was talking to Fred over at Arc. Checking every other day. For like, a year. And then, just when I don't check for a week, it comes out?
...........

Phew. Sept 23rd. And pre-orders are being taken tomorrow. Guess I'm stopping by my regular car audio shop tomorrow to order....

I'm still keeping the H800, because I have the RUX, and its sooo convenient. I'm only going to get the PS8 to mess around with it, it's useless to me without a remote.


----------



## iggz777

Hello. I am new here so pardon my stupidity please. I am having a problem with H800 setup. I have X305S connected to H800 via the Ai Net, connected to PDX F6, running Rainbow Profi Phase Plug at the front, and Dynaudio MD 100 + MW 150 at the rear, and Kenwood PS401M running 12" JL W3v3-2 single sub in a ported JL HO box. It does not sound good. I was playing around with H800 set up via PC, auto configured Imprint and Time Correction, played around with RoadEQ, however without any positive results. I did not touch the EQs as I wanted to make it sound decent first. Also I tried to tune TCR by ear which helped somewhat but nothing special was achieved and the sound quality is rather bad. The ported box is 1 issue, I tried to raise the HPF anywhere from 22Hz to 40Hz to reduce the booming effect, however the effect is still there and the bass doesn't sound crisp as it would in a sealed box. I read that you can make ported box sound as good as sealed 1 however I was not able to do that. Any help or ideas would be appreciated. Thank you.


----------



## quality_sound

For giggles I ran Imprint and it turned on Dolby Pro-Logic, which sounded like ass. First thing, go back into the Listening Mode and change it to Stereo or Rear Fill. The Auto TA isn't bad. If the bass is boomy, reduce the top end of the sub, not the bottom.


----------



## claytonzmvox

after a power failure PXA H800 stopped working. the unit held the setup, but it appears the reminder to turn off the acc. After off, when turned on again, the message appears to turn off acc. I appreciate if you can help me because I am a layman in English, and this equipment is new here!!


----------



## quality_sound

Try resetting the unit with the reset button on the main unit.


----------



## claytonzmvox

already reseted the main unit, the PXA own, removed the power cord from the main unit as well. Is it valid AGAIN I update the device with the latest update?


----------



## claytonzmvox

I solved the problem!!! Just updated the Rux with the same update and it was working again!!


----------



## quality_sound

That's awesome!

Anyone else running rear speakers? Something weird I noticed today. When I turn the rear output off I get noticeably more bass. Thoughts? Anyone else's do this?


----------



## quickaudi07

I have no idea mine works good without any problems. And i have rear fill on and when i turn them off i dont hear any difference on my unit.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2


----------



## tokapaho

Jim Walter should be participating more in this thread. Participating members here are the cream of the crop of Alpine enthusiasts and should deserve a steady Alpine support person. Not coming down on Jim, but there is a Crutchfield guy around here somewhere and he is doing one hell of a good job. Of course, this is his job, customer service that is, but this forum is not related to his company. 
Enough with the rant…

Anyone knows if the ICS-C8 is coming to the US?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## subwoofery

tokapaho said:


> Jim Walter should be participating more in this thread. Participating members here are the cream of the crop of Alpine enthusiasts and should deserve a steady Alpine support person. Not coming down on Jim, but there is a Crutchfield guy around here somewhere and he is doing one hell of a good job. Of course, this is his job, customer service that is, but this forum is not related to his company.
> Enough with the rant…
> 
> Anyone knows if the ICS-C8 is coming to the US?
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Why "should" Jim be around more? He's not in Alpine's marketing or commercial department. He's an engineer that sticks around the forum and try to help people as much as he can. He doesn't owe the forum anything and doesn't earn a penny for every advice he gives... 
Again, that is NOT Jim's job - he's just an enthousiast that helps regarding Alpine products. When he doesn't know the answer, he asks his collegue before posting the info. 

Kelvin


----------



## oca123

I'm siding with Kelvin on this one.
Andy set the bar too high 

The people on this forum are a tiny fraction of Alpine's sales. Same goes for a lot of car audio companies.
Stock systems are getting better, and most importantly, most of the new ones I've seen now include some kind of subwoofer. The problem with that is that everyone starts in car audio with "I want more bass" because bass used to be completely lacking in stock systems.
That results in less new car audio hobbyists... so economically speaking, if I were Alpine, I wouldn't spend the money and pay people to post on forums. There are far too many forums in far too many countries.

FIY - If one of you ever breaks, damages, or loses the "Power Connector" - all it is is a standard PCI-E power connector. If you've bought a video card recently, you may have one laying around. They're like $2.
When the ground wire on my connector broke, I had the choice to fix it (extract pin, etc.) or just make a new one. I made a new one with only the leads I need (12v, gnd, rem in, rem out) and techflex. MUCH CLEANER!

I might be selling my H800 + Remote soon, as I have a PS8 reserved for me. The PS8 is more involved to set up and does not include a remote (yet) but the output configuration is more versatile and I hear it has a mier on the outputs so you could route audio however you want.

How much would the H800 sell for here? It's in good condition obviously, and bought from a US seller.


----------



## tokapaho

My mistake, I was under the assumption that Jim were an Alpine employee. 
The ass in assumption fits I guess. 
Jim, my apologies. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jim walter

Hi Tokapaho, 

While I am an Alpine employee, I simply post here as a hobbyist and try to help out where possible, when possible. 

I answer countless PM's a week, as those get an email notice to me, but I do not monitor forums with any schedule or regularity. 

When I do browse, if I happen to see something where I may be able to help out or grabs my attention, I post up. Otherwise, I'm pretty scarce.

Jim


----------



## Technic

I just replaced my MS-8 with an H800 in a 2012 M3 with HiFi system (balanced outputs), OEM Individual Audio mid/tweeters, Kicker SSMB8 midbass, ID12 sub, PDX4.150 and PDX-5 amps... quick observations:

- The H800 ImprintEQ takes way, way longer to autotune than the MS-8 acoustic calibration. However there is no initial crossover setup to be done and still it produces a well balanced sound. Autotune results are slightly better with the MS-8 despite the elaborate and time consuming microphone positionings of the H800. However adjustments _after_ the autotune produces a better sound than the MS-8 overall, IMO.

- Logic7 is slightly better than Euphony in setting the front stage with a center speaker in 5.1ch mode, IMO. Euphony requires tuning after the autotune -as stated above. However, Euphony allows a much better control of the center speaker effects than Logic7. 

- No midbass or Bluetooth echo issues. This alone caused the swap. 

- No noises, no hiss (-6dB master volume level).

- I found the parametric EQ much more effective in getting the custom tuning that I was looking for than the graphic EQ. I never got the best out of the MS-8 graphic EQ.

- It is great to be able to change crossover setting _after_ the autotuning. Much better when I can overlap frequencies between Front High and Front Low. 

- The PC software is not intuitive right away, it takes quite some time to "get it". For example, to custom adjust the Euphony ambiance levels the system input needs to be in 2-ch mode, although the main inputs are 4-ch in my particular case (AUX1 is 4-ch, AUX2 is 2-ch). However, set the custom modes in 2-ch mode and then they will be selectable in 4-ch mode. That's a WTF moment in software development. 

- The controller requirement is stupid. Yes, Alpine... _stupid_. 

So far, it is a worthy replacement. :thumbsup:


----------



## 00flash00

Hi my friend

I need you help for connection for my NVE-M300P to PXA-H800 to IVA-D800
now a have this connection-
NVE is connected to KCE-900E then is connected to IVA. Into KCE is connected to "guide output" rca from procesor. That is all? Or must connect any remote cable from procesor?

Thank you ... I have big instalation, but sound in navigation is my big problem ... Now in rux setting is NAV OFF but i have route navigation quiets my sound ... What is this? NAV off is off so why the music quiets me? Its anywhere option for NAV MUTE?


----------



## evo9

00flash00 said:


> Hi my friend
> 
> I need you help for connection for my NVE-M300P to PXA-H800 to IVA-D800
> now a have this connection-
> NVE is connected to KCE-900E then is connected to IVA. Into KCE is connected to "guide output" rca from procesor. That is all? Or must connect any remote cable from procesor?
> 
> Thank you ... I have big instalation, but sound in navigation is my big problem ... Now in rux setting is NAV OFF but i have route navigation quiets my sound ... What is this? NAV off is off so why the music quiets me? Its anywhere option for NAV MUTE?





Why are you using the KCE-900E? It is NOT NEEDED based on the information you provided! The NVE-M300P connects directly to the IVA-D800 which is then connected to the PXA-H800. Look in the back pages of the IVA-D800 owners manual.


----------



## 00flash00

kce-900e is needed for the processor pxa-h800  look in the h800 manual ...


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## evo9

00flash00 said:


> kce-900e is needed for the processor pxa-h800  look in the h800 manual ...


Since you know the answer.................... Why ask??? 



_



Features

Overview: The Alpine KCE-900E Navigation System Interface Box is a navigation voice-guidance interrupt adapter along with an RGB to NTSC composite video adapter. The KCE-900E converts the multi-pin plug on the Alpine's Navigation unit's rear panel, allowing you to send an audio/video signal from the external Alpine Navigation unit to an Alpine in-dash receiver with an audio input and mute wire, and an external monitor with an RGB or composite video connector. The KCE-900E sends the navigation system's voice guidance through your Alpine audio system, and routes the video output to your vehicle's external video screen. This adapter works with the Alpine NVE-N872A, NVE-N852A, or NVE-851A navigation systems. 

Connections: The KCE-900E Navigation System Interface Box features the following connections. 
•Navigation Input: 13-Pin Navigation input for connecting the KCE-900E to your compatible Alpine external navigation unit. 
•RGB Output: 13-Pin RGB output which connects the KCE-900E to your vehicle's external monitor (via the supplied cable with your navigation unit) to display your Alpine navigation unit's on-screen map.
•Composite Video Output: Composite video output which allows you to connect the KCE-900E to your vehicle's external monitor (via optional composite video cable) to display your Alpine navigation unit's on-screen map. ◦Note: There is a switch on the unit which allows the KCE-900E to convert your Alpine navigation's RGB video signal to composite video.

•Guide Output: Mono RCA output which sends the audio signal (text-to-speech) of your external Alpine navigation unit to your Alpine head-unit via an optional RCA cable or RCA-to-mini cable. 
•Remote Input: 3.5mm input which connects to the supplied Remote In wire to use an optional IR emitter so you can control your external Alpine navigation unit from its supplied remote control. 
•Guide Control Output: Green/white wire which should be connected to the cellular mute wire of your compatible Alpine headunit.
•Display Control Output: Yellow/red wire which connects to your external monitor when available.

Click to expand...

_*From the IVA-D800 Owners Manual.*


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## 00flash00

see this


----------



## evo9

When I had tested mine I connected the way shown in the IVA-D800 manual! It worked perfectly. From what I can see the KCE 900E is needed when running external amps. If all your connections are correct, you need to go into the setup option and set the guide volume.


----------



## 00flash00

i have PDX-F4 F6 and M12. It also tested the PXA-H800 and IVA-D800?


----------



## porcupinextree

hey there nice cammaro any set up tips for doing imprint with mic for pxah800. manual does not tell you much i have alpine ixe920hb focal fps4160 amp pdxf6 mono amp hertz mile front stage only active i have done imprint it sounds good i have cross overs off do i leave gains set right imprint doe not set up sub i have to manually set up thanks


----------



## kobiejohn

I have read thru most of the pages on the H800 but can someone verify that when used without a ainet head unit or rux controller the h800 will not turn on? Or is it that I just would have zero control of the unit until I connect a laptop but it still would turn on and work with a non ainet or factory head unit.


----------



## quality_sound

It will not even turn on without an Ai-Net connection or the RUX-C800.


----------



## n_olympios

Why not? The remote input is there. Unless you mean the first time you run it.


----------



## acidbass303

n_olympios said:


> Why not? The remote input is there. Unless you mean the first time you run it.


Thats the way it just is, in spite of having remote input, it still needs either an Ai-Net HU OR a rux-c800 to turn on.
Another method to turn it on is through USB connection to a PC.


----------



## quality_sound

n_olympios said:


> Why not? The remote input is there. Unless you mean the first time you run it.


That's the way it is. The remote input is there for use with the RUX. With Ai-Net you don't need remote turn in as the HU sends it through that cable.


----------



## claytonzmvox

use optic cable from the player to the processor. And the player to the processor also use cable Ai-net, I can dispense with the remote? When I turn off the system I hear a pop, already tried everything and can not get him, the cause may be the remote?


----------



## quality_sound

If you use optical and Ai-Net and an Alpine Ai-Net head unit then you won't need the remote lead. It might take care of the pop. The pop might also be the amp as well. I have aren't anyone yet have a pop issue with the H800.


----------



## claytonzmvox

Ok, thank you friend. Try removing the remote and see if that is causing the pop. Before I used a PXA H660 and had no noise at all, I think it is the same remote. will post results after you have removed the remote. Thank you again!!


----------



## Technic

Hi Jim

In my particular case of a PXA-H800 with a pair of PDX amps (4.150 and -5), what would be your suggestion as to the PDX gain levels settings before the ImprintEQ measurements?

So far I have set the all the gains at minimum and then run the ImprintEQ. Most of the results are quite decent without any PDX gain adjustments. But the more I experiment with this ImprintEQ the more I have found that I need to raise the midbass channels gain (underseat woofers in the E92 M3) a couple of clicks to have it at the sound level that I really like. Not as much and involved as the MS-8 but some.

Midbass from the door and rear speakers is much better that the MS-8 that I used to have, no need to adjust the gain at those channels. Sub impact is fantastic, no need to mess with it. Voices as somewhat clear, but they need some help; sometimes the voices sound like they are coming from a big tunnel. By raising the gain of the center channel voice clarity improves but at the detriment of the overall balance achieved already. Which tells me that perhaps the ImprintEQ results would be better if the PDX gains are set at something other than minimum.

Before I start all over again and redo the ImprintEQ I would like to know your suggestion/Alpine recommendation so I do not spend too much time looking for the gains sweet spot all over the place. :thumbsup:



jim walter said:


> Hi Tokapaho,
> 
> While I am an Alpine employee, I simply post here as a hobbyist and try to help out where possible, when possible.
> 
> I answer countless PM's a week, as those get an email notice to me, but I do not monitor forums with any schedule or regularity.
> 
> When I do browse, if I happen to see something where I may be able to help out or grabs my attention, I post up. Otherwise, I'm pretty scarce.
> 
> Jim


----------



## Shinju

claytonzmvox said:


> Ok, thank you friend. Try removing the remote and see if that is causing the pop. Before I used a PXA H660 and had no noise at all, I think it is the same remote. will post results after you have removed the remote. Thank you again!!


I have a slight turn on pop with with my h800 that I did not have with my h701 and my 2 PDX 4.100 amps. When I switched to the new PDX f4 and v9 I inherited this turn on pop.

I run ai-net only, its frustrating and I cannot track it down.


----------



## chaser9478

Ok, I have a P dsp, I am using my factory H/U, so I have to use an audio control LC6I. I was hoping to be able to use the high level inputs on the pdsp but it only has 4.

What I am getting at is I do not like the P dsp. I have had a zapco dsp6, I loved it. I also had a pxa h700, I liked the gui but I didn't like the noises.

How does the Pxa h800 stack up to the other dsp's? I am also tired of waiting for helix to put out a remote. When it does come out I have been told its only basic.

How does the pxa h800 work with the high level inputs?

Does it have any of the noises like the pxa h700?

Could I use the rux only when I was tuning and then unplug it when I was finished?

Sorry for the long post, but I don't want to be unhappy with another Dsp.

Thanks


----------



## quality_sound

If you're using the OEM HU the C800 MUST be plugged in at all times or it won't power up. 

There are no noises. It is dead silent. I have used the Ai-Net and optical inputs and while the optical is better, the Ai-Net is very good as well. 

The only thing I'd replace my H800 for is a PS8. Which I MAY do oly because my D800 will block my A/C vents now. If you're looking, let me know and maybe we can work something out. I got love for my TACP guys.


----------



## chaser9478

Do you know any romads? 

I guess the pdsp is ok. Having to use the LC6I really turned me off. There is a very small hiss and I am sure that its the source. 

The pxa 800 has all the internal summing and flattens the oem signal, doesn't it?
Have you used it with an oem system? I have a mitsubishi with the rf system and there is all kinds of oem dsp stuff going on.

It has 6 high level inputs, right? Is there a limit on how much wattage it can take in? 

My wifes gonna crap if I buy another dsp....lol, the pdsp is maybe 4 weeks old.


----------



## quality_sound

chaser9478 said:


> Do you know any romads?


Not closely, no.



> I guess the pdsp is ok. Having to use the LC6I really turned me off. There is a very small hiss and I am sure that its the source.


There's a guy on Tundratalk with an LC6i and hiss as well. Weird. He thinks it the HU as well but he bypasses the LC6i and it's dead quiet. Weird.



> The pxa 800 has all the internal summing and flattens the oem signal, doesn't it?
> Have you used it with an oem system? I have a mitsubishi with the rf system and there is all kinds of oem dsp stuff going on.
> 
> It has 6 high level inputs, right? Is there a limit on how much wattage it can take in?


To be honest, I'm not sure. I bought mine specifically to use with the D800 so I've only ever fed it Ai-Net and optical.



> My wifes gonna crap if I buy another dsp....lol, the pdsp is maybe 4 weeks old.


I just traded-in a 2 month old Tundra... Sometimes changes have to be made. lol


----------



## chaser9478

I have a ssld6, that should remove the hiss. i can turn the gains now but then the output sucks.

Now I just need to find someone who wants a P dsp......

The worst gripe I have is having to use the audio control rig. It threw a wrench in my plans.


----------



## chevilo

00flash00 said:


> Hi my friend
> 
> I need you help for connection for my NVE-M300P to PXA-H800 to IVA-D800
> now a have this connection-
> NVE is connected to KCE-900E then is connected to IVA. Into KCE is connected to "guide output" rca from procesor. That is all? Or must connect any remote cable from procesor?
> 
> Thank you ... I have big instalation, but sound in navigation is my big problem ... Now in rux setting is NAV OFF but i have route navigation quiets my sound ... What is this? NAV off is off so why the music quiets me? Its anywhere option for NAV MUTE?



Hello, the problem is optic output.
Sound is not converted from analog inputs to digital/optic output.
All IVA-%%% and DVA-%%% Alpine units are similar in this.
Switch de IVA-D800 optic otuput to "OFF" for listen M300 navigation voices, over ai-net connection to PXA-H800.
KCE-900 is for interrupt the audio while announcements in navigation.

My english is very bad, sorry.
Regards,


----------



## eviling

so also just realised they AI net is gone off the alpoine decks and when i decided hey ima go with an alpine full feature..i order it than realise it doenst do it anymroe lol so now i still have to use the RUX ANYWAY, i can't believe i forgot such a vital detail lol


----------



## quality_sound

It's in the model number. IV*A*-XXXX is an Ai-Net HU. Any other letter in that that third position means it's not.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> It's in the model number. IV*A*-XXXX is an Ai-Net HU. Any other letter in that that third position means it's not.


Well according to the guy I talked to from alpine the ai net will be gone forever pretty soon he didn't have a reason...I don't know why either

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Thrill_House

eviling said:


> Well according to the guy I talked to from alpine the ai net will be gone forever pretty soon he didn't have a reason...I don't know why either
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


So wait, you are getting rid of the carputer?


----------



## eviling

Thrill_House said:


> So wait, you are getting rid of the carputer?


Yeah. Are you interested looking for 550 for the computer 350 for the screen..the computer is a steal.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Thrill_House

eviling said:


> Yeah. Are you interested looking for 550 for the computer 350 for the screen..the computer is a steal.
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


Im totally broke atm sadly...if you dont mind me asking though how come your deciding to switch back to standard hu?


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> Well according to the guy I talked to from alpine the ai net will be gone forever pretty soon he didn't have a reason...I don't know why either
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


They've already stopped making any new models with it. They're going to all-in-one units with anything external connected through USB.


----------



## eviling

Thrill_House said:


> Im totally broke atm sadly...if you dont mind me asking though how come your deciding to switch back to standard hu?


was many factors. honestly made to comrpomises in the end and didnt like the end result i ended up with, no usb hub, no dvd rom in dash, so i mean it was more novelty to me like it was because it just gimped my possible uses where a pre built uunit has everyhing and more i'll need. the softwre ended up not being suppored by 64 bit furthering my desician. the helix was my origonal choice, and the helix was a far more carputer friendly unit IMO but i mean only a few small things, the ability to add pots made it nice. 

the newer ones are android freiendly so we're back in buisness  lol i left the sony unit and than the z130 from pioneer. the pioneer was nice, the gps pissed me off allot in it,. the alpine has nice gps, nice macro buttons, dvd, back up cam, no controlf or my h800 but meh.


----------



## eviling

How do I do a video bypass on an alpine deck? I can't find anything on my s920 hd but I started wiring some stuff than I.remembered I.will have to wire in a bypass

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## quality_sound

Unless Alpine changed something go to eBay and order a Black Box R3. I will never recommend a PAC TR-7 for this purpose.


----------



## oca123

I have a PAC TR-7 and was about to recommend it... what's wrong with it?


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> Unless Alpine changed something go to eBay and order a Black Box R3. I will never recommend a PAC TR-7 for this purpose.


Can't I just hand wire a relay in to ground the video wire after the car starts 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## evo9

eviling said:


> Can't I just hand wire a relay in to ground the video wire after the car starts
> 
> Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2



Nope! You need the black box R3. 

ALPINE AUTOMATIC VIDEO BYPASS INA-W900BT INA-W910 IXA-W404 IXAW407 items in Specialty Electronics store on eBay!


----------



## eviling

evo9 said:


> Nope! You need the black box R3.
> 
> ALPINE AUTOMATIC VIDEO BYPASS INA-W900BT INA-W910 IXA-W404 IXAW407 items in Specialty Electronics store on eBay!


No their has to be a way to do it with a relay its not a data line just a simple on off line lol does it ground does it not that's all they usaily do 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## quality_sound

Alpine is different. RTFM! Don't tell us you can do it with a relay. We KNOW you can't! If you don't want to listen to the ansswers provided, don't ask the ****ing question! Alpine has had a dual line setup for at LEAST a decade. One for parking brake and one for the fiit brake. It's not a data line, it's a specifice sequence thse lines need to see ground in. You can't build it with the correct timing with a relay. I've tried.


----------



## quality_sound

oca123 said:


> I have a PAC TR-7 and was about to recommend it... what's wrong with it?



A TR-7 cost me to MD100s because the timing isn't quite right. If the timing is off a bit you'll get a full volume high-pitched squeal through the system that won't stop unless you turn the car off.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> Alpine is different. RTFM! Don't tell us you can do it with a relay. We KNOW you can't! If you don't want to listen to the ansswers provided, don't ask the ****ing question! Alpine has had a dual line setup for at LEAST a decade. One for parking brake and one for the fiit brake. It's not a data line, it's a specifice sequence thse lines need to see ground in. You can't build it with the correct timing with a relay. I've tried.


Chill man I was only asking from the short answer you gave before all I knew is it could be.done not that it had a sequence. First brand I've seen with that. I've done jvl clarion eclipse pioneer and Sony units never seen one like that. The cheaper decks don't even check of.it turns off lol if I.recall Sony you just ground. Pioneers was a bit of a pain needed a relay. But the z120 and 130 you could just switch a pin and tie it to that.

I havbt gotten to the manual yet though. Was checking out the harnesses last night and found out what was what on my new factory harness. Mine has like a **** ton of extra **** but my car needs the brainy box because it needs chimes and they go through the stock deck

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## bgalaxy

quality_sound said:


> A TR-7 cost me to MD100s because the timing isn't quite right. If the timing is off a bit you'll get a full volume high-pitched squeal through the system that won't stop unless you turn the car off.


Wow. Interesting. I've been using the Pac line for a number of years on a good amount of Alpine decks, and have never come across this issue. Other then having 1 that had a hard time taking the program ( and I think it was a repack) they have been a solid product.


----------



## quality_sound

You can get the manual right now from Alpine UK or Australia. It's been said more than a few times in this thread. I've said it multiple times myself. 

My issue was that you were arguing something without having a clue how it worked. Alpine has been using this method since before I got out of retail and that was in 2001. If a relay would have worked don't you think we'd have said "Use a relay."? It's like me asking a mechanic how to change, then he tells me I have to use a tire mounting machine and I say, "I'm sure I can use an etch-a-sketch."


----------



## eviling

i got the T7, its all the shop had they didnt have the other one. 











I wired - 

red - ignition 12v
black - ground
brown - remote (this is what the guy at the shop told me but i now see input trigger, i assume he is correct on this one) 

blue - yellow w\ blk stripes
white - yellow w\ blue stripes

now, he told me only orange shoudl be emptry, but i can't remember what green goes to or maybe he was mistaken?


----------



## ErinH

Did you read the yellow paper that comes with it? It specifically instructs you on wiring the tr7 to alpine decks. 

Or pull up their site and read the manual.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> Did you read the yellow paper that comes with it? It specifically instructs you on wiring the tr7 to alpine decks.
> 
> Or pull up their site and read the manual.


Erm I.only.found one with the pic I linked let me look again. I was reading the manuals for your info and was at work earlier I don't need to be yelled at.


Edit - found it. Yeah he was wrong its green to remote brown empty. Hmm but nothing is done with Brown on the yellow slip

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


----------



## ErinH

Who's yelling at you, man? I'm trying to help... 


Look in the box. There should be a small yellow piece of paper with wiring instructions on it. Thus what you want. It's come in every tr7 I've owned (and I've had 10 or so over the years). 

The manual itself states how to wire it as well. Bottom of page 3:
http://www.pac-audio.com/PACProductData/TR7/1_Instructions/tr-7_instructions_010505.pdf



Quick question: are you allergic to manuals, because you seem to really love avoiding them. Lol.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> Who's yelling at you, man? I'm trying to help...
> 
> 
> Look in the box. There should be a small yellow piece of paper with wiring instructions on it. Thus what you want. It's come in every tr7 I've owned (and I've had 10 or so over the years).
> 
> The manual itself states how to wire it as well. Bottom of page 3:
> http://www.pac-audio.com/PACProductData/TR7/1_Instructions/tr-7_instructions_010505.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> Quick question: are you allergic to manuals, because you seem to really love avoiding them. Lol.


I am using them. I used it to wire some stuff last night than I remembered I needed a bypass than asked got answer than bought now wired and ready for install pics tomorrow thanks for the help 



Oh I also talked in length with the shops Forman ( I've worked with him on a couple projects, he did my alarm instal and some other small things and he was at state finals last year) he said he be able to do an mdf built pod and mount my h800 rux on my headliner no wiring though. Quoted me 250-450 but with mdf he said he could keep it around 250-300 pretty easy. They always squirm on firm prices lol but these guys do exceptional work id use only one other shop in my area. 12 volt Dave's and the one I'm using is a &s installations. I'm gonna have that done once I'm finished lol that way ill get it back and be 100% done except for.final tuning of couse lol 

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2


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## eviling

just installed it. came out great  i am really happy, took a little more tinkering with the wiring. this harness was seriouse THE most complex harness their has to be on the market holy cow, thank god they labled some wires because i would of been lost. my guy helped me find my speed signal on the narness and the two leads on the alpine that needed to be wired into the T7. the T7 ran into no problems. gps worked great, cell phone is great too. 

also worh noting the USB does appear to be fully functional in many ways, so i have high hopes like my good buddy quality sound had said they are switching to USB as their main transport. maybe he or somebody might know if a firmware update might make this possible for my unit  i would really love that! 

need to get back in their to tweak the spacing, because of how my dahs is the whole thing is one piece so i had to completley install it to finaly know my clarences, i could of done a dry fit and messured but meh. the old screen was pretty close so i used that and adjusted it acording to how i felt it was off, but i was sitll a tiny bit off.


----------



## quality_sound

I've been VERY tempted to replace my D800 with S920HD. The D800's screen will block the A/C vent above the radio in the upper location and if I put it in the lower location I can't see the C800 all the time and I'd have to flip the screen down to use it. If I did I'd also switch to a PS8 since I wouldn't have room for the C800 anymore and obviously, it's not Ai-Net anymore. Decisions, decisions.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> I've been VERY tempted to replace my D800 with S920HD. The D800's screen will block the A/C vent above the radio in the upper location and if I put it in the lower location I can't see the C800 all the time and I'd have to flip the screen down to use it. If I did I'd also switch to a PS8 since I wouldn't have room for the C800 anymore and obviously, it's not Ai-Net anymore. Decisions, decisions.


ive got a video i just made, i went into a little detail on why i went with it and its went over some features, your a little more alpine knowledgblae so i might not of covered everything but hopfully i did a decent job :laugh: ima upload it, i'll post it in my build loog than if you wanna check it out.

although none movable screen, its a pretty chepap screen to, i mean decent but they could be using better touch screens idk why they havnt made the switch yet, its one of the few things that drives me nuts with these which is one of th rreasons i went carputer till i realised all screens these size are made this way  at least the ones i would be able to use.


----------



## ErinH

Paul, if you don't need navi consider the w535hd. Not out yet but I've been told that it should be soon. I think you saw my little ditty on the s920hd already.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> Paul, if you don't need navi consider the w535hd. Not out yet but I've been told that it should be soon. I think you saw my little ditty on the s920hd already.


i havn't id like to see your little ditty on the 920 :O\


also pretty sure that 535 is out because i chose the 920 because it had the GPS and i wanted the gps.


a side note. you can pick up a 920 on ebay from a user, under warrenty supposedly as well for 725 $ shipped. ive seen more lagit looking adds in the 850 range. get the z28 iuf you can its such a better screen. if you can fit it, i'd go with it. wish i could  best screen i find on full dashes are kenwoods though, they always have the most responsive ones it seems.


----------



## ErinH

Nope. The w535hd hasn't hit yet. I've been watching like a hawk. 

eBay is hit or miss but yes, there are some low prices on the s920hd there.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> Nope. The w535hd hasn't hit yet. I've been watching like a hawk.
> 
> eBay is hit or miss but yes, there are some low prices on the s920hd there.


hey could you show me this little pice you did on the 920? i looked in your recently made threads didnt do a forum search yet but if that comes up nothing i need a plan C


----------



## ErinH

It's nothing major. Just a quick little impression post in one of my other threads. Search for s920hd and you should be able to find it.

Speaking of the z820, I actually prefer the s920hd over it. Weird. I know.


----------



## eviling

bikinpunk said:


> It's nothing major. Just a quick little impression post in one of my other threads. Search for s920hd and you should be able to find it.
> 
> Speaking of the z820, I actually prefer the s920hd over it. Weird. I know.


same, have to have a knob. i had the 130 whitch was button, drove me up the wall. although i stated it in my video that the z doesnt have macro button's; it does indeed appear to have them all and than some lol so, yeah nobodys perfect. :mean: videos at 25% upload ima upload it in an hour on this post and my build log


----------



## quality_sound

bikinpunk said:


> Paul, if you don't need navi consider the w535hd. Not out yet but I've been told that it should be soon. I think you saw my little ditty on the s920hd already.



Erin - I don't NEED navi as I have a Tom Tom, but it sure would help with the clutter and audio interrupt for directions would be nice to have. I forgot about the 535 but figured if I'm going to replace what I have, I might as well at least explore the option of an all-in-one. It's so hard to compare the two because Alpine changes how they describe features every damned year. lol

I didn't see your info on the 920 though. I'll look it up.

I might just put in the OEM RNS-510 as well.


----------



## quality_sound

eviling said:


> i havn't id like to see your little ditty on the 920 :O\
> 
> 
> also pretty sure that 535 is out because i chose the 920 because it had the GPS and i wanted the gps.
> 
> 
> a side note. you can pick up a 920 on ebay from a user, under warrenty supposedly as well for 725 $ shipped. ive seen more lagit looking adds in the 850 range. get the z28 iuf you can its such a better screen. if you can fit it, i'd go with it. wish i could  best screen i find on full dashes are kenwoods though, they always have the most responsive ones it seems.


Kenwood has consistently had the worst responsiveness IME. My brother has one that's a couple of years old and I HATE that thing. The newer ones are better but their GUI irks me beyond belief. I like Pioneer but and their navi is pretty good too. I'll look at the 940 as well.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> Kenwood has consistently had the worst responsiveness IME. My brother has one that's a couple of years old and I HATE that thing. The newer ones are better but their GUI irks me beyond belief. I like Pioneer but and their navi is pretty good too. I'll look at the 940 as well.


I was playing with one yesterday when i was the shop picking up my t7,. it was a 6000 series not a 700, i think the 7970 or somehting is the latest? idk. the gui erks me too thats why i dont like it, but ive used one in a car once at a show for a full demo a guy gave me, and i played with howards alpine when he let me do a full demo on his car last year, i liked the alpine interface. its one of the large factors i chose this unit..also i thought it still had the AInet. because i had though like you mentioned...alpines been doing it for years they havn't changed that in years i at least knew that much lol. what were the odds i was wrong. i mean dont get me wrong im still happy with the deck, and having to fab a pod for the RUX just gives me a secendary controlelr so i dont have to close whatr im doing on my media to tune, which should making tuning at least easier i'd think. rather than flopping between options and song pause foward repeat yada yad

edit : got that video finily uploaded...might be some facts off about the little portal thing but it gives you an idea of what they have going on  also forgot to mention the phone mic (Which is the same mic they send you in the h800 box fyi) also, a decent looking mic havnt used it yet idk how the feedback is but hoping for good results lol i miss my sony's awsome bluetooth mic, it had zero feed back. my pioneer had gobs of feedback, i did a 4200 from pioneer 3 years ago, it had zero feed back so i dont think all pioneer had feedback. the radio is also HD radio, i forgot to mention that one, kind of a biggy. but you can see it on the frame in the video..few saved XD 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgQN_Qb1bS8&feature=player_embedded]Alpine


----------



## ET328

Is it just me or does H800's delay adjustment change phase in a weird way? 
I'm now using 3-way active front end and muted midbass and tweeter and adjusted midrange time delay. I used pink noise and it sounded like every other 0.05 ms step changed also audio phase (or something to that effect). 

It went like this: left ch was at 6.70 ms and right at 5.00 ms. Image was not at exact center so I set left to 6.75ms and it sounded like audio was little out of phase, but then at 6.80 it was back to normal and center moved a little etc. Is it really the H800 doing this or do I have some weird combing effect going on? But why does 0.05ms have such an effect?


----------



## subwoofery

ET328 said:


> Is it just me or does H800's delay adjustment change phase in a weird way?
> I'm now using 3-way active front end and muted midbass and tweeter and adjusted midrange time delay. I used pink noise and it sounded like every other 0.05 ms step changed also audio phase (or something to that effect).
> 
> It went like this: left ch was at 6.70 ms and right at 5.00 ms. Image was not at exact center so I set left to 6.75ms and it sounded like audio was little out of phase, but then at 6.80 it was back to normal and center moved a little etc. Is it really the H800 doing this or do I have some weird combing effect going on? But why does 0.05ms have such an effect?


T/A change phase - delta and parallel... 
Totally normal. 

Kelvin


----------



## deanorth

Hi guys

I have a INA W910R installed in my honda prelude (5G, 1997), and about to get a H800.
Only thing that worry me, I'm using a lot CD, but also my ipod with lossless M4a files.
and I can't find if, when switching to ipod, the W910r still use the optical out, or through ainet, send that data to the H800, or if there's a need to get an analog connection to the processor too... it's kinda one connection to rule them all that I would like to use


----------



## quality_sound

All you need is Ai-Net and optical.


----------



## deanorth

Great, really, you removed a massive weight from my shoulder


----------



## Tnutt19

Question, I assumed that the AINet from a DVI 7996 would be compatible with the H800 but just called Alpine Tech Support to confirm and they told me it is not. Is this true or is it possible he was wrong?


----------



## quality_sound

I don't even remember that head. Link?


----------



## tokapaho

I think he means the DVA -7996.
Crapfield link: http://www.crutchfield.com/S-VSF33sKGbIq/p_500DVA7996/Alpine-DVA-7996.html


----------



## tokapaho

quality_sound said:


> All you need is Ai-Net and optical.


Would the HU use the optical for both iPod and CD, or would that only be for CD?


----------



## quality_sound

Cd only. I think Alpine tech support said it won't work because it has Ai-Net changer control but it's not spec'd as having Ai-Net processor control. Worst case it'll still turn the processor on and eliminate the need for the C800, you just won't be able to access the processor presets. If you want, you can send it to me and I'll test it with my H800 and find out if it works before you order it.


----------



## Tnutt19

Sorry my bad that is the correct model number.


----------



## quality_sound

No worries. I edited my last post with more info.


----------



## n_olympios

quality_sound said:


> Cd only. I think Alpine tech support said it won't work because it has Ai-Net changer control but it's not spec'd as having Ai-Net processor control. Worst case it'll still turn the processor on and eliminate the need for the C800, you just won't be able to access the processor presets. If you want, you can send it to me and I'll test it with my H800 and find out if it works before you order it.


http://vault.alpine-usa.com/products/documents/OM_DVA-7996.PDF

In the rare occasion that Alpine support don't do their job properly, it's good as it makes us feel handy. The DVA-7996 will control any AiNet processor just the way other/newer HU's do.


----------



## kyheng

^Is mainly how the HU able talk to the processor...
Just like DEX-P9 can only see RS-P90's slope till -36dB only while RS-D7RII can see -72dB( just 1 example)....
But 1 thing is true that most of the tech support don't really knows how to do their job... Not just Alpine but Pioneer....


----------



## Randyman...

quality_sound said:


> Cd only.


Just to confirm - This is the INA-W910 you are referring to WRT deanorth's post about ipod USB > Optical to the H800?

One quick Q - I've heard the GPS is horrible on the W910 - can you disable it completely, or does it always get in your way and "try to be helpful"?

If it's true that the USB iPod uses Analog to the H800 on the W910, then I'd just go ahead and get the new IVE-W535HD and call it a day (would get the remote for the H800 regardless).

Thanks


----------



## quality_sound

I don't think that even the D800 passes iPod audio via optical and it was designed specifically to be paired with the H800. 

How would the Nav get in the way? If you don't use it you're not using it. I'm kind of confused about what you're concern is. It won't try to create a route for you or anything.


----------



## Randyman...

quality_sound said:


> I don't think that even the D800 passes iPod audio via optical and it was designed specifically to be paired with the H800.


Sounds like IVE-W535HD is the way to go then.




quality_sound said:


> How would the Nav get in the way? If you don't use it you're not using it. I'm kind of confused about what you're concern is. It won't try to create a route for you or anything.


I just figured the GPS would always want to be what's "active" on the screen if not actively fiddling with the HU - and that it might still be using up CPU and making other aspects of the HU GUI sluggish. It's a moot point with your above confirmation! :laugh:

Thanks for the speedy reply!


----------



## quality_sound

Ahhhh, no. I haven't seen any Nav unit that constantly goes back to the map screen except the new Toyota Entune units. Everything aftermarket just stays on what you want. The 535 looks to be a great unit...one it starts shipping. lol


----------



## eekern

Using a 910 and an pxa-h701 i was able to break out the digital signal of an ipod touch and still maintain control through the 910. The sq is night and day bypassing the extra conversions. I did this using the signal sensing toslink (#3 dvd) input on the 701. Those with an 800 will have to tell me if the 800 has a signal sensing fiber input capability


----------



## Randyman...

My "real world" 2 Cents:

Unless the converters are just piss poor, I'll be OK with going D>A>D>A with the W535. My previous install had the Sony C90/XDP4000X/Dual Changer combo. The C90 and one changer were Toslink to the XDP DSP. The second changer was Analog to the XDP DSP. I could not tell the difference in an un-scientific test using the same CD's - and these were 18-Bit and 20-Bit 44/48K AD/DA converters from the 90's! (granted, some of the best ones availabe in their time!).

Even in my studio, I don't mind coming into the DAW via Analog even if Digital connections are available - more so if there will be sample rate conversion to contend with and such. Even lots of Mastering Engineers will use a D>A>D loop ("Pitch" and "Catch") to perform Samplerate conversion instead of doing SRC in the digital domain!

Converters of today (even cheapish ones) have really come a long way from the first DAC's in the first CD Players IMO. Not to say that all converters are good - but at this level (W535 + H800) - I think they did enough R&D to get the pre-fabbed chips sounding good "in circuit" (the analog circuitry around the pre-fabbed chips is likely up to par)...

If there is an easy way to do this - I'd look into it, but seems like more hassle than the simplicity of staying analog would provide me (have to split off the 30-pin somehow so the Radio can still control the iPod, convert from Coax/Electircal to Optical via another unit, etc). Then there's the $$$ GPS in the 901 I'd never use 

Why oh why Alpine: Why can't your DSP R&D team be on the same page with your HU R&D Teams!!! I was serisouly scratching my head last month when I learned NONE of the new HU's have AI-Net when the H800 is such a capable piece (a PERFECT upgrade from my aging XDP4000X - minus the need for a separate controller  ). Sony has done some pretty boneheaded things in their time - but this AI-Net omission skirts on blatant stupidity IMO. Only one explanation: "Marketing Department"! :laugh:


----------



## quality_sound

I really wish we had the ODR stuff over here. Hell, if the tuner worked over here I'd seriously consider it.


----------



## aaron7

haha, saw the thread title and thought there was a model up from my PXA-H600 back in the day. Didn't realize it was a NEW model with such a close number! haha

Wonder if it's worth the upgrade... though I don't think the H800 has AI-Net


----------



## quality_sound

aaron7 said:


> haha, saw the thread title and thought there was a model up from my PXA-H600 back in the day. Didn't realize it was a NEW model with such a close number! haha
> 
> Wonder if it's worth the upgrade... though I don't think the H800 has AI-Net


It does. I run two cables to mine. Ai-Net and optical. 
As far as worth the upgrade goes I'd say significant would be putting it mildly.


----------



## aaron7

Hmm... that opens up a bunch of new ideas


----------



## tokapaho

eekern said:


> Using a 910 and an pxa-h701 i was able to break out the digital signal of an ipod touch and still maintain control through the 910. The sq is night and day bypassing the extra conversions. I did this using the signal sensing toslink (#3 dvd) input on the 701. Those with an 800 will have to tell me if the 800 has a signal sensing fiber input capability


Can you elaborate in more detail? How did you accomplish this and what is needed?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## 2way+sub

eekern said:


> Using a 910 and an pxa-h701 i was able to break out the digital signal of an ipod touch and still maintain control through the 910. The sq is night and day bypassing the extra conversions. I did this using the signal sensing toslink (#3 dvd) input on the 701. Those with an 800 will have to tell me if the 800 has a signal sensing fiber input capability


 can i send you my 910?


----------



## Tnutt19

Thanks quality_sound for the offer, I ended up ordering it and can confirm that it does work. Thanks for the help!


----------



## quickaudi07

Sorry but i think this was already mentioned, but have you guys tried to do auto tune on the unit, I didn't do it on mine, and also since i have after market HU unit, how would i go about getting it auto tune, just want to see what kind of difference i will hear in music vs manual tune. Can anyone confirm that if they did try it auto tune.

I have the pink noise cd, what volumes do i set the hu unit up, i'm kind of lost in that department and i'm trying to find some info.
Thank You


----------



## quality_sound

Ummm, RTFM??? lol 

Seriously, the auto-tune has NOTHING to do with what HU you're running. You'll initiate it either with the C800 or a laptop. You use the disc supplied with the unit as well. It's reptty simple but it has to be DEAD quiet for it to work. It does a pretty good job as a base tune and you can mod it from there.


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> Ummm, RTFM??? lol
> 
> Seriously, the auto-tune has NOTHING to do with what HU you're running. You'll initiate it either with the C800 or a laptop. You use the disc supplied with the unit as well. It's reptty simple but it has to be DEAD quiet for it to work. It does a pretty good job as a base tune and you can mod it from there.


Can it be modded from the remote commander? I tried doing that this week and as soon as I hit the EQ or TCR settings it essentially takes me out of the autotune and all settings disappear until I reload the preset. All I want to do is tweak the EQ a bit because the autotune actually got it close. I haven't with the software yet since it's a pain to hookup.


----------



## quality_sound

Yep. I saved the autotune in preset 6 then modded away but there's no reason it should remove the settings once you get into the settings menu.


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> Yep. I saved the autotune in preset 6 then modded away but there's no reason it should remove the settings once you get into the settings menu.


Strange why it acts different for me, I can't imagine the preset number having anything the do with it, I'm using 1. Something else I found strange is that why I did get into the time alignment settings they were all over 200", except the sub was at 0". When I guesstimated at real values the soundstage was a bit improved but the EQ from the autotune was off, and at that point I realized how good of a job it actually did, especially on the low end.


----------



## quality_sound

It's because time is relative and to get everything as close to exact as possible it'll use as much TA as it needs.


----------



## KenB129

Well I'm not worried about the numbers it thinks is correct as much as being able to tweak them without starting over. I might just have to try getting out the laptop and going that route and see if that works, but it's just such a pain.


----------



## quality_sound

It is, but for stuff like this it's better. For day-to-day changes the C800 kicks all kinds of ass.


----------



## eviling

quality_sound said:


> It is, but for stuff like this it's better. For day-to-day changes the C800 kicks all kinds of ass.


I finily got a chance to get into mine. its some what streight forward, took me a min. are the channels not assignable? only with the 4 dif setup selections? erm i should really make sure i check those rca's for L and R lol idk why i forgot all this stuff, i had a h700 for a bit. 

anyways, so i was working on it today, and i found my self in quite the pickle...first off technical problem - with my remote out wired to my two amps, the H800 keeps reseting, also restarting the amps. with them just hooked to direct remote, they turn on and no problems, not sure whats wrong thought the remote might of been grounded on one of the amps and was wigging it out, but it doesn't look like it to me. 

problem 2 - ...well when you mount your unit...try to keep in mind the RCA plugs extended your tolerances for you're how close to an edge you can put it...this is especily important with a bi-fold seat when you mount it on one of the edges. because if you pull the one side with out the other and the rca's were closer to the edge than you think...this happens - 










not as bad as it appears, it was a very clean break, the piece accualy fits back in, the prongs that hold the barb on the rca was not harmed and the 2 barbs going into the housing were not bent at all. so i pushed it back in and took off the rca's for now, gonna get an epoxy on it though that's for sure. 

also, not a huge thing but an oddity i found with the hardware, the screws all across the top got pretty thick corrosion. i mean i could see it with high humity, but only that area got it...not sure perhaps a defect ion the wheather coat for the hardware?


----------



## oca123

Funny, the first 2 issues happened here.
You need to use a relay. I couldnt find anywhere in the documentation what the max current draw on the remote out is. It is enough to turn on a Leviathan, and two Phoenix Gold Elite amps over here, but anything over that and the unit keeps rebooting. Use a standard Bosh-type automotive relay, send the remote out into the relay and have the relay provide the current to turn on all of your shyte.

I use StreetWires interconnects and to make them feel expensive they engineered them to fit very tightly around everything. This caused the same issue you describe on channel 7 for me. It fits right back in with no problem. Another thing that might happen that you need to watch out for is the red or white plastic ring piece might fall off.

As to corrosion I dont know, I havent had that issue and I live in SoCal by the ocean


----------



## eviling

oca123 said:


> Funny, the first 2 issues happened here.
> You need to use a relay. I couldnt find anywhere in the documentation what the max current draw on the remote out is. It is enough to turn on a Leviathan, and two Phoenix Gold Elite amps over here, but anything over that and the unit keeps rebooting. Use a standard Bosh-type automotive relay, send the remote out into the relay and have the relay provide the current to turn on all of your shyte.
> 
> I use StreetWires interconnects and to make them feel expensive they engineered them to fit very tightly around everything. This caused the same issue you describe on channel 7 for me. It fits right back in with no problem. Another thing that might happen that you need to watch out for is the red or white plastic ring piece might fall off.
> 
> As to corrosion I dont know, I havent had that issue and I live in SoCal by the ocean


I only have my remote on a leviathan and a minatour. 2 amps, that's def not to much from what you describe but maybe you only had one ZED< maybe they have large remote draws? that would be the only logical thing to me other than it shorting out at the amp with a frayed wire strand or something but I coudln't find anything unless it's internal, the decks remote output might not be as sensative? but it is an alpine deck as well. S930HD. whitch by the way i flipping love evrything about it. its a solid piece. GPS is great, very gardget friendly i love gadgets but for most it is a cluster **** when in a rout in the city, but you can zoom out it helps. the music i now know comes out a full 5 seconds before the screen with I would guesstimate to be about a 20-25 second boot. but lets put it to you this way, by the time my cars computer **** is fully booted and before its even done beeping for resgistration of all of its passes, their is music. and im not even in gear usialy before that if i dont already remote start it which i almost always do in the winter.


----------



## eekern

Randyman... said:


> My "real world" 2 Cents:
> 
> Unless the converters are just piss poor, I'll be OK with going D>A>D>A with the W535. My previous install had the Sony C90/XDP4000X/Dual Changer combo. The C90 and one changer were Toslink to the XDP DSP. The second changer was Analog to the XDP DSP. I could not tell the difference in an un-scientific test using the same CD's - and these were 18-Bit and 20-Bit 44/48K AD/DA converters from the 90's! (granted, some of the best ones availabe in their time!).
> 
> Even in my studio, I don't mind coming into the DAW via Analog even if Digital connections are available - more so if there will be sample rate conversion to contend with and such. Even lots of Mastering Engineers will use a D>A>D loop ("Pitch" and "Catch") to perform Samplerate conversion instead of doing SRC in the digital domain!
> 
> Converters of today (even cheapish ones) have really come a long way from the first DAC's in the first CD Players IMO. Not to say that all converters are good - but at this level (W535 + H800) - I think they did enough R&D to get the pre-fabbed chips sounding good "in circuit" (the analog circuitry around the pre-fabbed chips is likely up to par)...
> 
> If there is an easy way to do this - I'd look into it, but seems like more hassle than the simplicity of staying analog would provide me (have to split off the 30-pin somehow so the Radio can still control the iPod, convert from Coax/Electircal to Optical via another unit, etc). Then there's the $$$ GPS in the 901 I'd never use
> 
> Why oh why Alpine: Why can't your DSP R&D team be on the same page with your HU R&D Teams!!! I was serisouly scratching my head last month when I learned NONE of the new HU's have AI-Net when the H800 is such a capable piece (a PERFECT upgrade from my aging XDP4000X - minus the need for a separate controller  ). Sony has done some pretty boneheaded things in their time - but this AI-Net omission skirts on blatant stupidity IMO. Only one explanation: "Marketing Department"! :laugh:


My "experience based" 2 cents:
Maybe the above is one of the reasons most new recordings have such a sterile sound....

In my experience humans have very poor aural memory. When comparing the sound of two components, the switch has to be almost instantaneous to hear differences. One of the cool things about the system I put together is I can power down the digital break out and go back to the analog with only a couple seconds of silence. The difference is not subtle.....more space around instruments, more air, and more depth to the sound stage when eliminating the extra conversions. Reminded me of listening to a good turntable set up versus a poor cd


----------



## eekern

tokapaho said:


> Can you elaborate in more detail? How did you accomplish this and what is needed?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I was going to keep this my personal secret but now with the lightning connector the game has changed again.......

Items needed,

Apple AV adapter
HDMI cable
Monoprice HDMI splitter
5 volt dc-dc converter
toggle switch
pac tr7 (optional)
fiber optic cable

The apple av adapter works with an ipod touch or ipad to provide an HDMI av output and 30 pin connector for syncing/charging. I connect the 30 pin to the ipod connector of the 910 and send the hdmi output to the input of the Monoprice hdmi splitter (powered by the 5 volt converter). The splitter breaks out the HDMI signal into seperate audio and video. I then send the audio (via fiber optic) into the #3 toslink input of the 701 (which is a signal sensing input). The toggle switch is used to power the mono price splitter up as this needs to be done after the alpine powers up to properly "hand shake" the i-pod and monoprice splitter. This was kind of a pain but worth the effort. I later added a pac ptr7 to delay the turn on of the splitter by 16 seconds to automatically sync the pieces, pain gone. The system works by selecting ipod as the source, then switching on the splitter and sending the digital signal into digital in #3 on the 701 which signal senses and turns on. The beauty is the 910 still stays on the ipod screen for control and metadata. The only downside is no nav voice prompts when this input is triggered.
I can tell you all conections must be very solid and strain relief-ed.....hdmi was not designed for automotive use. Oh, and dont be a dumba$$ and expect your mp3s you stole off the internet to sound better. The damage has already been done. Rip some cds in wav and enjoy the music


----------



## Randyman...

On the H800 topic:

So will the W901 HU actually recall presets on the H800? Assuming one can have a few different presets ready to go (a few different EQ Tilts, and Driver/Passenger versions of each), would any of you say the RUX is not needed to enjoy some basic "tweaking" via preset selection? And does the W901 control the H800's volume, or does it simply attenuate the W901's own analog outputs?

Then, if I was to use 4 RCA's from W901 to H800, could I still use the Sub Out (or F/R fader) on the W901 to control the overall Sub Level?

If any of what I assume is correct, then I could see pushing for the W901 over the INE-S920HD. Otherwise, S920HD + RUX + dedicated GPS will be ideal for me (with the extra DA/AD/DA chain and all!  )...



Now to address eerken's above post:



eekern said:


> My "experience based" 2 cents:


Oposed to what - my "Real World" 2 cents? How is "experience based" 2 cents any different (or better) than "real world" 2 cents? Are "real world" experiences not qualified to count as "experience" - or is "experience" only something you pick up in a classroom? I guess I'm missing the point of your extraneous qualification...



eekern said:


> Maybe the above is one of the reasons most new recordings have such a sterile sound....


So, a DA/AD/DA chain in a high-end car audio system is suddenly to blame for the mastering "loudness wars" and the overall smiley-face tendencies of the musical productions in the 21st Century? Wow - that's a stretch!

I will admit I do lean slightly towards a top/bottom heavy mix with the bands I engineer (I track and mix local bands, and have played drums for over 20 years), but I can assure you a DA/AD/DA chain in a high-end car audio system has nothing to do with that!



eekern said:


> *In my experience* humans have very poor aural memory. When comparing the sound of two components, the switch has to be almost instantaneous to hear differences.


Your "In my experience" opinon is a well known fact - don't need "experience" to know that.



eekern said:


> One of the cool things about the system I put together is I can power down the digital break out and go back to the analog with only a couple seconds of silence.


Same here. The Sony Changers in my system could be swapped in mere seconds - and could use identical CD's at the same point of a song, etc. I did not hear (and am not tricked into hearing) dramatic (or discernable) deviations in an A/B/X test. Considering these were "old school" 90's AD/DA's by any standard, I do belive I might have been able to discern the difference in a more controlled setup (like with my Dynaudio AIR-15's and AIR-BASE-2's I use for Mixing  ). But in a car environment - I could not pick the Toslink Changer over the Analog Changer in my particular XDP4000x based system...



eekern said:


> The difference is not subtle.....more space around instruments, more air, and more depth to the sound stage when eliminating the extra conversions. Reminded me of listening to a good turntable set up versus a *poor cd*


Poor CD? Poor vinyl IMNSHO 

Extra DA/AD/DA conversions are only noticeably detrimental if passed through inferior converters. Those are less and less likely to be encountered with gear designed and built in the 21st century IMO. The cheap DAC chips are pretty good these days, and the mid/upper consumer markets' chips are holding their own against the big boys IMO.

Just my "Real World" input


----------



## eekern

Randy, You sound like a smart guy. Let me clarify a couple of my statements.



Randyman... said:


> On the H800 topic:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now to address eerken's above post:
> 
> 
> Oposed to what - my "Real World" 2 cents? How is "experience based" 2 cents any different (or better) than "real world" 2 cents? Are "real world" experiences not qualified to count as "experience" - or is "experience" only something you pick up in a classroom? I guess I'm missing the point of your extraneous qualification...
> 
> *What I meant by "experience based" was that I have just recently, as posted, done a direct a/b comparison between listening to the same system with direct digital signal versus a mutiple conversion signal using both cd and ipod. The difference was not subtle and what I was hearing was confirmed by multiple people. *
> 
> 
> So, a DA/AD/DA chain in a high-end car audio system is suddenly to blame for the mastering "loudness wars" and the overall smiley-face tendencies of the musical productions in the 21st Century? Wow - that's a stretch!
> 
> *As i stated this may be "one" of the reasons, not "the" reason. Definitely what you stated above has made a world of difference as well.*
> 
> I will admit I do lean slightly towards a top/bottom heavy mix with the bands I engineer (I track and mix local bands, and have played drums for over 20 years), but I can assure you a DA/AD/DA chain in a high-end car audio system has nothing to do with that!
> 
> *When you mix those bands, I am sure you dont do it in 16/41 format like our high-end car audio does....im sure you atleast do it in 24/96 if not 24/192. You cant tell me subtle nuances arnt lost with the extra 16/41 conversions*
> 
> 
> Your "In my experience" opinon is a well known fact - don't need "experience" to know that.
> 
> *I dont think that fact is as well known as you think. Many customers I have demo'ed speakers to over the years say they cant tell the difference, or they have tin ears. That is until I play them a proper demo and the light bulb goes on*
> 
> 
> Same here. The Sony Changers in my system could be swapped in mere seconds - and could use identical CD's at the same point of a song, etc. I did not hear (and am not tricked into hearing) dramatic (or discernable) deviations in an A/B/X test. Considering these were "old school" 90's AD/DA's by any standard, I do belive I might have been able to discern the difference in a more controlled setup (like with my Dynaudio AIR-15's and AIR-BASE-2's I use for Mixing  ). But in a car environment - I could not pick the Toslink Changer over the Analog Changer in my particular XDP4000x based system...
> 
> *Im talking maybe a dropout of 1/2 second from the exact same player, disc or ipod. It was pretty clear to hear when the switch was made, real time, in either direction. Im sure it would have been much more difficult if I had to get in the car and tell you which set up it was without the switch. *
> 
> 
> 
> Poor CD? Poor vinyl IMNSHO
> 
> *I think you took this out of context. I did not mean, in general, cds sound bad and vinyl is all good. I have heard and own plenty of good and bad exmples of both. I meant the the sound difference was similiar to what I hear when I listen to good vinyl pressing of an alblum versus a poor cd of the same alblum.*
> 
> Extra DA/AD/DA conversions are only noticeably detrimental if passed through inferior converters. Those are less and less likely to be encountered with gear designed and built in the 21st century IMO. The cheap DAC chips are pretty good these days, and the mid/upper consumer markets' chips are holding their own against the big boys IMO.
> 
> *The difference is there, especially when adding extra 16/41 conversions. When Im spending thousands of dollars and hundreds of man hours on an install I prefer to not short change my efforts in any way.
> 
> As I finish, Ijust remembered a display elettromedia had at CES a few years back. It had a bit one being fed analog and digital from the same head unit(dont remember the brand of radio but it had a digital out so I am sure it was no entry level) The difference was pretty apparent their as well.*
> 
> Just my "Real World" input


*I look foward to your comments*


----------



## oca123

quality_sound said:


> Ummm, RTFM??? lol
> 
> Seriously, the auto-tune has NOTHING to do with what HU you're running. You'll initiate it either with the C800 or a laptop. You use the disc supplied with the unit as well. It's reptty simple but it has to be DEAD quiet for it to work. It does a pretty good job as a base tune and you can mod it from there.


Actually you can only initiate auto t/a from the C800. Auto-tune is done from the laptop only. It could be because spatial averaging of all the measurements, filtering, smoothing, generating correction filters, and applying user-selected curve are all done on the computer before the filters are sent back to the H800. Imprint is almost the only thing that you can't do from the controller.


----------



## quality_sound

oca123 said:


> Actually you can only initiate auto t/a from the C800. Auto-tune is done from the laptop only. It could be because spatial averaging of all the measurements, filtering, smoothing, generating correction filters, and applying user-selected curve are all done on the computer before the filters are sent back to the H800. Imprint is almost the only thing that you can't do from the controller.


I'm pretty sure I initiated both, or tried to, but couldn't because there was too much noise. I was driving. When I did it parked I was at home and used the laptop since it's easier to manage everything other than TA and XO stuff.


----------



## oca123

I've run Road-EQ and auto T/A from the remote, but I've never seen an option to run Imprint from anything other than a computer. I don't even think that it would be possible??


----------



## quality_sound

It's a pain from the C800 because you have to get in and enable certain things and play with other settings. For that sort of thing it REALLY is easier from a computer.


----------



## cchrono

Haven't installed it yet but manual says you can only run imprint with computer.


----------



## 2way+sub

eekern said:


> The apple av adapter works with an ipod touch or ipad to provide an HDMI av output and 30 pin connector for syncing/charging.


and not with ipod classic really?


----------



## Randyman...

Before the OT Stuff - Can anyone confirm my previous Q's that the W901 HU can actually _recall presets_ and control volume from the H800 - and would any of you think presets would be adequate for minor tweaking (once tuned & tweaked with a Laptop)? Plus - how many H800 presets can actually be recalled from the W901?

My old XDP4000X setup had similar limitations (had to use a laptop to program it, and only had Preset Recall via HU, but could recall X-Over/TA separately from EQ presets) - and it worked OK for me once I had it tweaked and tuned with the bulky Laptop. I had a few different EQ Tilts depending on what I was listening to, and Driver/Passenger T/A presets - that along with a remote bass knob on the subs was just barely adequate for my "on the fly" tweaking desires.

I'd really like to forego the separate RUX if at all possible - but will gladly add it if it makes practical sense (W901+H800 w/o RUX or W535+H800+RUX).





eekern said:


> Randy, You sound like a smart guy. Let me clarify a couple of my statements. I look foward to your comments


I can certainly blow smoke with the best of them, but I do like to think I’ve been around the block a time or two. 



eekern said:


> What I meant by "experience based" was that I have just recently, as posted, done a direct a/b comparison between listening to the same system with direct digital signal versus a mutiple conversion signal using both cd and ipod. The difference was not subtle and what I was hearing was confirmed by multiple people.
> [snip]
> Im talking maybe a dropout of 1/2 second from the exact same player, disc or ipod. It was pretty clear to hear when the switch was made, real time, in either direction. Im sure it would have been much more difficult if I had to get in the car and tell you which set up it was without the switch.


And my system would switch in about 1.5-2 seconds (one changer to the other via the HU’s “Mode” button). The way I see it, if you can’t hear a perceptible and repeatable difference after 2 seconds, then the differences aren’t worth worrying about in the least. Change your T/A by 0.5ms and save a preset, and you will absolutely hear the A/B difference with something like that…




eekern said:


> When you mix those bands, I am sure you dont do it in 16/41 format like our high-end car audio does....im sure you atleast do it in 24/96 if not 24/192. You cant tell me subtle nuances arnt lost with the extra 16/41 conversions


44.1/24 over here 24/7. I can do upto 32 Analog Inputs and 32 Analog Outputs @ 96K (and 48 Analog ins and 48 Analog outs @ 44/48K plus 16 ADAT Ins and Outs), but my current SSL-Alphalink setup is not 192K compliant. Considering most mics (even high-end mics) have a pretty sharp rolloff above 18K-20K, I just don’t see the need for anything more (Nyquist dictates 44.1K is plenty adequate for 20K bandwidth) – and 2x the sample rate means ½ as much effective DSP/CPU is leftover in the DAW. I’m not a fan of wasting resources just to make myself feel good 




eekern said:


> The difference is there, especially when adding extra 16/41 conversions. When Im spending thousands of dollars and hundreds of man hours on an install I prefer to not short change my efforts in any way.
> [snip]
> As I finish, I just remembered a display elettromedia had at CES a few years back. It had a bit one being fed analog and digital from the same head unit(dont remember the brand of radio but it had a digital out so I am sure it was no entry level) The difference was pretty apparent their as well.


I can’t say I’ve tested a BitOne, and I have no idea what sources they were using. I can say that with the Sony CDX-828 Changers in my old system feeding the XDP4000X DSP, I could not hear a difference. This leads me to believe one of a few things: Either the source unit’s DAC was just piss poor (possibly had a high jitter clock feeding it, or just poor analog circuitry), the BitOne’s ADC’s aren’t good, or that there were other factors at play with that demo. The Sony equipment I have experience with is coveted for their high-quality DA/AD’s (albeit a 90’s design) – so maybe the BitOne and Source unit you have experience with utilize sub-standard conversion by comparison? There aren’t many other explanations that I can see.

I also have the ability to quickly A/B Digital vs Analog with my Dynaidio AIR-15 Studio monitors. They are an Active Digital Monitor, and use use the DSP and AD/DA converters form the coveted TC Electronic System 6000 Mastering Processor, and obviously use high-end Dynaudio drivers in nice enclosures (200w per driver).

When feeding them a pure SPDIF signal via my RME Multiface (one of my cheaper converters/interfaces), I can also swap over to the Multiface’s Analog Outs, and feed them into the AIR-15’s Analog Inputs (a DA/AD loop). When gain matching and flipping from SPDIF to Analog I/O, I cannot tell them apart. Granted, these are descent converters by any standards – but there is absolutely no perceptible difference in soudstage, detail, frequency response, etc. There might be a measureable difference that is imperceptible to Humans’ ears – and I’m not concerned with such discrepancies. There are far better places to improve sound than worrying about things you can’t consistently detect IMO...

It is even common for Mastering Engineers to use a DA>AD Chain to perform Sample-Rate-Conversion over SRC in the Digital Domain! Granted, they are using crazy expensive converters, but it is a fairly common practice. Not always the case, but they use their ears and go with whichever method gives them the best end-result.

If I find some time, I have a way to see if the masses here can detect an extra DA>AD pass on digital file. I can loop-back a SPDIF loop and a DA>AD loop (from the RME Multiface on my Desktop PC, and I might have time to try with the SSL Converters in the Studio) with my DAW Software, and swap back and forth at will. I can render this as a continuous file with the Digital vs Analog flipping back-and-forth throughout the track. I can do this and keep everything gain-matched and sample-accurate in the process.

I’ll see if I can squeak out any time over my weekend – but I’ve got a lot on my plate this week. It should be an interesting exercise regardless. I’m of the opinion if anyone can actually hear a difference and consistently pick out the Digital portions as being “Better”, then the converters are sub-par and upgrades might be worthwhile…

Back to work


----------



## quality_sound

Have you RTFM? That will tell you if it can recall processor presets. Once you set the presets, if you can recall them, just program them with whatever you want. There will be six presets.


----------



## Randyman...

quality_sound said:


> Have you RTFM? That will tell you if it can recall processor presets. Once you set the presets, if you can recall them, just program them with whatever you want. There will be six presets.


I haven't DL'd it yet - But I did see it mentioned casually on the Alpine H800 page. Regardless - I always like to confirm with people that actually use the stuff in this specific scenario to make sure the marketing department isn't sneaking any trickery past me - or that "only revision xx of the W901 will control presets" or whatever. I didn't even realize the W535 omitted Toslink and AI-Net until I read it here (that has to be one of the most boneheaded moves I have seen in product development in a while! It's like the DSP and HU were developed in two separate vacuums at Alpine!).

6 Presets should do - but that is still a bit limiting considering that's TA and EQ combined. Time to ponder. I guess if the W901's GPS is actually usable (seems doubtful from what I've read thus far) - it might get my cash...

Much obliged


----------



## Randyman...

I decided to plunge ahead. I bit the bullet and bought a scratch-n-dent W910 from Crutchfield and the H800 off Amazon (pleasantly surprised by the pricing on both units!). I tossed in the RUX for good measure - if I decide I can live w/o it, I'll sell it...

Can't wait to get this going! Thanks for the input and confirmations.


----------



## quality_sound

Once you get it in, if it's within arm's reach you'll love it. It makes quick changes SO much easier and faster.


----------



## Salad Fingers

quality_sound said:


> Once you get it in, if it's within arm's reach you'll love it.


That's what she said.


----------



## quality_sound

Yep, walked RIGHT into that one. lol


----------



## evo9

Kinda sucks that you cant prep the software without the unit coonected!


----------



## quality_sound

evo9 said:


> Kinda sucks that you cant prep the software without the unit coonected!


Can you do that with anything though?


----------



## evo9

The Bit1 & the Zapco DSP6 I was able to do that.


----------



## quality_sound

I never tried with my Bit1.1 not my Zapcos but it would be handy.


----------



## Randyman...

You could run the Sony XDP DSC software "offline" as well, but I never used it that way...

PS - I'm looking for the KWE-610A cable if one comes up cheap. I might as well include it during the main install as that's the only way I'll be able to A/B the system (analog/digital). I'll gladly pass on Digital for a $135 cable!!! I could justify it if it were handling all Digital Audio, but the fact that only CD's/DVD's are output digitally on the W910 makes it less appealing (in addition to my above rants on DA/AD conversions  )...


----------



## eekern

Randyman... said:


> You could run the Sony XDP DSC software "offline" as well, but I never used it that way...
> 
> PS - I'm looking for the KWE-610A cable if one comes up cheap. I might as well include it during the main install as that's the only way I'll be able to A/B the system (analog/digital). I'll gladly pass on Digital for a $135 cable!!! I could justify it if it were handling all Digital Audio, but the fact that only CD's/DVD's are output digitally on the W910 makes it less appealing (in addition to my above rants on DA/AD conversions  )...


Keep in mind the Panasonic CA-LRD60D will also work, its worth it. If you cant find one I might be able to get you a deal on a KWE-610a (im a dealer) if they are in stock (in typical Alpine fashion they are often on backorder).

I-pod digital info in earlier post.......


----------



## Randyman...

Wow - Thanks for your kind offer, eekern! Get back to me at your leisure.

I plan on running AI-Net, this adapter cable (if I find one for cheap), plus a standard Toslink, a standard pair of RCA's, and remote wire to the H800 just in case I swap out the Alpine HU for a Kenwood (or whatever). I only want to run this stuff once 

Thanks again for your offer! You rock :beerchug: PS - I haven't had time to make the audio track I mentioned - we had some family issues to contend with over the weekend. The project is still on my plate for whenever I get some free time...

Enjoy


----------



## eekern

Randyman... said:


> Wow - Thanks for your kind offer, eekern! Get back to me at your leisure.
> 
> I plan on running AI-Net, this adapter cable (if I find one for cheap), plus a standard Toslink, a standard pair of RCA's, and remote wire to the H800 just in case I swap out the Alpine HU for a Kenwood (or whatever). I only want to run this stuff once
> 
> Thanks again for your offer! You rock :beerchug: PS - I haven't had time to make the audio track I mentioned - we had some family issues to contend with over the weekend. The project is still on my plate for whenever I get some free time...
> 
> Enjoy


another thought....find an old alpine cd changer with toslink out on ebay for 50 bucks and add a 5 dollar toslink?!!!! of course that pesky 800 only has two digi ins.......


----------



## Randyman...

eekern said:


> another thought....find an old alpine cd changer with toslink out on ebay for 50 bucks and add a 5 dollar toslink?!!!! of course that pesky 800 only has two digi ins.......


I've used CD Changers in the past with my Sony XDP systems and older Sony RM-X2 system, and thanks for reminding me that was even an option with the H800! It honestly hadn't crossed my mind. I'm even selling off my old Sony CD Changers and XDP4000X soon - so the "Digital CD Changer -to- DSP" thing is fresh in my head!

That said, I'd like to stick with the simplicity of using the HU for the _sparse_ CD/DVD playback I anticipate from my system. The iPod will get most of the playback duties with 320kbps mp3, Waves ripped from CD's, or 24-bit Wave mixdowns of my own projects. I just figured I'd go ahead and run the Toslink cable now as I don't plan on running anything else after my initial install - and I might as well use the Toslink if it's available (that is: _if_ the proprietary cable can be had for a reasonable price).

I'm certainly interested in A/B'ing the connections with this new and unfamiliar gear! I figure a CD played back over Analog will be the same as a 16-Bit Wave on the iPod since both will be using the W910's DA converter and internal clock into the H800's AD's - but the CD over Toslink will obviously have a potential advantage that needs to be auditioned before any meaningful comments can be made on my part.

I look back, and it's funny how Alpine and Sony have demonstrated numerous similarities over the years IMO: Ai-Net / Unilink Bus (even use the same connections, but Sony omits Analog Audio from Unilink). "Modular" DSP Units controlled over Ai-Net/Unilink ("H" series vs "XDP" series). Digital connections on HU's and CD Changers. A proprietary format for getting a standard Toslink feed from the "Digital Capable" HU (the Sony C90 + XA-D210/D211 compared to Alpine's proprietary W910 cable mentioned in this thread). "F1" vs "XES". Sony's old-school CD Changers use the same cable Aline uses for the ERA-G320. The Sony RM-X2 vs ERA-G320 concept (wired remote "face"). Etc. ...

Lots of intersections there!

Alpine has kept on innovating and refining their high-end segment through present times (H800 is a nice example if I don't say so myself!), where Sony's "Elevated Standard" Car Audio chapter gave up the ghost long ago (99/00 with the AWESOME "Big Red" ES amps IMO - still have two 7547's and a 7527 in the closet along with a 2100G  ). I'll surely be glad to get an Alpine based system back in my ride! (a spankin' new system for a spankin' new ride!  ). I haven't run an Alpine HU since 1992 or so. Time flies...


----------



## Reginaldocm

I installed the H800 in the car along with the DVA 9965, fiber optic connection and Ai-Net, was very good, beyond my expectations.

Before the same set used in H701, change audio was impressive, the sound was much more focus and image.

Now in December will be a step in the EMMA in Brazil, let's see if I can keep the 3rd place of the previous step, or if I improve a little more, lol


----------



## KenB129

I posted here before about the processor not having decent imaging and it was suggested that my speakers were out of phase. I put a CD in and verified they were in phase - the sound was excellent with vocals in the center right where it should be. Well I never had time to dig deeper into it until today.

I put on a test CD that has a voice narrating whether it's in phase or out of phase. With my head between speakers the voice was dead center when it should be and jumped to the speakers when out of phase, the classic sound for speakers wired out of phase. I further tested AM, XM, and sound from my phone in mono, and it had that same effect with sounding like the speakers were out of phase.

The only difference is that I'm using the optical cable for CD and AI-NET for all other sources. Any thoughts?

BTW, the music on that 22yr audiophile test sounded phenomenal compared to most made today...


----------



## Reginaldocm

I have a doubt, someone already made ​​a comparison between the set D800/D511 + PXA H800 against a set DVA 9990 + PXI 990?


----------



## quality_sound

KenB129 said:


> I posted here before about the processor not having decent imaging and it was suggested that my speakers were out of phase. I put a CD in and verified they were in phase - the sound was excellent with vocals in the center right where it should be. Well I never had time to dig deeper into it until today.
> 
> I put on a test CD that has a voice narrating whether it's in phase or out of phase. With my head between speakers the voice was dead center when it should be and jumped to the speakers when out of phase, the classic sound for speakers wired out of phase. I further tested AM, XM, and sound from my phone in mono, and it had that same effect with sounding like the speakers were out of phase.
> 
> The only difference is that I'm using the optical cable for CD and AI-NET for all other sources. Any thoughts?
> 
> BTW, the music on that 22yr audiophile test sounded phenomenal compared to most made today...


Why did you listen with your head in the middle? Do you drive sitting on your center console?


----------



## KenB129

quality_sound said:


> Why did you listen with your head in the middle? Do you drive sitting on your center console?


I listened that way because I suspected something was not right - I posted a description some pages back but didn't have time to find it when I posted. 

I was starting to think that FM radio had declined to complete garbage until I finally tried other sources and determined that the only thing that sounded right is CD, as far as imaging goes.


----------



## eekern

Randyman... said:


> I'm certainly interested in A/B'ing the connections with this new and unfamiliar gear! I figure a CD played back over Analog will be the same as a 16-Bit Wave on the iPod since both will be using the W910's DA converter and internal clock into the H800's AD's - but the CD over Toslink will obviously have a potential advantage that needs to be auditioned before any meaningful comments can be made on my part.


Randy,

The I-pod signal is converted internally to analog before being sent to the W910 and passed on via ai-net to the h800 AD. That being said, the ipod modders out there claim the i-pod dac is not the weak link (wolfson, if memory serves me right), the analog output stage is....


----------



## n_olympios

They mean the analog stage in the iPod and not the Alpine HU's, right? Because if not I beg to differ; even when comparing iPod to Alpine cd via analog output through to the processor, the latter is better. At least that's what happens with my W505R/iPod Classic/H900 combo.


----------



## Randyman...

eekern said:


> Randy,
> 
> The I-pod signal is converted internally to analog before being sent to the W910 and passed on via ai-net to the h800 AD. That being said, the ipod modders out there claim the i-pod dac is not the weak link (wolfson, if memory serves me right), the analog output stage is....


Where does that happen when connecting the iPod digitally over USB (as is SOP on the W910)? It would seem to me that the iPod caches the data into the W910 via USB where it (the W910) then converts to Analog (the same way it would if playing back a CD via AI-Net). I don't believe an analog path exists between the iPod and W910 when using the USB Interface (making the iPod's analog output section a moot point).

I just got all of my equipment delivered, but I haven't had time to dig in and play around with it before the install. I'm sure I'll know every facet about the W910 and H800 by the time I get around to installing them  I'm a bit OCD in that regard


----------



## jim1274

Would there likely be an audible difference between a high quality analog input versus digital input to the 800? 

I am going to use an Itouch on the Aux input and trying to decided if it is worth the extra complexity to use a Pure i20 to feed a digital signal to the 800 vs using an iStreamer. In theory the i20 seems to be a much better option, but is the difference likely to be audible? I know the i20 is cheaper by 100 bucks, but the form factor is not as install friendly as the iStreamer in my situation. 

I considered just using a line out converter cable on the Itouch, but that only delivers 1v output vs 2v for the iStreamer, and the iStreamer has better(?) DAC than the Itouch.


----------



## quality_sound

A what? WTF is an iTouch? Oh, an iPod Touch.

There is a small difference between analog and optical on H800. So small that I wouldn't bother unless you're running an Alpinr HU.


----------



## jim1274

Oh...sorry...I meant iPod touch (gen 4)

I suppose it comes down to whether DTS playback capability is worth it--the 800 would automatically sense and decode a digital DTS file? I assume the iPod would support DTS since the format is wav file (which it supports) and it is just passing through the digital bits using an i20? Maybe even DTS via the iPod FLAC player, since you can encode DTS in a FLAC wrapper. 

I am surprised there is not more discussion on using the 800 for DTS decoding, unless I missed it. 

The 800 literature notes high quality wolfson DAC, but not sure how that compares to DAC in iStreamer. It is kind of a waste to use a good DAC between iPod and 800 just to do ADC for processing then DAC again for output...but...audible diff is key.,,


----------



## oca123

Optical that way is stereo only IIRC.
The i20 can be opened up and made very small. I'll have to snap some pictures, but mine is roughly the size of an iphone, but about as thick as a pack of cigarettes. i had an enclosure made out of aluminum for it with a lexan top. much better than the fugly i20 case.


----------



## jim1274

oca123 said:


> Optical that way is stereo only IIRC.
> The i20 can be opened up and made very small. I'll have to snap some pictures, but mine is roughly the size of an iphone, but about as thick as a pack of cigarettes. i had an enclosure made out of aluminum for it with a lexan top. much better than the fugly i20 case.


Good to know that the 800 won't decode DTS from the optical in--too bad on that.

The i20 seems the best solution for using an Ipod device with the 800, at least in theory. 100 bucks for a toslink input is nice, especially with your mod that cleans up the form factor for car use.

Anybody try both a line out dock and the i20 for an aux in via Ipod? Would be interesting to hear the results. The iSteamer would seem to be somewhere between the two in quality, at least in theory.


----------



## oca123

I never said the H800 cannot decode DTS on its optical input. I said that iPod to i20 to optical input on H800 is stereo only. I believe the H800 can receive 5.1 over its optical inputs, but I'd have to check on the manual.

I have used both a 30-pin to line-out adapter, and optical via i-20 with my ipod. Using analog, you have to be careful to route the signal cable away from anything that could introduce noise, and use a good quality shielded cable. You also need to make sure that you set the input gains on the H800 properly. That last step is crucial. Assuming all of that is done properly, it should sound close to optical, if not the same, to human ears anyway.

The i20 ensures that dynamic range is always the best it can be, and being optical means you can charge your phone/ipod and it will not cause any ground noise/etc. to be introduced, ever... whereas I've had line out docks that over time would start getting noisy when charging the ipod.


----------



## quality_sound

Most people use the H800 for a 3-way front plus sub(s) so surround processing isn't possible.


----------



## oca123

which is too bad really. Surround, etc. can sound really good if you have speakers in the right locations, and properly encoded (not upmixed) source material.
One day, hopefully, we will have a processor with enough outputs to do a 3-way front active and still have room for 2-way rear, stereo subs, 2-way center channel, and maybe some "ambiance" tweeters hidden away in A/C ducts (ok im exaggerating now) - considering a Cirrus Logic DSP chip costs $4 to $6 depending on QTY ordered, and their new DSP line includes everything including D/A, it is possible...


----------



## n_olympios

It's a very good thing that Alpine insist in incorporating multi-channel processing in their systems, because let's face it, there's no other choice out there. Now, if you do want a 3-way front, sub and multichannel, you could always get a s/h F#1 processor (or two, I never claimed it's going to be cheap). Or use a passive crossover for mid and tweeter up front, thus using the other channels for midbass, rear, sub, center.


----------



## jim1274

oca123 said:


> I never said the H800 cannot decode DTS on its optical input. I said that iPod to i20 to optical input on H800 is stereo only. I believe the H800 can receive 5.1 over its optical inputs, but I'd have to check on the manual.
> 
> I have used both a 30-pin to line-out adapter, and optical via i-20 with my ipod. Using analog, you have to be careful to route the signal cable away from anything that could introduce noise, and use a good quality shielded cable. You also need to make sure that you set the input gains on the H800 properly. That last step is crucial. Assuming all of that is done properly, it should sound close to optical, if not the same, to human ears anyway.
> 
> The i20 ensures that dynamic range is always the best it can be, and being optical means you can charge your phone/ipod and it will not cause any ground noise/etc. to be introduced, ever... whereas I've had line out docks that over time would start getting noisy when charging the ipod.


I scanned the manual for the H800 and came up empty on the question of how it handles DTS presented to the digital input.

Since DTS is in a wav wrapper, I thought it would pass it just like a stereo wav file to the H800. Obviously, I am not understanding this correctly.


----------



## eviling

so the guy who got my h800 informed me he can't find the disc. idk if i forgot it or lost it, i can't find it, and doesn't seem to be availble online to redily, i don't remmber if you NEED the disc some reason i think i did, but if i don't could somebody hook me up so i can help this guy out  thanks


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## n_olympios

jim1274 said:


> I scanned the manual for the H800 and came up empty on the question of how it handles DTS presented to the digital input.
> 
> Since DTS is in a wav wrapper, I thought it would pass it just like a stereo wav file to the H800. Obviously, I am not understanding this correctly.


Pages 32 to 34 and 54 to 57 of the manual will probably answer your questions.


----------



## jim1274

n_olympios said:


> Pages 32 to 34 and 54 to 57 of the manual will probably answer your questions.


My conclusion is that the H800 in fact does NOT decode a digital DTS signal input into discrete 5.1 channel output. It must downmix 5.1 DTS to 2 channel.

You could use the analog 5.1 input to feed the H800 from an external source that decodes DTS like a DVD player or some such. It appears that is the only option for true discrete 5.1 surround playback with an H800.

Do I have it right now?


----------



## n_olympios

No. 

It does in fact decode a DTS 5.1 signal to its discrete channels. The only reason it would downmix it into 2 channels is if you set it so through the menu.


----------



## jim1274

n_olympios said:


> No.
> 
> It does in fact decode a DTS 5.1 signal to its discrete channels. The only reason it would downmix it into 2 channels is if you set it so through the menu.


I did see that, but a bit confusing--would have thought they would be more explicit and note discrete 5.1 channel output.

Has anyone actually tested inputting a discreet 5.1 DTS signal to the digital input and verified that it will decode and properly output 5.1 channels??


----------



## quality_sound

Not in my car, but I know people that have.


----------



## Hextall 27

cpcustoms said:


> So, I just wanted to raise the question...
> 
> Why did Alpine decide to get me all excited by making a Nav unit with the ability for DVD-A playback of 24/96k encoding and put a digital optical out on the unit... and then make the H-800 to accept the digital optical in for beautiful SQ tuning... and then really bum me out when i read the manual and it states this about the encoding of the optical line:
> 
> "The audio signals recorded on the disc are converted to 48 kHz/16 bit (for DVDs) or 44.1 kHz (for Video CDs and CDs) linear PCM audio signals for output."
> 
> 
> I might as well just play a normal CD with that encoding coming out the back.
> 
> Now ive heard different conflicting things about the Bandwidth limits of optical transfer cables, some say they max out at 16 bit, other specs say they max out at the transfer of 24 bit. But if they were going for a new generation of "sound quality" pieces (which im glad they are FINALLY coming back to that at least somewhat in the USA. but why make it have the ability for DVD-A playback and Digital out with such a letdown on the actual output stage of the deck and the subsequent input stage of the H-800? If it truly is for the limitations of optical, then why not digital coax? It could have had GREAT inductive noise resistance and transferred the true 24/96. Just some thoughts for Alpine USA... Maybe someday i can actually use my car with the same Hi-Res recordings as my HT system? hint hint...
> 
> And anyone know what the deal is with their Proprietary optical cable? is it just so that you are forced to buy theirs? or is there a converter to regular toslink or an even better 3.5mm mini optical jack? I would rather get a higher end optical cable to run between the units if i decide to get them.


Has this been confirmed? If sent a digital signal from a 9965 for example does it actually downsample? What page of the manual is this on?


----------



## KenB129

KenB129 said:


> I posted here before about the processor not having decent imaging and it was suggested that my speakers were out of phase. I put a CD in and verified they were in phase - the sound was excellent with vocals in the center right where it should be. Well I never had time to dig deeper into it until today.
> 
> I put on a test CD that has a voice narrating whether it's in phase or out of phase. With my head between speakers the voice was dead center when it should be and jumped to the speakers when out of phase, the classic sound for speakers wired out of phase. I further tested AM, XM, and sound from my phone in mono, and it had that same effect with sounding like the speakers were out of phase.
> 
> The only difference is that I'm using the optical cable for CD and AI-NET for all other sources. Any thoughts?
> 
> BTW, the music on that 22yr audiophile test sounded phenomenal compared to most made today...


Problem solved. Before the processor was installed I was using the time delay built into the head unit. Once the processor was hooked up I thought it bypassed those settings since I could not access them from the head unit. Well it only bypassed them on the optical side, not the AI-NET. Once the installer disconnected the processor and cables he turned delay down to zero for all channels and the sound came right back where it should be.


----------



## Randyman...

eekern said:


> Randy,
> 
> The I-pod signal is converted internally to analog before being sent to the W910 and passed on via ai-net to the h800 AD. That being said, the ipod modders out there claim the i-pod dac is not the weak link (wolfson, if memory serves me right), the analog output stage is....





Randyman... said:


> Where does that happen when connecting the iPod digitally over USB (as is SOP on the W910)? It would seem to me that the iPod caches the data into the W910 via USB where it (the W910) then converts to Analog (the same way it would if playing back a CD via AI-Net). I don't believe an analog path exists between the iPod and W910 when using the USB Interface (making the iPod's analog output section a moot point).
> 
> I just got all of my equipment delivered, but I haven't had time to dig in and play around with it before the install. I'm sure I'll know every facet about the W910 and H800 by the time I get around to installing them  I'm a bit OCD in that regard


FYI/Update - I confirmed a few things:
If playing anything from an iPod listed under the "Music" category, the data is streamed DIGITALLY to the W910 via USB, and is converted to Analog by the W910's DAC and spits out Ai-Net (analog) to the H800. You can completely un-plug the 1/8" iPod A/V connector to the W910 and the USB connection still streams all data to the HU.

If playing anything from the iPod's "Video" category, the 1/8" analog A/V feed is used from the iPod, so you are using the iPod's Audio DAC and Video DAC (the iPod is rendering all of the digital data to analog). This is ONLY true with Video files. If you un-plug the 1/8" jack on the W910 when playing back Video, the audio and video instantly go away.

"Music" files DO NOT use the iPod's analog circuitry at all with the W910 over USB...

I'm not sure about the H800's downsampling mentioned above, but I can assure you a Toslink SPDIF cable can actually carry EIGHT CHANNELS of 24bit 48K linear Wave data (ADAT Optical) - and I know Toslink SPDIF supports upto 24bit/96K Linear Wave data and some Toslink receivers even support 192K Wave. If the H800 is downsampling, it is not due to a limitation in the Toslink Tx/Rx interface that I'm aware...



KenB129 said:


> Problem solved. Before the processor was installed I was using the time delay built into the head unit. Once the processor was hooked up I thought it bypassed those settings since I could not access them from the head unit. Well it only bypassed them on the optical side, not the AI-NET. Once the installer disconnected the processor and cables he turned delay down to zero for all channels and the sound came right back where it should be.


I'll have to remember that one! I'm currently running the W910 on my front door speakers until I get the amps and crap installed - I'll make sure to zero this out BEFORE integrating the H800!

As you were


----------



## t3sn4f2

Not following to close to please forgive me and ignore this post if it is out of place but.......

the ipod usb connection on the w910 has some type of DAC after the usb circuit and before the internal alpine DSP in order to source select in a less complex and costly way along with the other analog sources (ie fm, aux, etc.). This is why you don't see no other source other than CD on the digi out (ie spdif is taken straight from the transport).

Search bikinpunk's w910 measurements review for details on this. Basically an analog output measurement of the w910 would be virtually identical in all sources that remained in the digital domain throughout the peripheral and head unit. And that is not the case, clearly there is a difference when it comes to the usb input which is not the case in other brands. And it's not that its using the ipod dac and alpine ADC since USB can not possibly transmit analog audio.


----------



## t3sn4f2

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/bikinpunks-product-review-forum/108165-alpine-ina-w910-vs-alpine-iva-w505.html

You can see the "summary" results for the "cd" and 'ipod" (ie usb connected ipod) are significantly different. Those vast differences do not show when using different digital sources, no matter the type.


----------



## Randyman...

Interesting - I'll look into that. It seems a bit odd to do this seeing as the "transport" seems to handle everything from Redbook CD's to MP3 CD's to DVD and DVD-A formats - but I guess the digital input "switching" is streamlined in this setup (omitted altogether!). I guess the standalone USB iPod digital>analog decoder chip (inside the W910) was cheaper to implement than a Digital Input Switch capable of directly decoding iPod data?

In any case, the iPod's own analog section is being bypassed when listening to "Music" files - that's clear...


----------



## aznbo187

Can the RUX be used as a volume control/headunit replacement? I plan on using an iphone/ipod aux as my sole and only input, so no radio, cd, or anything else. It would be nice to be able to control/mute the sound via headunit while leaving the iphone somewhere out of reach.


----------



## Randyman...

I believe that's the main appeal of the RUX  I believe you'll still need a PC to access some of the advanced setup stuff. However, you WON'T be able to control the iPod (track selection) from the RUX that I'm aware (I think that was part of your inquiry).

I'm still in the installation process, but I noticed Alpine says the RUX's volume knob is not-operational if using the INA-W910 over Ai-Net. Is this correct? I'd prefer to have both volume knob options available, but keeping the W910 as the primary volume (with steering wheel control) is obviously good enough for me... (PS - I realize the W910 is simply "remote controlling" the gain on the H800 via Ai-Net - which seems like both the W910 and RUX should be able to simultaneously control the volume of the system)

I was also looking into the posts t3sn4f2 mentioned - I'm trying to get in touch with Alpine for clarification - but I'm not terribly concerned with this as the specs are still pretty darn good. And this is installed in a vehicle that travels 100+ miles per day at 70-80MPH - so I'm not going to hear any difference anyway.

If I want to sit in the peace and quiet and enjoy a "real" reference system, I'll crank on my Dynaudio AIR15's and AIR-BASE-II setup at home. No glass reflections 6" from my left ear, equidistant speaker positioning, etc. Just can't beat that in a heavily compromised car system of any sort. At some point, you have to accept the realistic limitations and unique (noisy) environment a car presents. True "reference audio" belongs in a good sounding well-treated room, not in a compromised vehicle with glass just 6" from your left ear!  (all this said as I just dropped about $5k on my truck's audio system!  ). It's just nice to put these comparatively minuscule specs into perspective sometimes


----------



## quality_sound

I think the only thing you need the computer for is auto-tuning but it's been a few months. The C800 does dmn near everything and everything I ever needed it to do.


----------



## Randyman...

quality_sound - Are you running a W910+H800 over Ai-Net by chance? If so, can you control system volume from the W910 and RUX, or just from the W910? Thanks! // Randy V


----------



## quality_sound

Nope, I had an IVA-D800. One you connect Ai-Net volume control reverts to the HU. Why would you want two volume controls?


----------



## Randyman...

My RUX will be mounted down low in my 4Runner - so it would be nice to have its volume control active when futzing with the TC and EQ opposed to reaching up to the radio and back down to the RUX when tweaking. No biggie - but I don't see why both couldn't function - they are just sending control signals after all.

I also prefer a physical knob over the W910's volume buttons - but again - no biggie. I'll gladly keep the W910's steering wheel controls over the RUX's knob


----------



## t3sn4f2

aznbo187 said:


> Can the RUX be used as a volume control/headunit replacement? I plan on using an iphone/ipod aux as my sole and only input, so no radio, cd, or anything else. It would be nice to be able to control/mute the sound via headunit while leaving the iphone somewhere out of reach.


http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/member-reviews-product-comparisons/118616-testing-pure-i20-bit-1-5-ipod-pad-phone-digital-output.html

^This and a lightning to 30 pin dock connector (if you have that type of idevice) is what you need. 

Not that an iDevice can't have a transparent analog output (http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/member-reviews-product-comparisons/138160-iphone-5-analog-output-measurements.html), but for the price of this setup why live with the possible limitations that come with the analog interface (ie rely on the unproven analog AUX in quality of the H800 and the risk of induced noise from a substandard level and ruggedness line level run.

By the way, the above only applies to the headphone jack on iDevices with lightning connectors since the new dock connectors is only digital and as a result the converter/line out dongle has its own DAC built in. IOW the "headphone" and "line" out are now derived from two different DAC stages. So my measurements only apply to running that iPhone via the mini jack out. This is IMO the reason why they move the headphone jack to the base. That way they could provide aftermarket dock makers with a quality analog output and not make them pay for digital output licensing and DAC implementation cost. This can be seen on docks with male lightning post and male mini-jack post along side.


----------



## aznbo187

Would this not also simply be going into the AUX input of the H800?


----------



## beerdrnkr

My girlfriend is picking me up the h800/c800 combo and I'll be running it off a stock headunit. I've used a ton of processors but other than the ms-8 I haven't really tried any of the newer ones that are out. I went with the ms-8 because I run a center channel and currently only have a two way up front. 

I noticed not as many people have the h800 and there's not too many people out there giving reviews. How's everyone enjoying their h800? Any common issues? Thanks. 

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## Audioholik

Ugh. I've been out of the loop & bought a INE-S920HD @ Crutch in a hurry to pair w/the h800, thinking it had AI-Net for sure! Not even an optical!? The 910 has such poor nav reviews, but it looks like I'm stuck w/that if I want to swap. Ridiculous as well that these units don't have full control over the h800. Is the PC Software still only compatible w/up to 32-bit windows 7? Meaning I have to set up a virtual machine to run it or buy the controller?


----------



## quality_sound

NOTHING has full control of the H800. Not even the IVA-D800 which was designed from the get-go to pair with the H800. It does have optical, however, as well as Ai-Net. If you can make a flip-out screen work, I highly recommend using that and returning the 920.


----------



## Audioholik

quality_sound said:


> NOTHING has full control of the H800. Not even the IVA-D800 which was designed from the get-go to pair with the H800. It does have optical, however, as well as Ai-Net. If you can make a flip-out screen work, I highly recommend using that and returning the 920.


Educate me? 800r/e's from euro or? & nav/bluetooth is separate? 

Should have gotten a DCT-z1 & a garmin.


----------



## quality_sound

A Z1 doesn't have any processing in it, right? You'd still be in the same boat. Mine was an E IIRC. I got it from a seller from Hong Kong on eBay. That gets you a US-compatible tuner, region-free DVD playback, and a one-wire DVD bypass. You will lose AM and XM/Sirius compatibility. Since its Ai-net any Alpine Nav module will work. As will the 400BT Bluetooth module.


----------



## Audioholik

quality_sound said:


> A Z1 doesn't have any processing in it, right? You'd still be in the same boat. Mine was an E IIRC. I got it from a seller from Hong Kong on eBay. That gets you a US-compatible tuner, region-free DVD playback, and a one-wire DVD bypass. You will lose AM and XM/Sirius compatibility. Since its Ai-net any Alpine Nav module will work. As will the 400BT Bluetooth module.


Yeah I meant the z1 & the h800. 

Cool, I'll hunt e's. I have 60 days to return this unit to crutchfield, they do biz right, fortunately.


----------



## Randyman...

OK - So t3sn4f2 just pointed out the H800 is pretty sensitive to heat, and mine is mounted above my JL 300/2 in a slightly space-restricted area. I searched this 83 page thread for "Heat", "Over Heat" and "Temperature" but nothing came up.

t3sn4f2 mentioned the H800 can severely malfunction if overheated and smoke an entire system's worth of drivers (a couple of G's in my system). What temps have caused people's H800's to "meltdown" and spit out a full-scale signal to the amps? Mine currently hovers around 44*C (111*F) after being on for over an hour, but the 300/2 amp was not being pushed hard so it was not adding to the heat issue. And - it's winter! 

Also on an un-related issue - is it possible to get the W910's Navigation Audio to spit out Ai-Net into the H800? I know the H800 will work with Alpine's specific external GPS Interface for other Alpine HU's (using the H800's "NAV Audio" RCA Input and trigger wire), but what about the W910 and its built-in navigation?

Thanks so much!


----------



## t3sn4f2

Randyman... said:


> OK - So t3sn4f2 just pointed out the H800 is pretty sensitive to heat, and mine is mounted above my JL 300/2 in a slightly space-restricted area. I searched this 83 page thread for "Heat", "Over Heat" and "Temperature" but nothing came up.
> 
> t3sn4f2 mentioned the H800 can severely malfunction if overheated and smoke an entire system's worth of drivers (a couple of G's in my system). What temps have caused people's H800's to "meltdown" and spit out a full-scale signal to the amps? Mine currently hovers around 44*C (111*F) after being on for over an hour, but the 300/2 amp was not being pushed hard so it was not adding to the heat issue. And - it's winter!
> 
> Also on an un-related issue - is it possible to get the W910's Navigation Audio to spit out Ai-Net into the H800? I know the H800 will work with Alpine's specific external GPS Interface for other Alpine HU's (using the H800's "NAV Audio" RCA Input and trigger wire), but what about the W910 and its built-in navigation?
> 
> Thanks so much!


Sorry maybe I didn't word my post correctly. I wasn't saying that the H800 had issues per say, just that IIRC some processors have run into this plus combined with the fact that the output of a DSP does not have an analog volume buffer to prevent full scale digital signal meltdowns (ie volume control is done in the digital domain so a software bug from overheating could result in a max volt noise output). Which results in nothing worse than playing a sine wave or square wave at typical volume setting (ie low output).

Again, not that it might happen but just a word of caution since people have been loosing speakers because of this type of digital volume controlled output stage combine with a software hiccup and the fact that the part that breaks are expensive speakers. and not a fuse or something benign.


----------



## Randyman...

Thanks for the clarification, t3sn4f2. That settles my nerves a little!

So, has anyone here experienced this with their H800's? Did you get a full-scale signal blasting out to your amps? If so, what was the approx temp reported by your RUX when this happened? Mine seems to hover around 44*C/111*F.

Thanks for any reports from the field


----------



## quality_sound

Randyman... said:


> OK - So t3sn4f2 just pointed out the H800 is pretty sensitive to heat, and mine is mounted above my JL 300/2 in a slightly space-restricted area. I searched this 83 page thread for "Heat", "Over Heat" and "Temperature" but nothing came up.
> 
> t3sn4f2 mentioned the H800 can severely malfunction if overheated and smoke an entire system's worth of drivers (a couple of G's in my system). What temps have caused people's H800's to "meltdown" and spit out a full-scale signal to the amps? Mine currently hovers around 44*C (111*F) after being on for over an hour, but the 300/2 amp was not being pushed hard so it was not adding to the heat issue. And - it's winter!
> 
> Also on an un-related issue - is it possible to get the W910's Navigation Audio to spit out Ai-Net into the H800? I know the H800 will work with Alpine's specific external GPS Interface for other Alpine HU's (using the H800's "NAV Audio" RCA Input and trigger wire), but what about the W910 and its built-in navigation?
> 
> Thanks so much!



Mine had zero issues here in Texas. In the summer. In a Tundra. Without tinted windows. I think if it can take that, you'll be fine with it just about anywhere.

Yes, the navi sounds will come though Ai-Net. The H800 doesn't know what source is what, it just sees signal on the Ai-Net.


----------



## Randyman...

Thanks quality_sound!!! I'm in Texas, too (Houston - born and raised) - so I know what you mean! I do have the "low-e" tint on my ride - so that seems to help keep interior temps down.

I think I'll leave the H800 where it is and see what happens. I haven't installed the Morel front-stage yet - so if anything were to happen I'd only fry my W12GTi's (still not good), $120 Punch 6.5"s in the rear-doors, and the factory front speakers... FYI - Fun Fact - The Stock Speakers in my 4Runner had Neo magnets on them!!! I was a little shocked when I saw this...

I'll look into the W910's Navigation sounds over Ai-Net as I didn't think I was hearing them through the H800 (I know I heard them when I was temporarily using the W910's built-in amp on the front speakers) - but maybe I was a little delirious 

You guys are a wealth of info as always! :bowdown:


----------



## Foosy

n_olympios said:


> No.
> 
> It does in fact decode a DTS 5.1 signal to its discrete channels. The only reason it would downmix it into 2 channels is if you set it so through the menu.


So I have a question to you, or any other experts with this unit:
I want to connect a pxa-h800 to my factory head unit in a Kia sorento. That head unit is part of a premium sound system, and does NOT have discrete outputs. It does have a coaxial SPDIF output that connects to a stock amplifier. I was thinking of also replacing the amp. My plan was to take the SPDIF output, convert it to coaxial and input it to the Alpine pxa-h800, and in turn connect its discrete outputs to new amplifiers and then reusing stock speakers. I do not want at this point to replace the head unit or the speakers. S the questions are:

1. Will this setup work? Has anyone tried this unit with a head unit connected to the optical input?
2. Will I get the surround sound in the car?
3. Will the fader/balance controls in the head unit still work?
4. Will it properly decode the digital multichannel signal coming from the head unit?
5. Will I get significant improvement that is worth this investment, assuming that everything will work?

Some additional details:
- sound in the car now is 'tinny'
- soundstage is overly exaggerated towards center due to overpowering center channel
- the premium system consists of a total of 10 speakers: 1 center, 1 sub, 2 tweeters and 2 mids in front doors, 2 full range in rear doors, and 2 full range in tailgate. My plan is to use the pxa-h800 in a 5.1 configuration, using all 8 channels and eliminating the use of the speakers in the tailgate OR connect them in parallel to the rear speakers - whichever gives me a better sound. 

Any ideas will be greatly appreciated!


----------



## Randyman...

Audioholik said:


> Ugh. I've been out of the loop & bought a INE-S920HD @ Crutch in a hurry to pair w/the h800, thinking it had AI-Net for sure! Not even an optical!? *The 910 has such poor nav reviews, but it looks like I'm stuck w/that if I want to swap.* Ridiculous as well that these units don't have full control over the h800. Is the PC Software still only compatible w/up to 32-bit windows 7? Meaning I have to set up a virtual machine to run it or buy the controller?


Lolz - I had the same reaction in November once I realized the newer Alpine stuff lacks Ai-Net and Optical!!! Luckily I discovered this on the forum BEFORE I purchased (just barely!). This forum is a wealth of info - but the info is sometimes buried between all of the pissing-matches :laugh:

FWIW - I bought the INA-W910 for the Ai-Net and Optical to pair with the H800 - and I was also *very worried about the GPS Performance* based off the reviews. I'm actually happy with it (coming from two Garmin standalones). Granted, it doesn't have the map updates that a Garmin does (I don't believe Alpine has released a single update for the W910 maps) - but it seems current enough for me.

The W910 actually seems to re-route quicker than my Nuvi 2450LM - and this was supposedly one of the sore points for many of the W910's negative GPS reviews!  The W910 does take a little longer to lock onto GPS when powered-on, but not a deal breaker by any means. I would prefer a Garmin GPS built into my W910 - but the few tradeoffs are negated by the nice H800/Ai-Net Integration IMNSHO...

Anyways - I added the RUX-C800 as well - and I'm glad I did. But having the Fader/Sub/Preset and VOLUME CONTROLS function on the W910 are worthwhile - and this means steering-wheel controls still work, too (BONUS!).





Foosy said:


> 1. Will this setup work? Has anyone tried this unit with a head unit connected to the optical input?
> 2. Will I get the surround sound in the car?
> 3. Will the fader/balance controls in the head unit still work?
> 4. Will it properly decode the digital multichannel signal coming from the head unit?
> 5. Will I get significant improvement that is worth this investment, assuming that everything will work?


1 - Should be fine - Where does the level control happen in this factory system? Does the HU digitally attenuate the SPDIF signal, or does the amp have some form of remote volume that responds to the HU?
2. If you choose one of the H800's "Surround" speaker modes - you should.
3. Not likely - You will need to add the RUX-C800 to have ANY kind of control over fader/EQ/TA and Volume. NTM, the H800 won't power on unless an Ai-Net Head-Unit, a PC-USB, or the RUX is connected...
4. Assuming it is a standard bitstream and the factory HU isn't using some proprietary crap - should be able to decode just fine.
5. Very possible - but I would highly consider upgrading speakers unless the stock ones are of very high quality. Why go through all of the expense and effort to use factory speakers?

I was temporarily running my stock speakers off the W910/H800 and a JL 450/4 - the sound was night and day compared to stock - but I anticipate the same level of improvement when I get my truck back from the Car Stereo Shop with the upgraded front-stage (Morel Elate 9"s and Integra Ovation XO 4").


----------



## n_olympios

Foosy, as Randyman says above, in order to correctly answer your questions there's a couple of info bits missing:

a) are we sure that the digital output is indeed SPDIF format? 
b) if so, does the HU support DD/DTS passthrough?
c) how/where is the volume control implemented? 

If you do go through with it, I suggest using the rear speakers in the tailgate instead of those in the rear doors. You might get less bass but them being further away from the front seats and higher is better for rear surround purposes.


----------



## Foosy

n_olympios said:


> Foosy, as Randyman says above, in order to correctly answer your questions there's a couple of info bits missing:
> 
> a) are we sure that the digital output is indeed SPDIF format?
> b) if so, does the HU support DD/DTS passthrough?
> c) how/where is the volume control implemented?
> 
> If you do go through with it, I suggest using the rear speakers in the tailgate instead of those in the rear doors. You might get less bass but them being further away from the front seats and higher is better for rear surround purposes.


Nick,

My post in this forum is intended to help me determine if indded this project is feasible, and if it is feasible - that it will indeed improve performance.

I tried to get information from infinity who manufactures the system for KIA- but they couldn't (or don't want to help), because they do not provide details regarding custom systems they OEM. 

I tried getting information from KIA, and I was able to get a diagram. Through it I can partially answer your questions:

a) I am sure it is SPDIF according to diagram
b) and c) - I don't know

I am attaching the diagram along with my notes on it. Tell me if you can determine other things from it.


----------



## Randyman...

Hard to tell - but it does look like that "CAN" bus is a control bus that allows the radio to control aspects on the amp (EQ, Volume, etc). I don;t see an analog link from HU to Amp - so I assume the HU is digitizing AM/FM at the HU and feeding it over SPDIF.

It is probably safe to assume that IF you currently get discrete 5.1 from the stock setup, then you should be able to use the SPDIF signal for bitstreaming DTS/DD to the H800.

You'll need the RUX-C800 to control volume/fade/EQ/TA/X-over and preset recall.


----------



## n_olympios

What he said.


----------



## Hextall 27

ET328 said:


> Does anyone know: what Alpine head units are compatible to control the PXA-H800? I have seen the Italian compatibility pdf that was posted earlier, but I'm more interested if older models also work as long as they have ai-net connector?


Just to answer this question and for others knowledge ALL Alpine Ai-Net HU are compatible with this processor. Ai-Net is a standard communication protocol that Alpine uses. 

So that means that older HU's such as the 7939, 7949, 7969, 7996 etc will work and you can use the Toslink output of these HU's as well. Finding a connector can be tough though bc of the way the Toslink is at a 90* I have used Esoteric cables that were just slightly cut down. I can verify the 7939/7949/7998/7996 all work as I have tried each with an H800 and H700/701. Using older HU's means that you can control the volume from the HU and you can access the presets. You still need the RUX or a laptop to make your changes, I find that easier anyway when setting things up the first time using an Autosound 2000 set up disc and RTA software. 

In short any head unit with a model number with an A before the - (CD*A*-7939 IV*A*-W505) is an Ai-Net HU. Model numbers with M are M-bus and with an I are the later F#1 Status type bus

Also bc I have seen this mentioned before, Ai-Net DOES NOT carry ANY digital audio signals to the 400/500/610/700/701/800 processors, it is strictly analog 2 ch audio and volume up/dn, track up/dn, remote turn on commands via a proprietary CRC.


----------



## Hextall 27

Foosy said:


> So I have a question to you, or any other experts with this unit:
> I want to connect a pxa-h800 to my factory head unit in a Kia sorento.
> 
> 1. Will this setup work? Has anyone tried this unit with a head unit connected to the optical input? YES
> 2. Will I get the surround sound in the car? I would never use 5.1 in a car but it should decode
> 3. Will the fader/balance controls in the head unit still work? NO
> 4. Will it properly decode the digital multichannel signal coming from the head unit? SAME QUESTION AS 2. AS LONG AS IT IS S/PDIF
> 5. Will I get significant improvement that is worth this investment, assuming that everything will work? YOUR SPEAKERS/FACTORY AMPS WILL BE THE WEAK LINK


Foosy, the slickest way to integrate a processor would be if you can find (and I haven't searched) a CAN interface similar to the mObridge unit that can interface the MOST system with processors such as the H800 or bit one.1 I have been using a Porsche CDR-23 with a mObridge adaptor to feed a bit one.1 and it works very well. The H800 or ANY processor that has S/PDIF input will work.


----------



## Foosy

Randyman... said:


> Hard to tell - but it does look like that "CAN" bus is a control bus that allows the radio to control aspects on the amp (EQ, Volume, etc). I don;t see an analog link from HU to Amp - so I assume the HU is digitizing AM/FM at the HU and feeding it over SPDIF.
> 
> It is probably safe to assume that IF you currently get discrete 5.1 from the stock setup, then you should be able to use the SPDIF signal for bitstreaming DTS/DD to the H800.
> 
> You'll need the RUX-C800 to control volume/fade/EQ/TA/X-over and preset recall.


Randy,
Thanks for your input.
I was planning on using the RUX-C800 as this is the only way to use the PXA-H800 if you are not using an alpine head unit.

I would like to know if someone has actually tackled such an install. There are too many unknowns, and while we can estimate how and if the system will work - we still do not know for sure, and this would be too expensive to fail.

Would be nice if we can get official word from Alpine, or from someone who did a similar upgrade...


----------



## quality_sound

You can either use a mObridge to feed analog or optical (if you have HK) into the H800. If you have the standard audio the best option is to just intercept the analog audio and feed it into the H800 with one of Technic's harnesses. If you tap signal after the OEM amp you'll need to sum the signal with something that can handle that much power and Audio Control is the only company I'm aware of that make a piece that will work. Beyond that it's a basic install.


----------



## Foosy

Hextall 27 said:


> Foosy, the slickest way to integrate a processor would be if you can find (and I haven't searched) a CAN interface similar to the mObridge unit that can interface the MOST system with processors such as the H800 or bit one.1 I have been using a Porsche CDR-23 with a mObridge adaptor to feed a bit one.1 and it works very well. The H800 or ANY processor that has S/PDIF input will work.


Thx Hextall,
Can't use the mObridge unit because its input is optical not coaxial.

So with all the inputs I am getting- it seems like this job *may *be possible.
I just have one question which I must answer before I start:

The diagram I posted has a strange SPDIF connection- it has 3 cables: OUT(+), OUT(-) and GND. This is super strange as SPDIF is to my knowledge only 2 cables. The only explanation I can think of is that it is using a floating ground so that the ground of the signal is different than the chassis ground. 

Is this common in cars? Does anyone have any experience with SPDIF signals in a car? 

If I can confirm the above, I plan to use a Kramer PT-1SPDIF which is a 12vdc SPDIF to TOSLINK converter.


----------



## Randyman...

I noticed the odd SPDIF setup in the fuzzy diagrams, too. I'm not familiar with that setup either, but I am familiar with AES which is basically a balanced version of SPDIF I use in pro-audio - so it seems probable your assumption is correct (balanced carriers plus shield). It would make sense to use a balanced carrier in a vehicle's hostile EMI/RFI environment IMO.

You might need a transformer to properly convert the differential +/- input to a single-ended (signal + shield) Coax SPDIF signal...

I know all of my RME recording gear's Coax I/O's are compatible with AES as they use transformers on their Coax I/O. If you find a Coax-to-Toslink adapter that includes a transformer on the Coax input - that might be all you need (+ to RCA Coax Tip, and - to RCA Coax Shield - float the ground)...

Hopefully someone that's already tacked this hurdle will chime in


----------



## n_olympios

I thought digital signal transfer is not susceptible to emi?


----------



## Hextall 27

Foosy said:


> Thx Hextall,
> Can't use the mObridge unit because its input is optical not coaxial.
> 
> If I can confirm the above, I plan to use a Kramer PT-1SPDIF which is a 12vdc SPDIF to TOSLINK converter.


mObridge was just an example, it doesn't work with CAN anyway.

Can you show us a picture of the connector going into the amp? 3 wires seems like AES/EBU aka Professional Digital. Those signals usually have a different voltage and impedance than S/PDIF aka Consumer Digital. Just because it's labeled like that in the service manual doesn't mean it's actually S/PDIF. 20 years reading OEM schematics and I see lots of errors. You may need a Kramer 465


----------



## Foosy

Hextall 27 said:


> mObridge was just an example, it doesn't work with CAN anyway.
> 
> Can you show us a picture of the connector going into the amp? 3 wires seems like AES/EBU aka Professional Digital. Those signals usually have a different voltage and impedance than S/PDIF aka Consumer Digital. Just because it's labeled like that in the service manual doesn't mean it's actually S/PDIF. 20 years reading OEM schematics and I see lots of errors. You may need a Kramer 465


You are on the same path as I am- thanks again for your input!
I do not have a picture of the connector - I have not tried to remove the passenger seat to get there. I am not sure that it will help me (to ascertain exactly what signal is used) as the connector is not XLR - it is a custom connector. 

As to the Kramer, you are right on. This is the one I would have to use. The one problem is that it costs almost like a new head-unit. If I can confirm that it is indeed AES/EBU I may decide to convert it first to SPDIF and then use the other Kramer converter as it is much cheaper. www.rane.com/note149.html contains a simple schemastic using a few resistors to convert the signal to SPDIF. 

At this point, I am trying to see if I can get confirmation that this is indeed AES. Since the diagram is wrong, it could be many other things unfortunately... Maybe it is a simple stereo signal with a common ground, maybe it is really SPDIF bi-directional? (I read that this head-unit does sound shaping based on sound level). Maybe it is some other thing?


----------



## Randyman...

You can generally use a transformer-isolated SPDIF COAX-to-Toslink adapter with an AES Input. The 75 Ohm to 110 Ohm disparity is not a huge deal at these distances, and the transformer input will allow you to wire the AES's "+" to the Tip/Pin, and the AES's "-" to the Ring/Sleeve (float the AES' Shield). At least this is how my RME Audio Gear works...

Regardless - the fuzzy diagram does specifically label the connection as a "SPDIF" connection - so I'm still not sure what the dealio is...

I'll hit up my installer and see if he can shed some light...


----------



## Foosy

Randyman... said:


> You can generally use a transformer-isolated SPDIF COAX-to-Toslink adapter with an AES Input. The 75 Ohm to 110 Ohm disparity is not a huge deal at these distances, and the transformer input will allow you to wire the AES's "+" to the Tip/Pin, and the AES's "-" to the Ring/Sleeve (float the AES' Shield). At least this is how my RME Audio Gear works...
> 
> Regardless - the fuzzy diagram does specifically label the connection as a "SPDIF" connection - so I'm still not sure what the dealio is...
> 
> *I'll hit up my installer and see if he can shed some light...*


Randy, you da' man! :beerchug:
Thanks for checking this, much appreciated!


----------



## Foosy

Randyman... said:


> ...
> Regardless - th*e fuzzy diagram* does specifically label the connection as a "SPDIF" connection - so I'm still not sure what the dealio is...


Randy and all who have tried to help- I have been able to locate better diagrams. While the diagrams I have are more accurate, they still present the same SPDIF dilemma.

*Diagram of connection between head-unit and amplifier:*









*Diagram of head-unit cabling:*









*Diagam of amplifier cabling:*









*Diagram of amplifier input connector, with highlighted 'SPDIF' pins:*


----------



## Randyman...

I don't have any more info ATM - and I could not find any hits with a quick search for "Balanced SPDIF". I'll be chatting with Speakerpimp on Tuesday - I'll do my best to bring this up and see if he or his gang has dealt with interfacing into a factory system like this.

I'd be willing to bet my transformer balanced COAX-to-Toslink suggestion will work (one I mentioned on the last page) - but I'm not confident enough to spend anyone's money on my assumptions alone


----------



## RichardP

Hi, I'm new to this thread and must confess to not having read all 2080 posts!

I'm trying to find out what AI-Net control there is over the H800 from ANY AI-Net head unit.

So far I know you can perform the following control :

Power On/Off
Volume
Left/Right Balance
Front/Rear Fader
Sub Level (not with V2.100 firmware?)
Preset selection 1-6
Source selection: HU, CDC, Aux 1, Aux 2, Aux 3, Digital 1, Digital 2.
Remote Power On/Off
Defeat On/Off

Does anyone know of ANY other functions that can be controlled over AI-Net with ANY AI-Net head unit (not RUX-C800 or PC)?


----------



## minbari

Depends on the HU. Some have full control. So add, T/A, eq, xover, etc

Sent from my motorola electrify using digital farts


----------



## ET328

minbari said:


> Depends on the HU. Some have full control. So add, T/A, eq, xover, etc


Are you sure about that? Name one HU that has full control of the H800?


----------



## RichardP

Name one HU that has one feature NOT in my list!! Many have full control over the H700 and H701, but only the features I've listed for the H800.


----------



## maxxx

Did a search but was unable to pull all the fragments together...
we plan to buy a Windows tablet (or an Android tablet capable of running Windows?), and since we're flexible I was hoping to get the best tablet solution for tuning the PXA H800. 
I would appreciate specific advice on this from people who are very happy with their present tablet performance with the PXA.

in particular, I would like to use a tablet instead of the RUX controller. 
are there any functions that I would lose by foregoing the rux controller in favor of a tablet?
Thanks in advance!


----------



## quality_sound

Unless you have an Ai-Net HU you HAVE to use the C800 to even get it to power up. 
Certain functions are easier to visualize with a computer but I preferred tuning with the C800.


----------



## oca123

I have a Samsung Slate 7. I think Samsung now has a new model with a higher resolution.

Tuning the H800 using the tablet is possible, assuming that you don't lose the stylus (it is a digitizer so not any stylus will work) - but if I were your insurance company I would immediately cancel your policy if I knew that you were about to attempt this.
The software is not made for on the fly tuning, AT ALL. Even using it on a tablet is kind of a stretch.

The RUX controller does EVERYTHING. The only thing it does not do, is the auto-EQ, which needs to be done with a computer... and it does not sound good, period.

Also, every tablet that runs Windows out there is 64bits, so prepare to have to install Windows Professional so you can access Virtual PC, or VMware. I have no idea about Windows 8, but I'm pretty sure the Alpine software will not work with W8 64 bits either and you will need to use an emulator to run Windows XP in a 32 bit virtual machine.

Also, I have not heard of an Android tablet that will run Windows. They are simply not powerful enough, and they use a completely different architecture. I know you could run Android on a Windows tablet, though I have no idea why anyone would want to do that unless they are writing Android software.
I love my windows tablet, and when someone pulls out an iPad and starts acting snobby, I show them what my tablet is running, what it does, and they STFU.
For tuning the H800 though it is utterly useless, and obsolete considering Alpine released the amazing RUX controller.


----------



## RichardP

The 64 bit version of Sound manager has just been completed, you can get it from Alpine support, it's not on the web site yet.


----------



## Booger

Alpine Connected


----------



## ET328

Booger said:


> Alpine Connected


_"website for authorized Alpine retailers"_. So what are we supposed to do over there?


----------



## Randyman...

RichardP said:


> The 64 bit version of Sound manager has just been completed, you can get it from Alpine support, it's not on the web site yet.


COOL! And I just recently reformatted my old laptop for W7-32 just to use the 32 bit version 

Now, if we can just get a friggin MAP UPDATE for the W910 

And a quick PS - If you run the H800 in "Ai-NET" mode, none of the "Aux inputs" are available. You must select sources from the Ai-Net HU in this case. As you were...


----------



## oca123

Just chiming in, I was looking at what's available today for windows tablets on Amazon.
When I got my Samsung Slate, they were $1200+

Now I see that you can get Windows tablets in the $500 range.

Regardless, if you plan on doing any tuning with a tablet, screen size is a huge factor. Don't even bother with anything less than 11'' for a screen, unless you have q-tips for fingers.


----------



## RichardP

Randyman... said:


> And a quick PS - If you run the H800 in "Ai-NET" mode, none of the "Aux inputs" are available. You must select sources from the Ai-Net HU in this case. As you were...


I'm not actually connecting te H800 to an AI-Net HU, just controlling it via AI-Net and trying to find out how much control there is compared to the H701 which has full control. Even the H100 has more control capability than the H800.


----------



## Randyman...

RichardP said:


> I'm not actually connecting te H800 to an AI-Net HU, just controlling it via AI-Net and trying to find out how much control there is compared to the H701 which has full control. Even the H100 has more control capability than the H800.


Sounds cool - how are you generating Ai-Net commands? Sounds like something I'd like to experiment with, too 

I do believe the H800 would need to run in Ai-Net mode to be controlled in this fashion (needs a defined Ai-Net host, doesn't it?) - and might still lock you out of the "Aux Input" configurations (conjecture on my part  ) I don't know if that behavior is hard-coded into the H800's firmware, or if it's simply an artificial control limitation that can be bypassed with whatever you have sending the Ai-Net commands.


----------



## RichardP

I can send AI-Net commands to the H800 that perform the functions that I listed initially, including direct selection of the 3 Aux ports (if in 3 x 2 Channel Aux Mode), digital audio inputs etc.

I'm actually using an Intravee (which is BMW iBus specific) to control the H800. There is a more generic project called Ai10 which can be used to control AI-Net devices from a PC https://sites.google.com/site/projai10/home


----------



## Randyman...

Cool! So I guess the limitatons are "artificial" and are on the control interface side! Figures Alpine would restrict that over Ai-Net with an Alpine HU 

I'll check out the PC Software - looks like fun!!! Thanks for the info


----------



## cchrono

Has anybody installed firmware v1.100/2.100 on the U.S. H800 and has it work or are there issues?


----------



## Randyman...

My H800 and RUX both shipped with v1.100 and matching firmware. Works like a charm with my W910 over Ai-Net...


RichardP indicated a 64-Bit version of Sound Manager is due out soon - might have new firmware, too?


----------



## cchrono

Sweet I will install new firmware tomorrow.


----------



## RichardP

Randyman... said:


> My H800 and RUX both shipped with v1.100 and matching firmware. Works like a charm with my W910 over Ai-Net...
> 
> 
> RichardP indicated a 64-Bit version of Sound Manager is due out soon - might have new firmware, too?


Pretty sure it's only the 64 bit app and drivers, the firmware is the same.


----------



## Randyman...

RichardP said:


> Pretty sure it's only the 64 bit app and drivers, the firmware is the same.


I'll still take it  Any word on when it will be released to us minions?


----------



## RichardP

Link to 64 bit version of SoundManager for the H800.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vmxdiwmykocduf6/PXA-H800 64bit 1.110.zip?m


----------



## Randyman...

Got it - Will play with it over the weekend. Thanks for hosting it until Alpine can get off their arses and post it on their website!!!


----------



## Pulse-R

Randyman... said:


> Thanks for the clarification, t3sn4f2. That settles my nerves a little!
> 
> So, has anyone here experienced this with their H800's? Did you get a full-scale signal blasting out to your amps? If so, what was the approx temp reported by your RUX when this happened? Mine seems to hover around 44*C/111*F.
> 
> Thanks for any reports from the field


The analog outputs of the H-800 come from the DAC, through a CS-3318, and then an op-amp to the RCA outputs.

the only way you'd get a full-scale output burst would be if the CPU/DSP has a fit, and the volume is at 100%.

That being said, I did have on a hot day, a "blurp" of funny sound come out of the speakers one at a time. this was at vehicle startup on a hot day, the temp on RUX read about 48C, which is normal for operation, not for startup.


----------



## Randyman...

Good to know. So there's no chance that an H800 "Meltdown" could cause the CS-3318 to suddenly run "wide open" (or anywhere near wide open) while spitting out full scale noise through the DAC?

I know with more dynamic source material, I run the H800's overall level quite a bit higher than with "dense" modern material (true with any playback system) - so I'd still assume if a "meltdown" were to occur in this scenario, speaker damage is still likely if any full-scale noise is being spit out of the DAC (and the CS-3318 is already running close to "wide open" due to source material at hand)...

I personally haven't had any issues with heat thus far - but a Texas Summer is upon us...

An aside - I fried a tweeter when running Imprint/Audyssey Auto TCR  . I accidentally severed my H800 Mic Cable on my rear-seat latch, and didn't notice it. I plugged in my laptop and ran Imprint Auto TCR from outside the vehicle.

I heard the first set of "Chirps" from the front left mid/high (Morel Point Source 4"). Then I heard a second pass from the same driver - but a bit louder. Then a third set even louder. I was outside, and couldn't tell exactly how loud these chirps were, but on the 4th round, I literally saw my Left Front tweet's coil GLOW and then a nice puff of smoke came out  .

Apparently, the H800 knew the mic was plugged in, but didn't know the mic's wire was severed. It wasn't "hearing" anything come back form the connected mic, so it kept increasing the level of the chirps until "oops - toast!". Just my luck  Should be getting the speaker back soon. I already fixed the H800 mic wire...


----------



## FSOL1

Hello to everyone.
I bought Pure i-20 and Alpine PXA-H800.Can i activate optical input on the processor without RUX-c800? Dont want to buy and use any RUX,just automatically adjust the sound with audissey (at least at the beginning). Can i activate Pure-Alpine optical connection with Mini-PC?
Thank you.


----------



## RichardP

You can select the input using Sound Manager on a PC with a USB connection.


----------



## FSOL1

Thank you *RichardP*!
Its a very good news for me


----------



## quality_sound

That's assuming you have an Ai-Net HU otherwise it won't even turn on.


----------



## RichardP

quality_sound said:


> That's assuming you have an Ai-Net HU otherwise it won't even turn on.


The H800 will turn on via USB with nothing else connected. All you need is ground, live, switched live and a connection via USB to a PC, no AI-Net no RUX.


----------



## quality_sound

To tune yes, it'll turn on, but it won't turn on for normal use without the RUX or an Ai-Net HU.


----------



## RichardP

What do you mean by 'normal use'?

When connected to only Sound Manager it turns on, you can select the source, control the volume, all the EQ curves and mode, fader, balance, sub level, etc etc etc. The only thing you can't do it turn it off, but the ignition line does that.


----------



## soundboy

Have not follow how going to this Alpine dsp.. 

Something new about it?

What is status on PXA-H800, Alpine fix all the problem about noise etc..?


----------



## RichardP

The latest firmware is much better then the original, I'm not sure if they have fixed everything yet though.


----------



## quality_sound

RichardP said:


> What do you mean by 'normal use'?
> 
> When connected to only Sound Manager it turns on, you can select the source, control the volume, all the EQ curves and mode, fader, balance, sub level, etc etc etc. The only thing you can't do it turn it off, but the ignition line does that.


For daily driving. Times when you don't have a laptop connected. 
For example, say you're using the OEM HU, any non-Alpine HU, or an Alpine non-Ai-Net HU and you are NOT using the C800; you'll be able to tune and listen as normal while the laptop is connected but as soon as the USB cable is removed the H800 will power down. 
That's how the H800 works. It MUST have the C800 or an Ai-Net HU connected to power up when you don't have a powered up laptop running Sound Manager connected. 
I guess you COULD leave a laptop connected to it all the time if you wanted to.


----------



## quality_sound

soundboy said:


> Have not follow how going to this Alpine dsp..
> 
> Something new about it?
> 
> What is status on PXA-H800, Alpine fix all the problem about noise etc..?



What noise problems? Mine was clean as a whistle.


----------



## ET328

quality_sound said:


> What noise problems? Mine was clean as a whistle.


If it had 1.000 firmware it sure wasn't clean. I'm talking about those bass sound modulated wideband noises.


----------



## RichardP

FSOL1 said:


> Hello to everyone.
> I bought Pure i-20 and Alpine PXA-H800.Can i activate optical input on the processor without RUX-c800? Dont want to buy and use any RUX,just automatically adjust the sound with audissey (at least at the beginning). Can i activate Pure-Alpine optical connection with Mini-PC?
> Thank you.





quality_sound said:


> For daily driving. Times when you don't have a laptop connected.
> For example, say you're using the OEM HU, any non-Alpine HU, or an Alpine non-Ai-Net HU and you are NOT using the C800; you'll be able to tune and listen as normal while the laptop is connected but as soon as the USB cable is removed the H800 will power down.
> That's how the H800 works. It MUST have the C800 or an Ai-Net HU connected to power up when you don't have a powered up laptop running Sound Manager connected.
> I guess you COULD leave a laptop connected to it all the time if you wanted to.


As the original question said that the H800 would be adjusted using SoundManager on a mIniP PC and asked if the Aux inputs could be selected. The answer is yes.

Of course, without A PC, C800 or AI-Net HU, the H800 is no use because, as you say, you can't turn it on.


----------



## quality_sound

ET328 said:


> If it had 1.000 firmware it sure wasn't clean. I'm talking about those bass sound modulated wideband noises.


Mine never had any issues with noise but I know the firmware had been updated before I got it.


----------



## cchrono

quality_sound said:


> Mine never had any issues with noise but I know the firmware had been updated before I got it.


I have your old processor and have no noise either. I also updated the firmware and to the newest version and have no noise.


----------



## FSOL1

Wow, so the only way to use the H800 daily connected to pure i-20 is necessary to connect it to the HU with Ainet or Rux c800? And if I do not want to replace the head unit, then I need to mount somewhere rux and push power up on him every time, the signal from the docking station is not enough to turn on the H800? Or rux should just be connected to the dsp, but dont need to click on it to play the music?
Really there is no way to get work dsp without using the rux or HU with ainet?
(I apologize for my English, I write with help of Google


----------



## quality_sound

FSOL1 said:


> Wow, so the only way to use the H800 daily connected to pure i-20 is necessary to connect it to the HU with Ainet or Rux c800? And if I do not want to replace the head unit, then I need to mount somewhere rux and push power up on him every time, the signal from the docking station is not enough to turn on the H800? Or rux should just be connected to the dsp, but dont need to click on it to play the music?
> Really there is no way to get work dsp without using the rux or HU with ainet?
> (I apologize for my English, I write with help of Google


Yes on what parts you have to use but you won't have to hit power in the C800 each time. The H800 has a remote turn-on lead so it'll turn on and off with the ignition, but only with the C800 connected. If you're using an Ai-Net HU then the remote input lead on the H800 can be used as an output or left disconnected. 

Your English is great! I had no problem with what you were asking.


----------



## 00flash00

Hi boys,

I have this combination PXA-H800 + KCE-900E + NVE-M300P + IVA-D800 but have sound problem. Nav mute is ok, but in rux-c800 NAV MIX option switch off, imprint sound quality is very very good, then switch on, sound quality in the entire system is poor. This is alpine bug or mine problem? I picked cinch out of KCE-900E but is the same sound quality ...

Thanks for reply


----------



## 00flash00

Or the problem is need to automatic calibration(imprint) run on NAV MIX ON? Because is possible that calibration in NAV MIX OFF mode ...


----------



## Jesstr

Hey guys, this might seem like a stupid question, but it been bugging me.

Currently I have the PXA-H800 which is outputting to two M12, each driving two R12's. My Question is what do i set the input selector switch to on the amplifier 0.1 - 1 or 1.0 - 8.0.

To be honest i have tried both and noticed the difference for both. But which is proper? The H800 only outputs at 4V (I think). 

Thanks for the help.

On a side note anyone with the INA-W910 ever have any luck using the optical cable as opposed to the AI-Net? I have tried with zero success.

Thanks


----------



## quality_sound

Optical worked fine on my D800. Did you flip the switches and turn on the optical output on the 910 as well as turn on the optical input on the H800?

Set the input switch to the 1.0-8.0 setting.


----------



## Jesstr

Yea you bet, i double and triple checked all the settings and switches. I'm starting to think I may have damaged the optical cable.

Ill pick up another Cable at my dealership and give it a try.

Thanks!


----------



## quality_sound

Do a quick check. Pull the cable from the H800 and see i you see the red light. If not, it's bad. If you do, it's something else.


----------



## Tool

Hey guys 
just need some clarification... i take it from the manual that the outputs on the H800 cannot be assigned manually. Is that true ? 
Can i assign output channels 1&2 to the Front , 3&4 to the Rear and 5&6 to the subs and turn 7&8 off or something ?
Can i just do a simple Front/Rear/Sub basically is what i am asking.?
My system is the following :-
Front - Passive 2way (L6SE Carbon midbass + L1R2 Tweet) ( Amp is Mosconi Zero 3 )
Rear - Passive 2way (L6SE midbass + L1v1 Tweet) ( Amp is Mosconi AS.200.2 )
Sub - 2x IDQ v2 12' subs running sealed ( Amp is RF 1500 BDcp )

All i want is the ability to do TA / 31 Band Eq and setup crossovers. My HU is the Pio - AVH - 8400BT

Should i be looking at another processor ? Will this be possible on the Bit One ?
Thanks for the help guys 

Taken from the H800 Manual :-


----------



## acidbass303

Yes you are right, we cant assign output channels according to our preference. We have to pick one of the preset combinations that meet our system requirements and go from there. But yes you can run your system as front rear sub. We get these combos:


System 1 (4.2ch): Front 2way+Rear+SubW

System 2 (2.2ch): Front 3way+SubW

System 3 (4.0ch): Front 3way+Rear

System 4 (5.1ch): Front 2way+Rear+Center+SubW


Choose system 1, connect your fronts to either channels 1 and 2 or 3 and 4. Simply turn of the spare channels that you dont use. If you use channels 1 and 2 you must set that channel as full range instead of tweeter only, that way you can set your xover point lower than 1k otherwise its not possible. 

Have fun with this exceptional processor, its much better than the bitone. Also look up Erin's tests and comparisons between the two posted here on diyma.


Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## aqua_blue

Just wondering is there any way I could hook up Alpine H800 via Ai-net into my Accord 2013 HU? Or do I need to connect using analog cables. If so do I lose out on sound quality? If someone could answer these for me I will appreciate it. Thank you.


----------



## quality_sound

Ai-Net IS analog.


----------



## Mr12voltwires

aqua_blue said:


> Just wondering is there any way I could hook up Alpine H800 via Ai-net into my Accord 2013 HU? Or do I need to connect using analog cables. If so do I lose out on sound quality? If someone could answer these for me I will appreciate it. Thank you.


If you're asking if you can use Ai-Net to connect to your OEM H/U, no, you can't. Honda's OEM bus is different than Ai-Net, which /////ALPINE stopped development for two or three years ago. I wouldn't be so concerned about analog & digital inputs to the H800. The difference in SQ between the analog & digital inputs is minimal, unless you're using test equipment to measure or you have dog-ears. 

Good luck with your system.


----------



## aqua_blue

Thanks guys for fast reply!

Ok I guess I will be connecting the Alpine H800 into OEM H/U the old fashion way with multiple RCA cables....

I have another question, I am going to install 2 amps with this processor. One for the mids/highs and the other for subwoofer. Now when I connect remote-on (the wire which allows the processor/amp to turn ON or OFF) wires for them, do I connect 2 Amps into the processor and then from processor to car or may I connect the 3 remote-on wires separately? The reason why I am asking is that on the Alpine H800 Manual, it said the "processor won't be turned off" and if I connect the remote-on wires from the amps into the processor wouldn't they also not be turned off? I don't know if this makes any sense... if someone could clarify this question I would really appreciate it.


----------



## jets88

Here's a link to the owners manual : http://a248.e.akamai.net/pix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/500/500PXAH800.PDF

Check out page 75 in the instalation section. I doubt you'd have any problems hooking up three separate turn on leads from the HU. But you really should go from HU to the H800's remote on lead, Then hookup your 2 amps to the remote out lead of the H800. Everything will still turn on and off from the HU.


----------



## fahrfrompuken

Man what a read! I have read most of this thread and still did not get all of it. Right now I am planning my next system that includes the PXA-H800 So far my system looks like this:

*HU in Dash*
iPad Mini
(Held into a custom fiberglass dash opening by magnets. Will have a hard cable for charging and audio/video output to CDA-9887 via Alpine KCE-422i.)
(Connection via Apple Lightning Digital AV Adapter to screens and HU. This outputs HDMI video and has another lightning connector that passes the digital audio and is for charging. Audio will pass to the CDA-9887 via the Lightning to 30pin adapter cable. Will also need something like the ViewHD Universal HDMI to Composite adapter to send the video signal to the rear screens. This video will be a mirror of the iPod screen.)

*Transport*
Alpine CDA-9887
(Hidden in the glove box)
(Will be using the KCE-400BT for calls)

*Processor*
Alpine PXA-H800

*Amps*
Zuki Eleets 4CH (x2)
Zuki Eleets Custom 2CH

*Speakers*
Morel Supremo Piccolo tweets
HAT L4SE mids
HAT L8 Midbasses

*Subs*
Morel Ultimo SC 10 (x2)

*Screens*
Kenwood LZ-612IR standalone monitors
(Installed in headrests)


I was really amazed that the iPad AV adapter allows for HDMI output as well as the audio through


----------



## dwhite832003

Just got off the phone with a alpine tech & he confirmed this will not sum the channels of an oem 2 - way system! Very disappointing considering mine arrives tomorrow!


----------



## santiagodraco

Just ordered a PXA-H800 and the RUX-C800 remote controller. The concern I have is the cable length for the controller and the mic. I will be mounting the controller in the overhead sunglasses holder in my Infiniti FX50. The H800 will be mounted in the far back with the amps inside the spare tire area. So it's going to be a long run down the window pillar and on back. 

A few questions for those who might know:

1. Is there an extension cable available for the RUX and/or is it a standard cable that can be purchased separately? 
2. How is the mic connected and the same question applies, any extension cables avail?

Has anyone installed in a similar fashion and if yes how did you deal with the cable lengths?

Thanks!


----------



## n_olympios

Why don't you run them under the roof liner and down through the C-pillar (or D-pillar)? That way you won't need an extension.


----------



## santiagodraco

n_olympios said:


> Why don't you run them under the roof liner and down through the C-pillar (or D-pillar)? That way you won't need an extension.


Hmm, that's a possibility. I have a sunroof, which shouldn't matter overly much I guess. I wasn't sure about the length of the cable for the mic, or the RUX. I'm assuming they are both 5 meters?

In any case I'm still curious as to extensions. I'll ring Alpine tomorrow and see if there's any options, just in case.


----------



## oca123

The cables are very long. Don't think you'll have an issue.


----------



## santiagodraco

In case everyone wasn't aware Windows 7 64bit support is available for the PXA-H800 management software. I just downloaded it from the Alpine dropbox.

If anyone needs it let me know and I'll PM it over, or you can call Alpine support and they'll send you the download link.

I don't want to post it publicly as they don't have it hosted for mass download but said it was ok to forward on request.

Cheers.


----------



## santiagodraco

Another question. Has anyone determined the minimum line level voltage the unit supports? I really want to add it before my bose amp (since I'll be using the Bose temporarily for the rears and center until I get another 4 channel amp). My concern is that the Infiniti head unit (which is a Clarion based system I understand) might have low line level voltage. 

The H800 docs don't state a min voltage that I can see.


----------



## jets88

santiagodraco said:


> In case everyone wasn't aware Windows 7 64bit support is available for the PXA-H800 management software. I just downloaded it from the Alpine dropbox.
> 
> If anyone needs it let me know and I'll PM it over, or you can call Alpine support and they'll send you the download link.
> 
> I don't want to post it publicly as they don't have it hosted for mass download but said it was ok to forward on request.
> 
> Cheers.


The Link is posted in post # 2102 of this thread. It works fine on win7.


----------



## santiagodraco

Apparently the dropbox link Alpine sent me doesn't work. Here' a link to Alpine AU that has both the 32 and 64bit versions.

Alpine Electronics of Australia


----------



## santiagodraco

Also, the cable for the RUX-800 and the mic were plenty long enough to reach to the back. You guys called it


----------



## pitbulladams

You guys seem to have played around with the H800 quite a bit and I've looked over the previous posts and have a few questions

1) are there any tablets be it iPad or similair that can be used to tune the H800 instead of a laptop ?

2) I'm running the INA-W910 into the H800 and really would like to be able to retrive digital data from an iPod and send digitally to the H800 to avoid the DA-AD-DA process ? Can this be done ?

3) Also Alpine have stated that the W910 takes the info from the iPod avoiding the iPods DAC if this is the case I can understand it with the 30-pin connected variants but any with the lightning connector then using the lightning adaptor which Apple has said it uses the inbuilt DAC to work !

4) or a way around so WAV files or even FLAC could be retrived from a USB and fed into the W910 digitally then into the H800 or straight into the H800


----------



## quality_sound

Use Apple Lossless instead of FLAC or WAV. I never used the 910 but my D800 sent iPod data over Ai-Net, which is analog.


----------



## santiagodraco

pitbulladams said:


> You guys seem to have played around with the H800 quite a bit and I've looked over the previous posts and have a few questions


1) are there any tablets be it iPad or similair that can be used to tune the H800 instead of a laptop ? *The software requires Windows. So, you could run a Windows tablet (should also work with Windows 8) but not an ipad or android tablet.*


----------



## pitbulladams

quality_sound said:


> Use Apple Lossless instead of FLAC or WAV. I never used the 910 but my D800 sent iPod data over Ai-Net, which is analog.


Yep all my contents on iPod is apple lossless 

But will the W910 use the iPods DAC or its own ?

From what I've found it bypasses the iPods DAC but this is in reference to the older 30-pin connector type, not in regards to Alpine or H/U's for that matter but found that the lightning to 30-pin adaptor has an inbuilt DAC which is required to integrate the lightning to 30-pin devices


----------



## pitbulladams

santiagodraco said:


> 1) are there any tablets be it iPad or similair that can be used to tune the H800 instead of a laptop ? *The software requires Windows. So, you could run a Windows tablet (should also work with Windows 8) but not an ipad or android tablet.*


Yeah thought as much ! Typical as pretty much everything in the house hold is Apple branded !


----------



## pitbulladams

Oh and something I may have just dreamt up but did someone on here figure how to modify an Alpine H/U to output the iPod signal via optical rather the AiNet ?


----------



## quality_sound

Not that I'm aware of but you won't notice the difference anyway. I'd stop worrying about it.


----------



## aqua_blue

I just installed alpine pxa-h800 & rux-c800 and it's not turning on! Not even the LCD... Why??

Can anyone tell me what problem this is? I bought mine used, should I have a suspicion that it's broken?

I have wired to 12v battery, ground and remote on. Please input would be appreciated.


----------



## dwhite832003

I would check for voltage @ the unit with a multimeter. Make sure your getting 12v constant & 12v switched on your remote on wire!


----------



## nsajuve

Can someone tell me the sampling rate of this dsp? (obviously on optical input setup)

Thank you


----------



## quality_sound

nsajuve said:


> Can someone tell me the sampling rate of this dsp? (obviously on optical input setup)
> 
> Thank you


Why?


----------



## nsajuve

Because i have a player that plays 24 bit on 96 khz and i'm interested.... 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## t3sn4f2

Native rate is 48khz. Anything other than that will get up or down converted to that. Like every other processor out there. Bitrate remains as is, ie 16 formats has extra bits added. 24 does as well, probably to 32 bits. But at the end the bit rate is still limited by the input resolution.


----------



## aqua_blue

Thanks, Dwhite832003!!! I just checked the voltage between one from battery (12v) and one from the ground and the value I got was 0.04volts from multimeter reading....

I am guessing this is abnormal value?...

btw I am using 16 gauge wire for battery wire and 14 gauge wire for ground wire. Please help me if there is anything I should do. Thanks again


----------



## quality_sound

If you're only getting .04V there's your problem. You should be getting at least 12V. Check your fuse.


----------



## nsajuve

Thanks for the reply, i think Helix's c-dsp does 96 Khz or even 192....

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## aqua_blue

I just rewired and power is on!!! Thank you guys.. but then happiness only lasted short when I realized there is no sound coming out!!!

This Alpine h800 is connected to an Alpine Pdx f4 amp and this connects to Boston Acoustics Pro60SE with crossovers in the front (I have not connected the amp to the back speakers yet!)

BUT Still, I should have some sound coming from front right???


----------



## aqua_blue

Also I have the C800 controller set to "Aux1" ( because I am using RCA cables, not using Ai-Net or Digital optic wires)...

Any inputs will be appreciated thank you guys!


----------



## quality_sound

Have you gone through the initial setup yet?


----------



## Randyman...

Did you power-cycle the system after you selected the H800's mode upon initial power-up? Have you configured the outputs and setup the crossover? Which set of H800 outputs are you currently connecting to your amp?

Looks like QS beet me to it! 

Also agreed on not fussing with feeding the iPod Digitally into the H800. I will say (to my amazement) I heard a teeny-weeny difference from a standard 16-Bit CD using the Toslink cable to the H800 vs playing the same Wave file off my iPod using the USB connection. The upper mids had a minute difference - the CD via Toslink did sound like it had less congestion in the upper mids. THis was not a blind test - but I might be able to pick it out in an A/B/X. I'm not considering jumping through hoops to get the Pure i20 dock (or whatever it's called) in my system - the difference from Alpine's USB DAC +ADC + H800's ADC vs a pure Toslink chain is that small IMO...


----------



## quality_sound

That was exactly my experience. Optical was NOT the reality-altering experience I had thought it was going to be. In the end, barely audible.  But on the plus side that means they REALLY optimized the analog inputs.


----------



## Randyman...

Indeed - I was already of the opinion that a good DAC>ADC chain is no biggie as we do this all the time in the pro-audio and recording world w/o any ill effects.

My above comment about "To my amazement" was the fact that I could hear a difference at all!  (Was not expecting to hear ANY difference!). It was incredibly small, and I don't believe it was a psycho-acoustic thing or a "I know which source is playing" thing as I was genuinely not expecting to hear any difference (thus my pre-conceptions shouldn't have an influence either way). In any event - the difference was too small to fret over IMO...

Back to the troubleshooting: I'd also ask aqua_blue if he has his source unit's volume cranked up (set it for best S/N and leave it), and if he has the RUX's volume turned up to get some signal out of it (system volume will be controlled from the RUX in a "Non Ai-Net" system).


----------



## t3sn4f2

Alpine throws another dac on the USB input in order to simplify source selections. It leaves the transport direct feed the only digital signal going into the dsp chip. This is why alpine only has the transport source available on its digital output port. 

What does all that represent? It depends, so I'm just saying then.


----------



## pitbulladams

Thanks for input guys, I'm still waiting on optical lead from Alpine so will be able to compare Opt vs AiNet then.


----------



## 00flash00

Hi boys

i have D800 + H800 + PDX-F4/F6/M12 + RUX

i driving in autobahn and suddenly my rear and front speakers silence only subwoofer work ... source is radio ... I reset procesor and call my preset but now silence all my sound ... I have optical and analog connection. Signal to procesor is OK, when playing DVD in procesor led light red to DTS ... Ampfliefer is on, blue led light ... Its procesor problem? or? I think this is no problem instalation can not go off all at once ...

When you activate processor, speakers are completely silent, nothing happens, no output signal to speakers - no noise, complete silence


----------



## santiagodraco

Make sure that after you set the proper input type and output on the H800, just in case. You should also try the channel level test... watch to see what channels it shows as available.

Otherwise it could be an amp issue. Check your main amp power source (battery cable, etc).

Lastly I would think you could check your amps by connecting another audio source that is known to be working to test. 

I'm sure some folks will have better ways to test the amps but I'd verify that the amps are working first by feeding them an alternate source.


----------



## 00flash00

chanel level test is silent, show all speakers but no sound, all chanels is silent. before this problem, chanel level test noise sound, but now silent 

amp is ON, light blue light.

tomorrow test amp to another source and result post here ...

thanks ... is amazing situation, Is it possible that fell out all amp at once????


----------



## 00flash00

problem solved, is fuse kaput from batery to ampliefers! But ampliefer have 5V and led lights little blue, cheating


----------



## Neil_J

Guys, I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on an H800 and having it in time for a MECA show on Saturday. I don't have time to read the thread this moment (I'm at work on lunch break), are there any noise issues with it at all? Can i use it without an Alpine head unit and without the RUX? I'd like to get it ordered on amazon in a few minutes to guarantee a quick delivery. Hoping someone responds to this quickly  thanks.


----------



## psycle_1

Yes, you can use it without the RUX. Played with one at SBN. Pioneer double DIN straight into the H800. Used a laptop to set everything up.


----------



## quality_sound

Neil_J said:


> Guys, I'm thinking about pulling the trigger on an H800 and having it in time for a MECA show on Saturday. I don't have time to read the thread this moment (I'm at work on lunch break), are there any noise issues with it at all? Can i use it without an Alpine head unit and without the RUX? I'd like to get it ordered on amazon in a few minutes to guarantee a quick delivery. Hoping someone responds to this quickly  thanks.





psycle_1 said:


> Yes, you can use it without the RUX. Played with one at SBN. Pioneer double DIN straight into the H800. Used a laptop to set everything up.


No, you can't. You have three options to get an H800 to power up.

1. - Use an Ai-Net HU. 

2. - Use the RUX-C800.

3. - Connect a laptop.

These are your only options. Unless you do one of these three, the H800 will not power up. Period.


----------



## psycle_1

That's odd, I don't remember him having an RUX. I could be wrong though.


----------



## quality_sound

It was probably hidden. Some people do that. I wouldn't because I LOVED tuning with it, but some do.


----------



## Neil_J

I bought the H800 and the RUX, should be here tomorrow 

Now to find somewhere to mount/hide the RUX in a MINI. I'm out of hiding spots at this point.


----------



## 00flash00

No alpine unit must have rux
Alpine unit no need rux but only basic functions in alpine unit, advanced setting you need notebook
Rux is best idea


----------



## quickaudi07

00flash00 said:


> No alpine unit must have rux
> Alpine unit no need rux but only basic functions in alpine unit, advanced setting you need notebook
> Rux is best idea


Agreee ^^^^^^^^


----------



## cjazzy4

Neil_J said:


> I bought the H800 and the RUX, should be here tomorrow
> 
> Now to find somewhere to mount/hide the RUX in a MINI. I'm out of hiding spots at this point.


Hey dude .....Make a video when you get it installed.....Been wondering how it sounds.....I'm leaning toward the Rockford Fosgate 3sixty3.....Because found out the MS-8 had only 2v of output....compared to 8v on the Rockford unit.


----------



## ErinH

can one of you guys email me the sound manager software? I used to have it, but went to see if it does something and realized I lost it when my PC died and had to be rebuilt. 

my email is:
hardisj at gmail dot com.

Thanks in advance if you can.


----------



## jkrob21

I have the link to the 64 bit version if that helps.


----------



## ErinH

That would work.


----------



## jets88

bikinpunk said:


> That would work.


Here's the 64 Bit. https://www.dropbox.com/s/vmxdiwmykocduf6/PXA-H800 64bit 1.110.zip?m

Alpines website will have the 32 bit


----------



## Randyman...

jets88 said:


> Alpines website will have the 32 bit


Since Alpine makes it so damn hard to find their links, here's both. Sound Manager isn't even available from the Alpine-USA site! They make you DL it from their Australian .au site:

v1.110 / v2.110
w/*64 Bit* H800 Drivers:
Alpine Electronics of Australia

v1.100 / v2.100
w/*32 Bit* H800 Drivers:
Alpine Electronics of Australia

Enjoy :drummer:


----------



## Neil_J

Is there any way to check/display the version(s) from the RUX display?


----------



## Bluenote

I searched this thread and found perhaps one reference to the H800 surround capabilites in comparison to the MS8. I wanted to know if anyone has used the h800 with 3way / ctr / rear / sub configuration, and if so, what were your impressions?


----------



## quality_sound

Neil_J said:


> Is there any way to check/display the version(s) from the RUX display?


I thought there was an "about" menu in there somewhere. I haven't had mine since Sept or so, so I'm a little foggy but I would swear there was.


----------



## Neil_J

Bluenote said:


> I searched this thread and found perhaps one reference to the H800 surround capabilites in comparison to the MS8. I wanted to know if anyone has used the h800 with 3way / ctr / rear / sub configuration, and if so, what were your impressions?


I am, but I just got it installed a few hours ago  I will give impressions after I can get it setup. I was able to use my amp's built-in 12dB active crossover at 4khz to cross the mids and tweets, the rest is all active by the H800. I'm planning on doing a pretty extensive surround shootout, between Dolby PL II, Logic 7, a PC plugin called SPEC/ZAG, and even DTS/Dolby Digital in the case of a few songs that I have discrete multichannel versions of.


----------



## Bluenote

Neil_J said:


> I am, but I just got it installed a few hours ago  I will give impressions after I can get it setup. I was able to use my amp's built-in 12dB active crossover at 4khz to cross the mids and tweets, the rest is all active by the H800. I'm planning on doing a pretty extensive surround shootout, between Dolby PL II, Logic 7, a PC plugin called SPEC/ZAG, and even DTS/Dolby Digital in the case of a few songs that I have discrete multichannel versions of.


Neil J, thanks for the response! I am looking forward to your impressions.


----------



## Neil_J

I seem to remember a post from Andy W. At least a year or two ago about one of the Alpine processors using FIR filters instead of the usual IIR filters? (he was answering a question comparing the alpine auto eq to the ms8's auto eq) Can anyone confirm or deny this, either relating to the H800 or other Alpine processors?


----------



## oca123

I don't recall that specific post and I can't find it, but AFAIR Alpine Imprint is 512 taps, and the H650 had it.
The thing is, the H800 doesnt have the Audissey stuff, so things might be different.


----------



## preston

The 800 config that makes the most sense to me is 2-way front, rear, +sub (+ center). I won't be using a center channel (horns). So it calls for a single channel sub input. My head unit puts out 2 channels. Is it acceptable practice to Y the two sub channels from the head unit into the single sub input the H800 is expecting to get the full mono signal ? 

I will tell it I have two subwoofers so that I can get 2 output channels to drive into my mono amplifier, because the same issue, the amplifier has two inputs even though I'm only driving one sub.

That seems to me to be one drawback to this unit, from what I can tell it doesn't let you sum channels like the other DSP's. Or is this actually something you can do in the software that isn't clear in the user's manual ? 

related question, it appears all EQ is based on a channel or channel pair - it doesn't look like its possible to EQ the entire output or 4 channels at a time. That seems a bit tedious to have to EQ each channel or channel pair individually. 

One more related question - the posts here on rear fill recommend running it in mono, can I bridge my rear amp and then wire the rear speakers in series to get a mono signal to both of them ? (I realize the implications on power output).


----------



## kartunesauto

preston said:


> The 800 config that makes the most sense to me is 2-way front, rear, +sub (+ center). I won't be using a center channel (horns). So it calls for a single channel sub input. My head unit puts out 2 channels. Is it acceptable practice to Y the two sub channels from the head unit into the single sub input the H800 is expecting to get the full mono signal ?
> 
> I will tell it I have two subwoofers so that I can get 2 output channels to drive into my mono amplifier, because the same issue, the amplifier has two inputs even though I'm only driving one sub.
> 
> That seems to me to be one drawback to this unit, from what I can tell it doesn't let you sum channels like the other DSP's. Or is this actually something you can do in the software that isn't clear in the user's manual ?
> 
> related question, it appears all EQ is based on a channel or channel pair - it doesn't look like its possible to EQ the entire output or 4 channels at a time. That seems a bit tedious to have to EQ each channel or channel pair individually.
> 
> One more related question - the posts here on rear fill recommend running it in mono, can I bridge my rear amp and then wire the rear speakers in series to get a mono signal to both of them ? (I realize the implications on power output).


Quick note, you should never 
use a "y" to sum.


----------



## t3sn4f2

kartunesauto said:


> Quick note, you should never
> use a "y" to sum.


x2

Why Not Wye?


----------



## Neil_J

t3sn4f2 said:


> x2
> 
> Why Not Wye?


^^ X3, great article. I will add that both your head unit and the H800 *should* have enough output impedance to drive the summing circuit in figure 1. So if you follow the paper's advice and make a cable/adapter per figure 1, you should be in good shape.


----------



## preston

Figure 1 does not make sense to me because I am using RCA cables not balanced lines. However figure 2 does make sense. I realized the only reason to feed it a sub signal is to have head unit control of the sub output. I think I'd rather be safe and not use the sub input on the H800 at all, and just derive it as an output channel and control its level with the RUX. 

I did read this thread once before I bought one but I can't remember, is anyone using and enjoying Pro-Logic II in the car ? I normally eschew all these gimmicky processes but I've been reading on the site and now I'm at least curious to try it. Still on the fence about using this box though, I ended up with a p99 (which is working great) just to get rolling and of course once I connect power to the Alpine I can't resell it "BNIB". Of course since I have already pulled things out of the plastic I can't really do that anyway.


----------



## mister_eff

it seems like my PXA-H800 is DOA, I haven't hooked it up properly, or I damaged it during installation.

I have power, ground, and the remote-on hooked up in my car. I have an Alpine amplifier and when I hook it up with the same cables, it lights up. The PXA-H800 doesn't light up, and I'm not measuring any voltage difference between ground and the PXA-H800's remote out (ie, if I hook up that remote out into the remote-on of the amplifier, the amplifier doesn't turn on). 

I've checked the cables for continuity and I'm getting the right voltage difference (~14 V) between ground and the battery cable/remote-on. What else can I check? Am I missing any connection? I'm just going by the light on the PXA-H800 and the voltage of the remote out.

Thanks.


----------



## Tnutt19

Do you have the rux or an ainet hu connected to it? If not that's your problem.
It has to have on or the other to turn on.


----------



## mister_eff

Tnutt19 said:


> Do you have the rux or an ainet hu connected to it? If not that's your problem.
> It has to have on or the other to turn on.


OHH I missed that fine print. Thanks!


----------



## musictoo

What is the difference between V1.1 and v2.1?




Randyman... said:


> Since Alpine makes it so damn hard to find their links, here's both. Sound Manager isn't even available from the Alpine-USA site! They make you DL it from their Australian .au site:
> 
> v1.110 / v2.110
> w/*64 Bit* H800 Drivers:
> Alpine Electronics of Australia
> 
> v1.100 / v2.100
> w/*32 Bit* H800 Drivers:
> Alpine Electronics of Australia
> 
> Enjoy :drummer:


----------



## Randyman...

musictoo said:


> What is the difference between V1.1 and v2.1?


Depends on which Ai-Net HU you are using, and if you plan on running standalone.

Taken directly from the links in my post:



Alpine.com.au Website said:


> 1. Firmware Version V1.110 (and V1.100)
> When a non-Alpine Ai-NET compatible head unit is used
> When one of the following Ai-NET compatible products is used:
> INA-W910R / IVA-W520E / IVA-D511E / IVA-W502E / IVA-W202E / IVA-D105E / IVA-D106E / IVA-D800E / CDA-117E / VPA-B222R
> 
> 2. Firmware Version V2.110 (and V2.100)
> When one of the following Ai-NET compatible head units is used:
> iDA-X305 / iDA-X305S / CDA-9884E / CDA-9885 / CDA-9886 / CDA-9887 / CDA-105E / DVA-9965 / iXA-W407EBT / iXA-W404


For the W910 and RUX in my setup over Ai-Net, I use V1.100 on a 32-bit PC.


----------



## gamma_ed

What to do if you want to run it stand alone? So no rux, or compatibile headunit?

But just want it to power on with just a remote trigger of the orginal car factory radio


----------



## bbfoto

It would be great to have a FAQ stickied to the 1st post to answer all of these repeated questions.  Or a separate "Alpine PXA-H800 and RUX-C800 Full Specs & FAQ" thread. Anybody up to the task?  

If I owned one I would do it, but I don't feel that I'm qualified. All of the information is here, it's just scattered throughout a very long thread.  And I tend to have more luck with a Google search rather than an inter-forum search.


----------



## David Z

Has anyone installed the PXA-H800 V1.110 / V2.110 Update?

Updates are:
Cancel residual DSP noise
*Save System Settings in Preset after lost battery or disconnected Ai-Net*
Improved Preset data back up and restore (Navi mix setting (ON/OFF), guidance mix levels and Imprint settings are stored in Preset)
Subwoofer level adjustment for older Ai-NET units
Higher woofer level for DD and dts
Higher level for Navi Mix
New Sound Manager Software
64-bit compatible

I currently have V1.1 and I have to re-upload my settings every time I disconnect my battery.


----------



## pitbulladams

I have had a couple issues arise with my newly purchased H800

Firstly the output voltage is slightly lower across the whole left outputs this was while testing with pink noise ! And also even with the subs output switched off on the PC noise bleed into the subs output ! 

I have just read over about the firmware update I'm not sure which version I'm currently running but as the H800 is only a couple of months old would of thought it would have the most up to date firmware already installed.


----------



## gamma_ed

*Re: Alpine H800 vs. H701 vs. Audison Bitone.1 Technical Comparison*



jim walter said:


> Confirmed. There needs to be a RUX in the system to allow for remote on.
> 
> This is a firmware spec, something that theoretically could be modified. As we are making some changes over here for our market spec, I'll investigate if this could be change for you non-AINetters our there


Hi Jim, I was hoping if you had any luck? I would really appreciate if I know what needs to be done to get it work without laptop, rux or ai-net headunit, so it just turn on with a remote trigger...


----------



## quality_sound

gamma_ed said:


> Hi Jim, I was hoping if you had any luck? I would really appreciate if I know what needs to be done to get it work without laptop, rux or ai-net headunit, so it just turn on with a remote trigger...


It's impossible. Deal with it or get a new processor.


----------



## Neil_J

quality_sound said:


> It's impossible. Deal with it or get a new processor.


Please cite where it was said that it is impossible. It's a software thing (iirc Jim Walter said that), and with enough bitching, Alpine could/would change it. Unlikely yes, but not impossible.


----------



## oca123

It is possible, and there are two ways.
First method:
You need *hopes*, and *dreams*

Second method:
reverse engineer rux and emulate its presence


----------



## quality_sound

Neil_J said:


> Please cite where it was said that it is impossible. It's a software thing (iirc Jim Walter said that), and with enough bitching, Alpine could/would change it. *Unlikely* yes, but not impossible.


Alpine can't release **** they're ALREADY working on on time. You really think THIS is a priority?? 

Better question, would you wait? 







I didn't think so.


----------



## pitbulladams

Updated to V1.110

And tried to reload previous settings and it now states the file can not be opened because data version is incompatible. Upgrade "sound manager for PXA-H80" to latest version.

Uninstalled and tried to get settings back on V1.100 and then just states the same !

Thanks Alpine looks like I've lost all my settings


----------



## Neil_J

quality_sound said:


> Alpine can't release **** they're ALREADY working on on time. You really think THIS is a priority??
> 
> Better question, would you wait?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think so.


I think I covered that, when I said it was possible, although unlikely. That pretty much sums it up. Saying it's impossible (due to physics or otherwise) is a little misleading.


----------



## Neil_J

I've been loving my H800, btw, and am glad I bought the RUX (I wouldn't have if I wasn't forced to). My tune is better now than it ever has been in the past, and it's steadily getting better. I feel bad for the early adopters, 'cause I've not had any problems.


----------



## quality_sound

Neil_J said:


> I think I covered that, when I said it was possible, although unlikely. That pretty much sums it up. Saying it's impossible (due to physics or otherwise) is a little misleading.


I said running it without the C800, at present, is impossible. I didn't say it was impossible for Alpine to change that.


----------



## Neil_J

And I'm saying that it's still not impossible even if Alpine is a greedy company, I debated reverse engineering the protocol, it's not rocket science. The AiNet CRC has already been cracked wide open.


----------



## quality_sound

Neil_J said:


> And I'm saying that it's still not impossible even if Alpine is a greedy company, I debated reverse engineering the protocol, it's not rocket science. The AiNet CRC has already been cracked wide open.


In its current form is it, or is it not impossible to use it without the C800? Yes. That's all I said.


----------



## Shinju

I have been running my 800/Rux for almost a year with no issues. I am using Ver 2.0 firmware upgrade.

Best Processor I have used to date, no issues, no noise, easy to use PC software. My only gripe is the RUX GUI and how cumbersome it is when trying to adjust and save settings live.

Maybe I will try the 2.1 firmware since they are now allowing the deck to control the subwoofer level and not the RUX.


----------



## Shinju

pitbulladams said:


> Updated to V1.110
> 
> And tried to reload previous settings and it now states the file can not be opened because data version is incompatible. Upgrade "sound manager for PXA-H80" to latest version.
> 
> Uninstalled and tried to get settings back on V1.100 and then just states the same !
> 
> Thanks Alpine looks like I've lost all my settings



Totally blows, but you should always write your x-over, TA and GEQ/PEQ specs down on paper no matter what. Nothing would suck worse then being at a comp and your DSP decides to take a **** on you right be for being judged and all of your settings got dumped or lost.


----------



## subwoofery

Shinju said:


> I have been running my 800/Rux for almost a year with no issues. I am using Ver 2.0 firmware upgrade.
> 
> Best Processor I have used to date, no issues, no noise, easy to use PC software. My only gripe is the RUX GUI and how cumbersome it is when trying to adjust and save settings live.
> 
> Maybe I will try the 2.1 firmware since they are now allowing the deck to control the subwoofer level and not the RUX.


We learn from our mistakes  At least next time you won't do it again  (hopefully)

Kelvin


----------



## Shinju

subwoofery said:


> We learn from our mistakes  At least next time you won't do it again  (hopefully)
> 
> Kelvin


 I am not sure I am following you here.


----------



## subwoofery

Shinju said:


> I am not sure I am following you here.


I think I quoted the wrong post lol 

Ohh well, don't worry about it :blush:

Kelvin


----------



## gamma_ed

oca123 said:


> It is possible, and there are two ways.
> First method:
> You need *hopes*, and *dreams*
> 
> Second method:
> reverse engineer rux and emulate its presence




Interesting, how to emulate? I saw that there is something like a break out box for in bmw. So its usuable with a BMW factory radio. So there is a another way to set the settings. Let's see if we can find another way How to turn it on,. I wouldn't mind to modify the h800 if someone can tell me how to do.


----------



## gamma_ed

Still want the h800 turn on with a simple remote trigger, allready a bit closer, found a interface that seems to work with the old h701, but also someone that is using this device with a H800. Anyone else with simuliar projects or known information? 

https://sites.google.com/site/projai10/home

ai net protocols 
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&...vbWFpbnxwcm9qYWkxMHxneDo1ZTdmOWJlMjJlZmVkNDJh


----------



## andre#4

Does anyone know if the rux for the 800 can make a picture of the graphic eq setting like the rux for the 701 can do?

On mine, I can see EQ preset #, but not the nice wide graphic representation of each of the 31 bands. Maybe I am doing it wrong or not pressing the right button?









Seems to me the rux for the 701 is much much better than the new one? That is correct, right? The new one is dumbed down terribly, right? (I have not owned the 701, so I have to ask) And from a rux point of view, it seems the 701 is preferable as a package, because you have so much better control of it. You seem to have one button for each feature and each preset, as opposed the 800 rux which is riddled with menu's? Aside from the road eq, what is the point of the 800? Plus, you can't totally control it from the head unit like you can with the 701 and some head units. (forgive me, it has been 6 months since I read through the entire 90 pages of this thread)

Now I own the 800, and have played with it, but when I see what I could have had for 1/3 the money in a 5 year old package that seems to be much better, I am disappointed.


----------



## n_olympios

Don't get mixed up. The 700/701 processor didn't have the option of being controlled via pc, so it needed a comprehensive controller, hence the RUX-C700/1.


----------



## quality_sound

The 700/701 also had ****ty analog inputs, zipper noise, and a lot less eq ability.


----------



## mvalpreda

Had a few questions.....

1) I currently have a INA-W900BT with the PXA-H100. Can I upgrade to the PXA-H800?
2) Does the H800 have the same PC tuning app/process as H100?

After I installed the H100 and got it all set up, I would have a very hard time not having a head unit with IMPRINT!


----------



## quality_sound

The H800 is a better processor in every way. Yes you can tune with a pc. Yes you can use it.


----------



## mvalpreda

I am sure is better all around! I see the USB and mic inputs so I figured I was safe. I just can't get a definitive answer if it works with the INA-W900BT. I see that it works with the W910...but a lot seemed to change between the 900 and 910. Lot of stuff that works on the 900 doesn't work on the 910 and vice-versa.


----------



## quality_sound

It's an Ai-Net piece. It'll work.


----------



## mvalpreda

OK. I will have to pick one up. I'm guessing I won't be able to control it the same way as with the newer head units.

Does the INE-W927HD allow all sorts of control over the H800? Or just curve selection after being configured with the PC?


----------



## quality_sound

mvalpreda said:


> OK. I will have to pick one up. I'm guessing I won't be able to control it the same way as with the newer head units.
> 
> Does the INE-W927HD allow all sorts of control over the H800? Or just curve selection after being configured with the PC?


Have you read ANY of this thread? NOTHING controls the H800 except a PC or the C800 controller. Since you have an Ai-Net HU you don't NEED the C800. You can tune with a PC just fine. You can not, however, tune on the fly without the C800.


----------



## robdridan

INE-927 having Ai-net ??? you sure about that?


----------



## quality_sound

Sorry, I missed that. He was talking about the W910 he already owns, which will work fine. The 927 will also work but will need the C800.


----------



## mvalpreda

I have a W900....NOT W910. I don't think the H800 will work with the W900. 

I don't care about tuning on the fly. Once I run through the automatic calibration I am sure it will be enough. I did that on my H100 and it's been that way for about 3 years. 

I'm guessing the H800 is like my current H100 and that I can choose a couple of different pre-set curves from the head unit and not changing those curves.


----------



## quality_sound

mvalpreda said:


> I have a W900....NOT W910. I don't think the H800 will work with the W900.


Yes, it will. It absolutely will. 



> I don't care about tuning on the fly. Once I run through the automatic calibration I am sure it will be enough. I did that on my H100 and it's been that way for about 3 years.


If you're only going to use the auto tune, don't bother. The H800's strength is its tunability. Letting it do the job for you won't really get you much of an improvement. 



> I'm guessing the H800 is like my current H100 and that I can choose a couple of different pre-set curves from the head unit and not changing those curves.


It's been a while since I had mine but I'm pretty sure it will let you select presets from the HU.


----------



## mvalpreda

The auto-tune is fine for me. I spend a lot of time in the car and going from unprocessed to processed even with the H100 was night and day improvement. Brought the soundstage up nice and high. Was very happy. Can only imagine the H800 is a vast improvement. 

I have not been able to find ay references to the W900 and H800. Plenty with the W910 and newer....but not the W900. 

I am sorry....I was under the impression the 2012 Alpine head units have AI-Net. I guess they ditched that. Seems odd to me.


----------



## robdridan

any head unit not having the A in the prefix eg INA does not have Ai-net. Found that out by mistake when i ordered and had fitted the INE-928HD. Even the dealer didnt realise til they went to fit the Ai-net cable..... I understand the 910 is the last head unit to have it.


----------



## quality_sound

Yeah, Ai-Net is a pretty significant improvement over RCA input because of the stabilized Voltage.


----------



## someyoungguy

I'm running out of solutions so I guess it's time to ask you guys 

(P.S. I don't have the RUX-C800)

My Alpine IVA-D800C is connected to the PXA-H800 via Optical and Ai-Net. 
I'm getting signal from my Optical using CD's but when I switch to the radio/turn optical off I don't hear anything at all. When I check in my laptop if the source switches from optical to ai-net when using radio, it does switch.

So to sum it all up I'm getting no sound at all from Ai-Net.


----------



## maxxx

Question for Jim or Booger or experienced user:

If using 5.1 setting for speaker-level input (Cen/FrL/FrR/RrL/RrR/Sub), is anything lost when outputs are configured for 3-way Front plus rear?
I plan to have a stereo front stage, with no center, and the low range of the front L+R taking care of sub-bass reproduction. Will the center info from the speaker input be redistributed to the left and right output channels? Similarly, will the mono sub input be redistributed to the front channels?


----------



## quality_sound

It derives the center from the sides not the sides from the center so you won't lose anything. Same thing with the subs. If run the fronts full range that's what they'll see. The sub channel isn't an LFE setup. 

I had two presets for my MINI. One for a front two-way and one with a three-way front. Never list anything.


----------



## maxxx

Thanks Paul, but to clarify, one of the six speaker level inputs is already center info (vs. extracted from sides), so im still concerned if anything is lost between 5.1ch aux input and quadrophonic 4.0 output (etc. as described)? 

I imagine the H800 is capable of reconstructing / reassembling my inputs into my desired output configuration but I would love get confirmation, as it seems unorthodox. Since translating 2ch stereo into psuedo 5.1 is probably much more common than summing/redistributing 5.1 into 4.0, so I'm hoping Alpine accounted for this unusual option. Even though it seems possible based on their settings, I want to be sure centre, sub - and for that matter, rear - are all reprocessed efficiently into the new configuration.

Basically, 
FL - CN - FR - RL - RR - SUB
needs to become
FL - FR - RL - RR


----------



## Neil_J

maxxx said:


> Question for Jim or Booger or experienced user:
> 
> If using 5.1 setting for speaker-level input (Cen/FrL/FrR/RrL/RrR/Sub), is anything lost when outputs are configured for 3-way Front plus rear?
> I plan to have a stereo front stage, with no center, and the low range of the front L+R taking care of sub-bass reproduction. Will the center info from the speaker input be redistributed to the left and right output channels? Similarly, will the mono sub input be redistributed to the front channels?


Just curious, but what source unit and/or accessories you using that outputs analog 5.1?


----------



## quality_sound

^^^that. If you're sending a true 5.1 signal into the H800 and you don't have a center output then it will send the information to the fronts.


----------



## maxxx

Audi B&O factory amp. Has 6 speaker outputs.


----------



## t3sn4f2

maxxx said:


> Audi B&O factory amp. Has 6 speaker outputs.


I would not use that. It's certain to be some highly processed make shift OEM 5.1 signal that is not going to be any where near a true 5.1 output. OEM systems play around with it in order to maintain good output and protect smaller speakers, at the expense of staging. For instance the center output is not going to be a true center since it's speakers are always small and limited on the low end. So they send more to the L/R and the center center stage is then completely sacrificed. BMW does this with their setups.


----------



## quality_sound

You can't tap the B&O system before the OEM amp. It's an optical connection and unless the ridiculously expensive options to intercept that are finally on the market then you have to grab signal after the amp.


----------



## t3sn4f2

quality_sound said:


> You can't tap the B&O system before the OEM amp. It's an optical connection and unless the ridiculously expensive options to intercept that are finally on the market then you have to grab signal after the amp.


I think he's talking about analog outputs post OEM amp. Since he asked about diff bal analog inputs on the h800.


----------



## maxxx

I'm just using the OEM B&O outputs to pipe in AM/FM, Howard Stern, Bluetooth cellular, Navigation, and occasional low-fi media. 
For critical SQ listening I will have an Audison Bit Play directly digital to the H800 and controlled by my Android phone.


----------



## Yagi-san

I am thinking going for pxa-h800. I sold mine old pxa-h701 and now it's time for new proc. I have Alpine IVA-W505R headunit at the moment. So, h800 it's not compatible with IVA in terms of tuning it with HU.
Is it possible to tune it with IVA-D800R or INE-W928R ? The case is, that I don't want to go for C800 8rux). >Do not have any place for it in car-dash! Is there only C800 or PC for my solution?
Looking forward for any reply !


Yagi-san


----------



## n_olympios

Yagi-san said:


> Is there only C800 or PC for my solution?


Yes. But you can use the 505R HU for volume, source change and IIRC memory preset selection on the processor (someone correct me if I'm wrong on that last one).


----------



## quality_sound

Yagi-san said:


> I am thinking going for pxa-h800. I sold mine old pxa-h701 and now it's time for new proc. I have Alpine IVA-W505R headunit at the moment. So, h800 it's not compatible with IVA in terms of tuning it with HU.
> Is it possible to tune it with IVA-D800R or INE-W928R ? The case is, that I don't want to go for C800 8rux). >Do not have any place for it in car-dash! Is there only C800 or PC for my solution?
> Looking forward for any reply !
> 
> 
> Yagi-san


Jesus, man, read the thread. NO head unit will let you tune the H800. To tune you MUST use the C800 or a PC. To get it to power up you MUST use the C800 or an Ai-Net head unit.


----------



## Yagi-san

quality_sound said:


> Jesus, man, read the thread. NO head unit will let you tune the H800. To tune you MUST use the C800 or a PC. To get it to power up you MUST use the C800 or an Ai-Net head unit.



Thank you on reply! There is +90 pages to read, so It was faster to ask, and for you nice users to reply me. Don't get mad !


Regards, Yagi-san


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Guys,

Went through this whole thread, 

Question...

Head unit kenwood dnx 9980hd
Alpine pxa h800
Jl audio 600/4 x2
Jl audio 1200/1

Dynaudio 3 way + sub fully active
Rux c800....

Question is, on the JL HD amps there is a setting for low and hi input .
My 600/4's I have set to low... My 1200/1 is currently set to low, but I can't confirm this is correct. 

I am running the full signal from HU to PXA H800 and the cross it from there to respective components, ie. tweet, mid, mid bass, sub... Not running a separate set of RCA's from HU to PXA. So I'm not sure the JL 1200/1 is seeing the correct voltage, or maybe I should say I don't know what it's seeing...

I hate to make this sound like a gain setting issue, but I guess not knowing which way to set the switch on the HD amps, that's what it is.

The jL Audio manual says to set them to Low... And the PXA is set to high...
I think something is happening to the signal???

Can anyone set me straight on this ??

Thank you,


----------



## quality_sound

Use JL's setting suggestion.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Thank you,

Definately tried that, dilemma is, when I set my 2 HD 600/4 to low, PXA to high, set the gains, on both bridged and unbridged all is fine, but when I set up my 1200/1 , I have to lower the sub woofer volume from max to just 5 above 0 on the rux c800.... Or in the software... Then I have to go into the crossover section and lower the tweets by about 10/12.5, mids lower to 10-12.5, mid bass lower to 12.5 to get a blend between them and the sub. 

As I have no room to increase sub volume, nor gain at this point.

Do you think I should run a separate set of sub RCA's to have that independent control outside of master volume? Or m I missing something?

At this point all jl amps are set to low input...


----------



## Mic10is

not Familiar with the H800 enough to comment but JL's manual is actually really good at describing their gain setting process


----------



## quality_sound

Why are you lowering the sub level and then the signal on all the others? It sounds like you're lowering everything. 

What level high/low on the H800 are you talking about? I don't remember an output Voltage setting anywhere.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Sorry,

Not lowering sub level, lowering all other drivers to blend with the sub level I do have.

And in h800 aux input setting, it offers high (default ) max 8v
Or low max 2v.

According to manual I have it set at high...

I tried setting gains every which way so I would have full sub volume up and down with rux-c800... No dice.. Max I can set sub level on rux is 5... Have to cut all channels to blend with sub.. Bummer is I'm losing quite a bit of usable un-clipped signal....

Surprising no one has run into this???


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Jl does address the gain setting process... Which I run everything through a scope, but ... Jl doesn't address the issue through a processor that puts out voltage that meets their high input setting, while the manual tells you to use the low setting " regardless of what the manufacture prints as output voltage"

Not sure that is fair for jl to say in this case, but I can't afford to damage any of the components.

Very tempted to try the high setting, but need a pros blessing....

Maybe a call to jl tomorrow would be wise...


----------



## quality_sound

That's normal. Set all your levels according to JLs manual. Then lower the amp gains to match the sub instead of the processor. 

What HU are you using?

Why can't you set the sub level higher than 5? It goes to 15. 

You're not going to damage anything so stop worrying about that. Setting the switches to high on the amps will make everything quieter.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Ok understood,

Head unit is kenwood dnx 9980hd

Sub level does go to 15, but my signal clips at 6, so my max on that setting is 5.

I only ran a single set of RCA's from the head unit to the processor to cut down on processing power.

I could run a second set from head unit to processor for sub only and that would allow me to use head unit controls for sub?

Just seems odd to me, all other gains hit close to JL recommended settings, but the sub clipped very early, or earlier than expected.

I started to attenuate each channel independently doing some initial tuning, but I think I will try your way.

FYI, sub amp is a 1200/1 running 2 jl audio 13tw5's / sealed box, 2013 Toyota tundra....

My last day to work on it, if anything comes to mind that I should be doing or not do, don't hesitate to lay the smack down....

Thank you again,


----------



## quality_sound

sbaumbaugh said:


> Ok understood,
> 
> Head unit is kenwood dnx 9980hd
> 
> Sub level does go to 15, but my signal clips at 6, so my max on that setting is 5.


The H800 doesn't clip. Also, the Alpine sub level control is an ateenuator only. +15 on an Alpine is the same as 0 on other brands. 



> I only ran a single set of RCA's from the head unit to the processor to cut down on processing power.
> 
> I could run a second set from head unit to processor for sub only and that would allow me to use head unit controls for sub?


It would but I won't affect any of the issues you're having. It would just let you control the sub fro the HU.



> Just seems odd to me, all other gains hit close to JL recommended settings, but the sub clipped very early, or earlier than expected.


How do you know it's clipping? Or do you just not like the way it sounds?



> I started to attenuate each channel independently doing some initial tuning, but I think I will try your way.
> 
> FYI, sub amp is a 1200/1 running 2 jl audio 13tw5's / sealed box, 2013 Toyota tundra....


I had a pair of round Solo-Baric S12d's in my '13 Tundra CrewMax with a 900/5 and a 600/4 and it definitely needed mroe power. How much volume do you have for each sub? You should be around a cube per sub. The "clipping" you're hearing might just be enclosures that are too small.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

quality_sound said:


> The H800 doesn't clip. Also, the Alpine sub level control is an ateenuator only. +15 on an Alpine is the same as 0 on other brands.
> 
> Hmm.. Interesting, I use a scope to get a general feel for where levels will be, and she clipped at 6/15, with h800 set to max, he'd unit set to 34/35, head unit clips at 35....
> 
> 
> It would but I won't affect any of the issues you're having. It would just let you control the sub fro the HU.
> 
> Be a good idea then, atleast it gives me a second set of RCA's for testing purposes.
> 
> 
> How do you know it's clipping? Or do you just not like the way it sounds?
> Clips outright on the scope, the other 2 600/4 hd's ( tweet,mid,mid bass ) are set up per side of vehicle, driver/ passenger. Mid bass is bridged, no issues setting levels ...
> 
> 
> 
> I had a pair of round Solo-Baric S12d's in my '13 Tundra CrewMax with a 900/5 and a 600/4 and it definitely needed mroe power. How much volume do you have for each sub? You should be around a cube per sub. The "clipping" you're hearing might just be enclosures that are too small.


Jl specs... Just under a cube per sub, mono... .8/.9ft3


----------



## quality_sound

Interesting. The H800 sub output is clipping at 6 or are you measuring at the amp outputs? The sub out should not be clipping at all. Have you made sure ALL of the processing is disabled, including in the HU? Kenwood likes to default to loudness on.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

I agree... 

All processing is off completely ...

I will explain...

Setting gains on sub amp with head unit at 34/35
H800 volume set to max ( un clipped)
Aux gain in h800 set to high
Aux gain level set to 0
Subwoofer volume control set to 0
Set gain on sub amp measuring at sub amp output.
Begin to raise subwoofer volume level on ruxc800.
Hits 6/15 and clips
Back off to 5/15.

So far that's the best I get.

My theory is because h800 volume is at max un clipped.
That any additional volume increase ie. subwoofer volume is acting as overall volume increase for the processor (h800 ) thus sending clipped signal to the last component I am setting gains on.

Like adding 5db more to a signal that was set just under clipping.

My thought is , could it be because I am not running a separate subwoofer signal from h800 to the sub amp? As I a running the full signal from head unit to h800 and from the h800 out to the prospective components?

I can't say that I explain things very well, but I hope that makes sense.

I have been at it for a coupe hours now, and have no new results.

I could explainit better live if needed?

I do appreciate your help.... Thank you.... Shawn.


----------



## Mic10is

How r u setting your gains? maybe I missed it?
1khz tone?

find your volume point where the signal clips. check voltage w a DMM. Then use a -10db tone to set the gains. turn gains up to reach that number.
done


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Setting gains using a Dmm...
50hz 0 db tone on sub amp
1k on components.

Components are right on the money.

Sub amp won't cooperate.

We figure, 2 x jl audio 13tw5-3 = 1.5 ohm
Jl specs= 42.4 v @1.5 ohm.

In order for me to get to that number I have to attenuate my subwoofer volume adjustment on the h800 to 5/15 at 6 it clips.

I think we agree I shouldn't have a clip up to 15/15 on the h800.

Going to try your advice as well... I have a 40hz -10db test tone if we're good with that?

I'm also going to set crossover on the sub channel to 200 -6db slope, the best I can do with in the processor.

Muting all other channels.

Checked DMM for accuracy just now, all good!

Will report results ASAP... Short of that I think it's to early for a Yingling ?

Then again ... Maybe not....


----------



## quality_sound

Are you using a 1KHz tone or a 50-60Hz tone? Mic is right on the money with that suggestion.

It's NEVER too early. lol


----------



## Neil_J

A lot of newer DMM's (that is, the cheaper ones) don't measure the correct RMS voltage at 1 KHz. The older ones do, and most of the newer Flukes do. Always read the specs and instructions, it's a newb mistake to trust an RMS voltage at a higher frequency than the test equipment supports.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Currently using a 50hz tone at 0db... 
Also have other tones ready, 50hz -5, -10, etc...

We are way passed the to early mark, so the yingling is cold and smooth...

You being in Texas may not be aware of our PA Yingling ...

But Mike being from PA will attest , it's a state wide treasure...

In any case, not to take this thread to a new place... 

Haven't used any 1k tones on the sub channel, are we saying I should?

I also have my Focal discs, but not sure if those tones put out 0db, -5db??? It's a mystery to me....


----------



## Mic10is

whenever I use 50hz or anything than lower than 1khz , I always end up with the sub gain being way above everything else


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Hmmm... Mine is the opposite... I'm having to attenuate my front 3 way just to get the sub to blend at its much lower volume.

So here's the verdict, 

Set gain at sub amp 1200/1 to 40 hz tone -10 db.

Turned subwoofer volume all the way down on h800, volume control to max on h800...

No clipping.

Turned subwoofer level control on h800 to 1... Clip!!!

So I'm leaning towards the h800 sub volume will clip the signal.

So, I will take a listen and see if I have any increased sub volume under these conditions. I set gain at sub with jl audio sub control knob disconnected.
Head unit at Max un clipped signal.
40 hz -10db tone...


----------



## Mic10is

set gain for sub at 0db and the rest at -10db


----------



## quality_sound

sbaumbaugh said:


> Currently using a 50hz tone at 0db...
> Also have other tones ready, 50hz -5, -10, etc...
> 
> We are way passed the to early mark, so the yingling is cold and smooth...
> 
> You being in Texas may not be aware of our PA Yingling ...
> 
> But Mike being from PA will attest , it's a state wide treasure...
> 
> In any case, not to take this thread to a new place...
> 
> Haven't used any 1k tones on the sub channel, are we saying I should?
> 
> I also have my Focal discs, but not sure if those tones put out 0db, -5db??? It's a mystery to me....




Oh, I'm just stationed here but I grew up in CA and was introduced to yingling many moons ago by other military guys. ;-)

No, you want to do the sub with the 50Hz tone. 

When you have the switch on low on the 1200/1 can you use the gain to set the sub appropriately?


----------



## sbaumbaugh

There seems to be a slight difference, can't say I would be able to set it appropriately though... Just took a listen though... Gains all set safely...
My reference material is either Natalie Merchant, or the soundtrack from the commitments... Not sure if you guys are familiar with either, but...

Lets take Mustang Sally.... We all know that one??

Had to cut the tweet to - 18db
Mid- -16.5db
Mid bass to -16db
Sub just comes through enough to hear the kick but not overly present.
Centered things up a bit, just left of center dash... Ugh....I'm going to have to start over... Very little life, ambience on the kick and snare is at about 50%.

Vocals are somewhat bland and missing the edge...

FYI, I usually avoid using any EQ, I only cut... Never boost...

I also have a recording studio, so referencing material isn't an issue...

Possibly going to lower all gains and shoot from the hip on the front 3 way and blend it by ear?

Problem is I know it won't be right, so I won't be able to sleep...

More Yingling might help that...

Any thoughts?


----------



## Mic10is

SPL meter
Pink noise. put the meter at either the headrest or center arm rest by the seat.
Put each channel to play fairly fully range signal. 
put volume at about 1/3 way up.
adjust gains til you reach 90db for each channel.

I prefer having each side be equal, but others tune strictly for headrest so the pass side is slightly louder then the driver side to account for distance.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

will try right after dinner,

other thought was and maybe we already mentioned this?

use a 0 db 5k track for tweets, 0 db 1k track for miss, 0 db 250hz track for mid bass, and then use a -10 db 50hz track for sub??

that should drop the gains on the fronts and the sub should be good without having to attenuate the whole system??


----------



## sbaumbaugh

well,

tried all of the options you have given me...

the tuning the system to 90db, seemed to work the best.

also played a bunch of tones in some problem areas to see if i could figure any of that out as well, got the tones and pink noise to 90 or so db.

i will say this, tuning an active 3 way setup is like a proctology exam with out the lube, what a pain... is there a good thread you could recommend to help me get my head around this?

so much going on with the h800... you know what i mean...

im half tempted to get some steaks and Yingling.. and hope Mike comes to town for the Erie Pa shake the lake show...


----------



## Yagi-san

One more question. What about combo PXA-H800 and IVA-D800R. Do I still need a RUX or can IVA-D800 does his job (about TC, tuning sound and other stuff) ? Is there any 2DIN Alpine HU (optical conn.), that is compatible with PXA-H800? 
Thank you for reply, sorry I didn't search the site.... !


----------



## Tnutt19

No you would not need the rux if you had the iva-D800.


----------



## Yagi-san

Thank you Tnutt19 ! What about a 2DIN HU on PXA-H800?


----------



## quality_sound

And HU that has an "A" as the third character in the model will turn on the H800. NOTHING, however, will let you tune without a laptop, other than the C800.


----------



## Yagi-san

Tnx on that ! 
Cause, at the moment I have Iva-505r, which is not compatible with H800, so I am looking for something 2DIN. In worse case, I will get with D800, I am not a big fan of flip-out TS!


----------



## quality_sound

Not compatible how? What are you looking for your HU to do? No HU will, in any way, shape, or form, do anything more than your 505 will. Not even the D800 and that was designed to be used with the H800.


----------



## n_olympios

Keep your 505R. The D800 will give you nothing more in terms of control of the PXA-H800.


----------



## Yagi-san

I am looking from HU to be capable of fine tuning the sound (TC, parameters, Hz)! Or, to be able to chose FM, USB, CD...! And not need a PC for that. The way as it was iva-505 and pxa-701 !


----------



## ErinH

As Paul stated, you cannot tune the h800 via any deck. You have to use the software or the c800 (which is limited itself). The only adjustments you can control from the deck (any of the ai-net ones) is sub level or fade/balance. No TA, EQ, crossover, etc.


----------



## Yagi-san

n_olympios said:


> Keep your 505R. The D800 will give you nothing more in terms of control of the PXA-H800.



If I keep mine iva-505 which is not compatible with H800, what can I do with it?! Tune the sound with PC and after...?
And , there is no space for RUX in case if I keep iva. Only with D800 and C800 (together are 2 DIN) is enought space.


----------



## Yagi-san

bikinpunk said:


> As Paul stated, you cannot tune the h800 via any deck. You have to use the software or the c800 (which is limited itself). The only adjustments you can control from the deck (any of the ai-net ones) is sub level or fade/balance. No TA, EQ, crossover, etc.


Anything clear now. Thank you!




Cheers


Yagi-san


----------



## Munky

Does anyone have issues with the software and windows 7? i cant seem to get them to work at all together.


----------



## quality_sound

Download the software from the Alpine UK or Australia sites.


----------



## Munky

I called alpine and they gave me an FTP login/password. 

I did search both websites and couldn't find a spot to download the sound manager software, though.


----------



## sbaumbaugh

Your PC has to be plugged into the H800 to download the updates, if any...
Should have gotten a disc with your H800?
I could be wrong ... Did you get the manuals for the unit?
They are also available for download if you go to the product area on Alpine, think its under the support area, then type in PXA-H800....


----------



## Grindcore

Hey guys I have scoured the many pages in here and haven't found any answers....couple of issues with my pxa-h800...one of them is it doesn't seem to detect my 3inch mids in speaker set up menu and its set to 3 way and sub...funny thing is tho sound comes out of them and I can adjust crossovers etc etc...so in speaker set up highs are highlighted then midbass are lit up along with the subs...but mids aren't???

I tried auto TCR to just see how it would sound but in the process it won't ping the 3" mids so it fails....so I'm guessing its because the processor hasn't detected them...but again they play music an I can mess with their settings...anyone else have this problem???

I have updated all software etc to version 2 I'm using and Ida-x05 head unit with the rux controller...now with the Ida I can't control subwoofer volume...I can by pushing the rux knob in and do it from there...but isn't my head unit meant to control that along with fader,balance etc??

Any help would be greatly appreciated

Cheers


----------



## quality_sound

The H800 doesn't detect anything. It only knows what you tell it you have. I have a feeling you're missing something in the setup or you possibly have some of the outputs connected to the wrong amps.


----------



## Grindcore

Thanks for the quick reply...yeah I thought that it would be a set up problem because I have checked all RCAs etc and they are all where they should be and into the correct spots on the pxa...in the initial set up for input,because it makes me choose one do I pick the last option...the 3 x RCA pairs option??? Or am I meant to choose something else?...I though that whole selection would be bypassed if you are using an appropriate alpine head unit??? One other thing that bloody switch at the bottom was a bugger to sort out...the documentation could be better....


----------



## Grindcore

The switch on the bottom of the head unit that is.....


----------



## quality_sound

Both switches need to be in the EQ/DIV position. 

What are the input options again?

Being that you're running ai-net there shouldn't be any RCAs between the HU and H800. Just between the H800 and amps.


----------



## Grindcore

I don't have the pxa near me at the moment and I can't remember the other input choices but I have nothing connected to them just the ainet cable.....and from pxa to amplifiers....


----------



## Grindcore

Both switches?? I only have flipped one?? Is there another?? X


----------



## Grindcore

On this screen mids are not highlighted
And it will only stop on highs,lows and subs


----------



## Tnutt19

So does anyone know if they are still working on a firmware update to make it so the rux is not needed without ainet hu, on pg 31 Jim said they one day may and that was 2 years ago. I am in the group that the rux would be not needed.


----------



## quality_sound

Don't hold your breath on that.


----------



## LaOJOE99

The mid driver is not highlighted because it can not be turned off in your setup(FR 3-way), I'm running a 2-way front, and i can not high light my Front Low(only Tweeter and sub). Refer to page 60 in the manual. You might not be putting enough volume into your mid driver channels and thats why its not pinging it correctly.


----------



## Tnutt19

Yea I wasn't but thought it would make since for them to do. I had the rux and h800 before and really liked it but now with what I'm doing I want to get another h800 but don't want or have a place to put the rux and I don't want to spend the money on it. 
I wonder what exactly the rux does to turn it on, seems there should be a way to modify a ainet cable to tie into remote turn on


----------



## quality_sound

Alpine isn't going to make a change that will take money out of their pocket.


----------



## Tnutt19

It would be a pretty simple update for them to do realistically and would be an investment to open up their potential buyers. I am a perfect example. If it had that feature I would have purchased several days ago but it pushes me back to the board comparing other processors. I just don't see changing that code taking them a long time too. They don't have to write new code, they would be simply changing the existing.


----------



## Deadpool_25

Hello. I'm putting a new system together. I recently found my old H701 in my garage and was thinking to use it, but since I can't seem to hunt down an RUX-701 (which I don't really want to use anyway), and since the H800 seems to be a significant upgrade I'm thinking maybe I'll go that route.

I'll be using the stock HU in my 2013 Sonata (stealth install). I have an Audio Control LCQ-1 which I kind of want to use for its Accubass functionality and remote sub control knob. Does it make sense to use the LCQ-1 in front of the H800?

Also, the LCQ-1 would allow me to EQ the signal a bit before it even hits the H800. In effect, giving me both graphic (LCQ-1) and parametric (H800) capabilities at the same time. 

Is this making any sense?

Edit: Ordered one. I'm sure it'll work out fine.


----------



## Deadpool_25

See my post above....

After reading about 75 pages of this insanely long thread, I went ahead and ordered the RUX. It looks like I should run from the factory HU to the LCQ-1 with the Sub channel summed into the main outputs (this should allow AccuBASS to function correctly), then just run a single pair of RCA's into the H800.

I think the plan is coming together.


----------



## MisterCaptain2000

[QUOTE= A decent PC with external sound output (firewire to an Echo AudioFire 12, for instance) would give you all the channels you could wish for with the highest possible studio grade sound quality. 

Echo Audiofire? Highest possible studio grade sound quality? Forgive me for thinking that you have not spent much time working in a studio. Echo Audiofire is entry level, for the home recording enthusiast. That said, it would be plenty in an automobile. Discussing bitrates and sampling frequencies quickly becomes a little pointless when the backdrop is a listening environment with ~85dB of constant noise. I like car audio and always have, but come on.


----------



## bigfoot9947

Hi,

Need help from expert here. My h800 not able to recall setting after battery was disconnected. Can it be recall? If not how I can do setting by my own?

Thanks in advance
Cheers


----------



## quality_sound

Have you updated to the latest firmware? Mine never had this issue after the update.


----------



## Shinju

I updated to the euro firmware with no issues or loss of data , but I am still not able to control subwoofer level via the deck like the update said it would do. I am thinking I need the CDA-9886r as I have the 9886. 

Bummer, but at least the update works on a US version h800.


----------



## Grindcore

Shinju said:


> I updated to the euro firmware with no issues or loss of data , but I am still not able to control subwoofer level via the deck like the update said it would do. I am thinking I need the CDA-9886r as I have the 9886.
> 
> Bummer, but at least the update works on a US version h800.


Yeah same as me I updated firmware no hassles but still have to control sub level by pushing rux mob in...I have the Ida-x05 head unit...


----------



## quality_sound

Shinju said:


> I updated to the euro firmware with no issues or loss of data , but I am still not able to control subwoofer level via the deck like the update said it would do. I am thinking I need the CDA-9886r as I have the 9886.
> 
> Bummer, but at least the update works on a US version h800.


Have you checked the list to see if that's one of the units that will give you sub level control?


----------



## Shinju

quality_sound said:


> Have you checked the list to see if that's one of the units that will give you sub level control?


The CDA-9886r is, as far as I know besides the obvious FM difference that the 9886r changes from Red/Blue illumination vs the US 9886 is only blue.


----------



## quality_sound

What does that have to do with having sub-level control with the H800? There's a PDF in this thread that lists what every Ai-Net HU will do when connected to the H800. You need to find and review that.


----------



## bigfoot9947

quality_sound said:


> Have you updated to the latest firmware? Mine never had this issue after the update.


Me is on v1.0


----------



## Shinju

quality_sound said:


> What does that have to do with having sub-level control with the H800? There's a PDF in this thread that lists what every Ai-Net HU will do when connected to the H800. You need to find and review that.


I don't need to review it, I know the down low on the h800 I compete with it and utilize it more then the average consumer.

I think you missed my point, the euro update on Alpine Europe's website 2.01 relinquished subwoofer control to a set list of euro alpine head units. The 9886r was one of them. I figured since on paper the 9886 us and 9886r euro deck are damn near identical with a few cosmetic changes like dual illumination and fm tuner that the euro update would allow subwoofer control on the 9886 us deck but it did not do that so there must be a different firmware inside the euro 9886r that the new h800 update code is looking for that the us 9886 doesn't have.


----------



## Ale555

9886 in euro spec does control the sub, that's true.
Done that with my very own hands.


----------



## Neil_J

Quick question, hopefully one of you guys can help me out.....

The power connector to the H800 has two blue/white wires coming out of it -- one for the remote turn-on lead, and one output to the amplifier. I cut and extended the leads and wrapped them in Techflex, so now I have no idea which wire is which. Can anyone look at their connector and get back to me?

The connector looks like this (wire side of the connector, as seen looking at the H800)










So which blue/white wire is which? Thanks in advance.


----------



## TitanCCBT3

Top blue one is remote out
Bottom blue is remote in


----------



## Neil_J

I guessed and got it right the first time, woohoo


----------



## Denslayer

Wow, long thread. I'm thinking about getting a processor for my new 2013 accord that has a oem amp . I want to use the processor after the HU , then off to my new amp and new speakers . Basically bypass the oem amp that sucks . I have a few questions for the experts . Will the alpine work with balanced differential signal if wired correctly . Will the BT have a echo like I've heard happens with the ms8 . Do I have to use the controller for volume ? Also how does everyone like the alpine and how do you like the sound .


----------



## Deadpool_25

Denslayer said:


> Wow, long thread. I'm thinking about getting a processor for my new 2013 accord that has a oem amp . I want to use the processor after the HU , then off to my new amp and new speakers . Basically bypass the oem amp that sucks . I have a few questions for the experts . Will the alpine work with balanced differential signal if wired correctly . Will the BT have a echo like I've heard happens with the ms8 . Do I have to use the controller for volume ? Also how does everyone like the alpine and how do you like the sound .


I'm a n00b so take this for what it's worth:

If you can get a clean signal into the H800 it sounds amazing. Pulling the signal out of the stock HU before it hits that stock amp is a very good idea and I'm researching how exactly I want to do that. Right now my signal is running from stock HU to stock amp to LCQ-1 to H800. I can control volume from the HU which is convenient, but the signal isn't clean enough (not surprising). It's kinda tricky pulling the signal out before the stock amp on my Sonata but I'll either work that out or just suck it up and put in a new HU.

I have a clean signal running straight from an iPod to the H800 and that sounds MUCH better. I have to control that volume from the RUX.


----------



## Deadpool_25

Maybe it's just me but it would be nice if different inputs/sources would automatically recall a preset. Or maybe it can and I'm not seeing how...


----------



## Neil_J

Another question, sorry if it's been asked before. I have my H800 hooked up to my CDA-117 head unit via Ai-Net, and have the RUX-C800 controller mounted below the head unit. I managed to get the auxiliary input setup where the first of the three stereo channels will play through the head unit, but when I turn the car off and get back in later, the aux input doesn't work until I cycle through the sources. I think this is an Ai-Net issue. I've also not figured out how to select the other two stereo input channels either. I went through the firmware upgrade process the day that i installed the H800, which was only a few months ago. Has anyone else had this issue?


----------



## Deadpool_25

Neil the only connection between HU and H800 is the AI-Net cable?


----------



## Neil_J

Deadpool_25 said:


> Neil the only connection between HU and H800 is the AI-Net cable?


Yes. Does anyone else have this issue, or am I the only one?


----------



## Deadpool_25

What input setting are you using?


----------



## Neil_J

"AUX" via the CDA-117


----------



## Deadpool_25

I mean on the Aux Input Selection screen of the H800. Im not sure how much control you get bia the 117. If you don't have the RUX, connect a PC/laptop via USB. And look at that setup screen. Your problem *may* be just a setting issue.

Nevermind. I see you DO have the RUX. Somehow missed that before. Sorry I couldn't help. Hopefully someone who actually knows will chime in. 

This thread is so long I wonder if it's past its expiration date.


----------



## Neil_J

So is anyone else using a CDA-117 with the H800 and RUX, and using the analog aux input? Is bikinpunk out there?


----------



## ErinH

I'm not using it yet. But I'll be using ai-net.

If I understand your question, I believe the answer is in the dip switches on the deck. Once set to EQ/div (or whatever the ainet setting is) the analog outputs are no longer active AFAIK.


----------



## quality_sound

Correct. It feeds everything over Ai-Net (and optical if you have it) at that point.


----------



## Neil_J

The dip switches on the 117 are set to "EXT AP" which is correct per the owners manual if Ai-Net is used. I'm trying to get the H800 AUX inputs to play, but the RUX "source" button doesn't work when it senses Ai-Net. So I've got to set the source somewhere on the CDA-117 front panel, which, if my understanding is correct, should send an Ai-Net message to the H800, telling it to send its AUX1, AUX2, or AUX3 input to the 117 via the Ai-Net analog wires. When i set the 117 source to "AUX", I can get it to play AUX1 until the car ignition is turned off; after that, i have to click "source" four times to cycle it back to AUX before it starts working again. I've not gotten AUX2 or AUX3 to play at all. The 117 also has an "AUX+", I have no idea what it does, the owners manual is pretty ambiguous. I may try to call Alpine but I doubt I'll get much help there.


----------



## n_olympios

> When an Ai-NET compatible head unit is connected, external input of the PXA-H800 becomes unavailable, and this setting will be disabled.


Page 15 of the manual.


----------



## Neil_J

n_olympios said:


> Page 15 of the manual.


Yea but that's in the PC setup section. Page 36 (in the RUX section) clearly states that "when an Ai-NET compatible head unit is connected, the source should be switched at the head unit. This feature is disabled at the [RUX] Commander."

That's pretty clear to me, it says that when using the RUX, I can set which analog AUX channel or digital channel I want by setting it on the head unit. It would be just plain asinine for Alpine to disallow analog inputs, just because Ai-net is connected. This is however one of the reasons I never even considered Alpine for the longest time... They make stuff so damned complicated when it doesn't have to be (lol, that's coming from me, pot meet kettle).


----------



## quality_sound

By source it means tuner, cd, iPod, and any other Ai-Net connected device, not the H800's aux input.


----------



## ErinH

Neil_J said:


> The 117 also has an "AUX+", I have no idea what it does, the owners manual is pretty ambiguous. I may try to call Alpine but I doubt I'll get much help there.


In pretty sure that allows you to use the RCA as either output or input. And I hope I'm right because I had planned to use them as an aux input.


----------



## Neil_J

Stupid, Stupid, Stupid, Stupid.



Alpine, not you guys


----------



## rnicolai

Hi, hoping someone could take a look at my thread in the advanced discussion regarding why my tweeters are blowing using the PXA-H800:
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...-overs-active-components-dsp.html#post1937347


----------



## TitanCCBT3

I would start from the beginning. Check the output mode, sounds like your running 2way plus sub/ rearfill. Next check speaker output. You have to set high output to tweeter and not full range. Next make sure output rcas are coming from 1 &2 and going to amp then to tweeters. Make sure crossover is set in pxa to at least 4k and up not the other way around. If you are unsure hook 1 channel up to amp with a full range speaker before you fire it up. If you hear mids then you did something wrong. I had a similar issue as you except I had no sound coming from mids. Found out had rca's in wrong spot.


----------



## rnicolai

TitanCCBT3 said:


> I would start from the beginning. Check the output mode, sounds like your running 2way plus sub/ rearfill. Next check speaker output. You have to set high output to tweeter and not full range. Next make sure output rcas are coming from 1 &2 and going to amp then to tweeters. Make sure crossover is set in pxa to at least 4k and up not the other way around. If you are unsure hook 1 channel up to amp with a full range speaker before you fire it up. If you hear mids then you did something wrong. I had a similar issue as you except I had no sound coming from mids. Found out had rca's in wrong spot.



Hi, the following is confirmed:
1. I have the output mode set up correctly and yes, Front high is set to tweeter
2. Channel 1 out of H800 is Left Tweeter and channel 2 is right tweeter
3. HP is set 4k -18 and LP is 20K -18 on rux800.

Now I AM running active with a 20UF cap inline on the tweeters. But having spoken to Tech guy at Alpine this morning, he said that the sweep will send a full signal to tweeters REGARDLESS of where you set crossover on rux800. The ONLY way to protect tweeter is by using the passives that came with speakers or a different cap - He STRONGLY recommended using the passives though so I didn't even ask about what size cap to use.


----------



## kaflam

Well, same question as Denslayer..

Can I use balanced differential signal to the pxa-h800??

And how?? As speaker input and raise the gain??


----------



## EvertonCa

Hey everyone.. I have a chevy cruze with OEM HU and the pxa+rux. But I have a weird problem.. My pxa are connected via high level, but now I don't have any car sounds (seat belt warning, headlight warning, etc) and the worst.. I lost my handsfree bluetooth! The audio that is reproduced are completelly distorted and very low volume.. I don't know what elso to do.. Did someone had a similar problem with OEM HU? BTW, I tried to connect it just with 2 channes (front right and front left) but the problem was still there..


----------



## TitanCCBT3

Make sure the master volume on the rux c800 is all the way up. That stumped me for about 30 minutes when I first hooked mine up. Also check which speakers/output from the HU provide BT and navi sounds if applicable. In my case above only came out the front channels so when I hooked up 2 channel inputs from the rear i lost BT and beeps from the HU.


----------



## EvertonCa

TitanCCBT3 said:


> Make sure the master volume on the rux c800 is all the way up. That stumped me for about 30 minutes when I first hooked mine up. Also check which speakers/output from the HU provide BT and navi sounds if applicable. In my case above only came out the front channels so when I hooked up 2 channel inputs from the rear i lost BT and beeps from the HU.


Only the driver's speakers reproduce the sounds. My rux volume stay always in -16db. The car sounds are muted but my bt sounds really distorted, seams like they are only been reproduced by the tweeters.
But I will try to raise de volume.


----------



## quickaudi07

quality_sound said:


> No, you can't. You have three options to get an H800 to power up.
> 
> 1. - Use an Ai-Net HU.
> 
> 2. - Use the RUX-C800.
> 
> 3. - Connect a laptop.
> 
> These are your only options. Unless you do one of these three, the H800 will not power up. Period.


Another way you could connect your H800 to power up, you need to have optical signal input to H800  and laptop to set everything up....

Other than that what he said above^^^^^


----------



## quality_sound

But once you disconnect the laptop it will turn off and not power up unless you do as I outlined.


----------



## kaflam

Well, I don't understand what you are saying... Are you talking about the turn on at any time??

I haven't received mine, but online manual says that you can use the remote turn on line on your OEM HU.

Or, are you talking about OEM HU without remote line??


----------



## quality_sound

kaflam said:


> Well, I don't understand what you are saying... Are you talking about the turn on at any time??
> 
> I haven't received mine, but online manual says that you can use the remote turn on line on your OEM HU.
> 
> Or, are you talking about OEM HU without remote line??


If you have a non-Ai-Net HU you will have to run a remote turn-on (accessory power) lead AND connect the C800 to get the H800 to power up.


----------



## kaflam

Ok, then I'm lost a bit... I'm not very familiar with Ai-NET concept, I think is a port for an aux input by Alpine, I'm I right?
So, are there any OEM HU with Ai-NET??
And finally, when using RCA to the Pxa-H800 from low level output in HU that will be configured via laptop, do I need the Rux for the H800 to turn on while playing?


----------



## n_olympios

The Ai-NET is a communication protocol, not an aux input (although there is an adaptor for that as well). It is a proprietary Alpine thing, so you won't find any OEM HU's with it, or any HU's other than Alpine that use it for that matter. 

And finally, yes.


----------



## kaflam

Aarrrggh!!
I supose I'll have to order the Rux.
Thanks!


----------



## Shinju

Neil_J said:


> The dip switches on the 117 are set to "EXT AP" which is correct per the owners manual if Ai-Net is used. I'm trying to get the H800 AUX inputs to play, but the RUX "source" button doesn't work when it senses Ai-Net. So I've got to set the source somewhere on the CDA-117 front panel, which, if my understanding is correct, should send an Ai-Net message to the H800, telling it to send its AUX1, AUX2, or AUX3 input to the 117 via the Ai-Net analog wires. When i set the 117 source to "AUX", I can get it to play AUX1 until the car ignition is turned off; after that, i have to click "source" four times to cycle it back to AUX before it starts working again. I've not gotten AUX2 or AUX3 to play at all. The 117 also has an "AUX+", I have no idea what it does, the owners manual is pretty ambiguous. I may try to call Alpine but I doubt I'll get much help there.




After switching to the 3 EXT/AP setting on the unit, you have to power it up (NOT CONNECTED) to the h800 and hit the reset button on the unit. This will then put the unit into the now selected AI-net mode. 

Some units do not have to do this, other like the 117 have to. Also do you have the AI-net cord plugged into the right AI-net port on the H800 and not the changer port? From the sounds if it you might if you are getting it working by cycling though the AUX settings on the HU. 







I got one for you guys.


So I recently upgraded from my 9886 (24bit dac of unknown origin) to a 9887 (24bit burr brown dac) I changed nothing other then the source unit and with the 9887 I have to crank the volume up to 35 to get atleast 70db of volume. The 9886 90db volume reference was around 26-28.

Could the burr brown dac on the 9887 have that much impact on output that I have to adjust the gains on the HD's? I have dropped in a 9855, 9835 and a 117 and reference volume did not really change.

I know the deck is not defective it works I tested the 6 channel pre amp outputs and they all function, the internal IC is off. I have the Norm/EQ switched to EQ.

Anyone run into anything like this with the H800 or even the 701 with the 9887?


----------



## Neil_J

Shinju said:


> After switching to the 3 EXT/AP setting on the unit, you have to power it up (NOT CONNECTED) to the h800 and hit the reset button on the unit. This will then put the unit into the now selected AI-net mode.
> 
> Some units do not have to do this, other like the 117 have to. Also do you have the AI-net cord plugged into the right AI-net port on the H800 and not the changer port? From the sounds if it you might if you are getting it working by cycling though the AUX settings on the HU.


Wow, thanks for this. I'll try this tonight hopefully and see if it changes anything.


----------



## Shinju

If any of you have source units with Toslink optical I cannot stress enough to utilize it.

I switched from AI-Net to Optical using a DVA-9861 and I am never looking back. The beauty of the h800 is that you can utilize AI-net in junction with Optical for total system control.

With AI-net/Toslink I have full control, I do not have to use the RUX for volume, I have full options I can use the radio, aux and ipod with out having to select input VIA processor like others.

The H800 has logic that auto detects what input you are using (Alpine Head units) I can watch the change between analog and digital when switching from source to source.

I do not know how this works with RCA input or source units outside of Alpine but defiantly worth a shot.

With Toslink input the H800 for me really came to life!


----------



## quality_sound

I ran Ai-Net then optical into my H800 from my D800 and the difference was negligible. Both are MILES better than RCA, but the jump from Ai-Net to optical is not, in any measurable way, a huge upgrade from Ai-Net.


----------



## Shinju

quality_sound said:


> I ran Ai-Net then optical into my H800 from my D800 and the difference was negligible. Both are MILES better than RCA, but the jump from Ai-Net to optical is not, in any measurable way, a huge upgrade from Ai-Net.


I will have to argue that, output was far dynamic with optical vs AI-net I actually had to turn down the gains on the amplifiers. Also as far as detail goes I can notice a slight difference. 

Maybe the d800 and 9861 have different DAC's and the audio is processed differently but I can tell you the overall output with the same unit using AI-0NET and Optical separately to test was noticeable in a good way.

The 9861 has a 24bit unknown brand DAC, I don't know about your d800. Also same 9861 Optical vs 9887 AI-net again the output was totally different.

I will agree that RCA input has nothing on AI or Optical.


----------



## quality_sound

The D800 is the ROW HU that was built specifically for the H800. Google "IVA-D800".


----------



## n_olympios

So, apart from the copper chassis what's so different in the D800 compared to, say, the D511R?


----------



## quality_sound

As near as I can tell, it's like the different between a 7909 and a 7915. All internal parts differences.


----------



## mmiller

quality_sound said:


> The D800 is the ROW HU that was built specifically for the H800. Google "IVA-D800".


Please correct me if I'm wrong, this unit is a direct swap if you already a H701 up and running via AI Net, and toslink? You don't need the controller if you tune it via laptop, correct?


----------



## n_olympios

quality_sound said:


> As near as I can tell, it's like the different between a 7909 and a 7915. All internal parts differences.


If it's anything to do with the cd transport (which I doubt), then I'm ok with that. If it's to do with the analog stages then it's a moot point. 

I'm not talking about appearance differences, obviously.


----------



## quality_sound

mmiller said:


> Please correct me if I'm wrong, this unit is a direct swap if you already a H701 up and running via AI Net, and toslink? You don't need the controller if you tune it via laptop, correct?


Correct.


----------



## mister_eff

Quick question: what kind of temperatures and temperatures-above-ambient are you getting for the PXA-H800 and how well-ventilated is it? I'm getting 40-50 degree Fahrenheit temps above ambient. (ie, if it's 70 F outside, the display is reading 115 F). It's in a somewhat confined space. I've been trying to add ventilation and airflow, but so far it hasn't made much of a difference. I haven't had any issues, but I'm curious what other people's experiences are.


----------



## Neil_J

Mine gets pretty toasty, according to the RUX temp sensor. Can't remember exact numbers but likely approaching 160F worst case. Sandwiching it between my amplifiers and living in Florida certainly isn't helping it.


----------



## quality_sound

I had mine under the front seat in my Tundra through a north Texas summer and it was fine. I wouldn't worry about it.


----------



## evo9

quality_sound said:


> As near as I can tell, it's like the different between a 7909 and a 7915. All internal parts differences.



I don't have a 511 for comparison. But I would lean more to just the copper chassis.


----------



## quality_sound

That's like saying the 335 and M3 are probably just skin differences without having both to compare.


----------



## quality_sound

That's like saying the 335 and M3 are probably just skin differences without having both to compare.


----------



## n_olympios

But the 335 and M3 have distinct differences both in specs and appearance.

Excluding the copper chassis and fascia colours, they share the exact same specs. 

Obviously this is not the thread for this discussion, apologies for the derailing.


----------



## ggh300

Hi two questions:

- how can i update the pxa-h800 software, i am using with my car original head unit.
- when using imprint, and have configured many times, always send to much power to my subwoofer amp. So after tuning i have to turn down the gain of my amp, and turn down db on the crossover control. if not the subwoofer sound so bad. like clipping and not armonized whit others outputs. Why??? why pxa send too much volume to the amp in the subwoofer. is there some one that hapened like me?


----------



## Shinju

1. Laptop connection, its pretty self explanatory in the menu system.

2. Sounds like a conflict with your stock HU, have you checked your subwoofer EQ after imprint is done? Sound like something is being over driven or you don't have your gains set correct.


----------



## TIibitzu

Hello my friends,

I have a problem or not????.
I want to know if the processor PXA - H800 can be full controlled by the IVA - D800R???

My pxa-h800 is not work it not full controlled ( only the 6 presets i can change) as was the old PXA - H701 is ok or is broken?.

Thanks from Romania.


----------



## jbholsters

ok I officially have a headache from reading through this. I have a 701 in another vehicle and love it, so the h800 is kind of exciting me. I have an MS8 in the vehicle I'm thinking of putting this in because the MS8 and I are not getting along.

If I purchase the H800, and have an Alpine W535HD head unit, do I still need to purchase the RUXC800? If so, can I still control the volume of the system with the head unit and hide the C800 when not tuning? I take it that they do not offer a screen head unit that will control the H800 fully as was possible with the H701? Where can I find a PDF of the H800 manual? Can't locate it on Alpine site.
Thx


----------



## quality_sound

TIibitzu said:


> Hello my friends,
> 
> I have a problem or not????.
> I want to know if the processor PXA - H800 can be full controlled by the IVA - D800R???
> 
> My pxa-h800 is not work it not full controlled ( only the 6 presets i can change) as was the old PXA - H701 is ok or is broken?.
> 
> Thanks from Romania.


I already commented on this,ore than once. NO head unit will control the H800. Your situation is normal.


----------



## quality_sound

jbholsters said:


> ok I officially have a headache from reading through this. I have a 701 in another vehicle and love it, so the h800 is kind of exciting me. I have an MS8 in the vehicle I'm thinking of putting this in because the MS8 and I are not getting along.
> 
> If I purchase the H800, and have an Alpine W535HD head unit, do I still need to purchase the RUXC800? If so, can I still control the volume of the system with the head unit and hide the C800 when not tuning? I take it that they do not offer a screen head unit that will control the H800 fully as was possible with the H701? Where can I find a PDF of the H800 manual? Can't locate it on Alpine site.
> Thx


Search for my posts in this thread and all of your questions will be answered.


----------



## kaflam

Simple question:

When using the PXA-H800 via RCA with NO Ai-Net HU, you need the RUX.

But do you need to turn the PXA-H800 every time you turn on your car with the RUX?? Or it will be turned on automatically by your remote in signal?


----------



## Deadpool_25

If you leave it on when you turn your car off, it will come back on when you start your car.


----------



## Reginaldocm

kaflam said:


> Simple question:
> 
> When using the PXA-H800 via RCA with NO Ai-Net HU, you need the RUX.
> 
> But do you need to turn the PXA-H800 every time you turn on your car with the RUX?? Or it will be turned on automatically by your remote in signal?


the RUX serves to control the subwoofer and make adjustments when aAny

The PXA H800 works independent of RUX


----------



## quality_sound

No it doesn't. The C800 controls the H800. They are useless without each other.


----------



## Reginaldocm

have you ever tried to take the C800 to see if the H800 keeps running?
makes this test


----------



## kaflam

Nice, i'll try.

Can it work with low level balanced signal?


----------



## kaflam

Ok, I'll change my question...

My HU have balanced differential low level outputs, with no distortion max volume running 3.29 Volt.

PXA-H800 uses RCA max 2 volt input and hi level max 7 volt input.

My question is, is my signal too low for hi level inputs on PXA-H800??

'Cause anyway, RCA seems to be too low.


----------



## quality_sound

Why wouldn't you just use the RCA inputs?


----------



## kaflam

The manual specify: RCA input up to 2 V
And I have 3.29 volt at max volume.

That's why, and I have balanced differential signal, can PXA-H800 handle differential signal on RCA inputs?


----------



## quality_sound

It'll be fine with 3.29V and yes, you can run balanced differential into the RCA inputs.


----------



## kaflam

Thanks for your help!


----------



## jbholsters

Hey guys installed the H800 the other day. I am having a very weird issue though. I was listening to Ecstasy of Gold from the good bad and ugly soundstack (not laugh) and the female vocalist was barely audible. There are a few other songs where the vocalist sounds drown out by the instrumentation as well. But for the most part songs sound fine. With most songs the vocalist is center stage and I can't notice any information missing in the music. The RTA responses look fine, no dips anywhere to indicate a problem. Could it be a setting on the H800? I went through it and can't find anything. Maybe I'm missing something? Help please


----------



## quality_sound

Sounds like you're using one of the surround settings.


----------



## jbholsters

that's what I thought but im running 2 way with rear shut off. So all of those options are greyed out on the software


----------



## jbholsters

doesn't seem to change when I enable defeat on the main menu either


----------



## quality_sound

Have you tried listening on another system?


----------



## jbholsters

yep I listened to it on my home system (pair of martin-logans and 2 old kicker c-12's in an iso box) 


Just don't understand how the frequency response on the RTA wouldn't show something like this


----------



## maxxx

jbholsters said:


> Hey guys installed the H800 the other day. I am having a very weird issue though. I was listening to Ecstasy of Gold from the good bad and ugly soundstack (not laugh) and the female vocalist was barely audible. There are a few other songs where the vocalist sounds drown out by the instrumentation as well. But for the most part songs sound fine. With most songs the vocalist is center stage and I can't notice any information missing in the music. The RTA responses look fine, no dips anywhere to indicate a problem. Could it be a setting on the H800? I went through it and can't find anything. Maybe I'm missing something? Help please


My experience is with the H701, but: Might need to change PCM from 3CH to 2CH (if you're using digital input)? Also disable centre channel in multiple menus, if not being used. Then centre vocal should then be redistributed to L/R. There may also be functions to decrease center info, make sure you don't have these dialed down.

Not sure if most/all of these functions are shared on the H800.


----------



## jbholsters

I'll look for that stuff, but like I said most of that is greyed out since I'm using aux 1 only and front 2 way setup is selected. I also have a few 701's in my other vehicle. the menues for the 800 are different but most of the functions are the same. I did find (unrelated to current issue) that the PCM gain on the 800 increases the front and sub, whereas on the 701 it wouldn't increase sub gain


----------



## jbholsters

I can try and post the rta plot to show you but its pretty flat on both the left and right as well as summed


----------



## jbholsters

haha, so I was playing around with this thing and decided to try the auto time delay calibration to see what it picked. It delayed the tweets, and mids all the same and nothing on the subs (right mid is farthest speaker in vehicle). So much for that. Back to WinMLS and my ears.


----------



## NateZ28

Has anyone come across a head unit that is equal or close to the H800 in sound quality? I'm looking for a high quality all in one solution for playing music from my iPhone via USB.


----------



## Neil_J

NateZ28 said:


> Has anyone come across a head unit that is equal or close to the H800 in sound quality? I'm looking for a high quality all in one solution for playing music from my iPhone via USB.


Pioneer P99 or DEH-80PRS?


----------



## NateZ28

Neil_J said:


> Pioneer P99 or DEH-80PRS?


I was leaning towards to 80PRS, but some people on here think that it ain't so great.


----------



## Neil_J

NateZ28 said:


> I was leaning towards to 80PRS, but some people on here think that it ain't so great.


Yea, we've got some snobs on this board


----------



## jbholsters

Hey quality-sound. i think I figured out what is wrong. Don't think it is the H800. i believe that the PDX amp running the highs is fudged up. I've started getting noise, but only with that amp. Both hiss, engine noise, and some funky noise when the dome lights fade out and turn off. i bypassed the rca's coming out of the H800 and ran a seperate set to the amp, noise still there, I also hooked up an external source to the H800 bypassing the HU and it still is noisy. during one of the tests one side quit playing for a minute as well. another thing i noticed is that when I was playing with the gains, a slight bump from minimum gain puts the amp into clipping (as in only turning the gain pot to where it just moves). It shouldn't clip that fast. I didn't hook a meter up to check voltage, but there is definiatly something wrong with the amp.


----------



## quality_sound

Good troubleshooting. Eliminating sections one at a time definitely helps. Now, before you decide it's the amp, disconnect all of the speakers to that amp and connect a known good speaker with a new, short, speaker wire. If all is good it's either the wires from the amp to the speakers, a speaker or speakers, or a speaker install problem. If it's still having issues, it's the amp.


----------



## jbholsters

thanks, i did this for 10 years way back when so i know how to troubleshoot. I'm pulling the amp and benching it on a power supply tomorrow.

incidently, taking reading on the output of both this and another new model pdx amp, I have found that there is no need to run "y's" to bridge the amp. Wish I would have checked this out before making cables.  it's funny when you call alpine tech and they don't know how to bridge there own amps. Also notice there are 2 different ways they show in the manual to bridge these amps. Wish I'd have had room for my Arc amps.


----------



## NateZ28

Neil_J said:


> Yea, we've got some snobs on this board


Haha well I'm somewhat of a snob myself. I'm trying to build an "audiophile" grade system in my car. 
So you don't think I would notice a difference between the DEH-80PRS and the H800 with an optical input source, both playing a lossless media file?


----------



## Neil_J

NateZ28 said:


> Haha well I'm somewhat of a snob myself. I'm trying to build an "audiophile" grade system in my car.
> So you don't think I would notice a difference between the DEH-80PRS and the H800 with an optical input source, both playing a lossless media file?


Depends on whether you're comparing the configurability of the eq, xover, t/a, etc, or if you'd notice a difference in SNR, crosstalk, distortion, jitter, etc. In the latter case, if you could tell the difference 10 times out if 10, double blind, I'd buy you a beer. In the former case, yea buy whatever you can afford that gives the best configurability yet is easy to use. And even then, if I could do my build over, I'd still put most of my money towards sound deadening, install, good speakers, and powerful amps and run a cheap head unit rather than the other way around.


----------



## NateZ28

Neil_J said:


> Depends on whether you're comparing the configurability of the eq, xover, t/a, etc, or if you'd notice a difference in SNR, crosstalk, distortion, jitter, etc. In the latter case, if you could tell the difference 10 times out if 10, double blind, I'd buy you a beer. In the former case, yea buy whatever you can afford that gives the best configurability yet is easy to use. And even then, if I could do my build over, I'd still put most of my money towards sound deadening, install, good speakers, and powerful amps and run a cheap head unit rather than the other way around.


That's interesting . It's great to hear an honest opinion from someone, rather than recommending the most expensive thing possible. I wouldn't want to mess around with the tuning on the H800 too much after it's set up. I'd probably just leave it with whatever the audio install shop sets it to.

I'm on somewhat of a budget but I want top of the line speakers and I don't want the source unit holding them back.


----------



## Neil_J

NateZ28 said:


> That's interesting . It's great to hear an honest opinion from someone, rather than recommending the most expensive thing possible. I wouldn't want to mess around with the tuning on the H800 too much after it's set up. I'd probably just leave it with whatever the audio install shop sets it to.
> 
> I'm on somewhat of a budget but I want top of the line speakers and I don't want the source unit holding them back.


Speakers create a lot of distortion; an enormous amount more than a head unit will create. However it gets complicated. Not all distortion sounds bad, but certainly it can sound bad. An audiophile tube amp might have 10% distortion but often that's mostly even harmonics (as opposed to odd), which sounds damn pleasant to the ear (even heavenly). All speakers will have distortion when pushed; the good ones will sound better to the ear though. A head unit might have 0.05% distortion when maxed out, but if its high-order harmonics, that 0.05% might sound bad. Sigfried Linkwitz wrote about this, and why THD (total harmonic distortion) is not a great metric. 

If you have a budget, I'd spend most of that on speakers and install/deadening, followed by getting enough power to your speakers (you can never have enough headroom). The Pioneer deck certainly wouldnt make the above sound bad. You can always upgrade later, or buy a used DSP and oldschool Alpine head unit like a 9887 or CDA-117.


----------



## NateZ28

Neil_J said:


> Speakers create a lot of distortion; an enormous amount more than a head unit will create. However it gets complicated. Not all distortion sounds bad, but certainly it can sound bad. An audiophile tube amp might have 10% distortion but often that's mostly even harmonics (as opposed to odd), which sounds damn pleasant to the ear (even heavenly). All speakers will have distortion when pushed; the good ones will sound better to the ear though. A head unit might have 0.05% distortion when maxed out, but if its high-order harmonics, that 0.05% might sound bad. Sigfried Linkwitz wrote about this, and why THD (total harmonic distortion) is not a great metric.
> 
> If you have a budget, I'd spend most of that on speakers and install/deadening, followed by getting enough power to your speakers (you can never have enough headroom). The Pioneer deck certainly wouldnt make the above sound bad. You can always upgrade later, or buy a used DSP and oldschool Alpine head unit like a 9887 or CDA-117.


I think I may initially start out with the 80PRS. I'm going to try to read a few more reviews and get opinions before making a final decision.
What sound deadening material do you recommend? My local audio install shop is all about Dynamat. But I know Dynamat is somewhat overhyped.


----------



## t3sn4f2

NateZ28 said:


> I think I may initially start out with the 80PRS. I'm going to try to read a few more reviews and get opinions before making a final decision.
> What sound deadening material do you recommend? My local audio install shop is all about Dynamat. But I know Dynamat is somewhat overhyped.





bikinpunk said:


> Seriously, where do you guys get these ideas the 80prs is so horrible? Aesthetically, it's hideous. But I own it and have tested it. It tests just as well as any other high end deck electronically. Buy based on features such as DSP, iPod. Bluetooth, etc and/or design style. But don't bother wasting your time comparing sonics as if there was really any audible difference (other than maybe the way the pre out voltage is incremented). If you know how to tune, ANY minute differences can be overcome (not that there are in reality anyway). Sweating indistinguishable differences is a waste of time.
> 
> I've got the data comparing it directly to the p99. Id be happy to post it for anyone who doubts what I say or just wants to see it. Trust me, if it were bad I wouldn't have removed the p99 and replaced it with the 80prs/mosconi DSP combo.
> 
> 
> Edit:
> I'll go ahead and post up the comparison data between the P99 & 80PRS. The differences are negligible... so much so, that I might as well not even acknowledge them. both measure at the bounds of my m-audio 2496 soundcard (used by many as 'high end' soundcard).
> The DRZ has been measured by myself but I don't have the data on this PC to compare to. Bottom line is it measured beyond the bounds of my sound card, too, which is higher than any human is able to detect. Bottom line: if you lose a sound quality competition, it's not the fault of the headunit.
> So, again, purchase based on features and/or personal taste. Not on perceived or proposed sonic detail. Any differences otherwise are negligible and certainly not dominant factors in why you hear what you hear (though, your brain probably is).


-Hope this helps. 

-And sounddeadenershowdown is a good resource.


----------



## Neil_J

NateZ28 said:


> I think I may initially start out with the 80PRS. I'm going to try to read a few more reviews and get opinions before making a final decision.
> What sound deadening material do you recommend? My local audio install shop is all about Dynamat. But I know Dynamat is somewhat overhyped.


Search around this forum, or read some build logs to see what some of us are using. I think we should keep this thread on topic to the H800. Anyway, good luck and keep in mind most people here are more than happy to help answer questions as long as its not been asked 100 times before, and its asked in the right place.


----------



## mister_eff

I'm cross-posting this between here and the Imprint how-to thread. I wasn't sure where to ask and I hope no one minds...

I have a quick question about Imprint... (I have PXA-H800)

What is the end result for Imprint? Is it "simply" time delay for every speaker and the 1/3 octave band EQ for every speaker? I'm asking if it is possible to get the exact same output from manually setting up the PXA-H800 with what Imprint does. I'm not talking about manually deriving every setting, but rather if Imprint does other DSP-ing stuff that the user does not have access to. ie, corrections in the time-domain.

I had some bad luck getting Imprint to work, so I just painstakingly set delays and EQ'ed (graphic) it myself because I'm able to measure 1/3 octave bands very easily. Then I was reading about Audyssey for home audio and it seems like Audysey actively corrects in the time domain (ie, more than just figuring out time delay/speaker distance)

So now I'm wondering if I'm missing out by not using Imprint if it can do time domain corrections that are impossible for me to measure and set myself.

Thanks.


----------



## Tnutt19

Ok guys here is a new question I have not seen here.
Trying to set up 5.1 surround with just 4 channels of input, 2 front and 2 rear.
I am unable to get sound on the center..
I set it to 4 channel input and 5.1 output. Am I missing a setting possibly or is this not possible, I tried turning Euphony on.

Everything is fine with the center, I pulled one of the inputs to the front speakers and plugged it into the amp running the center and sound came out.

Thanks guys!


----------



## mister_eff

Tnutt19 said:


> Ok guys here is a new question I have not seen here.
> Trying to set up 5.1 surround with just 4 channels of input, 2 front and 2 rear.
> I am unable to get sound on the center..
> I set it to 4 channel input and 5.1 output. Am I missing a setting possibly or is this not possible, I tried turning Euphony on.
> 
> Everything is fine with the center, I pulled one of the inputs to the front speakers and plugged it into the amp running the center and sound came out.
> 
> Thanks guys!


I'm not familiar with Euphony, but I think older versions of Dolby Pro Logic II couldn't convert 4.0 -> 5.1, even though they could do 2.0 -> 5.1. Have you tried PLII? Have you tried setting the input as only 2-channel? What are your 4 inputs? If they're just 2 separate stereo inputs (ie, front and rear), I'd just use a 2.0 channel input and use the H800 to control front/rear or whatever.


----------



## Tnutt19

Euphony is where it is suppose to create a center channel from front signals, I thought.
I am using 2 front channels and 2 rear channels, main reason is to retain parking sensors since it's tapped into a BMW 5 series cic HU running balanced.
Thanks for the advice, I think you are right I will give it a shot and see of it works then I can think of a plan for rear Parker sensors, worst case I could tap the rear RCA channels into a set of rear speakers not being used and keep HU fader forward thus retaining.
Thanks again ill post back my results after trying.


----------



## rudi_cpg

hi.... I am using alpine Head unit INA W900e and PXA H800 with ai-net connection (EQ mode), my setup is front 3 way (full active) and 1 Sub woofer, my question is how to switch on rear speaker ? because no more channel for rear speaker.

I have tried connect pre out (RCA Out) and internal power from INA W900e (speaker cable from head unit) but the sound signel still off.... please advise me to turn on rar speaker....

Thanks


----------



## james2266

I was reading through the manual for this processor and was wondering about crossover types. I could not find anywhere in the manual about what types of crossovers are available (ie. Butterworth, L-R, Bessel, etc). Are these even selectable in this unit? I did notice you can set your slopes to pretty much anything but was wondering about crossover types. If there is no option on this, what type are they using?


----------



## james2266

Nobody has any info?...


----------



## Neil_J

james2266 said:


> I was reading through the manual for this processor and was wondering about crossover types. I could not find anywhere in the manual about what types of crossovers are available (ie. Butterworth, L-R, Bessel, etc). Are these even selectable in this unit? I did notice you can set your slopes to pretty much anything but was wondering about crossover types. If there is no option on this, what type are they using?


They don't specifically say which type. Linkwitz Riley could only be used for the 12 dB or 24 dB slope but i really doubt they use Linkwitz Riley at all. I'd guess Butterworth but would have to measure the freq response or ask someone like Jim Walter. I've been curious about that myself.


----------



## sqnut

Probably the even orders are LR and the odd order are BW by default.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Neil_J said:


> They don't specifically say which type. Linkwitz Riley could only be used for the 12 dB or 24 dB slope but i really doubt they use Linkwitz Riley at all. I'd guess Butterworth but would have to measure the freq response or ask someone like Jim Walter. I've been curious about that myself.


You're probably right, the P99RS uses what looks to be Butterworth exclusively.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/member-reviews-product-comparisons/74329-testing-pioneer-carrozzeria-deh-p01-freq-respose-eq-x-over.html


----------



## james2266

Thanks guys. That's kind of what I assumed actually. I was just shocked that such an expensive unit would not have those options available when most (if not all) of its direct competitors have that available. Then again none of its competitors have many of the seemingly 'Alpine exclusives' that deal with surround sound. It is an interesting piece and I am on the look out to hear what one sounds like soon hopefully. Maybe it is in my future.


----------



## Neil_J

t3sn4f2 said:


> You're probably right, the P99RS uses what looks to be Butterworth exclusively.
> 
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/member-reviews-product-comparisons/74329-testing-pioneer-carrozzeria-deh-p01-freq-respose-eq-x-over.html


I halfway recall Andy W saying the H800 (or was it the H701?) used FIR filters instead of IIR. If that were true, the crossovers could very well be linear phase and not exhibit any phase distortion (eliminating the need for Linkwitz-Riley). Probably unlikely though, they're probably butterworth IIR. But I guess we'll never truly know until someone measures it. Dammit, why did Bikinpunk sell his again? Inquiring minds need to know 


I may run a few measurements to find out, very soon, as my H800 is coming out of the car temporarily. I will be modding my H800 to replace the stock JRC opamps with some performance Texas Instruments OPA1642's. Someone in this thread a while back did it and said it made noticeable results. The JRC opamps are proably 1/2 cent each; the OPA1642's were about $44 for 10. I will post here with my impressions before/during/after the modification.


----------



## Neil_J

james2266 said:


> Thanks guys. That's kind of what I assumed actually. I was just shocked that such an expensive unit would not have those options available when most (if not all) of its direct competitors have that available. Then again none of its competitors have many of the seemingly 'Alpine exclusives' that deal with surround sound. It is an interesting piece and I am on the look out to hear what one sounds like soon hopefully. Maybe it is in my future.


I think their heart is in a different place with the H800. I mean, only five parametric eq bands on the sub? While the 6to8 and PS8 have how many dozen bands? And why only 1/6 octave on the frequency selection? The DSP is in no way limited to these points, but the UI is (I know because I've done a lot of filter design over the last few years, outside of car audio). I think the H800 was an attempt to make a car sound great but not inundate the user with a bunch of crap they don't understand. I think this was direct feedback from the Alpine dealers and install shops (I don't think they surveyed Diyma, lol). The basic user can barely wrap their idea around a crossover, let alone the merits of phase distortion of Linkwitz-Riley vs Butterworth, etc. And I can tell you that if I walked in my local SQ shop in Melbourne FL that noone there could answer that question either. I do think you can get a great sounding car with the H800. But if you're looking to win SQ competitions and need every edge you can get, then the Mosconi 6to8 or Arc PS8 are likely a much better choice.


----------



## BigRed

I believe Todd Luliak did very well in competition with a 701 before swapping to the rane.

I run the H800 now and I'm convinced it will keep up with the best of the best.


----------



## Neil_J

BigRed said:


> I believe Todd Luliak did very well in competition with a 701 before swapping to the rane.
> 
> I run the H800 now and I'm convinced it will keep up with the best of the best.


Yea. It can sound good no doubt. My comment was just that its sorta "dumbed down" to the lowest common denominator. You don't have the ability to enter arbitrary frequencies (for example 68.004 Hz) with extremely high Q's on the peaking filters. Or select which filter type to use. It gives you 1/6 octave frequencies with like 5 choices for Q. Which yea, is enough to get a good sounding car. But other DSPs will obviously be more powerful if you've got nasty modal resonances like my car does, or need a lot of eq. But yea, it will get the job done.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Neil_J said:


> I halfway recall Andy W saying the H800 (or was it the H701?) used FIR filters instead of IIR. If that were true, the crossovers could very well be linear phase and not exhibit any phase distortion (eliminating the need for Linkwitz-Riley). Probably unlikely though, they're probably butterworth IIR. But I guess we'll never truly know until someone measures it. *Dammit, why did Bikinpunk sell his again? Inquiring minds need to know*


He got one of the early units that had _issues_. The he had some issues with Alpine and getting a working replacement IIRC. Just know it left a bad taste in his mouth and he got rid of it and the Alpine DD head unit he got for it at the time.


----------



## Neil_J

t3sn4f2 said:


> He got one of the early units that had _issues_. The he had some issues with Alpine and getting a working replacement IIRC. Just know it left a bad taste in his mouth and he got rid of it and the Alpine DD head unit he got for it at the time.


I think he got another one recently and then sold it off shortly thereafter. Oh well. Ill probably run some measurements when I'm doing my opamp mod because I'm curious. Will report back here.


----------



## Pulse-R

Pretty sure it's all butterworth from the sound of it, L-R are a bit hard on the ears to me.

One question here for the new IVA-W947 (optical out but not AiNet)
How does it control the volume?
I saw on a european web site that you connect the AUX output to the Aux IN, and that somehow tells it how to set the volume for the Digital input - but I am sceptical.


----------



## mmiller

quality_sound said:


> Alpine is different. RTFM! Don't tell us you can do it with a relay. We KNOW you can't! If you don't want to listen to the ansswers provided, don't ask the ****ing question! Alpine has had a dual line setup for at LEAST a decade. One for parking brake and one for the fiit brake. It's not a data line, it's a specifice sequence thse lines need to see ground in. You can't build it with the correct timing with a relay. I've tried.


You don't need the bypass, I've done it several times with two switches you have to flip the switches of and on in a certain sequence, but it takes 2 seconds to do once you know the sequence.

I'm not sure if this has been discussed anywhere else in this thread, I'm just skimming through it, so maybe it's been mentioned already. If it hasn't I'll try to make a video if I get a chance.


----------



## quality_sound

Doing it with switches is the same as connecting the wires as stated in the manual except you can do it in motion. The bypass does the same thing, just automatically. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## I Love BMW

I am about to get my h800. Is the cda 117 a good choice for a HU to go with it? Any other ones you recommend or will the 117 suffice? Im just curious... Thanks


----------



## james2266

I Love BMW said:


> I am about to get my h800. Is the cda 117 a good choice for a HU to go with it? Any other ones you recommend or will the 117 suffice? Im just curious... Thanks


Man, another Calgarian on here. Wow, maybe there are more audiophiles here than I thought. Maybe we should try getting a get-together going here. I know I am very interested in grabbing an H800 myself and would love to hear one in action and know your thoughts. As for the 117, you should be fine with that as a head. I don't know if it can control anything on the H800 through the deck tho. Are you going to run the Rux as well? I would very much like to see one of those in person as well. I would like to check it out for fitment in my vehicle. If you are going with the Rux, you don't need anything controlled through the HU really. You also might need the Rux for the H800 to even power up too if the 117 isn't ainet. Just FYI on that one. What else does your build have for equipment anyways?


----------



## I Love BMW

james2266 said:


> Man, another Calgarian on here. Wow, maybe there are more audiophiles here than I thought. Maybe we should try getting a get-together going here. I know I am very interested in grabbing an H800 myself and would love to hear one in action and know your thoughts. As for the 117, you should be fine with that as a head. I don't know if it can control anything on the H800 through the deck tho. Are you going to run the Rux as well? I would very much like to see one of those in person as well. I would like to check it out for fitment in my vehicle. If you are going with the Rux, you don't need anything controlled through the HU really. You also might need the Rux for the H800 to even power up too if the 117 isn't ainet. Just FYI on that one. What else does your build have for equipment anyways?


I am going to get the rux to control the h800. Im glad myself to see another Calgarian on here... As for my equipment I am about to order some Focal Kr2's running them active obviously. 2 12" JL w3's in a sealed enclosure. I need to make a bigger box though for them. Alpine mrx m110 amp for subs and mrx-f35 for the focals. No rear fill and the car is a 2001 BMW 330ci


----------



## cabro

I'm running a 2-way active front system (Tweeter + Mid) + Sub and i'm getting conflicting advice whether I should select F-2way+R+SW and turn off the Rears or go with the F-3way+SW and turn off the Front Lows.

Does anyone have a definitive answer?

Thanks


----------



## Grindcore

audioanamoly said:


> Quick question, has anybody else had an issue with trying to set up a 3-way+sub on the output set up menu of the RUX 800? It allows me to select the 3-way+sub output, saves the settings, but then will not allow me to make any x-over/TA/EQ adjustments from the controller. It just skips the midrange altogether when scrolling through speakers. Does this have to be done via pc only? I'm confused.


I seem to be having this problem...choose 3 way and subs but midrange is not highlighted when you scroll through speaker list...also fails on auto TCR because it can't detect mids.....

If I play music though the sound comes through the mods no problems

If anyone can help that would be greatly appreciated

Cheers

Sam


----------



## quality_sound

cabro said:


> I'm running a 2-way active front system (Tweeter + Mid) + Sub and i'm getting conflicting advice whether I should select F-2way+R+SW and turn off the Rears or go with the F-3way+SW and turn off the Front Lows.
> 
> Does anyone have a definitive answer?
> 
> Thanks


I'd do two way plus rears so that any surround info is processed properly. 

Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


----------



## cabro

quality_sound said:


> I'd do two way plus rears so that any surround info is processed properly.
> 
> Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


Hmm...never thought of that before.

So I would set the Front Highs to "Tweeters", Front Lows would be "OFF" (not available) then use the "Rears" for my Mids?


----------



## quality_sound

No, you'd use the front low for the mids. Don't confuse "low" and "sub"

Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


----------



## cabro

quality_sound said:


> No, you'd use the front low for the mids. Don't confuse "low" and "sub"
> 
> Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


That's the weird thing, when I select that speaker system the settings for the front lows and rears are not accessible, just the front highs and sub. Maybe I have outputs to mixed up?


----------



## quality_sound

I remember being able to go in and set up a 2-way with rears and a 3-way and being able to switch back and forth with no issues. I used it to show people the difference between the two with the same speakers (minus the mid, of course), etc.


----------



## cabro

quality_sound said:


> I remember being able to go in and set up a 2-way with rears and a 3-way and being able to switch back and forth with no issues. I used it to show people the difference between the two with the same speakers (minus the mid, of course), etc.


Thanks for the advice, i'll give it a go and report back.


----------



## cabro

Ok, something else has popped up.

Everything was fine last night when I turned off the car and unplugged the laptop. After I did that I plugged in the RUX with the car still off and called it a day. Just now I turned on the ignition, everything powered up and then the RUX turned off. If I hit the control knob on the RUX it will power back up again but then turn off after 3-5 seconds. At no point is there any sound coming out of the speakers even though the HU volume is at 3/4 and RUX at -40dB. I then held the knob in for 5+/- seconds and that made it stay powered on but still no sound. It's detecting voltage and temp and I can go through all the screens but no sound what so ever.

One other thing I noticed yesterday is every once in a while I would get a message that would pop stating "Input Overflow" (screenshot attached). I'm wondering if the HU volume was too high or something? Maybe it's detecting distortion?









Any ideas on either issue?


----------



## james2266

cabro said:


> Ok, something else has popped up.
> 
> Everything was fine last night when I turned off the car and unplugged the laptop. After I did that I plugged in the RUX with the car still off and called it a day. Just now I turned on the ignition, everything powered up and then the RUX turned off. If I hit the control knob on the RUX it will power back up again but then turn off after 3-5 seconds. At no point is there any sound coming out of the speakers even though the HU volume is at 3/4 and RUX at -40dB. I then held the knob in for 5+/- seconds and that made it stay powered on but still no sound. It's detecting voltage and temp and I can go through all the screens but no sound what so ever.
> 
> One other thing I noticed yesterday is every once in a while I would get a message that would pop stating "Input Overflow" (screenshot attached). I'm wondering if the HU volume was too high or something? Maybe it's detecting distortion?
> 
> View attachment 49921
> 
> 
> Any ideas on either issue?


I don't have this processor yet but it looks to me like the main HU might be sending a clipped signal to the H800 and it is shutting down. I know my Mosconi 6to8 does this. Do you have all of the crappy processing off at the HU? ie. bass boost, eq, staging, speed levelizing, etc. Did you try turning down the HU volume and seeing if you get output then? If you do that is the problem. Also, not all decks have clean output at the top end of their dial. I don't recall if you said if you had a factory or aftermarket HU.


----------



## james2266

cabro said:


> Ok, something else has popped up.
> 
> Everything was fine last night when I turned off the car and unplugged the laptop. After I did that I plugged in the RUX with the car still off and called it a day. Just now I turned on the ignition, everything powered up and then the RUX turned off. If I hit the control knob on the RUX it will power back up again but then turn off after 3-5 seconds. At no point is there any sound coming out of the speakers even though the HU volume is at 3/4 and RUX at -40dB. I then held the knob in for 5+/- seconds and that made it stay powered on but still no sound. It's detecting voltage and temp and I can go through all the screens but no sound what so ever.
> 
> One other thing I noticed yesterday is every once in a while I would get a message that would pop stating "Input Overflow" (screenshot attached). I'm wondering if the HU volume was too high or something? Maybe it's detecting distortion?
> 
> View attachment 49921
> 
> 
> Any ideas on either issue?


Also, your 'source' is set to Aux-1? I don't think this is right actually. What are the other options and is there a screen to assign what is on 'aux-1'?


----------



## cabro

james2266 said:


> I don't have this processor yet but it looks to me like the main HU might be sending a clipped signal to the H800 and it is shutting down. I know my Mosconi 6to8 does this. Do you have all of the crappy processing off at the HU? ie. bass boost, eq, staging, speed levelizing, etc. Did you try turning down the HU volume and seeing if you get output then? If you do that is the problem. Also, not all decks have clean output at the top end of their dial. I don't recall if you said if you had a factory or aftermarket HU.


Ya, I have all processing on the HU turned off and suspected clipping so I turned the volume on the HU down to 50% before unplugging the laptop to try and get rid of that Input Overflow error for next time.

The RUX not staying on seems to be a separate problem. Alpine Tech Support suspects a bad cable for the RUX so i'll unplug that and hook the laptop up again and see if that gets it going.


----------



## james2266

cabro said:


> Ya, I have all processing on the HU turned off and suspected clipping so I turned the volume on the HU down to 50% before unplugging the laptop to try and get rid of that Input Overflow error for next time.
> 
> The RUX not staying on seems to be a separate problem. Alpine Tech Support suspects a bad cable for the RUX so i'll unplug that and hook the laptop up again and see if that gets it going.


I thought I read something about a setting that turns the Rux display off after a couple seconds... Maybe that is set to on when it should be off?


----------



## cabro

james2266 said:


> I thought I read something about a setting that turns the Rux display off after a couple seconds... Maybe that is set to on when it should be off?


Could be, i'll take a look.


----------



## quality_sound

There is a setting to dim the display on the RUX. Aren't you using an Ai-Net HU? If you are, put it back into that mode. It'll make everything easier. The other thing I'd try since you already have RCAs run to the H800 input is to bypass the H800 before you go back to Ai-Net mode. If that fixes it then first try resetting the H800. If that doesn't fix it you may have to send it in. Also, if make sure you don't have TWO switches on the HU to go into processor mode. My D800 did.


----------



## cabro

quality_sound said:


> There is a setting to dim the display on the RUX. Aren't you using an Ai-Net HU? If you are, put it back into that mode. It'll make everything easier. The other thing I'd try since you already have RCAs run to the H800 input is to bypass the H800 before you go back to Ai-Net mode. If that fixes it then first try resetting the H800. If that doesn't fix it you may have to send it in. Also, if make sure you don't have TWO switches on the HU to go into processor mode. My D800 did.


Sorry, I must have left that part out. I'm using a Parrot Asteroid Smart for my HU so I only have control with the the RUX or with a Laptop connected.

I'm going RCA's Front L + R into AUX1 on the H800.

It's so weird, the RUX was working fine before I hooked the laptop up, now when disconnect the laptop and go back to the RUX it's not.

I'll try resetting the H800 as well, it's just a PITA for me to get to it.


----------



## cabro

After speaking with Alpine Tech Support (who suspected a bad RUX cable) I unplugged the cable from the H800 and plugged it back in again and i'm back in business.

The cable seemed snug but maybe it wasn't getting a good enough connection for some reason. I'll keep an eye on it and see if it happens again.

I also asked what the "Input Overflow" was and he basically confirmed that the input signal was to high and that I should lower the volume on the HU from 3/4 to 1/2 and see if the message goes away. I did this and will keep an eye on it as well.

The next thing I have to figure out is why some of my music sounds so hollow.

90's "alternative" music (Tool, Sound Garden ect). sound really quiet, almost like it's a mono recording or they are singing into a cave or tin can.

Dixie Chicks, same issue.

Only music that is sounding half way decent at the moment is Dubstep/Trap and Pop.

I've played around with phase and cross-over points so far and it's helped but not enough.

Anyone have any theories before I bust out an RTA this weekend so I can see what's going on?


----------



## james2266

cabro said:


> After speaking with Alpine Tech Support (who suspected a bad RUX cable) I unplugged the cable from the H800 and plugged it back in again and i'm back in business.
> 
> The cable seemed snug but maybe it wasn't getting a good enough connection for some reason. I'll keep an eye on it and see if it happens again.
> 
> I also asked what the "Input Overflow" was and he basically confirmed that the input signal was to high and that I should lower the volume on the HU from 3/4 to 1/2 and see if the message goes away. I did this and will keep an eye on it as well.
> 
> The next thing I have to figure out is why some of my music sounds so hollow.
> 
> 90's "alternative" music (Tool, Sound Garden ect). sound really quiet, almost like it's a mono recording or they are singing into a cave or tin can.
> 
> Dixie Chicks, same issue.
> 
> Only music that is sounding half way decent at the moment is Dubstep/Trap and Pop.
> 
> I've played around with phase and cross-over points so far and it's helped but not enough.
> 
> Anyone have any theories before I bust out an RTA this weekend so I can see what's going on?


Sounds like a simple tuning or balance issue. ie. Too little midbass would be my guess but talking into a tin can can usually be midrange issues going on. I always have my rta handy when tuning. I have learned to not use it for tuning exclusively especially when it comes down to left right balance. I just seem to have much greater success when I do the left right by ear exclusively. I use the rta very much on setting levels between pairs of drivers and for seeing any major trouble issues on the eq. I make note of them an then focus on those eq frequencies but with music playing. Helps me to see if it really is an issue or some anomaly. ie. usually reflections would be my guess.


----------



## Grindcore

Hey guys just letting yaz know I did a couple of imprint runs last night on my stereo and I was pleasantly surprised by the results...

I use to own a pxa-h100 and the imprint on that was very ordinary...so when I got my 800 I don't bother trying it!!

Until now I was just manually tuning and getting help with an RTA...I was pretty pleased with the results...but it was missing something...

Anyway my set up is a 3 way front with two 12's in the rear

Front midbass are 8" goldwoods in the doors
Fountek 3" fr88ex and mt23 morel tweets in pods on the dash.
Subs are Dayton HO's 12"

I set all gains am crossover settings,level matching etc...all before I had run imprint..and was pretty happy with the results...I had a high stage height and rock solid centre..bass was up front but it could have been better...I was also lacking the mid bass punch in the chest...stage width could have been better also...the main thing tho was my system lacked a lot of detail...
I had TCR dialled in pretty sweet also...just used the old tape measure and calcs for that!

Anyway...just to fill you in with some settings..

Now I'm not sure if imprint does its own thing or it uses some settings etc???

So crossover as follows

Subs [email protected]
Mids [email protected]
Midrange from [email protected] 
And tweets from 3.6 and up..I have the tweets cutting off around 18khz with a gentle slope

I had everything level matched to drivers seat which worked out being the left side of vehicle 4 dbs higher than right.

Ok...to imprint...I used a camera tripod when taking measurements
Set the microphone at ear height and had the mic facing straight up...I chose the drivers side seat..RHD..Australian vehicle....an did all six measurements...

When it all finished I sent the ref and red mid comp curves to the 800..
Gave the ref a go and it sounded ok.....a little bright...
Switched to the other curve and I was pleasantly surprised!! Tried a few types of music and it seemed to play them all very well...from metal to easy listening...handled it much better than with my own manual tuning...as I always have to tweak here and there when I'm playing different styles.....

Anyway stage height was there and I had a rock solid centre...which I had previously...but width was improved...upfront bass was also improved and I was getting the middbass kick to the chest I was missing before...just on that I don't know what imprint did but my left mid bass is hitting much harder than the left but my midbass/bass seems to be coming from dead centre of the dash...so it's not pullin to the drivers side which surprised me..

The biggest improvement though was the detais in the music...I was hearing things I want before...like certain guitar strumming or picking...backing vocals etc..

The only thing I can fault it at the moment is at very high volumes it tends to break up just a bit....but I very rarely play it that loud...just wanted to see how it worked at high volumes..

I tried running another imprint last night..and changed mic position to shoulder/head height..I have seen this posted on the net...and the results weren't as good...

Also I the manual it states if you have your kids and tweets on the dash you should choose the ref with mid comp curve...and it did suit my application..

Tonight I'm going to try another couple of runs and see why results I get

I haven't bothered fiddling with any settings yet after the imprint...but either way I have a very good base which I may try tweak in the coming days

All in all tho I was pretty impressed with the results.dunno if I just lucked out but whatever...it sounds ****in good!!

Will keep ya posted in the coming days with any new developments
Cheers

Sam


----------



## Grindcore

Kids on the dash!!! Stupid auto correct


----------



## Grindcore

The only other thing I can think of is I have my subs reversed phase...everything else has been left as is...


----------



## Grindcore

Just re reading post and that should be that my right mid bass...the one closest to me is hitting harder than the left....but bass is still centred in car...I thought that strange because I would have thought that it would have made the left louder to compensate for distance to driver??


----------



## Grindcore

Another observation...in my initial settings before imprint I mentioned that I had a 4db difference from left to right...would imprint still use that setting when it's pinging the drivers??? I never reset that value...maybe I will just have to put it back to 0 db and run another imprint session....

Does anyone know what exact settings it will keep?? 

Sam


----------



## cabro

james2266 said:


> Sounds like a simple tuning or balance issue. ie. Too little midbass would be my guess but talking into a tin can can usually be midrange issues going on. I always have my rta handy when tuning. I have learned to not use it for tuning exclusively especially when it comes down to left right balance. I just seem to have much greater success when I do the left right by ear exclusively. I use the rta very much on setting levels between pairs of drivers and for seeing any major trouble issues on the eq. I make note of them an then focus on those eq frequencies but with music playing. Helps me to see if it really is an issue or some anomaly. ie. usually reflections would be my guess.


I think you're right about too little midbass, it's a battle i've been fighting for quite a while now.

Before switching to the H800 I was using an MS-8 and couldn't tune it properly to get any midbass out of it. After switching out my mids and amp, which also didn't make a difference I swapped to the H800 to see if that would help and i'm pretty much in the same boat.

I will say however, that I still need to hook up the RTA to see exactly what frequencies are not coming through and try to tune based on yours and others advice on the forum.

I'm also going to add a spacer and foam baffle to my mids to try and "seal" them to the door cards in hopes that will help.


----------



## james2266

cabro said:


> I think you're right about too little midbass, it's a battle i've been fighting for quite a while now.
> 
> Before switching to the H800 I was using an MS-8 and couldn't tune it properly to get any midbass out of it. After switching out my mids and amp, which also didn't make a difference I swapped to the H800 to see if that would help and i'm pretty much in the same boat.
> 
> I will say however, that I still need to hook up the RTA to see exactly what frequencies are not coming through and try to tune based on yours and others advice on the forum.
> 
> I'm also going to add a spacer and foam baffle to my mids to try and "seal" them to the door cards in hopes that will help.


Well... what are you running for midbasses and how are your doors (or do you have them in a different configuration)? I always had issues with getting any midbass punch until I decided to step up to an 8 inch midbass. Then again, alot of people out there would say it was upper subbass that was the problem. Anyways, the problem I was having was a drop off in the 60-80 Hz range that neither my midbass or my sub would play seemingly. Once I got my Morel 8s, I had no more issues (other than some damned rattles I am still fighting). They actually play easily down to 50 Hz and could probably go lower but don't need it. Ultimo has to play something right and it truly does disappear when levels and ta are set correctly (another real challenge for me too). 

Each vehicle is different when it comes to this region and in yours your sub might fill this region just fine. In which case it would mainly come down to level matching and getting the ta dialed in correctly. Getting the install right for the midbass is absolutely critical however. Make sure there are no holes in that door at all and use a copious amount of cld. The larger the midbass the more it will help you out. I will say that a larger midbass has to work alot less hard than a smaller one too. Keeps distortion down more and surprisingly less buzzes and rattles for the same spl level at the same frequency. Problem for me is I am playing them a fair amount lower and that is the cause of my buzzes I think. My last deadening attempt really did kill alot of it. It is almost not noticeable. Deep down I know it is there so I will probably go back in when I get some time and it actually warms up some. I do hold out hope that will happen some day in the future


----------



## Bluenote

I hope this isn't too off topic but I'm planning a move from MS8 Logic 7 to H800 frt / ctr and rears. Would a minidsp 2x4 in the signal chain complicate things if used to band-pass mids and tweets on morel hybrid 402's? I only want to set the crossover on the minidsp no TA. Also, would the H800 support surround for sides and rears if wired in parallel like the MS8? Thanks!


----------



## cabro

quality_sound said:


> I'd do two way plus rears so that any surround info is processed properly.


I really appreciate the tip, this fixed my problem and the midbass is back. I was definitely missing info in the music

Thanks!


----------



## james2266

Good to hear you got your setup sounding better again.

I have a related question too. I was wondering if its possible to have the H800 setup to process a 3 way front with center processing and a sub (but no rears)? I didn't see that as an option but was wondering if there was a way to set this type of setup up?


----------



## cabro

james2266 said:


> Good to hear you got your setup sounding better again.
> 
> I have a related question too. I was wondering if its possible to have the H800 setup to process a 3 way front with center processing and a sub (but no rears)? I didn't see that as an option but was wondering if there was a way to set this type of setup up?


I'm not 100% sure as I don't run a center channel or rears at the moment but it doesn't look like you can.

Hopefully someone else with more experience with the H800 can confirm for you.


----------



## james2266

cabro said:


> I'm not 100% sure as I don't run a center channel or rears at the moment but it doesn't look like you can.
> 
> Hopefully someone else with more experience with the H800 can confirm for you.


Thanks but from what I see in the software, if you want center processing it must have full surround sound and that means rears. It would be so nice if it would allow for 3 way active front, sub and center as I dont' have rears and not so sure I really want the added investment. I likely will go that route in time. I will start out with 3 way front and sub like I have now and see how it goes. I can't glass anything in this cold until likely April or so anyways. Gives me time to hopefully perfect the 3 way first a little more.


----------



## kaflam

Hi there!! I need an advice...

With an undisorted signal of 3.7 volt output of my HU, what do you think is better: Low (2 volt) or High (7 volt) configuration.

Thanks!


----------



## t3sn4f2

kaflam said:


> Hi there!! I need an advice...
> 
> With an undisorted signal of 3.7 volt output of my HU, what do you think is better: Low (2 volt) or High (7 volt) configuration.
> 
> Thanks!


low. that way you push the dsp input to a max level for better resolution prior to processing. as well as leaving yourself some free gain headroom on the head unit output for low recording levels. You will have to be careful not to overdrive the dsp inputs when playing dynamic tracks that appear to be low level recordings since a clipped input sound very nasty compared to an over driven amp output or speaker.


----------



## kaflam

That's what I thought!! Thanks for the advice. I'll use an oscilloscope to set the max volume per channel on DSP and amp.

Nice day and again, thanks for the advice


----------



## cabro

t3sn4f2 said:


> low. that way you push the dsp input to a max level for better resolution prior to processing. as well as leaving yourself some free gain headroom on the head unit output for low recording levels. You will have to be careful not to overdrive the dsp inputs when playing dynamic tracks that appear to be low level recordings since a clipped input sound very nasty compared to an over driven amp output or speaker.


^^ +1


----------



## cabro

Has anyone had any luck getting the Sound Manager software to work on Windows 8.1, specifically a MS Surface Pro?

I can get it to install fine but when I launch the program it loads for a second then exits out to the desktop.

Running it on my laptop with Windows XP works perfect.

Thanks!


----------



## TheBlindMan

Read about 20 pages of this thread. Didn't run into anyone using the H800 processor with a factory head unit. What are your guys thoughts on this unit with the factory head unit using speaker-level outs? What year/vehicle?


----------



## kaflam

I'm running on windows 8.1 with no problem on a laptop, but since windows is not the same on tablets, I don't think it will be easy for you.

Ok, a little help please!!!

I have 5 channels on my OEM HU (FL, FR, RL, RR, Sw) and the same on my speakers running 5 channels for my amp.

How can I tell PXA-H800 to use each channel for each speaker?

It keeps mixing rear and subwoofer as a mono "mass" WTH !!

Please, help!


----------



## kaflam

Ok, ok!!

I got it! Channel 1 to 4 are for front
Channel 5 and 6 for rear
Channel 7 and 8 for sub.

Thanks folks, I wrote this for every noob as me looking for simple answers.


----------



## TitanCCBT3

TheBlindMan said:


> Read about 20 pages of this thread. Didn't run into anyone using the H800 processor with a factory head unit. What are your guys thoughts on this unit with the factory head unit using speaker-level outs? What year/vehicle?




Used it with factory head unit for about 6 months in 2010 Nissan Titan

No real issues except a little floor noise

Eventually tried it in conjunction with an audiocontrol LC6i which solved that problem a little

Finally just decided to go with aftermarket HU for better iPod control and have been satisfied since


----------



## kaflam

I have a 2012 CRV, alredy had a bit ten and now working with pxa-h800.
I can't work with any other HU because it manage some vehicle stuff.
So...
I need to work with analog signal!


----------



## wr022

Looking for some help.

I have recently installed D800E and have an optical cable running to my H800 with C800. After installation, I realise the CD was not playing over the optical cable and DVD had no sound too. Went back to my installer and they were also puzzled by the behaviour. After spending a day of troubleshooting with random results, the conclusion was a broken optical cable which they gladly change out the optical cable. For that moment, both CD and DVD could play over the optical cable. 

After a day, the problem returned. This time only the DVD had no sound. I have noticed that the H800 will start this dolby digital mode for the dvd that I was playing and when the dolby digital mode was not activated, there was no sound. I already at my wits end and there is no solution for this... I had to resort to ainet for DVD audio and constantly changing to optical for my CD..

Appreciate all kind advice!


----------



## quality_sound

Did you make sure BOTH switches were flipped?

Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


----------



## wr022

quality_sound said:


> Did you make sure BOTH switches were flipped?
> 
> Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


Hi, 

Optical was on and I'm not sure which other switch is needed.


----------



## kaflam

This is quite perfect. Imprinting while having a 18 years scotch!


----------



## kaflam

Ok, some questions and here is the first one:
ImprintEQ is suposed to set my Xovers, but after imprimting and set defeat on, the Xover section is enabled and Xovers are off.
My actual system is using:
Front: Chameleon Image Dynamics 6.5 (passive crossover)
Rear: Coaxial Image Dynamics 6.5
Sub: 10W6v3
Amp: PDX-V9 with xovers off

Should I set xovers manually??


----------



## quality_sound

wr022 said:


> Hi,
> 
> Optical was on and I'm not sure which other switch is needed.


The D800 has two switches on the side that have to be flipped to put it into a mode that will let it work with the H800. One says "norm-eq/div", it should be set to eq/div, and I forget the what the other says but it had to be flipped to. All of this is in one of the manuals, though I'm not sure which. 

Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


----------



## Guest

I'm sure this has been covered, but.... what outcome have people experienced using the H800 with only RCA inputs ? I have an Alpine S920HD currently and it does not offer any digital or ai-net outs....

Also, are there any fixes for the H701 analog noise issues ? I have one of those sitting on a shelf also...

THANKS !!!


----------



## kaflam

SQ_MDX said:


> I'm sure this has been covered, but.... what outcome have people experienced using the H800 with only RCA inputs ? I have an Alpine S920HD currently and it does not offer any digital or ai-net outs....
> 
> Also, are there any fixes for the H701 analog noise issues ? I have one of those sitting on a shelf also...
> 
> THANKS !!!


I´ve been using it with my OEM HU with no problem, cristal clear sound.


----------



## wr022

quality_sound said:


> The D800 has two switches on the side that have to be flipped to put it into a mode that will let it work with the H800. One says "norm-eq/div", it should be set to eq/div, and I forget the what the other says but it had to be flipped to. All of this is in one of the manuals, though I'm not sure which.
> 
> Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


Hi, 
Thanks for the help. I saw this in the D800 manual and went to my installer and checked the D800 and both HU switches are already flipped to eq/div.. there is still no sound from the dvd...


----------



## kaflam

Ok, this is what i think after installation:
AutoTCR is not working for me and don't know why, on ch3 just says volume is not enough.
ImprintEQ doesn't seems to work properly for me, maybe I did something wrong, but frecuencies are not reproducing as good as it suposed to be.
ImprintEQ + after eq with RTA was my best shoot. Tomorrow I'll be testing my actual config.
I don't know if I understand or not, but after setup imprint and roadeq the xover and TCR are not enabled so I decided to set them manually.

Well, this is just my opinion. Any advice??


----------



## robotott

cabro said:


> Has anyone had any luck getting the Sound Manager software to work on Windows 8.1, specifically a MS Surface Pro?
> 
> I can get it to install fine but when I launch the program it loads for a second then exits out to the desktop.
> 
> Running it on my laptop with Windows XP works perfect.
> 
> Thanks!


I got it to work with no problems. Be sure you download the 64 bit version from the alpine Europe site. I have it running on the surface pro I just got for Christmas.


----------



## cabro

robotott said:


> I got it to work with no problems. Be sure you download the 64 bit version from the alpine Europe site. I have it running on the surface pro I just got for Christmas.


I thought I used the 64-bit version, i'll take a second look.


----------



## vivmike

I am running a 9860 HU to my h800, optical out. The optical stops working whenever I switch out CD/DVD's or turn off power. The only way I can keep optical working is switching to AiNet before changing discs or powering off unit.

Any idea how to fix this?


----------



## robotott

vivmike said:


> I am running a 9860 HU to my h800, optical out. The optical stops working whenever I switch out CD/DVD's or turn off power. The only way I can keep optical working is switching to AiNet before changing discs or powering off unit.
> 
> Any idea how to fix this?


You should be using version 2.1 software with that head unit. What version are you using?


----------



## vivmike

Issue is still there. AiNet sounds louder too, is that common?


----------



## robotott

Try hitting the reset button behind the dva9860 faceplate, and make sure you have the
Eq/div switch on the dva9860 set correctly.


----------



## BigRed

Make sure your power and ignition wires are hooked up correctly. The radio has to remember your settings


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## robotott

kaflam said:


> Ok, this is what i think after installation:
> AutoTCR is not working for me and don't know why, on ch3 just says volume is not enough.
> ImprintEQ doesn't seems to work properly for me, maybe I did something wrong, but frecuencies are not reproducing as good as it suposed to be.
> ImprintEQ + after eq with RTA was my best shoot. Tomorrow I'll be testing my actual config.
> I don't know if I understand or not, but after setup imprint and roadeq the xover and TCR are not enabled so I decided to set them manually.
> 
> Well, this is just my opinion. Any advice??


I had the same problem for a while. I had the mic pointing sideways. Once I pointed the mic straight up in the air and reperformed imprint, it sounded great.


----------



## kaflam

Ok, I have a question:
After some Graphic Eq, and getting the curve I want, I'm supposed to turn Defeat On, but if I do that, the Frequency response changes!
Is it trying to get the reference curve when defeat is on?
Or what?
(No imprint or roadeq is being used)


----------



## TitanCCBT3

Defeat "on" turns off any processing performed by the unit.

Turns off time alignment, imprint, eq settings etc

Only thing not affected is the crossover/gain settings

Should be in defeat off mode during regular usage

So basically when you turn defeat"on" after setting eq etc you turn it off


----------



## kaflam

Yes... I don't think I get it.

The manual says "To enable this function, Defeat should be is set to ON." at the end of every "Setting the..."

Also, on my HU I have a subwoofer volume that works whith Defeat ON, but not in Defeat OFF. I do agree with you, TitanCCBT3 that Defeat ON turns off the processing of the unit, but is the HU (as I supossed) or the PXA-H800 unit??


----------



## TitanCCBT3

On page 12 of the manual/PC section with regards to setting defeat it says at the end of the sentence " restored to initial settings" or off. So turning in the defeat turns off all processing. I am not using the subwoofer control on my alpine HU and in fact am only using front outputs only sent to pxa h800. Are you using an alpine HU? If so us it an Ainet enabled unit?

I agree the manual is very poorly written and doesn't provide much into with regards to usage

I basically used this site to figure it out especially the imprint portion

Hope this helps and good luck


----------



## kaflam

Ok, I decided to do everything "by hand"

I'm using my OEM HU (is required by my car for bluethoot, cam, vehicle configuration, etc) with 5 output channels.

I decided to work with defeat OFF (I think that's the way)
Imprint EQ with reference curve
Graphic Eq after Imprint using RTA
Auto-TCR
Adjusted the gain for every channel with an SPL (fine meassure)

Finally, lower the gain for the sub on the amp :S (after oscilloscope set)

Now just working with some simple preferences: compression 1,2,3, music 1,2,3... nothing... Euphony: acoustic, live...

But after all...

Now everything is working great!!


----------



## kaflam

Also...

Is there any configuration where you don't loose subwoofer control on the HU using AUX when using imprintEq ??


----------



## robotott

kaflam said:


> Also...
> 
> Is there any configuration where you don't loose subwoofer control on the HU using AUX when using imprintEq ??


What is the model number of your head unit?


----------



## quality_sound

kaflam said:


> Also...
> 
> Is there any configuration where you don't loose subwoofer control on the HU using AUX when using imprintEq ??


There is a list in this thread that says which HUs keep sub control at the HU. My D800 did.


----------



## kaflam

I'm using my OEM HU via AUX 5.1 input.


----------



## Rapture333

What do you guys have your AUX In gain set to? "Low" or "High"? At "Low" I get a bit of noise at 0 volume. At "High" I get no noise, but at Max volume a lot of tracks aren't playing high enough. What gives?

Also, after an Auto-TCR, my settings are, FL: 20.00ms FR: 20.00ms, RL: 20.00ms, RR: 19.38ms. Does this sound right to everyone? Maxed out TCR? That doesn't seem like it would be correct, and most of the values are the same...


----------



## BigRed

Low if u are not using high level outputs like speaker level. There is plenty of gain on the h800. Just set it to low and use the aux gain adjustment to increase level


----------



## Rapture333

I just measured my time correction manually and tweaked in, and wow does it sound great! Much different then what the mic gave me, I'm not sure why its so different?

Anyway, I did Imprint EQ for the front left drivers seat. Is that the best way to go? 

Also, I'm curious to know what other people have done as far as other settings such as Euphony, Dolby Digital, Rear Mix, etc. I have a -6dB rear mix with Stereo processing atm.


----------



## Grindcore

Rapture333 said:


> What do you guys have your AUX In gain set to? "Low" or "High"? At "Low" I get a bit of noise at 0 volume. At "High" I get no noise, but at Max volume a lot of tracks aren't playing high enough. What gives?
> 
> Also, after an Auto-TCR, my settings are, FL: 20.00ms FR: 20.00ms, RL: 20.00ms, RR: 19.38ms. Does this sound right to everyone? Maxed out TCR? That doesn't seem like it would be correct, and most of the values are the same...



Yeah I've done auto TCR and my measurements were something like yours.maxed and the same distances between drivers.my miss and tweets are right next to each other on the dash and my midbass in the doors.i measured manually with tape and I was surprised that the distances in my car were all pretty close.the maxing of the TCR threw me off tho but could it be because of the subs? Mine are in the trunk and maybe they are delayed that much to blend with the subs? I was very surprised with how it sounded..very centered stage and quality up front bass.ive tried the manual way with tape measure,I can get it centered pretty good but if I don't delay the fronts enough you can tell the subs are in the back


----------



## thehatedguy

What are the types of rear mix you can do?


----------



## Rapture333

Rear Mix basically lets you raise or the rear speaker volume + or - 3 or 6db. I keep it at -6db.


----------



## evikins

I am using a W505 with PXA H100 now . If I upgrade to PXA H800 shoud i need to buy RUXC800 or not ? read somewhere that need this to power on H800... 

thank


----------



## quality_sound

I don't remember, does the 505 have an Ai-Net connection? If not you'll need the C800. 

Sent from my Moto X using Tapatalk


----------



## evikins

quality_sound said:


> I don't remember, does the 505 have an Ai-Net connection? If not you'll need the C800.


For sure ... W505 has AI-Net connection

Currently HU W505 is connecting to PXA H100 by this cable


----------



## gerry78

hello 
I installed the pxa h800 and have a professional radio f30. 
I like listening to euphony but the two-channel input is required. 
the problem is that if I use the two front hear the bluetood, but not the reverse alarm and if I use the two rear channels hear the alarm but not the bluetood. 
any idea how to fix this?


----------



## into_the_void

Newb here...

Hoping you guys can point me in the right direction with this. I didnt see it in the previous 100 pages here and the manual isnt much help for this setup. I need advice on how the system should be hooked up for an active 2 way front stage (no rears) + subwoofer. What are the recommended volume/sub levels on the H800 when setting amp gains?

2014 Toyota Tacoma Double Cab
OEM Head unit
Alpine PDX-V9 5 channel
Focal 165KRX2 components for front stage (active)
Alpine SWR-T12 in ported enclosure

Here's how i currently have it hooked up and the issues im running into:

I cut into the OEM front L&R and rear L&R speaker wires behind the head unit and ran them via RCA to the H800. (I wasnt sure if i needed to do the rears since im only running front stage).
I have three pair RCA's on the H800 output set up for F2way+R+SW (4.2ch system) running to the amp. Im not using Ch5 and Ch6 RCA's coming out of the H800 since im not running rear speakers.
In the software I have the speaker system selected as F2way+R+SW and turned off the rear speakers.

I ran Imprint and Auto TCR successfully, but I notice that the output volume level is noticeably quieter with these running (defeat off) vs. when i switch defeat on. For ****s and giggles i tried turning the rear speakers back on and the output volume came back to normal. Of course, this automatically turns Imprint off.

Should i be setting the H800 up for F3way + SW instead? If so, how do i connect 4 pair of RCA's coming out of the H800 to only 3 pair RCA's going into the amp?

Obviously i've never run a processor before and am in need of some help. Thanks in advance guys.


----------



## kaigoss69

I have been keeping an eye on this thread hoping to come across a review or two, especially in comparison to the MS-8. Maybe I missed it, but I just haven't seen any. The question I would like to have answered is this: Can this unit achieve better results than the MS-8, especially with a center channel installed, provided that the user is not good at tuning by ear? If you think it is better, in what areas?


----------



## Bluenote

^ same here...


----------



## hykhleif

want to make sure that my pioneer prs 80 does not interfere with the setting of the alpine pxah700 dsp

so I put my pioneer in standard mode, but still the HPF and LPF show frequencies, so will that affect the alpine pxah700 settings

On the pioneer prs 80 I still HPF1 pass, but HPF2 80, 

And on the subwoofer LPF2 is 80 

How can I cancel the pioneer frequencies points

Can someone tell me what is the ideal way to let the alpine pxa700 control all the sound without any interference from the pioneer prs80

I have hertz 1600 mille comps which is why i am now in standard mode with the pioneer prs80


----------



## jriggs

hykhleif said:


> want to make sure that my pioneer prs 80 does not interfere with the setting of the alpine pxah700 dsp
> 
> so I put my pioneer in standard mode, but still the HPF and LPF show frequencies, so will that affect the alpine pxah700 settings
> 
> On the pioneer prs 80 I still HPF1 pass, but HPF2 80,
> 
> And on the subwoofer LPF2 is 80
> 
> How can I cancel the pioneer frequencies points
> 
> Can someone tell me what is the ideal way to let the alpine pxa700 control all the sound without any interference from the pioneer prs80
> 
> I have hertz 1600 mille comps which is why i am now in standard mode with the pioneer prs80


you got the answer in your other thread.


----------



## hykhleif

just a quick question guys

I am wondering about the setup of the pxa 700 with my speakers hertz mlk2 and arc audio subs

so I have a herts mille mlk2 and its woofer is connected to audison lrx 2.9 and the tweeter to audison 4.1,the arc audio subwoofer is connected to audison lrx 1.1so on the pxa there are front 1 and front 2, rear, ct, subwoofer settings to chose. 

so what do i chose for front 1 on pxa, knowing i I put the rca on front 1 of the pxa and left the front 2 rca empty. So in pxa i only chose that front 1 is tw, is that correct and turned off front 2

I read somewhere that I must disable all other speakers not used, is that correct.

Also for a 2 way speakers do I have to setup the 5.1 speakers ( I think not ) on pxa

also in the speaker settings there is a choice for 2 channel or 3 channel what shall I chose for my speakers and subwoofer 

also I read that I should adjust the volume, so on my pioneer prs 80 I reach volume 58 out of 62 before i reach the message on the pxa, is that correct or am I doing something wrong

final question auto time correction can I use the mic that came with my pioneer prs 80 cause my pxa 700 does not have a mic


----------



## zonesundar

Hi 

Few days i've installed Alpine INE-W947e HU and PXA-H800+RUX-C800. Both connected with Digital Optical Cable(KWE-610a).Sound is good. But i dont see Dolby Digital and DTS processing in PXA-H800 processor even if use DD or DTS DVD Movie playback.

Is there any setting in PXA-H800 where i need to be turn on..
Processing is always Dolby prologic ||.

Alpine HU INE-W947e
Alpine mono PDX-M12


----------



## cdgatti

I have an H800 and C800 on the way for my '08 328i. Having read through this thread and both the install and operational manuals from ALpine, I still have this simple fundamental question. 

When do you set the crossovers, before or after all the auto tuning? I would think the auto tuning would benefit from only playing the correct frequencies to the various drivers, but the manual doesn't say anything about this. Can some of you experienced H800 users out there chime in? Thanks!


----------



## hykhleif

This is my setup

1-pioneer 80 prs
2-audison lrx 4.1, 2.9, 1.1
3-hertz mille mlk2
4-hertz xl 
5-arc audio subs
6-audison connection capacitor
7- alpine pxa h700

the mlk2 woofer is connected to the lrx 2.9 ( active )
the tweeter of mlk2 is connected to the lrx 4.1 ( active )
the hertz xl is also connected to lrx 4.1 ( passive )
the arc audio subs is connected to lrx 1.1

The sound is processed by alpine pxa 700

I hear static noise coming from the front mlk2 especially tweeters

guys I really need to figure out if the noise is from the pioneer or the pxa.

As for me this noise is irritating, i start to hear that static noise once i turn on the volume on the pxa to around 22

What is the easiest way for me to make sure where is the problem

could it be from pxa, pioneer, ground, alternator or any of my audison amp lrx 4.1,2.9,1.1

so what shall I do to know the cause.

what I noticed is that when I chose aux1 as a source in pioneer the noise is more than aux2 in pioneer, when I check the sound I don't have anything plugged into the aux 1 or 2, I just turn the volume to max on alpine pxa to check the noise, so its so weird to have aux1 causing this noise while aux 2 is also producing noise but not like aux1

unfortunately I don't have a ai-net cable

i tried another thing

more update so I connected a fiio x3 player directly to the pxa and removed the pioneer from the pxa

the static sound from the tweeters disappeared but the woofers noise sound is still there


----------



## mmiller

There's a thread on here for the H-700/701. Those units have analogue input issues. This is a completely different processor, you'll likely have better luck reading through that.


----------



## Rapture333

I don't know about you guys, but everytime I use Imprint EQ, I'm not satisfied with the sound. It just sounds unnatural to me, I don't understand why. Imprint just sounds, meh, I'm not really sure if its an improvement. My bass definitely sounds fake, I feel like I get the best most natural sound when I used my own manual adjustments. Am I the only one who feels this way? Are DPS's capable of making great sound but not on their own? What do you guys think? Am I the only one who feels this way?


----------



## Grindcore

Hey mate.i had trouble with imprint at the start.have you read up on all the tips that have been mentioned before you run imprint.mic positions etc etc.

All in all I ran imprint 3 times.1 sounded good but pulled the stage to far right.ran it again and the overall sound was average.i reset it all and ran a final time.i dunno if it was luck but it sounded pretty damn impressive.i chose the reference with midrange comp response.this sounded the best an in the manual it claims if your midranges and tweets are up on te dash you should use this setting.

I have saved the imprint as the base tune.then I had to fiddle with centring frequencies with the eq.i had to mess with TA just a bit as well but imprint did a great job in my opinion,just needed a couple of tweaks afterwards,which never end mind you.


----------



## Rapture333

Grindcore said:


> Hey mate.i had trouble with imprint at the start.have you read up on all the tips that have been mentioned before you run imprint.mic positions etc etc.
> 
> All in all I ran imprint 3 times.1 sounded good but pulled the stage to far right.ran it again and the overall sound was average.i reset it all and ran a final time.i dunno if it was luck but it sounded pretty damn impressive.i chose the reference with midrange comp response.this sounded the best an in the manual it claims if your midranges and tweets are up on te dash you should use this setting.
> 
> I have saved the imprint as the base tune.then I had to fiddle with centring frequencies with the eq.i had to mess with TA just a bit as well but imprint did a great job in my opinion,just needed a couple of tweaks afterwards,which never end mind you.


Hey grincore thanks for the quick response! I will definitely try running imprint again. Would you mind listing some of the tips and tricks for running imprint? Last night, I ran imprint on All (I saw another option was Front Left, is that preferable?) I used a tripod to move the microphone around and place it in each position, then after the measurement was completed, I tuned it to refernce with mid comps. I'll definitely try running it again. But I'm not sure what to do differently.

A few quick questions, how high should the volume on my headunit be before running Imprint? Does it matter what direction the mic is facing? How much noise outside the car is acceptable (I usually wait till night but I get some distant AC hum) thanks again!


----------



## Grindcore

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...-members/50129-imprint-tuning-hints-tips.html


----------



## Grindcore

These tips were originally used for the ktx-h100 but can be used on the h800.
I only tune to drivers seat.6 positions.if you have a tripod then mic facing up is the way to do it.doing the 6 positions for drivers
Seat pay lose attention to where it shows you to put the mic.there are 2 positions In the middle of the drivers seat that I found very important,edge of the seat near center console and edge of the seat close to drivers side glass..I found that these can shift stage if not done correctly.place mic at ear hight,and off the back of the seat 3-4 inches worked for me.i had crossovers set,bass volume on 15 then let it run.volume won't do anything it will do it itself.

Running it at night is a good idea..the quieter the better.if you have a garage do it in there with the door shut!


----------



## kaflam

Well, I've done almost every tip and a large amount of imprint"ings" and I totally prefer my own eq using RTA, maybe oldschool works better for me. Also I have a sub mono output on my OEM HU and using analog outputs, and Imprint always take just 4 inputs and ignore the others (it seems to).

Recently I heard some noises, little chrimps like digital sounds. Are hard to hear but they are definitely there. And they are constant repetitive sounds. Do you know why?


----------



## hykhleif

few quick question in set up

I have the following connection



I am using an rca from my HU to 1 &2 channel aux input of the h800

as for outputs in the pxa: 

channel 1 & 2 for-hertz front tweeters active
channel 3 & 4 for hertz front woofer active
channel 5&6 for rear hertz passive
channel 7&8 for 2 arc audio subs


so my question is

what system setup shall I choose:

1- what shall I choose in aux input system select ( 5.1 channel, 4 channel & 2 input , 2channel * 3 input ) 

2- After I choose the input , since I am using an rca from Hu to pxa what input aux gain shall I use ( high or low ) 
3- what shall I choose in output system select ( system 1, or 2, or 3, or 4 ) 

thanks for ur help


----------



## kaflam

Hi, hykhleif

Some answers

1. The input to select in your setup will be 2 channel * 3 input, any other will let you out of sound in 3&4 channels

2. You should know if you have High or Low outputs on your HU, and if you don't the best is to meassure the puput level using a test tone. If you can't do that either then you'll have to find some stuff on your HU: 1. If you have RCA outputs on your HU and you are using them to attach your PXA H800 then use Low level. 2. If you are using output wires on your HU that are directly connected to the speakers, you should use High level. 3. If you are using your OEM HU and you have an OEM amp with it, then the best is to use the wires directly from the HU (before the amp) and work with Low level. 4. Finally if you NEED to work with your OEM Amp outputs, maybe you'll need to use a line converter and work with low level.

3. Your output system should be something like F-2way+R+SW


----------



## hykhleif

kaflam said:


> Hi, hykhleif
> 
> Some answers
> 
> 1. The input to select in your setup will be 2 channel * 3 input, any other will let you out of sound in 3&4 channels
> 
> 2. You should know if you have High or Low outputs on your HU, and if you don't the best is to meassure the puput level using a test tone. If you can't do that either then you'll have to find some stuff on your HU: 1. If you have RCA outputs on your HU and you are using them to attach your PXA H800 then use Low level. 2. If you are using output wires on your HU that are directly connected to the speakers, you should use High level. 3. If you are using your OEM HU and you have an OEM amp with it, then the best is to use the wires directly from the HU (before the amp) and work with Low level. 4. Finally if you NEED to work with your OEM Amp outputs, maybe you'll need to use a line converter and work with low level.
> 
> 3. Your output system should be something like F-2way+R+SW


thanks for the answer my head unit is pioneer 80prs so shall i use high or low 
gain in my question 2

i have 3 amps

1- audison lrx 2.9 to which the front hertz woofer are connected ( active )
2- audison lrx 4.1 to which hertz front tweeters ( active ) are connected and the hertz rears ( passive )
3- audison lrx 1.1 to which 2 arc audio subs are connected

can this give u more idea what gain to use high or low for question 2


----------



## kaflam

I would go with Low level (2 volt) using RCA outputs (even when your HU is 5 volt output on RCA)


----------



## hykhleif

another question about why in speaker setup the mid lows are greyed out, although I used 2 ch * 3 input and 2 way front+rear+subs

Again my Hu is pioneer prs 80

i have 3 amps

1- audison lrx 2.9 to which the front hertz woofer are connected ( active )
2- audison lrx 4.1 to which hertz front tweeters ( active ) are connected and the hertz rears ( passive )
3- audison lrx 1.1 to which 2 arc audio subs are connected

on the pxa:

channel 1 & 2 for-hertz front tweeters active
channel 3 & 4 for hertz front woofer active
channel 5&6 for rear hertz passive
channel 7&8 for 2 arc audio subs


----------



## kaflam

Are you shure your output system select is on "System 1 (4.2 Ch) front 2 way + Rear + SubW ??
It should be working properly.


----------



## hykhleif

I used 2 channel 3 inputs maybe this is why

I will try 4ch 2 inputs and report back


----------



## hykhleif

hykhleif said:


> I used 2 channel 3 inputs maybe this is why
> 
> I will try 4ch 2 inputs and report back


I tried it. 4 ch 2 inputs and the 2 front +rear+subs. And still the same

When i select the speakers

It allows me.to choose front high tweetrrs but front low does not allow me.to chose.anything, but i can.choose also the rear and subs, i am.really wondering why mid low does not allow.me.to choose anything


----------



## hykhleif

i think i got it i was saying that i see no option of what to chose in front low like in front high I can choose tweeter or full range, that is when I use the rux

So when using the rux i guess in front low since there are no other option u don't have a choice to choose anything , while in front high u can chose tweeters, also rears and subs have options to choose from, am I right, but in front low u have no choice for anything so it skips it. I noticed even in the software for front low there are no choices to chose from like in high mid, rear and sub

am I right?

If my above assumption is right, what I am concerned about is when I use eq and want to modify the eq for the front it chooses both front high and front low together, will that not affect the sound. As I like for example to only modify the eq of the tweeters and not the front low and vice versa

I don't not understand as I got conflicting responses which system input shall I use

2 ch * 3 input or 4 chan & 2 input

for my setup;
Again my Hu is pioneer prs 80

i have 3 amps

1- audison lrx 2.9 to which the front hertz woofer are connected ( active )
2- audison lrx 4.1 to which hertz front tweeters ( active ) are connected and the hertz rears ( passive )
3- audison lrx 1.1 to which 2 arc audio subs are connected

on the pxa:

channel 1 & 2 for-hertz front tweeters active
channel 3 & 4 for hertz front woofer active
channel 5&6 for rear hertz passive
channel 7&8 for 2 arc audio subs


and what difference will it make in sound quality by choosing either one of the 2 ch * 3 input or 4 chan & 2 input?

I really wish when a thread starts, that the first page gets updated with a sticky for that device of that thread handles common setup trouble short, so people don't have to read 100 pages and after a while once people use the item and know how things work to create that sticky that people can read first and then continue with their questions on subjects where answers might need more clarification.


----------



## hykhleif

to make an imprint do I need the KTX H100 or only the setup cd, as I bought mine and it does not have a cd or ktx-h100.

Also can someone please send me a link to download the setup disk,


----------



## hykhleif

hykhleif said:


> to make an imprint do I need the KTX H100 or only the setup cd, as I bought mine and it does not have a cd or ktx-h100.
> 
> Also can someone please send me a link to download the setup disk,


anyone can help, please if i need to use a setup cd to do an imprint plz link me to where i can download this setup cd


----------



## james2266

hykhleif said:


> anyone can help, please if i need to use a setup cd to do an imprint plz link me to where i can download this setup cd


No CD needed. The unit creates all of the signals.


----------



## crea_78

Do you need a computer for imprint? If I get this DSP, I would do Imprint initially as I learn to tune.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## james2266

crea_78 said:


> Do you need a computer for imprint? If I get this DSP, I would do Imprint initially as I learn to tune.
> 
> Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


It's been a while but, if I recall correctly, you need a computer connection to run full auto eq/ta with this processor. There are some more limited auto functions without the computer with the rux however if I remember correctly. To be honest, for me, the auto eq was pretty much crap. It killed my midbass and all of the bass was coming from the sub. I have a full rta setup and an Omnimic now and can get much better results doing it manually so I gave up on the auto eq. The auto ta was actually fairly good if I remember however.


----------



## crea_78

james2266 said:


> It's been a while but, if I recall correctly, you need a computer connection to run full auto eq/ta with this processor. There are some more limited auto functions without the computer with the rux however if I remember correctly. To be honest, for me, the auto eq was pretty much crap. It killed my midbass and all of the bass was coming from the sub. I have a full rta setup and an Omnimic now and can get much better results doing it manually so I gave up on the auto eq. The auto ta was actually fairly good if I remember however.


Alrighty, thanks for the reply


----------



## james2266

crea_78 said:


> Alrighty, thanks for the reply


np, if you have any other questions on this processor, just shoot. It really is a nice and powerful little box with many different setup options. Having control at all times from the front seat with the Rux is just awesome too. My fave. processor that I've tried so far. I haven't even given surround sound a shot yet with it either.


----------



## hykhleif

guys before the 800 i had the pxa 700, and the first thing that we needed to do it to set the level of HU and match it up with the pxa700

Now with the 800 there is no mention at all about setting levels, unless I am mistaken.

1-Do u have to set the level of pxa 800 to match your HU ( non alpine HU), how ?
2- Are u controlling the volume from ur pxa or from HU for better sq ( non alpine HU )
3- I was wondering if someone can explain the gain level ( low, or high ) what exactly it does as its confusing me, some suggested that I should use low gain, although my HU has a voltage to 5V

I am sure many would like answers to such questions, and those are points not mentioned in the manual.


----------



## quickaudi07

Since right now i have a windows 8 tablet. Be fore i had tablet i was using Kenwood dnx999hd Hu unit. All extras like loud and sub and eq was set to flat . All extras were turned off, on the processor I had it all the way up to volume 100 and I was using Hu to control the volume. You could control the Gans and volume out put to the amps on the processor as well  great lite box. 

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk


----------



## hykhleif

quickaudi07 said:


> Since right now i have a windows 8 tablet. Be fore i had tablet i was using Kenwood dnx999hd on the Hu unit. All extras like loud and sub and equipment was set to flat l. All extras were turned off. On the processor I had it l the way up to volume 100 and I was using Hu to control the volume. You could control the Gans and volume out put to the amps on the Hu as well  great lite box.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk


this exactly the opposite way than alpine 700, where u fix the volume of HU and use the pxa 700 to control the volume.

Does everyone agree that we should use the HU to control volume or vice versa


----------



## hykhleif

quickaudi07 said:


> Since right now i have a windows 8 tablet. Be fore i had tablet i was using Kenwood dnx999hd Hu unit. All extras like loud and sub and eq was set to flat . All extras were turned off, on the processor I had it all the way up to volume 100 and I was using Hu to control the volume. You could control the Gans and volume out put to the amps on the processor as well  great lite box.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk


on another note how r u connection ur win 8 tab to the pxa what cable are u using

and which music player are u using on win 8 tablet


----------



## hykhleif

imprint question using a non alpine Head unit ( pioneer 80 prs ):

1- shall I set the crossovers in pxa 800 before I run an imprint ( I disabled the crossovers on my pioneer )
2- to what volume shall I set the subwoofers on pxa 800 before running imprint
3- shall I turn off equalizer mode before running imprint
4-before running imprint shall I set the output gain of the speakers to 0 ( aux gain in the pxa 800)
5- does it matter when I take an imprint if I sit in the car or not?
6- if I chose front ( both left and right ) does that mean both the driver and passenger will hear the same quality of sound


one observation when I ran an imprint it gave a me a weird TCR like for example my left mid is 648 cm which is impossible and all my other speakers are way way way off the actual distance, does that mean my reading is totally wrong

thanks


----------



## Huckleberry Sound

Is anyone getting good success using it as a 5.1 processor?
If so can you let me know what your setup is and etc.

Thanks


----------



## hykhleif

hykhleif said:


> imprint question using a non alpine Head unit ( pioneer 80 prs ):
> 
> 1- shall I set the crossovers in pxa 800 before I run an imprint ( I disabled the crossovers on my pioneer )
> 2- to what volume shall I set the subwoofers on pxa 800 before running imprint
> 3- shall I turn off equalizer mode before running imprint
> 4-before running imprint shall I set the output gain of the speakers to 0 ( aux gain in the pxa 800)
> 5- does it matter when I take an imprint if I sit in the car or not?
> 6- if I chose front ( both left and right ) does that mean both the driver and passenger will hear the same quality of sound
> 
> 
> one observation when I ran an imprint it gave a me a weird TCR like for example my left mid is 648 cm which is impossible and all my other speakers are way way way off the actual distance, does that mean my reading is totally wrong
> 
> thanks


any help here guys


----------



## rdlhifi

hykhleif said:


> imprint question using a non alpine Head unit ( pioneer 80 prs ):
> 1- shall I set the crossovers in pxa 800 before I run an imprint ( I disabled the crossovers on my pioneer )
> 2- to what volume shall I set the subwoofers on pxa 800 before running imprint
> 3- shall I turn off equalizer mode before running imprint
> 4-before running imprint shall I set the output gain of the speakers to 0 ( aux gain in the pxa 800)
> 5- does it matter when I take an imprint if I sit in the car or not?
> 6- if I chose front ( both left and right ) does that mean both the driver and passenger will hear the same quality of sound
> one observation when I ran an imprint it gave a me a weird TCR like for example my left mid is 648 cm which is impossible and all my other speakers are way way way off the actual distance, does that mean my reading is totally wrong thanks


Hi!, I can answer a couple of your Q's (sorry, not all of them) 

Q 1): X-overs should be set before (specially if you've an active system with separate Tweeters) to ensure optimum working level and overexcursion (that's my personal opinion, others could desagree)
Q 3): If you are resorting to an AutoEq function (Imprint) it's because your previous Eq Routine did not satisfy you, right? Nevertheless, You can (again, MY opinion) try both alternatives and see what happens 
Q 5): The Eq Curve will be COMPLETELY diff if you sit in the car vs. empty seat...specially if you are tall or of "great size"  (sorry, its not a joke, don't know how you are) but the fact IS that you will be hearing the Car System seated INSIDE the Car, so you should take that in consideration. 

There's just one caveat:
You should wear some Hearing protection (maybe simple earplugs will suffice?) because it can be a little disturbing when the Eq Session begins...

OK, thats all for now, Its late. 
Hope someone can answer the rest 
later
Dan


----------



## kaflam

hykhleif said:


> imprint question using a non alpine Head unit ( pioneer 80 prs ):
> 
> 1- shall I set the crossovers in pxa 800 before I run an imprint ( I disabled the crossovers on my pioneer )
> 2- to what volume shall I set the subwoofers on pxa 800 before running imprint
> 3- shall I turn off equalizer mode before running imprint
> 4-before running imprint shall I set the output gain of the speakers to 0 ( aux gain in the pxa 800)
> 5- does it matter when I take an imprint if I sit in the car or not?
> 6- if I chose front ( both left and right ) does that mean both the driver and passenger will hear the same quality of sound
> 
> 
> one observation when I ran an imprint it gave a me a weird TCR like for example my left mid is 648 cm which is impossible and all my other speakers are way way way off the actual distance, does that mean my reading is totally wrong
> 
> thanks




Well, this is NOT what you can say is the best, but only MHO based on how I suppose the PXA-H800 works and my small experience:

1. crossovers off before imprinting so you can avoid over-eq some frec on your cuts.
2. there is NO correct answer to that, but I usually set it in the half, but if you enjoy the sub volume really high, maybe you can set it on 2 or 3 so you can raise the volume even more (in comparison with the rest of your system).
3. the Eq should be flat (zero) so you can make extra tunning if needed
4. What I did is set the amp gain to almost 3/4 up and turned the volume of the pxa-h800 to "0" and then I slowly turned it down until the noise (hhssshhh and small beep beep) of the PXA is almost away (In my case was about -19 Db). Finally I raised the HU to the max volume accepted on PXA (when you begin the imprinting), played some test tones and using an oscilloscope I fixed the amp gains.
5. Yes, but is not comfortable, you can either use some pillows placed on your place.
6. Yes, that's the way it should be.


----------



## fat_joseph

Hi guys, I am new here! I would like to ask, have any1 found any solution to control the H800 using iPad or tablet? I am currently running ipad mini to i-20 to H800 now. Will be real cool if able to control H800 using tablet! Thanks!


----------



## jnchantler

fat_joseph said:


> Hi guys, I am new here! I would like to ask, have any1 found any solution to control the H800 using iPad or tablet? I am currently running ipad mini to i-20 to H800 now. Will be real cool if able to control H800 using tablet! Thanks!


I'm looking too. The only thing I have been able to find is a couple of pictures off of a foreign website. I have no clue what it is though, if anyone has any input, it would be much appreciated.

Here is the website: Review Alpine Processor PXA H800 + RUX C800

Here's the pictures:


----------



## Icely_slo

My guess is that they are using remote desktop app installed on the ipad which is controlling a pc/laptop hooked on pxa.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Icely_slo said:


> My guess is that they are using remote desktop app installed on the ipad which is controlling a pc/laptop hooked on pxa.


Yup. If you're going to tune in mostly one spot, you can just run a USB cable to a networked PC near by. Then contact to the PC via a Wifi connection and a table. Using a VNC connection works well for everything but video. Last time I checked. I used to use the "Real VNC" app and client in general, and it worked very well.

The interface can be a problem though. Since the Alpine app with design around being used primarily with a conventional mouse. By you can get around that if your tablet has a bluetooth mouse feature. I'd also set the PC resolution to exactly what the Alpine app has. That way the VNC software can be scaled to the tablets size with the most resolution pixels for the mouse point. 

For most people, that's an "app for your tablet", for the cost of the VNC package and the hardware needed for the USB run.


----------



## reath1

Installed my new H800 yesterday. I read over this entire thread a while back and noticed s few people had trouble with no output on some left channels but I can't find the posts now. Mine sadly has the same trouble. 

Was this fixed with a software update or did the units have to be returned?

Thanks


----------



## kaflam

Furst of all, make sure is the PXA-H800 (not the amp or HU).
Make sure you are using properly the outputs and the wires are ok.
The next step, take a look on the defined inputs, outputs and volume on each channel in the PC manager.
Finally try to update to the last version of PXA-H800 (and RUX if you have it).
Even try to imprint and see if you can hear all the channels.

Post back after that.


----------



## reath1

kaflam said:


> Furst of all, make sure is the PXA-H800 (not the amp or HU).
> I did a total swap to a 3sixty.3 and it works perfectly.
> Make sure you are using properly the outputs and the wires are ok.
> This should have been covered by the 3sixty.3 swap also.
> The next step, take a look on the defined inputs, outputs and volume on each channel in the PC manager.
> Checked this multiply times. All correct.
> Finally try to update to the last version of PXA-H800 (and RUX if you have it).
> Brand new unit. Don't remember which versions now but they are the newest versions I could find.
> Even try to imprint and see if you can hear all the channels.
> I may swap the H800 back in and try this but haven't yet.
> 
> Post back after that.


I changed out all RCA's, checked amps. Nothing wrong. It is definitely in the H800. All other channels are fine. I have it set up with 3-way front with rear fills. The left mid and left rear actually have a VERY low sound coming from them, not completely dead. I actually have to mute every other channel to barely hear them.


----------



## reath1

Just double checked everything. Seems to be nothing wrong that I can find. Almost has to be the processor as almost nothing is adjustable to just those channels independently of the others. Very strange.


----------



## kaflam

Can you please post what outputs number of your PXA-H800 are not working?


----------



## reath1

I already uninstalled it, but I am pretty sure the channels I am having trouble with are 5 and 7/


----------



## kaflam

If you have alredy check every step and with a 2nd check on every one. Maybe your unit is damaged.


----------



## reath1

kaflam said:


> If you have alredy check every step and with a 2nd check on every one. Maybe your unit is damaged.


Thanks for asking the questions. Some of this is easy to get side tracked about. But yes, I swapped everything I could out to make it work. When all failed, I took RCA's straight from this unit and onto a 3Sixty.3 and it is working flawlessly ruling out any wiring, speaker or amp problems whatsoever. I guess it is the H800 that is bad.


----------



## djm3311

you can run any windows 7 or 8 64 bit in "Windows XP Mode". XP Mode will run all 32 bit software as if it were a 32 bit machine. I have windows 7 64 bit and the sound manager software works fine.


----------



## 04sti

Just wanted to add a link to another thread in which I commented on a PXA-H800 overheat/output fail issue. 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...ussion/157126-alpine-optical-cable-bad-2.html

04


----------



## tjmitchem

*Need some help diagnosing a problem*

Is there anyone in/around/near the twin cities in Minnesota that has a RUX-C800 that we can plug into my PXA-H800?

The DSP works fine, but the remote is completely dead when we fire everything up. I'm assuming a faulty RUX, but a bad cable or bad connector on the PXA could also cause this problem. I'd like to figure out what's wrong before I return everything for a swap.

Any help is appreciated.


----------



## pankrok

ainet question

iva w505r (ainet) connected with ainet cable and optical to pxah800

everything working fine (automatic switch to digital input when playing the disc)

i want to add non ainet source with optical out
apparently will not (and is not) working when ainet headunit is connected unless you convince the h800 that the additional unit is ainet too.

how can i do that?
already plugged equivalent ainet cable for aux input but processor does not accepting this 
there should be some tweak (resistor ???) on the ainet connector that will enable h800 to see ainet changer input and allow w505 to select it as a source.

any ideas are welcomed


----------



## t3sn4f2

pankrok said:


> ainet question
> 
> iva w505r (ainet) connected with ainet cable and optical to pxah800
> 
> everything working fine (automatic switch to digital input when playing the disc)
> 
> i want to add non ainet source with optical out
> apparently will not (and is not) working when ainet headunit is connected unless you convince the h800 that the additional unit is ainet too.
> 
> how can i do that?
> already plugged equivalent ainet cable for aux input but processor does not accepting this
> there should be some tweak (resistor ???) on the ainet connector that will enable h800 to see ainet changer input and allow w505 to select it as a source.
> 
> any ideas are welcomed


If all else fails you can get an active Toslink switch (not cheap). Then play the transport and switch to the external digital source.


----------



## jnchantler

kaigoss69 said:


> I have been keeping an eye on this thread hoping to come across a review or two, especially in comparison to the MS-8. Maybe I missed it, but I just haven't seen any. The question I would like to have answered is this: Can this unit achieve better results than the MS-8, especially with a center channel installed, provided that the user is not good at tuning by ear? If you think it is better, in what areas?


I have an H800, and I came from the MS8. Both units are great. To keep it simple, if you have no clue how to tune and don't want to learn (which is what I originally thought), get the MS8 then once you have the MS8 set up and want to change something or decide you want to learn how to tune, you can sell it and buy the H800. Or you can save yourself the headache, start with the H800 and find someone to help you tune it until you learn how to do it yourself.


----------



## BigRed

pankrok said:


> ainet question
> 
> iva w505r (ainet) connected with ainet cable and optical to pxah800
> 
> everything working fine (automatic switch to digital input when playing the disc)
> 
> i want to add non ainet source with optical out
> apparently will not (and is not) working when ainet headunit is connected unless you convince the h800 that the additional unit is ainet too.
> 
> how can i do that?
> already plugged equivalent ainet cable for aux input but processor does not accepting this
> there should be some tweak (resistor ???) on the ainet connector that will enable h800 to see ainet changer input and allow w505 to select it as a source.
> 
> any ideas are welcomed



Just run the non ai-net unit into the secondary optical in. Run the first ai net into optical one and disconnect the ai-net including the switch on the unit. You will have to run RCAs for all the other features of unit one to work and use the h800 for volume


----------



## n_olympios

Ah, but what if there's no RUX controller available?


----------



## AbdulMateen 19

I have a INE-W927HD with siriusxm sxv200 and a PXA-H800. Should I use the Ai - Net cable to the head unit? If so where does the siriusxm module plug into ?
I have a 4ch.amp for front components and rear door coaxials and mono amp for subs. Peace


----------



## Shaheenk

HI Guys, can someone help me , I seem to have killed my PXA-H800, I think by accident I wired the remote in to remote out and sent power into the remote out circuit. The unit will now not power up.

I am in South Africa so finding an alpine agent to assist is near impossible.


----------



## quality_sound

AbdulMateen 19 said:


> I have a INE-W927HD with siriusxm sxv200 and a PXA-H800. Should I use the Ai - Net cable to the head unit? If so where does the siriusxm module plug into ?
> I have a 4ch.amp for front components and rear door coaxials and mono amp for subs. Peace


The sxv200 doesn't use an Ai-Net input so it would stay connected like it is now. 

Using Ai-Net from the HU sounds quite a bit better than RCA.


----------



## quality_sound

Shaheenk said:


> HI Guys, can someone help me , I seem to have killed my PXA-H800, I think by accident I wired the remote in to remote out and sent power into the remote out circuit. The unit will now not power up.
> 
> I am in South Africa so finding an alpine agent to assist is near impossible.


What HU are you using? Do you have the RUX?


----------



## Shaheenk

quality_sound said:


> What HU are you using? Do you have the RUX?


Headunit is a OEM VW radio, the unit was working, and I think I stuffed the cables up. I am using a RUX .

Using a high low convertor to provide remote turn on as the stock unit does not have this.


----------



## nineball76

Quick question while I'm installing the h800 with w910, will the ai-net turn on the h800 or do I need to run a remote turn on to it?


----------



## papasin

nineball76 said:


> Quick question while I'm installing the h800 with w910, will the ai-net turn on the h800 or do I need to run a remote turn on to it?



AI-net takes care of it.


----------



## nineball76

Awesome, thanks


----------



## estens

I`m sorry if this question has been asked before but I couldn`t find anything when seaching.

Is there any way to get the h800 to turn on without the control panel or alpine hu?


----------



## jnchantler

estens said:


> I`m sorry if this question has been asked before but I couldn`t find anything when seaching.
> 
> Is there any way to get the h800 to turn on without the control panel or alpine hu?


Yes, with a laptop, but that's not practical. Also the alpine head unit has to have an ainet connection to turn the H 800 on (I believe all of the older decks with a in the model name, such as INA, CDA etc had ainet, but none of the current ones do.


----------



## estens

jnchantler said:


> Yes, with a laptop, but that's not practical. Also the alpine head unit has to have an ainet connection to turn the H 800 on (I believe all of the older decks with a in the model name, such as INA, CDA etc had ainet, but none of the current ones do.



No that`s not very practical 

I`m using a nexus tab as a source and a laptop for tuning so I don`t want to use a a head unit or a control panel just to turn on the h800

Isn`t there any way of tricking it to think it is connected to something with ai net?


----------



## REGULARCAB

estens said:


> No that`s not very practical
> 
> I`m using a nexus tab as a source and a laptop for tuning so I don`t want to use a a head unit or a control panel just to turn on the h800
> 
> Isn`t there any way of tricking it to think it is connected to something with ai net?


without the rux how do you plan to control volume?


----------



## quality_sound

estens said:


> No that`s not very practical
> 
> I`m using a nexus tab as a source and a laptop for tuning so I don`t want to use a a head unit or a control panel just to turn on the h800
> 
> Isn`t there any way of tricking it to think it is connected to something with ai net?


You already have to send it power and ground. How hard is it to send it a switched power as well? FWIW, I LOVE having the C800 paired with the H800. No, it doesn't do EVERYTHING that a laptop will, but it does about 95% of it AND you'll have a volume control.


----------



## estens

REGULARCAB said:


> without the rux how do you plan to control volume?


For volume control I want to use a rca volume knob or a JL audio remote level control/line driver I have laying around.
The jl audio line driver worked flawless with my old ms-8


----------



## estens

quality_sound said:


> You already have to send it power and ground. How hard is it to send it a switched power as well? FWIW, I LOVE having the C800 paired with the H800. No, it doesn't do EVERYTHING that a laptop will, but it does about 95% of it AND you'll have a volume control.


If you mean a remote signal it is not very hard, but it dosn`t do anything. 
Seems like it has to be connected to a c800, ai-net hu or a computer running sound manager to turn on.


----------



## quality_sound

estens said:


> If you mean a remote signal it is not very hard, but it dosn`t do anything.
> Seems like it has to be connected to a c800, ai-net hu or a computer running sound manager to turn on.


Switched power and remote are the same thing unless you don't have a real HU. Cars have switched power, HUs have remote power leads. Semantics? Maybe. 

In any event you'll need switched power for the C800 anyway which will then also be fed to the H800. The C800 doesn't send a remote signal to the H800.


----------



## rdlhifi

REGULARCAB said:


> without the rux how do you plan to control volume?


Hi estens!

I was on the same boat as You're now! Wanted to use only the H800 and get rid of the RUX display : had luck using a very old Ainet HU (2002 model) that turned the blackbox on, but was pretty useless anyhow, because You lose features (and comfort too!). 
I tried other workarounds, but finally finished buying the Rux...and guess what: I love it! Once You have it, you will know how convenient it is! 

Sidenote: I'm using a Nexus 7 (like You) as a HU, that goes through an external DAC, and finally enters the H800: without the volume knob of the RUX I would go crazy . And You get access to all sort of convenience items, like memory presets, digital voltage indication a.s.o. 

DO THE RIGHT THING MATE! 
later 
Dan


----------



## qwank

So it looks like the H800 doesn't work with any current single din Alpine head units? 

Does Alpine have anything coming out in single din that will work with it? (AI-net and optical?) Or is this processor going to be replaced soon with something without AI-net?


----------



## Stookie

qwank said:


> So it looks like the H800 doesn't work with any current single din Alpine head units?
> 
> Does Alpine have anything coming out in single din that will work with it? (AI-net and optical?) Or is this processor going to be replaced soon with something without AI-net?


Alpine - Bluetooth - CDA-137BTi drives H800 with AI-net


----------



## Coppertone

^^^^. Luckily I have a new in box one of those for sale. Pm me if interested in purchasing or for photos.


----------



## Guy

My H800 croaked and is being sent in for repair to Alpine, estimated cost 200.00

I'm going to add the C800 upon reinstall- if I mount the RUX up front, will I have to run a cable from the trunk mounted H800, or can I connect to my W910 in the dash?


----------



## Golden Ear

Cable from the trunk mounted h800


----------



## ewffan

Getting "No Bluetooth Audio" message with IVA-D800 head unit. Have 400-BCT bluetooth adapter connected correctly and have set "Bluetooth On" in System settings. Anyone have any ideas why this unit won't recognize the BCT-400 unit? I have tried re-setting the unit with no success. Anyone else get this problem with this unti ?


----------



## mmiller

Guy said:


> My H800 croaked and is being sent in for repair to Alpine, estimated cost 200.00
> 
> I'm going to add the C800 upon reinstall- if I mount the RUX up front, will I have to run a cable from the trunk mounted H800, or can I connect to my W910 in the dash?


Why don't you see if one of the guys on here can fix the unit, and do some modifications at the same time?


----------



## bbfoto

t3sn4f2 said:


> If all else fails you can get an active Toslink switch (not cheap). Then play the transport and switch to the external digital source.


In response to the above and Original Post #2577 by pankrok: 

I do this with the Sony XDP-4000X and RF 3sixty.3 and it works great. The units that I use can be found on fleabay for~$45. They have 4 Toslink inputs and 1 output and will automatically switch to the active input or you can manually switch them via a small button on the switcher box or via the included IR Remote. You'll need to find an appropriate power adapter/DC-DC Converter (also on fleabay) or USB car charger and adapt it to power the unit. Size is roughly 3" x 3.25" x 1.25"


----------



## Wheels_78

I've got my H/C800 here and I'm slowly plugging away at the system install. Tonight I was playing with the software and wondering... Do I need to choose EITHER the parametric or graphic EQ, or can both be used? Seems like you can switch between them at will, but I don't know if the parametric would remain applied while you play with the graphic or vice versa. 

I've also searched for info on the effectiveness of roadeq and euphony without much success, can we get some reports how pleased (or not) you've been with these features? Thanks!


----------



## Ellenoir

ewffan said:


> Getting "No Bluetooth Audio" message with IVA-D800 head unit. Have 400-BCT bluetooth adapter connected correctly and have set "Bluetooth On" in System settings. Anyone have any ideas why this unit won't recognize the BCT-400 unit? I have tried re-setting the unit with no success. Anyone else get this problem with this unti ?



I think better check your "system setup" in your iva d800,

IN Int Icon = Tel
Aux1 In = On
Aux2 In = AUX
Bluetooth In = HPF + Audio
Aux + In = On
Aux + level = high 

After that, just turn off your ignition key, reconnect all connection to BCT 400 and if the connection done, just try again. Good luck


----------



## Ellenoir

Wheels_78 said:


> I've got my H/C800 here and I'm slowly plugging away at the system install. Tonight I was playing with the software and wondering... Do I need to choose EITHER the parametric or graphic EQ, or can both be used? Seems like you can switch between them at will, but I don't know if the parametric would remain applied while you play with the graphic or vice versa.
> 
> I've also searched for info on the effectiveness of roadeq and euphony without much success, can we get some reports how pleased (or not) you've been with these features? Thanks!


If you select parametric, then you will adjust eq in parametric format. The graphic eq will be not active by itself. And vice versa. 

I will to try road eq next week, because h800 just arrived today, and i will try it soon.


----------



## Ellenoir

*Re: Need some help diagnosing a problem*



tjmitchem said:


> Is there anyone in/around/near the twin cities in Minnesota that has a RUX-C800 that we can plug into my PXA-H800?
> 
> The DSP works fine, but the remote is completely dead when we fire everything up. I'm assuming a faulty RUX, but a bad cable or bad connector on the PXA could also cause this problem. I'd like to figure out what's wrong before I return everything for a swap.
> 
> Any help is appreciated.



Someone told me before, that first version rux 800 cant connect to latest version pxa800. But I'm sorry, i also don't know how we check both version.


----------



## Wheels_78

Ellenoir said:


> If you select parametric, then you will adjust eq in parametric format. The graphic eq will be not active by itself. And vice versa.
> 
> I will to try road eq next week, because h800 just arrived today, and i will try it soon.


Thanks, I look forward to your opinions.


----------



## mp3weenie

Sorry if this has been covered but can Sound Manager / H800 supported under Win 8.1?


----------



## pankrok

I m running it with 8.1


----------



## mp3weenie

Integration to 2004 Chrysler Pacifica:

I have the Interezzmo system (stereo not DVD) which includes the 8 channel amp and sub. Would the H800 take the HU FR/FL outputs to the H800 analog inputs and then hook the H800 8 channel output to the input of the 8 channel amp? 

(1) So I guess I am asking if the H800 goes between the HU and AMP not post AMP? 
(2) The mic is used to run the measurements and also the road EQ? So you take the cars measurements, store them, then install the mic for road EQ? 
(3) Once you do the measurements, when will you have to do them again? For example if add replaced any of the factory speakers? I plan to do this in two phases first install with factory speakers then upgrade speakers later.
(4) What is the best place to install the mic for road eq? On driver side visor?
(5) Can the digital input support DVD-Audio output (94kHz/24-bit)? I have various combinations DVD-Audio discs and hires stereo and DTS-CD (16/44) and DTS-DVD (48kHz/24bit) FLAC files that I used with my home stereo/surround system.
(6) What are the video/processing requirements of the Sound Manager software? I plan to run on a Win 8.1 tablet wondering how beefed up one I need as there are very low end ones that I could save some money on.

I plan to run digital output to H800 for surround sound from a separate unit such as a Win 8.1 tablet with an outboard USB sound module with optical out (first phase). 

Any input much appreciated.

Thanks.


----------



## mughal90

If i use auto TA can the meansurements be seen which the pro did itself ? Idea is i want to know the auto TA meansurements and use them as a bassline to do manual TA....is that possible ?


----------



## Philth

Gents,

Long time lurker here. I just picked up a '14 Camry with the base audio in it, which consists of a 6-speaker system; dash firing into the windshield, front door, and rear deck. I plan on doing a stealth install as much as possible, which includes a 2-way component system up front in the stock locations. 

From what I've been reading with the H800, I don't need to use the passive crossovers that come with the component set, and can use the crossovers within the H800 itself. What frequencies are best for the tweets and mids?


----------



## Golden Ear

You'll have to check the frequency response of the tweets and mids you're using. Since your tweets are on the dash and mids in the doors you'll want a tweeter that plays as low as possible so as to bring the sound stage up. One that can be crossed in the 2-2.5khz range should work nicely.


Sent from my mind using telekinesis


----------



## thechrisl

mughal90 said:


> If i use auto TA can the meansurements be seen which the pro did itself ? Idea is i want to know the auto TA meansurements and use them as a bassline to do manual TA....is that possible ?


Did you get an answer? I was wondering this myself about any of the auto-tune features. It would make a ton of sense...


----------



## quality_sound

I think you can go in and look but in the 8 days you waited couldn't you have just tried it for yourself?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## slowhatch

I'm trying to guage the number of people with this processor who use the auto tuning features? I have used the imprint, auto TCR, and road eq without being blown away. I have had better results using my rudimentary/novice tuning skills. I am currently using an RTA app on my phone with pink noise and calculating time correction. It's coming along and sounds good but it's just not there yet, if you know what I mean. Still playing and learning a lot. Dave.


----------



## Rapture333

slowhatch said:


> I'm trying to guage the number of people with this processor who use the auto tuning features? I have used the imprint, auto TCR, and road eq without being blown away. I have had better results using my rudimentary/novice tuning skills. I am currently using an RTA app on my phone with pink noise and calculating time correction. It's coming along and sounds good but it's just not there yet, if you know what I mean. Still playing and learning a lot. Dave.


Hey Dave, I just setup Imprint in my car tonight. The time correction actually came out great, but what you have to understand is that Imprint is going to make your sound stage sound like it is coming from the middle of your hood, which is what is sought after in SQ competitions and the like. It will also delay your cabin speakers a lot so your sub has the illusion of coming from the hood as well. The TCR didn't turn out too bad. I don't know how sensitive, or accurate the microphone itself is, but the Multi-channel output is different then what I've found using a very sensitive Rode mic. In my testing, the front left is brought down by -2 Db, but the PXA-H800 brought the FL down by -3 Db, the RL by -4 Db and the RR by -3 Db with the front right at 0. I am going to listen to it for a while and see how it sounds then run another test with my Rode Mic too see if I'm getting a steady Db level on each channel by playing with some pink noise. I am going to listen to the system tomorrow when its morning and really scrutinize the sound and compare it to my custom settings I had tuned in before. I'm curious to what others have experienced?


----------



## Philth

slowhatch said:


> I'm trying to guage the number of people with this processor who use the auto tuning features? I have used the imprint, auto TCR, and road eq without being blown away. I have had better results using my rudimentary/novice tuning skills. I am currently using an RTA app on my phone with pink noise and calculating time correction. It's coming along and sounds good but it's just not there yet, if you know what I mean. Still playing and learning a lot. Dave.


Can you share what app you are using? iPhone or Android platform? I'm considering purchasing the DQ-61 instead.


----------



## BelaCHAN

Hi Guys! I'm new here at DIYMA!

I'd like to ask, can anybody give me the pin out of the 8-pin wire harness of the PXA-800?

Lost mine when transporting, and now desperate to custom a new one to run the system!!


----------



## slowhatch

Thanks for the input guys. My time correction seemed like a lot with the imprint. It was like 18.5 ms for the LF. I used a calculator and get 3.45 ms. for the same channel. Plus it didn't sound right to me. I may try running it again to see if things change. FWIW I removed my headrests during the measurement session(I read that this helps somewhere). I think I will leave them next time. My thinking is that it would be best to have everything the way it normally would be so that the sound waves reflections/absorptions are not effected. Although I think having bodies in the vehicle would also effect the outcome. 

The app I'm using is Audio Tools by Studio Six. It works pretty well as far as I can tell. I do have to say that I'm a novice, so take that for what it's worth. 

I can probably provide the pin out. Give me a day or two. 

Dave.


----------



## Rapture333

slowhatch said:


> Thanks for the input guys. My time correction seemed like a lot with the imprint. It was like 18.5 ms for the LF. I used a calculator and get 3.45 ms. for the same channel. Plus it didn't sound right to me. I may try running it again to see if things change. FWIW I removed my headrests during the measurement session(I read that this helps somewhere). I think I will leave them next time. My thinking is that it would be best to have everything the way it normally would be so that the sound waves reflections/absorptions are not effected. Although I think having bodies in the vehicle would also effect the outcome.
> 
> The app I'm using is Audio Tools by Studio Six. It works pretty well as far as I can tell. I do have to say that I'm a novice, so take that for what it's worth.
> 
> I can probably provide the pin out. Give me a day or two.
> 
> Dave.


Hey Slowhatch, the reason why the Imprint sets your TCR so high on the cabin speakers is so it delays far from the subwoofer which I would guess is set at 0.00. This gives the illusion that the sub is coming from the dash. I ran this run with my headrests off for the first time and I've gotten the best results so far, and I've run Imprint about 10 times before. Also make sure that the microphone is at your ear level as you would sit in the vehicle. I have been listening to the Imprint tune for the last two days without modifying anything and it sounds on point. The Imprint will try to create the illusion that your soundstage is coming from the middle of your dashboard and you as a listener are sitting to the left of the stage. I would recommend using a camera tripod to get consistent height placement on each point. And also remember to select Front Left for your tune when you start the Imprint process. Or Front right depending on which side your steering wheel is on. I also set my Multi-Channel myself and the Imprint changed it up to reinforce the illusion that the sound stage is in the middle of the dashboard and extends onto the end of the hood. Once you realize what the Imprint is trying to do it might make a little bit more sense as to why it sounds so different. Also, I have a tweeter and midrange on my A-pillars and a woofer in my door up front and the same speakers in my rear deck, I ran the processing as Reference with Mid Comp for Imprint 1 and Reference for Imprint 2. After listening to Reference with Mid Comp for a few days and switching to Reference, I noticed a huge difference. The highs were a lot more realistic and louder, while still reinforcing the illusion of depth. If you have a tweeter and midrange in your dash or A-pillars, even if you have your woofer in the door, I would recommend selecting the Reference equalization.


----------



## slowhatch

Rapture333 said:


> Hey Slowhatch, the reason why the Imprint sets your TCR so high on the cabin speakers is so it delays far from the subwoofer which I would guess is set at 0.00. This gives the illusion that the sub is coming from the dash. I ran this run with my headrests off for the first time and I've gotten the best results so far, and I've run Imprint about 10 times before. Also make sure that the microphone is at your ear level as you would sit in the vehicle. I have been listening to the Imprint tune for the last two days without modifying anything and it sounds on point. The Imprint will try to create the illusion that your soundstage is coming from the middle of your dashboard and you as a listener are sitting to the left of the stage. I would recommend using a camera tripod to get consistent height placement on each point. And also remember to select Front Left for your tune when you start the Imprint process. Or Front right depending on which side your steering wheel is on. I also set my Multi-Channel myself and the Imprint changed it up to reinforce the illusion that the sound stage is in the middle of the dashboard and extends onto the end of the hood. Once you realize what the Imprint is trying to do it might make a little bit more sense as to why it sounds so different. Also, I have a tweeter and midrange on my A-pillars and a woofer in my door up front and the same speakers in my rear deck, I ran the processing as Reference with Mid Comp for Imprint 1 and Reference for Imprint 2. After listening to Reference with Mid Comp for a few days and switching to Reference, I noticed a huge difference. The highs were a lot more realistic and louder, while still reinforcing the illusion of depth. If you have a tweeter and midrange in your dash or A-pillars, even if you have your woofer in the door, I would recommend selecting the Reference equalization.


Thank you for the advice, this will help me a lot. I found out that I had two issues causing problems with my system/auto tune. The two items that were giving me issues were a loose connection at my right rear speaker(cutting in and out), and i had the off/lpf/hpf switched on for my front woofers. 

The rear speaker was found when the auto tune kept failing, it was saying output too low. That has since been corrected. 

The other issue was something that I should have realized awhile ago, I couldn't get the punch out of the front woofers that I had previous to the DSP/additional amp install. I was racking my brain and checking/rechecking crossover points. I even reset the DSP and ran through the setup process again to no avail. I was actually thinking that there might be something wrong with the amp. 

After swapping the speaker output plugs and the RCAs back and forth to narrow it down, I realized it was the amp. I would have sworn that I had all the filters defeated, but thats not the case. 

Moral of the story is check the basics, thats usually the problem. Now its time to run the Imprint again and hopefully enjoy the results. Dave.


----------



## Socalstangman

Im trying to find out some info and havent had much luck. I have an Alpine INE 957HD, if I was to use the PXA h800 would I need the RUX? I will buy it but Im on a budget and was hoping to use a computer for a little while until I have the funds for the controller. Id most likely hook it up with the RCAs. If I was to use an optical cable could I still control the volume thru the HU?


----------



## Socalstangman

NVM...did some reading and I see I need the RUX.


----------



## BlackHHR

07maximan said:


> Im trying to find out some info and havent had much luck. I have an Alpine INE 957HD, if I was to use the PXA h800 would I need the RUX? I will buy it but Im on a budget and was hoping to use a computer for a little while until I have the funds for the controller. Id most likely hook it up with the RCAs. If I was to use an optical cable could I still control the volume thru the HU?


Yes you will need to rux to turn on the h800. If you run optical optical out of the deck to the 800, then you will loose your volume controls on the deck, steering wheel interface and have to use the rux for volume. If you use rca`s then you will maintain the volume from the head unit and also if you have steering wheel interface .
I have that current set up in my car .. 957hd/optical/h800/ rux for volume


----------



## BlackHHR

Using the rux to control the volume is not that big of an issue. I had Dwayne Blackwood at the Salon next door mold the rux into where the cig lighter and rear windshield wiper control where OEM. In the 957HD it will ask if you are to use optical and external processor. Selecting yes, the 957HD defeats all of the head units audio controls and the rux takes over.


----------



## mmiller

BlackHHR said:


> Using the rux to control the volume is not that big of an issue. I had Dwayne Blackwood at the Salon next door mold the rux into where the cig lighter and rear windshield wiper control where OEM. In the 957HD it will ask if you are to use optical and external processor. Selecting yes, the 957HD defeats all of the head units audio controls and the rux takes over.


That looks like it's easier than using the HU for volume.... I hate those stupid buttons, I much prefer a volume knob than a push button!

It looks nice!


----------



## BlackHHR

The rotary knob was a plus for me. And it keep the wear off of the head unit. 
Get the kick panel cosmetic panels made and the front will be done again.


----------



## captainobvious

Question on the H800-

If you're running in 2.2 channel mode (Front 3-way plus SW), I see there is an option for mono or stereo sub output. But what if you have subs in different locations. Does it output a summed mono on BOTH L and R outputs, and can you time align them both separately?


Thanks


----------



## captainobvious

BlackHHR said:


> Yes you will need to rux to turn on the h800. If you run optical optical out of the deck to the 800, then you will loose your volume controls on the deck, steering wheel interface and have to use the rux for volume. If you use rca`s then you will maintain the volume from the head unit and also if you have steering wheel interface .
> I have that current set up in my car .. 957hd/optical/h800/ rux for volume



Hmmm, I was under the impression that you could control volume from the w957 or defeat it and use the C800 RUX controller. Can you double check that?

I ask because I currently use the Alpine D800 and the H800/C800 combo with optical digital and an AiNet cable and I'm able to control volume from the head unit, and integrate my factory steering wheel controls with the head unit as well so I don't use the RUX for volume control. BTW- Nice looking integration of the controller!


----------



## BlackHHR

There is no AI Net on this head unit thus defeating the volume control when using optical output. 
But if I am to use it without optical then yes, I retain the steering wheel controls and volume from the head unit. 
Found this out after I had purchased this kit. I made the call to Alpines rep support to confirm.
Will not control volume when in optical mode from steering wheel or head unit. Goes to Rux rotary knob. 
Thanks Steve


----------



## BlackHHR

captainobvious said:


> Question on the H800-
> 
> If you're running in 2.2 channel mode (Front 3-way plus SW), I see there is an option for mono or stereo sub output. But what if you have subs in different locations. Does it output a summed mono on BOTH L and R outputs, and can you time align them both separately?
> 
> 
> Thanks


Yes there is an option to run stereo. And yes indeed there is TA for the left and right sub. Looking at the Alpine widget on my lap top as we speak. 
But how the signal is summed is not anywhere to be found on this widget. One would think because you are running stereo then it would be stereo (ie left and right).


----------



## captainobvious

BlackHHR said:


> There is no AI Net on this head unit thus defeating the volume control when using optical output.
> But if I am to use it without optical then yes, I retain the steering wheel controls and volume from the head unit.
> Found this out after I had purchased this kit. I made the call to Alpines rep support to confirm.
> Will not control volume when in optical mode from steering wheel or head unit. Goes to Rux rotary knob.
> Thanks Steve


Yup, that makes total sense then as the D800 has AiNet and that is what is used to control the digital source volume. I didn't realize they did away with the AiNet on the newer w957HD. bummer. Still an outstanding unit though. Thanks!


[Quote-BlackHHR]Yes there is an option to run stereo. And yes indeed there is TA for the left and right sub. Looking at the Alpine widget on my lap top as we speak. 
But how the signal is summed is not anywhere to be found on this widget. One would think because you are running stereo then it would be stereo (ie left and right).[/quote]

Yep, the stereo part I get and that's how I run it right now. I guess what I mean is that I'm looking to run a sub in the rear in addition to the one I have upfront, for when I want some more low end on the road. However, this will require some time alignment between the two and I also need to make sure it sums the L+R and outputs it to both the sub outputs and that I can time align both individually. I'll have to play around with it as I was seeing the same thing as you and it's not that clear.

Thanks


----------



## adam770

reath1 said:


> I changed out all RCA's, checked amps. Nothing wrong. It is definitely in the H800. All other channels are fine. I have it set up with 3-way front with rear fills. The left mid and left rear actually have a VERY low sound coming from them, not completely dead. I actually have to mute every other channel to barely hear them.


Hi, I has the same issue, all left chanells dead after i used it trough a 12v stabilized power supply.

The reason is, the H800 grounded itself trough the rca cables to the amp.
The Audison vrx6.420 is quite roboust amp, therefore its rca inputs didnt burnt, but the Alpine's rca outputs , or something behind it burnt.

I sent it back to the retailer in Czech Republic, and they repaired it in warranty trough alpine.cz

Now the warranty is over, but it burnt again.
I dont know how much will it cost to repair, maybe I sell it rather.

My advice is take care of massive grounding the Pxa-H800 directly to the grounding hub, othervise the one side outputs will dead.


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## quality_sound

If you've had issues with the ground sourcing through the RCAs more than once, your installation needs to be addressed. It's not the processors fault. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Socalstangman

I just installed this processor and so far I'm really liking it. I'm still learning so I still have a ways to go. One issue I'm having is with the Auto time correction. When I run it, it sets everything at ridiculous settings. For instance, the front passenger will be 270". Obviously that's not even close. It does the same with the other speakers as well. I'm running a 3 way front and a sub.


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## quality_sound

It's basing it on the sub's distance. It's fine. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Socalstangman

quality_sound said:


> It's basing it on the sub's distance. It's fine.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Oh ok. Thanks


----------



## ssmith100

Hey guys I have question. I misread a post on this page and now am confused a bit.

I have w910 going to H800 ainet and optical. S690 changer in rear going to H800 ainet and optical. Everything works great but I want to add the C800 up front. From everything I'm reading will I need to unplug ainet from W910 to H800 to use the remote or will it just "work" the way I have it set up ??

I have a RCA ran from the deck to the H800 but it's not hooked up. I'm assuming I wouldn't hook that up either just run optical to H800?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Shane


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## quality_sound

Just connect the C800 to the H800 with the cable supplied with the C800. The C800 has NOTHING to with signal. It's is strictly a controller. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## gamma_ed

Just came from an H701 to an H800 with a front 3 way setup and in the back a subwoofer. 

What a major difference!!!!! 

But not sure if I like the imprint EQ automatic adjustments, during this setup procedure, it tells me where the place the microphone. But I'm not sure at what height I should place the microphone. 

When imprint, the alignment sounds bad, if your ears would be down on the seating, it would be ok. Like it doesn't know if your ears are on headheight. And the bass is way too loud! 

Anyone tips for me at what height to place the microphone? 



Something else, I saw some remarks above about C800 rux needed or not. If you have an Ai-net hu, then it can adjust some basic things in the H800, like volume, fader, balance, subwoofer loudness, and presets. The 701 you can adjust everything with an ai-net hu, but the h800 not. With a computer you can make full adjustment, and store them in the presets. And these presets can be called from the HU. 

With the rux (or computer) you can make every adjustment that is possible, but on the otherside, do you want to go fidling with it when driving? 

If you have not a Ai-net hu but with optical out, then a rux c800 is definatly required for volume adjustments and so on!


----------



## Mr12voltwires

gamma_ed said:


> Just came from an H701 to an H800 with a front 3 way setup and in the back a subwoofer.
> 
> What a major difference!!!!!
> 
> But not sure if I like the imprint EQ automatic adjustments, during this setup procedure, it tells me where the place the microphone. But I'm not sure at what height I should place the microphone.
> 
> When imprint, the alignment sounds bad, if your ears would be down on the seating, it would be ok. Like it doesn't know if your ears are on headheight. And the bass is way too loud!
> 
> Anyone tips for me at what height to place the microphone?
> 
> 
> 
> Something else, I saw some remarks above about C800 rux needed or not. If you have an Ai-net hu, then it can adjust some basic things in the H800, like volume, fader, balance, subwoofer loudness, and presets. The 701 you can adjust everything with an ai-net hu, but the h800 not. With a computer you can make full adjustment, and store them in the presets. And these presets can be called from the HU.
> 
> With the rux (or computer) you can make every adjustment that is possible, but on the otherside, do you want to go fidling with it when driving?
> 
> If you have not a Ai-net hu but with optical out, then a rux c800 is definatly required for volume adjustments and so on!


Having worked for Alpine for a decade before/during the Ai-Net days (my 1st system used 2 PRA-H400s...), use the IMPRINT software to 'ball park' your tuning and just tweak it to your liking. 

With regard to microphone placement put it on a tripod/similar so it's where the middle of your head would be, and again, tweak the settings until you're satisfied. 

I've been out of 12V for a long time and like to see some of the old SQ stuff still being used. Congratulations and enjoy.


----------



## Precisionmike

Hello All,
So using a PXA-H800, I must use either an Alpine deck, or the RUX-C800 controller? Any way around this? Thanks, Mike


----------



## thehatedguy

Nope.


----------



## Precisionmike

Nope, no way around it?


----------



## thehatedguy

Have to use one or the other...maybe both depending on the Alpine headunit.

I think that's what I read in this epic thread.


----------



## Precisionmike

Got it, thanks.


----------



## gamma_ed

Precisionmike said:


> Hello All,
> So using a PXA-H800, I must use either an Alpine deck, or the RUX-C800 controller? Any way around this? Thanks, Mike


Yes their is, if its an HU with rca out or using the HI speaker out, put this pxa h800 in. And this will work, volume up and down is only possible now. 

Other adjustments to be made with computer!


----------



## Precisionmike

Great idea, but I will be using just optical in. I would use an Audiocontrol Matrix as the volume control after the H800, keeping it simple.


----------



## gamma_ed

Optical in, and you need a rux or computer to have volume controll. 

Why put an audiocontrol matrix between it, a extra signal path can only distroy good signal. Besides, H800 allready have a pretty high voltage output (wasn;t 7 volts out?)


----------



## Precisionmike

The PXA H800 is 4 volts, the Audio Control Matrix is about 10 volts. Also, there is nothing in the circuitry that will pollute the signal, IMO.


----------



## gamma_ed

I would only do that if the rca cables to the amplifiers are very long, otherwise its only an extra signalpath. 

Everything extra between is a risc for signal loss. I also think that audiocontroll amplifiers opamps are not so new engineered as the H800


----------



## quality_sound

gamma_ed said:


> Yes their is, if its an HU with rca out or using the HI speaker out, put this pxa h800 in. And this will work, volume up and down is only possible now.
> 
> Other adjustments to be made with computer!


You would still need the C800 to get the H800 to even turn on.


----------



## thehatedguy

I wouldn't do it either.

More opamps that you don't need.


----------



## quality_sound

And 4 Volts is MORE than enough.


----------



## gamma_ed

quality_sound said:


> You would still need the C800 to get the H800 to even turn on.


Is the remote 12 volt wire not enough to turn on? (Did alpine really engineered it that way only to be turned on with c800 or ai-net?)


----------



## thehatedguy

In the install manual, for use with a factory deck, the C800 is required...as it is with an non AI-Net deck.


----------



## gamma_ed

thehatedguy said:


> In the install manual, for use with a factory deck, the C800 is required...as it is with an non AI-Net deck.[/QUOTE
> 
> Is alpine not rich enough that they really want to sell an c800. unbelievable.
> 
> Nevertheless I have an Ai-net + rux c800 so I have no problem. But alpine should be ashamed of themself to let you buy a rux. Perhaps they can make a firmware update that the 12 volt remote is enough to turn on.


----------



## kyheng

gamma_ed said:


> thehatedguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the install manual, for use with a factory deck, the C800 is required...as it is with an non AI-Net deck.[/QUOTE
> 
> Is alpine not rich enough that they really want to sell an c800. unbelievable.
> 
> Nevertheless I have an Ai-net + rux c800 so I have no problem. But alpine should be ashamed of themself to let you buy a rux. Perhaps they can make a firmware update that the 12 volt remote is enough to turn on.
> 
> 
> 
> Well, Alpine want to protect their business, so this is what you can expect.
> If really want to say like this , Pioneer even worst, their DSP only can be run from their HU.
Click to expand...


----------



## Mr12voltwires

gamma_ed said:


> thehatedguy said:
> 
> 
> 
> In the install manual, for use with a factory deck, the C800 is required...as it is with an non AI-Net deck.[/QUOTE
> 
> Is alpine not rich enough that they really want to sell an c800. unbelievable.
> 
> Nevertheless I have an Ai-net + rux c800 so I have no problem. But alpine should be ashamed of themself to let you buy a rux. Perhaps they can make a firmware update that the 12 volt remote is enough to turn on.
> 
> 
> 
> Alpine is a business, like any other, they exist to make money (you might ask yourself 'why do you go to work?'). By making the RUX-C800 controller and inviting car audio enthusiasts to use their favorite source unit, they expand H800's market. Time correction and digital processing make significant improvements in imaging and overall sound quality.
> 
> Best of luck with your system.
Click to expand...


----------



## gamma_ed

Mr12voltwires said:


> gamma_ed said:
> 
> 
> 
> Alpine is a business, like any other, they exist to make money (you might ask yourself 'why do you go to work?'). By making the RUX-C800 controller and inviting car audio enthusiasts to use their favorite source unit, they expand H800's market. Time correction and digital processing make significant improvements in imaging and overall sound quality.
> 
> Best of luck with your system.
> 
> 
> 
> You made your point, but i'm just a normal customer who just complaints about the price. When I order a steak in a restaurant, I do not expect that they charge me extra if I want salad, potatoes, etc with it. ALso something like normal knowledge it belongs with the price.
> 
> I just connect everything, ai net unit and rux and happy with it
Click to expand...


----------



## quality_sound

gamma_ed said:


> Mr12voltwires said:
> 
> 
> 
> You made your point, but i'm just a normal customer who just complaints about the price. When I order a steak in a restaurant, I do not expect that they charge me extra if I want salad, potatoes, etc with it. ALso something like normal knowledge it belongs with the price.
> 
> I just connect everything, ai net unit and rux and happy with it
> 
> 
> 
> Restaurants will, and do, charge more for all of those side items.
> 
> Also, it's Ai-Net OR the C800. You don't need both. You can use both, but you only need one or the other.
Click to expand...


----------



## Bluenote

Anyone have direct experience with the sound / effect of the Euphony setting on this processor?


----------



## t3sn4f2

Bluenote said:


> Anyone have direct experience with the sound / effect of the Euphony setting on this processor?


Neil should have a better idea than anyone I think.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/1868873-post473.html


----------



## Bluenote

Thanks!


----------



## mp3weenie

Ok going to look at building system in 2006 Volvo S80 which has 6.5" all around - two way up front, center, rear doors and rear deck. So I have the option to run two ways up front, center and rear deck plus sub or is there an option to use external crossover for front 2-ways and use all cabin speakers (7.1)? I plan to use with a nanoPC and use it to control the processor and provide optical output for the processor for both hi-res stereo and native 5.1 discrete sources. Thanks.


----------



## mikey7182

I'm about to get mine set up, and am curious about subwoofer output settings. I'm running a single sub, and the manual isn't clear (or I just haven't found it) about whether or not both outputs 7 & 8 are required for SW output even in Mono mode, or if I can get the SW signal just from output 7, or from 8. It says something about turning SW 2 off, but doesn't necessarily label the outputs 7 and 8 "SW 1 and SW 2." If someone can confirm that would be great. I have it all wired up to just use Ch 7 for sub.


----------



## papasin

mikey7182 said:


> I'm about to get mine set up, and am curious about subwoofer output settings. I'm running a single sub, and the manual isn't clear (or I just haven't found it) about whether or not both outputs 7 & 8 are required for SW output even in Mono mode, or if I can get the SW signal just from output 7, or from 8. It says something about turning SW 2 off, but doesn't necessarily label the outputs 7 and 8 "SW 1 and SW 2." If someone can confirm that would be great. I have it all wired up to just use Ch 7 for sub.



You can just use 7. That's what I do.


----------



## mikey7182

Thanks Richard!


----------



## No.23

Hi all

Ive noticed something the past month which I hope someone is able to offer an explanation as to why its happened.

From a cold start, cranked up volume to around 20 on the headunit (RUX set to -35db, thats where i hear no buzz / zing) and after about 1 minute of playing, sounded like the amp powering my mid range, mid bass and tweets cut off and i hear a loud humming from what appeared to be the woofer. Immediately switched the HU off, waited 2 mins, switched back on and the sound disappeared...but i didn't increase the volume past 10.

1) Is it possible that the amp gains are set incorrectly causing the increased volume from the HU to initiate this problem?

2) Should I be setting the headunit volume to say 20 and use the RUX controller to adjust my volume instead?

3) What volume (db) do you guys set your RUX controller at before all floor noise disappears, or is there a way to keep it higher than -35db without encountering any of that awful noise?

4) Ive noticed that turning the Navi Mix volume right down to -10 db also decreases the floor noise....should this happen or is it an indication of poor wiring or something else?

Thanks for reading, await some positive comments.


----------



## kaflam

Hi, No.23

Can you tell us more about your system? Please tell us about all devices and how are connected to each other.


----------



## Randyman...

I don't believe the Navi Volume should ALWAYS have an effect. If it does, it sounds like you might be triggering the Guide wire that "Ducks" the music volume to allow the Navi Voice to "Voice Over" and be heard.

The H800's Navi Voice Over function uses an RCA input for the Voice Audio (as fed from a compatible Navigation unit, like the W910), and if that input is unconnected/unterminated and you somehow trigger the "Guide" wire, you might very well hear hum and noise from that Navi Voice RCA Input in tandem with a lowering of music volume (ducking).

I should mention, all of my H800 exposure is via AI-Net with the W910, so I don't use the RUX for volume control (just for DSP Tweaking), so my system's gain structure is likely a bit different from yours. I've never noticed any artifacts based off where the volume was set during power-on or any other time.

As kaflam also mentioned - more info will help narrow this down, but I smell the H800's Navi/Guide voice-over circuit coming into play - but there's obviously tons of variables and potential points of failure in any system


----------



## captainobvious

papasin said:


> You can just use 7. That's what I do.


Is this a confirmation that both channel 7 (left sub) and channel 8 (right sub) are summed signals? Meaning by simply using output 7, your sub isn't just playing only left channel LF content and not right channel LF content as well...correct? That was my question too. 

If both outputs 7 and 8 can be summed mono on each then that allows the use of two separate subwoofers in different locations, EQ'd and time aligned separately. If this is the case, what should the setting be for the sub outputs?


----------



## seafish

There is a way to set the sub output on the H800 to EITHER mono or stereo along as more then one sub is connected-- 

"SUBWOOFER OUTPUT: Stereo/Mono (see footnote*2)

Note*2 "Only when two subwoofers are connected, is this item able to be set.
Stereo: Subwoofer stereo (L/R) output 
Mono: Subwoofer monaural output"
￼
The link--

http://www.alpine.com.au/files/2013OwnersManuals/PXA-H800.pdf

Look at page 13 and 14 of the owners manual, or search it for the word "mono" and find the first two occurrences of "mono" -- they will relate to the sub settings.

BTW--I am thinking about starting a thread about the advantages/disadvantages of using stereo vs mono sub output when dual subs are installed in a vehicle…do you guys think that it would be a useful thread??


----------



## fahadco80

Mic10is said:


> How r u setting your gains? maybe I missed it?
> 1khz tone?
> 
> find your volume point where the signal clips. check voltage w a DMM. Then use a -10db tone to set the gains. turn gains up to reach that number.
> done






Hi,

I really need some help on this setup. I live in Kuwait (Middle East), And here in Kuwait no shop can help as we they do not have the experience to work with Bose and processors, So I will be doing the installation and the tuning process.

I have a 2009 Nissan GTR, with factory Bose system, the head unit only have 4 channels (low level signals) FR, RL, RR and RL going to the factory Bose amp under the seat, from there the factory amp outputs those 4 to get 8 channels (speaker level signals), 1 channel for centre, 4 channels for my 3 ways in the doors, 2 channels for rears and 1 channel for the 2 subs in the middle of the back seats (with is own separate amp).

=================================================

My plan is to add the below equipments:

Subs: pair HERTZ ENERGY ES200.5 (factory location) 200 RMS
Centre: one HERTZ HI-ENERGY HL 70 (factory location) 50 RMS
Rear Deck: pair HERTZ DCX87.3 (factory location) 30 RMS
Rear Sides: pair HERTZ HCX 690 (new fabricated location) 130 RMS
Doors: pair HERTZ HSK 163 (3 WAY) (factory location) 150 RMS

I did not decide yet what amps and DSP will go for.

=================================================

Most of the people who I asked suggested to stick with front stage and subs, and some of them told me to go with a separate head unit, these two options I am not thinking of at all, I would like to keep all factory speakers locations working and would like to add the 6x9 extra rear speakers as I mentioned before, I want to have the sound to come from every ware like the factory Bose, I do not know how to explain, but its much like if you are in a club and listening to music from every where, hopefully you can understand me guys. 

=================================================

Now my questions:

1. where is the best place to take the wires from, is it the head unit (the 4 channels low level) to the processor and from there to the new aftermarket amps? Or keep the factory amp and take the speaker levels outputs from the factory amp to the processor and from processor to the new amps? (attached a wiring diagram so some one expert could take a look at)

2. Is there a way to keep the passive crossover box on the 3 way Hertz and install each 3 way on 1 channel off the processor? Or its a must to keep each speaker of the 3 way on a separate channel on the DSP (active)? most of installers does the 3 way on 2 channels, I really do not understand why, but for my situation, I would like to reserve some outputs off the DSP, I will need to use them for the other speakers, 8 is not enough cause I am going to add 2 more speakers in the rear sides.

3. If your answer to Q2 is yes I can play the 3 way passive xover on one channel on DSP, is it still going to be tuneable on the DSP? Or will be losing the tuning feature on this specific channel? 

4. I really need your suggestions on what amps and DSP to go for with my setup?



Regards

Fahad





PS: I attached the factory AMP adapters wiring diagram (and below, I wrote the wiring pin numbers), it may help you to figure out a way to do it all work.

Four Channels Bose Low Level from Head Unit to AMP:
2:Front Right:
19 - Red - line level input, front right +
20 - Green - line level input, front right -

1:Front Left:
18 - Blue - line level input, front left +
32 - Pink - line level input, front left -

3:Rear Right:
23 - Brown - line level input, rear right +
33 - Yellow - line level input, rear right -

4:Rear Left
21 - Violet - line level input, rear left +
22 - Light Blue - line level input, rear left -

One Channel Bose Line Level From Main Bose AMP under the seat to Bose Sub’s AMP:
09 - Pink - line level OUTPUT, subwoofer + (this goes to the subwoofer amp)
14 - Light Blue - line level OUTPUT, subwoofer - (this goes to the subwoofer amp)

Seven Channels Bose High Level From AMP to speakers and SUB’s AMP’s:
1: Center:
15 - Violet - speaker level output, centre +
28 - White - speaker level output, centre -

2:Mid-range & Tweeter Right:
08 - Light Blue - speaker level output, front right squawker and tweeter +
13 - Brown - speaker level output, front right squawker and tweeter -

3:Mid-range & Tweeter Left:
05 - Grey - speaker level output, front left squawker and tweeter +
04 - Orange - speaker level output, front left squawker and tweeter -

4:Mid-bass Right:
02 - Yellow - speaker level output, front right +
03 - Light Green - speaker level output, front right -

5:Mid-bass Left:
01 - Red - speaker level output, front left +
10 - Green - speaker level output, front left -

6:Full-range Rear Right (will be installed parallel with the extra 6x9 that I bought):
27 - Orange - speaker level output, rear right +
37 - Light Green - speaker level output, rear right -

7:Full-range Rear Left (will be installed parallel with the extra 6x9 that I bought):
06 - Violet - speaker level output, rear left +
07 - Light Green - speaker level output, rear left -

Bose Power:
11 - Yellow - Battery
12 - Black - Ground
31 - Violet - amp turn on signal


----------



## kaflam

Well, all i will tell you is just my opinion, and is just one of many ways you can go.

1. I really think you should take the HU outputs directly to the DSP, the less devices you have in line, the better.

2. One of your best choices is to take ch 1&2 for your 3 way front, 3&4 for your rear mids, 5&6 for your 6x9 and 7&8 for center and subs.

3. You won't be able to use DSP xover for the 3 way system, and you will not need it since you alredy have it on your passive network. But you will be able to eq and TA each side of your 3 way front.

4. For amps, you have many choices... You can get Hertz HDP5 for front and 6x9s and Hertz HDP5 for rear mids, center and subs. Or JL HD600/4 for fronts and 6x9s, JL XD400/4v2 for rears and center and finally a JL XD 600/1v2 for subs. Or Alpine PDX-F6 for fronts and 6x9s, MRV-F300 for mids rear and center, and PDR-M65 for subs...


----------



## kmarei

I installed my H800 yesterday, messed around with it a bit

I have a few questions
every time I try the Auto TCR I get a "calibration error"
from the manual it says it would fail if there is too much external noise around the car
I did this at 11:30pm last night in the car
everything turned off, phone on mute etc
I tried like 6 or 7 times
end result is the error each time
am I missing something?

is this unit overkill for my system?
I have 2 way passive 5 1/4" components in the doors
one 6.5" sub between the 2 front seats, the car is a 2 seater, so no rear speakers.
I already bought a small amp to try to run the front speakers active, never tried that before.


----------



## kaflam

You are not supposed to have problems, can you tell us how did you get it wired??? from HU to DSP to amp to speakers, step by step. And also, how are you doing the Auto TCR, step by step.


----------



## fahadco80

kaflam said:


> Well, all i will tell you is just my opinion, and is just one of many ways you can go.
> 
> 1. I really think you should take the HU outputs directly to the DSP, the less devices you have in line, the better.
> 
> 2. One of your best choices is to take ch 1&2 for your 3 way front, 3&4 for your rear mids, 5&6 for your 6x9 and 7&8 for center and subs.
> 
> 3. You won't be able to use DSP xover for the 3 way system, and you will not need it since you alredy have it on your passive network. But you will be able to eq and TA each side of your 3 way front.
> 
> 4. For amps, you have many choices... You can get Hertz HDP5 for front and 6x9s and Hertz HDP5 for rear mids, center and subs. Or JL HD600/4 for fronts and 6x9s, JL XD400/4v2 for rears and center and finally a JL XD 600/1v2 for subs. Or Alpine PDX-F6 for fronts and 6x9s, MRV-F300 for mids rear and center, and PDR-M65 for subs...



Hi Kaflam,

Regarding the HU outputs, it does not matter if its full range or not? most of people saying only full range low level can feed directly from HU's to DSP's, I am not sure if mine is a full range, is there a way to do a full range test?

And thanks for answering my questions 

Fahad


----------



## kmarei

kaflam said:


> You are not supposed to have problems, can you tell us how did you get it wired??? from HU to DSP to amp to speakers, step by step. And also, how are you doing the Auto TCR, step by step.


head unit is the Parrot Asteroid Classic (6 volt pre-out) straight to Aux 1 on the H800
from H800 to Alpine KTP-445U amp
output 1 and 2 are for the fronts, output 7 and 8 is for the sub (dual voice coil sub)

from amp to speakers using factory wiring
the amp is powering the front speakers 2x45W and the other 2x45W channels are for the sub

on another note, when I have the volume past 26 (out of 30) the volume starts to break up. I assume the 6v output is overpowering the input stage on the H800?
should I raise the output volume on the H800 and lower the volume on the parrot?
I know when I tested with a JBL MS-8, anything higher than 24 would get the "input too high message" on the MS-8.


Auto TCR is done from the C800
haven't tried it yet from the computer, after I mounted the H800, I realized the USB plug is blocked by part of the dash

Will try to test it tonight or tomorrow night
also keen on doing the IMPRINT setup


----------



## kaflam

There is no reason HU is not full range, but factory amp i really think is not full range on the outputs. You can confirm that on many ways... Take those signals to an aftermarket amp and play test tones (30 Hz, 1000 Hz and 5000 Hz) if you can hear the tones (on a properly connected speaker, then is full range. You can also use an oscilloscope and take the signal directly from HU with 3/4 volume and if you can see the wave from 20-40 Hz, 1000 Hz & 5000 Hz then is full range. You can even take a simple multimeter and with the same test tones at 3/4 volume and should get something between 1.5 - 4 volt on every tone.

But again, there is no reason to belive HU is not using full range.

One of the best things of the H800 is that can take low/hi level inputs, even balanced or unbalanced.


----------



## fahadco80

kaflam said:


> There is no reason HU is not full range, but factory amp i really think is not full range on the outputs. You can confirm that on many ways... Take those signals to an aftermarket amp and play test tones (30 Hz, 1000 Hz and 5000 Hz) if you can hear the tones (on a properly connected speaker, then is full range. You can also use an oscilloscope and take the signal directly from HU with 3/4 volume and if you can see the wave from 20-40 Hz, 1000 Hz & 5000 Hz then is full range. You can even take a simple multimeter and with the same test tones at 3/4 volume and should get something between 1.5 - 4 volt on every tone.
> 
> But again, there is no reason to belive HU is not using full range.
> 
> One of the best things of the H800 is that can take low/hi level inputs, even balanced or unbalanced.


Do you have any info about the JBL MS8? which one is better MS8 or H800?

I am looking for a DSP with auto tuning function, and I found both has this feature.

Thanks 

Thanks


----------



## kaflam

kmarei said:


> head unit is the Parrot Asteroid Classic (6 volt pre-out) straight to Aux 1 on the H800
> from H800 to Alpine KTP-445U amp
> output 1 and 2 are for the fronts, output 7 and 8 is for the sub (dual voice coil sub)
> 
> from amp to speakers using factory wiring
> the amp is powering the front speakers 2x45W and the other 2x45W channels are for the sub
> 
> on another note, when I have the volume past 26 (out of 30) the volume starts to break up. I assume the 6v output is overpowering the input stage on the H800?
> should I raise the output volume on the H800 and lower the volume on the parrot?
> I know when I tested with a JBL MS-8, anything higher than 24 would get the "input too high message" on the MS-8.
> 
> 
> Auto TCR is done from the C800
> haven't tried it yet from the computer, after I mounted the H800, I realized the USB plug is blocked by part of the dash
> 
> Will try to test it tonight or tomorrow night
> also keen on doing the IMPRINT setup


I think is because of you config. First of all, you should change input to 7 volt. And also check on the output setup in the H800, maybe you are trying to Auto TCR a nonexistent channel (3-6), i really think is the reason of the error.

I really recommend to use PC instead of RUX, give it a time to config with PC and mount it again.


----------



## kaflam

fahadco80 said:


> Do you have any info about the JBL MS8? which one is better MS8 or H800?
> 
> I am looking for a DSP with auto tuning function, and I found both has this feature.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Thanks


Haven't work with it but with a good installation/configuration and tunning, you should be ok with any. But i prefer the H800.


----------



## fahadco80

kaflam said:


> Haven't work with it but with a good installation/configuration and tunning, you should be on with any. But i prefer the H800.



Thanks a lot Kaflam


----------



## smalliehunter

Hi guys, I'm hoping someone can help me out here and would appreciated any advice or solutions you guys might have. 

I have PXA-H800 and RXU-C800 controller with 2 PDX-M12 amps for each JL sub and 1 PDX-F6 for my Focal 2-way active fronts. I am trying to connect my Fiio X5 High Resolution Lossless Music Player which has digital coaxial output that I have converted to optical with the appropriate adaptor and have connected to the PXA-H800 Optical "Digital HU" input. I have selected the correct "Digital 1" input on the RXU-C800, but I'm not getting any sound from the system. I know I have the amps connected and configured correctly because I had an Alpine head unit connected before I decided to go with my portable player and everything worked great. The reason why I didn't keep the Alpine HU installed is that there was not enough depth in my dash for it to fit far enough back. I have the system installed in a 67 Camaro convertible, the dashes are pretty small in these cars, so is the trunk.

I also have some really loud engine noise coming from the right 2-way speaker, this noise was not there when I had the HU installed.

My questions are, should the H800 work correctly with ONLY my Hi Res portable music player connected to the optical input or does a head unit need to be connected to the H800 analog inputs as well for it to ground properly and to reduce or eliminate the engine noise? Why do I all of the sudden have all this engine noise when no analog inputs are connected to the H800? I even disconnect the optical input and there are no inputs connected to the H800, I still have the engine noise.

I'm just getting back into the car audio world after being out of it for about 30 some odd years when I used to compete, so please bare with me if my questions sound a little stupid. Just trying to figure this out so I can get my car back on the road, with tunes this time!

I've attached the FiiO x5 manual as well as some pics of my current install, the Massive Toro's have been replaced with the JL JW7 AE-3.

Thanks for any input.

Regards,
Morey


----------



## kaflam

smalliehunter said:


> My questions are, should the H800 work correctly with ONLY my Hi Res portable music player connected to the optical input or does a head unit need to be connected to the H800 analog inputs as well for it to ground properly and to reduce or eliminate the engine noise? Why do I all of the sudden have all this engine noise when no analog inputs are connected to the H800? I even disconnect the optical input and there are no inputs connected to the H800, I still have the engine noise.


For engine noise you should take a look for a ground loop, and any link between the H800 and the amps, good ground for ever device.

Also, I haven't work with that kind of digital inputs, but you should try to hook the FiiO directly to the ch 1&2 via analog and see what happens.


----------



## smalliehunter

Thanks for the suggestions, I have all the amps grounded to the same location as the battery dedicated for the system which is the frame bare metal and the H800 grounded to the quarter panel support in the trunk, the paint has been ground to bare metal at this location as well. Do you think it would make a difference if I ran the H800 to the same location as the battery and amps?

Why do you think not having the head unit would make the ground noise louder?

I just picked up the 3.5mm to RCA adaptor and I'm going to try connecting to input 1 & 2 as you have suggested. 

Thanks again for the suggestions.


----------



## kaflam

smalliehunter said:


> Why do you think not having the head unit would make the ground noise louder?


No, I think the opposite. I really don't know how digital communication would work in the specific case, but hi res files/devices are working with tons of info and i don't know if H800 support the FiiO.

About the engine noise, try to remove all links and try them one by one until you find wich one is the guilty. That will narrow the possibilities.


----------



## seafish

smalliehunter said:


> Thanks for the suggestions, I have all the amps grounded to the same location as the battery dedicated for the system which is the frame bare metal and the H800 grounded to the quarter panel support in the trunk, the paint has been ground to bare metal at this location as well. Do you think it would make a difference if I ran the H800 to the same location as the battery and amps?


In fact using different grounding locations, even on the frame, is exactly what can cause a grounding loop due to 
the potential of different resistance of the ground in the different locations. Try running a good but temporary ground cable from the H800 back to the location where the amps are grounded and see if the noise goes away.


----------



## smalliehunter

kaflam said:


> No, I think the opposite. I really don't know how digital communication would work in the specific case, but hi res files/devices are working with tons of info and i don't know if H800 support the FiiO.
> 
> About the engine noise, try to remove all links and try them one by one until you find wich one is the guilty. That will narrow the possibilities.


Kaflam, you were spot on with using the analog inputs, the gain even works out on the FiiO! Just started tweeking and tuning, now the next problem is the trunk lid vibrating, or should i say convulsing. Man do those JL's ever kick! Now the next thing i have to figure out is the ground loop issue. The main thing is i have sound again, and great sound at that.

When tuning the system with the H800, should all the x-overs on the PDX amps be defeated?

Thanks


----------



## smalliehunter

seafish said:


> In fact using different grounding locations, even on the frame, is exactly what can cause a grounding loop due to
> the potential of different resistance of the ground in the different locations. Try running a good but temporary ground cable from the H800 back to the location where the amps are grounded and see if the noise goes away.


Seafish, we'll give that a try and see how it works.

Thanks for the input


----------



## kaflam

smalliehunter said:


> Kaflam, you were spot on with using the analog inputs, the gain even works out on the FiiO! Just started tweeking and tuning, now the next problem is the trunk lid vibrating, or should i say convulsing. Man do those JL's ever kick! Now the next thing i have to figure out is the ground loop issue. The main thing is i have sound again, and great sound at that.
> 
> When tuning the system with the H800, should all the x-overs on the PDX amps be defeated?
> 
> Thanks


Well, you have to decide what xovers are you going to use and how, if you have passive, etc. But you are supposed tu defeat the xover amps if you are going to use the h800 xovers (recommended), then set the xover points until you get the sound the way you like. This is very important.

How are you using the h800 outputs?


----------



## smalliehunter

I'm using the PDF-F6 active for my front Front tweeters and mids, I'll make sure I defeat all the xovers on my F6 as well as my 2 F12 sub amps and start from scratch on the tuning again.

Thanks


----------



## captainobvious

Fahad-

Have you heard a properly setup SQ car? They can get to club like output levels, yet sound absolutely amazing. When you do a system with speakers everywhere it can get loud and play clean, but will not be as accurate, nor sound as good.

I would recommend using the H800 to run everything actively. Ditch the notion of the 6x9's in the rear. You simply wont need them. The system will have gobs of output with a front 3-way, plus center, plus sub. Ditch the passive crossovers and run everything actively from the H800 so the system can be properly time aligned (each driver...it's critical) and EQ'd.


----------



## papasin

captainobvious said:


> The system will have gobs of output with a front 3-way, plus center, plus sub. Ditch the passive crossovers and run everything actively from the H800 so the system can be properly time aligned (each driver...it's critical) and EQ'd.



AFAIK, if the intent is to run with a center on an H800, it needs to be configured as 2-way front, rear-fill, center, and sub.

Everything else, I agree to try to run everything active. I'm experimenting with a 3-way active front, with center, rearfill, and sub, but it is going to require an H800 and a second DSP.


----------



## Bluenote

Yes Richard pleeeeez do that! Lol we need the Blueprint!


----------



## papasin

Bluenote said:


> Yes Richard pleeeeez do that! Lol we need the Blueprint!



Lol Thomas. garysummers (and I imagine others) have done this long before me. Last time I saw Gary's setup, he had 3 DSPs (a pair of H990s and an H800) so that his system is fully active with 16 speakers IIRC. But this isn't Gary's first rodeo in sound mastering so what he's doing in his car isn't for the faint of heart. :blush: For those that don't know who Gary is, might want to look him up on IMDB.

For most, I would strongly suggest to start off with a solid 2 or 3-way front + sub especially if the goal is solid SQ for the driver seat. I think as Steve was alluding to, once you hear a solid and well setup single seat 2 or 3-way system, it's pretty darn good and unless there are specific goals like trying to play Dolby digital content or 2-seat in a car, a center channel can potentially add more complication if the person hasn't even tried a solid one seat setup. Just my $0.02 and YMMV.


----------



## Bluenote

Correct on all points...I just haven't seen anyone on this thread (except the MiniCooper & Hat set-up) utilize the full potential of the H800 for PL2 and discussed it. Let alone any comparative notes with the MS8 L7. I've heard Gary's car before the recent mods and it definitely set a benchmark for me


----------



## papasin

Bluenote said:


> Correct on all points...I just haven't seen anyone on this thread (except the MiniCooper & Hat set-up) utilize the full potential of the H800 for PL2 and discussed it. Let alone any comparative notes with the MS8 L7. I've heard Gary's car before the recent mods and it definitely set a benchmark for me


Keep in mind you don't (necessarily) need a center to be taking advantage of PL2. I know of a small handful of vehicles that currently run H800s with PL2 enabled, in large part to incorporate rear-fill. I myself don't have it on right now in my Civic, but I was utilizing it when you first heard my car with the AP Nz3s and also using PL2 when I had the C4CX. It'd be nice if they came out with an H1000.


----------



## Kriszilla

To hell with this thread and everyone in it. I made the dire mistake of skimming through most of it and now I have a new H800 and RUX controller on their way to me now. 

Now I have to re-tune my entire setup and make it sound better than ever. I hope ya'll are happy now.


----------



## Golden Ear

Kriszilla said:


> To hell with this thread and everyone in it. I made the dire mistake of skimming through most of it and now I have a new H800 and RUX controller on their way to me now.
> 
> Now I have to re-tune my entire setup and make it sound better than ever. I hope ya'll are happy now.


Mission accomplished:laugh:


----------



## Kriszilla

Golden Ear said:


> Mission accomplished:laugh:


Apparently... Heh!

I do have a serious question though for the people here. I have a really nice home theater that, aside from movies, I love listening to 5.1 audio through. I've been toying with the thought of doing a scaled-down version of it in my Sienna for the same purpose. 

I'm considering changing my headunit to an E3io carpc, which would give me an optical out. Can I use that to pass 5.1 to the H800 and will it lock onto a 5.1 source that way?


----------



## captainobvious

papasin said:


> AFAIK, if the intent is to run with a center on an H800, it needs to be configured as 2-way front, rear-fill, center, and sub.
> 
> Everything else, I agree to try to run everything active. I'm experimenting with a 3-way active front, with center, rearfill, and sub, but it is going to require an H800 and a second DSP.



The way it's labeled in the H800 is the "System 4: 5.1 channel setup". This shows:

-Front High L/R
-Front Low L/R
-Rear Low L/R
-Center
-Sub

In this configuration, front high would be tweeters, front low would be midranges and rear low would be midbasses. There are bandpass crossovers for the front low and rear low as well as separate time alignment on each driver so it should work fine by doing a front 3-way with center and sub, no ?


----------



## papasin

captainobvious said:


> The way it's labeled in the H800 is the "System 4: 5.1 channel setup". This shows:
> 
> -Front High L/R
> -Front Low L/R
> -Rear Low L/R
> -Center
> -Sub
> 
> In this configuration, front high would be tweeters, front low would be midranges and rear low would be midbasses. There are bandpass crossovers for the front low and rear low as well as separate time alignment on each driver so it should work fine by doing a front 3-way with center and sub, no ?


What happens though when you turn on PL2 to enable center channel steering? Doesn't the rear signals get altered to mono, or some derivative of discrete rear L/R that Dolby utilizes to derive ch 4-5 (if you enumerate 1-3 as L,C,R)? That's why I caveat my statement with AFAIK, because as I understand, in order to effectively utilize center, you also need rears to act as rears for the Dolby algorithm to work correctly. Not 100% sure, but this is how I understand the System 4 intent, but happy to be proven wrong if I'm misunderstanding.


----------



## captainobvious

papasin said:


> What happens though when you turn on PL2 to enable center channel steering? Doesn't the rear signals get altered to mono, or some derivative of discrete rear L/R that Dolby utilizes to derive ch 4-5 (if you enumerate 1-3 as L,C,R)? That's why I caveat my statement with AFAIK, because as I understand, in order to effectively utilize center, you also need rears to act as rears for the Dolby algorithm to work correctly. Not 100% sure, but this is how I understand the System 4 intent, but happy to be proven wrong if I'm misunderstanding.



I'm just talking out my ass.:laugh: 
I know it can be _configured _that way, but I don't what happens with the processing at that point. You may be 100% correct for all I know


----------



## tgotovac

Hey all, I've had my h800 setup for about a year now and I'm pretty happy with it, but I have a few questions, is it possible to use it without the imprint function? I'm trying to tune via rta and would like an unaltered baseline to work with. Is this possible? If not what would be the ideal path to go interms of choosing the imprint curve which would give me the least altered base tune?


----------



## kaflam

Hi, tgotovac
Of course you can use it without imprint! Just tune it!
But also, is usefull if you set your xovers to your needs, then imprint and finally take your rta to get a perfect pitch.


----------



## smalliehunter

Guys, I've had a bit of time now to start tuning my system and I don't think my FiiO 5 has enough output voltage as the sound isn't as dynamic or loud without distortion. Can I use the H800 to increase the gain or do I need to get a line driver for the FiiO X5? Also, I don't know how to set up the gains, is there an easy way or a good reference site for this?


----------



## tgotovac

smalliehunter said:


> Guys, I've had a bit of time now to start tuning my system and I don't think my FiiO 5 has enough output voltage as the sound isn't as dynamic or loud without distortion. Can I use the H800 to increase the gain or do I need to get a line driver for the FiiO X5? Also, I don't know how to set up the gains, is there an easy way or a good reference site for this?


Where abouts in Canada are you? There is a way to boost aux input level on the h800. Also make sure you have the input gain in the input menu set to low. That'll help aswell. The manual is actually not terrible and will show you how to adjust input level, as well as input gain


----------



## t3sn4f2

smalliehunter said:


> Guys, I've had a bit of time now to start tuning my system and I don't think my FiiO 5 has enough output voltage as the sound isn't as dynamic or loud without distortion. Can I use the H800 to increase the gain or do I need to get a line driver for the FiiO X5? Also, I don't know how to set up the gains, is there an easy way or a good reference site for this?


Why not feed the H800 a digital signal from the X5? You'll need to do master volume control from the C800 and get a "coaxial to toslink s/pdif converter", but it's the way to go if you want the best signal. Not saying the X5 to h800 analog route can't/won't sound as good but why got hat route when you have the better option. Also eliminates any potential induced noise problems. Mount the converter nearest the player and run a toslink fiber to the processor would be best.


----------



## smalliehunter

I'm in Victoria BC. I've set the aux input levels to low in the H800, how do I boost the levels more?

Thanks


----------



## smalliehunter

t3sn4f2 said:


> Why not feed the H800 a digital signal from the X5? You'll need to do master volume control from the C800 and get a "coaxial to toslink s/pdif converter", but it's the way to go if you want the best signal. Not saying the X5 to h800 analog route can't/won't sound as good but why got hat route when you have the better option. Also eliminates any potential induced noise problems. Mount the converter nearest the player and run a toslink fiber to the processor would be best.


I actually connected the X5 with the digital originally and used a C2C digital coax to toslink converter, but didn't get any sound. I had all the settings for the H800 correct and the C800 input selected to digital input 1, the toslink was connected to the HU digital input. Did I not have some settings right in the H800? What other settings are there to get this working, I'd love to use this option if I could get it to work. Do you think the X5 has a high enough voltage output?


----------



## tgotovac

You can do it through the c800, in the input section, there should be something there about input level and you can go up to 10db boost


----------



## t3sn4f2

smalliehunter said:


> I actually connected the X5 with the digital originally and used a C2C digital coax to toslink converter, but didn't get any sound. I had all the settings for the H800 correct and the C800 input selected to digital input 1, the toslink was connected to the HU digital input. Did I not have some settings right in the H800? What other settings are there to get this working, I'd love to use this option if I could get it to work. Do you think the X5 has a high enough voltage output?


It should have worked. I would check all posible settings again on the player and the h800. Dumb question....you did have power going to the ctg converter correct?

As for the voltage being enough for the analog in? How much is that player rated for? If its something like 1 volt then maybe its a little on the low side. The input boost might work but it might only be a digital gain and not an input analog line driver which would not be as clean. You can try an alpine rca to ainet plug and run it straigh into the ainet input. That input is rated for ~1volt and should be a good match for that players 1 volt (if thats what it is in fact). 

But id still try to get that digi in working before anything


----------



## smalliehunter

tgotovac said:


> You can do it through the c800, in the input section, there should be something there about input level and you can go up to 10db boost


Thanks for the info, I'll have a look through the options and find that setting.


----------



## smalliehunter

t3sn4f2 said:


> It should have worked. I would check all posible settings again on the player and the h800. Dumb question....you did have power going to the ctg converter correct?
> 
> As for the voltage being enough for the analog in? How much is that player rated for? If its something like 1 volt then maybe its a little on the low side. The input boost might work but it might only be a digital gain and not an input analog line driver which would not be as clean. You can try an alpine rca to ainet plug and run it straigh into the ainet input. That input is rated for ~1volt and should be a good match for that players 1 volt (if thats what it is in fact).
> 
> But id still try to get that digi in working before anything


Not a dumb question at all, yes I did have the converter powered up, the red light at the end of the toslink cable was lit up so I know it was working. I'm going to go throughout all the settings again, anything particular that I should be looking for? I think the voltage is lower than 1v, but I'll go to the site and check

Ok, here's what I found on the FiiO form:
These are the published specs for the X5:

460 mW @ 16Ω, 255 mW @ 32Ω, 28 mW @ 300Ω.

Let's do some published specs comparisons on a per channel basis with 16 ohm IEMs:

X5: 230 Mw
AK100: 70 Mw
Sony ZX1: 15 Mw
Calyx M: 98.2 Mw (current specs)

To be totally honest, I don't know what all this means, is this enough voltage to run to my H800 and PDX M12 x 2 and PDX F6 x 1?
Thanks for the help


----------



## t3sn4f2

smalliehunter said:


> Not a dumb question at all, yes I did have the converter powered up, the red light at the end of the toslink cable was lit up so I know it was working. I'm going to go throughout all the settings again, anything particular that I should be looking for? I think the voltage is lower than 1v, but I'll go to the site and check
> 
> Ok, here's what I found on the FiiO form:
> These are the published specs for the X5:
> 
> 460 mW @ 16Ω, 255 mW @ 32Ω, 28 mW @ 300Ω.
> 
> Let's do some published specs comparisons on a per channel basis with 16 ohm IEMs:
> 
> X5: 230 Mw
> AK100: 70 Mw
> Sony ZX1: 15 Mw
> Calyx M: 98.2 Mw (current specs)
> 
> To be totally honest, I don't know what all this means, is this enough voltage to run to my H800 and PDX M12 x 2 and PDX F6 x 1?
> Thanks for the help


Those numbers are output wattage ratings at different headphone loads for the headphone amp. They don't correlate really to the line out port you would use to feed the H800. I found a page where they say the line out is rated at 1.5 volts. Not sure how accurate that is, but I think it's same to say it's al least 1 volt. 

Is that enough? Hard to say, it depends on the H800 input needs, if the H800 can't put out more than it is getting in, and if it can't can your amps make up for it with their own added noise free gain.

You say you are getting distorted sound? that would not be indicative of a low voltage situation. Distorted or clipped sound mean you over drove an output or an input somewhere, and that would not be possible from that player. Assuming you are using it's line out instead of the headphone jack, and are not using any sound functions (ie EQ) from the player itself.

Check all your settings on the H800, I can't tell you more than that since I'm not familiar with how the H800 handle its signal limits.

Can you go into the problem in more detail? You might also want to test the H800 with a home CD player's toslink output. That'll help you narrow down half the problems right away (ie player/analog input stage).


----------



## smalliehunter

t3sn4f2 said:


> Those numbers are output wattage ratings at different headphone loads for the headphone amp. They don't correlate really to the line out port you would use to feed the H800. I found a page where they say the line out is rated at 1.5 volts. Not sure how accurate that is, but I think it's same to say it's al least 1 volt.
> 
> Is that enough? Hard to say, it depends on the H800 input needs, if the H800 can't put out more than it is getting in, and if it can't can your amps make up for it with their own added noise free gain.
> 
> You say you are getting distorted sound? that would not be indicative of a low voltage situation. Distorted or clipped sound mean you over drove an output or an input somewhere, and that would not be possible from that player. Assuming you are using it's line out instead of the headphone jack, and are not using any sound functions (ie EQ) from the player itself.
> 
> Check all your settings on the H800, I can't tell you more than that since I'm not familiar with how the H800 handle its signal limits.
> 
> Can you go into the problem in more detail? You might also want to test the H800 with a home CD player's toslink output. That'll help you narrow down half the problems right away (ie player/analog input stage).


Yes, I am using the line out on the X5. The distortion is at moderate levels, the sound just dosnt seem to be as dynamic as it should be, the vocals seem to breakup a little at moderate to higher levels. I can see I'm going to have to do a bit more homework on my setup to try and dial it better. I'm also going to try and find a good site that explains in laymans terms, how to set up gains. I've been out of the car audio business for over 30 years now so a lot has changed. 

Thanks for the suggestions,


----------



## No.23

Randyman... said:


> I don't believe the Navi Volume should ALWAYS have an effect. If it does, it sounds like you might be triggering the Guide wire that "Ducks" the music volume to allow the Navi Voice to "Voice Over" and be heard.
> 
> The H800's Navi Voice Over function uses an RCA input for the Voice Audio (as fed from a compatible Navigation unit, like the W910), and if that input is unconnected/unterminated and you somehow trigger the "Guide" wire, you might very well hear hum and noise from that Navi Voice RCA Input in tandem with a lowering of music volume (ducking).
> 
> I should mention, all of my H800 exposure is via AI-Net with the W910, so I don't use the RUX for volume control (just for DSP Tweaking), so my system's gain structure is likely a bit different from yours. I've never noticed any artifacts based off where the volume was set during power-on or any other time.
> 
> As kaflam also mentioned - more info will help narrow this down, but I smell the H800's Navi/Guide voice-over circuit coming into play - but there's obviously tons of variables and potential points of failure in any system


Hi Randyman / Kafla - apologies for the extremely late response.

Im using an Alpine W928r navi headunit. Since this was done by an installer, im unsure about what was connected where, however it should have been done as per wiring instructions. There are 2 amps (mono and 4 channel) connected to the H800. Both HU and amps are connected via RCA (not AI-NET) Tweets and mids are off channel 1 & 2 on H800, mid bass off channel 3 & 4 and 1 sub off channel 8.

Have you noticed any of this hum/buzz/floornoise in the background get progressively louder as you increase the volume past -37db on the RUX controller?

PS: Ive been using the RUX controller for volume and kept the HU volume on 14....no issues, only problem is that floor noise when turning it up past -37db Ive also done the software upgrade on both the H800 and RUX to V1.1 and no help.


----------



## fahadco80

Hi Guys,

Sorry for the very noob question, I did not buy the DSP yes, but would like to know how to connect the sub off channel 8 only? cause most of amps has two inputs, so how to connect one channel coming from the DSP to the sub amp?

Is it still going to work? or there is a specific amp that can take only one channel?

Regards

Fahad


----------



## No.23

Hi Kaflam

HU to H800 via RCA to channel 1 & 2. RUX to H800 via supplied plug. 1 x 4 channel amp connected to H800 via channels 1 - 4 and 1 mono amp used on channel 8. 

As for the wiring into the HU and H800 harness, im assuming its wired as per instructions (had an installer wire it up)


----------



## fahadco80

No.23 said:


> Hi Kaflam
> 
> HU to H800 via RCA to channel 1 & 2. RUX to H800 via supplied plug. 1 x 4 channel amp connected to H800 via channels 1 - 4 and 1 mono amp used on channel 8.
> 
> As for the wiring into the HU and H800 harness, im assuming its wired as per instructions (had an installer wire it up)



Do you have to split the 8th channel with Y RCA to the mono amp?


----------



## Kriszilla

fahadco80 said:


> Do you have to split the 8th channel with Y RCA to the mono amp?


Depends on the amp. Some internally sum the L/R inputs and some don't.


----------



## fahadco80

Kriszilla said:


> Depends on the amp. Some internally sum the L/R inputs and some don't.


Great 

Thanks


----------



## CZ Eddie

I've got the PXA-H800 on the way soon.

I'll be using 7" midbass in my doors and 3" full range on each end of my dash.

My question here is, how important will the center channel speaker be? I'm thinking of making it the same 3" full range as my dash speakers to keep the "voicing" the same.
But I do have the option to go up to 5" in speaker size and even add a tweeter next to it. 

I'll be listening to two channel music, mostly 60's through current generation rock'n'roll, some jazz and _occasionally _dubstep type material.

I do not plan to watch movies in my car and kind of doubt I'll ever put multi-channel audio into the mix.


----------



## CZ Eddie

Going to buy my speakers on Sunday so hopefully someone can chime in with their center channel opinion by tomorrow.


----------



## DLO13

If you are tuning for single seat, I think you could pass on the center chan. 
If you do go center, I would stick to the same driver.


----------



## CZ Eddie

Great, thanks for the suggestion!


----------



## yoshiki

so far read until page 11 of this thread, but i think i shall ask a question if you guys don't mind assisting me. 
I recently bought H800 and C800. 
what i did not realise is, it didn't come with the calibration microphone. 
Could i purchase 1 instead? how do i connect it?


----------



## quality_sound

I'm sure you can but it's a waste of time. Alpine's algorithm sucks. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## CZ Eddie

yoshiki said:


> so far read until page 11 of this thread, but i think i shall ask a question if you guys don't mind assisting me.
> I recently bought H800 and C800.
> what i did not realise is, it didn't come with the calibration microphone.
> Could i purchase 1 instead? how do i connect it?


My H800 and C800 are still in shipping to me and I have not read the thread yet.

This pic of an H800 for sale shows that it comes with a mic?
PXA-H800 - Alpine Imprint Audio Processor

This eBay auction is selling what it claims to be the H800 microphone.
Alpine PXA H800 PXAH800 Genuine Microphone Pay Today Ships Today | eBay

The mic appears to connect via 3.5mm audio jack.


----------



## BlackHHR

It plugs directly into the processor next to the rca inputs. But as noted above, it is not the best at tuning your system with.


----------



## CZ Eddie

Confirmed on page nine of this thread:



Alpine's Audio Engineer - Jim Walter said:


> The Mic comes with the H800 and plugs into the H800 itself


----------



## yoshiki

quality_sound said:


> I'm sure you can but it's a waste of time. Alpine's algorithm sucks.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk





CZ Eddie said:


> My H800 and C800 are still in shipping to me and I have not read the thread yet.
> 
> This pic of an H800 for sale shows that it comes with a mic?
> PXA-H800 - Alpine Imprint Audio Processor
> 
> This eBay auction is selling what it claims to be the H800 microphone.
> Alpine PXA H800 PXAH800 Genuine Microphone Pay Today Ships Today | eBay
> 
> The mic appears to connect via 3.5mm audio jack.





BlackHHR said:


> It plugs directly into the processor next to the rca inputs. But as noted above, it is not the best at tuning your system with.





CZ Eddie said:


> Confirmed on page nine of this thread:


thanks for the quick replies. 
so what would be a better method to tune the system? 

Thanks everyone.


----------



## BlackHHR

yoshiki said:


> thanks for the quick replies.
> so what would be a better method to tune the system?
> 
> Thanks everyone.


A good place to start is with a RTA and a pink noise track.


----------



## kameraguy

Hi Guys,

After struggling with getting midbass to sound right with the MS8, I have switched to a PXA-H800/RUX-C800 system. 

I have an '08 Subaru Forester. Two-way Focal components up front, two-way Focal rear fill (all using stock speaker locations), and one JL subwoofer in a custom sealed enclosure in the rear. Headunit is a Pioneer 4100NEX, and Amp is a JL XD 700/5 powering all speakers.

I am still getting used to using sound manager and getting a good imprintEQ tune. Last night was my closest yet, and so far things sound much better than I ever was able to achieve with the MS8.

If you don't mind, I have a few hopefully easy questions please:

1) in sound manager, is Auto TCR needed if I do imprintEQ? Or does imprintEQ make TCR adjustments, negating the need for Auto TCR?

2) for RoadEQ, I see there are different levels. So far I have tuned RoadEQ to the location where my mic will reside and set that for level 1. How do you guys suggest tuning for the other level settings?

3) for those that use RoadEQ, what are your thoughts? So far I seem to prefer it on when driving, as everything seems clearer, but it seems the highs are boosted, and the overall volume raised a lot. I have to listen more to what things sound like without RoadEQ at the same volume level I guess.

4) I am just struggling to get the bass blending to sound convincingly coherent with the rest of the speakers. As it stands, I can slightly tell it is more rear-biased sounding from the front seats. This seems to be the last piece to the puzzle in my case. Any ideas/suggestions on how to improve subwoofer blending?

Thank you!


----------



## CZ Eddie

Just set up a PXA-H800 and a RUX on a test bench connected to my PC.
I'm using Optical input coming from a USB DAC on my PC.
I get audio out of channels 1-6 but no audio coming from 7/8 which are my center and subwoofer channels?
These are each on two different amps, which rules out the amp itself as the issue.
I do have the audio configuration set to F-2way+R+C+SW (5.1ch system).

Skimmed through the manual but didn't see anything right off the bat. Any ideas?

*EDIT:* I dunno what I did but it's all working now. 
I turned it on/off and swapped a cable and changed an amp crossover to full-range and somewhere along the line both channels started to work.
Though I did loose the Alpine's channel 7 RCA sleeve due to a too-tight-fitting RCA cable. Ugh.


----------



## Rapture333

kameraguy said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> After struggling with getting midbass to sound right with the MS8, I have switched to a PXA-H800/RUX-C800 system.
> 
> I have an '08 Subaru Forester. Two-way Focal components up front, two-way Focal rear fill (all using stock speaker locations), and one JL subwoofer in a custom sealed enclosure in the rear. Headunit is a Pioneer 4100NEX, and Amp is a JL XD 700/5 powering all speakers.
> 
> I am still getting used to using sound manager and getting a good imprintEQ tune. Last night was my closest yet, and so far things sound much better than I ever was able to achieve with the MS8.
> 
> If you don't mind, I have a few hopefully easy questions please:
> 
> 1) in sound manager, is Auto TCR needed if I do imprintEQ? Or does imprintEQ make TCR adjustments, negating the need for Auto TCR?
> 
> 2) for RoadEQ, I see there are different levels. So far I have tuned RoadEQ to the location where my mic will reside and set that for level 1. How do you guys suggest tuning for the other level settings?
> 
> 3) for those that use RoadEQ, what are your thoughts? So far I seem to prefer it on when driving, as everything seems clearer, but it seems the highs are boosted, and the overall volume raised a lot. I have to listen more to what things sound like without RoadEQ at the same volume level I guess.
> 
> 4) I am just struggling to get the bass blending to sound convincingly coherent with the rest of the speakers. As it stands, I can slightly tell it is more rear-biased sounding from the front seats. This seems to be the last piece to the puzzle in my case. Any ideas/suggestions on how to improve subwoofer blending?
> 
> Thank you!


1) When you run ImprintEQ, it automatically adjusts for time correction, and in my experience it is more accurate than just AutoTCR alone. Also, be sure to tune for the side your steering wheel is on, don't tune for All, tune for Front Left or Front Right. Oh, and make sure wherever your tuning is completely quiet! Remember, if you can hear it, so can the microphone! If you are in the city it is best to tune at night where noone is driving around.

2 and 3) Personally I'm not a big fan of RoadEQ, although it might work for you. I find that it equalizes the audio in ways that aren't exactly ideal for the audio. I wouldn't use it all thw time if you do, maybe on long highway drives, personally I just drown out road noise with the volume knob.

4) How are your subs time aligned? If they are the furthest speakers away from you, they should be at 0.00ms. My front stage is at 17-19ms and the subs are at 0, this gives the illusion of the subs coming from up front. Also what are your x' over settings? If your mids can handle it, crossover your subs at 40-50hz, if you have 6.5s crossover at 63-80hz. Set your subwoofers slope to 36db and your mids to 24db, I have found those to be the ideal crossover parameters for subs and mids. My personal system is tuned at 50hz with 24db slopes on the mids and 36db slopes on the subs. 

Good luck! Let us know your results.


----------



## CZ Eddie

Dammit, the PXA-H800 was burning in on the bench and doing just fine.
I left, came back an hour later and my PC said it lost the USB connection.
Can't get it to turn back on no matter what I do. 
Damn thing is dead. 

Even tried removing it from the PC and powering it on via the RUX.

Sure do hope Coast2Coast Audio honors the one-year warranty they advertise.


----------



## jnchantler

Unable to find a definitive answer to the following question:

I have my H800 fed via ainet from a CDA-9886. I lose volume control from the C800 which is fine, but I also lose the ability to change the input on the H800 and therefore theoretically I couldn't run a separate optical in from (for example my MacBookPro, or a Purei20.)

I also lose subwoofer control from both the headunit and the C800 controller.

Anyone else running this combo or having a similar problem that could give input? Thanks!


----------



## kustomkaraudio

jnchantler said:


> Unable to find a definitive answer to the following question:
> 
> I have my H800 fed via ainet from a CDA-9886. I lose volume control from the C800 which is fine, but I also lose the ability to change the input on the H800 and therefore theoretically I couldn't run a separate optical in from (for example my MacBookPro, or a Purei20.)
> 
> I also lose subwoofer control from both the headunit and the C800 controller.
> 
> Anyone else running this combo or having a similar problem that could give input? Thanks!


I think I a saw in one of the manuals something about updating the proc and rux to ver 2.1 that it will bring sub control back.


Have you checked that the AI net input is turned on in the I/O set up menu ?

Aux 1 is the only input that cannot be turned on and off, but if a input is turned on in set up, you should be able cycle through sources on the RUX and select it. 


I guess I should say that its been a long time since I actually used one of these with AI net connection....


----------



## abarahona

Hi, my rux-c800 display the message "p-off" when I start the unit. Do you know why did happen?


----------



## Socalstangman

Can I run a 3 way active front speaker set-up?


----------



## seafish

07maximan said:


> Can I run a 3 way active front speaker set-up?


Yes…the H800 is good for 8 channels.


----------



## kaflam

07maximan said:


> Can I run a 3 way active front speaker set-up?


For that porpouse, this is one of your best choices to run active 3-way setup


----------



## james2266

07maximan said:


> Can I run a 3 way active front speaker set-up?


As others have said above, yes, this processor can do 3 way active front with sub BUT you have to cheat a little. Choose the option of 2 way front, rears and sub and make the rears your midrange. 

This little tip brought to you by our friendly Jon... Give yourself a pat on the back man.


----------



## Socalstangman

james2266 said:


> As others have said above, yes, this processor can do 3 way active front with sub BUT you have to cheat a little. Choose the option of 2 way front, rears and sub and make the rears your midrange.
> 
> This little tip brought to you by our friendly Jon... Give yourself a pat on the back man.


Lol, thanks man. I was starting to read all this and I was getting confused. I thought I read that about using the rears but I wasnt completely sure. Thanks again.


----------



## james2266

07maximan said:


> Lol, thanks man. I was starting to read all this and I was getting confused. I thought I read that about using the rears but I wasnt completely sure. Thanks again.


np, have fun. Takes a while to get the sound you want. I am just waiting to get my midrange/tweet amp repaired and then I can get down to tuning again too.


----------



## kustomkaraudio

james2266 said:


> As others have said above, yes, this processor can do 3 way active front with sub BUT you have to cheat a little. Choose the option of 2 way front, rears and sub and make the rears your midrange.
> 
> This little tip brought to you by our friendly Jon... Give yourself a pat on the back man.


Hey James, I was a bit confused by what you said, but System #2 in the output select menu is 3 way front + sub. I think would be the ticket, unless I'm missing something ?


----------



## james2266

kustomkaraudio said:


> Hey James, I was a bit confused by what you said, but System #2 in the output select menu is 3 way front + sub. I think would be the ticket, unless I'm missing something ?


Yes, you would think. Try it and you'll find that you only have one eq for both your midrange and tweeters. If you choose 2 way front, rears and sub you will have eq for all of your speakers. Well, your tweeters and midbass will be on one eq but that's fine as the bands are far enough apart. I hope that makes sense.


----------



## Kriszilla

james2266 said:


> Yes, you would think. Try it and you'll find that you only have one eq for both your midrange and tweeters. If you choose 2 way front, rears and sub you will have eq for all of your speakers. Well, your tweeters and midbass will be on one eq but that's fine as the bands are far enough apart. I hope that makes sense.


Rep added. I'll be redoing my tune tomorrow. Thanks, mang.


----------



## kustomkaraudio

Gotcha, same as the old 701 trick


----------



## james2266

Kriszilla said:


> Rep added. I'll be redoing my tune tomorrow. Thanks, mang.


np, and good luck. Waiting for my 2nd amp to be repaired and then I'll be joining you - so to speak


----------



## hot9dog

Ive looked thru this whole thread and still have questions.
Currently have the PXA H800 with RUX controller, optical input from head unit.
This is my first H800, but not my first processor... so have been going thru a small learning curve with it- but im feeling confident with it now. 
MY QUESTION:
Im not getting much output out of the processor, I have the gains turned up pretty high (more than half way) on both of my amps in order to get any decent volume. The amps aren't clipping- but I feel I shouldn't have to turn the gains up so high- my spidey senses are tingling over this one. Am I missing something here- or is this normal with using optical with this processor. any help from this community would be greatly appreciated!


----------



## papasin

hot9dog said:


> Ive looked thru this whole thread and still have questions.
> 
> Currently have the PXA H800 with RUX controller, optical input from head unit.
> 
> This is my first H800, but not my first processor... so have been going thru a small learning curve with it- but im feeling confident with it now.
> 
> MY QUESTION:
> 
> Im not getting much output out of the processor, I have the gains turned up pretty high (more than half way) on both of my amps in order to get any decent volume. The amps aren't clipping- but I feel I shouldn't have to turn the gains up so high- my spidey senses are tingling over this one. Am I missing something here- or is this normal with using optical with this processor. any help from this community would be greatly appreciated!



You can add 10 db output on all channels except the sub. Go to output level and as each channel is playing the hiss, increase output +10 on all channels you will be using.


----------



## james2266

papasin said:


> You can add 10 db output on all channels except the sub. Go to output level and as each channel is playing the hiss, increase output +10 on all channels you will be using.


I have never been lucky enough to run optical into this processor but I have absolutely never had any issues with output. Actually I have had to turn down the gains on my amps with this one and not by a little bit either. It was especially noticeable with the sub channel. Maybe with Optical you do need that extra and maybe that is why Alpine has included this feature that Richard is talking about. Good to know for future for me if I ever do try out the optical with it.


----------



## hot9dog

papasin said:


> You can add 10 db output on all channels except the sub. Go to output level and as each channel is playing the hiss, increase output +10 on all channels you will be using.


Im still kinda new to the H800 but im not seeing anywhere to raise the levels on any menu screen. I see a level setting in the input menu, but its only for the AUX input, the digital input has no option for level setting in this menu.


----------



## papasin

hot9dog said:


> Im still kinda new to the H800 but im not seeing anywhere to raise the levels on any menu screen. I see a level setting in the input menu, but its only for the AUX input, the digital input has no option for level setting in this menu.



Func->Multi Ch. Setup->Output Level


----------



## DLO13

papasin said:


> Func->Multi Ch. Setup->Output Level


this guy and his 6 second preset creation...


----------



## hot9dog

papasin said:


> Func->Multi Ch. Setup->Output Level


very cool!!! thank you sir!!!!!


----------



## jtaudioacc

hot9dog said:


> very cool!!! thank you sir!!!!!


you can jack up the PCM level too.


----------



## papasin

jtaudioacc said:


> you can jack up the PCM level too.


And PL2, but I didn't want it to get too confusing.


----------



## hot9dog

Ok i raised the level in the output menu and the PCM also....... it worked great! Thank you gentleman. ... i owe you a drink. The gains are turned down on my amps now and they sound MUCH better. Im a happy boy now.


----------



## reath1

Ok guys, a little help here. I am running a DNX891HD into the AUX on the H800 with a 2 channels. I then have the outputs on the 800 set using System 3 as I have tweets, mids, mid bass and rear fill. What I'm having trouble with is I'm not seeing 31 bands of GEQ PER channel. I'm only seeing 31 bands left and right. What am I missing?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## nineball76

Need to unlink the channels.


----------



## reath1

I did un-link them. That's how I got 31 for each channel left and right. I was under the understanding that there were 31 for EACH speaker. Is that not true?


----------



## Golden Ear

reath1 said:


> I did un-link them. That's how I got 31 for each channel left and right. I was under the understanding that there were 31 for EACH speaker. Is that not true?


Nope, for all channels.


----------



## subwoofery

Lots of forum questions can be answered by reading the manual... 

Heck, I even read the manual *BEFORE* buying the product... 

Kelvin


----------



## reath1

I've read the manual several times. The manual appeared to state as I am finding it. Reading posts is where I got the idea that there were 31 bands per speaker.

Thanks


----------



## nineball76

subwoofery said:


> Lots of forum questions can be answered by reading the manual...
> 
> Heck, I even read the manual *BEFORE* buying the product...
> 
> Kelvin



But that's no fun. I doesn't stir up thoughts and questions like discussion does


----------



## papasin

reath1 said:


> Ok guys, a little help here. I am running a DNX891HD into the AUX on the H800 with a 2 channels. I then have the outputs on the 800 set using System 3 as I have tweets, mids, mid bass and rear fill. What I'm having trouble with is I'm not seeing 31 bands of GEQ PER channel. I'm only seeing 31 bands left and right. What am I missing?
> 
> Thanks in advance.





reath1 said:


> I did un-link them. That's how I got 31 for each channel left and right. I was under the understanding that there were 31 for EACH speaker. Is that not true?





reath1 said:


> I've read the manual several times. The manual appeared to state as I am finding it. Reading posts is where I got the idea that there were 31 bands per speaker.
> 
> Thanks


H800 is 31-band GEQ L/R front, 31-band GEQ L/R rear, 31-band GEQ center, 10-band GEQ sub(s).

As mentioned, if you're running 3-way front + sub(s), a way to configure for that set up is 2-way front, rear-fill, sub(s) but put the mids on the rear-fill channels and tweet and mid bass on the front channels, so you have plenty of bands to separate out mid bass and tweeter, and have full 31-band L/R for midrange, and then still 10-bands for sub(s).

In your case, not knowing what your goals/intent with the rear-fill, perhaps another way to get more bands of EQ for your config is to set up your mid-basses as subs having separate 10-band L/R on them (depending on how low and narrow the bands you are planning to have your mid bass play), then have mids/tweets share 31-band L/R EQ, then rear-fill have separate 31-band L/R EQ and be able to utilize PL2 for the rear-fill. Just thinking out loud...


----------



## papasin

nineball76 said:


> But that's no fun. I doesn't stir up thoughts and questions like discussion does


Agree. And the manual doesn't talk about the trick James mentions in post #2751...where the first time I saw that was actually in "the secrets of 701 thread" that's over 5 years old but is still useful in the context of the H800. I've recently re-read that thread and applied some of those tricks and they work quite well. BigRed and Erin's first two posts in that thread are quite valuable.


----------



## Gary Ross

Hi Everyone,

Hi Folks,

I'm using a H800 and want to run my front 2 way component speakers a set of Focal 165 KRX2's What would be the best way to do away with the supplied Focal crossovers as would like to use the H800 to do all the adjustments.

Was looking at a 4 Chanel jlaudio amp 100rms per Chanel that runs at 2 0hms which matches the focal woofers but the tweeters alone are rated at 8 0hms each.

Will have the H800 setup for 2 way front (high and low) , centre which will be set to off, Rears set to On and sub set to on.

Also am I correct in thinking that adjustments from the H800 going to the Focal crossover would not be correct if I set the fronts to Full as they would only receive either a low signal or high signal from either set of the front Pre outs on the H800 going into the amp.


Any help would be greatly appreciated as I'm new to this.

Regards,

Gary


----------



## seafish

You will not use the Focal xo, but instead assign one channel of the H800 to each driver, then use the H800 to set the xo and all other parameters for that channel…that is just one of the advantages of "going active" versus using passive crossovers…you lose the passive xo.


----------



## Gary Ross

Thanks for reply Seafish.

What about the tweeters being 8 0hm and the amp being 2 0hm.

Will use a 4 chanel 2 0hm amp so 2 0hms ok for the woofers but will the other 2 chanel run the 8 0hm tweeters?

Regards,

Gary


----------



## seafish

Yes, a 2 ohm capable amp will run 8 ohm tweeters, though the 8ohm tweeters will be a little less loud then the 2 ohm woofers…but that is OK, because generally you want tweeter volume less then woofer volume to prevent shrillness or harshness. That being said, , rather then posting here in the H800 thread, you should probably post up a new "build advice" thread in the correct section to get MUCH more input and advice on what you want to do and keep your questions in this thread related directly to the H800.


----------



## Gary Ross

Thanks again.

Will start a new post in the relevant section.

One more question regarding amp gains, I take it that the gain for the tweeter chanel will have to be set a lot lower than the woofers as I'm guessing the won't need nearly as much power as the woofers?


----------



## seafish

Gary Ross said:


> Thanks again.
> 
> Will start a new post in the relevant section.
> 
> One more question regarding amp gains, I take it that the gain for the tweeter chanel will have to be set a lot lower than the woofers as I'm guessing the won't need nearly as much power as the woofers?


You will have to set the gain (or let the H800 imprint processing do it for you) based on the entire system tuning.


----------



## fcojav

hello my forum friends...

My installation is well advanced and will soon publish a complete set of photos of my equipments and settings to make a contribution for newbies. I still not could resolve ground noise or whatever it Sounded up there. I have all my system connected to same the ground, and never had this problem . I do not know what happens..

Sorry for my english. Regards from Chile


----------



## CZ Eddie

CZ Eddie said:


> Dammit, the PXA-H800 was burning in on the bench and doing just fine.
> I left, came back an hour later and my PC said it lost the USB connection.
> Can't get it to turn back on no matter what I do.
> Damn thing is dead.
> 
> Even tried removing it from the PC and powering it on via the RUX.
> 
> Sure do hope Coast2Coast Audio honors the one-year warranty they advertise.


Just to update this thread, *Coast2Coast *did honor their advertised one-year warranty on the PXA-H800, even though they are not an "authorized dealer".


----------



## Tnutt19

Does anyone know if Alpine ever released H800 software for Mac? I know they made available for win7 but curious about mac?


----------



## Tnutt19

fcojav said:


> hello my forum friends...
> 
> My installation is well advanced and will soon publish a complete set of photos of my equipments and settings to make a contribution for newbies. I still not could resolve ground noise or whatever it Sounded up there. I have all my system connected to same the ground, and never had this problem . I do not know what happens..
> 
> Sorry for my english. Regards from Chile


No debe tener ruido así. Que pasa si quitas el H800, todavía hay ruido malo?


----------



## papasin

Tnutt19 said:


> Does anyone know if Alpine ever released H800 software for Mac? I know they made available for win7 but curious about mac?



No, although I run the Alpine, Mosconi, RF software on my Mac all with VMWare and they all work perfectly.


----------



## CZ Eddie

I've got my replacement PXA-H800 burning-in again on my test bench.
Anyone know how to enable the center channel? I mean, in the speaker setup I have it turned on. But when I play music, I only get the other four channels playing (front highs, front lows, rear and sub). 

When I use the mic to setup sound, I do hear test sounds coming out of the center channel, but that's the only time.

*EDIT:* I forgot that you have to enable Dolby ProLogic II. Now that I've done that, I get all five channels playing with my two-channel test MP3.


----------



## reath1

I've been pretty deep into this thing for a few weeks now and, maybe it's just me, but the software seems pretty weak compared to Helix....


----------



## CZ Eddie

I haven't dug into it a whole lot yet and have no Helix experience.
But yeah, this software blows.
Hope Alpine revamps it soon.


----------



## peekeesh

Regarding auto tune, is there any difference between using the setup CD vs using the unit produce the tones? which one is better?

Also, i tried to do auto tune w/o the CD but for some reason, the first measurement doesn't even finish and takes forever. I hear signals coming from front left/right speakers but can barely hear the subs. I have properly set the amp gains using a portable oscilloscope. The sub is very audible when listening to music so i'm not sure what's going on. Anyone has any ideas what's wrong and what to check?


----------



## brumledb

So has anyone actually tried running a 3-way front, center, and sub with this? I know it is not one of the setup options and people have proposed using 2-way front+Rears+Center+Sub with the midbass or midrange set as the rears. But I have not read where anyone actually said they did it and the midbass or midrange did not suffer because of signal steering.


----------



## Gary Ross

Hi,

Anyone know if the H800 has a built in memory to retain settings should the processor be disconnected or battery in vehicle goes flat.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Grindcore

Gary Ross said:


> Hi,
> 
> Anyone know if the H800 has a built in memory to retain settings should the processor be disconnected or battery in vehicle goes flat.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


yeah it does...ive had to disconnect the battery a few times and when you turn on the ignition after disconnecting/flat battery choose one of your presets and then it will tell you to switch off ingition and turn back on it should recall saved data


----------



## Gary Ross

Thanks for reply.

However My H800 asks me to choose speaker system setup (ie 2way or 3 way etc) when its been disconnected or battery goes flat.

Any ideas?


----------



## spdmn75

Pretty sure you have to reselect the initial settings


----------



## fcojav

Hi forum friends!

It is possible to connect a center speaker to the PXA-H800 processor if the HU does not have RCA outputs for the center channel?


----------



## seafish

Yes…the H800 will derive the center channel from a two channel inout using its processing algorithms.


----------



## fcojav

seafish said:


> Yes…the H800 will derive the center channel from a two channel inout using its processing algorithms.


1.- Can i choose 5.1ch input system or must choose 4ch & 2ch ?
2.- center channel have independent crossover or is like rear channel?

Thanks


----------



## fcojav

As I promissed . Here is my audio system in my Mazda CX -9.
HU: Pioneer AVH - x8650bt ( carplay )
Front & rear speakers : Focal krx2
* center channel : soon
Subwoofer: kx27
Amplifier main voices : 4160 & highcaps focal fps
Rear amplifier voices focal fp4.75
subwoofer amplifier : JL Audio XD600 / 1
Audio Processor Alpine PXA - H800
Power & Ground wire: Gladen 0 AWG
Speakers wire: Gladen
Protective tube wire: Wire Klein Pro driver
Cable terminals : Gladen & Klein Pro


----------



## fcojav

All install Process:

























Soon screenshots pxa-h800 configuration 
Regards from Chile


----------



## fcojav

More pictures


----------



## swyner

Hi All. Been following for a while and have installed the C800 and P800 in my 2011 audi TTS. Here is my setup:

- passive 3-way fronts (focal) - this is fed one channel then to crossover that is fed 2 channels, one to woofer, one to mid/tweet (believe there is a capacitor between mid/tweet)
- center (bose stock)
- rear (bose Stock)
- sub (JL 10")

I have HD600/4 running front (2 channel) and sub
I have XD400/4 running rear (2 channel) and center

Is there a better way to setup my fronts without a whole lot of work? i.e. should I remove my rears and have active 2 way (woofer and mid/tweet) in front and skip the focal crossovers entirely? 

PXA is setup 4 channel input (front and rear RCA from OEM deck) and System 4 (5.1) output as I have 2 way fronts, rears, center and sub. If I want to keep the 2 amps but go more active out to fronts, I will have to remove my rears. Even though I still have 8 channel output (2 4-channel amps) I cannot split the sub and center right and left mono can I (on my JL amps)?


----------



## Lycancatt

personally I'd ditch the center and rears in that small of a car and just tune for a nice centered image going active, overall the sound will end up so much better.

xd400/4 bridged to midbasses.

600/4 running mid/tweeter on first channels and sub on 2nd channels, splits the demanding lower frequencies up between amps which imo is a good thing though not make or break.

you'd set the h800 up to do two way plus sub, meaning your only using five of its available channels but later if you add an hd750/1 you can play with rear fill.


----------



## swyner

Lycancatt said:


> personally I'd ditch the center and rears in that small of a car and just tune for a nice centered image going active, overall the sound will end up so much better.
> 
> xd400/4 bridged to midbasses.
> 
> 600/4 running mid/tweeter on first channels and sub on 2nd channels, splits the demanding lower frequencies up between amps which imo is a good thing though not make or break.
> 
> you'd set the h800 up to do two way plus sub, meaning your only using five of its available channels but later if you add an hd750/1 you can play with rear fill.


Thank you for the advise!! That's what I figured would work better in my small car. However, just played with EQ for a while and got the current setup to sound pretty damn good! Will ride around with that for a while then try your suggestion. Just for clarity, I would have Left and Right for front woofer going to XD as Left on channel 1 and right on channel 4 for example??


----------



## Lycancatt

you'd get some rca y cables and feet left to channels 1 and 2 and right to channels 3 and 4


----------



## swyner

One more question. How do you properly setup the gains on the AMPs before you run Imprint or other modifications....Obviously you shut off all processing on the amps so there are no filters but trying to figure out if there is a good way to set the gains....


----------



## JakeG37

swyner said:


> One more question. How do you properly setup the gains on the AMPs before you run Imprint or other modifications....Obviously you shut off all processing on the amps so there are no filters but trying to figure out if there is a good way to set the gains....


Setting the gains should be done with a SMD DD-1 (or DD-1+) or an oscilloscope (or something similar to those). You should ideally check for clipping coming off of your head unit (the RCA out or the inputs to your processor). You will want to set all of your balances, fades, treble, and bass on the head unit to a flat setting. Once you know the point of where your head unit clips, you will use this as your max volume to checking the clipping coming out of your processor. If you do not have a processor you will then check the clipping (distortion) coming out of your amplifier. While doing all of this, disconnect the speaker outputs from your amplifier. You will need a CD with test tones to do this. If you will be mainly using a source outside of your head unit (like an iPhone) you should rip the test tone CD's to MP3 and put them on your phone to do the calibrations. 

Your crossovers (whether on the amp or on your processor) should be set to pass all frequencies (in other words, no filtering). Once you get the amplifier gains set, then you would connect your speakers back up to the amplifier and set your crossovers to the proper settings for your system. This may sound like a difficult process but it really isn't. The biggest thing is having the tools to do it which can be expensive. You may just want to have a shop do it or find someone with the tools to help you. If you search on YouTube for Steve Meade Designs he has some great videos on how to do all of this. He uses the tools he helped design in those videos.


----------



## JakeG37

I have a question of my own regarding the crossovers on the PXA-H800. I have an Audison AV 5.1k amp with a built in crossover. I am running a fully active setup to Hertz Mille 280.3 Legend tweeters, Hertz HV165 XL midbass, and Hertz HX250D sub. It seems like I still have to setup the crossovers on the amp even though I set the crossover inside the DSP. I had turned all my filtering on the amp to pass all frequencies while setting my gains. Once I was done setting the gains, I set the crossovers in the DSP to my desired settings but the system sounded bad. It wasn't until I reset the amp to the original settings (done by the shop who installed it) that everything sounded as expected. Am I missing something here? I thought being fully active meant my DSP would do all my processing and just pass that through the amplifier without any additional filtering?


----------



## swyner

JakeG37 said:


> Setting the gains should be done with a SMD DD-1 (or DD-1+) or an oscilloscope (or something similar to those).  You should ideally check for clipping coming off of your head unit (the RCA out or the inputs to your processor). You will want to set all of your balances, fades, treble, and bass on the head unit to a flat setting. Once you know the point of where your head unit clips, you will use this as your max volume to checking the clipping coming out of your processor. If you do not have a processor you will then check the clipping (distortion) coming out of your amplifier. While doing all of this, disconnect the speaker outputs from your amplifier. You will need a CD with test tones to do this. If you will be mainly using a source outside of your head unit (like an iPhone) you should rip the test tone CD's to MP3 and put them on your phone to do the calibrations.
> 
> Your crossovers (whether on the amp or on your processor) should be set to pass all frequencies (in other words, no filtering). Once you get the amplifier gains set, then you would connect your speakers back up to the amplifier and set your crossovers to the proper settings for your system. This may sound like a difficult process but it really isn't. The biggest thing is having the tools to do it which can be expensive. You may just want to have a shop do it or find someone with the tools to help you. If you search on YouTube for Steve Meade Designs he has some great videos on how to do all of this. He uses the tools he helped design in those videos.


Thanks for the help!!! I guess to truly check the amp clipping I would still need the processor connected between the headunit and amps....this way I would leave my system as is and run the tests. Or is it better to remove the processor from the equation and go straight to Amp from Headunit to test??


----------



## JakeG37

swyner said:


> Thanks for the help!!! I guess to truly check the amp clipping I would still need the processor connected between the headunit and amps....this way I would leave my system as is and run the tests. Or is it better to remove the processor from the equation and go straight to Amp from Headunit to test??


You don't need to remove the DSP, you just need to null out any equalization (make it flat) and set the frequency filtering to max (pass all freqs). The idea behind finding the clipping of the head unit is to make sure you don't introduce distortion before you get to the DSP,then from the DSP to the amp. The amplifier does just what it says, amplifies, whether its clean or distorted sound. Distortion damages speakers and sounds like crap. So you check the clipping at all stages to make sure you give the strongest signal to your components without distorting.


----------



## JakeG37

Oh, and to clarify, distortion and clipping are often used interchangeably but they are different. You can set clipping with an oscilloscope (when the sign wave starts to square off, that is clipping) but that doesn't mean you don't have distortion. That is why a tool like the SMD DD-1 is the better option. There is also something called overlap when setting your gains. You find the gain level where distortion lights up the DD-1 and then switch tracks to an overlap tone. With the DD-1+ you then push the read button which will show you a dB level. For a sub, +10dB should be fine, but you should not go much higher than +3dB for the tweeters. Mid-bass will fall somewhere in between your tweeters/sub. You set the dB level by bumping the gain on each channel until you reach the desired level.


----------



## BlackHHR

Can you not bury the amps gains and use the processors level controls ?


----------



## JakeG37

BlackHHR said:


> Can you not bury the amps gains and use the processors level controls ?


I would imagine that would be a horrible idea. Someone might chime in on an exact reason for that but I would not go that route.


----------



## BlackHHR

Not being a chit head head here. Please do not take it that way. But I have to ask if you have one of these processors or any of the current processors available at this level?
Setting gains as you described works very well if the noise floor is of little concern. 
Once again I am not being arrogant, 
The H800 has enough gain structure in the I/O menu to get the desired output from the amplifiers. Also you have more output control in the cross over section if you need more voltage into the amps. 
Tapping into the digital section of a processor for gain structure is far better than the analog section of an amp. 
SMD technique is not optimal for a sq system, you will encounter floor noise when you raise the gain levels to just below amp clipping. 
I may be totally wrong, but i am very satisfied with the results from the way I was taught to tune high performance systems.


----------



## JakeG37

BlackHHR said:


> Not being a chit head head here. Please do not take it that way. But I have to ask if you have one of these processors or any of the current processors available at this level?
> Setting gains as you described works very well if the noise floor is of little concern.
> Once again I am not being arrogant,
> The H800 has enough gain structure in the I/O menu to get the desired output from the amplifiers. Also you have more output control in the cross over section if you need more voltage into the amps.
> Tapping into the digital section of a processor for gain structure is far better than the analog section of an amp.
> SMD technique is not optimal for a sq system, you will encounter floor noise when you raise the gain levels to just below amp clipping.
> I may be totally wrong, but i am very satisfied with the results from the way I was taught to tune high performance systems.


Well if you have all the answers then what was the point of your question? I dont claim to be an expert, I have done a lot of reading and talking to knowledgeable people. You will find many different trains of thought on this subject and its not to say any of them are by themselves completely right, or wrong. To answer your question though, yes, I have the PXA-H800 and the controller. I am still trying to figure it out and thats why I asked the question regarding the crossover on my amp since it seems to affect the crossover frequencies while the DSP doesnt seem to yield the results I expected. If you can offer some insight to that, great. I am all ears. I will be switching DSP's once the new Bit One HD is released and I will be all digital once that happens.


----------



## swyner

What is the best OUTPUT selection for the PXA-H800 if I want to run 3 way active front, sub and rear? I found out I actually have 3 way fronts in my Audi that have 3 separate channels (not low plus mid/high crossed over). From reading the manual, it's only possible to do front 2 way, rears and sub, not front 3 way. Any advice? I suppose one solution would be to use my Focal passive 3 way crossover and input the mid and output the mid and tweet so I effectively have a 2 way active coming from the amp.....midbass and mid/tweet being the 2 channels. Thoughts? The reason why I want to get rear channel is to allow my to use some of the DSP (rear fill, Euphony, etc) as those are not selectable without rear or center channel.

Edit......after I recounted the number of channels in 3 way, rear and sub, it's more than 8, hence why I cannot do that!! Don't I feel stupid! HAHAHA. Maybe I will try the 2 way front with mid/tweet passively crossed over


----------



## Tnutt19

swyner said:


> What is the best OUTPUT selection for the PXA-H800 if I want to run 3 way active front, sub and rear? I found out I actually have 3 way fronts in my Audi that have 3 separate channels (not low plus mid/high crossed over). From reading the manual, it's only possible to do front 2 way, rears and sub, not front 3 way. Any advice? I suppose one solution would be to use my Focal passive 3 way crossover and input the mid and output the mid and tweet so I effectively have a 2 way active coming from the amp.....midbass and mid/tweet being the 2 channels. Thoughts? The reason why I want to get rear channel is to allow my to use some of the DSP (rear fill, Euphony, etc) as those are not selectable without rear or center channel.
> 
> Edit......after I recounted the number of channels in 3 way, rear and sub, it's more than 8, hence why I cannot do that!! Don't I feel stupid! HAHAHA. Maybe I will try the 2 way front with mid/tweet passively crossed over


You are reading correctly. To do a 3 way front, rear and sub you would need 9 channels. The 3 way front uses 6 channels, the rear passive would use 2 channels and the sub a single channel minimum.

You would need to either add a processor or do 2 way active front and use a passive crossover for the mid and tweeter, then do 2 way rear and sub. That would use 4 channels up front, 2 in the rear and 2 for sub.


----------



## swyner

Tnutt19 said:


> You are reading correctly. To do a 3 way front, rear and sub you would need 9 channels. The 3 way front uses 6 channels, the rear passive would use 2 channels and the sub a single channel minimum.
> 
> You would need to either add a processor or do 2 way active front and use a passive crossover for the mid and tweeter, then do 2 way rear and sub. That would use 4 channels up front, 2 in the rear and 2 for sub.


I thought I read somewhere you could set your front woofer as rear channel so you could use the multi channel options. Would this work?


----------



## Tnutt19

Not in a 3 way active set up no, the rear would have to be cut off to what ever you set the front up as, and T/A would get really funky


----------



## swyner

papasin said:


> H800 is 31-band GEQ L/R front, 31-band GEQ L/R rear, 31-band GEQ center, 10-band GEQ sub(s).
> 
> As mentioned, if you're running 3-way front + sub(s), a way to configure for that set up is 2-way front, rear-fill, sub(s) but put the mids on the rear-fill channels and tweet and mid bass on the front channels, so you have plenty of bands to separate out mid bass and tweeter, and have full 31-band L/R for midrange, and then still 10-bands for sub(s).
> 
> In your case, not knowing what your goals/intent with the rear-fill, perhaps another way to get more bands of EQ for your config is to set up your mid-basses as subs having separate 10-band L/R on them (depending on how low and narrow the bands you are planning to have your mid bass play), then have mids/tweets share 31-band L/R EQ, then rear-fill have separate 31-band L/R EQ and be able to utilize PL2 for the rear-fill. Just thinking out loud...





Tnutt19 said:


> Not in a 3 way active set up no, the rear would have to be cut off to what ever you set the front up as, and T/A would get really funky



This first quote above is what I was referring to. I assume that by setting up the 2-way front, rear and sub option, but actually having 3 way front and sub output, only the equalizer will be more "opened up". Any T/A or imprint will get whacked knowing the mids in the front of the car is driven by what the DSP thinks are rear...


----------



## Tnutt19

Yes exactly, also you would have to chose the same value for the front mid as the entire rear fill in that example. So if you are running a 2 way passive rear fill, you would have to cut it off higher then you want to and lower than you would want to. Your really wanting a 10 channel dsp. Not to mention giving up the T/A is a big loss.


----------



## Dantheman6490

You've simply outgrown ur processor my man ... Congrats .. On to a helix!! U won't be sorry


----------



## JakeG37

Can anyone recommend a replacement microphone to use for timing corrections? I tried tuning my DSP this weekend and every time I did it set the timing to max delay (20ms) for all the speakers. Luckily I had my old values written down so I manually input those back in and its sounds fine. I suspect something may have happened to my microphone as the microphone has a very tiny cable which might have gotten damaged from me pulling on it.


----------



## swyner

JakeG37 said:


> Can anyone recommend a replacement microphone to use for timing corrections? I tried tuning my DSP this weekend and every time I did it set the timing to max delay (20ms) for all the speakers. Luckily I had my old values written down so I manually input those back in and its sounds fine. I suspect something may have happened to my microphone as the microphone has a very tiny cable which might have gotten damaged from me pulling on it.


This is "normal" as it tries to make your sub closer to you and moves all the other speakers further away....it's been commented on quite a few times. Now, not sure ALL speakers should be 20ms but fairly close...mine is setup that way and the sound imaging is perfect front and center.


----------



## Dantheman6490

If u have the time and experience, do yourself a favor and don't use the mic... I've spent countless hours with all types of processors including the h800 and never had better results than tuning by ear... Yea I know it takes way longer but like they say "Rome wasn't built in a day"


----------



## JakeG37

Im not strong in the experience department with audio tuning. If I can measure things with test equipment and adjust settings while monitoring the change thats more in line with my expertise. Been an avionics technician for over 22 years. 

All I know is that the auto TCR is now way different with me trying to tune it the same way I did a couple of weeks ago. With the speakers at the max distance it sounds off. Is there a good audio file to use while trying to dial in the sound stage? Seeing how so many songs are mixed differently I cant imagine getting an accurate tune with random music. Thanks for the suggestions.


----------



## JakeG37

I played around with TA before I went in to work and noticed when adjusting my mid-bass I could hear the sound stage move around. Adjusting my tweeter timing didn't yield as noticeable results. Not sure if tweeters are harder to judge. I will be adding the ML700.3's in the next couple of weeks along with another amp which will round out my system. I currently have the tweeters mounted in a pod attached to the A-pillar and the ML700.3 mids will be in a pod mounted close to the factory location on the door. The pod for the mids will probably be modified to allow the mids to sound the way they should. The installer told me some process he will use to make a small hole in the back of the pod and use some fiberglass and something else to allow it to "breathe". He had a technical term for this but I forgot what it is. He is one of the top installers in the country so I will trust his methods. 

Currently my tweeters are crossed over at 3.2k @ 12dB, my mid-bass is 80-5k @ 12dB and my sub is at 20-80 @ 12dB. I imagine I will be putting my mids somewhere between 1k - 5k @ 12dB. Was reading about shaping the sound stage and crossover points can be adjusted to help shape it. It seems complicated for someone with little experience to find the balance between speaker placement (and where they are pointed), adjusting the crossovers, and changing the timing. Not to mention EQ adjustments on top of that.


----------



## captainobvious

The higher in frequency you go, the less that time alignment is going to help. Amplitude makes a much bigger difference for tweeters.


----------



## JakeG37

Why, thank you captainobvious! Sorry, couldnt help myself


----------



## fcarpio

Just got mine, waiting to have it delivered. Subbed.


----------



## Huckleberry Sound

Information!!!!


----------



## fcarpio

Find it for $506 @ Amazon.


----------



## lamprey

Howdy,

My H800 "freaked out" the other day. It started sending a test signal or something and I had to pull the power on it. It lost all the settings so, I did a recalibration. Everything seems to work as I remember except the time correction. When I try to do time correction I don't hear anything and after about 30 seconds it fails and says the output is too low to make an adjustment.

I'm guessing that the unit is damaged now, but wanted to check in to see if anyone might have a suggestion on anything I can double check before I try to replace the unit.

Cheers!


----------



## Dantheman6490

The alpine processor is one of the worst processors on the market... Especially for glitchy software issues ... Your much better off getting the Rockford fosgate 360.3 for the extra hundred bucks ... Or the audison bit one or the helix pro are outstanding .. Yes they are a little more expensive but they aren't even comparable to the ****tiness of the alpine and its inferior software


----------



## seafish

Dantheman6490 said:


> The alpine processor is one of the worst processors on the market... Especially for glitchy software issues ...


Wow, many users have ZERO problems with it…care to back that statement up with facts??


----------



## jtaudioacc

seafish said:


> Wow, many users have ZERO problems with it…care to back that statement up with facts??


and dan's 8th post he loses all credibility. lol j/k. well, not really. :laugh:


----------



## Coppertone

Yes I really tend to listen to someone who comes in out of the blue with facts such as he's presented. I wonder if he really works for Alpine and is using reverse psychology on himself lol.


----------



## Tnutt19

Dantheman6490 said:


> The alpine processor is one of the worst processors on the market... Especially for glitchy software issues ... Your much better off getting the Rockford fosgate 360.3 for the extra hundred bucks ... Or the audison bit one or the helix pro are outstanding .. Yes they are a little more expensive but they aren't even comparable to the ****tiness of the alpine and its inferior software


Alpine has been extremely reliable unit and my favorite stand alone unit. Rockford is junk, you talk about glitchy software and then suggest the Bitone in the same post, laughable... Those that have the H800 should feel very confident in having a great processor. And the software happens to be the most user friendly software out of the bunch and the commander is by far the best commander. 

What a silly post!!


----------



## Coppertone

I'm telling you I think he only posted because he was bored in the bathroom !


----------



## james2266

Tnutt19 said:


> Alpine has been extremely reliable unit and my favorite stand alone unit. Rockford is junk, you talk about glitchy software and then suggest the Bitone in the same post, laughable... Those that have the H800 should feel very confident in having a great processor. And the software happens to be the most user friendly software out of the bunch and the commander is by far the best commander.
> 
> What a silly post!!


Another very happy Alpine H800 user here. Went from the HHHIIISSSSS ONe to the 6to8 to this and this is the most stable, user friendly and has virtually the only commander that gives virtually full control of the unit. About the only unit I would consider in its place on the market right now would be the Helix PRO unit and that is mainly due to the 2 extra channels. Very versatile too.


----------



## BlackHHR

Dantheman6490 said:


> The alpine processor is one of the worst processors on the market... Especially for glitchy software issues ... Your much better off getting the Rockford fosgate 360.3 for the extra hundred bucks ... Or the audison bit one or the helix pro are outstanding .. Yes they are a little more expensive but they aren't even comparable to the ****tiness of the alpine and its inferior software


I have to beg to differ with you. Not to start pointing fingers at processors, but I have been let down at finals by a Helix processor. I was not the only one, Julian Ridi and Larry Willicot had the same software issues.You could not give me one to use, I know better. 
We had a client last week "update the software" in his DSP PRO and lost all of his settings. He had not realized that the cross overs went flat and he toasted a SE 3 way kit. 

I use the H800, rock solid processor.


----------



## quality_sound

He must have his model number backwards. The 3Sixty.3 is terrible and the H800 is probably the most stable processor on the market. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Coppertone

I'm thinking he only posted to try and rile us up.


----------



## BlackHHR

Dantheman6490 said:


> The alpine processor is one of the worst processors on the market... Especially for glitchy software issues ... Your much better off getting the Rockford fosgate 360.3 for the extra hundred bucks ... Or the audison bit one or the helix pro are outstanding .. Yes they are a little more expensive but they aren't even comparable to the ****tiness of the alpine and its inferior software


Just checked, you guys are not in our dealer data base.


----------



## Coppertone

I've had NO complaints with mine...


----------



## Golden Ear

I have 3 vehicles with h800s and have had ZERO issues with all of them. Just sayin


Sent from my mind using telekinesis


----------



## Dantheman6490

I will promise u I didn't make that statement to upset anyone... And ur right I don't spent a lot of time making comments on this forum simply due to the fact that I don't have a lot of time to do so.. I've been a professional installer for 11 years and have dealt with several different processors from helix to audison to Rockford, jbl , and especially alpine... The store I work for is a flagship alpine store... I've spent countless hours on the phone with flagship staff about the software issues and limitations of the unit that alpine is definately aware of.. I'm happy to hear that it has taken good care of some people but I'm not speaking from a one time hiccup with the unit.. It has had consistent flaws since its release... Anyone who takes sound seriously enough to build an sq car will tell u the alpine simply doesn't compare to the Rockford 360.3, the helix pro, or the audison bit one ... Also anyone who says the Rockford piece is junk clearly hasn't used it


----------



## BlackHHR

OK, so you suggesting that we do what with our Alpine processors?


----------



## BlackHHR

Dantheman6490 said:


> I will promise u I didn't make that statement to upset anyone... And ur right I don't spent a lot of time making comments on this forum simply due to the fact that I don't have a lot of time to do so.. I've been a professional installer for 11 years and have dealt with several different processors from helix to audison to Rockford, jbl , and especially alpine... The store I work for is a flagship alpine store... I've spent countless hours on the phone with flagship staff about the software issues and limitations of the unit that alpine is definately aware of.. I'm happy to hear that it has taken good care of some people but I'm not speaking from a one time hiccup with the unit.. It has had consistent flaws since its release... Anyone who takes sound seriously enough to build an sq car will tell u the alpine simply doesn't compare to the Rockford 360.3, the helix pro, or the audison bit one ... Also anyone who says the Rockford piece is junk clearly hasn't used it


What store do you work at ?
The Stereo shop in Mount Pleasant PA 

Alpine


----------



## Coppertone

I'm not bashing you, but it's really hard to come on here and blast what several sq competition people use without facts. I don't compete but I have nothing but praise for my combination. Is it the best that I've ever own, yes and I would buy another if I needed. I'm not putting down other processors because what may work for me, may not work for you. Please feel free to post pictures and or full disclosure of your personal vehicle install. I for one always welcome fact based thoughts.


----------



## quality_sound

There's only a few processors I'd run, a one of them is NOT the 3Sixty.3. PS8, 6to8, or H800 are it. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Dantheman6490

My intentions were not to ambush your thread with **** talking on your equipment. I couldn't agree more that what works for some is not ideal for others. Maybe I came off a little brash, and for that I apologize. Im happy to hear that you guys have had ideal success with your alpine product. Naturally as an alpine dealer, the pxa was my "go to" for several installs, but after so many issues (mostly with software) and limitations with input and outputs, I feel that for the little bit of extra money, there are a couple other processors that I (along with a lot of others in the competitive SQ world) feel are superior to what the Alpine has to offer. As I stated before, Im glad that those of you with a great overall experience are happy and have found a unit that your comfortable with and have given you everything your looking for. For my "ideal liking", I need more inputs and outputs on the unit to get the desired outcome for my clientel base. I use processors not only in the competitive world but also for those audiophile customers with high end cars that don't want to replace their head units for aesthetics and familiarity. Im not sure how many people have done installs on say a Bentley Mulsanne, or a Porsche panamera with already a "premium audio system" that just doesn't cut it, that's where I NEED the extra inputs and outputs, due to having to keep the factory amps/dsp's, that I cant get from the alpine. Also on 4 different occasions with all my crossovers and most tuning done, Ive had the units simply "disconnect" and reset all settings with no warning and smoke the tweeters in my customers cars. Alpine has admitted to me about their issues with the software being inconsistent and I get the " were working on it" speech. SO let me apologize for coming off the way I did initially, I never wanted to be "that guy" who thinks he knows everything and is careless with his remarks. Im here to help where I can and learn from what you guys have to say also.


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## BlackHHR

What I find is very hard to understand is this. As a flagship dealer for Alpine, to come to a public forum and bash Alpines products. That is very good way to piss of the people who signs your pay check. 
You never know who is lurking around monitoring these forums.


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## Dantheman6490

Alpine doesn't sign my paychecks, I also Gave an apology to those of whom Ive offended. I also am off the clock when Im on this forum so everything I say is my own personal opinion.


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## Dantheman6490

..and BlackHHR, even tho I put a sour taste in your mouth with my perspective on Alpine processors, I will commend you on your speaker and amplifer selection for your system design. nice choices. Not that my opinion means anything.


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## jtaudioacc

i don't think anyone was offended, just that your statements are silly, or funny, cause i definitely, LOL.


----------



## Huckleberry Sound

Wow....


----------



## seafish

Dan, thanks fro clarifying your earlier remarks…they DID appear trollish and not well thought out. It seems obvious that different DSPs have different software and/or hardware issues as well as strengths and weaknesses. For instance, I bought my H800 from a guy who liked it, but who could simplify not justify its user adjustbilty due to its C800 mounting location BEHIND him. Her just kinda picked the wrong unit for that particular install and now he is extremely happy with his RF 360.3. The Arc PS8 is extremely versatile except it does NOT have an onboard controller available for it. I really like my h800, though I DO also feel its preset system set-up options ARE in fact a system limitation that could have been easily mitigated on Alpines part. The lists and problems of diffent DSPs can go on and on , but that does NOT mean any one is inherently unusable or even unstable…too many H800 users here can testify otherwise. That begin said, I will guess that USER misunderstandings with the interface often cause the problems that you are talking, though obviously NOT all of them…sometimes software just hits bump in the road and Alpines calibration algorithms ARE complex I am sure so may not work correctly all the time as vehicle SQ insatlls are so individualistic and problematic that I am sure Alpine's tuning software cannot account for al the particulars problems it may find, let alsone the ones it does;t find due to user error of the mic and software. 

Anyway, just my .02,…again THANKS for clarifying your opinion….most everyone here appreciates THOUGHTFUL and FACTUAL input and as you just found out, many will NOT put up with anything but that.



Dantheman6490 said:


> My intentions were not to ambush your thread with **** talking on your equipment. I couldn't agree more that what works for some is not ideal for others. Maybe I came off a little brash, and for that I apologize. Im happy to hear that you guys have had ideal success with your alpine product. Naturally as an alpine dealer, the pxa was my "go to" for several installs, but after so many issues (mostly with software) and limitations with input and outputs, I feel that for the little bit of extra money, there are a couple other processors that I (along with a lot of others in the competitive SQ world) feel are superior to what the Alpine has to offer. As I stated before, Im glad that those of you with a great overall experience are happy and have found a unit that your comfortable with and have given you everything your looking for. For my "ideal liking", I need more inputs and outputs on the unit to get the desired outcome for my clientel base. I use processors not only in the competitive world but also for those audiophile customers with high end cars that don't want to replace their head units for aesthetics and familiarity. Im not sure how many people have done installs on say a Bentley Mulsanne, or a Porsche panamera with already a "premium audio system" that just doesn't cut it, that's where I NEED the extra inputs and outputs, due to having to keep the factory amps/dsp's, that I cant get from the alpine. Also on 4 different occasions with all my crossovers and most tuning done, Ive had the units simply "disconnect" and reset all settings with no warning and smoke the tweeters in my customers cars. Alpine has admitted to me about their issues with the software being inconsistent and I get the " were working on it" speech. SO let me apologize for coming off the way I did initially, I never wanted to be "that guy" who thinks he knows everything and is careless with his remarks. Im here to help where I can and learn from what you guys have to say also.


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## Dantheman6490

Glad I could bring a smile to a face


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## Coppertone

Trust me Dan I take no personal offense as you haven't directed it at me. What I was curious about was just facts backing up your statement. On that note again I would love to see/ read about your personal install. Not to bash it, but I'm always interested in seeing what others are doing with their vehicles.


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## Dantheman6490

My car was recently totaled parked on the side of the road ... I was able to save a couple Pieces of equipment from it but most was a total loss... As soon as I start a new build I will be posting the build log on here.. You can see some of my work on the NCSQ forum in jnorman5's 370z sq build


----------



## Coppertone

Dan sorry to hear about your car, my brand new delivered via flatbed Chevy truck was totaled. It was delivered on a Thursday evening in front of my house, Friday morning I drove my other truck and took my wife away for the weekend. Came back on Sunday and my Chevy truck was gone, come to find out that a trash truck slammed into it. Was towed away before I even had a chance to peel the plastic off of it.


----------



## gumbeelee

I personally love my h800 and I have used every processor out there except the rockford, which i wouldn't waste my time with personally, and I have yet to use the helix, but i know its a quality unit to say the least


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## Dantheman6490

Wow man that's AWEFUL... I can't say if it's worse that it was that new or maybe it was better that u didn't have a chance to grow an attachment to it... My situation was similar in the way of my car being parked in front of my house and about 3 minutes before my alarm went off for work I heard the sound of destruction ... Followed by the wife with a "uuummmm , someone just hit ur car".. Way to start the day off right


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## bbfoto

Dantheman6490 said:


> Also on 4 different occasions with all my crossovers and most tuning done, Ive had the units simply "disconnect" and reset all settings with no warning and smoke the tweeters in my customers cars.


I can certainly understand how this would make anybody riled-up enough to "bash" the offending piece of gear or the company that produces it. Smoking a few sets of expensive Morel Supremo/Piccolo or Gladen Aerospace tweeters can add up to big $$$ and very unhappy customers that will then think, "Hey man, you talked-up this DSP as if it were the greatest thing since sliced bread, so I bought it on your recommendation....and now it just smoked my effin' tweeters! You're a tool!" That doesn't make you or your shop look too good and you can be sure that this customer wouldn't feel great about referring you or your shop to others.

I haven't personally owned the H800 or used it in one of my installs, but I've used quite a few others and this can be a problem with just about ANY processor that is available. Plus, it can happen at any time just from accidental user error/brain farts even when the DSP and software don't have any issues whatsoever. Especially in a retail/shop environment, I would simply suggest to ALWAYS install "protection capacitors" on all tweeters when used with a DSP setup, or at least use the amplifier's built-in HPF if it has one. Generally you would want these to be 2 octaves below your DSP's HPF setting applied to the tweeters. No, this isn't a perfect or universal band-aid and may not save them in every situation, but it usually does.

I think that all DSP manufacturers should include one of those "STOP! Please read this to protect your Tweeters and Speakers" warning sheets of paper when you first open the box and/or a sticker on the DSP itself. They should also offer a certificate to send away for a FREE set of Protection Caps with the MFD value of your choice with each DSP purchase. 


EDIT: I want to add that in A LOT of circumstances it can be the user's actual Computer or Computer Configuration or setup that can cause the Software and USB connection issues and glitches! I really wish that DSP manufacturers would develop software for MAC OSX as well. It just seems to be a lot more consistent and stable for these types of things. I've experienced this with many pro audio digital recording interfaces. And this might be another good reason for manufacturers to move towards providing Mobile Apps for Smartphones and Tablets for the DSP setup and control.


----------



## jtaudioacc

bbfoto said:


> I think that all DSP manufacturers should include one of those "STOP! Please read this to protect your Tweeters and Speakers" warning sheets of paper when you first open the box and/or a sticker on the DSP itself. They should also offer a certificate to send away for a FREE set of Protection Caps with the MFD value of your choice with each DSP purchase.


you have to go into the software and turn off the default crossover for the tweeters on the H800.


----------



## bbfoto

jtaudioacc said:


> you have to go into the software and turn off the default crossover for the tweeters on the H800.


That's great, and smart on Alpine's part. But once you start making your own adjustments and/or if there is a power disconnection/USB cable disconnection/software glitch while tuning such as what Dan experienced, it doesn't do any good.  Or does it ALWAYS Default back to that setting under any of those circumstances???


----------



## jtaudioacc

bbfoto said:


> That's great, and smart on Alpine's part. But once you start making your own adjustments and/or if there is a power disconnection/USB cable disconnection/software glitch while tuning such as what Dan experienced, it doesn't do any good.


"if"


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## bbfoto

jtaudioacc said:


> "if"


Read my edited post above.

And I think that those "if" moments happen more often than we all realize.


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## seafish

Coppertone said:


> Dan sorry to hear about your car, my brand new delivered via flatbed Chevy truck was totaled. It was delivered on a Thursday evening in front of my house, Friday morning I drove my other truck and took my wife away for the weekend. Came back on Sunday and my Chevy truck was gone, come to find out that a trash truck slammed into it. Was towed away before I even had a chance to peel the plastic off of it.


Jeez...Sorry to hear that ...REALLY sucks. Maybe the other driver thought that you had an H800 installed in it?? 
SORRY couldnt help myself....needed to keep this post on topic.
JK ....really sucks!!!


----------



## Coppertone

Lol now that made me laugh, the good part is I ended up getting $8000 more then I paid for the truck.


----------



## BlackHHR

Dantheman6490 said:


> ..and BlackHHR, even tho I put a sour taste in your mouth with my perspective on Alpine processors, I will commend you on your speaker and amplifer selection for your system design. nice choices. Not that my opinion means anything.


You did not put a sour taste in my mouth. 
Moving on.


----------



## Dantheman6490

I'm not a big fan of Rockford fosgate product... so I can understand ur opinion on not feeling like u lost anything by not using it, but it is like nothing they've ever released... It's a great product and they've considered everything in their design of the unit.. It really is a great piece


----------



## JakeG37

Well I am pretty pleased with the performance of my H800 and I am pleased with the C800 also. The controller seems to offer a lot more control than other DSP's (Audison for example). That being said, I am currently looking to replace the H800 with the new Audison Bit One HD when it is released in Jan/Feb. The main reason is to go all digital with my Voce amps (5.1k and Due). Currently driving Hertz Mille 280.3's, Mille 700.3's, HV 165XL 6.5", and HX250D 10"sub in a 4080 sealed enclosure in my 2008 Infiniti G37S coupe. I have some questions about my tweeter/mid speaker placement but I will save that for my build thread.


----------



## Coppertone

I love what I have with my H800 & C800, but the Legacy is going with another transition for 2016. So out comes all of my Alpine gear, and I will be running all new dsp and controller....


----------



## nineball76

Anyone actually tried the h800 with a CarPC? I really don't want to use the C800. I know I read here that if not using a AI-Net head unit, that the controller was required. If that's absolutely the case I need to get rid of this Alpine and get a different processor.


----------



## gumbeelee

nineball76 said:


> Anyone actually tried the h800 with a CarPC? I really don't want to use the C800. I know I read here that if not using a AI-Net head unit, that the controller was required. If that's absolutely the case I need to get rid of this Alpine and get a different processor.


U have to use the rux-c800 unless u have an alpine deck with ai-net. If u don't have an alpine deck with ai-net or the rux controller u can't turn the pxa-h800 on. So u have to have the rux-c800 or buy an alpine deck with ai-net. If u have an alpine deck with ai-net u can make all of your adjustments with the h800 software via pc, the only thing u would not be able to do is make adjustments on the fly u have to have the rux controller for that. Good Luck!


----------



## nineball76

gumbeelee said:


> U have to use the rux-c800 unless u have an alpine deck with ai-net. If u don't have an alpine deck with ai-net or the rux controller u can't turn the pxa-h800 on. So u have to have the rux-c800 or buy an alpine deck with ai-net. If u have an alpine deck with ai-net u can make all of your adjustments with the h800 software via pc, the only thing u would not be able to do is make adjustments on the fly u have to have the rux controller for that. Good Luck!



Why does the h800 have a remote in then?


----------



## nineball76

I'll be using a CarPC. Always connected thru USB to make adjustments. The c800 offers nothing that I can't do with the CarPC. Volume control over digital.


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## nineball76

gumbeelee said:


> U have to use the rux-c800 unless u have an alpine deck with ai-net. If u don't have an alpine deck with ai-net or the rux controller u can't turn the pxa-h800 on. So u have to have the rux-c800 or buy an alpine deck with ai-net. If u have an alpine deck with ai-net u can make all of your adjustments with the h800 software via pc, the only thing u would not be able to do is make adjustments on the fly u have to have the rux controller for that. Good Luck!



And have you actually tried it or are you just going of what you read in this thread? I'm only asking those that have actually tried it.


----------



## gumbeelee

I have one, i currently use one. The reason it has remote in is so the h800 can turn on your amps. If u r not using an ai-net alpine unit it will not turn on. You have to use the rux controller to turn the h800 on when using an any deck except alpine with ai-net. Say u were using a kenwood deck, u could turn it on but it would not turn the h800 or your amps on. U have to use the rux controller to turn the h800 on and it turns your amps on. A pc will not turn the unit on u can just make adjustments with it. Sorry!!!


----------



## BlackHHR

Old Gumbeelee is on point with his assessment of the H800/C800. I have this same set up with a non AI Net head unit.


----------



## gumbeelee

BlackHHR said:


> Old Gumbeelee is on point with his assessment of the H800/C800. I have this same set up with a non AI Net head unit.


Take it from my man Greg, if he says it, it is as good as money in the bank!!


----------



## papasin

Let me see if I can assist. The way nineball is proposing I believe can work. Here's what I tried several years back and maybe gumbeelee and BlackHHR can also try it...

Non Ainet HU, h800 only (disconnect your rux), won't power on. However, plug in a laptop to it, launch the alpine software h800 will power on. Disconnect the laptop, it will power off. 

Nineball, are you planning on using the alpine software though for volume control with the carpc? The little slider of the software might be a bit of a pain, and why using a rux might still be a good idea. Just food for thought...


----------



## nineball76

Then screw Alpine. Have to use one or the other, cant use it stand alone. I bought a w910 to use with the h800, w910 was the biggest piece of crap I've ever used. Optical was only for CD. So the $100 alpine optical cable was a waste. Alpine and their terrible double dins is why I switched to CarPC to begin with. 

Anyone want a H800+C800 for$500 or trade for a PS8. I don't have the cable that connects the c800 to the h800, had to pull everything out of a vehicle before I traded it off and didn't have much time. Not at home so I can't get pics or set up a FS thread. But if someone had to have em, I can get my roommate to get em out for you.


----------



## nineball76

I loved the h800, but I'm not putting another screen in that I won't even use. Waste of dash space in a tiny car.


----------



## BlackHHR

Yes, Richard is correct. The H800 will power on when you plug into a PC and load the on screen widget.


----------



## gumbeelee

nineball76 said:


> I'll be using a CarPC. Always connected thru USB to make adjustments. The c800 offers nothing that I can't do with the CarPC. Volume control over digital.


just buy the rux-c800 controller and use the CarPc u will be happy u did. U can make quick adjustments with the rux controller, and u can still keep your CarPc.


----------



## BlackHHR

Educate me on the carpc for a moment. How do you control volume ? I honestly know nothing about them.


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## BlackHHR

Ben, that was quick!!


----------



## jtaudioacc

why not just stuff the C800 somewhere? if it's plugged in, and you send power to the H800, it turns on and off. you don't have to manually turn it on and off with the C800 every time.


----------



## papasin

The sense I get is nineball wants to use his carPC as an optical source into the H800, or for that matter any standalone DSP. The question is, does the carPC have a fixed optical output, or a variable one? If fixed, then an external controller or the DSP's software will be required to adjust volume. IMO, using Alpine's PC s/w for volume control would be a bit of a challenge since the slider UI isn't as easy to use as the RUX's volume knob. Switching to another DSP will likely pose similar challenges, even more challenging if the said DSP does not have an external controller readily available. My $0.02, and FWIW, I'm pretty happy with my W910 to H800, optical via CD, and AI-net with everything else and works very well for me...obviously, YMMV.


----------



## nineball76

BlackHHR said:


> Educate me on the carpc for a moment. How do you control volume ? I honestly know nothing about them.



Windows can control digital volume over optical. Optical, USB, and remote on are the only things that I'll need to run front to back. 

05 VW Golf. Car is tiny as it is, and I don't want to run the controller. I already have it, used it in a previous vehicle, don't like having all the extra pieces to fiddle with. The alpine software was easy enough, why mess with the controller to make adjustments that can be made right from the CarPC?


----------



## jtaudioacc

nineball76 said:


> Windows can control digital volume over optical. Optical, USB, and remote on are the only things that I'll need to run front to back.
> 
> 05 VW Golf. Car is tiny as it is, and I don't want to run the controller. I already have it, used it in a previous vehicle, don't like having all the extra pieces to fiddle with. The alpine software was easy enough, why mess with the controller to make adjustments that can be made right from the CarPC?


yeah, the controller is kinda big. no place to put it.


----------



## nineball76

papasin said:


> The sense I get is nineball wants to use his carPC as an optical source into the H800, or for that matter any standalone DSP. The question is, does the carPC have a fixed optical output, or a variable one? If fixed, then an external controller or the DSP's software will be required to adjust volume. IMO, using Alpine's PC s/w for volume control would be a bit of a challenge since the slider UI isn't as easy to use as the RUX's volume knob. Switching to another DSP will likely pose similar challenges, even more challenging if the said DSP does not have an external controller readily available. My $0.02, and FWIW, I'm pretty happy with my W910 to H800, optical via CD, and AI-net with everything else and works very well for me...obviously, YMMV.



And I understand, for most it probably is a superb unit. With a head unit I'm forced to use a ipod to carry my library, and Alpines iOS interface is terrible. Won't seek, half the library doesn't show up, and can't send a digital signal thru anyways so why waste time with a unit that's barely half as good as my previous Kenwood was. The w910 nav was horrendous. I don't carry CDs in the car. And the only way to get everything I wanted, a CarPC was the obvious choice. And volume truncation is a feature of Windows. That's control of the digital volume thru optical. 

Have you seen the dash in VW Golf? There's no room for a double din, plus a single din. 

I'm not in any way bashing the h800. As said before, I loved it and wish I could continue using it, but I don't want to have to use the controller. 
I have a helix pro that I'm deciding which vehicle it's going in. It may go in this car and I'll grab a P Six mk2 to run everything in the Dodge.


----------



## papasin

nineball76 said:


> Why does the h800 have a remote in then?





gumbeelee said:


> The reason it has remote in is so the h800 can turn on your amps. If u r not using an ai-net alpine unit it will not turn on. You have to use the rux controller to turn the h800 on when using an any deck except alpine with ai-net. Say u were using a kenwood deck, u could turn it on but it would not turn the h800 or your amps on. U have to use the rux controller to turn the h800 on and it turns your amps on. A pc will not turn the unit on u can just make adjustments with it. Sorry!!!


Let me take this one too just for the heck of it. Actually don't need the remote in when the h800 is hooked up to an ai-net HU. Mine isn't connected to anything, as the ai-net is what takes care of powering up the h800. I have my *remote out* hooked up to my amps, and that is used regardless of whether an AI-net HU or non AI-net HU is used to power on the amps.

The *remote in* is used for non AI-net HUs or for those who don't use a HU all together (JT and MrsPapasin for example) and I believe their remote ins are hooked up to ignition turn on, to tell the H800 to come back to the same state (on/off) provided the RUX is connected.

But as mentioned, if you don't want to use or need the RUX, you can stuff it somewhere (maybe glovebox or center console...heck, if it's really that tight, stuff it next to your h800). Even having an AI-net HU, I put the rux easily accessible in case I want to adjust something.


----------



## gumbeelee

papasin said:


> Let me take this one too just for the heck of it. Actually don't need the remote in when the h800 is hooked up to an ai-net HU. Mine isn't connected to anything, as the ai-net is what takes care of powering up the h800. I have my *remote out* hooked up to my amps, and that is used regardless of whether an AI-net HU or non AI-net HU is used to power on the amps.
> 
> The *remote in* is used for non AI-net HUs or for those who don't use a HU all together (JT and MrsPapasin for example) and I believe their remote ins are hooked up to ignition turn on, to tell the H800 to come back to the same state (on/off) provided the RUX is connected.
> 
> But as mentioned, if you don't want to use or need the RUX, you can stuff it somewhere (maybe glovebox or center console...heck, if it's really that tight, stuff it next to your h800). Even having an AI-net HU, I put the rux easily accessible in case I want to adjust something.


Papasin is correct, i have an alpine deck with ainet and my remote out is hooked up to my amps. The remote in is for non ainet units.


----------



## nineball76

I don't see any reason to stick with the Alpine over any other upper end processor that's out right now. It's a proprietary unit that the user is forced into buying at least one other piece of their gear to use. I can't stand by that. It offers nothing over Arc, Audison, Helix. The only thing it does that the others don't, selectable output voltage. Would've been nice since arc amps only can handle 3.5v in. Why their processor is 8v out, I'll never understand.


----------



## quality_sound

It does offer something the others don't, stability. Other than the Helix, I've owned every other good processor available and they ALL have quirks. Whether it be noise, dropping presets, locking up, whatever, the H800 doesn't do that. I'm sure there are faulty units out there but overall, nothing beats it for stability. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## fcarpio

If I only use the toslink input, does the signal get processed before or after the DAC?


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## kyheng

fcarpio said:


> If I only use the toslink input, does the signal get processed before or after the DAC?


H800 does not use DAC but using codecs(DAC, ADC together.


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## fcarpio

kyheng said:


> H800 does not use DAC but using codecs(DAC, ADC together.


Can you elaborate a little please? I don't understand.


----------



## Niick

Im so glad I found this thread!  

I will be working with a H800 in a couple days....I've been checking out the sound manager software to familiarize myself with the user interface. A couple things I'm not totally sure of.......

1: is the PEQ / GEQ an "either/or" type option or can they both be used simultaneously.
2: can each individual drive unit in a system with a fully active 2way front, rear coaxials, and mono subwoofer, be INDIVIDUALLY EQ'd? I can't seem to find a way to run, for example, the 10 band PEQ solely for the LEFT FRONT tweeter, and a COMPLETELY SEPERATE 10 band PEQ for the LEFT FRONT woofer. (of course the same for the right......)

It seems you can only EQ the left front CHANNEL as a whole. Is this correct? I've only worked with the software in demo mode so far......the car with the H800 won't the here for a couple days yet.


----------



## thehatedguy

A CODEC is an ADC and DAC on one chip.

Pretty much standard these days. Not many people are using separate DACs and ADCs these days.



fcarpio said:


> Can you elaborate a little please? I don't understand.


----------



## fcarpio

thehatedguy said:


> A CODEC is an ADC and DAC on one chip.
> 
> Pretty much standard these days. Not many people are using separate DACs and ADCs these days.


I see, thanks.


----------



## fcarpio

Niick said:


> Im so glad I found this thread!
> 
> I will be working with a H800 in a couple days....I've been checking out the sound manager software to familiarize myself with the user interface. A couple things I'm not totally sure of.......
> 
> 1: is the PEQ / GEQ an "either/or" type option or can they both be used simultaneously.
> 2: can each individual drive unit in a system with a fully active 2way front, rear coaxials, and mono subwoofer, be INDIVIDUALLY EQ'd? I can't seem to find a way to run, for example, the 10 band PEQ solely for the LEFT FRONT tweeter, and a COMPLETELY SEPERATE 10 band PEQ for the LEFT FRONT woofer. (of course the same for the right......)
> 
> It seems you can only EQ the left front CHANNEL as a whole. Is this correct? I've only worked with the software in demo mode so far......the car with the H800 won't the here for a couple days yet.


Messing with it for the first time as well. It seems that the front high and the front low are tied together in the same screen, but you can click on the top and bottom eq sliders and you get left and right. If you click on the rear speaker button you get a new set of L/R sliders, same for the sub. So that adds up to 8 channels, even though the EQ for the front high and the front low are on the same screen.

If I make changes to GEQ and the switch to PEQ and make changes there, when I switch back to GEQ the changes are still there. My guess, and what makes the most sense is that you can use both, parametric and graphic at the same time.

You should have FULL control over everything except for the front high and front low which in a way it kind of makes sense to keep them together.


----------



## seafish

fcarpio said:


> If I make changes to GEQ and the switch to PEQ and make changes there, when I switch back to GEQ the changes are still there. My guess, and what makes the most sense is that you can use both, parametric and graphic at the same time.


While mine is stil in a box waiting to be installed, and perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are saying, but I am pretty sure that you can use EITHER PEQ or GEQ at any one time on any one channel…they do NOT both work at the same time even though your settings are saved.


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## fcarpio

seafish said:


> fcarpio said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I make changes to GEQ and the switch to PEQ and make changes there, when I switch back to GEQ the changes are still there. My guess, and what makes the most sense is that you can use both, parametric and graphic at the same time.
> 
> 
> 
> While mine is stil in a box waiting to be installed, and perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are saying, but I am pretty sure that you can use EITHER PEQ or GEQ at any one time on any one channel…they do NOT both work at the same time even though your settings are saved.
Click to expand...

Maybe someone who is actively using the PXA can tell us for sure.


----------



## Niick

fcarpio said:


> Messing with it for the first time as well. It seems that the front high and the front low are tied together in the same screen, but you can click on the top and bottom eq sliders and you get left and right. If you click on the rear speaker button you get a new set of L/R sliders, same for the sub. So that adds up to 8 channels, even though the EQ for the front high and the front low are on the same screen.
> 
> If I make changes to GEQ and the switch to PEQ and make changes there, when I switch back to GEQ the changes are still there. My guess, and what makes the most sense is that you can use both, parametric and graphic at the same time.
> 
> You should have FULL control over everything except for the front high and front low which in a way it kind of makes sense to keep them together.


Yeah, that's what I've found too. Which is totally cool. No big deal. Just wanted to make sure I was FULLY grasping what this thing could and couldn't do before "crunch time" 

Im looking forward to working with the H800. I've done a lot of Audison Bit One & Ten, RF 360's, and a HELIX, and a lot of decks that have DSP capability. But this will be my first H800.


----------



## BlackHHR

Parametric is for the sub only if I am not totally off my rocker.
I have only used the H800 in 3 way plus sub set up only. We use the parametric for sub when needed.


----------



## Niick

BlackHHR said:


> Parametric is for the sub only if I am not totally off my rocker.
> I have only used the H800 in 3 way plus sub set up only. We use the parametric for sub when needed.


It looks as though the EQ is selectable as PEQ or GEQ on all channels. Sub included, but not exclusively. Anyways, I'll know for sure tomorrow. I've become very accustomed to a specific workflow, EQing each drive unit from its passband thru the transition region and into the stop-band, to match a target (defined by me at time of tuning). 

it's not 100% NECCESSARY though. It's just the way Im used to doing things. 

One aspect of the sound manger software that I really like so far is the way different parts of the gui are separated into different little windows. Like the EQ, the time alignment, crossovers, all are in different Windows that can be positioned however you want on screen. This makes it possible for me to tune the DSP AND run acoustic analysis on the same monitor. I usually use 2 different computers at the same time, one for acoustic analysis, the other to control the DSP. 

But with this piece, I might not.


----------



## JakeG37

I will say I like the GUI of the H800 and the versatility of the C800. The only reason I am going to use the Audison Bit One HD (when it comes out) is for the digital all the way to the amps. I am pleased with the sound I get from a digital source (currently a iPhone 6 via HDMI adapter to HDMI-Optical out). I just cant control the volume with the iPhone using that setup. Still looking for a better way to do this, but for now thats the best solution i can come up with. I tried going the CarPC route but was sick of screwing with the software and trying to make it user friendly for car use. So, I ripped it all out. I could however control the volume from within Windows 10 using the CarPC, as others have stated.


----------



## jtaudioacc

JakeG37 said:


> I will say I like the GUI of the H800 and the versatility of the C800. The only reason I am going to use the Audison Bit One HD (when it comes out) is for the digital all the way to the amps. I am pleased with the sound I get from a digital source (currently a iPhone 6 via HDMI adapter to HDMI-Optical out). I just cant control the volume with the iPhone using that setup. Still looking for a better way to do this, but for now thats the best solution i can come up with. I tried going the CarPC route but was sick of screwing with the software and trying to make it user friendly for car use. So, I ripped it all out. I could however control the volume from within Windows 10 using the CarPC, as others have stated.


i'd wait and let others be the guinea pigs for that if i were you.


----------



## kyheng

fcarpio said:


> Can you elaborate a little please? I don't understand.


Old circuit design is, ADC come first before DAC, with such 2 IC pass through, you will have some lost on the signal chain.
With CODEC, the signal directly goes in to the IC and do all the job before leaving it, so the lost are lesser.
With regards of ADC, DAC or CODEC, such DSP the most important component are still the DSP chip's processing power. For Pioneer's old school DSP(from DEQ-P9 to RS-P99), signal will go to DSP before to DACs.


----------



## JakeG37

jtaudioacc said:


> i'd wait and let others be the guinea pigs for that if i were you.


I agree with you, but I really want to see how my system will sound with a complete digital signal. I have read that people who have done it said it made a surprising difference. Just going to a digital source made a huge difference for me already.


----------



## t3sn4f2

JakeG37 said:


> I agree with you, but I really want to see how my system will sound with a complete digital signal. I have read that people who have done it said it made a surprising difference. Just going to a digital source made a huge difference for me already.


Moving the D to A conversion from the DSP to the amps isn't going to make a difference if everything else is installed correctly. Reason is that the DSP and amps are typically mounted so close together that there isn't a chance for ground loops and induced noise in the signal run. You're essentially moving the physical location of the conversion only.

But eliminating the D to A>A to D from a source to the DSP interface _can_ make a huge difference. You eliminate things like attenuated analog outputs, long signal runs that cross over many noisy automotive components, separate ground locations, etc. And you add the benefit of complete electrical isolation. But even that isn't necessary if you use quality component, install them properly, and make the analog output of the source a fixed level output and move master volume control to the DSP. In that case it'll sound just as good as a digital interface.


----------



## mrpeabody

JakeG37 said:


> I agree with you, but I really want to see how my system will sound with a complete digital signal. I have read that people who have done it said it made a surprising difference. Just going to a digital source made a huge difference for me already.


I've played around with full D/A setups and analog in to a bit processor and honestly i didn't really notice a big difference. Granted, I haven't switched between the two in the same car, on the same equipment so take it with a grain of salt. 

It makes sense theoretically to save the D/A conversion to one step, and also avoiding potential noise issues, but i'm still not convinced that it's a big improvement sonically. Just IMO.


----------



## Niick

mrpeabody said:


> I've played around with full D/A setups and analog in to a bit processor and honestly i didn't really notice a big difference. Granted, I haven't switched between the two in the same car, on the same equipment so take it with a grain of salt.
> 
> It makes sense theoretically to save the D/A conversion to one step, and also avoiding potential noise issues, but i'm still not convinced that it's a big improvement sonically. Just IMO.


So twice now I've performed this experiment (twice meaning "on two different cars") :

1- take a well know compilation of demo songs on CD and transfer them to my iPad NEplayer HiRes music player app in .wav format 44.1k @16bit.

2-hook up CCK to iPad, plug behringer uca202 into CCK, connect optical out to optical in of vehicle's DSP (bitTen in one car, 360.3 in the other) 

3-put original CD in vehicles CD player (connected to DSP via analog RCA) 

4-play disc and play iPad, same track, same time

5-switch between "master" input and "optical" input

6-be amazed at how much difference it actully makes! . CLEARLY audible.


----------



## t3sn4f2

Niick said:


> So twice now I've performed this experiment (twice meaning "on two different cars") :
> 
> 1- take a well know compilation of demo songs on CD and transfer them to my iPad NEplayer HiRes music player app in .wav format 44.1k @16bit.
> 
> 2-hook up CCK to iPad, plug behringer uca202 into CCK, connect optical out to optical in of vehicle's DSP (bitTen in one car, 360.3 in the other)
> 
> 3-put original CD in vehicles CD player (connected to DSP via analog RCA)
> 
> 4-play disc and play iPad, same track, same time
> 
> 5-switch between "master" input and "optical" input
> 
> 6-be amazed at how much difference it actully makes! . CLEARLY audible.


OE CD player? 

Matched source levels?


----------



## jtaudioacc

mrpeabody said:


> I've played around with full D/A setups and analog in to a bit processor and honestly i didn't really notice a big difference. Granted, I haven't switched between the two in the same car, on the same equipment so take it with a grain of salt.
> 
> It makes sense theoretically to save the D/A conversion to one step, and also avoiding potential noise issues, but i'm still not convinced that it's a big improvement sonically. Just IMO.


i have, more times than i can count. even now, working on a car with a DCT-1. i ran both. if you can easily use a digital connection from the head into a processor, i think that's a good thing. like t3sn4f2, it bypasses a lot of stuff. 

even then, depending on what head unit is feeding the analog, it's negligible.

maybe if you use some junk head unit, or factory system, it will be a huge difference. 

where it does make a difference with a bitone.1 for sure is, when using a digital input, it gets rid of about half of the floor noise they make.


----------



## Niick

t3sn4f2 said:


> OE CD player?
> 
> Matched source levels?


 OE CD player on one vehicle, alpine restyle on the other. YES I KNOW......it's possible to run the optical out of the Alpine into the DSP. But that's simply not how it was installed. And good thing, as it allowed for this experiment to take place.


----------



## Niick

Some people say it's negligible, some say it's audible..........NONE say that it makes NO difference. 

I would think, as much trouble as most people go to to get as good of sound as possible, keeping the d/a & a/d conversions to a minimum would seem a no-brainier. Especially seeing how simply it can be done now days.


----------



## jtaudioacc

Niick said:


> Some people say it's negligible, some say it's audible..........NONE say that it makes NO difference.
> 
> I would think, as much trouble as most people go to to get as good of sound as possible, keeping the d/a & a/d conversions to a minimum would seem a no-brainier. Especially seeing how simply it can be done now days.


with a new alpine double din that does both, the only thing i can say is, i'd guess the digital has a higher signal to noise ratio. i, as well as many others i'm sure would fail a double blind test.


----------



## Niick

Well, it's more than just signal to noise ratio I think. How many times can you sample and re-consruct an analog waveform before something gets lost? 

I really don't know the answer to that question. But then even more than that, it's not having ALL the analog audio stages too, that you have when running digital in.

Plus, the processor ITSELF would make a difference on how audible this phenomenon will be. How well does the processor do a-d and d-a without loosing microdyanmic detail? 

and I'm not "that guy". The guy who thinks a 1000 dollar per foot speaker cable is gonna bring more "rhythm and pace" in the music LOL

BUT I do think that the a-d d-a conversion process is anything but completely lossless.

Before doing this experiment, I didn't think I would be able to hear ANY difference. But now I know I was wrong. I will say the difference is much more pronounced, as one would expect, on the system with the OEM CD player.


----------



## kyheng

Niick said:


> So twice now I've performed this experiment (twice meaning "on two different cars") :
> 
> 1- take a well know compilation of demo songs on CD and transfer them to my iPad NEplayer HiRes music player app in .wav format 44.1k @16bit.
> 
> 2-hook up CCK to iPad, plug behringer uca202 into CCK, connect optical out to optical in of vehicle's DSP (bitTen in one car, 360.3 in the other)
> 
> 3-put original CD in vehicles CD player (connected to DSP via analog RCA)
> 
> 4-play disc and play iPad, same track, same time
> 
> 5-switch between "master" input and "optical" input
> 
> 6-be amazed at how much difference it actully makes! . CLEARLY audible.


Respect you on this
But my test were much more easier.
My setup is DEX-P9, DEQ-P9, XDV-P6 and CD-UB100 where CD-UB100 as primary player since my DEX-P9's CD mech failed. In the same time I have many burned MP3s from 90's. 
My test is copy the same songs from MP3 CD to pendrive plug it to CD-UB100, listen to it. Follow by taking the same CD and play it on the XDV-P6.
The difference are not that much, being the XDV plays louder and clearer. Is just because it is "digital" signal from player.


----------



## jtaudioacc

kyheng said:


> Respect you on this
> But my test were much more easier.
> My setup is DEX-P9, DEQ-P9, XDV-P6 and CD-UB100 where CD-UB100 as primary player since my DEX-P9's CD mech failed. In the same time I have many burned MP3s from 90's.
> My test is copy the same songs from MP3 CD to pendrive plug it to CD-UB100, listen to it. Follow by taking the same CD and play it on the XDV-P6.
> The difference are not that much, being the XDV plays louder and clearer. Is just because it is "digital" signal from player.


once did a listening test between a carrozzeria cd-7x and Pioneer CD-IB100II.
going into an odr head. would have failed that blind test as well. cd-7x works with way more newer stuff, so i'd get it if i went full odr. that stuff is only for ballers tho.


----------



## kyheng

jtaudioacc said:


> once did a listening test between a carrozzeria cd-7x and Pioneer CD-IB100II.
> going into an odr head. would have failed that blind test as well. cd-7x works with way more newer stuff, so i'd get it if i went full odr. that stuff is only for ballers tho.


Well, I kinda agree with you on this.
As Pioneer's DEQ or the high end ODR DSPs, all are the same in terms of signal processing, signal from source > DSP's CPU > DAC. This is when we are using digital source(where HU display "digital".
But when we are using analogue source and Hu does not display "digital", the signal will be transferred from IP-Bus > ADC > DSP's CPU > DAC.


----------



## Niick

So, regarding the PXA-H800......

Now that I've had an opportunity to tune a system using this DSP. I like it. I didn't like the fact that it didn't have a COMPLETLY SEPERATE EQ for EACH INDIVIDUAL OUTPUT, but that's not TOO huge a deal. 

Also, BE CAREFUL with linking/unlinking the L & R EQ's.

I had totally completed my EQing of the front L & R channels. Then, I took a look at the rears. There wasn't nearly that big of a difference between the left and right rear channels, we were playing them at a very reduced output, and we we getting low on remaining time.

So I decided to simply EQ the REAR L & R at the same time, instead of separately. So, I clicked the link button. It asked me which channel I wanted to apply the data of to the other channel. So I arbitrarily picked the left.

To my horror, this linked ALL EQs, including the fronts. I did not intend to link the fronts. I also had not yet saved my progress. So I had to go back and re-EQ my front right. 

Lesson learned.

I will say, that for whatever reason, I was able to more closely match target with the 30 band GEQ in the H-800 than I ever have been able to with other GEQs. It just seemed to work well. I know that doesn't sound like it makes sense. But there it is. 

In my opinion, it had the best graphic EQ I've used so far.


----------



## percy072

Just a couple humble questions :blush:

How affective is the H-800 for OEM integration (summing) on a source unit that does not have a dedicated sub channel??

Also...is it just a matter of tapping the front L+R channels to the Alpine??

Will be going from an MS-8 to the H-800 so if I needed more wiring...just wanted to get a jump on that. Sorry...I'm sure the answers are probably in here somewhere but it's such a huge thread and no luck with Forum or google search.

Thanks


----------



## gumbeelee

percy072 said:


> Just a couple humble questions :blush:
> 
> How affective is the H-800 for OEM integration (summing) on a source unit that does not have a dedicated sub channel??
> 
> Also...is it just a matter of tapping the front L+R channels to the Alpine??
> 
> Will be going from an MS-8 to the H-800 so if I needed more wiring...just wanted to get a jump on that. Sorry...I'm sure the answers are probably in here somewhere but it's such a huge thread and no luck with Forum or google search.
> 
> Thanks


You just use the front left and right pre-outs only, I believe I am correct on that, u might want to double-check. If u have an alpine deck with ainet u would just use the ainet cable only, no preouts. I use the h800 thru ainet and optical only, never used with rca preouts. I had a ms-8 and i like my h800 way better!


----------



## percy072

gumbeelee said:


> I had a ms-8 and i like my h800 way better!


Good to hear :thumbsup:

I have to stick with my factory Ford HU so I'm hoping (like the MS-8) the Alpine is able to produce as close as possible to a full range signal...or creates it's own sub channel?? 

MS-8 did a good job but really looking forward to having more control.


----------



## JakeG37

I use just the front l/r channel inputs to the H800 and the processor does the rest. I only use sub 1 out of the processor since I am running just one sub. So, to answer your question, the H800 can give you sub outputs with just L/R front inputs. My factory Navi system in my G37 does not have pre-outs per say. I just tapped into the front left/right signals from my HU before they went into the Bose amp.


----------



## kyheng

percy072 said:


> Just a couple humble questions :blush:
> 
> How affective is the H-800 for OEM integration (summing) on a source unit that does not have a dedicated sub channel??
> 
> Also...is it just a matter of tapping the front L+R channels to the Alpine??
> 
> Will be going from an MS-8 to the H-800 so if I needed more wiring...just wanted to get a jump on that. Sorry...I'm sure the answers are probably in here somewhere but it's such a huge thread and no luck with Forum or google search.
> 
> Thanks


For after market DSP, what important is the full range signal is real full range signal, so the best way is make sure no EQ on the HU to give "cleanest" signal to DSP.


----------



## Projektmkvii

Just a quick question ? I will be running a 3 way active using the H800, I'm confused on how the input side works. Can I just send a single stereo signal (Aux 1) into the dsp and choose the (3 way + sub) output to my amps? My equipment is as follows - X108U, 2x PDX-V9, 1x PDX-M12, HAT drivers L1v2, L3, L6v2 and 3x 8" Type R subs. I also thought about doing the 5.1 input and turning off center channel and using my mid bass ass my "rear" speakers. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


----------



## percy072

Any idea's why it won't do anything when trying to use the set-up CD...no matter what I do with the HU volume it has no affect and just times out?? I am using it for OEM integration so thought that was a critical step for the processor to know what it's dealing with (for lack of better wording) 

Otherwise everything else seems to be working great...lot's to learn but so far proving to have been a good investment!!


----------



## Golden Ear

maresgti12 said:


> Just a quick question  I will be running a 3 way active using the H800, I'm confused on how the input side works. Can I just send a single stereo signal (Aux 1) into the dsp and choose the (3 way + sub) output to my amps? My equipment is as follows - X108U, 2x PDX-V9, 1x PDX-M12, HAT drivers L1v2, L3, L6v2 and 3x 8" Type R subs. I also thought about doing the 5.1 input and turning off center channel and using my mid bass ass my "rear" speakers. Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk



Yes you can. Use full range pre-outs...usually the fronts of a hu.


Sent from my mind using telekinesis


----------



## Projektmkvii

Golden Ear said:


> Yes you can. Use full range pre-outs...usually the fronts of a hu.
> 
> 
> Sent from my mind using telekinesis


Perfect thanks

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


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## percy072

Can the mic that comes with the H-800 be used with REW?? Or do I need something else like the UMIK-! or Dayton EMM-6 

Ordered the UMIK-1 regardless...


----------



## percy072

percy072 said:


> Any idea's why it won't do anything when trying to use the set-up CD...no matter what I do with the HU volume it has no affect and just times out?? I am using it for OEM integration so thought that was a critical step for the processor to know what it's dealing with (for lack of better wording)


No idea's on this


----------



## Smith12

just bught this Alpine PXA-H800 Processor from caraudiogiants.com


----------



## Golden Ear

Smith12 said:


> just bught this Alpine PXA-H800 Processor from caraudiogiants.com



Did you get the last one? Nothing comes up when searching thru all their Alpine products or doing a direct search


Sent from my mind using telekinesis


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## james_spearo

Can someone please help with my initial setup of the H800, I have it plugged in via AI-Net cable to a CDA117e headunit, but it's not turning on the blue light on the processor when I turn the car onto Acc. I've only just installed the H800 but here's what I've done so far;

Wired the power, ground, Rem in (from HU), Rem Out (to Amps)
Wired the AI-Net cable from HU to H800
Installed soundmanager V1.110 and flashed firmware to H800

While I'm connected in via laptop I can see it's picking up the AI-Net connection but displaying Source as [Auxillary (Ai-NET (CHG))] instead of HU??

I have a RUX-c800 but the guy I bought the h800 from forgot to pack in the commander cable. getting that sorted. It's got me scratching my head why the RUX has a male ended D plug, and the 117e HU has a female ended D plug (therefore compatible) but when you plug the RUX into the HU it does Fck all! silly design

Confused.
-James


----------



## Golden Ear

james_spearo said:


> Can someone please help with my initial setup of the H800, I have it plugged in via AI-Net cable to a CDA117e headunit, but it's not turning on the blue light on the processor when I turn the car onto Acc. I've only just installed the H800 but here's what I've done so far;
> 
> 
> 
> Wired the power, ground, Rem in (from HU), Rem Out (to Amps)
> 
> Wired the AI-Net cable from HU to H800
> 
> Installed soundmanager V1.110 and flashed firmware to H800
> 
> 
> 
> While I'm connected in via laptop I can see it's picking up the AI-Net connection but displaying Source as [Auxillary (Ai-NET (CHG))] instead of HU??
> 
> 
> 
> I have a RUX-c800 but the guy I bought the h800 from forgot to pack in the commander cable. getting that sorted. It's got me scratching my head why the RUX has a male ended D plug, and the 117e HU has a female ended D plug (therefore compatible) but when you plug the RUX into the HU it does Fck all! silly design
> 
> 
> 
> Confused.
> 
> -James



I'm pretty sure you're going to need the controller plugged in to get the unit to fire up. 


Sent from my mind using telekinesis


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## quality_sound

Golden Ear said:


> I'm pretty sure you're going to need the controller plugged in to get the unit to fire up.
> 
> 
> Sent from my mind using telekinesis



Not with an Ai-Net processor you don't. 

Did you flip the switches on the HU?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## james_spearo

Just as a follow up I discovered the DIP switches under the CDA-117e, DOH! 
No idea what they do, but I've flicked them all to "EXT" and now it works.

No mention in the manual at all (In the PXA-H800 manual at least)

Still no light on the blue cube, but it's passing sound and I can tune via the laptop. Sounds awesome! no TA yet and just tweaked gains on 3-way + sub. very happy with the Esques. 

Doing more tuning tonight, going to set TA with REW & loop back microphone, and set the individual driver levels a bit tighter, and then do a EQ session!

Cheers
James


----------



## papasin

James, with an ai-net HU and H800, you also don't need the remote in wire connected on the h800 as the ai-net is what tells the h800 to power on.


----------



## Coolbeans

Percy, I've had the h800 in my 15' mustang for a year now off the OEM deck. I run alpine amps and HAT drivers. It's been nothing but bliss. Took a year to learn and tune the damn thing but well worth it.


----------



## Golden Ear

quality_sound said:


> Not with an Ai-Net processor you don't.
> 
> Did you flip the switches on the HU?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Thank you for the correction. I haven't used an h800 without the remote.


Sent from my mind using telekinesis


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## james_spearo

Cheers Papasin,

I cut the remote wire input from HU to H800. Not required as you said.

I called the local Alpine dealer today to get the Command Cable that should have come with the RUX replaced (was a 2nd hand purchase, guy I bought it from lost the cable). $150 to replace through Alpine!!! holy hell is it solid gold wire? Platinum 

I told the guy I can live without the RUX lol

I'm trying to source a cable through Pacparts but says they're out of stock. $40 US is a bit more reasonable.

James


----------



## Projektmkvii

I got my H800 and RUX for sale. If anyone needs one pm me. Both brand new in box.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


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## james_spearo

OK so I managed to spend about 3 hours last night tuning with REW, have set TA, driver gains & crossover points, and a bit of EQ. Sounds fantastic! a big step up in Sound Quality over the two MiniDSP 2x4 boards I was running. Especially at high volume levels, the noise floor is non-existent now.

I have two gripes though;

1) There is only 10 points of PEQ per channel (L & R) and no individual channel EQ!! what the?? Makes it a little difficult to EQ the drivers individually for example; the PEQ in the upper mids will effect the PEQ in the tweeter pass band etc. This is one section where the miniDSP kicked ass. 6 points of PEQ per driver! not to mention the Biquad - REW import feature. If the H800 had this feature I'd be in Audio nirvana.

2) The speakers seem to unmute themselves when I move between TA, Xover & EQ windows as I am trying to run a sweep in REW. Just have to be vigilant to check before running the sweep each time.

Overall pretty happy.

Cheers


----------



## percy072

sigh...:blush:

OK, HUGE thread...just need quick answer lol. Are the GEQ and PEQ not linked?? Is it either use one or the other?? Might help to relieve me of alot of frustration and wasted time. 

Also...better results with one over the other or??


----------



## quality_sound

Not linked and can only use one at a time. Results will depend on your skill with them. You can get excellent results with the PEQ if you can use it well. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## troyer2112

So i've had the Alpine PXA H800 now for 3 days.

I am going from iPad>Lightning cable>Lightning AV>HDMI>HDMI to Optical Converter>Optical>H800

It took a while to find the right crossover points (not sure if they are optimal yet) and the PEQ has done wonders.

I am going active to Alpine SPR-60c and JL 10w6v3 bass wedge from an Alpine PDX-V9

Sound deadened - CLD, CCF and MLV front doors and trunk


Questions

i dont really get sound until about -60db. Is this normal?
its not a big deal as i can go to 30 and it starts to get loud and i cannot turn it up all the way as its too much and im worried about breaking the speakers in.

My voltage readout says either 14.4 or so to 12.6 or so seemingly random. Not sure if its bad or not.


----------



## JVD240

troyer2112 said:


> So i've had the Alpine PXA H800 now for 3 days.
> 
> I am going from iPad>Lightning cable>Lightning AV>HDMI>HDMI to Optical Converter>Optical>H800
> 
> It took a while to find the right crossover points (not sure if they are optimal yet) and the PEQ has done wonders.
> 
> I am going active to Alpine SPR-60c and JL 10w6v3 bass wedge from an Alpine PDX-V9
> 
> Sound deadened - CLD, CCF and MLV front doors and trunk
> 
> 
> Questions
> 
> i dont really get sound until about -60db. Is this normal?
> its not a big deal as i can go to 30 and it starts to get loud and i cannot turn it up all the way as its too much and im worried about breaking the speakers in.
> 
> My voltage readout says either 14.4 or so to 12.6 or so seemingly random. Not sure if its bad or not.


The -60db thing shouldn't matter. If you've got enough volume and no noise floor I wouldn't worry about it.

The voltage reading you're seeing is probably with the engine running and the engine off respectively. The alternator is providing your 14.4V. 12.6 will be straight battery power.


----------



## katodevin

troyer2112 said:


> So i've had the Alpine PXA H800 now for 3 days.
> 
> I am going from iPad>Lightning cable>Lightning AV>HDMI>HDMI to Optical Converter>Optical>H800


Hi there - From my research re: the lightning AV adapter - I found that the adapter is basically a mini airplay device that re compresses the video output of the connected device. Curious if it does it do this for audio as well? Or is it bit perfect audio that is carried over the AV adapter

Article that I read about the contents of the AV adapter - AV ADAPTER


----------



## troyer2112

katodevin said:


> Hi there - From my research re: the lightning AV adapter - I found that the adapter is basically a mini airplay device that re compresses the video output of the connected device. Curious if it does it do this for audio as well? Or is it bit perfect audio that is carried over the AV adapter
> 
> Article that I read about the contents of the AV adapter - AV ADAPTER


Well im not exactly sure but i do know it sounds good so i guess i wont fret too much until the Audison bitplay HD is updated then ill use the ipad for the music selection


----------



## troyer2112

JVD240 said:


> The -60db thing shouldn't matter. If you've got enough volume and no noise floor I wouldn't worry about it.
> 
> The voltage reading you're seeing is probably with the engine running and the engine off respectively. The alternator is providing your 14.4V. 12.6 will be straight battery power.


I could swear that it goes to 12.6 while driving too. I will keep my eyes open. i dont hear any difference in sound when it does it. 

yeah no noise floor what so ever.


----------



## cvjoint

Just installed an Alpine H800 in the 'Vette yesterday! This unit is amazing, did most of the tuning with the Omnimic in 1 hour and it rocks. 

That said I have one observation and a lot of questions. 

Observation: there are two blue/white remote turn on wires. Thank you DIYMA (this thread) for the pointer on the top being remote out. 


I'm using a bluetooth adapter connected through optical and have the RUX. Running 2way front, rears, and mono sub for Pro Logic II.
Questions:
Is it true that I have to connect the ACC to the remote in wire even thought I have a RUX? 
Does the RUX have an on/off?
What the heck is subwoofer 2? 
Euphony better than Pro Logic II?
Pro Logic Music is best?


----------



## papasin

Hey George,

See my answers in bold below.



cvjoint said:


> Questions:
> Is it true that I have to connect the ACC to the remote in wire even thought I have a RUX?
> 
> *Yes, you probably should. That way, it turns your H800 on/off when you turn your car on/off.*
> 
> Does the RUX have an on/off?
> 
> *Hold down Source for a few seconds. Turning off the RUX turns off the H800.*
> 
> What the heck is subwoofer 2?
> 
> *In case you run your subs in stereo or have a front and rear sub, you can time align and eq them separately.*
> 
> Euphony better than Pro Logic II?
> 
> *I personally prefer PL2.*
> 
> Pro Logic Music is best?
> 
> *I don't use it.*


----------



## cvjoint

papasin said:


> Hey George,
> 
> See my answers in bold below.
> 
> Is it true that I have to connect the ACC to the remote in Wire even thought I have a RUX?
> 
> Yes, you probably should. That way, it turns your H800 on/off when you turn your Car on/off.
> 
> Thanks! I still don't get it though. What if I wire it to constant 12V and then use the RUX on/off that you pointed me to below to power on and off? You said the RUX turns off the H800 as well. It shouldn't draw any power then. Is it just for safety's sake?
> 
> Does the RUX have an on/off?
> 
> Hold down Source for a few seconds. Turning off the RUX turns off the H800.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> What the heck is subwoofer 2?
> 
> In case you run your subs in stereo or have a front and rear sub, you an time align and eq them separately.
> 
> Wow, that is a top notch feature. Should I get more subs then? :laugh:
> 
> Euphony better than Pro Logic II?
> 
> I personally prefer PL2.
> 
> Pro Logic Music is best?
> 
> I don't use it.


Very very useful, thank you! More questions in blue font.


----------



## papasin

cvjoint said:


> Very very useful, thank you! More questions in blue font.
> 
> Thanks! I still don't get it though. What if I wire it to constant 12V and then use the RUX on/off that you pointed me to below to power on and off? You said the RUX turns off the H800 as well. It shouldn't draw any power then. Is it just for safety's sake?


I suppose you can wire it to constant 12V. I think the point is for the case like you are using it where you don't have a HU, that it behaves like one...it powers on when the car is switched to ACC or you start it, and powers off when the car is turned off and not have to worry about manually switching it off.



cvjoint said:


> Wow, that is a top notch feature. Should I get more subs then?


I think if you were to run a center, then instead settings become LT,RT,LMB,RMB,Lrear,Rrear,C,Sub and subwoofer 2 goes away.


----------



## cvjoint

papasin said:


> I suppose you can wire it to constant 12V. I think the point is for the case like you are using it where you don't have a HU, that it behaves like one...it powers on when the car is switched to ACC or you start it, and powers off when the car is turned off and not have to worry about manually switching it off.
> 
> 
> 
> I think if you were to run a center, then instead settings become LT,RT,LMB,RMB,Lrear,Rrear,C,Sub and subwoofer 2 goes away.


I'll give constant 12V a try. So far I haven't touched any of the car's wiring. It's a marathon, want to see how far I can go without slicing stock harnesses. 

Yes, the center is a good way to use that channel. It is a bit annoying in 4.2 mode. I have to do the settings twice in sub 1 and sub 2. I guess I should have used a Y adapter on just one RCA but I think that pre-out voltage would be wasted with a single channel instead of 2.


----------



## papasin

cvjoint said:


> Yes, the center is a good way to use that channel. It is a bit annoying in 4.2 mode. I have to do the settings twice in sub 1 and sub 2. I guess I should have used a Y adapter on just one RCA but I think that pre-out voltage would be wasted with a single channel instead of 2.


Yep, we typically just use one pre-out so that we're not having to apply the settings twice via a Y adapter. You can also set it in 5.1 mode, and just turn off center and works the same way...and if you decide to add a center, just turn the center on.


----------



## cvjoint

papasin said:


> Yep, we typically just use one pre-out so that we're not having to apply the settings twice via a Y adapter. You can also set it in 5.1 mode, and just turn off center and works the same way...and if you decide to add a center, just turn the center on.


Oh, I didn't know you can turn center off in 5.1 mode. I'm afraid it screws up the center information and gets lost instead of getting to the front left and right channels. Do we know for sure common L and R goes back to L and R with center off in 5.1?


----------



## papasin

cvjoint said:


> Oh, I didn't know you can turn center off in 5.1 mode. I'm afraid it screws up the center information and gets lost instead of getting to the front left and right channels. Do we know for sure common L and R goes back to L and R with center off in 5.1?


That's how my car is set up.


----------



## cvjoint

papasin said:


> That's how my car is set up.


Works for me! 

I just remembered I was also a bit confused with the parametric EQ. Does the H800 combine front high and front low together and only offers you 10 bands for both? There should be 10 bands for the high and 10 for the low.


EDIT 1: BTW I do think the 5.1 with center off will give you only half the pre-out voltage compared to using sub 1 and sub 2. Is there something I'm missing?

EDIT 2: Any tips on level matching the rears? I was thinking of running a noise sequence and overlapping the FR's to match the SPL. If not that I guess changing them to stereo, tuning, then switching back to Pro Logic II? 

The more I read the manual the more "Movie" mode in PLII makes more sense than "Music." Odd.


----------



## cvjoint

JVD240 said:


> The -60db thing shouldn't matter. If you've got enough volume and no noise floor I wouldn't worry about it.
> 
> The voltage reading you're seeing is probably with the engine running and the engine off respectively. The alternator is providing your 14.4V. 12.6 will be straight battery power.


I believe the alternator has a regulator in it that switches between low and high voltage because mine also switched between the two while driving in all cars I've had. Therefore normal.


----------



## quickaudi07

Questions

i dont really get sound until about -60db. Is this normal?
its not a big deal as i can go to 30 and it starts to get loud and i cannot turn it up all the way as its too much and im worried about breaking the speakers in.

My voltage readout says either 14.4 or so to 12.6 or so seemingly random. Not sure if its bad or not.[/QUOTE]


To answer your question, yes this is perfectly normal! I have a car pc in my car and i dont get sound until 60-57 and i go down on it till about 10, my amps are turned up a little and lowed on the processor as well, but yes thats fine and perfectly normal.


----------



## quickaudi07

I have a second battery in the trunk, and my voltage still drops below 11 at times, but i do have 3 amps, and they are all very powerful and need the juice when the music plays... time for upgrade on front battery and maybe new alt.


----------



## cvjoint

quickaudi07 said:


> To answer your question, yes this is perfectly normal! I have a car pc in my car and i dont get sound until 60-57 and i go down on it till about 10, my amps are turned up a little and lowed on the processor as well, but yes thats fine and perfectly normal.


Yep. Alpine volume is in DB. The oddity of the system is that it starts at very low DB levels. It's the kind of volume style that an engineer would use. I love it! The scale gives you insight as to the range of amplitudes humans can hear and how we perceive it. Brilliant. 




quickaudi07 said:


> I have a second battery in the trunk, and my voltage still drops below 11 at times, but i do have 3 amps, and they are all very powerful and need the juice when the music plays... time for upgrade on front battery and maybe new alt.


Did a lot of that in the past, extra batteries and aftermarket alternators. The car I have now supports a 4 kilowatts system stock without dropping voltage. Reasons why it works:
*fully variable power supplies (class G/H)
*stock alternator delivers nearly *100 AMP off idle
*system sensitivity of 99 db @1 watt
*car can be auditioned with the engine on without a lot of noise (modern Corvettes have PMW modulated exhaust baffles)

Be careful with the aftermarket alternators, they increase peak output but typically have dismal idle performance. Unless you spend $600 on a custom Denso unit you won't get much out of it. Extra batteries are helpful of course, but even three will only get you so much audition time at high output.


----------



## gamma_ed

Is it possible to combine the H800 and H100 ? 
I have one AI NET headunit w910r

Why, I have a few channels short, so thought lets try to add a H100

I was trying this on my workbench, but so far no luck. But perhaps something needs to be modified


----------



## nstaln

When using RCA inputs(f/r/s) for the PXA will the volume level and subwoofer volume level still be controlled through the head unit? I have an alpine HU not an ai-net model. I plan on running a tweet/midrange/passive combo off the front channels, dedicated midbass from the rears and a dedicated sub if the sub-channels of course. 

What I want to know is can I use my volume control and sub control from my head unit or am I stuck using the controls on the RUX? Will the increase of input signal translate into more output signal (on the sub rca in/out assuming channels are programmed for subwoofer duty).


----------



## kaflam

If you are using sw RCA from HU, you can control it from HU or PXA.

But i think you should choose just one for a most accurate gain control.


----------



## nstaln

Ok cool...I like using the remote for my HU to adjust normal volume and I would prefer to use the sub level control built into the HU as well(just easier).

With this in mind what would be the best way to set the input and output levels on the PXA? Reading over the manual it looks like the input level is just hi/low but the output can be adjusted. I'm using a JL 900/5 amp and have always adjusted my gains according to the manual which instructs you to measure the output voltage from the amp. I guess I would keep the RUX volume and sub turned up and keep the HU volume and sub turned down and just increase as desired.


----------



## jnchantler

nstaln said:


> Ok cool...I like using the remote for my HU to adjust normal volume and I would prefer to use the sub level control built into the HU as well(just easier).
> 
> With this in mind what would be the best way to set the input and output levels on the PXA? Reading over the manual it looks like the input level is just hi/low but the output can be adjusted. I'm using a JL 900/5 amp and have always adjusted my gains according to the manual which instructs you to measure the output voltage from the amp. I guess I would keep the RUX volume and sub turned up and keep the HU volume and sub turned down and just increase as desired.




You won't be able to use the sub control from the head unit unless it's ainet.

Correction, if you run the dedicated SW out from the head you will be able to.


----------



## slowhatch

nstaln said:


> When using RCA inputs(f/r/s) for the PXA will the volume level and subwoofer volume level still be controlled through the head unit? I have an alpine HU not an ai-net model. I plan on running a tweet/midrange/passive combo off the front channels, dedicated midbass from the rears and a dedicated sub if the sub-channels of course.
> 
> What I want to know is can I use my volume control and sub control from my head unit or am I stuck using the controls on the RUX? Will the increase of input signal translate into more output signal (on the sub rca in/out assuming channels are programmed for subwoofer duty).


I use mine with a non-ainet head unit and use the head unit to control the volume. I just have the rux controller set to between 20-10 db (80-90%) volume. It works great for me and I have no detectable noise floor.


----------



## gamma_ed

nstaln said:


> When using RCA inputs(f/r/s) for the PXA will the volume level and subwoofer volume level still be controlled through the head unit? I have an alpine HU not an ai-net model. I plan on running a tweet/midrange/passive combo off the front channels, dedicated midbass from the rears and a dedicated sub if the sub-channels of course.
> 
> What I want to know is can I use my volume control and sub control from my head unit or am I stuck using the controls on the RUX? Will the increase of input signal translate into more output signal (on the sub rca in/out assuming channels are programmed for subwoofer duty).



Yes, it does work, but its not really good. Because in more silence passage (quiet music) it won;t work that accurate, cause it doesn't understand the volume level that well. I would recommend keep the rux to controll volume or AI-Net HU.


----------



## kaflam

It will be fine... I prefer to set the gains using an oscilloscope (measuring HU, PXA & amp) and set them to the max without distortion, then lower the volume/gain on each if you hear noise floor (with no other cause). But always work different for every installation or user.

As I can recall, you can set the volume all the way up on PXA without distortion (if inputs are distortion free).


----------



## eviling

I have an spdif 5.1 dolby coax feed out of my stock receiver into my stock amp. A flat unaltered signal. With what I believe is volume control over CAN(control area network) and what appears to be a separate navigation feed as well. 








This is the harnesses at the amp. I wanted to retain stock functions but can't figure out how to get stock volume control without line level inputs into the processor and only two take 5.1 spdif is ms8 and h800. 

The rainbow audio has a navigation feed. If I decode it into an analog 6 channel output I can and feed the navigation and a Bluetooth if theirs one I havnt figured out if their is but I still don't know what C+,- is on the harness. 

I could also do that with the rf360.3 rf tells me that I can use a discrete input/output I checked the software it does let you put a 7th channel the way I'd need to on input and I could pass it right through navigation feed and Bluetooth if I need to. But those two require the decoder to which I've only found these cheap 40$-70$ solutions on Amazon idk if I trust their signal not to have noise.

Most of these units appear to be used for xboxes and game consoles. 











So I could do the h800 but I loose volume control? I could mount the rf knob easier. I'm trying to decide which is best processing for my situation. 

This is the only setup I've come up with that gives my stock controls but no eq or t/a which I'm also not apposed too.









Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## nstaln

Does anyone out there have a copy of the management software? It seems I only received the audio test cd and not the software cd.

Thanks.

***Never mind, I downloaded it***


----------



## nstaln

I'm a little confused on setting the input and output RCA's in the system manager. I would like to use 2 sets of RCA's one for the front (which will need a pair of HP and BP outputs) and a second set for the subwoofer (to go out a dedicated RCA output pair).

My system consists of AudioFrog GB10 tweets, GB25 mids (utilizing the GB2510c passive crossovers), a pair of AudioFrog GB6.5's for mid bass, and a TC Sounds TC1000 15. Amplifier is a JL HD900/5.

I would like to use one RCA input for the front with (2) pairs of RCA's out, one pair at 300hz and up for the mid/tweet combo, the second set for the mid bass BP'd at 60hz-300.

I would like to run a dedicated subwoofer RCA input with a corresponding subwoofer out…so that I can use the built-in subwoofer level control from my head unit (Alpine IVE-w555bt) non-ainet.

So I'm a bit confused specifically on how to assign the output RCA's to correspond to the input RCA's (AUX's).

In short I want AUX IN 1 to output to RCA1/2(HP [email protected]) and RCA3/4(BP [email protected])

And I want AUX IN2 (or 3, it doesn't matter) to correspond to output RCA5/6[or 7/8](LP [email protected])

How do I accomplish this?

Thanks!


----------



## fcarpio

Has anyone had any issues with sub notes leaking into the mids? 

I just noticed this happening when my mids were bottoming out, did some quick digging and the response shows some leakage that does not correspond to the crossover slope. So it is either the processor or my amp. I now have temporarily fixed this by increasing the bottom end on the mids and making the crossover slope steeper, but I would like to fix it properly.

So it is either the processor or the amp as I run a 5 ch amp for the entire system.


----------



## nstaln

nstaln said:


> I'm a little confused on setting the input and output RCA's in the system manager. I would like to use 2 sets of RCA's one for the front (which will need a pair of HP and BP outputs) and a second set for the subwoofer (to go out a dedicated RCA output pair).
> 
> My system consists of AudioFrog GB10 tweets, GB25 mids (utilizing the GB2510c passive crossovers), a pair of AudioFrog GB6.5's for mid bass, and a TC Sounds TC1000 15. Amplifier is a JL HD900/5.
> 
> I would like to use one RCA input for the front with (2) pairs of RCA's out, one pair at 300hz and up for the mid/tweet combo, the second set for the mid bass BP'd at 60hz-300.
> 
> I would like to run a dedicated subwoofer RCA input with a corresponding subwoofer out…so that I can use the built-in subwoofer level control from my head unit (Alpine IVE-w555bt) non-ainet.
> 
> So I'm a bit confused specifically on how to assign the output RCA's to correspond to the input RCA's (AUX's).
> 
> In short I want AUX IN 1 to output to RCA1/2(HP [email protected]) and RCA3/4(BP [email protected])
> 
> And I want AUX IN2 (or 3, it doesn't matter) to correspond to output RCA5/6[or 7/8](LP [email protected])
> 
> How do I accomplish this?
> 
> Thanks!


Anyone? Can this be done? 

Thanks.


----------



## cvjoint

Had anyone had problems with the controller connection on the H800 becoming intermittent?


----------



## JakeG37

cvjoint said:


> Had anyone had problems with the controller connection on the H800 becoming intermittent?


Nope. I have been using my H800 for 9-10 months now without any problems.


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## cvjoint

JakeG37 said:


> Nope. I have been using my H800 for 9-10 months now without any problems.


That's good news. There is hope for fixing it then.


----------



## Coppertone

Mine has been in it seems for forever and not one single problem.


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## fcarpio

cvjoint said:


> Had anyone had problems with the controller connection on the H800 becoming intermittent?


Mine is fairly new, but no problems yet.


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## kyheng

looks more like loose connection somewhere.


----------



## cvjoint

*Note on how to turn Alpine H800 off with RUX but without headunit*

The H800 will not turn off entirely by pressing the source button in for a few seconds. It will shut off the amps and it will turn off its lights and controller but it will still draw power until it kills your battery. 

Make sure to hook up the remote-in to switched 12V. That is the only way the H800 turns off without an Aline headunit, through the switched 12V remote in. 

This took me a while to figure out. This is good info for others using the H800 with stand alone player like bluetooth receivers etc. Cheers.


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## CZ Eddie

$600 "new" for both the commander *and *processor!

Alpine PXA H800 Digital Sound Processor Alpine RUX C800 Remote Commander New | eBay


----------



## fcarpio

CZ Eddie said:


> $600 "new" for both the commander *and *processor!
> 
> Alpine PXA H800 Digital Sound Processor Alpine RUX C800 Remote Commander New | eBay


That is not bad at all. I hope someone from the forum got it.


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## CZ Eddie

fcarpio said:


> That is not bad at all. I hope someone from the forum got it.


It's a killer deal only because I have a huge bill I need to pay ASAP. lol

But stupid PayPal slapped their "21 day hold" on the funds for whatever reason. Some Googling says they are doing this a lot recently.
I've been with PayPal for 15 years and close to a thousand transactions and never had something like this happen before.

So the buyer either needs to pay for it a different way or it's going back up for sale again with a "Friends & Family Paypal payment" restriction or "bank to bank transfer". 
I'm refunding him in a few minutes.

PayPal is realllllly upsetting me.


----------



## Socalstangman

CZ Eddie said:


> $600 "new" for both the commander *and *processor!
> 
> Alpine PXA H800 Digital Sound Processor Alpine RUX C800 Remote Commander New | eBay


The H800 is a real nice unit and I might get another one some day. I saw your post, at 520.00 this is a real good deal. The resale value on these have really dropped...sucks.


----------



## CZ Eddie

It's gone now. The buyer and I worked something out. 
Sorry to have spammed the board. Didn't mean to turn it into a multi-post thing.


----------



## fcarpio

CZ Eddie said:


> It's a killer deal only because I have a huge bill I need to pay ASAP. lol
> 
> But stupid PayPal slapped their "21 day hold" on the funds for whatever reason. Some Googling says they are doing this a lot recently.
> I've been with PayPal for 15 years and close to a thousand transactions and never had something like this happen before.
> 
> So the buyer either needs to pay for it a different way or it's going back up for sale again with a "Friends & Family Paypal payment" restriction or "bank to bank transfer".
> I'm refunding him in a few minutes.
> 
> PayPal is realllllly upsetting me.


If I didn't already have one I would buy it from you. I love this processor.


----------



## fcarpio

I just noticed my processor getting pretty warm to the touch, warm enough to put my hand on the unit but can't hold it there for more than 5 seconds. Is that normal?


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## quality_sound

That's normal


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## fcarpio

quality_sound said:


> That's normal
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks, good to know. I kind of flipped for a minute there.


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## fcarpio

Is there any way to know exactly what data is actually saved on the presets? I don't think mine is saving the gains per channel on the crossover.


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## corcraft

Has anyone used/ compared high level and RCA on this unit? Noise difference? Since Alpine doesn't make an optical unit anymore and you have to use the rux for volume anyways I'm in a good mind to just put my factory deck back in and use speaker level vs RCA from pioneer PRS.


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## fcarpio

Sometimes my PXA does not shutdown when I turn my car off. When this happens I have to turn it off by holding the Source button. This seems totally random. Is there a setting that I am missing? How do I make sure that the PXA turns off when I turn the ignition off?


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## corcraft

This may be in here and I may get flamed but hard to search what I'm asking and I have read lots and lots of pages on this thread. I have a h800 bought and otw to me so I don't have any hands on or even a manual. I understand that when active 2way front that both channels share the same eq. In other words you can't eq mid and highs separate my understanding. My question is if this is true can you trick it and use a rear channel for either mid or highs so that you can eq separately?


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## Lou Frasier2

thats what i was thinking ,i think you can as long a one is the left channel and one is the right so you get your channel seperation,dont quote me on this please,its just what i thought


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## corcraft

corcraft said:


> This may be in here and I may get flamed but hard to search what I'm asking and I have read lots and lots of pages on this thread. I have a h800 bought and otw to me so I don't have any hands on or even a manual. I understand that when active 2way front that both channels share the same eq. In other words you can't eq mid and highs separate my understanding. My question is if this is true can you trick it and use a rear channel for either mid or highs so that you can eq separately?



I called Alpine tech and they said that this could be done..... Any hands on experience?


----------



## quality_sound

Every channel has it's own eq. However you assign the channels is up to you. There aren't any true "front" or "rear" channels. They're just labeled that way to help you visualize the layout. 


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## corcraft

^ok I understand that but I have read here that front active share the same eq. In other words if x-over is active and at 3000hz then when you cut 3000hz you are cutting both the high and mid together is this correct? What I'm wanting to do if possible is control the high and mid eq separately. Maybe I should just wait until I get mine and get it going lol because I may be wrong about this... just what I have picked up from reading here.


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## fcarpio

corcraft said:


> corcraft said:
> 
> 
> 
> This may be in here and I may get flamed but hard to search what I'm asking and I have read lots and lots of pages on this thread. I have a h800 bought and otw to me so I don't have any hands on or even a manual. I understand that when active 2way front that both channels share the same eq. In other words you can't eq mid and highs separate my understanding. My question is if this is true can you trick it and use a rear channel for either mid or highs so that you can eq separately?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I called Alpine tech and they said that this could be done..... Any hands on experience?
Click to expand...

Not separately. Tweets and mids are married Ch 1-3 and 2-4 share the same eq. You can use Ch 1 and 2 for tweets, then 5 and 6 for mids and 7 and 8 for subs.


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## corcraft

Sweet!!! Exactly what I was asking! So that way separate eqs correct? I wanted the pxa because I definitely want a rux rather than pc every time that I want to make an adjustment. However there is a ps8 in the classifieds for a great price and killer control so I wanted to make sure the pxa would do what I wanted before the ps8 gets gone. Now I just need or "want" an optical head unit.


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## fcarpio

corcraft said:


> Sweet!!! Exactly what I was asking! So that way separate eqs correct? I wanted the pxa because I definitely want a rux rather than pc every time that I want to make an adjustment. However there is a ps8 in the classifieds for a great price and killer control so I wanted to make sure the pxa would do what I wanted before the ps8 gets gone. Now I just need or "want" an optical head unit.


I use my phone (Samsung Note 4) and something like this to get optical into the PXA:

HDMI Arc Adapter to HDMI Optical Audio Converter 4K 3D 1080p CEC Special | eBay

Works very well.


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## corcraft

^good idea. I don't use ipod much but still a good alternative. Im going to use a changer for the changer input and will try and run the ipod through 1 of these with the other input.


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## Flyhogz

I want to give a big thanks and props to all the contributors to this thread for the past five years. I somehow got my PXA-H800 installed in a matter of an hour and it sounds pretty solid. Now given, I did plug my crossover, EQ ,and T/A settings from my Bit Ten, and it's far from perfect, but I feel pretty damn good about it considering I have difficulty installing a light bulb (Phillips Hue light bulbs, they can be tricky). It goes to show you, if you study hard and read the same questions and answers over and over for the pertinent material, you can figure it out. Actually, I probably just got lucky. Cheers!


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## Projektmkvii

Got a new H800 and C800 for sale if anyone is interested. 

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## Flyhogz

When utilizing an optical input, would it be advisable to set the output gains at all speaker levels in the crossover menu to maximum +10 dB on the H800? Then set the gains on the amplifier?


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## Lycancatt

curious about something, surround application

5.1 uses six outputs and that leaves two free ones, can I do two way active front plus the center surround and sub? this is a home audio system but I like the controller better than the remote for my old Yamaha preamp, and the old Yamaha only does dts 6 channel input and not optical.


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## nstaln

Lycancatt said:


> curious about something, surround application
> 
> 5.1 uses six outputs and that leaves two free ones, can I do two way active front plus the center surround and sub? this is a home audio system but I like the controller better than the remote for my old Yamaha preamp, and the old Yamaha only does dts 6 channel input and not optical.


Pretty sure the PXA-H800 allows for the use of 8 channels of output for the 5.1 surround; 

ch1) left high
ch2) left low
ch3) right high
ch4) right low
(right and left front 2-way)

ch5) left rear
ch6) right rear
ch7) center
ch8) sub


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## bigguy2010

Does anyone have experience with interfacing the H800 with a Ford Sony system? I have a 2012 F-150 FX4 with the sync, nav and the Sony setup. From my searching around it appears that I need to use the speaker outputs that run to the speakers to get signal for the processor analog inputs. Here's my concern, the Sony outputs are center, front tweets, front mids, rears and sub. What do I need to tie into to get the proper signal? The outputs from the factory radio to the Sony amp won't work from what I've read. I'm looking for high, mid and low to run to my amps for tweets, mids and a sub. I'd like to just get a headunit, but I'd lose the climate control and a rather long list of features along with it. Any advice would be awesome! I posted here so I didn't have to start a new thread, thanks guys!


----------



## Lycancatt

thanks for the breakdown on the 5.1 plus 2 way, really appreciated. its what I guessed but I have yet to fire mine up.

on the ford sync topic, you really need a summing device like the audiocontrol lc7i, the alpine doesn't seem to do summing/de eqing like the lc7


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## bigguy2010

Lycancatt said:


> thanks for the breakdown on the 5.1 plus 2 way, really appreciated. its what I guessed but I have yet to fire mine up.
> 
> on the ford sync topic, you really need a summing device like the audiocontrol lc7i, the alpine doesn't seem to do summing/de eqing like the lc7


So would the JL FiX and TwK combo be a better idea? I'm sure the Jl CS-SSI would do it too but I've spent enough on the Alpine already.

Edit: my center is only for sync and the nav voice from what I've read, so I'll have everything but that for input. Leaning towards the JL combo, it'll do signal summing for me.


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## Nav360

Does the PXA-H800 function similar to the MS-8, where it only requires a certain amount of inputs in order to recreate an full spectrum signal? I under stand the output side, since I'm using 2 tweeters, 2 fronts, 2 rears, 1 center, and 1 sub. With all those speakers connected my output side is maxed out at 8 which is no problem since it's the exact amount I need. I'm more confused on which speakers to tap into for the input side. I came from an MS-8, which was giving me problems with the blindspot, and backup tones being lost. Any tips or help would be greatly appreciated. 


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## Nav360

Bump


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## Dumas

Hi all,

Does anyone here know where I could get my hands on the Sound Manager software? I would prefer not to order one from Alpine, but if that's my last choice, so be it.


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## Nav360

It's available online at https://www.alpine.co.uk/support/so...800-rux-c800-v1110-v2110-firmware-update.html


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## Dumas

Nav360,

Wow that was a fast reply! Thank you!


----------



## Nav360

Yea no problem lol 


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## Niick

Anybody know where I can download the H800 software?


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## jtaudioacc

Dumas said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Does anyone here know where I could get my hands on the Sound Manager software? I would prefer not to order one from Alpine, but if that's my last choice, so be it.


multiple places, but i've always used..
Alpine Electronics of Australia

uk must be sleeping. lol


----------



## Flyhogz

Has anyone experienced intermittent output and performance issues with the unit? 

I can't exactly recreate the issue but sometimes when I start my car the output, dynamics, and tonality of my stage is perfect. On other occasions, the mids are flat, tweets are harsh, and the sub and mid woofers seem bloated and uncontrolled. I'm running the unit active on a 3-way setup with JL HD 600/4 and JL HD900/5 amps.

I'm wondering if it's a voltage issue affecting the boot up when starting the car. However, I am unsure how to isolate the problem. Any insight would be appreciated.


Sent from


----------



## jnchantler

Flyhogz said:


> Has anyone experienced intermittent output and performance issues with the unit?
> 
> I can't exactly recreate the issue but sometimes when I start my car the output, dynamics, and tonality of my stage is perfect. On other occasions, the mids are flat, tweets are harsh, and the sub and mid woofers seem bloated and uncontrolled. I'm running the unit active on a 3-way setup with JL HD 600/4 and JL HD900/5 amps.
> 
> I'm wondering if it's a voltage issue affecting the boot up when starting the car. However, I am unsure how to isolate the problem. Any insight would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> Sent from




That happened on mine one time, but that was it. 

What it does so frequently is play intermittent static/scratchy sounds loudly, I have to turn the car off and on again. Done that at least 15 times in the last 3 years.

It's also been turning off when it's hot, but I think it might not have liked being upside down.


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## Flyhogz

I think it's a voltage issue. I'm going to take it to the local shop this weekend. 


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## BillC

Before someone says rtfm I have spent 16 hours and made it through about half of this post with no clear answers in sight. 

I have a cda-9887, with tua-t550hd module and sirius scc1 with kca-sc100 hooked up via ai-net. No problems here HOWEVER......

I have a pxa-h800 on the way and am rerouting some wiring in my car to facilitate installation when it arrives. I know to use the pxa-h800 with an alpine ai-net head unit I have to flip the switch from normal to eq/div. 


1) So once I do that whats it going to do to my hd and sirius modules since they are not seperate inputs like a cd player and they require the head unit to function? I realize I can just run rcas and use the rux for volume, but id rather not do that, my cars older and only has single din opening in the dash.

2) Additionally, once I get the pxa hooked up, since I am currently running active off the 9887, does the dip switch go back to normal if connecting to the pxa via ai-net? 

3) and if i have to use rcas to keep my hd radio, do i keep the 9887 on active 3 way? Or switch it back to norm?

4) im assuming it would be ideal to just hit defeat, make all crossovers flat all time correction zeroed with multi eq off and send a completely unadulterated signal to the pxa?

5) i plan to run it 2 way front, rear fill, subwoofer so do i just send the pxa one set (L&R) of rca cables? Or three sets.

I have read the install manuals of the h800, and the 9887, as well as the tua-t550hd and kca-sc100 as well as the owners manuals extensively and read over 78 pages of this thread. No clear answers anywhere


Whew that was a mouthful haha, Im a diehard alpine guy but this ****s confusing, backward compatability of ai-net **** is an enigma wrapped in a riddle buried deep in a confusing mystery, and theres so much conflicting information out there. 

Alpine tech hotline is worthless i was told the tua-t550hd was not backward compatible with the 9887 on one occasion, and told the kca-sc100 wasnt either on seperate occasions. And they were dead wrong, ****in rude too! Youd think if someone has clearly invested 3-4 grand in your product at the least youd be courteous and polite?

So calling all alpine experts I need to keep the hd module, would like to use ai-net feed to the h800 for volume control via the head unit but if it isnt doable so be it, but that raises my other questions..... HELP!


----------



## fcarpio

I think you may be making this more complicated than it is.

1 - How do you work the inputs switching now? HU? Keep it the same, the PXA goes after all that.

2 - Yes. You want the full signal to go to the PXA, unless AINET sends the full signal anyway.

3 - That would defeat the purpose of the PXA, right? Norm I would say.

4 - Makes sense, I would do it like that.

5 - Just one if HU set to Norm.

Also, are you sure your unit is compatible with the PXA? From what I understand the PXA either requires the RUX or one of a few selected head units to work. You have the CDA9887, but the link below calls for CDA9887*R*. From what I can see your head unit is not one of them so you may have to get the RUX.

https://www.alpine.co.uk/support/so...800-rux-c800-v1110-v2110-firmware-update.html


----------



## BillC

9887R is european , has RDS, and different scaling of fm frequencies, as far as I know other than that its identical. 

I have the rux, just would like basic control through the head unit.

I have it set NORM on the eq div/norm switch currently thats the problem, to use it to send signal via ai-net to the h800, it has to be switched to EQ/DIV 

I am just unsure what this is going to do to the hd and sirius input and control once Its switched to eq/div because now it is essentially an input via ai-net and switching it makes it an output. 

I'm really looking for someone that has "been there done that" Anybody?


----------



## BillC

Well thatt
Was a bunch of worry for nothing, all hooked up just fine. But im having trouble getting the program to work on pc, i dont have the disks, so im trying to download it and it keeps crashing. But its in and working some small adjustments with the rux so far. I bought it used for a good price, but no sound manager discs, im going to have to do some reading lol


----------



## BillC

HAVE any of you had trouble with the downloaded software not recognizing the unit? It keeps saying it cannot find a device driver not installed

Using windows 7 home premium 64 bit.in a laptop. I have the 2.110 version and the program works, just isnt seeing the rux or pxa hmmm.


----------



## delerium168

Flyhogz said:


> Has anyone experienced intermittent output and performance issues with the unit?
> 
> I can't exactly recreate the issue but sometimes when I start my car the output, dynamics, and tonality of my stage is perfect. On other occasions, the mids are flat, tweets are harsh, and the sub and mid woofers seem bloated and uncontrolled. I'm running the unit active on a 3-way setup with JL HD 600/4 and JL HD900/5 amps.
> 
> I'm wondering if it's a voltage issue affecting the boot up when starting the car. However, I am unsure how to isolate the problem. Any insight would be appreciated.
> 
> 
> Sent from


I had the same issue last year..static sound and time allignment messed up ..couldnt replicate it,thou once back to normal.I had to turn off the car and restarted it .
It happened 2 or 3 times last year for about 2 minutes and back to normal.
I too always wonder if this has something to do with start up /boot up voltage.


----------



## BillC

I have a wierd thing going on with my cda-9887 pxa-h800 setup. I downloaded the current firmware for the 800, using ai-net connection, i have volume control, balance and fader from the head unit, but no access to preset tunes on the 800, and no subwoofer control. When i go into the audio settings of the 9887 it shows subwoofer as off, but will not allow me to turn it on. I have the tua-t550hd and kca-sc100 with scc1 as well. 

I have tried removing all ai-net modules and just going straight to the 9887 and it still doesn't work. I have the 9887 set to eq/div, and set to fr,rr,sw rather than 3 way. I have spent hours reading and tried reinstalling the firmware for the 800 and rux a few times, i have also tried running it without the rux and no matter what i do i have no access to presets or sub control.

Any ideas?


----------



## quickaudi07

I hope, hope, hope you saved your settings to a laptop when you were doing tuning on your laptop.
You have to reload your tune back to the DSP.. When you are doing any kind of frame-ware upgrades on H800 you have to reload your tune or it will be lost... its like upgrading motherboard bios on a computer. all settings in your bios will be lost and set to factory. .. same concept.


----------



## BillC

Yeah I got that part, but its a wierd thing how I have some control via ai-net head unit but no presets or sub control.


----------



## brusty

Hey PXA-h800 experts, I'd love your advice here.

Had the MS-8 for the better part of two years, and it was great for the first six months, and then things started burning out/behaving inconsistently (blame it on using the onboard amps for stage power for most of that time in a very ill-conceived and constrained install space).

Anyhow, did some reading (including most of this very extensive thread) and ended up pulling the trigger on the PXA-h800 and the RUX-c800. Very excited to work with a fully functioning device again that'll also give me much more granular control over the sound to let me tinker in peace. 

*Given your experience, would you advise running 3 way active + sub in the front, or 2 way active (midrange and tweeter passively crossed) + rear + sub?*

Here's a picture of my front door speaker setup.



The 6.5" midbass is an NVX XSP65 in the stock spot (knee level). The 3" midrange is an Infinity Kappa Perfect 300m in the gloss top trim of the door, and the tweeter is a JBL P26t in the sail panel.

The rear speakers are JBL P662 coaxials, again in the stock spot.

Sub duties are handled by a 15" Acoustic Elegance SBP15 run infinite baffle and fired into the cabin through a grill I fashioned behind the armrest of the rear seat. (This is a 2011 Hyundai Sonata, btw.)

Here's my thinking at present. When I was running the MS-8's autotune with a true 2 way front setup (with the original dash speakers + door speakers, and later with just tweeters and midbasses), the image was stable and rock center in the middle of the dash. Which of course was amazing and engaging to listen to. Now with the dedicated midrange in the picture, overall sonic resolution is improved, but with the relatively minimal path difference between mid and tweet, the soundstage is no longer pinpoint accuracy and moves depending on where you look, even with the driver's position-biased tune.

I know localization cues are frequency dependent, so referencing the midranges rather than tweets for setting distance to seating positions post autotune might clear that image somewhat with the Alpine.

Running 3 way active requires me to run another set of wires into the doors, but consider that a negligible factor. Also obviously don't care about not utilizing the P662s as they're basically the weak sonic point of the system now.

I'm currently leaning toward running the wires and going full 3 way active. The passive crossover between mid and tweet was from the original JBL P660c component set the P26t tweeters came from, and tbh I don't even know where it's crossed or at what slope. There don't seem to be any negative sonic artifacts from the crossover, but then again, don't know what I'm missing if I've never heard active 3 way in this setup, right? And I might upgrade the tweeter in the future if I went active...

*Really I'm asking: Are the surround processing capabilities provided by Dolby Pro Logic II or Euphony worth NOT going 3 way active front and just sticking with the currently passively crossed setup, even if that means tweaking delay for the mid-tweeter combo and still possibly coming up short of a holographic soundstage?*

Thanks for reading all of this, and thanks for your thought and replies! This forum has been invaluable to me in the past couple years, even if my wallet sometimes begs to differ.


----------



## drop1

Honest question . The helix dsp pro isn't that much more money than the alpine unit and can run circles around it.
Unless you are running an alpine head unit why would anyone can consider the alpine dsp? 
This post isn't meant to be inflammatory in any way. 
I got a quote on the helix dsp pro for a little over $1000. 

Personally I'm running a jl twk but I paid $250 New in the box for it from a brick and mortar store. 
I can understand the cost/effect of my choice but if you're paying $700 for a dsp it seems the jump to the helix isn't that extreme.


----------



## jnchantler

drop1 said:


> Honest question . The helix dsp pro isn't that much more money than the alpine unit and can run circles around it.
> 
> Unless you are running an alpine head unit why would anyone can consider the alpine dsp?
> 
> This post isn't meant to be inflammatory in any way.
> 
> I got a quote on the helix dsp pro for a little over $1000.
> 
> 
> 
> Personally I'm running a jl twk but I paid $250 New in the box for it from a brick and mortar store.
> 
> I can understand the cost/effect of my choice but if you're paying $700 for a dsp it seems the jump to the helix isn't that extreme.




I don't think The Helix wasn't around when I bought mine, at least it didn't have a controller like the Alpine does. Plus I was working Saturdays at a shop and got the Alpine for cost.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## brusty

drop1 said:


> Honest question . The helix dsp pro isn't that much more money than the alpine unit and can run circles around it.
> Unless you are running an alpine head unit why would anyone can consider the alpine dsp?
> This post isn't meant to be inflammatory in any way.
> I got a quote on the helix dsp pro for a little over $1000.
> 
> Personally I'm running a jl twk but I paid $250 New in the box for it from a brick and mortar store.
> I can understand the cost/effect of my choice but if you're paying $700 for a dsp it seems the jump to the helix isn't that extreme.


Run circles, perhaps, but they're running different races in my mind.  The DSP Pro sounds like an amazing piece of equipment from everything I've read, but I still want a little more convenience compared to the boilerplate RTA I'd have to do off the bat with it.

Marginally cost, but also the tradeoffs between complexity and what I want to accomplish.

Assuming you bring this up in part because the Helix can output 10 channels vs the Alpine's 8.

First, price. I dropped $750 on the Alpine DSP AND controller to make cycling between presets and doing basic on the go adjustment/tuning doable. If you're factoring ~$1,000 for the Helix DSP Pro, still gotta drop ~$400 for the Helix Director to be able to cycle between presets in the car or easily tune. If I want to have some degree of RTA relative to the software, gotta pick up a USB mic, and even if I'm not springing for their official ~$400 add-on kit, we're sitting at twice the price I paid for everything.

Maybe more significantly in the comparison and relative to my question, AFAIK, there's no mixing from a 2 channel source to a simulated surround with the DSP Pro. No Logic 7 as on the MS-8, no Dolby Pro Logic II or Euphony as on the PXA-h800.

To be frank, if the rear speakers can't serve as fill to give a sense of ambiance beyond what I'd be able to accomplish with a regular old head unit by fading more toward the front, I don't want them there at all - I'd be paying substantially more for less convincing fundamental functionality, not to mention I'd need to pick up another amp to power the two speakers currently unaccounted for, adding to cost. No need to reproduce what's in the front behind me or manually pass certain frequencies to try and achieve ambient effect. My level of tinkering on the go is more along the lines of optimizing for seating positions and adjusting response to bring out highlights in certain tracks more prominently (i.e. basic frequency response adjustment of the whole system).

Not as much of a factor, but the semi-******** features like RoadEQ do intrigue me, even if many consider them marginally effective or just shut them off. It grinds my gears that I'd pay at least around $100 extra for a mic I'll only intermittently plug in to tune, even if you can argue I didn't use the MS-8 mic headset outside of tuning, and that was obviously factored into its pricetag.

While I'd still appreciate anyone chiming in with experience with Dolby Pro Logic II or Euphony, I'll likely just take the route of running the wires to enable an active 3 way setup. Wiring for the rear fill speakers is already in place, obviously, so I can easily switch between them if I get curious. Passive crossovers can move out of the doors and into the back near the amp if this happens and I end up settling on simulated surround.

Anyone?


----------



## james2266

I have been using the Apline combo for 2 years now or so and it is the best processor I have used to date. I have not had the luxury of having my hands on the Helix Pro but I will say it knocks the socks off the Audison Bit One and Mosconi 6-8 I used previously.

I did have the same thoughts as you have back when I got it and was seriously considering the surround sound avenue. It is the center channel that is the most important to me and certainly not the rear speakers. The only vehicle I have heard that was awesome doing surround was Gary Summer's vehicle. That one was running like 6 amps and 2 processors one of which was the Alpine F1 unit which is like the Helix Pro with surround sound (if I recall). 

I would say, go 3 way front and sub like I have done and call it a day. The only way I would use this for surround would be if I went all out and grabbed a 2nd processor and run 3 way active rear as well with the midrange and tweets up high and as far back as possible (like Mr. Summers' ride). That is not something I am financially able to do or really have much desire to do really. I have heard many a 3 way front setup well with this unit and it will more than satisfy most ears including mine


----------



## brusty

james2266 said:


> I have been using the Apline combo for 2 years now or so and it is the best processor I have used to date. I have not had the luxury of having my hands on the Helix Pro but I will say it knocks the socks off the Audison Bit One and Mosconi 6-8 I used previously.
> 
> I did have the same thoughts as you have back when I got it and was seriously considering the surround sound avenue. It is the center channel that is the most important to me and certainly not the rear speakers. The only vehicle I have heard that was awesome doing surround was Gary Summer's vehicle. That one was running like 6 amps and 2 processors one of which was the Alpine F1 unit which is like the Helix Pro with surround sound (if I recall).
> 
> I would say, go 3 way front and sub like I have done and call it a day. The only way I would use this for surround would be if I went all out and grabbed a 2nd processor and run 3 way active rear as well with the midrange and tweets up high and as far back as possible (like Mr. Summers' ride). That is not something I am financially able to do or really have much desire to do really. I have heard many a 3 way front setup well with this unit and it will more than satisfy most ears including mine


Perfect - great to hear. Was leaning more and more toward this course of action as I came back to the pros and cons in my mind. Just wanted a prod.


----------



## Oteex

Neil_J said:


> Quick question, hopefully one of you guys can help me out.....
> 
> The power connector to the H800 has two blue/white wires coming out of it -- one for the remote turn-on lead, and one output to the amplifier. I cut and extended the leads and wrapped them in Techflex, so now I have no idea which wire is which. Can anyone look at their connector and get back to me?
> 
> The connector looks like this (wire side of the connector, as seen looking at the H800)
> 
> 
> 
> So which blue/white wire is which? Thanks in advance.


Hello,

I'm new here. I leave in France.
I've buy an alpine PXA-H800 for part.
I whant to test it but i don't have the power lead.
Can you tell me to whom correspond brooches on the grip?
Or can be have you a photo of the grip or we see the position pin

thank you


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## eviling

Will this decode logic 7?

Sent from my unknown using Tapatalk


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## TryDoingSomethingNew

"Will this decode logic 7?"

Hi there - no it can't. Logic 7 is a proprietary "encoding" that's not a true discrete codec like DTS or DD, therefore there aren't commercially available processors to support it.


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## t3sn4f2

TryDoingSomethingNew said:


> "Will this decode logic 7?"
> 
> Hi there - no it can't. Logic 7 is a proprietary "encoding" that's not a true discrete codec like DTS or DD, therefore there aren't commercially available processors to support it.


To add, Logic 7 isn't an encoded audio track that comes with the media. Which needs processor support to decode it, the way DTS or DD does. It is an on the fly upmixer like Dolby PLII which creates a x.1 sound field out of a standard stereo signal. The H800 uses PLII and the JBL MS-8 uses Logic 7.


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## MitchWolos

Anyone know about the PCM 3ch mode? I'm curious how it's matrixed?


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## TryDoingSomethingNew

MitchWolos said:


> Anyone know about the PCM 3ch mode? I'm curious how it's matrixed?


When I had the PXA-H701, it appeared to unfortunately be only L + R, and wasn't a "real" derived center channel. I wanted to use it badly but that obviously pulled the image all over the front.

I had planned to use Pro Logic II as well but in the PXA-H701 the Pro Logic II volume output was WAY too low...probably _at least_ -12dB. And that's with the output level set to +5.

The H800 so far doesn't seem to have that issue. I'm hoping to install my center channel speaker soon and test the Euphony center channel generation. I couldn't find any documentation or information *anywhere* which is odd.

If I were you I'd make a simple center channel test setup and try it out.

As I recall back in the 90s the custom installs that had a "center channel" weren't done properly and were nearly always a L + R, which I never understood (obviously not concerned with good imaging).


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## BillC

Has anyone ever tried running two h800 units in master slave configuration? Similar to hos the old pra-h400 units could be ran?


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## BillC

I have a weird question about importing curves into imprint on the h800. We all know how the 9887 imprint units worked, very good imaging, good everything except very light on the bass (for an auto tune setup, not competition) I was curious if you could import the curve, files from an imprint run on the 9887 into the pxa-h800. It just seems like it would give a nice baseline to start tuning from.

also when you create a target curve and run auto tune on the 800, I am guessing it tries to recreate that curve with proper time delay and upfront imaging etc? the manual does not say much about it. do any of you have a good street curve that i could import into the 800? what format does it need to be in? I am just bored today and playing with the auto tune features hahaha. 

It almost has me wanting to put my 9887 back in, run it in active mode into the 800 with rca jacks, do an imprint run, and then save the tune it comes up with? just curious if anyone has tried it?obviously i would'nt let it do the ant-eq for a stock head unit, but trick it into believing it is getting an unadultered signal.


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## EvertonCa

I have my PXA for almost 5 years now. And I’m having 2 problems. The first I’m not really sure if it is really a pxa problem, but sometimes the balance just goes to the left! And it goes slowly, shifting from the center to the left, stays there sometime and then goes back to the center. This happens in aux (oem input) AND optical input.
The second problem is that everytime I leave the car turned off for a couple of hours, the pxa loses it’s memory. It’s like I’ve disconnected it from the 12+ supply. It’s really annoying! 
Anyone having some problem like this? Or knows what to do? There is no alpine assistance here in Brazil.


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## darryldarryl

Is it still worth buying the Alpine PXA-H800 or should I go with the Helix DSP2?


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## hdrugs

It's higher resolution but i can't really hear it, the h800 to helix

If you can make use of the extra channels and give up tweaking of the controller


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## nadams5755

h800: fully tunable via the rux, pl2 if you want a good center channel algorithm (compared to l+r) and a better rear-fill algorithm (vs l-r). it's larger compared to the helix dsps. it's a little long in the tooth but they're still selling them.

helix: i/o module support, arguably the best pc-based dsp software. director is smaller than the rux but not full featured. must use a pc to tune it.

both are quite popular on this side of the country


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## darryldarryl

Connected the pxa-h800 successfully, but I have a question. I turned off the subwoofer 2 as I am only using one subwoofer. While subwoofer 2 is off, I noticed that the output got weak using only subwoofer 1 setting. Is this normal or should I use rca y adapters going to the amplifier?


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## BillC

I believe you would want to keep both on, as it also kills the input when you turn it off? I noticed the same thing with mine and just left it on


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## p2mdp2

Hi Jim, I have a 2018 bmw m240 that came with the basic low-fi sys. I replaced the oem drivers in the front doors with Focal ifbmw's with in-line passive crossovers, the rear deck sp were replaced with jl C5-400cm mids, C5-075ct tweeters, and C5-525-XO. The amp is a JL xds 600/6v2 connected via the analog feed from the oem hu with a Technic harness. I purchased the Alpine HUX-h800 and am having difficulty getting the auto calibration to work as i keep getting the "volume too low" on both TCR and imprint despite increasing the input sensitivity on the amp. Also prior to running the imprint it calibrates the volume from the hu and i get "ok"


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## BillC

i tried doing a search and have spent hours combing through posts in this thread and others. I am trying to setup rew to properly suggest crossover filter settings that match the h800. I have read through all associated data and spec sheets. and alpine does not list what the crossover filters are, and if they change when going from 1st order to 2nd or 3rd order (6db,12db,18db etc. etc.)

based on all the info i have found i think it is reasonable to assume they are butterworth filters.. but can someone tell me for sure exactly what the filters are at each slope.. are they linkwitz riley, butterworth, bessel, etc?

it is just a huge time saver and helps with the learning curve of room eq wizard if i can get its suggested settings matched to the h800,s capabilities.. and i am basically a complete neophyte.


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## Projektmkvii

Just an FYI Subwoofer level control is now available through the controller. You will need to send in the controller to Alpine to get it updated. 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## BillC

maresgti12 said:


> Just an FYI Subwoofer level control is now available through the controller. You will need to send in the controller to Alpine to get it updated.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk




That's been available since way before I bought mine.. did you send it to them to have the firmware updated? The version for use with ina-w910 has sub level control on the head unit and the version you use with decks like the cda-9887 have sub level control on the rux.

As a side note to all you guys running the h800.. what average temps do you see on yours? Mine seems to hover around 117°F it's never caused a problem yet it seems high????


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## mark3004

maresgti12 said:


> Just an FYI Subwoofer level control is now available through the controller. You will need to send in the controller to Alpine to get it updated.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Just bought a used one, and subwoofer level control is available from controller.


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## NeedfulThink

Hello all!

I connected my H800 (incl. RUX) via AI from HU (IVA D800R at EQ-Mode). 
How can I additionally use one of the 3 AuxIns?
Is it possible somehow??
This is *E X T R E M E L Y* important for us!

many thanks!


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## TryDoingSomethingNew

NeedfulThink said:


> I connected my H800 (incl. RUX) via AI from HU (IVA D800R at EQ-Mode).
> How can I additionally use one of the 3 AuxIns?


Hi there NeedfulThink. I got notice of your post tonight (No idea why I haven't seen the earlier posts this year as well!)

To use AUX inputs, when Ai-Net is connected via an Alpine head unit currently I'm having to use the KCA-410c dual AUX input & dual CD changer input expander module. That allows me to switch to AUX input mode from the head unit Source button and it uses the Ai-Net analog stereo path on the bus to route audio to the PXA-H800 (just as my PXA-H701 I formerly owned did).

According to the PXA-H800 documentation:

"_When an Ai-NET compatible head unit is connected, the source should be switched at the head unit. This feature is disabled on the Commander_"

...which I'm sure you're probably already aware of.

However, as the PXA-H800 has the AUX capability built-in, it would make sense logically that we should be able to switch the PXA-H800 AUX input sources from the Ai-Net head unit.

Unfortunately I'm not convinced that's true, and I'll need to verify this by removing my KCA-410c and seeing if my DVA-7996 will still switch to the H800's AUX inputs.

For now, I can recommend you look for a low-priced KCA-410c. When I checked tonight the prices on eBay were ridiculously high (some of these eBay sellers are pretty stupid!) but I paid less than $100 as I recall. I've seen them for much cheaper 

Hopefully this helps!


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## TryDoingSomethingNew

BillC said:


> i tried doing a search and have spent hours combing through posts in this thread and others. I am trying to setup rew to properly suggest crossover filter settings that match the h800. I have read through all associated data and spec sheets. and alpine does not list what the crossover filters are, and if they change when going from 1st order to 2nd or 3rd order (6db,12db,18db etc. etc.)


Hi Bill. That's a great question. As I believe, but would need to try to confirm, that they're likely Linkwitz-Riley crossovers and not Butterworth as if I'm not mistaken most car audio digital signal processors (DSPs) are L-R type.

Also the crossover types would not change based on the filter order, unless specified elsewhere. As I recall from my transforms class at college it was just another digital implementation of the same filter but basically an extension on the 1st order function.

I'm trying to recall if the PXA-H701 I used to used specified the order type, but I can't recall at the moment. However I'm 75% confident about it being L-R filter types as it's quite a "loose" standard in the industry.

I hope this helps some! I'll try to look and see if I find out more. Please post a comment or message me if you don't hear back, as sometimes I'm juggling several things during the week and I "drop" one if you will


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## TryDoingSomethingNew

BillC said:


> As a side note to all you guys running the h800.. what average temps do you see on yours? Mine seems to hover around 117°F it's never caused a problem yet it seems high????


Yeah, it's probably not a real issue, but that's definitely a bit warm for an audio DSP IC. Mine is also around 117-121 degrees.

I suspect there's either no heatsink or a poor one mounted on the DSP IC inside and that's likely a big contributing factor as well. I haven't opened my unit up yet but likely will soon to confirm this when I do something else unrelated.

*The H701 ran pretty cool and also allowed subwoofer control from a connected Ai-Net head unit instead of requiring the RUX controller to be used*, which disappointed me greatly when I discovered that.

The PXA-H701 was very reliable and worked great despite somewhat more limited than the PXA-H800.

However, the H800 has firmware bugs I've seen occur a number of times. This as well as some other flaws have affected my opinion of it fairly significantly although it does sound good and I still enjoy using it.


----------



## BillC

Agreed. For kicks I swapped in a pxa-h701 brain and its integration, and control, with the ina-w910 is much better, seamless too. With the rux the additional optical ports could be selected.. however this was not the case with the h800. All additional inputs on the h800 are no longer accessable when used with an ainet head unit (unless they are ainet devices.) To plug my cell phone in I had to use a 3.5mm to rca patch cable. And it is low voltage, the noise floor is appalling as well. When using the h800 and rux as a stand alone.. it is much more versatile with input options. 

I believe the h701 used butterworth on the even order slopes and I am not sure on the odd order slopes. Alpine used to post this information with their products owners manual. They do not list it anywhere with the h800, I even emailed and called alpine tech support several months ago and never got a response from them. .... I recently experimented with a friends iPad mini, it has a digital optical output and with the correct upgrades even properly decodes Dolby, and other 5.1 surround recordings. With an FM radio app.. it worked well as the single source into the h800, and h701... it was very impressive! For now I will stay with alpine double din control primarily because of the CD changer and ability to control and feed it optically into the dsp.. I too have noticed the firmware quirks and bugs. About once a month it requires a restart to get it to act right. This is a currently sold and supported unit from Alpine and I cannot believe they have not issued a firmware update in 5 years or more as this is a known problem. I wonder if using the UK website firmware on a north American market brain is the cause of it? I bought mine used and did not receive the setup disks for firmware changes and had to download them.


----------



## BillC

I have subwoofer level control from the ina-w910 without use of the rux, when used with a cda-9887 I did not have subwoofer level control without the rux. (Talking about the h800) had sub level control with all ainet units and the 700, 701. I would be hard pressed to say the 700 or 701 are inferior.. sure they have limited analog input options, and no PC tuning options. Substantially less parametric eq.. but they do some things better than the h800 does. When I bought my 800 used 700 and 701 units were still very high priced. Now a brain and controller can be had for 400 or less and that is quite the bargain for what it is. I have contemplated selling the h800, yet know I will likely keep both as I have began to collect/hoard ainet stuff and I just cannot bring myself to part with it once i have it.


----------



## TryDoingSomethingNew

Hi Bill - ok thanks for that. I would be curious where you heard about the Butterworth detail, as I haven't gotten that level of detail yet I think.

Regarding the optical inputs:

1. You can use any CD head unit - I still have my old DVA-7996 and just unplugged the optical connection and have it plugged into my very nice Bose Bluetooth receiver.

I put the DVA in CD mode with the disc stopped. Works wonderfully!

2. I've also experimented doing the same as #1 but with Android devices with HDMI output and using an HDMI audio extractor with TOSLINK connection, for 5.1 sound.

It works great. I haven't worked out the Android device (tablet, likely) installation details yet but I'm very close.

The sound, in principle, should be bit-perfect all the way back to the PXA-H800 in that case. Bluetooth currently sounds excellent, but the protocol does require altering the audio, unfortunatetly.


----------



## NeedfulThink

Hello TryDoing,

thanks, we know the KCA-410c. We have 2 KCA-400c on spare...
But this is not the problem. And not the solution...
We need one AUX INPUT (why, is a very loooong story...)
So... the one and only question is:
How can we additionally use one (or more) of the 3 AUX INs?
That is *absolutely *necessary!

The install manual IM_PXA-H800, Page 16 says:

"If connecting DVA-5210, connect it between the unit and the head unit using an additional Ai-NET extension cable. In this case, also connect the audio output jacks (L=white/R=red) of DVA-5210 to the AUX INPUT CH-1 (L)/CH-2 (R) jacks of the unit."

...so these inputs are usable with a Ai-HU...!?!?

And no, we have no DVA-5210 ;-)
But the install manual say it. So there is somehow a way to use???



TryDoingSomethingNew said:


> However, as the PXA-H800 has the AUX capability built-in, it would make sense logically that we should be able to switch the PXA-H800 AUX input sources from the Ai-Net head unit.


we see it exactly like that! (...or from the RUX)
but we have no idea how 
After a long time searching... we think... we need a Firmware Mod or so :surprised:

greetz!


----------



## BillC

If you are using a CD changer you could use a kca-801b. This would give you additional inputs.. I did not notice what head unit you are using. Many of them turn the rca outputs into additional inputs when you switch to eq/ div mode for ainet.. some do and some do not.


----------



## BillC

NeedfulThink said:


> Hello all!
> 
> I connected my H800 (incl. RUX) via AI from HU (IVA D800R at EQ-Mode).
> How can I additionally use one of the 3 AuxIns?
> Is it possible somehow??
> This is *E X T R E M E L Y* important for us!
> 
> many thanks!



Please tell me exactly what you are wanting to input and the rest of your system and perhaps I can better suggest options. CD changer, ipod, dab, TV tuner... everything in your preamp section and then we can see what your options are.. your deck should have a set of rca inputs for an audio video input. You should also have the CD changer optical and ainet port on the h800. The kca-801b is an easy option to add an input if you are limited. Or as others have said the 410 or 400 multi changer hubs... curious if you would be interested in selling one of the multi changer hubs?


----------



## NeedfulThink

hello BillC,

thanks, but sorry... 
*the one and only question is:*
How can we additionally use one (or more) of the 3 AUX INs at EQ-Mode? 
Plz, no other options... like KCA aso...

Thx!

b.t.w. ...


BillC said:


> Many of them turn the rca outputs into additional inputs when you switch to eq/ div mode for ainet..


...this is little wrong!
the turned rca outputs into "additional inputs", after switch to eq/ div mode, goes *DIRECTLY *to the HU-Amps! 
You *NOT *can use it like AUXxx input.

So you can use a PXA without external Amp


----------



## BillC

On the h800 the additional inputs are not usable in ainet mode period! You'll have to use a 410c, 400 hub, or a change and a kca-801b... unless your head unit allows other inputs and it is not available in north America. So I have never had cause to read the iva-d800r manual..


----------



## TryDoingSomethingNew

NeedfulThink said:


> Hello TryDoing,
> thanks, we know the KCA-410c. We have 2 KCA-400c on spare...
> But this is not the problem. And not the solution...
> We need one AUX INPUT (why, is a very loooong story...)
> So... the one and only question is:
> How can we additionally use one (or more) of the 3 AUX INs?


Hello, you're not paying attention to what Bill and I are saying.

a) *The KCA-410c is not the same as the KCA-400c.*

b) The KCA-410c or using a CD changer adapter (as Bill mentioned) IS the solution

*The KCA-410c is an AUX input adapter which provides 2 AUX inputs.*

_How can we additionally use one (or more) of the 3 AUX INs at EQ-Mode?_

In aftermarket stereo mode (no Ai-Net) you can access the AUX inputs using the RUX controller. However, *this function is not accessible when using an Ai-Net head unit.*

Therefore the only other way is to disconnect the Ai-Net cable and use the RUX for volume and source input selection, including the AUX inputs.

It you're capable of modifying electronics & wiring, it is also possible to modify the Ai-Net cable and use the stereo analog channels (wired to female RCA jacks) which will allow bypassing the head unit's analog signal and effectively creating an AUX input.

However I probably wouldn't recommend that, given that other options exist.


----------



## NeedfulThink

Yes, we know it. thx!

Let me say it by a other way... 
We need a AUX INPUT *DIRECTLY *at the PXA-H800 (at EQ/Div -Mode). 

does anyone have a firmware mod or so?

Thx to all!


----------



## TryDoingSomethingNew

NeedfulThink said:


> Yes, we know it. thx!
> 
> Let me say it by a other way...
> We need a AUX INPUT *DIRECTLY *at the PXA-H800 (at EQ/Div -Mode).
> 
> does anyone have a firmware mod or so?
> 
> Thx to all!


1. No, there's no way to modify the firmware.

2. You cannot get AUX access any other way.

Please, re-read the responses from Bill and I above. 

You have 4 options so far for getting an AUX input. 5 if you add using an analog-to-digital converter to send it via a TOSLINK connection with the head unit in CD mode.

If you _absolutely must_ in only using the built-in AUX inputs, you'll have to disconnect the Ai-Net connection and use the RUX controller.

That's it.

What is the requirement for using ONLY the built-in AUX jacks?


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## BillC

If you just want another toslink input.. you can get a 2 into 1 optical toslink splitter pure o2o monoprice has a small switching device you could trick it. You mentioned the 5210 with ainet and the additional 2 rca connections.. I believe that is a work around for that unit to have true 5.1 surround?? 

All I can say is I have been down this road and with an ainet head unit you are actually limited in inputs available on the h800. If we knew exactly what you are trying to do perhaps we can offer a more viable solution that you may have overlooked. Curious.. why are you against the kca-410?? It easily gives you 2 sets of additional stereo inputs that can be selected from the ainet head unit... you could just ditch the ainet deck and use an iPad mini with toslink output, download an FM radio app, a good nav app, and lossless music files.. and use the rux as a stand alone controller.. the h800 has been out for almost 8 years now and I have not heard of anyone hacking or modifying its firmware, another option you may consider is using your stock head unit and a vpa-b2111 ainet hub.. it actually has full control of a pxa-h701 and can be integrated with your stock DVD nav unit and allows rear zone monitors etc... again I ask.. exactly what do you have, and perhaps there is a way to do it through your head unit and existing equipment... this forum is all about sharing information and helping .. but you limit the help you get if you leave out half the system layout. You may have overlooked something simple and easy.


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## BillC

NeedfulThink said:


> hello BillC,
> 
> thanks, but sorry...
> *the one and only question is:*
> How can we additionally use one (or more) of the 3 AUX INs at EQ-Mode?
> Plz, no other options... like KCA aso...
> 
> Thx!
> 
> b.t.w. ...
> 
> 
> ...this is little wrong!
> the turned rca outputs into "additional inputs", after switch to eq/ div mode, goes *DIRECTLY *to the HU-Amps!
> You *NOT *can use it like AUXxx input.
> 
> So you can use a PXA without external Amp


You are correct it puts the front and rear channels back into the deck. But it doesnt look the processors sub output to the decks sub output.. or you would have no output for subwoofers.. and on some decks the subwoofer output can then be turned on as an auxiliary input on the stereo itself. Each one is different. Some allow the decks subwoofer output to become an input and some do not. At least north American units do.. perhaps the units for Europe with the "R" suffix do not?? And in general the manuals are very vague. Have you spoken to alpine America tech support? They can be helpful at times


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## fcojav

Hey, folks. I have a question regarding the equalization of my system. I have configured my speakers in 3 active ways and a subwoofer but I don't know if eq can be applied to each channel. (Tweeters, midrange and midbass) independently. I have only been able to apply general equalization to the components as a whole, i.e. take the left side (tw, midrange and midbass) and the same goes for the right side. It cannot be applied separately to each speaker ? Am I doing something wrong ?


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## nadams5755

in the rux, i think you keep highlighting your way through the selected interfaces to get individual interfaces. i remember seeing like "all left" then "all right" then individual channels.

maybe there's a setting to change eq style from input to output


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## fcojav

I did it but it's not useful to select by driver independently. Only selects the left channel separately from the right channel (includes midrange and midbass tweeters).


Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk


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## papasin

fcojav said:


> Hey, folks. I have a question regarding the equalization of my system. I have configured my speakers in 3 active ways and a subwoofer but I don't know if eq can be applied to each channel. (Tweeters, midrange and midbass) independently. I have only been able to apply general equalization to the components as a whole, i.e. take the left side (tw, midrange and midbass) and the same goes for the right side. It cannot be applied separately to each speaker ? Am I doing something wrong ?



Not on here very much anymore but ran into this post.

Anyway, assuming you are using GEQ, the best workaround to do this is to configure the H800 to 2-way, rear, sub(s). Don’t set up any sort of PL2 or rear fill processing however.

You would then physically hook up tweeters to ch1-2, midbasses to 3-4, then your midranges to 5-6, sub(s) to 7-8.

What this will allow you have is 31-band separate L/R for ch1-4, 31-band L/R for 5-6, and 10-band L/R 7-8. Since your tweeters and midbasses will be on the upper and lower bands of the 31-bands, there should be enough band separation that you effectively have them far enough apart in their crossover regions that you do not have overlapping bands. With your midranges on Ch5-6, they would have a dedicated 31-band L/R. And subs would have 10-band L/R.

Hope that makes sense and helps.


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## fcojav

I had thought of this solution but I did not give it credibility as I thought it would be crazy. Hahaha 

It is not understood that alpine has not given the 31 eq independently to each driver. What were they thinking? 

Thank you very much for confirming what I thought


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## tonynca

Anyone here have one of these for sale with the c800 controller? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Projektmkvii

tonynca said:


> Anyone here have one of these for sale with the c800 controller?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I do bnib. Pm me

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## BillC

+
Google Video














ERROR: If you can see this, then Google Video is down or you don't have Flash installed.







maresgti12 said:


> I do bnib. Pm me
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk



I sent pm, also looking for just a brain, don't need rux, but if price is right maybe


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## BillC

papasin said:


> Not on here very much anymore but ran into this post.
> 
> Anyway, assuming you are using GEQ, the best workaround to do this is to configure the H800 to 2-way, rear, sub(s). Don’t set up any sort of PL2 or rear fill processing however.
> 
> You would then physically hook up tweeters to ch1-2, midbasses to 3-4, then your midranges to 5-6, sub(s) to 7-8.
> 
> What this will allow you have is 31-band separate L/R for ch1-4, 31-band L/R for 5-6, and 10-band L/R 7-8. Since your tweeters and midbasses will be on the upper and lower bands of the 31-bands, there should be enough band separation that you effectively have them far enough apart in their crossover regions that you do not have overlapping bands. With your midranges on Ch5-6, they would have a dedicated 31-band L/R. And subs would have 10-band L/R.
> 
> Hope that makes sense and helps.


If you setup as 2 way front with rear fill and stereo subs, it will actually allow 31 band to a set of channels, so if you have a trouble area and need that much eq it is doable, plus by doing so it allows higher line level to that set of drivers.


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## isamu

Hi guys. Quick question. I'm thinking about getting an PXA-H800. When the unit is connected to a pc, does the PC see the alpine pxa-h800 as a sound card? In other words, does the unit allow the pc to pass audio through its USB connection, completely bypassing the need for a toslink or analog connection?


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## slowhatch

isamu said:


> Hi guys. Quick question. I'm thinking about getting an PXA-H800. When the unit is connected to a pc, does the PC see the alpine pxa-h800 as a sound card? In other words, does the unit allow the pc to pass audio through its USB connection, completely bypassing the need for a toslink or analog connection?


Unfortunately, it does not. You would need to use the optical in, aux in, or RCA inputs.
I am about to remov mine if you are interest in the PCs-h800 and controller.


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## Bnlcmbcar

No it does not feature USB audio input


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## isamu

Thanks guys. Two more questions....

1)I have a PXA-H700 unit w/ head controller(RUX-C700) already installed in my car. Would the plug from wire/cable that connects to my RUX-C700 head unit fit the RUX-C800 head unit? Or will I need to run a new cable specific to the RUX-C800? 

2)I understand that the unit can be fully tuned with a PC, which I already have installed. Does the PC allow main volume and input selection controls on the PXA-H800?


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## slowhatch

I am not familiar with the cable the H700 used. If it’s an AiNet cable, it will work. Yes you can control volume and input select from a pc. I would not recommend using a pc as the controller. It would be very clunky.


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## isamu

Thank you for the reply slowhatch much appreciated. 

I have decided to hang onto my H700 for now. I'm still pretty happy with the sound but I know it could sound better and want to make more adjustments.

The only reason I was considering upgrading to the H800 is because I figured it would be easier to fine tune the sound via the graphical equalizer and since this can be done by simply loading EQ profiles via PC, it would make life much easier. 

I've been using my H700 for years but never really took the time to fine tune it. The reason is because, well...I don't have any experience with tuning good sound through a graphical EQ. With my current EQ settings, the highs are too high and my hearing seems to have suffered a bit because of it. 

I'm looking for suggestions on what settings would be good for me and the type of music I listen to(ie 80's Rock/Pop, ie New Order, Depeche Mode, etc). Is there a website where I can go that has graphical EQ setting suggestions for different types of music, that pertain to the same type of EQ featured on the H700? 

Tuning the sound of the H700 via the graphical EQ is quite frankly a pain in the rear due to the nature of the control scheme and the fact that you need to adjust each channel individually one by one. I don't mind taking the time to do it, but I want to make sure the sound is good.


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## slowhatch

I am by no means an expert but in my opinion you need to either spend the time to learn the process and or pay someone who knows what they are doing. 
And when I say someone who knows what they are doing, I don’t just mean someone who will break out an RTA. Though many find that approach acceptable. 

In my limited experience, it will be very hard to find someone who is truly next level. I know only one person at that level and they work as an Engineer for one of the large audio manufacturers.

Again, I know almost nothing and this is all just my uneducated opinion.

Good luck with your pursuit.


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## Dr Dam

Hey there just got an H800 installed, I have 4 input channels from my HU to the device (FL, FR, RL, RR). Is there any way to assign these inputs to the output channels individually?

When using FL/FR channels from my HU to channel 1/2 on the h800 my sub has almost no bass under 50hz. When I switch to using RL/RR to channel 1/2 on h800 my sub has full range within crossover but my front speakers/tweeters sound worse.

My hunch is that the signal from the factory HU is equalized differently for front speakers and rear speakers so that's why there's such a difference when changing input to h800 channel 1/2.

My question is can I assign the input and outputs specifically to each other, ex. can I use front speaker inputs for front speakers and back speaker inputs for sub?

Thanks in advance


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## Sam Spade

*Short version:* Can I do rear fill with an Alpine PXA-H800 and my setup and will it deliver the tuning settings I want? (I've tried to work this out but am getting nowhere):
_Setup:_
Head unit is a single din Kenwood KDC-X7100DAB. Passive setup speakers and amps are:

front door speakers Hertz Mille MLK 1650.3 legend -2Way, excellent hi level tweeter position
rear door speakers Hertz Mille MLK 165.3 legend - 2Way tweeters 2/3 way up door
subs are two Hertz EBXF20.5 - 8" Enclosed Subwoofer boxes under a false floor in the wagon area just behind the rear seat
amps three Hertz HP802 SPL - class AB Stereo Amplifier 330rms into 4 ohms
I initially ideally want to tune 4 primary settings that I can switch between:

driver only and rear speakers switched off
driver only rear speakers used for rear fill
four passengers all speakers on 
doors and tailgate open sitting around a campfire
Oh and I have an Astell and Kern A&ultima SP1000M Digital audio player which is completely unbelievable for all sorts of uses and I'm ripping my 1000+ CDs to it in 16/44 FLAC. I am running it analog into the Aux in of the Kenwood and it sounds sublime but it also has USB out. So I think I can run it digital into the head unit but maybe also directly into the DSP. Advice welcome on this. 

*Long version:*
Right, I have recently installed a new car hifi system. Well had it installed. Pics and details here Which DSP should I get or don't I need one........ but it's a proper 4WD turbo diesel station wagon with a low range gear box that will go anywhere. I typically drive around the city alone, but on long trips can often have 4 people in the car driving for hours on end. So awesome sound, rear speakers and an OEM appearance were all part of the brief. It sounds awesome, like unbelievably awesome but I now realise that a DSP will improve that. 

I had been heading towards a Helix DSP pro Mk2 but only being able to tune with a laptop, and having to spend AU$460 extra for the HELIX DIRECTOR Remote Control is an issue, it would have to be a lot better to spend 500 bucks more than the Alpine which I can get here with a remote included for the same price as the Helix without one. I don't mind using a laptop. But I'd like a phone/tablet app as well. I don't want to carry a $2K laptop around in the car with me. I was drawn to the Helix cos everyone says the helix sounds better but no one has been able to articulate how/why that is the case.

My installer also has lots of experience with the Alpine and he says: "Also the Helix having a 100% need to have a PC for even simple switching is very backwards, vs the Alpine, Hertz and audio control which have apps which you could easily use on a tablet, or phone to adjust on the fly and the Alpine and Hertz having full display remote controls allowing many presets to be dialed in for listening alone, with a car full, different types of music, if your in the mood for bass or the mood for unbelievable clarity you can adapt on the fly whilst driving like a road trip situation. The fact the Alpine has a built in audio analysis microphone also puts it on another level as you can visualise the response curve and how your changes are actually translating to the sound profile, then the ability to make and adjust the presets on your phone or Android based music player is next level and gives you the ability to take advantage of all the power of the DSP without the need for a degree in audio engineering and computer programming. . The analysis mic also allows a level of noise cancellation and compensation for road noise and harmonics to keep the sound profile uniform at all times, to me that sounds fairly revolutionary."

I have great noise insulation, but we could drive hundreds of KM on unpaved roads on some trips. So the road noise cancellation really grabs me. I also get the impression that not only is my installer an expert with the Alpine I could get up to speed with it pretty quickly and with the helix that might not be the case.

Thanks in advance
Sam


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## atgeorge70

Does any one have the two tracks on the installation disc of PXA H800, track 1 for setting volume and track 2 for setting imprint EQ. I have misplaced my CD and do need them for reinstall


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## BillC

The discs are still available through alpine and or pacparts.


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## atgeorge70

BillC said:


> The discs are still available through alpine and or pacparts.


Thanks, I do have written to them, but did not get a reply yet. Meanwhile, I was hoping if someone had this disc, he could copy the two files and share it with me over mail or this forum. In any case, my new car does not have a CD drive, so eventually, I will have to copy these tracks on a pen drive and play through USB.


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## isamu

slowhatch said:


> I am not familiar with the cable the H700 used. If it’s an AiNet cable, it will work. Yes you can control volume and input select from a pc. I would not recommend using a pc as the controller. It would be very clunky.



I just read the manual of the Alpine PXA-H700(the I own) and yes, it uses the Ai-NET connection as its interface between the base unit and the head unit. So that means hopefully no need to run new cables when installing an H800. Yay!


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## Naveen

Centre Channel

Hi All,

I am new to this forum. 

I have an issue with my Center Channel. (this has been there since a few years now)

To begin with... I have a 2016 Tucson and I had a Win version aftermarket Chinese head-unit and it had a 5.1 channel RCA 

My set-up is 
Head Unit - Chinese 
DSP - PXA H800
Amp 1 - Pioneer GMD-8604 (4 CHANNEL) for my front and back door speakers
Amp 2 - Pioneer GMD-8601 for my Sub 
Amp 3 - Alpine SBS 0715 (amp and speaker set) for my center channel.

My setting on the PXA was Input - 5.1 ch Input and Output - 5.1ch system (Front2Way+Rear+Center+Subwoofer)

I have tried playing genuine movie DVD with Dolby in my unit and could hear the actual surround sound from it and also i have original Dolby test files and was so too good to hear with the separations and the dialog only from the center channel.

Now i wanted to upgrade my head unit to an Android unit so i could play Youtube, Netflix or something similar. I bought another Chinese Android Head-unit, but now the issue is the head-unit has only 4.1 channel RCA out and because of that the center channel did not work with the same settings and same movie DVD or the Dolby files that i have and with the same setting.(especially the dialog that came only through the center channel - i missed that)

I then changed the PXA input settings from 5.1 ch Input to "4 channel &amp; 2 channel" then it started working but now i can hear the dialog from all the speakers and also from the centre channel.

How do i get the pxa working like before. Can somebody please help.

Thank you in advance


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## atgeorge70

with 4.1, my understanding is that you lose the ability to have a true center channel. If the android unit has a digital out, you can try digital connections on PXA, this could help. An alternative is to use PXA capabilities, like equalizer and time delay to create the right level of the center image - for eg, delay the left and right speaker, so that the center speaker sound reaches first, use the equalizer to cut mid frequencies in the range of 300-600 a bit more than the others. Store this setting in one of the options and recall them based on listening preferences.


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## Naveen

Thank you George for your comments! Well my head -unit does not have a digital out so that is out of question. PXA has a option of Phantom where you can use your right and left to form the center channel. but i have a question can i anyhow use this 4.1 channel and using this 4.1 make a 5th channel out of it which will act as my Center "In".

Thank you!


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## atgeorge70

This is my understanding of 4.1 - FL, FR, RL, RR & Sub, so there is no center channel at source, hence alternatives are the only possibilities. I have used PXA in my previous car, where the HU output was 4 channels and output was set at 5.1 , my current car HU outputs, 5.2 - i.e. FL, FR, RL, RR, C, Sub L & R, since PXA can sum only 5.1 have ignored Sub R, since frequencies below 180Hz are normally present in both channels at near equal dB levels. The output here once again is set for 5.1

The point, I am attempting to make is you have to take a decision on what's important to you, is it listening to music or dialogues, the ability to enjoy dialogues in a near-perfect way while driving is limited given the constrained environment of the car. My choice will be to tune PXA well for music and use the capabilities of PXA like phantom & rear fill for specific needs (store this in one of the presets). With the right level of time delay and EQ settings (use the Global mode, rather than parametric) a good sound imaging is possible. 

For music do use a good sound source; lossless formats like WAV, FLAC, AAC, or similar; formats like MP3 & MP4 have limitations while being upsampled and the aliasing is pretty evident.


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## MitchWolos

Why not just put the PXA into Pro Logic II mode. It will matrix a center channel from the 2 channel input....


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## Joel3c

My H800 has started having an issue whereby the RUX will indicate 'battery low voltage' and the audio would cut out and come back intermittently. 

Could this be a case of a failed capacitor on the H800?


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## Rapture333

Joel3c said:


> My H800 has started having an issue whereby the RUX will indicate 'battery low voltage' and the audio would cut out and come back intermittently.
> 
> Could this be a case of a failed capacitor on the H800?


I have had a failure of my H800 once before, I recommend sending it back into Alpine to get it looked at. However, in the case low voltage you may want to look at your battery and alternator before going that route.


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## seafish

Joel3c said:


> My H800 has started having an issue whereby the RUX will indicate 'battery low voltage' and the audio would cut out and come back intermittently.
> 
> Could this be a case of a failed capacitor on the H800?



Could be, but you might want to check your actual battery condition and connections, as well as the positive and ground connections to the H800, first.


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## soundboy

Someone know the difference of this two dsp setuo. 

Alpine ina-w910r (Optical out) + pxa-h800 + rux-c800 (have this) 

Alpine F#1 DVI-9990R + pxi-h990 (+ TMI-M990 Monitor) 

How sounds best in this case? F#1, is now very old vs H800 gear..


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## bradsk88

soundboy said:


> Someone know the difference of this two dsp setuo.
> 
> Alpine ina-w910r (Optical out) + pxa-h800 + rux-c800 (have this)
> 
> Alpine F#1 DVI-9990R + pxi-h990 (+ TMI-M990 Monitor)
> 
> How sounds best in this case? F#1, is now very old vs H800 gear..


In my opinion the only reason to buy old F1 gear is if you're building a retro system. Or if you absolutely MUST do all Alpine and want a ton of channels (which would require running TWO H990s)

Nowadays, you're better off spending much less for something like a Helix DSP3


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