# Advice and help on speaker change on 2013 A6



## rimmi2002 (Feb 27, 2016)

Hi I have 2013 Prestige A6 V6 version. I find the speakers really low quality in there (Bose speakers) My honda speakers sound more lively and natural than these. 

I wanted to change the stock speakers to new ones. Would like to do it myself. 

From the kicker website, I got the following info for the speakers in my car. 

Front and rear door speakers are 6.5" with 3" depth (x 4)
Front smaller speaker is 3" with 2" depth (x 2)
Rear Smaller Speaker is 3.5" with 2" depth (x 2)
Center is 3" with 2" depth (x 1)


Can someone please advice on what type of speakers would be the best:
I'm looking for the best bang for the buck high end speakers. 
Thinking I can spend ~$150 per pair of front/rear speakers and get similar caliber smaller speakers. 

I was thinking of adding speaker first, then might looking into a sub and then if finally needed an amp. 

My experience with car audio is very limited. I am very good with home audio and other electronic projects. Pretty handy and can do most things with proper instructions/guides. 

Was wondering if there are any guides on how to do a job like this in my car. 
For the 4 fronts and rears, I need to take the door panel down. (found a youtube video of it, thinking It should work)

Anyone know how to access the center channel? 

I'm just starting my search. any help and advice would be great. Thanks.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

I have a lot of info for you. Will reply when I have more time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## washesp (Jan 11, 2016)

You might have to change head units. Especially if you plan on putting a subwoofer. 

There isn't a lot of work involved but your going to need more than just speakers to install


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## rimmi2002 (Feb 27, 2016)

subterFUSE said:


> I have a lot of info for you. Will reply when I have more time.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks. I'm looking forward to your post. Looked at your sig. You have an awesome setup in your S6.



washesp said:


> You might have to change head units. Especially if you plan on putting a subwoofer.
> 
> There isn't a lot of work involved but your going to need more than just speakers to install


No problem. I figured I'd start with the speakers which should be the easiest to do and if I need more sound (which basically means once I start I won't stop) I'll looked next into an amp and sub. 

Though only thing is I don't know how would a head unit fit into this car...seems like there is no dedicated space for one. Audio controls are blended in with the gear box.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

washesp said:


> You might have to change head units. Especially if you plan on putting a subwoofer.
> 
> There isn't a lot of work involved but your going to need more than just speakers to install


You can't change the head unit in an Audi A6. The ignition for the car is connected to it, along with the MMI system which controls too many systems of the car to be disabled.

The best solution is a mObridge DA1 preamp running optical digital into a DSP of your choice. This leaves the MMI fully functional.



I promise I will respond with more details. We are about to go out to see cirque du Soliel tonight, however.

Stay tuned.....


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## bertholomey (Dec 27, 2007)

subterFUSE said:


> You can't change the head unit in an Audi A6. The ignition for the car is connected to it, along with the MMI system which controls too many systems of the car to be disabled.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Have Fun at that show! subterFUSE will steer you in the right direction for sure!!!


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

I have essentially the same car as you, a 2013 Audi S6 with Bose system.


There are some very important things to consider when attempting a stereo upgrade on these cars:


How To Integrate

The biggest issue is that the MMI source unit can't be removed. The MMI is critical to the function of the car as it controls more than just audio and navigation. There are a whole series of car systems that are integrated with the MMI and they are all too critical to be disabled.

Is this a problem? No, not really. There are still very good options for this car to add aftermarket audio. In fact, there are basically 3 general options available:

1. You can keep the factory Bose system and just add a subwoofer. This can be done by using a Line Output Converter to intercept the subwoofer amplified output from the Bose amplifer, and then convert that signal to line level and add your own amp + subwoofer.

This is the most simple approach, and probably the least expensive.


2. You can add an aftermarket DSP with High Level inputs. The Bose amplifier outputs will be routed into the DSP which will convert the High Level signal into Low Level and then process the audio. You then add you own amplifier(s) and speakers.

The Bose speakers are removed and replaced in this case. This is a more complex setup than option 1 above, but is also likely to give you better performance since you will be replacing the Bose speakers.


3. You can add the mObridge DA1 preamp + your own DSP + your own amp(s) & speakers.

The mObridge is a very special device that only works on specific german cars like Audi, BMW and Mercedes (that use the MOST fiber-optic data network). The mObridge bypasses the Bose amplifier and intercepts the audio signal in digital form directly from the MMI. Then it outputs a stereo, optical digital signal that you can feed into a DSP of your choice.

This is the highest quality option, and is what I have done in my car. However, if you do get a mObridge then you will have no choice but to replace all of the speakers and amps in the car. The Bose system is disabled while the mObridge is connected. So this is only an option for people seeking to upgrade the entire audio system. You can't add a mObridge if you are just trying to add a subwoofer to the Bose system while keeping the Bose speakers active. This is an "All OR Nothing" choice.




Speakers

The Bose system in your 2013 Audi A6 has the following speakers in the stock locations:

Front Tweeters - located on the dash at corners, firing up into windshield
Front Midrange - located in front doors, middle of door
Front Midbass - located in front doors, ported enclosure, bottom of door
Front Center - Located in middle of dash, firing up

Rear Tweeter - located in back door, by door handle
Rear Midrange - located in back door, lower section

Rear Surrounds - located in rear parcel shelf, firing up

Subwoofer - located in rear parcel shelf, foring up. (note: Audi also makes a subwoofer enclosure that fits in the tire well, but I think they didn't start installing that until 2014?)


So that's a total of 14 speakers in the Bose system.



Technical Consideration

All of the Bose speakers are active crossover at the Bose amp, with the ONLY exception of the rear door midrange and tweeter which have a passive X-Over in the door. That means the Bose amplifier is not just an amp, but also a DSP. Audi have very carefully tuned this system to sound the way it does.  Yes, we all agree it sounds like crap but Audi and Bose decided it should sound the way it does.

The Bose system has a lot of EQ applied to it. Just take a look at the response curve coming out of the Bose amp in my 2013 S6.












For comparison, here is the exact same test when I installed the mObridge DA1 preamp.













Because the Bose amp applies so much EQ to the signal, I don't recommend changing the speakers unless you are going to add your own processing and amplifier(s). Adding a subwoofer while keeping the rest of the Bose system intact will be fine. But changing the Bose speakers to aftermarket while attempting to use the Bose amp to run them is not going to be a recipe for success. You'll be stuck with the Bose processing that was intended for the Bose speakers. That processing might not be correct for new speakers.



I have a lot more info about the stock speaker locations, wiring diagrams, etc...

Can post more later.


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## rimmi2002 (Feb 27, 2016)

Thanks for the detailed response subterFUSE. I really appreciate it. I have scoured the web quite a bit and have not been able to find much info at all up until now. 

So seems like my choice of replacing all the speakers first and then going for amp + sub if needed is out. 



The moBridge DA1 adds $500 to the install, that is doable. 

I was looking at these midrange speakers for front and rear and they come with tweeters: Any recommendation for anything better in a similar price range?

*Kicker KSS65 Series*

MidBass Speakers
*2016 DS Series 3.5"*

Is the center speaker also MidBass speaker or are there specific center speakers? 

What AMP and DSP would you recc'd for speakers of this caliber. Thanks for offering to share wiring diagrams. that would be really helpful! Thanks.


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## Angrywhopper (Jan 20, 2010)

subterFUSE.. Thanks for the long and proper response. OP was planning on Throwing in $150 Kicker speakers which will in turn sound worse than stock.


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## rimmi2002 (Feb 27, 2016)

Angrywhopper said:


> subterFUSE.. Thanks for the long and proper response. OP was planning on Throwing in $150 Kicker speakers which will in turn sound worse than stock.


I apologize for my ignorance. Didn't know kicker was such a horrible brand. I was trying to set up some sort of budget for myself and based on what I had read, they are not high end, but a "good" brand. They have great reviews on crutchfield. I googled all of SubterFuse's equipement and I'll be honest I cannot spend that type of money for all the gear in the car. I am hoping there was an alternate "good-high end" best bang for the buck type of setup.

Some things like the moBridge are required and there is no flexibility with. Other things like the DSP/AMPs/Speakers/Sub, I thought there would be flexibility. 


The speakers in my car right now sounds plan bad, but if you are they are better than what most people online are reviewing well and I understand most these people are not audiophiles, then I wonder if I just add a MoBrigde, DSP/AMP and Sub will that make a huge difference in quality, since according to subterFUSE, the Bose AMP is the biggest culprit in the awful sounds quality in this car. 

Thanks for the advice.


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## bertholomey (Dec 27, 2007)

Another option for speakers, is the audible physics XR's are on the for sale on DIYMA. Three drivers sold together for an outstanding price. Look up russell's thread (dblevel) - just add a couple inexpensive Seas Neo tweets and mid level mid bass drivers and call the front stage done.

Russel's AP XR3 thread


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

My real point was simply that the Bose amp is also a DSP, and they have used quite a lot of EQ on the Bose speakers. EQ that works on 1 set of speakers might not work on another set. That's why I don't think it's a good idea to try running aftermarket speakers with the Bose amp. The chances of it sounding good are not great because the Bose amp is tuned for the Bose speakers, and there is no way to tune it differently.

As I'm sitting here trying to organize thoughts and type them, I'm realizing that a phone call would be so much easier. 

I'll PM you my number.


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## greg09 (Jun 10, 2015)

I went through the same dilemma as you. My 2013 A7 came with the same crappy bose system. I told myself I only wanted to add a better sub when I first started. I went the first route that Subterfuse described. I tapped into the OEM sub's speaker wires and used an Audiocontrol LC2i to convert to RCA and installed a kicker amp and sub. It sounded ok, but the rest of the system couldn't keep up with the sub.

I looked around for a long time for a DSP/Amp/Speaker solution for the rest of the car. I ended up going with the MObridge DA3, which is like the DA1, but includes a DSP. It is about $200 more than the DA1, but you don't need to purchase a DSP which will run you from $300 to $800 (or more of course).

I started out with the Image Dynamics CXS64 components in the front. Here is the link Image Dynamics CXS64 v.2 6.5" Chameleon Component Speakers I am trying to sell them now if you are interested shoot me a PM and I'll give you a good deal.


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

Don't be intimidated by the cost of the equipment subterFUSE has chosen for his install. His build is representative of some very top shelf/no compromise selections. It certainly isn't for everyone, especially not those on more limited budgets. The advice he is offering is excellent though! Listen to what the man has to say. 

With a bit more detail on the diameter and depth available (there appears there may be some conflict between your original post and subterFUSE's run down) for all of the stock locations, if that is what you plan to use, I am sure you can get a lot of good recommendations for drivers, amplifiers and DSP to meet whatever budget constraints you have.


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## rimmi2002 (Feb 27, 2016)

greg09 said:


> I went through the same dilemma as you. My 2013 A7 came with the same crappy bose system. I told myself I only wanted to add a better sub when I first started. I went the first route that Subterfuse described. I tapped into the OEM sub's speaker wires and used an Audiocontrol LC2i to convert to RCA and installed a kicker amp and sub. It sounded ok, but the rest of the system couldn't keep up with the sub.
> 
> I looked around for a long time for a DSP/Amp/Speaker solution for the rest of the car. I ended up going with the MObridge DA3, which is like the DA1, but includes a DSP. It is about $200 more than the DA1, but you don't need to purchase a DSP which will run you from $300 to $800 (or more of course).
> 
> I started out with the Image Dynamics CXS64 components in the front. Here is the link I am trying to sell them now if you are interested shoot me a PM and I'll give you a good deal.


Thanks for the input Greg. If Mobridge 3 includes DSP, then that's really nice. I think I might get that instead and then need AMP and speakers + sub. How do you like your kicker sub? 

I'd like to spend $300 or less per component (Front speakers, rear speakers and sub) 
Are you happy with a change in front's only + sub, (was it a decent upgrade from stock?) or would you recc'd Front's + rears + sub? Thanks



rton20s said:


> Don't be intimidated by the cost of the equipment subterFUSE has chosen for his install. His build is representative of some very top shelf/no compromise selections. It certainly isn't for everyone, especially not those on more limited budgets. The advice he is offering is excellent though! Listen to what the man has to say.
> 
> With a bit more detail on the diameter and depth available (there appears there may be some conflict between your original post and subterFUSE's run down) for all of the stock locations, if that is what you plan to use, I am sure you can get a lot of good recommendations for drivers, amplifiers and DSP to meet whatever budget constraints you have.


That's good to know. I got my measurements from kicker's website. I'm thinking SubterFuse's are likely more accurate. I'll have to confirm the dimensions with him.


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## greg09 (Jun 10, 2015)

The Mobridge DA3 is very nice. It has some limitations, but is very easy to use and simplifies your equipment needs. It doesn't have any other inputs besides the MOST connection and doesn't have a a remote control option (you can control some of the functions through the MMI interface, but they are still buggy. you can switch between two presets, and supposed to be able to control the subwoofer level, but that doesn't work for me). Also, if you decide to use a different DSP in the future (like I decided to do) you can bypass the DSP and just use it to convert the MOST connection to optical or analog.

The kicker sub was OK, but I didn't keep it long. I have gone through several different subs since then. My favorites have been the Stereo Integrity Mag V3 and the Illusion C12XL. If you can find a Mag V3 for sale, it is a great sub at a good price (about $150). Also, I have a Sundown SA12 that I'm trying to sell if you are interested, it is a very nice 12 inch sub that gets very loud.

Unless you are going to have people in the back seat often, I would suggest just upgrading the front speakers and the sub.

Let me know if you have any other questions. I have just been through your exact situation in the past year.


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## rimmi2002 (Feb 27, 2016)

greg09 said:


> The Mobridge DA3 is very nice. It has some limitations, but is very easy to use and simplifies your equipment needs. It doesn't have any other inputs besides the MOST connection and doesn't have a a remote control option (you can control some of the functions through the MMI interface, but they are still buggy. you can switch between two presets, and supposed to be able to control the subwoofer level, but that doesn't work for me). Also, if you decide to use a different DSP in the future (like I decided to do) you can bypass the DSP and just use it to convert the MOST connection to optical or analog.
> 
> The kicker sub was OK, but I didn't keep it long. I have gone through several different subs since then. My favorites have been the Stereo Integrity Mag V3 and the Illusion C12XL. If you can find a Mag V3 for sale, it is a great sub at a good price (about $150). Also, I have a Sundown SA12 that I'm trying to sell if you are interested, it is a very nice 12 inch sub that gets very loud.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I'll look into the subs and speakers you recc'd. No one ever sits in the back, so I'll leave those speakers alone. I'll let you know if I'm interested in any of the gear you have for sale. Once I have my system finalized it will be easier for me to tell. Any Recommendations on the AMP for the front + sub? (need something good, not super high end, something that is a good value for the amount spent). Thanks. 

how can you find out the specifications of the speakers in the car (for replacement size)? Only place I found out that had info for my car was the kicker website. Thanks.


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## Scufi (Jun 27, 2010)

subterFUSE said:


> Technical Consideration
> 
> All of the Bose speakers are active crossover at the Bose amp, with the ONLY *exception of the rear door midrange and tweeter *which have a passive X-Over in the door. That means the Bose amplifier is not just an amp, but also a DSP.


Just to make a addendum.

Front, left-right dashboard tweeters are inline with a capacitor. Either it is just a form of protection in case the amplifier goes nuts, or it is a crossover.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Dude this discussion is six years old


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## Scufi (Jun 27, 2010)

Wrong information is wrong now and six decades from now, if not proven otherwise


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