# 2008 4Runner - Image Dynamics



## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

I've been out of the car audio game for a while, but I'm back and ready to get to work on this build. I went with a lot of Image Dynamics gear because I really liked their stuff back in the early 2000's from my elitecaraudio days. This will be my first time installing and tuning with a DSP, so it'll be a learning curve and we'll see if I remember how to do everything.

2008 4Runner Limited











Here's what I have ordered to be installed over the next few weeks:

*HU*
ATOTO F7 10.1"

*AMPS*
Image Dynamics Q450.4
Image Dynamics Q600.1

*DSP*
Dayton Audio DSP-408 4x8
* 
SPEAKERS *
ID CSX64 (active)
Image Dynamics IDMax 12 D2

*WIRING*
KnuKoncepts - 0 guage, disto blocks, rca

*SOUND DEADENING*
Noico Black 80 mil – 64 sq ft
Noico Red CCF - 36 sq ft


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## SQ_Bronco (Jul 31, 2005)

Welcome back! Good to see another ECA refugee/ID fan.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

SQ_Bronco said:


> Welcome back! Good to see another ECA refugee/ID fan.


I spent waaaay too much time on ECA in college. Your username sounds familiar, was it the same on ECA?

I got a few things in the mail today


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## SQ_Bronco (Jul 31, 2005)

Yeah, sold the bronco over 13 years ago now but it lives on in my user name, lol.

I took a pretty long break from the hobby as well, just got back into it about this time last year. Funny how many things change and how much is the same.


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## Ayrton (Jan 17, 2006)

I still have my old ECA t-shirt


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Ayrton said:


> I still have my old ECA t-shirt


I never had an ECA shirt, jealous!

Got the HU, Wiring, and misc install items in today!


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## clifff150 (Apr 19, 2012)

I actually really enjoyed those CSX’s passive and active. They are a beefy set for sure. I haven’t really used my 450.4. I think you’ll really like this setup. It will sound very very clean.


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## TrashPanda (May 21, 2021)

I love seeing the shots of the gear piled up on the dining room table. Reminiscent of my wife saying “when are you gonna move all this crap?!”


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

TrashPanda said:


> I love seeing the shots of the gear piled up on the dining room table. Reminiscent of my wife saying “when are you gonna move all this crap?!”


I've learned my lesson, it didn't stay on the table very long  Still waiting on the amps, should be here this week. 

I'm still trying to decide on amp rack/sub box setup. A lot of the 4runner guys do something like this, but it would need to stick out further with the idmax depth and to get 1.3 ct ft. So I'm thinking a vertical amp rack in that location and a more standard sub box against the back seats that can be removed easily when I need to haul things.


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## clifff150 (Apr 19, 2012)

We have a 4Runner and I built a standard sealed box that’s 1.3 as well. I have it pushed up against the driver side back seat with the amp sitting in the space between the box and seat. I have it to where the box can be removed easily and the amp stays where it is.


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## Bass Face (May 31, 2021)

Glad folks are still using Image Dynamics!
That's awesome.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Spent way too much time today installing the head unit. I’m not sure what they were thinking with the design. The screen isn’t removable and there’s no way to access the back to install a bracket or kit.

A trip to Lowe’s, some drilling, a little sawzalling and I got it mounted.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

I got similar gear waiting for the right 2018-2021 F150 Supercrew 5.0 2wd! I have an Atoto A6 Pro and Dayton Audio DSP-408.


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## court (Feb 7, 2017)

My first real system I had Image Dynamics chameleon components. I still have my ID Max 10. Maybe one day put it in use again.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Slowly starting to get some work done. 

Headunit installed. It works fine, wasn’t my first choice but everything I wanted has been out of stock forever.









Fuse holder bracket, 0 gauge wire, heat shrink and wire loom. 










Barely enough room for the 0 gauge:










First attempt at the amp rack template:










Amps finally came in and I’ll have to extended the template, but it should still work:










Hope to have it all finished this week. Takes so much longer trying to do things clean and correctly without cutting corners.


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## knever3 (Mar 9, 2009)

Love the equipment selection.

Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Did some work on the amp rack today. I still have some more sanding to do…my jigsaw skills aren’t what they used to be. The plan is to remove the factory subwoofer/amp and use the mounting locations from those to build a bracket for the amp rack.


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## Quinn Nissen (Jun 21, 2021)

What are you going to mount equipment with? Lately I have been using threaded inserts in order to remove easily and without making wood screws get loose the more I remove replace them.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Quinn Nissen said:


> What are you going to mount equipment with? Lately I have been using threaded inserts in order to remove easily and without making wood screws get loose the more I remove replace them.


I'm going to use threaded inserts. Mounting the rack to the car will be the more difficult task. I was planning on running the wires on top of the rack like yours, but I'm probably going to drill holes and use grommets instead.


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## Quinn Nissen (Jun 21, 2021)

Looking at the mounting board my suggestion would be under the dsp router out an oval then round over both sides front and back to run wire though. Save you a lot of time and you won't have to try and fit all wiring on back of rack and between vehicle panel. 
This is final look. 1999 Firebird Formula


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## Quinn Nissen (Jun 21, 2021)

I remember installing a lot if iD equipment back in the late 90s loved the sound. I ran across CT Sounds awhile back and reminded me alot of iD. The subs in that car are the Tropo series which look and sound like iD.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Got one door mostly done today. I just have to put the ccf on top tomorrow. The 4Runner is really easy to get the wires through the door jams, the boot comes off one end and 2 bolts hold the other on and the wires just go to the front of the door behind the panel.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Quinn Nissen said:


> I remember installing a lot if iD equipment back in the late 90s loved the sound. I ran across CT Sounds awhile back and reminded me alot of iD. The subs in that car are the Tropo series which look and sound like iD.


I was a huge ID fan boy early 2000’s, so maybe this is some kind of mid life crisis install, lol. I had horns, idq 6s and ran either idq 12s or the idmax when it came out.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

All the wiring is run to the back and finished both doors today. I don’t know if the CCF will do much, but it does look nice. Sound dreading the rear and figuring out how to mount the amp rack is next.


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## Quinn Nissen (Jun 21, 2021)

Looking good 👍 👌


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Sound deadened the rear and mounted the board that the amp rack will attach to. I have a few ideas, but it’ll probably just be metal L brackets with an extra bend. Getting them bent at the correct depth will be the tricky part. 

I wasn’t worried about the cuts being precise as this board won’t be seen.


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

im surprised you did not try to mount the amps under the front seats, thats how i did mines, first 2 amps under each seats, then the sub amp in the rear storage cavity.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

riceandpho said:


> im surprised you did not try to mount the amps under the front seats, thats how i did mines, first 2 amps under each seats, then the sub amp in the rear storage cavity.


I thought about it. The original plan was to fiberglass the subwoofer enclosure into the factory location and once I ditched that idea I still wanted to use that area.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Hot and sweaty update. It’s not an elegant design, but very solid and the rack is removable with the threaded inserts. Off the the fabric store for some vinyl and then the amps will get mounted to the rack.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Still lots of work to do, but it’s starting to come together. Not thrilled with some of the details, so that’s what I’ll be doing tomorrow.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Almost done. Gotta get some grommets or something to make the wire holes look better. The vinyl is a little lighter gray than I wanted, but it’ll do. 

Tomorrow I’ll load up the DSP and fire it up for the first time.


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## JohnnyOhh (Feb 19, 2015)

Looks great! Are you not concerned about theft? I have an RX350, planning my set-up now,.... I am trying to keep woofers/boxes/amps out of sight & lower in the trunk area.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

I’m not worried about it, the windows are pretty dark so it’s hard to see the amps from the outside. If they got in, the amps have hex screws and the screws that hold the rack in pace are under the amps. The way the head unit is “custom” mounted with metal brackets there’s no way to remove it without taking the dash apart.


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

the way you have the rack got me thinking should buy those molle panel and just mount my amps there. I did remount my amp on my rack, I should change out the mdf to the birch plywood, but that will be another time.
swapping out my fused block and tidy up my install also. used to have my amp mounted with the logos vertical, now I rotated the amp and its now horizontal.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

riceandpho said:


> the way you have the rack got me thinking should buy those molle panel and just mount my amps there. I did remount my amp on my rack, I should change out the mdf to the birch plywood, but that will be another time.
> swapping out my fused block and tidy up my install also. used to have my amp mounted with the logos vertical, now I rotated the amp and its now horizontal.


The molle panels could work well, probably much easier than what I did. The original plan was to use those tiny Toro amps and to fiberglass a a larger subwoofer box back into the factory location with the amps along the top. But I need the space and this allows me to just remove the sub and have almost 100% cargo space in the rear. I think my rack is birch plywood, I just grabbed something in a 2ftx4ft sheet at Lowe's that wasn't mdf or fiberboard.


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

i need to change out my fuse block to the knukoncept stuff once it arrive,


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Not much to update right now. The gains are set and started some basic tuning. I was having noise issues with the Dayton, but an DC-AC inverter solved them. I understand everything the DSP does, but it’s going to take some time to dial it in. Overall it sounds good right now but not great. When I get back from vacation I’ll post some tuning updates. 

Crossover settings at the moment:
Tweeters: 2800k
Mids: 80-2800k
Sub: 80 down 

I’m using the small Dayton mic and audio control app. Quite a few issues on the RTA with pink noise, it’s a learning process for me for sure.


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## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

Following along. Hope you get a hang of the tuning aspect. DSP can be amazing.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

KrautNotRice said:


> Following along. Hope you get a hang of the tuning aspect. DSP can be amazing.


I haven't had much time to spend on it recently, but made a dumb mistake in the DSP and had the inputs 1 and 2 selected for each tweeter instead of input 1 on L and input 2 on R and the same on the mids. I was pretty frustrated with how it sounded until I fixed that stupid mistake. I've done a little pink noise/mic/eqing and it's acceptable now. I'll post some graphs and settings soon to see if people with more experience have some tips.

Today was spent tracking down a few rattles in the rear. One is somewhere behind the amp rack and driving me crazy!


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## Complacent_One (Jul 2, 2009)

Any issues with that ATOTO? Mine likes to wait 3-5 minutes to power down after turning off the ignition. I know when it happens because it will thump the heck out of my 12w6v3. Not sure if I just got a bad one, or if it is one of the many glitchy issues with that software build. Put it in my 98 4Runner, and I can attest to it being a PITA to install. Was thinking about completely overhauling the Center Dash Bezel to move it up to the top and the Vents and AC Controls down....but will likely go for a different head unit.


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## Bass Face (May 31, 2021)

I am obsessed with those amps. All your Image Dynamics gear is the last of the amazing stuff ID put out. Great build, best of luck!


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Complacent_One said:


> Any issues with that ATOTO? Mine likes to wait 3-5 minutes to power down after turning off the ignition. I know when it happens because it will thump the heck out of my 12w6v3. Not sure if I just got a bad one, or if it is one of the many glitchy issues with that software build. Put it in my 98 4Runner, and I can attest to it being a PITA to install. Was thinking about completely overhauling the Center Dash Bezel to move it up to the top and the Vents and AC Controls down....but will likely go for a different head unit.


I ended up sending the original F7 back and getting the F7 pro 10.1. On the pro, the screen can be removed and adjusted, which made installing it much easier. I haven’t had any issues with the software being glitchy.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Bass Face said:


> I am obsessed with those amps. All your Image Dynamics gear is the last of the amazing stuff ID put out. Great build, best of luck!


Thanks! The amps have been great. I almost went super cheap with those mini Toro amps for the size and these ID amps are pretty big, but I’m glad I found them used for a pretty good price. The IDMax is great, tweeters are great, still trying to get some more mid bass out of the 6.5s, but overall really happy with my equipment choices.


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## Bass Face (May 31, 2021)

jcstites said:


> Thanks! The amps have been great. I almost went super cheap with those mini Toro amps for the size and these ID amps are pretty big, but I’m glad I found them used for a pretty good price. The IDMax is great, tweeters are great, still trying to get some more mid bass out of the 6.5s, but overall really happy with my equipment choices.


I want to say about 10 years ago this forum was significantly more active with more members and everyone ran ID. Folks were using their horns, IB setups, and almost everyone had an ID sub. Great times!


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## Complacent_One (Jul 2, 2009)

Gotcha..i have the 10.1 S8 premium. Was hopimg this next gen would be awesome.. When working, it is nice but just a few bugs that has me wishing i would have purchased an earlier gen. By the way, your install looks top notch!! I need to get mine sorted. JL 450/4, 300/2, AND 500/1 driving an old Pioneer PRS 3way front, simple coax in rear doors and 12w6v3 taking care of the low end.


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## CrimsonCountry (Mar 11, 2012)

Fellow 4th gen owner here and just ran across your thread while searching for something else. Nice install so far. How did this turn out?


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Finally an update a year later. I went to an SQ competition last weekend, ended up 4th in my class. Heard some amazing cars and instead of just getting better at tuning, I couldn't help myself and bought some new equipment. I was trying to keep it simple with just a 2 way, but was getting frustrated with some of the limitations while tuning. I'm hoping moving the tweeters to the a pillar will help with depth/imaging, and using the 3" will help with some EQ/response issues with having the 6.5's in the doors. 

New equipment:
Helix DSP.2
Arc Audio CXL2100
SB Acoustics 3" (I believe these are very similar to the Arc Audio black series)
Aluminum tweeter pods
Dash mat




















The DSP and Arc amp aren't in yet, but I got to work on the doors.

Factory tweeter location (where my tweets were):










3" using the factory mounts. This took some time with the dremel trimming the mounts and the top of the speaker. 










I had to trim the inside of the door panel and grille. I had to drill out the factory grille and will be dremeling the inner part of the grille, leaving only the outer ring and covering it with speaker cloth. Still needs some work, but I think it's going to work out with some more adjustments. 










I also made some new baffles for the 6.5's from 1/2" HDPE: (Not beautiful, first time cutting HDPE)











I'll probably paint the pods black once I figure out where to mount them. The pillar isn't completely flat, so I'm not sure how well the 3m tape will hold.


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

will your midrange fit behind the tweeter bracket? i had to redo all my tweeter adapter to the back side, didnt know it sits that tight to the door panel when i mount it to the front. if the factory brack dont work out, how about trying the metal straps with lots of holes, you can bend them pretty easily, and then nut and bolt the speaker.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

riceandpho said:


> will your midrange fit behind the tweeter bracket? i had to redo all my tweeter adapter to the back side, didnt know it sits that tight to the door panel when i mount it to the front. if the factory brack dont work out, how about trying the metal straps with lots of holes, you can bend them pretty easily, and then nut and bolt the speaker.


It’s a really tight fit right now. I added 3 washers behind the bracket and longer bolts. The magnet is touching on the rear, so I added a bit of the foam. Right not my concern is if the grill will touch the speaker surrounds. I think with some bending and tweaking it will be ok. Going to work on that today.

I saw a post on a 4runner forum where they dented the door panel behind the speaker with a hammer to provide more depth. Hoping to avoid doing that.


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

i was going to do this the cheaper way, not sure if ill like it. this means i need a new amp upgrade in order to add a mid.








3.5" (S3) Speaker Pods for 2003-2009 Toyota 4Runner - Custom Speaker Pods


Car stereo installation solution. Add more speakers to the A-pillar of your 2003-2009 Toyota 4Runner with our 3.5" (S3) speaker pods. Upgrade your stereo and replace your factory radio.




customspeakerpods.com








jcstites said:


> It’s a really tight fit right now. I added 3 washers behind the bracket and longer bolts. The magnet is touching on the rear, so I added a bit of the foam. Right not my concern is if the grill will touch the speaker surrounds. I think with some bending and tweaking it will be ok. Going to work on that today.
> 
> I saw a post on a 4runner forum where they dented the door panel behind the speaker with a hammer to provide more depth. Hoping to avoid doing that.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

riceandpho said:


> i was going to do this the cheaper way, not sure if ill like it. this means i need a new amp upgrade in order to add a mid.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I hadn’t seen those pods. If using the tweeter location doesn’t work out, I may get those. I did go all in on this location and will never be able to go back to the stock look with the grills, so I’m hoping it does work.

The Helix DSP and Arc amp are being delivered today!


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

the speaker pods are interesting, i just dont know how can the speakers sound good if its not really sealed back to the door cavity, those pods do mount on the a-pillar. all these 4runner mods makes me want to do another thing, the last mod i did was secondskindamplifier pro my whole roof about a week before mothers days. that 15% off sale comes in handy
i wonder where are you on the t4r.org anyways. me and CrimsonCountry be messaging here and sometimes t4r.
if your not happy with your speaker adapters, i did buy some from taco tunes. make sure to trim off the inner door panel speaker plastic ring and such, i didnt do it on the camry, and it cost me another new set of mids. but i get decent price on them hertz.



jcstites said:


> I hadn’t seen those pods. If using the tweeter location doesn’t work out, I may get those. I did go all in on this location and will never be able to go back to the stock look with the grills, so I’m hoping it does work.
> 
> The Helix DSP and Arc amp are being delivered today!


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Did dome work on the grilles. I am not an arts and craft person, so the dremel work etc aren't perfect, but the results look pretty good. The only issue is mounting them to the door panel. Pretty sure I'll just use hot glue...


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## shdw03 (Dec 30, 2018)

jcstites said:


> Did dome work on the grilles. I am not an arts and craft person, so the dremel work etc aren't perfect, but the results look pretty good. The only issue is mounting them to the door panel. Pretty sure I'll just use hot glue...


Small magnets? at least you can pop them in and out without damage. How are the factory ones mounted?


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## CrimsonCountry (Mar 11, 2012)

jcstites said:


> Did dome work on the grilles. I am not an arts and craft person, so the dremel work etc aren't perfect, but the results look pretty good. The only issue is mounting them to the door panel. Pretty sure I'll just use hot glue...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks good to me! I did something similar on the midbass grille for the lower door card and am about to do what you did for the that one. I had planned to use smaller magnets as well for mounting it.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

shdw03 said:


> Small magnets? at least you can pop them in and out without damage. How are the factory ones mounted?


The factory grilles are mounted without screws and I’m sure how to describe it, but they have 4 mounting points melted into the door panels. I could use magnets, but since I would need to remove the whole door panel to remove the 3” speakers, I think glueing the new grills in will be fine.

Helix DSP and Arc amp came in today


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Installed the mid grilles and the tweeter pods on the a pillars. I have some flexibility with the angles in the pods. It wasn’t how I planned on installing the pods, but since the pillar isn’t flat, the double sided tape wouldn’t hold them up.

Without changing anything in the DSP, I already regret not putting the tweeters in the A pillar until now. Depth/Imaging/etc are all improved. I hope the 3" mids will work better than the tweeters did in the doors.

Grilles:



























Tweeter pods:


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## riceandpho (Dec 30, 2009)

looks high, would it work if its lower closer to the dash?
also is your home-link not working? might have to do the program at the opener instead of the remote.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

riceandpho said:


> looks high, would it work if its lower closer to the dash?
> also is your home-link not working? might have to do the program at the opener instead of the remote.


I never setup the home link since I don’t get to use the garage unless I’m working on the car, so I just never programmed it. 
Yeah, they might be too high. I was trying to avoid the dash above the gauge cluster blocking the driver side. Hopefully I’ll have some time next week to work on it more.


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## CrimsonCountry (Mar 11, 2012)

How do you like the imaging from the midranges in the upper door card? I ran a fullrange there 3 or 4 years ago and remember it sounding pretty good, nice and "wide." 

The grille clothe came out great. Might be just enough to make me do mine so they match my midbass grille.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

CrimsonCountry said:


> How do you like the imaging from the midranges in the upper door card? I ran a fullrange there 3 or 4 years ago and remember it sounding pretty good, nice and "wide."
> 
> The grille clothe came out great. Might be just enough to make me do mine so they match my midbass grille.


I haven’t had time to install the new amp and get the mids going yet, so I don’t know how the imaging will be. The category I lost a lot of points at the competition was depth, so I’m hoping moving the tweeters to the pillar will help that. I didn’t spend that much time with the tweeter positioning, it was late, 100 degrees, and just wanted to get them in so they weren’t taped to the dash any longer.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

I got the Helix DSP.2 and Arc CXL2100 installed today. I took way more than I expected with tearing down the amp rack. I considered making brackets to have the Arc amp above and centered on the ID amps, but thought it might look odd, so instead of completely redoing my amp rack, I just mounted it to the side of the sub box. When I make a new sub box, I might find a fancier way to mount the amp. 

I only had time to set crossovers and time alignment, but I can already tell there is a lot more potential with the new equipment. Especially in the mid bass from the additional power and 1/2" HDPE baffles. Tomorrow I will use my new Dayton EMM-6 and Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 for some RTA and EQ work. I'll find out then if these SB Acoustic 3" speakers were a good idea or not. I will probably also move the tweeters lower and experiment with aiming them more off-axis.


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## jcstites (Aug 6, 2009)

Almost forgot! The new HU came in today. ATOTO S8 Pro, which has an optical output and wireless carplay. I'm hoping that I'll be able to control the volume from the HU with the optical output to the Helix without getting a URC.3 or Director.


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