# Old school solobaric s12d, decent sq?



## ludlamtheory

So I'm doing a job for a guy, and he wanted to know if I wanted to take a pair of old school solobaric s12d's off his hands for dirt cheap. 

I've recently blown my old sub, and am looking for something that's fairly transparent, good transient response, and decent output. 

I was looking to maybe get a single dayton reference 15", but for half the price of that, I can acquire these, and money is tight these days, so every penny counts.

So, does anyone have any feedback as to the sound quality of these suckers?


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## |Tch0rT|

I'm pretty sure that's the old round style before they turned into SPL fart subs... if so then they rock. The best Kicker ever made from what I hear, too bad they really don't do that anymore. I had a single 15" round Solobaric and it was pretty sweet but it was worn out. 

Ryan


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## tuckerbucket

I had a single 12 in a 1 ft cubed sealed box running off two channels in a mtx 4300x 4 channel. was in a regular cab chevy truck. Loved that thing. Wish I could find a couple 12's for my tahoe now. If you don't want them I would be seriously interested in them.


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## DS-21

Not a fan. That was one of the first attempts at a "small box" sub, and...we've learned quite a lot since then.


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## ludlamtheory

yes, they are the round ones indeed, and its the second run of the round ones, the first round ones were the 'c' series, this is the 'd'

tucker, i pm'd ya


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## doggboy

Those subs are still considered by some as one of the best sq subs ever. I had one back in the day in a 1.2cf box and it sounded great! Just fyi, the company that made those for Kicker is Credence, and they still make them with the credence logo instead of the kicker logo for a good price. Check ebay and their website.


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## Jroo

I am going to look at ebay to try and find those subs. I still have my round 15 and everytime I look at new subs and listen, I stick with mine. People always say subs have gotten so much better, but my ears still say no. There is a local shop that has 3 12 8ohm rounds new in box that I alway try to talk the guy down on. He wants something like 500 for all three (He wont break them up) which I thought was high for a great but 4 or 5 year old speaker. I a good sealed box the things kick butt. Also dont rule out band pass. This same shop did a good band pass with 3 12's round solos ported through the ski hole on a caddy Deville. I havent heard bass like that in years. Musical but hit hard with no rattles outside the car or trunk. You opened the car door and this wall of clean bass would hit out of no where because you didnt hear anything before the car door opened. Great sound quality woofer!


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## doggboy

I checked ebay and their site and I don't see them anymore, sorry. I have a brand new pair I bought from them a while back I might let go for the right price. I've only opened one to look at it, never hooked up or installed.


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## xencloud

ummmm, that Caddy sounds like it was deadened properly, which really has nothing to do with the woofers performance, just a good install.....I'm not saying they don't sound good, just making a point


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## 3.5max6spd

doggboy said:


> Those subs are still considered by some as one of the best sq subs ever. I had one back in the day in a 1.2cf box and it sounded great! Just fyi, the company that made those for Kicker is Credence, and they still make them with the credence logo instead of the kicker logo for a good price. Check ebay and their website.


Yep, i ran them back then in their small box requirements, and these days I have one I kept- its sitting in a 1.5 cu/ft sealed box and its a different sub- much better lowend, and can still deliver that hard bass.


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## DS-21

I'm really surprised there's so much love for these things. Back in the day, I found them vastly, _vastly_ inferior to woofers such as the Oz Audio 250L/300L, Aura Force 10 and 12 (IMO, the first really good small box woofer), the PPI Pro 10 and 12, a/d/s/ RS12, JL W6 line, ESX's knockoffs of the JL W6 line, Infinity Beta 12, Coustic DR12, Hsu ASW-1201, Soundstream Reference line, and Image Dynamics IDQ-12. Up to its much lower limits, even the Dynaudio MD190 was better. And Kicker's Comp line was much better, though I still prefer all of the woofers mentioned above to them.

Considering that none of those above-mentioned subs belong in the same rank as the likes of the Peerless XLS or other great subs available to us, I doubt the Solobaric would fare any better.


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## Jroo

That caddy didnt have a stitch of damping or deadning other than what the factory may have placed in it. This shop has a very good installer but is located in a not so savory part of town. Most of the dudes in this hood only want bass and a lot of bass. I remember the customer had 2 or 3 sets of 6 x 9 cut into the rear deck. I just remember the box, woofers, and port were just set up that good.


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## xencloud

no rattles still has nothing to do with the subwoofer. I guess his car was just that solid and the instllation was just that good!


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## Jroo

It might just be me, but with the right box and the correct amount of power, those subs played as clean, loud, and as musical as a good number of the subs you mentioned. Again most of this boils down to preference and I by no means was in Sq. I listed to about 6 of the subs you mentioned and they are all very good, but on the street, those solos could hang. Plus at the end of the day some of the subs you said just didnt hit the same when you switched over from Dave Matthews to Dr. Dre and Snoop.


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## doggboy

The biggest problem with the solos was people trying to stuff them in tiny boxes because Kicker told them they would work. Like any sub, you have to match the box the the sub and they sounded great in a 1.1 to 1.5cf box (depending on the vehicle). I have heard the 12 in a 0.8cf box and I admit I didn't like it much, the extra 0.4cf makes all the difference in the world.


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## luvdeftonz

I had an 8" 'd series' round solo. It did it's job. Nothing spectacular (bought it from Kicker themselves...$22, so I couldn't complain too much). I wouldn't say it was bad nor good. Just middle of the line (of course, I installed it right after I had, well, ludlamtheory's 15" xbl² Brahma clone ). For temporary bass that's cheap, you won't find enough objectionable things about its performance to complain about.


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## doggboy

Damn $22! I paid 140 for an 8 and I thought that was a good deal back then. Just like the 12's though, put it in a bigger box and it will still impress people these days. It might not be on the same level as a w7 ir idmax, but they are very nice when tuned right.


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## sqkev

Nothing out of the ordinary for those subs, it may be nice for audio back then (everyone prefered the "tightness" and solid bass). 
Subs now-a-days are vastly superior, imo.


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## 3.5max6spd

sqkev said:


> Nothing out of the ordinary for those subs, it may be nice for audio back then (everyone prefered the "tightness" and solid bass).
> Subs now-a-days are vastly superior, imo.


I agree. My enthusiasm for it is more because of its 'throw back' status- that was the very first sub I ever owned coming into this hobby 10+ yrs ago, and like most that dont go heads into SQ (its more of a progression for most), it was quite an experience to fire it up for my younger bro's to this day and not disappoint in delivering some tight, hard bass. A 10yr old driver, a cone built pretty rugged that you could literally use as a fruit bowl...hehe
I used Comps and XPL's in those days as well...but the SoloD's were my favs from that Kicker era.


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## MIAaron

I also preferred the comps over the solos back in the mid 90's. A few years ago audiooutfitter.com had a bunch of old stock s12d d2's for like $125.

I have to agree that subs have come a long way in the past 10 years. In the mid 90's I used to love my 1st gen power 12's. A few weeks ago I threw one of them in my car for S&G's. I was pretty shocked that I used to like them. It just sounds horrible in a car. lol Although I gotta say, it still gets really loud. I only had 100 watts on it and it was definitly louder than my sealed 12" IDMax on 800?! The whole experience suprised me, to say the least.


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## ludlamtheory

so i kept em...

just out of pure curiosity and packrat-ism

i should sell my "collection" some day...


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## Robb

Sorry to bring this up, but I just bought a BNIB never powered up Kicker s12d 2 ohm solobaric sub. Can't wait to get it ! 

Should I use a 1.1 cu/ft sealed box ? Or the recomended 0.88 cu/ft ? Im gonna be throwing 920 watts @ 2ohm mono from a Zapco Z300 C2. 

Pics of said sub !


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## Mless5

run it ported.


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## Robb

Mless5 said:


> run it ported.


It wont sound good ported ! No specs for it being ported, Kicker only recommends sealed in the manual..


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## Mless5

Robb said:


> It wont sound good ported ! No specs for it being ported, Kicker only recommends sealed in the manual..



********. It sounds EXCELLENT ported. I have my 10" in 1.15 tuned to 33 I think it was. I know they say no to ported, but I modeled one up to the box I had, changed the port and voila.


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## Robb

Mless5 said:


> ********.


Bulltrue ! You dont think the Kicker's speaker engineers tested these subs using ported boxes and sealed ? What reason would they have not recommend ported then over sealed ??


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## armen818

i used to have one in a sealed box long long time ago. as far as i can remember i did not like the way it sounded it was too boomy for me, i changed to a pioneer sub 



it was the Kicker s12c i think 1990's + made, im not sure


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## armen818

i used to have one in a sealed box long long time ago. as far as i can remember i did not like the way it sounded it was too boomy for me, i changed to a pioneer sub 



it was the Kicker s12c i think 1990's + made, im not sure


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## rmenergy

"Credence Speakers Small Box CSS12D4 subwoofer"

Same speaker from the REAL manufacturer. Scroll down to see ported enclosures.


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## slomofo

run it ported


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## Jroo

I still run the 15" kickers. Love em and wont get rid of them. You can run them in the kicker recommended small boxes, but go a little bit bigger sealed and get much better low end. I cant speak on them ported as I have never heard run that way, but credence gives sealed and ported specs for all the solobarics. I would say your output ported is going up but I dont what they would sound like ported. I have some credence 10's that are going a 4th order bandbass.


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## Fast VW

I would put the s12d sub in 1.3 cubic feet (gross volume) sealed just watch the excursion limits. At .88 cubic feet (Qtc = .95) there is too much ringing. String instruments sound too fat and "blurry". I think at 1.3 it would clean up significantly.


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## Robb

Ok thanks.. but Im gonna be running alot of power to the sub.. 
Maybe I'll try 1.0 cu/ft. I dont want a big box in my small cars...


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## Matt K

Robb said:


> Ok thanks.. but Im gonna be running alot of power to the sub..
> Maybe I'll try 1.0 cu/ft. I dont want a big box in my small cars...


Probably don't want to run too much power to it...300W rms 600W max...I love mine, got it back in '04 after looking at it in my buddy's shop for 2 years. I run mine in a 1.1 cu ft box with some polyfill. No complaints!


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## Robb

Well I now have it in a 0.88 cu/ft box .


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## Fast VW

And what do you think of the sound?


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## Robb

Fast VW said:


> And what do you think of the sound?


I havent installed my system yet. Should be done within the next few weeks.


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## circa40

When I had mine, it digged very deep for a 10 and sounded surprisingly good in a 1cu/ft sealed enclosure...with a lot of tuning of course


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## 22689

NO!!!!!!! do not listen to these people - ported enclosure is not right. For one thing - the power handling on this model would be crazy low ported. Whoever Mless5 is is wrong deluxe. " They" say that because " THEY" Built it and tested it - Do you really think they would hide a secrete like that? what would be the purpose? You Port this sub and you will regret it is all i am saying here. And It's not like they grow on trees. I sold Hundreds and Hundreds of these. i could go on but I don't want carpel tunnel syndrome- get the manual (If You can't find it for some reason i will send it to you direct)

Use a Sealed enclosure - The S12d will handle up to 425 watts in the .88 cubic enclosure; if more power (up to 600
watts) is available, the box size should be reduced to .66 cubic feet. 

Don't burn this bad boy up Bro - do it like it's your baby and you will not be sorry.

Also - anyone who tells you different . Question anything that person ever tells you again, no Joke - they are leading you astray for some odd reason. 

Imeverlast


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## The Real Old Guy

Imeverlast,

What's wrong with putting a solod in a larger box and not having to put a bunch of power to it? The best woofer Kicker made in my opinion was the Impulse line.

I had three solod 10's in a 3.5 cu box ported and had no problems. Ran a XS100 to them. They were four ohm models.

Markey Dietrich

KCG member 1996 to the end


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## Lee Rambler

kicker did have recommended box specs for the solo's ported that they gave to dealers starting with the D series. I helped develop some of them back in the day, and we ran more than a few competition cars with them ported in the early db drag days. you could get impressive results from them, you just needed to be careful with tuning and power. They could sound excellent in the right ported box, or a little larger than recommended sealed box. The 15's worked very well in the the recommended 1.5ft3 or a little larger. The 12's liked more like 1ft3 over the recommended size. Would love to come across a 15...


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## robcalm

Can anyone give a 'slightly larger' box size for two 8 inch solo-c's in a single box wired in parallel to be 2 ohms total. I'd really appreciate it.

Rob


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## 22689

The C series manual is escaping me but as I remember it - the specs are nearly , if not identical, Identical. 

If you even increase the box size of the 8 to .50 from .33 you nearly cut the power handling in half. You can do it, It will sound a little deeper but it will not have the same pressure that it was designed to run with so the power handling will go down dramatically even with only a slightly greater space increase. 

For instance: The space difference between a 10 and an 8 is only .33 cubic foot! 
The 8 being .33 and the 10 being .66. If you bump the space of the 8 to .50 you have nearly met the requirements for a 10 and you have dropped the power handling of that particular sub to about 165 watts MAX. 

For some reason people like to keep slamming people who actually have it correct. Saying that these can run ported well - and in way bigger boxes. 

For those people I would like to ask why they would do it to begin with? I mean , If you want to do something else other than what the sub is specifically designed for with the system you are building - why don't you pick a sub that does what you want it to do? 

LOL.. I mean good grief - Making up stories about how great it was when you did it just makes you look silly really. Do you really think when you did it it was just some magical moment and you uncovered some wicked secrete that no one ever found? What happened was - You didn't have a clue what you were doing, You built it and it made sound ( No surprise) You were happy with whatever it was you had done and you have great memories of it. That's all. It does not mean that it was right or the best system ever or anything of the sort. 

To the real Old Guy ( I might be older than you by the way. LOL ) You ran 3 4 ohm subs to an xs100 and you were happy with that set up in a 3.50 cubic foot box ported. 

and you had no problems. 
The key word here is "YOU". The subs had all kind of problems. 

1. a single air space occupied by three subs of this type will allow for constant cancellation - These subs need their own air space or the actions of one sub will conflict with the actions of another.
2. Box shapes - Port Lengths and sizes and all of the other variables make all the world of difference.
3. You had three 4 ohm subs wired to 1.33 Ohm on paper and in reality after all is said and done probably closer to 2 ohm. on an amp that will do 1ohm Mono and at 1 ohm mono with a proper power source can easily push nearly 1650 watts.
Again variables come into the scene - Power source, wiring, fuse placement, ect... - 

4. The best woofer KICKER ever made was the impulse line " In your opinion" 
I am thinking you are playing here now. You cannot seriously believe this. You have to be trolling for some reason. I do not know what it is you are trying to invoke but for the sake of argument I will just take you seriously and comment. 
A. The impulse line was created as the cheap line for people that were doing systems and wanted the name KICKER - and did not have the dollars for the to be paying thousands for their system - they were made over seas, cheaply to spec requirements for what I just stated. I do not think they were the crappies on the market But they certainly were not KICKERS best line of woofers. The magnet weights - motor structures and designed were all geared for extremely low watts and power handling for ever their own time. 

All that being said - they were tough sob's and I have to agree with you here - the impulse line - if used properly and not abused could outlast Many Many Many other brands low enders. I STILL HAVE SEVERAL HERE MYSELF! LOL They will never die. 
I would like to get a hold of 1 I12 8 ohm new in the box - i have one but I need one more and I have no match for it. I need them for a system I was putting in the kids room. 

I even have Impulse bass stations here - from 8's to 12's They are as new. No kidding. I have a lot of 1 ohm 8's 1 ohm 10's and 1 ohm 12's 

as many as you like- all 1 ohm single coil with grills.

And I will sell them - brand new. Make me an offer and when we come to an agreement on the deal I will send you pictures of them all and ship them Via Fed ex. No kidding. real deal here.


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## robcalm

Shouldda seen that coming. point taken. Had to chuckle at the idea that when something is installed incorrectly the person has no problems but the gear does. This idea can be applied to all facets of life... work, relationships, what have you.

Actually, I think I learned something, and I do have and have read the soloC manual. The ones I have came to me in a single space enclosure. Am I correct in thinking that ideally there should be a dividing 'wall' in the enclosure to ensure that each driver has its own airspace? even though they are accepting the same signal? 

These are small subs, and I'm driving them with a soundstream reference 300 bridged. I'm obviously not trying to rattle the world but I do like things to sound tight. Will separate airspace here make much difference to SQ or general performance in the real world?

Thanks!


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## filtor1

I still have 3 of these 12"s I just can't seem to part ways with. I really enjoyed them. Now they take up spots under my bed. 

No on porting them. You will increase the risk of driver failure as they were no designed to be used in this alignment. 

Yes on separate chambers. The additional cabinet rigidity, reduction in possible cancellation, and protection if one of the drivers blows has always kept me building individual chambers for each sealed configuration I have done. The only time I do single chambered enclosures for multiple drivers is if there is 3/4" tolerance in the box mounting location. I have had excellent results from this driver in .9-1.1 cf sealed enclosures. I still managed to blow one in 1.1cf, so understand the limitations imposed when increasing the cabinet size with relation to power.


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## 22689

*LOL!*
Yeah - the separate chambers thing is right for sure. 

The only reason is that no two subs are identical - even two subs that have the exact same Ohm reading on the monitor will still have slight variations. So even though they get the exact same signal they need their own space. 

It's not that important in a vented or ported, I have seen that done many times ( With other sub models that are designed for those enclosures ) 

Seems I still get better results separating those though. But that's just me - some factory KICKER boxes have two subs loaded in the same air space in ported boxes - they seem fine I suppose. until you build one that has two separate air spaces and use the very same subs - then you will find that the sounds different. It is a lot of extra work however - very well spent I think. :O) 

Really it's all up to the installer - I get a little frustrated from time to time becuase I see people burning up the coolest subs on the planet and then blaming the mfg for making a crap product. LOL I suppose if I still had everything I ever wanted and money was flying out my butt I would not give that much of a care but..... LOL That aint how it is. 

I do think it's funny when I build a proper box for two regular old school comp 15's and then put a 500.2 on that daily driver set up and it sounds better and is louder than installs that cost 2,000 dollars or better. Cracks me up.

I messed up and saved very few of the solo rounds for myself - Luckily I had the smarts to save me some Xpls - The XPLS are so much like the solo rounds that they are very hard to tell apart - They work fantastic in the boxes designed for solo rounds But they have the option to go in slightly larger enclosures. 

I am thinking it is the main reason reason that KICKER went with the XPLS as their 25th anniversary sub woofers choice rather than the solo "D" 



This summer is a great one, Sales are down so Low I will soon be Job hunting But it's still a great year to be alive. 

Ya'll keep up the good work


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## hotbutta

I know its old but...I have 4 Solo 15c each in their own 10 cf chamber tuned to a little over 14hz in my theater. They sound and FEEL great! I also had them in the recc. 1.5 sealed they were nice. But ported rules.


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## PPI_GUY

Never heard a Solo-baric in a ported enclosure that sounded good. I ran two of the ORIGINAL S-10's in .75 cu. ft. each sealed and loved them. In fact I still own the subs. 
However, by far the best sounding Kicker sub I have ever heard was their original Competition series. Handled lots of power (back in the day) and sounded powerfully clear. They sounded best in sealed enclosures too.


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## bigdwiz

I recently installed an older Kicker S10c in my "stealth box wanna be" Scosche SCXB04 enclosure for my Scion. It is approx 0.75cu/ft, completely stealth, and although it won't blow off the doors, provides clean, dynamic and powerful bass provided the 350 watts or so from 2 channels of the Rockford Power 550x amp. See my install in this vid:

YouTube Video in 1080p HD

or embedded below:


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## TrickyRicky

900watts its a little bit too much (okay way too much). All you need for those subs are 150-250 watts and you'll be rocking. They sound good, I wouldn't do ported but its up to you. I would keep it in a 1.25-1.5 sealed.

Hell I dont even give my Strokers (1000watts each) 500watts. I feed them 300watts each and they sound loud and good. Not to jinx you or anything but 900 is way too much and you might f-ed it up.

I remember I gave my moms two 15" round Solo's and about 2 months later some SOB broke the rear windshield and took them and left the 300watt pioneer amp behind. Thats right 300watts for two 15" and it was plenty.


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## hotbutta

PPI_GUY said:


> .......However, by far the best sounding Kicker sub I have ever heard was their original Competition series. Handled lots of power (back in the day) and sounded powerfully clear. They sounded best in sealed enclosures too.


Yeah, I have an original C12 with the gold 'KICKER' on the dustcap. I keep her snugly tucked away in the box.


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