# How to install terminals on 1/0 cable + ground questions



## Kerpal (Jan 27, 2009)

So I bought a length of 1/0 power cable & am ready to attach my ring terminals (just standard Sound Quest made for 1/0). What is the best way to attach these? Has anyone tried the crimp tool that Harbor Freight sells for about $50? Does it do a good job on these type of termnals? I suspect this is a specialty item that will probably run a lot more than $50 from anywhere else. I'll hardly ever use a crimper this size (I only have 3 terminals to install now), so $50 is the max I'd spend for one.

Or, what are my other options? Is there an advantage to soldering? If so can I use a propane torch and regular solder? I'd rather not have to order a high watt soldering gun and specialty solder (i.e. silver solder) since I want to get this done in the next couple days. 

If I choose to solder the terminals, should I crimp them slightly first (with a large pair of pliers or the like), just so that I won't need to use as much solder?

Or am I overthinking this, and I could get satisfactory results just crimping them w/ a pair of big channel locks or vice-grips, which I already have? Don't hate, but this is how I've installed 4 gauge terminals in the past and it has worked OK before. Though it makes a pretty ugly crimp, heat shrink and rubber boots will be hiding them anyway. 

The one method I am NOT considering is a hammer and chisel which I've read some use. Besides being way too ghetto-fabbed of a method to let me sleep at night, lol, I've already ran the cable in the car and it's not coming out to terminate. Getting 1/0 through the firewall was a PITA.

Also... I upgraded my factory grounds to 4 gauge and added two additional ones a few months back. I now have a battery to engine, battery to frame, and 2 engine to frame grounds, all 4 gauge. This is in a Mustang with a new 130 amp OEM alt, powering a RF P650.2 with an 80 amp draw and and ESX Q1752 of unknown draw (can't find that spec anywhere for some reason, but it will be ran in stereo producing about 200W x 2 at most). Will these grounds be sufficient, or do I need to replace some with/add some 1/0 grounds? I don't mind the extra work, but I forgot to take this into account when I bought the 1/0 so I'd have to order some more.

Finally, my battery + to alt cable is only 4 gauge (I know it's a true 4 gauge because I did it myself when I upgraded the alt). It's maybe a 6 or 7 foot length. Is this going to be big enough?

Thanks in advance for any advice.


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## Austin (Mar 12, 2009)

ive used vise grips only because i was on a budget. it works fine and ive even soldered some of them. but let the experts chime in because they might have a better way to do it. as for the upgrading ground wires you should be plenty fine with what you have.


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

I've used a hammer before, but no chisel. No way am I going to buy a $50 tool to use one time.

You'll need a torch to solder 1/0 gauge.


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## Kerpal (Jan 27, 2009)

Well, that's fine, since I can melt solder with a torch a heck of a lot better than I can solder with an iron or gun, lol.

I don't mind buying the tool if it will make a clean, solid connection. It's potentially a lot of current so I might as well make it safe. Plus I can always sell the tool for a small loss when I'm done with it.


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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

The hammer and chisel method that you describe as ghetto will probably give you a better connection than your vise grip method. I would guess 4 gauge would be safe to use instead, it can't be a very long piece of wire, and it'll be easier to terminate properly. I'd rather have a properly terminated 4 gauge under my hood than a 0 gauge run with a questionable termination.


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## Kerpal (Jan 27, 2009)

Can someone explain how exactly the hammer and chisel method is done? I.e. do you align the chisel point perpendicular to the wire or parallel with it? I just can't visualize this making a secure connection, but if you guys say it works, I believe you. I suppose I could lay a scrap piece of MDF on my intake manifold and use this method, still it just seems tricky to get right as opposed to just carfully crimping them with a big-ass set of vice grips. 

How I've done it in the past is to crimp one 'ear' of the terminal angled slightly downward, into the midpoint of the stripped wire, and then crimp the other side down on top of that, securing it the first crimp and the other half of the wire strands. Seems to work fine if you use the right size tool.


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## denzelwashington (May 19, 2009)

This talk of visegrips and hammers and chisels is pretty scary. Do you know what happens if the "crimp" comes loose and your 12VDC 1/0 cable touches the body of your vehicle? Nothing good, that's for sure, think burning. I would think a 1/0 cable would get pretty hot before burning in two and setting your car on fire. This is a good reason to:

1. Put a fuse as close as possible to the battery and
2. Make proper crimps. 

I work for an electrical contractor, and I used a manual(not hydraulic), dieless crimper for my larger connections. It takes all of 30 second per connector. If you don't have a proper crimper, stop at a smaller electrical contractor's shop and ask them to crimp your lugs. I wouldn't charge more than $5 if someone came through my door asking for that kind of help...


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## qstarin (Mar 25, 2009)

I use the hammer method, and I believe it makes an excellent connection - tons of surface area, and no way in h-e-double-hockey-sticks is that wire getting pulled out (I test every one I do this way by sticking a metal rod through the ring terminal and putting one person one the wire one on the rod - a few minutes of spirited "tug-of-war" and I'm pretty confident that it will stay put under any normal and a vast array of abnormal scenarios).

If I had a crimper, or somewhere nearby that would do it for me for a reasonable cost, I would prefer that. But I don't. Hammer works good enough, no dependencies.

Also, fyi, I'm going to pull my 1/0 ga. and do 3x 4 ga. I think that even 3 or 4 runs of 4 gauge will be easier to work with than a single 1/0. And to think, somewhere recently I saw mention of a guy running 3/0. Jebsus, that's huge.


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## Ziggy (Nov 29, 2007)

I hammered it... 
Thought about getting all tricky with solder too -but why waste time for something that could wind up melting some of you insolation?
If I didn't hammer it -then my next choice would be the big ass crimper tool... 
(like the one that you smack with a hammer)


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

The hammer method works fine assuming you make a tight crimp. If the wire came out of the crimp then it'd be the crimp still on the battery and the wire would be dead so i don't see the fire hazard.


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## qstarin (Mar 25, 2009)

^ depends on the wiring design. I use ring terms and posts in the trunk for all the wiring, except where the wire terminates into the amp. Crimped and wrapped ring terminal ends are so much cleaner and easier to work with imo (compared to loose power wire shedding little strands everywhere), so I use them anywhere I can design it in.

If one of my wires came loose at my distro blocks, it is certainly within the realm of possibility that it would contact a ground point.


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## Boostedrex (Apr 4, 2007)

I used a pnuematic crimper that was designed for 0/1 cable. Thankfully I work around aircraft so I have access to all types of nifty gear that I don't have to buy.


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

qstarin said:


> ^ depends on the wiring design. I use ring terms and posts in the trunk for all the wiring, except where the wire terminates into the amp. Crimped and wrapped ring terminal ends are so much cleaner and easier to work with imo (compared to loose power wire shedding little strands everywhere), so I use them anywhere I can design it in.
> 
> If one of my wires came loose at my distro blocks, it is certainly within the realm of possibility that it would contact a ground point.


Yeah, but the OP was talking about a 1/0 gauge. Surely that is going straight to the battery and not a block or anything.


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## Boostedrex (Apr 4, 2007)

nevermind


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

Nevermind what, you first post?

****, I'd use a pnuematic crimper too if I could. I think we all would.


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## lilmike (Jan 4, 2008)

I use my 12-ton press and scrap steel ground into dies on everything from 4 ga. to 4/0 terminals. I run over 200 amps through these cables (welding leads) on a regular basis and have had no problems with the crimps coming loose yet.

I suppose you could use a large vise too, but soldering is probably easiest if the wire is already pulled through the car. Use a torch and use some flux (rosin type), should work fine.


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

Proper crimp is best, but I would definitely solder before I would use any ghetto vice method.

I'm a bit disappointed that so many DIYMA'ers think the ghetto approach is acceptable.


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## HIS4 (Oct 6, 2005)

I bought the crimp tool for about $28 from Home Depot. Good for #6 to #2/0 AWG cable.


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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

capnxtreme said:


> Proper crimp is best, but I would definitely solder before I would use any ghetto vice method.
> 
> I'm a bit disappointed that so many DIYMA'ers think the ghetto approach is acceptable.


A crimp tool that big isn't exactly a common tool that everyone has in their toolboxes, and it's difficult to justify buying one when you only anticipate making one or two crimps with it.

I don't condone the half assed approach, I am an attention to detail kind of guy, but for your average person doing an install, another $30 for a tool that probably won't get much use is a difficult purchase. I think getting the job done with what you have is exactly the DIY spirit. If you can get a safe, solid connection with a hammer and chisel, go for it. It doesn't have to look pretty, but it does have to be reliable. I promise, a good connection is possible without the fancy tools.


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

capnxtreme said:


> Proper crimp is best, but I would definitely solder before I would use any ghetto vice method.
> 
> I'm a bit disappointed that so many DIYMA'ers think the ghetto approach is acceptable.



I used the hammer method and it held up for almost 2 years until I totaled the car. It's no different than a "proper" crimp with a tool unless you are pulling on it with all your might maybe.

I couldn't pull the terminal off.

I agree with the above. The hammer method is the classic DIY way!


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## lilmike (Jan 4, 2008)

capnxtreme said:


> Proper crimp is best, but I would definitely solder before I would use any ghetto vice method.
> 
> I'm a bit disappointed that so many DIYMA'ers think the ghetto approach is acceptable.


No way am I ghetto - my approach is most definitely *******.....

Seriously - 1/0 is BIG cable, takes a big crimper to squish it right. My press did a great job on the 4/0, but it is 12 TONS. 

Long ago, I crimped my 4 gauge stuff in my vise then soldered it. Several years before that when I was working with 1/0, I used a big hammer and chisel to crimp the ends and hold things in place, then got out the torch and soldered the 1/0 into the terminals.

All these terminations outlived the installs. That's acceptable in my book.


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## ChrisB (Jul 3, 2008)

I purchased the hammer crimper tool for about $17 or so. Works wonders for crimping anything bigger than 8 gauge 

WOW, they went up in cost since I purchased mine: **CLICK ME** or 

This one is the one I purchased for $17 and change: **Click here**


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## Austin (Mar 12, 2009)

ya ive used hammer and ive tried crimper but the little ones meant for say 8 gauge and up just dont work. i wouldnt spend a lot of money on something i would barely used either.


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## SRim23 (May 24, 2007)

you could just buy a ring terminal that screws on like this

Knukonceptz product detail for SET SCREW RING TERMINALS - 1/0


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

lilmike said:


> No way am I ghetto - my approach is most definitely *******.....
> 
> Seriously - 1/0 is BIG cable, takes a big crimper to squish it right. My press did a great job on the 4/0, but it is 12 TONS.
> 
> ...


I should have been more clear. If you're making your own dies, it sounds like you know what you're doing.

I just don't want the average DIY'er to get the impression that it's okay to clamp their ring terminals onto their power wire with some pliers, and call it a day. That ain't a crimp, period.


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

capnxtreme said:


> I should have been more clear. If you're making your own dies, it sounds like you know what you're doing.
> 
> I just don't want the average DIY'er to get the impression that it's okay to clamp their ring terminals onto their power wire with some pliers, and call it a day. That ain't a crimp, period.



Seriously man, no one thinks it's cool to run a ****ty unreliable crimp, but if smashing it with a hammer gives you a solid connection, well then you're good to go.

In my case, a hammer was good enough.


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## ~Magick_Man~ (Jul 11, 2006)

torch + flux + solder for the win.


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

89grand said:


> Seriously man, no one thinks it's cool to run a ****ty unreliable crimp, but if smashing it with a hammer gives you a solid connection, well then you're good to go.
> 
> In my case, a hammer was good enough.


Seriously man, stop encouraging people to do it the wrong way.


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

capnxtreme said:


> Seriously man, stop encouraging people to do it the wrong way.


Well then tell them the right way according to you and your standards there champ.

While you're at it, tell them what car to get, what speakers to get, what amps to get, what crossover points to use, etc so that'll have the ultimate car stereo.


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## aznboi3644 (Jan 25, 2009)

I solder my power and ground connections regardless of wire size.

Propane torch and some solder is all you need. There is no worry about melting the insulation. It will get hot but won't melt if done correctly. But will also melt to hell if done incorrectly.


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## denzelwashington (May 19, 2009)

89grand said:


> Well then tell them the right way according to you and your standards there champ.
> 
> While you're at it, tell them what car to get, what speakers to get, what amps to get, what crossover points to use, etc so that'll have the ultimate car stereo.


The right way to do it is with a proper crimping tool(dieless or with dies), or solder. Any other way is unreliable or inconsistent. Improper crimps are a fire hazard, I don't think anyone is trying to be an ass about it, it really is a safety concern.


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

89grand said:


> Well then tell them the right way according to you and your standards there champ.


Reading is your friend, champ:



capnxtreme said:


> Proper crimp is best, but I would definitely solder before I would use any ghetto vice method.


If you can't afford to buy a $20 tool that you're "only going to use one time", you're in the wrong hobby.



> While you're at it, tell them what car to get, what speakers to get, what amps to get, what crossover points to use, etc so that'll have the ultimate car stereo.


You seriously think that discouraging jury rigging is analogous to telling people what car to buy? :mean:

I don't care what the hell you do with your car or your life.

I do care that you're potentially encouraging newbs to do things the wrong way.


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## qstarin (Mar 25, 2009)

06BLMUSTANGGT said:


> I purchased the hammer crimper tool for about $17 or so. Works wonders for crimping anything bigger than 8 gauge
> 
> WOW, they went up in cost since I purchased mine: **CLICK ME** or
> 
> This one is the one I purchased for $17 and change: **Click here**



That looks interesting, and cheap enough to try. I've got at least one 4 ga. install coming up, so I think I'll try one out.


lol, cheapest car audio thing I've bought just to try in months. ha.


Have you used both? If so, is the ebay one worth the extra $$?


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

The hammer method can go wrong...if you do it all ****ed up and half assed.

I didn't, mine was fine.

For anyone that can't understand how to use a hammer to do this like capnxtreme, buy the tool. I personally don't need to.


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## Kerpal (Jan 27, 2009)

I still don't get how some of you guys are doing this with a hammer and chisel... I get how the crimp tools you hit with a hammer work, those look like a great idea, because they have the V shaped bottom channel to hold the terminals perfectly in place.

I can't see how hammering the terminals on flat ground, even with a chisel, would do anything other than flatten out the ends of the terminals and make them look all booger'd up.

F it... I'm just going to break out the torch and solder. Worked great for my 4 gauge battery & ground cables.

Those were super easy because I used plain copper lugs... I just clamp them in a vice, heat them up to melt solder in the ends until about 1/2 full, insert the wire and hold it for 10 seconds while it hardens. They're not going anywhere.


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## 89grand (Nov 23, 2006)

Well, you don't just stick the wire in the terminal and pound on it with a hammer.

You may as well just solder it.


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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

capnxtreme said:


> Reading is your friend, champ:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I understand where you're coming from. Safety should be a big concern, even for the weekend project, but there is always more than one way to skin a cat.

If you use the hammer/chisel method correctly, you will get the same exact results as you would with a tool. The only difference is the crimp tool does it neater. With the right technique, you can get perfectly safe and reliable crimps with a hammer and a chisel. It's really doing the same thing.

An inexperienced installer can have a bad crimp even when using a special tool. 

The tool used isn't the safety hazard, the person using the tool is.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

I think I'm gonna make a quick vid... hang tight.....


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Ignore mah big bellay, I'm preggers with a baby Elephant, I can show you it's trunk if you'd like


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## qstarin (Mar 25, 2009)

Damn. That looks like it made a solid connection.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

It's not coming apart, trick is to soak the wire when you tin it to get good penetration, you don't just wanna solder the outside conductors.


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## Kerpal (Jan 27, 2009)

Nice tutorial chad... that is exactly how I terminated all my battery and ground cables, except I didn't tin the wire first. Probably a good idea but so far mine are still holding strong. The solder seemed to wick into the inner stands pretty well even without tinning them.

Those copper lugs sure make soldering them on easy. I'm using these for my 1/0:
0 Gauge Ring Terminals
I assume they'll make a decent solder connection too, they'll just need a slightly different technique from using the lugs with the closed ends.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Welding lugs, dirt cheap, WAY thicker......


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## HIS4 (Oct 6, 2005)

If you can't solder or don't have the tools to crimp, there's always compression terminals. $$$ though. Set screw is alright but not the greatest connection.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

I've had terrible luck with setscrew and honestly it's REALLY hard to screw up a cup style solder connection, just watch the vid... one take, no edit, slam dunk, that easy. If you have a solder pot to tin in it's WAY easier to do when doing a bunch of connections. I have a solder pot but I did it that way for the vid because, well, not everyone can obtain a solder pot easily.


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## Kerpal (Jan 27, 2009)

I hate those set screw terminals. I won't use fuse holders or anything else with set screws under the hood since they always seem to work themselves loose over time. Plus, they're kinda bulky, and expensive.

Welding lugs rock though. I don't know why I didn't think of using those again before this thread. Anyone wanna buy some 1/0 crimp terminals?


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## johns (Feb 9, 2009)

Here is the proper tool if you want to crimp connector for next to nothing$$$
weldingsupply.com Lenco Swedge-on tool Model#840L $8.85


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

I solder all my power terminals 4ga and larger, regardless of whether I'm crimping them also or not. The hammer method and the vise method both work fine but you can make a pretty badass 1/0 crimping tool out of an old set of boltcutters.


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## Viperoni (Oct 14, 2006)

I dont see what's wrong with crimping with a vise... mine's fairly solid and I can get 1/0g crimped pretty damm hard.


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## mjgonegm (Jun 21, 2008)

I had success with a C- clamp with a ball point, works perfect for me.


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## AVIDEDTR (Sep 11, 2008)

chad said:


> Ignore mah big bellay, I'm preggers with a baby Elephant, I can show you it's trunk if you'd like





chad said:


> I've had terrible luck with setscrew and honestly it's REALLY hard to screw up a cup style solder connection, just watch the vid... one take, no edit, slam dunk, that easy. If you have a solder pot to tin in it's WAY easier to do when doing a bunch of connections. I have a solder pot but I did it that way for the vid because, well, not everyone can obtain a solder pot easily.


Nice vid....I'll definitely do that next build


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## 94VG30DE (Nov 28, 2007)

Great video Chad. I'm sending it to a friend that just wrecked his termination because he didn't know what he was doing. But honestly, what do you have in your left pocket? Is that like your ball of socks for the week or something?


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## smgreen20 (Oct 13, 2006)

Going to sound stupid, but a vice and an allen wrench. Put the terminal and the allen wrench in the vice so that when you crank on the vice it smashes the terminal. If I had a vice myself I'd just go out and take a pic, but I have yet to get one.


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## Austin (Mar 12, 2009)

94VG30DE said:


> But honestly, what do you have in your left pocket? Is that like your ball of socks for the week or something?


looks like maybe a brick cell phone? or or or magical soldering skills in brick form or more welding lugs that he just carrys around for good luck. ya dont now

im really tired right now so i dont know what im saying. gotta wake up in 5 hours


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## johns (Feb 9, 2009)

Does anyone know where to get 0 gauge welding lugs with 5/16" bolt hole, all welding lugs I have seen in 0 gauge size have too large of hole


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

94VG30DE said:


> But honestly, what do you have in your left pocket? Is that like your ball of socks for the week or something?


LOL..... The brick is a box of smokes in a hard-case (I make my own), a bic lighter, and probably a set of keys and a rag.


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## xcoldricex (Apr 28, 2007)

great video chad, thanks! if using the set screw type connections - is it still ok to tin the wire first to keep the wire from fraying?

also are there any 1/0 copper lugs with a 5/16" bolt hole like johns asked?


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Just tin the tip of it upside down, if you screw it down you wanna mash the copper alone. The tinning will keep it from pulling out if TSHTF


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## 94VG30DE (Nov 28, 2007)

chad said:


> Just tin the tip of it upside down, if you screw it down you wanna mash the copper alone. The tinning will keep it from pulling out if *TSHTF*


+ for tinning just the tip. I did this with the wires going to the terminal cup on my sub and they have been in and out of the spring clips probably 20 times with no damage. 

Also, I like how things have gone wrong for you so many times that you developed an abbreviation for when things go awry  TSHTF indeed.


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## RBeachTL (Jul 21, 2008)

This tool does a pretty good job on 1/0 crimps:

8 TON HYDRAULIC ELECTRIC WIRE CABLE CRIMPING CRIMPER - eBay (item 250506888778 end time Oct-30-09 16:54:52 PDT)

I was always taught that good crimps are the best method for electro-mechanical connections; solder is really for electrical connections where mechanical properties are not a primary consideration.


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## ogg (Oct 13, 2007)

There is no way I would trust a set screw ring connector. I've seen many set screws back out over time in many different applications. For connectors bigger than my crimping tool I crimp it as well as I can with a pair of linesman's pliers and then bang it tight with a hammer. I've got mine tight enough that I could lift the battery out of the car by the wire without it coming loose. Working in construction for 20+ years you learn how to improvise and use the tools at hand to get the job done without wasting a ton of money on tools you'll barely use.

EDIT: Next time I'll probably try Chad's method.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

RBeachTL said:


> This tool does a pretty good job on 1/0 crimps:
> 
> 8 TON HYDRAULIC ELECTRIC WIRE CABLE CRIMPING CRIMPER - eBay (item 250506888778 end time Oct-30-09 16:54:52 PDT)
> 
> I was always taught that good crimps are the best method for electro-mechanical connections; solder is really for electrical connections where mechanical properties are not a primary consideration.


We ain't building the national overhead power grid here  there should not be much mechanical about it unless you hang your amps from their power connections.


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## 2_Lude (Oct 5, 2009)

Has anyone used the Streewires Inter-Lok Terminals? Do they hold well, pretty pricey though.

StreetWires PRI0 1/0 AWG Inter-Lok Power Ring Pair


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## rexxxlo (Apr 14, 2009)

how to: cut strip and crimp hyperflex for - Car Audio Forum - CarAudio.com


i like this guys idea


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## Austin (Mar 12, 2009)

rexxxlo said:


> how to: cut strip and crimp hyperflex for - Car Audio Forum - CarAudio.com
> 
> 
> i like this guys idea


except that tool's cost was around $2000

Hydraulic Quad-Point Crimping Tool, Flip-Top Dieless - Google Product Search


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## rexxxlo (Apr 14, 2009)

ahhh minor details


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