# USB to Optical w/o conversion.



## Orion525iT

Maybe I don't know enough, but is there any way to go from USB to optical without using a DAC? Its just a digital signal in a different format, correct?

I am using Mini Dsp 2x8 with the DIGI-FP add on board. The add on board has optical in/out, AES-EBU, and s/pdif. I planned to do a car-pc, but in the meantime, I was wondering why it would not be possible simply to use the USB port on my Note II to send a purely digital signal. There are all sorts of USB DAC that will work with android devices, but why is there not a simply device that can send a digital signal from the usb port to the s/pdif or optical.

Am I just being dense?


----------



## crackinhedz

Amazon.com: Behringer UCA202 Audio Interface: Musical Instruments


----------



## crackinhedz

And those with iPhones use this

Amazon.com : Pure i-20 30-Pin iPod/iPhone Speaker Dock : MP3 Players & Accessories


----------



## 4thseason

This will do optical-

HiFimeDIY Sabre U2 Asynchronous USB DAC

B~


----------



## machinehead

Minidsp now sells a converter for usb to spdif: miniStreamer | MiniDSP


----------



## t3sn4f2

I'd get the hifimediy piece mentioned above. And also add their USB isolator.


----------



## GlasSman

BowDown uses this one but I still have to confirm he's not using it for another purpose since he also uses the Mini DSP.

Amazon.com: Teralink x2 Native 24bit/96k USB to SPDIF/I2S Converter: Electronics

I'm also looking for an optical from an Android device so I'm researching now to get the best price/performance ratio.

We all know once the vehicle starts rolling much of the benefits of the higher $$$$ units are masked by road noise.

My biggest question is how the Behringer unit stacks up to either the MiniDSP or HIFimeDIY units which are at attractive price points.


----------



## 1fastkingcab

I'm after the same thing. 

I do have a solution that works, but I'm hoping you guys have a cleaner option.

It's kind of a process so I'll go in order from source to DSP

My source is My phone (Spotify) HTC One (M8) which has a "MHL" output

MHL to HDMI converter (Rocketfish RGF1171)










Connected Via HDMI to a HDMI to SPDIF converter (Vanco 280573 HDMI Audio Extractor)



















Then Optical to my DSP (Alpine PXA-H701)




My biggest issue is that both boxes cost $100-$150 depending on where you shop and both converters are 5vDC powered so you have to stash a dual 5v phone charger and 2x Micro USB wires along with a HDMI cable 

I would LOVE a single Micro USB (MHL) connection at my Android Phone with an optical output & obviously 5v+ to the adapter.


----------



## AtlasMick

Turtle Beach Micro II


----------



## Orion525iT

1fastkingcab said:


> I'm after the same thing.
> 
> I do have a solution that works, but I'm hoping you guys have a cleaner option.
> 
> It's kind of a process so I'll go in order from source to DSP
> 
> My source is My phone (Spotify) HTC One (M8) which has a "MHL" output
> 
> MHL to HDMI converter (Rocketfish RGF1171)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Connected Via HDMI to a HDMI to SPDIF converter (Vanco 280573 HDMI Audio Extractor)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then Optical to my DSP (Alpine PXA-H701)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My biggest issue is that both boxes cost $100-$150 depending on where you shop and both converters are 5vDC powered so you have to stash a dual 5v phone charger and 2x Micro USB wires along with a HDMI cable
> 
> I would LOVE a single Micro USB (MHL) connection at my Android Phone with an optical output & obviously 5v+ to the adapter.


I honestly think that the Hifimediy U2 would be a better option. I think, as far as I can tell, that the MHL and the chain you used is not asynchronous and therefor uses the internal clock for the audio signal.

The Alpine is a Prologic II? If so that is surround extracted from a stereo signal, correct? So there is no need for MHL-HDMI-Optical. The U2 should do the trick, it's only used as transport to the DSP. I think that might be what I get, with the isolator. 

Someday I would like to play with a true carPC or maybe just Daphile in car music server. But I am so far from that point right now, it's stupid to consider.


----------



## 1fastkingcab

it doesn't look like that HiFimeDIY Sabre U2 DAC has an optical audio output.



I ordered one of the turtle beach Micro II's and a MHL to USB (under $50 shipped from amazon) I think I'll need to run it through a powered USB Hub but even with that the cost will be well under my previous solution.


----------



## Orion525iT

1fastkingcab said:


> it doesn't look like that HiFimeDIY Sabre U2 DAC has an optical audio output.
> 
> 
> 
> I ordered one of the turtle beach Micro II's and a MHL to USB (under $50 shipped from amazon) I think I'll need to run it through a powered USB Hub but even with that the cost will be well under my previous solution.


Let me know how that works out.

The U2 does have optical out. It's pretty vague and hard to tell, but there is an adapter piece that goes in place of the analog jack that is optical.


----------



## Orion525iT

Did some more looking.

X1 24/192 USB to SPDIF Converter | Peachtree Audio

Pretty much what I was looking for in a tighter package. It has no analog component and better 24/192 (if that really matters?). It has an isolator built in. It's more expensive, but you can get it from places like Crutchfield, so returns should't be an issue.

I am trying to find out is anybody has got it to work with android, but it seems it will take a lot of digging. There is so, so much more stuff out there from the last time I did a good search. This is a good thing but it also means more **** to dig though.


----------



## 1fastkingcab

Looks good, seems like it is Mac/Apple based, Crutchfield says you need a driver for Windows 7/8 but not for Mac.

I wonder how it would respond to a MHL connection.


----------



## Orion525iT

1fastkingcab said:


> Looks good, seems like it is Mac/Apple based, Crutchfield says you need a driver for Windows 7/8 but not for Mac.
> 
> I wonder how it would respond to a MHL connection.


I can almost guarantee that somebody has tried it. It's just a matter of finding it. Head-fi has a list of dacs that have been used successfully with android devices, but that thread is 400+ page long. It might be in that thread though. 

I am not sure why the driver is needed. If you look at the Peachtree website, it's almost like the bitrate or the asynchronous mode is not supported natively in Windows for some reason. The lowered tiered product that they sell (coax out only) is not asynchronous and does not need a driver for Windows, but it is lower bitrate too. Not sure what to make of that.


Somewhat OT for now, but

Ultimately, I would like to set up a dedicated audiophile linux box. Maybe a dual boot tablet, since they are not too expensive.

Screenshots | AudioPhile Linux

Another is Daphile, which is a headless linux box which you can control through a squeeze box app on your phone. Might be wonky in a car though and difficult to trouble shoot due to the headless nature. Would be a waste of a tablet too. Madybe good use for an old PC. 

Daphile ? Digital Music Convenience for Audiophiles


----------



## Ultimateherts

Orion525iT said:


> Somewhat OT for now, but
> 
> Ultimately, I would like to set up a dedicated audiophile linux box. Maybe a dual boot tablet, since they are not too expensive.
> 
> Screenshots | AudioPhile Linux
> 
> Another is Daphile, which is a headless linux box which you can control through a squeeze box app on your phone. Might be wonky in a car though and difficult to trouble shoot due to the headless nature. Would be a waste of a tablet too. Madybe good use for an old PC.
> 
> Daphile ? Digital Music Convenience for Audiophiles


That has about zero tuning capabilities, which defeats the purpose of a Carpc. You want something (in my eyes) that can replace an external processor (360.3, H800, MS8, etc.). 
Something like this would do:

DSP Crossover for PC. Frequency Allocator.


----------



## Orion525iT

Ultimateherts said:


> That has about zero tuning capabilities, which defeats the purpose of a Carpc. You want something (in my eyes) that can replace an external processor (360.3, H800, MS8, etc.).
> Something like this would do:
> 
> DSP Crossover for PC. Frequency Allocator.


Which one? Audiophile Linux or Daphile? In my case, I disagree somewhat since I already have a minidsp 4x10. However I do see your point, and having even more control can't be a bad thing. 

The main point to those OS configurations is that they are designed with sq in mind. The claim is that there is background garbage that always interferes with audio output. However, I would like to see actual data to back up the claim that these OS are definitively better. It would be nice to not have to mess around with foobar or other stuff. 

OS maybe a different topic altogether.


----------



## Ultimateherts

Orion525iT said:


> Which one? Audiophile Linux or Daphile? In my case, I disagree somewhat since I already have a minidsp 4x10. However I do see your point, and having even more control can't be a bad thing.
> 
> The main point to those OS configurations is that they are designed with sq in mind. The claim is that there is background garbage that always interferes with audio output.
> OS maybe a different topic altogether.


Processing power has come so far I would really doubt it would interfere that much. Also you can tweak the OS anyway you want either:

1) when you are installing a fresh copy of it

2) by adjusting system setting (startup programs or by removing unnecessary Windows components etc.) 

Also if you diy a Carpc the most important piece of software you need is driver support. As far as expandability goes, I doubt any of those new so called "SQ" operating systems have little or any driver support. What good is the Software if nothing is compatible with it?


----------



## 1fastkingcab

Ultimateherts said:


> Processing power has come so far I would really doubt it would interfere that much. Also you can tweak the OS anyway you want either:
> 
> 1) when you are installing a fresh copy of it
> 
> 2) by adjusting system setting (startup programs or by removing unnecessary Windows components etc.)
> 
> Also if you diy a Carpc the most important piece of software you need is driver support. As far as expandability goes, I doubt any of those new so called "SQ" operating systems have little or any driver support. What good is the Software if nothing is compatible with it?


I agree, and I know I am running the signal into a DSP and I think the OP was too. the main goal is the cleanest possible signal into the standalone DSP unit


----------



## Ultimateherts

1fastkingcab said:


> I agree, and I know I am running the signal into a DSP and I think the OP was too. the main goal is the cleanest possible signal into the standalone DSP unit


One could argue an IPOD and a line driver would accomplish this without any headaches!


----------



## 1fastkingcab

Ultimateherts said:


> One could argue an IPOD and a line driver would accomplish this without any headaches!


Not really, that's like saying "Why use an HDMI cable to hook up my DVD player it comes with RCA's"


----------



## Ultimateherts

1fastkingcab said:


> Not really, that's like saying "Why use an HDMI cable to hook up my DVD player it comes with RCA's"


Do your research the output on the one of the Iphones was tested here and it measured quite well!

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/member-reviews-product-comparisons/138160-iphone-5-analog-output-measurements.html


----------



## 1fastkingcab

No need for the attitude. But do your research just about every DSP out there is better in Every measurable way. With a digital input.


----------



## NealfromNZ

Orion525iT said:


> Let me know how that works out.
> 
> The U2 does have optical out. It's pretty vague and hard to tell, but there is an adapter piece that goes in place of the analog jack that is optical.


Correct, uses a 3.5mm male optical to toslink adaptor. Great little dac.

https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=3...niv&sa=X&ei=2oCvVJm_JqPpmQWnmoJA&ved=0CCIQsAQ


----------



## Ultimateherts

1fastkingcab said:


> No need for the attitude. But do your research just about every DSP out there is better in Every measurable way. With a digital input.


The only way I could see it being better is that you would not be converting analog to digital. It would be one less conversion in the chain. However, in a blind I would not be able to tell the difference...


----------



## NealfromNZ

So the reality of my situation which may help some of the points made here that I have a entry level PPI DSP-88r based system with an iPhone and carpc connected.

My iPhone 6 is connected via Analog input and it quite sounds reasonable.

My netbook based carpc with a hifimydiy Async sabre dac which is connected optically has a better overall sound when playing the same track recorded in Apple lossless format.
The sound stage is better defined, the bass has slightly more definition. vocals are slightly clearer and the edginess has gone.

Just to put a spanner in the works using the sabre dac via analog / RCA input into the 88r dsp may have a slight edge over using the dsp-88r. Almost nothing in it as its limited by the rest of the audio gear in my car. The sabre Dac running HD558 headphones from the car pc 
sounds fantastic.

Interesting enough I've had iPhones 5, 5s and 6. Via analog these all give more than expectable level of music quality via analog. For me although the six has better technical specs I think the 5s sounds more musical of the bunch. Not much in it but IMO the six looses out on vocals to the 5s


----------



## 1fastkingcab

The turtle beach micro 2 works flawlessly. I'm most impressed that my phone can use it as shown without a powered usb hub. 

I had to order the MHL adapter. And the micro 2 was $25. Grand total $25


----------



## 1fastkingcab

Ultimateherts said:


> The only way I could see it being better is that you would not be converting analog to digital. It would be one less conversion in the chain. However, in a blind I would not be able to tell the difference...


Exactly, The Digital to Analog conversion happens in the DSP instead of the source.

and I'd bet 9 out of 10 could tell a diffrence.

If we where talking about Video it would literally be the same as a Composite video connection (Maybe S-Video) VS. HDMI (DVI if you want to exclude the audio)


----------



## Orion525iT

1fastkingcab said:


> The turtle beach micro 2 works flawlessly. I'm most impressed that my phone can use it as shown without a powered usb hub.
> 
> I had to order the MHL adapter. And the micro 2 was $25. Grand total $25


Nice to know that works!




1fastkingcab said:


> Exactly, The Digital to Analog conversion happens in the DSP instead of the source.
> 
> and I'd bet 9 out of 10 could tell a diffrence.
> 
> If we where talking about Video it would literally be the same as a Composite video connection (Maybe S-Video) VS. HDMI (DVI if you want to exclude the audio)


Ya that's the goal, to have the DSP do the conversion, it does not make sense any other way really.


----------



## Ultimateherts

1fastkingcab said:


> Exactly, The Digital to Analog conversion happens in the DSP instead of the source.
> 
> and I'd bet 9 out of 10 could tell a diffrence.
> 
> If we where talking about Video it would literally be the same as a Composite video connection (Maybe S-Video) VS. HDMI (DVI if you want to exclude the audio)


It is different with video because of HDCP. The audio connector should make zero difference. It would also depend which DAC chip they use. If I am not mistaken the Ipods use some of the very best available. You also have to realize that 95% of the music we listen to that is downloaded is also encoded at a much lower rate as well. I said 95% because there are still other sources to get high quality downloads, just not for any POP music.


----------



## 1fastkingcab

Ultimateherts said:


> It is different with video because of HDCP. The audio connector should make zero difference. It would also depend which DAC chip they use. If I am not mistaken the Ipods use some of the very best available. You also have to realize that 95% of the music we listen to that is downloaded is also encoded at a much lower rate as well. I said 95% because there are still other sources to get high quality downloads, just not for any POP music.



Are you serious. The only diffrence between S-video and HDMI is the copyright protocols. WoW Microsoft was right Blurays do suck........


----------

