# IASCA Sunday February 15th 2009



## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

February 15th 2009 - Beach Autosound Sound Off
Beach Autosound
18042 Beach Blvd.
Huntington Beach, CA 92648
714-848-5400
Formats: SQi and SQc
Entry Fee: $30 and $50 for 2 formats



How many are coming to either compete or just hang out?


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## atsaubrey (Jan 10, 2007)

I totally want to make this one but I am getting married the day before :worried:


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I'll try to permanently mount my tweets and fix my rattles before i think about entering.. but I'll try to make it out there either or to hang out or compete for my first time.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

atsaubrey said:


> I totally want to make this one but I am getting married the day before :worried:


Congrats!

You can leave your car with me and I'll handle all the competing


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## atsaubrey (Jan 10, 2007)

If you wanna drive up to get it, you can compete with it. You have the fun but if there is a win I get the trophy.


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## FREQBOX (Jun 25, 2007)

I will most likely be there to hang out


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## NismoV35 (Aug 30, 2008)

Bing will have my car finished by Feb 6 and tuned by Eng on the 7th should I enter this? What class should I enter? SQi or SQc?


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

NismoV35 said:


> Bing will have my car finished by Feb 6 and tuned by Eng on the 7th should I enter this? What class should I enter? SQi or SQc?


I think you should enter, the last car Bing built and Eng tuned won SQi.


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## fredridge (Jan 17, 2007)

Tweets?!?! HUH



James Bang said:


> I'll try to permanently mount my tweets and fix my rattles before i think about entering.. but I'll try to make it out there either or to hang out or compete for my first time.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

fredridge said:


> Tweets?!?! HUH


Yeah and possibly getting rid of the Horns.

James is definitely a tweaker.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

dammit, iwsh it was one week earlier so i can make it...oh well...but hopefully i will be their in spirit with a coupla cars


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

simplicityinsound said:


> dammit, iwsh it was one week earlier so i can make it...oh well...but hopefully i will be their in spirit with a coupla cars


Damn Bing two of your creations are going to be there.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

i acutally have 4 out in socal that i thik should compete, but i dont know fi the other two will be available hehe


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## Insane01VWPassat (May 12, 2006)

Sorry guys..... going to miss this one. I still got a lot of work to complete on my Passat mechanical wise to finish before it leaves on tour... Ill see you guys at some of the northern and central cali events. Also unless I get this processor issue fixed I wint be doing much competiting till I find a replacement.. But well see wht happens..... Enjoy..


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

fredridge said:


> Tweets?!?! HUH


yeah..i have big O' nipples on my a-pillars like Eng now. I just have to permanently mount them and glass them, which i have no skills in doing.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

do the hack shop "stretched-felt-doubling-as-glass" method james...lol...mount hte baffle, get some hot pink stretch felt, and just pull it along and glue tot he back, unless someone touches it or wind hits it, from pics it looks like flawlessly excuted glass a pillar with perfect wrapping


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

simplicityinsound said:


> do the hack shop "stretched-felt-doubling-as-glass" method james...lol...mount hte baffle, get some hot pink stretch felt, and just pull it along and glue tot he back, unless someone touches it or wind hits it, from pics it looks like flawlessly excuted glass a pillar with perfect wrapping


lol.. i was thinking about that.. i might actually use resin and duraglass..


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## kevin k. (May 5, 2005)

simplicityinsound said:


> do the hack shop "stretched-felt-doubling-as-glass" method james...lol...mount hte baffle, get some hot pink stretch felt, and just pull it along and glue tot he back, unless someone touches it or wind hits it, from pics it looks like flawlessly excuted glass a pillar with perfect wrapping


I'll see your hack shop job and raise you cut up bath towels, lamp cord, and duct tape! imp:


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## BigRed (Aug 12, 2007)

I see James finally gave in  I noticed that you have the left tweeter at your left ear, and your right tweeter at your right ear. Looks like a familiar setup


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

I'll try to head down there. My car is almost out of the shop... Hopefully I can remember how to drive.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

BigRed said:


> I see James finally gave in  I noticed that you have the left tweeter at your left ear, and your right tweeter at your right ear. Looks like a familiar setup


They practically dead on-axis just like my midranges. That aiming for my tweets were my initial position, but i'm liking it a lot already, so i'll just keep them this way. Now it's time to make them purrrrdy.


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

Looking good James. Always trying something new.. I'll have something a little different for you guys in the next few months. I'm trying to be good and keep working on my install as much as I can. NEED to finish.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

PureDynamics said:


> Looking good James. Always trying something new.. I'll have something a little different for you guys in the next few months. I'm trying to be good and keep working on my install as much as I can. NEED to finish.


haha i've come a long way from back when i use to head to ID w/ blown subs for you to recone :laugh:

and with my brahma 15 only hitting 140dB


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## atsaubrey (Jan 10, 2007)

Another pillar car.....blah 





















Need Viagra or something? Not horny anymore?


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I actually ran out of room in my kicks


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

Slipped my mind... I might be at mammoth mtn that weekend. I'll might have to beat Eng  and take him to lunch another time


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> Slipped my mind... I might be at mammoth mtn that weekend. I'll might have to beat Eng  and take him to lunch another time


James,

Are you really going to let Eng chase you all the way to Mammoth? :laugh:


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

Darn, you saw right through me... :blush:

I'm almost ready to face him


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> Darn, you saw right through me... :blush:
> 
> I'm almost ready to face him


What happened to the front windshield? :surprised:


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

michaelsil1 said:


> What happened to the front windshield? :surprised:


a few months with no car wash...


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> a few months with no car wash...


Oh, that sounds like my car! :blush:


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

James Bang said:


> Slipped my mind... I might be at mammoth mtn that weekend. I'll might have to beat Eng  and take him to lunch another time


Oh maaaan!!!
j/k James.. Come on man, my nipples vs your nipples. (Mines are bigger) :laugh:

Aubrey, congrats, dude! Now say bye to that car audio hobby  

Boss Dan, you've been saying "finish" for what, 8 years now?  :laugh:


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Oh maaaan!!!
> j/k James.. Come on man, my nipples vs your nipples. (Mines are bigger) :laugh:
> 
> Aubrey, congrats, dude! Now say bye to that car audio hobby
> ...


I have more speakers, and we all know, the more the better 

Also, Dan actually show me pictures of PROGRESS in his sytem  8 more years maybe.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

James Bang said:


> I have more speakers, and we all know, the more the better
> 
> Also, Dan actually show me pictures of PROGRESS in his sytem  8 more years maybe.


But you see, I TWEAKED my nipples, just like GSP  :surprised: 
Don't worry about Dan. Before he gets close, he will change cars like always


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I applied some lotion to my nipples so they won't be harsh. I will soon tweak/perk them and put them up against yours.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> I applied some lotion to my nipples so they won't be harsh. I will soon tweak/perk them and put them up against yours.


Use Ice instead of lotion if you really want to get them perky.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

word is that Eng likes his a little bright. He might need a tan.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

James Bang said:


> word is that Eng likes his a little bright. He might need a tan.


Yeah, I like em blondie's nipples 
That's why mines are norwegians


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

uh huh.. I see how its going to be.. NO DEMO FOR YOU (soup nazi voice)!


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

oh snap, we have a demo nazi on our hands.


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## NismoV35 (Aug 30, 2008)

Ok What time does this start?


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

NismoV35 said:


> Ok What time does this start?


Good Question!

The last event was:

Lot opens at: 9am
Sign-up from: 9am-12 noon
Judging from: 11am-its done


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## dvflyer (May 11, 2007)

Working on the wife to let me go to this show... Valentines weekend...


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

dvflyer said:


> Working on the wife to let me go to this show... Valentines weekend...


You can work on her Saturday all day, what is this extended Valentines for you guys :laugh:

I got the car back and the new engine runs impressively well. The H701 remembered how I touched it in the past at a click of a button. Looks like a go for me on the 15th!


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> Looks like a go for me on the 15th!



Cool!


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I should be there,too.


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> You can work on her Saturday all day, what is this extended Valentines for you guys :laugh:
> 
> I got the car back and the new engine runs impressively well. The H701 remembered how I touched it in the past at a click of a button. Looks like a go for me on the 15th!


Was the clutch the same as you remembered, or did it take some getting use to?

I don't think I read exactly what your swap was
(turbo and stroked h22?)


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I'm gonna try to finish my pillars today and hopefully finish tuning these huge nipples by next week.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> I'm gonna try to finish my pillars today and hopefully finish tuning these huge nipples by next week.


I would of thought you'd have finished them by now.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

sr20det510 said:


> Was the clutch the same as you remembered, or did it take some getting use to?
> 
> I don't think I read exactly what your swap was
> (turbo and stroked h22?)


lol, not that crazy yet. It's just a Jdm h22a. I'm using all stock parts including clutch to run it. I got race grade mounts all around to make sure I don't break them again = lots of vibration at idle. I'll be demoing with the engine off for sure.


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## jaejw1 (Jul 2, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Yeah, I like em blondie's nipples
> That's why mines are norwegians


eng... r u going 

since it is so close to my house.. i might just go.. dont know if i will recognize any faces from years past.. been a long time since i even looked at an amplifier..


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

michaelsil1 said:


> I would of thought you'd have finished them by now.


I thought so too... i'm just gonna primer and spray paint them.. ghetto fabulous..


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

Crapers, I don't know if I'll get there by 12pm. Any possibility of signing in late?


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> Crapers, I don't know if I'll get there by 12pm. Any possibility of signing in late?


I believe they cut someone some slack last time and that person ended up making the ranks and bumping someone off the pedestal...

I'd really like to see how your car stacks up... against mine


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

We all know how your car stacks against mine. I have a sports suspension and more amps therefore it sits lower.

I can just as easily add that blue paintjob beats black.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I don't know about that... my shocks/suspension is pretty much shot.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

jaejw1 said:


> eng... r u going
> 
> since it is so close to my house.. i might just go.. dont know if i will recognize any faces from years past.. been a long time since i even looked at an amplifier..


I'll be there, officer.
No, you won't recognize anybody else. I am the last man standing from the last car audio generation, the golden ear mafia mofos 

Damn I miss those days


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## fredridge (Jan 17, 2007)

I wanted to be there, but things are not going well right now......and if I can get it worked out I am going to try and get to Aubrey's wedding.


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## jaejw1 (Jul 2, 2007)

dual700 said:


> I'll be there, officer.
> No, you won't recognize anybody else. I am the last man standing from the last car audio generation, the golden ear mafia mofos
> 
> Damn I miss those days


 dang its been that long... we are dinosaurs


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

dual700 said:


> I'll be there, officer.
> No, you won't recognize anybody else. I am the last man standing from the last car audio generation, the golden ear mafia mofos
> 
> Damn I miss those days


I remember reading hundreds of threads on ECA and many signatures read, "Golden Ear Mafia."

I always wondered who was in it? Eng, RJ, Jaejw1 (never met him), and ??


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> Crapers, I don't know if I'll get there by 12pm. Any possibility of signing in late?


I'm sure Todd will be more than happy to make an allowance. 

The Guy that won SQi last time got there at three. 
Some of us weren't so happy about it. :surprised:


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

sr20det510 said:


> I remember reading hundreds of threads on ECA and many signatures read, "Golden Ear Mafia."
> 
> I always wondered who was in it? Eng, RJ, Jaejw1 (never met him), and ??


There were a whole bunch of us...maybe around 15 - 20 guys...Leon, firegate, skylar, technobug, etc, etc
Now that you said it, I remember your user name now..
Go to Disneyland on Monday!


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## whatzzap (Jun 16, 2006)

michaelsil1 said:


> I'm sure Todd will be more than happy to make an allowance.
> 
> The Guy that won SQi last time got there at three.
> Some of us weren't so happy about it. :surprised:


uuuhhhhhh, someone asking for a spank


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

whatzzap said:


> uuuhhhhhh, someone asking for a spank


LOL!!

Ron, 
Michael's tune at the last Autobacs meet was his best effort yet! Should be some pretty stiff competition this time.

How are the new midbass working out for you?

Still have the 10" A/D/S for sale?


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## whatzzap (Jun 16, 2006)

new midbass has more output compare to the last one i used, its snappier, and Master Eng retuned my midrange and tweets, its sounds much better and very detail, too bad i wont compete this weekend. i still have the ADS, give you a discount if you want it ehhehehe


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

dual700 said:


> There were a whole bunch of us...maybe around 15 - 20 guys...Leon, firegate, skylar, technobug, etc, etc
> Now that you said it, I remember your user name now..
> Go to Disneyland on Monday!


I think Saturday is the perfect day for Disneyland 
That is what I will recommend

As for the Golden Ear Mafia who was the Capo Crimini/capo de tutti capi?


BTW, I need to make a trip to Java Spice (two orders of nasi bungkus are calling my name.)


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

whatzzap said:


> new midbass has more output compare to the last one i used, its snappier, and Master Eng retuned my midrange and tweets, its sounds much better and very detail, too bad i wont compete this weekend. i still have the ADS, give you a discount if you want it ehhehehe


If I can make it out on Sunday I will pick it up from you.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

whatzzap said:


> uuuhhhhhh, someone asking for a spank


I like getting spanked; that's why I'm in for a major Ass Whooping on the 15th. :uhoh2:


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

sr20det510 said:


> I think Saturday is the perfect day for Disneyland
> That is what I will recommend
> 
> As for the Golden Ear Mafia who was the Capo Crimini/capo de tutti capi?
> ...


Muahahaha! I can't remember who's got that title. :laugh:
I can't remember mine either  Capora something, haha
Java Spice? Bring it on!!  

Ron's car sounding better than ever..
Too bad he has to go to SF to attend a g#@ parade muahahahahaha


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

Team 10" midbass will make a spectacular debut 

WATCH OUT NOW!

I'm half way done retuning my setup and I almost busted a nut already.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> Team 10" midbass will make a spectacular debut
> 
> WATCH OUT NOW!
> 
> I'm half way done retuning my setup and I almost busted a nut already.


We're all in trouble now. 

For the life of me I can't even get mine to give me a reach around.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

IMO, my imaging is better than it's ever been. the wooooooos and lipsmacks come from the same spot 

also, I can't believe i'm a bit satisfied w/ the 7 drum track, which i've learned to hate.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> IMO, my imaging is better than it's ever been. the wooooooos and lipsmacks come from the same spot
> 
> also, I can't believe i'm a bit satisfied w/ the 7 drum track, which i've learned to hate.


James,

Did you keep or ditch the Horns?


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

michaelsil1 said:


> James,
> 
> Did you keep or ditch the Horns?


The horns are gone.


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

James Bang said:


> The horns are gone.


James save me some seat time!


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

What time is everyone getting to the show?


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

PureDynamics said:


> James save me some seat time!


you're the first and only one in line...

no one cares about the underdog. 



PureDynamics said:


> What time is everyone getting to the show?


I'll try to get there by 10:30a


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> you're the first and only one in line...
> 
> no one cares about the underdog.
> 
> ...


I want to be second. 

I thought I was the underdog haven't you seen my avatar.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

since i'm the young'n of this group, i guess i'm the underpup.

I'm seeing this as a meet with some judging involved. It should be fun. 

Also I have a question: Do we use our own material for them to judge? Or is an IASCA test disc involved? (yes, i'm a noooobie)


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> since i'm the young'n of this group, i guess i'm the underpup.
> 
> I'm seeing this as a meet with some judging involved. It should be fun.
> 
> Also I have a question: Do we use our own material for them to judge? Or is an IASCA test disc involved? (yes, i'm a noooobie)


The judges use a IASCA test disk.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> since i'm the young'n of this group, i guess i'm the underpup.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

michaelsil1 said:


> The judges use a IASCA test disk.


alrighty. Thanks Michael. I guess I'll get comfortable and make sweet love to my IASCA disc this week.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

There's a possibility of:
















Sunday


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I can't see the pic, but i'm assuming it might rain on Sunday. That might be okay with me... it'll give me an excuse for my car being dirty.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> I can't see the pic, but i'm assuming it might rain on Sunday. That might be okay with me... it'll give me an excuse for my car being dirty.


Correct


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## FREQBOX (Jun 25, 2007)

wont be able to make it this time. something important came up.
hope you guys have fun and Im sure I will see some of you at the next get together.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> It'll give me an excuse for my car being dirty.



Good thinking I'll follow suit and show up with a dirty car as well.


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## beerdrnkr (Apr 18, 2007)

I suppose I'll go to this show but with no system :mean:


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

beerdrnkr said:


> I suppose I'll go to this show but with no system :mean:


it's all good. You're system will be there at heart


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## SoCalSQ (Oct 7, 2008)

Rain or shine.

Ill be there at 9 am

Judging starts at 11 am


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## beerdrnkr (Apr 18, 2007)

James Bang said:


> it's all good. You're system will be there at heart


I'm really interested in hearing your car. You got rid of the horns right? By the way, that 7 drum track on the IASCA disc does really suck.


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## eugene (Nov 17, 2008)

I'll try to make it as well. Met some of you guys at the riverside show.. 

Different judges than last time?


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## SoCalSQ (Oct 7, 2008)

yes, different judges.


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## kevin k. (May 5, 2005)

If I'm able, I'll head up to visit with all you fellers...


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

James Bang said:


> The horns are gone.


 
Damn, lost another one!!! which one's were you using?


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

kevin k. said:


> If I'm able, I'll head up to visit with all you fellers...


It will be good to see you.


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)

If im not drenched in fiberglass, I'll head out there as a spectator


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

circa40 said:


> If im not drenched in fiberglass, I'll head out there as a spectator


Sounds good Vin!

I want to talk about moving my tweets upstairs!


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)

ooohhh no, you too?  LOL


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

sr20det510 said:


> Sounds good Vin!
> 
> I want to talk about moving my tweets upstairs!


socal on axis a-pillar large format tweeter club?


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## atsaubrey (Jan 10, 2007)

Post up the scores guys!!!!!!


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

shouldn't you be on your honeymoon?


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## eugene (Nov 17, 2008)

I don't know about the scores.. I had to leave early. but I do know that I heard some really really nice sounding cars today.. Oh and btw Jim's big red truck was sounding amazing. I won't be surprised if I don't place at all.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

eugene said:


> I don't know about the scores.. I had to leave early. but I do know that I heard some really really nice sounding cars today.. Oh and btw Jim's big red truck was sounding amazing. I won't be surprised if I don't place at all.


you placed... i didn't


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)

Im going to have to upload a bunch of pics. I'll have them up tonight


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## fredridge (Jan 17, 2007)

I am really sorry I missed it.... I had planned on going, but got up this morning and couldn't bring myself to it. 

hopefully next meet


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

James Bang said:


> you placed... i didn't


No worries James, you got 275 points on my list ha ha


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## beerdrnkr (Apr 18, 2007)

Which were the top cars?


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)

Sorry about the randomness and if I didn't get everyone, some left before I got a chance to take a few pics :blush:


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)




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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)




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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)




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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

circa40 said:


> Im going to have to upload a bunch of pics. I'll have them up tonight


thank you Vin, our photographer for today. Now we won't get those lame "no pix" non socal whiners 


cvjoint said:


> No worries James, you got 275 points on my list ha ha


Thanks George. I think there were probably just too many in rookie SQc. I wasn't surprised that you scored more than I did. I won't overhang my self over it.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

Another thing, I would've hated to Mr. Judge Jim. There were too many nice setups there today.


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

James don't worry about it. It sounded very nice. Once my right ear comes back to normal I can help tune if you want.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

chad said:


> shouldn't you be on your honeymoon?


Yeah,

Aubrey just enjoy your Honeymoon.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> Another thing, I would've hated to be Mr. Judge Jim. There were too many nice setups there today.


Jim was definitely put to the test; what a hell of a way to start.


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## beerdrnkr (Apr 18, 2007)

I left right before the announcements. Who placed?


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

Thanks for the pics, Circa. I am sorry I missed it, but my wife would have killed me!! I will try to fanagle more in the future. Congrats to the winners.


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## Apex Rex (Jan 8, 2009)

Thanks for the pics, they make me want to start competing but I can't find anything near me.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I took a bunch of random pix as well, but mine aren't of good quality like Vin's.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)




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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)




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## kevin k. (May 5, 2005)

Lots of nice looking cars with some serious sound systems... 

So, what are the results for the different classifications...?


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

Unofficial (What I think I remember :blush

Pro Class- Sir Eng
Rookie-Ron (G35 coupe), Eugene Scion TC), Jim (BIG RED)
SQC-Keith (altima), Eng, and Jim?


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

heck, I think Jim's install is good enough for pro class!! and I havent even seen it in person!! (I would if he ever ventures south!!)


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

lookin good guys, seems like the weather held okay for most of hte time? 

carlos, how did you think david's car sounded compared to the other one you heard at marv's? IMO they have some very similar characteristics overall.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I noticed that dynanmics is not a criteria on the score sheet.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

Are you feelind down and blue? Don't feel like you should compete? Does your setup sound dead and lifeless? Just compete, you might win.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

James are you disagreeing with IASCA rules?


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

it doesn't matter. I like how my setup sounds  whether it ranked up or not.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

James Bang said:


> it doesn't matter. I like how my setup sounds  whether it ranked up or not.


Then why did you compete?


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

James Bang said:


> it doesn't matter. I like how my setup sounds  whether it ranked up or not.


James, that's all that matters!! At the last "competition" I attended I left scratching my head when I heard the results. It's still not clear to me what qualifies someone to be a "judge," and how an OBJECTIVE standard is established upon which performance is to be judged on subjective impressions.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

How to become an IASCA Certified Judge - IASCA


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

kenk said:


> Then why did you compete?


I would venture to guess that like most, if not all, of us, James was probably "curious" about how his car would perform in a competition setting given how HE (and possibly others) felt about the quality of the sound in his car. That said, one must wonder about the merits of a SQ competition when people with good ears leave scratching their heads at the results, as appears to be the case here.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

Would you play a game if you didn't know the rules? Kind of like a street ball player thinks he can win in the NBA.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

No hard feelings people, I was just wondering.


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

kenk said:


> How to become an IASCA Certified Judge - IASCA


Thanks for the link. The most telling thing to me is that in order to qualify as a judge one has to attend live music performances. It is quite surprising to me that people are qualified to judge music without being required to know what certain instruments sound like (and that is broadly speaking because as a former musician I know that even among different instruments one brand will have a different sound than another).


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

kenk said:


> Then why did you compete?


STFU


kenk said:


> How to become an IASCA Certified Judge - IASCA


STFU


kenk said:


> Would you play a game if you didn't know the rules? Kind of like a street ball player thinks he can win in the NBA.


why are you on this site when you don't know **** about SQ or have any interest on tuning or imaging w/ your passives and wanting to go w/ the imprint. 

and I didn't say **** about not knowing the rules, so....

STFU




kenk said:


> No hard feelings people, I was just wondering.


no hard feelings, but STFU. 

:surprised:


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

kenk said:


> Would you play a game if you didn't know the rules? Kind of like a street ball player thinks he can win in the NBA.


Ken, I don't think the issue here is whether or not you know the "rules." You can look at a score sheet and see the criteria by which you will be judged, but at the end of the day, someone called a "judge" sits in your seat and applies standards that are both objective and subjective, but which are ultimately determined on subjective grounds (what the judge hears, and how he/she hears it). The ultimate question is whether the results are supposed to reflect the car with the most enjoyable music listening experience. There appears to be real debate as to whether the criteria applied are consistent with that goal, or even whether that is the goal.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

we missed you yesterday buzz-o


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

James Bang said:


> STFU
> 
> STFU
> 
> ...


Why are you attacking me? My system is irrelevant, I didn't compete then whine. I never said I was a audio expert.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

Buzzman said:


> Ken, I don't think the issue here is whether or not you know the "rules." You can look at a score sheet and see the criteria by which you will be judged, but at the end of the day, someone called a "judge" sits in your seat and applies standards that are both objective and subjective, but which are ultimately determined on subjective grounds (what the judge hears, and how he/she hears it). The ultimate question is whether the results are supposed to reflect the car with the most enjoyable music listening experience. There appears to be real debate as to whether the criteria applied are consistent with that goal, or even whether that is the goal.


So you are saying if your goal and IASCA's goal are different then you shouldn't compete? Sorry but I wasn't trying to attack anyone, it just didn't make sense. I will be at the next competition and anyone can listen if it sounds good or not. I did make a major adjustment.


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## monkeyboy (Jun 12, 2007)

Buzzman said:


> Ken, I don't think the issue here is whether or not you know the "rules." You can look at a score sheet and see the criteria by which you will be judged, but at the end of the day, someone called a "judge" sits in your seat and applies standards that are both objective and subjective, but which are ultimately determined on subjective grounds (what the judge hears, and how he/she hears it). The ultimate question is whether the results are supposed to reflect the car with the most enjoyable music listening experience. There appears to be real debate as to whether the criteria applied are consistent with that goal, or even whether that is the goal.


For what it's worth, those are the cars that seemed to score highest to me. The higher point totals seemed to directly coincide with the cars I remember enjoying judging the most. I judged way too many cars to remember every detail about every car, but the ones I remember having the best experiences in went home with trophies.

The rules seemed to work for me.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

kenk said:


> Why are you attacking me? My system is irrelevant, I didn't compete then whine. I never said I was a audio expert.


Don't come on here making some dumbass assumptions about someone not knowing the rules, especially when you weren't even at the event this thread is about.


kenk said:


> So you are saying if your goal and IASCA's goal are different then you shouldn't compete? Sorry but I wasn't trying to attack anyone, it just didn't make sense. I will be at the next competition and anyone can listen if it sounds good or not. I did make a major adjustment.


You seriously don't know what you're talking about or getting into.

And truthfully, I'm not sure why you even attend the meets when you won't absorb any of the good advice given to you by any of the other attendees.

Improving is our goal. If your goal and our goal are different then maybe you shouldn't attend... according to your logic.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

I don't feel the need to improve if I'm satisfied with the sound. It's not necessary to go active to sound good.


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## eugene (Nov 17, 2008)

monkeyboy said:


> For what it's worth, those are the cars that seemed to score highest to me. The higher point totals seemed to directly coincide with the cars I remember enjoying judging the most. I judged way too many cars to remember every detail about every car, but the ones I remember having the best experiences in went home with trophies.
> 
> The rules seemed to work for me.


Jim, just wanted to say thanks for judging the cars. Show wouldve been canceled if you didnt volunteer your help. So thanks, man.. I def. had a good time and appreciate the comments you made about the system.

And i liked how you laughed at me when i told you there were horns going in soon. hahaha.. too funny.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

kenk said:


> I don't feel the need to improve if I'm satisfied with the sound. It's not necessary to go active to sound good.


good for you. maybe you should compete.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

James Bang said:


> good for you. maybe you should compete.


Nah, no point.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

eugene said:


> Jim, just wanted to say thanks for judging the cars. Show wouldve been canceled if you didnt volunteer your help. So thanks, man.. I def. had a good time and appreciate the comments you made about the system.
> 
> And i liked how you laughed at me when i told you there were horns going in soon. hahaha.. too funny.


when I found out Jim was gonna judge, I thought, "****, I should've kept my horns." Kudos to Jim for going that rough long first event. The virgin got it rough :laugh:

I'm still hornier than Jim.... and rawdawg mr. jimmy james 

I didn't get a chance to demo your car Eugene. Maybe next time.


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## monkeyboy (Jun 12, 2007)

eugene said:


> Jim, just wanted to say thanks for judging the cars. Show wouldve been canceled if you didnt volunteer your help. So thanks, man.. I def. had a good time and appreciate the comments you made about the system.
> 
> And i liked how you laughed at me when i told you there were horns going in soon. hahaha.. too funny.


I had to have a little fun before the judges hat went on. 

I had a good time, and got to hear a bunch of really nice sounding cars. Truth be told, I owe you guys.


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## kenk (Feb 27, 2008)

James Bang said:


> You seriously don't know what you're talking about or getting into.
> 
> And truthfully, I'm not sure why you even attend the meets when you won't absorb any of the good advice given to you by any of the other attendees.
> 
> Improving is our goal. If your goal and our goal are different then maybe you shouldn't attend... according to your logic.


I don't go to the meets to get advice...I go to the meets to meet people with the same interest. A attitude like yours discourages people from showing up. STFU and other insults are childish.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

if you only knew...
but i'll forgive you for you know not what you do.


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## eugene (Nov 17, 2008)

James Bang said:


> when I found out Jim was gonna judge, I thought, "****, I should've kept my horns." Kudos to Jim for going that rough long first event. The virgin got it rough :laugh:
> 
> I'm still hornier than Jim.... and rawdawg mr. jimmy james
> 
> I didn't get a chance to demo your car Eugene. Maybe next time.


James... you're welcome to listen to my car anytime, buddy. I always welcome the advice and comments on my system.. I'm very new to this too so any input from people who love systems as much as me is always appreciated.

I had a blast listening to your system with you. the 10s in the doors had me smiling  But it's too funny you have that giant ID decal on your window with no ID in the car! lol.. Actually I was a little sad to be honest. I've been following your car since you had the idq8s and cd2s. always wanted to hear the idq8. But i don't blame you for the route you took.. the car sounds great and I'm sure it'll only keep improving. Hope to catch you at the next event (riverside i think).


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

Buzzman said:


> Thanks for the link. The most telling thing to me is that in order to qualify as a judge one has to attend live music performances. It is quite surprising to me that people are qualified to judge music without being required to know what certain instruments sound like (and that is broadly speaking because as a former musician I know that even among different instruments one brand will have a different sound than another).


I agree with you Buzz, that is definitely what the comps. should implement at the very least. No disrespect to Jimmy or Todd but I put in $30 bucks and 8 hours to get a bit more than I would at a So. Cal. meet. I went there with an open mind, didn't ask who's judging or anything but I did have expectations just like everyone else. I would love to see someone outside our general circle come in preferably with a bit of background in music reproduction. I would also like to see more than one judge to cushion the scores on more than one subjective opinion. 

Having been there and done that I can say I got no additional benefit from the competition aspect, but I put in my $30 to try it out and find out for myself. Can't say I would do it again, the general feel I got was that judging could be polar opposite from one event to another and you just have to plow along until you get a medal. Well I wasn't there for the medal, and the whole idea of trying until you get a judge that likes you kinda goes against the whole idea of a formal judging process which is based on shaky ideals to begin with.


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## AndyInOC (Jul 22, 2008)

Im sorry that i missed the comp just because its always great to see the guys and b.s. with everyone. James hopefully there will be a meet soon, i want to hear your new setup, i don't think i have ever seen you quite so passionate about your car before so i am sure i won't be disappointed


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

eugene said:


> James... you're welcome to listen to my car anytime, buddy. I always welcome the advice and comments on my system.. I'm very new to this too so any input from people who love systems as much as me is always appreciated.
> 
> I had a blast listening to your system with you. the 10s in the doors had me smiling  But it's too funny you have that giant ID decal on your window with no ID in the car! lol.. Actually I was a little sad to be honest. I've been following your car since you had the idq8s and cd2s. always wanted to hear the idq8. But i don't blame you for the route you took.. the car sounds great and I'm sure it'll only keep improving. Hope to catch you at the next event (riverside i think).


The next meet isn't too far away. If I'm there, i'll try to be sure I get a demo from you. 

I think that smile came from listening to MJ, not my tens 

About the ID sticker... banner I should say. ID treated me well, their products and their people. Too bad Dan and Jeremy aren't there anymore. It was great hanging out with Dan again. The banner seems to be peeling off a bit. I'll rep them till it comes off.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

AndyInOC said:


> Im sorry that i missed the comp just because its always great to see the guys and b.s. with everyone. James hopefully there will be a meet soon, i want to hear your new setup, i don't think i have ever seen you quite so passionate about your car before so i am sure i won't be disappointed


I hope Vegas and those singles treated you well


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## AndyInOC (Jul 22, 2008)

James Bang said:


> I hope Vegas and those singles treated you well


Sadly.......no they didn't lol but oh well, i still have my audio and pics of all my new gear coming soon as well since i finally have a digital cam


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

James Bang said:


> we missed you yesterday buzz-o


James, I would have loved to have been there. However, I was in Phoenix for the NBA All-Star Game festivities Business = Duty.  Hopefully, I have no conflicts for the next meet. I discovered a few weeks ago that I had been driving around with a blown tweeter and mid!  Some solo guitar and piano passages revealed the problem. So, I will be sending my comps to Japan for testing and repair. I have a short term fix planned that will allow me to have music in my car till the repaired speakers come back, hopefully in time for the next meet.


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

kenk said:


> So you are saying if your goal and IASCA's goal are different then you shouldn't compete? . . . .


No, that is NOT what I am saying. I am simply posing the question whether IASCA's standards, and the manner in which they are applied, are intended to identify the most enjoyable music listening experience. I have heard cars that have "won" competitions that would not be my first choice for a car in which to listen to and enjoy music. That leaves open to debate whether IASCA's standards (and/or the "judges" applying them) are flawed. I have a fundamental problem with sound "quality" being judged by persons who aren't required to have some measure of music experience, whether as a musician, producer, or frequent concert goer. How can someone opine as to whether the saxophone or piano or voice on a particular track sounds natural or "accurate" if they have never heard that instrument or vocalist in a live setting? In my opinion you cannot put someone in a room and teach them how to judge characteristics of music, without exposing them to live music.


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## BigRed (Aug 12, 2007)

Jim, thanks for taking the entire day to judge all the cars. I know it was a long sunday for you. It was good seeing all the peeps from the meets as well as some new faces.

See you guys soon


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

I hope you guys will not give up after this event??
Keep trying and improving guys. No need to be discouraged because you don't agree with someone's opinion about the sound of your car.

Try next judges, next things you can do to improve.
Listen to good reference/Home audio with your materials, then go back to your car to compare, listen to what's missing.
Listen carefully to those cars who won finals (keith, for example). You might not agree right away, but they won constantly for a reason.

Keep an open mind that our cars all sounds the best in OUR opinion. We are used to our cars. Once we step in to someone's car, it is easy to judge and point out what's missing (from our cars). I got this judge long ago that told me my center was on his kneecaps. ROFL

Have a good reference is key here, imo.

Though I was surprised about our brave man Jim  to judge, I gotta give him props for being thrown under the bus! 
In the old days, we have to compete first, get certified, judge INSTALL with assistance of senior judge, then after few shows, we judge SQ with assistance of a senior judge, then we are good to go. Don't take this as an offense, Jim. I'd piss myself if I were you..  Thanks for the effort, it's appreciated.

Don't give up guys, we asked for competitions, there they are...
Be prepared to be judged, have some thick skin, and have fun!

My 2 cents.


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> I agree with you Buzz, that is definitely what the comps. should implement at the very least. No disrespect to Jimmy or Todd but I put in $30 bucks and 8 hours to get a bit more than I would at a So. Cal. meet. I went there with an open mind, didn't ask who's judging or anything but I did have expectations just like everyone else. I would love to see someone outside our general circle come in preferably with a bit of background in music reproduction. I would also like to see more than one judge to cushion the scores on more than one subjective opinion.
> 
> Having been there and done that I can say I got no additional benefit from the competition aspect, but I put in my $30 to try it out and find out for myself. Can't say I would do it again, the general feel I got was that judging could be polar opposite from one event to another and you just have to plow along until you get a medal. Well I wasn't there for the medal, and the whole idea of trying until you get a judge that likes you kinda goes against the whole idea of a formal judging process which is based on shaky ideals to begin with.


George, I think you will find that a lot of people agree with what you just said. Marv and I have talked about this at length, and that is why he is looking to have 3 judges listen to a vehicle when he holds his event. The other thing that would help in my opinion is if scoring categories were weighted so that all scores were not given equal weight. I know that I personally would prefer to listen to a car with great tonal accuracy and balance and OK sounstaging, than one with great soundstaging but OK tonal accuracy and balance.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

dual700 said:


> I hope you guys will not give up after this event??
> Keep trying and improving guys. No need to be discouraged because you don't agree with someone's opinion about the sound of your car.
> 
> Try next judges, next things you can do to improve.
> ...


give up???? who do I look like, BJ Penn?


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

Buzzman said:


> No, that is NOT what I am saying. I am simply posing the question whether IASCA's standards, and the manner in which they are applied, are intended to identify the most enjoyable music listening experience. I have heard cars that have "won" competitions that would not be my first choice for a car in which to listen to and enjoy music. That leaves open to debate whether IASCA's standards (and/or the "judges" applying them) are flawed. I have a fundamental problem with sound "quality" being judged by persons who aren't required to have some measure of music experience, whether as a musician, producer, or frequent concert goer. How can someone opine as to whether the saxophone or piano or voice on a particular track sounds natural or "accurate" if they have never heard that instrument or vocalist in a live setting? In my opinion you cannot put someone in a room and teach them how to judge characteristics of music, without exposing them to live music.


Don, I am 100% agree with you. An sq judge should have the experience with live music performance on top of training.

What IASCA doesn't have here is those live performances for the judges to attend while getting the certifications. The closest one are those cds played in a room. 

A musician can tell what sounds right. But most of the time, they are not aware about staging, they were not the one listening the whole orchestra/band, so they have no idea how we perceive their presence.

I believe Iasca's approach is different. We are supposed to be the ones sitting in the middle of the row, seeing, listening where each of the instruments placed and mimic those in our cars (I am sure we already know that). How an instrument sounds play some point in the overall score sheet. It is a percentage of a whole.

Maybe this guy's car won over ours because he has slightly better staging Or maybe he has iasca membership and stickers and we don't?  
Or maybe our doors rattle and his don't? There are so many variables there that counts..

Oh, I worked for 4 yrs at the LAPHIL myself and I heard enuff audition, totally different with what I hear from a room/car. :laugh:

Anyways, hope to see you guys again at next comp..


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

James Bang said:


> give up???? who do I look like, BJ Penn?


Bahahaha


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

you better watch out for the next comp Eng. Your little tip helped me a lot. I did a bit more tuning today and it's getting better. My EQ still needs a little more work, but i'm not a part of the golden ear mafia. :worried:


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

sorry to see things go like this...but it reminds me of back when i used to go to comps, and it used to be after the comp, at chow or gatherings, all i used to hear was grumblings on how someone was cheated or some judge was a know-nothing...part of the reason i just got away from me.

for me, i was never seriousl into it, a few cars i built did okay, my own car i entered a few times to okay results, and i even co-piloted with someone who did okay. but for me, it was all about the fun, the learning experiences, both in regards to install, and ideas for obtaining sq.

i just hate to see the same kind of notion take hold here, again, when i felt hopeful, that iasca in cali, becuase it was much more relaxed and freindly, would NOT fall into the same issues as before.

i mean, most of us, on this forum, who attended these coupla comps, or who plan to compete in the near future, built car cars seriously for iasca standards...so...why should we be so passionate about hte outcome? if you think your car osund good, and your freinds say it honestly does, and you dont really want to seriously compete, then it should be all good. but if going higher in the iasca ranks is your goal, i think there is a lot of work that needs to be done, in terms of planning, reading, buidling tuning etc, to make your car a more worthy iasca comp car. i mean, there is a reason that certain installers, are known to built great iasca comp cars, while others, who are no less talented as far as installation goes, do not. 

i always felt htat sq-comp installation is actally quite distinct from a normal SQ install...

i guess hwat i am trying to say is, try to take it easy guys...and not get too emotional about this...try to have fun, think of it as a meet with some judging if you will...unless you are very serious about it, then there will be a lot of work to be done in the future 

cheers,

b


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## fredridge (Jan 17, 2007)

give it a couple days...the pain of loss is often hardest right after the game 

I am sure in a couple days we will be talking about the next one


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

i guess when it comes to the santa rosa event, i will be holding out for nothing but last place in class for my own car. 

i have heard quite a few iasca, usac and espeically EMMA, world champion cars that my own expectations of my car, even if i reach its theoritical "best" tuning solution, will still be so far below those cars on their worst days...

but still, i enjoy listening to my car from time to time when i am not working, and will enjoy going to a few comps just to have fun


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

3 judges
3 rounds
30 pts per round.

fighters, you ready?
you ready?

LET'S GET IT ON!!!



James Bang keeps his cool. Say what you will about my setup or whatnot. Just don't assume anything about that I know or don't know 

I just might enter the next one just for the hell of it. That was my reason for this last one...'for the hell of it'.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

one thing I forgot to mention. Luckily, Jose wasn't there to blow us out the water 

a few regulars we missed yesterday.


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Don, I am 100% agree with you. An sq judge should have the experience with live music performance on top of training.
> 
> What IASCA doesn't have here is those live performances for the judges to attend while getting the certifications. The closest one are those cds played in a room.
> 
> ...


Eng, we are on the same page. I just don't think that, for example, absence of noise should be accorded the same weight as tonal balance and accuracy. Then again, this is coming from someone who would rather listen to a scratchy old Charlie Parker LP recorded in Mono than Kenny G recorded in digital perfection.


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## veloze (Jul 2, 2007)

Hey James, take it easy amigo. We're all a pretty tight family here in SoCal. Just feel it...Love is in the air.  hehehe

Sorry I couldn't make it to the competition. But when I got up Sunday morning I started having back spasm, and **** the pain was almost unbearable that I had to stay home.

I hope to see all of you "audionutz" next time!!


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## kevin k. (May 5, 2005)

Missed seeing everybody... last minute mix-up / change of plans.  

When is the next get-together? 

Or comp?


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## rawdawg (Apr 27, 2007)

James is just mad because he found out he was "overhung" which is sort of ironic coming out the mouth of an Asian...

Anyways, his ride sounds way better than it ever did and I liked where it was going right before the ED hit and the horniness subsided.

I was hoping Buzzman would show for the event. I bought Ann Peebles Greatest Hits just for auditioning his whip. I can't stand the rain...


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

dual700 said:


> I hope you guys will not give up after this event??
> Keep trying and improving guys. No need to be discouraged because you don't agree with someone's opinion about the sound of your car.
> 
> Try next judges, next things you can do to improve.
> ...


Give up? I don't see the challenge. It's not about improvement. You'd think the score sheet would give you the input you need to improve. When I look at mine I see a few staging comments that are technically incorrect. 

I listened to Keith's car before. It's very far from what I prefer, safe to say if that's what it takes then there is more reason for me not to check in again. It's funny because he does have very similar music taste with me and James, yet his setup is not geared for it imo. 

All I'm saying is that it was kinda pointless for ME. I look back at the standings and I can't grasp what the correlation is, looks like random distribution to me. Furthermore there are entrants who get ranked in one order in a previous comp. and reversed for another. You can't tell me one bumped 80hz by 2db this one time and scored better.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

I liked hanging out and listening to the other cars. 

I got some input and will at least try to address the issues.


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## atsaubrey (Jan 10, 2007)

Man, sounds like alot of drama.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

James Bang said:


> you better watch out for the next comp Eng. Your little tip helped me a lot. I did a bit more tuning today and it's getting better. My EQ still needs a little more work, but i'm not a part of the golden ear mafia. :worried:


James, sorry brutha.. Your big nipples are gonna tap out to mine BEFORE the cage is closed ! 

From the hand of the mastah fabricator Circa_40!!!


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

veloze said:


> Hey James, take it easy amigo. We're all a pretty tight family here in SoCal. Just feel it...Love is in the air.  hehehe
> 
> Sorry I couldn't make it to the competition. But when I got up Sunday morning I started having back spasm, and **** the pain was almost unbearable that I had to stay home.
> 
> I hope to see all of you "audionutz" next time!!


Yikes! You must have had one hell of a Valentines the night before to get back spasms. :laugh:

I hope you're feeling better.

And Jose, you know me, I'm hardly ever too serious. I just don't need a noobie questioning my reason for competing and assuming I don't know the rules.



atsaubrey said:


> Man, sounds like alot of drama.


Not too much. Our meets are usually one big orgy. Plenty of eargasms.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

atsaubrey said:


> Man, sounds like a lot of drama.


Not really, I think there was more drama at the Riverside meet. It was pretty kick back and Jim definitely had a full plate.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

cvjoint said:


> Give up? I don't see the challenge. It's not about improvement. You'd think the score sheet would give you the input you need to improve. When I look at mine I see a few staging comments that are technically incorrect.
> 
> I listened to Keith's car before. It's very far from what I prefer, safe to say if that's what it takes then there is more reason for me not to check in again. It's funny because he does have very similar music taste with me and James, yet his setup is not geared for it imo.
> 
> All I'm saying is that it was kinda pointless for ME. I look back at the standings and I can't grasp what the correlation is, looks like random distribution to me. Furthermore there are entrants who get ranked in one order in a previous comp. and reversed for another. You can't tell me one bumped 80hz by 2db this one time and scored better.


George, I understand how you feel man, but come on, it's your first comp, you will get a lot of unexpected from the judge(s). We're all been there.

Again, those champs might not sound good to your ears, your taste. However, to the judges, they sound "closer" to that music they've been trained on, IN A ROOM. 
I have no doubt your car sounds like I am in Van Bureen's concert/club, but that's not the point of iasca's judging system..

Get another judge opinion next time? Ask someone who has more experience, maybe when Harry Kimura is judging next time.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

dual700 said:


> James, sorry brutha.. Your big nipples are gonna tap out to mine BEFORE the cage is closed !
> 
> From the hand of the mastah fabricator Circa_40!!!


Vin told me about those on Sunday.

Dang Eng. You've upgraded from huge nipples to full sized BOOBs on your pillars. I'm sure it'll sound very "full" 

Vin sure did a great job on them.


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

dual700 said:


> James, sorry brutha.. Your big nipples are gonna tap out to mine BEFORE the cage is closed !
> 
> From the hand of the mastah fabricator Circa_40!!!



Looking good Boss! SEAS?


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

PureDynamics said:


> Looking good Boss! SEAS?


Hey, that's the rude Dan Pulka guy!  
Seas Perf tweet, dayton rs100 (seas 4.5" booty is way too sexy/big), lotus perf midbass, lotus 10" in center console..
Good to see you, boss.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

kenk said:


> Why all the insults because I questioned you about being a sore loser? I never said anything about having the best system.


First off, I didn't expect to win.

Second, you don't know **** about me and what I know or do not know, so don't go assuming I don't know the rules. 

I was giving my opinion about my experience with the event as I have the freedom to. Also, my reason for competing is of no concern to you, so I'm not sure why you give a ****,... maybe I'm just cute? Beats me. 

Lastly, I'm not sure where the insult was on my last reply. It was an inside joke, which I guess you understood.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Hey, that's the rude Dan Pulka guy!
> Seas Perf tweet, dayton rs100 (seas 4.5" booty is way too sexy/big), lotus perf midbass, lotus 10" in center console..
> Good to see you, boss.


Eng, are you gonna bring the van to next meet? Maybe Linda could start competing with it... if she hasn't already.


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## monkeyboy (Jun 12, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> Give up? I don't see the challenge. It's not about improvement. You'd think the score sheet would give you the input you need to improve. When I look at mine I see a few staging comments that are technically incorrect.
> 
> I listened to Keith's car before. It's very far from what I prefer, safe to say if that's what it takes then there is more reason for me not to check in again. It's funny because he does have very similar music taste with me and James, yet his setup is not geared for it imo.
> 
> All I'm saying is that it was kinda pointless for ME. I look back at the standings and I can't grasp what the correlation is, looks like random distribution to me. Furthermore there are entrants who get ranked in one order in a previous comp. and reversed for another. You can't tell me one bumped 80hz by 2db this one time and scored better.


My notes were messy, I do admit that, but I made an effort to talk to everybody about what I heard after judging. You weren't around your vehicle so I didn't get a chance to talk to you.

As for the results of the comp, I thought it was pretty consistant, the cars that placed high at the previous show, did well this weekend as well.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

monkeyboy said:


> My notes were messy, I do admit that, but I made an effort to talk to everybody about what I heard after judging. You weren't around your vehicle so I didn't get a chance to talk to you.
> 
> As for the results of the comp, I thought it was pretty consistent, the cars that placed high at the previous show, did well this weekend as well.


Yeah,

I'm still trying to decipher your handwriting. :listenup:


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## Vestax (Aug 16, 2005)

Guys (ken and james), take your bickering to PM.


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

i think all this judging needs to be done blindfolded so you dont know what car or speakers you are listening to


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

My PM is my sacred area 

Seriously, though, Judge Jim had a hard first time. Plenty of cars came out that day, and I would say plenty of GREAT sounding cars. Its killer to have to officially judge cars that you somewhat follow in local meets. I personally enjoy most of the cars I demo at our meets and would hate to have to judge any of them as most of them are almost perfected to their own liking.


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

BeatsDownLow said:


> i think all this judging needs to be done blindfolded so you dont know what car or speakers you are listening to


Not a bad idea, actually, because while contestants expect (hope?) that a judge will be objective and fair, the reality is that there are definitely biases in favor of or against certain brands, many of which have been developed solely on reading commentary on this and other sites, and not on first hand experience, that can come into play. And, if the judge has heard a particular car before, again, we don't know how neutral he/she can be at the latest event. But, I can't get over the sight of the judge being escorted to a car and into his seat blindfolded, and having someone serve as the DJ from the passenger seat. :laugh:


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

Buzzman said:


> Not a bad idea, actually, because while contestants expect (hope?) that a judge will be objective and fair, the reality is that there are definitely biases in favor of or against certain brands, many of which have been developed solely on reading commentary on this and other sites, and not on first hand experience, that can come into play. And, if the judge has heard a particular car before, again, we don't know how neutral he/she can be at the latest event. But, I can't get over the sight of the judge being escorted to a car and into his seat blindfolded, and having someone serve as the DJ from the passenger seat. :laugh:


Ya i think this is the only true way of judging a car based on the install, and not to be swayed by what car won last or who they are sponsored by. I mean a new judge will probably look at the last comp see who scored what, and might think I need to score these things the same way so the results dont change much, then they will think I am doing a good job. I am just speculating on that last part there. But I think its a definet possibility. 

I was actuall talking to [email protected] about this blindfolded thing, I said it to him and he said he has always felt that way.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

dual700 said:


> George, I understand how you feel man, but come on, it's your first comp, you will get a lot of unexpected from the judge(s). We're all been there.
> 
> Again, those champs might not sound good to your ears, your taste. However, to the judges, they sound "closer" to that music they've been trained on, IN A ROOM.
> I have no doubt your car sounds like I am in Van Bureen's concert/club, but that's not the point of iasca's judging system..
> ...


Well, it shouldn't be different right? If the goals are clear and the judging is dependable the same result should ensue otherwise the whole scientific aspect gets thrown out the window. All that remains is pleasing the taste of the judge, and when there is only one it gets very hot. The blind fold idea I've been advocating for some time but don't expect to ever play out.

Then the interest of the comp. needs to align with your taste, which at this point I can guarantee they are polar opposite. If I can deduct anything at all there seems to be an emphasis on dinky drivers mounted on the dash. While that may be satisfying in a non moving vehicle when adequate output is not needed to me it always results in loss of depth and realism as the mid is mounted to close to get any depth cues, point sourcing or transparency, unusually high enclosure Q due to restricted airspace, inferior drivers being used like dome midrange (ATC the only one excluded) as well as compression when trying to simply beat road noise. I've moved from dash mounted gear a long time ago. 

The only time a system like the one above will sound like home theatre is in a broom closet. Almost all of us have a home stereo setup, we don't live in cars, we just commute in them. Playing the same disc at home and on the go is fairly common for all of us the only advantage between our training is if we were actually involved in the music reproduction like Chad or Buzz. 



monkeyboy said:


> My notes were messy, I do admit that, but I made an effort to talk to everybody about what I heard after judging. You weren't around your vehicle so I didn't get a chance to talk to you.
> 
> As for the results of the comp, I thought it was pretty consistant, the cars that placed high at the previous show, did well this weekend as well.


I was mostly intrigued by the goals set. For one, a stage centered at the steering wheel, and a width from pillar to pillar is utopia in car audio. By that token I don't see how to improve since those were stated impressions. The only real credit I can give is that the stage can move depending on the driver position with kicks which it's always a trade-off even with dash drivers if you move your head, which you should do when you drive. The only time these physical restrictions can be bypassed is in a van with a center seat and extended seat rails and steering column to achieve the correct azimuth and reverb. Either way center dash focusing is only desired in a two seater car and nobody at the meet tuned for it from what I demoed, nor do I understand why that would be required. 

I was knocked down for the Alpine head fan turning on and the bass being too loud, which are desired properties in a moving car. As soon as the engine is on the fan is inaudible yet keeps my setup working in 120degree heat in the desert in Cali, and the slightly bumped lower frequency ameliorates the road noise condition. Again it's geared for actual driving.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

*Well, it shouldn't be different right? If the goals are clear and the judging is dependable the same result should ensue otherwise the whole scientific aspect gets thrown out the window. All that remains is pleasing the taste of the judge, and when there is only one it gets very hot. The blind fold idea I've been advocating for some time but don't expect to ever play out.*

You can say that, pleasing that particular judge's taste and I do agree with multiple judging scoring system.
Blind folding is an idea, but how the heck can they write your score with blind folded?

*Then the interest of the comp. needs to align with your taste, which at this point I can guarantee they are polar opposite. If I can deduct anything at all there seems to be an emphasis on dinky drivers mounted on the dash. While that may be satisfying in a non moving vehicle when adequate output is not needed to me it always results in loss of depth and realism as the mid is mounted to close to get any depth cues, point sourcing or transparency, unusually high enclosure Q due to restricted airspace, inferior drivers being used like dome midrange (ATC the only one excluded) as well as compression when trying to simply beat road noise. I've moved from dash mounted gear a long time ago. 


The only time a system like the one above will sound like home theatre is in a broom closet. Almost all of us have a home stereo setup, we don't live in cars, we just commute in them. Playing the same disc at home and on the go is fairly common for all of us the only advantage between our training is if we were actually involved in the music reproduction like Chad or Buzz. *

It's all about compromise. Cars are not the ideal environment for musical reproduction, hence our ability to install, tune our cars to mimic our own reference that dictates who should win. If one has a good reference at home, nothing high end, something decent at home, one can jump in at home and his car back and forth and notice the difference. Our ability to tailor our car to sound close to our reference is the one being judged against others.



*I was mostly intrigued by the goals set. For one, a stage centered at the steering wheel, and a width from pillar to pillar is utopia in car audio. By that token I don't see how to improve since those were stated impressions. The only real credit I can give is that the stage can move depending on the driver position with kicks which it's always a trade-off even with dash drivers if you move your head, which you should do when you drive. The only time these physical restrictions can be bypassed is in a van with a center seat and extended seat rails and steering column to achieve the correct azimuth and reverb. Either way center dash focusing is only desired in a two seater car and nobody at the meet tuned for it from what I demoed, nor do I understand why that would be required. *

The goal of iasca is to exceed the physical limitation of our cars. Iasca wants that somehow our width and depth exceeds our a pillars and windshield while maintaining good tonality and overall staging. That's what we (should) improve upon.
To tell you the truth, I competed at 2001 USAC with center staging on my steering wheel and argued the crap outta it with the judges. They told me center should be in the center of the dash and I argued about the idea to mimic an orchestra while you sit in the middle and everything is in FRONT of you, not to your RIGHT, ha!

*I was knocked down for the Alpine head fan turning on and the bass being too loud, which are desired properties in a moving car. As soon as the engine is on the fan is inaudible yet keeps my setup working in 120degree heat in the desert in Cali, and the slightly bumped lower frequency ameliorates the road noise condition. Again it's geared for actual driving.*
Dude, I got knocked down for not having alarm at USAC 2001 - 2003 What do you want, man?  

Anyhow, I am not trying to argue with you, but I wanna give you my input on this competition ordeal.


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

For those talking about blind folding a judge, if you have to do that to put everyone on the same level, then you have the wrong judge.

We all know the car is judged sitting still, so why not tune for that? Sure you may like it better another way for driving, but thats why they made presets. Also Center is not center over the steering wheel, its center of the dash. Stage goes from pillar to pillar or beyond. We won't go into stage depth, ambience, and linearity. I'm not sure where most of you guys where in classes, but rookie has alot less things that are judged. For others, be thankful that you only have driver seat judging. Some cars I got to listen to are REALLY bad from the other seat.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I think IASCA has been going on long enough to have their rules set in stone. I don't think any new recommendation will fly. If there are any changes, past competitors will then dispute or appeal their loses due to new rules. The only way around it that I can see, is to start a new SQ association.


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## whatzzap (Jun 16, 2006)

But do you think by changing the rules that will satisfied people? To me when we enter Iasca competition, then we follow Iasca rules or their standard. How are we supposed to win if we want the judge to follow our own standard and criteria, its like working for a company but we want to set our own rules. Yes we might disagree with some of the rules or some of the people in that company, but does it mean that company is a terrible company to work with or has a faulty rules? 

Some of you might not like keith's car, and think he knows nothing about sound quality, but that dude not only won 1 time, for god sake he won world champion, which i believe has a different judge and maybe more senior compare to Jim. To me its a matter of taste. I went to CES last year and listen to DLS lime bettle, even tho that car won several throphy to me thats car its just not my taste. But does it mean that its a bad car or whoever judge the car know nothing about sound quality. Of course not, its just not suit my taste.

Oh well thats my 2 cents, so dont flame me, I am still a noobs


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## veloze (Jul 2, 2007)

I'm also a proponent of blind judging, and I think this has already been discussed in the past. What IASCA or another sanctioned body needs to do is to contact the Institute for the Blind and identify those people who can play a musical instruments or are involved in music.

Having said that, a blind person has the ability to train their hearing to a higher levels than a normal person could. By doing that, there's no way that is going to be any bias when it comes where the speakers are located or what kind of brand of equipment the vehicle has, etc, etc. 

Eng mentioned how a blind person will keep score? - the solution I see is to have another judge or an assistance to help the blind to go to through the whole evaluation process & to document the scores. I know it will be time consuming, but is the only alternative I see. Does this make sense?


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I would laugh if a blind judge sat in the same car twice and give two totally different scores.

Hell, that judge might think those 'two' cars smell different, too.


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## veloze (Jul 2, 2007)

James Bang said:


> I would laugh if a blind judge sat in the same car twice and give two totally different scores.
> 
> Hell, that judge might think those 'two' cars smell different, too.


A blind person would not give a **** if the car is a Porsche or a pos Yugo, but you are right if you wanna get extra brownie points make sure your car smells like a flower shop.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

It is comforting to see that even though I have not competed since 1991, the arguments and recommendations for judging are still the same. None of you know who I am, that's fine, but there were a few local shows I judged back then, with industry pros and musicians and installers and the general concensus was pretty much the same. 

Look, depending on what time of year it is, the cars get hot, we get tired and yes the better sounding cars to stick out!! I think it is actually disadvantageous for the 'well known' cars out there. The judges expectations increase multifold! I have heard several cars that went on to national championships and frankly some of them I have no idea how they did it! Of course, this was 18 years ago, but some things have the tendency of staying the same.

Hopefully, SOME day I will be able to make it to one of these events. Unfotunately, I have too many responsibilities and not enough time to be competition ready. Never the less, I think it would be a kick in the pants to check one out again.

Finally, my personal record for number of cars judged would be about 40-43 cars, different classes. I could tell you who my partner was, but most probably will not know him. 

Thanks for reading and allowing my to express my ramblings.
Flame away.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

PureDynamics said:


> For those talking about blind folding a judge, if you have to do that to put everyone on the same level, then you have the wrong judge.
> 
> We all know the car is judged sitting still, so why not tune for that? Sure you may like it better another way for driving, but thats why they made presets. Also Center is not center over the steering wheel, its center of the dash. Stage goes from pillar to pillar or beyond. We won't go into stage depth, ambience, and linearity. I'm not sure where most of you guys where in classes, but rookie has alot less things that are judged. For others, be thankful that you only have driver seat judging. Some cars I got to listen to are REALLY bad from the other seat.


So when you watch a movie you generally sit on the left of the center channel? When you go to Imax u sit by the door? If you want center dash centering than you don't really recognize that you are sitting on the left. All time alignment should have no variation from left to right, it should simply delay tweeters relative to midrange etc. The biggest benefit from time alignment is that you can delay speakers on the left which are much closer to you! If the ms. delay from your left midrange is different from the one on the right than guess what? You are tunning for steering wheel centering. It's either that or your install is bizarrely asymmetrical like one mid is on the dash and the other is in the kicks. 

Moving car vs. stationary is more than just a preset, it's about 70db+ of road noise that is imperfectly spread over the frequency response, larger listening duration, bigger variation in temperatures and a continuous power demand from the alternator. I would like to see a preset that downsizes speaker size and voice coils, a change from 5way to 3 way, and variable speaker location.


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## guitarsail (Oct 12, 2007)

I prefer my method of judge influencing..they open my door, see a half finished install, lots of bare MDF, think this'll take two seconds and Im done, they turn it on and go holy S#$% that was beyond expetations....overheard judges words...not mind


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## PureDynamics (Nov 3, 2007)

cvjoint said:


> So when you watch a movie you generally sit on the left of the center channel? When you go to Imax u sit by the door? If you want center dash centering than you don't really recognize that you are sitting on the left. All time alignment should have no variation from left to right, it should simply delay tweeters relative to midrange etc. The biggest benefit from time alignment is that you can delay speakers on the left which are much closer to you! If the ms. delay from your left midrange is different from the one on the right than guess what? You are tunning for steering wheel centering. It's either that or your install is bizarrely asymmetrical like one mid is on the dash and the other is in the kicks.
> 
> Moving car vs. stationary is more than just a preset, it's about 70db+ of road noise that is imperfectly spread over the frequency response, larger listening duration, bigger variation in temperatures and a continuous power demand from the alternator. I would like to see a preset that downsizes speaker size and voice coils, a change from 5way to 3 way, and variable speaker location.


George your missing my point.. I did not say I like "Center" in the middle of the dash vs over the steering wheel. I was stating that in IASCA. "Center" is stated to be center of the dash. Everyone is scored on the rule book to make it fair for one person to another. 

Moving vs stationary cars, yes sure you have road, engine, wind noise. What does that have to do with being judged sitting still? Thats what the rule book states. I see it much harder (and unsafe) to tune for "in motion", but what do I care, the judge is not taking the car for a spin. Why would you need to downsize speaker size, voice coils, etc. if I'm just sitting still? You really think its going to make a difference?


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

I suggest we get a poor person to judge; that way he won't refuse a bribe when offered. 

As George has so eloquently stated Cars are not stationery and tuning for road noise is a necessity, but IASCA has a set criteria for judging purposes.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

bribing does not always work! I tried it at a no name middle of nowhere show....I guess they didnt like In-n-Out!!!


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

PureDynamics said:


> George your missing my point.. I did not say I like "Center" in the middle of the dash vs over the steering wheel. I was stating that in IASCA. "Center" is stated to be center of the dash. Everyone is scored on the rule book to make it fair for one person to another.
> 
> Moving vs stationary cars, yes sure you have road, engine, wind noise. What does that have to do with being judged sitting still? Thats what the rule book states. I see it much harder (and unsafe) to tune for "in motion", but what do I care, the judge is not taking the car for a spin. Why would you need to downsize speaker size, voice coils, etc. if I'm just sitting still? You really think its going to make a difference?


I was under the impression that we are getting judged for a single seat. If that is true than someone at Iasca is incorrect in specifying center stage as middle of the dash. That's what I meant by technically incorrect. It is incongruent with the goals of the competition and any non TA'd setup has just as good of a chance to please, I would be accurate but biased, while a basic non tuned setup is less accurate but unbiased.

Sure it will make a difference, it is precisely the reason why I don't need 15 inch subwoofers in my headphones. Without the need to overcome low frequency road noise I can specify smaller drivers and place them such as to achieve better soundstaging. Smaller mids can be mounted wider apart, farther in kicks or even in the dash. Similarly I can place drivers closer to each other and achieve a better point source. Without the need to play for more than 15minutes I can specify smaller coils to achieve a lower inductance. Power need not be plenty and a battery will do it, a thicker cone will decrease resonance while the lost sensitivity is not that big of an issue. Single power runs will do, which will make it easier to get a good install score. Lastly a smaller driver can now reproduce larger bandwidth while keeping low distortion and timber accuracy.


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## SoCalSQ (Oct 7, 2008)

IASCA has a set of rules.

These rules are set up to try and make judging SQ as OBJECTIVE as possible.

These rules are put together by many many people who constantly discuss and modify them in order to try to achieve fairness woth the goal being reproducing music as it was recorded.

If you want to win at IASCA events you learn the rules, go to a judge training, hit up live performances, talk to people who understand how to achieve your goal.

A system that will win at an IASCA show MIGHT NOT SOUND THE WAY YOU LIKE IT, but it may.

I love the way my car sounds right now and I probably wouldn't have won.

To most audiophiles tonality is much more important than imaging, but on an IASCA scoresheet you have to see where the points are given out to decide what to "give and take"

As much as IASCA tries to make judging objective, there will always be a subjective component. Every person hears differently and has different preferences.

I go to these shows to meet new people, hang out with old friends, listen to as many cars as i can, get feedback on my car, and to learn from others.

I do not go to these shows to:

#1 win
#2 be a drama queen
#3 stir up ****
#4 tell people that the way I feel is the way it is

So, since opinions are like ass holes , lets try to realize that we all have our own and get the hell over it.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

slvrtsunami said:


> Bribing does not always work! I tried it at a no name middle of nowhere show....I guess they didn't like In-n-Out!!!


That's funny. :laugh:


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

slvrtsunami said:


> bribing does not always work! I tried it at a no name middle of nowhere show...*.I guess they didnt like In-n-Out!!!*


speaking of that. I'd like to thank Tom, I believe that's his name, the owner of Beach Auto Sound, for his generous gift of an In-n-Out gift card to everyone. That was extremely nice of him.

I thought he was just passing out his business card.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

SoCalSQ said:


> IASCA has a set of rules.
> 
> These rules are set up to try and make judging SQ as OBJECTIVE as possible.
> 
> ...


 
Thanks, you saved me a lot more typing. I couldn't agree more.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

James Bang said:


> speaking of that. I'd like to thank Tom, I believe that's his name, the owner of Beach Auto Sound, for his generous gift of an In-n-Out gift card to everyone. That was extremely nice of him.
> 
> I thought he was just passing out his business card.


 

Damn, I KNEW I should have gone


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

James Bang said:


> speaking of that. I'd like to thank Tom, I believe that's his name, the owner of Beach Auto Sound, for his generous gift of an In-n-Out gift card to everyone. That was extremely nice of him.
> 
> I thought he was just passing out his business card.


Hey,
I didn't get one! :bigcry:


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)

hey guys, rules are rules - what are you going to do :shrug: . This was the same back when I was into this sort of stuff in the early 2000s, its probably the same since the dawn of car audio competitions.


Honestly, I feel that we are fortunate to even have iasca to have in socal.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I personally won't let IASCA's criteria change the way I tune my setup. It'll always be tuned for me. But I guess this is where digital processing can become very handy as you can save different presets. It'll be a problem for those with analog processing though. 

Another thing is that when it comes to judging, it'll be best to have a judge that is the same size and height as the owner of the car, or some cases, the person who tuned the car. to add to it, how you sit in a car makes a huge difference on how it will sound. IME


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

michaelsil1 said:


> Hey,
> I didn't get one! :bigcry:


you were AT in-n-out at the time.


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## circa40 (Jan 20, 2008)

michaelsil1 said:


> Hey,
> I didn't get one! :bigcry:


Damnit Mike


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

circa40 said:


> hey guys, rules are rules - what are you going to do :shrug: . This was the same back when I was into this sort of stuff in the early 2000s, its probably the same since the dawn of car audio competitions.
> 
> 
> Honestly, I feel that we are fortunate to even have iasca to have in socal.


X2 arty2:


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## AndyInOC (Jul 22, 2008)

so when is the next meet or comp?


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

AndyInOC said:


> so when is the next meet or comp?


March 7th 2009 - Audio Shoppe Last Chance Show (Last chance for west coast to qualify for finals)
Audio Shoppe
6760 Central Ave, Ste A
Riverside, CA 92504
(951) 787-0550
Formats: SQi, SQc, and IDbL
Entry Fee: $30, $50 for 2 formats, and $65 for 3 formats


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## beerdrnkr (Apr 18, 2007)

SoCalSQ said:


> IASCA has a set of rules.
> 
> These rules are set up to try and make judging SQ as OBJECTIVE as possible.
> 
> ...


Agreed!


James Bang said:


> speaking of that. I'd like to thank Tom, I believe that's his name, the owner of Beach Auto Sound, for his generous gift of an In-n-Out gift card to everyone. That was extremely nice of him.
> 
> I thought he was just passing out his business card.


Agreed!

On another note, I installed my 8's today in the doors and damn it's sounding good. Even sounds decent on the IASCA drum track. Sure was a pain to do though.


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## AndyInOC (Jul 22, 2008)

michaelsil1 said:


> March 7th 2009 - Audio Shoppe Last Chance Show (Last chance for west coast to qualify for finals)
> Audio Shoppe
> 6760 Central Ave, Ste A
> Riverside, CA 92504
> ...


thank you sir, appreciate the info


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

It sucks being self-employed when things arent going too well, the economy, I am going to miss that one as well, Riverside. What a shame.


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## sr20det510 (May 20, 2007)

beerdrnkr said:


> Agreed!
> 
> 
> Agreed!
> ...



Congrats! 
Car was sounding good with just the 4" mids!


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

I can't help but think some folks got a bit offended, we addressed the structure of the comp in general. But this is a public forum, it is mostly filled with opinions - nature of the beast.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

cvjoint said:


> I can't help but think some folks got a bit offended, we addressed the structure of the comp in general. But this is a public forum, it is mostly filled with opinions - nature of the beast.


George, the reason you lost was simple actually....














You don't have magnesium drivers!!!


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

beerdrnkr said:


> On another note, I installed my 8's today in the doors and damn it's sounding good. Even sounds decent on the IASCA drum track. Sure was a pain to do though.


Nicccceeee!!!Coming to next comp?


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

dual700 said:


> George, the reason you lost was simple actually....
> 
> You don't have magnesium drivers!!!


Ha ha bastard, you and your detailed midrange.


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

veloze said:


> I'm also a proponent of blind judging, and I think this has already been discussed in the past. What IASCA or another sanctioned body needs to do is to contact the Institute for the Blind and identify those people who can play a musical instruments or are involved in music.
> 
> Having said that, a blind person has the ability to train their hearing to a higher levels than a normal person could. By doing that, there's no way that is going to be any bias when it comes where the speakers are located or what kind of brand of equipment the vehicle has, etc, etc.
> 
> Eng mentioned how a blind person will keep score? - the solution I see is to have another judge or an assistance to help the blind to go to through the whole evaluation process & to document the scores. I know it will be time consuming, but is the only alternative I see. Does this make sense?


Jose, you are killing me man. :laugh: We aren't talking about having Stevie Wonder judge. :laugh: Blind in this case, is the judge not knowing what equipment he is listening to, whose car he is sitting in, etc. I love you man, and I just can't stop laughing. :laugh::laugh:


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## Buzzman (Jul 26, 2007)

SoCalSQ said:


> IASCA has a set of rules.
> 
> These rules are set up to try and make judging SQ as OBJECTIVE as possible.
> 
> ...


That is precisely what many (including myself) have said. Unless the subjectivity involved in applying supposedly objective standards is eliminated, the system is flawed. Speaking for myself, I understand that the organization has a set of rules in place that have been around for eons. However, that does not mean the merits of the rules or standards are correct, or not subject to challenge.


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## beerdrnkr (Apr 18, 2007)

sr20det510 said:


> Congrats!
> Car was sounding good with just the 4" mids!


Thanks, it feels good finally to have a little bit of bass 


dual700 said:


> Nicccceeee!!!Coming to next comp?


Yeah, I think I will. I hope to finish my install pretty soon but adding the 3sixty.2 is going to have me starting all over on the tuning :mean:


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## veloze (Jul 2, 2007)

Buzzman said:


> Jose, you are killing me man. :laugh: We aren't talking about having Stevie Wonder judge. :laugh: Blind in this case, is the judge not knowing what equipment he is listening to, whose car he is sitting in, etc. I love you man, and I just can't stop laughing. :laugh::laugh:


Yeah Buzz, :laugh: I had to put some humor because of all the drama going on. It's funny that I wrote Stevie Wonder's name then I deleted out of respect for the guy. 

Probably the blind thing is not such good idea to be implemented for now, but like they said *"The blind leading the blind"* does not make any sense. I love you too man!!


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## schuey_1 (Nov 11, 2007)

To much DRAMA going on here.Back when we don't have a show in SoCal people are complaining now that we have shows people are still complaining.I bet the one that keep on complaining are the 2nd or 3rd palce bwahahahahahaha.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

schuey_1 said:


> To much DRAMA going on here.Back when we don't have a show in SoCal people are complaining now that we have shows people are still complaining.I bet the one that keep on complaining are the 2nd or 3rd palce bwahahahahahaha.


Hey hey hey!
I got 2nd!  :laugh: :laugh:


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

Buzzman said:


> Jose, you are killing me man. :laugh: We aren't talking about having Stevie Wonder judge. :laugh: Blind in this case, is the judge not knowing what equipment he is listening to, whose car he is sitting in, etc. I love you man, and I just can't stop laughing. :laugh::laugh:


Jose's judge says:
I just called.. to say.. your car sux0r
And I mean it from the bottom of my heart.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

I don't see much of complaining, but people's thoughts about their experience or how they feel things should be changed after their experience. I don't see anything wrong with that. It's their opinion and just that, an opinion, nothing to take too seriously. 

Even if I wouldn't compete, I will still try to make these events. Plenty of cool people to hang around with while supporting the scene.


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## James Bang (Jul 25, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Hey hey hey!
> I got 2nd!  :laugh: :laugh:


stop complaining sore loser..  :surprised:


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Jose's judge says:
> I just called.. to say.. your car sux0r
> And I mean it from the bottom of my heart.












I never said that.


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

I'm okay with the results. :deal2:


I got some good input and I'm addressing the issues. :smug:


Hopefully at the next meet my scores will improve. :chinese:


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## veloze (Jul 2, 2007)

Damn, give it a rest you guys. Stop the bitching...there's going to be plenty of ass wooping the next competition, specially you Senor Eng. Hehehe


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

veloze said:


> Damn, give it a rest you guys. Stop the bitching...there's going to be plenty of ass whooping at the next competition, especially you Senor Eng. Hehehe


I don't know, Senior Eng sounded really good.


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## veloze (Jul 2, 2007)

michaelsil1 said:


> I don't know, Senior Eng sounded really good.


Yo Mike, you wanna bet me? :crown:


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

veloze said:


> Yo Mike, you wanna bet me? :crown:


I could afford to bet a Taco.


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

veloze said:


> Yo Mike, you wanna bet me? :crown:


    Looks like someone found a secret weapon?
How about lunch?


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## michaelsil1 (May 24, 2007)

dual700 said:


> Looks like someone found a secret weapon?
> How about lunch?


He was the reigning SQC Champ. :toff:


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## dual700 (Mar 6, 2005)

michaelsil1 said:


> He was the reigning SQC Champ. :toff:


I know, I gotta ask Leon to tune mine too, then..  
j/k


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

Gentlemen, even though I agree and disgree with the opinions expressed, I would just like to remind all that its the experience that counts. I personally use competitions to better myself at whatever it is i compete in!!! I have lost WAY more than one, but that does not discourage me. Actually makes me work harder! 

I hope all of you will get as much knowledge and experience as I did when I started competing. Of course, back then it was a whole different learning curve. some will understand others won't.

I will try hard to make it to Riverside, although it is not looking to be possible.

Thanks for your time.


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