# Help with battery



## boom_squid_2 (Jan 29, 2008)

I have an optima d34 yellow top battery. I use the battery to power my spl system and as a daily battery in my van.


I compete in iasca rookie class for spl shows which come around once ever 2months or so.


Recently I found my battery giving me low reading and I wanted to know, to the guys with the d34's. whats your rest voltage on the batts?

Right now mine is at 12.3v.


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## 8675309 (Jan 8, 2007)

Take it back to the place you got it and get a replacement


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## boom_squid_2 (Jan 29, 2008)

Sry man I wish I could but in my country we dont get that warranty.


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

Sell it and buy a new one . . . mebbe


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## tann808 (May 19, 2009)

Try a slow trickle charge for a slower and steady charge and see what it rest at after that.


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## rexxxlo (Apr 14, 2009)

those battery's die for odd reasons i have had 2 relatively new batts go completely dead in a matter of a few weeks from what i have heard they have stuff that falls to the bottom of the battery and shorts out the cells


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## Stryker27 (Jul 10, 2009)

my yellow top rests at 12.4, Thought this was normal. stays there for a long time too.


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## Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX (Oct 24, 2007)

A battery isn't going to give you much more than 12.5v or so... It's not designed to... ? 

This is why most cars are regulated to 14.5v or so... it's the only way to charge a 12v DC battery.. you need just over the actual voltage to start the charging process.. 

If you are talking about voltage while running, well, you should see at least 14v at the battery at idle.. if you don't you likely have alt issues.. 

Optima is rather well known anymore for failures... it's old technology anymore... at least 10yrs old, if not more now..


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## rexxxlo (Apr 14, 2009)

Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX said:


> This is why most cars are regulated to 14.5v or so... it's the only way to charge a 12v DC battery.. you need just over the actual voltage to start the charging process..
> 
> .


isnt it 2.1 volts over rest to achieve a good charge?

i know that the "ctek" charger reconditions a battery at over 15 volts


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## Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX (Oct 24, 2007)

rexxxlo said:


> isnt it 2.1 volts over rest to achieve a good charge?
> 
> i know that the "ctek" charger reconditions a battery at over 15 volts


That sounds about right, i'm not an expert, I just know a few things... 

The over 15v thing sounds about right, I don't know the chemistry behind it exactly, but it's likely got to do that to "burn off" oxides or something from the plates to make the battery charge again..


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## my6x9s (Apr 15, 2009)

just for some clarification gel batterys dislike large amperage going into them they like it a slow trickle so when you have the big 3 with gels they get bitchy and the dielectric brakes down in the gel .. if you want large amperage and want to abuse the heck out of it get a true deep cycle wet cell.. like a t105 6v or the L16 6v they are almost bullet proof.. and with some of the new amps taking 18+volts you can go 6+6+6=18vdc i love the t105 but they are messy like all wet cells and if they get a tad weak you can have the local battey shop replace the acid levels and they are fresh again. i run 6 gels in my system and they cant do what the 4-105s did 
my gels 4 are inside the cab and 1 is tipped on its side under the hood so i cant do that with a 105 just food for thoughts for ya


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

The big 3 is not gonna make the difference in charge rate enough to alter the life of the battery.


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## my6x9s (Apr 15, 2009)

well chad im really not here to argue. i feel that it is true ill use my nissan truck as a example stock alt is about 60-65 amps after market from dc gen is just shy of 200amps lets use 160 to 165 for easy math.. ok lets say again for easy math say that stock your engine and running gear uses say 50 amps that leaves a surplus of 10-15 amps for accessory when you charge a optima with lil amps in no prob but when you go back to aftermarket you will get 110 to 115amps in making the assumpsion you are not using your "system" also have to assume the voltage reg tells it to charge that fast (saying low battery)
i think even a charge rate that big would harm a wet cell but you can test this theory by placing your battery on a charger on the start mode most will supply more that 50amps .. tell me if it doesn't boil out your battery. 
i think i will diss agree to your thoughts that huge amps in fast will not harm a battery..
the bi-product is heat .. and we know if you heat a battery it will not last as long.
i don't really know what make you think that it will not harm a battery but im game please inform me how you think it will not do damage running high current to a gel .. much less a wet cell system ..

edit:
if you run a multi-battery that would play out a lil different though like mine 110amps divided by 6 gel battery's comes out to about 18.33 amps per battery still nice and slow charging for the most part but a single battery at 110 amps is going to feel the effects


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## B4SSB0Y (Aug 25, 2009)

You have to also figure most guys running high amperage alts, multi-batt systems and some multi alt. all tend to have systems that draw well more than 110 amps, therefore batteries are just there for when the alternator cant keep up. I know this isnt the case for all but I know that is the standpoint quite a few of us have of this. Also I'm on my 3rd RedTop batt, my issue was a bit diff though. My rest voltage is around 12.4 ircc, if I remember I'll check it tomorrow.


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## savagebee (Sep 12, 2006)

Im runing 2 irragi large case alts on my caprice
one 180, one is 220
I am hardly ever playing my system loud enough to even need a rapid charge, and when I do I never drop below 14 volts
this is on an autozone diehard thats 3 or more years old.

no issues whatsoever

I would think an optima gel batt would be better suited to handle this kind of abuse than my cheapie battery does


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## Austin (Mar 12, 2009)

my6x9s said:


> well chad im really not here to argue. i feel that it is true ill use my nissan truck as a example stock alt is about 60-65 amps after market from dc gen is just shy of 200amps lets use 160 to 165 for easy math.. ok lets say again for easy math say that stock your engine and running gear uses say 50 amps that leaves a surplus of 10-15 amps for accessory when you charge a optima with lil amps in no prob but when you go back to aftermarket you will get 110 to 115amps in making the assumpsion you are not using your "system" also have to assume the voltage reg tells it to charge that fast (saying low battery)
> i think even a charge rate that big would harm a wet cell but you can test this theory by placing your battery on a charger on the start mode most will supply more that 50amps .. tell me if it doesn't boil out your battery.
> i think i will diss agree to your thoughts that huge amps in fast will not harm a battery..
> the bi-product is heat .. and we know if you heat a battery it will not last as long.
> ...



chad was saying putting bigger wire from the alt to battery wont make the battery charge any faster than it previously did. he said nothing about high amp alts or how fast the batteries were charging.


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## my6x9s (Apr 15, 2009)

well like i said before im really not here to argue with you all and im glad that you all came to the defense of chad


Austin said:


> chad was saying putting bigger wire from the alt to battery wont make the battery charge any faster than it previously did. he said nothing about high amp alts or how fast the batteries were charging.


 that was not chads statement by the way this was "The big 3 is not gonna make the difference in charge rate enough to alter the life of the battery" i figure with a post count that high he must be a moderator or something on here.
this is my opinion of the gels and im sure i share this opinion with others as well. 
they really dis-like large current input.. call any shop that is a battery distributor(not your local wal-mart) ones with real working knowledge of a battery here is a local shop if you want to call them (509) 484-5114 yes i stand behind my "gel vs wet cell" statement gels are bitchy when large amp-input to them .. wet cells are just better for the abuse but have a higher internal resistance than a gel . but when you run multi-battery the resistance is lowered anyways 
i want to thank you all for your time to read this and perhaps it will be food for thought for the person that wants to run one gel and try to abuse the life out of it.
this all seems really common cents to me but look into it.
whats the worse thing that can happen. you will gain some knowledge that proved or dis-proves my point. knowledge is power that no one can take from you once you have it. i will leave on a happy note today i run 6-gel and i have no problems with my system nor charging system.
this was all for food for thought. good luck on your research projects


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

1. Yes I'm a mod, I had a large post count well before I was a mod, I have a large post count because I enjoy interaction with forum members. My daily posting was actually higher BEFORE I became a mod, that should come as no surprise.

2. Shift key... use it, you have a comma key too, that helps also. Or use shift and period a whole bunch.

Now that this is out in the open, lets look at the difference in charge rate to a battery between a stock 8Ga wire and one upgraded to 4 Ga. I said that it' NOT ENOUGH TO ALTER THE LIFESPAN OF THE BATTERY. Think about losses over that short of a run between the 2 diameters of wire.

3. It's common sense, not common cents.


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## my6x9s (Apr 15, 2009)

ok the spelling police was here and lucky for me i got off with a warning this time. 
let that be a lesson for all you bad spellers.( i got really lucky this time ) next time im looking at 60day. ...... damn i hope they don't see that mis-use of periods 
ok with all joking aside. (please dont take it personal im kidding around)
still really does not get much in to the 8awg(24amps) vs 4awg(60amps) i seen no mention of that in your post. i really don't care about that part much. 
here is the awg chart i found American Wire Gauge table and AWG Electrical Current Load Limits with skin depth frequencies
would you like to engage the topic of wet vs gel. 

i would indeed like to know your .02 cents on the topic. 
thought stock wire was 4awg? but i got a nissan maybe built to last i up grades it to some scrap 1/0 i had. besides the run is only about 3'-4' to the battery and the motor to frame seem to make a difference on the stock alt by the way.(i would say this was the biggest difference i noticed right a way)
again this is discussion not a argument. im open to ideas that may dis-prove my point of view. on the wet vs gel. 
"besides chad with all that time logged in here im sure i will be asking you a few questions that are way outside my realm in the audio areas." it always good to have another friend in life with knowledge. ps your right sense makes more cents to use.


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## unpredictableacts (Aug 16, 2006)

chad said:


> 1. Yes I'm a mod, I had a large post count well before I was a mod, I have a large post count because I enjoy interaction with forum members. My daily posting was actually higher BEFORE I became a mod, that should come as no surprise.
> 
> 2. Shift key... use it, you have a comma key too, that helps also. Or use shift and period a whole bunch.
> 
> ...


PBR!!!=PWNED BY RICE


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Well lets say that the stock wiring is indeed 4Ga, which is pretty damn beefy, I think out F350 7.3L diesel MAY have a 4Ga alternator wire but it may be more like 6 Ga. Anyway you have a 4 Ga wire that has a resistance of .24 ohms per 1000 feet (rounded up) while a 0 Ga wire has a resistance of .10 ohms per 1000 feet. If this is a linear measurement, as it should be, then per foot the 4Ga wire has a resistance of .00024 ohms per foot and the 0 Ga has a resistance of .0001 ohms per foot. Lets be VERY liberal and say that you have 8 feet of wire coming from your alternator to the battery in a typical front mounted battery situation. This means that we are looking at the difference between .00192 ohm and .0008 ohm.

Wandering off a bit, a resistor is rated in ohms, a resistor can also be use as current limiting in charge control, in fact they often times ARE used as current limiting in charge control. 

So let's say that we are using a resistance limited charge controller and we are charging the battery hot and heavy..... I highly doubt that you are gonna make or break the integrity of the battery by changing the resistance of the current limiting by .00112 ohms.

That's basically where I'm coming from.


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## Austin (Mar 12, 2009)

my6x9s said:


> that was not chads statement by the way this was "The big 3 is not gonna make the difference in charge rate enough to alter the life of the battery"\


I know that wasn't his post... Its because i was talking to you.


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## my6x9s (Apr 15, 2009)

wow chad that was awesome. i really like that you took the time to explain in detail the differences in the wire for a short run. thank you 
this forum is interesting,never a dull moment 
well ill shut-up about the wet vs gel 
i failed on one of the gels in my own ride just today. 
the first battery that was hooked direct to the alt (dc gen) just shy of 200a and they are all wired parallel and fused well seems i took out the fuse in between the motor area and the ones inside so that only the two under the hood got the full charge.
so end result it cooked the first battery in the chain. .. i bought a new battery today and lucky me they had one wet one in stock that fit in the original area.. 
so i asked the battery shop this vary question on the forum gel vs wet
he said the truth is in the warranty offered by the makers 
wet cells always have a longer warranty than the gels 
so he said its easy to see but always let the customer make the choice
customers are always right.
so i will drop this topic and say i now mix my own battery system 
the wet is first in line now and the nick in the wire is fixed and will soon be re-routing the wire in a pvc or conduit pipe under the truck where its not able to get nicked again.

so i don't think there really is a resolve for this its really up to the customer to make a choice of their own. 
by the way chad cant wait till i need tech advice you seem vary knowledgeable indeed
but you prob already know that since your a moderator. peace out


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

OT, I bought a couple of SLA's here that were dead ringers for smaller batcaps... Presto, a PERFECT powersports battery so I dropped it in the quad to replace the flooded battery that was failing. Fukin awesome man, great battery for the application.

Fast forward two weeks, We are out riding and a friend flips a quad into a ravine, of course people ride with me because although my quad is slow, it's 4WD and has a winch, great insurance. We get that sucker hooked up, mine tied off to a tree and commence winching. Hell of a load on that battery, well I stopped to let it charge back up, hit the switch, it slowed down and I felt a FUMP under my ass and I had no torque on the winch...... the battery failed, dunno what happened, know HOW it happened, but that sucker WILL charge to 13.8V and not make current. The battery LOOKS OK, but it sure is shot, and even when making that horrible noise, it never popped a relief cover! Good thing I bought 2 

I'm not a mod because of knowledge, I'm a mod because I can take **** from others


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## my6x9s (Apr 15, 2009)

chad said:


> I'm not a mod because of knowledge, I'm a mod because I can take **** from others


yeah thats has to be the reason too. im not good at the political correct thing may times. and i always give kudos to those that can deal with the public. 
i know thats not easy at all :laugh: i will never be a customer service worker.


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## freemind (Sep 11, 2008)

Get your hands on this,

DieHard Automotive Battery, Platinum P-4 - Group Size 34/78DT (with exchange)

Nothing but good stories everywhere.................


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## Audiolife (Dec 19, 2008)

I would get an AGM battery that actually uses most of the space it takes up with the actual plates of the battery like a kinetik or odyssey battery


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