# Focal k2 165 sound horrible



## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Good day,

I installed my focal k2 power 165kr fronts by professional installer with sound treating material in the doors. And they sound absolute terrible. I tried three different amps and all sound the same. It feels like the bass is missing and give me headache. I tried a zed levithian amp, a nakamiki pa2004 amp and JL audio 500/4 amp. All sound the same terrible. 

What am I doing wrong here? 

Alpine Ina w910 headunit. 

Thank you

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## gumbeelee (Jan 3, 2011)

What sounds so horrible...are u running active or passive?


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## Erick_Markland (Aug 30, 2017)

what type of vehicle? any aftermarket Processing?


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## makhdoom123 (Aug 10, 2017)

They need to break in 
How much time have u heard them from ? 


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

I heard a set in a car where the owner hadn't a clue how to set them up - had every tuning feature on max - like loudness etc... I almost ran out his car...

I switched all that off and his system went from absolute rubbish to pretty good...

Focals get a bad rap because of the so called brightness... but it's tuning error that causes that...


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

No processing. I am using the crossover that came with them. 

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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> No processing. I am using the crossover that came with them.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




So describe the sound..


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Try EQing down around 2K and 200 Hz. Just a guess based on what I have done with this type of Focals more than once. It should sound like you're getting more lows, and smooth out the bright upper midrange area.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

GEM592 said:


> Try EQing down around 2K and 200 Hz. Just a guess based on what I have done with this type of Focals more than once. It should sound like you're getting more lows, and smooth out the bright upper midrange area.


I cannot figure out the eq settings on the headunit. 

The sounds high pitch like someone screaming with no bass 

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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> I cannot figure out the eq settings on the headunit.
> 
> The sounds high pitch like someone screaming with no bass
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Try switch off any EQ and run flat setting also if you have any sound effect like loudness etc turn that off


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

alex1002 said:


> I cannot figure out the eq settings on the headunit.
> 
> The sounds high pitch like someone screaming with no bass
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


What headunit?

Are those the ES 165 K2?

You can try setting the tweeters 3 dB down on the crossover too. There is a switch.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

There are probably several crossover adjustments you can try, I can help if you tell me exactly which focals you have:

ES 165 K
ES 165 K2
ES 165 KX2

Or you can check the manual. The settings available vary a little by model.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Are you sure the speakers are in phase? Easy to get it wrong ... even for a professional 


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

For ES 165 K2 there are three crossover switches under the cover.

Check the manual 

https://www.focal.com/sites/www.focal.fr/files/shared/catalog/document/k2power_user-manual.pdf

on pages 7 or 8 for what is available.

Sounds like you maybe want the upper midrange bump (switch 1) off, woofer low pass slope 6/12 dB/oct (switch 2) set to 12 dB/oct, and tweeter level (switch 3) set to 0 dB or -3 dB (0 dB is no doubt the middle setting, maybe H is the +3 dB and F is the -3 dB, not sure).


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

If you have the last generation 165 kr, you would have only two crossover settings (switches next to speaker connection terminals). Based on what you're saying, I guess in this case I would try Mid Flat on the left switch, and tweeter -6 dB on the right.


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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

Elektra said:


> Are you sure the speakers are in phase? Easy to get it wrong ... even for a professional
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Phase will not cause the high frequency problem OP is describing.

OP, is the high frequencies and missing bass your only problems? Is there noise, hiss, whine?


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

gijoe said:


> Phase will not cause the high frequency problem OP is describing.
> 
> 
> 
> OP, is the high frequencies and missing bass your only problems? Is there noise, hiss, whine?




It did on my kit 7 - sounded so bad I could not listen to it - found out I reversed the phase on one of the mids - changed it and it was a total reversal of sound 


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

Those speakers can sound great but unfortuantly without some way to tune them they wont sound that good.
If you have an eq cut the highs.
Cross them over higher.
Boosting the bass will likely not help. 
You really need a way to smooth out the freq response. You have peaks in your freq response and thats whats hurting your ears. Unfortunately it sounds like those peaks are in bad areas which only makes it worse.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

There is no hiss or Huss. 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Issue is that crossover are in the doors and only way to get to them by opening the doors. 

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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

Elektra said:


> It did on my kit 7 - sounded so bad I could not listen to it - found out I reversed the phase on one of the mids - changed it and it was a total reversal of sound
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I call BS. If you know how phase works you would know that we don't hear phase differences in high frequencies. At 15khz the wavelength is less than an inch long, meaning 180 degrees out of phase is less than half an inch difference. That would mean every move we make would cause constant phase issues, if we heard them we'd go crazy.

At low frequencies we hear phase, but it won't cause the issued being described. You'd have interference, both constructive and destructive so some frequencies will be attenuated, some boosted. This could cause the lack of bass, but it's not going to present itself as distortion, it just might have weak bass and sound a bit off. It simply won't cause a "total reversal of sound."


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

alex1002 said:


> Issue is that crossover are in the doors and only way to get to them by opening the doors.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


Well you may have to get to them. If they're set wrong, especially the tweeter level, it can be bad.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

https://youtu.be/YUwBG8JjB-M

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## will. (Jul 7, 2015)

For me, any set of speakers can sound terrible out of the box, especially focal. Too many variables as what's described as terrible sound. 
If I'm 3db down in my midbass, I gave that same terrible sounding feeling the OP is describing.
Scoop out what you don't like with an eq and go from there.
Also, have the doors been properly treated and sealed? This alone can cause this 

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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

Its a response issue. Ive never heard a good sounding system that didnt have eq and ta.
Tweeter attenuation and crossover settings can help but without ta and eq your speakers are at the mercy of the dimensions of your car. 
Those speakers arent cheap and at least deserve a basic dsp. A stand alone or in the head unit. Either way. 
Without the ability to do basic tuning something will always sound wrong.

I didnt see anyone ask. Did you have stock speakers before?
If yes this is very common. Stock speakers tend to be loaded with midbass and a weak top end. Switch to good speakers amd everything sounds horrible without some tuning.


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## Angrywhopper (Jan 20, 2010)

I noticed your source is USB audio. Where are you getting the music loaded on your USB stick?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

drop1 said:


> Its a response issue. Ive never heard a good sounding system that didnt have eq and ta.
> Tweeter attenuation and crossover settings can help but without ta and eq your speakers are at the mercy of the dimensions of your car.
> Those speakers arent cheap and at least deserve a basic dsp. A stand alone or in the head unit. Either way.
> Without the ability to do basic tuning something will always sound wrong.
> ...


All 100% correct, but if we're passive and those crossovers aren't reasonable the tuning problem is 10x harder. If you're running passive you're going to want to check the passive settings and see if they're right. For all we know the left settings don't match the right.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

gijoe said:


> I call BS. If you know how phase works you would know that we don't hear phase differences in high frequencies. At 15khz the wavelength is less than an inch long, meaning 180 degrees out of phase is less than half an inch difference. That would mean every move we make would cause constant phase issues, if we heard them we'd go crazy.
> 
> 
> 
> At low frequencies we hear phase, but it won't cause the issued being described. You'd have interference, both constructive and destructive so some frequencies will be attenuated, some boosted. This could cause the lack of bass, but it's not going to present itself as distortion, it just might have weak bass and sound a bit off. It simply won't cause a "total reversal of sound."




Look... I may be wrong who knows but - I fiddled with something on my crossblock and it sounded so bad I could not even listen to them even at low volumes - it was screaming at me 

I double checked the crossblock and unnoticed I wired the midrange incorrectly and once I changed it it completely changed the car back to smooth again

Just saying that's what happened to me...


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I was told that the speakers may be blown by installer. That's why they sound horrible. On my head unit I found setting for bass and treble frequency. I tried playing with them no improvement. 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Settings https://youtu.be/L4dPlsVaAcI

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

From your videos, they don't really sound blown. But I was listening through youtube so ...

Do you have the option to go back to the installer, and ask him at least what crossover settings he used? Maybe have him help you pop off the door panels real quick to reset both sides?

After that, you may have to look at equipment upgrades (deck/DSP) if you're still not happy.


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## 555nova (Apr 12, 2014)

Listening to a video on youtube is useless, we don't hear your speakers, we hear our computer speakers.


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

Get rid of that headunit, I'v owned b4 an it lacks in much ways in terms of tuning, it's setting are not extensive, it has very ltd bandwidth to tune an from what I can remember it lacks so much midrange, it's presets are trash in my opinion compared to what I used last and now. The 2 amps u mentioned are good amps I'v dealt with em both, either you get an extensive headunit or get yourself a decent DSP. 

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## gumbeelee (Jan 3, 2011)

alex1002 said:


> I was told that the speakers may be blown by installer. That's why they sound horrible. On my head unit I found setting for bass and treble frequency. I tried playing with them no improvement.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Why dont you check the speakers with a multimeter, if there blown no wonder they sound like ****. The installer could have easily checked if they were blown 


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## gumbeelee (Jan 3, 2011)

alex1002 said:


> Settings https://youtu.be/L4dPlsVaAcI
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Also I would set everything to flat on your headunit, and full range on your amp. Make sure loudness, bass boost, and the rest of that junk is turned off as well on your deck. Your passive networks are automatically setting your xovers


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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

i would take everything out, start with the basic; test the woofer free air to make sure its proper and make sure the xover is properly connected..... 

if the speakers and connection are fine. then make sure your doors are properly deadened and theres no leak in the woofer mounting... 

if you still have issue, then it would suggest to be either that extremely basic head unit and/or high expectation

which model of focal are these? theres a bunch of different k2 165 ..?


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## gumbeelee (Jan 3, 2011)

gijoe said:


> I call BS. If you know how phase works you would know that we don't hear phase differences in high frequencies. At 15khz the wavelength is less than an inch long, meaning 180 degrees out of phase is less than half an inch difference. That would mean every move we make would cause constant phase issues, if we heard them we'd go crazy.
> 
> 
> 
> At low frequencies we hear phase, but it won't cause the issued being described. You'd have interference, both constructive and destructive so some frequencies will be attenuated, some boosted. This could cause the lack of bass, but it's not going to present itself as distortion, it just might have weak bass and sound a bit off. It simply won't cause a "total reversal of sound."




I agree on calling "bs"


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I got a new headunit Pioneer ddx9904s. Can someone tell me what a DSP would do for me?

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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

u trolling ? lol


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Isn't that a Kenwood?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

I would hold off on DSP right now, put that in first - it is not bad.

But still check your crossovers lol.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

What should I do at the end of the day?

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

At the end of the day, you should remember that you're damned if you do, and damned if you don't, a stitch in time saves nine, six in one, half a dozen with the other, a rolling stone gathers no moss, if you can't beat 'em then join 'em, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free, and ...

I think I made a point there


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Should I try to open the doors and look at the crossovers?

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

alex1002 said:


> Should I try to open the doors and look at the crossovers?
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


Yes. Let me know where they are set, and whatever happens make sure they are both set the same.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Another person told me they could be fake focal speakers. I checked the serials before installed and they were fine on focal website 

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

I'm thinking they are not fake. Nor blown. I have watched your videos.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Then why they sound so horrible? Even with new head unit and now third amp hert HDP 4

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

What is the brand of the head unit? Kenwood or Pioneer?


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Kenwood DDX9904S

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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

define "sound so horrible" please, its an extremely vague statement... what exactly dont you like? 

what were you expecting when upgrading to the focals?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

So it is a Kenwood. 

You need to make sure the crossovers are set the same, or know what they're set at, at least. 

Either you yourself will have to get in the doors, or your installer will have to help you. Then some tuning can be done. That deck is pretty capable. 

Maybe your deck installer can look at your crossovers, if your speaker installer can't? Maybe he's busy posting to diymobileaudio.com at the moment?


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I'll check the crossover. Open the doors myself and check then. Should I try without them using the zed amp?

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

They sound mudy, missing the bass and gives me headches. Even the stock speakers sounded better to me. I also tried hires audio files in FLAC format from hdtracks.com 

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Any good amp should be OK. Make sure the left and right crossovers are the same, first of all. Check your tweeter level and mid boost. Tell me exactly which focals you are running, if possible. I think you are one generation back, but they are very good.


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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

you might have loose connections somewhere too...
definitly open your doors, take your time and inspect the signal path, all the connections make sure they are good and tight

also make sure that you dindt invert the woofer/tweeter connections on the crossover, that could very well be whats happening aswell.

what kind of wires are you using? and did you bought the speakers brand new or used?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

18inch said:


> you might have loose connections somewhere too...
> definitly open your doors, take your time and inspect the signal path, all the connections make sure they are good and tight
> 
> also make sure that you dindt invert the woofer/tweeter connections on the crossover, that could very well be whats happening aswell.
> ...


Good advice, if you open up the doors. It seems to me like the speakers are probably OK.


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## Iamsecond (Jan 3, 2017)

Man, I know what your saying. What your experiencing is frustrating. I installed 3 different speaker combos ranging from 150 to 300 component set with a kenwood ddx393 with a small 4 channel ktp445u amp and had the same thing happen. It literally gave me a headache every time I got in the vehicle to the point I stopped listening to it. I was never able to get things to sound right with the kenwood eq. Not sure why but I finally gave up trying to use it. If your ears are that sensitive I would suggest using a dsp that would give you a lot of eq flexibility. There are probably a couple of frequencies that are causing the trouble. Even when I upgraded to si m25 and tm65 I was not able to get it right with the kenwood eq. Its amazing what can be done with a dsp even if it's only using the eq.


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## SQ_Blaze (Sep 29, 2008)

Something about this thread just seems fishy to me.

The OP still has yet to mention what vehicle this is in, nor has he mentioned which model version of Focal he has. Not very difficult questions to answer. 

Also, having no bass and being muddy at the same time? That doesn't seem right. I've never witnessed an aftermarket speaker that didn't seem a bit too bright if anything else. 

I'm guessing the installer wired the crossovers wrong, putting the mids on the tweeter output and the tweeters on the mid output, blowing the tweeters, hence no bass and no highs.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I opened the doors and discovered the crossover modules are missing. He connected the twitter and woofer together with no cross over. 

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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

Post a picture


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Well that won't do lol. If you know where they are, you can put them in, or you can possibly try active wiring depending on what equipment is available.


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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

GEM592 said:


> Well that won't do lol. If you know where they are, you can put them in, or you can possibly try active wiring depending on what equipment is available.


Thats if his tweets arent already blown. Full power with no crossover ,it would be amazing if his tweets still work.


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## 652mac (Apr 21, 2012)

did the same guy install your head unit in your dash that way too?


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

18inch said:


> you might have loose connections somewhere too...
> 
> definitly open your doors, take your time and inspect the signal path, all the connections make sure they are good and tight
> 
> ...




What wire in this entire audio system could be "loose" and give this type of problem... and by "loose" u mean connecting and then not connecting? I've heard the term "loose wire" or "loose connection" atleast 1.5 million times from people as well as customers, and to be honest, for a guy who does around 800 cars a year, I have yet to find anything "loose" that affects sound quality... hard to believe how much that term is used but yet is almost never the issue .. please help me understand why that term is used so much and so universally .. I feel like I missed an era in the past that nothing was ever tightened or something 


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> I opened the doors and discovered the crossover modules are missing. He connected the twitter and woofer together with no cross over.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




U should drive back to the place where u got the speakers done and simply ask the installer why there are no crossovers on your nice set of focals... that's absolutely unacceptable and gives all installers a bad name... on behalf of quality installers all over, I'm sorry that u have had to deal with this, and also know this, not all installers do work like that.


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

U should drive back to the place where u got the speakers done and simply ask the installer why there are no crossovers on your nice set of focals... that's absolutely unacceptable and gives all installers a bad name... on behalf of quality installers all over, I'm sorry that u have had to deal with this, and also know this, not all installers do work like that.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

165kr. There's an option for flat/high and also 0 -3, -6 db 

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

alex1002 said:


> 165kr. There's an option for flat/high and also 0 -3, -6 db
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


Well it's going to sound better no matter where you put those, as long as a tweeter isn't blown. 

Make sure both sides are the same, maybe flat and -3. 

Would be good to listen to different settings before replacing the doorpanels if possible, leave them somewhere conservative.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

He actually left the crossovers in my spare tire comparement. I installed them myself 

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## Iamsecond (Jan 3, 2017)

So what did it sound like when you installed the crossovers


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> He actually left the crossovers in my spare tire comparement. I installed them myself
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Wooooooow


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> He actually left the crossovers in my spare tire comparement. I installed them myself
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




U need to talk to his boss.. or the owner of the shop.. that's unacceptable bud


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

They still sound bad. I set to high and -3db. 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

What's the best way to test if they blown?

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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

If they work they're not blown.. if there is a mechanical problem with the woofer it will make a popping, buzzing, rattling sound wth bass or
Midbass.. the tweeter will just simply not work if it's blown.. take your car to the shop.. bring the owner/manager out to your car.. explain what u found and what happened.. and let him listen and ask him if it would be acceptable to him, given the money u spent there


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## MikeS (May 23, 2015)

alex1002 said:


> They still sound bad. I set to high and -3db.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


If they still work see if theres air gap(s) somewhere between the door/speaker or speaker/door card speaker opening. Search for fast rings or visit local hardware store for window seal section to seal off the speaker area on top so it can't vent inside between the door. Those leaks will kill all the bass if theres any.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Is it worth redoing the whole doors with dynamat?

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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

no offense but your honestly sounding like a troll .... this whole thread dont make any sense at all...................................


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Yeah I feel like I did my part, thinking of moving on. Maybe somebody programmed an AI bot, and is testing to see how long a thread can be dragged out.


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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

20to20 said:


> What wire in this entire audio system could be "loose" and give this type of problem... and by "loose" u mean connecting and then not connecting? I've heard the term "loose wire" or "loose connection" atleast 1.5 million times from people as well as customers, and to be honest, for a guy who does around 800 cars a year, I have yet to find anything "loose" that affects sound quality... hard to believe how much that term is used but yet is almost never the issue .. please help me understand why that term is used so much and so universally .. I feel like I missed an era in the past that nothing was ever tightened or something
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


im not sure about the people saying this term... ive been into car audio since about 10years ago, jump to home audio since then and only recently got back into car audio.. 

regardless, i was mentioning loose connection because ive had an very odd situation where one of my diy home audio sub where it sounded off and was playing on and off and even had a bit of scratching sound even, there was no way i had blown the sub since i only use home sub as low frequency fillers and not for loundness (so never use the full potential of the sub), plus ive blown 2 subs so i know how they sound & smell when theyre toasted lol... 

so anyways long story short i opened it and checked all the wires and had a connection that was simply terrible that ran from my sub to the binding post in the enclosure, it was so loose that even just blowing air on it would make it lose contact/signal, had no idea how it ended up this loose, maybe i dindt pay attention when i was mounting it the first time....

so thats why i suggested this.... not because "people keep saying this" but because ive actually had a situation that was as simple as fixing the wire connections to fix a stupid issue... lol

granted it was an extremely unique situation, but still possible in some cases...


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

GEM592 said:


> Yeah I feel like I did my part, thinking of moving on. Maybe somebody programmed an AI bot, and is testing to see how long a thread can be dragged out.


Sorry man. I am just really dissapointed and not sure what other ideas to try. 

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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

^^^Go to a competent installer and have them troubleshoot. There isn't enough info provided in this thread to help. You refuse to provide what members have asked for.


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

18inch said:


> im not sure about the people saying this term... ive been into car audio since about 10years ago, jump to home audio since then and only recently got back into car audio..
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Understood, thank u for clearing that up


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Niebur3 said:


> ^^^Go to a competent installer and have them troubleshoot. There isn't enough info provided in this thread to help. You refuse to provide what members have asked for.


What am I missing?

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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

I think just what model HU and type of car. Some asked your capability to go active.


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

Pics, type of car (unless I missed it), etc.....

Seriously, enough has been screwed up on this install already. Find a competent installer to tell you if the speakers are still good. If not, have the installer that screwed everything up warranty them, if you purchased from him. If not, then you might have just learned an expensive lesson.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

2010 hyundai accent hatch. 165kr. Hertz hdp4 amp. Kenwood DDX9904S headunit. Back speakers are Pioneer TS-D801P. Alpine typer sub powered by Hertz hdp1. 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Theslaking said:


> I think just what model HU and type of car. Some asked your capability to go active.


I can use my zed amp and go active. 

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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

Theslaking said:


> I think just what model HU and type of car. Some asked your capability to go active.




Looks like a Hyundai Accent or Elantra based off of the interior ... and it's an alpine ine-w910... if this dude does go active, he really needs to find someone else to do the work for sure.. and I'm really praying his head unit didn't get "installed" by that same dude and that it's still not finished for some reason


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I wanted to provide an update on changes I made. I took out the crossover and wired the tweeters directly into channel 1 of my zed amp and the woofer into channel 2. Now my issue I only get the tweeters working and if I move the rcas to channel too I get the woofers working. What am I doing wrong 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Some picture of the back of the zed
















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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

Unhook your tweeter from there before u blow it up.. u don't have a crossover right now to filter out any low end going to it ...u need to go to a professional .. where do u live 


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

gijoe said:


> I call BS. If you know how phase works you would know that we don't hear phase differences in high frequencies. At 15khz the wavelength is less than an inch long, meaning 180 degrees out of phase is less than half an inch difference. That would mean every move we make would cause constant phase issues, if we heard them we'd go crazy.
> 
> At low frequencies we hear phase, but it won't cause the issued being described. You'd have interference, both constructive and destructive so some frequencies will be attenuated, some boosted. This could cause the lack of bass, but it's not going to present itself as distortion, it just might have weak bass and sound a bit off. It simply won't cause a "total reversal of sound."


100% correct. I'v ran out of phase quite a few many times. 

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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

gijoe said:


> I call BS.
> ...
> It simply won't cause a "total reversal of sound."


I am picturing the scene from Kubrik's 2001 where the HAL will not open the pod bay doors, and the wind exits Bowman's lungs.

In this case it seems it would be coming out of the ears...


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Can someone please just help this poor idiot. 

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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> Can someone please just help this poor idiot.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




U NEED TO SEE A PROFESSIONAL!!!!! U are not qualified to do what your trying to do... where do u live so someone here can refer u to a reliable installer or shop ... I'm really not trying to be rude... someone is gonna tell u to do something and your either not going to understand or it isn't going to be done correctly... there are always unforeseen variables involved... a professional will be able to evaluate everything and come to a conclusion as to what will be best for u as far as cost and product usage 


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

You need a splitter for the RCA to go to 1&2 for the tweets and 5&6 for the mids. Set the crossover for 1&2 to at least 3k immediately(don't know your tweets specs). Your going to blow them up putting a signal below 2500 to them. If I see that amp correctly you can set the high pass and low pass for one set of channels. Use that for your mids and set the HP to 80 and LP to 3k. Those are not perfect settings but it is a good starting point.


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> Can someone please just help this poor idiot.


Well at the end of the conversation in the scene from 2001... HAL says to Dave, "The conversation can serve no useful purpose anymore. Good bye Dave".


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

Are you running an external equaliser? 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

welly.anthony.cat said:


> Are you running an external equaliser?
> 
> Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk


I can use the one in the Kenwood head unit 

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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

20to20 said:


> Unhook your tweeter from there before u blow it up.. u don't have a crossover right now to filter out any low end going to it ...u need to go to a professional .. where do u live
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


He does have filters, he's just not using them! 
If you really live around Toronto there is a couple guys around here (Buffalo/Rochester) that are competent and on diyma. It's only an hour and a half. There has to be someone around in that 20 million person area you live that's willing and knowledgeable enough to help.


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

I have read through this entire thread, not once have you given I more accurate description of the distortion u speak of, and untill you do No1 in here can really help you solve your problem, I Dnt wana give you the run around and make you check things that Dnt need checking because you issue only comes down to very specific things but as I said a more accurate description of your issue is key to solve the problem. 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I'm in Toronto 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

High pass set to 290. Low pass290 according to manual. Tweeters on channel 1+2 woofers on 5+6. Do I still need a y adapter?

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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> High pass set to 290. Low pass290 according to manual. Tweeters on channel 1+2 woofers on 5+6. Do I still need a y adapter?
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


On your amplifier there should HP/LP switches. For 1+2 put it on hp and for 5+6 put it on full range or if it has an off setting put on off an put Fz gain on or below 3.5k hz

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

welly.anthony.cat said:


> On your amplifier there should HP/LP switches. For 1+2 put it on hp and for 5+6 put it on full range or if it has an off setting put on off an put Fz gain on or below 3.5k hz
> 
> Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk


I made those changes. Do I need a y adapter?

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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

welly.anthony.cat said:


> On your amplifier there should HP/LP switches. For 1+2 put it on hp and for 5+6 put it on full range or if it has an off setting put on off an put Fz gain on or below 3.5k hz
> 
> Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk


If I'm reading the pic correctly 1&2 have HP or LP. 5&6 have the ability to do both HP and LP. That's why I suggested what I did.

Yes. You need RCA's going into all channels that haves speaker wires.


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> High pass set to 290. Low pass290 according to manual. Tweeters on channel 1+2 woofers on 5+6. Do I still need a y adapter?
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


HP to which channels? 290 is not anywhere near high enough for channels 1&2 if the tweets are hooked up there. 290 is to high for the the woofers if that's where the LP is set.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I really want to get these going. Can someone please spend sometime on it and help me please. I would be great full 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I got the woofers giving nice bass now. But the tweeters have this pitch sound. 

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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

Did you set them where I suggested? Post of pics of your current amp settings.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Settings now
















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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Sound sample https://youtu.be/ADzggYN4Xlc

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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

I apologize for the response in assuming u didn't have a crossover with a multiplier on it to use as a crossover for tweets, that's great news... you will notice that the tweeters will be much louder than the woofers with the gains set at the same place... they are much more efficient with power.. this is where a processor comes in handy, but given the equipment situation, set the gains for the mids with a rear tone and oscope if u can and you will most likely end up with the gains for the tweets much lower to have it sounding relatively "equalized"... ideally u would scope the channels driving the tweets also , but like I said, you'll end up with screaming loud tweets that are much louder than the mids... set the gains on the mids and slowly Increase the gains on the tweets until your satisfied.. also, did u ever confirm that the mids are truly electrically in phase? 


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

Set the High pass for 1&2 just about all the way to the right. Focal sets it at 3.8k. That will definitely help. Switch the woofers to 3&4. Set it to bp. Then turn the low pass most of the way to the right (3.5k) and turn the HP all the way to the left. Those 6.5 can play down to 65hz at proper power levels.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Here's a better view of the control. Can you tell me now. I am getting closer to getting right..thanks everyone.









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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Sorry this is for my version









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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> I made those changes. Do I need a y adapter?
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk


RCA y adapters? If your running 1 set of RCA each for front and rear then no. I strongly suggest you do not use your splitters as they mess up sound quality 

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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

welly.anthony.cat said:


> RCA y adapters? If your running 1 set of RCA each for front and rear then no. I strongly suggest you do not use your splitters as they mess up sound quality
> 
> Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk


He's at the point of blowing up his tweeters. He's going for it with or without us. So a y splitter is far better than what he's doing. The potential lose of sq is minimized if you have plenty of power to compensate for the lowered voltage from splitter. And going active is a huge gain over blowing up or distorting speakers. He's clearly at the experience level or patience level to do this 100% correctly. I am trying to help him with what he has before he has to start a "replacement suggestions" thread.

He did ask why he only had music from one set of speakers then showed us a pic with only one set of RCA's so I made an assumption.


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

alex1002... I told you where to put your amp settings. Turn the dials the way I suggested. I got the info from Focal. It will sound acceptable. You will be happy I'm sure. Unless I typed something incorrectly I gave all the info you needed.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Theslaking said:


> Set the High pass for 1&2 just about all the way to the right. Focal sets it at 3.8k. That will definitely help. Switch the woofers to 3&4. Set it to be. Then turn the low pass most of the way to the right (3.5k) and turn the HP all the way to the left. Those 6.5 can play down to 65hz at proper power levels.


Yep that is about where I'd start.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Captain ... she's breaking up ...


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

1set RCA for each channel mate, Dnt be cutting corners here or doing half jobs cause nobody in here tolerates cheap crappy alternatives, do it right or Dnt do it at all!! 

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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

GEM592 said:


> Captain ... she's breaking up ...


Yep.


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

Theslaking said:


> Yep.


"static static" 

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Don't use 5/6 for now. Tweeters on 1/2, freq all the way clockwise (right), "mode" switch set to "hp", level low. Mids on 3/4, with "mode" switch set to "lp/bp" and "mode-lp/bp" switch set to "bp." On 3/4, "high pass" can be set mostly counter-clockwise (left), and "low pass" can be set mostly clockwise (right). Also start with level low.

Interesting amp, no matter what happens lol.

Edit: Forgot to mention 1/2 "mode" switch set to "hp".


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

Yeah what amp is that I'd like to get my hands on one. 

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## AyOne (Sep 24, 2016)

welly.anthony.cat said:


> Yeah what amp is that I'd like to get my hands on one.
> 
> Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk


Looks like a Leviathan(zed audio).


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

Good one no doubt. Those complicated crossover settings are just there to keep you honest. I myself prefer in/out only amps but I am biased.


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

Not a single one in my area listed on any database lol, what a bummer. 

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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

GEM592 said:


> Don't use 5/6 for now. Tweeters on 1/2, freq all the way clockwise (right), "mode" switch set to "hp", level low. Mids on 3/4, with "mode" switch set to "lp/bp" and "mode-lp/bp" switch set to "bp." On 3/4, "high pass" can be set mostly counter-clockwise (left), and "low pass" can be set mostly clockwise (right). Also start with level low.
> 
> Interesting amp, no matter what happens lol.
> 
> Edit: Forgot to mention 1/2 "mode" switch set to "hp".


When I 1st read this post b4 u edited, I said to myself *this guys a **** head* lol

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

It should sound pretty good, even off a stock deck. Let's see what he says.


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## welly.anthony.cat (Aug 6, 2017)

$100 he will blow somthing!!! 

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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

You ain't have no bill yo


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

This is what the zed dealer told me. But still doesn't right. The bass is really good. But the tweeters give this high pitch sound. HIGH PASS set at about 25Hz for initial listening.

LOW PASS set at about 100Hz (1/2 way between 75 and 120)*for initial listening.

Set 1st push switch in to "LP-1-4" and set 2nd push switch to "LP"

Set LEVEL control for desired loudness.

YOUR SUBS WILL WORK.

*

Now looking below to Chs 1+2:

Set HIGH PASS to between 85 and 290 Hz*for initial listening.

Set LEVEL*control for desired loudness.

Set slide switch to "HP"



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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> This is what the zed dealer told me. But still doesn't right. The bass is really good. But the tweeters give this high pitch sound. HIGH PASS set at about 25Hz for initial listening.
> 
> LOW PASS set at about 100Hz (1/2 way between 75 and 120)*for initial listening.
> 
> ...




So your crossing the tweeters at what? What is 25hz and what is at 100hz

Confused here...


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

welly.anthony.cat said:


> $100 he will blow somthing!!!
> 
> Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk




I with you here..


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Elektra said:


> So your crossing the tweeters at what? What is 25hz and what is at 100hz
> 
> Confused here...
> 
> ...


I am also confused. I also cannot get the tweeters to soubd good. They got this high pitch sound. 
https://youtu.be/ADzggYN4Xlc

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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> I am also confused. I also cannot get the tweeters to soubd good. They got this high pitch sound.
> https://youtu.be/ADzggYN4Xlc
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Dude - your running passive right? You don't need to do anything but connect the speakers to the passive correctly 

The frequencies are pre-determined for you... 


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Elektra said:


> Dude - your running passive right? You don't need to do anything but connect the speakers to the passive correctly
> 
> The frequencies are pre-determined for you...
> 
> ...


They not using the crossover module anymore. 

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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> They not using the crossover module anymore.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




I suggest you do use it...


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Elektra said:


> I suggest you do use it...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I did and it sounded horrible 

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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> I did and it sounded horrible
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Then you have done something wrong in your wiring or setup..

I heard that set in a car with totally average HU and amps and wiring and it sounded pretty good to me...


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

I called that about 20 posts ago.. (about blowing something up) shoulda put bit coin on it.. damn it


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

20to20 said:


> I called that about 20 posts ago.. shoulda put bit coin on it.. damn it
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




Lol... this is how Focal gets a bad rep... 

Those speakers are very smooth and detailed - they actually very nice speakers - if I didn't have the Utopia Kit 7 already I would seriously look into getting the 3 way set...


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

20to20 said:


> I called that about 20 posts ago.. (about blowing something up) shoulda put bit coin on it.. damn it
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




I couldn't agree more.. they have great potential .. wish this dude would just take it to someone who knows what's up 


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

They wires are fine. I triple checked all 

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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> They wires are fine. I triple checked all
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




If you use the passive - set it to 0db on the tweeter, turn off all sound enhancements off your HU/amp - run no EQ just a flat line 

Check that you have crossed the midbass at around 63hz at 12/18db slope 

How are the tweeters positioned in terms of axis - what amp are you using? A Zed? 

What RCA cables and speaker wires...

Failing which you need to demo a similar setup and compare to yours to understand the shortfalls

Side note....

I heard that video - if that was my car I would return it to stock... or sent it to a reputable installer to go through the car...

Everything sounded wrong to me not just your treble 

How much power are you sending the speakers? You could just be over driving the speakers also these are the 2ohm version Focals? Is your amp 1ohm stable? 

Lots to consider...


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I took it to a local installer. He spend 30-45 min on it. He also cannot get rid of the high pitch sound. 

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

He took out my amp and connected to their demo units using Hertz mille 165.3 and still doesn't sound amazing. Maybe I wasn't meant to hear good sound. 

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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> I took it to a local installer. He spend 30-45 min on it. He also cannot get rid of the high pitch sound.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Soooo... as a professional installer , when u say "high pitched sound" wtf are u referring to? Is it a noise that isn't on the cd? Or whatever your listening to? Something like an alternator whine? Or a constant hum? Or are u saying that the tweeters are just playing louder than they should be in reference to the mids? And if the installer was worth going to, he would be able to fix your audio system ... he wouldn't let u leave until he could tell u exactly what the problem is, how to fix it , and what it will cost u to do so.... tell u what, drive to Pittsburgh and I will fix your whole set up GUARANTEED!!


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

alex1002 said:


> I took it to a local installer. He spend 30-45 min on it. He also cannot get rid of the high pitch sound.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




At the risk of going through a 100 posts can you tell us what system you have? 

Pics of the install? Pics of the tweeter positions etc...


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## HeyWaj10 (Nov 14, 2011)

This thread is equally entertaining as it is utterly frustrating.


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

Elektra said:


> I suggest you do use it...
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


He had a "professional" install it the first time and they wired it wrong so it got messed up. I suggested active to get him by and told him how to set the crossovers on the amp. He responded with "the dealer told me...Which is the 100hz or whatever number. And surprisingly it still sounds like crap.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Theslaking said:


> He had a "professional" install it the first time and they wired it wrong so it got messed up. I suggested active to get him by and told him how to set the crossovers on the amp. He responded with "the dealer told me...Which is the 100hz or whatever number. And surprisingly it still sounds like crap.




This is why the manufacturers give passives with there speakers....

If you haven't a clue - use the passives...

But a RTA reading will solve this "mystery" once and for all 

But I suspect he has been running wrong frequencies into fragile drivers - blowing or damaging a tweeter is very easy..


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> He took out my amp and connected to their demo units using Hertz mille 165.3 and still doesn't sound amazing. Maybe I wasn't meant to hear good sound.
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




Probably one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever read... so he took your amp out and hooked your amp up to their display board? That's what I got from what u said ... if that's the case, it proves nothing 


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

https://youtu.be/YulV89iJonw

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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

Guys most interesting discovery. My friend suggest to swap out the crossover boxes. I installed a new pair from Hertz and my focal sound better. Still nothing like they do in other cars. 

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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

I read a thread with a guy that said almost exactly what u said from the beginning, took it to a shop, dude didn't use crossovers, sounded like crap...etc... I told him to bring it to me, he did... when he left he was thrilled to death, then posted on the forum that I was awesome and it was worth driving to get quality work done... I'm not saying you need to drive to where I live, but you've been to 2 "professionals" so far that can't fix your issue,... they aren't professionals, they just coincidentally work at an audio shop


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## 20to20 (Mar 3, 2017)

alex1002 said:


> https://youtu.be/YulV89iJonw
> 
> Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk




When u post a video like this, it doesn't sound like anything is wrong.. obviously the tweeter is blasting loud, but you are also right next to the tweeter 


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## 18inch (Jul 19, 2017)

^^x2 
that video doesnt say much, but i have to admit though it doesnt seem right... it sounds way too bright even considering were hearing it through youtube/camera mic...

how is your setting on your head unit ?
Im thinking you have the gains way to high on those tweets, or you have the treble/high frequencies bands way too high on your head unit EQ/functions....

try looking into this

btw if your talking about hiss or high pitched sound show us a video without music at least... unless youre taking about that sound while playing music?


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## SQ_Blaze (Sep 29, 2008)

alex1002 said:


> Can someone please just help this poor idiot.





20to20 said:


> U NEED TO SEE A PROFESSIONAL!!!!! U are not qualified to do what your trying to do... I'm really not trying to be rude... someone is gonna tell u to do something and your either not going to understand or it isn't going to be done correctly...





alex1002 said:


> I really want to get these going. Can someone please spend sometime on it and help me please. I would be great full



So what part of that answer you were given do you not understand?

It's quite obvious the installers you used are bumbling idiots that should be fired and/or shut down. It's also quite obvious that you're not sure of what's going on either, and I'm not saying that to be rude or mean.

It's just that countless times, members here have asked you to go to a competent installer or even a forum member near you to help you resolve your issues, yet you continue to ignore our suggestions and insist on attempting to fix something you know nothing about on your own by us telling you on what to do on your INCOMPLETE information.

If by some chance none of the drivers are blown yet, they will be if you continue to mess around with it on your own.

So in short, GO TO A COMPETENT SHOP AND HAVE THEM FIX IT FOR YOU!!!


This thread has given me a headache...


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

I would be great full. But not grateful. I mean that has to be a joke.


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## alex1002 (Aug 26, 2011)

I made a major mistake when I said the dealer gave me recommended settings it was actually Stephen from Zed. I taught they were the dealer of zed. Sorry about this mistake. 

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## drop1 (Jul 26, 2015)

Cant believe this is still going.
I strongly suggest everyone just stop replying and let him learn. The best advice was already given when he was told to take it to a shop.
Obviously that wont happen so either this is the most convincing troll thread ive ever seen or....


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## Timelessr1 (Feb 12, 2010)

I don't know if it was mentioned earlier in the thread...but where did you buy this set from? there have been focal knock offs


read post #5


"Tweeters sounds SHRILL"

Fake focal speakers? - In-Car-Entertainment - MyCarForum.com


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