# REGULARCABS 2013 Kia Rio5



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

The Silverado has been sold to some sleazy car salesman who will most likely put his greasy hands all over it. It was time to buy a vehicle that could haul the kids around. If I couldn’t drive my big, sexy, and paid off Chevy anymore I wanted something that got great gas mileage. I told myself I wasn’t going to do any audio in this car… That was 16 days ago....


Introducing REGULARCAB’s 2013 Kia Rio.









I will say, I already wish I could just drive to Lowes and throw some mdf in my truck. But that is about the only thing I miss. I love the way this car drives and feels. I got it for a steal of a price and got way more than I expected for the Silverado, tho I attribute all of that to a:not having my wife’s emotions come into play whatsoever and b:not actually wanting to trade in my truck. 

Usually I would start off with my goals and planned system, but really the only goal I have at the moment is to use as much of the salvaged gear from my truck as possible. And make as few permanent modifications as I can get away with. I would say I want to keep it budget but we all know how that turns out, I will settle for not wasting any money. 

Salvaged Gear:
-Pioneer gm-d9601 mono amplifier
-2 PPI bk-800.4 four channel amplifiers
-2 JBL GTO804 subwoofers
-all power wire from the Silverado
-all Xscorpion ground/distro and fuse blocks
-A pair of vifa xt25’s that I never got around to installing

I did make a little progress on her this last weekend. I got the mono amp installed under the drivers seat, and got a little progress on the false floor sub. I am going to wait to sound deaden the vehicle until I get the funds and can do it right this time. I went way overkill in the Silverado with the CLD to the point that panels wouldn’t fit correctly. It was a decade old asphalt product as well. I will not do that with this car. The plan for now at least is Knu Kolossus CLD and SDS mlv. I still want to see what CCF I want.

Here is the trunk all cleared out. Yeah, she didn’t come with a spare tire. Oooh look a big hole where a sub can go. The Silverado didn’t have that. I love having a newer car, when I remove panels, thing are so clean… like a virgin









Here is what I got done so far on the false floor. Now I promised myself I would take better/more pictures for this build log, but hey I’ll try better from here one out. Its basically just a rectangular box with .838 cubic feet of airspace made of ¾ marine grade birch ply. I laid the trunk carpet on top of a piece of ½ inch ply and traced out a cover, cut the hole for the sub and braced the hell out of everything I possibly could with more 3/4 birch ply. Unfortunately I didn’t cut the ½ inch ply in one piece but it is sturdy as hell and will get carpeted. I did put foam/rubber tape everywhere I thought might rub on metal and put a fair amount of fatmat (a horrible, unresearched purchase about a year ago) anywhere I thought could help on the box, no CLD was put on the car yet. I then laid a healthy amount of fiberglass insulation in the spare tire well, laid the heavy beast in the hatch and bolted it through the body with 4 stainless bolts. That was followed up on the underside with a heavy coat of truck bed liner to keep things water tight. I need to source some material for the cover. The plan is to use some perforated steel mesh and ¾ ply and carpet it with matching interior carpet. 

My little 8 inch subs. Im still in love with these guys. We will see if the hold up to a hatch instead of a single cab. 









After that I got the Pioneer mono amp installed under the drivers seat. I was lucky enough to find the G and yaw sensor under the seat. It had some nice bolts to attach a piece of half inch ply too. I cut my piece, lined it up and gave it a good whack to mark the bolt holes. A layer of rubber/foam tape was added to the bottom of the board as well as everything nice and rounded to fend off rattles. I then slid the whole piece under the carpet. Used the existing nuts to hold it down and proceeded to attach the sensor and the amp through the carpet to my new little amp rack. Here are the pics I was able to remember to get.

The G and Yaw sensor








Lining up the bolt holes








Installed under the carpet









Alright its time for a to do list:
1:Run power/ground wires for the mono amp under the seat and 2 4channels I will have in the back. I think with the two different spots I will run 4awg straight to the mono and then 0awg to the back.
2:Carpet and finish the false floor and fabricate the top (debate on hinges or not)
3:Install my 2 BK-800.4’s in the back (there is barely enough room left for these surfboard amps)
4:Install barrier strips for speaker wire and remote leads. I think I will make a run to the front doors and two runs to each pillar for the inevitable 3-way
5:Run speaker wire from the mono amp to the sub
6:Fabricate RCA's out of the 500feet of RG6 I have in my garage, stiff and overkill but shielded as hell and will only cost me a few RCA ends as I already have a stripper and compression tool.
7: Decide what midbass and mids I want to run. Im leaning heavily toward Dayton RS180’s and some fountek mids or perhaps the Dayton RS100.


I will leave off with something I am very excited about. I have a PPI DSP-88r coming in the mail. I look forward to being able to tune on something with a little more power than the 80prs that I had. I also look forward to being able to use the stock headunit. I will post an unboxing when I get it and my thoughts once I start tuning.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Nice car! lol

Does yours have the ISG (where it shuts off the engine at stop lights?) 
Before I bought mine I thought it was going to come with that and found a couple of articles that said that changing the ground wire at the battery could present a problem and cause the system not to work properly. Glad I don't have that.

Also, see if you can set up a free account at Kiatechinfo.com.
It lets you look up parts diagrams, wire colors, TSB's, etc. REALLY handy site.

Also, Metra makes a dash kit for these cars.

Jay


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## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

REGULARCAB said:


> I will say, I already wish I could just drive to Lowes and throw some mdf in my truck. But that is about the only thing I miss. I love the way this car drives and feels. I got it for a steal of a price and got way more than I expected for the Silverado, tho I attribute all of that to a:not having my wife’s emotions come into play whatsoever and b:not actually wanting to trade in my truck.


I had a similar situation. I got what I paid for my Silverado 22K miles ago so I took the deal and got me a Mercedes for a great deal that gets 34 MPG. Biggest mistake ever... the MB experience SUCKED. After 3-4 months, I went back to a truck (2014 Silverado). I miss the gas mileage a lot but it was really, really hard to part with the cargo space and towing ability. My Harley's modified suspension great but it's no cruiser anymore, haha. Rather tow it long distance like a puss. :mean:

Looking forward to the build!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Nice car! lol
> 
> Does yours have the ISG (where it shuts off the engine at stop lights?)
> Before I bought mine I thought it was going to come with that and found a couple of articles that said that changing the ground wire at the battery could present a problem and cause the system not to work properly. Glad I don't have that.
> ...


No ISG on mine either. I thought it would come standard as well lol. Have you run into any issues with the tiny charging system in this guy? 

I do have a metra dash kit coming but my dumb ass sold the 80prs with the truck and all I have atm is a x7500s. I'm not sure if I'll go with that or run the stock unit to the dsp-88r.

Would happen to know where you started prying to get the pillars off?


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

sirbOOm said:


> I had a similar situation. I got what I paid for my Silverado 22K miles ago so I took the deal and got me a Mercedes for a great deal that gets 34 MPG. Biggest mistake ever... the MB experience SUCKED. After 3-4 months, I went back to a truck (2014 Silverado). I miss the gas mileage a lot but it was really, really hard to part with the cargo space and towing ability. My Harley's modified suspension great but it's no cruiser anymore, haha. Rather tow it long distance like a puss. :mean:
> 
> Looking forward to the build!


I won't lie, I miss my truck. I drove that thing for a third of my life, and I've only ever owned trucks before. Luckily my wife owns a sorento so getting full sheets of lumber isn't impossible just more of a pain. I had the Silverado paid of for the last 6 years, if I could afford an extended cab truck I would have done it in a heartbeat, but I opted to get the newest best gas mileage car that I could stand to drive rather than basically trade in my truck for an extended cab with a couple less miles on it.

Atm I'm just happy seeing how fast I can take a corner, havent under steered yet :laugh:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Oooooh Kia tech info kicks ass! Plus rep on that one Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hmmmmmm, the interwebz tells me there is a clip on the top of the a-pillars that you have to break everytime you take it off. This could be an issue in the near future.

Edit: sweet! Jay, you mentioned it in your build log, ill have to try taking it off on the trim side and go from there.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Yeah, it has a weird clip at the top, but you can use a small pick tool to take it off the pillar. I learned that AFTER I did mine, so mine are floating around in the garage somewhere. lol

I still don't have my amps in, so I can't comment on the charging system.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Yeah, it has a weird clip at the top, but you can use a small pick tool to take it off the pillar. I learned that AFTER I did mine, so mine are floating around in the garage somewhere. lol
> 
> I still don't have my amps in, so I can't comment on the charging system.


So there is something else holding them in at the top if I happen to break the damn things?


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Not sure exactly what you mean. I may have damaged mine...so if I had to do it all over, I'd push down the locking tab and slide the pillar side of the clip off of the pillar. That's the best way to do it.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Not sure exactly what you mean. I may have damaged mine...so if I had to do it all over, I'd push down the locking tab and slide the pillar side of the clip off of the pillar. That's the best way to do it.
> 
> Jay


Thanks I will give that a shot tomorrow, that is if my 1 year old is as content crawling around the back seat as she was today


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

35 square feet of knukonceptz kolossus is in the mail. Might as well get the cld down while I have the car apart to run wires.

I still need speakers. But the $430 water bill I just got will make that a no go this month. I had a broken pipe and took 25 minutes to find the shutoff, it was not where you would expect it. Plus I had my 12 year old overflow a toilet for 6 hours on the second floor of our house, all on the same water bill. I'm just glad I was a carpenter and didn't have to pay someone to fix all that... Also why I hadn't been on here in a while.


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Dang, my wife and Nanny were home when our downstairs toilet overflowed. By the time it was discovered, we had $35,000 in damages downstairs. As far as that water bill, eeeekk.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I was soooo lucky with the overflow. The water went perfectly into the hvac vent straight down into the crawlspace and the corner piece fell right off. So all that damn water went straight under the house. 2 sheets of drywall a sheet of osb underlayment some linoleum and a couple days work and that was fixed.

Plus I got so many brownie points from my wife for not flipping my lid that life was pretty damn sweet for a while. You would think after 4 years she would know I don't get angry like that. She just has this irrational fear, poor thing could hardly even speak when she was telling me what happened.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, so I got my Metra 95-7353CH dash kit a couple days ago and got my wiring harness today. I was able to get everything all hooked up this morinng before my daughter woke. Im not a huge fan of how it looks. Single din's never quite fit in newer cars and the huge recess around it certainly could have been contoured in. But its not like I didnt see pictures of the thing before i bought it. Im seriously debating running the stock headunit once my DSP arrives just for looks. The Dsp-88r supposedly has a leveling/unequalization function, we will see how well that works out. Im looking for a reverse harness for the stock headunit, i would love to not have to tap into the factory harness, any good ideas on that would be greatly appreciated.

Perhaps a touch screen double din would look a little better, tho those cost money, or some body filler to contour that it a little more. 










I have a few pics of how the dash kit goes together that I will post up sometime tomorrow when I can get them off my other phone.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Just ordered a pair of Dayton rs100's a bunch of tech flex some more shrink tube (as if i needed more) and some xt60 disconnects.

Now when I get the time I can wire her up right 

Ok someone tell me to stop spending money.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Yeah, I'm not loving that dash kit either. First time I've seen it "in person."

Bummer about the house stuff.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Yeah, I'm not loving that dash kit either. First time I've seen it "in person."
> 
> Bummer about the house stuff.
> 
> Jay


Yeah, Ill try my luck with the stock non UVO and the DSP. It doesnt help that the "BLACK" dash kit isnt black.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I'm pretty happy with my UVO radio. It's the biggest deterrent to me changing the radio. It does everything! lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Decided to punt on the the sub box/false floor. Just couldnt live with the 1/2 inch i used on the top. I am also having some really strange output characteristics with the subs. Could be box volume could be some strange loading back there. I seem to hear 2 peaks. I will get an extension cable for my mic and give it a few reads before I do anything but either way the top will be replaced with MDf.... if i can figure out how to get a full sheet home in either a Sorento or a Rio :laugh:

Things I have ordered have slowly been showing up and I cant wait for the big group shot of all my new crap. On a side note, my brother in law gave me a Nikon D60 SLR he had "laying around". It should be fun to take some real pictures.

No real progress this weekend. But we all know how that goes.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Thrashed on the pillars tonight after my wife got off work. I will say its really nice being able to take the whole pillar out and work on a work bench. Though I am reminded that I haven't a done any real glass in years. My center console didn't really count. Pretty damn proud of myself atm. We will see how the faces of the pods turn out.

Pics tomorrow, sleep tonight...


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## mires (Mar 5, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> Pics tomorrow, sleep tonight...


I think you have that backwards. Sleep can wait


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I built mine in the car, because I was worried that the pieces would flex a little out of the car and not fit back in right. I hope it works out for you, since after hearing the L3se's inthe CTS-V Wagon I just did, I may change up my front stage and I'll need to build new pods (again.)

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Jay, you got me scared enough that I had to go out and check this morning. Luckily it all works out. Laying in the car to top does want to come away about a 16th, but that is just gravity more than anything and will fix itself once they are installed.

Crappy phone pic as a teaser, quickly shaped and a couple bubbles ground out. More to come.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Jay, you got me scared enough that I had to go out and check this morning. Luckily it all works out. Laying in the car to top does want to come away about a 16th, but that is just gravity more than anything and will fix itself once they are installed.
> 
> Crappy phone pic as a teaser, quickly shaped and a couple bubbles ground out. More to come.


Yeah, that wasn't my intent. I'm just OCD like that. I wish I could have found a decent price on some base model pillars. But since I built my pods to fit around the stock tweeters, I'm entertaining leaving the stock system intact so I can switch back and forth for demo purposes. Knowing that they came out that close means the next set won't have to be built in the car. Yay!

Jay


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## rdubbs (Sep 26, 2012)

Looks great so far!  in for the rest of the progress


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Yeah, that wasn't my intent. I'm just OCD like that. I wish I could have found a decent price on some base model pillars. But since I built my pods to fit around the stock tweeters, I'm entertaining leaving the stock system intact so I can switch back and forth for demo purposes. Knowing that they came out that close means the next set won't have to be built in the car. Yay!
> 
> Jay


Seriously wishing I had setup the boundries like you had however. I dont have a clear picture in my head how I am going to transition from what i have to the front face. But I will figure it out.

I would be a little scared molding the whole thing to the pillar, I notice that the bottom does have to flex where the dash and windshield meet when you are putting them back in. Had I made them one piece and rigid im sure it would have given me fits.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Unfortunately the other pics will have to wait till tomorrow. My wife changed the camera to take .nef files. So im on a hospital computer atm with 2 gigs worth of unreadable pictures.

I did get the DSP-88r today, and took a bunch of unboxing pics that I will post up.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Strangely, I went back and looked at my build, and apparently the second set didn't get build in the car. It's been so long, I forgot. lol

I didn't mold mine in, I plan to wrap them separately from the pillars but in the same material. That way if I decide to change things later, I don't have to try and split it back apart.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

On a side note I was truelly shocked that the texture on the pillars was actually texture in the plastic and not some kind of fabric. Sure as hell fooled me, looks good, feels good and cleans well.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

The texture on them is VERY similar to some grille cloth I had....
I was thinking of trying to water down some glue or something, soak the cloth in it, and then wrapping it. After it dries, I was hoping it would be rigid enough to paint so that it would match everything else. But I have no idea if it would work, it was just a thought.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I have been debating coverings as well. You might be on the right track wanting to cover the pillars in the same material.

The glue isn't a horrible idea. Sitting here trying to figure out what you would use for that, something that would handle being thinned out.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

White Elemer's glue? I was thinking it would be like paper mache.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah elmers glue and some water would work.

I was thinking that there is enough of a gap between the pillar edges and the metal that I might just stretch some grill cloth and ca glue it on the back side. Ill be honest tho, I have never messed with grill cloth.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, a few pics I took while starting on my pillars. Its not the cleanest layup I have ever done, but it has been about 8 years since I have done any real fiberglass. I mixed too small a batch to complete the first pillar and I also mixed it a little too hot considering is was a dry sunny 80 degree day. Live and learn and next time I will plan a little better.

First a pic of the backside of the pillar, there are two clips, one at the top one more central and a hook at the bottom of the pillar that slides into a corresponding lip in the dash. It was easy enough to pry the pillar away at the top loosen the two clips and proceed to pull the whole thing toward the rear of the car to get the “hook” out. Unfortunately I wasn’t able to save the black clip on the first pillar I pulled but I did on the second. Luckily they are not used to hold the pillar on.










Here is the black clip popped out… it does not go back into place










It is very nice that the whole cavity including the bottom comes out in one piece, also the bottom and the plastic that covers the gap between the pillar and the window can simply be screwed off. Very nice engineering if you ask me. I already enjoy working on this car far more than the Silverado.



















Much as Jayinmi did with his rio pillars I started by cutting a piece of half inch play to act as a spacer between the pod and the window. I did this just to give myself a little play so I have room for whatever treatment I want for the back of the pod… you can see the back side through the window after all.










After taping everything off I cut up some strips of fiberglass chop and mixed up my resin. I also dawned my trusty rubber gloves that I stole from a box of my wife’s hair dye because this dumb ass forgot to buy some. I simply ran the strips through my resin and laid it where I wanted it. This pillar turned out ok, the first one not so much, but it is workable.










After letting thing set up, which took about 45minutes in the heat, I popped the mold out traced the boundaries I wanted and used my trusty angle grinder with a tile cutting blade to cut them into shape.










That is all I was able to accomplish Monday night. I will admit to a few things I would have done differently for anyone looking to do some fiberglass.
1:Cut more mat or chop than you think you need and plan your lay up
2:Have more than one pair of gloves, the first pair will get sticky and start to piss you off
3:Mix a larger batch of resin than you think you need, going back to mix more with those sticky gloves is no fun
4lan out your margins carefully and leave yourself something for reference. I ended up not laying enough around the edges and had to cut back farther than I would have liked. Although I have a plan for that, it will have to wait however


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

A few pics of my unboxing of the PPI DSP-88r. I of course did not upload the pics of the actual unit, but we all know what it looks like.














































The controller, with a pack of smokes to reference size



















The controller cable










The wiring harness. There is also a wiring diagram sticker on the bottom of the unit...pic has yet to be found










The usb cable










I will find the pics of the unit or take more and post em up. I also have a pic of the “manual” it is pretty useless but I have no real complaints yet. I will post my thoughts once I get things hooked up. Im certainly wanting to test output voltage as I dont believe the specs are posted anywhere to find.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> First a pic of the backside of the pillar, there are two clips, one at the top one more central and a hook at the bottom of the pillar that slides into a corresponding lip in the dash. It was easy enough to pry the pillar away at the top loosen the two clips and proceed to pull the whole thing toward the rear of the car to get the “hook” out. Unfortunately I wasn’t able to save the black clip on the first pillar I pulled but I did on the second. Luckily they are not used to hold the pillar on.


I think I popped the top of the pillar out on mine and then used my wire crimpers to twist the black clip so it would come off of the pillar...I think, but that seems right.











Here is the black clip popped out… it does not go back into place










It is very nice that the whole cavity including the bottom comes out in one piece, also the bottom and the plastic that covers the gap between the pillar and the window can simply be screwed off. Very nice engineering if you ask me. I already enjoy working on this car far more than the Silverado.



















Much as Jayinmi did with his rio pillars I started by cutting a piece of half inch play to act as a spacer between the pod and the window. I did this just to give myself a little play so I have room for whatever treatment I want for the back of the pod… you can see the back side through the window after all.










After taping everything off I cut up some strips of fiberglass chop and mixed up my resin. I also dawned my trusty rubber gloves that I stole from a box of my wife’s hair dye because this dumb ass forgot to buy some. I simply ran the strips through my resin and laid it where I wanted it. This pillar turned out ok, the first one not so much, but it is workable.








[/quote]

I usually rip the mat into small pieces...squares, "circles," etc. then I use a piece of glass (like window glass, not fiberglass) or a piece of wood with tin foil on it and wet it out first with a 2" chip brush. Then I apply it to the area until it's covered at least well enough to get out of the area I am fiberglassing. Works pretty well for me.




REGULARCAB said:


> After letting thing set up, which took about 45minutes in the heat, I popped the mold out traced the boundaries I wanted and used my trusty angle grinder with a tile cutting blade to cut them into shape.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Agreed! lol



REGULARCAB said:


> 3:Mix a larger batch of resin than you think you need, going back to mix more with those sticky gloves is no fun


I usually go a little less than I think I need so I don't waste a bunch of resin. Wetting it out first seems to save resin also.



REGULARCAB said:


> 4lan out your margins carefully and leave yourself something for reference. I ended up not laying enough around the edges and had to cut back farther than I would have liked. Although I have a plan for that, it will have to wait however


I usually draw the basic shape with a sharpie before glassing so it shows though the glass. If I do a couple of layers I go over it again just to make sure. If you get within like 1/4" of where you want to be, you can always build the pod and use duraglass (or equivalent) to blend the edges and then regular gold body filler to smooth it out.

I would definitely do mine a little differently. They would be easier to build, but I wanted them to be heavy so they wouldn't vibrate, which is why I used so much fiberglass reinforced filler. Not recommended. lol

Nice progress.

I've been very happy with the way the car is put together. Like most asian cars, the construction makes sense, the clips generally don't break, go back together like it came apart and is relatively simple to figure out.

Kiatechinfo.com helps alot too. lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Wetting it out first would have saved me some resin and mostlikely would have kept me from having pools, that is a good tip. I also feel I cut the mat a little too large for some areas.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Who wants to swing by lowes and bring me a full sheet of MDF?  I cant stand looking at my false floor anymore and my perforated metal screen came in today.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Big update tomorrow! I will upload it all in the evening while at work. Now I guess it's time to enjoy the fireworks. After a hot day and a ton of work this non drinker wants a big ole beer, maybe a rum n coke, there has to be some in the back of a cupboard somewhere.
:beerchug::beerchug::beerchug::beerchug::beerchug:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Long day yesterday. I decided since everyone in my neighborhood was making noise I would just work on my car until I passed out. First I laid down Knu Konceptz Kolossus in the spare tire well and behind all the plastic panels in the trunk (just realized I forgot the hatch and its panel). I would say 50% coverage? I pulled my false floor from the trunk and sprayed it black, for giggles, I then started off running power wire, I saved the knu 0 gauge from my truck as well as the xscorpion distribution blocks.










Battery to main fuse. 










Run behind the driver kick panel and down under the sill panels.










Here is the distribution block under the rear seat. (im iffy on this decision, but at least there is no copper showing). 










After running power, it was time to run some speaker wire for the 3-way that will be going in. My plan was to only ever have to run speaker wire in this car once. I measured out my length cut 6 pieces and soldered on xt60 plugs to one end. You will notice my fancy labeling scheme, it’s a sharpie brand tool, very hush hush :laugh:










I then gathered the cables into left and right (3 channels each) and spent the better part of an hour worming the wires through some 3/8 techflex. I will point out it was branded clean cut on amazon.com, it still unraveled when cut. Here is a finished cable.










Both cabled where then run from the trunk to the passenger kick panel, on the opposite side of the car from the power wire, where they will be connected to runs going to each speaker (once I get those all sorted out). Love how much room is under the sill panels.

















You will notice the insulation behind the panels in the trunk, because why not.










Here is my daughter helping me put the panels back in.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Next up was the false floor. Again, I just set my trunk carpet on a piece of ¾ mdf, marked it, and cut it with a jigsaw. Here it is getting mocked up for the grill.










I then cut my hole and used my router to cut a little relief so the grill would sit flush.









Set the grill in the hole and stapled her down. Here she is sitting in the trunk.









Everything was carpeted and set in the trunk, nice and stealth.










At least it covers up this mess. I will have to wait for next weekend to clean that all up.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

After a little dinner it was time start work on the pillar pods. Pretty familiar practice here; cut some baffles, get out the hot glue gun and some dowels, try out your placement, swear a bunch. What a pain but finally I got it. Then I stretched an old shirt over the whole thing, remembering to staple it down around the baffle where it would have pulled off the spray glue once I started glassing.










After that set up I placed a fair amount of cld inside the pods and began the process of using fiberglass reinforced body filler to get a little nicer shape. I will say, get it at just the right time before it goes off and this stuff is very easy to sand down. Here is where it sat before bedtime.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

And as promised, those pics of the DSP-88R and also the Vifa xt25 and Dayton RS100 I took while I was sizing them up.

PPI DSP-88R:


























Vifa XT25:


















Dayton RS100-4:


----------



## WhereAmEye? (Jun 17, 2013)

REGULARCAB said:


> Run behind the driver kick panel and down under the sill panels.


Do you usually work in business wear  ? Good job and happy late Independence Day!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

WhereAmEye? said:


> Do you usually work in business wear  ? Good job and happy late Independence Day!


Its how the cool kids do it. Nah I forgot that pic so I took it as I was leaving for work.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Those are the same tweeters I have! lol Mine have still never seen power after almost 4 years. Soon, tho.

I'm going to have to route my wires differently, because I tucked the factory harnesses in the kicks up and around the speakers, and I don't have enough room left for 1/0 or thr 3 runs of KnuKonceptz OFC 12ga speaker wire...thinking of running them up the center of the car.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Those are the same tweeters I have! lol Mine have still never seen power after almost 4 years. Soon, tho.
> 
> I'm going to have to route my wires differently, because I tucked the factory harnesses in the kicks up and around the speakers, and I don't have enough room left for 1/0 or thr 3 runs of KnuKonceptz OFC 12ga speaker wire...thinking of running them up the center of the car.
> 
> Jay


Yeah i dont know what I would do if I couldn't use the sill plates. I told myself there will be no wires running under the carpet in this build. I can see the speaker wires under there, and there is a big channel of space under the center console, I have not had the front piece disconnected from the dash however.

I need to figure out how im going to tap into the factory headunit. I hate cutting stock wires, may tap into the rears on the speaker side of the plug in the door and run it back out the doors to the DSP.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Those are the same tweeters I have! lol Mine have still never seen power after almost 4 years.


Ill let ya know how they sound


----------



## WhereAmEye? (Jun 17, 2013)

REGULARCAB said:


> Yeah i dont know what I would do if I couldn't use the sill plates. I told myself there will be no wires running under the carpet in this build. I can see the speaker wires under there, and there is a big channel of space under the center console, I have not had the front piece disconnected from the dash however.
> 
> I need to figure out how im going to tap into the factory headunit. I hate cutting stock wires, may tap into the rears on the speaker side of the plug in the door and run it back out the doors to the DSP.


I don't know how much is out for this car in terms of harnesses but I know for my old truck I put in a simple sub + mono amp to the stock head unit by using a male and female harness to extend the stock harness right before plugging into the radio. Easily removable down the road and no cutting required


----------



## WhereAmEye? (Jun 17, 2013)

Factory Radio Amp Amplifier Interface Install Adapter Wiring Wire Harness Cable | eBay
Like this


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

WhereAmEye? said:


> I don't know how much is out for this car in terms of harnesses but I know for my old truck I put in a simple sub + mono amp to the stock head unit by using a male and female harness to extend the stock harness right before plugging into the radio. Easily removable down the road and no cutting required


Yeah, i have been looking for one but no luck so far.


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## DBlevel (Oct 6, 2006)

Sub'd

I want to see how those 8" sound......

Besides.....I like the Rio. I like it so far!!


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Yeah i dont know what I would do if I couldn't use the sill plates. I told myself there will be no wires running under the carpet in this build. I can see the speaker wires under there, and there is a big channel of space under the center console, I have not had the front piece disconnected from the dash however.
> 
> I need to figure out how im going to tap into the factory headunit. I hate cutting stock wires, may tap into the rears on the speaker side of the plug in the door and run it back out the doors to the DSP.


You'll want to grab the front speakers for the DSP if your car has BT hands free, otherwise it won't work anymore.

How about making a T harness out of these:

Metra Online

and

Metra Online

Jay


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> You'll want to grab the front speakers for the DSP if your car has BT hands free, otherwise it won't work anymore.
> 
> How about making a T harness out of these:
> 
> ...


Oh snap!!! I didnt figure anyone made a harness that plugs into the OE radio. :bowdown:


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I know where to find all kinds of things for this car. LOL. I've been looking since I got it, and usually end up pointing people to various things in some of the FB groups/Forums I'm on. I feel like I should just put it all together and start a Kia Rio Only store. haha

Glad to help.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I know where to find all kinds of things for this car.


How about interior light replacements? In red


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

DBlevel said:


> Sub'd
> 
> I want to see how those 8" sound......
> 
> Besides.....I like the Rio. I like it so far!!


Thanks! Trying not to make any of the dumb mistakes I did with the silverado.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> How about interior light replacements? In red


Here you go:

exLED Interior LED Lamp Module for All New Pride (2011~)

In the color section you can choose red.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Here you go:
> 
> exLED Interior LED Lamp Module for All New Pride (2011~)
> 
> ...


Those are bad ass. Thanks for the link.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I think ExLEDshop has a US website too, but I don't think they had them there last time I looked.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Since you've been making so much progress, I had to go clean out my car and pull the center console. Thanks. lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Since you've been making so much progress, I had to go clean out my car and pull the center console. Thanks. lol
> 
> Jay


You actually able to get the whole console out? I couldn't even figure out how to get off those two connectors on the side closest to the dash. I didn't spend much time looking.

Now its time for me to get my butt over to Kia tech info and figure where the hell I can get switched power for my DSP, at least it has remote outs, tho with high level in's it would be nice to have signal auto sensing.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

It would appear there is a remote power for the antenna, should be easy enough to incorporate into my t-harness once everything gets here on Wednesday.

Then I can get that ugly ass dash kit out, and sell my Pioneer x7500s.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I'd verify that antenna wire first. It might be in the Metra harnesses, but I don't know if it's on our cars, and it might turn off when on other sources. If it doesn't have it, the accessory ports in the center console are switched accessory...

I've also been thinking of tapping the window switch feed to power the radio, because it appears to be retained accessory power (stays on till the doors open.) You might have noticed the radio shuts off, but the windows still work after the key is off. I haven't verified how long this is so, however, just something I was considering.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I will certainly verify it. The diagram for the non uvo radio states pin 18a is power supply for the antenna and "condition" is acc. A bit ambiguous, we shall see


----------



## Bret Triano (May 16, 2014)

REGULARCAB said:


> I then gathered the cables into left and right (3 channels each) and spent the better part of an hour worming the wires through some 3/8 techflex. I will point out it was branded clean cut on amazon.com, it still unraveled when cut. Here is a finished cable.


Oh my goodness this is genius, you better bet I'm gonna do this on my next install. I love this build log I'm learning so many little tricks.  Can't wait to see more.

-Bret


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Bret Triano said:


> Oh my goodness this is genius, you better bet I'm gonna do this on my next install. I love this build log I'm learning so many little tricks.  Can't wait to see more.
> 
> -Bret


Thanks! The speaker cables are one of my favorite parts. I probably ran new cable everytime I changed a speaker or amp in my Silverado. Granted in that truck you just pull a kick and a sill panel and you are good to start laying wire.

I still need to get wire from that passenger kick panel to both doors and up to the sail windows. I'll be cussing at the molex plugs in the door I'm sure.

Everything should be here Wednesday (midbass and wire harnesses). We go on vacation next weekend then I was planning on having the whole week off to work on my car, but my wife got a huge promotion at work so she will have to go in all next week.

Oh well I guess a little delay in the build is worth it. I finally have my sugar momma :laugh:


----------



## Bret Triano (May 16, 2014)

REGULARCAB said:


> I still need to get wire from that passenger kick panel to both doors and up to the sail windows.


Can you be sure to include pics of this? I'm interested in how you're going to get everything to where it goes. 

-Bret


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Bret Triano said:


> Can you be sure to include pics of this? I'm interested in how you're going to get everything to where it goes.
> 
> -Bret


I'll certainly take pics. Much easier taking wiring pics than fiberglassing with those sticky hands. I'll post up the good the bad and the ugly, I'm going into it assuming it will be a pita. I will also be deadening the door while I am in there.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Looking at my amp rack on a smoke break. I really should carpet that thing. I don't care if it gets covered up, I know it is there and I may as well do it before I get all the wires in.


----------



## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

Should also quit smoking. I quit, and I'm much better in bed, which I didn't even think was possible.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

sirbOOm said:


> Should also quit smoking. I quit, and I'm much better in bed, which I didn't even think was possible.


Wait wait wait. Are you saying smoking is bad for me?


----------



## mires (Mar 5, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> Wait wait wait. Are you saying smoking is bad for me?


I loved when people used to tell me smoking was bad for me like I had no idea. They were usually the same people that were 100 lbs. overweight stuffing their faces with fast food twice a day. I did eventually quit and I have to admit, I don't feel any better at all. Just more stressed. Maybe not the popular viewpoint but it's the truth. 

BTW, I know that isn't what Sirboom was doing. I know he was only kidding.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Oh i have no issue with peoples opinions on smoking. I work in a hospital where every nurse thinks they are my mother (mainly because I have known them all since i was 5), I hear it 300 times a day.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, I had debated not even posting this pic today because in all honesty Im just not sure I like the way they look, I got impatient and threw some trunk liner on my pillar pods. Its easy enough to rip off that carpet and try another material, something MUCH lighter and sand down those fat edges maybe. But here it is, full disclosure and everything.


----------



## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

Quitting smoking made my PP like 2 inches bigger... and ended global warming. (Or gave me more money for car audio.)

Dash pods... concept great, trunk liner not perm I hope. Version two can wrap around the pillar a bit. I'd focus on tuning now... but that's just me.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Im eyeing some replacement pillars so I can mold the whole thing in. Would be sooo much easier than trying to make a pod look decent.

No, trunk liner isnt permanent.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Jay, you ever get a line on a-pillars for these cars?


Well, I was looking on Kiapartsoverstock, and apparently, the left side pillar is no longer available (the base level one.) The right one is like $18. When I googled it and looked at a couple other sites, any that didn't say "No Longer Available," said that the left side pillar was $50-60. Say wha?

Thus, why I worked around my tweeters. 
I've seen a couple of wrecked late model Rios on eBay tho. They might have them.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Well, I was looking on Kiapartsoverstock, and apparently, the left side pillar is no longer available (the base level one.) The right one is like $18. When I googled it and looked at a couple other sites, any that didn't say "No Longer Available," said that the left side pillar was $50-60. Say wha?
> 
> Thus, why I worked around my tweeters.
> I've seen a couple of wrecked late model Rios on eBay tho. They might have them.
> ...


Thanks for looking. I did see a few people on kia-forums.com ordered from kiastuff.com, so i said the hell with it and ordered a left and right w/o tweeter. Came to $89 we will see if I get screwed. Ill let ya know. Those pods came out no bueno. I could do a ton of work to blend em in better but im also thinking the tweeters are kicked in a little far for my tastes. Round two will be much better 

Now to figure out what I want to wrap an entire pillar in.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Luckily I have a metric ton of resin, duraglass, and filler left.... okay really just half of what I bought.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Thanks for looking. I did see a few people on kia-forums.com ordered from kiastuff.com, so i said the hell with it and ordered a left and right w/o tweeter. Came to $89 we will see if I get screwed. Ill let ya know. Those pods came out no bueno. I could do a ton of work to blend em in better but im also thinking the tweeters are kicked in a little far for my tastes. Round two will be much better
> 
> Now to figure out what I want to wrap an entire pillar in.


I just don't understand why the right side is $18, and left is $56 for the same thing? I'm almost inclined to buy them with the tweeter and then cut the tweeter grill off and fill it in before wrapping it in another material.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I just don't understand why the right side is $18, and left is $56 for the same thing? I'm almost inclined to buy them with the tweeter and then cut the tweeter grill off and fill it in before wrapping it in another material.
> 
> Jay


Yeah, I am pretty skeptical on the price as well. Though everywhere I looked the pillars with the tweeter were both $56. Hopefully I wont have to wait for some poor bastard floating on a pallet to row all the way from Korea to get these things. :laugh:

I certainly want to plan everything out better this time around and not f up these pillars. Time to read every damn pillar window build log I can find.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

ErinH and Papasin both have good pillar window builds in their build threads.

I looked for a while and kept thinking the $18 part must not be what I want...the dealer wants $70!

Everything I've had shipped from Korea arrived in a relative timely manner.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I have a problem, im one of those obsessive brooding types when it comes to my projects. I just have to tell myself "brian, you dont actually know if those pillars will come and you dont know if they are the right color, dont start glassing when you get home at midnight"


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Jesus, looking at Erin's older build log. How many times did he redo those pillars? Lots of good info.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Im loving the aluminum tape method that erin showed on his pillars. I was having the hardest time trying to figure out how to wrap the mold when the material would be pulled both behind and in front of the baffle. Using the tape then glassing from the back to get your shape is a damn good idea.


----------



## Bret Triano (May 16, 2014)

oh those dash pods *gouges out eyes*

you can do better, please do better 

-Bret

they ain't that bad just a little to round for my tastes


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yup like I said, no bueno. I actually knew the second I cut the back piece I molded in that it just wasnt going to look right. Luckily new pillars are in the works. But hey, first attempt at any fiberglass above the dash, and now I have a clearer plan of what I want and what sure as hell isn't going to work.

No experience, even with a bad result, is a bad experience.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Wiring harnesses, a couple short RCA's and my RS180's will be here tomorrow. At least Ill be able to solder up those harnesses when I get home tomorrow night. I need something to do while I wait for those pillars. Ive been debating redoing the whole sub box false floor, I need something to keep me out of trouble


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Is it sad that since my rs-180's came to the door without my wife noticing that I really want to order some new amps now? 

Those bk8004's are so damn big. Im debating going with 2 P900.4's or GM-D8604's. basically the same price. The pioneers would match the mono amp that im keeping under drivers seat. The PPI's would match the dsp and have half again more power. Hmmmmm....


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I found a couple of wrecked UB (internal designation for out cars) Rios on eBay, and need to call one of the places to see if they still have the pillars out of the car they were selling some other stuff off of. 

I found 3, one had tweeters, one was tan and one appeared to be the right color.

I also just spent about 45 minutes braiding the wire for the analog signal from the HU to the BitOne. And that was just the left side.  
Papasin suggested I shouldn't braid them because of magnetic fields, and that I should just twist them with a drill...because that is how his wife had to do it on something that was being sent in to space. And if it's better for something that needs to work millions of miles away, it should be better for my audio signal run, right? But it just looks so nice braided. lol

Nice that we have NASA smart people on this board, isn't it?! lol

So, I'm making progress, but not as much as you! haha


Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Sweet, thanks for the info. Ill have to get to twisting then, though I have always wondered how do you keep it twisted?

I wasnt sure on the coloring of the pillars. They had black and tan and just assumed that the "tan" must be the grey I have. No huge issue there, I will get the entire pillar wrapped I just have to figure out what material and color to use.

If you end up getting pillars for like $40 dont tell me, cuz ill cut you


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> If you end up getting pillars for like $40 dont tell me, cuz ill cut you


Nah, I wouldn't pay that much. 

If you twist them with a drill, this is what I do...

Clamp one end in a vice. Other end goes in the drill (obviously). Twist them up pretty tight, and before you release the chuck, pull toward you. You'll feel the wire stretch some. Don't pull too hard or it will break at the vise and you'll fall backward. When you release the chuck it will unwind a little but not nearly as much as if you didn't stretch it first. I will hold it's "shape" fine after that.

Maybe cut a couple of sets of wires about 6' long to practice on, but you should get the idea. I see a lot of guys not twist it tight enough and it will unravel over a short period of time.

Jay


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Nah, I wouldn't pay that much.
> 
> If you twist them with a drill, this is what I do...
> 
> ...


Ahhh its the pull that I was missing. Thanks for the info. Grandma is coming bright and early to take my daughter for the day, If i have the energy when i get home at midnight I may do a little work then sleep in.


----------



## Bret Triano (May 16, 2014)

regarding the ppi900.4 

I have the amp and I have a complaint about it. Towards the end of me using it (my car was totaled) every now and then it would randomly cut out and after i lowered the volume it would kick back on. I have no idea what it is but it happened probably 3 times within 2 months. I'm going to use it on my next build because I like it but that cutting out has kept me from buying another, I'm a little concerned about its lifespan. 

Other than that i like the amp alot, although it is my first amp soooooo my word doesnt mean too much in that department ;D

-Bret


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hmmmmm going on day three for my pillar order, the payment was take out the next morning but my order still shows processing. Perhaps I just have high expectations as I usually work with amazon and the like.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I'm usually happy if I get anything I order from most places inside of a week.

Jay


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I'm usually happy if I get anything I order from most places inside of a week.
> 
> Jay


Yeah, maybe im just impatient. But they need to ship those damn things already.

Ive been looking at the dimensions I took of the spare tire area, and the box mikey7182 helped design for my silverado and thinking I wanna run the 2 GTO804's ported. Plus it would just give me a reason to redo the whole thing.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Back from vacation. Front doors and hatch sound deadened last night, speaker rings cut and coated for the rs180's. I'll get pics up at nap time when I don't have a 1 year old wacking my keyboard.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Sorry guys no pics but I did get a chance to call kiastuff about my pillars. Wayne was very nice and knew my order off the top of his head. He did say that all but one warehouse was out of stock when he put the order in. He said he would check then get back to me. 5 min later he called me back and said he just received the pillars and I will get a tracking number today when they are shipped. Very nice guy but seems a lil shady that it just so happens that they get the items when I call. Prolly had low stock and are seeing who is willing to wait for them. Either way I should have them before long.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Well screw me sideways!!!! The rs180's don't fit in the doors.

I measured and everything. I guess I measured wrong :blush: Another 1/4 inch of depth and I would be golden. Pretty deflated at the moment, two total screw ups in a row. Guess I will sell the 180's or keep em incase I do some kicks. Im also debating a couple smaller 4 channel amps. We shall see.

On the bright side my pillars should be here next Wednesday. Hopefully round two will turn out better.

Pics of the progress I did make will have to wait.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

That sucks! I had my doors off a while ago just to see what was up, and since the factory speakers were like 5.25" (or maybe even a small 6") I decided to go kicks since I had my RS180's left over from my Genesis Coupe. How long have you had them? If you got them from PE, they have a 45 day return policy and you might be able to get some RS150's instead? Tho, I'm not sure of the depth difference.

Jay


----------



## cajunner (Apr 13, 2007)

REGULARCAB said:


> Well screw me sideways!!!! The rs180's don't fit in the doors.
> 
> I measured and everything. I guess I measured wrong :blush: Another 1/4 inch of depth and I would be golden. Pretty deflated at the moment, two total screw ups in a row. Guess I will sell the 180's or keep em incase I do some kicks. Im also debating a couple smaller 4 channel amps. We shall see.
> 
> ...


1/4"?

really?

I have a sledge that makes a 1/4" of clearance in it's sleep...


:surprised:


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah that 1/4 inch is driving me nuts. But I guess I'm in the market for some new midbass. I will check out the smaller Daytons. Or something with a neo motor perhaps. The area of the 7 was perfect it was just the depth. Something 2.5 inches deep will give me wiggle room both directions.

Was talking to a neighbor that has a set of type r comps he is willing to sell. I haven't taken a look at em but he at least doesn't seem like the type that would beat the hell out of his things. We will see. Its a good price for the comps, just not sure its the midbass that I really want.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

What about making a spacer between the door shell and the window track? I've done that before and it worked out fine. Just a thought.

Jay


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> What about making a spacer between the door shell and the window track? I've done that before and it worked out fine. Just a thought.
> 
> Jay


Ive been seriously debating doing the rs180s in some kicks, because its like never been done before :laugh:

Seriously tho Im leaning towards it. That or finding a way to safely keep the window from rolling all the way down, it only sticks up about 3/4 of an inch to completely clear the hole. 

I would be worried about the window shifting as it goes down/up if i made a spacer. A 1/4 inch would do it, but I would really like about a half inch to be safe.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, so here is the progress I made in the evenings after I got back from vacation. I will include it all, the good the bad and the frustrating. First on the list was to make some baffles for my lovely Dayton RS180s. I removed the stock speaker in the front door and used that as a template to make the baffles, unfortunately the construction of the stock speaker made it very hard to follow with a router. After the first one was cut I used that as a template to cut the other three. Stock spacer stuck out just under an inch and a half from the door so two pieces of ¾ per side.

Using the first baffle to route out the other two, pieces where held down with screws through the mounting holes that I would need. I made a super rough cut with the jigsaw so the router didn't have to work so hard.










Lots of mdf dust, I made sure to inhale as much of it as possible.










Getting ready for the truck bed coating, Duplicolor in the blue can. I know HDPE is preferred but im certainly glad I didn’t spend the money yet, more on that later.










Truck bed coating was dry enough to work with overnight.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Deadening the hatch that I had forgotten to do, hey it was above me when I was working on the trunk. I would have done a little cleaner job but both pieces where “scraps” from doing the doors. Here is a pick of the panel, some jute had to be removed, looks like it was hot melted on, it pulled off easy enough and I used some spray glue to hold it in place before re installing the panel. The metal inside the hatch got about 90% covered where I could get to.










At that point it was about 10pm and dark outside. I was working in the driveway with a lamp with the shade removed, I had to get as much alone time as possible and figured this stuff required no power tools so I worked till about 3pm. Pics are a little scarce. Here is the door panel before deadening (deadening is a verb right?)










Here she is after, I put a ton around the door pocket because things moving around in the pocket always made a horrible sound.










Front door before deadening.










I put a full layer of KnuKonceptz Kolossus on the outer door panel, then everywhere there wasn’t wiring attached to the backside of the inner door panel. Small pieces where then used on the inner door panel for fitment issues and to keep everything serviceable. Knu was also placed over the speaker opening, cut and wrapped around to the inside, I payed special attention to the area around the speaker opening. Then fatmat was used to seal up the holes, I had it and I wasn’t going to waste the Knu, I just wanted something that would seal nicely. After all was said and done I ended up having about 10 sheets of Knu left, I’m sure I will find a use. I didn’t do the rear doors, and most likely will not do the floors. I eventually want to do CCF and MLV, but that will have to wait a bit.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Now, the fight to get wires into the doors. I needed two sets one for the midbass and one to get the stock headunit signal back out of the door. There was no good place other than right behind the headunit to tap into, and I refused to use t connectors.

The molex plug come off fairly easily, there is a plastic tab that you pull straight up then pull the plug loose.










Zero room in the molex connector for some wires.










Screw this im going to do something I know I can accomplish, techflexing the wires to go into the doors. 










So I had to make a decision, since the molex connector was a no go I decided to drill a hole just under the molex connector and us a grommet, then fish the wire through the boot on the door side. Drilling a hole sounds easy enough right? Wrong, I had no way to get in there so I proceeded to take off the lower part of the drivers’ side dash to give me a little more room.
Start by prying off the the panel on dash between the dash and the door.










This will reveal 2 screws that will have to be removed.



















Next remove the fuse panel cover under the dash and use a 10mm socket to remove that bolt, then a screw on the other side near the center console. Then it is just a few clips and the whole thing will pop off.



















Well that gained me absolutely nothing.










The passenger side was a little more difficult, the entire glove box was in the way. I attempted to remove it, again I got nowhere. None the less I was able to get a hole in the driver’s side just under the molex connector and a little lower on the passenger’s side. My wires where fished through some rubber grommets and into the door. I then soldered, heat shrunk, and felt taped the stock speaker wires to my new leads. Everything was held down and out of way with come CLD. Here is a little progress shot.










That is when the story turned bad again. After bolting my new baffles to the door fitting up the rs180’s and dry fitting the door card…. They don’t fit, they are too thick. I took a bunch of measurements but it was about 2am again and dark outside, once I get a good (calm) time to take another look I will see if I can massage them in. It is not looking hope full however, I would appear to need a ¼ inch of depth that just isn’t there.
Punt on the door speakers, pillars will be here next Wednesday so I will be able to work on those and figure out what to do until then. 

And I will grab some shots of what the wires look like going from the car to the door.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Lots of progress and not a thing buttoned up. I think it is time for a to do list. In no particular order, because that's how I roll.

1: find an acc wire and run it to the back of the car for a remote turn on
2:mount the DSP-88r control display under the usb ports in the dash above the center console and run the control wire
3:run the usb cable from the DSP-88r to the center console, something stealth but handy.
4:finish running speaker wire from the passenger kick to all 6 speaker locations, xt60's on one end and female disconnects on the speaker side.
5: Do something about the tire noise coming from the rear wheel wells
6:Connect the speaker runs to the barrier strips then to the PPIs
7:Run RCA's from the DSP-88r to the PPIs on the amp rack and Pioneer Mono under the front seat.
8:Carpet the amp rack (prolly before more wiring)
9:Run the stock headunit signal to the DSP-88r
10:Figure out my midbass drivers, different drivers or kickpanels
11:Round 2 on the pillars

Im sure im forgetting something but that should keep me busy for a while. Most of the wiring should only take a few uninterrupted hours, the pillars and midbasses are another story.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> There was no good place other than right behind the headunit to tap into, and I refused to use t connectors.


I thought you had ordered male/female harnesses to make a T-harness behind the HU?


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I thought you had ordered male/female harnesses to make a T-harness behind the HU?


The female harness unfortunately was missing a ton of wires that the stock unit needed.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> The female harness unfortunately was missing a ton of wires that the stock unit needed.


Weird. Usually they come with every pin filled.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

The harness on the radio side was all full up. The two for the plug side only had acc power ground speaker wires etc. Its all good, that part is past me now at least. And the stock head unit is back in and looking sexy.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I may look into adding some pins to the harness now that Im under no self imposed time crunch. It would be a much cleaner setup.

I also had myself fairly excited about the idea of doing some kick panels. That is until last night when I got off work, got in my car, and saw the first place my left foot wanted to go... my size 14 foot. So i am in the market for some 6.5" midbasses with 2.5 inch depth. I will be keeping my eye out, I have some time however. Ive got sound playing through the stock rears to tide me over


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Yeah. I did kicks, and it's been a pain to get used to putting my foot somewhere else. I think it may be actually contributing to my recent knee pain.
I had to relocate the hood release. I'm hoping that it's worth going to kicks once I get everything in.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Yeah. I did kicks, and it's been a pain to get used to putting my foot somewhere else. I think it may be actually contributing to my recent knee pain.
> I had to relocate the hood release. I'm hoping that it's worth going to kicks once I get everything in.
> 
> Jay


In my wifes Sorento the pedals are at just the right place that anytime I drive it for more than 15min my knee screams at me.

If it makes you feel any better the second time I removed the drivers kick panel I broke the hood release latch right off... and I wasnt pulling hard just trying to feed it throught. Now I just pull the cable :laugh:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Ahhhhhh, finally a day below 80 degrees. It was 65 and overcast all day, it was amazing. I guess im a true NW guy.

I was able to get the DSP-88r controller mounted with the controller cable, and usb cable running to the trunk. Got the midbass wires hooked up to my xt60s in the passenger kick panel. Ran the signal wires to the back and cleaned up the wiring for the monoblock under the seat. All while being an amazing father, getting groceries for my wife, taking my wife out to dinner and having a long conversation with my father in law on what a good guy I am  

Pics and full descriptions to come.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> The passenger side was a little more difficult, the entire glove box was in the way. I attempted to remove it, again I got nowhere. None the less I was able to get a hole in the driver’s side just under the molex connector and a little lower on the passenger’s side. My wires where fished through some rubber grommets and into the door. I then soldered, heat shrunk, and felt taped the stock speaker wires to my new leads. Everything was held down and out of way with come CLD. Here is a little progress shot.


I just had my glovebox out the other day. You have to pop off the side of the dash, there are like 2 screws on the side. There are 3 or 4 across the bottom of the glovebox under the glovebox door. There are like 5 screws on the top (3 hold a separate panel, 2 for the latch), and I think there were like 3 screws across the back. (Going from memory here.) Then the separate piece up top has to come out first. You need to unplug the harness attached to it, and then you should be able to pop the whole glovebox out as an assembly. I started by prying the clips on the passenger side of the dash and kind of worked down and around to pop all the clips. It's actually not too bad (be careful, obviously) and affords you A LOT OF ROOM to access the area over there. lol. I almost thought about nixing a big chunk of the glovebox and doing an up front sub there. I usually keep most of my car related crap in the center console anyway. 

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

That's pretty funny, I got the screws on the side and bottom and couldnt find much more than that. So I was missing like 20 more screws.

I will say that these cars have the largest glove box I've ever seen. Hell i was thinking you could stack a pair of four channel class d's put another under the drivers seat and a dsp under the passenger seat.

Or a front sub (my wife/family would kill me). Just going from a box i had at one point there is at least .3 cubes.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Well, a Dayton RSS265HO-4 models pretty well in .3 cu ft. lol
Tho after hearing the one in Strakele's car in around .7, I'd go for as much as I can get.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Pics are coming I promise.

BTW 1 mark off for the DSP-88r, something inside the controller fracken rattles... Like anytime I accelerate. So I will be opening it up and seeing wtf it is.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

JayinMI said:


> Weird. Usually they come with every pin filled.


I just read this again, and it sounds dirty. lol

As a side thought, what about removing the pins for the front speakers from the factory plug, and removing the pins from the Metra 71 series harness, plug the Metra wires in behind the radio to the factory harness, grab signal there, and then just zip tie the factory wires to the harness in case you want to return to factory someday.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I just read this again, and it sounds dirty. lol
> 
> As a side thought, what about removing the pins for the front speakers from the factory plug, and removing the pins from the Metra 71 series harness, plug the Metra wires in behind the radio to the factory harness, grab signal there, and then just zip tie the factory wires to the harness in case you want to return to factory someday.
> 
> Jay


Now that's thinking with ur noggin. That way all I would need is to figure out how to remove the pins, and I imagine google is all over that. 

Luckily atm all I would need to do is resolder the factory speaker plugs back on. But I will certainly look into working with the pins, as an intellectual pursuet if nothing else.

My god there is a lot going on with this amp rack. But it is coming together. Almost buttoned up then its just midbasses and pillars.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Now that's thinking with ur noggin. That way all I would need is to figure out how to remove the pins, and I imagine google is all over that.
> 
> Luckily atm all I would need to do is resolder the factory speaker plugs back on. But I will certainly look into working with the pins, as an intellectual pursuet if nothing else.
> 
> My god there is a lot going on with this amp rack. But it is coming together. Almost buttoned up then its just midbasses and pillars.


I think Octave or JTAudio have done it this way, but it just occurred to me you could do it that way too.

My amp rack has 3 amps and a processor, and I still need to figure out what I'm doing with my Distro block and small fuseblock which will supply power to the Bitone and fuse the turn on lead relay I have yet to add. I'm running out of room in the spare tire well. lol


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright dsp-88r is up and running flawlessly. The controller has white leds if anyone was wondering. Just have the subwoofer and factory rears running atm.

But now my non UVO radio gives me a god damn "connection error" when trying to plug in a USB stick. Sirius cd and radio are just fine.... And I was so excited...


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

The rattle in the dsp controller was the back plate luckily. Fixed it with some silicon. 

Still working on the USB stick issue with my radio, im entertaining all options. Its happened with 2 usb sticks. I did just update to windows 8.1 on all my comps, don't have a formatted usb stick that I know worked at one point. Ill play with the formatting and such for now, as a wiring or radio issue would really piss me off. Wish I had the IPhone cable to try that out. Its time for bed though.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Both USB sticks say USB not recognized when plugged into a computer despite functioning perfectly. That's a good sign its not the radio. Doing a hard format of one atm.... Now I can sleep


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Wish I had the IPhone cable to try that out. Its time for bed though.


Which iPhone do you have? When I tried to use the Kia/Hyundai interface cable with my iPod Classic, it didn't work right. A little poking around on Kiatechinfo led me learn that I didn't need to use it. It's mainly for the older iPods. I actually use my regular iPod sync cable and it works flawlessly. I believe the iPhone 4 is the same way. Not sure about the 5, but I'd at least try it.
If not, you can stream it, can't you? 

I thought all the 2012+ Rio's had handsfree and streaming even with no UVO.
All the ones I looked at did.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I've been trying a USB stick but I do have a iPhone four laying around somewhere I can try. I honestly haven't looked at streaming at all I will check.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Just finished a 6 hour format on a 64gig USB stick (the one I used before) I will see if that worked. I did read that a USB stick that has EVER been formated ntfs will give error. I don't think that can be correct but either way if the stick is the issue it will be fixed now.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright! Got an older SanDisk to work. Its not the radio!

I'll get pics of the progress up tonight at work.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Alright! Got an older SanDisk to work. Its not the radio!
> 
> I'll get pics of the progress up tonight at work.


I want to say it might be limited to 32Gb. I know a lot of the aftermarket radios used to be that way, and I want to say I read that somewhere, but not 100%. 

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I want to say it might be limited to 32Gb. I know a lot of the aftermarket radios used to be that way, and I want to say I read that somewhere, but not 100%.
> 
> Jay


I had a full up 64gig running before I swapped to the x7500s. But I at least know its something with the usb stick and not the radio.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

There was talk of pictures? lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

So far it seems that this entire car could be disassembled with a 10mm socket and a phillips head screwdriver.

Had some time this weekend to run the controller wiring etc. Figured I give a little rundown of how I got the center console apart to work on it. First off the silver bezel around the shift knob pops off with clips behind it. I really found the pulling up the front then going in a counterclockwise direction was the best order to pop the clips. Once that is off the trim just below it comes off in a similar fashion.










To remove the main console piece there is a 10mm bolt under the rear storage area (revealed by pulling out a felt covered drop in), two screws about midway that attach to the shifter housing and two more 10mm bolts up at the dash. Oh and two ****ty screws up under the dash on the sides that feed into expanding plastic thread. The first thing I haven’t liked about the construction of this car.




























I will admit that I went through half of the day before realizing that I could just fish the silver bezel through the lower part to move everything out of the way. Next I worked on removing the usb/cigarette lighter panel so I could install the DSP-88r controller and run my switched ACC. As with most things two screws and and start pulling on the bottom, she will pop off.




























Here she is pulled out.










The DSP controller has two L brackets that are used to mount it. These are easy enough to put on the the provided self taping screws. As you can see there are predrilled holes for mounting the unit from the top or back.









[url]http://i1297.photob[/url]
ucket.com/albums/ag27/Baronmuadib/DSC_0139_zps4a7270f7.jpg










Here is a shot of the controller up under the dash once everything was popped back into place. The usb cable is just chillin there until my mount gets here. It was a total pain in the ass to mount it under there. Especially considering that there is a mounting bracket right behind where I wanted my mounting screws, so I had to screw them on while the usb panel was mounted but at least I was able to pre drill some holes.










Soldered some xt60’s just to do something outside the car.










Attached some spade connectors to the speaker wires I already ran in the car.



















Attached some lugs and heatshrink for my ground wires, I was going to run everything to a ground block but decided against it due to space constraints.










This torch makes quick work of shrink tubing if you are careful. Plus playing with fire is just plain fun, as is scaring my wife by starting up a torch and leaning into my car.










Next up I wired my amp rack sans RCA cables. I only have pics of the final product before clipping any wire tie ends. It was go time.




























I have some tidying up to do on the amp rack. I figured why techflex back there, everything Is held down nicely. I sort of wish I had feed everything through the bottom, but I also sort of wish I had smaller amps and that’s not happening atm.

What does need to happen is cleaning up this crap hole.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Sounds like what I always said about Neons. Whole car comes apart with a phillips, 10mm and 13mm. lol

I was pretty happy with how easily the console came apart. 

Nice work. I hope to get sound in my car soon...

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Pillars will be here tomorrow or wednesday so I can get working on those. I also need to figure out my midbasses. Im considering going with the P660c comps again and replacing the blown tweet in the wifes sorento. $100 dollars and I would have some temp midbasses I know I liked, and I would kill two birds with one stone.

Im wishing I did the whole amp rack/sub enclosure differently. It is certainly more function than form. But I need to keep telling myself not to change it until I decide to change up subs, which will happen at some point im sure.

But lots of work and lots and lots of tuning before then.


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## Bret Triano (May 16, 2014)

Is it weird that the wiring is always my favorite part of an install? I love seeing how people do their stuff and I can't wait to plan out the wiring for my car lol.

It looks great so far! I'm excited for more.

-Bret


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Bret Triano said:


> Is it weird that the wiring is always my favorite part of an install? I love seeing how people do their stuff and I can't wait to plan out the wiring for my car lol.
> 
> It looks great so far! I'm excited for more.
> 
> -Bret


I'm the same way. I see too much bad wiring/badly laid out wiring, and take a certain pride in my wiring being clean and functional. 

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I'm the same way. I see too much bad wiring/badly laid out wiring.
> Jay


You mean like what I got just above that dsp?


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

LOL. You're already talking about changing, so who cares? At least I see _some_ zipties in there. hahaha!

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

What that amp rack needs is smaller amps, bigger subs..... And more zip ties :laugh:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I need less work and more build time, but I guess work pays for the car audio. Just ordered some JBL p660c comps. Ill throw the midbass in my car and the tweets in my wifes sorento.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Ive got a labeler coming and realized now that I have the perfect lengths it would be super easy to label the wires and tech flex em... done, that will make me feel better.

Im also debating a double din headunit. Even after getting the USB issue fixed I was reminded how annoying it was to scroll through music on this unit. I loved the way my old pioneer DD did it. The stock HU doesnt have bluetooth or nav or anything and despite the DSP-88r having an un equalization function, I just cant get over the fact that its eq'd and possibly t/a'd. But we shall see I guess.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Ive got a labeler coming and realized now that I have the perfect lengths it would be super easy to label the wires and tech flex em... done, that will make me feel better.
> 
> Im also debating a double din headunit. Even after getting the USB issue fixed I was reminded how annoying it was to scroll through music on this unit. I loved the way my old pioneer DD did it. The stock HU doesnt have bluetooth or nav or anything and despite the DSP-88r having an un equalization function, I just cant get over the fact that its eq'd and possibly t/a'd. But we shall see I guess.


Yeah, when I use my iPod I usually just find what I want to listen to, set it on my iPod and then plug it in. Even the UVO doesn't have a very friendly GUI.

IIRC, One of the guys in my thread (Eskil, I think it was) said that there was some time alignment-ish stuff going on with the factory non-UVO HU. I actually think the factory sound sounds pretty good compared to many other cars. I could have sworn all the Rios had bluetooth. Guess not.

If you are looking at a double din HU, the new Pioneer NEX stuff is pretty sweet.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Ah hell, those nex units are pretty sick. Now if someone told me they had a bur brown dac i would be sold.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

They can play H.264 video :bowdown:

Completely useless to me but I thought it would never happen.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Pretty sure they do FLAC too.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Didn't see flac but I'll check. I have a feeling cooler heads will prevail. The avh-1600 is on sale. No nav but mirror link and the like. A solid DD that will let me browse songs the way I want. Not as fun a choice as an nex though.

Pillars are out for delivery!!!

Edited for...... Well everything was wrong in this post


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I gotta say, I'd probably do the 2600 or 3600.
The 1600 doesn't offer bluetooth (streaming or handsfree). 
The 2600 has Bluetooth
The 3600 has Bluetooth/HD Radio/Option for satellite radio.

If you start looking back at the NEX units, I'd hold off. We had one last week that took in a cd and played it, but wouldn't eject it. We've had 2 in the past month that locked up, and even resetting the units didn't help. Seems like a software problem, so hopefully they get it worked out soon.

My GF has last year's 3500 in her Jeep and it works great. I replaced an Avic-F90BT with it for Christmas. Running Waze from her iPhone gets Nav, and all the functions work. I have an Android phone so I can run the apps via bluetooth with no cables. Her iPhone 4 needs a special cable, and the 5 needs all kinds of crap. lol

Jay


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## jamesjones (Mar 8, 2007)

REGULARCAB said:


> Ah hell, those nex units are pretty sick. Now if someone told me they had a bur brown dac i would be sold.



You already have the dsp-88, if you're going to change, go iPad mini/pure i20.

That's what I'm planning to do.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I've decided on the 1600. I was siting here looking st all the nifty options these unit have and then I came to my senses. I've honestly never actually wanted or needs hands free. I don't ever have any music stored on my windows phones. In dash nav would be nice but to be honest the only time I ever need nav is when we are on trips, and in that case we would be in my wife's sorento. 

I would have liked something with a bur brown dac and 4v outs but I can live without especially for a dsp.

I've thought about it and the plan is to someday do a car PC and I believe the extra money would be better spent on that. I've wanted a carpc since I turned 16. Back in the days of the t-bird processors when it would have almost been impossible. Nowadays it seem easily doable, and I always like to tinker.

Pillars came just now!!!!! I was correct, it is a drivers side and a passenger side pillar. One was 20 dollars the other was 56.... Go figure.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I have an iPod, so I don't use my phone for music anymore, but you had mentioned an iPhone at one point so I wasn't sure. But I've been listening to a lot of audiobooks lately, and those are on my phone, so I use streaming/handsfree all the time. As a matter of fact, I rarely talk on the phone _unless_ I'm in the car. I always look for expandability. I also have Satellite Radio (and pay for the service) so that's why I suggested it. 

If you don't need the extra gadgets, the 1600 is a great unit with a lot of features for it's @ $250 street price.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Even better at $209 from best buy! I'd like all the nifty features but I didn't usem before when I had a DD in my Silverado for a decade. In my eyes I could justify 200 just for a touch screen and better UI.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Now my wife needs to get home so I can se about these pillars.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Dear god I need more practice/skill with a router. And a damn jasper jig. These tweeter/mid rings pissed me off tonight. No updates guys... I fail.

Time to to take a step back. Buy a jasper jig and build myself a router table. I can do midbass rings all day long but these little guys are kicking my ass. The precision just isn't there.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

If you order a Jasper Jig, I'd recommend getting the combo kit (the 200 and the 400, IIRC). I only have the 400, and I find myself wanting to be able to make smaller rings more and more often.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

For bits are you using an up spiral?

I'm also trying to decide if I want the tweet and mid on the same plane or if I want to make separate rings for each. Though I can answer that myself, separate rings would allow me to get a lil more on axis while staying as wide as possible.


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## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

Tweeter rings are easy to make with a drill press and a couple sizes of hole saw bits, so long as you can get the right sizes and hole saws are hella expensive. Alas... there's never the right sizes. And who the hell has a drill press in their garage? Wouldn't it be awesome if SOMEONE NAMED METRA MADE TWEETER RINGS of various sizes hint hint hint hint... hinty hint hint.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

sirbOOm said:


> Tweeter rings are easy to make with a drill press and a couple sizes of hole saw bits, so long as you can get the right sizes and hole saws are hella expensive. Alas... there's never the right sizes. And who the hell has a drill press in their garage? Wouldn't it be awesome if SOMEONE NAMED METRA MADE TWEETER RINGS of various sizes hint hint hint hint... hinty hint hint.


I'm almost about too. But I'm the type of guy that can't stand not being able to accomplish something... Ask my wife


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> For bits are you using an up spiral?
> 
> I'm also trying to decide if I want the tweet and mid on the same plane or if I want to make separate rings for each. Though I can answer that myself, separate rings would allow me to get a lil more on axis while staying as wide as possible.


Mine are on the same plane, and are about as far in as I could get them, so I don't know how much more on axis you could get by making the pieces separate vs. a simpler design for a single plate to mount them on the same plane.

Jay


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

sirbOOm said:


> Tweeter rings are easy to make with a drill press and a couple sizes of hole saw bits, so long as you can get the right sizes and hole saws are hella expensive. Alas... there's never the right sizes. And who the hell has a drill press in their garage? Wouldn't it be awesome if SOMEONE NAMED METRA MADE TWEETER RINGS of various sizes hint hint hint hint... hinty hint hint.


I don't see anything like tweeter rings on Metra's site. They have them from 5 to 15, bit I don't see anything smaller.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Teaser shot! 
Round two in progress.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Taking a small break from the pillars today. Got my daughters first birthday party. But I do have some time so I think I'll work on the new head unit and run some rca's. 

Didn't I say I only wanted to run wire in this car once? My goal someday (probably 10 years from now when the kids are older) is to pull my car into a big garage strip it completely down and do everything I need to do to it all in one shot.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

About to get some vinyl on these pillars.... Wish me luck:blush:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

They even fit back in the car after vinyl!!!!!    

Ill post up more pics later. The little one will be awake in about 6 hours. Its time for bed.

Stoked epper:epper::thumbsup:


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Nice work. Those came out awesome...now whatcha gonna do about grilles?


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Grills are for pussies...


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

That's what I've been saying since I built my pods. lol
How about a pic from outside the car through the little window? 

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I suppose that I can throw up a couple pics before I write this all up. Note the new windshield crack, farking I-5. I drove with a cracked I windshield for 2 years in my truck. Now I have zero deductible glass coverage.



















No drivers in atm... it got really hot today and I gave up.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

What kinda glue did you use? Looks like it might be coming off...but the pillars look awesome!

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

The passenger side is coming off a bit I see, it pulled a bit putting it in. I used 3m90 and yellow hot glue on the back. The vinyl is actually darker than I wanted but I'm so damn broke I used what I had. The plan was to make it redoable. But they look so damn good.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

After I saw them, I was seriously considering redoing mine. Then I decided I'd wait until I change speakers. lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

My only wish at this point is that the tweeter was toed in just a bit more. But once my midbasses get here in gonna get everything finalized and start tuning. Then plan the complete redo


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Now I will say, as most of you have probably read about vinyl. 3m spray glue sucks balls. It worked very well to lay things out and get an initial stick. The curve around to the backside and the hard inside curve going from the baffle to the pillar where handled by the Stanley brand yellow hot glue. That stuff works amazingly well and grips the plastic like crazy. You are still able to rip it off with pliers which was beneficial for the temp application.

I have worked with vinyl before and had to use a lot of heat and stretching. For some reason this time I just let the vinyl go where it wanted too instead of fighting it. It worked out far easier than my past experiences.

Also I took a tip from bikinipunks build thread and taped off the front side then added glass from the inside/back. It worked out surprisingly well and was very easy to build on top with some duraglass followed by body filler. All in all I could probably do these again in a few hours knowing what I know now.

I suppose I should keep all this till I post up all my pics tomorrow at work.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright since Jay won’t leave me alone about it… :laugh:

Here are the progress shots and write up of the pillars I built this last weekend. I was having a hell of a time routing out some tweeter rings. I finally decided to make it one plate and freehand the circle with my router. It actually turned out pretty damn well. I screwed the first onto another piece of material and duped it with my router.










How do I not have pictures of me positioning the baffles? Well I decided to place them as wide as I could . The baffle was attached at the top to the pillar with some hot glue. My thinking here was to make as little gap as possible at the top so I wouldn’t have to fill as much. I wish I had pictures, they layed right up to the opening in the pillar. A stick of MDF was use to space out the bottom of the baffle and was screwed through. 

The next step was a new one for me. On small pieces I never muc h liked stretching fleece over the entire baffle. I searched a number of threads on pillar window builds and saw a new technique on ErinH’s build log. So I proceeded to tape off the front side. Basically the same procedure as stretching fleece, but instead you glass from the back side, remove the tape and fill and sand the front. This meant that I didn’t need to stretch fleece over the entire pillar making it far easier and quicker to blend things in.




























After taping things up I started to glass from the inside, I decided to just use resin and chop since it has to span such a small area and it would be easy to build up thickness. A few shots after pulling the tape.














































As you can see you aren’t left with a perfect finished shape, but what you are left with is a piece that is really easy to fill with dynaglass then body filler. Here is a shot after the reinforced filler and after the first coat of gold filler.










They were surprisingly easy to wrap. All I had was the vinyl I used in my Silverado, Its not the color I really wanted so I planned to make it easily removable. Though they came out really well and I kinda wish I had used some real contact adhesive. For now though I used some 3m 90 spray glue and yellow hot glue where it really needed to hold.










I used the same vinyl to cover up the back since you could see everything through the pillar window. I popped em into place, then gave up before I mounted the drivers because it was like 85 outside and im built like a polar bear.










You can see the 3m 90 pulling a bit, for now the drivers will hold that bit. I will recover them once I find that perfect color. 










The pillars were not terribly easy to fit back in but im am certainly glad I didn’t glass the whole bottom, the part that fits the windshield has to flex quite a bit when replacing them. I will post in car pics once I get the drivers mounted. There is cable already ran into the pillar and over to the drivers side kick where the xt60’s are. It was a nice straight shot from the pillar to the floor. Very easy to run wires.

I also got my rca's ran and my new headunit installed, no pics yet.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Something like this, maybe:



I saw that at Joann Fabrics the other day. They had it in 3 colors (gray, black and sand) and I would bet you could dye it since it's not in an area where it will get touched alot. (If you had to)

Jay


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## ccover916 (Jul 29, 2014)

1. 
2.
3.
4.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

ccover916 said:


> 1.
> 2.
> 3.
> 4.


I declare a thumb war?


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Um...Okay.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Something like this, maybe:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I do like that, does it stretch at all? Though I am still surprised how little stretching I had to do. I have a Joann Fabrics on my way home from work, they just need to be open 24/7 for those who need their late night knitting fix :laugh:


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> I declare a thumb war?


DIYMA needs a "Like" button! lol


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Looks good, I like how the PPI amps and DSP look together and how they match too. 

Some Sandisk Cruzer flash drives, when they first came out did not work at all with music. Maybe that is the issue you had with the bad one.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I didn't pull on it much, so I'm sure the stretchiness. Seemed to have some give, but it's no 4-way stretch. A little heat might help.
I might have to pick some up, but I was going to wait til I had sound to see if I thought I needed to fix the pods/kicks before I put material on them.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alrojoca said:


> :thumbsup::thumbsup:
> 
> Looks good, I like how the PPI amps and DSP look together and how they match too.
> 
> Some Sandisk Cruzer flash drives, when they first came out did not work at all with music. Maybe that is the issue you had with the bad one.


Thanks! I really wish I had bought smaller amps, but those where purchased for my silverado where I had an entire back wall. I do love the good ole A/B's though and it is not a problem since I did get them to fit.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I didn't pull on it much, so I'm sure the stretchiness. Seemed to have some give, but it's no 4-way stretch. A little heat might help.
> I might have to pick some up, but I was going to wait til I had sound to see if I thought I needed to fix the pods/kicks before I put material on them.
> 
> Jay


I will go play with some, somehow I got away with very little stretch on these pillars so it may not be an issue.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I'd be curious to hear your opinions on that material. Me being me, if it worked out, I'd probably wrap all the light colored plastic in it to match.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

So I took my little one to Joanns today and found somethingn very similar if not the same thing. There was very very minimal stretch to it and it was only a little bit thinner than the vinyl I have on their. I was hoping for something pretty thin. I would have bought some but I was number 8 in line at the cutting table.

Honestly I am really debating spraying them with some primer and wrapping them with the right color grill cloth.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

My daughter this morning trying to tune my dsp-88r in off line mode... seriously the computer was off I turn around and its on with the DSP software running. BTW I am now missing the X key.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Pulled my pillars this morning. Ripped off the vinyl and ground the bottom edge a bit where there where a few fitment issues. Nothing bad but it should be about perfect now. The clip at the top is not holding very well so I'll have to see if I can get some clips before the final install. Once the girls wake up I will head to Joanns and grab some material to cover these guys.

I hope to have everything buttoned up this weekend and my midbass should be here Tuesday. I'll have to route some new rings but at least I know the damn thing will fit. Wishing I ordered some hdpe. I can tell you that no store around here carries cutting boards thicker than an 1/8th of an inch


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I can finally see some tuning in my future!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright Jay, I finally bought the vinyl. Looks to be the same as pictured above. You are correct it is a damn close match to the original plastic. I would say its stretches about half as much as the cheap vinyl with the same pressure. Still have to pick up some contact cement.... And some balls, before I start this. Luckily I bought enough vinyl that I can completely f up 4 times on each pillar. Or use it on the spare tire redo when I get around to that.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

What midbasses did you end up going with?

Good luck with the pillars. I know the vinyl isn't a _perfect_ match, but I'm still looking forward to the results.

I've been routing wires since I got home, and hope to get a little more done tomorrow.

If you're looking for HDPE, check with any local Boat supply places. Look for King Starboard. It's available from 1/4" to 1.5" thick in several colors. Pretty easy to work with too.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I decided to pull the 6.5s from a set of jbl p660c. They where spectacular for mid bass in my truck and should hold me until the new stereo integrity comes out. Or I decide to pull the trigger on some illusions. I was really hoping to stick with a raw driver, I like knowing I can get amazing sound for a low cost, but that 2.5 inch depth is killing me. Another half inch and I could use about anything I wanted up to a 7.5 inch frame.

Waiting for it to cool down and I will start the pillar wrapping tonight. Being a true northwest kid my mind just doesn't work if I'm too hot. Which means anything over 70 degrees.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright. 2 attempts and 2 failures down. Should have stopped after the first. Everything shows through this vinyl. I didn't clean the pillars well enough and had a few greablies(technical term) stuck under the vinyl. Hit it all with goof off and a towel removing ALL the crap including the adhesive. Now I am waiting for everything to dry really well to give it another shot.

The wrapping worked really well however! Just too much crap underneath.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Nope.... Time for something a little thicker and a little more stretchy. Even at the top of the pillar where I had it down to bare plastic there was little bumps n crap. The slightest little thing comes through this vinyl. I had a super smooth application of glue too. 

Perhaps someone with more skill could get it too work but there does not appear to be much more someone could do. The other vinyl I used was maybe a 32nd thicker and had none of these issues. I will also say that I did something to one tiny spot and it instantly looked like hell. Right in the middle of the panel I must have caught it with a finger nail or something and messed up the texture.


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## SQram (Aug 17, 2007)

REGULARCAB said:


> My daughter this morning trying to tune my dsp-88r in off line mode... seriously the computer was off I turn around and its on with the DSP software running. BTW I am now missing the X key.



Just read your entire build, this was my favorite part...I can definitely relate. ?

Great work, keep it coming!


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Maybe use some 1/8" foam under it?

I like the DIY drivers I've tried so far, and DRTHJTA is using almost all Dayton in his car and is doing really well in comps. So I feel like that's some form of validation, but after hearing the Hybrid stuff I used in a CTS-V a few weeks ago, I totally see an "upgrade" in my future.

Thanks for your opinions on the vinyl...I bet you'd have had the same problems using speaker grill cloth as well.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah grill cloth is totally out at this point. Joanns has headliner. I'm thinking that will be the way to go. I looked at it when I bought the vinyl and thought. "if I say **** it, that's what I'll use"


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I say give the vinyl a shot jay. I mean, people cover pillars in suede... Just not me


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

No progress. I have a sick baby


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Boooo


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> No progress. I have a sick baby


Maybe she'll feel better after she poops out the 'X' key?
(Seriously, tho, hope she feels better.)

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

SkizeR said:


> Boooo





JayinMI said:


> Maybe she'll feel better after she poops out the 'X' key?
> (Seriously, tho, hope she feels better.)
> 
> Jay


I think if the x key was in there it would be long gone by now. Poor thing. If you ever want to see a 6'2 250lb dude cry put his daughter in pain. Thankfully I think she is on the upswing, and she slept for like 14 hours last night.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Midbass' will be here tomorrow. Im going to fight the urge to just install the whole 2-way set and say f the pillars.

I just have to get them covered again. The original vinyl worked quite well. Ill just find the same product in a lighter gray and be happy with it. Plus the dap contact cement hold like a mofo as opposed to the spray glue.


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## YukonXL04 (Mar 6, 2014)

how are you applying the dap contact cement? I have some just not sure how to go about applying.

Also fight the urge!!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I'm using a foam brush to start and evening it out with a foam roller. It totaly did not work out for me. You may want to ask someone else lol. I hear spraying it is best but I didn't feel like destroying my sprayer.

I got headliner today. Super stretchy and foam backed. I'm looking forward to a super easy application. Tho I shouldn't jinx myself. It will have to wait till Friday night however.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

If you have a compressor, you can get a cheap spray guy for less than $20 to shoot glue with. As long as you leave glue in it, it shouldn't harden. Are you using Landau Top Adhesive or just regular contact cement?

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> If you have a compressor, you can get a cheap spray guy for less than $20 to shoot glue with. As long as you leave glue in it, it shouldn't harden. Are you using Landau Top Adhesive or just regular contact cement?
> 
> Jay


I bought the DAP contact cement in the green can, not the Landau Top Adhesive. It was all they had when I was looking. I will also say that I am damn glad I got the original and not the gel, It was already a little thicker than I imagined it.

For sprayers, would you recommend a gravity feed (with the cup on top) or a siphon feed? and is the landau any thicker than enamel paint? The dap I bought was thicker even than old latex paint, I figured I would have a hell of a time spraying it.

Good call on just leaving the adhesive in there, I imagine at the worst I would have to soak the nozel in some acetone once in a while.

EDIT: I do have a cheap old latex siphon feed sprayer, but damn the spray pattern is way too large for this application.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

God damn car audio closeout! The shipment for my P660c's is delayed because the postal code for the reciever is incorrect. Dumbasses!!! btw I checked, the info they have is correct.

Edit: Im normally a pretty laid back guy but I ordered these damn things a month ago


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> I bought the DAP contact cement in the green can, not the Landau Top Adhesive. It was all they had when I was looking. I will also say that I am damn glad I got the original and not the gel, It was already a little thicker than I imagined it.


Made that mistake once.



REGULARCAB said:


> For sprayers, would you recommend a gravity feed (with the cup on top) or a siphon feed? and is the landau any thicker than enamel paint? The dap I bought was thicker even than old latex paint, I figured I would have a hell of a time spraying it.


I usually use a siphon feed cheapo. That was what we had at the shop location I used to work at, and it works OK. I talked to a guy the other day who frankly does really nice vinyl work and asked him what he used...he said he likes a gravity feed. They'll both work, you just need to adjust it.



REGULARCAB said:


> Good call on just leaving the adhesive in there, I imagine at the worst I would have to soak the nozel in some acetone once in a while.


Or pitch it cause it's only like $20. lol




REGULARCAB said:


> EDIT: I do have a cheap old latex siphon feed sprayer, but damn the spray pattern is way too large for this application.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I just got the layout in my head for how I could stitch the vinyl for the pillars, perhaps once I get things buttoned up and I need something to do Ill go that route with some nice thick vinyl.

Edit: god damn it now I won't feel its finished till ive got stitched pillars lol


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

You've been looking at Strakele's build log, haven't you? lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> You've been looking at Strakele's build log, haven't you? lol
> 
> Jay


I may have peaked at it a few times... 

It seems like the perfect way to do it without much stretch. Its the transition from the baffle to the concave part that is killing me. Plus I could get away with some really thick vinyl to hide whatever the frak is under there giving me the bumps.

But the headliner will be my next move and once I get the drivers in I will be happy for a while.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Ive also been eyeballing some flat black rims. The wife just got a huge raise, she wont mind right? This car was supposed to be a financially responsible decision


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Been there, done that, sitting in my garage waiting for winter tires. 





(Literally hours before I vinyl wrapped my roof).

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Dick.... 

Yeah ive been sporting wood for that vinyl roof since the first time I saw your build log. Really changes the lines of the car.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Haha! I really liked those rims, and they were only a little over $400 for the set from Discount Tire. I was just looking a pics of when I first got the car until the end of last summer and the little bit of vinyl I did made a huge difference in the look of the car. I did the roof, the mirror caps, fog light surrounds, grill surround. Probably under $300 to do all of it.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright my car audio brethren, from now until the day I die I will be covering everything I make in headliner lol. Let me get the drivers in and everything in the car for some wow factor pics.

Jay, are those 16s?


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Yeah. Those are 16x7, either +37 or +40 offset (I don't remember offhand)

They fit great. I had 17's with 40 series tires on another car, and it looked sweet but our roads suck and I didn't want to have do deal with the harsh ride.

Jay


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## YukonXL04 (Mar 6, 2014)

JayinMI said:


> Made that mistake once.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Awesome, Thanks for the intel. So you are recommending getting the Landau Top Adhesive as opposed to the green can contact cement? I would really like to be able to wrap some stuff without having to put a thousand staples into it... 
When I get ready to do my pillars I will grab a cheapo sprayer from HF. Do you thin out the adhesive at all?


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Got my pillars in! But my windows phone hates photo bucket links. I'll post up a pic at work


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

BOOM!!!!










Just imagine it without the cracked windshield lol.


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## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

Nice work. 

But BOOM is my line. $5


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

sirbOOm said:


> Nice work.
> 
> But BOOM is my line. $5


Thanks

$2.50 and a McChicken?


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

YukonXL04 said:


> Awesome, Thanks for the intel. So you are recommending getting the Landau Top Adhesive as opposed to the green can contact cement? I would really like to be able to wrap some stuff without having to put a thousand staples into it...
> When I get ready to do my pillars I will grab a cheapo sprayer from HF. Do you thin out the adhesive at all?


Yeah. Definitely go with the Landau Top Adhesive. I don't thin it, but it takes a little work to get the gun to spray right. I went with a cheap gun with the largest tip I could find. Maybe try it out on some scrap vinyl or some carpet to get a feel for it before you do anything important. 
Just to be safe, I usually use some CA Glue on the back side just to help it stay in place. Probably not necessary, but it's cheap insurance.

Spray it to both surfaces and wait til it's dryish to the touch. Once you put it down and the two pieces touch, it better be where you want it. lol

Jay


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Those pillars look great! Evey since I saw them in vinyl, I've been considering redoing mine. Not REAL seriously, but it keeps popping up every now and again.

How do you like the new HU?

Jay


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

wow. that looks ****ing awesome!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Those pillars look great!





SkizeR said:


> wow. that looks ****ing awesome!


Thanks guys, I am pretty stoked with how they turned out 

As far as the new headunit goes. I guess I forgot to mention that i got that thing installed. I certainly like the look of the double din better than the single din. The user interface is nice as well, far better then the 2005 ish pioneer double din I had that is now in the wifes sorento. I also like the fact that I can upload my own background, not that i have done that yet. Alas i have not played any sound through her yet. But my midbass' did show up today under the guise of "new tweeters for your sorento honey". I hope to have things buttoned up this weekend and start on a tune. epper:


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## WhereAmEye? (Jun 17, 2013)

Can't wait, pillars look sick!


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## YukonXL04 (Mar 6, 2014)

Those pillars look great man. Way to go!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

WhereAmEye? said:


> Can't wait, pillars look sick!





YukonXL04 said:


> Those pillars look great man. Way to go!


Thanks guys.

epper:epper:epper:epper: I got music!epper:epper:epper:

I have zero tune atm, just some initial crossovers set. I need to wait for a mic extension cable before I bother taking measurements. I will try out bikinipunks t/a site tonight. I will say I love what I hear so far. I have every gain set to minimum along with the dsp and my headunit at half gives listenable levels. My stage may blow atm and my levels between drivers are all f'ed up but god damn it is a clean sound. Stoked!!!!

Let the tuning begin :juggle:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Here I expected to spend the next 8 hours at working reading up on tuning. But I already know what I plan to do next, i just need time to do it :mean:

I did a preliminary t/a this morning and It did wonders. I would level match but I do believe I want to do take some measurements first just to see what Im really working with, and to see if my ears are correct. 

I am finding that I need two things in my car however. A fracken outlet in my car for my dumbass laptop that only runs for 30min, and a windshield cover because I cant stand heat... like at all.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I had planned on going through the system with a DMM and setting all my gains but the output on the DSP-88r must be so high that everything Is set at a minimum atm. I may do so just to make sure im not leaving a ton of power on the table.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Pushed some buttons, changed some crap. Thats about what most of my updates will sound like until I can get this damn mic figured out. Im trying to run an Imm6 on my laptop, damn thing wont take any input from any mic, and I own a ton of gaming mics. PITA but I will figure it out.

Its almost worth buying a usb sound card or umm6 just to not f with it. I love computers and hate them at the same time. It also doesnt help that I have given my nice laptops to my wife and daughter and am left with one that is maybe 1/8th the processing speed of my damn phone...


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I bought an ACER Netbook just for doing my audio stuff, so I could take the Winbloze partition off my Macbook. It has been nothing but problems.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I suppose I could just use my Corei7 Asus that I gave to my wife that she does nothing with other than store pictures. Thing has a beast built in sound card.

Im seriously thinking about to take my 80lb full tower and just chuck it in my trunk till I get this f'er tuned.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> I suppose I could just use my Corei7 Asus that I gave to my wife that she does nothing with other than store pictures. Thing has a beast built in sound card.
> 
> Im seriously thinking about to take my 80lb full tower and just chuck it in my trunk till I get this f'er tuned.


same. my laptop burns through hard drives like no other


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright I have an issue. Other than still not having a working mic setup. Ive been tuning by ear when I and where I can.

The issue is, I can feel fricken midbass all the way through my fricken roof. I can add more cld, its not 100% coverage on the doors atm but there is not _much_ to do other than more layers. I am debating duct seal around the midbass baffle, just for some added weight. Unfortunately there is just no room to make the baffles thicker or larger.

I will say, at least I cant hear a bunch of resonance, and the door card if fairly dead (ill add a little extra CLD) but the tactile feel drives me nuts and makes me wonder what others might be able to hear.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

maybe add mlv?


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

too much midbass? sounds like my problem too, but I like it. And I keep being told it is too much, maybe I need to figure out to get rid of it too.

I think it has to do with the doors, some doors just generate too much midbass if they are fully sealed. Adding more deadener makes it even worse, that was my experience after I went from 65% to 100% and a double layer just behind the midbass on the outter door. Try reverse phase and see how that works, it worked for me in my former sub box I had against the rear wall with the truck I had, after I deaden the wall it killed my deep low bass and once I reversed the phase it came back.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Sooooooo, i figured out why i couldnt get my imm6 to work on any computer or tablet I tried. Its a damn trrs connector, dont judge me, i had no idea lol.

Cable ordered from amazon. 4 pin female to 2X3 pin male from startech . Should be here friday, can't fricken wait. I knew something was wrong when i plugged in my headphone mic after finally getting my soundcard drivers taken care of and everything worked flawlessly.

Measurements to come... and questions im sure


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

2 realizations:

-its extremely annoying not to be able to tune on lunch breaks because I need a laptop. May have to install an inverter and keep one under the seat

-I really need some kind of reference. Headphones or something. This is the best anything I've heard In a couple years so I have no idea what in shooting for. Of course hearing some other cars would be nice.


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## Serieus (May 27, 2011)

imo, iem's (in ear monitors) are cheapest for getting a solid tonality reference for cheap. few budget brands that make fantastic stuff are brainwavz and meelectronics, meelectronics a151's would be a solid starter set and i believe i saw them on sale at sonic electronix today reasonably cheap. pair them up with a cheap fiio amp and you'd have a strong reference for tonality for around $100-120


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

well done sir...those pillars are a thing of beauty!!!


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

REGULARCAB said:


> Alright I have an issue. Other than still not having a working mic setup. Ive been tuning by ear when I and where I can.
> 
> The issue is, I can feel fricken midbass all the way through my fricken roof. I can add more cld, its not 100% coverage on the doors atm but there is not _much_ to do other than more layers. I am debating duct seal around the midbass baffle, just for some added weight. Unfortunately there is just no room to make the baffles thicker or larger.
> 
> I will say, at least I cant hear a bunch of resonance, and the door card if fairly dead (ill add a little extra CLD) but the tactile feel drives me nuts and makes me wonder what others might be able to hear.


Try the PN tracks to see if you can identify the frequency. Could be a really strong resonance at a particular frequency being transmitted to the roof by the door. I'm just guessing. BTW those pillars look really nice!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Got some tuning in, my laptop died I'll post up my graphs tomorrow. That sub was a freakin pyramid up to 30hz. Wich is in fact far lower in frequency than I would have thought. I was able to tame that pretty easily and it sounds much much better atm.

I do have big dips right at the crossover frequencies. Midbass 80-350 mid 350-5k tweet 5k+. I'll have to play with that a bit, eq didn't touch them, messing with slopes did nothing. I knew I wouldn't get very far tonight so I was really just playing around getting a feel for REW and the DSP.

Next up I want to do left right level matching, then I will post up my graph and see if anyone can give a few pointers


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I seem to remember reading somewhere than dips at the x over freq might be something to do with phasing. Maybe try changing the phase on one, the other or both speakers in those ranges? Can you do that with your DSP or would you have to do it at the amp or speaker? If at the DSP, I'd try it and see what happens.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah I can do it at the DSP I'll give that a shot. Only problem is it farks with my t/a and that sound stage is like 99% percent there just by running erin's calcs. I'm a litlebworried about messing with it actually.

I will say, and its a total fluke because lets face it I aimed my drivers on what looked best and what I thought would sound ok. But omg that stage seems way out in front and center is actually center. I'm pretty shocked. Though that is with vocal left left center center right center right, it does move a bit with music but I'm hoping the left right matching will help with that.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

Well, what do I know ? i'm new at this, but I did get a chance to listen to systems with nearly close to perfect center stage, and guess what? they lack deep bass big time despite 3 amps and 12" $ 1k sub in some 

Maybe the positioning of the front drivers on the pillars does this, who knows.

The TA, EQ and sub's polarity affect the stage, maybe you can only tune for a great stage and no deep bass, or more deep bass and less midbass but not quite a centered good stage. 

Your system may be ready as it is to compete in SQ events you will never know


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

Not picking, just clarifying. 



Alrojoca said:


> Well, what do I know ? i'm new at this, but I did get a chance to listen to systems with nearly close to perfect center stage, and guess what? they lack deep bass big time despite 3 amps and 12" $ 1k sub in some
> 
> Maybe the positioning of the front drivers on the pillars does this, who knows.


With a solid center you can absolutely have a solid and tactile low end when it's there in the music. If it's in the music and you're not hearing and feeling it then it could be anything from arrival time to response to an install issue. 8 out of 10 it's either timing between the sub and the mid bass or a hot mid-range that kill the perception of low end. Even if you have the L/R balanced to get a working center. A solid center by itself does not cause loss of low end. 

Typical drivers on pillars/dash don't play down below ~200. The low end is down to integration and response.




Alrojoca said:


> The TA, EQ and sub's polarity affect the stage, maybe you can only tune for a great stage and no deep bass, or more deep bass and less midbass but not quite a centered good stage.


When both response and timing are done right, you'll have everything you want. You don't have to make the compromises you mentioned



Alrojoca said:


> Your system may be ready as it is to compete in SQ events you will never know


If you like this hobby you must compete.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

sqnut said:


> If you like this hobby you must compete.


Is that an order? lol If that's the case, I need to move to another state that actually _has_ shows to go to. lol

Jay


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

Alrojoca said:


> Well, what do I know ? i'm new at this, but I did get a chance to listen to systems with nearly close to perfect center stage, and guess what? they lack deep bass big time despite 3 amps and 12" $ 1k sub in some
> 
> Maybe the positioning of the front drivers on the pillars does this, who knows.
> 
> ...


Have 1 tweeter out of phase and I assure you that bass won't come alive in any car  
And yes, with a tweeter out of phase, you can still have a close to perfect center stage...

Kelvin


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

JayinMI said:


> Is that an order? lol If that's the case, I need to move to another state that actually _has_ shows to go to. lol
> 
> Jay


No just encouragement since he showed a desire to compete. We're both in the same boat no competitions here either


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

subwoofery said:


> Have 1 tweeter out of phase and I assure you that bass won't come alive in any car
> And yes, with a tweeter out of phase, you can still have a close to perfect center stage...
> 
> Kelvin


Yuck!! drivers out of phase is a band aid that never sounds complete and cohesive. Get the timing and response right and you don't need to flip polarity. It's as simple as that.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

I had no doubts with a good DSP and good tunning we could have everything we want, a great centered stage and good low end. The thing is, in comp events, you tune for the CD that judges use, not for your own taste or the type of music we like to play, that is probably the difference I heard.


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

There are enough low end cues on the test discs, after all the judges have to rate the low end and a thin low end is not going to score points. The point I'm making is, just cause the car competes doesn't mean it is setup or sounds right. Could be someone just starting out.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

sqnut said:


> Yuck!! drivers out of phase is a band aid that never sounds complete and cohesive. Get the timing and response right and you don't need to flip polarity. It's as simple as that.


I kinda of agree. I've read a lot of different "how to tune" posts and threads, and a lot of people have suggested changing phases. What I've found (in my case) is I usually find the center image improved (as far as placement), but the rest of the stage sounded diffused. Since I can switch phase on individual drivers with my DSP, I will try it, but it it doesn't make a positive difference, I switch back and try to make improvements with T/A and EQ.

Jay


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

sqnut said:


> There are enough low end cues on the test discs, after all the judges have to rate the low end and a thin low end is not going to score points. The point I'm making is, just cause the car competes doesn't mean it is setup or sounds right. Could be someone just starting out.




I agree, one of the systems I got a chance to listen to, has won Master's events, that is why I said what I said. Maybe the bass was there, just the level or bass volume was not the way I am used to have mine. Most of these systems also use Sealed boxes not ported.


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

We are normally spoilt for bass in a car. An accurate system will not make continuous bass .


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

sqnut said:


> We are normally spoilt for bass in a car. An accurate system will not make continuous bass .


I agree and my 9 band EQ is for all driver's , No DSP. I had the EQ mostly flat except for maybe a couple of bands maybe 1 point or two higher and the sub's volume at mid volume. 

I was told my system had too much bass not in a bad way, I guess I need an RTA to tune it or maybe it is just midbass what I enjoy the most


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

sqnut said:


> We are normally spoilt for bass in a car. An accurate system will not make continuous bass .


Yeah, let me put it this way. My initial rta said my bass is 15db louder than the rest. I thought it sounded damn good, more than enough volume. Then my wife gets in and has a listen. The first thing she says. Where is the bass?

She is driving my car to work tomorrow just so she can listen to the new system. She is still one of those people that thinks tons of bass is what sounds good. I'm hoping to convert her. I told her I turned it up for her... I did not. We will see what she thinks from the drivers seat listening to her favorite songs when that kick is coming from in front of her.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

I guess SQ is not how we want our system to sound, we get in to a car with a $4K system and we expect to hear and feel more bass and we don't get that. Although I did hear a couple of systems that were what I expected.

This SQ thing is a learning experience is more about the centered stage and flat response more than feeling and hearing more bass.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

REGULARCAB said:


> Yeah, let me put it this way. My initial rta said my bass is 15db louder than the rest. I thought it sounded damn good, more than enough volume. Then my wife gets in and has a listen. The first thing she says. Where is the bass?
> 
> She is driving my car to work tomorrow just so she can listen to the new system. She is still one of those people that thinks tons of bass is what sounds good. I'm hoping to convert her. I told her I turned it up for her... I did not. We will see what she thinks from the drivers seat listening to her favorite songs when that kick is coming from in front of her.


Does't the PPI DSP have at least 3 audio settings? Maybe you can have one with RTA, one for you and one for your wife for more bass.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah I can store ten


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Wow, I think I can only do 4 with my BitOne.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Starting to sound pretty good over here though I have a weird ****ing "issue". Trying to ta by ear I don't know what I'm listening for.

Another hour or two of tinkering then I'll post some graphs n ask for some help. Though it sounds awesome, I'm sure there are things I can tackle.

Btw... Wtf would I ever do with ten presets?


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Soooooo, I'm stupid. I forgot that the p660's were 2 ohm, and I had em bridged off my bk800.4. Luckily I still have two working channels and more than enough power.

Plus I have a reason to get a new amp or two.


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## southpawskater (Feb 17, 2010)

Sounds like its all starting to come together.

If you want to get some experienced ears on your tune there will be an IASCA show in Marysville on Saturday the 6th, even if you aren't looking to compete the Northwest crew is super friendly and more than willing to give a listen and offer pointers. But if you are interested in competing it would be a good show to get some judging feed back and its only a single point show so fees are pretty reasonable ($25.00 for any or all formats).

Also on October 5th in Lacey is the IASCA west coast finals, there will be some impressive competition cars available to demo and its also a 3x points show for the 2015 season.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

Sounds like a nice invitation and opportunity to go to get some demo's and give some demo's to local forum members


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

southpawskater said:


> Sounds like its all starting to come together.
> 
> If you want to get some experienced ears on your tune there will be an IASCA show in Marysville on Saturday the 6th, even if you aren't looking to compete the Northwest crew is super friendly and more than willing to give a listen and offer pointers. But if you are interested in competing it would be a good show to get some judging feed back and its only a single point show so fees are pretty reasonable ($25.00 for any or all formats).
> 
> Also on October 5th in Lacey is the IASCA west coast finals, there will be some impressive competition cars available to demo and its also a 3x points show for the 2015 season.


Booo I work that weekend. I will see if I can get it off, I would love to come out if for nothing else than to listen to some cars and get some feedback. Its pretty sad, it's been years since i've even heard anyone elses system that was worth a damn. I think I could handle the 5 min drive to Marysville


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Another strange issue im having. The imm6 or perhaps my sound card is not recording anything above 5k. I would be concerned considering that is where my tweeters are crossed but playing 10k or even 10k-20k pink noise my tweeters sound just fine.

Also for some reason unbridging the amp screwed my tune in the midrange, I suppose it could be a leveling issue again, but it would appear that I will have to retune from scratch.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

I thought I would share that those events are not 2 hr events, they go on all they long from 9 am until 5-6 PM, being 5 mins away makes it easier to be there for a few minutes I would say.


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## southpawskater (Feb 17, 2010)

It would be awesome if you can make it out, Id love to see some new faces in the lanes. But I totally understand other commitments. 

Also if you ever need a hand or another set of ears, I'm just in Lake Stevens and am always willing to help out fellow enthusiasts. During the summer its pretty much every weekend me and the local boys are in my shop working on something for one of our cars.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I will certainly take you up on that offer. I work every other weekend but its usually the weekends off that I can be out n about without the little one.

I have a message out to our on call staff, I'm certainly trying to be there. I never would have thought there would be any kind of meet anywhere around here so I'm gonna do my best to make it out.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, I scrapped my tune completely after unbridging the midbass driver. I then started out with uncorrelated full range pink noise and measured every driver individually and did some level matching. The first go around things where pretty close but I did all the drivers on each side. Doing them individually and matching each set did wonders. Not just for staging but also for tonality. I was hoping to upload my recent measurement just to see what yall think I can work on but unfortunately I didn't get it off my laptop and into photobucket before I left for work.

In the near future... at my wifes request none the less, I will be looking for some different subs. Two JBL gto804's could really impress in my regularcab silverado in a down firing center console. In the current install however, I can get a nice SQ blend but that is about all they have in them. 

This time around im actually debating an Alpine SWS-15. I have never done an install with a **** ton of cone area and I hear they can sound pretty good in 2 cubes sealed. Which would be about perfect. I also like the displacement to dollar ration on these guys.

The midbasses I have at the moment (torn from a set of JBL p660c) are fine in terms of impact and volume but they do lack the clarity of the RS-100 and the Vifa tweets. They where fantastic in my truck but when you hear them coupled with something that has such low distortion it is pretty apparent that you get what you pay for, and i knew that. I will definitely be on the look out for the SI buyout coming up, as that would seem to be my best option other than illusion for shallow midbass drivers.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

How's it looking for making it to the show?

You know, I'm having trouble finding a 10" sub that will fit in my enclosure, and was entertaining a couple of 12's or 15's free air, like in Req's Golf. But I'll probably just stick with a 10". lol

And no, I still don't have sound yet. I was gonna work on it this Sunday, but I have to go to my GF's family reunion.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Unfortunately our on calls are pissing me off atm. I had gotten an email saying that pretty much every on call had requested "unavailable" for the entire month of september. I then proceeded to reply all with "I think we need some more on call that are available". So yeah... I start work at noon on the sixth but the wife will be home to watch the little one so I will plan to at least stop by shake some hands and listen to a few cars. I will have to get a little more info on exactly where this thing is.

As far as the sub goes. I have always been the type to try n get as much out of little subs as I could and I thought since Im finally not trying to build for a truck I may as well go for something completely different. If anything there should be some bump when I want it.

I have loved the idea of doing free air like Req's but im just not quite ready for the panel cutting that may need to happen.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Still fighting the tune over here. God I really have to post some graphs, my plan was to document every step along the way good or bad. I just havent had the time to really sit down and do what I want. The initial un tuned sound was so god aweful that what little time I did have was spent trying to get some listenable sound. There has also been a pretty steep learning curve with measuring. The DSP-88r is pretty damn simple to use however.

Somehow It would appear that next weekend my wife and children will be spending a couple days with her mother in some damn place in eastern washington. It makes me realize that I haven't had a night alone in my house since my wife and her daughter moved in 3 years ago. So either I will get a **** ton of tuning done, or ill be drunk watching Game Of Thrones in my undies on the couch at 11am... only time will tell.


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

REGULARCAB said:


> Still fighting the tune over here. God I really have to post some graphs, my plan was to document every step along the way good or bad. I just havent had the time to really sit down and do what I want. The initial un tuned sound was so god aweful that what little time I did have was spent trying to get some listenable sound. There has also been a pretty steep learning curve with measuring. The DSP-88r is pretty damn simple to use however.
> 
> Somehow It would appear that next weekend my wife and children will be spending a couple days with her mother in some damn place in eastern washington. It makes me realize that I haven't had a night alone in my house since my wife and her daughter moved in 3 years ago. So either I will get a **** ton of tuning done, or ill be drunk watching Game Of Thrones in my undies on the couch at 11am... only time will tell.


3 years huh? Well you said they would be gone for a couple days...see if you can squeeze both in


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## Orion525iT (Mar 6, 2011)

How about sitting in your car (parked of course) drunk, in your undies, tuning to the Game of Thrones soundtrack.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Orion525iT said:


> How about sitting in your car (parked of course) drunk, in your undies, tuning to the Game of Thrones soundtrack.


I wonder if Raines Of Castamere has a centered vocalist? :laugh:

Yeah, three years. My wife and I are real home bodies and any trips we have taken have been together. The quick kick in the arse I got going from a bachelor to a husband with a then 9 year old daughter was certainly an eye opener. I love my family but I always enjoyed my alone time as well. I am sure absence will make the heart grow stronger, not that it needs to.

Or do I spend the weekend tearing out my boot and installing an Alpine sws-15?


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

REGULARCAB said:


> Or do I spend the weekend tearing out my boot and installing an Alpine sws-15?


Tune before you swap


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Just got done doing some t/a work and finally got measurement for all driver in the car again. Got my levels adjusted and remeasured. Its bed time now. I have a few questions but they will have to wait. It will most likely be next weekend before I can get to tuning again. 

It does sound damn good. Its funny tho, I've opened up a can of worms in my own head taking all these measurements. No matter how it sounds there will be things in the graphs that drive me nuts.


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## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

That's why I'm willing to pay someone else to do the final tune on my car...


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Seriously would drive out to Cali when I'm done for some BigRed tuning magic, and to check out SIS and the Papasin's stable of vehicles...and WA is way closer than I am. lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I wrote up a nice long post with some questions but realized I really need to post my graphs (wich are at home). The issue I am having is that the passenger mid seems to drop off in response about 100hz higher than the crossover frequency. Despite having roughly the same airspace and far more than they should need. There is no fill atm and I am debating opening them up into the dash. But again the airspace "should" have no affect at the 350hz crossover point.

Its driving me f ing crazy. I have not run my measurements without crossovers and I assume that is my next step to really see wtf is going on. Worst case I suppose I can just run the drivers side at 450hz to match the passenger side.

As far as the midbass goes I realized today that I have never put the door handle trim back and am most likely getting some interference from the big hole that is left in the panel and the massive gap between the midbass and door card. That is fixed easy enough. Atm there is far too much localization and a fair amount of door card resonance. I thought I did a decent job with the Knu Kolossus but a tap test I just did proved me wrong.


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

There will always be a difference between the electronic and acoustic xover points. Put the drivers on 4th order slopes and then measure to see the actual acoustic xover. Now use the eq to balance L/R and the transition from one driver to the next, i.e. get the acoustic xover to match the electronic one.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Eq'ing them to match is doable. Now if i measured both sides independently and the curve was very close. Would there be a huge issue with the acoustic crossover point being different as long as they blended.

The answer I just got in my head was "its not ideal Brian"


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I need to snap some new pics nor that I have the amp rack all buttoned up. I also finally got that damn cracked windshield replaces. I love brand new windshields... its like driving in HD!!!!!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Sitting in my car as we speak tuning away. I am fairly impaired atm so I do believe ill have to go purely off of measurements tonight.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Oooh nice. Played with each driver by itself then measured one whole aide at a time. Played a little more with eq and slopes on each side. Got things nice n blended. Then ran everything and eq'd the sub a bit. Sounds fracken amazing atm and the "punch" is up on the dash. My only complaint at the moment is 30hz on down is really easy to localize. Time for an overall measurement and in promise I'll throw up a graph.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Did a little extra sound damping today. Pulled off all the fat mat I had used to cover the holes. That crap was so finicky about sticking, it all came off by hand. All for the better though, I had decided the openings in the inner door skin needed a little better treatment. I had a large piece of perforated aluminum that I got off amazon. It was meant to be used as the grate in my false floor cover but the holes turned out to be far too small. 

Rough cut, this also gave me a reason to buy some metal snips. It was not particularly easy to cut that thick aluminum.










I still didn't want to drill screws into my new car yet so the aluminum was adhered using Knu Kolossus. A smaller amount was added to the back side.










I also beefed up the amount of CLD on the door cards and the inner door skin. Im pretty glad I checked the midbasses, the bolts had loosened. I put some lock nuts on em and while I was at it added some butyl rope to the back of the speaker baffle.










After a little break I started tuning. Here is what I left off with. I promise the tweeter does not drop off the face of the earth like that. Its an anomaly I get about 50% of the time while measuring. The sub is probably a little hot atm as well.

Im fairly certain where I should go from here but if anyone has some advice on what they see Im all ears. I have to say that matching up the entire curve for left and right does wonders for imaging. 

Here is the whole system as she sits tonight


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> The answer I just got in my head was "its not ideal Brian"


Hey! No kidding? One of the voices in my head is named Brian, too. LOL

Looks like it's coming along. If my allergies stop kicking my ass for a little while, and it isn't 89 and humid, I am going to make SOME progress this long weekend....if nothing else, I'm going to clean the garage enough to find my plugs I bought so I can wire up my turn on leads. I've bought them twice and keep losing them. I know they're out there somewhere.

Looking forward to those pics...

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Ha! I let my wife drive my car to work today. She seemed absolutely floored. Now shes talking about what I can do to her car. There may be a "REGULARCABs 2007 Kia Sorento" build coming up


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> Ha! I let my wife drive my car to work today. She seemed absolutely floored. Now shes talking about what I can do to her car. There may be a "REGULARCABs 2007 Kia Sorento" build coming up



This sounds familiar.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

REGULARCAB said:


> Ha! I let my wife drive my car to work today. She seemed absolutely floored. Now shes talking about what I can do to her car. There may be a "REGULARCABs 2007 Kia Sorento" build coming up


Good luck with that , maybe you will not get to drive your car too much until you get her's done :worried:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Got about 30minutes of tuning time before work today. Things are pretty damn solid as they sit. My silverado never had a center this tight before. Then again it never had pillar mids and hours of tuning. 

I had talked about a sub upgrade but after a few more listening sessions and some tuning I really am more than happy with the pair of JBL gto804's. In a ~.8 cube sealed box they get low and stay clean. They required a fair amount of eq but luckily only took cuts. The output is certainly there if it is present in the song. The pioneer gm-d9601 is more than enough power and I have never felt the thing even get warm running a 2ohm load.

I couldn’t really ask for anything better from the rs100 mids and vifa xt25 tweets. To my ears the are very very revealing and never harsh. Vocal's out of this system are just amazing. Both drivers live up to their reputation of having low distortion.

The midbass at this point seem to be my weak link. I can listen to most music and marvel at how realistic a guitar sounds. I am also very pleased that all the thump is right up on top of my dash dead center with a real tap to the chest feeling. The issue I have with them is once a passage or song gets fairly complicated they seem to just take a **** regardless of volume levels. I blame it on distortion. A swap to a nice midbass will be next. SI needs to kick it in high gear and come out with that shallow 6.5. 

The PPI BK800.4 Black Ice 4 channel amps continue to surprise me. They didn't like being bridged to a 2.7ohm load, but luckily they would just cut out with no permanent damage (I was dumb). The only complaint I have with these amplifiers is the size. I forget the measurements but they are something like 27inches long and 8 inches wide. They are fricken huge and heavy. I will always have the itch to go to some small class D amps, but at this point I would have to move to something really nice to make it worth my while. I have thought about getting a pair of P900.4s or a pair of Pioneer GM-d8604s but honestly until someone can convince me that there would be a noticable difference in sound as well as being smaller, the BK's will have a place in the boot. I was worried about inefficiency and the load on my charging system but even with 2600 potential watts of power (1600 of which being class AB) there is not an ounce of dimming or other electrical issues.

The Pioneer x1600dvd does what it does well. I have no complaints other than the slightest bit of lag in the menus. Its not terrible but when coupled with a full 32gig usb stick selections arent instant. The screen is bright enough in full sun, until I leave my headlights on which dims the screen and im sitting there wondering wtf the problem is. Also I didnt listen to the recommendations and a volume knob would be kind of nice, I forgot the tactile satifaction they can give.

My favorite piece so far is the PPI DSP-88r. My biggest concern when purchasing it was noise floor. I already knew what features it had and It delivered on everything it claimed. But I am certainly surprised at how dead silent this thing is (as well as the rest of my system). I suppose I could ask for a better looking controller for it but that is nitpicking especially at this price point. Setup was easy enough, and tuning is certainly easy with everything right in front of you. I think I have said it before but this unit has done everything I have wanted it to do.

I am really happy with the system as a whole and don’t really see any huge improvements without shelling out large amounts of cash to replace equipment I already have for something that “might” be better. It’s really nice to be at this point in an install. Everything is in and sounding good without any glaring changes I want to make. It’s a point I never got to with my Silverado before I sold it. In the near future I can spend the time to do the little fun things I never really thought I would get to. 

-steering wheel controls would be nice but I think I want to invest the time into a stand alone volume knob just for giggles

-Laying around in boxes in my garage are about 80% of the parts needed for a car pc. My biggest hurdle would be a screen, at some point I may make the jump. It would be very nice to be able to tune without needing a laptop and being able to take advantage of one of my many many large hard drives would be awesome… did someone say FLAC? Also optical straight to the DSP-88r would be pretty nifty.

-At some point I would like to play around with some interior LED swaps in the car. Some nice red LEDS to match everything else in the car

-I’m sure I will get the fabrication itch some time soon. It really is my favorite part. IF I were to upgrade amps I would like to build something with a little flash. Some day if I get the balls I would love a 6.5 or 5.25 point source in those pillar windows

Then of course there is always my wifes car   :laugh:


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

REGULARCAB said:


> Here is the whole system as she sits tonight


Try this.

Cut about 3 db at 80, 4db at 250, 1 db at 500, raise 1 khz by ~ 1.5db, cut 3 khz by 3 db and cut 8 khz by about 3-4db. 

See how that sounds.


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

sqnut said:


> Try this.
> 
> Cut about 3 db at 80, 4db at 250, 1 db at 500, raise 1 khz by ~ 1.5db, cut 3 khz by 3 db and cut 8 khz by about 3-4db.
> 
> See how that sounds.


Thank you for the input. I have changed a bit since this but I do have this preset saved. I will give your recommendations a shot and see how I like it. The last tune I did sounds much tighter but a little flat, I had cut 250 and 1.2k and smoothed out the sub a bit along with a few other tweaks.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright I decided I was already fighting my previous EQ treatments so after I kept my level adjustment and crossovers and scrapped the EQ. Here is what I ended up with after about an hour. This is starting to get much easier and this EQ is not so heavy handed atm. Unfortunately about half way through my ears started plugging up so I didn't get a chance to listen. God I hate ear infections.

Yellow is Left, Green is Right, Purple is all together


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

:thumbsdown: its funny what you think looks good and sounds good one day looks like hell when you go back and take a peak. Ill be tuning for a bit when I get home tonight.

Btw I downloaded the focal disks in losless wav. My god some of those tracks blow up my midbass... and not because of output, ewwwww. Im seriously wanting to track down wtf is going on there, even tho all the music I actually listen to sounds amazing. Just one more reason I need a damn reference. (I keep saying it but never actually do anything about it)


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

You know what? I noticed the opposite on most of the systems I've had. The better they get, they worse the music I like sounds. Probably because it's recorded so bad.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I will agree with you on that point.  Linkin Park is one that stands out to me (one of my wifes favorite bands). Sounds pretty good in her car, then I bring it over to my car to show off and it starts sounding like hell.

One big difference we might have is that I tend to gravitate to the music that sounds good to me at the time, I have never had a huge preference and will listen to just about anything.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Yeah, I listen to a wide variety of music, but a lot of the newer Hard Rock/Metal that I mainly listen to is recorded like crap. And having equipment that can play the subtle nuances makes it obvious. I got to listen to Strakele's car last year and he had some music I'd never heard, nor come across on my own that I really liked. I can't remember what it was now. But it sounded amazing in his car.


Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Before I really got a tune on this car I was rocking out to Chevelle and Audioslave, the more I tune the less I like it. Same with Dilated Peoples and Jedi Mind Tricks. Some scarface tracks still sound good...

Sadly I've been so lost that I downloaded the billboard top 100... And....and I liked some of it


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Spent most the night on MP3car.com... I think im a glutton for punishment but optical out to my DSP and in car tuning would be so sweet, unlimited storage, no dumb ass menu lag hmmmmm time to shop for screens i think.

And try n find a way to wire a different (better looking/feeling) volume knob for the dsp-88r.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Sadly I've been so lost that I downloaded the billboard top 100... And....and I liked some of it


 Say it ain't so! lol...my GF's sister buys those "Now that's what I call music..." discs. Sometimes they have a decent song or two on them, so I copy the whole disc into my iTunes library. Then some songs I've never heard of pop up on my iPod when it's on shuffle, and I'm like "Where did this come from?!?"



REGULARCAB said:


> Spent most the night on MP3car.com... I think im a glutton for punishment but optical out to my DSP and in car tuning would be so sweet, unlimited storage, no dumb ass menu lag hmmmmm time to shop for screens i think.
> 
> And try n find a way to wire a different (better looking/feeling) volume knob for the dsp-88r.


Are you having a menu lag problem with the Pioneer HU? Those weren't Windows Mobile based like the navi units, and actually worked pretty smoothly. I thought about doing a Mac Mini for awhile, but just couldn't justify the cost. I'm still on the fence about doing an iPad Mini with a Sony radio running with AppRemote.

Jay


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

REGULARCAB said:


> Yellow is Left, Green is Right, Purple is all together





REGULARCAB said:


> Btw I downloaded the focal disks in losless wav. My god some of those tracks blow up my midbass... and not because of output, ewwwww. Im seriously wanting to track down wtf is going on there, even tho all the music I actually listen to sounds amazing. Just one more reason I need a damn reference. (I keep saying it but never actually do anything about it)


80 and 200 hz are hot. That's why the midbass is bloated on the focal tracks. Cut 80-125 on the left by ~ 4-5 db. That should solve your summation bump in this range. Cut 200 by ~ 2.5-3db. 

Cut 500-600 by 3 db on the far side. Bring 1kz up about 2db on the left side. Cut 1.25-1.6 khz by 2db. Cut 3khz on the far side ~ 4db. Cut 8khz ~2-3 db.

How does it sound?


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Say it ain't so! lol...my GF's sister buys those "Now that's what I call music..." discs. Sometimes they have a decent song or two on them, so I copy the whole disc into my iTunes library. Then some songs I've never heard of pop up on my iPod when it's on shuffle, and I'm like "Where did this come from?!?"
> 
> Yeah its pretty stupid when I load 100 songs from 95 different artists. I generally search by artist and instead of having 10 I have a 105 and don't recognize half of em.
> 
> ...


I have a decent ITX motherboard sitting in a box somewhere. I can steal the hard drives and ram from my gaming pc that I haven't even turned on since my daughter was born. In the most basic sense, a little psu, a processor and a screen and I would be well on my way to a car pc. I have wanted one since my first truck back in the day when the AMD T-bird was rocking 1ghz 

For my tastes I haven't even considered anything less than a full blown PC. I still haven't moved to tablets for anything else and just cant give up the connectivity and expandability of a PC. At least in my head.

Plus I could run a OBDII scanner... cuz I totally need one in a kia :laugh:



sqnut said:


> 80 and 200 hz are hot. That's why the midbass is bloated on the focal tracks. Cut 80-125 on the left by ~ 4-5 db. That should solve your summation bump in this range. Cut 200 by ~ 2.5-3db.
> 
> Cut 500-600 by 3 db on the far side. Bring 1kz up about 2db on the left side. Cut 1.25-1.6 khz by 2db. Cut 3khz on the far side ~ 4db. Cut 8khz ~2-3 db.
> 
> How does it sound?


Thank you for the input. I was planning on spending last night tuning but got home and turned on The Nick and ended up watching 4 episodes before my wife told me to come to bed a 3:30


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright I have a question about tracking down which pins/wires are connected to the volume control on the DSP-88r. 

Woudn't the simplest plan be to find two pins that have some kind of continuity and also change resistance when manipulating the volume knob?

I have a fair amount of reading up to do before I actually attempt to do a swap but I do want to make sure I can actually identify the pin outs before I move any further.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Nope. I made the same mistake in thinking when I assumed volume controls were typically potentiometer based. I found some volume controls on radios (as well as my BitOne DRC) use a rotary encoder. 

It's a little more complicated than a variable resistor. The BitOne DRC one has something like 6 pins. ground, button, and 4 pins that get read to determine which way it is turning.

Wikipedia has a good page on them:

Rotary encoder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I also found some good info over on Arduino.cc

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Thank you for the info, I will certainly look into it. It will be nice to have something to sink my brain into while I sit here at work and cant actually get anything done on the car.

A wiring schematic for the controller would be nice but just don't seem to exist. I did assume that it would be a simple pot. Looks like I have some reading to do.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Open it up and take some pics of the board. Maybe we can figure it out on here. I thought it was a pot until I opened mine up and it had 6 pins. Then I hit Google and talked to a couple friends with more experience than me.

Jay


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## etroze (Dec 24, 2013)

Well in for this cause I want to see what you do with that ugly ass volume knob before I buy another one for my wifes car. Good luck!


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I sent you a PM.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I sent you a PM.


Thank you sir. I'll look all that over tonight at work.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Help any?

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

It did help quite a bit Jay. I still haven't researched the arduino hardware itself much. Ill have to spend a little time on the forum. I have the concept down now, just need to move toward some implementation.

And I need to take a pic of the inside of that controller... and rewire the wifes double din... and track down why one of my mids only plays down to 600hz.... then retune the whole damn thing using the other EQ setup on the DSP (if you have a 3-way don't choose 3-way lol)... then Im seriously debating the Alpine sws-15 again and probably should make that decision before I go tuning again... and I want to track down some super dark cheap tint for the pillar windows... and mount my usb panel jacks...


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I got my windows tinted lightly (including the small windows in front) and just put some black carpet on the back side of the pods. You can't see anything through them. You could try the cling stuff like they use on the back windows of cars with babies in them.

I traded labor for my window tint, so it was pretty cheap. lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I got my windows tinted lightly (including the small windows in front) and just put some black carpet on the back side of the pods. You can't see anything through them. You could try the cling stuff like they use on the back windows of cars with babies in them.
> 
> I traded labor for my window tint, so it was pretty cheap. lol
> 
> Jay


Oh lord I have some of that cling stuff, and a baby. Good call  I have the grey vinyl on there now and it matches fairly well but it would look so much better if that whole area was black on the outside.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

UPDATES?... nope too damn sick, 4 days off and didn't get a chance to do anything.


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Sorry to hear this, and hopeful that you get better soon.


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Hopefully you are feeling better.

In reading further about rotary encoders (The Wikipedia page has been updated since I had last looked at it last year) I see that it cycles through the 4 positions during each detent then rests at open. It all happens so fast I couldn't check it with a meter. Apparently, it's an "incremental rotary encoder."

I have found the Arduino Uno to make a pretty handy piece of test equipment, by writing simple little sketches to monitor things...this may be no different. A quickie little sketch that reads the changes and prints them to the screen. 

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Well unfortunately no updates in my research or on my build. After/while I was sick my wife found out that her mother is finally ready to sell us her house. Long story short we get a huge house that we would never ever be able to afford otherwise.

Only thing is we have to sell my house before we do anything else, and my wife being who she is already has a realtor coming Monday to take a look. I have been busting my ass painting and getting my poor neglected lawn in shape... all while coughing my lungs out for the 3rd week now.

Is it sad that the thing i'm most excited about is the possibility of selling my house for nearly double what I paid for it three years ago? epper:

Would it be wrong to have mosconi amps in a Kia Rio?


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

No. No it would not.

Jay


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

Nothing wrong with adding a Morel Ultimo or ilusion carbon XL sub either


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Alrojoca said:


> Nothing wrong with adding a <snip> illusion carbon XL sub either



No, there isn't. lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> No, there isn't. lol
> 
> Jay


Lol

I got no updates again. Other than the realtor was very complimentary on what we got done to the house and gave us a few more pointers. I have to tear out my office in the garage  But I knew that was coming. Should go on the market next Monday which means the house and garage need to be spotless 24/7 :blush:

Currently looking into a tweeter change, debating a change in tweeter or change in mounting. I just cant live with the roll off on the drivers side, once I measured it and saw it was there its all I can hear.

Still haven't really looked into the response issue on the passenger mid, no time.

It sound pretty damn good tho, im at least not scrambling to get something listenable while I wait.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> It sound pretty damn good tho, im at least not scrambling to get something listenable while I wait.


oke: Was that directed at anyone in particular? lol

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> oke: Was that directed at anyone in particular? lol
> 
> Jay


If the shoe fits Jay..... if the shoe fits


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

My next purchase me thinks Seas Prestige L12re/xfc

I like it, and not nearly as expensive as the Morel Point source... and far more attainable than the KEF q100

After the off axis issues Ive been having with the Vifa xt25 and the thought of doing a big rebuild I have decided that a point source on axis would be a pretty sweet deal.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I have been doing some thinking on the xt25's as I have them currently mounted. I stated earlier that I can tell that the drivers side tweeter rolls off pretty hard. I would like to amend that statement slightly. It is not so much that I can tell what the drivers side is doing. Its that on passages where there is content above 10khz or so those particular sounds pull pretty hard right.

Now one could easily fix this by matching the roll off using eq on the passenger side. I personally believe that tonality would not suffer one bit. Though I may lose some "airiness" up top.

My pillars where built mainly with aesthetics in mind and imaging was an afterthought. Im honestly regretting that decision. I don't see a good way to toe in a mid tweet combo without looking like hell. I believe a point source driver would be the answer to my problem. I could get a single round driver fairly on axis and still look decent.

Never the less I am going to keep tuning until I am able to procure the new gear. First to go will be the amps as I just cant justify the huge footprint and massively inefficient nature(at low volumes) of the PPI black ice amps. 

Alpine PDX would be my choice atm. However Im almost scared that I would go balls out and talk myself into an Alpine HU/ rux / h800 / pdx amps combo.

Perhaps that is exactly what I need to do....


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

Very interesting thought process. Sounds surprisingly familiar.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Strangely, ^this guy runs a very similar setup as to what you describe. lol

I was looking at those point source drivers you linked to, and I'm pretty sure those are $169 EACH. Just in case you were assuming a pair...might make a difference on your thought process.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Strangely, ^this guy runs a very similar setup as to what you describe. lol
> 
> I was looking at those point source drivers you linked to, and I'm pretty sure those are $169 EACH. Just in case you were assuming a pair...might make a difference on your thought process.
> 
> Jay


Yeah I was aware that they are priced each. Actually what I didn't consider is the fact that they have a big ole ass. May be hell trying to get em to fit anyway.

Luckily I have some time to think it over... I don't actually have the money in my hand yet after all.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Im sure I could research this but im also sure someone could answer it for me in about 3 seconds. If someone went with an alpine 1din/rux/h800/pdx amps, you have the option to run digital all the way to the amps correct?

The big change alpine did was that you can no longer control the h800 through there double dins?


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

H800 to PDX amps is not digital (use RCAs).

Actually, the latest double DIN (as well as the 8" and 9") by Alpine output optical and it is digital to all sources and can feed into the H800 via the alpine toslink adapter. You could do the same to a Helix or a 6to8 with an optical board also.

The W910 to H800 combo I have been super happy with, as it allows for optical via CD, and everything else via Ai-net (no RCA runs from front to back) and the Ai-net allows the w910 to act as master volume, can switch presets, sub level control etc. with it. So basically, a w910 serves as a "controller" and a really clean source unit. Functionally, it is comparable to what a Audison DRC or a Mosconi controller does in a pure digital form but you get a cd source and dual din screen out of it. Getting the rux becomes optional as you can tune with a laptop, but the rux is handy for on the fly changes and can be tucked away in the center console or mounted if you have an extra pocket.

Confused yet?


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

papasin said:


> Very interesting thought process. Sounds surprisingly familiar.


You might think that all the time I spend on this forum I might actually learn from others... but I guess I just had to hear it for myself 



papasin said:


> H800 to PDX amps is not digital (use RCAs).
> 
> Actually, the latest double DIN (as well as the 8" and 9") by Alpine output optical and it is digital to all sources and can feed into the H800 via the alpine toslink adapter. You could do the same to a Helix or a 6to8 with an optical board also.
> 
> ...


Fantastic info! Thank you. That makes it a fairly hard choice. One thing I haven't liked is the inability to tune without a laptop. But honestly my biggest gripe was no sub level control with the 88r. If I where to spend the coin on the w910 I would most likely forego the rux... for now


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> You might think that all the time I spend on this forum I might actually learn from others... but I guess I just had to hear it for myself


I'm right there with you. That's how I learn too, and quite honestly, am still learning! 



REGULARCAB said:


> Fantastic info! Thank you. That makes it a fairly hard choice. One thing I haven't liked is the inability to tune without a laptop. But honestly my biggest gripe was no sub level control with the 88r. If I where to spend the coin on the w910 I would most likely forego the rux... for now


Or....you could forego the 910, and just jump straight to an iPad mini in the dash with a RUX/H800 combo. That gives you full optical from the iPad mini (and MrsPapasin can tell you three different methods she's tried to provide the optical interface lol) and you can get an optical CD changer for the occasional CD that you may want to load or have one of your friends want to demo with. Pretty straightforward too since the H800 has two optical inputs. I would say the cost of an iPad mini+RUX is likely comparable to a W910 (which the latter may not be easy to find as it is now 2-3 models old). Of course, the iPad mini route requires some fab skills, but unless steering wheel controls is something you are trying to retain, this would be IMHO a more "modern" interface as the W910 maps/navigation is quite dated.

Personally, I stuck to a W910 since it integrates well with my steering wheel controls with full control of volume, track up/down, even changer disc control that I was able to map to a couple buttons I don't normally use, and bluetooth handsfree answer/mute/hang up. This is not relevant in MrsPapasin's vehicle, hence why we chose the iPad mini route for her car.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

That WOULD explain why the w910 was a little harder to find just now. An Ipad mini with a rux does sound like a pretty slick deal. I am actually the type that doesn't use Bluetooth for phone calls or navigation and would easily exchange those two options for the ability to tune on the fly.

The fab isn't an issue... its the finish 

I was running through the ForTwo build log about 20mins ago. I also want to spy how you guys managed to get the wiring to the hatch door. It looks like I have my homework for the night.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

REGULARCAB said:


> I also want to spy how you guys managed to get the wiring to the hatch door.


Ahhh it flips down, a slightly different beast.


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> I also want to spy how you guys managed to get the wiring to the hatch door. It looks like I have my homework for the night.


Don't think we have build pics, but all the credit for that aspect of the install goes to jtaudioacc and it wasn't a small feat. Imagine what 3 amps needs...power, ground, remote turn on, speaker wires, and RCAs. Basically, JT added three additional wire bundles/looms that went into the hatch, one in parallel with an existing bundle and two he added on the opposite side/end. This had to remain quite flexible too, so doing a couple 1/0 was out of the question into the hatch for power and ground. For your case though, I don't think you need to make it that challenging.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

papasin said:


> Don't think we have build pics, but all the credit for that aspect of the install goes to jtaudioacc and it wasn't a small feat. Imagine what 3 amps needs...power, ground, remote turn on, speaker wires, and RCAs. Basically, JT added three additional wire bundles/looms that went into the hatch, one in parallel with an existing bundle and two he added on the opposite side/end. This had to remain quite flexible too, so doing a couple 1/0 was out of the question into the hatch for power and ground. For your case though, I don't think you need to make it that challenging.


Still a pretty neat idea. Though luckily moving to smaller amps will save me from needing to get that creative.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Since the house is finally listed, my office is finally torn out of the garage, and I actually got a nap today on top of my usual four hours of sleep. I do believe I will pull my car into my nice cleaned out garage and see why the F my passenger mid only plays down to 600hz.

EDIT: or might just go to sleep once I get off work since my baby girl will be up at 6am no matter what


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Three days on the market and I have a full price offer on my house!!! epper:


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Congrats!

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

So after taking some real measurements of the dash Its just too damn tight. I would be left with almost nothing on the top and bottom. Back to the drawing board. 

There are some Android tablets that would fit but I think if I would go android and not have the polished interface of the Apple I may as well go carpc. I haven't looked much at touch screens but they may be next. Plus it would allow me to simply have all of my music and media on hardrives in the car, cant complain about that. Not sure I want or have time for all the tinkering a car pc might take.

I still like the Ipad option the best and decided to mock up what it would look like if I had a dock that would hold the Ipad (not mini) from the bottom. This would also be a very simple mod, the worst part would be a repaint or recover of the dash piece.










So it covers up the vents when it in and I also notice (and would have with the mini as well) that there is no good place for a RUX. They are a full single din correct? The one thing I do like however is that it would be very simple to just remove the Ipad from the car and take wherever I want. Plus I have the Ipad already.

Its all just thoughts and dreams atm, we will see what actually happens once I have some money in hand.

EDIT: the ipad in the pic is pretty true to size, and it seems to be a pretty natural spot with the shelf that the aftermarket dash kit creates


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

iPhone 6 Plus? 

RUX is a little smaller than a full single din.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

papasin said:


> iPhone 6 Plus?
> 
> RUX is a little smaller than a full single din.


I have to say that w910 is looking better and better. Although I did see CAF post some 6+ slide mounts on facebook. My windows phone constantly disappoints with the lack of apps anyway... hmmmmm


----------



## diy.phil (May 23, 2011)

^^ screen/dash proportion is like a Tesla S


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

diy.phil said:


> ^^ screen/dash proportion is like a Tesla S


----------



## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Frankly, I think the Android interface works great. I've had a couple of android phones and it's intuitive to me now. My new tablet seems to work great. It's quick and has a bigger screen and better pixel density than an iPad mini Retina. It's dimensions are also more Kia Rio Dash Friendly. What REALLY pushed me toward Android was all the modded Roms out there. There are a few that are specifically geared toward using a tablet in the car with features like OTG USB support and turn off on power loss, that (AFAIK) you can't yet do on an iPad. I believe when I asked Linda about it some time ago she said she had to remember to turn hers off when she got out of the car.

I don't have the time right now, but when I get back from Finals I will probably start working on my tablet install.

Jay


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

JayinMI said:


> I believe when I asked Linda about it some time ago she said she had to remember to turn hers off when she got out of the car.



That's no longer an issue (iPad turns off after a set time once power is lost).

I think either iOS or Android can be made to work, but no matter which direction there will be trade offs compared to each other and even to a traditional HU. I'm still sticking to my W910, and for a secondary screen/device, have an iPhone 6 plus in a cradle next to me. More overall screen real-estate!


----------



## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Frankly, I think the Android interface works great. I've had a couple of android phones and it's intuitive to me now. My new tablet seems to work great. It's quick and has a bigger screen and better pixel density than an iPad mini Retina. It's dimensions are also more Kia Rio Dash Friendly. What REALLY pushed me toward Android was all the modded Roms out there. There are a few that are specifically geared toward using a tablet in the car with features like OTG USB support and turn off on power loss, that (AFAIK) you can't yet do on an iPad. I believe when I asked Linda about it some time ago she said she had to remember to turn hers off when she got out of the car.
> 
> I don't have the time right now, but when I get back from Finals I will probably start working on my tablet install.
> 
> Jay


The biggest contribution to my opinion on android tablets could very well be that I have only gotten to play with some really really crappy hardware.

I will hold the Ipad up there some time this weekend and make a decision on weather it looks atrocious or not. The nice thing would be its a minimal cost if I installed it and just hated it.

I would jump on the 910 for $500 but I would still be left with a double din dash kit im not entirely happy with, tho I just realized that there is nothing stopping me from modding it even if I stick with a double din.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

HUGE PROGRESS THIS WEEKEND!!!!

I held the Ipad up and it looked like hell, then I went back inside and watched Tranformers 4.

Carry on, that is all.....


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I got a fantastic deal on a used Alpine PDX f4 today, should ship out Monday and I will have the mids and tweets covered. I am thinking about a second f4 bridged for the midbasses, depending on the impedence of the midbasses I choose I suppose. I honestly think for now I will stay with the Pioneer GM-D mono amp, I have no issues with its size or power. Also I can't see spending a ton of scratch for a sub amp hoping for a sonic difference, maybe when I have nothing else I wasn't to swap.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Never seen your build thread until now. Really like your pillars, looks great indeed!

The Alpine PDX 2nd gen are nice amps. They are all underrated, expect ~10-15% more power than specced.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hanatsu said:


> Never seen your build thread until now. Really like your pillars, looks great indeed!
> 
> The Alpine PDX 2nd gen are nice amps. They are all underrated, expect ~10-15% more power than specced.


Yeah I have heard great things about the PDX amps.

Thanks for the props on the pillars, I've had more compliments on them than I though I would. The xt25 on the drivers side is a little too far off axis, but I just matched the roll off on each side and am pretty darn happy with the top end. I don't know that I would trade the aesthetics that I have now just to be more one axis.

I am still really debating on a point source driver for the pillars more on axis. But that is simply because I know that it should technically be a better setup, not because I have any huge issue up there.

Swapping out my big beast amps, getting a little more cone area for my sub setup, and some new midbasses are top of my list.

After those are taken care of I will consider a different processor. But again that in my mind is another case where I have to "hope" that a higher end product will make a sonic difference. Also the 88r is very capable and sounds damn good, but if I had to send it a digital signal and use that controller it came with daily I might become suicidal. I would much rather fondle a RUX than the 88r controller.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Just now realized the PDX-F4 is a little smaller footprint than a sheet of fricken paper.... WHAT WHAT!!! epper:


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Perfect as that will allow your build to take up even less space. You sir are the man.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Or an F6 bridged for the midbssses.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Or an F6 bridged for the midbssses.


I thought about that as well...


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Well the PDX f4 I bought is in a little rough shape for my tastes. Its my fault, I should have asked for more pics, I didn't see much on the pics posted and it was already known it was missing the trim ring. It was a damn steal so I can't really complain. We will see if I end up using it or not.


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## All-Or-Nothing (Apr 16, 2013)

Have you ran anything thru the AUX input on the 88r......and how does it sound.

I ask because my next build I am going to be using only an iPod Touch plugged into the 88r than out to the amps.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I'm current running my Pioneer double din front RCA output through aux. Its all I use sounds fantastic. I only did that way because initially I had everything wired to the stock radio and wanted to leave the wiring after switching to the Pioneer.


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## Rs roms (Jul 12, 2012)

REGULARCAB said:


> I got a fantastic deal on a used Alpine PDX f4 today, should ship out Monday and I will have the mids and tweets covered. I am thinking about a second f4 bridged for the midbasses, depending on the impedence of the midbasses I choose I suppose. I honestly think for now I will stay with the Pioneer GM-D mono amp, I have no issues with its size or power. Also I can't see spending a ton of scratch for a sub amp hoping for a sonic difference, maybe when I have nothing else I wasn't to swap.


I guess the F4 and F6 are sonically different, or may its just me. I myself use Gm mono and its fantastic amp, i did a blind test with focal le1.800 and couldn't spot a difference sonically. 

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

The F4 is 100*4, the F6 is 150*4, iirc. I don't know about sonically different, but slightly more headroom on the F6.

Also, I might have a pdx trim ring at the shop. Let me look around.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

There is so much fantastic gear in the classifieds right now... My damn house needs to close, I know the second I spend money I don't really have something will fall through and we will have to put it back on the market.

I'm eyeballing Vics zapco dc's. As much as I love little amps, my heart will always be with the surfboards. We will see what happens once I get the cash and pay off all my bills/debts. Then its game on. Still debating just going with a full suite of bnib authorized h800 rux 2xf6 and an m12. Tho that would honestly be the largest single purchase I've made for a hobby.

I also have to remind myself i still need midbasses and a sub. Almost 100% percent sure I'll go with the SI 6.5 since its probably going to be the most awesomeness I'll be able to fit in my doors.

The SI bm mkiv is also really hard to pass up at $300. But not being able to hear one next to an illusion xl12 has me waffling back and forth.

What's up in the pillars may stay for a while, just not sure on that one. If I do anything it will be a point source. That means new fab work, wich is actually the part I enjoy the most but I need to do trunk work first me thinks.

Just talking out loud, carry on.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> The F4 is 100*4, the F6 is 150*4, iirc. I don't know about sonically different, but slightly more headroom on the F6.
> 
> Also, I might have a pdx trim ring at the shop. Let me look around.


That would be sweet, they are 20 on ebay amd he graciously refunded 20 when he couldnt find it so i have that option as well. I'm going to clean the f4 up a little today. There are some odd corrosion spots on screws that have me worried. I'm gonna pull the top of n have a look around and see about replacing some screws. A little green crap on the RCA plugs, the rest looks pretty good besides some little scratches and a cracked logo.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I am still amazed at how damn small this thing is...


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## sirbOOm (Jan 24, 2013)

REGULARCAB said:


> That would be sweet, they are 20 on ebay amd he graciously refunded 20 when he couldnt find it so i have that option as well. I'm going to clean the f4 up a little today. There are some odd corrosion spots on screws that have me worried. I'm gonna pull the top of n have a look around and see about replacing some screws. A little green crap on the RCA plugs, the rest looks pretty good besides some little scratches and a cracked logo.


Sounds like this amp was used on a boat.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Its looking that way. I'm in the process of stripping it down as we speak. We will se how far my child lets me get before she is bored.


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

JayinMI said:


> The F4 is 100*4, the F6 is 150*4, iirc. I don't know about sonically different, but slightly more headroom on the F6.


Jay is correct on the specs. Linda has the F4s and an M12 in her car, we have the F6 and a V9 in the van.

I tested a pair of F6s in Linda's car, pretty negligible add in headroom IME FWIW. 50% more power, that translates to around 1.5dB if I'm not mistaken. The F6 comes with the stacking kit though whereas the V9 and F4 do not.


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> Still debating just going with a full suite of bnib authorized h800 rux 2xf6 and an m12. Tho that would honestly be the largest single purchase I've made for a hobby.


Do it!  Jay might know someone with a spare set that person brought to finals, although not sure what his intentions are. 



REGULARCAB said:


> The SI bm mkiv is also really hard to pass up at $300. But not being able to hear one next to an illusion xl12 has me waffling back and forth.


Also talk to Jay. He can give his impressions demoing Steve's Mazda and the Smart. :surprised: Honestly, depends on the application. The MK4 is pretty impressive if u can figure out how to shoehorn 0.5cubes up front.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Thanks papasin I was wondering what the deal was with the stacking kit.

So I opened her up and all looks good, just surface corrosion that I can actually knock off with a finger nail. Nothing in the inside. I'll post pics a little later. I'm a horrible father and I'm pretty sure my daughter needs a hug or something after ignoring her for ten minutes.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Jay, mk4 vs the illusion spit it out  

Its not the .5 cubes that would be a problem up front I think it would be the sub OD


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

papasin said:


> Do it!  Jay might know someone with a spare set that person brought to finals, although not sure what his intentions are.


Do I? Who might that be?





papasin said:


> Also talk to Jay. He can give his impressions demoing Steve's Mazda and the Smart. :surprised: Honestly, depends on the application. The MK4 is pretty impressive if u can figure out how to shoehorn 0.5cubes up front.





REGULARCAB said:


> Jay, mk4 vs the illusion spit it out
> 
> Its not the .5 cubes that would be a problem up front I think it would be the sub OD


Well, I've got to say, I heard great results from both. 
I REALLY liked Steve's car (Captainobvious), and he runs a BM MKIV. If there was anything I noticed on the down side of it was that if you listened carefully, at higher volumes, it almost sounded like the sub was fluttering or maybe hitting something inside the dash. But other than that, it sounded great.

I also heard Jason (Bertholomey's) car, and he ran one as well. His was mounted in the passenger foot well. I didn't hear the same fluttering sound I ocassionally heard in Steve's car. It's kind of hard to judge because I didn't listen to the same songs in both songs, but I was impressed by every car I heard running a MkIV. 

I heard the 12XL in Linda's car, but nothing I listened to really demonstrated the abilities of this sub. But I heard some people who demoed her car after me and it was rocking from outside the car, so it's pretty capable.

I'd say if you have the room and the power, I'd maybe do the Illusion. But the results with a BM MkIV in .5 cubes were QUITE impressive.

Jay


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

JayinMI said:


> Do I? Who might that be?



Sure...or maybe you missed the morning where you saw the bin of spares. I've PM'd REGULARCAB who I'm referring to. 

















JayinMI said:


> Well, I've got to say, I heard great results from both.
> 
> I REALLY liked Steve's car (Captainobvious), and he runs a BM MKIV. If there was anything I noticed on the down side of it was that if you listened carefully, at higher volumes, it almost sounded like the sub was fluttering or maybe hitting something inside the dash. But other than that, it sounded great.
> 
> ...



Great description Jay. You should have gone thru my playlists on the iPad. Linda has a couple tracks (i.e. Pipe organ) that go really low, but when I let Kelly, Tim, Steve Cook and a few others listen to a couple tracks on my playlist that really push that single XL, I saw some grins. 

If you have two cubes, two will really rock the car (hehe). Paired with some 8s, it's just effortless. But up front subs that can dig low really is something. I think I understand why Cook has a pair of 11s up front.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

papasin said:


> Great description Jay. You should have gone thru my playlists on the iPad. Linda has a couple tracks (i.e. Pipe organ) that go really low, but when I let Kelly, Tim, Steve Cook and a few others listen to a couple tracks on my playlist that really push that single XL, I saw some grins.


Yeah, I think it was Steve Cook who couldn't wipe the grin off his face after he got out of the Smart. He REALLY liked it. lol I figure that's sayin' something. haha.


Jay


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## BigRed (Aug 12, 2007)

The thing about up front subs is any leak, even the smallest, will be audible, especially low frequencies. Don't ask me how I know this.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I have such a small car, and haul kids. If I was to do an upfront sub it would have to go almost all the way up under the dash. I haven't taken a tape to it yet but I do know there is an ungodly amount of room up there. There are also a ton of mounting points if I remove the glove box completely, just not sure if I want to isolate it more than that.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Get a small trailer to haul the kids. Lol


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> Get a small trailer to haul the kids. Lol


Lol at least that way the words "get your shoes of my dashboard" would never have to come out of my mouth again. I'm super anal and could make anything last 100 years because I take care of it.... My wife and kids.... Aren't 

Still worth it though


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright I got the f4 cleaned and installed today. Its a shame its so marked up because it sounds fantastic. There is most certainly a difference between the PDX and my PPI black ice. The only thing I did was level match with the gains and the whole stage sounds different. There us also clearly more high frequency content. Not something I expected going from class ab to class d. Gonna do a retune for giggles even though there should be a huge gear swap in the coming weeks.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Please measure the system before and after the swap. Keep the mic in a fixed position. That would be very interesting 

Have you posted a pic on that amp btw?

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hmmmmm I believe I have graphs saved pre swap and I'll certainly run some new measurements. Unfortunately the only pre swap ones I'll have are averaged. But I can at least use the same method post swap. I'm telling you I was one that though it wouldn't make a difference... But it totally sounds different.

I haven't, I'll see if I can pull my laptop out after I get this little one to sleep.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hanatsu said:


> Please measure the system before and after the swap. Keep the mic in a fixed position. That would be very interesting
> 
> Have you posted a pic on that amp btw?
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


Btw I'm totally not starting that debate lol. I'm pretty sure it will measure damn near identical. But you have me curious now...


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, so my 88r had defaulted to a different tune after disconnecting the battery. Thank god that tune had crossovers.

Yup it sounds pretty much the same, not the night and day difference I was hearing.... I stand corrected. I'm still going to measure a before and after though.

Pics when I get to work.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Rational explainations ftw 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


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## sqnut (Dec 24, 2009)

REGULARCAB said:


> Alright, so my 88r had defaulted to a different tune after disconnecting the battery. Thank god that tune had crossovers.


You had me worried there for a while


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

At least I never said it sounded better, just different


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

A copy from my other thread. I still have no measurements, my wifes father got hurt so I've been a single dad for 5 days now. Im actually very surprised my little one let me get as much done as I have. She's missed mom so i've been soaking up all the snuggles, its been awesome.

I actually failed to get any good pics of the corrosion… here is the cracked logo plate and a few other random damage pics. It’s actually hard to get a pics of this. 




























Corrosion on RCA's. This was after some manual manipulation. Some clr and some care fixed it right up.










All four corners looked like this. No corrosion, but pretty messed up.










Somehow the only pic I have of a corroded screw, they where white/green. There were 4 screws on the top plate that had the heads sheared right off, but they were clean bare metal so its not like they were rusted through. Who knows.










I decided to open her up just to make sure there wasn't any water damage on the inside. Luckily it was clean as a whistle.





































I was able to get all of the corrosion off with CLR in a cup. Just let it soak for about 30min then wiped the screws off. My god these things have a lot of screws. Most of the paint came off where the corrosion was. I fixed it with a sharpie.










Here is the current mess I have, at least she is installed. I’ll do a full rebuild once I get the rest of the gear.










Its certainly smaller than the Black Ice epper:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I can't find my laptop charger for the life of me. But on a happy note buying 32 Rubbermaid totes instead of moving boxes was the best idea ever!!!! My garage is going to look so organized once we get all the moving crap out of them  Nice big shelves and 32 of the exact same box... with labels


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Finally found my laptop charger, if I get a chance Ill try and find some time to see whats really going on with my tune.

I did finally get the gains set by ear to a point that is at least listenable with the original tune I had. The gain seems far more touchy on the PDX compared to the black ice. I could F with the gain on the black ice all day long and not really be able to tell the difference in levels. Not sure if that has to do with power or gain knob sensitivity.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Finally ordered myself another Porter Cable cordless drill and Impact driver combo. Now Ill have 2 of the same drill plus the impact driver, 4 batteries and two chargers. Lowes had a clearance on batteries as well I will go see if I can pick up another on the cheap for giggles.

I preferred my Bosch drill while it lasted but the porter cable seems to be a damn good bang for buck and has lasted for 5 years of hobby use. The bosch was used when I was a carpenter. It died a heroic death driving trex screws for the last months of its life.

Finally I will have 3 drill drivers to use. Drill the hole, counter sink, drive the screw without changing bits. Sounds like a small thing but I'm excited epper:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Alright, my darn house needs to sell already. I've been on a tool buying binge the last 2 weeks or so.... I wanna cut some damn wood!!!!! Now!!!


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I thought you already had accepted an offer, and I know when I was looking to buy a house the mortgage companies always wanted to do it by the end/beginning of a month to avoid extra interest or something. Did the offer fall through? Or is the process just taking too long? lol

Jay


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Completely OT.

What's the general short time interest rate for a house loan in the US? In Sweden we recently hit an extremely low rate of 2,09%/3 months.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I wouldn't know unfortunately. We aren't looking to buy another house. My mother in law is moving to the beach house after getting divorced and we are getting her big ass house that we could never afford. So the equity in my home is going to be straight up cash. Good times!! epper:

I wanna say its 3% on a 30 year but don't quote me.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Lol can you do 30year deals? 10years is the maximum here.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

JayinMI said:


> I thought you already had accepted an offer, and I know when I was looking to buy a house the mortgage companies always wanted to do it by the end/beginning of a month to avoid extra interest or something. Did the offer fall through? Or is the process just taking too long? lol
> 
> Jay


Nah its going by super fast actually. I won't jjnx myself but its shaping up to be the first real 6 week closing I've ever seen. I'm just impatient lol.

Set to close Friday the 14th. I'm telling the wife, who has never sold a house that it will most likely be the week after just to be safe. Something stupid is bound to happen.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hanatsu said:


> Lol can you do 30year deals? 10years is the maximum here.
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


Yup and I bet y'all have far less people upside down in their loans because of it.


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

I've heard people talk about 50 year loans in CA because of the crazy prices.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah you can get 50 year loans... And pay more in interest over those 50 year than you paid for the house.

Its an option tho and still better than renting.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Balls!!!!!

Only 11 inches under the dash from firewall to inside bottom of the glove box cover. But then again there is no reason I can't just remove the glove box and the cover . I'm getting a bm mkiv in there I promise. But I REALLY can't give up leg room... Or more accurate, I can't have out in the open for my daughter to kick.

Jay, you don't happen to have any shots of the car with the glove box pulled out? I'll check your build log.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

REGULARCAB said:


> Jay, you don't happen to have any shots of the car with the glove box pulled out? I'll check you build.








That's what I got.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Hmmmmm no good way to get rid of that bar across the bottom. Thanks for the pics Jay!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Of course there is always this option (drawn perfectly to scale  )


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

If a Smart can house a C12XL up front in a 1 cu. enclosure, anything is possible.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

papasin said:


> If a Smart can house a C12XL up front in a 1 cu. enclosure, anything is possible.


Yeah, the footwell in the Rio is very deep. I may just have to try and find a really nice grill that I like... and set some ground rules for riding in my car 

I did get the call today to set up the appointment with the escrow company to close on the house. Its getting real now :blush:


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Just a thought, but you could probably do a Dayton RSS265HO up front, and they model pretty well down to .3 ft3, and I've heard 2 of them sharing .55, and was quite impressed. 

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I haven't had the chance to really look at subs since the size constraint became apparent. But with no glove box I could do a ten and .5 seems reasonable up under there. I would love to do an illusion up there just not sure I can justify the cost. 300 I could do for the SI. I haven't heard any subs other than the 804's in years. A Dayton may be the ticket. I'll have to do some searching and modeling and see what I think. I have to realize that the SI while probably amazing isn't a silver bullet solution and other subs would probably sound damn good.

After all I'm pretty happy with the 804's in just want something up front with some really low extension.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Damon (DRTHJTA) is running them in his Jetta Sport Wagon (Wagen?) so you might shoot him a message. They also do REALLY well in a .65-.7ft ported enclosure tuned in the 30-33Hz range.

Jay


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

A three inch port in a .65 foot enclosure tuned to 30hz is 30inches. I wonder If I could squeeze the extra length in the space behind the console and across the firewall into the drivers side.

Ill get into the nitty gritty once I actually move. And the wait is killing me! Everything Is signed and will be recorded on Friday. I at least know exactly how much we will make off the sale. No car payments and zero debt is going to be so damn nice!


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Found the grill I need for a sub in the footwell :laugh:










:kaboom: :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown:


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

A little disadvantage with front subs is that the first modal null occurs much lower in frequency. In a smaller car it tends to end up around 50Hz.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S5 using Tapatalk


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## All-Or-Nothing (Apr 16, 2013)

REGULARCAB said:


> Of course there is always this option (drawn perfectly to scale  )




I'm liking this option and if you are looking just for some up-front bass an Earthquake SWS slim sub would sound really good. They are really really slim.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

MOVING TOMORROW!!!! epper:

Will be doing a little subwoofer research and some overall system planning tonight at work while I squirm in my seat.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Some recent thoughts. Thinking of either toeing in the tweeters a bit. The roll off on the drivers side kills me.

Or putting some different tweeters here.


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> Or putting some different tweeters here.


In my car, relocating the tweeters worked quite well.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Yeah at the moment I'm suffering a bit on width and the image just collapses into the speaker when anything is panned left or right. I remember you had your tweeters there, erin had his in a similar location at one point. Its nice to see a few cars without sails have them in that location... so im not crazy

I am going to toe in the mid a bit. Im also seriously debating grabbing a second f4 and just stacking it on top of the one I got such a deal on. It came with what I swear are plates to stack these things... tho I hear they do not stack :shrug:


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

REGULARCAB said:


> Its nice to see a few cars without sails have them in that location... so im not crazy




xxx_busa's Acura TL 
















REGULARCAB said:


> Im also seriously debating grabbing a second f4 and just stacking it on top of the one I got such a deal on. It came with what I swear are plates to stack these things... tho I hear they do not stack :shrug:




All the 2nd gen Alpine PDX amps stack. The only difference between them is which ones come with the stacking kits. The F4 and V9 nominally don't come with the kits, but it looks like your F4 did. The M6, M12, and F6 come with the kits. In my brother's pilot, I stacked an F4 and an M6 before he totaled it and took the loss on the audio. :mean:


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Always a wealth of knowledge Richard, thank you.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

I would start a new thread but I fear getting banned for starting another thread on gains. I've always set mine by eat and adjusted at the gain knob when rta'ing then do cuts to match left and right. Do most of you guys set your gains to max unclipped then do ALL of your adjustments at the dsp? I feel I should have read this somewhere.


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## Rs roms (Jul 12, 2012)

REGULARCAB said:


> I would start a new thread but I fear getting banned for starting another thread on gains. I've always set mine by eat and adjusted at the gain knob when rta'ing then do cuts to match left and right. Do most of you guys set your gains to max unclipped then do ALL of your adjustments at the dsp? I feel I should have read this somewhere.


I always set my gains with ear and Yes to the max unclipped level.
Then everything from dsp/ head unit to level match drivers and pair of drivers.

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Well that was one hell of a day. We decided to get all thrifty and not hire movers. With my brother having not spoken to us in six months, my fathers broken foot, and everyone else helping my mother in law move. My poor wife and my self decided to do the entire move ourselves with s 17foot U-Haul. Let me say, the last time I moved i had a bachelors amount of crap. Wtf! Never again will i move without hiring someone... Or with a 15mobrh old under foot (my goodness she was a little trooper today)

Now i probably drink 4 or 5 times a year, but a rum and coke is treating me real nice atm.


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

When we moved houses in 2010 (our old place and current one are only two blocks apart), Linda was nearly 7 months pregnant with our daughter. We were even more hard headed and didn't even rent a U haul. She moved things by loading up her Smart car multiple times a day. Her rationale was she could never fit anything big in the Smart, but was able to take small loads. Everything else was moved with our van or a pickup truck from a coworker. It was a two week ordeal. We're not moving again! Lol


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## Hoptologist (Sep 14, 2012)

I feel you. Between 2005 and 2011, I moved 11 times, LOL, I've never calculated it before now. (Moved to Goleta, 2 times there, back home, 2 more times in Fresno, to Santa Cruz, back to Fresno, and 3 more times in Fresno), which is where I've stayed since then. That seems NUTS, but I loved it. I was also with roommates/friends, so moving wasn't a big deal and was pretty fun actually. Now that I'm just living with my GF, I'm dreading the next move, which will be next August into a house.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

I also moved just 1.5 miles from where we lived, we moved to a much bigger house in 2000, my younger half brothers helped.

I do not want to think about the next time I move. When you move to a bigger house you tend to fill it up with more furniture and things. The good thing is my kids are bigger.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Hey man, you still alive out there? Been a minute since I've seen you post. Did you move yet?

Jay


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

I hope he is okay, I have not seen him post in the forum for quite some time, weeks.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

I just checked and he is (or was in the last like 10mins) online. So, that's a good sign. lol


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

That's good, you know how it is, sometimes things get so busy, no time to post, I can imagine all the work needed moving to another home and unpack and fix the new one, and having a little one and both parents working, not easy.


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## REGULARCAB (Sep 26, 2013)

Sorry. Yeah I'm still alive. Can't promise I'm back tho. Life got pretty crazy with work n the kiddos. Been driving around for a few months now w a whine. Decided to take a look today, it was a loose speaker plug on that alpine amp. Somehow I thought of yall and figured I'd see what ur up to.


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