# Blackmore V2.. taking the dipole Lowther to the next level



## the other hated guy

Hello all, I have spent the last 2 weeks planing and working out the details for this.. Also getting all the ancillary mfg's taken care of.. 

First off a big thank you to Jon Ver Halen for going above and beyond as he is truly a class act.. 

This will be a true 2way with dual Dynaudio MW172's handling the midbass/subbass duties.. 

The up and coming design starting tomorrow night, please keep in mind that the original was going to be a set of dual 6's and 10pr's which has changed to dual Dynaudio MW172's :eyebrows:










the template drawn onto a sheet of mdf...










A tasty pair of PM6A's 15ohm silver vc's that showed up on my doorstep today


----------



## Volenti

Certainlly looks very intriuging, you're not worried about edge diffraction with essentially just the bare driver there? I've built/measured a few open baffle setups and a small equidistant baffle with sharp edges always has a nasty effect on the response in my experience.


----------



## sinister-kustoms

Awesome! I love watching your builds...very inspiring!


----------



## the other hated guy

Volenti said:


> Certainlly looks very intriuging, you're not worried about edge diffraction with essentially just the bare driver there? I've built/measured a few open baffle setups and a small equidistant baffle with sharp edges always has a nasty effect on the response in my experience.


This is the best Lowther application I have heard to date.. above and beyond any horn or OB application that I have hard the pleasure of listening to. 

No baffle...no box.. this takes everything I thought I knew about audio and tosses it right out of the door..


----------



## the other hated guy

sinister-kustoms said:


> Awesome! I love watching your builds...very inspiring!


Thanks!!!!

this will be allot of fun


----------



## the other hated guy

So, some toys showed up on my doorstep today ... I love me some Dyn!!!!!

excuse the mess as this is just my break in rig...


----------



## Mtgrooves

The new designs looks like the old Revel Salon on acid I love it man!


----------



## Fozz

Where can you buy raw Dynaudio drivers?


----------



## the other hated guy

so I couldn't just sit around.. lol.. baffles are rough cut and glued and ready to be routed. And the master jig is a 100% drawn and rough cut and ready for tomorrow 's date with the new tool  aka the mobile solutions shape stick


----------



## the other hated guy

Mtgrooves said:


> The new designs looks like the old Revel Salon on acid I love it man!



thanks brother...


----------



## the other hated guy

Fozz said:


> Where can you buy raw Dynaudio drivers?


why those are car audio drivers :surprised:


----------



## the other hated guy

So 23 pieces per side with a mixture of 1/2 and 3/4 mdf..

Picked up all the material needed today. Finished cleaning up the Master Jig and created 2 more smaller masters for each section with a little router clean up in a few areas. All that's left is to make the insert jigs and all the hard work is done. I also traced out all the pieces needed on all the mdf


----------



## 60ndown

the other hated guy said:


>


so the pressurized air in front of the cone just whips round the back,

and sounds good ?

explain please, in 25 words or less


----------



## laxcat73

hooly **** had no idea those speakers were $1300/pair...they better sound good!


----------



## MiniVanMan

60ndown said:


> so the pressurized air in front of the cone just whips round the back,
> 
> and sounds good ?
> 
> explain please, in 25 words or less


1. Crossed
2. Over
3. at
4. 400 hz
5. Helps
6. Reduce
7. The
8. Effects
9. Of
10. Baffle
11. Step
12. Which 
13. Is 
14. The 
15. Product
16. Of
17. The
18. Wave
19. Wrapping
20. Around
21. The
22. Baffle.
23. Including
24. DiPole
25. Configurations.


----------



## the other hated guy

LOL... that's awesome... couldn't have said in better in 25 words or less.. :laugh:



MiniVanMan said:


> 1. Crossed
> 2. Over
> 3. at
> 4. 400 hz
> 5. Helps
> 6. Reduce
> 7. The
> 8. Effects
> 9. Of
> 10. Baffle
> 11. Step
> 12. Which
> 13. Is
> 14. The
> 15. Product
> 16. Of
> 17. The
> 18. Wave
> 19. Wrapping
> 20. Around
> 21. The
> 22. Baffle.
> 23. Including
> 24. DiPole
> 25. Configurations.


----------



## the other hated guy

Alright... this 95 + degree with heat index's of 105 plus sucks..


After 2 -3/4 inch sheets and 4 - 1/2 sheets of mdf all is rough cut and one is routed and glued together.. The end caps are just sitting in place as the baffle for the dual Dynaudio MW172's still has to be made, but you get the idea.. 

You can also see the dual 1 1/4 dowel bracing which worked out very nicely.. 

All the roundovers had to be extended past each layer to insure the shape held true and any imperfections will be fixed..


----------



## 60ndown

MiniVanMan said:


> 1. Crossed
> 2. Over
> 3. at
> 4. 400 hz
> 5. Helps
> 6. Reduce
> 7. The
> 8. Effects
> 9. Of
> 10. Baffle
> 11. Step
> 12. Which
> 13. Is
> 14. The
> 15. Product
> 16. Of
> 17. The
> 18. Wave
> 19. Wrapping
> 20. Around
> 21. The
> 22. Baffle.
> 23. Including
> 24. DiPole
> 25. Configurations.


love it, straight talk. thanks.


----------



## MarkZ

the other hated guy said:


>


----------



## 60ndown

sealed, ported, bandpass, isobarrek, horn, open baffle i can understand, 

but wtf is going on inside this box?

looks like the frequency graph of a badly tuned car

can that be the idea? to tune peaks and troughs inside the box ??


----------



## 60ndown

MarkZ said:


>


lmfao


----------



## the other hated guy

OK... not allot finished today... just way to damn hot and humid.. plus I'm waiting on some more 2way tape...

baffles are cut-routed-and glued in place.. and I ran some fiberglass paste over a few areas.. all that is left on these guys is to do the inserts and then off to body work 

P.S.... yeah the pics are taken in my kid's play room


----------



## mmiller

Looking at these sick ass speakers makes me wanna forget about Car audio all together!

Wow, I understand your sig now... I hate you too... im envious of your mad woodworking skills!


----------



## mmiller

what will the total impedance be??


----------



## mmiller

60ndown said:


> sealed, ported, bandpass, isobarrek, horn, open baffle i can understand,
> 
> but wtf is going on inside this box?
> 
> looks like the frequency graph of a badly tuned car
> 
> can that be the idea? to tune peaks and troughs inside the box ??



x2!!!!!!!


----------



## MiniVanMan

60ndown said:


> sealed, ported, bandpass, isobarrek, horn, open baffle i can understand,
> 
> but wtf is going on inside this box?
> 
> looks like the frequency graph of a badly tuned car
> 
> can that be the idea? to tune peaks and troughs inside the box ??


Breaking up the backwave.


----------



## silentbass

u my friend are amazing....good wrk


----------



## 60ndown

MiniVanMan said:


> Breaking up the backwave.


http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=260-515


----------



## the other hated guy

60ndown said:


> Acoustic Foam 2-1/2" 24" x 18" UL 94 | Parts-Express.com


the foam will not act like anything that I am doing.. I am randomizing the contact areas of the backwave "not absorbing" .. this provides a smoother response along with some very minor impedance correction believe it or not..


----------



## the other hated guy

mmiller said:


> Looking at these sick ass speakers makes me wanna forget about Car audio all together!
> 
> Wow, I understand your sig now... I hate you too... im envious of your mad woodworking skills!


Thanks


----------



## 60ndown

the other hated guy said:


> the foam will not act like anything that I am doing.. I am randomizing the contact areas of the backwave "not absorbing" .. this provides a smoother response along with some very minor impedance correction believe it or not..


if we built 2 cabinets, 1 with your design, 1 with the foam, same drivers.

and richard clarke set up the amps 

you really think you could identify accurately and consistently which box was which? 

if the test was done blindly id have $50 to gamble. 

inert is inert right?


----------



## the other hated guy

mmiller said:


> what will the total impedance be??


this loudspeaker is designed to be biamped.. 

so a amp of your choice to the the Lowther " Tube or ss like a firstwatt"...... Then a large A/B or D to power the dyns


----------



## the other hated guy

60ndown said:


> if we built 2 cabinets, 1 with your design, 1 with the foam, same drivers.
> 
> and richard clarke set up the amps
> 
> you really think you could identify accurately and consistently which box was which?
> 
> if the test was done blindly id have $50 to gamble.
> 
> inert is inert right?


I have tested both which is why I build it this way... I wouldn't waste allot of work..allot of time and allot of money if it wasn't beneficial


----------



## the other hated guy

60ndown said:


> if we built 2 cabinets, 1 with your design, 1 with the foam, same drivers.
> 
> and richard clarke set up the amps
> 
> you really think you could identify accurately and consistently which box was which?
> 
> if the test was done blindly id have $50 to gamble.
> 
> inert is inert right?


*******


----------



## laxcat73

pwnt


----------



## MiniVanMan

60ndown said:


> if we built 2 cabinets, 1 with your design, 1 with the foam, same drivers.
> 
> and richard clarke set up the amps
> 
> you really think you could identify accurately and consistently which box was which?
> 
> if the test was done blindly id have $50 to gamble.
> 
> inert is inert right?


If you're going to argue with him on it, AT LEAST be intelligent, and thought provoking. Also, understanding some concepts might be in your best interest as well.

See, your first question should have been, "how thick is the front baffle?". Why? Well, because that's what's going to separate the backwave from the front wave. By breaking up the backwave you have much less chance of it interfering with the front wave. 

A 3/4" MDF plank will attenuate an 80 hz tone by 12 db. So, if he's playing these lower, which I suspect he will, as they're perfectly capable of, it will create even less attenuation. What happens when a back wave interferes with a front wave? Well, it's out of phase for one, so you figure it out. Is it audible? Can be, depending on the frequency.

So, let's say he's doing this right and utilizing a 1 1/2" thick baffle. He gets roughly 24db of attenuation at 80 hz, and plays these at 100 db. 80 hz will be attenuated down to 76 db. Is that audible enough to hear? Sure is. Can you hear the road noise in your car? 

So, by breaking up the backwave, you never let it propagate enough so that it can interfere with the front wave. At least, not at a frequency powerful enough to cause interference, given the baffle is thick enough.

The acoustic foam is really only designed to handle midrange and higher frequencies. It's simply not absorbent enough to null a full power sub 100 hz propagated 1/4, 1/2 or full wave. 

There! Now you feel better about all the hard work and attention to detail he's doing. Randy and I have butted heads in the past, but never over actual physics, and design. There's a reason for that. What he's doing is right, and highly attentive to detail. 

By the way, most high end loudspeakers, and even mid level utilize some form of backwave break up system. The simplest is a simple plank of MDF running the height of the two bass producing drivers. Turn it parallel to the plane of the speakers and you can drill as many irregularly sized (2, 3, 4, 5 inch) holes as you can. 

What he's doing is common for well designed cabinets. What you're suggesting is being lazy, and compromises any design due to that.


----------



## mmiller

60ndown said:


> if we built 2 cabinets, 1 with your design, 1 with the foam, same drivers.
> 
> and richard clarke set up the amps
> 
> you really think you could identify accurately and consistently which box was which?
> 
> if the test was done blindly id have $50 to gamble.
> 
> inert is inert right?



I wanna see you Build something better!


----------



## the other hated guy

MiniVanMan said:


> There! Now you feel better about all the hard work and attention to detail he's doing. Randy and I have butted heads in the past, but never over actual physics, and design. There's a reason for that. What he's doing is right, and highly attentive to detail.


we but heads because we are thick headed and passionate... not a good combo


----------



## Lanson

All I'm thinking is that you must have hundreds of acres of MDF forest behind your house.



















Looks awesome, as usual. Keep doing what you do.


----------



## sinister-kustoms

the other hated guy said:


> I am randomizing the contact areas of the backwave "not absorbing" .. this provides a smoother response along with some very minor impedance correction believe it or not..


Is there a calculation process to this, or is it as simple as adding randomised shapes to to enclosure?


----------



## MiniVanMan

sinister-kustoms said:


> Is there a calculation process to this, or is it as simple as adding randomised shapes to to enclosure?


You can, but in the end, after all your calculations you'll find yourself using randomized shapes to accomplish the task.


----------



## roduk

Wow Randy they look amazing. Love the builds and the lengths you go to to stop the rear wave - Absolutely amazing stuff 

I'm over on Talkaudio in the UK - (Rug Doctor, moderator,) and had seen the previous builds - please update over there too, some of the guys would love to see these


----------



## 60ndown

MiniVanMan said:


> If you're going to argue with him on it, AT LEAST be intelligent, and thought provoking. Also, understanding some concepts might be in your best interest as well.
> 
> See, your first question should have been, "how thick is the front baffle?". Why? Well, because that's what's going to separate the backwave from the front wave. By breaking up the backwave you have much less chance of it interfering with the front wave.
> 
> A 3/4" MDF plank will attenuate an 80 hz tone by 12 db. So, if he's playing these lower, which I suspect he will, as they're perfectly capable of, it will create even less attenuation. What happens when a back wave interferes with a front wave? Well, it's out of phase for one, so you figure it out. Is it audible? Can be, depending on the frequency.
> 
> So, let's say he's doing this right and utilizing a 1 1/2" thick baffle. He gets roughly 24db of attenuation at 80 hz, and plays these at 100 db. 80 hz will be attenuated down to 76 db. Is that audible enough to hear? Sure is. Can you hear the road noise in your car?
> 
> So, by breaking up the backwave, you never let it propagate enough so that it can interfere with the front wave. At least, not at a frequency powerful enough to cause interference, given the baffle is thick enough.
> 
> The acoustic foam is really only designed to handle midrange and higher frequencies. It's simply not absorbent enough to null a full power sub 100 hz propagated 1/4, 1/2 or full wave.
> 
> There! Now you feel better about all the hard work and attention to detail he's doing. Randy and I have butted heads in the past, but never over actual physics, and design. There's a reason for that. What he's doing is right, and highly attentive to detail.
> 
> By the way, most high end loudspeakers, and even mid level utilize some form of backwave break up system. The simplest is a simple plank of MDF running the height of the two bass producing drivers. Turn it parallel to the plane of the speakers and you can drill as many irregularly sized (2, 3, 4, 5 inch) holes as you can.
> 
> What he's doing is common for well designed cabinets. What you're suggesting is being lazy, and compromises any design due to that.


im not arguing with anyone, just thinking out loud. 

ill have to read your post a few times to understand it.

im not lazy at all, but if the difference between a simple and complicated box is 2% more sq, im not sure its worth it, to me.

but even as i type that, im tempted to go brace "the ****e' out of my sub box :blush:


----------



## the other hated guy

A decent day today in the ole shop..

both insert jigs were made and fit nicely.. the 5 main middle layers of the second loudspeaker were routed and glued together... but now I am waiting on some more 2way tape to finish the second one.. more will be in Tuesday.. 

The baffle is glued in place and cured along with the nutserts.. and some minor fiberglassing was done.. a light skim coat and this baby is ready for some slicksand


----------



## MiniVanMan

60ndown said:


> im not arguing with anyone, just thinking out loud.
> 
> ill have to read your post a few times to understand it.
> 
> im not lazy at all, but if the difference between a simple and complicated box is 2% more sq, im not sure its worth it, to me.
> 
> but even as i type that, im tempted to go brace "the ****e' out of my sub box :blush:


It's not bracing that he was going after. He got bracing a side effect, but it wasn't bracing. Two different animals to combat two different problems.

As for a 2% gain. If you've spent $3000.00 on drivers to realize a 2% gain in performance over $500.00 in drivers, then you bet your ass you go for the other 2%. If you're building loudspeakers around Dayton Classics? Well, it might be overkill.

Home audio is a different animal for me. I don't have a problem spending money on good drivers, given the performance justifies the cost. Because, when designing the loudspeaker, I don't feel it's worth going to the trouble to just throw $20.00 drivers in there. It's a lot of work. Sure, it'll sound good, but, with that level of work to do it right, you might as well go for broke.


----------



## 60ndown

MiniVanMan said:


> It's not bracing that he was going after. He got bracing a side effect, but it wasn't bracing. Two different animals to combat two different problems.
> 
> As for a 2% gain. If you've spent $3000.00 on drivers to realize a 2% gain in performance over $500.00 in drivers, then you bet your ass you go for the other 2%. If you're building loudspeakers around Dayton Classics? Well, it might be overkill.
> 
> Home audio is a different animal for me. I don't have a problem spending money on good drivers, given the performance justifies the cost. Because, when designing the loudspeaker, I don't feel it's worth going to the trouble to just throw $20.00 drivers in there. It's a lot of work. Sure, it'll sound good, but, with that level of work to do it right, you might as well go for broke.


in a blind test,
dark room, several amps/speakers/sources
im sure we would have some interesting results.

id wager most people would find it impossible to consistantly pick the *high end* stuffs if they couldnt see it, using just their hearing, which means, lower end stuff can sound just as good. 

i try to stay focussed on the music, not the last 2% performance of the system.

spending a week in a hot garage cutting mdf and another week finishing ($30 an hour x 80), and spending $3000 on drivers appeals to me much less then spending $350 on a forum on some well respected used speakers, and enjoying great music the same day.

over 2%.

Forums - Classifieds


ive heard some killer home rigs, its nice, but not $30,000 better then a $700 system.

imo


----------



## laxcat73

minivan nailed it on the head.

home audio is a completely different beast than car audio and in my opinion much more enjoyable 

60ndown, different strokes for different folks. you might not care but he might. that's why everyone's different i suppose


----------



## the other hated guy

acouple of things

I live a very black/white view of audio..

if it's better.. then it's better period.. putting brand...price etc aside.. 

I am tired of listening to good speakers.. there are a 1000 mfgs that make them.. but very few IMO make astounding speakers.. and usually it's that last 10% the seperates the men from the boys.. and sometimes that last 10% cost 1000x's more then the first 90%..

if you are happy with average playback then good for you.. I'm not.. nor do I build pieces for clients that want it.. they want that last 10%..

and contrary to the large belief on this forum that not all solutions can be had for $10...


----------



## Boostedrex

More great work Randy! I wish I lived closer so I could hear some of your designs after they're finished. 

What kind of wood are you going to use for the inlay on these??


----------



## Fozz

MiniVanMan said:


> If you're going to argue with him on it, AT LEAST be intelligent, and thought provoking. Also, understanding some concepts might be in your best interest as well.
> 
> See, your first question should have been, "how thick is the front baffle?". Why? Well, because that's what's going to separate the backwave from the front wave. By breaking up the backwave you have much less chance of it interfering with the front wave.
> 
> A 3/4" MDF plank will attenuate an 80 hz tone by 12 db. So, if he's playing these lower, which I suspect he will, as they're perfectly capable of, it will create even less attenuation. What happens when a back wave interferes with a front wave? Well, it's out of phase for one, so you figure it out. Is it audible? Can be, depending on the frequency.
> 
> So, let's say he's doing this right and utilizing a 1 1/2" thick baffle. He gets
> roughly 24db of attenuation at 80 hz, and plays these at 100 db. 80 hz will be attenuated down to 76 db. Is that audible enough to hear? Sure is. Can you hear the road noise in your car?
> 
> So, by breaking up the backwave, you never let it propagate enough so that it can interfere with the front wave. At least, not at a frequency powerful enough to cause interference, given the baffle is thick enough.
> 
> The acoustic foam is really only designed to handle midrange and higher frequencies. It's simply not absorbent enough to null a full power sub 100 hz propagated 1/4, 1/2 or full wave.
> 
> There! Now you feel better about all the hard work and attention to detail he's doing. Randy and I have butted heads in the past, but never over actual physics, and design. There's a reason for that. What he's doing is right, and highly attentive to detail.
> 
> By the way, most high end loudspeakers, and even mid level utilize some form of backwave break up system. The simplest is a simple plank of MDF running the height of the two bass producing drivers. Turn it parallel to the plane of the speakers and you can drill as many irregularly sized (2, 3, 4, 5 inch) holes as you can.
> 
> What he's doing is common for well designed cabinets. What you're suggesting is being lazy, and compromises any design due to that.


Not sure I agree with some of your numbers here. I'm not saying your incorrect, just that I've never read anything about how much MDF attenuates a particular frequency. Where did that information come from? Can you explain more on this?

I don't follow you on your front baffle theory either. Again, I'm not saying your wrong, just that I'm not following you.

As far as irregular shaped enclosures go, I would say they help midrange frequencies most due to the shorter wave lengths, but I'm sure some small gain can be made for lower frequency drivers as well (though minor). The increased rigidity and density will probably help ,more than the shape alone.

Do you feel having air space between the layers to be a good thing? I've only ever built cabinets with similar shaped walls ( the irregular internal shape is more uniform in my personal designs).


----------



## MiniVanMan

Fozz said:


> Not sure I agree with some of your numbers here. I'm not saying your incorrect, just that I've never read anything about how much MDF attenuates a particular frequency. Where did that information come from? Can you explain more on this?
> 
> I don't follow you on your front baffle theory either. Again, I'm not saying your wrong, just that I'm not following you.
> 
> As far as irregular shaped enclosures go, I would say they help midrange frequencies most due to the shorter wave lengths, but I'm sure some small gain can be made for lower frequency drivers as well (though minor). The increased rigidity and density will probably help ,more than the shape alone.
> 
> Do you feel having air space between the layers to be a good thing? I've only ever built cabinets with similar shaped walls ( the irregular internal shape is more uniform in my personal designs).


I can't find it right now. A few years ago, there was some huge talk about various densities of materials used for baffles. I'll have to dig further. STC ratings help a little bit, but are only good down to 125 hz. I don't remember if I did some math, or found the information. My numbers might also be off, but the points are still valid.

The lower the frequency, the less attenuation a barrier will provide. 

You are correct about midrange frequencies being more affected by the random shapes. Because these are the frequencies that will fully propagate in the enclosure. However, we need to be concerned with quarter wave as well.

The baffle is one of the least understood, and misstated in purpose, components of loudspeaker design. It's SOOOO much more than just a place to mount the drivers.


----------



## Fozz

I think you need to come to a happy medium when it comes to front baffle thickness. If it's too thin, you loose strength, but if it's too thick, you can choke The loudspeaker. Obviously, the shape of the front of the cabinet is going to influence the speakers sound.


----------



## the other hated guy

Fozz said:


> I think you need to come to a happy medium when it comes to front baffle thickness. If it's too thin, you loose strength, but if it's too thick, you can choke The loudspeaker. Obviously, the shape of the front of the cabinet is going to influence the speakers sound.


You can have a thick baffle and not choke the driver.. you just have to be cleaver about it


----------



## Fozz

True enough.
And you certainly don't have that problem with the mids on this build.


----------



## the other hated guy

Got the other one routed today along with the top inserts... I am changing the paint color along with doing some suede and veneer..


----------



## ItalynStylion

the other hated guy said:


> You can have a thick baffle and not choke the driver.. you just have to be cleaver about it


Indeed. And it's a very important thing to do depending on the driver type and size.

Randy, I gotta come up there and build with you one day. Your finishing skills and router work are just plain awesome.


----------



## 60ndown

whats your top 3 demo songs randy?

what music will emanate from these first once they are finished?

suede?


----------



## ItalynStylion

60ndown said:


> what music will emanate from these first once they are finished?


Always what I'm thinking about during a build....


----------



## the other hated guy

ItalynStylion said:


> Indeed. And it's a very important thing to do depending on the driver type and size.
> 
> Randy, I gotta come up there and build with you one day. Your finishing skills and router work are just plain awesome.



Thanks buddy... you are welcome anytime.. but I'd hold off until the listening room is done...


----------



## the other hated guy

3 songs are hard...

But typically it will be:

Brian Bromberg - Come Together
Nils Lofgren - Keith Don't Go
Lisa Hannigan - Silent Night


----------



## ItalynStylion

the other hated guy said:


> Thanks buddy... you are welcome anytime.. but I'd hold off until the listening room is done...


Let me know when that is. I might even have to bring up a set of my own speakers so we can have some fun.


----------



## 60ndown

another q randy,

the last set of speakers you put such a labor of love into,

where are they now?

im guessing they didnt satisfy you for some reason, 

why not?


----------



## thehatedguy

The v1s were for a customer and they are residing at said customer's house.


----------



## 60ndown

thehatedguy said:


> The v1s were for a customer and they are residing at said customer's house.


not what i meant, 

you have built other speakers over the years, all no doubt with great drivers and lots of hard work,

what was flaw in them that makes you want to build a better speaker/design?


----------



## the other hated guy

60ndown said:


> not what i meant,
> 
> you have built other speakers over the years, all no doubt with great drivers and lots of hard work,
> 
> what was flaw in them that makes you want to build a better speaker/design?


Starting later this year I will be having the worlds first "Audio Art Show". My work will be displayed in an art gallery. It's all about making hifi a very social medium.. Were all walks of life and people with various music tastes can come and experience my work and great audio..

plus i make pieces for clients etc..


----------



## the other hated guy

Dennis Burger from Home Entertainment Mag and HomeTechTell.com is doing a feature and write up on my art and what I do.. expect the HomeTechTell.com to be up in a few days and the HE mag featurette up once I get some good high res pics of the Blackmore's.... now I just gotta get Mark to let me take them


----------



## MarkZ

Really friggin cool. Keep us posted.


----------



## the other hated guy

MarkZ said:


> Really friggin cool. Keep us posted.


Thanks dude!!!!

It has been allot of hard work and more hard times... but it's neat seeing this unfold..


----------



## ItalynStylion

Sweet action. Sounds like the perfect outcome for extremely hard work!


----------



## the other hated guy

A great article about what I do and were I am going.. and once some high res photo's are taken, then a featurette in Home Entertainment mag as well :green:

Functional Audio Art: a Q&A with Randy Kunin of Sounds by Design


----------



## 60ndown

so whats your current car audio system Randy?

and whats the best car audio rig you ever heard?


----------



## 60ndown

also,

the swirly mdf cuts inside your speakers allow for a passage/tube/tunnel directly behind the driver, is there any reason for this? 

id have thought breaking up the back wave would be done best by having something asymmetrical directly behind the driver?


----------



## the other hated guy

60ndown said:


> so whats your current car audio system Randy?
> 
> and whats the best car audio rig you ever heard?



haven't had a system since I totaled my accord a few years back a week before meca finals 

the best car... can't say as none were the best at everything.. but if I had to listen them in no particular order..

Matt Roberts truck pre new dash build..
Keith Turner's nissan truck
my accord
ron buffington's bmw
mark eldridge's 4runner
bigg's regal "haven't heard it since 2005 finals"
phil petracca's mercedes
steve head's civic "this last rendition"


----------



## the other hated guy

60ndown said:


> also,
> 
> the swirly mdf cuts inside your speakers allow for a passage/tube/tunnel directly behind the driver, is there any reason for this?
> 
> id have thought breaking up the back wave would be done best by having something asymmetrical directly behind the driver?


think wooden diffuser pad


----------



## the other hated guy

got my Cardas in.. ran the wire to the Lowther and flushed in the binding posts


----------



## 60ndown

last box i built was 4.5 cubes @ 28 hz, 

took me about an hour


----------



## Oliver

the other hated guy said:


> 3 songs are hard...
> 
> But typically it will be:
> 
> Brian Bromberg - Come Together
> Nils Lofgren - Keith Don't Go
> Lisa Hannigan - Silent Night





the other hated guy said:


> got my Cardas in.. ran the wire to the Lowther and flushed in the binding posts


*WOW !*

_Incredible !_

Smoother than a 12 yr old bottle !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1Zce8_k5pw&NR=1

YouTube - ‪Akira Jimbo & Brian Bromberg - Brombo - "I got Rhythm"‬‎


----------



## Lanson

This is what we in the industry call, "Mad Skillz"


----------



## the other hated guy

thanks guys for the feedback, much appreciated!!!


----------



## the other hated guy

Already for a slicksand "high build primer" session on sunday after the Blackmore photo shoot. The suede will arrive Monday and I'll be able to wrap the inserts.. then off to paint shortly after that :green:


----------



## Oliver

Randy,

_That is simply_ * BEAUTIFUL !!!!*


----------



## 60ndown

a$$hole said:


> YouTube - ‪Akira Jimbo & Brian Bromberg - Brombo - "I got Rhythm"‬‎


that ^ led me to this






best drum solo ive ever heard/seen,


better get some more mdf in those speakers randy, any speaker that can do an accurate dynamic full range unstrained version of that is 

what i want in my van


----------



## Fozz

How rigid is the rig for the mids. Would you ever consider using aluminum? Seems like it might work well in this situation.


----------



## Oliver

Fozz said:


> How rigid is the rig for the mids. Would you ever consider using aluminum? Seems like it might work well in this situation.


Aluminum could add resonances that are undesirable, wood is more forgiving.


----------



## Fozz

I think if you chose the right grade and thickness it might add strength and reduce resonance issues. Not a cheap experiment, but when your trying to build something of this caliber it might be worth a try.

Might be nice to see tha main body built from a composite material as well. Even something as simple a marble or stone. Should be easy enough to have cut. But again, not a cheap experiment.

A very intriguing build non the less.


----------



## the other hated guy

a$$hole said:


> Aluminum could add resonances that are undesirable, wood is more forgiving.


bingo... anyting under 1/2 resonates horribly.. though I'd love to have a 1/2 aluminum piece made... but I'm in love my fingers to much ... 

I need to have a piece made in cad and sent to a water jet company to get a quote... but I'll need some CAD help :blush:


----------



## the other hated guy

First off, sorry for the blurry pics, damn heat and humidity was fogging up the camera lens..

The color is allot richer then I originally wanted.. but I'm really loving it..

Got the 2 bottom inserts wrapped and need to do the other 2 bottoms.. I need to remake the top inserts as there is no way in hell I can wrap the tight inner radius of the center cut out, I had to find that out the hard way as this is the first time I have worked with Suede and it doesn't stretch worth a ****..

The large black area is were the Ash Burl Veneer will go


----------



## trigg007

Nice Art Deco "feel". I'd prefer a paper driver to mate with the Lowther, but nonetheless an interesting design.


----------



## the other hated guy

TylerB said:


> wow that looks seriously amazing, mad props dude.


Thank you


----------



## the other hated guy

trigg007 said:


> Nice Art Deco "feel". I'd prefer a paper driver to mate with the Lowther, but nonetheless an interesting design.


the orginal design was to do paper AE's... but I couldn't be happier with this combo... very unconventional.. but they compliment each other perfectly ..


----------



## the other hated guy

been a little slow on progress the last few days.. the ole shop has been a 100+ degrees which isn't fun nor healthy.. But all the inserts are completed along with the first coat of slicksand... Even started to block sand :green:


----------



## 60ndown

quit yer moaning

Walmart.com: 12,000 BTU Commercial Cool by Haier Portable Air Conditioner: Home Improvement


----------



## the other hated guy

Taking a little breather in between pieces.. first round of block sanding is complete on this guy and I tossed in the bottom inlay to give you an idea.. I'm probably going to ditch the veneer and just paint the middle.. Not sure if adding another medium is the answer..


----------



## ItalynStylion

Nice work R man....keep up the good work; home stretch!


----------



## gbryant

Nice work!


----------



## the other hated guy

Just got back from a long out of town PM gig and picked this up today from the painters..

Pictures do not do this color justice. It's a very subtle, drab and understated color. Just the way I like it.. You can also see the top suede insert being glued into place.. happy times


----------



## the other hated guy

Did some test fitting with the drivers and all is good :thumb:.. I still have to veneer the bottom area "that's painted black" on this particular one. But I am very please with the results thus far :icon_twisted:


----------



## sinister-kustoms

Now they are some damn sexy speakers! Now the big question is...HOW DO THEY SOUND!?


----------



## the other hated guy

So with the color change at the last minute, the original veneer choice which was beautiful, just didn't go with the paint color and suede..

So I re-veneered one side and I couldn't be happier.. These are one of the most stunning loudspeakers I have ever seen.. but I may also be a little biased


----------



## sinister-kustoms

Good lord man, those belong in the Musée du Louvre!


----------



## the other hated guy

sinister-kustoms said:


> Good lord man, those belong in the Musée du Louvre!


Thanks my friend 


Cardas SE11 ran and their Flagship binding posts were stuffed into place.. Only have to glue the bottom suede insert rings and wire it up


----------



## crux131

These are definitely great looking speakers...bordering on fine art when combined with the right decor.

Wish I could hear them...send them to me. LOL


----------



## lowpoke

I can see the finished product in your avatar! Quit holding out on us, let's see these babies in their finished state!


----------



## antnbarao

Show de bola o projeto muito inspirador


----------



## the other hated guy

crux131 said:


> These are definitely great looking speakers...bordering on fine art when combined with the right decor.
> 
> Wish I could hear them...send them to me. LOL


LOL... haven't been on here in a while.. 

here they are ... plus a few shots of my latest project that I am working on... my room


----------



## the other hated guy

A great outtake from a photo shoot this past Friday for an up and coming article on my work..


----------



## pyropoptrt

Randy, that's a great photo of you and your daughter!


----------



## the other hated guy

pyropoptrt said:


> Randy, that's a great photo of you and your daughter!



Thanks brother!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## MHLY01

Nice pic, I need a pair of these to compare to my Ref speaks from AV123.


----------



## the other hated guy

MHLY01 said:


> Nice pic, I need a pair of these to compare to my Ref speaks from AV123.


I'd love to build you a pair ..

If you have the room to do it... IMO these are something very special..


----------



## MHLY01

Yeah, I have a listening room set up in my office with a H34 tube amp and CD transport. Have a completely deadened theater room as well. May be fun. Glad things are going good.


----------



## the other hated guy

A little review on these 

sedition


----------



## Se7en

the other hated guy said:


> A little review on these
> 
> sedition


That's fantastic man!!!


----------



## tornaido_3927

Wow, I'm glad this got bumped as I never saw this thread before, and I've just gone through the whole thing..

These speakers are, as everyone has stated, nothing short of amazing.. I am so jealous I won't be able to hear anything of the caliber of these 

I for one am just about to start my first DIY sub that won't include any outside help and will be all on my own, but now after seeing this thread I feel like no more than the tools that I will be using!


----------



## the other hated guy

Se7en said:


> That's fantastic man!!!


Thanks brother.. they are one of the most seductive loudspeakers that I have ever heard.. 

I'd like to build a reference pair with an Esotar 650 and powered Esotar 1200 per side.. and look forward to finding a client that would let me do it..

Happy Holidays Gabe!!!!


----------



## the other hated guy

tornaido_3927 said:


> Wow, I'm glad this got bumped as I never saw this thread before, and I've just gone through the whole thing..
> 
> These speakers are, as everyone has stated, nothing short of amazing.. I am so jealous I won't be able to hear anything of the caliber of these
> 
> I for one am just about to start my first DIY sub that won't include any outside help and will be all on my own, but now after seeing this thread I feel like no more than the tools that I will be using!


Thanks Dude!!!!

The best advice I can give is just to try and get dirty.. that's how you learn and progress as a fabricator.. and don't be afraid to try new things.. And it doesn't take a fancy shop or fancy tools "Though I wish I had them both..lol" as I do this from my garage with minimal tools..


----------



## dman

Randy, your a very gifted young man... Keep up the good work!


----------



## Triggz

Have you used LAT International cables? Eichmann bullet plugs? They have great reviews.


LAT International IC-200 Mark II Interconnect Reviews

L A T International, Inc. - Audio Interconnects


----------



## DonutHands

So how the hell did you calculate the airspace for these?


----------

