# Helix P SIX DSP - 6! ch amp plus 8ch DSP - One box!



## Babs

Couldn't find anything in here on it, so thought I'd share. 
Yes Im the guy who brought it up on FB in 'that' SQ forum.

In a nutshell:

Helix's new DSP amp combo.. Highlights.. 
- Something close to DSP Pro processing quality in 8 channels
- 6-channel amp with actual power, unusual for such a piece
- Sub channels RCA out to a sub amp (processed).
- Optical input like their other DSP's

Badassness in one box. 

Discuss... 


























*P SIX DSP*

The 6-channel amplifier P SIX DSP not only delivers loads of clean power and a top-notch DSP processor, it also comes with a completely new output stage concept that combines the benefits of class D amplifiers with the sound quality of class AB technology. Our unique “Class Ultra D” concept eliminates the negative influence of the indispensable output filters with a revolutionary concept that incorporates an analog feedback path back to the digital domain.

The result: Incredible damping factor (up to 1,000) even at 20 kHz, no load dependency of the frequency response and lowest possible THD for unparalleled sound quality. Almost needless to mention are the numerous input options including SPDIF optical and a HEC (HELIX Extension Card) slot for e.g. Bluetooth® audio streaming or other additional functions.

The P SIX DSP incorporates the same ultimate audio DSP with 64 Bit resolution and unbelievable processing power as HELIX DSP PRO. Two additional RCA outputs allow extending the system with external amplifiers up to eight processed channels. Despite this impressive bundle of engineering know-how the P SIX DSP shows up with a typical, clean design that has remained very compact for easiest integration.


*FEATURES*

New “Class Ultra D” concept which combines the sound quality of class AB technology with the benefits of class D amplifiers
Cutting-edge, extremely powerful “fixed point” Audio DSP with 64 Bit resolution and 1.2 billion MAC operations per second
Six speaker outputs with up to 215 Watts RMS into 2 Ohms
Two processed RCA outputs
Extremely high damping factor (> 1,000)
Inputs: 6 x RCA, 6 x Highlevel with up to 20V RMS input *sensitivity, optical SPDIF input
HELIX Extension Card slot (HEC) for additional input / output modules like Bluetooth® Audio Streaming
Compact design with low heat dissipation thanks to *extraordinary efficiency


*SPECS*

RMS power:
Measured acc. to CEA 2006-A
- Channel A - F @ 4 Ohms:120 Watts per channel (≤ 1% THD+N)
- Channel C - F @ 2 Ohms:215 Watts per channel (≤ 1% THD+N)

Inputs:
6 x RCA / Cinch
6 x Highlevel speaker input
1 x Optical SPDIF (12 - 96 kHz)
1 x Remote In

Input sensitivity: 
RCA / Cinch 2 - 4 Volts or 4 - 8 Volts
Highlevel 5 - 10 Volts or 10 - 20 Volts

Outputs:
6 x Speaker
2 x RCA / Cinch
2 x Remote Out

Output voltage RCA:3 Volts RMS

Frequency response:20 Hz - 22,000 Hz

DSP resolution:64 Bit

DSP power:295 MHz 1.2 billion MAC operations per second

Sampling rate:48 kHz

Signal converters:
A/D: BurrBrown
D/A: BurrBrown

Signal-to-noise ratio
(A-weighted):105 dB (digital input) 100 dB (analog input)

Distortion (THD):< 0.01 %

Damping factor:> 1,000

Input impedance RCA / Cinch:64 kOhms

Input impedance highlevel:30 Ohms or 64 kOhms

Operating voltage:9.6 - 18 Volts (max. 5 sec. down to 6 Volts)

Additional features:Control Input, USB, HEC slot

Dimensions (H x W x D):50 x 250 x 190 mm / 1.97 x 9.84 x 7.48”

*LINK*


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## Guest

This is going to be a spectacular solution !


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## Lycancatt

this is very cool!

one concer though 1 percent thd ratings? that means clean power is likely to be a good bit less than rated? am I missing something? 

also doesn't say if channels are bridgeable.

Can the hex remote input thing have some kidn of controller for it? for preset/volume?


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## Babs

Lycancatt said:


> this is very cool!
> 
> one concer though 1 percent thd ratings? that means clean power is likely to be a good bit less than rated? am I missing something?


Might have something to do with their newfangled class-D setup. Dunno.



Lycancatt said:


> also doesn't say if channels are bridgeable.


I'm gonna guess you can't. Yeah I know.. A little let-down.



Lycancatt said:


> Can the hex remote input thing have some kidn of controller for it? for preset/volume?


There's the current remote which is basic one switch, two-knob, configured by the software. Or a new "Director" remote they're coming out with which looks bangin', in comparison. I have the basic remote as I wanted to try non-volume'd optical from an idevice output to hdmi, then converted optical.


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## Lycancatt

nonbridgable limites the market quite a bit imo since everyone is so power crazy..myself included to a certain extent.


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## groberts

Bridgeable or not, that's still a lot of flexibility in a single box that fits under most seats! Whoah! What is the price point and when are they available? Who are the US dealers?


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## Huckleberry Sound

SQ_TSX said:


> This is going to be a spectacular solution !


I still got the itchies for this one!!!


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## Babs

Oh.. Whether interested or not. I got reply back from Kicker. Yes Kicker and Helix in the same thread.. I had just asked about their "similar" product, Q-Class amps with built in DSP. They're shipping now. Should be on shelves soon. That's another one I wanna read reviews on. I think their tool is bluetooth capable on iDevice (think being the keyword), and it controls multiple Q amps. I'm sure Helix > Kicker Q but ya know.. I love new gear, regardless, for a fair shake. I suspect they did pretty well with the Q amps over what we normal expect from Kicker, to attract more than the bassheads with these amps.


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## miniSQ

its an interesting piece for sure...but do people who run DSP really want onboard amplification? Do the users of the MS8 use the onboard amps? My guess is most do not.


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## Victor_inox

Brax nox is a little more expensive and only 4 ch with 6ch dsp. It has class AB amps though..


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## thehatedguy

The Brax is like 5 grand though.

Bridging...wonder if the DSP side of things could combine channels? If not, then there is why you couldn't bridge the amp side of things. It wouldn't (to me) make sense to buy this if you were going to need or want to bridge the amp channels...then you wouldn't need all of the processing in it.

So I guess amps with processors might be going a way for processors with amps in them?


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## Manic1!

This is a great idea. Allows you to do 3 way front stage and add your own sub amp.


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## AVIDEDTR

3.05 is the software for this amp


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## Guest

Yes, plus most of the other DSP based products. The new release, version b I think, will upgrade most other products.... including the lesser know Brax Nox4-dsp. ...


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## Victor_inox

thehatedguy said:


> The Brax is like 5 grand though.
> 
> Bridging...wonder if the DSP side of things could combine channels? If not, then there is why you couldn't bridge the amp side of things. It wouldn't (to me) make sense to buy this if you were going to need or want to bridge the amp channels...then you wouldn't need all of the processing in it.
> 
> So I guess amps with processors might be going a way for processors with amps in them?


street price is half that. perhaps helix is for less demanding customers on tighter budget.
BTW where does it says that channels unbridgeable?


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## Victor_inox

miniSQ said:


> its an interesting piece for sure...but do people who run DSP really want onboard amplification? Do the users of the MS8 use the onboard amps? My guess is most do not.


MS8 using el cheapo chip amps for all 8 channels, similar to what used in stock HU. 18W on good day with 10%THD. Not really comparable.


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## Guest

Correct, the PSIX is not bridgable....


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## tulse

miniSQ said:


> its an interesting piece for sure...but do people who run DSP really want onboard amplification? Do the users of the MS8 use the onboard amps? My guess is most do not.


It's close to exactly what I'd want for a new vehicle. Give me 3 + 1, amp, full DSP, summing and factory integration in one box so I can stuff it up under the dash somewhere. Eliminate the need for a Sunday afternoon DIY'er to gut the car, fiddle with mounting 2 or 3 amps and run cable except maybe speaker wire for a sub. Replace the factory drivers... boom, you're done. 

Right now I'm looking at 2 MiniDSP's and two digital amps to do the same in a car that I have no interest in pulling apart or taking up space in the cargo area. 

JBL brushed the surface with the MS-A1004 but stopped a bit short. And, of course, there's the MS8. 

What I'd really like is a line tiny amps that each contained its own "MiniDSP" and interface. Let me buy two of your four channel amps, or one two channel and one mono, or whatever, and daisy chain their DSP's. Put it all into one UI. 

Add and amp >>>> plug it into the rest >>>> add it to the app you already have running on your tablet.


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## Babs

miniSQ said:


> its an interesting piece for sure...but do people who run DSP really want onboard amplification? Do the users of the MS8 use the onboard amps? My guess is most do not.



I ran rear fill off an ms-8 and it was actually plenty for rears on the ms-8's internal amps. Worked good. This helix piece I think though could rock.


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## kyheng

720W of power in that small package.
I'll prefer to wait for P 8 DSP where first 6 channels with built in amp and sub channel just RCA output. That's will be better.


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## JoeHemi57

Did i miss the price somewhere? I'm going to assume close to $1500 since the Audison Prima's are like $1300 and have less power overall.


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## Babs

kyheng said:


> 720W of power in that small package.
> I'll prefer to wait for P 8 DSP where first 6 channels with built in amp and sub channel just RCA output. That's will be better.


I'd fear the single box footprint would get too large though. I'm a modular kinda guy though. I'd think a couple smaller boxes could give more install options than one big one. I think leaving an outboard sub amp up to the user, but still having it processed by the Helix, is a brilliant idea. I think Kenwood did this years ago with the KAC-X4R. That was a nice piece.


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## Huckleberry Sound

I am considering using this with the Helix SPXL1000 to run the subwoofer.


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## Guest

That would be an EXCELLENT solution...!


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## mbradlawrence

I have a car with a MOST bus so getting that signal is very important for me (considering mobridge/new audison piece for this but that is like $800). Saw the below in the spec. for this product:

Note - Cars equipped with MOST bus:
In cars equipped with MOST bus structure it is
mandatory to unplug the fiber-optic cable from the
original radio connector and insert it into the ISO
adaptor which has a dedicated recess for this.

Any thoughts as to whether this is a viable solution?


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## teldzc1

AVIDEDTR said:


> 3.05 is the software for this amp





SQ_TSX said:


> Yes, plus most of the other DSP based products. The new release, version b I think, will upgrade most other products.... including the lesser know Brax Nox4-dsp. ...


Oh Really? When is this happening?

This thing is a lot more interesting than I thought it was. Lots of ways to think about this. If you get a BT HEC card, you essentially can just add a phone and have a full standalone solution outside of your vehicle's electronics. I know interfacing with modern OEM HU's can be a pain in the ass. This offers a one box solution to get out of that. Also, if you have a cramped car or simply don't want to give up much space this is it. Additionally you save on a ton of wiring. 3 less pairs of RCA's. Less power and ground routing. Seems a lot neater and easier to install.


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## Babs

mbradlawrence said:


> I have a car with a MOST bus so getting that signal is very important for me (considering mobridge/new audison piece for this but that is like $800). Saw the below in the spec. for this product:
> 
> Note - Cars equipped with MOST bus:
> In cars equipped with MOST bus structure it is
> mandatory to unplug the fiber-optic cable from the
> original radio connector and insert it into the ISO
> adaptor which has a dedicated recess for this.
> 
> Any thoughts as to whether this is a viable solution?


Maybe this one?
Depends on what car of course.


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## AAAAAAA

This is a nice find. Very nice and tiny.
Will be a little less nice when we see msrp though.


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## Jon225

Seems like an interesting piece.

HELIX P SIX DSP

Owners Manuel PDF scroll down for English. No mention of being bridgeable.


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## Guest

I'm pretty sure the MSRP is $1300.00.... Considering the build quality, power provided and the DSP on board.... VERY nice and reasonable


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## Babs

Street pricing will be somewhere around a G-note.


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## Huckleberry Sound

As amazing as this piece looks, time will if people will use it!!


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## Babs

Makes me think, if we had a universal method of sending digital from source to DSP, along with volume control from source but with full resolution within the DSP, the pinnacle would be reached. I guess at one time Alpine approached this with AI-net. Unfortunately dealing with toslink is still buggy because of volume control and any solution would be proprietary requiring a second remote for the DSP such as BIT controller or helix director/remote. 

The technology is moving but still far from eliminating analog wiring entirely I suppose, save for maybe Audisons digital goodies, digital all the way to the amps. 

All to get down to a goal of just one single optimum D/A conversion.

If some standard is ever established maybe over USB or HDMI or similar for digital audio signal plus volume signal so volume data is sent with the actual audio and whatever device understands that volume protocol, that would be monumental.


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## Huckleberry Sound

I agree. This would be a prime time for the Big Three of Interfaces (Pioneer, Kenwood and Alpine) to get with the Big three of processors (Alpine, Helix and Mosconi).

Force the hand and bring the technology to past. That would give them a multiple patients out of the research and development. Charge others a premium for the use of the technology and get to moving.

This would eliminate the use of RCA from the headunit to the processors all together. And give complete control, and resolution. Regardless if you are using 2 channels or 22.


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## Babs

Huckleberry Sound said:


> I agree. This would be a prime time for the Big Three of Interfaces (Pioneer, Kenwood and Alpine) to get with the Big _*five*_ processors (Alpine, Helix, Mosconi, Audison, Rockford).
> 
> Force the hand and bring the technology to past. That would give them a multiple patients out of the research and development. Charge others a premium for the use of the technology and get to moving.
> 
> This would eliminate the use of RCA from the headunit to the processors all together. And give complete control, and resolution. Regardless if you are using 2 channels or 22.


Added to your list a little, and I'd say they'd do well to approach the companies who've also dabbled in D/A and Amp single chassis items... Kenwood, JBL, Kicker, Zapco, Audison again.

Absolutely! Were I the king of either of these head unit companies, I'd be approaching folks in order of preference to discuss a joint-venture interest.

Imagine all the goodies in a NEX unit, just for example, with one data cable, one DSP, one D/A conversion, straight to amp outputs. Nom nom! 

Two USB's upfront from device to amp, then speaker runs. Don't get much cleaner from an audio fidelity standpoint. Which is why I always pontificate about a dead-head 2-din with no disc, but helix or Bit level DSP built in. Then it pretty much does it all w/ volume right at the head unit, just like any modern home media A/V pre/pro with room correction.

Beginning to see why simbilink was around.


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## JoeHemi57

Here is a 6 channel from Mosconi also.

GLADEN D2 80.6 DSP


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## Huckleberry Sound

JoeHemi57 said:


> Here is a 6 channel from Mosconi also.
> 
> GLADEN D2 80.6 DSP


The one looks solid to. 

Target powers (14V4):
80W @ 4 Ohm
100W @ 2 Ohm
70W x 4 + 215W x 1 (Ch 5-6) @ 4 Ohm
Input sensitivity: (Power rating ref)
0.27 V ÷ 8.5 V (Low Level)
0.7 V ÷ 22 V (High Level)
Xover functions: (always in line)
Subsonic Filter: (10 ÷ 20000 Hz)
Low Pass Filter: (10 ÷ 20000 Hz)
Slope (dB/Oct): 6-12 [up to 60 (CH1-2-3-4) or 48 (CH5-6-7-8), if cascaded]
Band pass allowed, Variable Q: 0.5 ÷ 40
Special Features:
Remote Volume Control (optional)
Phase Inversion: 0° ÷ 180°
Time delay (ms): 0 ÷ 15 (0.02 steps)
Low Level / High Level imput mode (by switch)
Auto Sense (only in High Level mode)
Low Level Output (CH7/8)
Size:200x145x40 mm
Weight:1340 g


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## ScarySkulls

If anyone knows about the price of the Gladen D2, please post!


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## JoeHemi57

Hopefully before too long there will be stuff like this available from more mainstream companies, seems like JBL could pull it off if Andy was still there or Rockford or Alpine maybe. I'm waiting to see whats up with the JL processors too.


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## Victor_inox

JoeHemi57 said:


> Hopefully before too long there will be stuff like this available from more mainstream companies, seems like JBL could pull it off if Andy was still there or Rockford or Alpine maybe. I'm waiting to see whats up with the JL processors too.


I`d take Helix over mainstream manufacturers at any time.


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## Hugg727

ScarySkulls said:


> If anyone knows about the price of the Gladen D2, please post!


I called Orca, disti for Mosconi,and they passed me over to a dealer near me. They are telling me that the DS 80.6 DSP has an MSRP of $1600

Can anyone confirm this, seemed a little high to me since its only 80W x 6


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## mosfidelity

I am really considering this unit. I am just not sure if the power is enough for some 6.5" or 8" in the doors.

Does anyone have an opinion on the power? The alternative is 200 watts from a Mosconi Zero 4. However, the space savings on the Helix vs the Mosconi is a nice addition in a small car.


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## Huckleberry Sound

mosfidelity said:


> I am really considering this unit. I am just not sure if the power is enough for some 6.5" or 8" in the doors.
> 
> Does anyone have an opinion on the power? The alternative is 200 watts from a Mosconi Zero 4. However, the space savings on the Helix vs the Mosconi is a nice addition in a small car.



Pm sent


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## JoeHemi57

Victor_inox said:


> I`d take Helix over mainstream manufacturers at any time.


Mainstream companies can usually build for a lower price since they move more volume and can buy the parts cheaper in higher quantities. I would think so anyways. Helix is awesome and i'm looking at some of their stuff but audio isn't a high enough priority for me to spend that much.


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## Huckleberry Sound

Well they do exist!!! See attached pics.

This is for the use of my install. Please feel free to follow the thread. 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...ery/175061-pontiac-grand-am-simple-clean.html

I am not in a race to the finish line. The weather is crazy and tax season is gone!!! So right now the planning has begun. I have attached the system diagram to show how this install will work! The explanation for everything is on my thread.

Enjoy the Essence of Sound!!!


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## rockytophigh

I have one of these on the way for my car. I'm pairing it with a SPXL mono for sub duty.


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## Babs

Huckleberry Sound said:


> Well they do exist!!! See attached pics.
> 
> 
> 
> This is for the use of my install. Please feel free to follow the thread.
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...ery/175061-pontiac-grand-am-simple-clean.html
> 
> 
> 
> I am not in a race to the finish line. The weather is crazy and tax season is gone!!! So right now the planning has begun. I have attached the system diagram to show how this install will work! The explanation for everything is on my thread.
> 
> 
> 
> Enjoy the Essence of Sound!!!



Awesome! About how big is this thing? It looks tiny for what it is. 


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## Babs

Awesome! About how big is this thing? It looks tiny for what it is. Actually I could refer to the specs I posted. Dang 8x10 notebook paper size! Wow. So roughly PDX size. Impressive! Very anxious for audio review on it. 


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## haakono

Just ordered myself one of these today  along with the two-wheel remote. Already gotten the tracking # for it, so should be here by the weekend. 

Will use it to power (semi actively) a Focal KRX3 component set (2 channels for mid+tweeter through passive crossover, 2 channels for midbass and 2 channels for sub(s).

Now I just have to decide on source unit. I do have an old iPad mini, but it will require major mods to the dash.. Any tips on good 7" tablets that could work well as a multimedia HU?


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## rockytophigh

I can source a few of these if anyone is interested. They are not common....


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## haakono

Happy day


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## Babs

Reviews are coming I hope. I have sneaky suspicion this bad boy is gonna be serious, and fear I'll have to have one. 


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## edzyy

Nice unit. 

If only it were bridgeable and had a better controller.


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## Huckleberry Sound

edzyy said:


> Nice unit.
> 
> If only it were bridgeable and had a better controller.


You can use any of the existing Helix controllers and new controllers to come. To achieve that 2 ohm load of 250 watts, you can do it by impedance, not bringing. I planned out use a set of dual 4 ohm midbass to get that power up front on channels 3 and 4. For channels 5 and six. I will use a dual 2 ohm subwoofer. Now I have 250 going to each side of the subwoofer due to impedance, not bridging.


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## Hugg727

Nice unit...Looking forward to seeing how it works for you. I am just finishing up my build with my Mosconi D2 80.6 DSP. SHould be interesting to compare notes on the 2.


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## Babs

Huckleberry Sound said:


> You can use any of the existing Helix controllers and new controllers to come. To achieve that 2 ohm load of 250 watts, you can do it by impedance, not bringing. I planned out use a set of dual 4 ohm midbass to get that power up front on channels 3 and 4. For channels 5 and six. I will use a dual 2 ohm subwoofer. Now I have 250 going to each side of the subwoofer due to impedance, not bridging.



Hmm. My SD-3 is a dual 2 ohm. 


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## Hillbilly SQ

The biggest issue for me would be getting a clean signal from a factory headunit. It's getting nearly impossible to replace a factory unit since nearly everything is tied to it in one way or another. Will this Helix unit help take care of that like a cleansweep would? I plan on trading my Ram in about 90k (nearly halfway there now after just over 4 years of ownership). This Helix unit would be excellent for just about anyone and 1% thd at rated power isn't anything to worry about imo. As long as the class d circuitry isn't like what's in the PPI Atom and the multitude of clones of that amp it should sound just fine.


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## Hillbilly SQ

Huckleberry Sound said:


> You can use any of the existing Helix controllers and new controllers to come. To achieve that 2 ohm load of 250 watts, you can do it by impedance, not bringing. I planned out use a set of dual 4 ohm midbass to get that power up front on channels 3 and 4. For channels 5 and six. I will use a dual 2 ohm subwoofer. Now I have 250 going to each side of the subwoofer due to impedance, not bridging.


That's a good idea! I'd do that in my own rig then use one of my Mosconi 4ch amps on midrange and tweets.


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## edzyy

Huckleberry Sound said:


> You can use any of the existing Helix controllers and new controllers to come. To achieve that 2 ohm load of 250 watts, you can do it by impedance, not bringing. I planned out use a set of dual 4 ohm midbass to get that power up front on channels 3 and 4. For channels 5 and six. I will use a dual 2 ohm subwoofer. Now I have 250 going to each side of the subwoofer due to impedance, not bridging.


I only use pro stuff & 99.9% of it is 8 ohm

In a perfect world, i would bridge 4 channels to power mids & the remaining 2 to power horns. I can still do this, but i like headroom.


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## Babs

Hillbilly SQ said:


> The biggest issue for me would be getting a clean signal from a factory headunit. It's getting nearly impossible to replace a factory unit since nearly everything is tied to it in one way or another. Will this Helix unit help take care of that like a cleansweep would? I plan on trading my Ram in about 90k (nearly halfway there now after just over 4 years of ownership). This Helix unit would be excellent for just about anyone and 1% thd at rated power isn't anything to worry about imo. As long as the class d circuitry isn't like what's in the PPI Atom and the multitude of clones of that amp it should sound just fine.



Don't believe any of the Helix stuff does OEM head unit un-EQ'ing or un-time-aligning like something like the MS-8. New JL Audio Fix processor I think it's called, when it comes out. The helix will take high-level inputs and will do signal summing to a point I believe. Other than those, I don't think there's much out there besides H800 maybe or 3Sixty.3 that analyzes and corrects OEM signals, screwed up by car-makers... Reason I've been gently nudging Andy to consider an Audiofrog DSP, since he's got integration figured out.


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## Guest

Just thought I would post here, I have a Brand New P-six DSP... I plan to post in the FS section....


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## Guest

.......


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## mathematics

Had mine installed since last Friday (5/8). I am going optical from my Airport Express without any issues. Tweeters are Micro-precision 5.28, Midranges are Dynaudio MW152's, and midbasses are 8 jehnert's (3 in each door and 1 under each seat)


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## mathematics

miniSQ said:


> its an interesting piece for sure...but do people who run DSP really want onboard amplification? Do the users of the MS8 use the onboard amps? My guess is most do not.



huge difference between MS-8's internal amp and the DSP Six's internal amp. you can't even compare them.


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## mathematics

Babs said:


> Makes me think, if we had a universal method of sending digital from source to DSP, along with volume control from source but with full resolution within the DSP, the pinnacle would be reached. I guess at one time Alpine approached this with AI-net. Unfortunately dealing with toslink is still buggy because of volume control and any solution would be proprietary requiring a second remote for the DSP such as BIT controller or helix director/remote.
> 
> The technology is moving but still far from eliminating analog wiring entirely I suppose, save for maybe Audisons digital goodies, digital all the way to the amps.
> 
> All to get down to a goal of just one single optimum D/A conversion.
> 
> If some standard is ever established maybe over USB or HDMI or similar for digital audio signal plus volume signal so volume data is sent with the actual audio and whatever device understands that volume protocol, that would be monumental.


digital volume control from the source works with AirPlay. no dsp remote required.


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## mathematics

mosfidelity said:


> I am really considering this unit. I am just not sure if the power is enough for some 6.5" or 8" in the doors.
> 
> Does anyone have an opinion on the power? The alternative is 200 watts from a Mosconi Zero 4. However, the space savings on the Helix vs the Mosconi is a nice addition in a small car.



at 4 ohms, i have 4 6.5" midbasses per channel on 2 channels and i can be heard a block away and don't even need a sub for most music. hope that helps lol


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## mosfidelity

mathematics said:


> at 4 ohms, i have 4 6.5" midbasses per channel on 2 channels and i can be heard a block away and don't even need a sub for most music. hope that helps lol


That sounds promising. What midbasses are you running? 8 of them?!


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## mathematics

mosfidelity said:


> That sounds promising. What midbasses are you running? 8 of them?!


BMW 3 Series E92/93 – Doorboards with 3-way soundsystem | Jehnert Sound Design Automotive


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## gstokes

miniSQ said:


> its an interesting piece for sure...but do people who run DSP really want onboard amplification? ... My guess is most do not.


Count me in for NOT wanting my DSP to have it's own amplifier..
It's a real space saver to combine the DSP with the amplifier but..


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## mathematics

gstokes said:


> Count me in for NOT wanting my DSP to have it's own amplifier..
> It's a real space saver to combine the DSP with the amplifier but..




But what?


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## gstokes

mathematics said:


> But what?


but,,, when you integrate the DSP with the amplifier you are limiting the system capabilities to what is contained in the box and the chances of something going wrong with a 2in1 unit are twice as high as they would be for 2 separate components, just my $.02


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## Guest

All depends on your system goals


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## gstokes

SQ_TSX said:


> All depends on your system goals


very true..


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## Babs

mathematics said:


> Had mine installed since last Friday (5/8). I am going optical from my Airport Express without any issues. Tweeters are Micro-precision 5.28, Midranges are Dynaudio MW152's, and midbasses are 8 jehnert's (3 in each door and 1 under each seat)


Ya know.. I knew when I had the Apple AV adapter in my hand, I shoulda opted for the Airport Express. May have to get one just for ****s and giggles and give it a try.



mathematics said:


> huge difference between MS-8's internal amp and the DSP Six's internal amp. you can't even compare them.


Oh I can imagine.. How's it sound?



mathematics said:


> digital volume control from the source works with AirPlay. no dsp remote required.


So hmm.. Are you getting any graininess at lower volumes or does the iDevice send basically a full digi signal and controls the volume from within the Airport Express? Using iPad or phone or what? This is kinda cool!


----------



## Babs

gstokes said:


> Count me in for NOT wanting my DSP to have it's own amplifier..
> It's a real space saver to combine the DSP with the amplifier but..


There is validity to that concern, however we do it everyday with a typical A/V home-theater receiver. However, yes it does kinda hold you to the amp's capabilities or the DSP's capabilities. But for the most part it's the kind of piece where you've pretty much flushed those decisions out going in.


----------



## DDfusion

I use my ms-8s internal amp for rear fill. Does a good job on stock 1 ways.


----------



## BlueGhost

I can really see the appeal, but I'm not the typical costumer either. I would essentially be using the DSP as my head unit. 

I'm doing this now in my with a DSP-88R in my 1965 F100. I use an add-on HD tuner for radio, and Apt-X Bluetooth via optical on the DSP. They other half of the system is a JL xd700/5. 

I could replace both my amp and DSP with one box, plus Helix has an Apt-X adapter that would remove one more external piece. The optional remote, the simple one with two rotary knobs and a push button looks easily hackable. I'm using the volume control for the 88R and remote volume form the amp currently.


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

What's street price on this thing? And does the internal amp have any real weaknesses? This type of setup is nothing new since Zapco has been doing it for years. Kicker and Kenwood did it for a bit. I know there are others. Basically it's a real amp with dsp capabilities instead of a dsp with a piss poor amp like the ms8. If I were to use the internal CLASS D amp it would be on some d2 subs and then on some midbasses. tm65 looks promising. Can anyone see running all 6 channels at 2 ohms being an issue? I'd still like to keep one of my existing a/b amps that has proven itself on midrange and tweets.


----------



## Babs

gstokes said:


> Count me in for NOT wanting my DSP to have it's own amplifier..
> It's a real space saver to combine the DSP with the amplifier but..





Hillbilly SQ said:


> What's street price on this thing? And does the internal amp have any real weaknesses? This type of setup is nothing new since Zapco has been doing it for years. Kicker and Kenwood did it for a bit. I know there are others. Basically it's a real amp with dsp capabilities instead of a dsp with a piss poor amp like the ms8. If I were to use the internal CLASS D amp it would be on some d2 subs and then on some midbasses. tm65 looks promising. Can anyone see running all 6 channels at 2 ohms being an issue? I'd still like to keep one of my existing a/b amps that has proven itself on midrange and tweets.


Actually Kicker Q-class (IQ) amps are shipping now, and cost about as much I think for their 4-channel.

I believe these are sure-enough amps. Anxious to read sonic reviews. hint hint.

Would they be a Mosconi killer? Prolly subjective. Would they rock a nice 3-way front-stage? I'd bet they could easily as good as say PDX's or other class-D's. I have an itchy suspicion this one though is very nice sonically. Unconfirmed.


----------



## gstokes

Babs said:


> There is validity to that concern, however we do it everyday with a typical A/V home-theater receiver. However, yes it does kinda hold you to the amp's capabilities or the DSP's capabilities. But for the most part it's the kind of piece where you've pretty much flushed those decisions out going in.


Right on, you know exactly how it's going to end before you get to the end..
I really like what Kicker has done with the IQ series Amplifiers, spinning things around and integrating the DSP with the Amplifier, they hit the mark with that setup..


----------



## Hillbilly SQ

I would hope you could still use the dsp portion if the amp takes a dive. As reliable as most quality amps are these days I don't see that being an issue. Treat it right and it will treat you right. Guess this unit is the boner of the year. Hope it performs and the amp has the cleanliness of the JL class d amps.


----------



## BlueGhost

The Match siblings look good too. I hadn't noticed them until I started looking into the P 6 DSP.

Take a PP 88DSP and pair it with a MA 10FX and you've got a modest 3 way active front stage, rear fill, and a 500 watt sub channel all for around $1000.


----------



## Babs

gstokes said:


> Right on, you know exactly how it's going to end before you get to the end..
> I really like what Kicker has done with the IQ series Amplifiers, spinning things around and integrating the DSP with the Amplifier, they hit the mark with that setup..


Except... No digital inputs I believe unfortunately, however you pretty much get a standalone DSP within each amp and hopefully a good processing SQ. That's another one I'm anxiously waiting to hear folks review in hopes Kicker hit the mark with the line-up. I've been spouting off about them simply because it's nice to see more options in the mix so hoping for their success.


----------



## Babs

BlueGhost said:


> The Match siblings look good too. I hadn't noticed them until I started looking into the P 6 DSP.
> 
> Take a PP 88DSP and pair it with a MA 10FX and you've got a modest 3 way active front stage, rear fill, and a 500 watt sub channel all for around $1000.


Yeah I wonder how much they downgrade or upgrade and where (in the components of the products) between the three Audiotec-Fischer brands. Seem like parallel-ish similar products. Big jumps from Helix to Brax though.


----------



## Babs

Hillbilly SQ said:


> Hope it performs and the amp has the cleanliness of the JL class d amps.


They may possibly have some interesting interfacing going on, possibly in the digital domain, between the DSP output section and amp input section, rather than just a conventional DA conversion, preamping for analog as would be the case for feeding conventional amps RCA's. Just remembering some 1's and 0's business used in Class-D. I dunno.. Might be a completely ass-hat thought by someone admittedly who knows next to nothing about the technology.  Being yours truly.


----------



## gstokes

Babs said:


> Except... No digital inputs I believe unfortunately, however you pretty much get a standalone DSP within each amp and hopefully a good processing SQ. That's another one I'm anxiously waiting to hear folks review in hopes Kicker hit the mark with the line-up. I've been spouting off about them simply because it's nice to see more options in the mix so hoping for their success.


I am excited for them but it's craziness having to add a DAC to a DSP, the IQ's should have a TOSLINK Input ?


----------



## Babs

It'd be nice if they did but not crucial. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Victor_inox

Babs said:


> They may possibly have some interesting interfacing going on, possibly in the digital domain, between the DSP output section and amp input section, rather than just a conventional DA conversion, preamping for analog as would be the case for feeding conventional amps RCA's. Just remembering some 1's and 0's business used in Class-D. I dunno.. Might be a completely ass-hat thought by someone admittedly who knows next to nothing about the technology.  Being yours truly.


No they don`t. please read how class D works, there is no 1 and 0 whatsoever.


----------



## Babs

Gotcha. Yeah it's been a while since I read it. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## thebookfreak58

mathematics said:


> Had mine installed since last Friday (5/8). I am going optical from my Airport Express without any issues. Tweeters are Micro-precision 5.28, Midranges are Dynaudio MW152's, and midbasses are 8 jehnert's (3 in each door and 1 under each seat)


Interested in how you have setup the Airport? How are you powering the Airport? Any issues with waiting for it to power on?


----------



## mathematics

Babs said:


> Ya know.. I knew when I had the Apple AV adapter in my hand, I shoulda opted for the Airport Express. May have to get one just for ****s and giggles and give it a try.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I can imagine.. How's it sound?
> 
> 
> 
> So hmm.. Are you getting any graininess at lower volumes or does the iDevice send basically a full digi signal and controls the volume from within the Airport Express? Using iPad or phone or what? This is kinda cool!


it sounds pretty incredible. i hear more detail than when i was going from the airport express to Helix A4 amp via analog.

No graininess at any volume level. The iDevice sends volume information digitally. I use an iphone6 plus with itunes/itunes radio/spotify/ waze...


----------



## mathematics

thebookfreak58 said:


> Interested in how you have setup the Airport? How are you powering the Airport? Any issues with waiting for it to power on?


i made a voltage regulator circuit for power and then soldered directly to the PCB in the airport express. i remote start my car, so by the time i get in, the airport is booted up.if i just get in and start the car, it's about a minute to boot up. i've been using the airport express since april of 2014 without any issues.


----------



## mathematics

People, this isn't your run of the mill class D technology. please read about it on their website.


----------



## Babs

mathematics said:


> it sounds pretty incredible. i hear more detail than when i was going from the airport express to Helix A4 amp via analog.
> 
> 
> 
> No graininess at any volume level. The iDevice sends volume information digitally. I use an iphone6 plus with itunes/itunes radio/spotify/ waze...



Well hmmmmm. Alrighty then! Cool beans.. I must try the airport express. I too am interested in how you're powering it. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Babs

mathematics said:


> People, this isn't your run of the mill class D technology. please read about it on their website.


I'll bring it here if I may.. Certainly does look promising. 












Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## djnsmith7

New member here & I'm trying to do a direct comparison between the P Six & the Bit Ten. Does the P Six offer the same level of EQ adjustment capabilities as the Bit Ten? It appears so on page 24 of the manual. Looks as though the P Six has a range of 25 - 20khz per output channel, which appears to be in-line with the Bit Ten.


----------



## Guest

I would use the P-six over the bit ten any day of the week.


----------



## thebookfreak58

Got one of these installed. Will write a mini review soon


----------



## chithead

thebookfreak58 said:


> Got one of these installed. Will write a mini review soon


I am VERY much looking forward to it!!!


----------



## subterFUSE

djnsmith7 said:


> New member here & I'm trying to do a direct comparison between the P Six & the Bit Ten. Does the P Six offer the same level of EQ adjustment capabilities as the Bit Ten? It appears so on page 24 of the manual. Looks as though the P Six has a range of 25 - 20khz per output channel, which appears to be in-line with the Bit Ten.


The Bit Ten is just a DSP. The P-Six is a DSP and amplifier in one unit. So that isn't even an apples to apples comparison.


Secondly, the DSP inside of the Helix P-Six will dominate the Audison Bit Ten, then tell it to get up early, cook breakfast and do the laundry. Again, it's not even an apples to apples comparison.

The Audison Bit One is their flagship processor. The Bit Ten is the little brother to the Bit One. The Helix DSP Pro, which is the same DSP inside of the P-Six, has everything the Audison Bit One has and more:

10 channels vs. 8
64 bit processing, vs. 32 bit
96 kHz sample rate vs. 48kHz
parametric EQ vs. graphic
phase angle adjustments vs. simple 0/180 invert

Plus, the Helix has the best DSP software on the market.
It's so simple and intuitive. Even a novice can work with it on the first try.


----------



## thebookfreak58

subterFUSE said:


> Plus, the Helix has the best DSP software on the market.
> It's so simple and intuitive. Even a novice can work with it on the first try.


Agree it's very easy. Only downside is the resolution dependence...doesnt seem to work well on high res screens?


----------



## 6spdcoupe

subterFUSE said:


> The Bit Ten is just a DSP. The P-Six is a DSP and amplifier in one unit. So that isn't even an apples to apples comparison.
> 
> 
> Secondly, the DSP inside of the Helix P-Six will dominate the Audison Bit Ten, then tell it to get up early, cook breakfast and do the laundry. Again, it's not even an apples to apples comparison.
> 
> The Audison Bit One is their flagship processor. The Bit Ten is the little brother to the Bit One. The Helix DSP Pro, which is the same DSP inside of the P-Six, has everything the Audison Bit One has and more:
> 
> 10 channels vs. 8
> 64 bit processing, vs. 32 bit
> 96 kHz sample rate vs. 48kHz
> parametric EQ vs. graphic
> phase angle adjustments vs. simple 0/180 invert
> 
> Plus, the Helix has the best DSP software on the market.
> It's so simple and intuitive. Even a novice can work with it on the first try.


While I agree on all counts and would certainly favor the Helix over any Audison piece, your specs are a bit off. The DSP in the P SIX is not quite the same as the one in a Pro. Excellent, but not quite the same.


----------



## chithead

6spdcoupe said:


> While I agree on all counts and would certainly favor the Helix over any Audison piece, your specs are a bit off. The DSP in the P SIX is not quite the same as the one in a Pro. Excellent, but not quite the same.


Agreed, from what I read on their website, the P SIX DSP is only 8 channels of processing, and 48kHz sampling rate versus the 96kHz in the DSP PRO. Signal-to-noise ratio, RCA output voltage, frequency response, and distortion (THD) was a bit different too.


----------



## teldzc1

Is be interested to see Helix release some standalone amps using the topology used in the P Six.


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## subterFUSE

Oops. I was under the impression it was just the DSP Pro with an amp included. My bad. &#55357;&#56841;

So maybe it's more like the Helix DSP rather than the Pro?

In which case it's 8 channels, but still has 30 band parametric and also uses the version 3.11c software.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## subterFUSE

teldzc1 said:


> Is be interested to see Helix release some standalone amps using the topology used in the P Six.


Absolutely!


I would also like them to build a media player to compete with the Audison Bit Play. Audison did such a poor job with it, but I really like the concept. Would be great if a more competent company like Helix would give it a try.


----------



## haakono

I'm putting together a system based around my recently bought P SIX (I also bought the two-wheel remote controller along with it).

Components will be Focal KRX3, two channels powering the tweeters and mids through their passive crossover, two channels will be powering the midbasses fully active, and the last two channels will power a 2x2ohm voice coil Focal KX33 subwoofer. 

Playback source will be a tablet of some kind, with main volume adjustment done by the Helix remote controller. 

Now my question is this: What is the best way to transfer the audio signal to the amp? Lots of options- Line level RCA, Optical or wireless (with BT adapter). 

I haven't decided on tablet yet, I do have an ipad (mini), but are willing to get what's best for my setup. Pros/cons with each option?


----------



## teldzc1

subterFUSE said:


> Oops. I was under the impression it was just the DSP Pro with an amp included. My bad. &#55357;&#56841;
> 
> So maybe it's more like the Helix DSP rather than the Pro?
> 
> In which case it's 8 channels, but still has 30 band parametric and also uses the version 3.11c software.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's kind of a cross between the pro and non pro. The non pro is a 56bit processor at 48khz. The pro is 64bit at 96khz. The P Six is 64bit at 48khz. Either way, like you said it runs the latest software which is critical.


----------



## Hugg727

haakono said:


> I'm putting together a system based around my recently bought P SIX (I also bought the two-wheel remote controller along with it).
> 
> Components will be Focal KRX3, two channels powering the tweeters and mids through their passive crossover, two channels will be powering the midbasses fully active, and the last two channels will power a 2x2ohm voice coil Focal KX33 subwoofer.
> 
> Playback source will be a tablet of some kind, with main volume adjustment done by the Helix remote controller.
> 
> Now my question is this: What is the best way to transfer the audio signal to the amp? Lots of options- Line level RCA, Optical or wireless (with BT adapter).
> 
> I haven't decided on tablet yet, I do have an ipad (mini), but are willing to get what's best for my setup. Pros/cons with each option?


If the ipad is your only source then I would got with the bluetooth option. If you also have a HU then you could go low level from that and it then switch over to the optical with the remote when you stream from the tablet


----------



## thebookfreak58

thebookfreak58 said:


> Agree it's very easy. Only downside is the resolution dependence...doesnt seem to work well on high res screens?



Reply from Helix:



> Regarding your resolution question we are aware of this but due to teh software concept it is quite a big thing to increase the resolution and size but we are working on a solution for autumn/winter this year.
> 
> Thanks


----------



## 6spdcoupe

haakono said:


> I'm putting together a system based around my recently bought P SIX (I also bought the two-wheel remote controller along with it).
> 
> Components will be Focal KRX3, two channels powering the tweeters and mids through their passive crossover, two channels will be powering the midbasses fully active, and the last two channels will power a 2x2ohm voice coil Focal KX33 subwoofer.
> 
> Playback source will be a tablet of some kind, with main volume adjustment done by the Helix remote controller.
> 
> Now my question is this: What is the best way to transfer the audio signal to the amp? Lots of options- Line level RCA, Optical or wireless (with BT adapter).
> 
> I haven't decided on tablet yet, I do have an ipad (mini), but are willing to get what's best for my setup. Pros/cons with each option?


Android tablet via AptX and a HU if you want/need both. There is no need for the controller to utilize both devices. Use your tablets volume when connecting via the tablet.


----------



## rockytophigh

6spdcoupe said:


> Android tablet via AptX and a HU if you want/need both. There is no need for the controller to utilize both devices. Use your tablets volume when connecting via the tablet.


Bleh....what do you yanks know about audio? ??


----------



## 6spdcoupe

rockytophigh said:


> Bleh....what do you yanks know about audio? ??


We know how to watch YouTube videos. :laugh:


----------



## rockytophigh

I searched world's greatest audiophile on YouTube.... all I got was a link to a hoarder in Jersey???


----------



## 6spdcoupe

rockytophigh said:


> I searched world's greatest audiophile on YouTube.... all I got was a link to a hoarder in Jersey???


I may have met him once !


----------



## thebookfreak58

My initial impressions of the P SIX DSP

*System:*
HAT L1 Ring Radiators
HAT L6SE
Image Dynamics IDMAX 12 -> JL Audio HD1200/1
80PRS
BL Mazda 3 Neo Sedan (unsure if this model is available in the USA?)

The front stage was previously driven with a HD600/4. Only change was the front stage amp and moving the processing from the 80PRS to the P SIX DSP.

Build Quality: 
This thing is super solid and built like a tank. The chassis is made of a single machined piece of aluminium for heat dissipation. The edges are super sharp too, much to the sadness of my sliced hands  

Terminals use grub screws that require a tiny allen key included.

Usability:

Amp layout and controls are very clear as is the included manual. Audiotech-Fisher are also great with customer service answering some questions I had via their Facebook page and calling Germany. The DSP Tool v3 is incredibly easy to use. I had no issues assigning and routing the IO and setting things up.

Please note, the DSP will refuse to communicate using Windows in VMWare Fusion (Mac OS virtualisation app). It needs native Windows. I'm sure Bootcamp would work for fellow Mac users.

DSP has a similar feature set to the DSP PRO, so I won't go over it here.

Amp does get warm to touch, certainly a lot warmer than the HD series. But nothing too hot or to worry about. Just to note.

Pre-Outs provide a processed signal for my sub amp. When they say 3V they really mean it! I had to wind back the gain compared to the "4V" the 80PRS used to provide.

Sound:

This is a tricky one to objectively define as I haven't yet tuned the car with the new tool (basic levels and gain have been set), but compared to the HD600/4 this amp sounds incredibly warm. The HD had a very precise clinical sound, where as this sounds a bit more laid back and natural. I haven't noticed any difference with the power to the L6SE's dropping from 150W to 120W. I can't comment much more on sound as it really comes down to tuning IMO.

I have a HEC-BT hopefully on it's way soon so can include some more thoughts when it arrives.

I will hopefully be putting the 6 channels to good use with future HAT L3SE midrange drivers.

I highly recommend this amp/DSP


----------



## Huckleberry Sound

thebookfreak58 said:


> My initial impressions of the P SIX DSP
> 
> *System:*
> 
> I highly recommend this amp/DSP


Thanks for sharing your thoughts and impressions. This will go a long way. I do have one already. I have not hooked mines up yet. Still awaiting a few last times.

Thanks!!!


----------



## chithead

Initial review is sounding pretty good! Very excited to implement this piece into my install as well.


----------



## Babs

subterFUSE said:


> Absolutely!
> 
> 
> I would also like them to build a media player to compete with the Audison Bit Play. Audison did such a poor job with it, but I really like the concept. Would be great if a more competent company like Helix would give it a try.


That would be cool! This would be a good suggestion to Audiotec-Fischer to do a media solution like that. 

I plan on a wired but somewhat simple solution of iPhone to an Apple HDMI adapter to optical exctractor into the DSP. 

I imagine that would work swimmingly with any optical-input DSP with separate volume control, such as the DSP, Bit.1, 6to8, or this P Six DSP.


----------



## tjswarbrick

Babs said:


> Awesome! About how big is this thing? It looks tiny for what it is. Actually I could refer to the specs I posted. Dang 8x10 notebook paper size! Wow. So roughly PDX size. Impressive! Very anxious for audio review on it.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Dimensions (H x W x D):

50 x 250 x 190 mm / 1.97 x 9.84 x 7.48”

Very interesting...


----------



## Babs

Wow. Roughly the footprint of a piece of paper. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## chithead

Perfect for those stealthy setups, like myself


----------



## RandyJ75

Now I want to sell all my stuff and buy this!


----------



## hc_TK

haakono said:


> I'm putting together a system based around my recently bought P SIX (I also bought the two-wheel remote controller along with it).
> 
> Components will be Focal KRX3, two channels powering the tweeters and mids through their passive crossover, two channels will be powering the midbasses fully active, and the last two channels will power a 2x2ohm voice coil Focal KX33 subwoofer.
> 
> Playback source will be a tablet of some kind, with main volume adjustment done by the Helix remote controller.
> 
> Now my question is this: What is the best way to transfer the audio signal to the amp? Lots of options- Line level RCA, Optical or wireless (with BT adapter).
> 
> 
> I haven't decided on tablet yet, I do have an ipad (mini), but are willing to get what's best for my setup. Pros/cons with each option?


A USB to coax/toslink adaptor!
These are USB powered, and does only need a coax or optical cable.


----------



## mathematics

The HEC Bluetooth module doesn't support AAC, only SBC from Apple devices. That's not the most ideal thing to do.


----------



## Babs

haakono said:


> Playback source will be a tablet of some kind, with main volume adjustment done by the Helix remote controller.
> 
> Now my question is this: What is the best way to transfer the audio signal to the amp? Lots of options- Line level RCA, Optical or wireless (with BT adapter).
> 
> I haven't decided on tablet yet, I do have an ipad (mini), but are willing to get what's best for my setup. Pros/cons with each option?





Hugg727 said:


> If the ipad is your only source then I would got with the bluetooth option. If you also have a HU then you could go low level from that and it then switch over to the optical with the remote when you stream from the tablet





hc_TK said:


> A USB to coax/toslink adaptor!
> These are USB powered, and does only need a coax or optical cable.


I'd run iPad to HDMI adapter to an audio extractor.. I've been told and read it works extremely well. You'll need the Helix remote for volume.

Also I have tested an Airport Express, sending optical to a Helix DSP with what I thought was awesome results, but it will not also allow the device to utilize cellular data as it's switched to wifi. Tested good enough to me I hated to remove it as I hadn't done the 12V conversion.. I just tested it on A/C power to hear optical vs analog, which rocks!

The Airport method will allow volume control via the Helix remote OR from the iDevice itself, where the HDMI option does not, I'm fairly sure.

Either way would be noticeably better than any analog input, IMO.. Don't care how good the head unit is.


----------



## 6spdcoupe

Babs said:


> I'd run iPad to HDMI adapter to an audio extractor.. I've been told and read it works extremely well. You'll need the Helix remote for volume.
> 
> Also I have tested an Airport Express, sending optical to a Helix DSP with what I thought was awesome results, but it will not also allow the device to utilize cellular data as it's switched to wifi. Tested good enough to me I hated to remove it as I hadn't done the 12V conversion.. I just tested it on A/C power to hear optical vs analog, which rocks!
> 
> The Airport method will allow volume control via the Helix remote OR from the iDevice itself, where the HDMI option does not, I'm fairly sure.
> 
> Either way would be noticeably better than any analog input, IMO.. Don't care how good the head unit is.


You can absolutely stream and use data simultaneously. That is not a problem at all.


----------



## mathematics

Babs said:


> I'd run iPad to HDMI adapter to an audio extractor.. I've been told and read it works extremely well. You'll need the Helix remote for volume.
> 
> Also I have tested an Airport Express, sending optical to a Helix DSP with what I thought was awesome results, but it will not also allow the device to utilize cellular data as it's switched to wifi. Tested good enough to me I hated to remove it as I hadn't done the 12V conversion.. I just tested it on A/C power to hear optical vs analog, which rocks!
> 
> The Airport method will allow volume control via the Helix remote OR from the iDevice itself, where the HDMI option does not, I'm fairly sure.
> 
> Either way would be noticeably better than any analog input, IMO.. Don't care how good the head unit is.


I have been using an Airport Express in the car for over a year now. You have to manually setup the wifi network on the phone (use 10.0.1.4 for example and 255.255.0.0 as the subnet mask, and leave router, search domains, and DNS blank. that tells your phone to use cellular for internet.)

you always want to choose the device with better D/A converter where possible.


----------



## mathematics

rockytophigh said:


> I searched world's greatest audiophile on YouTube.... all I got was a link to a hoarder in Jersey???


lmao that's awesome.


----------



## idelgado782

subterFUSE said:


> The Bit Ten is just a DSP. The P-Six is a DSP and amplifier in one unit. So that isn't even an apples to apples comparison.
> 
> 
> Secondly, the DSP inside of the Helix P-Six will dominate the Audison Bit Ten, then tell it to get up early, cook breakfast and do the laundry. Again, it's not even an apples to apples comparison.
> 
> The Audison Bit One is their flagship processor. The Bit Ten is the little brother to the Bit One. The Helix DSP Pro, which is the same DSP inside of the P-Six, has everything the Audison Bit One has and more:
> 
> 10 channels vs. 8
> 64 bit processing, vs. 32 bit
> 96 kHz sample rate vs. 48kHz
> parametric EQ vs. graphic
> phase angle adjustments vs. simple 0/180 invert
> 
> Plus, the Helix has the best DSP software on the market.
> It's so simple and intuitive. Even a novice can work with it on the first try.



So my the next step in my system would be the dsp. A couple of installers have spoken highly about the bit one and have pushed me in that direction. I heard about the helix dsp from one hifi shop and started doing research. Now im torn. Ive been looking on the classifieds for either unit and have the opportunity to get the bitone for $470. Should I wait till another helix dsp becomes available? Or is the bitone just as good if not better? I don't mind saving up and waiting. I want to get the best unit. What do you guys think?


----------



## subterFUSE

The Helix products are more powerful and easier to tune than the Bit One.

Helix have parametric EQ
Bit One only has graphic.

Helix has an input matrix.
Bit One does not.

Helix has relative EQ and time linking between channels.
Bit One only has absolute linking.

Helix Pro has 10 channels.
Bit One has 8.

Helix Pro has option for 2 optical or coax digital inputs.
Bit One just has 1.


I had the Bit One for many years and it was always stable and reliable for me, but the Helix Pro has changed the way I tune dramatically. It's easier, faster and more intuitive to use. The workflow is better and there are ways to adjust it that the Bit One can't do.

Of course, the Helix Pro isn't even a year old yet. Bit One has been around since 2009 or maybe earlier? I got mine in 2009, at least.
Some might say the Bit One has a more proven track record, which is a fair point. My Helix Pro has been rock solid stable so far.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Babs

mathematics said:


> I have been using an Airport Express in the car for over a year now. You have to manually setup the wifi network on the phone (use 10.0.1.4 for example and 255.255.0.0 as the subnet mask, and leave router, search domains, and DNS blank. that tells your phone to use cellular for internet.)
> 
> you always want to choose the device with better D/A converter where possible.


Holy crap! I gotta try that.. If that works, I'm going with it. I can report that just testing AE from just wall A/C via optical into the Helix, it had noticeably better fidelity, better output, and better noise floor. And in my system currently I've lucked out and have a pretty darn quiet noise floor as is. But the main improvements were the SQ improvements from eliminating all the conversions up front, as suspected it should. 

Here's a question for you... Phone through the EA optical, can you use the phone as a speakerphone through the system? If I had to guess I'd bet not, but thought I'd ask.. If it did that it'd be beyond perfect.

Also.. One thing I had a little cabling issue.. Did you find the EA spitting out the optical cable? On mine, it doesn't hold it well and it will pop out. Not a dealbreaker as I'm sure it could be secured somehow but it was a bit annoying as a spring-loaded thing.


----------



## Babs

Aha. Off topic sorry. Found it..
AE with cell data explained. 

http://evolver.fm/2013/06/06/airplay-on-the-highway-put-apple-airport-express-in-your-car/


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## idelgado782

subterFUSE said:


> The Helix products are more powerful and easier to tune than the Bit One.
> 
> Helix have parametric EQ
> Bit One only has graphic.
> 
> Helix has an input matrix.
> Bit One does not.
> 
> Helix has relative EQ and time linking between channels.
> Bit One only has absolute linking.
> 
> Helix Pro has 10 channels.
> Bit One has 8.
> 
> Helix Pro has option for 2 optical or coax digital inputs.
> Bit One just has 1.
> 
> 
> I had the Bit One for many years and it was always stable and reliable for me, but the Helix Pro has changed the way I tune dramatically. It's easier, faster and more intuitive to use. The workflow is better and there are ways to adjust it that the Bit One can't do.
> 
> Of course, the Helix Pro isn't even a year old yet. Bit One has been around since 2009 or maybe earlier? I got mine in 2009, at least.
> Some might say the Bit One has a more proven track record, which is a fair point. My Helix Pro has been rock solid stable so far.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks for the breakdown. thats great info. I feel like with all the different things, i'm crossing the bitone off of my list. And i'm most likely leaning Helix.


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## Babs

idelgado782 said:


> Thanks for the breakdown. thats great info. I feel like with all the different things, i'm crossing the bitone off of my list. And i'm most likely leaning Helix.


I'd say wise move.. I'd only add mine has shown itself (standard 8ch DSP) to be dead on silent running. My only complaint is my garage is hotter than GA asphalt or I'd be out there all night messing with perfecting the tune.


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## tgsound

Hey, you can surely tap into your MOST network with the mobridge DA1 (with toslink output) and feed the P six Dsp with a clear signal. You just have to make triple sure that your car model is compatible with DA1 product.


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## t3sn4f2

Babs said:


> I'd say wise move.. I'd only add mine has shown itself (standard 8ch DSP) to be dead on silent running. My only complaint is my garage is hotter than GA asphalt or I'd be out there all night messing with perfecting the tune.


Get a mini portable indoor AC or a window mounted one if your garage has a window, some insulated flexible duct work and build adapter in/out vent for it that fit the AC and either the back windows or even better the sunroof. OH and a return duct mounted on the other end of the car so you recondition the cooler cabin air instead of constantly sucking in hot humid garage air. Walla!.....silent AC'd tuning with the windows up. :thumbsup:


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## Babs

t3sn4f2 said:


> Get a mini portable indoor AC or a window mounted one if your garage has a window, some insulated flexible duct work and build adapter in/out vent for it that fit the AC and either the back windows or even better the sunroof. OH and a return duct mounted on the other end of the car so you recondition the cooler cabin air instead of constantly sucking in hot humid garage air. Walla!.....silent AC'd tuning with the windows up. :thumbsup:



Nice!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Babs

tgsound said:


> Hey, you can surely tap into your MOST network with the mobridge DA1 (with toslink output) and feed the P six Dsp with a clear signal. You just have to make triple sure that your car model is compatible with DA1 product.



I'm fairly sure you can. Might check with SubterFUSE on that one. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## mrgreenjeans71

Most people on this forum appear to be in favor of using a DSP, whether in a HU or a product like this one. Don't get me wrong, I would love to buy one of these. But something I read on another forum page suggests that a DSP compromises sound quality. I understand that in home audio there are purists, like analogue and tube amp guys, pass labs First Watt types, and in loudspeakers. I have noticed that Alpine units are pretty cheap compared to some older models that didn't have DSP and were geared toward audiophiles. Has everyone in car audio (there's always a few contrarians of course) gone in this new direction?


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## teldzc1

If you've ever heard even an average dsp tune in a car, you'll never go back to a non dsp system.


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## tgsound

mrgreenjeans71 said:


> Most people on this forum appear to be in favor of using a DSP, whether in a HU or a product like this one. Don't get me wrong, I would love to buy one of these. But something I read on another forum page suggests that a DSP compromises sound quality. I understand that in home audio there are purists, like analogue and tube amp guys, pass labs First Watt types, and in loudspeakers. I have noticed that Alpine units are pretty cheap compared to some older models that didn't have DSP and were geared toward audiophiles. Has everyone in car audio (there's always a few contrarians of course) gone in this new direction?


Of course there are always 'purists' that will tell you that the best sound comes from analog source (and they would be right because analog distortions are more pleasing to the human ear than digital distortions) but we live in the 21st century and all new music comes in a digital format, first! HOWEVER, to state that a CD played through a car audio system using passive x-over (and no DSP) sounds better is a pure non-sense. When your primary goals are to achieve staging, imaging, dynamics (not leaving behind other important characteristics), then you can only reach by using a DSP, no other way!!
Also, consider that the old saying 'every decoding is an encoding', so if you are using s DSP after your HU has already converted the digital signal to analog (!), then you convert it back to digital and again to analog (thru your DSP), you will be definitely losing but there are ways NOT do go through double conversion (D/A; A/D; D/A) by feeding your DSP straight digital signal...
So, for those who say that a non DSP system is better than a DSP one, then they should listen to a straight, well-tuned DSP system and clarify exactly what is better.
The only way I would consider a non-dsp car audio system is if I could bring my turntable into the car!! Enjoy.


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## subterFUSE

It just depends on your goals.

DSP is simply another tool in the bag. It's a very powerful tool, but not 100% necessary.

Of course, I wouldn't own a system without it at this point. But that's just me.


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## Babs

teldzc1 said:


> If you've ever heard even an average dsp tune in a car, you'll never go back to a non dsp system.





subterFUSE said:


> It just depends on your goals.
> 
> DSP is simply another tool in the bag. It's a very powerful tool, but not 100% necessary.
> 
> Of course, I wouldn't own a system without it at this point. But that's just me.


Agreed.. Yes there is a compromise feeding a DSP an analog signal that's already been D/A converted, however so long as the source (head unit) has solid dac's and preamp it's fine especially considering what the tune from the DSP can do for you. That said, the beauty of these new DSP's after years of going without, is that simple thing about every decent home receiver has (toslink inputs). So I'm with SubterFUSE on this.. While considering just an 80PRS for another build, for the "main" car, the Helix is staying put, period until I do a Pro.


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## new2008

Sorry I just order a helipx p six,can you help me how configure and tune it first time?
original unit
front :2 ways hertz hsk xl
rera : original speakers 16.5
sub hertz dba 200.3

for the moment 2 way in activ and after 2 way on a new sub as i think this it would be to small.


thanks


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## chithead

I just encounted this Saturday night. You have to click on the input/output tab at the top on the right hand side and that will allow you to change the channels E/F from Sub and assign them as something else. You can also change all the channels from that menu and assign them as others if you wish.


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## new2008

ok thanks.
have I to run internet first time I connect pc tool??
I must have speakers connected to configure fist time?

I am very afraid to blow up tweeters first time I connect

It is difficult to tune it by yourself??
Have you got a tutorial for me please.


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## chithead

Mine updated no problem without connecting to the internet. I had no speakers connected before setting up the crossovers first. 

Was not difficult to tune at all. The sliders are a bit tricky, but still very easy to use.


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## new2008

Sorry so I have to run the helix p six with no speakers first?tune it up and connect speakers?I undestand it right?


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## chithead

Yes. That is the safe way.


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## new2008

I see and after how I tune them fot not blow them up?


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## Babs

Typically when you fire it up first time to setup inputs and outputs, the safe way would be to not have tweets connected. Get your input/outputs dialed in and verify extreme low volume at your source. Then once you're confident you got it all correct and verified, and your tweet channels are safely high-passed, then try you can try them out.


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## Babs

Also, I'll say I wish I had done this on my current tune. Next time I start fresh I will swap.. I'll assign channels on the main screen in order of their appearance on the FR plot below. So A/B will be sub, for example, and G/H would be tweeters. Right now I have A/B as tweeters. 

It's no big deal but it doesn't follow the graph from left to right. It's a trivial thing, but that extra little bit of UI ergonomics for tuning ease, so thought I'd mention it as recommendation.. Because.. Once you start tuning, I think you only get one shot at that. You lose all your trims etc if you start messing with IO again and re-assigning outputs. It's a 1-shot deal there.


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## new2008

so you can not connct the tweeter and paly the dsp with no problems,but I have to flag or click on something as the tweeter is missing?

sorry what you mean with that "in order of their appearance on the FR plot below. So A/B will be sub, for example, and G/H would be tweeters. Right now I have A/B as tweeters"sorry I did not understand very well...

I think I will put A left tweeter B right tweeter c left woofer D right woofer E none f none
I think it is correct.


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## new2008

I tought on default the dsp gives a cut as you can not blow tweeters.

Wich sub you installed with this dsp?


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## Babs

new2008 said:


> so you can not connct the tweeter and paly the dsp with no problems,but I have to flag or click on something as the tweeter is missing?
> 
> sorry what you mean with that "in order of their appearance on the FR plot below. So A/B will be sub, for example, and G/H would be tweeters. Right now I have A/B as tweeters"sorry I did not understand very well...
> 
> I think I will put A left tweeter B right tweeter c left woofer D right woofer E none f none
> I think it is correct.


You can disconnect the tweeters at your amp no problem, just for verifying your other channels and by elimination verifying all channels are accounted for without having to play your tweeters. Then just volume down, re-verify just to be safe your hi-pass crossover is engaged for the tweeter channels, and test low-levels, all other drivers muted.. Then you know your tweeters are high-passed if they're only playing some random ultra-high safe range, such as 3khz etc. Then just set accordingly as you tune for that particular tweeter.

Oh.. Also, what I meant by that was, if you look at your main screen in the tool, they're labeled logically left to right, channels A through H (for 8ch models).. So instead of having my tweeters at channels A/B, but on the right side of the chart below as they're high-passed, why not set it up so going left to right on the channels correstponds to how their plots would appear on the graph.. Subs on the left (channels A and B maybe), then as they're low-passed they'll be naturally on the left side of the graph.. Make sense?

So for a 3-way plus sub it'd look like:
A Left tweeter
B Right tweeter
C Left mid
D Right mid
E Left midbass
F Right midbass
G Sub1
H Sub2

Rather than flipped.




new2008 said:


> I tought on default the dsp gives a cut as you can not blow tweeters.
> 
> Wich sub you installed with this dsp?


It kinda does if you select L Front High for example, but don't just trust it.. Verify.  I'm using the regular DSP (8ch), not this combo product, but the tool is the same. I'm running a single little SD-3 10" sub now powered by a PDX V9 sub channel. With now much joy, after testing last night. Wow for a little 10 it's got some oomph with an amp that really controls it well.


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## new2008

I have two way 6 channel so:

A Left tweeter
B Right tweeter
C Left mdbass
D Right midbass
E Left not used
F Right not used

as I am runnining actually a amplifed sub by pre out

it is right?


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## Babs

new2008 said:


> I have two way 6 channel so:
> 
> A Left tweeter
> B Right tweeter
> C Left mdbass
> D Right midbass
> E Left not used
> F Right not used
> 
> as I am runnining actually a amplifed sub by pre out
> 
> it is right?


Rock on! I'm jealous.. Would like to play with a P Six DSP. Reports seem to be flowing in slowly that this rascal sounds pretty dang great.


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## new2008

On G and H I will connect the rca for a amplifed subwoofer
Wich color ted and ehi te I have to plug in G and in H?


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## Babs

Ah yeah the P 6 DSP may require certain outputs for the sub RCA outs. You can define the others to your liking I believe. 


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## lv_v

Early on in the thread it was said that the channels are NOT bridgeable, has this been confirmed? Seriously considering this piece if I can run some widebanders off channel 1 & 2, and midbass bridged off channels 3+4 & 5+6.

Dropping this same question to Helix direct too.


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## subterFUSE

lv_v said:


> Early on in the thread it was said that the channels are NOT bridgeable, has this been confirmed? Seriously considering this piece if I can run some widebanders off channel 1 & 2, and midbass bridged off channels 3+4 & 5+6.
> 
> 
> 
> Dropping this same question to Helix direct too.



Not bridgable


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Huckleberry Sound

lv_v said:


> Early on in the thread it was said that the channels are NOT bridgeable, has this been confirmed? Seriously considering this piece if I can run some widebanders off channel 1 & 2, and midbass bridged off channels 3+4 & 5+6.
> 
> Dropping this same question to Helix direct too.


To gain the maximum wattage out of this unit you have to do it through impedance loads. You cant do it by bringing. Example. For my systems, the plan was to do this.

Power Ratings

*Minimum Connection and Power*
Channels A/B = 120 per channel w/ 4 Ohm Speakers
Channels C/D = 120 per channel w/ 4 Ohm Speakers
Channels E/F = 120 Per Channel w/ 4 Ohm Speakers
Channels G/H = L/R RCA DSP Controlled Outs to External Amplifier or etc?

*Maximum Connection and Power*
Channels A/B = 120 per channel w/ 4 Ohm Speakers
Channels C/D = 215 per channel w/ 2 Ohm Speakers
Channels E/F = 215 Per Channel w/ 2 Ohm Speakers
Channels G/H = L/R RCA DSP Controlled Outs to External Amplifier or etc?

Now what you do to draw out that 2 ohm load is up to you. For example. The Stereo Integrity TM6.5 is a dual 4 ohm speakers. So if you wire them a dual 4 ohm speaker, it will draw a 2 ohm load. Which means you now go from getting a 120 watts, to reaching 215 watters per driver. This is done on the left or right side. See the attached image.

Now you can do this for up to four channels. Channels C/D/E/F. You try this with channels A/B, you will toast your unit.

NOW in my personal situation. I am taking channels E and F, and inserting them to a dual 2 ohm subwoofer. It is a Clarus C8 Dual 2 Ohm Subwoofer. SO for me, I am getting 215 watts per channel to each side of that 8" Subwoofer. For the location of the driver, that should work out just right.

I first did the math on it personally. Then I asked some questions to some very qualified people. I even ran this by Helix themselves. My response from them was, no problem whatsoever and this is what the unit was designed for!

SO IF you think it out right. Anything is possible with it. This unit is amazing. My first round of this unit is to get a nice front stage SQ system. For those days that I feel like I really want to dig into something serious. Right now I plan on getting an Helix SPXL1000 and run a set of subwoofers with no problem on channels G and H.


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## Huckleberry Sound

That 120 watts per channel at 4 ohm, will run any set of tweeters, midrange or midbass drivers. Just depends on your end goal. IF SQ, I know you are set. IF SPL, you need to really think this out.


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## lv_v

Thanks for that info. Really is too bad they're not bridgable, I wonder why they chose that design structure. Was hoping to put ~400w+ at 4-ohm bridged on each MW182 woofer and 120w at 4-ohm on each L3V2.


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## Huckleberry Sound

lv_v said:


> Thanks for that info. Really is too bad they're not bridgable, I wonder why they chose that design structure. Was hoping to put ~400w+ at 4-ohm bridged on each MW182 woofer and 120w at 4-ohm on each L3V2.


It does force you to really study your drivers before you go and just get them. I did speak to Helix via email about getting the most out of these units and they said dual 4 ohm speakers will work the best. They even shared that they were going to start designing their speakers around that dual 4 or dual 2, just so people can get the most out of this unit using their speakers.

There are not a lot of dual 4 midbass drivers. So you will need to pick wisely. I would suggest woofers that are high in efficiency would be and work there best to get all the power you can out of them.

Do you plan on going SPL or SQ?


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## new2008

you think this is ok with mi speakers


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## Huckleberry Sound

new2008 said:


> you think this is ok with mi speakers


What are your speakers?


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## lv_v

Huckleberry Sound said:


> Do you plan on going SPL or SQ?


SQ but I like to crank some Five Finger Death Punch or A$AP Rocky from time to time 

I've been hard for the MW182 woofers for about 10 years. Now I have the car that can fit them and the wallet to pay for them.


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## new2008

I have original radio with navi connect p six with high level inputs
front 2 way hertz Hsk XL 165
rear original full range 165 speakers
sub hertz amplifed dba 200.3 connected with pre our rca G and H


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## lv_v

Helix confirmed outputs not bridgable. Trust but verify! 

Guess I'm out a few hundred more $ for the DSP Pro and a Leviathan instead.


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## mlp-mx6

You could always do a second amp using the pre-outs.


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## lv_v

mlp-mx6 said:


> You could always do a second amp using the pre-outs.


I already am, for my sub amp. If only there were 2 pairs of RCA outputs...


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## Huckleberry Sound

EISA - European In-Car Amplifier 2015 - 2016

European In-Car Amplifier 2015-2016 = Helix P Six DSP

https://www.eisa.eu/awards/in-car-electronics/49/european-in-car-amplifier-2015-2016.html#award


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## subterFUSE

Huckleberry Sound said:


> EISA - European In-Car Amplifier 2015 - 2016
> 
> European In-Car Amplifier 2015-2016 = Helix P Six DSP
> 
> https://www.eisa.eu/awards/in-car-electronics/49/european-in-car-amplifier-2015-2016.html#award




Yeah. Saw that on Facebook.


Brax / Helix rules!


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## new2008

new2008 said:


> I have original radio with navi connect p six with high level inputs
> front 2 way hertz Hsk XL 165
> rear original full range 165 speakers
> sub hertz amplifed dba 200.3 connected with pre our rca G and H


Nobody can help me how ti configure it?


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## chithead

new2008 said:


> Nobody can help me how ti configure it?


This took me a bit to figure out. 

On that screen with your assigned inputs/outputs, down there where you want to assign the Subwoofer, right click on the R Full, L Full. This will remove them from that line/arrow drawn over to your subwoofer output. 

On the left side of the screen, you can then change G and H to subwoofer input. Then click and hold down your mouse button, and drag that over to the arrow for your subwoofer on the output. It will then assign the input to that particular output.

You can do that with the other outputs as well to assign them.


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## Babs

Yep. You got it. Once you figure that stuff out a bit you'll be a pro. In fact, you can configure an initial IO file with your in's, out's, initial crossovers and even distance-based TA if you wish outside the car even on your laptop or PC. The software tool is what makes working with these Helix DSP products so nice. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## new2008

I have original radio with navi connect p six with high level inputs
front 2 way hertz Hsk XL 165
rear original full range 165 speakers
sub hertz amplifed dba 200.3 connected with pre our rca G and H

in the picture as I configurate it,whay do you think?


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## chithead

That looks right to me


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## new2008

So I did a good configuration?
and know from where I start to tune first?


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## new2008

now I have the sub with gain in the middle and hertz at low 50 HZ is ok? or I have to put gain at low as I tune it by helix pc tool?

it is normal that I have a green light always lighted on helix p six clip led ?


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## haakono

For those of you that run sub(s) off this amp, how woujld you rate its control over them? It has low(ish) power but high damping factor - from the specs at least.


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## Babs

New2008. Pm sent


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Huckleberry Sound

Helix has some amazing online magazines that teat you how you get stared. Have you used them.


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## Babs

First things first. Verify channels. Mute all but tweets. Verify you have a safe high-pass that's not bypassed for the tweeters. Play low volume and make sure tweet signal is going to tweeters. Test for left and right by muting one side. Then mute mids. Verify mids same way, verifying a rude crossover band pass (a high-pass and low-pass). Etc. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Huckleberry Sound

Look what showed up! Accessories always make an outfit!


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## e90bmw328i

Is it possible to add a center channel using the P-six DSP?


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## Babs

e90bmw328i said:


> Is it possible to add a center channel using the P-six DSP?



I imagine you can but steering to that center would be the real trick. You wouldn't be steering the mid-center panned audio to it in a conventional stereo setting, but you could use left and right both as inputs for the center output channel. Would probably wreck your stage or imaging though. Might be wrong on that. 

However if you had a A/V source that steered center with such as a prologic decoder, that could work. Possibly one of the Car PC's... IF it had some kind of Dolby decoding built in and discrete center channel output. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## e90bmw328i

Babs said:


> I imagine you can but steering to that center would be the real trick. You wouldn't be steering the mid-center panned audio to it in a conventional stereo setting, but you could use left and right both as inputs for the center output channel. Would probably wreck your stage or imaging though. Might be wrong on that.
> 
> However if you had a A/V source that steered center with such as a prologic decoder, that could work. Possibly one of the Car PC's... IF it had some kind of Dolby decoding built in and discrete center channel output.
> 
> 
> Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks for the quick reply. I am already loving this forum. I did consider connecting the fronts with the center in series at my XD600 but that isnt quite a balanced audio. With a MS-8, I used to have center channel but I got rid of MS-8 due to bluetooth echo (I hated the idea of hot patch JBL issued to fix MS-8). Now I am considering a Helix DSP or may be even a match pp 82dsp. But I was hoping I could add a center channel in the car.


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## chithead

That would be interesting. ^^^ Does your car have a center channel now? Wonder if you can tap after the factory amp. Would have the factory DSP to worry about, but would still have a center channel of sorts.


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## e90bmw328i

chithead said:


> That would be interesting. ^^^ Does your car have a center channel now? Wonder if you can tap after the factory amp. Would have the factory DSP to worry about, but would still have a center channel of sorts.


No. From the factory, my car did not have a center channel. So I had a MS-8 which allowed me to have the center channel. It definitely improved the sound quality by orders of magnitude. If it werent for the stupid echo, I would gladly keep the MS-8


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## Victor_inox

I just got one, very nicely made piece, finish not on par with Brax but for price point is unbeatable. That`s all I can say right now, I might sell it or keep it haven't decided yet.


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## mlp-mx6

Is the US backorder over? I'm still waiting for mine.


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## Victor_inox

mlp-mx6 said:


> Is the US backorder over? I'm still waiting for mine.


 I didn`t get it through official chanel, I never do, screw those dealer`s fees.
never needed their service after purchase.
I can get you one for 1000 plus shipping. It will be BNIB.


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## mlp-mx6

Thanks. Due to a pricing error, that's what I'm paying. (In fact, it was lower than that at purchase time, then they realized their error and got in touch with me.) So I suppose I'll continue to wait.


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## rockytophigh

I'm picking up my truck tomorrow and will be able to give some feedback. Audio X said they were really impressed with it!


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## Victor_inox

mlp-mx6 said:


> Thanks. Due to a pricing error, that's what I'm paying. (In fact, it was lower than that at purchase time, then they realized their error and got in touch with me.) So I suppose I'll continue to wait.


 good luck, stunning piece of engineering!


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## rockytophigh

This amp is simply awesome! Plenty of power...great center imaging. If course, all credit goes to the tuner!!!


----------



## Tony407

I apologize if this has been discussed before, but are you able to control all the DSP functions real-time from the driver's seat, assuming you have your laptop connected with a cable long enough to reach the front seat? 

Tony


----------



## Babs

Tony407 said:


> I apologize if this has been discussed before, but are you able to control all the DSP functions real-time from the driver's seat, assuming you have your laptop connected with a cable long enough to reach the front seat?
> 
> Tony


Yes, via laptop and USB connection which might require an active extension for length, you can control it all.


----------



## wrangler

I'm getting a turn off thump from the amplified subwoofer channels.
What can I do to eliminate this.


----------



## hortex69

Is there som sub monoblock amps whtit optical in, not whit rca`s? That a can use by this helix six dsp?


----------



## nineball76

The helix doesn't have optical out. The outputs are rca


----------



## Babs

hortex69 said:


> Is there som sub monoblock amps whtit optical in, not whit rca`s? That a can use by this helix six dsp?






nineball76 said:


> The helix doesn't have optical out. The outputs are rca



Yeah you'd wanna run RCA to the mono amp after processing. However if simply had to run optical you could split an optical signal easy enough, but you'd want the processed channel from the Helix. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## subterFUSE

I don't think there are any car DSP units that have a post-processing digital output.... Except for Audison with the Thesis and Voce amps.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## hortex69

A see on HEC AUX IN and HEC BT manuals this : 
The optical SPDIF output of the HEC AUX IN module
The installation of the HEC module adds as well an additional digital
optical SPDIF output to your device. This output allows to transmit
any unprocessed input or processed output signals to other devices.
A new matrix “Optical Output Routing” appears in the “Input and Output Configuration” page in which you can make your desired settings.

Or a miss andestanding here?

But a downt think that there are only Audison Voise Uno amp, hi is wery expensiv.
Sory for poor English.


----------



## subterFUSE

Oops. Well I never noticed that. Pretty cool!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Babs

Hmm that's slick. You could run TWO Helix's. My head would explode with that many channels. Time for a 5-way front stage. Hehehe 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Tony407

So I just back from my local authorized Helix dealer/install shop. The guy there said that as much as he's in love with the P Six on paper, it's just not that great of a unit. He told me that of all the installs they've done with it, almost every single one had to have warranty work done. He even said some of them actually caught on fire. He loves the DSP part of the P Six (and all Helix DSPs for that matter) but said this particular piece of equipment at present is just downright faulty. 

With that said, I'm holding off for a while.

Just FYI.


----------



## rockytophigh

Been rocking one for months now with zero issues....and most of the time at full tilt. Sounds amazing and hasn't flinched.


----------



## thebookfreak58

Hmmm...been using one here since May. No dramas!


----------



## Twonks

Tony407 said:


> So I just back from my local authorized Helix dealer/install shop. The guy there said that as much as he's in love with the P Six on paper, it's just not that great of a unit. He told me that of all the installs they've done with it, almost every single one had to have warranty work done. He even said some of them actually caught on fire. He loves the DSP part of the P Six (and all Helix DSPs for that matter) but said this particular piece of equipment at present is just downright faulty.
> 
> With that said, I'm holding off for a while.
> 
> Just FYI.


There was a recall of the very first units due to some software (that users can't get at) causing issues with channel distortion and I suppose ultimately meltdown, but all that has now been dealt with.

If he had a batch of these units and didn't go through the returns procedure to get them sorted then I suppose it could explain some problems.

I had the first in the UK and it had the problem. Ran into distortion once but I turned it off and waited for the replacement.

Since then it is played loud with all channels driving hard for up to 7 hours a day 2 or 3 times a week and has never put a foot wrong.


----------



## thebookfreak58

Twonks said:


> There was a recall of the very first units due to some software (that users can't get at) causing issues with channel distortion and I suppose ultimately meltdown, but all that has now been dealt with.
> 
> If he had a batch of these units and didn't go through the returns procedure to get them sorted then I suppose it could explain some problems.
> 
> I had the first in the UK and it had the problem. Ran into distortion once but I turned it off and waited for the replacement.
> 
> Since then it is played loud with all channels driving hard for up to 7 hours a day 2 or 3 times a week and has never put a foot wrong.


Serial number range?


----------



## Twonks

I dunno. Was contacted by the dealer who soted mine out.


----------



## wrangler

Is it possible to deactivate the remote turn on through the high level and use the dedicated remote turn on.
I have an 8.4an Jeep head unit and it stays on "invisibly" for 30 seconds after opening the door, after this delay a turn off thump happens.


----------



## Oefla

Apparently dubbed Helix P Six DSP MKII with the fix, still waiting on it.


----------



## wrangler

Anyone have any ideas how to solve this turn off thump/pop, it is through all the speakers including the sub through the sub amp.
I tried the suggestion below but didn't work. 

Reply from Audiotec Fischer:

"The P SIX DSP itself, does normally not generate pop noises during power off. Maybe the head unit emits some noise while switching off.

The thing with the ".. turned on for up to 45 min .." is, that some cars does keep the head unit in power on state up to 45 minutes after locking the car, to keep the power consumption as small as possible the device it self has a power safe function, which deactivates the internal amplifiers and the remote output after the configured time (DCM -> power safe mode) via a signal detection.

You can try to activate the power safe mode and set the time to 30 secs."


----------



## wrangler

Hating Helix at the moment!
The device keeps loosing its programming, twice this week for a total of 5 times in 2 months.
No output at all. Connect the computer to the Director and then open the software it only goes to "demo" mode. Have to reset the unit then open software for it to see the system which then allows me to upload the file.
Firmware is up to date on both the DSP and the director.
Connections are secure.
Helix is not much help in replying to emails...they probably don't know themselves....


----------



## Victor_inox

Helix only losing settings if power disconnected. And then it must be interrupted for some time. 
Keep it connected as you would regular amplifier and it should be fine.


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Tapatalk


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## wrangler

Victor_inox said:


> Helix only losing settings if power disconnected. And then it must be interrupted for some time.
> Keep it connected as you would regular amplifier and it should be fine.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Tapatalk


I understand what you are saying, but not sure how the power is being interrupted. 
Do you think the circuit breaker at the battery could be faulty, however, I've never had any interruptions during driving. Some of my driving is four to five hours long, or repeated thirty minute to one hour intervals...


----------



## Victor_inox

Do you disconnect battery/circuit breaker when your car parked overnight?


----------



## wrangler

Victor_inox said:


> Do you disconnect battery/circuit breaker when your car parked overnight?


No.
This system replaces a JBL MS-8, for what it's worth.


----------



## Victor_inox

wrangler said:


> No.
> This system replaces a JBL MS-8, for what it's worth.


 Is there always power on helix power terminals. if it is then It`s faulty unit.


----------



## wrangler

Victor_inox said:


> Is there always power on helix power terminals. if it is then It`s faulty unit.


Thank you for your replies.
Re: power, I assume that the DSP has power because it does work most of the time...it is random when it stops.
I was thinking it was aproblematic unit, this is the second one, first one started to "smoke after a week of usage. It was happily replaced. 
I'll call the company and ask what to do next.


----------



## aykhan

An interesting post for me. I'm new to car audio but after reading a lot of forums and doing whatever research I could I've finally decided to go with the Helix P Six DSP. My head unit will be Pioneer AVIC-8100NEX. I'm going with full Active setup of Focal Utopia Be no 7 and a single ten inch Morel subwoofer for an SQ setup (Morel Ultima Ti 102 which is the 2 ohm version and rated 1000W RMS). I will power the amp with a JL Audio HD1200/1 connected to the Helix P Sic for channel processing. I am not using any rears.

My confusion is, since I'm new to hooking things up, what cables to I need and how exactly do I hookup the headunit to the P Six? Do I take a single RCA cable (@ connectors red and white) from the headunit and put that into the A and B input of the P Six and then assign all 6 outputs (2 tweeters, 2 midranges and 2 midbass) randomly from A and B? Kinda confused although I'm certain this is very basic stuff.


----------



## thebookfreak58

You got it. One RCA sending a full range signal from the head unit. Then configure the outputs just as you described.


----------



## aykhan

If I can use any input channel on the P Six for assigning all channels then is it possible to get a single one connector RCA cable (like a regular sub cable) from the headunit into just the A input of the P Six then assign all the 6 outputs from the single input A? Also can just a single cable be run from the output G only into the JL amp for the subwoofer? All probably quite juvenile questions but I dont want anything to blow up in my face!


----------



## tjswarbrick

aykhan said:


> If I can use any input channel on the P Six for assigning all channels then is it possible to get a single one connector RCA cable (like a regular sub cable) from the headunit into just the A input of the P Six then assign all the 6 outputs from the single input A? Also can just a single cable be run from the output G only into the JL amp for the subwoofer? All probably quite juvenile questions but I dont want anything to blow up in my face!


H/U to Processor you'll want a stereo pair. A mono cable will only give you left or right.
As far as Processor to sub amp - according to the manual, you must feed both inputs. (It sums the signals internally.) So if you want to run a mono cable from the DSP, you'll need a "Y" splitter before the amp.
Probably best to just run a stereo pair there, as well.


----------



## aykhan

Anyone got any screen shots of how the channel assignment will look like running 3-way fronts active and 2 subs?


----------



## aykhan

Also the P Six comes with the option of putting a HEC module in for BT and Aux input. What would be the benefit if the headunit already has BT capability and an aux input?


----------



## nineball76

aykhan said:


> Also the P Six comes with the option of putting a HEC module in for BT and Aux input. What would be the benefit if the headunit already has BT capability and an aux input?



It's to add another source such as iPad or other phone/tablet thru Bluetooth straight to the processor.


----------



## wrangler

wrangler said:


> Thank you for your replies.
> Re: power, I assume that the DSP has power because it does work most of the time...it is random when it stops.
> I was thinking it was aproblematic unit, this is the second one, first one started to "smoke after a week of usage. It was happily replaced.
> I'll call the company and ask what to do next.


I think I found the problem with loosing the software issue, looks like the DIN connecter at the DSP comes loose from vibration. 
Now only if the turn off thump can be resolved.


----------



## BlueGhost

aykhan said:


> Also the P Six comes with the option of putting a HEC module in for BT and Aux input. What would be the benefit if the headunit already has BT capability and an aux input?


Most headunits, especially OEM, have poor quality BT streaming. The HEC module is APTX so it should give better results, at least with an APTX source. Bypassing the headunit BT would also take another link out of the times the signal has to pass trough digital to analog/analog to digital conversions.


----------



## aykhan

Yeah ok makes sense


----------



## aykhan

Another confusion for me. I'm nearing my install soon and trying to work everything through. When I setup the frequency graphs in the RTA using the pink noise do I tune all 6 components of the 3-way individually (3 on left and 3 on right - tweeter, midrange, midbass) or do I link all three components of the left (and then later on right) and take my measurements?


----------



## thebookfreak58

Anyone seen that there is now a MK2?

Differences I can see are the new 12-24V input voltage range, frequency to 44kHz and slightly more power at 2ohm? (215 vs 230W)?

Any other differences?


----------



## nineball76

The original was 44khz I think since the optical in was 24/96 capable. But the mk2 loses the coax in. Not a huge deal,, haven't heard of anyone using it.


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## nineball76

But I see 10.5-32v operating voltage


----------



## Babs

aykhan said:


> Another confusion for me. I'm nearing my install soon and trying to work everything through. When I setup the frequency graphs in the RTA using the pink noise do I tune all 6 components of the 3-way individually (3 on left and 3 on right - tweeter, midrange, midbass) or do I link all three components of the left (and then later on right) and take my measurements?



Oh you stepped in it now. Hehehe

I typically recommend Room EQ Wizard because of its power and resolution however if new to tuning, using the Helix RTA tool is a good way to get your feet wet. 

You can do this a few ways. One method:
1 set crossovers and general levels by ear and get time alignment pretty close. 

2 measure a whole side against the RTA curve to gauge where you're at and adjust levels to match. 

3 begin making EQ cuts to individual drivers on that side to bring it closer to the RTA curve. You can select bandwidths in RTA so you're just working on your mids or tweeters for example. 

4 rinse and repeat for the other side. 

5 play it and see if the results helped balance sides for a good image and stage. You can customize the Helix curve if it's too bright or otherwise not to your liking

Couple notes here:
Balancing responses between left/right drivers will dramatically improve your imaging. 

Only make cuts and only minute increases in EQ to avoid distortion

Dramatic wide dips in crossover areas are an indicator of destructive phase cutouts. Play with TA to see what happens there between tweets/mids for example. 

.. Pandora's box officially opened. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## #1BigMike

I have been using the Helix P6 for 3 weeks now and I am really impressed. As I stated before, this is my first go round with a D class amplifier and I am very very pleased. 

I have the following gear currently running off of the P6 and it is slamming! 

Dynaudio Esotar - 110 tweeters
Sinfoni Tempo - 6.5" woofers (Revised Maestoso)
(2) Stereo Integrity SI BM MK IV 12" subs (2ohm)

The amp seems to control all the speakers including the subs very well.

I had my buddy in my work truck and he could not believe the SQ he was hearing. After a 30 minute demo I decided to show him the amp, his jaw hit the ground  LOL.

For what this amp is designed for, it is stellar!!!


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## Babs

Stop man! I want one and can't shell out for it. Would be such fun in the Tacoma under a seat somewhere.


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## #1BigMike

Not going to lie, the P6 will rock your Tacoma. I have a full size f150 supercrew and it is slamming. I did cheat a bit by going to a tuner but I did the deadening, speaker and amp install I didnmyself.

My tuner was even shocked and he is a dieheart A-AB amp guy. Best class D amp he has heard. 

If you want 'simple, stealth and bad ass,' the P6 will be tough to beat for sure. I honestly do feel that with good driver selection and proper tuning with the P6, the majority of people would be more than happy with its performance given the price point and all that you get.

If you were closer I would let you demo it.

I was thinking of getting an amp for the subs but I no longer feel I need to. This sub amp combo is almost perfect.




Babs said:


> Stop man! I want one and can't shell out for it. Would be such fun in the Tacoma under a seat somewhere.


----------



## Babs

^ Well that did it.. Stick a fork in me. I'll have to try one. Especially since the same laptop with the same software will run both cars. Kinda gotta.


----------



## thebookfreak58

From AF.

Good Morning,

Thank you for your Mail.
The main difference of the P SIX DSP MK1 and MK2 is the used amplifier circuit.
Due to component shortages the amplifier was slightly changed which lead to a slight change in the technical data.
Mainly the damping factor is lower, the frequency response got higher due to the higher possible sampling rate and the amplifier concept itself is now also 24 Volt compatible.
The amplifier concept and design is still the same.
So the MK2 indicates just a slightly changed circuit and not a completely new designed product.


----------



## masse1369

Maybe I missed it reading through this thread but can channels 5&6 be bridged for a sub? This truly does look like an incredible bargain. Definitely putting this at the top of my list along with the Zapco 6.150LX and a separate processor.


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## brumledb

masse1369 said:


> Maybe I missed it reading through this thread but can channels 5&6 be bridged for a sub? This truly does look like an incredible bargain. Definitely putting this at the top of my list along with the Zapco 6.150LX and a separate processor.


It isn't bridgeable. It's discussed a little on the first page of thread.


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## nineball76

Best to get a d2 sub and run channel 5 to one coil, channel 6 to the other.


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## masse1369

Thanks!


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## #1BigMike

Efficiency is the name of the Game with this Beast.

As "Huckleberry Sound" mentioned early on, do your homework on driver selection. I did not head to his advice and had/am making changes.


----------



## Babs

Yeah I'm seriously considering just for my own testing or rather comparison to the PDX's, next build will be class-AB craziness. There will certainly be some Helix processing in front of it though. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## thebookfreak58

Had this in my car since May. Never skipped a beat  Great piece of kit!


----------



## Onyx1136

So, since Rockford is apparently not bringing this particular piece into the US, who is our source for acquiring these? I found them on Amazon Europe, but is there a better source here State side?


----------



## Babs

Onyx1136 said:


> So, since Rockford is apparently not bringing this particular piece into the US, who is our source for acquiring these? I found them on Amazon Europe, but is there a better source here State side?



You should be able to get them. Contact a dealer. 


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----------



## Jrvtecaccord

Onyx1136 said:


> So, since Rockford is apparently not bringing this particular piece into the US, who is our source for acquiring these? I found them on Amazon Europe, but is there a better source here State side?


Crutchfield carries it. 

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk


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## rockytophigh

They're readily available at dealers.


----------



## Babs

I still can't get over how tiny the thing is for what's in the case. If it makes rated sure enough 120 x 6 with good control, that is extremely impressive. A compact car install dream come true.


----------



## Huckleberry Sound

Babs said:


> I still can't get over how tiny the thing is for what's in the case. If it makes rated sure enough 120 x 6 with good control, that is extremely impressive. A compact car install dream come true.


I agree. I wish they had a matching mono block amplifier that sourced out about 1600 watts. Same size and format. Just to keep it simple and clean.


----------



## #1BigMike

Huckleberry Sound said:


> I agree. I wish they had a matching mono block amplifier that sourced out about 1600 watts. Same size and format. Just to keep it simple and clean.


Yes this would be very very nice.


----------



## Victor_inox

Huckleberry Sound said:


> I agree. I wish they had a matching mono block amplifier that sourced out about 1600 watts. Same size and format. Just to keep it simple and clean.


THey have SPLX1000 but it`s about twice the size.
I don`t see how they can make it into p6 dsp sized box.


----------



## moparman79

I will be doing a few of these in upcoming builds Ferrari 458 Italia and dodge challenger.


----------



## aykhan

I have now decided to go with Audison amps for class A power. So now I will be using the Helix DSP Pro instead of the P Six. I've put it on eBay if anyone interested in placing an offer. I just got it barely 2 weeks ago.


----------



## Babs

customaudioman said:


> I will be doing a few of these in upcoming builds Ferrari 458 Italia and dodge challenger.


You just said Ferrari and Dodge in the same sentence. What is this world coming to!?!?!


----------



## rockytophigh

aykhan said:


> I have now decided to go with Audison amps for class A power. So now I will be using the Helix DSP Pro instead of the P Six. I've put it on eBay if anyone interested in placing an offer. I just got it barely 2 weeks ago.


I've got Audison in my car....and the Helix in my truck. Very comparable amps IMHO


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## moparman79

Babs said:


> You just said Ferrari and Dodge in the same sentence. What is this world coming to!?!?!


Yep thats right, both ends of the spectrum. lol. I'm more of a muscle car guy for sure.


----------



## The ///Man

Huckleberry Sound said:


> I agree. I wish they had a matching mono block amplifier that sourced out about 1600 watts. Same size and format. Just to keep it simple and clean.


Hahaha, I'm still waiting on my PSIX, but the SPXL amp is a similar style, unfortunately I'm 90% certain it's like 4x the size.


----------



## moparman79

The P Six DSP MK2 9.84" X 6.46" X 1.73" (L x W x H) 120w x 6 230w @ 2ohm $1299.95
The SPXL1000 16.93" X 9.84" X 2.16" (L x W x H) [email protected] [email protected] [email protected] $999.95

The SPXL1000 is 7.09" longer 3.5" wider and .19" taller then the P-Six MK2, not to bad for a 1600 watt amplifier.


----------



## haakono

We're using a Helix B One for sub duties in a friends car, with a P six to power the 3-ways up front + control the B One. Well, still waiting for the P six to arrive, but the rest is installed. The P six has about the same (combined) output power as the B One, so they should be able to make a 1/2 channel amp with about 1kw in that same size. Especially when you look at the prototypes for the microsized Match line amps from Helix.


----------



## moparman79

Update to the Helix P SIX DSP model is now Helix P SIX DSP MK2
From Helix: 

Due to unexpected supply difficulties of an essential component and after careful consideration we decided to change the amplifier IC of the device. For this reason some parameters of the technical specifications changed and the device got slight modifications. 
The main difference is that the “Class Ultra D” amplifier concept is replaced by the “Ultra HD Class D” technology. This technology allows a 96 kHz sampling rate and an extended audio bandwith of more than 40 kHz. Additionally the P SIX DSP MK2 is now 24V compatible.
Other features and the product design remain the same.


----------



## ChrisUlrich

customaudioman said:


> Update to the Helix P SIX DSP model is now Helix P SIX DSP MK2
> From Helix:
> 
> Due to unexpected supply difficulties of an essential component and after careful consideration we decided to change the amplifier IC of the device. For this reason some parameters of the technical specifications changed and the device got slight modifications.
> The main difference is that the “Class Ultra D” amplifier concept is replaced by the “Ultra HD Class D” technology. This technology allows a 96 kHz sampling rate and an extended audio bandwith of more than 40 kHz. Additionally the P SIX DSP MK2 is now 24V compatible.
> Other features and the product design remain the same.


One of the first to have the PSIX installed and mine still works fantastic! Paired with Micro Precision 7 series and a Brax Matrix 10.1 is a thing of beauty!


----------



## brumledb

Trying to install mine..
Manual says when clipping a Red LED should come on. Mine is green as soon as it comes on. I cannot get it to turn red. I am giving it a 1khz at -3db max volum on h/u. I have tried moving the jumpers around.
Any advice?


----------



## Babs

brumledb said:


> Trying to install mine..
> Manual says when clipping a Red LED should come on. Mine is green as soon as it comes on. I cannot get it to turn red. I am giving it a 1khz at -3db max volum on h/u. I have tried moving the jumpers around.
> Any advice?



Are you trying to get it to clip? You may not have enough head unit juice. Is the output strong and clean? If so I wouldn't sweat it. 


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk


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## brumledb

Yeah... And wasn't sure if the green light was supposed to stay on. Not sure about output yet. This was my first setup step and step and have been hung on this step far too long. Two of my output channels didn't have the threaded inserts for tightening (go figure). Was able to scrounge up 2 then finally just had to go to Home Depot to find something suitable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## #1BigMike

I never got mine to clip either. It is currently mated with a pioneer 80PRS. "It's the little engine that could lol." 

I wouldn't sweat it Sir.


----------



## thebookfreak58

Are you sure you're looking at the right LED? From memory the setup selected is Green/Orange (Preset 1/2) and the clipping LED only lights up red when clipping??

If I remember correctly...


----------



## brumledb

#1BigMike said:


> I never got mine to clip either. It is currently mated with a pioneer 80PRS. "It's the little engine that could lol."
> 
> 
> 
> I wouldn't sweat it Sir.



Mine is going to a stock h/u. After posting last night I moved forward. Everything seems to be working great. Did a very quick, dirty tune last night and can already tell it's going to sound way better than my previous install.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## brumledb

thebookfreak58 said:


> Are you sure you're looking at the right LED? From memory the setup selected is Green/Orange (Preset 1/2) and the clipping LED only lights up red when clipping??
> 
> If I remember correctly...



Yep I was looking at the correct LED. Either you are misremembering or yours was different. The manual states a red LED will come on when clipping and never mentions a green LED for clipping. However, my unit has a green LED that stays on and that LED is directly under the word "Clip".


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## #1BigMike

Thats great to read! Glad she is sounding good. OEM speakers also?


----------



## brumledb

No sir. Scan R3004, Scan 10f, ID x69, SI MKIV. Subs are ran off Alpine PDX M12. The tweets and mids are mounted in pods from the German fellow. 

So far my only complaint is the High level speaker input system they use. That could most definitely be made a lot better.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## brumledb

So this question isn't specific to the P-Six but didn't want to create a new thread just for this question...

This is my first attempt at tuning, I am using my computer w/ REW connected via aux to my OEM H/U to measure. I am using the sweeps method. How do I account for the volume setting on my computer? 

What I mean is, I finished my first tune and it sounded pretty good but there wasn't enough volume. I realized that my computer volume setting was nearly maxed, so I went back and tried remeasuring at a much lower volume setting on my computer but same volume setting on my h/u and sure enough the sweep was at a much lower volume.

The only thing I can think to do, is set the h/u to a particular volume setting and take an SPL measurement with Helix at its stock setting. Then connect the computer and determine what volume setting the computer has to be at to give me the same SPL measurement, with the same H/U volume setting.

Am I missing something really simple?


----------



## bquarforth

I have the HEC AUX IN - P SIX DSP module and can sell in 10 days for $49.00 . Was sent to me by accident and getting replacement module for my DSP Pro. I can be reached at 703-244-8200. Bob


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## KingHobo

I have used the Match and Helix DSP's quite a bit and they are phenomenal. Even if the amplifier in here is only half as good as the DSP, it will still be a great piece.


----------



## mark1478

How is the match series amps? Looking to pair it with my p six with a 10fx to run an esotar 1200 but wondering if the 300 watts will be sufficient


----------



## #1BigMike

Do you have space constraints?

For best performance out of the Esotar 1200 IMO, I don't think 300 watts will do it.

The Helix SPXL 1000 may do it with head room .

Links posted below for others to glance at the specs and to chime in for ya.

http://www.dynaudio.com/media/2530/esotar2_1200.pdf

MATCH MA 10FX

HELIX SPXL 1000





mark1478 said:


> How is the match series amps? Looking to pair it with my p six with a 10fx to run an esotar 1200 but wondering if the 300 watts will be sufficient


----------



## mark1478

Thanks buddy. Space constraints ya kinda. its going into a G37 coupe trunk. I am infinite baffle so i thought I would be fine with 300. The SPXL is nice but retail of 1k and a lot more juice than I need. But I'm anal and want to run all the same kind of amps if possible. Guess ill stick with my surfboard DC750.2 for a bit lol


----------



## #1BigMike

Lets see if some others can chime in. I don't have any experience with IB installs. I am sure you can get a better price for that amp also.


----------



## theWildBoy

I'm just curious about which speakers in a 2-way would be a great pick to be amplified from the Helix P Six DSP...
Brax Matrix 6.1 and 1.1?
Sinfoni Maestoso comps?
Audiofrog GB60 and GB15?
Audio development MM6 and Aerospace 28?

It is such an amazing product but I'm not sure if the power provided by the P Six is enough for some people drive their 6.5s.


----------



## mathematics

I have mine powering 8-6.5" midbasses, two 4" midranges, and two tweeters. So, I dunno., seems like it does a decent job lol =)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## mark1478

drives my Dyn MW182s fine. and you should hear mathematics car. Its scary loud and clear with the P Six


----------



## sicride

brumledb said:


> So this question isn't specific to the P-Six but didn't want to create a new thread just for this question...
> 
> This is my first attempt at tuning, I am using my computer w/ REW connected via aux to my OEM H/U to measure. I am using the sweeps method. How do I account for the volume setting on my computer?
> 
> What I mean is, I finished my first tune and it sounded pretty good but there wasn't enough volume. I realized that my computer volume setting was nearly maxed, so I went back and tried remeasuring at a much lower volume setting on my computer but same volume setting on my h/u and sure enough the sweep was at a much lower volume.
> 
> The only thing I can think to do, is set the h/u to a particular volume setting and take an SPL measurement with Helix at its stock setting. Then connect the computer and determine what volume setting the computer has to be at to give me the same SPL measurement, with the same H/U volume setting.
> 
> Am I missing something really simple?


It is my understanding that any component in your audio system should be set at the max volume before clipping when tuning. There are exceptions, of course, like if your system is capable of playing louder than you ever reasonably would then lower the volume of the component that may introduce the most noise until you are at the maximum normal listening volume. Then keep your hearing safety in mind when measuring if you are in the vehicle during tuning (which I prefer).

There are different theories from there what volume to tune at but I prefer an average of about 85-90db for normal listening and tend to tune there. When complete I usually test at max volume to be sure there is nothing that is out of line or causing damage to components.

Summary though yes your pc volume should be very high up to the point where your sound card may induce clipping. If your system does not seem to have enough dynamic range or overall volume after tuning, but it did before tuning, then there may be too much cutting to achieve the perfect tune. So either reduce your cuts and make compromises or get more power!!!!!


----------



## falcon

So I am trying to make sure I understand something correctly...if I buy the Optical Aux In extension card, I can run an iPod with a digital signal directly into the DSP? This seems it would bypass the factory HU for this source...is that correct? Does Apple Lossless work in this hypothetical setup?

Secondly, do I need their harnesses to connect this to my factory HU, or can I just connect the wires directly (speaker level inputs)?


----------



## falcon

Forget my previous question...it was dumb. Anyone else using one of these that hasn't commented on how they like it?


----------



## chinhow

Hi all, i am ready to get one into my 2010 Q7, 1 question though, is the DSP setting able to create kind of surround sound in the car? like JBL MS-8 logic 7 kind of profile? thanks!


----------



## sicride

Nope. So far only ms-8 and alpine processors can do that as far as I know.


----------



## #1BigMike

theWildBoy said:


> I'm just curious about which speakers in a 2-way would be a great pick to be amplified from the Helix P Six DSP...
> Brax Matrix 6.1 and 1.1?
> Sinfoni Maestoso comps?
> Audiofrog GB60 and GB15?
> Audio development MM6 and Aerospace 28?
> 
> It is such an amazing product but I'm not sure if the power provided by the P Six is enough for some people drive their 6.5s.


The more efficient the drivers the better.


----------



## Hugg727

Not sure if this has been covered here .... Has anyone tried experimenting with the Dynamic Headroom Management setting in the DCM section of the p Six? Here is the description from the AF change log, it was introduced in v3.15:
_(HELIX P SIX DSP) - Added the feature 'Dynamic headroom management" which allows to increase the maximum output power of each channel pair by accepting higher distortion._

It does seem louder but I am a little concerned about how much distortion. Are we still getting 120w in SQ mode or do we need to switch it to SPL mode to get all of that power?


----------



## Babs

Dunno about that.. But, unless it's already covered.. I saw AF posted this.. 
The Helix V Eight DSP.


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## Hugg727

Wonder what the power is on that.....if its like the P6, 120x6, and you could bridge channels 7/8 into a sub channel then this is a 3 way active plus a sub in a box. It doesnt look much bigger than the P6. I wonder if they could bump up the power slightly...like 150 x 6 and 300x1 Bridged....that would be a killer all in one.


----------



## Hugg727

Hugg727 said:


> Not sure if this has been covered here .... Has anyone tried experimenting with the Dynamic Headroom Management setting in the DCM section of the p Six? Here is the description from the AF change log, it was introduced in v3.15:
> _(HELIX P SIX DSP) - Added the feature 'Dynamic headroom management" which allows to increase the maximum output power of each channel pair by accepting higher distortion._
> 
> It does seem louder but I am a little concerned about how much distortion. Are we still getting 120w in SQ mode or do we need to switch it to SPL mode to get all of that power?


I emailed AF on this and here is their response:

_thanks for your email and we are glad to that you are happy with our products.
Actually the output power of the P SIX in SQ and SPL mode is identical, but the SPL mode adds some dB’s to the overall gain.
We have experienced that several users of the P SIX adjusted the equalizer so that it isn’t possible to drive the amplifier to the maximum possible output level (e.g. by reducing the gain in many EQ bands).
So we implemented the Dynamic Headroom Management which increases the overall gain and adds limiters to the signal path in order to avoid digital clipping._


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## hykhleif

Greetings

My 2 way set up is 

helix p six- mk2
hertz mille 1600ml - woofer
hybrid Audio L1PRO -- tweeter
arc series 12d4----1 sub--350rms/700

I kindly seek help, so I bought the p6 mk2 with the director and main purpose is to use my digital cowon player as a source to be connected directly to the p six using rca from p6 - 3.5mm to my digital player

and I am lost in configuration as I am new in setups

The installer put the tweeters in the AB, Woofers in CD and subs in EF output of the p six

I know there is an rca coming out of the Headunit to input A/B

Other than that I am lost, the whole purpose of buying this unit is to connect my small cowon digital player directly to the processor using an RCA-3.5mm cable from the processor to my DAP The installer told me the RCA -3.5mm cable is connected to input EF on the helix

In the setup software everything is messed up and we struggled to make the right configurations and I need help in this as I gave up to set up the inputs and outputs properly, can anyone please help in making a file configuration file that i can load to get my setup going where each input and output is assigned correctly for both my HU and my digital player. 

I also have the director which is connected as well 

I will truly appreciate your help in sending me a file to load with correct inputs output confirguartions and the basic crossovers set, and the director to be on, kinldy please send it to my email [email protected], or if you can send it here by message


----------



## haakono

If I understand it correctly you want to use 2 different analog sources connected directly to the amp (Head unit and media player), using 4 of the 6 RCA inputs? 

I think you need to make two separate configurations, load both, and switch between them on the Director for each time you want to swap sources. One preset that use inputs A+B to send signals to A to F outputs, and another preset that use inputs E+F to send signals to A to F outputs.


----------



## hykhleif

haakono said:


> If I understand it correctly you want to use 2 different analog sources connected directly to the amp (Head unit and media player), using 4 of the 6 RCA inputs?
> 
> I think you need to make two separate configurations, load both, and switch between them on the Director for each time you want to swap sources. One preset that use inputs A+B to send signals to A to F outputs, and another preset that use inputs E+F to send signals to A to F outputs.


that is correct. So this means 2 setups then, as you mentioned. I thought i can do one and switch between inputs

kindly I have 2 questions please :

1- I was wondering do I need to play around with jumpers and sensitivity my digital player is cowon plenue D. Do i need to open the helix and move the jumpers, as the cown plenuse D has Output	1Vrms, Output Impedance	0.5Ω

[ Welcome to COWONGLOBAL.com ]

Another question please, what is the advised volume that I should set on my cowon which has no full line out, what volume shall I set the volume on my cowon plenue D

2- can anyone tell me how to setup the gain on inputs a/b and e/f, shall i play some kind of noise file and at what volume shall i keep my headunit?


----------



## haakono

I've just gotten my p six myself, and is just trying to get to grips with the software/setup on the computer now, before I install it. So I can't say for sure that it will work that way, but it's the only way I see it working with multiple RCA sources.


----------



## hykhleif

haakono said:


> I've just gotten my p six myself, and is just trying to get to grips with the software/setup on the computer now, before I install it. So I can't say for sure that it will work that way, but it's the only way I see it working with multiple RCA sources.


I see, how will you set the sensitivity of p six, what is the process to do this, as i assume that is the starting pointing before fine tuning and using eq


----------



## Oefla

Have connected everything but the speakers, some installation work left, trying out the dsp settings and seeing if things will work.

No sound on subwoofer out, no signal received on amplifier or when trying an old p-dsp.

But to my biggest surprise, felt like an dream when the volume was turned up and music plays out of the amplifier itself!

Anyone?

Used in this setup:

Pioneer f60dab, nex in eu format.
Audison bit play hd, hdmi to pioneer, optical to psix
Helix p6dsp mkII.
Dls a6 mono, rca from p6 and sub connected.


----------



## TravisT

can anyone pm me with Dealer info to purchase helix from? pm's are welcome! thank you


----------



## nineball76

How warm do these things tend to run? Be better to mount under a seat where it can breathe or in a covered false floor?


----------



## Hugg727

They do get a little hot

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk


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## Twonks

I've had a P Six installed upside down on the rear deck of a VW CC for around 14 months.

Played solidly for 4 hours 2 or 3 times a week (and at least 2 x 40 minutes every week day) at a time on loud music and it never put a foot wrong. (Drive for a living)

It is in the UK so ambient is never too hot and the amp was in free air as such. I'd say it got warm but never hot enough to question.

Load wise it was powering the front components actively and the remaining two channels paired through software and ran into a DVC sub.

Was also playing in SPL mode software wise, although gains and EQ never pushed it too hard into the red.

Hope this helps.


----------



## nineball76

Yup, both of those help a little. It'd probably be for the best having it under the front seat of my mkiv golf. Plus the shorter runs to the front speakers would be nice, along with a shorter spdif from head unit.


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## t3sn4f2

nineball76 said:


> Yup, both of those help a little. It'd probably be for the best having it under the front seat of my mkiv golf. Plus the shorter runs to the front speakers would be nice, along with a shorter spdif from head unit.


Does your car have underseat AC vents? Those are sure to help also.


----------



## nineball76

I don't think so


----------



## mistaleung

Hello guys.I am new to the car audio.
I came across to the Helix amp 2 weeks ago and the sound is just amazing.
The shop is very professional and skilled.
However the price in Hong Kong here is way higher than in U.S.
So if i order the unit online and ship to Hong Kong. Could a regular car audio shop install and tune the unit properly? (I drive a golf GTI mk6)

Thanks in advance!!


----------



## t3sn4f2

mistaleung said:


> Hello guys.I am new to the car audio.
> I came across to the Helix amp 2 weeks ago and the sound is just amazing.
> The shop is very professional and skilled.
> However the price in Hong Kong here is way higher than in U.S.
> So if i order the unit online and ship to Hong Kong. Could a regular car audio shop install and tune the unit properly? (I drive a golf GTI mk6)
> 
> Thanks in advance!!


Yes, all you need is a home computer/laptop to run the tuning software and the skill to tune a car audio system.


----------



## RattyMcClelland

Can anyone tell me if the USB to change settings via a windows tablet can charge the tablet at the same time so it can be permanently connected.

So I can change settings as and when, have full apps from the tablet and play everything via Bluetooth.


I basically want to use a tablet instead of a headunit. But trying to decide which is to use as all my music is alac from my iPod.

It would be a bonus if I could use a windows tablet that has iTunes on it, can access the helix software and be charged by the helix.


----------



## Babs

RattyMcClelland said:


> Can anyone tell me if the USB to change settings via a windows tablet can charge the tablet at the same time so it can be permanently connected.
> 
> So I can change settings as and when, have full apps from the tablet and play everything via Bluetooth.
> 
> 
> I basically want to use a tablet instead of a headunit. But trying to decide which is to use as all my music is alac from my iPod.
> 
> It would be a bonus if I could use a windows tablet that has iTunes on it, can access the helix software and be charged by the helix.


Might have two different things confused here.. 

There's currently one USB for PC connection for the software. It does not stream audio into the DSP. 

For streaming, you'd go through the USB HEC that's coming out, and I think it does also have a charge-back voltage for devices. However you don't run the software tuning tool through the USB HEC. 

So you tune via the panel USB (or Director USB port). Stream through USB HEC in the HEC slot. Two different USB's for different purposes.


----------



## haakono

No, the question was simpler than that, it says that he wants audio output through Bluetooth (with the BT module presumably). 

While using the tablet to control the DSP separately, but the question is does the USB connection for the DSP also provide charging for whatever's connected to it?


----------



## RattyMcClelland

haakono said:


> No, the question was simpler than that, it says that he wants audio output through Bluetooth (with the BT module presumably).
> 
> While using the tablet to control the DSP separately, but the question is does the USB connection for the DSP also provide charging for whatever's connected to it?




Yep that's what I meant. My English is bad because I'm from Leicestershire in the UK. All Leicester folk speak weird. 

So yes basic system setup. 

Tablet up front, ideally windows based so I can use iTunes for my audio and connect to the dsp to change settings. All audio goes via Bluetooth.

Failing that it will be an Android tablet via Bluetooth and separate iPod with a Cambridge audio id100 output via spdif into the helix.

Director up front anyway. And change dsp settings with a separate laptop.


It would be a bonus for the tablet to be connected at all times, have full alac audio via iTunes and a wifi hard-drive all using Bluetooth.


It's an idea anyway.

I'm trying to go lightweight and remove my drz9255 and 4 Genesis amps but gain satnav and usual app features upfront from a tablet. Plus video and much tube video porn.

I'll be getting the helix p six no matter what.


----------



## haakono

Interesting subject, I haven't really though about a windows based tablet - but it would be nice to control the DSP from a "head unit" rather than a dragging along a laptop. I have the p six myself. 

But if you use the director, I think you hook your laptop/tablet etc directly to this for adjusting the DSP software? Instead of the actual amplifier?


----------



## RattyMcClelland

I have sent Audiotec fischer an email to see what they say about usb charging. Im pretty sure it can't charge which isn't an issue.

My main issue was trying to use or ditch my ipod with over 5000 songs of ALAC on it and have an upfront tablet for sat nav and video etc.

Im not an apple fan, everything i have is Android however i have had ipods since day one and my latest ipod is 256bg ssd and used in my other vehicle brilliantly with the Alpine X801D-U


I have just downloaded Poweramp onto my HTC m10 and test its music ability with itunes files on android and im stunned at how easy it is, fast and a better user interface than itunes or ipod.

I should be able to transfer my entire library to a 256gb micro sd card in the tablet or wifi hard drive and use an android 7" tab with aptX bluetooth as a headunit and have full lossless audio with the aptX module for the Helix. Ill have a complete high quality audio in car setup from android with this amazing P six dsp.
Plus full Hondata engine management analasys from the Hondata app.

So no wires at all apart from power and speaker. (should remove my alt whine i have never been able to remove in 7 years of owning the car)


I think ill go down this route.


----------



## subterFUSE

Not charging is a major fail.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## steelwindmachine

What DVC sub are you running?

I'm wondering if I could set this amp to run a pair of Morel coaxes actively and a sub and am not understanding how the sub wiring would work based on what I see in the manual and/or what the Ohm/wattage parameters would be supported.



Twonks said:


> I've had a P Six installed upside down on the rear deck of a VW CC for around 14 months.
> 
> Load wise it was powering the front components actively and the remaining two channels paired through software and ran into a DVC sub.


----------



## falcon

steelwindmachine said:


> What DVC sub are you running?
> 
> I'm wondering if I could set this amp to run a pair of Morel coaxes actively and a sub and am not understanding how the sub wiring would work based on what I see in the manual and/or what the Ohm/wattage parameters would be supported.


I run mine exactly the way you want to with a DVC Hybrid Audio Clarus. Just wire each voice coil as if it was its own independent driver. Then map each voice coil to have L/R 50/50 in the I/O tab in the Helix.


----------



## Twonks

steelwindmachine said:


> What DVC sub are you running?
> 
> I'm wondering if I could set this amp to run a pair of Morel coaxes actively and a sub and am not understanding how the sub wiring would work based on what I see in the manual and/or what the Ohm/wattage parameters would be supported.


Sorry for the late reply.

I use my P-Six with a German Maestro 3 sub 12 in a sealed enclosure of their recomendation.

It is a dual 2 ohm and fed from channels E+F on the Helix. The channels are locked together in the software and each channel is set to 50/50 left and right as mentioned above.

Ultimately I think the P-Six is slightly, dare I say it, weedy for the sub bass. It just doesn't seeem to create the presence that a stand alone sub amp of similar power can.

I've no idea if this is actually true or just me not setting the DSP correctly - but a few owners are reporting the same.


----------



## falcon

Twonks said:


> Sorry for the late reply.
> 
> I use my P-Six with a German Maestro 3 sub 12 in a sealed enclosure of their recomendation.
> 
> It is a dual 2 ohm and fed from channels E+F on the Helix. The channels are locked together in the software and each channel is set to 50/50 left and right as mentioned above.
> 
> Ultimately I think the P-Six is slightly, dare I say it, weedy for the sub bass. It just doesn't seeem to create the presence that a stand alone sub amp of similar power can.
> 
> I've no idea if this is actually true or just me not setting the DSP correctly - but a few owners are reporting the same.


Serious question: what does weedy mean? 

I know that for my set-up I had to boost the sub channel to get the bass I expected. A lot of people advise against this, but my view is that 1) It's a sub channel, so any minor distortion that may be introduced by boost isn't going to be a big deal, and 2) The people that engineered the DSP know a lot more about audio than 99.9% of the people online, and they designed the product to do this safely.


----------



## nineball76

Twonks said:


> Sorry for the late reply.
> 
> I use my P-Six with a German Maestro 3 sub 12 in a sealed enclosure of their recomendation.
> 
> It is a dual 2 ohm and fed from channels E+F on the Helix. The channels are locked together in the software and each channel is set to 50/50 left and right as mentioned above.
> 
> Ultimately I think the P-Six is slightly, dare I say it, weedy for the sub bass. It just doesn't seeem to create the presence that a stand alone sub amp of similar power can.
> 
> I've no idea if this is actually true or just me not setting the DSP correctly - but a few owners are reporting the same.


Could this be a damping issue? AF advertises only >100 as their df, however accurate that can be. 

Sent from my LG-V20 using Tapatalk


----------



## Twonks

falcon said:


> Serious question: what does weedy mean?


Weedy, means a little thin and lacking in substance. No balls might be another expression :laugh:



nineball76 said:


> Could this be a damping issue? AF advertises only >100 as their df, however accurate that can be.


Not sure really but I know they make a big thing about the damping factor being so high on the amp. 

I'm on the verge of buying around say 500 or 600W into 4 ohms for a sub amp and just using the P six as signals into it. Seems a shame and detracts from the otherwise very good one box efficient system, but I like stronger sub bass.


----------



## falcon

Twonks said:


> Weedy, means a little thin and lacking in substance. No balls might be another expression :laugh:
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure really but I know they make a big thing about the damping factor being so high on the amp.
> 
> I'm on the verge of buying around say 500 or 600W into 4 ohms for a sub amp and just using the P six as signals into it. Seems a shame and detracts from the otherwise very good one box efficient system, but I like stronger sub bass.


Thanks for the clarification. Now that I know what weedy means, I had the same exact issue. I would try boosting the entire sub range using the PEQ. This solved my problem. You may still be unhappy, but I am more than happy with what I ended up with.


----------



## Twonks

Yeh I did the same initially and ended up turning it back down as the sub then became over powering and like it was fighting with a cardboard box rather than deep and tunefull bass.

I'll have another play and tune when I get my new source installed - which is likely to be the same as yours in your sig !

Iphone X into HEC USB port on P Six.

I haven't got the phone or USB card yet, although it would be good if you could share your thoughts on the SQ and general usage? I take it you are using the camera kit and factory stereo bluetooth to control the music?

What do you do for volume control on the phone? I have a director and a URC 3 controller and think I'll go with the URC as the director is a pain to fit.


----------



## falcon

Twonks said:


> Yeh I did the same initially and ended up turning it back down as the sub then became over powering and like it was fighting with a cardboard box rather than deep and tunefull bass.
> 
> I'll have another play and tune when I get my new source installed - which is likely to be the same as yours in your sig !
> 
> Iphone X into HEC USB port on P Six.
> 
> I haven't got the phone or USB card yet, although it would be good if you could share your thoughts on the SQ and general usage? I take it you are using the camera kit and factory stereo bluetooth to control the music?
> 
> What do you do for volume control on the phone? I have a director and a URC 3 controller and think I'll go with the URC as the director is a pain to fit.


I have the Director as well. I just turn the volume all the way up on the phone, and then use the Director for volume control. I do have the camera kit which works perfectly well, and charges the phone. My only complaint is the bulky nature of it (the camera kit), which really can't be avoided.

Quick question...the factory BT can control the music app on the phone? If that is what you mean, I didn't even know that, and that would be fantastic.

I have been using Siri or just changing music directly on the device when I am stopped. I was previously using the iPod to Pure i20 to optical. The sound was great, but the iPod wheel was getting finicky so I was worried I wouldn't have a source soon...that's the only reason I changed. It's also somewhat future-proof.

As far as SQ goes, it's to be determined. I honestly haven't played around with it much. But out of the gate it sounds somewhat different to me. I don't know if my mind is playing tricks on me, or if there are some settings in the phone I need to adjust. I've had little time to do side-by-side listening with the iPod (which is still installed), or to do some mic measurements. I'll follow up.

A couple of things to consider:

1) Out of the box the audio crackles. This is an issue with the iOS version the phone ships with. It has been fixed with later versions.

2) If you like magnetic mounts and wireless charging, prepare to be disappointed. I haven't found a place to put the magnet where the phone will stay mounted and/or wirelessly charge.

3) Using the GPS on the phone while playing music is either seamless or annoying depending on your viewpoint - but I think you can change the settings on the app to mute the GPS if you want to.

I am considering using my old iPhone 6s as a dedicated GPS unit, because screwing around with 20 opened apps while driving - even if you are doing it responsibly, i.e. stopped - is a little cumbersome.


----------



## Twonks

Sorry all, this is a bit of a distraction from the P Six direct content, but it is all relavent so hopefully ok with the other members on this post.



falcon said:


> Quick question...the factory BT can control the music app on the phone? If that is what you mean, I didn't even know that, and that would be fantastic.


Yes, although I have not done it yet. The idea is that you connect the phone to the car via BT (at the same time it is conneted to the camera dock) and use the BT audio section on the stereo to move songs etc. Not sure how much control you actually have but on my car (Focus ST3 with Sync 2 and 8" screen) I think I'll be able to change tracks and see album detail.



falcon said:


> I have been using Siri or just changing music directly on the device when I am stopped. I was previously using the iPod to Pure i20 to optical. The sound was great, but the iPod wheel was getting finicky so I was worried I wouldn't have a source soon...that's the only reason I changed. It's also somewhat future-proof.


I have an older ipod and was also thinking of getting the i20 s/hand to use into optical. Stil might have a play at that if I can get one cheap enough.



falcon said:


> A couple of things to consider:
> 
> 1) Out of the box the audio crackles. This is an issue with the iOS version the phone ships with. It has been fixed with later versions.
> 
> 2) If you like magnetic mounts and wireless charging, prepare to be disappointed. I haven't found a place to put the magnet where the phone will stay mounted and/or wirelessly charge.
> 
> 3) Using the GPS on the phone while playing music is either seamless or annoying depending on your viewpoint - but I think you can change the settings on the app to mute the GPS if you want to.
> 
> I am considering using my old iPhone 6s as a dedicated GPS unit, because screwing around with 20 opened apps while driving - even if you are doing it responsibly, i.e. stopped - is a little cumbersome.


1) A bit poor, but hopefully Apple will get it sorted.

2) Not bothered about that. My intention is to leave all the connectors hidden in a centre section of the car and just drop the phone into a modified cup holder. Then use the car stereo and URC/director to control the volume and tracks.

3) The car has Nav as standard so only need phone for music.

I am a bit annoyed with my factory system as a lot of fords can be reprogrammd by forscan to give a flat non eq'd output. My euro spec 2016 car can't be as yet  

The alternative is to rip the lot out and buy a fascia kit and then something like a Kenwood double din with Apple Carplay, and use that into the helix via phonos. 

Nice and easy to use but £££ start adding up and features dropping off, just for some good sounds.


----------



## falcon

Twonks said:


> Sorry all, this is a bit of a distraction from the P Six direct content, but it is all relavent so hopefully ok with the other members on this post.
> 
> 
> Yes, although I have not done it yet. The idea is that you connect the phone to the car via BT (at the same time it is conneted to the camera dock) and use the BT audio section on the stereo to move songs etc. Not sure how much control you actually have but on my car (Focus ST3 with Sync 2 and 8" screen) I think I'll be able to change tracks and see album detail.
> 
> 
> 
> I have an older ipod and was also thinking of getting the i20 s/hand to use into optical. Stil might have a play at that if I can get one cheap enough.
> 
> 
> 
> 1) A bit poor, but hopefully Apple will get it sorted.
> 
> 2) Not bothered about that. My intention is to leave all the connectors hidden in a centre section of the car and just drop the phone into a modified cup holder. Then use the car stereo and URC/director to control the volume and tracks.
> 
> 3) The car has Nav as standard so only need phone for music.
> 
> I am a bit annoyed with my factory system as a lot of fords can be reprogrammd by forscan to give a flat non eq'd output. My euro spec 2016 car can't be as yet
> 
> The alternative is to rip the lot out and buy a fascia kit and then something like a Kenwood double din with Apple Carplay, and use that into the helix via phonos.
> 
> Nice and easy to use but £££ start adding up and features dropping off, just for some good sounds.


I'll have to try the BT and see if this works on my car tonight. And I agree...if Honda would have just made the damn HPF by-passable, I could have connected to speaker-level inputs only and had a totally seamless system, while saving over $1000 in extras.


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## miniSQ

So whats the verdict regarding this piece powering a small subwoofer? I was thinking channels 1-4 being front active, and 5 and 6 running a small D2 ported sub.


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## falcon

miniSQ said:


> So whats the verdict regarding this piece powering a small subwoofer? I was thinking channels 1-4 being front active, and 5 and 6 running a small D2 ported sub.


I'm quite happy with it powering my 10" Hybrid Audio Clarus. And I like bass. I think it's plenty.


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## miniSQ

falcon said:


> I'm quite happy with it powering my 10" Hybrid Audio Clarus. And I like bass. I think it's plenty.


good to hear. I Have run 2 clarus 10's and i am sure a single clarus 10 would be great.


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## Twonks

Going back to the options for input into the P-Six, I now have an Iphone available and am considering the possibilities.

Factory deck into high level isn't staying as the SQ and factory EQ is poor.

I can either-
Stream via aptx from android phone into Psix. Have done this before but got annoyed with the phone dropping the volume every so often to 'protect my hearing' and it occasionally had a partial drop out of the music.

Buy the USB card and apple camera kit etc to get usb audio from Iphone into psix.

Buy aftermarket dash kit to give me double din, and use the wifes old Pioneer app radio 4 with car play for nav and ipod on the other usb for audio. This will come with steering wheel control and be by far the most ergonomic.

I have a Helix director and URC3 so controls are not a problem just don't really like the faff of all the extra controls over a standard easy to use stereo.

Basically, how much better is the USB audio than aptx, and how much better are either of them over an aftermarket deck going into the P six via low level phonos?


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## benny z

i have the usb input card for my p6 and honestly just very rarely use it, as i also have a double din pioneer deck with usb connectivity to my iphone. convenience wins here for me with everything just being controlled by the head unit.

that said, there are times (usually when i'm just sitting in the vehicle listening to music...not driving...) that i will connect up to the usb hec straight into the p six. it's those time when i'll pull up some actual high resolution music on my phone to play...and yes, it's a better sounding source for when i'm wanting to hear the best possible sound.


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## Twonks

Thanks Ben. I am coming round to the fact that I've tried chasing the best SQ I coud get out of the components, and found I was annoyed with having to use the director to control the volume, and also taking the phone in and out of a cradle all the time.

This combined with the fact that it will cost the same for a USB card as it does the factory dash kit and I very rarely (never) just sit in the car and listen to music, means I should probably just go down aftermarket and be done with it.


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## Got-Four-Eights

miniSQ said:


> good to hear. I Have run 2 clarus 10's and i am sure a single clarus 10 would be great.


I believe BennyZ has a buddy with a P Six that is driving a 15" in IB. He also runs a pair of 10's if I recall. 


I have been pretty happy with my P six.. It's not as powerful as my last setup with Zapco LX but to me it sounds just as nice and the volume is enough to be uncomfortable. 

Helix Released the P TWO which looks identical in size compared to the P Six. The two ran together make for a nice 3way with sub. P TWO dishes out 490x2 and it feels about right. Drives my 10's pretty hard. Two pieces that are pretty small drive my whole system.. Pretty damn cool. I run a P Six with a JL XD600 in my other car.. I plan to keep these amps a very long time.


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## Hery

Hello, i have some problem of my psix.
No voice, and then inconnect to my dsp application.
There notif









anybody can help me?


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