# Morel Supremo 3 Way Help



## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

I currently have a set of Morel supremo 6 drivers and Piccolo tweeters and I was considering making this setup a 3 way system by adding either the cdm-88 or the cdm-54. Or am I just better off keeping the supremo set as a 2 way system and not a 3 way. This is going into a 2010 dodge ram crew cab and I am going to install the tweeters and mids in the A-pillars and the driver in the stock door location. As far as head unit im considering the Pioneer DEX-P99RS mainly because its an all in one package where it has crossover control, 30+ EQ bands for left and right and rca outputs for high, mid, low and sub making it a perfect choice for a 3 way set up plus a subwoofer to cover the low end. My other question would be regarding the rear fill, is it recommend or would that just throw off my front stage, i guess if i did install anything in the rear doors it would be something like a set of morel elate 6 drivers to just play the lower frequencies and allow the tweeter up front to cover all the high frequencies. 

Any recommendations on amplifier power for this system? My system would consist of....

Pioneer DEX-P99RS (Source Unit)
Morel Supremo 6 driver (Stock door location)
Morel Supremo Piccolo tweeters (Pillar)
Morel Elate 6 driver (rear door)
Subwoofer.......one or 2 10" subwoofers that will fit under the rear seat of a 2010 dodge ram....undecided on brand.....open for suggestions
Amplifiers.......Open for suggestions




Does anyone hear have a set of either cdm-54 or cdm-88 mids that are either new or in like new condition for sale?

I do currently have 2 JL Audio 300/2v2 amplifiers that are like new but im considering selling them because since im running my system active I would like to keep it to a 2-3 amplifier system and I think that if I were to keep the two JL audio amplifier I would need 4 amplifiers to power everything correctly.

The two JL audio 300/2v2 amplifier are for sale at $275 shipped each.

Thank you very much in advance for any input and/or advise.


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## DAT (Oct 8, 2006)

vfparts said:


> I currently have a set of Morel supremo 6 drivers and Piccolo tweeters and I was considering making this setup a 3 way system by adding either the cdm-88 or the cdm-54. Or am I just better off keeping the supremo set as a 2 way system and not a 3 way. This is going into a 2010 dodge ram crew cab and I am going to install the tweeters and mids in the A-pillars and the driver in the stock door location. As far as head unit im considering the Pioneer DEX-P99RS mainly because its an all in one package where it has crossover control, 30+ EQ bands for left and right and rca outputs for high, mid, low and sub making it a perfect choice for a 3 way set up plus a subwoofer to cover the low end. My other question would be regarding the rear fill, is it recommend or would that just throw off my front stage, i guess if i did install anything in the rear doors it would be something like a set of morel elate 6 drivers to just play the lower frequencies and allow the tweeter up front to cover all the high frequencies.
> 
> Any recommendations on amplifier power for this system? My system would consist of....
> 
> ...




First of all I like lots of power so at least something 100w rms per channel.
Then if you go with a mid and want to use Morel get the CDM54 better sounding than the 88's IMHO but quite a few like the 88's better.

*Erin has some for sale..... CLICK ME*

For subs I would just get 1 or 2 of the SI BM3's.. if you don't have the loot get a cheap 250w rms sub. PG RSD, JL W1 or W3, just something kind shallow.

The JL amps are nice and would work so just get a sub amp if you go JL.

Otherwise get a Zuki amp and try one of them.

PM you if you have any other questions...


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## Shocks (Oct 1, 2008)

I've also been thinking about adding a mid to my Supremos set. A couple of Morel dealers have actually told me I would gain very little by adding a mid but I don't know I would like to hear a Supremo 3 way but we all know it's not that easy. I would search here first I believe a few members have done it. As far as rear fill goes I would say it's a matter of preference a little rear fill done right Isn't going to kill anybody but It's a truck and I would hold off on the rear fill and invest in some good amps first....TRU, Zapco, Arc Audio to name a few and only then would I consider the rears.


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## TPMS (Jan 26, 2009)

vfparts said:


> I currently have a set of Morel supremo 6 drivers and Piccolo tweeters and I was considering making this setup a 3 way system by adding either the cdm-88 or the cdm-54. Or am I just better off keeping the supremo set as a 2 way system and not a 3 way. This is going into a 2010 dodge ram crew cab and I am going to install the tweeters and mids in the A-pillars and the driver in the stock door location. As far as head unit im considering the Pioneer DEX-P99RS mainly because its an all in one package where it has crossover control, 30+ EQ bands for left and right and rca outputs for high, mid, low and sub making it a perfect choice for a 3 way set up plus a subwoofer to cover the low end. My other question would be regarding the rear fill, is it recommend or would that just throw off my front stage, i guess if i did install anything in the rear doors it would be something like a set of morel elate 6 drivers to just play the lower frequencies and allow the tweeter up front to cover all the high frequencies.
> ....
> QUOTE]
> 
> ...


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

Do you guys think the JL Audio HD600/4 is a good choice if I decide to stick with a 2 way setup rather than a 3 way. The tweeters installed either on the A-pillars or the trim peice where the side mirrors are and that would be 150 rms to the drivers and 150 rms to the piccolo tweeters and have a good SQ? As i mentioned before I currently have two jl audio 300/2v2 and I like the fact that they are class A/B but due to space limitations I was considering the HD600/4 for my front stage and the HD750/1 for a 10" subwoofer like the Ultimo 10. Anty thoughts on that? Otherwise I could keep my two 300/2v2 for my front stage then get wither a 1000/1v2 or a 500/1v2 whichever is more recommended for an ultimo 10 subwoofer.


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## kidlat (Aug 27, 2009)

I currently have a morel supremo 6, cdm 54, picolo tweets, ultimo 8 in a 4 way active configuration using a pioneer p90 combo. It made a diff coming from a 2 way front stage. I'd say go for it!


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

Decided on the Hydrid audio Legatia L4 as my midrange because I have heard nothing but good things about it and it has a much better frequency range than the cdm-54 and cdm-88. What do you guys think of the morel supremo 6 playing 50hz to 250hz, the legatia L4 playing 250hz-8000hz and the Morel piccolo playing 8000hz-20,000hz. Im planning on powering the piccolo and the L4 with around 100 watts rms and the supremo 6 with around 150 rms. Any thoughts with that?


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## Bluenote (Aug 29, 2008)

I am doing something similar, using JL HD 600/4 bridged on Elate LE Mids and another 600/4 -150x4 on Piccolo and CDM 88. Have'nt heard it yet, but should know something in about a week or so. I hear that the HD's have good SQ performance for the size. Later on I might switch out the LE mids for Supremo but we'll see.


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## TPMS (Jan 26, 2009)

vfparts said:


> Decided on the Hydrid audio Legatia L4 as my midrange because I have heard nothing but good things about it and it has a much better frequency range than the cdm-54 and cdm-88. What do you guys think of the morel supremo 6 playing 50hz to 250hz, the legatia L4 playing 250hz-8000hz and the* Morel piccolo playing 8000hz-20,000hz*. Im planning on powering the piccolo and the L4 with around 100 watts rms and the supremo 6 with around 150 rms. Any thoughts with that?



sorry, but hipassing at 8000 you are really under-employing your Piccolo :worried:
I am not an expert but if you just look which points Morel itself set at its passive xovers (for Elate and Supremo) you see that's 1800Hz in case of a 2-way and 700-3800Hz for 3-way.
I have it at 3500 with a custom passive.
the same waste if you don't push the Supremo 6 till at least 4-500. 
can tell you that I had it before at 200-250Hz because that was the maximum setting in my amp (genesis extreme dmx) but I realized I was loosing too much of its dynamics and decided to mod internal filters ..
now i can play till 950 

Power.. yes, that should just suffice.


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## rommelrommel (Apr 11, 2007)

Yeah, the idea of the supremo/piccolo tweeter was to play low. Adding a midrange isn't a bad idea or anything but if you're going to use a wideband midrange that tweeter will be quite under utilized.


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## TPMS (Jan 26, 2009)

rommelrommel said:


> Yeah, the idea of the supremo/piccolo tweeter was to play low. Adding a midrange isn't a bad idea or anything but if you're going to use a wideband midrange that tweeter will be quite under utilized.



I would better shrink the working area of the wideband, because "widebands" are not truly so wide, especially if you like loud ...


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## jimmys91 (Nov 28, 2009)

What is your goal from doing this, I would say you get get more return on your investment by putting more money on the install. Those tweets and mids will play far higher and lower than you need them to play 2 way much less 3 way. If your just wanting to go 3 way sell your supremo/pic's and buy elate 3 way set. There is a reason Morel does not sell a supremo 3 way set. JMO.


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## TPMS (Jan 26, 2009)

or, save some more and stick with elate 2 way set ...


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## Hernan (Jul 9, 2006)

With those nice drivers, do you though on moving de woofers to the kicks more on axis?

A pillar mid installs are not so good. A good 4 at the kicks has much more sense.

3 ways are more about even dispersion than a finer midrange. And yes, well executed they images a lot better and are easier to eq right. Direct and reflected sound are much more similar than a 2 way.


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

ok so it sounds like im better off keeping them a 2 way, if i do that how many watts rms should i run to the driver and to the tweeter. I was thinking of 150 to the drivers and 75 to the piccolo?


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## DAT (Oct 8, 2006)

vfparts said:


> ok so it sounds like im better off keeping them a 2 way, if i do that how many watts rms should i run to the driver and to the tweeter. I was thinking of 150 to the drivers and 75 to the piccolo?


Personally I like the Supremo & Piccolo Setup as a 2 way way better than I did the HAT 2way, Hertz Mille also.

so just go 2 way and dump atleast 150w rms into the Supremo and 75w rms or more into the Piccolo and call it a day.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

Um, a JL W3 is anything but shallow.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

I think if you had the budget, the JL HD amps are VERY nice...much nicer than the Slash series amps.


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## jimmys91 (Nov 28, 2009)

I really hate to open this can of worms but what the hell. You say the HD are nicer than the Slash. The slash amps came from the same guy/design as the Xtant and PPI Arts which are considered by many to be some of the best SQ amps ever made.


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

I decided to stick with a 2 way system up front. Is 150 rms too much for the piccolo tweeters, the only reason I ask is because I already have 2 of the jl audio 300/2v2 amplifiers that I can use one of them to power the drivers at 150rms each then I can use the other one to power the piccolo tweeters at 150 rms each and adjust the gains accordingly or should I sell the second 300/2v2 and get a 300/4v2 to get 75rms to each piccolo then have another two channels available for the rear fill at 75rms. If i stick with the 2 300/2v2 amplifiers I will power the rear fill off the head unit. As far as bass is concerned im going with one 500/1v2 to keep the amps looking the same. Any thoughts?


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## jimmys91 (Nov 28, 2009)

I would put 150 to them with out worries if you keep gains turn down. I ran 150 to my HAT L1's and they took the power no problem.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

So did the HDs. I've owned both...was not that impressed with the Slash series. The HDs are a set up from the Slash series.



jimmys91 said:


> I really hate to open this can of worms but what the hell. You say the HD are nicer than the Slash. The slash amps came from the same guy/design as the Xtant and PPI Arts which are considered by many to be some of the best SQ amps ever made.


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

Would you guys recommend running the supremo 6 and piccolo tweeter fully active, bi amp with the morel supremo crossover or just single input witht he supremo 2 way crossover? Im pretty much set on keeping this a 2 way system to use the system to its fullest potential as far as frequency responce goes. ive been told the tweeter will play down to 1.9Khz without a problem and the same goes for the driver. Does that sound about right?


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

I was going to go with a 3 way setup with these supremo speakers but since I decided to stick to a 2 way setup is anyone here interested in a pair of hybrid audio L4 midrange speakers, they are in like new condition, one of them is actually brand new and never used the other one was only tested for maybe a couple of hours before i decided not to modify my kick pannels and stay with the 2 way rather than adding this L4 to make a 3 way. Asking for $300, anyone interested please send me a pm. Thank you.


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## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

using an elate for the rear ist just plain waste of money.. but i mean if you can afford it by all means but you can look into the tempos which im using in the rear to go with a morel 3way upfront and it does the job pretty good


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

That actually sounds like a good idea, they are rear fill anyway so I'm primarily concerned with the front stage speakers and amplifier. Still haven't decided on which amplifier to use. So far I have decided on running the piccolo tweeter and the supremo 6 up front, (Ive heard a lot of good things about running the supremo crossover bi amped rather than running fully active so that might be something to consider) maybe the tempo coax 6" as rear fill then an ultimo 10" sub woofer or a JL audio 10w3v3, I'm not sure if the specs on those sub woofers are similar or not but I'm not looking for earth shattering bass, I want something that will compliment the supremos nicely. Any advise on that?


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## NSTar (Feb 24, 2010)

kidlat said:


> I currently have a morel supremo 6, cdm 54, picolo tweets, ultimo 8 in a 4 way active configuration using a pioneer p90 combo. It made a diff coming from a 2 way front stage. I'd say go for it!


4 way active? what did you use?


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## asawendo (Nov 22, 2009)

vidizzle said:


> using an elate for the rear ist just plain waste of money.. but i mean if you can afford it by all means but you can look into the tempos which im using in the rear to go with a morel 3way upfront and it does the job pretty good


Agree with that, don't use elate for rear. Save some cash for Morel Coaxial or Morel Tempo.

Best Regards

Wendo


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

Would it be a better idea to use a full range morel coax in the rear of some other type of midbass/midrange driver, I was just wondering since the stock speaker is so low in the door panel i dont think ill be hearing it very much.


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## appleyard (Apr 29, 2009)

Not to jack your thread but I just bought the supremo mids and tweeter (not picollo). The specs on the tweeter is [email protected] and mids is [email protected] Im not sure where to look for power for the tweeter. 

Would you share your xover points for the mids and tweeter? IIRC the fs is like 680hz on the tweeter.


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

Ok after roughly half a year of a dry spell Im starting my project back up again. Decided on going with a 3 way consisting of the piccolo tweeters, cdm88 midrange, sw6 drivers and a single 10" ultimo subwoofer. I havnt decided on the amplifiers or processor but im considering the following crossover points and rms power

piccolo tweeters ..........1.5khz and up with 75 - 150rms
cdm88 midrange ..........500hz -1.5khz with 75 - 150rms
supremo sw6 drivers .....60hz - 500hz with 150-200 rms
ultimo 10 subwoofer.......60hz and below with 1000-1200 rms

What do guys think about the projected crossover points and power levels.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

For the Midrange, i would choose a driver that cover at least the 300 - 3000hz range. If it don't, I wouldn't bother doing a 3 way front active.
If the cdm88 can handle 300hz @ 24db HP than I would set the following:
Piccolo tweeters = 3.25k @ 24db/HP
cdm88 midrange = 300hz 24db/HP and 3.25k 24db/LP
Sumpremo SW6 = 60hz 24db/HP and 250 24db/LP
Ultimo 10" = 50hz 18db/LP

Please use my crossover/slope as an example. You have to spend lots of time to find the right combination for yourself.



vfparts said:


> Ok after roughly half a year of a dry spell Im starting my project back up again. Decided on going with a 3 way consisting of the piccolo tweeters, cdm88 midrange, sw6 drivers and a single 10" ultimo subwoofer. I havnt decided on the amplifiers or processor but im considering the following crossover points and rms power
> 
> piccolo tweeters ..........1.5khz and up with 75 - 150rms
> cdm88 midrange ..........500hz -1.5khz with 75 - 150rms
> ...


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## dman (Dec 21, 2008)

If your running all Morel, i would definately go 3 way... But i would scrap the Supremo series, and go with the following.. I deal with Morel on a daily basis, so im not just throwing this out there.

Elate 3 way set. I would install in kick panels, build or buy some, with cdm-88's in the doors
Tempo for rear fill (dont waste money on elates for rear)
Ultimo sc subs (if doing 2)(unless you have the power for Ultimo's, min. of 800rms per sub)

thats my .02 worth


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

In regards to the cdm at 300hz, according to morels specs the frequency response is 450-7khz so im not if 300 would work. In regards to rear fill, im not plannin on using any, just the front 3 way system. For the subwoofer i definately want the ultimo 10 so ill have to just give it the 800+watts it wants to sound right.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

If it can do 450hz @ 12db, than it can do 300hz @ 24db.
That's the beauty of running active, you can play with numerous crossover/slope combination to find the combination that sound best.
Did you already purchase the speakers, or are you still looking?
IMO, midrange is probably the most important driver when running 3 way active.
I would choose that carefully.



vfparts said:


> In regards to the cdm at 300hz, according to morels specs the frequency response is 450-7khz so im not if 300 would work. In regards to rear fill, im not plannin on using any, just the front 3 way system. For the subwoofer i definately want the ultimo 10 so ill have to just give it the 800+watts it wants to sound right.


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

I was thinking about what amps i could run and i know i would need a four ch to drive the cdm88 and piccolo tweeters then a 2 or 4 ch amp to drive the sw6 drivers and a monoblock for the ultimo but i was trying to see if i could simplify things with 2 amps rather than 3 so i was considering the audison lrx6.9 im just not sure if 75 watts is enough for the sw6. im assuming it should work for the tweeters and midrage but im just worried that it might be underpowering the sw6. Then id do the audison lrx.1.1k for the sub. I hope i got the model numbers right. please let me know your thoughts.


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

yes, i already have the speakers. im looking for the right amplifiers and processor.


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## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

at 300hz i wont push them too hard..

and 1 thing about morel they like power so make sure u put some power on them..
im using a zed audio leviathan for mids and highs and a kenwood excelon bridged on my sw6 and zed kronos for bass.. eventually ill swap the excelon for another zed though

as for processing u got tons of options.. just depends on what ur looking for.. h701, or bitone seems to be the most popular options right now..

but both are coming out with new updated versions


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## dman (Dec 21, 2008)

LOL, just realized this thread was started 7 months ago.. And you still dont have your issue solved, LOL


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

I know its been 7 months, due to home purchase, new born baby i had to sell my previous supremo system but now that enough time has gone by im able to treat myself with my car audio again. priorities change all the time.


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## dman (Dec 21, 2008)

vfparts said:


> I know its been 7 months, due to home purchase, new born baby i had to sell my previous supremo system but now that enough time has gone by im able to treat myself with my car audio again. priorities change all the time.


so you sold your old ones, and purchased new ones... in that turn around time... I think its a waste of boards time, if you are just procrastinating on things.. Most people here like to help, but not when people blow hot air. At your rate, your looking at hopefully mid 2012....


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

Id like to take this time to thank the few good people that were very informative and helpfull. It appears some users here believe im just blowing smoke out of my *** so i dont want to WASTE everyones time. Ill just figure it out myself and take the posetive information you guys were so kind to provide . Have a great day.


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## Bluenote (Aug 29, 2008)

vidizzle said:


> *at 300hz i wont push them too hard*..
> 
> and 1 thing about morel they like power so make sure u put some power on them..
> im using a zed audio leviathan for mids and highs and a kenwood excelon bridged on my sw6 and zed kronos for bass.. eventually ill swap the excelon for another zed though
> ...


vdizzle, regarding the underlined point above...Would 150watts be considered "pushing too hard?" Is there a risk of blowing them? or just bad SQ? I ask because I am running the same set-up Piccolo/CDM88 but would like to 'safely' try a 300ish xover setting w/o collateral damage. 

Thanks!


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## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

http://www.morelhifi.com/support/pdf/mobile/CDM88.pdf

look at the graph.. there is a significant drop off and thats one reason
if ur playing at lower and moderate volume i think you would be fine.. but 300ish hz usually have slight movement on a cone and the domes lack a suspension .. similar to what would happen if you play a dome tweeter too low

plus if your mounting them in the kicks you wouldnt need to cross so low as they are already close to ur midbass woofer and it might not matter much at that point..

when i competed last year i ran them in the at 400 with a 24db slope but my volume never exceeded more than 90 dbs or so..

plus thats a bit low below the frequecy range of the drivers.. and im flat out jus scared ****less to play them that low in fear of blowing them as they are not exactly cheap drivers..but hey if you want to be the guinea pig let me know 

and reason i said morel like power is that i was using dls amplifiers before and i was happy with the sq but it just lack that little extra umpff i wanted which i got with the power im putting on them now

but hey this is just my experience and my thoughts.. if im off id gladly stand corrected 

and vfparts its all good man.. we're all here to learn an i dont mind helping out anway i can


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## Bluenote (Aug 29, 2008)

vidizzle said:


> http://www.morelhifi.com/support/pdf/mobile/CDM88.pdf
> 
> look at the graph.. there is a significant drop off and thats one reason
> if ur playing at lower and moderate volume i think you would be fine.. but 300ish hz usually have slight movement on a cone and the domes lack a suspension .. similar to what would happen if you play a dome tweeter too low
> ...


Yep! thanks for the info on that, I've been playing mine at 450-500 but always wondered if they can play lower. This is good information - I still might try it out at like 315/24db and see how it feels - but prolly not for too long.


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## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

well i got bored and couldnt sleep so i sat in the car.. dropped my xover to 315 at 24db and it was way tooooooooo thin and airy for my liking so i bumped it back up to 560 at 18db and i was much more satisfied and everything sounded a bit more full.. you get a slight bit better imaging due to it being lower but that can be compensated with some ta on the midbass woofers.. but it wasnt anything that drastic to warrant dropping it that low in the kicks.

note that mine are located in the kicks off axis firing across at each other..


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## vfparts (Jul 11, 2010)

just thought id let everyone know what i decided on going with this setup. two audison lrx 4.1k amplifiers. one of them running the piccolos with 130rms and the cdm88 with 140rms the second one will power the sw6 with 130 rms and the ultimo bridged at 800 rms. Based on the replies i got here that should work just fine. as far as processor ill most likely go with the bit one. Thanks everyone for your input.


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## Bluenote (Aug 29, 2008)

vidizzle said:


> well i got bored and couldnt sleep so i sat in the car.. dropped my xover to 315 at 24db and it was way tooooooooo thin and airy for my liking so i bumped it back up to 560 at 18db and i was much more satisfied and everything sounded a bit more full.. you get a slight bit better imaging due to it being lower but that can be compensated with some ta on the midbass woofers.. but it wasnt anything that drastic to warrant dropping it that low in the kicks.
> 
> note that mine are located in the kicks off axis firing across at each other..


vdizzle, dizzle thanks for sharing that ([email protected] lol) Im glad you at least tried it to see whats what. When I get my CDM88's returned from Morel...Sometime...this...year...I will see how they do in my a-pillar set-up.


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## Bluenote (Aug 29, 2008)

vfparts said:


> just thought id let everyone know what i decided on going with this setup. two audison lrx 4.1k amplifiers. one of them running the piccolos with 130rms and the cdm88 with 140rms the second one will power the sw6 with 130 rms and the ultimo bridged at 800 rms. Based on the replies i got here that should work just fine. as far as processor ill most likely go with the bit one. Thanks everyone for your input.


Hey vfparts, just thought I'd share...I think your on-pointe with the Mids/Tweets power wise...But for the Mids I would try a lrx 2.9 = [email protected] I only suggest because I am running JL HD600 to Supremo [email protected] and 150x4 to Piccolo/CDM88...they can handle the power with no sweat ( with proper gain adjustments ) just a suggestion...


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## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

im running 300 to each elate midbass.. so also a suggestion 
you may really want that headroom and like that headroom given to the midbass

and the bitone seems like a great choice but i read somewhere they are going to release a newer version?? correct me if im wrong...


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## NineInchNail (Nov 22, 2011)

Had to revive this topic. I have the same set of speakers. Morel SW6, Supremo and CDM-54(CDM are still not installed). I'm beginning to wonder if 100Wx2 for Supremo SW6 is not enough. Maybe I should bridge my T600-4 to achieve some higher power and use Helix Precision B4 for tweets and CDM-54? My preference is still SQ over SPL but I love a clean, powerful punch.


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## vidizzle (May 30, 2008)

give em more power an i think you may be happier with the results


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