# Audiofrog GS25 coming this summer!



## mpednault (Mar 23, 2012)

Just saw a post on the AF Facebook group of a prototype GS25 that read:

“A little tease from the Importel show in Toronto Canada. Prototype GS25 midrange. Tabs for Toyota Camry and pickups, GM Bose applications and 3.5-inch Mercedes applications. Available in July.“

Hopefully Andy gets these out this summer! I was literally up at 4am this morning trying to figure out how to get the GS40’s on the dash of my 2016 Tundra. I can’t afford the GB25’s. I had been eyeing the Morel CCWR254, but they don’t come with grilles and I don’t want to install them in the factory locations due to them pointing directly at the windshield. I’ve got the GS10 and GS690’s in my cart at Crutchfield. Can’t wait for this to be released!

Thoughts? More insight on this driver?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

mpednault said:


> I don’t want to install them in the factory locations


Well, this is *exactly* what the gs25 is designed for. I'm not sure what kind of hardware they will come with but I'm sure those mounting options you see in the photo are going to be part of it.

Side note, nothing wrong with firing off the windshield 95% of the time


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## soundstreamer (Jun 2, 2015)

Very interesting. I'm currently working on building my sail panels to fit the Morel CCWR254's. Wonder if the new AF's will come with grills because that is the one thing I don't like about the Morels.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

I think this will be a success just like the rest of Andy's products. I'm guessing those tabs are made to be broken off by the original owner?


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

soundstreamer said:


> Very interesting. I'm currently working on building my sail panels to fit the Morel CCWR254's. Wonder if the new AF's will come with grills because that is the one thing I don't like about the Morels.


If they are designed for factory replacements as told by Skizer, then I highly doubt it since every location listed in application description has stock grilles. 

Skizer also noted that they're widebands. Still curious to see how they will differ spec-wise from other widebands. In my 05 Tacoma, the space for these are in the upper doors. Not the same as firing off the windshield, but the GB25 is too deep to fit there as well. If the GS25 is at least more efficient with a better power handling & response than most widebands available, I might give them a try even perhaps with the matching 6x9. 

Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


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## WilliamS (Oct 1, 2016)

Well shoot, now I gotta wait to see how they spec out. Might be the solution to my rams dashboard I was looking for.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Bayboy said:


> If they are designed for factory replacements as told by Skizer, then I highly doubt it since every location listed in application description has stock grilles.
> 
> Skizer also noted that they're widebands. Still curious to see how they will differ spec-wise from other widebands. In my 05 Tacoma, the space for these are in the upper doors. Not the same as firing off the windshield, but the GB25 is too deep to fit there as well. If the GS25 is at least more efficient with a better power handling & response than most widebands available, I might give them a try even perhaps with the matching 6x9.
> 
> Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


from what i understand, the motor is the same as the gb25. They might be the same depth.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Hillbilly SQ said:


> I think this will be a success just like the rest of Andy's products. I'm guessing those tabs are made to be broken off by the original owner?


Yes. You break off what you dont use. There are tabs for Toyota, GM, and Mercedes. 

I'm sure they will come with a grill. Every other product he offers does.


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

I see the labeled tabs "t/mb" and GM. But what it J


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

ToNasty said:


> I see the labeled tabs "t/mb" and GM. But what it J


Jeep?

I have found it to be uncanny how well AF drivers fit in a Grand Cherokee...


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

DavidRam said:


> Jeep?
> 
> 
> 
> I have found it to be uncanny how well AF drivers fit in a Grand Cherokee...


Hmm Chrysler. So maybe these would fit in the dash of a Chrysler 300 then. Which would make my next install nice and easy

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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

ToNasty said:


> I see the labeled tabs "t/mb" and GM. But what it J


I only see T. No J. Then again, only one of my eyes works


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

SkizeR said:


> I only see T. No J. Then again, only one of my eyes works


Hope your pecker works better than your eyes









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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

yeah, looks like a T to me.. Andy never mentioned Chrysler or Jeep.


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

SkizeR said:


> from what i understand, the motor is the same as the gb25. They might be the same depth.


That would be bittersweet. 

Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

SkizeR said:


> yeah, looks like a T to me.. Andy never mentioned Chrysler or Jeep.


Looks like an upside-down T to me too.


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

Damn im the blind one. If i turn my phone 180 degrees. It turns into a T. Im an idiot

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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

ToNasty said:


> Damn im the blind one. If i turn my phone 180 degrees. It turns into a T. Im an idiot
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Hope your pecker works better than your eyes:laugh:


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## krisl19 (Jan 26, 2009)

Anyone know why Andy doesn't post here?


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

krisl19 said:


> Anyone know why Andy doesn't post here?


He has in the past but I recon he is just too damn busy now.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

krisl19 said:


> Anyone know why Andy doesn't post here?


because of the ****ery. seriously.


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## mrichard89 (Sep 29, 2016)

Andy should do a pre-order on these. I was thinking of picking up a set of AP NZ3's for the factory locations in my 4Runner, but these would be perfect.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

mrichard89 said:


> Andy should do a pre-order on these. I was thinking of picking up a set of AP NZ3's for the factory locations in my 4Runner, but these would be perfect.


you guys have a wrong idea about andys target market. He has no interest in doing business here. Thats why he even has a diyma appointed dealer.


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

Also there are more people on facebook than here. So it seems him doing a lot on facebook is just easier

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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

ToNasty said:


> Also there are more people on facebook than here. So it seems him doing a lot on facebook is just easier
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


hes not a fan of facebook either lol


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## Chris12 (Sep 20, 2018)

SkizeR said:


> you guys have a wrong idea about andys target market. He has no interest in doing business here. Thats why he even has a diyma appointed dealer.


So what IS his target market?

(Seriously wondering. Not being a smart ass.)


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Chris12 said:


> So what IS his target market?
> 
> (Seriously wondering. Not being a smart ass.)


Dealers. Good dealers. Not just any dealers that will sell product. At the end of the day, a company cannot have reliable customer service if they are dealing with tons of people asking questions all day. He is trying to build a good brand through the use of good reps and good dealers who can take care of the end use so he, one man, doesnt have to be the guy to help or answer a simple question to 100+ people a day so he can focus on making good products, and supporting his dealers who can support the end user. Thats how a proper car audio brand is supposed to work.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

If this speaker has the same motor and possibly the same cone as the gb25 is it going to have the same 4mm of linear excursion? Is the "lower end" gs25 going to meet a more budget friendly price point by not having all the extra install stuff the gb25 comes with? To be honest it looks like the gs25 will be kind of a pain for non-oem type installs.


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

Hillbilly SQ said:


> If this speaker has the same motor and possibly the same cone as the gb25 is it going to have the same 4mm of linear excursion? Is the "lower end" gs25 going to meet a more budget friendly price point by not having all the extra install stuff the gb25 comes with? To be honest it looks like the gs25 will be kind of a pain for non-oem type installs.


But that's what it is designed for, stock replacements, thus the break off tabs. For custom installs the GB25 should be chosen; it makes good sense to me at least since a custom install will probably be geared towards better performance capabilities.

I would guess, or hope at least that being in the GS series, the price will be under the GS40. Maybe $120-150 at best would be cool since the GS40 is $180 at Crutchfield. Easy mounting and hopefully better performance than your average home audio wideband that can fit in the same space since it's designed with car audio in mind; I think these could be a winner for lower budgets. If they can hold their own down to 400-500hz with 2-3mm xmax, that's still par for the course.

Im just hoping the mounting depth isn't as deep as the GB25. If they can fit my truck, I might be willing to sacrifice trying an unused pair of ZR800CW for the matching GS 6x9 & GS25. 

Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Hillbilly SQ said:


> If this speaker has the same motor and possibly the same cone as the gb25 is it going to have the same 4mm of linear excursion? Is the "lower end" gs25 going to meet a more budget friendly price point by not having all the extra install stuff the gb25 comes with? To be honest it looks like the gs25 will be kind of a pain for non-oem type installs.


Its not the same cone or coil from what I understand 

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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

I doubt it would be the same cone and exact same motor or that would undercut some sales from the GB25 as soon as word got out that is was the same driver sans installation accessories


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

V8toilet said:


> I doubt it would be the same cone and exact same motor or that would undercut some sales from the GB25 as soon as word got out that is was the same driver sans installation accessories


I forget the convo i had with Andy a while back on these, but im willing to bet since the motor is the same and his goal for this is an OEM wideband replacement, the cone/dustcap will be a bit different to reduce the breakup thats at 16k on the gb25, and the coil wont be as big to reduce moving mass and will result in less power handling and inductance. Just my guess, by no way is this from the horses mouth


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## WilliamS (Oct 1, 2016)

I just want it to fit in the stock dash location of a Ram!


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## 50TYSON (Mar 7, 2011)

Widebands? Yes!! Hopefully they can get loud like the GBs.


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## GreatLaBroski (Jan 20, 2018)

50TYSON said:


> Widebands? Yes!! Hopefully they can get loud like the GBs.


Typically with widebands you end up sacrificing sensitivity, but I’m sure that it’ll be good for it’s size. Don’t expect GB25 sensitivity though.


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## Truthunter (Jun 15, 2015)

With those custom mounting tabs - I can see this thing selling like hotcakes.


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

GreatLaBroski said:


> Typically with widebands you end up sacrificing sensitivity, but I’m sure that it’ll be good for it’s size. Don’t expect GB25 sensitivity though.


At least be better than your average wideband in power handling and efficiency. Widebands usually have a rising upper response so that's a given. Being an OEM solution, not so sure that it really needs to be better in power and efficiency though the GS insignia suggests that it would be. Assumptions aside, probably just best to wait to see when it comes out. 

Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

GreatLaBroski said:


> Typically with widebands you end up sacrificing sensitivity, but I’m sure that it’ll be good for it’s size. Don’t expect GB25 sensitivity though.


Actually, he told me he sacrificed frequency response to have a higher sensitivity. So, it might

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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

SkizeR said:


> Actually, he told me he sacrificed frequency response to have a higher sensitivity. So, it might
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk




Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

And knowing what these are designed for (wideband firing off the windshield), that frequency response should be an easy fix. Good trade off for the situation if you ask me

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## mrichard89 (Sep 29, 2016)

My local Audiofrog dealer just quit carrying the brand, but I'll definitely be picking up a set of these from Crutchfield once they're available.


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## GreatLaBroski (Jan 20, 2018)

SkizeR said:


> Actually, he told me he sacrificed frequency response to have a higher sensitivity. So, it might
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


:surprised:

These are sounding like winners.


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## krisl19 (Jan 26, 2009)

mrichard89 said:


> My local Audiofrog dealer just quit carrying the brand


Did he say why? Seems like a very hot brand, relatively speaking.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

krisl19 said:


> Did he say why? Seems like a very hot brand, relatively speaking.


Most drop brands because of politics, not the product itself

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## mpednault (Mar 23, 2012)

Well ****, if these fit in the factory dash locations in my Tundra and sound better than my RS100-4’s, I’ll definitely pick up a pair! Isn’t there a AF dealer here on DIYMA?


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## .69077 (Aug 24, 2013)

mpednault said:


> Well ****, if these fit in the factory dash locations in my Tundra and sound better than my RS100-4’s, I’ll definitely pick up a pair! Isn’t there a AF dealer here on DIYMA?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I had GB25s in my dash. I had to top mount them using the factory dash grilles. They sounded amazing with the GB10s in the sail panels though.


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## mrichard89 (Sep 29, 2016)

How can we get our hands on a set of these?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

mrichard89 said:


> How can we get our hands on a set of these?


By going to a dealer and ordering them. They have been available for a bit now

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## mrichard89 (Sep 29, 2016)

My local dealer in St. Louis no longer carries Audiofrog, so I was hoping they'd be available online from crutchfield, or somewhere else. Thanks.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

Looks great!  I'm sure it will be one of the absolute best factory replacement speakers available in this size. Kudos to Andy once again and a big :thumbsup: 

I'd still really like to see Andy release a narrow-flange 3.5" GB- & GS-series midrange. i.e. look at the 4 small mounting holes placed in the surround/basket flange of the GS25 (not the protruding mounting tabs). 

I realize that the GB25/GS25 offers just about all the performance you'd typically need from OEM 3.5" mounting locations, but I'd really like that additional bit of cone area and slightly lower FS of a 3.5" cone driver.

If you've held them side-by-side, there's currently quite a large gap in physical size when going from the GB25 to the GB40! The GB40 seems like more than 4x the size of the GB25. So IMO a "GB35" that leans towards the form factor/design of the GB25 would be awesome.

And there are lots of vehicles with OEM 3.5" locations, but there's not a lot of higher-quality options for those mounting locations...mostly just lower- to mid-level coaxials by the likes of Kicker, Kenwood, and Pioneer, etc.  I've used the really inexpensive, but great-sounding entry-level Pioneer TS-A878 A LOT. But I'd really like something higher-quality from Audiofrog to step up to.

The Illusion C3/C3CX is an option, but hard to come by IME and really expensive. And haven't they been discontinued?

The Scan 10F will _sometimes_ work in these locations with a bit of modification to the mounting hole and is awesome especially for the price, but it's just a bit too big to fit most of the time. 

Anyway...just thinking out loud again. 

P.S. Also looking forward to the release of the small Audiofrog amps.  Any teasers on FB for those?


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## Nik_Ind (May 24, 2017)

Does anyone know the price for the GS25 yet? And, do you reckon they'll be available online as well?

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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Nik_Ind said:


> Does anyone know the price for the GS25 yet? And, do you reckon they'll be available online as well?
> 
> Sent from my BBF100-6 using Tapatalk


200

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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

bbfoto said:


> Looks great!  I'm sure it will be one of the absolute best factory replacement speakers available in this size. Kudos to Andy once again and a big
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Have you ever considered or tried the TC9? Not sure if it will fit the dimensions you require or would like to see, but it is quite small in person. The response is far above the price range as well as others above it. A really very good driver albeit 8 ohm... really not an issue though. 

Man & Machine... Power Extreme!


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

Bayboy said:


> Have you ever considered or tried the TC9? Not sure if it will fit the dimensions you require or would like to see, but it is quite small in person. The response is far above the price range as well as others above it. A really very good driver albeit 8 ohm... really not an issue though.



Yeah, the TC9 is a great budget driver. But the square-ish mounting flange & steel backplate in the motor can be an issue in a lot of 3.5" OEM locations. And it can't handle much power before it reaches its limits.

Something 3.5" with a very minimal mounting flange and a compact Neo motor would be ideal...basically a slightly upscaled GB25, or maybe a slightly down-scaled Morel CAW-428...

https://www.parts-express.com/morel-caw-428-4-classic-woofer--297-080


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

andy himself states that there is pretty much zero output difference between the gb25 and gb40 (specs even show you this), and the gb25 has 4mm xmax. why would he bother spending the money on tooling for a speaker thats a half an inch smaller than the gb40? Just use the GB25 or the GB40.

also, the c3cx is not discontinued.


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## subiemax (Nov 19, 2007)

Do these play as low as the GB25?


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## 50TYSON (Mar 7, 2011)

Specifications:

65mm / 2.5" full range speaker
Impedance: 4 ohms
RMS load capacity : 100W (12dB / Oct 3500Hz)
Frequency response: 200hz - 20kHz
SPL: 89dB
Neodymium magnet system
25mm voice coil
Universal installation basket
Solid connection terminal
Outer diameter: 76mm
Installation depth: 38mm
Installation diameter: 64mm


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## mpednault (Mar 23, 2012)

Decision time!

I'm looking to replace the Dayton RS100-4's on the dash of my 2016 Tundra.

Which speaker would you select for a 350Hz - 5kHz range powered by a Zapco ST-4X SQ ([email protected] RMS):

AF GS25 - $180
Morel CCWR254 - $160
Infinity 300m - $143


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

mpednault said:


> Decision time!
> 
> I'm looking to replace the Dayton RS100-4's on the dash of my 2016 Tundra.
> 
> ...


In terms of output, the Infinity will be louder than the AF and Morel based on cone area and sensitivity. However, the FR graphs I have seen would make me lean away from the Infinity if the Morel or AF are loud enough for you. The Morel's FR graph looks much nicer than the Infinity, especially at the top end. I don't recall seeing the FR graph on the AF, but I am sure it would also be nicer than the Infinity.


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## mpednault (Mar 23, 2012)

Thanks rton20s. Think I'm just going to bite the bullet and go with an AF 3-way meaning the GS25...


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

I wonder if this little guy will fit in place of the factory tweeter location in my FJ's dash. Would be an awesome combo with GS690's in the door, might not even need the GS10's.


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## metanium (Feb 2, 2007)

Lanson said:


> I wonder if this little guy will fit in place of the factory tweeter location in my FJ's dash. Would be an awesome combo with GS690's in the door, might not even need the GS10's.


I believe that it fits precisely in the FJ's dash locations. At least if they're the same as many other newer model Toyota's (Tacoma, Tundra, Sequoia).


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Lanson said:


> I wonder if this little guy will fit in place of the factory tweeter location in my FJ's dash. Would be an awesome combo with GS690's in the door, might not even need the GS10's.


That's the point of them. Drop in, and is a wideband. Although andy doesnt suggest widebands over a 3 way, it is a solution that needed to be filled, so he filled it. 

Also, I want to post this while there is some attention. A wideband still has drawbacks vs a midrange due to the design to enable it to play up high. If you are going to use a tweeter, the gb25 will still be a much better choice.

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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

SkizeR said:


> That's the point of them. Drop in, and is a wideband. Although andy doesnt suggest widebands over a 3 way, it is a solution that needed to be filled, so he filled it.
> 
> Also, I want to post this while there is some attention. A wideband still has drawbacks vs a midrange due to the design to enable it to play up high. If you are going to use a tweeter, the gb25 will still be a much better choice.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


As well it should be for twice the price.


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## EricP72 (Mar 23, 2008)

bbfoto said:


> Looks great!  I'm sure it will be one of the absolute best factory replacement speakers available in this size. Kudos to Andy once again and a big :thumbsup:
> 
> I'd still really like to see Andy release a narrow-flange 3.5" GB- & GS-series midrange. i.e. look at the 4 small mounting holes placed in the surround/basket flange of the GS25 (not the protruding mounting tabs).
> 
> ...


I like the way you think, but I agree, if the output from the GB25 is identical to the GB40 then tooling cost isn't worth it, BUT! I see something that would make sense...A point source 3". Something to directly compete against the Illusion C3. esp with the installation hardware that Andy includes with his drivers. I think that would be a hit, esp if its A-pillar friendly.


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## bnae38 (Oct 3, 2015)

manish said:


> I like the way you think, but I agree, if the output from the GB25 is identical to the GB40 then tooling cost isn't worth it, BUT! I see something that would make sense...A point source 3". Something to directly compete against the Illusion C3. esp with the installation hardware that Andy includes with his drivers. I think that would be a hit, esp if its A-pillar friendly.


Yes! 

Something to compete with the c3cx would be sweet.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Keep dreaming guys.. You guys work on maybe 1 car every 3 years at most (thats being generous), and are thinking from a hobbyist standpoint where you most likely want to do custom locations anyways. Andys products are not just sound quality based products.. THEY ARE SOLUTION BASED PRODUCTS. This means hes making products to make retailers lives easier, while also offering customers the option to not have to spend a ton of money just to install the things. Think about it from a business standpoint.. if he made just a 3", say the "GB30".. well, he just tossed a ton of sales since they are now not going to be able to fit into toyota, GM, mercedes, some nissan, some mazda, etc OEM locations since theyre all about 2.5" drivers. Most customers going into retail locations arent going to want to spend 1k+ on pillars (becuase frankly, what normal customer would even want pillars) or custom dash locations.. its just not happening. They are also made so that you can put them in a sealed enclosure that is small enough to just encapsulate the basket and magnet. Now on the other hand, with just the GB25 you are leaving another market segment open. BMW's, Jeeps, many older cars, etc etc.. They have oem locations for 4" drivers. Now the reason they have only 1 or so db more sensitivity is because FS is much lower. Why? because this driver can also act as a midwoofer in a system if it really needed to. A lot of shops are building hot rods, or doing restores on a lot of older cars where there are no speaker locations and NOTHING can looking anything but original. Guess whos time to shine? GB40. Side note: the gb40 wants infinite baffle. As far as a "point source", im 99% sure that Andy would never do one. First reason, hes not a proponent of losing the dust cap at the expense of lost sensitivity. And secondly, he has been pretty open about hating the "warble" sound that you can hear on coax/point source drivers. In his words, "once you hear it, you can never not hear it".

Also, if the difference between the gb25 and gb40 is only 1db in sensitivity, why the hell would you even want a 3" lol. just take the smaller diaphragm and be grateful for the better polar response


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

manish said:


> First...I'm not and installer...lol but thank you. 2, you sir are a kill joy . 3, I left the I.T./Data management world years ago and I'm now in supply chain management as the US Operations Manager for Suppliers with our customers (DTNA, MAGNA, MartinRea, Hannon, Visteon) to name a few, not bragging just giving a background so when I say I understand oem requirement and demands, cost and toolings trust me I get it. I was one of the first people on these boards screaming that the big brands need to start looking at 6x9 midbass drivers and I was laughed at. I saw how the oem market was going that route. Well right now FCA uses primarily 6x9, 3", and 1" with the 6.5" being phased out. That includes Jeep, Fiat, Dodge, Ram, and Chrysler. Ford is now phasing in 6×9 and 3.5" drivers as well, which means Ford's and Lincoln's. Gm I believe already started using both sizes in their Cadillac SUV vehicles. All I'm saying is the Market is changing. Now where you are  is Andy doesn't care for concentric drivers. And that means the dreams ends before it even started...sigh...maybe I should start up a company and just offer 6x9 and a 3" concentric driver...naw tooling cost...lol thanks for the insight though...please push for that DSP and those amps to be released asap!


Me pushing will only annoy him lol. I cant make a factory work faster

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## JMikeK (Jan 2, 2019)

SkizeR said:


> Keep dreaming guys.. You guys work on maybe 1 car every 3 years at most (thats being generous), and are thinking from a hobbyist standpoint where you most likely want to do custom locations anyways. Andys products are not just sound quality based products.. THEY ARE SOLUTION BASED PRODUCTS. Think about it from a business standpoint.. if he made just a 3", say the "GB30".. well, he just tossed a ton of sales since they are now not going to be able to fit into toyota, GM, mercedes, some nissan, some mazda, etc OEM locations since theyre all about 2.5" drivers. Most customers going into retail locations arent going to want to spend 1k+ on pillars (becuase frankly, what normal customer would even want pillars) or custom dash locations.. its just not happening. They are also made so that you can put them in a sealed enclosure that is small enough to just encapsulate the basket and magnet. Now on the other hand, with just the GB25 you are leaving another market segment open. BMW's, Jeeps, many older cars, etc etc.. They have oem locations for 4" drivers. Now the reason they have only 1 or so db more sensitivity is because FS is much lower. Why? because this driver can also act as a midwoofer in a system if it really needed to. A lot of shops are building hot rods, or doing restores on a lot of older cars where there are no speaker locations and NOTHING can looking anything but original. Guess whos time to shine? GB40. Side note: the gb40 wants infinite baffle. As far as a "point source", im 99% sure that Andy would never do one. First reason, hes not a proponent of losing the dust cap at the expense of lost sensitivity. And secondly, he has been pretty open about hating the "warble" sound that you can hear on coax/point source drivers. In his words, "once you hear it, you can never not hear it".
> 
> Also, if the difference between the gb25 and gb40 is only 1db in sensitivity, why the hell would you even want a 3" lol. just take the smaller diaphragm and be grateful for the better polar response


Nick I am 100% sympathetic to the engineering and business reasons to not engineer and manufacture a million different driver sizes, but you act as if the GB25 is the same as the 40. In one thread you even say Andy and the specs of the drivers insist the response is the same. This is obviously not true. The 25, being much smaller is missing about an octave of response compared to the 40. A 3.5" would be able to reproduce that 120-200 range much better.

I still don't disagree with your general principle, so please spare me the traditional slamming, but maybe you just need to be more clear, particularly when representing products you sell and openly support.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

JMikeK said:


> Nick I am 100% sympathetic to the engineering and business reasons to not engineer and manufacture a million different driver sizes, but you act as if the GB25 is the same as the 40. In one thread you even say Andy and the specs of the drivers insist the response is the same. This is obviously not true. The 25, being much smaller is missing about an octave of response compared to the 40. A 3.5" would be able to reproduce that 120-200 range much better.
> 
> 
> 
> I still don't disagree with your general principle, so please spare me the traditional slamming, but maybe you just need to be more clear, particularly when representing products you sell and openly support.


No slamming. Just explaining. Also, you would cross a 3 inch at 120hz? 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## JMikeK (Jan 2, 2019)

SkizeR said:


> No slamming. Just explaining. Also, you would cross a 3 inch at 120hz?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Definitely not. Depending on specific driver and system goals, maybe 200 - 400. 120 is better for 5.25" IMO.


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

I'm 100% with Nick on this. Developing a driver between the GB25 and GB40 just doesn't make sense. He also did a good job outlining the reasons. If you can't fit the GB40, or the volume at your mounting location is too small, go with the GB25. 

Now a GB80... an 8" dedicated midbass driver on the other hand... Yeah, I know, "limited applications" and all of that. And I am aware that Andy will likely never bring one to market. BUT, there are actually plenty of vehicles out there that will accept an 8"driver of reasonable depth in the factory location. Volkswagen/Audi, Nissan/Infiniti, Mazda, GM are just a few of the makes that use OE 8s that I know of off the top of my head.


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## GreatLaBroski (Jan 20, 2018)

A GB80 would be a stellar idea.


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

If said 8" sub was a neodymium shallow-ish driver, it would be a hit for sure. Then it would be able to fit in so many more OEM locations and keep doors from weighing down.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

IDK, if the GB60 is $800 and can do two way and three way applications and many already complain about the $800 price tag than an 8” (GB80) driver that costs more and can only be used really in a three way off axis might not make good business sense. Many already incorporate the GS690 into three way applications because you really don’t need a very expensive midbass to do 70Hz-300Hz. I don’t see Andy wanting to pour resources into that limited market.


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## bnae38 (Oct 3, 2015)

The Illusion C3CX makes sense to me on SO MANY levels, I dont see why another company doing that would be such a stretch. 

I mean.. as long as they make it look that good too.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> As far as a "point source", im 99% sure that Andy would never do one. First reason, *hes not a proponent of losing the dust cap at the expense of lost sensitivity.* And secondly, he has been pretty open about hating the "warble" sound that you can hear on coax/point source drivers. In his words, "once you hear it, you can never not hear it".
> 
> Also, if the difference between the gb25 and gb40 is only 1db in sensitivity, why the hell would you even want a 3" lol. just take the smaller diaphragm and be grateful for the better polar response


Good info there. I like it!


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## bnae38 (Oct 3, 2015)

I should read more thoroughly, fair enough .


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## Dan750iL (Jan 16, 2016)

GB20 wideband?


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

Dan750iL said:


> GB20 wideband?


But why? It makes no sense. 

I'm certain the GS25 is the closest thing Audiofrog is ever going to make to the wideband drivers you guys are wanting. And no one is telling you that you can't cut off all the tabs, mount them on axis and EQ them to your heart's content.


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