# Stock Looking, low powered, simple SQ setup in a 2007 Acura TL-S



## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

hey guys, just finished an install in a 2007 acura TL type S. this is for a good freind of mine's car and is somewhat unique for me in a few ways.

for one, we wanted to keep the car completely stock looking after its done. by this i dont mean building something that simply looks stock, but rather, have everything hidden beneath stock material so when closed up, there is no sign of a system anywhere.

secondly, due to budget constraints, we decided on a design that is lower powered than ANY of my previous SQ setups. the entire car have 480 watts RMS on it  my freind mainly listens to jazz and other relatively soft music, so we felt this was adequate and focus on tonality than outright headroom and impact.

and finally, the car features a set of speakeres i have never used before. a 6.5" two way component set from Sonic Expressions. you may not have heard of this company, but its run by my freind and fellow SQ competitor Greg. As a passion, he has been doing this little brand name for quite sometime, using it in his own Mustang to compete in the expert class over the past coupla years. For more info on the line:
Home
after seeing his car improve and hearing the potential in these drivers, coupled with the fact that Greg is always an extremely nice guy, i decided to give his top of hte line SE-6 Elite set a try in this vehicle.

so lets get started, the goals are pretty much as before, do a low powered set up that is enjoyable to listen to, while maintaining a completely stock look.

so...onto the pics.

the first pic is a shot of the interior, which looks exactly like stock...but thats not really too hard to do 










becuase the system features zapco tuning, a laptop is used to tweak the system from the front seat as usual:










behind the factory door panels are the sonic expressions 6.5" midbass. first, the stock opening on the metal was enlarged to house a proper sized driver. then a MDF baffle ring was secured to the metal. around the edges of the ring, i stuffed a bit of modeling clay to fill the voids and give it a bit of resonance killing ability. the ring is coated in truck bedliner, speaker wires are also run:










now lets take a quick look at the SE 6.5" midbass, overall impression that its a pretty solidly built unit with good QC:



















then, the entire door was sound proofed wtih a combination of foam and damping. and the speaker is wired up and installed:










a closer look at the driver:


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

the same of course, goes for the passenger side door:




























onto the tweeters. first again, a quick gander at the SE tweeter:



















i massaged these into the stock tweeter mount. didnt get to take too many pics, but basically, what i did was, removed the stock tweeter from the mounting grille, trimmed it out a bit, removed the SE tweeter from its cup, carefully trimmed off the protective grille over the dome. what ends up happening is the SE tweeter then is secured to the stock tweeter grille, and lines up almost perfectly with the factory opening. the top of hte dome sits about 1/8" below the plastic grille. 

so here are the finished products, wires sodered and ready to snap back into the car:


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

now a few quick shots of the wiring running from the front to the back of the car, and into the trunk:























































to tap into the stock signal, three modules were used. a Pac-audio TR4 trigger module converts the low voltage stock turn on to one usable by aftermarket components, a David Navone 4 channel LOC taps into the stock signal prior to the factory amplifier, and a zapco TP4 module boosts the signal voltage and converts it to simblink. 

here you see these three modules, from left to right, tucked away behind the glovebox.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

so thats it for the interior. so far its relatively easy, the real challenge i guess for me, was to keep the trunk looking totally stock. 

The TL doesnt exactly have a deep, wide, or regularly shaped wheel well. plus the floor itself is not flat, but rather oriented at three slightly different angles. 

using a bit of expereince from my past installs on TLs and civics, i came up wtih a plan, and here is the end result. 

here is the normal view, and as you can see, it is 100 percent factory looking, nothing was changed, moved, or raised:










flip up the factory spare tire well cover ,and here is hwat you see.

a new fake floor has been built across the stock spare tire well opening. the top panel is trimmed in black CF vinyl. upfront, are two image dynamics ID8 subs, and in the back, peering through its own cutout, is a single zapco DC reference 650.6 that powers the entire system. the subwoofer is trimmed in white to match the exterior of the car. the 650.6 sends 50 watts to each tweeter, 100 watts to each midbass, and 180 watts bridged to the two subs.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

so a few quick build pics:

here is the wires ran down, routed, and the amp rack mounted and the amp wired up. two of the amp's feet is secured via screws, and there is a long strip of HD velcro across the bottom of the amp that holds it tightly to the amp rack. it literally was too tight for me to extend the amp rack further out for the other two feet.










next comes the subbox, whcih is about .85 cub feet in internal volume. its mostly fiberglass except the top baffle. basically, the bottom mold was taken, and the top wood baffle, after a lot of measuring and postioning, was secured to the mold via strips of MDF at the proper height and angle. and then fleece was pulled across to form the side walls. 

once that was cured, the box was strengthend from the inside with more glass. and here is the finished result:



















note the slight rabet on the openingto sink the sub down a tiny bit. i wanted to get as much distance between the factory floor cover and the sub, so every little bit helps.

next, white vinyl was applied to the top of the box:










next the subbox was installed into the spare tire well:










the key piece to the entire install is acutally the top baffle. what it is, is a composite of three separate pieces of wood. the top main section is out of 1/8" hardboard. this allows the baffle to slide in between the stock floor carpet and the metal floor to form a seamless transition. but, around the opening of the sub and amp, it obviously should be thicker. so a piece of 3/4" and 1/2" MDF board was bonded to hardboard, the opening was made, slant routed, and here is the result, from top and bottom:



















and finally, its trimmed in black CF vinyl:



















so basically, this piece was then slide underneath the stock carpet, and goes over the entire opening.

i know this is a bit hard to explain with words, but hopefully its pretty intuitive with the pics.

anyway, thats it.

i am pretty happy wtih how it turned out, the car sounds pretty good, but we will be doing some more tuning since htis is a speaker set i have not used before.

my initial impression of the SE-6 Elite set is quite positive. right off the bat, with nothing but the xovers set, the speakers exhibited a natural and smooth response. nothing jumped out to bite me in the face. smooth midrange and highs, and pretty good midbass. i think i am a bit spoiled by sq installs of much higher power that i do notice the lack of headroom and huge impact. but i think for his needs, its very good. overall, i am quite happy with the set and plan to use it for sure in the future.

cheers,

b


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## lucas569 (Apr 17, 2007)

as always bing, great work!


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## dbiegel (Oct 15, 2006)

Greg is a great guy and I'm glad to see that his speaker company is getting some appreciation here.

Your install is an inspiration, as always.


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## Starlet-SQ (Apr 19, 2008)

Man....
I now understand why peeps always turn to your for their system
if i was living in the states....you would've surely had2do my rides...
keep up the beautyfull artsy work u do 
Nuff Respect


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## cannan (Jan 19, 2010)

Really nice and simple install, I bet it sounds great. I love the 07-08 TL-S.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

thanks guys, yeah, no doubt greg is a great guy  and i will try to support him as much as i can from now on.


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## RBeachTL (Jul 21, 2008)

Bing great job as always. 

How did you run the power from the engine compartment through the firewall? Any pics?

Also do you have any concerns with cooling the Zapco amp? Is there enough air circulation with the amps in the spare tire well?

One last question, did you secure the components behing the glove box with velcro?

Thanks for your help and great job!!


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## ikoolguy (Oct 23, 2009)

also set up...sucks that u couldn't keep the spare tires


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

1. there is a big thick factory grommit on the driver side firewall, in all the Tls i have used this, you can probably push two 0 guages through no problem.

2. cooling should be okay, the zapco dc has fans and its acutally more helpful to keep the two sides of the amps unblocked, than just the top heatsink. i drove around for half an hour yesterday and it didnt get all that hot, but there is also the option of adding a secondary fan in it should it become an issue.

3. yeah its HD vecro plus zipties to stock wiring bundles(TR4). there are too many vents back there to screw anyhting into. the back trim plate behind the glovebox also pushes right up against it all to keep things in place. the wide HD velcro i get from Homedepot has proven to be quite strong over the years


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

I don't understand why you're using a LOC on a line-level signal (a balanced one at that--ideal for the Zapco).


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

mainyl cost, two BTLs plus to SLB-Us would add quite a bit to the overall cost.  TP4 is a more efficient way to go from that standpoint


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

If that's really the case, that just highlights how absurd Zapco's product line and Symbilink **** is.

You're adding an extra voltage divider, and an extra piece in the signal chain, just because Zapco's product line and pricing sucks. 

Sorry to crap on your thread, but that's just so ****ing absurd. SMH.

Also, look at this: http://tom-morrow-land.com/tests/navoneloc/

Couldn't you just splice a Symbilink cable into the factory wiring anyway, without adding additional boxes whatsoever?


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

how classy...;0

everyone have a certain budget, and we build things to accomodate that budget. i am not sure why the manufacturer is at fault? besides, if this method works fine, what is the main problem here? tell me what i stand to gain by going wtih two BTl and Two SLB-Us over this setup? and yes, i have done it that way half a dozen times before too 

maybe its just penis envy for a TL type S becuase its better than your Si? 


that last one was a joke btw. but really, your reply was kinda pointless, but i guess i saw that coming when you made your first comment


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

I wasn't attacking you, Bing. I think your defensiveness speaks for itself.

Adding unnecessary components to the signal chain certainly doesn't help with the budget. And that's a pretty weak card to pull, when we're talking about high-end, expensive amps. If you can't afford to feed your high-end, expensive amps a clean signal, maybe you shouldn't be using those amps?


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

p.s. i mean what do i stand to gain in the real world from a audible perspective, by not going with the other route of maintaining balaneced throughout?


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

huh?


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

i can clearly see this debate is pointless  no worries.. i will take your advices into consideration for future builds.


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

It shouldn't be pointless!

That last question simply didn't make any sense.

The factory outputs are already balanced. No matter what, the system should indeed be balanced the whole way. I do not believe that you need additional components in the signal chain to accomplish this (though I could be wrong on that).

Regardless, using a LOC on a line-level signal seems like a bad approach to me. Getting the best possible source signal seems like more than a minor detail to me.

And if Zapco's pricing structure is such that it prices its customers out of buying the correct tools for the job, well, see my comments above.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

okay okay lol.

from reading your responses, i have an impression that you dont have a firm overall grasp of zapco's pricing or their simblink stuff. and i am also a bit unsure if you have a firm idea on the way the TL's stock system works and how best to integrated.

but again, i could be wrong here was just put off by your off the wall attacks on zapco, a brand that has treated me extremely well and i am very loyal to and of course will defend against your remarks. 

but again, if you want to prove me wrong, why dont you tell me how this system should be done? with zapco and non zapco products, on this particular car, to achieve a superior result?


p.s. please do realize that the main reason for the DC reference was not for simblink balanced intput, but for its tuning capability so we can have the least amount of gear possible? if i just cared about simblink the iforce amps have simblink inputs.


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

I'm not sure why you would assume that I'm incapable of using the Internet, considering that we are communicating over the Internet. Using this "Internet", I am able to see pricing information on Zapco's Web site. These prices appear to be those of "high-end" car audio products. You said yourself that the reason for not using some of these products (the correct ones for the job) was that they were out of the customer's budget.

And yes, you "could be wrong" regarding my understanding of the TL's stock system, considering that it is essentially the same as the one in my "small penis" Civic, which I have interfaced to aftermarket components.

I don't need to prove anything. If you actually wanted my help, you could have chosen a different attitude, and I would have been happy to do so.


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Bing, great work as usual. your skill with simplistic, good looking designs always brings a smile to my face first, and a grimace when I realize that even with your detailed build pics and explanations, I simply cannot make mine look as good as yours. But that's just how it goes I guess.

Did you notice that the SE mid-line speakers look a whole lot like Daytons?


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Oh yes, and I wanted to ask you (as I own an older TL), when you build subs in the trunk like that... can you clearly hear them in the cabin, even with the way TL's are built?


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## Griffith (Jul 10, 2008)

fourthmeal said:


> Did you notice that the SE mid-line speakers look a whole lot like Daytons?


Was just about to point that out. What's up with that? It seems like they took the images straight from PE. However I do see a very small difference in the basket. 

Why do they use 12db /oct crossovers for their reference components? Shouldn't it be 18db-24db /oct minimum?

Their Elite series state 3" voice coils. They dont' look 3", more like 2". I'm willing to bet the tweeters they're using are ND20 based.


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## jimp (Jul 12, 2009)

love the stealth install, very nice work. Hope the guy is happy with the end result as that is what really matters.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

capnxtreme said:


> I'm not sure why you would assume that I'm incapable of using the Internet, considering that we are communicating over the Internet. Using this "Internet", I am able to see pricing information on Zapco's Web site. These prices appear to be those of "high-end" car audio products. You said yourself that the reason for not using some of these products (the correct ones for the job) was that they were out of the customer's budget.
> 
> And yes, you "could be wrong" regarding my understanding of the TL's stock system, considering that it is essentially the same as the one in my "small penis" Civic, which I have interfaced to aftermarket components.
> 
> I don't need to prove anything. If you actually wanted my help, you could have chosen a different attitude, and I would have been happy to do so.


sigh... i knew this was going to be pointless...okay, last reponse i have to this matter.

1. i didnt ask for your help from the get go.

2. you asked one question, and when i responded with what is the simple truth, you went on a big attack on zapco, using big words such as "****" "****" and "sucks". if you were really here to offer helpful advice YOU should have startd with a different attitude.

3. you should realize that not everyone thinks exactly the way you do, people have different priorities, instead of leveling your judgement and opinion as the correct and only way to go, try to open your mind. did you stop for one minute and think, wait a minute, maybe it doesnt affect the sound that much and maybe the budget is what it is? and if the end result is that the customer is happy and not going fully balanced line didnt make any detriment to the system, that it is what matters in the end?

4. did you stop to think that since i mentioned that this was a good freind of mine, that i did the entire setup on a very low cost? to the point that the extra cost of having two SLB-Us versus a single TP4, small as the price difference may be, can literally be 1/3 of my total profit on this build? 

again, this is the real world, i for one, have NEVER acted like my method is best or try to push my opinion on people as fact. i simply care about the end result.

in that if the end result is good, the customer is happy, it came in within the budet, then thats what makes me happy.


and lastly, i wasnt asking you to prove yourself to me by having you come up with a design. i asked for you to prove that i was wrong by interpreting your rant against zapco as a simple ego driven tirade. to acutally back up your attacks with some knowledge and make this into a real debate...versus just a pointless shouting match.

not to mention, there are very few prices listed on zapco's site, and most of those are out of date. and nor does it mention the whole story. you do realize that every DC amplifier comes wtih transmitters for FREE right? but in this case, using them wasnt an option. 

anyway, thats my opinion.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

fourthmeal said:


> Oh yes, and I wanted to ask you (as I own an older TL), when you build subs in the trunk like that... can you clearly hear them in the cabin, even with the way TL's are built?


from my experience, when you remove either just hte sub, or the sub and the rear speakers from the rear deck, it opens up it up quite a bit. a clear path pretty much to the interior. in this car, i removed the stock sub.

the panel over the sub really doesnt make much of a differnece in sound. bass finds a way to get to you IMO 

b


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## mSaLL150 (Aug 14, 2008)

Very nice simple build! I got a chance to listen to Greg's mustang at Marv's last year and was impressed by his speakers. One of the few installs with everything down by that Kicks that I really enjoyed.


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## xxx_busa (May 4, 2009)

Nice Looking Install BING !!!!


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

simplicityinsound said:


> sigh... i knew this was going to be pointless...okay, last reponse i have to this matter.
> 
> 1. i didnt ask for your help from the get go.


Considering that this is your profession, I would hope that you wouldn't need to ask for help on something so basic. Unfortunately, this does not seem to be the case. Later, however, you asked the following:



> why dont you tell me how this system should be done? with zapco and non zapco products, on this particular car, to achieve a superior result?


But I guess you were just being a smart-ass, and weren't actually asking for help, even though you could obviously use it?



> 2. you asked one question, and when i responded with what is the simple truth, you went on a big *attack on zapco*, using big words such as "****" "****" and "sucks". if you were really here to offer helpful advice YOU should have startd with a different attitude.


Correct. I attacked *Zapco*, and clearly laid out my reasons for doing so. Why did you take this so incredibly personally?



> 3. you should realize that not everyone thinks exactly the way you do, people have different priorities, instead of leveling your judgement and opinion as the correct and only way to go, try to open your mind. did you stop for one minute and think, wait a minute, maybe it doesnt affect the sound that much and maybe the budget is what it is? and if the end result is that the customer is happy and not going fully balanced line didnt make any detriment to the system, that it is what matters in the end?


This is irrelevant drivel. Done properly, it would sound better and cost less. The fact that the customer is happy doesn't mean it couldn't have been done better.

Did you even look at the link I posted? IT DOES AFFECT THE SOUND.



> 4. did you stop to think that since i mentioned that this was a good freind of mine, that i did the entire setup on a very low cost? to the point that the extra cost of having two SLB-Us versus a single TP4, small as the price difference may be, can literally be 1/3 of my total profit on this build?


So you DO understand my point about the ridiculousness of Zapco's pricing, after all?



> again, this is the real world, i for one, have NEVER acted like my method is best or try to push my opinion on people as fact. i simply care about the end result.
> 
> in that if the end result is good, the customer is happy, it came in within the budet, then thats what makes me happy.


I'm happy that you are happy.



> and lastly, i wasnt asking you to prove yourself to me by having you come up with a design. i asked for you to prove that i was wrong by interpreting your rant against zapco as a simple ego driven tirade. to acutally back up your attacks with some knowledge and make this into a real debate...versus just a pointless shouting match.


There's nothing to prove, and nothing to debate. You're using a LOC on a balanced line-level signal, to feed amps that natively accept balanced line-level signals.



> not to mention, there are very few prices listed on zapco's site, and most of those are out of date. and nor does it mention the whole story. you do realize that every DC amplifier comes wtih transmitters for FREE right? but in this case, using them wasnt an option.


Excuse me for assuming that Zapco runs a competent business.

So when you buy an expensive amp from Zapco, you're also paying for transmitters that you may or may not need (and if they're not the ones you need, you need to go out and drop a few hundo on the correct ones). How exactly does that counter my point that Zapco's products and pricing are absurd?


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

simplicityinsound said:


> from my experience, when you remove either just hte sub, or the sub and the rear speakers from the rear deck, it opens up it up quite a bit. a clear path pretty much to the interior. in this car, i removed the stock sub.
> 
> the panel over the sub really doesnt make much of a differnece in sound. bass finds a way to get to you IMO
> 
> b



Thanks for that, I know there are no rear deck speakers but there is that ominous sub that will be going. 

Keep it up dude, you are an inspiration and I hope your customers appreciate the level of detail you put into your work. Someday I'll have to pick your brain to learn how you do perfect cuts on these damn beauty boards you make.


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## Samuel (Dec 22, 2008)

As always a great instal, very neat and i like your approach too, how did it end up sounding?

As for capnxtreme my advice would be in future to simply look at Simplicity in Sounds installs and keep your childish confrontational comments and rude language to yourself.


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## CarbonDetails (Sep 9, 2009)

Samuel said:


> As always a great instal, very neat and i like your approach too, how did it end up sounding?
> 
> As for capnxtreme my advice would be in future to simply look at Simplicity in Sounds installs and keep your childish confrontational comments and rude language to yourself.


x2, just keep the negative comments to yourself, your killing this thread.


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## bafukie (Nov 23, 2007)

one ques bing.... i seen most of ur boot installation are stealth-base theme. Any fancy blink blink installation coming ya way?


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## RBeachTL (Jul 21, 2008)

Bing please don't let the confrontational attitude of a single member detract from the respect and gratitude that the majority of the members here have for you and your work. I for one have learned a lot from your posts and the time you have spent answering questions from the lot of us here. Thank you.

BTW: the TL's HU output is balanced but of a low level. A level that is intended to drive the signals to the stock amp located in the passenger kick-panel. When this signal is run to the trunk it is often low enough that the gain on the amps needs to be turned up to the point that the system noise level is audible. When the signal is pre-amplified the amp gain can be set to a level that results in an inaudible noise floor. Using the SLB-U for the TL can be problematic as it is just a two channel pre-amp. I looked long and hard to find three of these for my TL that were at a price that I was willing to pay; I'm sure that Bing didn't have the luxury of time to be able to surf the classifieds to find three of these and he found a very clever workaround. 

One follow up to my earlier question; the large grommet that you described for the power wire, is it the one tucked up by the master cylinder. A lot of TL owners use a hole in the center of the firewall that has a grommet without any wires. I think you are recommending the boot to the far drivers side of the firewall that already has a bundle of wires going through it. Am I reading you right?


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

RBeachTL said:


> BTW: the TL's HU output is balanced but of a low level.


Thus, why using a LOC (which DIVIDES the voltage, as well as screwing up the frequency response in this case) is so silly.



> Using the SLB-U for the TL can be problematic as it is just a two channel pre-amp. I looked long and hard to find three of these for my TL that were at a price that I was willing to pay; I'm sure that Bing didn't have the luxury of time to be able to surf the classifieds to find three of these and he found a very clever workaround.


Thus, why Zapco sucks (I hope I didn't offend too many of you ladies by using the word "sucks").


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

hey guys,

it sounds quite good acutally, imaging wise is good, very high stage, but i guess no different than the past TLs i ahve done. it definetly cna use more power, but we will keep tweaking it. right now, we may add second line driver infront of the TP4, becuase even wtih the Tp4, the stock voltage is so low that its hard to turn the amp up without sacrificing some of the noise floor. with past TLs this wasnt too big of an issue since we have a boat load more power, but with a rather low powered system, we can definetly feel the low voltage. so we may get another 4 channel to further boost the signal before reacing the TP4. but for the first time using these speakers, i am very impressed at them especially considering their cost level 

plus i am always more about making personal relationships with my manufacturers, top notch equipment is all over the place, but i tend to want to work with really nice guys. and Greg is surely one of them 

on the firewall:

yeah its sorta next to the master cylinder, its got a big empty surround area beside the stock wiring bundle, next time i will try and get a picture of it, but its at a werid angle that its hard to get a camera on it. i tend to use pass throughts on either side of the car versus the middle, to get it as far away from the signal source and thus signal cables as i can.

as for bling bling install? hmm not sure what one would consider a bling bling, but if you are thiking of like that G37 with the rising sun flag, maybe way later this year, i tend to do only one of those a year hehe. 

but the next install coming up is a bit more complicated, and a VERY different type of vehicle 

i have yet to figure out if this "different" is good or bad yet for my poor aching back


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

capnxtreme said:


> Thus, why using a LOC (which DIVIDES the voltage, as well as screwing up the frequency response in this case) is so silly.
> 
> 
> 
> Thus, why Zapco sucks (I hope I didn't offend too many of you ladies by using the word "sucks").



Shut the **** up.


Are you drunk or something? This is a damn install thread.


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

SMH. Look at Bing's post right above you. Guess what the issue is.


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## Gearhead Greg (Jul 1, 2009)

Phew, wow, this thread got a little crazy here, before I got a chance to reply.

First of all, thanks goes out to my buddy Mr. Bing, for trusting me and putting my top designs to the test. Bing, please let your friend know that I'll be more than happy to help out with any tuning advice that I can.

OK, the 28mm tweeters (as well as the 25mm in my lower sets) are not based on anyone else's, they are my design. The same goes for all of my other speakers as well (and yes, that IS a 3" vc on the Elite). You are correct, the Reference mids are similar in appearance to the Dayton drivers. But they are not the same. I have these speakers built for me, as I do for all of the others that I offer.

Having seen (and judged) many of the vehicles that Bing has built, I continue to be amazed by what this master installer can do! Not only that, but he offers up ALL of his tips on here, for all to see. I am honored to have friends that share my passion for the proper reproduction of sound in a vehicle. 

If anyone has any questions about my speakers, please feel free to contact me directly: [email protected], and I will be more than happy to reply. 

I'll see everyone in a few weeks up at Kustom Kar (hopefully the Cobra will be ready again...either way, I'll be there!)...

Later,

Greg


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Would you consent to having your drivers tested on the DIYMA Kippel?

Because if they do well, I can virtually assure you the DIYMA community will buy your product and run you dry (in a good way.)





Gearhead Greg said:


> Phew, wow, this thread got a little crazy here, before I got a chance to reply.
> 
> First of all, thanks goes out to my buddy Mr. Bing, for trusting me and putting my top designs to the test. Bing, please let your friend know that I'll be more than happy to help out with any tuning advice that I can.
> 
> ...


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## Damo98 (Mar 20, 2009)

awesome install.. 

stealth at its best.. and only sacrificed spare wheel... i like... 

well done....


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## casual (Jun 22, 2007)

In terms of weight.......how much do you think your trunk additon adds..........would you recommend something like this for a light weight install


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

i would honestly say, weight added was almost nil...maybe 5-10 lbs max, the spare tire and the tool bin, together i would say weight a solid 40lbs? maybe more? so i guess you can call it a light weight setup?


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## Gearhead Greg (Jul 1, 2009)

> Would you consent to having your drivers tested on the DIYMA Kippel?


I would be extremely interested in that, but I need to have more of the Elite sets built. As soon as I get some inventory built up, I would very much like to submit a set for testing.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

yeah, i cleaned him out!!


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## KAPendley (Nov 19, 2007)

Bing, great install. It really is to bad you cannot post your work and be proud of what you do, and you do so with humility, and then get smashed for it by someone. There will always be the 2% that aim to make life for others miserable, but the 98% who appreciate it are always there to back ya.

Take care bro.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

Bing, I think you found your "style." Your factory looking installs are your best. It takes as much or more skill to make it look factory than over the top.


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## Lanson (Jan 9, 2007)

Gearhead Greg said:


> I would be extremely interested in that, but I need to have more of the Elite sets built. As soon as I get some inventory built up, I would very much like to submit a set for testing.



And that right there means you just went up a few ranks in my book. Just the willingness shows the pride you have in your lineup. 

I look forward to seeing these tested, hell even test the lower ends too,


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## Gearhead Greg (Jul 1, 2009)

> I look forward to seeing these tested, hell even test the lower ends too,


Hmmm...I still have an "SE-6" set...those may be worth testing, heck, even my lower-end stuff is still quite nice! I'll look into the testing...

Thanks for the heads up!


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Greg,

Do you have a website? When I search for Sonic Expressions I get alot of weird pictures of Sonic the Hedgehog. And some guy named Michael Huang, if I add "Audio" to the end.

Bing, 

This is my kind of install. I prefer to leave my cars usable. The eventual idea in my car is that with everything buttoned up, *NOTHING* will be visible, except maybe the tweeters. Great Job!

Jay


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## Gearhead Greg (Jul 1, 2009)

Hi Jay, ask and you shall receive!

Home

Note, I just learned that the production costs for the Reference Mids increased substantially, so they most likely will be going away. To be honest, they did cost nearly as much as the Elites to manufacture, but they did not sound as good. Once I get the final confirmation from my build house, I will update my site accordingly.

Thanks for your interest! If you have any questions regarding my products, or even want some advice (tuning, install options, etc.), feel free to hit me up: [email protected] 

As you said, I too agree that Bing is the king of the stealth installs, hands down. What he can do, utilizing STOCK mounting locations is amazing!

Take care,

Greg


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## bullyx2 (Jun 27, 2007)

I have never posted a reply on any of your work, but have always enjoyed reading your build logs. While I like the giant flashy installs as much as the everybody, quality installs that manage to sound great while taking up minimal space are what I really enjoy seeing. The attention to detail in your installs and some of the more subtle things you do are truly impressive.

I wanted to bounce something off of you concenring the Sonic Expressions speakers. I was intrigued by them as I have an Acura TSX with a similar total power and speaker layout. I currently have DLS Reference MS6A's running passively off 2 channels of a JL 300/4. When I bought the DLSs, I was looking at other components that were more expensive and only considering speakers I could hear before buying. These were the first DLS speakers I had heard and I thought they sounded as good as almost everything else I auditioned and the price was too good so I went with those. I love what you did with the tweeter and if there's one thingI am not happy with on the DLS, it's the look of the tweeter in my dash. I am still happy with them, but when I saw what you did in this TL with almost identical speaker locations, and since you obviously are familiar with DLS, I wanted to get your opinion on how these compare. How would Greg's other speakers compare? Thanks in advance!


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

well, unfortunately, right now, you probably wont a solid opinion from me. i dont go on hearsay or initial impressions, and only will give suggestions or recommendations after some serious listening time and installation expereince.

being that this is the first set of SE speakers i have used, i cannot honestly give you a comparison with the MS6A. i do like both speakers, and as you mentioned i do think the MS6A punches above its weight class. i even preferred it to the Up6. the SE set here, on initial impression, as mentioned, is very natural and sounds very good.

I think with more tuning time on this car, i will know better in time  I have reason to believe the SE is a superior tweeter, but until i get some more time, i dont want to give any opinion that isnt based on solid knowledge or experience.



b


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## bullyx2 (Jun 27, 2007)

Thanks for the honest reply. I really am not in the market for new speakers but seeing those in the TL, especially the tweeters, got me thinking. I will look forward to hearing more on these down the road and hope to hear them in person sometime. I am about to purchase an older Miata as a project/fun car and may jump on one of the lower priced SE sets for that. 

Once again, as with all of your work, very impressive install.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

i cant say for sure hwat the TSX's tweeter location is like, since i havent used it. but you dont think the same solution would work for that to keep the MS6A tweeter under the grille?

b


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## bullyx2 (Jun 27, 2007)

Sorry, I feel like I am jacking this thread. Location is almost identical to the TL and am guessing grill is very similar if not identical. I installed them forever ago and vaguely recall thinking that it didn't look like something that could be easily done. Car is in the body shop now but may try when I get it back. 

Thanks again for the replies.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

give it a shot, what allowed this to work was i found that if i removed the grille arches over the dome, the tweeter fits in almost perfectly and the dome doesnt hit the grille. if you can confrim that, then you are good to go 

b


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## bikerider (Dec 28, 2008)

Love the stealth install Bing!

Not to clutter up your thread any more, but where exactly are the tweeters mounted in the TL? I only saw pics above of them unmounted.


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## Gearhead Greg (Jul 1, 2009)

> but until i get some more time, i dont want to give any opinion that isnt based on solid knowledge or experience.


Thank you Bing, for keeping it un-biased and honest. I would never ask for any favoritism, etc. as I hold reputation & integrity in high regards.



> I am about to purchase an older Miata as a project/fun car and may jump on one of the lower priced SE sets for that.


Wow "Bully", those are cool little cars...I tried to fit into one of those a while back, a friend had one with a turbo...SCARY RIDE, when my head was about 1" from the windshield!

Seriously though, I have a set of the 5" components & the 6" components for the SE sets. If you want to come out to Patterson next weekend, you're welcome to hear them (on the test bench), if you want...

Thanks,

Greg


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

bikerider said:


> Love the stealth install Bing!
> 
> Not to clutter up your thread any more, but where exactly are the tweeters mounted in the TL? I only saw pics above of them unmounted.


the tweet stock location is at the top corners of the dash, firing up at the windshield 

if you see the interior pics 1 and 2, you can sorta see them on top of the dash 

b


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## bullyx2 (Jun 27, 2007)

Thanks for the offer Greg, but unfortunately, Patterson is a little ways away from Florida. Giong to have to check them out one day though, either in person or by just jumping on a set. Have been wanting an old Miata for years and think I am finally going to bite when I find the right one. 

Bing, thanks again for the feedback. I hope I didn't put you in an odd spot asking for a recommendation like that in this forum. (especially since you deal with both brands)


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

not a problem, in the end, i will always give you my honest opinion, regardless if it sways one way or the other


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## RBeachTL (Jul 21, 2008)

Bing, 

Thanks for the info on the power wire. One of the last things I have to do for my install is to run the power wire and I'm having a tough time figuring out the path of least resistance. When you run the power wire through the driver side firewall penetration, do you go through the grommet with the stock wire? If so, do you have to cut the engine side of the grommet to enlarge it. If you do cut the grommet, do you cut the part of the grommet that surrounds the stock bundle or do you cut the flat part?

Thanks again,


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

its pretty hard to reach the engine side of that grommit.

what i do is, feel for the grommet, to make sure there isnt stock wires on the surround areas of the rubber (stock bundle travesl through the center of the grommet).

then i take a sharpend flat head screw driver, push it in and through the other side, and then take it out, and push through it again this time wtih the blade tilted 90 degress. thats usually enough. then i take a little vaseline on a finger tip, and umm finger the cut i just made, okay that sounds kinky lol

anyway, then you just line up the power cable and push, the vaseline allows it to slide through easily, without having to worry about hte friction taking the entire rubber grommet off the firewall hole.

b


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## RBeachTL (Jul 21, 2008)

Bing,

That makes perfect sense. Do you just leave it at that or do you use electrical tape on the engine side? I agree that it is tough to get to that spot so I'm not sure that I could get to the grommet if I needed to. The only reason I ask is that a couple of Acura owners have reported computer trouble when water leaked through their firewalls. 

Thanks again for the help


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

i havent had any issues with it, i have gotten in TLs from a few years ago, and it was perfectly dry. i think maybe the key is not to make a big hole. i make a small slit so the power cable makes a decent seal wtih the rubber. plus i feel that its at a location that should get soaked with water. 

if you feel unsure, get some strip caulk or silicone and put it around the inside of the grommet.

b


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## Gearhead Greg (Jul 1, 2009)

Wow, dude:


> but unfortunately, Patterson is a little ways away from Florida


That proves I can't read! ;P Sorry, I was thinking for some reason you were out in Sacramento!? Hey, to my defense, I was sick @ home with Bronchitis...

Lemme' know if you want any more info, I'll be glad to shoot it over to you.


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## cjj2d (Jun 28, 2005)

that is freakin sweet!!!!

that is EXACTLY my goal for my TL... keep the factory look, just like you did and get great sound quality.

I think you should build me a box/amp rack for my TL!!!!

I am going to go with one or two SI BM MKII's as my sub stage. 

I am about to start on my front stage install: Seas w16nx mids, still fumbling around with tweeter options, and RF 3sixty.2 for the signal interface. Going to use a pair of PPI PC2150's for now, until I get a JL HD900/5 for the entire system. Dont want multiple amps this time around.


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## BlueAc (May 19, 2007)

^ Hey man... I saw you looking around acurazine.com for install help. If your close to Bing then you should definitely check him out. Also search threads started by him in the build logs section and see his other TL jobs.. You Cali guys who aren't true diyers are lucky to have him on your side. I wish I could find someone close to me with this kind of skills, that actually wants the business!


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## fastev (May 28, 2007)

BlueAc said:


> ...You Cali guys who aren't true diyers are lucky to have him on your side...


Even those of us who are DIY'ers are lucky-- Bing is willing to help and offers some great advice and opinions. I know my install will turn out better after 20 minutes talking to him.

Great looking install as usual Bing!


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## BlueAc (May 19, 2007)

Exactly...


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

aww shucks... Evan, i did demand payment for my time no? those two bottles of coke felt great after a long day!


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## jimmyjames16 (Dec 12, 2006)

Bing ... man.. this just blows my mind. Even though this is not your most elaborate install... just your knowledge and way of going about every install completely astonishes me every time. Awesome.. awesome work as usual. 

Like I said before... your going to be a very rich man someday... if it hasn't happened already. I hope you the best brother.


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## cjj2d (Jun 28, 2005)

BlueAc said:


> ^ Hey man... I saw you looking around acurazine.com for install help. If your close to Bing then you should definitely check him out. Also search threads started by him in the build logs section and see his other TL jobs.. You Cali guys who aren't true diyers are lucky to have him on your side. I wish I could find someone close to me with this kind of skills, that actually wants the business!


haha, I am no cali guy. I am in TN. but thanks! will look around for his posts/work. definately looks top notch.

currently I am working on my doors. Getting my Seas w16's in there. had to do some cutting yesterday but all is good.


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## BlueAc (May 19, 2007)

cjj2d said:


> haha, I am no cali guy. I am in TN. but thanks! will look around for his posts/work. definately looks top notch.
> 
> currently I am working on my doors. Getting my Seas w16's in there. had to do some cutting yesterday but all is good.


Oh the "Big Orange County" threw me off... Good luck man! I have an 07 Type S and I'm having a hard time finding a shop to do my install.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

why dont you take the trip into jersey and have Don take a look at it?


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## BlueAc (May 19, 2007)

simplicityinsound said:


> why dont you take the trip into jersey and have Don take a look at it?


I heard he does very good work but he is VERY hard to get a hold of. I don't like to feel like I'm harrasing someone to take my business. Next time u do a TL let me know so u can build duplicates for me... lol!


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## cjj2d (Jun 28, 2005)

BlueAc said:


> Oh the "Big Orange County" threw me off... Good luck man! I have an 07 Type S and I'm having a hard time finding a shop to do my install.


I have started mine.... it will be a slow process but atleast I have a start now.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/diyma-member-build-logs/92483-06-acura-tl.html


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## audio+civic (Apr 16, 2009)

good stuff


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## VIP3R (Nov 11, 2009)

looking great!


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## Big_Valven (Aug 20, 2008)

thehatedguy said:


> It takes as much or more skill to make it look factory than over the top.


You can say that again. You need to 'think' the same as the car's designers to come up with something that looks and works like the designers would have wanted.


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## HornetZ2 (May 13, 2010)

Hi Bing, 

Great Install as usual (I really enjoy your work). I was wondering if you might share your opinion on the ID8's you used in this install (and several others if IIRC). I've been thinking of using 3 of these powered by a Diamond D7402, and it would be nice to get feedback from someone who's opinion I trust. 

Best Regards, 
Zack. 

(please PM me if I'm hijacking your thread)


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## GSlider (Jun 11, 2009)

Love it Bing. I'd like more info on the SE comps if possible.


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## marcs325i (Nov 22, 2009)

nice and clean 
thats really smooth.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

hey Guys, for more info on the SE set, PM gearhead greg  he is the owner of the company.

as for the ID8, its a good little sub. i think with most normal good 8" subs, (i.e. NOT 8w7 whcih is a monster of an 8" sub) when you do 3 or 4 of them, they tend to have very good output and depending on car, very smooth extension as well...and of course, they blend in very well when properly tuned. 

however, dont expect them to have the same bottom end as a 10 or 12" driver of similar quality. for me, i prefer a single 10 or 12 over 8" in MOST cases, simply because its better low end extension and usually takes up less room than a pair , 3 or 4 8" 

so i guess the answer in my opinion is, if you listen to any great percentage of hiphop, heavy R&B, or other genres with a lot of very low bass material, go with 10s or 12s...but if you dont, the 8s may be a good call.


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## Jmirage (Nov 23, 2010)

Where can I get CF vinyl like you use?


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

selectproducts.com sells them, i get it from them or from my local upholstery distributor.


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## strong*I*bumpin (Oct 3, 2005)

simplicityinsound said:


> selectproducts.com sells them, i get it from them or from my local upholstery distributor.


That site use to be easy to order from,now ....WTF.Looks like u need a catalog.


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## tru tech99 (Jan 3, 2011)

do you have to cut out the front door for the speaker to fit?


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

yeah, very few aftermarket 6.5" can fit in the stock cutout.


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## tru tech99 (Jan 3, 2011)

where did you tap the wires to get signal from, and what you use for signal processer? imma do what you do good job man


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## redbaronace (Sep 27, 2011)

Beautiful work. I really appreciate stock look.


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