# Help Designing my first single driver full range cabinets??



## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

Hopefully this is posted in the right section!

So I am soooooo new to home audio, but am falling quickly in love!  I have been heavily involved in car audio for about 10 years and am very SQ minded. A recent thread either on here or on CA.com sparked my interest in building my own home speaker cabinets. He built a single driver cabinet with some sort of internal porting and it looked amazing. My fabrication skills are decent and I have been building all kinds of things lately, and wanted to try my knack at the home scene. I have lots of questions though, so rather than doing another 12 searches (which I already did  ) I thought I'd post this up to see if I can get a few answers. First off, my current home setup is pretty simple, but when I started becoming interested a few months ago, I started gathering things. I bought a new PC with an HD sound card that has optical out, and ripped my music collection in WMA Lossless to start... wanted to have an easy to use Music Server, and hooked up to my 1080p tv, it works perfect as a monitor! I was close to buying a set of B&W 604 Series 3 (have always wanted a set of B&Ws... absolutely love them) but they are a little out of my price range for now. Then I bought a Pioneer Elite receiver, which after doing my homework realized I should have maybe gone with a stereo amplifier instead as I just want to do a 2 channel setup with maybe a sub, but oh well. The SQ from it is far better than anything I've had in the home, so I'm happy with it for now. I think it retailed for $1400 and I picked it up used for $350. I wanna say it does 110w by 7 channels or something along those lines. Anyway, I want to build a pair of single driver cabinets, and from looking at some of the designs, I think I can pull it off as long as it doesn't involve curving the wood. My questions:

1) What type of wood is typically used, and where can it be purchased? 
2) How do you select which driver to go with or know if it can be used as full range?
3) How do you know how to design the enclosure specific to the driver you picked, or know if a driver will sound good in a certain pre-designed enclosure? There are tons of designs out there... not sure where to start.
4) When doing a full range single speaker enclosure, is it truly full range? In other words, can it be exposed to a full range signal instead of needing a crossover?

That should help me start. I know guys get into tube amps and all that, but I want to start of relatively inexpensive... maybe looking to spend $400 including drivers and materials. Is this realistic? From what I've seen on madisound and what not, a lot of DIY drivers are relatively inexpensive (~$100 each) and receive rave reviews from people on here. Ask me anything about car audio and I know how much to spend, or what's worth what, but I am so new to home audio I haven't the slightest if this budget is high or low or realistic or what. So any input including answers to any of the above questions would be appreciated!

Mike


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## evan (Dec 2, 2006)

Hopefully aneonrider will chime in here. He's done something similar before.


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## thylantyr (Jan 21, 2008)

There are many designs in cyber to choose from. All the engineering done.
Are you restricted to single driver loudspeakers only ?


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## Luke352 (Jul 24, 2006)

Here is a link with lots of full range driver designs the particular page is for the CSS drivers which are cheap so they make a good point to start from, with simple boxes if you want more involved look at the Frugal horns from the tab on the left hand side of the page. http://www.planet10-hifi.com/boxes-CSS.html

Great thing about that page is it has stuff from a simple box through to really involved designs like this http://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_comp/pdf/recom_enclose/168ez_enclrev.pdf and you'll generally find with full rangers because there a single driver there are heaps of designs using the same driver allowing you to start with something simple and work your way up to something very involved in build, all without the added cost of buying more drivers.


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

thylantyr said:


> There are many designs in cyber to choose from. All the engineering done.
> Are you restricted to single driver loudspeakers only ?


I'm not in terms of space or whatever, I would just like to try the design out as they seem to have awesome reviews from those who have built them, and seem relatively easy to build. Also inexpensive considering there are only 2 drivers. I realize a multi driver setup could sound just as good/maybe better but there seems to be something to be said about the seamless transition in frequency with a single driver, so I'd like to experience it more than anything  Also the horn concept has really got my attention, which seems to be popular with single driver applications. For those that have built their own with great results, what drivers do you suggest? What differences do the driver diameters make? In other words, advantages/disadvantages of going with say an 8" driver vs. a 5.25"? Thanks for the feedback so far, and I will check out that website, Luke!

Mike


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## thylantyr (Jan 21, 2008)

*I'm not in terms of space or whatever, I would just like to try the design out as they seem to have awesome reviews from those who have built them, and seem relatively easy to build. *

Reviews are subjective. You get awesome reviews from multi-driver loudspeakers too   



> I have been heavily involved in car audio for about 10 years and am very SQ minded. My fabrication skills are decent and I have been building all kinds of things lately, and wanted to try my knack at the home scene.


With 10 years of experience, plus you have fabrication skills, there is no
need to fear other designs. 

*Also inexpensive considering there are only 2 drivers. I realize a multi driver setup could sound just as good/maybe better but there seems to be something to be said about the seamless transition in frequency with a single driver, so I'd like to experience it more than anything  *

There you go, try one out to see if you like it.

*Also the horn concept has really got my attention, which seems to be popular with single driver applications. *

Extending the bass using a horn or TL design is required when you have only
one driver trying to do all the work. In a multi-driver loudspeaker, the job
of bass is dedicated to a capable driver, hence it works in a simple sealed
or ported design. You can also use that dedicated woofer to make more
complicated sub designs.

*For those that have built their own with great results, what drivers do you suggest? What differences do the driver diameters make? In other words, advantages/disadvantages of going with say an 8" driver vs. a 5.25"? *

All things being equal except size, the 8" can give you more bass. There is
issues with beaming with larger midrange sizes so aim the driver at the listener. 

Take pics.


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

I'll definitely take pics  

Luke, from what I can see on that page you linked, most of those are for bi-pole designs. Did I miss something on the single drivers? As far as bi-pole goes, it seems like they need to be away from the wall to sound good... is this accurate? They look like fun too!


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## Luke352 (Jul 24, 2006)

Yeah there is quite a few bi pole designs on that page aswell, but not all check some of the horn designs as they tend to not be bi poles.

http://www.frugal-horn.com/plans.html
http://www.frugal-horn.com/spawn-plans.html
http://www.frugal-horn.com/ronhorns.html (some require bending)
http://www.planet10-hifi.com/tom-zHorn.html
http://www.planet10-hifi.com/boxes-fostex.html#GR-fonken
The fostex site has plenty of plans aswell http://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_comp/rec_enc_1.shtml


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

The first Fostex link you posted in your first post looks insane!! Why do I want to build that one all of the sudden??


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## Neil (Dec 9, 2005)

mikey7182 said:


> My questions:
> 
> 1) What type of wood is typically used, and where can it be purchased?


Typically a void free plywood (birch, for example) or MDF is used. The thickness will depend on what you need and you should be able to find what you're looking for in most hardware/wood stores.



mikey7182 said:


> 2) How do you select which driver to go with or know if it can be used as full range?


Typically they are marketed as full range or wide range. But the best way to know what will work is to either try it for yourself or make a choice based on others experience with it. There are certain characteristics of a speaker that usually make one better than another, though. This includes things like low inductance, high efficiency, incorporation of a phase plug or whizzer cone, etc.



mikey7182 said:


> 3) How do you know how to design the enclosure specific to the driver you picked, or know if a driver will sound good in a certain pre-designed enclosure? There are tons of designs out there... not sure where to start.


Most pre-designed enclosures specifically state which drivers they were built around. Take a look at the planet10 site (premier work, in my opinion), diyaudio.com's full range section, or the single driver section at audiocircles.com. Oh, and take a look at the BIB. You can certainly design one yourself but it does require a little trial and error, as well as some knowledge behind speaker design.



mikey7182 said:


> 4) When doing a full range single speaker enclosure, is it truly full range? In other words, can it be exposed to a full range signal instead of needing a crossover?


Questionable. For example, I have a lot of experience with the CSS FR125S, which have proven very popular. The output this driver is capable of at low frequencies is extremely impressive. When placed in a proper enclosure, I would say that no subwoofer is required for most music. However, the top end is not perfect... due to the size of the driver, you experience beaming and rolloff on the top end when turned off-axis. The lower efficiency is also considered a detriment to some, but that is the trade-off for the low frequency performance.

There are two general approaches: 1. Go with a small driver that will play the top end well and design an enclosure (ie. horn) that will pick up the bottom end for you, or 2. Go with a larger driver, usable in almost any enclosure, that features a phase plug or whizzer cone that makes the top end more livable. However, the top end is typically lackluster, in my opinion, when using this approach.

And with either approach, it is still tough to achieve "perfect" performance full-range. Use of a notch filter or EQ is not uncommon for many fullrange drivers. And for many, a single full range driver does not offer that "rock the room" type of performance they are looking for, which is easily found in a number of 2, 3, or 4 way systems.

Personally, I say fullrange is simply something everyone must try. As you pointed out, coherence is at an all time high and many fall in love with the single driver approach.


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## zukiaudio (Jan 31, 2007)




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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

Yeah, but I think I am going to give it a try for sure. Honestly, that pretty complex Fostex one has really got my attention. One question I have, is a lot of the designs I've seen give intricate drawings and measurements, but they don't really go into specifics on the actual port/horn, i.e. where it exits the enclosure. Some are rounded, some are just square, some are loaded with gradually staggered wood, etc. Just trying to figure out that Fostex one, as it looks like a lot of fun to build, and I have an ungodly amount of spare time on my hands  

Another question: What is the best way to fasten all the pieces? Wood glue? Brad nails? Screws? A mixture of those? I'm sure different fasteners give off different resonance if I were to get super technical, so just curious what the best approach would be, especially with the staggered pieces where the horn loads or exits the enclosure... I would think glue but I could be wrong.


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

LOL!  Zuki, I saw those pics floating aroud a few weeks back. Those things are insane! I'm sure they are the aural equivalent of a 10 minute orgasm though!  Wish I had the room and the know-how. I'm learning quickly though not to be afraid of venturing into the dark so to speak. The internet has proven to be a valuable resource.


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## zukiaudio (Jan 31, 2007)

i am using the ace cabinets with lowther drivers currently.

http://www.lowther-america.com/plans.htm


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## Luke352 (Jul 24, 2006)

Most of your purists will use Wood Glue alone, as I believe they feel the use of screws effects the stability/resonance of the timber, but I'm sure for some of us more mere mortals we wouldnt be able to pick any difference so I can't see anything wrong with using Glue with Screws placed strategically to help hold everything in place during the building process.


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

From first "Fostex" post

Recommended Back Loaded Horn Type Enclosure

I likey


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## Neil (Dec 9, 2005)

Luke352 said:


> Most of your purists will use Wood Glue alone, as I believe they feel the use of screws effects the stability/resonance of the timber, but I'm sure for some of us more mere mortals we wouldnt be able to pick any difference so I can't see anything wrong with using Glue with Screws placed strategically to help hold everything in place during the building process.


The purpose of the screws is to hold the boards together while the glue cures. If you make good cuts, lay a good bead and clamp the joint well, there's no need for screws. They only make finishing harder, in my opinion.


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## niceguy (Mar 12, 2006)

MDF is good and cheap (1/2" or 3/4" depending on size of driver(s)) if you plan on painting or adding veneer or whatever...

Hardwoods (cherry, popler,etc) are nice to use since they are basically prefinished or can be stained but are pretty expensive nowadays. I wouldn't practice using those woods


Jeremy


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

zukiaudio said:


> i am using the ace cabinets with lowther drivers currently.
> 
> http://www.lowther-america.com/plans.htm



The driver on that design goes on the top?? The directions are sorta hard to decipher. Is it a horn design, and if so, where does it exit the enclosure? How does it sound?


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## thylantyr (Jan 21, 2008)

The reason woodworkers use wood glue is because they
are making furniture. They don't want the fastener [nail, screw, etc] to be exposed as it looks fugly. For areas that
are not visible, they will use fasteners too if they want.

If you use fasteners, becareful not to crack the wood,
depends on the scenario. If you plan to use wood or
drywall screws, pre-drill and countersink so the wood
doesn't crack. Even nails can crack wood, sometimes 
I would predrill holes for nails when using MDF. 

Whatever you do, always use glue, glue + clamps or
glue + fasteners.

If the speaker project requires a certain finish, the 
fastener may show up, ie if you prep the surface, sand,
primer, paint, the screw area may show through. If
you do veneer or fabric on MDF, you are good.

MDF is a different animal, the MDF has a 'skin' and
glue alone isn't the ultimate best way to go.


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