# 2015 F150 4x4 stealth project



## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

This is going to be the start of my log.

I picked up a 2015 F150 Platinum Supercrew 4x4 a couple months ago and with the advent of cooler weather way down south, it is time to start installing my gear. This truck has the Sony premium system with an outboard amp/processor and an 8" oem subwoofer behind the rear seat.

Goals:

1. I want the system to look STOCK as possible.
2. I want to retain all of the stock storage space and folding seats.
3. I want it to sound great.
4. I want people to say "this sounds amazing".
5. I want to reuse as many of my old parts as possible from my old G8 GT.

This means no big enclosure under the rear seats. Also the amps and processor will be mostly hidden under/behind the rear seat in a small storage bin that is perfect for the task. After reading and looking and measuring on many ford forums and on diyma, I have designed an enclosure that will fit within the stock confines of the factory sub and amp space behind the rear seat and still allow for folding it up and down as necessary for storage since I use this truck for hauling a camper as well as other assorted crap. 

Equipment list:

Stock head unit - this can be custom programmed to deliver a low level output to the processor or just feed the stock signals into my processor. The EQ and tuning is all done within the Sony amp so once this is removed out of the chain there is no issue with different amounts of bass at different volumes that the stock system applies. This is also nice because I already have signal at the rear of the cab where the processor and amp are going to be mounted.

old: Rockford 360.3 processor. I have had this for 5 years now, know how to use it well with it's quirks, and it is still plenty powerful for a simple 5 channel system like I will have.

old: Alpine V9 5 channel amplifier. Same here, this thing rocks and has plenty of power for a modest stealth SQ build.

old: CDT 2" ES-02 "wide band" aka large format tweeter. These will go into the A pillars in the oem location, as far as integrating them, that will be dialed in soon. Short of fiber glassing the pillar trims, I have a couple ideas to look at.

new: Alpine S69c 6x9. Door mounted in oem location, I love the midbass output of a 6x9, and with the proper spacers I already have, are super easy to install.

new: A pair of Dayton Audio DCS165-4 (6.5") subwoofers. These are to be ran as a 2 ohm load pair in a vented enclosure, tuned to 38hz. Attached is a model of these drivers running sealed vs. vented in WinISD. I chose these for the small enclosure space as well as cost, and vented with proper tuning looks to provide decent output.

I love building cheaper(er) and well tuned systems that make people go "wow" with the quality and then shake their heads when they see what's behind it. I also don't have the patience to spend months building a system, I like the down and dirty method of getting it done but with a nod to install quality.

Stage 1: door sealing. I will do a bit more once I am installing the 6x9's this weekend.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Looks like you put a lot of time into designing and planning I well. One thing I would mention is that big hole in your door you covered up with what looks like sound deadener. Wouldn’t it be better for your mid bass if you covered that big hole in the door with something more substantial like 1/4” plastic sheet or something similar? Sound Deadening Front Vehicle Doors

I like your thought on keeping it stealth, clean, and simple. I have equipped my F-150 in a similar way. I had a co worker listen to it today and he was definitely wowed by it.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

That gaping hole is double layered, aka a sandwich of deadener attached to both sides of the door as well as 50-60% coverage of the door skin to help cut resonance there. The adhesive sides covering the hole is stuck to each other if that makes sense. I also "stretched" it as tight as I could to make it stiffer. I reached in from the speaker hole and rolled/pressed it all around the interior before attaching the cab side piece. It was kind of a PITA but came out pretty dense. It definitely tightened up the midbass from the stock speaker and the flutter of that stock plastic sheet is gone. 

While I am in there this weekend I will see if I can backyard engineer something to stiffen it further.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

I got around to mounting the 6x9 yesterday. I used a foam tape gasket between the spacer and the door mounting as well as between the driver and the spacer. I was careful to watch for potential rattle spots and added some mlv to a couple spots where the one parts interfaced such as j-nuts and what not. I sealed up the holes where the speaker wire passed through the adaptor/spacer and also added mlv around the base of the adaptor to further dampen it as well as make sure there are no air leaks. 

After test playing a few songs with solid mid bass and bass I was satisfied. The door is well built and MUCH quieter/easier to tame than the prior 2015 GMC truck I had. These Alpine drivers are definitely an improvment over the stock Sony driver and appear to have a higher sensitivity as they are somewhat louder and cleaner. I can’t wait to get some real power to them.

Next weekend I will be cutting out the enclosure pieces and assembling that.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Minor update:

Since I have a Ford with the Sync/Sony "premium" system, I was planning on reprogramming the ACM and some minor harness work to integrate my RF 360.3 in as well as maintain chime warnings, nav voice, etc. 

Well, forget all of that, I found a simple and effective solution that will require ZERO splicing/cutting. Maestro/Rockford DSR1 with my specific Ford harness that is basically plug and play. You just flash the unit with your specific vehicle and it goes inline using the oem harness connectors where the factory Sony amp/dsp clunker was. The head unit in this truck delivers a flat line level signal to the amp and controls the other functions via CANBUS. RCA outs to my amplifier, a little speaker wiring and I am in business!

PLUS, it includes a built in Rockford 360.3 dsp chip tunable via an Ipad or Android interface! So my existing 360.3 will be for sale I guess 

Next weekend I will be cutting out the sub enclosure panels and assembling them. The subs are backordered until late January so I havve plenty of time on this phase. I will be gluing this enclosure, no wood screws.

iDatalink - Maestro - Maestro DSR1


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

So I got interested today in taking a look at my A pillars to see how the 2” CDT drivers are going to work out. I was pleasantly surprised at what I found!

First I removed the stock tweet. Appeared to be a decent amount of space. I test fitted and saw that once the CDT was broken down that I could trim some plastic from the pillar to allow the driver to sit flat, leave the stock grill in there, and using washers I could even reuse the stock mounts to hold the driver in.

I had to bend the stock grill ends a bit to make extra width, the end result being the driver sat snugly between the stock mount tabs and once everything was screwed down it was very solid and looks stock from the outside!

I added foam behind the A pillar before installing it, and even used the stock wire harness with new terminals soldered on to attach to the CDT ES-02. Took a listen and even with the stock amp/dsp it sounded a lot better. More lower vocal range and cleaner, raised the soundstage a fair amount. Once I get the replacement dsp and amp installed and better xovers set it is going to be sano.

Behold, stock appearance.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Minor update: I got around to starting the sub enclosure. Since space is so tight behind the seat I really needed the extra 1/2” of depth inside the enclosure for the drivers, so that neccesitated using 1/2” instead of 3/4” material. I had to hunt through the stacks at Lowe’s to find a perfect piece of 1/2 birch plywood with no voids or knots. I will use internal bracing and mlv on the interior as well. It is a very simple enclosure that will net .42 cubes plus these are only 6.5” subs getting @200 watts max. I predrilled for the screws to prevent any possible cracking then glued all edges together, once it dries I will remove the screws and countersink all of them. 

As you can see the enclosure is very thin, external measurements are 24” long by 12.5” tall, 4.5” at the bottom and only 3.6” at the top. I had one edge a bit rough (you can see it in the pic) but once the glue dries I can sand out the minor edge before covering with a factory look alike carpet. I will cut the end pieces out later this week. My drivers are back ordered until Jan 22 so once those come in I will be able to get the baffle cut out and get the spacing correct so the 2.5” x 22” port can be added. Next weekend I should be able to install the power wire and then get the amplifier and processor laid in and start basic tuning on the front stage in lieu of the subs arriving.


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

Are you using the cdt es-02?


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

ToNasty said:


> Are you using the cdt es-02?


Yes sir, they are in and working - no idea what the factory crossover is but they are an improvement over the little factory tweet.

I will post an REW graph of the OEM system in a bit, I did a few sweeps and averaged them for fun.


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

therapture said:


> Yes sir, they are in and working - no idea what the factory crossover is but they are an improvement over the little factory tweet.
> 
> 
> 
> I will post an REW graph of the OEM system in a bit, I did a few sweeps and averaged them for fun.


Im using them in my 3 way passive setup. Full cdt. Havent got them in yet

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

ToNasty said:


> Im using them in my 3 way passive setup. Full cdt. Havent got them in yet


They are beautiful drivers if a bit overpriced. I have had these ES02 for 3 years or better.


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## ToNasty (Jan 23, 2013)

Good to hear. Makes me feel better about them


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

OK, I have some port options now, looking for some expert advice on my options.

The subs have an fs of 35.7 hz. My total net volume after port and sub displacement is .423 cubes. Given that I am aiming to keep my port velocity below 22 m/s, here is what I have and can fit in the box. I want to tune as low as feasible to keep SQ up, how far below the speaker fs should I tune to?

1. 2.5" x 20.9" is 37hz at 19 m/s
2. 2.25" x 18.95" is 35hz at 21.5 m/s
3. 2.25" x 21.5" is 33hz at 20.5 m/s (my favorite option)
4. 2.0" x 16.80" is 33hz at 24 m/s (too high)
5. 2.25" x 20.1" is 34hz at 19.8 m/s (second favorite option)

I have 24" of space in the enclosure so how far do I need to keep the port away from the wall? Would the 3rd option work giving it only leaves 2.5" of clearance from the internal port end? I could leave the port sticking out of the enclosure an inch if need be since it will be hidden behind a rear seat.

sub specs:


Nominal Diameter6-1/2"Power Handling (RMS)100 Watts
Power Handling (max)200 Watts Impedance4 ohms
Frequency Response36 to 1,100 HzSensitivity87.4 dB 2.83V/1m

Thiele-Small Parameters
Resonant Frequency (Fs)35.7 HzDC Resistance (Re)3.4 ohms
Voice Coil Inductance (Le)1.43 mHMechanical Q (Qms)6.62
Electromagnetic Q (Qes)0.36Total Q (Qts)0.34
Compliance Equivalent Volume (Vas)0.42 ft.³Mechanical Compliance of Suspension (Cms)0.5 mm/N
BL Product (BL)9.15 TmDiaphragm Mass Inc. Airload (Mms)39.5g
Maximum Linear Excursion (Xmax)6 mm
Surface Area of Cone (Sd)124.7 cm²


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## tenx82 (Jun 15, 2018)

therapture said:


> Yes sir, they are in and working - no idea what the factory crossover is but they are an improvement over the little factory tweet.
> 
> I will post an REW graph of the OEM system in a bit, I did a few sweeps and averaged them for fun.


The OEM tweeter has a built-in crossover. Your ES-02s are running full range if they're not high-passed from your amp.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

tenx82 said:


> The OEM tweeter has a built-in crossover. Your ES-02s are running full range if they're not high-passed from your amp.


Def not running full range or the ES02 would be distorting like crazy and it def isn't. Others have tested this stock amp and it does not run full range to the doors and tweets.The factory Sony dsp/amp is crossed over as tweeter and mid are ran on a separate channel. The sub channel seems to have a fairly high subsonic filter as well @35hz, you can see the steep falloff there on an REW sweep. I mic'ed it for fun the other day and I will actually run a few sweeps for reference with everything flat before I rip out the Sony amp this weekend.

The good news is I should be installing my V9 and DSR1 on saturday.


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## tenx82 (Jun 15, 2018)

therapture said:


> Def not running full range or the ES02 would be distorting like crazy and it def isn't. Others have tested this stock amp and it does not run full range to the doors and tweets.The factory Sony dsp/amp is crossed over as tweeter and mid are ran on a separate channel. The sub channel seems to have a fairly high subsonic filter as well @35hz, you can see the steep falloff there on an REW sweep. I mic'ed it for fun the other day and I will actually run a few sweeps for reference with everything flat before I rip out the Sony amp this weekend.
> 
> The good news is I should be installing my V9 and DSR1 on saturday.


Ah, ok. Didn't realize you were still running the factory amp.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

tenx82 said:


> Ah, ok. Didn't realize you were still running the factory amp.


Only because I bought this truck a couple months ago and haven't had much time to work on it.

To be honest, with the settings tweaked it's a fairly decent stock system. If it had ANY TA at all it would improve it tremendously as the bass ends up in your lap and if you fade right enough then the right tweeter becomes too loud and voices come from the middle while high end comes from far right. Cross firing tweeters in the A pillars help keep the stage up. The factory 6x9 played fairly low up front and the little 8" factory sub adds some low end. Musical if I might say...as long as the bass at the head unit is at 50% or a bit less it is fine, more than that and anything remotely bass heavy gets muddy real fast. And the factory EQ curve is minimal with minimal rolloff up to 75% volume. Past that is basically pointless as it seems to have little affect other than distortion.

Only thing I have done until this weekend is seal up the doors and replace the front end. I will not be running rear fill with the new setup.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Update. I got the power wire ran and my V9 and DSR-1 are installed. I still have some mounting stuff to clean up and hide, the wiring adaptors and RCA are fairly complex. The good news is the DSR-1 works flawlessly thus far. Just a little bit of background ssss when the volume is 75% up and no content playing, completely inaudible when anything is playing. And certainly not even an issue with the engine and ac running. Zero motor noise. I do not have the subwoofer installed as they are on BO until January 29.

The ipad tuning app works great and is very easy to use. I got the TA and crossovers set and ran a few sweeps to check initial response. Had to turn the ES-02's down they were really loud. Crossovers are all 24 db LR slopes. The 6x9's are bandpassed from 80-1200 hz and the ES-02's high passed at 1200 hz.

After that I ran a few sweeps to average and here is the starting point. Bass mid and treble on the headunit are flat. Sounds decent and I don't see or hear any major problems, just time to tune.

Green is the initial system average and purple is after I cut the top end -4db.


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## tenx82 (Jun 15, 2018)

therapture said:


> Only because I bought this truck a couple months ago and haven't had much time to work on it.
> 
> To be honest, with the settings tweaked it's a fairly decent stock system. If it had ANY TA at all it would improve it tremendously as the bass ends up in your lap and if you fade right enough then the right tweeter becomes too loud and voices come from the middle while high end comes from far right. Cross firing tweeters in the A pillars help keep the stage up. The factory 6x9 played fairly low up front and the little 8" factory sub adds some low end. Musical if I might say...as long as the bass at the head unit is at 50% or a bit less it is fine, more than that and anything remotely bass heavy gets muddy real fast. And the factory EQ curve is minimal with minimal rolloff up to 75% volume. Past that is basically pointless as it seems to have little affect other than distortion.
> 
> Only thing I have done until this weekend is seal up the doors and replace the front end. I will not be running rear fill with the new setup.


There is some TA (if you use the term loosely). There's a setting in the radio for "Driver" or "All seats". It does make a noticeable difference.
I've had a similar feeling now about even my XLT's non-Sony stock setup. I hated it at first, then I "upgraded" to Focal Integrations and a Kicker Key, and put a double layer of CLD on the doors at the same time. I didn't like how it sounded and pulled the speakers and amp, going back to stock while I accumulated parts for a better build. With everything stock, but with the doors mildly treated, it sounds MUCH better than it did originally.

I now have a 3-way set of Hertz Mille Legends sitting here, but now I'm wondering how good the stock speakers could sound with a DSP and small amp.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

tenx82 said:


> now I'm wondering how good the stock speakers could sound with a DSP and small amp.


I ran the stock 6x8 woofers with a JL DSP actively crossed from 80 Hz to 2500 Hz 24 db L-R with a set of Tang Bang home audio tweeters and a Pioner D8604 amp in my F150 and I liked it so much that I’ve be running it like this for a year now. I was surprised at how much better they sounded when bandpassed and amped compared to stock off the stock radio. It’s like they were new speakers in there. It’s worth a shot to try! 

For reference I have NVX X series mid woofers (same as SB Acoustics 17) in my Mazda and Focal 65v mid woofers in my van, all run active with a DSP. When tuning with REW, I also found those stock Ford woofers the easiest to tune.


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## tenx82 (Jun 15, 2018)

V8toilet said:


> I ran the stock 6x8 woofers with a JL DSP actively crossed from 80 Hz to 2500 Hz 24 db L-R with a set of Tang Bang home audio tweeters and a Pioner D8604 amp in my F150 and I liked it so much that I’ve be running it like this for a year now. I was surprised at how much better they sounded when bandpassed and amped compared to stock off the stock radio. It’s like they were new speakers in there. It’s worth a shot to try!
> 
> For reference I have NVX X series mid woofers (same as SB Acoustics 17) in my Mazda and Focal 65v mid woofers in my van, all run active with a DSP. When tuning with REW, I also found those stock Ford woofers the easiest to tune.


I've seen your sig a few times now, and thought it was pretty cool that you kept the stock woofers.
I'm thinking about snagging an old Sony XM-3060 (30x6) and a Dayton DSP, and seeing what I can do for < $250.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Sounds good, I’m currently gathering a bunch of stuff together to put up for sale. I have a couple of 4 channel and monoblock amplifiers in that bunch that will be cheap.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

tenx82 said:


> There is some TA (if you use the term loosely). There's a setting in the radio for "Driver" or "All seats". It does make a noticeable difference.


Not on my 2015 F150, but my chicks 2015 Expedition with the Sony system DOES have that setting and it is definitely better than plain old stereo.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

And to update, I actually tossed my stock Sony subwoofer assembly back in while waiting on the backordered Daytons and vented enclosure. ANY sub is better than NO sub practically.

It had 4 wires coming out of it since the stock amp was a 2 channel sub output, one to each voice coil. I broke out the ohm meter and after running the voice coils in series I see a 4 ohm load. Boom. Hooked it up to my V9 and with careful level setup...it is producing FAR more output than stock ever could. Of course, the V9 could turn it into slag. Maybe I will smoke it for fun once my new sub is ready to go in 

The 6x9's are putting out serious midbass, you feel it up front with impact and presence. With time alignment and some basic EQ work, I have a solid foundation to work from. I will post some response curves over the next few days. As well as some sub enclosure pics, I made the port last night and shaped the edges for airflow and no noise. Going to be tuned to 32hz with a 2" x 18" pvc port. Keeps excursion far below trouble range and digs nice and deep, with a max port velocity of 24 m/s.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Minor update. Getting the subwoofer enclosure ready. Once I cut the baffle holes and seal all interior joints to be sure it is air tight, I will add the two braces. 

Prior to the subs arriving I will then finish it out in a matching carpet and get the mounting finalized.

Placement of the port and subs are all measured out. I am having very positive expectations of this setup and I think it will do exactly what I want and surprise people at the same time. As of now even the stock sub has disappeared into the front stage but it just doesn't play low enough, falls off a cliff from about 35hz down. This ported setup should do the trick! 2"x 18" port tuned at 32hz. Subsonic filter modeled at 27hz and LR xover at 60hz.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Hey there therapture, May I suggest you use a 7 or 11 ply plywood, preferably of a hardwood verity. That plywood for that box looks like regular CDX pine plywood; not the best choice for a subwoofer box. At the very least, double up the front and glue it together and brace the **** out of it. Also in case you may not be aware, ported boxes are very sensitive to any air leaks, even the tiniest ones. It’s not something you would think is important for a box with a big hole in it but it’s very important. The air volume in the port acts like a piston moving back and forth with the movement of the subwoofer and back wave from the cone and any air leakage from elsewhere will reduce its efficiency. CDX plywood can have voids and imperfections in the wood that could make keeping things sealed tricky.

A few other tricks:


Use gasket sealing tape to seal the subs to the box and the terminal cup if you use one. 

Consider a precision port aero port for the greatest possible SQ/efficiency and to reduce the possibility of chuffing noise. 

Use a dual terminal cup for future wiring efficiency if using DVC subs.

Use lots and lots and lots of good quality wood glue on those joints. 

Round off any square edges on internal braces to aid in air flow

Rigidly secure the box to the truck in the cab so that the vibrations emanate through the cab structure thus giving the feeling of powerful bass. Of course you’ll need to quell any rattles too that may arise.

https://www.parts-express.com/parts-express-speaker-gasketing-tape-1-8-x-3-8-x-50-ft-roll--260-540
https://www.parts-express.com/precision-port-3-flared-speaker-cabinet-port-tube-kit--268-350
https://www.parts-express.com/precision-port-4-flared-speaker-cabinet-port-tube-kit--268-352
https://www.parts-express.com/bi-amp-speaker-terminal-cup-satin-nickel-banana-binding-post--260-286


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

It is actually birch ply and I hunted for a basically immaculate piece lol with no voids or knots. I did use heavy glue on all the joints and I will be using sealer on the inside as well. Totally get the tech, I have been in car stereo for a fair time, only new to the DSP/tuning world for about 5 years now.

The pvc is part of the "cheap but effective" approach. Also I could not find an aero port in 2" x 18" long so...I rounded the port edges for smooth flow. I have had a couple ported enclosures before and totally know what port noise is! The enclosure will be an airtight (well except for that gaping port hole haha) setup for sure.






V8toilet said:


> Hey there therapture, May I suggest you use a 7 or 11 ply plywood, preferably of a hardwood verity. That plywood for that box looks like regular CDX pine plywood; not the best choice for a subwoofer box. At the very least, double up the front and glue it together and brace the **** out of it. Also in case you may not be aware, ported boxes are very sensitive to any air leaks, even the tiniest ones. It’s not something you would think is important for a box with a big hole in it but it’s very important. The air volume in the port acts like a piston moving back and forth with the movement of the subwoofer and back wave from the cone and any air leakage from elsewhere will reduce its efficiency. CDX plywood can have voids and imperfections in the wood that could make keeping things sealed tricky.
> 
> A few other tricks:
> 
> ...


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

therapture said:


> It is actually birch ply and I hunted for a basically immaculate piece lol with no voids or knots. I did use heavy glue on all the joints and I will be using sealer on the inside as well. Totally get the tech, I have been in car stereo for a fair time, only new to the DSP/tuning world for about 5 years now.
> 
> The pvc is part of the "cheap but effective" approach. Also I could not find an aero port in 2" x 18" long so...I rounded the port edges for smooth flow. I have had a couple ported enclosures before and totally know what port noise is! The enclosure will be an airtight (well except for that gaping port hole haha) setup for sure.


O-sorry man, sometimes it’s hard to tell what the skill levels are on here and the pictures can be misleading. Glad to hear you’ve got things right.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Well I am no super builder lol... but once I wrap that ugly box and mount it in the oem "pocket" it will look pretty decent. Of course I will post pics.

I embody and claim not only the DIY methodology but I like the "cheap when effective" approach. I like good hardware though. Hence the V9. It was just cool.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

:snacks:


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Slow progress, I don't get home from my work until 6:30 and I usually have dinner with my awesome female partner, we are in bed by 9:30 and I love being with her so that limits my time during the week. Not to mention my kids time (they don't live with me, I am divorced). Plus home stuff to do, etc.

The subwoofers have been shipped and arrive today so I plan on getting those fitted and getting the mounting finished, then I have to cover the enclosure. 

I have done some tuning at the basic curve, and then level matching the 1/3 octave bands to center up and focus the image - this did WONDERS for focus and I believe my TA is also 95% dialed in. I was having an issue that was making me think TA was off, the bass was sitting too far left/in my left floorboard, and male vocals wouldn't line up in the middle, it was just that the left midbass was way to beefy and after level matching the bands it cleared right up.

My 6x9's are a bit "upper midbass-y" or "too much knock/hollow sounding" (guessing in the 125-160 range) and will be refined once I mic them again and see where I need to EQ. I basically had raised the 50-160 range 1 db to get them filling in the low end of their spectrum, as they sounded a bit thin.

The DSR-1 does a decent job once you learn it's quirks. It tends to be finicky on bluetooth, but if I connect my ipad and let it sit a minute or two before going into the advanced tuning, it seems fine. The good thing is, any changes made "stick" even if you lose connection, once you reconnect it is just as you left it. It will also synchronize left and right channels on the level control on a new bootup so you have to make sure you watch that and unlink them before changing anything. No biggie. 

More to come soon!


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Got the subs in finally from back order. I test fitted the subs in the baffle and everything is good to go. Installed a brace in the enclosure and now I need to wrap that thing up. I have the material and glue to cover it this evening and plan on getting it into the truck tomorrow. It is going to be held down with a long factory bolt and nut. There is a long stud sticking up that was used to mount the stock sub and amp assembly. I basically am going to carefully align that stud to the bottom of the enclosure then drill a hole in the bottom just big enough to fit over the stud. Slide the enclosure down over it, seal it well with silicone adhesive and then bolt it down with a large washer and nut. I have seen it done and it works great supposedly, and the enclosure tucks nicely into the factory carpet pocketon the back cab wall. I will be sure to document that process.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

The box is covered and wiring ran inside to have the dual 6.5's at 4 ohm each, ran in parallel for a 2 ohm load to the V9. The port is glued in place, plus glued to the baffle crossbrace inside for extra stability. I am waiting for the glue to dry and will get to install this week. I had some home maintenance issues pop up that had to be fixed today so I am a bit behind.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

Nice!


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## Pb82 Ronin (Jun 6, 2018)

Subing man. I have an 08 F150 with some "toons" in it. Nice to see other ideas.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

UPDATE: I have the sub installed in the truck and a did a quick 10 minute tune and listen session to dial in x-overs. I was quite surprised how...flat?...the passband was. Final settings are set as a bandpass from 30 (subsonic effectively) to 70 hertz. I crossed my 6x9's at 93-1200 and like the way that sounds so it will stay that way. Blue is the first run with flat eq. Red is after messing around with it a bit, fixing the hump at @120 and filling in from 20-30 a little. I like the sound and it came out loud enough to fill in the midbass and it plays well right to the subsonic filter. What really impressed me is that it is "invisible" while listening to music. Until you turn it off. Then the contrast is stark and you really appreciate what that lower octave can do for music!


Opinions? It seems I may want to flesh out the passband a little? Should it be that flat?


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

That looks good, nice job.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

I have to finalize mounting on Saturday because I just don't care to work at night after getting home and I will post pics of that method.

I will be tuning every chance I get over the next few days. I will zoom in on the sub plot and EQ it smoother and shape the transition to the midbasses. I started over with the entire tune, well, because I hit a wall and needed to! The sub is actually changed slightly to a 27-70 xover, it just sounds better to my ear with the subsonic a few hertz lower.

I was chasing fixes and ending up with way too many eq points. I dialed a nice sounding curve by ear and then level matched 1/3 octave pink noise bands to get it closer. Now I need to run the mic and REW again to confirm/deny what I am hearing.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Getting close to finished. Well. More on that in a bit.

I got some time Saturday to figure out mounting and I totally went a different direction, cutting a hole in the bottom of my enclosure to mount to an existing bolt just seemed wrong. So I ended up making "legs" for the bottom of the enclosure to hold it off the floor and clear the existing seat/seatbelt bracket. Somehow my damn pic didn't save but I will post another later, but just think a pair of 1" or so spacer for the enclosure to sit on at each end. You can see between the first pic and the third pic how far the enclosure "sunk" into the cutout space, that is why the port got alot closer to the molded carpet, but that is easy to fix with the heat gun.

I test fitted before trimming the factory carpet/padding and after careful cutting I ended up having a beautiful pocket for the enclosure to slide into. The factory stuff was so thick that it held the enclosure too far out and was a bit too close for comfort to the back seat and I didn't want to chance having the seat against the surround if a passenger is in it. It fit like a glove and helps hold the enclosure in place. I will go back next session and add some mlv/just behind it to ensure noise blocking although I didn't notice any increased road noise.

I think I am going to end up gluing the "legs" to the floor with construction adhesive rather than drilling into the metal. Same for the back of the enclosure, a simple "leg" that touches the back wall and glues to it will hold the tiny enclosure secure and be removable later on if need be, and I will attach the legs to the enclosure with screws from the inside. Lastly, I need to take my heat gun and permanently mold the factory carpet away from the port as it sits a bit close, you can see in the pics what I mean.

I managed to get some tuning in on the sub and made a pretty nice curve. I am having some tuning issues on the front though, what I hear and what I measure is not jiving. If I make the levels match very close, then it gets very one sided as if it is playing much louder on one side vs. what I see on the charts. So I just set everything flat and then linked the L/R eq and went though the bands, cutting the obvious trouble spots down and getting levels between the midbass and wideband set. I revisited TA carefully and it is good. The overall sound is nice and punchy and not tiring to listen to loud. However, I then broke my damn mic and will have to wait for another before I can go much further. Probably a good thing as I need to listen to all my various music and get a feel for any issues. Even with linked EQ's it sounds pretty good.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

Nice install!


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

BP1Fanatic said:


> Nice install!


I got really lucky on the box covering, it was some crap from the walmart home section and it matched about as close as anything could!


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

You can't beat good cheap stuff...unless you can get it for free!


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## TheLex (Jan 25, 2019)

therapture - awesome work! Thanks for posting this thread. I have a 2017 F450 with the Sony "upgraded" system. It definitely needs to be replaced, but like many, I definitely want to keep all my chimes, nav, etc.

Any particular reason you went with the Maestro AR? From their website it's limited to use with Audiocontrol, Audison, Kenwood, and the upcoming ARC DSPs. What's the difference between this and the PAC AmpPRO 4? https://pac-audio.com/catalog/amppro-amplifier-interfaces/ap4-fd21

I'm planning on using the Morel Tempo Ultra 692 6x9 in the front door and their 1" tweeters in the A-Pillar sail panel. Your photos help a lot!

I'm probably going to try and squeeze a JL 12 TW3 or SI BM MK V subwoofer in a sealed box behind the rear seat, in the same place where your box is sitting. I haven't decided whether to build my own box or go with the SuperCrew Sound 12" box. They told me that as built, it causes a problem with the bottom seat staying upright, but they could thin out the box a bit to correct for that problem. https://www.supercrewsound.com/product1389.html

Love your install!


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

TheLex said:


> therapture - awesome work! Thanks for posting this thread. I have a 2017 F450 with the Sony "upgraded" system. It definitely needs to be replaced, but like many, I definitely want to keep all my chimes, nav, etc.
> 
> Any particular reason you went with the Maestro AR? From their website it's limited to use with Audiocontrol, Audison, Kenwood, and the upcoming ARC DSPs. What's the difference between this and the PAC AmpPRO 4? https://pac-audio.com/catalog/amppro-amplifier-interfaces/ap4-fd21
> 
> ...



I didn't use just the Maestro AR, the DSR-1 is the dsp version of the AR. I wanted to keep it ultra simple and got the DSR-1 since it has the 360.3 DSP chip in it and I previously had the 360.3 - The pac amp pro is just a converter basically and I think it flattens out input signals. Keep in mind the stock Sync head unit outputs a flat, un-eq'ed signal to that back Sony amp so you do not need to worry about flattening the source signal, everything was done in the amp. Just feed the DSR-1 input signal and RCA out to your replacement amps.

And the matching Maestro interface harness was literally plug and play so I actually used the same OEM speaker wiring harness to the front since the factory Sony amp/dsp already fed the front 4 channels of power. I literally only had to run power from the battery to the back of the vehicle and find a ground spot back there. The factory speaker wiring can easily handle all the power that the 6 x 9 and 2" drivers need up front. My amp can deliver up to 134w per the Alpine test sheet but even at loud listening levels that average is probably half that. And the 2" would be lucky to see 25w continuous lol.

Thanks for the compliments. It is a simple but effective upgrade that sounds far better than the simple design would suggest.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

After messing around with the system a few days using no mic, I had a magic moment arrive today. I was having an issue with bass response right around the midbass to sub crossover. No TA or x-over would fix it. In music where there was a lot of info in that area it would lose impact and seemingly low bass levels. The bass would drag to the left and down and lose presence, but turn the sub off and the midbass snapped back to middle. It was obvious it was a phase/timing issue. The DSR-1 has no phase setting so I just flipped the sub polarity and went back to work. BOOM. With reverse polarity and dialing in 1-2 ms of delay to the sub channel, everything came back. Midbass impact, low extension, and bass back up front where it belongs. Whatever works. Maybe because of the ported enclosure being almost 60 degrees out of phase at 50hz....?

Finally, final settings, are:

2" CDT playing from 1000+ - keeps a lot of vocals playing up high.
6x9 Alpine s69's bandpassed from 80-1000 -great midbass!
dual vented 6.5" Dayton subs bandpassed from 25-60 (sounds absurd ) -they play very nicely way down low though!

No port noise. Stage is just about 4 inches above the dash and midbass impact just below that. I do plan on making some 2" a-pillar pods though and that will no doubt improve the ease of tuning and fix the extreme off axis issue of the left side.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

Did you model the enclosure in Hornresp or winisd?


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

BP1Fanatic said:


> Did you model the enclosure in Hornresp or winisd?


WinISD. I have the charts if you want to see them.

I have been doing some EQ/filter tweaking and have improved response, I am currently running them bandpassed from 27-70 hz, looks like this resulted in phase improvements and the bass presence improved and is more coherent to the midbass, which I also moved to a 92-1000 hz settings (from old 80-1000) at the same time.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

Wow, you have a vehicle resonate peak between 70 & 92hz.


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

BP1Fanatic said:


> Wow, you have a vehicle resonate peak between 70 & 92hz.


I need to mic everything again and visit REW. I broke my mic connector 

Another on the way.

Not sure about the resonance but moving the midbass up from 80 to 92 and moving the sub a bit wider from 27-60 to 27-70, cleaned up the handoff from the sub to the midbass and kept everything up front. I noticed in the WinISD charts that the filter change shows a phase shift from -67 to -33 degrees.


ALSO - the DSR-1 does indeed have a phase flip feature per channel. I put the sub back to correct polarity on the wires and then used that instead. It DEFINITELY is the right setting. With normal phase it just sounds like crap with reduced output where the sub and mids meet.


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## Vx220 (Nov 30, 2015)

I noticed you'd slipped off the front page, how's those sail panels coming? Finished?


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Vx220 said:


> I noticed you'd slipped off the front page, how's those sail panels coming? Finished?


No sir, I am waiting for the new drivers I am going to use, the Fountek FR59EXE 2", to come off of backorder. They are cheap enough that I want to try them in sealed little pods, they have double the excursion of the ES-02's I am using now. I have new panels waiting for the drivers to get here so I can work on them and not have my system down at all until time to swap.

I have been tweaking and listening and tweaking and listening and have arrived at a better SQ level than prior. After researching and modeling, I changed the sub box by cutting the port down from 18" to 14.8" which tuned it to a higher 35hz. While that was out I stuffed the box with .75ft of polyfil as well. Xovers are set to 27-60 now and the midbass back to 80-1000hz. Those changes got the system working better, the bass had more impact and stayed up front. The little 6.5's are playing better in a range that makes them happier. I am still amazed at how much they add to the system. They blend in fantastically and are invisible...until you turn them off. Then you realize how much they contribute to the overall system.

I ended up cutting the level of the 2" by ~3db, they were just overpowering and masking midbass response, just way too loud especially in the 1k to 5k range. That smoothed out the overall response. I did a bunch of level balancing, and after I got that closer I ended up cutting 100-125-160-200 by about 1.5db on both sides because midbass was too heavy and acoustic guitar and what not was way too loud on the lower notes. Male vocals were way chesty and overbearing. It is much nicer now. Time alignment is dialed though and I haven't touched it.

Sorry for the long winded reply. I think getting these sail panels done and having the drivers on axis to the listening positions will improve the system by another level or two. The current EQ work needed to get response matching between sides is pretty heavy, I had to boost a couple places as much as 2-3 db on the left to get it anywhere close to the right side. All in all it sounds great and once I get my mic back on and record the response I will post them. Been listening to some HQ music and variety. I have found some new music in the process, some of it from the music thread on here.


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## Vx220 (Nov 30, 2015)

Cheers for the update, especially for the little Dayton subs

There's a good chance that my next system will be very similar to what you have now, so I'll keep an eye out for progress, especially now I know you are trying the FR59EXE!

Thanks again


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Long term update...

The DSR-1 has been decent. On my ipad I connect to it the first time, wait 10 seconds for it to "disconnect". Close the software by double clicking home button and dragging the app off screen, then relaunch, it, works impeccably from there on. It has the power of the old RF 360.3 for ALOT cheaper, plus it ties into my oem controls and head unit and I have 100% functionality there. Done.

The Alpine 6x9's are working great and produce awesome midbass. Even without the subs on I have very enjoyable low end and "kick" you can feel. Currently I have been testing them at 18db/80hz -1000hz pretty much as dedicated midbass drivers. They can work the doors over and I have a little more work to do there, I think they can do better if I fix a couple of noise issues (rattles) in the door card itself.

The CDT 2" run from 1000+ with no issues in the stock A pillar trims with enough output to match the 6x9's. I am still working on custom sail panel sealed pods for them that will improve staging and cut down on EQ work since the stock locations fire across the dash. I wish they were IN the dash firing up at the glass, but I digress. It has to look basically factory so...more on that later.

Now, the poor little Dayton subs. Currently I have them at 18db slope and bandpassed from 20 subsonic filter to 60hz. I have played some hard content on them and could smell the voice coils, so I have to be careful. At first I was wanting to go bigger, but I REALLY want to retain the hidden enclosure and all of my floor space under the seat. 

Once you let go of the mentality of pounding bass, you soon learn to enjoy the UPFRONT BASS and the almost pure sound quality tendencies. They do play low and fill in the lower octave quite effectively. I tend to demo the system with the subs off to start, people love the sound! Then I roll in the subs and it wraps you in warm happy sub-bass. Then the peeps are really impressed because they can't tell where they are - and then they realize just how much a modest subwoofer can add to the overall sound quality.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Awesome, glad to read that you’re enjoying your system. I’ve been experimenting with my 1.5” tweeters on axis too and just waiting for the weather to not be so oppressive to do more.


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## BP1Fanatic (Jan 10, 2010)

I had my old 1996 Ranger SuperCab 4 x 6.5" BP4 in my F150 for a minute when I was in between 2 x 15" enclosures. That enclosure is still running in my son's apartment for home theater. It's probably 15 years old.


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## Vx220 (Nov 30, 2015)

Thanks for the update, any news on the 59exe in the sails?


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

Finally....got the FR59EXE in today! I will start the work on the sail panel pods this weekend. The 59's will be aimed at the opposite seat and man, I expect to have really good results with these. Considering my left side wide band is currently about 70 degrees off axis, tuning is difficult.

Once I get aiming correct I am going to run these sealed. I think these would be able to run with a x-over of about 500. Testing will provide the final result though. It will be good to get more vocal range physically high up in the stage.


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## Vx220 (Nov 30, 2015)

Good to hear, keep us updated (with pics!)

Hope it works out well for you, good luck


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## therapture (Jan 31, 2013)

JCsAudio said:


> Awesome, glad to read that you’re enjoying your system. I’ve been experimenting with my 1.5” tweeters on axis too and just waiting for the weather to not be so oppressive to do more.


Exactly. Here in south Texas it is brutal to be outside working on a vehicle, even at night with temp at 80-85 and high humidity. I was waiting for the FR59's to be off backorder and quite frankly until the evenings are cooler and drier I Wasn't going to work on them anyway. Been doing a lot of house stuff, INSIDE lol.


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