# Brax DSP



## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

Hey guys! Havent been posting lately on my build log, was due to me waiting on a few things! Finally, this beauty came in after waiting around 2 months due to backorder and limited supplies... Will be switching out my helix dsp mk2 pro, and see what kind of improvement that brings to the sound stage. Will keep you guys posted! Cheers


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## mark3004 (Oct 4, 2017)

An appropriate tune worth it more than a better part. 😉


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## AudioGal (Oct 16, 2019)

Cool, i am looking forward to your thoughts on this incredibly expensive piece of gear 😁

The posts on the Brax stuff is few and far between .


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## dumdum (Feb 27, 2007)

For me the staging doesn’t improve over say a dsp ultra, but… the sound quality is a little better, not night and day better, but more detailed, it will however be a good improvement for a pro 2 👍🏼 Let us know how you get on


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Looking forward to hearing your feedback on this beautiful piece of gear.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

dumdum said:


> For me the staging doesn’t improve over say a dsp ultra, but… the sound quality is a little better, not night and day better, but more detailed, it will however be a good improvement for a pro 2 👍🏼 Let us know how you get on


Yeah the ultra has nice components… high end Texas Instruments op amps… but the Brax is just silly it’s attention to detail on the construction and internal components is the best of the best the gut shots are beautiful


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## AudioGal (Oct 16, 2019)

I would hope that the time domain performance is also improved as a result of the higher sample rate of the DSP and hopefully better clocks and jitter performance. Which should translate to better micro and macro dynamics including sound staging. I would love to try one in my system but that will never happen unless @JimmyDee buys one in the future and lets me borrow it for a day ....hint hint wink wink ...lol!


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## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

SkizeR said:


> You didnt try to return it like everything else?


Surely i would have if i bought from you, selling it almost double the price it goes for. Anyways, if you have nothing positive to add, please dont comment! Although, I would love your positive feedback since I know you have installed many.


dumdum said:


> For me the staging doesn’t improve over say a dsp ultra, but… the sound quality is a little better, not night and day better, but more detailed, it will however be a good improvement for a pro 2 👍🏼 Let us know how you get on


Definately! Will be getting it the car tonight, will do some tuning and testing 😉


JimmyDee said:


> Looking forward to hearing your feedback on this beautiful piece of gear.


Thank you! Stay tuned


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## haakono (Apr 5, 2009)

Very nice unit, what configuration did you order? Analog inputs and outputs? 

Are these priced more favourably in Indonesia than locally?


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## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

haakono said:


> Very nice unit, what configuration did you order? Analog inputs and outputs?
> 
> Are these priced more favourably in Indonesia than locally?


I'll be using the analog inputs and outputs, but it also has coaxial/digital also.

And yes, I was able to find a better pricing through a friend in indonesia, much less then what I would pay here!


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## AudioGal (Oct 16, 2019)

Wow serial Number 854 amazing a lot of folks have spent some serious coin on these. There seems to be enough out there, but no discussion on the forms for some reason. Must not be the DIY crowd buying them perhaps, at least not in the US or Can. Hmm


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

Very nice! For sh!ts and giggles… MSRP? And do you mind sharing what they sell for in Indonesia? If not, that’s cool too. Just curious.


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## Turb0Yoda (Jan 4, 2019)

second MSRP question-
Also, I am up for adoption in case you want to give that brax unit to someone...


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## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

DaveG said:


> Very nice! For sh!ts and giggles… MSRP? And do you mind sharing what they sell for in Indonesia? If not, that’s cool too. Just curious.


I live in Canada, and asked around for the DSP from brax dealers, but none had in stock or ETA, selling for $9000 CAD + taxes.. opted that route, went on the 2nd option, which in US MSRP is $6500, had a couple in stock but shipping and duties/insurance would bump it up to around 8k US for me here in Canada... opted that also. Luckily my friend who owns a audiostore in Indonesia had last one remaining in stock, and gave me his dealer price which was $4250 USD, including shipping/duties/taxes, and he also threw me a free brax HD USB card, which was awesome of him! Retail in Indonesia is around 5500 USD. Got a heck of a deal! Also Ive heard this from others and my friend also confirmed, they are only limiting to 1000 Pieces of the Brax DSP for now since where they make the DAC chips, the factory burned down and have only limited supplies until further notice. Hope that helps on the curiosity side 😉 Cheers!









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## haakono (Apr 5, 2009)

That's a good deal! About the same retail in Indonesia as here in Norway


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## Turb0Yoda (Jan 4, 2019)

Came to wank over Brax gear.
Stayed for the chisme.


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## quickaudi07 (May 19, 2010)

I have to agree with skizer. These drivers are beautiful and extremely expensive!
Having a shipping like that and have the drivers fly around the box would kill me inside. 

I don't want to say anything negative, but this is unacceptable. 


Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk


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## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

Just to update...

After installing the brax dsp, could immediately tell difference in quality! First off the loading time was basically none. My previous mk2 pro would take about 5-10 seconds to start, and when switching presets, the mk2 pro took about 7-10 seconds, while the brax takes only 2-3, which is a neat improvement. All channels, high/midrange/midbass and subass had a huge audible improvement, the tweeters sounded more prcise and clear, while the midrange is more focued and sharp. The midbass and subbass had the biggest improvement overall.. the midbass sounds more expanded and pronounced throughout while the subbass has become more smoother and linear. Did not imagine just by switching a dsp it can make such a drastic improvement. Now I need to adjust tuning properly and a few tweaks along the way. Ive spent alot of time, effort, and money in this build, hoping for it all to work out! Still working on the build currently, getting the door panels redone, and a pillars. Will post a few pics of how it looks after everything is settled! Cheers!


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## Gill (Sep 26, 2007)

ExoTicLeveL said:


> Just to update...
> 
> After installing the brax dsp, could immediately tell difference in quality! First off the loading time was basically none. My previous mk2 pro would take about 5-10 seconds to start, and when switching presets, the mk2 pro took about 7-10 seconds, while the brax takes only 2-3, which is a neat improvement. All channels, high/midrange/midbass and subass had a huge audible improvement, the tweeters sounded more prcise and clear, while the midrange is more focued and sharp. The midbass and subbass had the biggest improvement overall.. the midbass sounds more expanded and pronounced throughout while the subbass has become more smoother and linear. Did not imagine just by switching a dsp it can make such a drastic improvement. Now I need to adjust tuning properly and a few tweaks along the way. Ive spent alot of time, effort, and money in this build, hoping for it all to work out! Still working on the build currently, getting the door panels redone, and a pillars. Will post a few pics of how it looks after everything is settled! Cheers!


Feedback is on expected line, as in your first post you mentioned improvement. How would you quantify the so called improvement, as adjectives used are familiar.
Its your money, effort, time yet I would like to know how that can happen, just by switching a dsp, everything else stays same?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

I'd love to see the eq settings lol


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## dumdum (Feb 27, 2007)

ExoTicLeveL said:


> Just to update...
> 
> After installing the brax dsp, could immediately tell difference in quality! First off the loading time was basically none. My previous mk2 pro would take about 5-10 seconds to start, and when switching presets, the mk2 pro took about 7-10 seconds, while the brax takes only 2-3, which is a neat improvement. All channels, high/midrange/midbass and subass had a huge audible improvement, the tweeters sounded more prcise and clear, while the midrange is more focued and sharp. The midbass and subbass had the biggest improvement overall.. the midbass sounds more expanded and pronounced throughout while the subbass has become more smoother and linear. Did not imagine just by switching a dsp it can make such a drastic improvement. Now I need to adjust tuning properly and a few tweaks along the way. Ive spent alot of time, effort, and money in this build, hoping for it all to work out! Still working on the build currently, getting the door panels redone, and a pillars. Will post a few pics of how it looks after everything is settled! Cheers!


Look up confirmation bias 👍🏼


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

@SkizeR @Porsche; you guys clearly have a vendetta with the OP. Everyone knows it.

I know there was some history with sales gone bad, and I'm not defending anyone, or taking sides here... but you need to back off.

If you have specific questions for the OP about the setup of this DSP, or what his measured findings are, then go ahead and ask.
But all you're doing right now is throwing grenades over a fence, hoping to get a reaction from the OP.
It's getting tiresome...


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## trunks9_us (Oct 25, 2007)

I wish you were closer I’d like a real comparison with this and my upgraded zapco hdsp. It makes me wonder now how much mark up is on that. To each his own tho it’s a great dsp no matter what it was one I was debating for a good while getting myself.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

I'd like to see some more gut shots of the Brax DSP. So the Brax amps have LME49720 which is a high performance Bipolar op amp.. very nice and arguably better sounding than most burr brown ones. The only amp I have seen them in from the factory besides Brax is the Zapco AP series. So it makes me wonder if these were also somehow implemented in the Brax DSP.. or really just what op amps they are using for the Analog Inputs and especially the Analog outputs..

The Helix Ultra has some pretty decent ones.. they are the "OPA" series (OP1678) on the analog inputs and outputs.. so they are not branded burr brown they are branded as Texas Instruments Audio op amps, but they are a modern high performance op amp from the same line as burr brown. so that essentially what they are.. but without the burr brown badge.

Sometimes people think optical is king.. but if you have low quality dac where the conversion is being done I would argue It could be better to do the digital to analog conversion on the high end DAC (there should be good ones in the Brax DSP) and as a result using the analog outputs could be better. The signal WILL need to be converted to analog at some point to be amplified.. so there is that.. if you have an amp with optical input it depends on what DAC is in it..

If anyone can get pictures of these chips on the Brax DSP analog output cards I would love to see what they are... I cannot find any high resolution pics of the insides of the Brax DSP..


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

JimmyDee said:


> @SkizeR @Porsche; you guys clearly have a vendetta with the OP. Everyone knows it.


Oh, there's plenty more. People just don't speak up like porsche and I


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## Mullings (Jan 31, 2016)

The night and day difference is for real, we did the A/B testing with Brax and Ultra, that’s the reason why I’m using the HDSP in my truck and is getting an Brax for A/B with the Zapco for my shop’s comp car. The Ultra is still a really really good processor but the Brax and Zapco is on another level.


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## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

cman said:


> I'd like to see some more gut shots of the Brax DSP. So the Brax amps have LME49720 which is a high performance Bipolar op amp.. very nice and arguably better sounding than most burr brown ones. The only amp I have seen them in from the factory besides Brax is the Zapco AP series. So it makes me wonder if these were also somehow implemented in the Brax DSP.. or really just what op amps they are using for the Analog Inputs and especially the Analog outputs..
> 
> The Helix Ultra has some pretty decent ones.. they are the "OPA" series (OP1678) on the analog inputs and outputs.. so they are not branded burr brown they are branded as Texas Instruments Audio op amps, but they are a modern high performance op amp from the same line as burr brown. so that essentially what they are.. but without the burr brown badge.
> 
> ...


I will try to get the pics of the guts for the brax, but maybe this might help a bit. Also, I think the brax has dual OP amp bb2134 but I will confirm on that.


Mullings said:


> The night and day difference is for real, we did the A/B testing with Brax and Ultra, that’s the reason why I’m using the HDSP in my truck and is getting an Brax for A/B with the Zapco for my shop’s comp car. The Ultra is still a really really good processor but the Brax and Zapco is on another level.


Yes, definately, I went from the mk2pro to the brax and there is an audible difference just by switching.. still have to do a lot of tuning and eqing, hopefully I can find someone decent here In Canada that can do some proper tuning! The Zapco HDSP is also an awesome DSP. I was going to go ahead with that, but since I got a great deal on the brax, decided might as well.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Mullings said:


> The night and day difference is for real, we did the A/B testing with Brax and Ultra, that’s the reason why I’m using the HDSP in my truck and is getting an Brax for A/B with the Zapco for my shop’s comp car. The Ultra is still a really really good processor but the Brax and Zapco is on another level.


I still remember checking something on the computer in another room being able to tell when the Brax was playing lol


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## Mullings (Jan 31, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> I still remember checking something on the computer in another room being able to tell when the Brax was playing lol


Yep, it was that much better


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## Mullings (Jan 31, 2016)

ExoTicLeveL said:


> I will try to get the pics of the guts for the brax, but maybe this might help a bit. Also, I think the brax has dual OP amp bb2134 but I will confirm on that.
> 
> 
> Yes, definately, I went from the mk2pro to the brax and there is an audible difference just by switching.. still have to do a lot of tuning and eqing, hopefully I can find someone decent here In Canada that can do some proper tuning! The Zapco HDSP is also an awesome DSP. I was going to go ahead with that, but since I got a great deal on the brax, decided might as well.


@AudioGal has the gear and know how to nail down a proper tune, make the drive.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

Mullings said:


> The night and day difference is for real, we did the A/B testing with Brax and Ultra, that’s the reason why I’m using the HDSP in my truck and is getting an Brax for A/B with the Zapco for my shop’s comp car. The Ultra is still a really really good processor but the Brax and Zapco is on another level.



That's great. I've heard good things about the Zapco I just get very weary with newer products. Audiotech Fischer has been doing it for so long I trust them more, especially considering the complexity of a DSP. I've not tried the Zapco so I cant really comment on them, except that literally every other DSP i've used besides an Audiotech Fischer unit has given me issues. Noise, low output voltage, lack of features, glitching, not turning on or off, all the crap you dont want happening. But you and a few other people now have mentioned to me that the Zapco unit was performing well so that is good to hear. Competition always drives innovation so I think it's a good thing.


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## robtr8 (Dec 6, 2011)

Hopefully not too far off topic: With my DM-810, really well produced clean music sounds fantastic. All the usual "test" songs from Focal and Helix where every instrument is well defined sounds great. But that's not what I listen to. Tool sounds muddy and overly processed. Adding the LGD's helped. Would a better DSP make a difference? Or is the crappy "Meridian/jag" amp messing with the signal before it even hits the DSP? In my previous car with nothing but a Pioneer "network mode" DSP HU, "Parabola" sounded amazing. It sounds amazing in the TR8, which has no DSP at all.


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## DoubleCrown (Jun 26, 2019)




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## SiW80 (Mar 13, 2019)

robtr8 said:


> Hopefully not too far off topic: With my DM-810, really well produced clean music sounds fantastic. All the usual "test" songs from Focal and Helix where every instrument is well defined sounds great. But that's not what I listen to. Tool sounds muddy and overly processed. Adding the LGD's helped. Would a better DSP make a difference? Or is the crappy "Meridian/jag" amp messing with the signal before it even hits the DSP? In my previous car with nothing but a Pioneer "network mode" DSP HU, "Parabola" sounded amazing. It sounds amazing in the TR8, which has no DSP at all.


Or is it different expectation? If you invest more do we expect it to be 50%+ better?

My current cheap system to me sounds more enjoyable than my old competition sub (except lacking the large sub). But it isn’t as accurate and wouldn’t score as well. 

Maybe some systems just don’t sound enjoyable and are more technical. Could be down to balance between sub or mid bass output or high end level. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Mullings (Jan 31, 2016)

cman said:


> That's great. I've heard good things about the Zapco I just get very weary with newer products. Audiotech Fischer has been doing it for so long I trust them more, especially considering the complexity of a DSP. I've not tried the Zapco so I cant really comment on them, except that literally every other DSP i've used besides an Audiotech Fischer unit has given me issues. Noise, low output voltage, lack of features, glitching, not turning on or off, all the crap you dont want happening. But you and a few other people now have mentioned to me that the Zapco unit was performing well so that is good to hear. Competition always drives innovation so I think it's a good thing.


The zapco is a solid piece, it definitely is a step up from the Ultra but the UI is not as friendly as PC tools, with good time alignment and a 1/3 octave tune, everything is more detailed and clearer than my best tune on the Ultra. 3 people purchased one after hearing my truck at SVR, one walked out and went straight over to the xcellsus tent and bought a pair of xxm325’s immediately. The UI needs some “getting use to” but if you’re not stupid you’ll be ok, it pisses me off a few times but that vivid and clear signature makes me can’t look back, I’m gonna get a Brax for a comparison only because I don’t like to settle but the zapco is solid.


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## haakono (Apr 5, 2009)

cman said:


> I'd like to see some more gut shots of the Brax DSP.
> 
> If anyone can get pictures of these chips on the Brax DSP analog output cards I would love to see what they are... I cannot find any high resolution pics of the insides of the Brax DSP..


Found this recent clip where they change some of the output modules, but not sure if it's clear enough to pinpoint the actual chips. But there are gut shots at least


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## SiW80 (Mar 13, 2019)

haakono said:


> Found this recent clip where they change some of the output modules, but not sure if it's clear enough to pinpoint the actual chips. But there are gut shots at least


You need to buy one for ‘research’ purposes for us all 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## haakono (Apr 5, 2009)

Seems like a perfectly reasonable excuse 😁


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## Stycker (Jan 31, 2018)

damn you guys, I just bought an Ultra


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## Turb0Yoda (Jan 4, 2019)

Has anyone (else as I read up and someone indeed did leave a comment about this exactly) compared the H-DSP directly with the Ultra? Kinda curious if people say the H-DSP goes against the Brax at such a price disparity.

Can't launch the zapco software atm to compare with Helix


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## trunks9_us (Oct 25, 2007)

Turb0Yoda said:


> Has anyone (else as I read up and someone indeed did leave a comment about this exactly) compared the H-DSP directly with the Ultra? Kinda curious if people say the H-DSP goes against the Brax at such a price disparity.
> 
> Can't launch the zapco software atm to compare with Helix


Zapco hdsp has a demo why can’t you launch it?
I run a hdsp 8ch es9038pro dac upgrade playing 192khz 32bit fp music my sources of music. Aren’t important just know it sounds great no other dsp offers the es9038pro unless you want o count a external dac like topping which isn’t a dsp. The GUI on zapco is difficult especially the saving and loading presets at first the errors until you figure out the correct way it behaves. Best way to to always load from file while tuning save new file save new preset always load from file tho when tuning.


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## trunks9_us (Oct 25, 2007)

I can’t help what others can’t hear it’s not my fault that god gave me better ears.


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## Turb0Yoda (Jan 4, 2019)

trunks9_us said:


> Zapco hdsp has a demo why can’t you launch it?



The tool won't launch on my host and I didn't have enough ram left to spin up another virtual machine quickly for the tool at the time. Didn't bother to troubleshoot besides enabling compatibility mode and seeing if it worked


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## trunks9_us (Oct 25, 2007)

Turb0Yoda said:


> The tool won't launch on my host and I didn't have enough ram left to spin up another virtual machine quickly for the tool at the time. Didn't bother to troubleshoot besides enabling compatibility mode and seeing if it worked


Might need to enter startup mode install unsigned drivers after it’s installed it should work at least with the dsp hooked up the actual GUI should work alone tho regardless idk tho mine doesn’t work on my desktop even tho it’s installed but idk if I installed it that way yet but I know it’s how you get it to work regardless


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## haakono (Apr 5, 2009)

So I did something the other day, and in response, today I got forwarded this email sent to my local distributor

Hi B*****

Thanks for your order. Enclosed you’ll find the order confirmation. Our production department is very busy and we need 1-2 weeks to produce the DSP.

I’ll let you know at once it is ready.

Best regards and have a great weekend

J**** S****

AUDIOTEC FISCHER GmbH

(names withheld)

So now we play the waiting game


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I bought a couple Brax amps today, and while I was at the dealer; I was informed that the Brax DSP is going to be discontinued later this year... just a heads-up for anyone that is actually considering getting one of these unicorns. Your opportunity is limited...


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## ExoTicLeveL (Oct 29, 2020)

+1 i heard they will be only making 1000 pcs in total.. so grab it while you can.. its a masterpiece for any install


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