# 8 or 10 inch in the kick panel paired with horns



## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

I have a 78 trans am I'm building 

Full body horns with b&c de500 compression drivers (unless there is a better CD to go with those horns?)

I can either vent the speakers bout the cowl or seal up the cowl that will give the speakers roughly 2-4 cu. ft. I've read that off axis is ok for a 10inch up the 2000hz

Freq will 50-70 to 1200-1400 hz

I've been looking at many pro audio 8's and 10's as well as 
Dyn 182
Morel supremos

Any body have any comments or suggestions ?
Thank you 
Brad


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## MacLeod (Aug 16, 2009)

Sorry, off topic but just wanted to say the 77-78 Trans Am is my all time favorite car. Definitely post up some pics once you get it complete.


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

hessdawg said:


> I have a 78 trans am I'm building
> 
> Full body horns with b&c de500 compression drivers (unless there is a better CD to go with those horns?)
> 
> ...


That horn/CD combo is great. It's what I run and have run for years. 

I ran JBL 2118H in the kicks of a Dodge Magnum with decent results, but my kicks were sealed and too small, IMO. Great results can be had though for sure. 70hz is about as low as I would go with a pro audio 10, and even a bit higher with an 8". Unless you're able to do a ported enclosure and tune it.

I have some 18Sound 8MB400 8" mids for sale right now. Not sure how well they play high, and if it were me doing a 2-way, I would shoot for as big as I could fit, so if you can find some 10s, take a look into the B&C 10NW64, or if you're on a budged, the Pyle PCW10S.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

What kind of budget you dealing with?

DE500s are nice drivers. Earl Geddes has recently switched to them...so expect any used ones to get snatched up like the DE250s that he made famous.

And the big bodies can go lower than 1.2k. Could take them down to 8oo if you wanted.

There are better drivers out there...but in different areas and much different prices (higher). But as an all around good small 1" driver, it is very hard to best.


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

I currently run mine down to 900 and have had them at 800 with no problem. With on-axis mids, you may not need to run the horns that low depending on the performance of the mid, but just know that you aren't stuck trying to find a mid with a flat response up to 1.5khz.


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

MacLeod said:


> Sorry, off topic but just wanted to say the 77-78 Trans Am is my all time favorite car. Definitely post up some pics once you get it complete.












Engine









Engine in the car starting
Olds 455 ms3x start up - YouTube




Thank you for all the suggestions so far please keep them coming


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

mikey7182 said:


> I currently run mine down to 900 and have had them at 800 with no problem. With on-axis mids, you may not need to run the horns that low depending on the performance of the mid, but just know that you aren't stuck trying to find a mid with a flat response up to 1.5khz.


What slope do you have the crossed at?


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

I have had consistent luck with horn setups using all -24db slopes for some reason. My current install has a -12db slope on the SW LPF but everything else is -24. I like how it blends without so much overlap. Everything sounds sharper I suppose.


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

What processor are you running


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

I think he is using a H701


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

Let's move this thread over to the HLCD section, might get some more traffic over there...


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

That is correct- I run an Alpine W200 with an H701 processor. I've used lots of different setups with horns including the P01/P99 HU, and I keep going back to the 701. It's just such an intuitive layout on the W200, everything is a graphic interface rather than alphanumerical (there are various threads on what controls the H701 the best). But tons of flexibility in the EQ, Xover, TA, etc. There are more xover points to choose from on this than on the P99, and you can pick up a stock H701 for $200-$225 all day long (at least that's what I paid a few months back).


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

It a long shot but anybody has had any experience with any of these drivers

Visaton W250S-4 10" Woofer with Treated Paper Cone 4 Ohm | 292-574

Goldwood GW-210/4 10" OEM Woofer 4 Ohm | 290-320

Pyle PCW10S 10" Midbass | 292-2536

Pyle PCW10S 10" Midbass | 292-2536

FaitalPRO 10FE200 10" Professional Woofer 4 Ohm | 294-1200


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

I'm leaning towards the fatialpros or the Pyles
Anybody used these????


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## fenis (Apr 12, 2008)

I have the Faital 10fe200's (8ohm version) in my doors playing 100-800hz being powered with 200w from a bridged Arc 4200SE and I'm very happy with them. They have great snap and impact and blend nicely with my horns. They can easily play up to 1600hz off axis in the doors.

Out of all 10" pro audio mids these have the best midbass sensitivity that I could find (due to qts = 0.70 and fs of 55hz). Now some on here argue that you don't need that much midbass as all cars have a huge peak in the 150-400hz area which is true in my Subaru sedan as well. But BELOW this peak (around 80-100hz) is where you want to cross to the subwoofer and most of the lower qts PA mids drop off like a rock below 120hz which makes it harder to blend with your sub. I've found that with my low distortion 18" BMS sub I can cross over as high as 120hz and still have the bass impact coming from the dash but only if my midbass' response is slowly rising from 160-100hz. This is why I don't understand some people's recommendations to choose a low qts midbass - most people shoot for a house curve with a rising bass response (eg. +9db 20-60hz then smooth transition back to 0db by 160hz). It becomes much harder to give the illusion of the impact coming from the front if the midbass response is rapidly dropping off below 120hz.

Overall the faitals are great value for money at $60 each so give them a try!


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## Huckleberry Sound (Jan 17, 2009)

hessdawg said:


> I have a 78 trans am I'm building
> 
> Full body horns with b&c de500 compression drivers (unless there is a better CD to go with those horns?)
> 
> ...


PM Sent


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

Huckleberry Sound said:


> PM Sent


Never got a pm


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

fenis said:


> I have the Faital 10fe200's (8ohm version) in my doors playing 100-800hz being powered with 200w from a bridged Arc 4200SE and I'm very happy with them. They have great snap and impact and blend nicely with my horns. They can easily play up to 1600hz off axis in the doors.
> 
> Out of all 10" pro audio mids these have the best midbass sensitivity that I could find (due to qts = 0.70 and fs of 55hz). Now some on here argue that you don't need that much midbass as all cars have a huge peak in the 150-400hz area which is true in my Subaru sedan as well. But BELOW this peak (around 80-100hz) is where you want to cross to the subwoofer and most of the lower qts PA mids drop off like a rock below 120hz which makes it harder to blend with your sub. I've found that with my low distortion 18" BMS sub I can cross over as high as 120hz and still have the bass impact coming from the dash but only if my midbass' response is slowly rising from 160-100hz. This is why I don't understand some people's recommendations to choose a low qts midbass - most people shoot for a house curve with a rising bass response (eg. +9db 20-60hz then smooth transition back to 0db by 160hz). It becomes much harder to give the illusion of the impact coming from the front if the midbass response is rapidly dropping off below 120hz.
> 
> Overall the faitals are great value for money at $60 each so give them a try!


Thank you for all that great info


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## Patrick Bateman (Sep 11, 2006)

thehatedguy said:


> What kind of budget you dealing with?
> 
> DE500s are nice drivers. Earl Geddes has recently switched to them...so expect any used ones to get snatched up like the DE250s that he made famous.
> 
> ...


I didn't realize the DE500 had shorting rings. That's a big plus. One of the reasons I keep coming back to the CDX1-1425 is that it has them. To me, the Celestion sounds much more extended than the DE250. My JBL 2470s have shorting rings also, albeit silver instead of copper.


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## Patrick Bateman (Sep 11, 2006)

fenis said:


> I have the Faital 10fe200's (8ohm version) in my doors playing 100-800hz being powered with 200w from a bridged Arc 4200SE and I'm very happy with them. They have great snap and impact and blend nicely with my horns. They can easily play up to 1600hz off axis in the doors.
> 
> Out of all 10" pro audio mids these have the best midbass sensitivity that I could find (due to qts = 0.70 and fs of 55hz). Now some on here argue that you don't need that much midbass as all cars have a huge peak in the 150-400hz area which is true in my Subaru sedan as well. But BELOW this peak (around 80-100hz) is where you want to cross to the subwoofer and most of the lower qts PA mids drop off like a rock below 120hz which makes it harder to blend with your sub. I've found that with my low distortion 18" BMS sub I can cross over as high as 120hz and still have the bass impact coming from the dash but only if my midbass' response is slowly rising from 160-100hz. This is why I don't understand some people's recommendations to choose a low qts midbass - most people shoot for a house curve with a rising bass response (eg. +9db 20-60hz then smooth transition back to 0db by 160hz). It becomes much harder to give the illusion of the impact coming from the front if the midbass response is rapidly dropping off below 120hz.
> 
> Overall the faitals are great value for money at $60 each so give them a try!


Neat, I wasn't aware of this driver. I've been thinking about doing dual eights or dual 10s in my "Monster Massive" project instead of the Diyma12. I was leaning towards some cheap MCM or Pyle woofers, but this Faital is about as cheap and it's a good match for what I'm doing. (Big sealed box with an array of eights or tens flanking a horn.)

I came *this* close to pulling the trigger on four of the B&C 8PL21s, but held back because I didn't want to spend $320.


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## mikey7182 (Jan 16, 2008)

hessdawg said:


> Never got a pm


That's because he sent it to me by accident.  I just noticed.


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

Anybody else have suggestions ?


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## Huckleberry Sound (Jan 17, 2009)

hessdawg said:


> What processor are you running


What processor are you using?


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## hessdawg (Feb 20, 2007)

I was leaning towards Either rux and h701 or the new ppi dsp-88r 
If I can ever see one or read a review on it


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