# Acouple of questions for the experts from a noob!!



## firefighter1225 (Nov 17, 2011)

Here is what I have.
USD roto mount horn bodies.
Selenium 220ti compression drivers.
2 12" Alpine type R subs.

Questions:
1. Looking at a pair of B&C 8ps21 woofer-94db 1w 70-3,000 would these match up?
2. Power would be 12.5w/each to the horns, 240w/each to the mids, 1800w to the subs.
Would this be about right or would I need more power to the horns?
3. Would I have issues mounting the mids in the door, they are sealed and deadened heavy. I want to keep things looking as stock as possible and I use the dead pedal to rest my foot.

Thanks for looking!!


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## firefighter1225 (Nov 17, 2011)

I have been trying to read as much as possible, and would just like to know if this is a good starting point. It will be a 3way active set-up with time alignment for all drivers. The mids I have now are 6.5" Boston Acoustic pro driver, but even with feeding them 350 plus watts from what I have read they would not be efficent enough. Could someone at least let me know if I'm on the right path or not?


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

Firstly, welcome on the forum - nice to see someone try horns 

Instead of the 8PS21, get either the 8NDL51 @ 94dB but with more Xmax, lower FS, shorting ring, etc... OR 
the 8NW51 @ 97dB, shorting ring but will need a higher highpass than the 8NDL51 (eg. 80Hz @24dB --> 100Hz @ 24dB)
Regarding your power available, it's hard to know... You'll have to try and see if you have enough power for the horns. I'd say yes BUT only if your amp has a really low noise floor... 
Mounting: depends on how much depth you have available, don't know which car this is going in so we don't know if it comes with a 6" or an 8" from factory... 

Kelvin 

PS: you're right, throw away the boston coz it's not gonna work with horns... Even with 1000 watts


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## toysoldier3646 (Jan 25, 2010)

you're gonna want to find midbass/mid drivers that have as high a sensitivity as possible, but you have to take into account the frequency range they will be playing.

for example, I am going to start with some Image Dynamics x69's in my doors with a 63hz/24db hpf and somewhere around a 1200hz/24db lpf. I hope to upgrade to some B&C 10nw64 or B&C 8ndl51 or 8mdn51 which have higher sensitivities than the ID's but also have some differences in the playable ranges. I'm also feeding the ID's 400 watts a piece and my horns are only going to get at most 30.

so my recommendation would be to get drivers with a good combination of sensitivity and range. most on here will recommend the ID drivers if you can find a pair or the B&C's.


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## firefighter1225 (Nov 17, 2011)

> Firstly, welcome on the forum - nice to see someone try horns
> 
> Instead of the 8PS21, get either the 8NDL51 @ 94dB but with more Xmax, lower FS, shorting ring, etc... OR
> the 8NW51 @ 97dB, shorting ring but will need a higher highpass than the 8NDL51 (eg. 80Hz @24dB --> 100Hz @ 24dB)
> ...


If I go with those mids, will my subs be more localized and loose the upfront bass? The car is a '08 Daytona and it will fit 8's, I had a set in there but liked the 6.5's musical sound better. I could feed the horns with 60w per channel but I thought that might be to much for the rest.


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

firefighter1225 said:


> If I go with those mids, will my subs be more localized and loose the upfront bass? Don't understand what you're asking... Upfront bass is a function of tuning and panel threating. You can have impressive upfront bass even with a Xover point of 125Hz... The car is a '08 Daytona and it will fit 8's, I had a set in there but liked the 6.5's musical sound better. No comparison between an OEM driver and an aftermarket one, even if the aftermarket is smaller... I could feed the horns with 60w per channel but I thought that might be to much for the rest.


If you can feed more to the horns, it will be better coz it's better to have too much than not enough. And as stated earlier, more power while leaving the gains lower @ the amp will have less chance for noise. 

Kelvin


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## firefighter1225 (Nov 17, 2011)

Sorry, I meant I had a set of aftermarket 8's in the doors before the 6.5's. I have always crossed over the subs in the 65-90 range, what is panel threading?


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## nubz69 (Aug 27, 2005)

your horns and drivers sound good. 

The midbass you picked is not optimal for this environment. It's FS is too high. The driver is very sensitive but the trade off is it won't play low enough. Put another way, you won't have enough midbass. The 8NDL51 would be a good choice but I think the 8BG51 would be even better. The 8NDL51 has an FS of 66 and the 8BG51 has an FS of 52hz. In the real world, you will most likely get down to 60hz with the 8BG51 before it runs out of steam.

Your subs sound fine.

Your power requirements are a little off. Here is what I would have as minimums, you can always have more.

Horns - 25-50 WRMS
Mids - 100 WRMS
Subs - 500 WRMS

Make sure you are looking at RMS ratings!

You don't mention what processor you will be using. Once you learn your how to tune with your processor, you will see that you don't need a huge amount of power on your horns and mids. I am running 50 on my horns and 150 on my mids, I could run half that on my mids and still be ok.


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

nubz69 said:


> your horns and drivers sound good.
> 
> The midbass you picked is not optimal for this environment. It's FS is too high. The driver is very sensitive but the trade off is it won't play low enough. Put another way, you won't have enough midbass. The 8NDL51 would be a good choice but I think the 8BG51 would be even better. The 8NDL51 has an FS of 66 and the 8BG51 has an FS of 52hz. In the real world, you will most likely get down to 60hz with the 8BG51 before it runs out of steam.
> 
> ...


Actually FS is not that big of a problem - please remember that a lot have had good result with the 2118H/J which has an FS of 85Hz with an Xmax of 3mm 
Lower is better but is not a necessity - just makes tuning a bit more fun  

Kelvin


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## firefighter1225 (Nov 17, 2011)

nubz69 said:


> your horns and drivers sound good.
> 
> The midbass you picked is not optimal for this environment. It's FS is too high. The driver is very sensitive but the trade off is it won't play low enough. Put another way, you won't have enough midbass. The 8NDL51 would be a good choice but I think the 8BG51 would be even better. The 8NDL51 has an FS of 66 and the 8BG51 has an FS of 52hz. In the real world, you will most likely get down to 60hz with the 8BG51 before it runs out of steam.
> 
> ...


The power from my amps are RMS ratings at 8ohm for the horns and mids, and 1 ohm for the subs, however I rarely reach the full potential of the amps anymore, kids and all! Thanks for the reply.
P.S. Will these B&C's work in a door?



> Actually FS is not that big of a problem - please remember that a lot have had good result with the 2118H/J which has an FS of 85Hz with an Xmax of 3mm
> Lower is better but is not a necessity - just makes tuning a bit more fun
> 
> Kelvin


Thanks for the help!! This will be a good winter project. Once finished I will post pics from start to finish, probably around March or April!


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