# Scanspeak 18W vs. Peerless SLS6 vs. Mpyre 65m review for 3 way front stage.



## Ge0

I run a three way front staqe. My midbass drivers are required to play from approximately 60Hz up to 300Hz crossed over with 24db/octave filters at each end.

Drivers I have tried:

a/d/s/ 346is
Image dynamics XS65
Scanspeak 18W revelator
Peerless SLS6
Mpyre 65m

I will not include my thoughts on the a/d/s/ and Image Dynamics drivers as they were used in a 2 way front stage vs. the 3 way I have now. Both drivers were great in the vocal range but peter out below 80Hz. The exception would be the Scan 18W. It did GREAT in the lower octaves an of course excelled in the upper octaves. My favorite for a two way front stage. But, I digress, this review is for midbass duty only.

I'll start with the Scans:

















I hope my install did them justice. What can I say about these drivers? They are the perfect solution IF you don't get rowdy and crank them up when crossed below 80Hz mounted IB in a door. They offer THE BEST bass extension combined with upper octave extension I have ever encountered. However, they are not the best solution for midbass only duties. They tended to make a lot of mechanical noise and stress while pushed too hard down low. Something they were not designed for mind you. But, when push comes to shove, you want good bump up front at all times. Even when you kick up the volume a notch or two .

Next, the Mpyre 65M:

































The 65m is based off the same XBL2 stuff the Adire Extremis was fashioned from. Quite a nice (and REAL light) driver due to its Ne0 motor. Though, it was about 1/8" deeper than the Scan 18W or SLS6. It produced an abundance of midbass crossed 55Hz up to 300hz. Its upper frequency response was OK too, but, I didn't use it in this fashion for this evaluation so I won't go into details. It was a tough call between this and the SLS6. However, in the long run, I could sense the speaker was stressing a little when I really laid on the volume. I could hear it sputtering a little when playing bass heavy content. Mind you, it did so gracefully, but, if I can hear anything but music it is a distraction. It behaved well and was totally satisfactory up until approx 113db. After that, I could sense that all was not well with it living in this environment.

Enter the Peerless SLS6:









Quite a plain looking driver to the blind eye. Its response drops off like a brick wall above 500Hz. However, this sucker can POUND down in the lower octaves. I run mine from 50Hz up to 300Hz. Unless I reach the upper extremes of its power handling I can't even tell they are there. These suckers take a licking and keep on ticking. They do nothing but midbass and they do it well. I hear no mechanical noise from the motor what so ever. They are like the Energizer bunny. They keep going and going and going. I was going to try an 8" driver in my doors. However, I doubt many will beat this little gem unless they have a clean 8mm of x-max or greater and make no mechanical noise. The only thing I think would be better for midbass would be an SLS8. I can't tell you enough how happy I am with these little SOB's. Clean midbass 53Hz to 300hz at levels up to and exceeding 114db. No signs of stress or mechanical noise whatsoever. They just disappear. I defintely would not use them in a 2 way front stage setup. But, if you run a 3 way front and are limited to the diameter or depth (in my instance) of a 6.5" driver then seriously consider trying these cheap little suckers out. You will not be sorry.

I'll post RTA plots if you want to see them. All three drivers are pretty much the same from 50Hz up to 300Hz. The Scan and the SLS6 beat out the Mypre by about 5db from 70Hz down to the crossover limit of 50ish Hz on my passengers side. Everything else is equivalent.

The major difference being the mechanical noise mentioned throughout this review.

1st: Peerless SLS6
2nd: MPypre 65m
3rd: Scan 18W.

Mind you others (err, like Matt R) were able to get excellent results from the Scan 18W. However, they mount theirs in a closer proximity to a real and optimized enclosure or doubled up on drivers to alleviate the x-max mechanical displacement problem like Kevin K. Given my circumstances, and my install, the SLS6 is the driver for me. 

This may not be your idea of a perfect review. I don't add the fluff you may be accustomed to. But, if you have questions please feel free to ask away...

Ge0


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## RMAT

dude thanks so much for this thread. This is exactly waht I was looking for and may just have to give the peerless a try.


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## mvw2

Cool review and some nice options. Those SLS drivers do tend to get ignored a bit, but they excel in what they were designed for. It's tough to beat their price too.


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## Candisa

Aaaah, the Peerless SLS, great midbass drivers, I was planning to use them too, and I recommend them to anybody that wants a good midbass-only driver, even if they budget allows much more expensive drivers.

Unfortunately a subwoofer-setup that can keep up with them would add a lot of weight in the trunk and take a lot of space and that's something I don't want in my car, that's why I'll go with the TangBand 6" 'subwoofers', according to WinISD they should give the same midbass output level, but thanks to the extended x-max of 11.5mm (compared to 8mm on the SLS6), I can let them play almost all the subbass too and I'll only need a single 10 or 12" sub in a sealed enclosure to help them a little with that, instead of needing 2 12" subs in a big ported or PRed enclosure.

Playing a bit more than 1 octave trough 2 different drivers (a 12" in the trunk *and* 4 6.5"es in the front doors) isn't optimal and will require quite some tuning to get it right, that's why I don't recommend it to anybody else because I'm not sure if it'll work out well, 1 or 2 sets of woofers for midbass only up front and a powerfull sub-system in the back does and the Peerless SLS is the perfect driver for midbass-only duty.

greetz,
Isabelle


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## WLDock

Gerorge,

Thanks for the review...really would like to take a listen. I agree about the SLS drivers....after hearing the 8" SLS drivers that I picked up for $80 there really was no reason to keep the JL Audio Drivers that I paid ~$220 for....the SLS's just get it done in a clean fashion. Just need to figure out where they will work best....Spring will be a busy time.

Walt


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## machinehead

How did you know i was having trouble deciding between the mpyre and sls? So even with all that xmax, the mpyre didnt have more output? I kinda saw the mechanical noise issue coming, sooo much extention for a 6.5. I'm still trying to figure a way to sneak some 8's into my doors...


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## Boostedrex

Very nice review. Thanks for taking the time to write it up for us.


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## bassfromspace

Excellent review Ge0!


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## nomed

Good review!


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## bass_lover1

For the price, as a dedicated midbass the SLS 6.5s are pretty much impossible to beat. 

They are usable in a 2-way setup, just don't expect any kind of decent output above 1khz, though the natural roll off of the SLS does lend it self a very mild midrange, no break ups or harshness but you'll need some heavy EQ work in that area to get a level response.


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## fish

Beside the fact the SLS series doesn't play too high, I don't think I've read anything negative about them.


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## kappa546

that's not really a negative, they simply weren't designed to pay that high. but yea... sls are fantastic.


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## FoxPro5

Ge0 said:


> I'll post RTA plots if you want to see them. All three drivers are pretty much the same from 50Hz up to 300Hz. The Scan and the SLS6 beat out the Mypre by about 5db from 70Hz down to the crossover limit of 50ish Hz on my passengers side. Everything else is equivalent.


Yes please. 

So even with Madisound dropping the price on the 18W a little, it's still more than four times the price of the SLS ($200 vs $45). I guess you have to pay for that bandwidth, though, and the sweet Rev sound up top. 

Just looking at the Sd on both, the Scan has the SLS by about 15% (150 vs 129 cm2). Just thought this was interesting as the SLS has the SS by 1.5mm xmax. Methinks lower xmax make for more betterer MB's...but i should really stop thinking.


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## mvw2

2-way with a wideband mid on-axis maybe.


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## Ge0

machinehead said:


> How did you know i was having trouble deciding between the mpyre and sls? So even with all that xmax, the mpyre didnt have more output? I kinda saw the mechanical noise issue coming, sooo much extention for a 6.5. I'm still trying to figure a way to sneak some 8's into my doors...


Both had an equivalent amount of output. The main difference is that I could hear the Mypres motor and cone stressing whereas the Peerless do not. ANY other 6.5" midbass I have ever tried makes mechanical noise when pushed to these limits. The Peerless do not. I'd hate to go so far as to say they are the BEST driver, but, they are damn hard to beat for this purpose.

Ge0


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## machinehead

I'm still tryin to talk myself into chopping up my doors for the 8"


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## Ge0

FoxPro5 said:


> Yes please.
> 
> So even with Madisound dropping the price on the 18W a little, it's still more than four times the price of the SLS ($200 vs $45). I guess you have to pay for that bandwidth, though, and the sweet Rev sound up top.
> 
> Just looking at the Sd on both, the Scan has the SLS by about 15% (150 vs 129 cm2). Just thought this was interesting as the SLS has the SS by 1.5mm xmax. Methinks lower xmax make for more betterer MB's...but i should really stop thinking.


My 18w'S are sitting collecting dust for now, what as shame... If I ever go back to a 2 way system they will be put back to use as my first and only choice. What you say is true, SWEET upper end.

But, not even the mighty Revelator could go without fault in the lower octaves. It shows signs of weakness when you really put its deep bass response to the test. At lower volumes you are in heaven. But, kick it up a few notches and it lets you know right quick that it is not happy about it.

I have a rather unique circumstance though. My sub response has a sucking hole at approx 60Hz. NO enclosure or placement combination I tried could correct this. So, I overlap this region with my midbasses to fill in the blank. To date, the SLS6 is the only driver that has been up to this challenge.

I'm not saying other drivers are not superior to the SLS6 in all other aspects, err, say distortion for one thing... But, at that low of a frequency your brain can tolerate high levels of distortion without notice. Mechanical buzzing, farting, slapping, etc. is just not as tolerable. 

Ge0


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## Ge0

machinehead said:


> I'm still tryin to talk myself into chopping up my doors for the 8"


I'm with you brother. All I would have to do is cut out the fake plastic speaker grill in my decorative door skin:

















And I could fit up to a 10" driver in there. To put it into perspective, the perforated fake grill you see is 7.5" in diameter. The outer ring is 10.5". I'm planning how to make a good decorative speaker grill to cover the driver now. An 8" would be flush with the door trim. A 10" would definitely stick out beyond the plane of my door skin. Hmmm... Good summer project?

Ge0


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## Ge0

Thanks for the good words everyone.

Ge0


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## quality_sound

What is the model of the comparable SLS 8" driver?


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## nycsurfer

great review ,tempting about the scans


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## t3sn4f2

quality_sound said:


> What is the model of the comparable SLS 8" driver?


830667 | Tymphany


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## MuTT

Good review, and yup, I'm liking my sls's as well....now if they just built a door that could handle them....oh well, going to the kicks shortly.


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## quality_sound

Now I want to compare these to the ZR800s. The ZR800 has more cone area, more excursion, and is 4 Ohms vs. 8 Ohms. Both are 87dB but measured differently. JL is 1W/1m, Peerless is 2.83V/1M. I can't remember which yields the higher efficiency rating. 

Should be interesting.


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## bass_lover1

quality_sound said:


> Now I want to compare these to the ZR800s. The ZR800 has more cone area, more excursion, and is 4 Ohms vs. 8 Ohms. Both are 87dB but measured differently. JL is 1W/1m, Peerless is 2.83V/1M. I can't remember which yields the higher efficiency rating.
> 
> Should be interesting.


If the JL was measured @ 2.83 volts, it would be equivalent to 2 watts. I'm guessing the efficiency on both is pretty similar.


Anywho, I never was able to push the SLS 6.5s to their mechanical limits, the surround would hit my door panel before that could happen. And that was playing from 40hz-250 just for fun, and they took it pretty damn well. They were also being powered by a LP 2.2HV so I had plenty of power behind them as well.


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## WLDock

quality_sound said:


> Now I want to compare these to the ZR800s. The ZR800 has more cone area, more excursion, and is 4 Ohms vs. 8 Ohms. Both are 87dB but measured differently. JL is 1W/1m, Peerless is 2.83V/1M. I can't remember which yields the higher efficiency rating.
> Should be interesting.


 Myself, I compared the 8" SLS to the ZR800 and found the two very close in output to the ear. The SLS's had more of a dry and clean quality to them. The JL's had a little more lively sound to them. However, it was hard to tell big differences between the two...more playing time, proper filtering, and a larger enclosure would have been cool but I did not have that available at the time but the listening was done in the home however. 

I ended up selling the JL's and saving some money by keeping the SLS drivers. I think in a less than ideal enclosure with less space like kicks or too small doors, the SLS might work better than the JL's? However, for large doors or rear decks I think the JL's should work out very nice....not that the SLS's won't work there as well...but the JL's seem better suited for that type of install given the specs.

Anyway, I bet the SLS 6's will hold their own against the JL's but if one can run 8's why even think about 6's? Surface area is surface area. But, it would be nice to see how they stack up...I am sure the SLS 6's will work out fine for many.


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## Ge0

WLDock said:


> Anyway, I bet the SLS 6's will hold their own against the JL's but if one can run 8's why even think about 6's? Surface area is surface area. But, it would be nice to see how they stack up...I am sure the SLS 6's will work out fine for many.


Volume of displacement. The SLS6 has a higher volume of displacement than a typical 8" with 6mm x-max. However, an 8" driver with 8mm x-max or greater would be another story...

Ge0


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## machinehead

Ge0 said:


> I'm with you brother. All I would have to do is cut out the fake plastic speaker grill in my decorative door skin:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And I could fit up to a 10" driver in there. To put it into perspective, the perforated fake grill you see is 7.5" in diameter. The outer ring is 10.5". I'm planning how to make a good decorative speaker grill to cover the driver now. An 8" would be flush with the door trim. A 10" would definitely stick out beyond the plane of my door skin. Hmmm... Good summer project?
> 
> Ge0


Good *spring project*, get to work! You have it pretty easy though. My door panel has 3 pieces. If I rebuilt the bottom piece to accept an 8" driver, it would extrude into the top half by 1.5-2inches, and I'm not sure if I would be ok with the look of that. I might have to combine the bottom 2 pieces into 1 piece to keep it clean. That is if i can get the 8 in a spot that clears the window rail. I havent had my door panel panel off yet, gonna do that this week as I will be deadening it as well. Hopefully I will have a better idea of what I can get in there.


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## $rEe

You should try the HDS Exclusive8.


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## Ge0

$rEe said:


> You should try the HDS Exclusive8.


Pourquoi? 

Ge0


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## theothermike

if you go 8 i also suggest you go with 8" exclusives.

flatter response than the sls8 and stays flat from 300 - 400 down to about 70where it slopes slightly down real low.

not much more than sls 8 but definately better distortion figures. and could be used in 2 way with large format low fs tweeter


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## mokedaddy

Thanks for the review. I just picked up a pair of sls 6s and cant wait to hear them.


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## andy335touring

How do the SLS 8" compair to HAT L8's ?


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## MIAaron

Don't get me wrong, I love the exclusives...but as far as a dedicated midbass they wouldn't be my first pick.


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## FoxPro5

Just my couple of pennies, but if you want the "ultimate" IB midbass/woofer from Peerless, then try the XLS 8" (830491). Should edge the SLS out in a few key areas (read npdang's review).


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## FoxPro5

andy335touring said:


> How do the SLS 8" compair to HAT L8's ?


Search the forum rather than dropping your irrelevant, random question into this guy's review thread? Christ that's annoying.

Oh, and GOOD JOB Ge0!


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## kappa546

FoxPro5 said:


> Just my couple of pennies, but if you want the "ultimate" IB midbass/woofer from Peerless, then try the XLS 8" (830491). Should edge the SLS out in a few key areas (read npdang's review).


have you tested both? a hunch tells me you have, as have I, and for car use IB in a door I actually prefer the sls.


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## andy335touring

FoxPro5 said:


> random question into this guy's review thread? Christ that's annoying.


Some one's easily annoyed 

It's not random as there's other folks talking about the SLS driver's(6's and 8's) in this thread, they seemed to have first hand experience with the drivers so i thought one of them might have also played with some HAT's. 

Worth an ask i thought ?

Sorry to the original poster if you feel this has infringed on your thread and i am gratefull of your review as i'd not heard of these SLS drivers before.

I will be happy to edit or delete my posts if you so wish ?


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## Ge0

FoxPro5 said:


> Just my couple of pennies, but if you want the "ultimate" IB midbass/woofer from Peerless, then try the XLS 8" (830491). Should edge the SLS out in a few key areas (read npdang's review).


Foxpro J, I am well aware of your success with the XLS driver. I enjoyed reading your write up comparing them to some of the best. I respect this. Thanks. I have also read NPdang's review. To be honest the XLS seems dreamy. Two problems with this train of thought though...

1.) No matter how nice the XLS is, the price/performance ratio is not there. My best guess is that there is a marginal improvement at the best (never got my hands on a set of XLS due to cash flow issues). A new set of SLS drivers goes for $100 less than a used set of XLS drivers these days. That is if you can find the XLS. They rarely come up for sale. You'll have a snow balls chance in hell to find them new. They were discontinued.

2.) What if you pop (damage) one? How long will it take to find a replacement?

Ge0


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## Ge0

FoxPro5 said:


> Search the forum rather than dropping your irrelevant, random question into this guy's review thread? Christ that's annoying.
> 
> Oh, and GOOD JOB Ge0!


Nice thanks. You are most welcome. I'll do ya one better...










(inside joke).

Ge0


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## Ge0

andy335touring said:


> Some one's easily annoyed
> 
> It's not random as there's other folks talking about the SLS driver's(6's and 8's) in this thread, they seemed to have first hand experience with the drivers so i thought one of them might have also played with some HAT's.
> 
> Worth an ask i thought ?
> 
> Sorry to the original poster if you feel this has infringed on your thread and i am gratefull of your review as i'd not heard of these SLS drivers before.
> 
> I will be happy to edit or delete my posts if you so wish ?


No problems here. This is an open discussion after all. I don't recollect a direct comparison between the SLS and XLS myself. But, if you search hard enough you will find a damn good review of the XLS vs. the L8. Let's just say, both have thier strengths.

Ge0


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## npdang

I really like looking at your doors, well done. It's amazing to me how different things were several years ago when people were still trying to cram these drivers into the stock, plastic baffles that came with the car!


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## Ge0

npdang said:


> I really like looking at your doors, well done. It's amazing to me how different things were several years ago when people were still trying to cram these drivers into the stock, plastic baffles that came with the car!


Thanks. But, I can't claim credit. I give credit where credit is due. 

Your cheap and effective door treatment thread has changed the way a lot of people think.

Ge0


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## FoxPro5

Ge0 said:


> Foxpro J, I am well aware of your success with the XLS driver. I enjoyed reading your write up comparing them to some of the best. I respect this. Thanks. I have also read NPdang's review. To be honest the XLS seems dreamy. Two problems with this train of thought though...
> 
> 1.) No matter how nice the XLS is, the price/performance ratio is not there. My best guess is that there is a marginal improvement at the best (never got my hands on a set of XLS due to cash flow issues). A new set of SLS drivers goes for $100 less than a used set of XLS drivers these days. That is if you can find the XLS. They rarely come up for sale. You'll have a snow balls chance in hell to find them new. They were discontinued.
> 
> 2.) What if you pop (damage) one? How long will it take to find a replacement?
> 
> Ge0


Both are very good points. The SLS is the "you cannot go wrong for the price" driver of the year, that's for sure. In my eyes though, that doesn't make it _better_. 

IMHO, after using both the SLS and XLS, I prefer the XLS. Since I didn't run them back to back in a direct A/B comparison cannot say for sure, but my finding was very similar to yours; the SLS just keep bringing it. They are more "agressive" where as the XLS are more "mild mannered." I did find, on the contrary however, that the SLS's cannot go forever and will begin to argue if you ask too much. Compared to what I remember from the XLS's as far as power handling goes, the XLS's hold their integrity better and give you more "refined" sound vs the SLS's "rugged" sound. 

I also chose the XLS 8 over the Legatia 8 in my own MB challenge, if that's worth anything to this discussion now that someone dropped the question.


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## FoxPro5

andy335touring said:


> It's not random as there's other folks talking about the SLS driver's(6's and 8's) in this thread, they seemed to have first hand experience with the drivers so i thought one of them might have also played with some HAT's.


What? This thread is a review of the SLS driver vs two others. They are all 6.5" drivers, not 8's. There are plenty of threads discussing 8" MB drivers. Why you felt like asking here doesn't make sense to me, is rude, and very annoying. But since Ge0 is kewl dood, keep it up!


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## KMelt

Scanspeak please


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## Hernan

A bit off topic but I'm using the Mpyres for some 4 month and I really like their midrange.
Midbass is more than OK. More than muy doors can handle. 
I have a 3 way frontstage and find me using them in a two way mode more...
They play very nice up to 1.8khz 6dB/oct.
Thay blend perfectly with the sub at 80hz.12/db.
Of course they feel at home playing lower but it's not my liking.


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## Hernan

A bit off topic but I'm using the Mpyres for some 4 month and I really like their midrange.
Midbass is more than OK. More than muy doors can handle. 
I have a 3 way frontstage and find me using them in a two way mode more...
They play very nice up to 1.8khz 6dB/oct.
Thay blend perfectly with the sub at 80hz.12/db.
Of course they feel at home playing lower but it's not my liking.


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## Ge0

KMelt said:


> Scanspeak please


What do you want to know about the Scans specifically? I am very familiar with them in a door mount application.

Ge0


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## Ge0

Hernan said:


> A bit off topic but I'm using the Mpyres for some 4 month and I really like their midrange.
> Midbass is more than OK. More than muy doors can handle.
> I have a 3 way frontstage and find me using them in a two way mode more...
> They play very nice up to 1.8khz 6dB/oct.
> Thay blend perfectly with the sub at 80hz.12/db.
> Of course they feel at home playing lower but it's not my liking.


Good to know. Thank you for sharing your experience with them in a two way config. As mentioned before, I used them strictly for midbass and crossed them over quite a bit lower.

Ge0


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## Ge0

Here is a comparison I just found on one of my old computers showing my results using the Scan 18W vs. Peerless SLS6.










All settings equal. No EQ or crossover. Just set the gain and tested both using pink noise at 90dB and TrueRTA software. ALL the same settings.

You'll notice the Scan is quite a bit more sensitive and has a lower bass extension. You'll also notice the Scan 18W KILLS the peerless in upper frequency extension (this my belief it is the perfect 2 way front stage solution). I had to boost the gain on the SLS6 to obtain proper spectral balance (equal to the scans output) in the midbass region. 

Keep in mind these graphs can be decieving. Beyond 90dB with x-over set at 50Hz, 24dB/octave or so the Peerless SLS6 takes over. The Scan makes a lot of mechanical noise when pushed hard (considered distortion). The Peerless does not.

If you listen to tunes at elevator background music levels then the Scan is the driver for you. I am being sarcastic of course. If you like Bone Crushing midbass at high volume levels in a car door look elsewhere, the Scan does not keep up. Try the SLS6... 

Ge0


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## bassfromspace

Ge0 said:


> Here is a comparison I just found on one of my old computers showing my results using the Scan 18W vs. Peerless SLS6.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All settings equal. No EQ or crossover. Just set the gain and tested both using pink noise at 90dB and TrueRTA software. ALL the same settings.
> 
> You'll notice the Scan is quite a bit more sensitive and has a lower bass extension. You'll also notice the Scan 18W KILLS the peerless in upper frequency extension (this my belief it is the perfect 2 way front stage solution). I had to boost the gain on the SLS6 to obtain proper spectral balance (equal to the scans output) in the midbass region.
> 
> Keep in mind these graphs can be decieving. Beyond 90dB with x-over set at 50Hz, 24dB/octave or so the Peerless SLS6 takes over. The Scan makes a lot of mechanical noise when pushed hard (considered distortion). The Peerless does not.
> 
> If you listen to tunes at elevator background music levels then the Scan is the driver for you. But, if you like Bone Crushing midbass at high volume levels in a car door look elsewhere...
> 
> Ge0


So, does the SLS6 not provide you with "bone crushing midbass at high volume levels in a car door"?


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## FoxPro5

Ge0 said:


> Keep in mind these graphs can be decieving. Beyond 90dB with x-over set at 50Hz, 24dB/octave or so the Peerless SLS6 takes over. The Scan makes a lot of mechanical noise when pushed hard (considered distortion). The Peerless does not.


So is that with the 18W crossed at 50 hz, 24 db/oct slope only? Or anytime you push it hard? What does this noise sound like? I don't believe I ever heard mine do such a thing. You hear it during normal music playback? Sry for all these q's Georgie.


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## Ge0

bassfromspace said:


> So, does the SLS6 not provide you with "bone crushing midbass at high volume levels in a car door"?


I can see your confusion in my last statement. The SLS6 offers an abundance of bass at high volume. The Scan 18W got fussy about it and did not like it.

Ge0


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## Ge0

FoxPro5 said:


> So is that with the 18W crossed at 50 hz, 24 db/oct slope only? Or anytime you push it hard? What does this noise sound like? I don't believe I ever heard mine do such a thing. You hear it during normal music playback? Sry for all these q's Georgie.


Mind you, God did not intend 6-1/2" drivers to play sub bass. I think the SLS6 is merely an abomination since it can. I need this abomination since Subwoofer system has a huge suckout at approximately 60Hz (has to do with vehicle dimensions or something of that nature).

The Scan got fussy ONLY at high volume 109dB and up crossed over at 50Hz/24db slopes, 60Hz/24dB slopes, and finally stopped at 68Hz/24dB slopes. Mind you, this only happened on occasion when playing music much louder than I should be. I could hear a loud rapping sound. I don't think it was the coil bottoming out. Perhaps just ran out of mechanical displacement. Nevertheless it did not sound good. I didn't want to rag on such an expensive driver.

Ge0


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## captainobvious

First off: Great review Geo! Sounds like you were about as enthusiastic as I was when I installed the SLS 8's in the doors for the first time.  GREAT drivers!


Second:


FoxPro5 said:


> Search the forum rather than dropping your irrelevant, random question into this guy's review thread? Christ that's annoying.
> 
> Oh, and GOOD JOB Ge0!





FoxPro5 said:


> What? This thread is a review of the SLS driver vs two others. They are all 6.5" drivers, not 8's. There are plenty of threads discussing 8" MB drivers. Why you felt like asking here doesn't make sense to me, is rude, and very annoying. But since Ge0 is kewl dood, keep it up!


??



FoxPro5 said:


> Just my couple of pennies, but if you want the "ultimate" IB midbass/woofer from Peerless, then try the XLS 8" (830491). Should edge the
> SLS out in a few key areas (read npdang's review).





FoxPro5 said:


> I also chose the XLS 8 over the Legatia 8 in my own MB challenge, if that's worth anything to this discussion now
> that someone dropped the question.


I thought only Spense got you riled up man :lol:

You must be having a hell of a month 

.


----------



## FoxPro5

captainobvious said:


> I thought only Spense got you riled up man
> 
> You must be having a hell of a month


Just added you to the list, ahole! 

But seriously, Ge0 takes all this time to write this up and gives great feedback and some turd drops some random question in. How aggravating. [said the guy who's easily aggravated :blush:]

And yes, it has been very HIGH flow for the past 3 months, thank you for your concern. 

Now back to your after school special, kids.......


----------



## RowJoe

How much power were you running to the SLS 6.5s? I'm going crazy trying to decide between the 6.5 or 8. I do like the 6.5's impedance a bit more since I'll have about 200w RMS at 4 ohms per side, but the loss in cone area bugs me. I don't really mind cutting up the doors, though. I just want the most output I can get for my money out of one pair, whichever version it may be.


----------



## captainobvious

RowJoe said:


> How much power were you running to the SLS 6.5s? I'm going crazy trying to decide between the 6.5 or 8. I do like the 6.5's impedance a bit more since I'll have about 200w RMS at 4 ohms per side, but the loss in cone area bugs me. I don't really mind cutting up the doors, though. I just want the most output I can get for my money out of one pair, whichever version it may be.


If you are brave enough to "make room" for the 8", I would go that route. More cone surface area. Even with 100 watts per side on these they will get moving.


----------



## AdamTaylor

how much wattage were you running to the SLS's you think 150rms would do them justice?


----------



## mrbrightside695

Being brand new to the forum, and DIY audio in general, I'd just like to say thanks to Ge0 for his review, it was quite a big help as I was looking at various drivers.

I'm debating the same decision as RowJoe, using the 6.5" or 8". I'll be using them as midbass, (tentatively) with a Cadence iA4 amp, bridged for 250W x2 @ 4 ohms, or 125W x2 @ 8 ohms. I have stock 8" "subs" in the doors right now, so either should install relatively easily. Will 125W be enough to get good sound quality out of the 8's? My current (tentative, until I can afford it) design for the system will also have a Fi Q sub-will the 6.5's blend better (assuming proper crossover and EQ settings) with their higher power?


----------



## Ge0

RowJoe said:


> How much power were you running to the SLS 6.5s? I'm going crazy trying to decide between the 6.5 or 8. I do like the 6.5's impedance a bit more since I'll have about 200w RMS at 4 ohms per side, but the loss in cone area bugs me. I don't really mind cutting up the doors, though. I just want the most output I can get for my money out of one pair, whichever version it may be.


Don't get me wrong. I love my SLS6's. But, if you have the room to fit the 8's and don't mind cutting **** up then definitely try the 8's. That is the next step in my evolution. I just don't have the time for the mod now...

200W is more than enough to make them sing.

Ge0


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## Ge0

mrbrightside695 said:


> Being brand new to the forum, and DIY audio in general, I'd just like to say thanks to Ge0 for his review, it was quite a big help as I was looking at various drivers.
> 
> I'm debating the same decision as RowJoe, using the 6.5" or 8". I'll be using them as midbass, (tentatively) with a Cadence iA4 amp, bridged for 250W x2 @ 4 ohms, or 125W x2 @ 8 ohms. I have stock 8" "subs" in the doors right now, so either should install relatively easily. Will 125W be enough to get good sound quality out of the 8's? My current (tentative, until I can afford it) design for the system will also have a Fi Q sub-will the 6.5's blend better (assuming proper crossover and EQ settings) with their higher power?


If you can fit the 8 then definitely do the 8. If you can't, then a 6 will be fine as long as your sub region can play strong up to 60Hz.

You power to drive them is just fine as long as you don't drop them down below 60Hz.

Ge0


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## gharu

sorry to chime in to this thread as a potential buyer of SLS 6 could anyone give me a feedback on how does it sound in comparision with 18w for freq between 60-315hz as thats the intended freq that im trying to get a driver to complete my set up which will be mated with SS12m..:


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## mrbrightside695

Ge0 said:


> If you can fit the 8 then definitely do the 8. If you can't, then a 6 will be fine as long as your sub region can play strong up to 60Hz.
> 
> You power to drive them is just fine as long as you don't drop them down below 60Hz.
> 
> Ge0


Thanks for the advice, I've decided to go with the 8's. The way I see it, if I don't like how they sound, I can sell them, or just deal with the $110 a pair would cost. Plus, the higher resistance for the 8's means less current, which certainly can't hurt the car's electrical system.


----------



## Ge0

gharu said:


> sorry to chime in to this thread as a potential buyer of SLS 6 could anyone give me a feedback on how does it sound in comparision with 18w for freq between 60-315hz as thats the intended freq that im trying to get a driver to complete my set up which will be mated with SS12m..:


Read this thread from post #1. You'll get you answer...

Ge0


----------



## Ge0

mrbrightside695 said:


> Thanks for the advice, I've decided to go with the 8's. The way I see it, if I don't like how they sound, I can sell them, or just deal with the $110 a pair would cost. Plus, the higher resistance for the 8's means less current, which certainly can't hurt the car's electrical system.


Don't fuss too much over 4ohm vs. 8ohm drivers until you look at the sensitivity between the two.

ge0


----------



## gharu

Quite a plain looking driver to the blind eye. Its response drops off like a brick wall above 500Hz. However, this sucker can POUND down in the lower octaves. I run mine from *50Hz up to 300Hz*. Unless I reach the upper extremes of its power handling I can't even tell they are there. These suckers take a licking and keep on ticking.

damm my bad didn't read it carefully:blush: have already ordered my SLS6 once its in I'll definitely post a review on it too..thanks man 
DIYMA rocks:rockstar:


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## SkodaTeam

A little offtopic. Guys, i have DLS MS6 midbass and i wanna something better,how do you compare SLS6 to DLS MS6?? A never heard Peerless :blush:


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## Bobo

Great info Ge0!



mvw2 said:


> 2-way with a wideband mid on-axis maybe.


What is a wideband mid? I'm wondering about the Peerless 6.5 for IB midbass in a 2 way deal, but it looks like it doesn't want to go above about 500hz. The good thing is I can put a 3.5" in the factory spot in my dash, but not sure what kinda options I have for 2 way there (got the amps for 2 way, guess I'd need one more for 3 way).


----------



## Ge0

Bobo said:


> Great info Ge0!
> 
> 
> 
> What is a wideband mid? I'm wondering about the Peerless 6.5 for IB midbass in a 2 way deal, but it looks like it doesn't want to go above about 500hz. The good thing is I can put a 3.5" in the factory spot in my dash, but not sure what kinda options I have for 2 way there (got the amps for 2 way, guess I'd need one more for 3 way).


Dude, just read the 1st page of my post. The SCAN 18W is hands down the best "wideband" midbass I have found PERIOD.

And I'm not just saying that because I am currently selling my spare set either...

Ge0


----------



## Bobo

So I'm guessing wideband means it operates well over a wide frequency range? The Scans would be beyond what I can spend, that's why the SLS looks nice, if I can figure out a 3-4" to pair with it. Actually just read about the 8" SLS more which may be doable in my car, just figuring out options.


----------



## Ge0

Bobo said:


> So I'm guessing wideband means it operates well over a wide frequency range? The Scans would be beyond what I can spend, that's why the SLS looks nice, if I can figure out a 3-4" to pair with it. Actually just read about the 8" SLS more which may be doable in my car, just figuring out options.


The SLS drivers ARE NOT intended for midrange. Look elsewhere. Perhaps a nice set of ID OEM Mids for you?

Ge0


----------



## Bobo

I read a bit about a new version (or two?) of the ID OEM. I'll be checking back in on that as I'm interested. Don't know much about those drivers except a lot of people seem to love em.


----------



## Ge0

Bobo said:


> I read a bit about a new version (or two?) of the ID OEM. I'll be checking back in on that as I'm interested. Don't know much about those drivers except a lot of people seem to love em.


They just seem right for you...

Read the reviews.

Ge0


----------



## blamus

Or you can try a 3" full range (like one of the fostex) to go with a SLS 6/8.

Which is what I am thinking - I have now got my 2" peerless fullrange up on the dash, and peerless HDS 6.5 mids in the doors, I always told myself that if the HDS arent enough, I can still turn them into SLS - thats the advatage of using full ranges on the dash - you can cross very very low. 

But after installing those 6.5s (lots of work) i'm thinking if I ever do need to upgrade, I am tempted with the 8s instead - but then so much more work!!!!


----------



## Billy Mays

blamus said:


> Or you can try a 3" full range (like one of the fostex) to go with a SLS 6/8.
> 
> Which is what I am thinking - I have now got my 2" peerless fullrange up on the dash, and peerless HDS 6.5 mids in the doors, I always told myself that if the HDS arent enough, I can still turn them into SLS - thats the advatage of using full ranges on the dash - you can cross very very low.
> 
> But after installing those 6.5s (lots of work) i'm thinking if I ever do need to upgrade, I am tempted with the 8s instead - but then so much more work!!!!


i was just going to ask this. i'm going to slowly develop a 3way setup and the plan was to go SLS and FR88 in two way then add tweets down the road.


----------



## Ge0

If you can install the SLS6 right (low loss system), and have a sub. There is no need for the 8" driver.

Ge0


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## Billy Mays

Ge0 said:


> If you can install the SLS6 right (low loss system), and have a sub. There is no need for the 8" driver.
> 
> Ge0


what do you mean low loss system? sub section is a single 12w6v2 that gets about 500w right now but i'm redoing the amps and will probably get 300 arc audio watts to it.


----------



## dBassHz

Another consideration for those deciding between the SLS6 and the SLS8 is the air space in your doors. The 8's t/s parameters dictate a need for a large enclosure. I have the SLS8s installed in my Forester (same body as the impreza) and I have to use 2 of my 7 mid EQ bands to lower the peak that I get in the 100Hz - 160Hz range.


----------



## bertholomey

Thank you very much Geo for that informative comparison. 

I am planning on making the plunge to 3 way, and the Peerless SLS 6.5" (8" if I can fit them) is what has been recommended. 

After reading this review - I have a lot more confidence that this driver will perform the task that it will be given. Now I just have to purchase, install, tune, and enjoy.


----------



## FoxPro5

You know Georgie, since so many have mentioned the SLS 8, I will just say I left the 8" MB world on the SLS 8's and returned to the 7" Scan Rev and I'm glad I did. I'm with you on what you said regarding the Scans nearly 100%. Spot on less the thing about the mechanical noise, which I either don't get or cannot hear. 

The only gripe I have with the 8" SLS (you know I gotta have a gripe) is that it might be too sub-like. I don't like my MB's to sound like a subs, is what I've learned in all my madness. Thing about the Scan's is they sort of magically transcend the band between the sub and midrange, sort of in a Dynaudio disappearing act kind of a way, but with some guts and determination (as apposed to Dyn which is weak like little girl and scared like wuss-bag...but I digress).

Keep up the car audio intelligence, yo! :thumbsup:


----------



## Ge0

FoxPro5 said:


> You know Georgie, since so many have mentioned the SLS 8, I will just say I left the 8" MB world on the SLS 8's and returned to the 7" Scan Rev and I'm glad I did. I'm with you on what you said regarding the Scans nearly 100%. Spot on less the thing about the mechanical noise, which I either don't get or cannot hear.


I've said this before. You only hear it when asking the 18W to pull duties more meant for a sub (50 to 60 Hz) at high volume. Otherwise they are perfect.



FoxPro5 said:


> The only gripe I have with the 8" SLS (you know I gotta have a gripe) is that it might be too sub-like. I don't like my MB's to sound like a subs, is what I've learned in all my madness. Thing about the Scan's is they sort of magically transcend the band between the sub and midrange, sort of in a Dynaudio disappearing act kind of a way, but with some guts and determination (as apposed to Dyn which is weak like little girl and scared like wuss-bag...but I digress).
> 
> Keep up the car audio intelligence, yo! :thumbsup:


Couldn't agree with you more about the Scans. I don't have any experience with the Dyn Midbasses. I broke off my hunt for a set shortly after reading your review of them. I'm sure it was just user error () but I stayed away from them none the less. 

Ge0


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## Ge0

bertholomey said:


> Thank you very much Geo for that informative comparison.
> 
> I am planning on making the plunge to 3 way, and the Peerless SLS 6.5" (8" if I can fit them) is what has been recommended.
> 
> After reading this review - I have a lot more confidence that this driver will perform the task that it will be given. Now I just have to purchase, install, tune, and enjoy.


Glad my opinion was help to you. Let us know how things turn out.

Ge0


----------



## Ge0

Billy Mays said:


> what do you mean low loss system?


Installed in a location with a rock solid strong baffle and low front to back wave cancellation. Don't mount these fuggers on a floppy door panel that has not been re-enforced and does not have the access holes plugged up. You'll never hear their full potential.

Ge0


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## mSaLL150

theothermike said:


> if you go 8 i also suggest you go with 8" exclusives.
> 
> flatter response than the sls8 and stays flat from 300 - 400 down to about 70where it slopes slightly down real low.
> 
> not much more than sls 8 but definately better distortion figures. and could be used in 2 way with large format low fs tweeter


How high could those 8" exclusives play in a door? Could they be crossed as high as 2k?


----------



## blamus

lol, think of them as subs, the SLS 6 plays up to 500Hz I think, use your imagination for the 8s!


----------



## mSaLL150

blamus said:


> lol, think of them as subs, the SLS 6 plays up to 500Hz I think, use your imagination for the 8s!


Exclusive 8s vs. SLS 8s. Two VERY different model lines. I think you are confused...


----------



## blamus

ooops, i am, sorry about that, i thought u were talking about sls because of the thread title.

I have studied the exclusive's graphs but havnt seen the 8" one, so I cannot help : (


----------



## mSaLL150

blamus said:


> ooops, i am, sorry about that, i thought u were talking about sls because of the thread title.
> 
> I have studied the exclusive's graphs but havnt seen the 8" one, so I cannot help : (


No problem. I am just curious if these Exclusive 8" have any potential in a 2-way like stated in the quote above.


----------



## RowJoe

FoxPro5 said:


> You know Georgie, since so many have mentioned the SLS 8, I will just say I left the 8" MB world on the SLS 8's and returned to the 7" Scan Rev and I'm glad I did. I'm with you on what you said regarding the Scans nearly 100%. Spot on less the thing about the mechanical noise, which I either don't get or cannot hear.
> 
> The only gripe I have with the 8" SLS (you know I gotta have a gripe) is that it might be too sub-like. I don't like my MB's to sound like a subs, is what I've learned in all my madness. Thing about the Scan's is they sort of magically transcend the band between the sub and midrange, sort of in a Dynaudio disappearing act kind of a way, but with some guts and determination (as apposed to Dyn which is weak like little girl and scared like wuss-bag...but I digress).
> 
> Keep up the car audio intelligence, yo! :thumbsup:


Just out of curiosity, which MB would you recommend for someone on a ~$150/pair budget?


----------



## invinsible

Can anyone tell me how does the SLS6 perform against the Morel Elate SW6 and Dynaudio MW162GT? I am looking for a midbass driver that could handle freq from 50/63hz to 200hz at 150RMS.


----------



## DavidT

Ignore this. Posting so I can enter the Klippel section acording to the rules of this forum. Appologize for this interruption.

David


----------



## instalher

i plan on buying a pair on tuesday to fit my kick panels. they are sealed at about .2 ft3 will they work in that small of a box? xover is 24db/oct. from 70 to 500 hz. running into a pair of dayton rs52 and tang band ceramic tweeters up in the a pillars... for power i have 110 watts, jbl/crown.... right now my energy cant play anything in there below 120 hz... but man they have tons of midrange!!!!!


----------



## thisgsx

jeezus, did you ever manage to get that door panel back on?


----------



## Ge0

bertholomey said:


> Thank you very much Geo for that informative comparison.
> 
> I am planning on making the plunge to 3 way, and the Peerless SLS 6.5" (8" if I can fit them) is what has been recommended.
> 
> After reading this review - I have a lot more confidence that this driver will perform the task that it will be given. Now I just have to purchase, install, tune, and enjoy.


You're welcome. Just let us w about YOUR trials and tribulations.

Ge0


----------



## Ge0

thisgsx said:


> jeezus, did you ever manage to get that door panel back on?


Who, ME? Well of course. AND I have room to spare. I can fit an 8" with some work. But, I ask myself why??? The 6.5 has me smiling...

Ge0


----------



## The Drake

FoxPro5 said:


> You know Georgie, since so many have mentioned the SLS 8, I will just say I left the 8" MB world on the SLS 8's and returned to the 7" Scan Rev and I'm glad I did.


I went the opposite way you went  Had the 7" revs first and then moved on to the SLS 8's and I couldnt be happier with that switch. Guess it just depends on what you are looking for in a midbass/midrange.


----------



## thisgsx

Ge0 said:


> Who, ME? Well of course. AND I have room to spare. I can fit an 8" with some work. But, I ask myself why??? The 6.5 has me smiling...
> 
> Ge0


Damn lucky you. I had my previous set up like yours and my door panel wouldnt go back on.


----------



## subwoofery

I remember reading Patrick's post regarding midbass and "snappy sound". 
I know we shouldn't look at specs that much but I feel that the voice coil inductance (Le) is way too high on the SLS: 1.5mH for the 6.5" - 2.1mH for the 8". 

As we all know, the Le figure can help determine how high driver can play - that might explain why the SLS drivers can't play past 1khz. 

On the other hand, I've found one driver that I might try (midbass duty only) that should serve well: 
Eminence BETA-8A, 8" Woofer from Madisound 
Best part is that it is a cheap driver (SLS 8" cheap) - high sensitivity - uber high power handling with a really low inductance

Can anyone comment on my thoughts? 
Kelvin


----------



## Ge0

subwoofery said:


> I remember reading Patrick's post regarding midbass and "snappy sound".
> I know we shouldn't look at specs that much but I feel that the voice coil inductance (Le) is way too high on the SLS: 1.5mH for the 6.5" - 2.1mH for the 8".
> 
> As we all know, the Le figure can help determine how high driver can play - that might explain why the SLS drivers can't play past 1khz.
> 
> On the other hand, I've found one driver that I might try (midbass duty only) that should serve well:
> Eminence BETA-8A, 8" Woofer from Madisound
> Best part is that it is a cheap driver (SLS 8" cheap) - high sensitivity - uber high power handling with a really low inductance
> 
> Can anyone comment on my thoughts?
> Kelvin


A higher inductance means more energy can be stored in the coil. A side effect is that it takes longer for this energy to be stored and then to transform into mechanical energy. What does this mean? A lower usable frequency response?

I can live with that as long as I'm using the SLS's as a dedicted midbass. They seem to be plenty "punchy" to me when limited to 300Hz.

Ge0


----------



## blamus

Eminence BETA-8A with 3mm xmax, I hope its more snappy!


----------



## Ge0

Ge0 said:


> A higher inductance means more energy can be stored in the coil. A side effect is that it takes longer for this energy to be stored and then to transform into mechanical energy. What does this mean? A lower usable frequency response?
> 
> I can live with that as long as I'm using the SLS's as a dedicted midbass. They seem to be plenty "punchy" to me when limited to 300Hz.
> 
> Ge0


I forgot to mention, a higher energy build up in the coil means a stronger motor force. Thus the reason for its slammin midbass and lack of high end. Think of the SLS more as a woofer than a midrange and you'll be fine.

Gee oh...


----------



## cvjoint

Hey GeO,

I was just about to pull the trigger on some B&C drivers for midbass when I saw the SLS6 on Madi, and remembered how bad ass they are. 

I have a contender for the midbass position. How about the 6ndl either the 38 or 44 ending models. 6mm of xmax and ~92db sensitivity. I know down at 50hz the SLS6 would probably own, but where do you think they tie and the B&C starts to gain up. I mean if it's around 80hz the B&C might be the winner...for me. I understand you have the little dip at 60hz, but i'm hoping I wont haha. Noise wise I think the BC will be the clear winner with a slim rounded neo magnet and thin spokes. 

GEo


----------



## t3sn4f2

cvjoint said:


> Hey GeO,
> 
> I was just about to pull the trigger on some B&C drivers for midbass when I saw the SLS6 on Madi, and remembered how bad ass they are.
> 
> I have a contender for the midbass position. How about the 6ndl either the 38 or 44 ending models. 6mm of xmax and ~92db sensitivity. I know down at 50hz the SLS6 would probably own, but where do you think they tie and the B&C starts to gain up. I mean if it's around 80hz the B&C might be the winner...for me. I understand you have the little dip at 60hz, but i'm hoping I wont haha. Noise wise I think the BC will be the clear winner with a slim rounded neo magnet and thin spokes.
> 
> GEo


Not Ge0 but I recall this post.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/438466-post14.html


----------



## cvjoint

t3sn4f2 said:


> Not Ge0 but I recall this post.
> 
> http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/438466-post14.html


Wow, you got good memory 2008! 
I used the 8s when I commented on that thread...for midrange haha. I don't have that kinda space anymore.


----------



## joo89

nice review


----------



## Ge0

Reviving the dead for the youngins to see


----------



## Ge0

Wow. Now that's reviving the dead . Thx Gill

Ge0


----------



## Gill

Stumbled upon it, while searching for 18W, ironically almost made mind to order SLS as replacement for MW162.


----------

