# Stereo Integrity HT18 Infinite Baffle Build



## rich20730

I decided to replace my 8" Boston Acoustics HTIB powered sub with dual 18" attic mounted manifold.

Equipment:
- (2) Stereo Integrity HT 18 D2
- Behringer EP 4000 power amp (950 watts per channel RMS @ 4ohms)
- MiniDSP 2x4 Balanced
- Denon AVR-591


Subs:


















Building the manifold:

I used 3/4" MDF on the outside and 3/4" birch ply on the inside. It's 24" tall and the opening is 16"x21"



























The subs are rear mounted and attached with clamps and hurricane nuts:


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## rich20730

I added some 2x4's to the existing ceiling joists where I planned to put the manifold:










Hole cut:

















Cut away the drywall to expose the 2x4's I added:









Struggled to fit the manifold through the air conditioning ducts:









And not without some casualties:









Manifold finally in place:


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## fish

Nice! How do they sound? I have a bass reflex design I may use a pair of these for HT, but they're big cabs.


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## rich20730

Added some trim around the opening:


















Grill:

Test fit before adding grill cloth:









I originally planned to attach the grill with neodymium magnets, but the ones I ordered were too small to hold the grill on with the cloth in place so I just ended up using velcro



















Finished result:


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## rich20730

fish said:


> Nice! How do they sound? I have a bass reflex design I may use a pair of these for HT, but they're big cabs.


They sound awesome. It's definitely a different experience compared to a HTIB sub or even a movie theater. They shake the whole house, but they sound totally natural and not boomy or obnoxious. I just finished doing some tuning with the MiniDSP and REW and I got it flat down to about 10hz near reference levels without running out of excursion or amplifier headroom. I'll post a few graphs when I get a chance.


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## rich20730

Here's the response before EQ with no smoothing. Fairly flat down to 20hz, but pretty sharp drop of about 10db below that:










Here's the response after EQ with no smoothing. I did some significant boosting below 20hz, but lowered the overall gains to compensate. Even at high levels the subs don't seem to strain and the amp has plenty of headroom:










Here's the full range response EQ vs. No EQ with 1/3 octave smoothing:


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## lionelc5

Where in TX are you? I am in the Houston area and I have been dying to give this a try. I am in a two story and living room is on the first floor so I cant do the atic thing. But I do have a wall next to the garage that will work. 

I dont have the testing equipment to properly EQ the set up, I was hopeing for a little advice on that side of it.

Also, how did you decide on the subs?
I was thinking about 4 of the Dayton IB 15s or just 4 of the Dayton "Clasic" 18s.

With the higher excusion, the 15s seem to model better, but I just dont know enough to make a good choice.


LionelC


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## ErinH

Looks very nice. Great finish work!

IB installs have always concerned me when it comes to structural integrity, so I was curious to see your take on that.


regarding the response below 20hz, what is your mic's FR rating? it's possible it just doesn't have good response (or any notional response) below 20hz. If so, you may be boosting something that doesn't need it. Just something worth thinking about.


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## rich20730

lionelc5 said:


> Where in TX are you? I am in the Houston area and I have been dying to give this a try. I am in a two story and living room is on the first floor so I cant do the atic thing. But I do have a wall next to the garage that will work.
> 
> I dont have the testing equipment to properly EQ the set up, I was hopeing for a little advice on that side of it.
> 
> Also, how did you decide on the subs?
> I was thinking about 4 of the Dayton IB 15s or just 4 of the Dayton "Clasic" 18s.
> 
> With the higher excusion, the 15s seem to model better, but I just dont know enough to make a good choice.
> 
> 
> LionelC


I'm in Longview. It's about 3 hours north of Houston straight up 59. I highly recommend doing an IB setup if you've got the adjacent room/space for the back-wave. This is my first home theater build and even though I don't have any experience in fabrication or woodwork it really wasn't that difficult. I installed a couple IDmax 12's IB in my car last year and I was hooked.

For EQ and room correction, if you have a laptop you can download Room EQ Wizard for free and pick up a calibrated measurement mic and USB preamp pretty cheap.

As for which sub, I knew I wanted to go with 18's to maximize my cone area. I looked at the Dayton Reference 18" RSS460HO and the Fi IB318, but the Dayton was out of stock at the time and the IB3's have to be built before they ship. Plus the HT18 has more linear excursion than the Dayton and is cheaper than the other two.


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## rich20730

bikinpunk said:


> Looks very nice. Great finish work!
> 
> IB installs have always concerned me when it comes to structural integrity, so I was curious to see your take on that.
> 
> 
> regarding the response below 20hz, what is your mic's FR rating? it's possible it just doesn't have good response (or any notional response) below 20hz. If so, you may be boosting something that doesn't need it. Just something worth thinking about.


Thanks! I'm about to start building some cabinets for the Zaph Revelator Tower kit so that should really test my ability to achieve a clean-looking finish. I could end up with some really nice sounding ugly speakers.

I'm pretty clueless about construction standards and whatnot, but it seems like most of the time you should be able to install an IB setup without cutting into or compromising any load bearing structures. I did have to secure the drywall after cutting the hole through it, but that just required gluing the exposed edges to the new 2x4's.

As far as movement or stress from woofer excursion, I read that by having the subs firing toward each other, it cancels out a lot of the potential strain on the manifold and attached structures. After setting everything up I spent a lot of time testing the subs by playing bass heavy material and the manifold was dead still, even with crazy excursion from the subs. I did, however, have to put some extra caulk on one of my windows and some Dynamat on the back some of my wall hangings to stop them from rattling.

That's a good point about the measurement mic response below 20hz. I'm using the Dayton EMM-6 and the specs list the frequency response as only 18hz-20khz. Also, it looks like the calibration file values only go down to 20hz. My sound card has some rolloff below 20hz which is accounted for in the REW calibration process, but aside from loading the mic calibration file into REW, I completely forgot about the mic.

Having said that, just based on eyeballing the excursion while playing some familiar low bass tracks (Bass I love You etc.) before applying the boosts below 20hz, I was getting nowhere near the excursion on the HT18's as I do on my Idmax 12's at a similar output level.


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## rich20730

bikinpunk said:


> Looks very nice. Great finish work!
> 
> IB installs have always concerned me when it comes to structural integrity, so I was curious to see your take on that.
> 
> 
> regarding the response below 20hz, what is your mic's FR rating? it's possible it just doesn't have good response (or any notional response) below 20hz. If so, you may be boosting something that doesn't need it. Just something worth thinking about.


By the way, I don't post much on here, but I do a lot of reading and I wanted to say that I appreciate all the time and effort you've put into testing speakers and providing measurement data for this forum. When it comes to home and car audio, it's often difficult to find reliable objective information among all the subjective opinions and conflicting points of view so it's refreshing to see these topics approached in a more scientific manner.


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## lionelc5

Are the 2-18s enough? You see so many IB set-up with 8-15s and so on, could you concieve needing 4-18s for your set up?


LionelC


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## rich20730

2 18's is more than enough for me. The room is 17' x 17' with an 8 foot ceiling. The main listening position is about 8' from the subs. I think the reason most people use more is simply because they can. Since the price for each sub is relatively cheap, it doesn't cost you any additional space, it doesn't require much amplifier power, and it takes a fair amount of time and energy to construct, I think people just go ahead and use more subs.


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## Booger

Time for a giant Center channel speaker!!! lol


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## rich20730

Started working on the Revelator Towers this week. Thought about going with the 2.5 way, but since I don't listen that loud and it would have cost 50% more I bought the 2-way kit, ported

The Madisound Speaker Store

The cabinets will be MDF with veneer on the front, top and back. The sides will be painted black. The sides are 1 1/4" thick and the baffle is 1 1/2". The rest is 3/4"

Since the thickest MDF Home Depot has is 3/4" I had to laminate pieces together for the baffle and sides




























I'm not sure how much bracing I need. This is all I have so far. Might add more later



















Filled in the gaps with bondo and sanded


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## rich20730

I temporarily attached the baffles with screws so I could to trim, sand and fit the baffles to match the rest of the cabinets. I cut the edge of the baffle at an angle to reduce the baffle width from 10 inches to 9 inches at the front.


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## rich20730

Speaker kit came in the mail today. Those scans sure are pretty.










I also found some raw mottled makore veneer on sale at veneersupplies.com. I don't know why, but I have a sudden craving for bacon.



















Got the cabinets sealed sanded and primed. I used a mixture of Titebond II and water for sealing. It seemed like the glue/water mixture raised the grain a little on the mdf and made it rougher. Next time I'm going to try some Zinsser Seal Coat and see if I get better results.



















I glued the veneer for the baffles using Titebond Cold Press Veneer glue and clamped the two baffles together with a sheet of 3/4 MDF in between. I was pretty worried that I would somehow mess this up, but it turned out okay. No bubbles, no edges pealing up.



















Same thing with the back of the cabinets. I will see how that turns out in the morning.


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## ousooner2

Looks great Rich!!

I'm debating DIY'ing the 18" Dayton HO build. Using a 4cuft flat pack from diysoundgroup so it shouldn't be too hard I wouldn't think. He already cuts the recess for the driver, bracing...everything! lol. Not sure how I'd finish it, but if I go the veneer route I'll definitely PM you for tips. 

Also!....I just found this DVD-r in my car. Yes....that one lol. I thought I had sent you this already, but obviously I haven't. I'll reburn you a copy since I've picked up a few other discs to go along with the Autosound, Focal, etc.


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## oilman

Thanks for sharing this. I've been wanting to tackle subs in the attic and this was a big help.


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## rich20730

oilman said:


> Thanks for sharing this. I've been wanting to tackle subs in the attic and this was a big help.


No problem! I'm happy to help out if you have any questions about it.



ousooner2 said:


> Looks great Rich!!
> 
> I'm debating DIY'ing the 18" Dayton HO build. Using a 4cuft flat pack from diysoundgroup so it shouldn't be too hard I wouldn't think. He already cuts the recess for the driver, bracing...everything! lol. Not sure how I'd finish it, but if I go the veneer route I'll definitely PM you for tips.
> 
> Also!....I just found this DVD-r in my car. Yes....that one lol. I thought I had sent you this already, but obviously I haven't. I'll reburn you a copy since I've picked up a few other discs to go along with the Autosound, Focal, etc.


Thanks man. The Dayton HO looks like a nice sub. It was on my short list for the IB build. Good review on data-bass: Data-Bass

The veneering wasn't nearly as difficult as I expected it to be. Went fairly smooth, aside from snapping off a few edges while trying to roll out the bubbles. If you do veneer for your sub, you'd probably have to go with some sort of paper-backed veneer. I'm guessing it's pretty hard to find raw veneer big enough for an 18 inch sub box. It'd have to be a big ass tree.

Don't worry about the Autosound discs. I already bought them a while back, but still haven't taken the time to do any critical listening with them. Someday hopefully...

Here's a few updated pics of the tower build:

I decided to flush mount the terminal cups. It took quite a bit more time than surface mounting, but I'm happy with the result.

















Cut the driver and port holes









Chamfered the rear side of the driver cut out
/IMG]









Crossovers and internal damping:

















Test run before finishing process:









I used nitrocellulose lacquer for the veneer finish. This stuff is great. Dries in minutes/seconds and is easy to fix when you mess up. Read a post online about using a chamois with a 50/50 mix of lacquer thinner and denatured alcohol to "pull" the lacquer to get rid of orange peel and other imperfections. The technique worked so good I don't think I'll even do any sanding.


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## highly

Gorgeous! I'm jealous


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## rich20730

Thanks!


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## chevbowtie22

Amazing work!


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## rich20730

I added a few more layers of primer and sanded down to 400 grit then painted with PPG single-stage 2K gloss black. The paint laid down pretty well, but not without some orange peel:










I tried wet sanding with 2000 grit, but it quickly became apparent that I needed to start with a coarser grit or it would take forever. Tried 1500, 1000, and then finally 600. I probably should have gone no lower than 1000, but 600 cuts so much quicker. Of course, I sanded through the paint in several spots along the edges 










Sanding through the paint was annoying, but nothing compared to what happened next. While sanding, I noticed that some of the masking tape was peeling up. When I peeled the tape back further to inspect it, the tape peeled the veneer right off :furious:

I was so mad, I pulled up the rest of the masking tape, which was no easy task. I was able to peel it off using a blow dryer to soften the adhesive, but not without destroying the veneer in several places.




























Since the masking tape debacle yesterday, I've decided to take a break from completing the finishing process until I'm in a better state of mind. I just glued the broken veneer pieces back on, cleaned off the tape residue with some naphtha, reinstalled the drivers, and stuck the speakers back in my living room. 

Thank goodness these things make beautiful music :rockon:

Pictures of everything reassembled:


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## Schramm

You have used your space very wisely. The Zaph Audio ZRT design is top notch and you executed well on the build, especially with minimal equipment. I have built some high end furniture and am very impressed. I have found it hard to get a good paint job without expensive equipment. I had the pleasure of using automotive grade spray equipment with 2 part epoxy paint and obtained awesome results. Very expensive paint, but worth it.

Have you considered improving the acoustics of the room itself? Significant improvements can be made for a few hundred dollars if done well. Perhaps try centering the speakers and TV in the room if possible. Wood floors are great for lively acoustics but you may still benefit from bass traps in the corners and Dow Corning acoustic fiberglass panels hung on the walls. Drywall and 4-6" of cellulose insulation on the ceiling is still quite transparent to low frequencies. Those subwoofers are extremely powerful. It would be great if you could line the attic with mass loaded vinyl, but at $1 + per square foot, it is not cost effective. I have an idea which I have never seen implemented, but would try myself. Have you considered lining the ceiling above the room with densely packed hay bales? They can be sprayed with a fire retardant. As long as your roof structure could bear the additional weight, it would be extremely effective sound barrier, lower your heating costs, and be low cost.


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## ousooner2

Lower than dang TV now Rich! :laugh:


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## rich20730

ousooner2 said:


> Lower than dang TV now Rich! :laugh:


Ha. Yea, I didn't give it much thought when I installed the mount. Once I stuck the TV on there I realized how high it was, but I didn't care enough to move it. Doesn't bother me at all now.



Schramm said:


> You have used your space very wisely. The Zaph Audio ZRT design is top notch and you executed well on the build, especially with minimal equipment. I have built some high end furniture and am very impressed. I have found it hard to get a good paint job without expensive equipment. I had the pleasure of using automotive grade spray equipment with 2 part epoxy paint and obtained awesome results. Very expensive paint, but worth it.
> 
> Have you considered improving the acoustics of the room itself? Significant improvements can be made for a few hundred dollars if done well. Perhaps try centering the speakers and TV in the room if possible. Wood floors are great for lively acoustics but you may still benefit from bass traps in the corners and Dow Corning acoustic fiberglass panels hung on the walls. Drywall and 4-6" of cellulose insulation on the ceiling is still quite transparent to low frequencies. Those subwoofers are extremely powerful. It would be great if you could line the attic with mass loaded vinyl, but at $1 + per square foot, it is not cost effective. I have an idea which I have never seen implemented, but would try myself. Have you considered lining the ceiling above the room with densely packed hay bales? They can be sprayed with a fire retardant. As long as your roof structure could bear the additional weight, it would be extremely effective sound barrier, lower your heating costs, and be low cost.


Thanks for the input. Your comments prompted me to start looking into acoustic treatments. I made some phone calls today and found a local supplier that had some Conwed 2-inch, 6-7 PFC glass fiberboard leftover from a commercial job. http://www.conweddesignscape.com/docs/products/wallpanels/ds_ACT.pdf They gave me a pretty good price so I bought what they had left, which was one 2'X6' panel and two 30"X48" panels.

Now I just need to figure out how and where to mount this stuff. Most of the corners where the walls meet would be problematic due to proximity to windows, doors, and the hallway so I will probably first try to mount some where the ceiling meets the walls and then pick a couple other spots if I have any panels left over.

I'll take some more pictures of the room layout when I get a chance, but here are a couple pics of the panels I picked up:


























The hay bale idea definitely sounds interesting. I don't see why it wouldn't work as a sound barrier/absorber, but I'd be a little concerned about it causing unforeseen or unintended consequences like attracting wild animals and pests into my attic or voiding my insurance policy etc.


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL

The local police department recently built two precincts, and used hay bales for the wall insulation. Build an inner layer of concrete, then hay bales, then built cinder blocks around the outside of the hay bales. Of course, there were some construction delays, and the north side precinct had its hay bales burned twice before completion.


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## rich20730

Hmm... Only caught fire twice ey? Lol


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL

Bad side of town, no one around at night when it was just the framework of the building, and I'm sure the hay was an extremely tempting target for pyro's. We have someone that comes out every winter and burns our trash bins to the ground too, as the guy that dumps the bins, nothing smells worse than a burnt out trash bin.


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## thisgsx

Can this sub be used for car audio? SQ wise, how does it sound?


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## WLDock

thisgsx said:


> Can this sub be used for car audio?


Bass is Bass! just have to model the enclosure to get a desired result. The transfer function or bass boost in a car allows for a smaller enclosure....thank god because these need some big boxes in the home...but not too bad if one goes sealed:
Stereo Integrity | HT Subwoofers
Data-Bass




thisgsx said:


> SQ wise, how does it sound?





rich20730 said:


> They sound awesome. It's definitely a different experience compared to a HTIB sub or even a movie theater. They shake the whole house, but they sound totally natural and not boomy or obnoxious. I just finished doing some tuning with the MiniDSP and REW and I got it flat down to about 10hz near reference levels without running out of excursion or amplifier headroom. I'll post a few graphs when I get a chance.



To the OP Rich, Nice build! Now you need a BIG screen to match the BIG sound. Time for a 60"-70" upgrade. I really want to do an IB install myself. I'm renting now but the next house I buy its on! I have the BIG screen, 73" but have yet to put together the BIG bass. A single sealed 15" HSU Research ULS-15 was in my sights but now I think I will build my own sub for my HT needs. One of these combined with a 500 watt BASH amp would be just right for my taste and SO much cheaper than the HSU.


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## rich20730

thisgsx said:


> Can this sub be used for car audio? SQ wise, how does it sound?


Like WLDock said, I don't see any reason it wouldn't work well in a car application, as long as you have enough trunk/cargo space to fit the right size box or IB setup. Compared to the dual Idmax IB I have in my car, the HT18's sound significantly better. I really like the Idmax's, but the HT18's just sound smoother and cleaner.

You can take that with a grain of salt though since it's not a fair comparison - dual 18's vs. 12's, home vs. car environment, different crossover points, different midbass speakers etc.



WLDock said:


> To the OP Rich, Nice build! Now you need a BIG screen to match the BIG sound. Time for a 60"-70" upgrade. I really want to do an IB install myself. I'm renting now but the next house I buy its on! I have the BIG screen, 73" but have yet to put together the BIG bass. A single sealed 15" HSU Research ULS-15 was in my sights but now I think I will build my own sub for my HT needs. One of these combined with a 500 watt BASH amp would be just right for my taste and SO much cheaper than the HSU.


Thanks! Yea, a new TV is definitely on my radar, but in the interest of keeping my wife happy, I'll probably lay off of the big purchases for at least a while. I'm already on thin ice for sticking these big ugly bass traps all over the living room 

I got the traps mounted today - One on the back wall, three in the corners, and two hanging from the ceiling. I bought some fabric to replace the burlap material that came on the panels, but I ran out of fabric before I could finish the ones on the ceiling so they currently look pretty terrible.

I did some testing with REW, but since I didn't save my last full-range measurement I couldn't directly compare anything over 200 Hz. From a quick glance, the bass traps didn't have any effect under 100hz, but they tamed a few peaks between 100hz and 200hz. One thing I did notice was that when I ran Audyssey, it set the high pass on the towers to 90hz. Up until now it has never set my fronts to less than 150hz 

Pictures:

Broke up some paint stirrers and used them as anchors in the fiberglass:


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## thisgsx

rich20730 said:


> Like WLDock said, I don't see any reason it wouldn't work well in a car application, as long as you have enough trunk/cargo space to fit the right size box or IB setup. Compared to the dual Idmax IB I have in my car, the HT18's sound significantly better. I really like the Idmax's, but the HT18's just sound smoother and cleaner.
> 
> You can take that with a grain of salt though since it's not a fair comparison - dual 18's vs. 12's, home vs. car environment, different crossover points, different midbass speakers etc.


Excellent. I used to have a single 12 Idmax so I am familiar with how it sounds. If you say it sounds smoother and cleaner, I'll take your word for it, even though I know it's car vs. home, at least I have an idea of how it'll sound. This may be my next sub. Besides, the 600 watts rms is perfect for me as well because I only have 500 watts on tap.


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## Electrodynamic

Nice build!


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## rich20730

Thanks! Your subs are awesome :thumbsup:

Here's a few updates: 

I did some more experimenting with some homemade bass traps. I made a frame out of MDF, filled it with fluffy fiberglass, and put it in the fireplace. I also stuck a large roll of fiberglass in the cavity behind the frame. It's a gas fireplace and we've never used it in the 6 years we've lived in this house so covering it up is not a problem, plus the extra insulation will probably save us a little on our energy bill and it keeps my son from playing in there.


















I bought some blow-in fiberglass packs and wrapped them in fabric and put them in the corners under the ones I had. 

















I ran several measurements in REW before and after installing the bass traps and I will post the results when I get some time.

I started back on the finishing work. I'm pretty happy with the veneer, but the paint is a PITA. I didn't want to do a full re-coat and have to sand everything again so I tried using a foam brush to paint over just the spots and edges where I sanded through the paint. It turned out thick and uneven and I ended up sanding through in several other spots. I masked everything back up to shoot another coat with the spray gun, but the needle packing was leaking and needs to be replaced. Rather than being reasonable and waiting until the spray gun parts come, I decided to try the black gloss rattle cans I had in my garage. The color looked the same when I sprayed it on some scrap, but once I sprayed it on the speakers it is obviously not the same and is very noticeable. I managed to sand through several places again anyway. Oh well... I'll do a full re-coat later with the gun and try not to sand through again next time.










I sanded everything to 2000 grit and buffed out the finish just to see how it would look when it's done. The parts that I didn't screw up look pretty good.

Pics:


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## MikeGratton

Beautiful work!! and great timeline/build report


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## fish

Wow! Absolutely beautiful!


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## rich20730

Thanks guys. There are several problems that I still need to fix, but hopefully I'll be able to wrap this project up pretty soon. Just gotta figure out how to shoot a smooth top coat and not screw up the sanding again. I'm thinking about adding some more reducer to the mix and going straight to 2000 grit for sanding.


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## BP1Fanatic

AWESOME build!


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## scotty_hall

Nice man. I've run an IB in two different houses. You can't beat them for clarity and detail.


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## req

i dont know how i missed your build here man.

this looks awesome. its funny that you looked at my car build and went that route - and now im doing the same thing you already did in your house haha. i just have not gotten around to it.

did you use those pipe clamps to hold the drivers in place? or did you buy specific brackets for that?

your 18's are facing eachother and push\push to negate vibrations, or are they push\pull? i relaly like how you finished the hole in the cieling.


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## rich20730

req said:


> i dont know how i missed your build here man.
> 
> this looks awesome. its funny that you looked at my car build and went that route - and now im doing the same thing you already did in your house haha. i just have not gotten around to it.
> 
> did you use those pipe clamps to hold the drivers in place? or did you buy specific brackets for that?
> 
> your 18's are facing eachother and push\push to negate vibrations, or are they push\pull? i relaly like how you finished the hole in the cieling.


Thanks! I bought this clamp kit here: Speaker Grill Clamp Kit, Steel, Screws, T-Nuts, 4 Pack, A-517 I needed 4 of them (16 clamps) to mount the subs. Came out to $30 with shipping. Kind of a rip off, but I was too lazy to make some myself.

They are push/push. There is hardly any movement from the manifold.


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## req

awesome. 

basically exactly the design\plan i had in my head, except mine will be firing into the vertical wall of a vaulted cieling instead of down into the room.

i only have two 100w plate amps for now haha. seems like ill need a bit more power to have some fun


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## rich20730

Got a new center channel: Kef Q600c. Was going to try building one myself, but wussed out and decided to buy one instead. I've been using one of my Zaph ZA5 2-way's as a center. Built them several months ago and now I can finally move them to surround duty like I had planned.

Man thing is huge! - 31lbs


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL

How does that thing sound?


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## rich20730

TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL said:


> How does that thing sound?


Don't know yet. Fresh out of the box. Hopefully I'll get a chance to hook it up and have a listen tonight when I get home from work.


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## rich20730

Over the past few months I've updated several things:

- Installed the KEF Q600c center channel
- Replaced the 7 year-old 46" Samsung LCD with a 60" Panasonic ST60 plasma
- Replaced the Denon 5.1 channel AVR with an Onkyo TX-NR818 7.1 receiver
- Installed the Zaph ZA 5.2's as rear surrounds and mounted the Boston satellites in the ceiling for surround left and right.

Most recently, I've started experimenting with a quasi Geddes-style multi-sub setup. 

To go with the IB18's I picked up a couple Polk PSW10 powered subs and hooked up an IDQ10V3 to the second channel of the EP-4000.

Since my home theater setup is also my living room, I'm somewhat limited regarding where I can place each sub. 

With the MiniDSP, each sub has its own independent gain, delay, and EQ so hopefully that should alleviate some of the issues with placement.

Here are some pictures of the current setup:


















































As I continue to experiment with sub placement and tuning, I plan to post some of my measurements and findings as things progress.


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## BP1Fanatic

Nice setup!


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## rich20730

^Thanks!


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## WLDock

rich20730 said:


> Got a new center channel: Kef Q600c. Man thing is huge! - 31lbs


So how do you like the Q series? I'm thinking about trying out KEF in my own system. Finally, have some plans for bass...I just bought one of the closeout HT15's. It should be fun.


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## rich20730

WLDock said:


> So how do you like the Q series? I'm thinking about trying out KEF in my own system. Finally, have some plans for bass...I just bought one of the closeout HT15's. It should be fun.


I've been really happy with the Q center so far, although I tend to be happy with most of the audio equipment that I buy, so take it with a grain of salt. Before making a purchase, I typically spend all of my time reading and looking at objective criteria rather than listening to the actual product because I honestly don't trust my ears to be all that discriminating.

With that said, here are a few observations:

The coaxial driver seemed like a good alternative to using a traditional horizontal MTM as a center channel and I can definitely say that it sounds great, even over a wide seating area. Dialogue on TV and movies sounds clear and intelligible from anywhere in the room.

When listening to music, I don't notice any degradation in tonal quality or imaging when I switch from stereo with the Scan Revelator fronts to multichannel with the Q600 center. Of course, Dolby and Audyssey XT32 may have something to do with this.

In terms of output, the Q600 doesn't sound strained at high volumes and has no trouble keeping up with my mains. I'm not sure what the exact efficiency numbers are, but my receiver sets the Q600 at minus 3dB compared to the scans when running Audyssey.

Overall, I'm very satisfied with the Q600c. I'd definitely buy more KEF speakers in the future and, based on price/performance, I think the Q series is a really good value.

What are you looking to buy? Mains/Center/Surrounds?

I know a lot of people recommend buying two pairs of Q100's or Q300's for LCR and selling the extra speaker online.

What closeout on the HT15's? Is it still going on?


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## WLDock

Right now I have a Polk system, CS400i center, RT3000P mains, F/X1000 surrounds. I've listened to the previous Q series and have been wanting to hear the current stuff(I will soon.) I have a crazy idea of trying the center...then maybe trying a set of Q300 in place of the satellites on top of the RT3000 bass modules. Then, see how the surrounds sound and maybe move the RT3000 satellites to the rear for a 7.1 system. Who knows how it will sound...or how well it would blend? Its something I've been thinking about. I really like the smaller KEF egg speakers that I have.

Anyway, that's down the line a bit...I need to get the sub in and built. But , Yes SI is clearing out the HT line of subs, the prices have been reduced to $145 for the 15", $162 for the 18" Stereo Integrity | Order Online

Hey, nice drivers in your car system...the exact same 3-way I was trying to put together a couple of years ago. I sold off everything and focused on HT, but one day I will get the car together.


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## ErinH

I wondered about the voicing between the Scan and the Kef center channel myself. 

After buying a set of the Q100's to test last year, I fell in love with the Kef products. Using a set of the R500's in my home now and have considered stepping up to the R900. Right now I have the R200c for center, and still have the Q100's as rear-surrounds. 

I have read quite a few people on avsforum state the difference between the Q and R-series for HT use isn't entirely worth the jump in price, but if you listen to music at all, then it certainly is. The R-series drivers are a step up, namely due to their use of a shorting ring on the mid and the ribbed cone, for mode damping. Comparing the Q to the R-series I have, the biggest difference to me comes when you get on the volume. The Q-series drivers' breakup is more noticeable at high(er) output, where the R-series driver shows no fatigue. 

The LS50 has nothing but stellar reviews, but for what we are doing, they wouldn't really fit the bill given the size of the room. That said, the driver certainly has piqued my interest as it is a step up above the R-series concentric, using a shorting ring on the tweeter and a neo magnet. Now, those, I'd love to get my hands on to test out. I just can't justify it to myself. 

Anyway, definitely still following this build. Was most interested to see the kef center being used with the Scan surrounds, and was curious if you thought you may wind up going to the kefs for a better 'match', but I get the impression you don't see the point.


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## WLDock

This quick review alone makes me want to check out the Q line: http://www.amazon.com/review/R2BWRG...e=UTF8&ASIN=B0048LOES6&linkCode=&nodeID=&tag=


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## ErinH

I wouldn't hesitate to recommend Kef products. So, I say pull the trigger.


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## Patrick Bateman

This thread is basically a perfect example of how to do home theater bass without breaking the bank. Great finish too.

One thing you might consider is flipping one woofer. Push-pull lowers second harmonic distortion. The effect is quite noticeable. When I did it using a pair of cheap $25 MCM woofers, it was like the difference between listening to my Diyma 12s and listening to a Pyle subwoofer.

Basically one of the biggest differences between cheap subs and expensive subs is distortion, and push-pull lowers it.


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## gckless

Flamed wood is so sexy. Very nicely done, all of it.


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