# Arizona Power Company



## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

I've just received an "Arizona Power Company - 10000 Limited Edition" Amplifier

I received it as part of a craig's list trade as I was interested in it's shape.

This amp is silver, about 3 feet long, and 6 inches wide. It isn't the heaviest amp, but I was told it is some kind of Dr Crankenstein competition amp.

I'll post a photo ASAP. Thanks for any info.


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## TWiZTiD859 (Mar 1, 2011)

Never heard of them but i would like to see a pic.


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

Made in the USA



















http://i1225.photobucket.com/albums/ee384/ninachan401/ArizonaPowerCompany.jpg?t=1301966233

http://i1225.photobucket.com/albums/ee384/ninachan401/ArizPCX-Over.jpg?t=1301966310

http://i1225.photobucket.com/albums/ee384/ninachan401/ArizPCTerminals.jpg?t=1301966345


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## Notloudenuf (Sep 14, 2008)

Sweet amp. This probably doesn't mean anything but the heatsink looks like an old school US Amps heatsink.
Look at this one for reference US Amps 50hc | eBay


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

It powers up, doesn't seem to have any on-board fuses, I wish I had some more info on it.


The kid I got it from knew nothing about it, but claimed it was stable @ 1ohm.


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

Anyone have an idea of the value or collectability of this amp?

I may be getting rid of it before I have a chance to give it a listen.


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## St. Dark (Mar 19, 2008)

Never heard of it...maybe an off-brand? Interesting name, though.


You're missing the rivet that secures the filter switch to the chassis; be careful if you move the switch so you don't knock any of it's contacts from the mainboard.


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

St. Dark said:


> missing the rivet that secures the filter switch to the chassis; be careful if you move the switch so you don't knock any of it's contacts from the mainboard.


Good call, I've already flicked the switch once without noticing, and that is the important one, at least it is on LP now.

The sound was clean, but the amp was making a little bit of a hiss/hum, THE AMP, not the output. Any ideas?


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## austin4heatwave (Feb 22, 2009)

check out this link scroll down to the middle of the page there is another az pwr c amp a 4000

Crap VS. Quality - Page 8


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

austin4heatwave said:


> another az pwr c amp a 4000
> 
> Crap VS. Quality - Page 8


Doesn't seem to have much going on inside...


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## Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX (Oct 24, 2007)

Dam, that's a BIG bish...:laugh:


Crack that sucker open and have a look-see...


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## jasonspgt (Aug 25, 2011)

This amp looks just like my dr. crankenstein m-1200cx amplifier.. Id have to see the bottom to be sure.. Is the bottom a clear acrylic?


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

jasonspgt said:


> Is the bottom a clear acrylic?


The bottom is solid black, thin plastic. In fact it was cracked, so I stuck it back together with a Knu Koncepts sticker.

I think I deleted the photos I had of it. It had knobs for the crossover and gain, I'm not sure if it had a subsonic or not.


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## jasonspgt (Aug 25, 2011)

I wonder if someone painted it or replaced the original clear acrylic because it got broke or something.. I could definately tell you what it was if i could see the board


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## dman (Dec 21, 2008)

yep, just a Dr. Cranky... 

[SOLD]dr crankenstein m-1200cx super rare - Car Audio Classifieds


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## dman (Dec 21, 2008)

that thing has NO nuts inside it at all... guestimating at 500 watts, lol, 3' for that.. sell it while you can for something.....

I have a amp that I am confused about - Car Audio Classifieds


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## jasonspgt (Aug 25, 2011)

Ive been talking with the OP and he said he has already sold it.. I like these old crankenstein amps.. In my opinion they are still better than most of what is sold today..


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## envisionelec (Dec 14, 2005)

jasonspgt said:


> Ive been talking with the OP and he said he has already sold it.. I like these old crankenstein amps.. In my opinion they are still better than most of what is sold today..


Not even.

The stuff with the LM3886 amps inside are well...50W per channel, non bridgeable.

The Big 10000 is also nothing special. It seems Dr. Crank made "datasheet" designs. Poorly executed copies made by someone that doesn't really understand amplifier engineering.

The LM3886-based amps were sold at Walmart at one point.


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## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

I would guess 2x200rms, but hard to say. Still that is not bad for an old class AB. The shape is just for show. Someone should measure the rail voltage that might give an idea of output possible more than any guess. Those outputs are usually the type that can handle 50rms per pair, and there are 4 pair each side...but that is just a guess it could always be less. If more then they are pushing the limits, get the number off the transistor they can all be looked up for power ratings.

It might in fact be 2x250 at 2 ohms and 2x150-200 at 4 ohms. That would make for 500rms bridged and 1,000 peak. A lot of amps rated that way are a true rating, except some really cheap brands that add some bs to that. And 500rms on subs is not that bad, will cause owners to like it well enough, especially in the past when 1kw amps were not common.

I have an ultra linear with 12 outputs that is around 2x150rms, very similar to an older hifonics with the same rating....though I bet the hifonics puts out more with similar parts they are likely better parts and it also doubles at 2 ohms that is 600rms rated bridged. Cheaper amps might not double.

The 4ch in the other link is interesting that is an IC amp they are not very common. It did have a power supply but pretty tiny one I only saw two transistors on the sink that is odd. Unless it was not a PS then its just a junky 12v amp. Most of the better IC amps used the larger STK ICs and even a 2x60 had a PS double or more than that one, if that is a PS and steps up the voltage.


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## jasonspgt (Aug 25, 2011)

Theres no need to guess.. Its true rating is 200X2.. And i still say its a better amp than a lot of the crap they make today because it was made in the USA.. Most amps and car audio today is made in china or malaysia etc etc and the quality control is really crappy.. Even rockford fosgate has started making their stuff overseas now which is why i only buy old school car audio now..

I have a decent amount of old school dr. crankenstein stuff that ive aquired over a long time including a dr. crankenstein m-1200-cx amp and 2 m-80 amps they also made.. One of the m-80 amps is brand new and still in the box.. On the warranty information it says that if repairs are needed that the amp needs to be sent to riviera beach florida.. That leads me to believe that US amps down in florida made these amps.. At least some of them..

The reason i say some of them is because when i look at both of my m-80 amps from them at the same time i notice a few things different.. On the brand new one thats still in the box it has a way eariler production number on it and has a sticker on the inside that says made in usa.. But on the other one with a later production number it says built in usa and is engraved in the board.. Now we all know made in usa and built in usa usually mean two different things so it is definately possible that before they went out of business they were building stuff cheaper but im not 100 percent sure on that..

All im saying is that in my opinion the stuff they made was better than a lot of the crap thats made today.. But of course thats just my opinion


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## WhippingBoy (Dec 21, 2010)

jasonspgt said:


> Theres no need to guess.. Its true rating is 200X2.. And i still say its a better amp than a lot of the crap they make today because it was made in the USA.. Most amps and car audio today is made in china or malaysia etc etc and the quality control is really crappy.. Even rockford fosgate has started making their stuff overseas now which is why i only buy old school car audio now..
> 
> I have a decent amount of old school dr. crankenstein stuff that ive aquired over a long time including a dr. crankenstein m-1200-cx amp and 2 m-80 amps they also made.. One of the m-80 amps is brand new and still in the box.. On the warranty information it says that if repairs are needed that the amp needs to be sent to riviera beach florida.. That leads me to believe that US amps down in florida made these amps.. At least some of them..
> 
> ...


You are correct - made by US Amps. Well, the M-80s were made by US Amps. Not sure about the AZ PC amps. US Amps designed the M-80s as well. Nothing special but decent.


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## envisionelec (Dec 14, 2005)

sqshoestring said:


> The 4ch in the other link is interesting that is an IC amp they are not very common. It did have a power supply but pretty tiny one I only saw two transistors on the sink that is odd. Unless it was not a PS then its just a junky 12v amp. Most of the better IC amps used the larger STK ICs and even a 2x60 had a PS double or more than that one, if that is a PS and steps up the voltage.


The M80 has two MosFETs in the power supply. How is that weird? It only need to develop around 100W with 250W peaks. Since it was running 4 ohm loads, the rails weren't much more than 28V.


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## envisionelec (Dec 14, 2005)

jasonspgt said:


> Theres no need to guess.. Its true rating is 200X2.. And i still say its a better amp than a lot of the crap they make today because it was made in the USA.. Most amps and car audio today is made in china or malaysia etc etc and the quality control is really crappy.. Even rockford fosgate has started making their stuff overseas now which is why i only buy old school car audio now..
> 
> I have a decent amount of old school dr. crankenstein stuff that ive aquired over a long time including a dr. crankenstein m-1200-cx amp and 2 m-80 amps they also made.. One of the m-80 amps is brand new and still in the box.. On the warranty information it says that if repairs are needed that the amp needs to be sent to riviera beach florida.. That leads me to believe that US amps down in florida made these amps.. At least some of them..
> 
> ...


A) Not everything made *today* is crap.
B) It was marginal. Like US Amps Merlin series (the first ones with LM3886 amplifiers...heheh)


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

The AZ Power Company 10000 LE Lives on the Rhode Island Craig's List.

It's famous. It was however, also able to drive an SSA Dcon 12" nicely @4ohms bridged when benched for 10min. 

It did have a physical hum which kind of irked me out.

For the record this is not a classified listing, but more so a directory listing:

3 real nice amps here forsale $$$


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## minbari (Mar 3, 2011)

waldojeffershead said:


> It did have a physical hum which kind of irked me out.


more than likely just transformer hum. dont see it much on audio amplifiers since they use toriodial transformers. but I bet that is what it is.


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## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

envisionelec said:


> The M80 has two MosFETs in the power supply. How is that weird? It only need to develop around 100W with 250W peaks. Since it was running 4 ohm loads, the rails weren't much more than 28V.


Its odd because I rarely see it even in smaller amps. So it is a 4x30? No 2 ohm capability certainly would reduce power demand. Those do look like beefy clamp bars. You have to love the cheap china amps where the bars bend when you tighten down the tiny screw that is about as big around as a fly's azz.


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## envisionelec (Dec 14, 2005)

sqshoestring said:


> Its odd because I rarely see it even in smaller amps. So it is a 4x30? No 2 ohm capability certainly would reduce power demand. Those do look like beefy clamp bars. You have to love the cheap china amps where the bars bend when you tighten down the tiny screw that is about as big around as a fly's azz.


Ah, gotcha.

Right, the 3886 chip is 30W into 8 ohm loads and 50W into 4 ohms. No 2 ohm loads.

They also clipped HARD due to the circuitry implemented by National. It was called SpiKe and limited current to about 5A, die temperature dependent. I built _many_ amplifier designs around this chip in the early 2000's. 

It's a moderately capable part, but in my opinion, a terrible choice for car audio due to the elevated operating temperatures. It's a "black box" solution. Audio in, Audio out. Few components. It's idiot-resistant (not idiot proof). I have licensed a clipping reduction circuit for the IC which has been since patented by RR Cordell, a good friend of mine. But outside a closed-loop system like a set of powered speakers, it's a poor choice compared to a discrete solution.


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## jasonspgt (Aug 25, 2011)

envisionelec said:


> A) Not everything made *today* is crap.
> B) It was marginal. Like US Amps Merlin series (the first ones with LM3886 amplifiers...heheh)


Your right.. Not everything made today is crap.. Just most of it.. If its made overseas its crap.. Just my opinion..


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## envisionelec (Dec 14, 2005)

jasonspgt said:


> Your right.. Not everything made today is crap.. Just most of it.. If its made overseas its crap.. Just my opinion..


Yes and no. If it's designed overseas or the parts are sourced willy-nilly from disreputable sources (and most are), then yes - they're generally crap.

But we Americans can just as easily design some crap. I work for just such a company, and it's a big one that should know better...


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## waldojeffershead (Jun 6, 2010)

envisionelec said:


> Yes and no. If it's designed overseas or the parts are sourced willy-nilly from disreputable sources (and most are), then yes - they're generally crap.
> 
> But we Americans can just as easily design some crap. I work for just such a company, and it's a big one that should know better...


Customer service is key, and the general reputation of the designer/brand.

I do however sometimes cave on price point or find myself paying face value to witness the hype surrounding certain products.

There is just something fulfilling about buying a USA based company's product and it actually being a satisfying product.

Be it PPI, JL, Zed, or Zuki. I've even given SSA a fair shake recently, should have sprung for the icon instead of the dcon.

Anyway there are some great pieces out there, but you really need to comparison shop and do some research.


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## jasonspgt (Aug 25, 2011)

I agree with you both.. However, if our country (and i say that because 95 percent of our country does the bulk of their business overseas now) kept most of its business here in america our country would NOT be in the bad shape its in now.. Sending all of our work overseas is putting our people out of work and putting our country in a bind.. Its as simple as that.. Things have changed a lot over the years and not just with car audio.. Basically everything we have now is made overseas.. WE as a country should not be depending on other countries that much for things we need.. I will give you an example.. Rockford fosgate once made products proudly here in america.. Now not even their top of the line products are made here.. Now rockford is a pretty big company so im sure when they stopped giving a dam about their quality they stopped giving a dam about their people too.. Its big companies like them that are hurting our people so they can make more money.. So if and when i can ill buy an american made product.. To me the qualitys better, the quality control is better and i know that im supporting my country..


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