# BRAX MX4 vs. BRAX GS2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX



## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

*BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*

Hello I need advice from anywone who had first hand experience with:
a. Brax Matrix MX4
b. Brax Graphic GX2400
c. Zapco Z-150.6LX

I was planning to get a Zapco Z-150.6LX for my build:
http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...d-sony-zapco-dynaudio-morel-maybe-jl-etc.html

but now I am rethinking my choices...
you see, I am not planning to upgrade or change anything after I am done with this system... 
so I thought... maybe I should open my eyes more and try to get the best equipment available... and be done forever...
so I started researching and it seemed that
Brax Matrix MX4 always mention as one of the best amp out there...
that also meet my "aesthetic criteria" 
Problem is that mean I need to "adjust" my budget if I decide with Brax Matrix MX4

If I buy Brax Matrix MX4, it will power the front channel 2 way active (Dynaudio Esotar 650 and 110),
then I still need to buy 2 channel amp for my rear fill, but I think a Zapco Z150.2LX should be more than enough for rear fill since it is only driving a Morel Hybrid Integra 602 coaxial anyway...

But...
before I make final decision, I want to ask for public opinion...
From the paper spec, the Brax Graphic GX2400 looks like it is just a less powerful version of Brax Matrix MX4 and without the D/A Converter/Digital Input of the Brax Matrix MX4. 
I do NOT need a Digital Input anyway and at 150watt per channel the GX2400 have the same exact power rating as the Zapco Z150.6LX... which I think should be enough to drive the Esotars
plus the GX2400 spec in THD and S/N ratio looks the same as the Matrix MX4

Today, someone with experience already give me advice that the Brax MX4 do sounds much better than the GX2400... and I appreciate his expert advice but I still want to hear more opinions...

so...
everyone who have experience with Brax Matrix MX4, Brax Graphic GX2400 and Zapco Z150.6LX...
please share it with me on how they compare...

ps: I am not interested in other amplifier like Audison or Sinfoni or Arc or Phoenix Gold or Mosconi etc. so please kindly keep the comparison with the 3 amps above...

Thank You in advance


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



BMW Alpina said:


> Hello I need advice from anywone who had first hand experience with:
> a. Brax Matrix MX4
> b. Brax Graphic GX2400
> c. Zapco Z-150.6LX
> ...




When I tested my MX4 if found it to be very “German” it’s like single file in a straight line - if not straight it’s not straight no compromise. If you get what I am saying...

I think the amp is so well built and so true to source that some may find it a little dry or clinical sounding...

Make no mistake it’s a brilliant amp. 

There are other more “musical” amps out there - the Brax amps are very source and speaker dependent - the Dyns will be good enough just make sure your source is good as well

Personally I preferred the more musical HV Venti...

Don’t think you can go wrong with the Brax as well superb built quality and specs...


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

I’m local to you and while I have never heard a Brax (I run Tru, Sinfoni and Zapco), they are definitely on the short list of amps I want to try. I would love to hear it if you go that way.

TomT


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



Elektra said:


> When I tested my MX4 if found it to be very “German” it’s like single file in a straight line - if not straight it’s not straight no compromise. If you get what I am saying...
> 
> I think the amp is so well built and so true to source that some may find it a little dry or clinical sounding...
> 
> ...


Thanks Elektra,

Have you had a chance to hear Brax Graphic GX2400?

Thanks


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



BMW Alpina said:


> Thanks Elektra,
> 
> Have you had a chance to hear Brax Graphic GX2400?
> 
> Thanks




No but I think it would sound similar only less power..


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

I would honestly put the money into the install, processor and tuning of the vehicle. As long as the amp you buy properly powers the speakers you have, looks how you want it to look for aesthetics, and has good build quality (reliable with no noise floor), then the differences will be minimal. Tuning/install will play a much bigger role in how your systems sounds.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

Niebur3 said:


> I would honestly put the money into the install, processor and tuning of the vehicle. As long as the amp you buy properly powers the speakers you have, looks how you want it to look for aesthetics, and has good build quality (reliable with no noise floor), then the differences will be minimal. Tuning/install will play a much bigger role in how your systems sounds.


Thanks for your advice Niebur3,

I intend (and already purchase) Zapco ASP-X4 Analog Crossover so no DSP 
due to several technical reasons that I wrote on my build thread. 

My plan had always been to learn how to tune everything myself and of course install it myself.
If I make mistake, I will learn from it and improve upon it until perfect. 
Just like what I did in building/customizing this car (Supercharged with custom design 6 piston Brembo braking system) 

Being an Engineer as my education and my line of work of course help me to understand and learn fast, plus the cost saving from the install and tuning will allow me to buy the best equipment.

If there is an investment I would do is perhaps to buy a Real Time Analyzer myself, just like I buy my own wheel alignment tools for my car.

I just don't want to buy a very good amp and later be disappointed that I didn't buy the best amp available which will make me go upset and have to sell the "very good amp" at huge loss then buy the nicer amp and have to redo the amp rack etc etc ........ 

So I am now trying to determine and made up my mind if Brax MX-4 is really the best amp for me that will make me forever happy and don't want have the itch in the future to upgrade 
or if GX2400 is already enough,
or the Zapco Z150.6LX is actually better in term of sound quality that I am looking for compare to the Braxs...


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*

Woah.. slow down. Buy a decent dsp first before spending thousands on amps

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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



SkizeR said:


> Woah.. slow down. Buy a decent dsp first before spending thousands on amps
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


I really think no DSP needed because the Sony RSX-GS9 already have a very good time alignment function. Yes, the EQ adjustment is not that powerful, but I think it will be enough for my application.
And if I later I think I make mistake and change my mind and need DSP, it is only a purchase away 

Right now I want to use full analog after the Sony RSX-GS9 thus why I had purchased the Zapco ASP-X4.

My car already have full sound deadening applied though with layers of (Acoustic Foam, MLV, Closed Cell Foam, CLD Tiles)... applied back in 2013

https://www.fitfreak.net/forums/2nd...stic-foam-mlv-closed-ceal-foam-cld-tiles.html

note: if I buy nice DSP now with just decent amp,
then like I said, I will have the itch to upgrade to the best amp later and I will have to sell the decent amp at loss and pay more for the best amp...
if I buy the best amp now, I can just buy the best available DSP later,
and lose only few buck on the Zapco ASP-X4 analog xover...


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*

Your doing yourself a disservice, especially considering the nice gear. Time alignment is the least of the issues. It's independent channel eq that makes them so helpful.

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## mmiller (Mar 7, 2008)

I would rather run a couple class A/B Sony amps from Walmart and a good DSP, that a $4,000 anp with an anologue EQ, makes no sense at all. System with the DSP amd cheap amp’s will be 100X better.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

mmiller said:


> I would rather run a couple class A/B Sony amps from Walmart and a good DSP, that a $4,000 anp with an anologue EQ, makes no sense at all. System with the DSP amd cheap amp’s will be 100X better.


Everybody have different ear and preferences and you might be right (for what you are looking for),
but I want to focus on finding information between this 3 amps and what I am looking for in my system.


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## benny z (Mar 17, 2008)

I agree with the comments to spend the money on a processor/tuning, and optimizing the install, long before purchasing any Holy Grail amplifier.


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## mmiller (Mar 7, 2008)

BMW Alpina said:


> Everybody have different ear and preferences and you might be right (for what you are looking for),
> but I want to focus on finding information between this 3 amps and what I am looking for in my system.


Well..... I’ve heard some of the highest regarded Compitition vehicles in NA, so my ears have a pretty good reference between what sounds right, and what doesn’t.... And what will, or will not work.

If you want to spend $4,000 on an amplifier, and put it through an EQ you could buy at RadioShack in 1990, going ahead. As I and others are trying to point you in the right direction.

Regardless, I’ve owned a Zapco LX 650.6 and it’s a very good amp, low noise floor, lots of power. you’re going to get 90% of the what the brax is capable of for $3000 less.... and maybe pick up a processor for $4-500. Unless your trying to win a World championship, or have lots of money with a high end install, Brax doesn’t make sense. Zapco LX amps are awesome.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

benny z said:


> I agree with the comments to spend the money on a processor/tuning, and optimizing the install, long before purchasing any Holy Grail amplifier.


On my build thread I had explain several time why I choose my path,
but I guess I really have to explain my methodology and my specific case:

a. Sony RSX-GS9 have the ESS Sabre ES9018S DAC chip that can decode DSD,
but it's optical output cannot output at the same resolution, so if I want to maintain the resolution, I need to output via Analog signal (RCA).

b. If I use outboard DSP, that mean another A/D and D/A conversion taking place inside the DSP, and I don't like this concept, plus the D/A chip inside the DSP might be inferior to the ESS Sabre ES9018S DAC chip inside the Sony RSX-GS9 so that feel like a downgrade of the signal quality from the Sony.

c. The Sony RSX-GS9 not only have excellent Digital section, it also have excellent Analog (op-amp) section courtesy of the MUSES 8920E op-amp,
and again the outboard DSP might not have as good as analog output section as the Sony RSX-GS9 so it might be another downgrade, not to mention passing through another op-amp in the DSP.

d. The Sony RSX-GS9 have excellent time alignment setting
Each of the 4 channel (Front/Rear/Left/Right) and Subwoofer can have their position adjusted with range between 1cm to 350cm from your listening position, at the increment of 1cm... that is very precise for me, I mean, if you just slanted your head a bit, it is already 1cm distance, so this is good enough for me.
I also updated my firmware to version 12, I think that is why I can also adjust the subwoofer position even in USB-DAC input mode, while the owner manual say, the sub position is not available during USB-DAC input mode...

I will utilize this capability by using the Front Channel (Left/Right) to drive Front Tweeter and Rear Channel (Left/Right) to drive Front Mid-Bass
This will allow me to have full time alignment for each driver.

e. Then I will use the Zapco ASP-X4 ANALOG Crossover 
*(not Analog EQ but Analog Crossover) *
to cut the freq in the analog domain (thus maintain the resolution from the Sony RSX-GS9) and feed an amplifier that will powered 2 way front active Dynaudio Esotar speaker.
Notice that Zapco build this ASP-X4 with the same capacitor and op-amp as in their LX amplifier amp so that is why my plan was to get Zapco LX amp because it is a perfect match in term of Analog circuit with the Xover.

f. EQ function, although the Sony RSX-GS9 do not have individual channel EQ capability, it do have basic all channel 10 band EQ which help if really needed. But I plan to bypass the EQ function anyway for the most undisturbed signal as possible. Will this resulted in a perfectly flat frequency response using tone signal (pink noise)?
of course not. But I am not looking for that perfectly flat freq response.
Why because I want to keep it as natural as possible, I don't need a perfect beauty, I am just looking for as natural as possible even it is not perfect.

You see, in some famous opera house that have imperfect acoustic response, people would actually say, that is the character of that opera house even though it is actually flawed.

Car environment is also flawed but I am not looking to go to competition and have car audio competition judge measure the response curve while the engine is off and the car is stationery.

I am looking to enjoy my music in my daily driver.
The wind noise when I drive fast,
The noise generated by my Michelin Pilot SuperSport tire on the rough freeway of California,
the whine from my Sprintex Supercharger,
the induction noise from my Mugen intake,
the exhaust sound from my free flow exhaust system,
all induce their own noise and freq response which make a fully flat EQ response from my soundsystem (when engine if off and car is stationary) no longer relevance for me (again for me, not for many of you guys who plan to
compete or follow the competition guideline).

Still, as you had see from the sample list of things I installed on my car above,
I really want to buy the best equipment available (don't have to be the most expensive, if the Zapco amp turn out to be better, than I will choose Zapco).
Eventhough I might not use the potential to the max, but I just want to have it.

Everybody have different taste and goal, my goal is not the norm but that is my goal.

I mean how many people who buy Koenigsegg or Pagani or Ferrari ever drive their car to the highest potential possible, not much...
but most of them just want to enjoy it as much as they can just like me.

I hope this explain enough...
and last, if someday I want a DSP, it's only a purchase away.
but if buy the amplifier that is not the best at this moment of purchase, I will feel bad and will be force to buy a better one making me losing more money in the process.

So far, from all the input I gather here and privately, it looks like I am going to get the Brax MX-4 

Wow, that is a long post 
so if anybody have personal experience with the 3 amps above,
please kindly help me


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

BMW Alpina said:


> On my build thread I had explain several time why I choose my path,
> 
> but I guess I really have to explain my methodology and my specific case:
> 
> ...




I had the Z150.6... it was a joke took it back the next day for a refund. I presume the LX amps are better but I won’t touch Zapco amps 

If I had to choose from your list assuming cash isn’t a problem - get the MX amp

If you want to spend a little less get the GX amps...

Consider warranty and piece of mind in your equation as well Brax amps can be repaired 20 years later - there warranty is better and you buying in house German design and built products

Zapco you buying a name built by the lowest bidder in Korea....

There is your answer...


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

Elektra said:


> I had the Z150.6... it was a joke took it back the next day for a refund. I presume the LX amps are better but I won’t touch Zapco amps
> 
> If I had to choose from your list assuming cash isn’t a problem - get the MX amp
> 
> ...


Thanks for honest and no holds barred answer Elektra,
This kind of answer is what I really hope I can gather (and processed) from all the experience member here.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

BMW Alpina said:


> Thanks for honest and no holds barred answer Elektra,
> 
> This kind of answer is what I really hope I can gather (and processed) from all the experience member here.




Just get what you want and if you like the design and aesthetics of the product not to mention the manner in which it was made then go for it..

Makes good power has specs nobody else can match and has appeal in the used market once your done with it...

I would not get the Zapco personally... dunno if mine was dud but it sounded god awful to me nothing I did in the tuning dept made any difference - it sounded crap! 

I took it back and swopped it for a unknown brand called EOS which was like Angles singing in heaven compared to the Zapco 

Turns out the EOS was a Ground Zero Ref 4 without the bling and sounded absolutely lovely...

That was years ago...

Only 2 weeks ago did I repurchase that same EOS amp back so now it’s safely in my cupboard on top of my HV Venti...

I haven’t compared the EOS to the MX amps but I will compare it against my HV Venti next weekend if I get a chance...




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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

You're concerned about an extra DA conversion, but not concerned about how much you are limiting yourself by not having independent left/right EQ (among other things). I understand you have a plan and want to stick to it, but you really should know (if you didn't pick up from other people's input) that an extra conversion is negligible compared to the impact that a strong DSP will make. You are spending a lot of money on top of the line gear, that won't sound as good as a system costing a fraction of what you're doing. My point is, this system sounds a lot more like you're showing off than trying to build a proper SQ system. If sound quality is really a priority then you will not be able to optimize your system without DSP and buying luxury amps and a hi-res player will be a waste. If you can't match the left and right response, then you will not get the staging and imaging of a proper system. Sorry, but your plan is much more show than go. You're system will be much more expensive than most, but won't sound as good, without a DSP that's just the truth.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

gijoe said:


> You're concerned about an extra DA conversion, but not concerned about how much you are limiting yourself by not having independent left/right EQ (among other things). I understand you have a plan and want to stick to it, but you really should know (if you didn't pick up from other people's input) that an extra conversion is negligible compared to the impact that a strong DSP will make. You are spending a lot of money on top of the line gear, that won't sound as good as a system costing a fraction of what you're doing. My point is, this system sounds a lot more like you're showing off than trying to build a proper SQ system. If sound quality is really a priority then you will not be able to optimize your system without DSP and buying luxury amps and a hi-res player will be a waste. If you can't match the left and right response, then you will not get the staging and imaging of a proper system. Sorry, but your plan is much more show than go. You're system will be much more expensive than most, but won't sound as good, without a DSP that's just the truth.


From what I believe, the most important part of DSP is the time alignment part when both sound arrive at the proper time to your ear and I already have that from the Sony RSX-GS9.
It's a stereo system not mono so you will never have an exact match left and right.

Again, I might be already happy without DSP (or I might not be happy) but I want to have it without DSP for now just to learn from my experience.

As I had pointed out before, if later I feel like I need a DSP it will only be a purchase away and I will not lose much money in selling my Zapco ASP-X4 analog crossover.
but I will lost a lot of money if I choose the wrong amp and had to upgrade.

Your observation is also true that I am not looking for the best sound quality ever,
I just looking for an audio system that I am happy with. 
You also right that I really like to spent money on expensive thing eventhough I might not use it to the max, hence the same analogy of Ferrari/Pagani buyer above or as you put it (more show than go).
I am not a hypocrite 

But when I decide to buy an equipment I would make sure I buy the best one even I might not use it's all potential... 

Same as buyer of Ferrari might do comparison with McLaren before they buy eventhough it's not really matter by the way he drive it (or his driving skill).

I will never compete in audio competition, 
I just want the finest thing in life, and be able to enjoy and be happy with it for a long time without the itch to upgrade again.

I hope this really clear up my goal with this system, 
and I really not going to debate or defend why I don't want to use DSP on this thread again,...

but

I do hope more people can share their experience regarding the 3 amps that I listed above.


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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

BMW Alpina said:


> From what I believe, the most important part of DSP is the time alignment part when both sound arrive at the proper time to your ear and I already have that from the Sony RSX-GS9.
> It's a stereo system not mono so you will never have an exact match left and right.
> 
> Again, I might be already happy without DSP (or I might not be happy) but I want to have it without DSP for now just to learn from my experience.
> ...



The thing is, you won't lose anything if you buy a different amp, there are hundreds of amps that are far less expensive, that will do the job just as well as those luxury brands. There are reasons to buy luxury amps, but sound quality isn't one of those reasons.

As important as time alignment is, independent left and right EQ is even more important. Nick (SkizeR) has some measurements showing how different the exact same speakers measure on the left side and right side of the car, the difference is incredible. You don't have to worry about this in a house, but the car is a much different beast. Time alignment is only part of it. Again, you have your own design goals in mind, but a DSP will make a significantly bigger difference than the difference between a Brax amp and a 10 year old Alpine amp. I promise you, the amp will not be the bottleneck. 

I'm not calling you a hypocrite at all. It seems that you understand electronics fairly well, if you're concerned about unnecessary DA conversions, but the issue here isn't the electronics, it's the acoustics. In a car, the acoustic environment will ruin the sound much quicker than the S/N ratio of an amp, or a redundant conversion. A good DSP will fix much bigger problems than a fancy amp will. We're just making sure that you understand the acoustic limitations of your plan before you end up disappointed after spending a lot of money. Again, there are plenty of reasons for spending my on top tier equipment, but in the hands of a decent tuner an Alpine amp and good DSP will, without a doubt, sound better than the Brax amp and analog crossover. 

Make whatever choice you want, just be educated before making that choice.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

gijoe said:


> The think is, you won't lose anything if you buy a different amp, there are hundreds of amps that are far less expensive, that will do the job just as well as those luxury brands. There are reasons to buy luxury amps, but sound quality isn't one of those reasons.
> 
> As important as time alignment is, independent left and right EQ is even more important. Nick (SkizeR) has some measurements showing how different the exact same speakers measure on the left side and right side of the car, the difference is incredible. You don't have to worry about this in a house, but the car is a much different beast. Time alignment is only part of it. Again, you have your own design goals in mind, but a DSP will make a significantly bigger difference than the difference between a Brax amp and a 10 year old Alpine amp. I promise you, the amp will not be the bottleneck.
> 
> ...


Thanks and appreciate your input GIJoe


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

what i want to say has pretty much already ben said, so i'll say this. if you pick up a dsp like the helix pro or mosconi aerospace, you can still maintain the high res sampling rate (not that it makes an audible difference anyway)


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

as for the measurements in car, heres a before and after of some pretty damn good gear if i remember correctly (plot twist, the gear doesnt matter. the car causes all of this ****ery)

Before:















After..















Now ask yourself, which do you prefer?


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

SkizeR said:


> what i want to say has pretty much already ben said, so i'll say this. if you pick up a dsp like the helix pro or mosconi aerospace, you can still maintain the high res sampling rate (not that it makes an audible difference anyway)


Thanks SkizeR


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

SkizeR said:


> as for the measurements in car, heres a before and after of some pretty damn good gear if i remember correctly (plot twist, the gear doesnt matter. the car causes all of this ****ery)
> 
> Before:
> 
> ...


That is a very good data comparison, 

although I still going to go without DSP for now,
but 
this really interest me in getting myself a Real Time Analyzer now,
so I can see how (bad) will my system do after I install it.


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## AyOne (Sep 24, 2016)

I run a Mac and with T/A an no L/R eq my FR looks very similar to the top graph SkizeR posted. Without a DSP I don’t get to take full advantage of the amp because the car messes everything up. Get the amp you want just know that the biggest benefit:cost piece is the DSP.


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

BMW Alpina said:


> That is a very good data comparison,
> 
> although I still going to go without DSP for now,
> but
> ...


You DO resalize that if you get a Helix DSP you can also get a top quality Helix RTA measurement kit that works with the DSP.

https://www.crutchfield.com/S-SvWAIxcgRWq/p_975MK1KIT/HELIX-MTK-1-Measurement-Tool-Kit.html

It is an expensive kit, particularly at Crutchfield, but likely less then getting an actual high end RTA and the results of using the DSP and the RTA will be exceptional !!


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## gijoe (Mar 25, 2008)

BMW Alpina said:


> That is a very good data comparison,
> 
> although I still going to go without DSP for now,
> but
> ...


A real time analyzer will just show you a bunch of problems that you won't be able to fix, haha.


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## Velozity (Jul 6, 2007)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



BMW Alpina said:


> you see, I am not planning to upgrade or change anything after I am done with this system...
> so I thought... maybe I should open my eyes more and try to get the best equipment available... and be done forever...




Good luck with that, lol.  Once bitten, forever infected.


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## Velozity (Jul 6, 2007)

Buy a Dayton or MiniDSP USB mic and download REW if you're curious about what your frequency response looks like. Less than $100 all-in. You'll need it later anyway when you do eventually get a DSP...and you will, trust us.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

AyOne said:


> I run a Mac and with T/A an no L/R eq my FR looks very similar to the top graph SkizeR posted. Without a DSP I don’t get to take full advantage of the amp because the car messes everything up. Get the amp you want just know that the biggest benefit:cost piece is the DSP.





seafish said:


> You DO resalize that if you get a Helix DSP you can also get a top quality Helix RTA measurement kit that works with the DSP.
> 
> https://www.crutchfield.com/S-SvWAIxcgRWq/p_975MK1KIT/HELIX-MTK-1-Measurement-Tool-Kit.html
> 
> It is an expensive kit, particularly at Crutchfield, but likely less then getting an actual high end RTA and the results of using the DSP and the RTA will be exceptional !!





Velozity said:


> Good luck with that, lol.  Once bitten, forever infected.





Velozity said:


> Buy a Dayton or MiniDSP USB mic and download REW if you're curious about what your frequency response looks like. Less than $100 all-in. You'll need it later anyway when you do eventually get a DSP...and you will, trust us.


Thanks for the information guys 





gijoe said:


> A real time analyzer will just show you a bunch of problems that you won't be able to fix, haha.


That is ok, I like to learn from my mistakes


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## TerryGreen5986 (Jun 23, 2017)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*

OP has already stated he doesn’t want to do DSP (a few times). He just wants to buy the best amplifier possible (from his 3 choices listed).

You’re not going to change his mind. Why not just help him choose an amp and be done? 

When or if....he ends up unhappy....I’m sure he’ll figure out that he should’ve used a DSP and then he’ll purchase one. Obviously he has enough funds to do trial and error, and add a DSP later. 

In the end, he will still have an amazing amplifier, and decent source...then he’ll make a thread telling you all that u were right (which u already know) 


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

My vote is for the Zapco 150.6LX but again I have no stake in this lol.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



TerryGreen5986 said:


> OP has already stated he doesn’t want to do DSP (a few times). He just wants to buy the best amplifier possible (from his 3 choices listed).
> 
> You’re not going to change his mind. Why not just help him choose an amp and be done?
> 
> ...


solid point. but, my philosophy is do it right the first time. not only that, but he has a very small car. IDK if you have seen the 3 amps he mentioned in person, but they are freakin massive. not sure what he plans on doing for subs, but he might want to think of a dsp install ahead of time so the install doesnt have to be re-done


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



Coppertone said:


> My vote is for the Zapco 150.6LX but again I have no stake in this lol.





TerryGreen5986 said:


> OP has already stated he doesn’t want to do DSP (a few times). He just wants to buy the best amplifier possible (from his 3 choices listed).
> 
> You’re not going to change his mind. Why not just help him choose an amp and be done?
> 
> ...





SkizeR said:


> solid point. but, my philosophy is do it right the first time. not only that, but he has a very small car. IDK if you have seen the 3 amps he mentioned in person, but they are freakin massive. not sure what he plans on doing for subs, but he might want to think of a dsp install ahead of time so the install doesnt have to be re-done



Thanks everyone,
I actually had measured all the dimension to make sure I can fit the amp...

Ok, first, I no longer can put the amp on the floor of the trunk because I need full size spare tire there, what I mean by full size is really full size 18in BBS wheel and tire... the reason is because my front 6 piston Brembo brake with 355mm rotor need 18in wheel (and it's barely clear it), and I don't want any run flat tire,... sacrifice sacrifice..

so a Zapco Z150.6LX at 19cm x 61.4cm will perfectly fit behind the rear LEFT seat, (the left rear seat is wider than the right one)

while a Brax MX4 at 36cm x 36cm will perfectly find behind the RIGHT rear seat and of course can fit behind the left rear seat too.
below is the picture so you can see the different in width between left and right rear seat.

I even already buy the Mugen Trunk Mat kit that come with extra mat to cover the rear of the rear seat. I plan to put an MDF sheet behind those extra mat to mount the amp.












* If you see on the right side panel of the trunk (where there is a yellow foam now), that is where I will flush mount the Zapco ASP-X4 Analog crossover and 
the dimension fit perfectly.
* 
For the subwoofer, I plan to use STEREO underseat subwoofer,
I think I most likely will buy Japanese market only Pioneer/Carrozzeria TS-WH1000a.
TS-WH1000A????????????????????????
so 2 sub under both front seat.










This will make it more like a front 3 way system.
The Sony RSX-GS9 have time alignment setting for Stereo Under Front Seat Subwoofer, so this should be perfect.
Plus I don't waste any trunk space.

I was originally plan to get TWO POWERED JL Audio ACS110LG-TW1 










and put it under the REAR seat, (yes they actually surprisingly fit there)
and use quick release socket so I can take them out if I need to fold the REAR seat,... but ... at this point I really want to have a subwoofer that located more toward the front of the car and that I don't have to take out... thus the choice toward the Pioneer/Carrozzeria..

The only catch is,
I still need to make sure this Pioneer/Carrozzeria under seat sub will fit the Recaro SR-7 ASM Limited Ruby front seats that I plan to purchase 
(I already bought the rail for this recaros)... 
if no space under the Recaros then, I have no choice but o go back to using a pair of JL Powered Sub under rear seat...
so final decision on subwoofer will need to wait after Recaro came...












*In summary, I already find out to make sure all those 3 amps above will fit in my Honda Fit and they all fit *


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## benny z (Mar 17, 2008)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*

So out of your choices, I’d definitely buy the MX4. Yes, I have heard them all. It’s a no questions asked, take my money, MX4 all day.


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## dcfis (Sep 9, 2016)

That Carrozzeria sub is almost worth trying for 90 bucks


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

*Re: BRAX Matrix MX4 vs. BRAX Graphic GX2400 vs. Zapco Z-150.6LX*



benny z said:


> So out of your choices, I’d definitely buy the MX4. Yes, I have heard them all. It’s a no questions asked, take my money, MX4 all day.


Thanks Benny Z,
I also got several PM with information and after careful thinking, 
I think I really need to get Brax MX-4 for the active 2 way front channel.

For Rear fill... still not sure whether I even want to have rear fill,
but if I do (and I already bought a pair of Morel Hybrid Integra 602 coaxial),
most likely it will be a Zapco Z150.2LX driving the Morel through it's passive crossover. This way, I can kinda compare them myself too.

Thanks again for everyone who assist me with their experience with the 3 amps choice above.
I really appreciate it and will report back on my build thread once I installed them.

Thanks


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Well I for one am glad that you’ve made a decision and I wish you well towards acquiring that amp.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

Coppertone said:


> Well I for one am glad that you’ve made a decision and I wish you well towards acquiring that amp.


Thanks Coppertone


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Get the Brax MX-4...

I own the Zapco amp, and despite what Elektra reports; it is definitely not a joke of an amp... but it's not a Brax MX-4.

You mentioned that you are worried that if you buy anything less than the Brax, you will always be wondering _'what if...'_ 
I know this exact scenario! I'm living it every day!

Although I can wholeheartedly say that the Zapco is a very nice amp, I often find myself still dreaming about owning a pair of MX4's.

If you have the money to spend on a Brax, then just get the Brax. Do it once... do it right.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

jimmydee said:


> Get the Brax MX-4...
> 
> I own the Zapco amp, and despite what Elektra reports; it is definitely not a joke of an amp... but it's not a Brax MX-4.
> 
> ...


Thanks jimmydee, I appreciate your honesty


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

depends on your budget, if its unlimited and by that i mean you are using the best thru out and it is installed and tuned properly than buy the brax. however, the zapco LX has won a lot of the best of sound etc in the last couple of years. i have them in 2 of my cars and am very pleased


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## OCD66 (Apr 2, 2017)

Those under seat subs are worthless. I bought one and took it out the same day. Ended up going with CP110LG-TW1-2 - Car Audio - Subwoofer Systems - MicroSub™ - JL Audio Better option if you plan on temporarily removing it. Just a speaker lead. This is in a MKVII GTI. 

I've never heard one, but the Brax are on my list.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

OCD66 said:


> Those under seat subs are worthless. I bought one and took it out the same day. Ended up going with CP110LG-TW1-2 - Car Audio - Subwoofer Systems - MicroSub™ - JL Audio Better option if you plan on temporarily removing it. Just a speaker lead. This is in a MKVII GTI.
> 
> I've never heard one, but the Brax are on my list.


Hello OCD66, 
Do you have the same exact model of under seat subwoofer?
Pioneer Carrozzeria TS-WH1000A?

if not, what model do you use?

Thanks


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## OCD66 (Apr 2, 2017)

BMW Alpina said:


> Hello OCD66,
> Do you have the same exact model of under seat subwoofer?
> Pioneer Carrozzeria TS-WH1000A?
> 
> ...


It was a kicker. No real bass. Just annoying seat vibration. A box in the back will also get you some cabin gain.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

My post lottery dream system includes two MX4s and an MX2. Although I don’t agree with your overall plan (a DSP will make a world of difference and should be part of your base plan), as long as you can afford it, get the Brax and don’t look back. There’s nothing worse than second guessing yourself after the fact.


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

Do anybody know whether the Brax MX series have Regulated or Unregulated Power Supply?


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

BMW Alpina said:


> Do anybody know whether the Brax MX series have Regulated or Unregulated Power Supply?


Regulated almost every new amp is regulated mostly old school amps like Soundstream have unregulated power supplies 

Sent from my LG-H990 using Tapatalk


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

Elektra said:


> Regulated almost every new amp is regulated mostly old school amps like Soundstream have unregulated power supplies
> 
> Sent from my LG-H990 using Tapatalk


Thanks Elektra for the information,
so from my limited understanding,
a Power Amp with Regulated Power Supply will always draw similar current regardless of the output level to the speaker? meaning if you have your volume control at zero, the amp will still draw its maximum regulated current just like if you set the volume control at max position?

or 
will the current draw for regulated amp will still vary depend on the load of the speaker (how load you play your speaker) but it have several step of regulated current draw?
ie if you play at low level the input current draw will be ie. 10 amp
and if you plat at mid level the input current draw will be ie. 20 amp etc...

Thanks


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

BMW Alpina said:


> Thanks Elektra for the information,
> so from my limited understanding,
> a Power Amp with Regulated Power Supply will always draw similar current regardless of the output level to the speaker? meaning if you have your volume control at zero, the amp will still draw its maximum regulated current just like if you set the volume control at max position?
> 
> ...


no. a regulated power supply will just put out the same amount of power to your speakers if its at 12 volts, or 14.5 volts, or anywhere in between or around. unregulated will put out less power at 12 volts vs say 14.5 volts


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

SkizeR said:


> no. a regulated power supply will just put out the same amount of power to your speakers if its at 12 volts, or 14.5 volts, or anywhere in between or around. unregulated will put out less power at 12 volts vs say 14.5 volts


Considering the fact that the MX Series puts out the same power to both 4 and 2 ohm loads, I would imagine that they are highly regulated throughout.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

TomT said:


> Considering the fact that the MX Series puts out the same power to both 4 and 2 ohm loads, I would imagine that they are highly regulated throughout.


yup. thats a regulated supply. forgot to mention that if they put out the same power at different impedance theyre regulated

the trade off to regulated is the amp is usually less efficient btw


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## BMW Alpina (Dec 5, 2012)

SkizeR said:


> no. a regulated power supply will just put out the same amount of power to your speakers if its at 12 volts, or 14.5 volts, or anywhere in between or around. unregulated will put out less power at 12 volts vs say 14.5 volts





TomT said:


> Considering the fact that the MX Series puts out the same power to both 4 and 2 ohm loads, I would imagine that they are highly regulated throughout.





SkizeR said:


> yup. thats a regulated supply. forgot to mention that if they put out the same power at different impedance theyre regulated
> 
> the trade off to regulated is the amp is usually less efficient btw


Hi everybody,
Thanks for the information,
well this mean, this rule out the possibility of me running Two MX2 then...
I don't think the small alternator on my Honda Fit can handle Two MX2
plus 2 powered underseat subwoofer...

I really don't want to change to larger alternator,
my Honda Fit is already slow enough despite the supercharger...
and a larger alternator would just make it too slow...

ok MX4, back to you...
just need to be patient to find the right deal...


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