# Audio Frog Build Quality Issues



## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)

The issue got resolved by the seller. I am sure many have excellent success with Audio Frog however my experience was less than great.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Sub'd to see where this goes... Lol


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## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)




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## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)

The photos above are of the GB25's. They speak for themself. The last two of the four pictures show how the magnet on one of them is not aligned correctly at all. You can even see the set screw isnt making contact with the basket. I have tried to remove the screws and realign, however it is glued in position.


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## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)

I left the GB60's at the office so I will take pictures of those tomorrow. They are worse than the GB25's as far as glue construction.


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## Lou Frasier2 (Jul 17, 2012)

have you tried contacting the company?


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

DavidRam said:


> Sub'd to see where this goes... Lol


Me too. Have you contacted Audiofrog? The man behind the company is Andy Wehmeyer and he is very reachable and responsive. He also is a member here @GotFrogs.


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## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)

DaveG said:


> Me too. Have you contacted Audiofrog? The man behind the company is Andy Wehmeyer and he is very reachable and responsive. He also is a member here @GotFrogs.


I have not, however I am not interested in waiting a week or likely more for the replacement process. I don't have much hope for replacement sets to be much better. I should clarify that there are many speakers out there with similar build quality issues, however they also cost a fraction of what these do. It's hard to overlook that when spending this kind of money. The worst part is that I spent weeks making custom enclosures to specifically fit these speakers, only to receive them like this. I am sure I wont have much trouble finding replacements for the GB60's and GB10, however I am not sure where I will be able to find a speaker comparable to the GB25's (at least on paper). Any input would be greatly appreciated.


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## Gurpreet (Sep 6, 2011)

I also suggest contacting Andy directly. I would be surprised if he didn't take care of this immediately.


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## LBaudio (Jan 9, 2009)

what would you say when you see even worse glue work on Bewith drivers - 5" for 2,5kEUR
You would never see such poor glue work on ZR Speaker Lab drivers,.....


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

I would ask why the OP didnt contact AF first? It is a mass produced speaker from overseas and things can happen depending on the manufacturing run. If AF cant make it right or make the OP whole, then move on to a different speaker. IMO if a second set of speakers came with the same build issues, blast away at AF.


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## johnbooth3 (Feb 26, 2008)

If you are going to spend that time looking for a newer driver, then you can wait a few days for AF to work to resolve the issue. Every manufacture has issues, some more than others. Should the price demand perfections, absolutely. Based on your pictures, i would reach out to the AF to get resolved. In most cases that Andy has been involved in resolving any issue is it is done immediately. I have an small issue with the Illusion Audio Carbon C3CX speakers. I have noticed that the mounting holes are not exact between drivers and even on the drivers themselves. I can rotate the driver on the mount and the holes will line up, rotate again and they are slightly off. This became an issue when I was tapping the acrylic to mount the speakers as a few of the screws would not line up. After redoing a few of the adapters I created, I noticed this flaw and I am working around it by drilling the hole slightly larger and using locking nuts. In you case, you may need replacements especially with the magnet misalignment. If AF doesn't know there is a problem, how can they fix it in the future.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

I thought those bottom chrome covers came off? I’ve seen photos of them detached from the GB25’s. I would love to see more photos of all the items in question.

Like other have said, Andy has some of the best customer service in the business and can most likely make the situation right for you.


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

OP, I totally get your disappointment, but you need to know that ANYONE here could DM member GotFrogs (ie Andy Wehmeyer aka CIC of Audio Frog) here on diyma and I'd imagine you would have contact with him within 24 hours and have replacement drivers in the mail within 48 hours after the actual explanation of your particular problem(s). 

You could save yourself some hassle simply by contacting him yourself now that you know this.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

nvidia_guy said:


> The photos above are of the GB25's. They speak for themself. The last two of the four pictures show how the magnet on one of them is not aligned correctly at all. You can even see the set screw isnt making contact with the basket. I have tried to remove the screws and realign, however it is glued in position.


Just a heads up, that "magnet" that is not centered on the screws isn't the actual magnet. Its a cover. The cover doesn't need to be perfectly centered. 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## mattjk (Apr 7, 2011)

Not trying to insult the OP, but have you ever owned speakers before? A little glue overspilling on the dust caps is perfectly normal, some may be more than others, but if you do a quick GIS, you'll see even $100,000 home speakers have glue exposed.


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

Yeah I have had sets of Phass speakers in my hands that weren't much better. I think your expectation of every set arriving at your door perfect is a little to high. You probably could have paid $499 for good sound, no warranty, and no customer service. Use that extra money you spent wisely and shoot an email to the company.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

I thought buyers were supposed to contact the dealer who sold the drivers to them and if its not resolved then contact Audiofrog direct. I don’t think Andy wants to be the contact guy for every issue when he has a dealer network to handle it. I’ll be honest and say I have three vehicles with AF GB drivers and I love them.


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

Where did you buy them?


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

So, the OP joined the forum just to bash AudioFrog....seems a bit fishy to me.


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## Theslaking (Oct 8, 2013)

Niebur3 said:


> So, the OP joined the forum just to bash AudioFrog....seems a bit fishy to me


It didn't seem like bashing to me. It's just the new way of the world. He has a legitimate gripe. He expressed his opinion about it. It's just that people truly don't realize that complaining on the internet isn't a cordial way to get things done. We're getting so used to searching, reading reviews, and purchasing that we have inadvertently forgotten there is a human side to solving problems. Publicly expressing discontent is the new norm opposed to privately speaking with the person that can solve it or was the cause.

I've had plenty of repairs where people didn't even bother to call the company that did it in the first place. I'm usually baffled. Like your going to pay me instead of getting them to fix their mistake for free? They almost always say that they don't think the companies care after they get their money. It's a shame that train of thought exist. But I feel it's on display here.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Niebur3 said:


> So, the OP joined the forum just to bash AudioFrog....seems a bit fishy to me.


Calm down, your sales will be fine lol

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

SkizeR said:


> Calm down, your sales will be fine lol
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


And so will yours. Not something that even crossed my mind.


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## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)

Definitely not “bashing”. I spent a lot of money on drivers and expected the build quality to reflect the price. Yes I have been in the audio world for well over a decade. I know how speakers work. I understand that you can build a speaker in your backyard and glue a dust cap on in a similar fashion as the GB25’s I received. The issue is that I didn’t build them in my backyard. You will find other speakers in the same price category by other manufacturers have excellent build quality. Again I am not saying all Audio Frog speakers are like the ones I received. Though three out of three sets with the exact same issue turned me away.


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## GMCtrk (Apr 14, 2018)

Get you some Dynas. The build quality on my esotars is impeccable.


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## Patriot83 (May 10, 2017)

GMCtrk said:


> Get you some Dynas. The build quality on my esotars is impeccable.


I have to agree. Just looked at my E650's again. They are perfection!!


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

GMCtrk said:


> Get you some Dynas. The build quality on my esotars is impeccable.


But the midbass capability most certainly isn't :/


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## FAUEE (Jul 22, 2010)

Not my fight here, but I'll chime in as a neutral party. 

I've installed a LOT of speakers in my day. Mostly inexpensive to moderately expensive (think $50-350 range). As a pro, I was probably a bit less likely to care about a little extra glue here or there... I'm not going to see it again nor will my customer behind a door panel. That said, in installing untold thousands off speakers from alpine, Pioneer, Rockford, etc, I very very rarely encountered this. I remember seeing it on a handful of alpine, but not as bad as that, and only on their cheapest models. 

If I was a Co sumer and spent 4 or 5 times as much money as "decent" speakers cost, and my high dollar speakers came looking like like that, I'd be pissed too. Higher price boutique items come with an expectation of higher quality. That's why Bentley has inspectors that check over every piece of leather to make sure it all matches in grain and color and has no imperfections, because their higher end clients expect higher end quality. Granted a 300k Bentley costs more than a 500 dollar set of speakers, but they're both roughly 10x the price of a standard equivalent. 

I'm sure it was a one off, and likely had no real effect on performance, but perceived quality is, in many cases, more important than performance quality.


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## nvidia_guy (Sep 16, 2020)

FAUEE said:


> Not my fight here, but I'll chime in as a neutral party.
> 
> I've installed a LOT of speakers in my day. Mostly inexpensive to moderately expensive (think $50-350 range). As a pro, I was probably a bit less likely to care about a little extra glue here or there... I'm not going to see it again nor will my customer behind a door panel. That said, in installing untold thousands off speakers from alpine, Pioneer, Rockford, etc, I very very rarely encountered this. I remember seeing it on a handful of alpine, but not as bad as that, and only on their cheapest models.
> 
> ...


This right here is what compelled me to post here. Mind you I am a long time lurker. I rarely ever post to a discussion forum. A pair of GB60’s is nearly $1,000 with tax and shipping. Now consider, a GB60 uses standard materials and is made in China. From my days of DIY home audio and making my own speakers, I would estimate it costs well under $50 to make each speaker including material and labor. That’s fine, if all the other ingredients of quality and performance are present. The issue was the quality was missing. From what I have researched, the GB series of drivers are unparalleled when it comes to performance, especially the GB25. As you said, a high end boutique brand is expected to come with not only quality, but quality control. If I had just gotten the GB25’s and that was it, I wouldn’t be here right now. The problem arose when I opened two more boxes of speakers with the same exact poor build quality. Either the quality control at Audiofrog is severely lacking or I am just extremely unlucky. Either way, it’s been resolved and I’m moving on.


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## ANS (Sep 23, 2011)

Give the manufacturer the opportunity to make the situation right. Andy is a great person to work with, and yes manufacturing defects happen. Unfortunately, it is apart of running a business. You were unlucky in getting the set which had some problems. I understand complaining about it if he were not able to rectify the situation but you first have to let him try.


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## FAUEE (Jul 22, 2010)

ANS said:


> Give the manufacturer the opportunity to make the situation right. Andy is a great person to work with, and yes manufacturing defects happen. Unfortunately, it is apart of running a business. You were unlucky in getting the set which had some problems. I understand complaining about it if he were not able to rectify the situation but you first have to let him try.


I disagree. This forum is here to spread information. The information that "there is a chance of unknown quantity that your speakers will look like they were flea market level" is valuable information to people shopping for speakers. If it were to be hidden, ignored, etc then customers would have no idea, and be blindsided like the OP was. 

There is no question that Audiofrog or their dealer should and will (and sounds like did) resolve the issue. But not letting others know about the experience isn't the spirit of the community, regardless of the standing of the product in the community.


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## nhtunes (Jul 31, 2016)

FAUEE said:


> I disagree. This forum is here to spread information. The information that "there is a chance of unknown quantity that your speakers will look like they were flea market level" is valuable information to people shopping for speakers. If it were to be hidden, ignored, etc then customers would have no idea, and be blindsided like the OP was.
> 
> There is no question that Audiofrog or their dealer should and will (and sounds like did) resolve the issue. But not letting others know about the experience isn't the spirit of the community, regardless of the standing of the product in the community.



I also agree with the OP. You pay that kind of money and you expect quality. They could at least visually inspect them. Don't forget, this throws a wrench into the OP's installation. When you pay this kind of money you shouldn't be haggling with the vendor and waiting for a replacement. It should show up ready for installation, period. On the flip side the vendor should agree 100% with what I just stated.


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

Has any one heard of any quality issues with AF before. I could have certainly missed it, but I dont think I have run across any posts like this for their speakers


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

nhtunes said:


> I also agree with the OP. You pay that kind of money and you expect quality. They could at least visually inspect them. Don't forget, this throws a wrench into the OP's installation. When you pay this kind of money you shouldn't be haggling with the vendor and waiting for a replacement. It should show up ready for installation, period. On the flip side the vendor should agree 100% with what I just stated.


Where the OP purchased the speakers also plays into this. I have never purchased AF speakers but have been to my local AF dealer. I have talked with them about the AFs and others speakers they carry. I can tell you from other purchases there, if the OP opened an AF box and saw quality issues they would have swapped out no questions asked. Sure it sucks to take time to go back to the shop or wait for a pair sent, but the big thing is did the vendor or company make it right. In that scenario if the second or swapped out speakers had the same QC issues, I would post about quality problems. 

I am reminded of a situation with my buddy recently. He does landscaping and his reviews are very good online. He recently had a situation where an employee cut or did something to a ladys flowers. He talked with her and had already purchased flowers to replace and was heading over to replant. She put a review of him online saying basically he sucked and had bad service even before he had a chance to fix the situation.


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

FAUEE said:


> I disagree. This forum is here to spread information. The information that "there is a chance of unknown quantity that your speakers will look like they were flea market level" is valuable information to people shopping for speakers. If it were to be hidden, ignored, etc then customers would have no idea, and be blindsided like the OP was.
> 
> There is no question that Audiofrog or their dealer should and will (and sounds like did) resolve the issue. But not letting others know about the experience isn't the spirit of the community, regardless of the standing of the product in the community.


Did the pictures look like flea market quality to you? i saw nothing that would affect performance or longevity. But i also know that I would expect Andy to step up and offer to replace them with hand selected drivers once he is aware of the situation.


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## FAUEE (Jul 22, 2010)

miniSQ said:


> Did the pictures look like flea market quality to you? i saw nothing that would affect performance or longevity. But i also know that I would expect Andy to step up and offer to replace them with hand selected drivers once he is aware of the situation.


Flea market quality may have been an exaggeration, but they were not up to the same quality as other mainstream products that cost much less. 

I agree, I bet the perform fine. But that gets back to my statements about perceived quality. It doesn't matter if something is of high or poor quality if the perception is there. Example, my. Gf has an. IPhone that she perceives as high quality. It has **** for reception and wifi signal. But, as she perceives it as high quality, she refuses to believe her phone is the issue. On the flip side, if you see a dirty, rusty car with missing paint, you're not going to assume the rest of it is perfect inside and mechanically. 

As the saying goes, perception is someone's reality.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

SkizeR said:


> But the midbass capability most certainly isn't :/


True statement. The dynaudios have an amazing signature sound though. I’ve never owned a pair of GB60’s but I have heard them in a friends vehicle and was impressed with the midbass performance. I wish there was a driver that had the SQ of the E650 with the excursion of the GB60. Not saying the GB60 has lower SQ but the E650 is just amazing in my opinion 😉


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

I think there is a chance that there was a change of crew at the factory compared to the normal crew working at the manufacturing facility in China. Or possibly a different facility altogether due to Covid-19 supply chain issues. That is just my opinion. But Either way, someone in China on the manufacturing side dropped the ball on quality control for a high end product.


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## dcfis (Sep 9, 2016)

nvidia_guy said:


> This right here is what compelled me to post here. Mind you I am a long time lurker. I rarely ever post to a discussion forum. A pair of GB60’s is nearly $1,000 with tax and shipping. Now consider, a GB60 uses standard materials and is made in China. From my days of DIY home audio and making my own speakers, I would estimate it costs well under $50 to make each speaker including material and labor. That’s fine, if all the other ingredients of quality and performance are present. The issue was the quality was missing. From what I have researched, the GB series of drivers are unparalleled when it comes to performance, especially the GB25. As you said, a high end boutique brand is expected to come with not only quality, but quality control. If I had just gotten the GB25’s and that was it, I wouldn’t be here right now. The problem arose when I opened two more boxes of speakers with the same exact poor build quality. Either the quality control at Audiofrog is severely lacking or I am just extremely unlucky. Either way, it’s been resolved and I’m moving on.


I love how totally custom becomes standard materials. You had zero interest in getting this resolved you got your refund then made sure to come over here and post your grievance. I don't care but you want to tell it like it is, then start with yourself


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## ANS (Sep 23, 2011)

FAUEE said:


> I disagree. This forum is here to spread information. The information that "there is a chance of unknown quantity that your speakers will look like they were flea market level" is valuable information to people shopping for speakers. If it were to be hidden, ignored, etc then customers would have no idea, and be blindsided like the OP was.
> 
> There is no question that Audiofrog or their dealer should and will (and sounds like did) resolve the issue. But not letting others know about the experience isn't the spirit of the community, regardless of the standing of the product in the community.


It is fine to spread information and be upset about receiving a bad batch of product. At the same time, there should be a little understanding that even some of the best manufacturers in the world in every industry have defects from time to time. Things happen. This is why I said it then comes down to the customer service of the brand to rectify the situation. If the brand takes care of the customer in a fast, easy process then I would say that speaks more to the overall quality of the brand. Obviously no one is hiding, or ignoring any information, he shared his experience. It is not as if anyone is saying "Don't share your experiences here". Just simply saying things happen, let us see how good that customer service is.


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## Train45 (May 31, 2020)

A few people saying, glue spilling out no big deal. Imo too many companies get away with manufacturing defects. too many people say no big deal. But it really speaks volumes when a company makes a real effort to make products with no visible flaws. Have some morel tempos and a primo sub. Not a single visible flaw on em, just beautiful precise construction, now I also have a Hertz mp250, and even though its twice the price of the Primo, it has glue spilled out of every nearly every seam, just looks bad.


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

Train45 said:


> A few people saying, glue spilling out no big deal. Imo too many companies get away with manufacturing defects. too many people say no big deal. But it really speaks volumes when a company makes a real effort to make products with no visible flaws. Have some morel tempos and a primo sub. Not a single visible flaw on em, just beautiful precise construction, now I also have a Hertz mp250, and even though its twice the price of the Primo, it has glue spilled out of every nearly every seam, just looks bad.


weird thing for me is i have been doing this for 40+ years and have owned probably 50-75 different subs and equal number or more of component speakers, and i can't say for sure if i EVER paid attention to the glue on any of the dustcaps. And if i had received the speakers the OP received i would have installed them and enjoyed them.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

miniSQ said:


> weird thing for me is i have been doing this for 40+ years and have owned probably 50-75 different subs and equal number or more of component speakers, and i can't say for sure if i EVER paid attention to the glue on any of the dustcaps. And if i had received the speakers the OP received i would have installed them and enjoyed them.


I most likely would have hooked them up and gave them a good testing as well. I care about performance, not visual appearances. I would gladly buy the speakers in question as B stock if offered.


With that being said, There is one thing I would be concerned about due a similar experience I have personally had with another speaker company. I bought a brand new subwoofer one time with an improper glue job. Half of the surround glue was not spread even and so you could literally lift up part of the surround from the basket. I hooked it up before noticing and the cone popped out sideways. So while this looks to just be a bit sloppy or excess gluing, it can indeed be an issue if you dont have glue in the correct places.

I'm happy to hear the problem was fixed. I personally look forward to purchasing more Audiofrog products in the future due to Andy's reputation for excellent customer service.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Too many drivers out there have the lipstick treatment and look better then they actually perform. That is not AudioFrog and thank god for that. Saying the visible glue is a defect though is incorrect. I would think seeing the glue beyond the seam means it’s very securely attached much like the wood glue in the joints of a well made box. 

Just my opinion though.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

JCsAudio said:


> Too many drivers out there have the lipstick treatment and look better then they actually perform. That is not AudioFrog and thank god for that. Saying the visible glue is a defect though is incorrect. I would think seeing the glue beyond the seam means it’s very securely attached much like the wood glue in the joints of a well made box.
> 
> Just my opinion though.


You bring up a great point. I have owned Focal flax speakers that honestly, looked very clean and visually appealing. But the performance in a car was not up to par with the appearance. Same with a couple others. On the other hand, my most ugly speakers I have owned, my Dynaudio MW162GT's with a stamped steel basket and plain black cone are one of my all time favorite drivers I have ever owned and still going strong after 10 years + of use


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## FAUEE (Jul 22, 2010)

ANS said:


> It is fine to spread information and be upset about receiving a bad batch of product. At the same time, there should be a little understanding that even some of the best manufacturers in the world in every industry have defects from time to time. Things happen. This is why I said it then comes down to the customer service of the brand to rectify the situation. If the brand takes care of the customer in a fast, easy process then I would say that speaks more to the overall quality of the brand. Obviously no one is hiding, or ignoring any information, he shared his experience. It is not as if anyone is saying "Don't share your experiences here". Just simply saying things happen, let us see how good that customer service is.


I agree with this, and that's what happened. He posted his issue, it was resolved through customer service. We know there may be some less than perfect speakers out there, but that customer service will take care of it if you get one. And there might be some. B stock speakers out somewhere that will get sold cheaper, lol.


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## Mullings (Jan 31, 2016)

I’m honestly happy that he returned them because if he had looked past the imperfections and tried hooking these speakers up without any experience with them, that’s where he would have so much ammo that no one here could try to play defense for the AF.


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

Let it go fellas! The op has. At this point it’s just beating a dead horse. The speakers speak for themselves!


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## Mullings (Jan 31, 2016)

DaveG said:


> Let it go fellas! The op has. At this point it’s just beating a dead horse. The speakers speak for themselves!


Good point


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## ckirocz28 (Nov 29, 2017)

cman said:


> I think there is a chance that there was a change of crew at the factory compared to the normal crew working at the manufacturing facility in China. Or possibly a different facility altogether due to Covid-19 supply chain issues. That is just my opinion. But Either way, someone in China on the manufacturing side dropped the ball on quality control for a high end product.


While I agree that these cosmetic issues are unacceptable for a product in this price range, you are correct that this quality control problem originated in China, and Andy is in the U.S., can't really hold him responsible unless you inform him there are issues with qc.


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## ckirocz28 (Nov 29, 2017)

miniSQ said:


> weird thing for me is i have been doing this for 40+ years and have owned probably 50-75 different subs and equal number or more of component speakers, and i can't say for sure if i EVER paid attention to the glue on any of the dustcaps. And if i had received the speakers the OP received i would have installed them and enjoyed them.


No one pays attention to the glue on the dust cap, until the dust cap comes off.


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## 1978monte (Aug 16, 2009)

DRAMA LOL..


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## Train45 (May 31, 2020)

JCsAudio said:


> Too many drivers out there have the lipstick treatment and look better then they actually perform. That is not AudioFrog and thank god for that. Saying the visible glue is a defect though is incorrect. I would think seeing the glue beyond the seam means it’s very securely attached much like the wood glue in the joints of a well made box.
> 
> Just my opinion though.


if precise construction methods and exellent quality control is "lipstick treatment" then sign me up lol


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Train45 said:


> if precise construction methods and exellent quality control is "lipstick treatment" then sign me up lol


I guess what I’m sayin is a lot of drivers have this “precise construction” as you call it and they also look much better than they actually perform. Having the glue visible on the cone to dust cap joint is not a defect, it’s an indication that they used enough glue in the manufacturing process. As far as performance, Audiofrog beats most for the money in my opinion.


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## Train45 (May 31, 2020)

I think differences between speakers are overrated. Only thing that really matters is how close a speaker comes to its published parameters.

its not just the dust cap, its the surround aswell, glue doesnt have to spill out to ensure proper adhesion, its just sloppy manufacturing. If they feel they cant get a good joint without doing so, thats on them.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Train45 said:


> I think differences between speakers are overrated. Only thing that really matters is how close a speaker comes to its published parameters.
> 
> its not just the dust cap, its the surround aswell, glue doesnt have to spill out to ensure proper adhesion, its just sloppy manufacturing. If they feel they cant get a good joint without doing so, thats on them.


The differences between speakers are actually quit big and it’s mainly in how much distortion they produce, especially at higher volumes. This is what separates average drivers from great drivers. I would suggest you privately contact Andy direct and ask him about his manufacturing tolerances. Do it respectfully and I’m confident he will be more than happy to explain why these things are the way they are.


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## Petererc (Dec 28, 2016)

This thread is crazy to me. Op posted his experience, dissatisfaction with a product. So be it. Take the info for what its worth, share your experience and move on.
The part that is crazy to me is the replies in this thread that state what “Andy” will do. What did Andy do? Where is Andy? 
Reminds me if another following..WWAD.. lol


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

Train45 said:


> A few people saying, glue spilling out no big deal. Imo too many companies get away with manufacturing defects. too many people say no big deal. But it really speaks volumes when a company makes a real effort to make products with no visible flaws. Have some morel tempos and a primo sub. Not a single visible flaw on em, just beautiful precise construction, now I also have a Hertz mp250, and even though its twice the price of the Primo, it has glue spilled out of every nearly every seam, just looks bad.


I think we also need to determine or define what is a manufacturing defect. If a speaker 100% works but has glue on it, do we really considered defective or is this just aesthetics? I guess we can argue that attention to detail for the person that assembled is not there, but is the actual speaker performance changed? If OP had stuck these mids in a door panel and they worked flawlessly for the next 10 years, would we still consider it a defective product? BTW, I am just placing the question out here for discussion. I am not an AF user. As good as they are and I have heard them a few times, I have a mental and wallet block to pay 800 bucks for a midbass set.


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## John Swanberg (Mar 17, 2008)

This series of posts shows me that I am old. I would not take to any social media to vent, I would go to the manufacturer for a conversation, or the police if there was criminality involved. Social media, no. My experience, belief and opinions are not so important that anyone else needs to hear them (with my wife being the exception, knowing that she most likely won't care either, especially about music or musical equipment). I have used car stereo equipment since 1980 and the only two pieces I have looked at with any degree of scrutiny was a pair of Kef 160Q's, because they were so cool looking and a JL 8W3V1 who's cone I launched out of the basket after abusing it horribly for over a year with audible distortion and "clacking" sounds while driving it with 3 times the rated power. Looks of the rest of the drivers? Don't know, don't care. The sound? Now that I care about.


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## dgage (Oct 1, 2013)

JCsAudio said:


> The differences between speakers are actually quit big and it’s mainly in how much distortion they produce, especially at higher volumes. This is what separates average drivers from great drivers. I would suggest you privately contact Andy direct and ask him about his manufacturing tolerances. Do it respectfully and I’m confident he will be more than happy to explain why these things are the way they are.


But are the differences really there? Speakers that play very loud often don’t play deep. Or those that play loud and deep may be too deep for most doors. To me the differences in the vast majority of speakers are more design decisions than a particular speaker maker being better than another.

My home speakers have horn loaded compression drivers and are 104 dB sensitive. The dual 12” midranges don’t play much below 80 Hz and are just there to try to keep up with the sheer sensitivity of the HLCD. They play LOUD with low distortion but thats primarily due to the design decisions than anything special with the individual speakers. But they are also low distortion, detailed, and incredibly dynamic. 

But I agree completely about contacting the manufacturer and getting taken care of.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

dgage, I think you’re referring to pro audio type drivers which of course are not the same. And of course you can’t have high efficiency and a wide extended frequency response at the same time. Pro audio drivers gain efficiency because they have a short light weight voice coil but they also have low xmax so their low end extension isn’t there. That’s not a bad thing, it’s just a different way. If their Thiele Small Parameters and intended use are similar (apples to apples) then the difference between drivers like AF GB or similar would be very low distortion and a wide flat frequency response. I’ve used many different drivers in two way setups and the GB60 was the best one I’ve used due to its wide and flat frequency response. I also liked Dynaudio too.


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## LumbermanSVO (Nov 11, 2009)

Petererc said:


> This thread is crazy to me. Op posted his experience, dissatisfaction with a product. So be it. Take the info for what its worth, share your experience and move on.
> The part that is crazy to me is the replies in this thread that state what “Andy” will do. What did Andy do? Where is Andy?
> Reminds me if another following..WWAD.. lol


Andy isn't the biggest fan of this place. But he does answer his phone when customers call...


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## dgage (Oct 1, 2013)

I still think in most but not all cases, it’s still design decisions as shown by the GB60 vs the new AF 8”. We know Andy could make a phenomenal GB80 but then it would cost a lot more and limit its market.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Petererc said:


> This thread is crazy to me. Op posted his experience, dissatisfaction with a product. So be it. Take the info for what its worth, share your experience and move on.
> The part that is crazy to me is the replies in this thread that state what “Andy” will do. What did Andy do? Where is Andy?
> Reminds me if another following..WWAD.. lol


This is a hobbyist forum. No industry members want anything to do with this place


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Why is this thread still alive? For fuhk sakes just contact your dealer. If not, contact Andy direct. If there is a build flaw with a driver he will take care of it.

Ge0


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## Petererc (Dec 28, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> This is a hobbyist forum. No industry members want anything to do with this place


except when they are trying to sell something lol


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Ge0 said:


> Why is this thread still alive? For fuhk sakes just contact your dealer. If not, contact Andy direct. If there is a build flaw with a driver he will take care of it.
> 
> Ge0


Seriously. This place needs to be nuked 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

SkizeR said:


> This is a hobbyist forum. No industry members want anything to do with this place


Why are you even here then? You are one of the biggest complainers about this site! Yet, here you are. Are you not part of the “industry?” Do you not push your product here? Posting job openings? Is there anything hypocritical going on here?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

TRUTHhz said:


> Why are you even here then? You are one of the biggest complainers about this site! Yet, here you are. Are you not part of the “industry?” Do you not push your product here? Posting job openings? Is there anything hypocritical going on here?


Because i have an unfortunate internet addiction that seriously needs to be kicked

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

SkizeR said:


> Because i have an unfortunate internet addiction that seriously needs to be kicked
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Great response! I can relate to a degree.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

TRUTHhz said:


> Great response! I can relate to a degree.


I'm not even being sarcastic. Its a problem and I recognize it. 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Don’t leave Nick, most value your input here even if you’re complaining but in my opinion you’re allowed to do that if you contributing so much.


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## ANS (Sep 23, 2011)

SkizeR said:


> Because i have an unfortunate internet addiction that seriously needs to be kicked
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


SkizeR, I always appreciate you being direct and to the point, even if it upsets others. You have contributed a lot of information to the site, thank you.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

ANS said:


> SkizeR, I always appreciate you being direct and to the point, even if it upsets others. You have contributed a lot of information to the site, thank you.


Thank you. I enjoy interacting on the internet. BUT, I have a very addictive personality. Once I have a habit, its nearly impossible for me to break it. If I ever started using drugs I'd be done for lol. But due to that, this place has sucked an obscene amount of time for almost no benefit to me tbh.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

SkizeR said:


> Because i have an unfortunate internet addiction that seriously needs to be kicked
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


ROTFL!!!

The weird thing is I get you Nick. That's why I appreciate your a$$h0le sarcastic humor 

Ge0


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Ge0 said:


> ROTFL!!!
> 
> The weird thing is I get you Nick. That's why I appreciate your a$$h0le sarcastic humor
> 
> Ge0


Fook off m8 






Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

SkizeR said:


> Fook off m8
> 
> 
> 
> ...


See. That's what I'm talking about. So fuggin adorable 🖕

Ge0


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

@SkizeR & @Ge0 you 2 need to get a room! Cute! #Bromance


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

DaveG said:


> @SkizeR & @Ge0 you 2 need to get a room! Cute! #Bromance


You have a camera? 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

SkizeR said:


> You have a camera?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Of course! Don't you know we all have cameras these days? #NastyBoy!


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

SkizeR said:


> You have a camera?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


Oh sh!t......

Ge0


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## dgage (Oct 1, 2013)

It just got too real for Ge0. Lol!


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

dgage said:


> It just got too real for Ge0. Lol!


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Nick does have a cute little a$$ on camera but he's too [email protected] skinny for my liking. I like my girls with some meat on them LOL 😘


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Wow, this thread seems to have turned into an internet gay bar! Lol


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

DavidRam said:


> Wow, this thread seems to have turned into an internet gay bar! Lol


Did we veer off target LOL!!!

Ge0


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Ge0 said:


> Did we veer off target LOL!!!
> 
> Ge0


It depends on what the target was?! Lol


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## Petererc (Dec 28, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> Seriously. This place needs to be nuked
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


You were saying


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Petererc said:


> You were saying


I was saying that this place needs to be nuked

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

SkizeR said:


> I was saying that this place needs to be nuked
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk



You don't nuke the liquor store to cure the alcoholic...


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

DavidRam said:


> You don't nuke the liquor store to cure the alcoholic...


But it sure is a good way to get rid of all of the alcoholics

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## evo9 (Jul 6, 2005)

Which one you champion is this?


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

On second thought Nick and Geo need to leave.


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

evo9 said:


> Which one you champion is this?


That was the most informative video I have ever seen 🙄

Ge0


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## Lou Frasier2 (Jul 17, 2012)

Ge0 said:


> That was the most informative video I have ever seen 🙄
> 
> Ge0


I threeve that ,wtf was it about


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## diy.phil (May 23, 2011)

ugh


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## 156546 (Feb 10, 2017)

nvidia_guy said:


> Definitely not “bashing”. I spent a lot of money on drivers and expected the build quality to reflect the price. Yes I have been in the audio world for well over a decade. I know how speakers work. I understand that you can build a speaker in your backyard and glue a dust cap on in a similar fashion as the GB25’s I received. The issue is that I didn’t build them in my backyard. You will find other speakers in the same price category by other manufacturers have excellent build quality. Again I am not saying all Audio Frog speakers are like the ones I received. Though three out of three sets with the exact same issue turned me away.


I think we talked on the phone about this and about a midbass problem. If this is the same conversation, then I asked if I could PLEASE replace these for you because they weren't right. I think (if this was the same conversation) that we also talked about trying a different tuning process.
If this wasn't the same conversation, then sorry. 
But, if you'd like me to replace these, I will.

[email protected]


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## Smdaniel-11 (Feb 4, 2019)

mattjk said:


> Not trying to insult the OP, but have you ever owned speakers before? A little glue overspilling on the dust caps is perfectly normal, some may be more than others, but if you do a quick GIS, you'll see even $100,000 home speakers have glue exposed.





nvidia_guy said:


> View attachment 278665
> View attachment 278666
> View attachment 278667
> View attachment 278668


Maybe contact who sold you the drivers before kinda bashing one of the best customer service companies in quality audio. Several people gave two great suggestions that would be a great start.
That GB25 doesn’t seem to be the error by the photos.... get to know the set up and best of luck with your situation. 
GB10’s
GB25’s
GB60’s
GB12
I thank about ten guys for helping me get in touch with AF! They are a wonderful 3 way, think you will find it hard to get many to disagree.


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## Dremgragen (Jul 14, 2008)

My GB25s have crooked magnet covers too, but sound fine so I ignored it.


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