# Worth it to upgrade to McIntosh amp ???



## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

I'm currently running Alpine PDX 4.150 to handle my Dynaudio 242 (front) and DLS Nobelium 6.2 (rear) with an Eclipse CD7200 mkII. The sound is really good but yet I felt it can be better. I want to take my car audio to the next level of SQ.
Will upgrading my PDX 4.150 to McIntosh MC404 make a big different in SQ?
The reason I asked because the MC404 cost over $1000, that's a big investment. If there are any amp better than the MC404 at the same price range, please let me know. Thanks for any advice.


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## rexroadj (Oct 31, 2008)

I have owned both. Personally I hated the pdx amps (I am sure I will catch hell for this since a ton of people will buy and worship anything alpine) but to me they sounded very compressed, tinny, and processed? I miss my mc404 every friggin day.....dumb ass I am sold it for practicaly nothing... I had a dozen Mac. amps and have sold all of them over the last few years. I would say unless you go to brax or something like that, Mac is the absolute best for the $. I know they are expensive but one thing to think of when purchasing something like Mcintosh is that you are investing in an amp that is made to/ and will last forever. I ran the same 431 for almost 15 years without so much as a warning light. So to me yes it is worth it, I believe you do get what you pay for and amps do sound different and make a huge difference. You have a fantastic setup as is and it would be a great addition/upgrade in my opinion but its just that......my opinion. Best of luck with what ever you choose to do and keep us posted.


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

rexroadj said:


> I have owned both. Personally I hated the pdx amps (I am sure I will catch hell for this since a ton of people will buy and worship anything alpine) but to me they sounded very compressed, tinny, and processed? I miss my mc404 every friggin day.....dumb ass I am sold it for practicaly nothing... I had a dozen Mac. amps and have sold all of them over the last few years. I would say unless you go to brax or something like that, Mac is the absolute best for the $. I know they are expensive but one thing to think of when purchasing something like Mcintosh is that you are investing in an amp that is made to/ and will last forever. I ran the same 431 for almost 15 years without so much as a warning light. So to me yes it is worth it, I believe you do get what you pay for and amps do sound different and make a huge difference. You have a fantastic setup as is and it would be a great addition/upgrade in my opinion but its just that......my opinion. Best of luck with what ever you choose to do and keep us posted.


My experiences have been the same, both with the PDX amps and the McIntosh amps. I would run Mac right now if I could fit them where my amps are, and if I could afford them again.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

Thank you for your opinion. I think I will get the Mac amp. 
Any different between the MCC431 vs MCC404?
I saw a used MCC431 for $500 and a new MCC404 for $1300.
The MCC431 seem like a good buy if there ain't much different.



rexroadj said:


> I have owned both. Personally I hated the pdx amps (I am sure I will catch hell for this since a ton of people will buy and worship anything alpine) but to me they sounded very compressed, tinny, and processed? I miss my mc404 every friggin day.....dumb ass I am sold it for practicaly nothing... I had a dozen Mac. amps and have sold all of them over the last few years. I would say unless you go to brax or something like that, Mac is the absolute best for the $. I know they are expensive but one thing to think of when purchasing something like Mcintosh is that you are investing in an amp that is made to/ and will last forever. I ran the same 431 for almost 15 years without so much as a warning light. So to me yes it is worth it, I believe you do get what you pay for and amps do sound different and make a huge difference. You have a fantastic setup as is and it would be a great addition/upgrade in my opinion but its just that......my opinion. Best of luck with what ever you choose to do and keep us posted.


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## Catman (Mar 18, 2008)

I agree with the others ...I hated the PDX ...it was cold, thin and processed. The McIntosh amps are amazing. Ultimate SQ ...you will not go wrong with McIntosh.

>^..^<


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## rexroadj (Oct 31, 2008)

The only real difference I noticed was the 404 has an incredible xover (bandpass) Aside from that I did not really notice any real audible differences. At one point I had the 404 running 4s and tweets, and 431 running midbass and sub so it would have been pretty much impossible for a comparsion in that case.


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## elparner (Oct 20, 2007)

if you bridge them the MC404 wil give you more power than the MC431 and it also has a bass knob port on it, that may be useful or not according on how are you planing your set up


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## zerodistortion (Jul 23, 2009)

Another difference between the 404 and 431 is higher input sensitivity on the 404. This allows you to use less gain on the amp if your headunit have high outputs. BTW...I was running a PDX amp in my set-up recently and it sounded too processed (a bit harsh on the highs). Switched to an old school Harman Kardon TC400Q and it sounded much better! Also tested my friend's Mac amp in my car...it's definately a huge improvement over the PDX.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

That's good to hear. I'll definitely get the Mac. I think the 431 should be perfect for me since I am running 4 speakers setup. Wish there is a used 404 forsale, but so far I haven't find any. Anyone know any good price for the used 404?



zerodistortion said:


> Another difference between the 404 and 431 is higher input sensitivity on the 404. This allows you to use less gain on the amp if your headunit have high outputs. BTW...I was running a PDX amp in my set-up recently and it sounded too processed (a bit harsh on the highs). Switched to an old school Harman Kardon TC400Q and it sounded much better! Also tested my friend's Mac amp in my car...it's definately a huge improvement over the PDX.


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## XllentAudio (Jun 29, 2009)

Buy it new and you will have absolutely no regrets.


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

If your looking for an excellent front stage amp, this is it. At 4X50 watts 4ohms it should be more than enough super clean power .

Mcintosh MC 420 Audiophile amplifier - eBay (item 320422394140 end time Sep-14-09 11:59:20 PDT)

McIntosh MCC446 car amplifier high end 6 channel amp NR:eBay Motors (item 280395493339 end time Sep-16-09 17:00:58 PDT)

I can't believe I'm actually selling this but unfortunately I have no use for it since I opted not to install it in my new car. Just too lazy to redo another car audio install especially since BMW makes a good sounding system already


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## placenta (Feb 2, 2008)

i agree with everyone else, having owned both PDX and McIntosh. That is a good jump in quality and you will hear it. If you had a slightly better amp to begin with it might not be so huge a step, but come on... PDX?? yes, Mac is way better.


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## zerodistortion (Jul 23, 2009)

If you want to spend less, look for the Mac amps without the meters. It's the exact same amp (less the meters), but you save a few hundred $$. I'd take a look at the amps a$$hole posted on this thread. Nice amps btw!


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## elparner (Oct 20, 2007)

Ask MACS, he migth have something that could interest you and he is a great guy to deal with


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## ZZROCOOL (Jun 1, 2009)

I have both and VOTE McIntosh I don't think there are better amps out there


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## Curlystereo (Mar 11, 2009)

Not to downgrade Mac amps because they are top shelf amps... But have you considered anything like Tru Tech tube amp? since you are going for sq and not spl you might look into a tube style amp... They have a warm sound that is awesome


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## Catman (Mar 18, 2008)

Curlystereo said:


> Not to downgrade Mac amps because they are top shelf amps... But have you considered anything like Tru Tech tube amp? since you are going for sq and not spl you might look into a tube style amp... They have a warm sound that is awesome


I own both TRU an McIntosh ...they are both nice. Unfortunately they are in different systems and I haven't had a chance to compare them A/B in the same car. You won't go wrong with either one.

>^..^<


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

duckymcse said:


> I'm currently running Alpine PDX 4.150 to handle my Dynaudio 242 (front) and DLS Nobelium 6.2 (rear) with an Eclipse CD7200 mkII. The sound is really good but yet I felt it can be better. I want to take my car audio to the next level of SQ.
> Will upgrading my PDX 4.150 to McIntosh MC404 make a big different in SQ?
> The reason I asked because the MC404 cost over $1000, that's a big investment. If there are any amp better than the MC404 at the same price range, please let me know. Thanks for any advice.


Zuki Eleets have excellent sound for [ a 4 channel , bout 400 bucks ]less money


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## MACS (Oct 3, 2007)

elparner said:


> Ask MACS, he might have something that could interest you and he is a great guy to deal with


Thanks for the vote of confidence elparner . 

The older MC amps are affordable and excellent performers, but the new MCC's have better crossovers and make more power bridged if that is important to you. If you have external processing or run passive crossovers I would just get the older amps and save some money. 

I've got a few extra 4 channel amps laying around. MC420, MC420M, MC431.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

Does Zuki Eleets have 4 channels with at least 100W RMS? If yes, do you know the name of the model?
Right now, McIntosh is on the top of my choice but if the Zuki have something similar to McIntosh in term of SQ and cheaper, I might look into it.




a$$hole said:


> Zuki Eleets have excellent sound for [ a 4 channel , bout 400 bucks ]less money


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

The MC431 is just right for me since I am running passive with 4 speakers. PM you asking for the price of the MC431. Thanks.



MACS said:


> Thanks for the vote of confidence elparner .
> 
> The older MC amps are affordable and excellent performers, but the new MCC's have better crossovers and make more power bridged if that is important to you. If you have external processing or run passive crossovers I would just get the older amps and save some money.
> 
> I've got a few extra 4 channel amps laying around. MC420, MC420M, MC431.


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## Patrick Bateman (Sep 11, 2006)

duckymcse said:


> I'm currently running Alpine PDX 4.150 to handle my Dynaudio 242 (front) and DLS Nobelium 6.2 (rear) with an Eclipse CD7200 mkII. The sound is really good but yet I felt it can be better. I want to take my car audio to the next level of SQ.
> Will upgrading my PDX 4.150 to McIntosh MC404 make a big different in SQ?
> The reason I asked because the MC404 cost over $1000, that's a big investment. If there are any amp better than the MC404 at the same price range, please let me know. Thanks for any advice.


Your $1000 would be better spent on refining the installation of your components. A thousand bucks isn't chump change, and there are dozens of things a good installer can do to improve your sound quality.

Just off the top of my head, here's a few ideas:


Have your system profesionally measured and tweaked using a microphone, gated measurements, and an EQ. I'm using an Audio Control EQT and it works very well. There are digital options which cost more and work even better.
If you'd prefer to DIY, I've posted information on how to measure your car.
The crossover for your components set uses components that are very good, but you can do even better. For instance, there's an eloctrolytic cap in the crossover.
Where are those tweeters mounted? Their location and direction will be critical.
A professional installer could dial in a bit of time delay, which would make an audible improvement if done correctly and carefully.


McIntosh makes nice equipment, but I personally would recommend squeezing every lost drop of performance out of your existing system before swapping amplifiers. The difference between an excellent and an average install is bigger than the difference between an excellent and an average amplifier.

P.S. This is your crossover - note the $1 electrolytic cap?


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

Patrick Bateman said:


> ...The difference between an excellent and an average install is bigger than the difference between an excellent and an average amplifier...


Excellent point, good way to put that.


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## Patrick Bateman (Sep 11, 2006)

TREETOP said:


> Excellent point, good way to put that.


Having said that, I'm looking forward to the point when my system is finished, and I can obsess over amplifier and DAC options 

Winslow built a mini Aleph amp, think I might do that too. It's about $100-$150 in parts, so not a huge investment.

6moons audio reviews: Reality Check with Terry Aben


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

Based on the image, which one is the electrolytic cap?
What do I replace it with to make it sound better?



Patrick Bateman said:


> P.S. This is your crossover - note the $1 electrolytic cap?


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## ZZROCOOL (Jun 1, 2009)

the cap is not the problem, stereo equipment is a SUM of its parts the make a system selected to work together! I agree to get the most out of your existing system before changing things the difference between Alpine and McIntoch are *NIGHT AND DAY*
we are not talking about a small upgrade. I do agree that you need to educate yourself on setup or have it done professionally. 

I have 4 cars with systems in them 
McIntosh & Morel Elate
Audison & Dynaudio
Rainbow & Alipne
Elemental & Diamond Audio

in fact the Dynaudio & Audison using a bit 1 processor doesnt come close to the musicality and 'musical rightness" provided by the McIntoch Morel system. Now there are 100's of factors but the large majority is IMO the amps. You could spend tons of time tuning the system but if the pieces are not matched well or just aren't that good you will never get the results you are hoping for. 
CONSIDER THIS
Dynaudio is a legendary Audio/speaker speciality manufacture, 
Alpine is a general "we make everything" car electronics manufacture

McIntosh is also a legendary Audio/speaker speciality manufacture 

It would seem to me that the motivation by each is different which = different priorities when building a product. 
I speak from a lot of experience though not an expert in 12V I do home A/V for almost 15 years and sell many great products, so I have sometimes overly high and unrealistic expectations for the results in my cars. However I do understand different manufactures design, build, and market products. Alpine is like Denon in my world they do everything well but do nothing exceptionally. Dynaudio, McIntosh, Tru, etc etc ( I am not advocating for the McIntosh, just a better amp) do a small number of things exceptionally! 

Call Emilios at Dynaudio and he will tell you flat out that the Alpine amps aren't good enough to properly drive those speakers! 

LAST POINT - INSTALL AND SETUP ARE MORE IMPORTANT THE BOTH REGARDLESS OF EQUIPMENT


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## Patrick Bateman (Sep 11, 2006)

duckymcse said:


> Based on the image, which one is the electrolytic cap?
> What do I replace it with to make it sound better?


Those big black caps are from Solen; the yellow cap is an electrolytic. Solen sells excellent and reasonably priced caps. There *are* more expensive options, if you're in the mood to tweak something.

It looks like your head unit includes digital delay and EQ; have you had your car measured with a microphone, preferably using gated measurements? Or was everything adjusted by ear?

You need a microphone to do the EQ and delay accurately, but it can bring things to "the next level."

Whatever you do, don't do it by ear; going that route could make things worse.

Digital delay will affect the frequency response, and the EQ will too, so adjustments require patience and a mic.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

All my adjustment is done by ear. I spend countless hours (almost everyday) adjusting crossover, EQ, TA, etc to get to point where I think I am maxing out the SQ on my car audio. I don't really believe in third party device to do the adjustment for me. I'm happy with the way my system sound with the Alpine PDX amp as of now. It's does sound warm and dynamic unlike other people experience with this amp (maybe my Eclipse HU got something to do with it). But when it come to audio, you never satisfy with what you had and alway thinking there are better equipments out there. The only way to find out is to ask (which I did) and do it yourself (which I will buy the McIntosh amp if I can find a good deal for it).

As for your advice, maybe I should give it a try and see. The microphone for my Eclipse only cost $25, so it's not too bad to try it. I doubt it will help me much, but than again I will never know until I try it. At least it will keep my mind out of the McIntosh amp for a while 



Patrick Bateman said:


> It looks like your head unit includes digital delay and EQ; have you had your car measured with a microphone, preferably using gated measurements? Or was everything adjusted by ear?
> 
> You need a microphone to do the EQ and delay accurately, but it can bring things to "the next level."
> 
> ...


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

Patrick Bateman said:


> Those big black caps are from Solen; the yellow cap is an electrolytic. Solen sells excellent and reasonably priced caps. There *are* more expensive options, if you're in the mood to tweak something.
> 
> It looks like your head unit includes digital delay and EQ; have you had your car measured with a microphone, preferably using gated measurements? Or was everything adjusted by ear?
> 
> ...


With all due respect, this is garbage. I don't _listen_ to music with a microphone, I _listen_ with my ears. The ears are the most powerful tool in the tuning toolbox in my opinion.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

TREETOP said:


> With all due respect, this is garbage. I don't _listen_ to music with a microphone, I _listen_ with my ears. The ears are the most powerful tool in the tuning toolbox in my opinion.


5 bucks says you can't do time alignment by ear...... In the reasonable time of a tortoise lifetime.... I'll even buy the beer. Setting time alignment properly needs to be done with test equipment... at LEAST a tape measure to get it close THEN you still won't know real numbers. and i can assure you that after doing it in 10 minutes with a good test rig.. it WILL sound good...... 

I have to agree with you on the EQ thing however.


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

chad said:


> 5 bucks says you can't do time alignment by ear...... In the reasonable time of a tortoise lifetime.... I'll even buy the beer. Setting time alignment properly needs to be done with test equipment... at LEAST a tape measure to get it close THEN you still won't know real numbers. and i can assure you that after doing it in 10 minutes with a good test rig.. it WILL sound good......
> 
> I have to agree with you on the EQ thing however.


Mmmmm BEER. 

Yeah I use a tape measure too, but ultimately I have to listen with my ears so they're the reference I use to tune with also. 
Maybe I haven't been exposed enough to fancy test equipment yet, I work with what I've got.


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## MACS (Oct 3, 2007)

ZZROCOOL said:


> McIntosh is also a legendary Audio/speaker speciality manufacture


McIntosh isn't a speaker manufacturer, so not fair to call them "legendary" in that market segment. Amps? Yes. Speakers? No.

Their speaker offerings have fallen short for decades and have for the most part been rebadged variants from other manufacturers that are placed in McIntosh cabinetry. The car audio speakers are no different. I love McIntosh amps and source units (car and home), but you couldn't pay me to use their speakers.


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## Catman (Mar 18, 2008)

MACS said:


> McIntosh isn't a speaker manufacturer, so not fair to call them "legendary" in that market segment. Amps? Yes. Speakers? No.
> 
> Their speaker offerings have fallen short for decades and have for the most part been rebadged variants from other manufacturers that are placed in McIntosh cabinetry. The car audio speakers are no different. I love McIntosh amps and source units (car and home), but you couldn't pay me to use their speakers.


I agree totally. I have used McIntosh speakers in the past. They are OK ...not great. The last ones I owned were (IIRC) 8" subs ....the ID8's are MUCH better.

>^..^<


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## ZZROCOOL (Jun 1, 2009)

MACS said:


> McIntosh isn't a speaker manufacturer, so not fair to call them "legendary" in that market segment. Amps? Yes. Speakers? No.
> 
> Their speaker offerings have fallen short for decades and have for the most part been rebadged variants from other manufacturers that are placed in McIntosh cabinetry. The car audio speakers are no different. I love McIntosh amps and source units (car and home), but you couldn't pay me to use their speakers.


matter of opinion, AND McIntosh *IS *a speaker manufacture, they make and sell them which I believe qualifies

McIntosh | Loudspeakers
McIntosh | MSS530

they certainly are better then most of the mass market stuff, ie Alpine speakers, most of the JL, etc etc (though again is an opinion)
also at no point did I mention he should use their speakers and considering the conversation was about him changing amps I am not sure why you felt the comment was necessary. 
ALSO they receive very high praise for both their home and car speakers considering thats not their thing!


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## rexroadj (Oct 31, 2008)

Actually *Most* of the speakers "made" by Mcintosh are from VIFA or other parent driver companys, as are some of alpine's and JL. Several car audio manufactures we know and love/hate use some of the big raw driver company's to produce there lines for them (vifa, scan, seas, morel, etc....). I will look around my shop, I am pretty sure I have a set of Mcintosh 5.25 midbass drivers that say mcintosh on them and then there is a stamp or fine print that says vifa. Some of there home lines (speakers) yes are rated very very well, and with good reason. However they did not make the actual drivers (look it up, its pretty common knowledge and easy to research) There car components are pretty good, really love the xovers for them as far as passives go. I would not say they get much praise in that arena either. They are very good/decent but that is about the extent to which I would every rate them as. Electronics however they are absolute legends and can hold there own with anyone! This was nto a dig to anyone, I am just stating facts about the origin of the drivers used in several home and all car mcintosh speaker systems.


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## MACS (Oct 3, 2007)

ZZROCOOL said:


> matter of opinion, AND McIntosh *IS *a speaker manufacture, they make and sell them which I believe qualifies
> 
> McIntosh | Loudspeakers
> McIntosh | MSS530
> ...


I was just making the point that McIntosh does not make their own drivers. Your statement, "_McIntosh is also a legendary Audio/speaker speciality manufacture_" might lead someone to wrongly think otherwise. 

I owned a set of McIntosh MSS630 car audio speakers. They were rebadged Vifas and nothing more. I've auditioned both their home and car audio line and was in no way impressed by them. My opinion and the opinion of many others as well. Take it for what it's worth. 

MSS630 = rebadged Vifa drivers with a high price tag. All day, every day.


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

MACS said:


> I was just making the point that McIntosh does not make their own drivers. Your statement, "_McIntosh is also a legendary Audio/speaker speciality manufacture_" might lead someone to wrongly think otherwise.
> 
> I owned a set of McIntosh MSS630 car audio speakers. They were rebadged Vifas and nothing more. I've auditioned both their home and car audio line and was in no way impressed by them. My opinion and the opinion of many others as well. Take it for what it's worth.
> 
> MSS630 = rebadged Vifa drivers with a high price tag. All day, every day.


I've installed McIntosh components on a number of occasions, and I was left disappointed every time. I found them to be dull, flat, and lifeless, almost like they absorbed the feeling of the music and only shared a little bit with the listener..


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## kidlat (Aug 27, 2009)

ZZROCOOL said:


> the cap is not the problem, stereo equipment is a SUM of its parts the make a system selected to work together! I agree to get the most out of your existing system before changing things the difference between Alpine and McIntoch are *NIGHT AND DAY*
> we are not talking about a small upgrade. I do agree that you need to educate yourself on setup or have it done professionally.
> 
> I have 4 cars with systems in them
> ...




i totally agree with you on the mcintosh morel combo. i am using more picolo, cdm 54, supremo6 and ultimos in a 4 way active set up driven by macs. couldnt ask for more.


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

Here ya go 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/classifieds/65961-mcintosh-mc4000m-six-channel-beast-sale.html

from Macs himself


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## ZZROCOOL (Jun 1, 2009)

MACS said:


> I was just making the point that McIntosh does not make their own drivers. Your statement, "_McIntosh is also a legendary Audio/speaker speciality manufacture_" might lead someone to wrongly think otherwise.
> 
> I owned a set of McIntosh MSS630 car audio speakers. They were rebadged Vifas and nothing more. I've auditioned both their home and car audio line and was in no way impressed by them. My opinion and the opinion of many others as well. Take it for what it's worth.
> 
> MSS630 = rebadged Vifa drivers with a high price tag. All day, every day.


ALMOST all speakers that are sold are sourced from of 5 or 6 "driver" manufactures (Vifa, Seas, Focal, Scanspek, to name a few) The drivers are selected or ordered to a manufactures spec. They are not always simply "rebadged", very often they are tweaked to fit a specific application. McIntosh speakers may not be your taste but they are certainly better then the boom and sizzle audio brands. JL (which I think are HORRIBLE), Alpine, etc etc. That being said the thread wasn't about changing speakers and my comments we not about McIntosh speakers in fact I didn't refer to them at all except in saying "McIntosh is a legendary amplifier/speaker manufacture" 
which you felt the need to point out first that McIntosh didn't make speakers (wrong) and that they were just rebadged vifa, point is who cares we were not discussing the speakers just discussing McIntosh's place as a high performance quality first manufacture. Please don't comment just for the sake of making useless off topic points which are based only in your opinion and to feel like you need to correct me. Everything I have said is factual and correct. 

BACK ON TOPIC THE AMPS ARE BAD A$$ AND WILL TORCH THE PERFORMANCE OF THE ALIPNE> OFFERING AN IMMEDIATE AND DECISIVE DIFFERENCE PERIOD.


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## 98RedGT (Jan 11, 2009)

I'd be interested to know a bit more about how you have your car set up before saying that the amount of money you will sink into the McIntosh amps will provide a clear difference over spending that money towards improving your install.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

I finally bid and won a brand new McIntosh MC404 for $1010 shipped from Ebay.
I hope it will arrive by next week.
Once it arrive, I will hook it up and compare with my current Alpine PDX 4.150.
I do expect a major improvement in SQ, if not I will be very disappointed.



98RedGT said:


> I'd be interested to know a bit more about how you have your car set up before saying that the amount of money you will sink into the McIntosh amps will provide a clear difference over spending that money towards improving your install.


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

Great price  list the auctioneer's name , please ! [ maybe they have more ]

*Quot:*

0 results found for McIntosh MC404 [ Save this searchSaved toMy eBay. ]
Preferences: *Completed listings* [ See only active listings | Edit preferences ]
Your search returned *0 items*.

*I searched and the only thing I could find was from a year ago and used.*
mint Mcinitosh MC404....SoCal $950.00 Amplifiers McIntosh 09/09/2007
McIntosh, AmplifiersMint condition....I bought it last year and used it on my car for 6 months...Then, i sold my car and has been kept in the box since then...

asking $950 OBO

Local pick up preferred

*Quot:*


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

Auctioneer name is sensuossoundsys. He probably got more since he asked me if I want to buy more.
Why are you asking if you going to sell your MC404?



a$$hole said:


> Great price  list the auctioneer's name , please ! [ maybe they have more ]
> 
> 0 results found for McIntosh MC404 [ Save this searchSaved toMy eBay. ]
> Preferences: *Completed listings* [ See only active listings | Edit preferences ]
> ...


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## joshyd (Dec 17, 2008)

One more vote for McIntosh amps. One of my friends upgraded 16 or so years ago and they are still running strong and they still sound better than 99% of the amps out there.


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## TREETOP (Feb 11, 2009)

duckymcse said:


> Auctioneer name is sensuossoundsys. He probably got more since he asked me if I want to buy more.
> Why are you asking if you going to sell your MC404?


He's not looking to sell, he just hasn't learned to use the quote tags properly. 

And the reason it doesn't show up as MC404 in an eBay search is because it's an MC*C*404.


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## Brian_smith06 (Jan 31, 2008)

I want to try out some mac amps :devil:


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

My McIntosh MCC404 amp arrived today. Got home from work and immediately install this beast. This amp is hugh and heavy compare to my PDX 4.150. It's like David vs Goliath.
Got everything wired up and very excited to hear the sound. Plug back in the battery negative wire and see a pop from the fuse. Check the fuse and it did fried. Check the wiring power/ground wire from the amp and I notice I connect it WRONG!!! NOOOO!!! Did I fried the amp?
I connect the power/ground correctly this time and replace the fried fuse(near the batter). Turn on the car and no sound 
The McIntosh did light up but no sound. I haven't check the 4 fuse inside the McIntosh. Since it is so dark outside, I have to check it tomorrow. I'm hoping one of the fuse inside the McIntosh fried. If none of the fuse is fried, is that mean the amp is dead?


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## placenta (Feb 2, 2008)

Dood... you reversed the polarity on your brand new McIntosh amp??? 

Might be blown.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

No kidding, I felt so sad right now. 
I still have one more hope that the internal fuse is blown. This is easy to fix.



placenta said:


> Dood... you reversed the polarity on your brand new McIntosh amp???
> 
> Might be blown.


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## m R g S r (Oct 1, 2009)

you guys are making me not want to go buy a pdx amp for my new civic lol


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## rexroadj (Oct 31, 2008)

I forget if the new macs have them or not.....but if you check near the power and ground terminals there are reset buttons (circuit breaker before the fuses) I know they older macs had them but do not recall if the new ones had them or not? Either way it is hightly unlikely that you "fried"the amp. They are almost indestructable (hence the $$$ the call) Good luck, and BE CAREFULL!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

m R g S R- dont waste your $ on the pdx unless it is the only amp that will fit in one particular spot. There are so many better amps out there with out that compressed sound! (just my opinion, of course


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## m R g S r (Oct 1, 2009)

i was really going for the tiny but powerful package, i didn't know they sounded so bad! i wanted to place it under the seat of my civic to 1. keep the trunk usable, and 2. run the shortest amount of wire possible, and 3. be able to tune the amp from inside the car.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

You are right, the MAC is indestructable 
I felt so stupid that the Mac tech guy asked me if I turn up the gain. I checked and all the gain knob was way down. I turn up the gain knob and sound coming out the speakers. I felt so happy now. I only listen to it for couple of minutes (I'm at work now) and I am impressed how quite and clean the MAC sound. I'll do more adjustment after work and see how good this MAC amp really is. 



rexroadj said:


> I forget if the new macs have them or not.....but if you check near the power and ground terminals there are reset buttons (circuit breaker before the fuses) I know they older macs had them but do not recall if the new ones had them or not? Either way it is hightly unlikely that you "fried"the amp. They are almost indestructable (hence the $$$ the call) Good luck, and BE CAREFULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> m R g S R- dont waste your $ on the pdx unless it is the only amp that will fit in one particular spot. There are so many better amps out there with out that compressed sound! (just my opinion, of course


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

I was thinking the same like you when I purchase the PDX amp. Put it under the sit and run the wires as short as possible. So far, I am impressed with the PDX amp. I think the PDX amp require good amount of EQ to make it sound good. Make sure your HU had good amound of EQ or a sound processor. The only problem with the PDX amp is when you turn it up loud, it tend to loose the musicality especially the vocal.
I'm give my impression of the PDX vs Mac maybe by Satursday night. It's a good comparison since I basically swap out the amp. I'm going to spend all day Satursday adjusting and listening to my newly bought MAC 



m R g S r said:


> i was really going for the tiny but powerful package, i didn't know they sounded so bad! i wanted to place it under the seat of my civic to 1. keep the trunk usable, and 2. run the shortest amount of wire possible, and 3. be able to tune the amp from inside the car.


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## zerodistortion (Jul 23, 2009)

PDX vs Mcintosh review....that would be interesting to read, since I've tested a PDX and a Mcintosh amp back-to-back. See if we had a similar experience with the two.


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## duckymcse (Mar 15, 2009)

I'm not a good reviewer on product. What I can do is provide my experience and opinion of what I found out. I spend a good amount of time today playing and listening to the MAC amp (MCC404). One word about this MAC amp: AWESOME  I'm not saying that to justify my cost, LOL, that just not me.
My original question, "Is it worth it to upgrade to MAC amp?", I can confidently say "YES!". Of course the majority of you MAC owner already knew that and I really appreciate your input which persuaded me to upgrade to the MAC. It worth every penny.
So, how does the PDX compare to the MAC? I'm sure many wants to know.
This is solely based on my opinion and got the oppurtunity to listen to both in the same setup and environment.
First of all, the PDX 4.150 is not a push over. Surprisely to me, it does stand it ground against the MAC in the lower to mid frequency. But when you get to the mid to high frequency, the PDX is no match for the MAC. The MAC just sound so much cleaner and more details. With the PDX, when I crank up to high volume, it lost alots of details in sound especially the vocals. With the MAC, even at high volume, the sound still maintain it clarity and details. I can listen to more than an hour at high volume with the MAC and my ear still doesn't felt fatique. This is not the case with the PDX.
The MAC is expensive, but it built quality and sound quality make it well woth it. I even plug in the negative/positive power wrong and saw the fuse near the battery blown up and yet the MAC still alive. 
Anway, the picture below worth a thousand words.




zerodistortion said:


> PDX vs Mcintosh review....that would be interesting to read, since I've tested a PDX and a Mcintosh amp back-to-back. See if we had a similar experience with the two.


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## zerodistortion (Jul 23, 2009)

Well said. I have many buddies running Macs from 97 and still running strong. You'll have many years of enjoyment with Mac's build quality! PDX are not bad, but I do find them pretty harsh on the highs with everything set at flat. Definately lacked details when volume is up. Congrats on finding the right amp for your set-up!


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## pnn23 (Jun 7, 2008)

That Mac is built like a brick sh!t house!


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