# Abyss



## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

finally got my dual monos and zelos


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

Oh just look at it! Would you look at it! Set it up so pretty for the pictures. Just look at it! Must be so proud! Wow, did ya look at it! Look!


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

TRUTHhz said:


> Oh just look at it! Would you look at it! Set it up so pretty for the pictures. Just look at it! Must be so proud! Wow, did ya look at it! Look!


thanks, glad you like


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

lmao!!!


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

thanks again


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## preston (Dec 10, 2007)

What vehicle are they going in and how do you plan to set them up speaker wise ? What amps are you replacing ?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

They truly are friggen magnificent... 
Any chance you could pull them out of the plastic so I can really jerk off? (I mean have a good look)

I'd also like to know what vehicle they will be going into... and what speakers you will be pairing them to?


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

This looks like a $50,000 build, hope all your equipment matches this along with the sound deadening your doing, I would love to hear these, please do and share a build log. What head unit are you running?


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

better pics for you truthhz


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

jimmydee said:


> I'd also like to know what vehicle they will be going into...


Well, he did just have that gorgeous Fastback built. But, with the straight pipes on that sucker maybe not a great candidate for this gear.

Ge0


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

Porsche said:


> better pics for you truthhz
> View attachment 280120
> View attachment 280121
> View attachment 280122


I called my mom to show her, she’s just so proud of you! Roflmao!


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

TRUTHhz said:


> I called my mom to show her, she’s just so proud of you! Roflmao!


i know, when you called her it woke me up


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

Porsche said:


> i know, when you called her it woke me up


Why were you sleeping at the women’s hair salon? Odd place for an old bald guy.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

dude just go away, you are not relevant on this forum and at the end of the day you are a sad excuse of a human, your antics are weak.just walk away and get a life. Jesus loves u


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

In all seriousness they are beautiful! Tell us what the build is and vehicle? And by all means you gotta do a build log!


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

These amps are 7k each , sounds like a build for a person with zero money issues


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

drphilb said:


> These amps are 7k each , sounds like a build for a person with zero money issues


I don't have money issues either... as long as I'm not buying a table full of $7,000 amps!


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

I very much appreciate high sound / build quality gear Porsche. Unfortunately I fear these amps cross the line into over priced gimmick. I admit I have never heard them so can't make a fair assessment. But, in your words what makes these so [email protected] good? 

Can you hear the difference between 0.01% and 0.001% distortion an amp adds to your music? I would think the distortion produced by the best loudspeakers you can buy which is a factor of 10x greater would dominate.

Ge0


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

Ge0 said:


> I very much appreciate high sound / build quality gear Porsche. Unfortunately I fear these amps cross the line into over priced gimmick. I admit I have never heard them so can't make a fair assessment. But, in your words what makes these so [email protected] good?
> 
> Can you hear the difference between 0.01% and 0.001% distortion an amp adds to your music? I would think the distortion produced by the best loudspeakers you can buy which is a factor of 10x greater would dominate.
> 
> Ge0


These medium good speakers are around ~0.001 to 0.01 dB THD:





ScanSpeak Revelator 12M/4631-G00 4.5″ Midrange Driver Review


ScanSpeak Revelator 12M/4631-G00 4.5″ Midrange Driver




www.erinsaudiocorner.com





The 18Wu was even better from memory??

So at some point the low distortion amps require low distortion speakers, and these high end builds are nice to see... so I wish Porsche well with it.

While those Abyss look stunning, and I would like a set... my amps are probably not much worse, and the vehicle makes a huge different in noise.
And I suspect that the abyss also do not hiss like a pit full of vipers.


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Porsche said:


> finally got my dual monos and zelos
> 
> View attachment 280109
> View attachment 280110


Nice. Almost too scary to take them out of the plastic. 😄 dont these guys make a legendary head unit too? That someone on this forum might have a pair of?


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

Sam Spade said:


> Nice. Almost too scary to take them out of the plastic. 😄 dont these guys make a legendary head unit too? That someone on this forum might have a pair of?


Sam,
I have two... do you want one?


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Ge0 said:


> I very much appreciate high sound / build quality gear Porsche. Unfortunately I fear these amps cross the line into over priced gimmick. I admit I have never heard them so can't make a fair assessment. But, in your words what makes these so [email protected] good?
> 
> Can you hear the difference between 0.01% and 0.001% distortion an amp adds to your music? I would think the distortion produced by the best loudspeakers you can buy which is a factor of 10x greater would dominate.
> 
> Ge0


There are diminishing returns. I was looking at krell class A home amps yesterday. $10k for a 200wpc power amp. They are most certainly better sounding than my $3k 200wpc rotel. So it isnt just about power. But i can't convince the wife oops i mean justify the cash. Selling home hifi putting any speaker on a $10k amp made it sound completely different than a 1k amp. But that was cheating so we didnt use it as a sales technique. We did blind tests too. It wasn't just confirmation bias. More money doesn't guarantee a better sound. While the $10K nakamichi pre power was sublime the very expensive nakamichi cd player in the same range was no match for much cheaper rotels and especially marantz.


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Holmz said:


> Sam,
> I have two... do you want one?


No unless it's for my birthday 🤣 but you should post us a pic and tell us how you got them 😄


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

Sam Spade said:


> There are diminishing returns. ...


^Says the fellow moving from Helix to Brax^ 




Sam Spade said:


> No unless it's for my birthday ...


Treat yourself. You know the source is the best place to start 




Sam Spade said:


> ... and tell us how you got them 😄


Paid the money, and I got them shipped.


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

Porsche said:


> dude just go away, you are not relevant on this forum and at the end of the day you are a sad excuse of a human, your antics are weak.just walk away and get a life. Jesus loves u





Porsche said:


> dude just go away, you are not relevant on this forum and at the end of the day you are a sad excuse of a human, your antics are weak.just walk away and get a life. Jesus loves u


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Holmz said:


> ^Says the fellow moving from Helix to Brax^
> 
> 
> 
> ...


New or 2nd hand? The most unique stuff I've picked up is 2nd hand.


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

2nd...
The nakamichi was NIB.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

jimmydee said:


> They truly are friggen magnificent...
> Any chance you could pull them out of the plastic so I can really jerk off? (I mean have a good look)
> 
> I'd also like to know what vehicle they will be going into... and what speakers you will be pairing them to?



they are going in my panamera turbo.


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

Porsche, I have a brand new Stage 4 Pioneer DEX-P99RS along with the HD Radio accessory. Let me know if your interested, I decided to go around my factory system and go all digital to the DSP so I am not going to use it.


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## lingling1337 (Oct 14, 2019)

Porsche, what DAC units are you planning to run?


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

Porsche, maybe consider having Musicar Northwest do your build, Tom is quite the fabricator and has gotten installer of the year multiple times.musicarnw.com | World-Class Audio and Electronics Integration Considering the value of your car an the cost of your equipment


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

drphilb said:


> Porsche, maybe consider having Musicar Northwest do your build, Tom is quite the fabricator and has gotten installer of the year multiple times.musicarnw.com | World-Class Audio and Electronics Integration Considering the value of your car an the cost of your equipment


I'm pretty sure Porsche is all set from the installer perspective. Do you have any idea how many cars he has? 

I agree though. I do like some of Musicar's work. They gave me ideas for my install.

Ge0


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

No , just a thought


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> Porsche, maybe consider having Musicar Northwest do your build, Tom is quite the fabricator and has gotten installer of the year multiple times.musicarnw.com | World-Class Audio and Electronics Integration Considering the value of your car an the cost of your equipment


naw, im good, thanks for recommendation tho, i have it covered


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## chargedtaco (Feb 27, 2008)

Porsche said:


> they are going in my panamera turbo.


Please don't tell me you have the Burmester system. I have it in my 971 and taking it out has never crossed my mind.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

chargedtaco said:


> Please don't tell me you have the Burmester system. I have it in my 971 and taking it out has never crossed my mind.


have the bose. which panny u have


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

chargedtaco said:


> Please don't tell me you have the Burmester system. I have it in my 971 and taking it out has never crossed my mind.


Did you actually spec your build with the Burmester system?

Ge0


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## LBaudio (Jan 9, 2009)

congrats for purchase! Hope you will be happy with them sonically and visually!


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

I am looking forward to your build log, I would love to learn more on your fabrication and overall system planning. I have a very involved one going on myself and so looking forward to learning something new from your experience


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

drphilb said:


> I am looking forward to your build log, I would love to learn more on your fabrication and overall system planning. I have a very involved one going on myself and so looking forward to learning something new from your experience


Lmao!!! You are going to learn how someone drops their vehicle off at a shop, that’s about it!


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

My bad, I thought he was doing the work


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

TRUTHhz said:


> Lmao!!! You are going to learn how someone drops their vehicle off at a shop, that’s about it!


very true. im not like folks in the atlanta area that claim to have done and worked on world class installs with some of the best in the business, prefer to pay a pro that i trust and be done with it instead of always chasing gremlins/issues like someone in the atlanta area, prefer to enjoy it instead of claim to know how to do it, its not my expertise, much like someone in the atlanta area as well


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

Ge0 said:


> I very much appreciate high sound / build quality gear Porsche. Unfortunately I fear these amps cross the line into over priced gimmick. I admit I have never heard them so can't make a fair assessment. But, in your words what makes these so [email protected] good?
> 
> Can you hear the difference between 0.01% and 0.001% distortion an amp adds to your music? I would think the distortion produced by the best loudspeakers you can buy which is a factor of 10x greater would dominate.
> 
> Ge0


I have the same question although I dont ever knock a man and his money or ability to spend his money. I would love to hear a head to head testing to see if you would hear or test any differences in a 8k amp and lets say a 1K amp. I think at a certain point you just hit diminishing returns. This just reminds me when I purchased my first what I call decent watch. My father saw it and asked about price. reluctantly told him and he went upstairs and got his Timex which was something like 10 years old. He sat it on the table and said you paid x amount more than this and it does the same thing, tells time. 

Beautiful amps either way and looking forward to the install.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> My bad, I thought he was doing the work


nope, but there will be a build log like the other cars i have done. i do not have the time or patience to install car audio nor the expertise, mush like an atlanta installer around this forum


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Jroo said:


> I have the same question although I dont ever knock a man and his money or ability to spend his money. I would love to hear a head to head testing to see if you would hear or test any differences in a 8k amp and lets say a 1K amp. I think at a certain point you just hit diminishing returns. This just reminds me when I purchased my first what I call decent watch. My father saw it and asked about price. reluctantly told him and he went upstairs and got his Timex which was something like 10 years old. He sat it on the table and said you paid x amount more than this and it does the same thing, tells time.
> 
> Beautiful amps either way and looking forward to the install.


Don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking Chris or his ability to spend his money as he sees fit. That's his decision. I'd just like to understand what benefits he hopes to gain. I've never had the opportunity to make such a comparison.

Funny you should mention watches. My Father-in-law did the same thing with his Timex the first time I showed him the TAG his daughter bought me for my birthday. I didn't bother bringing up my Panerai Luminor I purchased a few years later .

Ge0


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

TRUTHhz said:


> Lmao!!! You are going to learn how someone drops their vehicle off at a shop, that’s about it!


hilarious


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Sam Spade said:


> hilarious


whats funny?


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Porsche said:


> whats funny?


This is funny  I would have given the same answer


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Sam Spade said:


> This is funny  I would have given the same answer
> 
> View attachment 280584


good for you


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Why is there so much a$$ fuggery going on around this forum lately. Why spam someone's thread with useless garbage? Starting to become a common theme.

Ge0


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Ge0 said:


> Why is there so much a$$ fuggery going on around this forum lately. Why spam someone's thread with useless garbage? Starting to become a common theme.
> 
> Ge0


jealousy and envy is a *****, this forum is a shadow of what it was. sad, it use to be a cool place to chat and discuss our systems, now its just a whine fest with a bunch of morons.


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Porsche said:


> jealousy and envy is a ***, this forum is a shadow of what it was. sad, it use to be a cool place to chat and discuss our systems, now its just a whine fest with a bunch of morons.


Well, I have to agree to some extent. There are a bunch of morons around here. I'll try to get more smarter and stuff 

Ge0


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

On a side note those gold amps are going to look badass in a black Panny. What color is the interior?

Ge0


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

Porsche said:


> jealousy and envy is a ***, this forum is a shadow of what it was. sad, it use to be a cool place to chat and discuss our systems, now its just a whine fest with a bunch of morons.


I mean, yes it has gone to ****, but I don't think showing those expensive of amps being installed by a shop would have had any better of a response 10-15 years ago. Not exactly what this forum was made for. In fact, I think the place this forum used to be would have been a lot harsher on you. Not even like you discussed anything system wise, just showed off really expensive amps.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Niebur3 said:


> I mean, yes it has gone to ****, but I don't think showing those expensive of amps being installed by a shop would have had any better of a response 10-15 years ago. Not exactly what this forum was made for. In fact, I think the place this forum used to be would have been a lot harsher on you. Not even like you discussed anything system wise, just showed off really expensive amps.


let me get this straight, this is a forum about car audio. i post that my amps came in and thats showing off because they are expensive, but i guess if they $299 alpine amps than its all good. an since i do not do my own installs and i pay a pro which folks like you should be thankful for than i guess im a poser. your logic is fu==ed, go screw your self neibur, an by the way i retract my statement about you being a pro. i wonder if you would think that if i was paying you to install them, don't worry, never happen, im going with nick on this one. oh, an thanks for driving my earlier point home


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

This is a DIY forum more than a equipment forum so we can all learn from each other. One of the biggest reasons I decided to do the build myself is I was quoted 30k from 2 shops to do my build. I could not justify that and for the most part I don't trust most installers not to say there are not great ones out there. Part of the issue these days around social media is the hate that seems to come out and god forbid if your wrong about something everyone jumps all over you. I blew it on an earlier topic and gave incorrect information and was corrected. I thanked the group for the info because we all should help each other out. But there will be lots of forks in the road and a few different ways of doing things. Skill sets help the job go faster and with less effort and if you have the tools the fabrication comes out better. But looks is one thing and sound is another. Cost for most is the limiting factor of the cool **** but does not mean that the sound is better. With anything, there are diminishing returns but the quest for excellence is what some of us are after. I think the tuning is the most important part of the build because if you know what your doing most equipment comes out sounding pretty good. Of course its great to get to the next level and experience it for yourself


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

Porsche said:


> let me get this straight, this is a forum about car audio. i post that my amps came in and thats showing off because they are expensive, but i guess if they $299 alpine amps than its all good. an since i do not do my own installs and i pay a pro which folks like you should be thankful for than i guess im a poser. your logic is fu==ed, go screw your self neibur, an by the way i retract my statement about you being a pro. i wonder if you would think that if i was paying you to install them, don't worry, never happen, im going with nick on this one. oh, an thanks for driving my earlier point home


Really Dude? You think this is at all what this forum was built on? I didn't have a problem with anything you did until you tried to say the "old forum" was better for a thread like this. People got flamed for buying Alpine on the "old forum". Get a clue dude. 

I have no problem with you spending your money the way you see fit. Or getting a pro to install it. But that is NOT what the forum was originally about. If you don't understand that, then you might need a forum history lesson.

And FWIW, those amp look amazing and Nick is a really smart choice for an installer.


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Niebur3 said:


> Really Dude? You think this is at all what this forum was built on? I didn't have a problem with anything you did until you tried to say the "old forum" was better for a thread like this. People got flamed for buying Alpine on the "old forum". Get a clue dude.
> 
> I have no problem with you spending your money the way you see fit. Or getting a pro to install it. But that is NOT what the forum was originally about. If you don't understand that, then you might need a forum history lesson.
> 
> And FWIW, those amp look amazing and Nick is a really smart choice for an installer.


OK. Now I feel compelled to play moderator here. Jerry, glad you took the direction you did on this one. You could have went the opposite route but decided to keep it civil.

Ge0


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## 218625 (Jun 18, 2020)




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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Easy fellas... this is quickly getting nasty, and it doesn't need to.

Looking forward to seeing the Apicella Build Log.


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## tranv9565 (Jun 6, 2017)

The guy made a thread on some new amps he received. I'm sure he was excited to show the community. I don't understand what people's issues are here. I love seeing photos and reading comments about these ultra high end amps, speakers, DSP, etc. 

Keep posting these threads Porsche! Love seeing them, especially your previous build logs from Audio X!


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

I LIKE me some amp porn and the pics that Porsche posted are definetely worthy amp porn!!!

That said, I can say without a doubt that diyma as a forum has strayed far from its roots, though IMO that has nothing to do with Porsche and everything to do with the recent ownership and admin change.


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

seafish said:


> I LIKE me some amp porn and the pics that Porsche posted are definetely worthy amp porn!!!
> 
> That said, I can say without a doubt that diyma as a forum has strayed far from its roots, though IMO that has nothing to do with Porsche and everything to do with the recent ownership and admin change.


Let's not fool ourselves. The forum is what the members make of it. Focus deviated from "doing it home grown on the cheap" years ago.

Ge0


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## Patriot83 (May 10, 2017)

I don't get why a few get so butt hurt over a few pics. Be glad he showed them as most will never get to see them in person. If I spent 30-40K on just amps I'd damn sure get a pro to do a top notch install as would most people. Besides, who wouldn't want Nick doing their install?


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Jroo said:


> I have the same question although I dont ever knock a man and his money or ability to spend his money. I would love to hear a head to head testing to see if you would hear or test any differences in a 8k amp and lets say a 1K amp. I think at a certain point you just hit diminishing returns. This just reminds me when I purchased my first what I call decent watch. My father saw it and asked about price. reluctantly told him and he went upstairs and got his Timex which was something like 10 years old. He sat it on the table and said you paid x amount more than this and it does the same thing, tells time.
> 
> Beautiful amps either way and looking forward to the install.


I sold home hifi while I was at Uni in the early '90s, dream job. Our two stores had some remarkable gear and some of it was very rare and expensive.

The question isn't "does gear sound different or better", it's whether you can afford it, whether you can justify it in terms of value, or whatever else motivates you.

The AU$10,000 Nakamichi 200 watt pc into 8 ohms pre power and the Marantz PM95 AU$6,000 integrated were unbelievable. The Nakamichi tape decks were amazing too, the Dragon and the other top models. The two box Marantz CD12LE was getting close to ten grand and it was unbelievable, only 5 came into Australia, and I'd back it against most current CD players. This is all 1990 dollars.

In contrast the Nakamichi CD players and receivers underperformed badly compared to other brands. So being expensive doesn't always guarantee performance.

But also, we sold a lot of AU$600 amps (and CD players). Stretching my memory I think they were the Marantz PM50, Rotel RA-940BX and the Pioneer A400, all about 50wpc into 8 ohms. They all sounded different. If three $600 amps can sound different then most gear will too.

And if porshe can afford those awesome looking amps good on him. We all have our hobbies.


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Porsche said:


> jealousy and envy is a ***, this forum is a shadow of what it was. sad, it use to be a cool place to chat and discuss our systems, now its just a whine fest with a bunch of morons.


Before you trash the forum consider the viewpoint of a newbie. 

I have learned so much here in the past year, excellent car audio threads, met some great people, and had some interesting off topic threads. I think it's great, but I wasn't here 10 years ago. And while I mostly use an installer, I've been inspired and am doing some stuff myself. The lack of a garage in an inner city townhouse makes DIY difficult too.

Critically, even if you aren't a DIY person, I've learned stuff that helps me deal with installers.

And car audio is a different beast, I arrived here with a lot of knowledge and experience in home hifi, head fi and portables/DAPs. And while there is significant overlap across platforms the learnings I've got about car audio have been great.


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Coming from someone who has over $20K wrapped up into watches, $12K in bicycles, not to mention computer equipment. I appreciate seeing how Porsche indulged in amplifiers. I do have one question though.

In the first post of this thread. Is that a BOSE Wave radio I see on top of Porsche's entertainment console? Take a close look









Amazon.com: Bose Wave SoundTouch Music System IV, works with Alexa, Espresso Black : Electronics


Amazon.com: Bose Wave SoundTouch Music System IV, works with Alexa, Espresso Black : Electronics



www.amazon.com





LOL!!!

Ge0


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

McLovin said:


>


I like your sense of humor. The only references you have not made so far that are dear to my heart are South Park, Kick Ass, and Napoleon Dynamite .

Oh, and a lot of Ryan Renolds stuff. Ever see the movie Waiting? I'm sure you know Deadpool...

Ge0


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Ge0 said:


> Let's not fool ourselves. The forum is what the members make of it. Focus deviated from "doing it home grown on the cheap" years ago.
> 
> Ge0


like it said, its sad what it has become over the years, everything is a pissing match on here instead of discussing our hobby


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

And what exactly did you discuss? You showed pics of amps. Did say anything about them (other than the fact they were dual monos and zelos) or why you choose them or who was doing the install or the car it was going in. You gave flip answers to anyone asking questions. You made it the thread it is. And then you ***** at me when I said you "showed off really expensive amps" and of course you take that as me saying you were "showing off" (2 different things). So, maybe next time, actually discuss our hobby......you made this thread the pissing match it has become. 

So, Lets try this again.......Those are amazing looking amps that happen to be very expensive (not a dig, just a fact) that I'm sure Nick (Apicella Auto Sound for those who don't know) will do a world class install with. What will the rest of the system consist of? Why did you choose these particular amps? Please tell us more!


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Niebur3 said:


> Really Dude? You think this is at all what this forum was built on? I didn't have a problem with anything you did until you tried to say the "old forum" was better for a thread like this. People got flamed for buying Alpine on the "old forum". Get a clue dude.
> 
> I have no problem with you spending your money the way you see fit. Or getting a pro to install it. But that is NOT what the forum was originally about. If you don't understand that, then you might need a forum history lesson.
> 
> And FWIW, those amp look amazing and Nick is a really smart choice for an installer.


Thanks for the kind words, but... What does it matter what the forum WAS about? It wasn't meant for professional installers and their customers and also wasn't meant for internet dealers to hang around just to get sales... don't be a hypocrite 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Mad Scientist (Feb 12, 2017)

From a design and construction point of view, it's surprising to see Abyss use a very traditional / standard cut to length heat sink design. They mention the design pays homage to 90's amps, (which is clearly visible in their construction), and to dress it up they've been anodized, but I also see Abyss using stamped 18 gauge stainless steel covers for the sides of the case which seems rather odd. Even their own MFA series has thicker endplates than the Class A does. Speaking of class A, due to the additional heat inherent in class A design, why not use a full copper heat sink? Without being overly technical, copper has a BTU thermal conductivity of 223 while aluminum is only 118. Yes, copper is much more expensive, but at $9k there's plenty of margin in the pricing to use copper. Or, you might say asethically speaking, copper is prone to tarnishing (which is very true), but there are modern methods to address this issue as well. Using aluminum is likely more than sufficient, and I'm certain it's more than capable of dissipating the thermal load of the amps, but it would have been nice to see more premium materials. -Or, at least in a more creative way. The more I look at them, the more they remind me of Linear Power's amps.

Make no mistake, I'd love to have these, and I'm sure many here on the forum would as well, but as a scientist / engineer, there are aspects of these amps that are visually surprising considering the $9k price point. To be clear, I'm not trying to knock on these amps.... truely, I'm not, but I can't help but notice very similar heat sinks and stamped steel endplates as $200 amps. 

Hopefully Abyss makes up for the above with their internals, and I'd love to see those internals (as I'm sure others would be as well). 

I wish Chris and Nick all the best in this build, and I'm anxious to see the end result as I'm certain it will be stunning.


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## preston (Dec 10, 2007)

> also wasn't meant for internet dealers to hang around just to get sales


ooh burn.

As a member since 2007 I don't particularly care what the forum used to be about I only care what it is about now. And I'm just thankful it exists. been into car audio for 30 years and admit i've only gone to one comp, but other than that I've never met anyone that really cared or knew anything about it. This forum is a lifeline for me ha ha, I don't care whether its DIY'ers trying to bondo some crappy pillar together or Skizer making tiny acrylic grille highlights, or questions about a 2001 Clarion head unit.

It would be interesting to hear about the topology and components of these amps and what makes them special.
I don't even know how you guys find out about these kinds of things, never heard of them before.


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

preston said:


> ooh burn.
> 
> As a member since 2007 I don't particularly care what the forum used to be about I only care what it is about now. And I'm just thankful it exists. been into car audio for 30 years and admit i've only gone to one comp, but other than that I've never met anyone that really cared or knew anything about it. This forum is a lifeline for me ha ha, I don't care whether its DIY'ers trying to bondo some crappy pillar together or Skizer making tiny acrylic grille highlights, or questions about a 2001 Clarion head unit.
> 
> ...


Very well said Preston. Thank you.

Ge0


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

SkizeR said:


> Thanks for the kind words, but... What does it matter what the forum WAS about? It wasn't meant for professional installers and their customers and also wasn't meant for internet dealers to hang around just to get sales... don't be a hypocrite
> 
> Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


IDK, Porsche is the one bringing up this place has gone to **** (a shadow of with it was and that it use to be a cool place to discuss his system - although didn't actually discuss anything, even when asked). Ask him why he brought it up, not me.

I keep hoping he will tell us more, as he claims he wants to discuss it, but he won't.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

Niebur3 said:


> IDK, Porsche is the one bringing up this place has gone to **** (a shadow of with it was and that it use to be a cool place to discuss his system - although didn't actually discuss anything, even when asked). Ask him why he brought it up, not me.
> 
> I keep hoping he will tell us more, as he claims he wants to discuss it, but he won't.


He ain't wrong. This place is a joke now

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Niebur3 said:


> IDK, Porsche is the one bringing up this place has gone to **** (a shadow of with it was and that it use to be a cool place to discuss his system - although didn't actually discuss anything, even when asked). Ask him why he brought it up, not me.
> 
> I keep hoping he will tell us more, as he claims he wants to discuss it, but he won't.


had no idea you the forum police, i made a topic to show the amps, have had several folks ask to see them, thats all niebuhr, sorry it doesn't meet your approval, not that i care


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## TRUTHhz (May 13, 2020)

YA! Just look at them! Did everyone get to look at them!


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

TRUTHhz said:


> YA! Just look at them! Did everyone get to look at them!


you really are a loser, such a pity


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

Porsche said:


> you really are a loser, such a pity


Dude why do you even bother engaging him? Most of us sheep are smarter than that! Seriously, this douche has issues... just couldn’t help myself any longer. Good luck with the build. JFC!


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

DaveG said:


> Dude why do you even bother engaging him? Most of us sheep are smarter than that! Seriously, this douche has issues... just couldn’t help myself any longer. Good luck with the build. JFC!


thanks


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

TRUTHhz said:


> YA! Just look at them! Did everyone get to look at them!


BANNED. That will work. Thx 

Ge0


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Ge0 said:


> BANNED. That will work. Thx
> 
> Ge0


yup


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## jrouter76 (Dec 21, 2005)

Porsche said:


> jealousy and envy is a ***, this forum is a shadow of what it was. sad, it use to be a cool place to chat and discuss our systems, now its just a whine fest with a bunch of morons.


you are correct,some of it is the guys that contribute have left. There are some who have nothing better then to harass guys who are doing something with their lives....Hey you know what time it is.


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

Porsche, when are you going to begin your build? What equipment makes up the build?, we got 6 pages of your amplifiers so just wondering what the rest looks like. Bottom line is there are levels to just about everything you want to get into. This build is around the same level that you seen in SEMA shows so who cares what any of them thinks, I would like like to see what your doing, I think the process is pretty fascinating, when you push the boundaries to experience something that is new regardless of the costs or time. I am the slowest builder on this forum so I have zero to boast about but I am excited to see how it turns out after I am done


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> Porsche, when are you going to begin your build? What equipment makes up the build?, we got 6 pages of your amplifiers so just wondering what the rest looks like. Bottom line is there are levels to just about everything you want to get into. This build is around the same level that you seen in SEMA shows so who cares what any of them thinks, I would like like to see what your doing, I think the process is pretty fascinating, when you push the boundaries to experience something that is new regardless of the costs or time. I am the slowest builder on this forum so I have zero to boast about but I am excited to see how it turns out after I am done


i will be posting a build log shortly once i get all the details worked out, this post was simply to show the amps, had no intention for anything else and sucks that it turned into a pissing match


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

Porsche said:


> i will be posting a build log shortly once i get all the details worked out, this post was simply to show the amps, had no intention for anything else and sucks that it turned into a pissing match


At least one person appreciated it.
Thanks!


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

Sam Spade said:


> .
> 
> The question isn't "does gear sound different or better", it's whether you can afford it, whether you can justify it in terms of value, or whatever else motivates you.
> 
> ...


I highlight the expensive doesnt always guarantee performance. We all have to justify value. In many cases I throw purchase price to the side understanding this, whatever I am looking at should be competitively priced but certainly can be different. In this case, OP has determined he sees value in amps at that price point. For me, I would love to just see testing to see if at that price point, we could detect any performance difference. Again, this is no slam at all against the OP. Great for him, that he can purchase amps at 8k a pop. I just wonder if an 8k amp performs any differently that lets say a very good 1500 dollar amp. I am concerned more about how the amps test out compared to other well known amps that cost significantly less. 

As example we are justify the value in things we pay. I have decent set of aftermarket wheels on my car. The shop that balances and mounts my tires does work for a speed shop across the street. The shop does high end fabrication and motor work for car projects and sends their wheels over to the wheel shop I go to. The last time I had a new set of tires mounted they were aligning a Supra. While I was there, the tech who knows I like cars said come look at these wheels. They had a set of wheels the speed shop sent over and wouldnt touch. The wheels before tires were something like 15k. The owner basically wasnt willing to mount a set of 20k wheels and scratch them. Case in point, I have about 2 k in my aftermarket wheels and they are considered pretty decent. The next guy spent 20k on wheels and tires for a street car. BTW, this was not a track car, just a daily driver.


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## preston (Dec 10, 2007)

> The wheels before tires were something like 15k. The owner basically wasnt willing to mount a set of 20k wheels and scratch them. Case in point, I have about 2 k in mine


And to that guy, the $15k most likely means less to him than the $2k did for you.
Its good to be the King !


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

I would say that if you are wondering how well an amp performs, I certainly would not base your understandings from posters on a forum, go do the research and find out by a respectable review and read the stats for yourself. https://www.facebook.com/abysscaraudio/ ABYSS CAR AUDIO. It will be difficult to find because the amps are produced overseas and looks like they have limited distribution here in the US. The biggest thing around sound quality is that these are class A and most amps are either A/B or D. Class A amps run hot because of their AMP draw but they are more on the high end scale.


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

Jroo said:


> I highlight the expensive doesnt always guarantee performance. We all have to justify value. In many cases I throw purchase price to the side understanding this, whatever I am looking at should be competitively priced but certainly can be different. In this case, OP has determined he sees value in amps at that price point. For me, I would love to just see testing to see if at that price point, we could detect any performance difference. Again, this is no slam at all against the OP. Great for him, that he can purchase amps at 8k a pop. I just wonder if an 8k amp performs any differently that lets say a very good 1500 dollar amp. I am concerned more about how the amps test out compared to other well known amps that cost significantly less.
> 
> As example we are justify the value in things we pay. I have decent set of aftermarket wheels on my car. The shop that balances and mounts my tires does work for a speed shop across the street. The shop does high end fabrication and motor work for car projects and sends their wheels over to the wheel shop I go to. The last time I had a new set of tires mounted they were aligning a Supra. While I was there, the tech who knows I like cars said come look at these wheels. They had a set of wheels the speed shop sent over and wouldnt touch. The wheels before tires were something like 15k. The owner basically wasnt willing to mount a set of 20k wheels and scratch them. Case in point, I have about 2 k in my aftermarket wheels and they are considered pretty decent. The next guy spent 20k on wheels and tires for a street car. BTW, this was not a track car, just a daily driver.


I too am not bagging @Porsche and we all have our hobbies and in the middle of covid that can make us insane. 

Those amps look absolutely beautiful. 

Re value and performance price doesn't always guarantee quality. I'm sure porshe has done his homework


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## Sam Spade (Mar 16, 2020)

drphilb said:


> I would say that if you are wondering how well an amp performs, I certainly would not base your understandings from posters on a forum, go do the research and find out by a respectable review and read the stats for yourself. https://www.facebook.com/abysscaraudio/ ABYSS CAR AUDIO. It will be difficult to find because the amps are produced overseas and looks like they have limited distribution here in the US. The biggest thing around sound quality is that these are class A and most amps are either A/B or D. Class A amps run hot because of their AMP draw but they are more on the high end scale.


I have class A at home, my Marantz 30yo PM80 does 20 in class A and you can switch to 100 clas AB

Also my limited edition musical fidelity Nuvista preamp #276/500 is class A. That has valves too, the nuvistor, the tiny metal ones. I think my MF X-P100 preamp is class a too. And my burson conductor preamp / headamp/ dac is class A too. 

I just need to work out what to sell


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> I would say that if you are wondering how well an amp performs, I certainly would not base your understandings from posters on a forum, go do the research and find out by a respectable review and read the stats for yourself. https://www.facebook.com/abysscaraudio/ ABYSS CAR AUDIO. It will be difficult to find because the amps are produced overseas and looks like they have limited distribution here in the US. The biggest thing around sound quality is that these are class A and most amps are either A/B or D. Class A amps run hot because of their AMP draw but they are more on the high end scale.


they run class a upto about 20 watts than switch to a/b


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

How did you decide to go with these amps vs other high end amps? I can't find any reviews or detailed information around them. Since they are made overseas and have no distributors that I could find here in the US did you get them shipped directly from Abyss? Did you look at the Billet series from Tru-Techonology (B22-A)?


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> How did you decide to go with these amps vs other high end amps? I can't find any reviews or detailed information around them. Since they are made overseas and have no distributors that I could find here in the US did you get them shipped directly from Abyss? Did you look at the Billet series from Tru-Techonology (B22-A)?


i have used the tru amps, not even close to the dual mono. abyss built the tru coppers many years ago. they are a refined amp built off the legendary monolithic sound dual mono which i have owned several over the years, best i amp i have owned and i have owned many


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

What are your thoughts around the Genesis Duel Mono? I don't know of very many duel Mono, what makes these duel mono's superior to the rest out there?


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

Would you give the Tru Technology Copper amps a second place to your Abyss?


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> Would you give the Tru Technology Copper amps a second place to your Abyss?


the tru coppers where designed/built by abyss, they are great amps. they do not compare to the dual mono, A class or zelos.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> What are your thoughts around the Genesis Duel Mono? I don't know of very many duel Mono, what makes these duel mono's superior to the rest out there?


the genesis DM is a great ample have used them years ago. the DM is better. im not going to get into a debate on why one is better than the other but i have owned both, the abyss is better, no question


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## drphilb (Oct 23, 2014)

I never knew that Tru-Tech ripped off the design for their copper series from Abyss. I always known that the Copper series amps were the top of the line back in the day. The Zelos Verdi, what is the output of that one?, I don't see that AMP listed on their home page. The only issue with Amplifiers is the foot print installing them which is a bit of a challenge when you need so many to run a typical 3 way with subs. Are you going to run more speakers than the typical 6 plus subs?


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## Lou Frasier2 (Jul 17, 2012)

porsche,if you were to spend 100,000 on a system and were to post it here, thats awesome ,I love seeing people succeed and seeing what they are doing,dont pay attention to the negative ones responding


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## Ge0 (Jul 23, 2007)

Lou Frasier2 said:


> porsche,if you were to spend 100,000 on a system and were to post it here, thats awesome ,I love seeing people succeed and seeing what they are doing,dont pay attention to the negative ones responding


I think we are over that now. The idiot was banned.

Ge0


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Ge0 said:


> I think we are over that now. The idiot was banned.
> 
> Ge0


one was


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

drphilb said:


> I never knew that Tru-Tech ripped off the design for their copper series from Abyss. I always known that the Copper series amps were the top of the line back in the day. The Zelos Verdi, what is the output of that one?, I don't see that AMP listed on their home page. The only issue with Amplifiers is the foot print installing them which is a bit of a challenge when you need so many to run a typical 3 way with subs. Are you going to run more speakers than the typical 6 plus subs?


tru tech did not rip anyone off. they contracted abyss to build/design them


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## Lou Frasier2 (Jul 17, 2012)

Ge0 said:


> I think we are over that now. The idiot was banned.
> 
> Ge0


awesome, thanks 
im all for people succeeding and showing proudly what they can afford


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Lou Frasier2 said:


> awesome, thanks
> im all for people succeeding and showing proudly what they can afford


i never mentioned money, other did. like i said in earlier post, if they where $299 amps this thread would not have spiraled the way it did, was meant to show the amps cause several asked me about them, nothing more, nothing less.


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## KAD (Oct 18, 2020)

Porsche, I love your car collection and your selection of Abyss amplifiers.


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## Lou Frasier2 (Jul 17, 2012)

Porsche said:


> i never mentioned money, other did. like i said in earlier post, if they where $299 amps this thread would not have spiraled the way it did, was meant to show the amps cause several asked me about them, nothing more, nothing less.


im not disagreeing with you, just stating what I think,


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

Lou Frasier2 said:


> im not disagreeing with you, just stating what I think,


im aware of that, just speaking on what happened, thanks


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## LBaudio (Jan 9, 2009)

6 pages of stupid arguing, just because Porsche posted a couple of pics of really beautiful amps, that many of us probably will not see anywhere else nor be able to own them. We should be happy and share enthusiasm with the owner, but, you know what fox said when she could not reach to the grapes - .....it is bitter!

So, Porsche, enjoy your setup and post some build pics when install happens, Im sure that Skizer will do his magic!


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## carlthess40 (Aug 21, 2018)

Can’t wait to see them installed 
I always do my builds in a stealth mode so people can’t see what’s inside 
When my son did his Tour in Kuwait , I gutted his 2017 Honda SI and installed all 5 of his amps and one sub and wires, plus’s all the sound treatment. When he came home ( all in one peace) thank god
He went to his car and was somewhat sad. He came into the house and asked me where all his audio gear went. I told him it’s all there. And I’d give him a C-note if he could find the amps. Well I still have the C-note. Lol
3 years later, he is happy that I did it the way I did, his car has been broken into 4 times and 
Not one peace of gear is gone. 
I tell my kids and other people not to advertise what they have for a system in their cars


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Nineteen69Mach1 (May 30, 2017)

What are your thoughts on the Abyss MFA 5?


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