# Free air or enclosure??



## Fellippe (Sep 15, 2006)

For midbass woofers up front in a door....what would you prefer ideally?? Your dream setup, fiberglassed to your hearts delight. 

I'd like to hear the real pros/cons of each setup....I don't see many on here building enclosures in their doors....surprising since we've got quite the purists.


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## demon2091tb (May 30, 2005)

Ported to 45hz would do me ideally.......I have enough midbass right now IB, ported would be crazy.


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## Fellippe (Sep 15, 2006)

demon2091tb said:


> Ported to 45hz would do me ideally.......I have enough midbass right now IB, ported would be crazy.


What speaker are you using, how much amplifier power, and what car is it installed in?

Also, are you low passing it active or passive? High pass is assumed active in 99% of the cases.


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## demon2091tb (May 30, 2005)

Adire Extremis 6.4, 160rms @4ohms, Scion tC..........All active, just looking for a tad more controlled output with lower excursion. It does exceptional job IB, but could always have more midbass.


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## bdubs767 (Apr 4, 2006)

IB IBIB IB IB IB IB or as matt from ID says TB


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## Fellippe (Sep 15, 2006)

bdubs767 said:


> IB IBIB IB IB IB IB or as matt from ID says TB


I dunno man....for midbass, I might have to disagree. You writing TB makes me think you're assuming this is for subs...

Output and extension are one reason why I think enclosures are best for midbass drivers. But even the ones that CAN do it in big door airspaces.....what about the door resonances?? 

I heard an enclosure can eliminate that. If true, HUGE. 

I'm a bit biased because I've got an Elate 6.5" that needs to be enclosed. My old Kicker RMB8s pounded hard right from the door, but weren't free from resonances.

As far as subs....we're talking about significantly larger cone areas and frequencies that require serious airspace to provide bass. I mean, a 6.5" woofer playing in a door is probably playing in more airspace than a loadful of 12" or even 15" subs........


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## Fellippe (Sep 15, 2006)

demon2091tb said:


> Adire Extremis 6.4, 160rms @4ohms, Scion tC..........All active, just looking for a tad more controlled output with lower excursion. It does exceptional job IB, but could always have more midbass.


Very nice....two way or three way setup?


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## demon2091tb (May 30, 2005)

3way.


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## bdubs767 (Apr 4, 2006)

def read the first psot wrong lol.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

actually I'm thinking of what do do with my xls now. 

My plan so far is to do a ported .75 ft3, with a tunning frequency of 50hz. HP would be at 63hz. I'm running 150w to each so it should hang with a 12 idmax sealed.

These guys bottom out with this much power IB


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## bobditts (Jul 19, 2006)

if youre going to highpass at 63hz, why would you tune the port to 50hz?


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

I can drop the filter down to 50 if I ever need to have my subs out to make room. It also gives me some leeway when making the door. I am aiming for 20 liters or .75 ft3 but it might end up a little smaller, driving my tuned freq. up to around 60hz when I only have 15 liters to work with. It's a flexibility thing 

People aim for HP and tunning frequency point to be the exact same thing usually? I never did ported before.


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## bobditts (Jul 19, 2006)

but i still dont understand why you want to tune the port to a frequency that is cut off by the filter. the driver will never be able to play 50hz.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

I intend to use it 63-200hz. Where should I set the port freqency?


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## bobditts (Jul 19, 2006)

I couldnt tell you. Ive never dealt with porting a midbass enclosure before. I would however recommend that whatever you tune it to be somewhere in between 63 and 200hz


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## Fellippe (Sep 15, 2006)

Bob makes some good points here in that the you're essentially leaving out some unused frequency response. It could also be argued back that a high pass filter doesn't cut off EVERYTHING below the point...this is how you can get away with crossover points between drivers that don't match. 

I'd say that in an ideal world, tuning to the Fs must be cool as you'd exploit the resonant frequency of the driver and the enclosure at the same time for some impressive efficiency. 

However, when it comes down to designing vented enclosures (optimal, high quality ones at least)....there are factors at hand like "ripple" that dictate tuning frequencies and the like. Makes designing sealed enclosures look like a simple art by comparison....

A friend sent me a car stereo mag from the early '90s that discussed advanced topics of vented enclosure design that I rarely see written about in forums...ripple was one of them. Forgot what it means....I'm sure someone on here does. (If I can get around to scanning the article, I'll do it if there's interest). 

Many of the SQ oriented vented enclosures tune rather low....sometimes lower than can be exploited by the driver. If I am not mistaken, I believe group delay can be lowered with lower tuning frequencies.

And let's not forget that even if we could master the vented design in a perfect environment.......the automotive cabin changes everything.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

I used some software to choose my specs. When I choose a 50hz tuning freq. the graph looked almost flat from 200 down to 60hz with a 2 db gain around the 110-70 hz region which is what I want, most probably my sub is going to have gains set higher, I like some enhanced low end with my music.

Then I changed the tunning freq. at 100hz just to see what you guys are talking about. The result: a huge peak of 9 db around the 120hz region...at 60 hz however I was loosing 12 db of output. There is now way this kind of setup is even remotely sq. I've also heard that you are supposed to have HP filter set at tunning freq. or above to protect the sub. from reaching its mechanical limits.

Here is FB of 100hz:










Here is FB of 50hz:


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

Ha Ha wow that was back in the day. I never went ported, doesn't seem like a good idea right now at all. I'm changing my vote to IB!


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## Konni (Jun 22, 2008)

My favorites are sealed enclosures ... this gives the "fastest" midbass and the best dynamics.

I have a wooden enclosure in my door ... 



















Cheers


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

Konni said:


> My favorites are sealed enclosures ... this gives the "fastest" midbass and the best dynamics.
> 
> I have a wooden enclosure in my door ...
> 
> Cheers


How fast would you say yours are? Speeding bullet? Speed of sound? 

Nice work on the enclosure. What kind of drivers do you use?


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## Konni (Jun 22, 2008)

Please excuse - this word is in Germany used for a speaker, that follows the audio signal very good. Very precise sound ... don't know, how to describe it better in English ... 

The used speakers are made in Germany (handmade!). The brand is "Micro-Precision" (www.micro-precision.eu) - Z series (formerly known as "Goerlich").

Cheers


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## bobditts (Jul 19, 2006)

this is why polls should be closed automatically after a month. lol. A thread back from 2006 that gets bumped for no reason other than someone voting.


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## cvjoint (Mar 10, 2006)

Konni said:


> Please excuse - this word is in Germany used for a speaker, that follows the audio signal very good. Very precise sound ... don't know, how to describe it better in English ...
> 
> The used speakers are made in Germany (handmade!). The brand is "Micro-Precision" (www.micro-precision.eu) - Z series (formerly known as "Goerlich").
> 
> Cheers


Those really really look hand made. None of the cone surfaces look the same, that kinda scares me. Is there a link where he posts ts parameters?


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## Konni (Jun 22, 2008)

cvjoint said:


> Those really really look hand made. None of the cone surfaces look the same, that kinda scares me. Is there a link where he posts ts parameters?


You can find TS parameters on the website --> KLICK
Just browse the download-center. Folder "Informations".

The Z series is fully handmade - even the magnets. The material is a very hard and thin foam covered with thin aluminum foil. Because of this the cone is very light and hard.

This is one recent project:










Cheers


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

I think it depends on the driver, but I have heard a sealed midbass once. Loved it but just have never been able to truly replicate with the cars I own. I have kicked around the idea of trying a set of sealed boxes right in front of the front seats firing the midbass up. I think maybe with a driver like the anarchy or SLS, the box would be small enough to not intrude into my foot space.


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## LBaudio (Jan 9, 2009)

Big fan of enclosures for midbass,...for last 5 years Im running ported dual midbass and it is crazy good....also did a lot of sealed panels before... better control, better definition, less or almost none of the door resonances, stronger midbass-upper midbass, speakers are protected against elements,.......


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## Holmz (Jul 12, 2017)

bobditts said:


> this is why polls should be closed automatically after a month. lol. A thread back from 2006 that gets bumped for no reason other than someone voting.


Like déjàvu all over again.


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