# Pairing Hertz Mille with Audioforg GB



## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

Just wanted to see if they make a good 3 way active pair, or stick with an all Hertz.

Hertz Mille MLK 1650.3 LEGEND + AF GB25
Tweeter: ML 280.3
Mid-Range: AF GB25
Woofer: ML 1650.3

What do you think?


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## Naptownsoldier1488 (Jul 9, 2016)

I think it would sound great I love the ml280.3 very nice tweeter I do like the gb25 a lot more than the ml700.3 I have had both like the gb25 better and it's smaller Easyer to mount and beams later win win the ml 1600.3 Is a nice sounding midwoofer but imo the gb60 is a better midwoofer


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## unix_usr (Dec 4, 2013)

Interesting combo...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

Looking at this combo to save on some money and use the budget for something else, I could get some good deals on the Hertz Mille ML-1650.3 from authorized/legit places, which will be 45-60% less than the GB60.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> Just wanted to see if they make a good 3 way active pair, or stick with an all Hertz.
> 
> Hertz Mille MLK 1650.3 LEGEND + AF GB25
> Tweeter: ML 280.3
> ...


I’m curious, how do you like the 1650.3 woofer for mid bass? I have a set but I also have a set of ML1600’s one of them is going up front to replace my 165XL’s. I’m also curious about the GB25 as a mid, or Dynaudio Esotar’s, Esotec.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

Naptownsoldier1488 said:


> I think it would sound great I love the ml280.3 very nice tweeter I do like the gb25 a lot more than the ml700.3 I have had both like the gb25 better and it's smaller Easyer to mount and beams later win win the ml 1600.3 Is a nice sounding midwoofer but imo the gb60 is a better midwoofer


How do you define better?


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

I have heard good reviews of GB series, I really want to get the GB all in, but GB60 is way out of my budget  

In terms of the speakers, unfortunately I live in Dubai where most of them are not even available locally, and its also not possible to audition any before buying  , hence I rely on DIYMA. 

Again on the Hertz read good reviews, but have been reading lately that the 1650.2 were better that the 1650.3. The new ones lack the punch. 

I am planning to build a system, which will sound good even without a sub. I will be having the sub, but just saying I need enough punch from my mids.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> I have heard good reviews of GB series, I really want to get the GB all in, but GB60 is way out of my budget
> 
> In terms of the speakers, unfortunately I live in Dubai where most of them are not even available locally, and its also not possible to audition any before buying  , hence I rely on DIYMA.
> 
> ...


Honestly I have thought of keeping my Hertz 165XL’s as my woofer to go with, since all the info I found said it hits the hardest out of all of them. I am going with the ML280 tweeter then I need to buy a mid. I will probably go with the ML 700 but I can get the Audio Frog one pretty cheap, also I have never heard it, I would have to buy it online as well. I will try the 1650.3 woofer first just to make sure then I will put in the ML 1600 and see out of the three which one I like the best. Either way the ML280 is one of the best tweeters out there, the only tweeter I will ever replace it with would be the Dynaudio Esotar’s.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

Based on feedback GB25, but I never heard them. I think thats what I am going for. But I need a good midwoofer which I am still not sure about. I thought the Hertz would be the best option in my budget hence this post.

The Hertz HSK is the new Mille Pro's?


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> Based on feedback GB25, but I never heard them.
> 
> The Hertz HSK is the new Mille Pro's?


No but the woofer produces insane mid bass, I have them installed in my vehicle for a year now. I recently bought the ML 1600’s and I also have a set of MLK1650.3’s. I’m just searching for the right DSP, which I was hoping the DSR1 was going to solve this but as of now it’s glitchy. So on Tuesday/Wednesday I’m going to install the ML 280’s and test all three woofers and see what I like best. 

On a side note the tweeter that comes with the HSK165XL is good but at times reminds me of the focal tweeters bright/harsh at higher volume on some music.

I’m a big Soundman fan lol he said the Mille’s were better than the Audio Frogs components not sure about mids.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

HOIRiIZON said:


> No but the woofer produces insane mid bass, I have them installed in my vehicle for a year now. I recently bought the ML 1600’s and I also have a set of MLK1650.3’s. I’m just searching for the right DSP, which I was hoping the DSR1 was going to solve this but as of now it’s glitchy. So on Tuesday/Wednesday I’m going to install the ML 280’s and test all three woofers and see what I like best.
> 
> On a side note the tweeter that comes with the HSK165XL is good but at times reminds me of the focal tweeters bright/harsh at higher volume on some music.


Please give your feedback, it would be really helpful for me 

Yeah, I hate those Focal too, fortunately or unfortunately thats the only brand I have been able to audition.

For the DSP I am looking at minidsp 8x12, I hope they are good. I have a local dealer for the same hence I am ok with the risk . Initially was planning the Helix P6 DSP MK2 with the USB HEC, then thought why not save some money. They also have the USB streamer.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

Right now I’m using the Fiio X5iii as my source, this sounds great and my system was night and day different when I added this. I’m a Hertz/Audison guy although Audison lately I don’t care much for but I like there old VRX amps and LRX’s ones were decent as well. Honestly I’m going with the Amp Pro since the Maestro pieces are glitchy right now. My tuffest decision is the DSP, the Helix seems like what most of the people on here like, but I know like everything car audio it’s about the install/tune more than it is about the brand. I was out of the car audio scene for a long time. I got back into it last year with a mid level system and just went with all Hertz, HDP5 in 3 channel mode running HSK165XL and two Hi Energy tens with an Apple IPod 5.5 which I still have but use the Fiio X5iii now and soon Astell & Kern Khan. 

I wanted to go a little high end so I bought the Mille’s and the ML1600’s. I have a brand new Audison VRX 240.6 that I have been wanting to put in forever. I’m not a big bass guy like I was in my younger days so I’m going to keep my HDP5 and run it in 3 channel mode still but bi amp the Mille’s Audison running the tweets and eventually the mids and rear fill. The Hertz running the woofers.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

The last couple of days I was in cars with premium OEM, those cars had the punch I was looking for. Specially when playing at low volumes, they were highly tuned and good sound processing. One was a Jaguar with the meridian system and the other was a BMW with B&O or Harman I guess.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> The last couple of days I was in cars with premium OEM, those cars had the punch I was looking for. Specially when playing at low volumes, they were highly tuned and good sound processing. One was a Jaguar with the meridian system and the other was a BMW with B&O or Harman I guess.


Are you saying you liked the OEM systems or they had upgraded systems? Because I have heard pretty much all OEM systems and none of them sound even close to anything even mid range in aftermarket, or low range for that matter. Don’t let those stereo stickers prices fool you.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

I dint mean the whole system, I meant the midbass punch. It may be to do with the woofer under the seat, I know BMW has those.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

bonesb said:


> Just wanted to see if they make a good 3 way active pair, or stick with an all Hertz.
> 
> Hertz Mille MLK 1650.3 LEGEND + AF GB25
> Tweeter: ML 280.3
> ...


All AF or you're off the forum dude.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> I dint mean the whole system, I meant the midbass punch. It may be to do with the woofer under the seat, I know BMW has those.


Well pretty much every stock vehicle has an amp with dsp built into it and a sub. They’re getting better but won’t come close to a mid end aftermarket system. But a lot of people are happy with a stock system. But on say the Audi the premium sticker price is over 5k here. You can get a really nice system for 5k here.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

GEM592 said:


> All AF or you're off the forum dude.




Hahahah I really wish all AF, but those woofers are what will kill me. $799 is double what I will have to pay for the ML1650.3. I dont mind the GB10 and GB25.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> Hahahah I really wish all AF, but those woofers are what will kill me. $799 is double what I will have to pay for the ML1650.3. I dont mind the GB10 and GB25.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Let me know if you go al AF I’m curious how they sound. The closest AF dealer to me is like 10 hour drive.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Let me know if you go al AF I’m curious how they sound. The closest AF dealer to me is like 10 hour drive.


as someone whos used both multiple times, the AF is better. not like you will believe me.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

bonesb said:


> Hahahah I really wish all AF, but those woofers are what will kill me. $799 is double what I will have to pay for the ML1650.3. I dont mind the GB10 and GB25.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Oh, so you're aware that there's an invention called Ebay?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

... and on this invention they sell stuff?


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> Oh, so you're aware that there's an invention called Ebay?


Go search Audio Frog on eBay and you will see two sets of speaker grills and a bunch of frog books lol.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Go search Audio Frog on eBay and you will see two sets of speaker grills and a bunch of frog books lol.


... and available at the low low price of $1000? Wow.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

GEM592 said:


> Oh, so you're aware that there's an invention called Ebay?


hes not aware of much. cut him some slack


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

SkizeR said:


> hes not aware of much. cut him some slack


Well, you may have a point


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> as someone whos used both multiple times, the AF is better. not like you will believe me.


Well I have never heard them so I can’t compare, price wise where I’m at they’re are cheaper than the MLK 1650.3. I know just because something is more expensive doesn’t make it better. I have heard good things about the GB’s but how much better could speakers really be once you get into the 1k and over? I know I have never heard better speakers in my life that sounded as good as Dynaudio Esotar’s but they’re like 3k-4k systems so they should be. 

Skizer you have to remember everyone hears differently, and I see your selling yours so if they were that great why are you be selling them? Just to make a change?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Well I have never heard them so I can’t compare, price wise where I’m at they’re are cheaper than the MLK 1650.3. I know just because something is more expensive doesn’t make it better. I have heard good things about the GB’s but how much better could speakers really be once you get into the 1k and over? I know I have never heard better speakers in my life that sounded as good as Dynaudio Esotar’s but they’re like 3k-4k systems so they should be.
> 
> Skizer you have to remember everyone hears differently, and I see your selling yours so if they were that great why are you be selling them? Just to make a change?


They are both very good. I believe Nick favors AF, he is sincere and that is fine.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> hes not aware of much. cut him some slack


He is on a budget, and I’m sure he is aware of plenty.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> They are both very good. I believe Nick favors AF, he is sincere and that is fine.


Are you kidding me, he can’t stand Audison/Hertz since they didn’t sell enough and lost them to another local shop lol


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

Anyone that doesn’t put the original Mille’s as one of the top 5 speakers of all time is on Crack.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Well I have never heard them so I can’t compare, price wise where I’m at they’re are cheaper than the MLK 1650.3. I know just because something is more expensive doesn’t make it better. I have heard good things about the GB’s but how much better could speakers really be once you get into the 1k and over? I know I have never heard better speakers in my life that sounded as good as Dynaudio Esotar’s but they’re like 3k-4k systems so they should be.
> 
> Skizer you have to remember everyone hears differently, and I see your selling yours so if they were that great why are you be selling them? Just to make a change?


my audiofrogs arent going anywhere any time soon, so i dont think i know what your talking about



GEM592 said:


> They are both very good. I believe Nick favors AF, he is sincere and that is fine.


I definitely favor them in pretty much every regard to Hertz offerings. Ease of install, customer support (big one here, opposite ends of the spectrum), and of course, overall sound. I started off as a fanboy of hertz. Then Hybrid. Then dynaudio. Then i started learning how to understand data and getting some real experience as opposed to what some guys on the forum or my local "buddy who works at a shop". Thats when this hobby got a lot easier.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

I love threads where we argue about two or three very good solutions that are more alike one another than they are different, at least compared to the rest of what's out there. I have favored the Hertz just because there are dealers that sell them very reasonably, I can't find AF at a price point I like but they are superior by all accounts.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Are you kidding me, he can’t stand Audison/Hertz since they didn’t sell enough and lost them to another local shop lol


false. If you must know, I worked for the only elettromedia dealer on the island of manhattan. Not only are they the only elettromedia dealer on manhattan, they are the only shop that isnt a fly-by-night shop in manhattan. They loved us. Then i left to start my own thing and was approached by the local rep to sell them. I turned them down.



HOIRiIZON said:


> Anyone that doesn’t put the original Mille’s as one of the top 5 speakers of all time is on Crack.


Lol. LOOOL. They were good, but lets be rational here.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Are you kidding me, he can’t stand Audison/Hertz since they didn’t sell enough and lost them to another local shop lol


Is that a conspiracy theory? I'm scared ...


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> I love threads where we argue about two or three very good solutions that are more alike one another than they are different, at least compared to the rest of what's out there. I have favored the Hertz just because there are dealers that sell them very reasonably, I can't find AF at a price point I like but they are superior by all accounts.


So you have owned the Audio Frogs?


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> So you have owned the Audio Frogs?


No. I will admit I have not.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> false. If you must know, I worked for the only elettromedia dealer on the island of manhattan. Not only are they the only elettromedia dealer on manhattan, they are the only shop that isnt a fly-by-night shop in manhattan. They loved us. Then i left to start my own thing and was approached by the local rep to sell them. I turned them down.
> 
> 
> 
> Lol. LOOOL. They were good, but lets be rational here.


Well we know your on crack, I’m talking about the norm lol


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

GEM592 said:


> Is that a conspiracy theory? I'm scared ...


imagine sticking him, XSIV SPL, and DC/Hertz in the same room.. now thats entertainment


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> No. I will admit I have not.


Well at least you’re honest. The other guy Mr I just took out all my AF GB and replaced it, I’m not to sure about.....


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Well we know your on crack, I’m talking about the norm lol


You mean YOU'RE on crack, as in YOU ARE on crack. English.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> imagine sticking him, XSIV SPL, and DC/Hertz in the same room.. now thats entertainment


I remember DC/Hertz from months ago he was all up your ASSSS. You were like everyone’s hero on here lol


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Well at least you’re honest. The other guy Mr I just took out all my AF GB and replaced it, I’m not to sure about.....


audiofrog has been in my car for over a year and still is to this very second.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Well at least you’re honest. The other guy Mr I just took out all my AF GB and replaced it, I’m not to sure about.....


Oh I'm a Hertz/Focal fanboy. ML 1600 6.5s if ignorance is bliss I might be satisfied.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> audiofrog has been in my car for over a year and still is to this very second.


Yes I know I read your add, you have them for sale until your new stuff is installed then whoever buys it, then will get it, like you always do. That’s what it said.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> I remember DC/Hertz from months ago he was all up your ASSSS. You were like everyone’s hero on here lol


That guy can just re-register with a different username if he wants to state his case lol.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> Oh I'm a Hertz/Focal fanboy. ML 1600 6.5s if ignorance is bliss I might be satisfied.


I used to run Focal when I was younger, I had the first set of Utopias on Vancouver Island. They sounded great back then, I always liked the KRX2’s as well.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> I used to run Focal when I was younger, I had the first set of Utopias on Vancouver Island. They sounded great back then, I always liked the KRX2’s as well.


Oh yeah I have sets of krx2s in the closet. They don't handle heat well, but play high. 

Very fun thread, thanks to all


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> You mean YOU'RE on crack, as in YOU ARE on crack. English.


On a phone so ya you’re on crack that’s the ticket. Thanks for the grammar lesson.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> On a phone so ya you’re on crack that’s the ticket. Thanks for the grammar lesson.


My good deed for the day. You can help an old lady across the street.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> My good deed for the day. You can help an old lady across the street.


I think Skizer is deleting his AF GB for sale post, so he can say I’m wrong lol.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> I think Skizer is deleting his AF GB for sale post, so he can say I’m wrong lol.


I'll look into that! But he tends to know what he's doing


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> I'll look into that! But he tends to know what he's doing


When I was his age I changed systems every year with the newest and supposedly greatest thing. It didn’t always sound better, more often than not it was worse. My girlfriends back then were not happy. The new 1k single din, the new 3 ways, the new whatever. Usually a companies first products are the best because they have to be better than the giant companies, and get there foot in the door. So I don’t doubt the AF GB product is good, but it ain’t Dynaudio Esotar’s Magic Bus good lol


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

Time to RAM in with some Audible Physics :worried:


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> When I was his age I changed systems every year with the newest and supposedly greatest thing. It didn’t always sound better, more often than not it was worse. My girlfriends back then were not happy. The new 1k single din, the new 3 ways, the new whatever. Usually a companies first products are the best because they have to be better than the giant companies, and get there foot in the door. So I don’t doubt the AF GB product is good, but it ain’t Dynaudio Esotar’s Magic Bus good lol


I hear what you're saying. Everybody thinks what they like is the best, but those that have heard the best fear there is something slightly better. You have to respect that which you might not have yet encountered. Good point.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Yes I know I read your add, you have them for sale until your new stuff is installed then whoever buys it, then will get it, like you always do. That’s what it said.


I think you need to improve your reading comprehension. 

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

GEM592 said:


> I hear what you're saying. Everybody thinks what they like is the best, but those that have heard the best fear there is something slightly better. You have to respect that which you might not have yet encountered. Good point.


I’m 46 now, I competed from ages 17-25 always in search of the ultimate sound. You will never find it, doesn’t exist. I know that now, my advice is stick to your budget and listen to as many vehicles as possible, not speaker boards. Then make sure your 100% with what you want to do. That’s the hard part, then make a plan and pull the trigger. Don’t worry if you picked, Hertz, Audio Frog, Morels, Dynaudio. Just pick what makes you happy. That’s it.


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## GEM592 (Jun 19, 2015)

HOIRiIZON said:


> I’m 46 now, I competed from ages 17-25 always in search of the ultimate sound. You will never find it, doesn’t exist. I know that now, my advice is stick to your budget and listen to as many vehicles as possible, not speaker boards. Then make sure your 100% with what you want to do. That’s the hard part, then make a plan and pull the trigger. Don’t worry if you picked, Hertz, Audio Frog, Morels, Dynaudio. Just pick what makes you happy. That’s it.


I heard that.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

SkizeR said:


> I think you need to improve your reading comprehension.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk


Lol I was waiting for that exact response.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

WOW really this expensive in the US?

Hertz Mille Series 2-Way Component System - MLK16503 -Abt

My elettromedia dealer said 570 list price, maybe some 15-20% off could get 450-475.

Looks like I will go the Hertz route, fits in my budget. Once day when the itch kicks in will save for the AF


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> WOW really this expensive in the US?
> 
> Hertz Mille Series 2-Way Component System - MLK16503 -Abt
> 
> ...


When I was looking at the AF I was looking at the mids, the woofers retail for 1k here lol. So you could probably get them for $800 ish Canadian. Then depending if your going to go two way or three way they will be up there in price. I paid $300 for my MLK 1650.3 brand new in the box, that’s Canadian so US would be around $238. They retail for $1499 here. So the Audio Frogs are more expensive.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

HOIRiIZON said:


> When I was looking at the AF I was looking at the mids, the woofers retail for 1k here lol. So you could probably get them for $800 ish Canadian. Then depending if your going to go two way or three way they will be up there in price. I paid $300 for my MLK 1650.3 brand new in the box, that’s Canadian so US would be around $238. They retail for $1499 here. So the Audio Frogs are more expensive.


So if the MLK 1650.3 retail is $1499, how do you get it for $300, that much knock down? For me its $570 retail and probably after discount max $450. Maybe the retail price is lower here as its in the EMEA region.
I have been looking for discounts on the frogs, do you get these type of discounts on them


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> So if the MLK 1650.3 retail is $1499, how do you get it for $300, that much knock down? For me its $570 retail and probably after discount max $450. Maybe the retail price is lower here as its in the EMEA region.
> I have been looking for discounts on the frogs, do you get these type of discounts on them


I bought it on Kijiji which is like eBay sort of, like local classifieds. The guy had these 1650.3 and the ML 1600’s which I got for $150 new in a box. He put the add up and I seen it and snatched it up.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

HOIRiIZON said:


> I bought it on Kijiji which is like eBay sort of, like local classifieds. The guy had these 1650.3 and the ML 1600’s which I got for $150 new in a box. He put the add up and I seen it and snatched it up.


Seriously BNIB at those price, those are legit  ?


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> Seriously BNIB at those price, those are legit  ?


There was another used set of MLK 1650.3 on there for $375 and a pair I seen yesterday but it was a good 3 hour drive from me. I’m always looking for a good deal on anything new. You would be surprised how many people buy car audio for an install and never install it lol. I think for mine it was a lady selling her exes stuff lol that’s what she told me when I asked her why she was selling it, she didn’t know anything about Hertz.

.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> Just wanted to see if they make a good 3 way active pair, or stick with an all Hertz.
> 
> Hertz Mille MLK 1650.3 LEGEND + AF GB25
> Tweeter: ML 280.3
> ...


Hi Bonesb, I called the closest AF dealer to me today, and talked to a guy named Dave out of the Kelowna store. After talking to him for some time on the phone, he told me to keep my Mille 280 tweeter and just buy the AF GB60 and go active. His stores used to sell Hertz 5 years ago and he said the ML280 tweeter is a great tweeter. This is coming from a guy that sells Audio Frog and not Hertz, on a side note they sell Focal, Mosconi, Morel etc.. So they have hi end products. 

I’m going to get my system finished first, and since I always take a trip in the Summer to Kelowna, I will try the AF GB60 with my set up. I can pick them up for around 7-800 Canadian so that’s a decent price.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Hi Bonesb, I called the closest AF dealer to me today, and talked to a guy named Dave out of the Kelowna store. After talking to him for some time on the phone, he told me to keep my Mille 280 tweeter and just buy the AF GB60 and go active. His stores used to sell Hertz 5 years ago and he said the ML280 tweeter is a great tweeter. This is coming from a guy that sells Audio Frog and not Hertz, on a side note they sell Focal, Mosconi, Morel etc.. So they have hi end products.
> 
> I’m going to get my system finished first, and since I always take a trip in the Summer to Kelowna, I will try the AF GB60 with my set up. I can pick them up for around 7-800 Canadian so that’s a decent price.


Just update me once your setup is complete and which Hertz woofer you decided to go.


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## unix_usr (Dec 4, 2013)

HOIRiIZON said:


> I bought it on Kijiji which is like eBay sort of, like local classifieds. The guy had these 1650.3 and the ML 1600’s which I got for $150 new in a box. He put the add up and I seen it and snatched it up.


Kijiji in Canada == Craigslist in USA.... except Kijiji has a MUCH nicer interface lending to the fact it's developed, maintained, hosted, and operated by eBay. Nevertheless the USA equivalent is Craigslist.


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## quality_sound (Dec 25, 2005)

HOIRiIZON said:


> *Well pretty much every stock vehicle has an amp with dsp built into it and a sub.* They’re getting better but won’t come close to a mid end aftermarket system. But a lot of people are happy with a stock system. But on say the Audi the premium sticker price is over 5k here. You can get a really nice system for 5k here.


You couldn't be more wrong. Very few cars come with amps and DSPs. More and more are coming with amps, but a DSP as well? Not nearly as many as you'd think. Especially in the lower and mid-level offerings from most car makers. 

Also you can't add JUST B&O to an Audi. Look at the 2018 A4. You can't even OPTION B&O on the Premium Trims and it's standard on the Premium Plus. The price difference between the Premium and Premium Plus is all of $3,200 and it gets you a hell of a lot more than just B&O. Say the B&O itself is half of that $3,200. You really think you can beat B&O for $1,600 installed and integrated as well as OEM? 

I agree that even mid-tied aftermarket can outperform OEM, but you're high if you think you can do it for less than a what the B&O upgrade costs.


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## SnakeOil (Jan 4, 2018)

quality_sound said:


> You couldn't be more wrong. Very few cars come with amps and DSPs. More and more are coming with amps, but a DSP as well? Not nearly as many as you'd thing. Especially in the lower and mid-level offerings from most car makers.
> 
> Also you can't add JUST B&O to an Audi. Look at the 2018 A4. You can't even OPTION B&O on the Premium Trims and it's standard on the Premium Plus. The price difference between the Premium and Premium Plus is all of $3,200 and it gets you a hell of a lot more than just B&O. Say the B&O itself is half of that $3,200. You really think you can beat B&O for $1,600 installed and integrated as well as OEM?
> 
> I agree that even mid-tied aftermarket can outperform OEM, but you're high if you think you can do it for less than a what the B&O upgrade costs.


Yes every car has a amp or there would be no sound. And anything that changes the sound would be a DSP. So if it has speed controlled volume it has a DSP.


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## quality_sound (Dec 25, 2005)

SnakeOil said:


> Yes every car has a amp or there would be no sound. And anything that changes the sound would be a DSP. So if it has speed controlled volume it has a DSP.


Way to be pedantic


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## SnakeOil (Jan 4, 2018)

quality_sound said:


> Way to be pedantic


Sorry.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

quality_sound said:


> Very few cars come with amps and DSPs. More and more are coming with amps, but a DSP as well? Not nearly as many as you'd think. Especially in the lower and mid-level offerings from most car makers.


false. just straight up false. most cars are coming with amps in recent years. cars with amps most of the time are processed. theyre not just straight through amps.


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## unix_usr (Dec 4, 2013)

quality_sound said:


> You couldn't be more wrong. Very few cars come with amps and DSPs. More and more are coming with amps, but a DSP as well? Not nearly as many as you'd think. Especially in the lower and mid-level offerings from most car makers.


FALSE. I must preface this with the fact that I literally work beside the OEM audio engineering group (one building over in the research/product engineering complex). I'm not sure what you would define as "lower and mid-level" - but on the cheapest of the cheapest Ford Fiesta - built for South America or India even, there is a full DSP, parametric EQ configured, crossovers, and time alignment all tailored to a house curve based on hours of combined measurement and listening sessions. This is on the base model $12,000 car - it more or less goes up from here, and this is just at Ford/Lincoln as the OEM. Some of the Lincoln (harmon) Revel systems have 20+ amplifier channels *ALL* processed, after extensive measurements well above and beyond what most of us in this hobby are even capable of doing (like taking measurements of audio WHILE in a wind tunnel test using microphone arrays built into test dummy heads).

What OEM audio engineers are highly constrained with are mostly marketing and cost-cutting efforts; they get told to make the best they can, as long as it's under X dollars, Y pounds of weight and competes with the rest of the vehicle segment offering "10 speaker audio" systems, etc.


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## unix_usr (Dec 4, 2013)

SkizeR said:


> false. just straight up false. most cars are coming with amps in recent years. cars with amps most of the time are processed. theyre not just straight through amps.



Even then - when no "external" amplification outside of the stock radio itself is employed, most stock/oem sources still have internal processing.


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## TerryGreen5986 (Jun 23, 2017)

Omg! Enough lol 


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

unix_usr said:


> Even then - when no "external" amplification outside of the stock radio itself is employed, most stock/oem sources still have internal processing.


oh i know. working on a car with this right now.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

How good is this Dynaudio Esotec System 342 7" Three way component system ?

https://www.caraudiocentre.co.uk/product_m-dynaudio-esotec-system-342_p-25901.htm

about $600 cheaper for me compared to the frog. I am in London in two weeks and no addition shipping cost too.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

Horizon are you done with the Hertz install?


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## uniemaia (Feb 27, 2018)

Loving this thread! sub'd


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## wizzi001 (Apr 29, 2011)

bonesb said:


> Horizon are you done with the Hertz install?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


He's banned. He won't be answering anytime soon.


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## bonesb (Sep 19, 2017)

Ok I went ahead and ordered the GB10 and GB25 for now. Saw the dyns on sale for months in the classifieds and no on pickin it up but the frogs get sold in a day or two. 

Will wait on feedback and decide on the woofer. 

For now GB60 a bit out of budget, maybe only until I listen to the 10 and 25 .


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

wizzi001 said:


> He's banned. He won't be answering anytime soon.


Did I? I never noticed, my brother must have been messing around again.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

bonesb said:


> Ok I went ahead and ordered the GB10 and GB25 for now. Saw the dyns on sale for months in the classifieds and no on pickin it up but the frogs get sold in a day or two.
> 
> Will wait on feedback and decide on the woofer.
> 
> ...


Hey Bonesb, you were talking to my brother and he is an idiot and a big Hertz/Audison fanboy. He did get half of his install finished. 

He went with the ML 1600’s they sounded better than the 1650’s. They do not sound as good as the Audio Frog GB60’s. You won’t be disappointed in the Audio Frogs, great speakers, and even better price for how they stack up with the over 3k speakers. 

Good luck with your install.


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