# 10" or 12" SQ subwoofer recommendation....I'm sorry, I have to



## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Hey guys, allow me to first apologize for creating a thread I'm sure you guys see at least 492381t75 times a day. I've searched, found some recommended subs but they were either out of my price range or I just couldn't power them enough, here's my criteria for the best sub for me. I'll try to be as detailed as I can!

The amp will by run off the 5th channel of a Kicker ZX700.5 amp. The sub mono channel is rated at 420 watts @ 2 ohms. Then again, my birthsheet stated my amp was rated at 919 watts, which is obviously more than 700 but I can't figure out a way to somehow see if the 420 is still 420 or it's more since overall the amp is underrated.....

Anyway, I'm looking for first and foremost a SQ sub that can get somewhat loud if need be. I don't need or want anything crazy, but I'd like to feel the clean bass, if that makes sense.

From what I've researched, the Dayton HO 10" looks to be a winner but that's a 4 ohm sub meaning it would only receive 210 watts...is that correct? That wouldn't be enough power would it?

Also, I'm looking for a sub that I can port without doing anything crazy. I measured and I can fit about 2.78 cu ft for a box. Should be big enough for most 10's or 12's out there I think but if I can go smaller, I definintely will.

Last and certainly not least, the price. I'm looking around $200, with a max of $250. Most of all I want a sub that has an excellent bang for the buck. Like if see two subs, one is $250 and one is $160, and the more expensive one is only a tiny bit better, I will go with the $160.

So based on my criteria, what would you all recommend that will give me the sound I'm looking for while being perfectly happy with the power the amp is giving it?

Any replies from anyone would be greatly appreciated, thank you very much!


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## rimshot (May 17, 2005)

I have an Oz audio Matrix elite D4 would work well with that power ported. I believe its 2.75 cubes as well. BNIB 12". Also look at going IB if possible or get a really nice 12" you can seal (like the OZ or IDMAX, W7, Shiva etc)


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

If your amp does 420 to the sub channel at 2 ohm, it will give a little more than 50% of the power at 4 ohm. It probably does 250 or more at 4 ohm. 

If you don't mind using a sealed enclosure, get a Dayton RSS315HF, and put it in a 2 cubic foot box. The HF versions have slightly better sound quality and a little bit better extension, but require a bigger box. 

And they're on sale for $119. This is the smokin deal for subs right now. 

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=295-464


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## its_bacon12 (Aug 16, 2007)

Look at Exodus Shiva-X. $135+shipping, works great in 2 cubic feet sealed.


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

its_bacon12 said:


> Look at Exodus Shiva-X. $135+shipping, works great in 2 cubic feet sealed.


Damn. That looks pretty damn stellar, especially for the price. I didb't see it mentioned, but what's the impendence on those? And just to make sure, this should work fine with my amps power output correct? I'm not doubting your suggestion, I just have a nasty habit of making absoultely sure about everything before I make a purchase.

The RSS315HF is also on the block for strong consideration.

Thanks again for the replies guys, I really do appreciate it. Anymore input would still be great, thanks!


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Damn this forum moves fast!

Does anyone know the impendence and RMS of the Shiva-X? I'm guessing it will work with my amp since it was posted but I'd like to make sure.

I'm this close to buying it already, haha.

Thanks!


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

shiva is a dual 8 ohm so it wont be best for you


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

BeatsDownLow said:


> shiva is a dual 8 ohm so it wont be best for you


Seriously?  Ah man, these looked really good.

Just so I don't jump the gun, is this correct? Since my amp pushes out 420 @ 2 ohms, if I were to get a sub that has an impedence of 4 ohms, it would only receive around 250 watts? And if a sub has 8 ohms as the impedence, it would only receive 175 watts or so? Is that correct? As you can tell, I'm kinda new. 

However, I was informed recently by another Kicker ZX700.5 user, that he actually did some testing on his and he managed to get 515 @ 2 ohms. Now taking the new figure into consideration, what would you all suggest now? Does anyone know where I can learn more about the previously mentioned Dayton RSS315HF subs? I tried doing a search but found minimal results. rimshot, I'll keep in mind your offer and do a little research. If I like what I see, I'll definintely let you know.

I keep hearing great things about the Peerless XLS line of subs as well. Could I run one of those?

Someone throw me a bone, I have no idea what to go with. Deciding really sucks. 

Thanks!


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## reindeers (Mar 7, 2008)

I hear the IDs or IDQs are great SQ subs, and they have the Dual 4 as well so your amp will be maximised. Hope this helps.


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## tcguy85 (Oct 29, 2007)

IDQ 10v3 dual 4 ohm


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

reindeers said:


> Dual 4 as well so your amp will be maximised. Hope this helps.


Can you explain this a bit more? How exactly will my amp be maximized? I'm not doubting you, I'm just trying to learn. 

I've heard great things about the IDQ's, they just seem a tad expensive. Sorry to add another possible sub, but how about the Phoenix Gold RSDC-102? The 102 series are the 2 ohm version so all the watts from my amp would be able to power it correct? Meaning, since my amp is underrated, an average of 515 watts @ 2 ohms sounds a bit more reasonable. The RMS of the RSDC's is 600 watts so they are pretty close.

What do you all think about that? Should I look more into this particular sub or are there other options I should consider?

Thanks!


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## tcguy85 (Oct 29, 2007)

well dual 4 ohm coils get wired to create a 2 ohm load. thats what was meant by maximized.

these would be nice too... http://www.ascendantaudio.com/arsenal-subwoofers/


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Ah, gotcha. I think. Just one thing, if the 4 ohm sub gets wired to a 2 ohm load, how man watts does it recevie? The full 420 @ 2 ohms (or 515 @ 2 ohm is not underrated)? Or more?

Sorry for the noobish question, I think this my biggest hurdle. If you don't want to explain something that's probably been explained one too many times, would you happen know an easy to read site that breaks it down better?

Thanks again guys for all your patience.


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## rockondon (Jan 18, 2008)

Chowder Head said:


> Ah, gotcha. I think. Just one thing, if the 4 ohm sub gets wired to a 2 ohm load, how man watts does it recevie? The full 420 @ 2 ohms (or 515 @ 2 ohm is not underrated)? Or more?
> 
> Sorry for the noobish question, I think this my biggest hurdle. If you don't want to explain something that's probably been explained one too many times, would you happen know an easy to read site that breaks it down better?
> 
> Thanks again guys for all your patience.


On the sub will be two sets of inputs. Take the plus+ from both and tie together at the output from the amp. Do the same for the neg- wires.


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## Dangerranger (Apr 12, 2006)

Used 12W6v2 would be a good option. 13W6v2 would fit in that enclosure size as well. Dual 4 ohm, work well with 400-500W, great SQ, get loud. Put it in a low tuned ported box and rock out


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## Et Cetera (Jul 28, 2006)

May I suggest the iDQ15 v2 D2. These are on their way out and should be going cheap somewhere. 15" cone area, 94dB sensitivity, reasonably small box friendly. We have these kicking off 200w in some installs, should do wonders in yours.


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## dftnz7 (Mar 2, 2008)

I second the notion of an IDQv2, be it a 12" or 15". These can be had all over the boards for less than $150. Great SQ sub, doesn't look all that impressive, but is a great driver. Would try to squeeze a 15" if you could since these wont have quite the output of the newer (and more expensive) IDQv3....


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

The suggestions to go with a single 15 is good advice if you can fit it in your car. This will give you a good amount of output from a single sub, and keep price reasonable since you're only buying one sub and a smaller (single) box. Don't go smaller than a single 12. I personally would never recommend a single 10 or smaller unless space is limited. 

One thing to keep in mind: A single 4 ohm 12" sub (a small box version) might be a good idea because it gives you room to expand. If you decide you want or need more output, one more sub (more cone area) is the best way to do it. Just pick up one more 12" sub identical to the one you decide on, and you're good to go.


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## daGwagon (Jul 27, 2008)

here ya go buddy... this should help with your wiring woes 
series & parallel


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

Chowder Head said:


> Does anyone know where I can learn more about the previously mentioned Dayton RSS315HF subs? I tried doing a search but found minimal results.


http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=841


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

Here's one for sale right here on DIYMA.

http://diymobileaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38374


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## skeleto (May 6, 2008)

css subduction. I have the 15" in a sealed box. its a great sq sub and it gets loud. I have to keep my gain at 1/4 for normal listening.

http://www.creativesound.ca/details.php?model=SD12


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

X Ray said:


> Here's one for sale right here on DIYMA.
> 
> http://diymobileaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38374


I was just about to post this, it looks really good for the price.

If you guys don't mind, let me run through a few things and tell me if I got this or not.

Ok. This HO is a 4 ohm, DVC (it is DVC right?). My amp pumps out the suggested 420, real world around 510 or so, watts @ 2 ohms. 

Since this sub is a 4 ohm, and my amp is a 2 ohm, I have to wire so there is 2 ohms all around. I do this by wiring them parallel, so it looks like this...










Then since everything is 2 ohms, the 510 watts or so will go straight to the sub.

First question....am I correct?

2nd question....that deal looks really good. The Dayton HO 12"s has an RMS of 700 watts. Will my 510 or so RMS watts be enough to make this sub sound good? Or would I be starving it too much thus making me lose some sound quality? I already know subs can't be damaged from being underpowered, I'm just worried about the sound.

Lastly, is there anyplace that sells the IDQv3's other than woofersetc? Maybe someplace cheaper?

Thanks again for all the assistance guys, I really do appreciate it.


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## chrisw85 (Apr 24, 2008)

The dayton Ho 12 is SVC, meaning it has a single 4 ohm voice coil.


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## reindeers (Mar 7, 2008)

Yep, basically wiring your DVC 4 subs in parallel gives you a final impedance of 2 ohms maximising your amp output of 510 or so watts. As chrisw85 mentioned the daytons are SVC with 4 ohm impedance. It's a good SQ sub although you wont be achieving your initial goal which is maximising your amp.


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## hans030390 (Jun 23, 2008)

Crutchfield has that buy one get one free offer going for the Boston Acoustic subs (over $300 each). So, you get two for that price...then you can sell one of them and end up getting a good sub for cheap! 

Of course, I don't doubt that's there's better for your budget. I'm just thinking you could probably get one of the BA subs for $100 or less if you sold the second.


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## its_bacon12 (Aug 16, 2007)

I was running my TCON at 4 ohms on about 200w rms and it got plenty loud for me...

Before this summer, I had it running on upwards of 1200w rms. Didnt even notice a difference to 200w rms on the music I listen to.


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## Dr.Telepathy SQ (Nov 17, 2007)

In the great words of 300Z

*"I think most people worry too much about subbass.

IMO for low freq dutys just about any driver can work well as long as it is reasonably linear, has low distortion in it's intended freq range and has low mechanical noises. 
For the most part all the difference that people "hear" and claim that one driver is better than another is due to FR irregularities, level matching and poor integration with the midbass driver. 
There's plenty of low distortion low freq drivers out there now."*


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## Aaron Clinton (Oct 17, 2006)

*I responded to your pm on the other forum.......*


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## npdang (Jul 29, 2005)

I would suggest asking yourself the question, what makes you think that simply buying the right sub will provide you with the performance you are looking for?


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

its_bacon12 said:


> I was running my TCON at 4 ohms on about 200w rms and it got plenty loud for me...
> 
> Before this summer, I had it running on upwards of 1200w rms. Didnt even notice a difference to 200w rms on the music I listen to.


Wow  {what a bummer }.

I've always found that a sub plays, then it sounds good , then it sings ... Then it dies as the power is increased!


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

Where are the IDQ15's for under $150? I cant find one for less than $230 from woofersetc


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## benny z (Mar 17, 2008)

(i think he meant used)


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## B///M3W (Aug 7, 2008)

I have always had 10"s in every car I have owned thinking they were better for SQ than bigger speakers. I just bought a bunch of car audio equipment for my new car (which finally arrives in 2 days after a 2.5 month wait!) and after a TON of research, I decided on the 12w6v2 over the 10w6v2 or 10w7v2 in an attempt to focus on SQ. From what I read, if you get into that high end of the spectrum, really what you gain is the ability to hit lower notes a bit louder, and a bit more volume. Other than that, they are supposed to be relatively speaking, equal. Is that right?


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Thanks for the great replies, keep them coming! I'll try to answer questions and reply to posts in a minute but how do you guys feel about the RE Audio SE 12" subs? They're DVC, rated at 600 RMS which would be close to what my amp can pump out, fairly cheap, and everything I've read about them seem to indicate they're a really good sub. Only question is would this sub be more geared towards sound quality or just plain SPL?

Thanks again for the help everyone!


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

Unless you're a bass head, and want every last decibel, don't worry about power too much.

The Dayton is a single voice coil (SVC) sub. It's impedance (A/C resistance) is 4 ohm. The reason I recommend getting a 4 ohm sub is to give you the ability to get louder if you need or want to in the future. If you do, just add one more 4 ohm sub. (the same exact size and model) Any time you double up on subs, two things happen. Typically, you "almost" double your amplifier output, plus you double cone area. When you do this, you can get louder, but the subs don't increase much in distortion because they split up the work. When your subs are playing easier, they play cleaner. The harder you push a driver (speaker), it's distortion level goes up, so increasing amplifier power to increase output is typically not the best way unless you have very limited space. In that case, you would want a very high excursion sub, and a big amp to power it. Something like a JL 12w7 and 1000 watts, but this is only if you want a good amount of output, and don't have alot of room for multiple subs.

As a good general rule, try to get atleast 200+ watts RMS to a sub and you'll be fine. (again, this is assuming you're not a bass head) I was running my JL 12w6 off only 150 RMS for two years, and it sounded fine. I've run it off 150, 200, 285, and 800 watts RMS. From 150 watts to 285, there is only a very slight difference in sound pressure, so the increase in power is worthless in my opinion. There's no advantage to running 800 because it just makes the sub bottom out. (this sub can't handle much power) 

The way our ears hear sound and then the way our brain interprets it is a funny thing. Doubling amplifier power only increases sound pressure by 3 decibels. To the human ear, this level increase is noticeable, but not a huge difference. It typically takes TEN TIMES as much power for the human ear to perceive sound as being twice as loud. So do the math real quick............if you have a sub being powered by 200 watts RMS, you'll have to bump power up to 2,000 watts RMS for it to appear to be double as loud. (roughly 9 decibel increase in sound pressure)

Another example: I have two JBL 18 inch subs in my home stereo (PA system). If I run the amp bridged mono, the subs get 2,400 watts RMS (1,200 per sub) If I run both subs off one channel, they get 750 watts RMS (375 per sub). There is very little difference in volume level (to the human ear) with more than three times the power. So it's WORTHLESS to run the subs with 2,400 watts because all it's going to do is destroy the suspension on both subs and land me with a nice big bill to have them reconed. 

Let the arguing begin..........


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Very good post there, thanks for that X Ray.

I forgot to mention that the RE Audio SE I was referring to is a DVC 4 ohm driver. What I'm looking for right now at this very moment is a single sub that will give me what I need. Quick, clean, accurate bass that I can feel. I don't need the largest or baddest sounding sub, or a sub that rattles everything. But then again, I don't want a SQ sub that has no guts though, if that makes sense.

I really do believe I'll be fine with just one sub, I'm just having having trouble finding one that will give me what I'm looking for.

Does anyone have any experience or opinions regarding the RE Audio SE subs? I've heard they're good, I just don't know what they're geared towards.

Thanks again for the help everyone!


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

Chowder Head said:


> Very good post there, thanks for that X Ray.


No problem.



Chowder Head said:


> I forgot to mention that the RE Audio SE I was referring to is a DVC 4 ohm driver.


Is it 4 ohm per coil? Nevermind, I'll check  ........



Chowder Head said:


> What I'm looking for right now at this very moment is a single sub that will give me what I need. Quick, clean, accurate bass that I can feel.


Try not to use the words "Quick" or "Fast" when referring to bass. It's urban legend. There's no such thing as "fast" low frequency. Low frequency = less cycles per second = slow. 

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but I want the slowest bass possible. Hahaha! 

Any good quality sub (basically all that have been mentioned) should make you happy in terms of sound quality. My advice to use one 4 ohm sub now is just an idea that will give you an option to expand if you decide you need a little more volume, or you want to get a little lower in the future.



Chowder Head said:


> I really do believe I'll be fine with just one sub, I'm just having having trouble finding one that will give me what I'm looking for.


Again, all the ones mentioned should give you what your looking for, again, just give yourself room for expansion if you decided you desire it. Get one 12" 4 ohm sub that will play in a small box.


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

It appears that the RE SE series comes in either dual 2 ohm, or dual 4 ohm models. You'll need a dual 2 ohm model if you want a sub that can be utilized as a 4 ohm driver. 

A little pricey, but I've only heard very good things about the RE SE subs. If you're into the "look", and there's nothing wrong with that, get a sub with a good rep that looks good, assuming you can fit it in your budget. 

If you're into "bang for the buck", a Dayton or a Peerless XXL are more up your alley. Both of these measure very well, and are pretty inexpensive. 

I'll be ditching my JL 12w6 for a pair of Dayton 12's here very soon. I think the Daytons are SEXY, too!


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Would you happen to have a link for the XXL? I've heard of the XLS and the XXLS but never the XXL.

Oh, and just so I know, is the Dayton HF you suggested before a SVC like the HO or is it DVC?

Thanks in advance once again!


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

Whoops! I meant "XXLS". I accidentally left the "S" off.

All Dayton Reference series subs are single voice coil, in either 4 or 8 ohm. The HO models work in small enclosures, more ideal for car use. The HF models require large enclosures, but have slightly better low end extension, ideal for home theater use. The HF models do have slightly better sound quality, and will work fine in a car if you have the room for the larger enclosure.


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## chrisw85 (Apr 24, 2008)

HF is SVC, I believe the Titantic(sp) and they have another sub that is DVC


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## X Ray (Oct 29, 2007)

chrisw85 said:


> HF is SVC, I believe the Titantic(sp) and they have another sub that is DVC





X Ray said:


> All Dayton *Reference series* subs are single voice coil.....


I was specifically referring to the Reference Series as stated in my last post.


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## peter_bigblock (Jul 30, 2008)

Chowder Head said:


> Very good post there, thanks for that X Ray.
> ... Quick, clean, accurate bass that I can feel. I don't need the largest or baddest sounding sub, or a sub that rattles everything. But then again, I don't want a SQ sub that has no guts though, if that makes sense.
> 
> I really do believe I'll be fine with just one sub, I'm just having having trouble finding one that will give me what I'm looking for...


I recently installed an IDQ10D4 v.2 in a .55 ft^3 sealed box, it is DVC wired parallel to 2ohms, and it provides exactly what you're talking about in a small package. Good bass extension, nice tight SQ sub, $170 at woofersetc.com. I was looking for the same as you, bass that i could feel in my chest and that was clear and detailed with absolutely no need for trunk-thumping. I couldn't be happier, and the enclosure takes up very little space and is easy to move around to play with placement vs. SQ. The IDQ v.3, from what I have read, is a little more of an SPL sub balanced with SQ -- longer excursion, etc. The v.2 was cheaper and more what I was looking for...


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## Dr.Telepathy SQ (Nov 17, 2007)

npdang said:


> I would suggest asking yourself the question, what makes you think that simply buying the right sub will provide you with the performance you are looking for?


"A speaker^sub is only as good as the enclosure that you put it in to reach the desired results". 

Look at the numbers,model it,look at the power that you have on tap, plan your goal, and then move forward. Picking subs based on brand names,etc,etc, has about the same odds as winning big money in Las Vegas.

Subs are not sprinkled with magical "SQ" dust from the factory.


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## fonque (May 30, 2008)

if you can wait, you can preorder a stereo integrity Mag D2 12" $250
handles 1000W but will get loud enough with 275 - 300W
http://stereointegrity.com/order.php


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## npdang (Jul 29, 2005)

Dr.Telepathy SQ said:


> "A speaker^sub is only as good as the enclosure that you put it in to reach the desired results".
> 
> Look at the numbers,model it,look at the power that you have on tap, plan your goal, and then move forward. Picking subs based on brand names,etc,etc, has about the same odds as winning big money in Las Vegas.
> 
> Subs are not sprinkled with magical "SQ" dust from the factory.


Exactly... good bass SQ is a matter of smooth transition with the frontstage, smooth frequency response, and low distortion. The sub (although important) is hardly the only factor, nor really the most important one to a certain extent. You have to worry about how the sub interacts in the car, how it interacts with the enclosure, and how it interacts with the frontstage. Much more critical.

My advice, find a list of companies that provide good support and have a decent reputation for quality. Then investigate 1) pricing 2) box requirements 3) efficiency 4) total output capability. Prioritize your findings, and then pick appropriately.

Although you may get lucky buying and trying different subs and simply running them out of the box, learning how to properly tune and setup a sub is a MUCH more assured way of achieving the results you are looking for.


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

I really cannot thank you all enough for the great advice.

Dr. I kind of figured that, I just wanted to make sure I picked out a sub that was "designed" for what I wanted out of a sub. That way, when I install it into the proper enclosure, it will sound exactly how I want it to sound.

npdang, thanks for the great info. I'm a big fan of your reviews so really do appreciate the personal reply from you. 

Last suggestion for right now, I promise. How do you guys feel about the PG RSDC's? I was looking to get a single 12" and I see they go for around $160. DVC, 4 ohms, 600W RMS....sounds in order power wise and from what I've heard about the RSD's, they sound like a winner.

The only thing I haven't figured out would be the differences between the RSD and the RSDC. I know the RSDC is the more recent line but is this an improvement in all areas compared to the RSD's and if I went this route, I should get the RSDC no matter what? Or does the RSDC do better in some areas not not better than the RSD in others?

Any feedback regarding this particular driver would be really appreciated, as I've heard great things about them. They seem like a good candidate to what I want but I'd like to make sure with you guys first.


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## Dr.Telepathy SQ (Nov 17, 2007)

I don't think it's best for us to say " go purchase X sub and you will be happy". 

Again, have you modeled the PG sub? I will tell you upfront that you will need a large box for it, 2 cubes or more. Search a reivew by MVM, he had a great review over this sub.
I will say, better options are out there for the price. 

You need a goal in mind first. What are you goals? What are you looking for and what do you want from this sub? It's more than just how much output. Just as Npdang as stated, it's all about smooth response and seemless transition with the rest of your system. 

Questions you need to ask yourself

-budget

-type of box or enclosure, what type of vehicle do you have and how much space are you working with or willing to part with for a sub? Maybe you would like IB? just an example.

-power, how much do you have and how is your power dished out? do you have a monoblock that needs a 2ohm load to reach full power output, or are you going to bridge 2 channels of an amp for a single 4ohm load?, is your amp 2ohm stable bridged..etc,etc,etc. Some subs make better use of power than others. Again, I'm trying to make this simple, but once you learn how to model, you will learn more about what the numbers and the plots are telling you.

- do you have a decent amount of midbass from your mid/midbass driver or are you going to need a sub to cover the higher fq for you in order to smooth out the transition?

-is low end ext important for you? 

Other questions can be asked, but this is a start. Honestly, at the end of the day, it's just bass. Simply put. We're talking about 20hz-100hz, a very narrow range when we're talking about 20-15,000 cycles. 

Come up with 5 subs that you're intrested in. Download WinISD or bassboxpro, look at the numbers, and plot it. Think about the type of car/truck that you have, the purpose of the install and the goal that you want. But you first have to target a goal. 

It doesn't matter if the sub cost $30 or $500, if it's not in a correct situation, it's not going reproduce good results. 


Just to give you an example, I'm currently running a pair of the cheapest, in terms of how much I paid for them, subs I've ever had. (2) 8"s, and I'm VERY happy with them. They are not lacking output or low end ext either, but it's all in the enclosure.  I paid less than $100 for both of them.


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## Chowder Head (Aug 3, 2008)

Well the reason why I'm considering the PG's would be from what I've heard, they're a pretty great budget sub. Even saw this review that makes me want them even more. http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5698&highlight=Phoenix+Gold+RSD12d

Granted, this was a RSD and test is a few years old so I'm not sure how it stacks up the competition but it does sound interesting. Is the RSDC a complete upgrade from the RSD in every aspect? 

Concerning the box size, I thought I originally posted it but I guess not. Sorry about that. The max I can go would be around 2.78cu. I was hoping I could get just one 10" or 12" sub and be happy. DVC, 4 ohms.

As posted, my amp puts out a suggested 420 @ 2 ohms, real world around 510 @ 2 ohms (thanks again for that Dr.)

The rest of my setup consists of a Pioneer 880PRS (I'll be going active with this) Seas Neo aluminum tweeters, and Mach 5 MLI-65 mids.

Part of me is trying to get the most out of my money and a part of me wants to say screw it and order the damn IDQv3 12" already...

But you're right Dr, I'll have to do more research regarding exactly what I want. I was just curious to find subs people have had success with and they find out if those subs will fit my particular application. 

Any more thoughts or opinions would still be appreciated, thank you.


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## dftnz7 (Mar 2, 2008)

You wont be sorry with the IDQv3, as far as SQ goes. You MAY be disappointed with the output of it however if you go sealed. I would try to get one and go ported, then you would have the best of both worlds. It really is a great sub, but to get the most out of it it needs to be ported. I am running mine sealed, and it blends so smoothly with the front stage, but sometimes I wish I had that little extra kick/low end extension to it. Ported would solve those problems instantly.


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## Oliver (Jun 25, 2007)

Perhaps a 2512a DVC 4 ohm ?

http://cgi.ebay.com/DD-Audio-2512a-...39:1|66:2|65:12|240:1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

Guys , 92.2 feedback is "OUCH" as far as ratings go [ credit card for a safety net , recommended ].
Current bid: US $185.00


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## bobduch (Jul 22, 2005)

FWIW
I had 2 old school Nakamichi SP1010 subs in a larger ported enclosure powered by a single Nak PA301 mono amp and the SQ was great and it got pretty loud. Now they sit in the closet since being replaced by Velodynes.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

all i look for in a sub is a cone that won't flex when i decide to pour the coals to it...same with mids too. cone flex is BAD.


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