# Upcoming midbass/midrange comparasion test



## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Hi,

Finally done with school projects and stuff. So I'm gonna do a midrange/fullrange review.

I'm planning to test 5 of the following drivers:

*Usher 8848P (7")
*DLS Iridium 8i (8")
*Seas L18 H1224 (6,5")
*Exodus Anarchy EX (6,5")
*Peerless SDS (6,5")
*Peerless HDS (7")
*Dayton RS180 (7")

I'm not doing more than 5 drivers, too much much work involved building baffles and stuff. I will focus on the objective part (measurements, T/S parameters and FR/HD graphs). But I will do a blind ABX test on each driver as well. Still figuring out how to do the test, I will probably test them against a fullrange driver (Fountek FR88EX) or a Peerless HDS tweeter that can be crossed really low. Wanna test both how they sound crossed in a 2-way or 3-way system. I will use active crossovers (Moscini 6to8 or my Helix P-DSP) and dual amps and an instant speaker switch. I either use my home audio XTZ class-A amps or some car audio amp I have on the shelf powered by a transformer.

Will take a month or so to complete, if I found some other interesting driver I might add it (if I got the time :>)


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## nabot49 (Apr 24, 2008)

Looking forward to this as well!


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## adrenalinejunkie (Oct 17, 2010)

Sub'd.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

I'm gathering drivers atm from friends. Got the Usher 8848p, seas l18, dls iri8, anarchys and dayton rs180 atm. Looking for one or two more... 

Pictures coming soon.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy 3 via Tapatalk.


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## nabot49 (Apr 24, 2008)

Awesome!


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## 94VG30DE (Nov 28, 2007)

Interested. Some of those are even speakers I can afford  

I trust you are going to have someone else pushing the speaker-switch buttons and writing down your comments?


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

94VG30DE said:


> Interested. Some of those are even speakers I can afford
> 
> I trust you are going to have someone else pushing the speaker-switch buttons and writing down your comments?


I do not perform sighted tests, only ABX blind tests and measurements.

And yes, I will do a subjective analysis and see how they match up against measured data later on. If I'm lucky I might get a few friends to come over and do the same ABX test and see if we prefer the same drivers.


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

Interesting. I'd offer my help but it's a long drive and most of the route is ocean.


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## ErinH (Feb 14, 2007)

I really would like to see you put together a test method/procedure/setup detailing EVERYTHING about how you're going to measure speakers, how they're going to be installed/set up, etc. These are HUGELY important factors, as I'm sure you already know.


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## thehatedguy (May 4, 2007)

Make sure all of the speakers meaure and function correctly (not damaged in shipping) before you do any listening tests. The mids I submitted were, uh, not right for whatever reason.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

bikinpunk said:


> I really would like to see you put together a test method/procedure/setup detailing EVERYTHING about how you're going to measure speakers, how they're going to be installed/set up, etc. These are HUGELY important factors, as I'm sure you already know.


I will.

There are lots of things to consider as you say... That's why I'm thinking it through before I post anything. I don't have a "controlled" environment either so all frequencies below 200Hz or so will be affected by the room. Can't do much about it, at least all drivers share the same conditions.

Since the intended usage for these drivers is for car audio as mid-woofers/midrange I intend to bandpass the drivers with specific frequencies. I'm aware that some drivers will have better upper extension than others and testing in this way will effectively disregard upper range performance (I will show this with fullrange FR measurements though). Many (most?) people mount their drivers in doors so they will run into serious beaming issues (driver's side) at some point anyway. It would be more interesting to see how they perform offaxis actually.

Thinking of using the presets in the DSP to quickly switch between different level settings (well someone will have to do it as soon they change speakers)

Enclosures is bit tricky too, building enclosures to gain a Qtc of 0,7 is meaningless imo, almost everyone use their mids "IB" inside doors or in some AP configuration in kicks. Low end will also be affected by cabin gain... well. Many things to consider, I'll try to do it to the best of my ability.

Any suggestions would be appreciated since you and several other guys surely have lots more experience than me performing 'close to accurate tests'. Done this before but my methods might have been less than perfect 

My biggest issue is how to level match the drivers, there are at least two ways (or more) to do this...


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

thehatedguy said:


> Make sure all of the speakers meaure and function correctly (not damaged in shipping) before you do any listening tests. The mids I submitted were, uh, not right for whatever reason.


All drivers have been used, but never misused. All drivers but the DLS have been used in home audio projects and sound as they should 

Actually I have replaced 2!! of the Seas drivers, phase plug was off center and rubbed against the cone. Bad quality control =/ (1 year ago now, though)


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## kizz (Jun 22, 2009)

Why did you choose these drivers? What is your background in car audio that makes you credible for this test? What equipment do you have for the testing? How will you ensure that testing is blind? How will you set up the test so that there are as few variables as possible? 

Im not trying to discourage, just curious as this kind of testing is a HUGE undertaking and like it was said earlier, You can't please everybody.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

I am not sponsored by anyone. I test these drivers because I can get hold of them, some I already own. I'm not saying I'm professional product tester, but I will do my best. I should have enough eqiupment and software for speaker testing.

Bikinpunk, I'll pm you my mail and such later. Thanks 

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy 3 via Tapatalk.


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## 07azhhr (Dec 28, 2011)

Hanatsu - GL with this testing. I am looking forward to the results.


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## co_leonard (Aug 14, 2009)

Nice! Looking forward to this too!


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## 1996blackmax (Aug 29, 2007)

Looking forward to your results.


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## BowDown (Sep 24, 2009)

I have heard about 4 of these drivers and still run 1 of them. Curious how it stacks up. 



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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

I'll post a new thread later. I'll begin preparing for the test the coming week 

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## NonSenCe (Jun 4, 2011)

are you going to listen them with music too? if so, give us the playlist also. 

and as everyone has their own favorite/reference songs, and you plan to have friends over to hear the speakers out too.. so remember to ask their favorite songs also to be included to your original playlist.. so everyone listening and grading them will have atleast one song they know well.


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## Fricasseekid (Apr 19, 2011)

Subscribed


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

Good luck with everything buddy... I know there's gonna be a lot of critisism before and after but as long as you're happy with the outcome of your test, it's all that matters 

Would love to see freq resp of each drivers in the tested environment to see if we can collerate what you guyz heard and if it shows on a graph  

Kelvin


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## Fricasseekid (Apr 19, 2011)

I wish the peerless SLS was part of this.


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

Fricasseekid said:


> I wish the peerless SLS was part of this.


Doesn't play much above midbass frequencies  

Kelvin


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Fricasseekid said:


> I wish the peerless SLS was part of this.


Had these drivers a few month back, sold them to a friend, thought I could borrow them now but they're installed in his doors already :/

They can't be used aboce 500Hz or so IIRC. Great mids though.

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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Ok. I've got 4 drivers so far ready for testing. DLS Iridium 8, Seas L18, Usher 8848P (very similar to 8845P, different cone material) and Exodus Anarchy.

For another project I've just ordered a pair of Dayton RS125-8. I'll include those, I know they are smaller than the rest and it will put them to a disadvantage in midbass output. But it's quite a popular driver from what I can tell, so I'll include it. Midrange will also be tested so it might be interesting for some to see how they perform.

Most likely I get hold of a pair of Dayton RS180 tomorrow or on Saturday. When I do, I'll perform the measurements asap. Subjective blind tests will follow soon after.

I keep you guys posted, the RS125 should turn up tomorrow, but if they don't it will have to wait until Monday ;/

( At least preparations are done, had to make a "jig" for offaxis FR mic measurement as well. I will measure 0, 15, 30, 45, 60 deg offaxis. )


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## req (Aug 4, 2007)

awesome dude. plase take pictures of stuff as you are testing it, and maybe even some videos of stuff. that would be totally rad.

i wish i could help for **** like this


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

req said:


> awesome dude. plase take pictures of stuff as you are testing it, and maybe even some videos of stuff. that would be totally rad.
> 
> i wish i could help for **** like this


Sure, no problem. Pictures will be posted. I have a 1080p professional camera so I might do a video too, heh


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## Wesayso (Jul 20, 2010)

So you're not hacking into your Illuminator home set yet?


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Wesayso said:


> So you're not hacking into your Illuminator home set yet?


Hah, no way. Those are mounted neatly from behind, cables soldered etc. Too annoying to remove xD


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## Wesayso (Jul 20, 2010)

Got a picture? would love to see them...


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## ErinH (Feb 14, 2007)

Pics of the jig for measurements? 

Do you know how to measure and merge NF and FF properly? I forgot to email you back. Just been really busy.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

bikinpunk said:


> Pics of the jig for measurements?
> 
> Do you know how to measure and merge NF and FF properly? I forgot to email you back. Just been really busy.


I'll get a picture tonight. 

NF, FF should be merged around 500Hz or so? I don't know if I've done it properly before. Complicated? 

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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Found this page;

http://www.google.se/url?q=http://w...kQFjAA&usg=AFQjCNGULhHdPMT1RH5gvPcxFpfkq4wN-w

Edit: Found this as well; http://www.artalabs.hr/AppNotes/AP4_FreeField-Rev03eng.pdf. Seems to explain it pretty good, right? 

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## ErinH (Feb 14, 2007)

The klippel link is what I was going to suggest.


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

Used Holmimpulse instead of Arta for NR/FF merging, much easier and better.

Got the Rs180 today, still waiting for the Rs125 though. Finished measure three drivers so far. Compared two of them to Zaph's graphs, seem to be accurate enough.

Probably finish this by Tuesday, need to place the new drivers on break-in over the night before testing them.

Bikinpunk, at what distance do you perform HD-sweeps btw?

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## ErinH (Feb 14, 2007)

nearfield. approximately 4-6", depending on the driver.


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## NonSenCe (Jun 4, 2011)

glad to hear things are moving along.

i am just wondering if these speakers will be available for sale after the test? 

-if they are, i might have to call "DIBS". hah. (to be determined later which pair of speakers i call for, after the testresults and knowing the pricing of them.)


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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

NonSenCe said:


> glad to hear things are moving along.
> 
> i am just wondering if these speakers will be available for sale after the test?
> 
> -if they are, i might have to call "DIBS". hah. (to be determined later which pair of speakers i call for, after the testresults and knowing the pricing of them.)


Hehe, sure. The Dls Iri8 comes from my install, so I'm already using them. The Dayton Rs180 is not mine (I used to own these but I sold them and borrowed them back now for the test) 

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## Hanatsu (Nov 9, 2010)

So I completed all measurements yesterday. Would have posted it as soon as I got home today but I got called away on a job 600km away and won't be home until Friday night. Well, I post a pic from the phone as a small teaser in the meantime 











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## rsjaurr (Apr 8, 2012)

Eagerly awaiting your final analysis because I have bought RS180 to go with HAT L1Pro R2 and L3Pro as front 3 way active with subs in the back.


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