# Can I connect my power cables like this?



## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

Hi all,
I'm installing this NVX JAD900.5 amp into my car tomorrow, just finished building the mounting brackets.
I'm running 4 ga power and ground wire. If I tin them they'll fit into the amp's receptacles just fine without the adapter shown in the pics
-BUT-
I ordered these 4 ga ferrules shown because this is my first install I wanted to use nice connectors on everything and have no unterminated wire ends anywhere. I want the wiring to be as clean and neat as possible.
The bummer is that the 4 ga ferrules don't fit into the amp without using the adapter shown.
So my question is:
Is it bad that the ferrules don't fill out the adapter's full receptacles?
As you can see in the pics the ferrules touch on the bottom and the large set screw obviously will make good contact as well.
Hardest OCD decision ever. Do I forego the ferrules to have the power & ground wires (tinned) make contact with the amp's receptacles all the way around? Or is it OK to run ferrules in the adapter not quite filling out the whole hole?
Thank you for your input!


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

IMO, I would just tin the #4 and insert into the amp…the less conections the better.
I also think that would look better then that extra connector.


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## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

seafish said:


> IMO, I would just tin the #4 and insert into the amp…the less conections the better.
> I also think that would look better then that extra connector.


Cool, thanks! That does make sense, less connections is better for sure.
And I'm honored you dropped your 1000th post here! Congrats.


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

KrautNotRice said:


> Cool, thanks! That does make sense, less connections is better for sure.
> And I'm honored you dropped your 1000th post here! Congrats.


haha... didn;t even notice. Thanks!


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## dgage (Oct 1, 2013)

Interestingly, ferrules are required on most/all electronics and equipment in Europe with similar connections. I had similar thoughts but didn't find any comments that there were any connection issues with ferrules, actually just the opposite since the ferrule could hold the wire in shape so the wire doesn't splay around the set screw (strong tinning would stop the splay as well). As long as the ferrule is sized correctly for the wire, meaning the wire fills the ferrule, you should be good. I know I plan to start using ferrules for everything.


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## Justin Zazzi (May 28, 2012)

It looks like if you use the ferrules they will only be in contact a little bit on the top by the set screw and a little bit on the bottom where they touch the adapter. You want lots of surface area, and using the bare wires into the amp terminals would give you a lot more.


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## jtaudioacc (Apr 6, 2010)

with only 80 amps of fusing do whatever you want that makes you happy with the way it looks.


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## miniSQ (Aug 4, 2009)

why even use that silver adapter piece? can you run the 4ga right into the amp without that adapter piece? Do the ferules fit any better without it?

Like jtaudioacc said...do whatever makes your OCD stress the least


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## High Resolution Audio (Sep 12, 2014)

As a licensed electrician, I strongly oppose using ferrules. They are a very bad idea. As stated in earlier posts, the contact points are very small which makes for a poor connection. I've come across one wire for a low voltage fixture that came with a ferrule crimped onto the end from the factory. I thought it was cool at first until I had to come back for a trouble repair because it stopped working due to bad design. Much better to put the wire in the connector and tighten the set screw. As the set screw pushes down into the strands, the force pushes the strands out in all directions and makes a contact throughout the entire surface area of the lug.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

Unless gold or a gold plated metal is mixed with 2 other different metals, it's better to keep it simple, if it fits, copper wire, brass terminal, just end it there, tin the copper, no no, adding a Zinc connector even if it's tinned or marine application approved, no no, in 6 months the copper will be 70% darker, and and the isulation will change color.

Simple crimps, or only 2 metals connected will remain clean and lasrt longer than when adding a third metal, no solder, no no, rosin will be the third or fourth metal that can oxidize the copper and create the galvanic reaction. Gold is the only exception besides looking better even if you solder it. I'm no electrician, just speaking from personal experience.


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## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

Thanks for all the input. I'll ditch the adapter and ferrules. I'll tin the ends of the 4 ga power wires as the ferrules don't fit into the amp.
Thanks again!


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## dugjt88 (Dec 7, 2012)

Could always go with 4ga to 4ga machined adapters or whatever size you need. There's test done showing the difference between using wire, using wire into a reducer, and wire into dual inputs. (Wire alone showed lower voltage and thus less power). I like reducers not only because i'm running 4/0, but because i change amps quite often when i have a stuff installed so less of a hassle dealing with wire (fraying from removing and reinstalling).

http://www.droppinhzcaraudio.com/toolmaker-4ga-to-4ga-amplifier-inputs/


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## dugjt88 (Dec 7, 2012)

also all of the ferrules we use at work are crimped square so that may be something to consider. Also i'm guessing that why your 4ga ferrule doesnt fit the 4ga terminal is it's not crimped yet


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## jtaudioacc (Apr 6, 2010)

you can also google search it's uses, and benefits and make a better informed decision.


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## sebberry (May 1, 2008)

I never really liked the idea of using the set screw on fine strand, heavy gauge wire. It seems that many of the wires would be displaced and make little or no contact. 

I'd rather crimp on a lug and bolt that sucker down, but amps don't provide that option.


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## WhereAmEye? (Jun 17, 2013)

Have nothing to say, but I just took this photo last week. The irony is awesome


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

If the terminal hole is so big, for the wire then I would understand the risk of damage with multiple removal and re installing the wire.

If the wire just fits tight already, the set screw will just put a minor dent on the wire.

If it is too loose, get a copper pipe that just fits the terminal and the wire and tightening the set screw won't damage the wire, the copper will press on the wire.

It really takes a lot of force to damage the wire with the set screw even with a large gap, if more force is needed, the solution may be here then........................http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/fabrication-tools-tricks-trade/167610-set-screw-solution.html


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## firebirdude (Dec 24, 2009)

I don't understand it, but ferrules have been all the rage lately. My first thought was, why? As was said the contact point between the ferrule and amp terminal is limited. It's the same when you tin 4g, but it's actually even worse with a ferrule as it just serves as an intermediary. Being able to tighten the set screw around non-tinned wire and allowing the strands to splay around the set screw maximizes contact surface area, when compared to these two other methods. Keep in mind, we're not trying to install 8g in a 0g terminal. Most terminals barely accept the gauge they're designed for, and then you run a set screw down through it. It's a tight clean connection.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

Yes I agree, keep it simple. And the link I posted, it's not about ferrules though.

It's about using 2 pieces of copper, that will take the pressure and stress from most of the wire.

Personally I just use one piece, on the top, the one that will contact the set screw, and let the bare wire compress on the bottom making more contact with the amp's terminal


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## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

The link you posted about the piece of copper pipe compressing the wire strands is a neat idea for when you're dealing with bare strands, no doubt.
I'm just trying not to mess with bare wire strands anymore.
So since the 4ga ferrules don't fit into the amp I'll just tin the wire if that's not bad.
I just don't care how well bare strands theoretically make contact, it looks terrible and suffers from each removal & reinstall.
I wanna keep it simple yet clean.


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## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

When I did my brother's install recently I added ferrules to all connections possible, there was no bare wire strands connection in the entire install. The mids had set screws so that worked out, the tweeters had disconnects so they got disconnects of course. The amp also had set screws, so instead of spade terminals (like on older style amps) I used ferrules for the amp's speaker wire connections as well. 
I inserted the ferrules uncrimped, but when you tighten down the set screw it crimps the ferrule. I tested it by pulling on the wire and it was very secure.
I tinned the power cables but didn't get a picture.







Every connection you see here either has ferrules (speaker wires) or was tinned (power cables), then color coded with shrink tubing:


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## dgage (Oct 1, 2013)

Thanks KrautNotRice. That looks very nice. I was worried about using ferrules primarily due to size and availability/cost of ferrule tools. Essentially, decently priced ferrules only go to 8/10 gauge and I want to use ferrules with 4 gauges as well. I figure I can tin/solder the wire to a larger ferrule and use the tool and smaller gauge wire. Thanks for sharing.


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## Alrojoca (Oct 5, 2012)

That looks clean, for speaker wires, I used these, no solder to tinning.

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...-buy-banana-plugs.html?highlight=Dynex+banana

The resistance increase is either non existent or 0.1 ohm if any with the added banana connectors, not sure if you meant solder the ferrules to the wire or just tin the wire and slip it in. Either way if you know the exact impedance from your drivers measured at the speaker terminals, then you can check it with the 10-15 ft wire run before connecting them to the amp, and add the ferrules later and if the ferrules add no extra resistance (less than 0.2 ohms ) I guess the ferrules are OK. 

Ferrules are not cheap and if you have the time to heat shrink color code them and all that, great. I prefer the dynex plugs, for speakers, I trust gold plated connectors more than any other metal, besides copper, when a third metal is added in the the mix.

And of course, guys here love the terminal barriers, having a foot or 2 from the barrier to the amp, instead of making the wire shorter each time, simply deal with the existing 1-2 ft of wire from the amp to the barrier until it wears out short from stripping and cutting after multiple removals , then you just replace the 1-2 ft wire instead of making the main wire short, problem solved


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## KrautNotRice (Nov 2, 2015)

I really like those banana plugs for speaker wire, too. In my opinion bare wires are just a no no. Thanks for sharing. 
Another thing to mentioned about the ferrules I used: there's no special tools needed and nothing was soldered. You just strip the wire, slide the ferrules on, the heat shrink holds them in place, then the set screw crimps it down. Pretty simple and just like the banana plugs -- can remove and reinstall a hundred times without damage or change.

...When I'm not working I nerd out about wire connectors with other car audio nerds on the internet... LOL


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

Is not wrong to use something to secure the cable. It is wrong when after connect something in between and you are getting high voltage drop.


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## caraudiopimps (May 4, 2016)

firebirdude said:


> I don't understand it, but ferrules have been all the rage lately. My first thought was, why? As was said the contact point between the ferrule and amp terminal is limited. It's the same when you tin 4g, but it's actually even worse with a ferrule as it just serves as an intermediary. Being able to tighten the set screw around non-tinned wire and allowing the strands to splay around the set screw maximizes contact surface area, when compared to these two other methods. Keep in mind, we're not trying to install 8g in a 0g terminal. Most terminals barely accept the gauge they're designed for, and then you run a set screw down through it. It's a tight clean connection.


No matter how well I tighten my set screws, I get the jacket of the wire pulling back a bit if the amp gets moved around, ferrules and heatshrink prevent this, the set screw crimps the ferrule, and looks pretty. And I don't have to cut my wiring and restrictions if I take the amp out for testing or any other number of reasons. I've tested resistance, and it's .0x added with the ferrules, which to me is a perfectly acceptable trade-off.


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## caraudiopimps (May 4, 2016)

dugjt88 said:


> Could always go with 4ga to 4ga machined adapters or whatever size you need. There's test done showing the difference between using wire, using wire into a reducer, and wire into dual inputs. (Wire alone showed lower voltage and thus less power). I like reducers not only because i'm running 4/0, but because i change amps quite often when i have a stuff installed so less of a hassle dealing with wire (fraying from removing and reinstalling).
> 
> http://www.droppinhzcaraudio.com/toolmaker-4ga-to-4ga-amplifier-inputs/


I personally wouldn't use these, ferrules will spread out more when the set screw is tightened down and give more surface area to contact. If you need the reducers I suppose they wouldn't be a huge issue, but it's still the same connection method as most amps have, you're just moving it back a little..


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

caraudiopimps said:


> No matter how well I tighten my set screws, I get the jacket of the wire pulling back a bit if the amp gets moved around...


Yet another reason to bolt your amp down so it can't move it around.


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## jriggs (Jun 14, 2011)

seafish said:


> Yet another reason to bolt your amp down so it can't move it around.


+1. Seriously, your amps should never move around.


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

jriggs said:


> +1. Seriously, your amps should never move around.


+20000000, even the manual stated clearly on this matter.


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## emilime75 (Jan 27, 2011)

You should never tin wire that's terminated by any sort of crimp/compression/clamp method. By doing so, you're not allowing the connector to work as intended. Ferrules are helpful when using smaller gauge wire in a connector designed to accept larger wire.

And, yes, always always always bolt down your amps so they can't move around.


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## Madcow (Apr 30, 2013)

Bare copper wire with Brundy anti-oxidation compound is my vote. It keeps galvanization down between two dissimilar metals. 


Sent from the future via a wifi time portal.


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## caraudiopimps (May 4, 2016)

dugjt88 said:


> also all of the ferrules we use at work are crimped square so that may be something to consider. Also i'm guessing that why your 4ga ferrule doesnt fit the 4ga terminal is it's not crimped yet


Can you elaborate on this? Are you crimping them square? What tool do you use? Can you link a pic?


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## dugjt88 (Dec 7, 2012)

caraudiopimps said:


> Can you elaborate on this? Are you crimping them square? What tool do you use? Can you link a pic?


Almost all of the ferrule crimpers i've seen and used are all square or trapezoid crimp (it does not turn out round like the amp inputs). The tool is simply a ferrule crimper

Wire Ferrules Crimping Tool: Ratchet Compression Hydraulic Pneumatic Mechanisms 28AWG-500MCM at Ferrules Direct


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## Sine Swept (Sep 3, 2010)

This is the one I have:

https://www.amazon.com/Velleman-VTECT4-Adjusting-Crimping-Connectors/dp/B004W77GFE


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## dugjt88 (Dec 7, 2012)

Sine Swept said:


> This is the one I have:
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Velleman-VTECT4-Adjusting-Crimping-Connectors/dp/B004W77GFE


We use knipex here, but same style.


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## caraudiopimps (May 4, 2016)

dugjt88 said:


> Almost all of the ferrule crimpers i've seen and used are all square or trapezoid crimp (it does not turn out round like the amp inputs). The tool is simply a ferrule crimper
> 
> Wire Ferrules Crimping Tool: Ratchet Compression Hydraulic Pneumatic Mechanisms 28AWG-500MCM at Ferrules Direct


Thanks a ton for the response, I actually spent an hr on that exact site looking at tools and ferrules last night! I'm ordering some ferrules, they look pretty, and they're not too pricey, I'll rip em out if my resistance gets bumped up or the connection worsens.


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## caraudiopimps (May 4, 2016)

Sine Swept said:


> This is the one I have:
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Velleman-VTECT4-Adjusting-Crimping-Connectors/dp/B004W77GFE


Thanks a bunch! Should I buy this if I'm using ferrules? Or can my set screw and heat shrink do the job? Or can I just use my Klein crimpers?


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