# 05 Subaru STi starting my first SQ Build



## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Here is my attempt at my first SQ build. I don't have all the high end processing yet or high end radio but that will come with some time. If you have any tips of advice I'd love to hear it. I may not take it but I love to learn. Please don't criticize my choice of product. This is a build log not a product opinion thread.

Here goes......

The product list as it stands so far are......

Pioneer AVIC-F90BT (not really SQ Oriented but stays for now)
Hybrid Audio Legatia L841-3 Pro 3-way Component set....includes a 8", 4" and 1" tweeter
JL Audio 600/4
Second Skin Damplifier Pro, Overkill Pro, Overkill and Luxury Liner Pro

I will not be doing a sub for now because the 8's in the doors should be enough for my tastes. If its not I will add a decent 10 or 12 later on. I also am very limited for space in the trunk with a double stroller.

Here we go with the pics from day one.....

We started on sound deadening the front doors using Second Skin Damplifer Pro and Overkill Pro. The Overkill Pro is a 3/8" closed cell foam used to eliminate standing waves behind and in front of the speaker. On the panel the speaker is mounted to there will be a layer of Overkill applied over the Damplifer Pro. We also trimmed and heated three ABS plastic pieces per side to seal up the holes in the doors to create a solid sealed environment for the L8 8" midbass. I will be going over these panels this weekend with the remaining Damplifier Pro to seal the door skin up.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Here are the pics of the drivers....

*L1 Pro Tweeter....*


























*L4 Mid Driver....*


















*L8 Midbass....*


























Hopefully tomorrow night I'll have some more updates with some finished door panel deadening.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Figured I would throw a pic of the car and a dyno run just for reference. Enjoy!!!!


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## pjhabit (Aug 12, 2008)

Lookin' good...subscribed:snacks:


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

Where are you putting the 8's 4's and tweets?

8's will require a lot of work to fit in the doors
4's either in the kicks or pillars will require a lot of work...

Interested none the less-


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

NotTheDavel said:


> Where are you putting the 8's 4's and tweets?
> 
> 8's will require a lot of work to fit in the doors
> 4's either in the kicks or pillars will require a lot of work...
> ...


The 8's will be going in the door. The 4's will be going in the kicks as flush as I can get them and the tweets will be in the pillars.


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

I hope you are prepaired to hack up and rebuild the door panels- I have worked on many wrx/sti's and owned my fair share- without mods to the panel and door you can not fit anything larger than a 6.5 and nothing deeper than 2.6 inches which can be tricky to do-

Good luck! 

Staying tuned- if you need any help let me know


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## SD_R/T (Nov 28, 2007)

Looking good so far. Mind sharing what process you took to heat up/mold the abs to the door panels?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

NotTheDavel said:


> I hope you are prepaired to hack up and rebuild the door panels- I have worked on many wrx/sti's and owned my fair share- without mods to the panel and door you can not fit anything larger than a 6.5 and nothing deeper than 2.6 inches which can be tricky to do-
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> Staying tuned- if you need any help let me know



I work in the industry and the shop I work for does a lot of fabrication. We have a top 100 installer here that is helping me with the build. I will cut hack modify whatever it takes to make it the way I want. It will be built to look as factory like as possible with maybe a little flair to it. It won't be anything super flashy.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

SD_R/T said:


> Looking good so far. Mind sharing what process you took to heat up/mold the abs to the door panels?


We took two pieces of MDF...small strips and taped them together and mounted them to our bench. We then rough cut the shape of each opening and marked a line with a sharpy where the panel needed to be raised. Then we brough the ABS plastic to the holder and heated it with a heat gun and bent each bend as necessary. Final touches were done with the panels screwed in then heated in place. Hope that helps.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Ok so here is a decent update for you guys. Tonight myself and my buddy did some more sound deadening and mounted the rings that will hold the tweeters. Aiming them on axis with each other was probably one of the more difficult things we had to do. Deciding that they were finally straight and level was such a pain. After laying them on the bench out of the car I was amazed at how perfectly symmetrical they wound up doing it by eye. In one of the pics you can see we mounted the tweeter just a tad higher than the highest point on the dash to try to minimize as many reflections as we could.

Here are some pics of the Rear Left door damped with Second Skin Damp Pro and Overkill Pro.


















Here are the pics from building the rings for the tweeters out of 1/2" MDF. We then temporarily mounted them to the pillars via hot glue. The next step will be to use Duramix (Liquid plastic) to permanently fix them in place.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)




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## TXwrxWagon (Sep 26, 2008)

NotTheDavel said:


> I hope you are prepaired to hack up and rebuild the door panels- I have worked on many wrx/sti's and owned my fair share- without mods to the panel and door you can not fit anything larger than a 6.5 and nothing deeper than 2.6 inches which can be tricky to do-
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> Staying tuned- if you need any help let me know


HUH??!!!???... my Alpine SPX/F#1/Scan-Speak 6.5" mids are nearly 2.75" deep+. With the right spacer, adjust the window track, & a little sanding on the back of the '02-'04 "bug-eye" door panels fit & clear the window fine... I guess I am missing something from your "many worked on" & "owned fair share" experience? What speakers have you tried to fit, specifically?

the '05-07 doors have the round door grill, somewhere about 3/8"-1/2" more speaker clearance & better brackets supporting the door panel.

With the right mounting configuration & some planing... I can see this happening.. can't wait to see more...

Rob


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Rear doors being treated like the front sans sealing since no speakers are going in there.


















Beginning the work on mounting the rings for the tweeters in the pillars


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Tweeter fabrication DONE!!! Just need to get the material to wrap them with. Started on the floor with Damplifier Pro. Next time I hope to get most of the interior finished with the Damplifier Pro and then lay down the Luxury Liner Pro.


























































One more: Look what came in today. I am so excited at the amazing deal I got. Brand New Pioneer Premier DEX-P9 and DEQ-P9. $700.00 plus shipping!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

TXwrxWagon said:


> HUH??!!!???... my Alpine SPX/F#1/Scan-Speak 6.5" mids are nearly 2.75" deep+. With the right spacer, adjust the window track, & a little sanding on the back of the '02-'04 "bug-eye" door panels fit & clear the window fine... I guess I am missing something from your "many worked on" & "owned fair share" experience? What speakers have you tried to fit, specifically?
> 
> the '05-07 doors have the round door grill, somewhere about 3/8"-1/2" more speaker clearance & better brackets supporting the door panel.
> 
> ...


As you stated you adjusted the window track- without doing so or without extended door panel clips fitting something with more than 2.6" of backspacing is near impossible (relative to the amount of required "front spacing" not sure that is even close to a real term) 
While working in the industry I put anything from your run of the mill alpines/focal/diamonds what ever crap the particular shop I was working at carried/customer wanted... in addition, side work on my own and many friends subarus pushed me towards other mids ect... (I ran focal polyglass mids in my 02, my 03, my 04 and 05 wrx's since you asked and will probably do so if I get an 08/09 as well) Sorry if I am coming off like a smart ass... not my intentions at all... just trying to back what was said-

The point you missed is that he is dealing with 8's not 6.5's and that is where my comments stemmed from (maybe could have been a bit more clear though)... which admittedly from your own comment is true... you said to fit your 2.75" deep mids you had to move the window track (door modification) He will not fit an 8 that I know of behind the factory panel without mods...

I have done a lot of undocumented installs in subies too... these are cars that I owned/own
some of that subaru "experience" here:
































































End thread jack-


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

Some food for thought regarding flush mounting tweeters in the pillars of a WRX- you can typically heat the ABS without distorting the grain and warping the shape of the pillar and get a tweeter to sit flush, you can even play with slight angles too (obviously to to the point of the tweeter being on axis or anything)... this cuts down on a lot of work and you don't have to worry about matching materials or wrapping panels-


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

NotTheDavel said:


> Some food for thought regarding flush mounting tweeters in the pillars of a WRX- you can typically heat the ABS without distorting the grain and warping the shape of the pillar and get a tweeter to sit flush, you can even play with slight angles too (obviously to to the point of the tweeter being on axis or anything)... this cuts down on a lot of work and you don't have to worry about matching materials or wrapping panels-


I promise you won't flush mount these tweeters. They are very deep and wide. Aiming will also be an issue as there are no true flat spots on the panel.


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## Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX (Oct 24, 2007)

I've seen this install somewhere.... lol....


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX said:


> I've seen this install somewhere.... lol....


Nope completely different car. Move along!!!!!:surprised:


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## Echo42987 (Dec 25, 2008)

Can't wait to hear what you think of those Legatias!


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

Where are the midrange going to go? Great deal on that P9 combo. What amps are you going to be using? Looks great so far!


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## Echo42987 (Dec 25, 2008)

Niebur3 said:


> Where are the midrange going to go? Great deal on that P9 combo. What amps are you going to be using? Looks great so far!


I'm catching up


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Niebur3 said:


> Where are the midrange going to go? Great deal on that P9 combo. What amps are you going to be using? Looks great so far!


The midrange will be going into the kicks vented into the A-pillar. As far as amps go I will be using two JL Audio HD600/4's. One will be sending 150 watts to each tweeter and mid and the other will be bridged two channel sending 300 watts to each L8.



Echo42987 said:


> I'm catching up


Catching up to the build or your own build?


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## TEGBOY (May 4, 2008)

Looks great I love that tweeter build. Roughly what height from the dash are those tweeters? It appears to be level with the top of the instrument cluster?

I have an 05 Forester which basically has the same pillars, so I am looking for any advise with tweeter positioning.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

lol wonderful how this sorta turned into a pissing contest about installing lol

all i care about is:

1. what dyno is that

2. what whp tq did you put down?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

simplicityinsound said:


> lol wonderful how this sorta turned into a pissing contest about installing lol
> 
> all i care about is:
> 
> ...


I think a lot of things on this forum turn into pissing matches. Everyone always has a better way or wants to tell you your way won't work.

Anyhow. Mustang AWD Dyno. Put down 375HP and 325TQ. Before the sound deadening it ran a 11.9 @ 116MPH in the quarter mile. Its a little on the low side because my MAF is maxed out right now. I need a bigger one. I really wanted to get the audio done before she goes back on the dyno. I also wanted to get Methanol injection too so maybe next year she'll she the dyno again. Hoping for 450HP once that's done.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

that some very nice numbers  I thought about going to near that level but i know for one, i would need a built tranny, the 5eat in my just wont take that kind of power stock...

so end up with 310whp or so on the mustang wtih meth, automatic, if i had hte 5 speed it would be roughly 340whp or so.

but yeah, big believer in meth, this is how can run a relatively small turbo, have better than stock spool, and still do decent at the top end


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## dBassHz (Nov 2, 2005)

Yeah, fabrication is a must to run 8s. I have Peerless SLS 8s in my Forester doors (2.25" angled BB/HDPE spacer), which are similar if not the same as the impreza ones (2.75" Max depth). I'm on my second set of door panels, which I hope to finish soon...









1st try when I was running JL Audio 8IB4s...


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## reindeers (Mar 7, 2008)

Sub'd


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

*Update:* Finally got the floor deadening done. There is now one layer of Damplifier Pro on the entire floor as well as a layer of Luxury Liner Pro. Seems counter productive but the car is plenty fast anyhow. I imagine I have added around 150 pounds or so. I also got the roof done with a layer of Damplifier Pro. I will be adding Overkill to it as well once I go get my spray glue from work. All door panels will have one layer of Overkill as well as the rest of the plastic panels in the car. I have 90 sq ft of Overkill so that should be enough to go around.


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## blacksvtf03 (Feb 27, 2009)

Quick question about your tweeter install, Did HAT recommend that positioning for the tweeters? Crossfired? I want those same tweeters in my SVT, just looking for info on how people are mounting for the best staging/imaging.

Do you have a part number for the Duramix you used? Looks easier than FG. What are you wrapping them with?

Looks awesome so far! Great choice of quality equipment.


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

1slysti said:


> I promise you won't flush mount these tweeters. They are very deep and wide. Aiming will also be an issue as there are no true flat spots on the panel.



Don't make me prove you wrong- I do have pictures of like tweeters flushed into the same car- however very low in the pillar... Flushed like a champ with minimal effort, nothing was remotely distorted, imaging and staging was the best I have heard to date (center channel helped a bit)... - I never speak out my ass- In all seriousness- I am not here to argue **** just to help... good luck!


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## talibmohamid (Dec 5, 2008)

MAN THINGS LOOK REALLY NICE IN YOUR INSTALL......BET IT SOUNDS EVEN BETTER....NICE INSTALL WORK ALSO


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Double UP.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

*Update:* Tonight was spent mostly looking at the kicks and trying to find a way to keep as much of the factory style kick as possible. I drive this car everyday and don't want to be kicking the mid all the time. We aimed to not protrude on the dead pedal and it looks as if that's no problem. It is quite annoying though to have fuel lines run through one kick and brake lines through the other side. It makes getting the mid more flush impossible without modifying the lines (which I won't do). We could make it more flush without the grill but I really want to have a solid grill to protect the driver. On with the pics. I'll put explanations with whats important.

*Right Side Kick *









*Right Side Kick Different angle*









*Driver Side Kick*









*Driver Side Kick different angle*









*One more angle of Driver Side Kick*









*Rings with grills laid in. You'll notice the edges are rounded. We did that to allow a more natural contour into the factory panel once wrapped. We also left a slight edge so the glass won't protrude onto the face of the wood. It allows for a cleaner finished product.*









*Top of rings no grill*








*
Back of rings with 45 degree routed edge on inner and outer side. The outer edge was to allow us a little more room to sink the ring and the inner was to allow the backwave of the speaker to escape more effectively.*


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

blacksvtf03 said:


> Quick question about your tweeter install, Did HAT recommend that positioning for the tweeters? Crossfired? I want those same tweeters in my SVT, just looking for info on how people are mounting for the best staging/imaging.
> 
> Do you have a part number for the Duramix you used? Looks easier than FG. What are you wrapping them with?
> 
> Looks awesome so far! Great choice of quality equipment.


HAT told me that firing the tweeters off axis to me or on axis with each other would be fine. They are supposed to have great off axis response. I mounted them as high as they are because I wanted to get them higher than my instrument cluster to avoid reflections.

The material used was not Duramix it was SEM Problem Plastic. It is a better product than the Duramix because it won't cause chemical reactions once painted and also flows out better (self levels). We have used tons of Duramix before and anytime it gets primed and painted it almost always shows back through the paint just slightly. Sometimes you can only notice it at certain angles. No matter how much high build primer you use it always seemed to be a problem. The SEM should cure all of those problems.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

great progress....I kind of miss my '03 WRX.


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## blacksvtf03 (Feb 27, 2009)

1slysti said:


> HAT told me that firing the tweeters off axis to me or on axis with each other would be fine. They are supposed to have great off axis response. I mounted them as high as they are because I wanted to get them higher than my instrument cluster to avoid reflections.


I Talked to Scott at HAT yesterday after I saw this post. He tol me pretty much the same thing. My cluster and the contour of the dash is similar to yours so I will prolly install mine in a similar manner. What are you wrapping with?



1slysti said:


> The material used was not Duramix it was SEM Problem Plastic.


Thanks for the info!


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

1slysti said:


> Double UP.


 bluff called-

these are just TN 47's- They were replaced w/TN-52's, I have also put Diamond audio D9 tweets in the same spot as well as infinity perfect tweeters- 

Your install is looking great by the way, you do some quality work!


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

My post you quoted was saying I double posted and had nothing to do with calling your bluff. Hopefully my work will continue to impress. Wish I had more time to make more progress. I only get a few hours a week.


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## Badmunky (Mar 9, 2009)

Up dates? Its been a week sins you posted any thing.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Badmunky said:


> Up dates? Its been a week sins you posted any thing.


Sorry nothing yet. I will get some work done this week. Had some family in from out of town this past week. So time to get back to it.


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## SubNit (Nov 5, 2008)

So how has the SEM platic repair holding up? I gotta say it looks great

I'm going to be doing some fab work with my center console soon and was looking at using the Duramix stuff until I saw your post about the problems encountered with it.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

SubNit said:


> So how has the SEM platic repair holding up? I gotta say it looks great
> 
> I'm going to be doing some fab work with my center console soon and was looking at using the Duramix stuff until I saw your post about the problems encountered with it.


Problem plastic is awesome. Works very well. We used to use a ton of Duramix for dash building, monitor molding and various other projects. This is a permanent replacement for Duramix for us now.


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## Low_e_Red (Aug 23, 2008)

I noticed my Duraglas doing the same thing. It shows under certain angles. To fix this I used more layers of paint.

But is this problem plastic that worthwhile? Any differences other than that you have noticed? If its that worthwhile I might have to replace it.


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## WRX/Z28 (Feb 21, 2008)

Looking good man. Only thing that makes me nervous is the ultra high tweeter mount and it's seperation from the midrange driver. 

BTW, i've fit 6.5" speakers 2.9" deep with proper baffles, and door panel spacers.


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

Low_e_Red said:


> I noticed my Duraglas doing the same thing. It shows under certain angles. To fix this I used more layers of paint.
> 
> But is this problem plastic that worthwhile? Any differences other than that you have noticed? If its that worthwhile I might have to replace it.


Duraglas (fiberglass reinforced body filler) and Duramix (2 part epoxy for doing plastic repair) are 2 different things.

Jay


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## pieces (Dec 29, 2005)

Looking nice.
Doing my STI right now.

Couple of Q's if you don't mind. 
1) How did the floor sound deadening do for the noise reduction?
2) Which muffler is making for a good SQ build? I ended up w/ a Magnaflow plus an extra resonator (GR body). It sounds nice, but I still wonder once I get the stereo in if I will feel like it is too loud and conflicting with the stereo.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

JayinMI said:


> Duraglas (fiberglass reinforced body filler) and Duramix (2 part epoxy for doing plastic repair) are 2 different things.
> 
> Jay


He's right. You don't want to have Duraglass under paint. It would need to be finished with something like Icing and then primed/paint.



pieces said:


> Looking nice.
> Doing my STI right now.
> 
> Couple of Q's if you don't mind.
> ...


1)It worked very well. You can tell a pretty significant difference.

2) I have a Perrin Stealth Exhaust and its a little loud for this purpose. They have a sport version that may work better.

Check out this link for DB testing of exhausts. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=677926 That may help.


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## Badmunky (Mar 9, 2009)

^ What link? 404 link not found? LOL.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Badmunky said:


> ^ What link? 404 link not found? LOL.


The link is right there. I don't know why you can't see it. Must be an ID10T error. :laugh: Pay no attention to the fact that I edited that post though.


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## Bretfred (Dec 22, 2008)

Lookin real good man. Im jealous I love the sti. Almost bought one when i was gettin a new car went with an 05 cts instead.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Update: Finally got back to work on this project. I have had family in town and a bunch of other things that weren't letting me get to work. Tonights project was to glass both kicks so we can start aiming drivers and get a feel for how its going to look. Took about five hours including prep time to do this part.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

wow, those are going to be shallow pods! As you mentioned earlier, I dont think you'll have any problems with them sticking out. I there enough to allow flexibility for positioning? Also, Where are you going to have them point to? thnks


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## JayinMI (Oct 18, 2008)

gonna vent them into the kicks or anything? That's a tiny amount of airspace.
I like the plan tho...nice that they won't intrude on footspace hardly at all.

Jay


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

JayinMI said:


> gonna vent them into the kicks or anything? That's a tiny amount of airspace.
> I like the plan tho...nice that they won't intrude on footspace hardly at all.
> 
> Jay


They will be vented into the kick. There is a big hole right behind there. The magnet will sit in the hole slightly allowing me to keep it shallow.


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## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

If you were interested in sound quality, why would you crossfire the tweeters above the dash like that? 

Make sure to angle those midranges up, and the drivers side towards your left ear.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

pwnt by pat said:


> If you were interested in sound quality, why would you crossfire the tweeters above the dash like that?
> 
> Make sure to angle those midranges up, and the drivers side towards your left ear.


Everyone has an opinion!


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

He will have great staging with the tweets as he is doing it- I found that installing the tweets in WRX/STI's this way produces the best over all results- the only thing he may lack is a little detail. 


Looking good


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

NotTheDavel said:


> He will have great staging with the tweets as he is doing it- I found that installing the tweets in WRX/STI's this way produces the best over all results- the only thing he may lack is a little detail.
> 
> 
> Looking good


Thank you!!!!


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## Bob'O (Apr 8, 2009)

can't wait to see more!


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

pwnt by pat said:


> If you were interested in sound quality, why would you crossfire the tweeters above the dash like that?
> 
> Make sure to angle those midranges up, and the drivers side towards your left ear.


i assume you havent heard too many off axis tweeter installs thats done properly or tuned well? if so, you will know that they can certain sound very good. sometimes giving better depth, center focus and overall smoothness over full on axis set ups  it varies wildly from car to car, but again, I dont agree with the statement that off axis firing across equals "not interested in sound quality".

just based on my own personal experiences


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## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

Assuming makes an ass of you 

Crossfiring speakers is the same as cutting the effective mounting distance in half. considering stereo reproduction requires a 30 degree listening azimuth, it's obvious to see crossfiring is a step backwards. Center focus.... hah. If you listen carefully to a stereo that impliments crossfiring tweeters, you'll notice what you actually hear is mono 

Never mind the fact that it encourages dash, windshield, and gauge cluster reflections, causes frequency response discrepancies between sides, and causes premature top-end rolloff..

Basic acoustics and physics don't care what kind of listening environment you are in

Carry on with the build. So far the fab looks good.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

pwnt by pat said:


> Assuming makes an ass of you
> 
> Crossfiring speakers is the same as cutting the effective mounting distance in half. considering stereo reproduction requires a 30 degree listening azimuth, it's obvious to see crossfiring is a step backwards. Center focus.... hah. If you listen carefully to a stereo that impliments crossfiring tweeters, you'll notice what you actually hear is mono
> 
> ...


Basic acoustics will tell you that most of your imaging cues will be below 5,000hz. So since my tweeters will be crossed somewhere in the neighborhood of 8-10k I'm not too worried. I've done my homework. Your basis that I'll hear mono is completely unfounded based on that fact.


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## WRX/Z28 (Feb 21, 2008)

1slysti said:


> Basic acoustics will tell you that most of your imaging cues will be below 5,000hz. So since my tweeters will be crossed somewhere in the neighborhood of 8-10k I'm not too worried. I've done my homework. Your basis that I'll hear mono is completely unfounded based on that fact.



I'm not sure that I agree that most imaging cues are below 5k. At any rate, it's all personal preference. My $.02 is that I've never liked any car that had it's main tweeter mounted so high and reflecting off the windsheild. I've heard quite a few guys car's at the WRX meets around here, and I wouldn't do it in my own car. 

At the end of the day, if you like it, you have nothing to worry about. If you don't, it's not really all that hard to change positions. 

BTW, why are your tweets going to be crossed so high?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

WRX/Z28 said:


> I'm not sure that I agree that most imaging cues are below 5k. At any rate, it's all personal preference. My $.02 is that I've never liked any car that had it's main tweeter mounted so high and reflecting off the windsheild. I've heard quite a few guys car's at the WRX meets around here, and I wouldn't do it in my own car.
> 
> At the end of the day, if you like it, you have nothing to worry about. If you don't, it's not really all that hard to change positions.
> 
> BTW, why are your tweets going to be crossed so high?


The Hybrid Audio L4 is a speaker that plays a large spectrum of the frequency band very effectively. It will play from around 250hz to around 8000hz. That way vocal cues won't come from the tweeter for the most part. So localization won't be mixed between two different drivers that are far apart from each other. It will be more of a point source doing it this way.


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

pwnt by pat said:


> Assuming makes an ass of you
> 
> Crossfiring speakers is the same as cutting the effective mounting distance in half. considering stereo reproduction requires a 30 degree listening azimuth, it's obvious to see crossfiring is a step backwards. Center focus.... hah. If you listen carefully to a stereo that impliments crossfiring tweeters, you'll notice what you actually hear is mono
> 
> ...


so judging from your response, my original assumption that you have never heard a well installed and tuned off axis A pillar tweet set up seems to be 100 percent correct.

thanks for the validation. 

would it be nice of SQ was all about scoring points on a test regarding theoritical acoustical sound quality. in the end, i only care about if the end result sounds good or not, i could careless if it is theoritical ideal or not. but hey, thats where we differ right? 

again, not saying that off axis sounds better than on axis, but merely htat good results can be achieved with off axis and usually results in a smaller "boob" in your A pillar


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

pwnt by pat said:


> Basic acoustics and physics don't care what kind of listening environment you are in


this is one of the more interesting statments i have heard in a long time. In that it is in itself, contradictory.

lets see:

1. acoustics, loosely defined, is based on physics and can be affected by changes in physical parameters. correct?

2. listening environment, when applied to acoustics, is prolly one of the dominant aspects of the physics and physical restraints.

so in that essense, acoustics does indeed "care" about the physics and changes applied to its parameters, and of which, listening environment is a major contributor.

if what you say is true, then you are saying, the same exact system with the same exact tuning would sound exactly the same wehter youare in a room, or in a car, and like wise, whether you are in a dodge viper or vw beatle?

nice...

anyway, last from me on this thread


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## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

1slysti said:


> Basic acoustics will tell you that most of your imaging cues will be below 5,000hz. So since my tweeters will be crossed somewhere in the neighborhood of 8-10k I'm not too worried. I've done my homework. Your basis that I'll hear mono is completely unfounded based on that fact.


Staging /= Imaging

Imaging cues begin well below 5000hz.
Staging cues do not.

As for mono, considering the best you can achieve in a 2-seat side-by-side car is panned mono, I would say what I said is pretty spot on 



simplicityinsound said:


> would it be nice of SQ was all about scoring points on a test regarding theoritical acoustical sound quality. in the end, i only care about if the end result sounds good or not, i could careless if it is theoritical ideal or not. but hey, thats where we differ right?
> 
> again, not saying that off axis sounds better than on axis, but merely htat good results can be achieved with off axis and usually results in a smaller "boob" in your A pillar


Again, you don't have the slightest idea about what I have and have not heard.

Sounding good to us individually is, again, where it's at. But I'm not a man of magic. If you're going to claim SQ, you can't play ignorant to basic principles.

If you're trying to achieve "SQ" and a "boob" is what's required, and you're willing to compromise on that then what does that say about what you're trying to achieve? 



simplicityinsound said:


> this is one of the more interesting statments i have heard in a long time. In that it is in itself, contradictory.
> 
> lets see:
> 
> ...


Much like a square is a rectangle, a rectangle is not a square.

Twisting the words. What was said (or implied, if you will) was that the same rules apply to whatever room you are in. Acoustic principles don't change just because it's practiced in a car. 

Just keep cranking out them cookie cutter systems that rely on magic as opposed to trying something that isn't designed completely for looks and convenience.

again: fab looks good. Lets see more work :thumbup


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

haha okay fine this will be really my last post on this thread:

fine, i dont know what you have heard and what you have not, but you are the one coming off representing your opinion as "fact" and i am just saying what i hear and seen through experience.

so i guess 2-3 years is now plenty long enough to go from someone seeking advice on sq in general to becoming the steven hawking of acoustics and giving us iron hand rules on sq. congrats 

usually dont care i guess about these types of posts, maybe i am grumpy from a 105 degree day in the garage lol


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## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

Developing a basis on knowing what to test, how to test, and what to look for. How much of a degree is learned at a 4 year institution in the second two years once all the basics and "unnecessaries" are out of the way?

I never said I was a Steven Hawking of acoustics. I will be the first to admit there is a lot I don't know. But what I do know is that sound science trumps luck any day.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

My basis for the foundation of this setup was done with some extensive research and by talking to a world champion SQ competitor. Based on our discussion I am building the car this way. Let it also be known that some well respected people such as simplicityinsound among others also believe that this way works well. I have also researched vehicles that have won numerous SQ awards using tweeters on axis with each other. I am not flying by the seat of my pants and its time for you to leave this thread alone as you have nothing of worth to post here. I do appreciate your comments on how the build is progressing but I don't need discussion on my methods here. This is a build thread not a acoustic theory thread. Thank You!!!


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## AdamTaylor (Sep 7, 2008)

I  like  this  build  so  far 

 keep  it  up 



 seemed to be the thing to do, so i joined in on the fun


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

AdamTaylor said:


> I  like  this  build  so  far
> 
> keep  it  up
> 
> ...


Glad to have you!!!!!


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## Believe78 (Apr 24, 2009)

Very nice car. Can't wait to see the pics when it's complete.


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## It_Hertz (Mar 4, 2008)

Mike, Bing and anyone else reading this that has actually worked professionally in the business, built true SQ vehicles (not sat in class reading some damn book) please remember that not matter what these keyboard commandos think they know.... it is the experience of building MANY vehicles not 4 or 5 (or less) and having the ability to pick up a phone and call others of like mind to draw form their exp. that will prove to be the best for the finished build in the end.

Mike keep up the great work your build looks great and I am sure will have the sound quality and performance to match.


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

I cant wait to hear your impressions of the system when your done and its tuned.

Hey at least no one here is implying the fiber glass wont work. Yes I followed you here from NASIOC. I cant wait to see this finished.

R-


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

It_Hertz said:


> Mike, Bing and anyone else reading this that has actually worked professionally in the business, built true SQ vehicles (not sat in class reading some damn book) please remember that not matter what these keyboard commandos think they know.... it is the experience of building MANY vehicles not 4 or 5 (or less) and having the ability to pick up a phone and call others of like mind to draw form their exp. that will prove to be the best for the finished build in the end.
> 
> Mike keep up the great work your build looks great and I am sure will have the sound quality and performance to match.


Thanks Bryan. Its hard sometimes wanting to defend your position. I am really passionate about car audio and get heated when people spout off at the mouth thinking that one idea is the end all be all to a solution.



labcoat22 said:


> I cant wait to hear your impressions of the system when your done and its tuned.
> 
> Hey at least no one here is implying the fiber glass wont work. Yes I followed you here from NASIOC. I cant wait to see this finished.
> 
> R-


That is by far the funniest post!!!! That made me laugh....thanks.:laugh:


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

Well im glad you enjoyed that. NASIOC can be amusing sometimes. Anyway Im a fan of this install I cant wait to see it finnished.

R-


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Here is an update to the last pics....finished the tweeter pods and have the kicks pretty well underway. The kicks are filled with Marglass as to prevent any type of resonance and flexing. They weigh a few pounds each and are vented into the A frame. They are strong enough once mounted to pull the car with.


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## nickpapa (Oct 21, 2008)

looks awesome so far!


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

A pilers look fantastic.

R-


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## pieces (Dec 29, 2005)

Hmmm... I will sit on my hands now about taking my door panels off. these kicks of yours look fairly unobtrusive. I think I'll wait to see what they look like to consider my options. 

Very nice work on the A-pillars.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

labcoat22 said:


> A pilers look fantastic.
> 
> R-





pieces said:


> Hmmm... I will sit on my hands now about taking my door panels off. these kicks of yours look fairly unobtrusive. I think I'll wait to see what they look like to consider my options.
> 
> Very nice work on the A-pillars.


Thanks guys. We really wanted the pillars to remain fairly factory looking. I may still wrap them in the future but for now they stay as is. Hope to get the kicks finished up this week.


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

1slysti said:


> Thanks guys. We really wanted the pillars to remain fairly factory looking.


that is why I think they look so good, like they should be there.

R-


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Update from last nights work: We planned on finishing the kicks fabrication wise but that didn't quite happen. We after staring at them awhile realized the right side didn't really match the left as well as we'd hoped. So we pulled some more Marglass on the right side to get the shape more inline with the other side. They can't be the same because of the way the dead pedal sits but we wanted them to be close. The rings are in the right spots at least. We have a little more work to go but are 85% of the way there. Let me know if I am posting too many pics. I always see people asking for build pics so I figured I would over do it!


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

you should mold those and offer them to other 2003-2007 WRX owners. I knew I should have kept my '03!!


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## capnxtreme (Feb 5, 2008)

Wow, I love that you kept the dead pedal.


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

Kick look great I guess I expected them to be bigger but they don't look very intrusive at all. I would use them If i was doing a 3 way up front. Can't wait to see this finished.

R-


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## Bretfred (Dec 22, 2008)

Great work those look stock i like how u kept most the foot room. that's my biggest gripe about kicks i got big ass legs and move them a lot when driving


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

labcoat22 said:


> Kick look great I guess I expected them to be bigger but they don't look very intrusive at all. I would use them If i was doing a 3 way up front. Can't wait to see this finished.
> 
> R-


They are only a 4" mid driver so they don't need to be as big as a 6 1/2". Kicks don't always have to be huge to work out. My intended goal was great sound quality while retaining as much of the factory space as I could get. Some slight compromises will be made where necessary but not many. I wanted at least a portion of my dead pedal.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Another Update: Got a little finish work done today. If you look at the passenger side kick where it meets the factory panel you will notice before we sprayed it that it didn't follow the factory curve as well as it does now. Details man details. Did a black guide coat to check the sanding process. I forgot the grills at home so we couldn't finish them today. We need to put them in there to make sure they sit flush with the edge of the kicks. Put the speakers in there to get some form of accomplishment.


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

1slysti said:


> They are only a 4" mid driver so they don't need to be as big as a 6 1/2". Kicks don't always have to be huge to work out. My intended goal was great sound quality while retaining as much of the factory space as I could get. Some slight compromises will be made where necessary but not many. I wanted at least a portion of my dead pedal.


I had 5 1/4 kicks in my Toyota P'up and it was ok but I missed some of the space I had before them.

any way they look good and dont take up too much space its a win in my book.

R-


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

I still think you should make a mold and offer them for sale...they look THAT good and solid!


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

slvrtsunami said:


> I still think you should make a mold and offer them for sale...they look THAT good and solid!


Thanks for the compliment. Having been built so heavily with Marglass on the backside I think it would cause them to be very expensive and only work with a four or five inch driver. It really limits your clientele. Plus the folks at NASIOC don't much care for me anymore. I don't deal well with them having to have an opinion about everything I was doing. So much so that I stopped posting over there.


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

1slysti said:


> Thanks for the compliment. Having been built so heavily with Marglass on the backside I think it would cause them to be very expensive and only work with a four or five inch driver. It really limits your clientele. Plus the folks at NASIOC don't much care for me anymore. I don't deal well with them having to have an opinion about everything I was doing. So much so that I stopped posting over there.


 
Yeah, I can understand the opinions expressed over there. I usually stayed on clubwrx for the most part. I know there are other boards out there as well. Looking forward to the rest of the build.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Hopefully some more work will be done Thursday night.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Finally a little update: We go the 8's situated where we want them. Now its time to fill and build. We are going to do a little insert to kill what will be otherwise flat area on the rest of the lower door.


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

I'm at a similar spot in construction of my door panels now too. Looking forward to seeing how you guys tackle these.


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## Notloudenuf (Sep 14, 2008)

Great work. We have got to meet up sometime. What shop do you work at/have this being installed at?


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## AdamTaylor (Sep 7, 2008)

good work man


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## simplicityinsound (Feb 2, 2007)

did you fire them up yet? in my experience, 8s in small thin doors like our subbies, result in a lot of coloration int he 150-250 range, and when you kill those freq, the end result isnt much greater than a 6.5"  but thats my take hehe...

lookin good.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

simplicityinsound said:


> did you fire them up yet? in my experience, 8s in small thin doors like our subbies, result in a lot of coloration int he 150-250 range, and when you kill those freq, the end result isnt much greater than a 6.5"  but thats my take hehe...
> 
> lookin good.


There aren't any amps in the car right now so they aren't playing yet. Nor are they sealed against the door yet. We will find out though won't we.


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## kilokhan (Jun 5, 2009)

Nice Build Log


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Thanks. Glad to see I could be part of your first post.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Quick update: Finished laying out the insert for the lower door panel behind the 8. Wanted to make it look like we just didn't stick a 8 in there. Gave it some more interest.


























Have a lot more to do but its a good piece of work to get done for last night. We will be doing the insert in black suede and the gray on the doors in black suede as well.


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## rkb993 (Apr 10, 2009)

Nice work.


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## drake78 (May 27, 2007)

simplicityinsound said:


> did you fire them up yet? in my experience, 8s in small thin doors like our subbies, result in a lot of coloration int he 150-250 range, and when you kill those freq, the end result isnt much greater than a 6.5"  but thats my take hehe...
> 
> lookin good.



LOL....but does size really matter...when your listening to tunes :surprised:...buwahaha...:laugh:


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## Johnny-j5 (Jul 13, 2009)

Wow awesome work....i wish i had the DIY knowledge to do this to my 07sti.


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## tr0y_audi0 (Feb 13, 2007)

Nice work man, 
Im digging the doors, The tweeters are sick, great spot for them, 
Im sure the stage will be great, 
Waiting for more updates..
Keep up the great work!


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## del norte dodge (Jun 9, 2009)

Nice build,
This makes me miss my STI


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

updates?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Sorry guys my car was hit in my work parking lot. So its been in the body shop and has taken up a lot of my extra audio money. So the project is on a temporary hold. It was a hit and run so the deductible comes out of my pocket. I am taking advantage of the deal by getting the whole car painted as it really needed it anyhow.


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

Typical subie paint... rock chips galore! sorry about the news


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

Sorry to hear about the hit and run. I had an '03 and can relate to the paint issue. Maybe cover the front with a clear bra? 

Hope you get back to finishing the car soon.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Thanks guys I appreciate that!


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## Yoursogansta (Apr 6, 2009)

I like the way doors are turning out. Just make sure to protect those MDF rings from moisture REALLY REALLY WELL!


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## Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX (Oct 24, 2007)

I hope I wasn't one to help along your decision on not posting over on NASIOC??... I have a feeling I know who it could have been, though... 

I don't remember commenting much at least.. lol.. 

Ahh, the NASIOC mentality.. god, I hate it.. It's why I stay in the audio forum.. lol.. even there is can be a ***** though...

I'm diggin the 8" mounting idea... I may have to borrow the concept when I do my IDQ8's this fall... if that's ok... lol...


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## deodkid (Jan 1, 2009)

great job..


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Aaron'z 2.5RS/WRX said:


> I hope I wasn't one to help along your decision on not posting over on NASIOC??... I have a feeling I know who it could have been, though...
> 
> I don't remember commenting much at least.. lol..
> 
> ...


You had nothing to do with it. The idea behind posting for me isn't to try and bask in the praise that comes from people that see what we do as brilliant. It is however to show people what can be done with the car and my perspective on how to acheive my goals. If your goals are similar than use my ideas. So when you ask is it okay. Hell yeah its okay. Thats what its all about. It is never about being criticized because someone doesn't agree with you or your product selection. Too much of that happened over there to be worth the effort of posting.


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## sigma6 (Mar 28, 2006)

Very nice build! Props to you for the work, and overcoming the negativity on nabisco.


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## Badmunky (Mar 9, 2009)

So when do you think you will start working on the build again?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Badmunky said:


> So when do you think you will start working on the build again?


I'm really not sure. I may have the door panels done in the next two weeks. My awesome installer moved to Charlotte so he is working on them some there and may come to Raleigh next week and stay over to help me finish them and get them vinyl wrapped. For right now I had to hold off on the amplifiers so I'm not sure when this will really get moving again.

The wreck hurt my audio money pretty good. But I do have a freshly painted car now so thats a plus.


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Alright Ladies and Gentlemen here is some progress......The door panels are done as far as fabrication is concerned. We just have to vinyl wrap the new section and re wrap the light gray areas in black suede as well as the insert behind the L8. Hopefully I get to that in the next week or so. So onto the pics.


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

Good to see you are making some progress.

R-


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

hello?


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## lucas569 (Apr 17, 2007)

nice build


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## slvrtsunami (Apr 18, 2008)

Hmmm, I wonder what happened to the progress. I hope he didnt crash the car!!


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

Some one hit him and that slowed him down. 

R-


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## Hextall 27 (Jan 20, 2010)

This guy ever get done with his project? Awesome build so far!!!


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

Any updates?

Ry-


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## TXwrxWagon (Sep 26, 2008)

STi SQ Build pictures by FocusdSound - Photobucket

that's the last of what was posted in his photobucket

Rob


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## jonnyanalog (Nov 14, 2007)

I think I remember reading over on BuwaldaHybrids the car got wrecked and he was repainting the whole thing. Thats where the progress stopped there too. It was a clean build too...


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## labcoat22 (Mar 29, 2009)

Yea I heard that too but that was months ago.

R-


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Tada!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Hextall 27 (Jan 20, 2010)

Looks Damn good super clean and stealthy!!


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

Looks awesome! Glad you were able to get this finished! Top notch-


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## Notloudenuf (Sep 14, 2008)

You have GOT to make it to the next NC G2G.
Great work!


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## TEGBOY (May 4, 2008)

That is simply awesome. Love it, would love to see some more build pics. Gives me some ideas for my STi Forester


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Dug this out from the grave.......I miss this car....that is all =(


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

So did you replace it with another Subaru ?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Coppertone said:


> So did you replace it with another Subaru ?


I just got back in the industry part time.....Have been gone for a good 7 years. My buddy finally opened a store front and carries lines like Sinfoni and Hybrid Audio. So now I am bringing myself back up to speed. I do have an 05 Forester, but it is as boring as they come. I do have the itch though lol.


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

That's wild as I have a nib set of Sinfoni sitting in my car audio room. I'll pm you for your buddy's shop info if you do not mind.


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## Mic10is (Aug 20, 2007)

that looks really nice. what happened to all the build pics?


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## 1slysti (Jan 31, 2009)

Mic10is said:


> that looks really nice. what happened to all the build pics?


Here are all the build pics I have all together.

STi SQ Build Slideshow by FocusdSound | Photobucket


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