# horn tuning: able to localize the right horn



## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

i got my horns mounted the other day and stereo playing. they're ID minis with selenium d220ti drivers. they're mounted right at the bottom of the dash with the driver being right next to the kick panel metal. the limiting factor of putting the drivers back further is the hvac blower motor. screws are countersunk now but not in the pictures.



















anyway.. in this car and any other car i've had horns in, i've been able to localize the passenger side horn. my ears are drawn to it. is this part of the crossfiring function of the mini horns? any way i can avoid this?

i've got them crossed over at 1500hz/24db. changing phase on the driver doesn't impact the effect (or image). reticulated foam or not, the effect is the same.

suggestions? thanks!


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## Eric Stevens (Dec 29, 2007)

Can you post a picture showing the console please.

Eric


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

i took some shots tonight after work. it's dark here in detroit so i had to get out the flash. nikon's creative lighting system is awesome. 

car is a vw mk6 golf (2010-13). images are links to high-res. pardon the mess.


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

As said in the other thread, play with your polarity first, then level everything (your horns shouldn't be too loud or even with the best Xover+T/A setting, your attention will be drawn towards the horn) - last but not least, use T/A. 
Play with your T/A as much as you can to bring your mids into phase with the horn - play a nice spoken track that will help you bring the sound up on the dash. 

I had that same problem and T/A do work wonders 

Kelvin


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## Eric Stevens (Dec 29, 2007)

Get yourself a large bath towel and drape it over the console and try to keep it thick on the sides to absorb any direct sound from the horns. Or use some 1" thick open cell foam instead.

Re-listen and see what you get. 

If you have followed proper set up and tuning procedures in order: levels, XO, Phase, delays then EQ you should not localize to the drivers unless there is a bad reflection going on.

Maybe it isn't even the passenger side causing the problem, a reflection off the console from the drivers side horn can almost sound like another driver playing there. 

Eric


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## Mic10is (Aug 20, 2007)

Could just be an amplitude problem as well. Unless the amp has independent gains there is a good chance that it is not equal left to right. I've seen amps several volts in difference between sides.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

thanks. i did level tests last night before bed and noticed that the left channel was 3-6db lower across the line. this morning, i adjusted the dsp's input levels since it appeared across the whole range. things are better now. also retuned each side. i bumped the xover point from 1500/24 to 2500/24 and adjusted the tune.

localizing the horn is mostly gone. i'll play with the T/A some more to see if i can get it to go completely.

thanks everyone!


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## minbari (Mar 3, 2011)

if you like how it sounds, then you are good to go. but half the point of using HLCDs is that you can get the xover down to 1000-1200hz. or am I off base here?


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

minbari said:


> if you like how it sounds, then you are good to go. but half the point of using HLCDs is that you can get the xover down to 1000-1200hz. or am I off base here?


a nice part about pc-driven DSPs is that you can save off configs and try many different options before settling one something. 

that said, i play, i learn, i try, i listen, read some more, try other stuff, and find something that works.


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## minbari (Mar 3, 2011)

very true 

and you might discover where the reflections, ect are.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

for the past couple weeks, i've had the idq62s crossed over at 80hz/24db to 2500hz/12db and the horns at 5500hz/6db. sub is playing 80hz/24db and down. horns are 20db and 26db down from the midbasses. i've got the DSP's driver path lengths set and eq'd; no other T/A was done. i left the reticulated foam out for now, i might play with it again when this semester settles in.

localizing the right horn has gone away, center image is pretty good, stage width is at least pillar to pillar and depth is about to the bottom of the windshield. stage height is from chest height to the mirror.

it's about as good as it'll get until i get someone more experienced to listen and tune, or i learn more myself. 

thanks everyone for the tips and help!


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

nadams5755 said:


> for the past couple weeks, i've had the idq62s crossed over at 80hz/24db to 2500hz/12db and the horns at 5500hz/6db. sub is playing 80hz/24db and down. horns are 20db and 26db down from the midbasses. i've got the DSP's driver path lengths set and eq'd; no other T/A was done. i left the reticulated foam out for now, i might play with it again when this semester settles in.
> 
> localizing the right horn has gone away, center image is pretty good, stage width is at least pillar to pillar and depth is about to the bottom of the windshield. stage height is from chest height to the mirror.
> 
> ...


Midbass LP is a bit high IMO but other than that, I'm sure it sounds great  
Don't remember which processor you were using... One thing your could try is to EQ L/R separately so that loudness of one side is close to the other side - that will help in centering your image. 

Kelvin


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

i tried pushing the midbass LP down to 1500-2000hz at various slopes (and re-leveled, then re-eq'd) and the midrange felt negatively impacted. i did the same with the horn HP xover too.

i'm using an audison bit-ten. i did adjust levels and eq for each channel separately though


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