# NEW Morel Elate Carbon Alto - Any thoughts or experience?



## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

It looks like a slightly smaller Piccolo... Does anyone have any experience with these?

From CF:
*The best of the best*
Morel enhanced their Elate Carbon Series with the most effective technology from their flagship Supremo Piccolo tweeters. In addition to the Supremo Piccolo's cavity-back design, you'll find other famous Morel elements in play like a Hexatech aluminum voice coil, which promotes lightning-quick response. Morel enhances the performance of the 1.1" silk dome tweeter with a coating of Acuflex™ compound, which helps damping for a natural sound. By cancelling break-up that can happen at high-frequencies, this special tweeter can soar with a frequency response that reaches up to 25,000 Hz.

*Mighty power-handling*
Morel allows for a very low crossover point with the Elate Carbon Alto tweeter, which means it can achieve powerfully realistic performance and a highly accurate soundstage with even the most complex music. With power handling up to 220 watts RMS, you'll hear awesome detail at any volume.

*Product highlights:*

1.1" Acuflex coated silk soft dome tweeter (pair)
flush-mount hardware included
handles up to 220 watts RMS (1000 watts peak power)
frequency response: 1,400-25,000 Hz
impedance: 6 ohms
sensitivity: 91 dB at 2.83 V
flush-mount depth: 1-3/16"
cutout diameter: 2-1/8"
warranty: 1 year









Morel Elate Carbon Alto


Elate Carbon Series 1.1" tweeters




www.crutchfield.com


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## MythosDreamLab (Nov 28, 2020)

I considered these they "seem" very nice, saw them on Crutchfield, never heard them and went Thesis tweeters instead...


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## K-pop sucks (May 28, 2018)

It aint no Esotar


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## ocuriel (Oct 7, 2005)

I’ve auduitioned a few Morel tweeters lately and Morel seem to check every box for me. I have not heard these though. I am curious as well.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

I believe I tuned a car with those or maybe it was the Supremo Piccolo tweeters and I was very impressed with them.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

I admit, I am tempted...


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Yep, It was the Supremo Piccolo tweeters I tuned and they were fantastic.


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

They are probably excellent tweeters, but really below $100 less expensive then the Piccolo which are tried and true. Why not just go with the Piccolo;s ?


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

I have not heard any reviews yet, but I do believe these are supposed to be one step down from the supremo piccolo. I know the woofer is a overhung design like the titanium, while the supremo woofer is a underhung... these I believe are an updated verison of the elate titanium if I'm not mistaken... I like the rear chamber.. I bet they do play down low!


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

seafish said:


> They are probably excellent tweeters, but really below $100 less expensive then the Piccolo which are tried and true. Why not just go with the Piccolo;s ?


They wouldn't match my mid ranges, CDM880, because the Piccolo grill is different. My tweeters and mids will soon be on the dash in pods and I couldn't live with non-matching. OCD


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> They wouldn't match my mid ranges, CDM880, because the Piccolo grill is different. My tweeters and mids will soon be on the dash in pods and I couldn't live with non-matching. OCD


Are you going to try the new Carbon mid? Im pumped to hear reviews on that, Im so tired of Morel and their Domes, Nothing wrong with the domes.. but an actual cone is super nice to see from morel so there is at least that option for a midrange


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> Are you going to try the new Carbon mid? Im pumped to hear reviews on that, Im so tired of Morel and their Domes, Nothing wrong with the domes.. but an actual cone is super nice to see from morel!


I do admit, it's in my Crutchfield cart with the Alto tweeters...


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> I do admit, it's in my Crutchfield cart with the Alto tweeters...


LOLL - Well they sure look like they can hold their own against some other mids. 2.1" voice coil, 10mm voice coil height so similar voice coil overhang as the GB25, but more cone area. Ive never personally heard the morel carbon mids, but these use the same Roacell foam sandwiched inbetween the carbon which is similar to how Focal makes their top of the line stuff, with foam sandwiched in the middle for damping... You could always send them back if they suck, Crutchfield is great about that...


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> LOLL - Well they sure look like they can hold their own against some other mids. 2.1" voice coil, 10mm voice coil height so similar voice coil overhang as the GB25, but more cone area. Ive never personally heard the morel carbon mids, but these use the same Roacell foam sandwiched inbetween the carbon which is similar to how Focal makes their top of the line stuff, with foam sandwiched in the middle for damping... You could always send them back if they suck, Crutchfield is great about that...


Yep. I can get them cheaper than Crutchfield from my local dealer, but he doesn't like returns and I respect that...


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

These tweeters are pretty big, I am having a hard time deciding if it's worth it to try and make them fit. I might just grab the Elate Carbon MM3s and retire my CDM880s, but leave the tweeters alone (I have the MT350s). I am gonna start doing some custom work on my dash in regards to tweeters and mids, and I don't want to do all the work only to decide I want to swap gear again...


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> These tweeters are pretty big, I am having a hard time deciding if it's worth it to try and make them fit. I might just grab the Elate Carbon MM3s and retire my CDM880s, but leave the tweeters alone (I have the MT350s). I am gonna start doing some custom work on my dash in regards to tweeters and mids, and I don't want to do all the work only to decide I want to swap gear again...


Those MT 350's are quite a bit smaller. You can always set them on the dash before making the mounts, and see how they sound..


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> Those MT 350's are quite a bit smaller. You can always set them on the dash before making the mounts, and see how they sound..


True. If I bought them from CF they'd be returnable... The MT350s are tiny (both depth and diameter) and that's part of the reason I went with them. If I am planning on putting both mid and tweeter on the little tiny, shallow Jeep dash, I need to be careful with dimensions.
I'm sure they sound amazing...


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> True. If I bought them from CF they'd be returnable... The MT350s are tiny (both depth and diameter) and that's part of the reason I went with them. If I am planning on putting both mid and tweeter on the little tiny, shallow Jeep dash, I need to be careful with dimensions.
> I'm sure they sound amazing...


I've found when using a midrange my tweeter is not so important depending if the mids are on axis or not. My mids can play up to 5 or 6k before my tweets take over, so the tweeter is just catching the stuff above that. I would love to play them lower but I'm just running 1" GB10's and i like to not stress them even though they can go down to 2.5-3k - Are youre mids on or off axis? I will tell you one thing for sure, that carbon mid will play significantly lower than the morel Dome... But I have not seen any frequency response graphs on it yet.. I wonder how high it plays....


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

I have great faith in morel and their mids for one main reason.. I'm running Morel CCWR254 "wide band" mids as dedicated midrange speakers and they are smooth, yet very detailed... I just wish they could play louder as they start to distort at lower volumes than I would like, I can only play then down to 500hz @ 24/db without stressing them


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> I've found when using a midrange my tweeter is not so important depending if the mids are on axis or not. My mids can play up to 5 or 6k before my tweets take over, so the tweeter is just catching the stuff above that. I would love to play them lower but I'm just running 1" GB10's and i like to not stress them even though they can go down to 2.5-3k - Are youre mids on or off axis? I will tell you one thing for sure, that carbon mid will play significantly lower than the morel Dome... But I have not seen any frequency response graphs on it yet.. I wonder how high it plays....


Agreed. That's why I am thinking, that if I make any change or "upgrades", money and time would be better spent on the midrange, than the tweeter. Considering I already have a great tweeter, and I'd consider my midrange to be the weakest link in my system, maybe that should help me make my decision. Though I am really tempted to at least TRY and make both upgrades fit. Decisions...


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> I have great faith in morel and their mids for one main reason.. I'm running Morel CCWR254 "wide band" mids as dedicated midrange speakers and they are smooth, yet very detailed... I just wish they could play louder as they start to distort at lower volumes than I would like, I can only play then down to 500hz @ 24/db without stressing them


I, too, love Morel's and how they sound and perform. This is my second go around with Elates and I have never been less than extremely happy with them. The fact that they are made in Israel and not China also makes me happy!


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> I, too, love Morel's and how they sound and perform. This is my second go around with Elates and I have never been less than extremely happy with them. The fact that they are made in Israel and not China also makes me happy!


Morels definitely have a certain sonic signature to them - I agree that the largest improvement would be made in the midrange on your setup, but looking at the MT350 compared to the Carbon Alto, The Alto has a rear chamber which is really a game changer in my opinion, that is what seprates a simple dome from a big tweeter, like the most popular Scan designs, they all have a damped rear chamber - if I can find the space, I will definately be upgrading my tweeters to a design with a rear chmaber like the morels or a Scan - I like the sound of the rear chamber designs compared to a sealed back. You can generally play them lower and the sound just sounds more open or natural in my opinion.. I know some disagree if the tweeter is crossed high enough.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

The diameter difference between the Alto and the Mt350, is about an inch and the depth about .75". Pretty significant. 

Alto
diameter 2.6" x depth 1.25"
vs.
Mt350
diameter 1.6" x depth .52"


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> The diameter difference between the Alto and the Mt350, is about an inch and the depth about .75". Pretty significant.
> 
> Alto
> diameter 2.6" x depth 1.25"
> ...


Whew, big difference. Maybe cut some pieces of cardboard to size and see if they look feasible to fit where you want them?


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> Whew, big difference. Maybe cut some pieces of cardboard to size and see if they look feasible to fit where you want them?


Yep, I'll do that... Big difference, for sure..


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## Anu2g (Nov 4, 2020)

Hey David, not sure if this helps you, but as you know, I started tuning my system using your crossover points, which had the mid HPed at 600Hz. I started lowering the mid HP, and the lower I got, the higher the sound stage rose, which makes sense since our mids are in the dash.

I ended up with mine set to 300Hz, using my ears...no measuring yet, so it might get tweaked once Ryan digs in. But he was suggesting that 300ish would be good, since my mid is a cone, as opposed to a dome.

I thought maybe this info would be helpful given that we have the same car, and you are contemplating switching to a cone mid.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Anu2g said:


> Hey David, not sure if this helps you, but as you know, I started tuning my system using your crossover points, which had the mid HPed at 600Hz. I started lowering the mid HP, and the lower I got, the higher the sound stage rose, which makes sense since our mids are in the dash.
> 
> I ended up with mine set to 300Hz, using my ears...no measuring yet, so it might get tweaked once Ryan digs in. But he was suggesting that 300ish would be good, since my mid is a cone, as opposed to a dome.
> 
> I thought maybe this info would be helpful given that we have the same car, and you are contemplating switching to a cone mid.



Very good info, thanks! My stage height right now is really good, no complaints there, but I am interested in seeing what differences in sound I can get with an upgrade to the tweeters and mids (or at least the mids) AND getting them closer to on access...


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## Anu2g (Nov 4, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> Very good info, thanks! My stage height right now is really good, no complaints there, but I am interested in seeing what differences in sound I can get with an upgrade to the tweeters and mids (or at least the mids) AND getting them closer to on access...


Yea, makes sense. Also keep in mind I haven't fully tuned or ran Dirac, so take my exp w a grain of salt


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

That larger Morel tweeter would be a noticeable upgrade in a two way system but in a three way I’m not sure it’s going to give you the difference you are looking for. I’d seriously look at the midrange first. The midrange, and even midbass is where most of the musical and vocal information comes from so I think those are extremely important. 

You can always try different midranges and tweeters in makeshift enclosures and tune with them before you commit to a more permanent custom final product.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

JCsAudio said:


> That larger Morel tweeter would be a noticeable upgrade in a two way system but in a three way I’m not sure it’s going to give you the difference you are looking for.* I’d seriously look at the midrange first. *The midrange, and even midbass is where most of the musical and vocal information comes from so I think those are extremely important.
> 
> You can always try different midranges and tweeters in makeshift enclosures and tune with them before you commit to a more permanent custom final product.


I have been leaning towards just that... That big tweeter would be difficult to make fit, and like you said, the difference may not be worth the cost and labor.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Work on the tuning aspect of this whole thing David. You will get more from that than any other single component change, especially a tweeter change so long as the one you have was used within it’s design limits and is low enough distortion.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

JCsAudio said:


> Work on the tuning aspect of this whole thing David. You will get more from that than any other single component change, especially a tweeter change so long as the one you have was used within it’s design limits and is low enough distortion.


Well, as you know, I don't have a hand in that anymore... It's Ryan and Dirac! Lol

It's one of those things where I don't want to do the work and not spend the money, only to want to swap out one of the components again. Just like I am doing with my subwoofer comparison, I want to have the best sound I can get/fit according to my taste. My mids are the weakest component, imo. My tweeters are not, as they are excellent. My interest in the Altos is because they are the latest (and maybe greatest, lol). 

It's not that anything is wrong with my current system, it sounds amazing! You know how this hobby/addiction works...


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## daloudin (Nov 2, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> These tweeters are pretty big, I am having a hard time deciding if it's worth it to try and make them fit. I might just grab the Elate Carbon MM3s and retire my CDM880s, but leave the tweeters alone (I have the MT350s). I am gonna start doing some custom work on my dash in regards to tweeters and mids, and I don't want to do all the work only to decide I want to swap gear again...


LMK if you decide to sell the CDM880s. I'm biding my time waiting for any of the Morel CDM600/700/88/880 to come up used. 

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

daloudin said:


> LMK if you decide to sell the CDM880s. I'm biding my time waiting for any of the Morel CDM600/700/88/880 to come up used.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


Quick, that's your queue David, get the carbon mids, sell your CDM's and tell us how they sound!! 

...LOLL, JK, I mean someone has to be the guy that tests them first... It is definitely taking a risk buying something before there is any feedback on them. I'm sure someone will chime in that has tried them soon.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> Quick, that's your queue David, get the carbon mids, sell your CDM's and tell us how they sound!!
> 
> ...LOLL, JK, I mean someone has to be the guy that tests them first... It is definitely taking a risk buying something before there is any feedback on them. I'm sure someone will chime in that has tried them soon.



Haha! I guess if I needed a sign, huh?!


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## Patriot83 (May 10, 2017)

I vote to get the alto tweeter and tell us what you think. Morel is a solid brand and the fact that the elate carbon alto tweeter is 2.5x higher than the mt350's should be a pretty serious upgrade.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

Patriot83 said:


> I vote to get the alto tweeter and tell us what you think. Morel is a solid brand and the fact that the elate carbon alto tweeter is 2.5x higher than the mt350's should be a pretty serious upgrade.


I agree... I'm still gonna try and see if I can make it work. 

I could put the mids in the vents!


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## Anu2g (Nov 4, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> I agree... I'm still gonna try and see if I can make it work.
> 
> I could put the mids in the vents!
> 
> ...


Go with the nautilus approach.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> I agree... I'm still gonna try and see if I can make it work.
> 
> I could put the mids in the vents!
> 
> ...


cut out them air vents and pop ‘em in there. You still got the center vents, perfect fit!!

-edit. LOL just realized that’s exactly what you said!! Looks meant to be!


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> cut out them air vents and pop ‘em in there. You still got the center vents, perfect fit!!
> 
> -edit. LOL just realized that’s exactly what you said!! Looks meant to be!


I rarely use the dash vents, I prefer the defrost and floor vents anyways... I'll get some measurements and see if that's an option.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> I rarely use the dash vents, I prefer the defrost and floor vents anyways... I'll get some measurements and see if that's an option.


It may sound crazy... but on my vehicle when I modify say the a pillars I buy a replacement OEM one and modify them... so you could theoretically mount it inside there and be able to pop a replacement vent back in there if you ever get rid of the vehicle. But it’s still kind of crazy LOL


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

NOT crazy at all...I am contemplating the same location for mids when I redo my 2005 Jeep Liberty CRD. And then tuck a tiny tweeter like the Gladen Aerospce 20 into the corner of the pillar/dash/windshield.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

I put my GB25 in semi sealed pods inside the round holes where the two outer dash vents were in my F-150 XL work truck. Fits really nice actually and sounds amazing and since it’s a work truck I wast all that picky about it. The two inner vents do the job so it works well and when I sell the truck I can just pop the speakers out and and pop the vents back in and its back to OEM. I think from a sound good/location perspective this location is ideal and the tweeter is right above it in the A pillar so even better.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

JCsAudio said:


> I put my GB25 in semi sealed pods inside the round holes where the two outer dash vents were in my F-150 XL work truck. Fits really nice actually and sounds amazing and since it’s a work truck I wast all that picky about it. The two inner vents do the job so it works well and when I sell the truck I can just pop the speakers out and and pop the vents back in and its back to OEM. I think from a sound good/location perspective this location is ideal and the tweeter is right above it in the A pillar so even better.


Interesting! 
In the Jeep, that ^^^ set up would actually stack the drivers sorta like bookshelf speakers, because the midbass is below the tweeter aiming the same as the vent... It also puts the drivers about as close together as you could possibly get in a car.


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

Well it is still arguably my best sounding vehicle I have, yet it has the cheapest amps, midbass drivers, and subwoofer. I think the vehicle driver locations, coupled with a solid tune, and good vehicle acoustics play a big part. It has the widest sound stage but it’s also my widest vehicle so the drivers are further apart from each other left to right. I still love listening to this system every day on my post CCP virus 53-minute traffic free commute now. That commute used to take me up to two hours before. I still flirt with upgrading the Twk88 and Pioneer 4-ch and Mosconi 2-ch amps to a single 6-channel amp, or Vxi600/6i solution but with the economy headed down, I might wait. 

If you do try those locations David, make sure you seal around the sides and back of the midrange so the back wave of the driver does leak and meet the front. I didn’t do that at first and it reeked havoc with my tune.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

JCsAudio said:


> Well it is still arguably my best sounding vehicle I have, yet it has the cheapest amps, midbass drivers, and subwoofer. I think the vehicle driver locations, coupled with a solid tune, and good vehicle acoustics play a big part. It has the widest sound stage but it’s also my widest vehicle so the drivers are further apart from each other left to right. I still love listening to this system every day on my post CCP virus 53-minute traffic free commute now. That commute used to take me up to two hours before. I still flirt with upgrading the Twk88 and Pioneer 4-ch and Mosconi 2-ch amps to a single 6-channel amp, or Vxi600/6i solution but with the economy headed down, I might wait.
> 
> If you do try those locations David, make sure you seal around the sides and back of the midrange so the back wave of the driver does leak and meet the front. I didn’t do that at first and it reeked havoc with my tune.


Cool... Any pics you care to share of the mids in the dash?


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## JCsAudio (Jun 16, 2014)

DavidRam said:


> Cool... Any pics you care to share of the mids in the dash?


Yes, that is snow and no it’s not pretty but it is a work truck so it’s all about the SQ and not the bling.


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

JCsAudio said:


> Yes, that is snow and no it’s not pretty but it is a work truck so it’s all about the SQ and not the bling.
> View attachment 289970
> 
> View attachment 289971



That is on point!!! When its cold outside im always on defrost mode anyways. Im so used to heating on defrost i actually feel out of place when the air is blowing forward so I actually like this setup youve got! nice!


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

JCsAudio said:


> Yes, that is snow and no it’s not pretty but it is a work truck so it’s all about the SQ and not the bling.
> View attachment 289970
> 
> View attachment 289971


Wow, that looks really good!!!


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## Huckleberry Sound (Jan 17, 2009)

Thump!


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## ATXcyclist (Sep 19, 2020)

Not sure if you have seen this YouTube review of a preproduction Morel MM3 paired with a large format Morel tweeter and 9" Midbass. He absolutely loves them compared to his previous competition setup with Dyn's.


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

*Unbelievably, the Carbon MM3 mids are 3 5/16" in diameter, and my vents are just under 3 3/8"! Lol*


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> *Unbelievably, the Carbon MM3 mids are 3 5/16" in diameter, and my vents are just under 3 3/8"! Lol*



Like it was meant to be


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## RyuTsuiSen (Jan 26, 2018)

Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

cman said:


> Like it was meant to be


Nuts, huh?! If it was slightly smaller than the mid, that would have sucked, if it was bigger that would have meant making a baffle of some sorts. As it is, it could just slip right in!


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

DavidRam said:


> Nuts, huh?! If it was slightly smaller than the mid, that would have sucked, if it was bigger that would have meant making a baffle of some sorts. As it is, it could just slip right in!


Exactly!!


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## ocuriel (Oct 7, 2005)

DavidRam said:


> *Unbelievably, the Carbon MM3 mids are 3 5/16" in diameter, and my vents are just under 3 3/8"! Lol*


That’s the cutout diameter


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

DavidRam said:


> *Unbelievably, the Carbon MM3 mids are 3 5/16" in diameter, and my vents are just under 3 3/8"! Lol*


Ive got a roll of electrical tape that I can sell you cheap !!! LOL


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

ocuriel said:


> That’s the cutout diameter


Oops! You are right... Hmmmm, that might not work. The total dia is 3.9".


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

Ummmm talking about meant to be... how about 3 & 5/15”? (typo on purpose)


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## seafish (Aug 1, 2012)

DavidRam said:


> Oops! You are right... Hmmmm, that might not work. The total dia is 3.9".


Ive got a 4" hole saw that I can lend you !!!


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

seafish said:


> Ive got a 4" hole saw that I can lend you !!!


/\ What he said /\


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## DavidRam (Nov 2, 2014)

seafish said:


> Ive got a 4" hole saw that I can lend you !!!


I only have 3,500 miles on this Jeep. I don't use 4" hole saws on the dash until they reach 5,000 miles...


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## ShawnP (Oct 16, 2021)

K-pop sucks said:


> It aint no Esotar


Have you heard the Alto?
I know a guy that swapped esostar for the alto and saw an improvement. The judges apparently agreed.
Curious about your experience


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