# Best subwoofer for low budget? (sq)



## Hatfield (Jul 21, 2012)

Looking for a the best bang for the buck sub to go in the front of my truck. Mostly Rock, some hip hop and instrumental. 

Which lower budget subs are the biggest bargain? Less than 125.


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## jriggs (Jun 14, 2011)

Take look at the alpine type r 8" and the dayton ho 10".


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## qwertydude (Dec 22, 2008)

The Power Acoustik Mofo 12" is a definite powerhouse especially for the money. It can be had for about $125.

For very good SQ the Infinity 120.9W has very good sound quality.

The best recommendation I can make is definitely the JBL P1224 but they're are pretty rare but I did get mine for $130 on closeout. Definitely the best bang for the buck if you can find them cheap. But the GTO1214D is probably equal in performance to the Infinity 120.9W and can be had for $120.


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## Danometal (Nov 16, 2009)

The Alpine and the Dayton will suffer from low sensitivity. A powerful amp will be necessary for either of those. With lower power, like 300-400 watts, JBL GTO series are cheap and just great subwoofers with good sensitivity specs. If my JBL Power sub ever dies, I plan to run a pair of GTO 12s in a low tuned ported box.


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## negativegain (Oct 6, 2009)

this, i used one until recently. sounds quite good.
JBL GTO1514 15" Die-Cast Subwoofer with Single-ohm Voice Coil | eBay


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## Wy2quiet (Jun 29, 2010)

I third JBL's. Cannot go wrong with high efficiency moderate (for the price) excursion subs. They fall a little flat in low end reproduction due to the law I am forgetting to mention (efficiency vs response) however they are very good subs for the money.


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## Danometal (Nov 16, 2009)

Wy2quiet said:


> I third JBL's. Cannot go wrong with high efficiency moderate (for the price) excursion subs. They fall a little flat in low end reproduction due to the law I am forgetting to mention (efficiency vs response) however they are very good subs for the money.


You may be thinking of Hoffman's Iron Law (sp?). I do have to respectfully disagree with the suggestion that JBL subs lack in the low end. The Power series is the only series I've heard in person (I own a P1224). It absolutely punishes the lows like I've never heard from any other subwoofer. We're talking ZERO in car roll off down to below 20 hz in a big ported box tuned to 25 hz. 

I've had a few subs, but none compare to the JBL in coming close to breaking Hoffman's Iron Law. Well, it is in a big box @ 2.5 net cubes, but still..


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## Treesive (Aug 29, 2011)

Agreed. Jbl makes some of the best bang for buck SQL subs.

Sent from BFI


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## Mooresound (Jan 17, 2012)

A set of GTO804's can be had cheap via amazon and would sound pretty good tuned low..... i put a piar in my truck under the back seat on 300 watts sealed... pretty good response for 8's// but lacking in the low end... Porting would fix that though..

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FHAXPA/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00

a pair can be had <100. Three would be better @1.38 ohms or so... on a cheap audipipe 1000 watter.


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## Mooresound (Jan 17, 2012)

800 watts and wont break Xmax.... thats with a highpass @ 30HZ 

Almost matches ouput of two JBL GTO1514D's in my infinite baffle install.


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

How do you plan to fit a 12" or 15" in a single cab? (Depth wise)

JBL GTO 8's get my vote as well. Get at least 2 if you decide on 8's. They *can *have some good low end depending on how you eq them. Or, like someone said, port them.


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

Danometal said:


> The Alpine and the Dayton will suffer from low sensitivity. A powerful amp will be necessary for either of those. With lower power, like 300-400 watts, JBL GTO series are cheap and just great subwoofers with good sensitivity specs. If my JBL Power sub ever dies, I plan to run a pair of GTO 12s in a low tuned ported box.


Idk how much I believe sensitivity specs any more. I did a test between a 91db infinity(which is basically jbl) and an 85db dayton(both 10's). Watt for watt, couldn't tell the difference. I could however tell a difference when the dayton destroyed the infinity in max spl. :surprised:

Here's why: The 85db rating of the dayton is the 8 ohm rating. The 91db rating of the infinity is the 2 ohm rating. Subtract 3db from the infinity to get the 4ohm rating (88db) Add 3db to the dayton to get the 4 ohm rating (88db)

Both subs have equal sensitivity. It's just the difference in how manufacturers rate speakers.


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## ZAKOH (Nov 26, 2010)

RE SRX is pretty good for the price.
Alpine Type R8 for ported box.
Alpine SWS-15D or SWS-10D in a sealed box.
If you can find Infinity 120.9w for the budget, that's also pretty good.


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## Mooresound (Jan 17, 2012)

Spyke said:


> Idk how much I believe sensitivity specs any more. I did a test between a 91db infinity(which is basically jbl) and an 85db dayton(both 10's). Watt for watt, couldn't tell the difference. I could however tell a difference when the dayton destroyed the infinity in max spl. :surprised:
> 
> Here's why: The 85db rating of the dayton is the 8 ohm rating. The 91db rating of the infinity is the 2 ohm rating. Subtract 3db from the infinity to get the 4ohm rating (88db) Add 3db to the dayton to get the 4 ohm rating (88db)
> 
> Both subs have equal sensitivity. It's just the difference in how manufacturers rate speakers.


--Totally agree... I think that the sensitivity thing is above my head.. I modeled two GTO 1514D's vs two Dayton IB 15's and the daytons were more efficient according to win ISD... those JBL's are supposedly at 96 DB....88DB on the daytons.


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## ZAKOH (Nov 26, 2010)

Spyke said:


> Idk how much I believe sensitivity specs any more. I did a test between a 91db infinity(which is basically jbl) and an 85db dayton(both 10's). Watt for watt, couldn't tell the difference. I could however tell a difference when the dayton destroyed the infinity in max spl. :surprised:


Infinity always inflates their sensitivity specs, even for home audio speakers. One good way to find out a subwoofer's sensitivity, say 1watt/1meter, is enter its paramemters into WinISD alpha, but leave SPL field blank. It will estimate it. Most of the time it is consistent with the sensitivity specs of subwoofers where specs are correct. In case of Kappa 120.9w, I believe its sensitivity is about 86dB which is well midpack for the subwoofers of this class and size with good qtc in a 1-1.2cu ft sealed box. It's about the same as Alpine Type-R or Image Dynamics subs for example. The bottom line is that it will sound pretty good with 250-450watts of power. But the Dayton HO 12 (DVC) will need about twice as much wattage to get there. The SVC version has better sensitivity but one needs an amplifier that supplies the necessary power with 4ohm impedance.

Dayton HO series do have a pretty low sensitivity spec. The 4ohm DVC 12" version is 83dB, which is pretty low for 12 inch subwoofer. This is 1watt/1meter. You need to run 700watts to it to make it reach SPL of an average subwoofer with half of that power. I'd use a dedicate mono block amplifier for it. The 4ohm SVC version is a little better, like 85dB - not the best but reasonable. The 10 inch subwoofers will probably need a muscular amplifier or a ported box. Again, the 10 inch SVC version has slightly better sensitivity. The 10inch DVC sensitivity is about 82dB.





> Here's why: The 85db rating of the dayton is the 8 ohm rating. The 91db rating of the infinity is the 2 ohm rating. Subtract 3db from the infinity to get the 4ohm rating (88db) Add 3db to the dayton to get the 4 ohm rating (88db)
> 
> Both subs have equal sensitivity. It's just the difference in how manufacturers rate speakers.


I don't think that the SPL specs correspond with subwoofer wired for 8ohm impedance as the (final) resistance specs are more consistent with wiring subwoofer voice coil in parallel. This spec is also consistent with what WinISD predicts. It's just a very low sensitivity subwoofer for some reason. The web page for Dayton Audio RSS265HO-44 says:

DC Resistance (Re) 1.7 ohms 
Sensitivity 82.5 dB 1W/1m 

For the 12 inch subwoofer:

Impedance: 2ohms
DC Resistance (Re) 1.7 ohms 
Sensitivity: 83.2

This resistance and the last impedance number imply IMO that ALL parameters correspond do subwoofer wired in parallel, for nominal 2ohm impedance.


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## 8675309 (Jan 8, 2007)

How much space and power do you have to work with? That should be the starting point. 

Don't listen to anyone about anything until you provide the above information. You should never purchase a subwoofer until you have modeled that woofer with what you have to work with. I can take a $80 woofer in the correct enclosure and make it sound better than a $800 woofer in the wrong enclosure.


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

ZAKOH said:


> Infinity always inflates their sensitivity specs, even for home audio speakers. One good way to find out a subwoofer's sensitivity, say 1watt/1meter, is enter its paramemters into WinISD alpha, but leave SPL field blank. It will estimate it. Most of the time it is consistent with the sensitivity specs of subwoofers where specs are correct. In case of Kappa 120.9w, I believe its sensitivity is about 86dB which is well midpack for the subwoofers of this class and size with good qtc in a 1-1.2cu ft sealed box. It's about the same as Alpine Type-R or Image Dynamics subs for example. The bottom line is that it will sound pretty good with 250-450watts of power.* But the Dayton HO 12 (DVC) will need about twice as much wattage to get there.* The SVC version has better sensitivity but one needs an amplifier that supplies the necessary power with 4ohm impedance.


You aren't comparing apples to apples. You are comparing a 4 ohm dvc sub wired in series to a bunch of 4 ohm svc subs. Of course it will take more power because you have effectively decreased the sensitivity of the dvc sub.



ZAKOH said:


> Dayton HO series do have a pretty low sensitivity spec. The 4ohm DVC 12" version is 83dB, which is pretty low for 12 inch subwoofer. *This is 1watt/1meter. *You need to run 700watts to it to make it reach SPL of an average subwoofer with half of that power. I'd use a dedicate mono block amplifier for it. The 4ohm SVC version is a little better, like 85dB - not the best but reasonable. The 10 inch subwoofers will probably need a muscular amplifier or a ported box. Again, the 10 inch SVC version has slightly better sensitivity. The 10inch DVC sensitivity is about 82dB.


You can't go by 1w/1m ratings. 1w is only equal to 2.83v at 8 ohms. Therefore, a 4ohm sub with an 88db 1w/1m rating is equal to an 8 ohm sub with an 85db 1w/1m rating.



ZAKOH said:


> I don't think that the SPL specs correspond with subwoofer wired for 8ohm impedance as the (final) resistance specs are more consistent with wiring subwoofer voice coil in parallel. This spec is also consistent with what WinISD predicts. It's just a very low sensitivity subwoofer for some reason. The web page for Dayton Audio RSS265HO-44 says:
> 
> DC Resistance (Re) 1.7 ohms
> Sensitivity 82.5 dB 1W/1m
> ...


No. When ohm load goes down wattage increases and sensitivity appears to increase. So that's a little backwards. A 2 ohm rating of 82.5db would mean an 8 ohm rating of about 76db. 82.5 db is more than likely the 8ohm rating, with both 4ohm coils in series. To compare that to a 4 ohm svc it would be about 86db, so, average.



Ok, my point is this: *Most* subs are about 83-86db 1w/1m @ 8ohms.


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

8675309 said:


> How much space and power do you have to work with? That should be the starting point.
> 
> Don't listen to anyone about anything until you provide the above information. You should never purchase a subwoofer until you have modeled that woofer with what you have to work with. I can take a $80 woofer in the correct enclosure and make it sound better than a $800 woofer in the wrong enclosure.


Behind the seat of a standard cab. Bout 3 cu ft max, if he wants to take the whole space and not leave room for storage. Mounting depth is the biggest issue in this case.


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## ZAKOH (Nov 26, 2010)

> 82.5 db is more than likely the 8ohm rating, with both 4ohm coils in series.


You got it all backwards. Why do you find it hard to accept that 82.5dB is "unlikely" sensitivity with voice coils wired in parallel? It's just a very low sensitivity subwoofer, with 10 inch cone. In fact, wiring the voice coils in parallel is consistent with the 1.7ohm resistance listed in parts express specs. What's unlikely is to get 1.7ohm resistance if they did measure the parameters with the voice coils wired in series as you suggest.

I have entered the parameters of the DVC Dayton HO12 in WinISD and played with it in the SPL graph section. A typical 12 inch subwoofer (say Alpine Type-R 2ohm DVC wired in series) needs about 100watts to reach 103dB output (just a random number I picked) in an optimal sealed box. WinISD predicts that Dayton HO12 DVC needs 240-250watts. WinISD also predicts it has 83.19dB sensitivity, which is pretty much consistent with 83.2dB given by parts express.


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## 8675309 (Jan 8, 2007)

Looking for a the best bang for the buck sub to go in the front of my single cab truck.

This would make me think he is talking about in front of the seat.

But if it was going behind the seat and I would figure a slanted box at 15 tall x 3 top x 7 bottom x 52 long with .75 thickness would give you around 1.4 cube with the seat all the way back. If you got crazy with glass and keep the seat all they way back you may be able to get 2 cube. If it is a new Ford or Dodge you could get more but I am not sure because type of truck is not listed.

Now lets use the basics and say no crazy box you are now looking at a single 10 or 12 in a ported box by the time you account for sub displacement and port displacement. 

You could do a pair of 10's or 12's sealed but that could go above the price point. 







Spyke said:


> Behind the seat of a standard cab. Bout 3 cu ft max, if he wants to take the whole space and not leave room for storage. Mounting depth is the biggest issue in this case.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Spyke said:


> You can't go by 1w/1m ratings. 1w is only equal to 2.83v at 8 ohms. Therefore, a 4ohm sub with an 88db 1w/1m rating is equal to an 8 ohm sub with an 85db 1w/1m rating.


1W/1M is 1W/1M Its that 2.83V is not 1W/1M for anything BUT 8 ohm drivers. You WILL find car folks using 2.83V over 1 watt.

all of this horseshit is really moot considering most around here shove it in an enclosure the size of a shot glass. Then cross it over super low WELL OUT OF the pass-band where the fictitious sensitivity number was derived. Then shove it in an environment with X amount of cabin gain.


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## Hatfield (Jul 21, 2012)

I have a jbl bp1200.1 (1200 watts at 1 or 2 ohms) i can use if I have to, so sensitivity isn't necessarily a deal breaker. And it's going in the floor space between the driver and passenger sides of my 94 full size blazer. There's about 1-1.5 cu ft there(prob not enough for a 15), and i want to see how it will sound with the sub upfront instead of all the way in the rear. Two 8's, a 10, or 12 is what will probably work best. Sorry for not being more specific in my original post


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

ZAKOH said:


> You got it all backwards. Why do you find it hard to accept that 82.5dB is "unlikely" sensitivity with voice coils wired in parallel? It's just a very low sensitivity subwoofer, with 10 inch cone. In fact, wiring the voice coils in parallel is consistent with the 1.7ohm resistance listed in parts express specs. What's unlikely is to get 1.7ohm resistance if they did measure the parameters with the voice coils wired in series as you suggest.
> 
> I have entered the parameters of the DVC Dayton HO12 in WinISD and played with it in the SPL graph section. A typical 12 inch subwoofer (say Alpine Type-R 2ohm DVC wired in series) needs about 100watts to reach 103dB output (just a random number I picked) in an optimal sealed box. WinISD predicts that Dayton HO12 DVC needs 240-250watts. WinISD also predicts it has 83.19dB sensitivity, which is pretty much consistent with 83.2dB given by parts express.


Calm down, I just checked that particular sub and you are right. It's just a very oddly insensitive driver.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Spyke said:


> Calm down,


The Stripes "Lighten up Francis" pic should just be on tap on this forum


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

chad said:


> 1W/1M is 1W/1M Its that 2.83V is not 1W/1M for anything BUT 8 ohm drivers. You WILL find car folks using 2.83V over 1 watt.
> 
> all of this horseshit is really moot considering *most around here shove it in an enclosure the size of a shot glass. *


Good point. The sensitivity in the passband of interest is maybe 70ish.



chad said:


> *Then cross it over super low WELL OUT OF the pass-band where the fictitious sensitivity number was derived.* Then shove it in an environment with X amount of cabin gain.


 This is another thing that I forgot to bring up. There's no telling what freq that sensitivity number was measured at. A rating for a sub woofer at 150hz really doesn't tell you much. It's like taking a tweeter measured at 1k and crossing it at 4k. All of a sudden the ratings mean absolutely nothing.


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## tnbubba (Mar 1, 2008)

dayton has a new 8" out too.. looks to be a BAMF


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

tnbubba said:


> dayton has a new 8" out too.. looks to be a BAMF


Did you see their more BAMF sub? Got my new catalog today, looks neet, I need to model it though.


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

chad said:


> The Stripes "Lighten up Francis" pic should just be on tap on this forum


If anyone calls me Francis....I'll kill you!!


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## Spyke (Apr 20, 2012)

chad said:


> Did you see their more BAMF sub? Got my new catalog today, looks neet, I need to model it though.


Ultimax? There's a thread about it here somewhere. Looks like a dvc titanic with a glass fiber cone. Could be fun.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

that's the one


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## jriggs (Jun 14, 2011)

Well after all of the enlightening arguments ...

I still stand by my recommendations for two reasons. First I read your post and understood that you are intending to mount the sub in front of the seats, implying the need for a sub that requires a very small enclosure and shallow depth. And second, I have real world experience with the subs I recommended. By the way, you have plenty of power with that jbl amp.


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## Danometal (Nov 16, 2009)

Fwiw, JBL rates their subs @ 2.83 V vs 1W/1M. To roughly convert that, I just start at 8 ohms, and subtract 3 dbs every time the impedance is halved until you arrive at the target impedance. For example, say a sub is rated 93 dbs @ 2.83 V, and it's a dual 4 ohm sub you plan to run in parallel to create a 2 ohm load at the amp. 93 dbs @ 8 ohms (2.83 V) = 90 dbs @ 4 ohms = 87 dbs @ 2 ohms. So, you would plug the 87 dbs into WinISD or whatever and that will get you in the neighborhood.


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## Mr. Nice Guy (Jul 21, 2011)

Definitely DD 500 series. A single 8" or 10" would probably be perfect for what you're wanting. Even if you're very limited on space, a 508b ($89) would work well in a .5 cu. ft. sealed enclosure...but if you have the space, go ported.


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## 111brandon111 (Nov 13, 2012)

I would look into infinity reference series their cheap and do give u some quality bass. the 8 inch sub is $50 bucks on ebay the 12 is $57


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## Hatfield (Jul 21, 2012)

What/who is DD?

Ok so I have a few options to research
Gto 8 or 10, infinity r 8 or 10, dayton ho 10 all seem to be pretty popular suggestions that I will look intO. Thanks for all the input!


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## quality_sound (Dec 25, 2005)

Digital Designs


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## eggyhustles (Sep 18, 2008)

Mooresound said:


> 800 watts and wont break Xmax.... thats with a highpass @ 30HZ
> 
> Almost matches ouput of two JBL GTO1514D's in my infinite baffle install.


2 cubes for 2 8's, though?


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## SilkySlim (Oct 24, 2012)

I have just used a couple of Morel primos not real low budget but lower to mid priced. Great sq and output for the money. Very efficient.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2


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## quality_sound (Dec 25, 2005)

I have been throoughly impressed with the Polm MM1240. Especially for the price.


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## RNBRAD (Oct 30, 2012)

I just bought some mb-Quart 12's for $29.00 a piece. Going to see how they sound tonight. Probably need some break in. These are for my teenagers first system.


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## mos805 (Nov 30, 2011)

RNBRAD said:


> I just bought some mb-Quart 12's for $29.00 a piece. Going to see how they sound tonight. Probably need some break in. These are for my teenagers first system.


Are those the ones on sale at sonicelectronix?


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## RNBRAD (Oct 30, 2012)

mos805 said:


> Are those the ones on sale at sonicelectronix?


Yep, that's the ones. I thought for the price, worth a try.


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## K-Mike (Sep 17, 2012)

BTW, if your still interested in the JBL GTO1214D its on sale at sonic electronics. JBL GTO1214D (GTO-1214D) 12" Dual 4 ohm Grand Touring Subwoofer for $75


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## mos805 (Nov 30, 2011)

RNBRAD said:


> Yep, that's the ones. I thought for the price, worth a try.


Nice hopefully we can hear your impressions soon, I was considering getting those until I snagged one of the Alpine Type E 12s on the Best Buy sale.


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