# Mosconi 8to12



## Angrywhopper (Jan 20, 2010)

The all new Mosconi 8to12 has been announced!

There will be two models:

8to12 PRO
8to12 Aerospace

They will be listed at $999 and $1399, respectively. 

Yesterday, the Aerospace won a prestige Eisa award for this year.


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## matdotcom2000 (Aug 16, 2005)

Oh snap!!!!
Specs??


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## Onyx1136 (Mar 15, 2009)

Mosconi Releases New DSP Next Month, Wins EISA Award | ceoutlook.com

That's all I can find so far. There's a little blurb on their Facebook page from a few months ago, but it doesn't say much more.


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## ndm (Jul 5, 2007)

MMMMMM......I love me some mosconi dsp....Im drooling!!


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## frontman (May 1, 2013)

Sub'd for interest


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## matdotcom2000 (Aug 16, 2005)

Damn 120db crossover... That's excessive...


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## Onyx1136 (Mar 15, 2009)

matdotcom2000 said:


> Damn 120db crossover... That's excessive...


Yeah, it takes a crossover slope and turns it into a brick wall.


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## cmusic (Nov 16, 2006)

Can't wait for a three way battle between this, the new Zapco and Audio Frog DSPs!


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

matdotcom2000 said:


> Damn 120db crossover... That's excessive...


While 120dB per octave slope is excessive, essentially what they mean is that you have 10 stackable crossover selections. So lets say you want a 24db/octave bandpass, that is 4 lines, then you need a shelf, that's a 5th, maybe another shelf, 6, and a notch, that's 7. If you need to make the bandpass 36dB/octave and now you're at 9 lines of network. So...it's pretty elaborate.


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## matdotcom2000 (Aug 16, 2005)

cobb2819 said:


> While 120dB per octave slope is excessive, essentially what they mean is that you have 10 stackable crossover selections. So lets say you want a 24db/octave bandpass, that is 4 lines, then you need a shelf, that's a 5th, maybe another shelf, 6, and a notch, that's 7. If you need to make the bandpass 36dB/octave and now you're at 9 lines of network. So...it's pretty elaborate.


Any idea on the ability for phase correction?


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## Huckleberry Sound (Jan 17, 2009)

Nice!!!


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

matdotcom2000 said:


> Any idea on the ability for phase correction?


As of right now, still 0 (zero) and 180 degrees of adjustment.


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## Onyx1136 (Mar 15, 2009)

cobb2819 said:


> While 120dB per octave slope is excessive, essentially what they mean is that you have 10 stackable crossover selections. So lets say you want a 24db/octave bandpass, that is 4 lines, then you need a shelf, that's a 5th, maybe another shelf, 6, and a notch, that's 7. If you need to make the bandpass 36dB/octave and now you're at 9 lines of network. So...it's pretty elaborate.


I figured it was something like that. Any chance it has FIR filters? Or multichannel upmixing? Or that the tuning can be done from an iOS app?


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## Denaliz (Dec 2, 2014)

sub'd


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## MrGreen83 (Jun 11, 2015)

cmusic said:


> Can't wait for a three way battle between this, the new Zapco and Audio Frog DSPs!




Hey don't forget the Bit One HD 


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Onyx1136 said:


> I figured it was something like that. Any chance it has FIR filters? Or multichannel upmixing? Or that the tuning can be done from an iOS app?



I don't think it has FIR filters, and an iOS app is also fairly unlikely. I have tried tuning some pro-audio DSPs using iOS apps and they don't really work all that great, to be honest.
Some things lend themselves well to a touch screen. Generally, I don't think DSP tuning is one of those things that does. Sounds nice in theory, until you actually try using it.


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## Onyx1136 (Mar 15, 2009)

subterFUSE said:


> I don't think it has FIR filters, and an iOS app is also fairly unlikely. I have tried tuning some pro-audio DSPs using iOS apps and they don't really work all that great, to be honest.
> Some things lend themselves well to a touch screen. Generally, I don't think DSP tuning is one of those things that does. Sounds nice in theory, until you actually try using it.


I can see that. Maybe that's why Kicker went with 1/3 octave EQ for their amp/processor line. Their iOS interface works really well, for the record. For tuning at least. It seems like someone would be able to figure out a way to adapt a touchscreen device to DSP tuning software and make it easy to operate. Lots of smart people in the audio industry. Surely one of them has the brain to figure it out.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

subterFUSE said:


> I don't think it has FIR filters, and an iOS app is also fairly unlikely. I have tried tuning some pro-audio DSPs using iOS apps and they don't really work all that great, to be honest.
> Some things lend themselves well to a touch screen. Generally, I don't think DSP tuning is one of those things that does. Sounds nice in theory, until you actually try using it.





Onyx1136 said:


> I can see that. Maybe that's why Kicker went with 1/3 octave EQ for their amp/processor line. Their iOS interface works really well, for the record. For tuning at least. It seems like someone would be able to figure out a way to adapt a touchscreen device to DSP tuning software and make it easy to operate. Lots of smart people in the audio industry. Surely one of them has the brain to figure it out.


The Mosconi software on a surface pro tablet works really well. 

The main issue with the Mosconi stuff is...Apple devices in Europe weren't really a thing for a LONG time. To top is off, you originally had to pay apple to "certify" the bluetooth interface. Now with BT 4.0, that doesn't need this certification, and the Mosconi support so much higher in the US than it ever has been before, Apple support is being looked at, and being worked on. If a Mac command library can be generated, then an iOS interface would be easy.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

How much longer until we can test drive the software? 

I'm interested to see what the Aerospace can do.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

subterFUSE said:


> How much longer until we can test drive the software?
> 
> I'm interested to see what the Aerospace can do.


Imagine a 6to8, only better, and there you have it. HAHA. Software will pretty much be the sale with the additional channels. Mixer layout is a bit different, 11 and 12 are monos and programmable to suit most people's needs, within reason. More input EQing, more output EQing, source dependent preset selection for varying EQ needs. Other than that...it's mostly the same.


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## ross.cottrill (Aug 27, 2011)

Sub'd.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

cobb2819 said:


> Imagine a 6to8, only better, and there you have it. HAHA. Software will pretty much be the sale with the additional channels. Mixer layout is a bit different, 11 and 12 are monos and programmable to suit most people's needs, within reason. More input EQing, more output EQing, source dependent preset selection for varying EQ needs. Other than that...it's mostly the same.




More input EQ? Sweet! I'm glad to see this coming to more DSPs.

How about crossovers on the inputs? 


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

Meh. Old news. I held one in my hand almost a week ago. I heard someone already got one installed in SoCal.


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## ugnlol (Apr 14, 2010)

Sweet, but is the marked really high enough for a 12 channel dsp?


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

ugnlol said:


> Sweet, but is the marked really high enough for a 12 channel dsp?




Hmmm. Well, a 3 way active front with subwoofer and rear fill requires 9 channels. The answer is a resounding YES, 12 channels is necessary.


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## ryanr7386 (Feb 21, 2011)

subterFUSE said:


> Hmmm. Well, a 3 way active front with subwoofer and rear fill requires 9 channels. The answer is a resounding YES, 12 channels is necessary.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Orrrrr, 3-Way active in the doors, 2 way active in the A-Pillers and a pair of Subs. I Agree!


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

rton20s said:


> Meh. Old news. I held one in my hand almost a week ago. I heard someone already got one installed in SoCal.


You did hold one, and there will be one tweak to the new one, losing one optical in, and adding a coax in. 



ugnlol said:


> Sweet, but is the marked really high enough for a 12 channel dsp?


I didn't wanna think so, but yes.



subterFUSE said:


> Hmmm. Well, a 3 way active front with subwoofer and rear fill requires 9 channels. The answer is a resounding YES, 12 channels is necessary.


Three way front, rear fill, center, stereo subs, 11 channels accounted for.


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## Catalyx (Oct 13, 2011)

cobb2819 said:


> You did hold one, and there will be one tweak to the new one, losing one optical in, and adding a coax in.


Nice to hear about the coax input, I'll need one for my Focal iBox.



cobb2819 said:


> Three way front, rear fill, center, stereo subs, 11 channels accounted for.


I'd like to try a four way front, two way rear fill and single sub but that's 13 channels... ;-)


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## matdotcom2000 (Aug 16, 2005)

Out of everything I am excited to hear the DA converter!!!!! I think it has the same converter that the sony rsx gs9 has...


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

Catalyx said:


> Nice to hear about the coax input, I'll need one for my Focal iBox.
> 
> 
> 
> I'd like to try a four way front, two way rear fill and single sub but that's 13 channels... ;-)


I think we talked about the coax in Torrence. This was a last minute Monday or Tuesday change to the hardware. Italy's ears must have been ringing. 

Mono rear, mono sub, 12 channels, hahaha. Or just use a point source on the rear with a passive network.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Can it do (L minus R) and (R minus L) for the rear fill?
What is the maximum delay available?


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## Mic10is (Aug 20, 2007)

subterFUSE said:


> Can it do (L minus R) and (R minus L) for the rear fill?
> What is the maximum delay available?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


and can it allow for any center processing, since center speaker was already mentioned


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

subterFUSE said:


> Can it do (L minus R) and (R minus L) for the rear fill?
> What is the maximum delay available?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Yes, you will be to invert phase on the input mixer for each output "arrangement". So you'll be able to left 100% and right -100%.

As for max delay, 15ms to the best of my knowledge.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

Mic10is said:


> and can it allow for any center processing, since center speaker was already mentioned


Same thing in reference to input mixing as mentioned before.


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## Catalyx (Oct 13, 2011)

cobb2819 said:


> I think we talked about the coax in Torrence. This was a last minute Monday or Tuesday change to the hardware. Italy's ears must have been ringing.


Hehe, I think so!



cobb2819 said:


> Mono rear, mono sub, 12 channels, hahaha. Or just use a point source on the rear with a passive network.


Good idea, I assume the 11 & 12 mono channels can be sums of an L&R input?


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## tonny (Dec 4, 2010)

GLADEN DSP 8to12 AEROSPACE

The dsp is already on the website.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

Catalyx said:


> Good idea, I assume the 11 & 12 mono channels can be sums of an L&R input?


Pretty much.


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## MrGreen83 (Jun 11, 2015)

subterFUSE said:


> Hmmm. Well, a 3 way active front with subwoofer and rear fill requires 9 channels. The answer is a resounding YES, 12 channels is necessary.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk




Saw a guy do that setup with a Bit One (8 channels). 

Ran the rear fill on the DSP as 1 channel (mono no left to right). So 2 channels on the amp, but only 1 on the DSP. 




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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

MrGreen83 said:


> Saw a guy do that setup with a Bit One (8 channels).
> 
> Ran the rear fill on the DSP as 1 channel (mono no left to right). So 2 channels on the amp, but only 1 on the DSP.


We've done it several times with a firmware upgrade to the 6to8 for those clients that wanted it. Worked very well!! Now you won't need to update the firmware, i'll work out of the box depending on your channel needs.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

MrGreen83 said:


> Saw a guy do that setup with a Bit One (8 channels).
> 
> Ran the rear fill on the DSP as 1 channel (mono no left to right). So 2 channels on the amp, but only 1 on the DSP.
> 
> ...




You can do rears mono, but it's better to have them independent so you can delay separately. So more channels on the DSP is nice to have.

But yeah, I'm probably going to do my rears in the upcoming build by sending a mono DSP output with L-R mixed and then just invert one of the drivers at the amp. So left would get L-R signal and then with the right side flipped it would be R-L.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Is the software finalized? Are features still being added?

If so, tell them to make crossovers available on both the inputs AND the outputs.
And very good parametric EQ on the inputs.

All pass filters would be great, too.


And more than 30ms delay.


In other words, just make it like a pro audio DSP and I'll be really, really happy.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

subterFUSE said:


> In other words, just make it like a pro audio DSP and I'll be really, really happy.


I've heard the DriveRack is pretty good for what you specifically want, HAHA. 

Honestly, there is only so many options you can select, and we need to weigh out what is worth it and what isn't. I think the new setup is gonna make about 95% of it's users completely happy.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

I'm not sure that dBx makes anything with crossovers on the inputs. The driverack series are very... shall we say, "entry level" as far as pro audio stuff goes. 


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## BigAl205 (May 20, 2009)

I had the 6to8 and really enjoyed it (and wish I hadn't sold it). I was excited when I saw the 8to12 was coming out and I just now took the time to download the software to try out. While I like the familiar software layout, I was disappointed to see that you can no longer group channels together to do either delay, gain adjustment, or phase adjustment. I used to find it very useful to be able to get the tweets centered and then link them together and do a group delay to match the mids, etc. Am I missing something?


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## tonny (Dec 4, 2010)

BigAl205 said:


> I had the 6to8 and really enjoyed it (and wish I hadn't sold it). I was excited when I saw the 8to12 was coming out and I just now took the time to download the software to try out. While I like the familiar software layout, I was disappointed to see that you can no longer group channels together to do either delay, gain adjustment, or phase adjustment. I used to find it very useful to be able to get the tweets centered and then link them together and do a group delay to match the mids, etc. Am I missing something?


What I've been told is that the group settings will come back in the software and some changes in the mixer settings and eq section, and they told me there will also be some nice new features in it! 

I've changed my 6to8 last weekend for an 8to12 made the same settings and I must say it is really an improvement in everything! it is just like it plays so much easier and the sounds are more real with better depth and width off the sound stage! and more extension in the top end and in the low end, so they did a very good job with the new dsp!


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## mclaren1885 (Feb 15, 2012)

@cobb2819, would you by any chance know why the Mixer settings always end up showing as 101% even though the value entered is 100%? I was wondering if it's somehow linked to the Preset #?

Also, have they changed the way the Time Delay works? I tried the older method where you measure the distances of each driver, subtract each drivers distance from the farthest drivers distance and enter the difference values in the TD screen. Usually, it's a 2 minute job to get the vocals to the centre of the dash on the 6to8! However in the 8to12, it was nowhere near the centre. 

Also, I've assigned Ch 11 and Ch 12 to the subwoofer, setup the Input Matrix correctly as well. However, muting Ch 11 does nothing to the sub. Is that because in the Mixer Menu I've chosen Ch 11 & Ch 12 as sub in the Assignment of EQ & Volume Control?

Edit: Never mind the Ch 11 and Ch 12 doubt, just now realised they work as a mono.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

mclaren1885 said:


> @cobb2819, would you by any chance know why the Mixer settings always end up showing as 101% even though the value entered is 100%? I was wondering if it's somehow linked to the Preset #?


With the new hardware for low voltage inputs like a porsche with 1v low level from the stock headunit, you can now boost the input mixer to 200%. If you have high(er) voltage than numbers like that, this provision should not be used, is unnecessary, and will not help anything. 



mclaren1885 said:


> Also, have they changed the way the Time Delay works? I tried the older method where you measure the distances of each driver, subtract each drivers distance from the farthest drivers distance and enter the difference values in the TD screen. Usually, it's a 2 minute job to get the vocals to the centre of the dash on the 6to8! However in the 8to12, it was nowhere near the centre.


No, time alignment has not been changed. I'd recommend resetting the DSP and starting over. 



mclaren1885 said:


> Also, I've assigned Ch 11 and Ch 12 to the subwoofer, setup the Input Matrix correctly as well. However, muting Ch 11 does nothing to the sub. Is that because in the Mixer Menu I've chosen Ch 11 & Ch 12 as sub in the Assignment of EQ & Volume Control?


This could have something more to do with the amp setup. If muting half a channel does nothing to the sub, and for example it's a monoblock that might might have a mono input configuration, it wouldn't really change anything.


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## ryanr7386 (Feb 21, 2011)

So is there going to be a seperate GLADEN DSP 8to12 Pro model or just the AEROSPACE model?


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

ryanr7386 said:


> So is there going to be a seperate GLADEN DSP 8to12 Pro model or just the AEROSPACE model?


There already is a Pro model.


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## Hammer1 (Jan 30, 2011)

Now there is a 6to8 aerospace out now too. Will see how much better it is over my 6to8V8


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## MrGreen83 (Jun 11, 2015)

Hammer1 said:


> Now there is a 6to8 aerospace out now too. Will see how much better it is over my 6to8V8




Nice!!! 


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

Great info!! See that's the problem with all the DSP's out there they say one thing that there DSP is 24/192 with a down the road software update lmao!! Well we have all heard that one before, then you wait a year, then another year, finally it never happens? It's the downsampling that is supposed to be worse from a few articles I have read, they said don't even bother putting anything 24/192 on something if it's going to be down sampled, just put only what the system truly does which in most cases is 24/96. 

This is why at this point in time I'm probably just going to go with a basic DSP the Hertz H8 it does everything I need it to do at this point in time and is 24/96. I will wait until they come out with a DSP that is a true 24/192 or higher.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> Great info!! See that's the problem with all the DSP's out there they say one thing that there DSP is 24/192 with a down the road software update lmao!! Well we have all heard that one before, then you wait a year, then another year, finally it never happens? It's the downsampling that is supposed to be worse from a few articles I have read, they said don't even bother putting anything 24/192 on something if it's going to be down sampled, just put only what the system truly does which in most cases is 24/96.
> 
> This is why at this point in time I'm probably just going to go with a basic DSP the Hertz H8 it does everything I need it to do at this point in time and is 24/96. *I will wait until they come out with a DSP that is a true 24/192 or higher.*


The 8to12 Aerospace is 24/192 native with no downsampling, and it's available now.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

I think that is around $2500.00 in Canada lol


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

cobb2819 said:


> The 8to12 Aerospace is 24/192 native with no downsampling, and it's available now.


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## James Cole (Dec 6, 2016)

What are the benefits of 24/192 feeding the DSP of a standard low level signal?

Also any reviews of the 8to12?


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## MrGreen83 (Jun 11, 2015)

I don't think any DSP is superior....they all have cons and pros. It just kills me to see people bad-mouth a brand. People can still get good...if not great...results using any of the quality DSP's out here for sale. What you use.....is your preference. 

Whether it be for the features, the ease of use, parametric EQ, whatever. It's all a preference. Don't bash someone else for their preference. 

is all I'm saying. 


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

Might I ask a favor. Please go discuss Audison in an Audition thread, or FIR filters in a FIR filter thread. If there is one thing I'm not a huge fan of, it is nonsense in a thread about a specific product, that has nothing to do with said product. This thread is here to help people interested in the 8to12 Pro and Aerospace, not discuss your thoughts on Audison's ability to deliver what they promise or not. 

As for FIR filters, we've discussed them and why the were not included. As mentioned, there are other inherent issues that would eliminate the work that a FIR filter does, as well as rob processing power from the DSP. Did the pros outweigh the cons, not for us. 

Cool, thanks, if we can get back to the tech, and not pages of nothing related to the thread subject...


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

Speaking of 24/192, it was mentioned a while back that the Ps8 handles it just fine over coax.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

nineball76 said:


> Speaking of 24/192, it was mentioned a while back that the Ps8 handles it just fine over coax.


It handles it, but is it actually natively processing it, or is it downsampling to something the processor can work with?


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

cobb2819 said:


> It handles it, but is it actually natively processing it, or is it downsampling to something the processor can work with?


I'd really be interested in finding out for sure. Arc said 24/96 when it was first released but I think latest update changed to 192 native. Dac is a 32 bit 384 dsd capable by the specs.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

cobb2819 said:


> It handles it, but is it actually natively processing it, or is it downsampling to something the processor can work with?




The Arc PS8 processes at 24/96 maximum. So it is downsampling if you feed it 192.


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

subterFUSE said:


> The Arc PS8 processes at 24/96 maximum. So it is downsampling if you feed it 192.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Says who? Honestly curious about your source.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

It was previously processing at 24/48. The new software was released and added 24/96 processing support. This can be verified by looking at the time alignment steps, which are now .01 ms. You can't have .01 ms time delay steps unless you are processing at 96 kHz or more.

The Mosconi 8to12 is the only DSP in the car market that is processing at 192.

Most pro audio DSP units costing $3,000+ don't even process at 192. And the ones that do have the option to process 192 usually must disable some of the processing features like EQ in order to do that. For example, they might have 30 band EQ when running at 48 or 96 KHz but at 192 the EQ gets disabled.


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## HOIRiIZON (Apr 3, 2016)

cobb2819 said:


> The 8to12 Aerospace is 24/192 native with no downsampling, and it's available now.


So I researched this and can't find anything or anyone that has used a DAP on this Mosconi piece. So if your saying it's 24/192 that should mean I can hook up and DAP to it through digital input and it will play all my 24/192 HD Track songs, or will it get converted at the amp?


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

HOIRiIZON said:


> So I researched this and can't find anything or anyone that has used a DAP on this Mosconi piece. So if your saying it's 24/192 that should mean I can hook up and DAP to it through digital input and it will play all my 24/192 HD Track songs, or will it get converted at the amp?


As long as the audio player will actually output 24/192, the DSP will be able to keep it 24/192 until the DAC, then it's converted to analog.


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

subterFUSE said:


> It was previously processing at 24/48. The new software was released and added 24/96 processing support. This can be verified by looking at the time alignment steps, which are now .01 ms. You can't have .01 ms time delay steps unless you are processing at 96 kHz or more.
> 
> The Mosconi 8to12 is the only DSP in the car market that is processing at 192.
> 
> ...


Hmm ok. I thought someone mentioned they were doing 96 in before the update and 192 after. Looked at the original manual and it lists 32/48. 

I didn't suppose the 8to12 has removable opamps.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

nineball76 said:


> I didn't suppose the 8to12 has removable opamps.


Nope.


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

nineball76 said:


> Hmm ok. I thought someone mentioned they were doing 96 in before the update and 192 after. Looked at the original manual and it lists 32/48.
> 
> I didn't suppose the 8to12 has removable opamps.



It was 48 kHz previously and the delay steps were .02 ms


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

cobb2819 said:


> Nope.


 

But do I want to add rear speakers and 2 more amps?


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

cobb2819 said:


> Nope.




They are not socketed.... but still upgradable by a professional who can solder. 


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

subterFUSE said:


> They are not socketed.... but still upgradable by a professional who can solder.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


If you knew exactly which ones you preffered to use. I myself don't. I prefer to listen, swap, listen. Unless I find those $75 ones I saw a few weeks ago. Don't remember who made them.


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## nineball76 (Mar 13, 2010)

Found em. Sparkos ss3602. Would definitely like to hear those.


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## James Cole (Dec 6, 2016)

Mic10is said:


> and can it allow for any center processing, since center speaker was already mentioned


Hi

Just got an 8to12 aero and would like to know how to process for a center speaker...

Thanks in advanve!
JC


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## ndm (Jul 5, 2007)

James Cole said:


> Hi
> 
> Just got an 8to12 aero and would like to know how to process for a center speaker...
> 
> ...


I would like to know this 

I also want to know if they still have the annoying mute thing going on? 
I would consider trading up from the DSP Pro but I just cannot deal with that muting stuff. 

I really liked my 6to8v8 but ARGHHHH!!!! that muting stuff!!!


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## outroku (Jul 20, 2014)

ndm said:


> I also want to know if they still have the annoying mute thing going on?
> I would consider trading up from the DSP Pro but I just cannot deal with that muting stuff.
> 
> I really liked my 6to8v8 but ARGHHHH!!!! that muting stuff!!!


Can you elaborate?


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

outroku said:


> Can you elaborate?


The unit mutes if you clip an output

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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

SkizeR said:


> The unit mutes if you clip an output
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


The unit mutes if you over drive the input.


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

cobb2819 said:


> The unit mutes if you over drive the input.


Oops. Sorry for the mixup. So how much voltage would cause it to mute? Is it just caused my 1 quick peak? Or does it have to be over driven for an amount of time before it says to itself "ok I need to tell this guy to chill"

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

ndm said:


> I would like to know this
> 
> I also want to know if they still have the annoying mute thing going on?
> I would consider trading up from the DSP Pro but I just cannot deal with that muting stuff.
> ...


The muting happened if you just take a dsp and slap it in a car without setting up ALL the hardware to play nice with each other. If you overdrive the hardware, it protects itself, this is a good thing. And yes, this processor still does it.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

SkizeR said:


> Oops. Sorry for the mixup. So how much voltage would cause it to mute? Is it just caused my 1 quick peak? Or does it have to be over driven for an amount of time before it says to itself "ok I need to tell this guy to chill"
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk


The analog input can support low level up to 8v when dialed in. IIRC, this mute threshold is 4v. So with zero (0) dB of attenuation the processor should play nice with 4v rms input, as you up the low level, you'll need to attenuate the pots on the side for the particular input that is overdriving the circuit. Same applies for High Level, only the range goes up to 20v


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## James Cole (Dec 6, 2016)

On the mixer you can add inputs from 1-200% intensity... what should be de default? 100% or 200%?


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

James Cole said:


> On the mixer you can add inputs from 1-200% intensity... what should be de default? 100% or 200%?


What is your source voltage?


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## Hammer1 (Jan 30, 2011)

If Input gain is set to high the 6to8 will detect clipping and mute


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## subterFUSE (Sep 21, 2009)

Google: Gain Structure.


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## James Cole (Dec 6, 2016)

cobb2819 said:


> What is your source voltage?


Source voltage is 4v


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

James Cole said:


> Source voltage is 4v


100% should be your max.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

Does anyone have a PDF of the 8to12 Aerospace manual? I'm picking up my truck from the shop tomorrow and wanted to order a long USB cable but I'm not sure which one it needs.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

TomT said:


> Does anyone have a PDF of the 8to12 Aerospace manual? I'm picking up my truck from the shop tomorrow and wanted to order a long USB cable but I'm not sure which one it needs.


Technically I'm the manual. It comes with a USB cable, and the connector on the device is a Mini-B.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

cobb2819 said:


> Technically I'm the manual. It comes with a USB cable, and the connector on the device is a Mini-B.


Thanks, pretty sure I've already got a long one of those then. Is the Bluetooth adapter in stock?


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

TomT said:


> Thanks, pretty sure I've already got a long one of those then. *Is the Bluetooth adapter in stock?*


Yes indeed, and that is my go to over USB.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

Picking it up from Beach tomorrow. Can't wait!


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

Came out to a dead battery. It seems the system is staying powered on all the time. Is there a way in the Mosconi to tell it to power down the system?

I'm using the RAM factory head unit and it has no actual power button that I am aware of.


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## Hammer1 (Jan 30, 2011)

Are you using signal sense mode ?? Try running a remote wire to turn on 8to12 and then from dsp to amps. Find a ignition hot wire to tap into.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

I'm not sure as the install was done by a shop. Taking it in tomorrow but was hoping I could manually shut down the system without disconnecting the battery overnight.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

TomT said:


> Came out to a dead battery. It seems the system is staying powered on all the time. Is there a way in the Mosconi to tell it to power down the system?
> 
> I'm using the RAM factory head unit and it has no actual power button that I am aware of.


Either signal sense needs to be turned off and a remote input should be used from an accessory circuit in the vehicle, or the signal sense switch needs to be changed based on the output of the factory head unit.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

cobb2819 said:


> Either signal sense needs to be turned off and a remote input should be used from an accessory circuit in the vehicle, or the signal sense switch needs to be changed based on the output of the factory head unit.


At the shop now. We're using the new PAC unit for my 2015 RAM (Alpine system) and sending it to the 8to12 via Toslink. It seems like the processor is not seeing the signal cease when the radio shuts off. Testing to see if it may be the PAC unit still sending signal even after the radio shuts down.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

TomT said:


> At the shop now. We're using the new PAC unit for my 2015 RAM (Alpine system) and sending it to the 8to12 via Toslink. It seems like the processor is not seeing the signal cease when the radio shuts off. Testing to see if it may be the PAC unit still sending signal even after the radio shuts down.


When using optical you cannot use signal sense. Have them unplug the power connector, flip the AutoSense switch to off, plug the processor back in, and run a remote turn on to the Remote Input on the processor.

Also, if the processor is connected to the software via bluetooth or USB, the processor will not turn off, so make sure that all connections unplugged and software closed.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

cobb2819 said:


> When using optical you cannot use signal sense. Have them unplug the power connector, flip the AutoSense switch to off, plug the processor back in, and run a remote turn on to the Remote Input on the processor.


Is something planned for a future software release? It seems like the signal sense should function with any type of input either analog or digital.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

Update: It turns out that the PAC unit is sending constant voltage on the remote trigger circuit. It's either a design flaw with the newly released unit or this one is faulty.

Working around by using a different power source for the remote turn on.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

TomT said:


> Is something planned for a future software release? It seems like the signal sense should function with any type of input either analog or digital.


Likely no, because analog signal sense uses voltage to trigger the processor, just like a remote turn on. To do the same over optical, the processor would have to remain on to see the digital info come in, and this would be a draw on the electrical system.


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

cobb2819 said:


> Likely no, because analog signal sense uses voltage to trigger the processor, just like a remote turn on. To do the same over optical, the processor would have to remain on to see the digital info come in, and this would be a draw on the electrical system.


Makes sense, thanks.

A suggestion, maybe include a 6 foot or longer USB cable? I'd venture to guess that most installs using a high end DSP will not have it mounted up front. I'm sure the cost to include it would be more than offset by goodwill and word of mouth happiness.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

TomT said:


> Makes sense, thanks.
> 
> A suggestion, maybe include a 6 foot or longer USB cable? I'd venture to guess that most installs using a high end DSP will not have it mounted up front. I'm sure the cost to include it would be more than offset by goodwill and word of mouth happiness.


Bluetooth is more stable for tuning than long USB cables or extensions, just based off word of mouth happiness.


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## Hammer1 (Jan 30, 2011)

Yep Bluetooth for tuning is the way to go. I have had two Mosconi processors and have never used the USB. There's some word of mouth happiness


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

That's most likely in my future plan. I wish Mosconi would port the software to Mac and iOS. I can't imagine a better way to tune than over Bluetooth using my iPad Pro.


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## Hammer1 (Jan 30, 2011)

TomT said:


> That's most likely in my future plan. I wish Mosconi would port the software to Mac and iOS. I can't imagine a better way to tune than over Bluetooth using my iPad Pro.


That would be sweet if they did. I have a iPad Pro in my dash as my HU.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

Maybe one day, but MacOS/iOS app development is expensive, and really the US is the only country to have adopted Apple products as crazy as we have. Also keep in mind that the BT hardware would need to be redesigned for BT4.0 to be able to work with Apple products without expensive Apple certification. Lots of factors have gone into it not having been done yet, but we'll see what happens.


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## pro-gon (Aug 14, 2017)

Dear Cobb2819, could You tell us more about the implementation of the "Central channel" in the lines of pro and aerospace? If they can generate (select) "Central channel" of a stereo signal? If Yes, then how: by adding the left and right channels, or using your own algorithm?


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

pro-gon said:


> Dear Cobb2819, could You tell us more about the implementation of the "Central channel" in the lines of pro and aerospace? If they can generate (select) "Central channel" of a stereo signal? If Yes, then how: by adding the left and right channels, or using your own algorithm?


Not cobb2819, but I do not believe that the new Mosconi DSPs utilize any sort of algorithm (licensed or otherwise) to generate a center (or surround) channel. This is handled entirely in the input matrix. It is up to you as the end user to handle the mixing for those channels. 

Fortunately, there is some decent information out there that may be a good _starting point_ if you're interested in pursuing center channels and/or rear speakers. Start at post #73 of the thread linked below from "Patrick Bateman" to see some of the matrixes used by licensed upmixers. 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/technical-advanced-car-audio-discussion/210570-five-channel-soundstage-3.html


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## pro-gon (Aug 14, 2017)

Thank you! So, if I understand correctly, the "Central channel" in Aerospace and Pro it's just a name, and its purpose is to work with an already generated signal (from an external source or processor type Logic7, ms-8 and other), or mixing (addition or subtraction) input channels?

Thanks for the link, I'm watching for topics Patrick and Andy.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

pro-gon said:


> Thank you! So, if I understand correctly, the "Central channel" in Aerospace and Pro it's just a name, and its purpose is to work with an already generated signal (from an external source or processor type Logic7, ms-8 and other), or mixing (addition or subtraction) input channels?
> 
> Thanks for the link, I'm watching for topics Patrick and Andy.


As Dustin pointed out, the "Center" in the new mixer is designed to do really whatever you want. You can combine and mix signals to generate it, you and use it as a single channel, unlinked pass through from unmixed/processed sources, or you not use it at all. It all depends on how you configure the mixer, and what your sources are.


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## pro-gon (Aug 14, 2017)

Thank you!
Some questions already sounded on this forum, but I would like to clarify:
- In the setup program on the mixer tab, the negative value of the input signal means that it is being mixed in the reverse phase?;
- in the crossover settings appeared filter type "Allpass", how it works?;
- "Frequency Chart" does not display changes in crossovers, and the icons for the selection of the displayed channels are constantly shifted when the window size is changed (win10x64 full HD, display problems are the same as for the program to 6to8);
- Does MOS prepare a response for Fischer with their "HEC HD-AUDIO USB-INTERFACE"?
Thankful in advance for answers, and I'm sorry for my English!


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## jj8888 (Oct 5, 2017)

No more update? Everybody are busy?


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

I’m wondering about the progress of the updated software?


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## tonny (Dec 4, 2010)

Nothing wrong with the current software, and my 8to12 is still working perfect!


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

tonny said:


> Nothing wrong with the current software, and my 8to12 is still working perfect!


Agreed


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

Just wondering what the current version of the 8to12 Aerospace firmware/software is? 

I'm currently running software v2.1.26.0 and firmware v1.40. I can't find anywhere on the Mosconi site (US or EUR) that lists the most current release. There is just an exe link but it doesn't say what versions.


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## Hammer1 (Jan 30, 2011)

TomT said:


> Just wondering what the current version of the 8to12 Aerospace firmware/software is?
> 
> I'm currently running software v2.1.26.0 and firmware v1.40. I can't find anywhere on the Mosconi site (US or EUR) that lists the most current release. There is just an exe link but it doesn't say what versions.


That is the current version of software / firmware


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## TomT (May 19, 2005)

Hammer1 said:


> That is the current version of software / firmware


Thanks


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

All updates are automatic, as long as your tuning computer is connected to the internet. If there is a software update available, it'll alert you, and the same goes for firmware.


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## arashi01 (Sep 5, 2013)

Trying to decide between the 8to12 Pro and Aerospace. The input signal will be 48 kHz 24-bit optical from a Trioma MOST-toslink 2.2 interface. 

Is there any real benefit to the Aerospace if input sample rate is not higher than 96 kHz, and one doesn't need the digital out?

From what I can tell, main differences are:

Better DAC on Aerospace. (118 dB Dynamic Range and -98 dB THD+N on Aerospace vs 112 dB Dynamic range and -94 dB THD+N on Pro)
Better channel separation on Aerospace (>80dB @ 10KHz vs >70dB)
Aerospace has additional digital output

Is the better DAC and slightly better SNR and Dynamic Range actually noticeable between the two?


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