# BIG 3 DONE, Lights dim, amp cuts off at 13v



## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

ok so i done some trouble shooting to figure out why im still getting voltage drops, light dimming, and why my subs turn off when i play heavy bass songs, and this is what i came across

so today i measured for bad grounds, first i measured the battery with the car off, 12.6volts.

secound i measured from the neg side of batt post to chassis ground, got 0.01 as a reading on the DMM, so that means mininum resistance which is good right?

i turned my car on, turned on the wiper blades front and rear, turned high beams and headlights on, and put my heater on MAX

i put my HU to about 26/35 and measured the battery and it never went less than 13volts

so with everything still on, i measured the power cable and ground cable AT THE AMP, same reading 13-14 volts

this is the part where im confused, so with all that being done, my lights still dim, and when the heavy bass drops when im driving and listening to music, my amp seems like it cut offs, but the green light always stays on, so really its just my subs that cut off for like 1-3 seconds

so is it a bad ground at the amp? i have 17 feet of power cable and im running 1200 watts, do i need to upgrade my power wire to 2 gauge? Should i be worried that this will ruin my amp?

any other places i should meaure with my DMM? 

heres a little background info

-harbor freight tool DMM, CEN-TECH model for $3
-1995 ford explorer
-130-140 amp alternator
-BIG 3, 4 gauge everywhere
-4 gauge amp kit from ebay
-Hifonics BXI1210D 1200 watts at 1 ohm, setted gains with DMM also and measured for 34.0 volts instead of 34.46 volts.
-2 12" pioneer subs 400 wrms per sub
-kenwood mpc 205 HU, 2 volt pre-outs 

thanks guys for all feed back


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

Try wiring your amp for load of 2 or 4ohm.... 1ohm is "too good" for your power supply system to catch up.


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## Thunderplains (Sep 6, 2009)

TK

A few things..

Big 3 at 4 gauge, not bad, will help (There is a bunch of people who also think otherwise)

Things to think about, Your battery, same one since 95? Your Alt is fine for that amp.

I would do this. MAKE SURE your amp is RATED for 1 Ohm not just 1 Ohm stable, big difference. If it's 1 Ohm stable, pushing it hard might make it kick off to protect itself.
Second, I would upgrade from battery to amp the power and the ground to 2 Ga, YES.
I feel that 4Ga might be a tad on the small side.
If you still have issues with your lights dimming AFTER upgrading your power & ground, upgrade to a deep cell battery (Optima Yellow, Odyessy Red or even a Diehard platinum from sears (made by Odyessy, same as their red) Rememeber all your accessories and your amp is pulling from battery. Also, I would not go down the "Capacitor" route until you address the battery first.
SPL (Thump) rather than SQL is all about power and power supply.

Hope this helps..


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## nineball (Jan 17, 2008)

forget optima. years ago they were much better than they are today. the sears platinum is an agm battery under $200 with a 4 year warranty. 

forget capacitors. they will do nothing more than put an additional strain on your charging system.


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

thanks guys for the fast response, as for my battery, i have a everstart maxx 1000 cca in the front, higher end walmart brand.

i hear to much contraversy about caps, but in my case i think i need one

I hear they arent good to use, but i also hear if i barely get light dimming isssues i should be okto use one, my system voltage drops only occur 3 times typically at full tilt when i play a 4 min song, those 3 times is the hook of the song, where the bass just drops excessively and thats why my dash voltmeter drops a quarter down to low when it happens

so would a capacitor and 2 gauge wiring be ok? would it cause more harm than good to my amp, and fry it?


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## nineball (Jan 17, 2008)

this is a repost but i forget where it is on this site.


After studying a little history on large 1 Farad capacitors in car audio, you'd be amazed that they even sell at all. How useful are they? What do they really do? Will a Cap 'improve' my sound quality? Will it Prevent my lights from dimming? Will it audibly affect my audio system in any way?

Before you get the truth to any of the above questions, chances are, you've probably spent $100 or more on one of these devices. However, let's study a little history regarding this issue.

A long time ago, in a land far away, 2 elves...Ok, Richard Clark & Wayne Harris (Carsound magazine and the inventor of DB Drag, respectively) separately came up with a solution to preventing their lights from dimming.

WHO WERE THESE GUYZ?

As you may know, Richard Clark is one of the founders of autosound2000 Tech Briefs, Carsound magazine, and a published author of the industry of mobile electronics. In SQ competitions, he posted a record of 1234 1st place finishes, and only ended up NOT 1st in his first event. I've heard that he had minor system problems, but judging by his record, he must have corrected it. (evidently, he needed a Capacitor )

Wayne Harris was previously a leader at Rockford Fosgate in their development. Later, in his free time, he created the organization we call DB DRAG. Wayne was the first SQ World Champion from the organization we know as IASCA (International AutoSound Challenge Association).

Both of these gurus are both legends, and considered the leading experts in the field. During their competition days, both guyz came up with a way to assist in the prevention of voltage drops. In SQ competitions, the look of your system is actually more important than the sound, and having your lights NOT dim under high playing levels is a competitive advantage.

As you may know, amplifiers are made up a bank of little capacitors, resistors, etc. What has been common engineering knowledge is that capacitors store energy, and more or bigger ones assist in balancing the power supply.

Wayne came up with the idea of putting several dozen 'little' (approx 100uF) capacitors on a circuit board to 'extend' the power supplies storage. At about the same time, or shortly afterward, Richard came up with the idea of one huge mondo capacitor (I believe it was 800,000uF or 0.8F) to do the job.

Eventually, Richard won. The large cylindrical tubes won over the complicated 48 caps strapped to a circuit board. However, what did this really accomplish? Let's start here:

WHAT IS A CAPACITOR?

Basically, capacitors are an energy storage device. Large, 1 Farad or more
capacitors store energy (electrons) between their plates. Capacitors differ
from batteries because batteries store energy in the form of chemical
energy--and rely on acid and lead plates, as the place of storage. For a more detailed
description of a capacitor, go here:

http://www.eatel.net/~amptech/elecdisc/caraudio.htm

Then on the right hand side, scroll down to CAPACITOR. Keep in mind the use
of capacitors in an audio system.

WHY DO PEOPLE BUY CAPACITORS?

The number 1 reason would have to be because their lights dim when their
system is playing HARD. In car audio, we are told that a capacitor is
designed to prevent the voltage drop associated with your lights dimming.
The number2 reason is that it is rumored to 'improve' sound quality or
'stiffen' the power supply/source.

WHY DO MY LIGHTS DIM?

Headlights brightness is in direct proportion to the source voltage. For
instance, if your car is running, system voltage is ~12.5 -14.4 VOLTS. Your
lights will be much brighter than when your car is turned off--where battery
voltage is ~12V. Most car alternators put out between 75 to 120 amps of
current. When this current draw threshold of the charging system is
exceeded, system voltage will drop as power demands are now shared by the
alternator and the storage devices (battery & cap). We are using battery
reserves beyond this point until the demand lessens

When playing your system really hard. Your lights dim because your
alternator can't keep up it's charging voltage (around 13.5V) and therefore,
demand exceeds output. When this happens, your electronic devices are
dipping into the power storage of the battery. Since the battery stores
power at ~ 12-12.5V, there is a 1.3 to 1.8V drop in voltage available. This
in turn is why your lights dim down.

HOW MUCH POWER DOES A CAPACITOR STORE?

1 Farad = 100 joules or 100W/second
850cca battery = ~2,200,000 farads

For storage purposes, you'd need ~2,200 1 Farad capacitors to equal the energy of your battery.

Due to its impedence (ESR & ESL), a cap's energy is only 50% available. What's worse, is that in order for a 1 Farad cap to discharge, first the alternator output must have maxed out, and the voltage must have dropped around 1.5 volts. But I thought a cap was supposed to prevent that (voltage drop)!!!!!????? Yep, you got the point.


IF A BATTERY = 2,200 CAPS, THEN WHY BUY A (PUNY) CAP?

My question exactly. Marketing is the reason why people buy caps. In many cases, upgrading wiring will help your system get the maximum transfer of current. Once that has been reached, adding a capacitor may have a minor effect on your system. 50W over the course of a second is not a lot of power considering an amplifier may draw 2000W to put out 1400 watts. Let's look at the situation from a resources standpoint.

Alternator 80 amps
Car accessories (minus stereo) 40 amps
A large Car Audio system (DRAWS ) ~200 amps AT FULL OUTPUT

In this case, you have 240 amps of draw, but only 80 amps of current from the alternator. In your case, you need 160 amps x 12 volts or or let's say 1920 watts of energy. Since a cap stores 50W, how much of a difference do you think it's going to make? A cap is basically a peashooter. W+e need a Howitzer cannon here, to do the job well.

Also, Once a cap is discharged, where does it get it's power from? The alternator, which is already overloaded. Once a cap is discharged, it's worthless. Like SWEZ says, ・.The cap already shot its wad, an does limp til recharged・ I知 not so certain I will allow him to babysit my kids, but you get the drift. (I never said it quiet like that... and oh...I'm great with kids!)

SO, WHAT IS A CAPACITOR GOOD FOR?

1. Audio Jewelry- impress chicks with large cylindrical shiny thingy
2. Extra weight in winter time
3. A very POOR... BUT expensive distribution block
4. A projectile in the event of a crash
5. Rolling pin--for cooking purposes
6. A neat thing to tell your friend, "..Hey man, lick the top of this..


Please do not try # 6. New hairstyles are always refreshing, but if you are wearing railroad tracks across your teeth, you might have one big filling after it痴 over.

HOW CAN CAPACITORS IMPROVE SOUND QUALITY?

They can't. Sound quality is not dependant upon the presence of large bulky 1 Farad capacitors. How many 1 Farad Capacitors do you think the Boston Pops, Aerosmith, or Snoop dog use in the recording studio?

IN A NUTSHELL.......

When Richard, our fearless inventor, became World renown for winning every competition under the sun, people began copying what he did. Soon, every 'serious' competitor had a 'stiffening' capacitor--not to be confused with the 'loosening' capacitor.

WHY?

In the late 80s, people began sticking out their tongue when dunking the basketball because Michael Jordan did. Did sticking out your tongue improve your dunking ability? Same here with adding a capacitor to your electrical system.

STILL A GLUTTON FOR MORE PUNISHMENT?

Here's the Original Cap Debate.

http://www.carsound.com/ubb/Archives...-1-000307.html

Phoenix Gold's marketing guru had just posted information on how their Powercore (basically the Alumapro CAP15 in a Phoenix shell) had both stabilized their voltage and improved the sound quality. Richard called him on it (all in another post) and the marketing geek was unable to quantify any of the conditions that resulted in the voltage being HELD at 14.2V and the 'improved' sound quality.

Please do not read every stinking post as valid. There are a lot of people that have had the efficacy of capacitors inbred to their minds, and were not (and still not) convinced in the futility of a 1 Farad storage device.

In a final note, Richard relayed a quote regarding battcaps ( www.battcap.net ) as, "..The audio industry is the only place i know of where you can publish specs that show your product is useless and still be able to sell them------and whats worse is that technically ignorant people will argue against the math!!!!!!!..............RC.." when referring to the product. This also relates to most digital readout capacitors, and I wish my Archie Bunker skills could have said it better myself.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

:inout:


:lurk:


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## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

I have to get in the mill, but will say that battery is junk. my son has gone through 3 of them. can tell you story later. work calls!


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## TrickyRicky (Apr 5, 2009)

First the amp isn't going to get damage. It has protection circuits. Which means if voltage droppes then the amp cuts off, then cuts back on after a few seconds.

Second you should rewire the subs to have a higher load like 4ohms atleast. Then try it again with loud music (you will notice some power loss, but not much. But will also notice better sound). After this is done and your amp still cuts off, then you would need to upgrade your alternator and battery. The alternator is stock and the 130-amps it produces is pretty much for stock electronics. If your amp pulls about 60-80 amps then upgrade to a 200+ alternator and a AGM battery. And you will notice quick and instant results.

PS: Wouldnt hurt to use 1/0 gauge wire, but for 1200watts 4 gauge should be fine.


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

so i shouldnt get a cap, even for small voltage drops?


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

thanks guys


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

TrickyRicky said:


> First the amp isn't going to get damage. It has protection circuits. Which means if voltage droppes then the amp cuts off, then cuts back on after a few seconds.


when you drink too much you pass out, this is your bodies protection to keep you from drinking more, you puke to expel the excess alcohol, again more protection.

If you repeat experimenting with these protection mechanisms you will die an early death. Protection is there to let you know that you are being a dumbass.


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## starboy869 (Dec 16, 2006)

I would check into something like a batcap300 or 400 or something more than 1f for a cap. However i would try a good under the hood battery like stinger, or one of the above mentioned brands first.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

battcap 300/400 are just supercaps in series/parallel, bunches of them.... from there up you are looking at simple SLA batteries.


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

^Chad, sometimes I just love you..... That's why I stopped drinking..... 
What a joke, you know your amp is going to protect and want to continue to test its protection. Make it another simple example : your main fuse blown for unknown reason, you replace it and it blows again. Do you want to replace it again or check the wiring?


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

lucky my amp has never went into protect at all, i would know if i saw the red light come on.

some times my amp seems like it cuts out at high volume, but one day i was watching the 2 led lights on amp, and when i cranked my volume to 26/35 i stared at the lights and my subs cut out for like 1-3 secs, but my amps green light stayed on.

any idea what that is?


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## SoundChaser (Apr 3, 2009)

kyheng said:


> ^Chad, sometimes I just love you..... That's why I stopped drinking.....
> What a joke, you know your amp is going to protect and want to continue to test its protection. Make it another simple example : your main fuse blown for unknown reason, you replace it and it blows again. Do you want to replace it again or check the wiring?


Just wrap some tinfoil around that there darn fuse! :laugh:


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

and btw chad, thanks for explainin to me in a noob perspective, peferct for me to understand


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

what if i got a 3-9 farad cap? would higher farads necessarily mean that its going to work better?


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

thizzkid said:


> lucky my amp has never went into protect at all, i would know if i saw the red light come on.
> 
> some times my amp seems like it cuts out at high volume, but one day i was watching the 2 led lights on amp, and when i cranked my volume to 26/35 i stared at the lights and my subs cut out for like 1-3 secs, but my amps green light stayed on.
> 
> any idea what that is?





thizzkid said:


> and why my subs turn off when i play heavy bass songs,
> 
> my amp seems like it cut offs, but the green light always stays on, so really its just my subs that cut off for like 1-3 seconds



Amplifier protection, that's what it is.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

thizzkid said:


> what if i got a 3-9 farad cap? would higher farads necessarily mean that its going to work better?


wire the amp to 4 ohms, you gots caps on the brain mang.

You are paying WAY too much attention to a fictitious power number derived by a marketing department that does not understand voltage sag.


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

ok head away from caps, will do...

so when the sub cuts-out, thats what you guys call protection mode,

i thought protection mode was when the amp restarts itself and the redlight comes on, and you have to restart your deck


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

thizzkid : That's another kind of protection mode. You have to check on your amp's manual. Like JL Audio is reducing the output back to safe operating mode.
But still, you got red lights turned on = you need to check your setup. 
Just see your setup(my bad), maybe can consider power 1 sub only at its highest impedance? 
Just before I forgot, frequencies will change the impedance.

If really want to use the cap to solve your lights dimming and amp goes to protection mode, the value you need is 1000farad.


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

RMS Power Output: 1 x 450 W @ 4 Ohms 

my subs are 400 wrms each, so 4 ohms wouldnt make sense


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

thizzkid said:


> RMS Power Output: 1 x 450 W @ 4 Ohms
> 
> my subs are 400 wrms each, so 4 ohms wouldnt make sense


no you are not making sense.

they HANDLE 400W applying LESS THAN 400 watts is still in the safe operating area, applying less is not like dividing by zero.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

kyheng said:


> the value you need is 1000farad.


:laugh:


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

im sorry i dont think you understood me,

my amp is rated at 

RMS Power Output: 1 x 450 W @ 4 Ohms 
RMS Power Output: 1 x 900 W @ 2 Ohms 
RMS Power Output: 1 x 1200 W @ 1 Ohm 

i have 2 12" pioneer w308D4 400 wrms per sub, 1400 watts max peak power per sub

i have both subs wired at 1 ohm final impedance

both subs at 4 ohm final impedance wouldnt be ideal since i dont want to underpower them, perfect for 1 sub perhaps


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

thizzkid said:


> both subs at 4 ohm final impedance wouldnt be ideal, perfect for 1 sub perhaps


says who?
you did not understand me...

See how it went from 900 to 1200 from 2 ohms to 1 ohm? this is a representative example that the power supply is ****ting it's pants because it cannot even make CLOSE to double the output. wire it to 4 ohms, you are likely never seeing 1200W into those subs due to sag, it will work just fine. 

Stop looking at numbers and use your ears, you are willing to toss money at a situation that can be solved possibly by 10 minutes on a quick re-wire and 5 minutes int eh drivers seat.

5 bucks says it sounds better and is possibly more dynamic.


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

chad : I know that's an insane value, but if I were really to get such junk, this is the value I will be getting. Atleast it can last me for 30seconds. I don't want something that will support me for 1-2 seconds.
I guess at 1ohm, I doubt the amp is pushing that 1200W to the subs, looks like is more on being a boiler.....

thizzkid : If this is the case, run 1 sub. I feel it is much easier to run 1 sub in a bigger enclosure. The concept of more is better is wrong.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

cubdenno said:


> I have to get in the mill, but will say that battery is junk. my son has gone through 3 of them. can tell you story later. work calls!


Funny you say that because everyone I know personally has had nothing but good luck out of them. Now the entry level Neverstarts are junk. Previous owner put 2 deepcycles and a cranking battery in my boat at the end of last year before he traded it in and the replacements will be the MAXX unless I can get a good deal on a couple Interstates. Don't mind having a ****ty battery for cranking as long as there's at least one good one to jump over to if needed.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

It's NOT THE CASE, NOBODY EVER said that a sub's ideal usage is on the ragged edge of it POWER HANDLING CAPACITY... that number is something you don't wanna push, it's CAPACITY. 

It's like flooring your car at every stoplight, you just don't do that.


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

so your telling me to wire my subs into 4 ohms cause it would sound better? it must be to early or something (9am pst). Darn i hate to ask, but no question is a dumb question so ima shoot.

if i put both subs at 1 ohm isint that suppose to give my subs all the power the amp can handle? if so, how is wiring both subs to 4 ohms, which is only giving both subs 225 wrms,gonna make my setup better and dynamic?


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

wire them to a 4 ohms final impedance.

I'm assuming that they are either single coil 2 ohm or dual coil 4 ohm each.

First scenario, wire them in series

Second scenario, wire each dual coil driver in series for 8 ohms then parallel the 2 speakers for a net of 4 ohms total load.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

thizzkid said:


> if i put both subs at 1 ohm isint that suppose to give my subs all the power the amp can handle?


It's painfully obvious that the amplifier cannot handle the final impedance it's seeing now.


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## kyheng (Jan 31, 2007)

Make it a simple test and do it on night : run your amp at 4ohm and Basstronic's Bass, I love you for 3 times repeating. Then put your hand on the amp.
Next, run the amp for 1ohm and 3 times the same song, also put your hand on the amp. 

Then you will know why I insist on running the amp on higher impedance.


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

ok ill put my subs back to 4 ohms and see what it does to troubleshooting purposes, hopefully i see what your trying to point out, but ill let you guys know what happens, im bout to do it right now


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

my amp doesnt get warm at 1 ohm btw, for my amp to even get close to warm, i have to play for like a hour straight, literally a flourecent tubing lightbulb gets hotter


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

a speaker is not purely resistive, it's resistance is not X ohms, it's IMPEDANCE is a NOMINAL X ohms, Impedance meaning that it's reactive. lets say at some frequency the each 4 ohm coil may dip to say 3 ohms... Not uncommon, when all of them piled up on the amp in parallel the resultant load presented to the amplifier would be .75 ohms at said frequency... the amp is crow-barring.


Stop looking at numbers and use your ears.


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## falkenbd (Aug 16, 2008)

thizzkid said:


> so your telling me to wire my subs into 4 ohms cause it would sound better? it must be to early or something (9am pst). Darn i hate to ask, but no question is a dumb question so ima shoot.
> 
> if i put both subs at 1 ohm isint that suppose to give my subs all the power the amp can handle? if so, how is wiring both subs to 4 ohms, which is only giving both subs 225 wrms,gonna make my setup better and dynamic?


you really aren't that willing to try it?

chad gave you the answers - your amp won't be ****ting its pants was one way he said it.

and currently you said your sound is cutting out? seems to me like I'd want to avoid that at all costs, can't sound very good....


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## thizzkid (Mar 17, 2010)

falkenbd said:


> and currently you said your sound is cutting out? seems to me like I'd want to avoid that at all costs, can't sound very good....


i assumed it was a bad ground or something, i heard from people that i should measure my ground spots with a DMM and see if theres voltage drops

dont get me wrong ill try it, its kinda mind boggling, never had my subs at 4 ohms on this amp before, cant wait to see what will happen


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

thizzkid said:


> i assumed it was a bad ground or something, i heard from people that i should measure my ground spots with a DMM and see if theres voltage drops


you cannot measure resistance accurately of a ground because it's not under load, it will always look pretty darn good, after you put a ton of stress on it then it can break down. NOW measuring the voltage DIFFERENCE between the amp's ground terminal and the neg battery terminal or where the main ground hits the car will tell you a different story. But sufficed to say if the voltage at the amp terminals is equal to or close to that of the voltage of the battery terminals, under load (amplifier load) then the ground is not the problem.


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## cubdenno (Nov 10, 2007)

Listen to Chad!! Wire the subs to 4 ohm load for amp and see if it cuts out. Am curious if you have gain on sub amp set to high as well so when you are playing loud and bass heavy song it is doing exactly what Chad is telling you is happening.

As for the battery, I bought the boy a MAXX battery after reading up on them. Something about cold weather, if the temp was below 25 degrees, the battery would not start his car. Left him stranded a couple of times. Traded it in and cold spell hit. Kid is stranded. battery would not hold a charge. Took it back (kind of, bought a second from a different store as I was out of town and had the receipt) It did it again. Now that it is warmer, no issues. But i have two of those dang batteries.We will see what happens.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

Never had that problem out of them down here in Arkansas. It got down into the teens on several occasions as well. That said, I'll probably do Interstate and call it a day.


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## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

Simple, you measure the voltage at the amp under max load. This is easier with a meter that records min/max. If the voltage drops to near 10v for most amps they will shut off. If not you don't have a ground or wiring or supply problem.

So, is it protecting? It might because you are running minimum load. So wire it to higher ohms and beat it hard. Does it stay on? If so you need a different amp that _can_ run it at 1 ohm if that is what you want. Or you can investigate changing the enclosure and/or subs and/or crossover to change the ohm load a little higher to possibly make it work with this amp. Lastly, maybe the amp is a little off hard to say. Maybe your subs are toasted a little and it lowered the ohms, those can be factors. Note I'm not into spl, but the impedance can be manipulated so the amp sees more.


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## Robb (Dec 5, 2008)

TrickyRicky said:


> Second you should rewire the subs to have a higher load like 4ohms atleast. Then try it again with loud music (you will notice some power loss, but not much. But will also notice better sound). After this is done and your amp still cuts off, then you would need to upgrade your alternator and battery. The alternator is stock and the 130-amps it produces is pretty much for stock electronics. If your amp pulls about 60-80 amps then upgrade to a 200+ alternator and a AGM battery. And you will notice quick and instant results.
> 
> PS: Wouldnt hurt to use 1/0 gauge wire, but for 1200watts 4 gauge should be fine.


Yes do what this man says and change the alternator for a High Output one !
It's simple and basic...
If there's not enough current produced at engine idle, you will get dimming !


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## SQfreak (Feb 13, 2007)

Reading this thread is taking me back in time when I thought the max ratings for amps were the real values for output.


thizzkid, everyone is just trying to get you to think outside of what you think you know about your amp and how it works. This is one of the first steps to make when you join this forum. Chad has written the best advice you will ever get on here "Stop looking at numbers and use your ears" It's so true. Specs are just a very general guide not the entire map.


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Robb said:


> Yes do what this man says and change the alternator for a High Output one !
> It's simple and basic...
> If there's not enough current produced at engine idle, you will get dimming !


Someone left the door open to the moron cage and they travel in pairs.


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## el_chupo_ (May 27, 2007)

chad said:


> Someone left the door open to the moron cage and they travel in pairs.


That is sig quality right there.


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## sqshoestring (Jun 19, 2007)

I tend to not run huge amps so I don't care, but if you run higher ohm load on your subs sure you lose a little output....but also most amps are more efficient there (if Chad didn't post that) so you save a fair amount of power doing that for not much loss in actual dB. If you have the room and funds it is better to run subs that way; less 12v power used per watt to the sub and possibly a hair more SQ but typically not enough to hear.

(I don't care if I run 2 ohms is what I meant, as I don't get dimming issues )


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## chad (Jun 30, 2005)

Going that low in impedance you lose A LOT of what you gain on paper from voltage sag and power compression, both are bad things.

The numbers can be shocking.... as in the SAME sometimes.


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