# Audi RS5 Build (updated again - September 2022)... Brax, Utopia, Esotar... Oh My!



## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I bought a new Audi RS5, last summer. Originally, I wasn't going to touch the stereo... but the bug got hold of me!









As with all my previous builds, I have 3 main criteria:

Sound Quality (the best I can get, with what I have to work with).
Stealth Installation (I don't want to see any of the system).
Full Integration with the Vehicle's System.
** There's been a number of updates to this original build. 
Updates start on page: 5









Audi RS5 Build (updated again)... Brax, Utopia...


What did you use for remote in? I have done a fair bit of searching, other than tapping into the fusebox I didn't see any wires I could use in the trunk area. Might have to actually get the FSM and look it up. I'm not sure I fully understand the question, but let me tell you the chain for remote...




www.diymobileaudio.com




*


Here's the components, along with the few install pictures I did take:

Integration into the Audi (MOST150) fibre optic MMI system is handled by a NAV-TV Zen-V unit:









The Zen-V then feeds a Toslink signal into a Helix DSP-Ultra:









The Ultra then feeds 4 Audison amps. I'm using Class D amps for this build. My goal is: full stealth, and no heat.

SR 4.500 feeds the front tweeters and the front midrange
SR 4.500 feeds the front midbass (bridged)
SR 4.500 feeds the rear door tweeters and midrange
SR 1.500 feeds the sub











Front tweeters are: Audison Thesis Violino II
Front midrange are: Dynaudio Esotar 430
Front midbass are: Audio Development W800-NEO










Rear Doors (because I often have people in the back seat) are:

Sinfoni Tempo 10 tweeters
Dynaudio Esotar 650 midrange










Sub is: Hertz Mille Legend ML2500.3









The full system, laid-out on my garage floor.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

The Thesis tweeters are mounted in the dash, facing upwards toward the windshield. This location originally had an OEM 3" midrange driver.
I was apprehensive about putting them in this location, but after firing the system up and tuning, I am absolutely stunned at how good they sound!
They're a magnificent tweeter, and I honestly don't feel like I'm losing much (if anything) by mounting them where they are.
I'm sure a set of custom pods would improve the sound slightly... but my goal was full stealth:









They were a pain to get in there... pretty sure I'll never get them out (without removing the dash).









It's pretty much never, that I can brag about stuffing 8 inches of anything into anything...
But I can happily report that my W800-NEO's fit perfectly into the Audi door's OEM location.
Extension rings were made from MDF, and then primed, and then painted with two coats of Plasti-Dip.









I didn't take any pictures of the Esotar 430's, but they are mounted onto the back-side of the door skin with custom brackets that I had a friend (with a shop) make for me.
Shoutout to: SoundsGood Auto Services Inc. Metro Vancouver, BC

This area (circled in red) is molded into the steel of the door, to accomadate the OEM midrange depth. It also is just deep enough to fit an Esotar driver!









The doors are all covered with Noico 80mil CLD sound deadener - yes, I used Noico. I had a pile of it leftover from previous builds.
The inner door skins are treated with Noico Closed-Cell PE foam deadener.


Factory integration was a nightmare in this car...
Typically, you would just unplug the fiber MOST cable from the factory amp in the trunk, and plug it into the Zen-V...
But Audi updated their MMI for 2021, and the brain unit (with the fibre access point) is located behind the glove box. So it all had to come out.
I also had to run a fiber line from the glove box, back to the rear of the car (where my Zen-V is located):









Here's the splitter cable, coming from the feed and then going into the MMI brain unit, and also feeding out to the line going to my trunk:









The Helix DSP is located in the spot where the factory amp was (behind the driver's side rear wheel):
The Zen-V is also tucked in there... but you can't see it.









On the passenger side rear wheel; is where the stealth sub enclosure is.
It's a custom enclosure, made by Basser (in Poland). He built it and shipped it cheaper than I could even buy the material for!





Basser - FBaudi11 Audi A5/S5 (F5) Sportback 2 Fit-Box subwoofer enclosure


FBaudi11 Audi A5/S5 (F5) Sportback 2 Fit Box subwoofer enclosure Fit box subwoofer enclosure is the ideal way to improve bass in the car. By matching to the vehicle takes little




sklep.basser.pl













I stuffed it with Poly-Fil to compensate for the fact that the enclosure is slightly undersized for the sub.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Back doors have Sinfoni Tempo 10 Tweeters, and Dynaudio Esotar 650 mids.
Total overkill for rear fill... but I had them sitting around from a previous build, so I used them here.








I used Noico butyl sound deadener on the steel frame of the doors, and Noico foam on the inner door skins (the foam is mainly to eliminate rattles)








I also put quick disconnect plugs on the tweeter leads (dangling on the left-hand side), in case I need to pull the doorskins off - they can easily unplug.









Now back to the stealth sub;
I drilled holes into the steel chassis, and inserted Riv-Nuts to hold the sub in place.
Then cut 5" lengths of threaded rod, and inserted them into the Riv-Nuts:
Also ran a length of 12awg wire from the amp area, to feed the sub.









Slipped the threaded rod through the pre-drilled mounting holes:









And secured it with Allen Cap Bolts:









Worked out great. That sucker is in there tight! Give it a tug... it's solid. Not going anywhere.
Also note that Basser has pre-cut a notch in the lower right corner, to retain the factory 12V power outlet.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Thanks to Amazon for the cardboard... I used it to make a template for the amp rack:









Amps and DSP sit perfectly flush underneath the floor piece.









I also made my own RCA's. They are all cut to size, to fit the application:








Super tidy... I'll never go back to regular store bought RCA's again.










OK... so the Audison amps lasted all of 3 months (my threshold for changing amps is sh!tty)
With that said; I do believe I may have hit Amplifier Xanadu with this new setup. Can't see myself swapping these out... ever.









Relocated the Helix DSP and the Zen-V back to the side cubby in the trunk:









And mounted a Zapco mono amp under the amp rack, for the sub. I've had this amp sitting in my basement for about 10 years... glad to finally use it!









Because of the long chassis covering the lugs; you have to wire these Brax amps upside down.









And the finished product:









Everything buttoned back up. Cover down... Fully stealth. I'm really please with how this turned out:


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

Wow this is outstanding! I've seen gut shots of those Audison amps they look pretty nice. The little compartments are really cool i cant believe you fit everything in there..


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

cman said:


> Wow this is outstanding! I've seen gut shots of those Audison amps they look pretty nice. The little compartments are really cool i cant believe you fit everything in there..


Class D amps have come a long way. 
These Audison amps are VERY nice sounding. I give them THREE thumbs up!
They're solid too. The whole thing is aluminum. No plastic.








SR 4.500 | Audison - car audio processors, amplifiers and speakers







www.audison.eu












SR 1.500 | Audison - car audio processors, amplifiers and speakers







www.audison.eu





And before anyone asks... I would say; _"yes, they sound as good as my old MMATS amps"_.


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

From one AUDI owner to another I say bravo…..


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

Dang talk about an interesting way to update the thread! 

Surprising the box could be built and shipped for that cheap!


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## slowride (Jan 26, 2009)

JimmyDee said:


> Class D amps have come a long way.
> These Audison amps are VERY nice sounding. I give them THREE thumbs up!
> They're solid too. The whole thing is aluminum. No plastic.
> 
> ...


I was intrigued by these as audison has seem to fall out of favor here on this forum


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

That's come out really nice


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

Really, really impressive work! The rivnut/threaded rod combo is genius! Also, thanks for posting the effort needed for the Violino tweets, I just picked up a set and was considering putting them in the same location.


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## audiocholic (Dec 5, 2016)

wonderful car,great components and a well thought out install, hope all turns out amazing for a fellow member.


just kindly wanted to ask though wont the 4.500 being bridged yielding +450rms on an already super efficient 8inch midbass going to be overpowering the 10inch subwoofer barely recieving 500rms?

why not go:

1 x 4.500 bridged to front midbasses
2 x 5.600 with the total 8 stereo channels powering rear mid+ tweeter,front midranges + tweeters and 2 sub channels powering a dual 2ohm subwoofer 

that way you would actually cut down to 3 amps instead of 4,still have adequate power for stereo yet have 1100rms going to your sub duty instead of 500 with a more balanced front end/sub.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

audiocholic said:


> why not go:
> 1 x 4.500 bridged to front midbasses
> 2 x 5.600 with the total 8 stereo channels powering rear mid+ tweeter,front midranges + tweeters and 2 sub channels powering a dual 2ohm subwoofer


For anyone who has followed me... I tend to try a lot of new gear, and swap-out equipment often.
Then I hate selling the used stuff afterward - based on bad experiences.
Sell a guy a 6 month old amp for half price, and he still finds something to complain about... pisses me off, so I don't do it anymore.
Then, I end-up with a basement full of high-end equipment, just sitting around. Which pisses my wife off...

I already owned all of the speakers (from previous builds) and wanted to use them on this vehicle.
I mean, let's be honest; an Esotar 650 and Tempo 10 tweeter is WAY overkill for rear fill... but I had them sitting around for years.

Ya, the bridged amp to the front midbass might also be overkill... but that's where proper tuning comes into play.
Everything is blended nicely. The sub gets plenty enough power from that 1.500 amp.
It's a crazy loud system. Crystal clear. And none of the amps barely even get warm... that's what I wanted.

I have a friend who is an Audison dealer, and he gave me a great deal on those amps.
Shoutout to: SoundsGood Auto Services Inc. Metro Vancouver, BC


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## AudioGal (Oct 16, 2019)

JimmyDee said:


> I want to give a huge shout-out to @AudioGal for tuning my system. She is an absolute Wizard!
> Can't thank her enough... it sounds incredible! Way beyond what I was expecting. Tuning is what makes the system.



My pleasure JimmyDee , it was awesome being able to enjoy the massaging seat while tuning!!!

I am super happy that the system met your expectations. It turned out very nice !!


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## oldieHawn (Mar 31, 2021)

Dreamy build. Any plans to mod the rs5 beyond audio?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

oldieHawn said:


> Any plans to mod the rs5 beyond audio?



Today, I say; "No". 
But I also said I wasn't going to do a stereo in this vehicle...

The car is fully loaded... and stupidly fast already.


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Yes, so leave it be ha ha ha.


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## Audi-A3 (Jul 18, 2021)

Looks like a great build. sweet car as well, Have to love Audi for not making things easy.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Audi-A3 said:


> Have to love Audi for not making things easy.


They did seem to over-complicate it. 
With that said; it's a massive upgrade over any of their previous MMI's... but not installer friendly.

But let's be honest; when they were designing it, I'm sure the last thing on their mind was: _"how do make this easy for some chump to tap into, so he can beef-up the stereo..."_


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

JimmyDee said:


> Sell a guy a 6 month old amp for half price, and he still finds something to complain about... pisses me off, so I don't do it anymore.
> Then, I end-up with a basement full of high-end equipment, just sitting around. Which pisses my wife off...


I'll take that deal and you'll never hear from me again! Might hear the car though.


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## JohnnyOhh (Feb 19, 2015)

Neeeeeeat!


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Updated the amp rack today...


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

Pics or it didn't happen...


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

mumbles said:


> Pics or it didn't happen...


The new amp rack update and pics are at the end of my Post #4...








Audi RS5 Build (updated again - September 2022)... Brax...


I bought a new Audi RS5, last summer. Originally, I wasn't going to touch the stereo... but the bug got hold of me! As with all my previous builds, I have 3 main criteria: Sound Quality (the best I can get, with what I have to work with). Stealth Installation (I don't want to see any of the...




www.diymobileaudio.com





But here's a recap picture of the finished rack:


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Also finished the back doors today... pics updated in Post #3


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## cman (Aug 24, 2020)

I love the amp rack and custom RCAs... Its more work but sometimes it takes doing something done one way to realize you want it another way. Amp rack V2 is sweet!

I did mw own RCAs as well..a little tedious but after the first few it gets easier.. i noticed a little flux or flux core solder makes a strong bond pretty easy.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I believe I'm pretty-much done this project...
Sounds incredible! I'm really pleased with how it turned out.


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

Great build! I am sure it sounds incredible. About to start my own audio upgrade on a 2018 A6 with the base system. Do you feel the stock speaker locations are adequate for a good 3 way SQ build? The mid range speaker is the one I am concerned with most. Was thinking about modding the a pillars with aluminum pods or full custom fiberglass, but if in your opinion the stock locations sound good I would prefer the stealth factory look. This is my daily driver so does not have to be competition worthy just want it to sound really good. Also, did you run new wire through the doors? If yes how did you get the wires through the plugs?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

The stock locations are fine. I was concerned about putting the tweeters in the dash (far away from the mids), but with proper tuning it blends nicely. The mid location in the door is totally fine.

I'm in the same boat. This is a daily driver car... and a $100k one at that, so I didn't want to mess with the interior. Plus, stealth builds are cool!

The beauty with Audi doors, is that they run two separate feeds of 16awg through the Molex to individually power the midrange and the midbass. You don't need to pull new wire through the Molex.

Sent from my SM-G991W using Tapatalk


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

JimmyDee said:


> The stock locations are fine. I was concerned about putting the tweeters in the dash (far away from the mids), but with proper tuning it blends nicely. The mid location in the door is totally fine.


i've looked at mimicking the mid location for my car. My wifes VW using a similar setup for the oem 3 way


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

Thanks for the feedback on the speaker staging. I am going to stick with the stock locations. 
The base stereo does not have a mid driver in the location so I may need to fabricate something to house it. You mentioned having a shop make a bracket to hold the mid. Did this attach to the door card or door itself?
Great news on the Molex plugs. I may use components in rear now since I dont need to run wires. I have a set of Hertz Mille coaxial and components from previous build so not a big deal using “too much” speaker in the rear fill. Would run them through passive crossover and tune with Helix DSP. The 3 way fronts will be active. 
Last question regarding the Nav TV Zen V unit. I am pretty sure I will be removing the dash head unit to hook up my Zen V. I have not found a factory amp to connect to. Should I try to locate Zen in the rear cubby hole (empty now) or do I need to leave in dash behind factory head unit and run a toslink back to DSP?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

StaudiA6 said:


> You mentioned having a shop make a bracket to hold the mid. Did this attach to the door card or door itself?


Yes. The mid is attached to the door card, and the bracket mounts from behind the speaker and holds it to the door card.


StaudiA6 said:


> Great news on the Molex plugs. I may use components in rear now since I dont need to run wires.


I should clarify; The FRONT DOORS have two sets of wires going into them, for the mid and midbass. The rear doors only have one set of wires, as the mid and tweeter are passive in the OEM system. I installed a passive crossover in the rear doors.


StaudiA6 said:


> Last question regarding the Nav TV Zen V unit. I am pretty sure I will be removing the dash head unit to hook up my Zen V. I have not found a factory amp to connect to. Should I try to locate Zen in the rear cubby hole (empty now) or do I need to leave in dash behind factory head unit and run a toslink back to DSP?


You can do either. I chose to run a MOST cable to the rear and locate the Zen-V back there, just to make it more accessible (in case anything went wrong with it and I had to pull it out). Trust me, you only want to pull your dash apart once...


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I ordered the MOST cable from AliExpress. You'll want to do this about 3 weeks in advance of starting the build, as it takes time to arrive from China.

The cable I ordered is 13 feet (400cm). That gets it from the glove box to the rear passenger side wheel well of the car, but is not long enough to get it to the opposite corner of the car. If your intention is to mount the Zen-V in the cubby behind the driver's side wheel well, then you'll need a longer cable (a 500cm cable should do it). Also, your A6 is a bit longer than my RS5, so you'll probably want to get a longer cable anyways (maybe 600cm?).








12.16US $ 5% OFF|Free Shipping Optical Fiber Cable Most Cable 400cm For Bmw Au-di Amp Bluetooth Car Gps Car Fiber Cable For Nbt Cic 2g 3g 3g+ - Radio - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com





You will also need a splitter cable. Unplug the MOST cable from the back of the head unit. Plug one side of this splitter into the head unit. Plug the OEM MOST cable into the other side. And plug your MOST extension cable into the 3rd side. This is the one I ordered:








7.65US $ 10% OFF|Free shipping MOST Optic Fiber Jumper Cable Multimedia Connectors 2 Female to 1 male For Audi BMW Benz Porsche Amplifier unit|Flex Cables| - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com





And, just in case you don't have time to get your Zen-V hooked up the same day you run the MOST cable. I would also recommend getting a MOST loop. You need to keep the MOST network connected, in order for the car to function. You would plug this onto the end of your MOST extension (in the trunk). It just keeps the MOST network running, and gives you time to come back and finish the project later. I'm a bit nuts, and tend to work non-stop, so I got everything done in one day and connected to the Zen-V in the trunk. But I bought one of these, just in case:








5.98US $ 5% OFF|New Female MOST Optical Optic Fiber Cable Loop Connector Diagnostic Device Tool Navigation Systems for VW Audi BMW Mercedes Benz|Radio| - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

I greatly appreciate your help on those questions. You saved me a ton of headache and trial and error! I will likely do the trunk mount DSP to improve serviceability. 
Looks like I have some fun weekends ahead of me over the next few months. I have all equipment in my possession now and will get misc wiring and sound proofing on the way. Will post progress as time permits. May have some questions along the way. This is my 2nd build the past year (prior builds 25 +yrs ago). Will be using XT style connectors for all interior speakers in case the upgrade bug hits me. After seeing what you put in your car I have a feeling that will happen someday.

Zen V
Helix DSP Pro MK2 with Director
Hertz MPK 163.3 Active 3 way
Hertz MPK 165.3 Passive
Phoenix Gold SX 800.4
Left 3 way and rear components
Phoenix Gold SX 800.4
Right 3 way and rear components
Phoenix Gold 1200.1
2 JL TW3 12” in sealed forward firing box

*Need to buy a hi-res player - TBD

Love my Audi. Great car to put business miles on!


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

StaudiA6 said:


> *Need to buy a hi-res player - TBD


You've got some nice equipment. No doubt, it'll sound great!

I don't like messing around with FIIO's or things like that while I'm driving, so I have all my music ripped to FLAC on a USB stick, and I just use the Audi MMI to control / select songs.


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

I was wondering about the SQ of the external drives in MMI have not tried it out yet. Bought the car a couple of months ago. I have Amazon Music HD now and it plays surprisingly well compared to sirius XM or even CD’s. There is some software out there that I could use to do the download files from Amazon. I like the idea of not having to mess with external players if I can get a really good quality FLAC file to play through my MMI. Not sure if tue 2018 MIB2 version is as good as the new though.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

StaudiA6 said:


> Not sure if tue 2018 MIB2 version is as good as the new though.


When you're using the Zen-V; it just extracts the digital signal from your source (mine being a USB), and sends it straight into your DSP via Toslink.
There's nothing filtered or altered by the MMI. It's just the flat raw digital audio signal going straight into your DSP.
The MMI is really just a means to control / select your music files. The newer versions have better graphics, but that's about it.

I've used this type of setup for years, and it is perfect. Never needed (or wanted) an external player.

2012 Audi S4 - I used a mObridge DA1
2015 Audi SQ5 - I used a mObridge DA3
2018 BMW 440i - I used a mObridge DA3
2020 BMW X6M - I used a Helix SDMI25
2021 Audi RS5 - I used a Zen-V



StaudiA6 said:


> There is some software out there that I could use to do the download files from Amazon.


I have Tidal, and I use a 3rd party software to download the music files onto my home PC, then transfer it to USB for the car.


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

That definitely clarifies some questions I had on the MMI system. Seems like Audi was thinking about people who care about SQ with external drive options. I think you just saved me some $$…. Thank you!!


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## jedi-knight83 (Aug 25, 2012)

Hi @JimmyDee 

Just finished reading your latest build thread.

Can I ask a couple of questions

1. Here in the UK the Helix SDMI25 is the cheapest option for MOST - Toslink. Is there any advantage (other than the built in DSP) to getting anything other than this? And am I correct that the SDMI25 only puts out 2 channels not 4?

2. If you had to start again and with a limited budget, what order would you prioritise the components? IE get the best and most expensive mid speakers but then maybe an all in one amp and DSP to save a bit of money there? Or make do with a semi decent component set (I currently have the Focal ES100K) but then spend more on Maybe the Helix DSP and separate amps (I currently have the Audison APF8.9 which is nice but the DSP software is terrible compared to the Helix (previously had the Up7BMW amp/DSP)

3. My car only had the S676A 'hifi' option which runs analogue speaker cables to the rear and into a small amp. I've tapped into those speaker cables to feed my DSP / AMP. I'm wanted to try the digital method though (just need to work out how to code my car to Harmon Kardon). Would you say going digital is a big upgrade? (presuming you have ever sampled a set up that is analogue fed

4. (sorry last one). You have ended up with some very nice, very high end speakers but have you also sampled some of the low end stuff? IE the Focal's I referenced earlier and even the Audison or Focal drop in 8".

Thank you and look forward to future updates / builds


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

@jedi-knight83 first things first... what year of Audi do you have? The SDMI25 only works up to model year 2015 (which had MOST 25). 
Past that, Audi switched to MOST 150 for its newer models. You would need a Nav TV Zen-V unit for newer Audi's.

It's been MANY years since I've used lower quality speakers (way before I discovered DSP's)... so I can't really comment on them.


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## jedi-knight83 (Aug 25, 2012)

JimmyDee said:


> @jedi-knight83 first things first... what year of Audi do you have? The SDMI25 only works up to model year 2015 (which had MOST 25).
> Past that, Audi switched to MOST 150 for its newer models. You would need a Nav TV Zen-V unit for newer Audi's.
> 
> It's been MANY years since I've used lower quality speakers (way before I discovered DSP's)... so I can't really comment on them.


F31 BMW actually.


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## kB86 (Jun 12, 2021)

.


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

jedi-knight83 said:


> F31 BMW actually.


If I had your car I'd keep the F8.9 - ok it's no Helix but you have it already
Chan 1&2 to the tweeters you already have (you'll need to get busy with the wiring here)
Chan 3&4 to the mids
Chan 5&6 to passive xover rears
Chan 7&8 to some 2 ohm under seat 8" like the match ones

The get a active sub box like the one Audison does or JL do and feed it from the 8.9.

Enjoy for a bit, see what you think and maybe upgrade from there.


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## LiquidClen (Dec 27, 2005)

Nice car. Maybe I missed it, but what year is your RS5 and did it come with the B&O system? Is there anything you're aware of that's less expensive than the Zen-V that allows for upgrading the speakers?

I have an RSQ8 with the B&O system and I'd like to add a sub to it. Thusfar I haven't seen ANYONE who's modded the RSQ8, so I'm not sure what I'm getting myself into. 

Appreciate any insight. Cheers


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

LiquidClen said:


> Nice car. Maybe I missed it, but what year is your RS5 and did it come with the B&O system?


It's a 2021. Brand new last summer.
Yes, it came with the B&O system... total garbage.



LiquidClen said:


> Is there anything you're aware of that's less expensive than the Zen-V that allows for upgrading the speakers?


If you truly care about getting the best sound quality, then the Zen-V is the only option that is currently available for Audi.
Alternately, you could tap into the speaker outputs, and mess around with trying to make that sound good... trust me, it won't sound good.



LiquidClen said:


> I have an RSQ8 with the B&O system and I'd like to add a sub to it. Thusfar I haven't seen ANYONE who's modded the RSQ8, so I'm not sure what I'm getting myself into.


Audi is rather 'cookie-cutter' in their audio systems. The factory locations tend to be similar between most of their vehicles.
You don't need 16 speakers, or whatever your B&O system has... you'd be way better-off simplifying it down to:

3-way front stage
rear fill in doors (optional)
subwoofer.
If all you want to do is add a sub, then there's posts on Rennlist about guys tapping into the sub channel, and adding a hi-lo converter, amp, and a sub box.

But if you want to do a full system, and have it sound better than the stock B&O, then you need a Zen-V, a DSP, amplification, and new speakers.
Here's what I'd recommend, if you're concerned about budget:





NAV-TV - Interfacing the Future


<p>Enhance your driving experience with ZEN-V MOST-150 processor. Convert the MOST-150 audio bus to low level RCA and TOSLink outputs. Compatible with Audi, Bentley with MIB infotainment systems and Porsche with PCM4.0 - PCM5.2 infotainment systems.</p>. Car radio versions: AUDI MIB, MIB HS...




navtv.com












HELIX V EIGHT DSP MK2


8-channel amplifier with 10-channel DSP, 8-channel highlevel input & ACO platform




www.audiotec-fischer.de




Replacement speakers of your choice... and a powered subwoofer:








HELIX U 10A


Ultra-compact 10




www.audiotec-fischer.de


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## audiocholic (Dec 5, 2016)

JimmyDee said:


> If you truly care about getting the best sound quality, then the Zen-V is the only option that is currently available for Audi.
> Alternately, you could tap into the speaker outputs, and mess around with trying to make that sound good... trust me, it won't sound good.



I'am not sure if its common practice in the U.S or even possible for your car but in the EU many countries do something called DECODING atleast thats what it is called in my market/language where they simply enter the head unit and turn off all OEM crossover points and various other sound processing off to get a traditional flat outout from the speaker outputs.

do you know if that is possible for your car? does the ZEN-V offer anything additional to what I described that would increase SQ somehow?


----------



## audiocholic (Dec 5, 2016)

forgot to mention, this decoding is generally and very often done here for VAG cars so basically audi,vw,porsche,seat,skoda but moreso vw,seat,skoda is the main players who get this done


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## LiquidClen (Dec 27, 2005)

JimmyDee said:


> It's a 2021. Brand new last summer.
> Yes, it came with the B&O system... total garbage.
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for the very detailed response. Don't really want to mess with too much, so just looking to add a sub on the Audi. I have a '62 Continental that will get the full system upgrade treatment 😈


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## Eatmore Bacon (Dec 17, 2020)

Very clean build. I hope to do something similar with the wife Q7 soon. Probably not quite as extensive but an upgrade over stock non the less. Its amazing that they keep putting such poor audio systems in higher end cars and trucks. Ours is a Premium Plus loaded and the audio is terrible.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

OK... so I made a few modifications to the build. Replaced the Audison amps with a pair of Brax. 
Original post (on page 1) has been updated to show the Brax installation.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

how does it compare


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Porsche said:


> how does it compare


I still have to do a bit of re-tuning and adjust the gains... Right now; the system is all tweeters! They're overpowering the mids and midbass.
I had to take my kid to hockey practice last night, so I didn't get a chance to do any adjustments after the install.

But one thing I did notice, is that; they are DEAD QUIET. I mean... creepily quiet. 

I'll ding around with the gains this morning, and try to level match the speakers a bit.
I have a meeting with @AudioGal this weekend, to do a re-tune (she's a Master at tuning... I'm barely a Padawan).
I'll give a full update, once the system is re-tuned.


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## Mike Lang (Apr 6, 2021)

Beautiful ride! That must sound amazing.


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## bertholomey (Dec 27, 2007)

JimmyDee said:


> I still have to do a bit of re-tuning and adjust the gains... Right now; the system is all tweeters! They're overpowering the mids and midbass.
> I had to take my kid to hockey practice last night, so I didn't get a chance to do any adjustments after the install.
> 
> But one thing I did notice, is that; they are DEAD QUIET. I mean... creepily quiet.
> ...


You are lucky! I bet that will be a good time - I bet it will sound amazing after she gets her knowledge and her rig in there. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Coppertone (Oct 4, 2011)

Man it has to be nice to be near someone who’s willing to take great gear to the next level. I’m sure by the end of the weekend your system will truly shine.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

bertholomey said:


> You are lucky! I bet that will be a good time - I bet it will sound amazing after she gets her knowledge and her rig in there.


Yes, I am definitely blessed to have such knowlege and skill in my back yard...

I've built a number of fairly high-end systems, over the years... but it wasn't until a couple years ago, when I first got @AudioGal to tune my system, that it went from nice sounding, to incredible sounding. Tuning makes all the difference, and I give her full props for taking high-end equipment and making it a super-nice sounding system. 

I can do the install and basic fabrication. I'm meticulous, and kinda fussy on how I want that part done. But I just go to her for the tuning. I can't tune the way she can... not even close.


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## Slow Cruiser (Aug 21, 2016)

JimmyDee im asuming since you know AudioGal your in the Alberta region? If so be possible to get a demo later in the year? 

Im just west of Edmonton


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I'll send you a PM


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## MythosDreamLab (Nov 28, 2020)

JimmyDee said:


> I still have to do a bit of re-tuning and adjust the gains... Right now; the system is all tweeters! They're overpowering the mids and midbass.
> I had to take my kid to hockey practice last night, so I didn't get a chance to do any adjustments after the install.
> 
> But one thing I did notice, is that; they are DEAD QUIET. I mean... creepily quiet.
> ...



Any update? Are the Brax mounted and tuned?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Yes, the system is tuned... and it sounds PHENOMENAL!

I've got one Brax amp dedicated to the left channels, and the other Brax for the right channels.
(plus a Zapco mono amp driving my sub)
3-way front stage, plus rear fill on each Brax amp (left and right separated per amp).

FRONT STAGE:

Audison Thesis Violino II - Tweeter
Dynaudio Esotar 430 - Midrange
Audio-Development W800NEO - 8" Midbass
REAR FILL:

Sinfoni Tempo 10 Tweeter
Dynaudio Esotar 650 Midrange
Passive Crossover
The amps are absolute beasts. They drive all speakers effortlessly, and with complete precise control. 
Honestly, I've never experienced anything like it.

Many of you know how often I swap amps, and try new things. I can't ever see myself trying anything else... they're that good.
Any build I do from now on, will have Brax amps. End of story.


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## Porsche (Jun 29, 2008)

brax is a fine amp, i bought some of the very first when they imported to the US, back in '95 or 96, the 1400 & 1000 i believe, great amps


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

This really amazing build. I have an 2019 RS5 and put in 

Navtv Zen V
Mosconi 8-12 DSP pro
Mosconi 4/10 powering front miss and rear fill
Mosconi 5/30 powering front tweeters/front mid bass and sub
Focal K2 3 way components active in front
Focal flax in rear
Focal 25kx sub in BBox (sub is too deep for Basser box)

I agonized over tweeter placement but ended up putting them in A pillar bottom location

cheers


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## jlx40 (Aug 14, 2014)

Did you gents go digital into the processors and if you did so, does the subwoofer level adjustment still work? In other words, am I forced to go analog out of the zen v if I want to use the on-screen sub adjustment.
And what happens to the park assist warnings when going digital? On the SB the warning tone comes from the front left a pillar lower tweeter and the rear right surround (c pillar). As I plan on setting up downmix on (zen v) for a front 2 ch, rear door 2 ch (fill) + sub, so no front/rear surrounds or center, what happens to the park assist tones?

thanks


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

jlx40 said:


> Did you gents go digital into the processors and if you did so, does the subwoofer level adjustment still work? In other words, am I forced to go analog out of the zen v if I want to use the on-screen sub adjustment.
> And what happens to the park assist warnings when going digital? On the SB the warning tone comes from the front left a pillar lower tweeter and the rear right surround (c pillar). As I plan on setting up downmix on (zen v) for a front 2 ch, rear door 2 ch (fill) + sub, so no front/rear surrounds or center, what happens to the park assist tones?
> 
> thanks


Jix40
Yes digital toslink into processor from zen v from headunit most150 fiber connector. On 2019 the amp/processor on b&o is in driver side cubby in back so just remove and ad zen v. 
Head unit still functions all work but I haven’t tried using tone controls. I set the equalization to house curve and like it for all the music I listen to. 

All tones and phone still work but sometimes when music is loud (yes I like loud music) phone calls mute music then when rejected it jumps back to previous volume. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

vsaudi said:


> All tones and phone still work but sometimes when music is loud (yes I like loud music) phone calls mute music then when rejected it jumps back to previous volume.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hate it when that happens… oh well, first world problems, right?


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

I just got a 2021 S5 SB with B&O, I am trying to find some details on how to get to unit behind glove box while I wait for parts like the zen to arrive. When someone who obviously is pretty capable like you says its a "nightmare" that worries the hell out of me. I am confident I can install front three without issue (wiring through door gives me pause) but just how much of a "nightmare" is getting to that unit behind the glove box? Would it be worth taking to a high end install place to get to it or is it just time consuming? I did some digging on youtube and other forums and didn't see much detailed info. Any thoughts would be VERY much appreciated.

_edit_
Would it be the same method as if i were accessing behind the glove box in a 2018-2020? I saw you mentioned the unit was in the rear near the amp in previous years, but accessing the area should be the same as a 21, right?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

surfsq said:


> When someone who obviously is pretty capable like you says its a "nightmare" that worries the hell out of me.


Nightmare might be a bit strong of a word... but it was definitely time consuming to remove the glove box in order to access the MIB unit.


I also see you had also PM'd me with a few questions, so i will answer them here (for other's benefit):



surfsq said:


> Remove glove box and then unhook the MIB to get access to hook up the MOST (male to male) cable to the Zen-v in the trunk, you said the 500cm version will get to the cubby on the driver side.


You want a single female to double male splitter - like this one:








7.65US $ 10% OFF|Free shipping MOST Optic Fiber Jumper Cable Multimedia Connectors 2 Female to 1 male For Audi BMW Benz Porsche Amplifier unit|Flex Cables| - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com




I originally ordered a 400cm MOST extension cable, and it got me back to the trunk... but only as far as the passenger side. I had to get another 300cm cable to bring it over to the driver's side cubby area. The extra 300cm was a bit longer than needed, but better than being too short. If you can find a 600cm cable, I suspect that would be perfect.



surfsq said:


> You said splitter is needed behind the head unit, is that the MIB? If so, I unplug the OEM MOST cable, connect that to one of the two female connections on the splitter, connect the extension MOST cable (going to the trunk) to the other female and then connect the male back into the back of the MIB. Is that correct?


Yes, the splitter attaches to the MIB (located behind the glove box). I called it the head unit... but it's the MIB unit. As mentioned above; you need a single female to two male splitter. Unplug at the MIB and put that into the female end of the splitter, Then plug one male end of splitter back into the MIB, and the other male end into the female end of your extension cable. Then the male end of the extension goes into your Zen-V.



surfsq said:


> Since I have essentially the same vehicle as you, the NAV-TV - Interfacing the Future Zen-v should work correct? The NAVtv site doesnt specify a device for the 2021+ RS5, S5, or A5 but if its working for you, it should be fine.


Yes, the Zen-V will work for your vehicle... but you need to order the kit with the OBD programming tool. The MIB needs to be re-programmed for optical audio output. The OBD tool does it flawlessly, but you can also reprogram it with a Vag-Com (if you have one). 

The programming tool also allows you to re-set it back to factory settings, when you decide to rip the system out and sell the car.

You also need to set the Zen-V dip switches to a Porsche setting (as the new Audi MIB and Porsche are the same. If you set it to Audi, then it won't work (thanks to @SkizeR for that tip).

Here's a link to the kit with the OBD programming tool:





NAV-TV - Interfacing the Future


<p>Enhance your driving experience with ZEN-V MOST-150 processor. Convert the MOST-150 audio bus to low level RCA and TOSLink outputs. Compatible with 2020 and 2021 Audi vehicles with MIB3 amplified systems with MOST 150 connector at the MMI/Radio.</p>. Car radio versions: MIB3 with MOST 150...




navtv.com


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

I appreciate the clarification and taking the time while traveling to respond. All parts ordered, when they arrive in a few weeks I will make sure to log the build. Thank you again for paving the way, I am honestly shocked I couldn't find a single other build like yours.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

There are a few guys on the Audi forums that have done lesser builds... but I found none that were at the same level as what i wanted to do. It was a lot of research, and some trial and error. I've also owned a few Audis and a few BMW's, so this isn't the first MOST vehicle I've done a build on. But the new MIB is different from the old MOST25 systems...

I'm glad I can help a fellow enthusiast.

I'll give credit where credit is due... I mentioned him in my post above, but @SkizeR threw me a few information bones. He's a wealth of knowledge, and he's done a lot of Porsche builds, so he was aware of some of the quirks with the new Audi / Porsche MIB.


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

JimmyDee said:


> There are a few guys on the Audi forums that have done lesser builds... but I found none that were at the same level as what i wanted to do. It was a lot of research, and some trial and error. I've also owned a few Audis and a few BMW's, so this isn't the first MOST vehicle I've done a build on. But the new MIB is different from the old MOST25 systems...
> 
> I'm glad I can help a fellow enthusiast.
> 
> I'll give credit where credit is due... I mentioned him in my post above, but @SkizeR threw me a few information bones. He's a wealth of knowledge, and he's done a lot of Porsche builds, so he was aware of some of the quirks with the new Audi / Porsche MIB.


I have some resonix barrier and blackhole tiles i'm itching to put to use, Nicks videos got me into car audio some years ago and I made sure to pay it forward when i can buy his stuff. I would be a lot poorer if I was closer to NY that's for sure. Anyway, I have a bunch of parts for my audi enroute from China, Europe, and Coral Springs... Pretty excited to start in a few weeks. 

The biggest hurdle for me is not breaking clips and doing the install clean with no scratches etc. This is my first European car that I will be taking apart. Personally that is the most impressive thing (other than tuning) about good car audio installation shops, taking apart a "difficult" vehicle and putting it back together again without a hint of work. I have about 20 tabs saved from audizine, diy, youtube, audiworld, etc showing how people have removed Audi door panels, trunk, glovebox, dash, run wiring through door seal, etc etc. Last vehicle I did a good job but the mistakes i made on that journey were painful for me, broken clips, tabs, stripped screws, scratched A pillars, etc. Uhggg.

Again, thanks for the contribution to the community.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

You'll find that new Audi's are fairly easy to take apart. They don't use cheap plastic clips to hold the door skins on. They have a series of steel posts that are welded onto the door, and the door skin has receptacles that these steel posts go into. You won't break any cheap clips on a new Audi... every new car should be designed this way.


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

surfsq said:


> I just got a 2021 S5 SB with B&O, I am trying to find some details on how to get to unit behind glove box while I wait for parts like the zen to arrive. When someone who obviously is pretty capable like you says its a "nightmare" that worries the hell out of me. I am confident I can install front three without issue (wiring through door gives me pause) but just how much of a "nightmare" is getting to that unit behind the glove box? Would it be worth taking to a high end install place to get to it or is it just time consuming? I did some digging on youtube and other forums and didn't see much detailed info. Any thoughts would be VERY much appreciated.
> 
> _edit_
> Would it be the same method as if i were accessing behind the glove box in a 2018-2020? I saw you mentioned the unit was in the rear near the amp in previous years, but accessing the area should be the same as a 21, right?


would try to get the technical manual. really a lot of good stuff in there for basic finding bolts and tricks for taking off panels. also wiring diagrams. got mine at factory-manuals.com


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Nothin like a factory service manual. Prevent one f**k up and it pays for itself. I watched lots of u tube for removing audi door panels and unfortunately there are still guys yanking on the bottom of the panel to get it off. Anyone can make a you tube video!!!


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

JimmyDee said:


> The beauty with Audi doors, is that they run two separate feeds of 16awg through the Molex to individually power the midrange and the midbass. You don't need to pull new wire through the Molex.


How did you use those two 16awg speaker wires? My plan was leave existing wires for when i sell it later and run new wires. I would be quite pleased if i didn't have to run two sets of speaker wires through each front door.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

If your factory amp has a 38 pin connector get one of these. It makes thinks way easier. Specially when u put everything back to stock


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

dkc7 said:


> If your factory amp has a 38 pin connector get one of these. It makes thinks way easier. Specially when u put everything back to stock


Been down this road... the connector you're referring to, doesn't work on the new Audi MIB3 units. 
Totally different pinout configuration.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

I wonder if bruce meranda is working on a new pinout. Hint hint. Cause his 38 pin adapter is a real game changer.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

It's not his design... you can buy this pinout connector unit on Alibaba for 7 dollars...


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

S!!t


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

What did you use for remote in? I have done a fair bit of searching, other than tapping into the fusebox I didn't see any wires I could use in the trunk area. Might have to actually get the FSM and look it up.
Did you research any other subwoofers for that box or is the Hertz just a proven winner you happen to have lying around? I would rather buy once cry once for the 10" sub, we have just over 5" of depth to work with and 15 liters of volume (iirc).
Did you replace your front door speaker grills with the ASS (non B&O) or cut out the blocked portion of the existing?
Next week I have to take my s5 in to get the Navigation database on the MIB3 reinstalled, I carved out this weekend to start the install so hopefully this won't cause an issue with Audi since the issue is covered by warranty. https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2021/MC-10189150-0001.pdf


I will be taking a reading on REW of the stock system, then also get DB's for non sport comfort mode before and after some sound treatment. I am not sure how crazy i will go, I'd rather not add too much weight.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

surfsq said:


> What did you use for remote in? I have done a fair bit of searching, other than tapping into the fusebox I didn't see any wires I could use in the trunk area. Might have to actually get the FSM and look it up.


I'm not sure I fully understand the question, but let me tell you the chain for remote turn-on:
The Zen-V gets it's remote turn-on signal through the fiber optic MOST150 input.
From there; the Zen-V has a remote out wire to trigger the DSP.
The Helix DSP has a remote in and a remote out. Use them both. Do not turn on your amps directly from the Zen-V.



surfsq said:


> Did you research any other subwoofers for that box or is the Hertz just a proven winner you happen to have lying around? I would rather buy once cry once for the 10" sub, we have just over 5" of depth to work with and 15 liters of volume (iirc).


I just used a sub that I had lying around. The Hertz sub is definitely not optimal. Something like a JL 10TW3 would be optimal.



surfsq said:


> Did you replace your front door speaker grills with the ASS (non B&O) or cut out the blocked portion of the existing?


I tried to cut the B&O grilles, but it was turning into a mess. So I bought new ones. Just the standard (non B&O) grilles work perfectly. I think they were 80 bucks each new from the dealership.


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

JimmyDee said:


> The Zen-V goes to the Helix remote in, and then the remote out goes to your amps.
> I just used a sub that I had lying around. The Hertz sub is definitely not optimal. Something like a JL 10TW3 would be optimal.
> I tried to cut the B&O grilles, but it was turning into a mess. So I bought new ones. Just the standard (non B&O) grilles work perfectly. I think they were 80 bucks each new from the dealership.


Despite my poorly worded question you got it and hit the nail on the head, I haven't used the Zen before so I didn't think or know the zen-v had a remote out. Got it and checked off the list.
I was considering the audiofrog and 10wm, the 10tw3 is the smart move. I had one in my previous vehicle that I let go, uhgg.
I ordered the same speaker ASS grills, i have tried the dremel on plastic before.... No thank you, never again.

Thanks as always.


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

surfsq said:


> I have some resonix barrier and blackhole tiles i'm itching to put to use, Nicks videos got me into car audio some years ago and I made sure to pay it forward when i can buy his stuff. I would be a lot poorer if I was closer to NY that's for sure. Anyway, I have a bunch of parts for my audi enroute from China, Europe, and Coral Springs... Pretty excited to start in a few weeks.
> 
> The biggest hurdle for me is not breaking clips and doing the install clean with no scratches etc. This is my first European car that I will be taking apart. Personally that is the most impressive thing (other than tuning) about good car audio installation shops, taking apart a "difficult" vehicle and putting it back together again without a hint of work. I have about 20 tabs saved from audizine, diy, youtube, audiworld, etc showing how people have removed Audi door panels, trunk, glovebox, dash, run wiring through door seal, etc etc. Last vehicle I did a good job but the mistakes i made on that journey were painful for me, broken clips, tabs, stripped screws, scratched A pillars, etc. Uhggg.
> 
> Again, thanks for the contribution to the community.


comment on the broken clips etc. I have RS5 and found the owners manual invaluable on the secrets of removing panels. there is always a trick and once learned it is easy(er)


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

JimmyDee said:


> I'm not sure I fully understand the question, but let me tell you the chain for remote turn-on:
> The Zen-V gets it's remote turn-on signal through the fiber optic MOST150 input.
> From there; the Zen-V has a remote out wire to trigger the DSP.
> The Helix DSP has a remote in and a remote out. Use them both. Do not turn on your amps directly from the Zen-V.
> ...


JimmyDee
Have you been in higher temps 100deg? I have had lockup issues but only when outside temps are above 80 and sun is on car. My ZenV is in same spot in drivers side cubby

the airflow in RS5 is supposed to flow through vents and out flap in lower part of the cubby. actually found rocks inside before so I know it opens.

Installed fans to see if it helps.

Also started running Tidal lossless files so I also curious if will cause more heat because of higher bit rates.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I haven't had the Zen-V lockup... but I have had instances where it goes silent for about 10 seconds, and then the sound comes back. I suspect it has to do with the bitrate (the Audi is delivering data faster than the Zen-V can handle).

I've tried multiple times to get an updated firmware file from Nav-TV... but they don't answer their phones, they don't respond to phone messages, and they have never replied to my emails. The product is good... but the customer service side of their business is poor, at best.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Sorry.. I responded above, before I looed at the picture you attached.

I used to own Mosconi PRO amps... and they get hot. Particularly the PRO 4/10.
I would suggest that the amp is probably the culprit for generating the heat in that compartment...


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

JimmyDee said:


> Sorry.. I responded above, before I looed at the picture you attached.
> 
> I used to own Mosconi PRO amps... and they get hot. Particularly the PRO 4/10.
> I would suggest that the amp is probably the culprit for generating the heat in that compartment...


that is what I thought but amp is cool.
there is a backup view computer tucked in there with dsp and zen v. it gets really hot.
actually put thermistor on it and it shuts off when reaching 100C

so I guess no problems with yours getting too hot


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

JimmyDee said:


> I haven't had the Zen-V lockup... but I have had instances where it goes silent for about 10 seconds, and then the sound comes back. I suspect it has to do with the bitrate (the Audi is delivering data faster than the Zen-V can handle).
> 
> I've tried multiple times to get an updated firmware file from Nav-TV... but they don't answer their phones, they don't respond to phone messages, and they have never replied to my emails. The product is good... but the customer service side of their business is poor, at best.


I have not had good customer service from them recently.
when I first got the unit they responded well with emails but could not replicate issue that I was having.

on the website under zen v they have the latest firmware update





NAV-TV - Interfacing the Future


<p>Enhance your driving experience with ZEN-V MOST-150 processor. Convert the MOST-150 audio bus to low level RCA and TOSLink outputs. Compatible with Audi, Bentley with MIB infotainment systems and Porsche with PCM4.0 - PCM5.2 infotainment systems.</p>. Car radio versions: AUDI MIB, MIB HS...




navtv.com





I have seen the 10sec no sound issue but it seems random.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

vsaudi said:


> on the website under zen v they have the latest firmware update
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The Firmware version on their website is 2.3.6 (dated September 2021)
I know there are newer firmware versions than this, as I have a friend who recently bought a Zen-V, and he has a newer version.

I'll try Tony @ Nav-TV again... so far, he has ignored all of my previous emails, and not returned any of my calls.


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

JimmyDee said:


> The Firmware version on their website is 2.3.6 (dated September 2021)
> I know there are newer firmware versions than this, as I have a friend who recently bought a Zen-V, and he has a newer version.
> 
> I'll try Tony @ Nav-TV again... so far, he has ignored all of my previous emails, and not returned any of my calls.


same with me lately.
no response.
I dont know if it new firmware changes anything for our Audi's

would be curious if they changed silicon in unit to handle more processing


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

I was able to speak to Tony a few times, only hit voicemail once. I tried between 4-5pm eastern. Maybe surf was up in Florida those days .

I didn't want to jack up my zen since its been working for me so i never connected it to a PC. I got mine a month or so ago, how can i check version for you guys? Connect via usb to the device while car is off? On?


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

surfsq said:


> I was able to speak to Tony a few times, only hit voicemail once. I tried between 4-5pm eastern. Maybe surf was up in Florida those days .
> 
> I didn't want to jack up my zen since its been working for me so i never connected it to a PC. I got mine a month or so ago, how can i check version for you guys? Connect via usb to the device while car is off? On?


Thanks
my understanding is always unplug Zen V from stereo then plug in USB to PC. it powers up off of USB
cant remember if it tells you the current load firmware version


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

Looks like you just updated yours, no?


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

surfsq said:


> Looks like you just updated yours, no?


yes just did it to see what screen looked like


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## oabeieo (Feb 22, 2015)

I’ve had decent luck with navTv tech support 

Maybe they were on vacation?? 

I’ve called in several times , I order a lot of things through them and always get helped 

Like the navTv piece for Cadillac io5/6 toslink output….. the ground wire is super sensitive and they helped me get it working


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

*So, I've done a handful of updates to the system...*
Kinda went overboard, but this is how we are on this site.

So, as it sits now, the system is comprised of:

Nav-TV ZEN-V interface unit to Audi MOST150 OEM headunit
Brax DSP
Brax GX-2400 amplifier for the _front left stage_
Channel A – Morel Supremo Picollo tweeter
Channel B – Dynaudio Esotar 430 midrange
Channel C&D Bridged – Focal Utopia 8WM midbass

Brax GX-2400 amplifier for the _front right stage_
Channel A – Morel Supremo Picollo tweeter
Channel B – Dynaudio Esotar 430 midrange
Channel C&D Bridged – Focal Utopia 8WM midbass

Helix P-TWO amplifier for the rear fill
Driving Brax ML3 midrange

Helix P-ONE amplifier for the subwoofer
Driving Focal Utopia SUB10WM



Replaced the Helix Ultra with a Brax DSP:









Replaced the Audison Thesis Violino II tweeters with Morel Supremo Picollo:









Replaced the Audio Development W800-NEO's with Focal Utopia 8WM:









Replaced the Hertz Mille sub with a Focal Utopia SUB10WM









Replaced the Zapco sub amp with a Helix P-One:









Added a Helix P-Two for Rear Fill duty:









Completely removed the speakers out of the back doors.
And then added a pair of Brax 3" midrange to the rear deck, for proper Rear Fill.
These are Brax Graphic mids - they're just temporary. I have a set of Brax Matrix mids coming in a few weeks:


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Since stealth is 'my gig'; I always make an effort to hide everything.
This is why my builds always have speakers in factory locations (and tuned to sound great there!)

The P-One and the P-Two were put into the rear trunk space (along with the Zen-V interface), just behind the wheel well:
Since the P-Two is only driving a pair of 3" mids, I'm gambling that it won't even get warm... so it's on the bottom.
The P-One is driving the sub. It's on top, and has some room to breathe.









Audison tweeters were pulled and replaced with Morel Supremo Picollo's.
Sorry, I got busy and forgot to take pics of them mounted. But they are in the same location as the original Audisons were in.
I added a protection capacitor (under the black heat shrink) and XT60 quick-disconnects to all speakers.









The only speakers I kept, were the Dynaudio Esotar 430's. I haven't found a midrange that sounds better...

I pulled the W800-NEO's and replaced them with Focal 8WM's - these things friggen pound!:









The speakers in the back doors (Esotar 650 and Sinfoni tweeter) got completely removed.

In their place, I decided to do proper rear fill, using a pair of Brax 3" midranges.
They fit perfectly in the rear factory location. Sorry, picture is kinda [email protected]:

















The Hertz sub was pulled and replaced with a Focal Utopia SUB10WM:
(I've got a 3-bar protector coming for the sub)









And the Helix DSP was replaced with a Brax DSP, which I integrated into the floor area, along with the Brax amps:









And with the trunk floor back in place; everything is hidden:


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

Nice work, I’m curious if you notice a difference between the Picollos and the Violinos… speaking of which, I seem to remember you saying it would be difficult to get the tweeters removed. How did that work out?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

mumbles said:


> Nice work, I’m curious if you notice a difference between the Picollos and the Violinos… speaking of which, I seem to remember you saying it would be difficult to get the tweeters removed. How did that work out?


Honestly... it was a sh!t-show getting the Audisons out... but I managed, with a bit of ingenuity.
The Picollos are a nicer sounding tweeter (to me). I find they are a bit more precise. But variants in tuning can change a lot of things...

I found the Violinos were more _'laid back' _sounding. Similar to an AudioFrog GB15.
They're still a damn fine tweeter... but I prefer the sound of the Morel Picollos.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

I also added quick disconnect power and speaker connectors to the amps, in case I need to pull them out for car servicing:









And properly labelled all wires (including RCA's), for easy re-connect:









Just for fun... here's some 'guts shots' of the Helix P-Two (left) and P-One (right):









And 'guts shots' of the Brax amp:


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## Selkec (Nov 18, 2018)

Where do you get those quick connects and what didn’t you like about the Audison tweeters? I’ve thought about trying them since I’ve had the voce 3 and 6.5”


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## crxsir121 (Oct 18, 2006)

Which brand and value capacitor do you use with the Morel Piccolos?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Selkec said:


> Where do you get those quick connects


Amazon (just search for XT60, and they will come up)



Selkec said:


> and what didn’t you like about the Audison tweeters?


Honestly, the Audisons are a damn fine tweeter. There's a lot to like about them.
But this was just a personal taste decision. I prefer the sound of the Morel tweeters.

As I mentioned in my previous post; the Audisons had a more _'laid back'_ sound to them (similar to an AudioFrog GB15).
Really nice, smooth sounding tweeter. Whereas the Morels just sound a bit more detailed (to me).


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

crxsir121 said:


> Which brand and value capacitor do you use with the Morel Piccolos?


Nichicon ES Muse Bipolar Capacitor. 33uF, 35 volt.


https://www.nichiconcapacitors.com/product/nichicon-es-muse-33uf-35v/



The Morel Supremo Picollo tweeter is rated at 6ohm, so I had to do a bit of math.
Safe starting point for a typicaL 4ohm active car audio tweeter is around 47uF. 
You can figure out what you need with this chart:


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## dgage (Oct 1, 2013)

Selkec said:


> Where do you get those quick connects and what didn’t you like about the Audison tweeters? I’ve thought about trying them since I’ve had the voce 3 and 6.5”


And if you mean the power disconnects, those look similar to Anderson SB connectors.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Selkec said:


> Where do you get those quick connects


Ya... I thought you were asking about the speaker disconnects (which are XT60)

But if you mean the power disconnects, then they are a 175amp Quick Disconnect, most commonly used on trailers.
The pins accept a 4 awg cable. I put a disconnect on each Brax amp. Just Google (or Amazon): 175 amp Quick Disconnect.








Amazon.com: Orion Motor Tech Wire Connector 4 Pack, 175A Wire Harness Plug Kit for 2 to 4 Gauge Cables, 12V to 36V Battery Quick Connect Disconnect Set for Car Bike ATV Winches Lifts Motors More, Set of 4, Gray : Automotive


Buy Orion Motor Tech Wire Connector 4 Pack, 175A Wire Harness Plug Kit for 2 to 4 Gauge Cables, 12V to 36V Battery Quick Connect Disconnect Set for Car Bike ATV Winches Lifts Motors More, Set of 4, Gray: Quick Connect Systems - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



www.amazon.com


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## kB86 (Jun 12, 2021)

Do you use carplay? Do you rekon the siri voice is very loud regardness of volume? I just install Nav Tv M (mercedes) and have this problem. Thank you.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

kB86 said:


> Do you use carplay? Do you rekon the siri voice is very loud regardness of volume? I just install Nav Tv M (mercedes) and have this problem. Thank you.


I don't... all of my music is FLAC on a USB stick, which I control through the Audi MMI system.

On Audi, you can adjust the voice and notification volume through the MMI. Not sure about Merc.


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## Dgan21 (Mar 25, 2021)

Very nice setup, now u make me want to hear the morel tweeters since I have the audison Thesis 😂


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## preston (Dec 10, 2007)

Well you changed so many things at once I don't know if you can honestly say but do you feel there was an enhancement from the Brax DSP ? 
Would have loved to hear your impression of just changing that one piece out.

Those Brax amplifiers look very nice.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

preston said:


> Well you changed so many things at once I don't know if you can honestly say but do you feel there was an enhancement from the Brax DSP ?
> Would have loved to hear your impression of just changing that one piece out.
> 
> Those Brax amplifiers look very nice.


Ya, there's no way of knowing the true impact of just the Brax DSP.

I did change-out the midbass first, and there was a noticable low-end improvement.
Then I changed the tweeters, and there was a noticable improvement with them..
Then I changed the sub, and there was a very noticable improvement.
Then I changed the DSP... but it isn't properly tuned yet. So I dunno...


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Subwoofer protector grille showed-up today.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Looks just like the one i ordered from amazon yesterday. Not as robust as that hertz 2bar. Gotta love those basser boxes. Unfortunately the one for a6 is for left side.


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## Niebur3 (Jul 11, 2008)

JimmyDee said:


> Ya, there's no way of knowing the true impact of just the Brax DSP.
> 
> I did change-out the midbass first, and there was a noticable low-end improvement.
> Then I changed the tweeters, and there was a noticable improvement with them..
> ...


I find it very commendable with your honesty. Most people would swear it’s better before it even being installed, little line tuned because of the cost. I would assume it will be better but I like that you are waiting to make that statement. Would love to hear this someday.


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## UNBROKEN (Sep 25, 2009)

Curious how you like the single 10 in an SUV? I didn’t like a single 12 in mine…maybe I still have some childhood tendencies left in me after all.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Audi suvs start with a Q😁


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

UNBROKEN said:


> Curious how you like the single 10 in an SUV? I didn’t like a single 12 in mine…maybe I still have some childhood tendencies left in me after all.


This isn't an SUV.


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## UNBROKEN (Sep 25, 2009)

JimmyDee said:


> This isn't an SUV.
> View attachment 346900


Hell…guess I’m dyslexic too.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

dkc7 said:


> Looks just like the one i ordered from amazon yesterday. Not as robust as that hertz 2bar.


My one also came from Amazon... we prolly have the same one.
Unfortunately, Focal doesn't make a protector grille for this sub. Not sure why... but I really wish they did (and it was chunky, like the Hertz one).


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## UNBROKEN (Sep 25, 2009)

JimmyDee said:


> My one also came from Amazon... we prolly have the same one.
> Unfortunately, Focal doesn't make a protector grille for this sub. Not sure why... but I really wish they did (and it was chunky, like the Hertz one).


There’s a guy on eBay that makes grilles for them that kinda mimic the Focal grilles for their other stuff.








Custom Protective speaker Grill FOCAL Car Sound Sub protect Mesh Acoustic 1pc | eBay


How every single grill is manufactured?. AutoCAD layout. Protective speaker grills. XMAX (clearance above speaker) Coating with powder paint and baking grills in the oven. Our grills fit the most speakers/subs.



www.ebay.com


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## Picassotheimpaler (Sep 21, 2014)

JimmyDee said:


> Ya, there's no way of knowing the true impact of just the Brax DSP.
> 
> I did change-out the midbass first, and there was a noticable low-end improvement.
> Then I changed the tweeters, and there was a noticable improvement with them..
> ...


In what way was there a very noticable improvement between subs??


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Picassotheimpaler said:


> In what way was there a very noticable improvement between subs??


I couldn't get that Hertz sub to effectively play much below 40hz in that (undersized) enclosure.
But with the Utopia sub; I need to cut 25hz and 32hz bands on the DSP, just to keep the thing from blowing itself out of the enclosure!

In all fairness;

The Utopia sub is properly sized for that enclosure (which is the main reason I got it).
I also added a more powerful amp into the mix, to drive it.
The Utopia is a 2ohm sub versus the Hertz being a 4ohm.
That Hertz Mille is a great subwoofer. But the Utopia sub just has more _'poop'_ to it... a lot more.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

JimmyDee said:


> ...That Hertz Mille is a great subwoofer. *But the Utopia sub just has more 'poop' to it... a lot more*.


Not sure if more "Poop" is a good thing or not.  😊

Seriously tho', the install looks amazing and I'm sure that it sounds amazing as well. Nice work.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Thanks.
I enjoy planning and doing the fabrication and installation work.
But tuning is not my strength. For that; I turn to @AudioGal - she is truly a Jedi Master in this area.

At the moment, I have set it up with _trusty ol' _Helix Auto-Tune, which will get me by for the next week.
It sounds pretty good. But auto-tune can only take things so far. It'll get you about 75% of the way there.

This upcoming weekend, I have a meeting with @AudioGal to do a proper system tune.
I'm REALLY looking forward to it, as I know the current setup is playing nowhere near its potential.

As for_ 'poop'_... if you've got more of it in your pants, then it's typically not a good thing.
But if you've got more of it in your subwoofer... then you're smiling.


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## crxsir121 (Oct 18, 2006)

Just curious if you have any electrical upgrades? Upgraded battery or Alternator? You've got a nice variety of Class A/B and D amps...


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## preston (Dec 10, 2007)

JimmyDee said:


> Thanks.
> I enjoy planning and doing the fabrication and installation work.
> But tuning is not my strength. For that; I turn to @AudioGal - she is truly a Jedi Master in this area.
> 
> ...



Wish there was some way we could sit in on that session !

Would be very interesting to see your tune file when you're done even though it is of course not applicable to anything else. I just wonder sometimes what a master tune looks like and if there's any hidden tricks. Particularly interested in if/where the phase slider or other all pass filters may be applied, and how radical the EQ ends up looking.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

crxsir121 said:


> Just curious if you have any electrical upgrades? Upgraded battery or Alternator? You've got a nice variety of Class A/B and D amps...


I dont.
The Audi has a fairly robust electrical system, which to date has provided sufficient power.


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## Stycker (Jan 31, 2018)

Your equiptment and builds are always amazing. That Brax DSP should include "Tuning Tech" that travels to your house to tune the system. I love stealth builds. Nice to hear all that sound and wonder where its all coming from.


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## crxsir121 (Oct 18, 2006)

JimmyDee said:


> I dont.
> The Audi has a fairly robust electrical system, which to date has provided sufficient power.


That's good to know, as I'm putting a bigger system into my BMW M3 which has a stock 210Amp Alternator. Hopefully its good enough as an Audi...


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Apples and oranges dude


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## AudioGal (Oct 16, 2019)

JimmyDee said:


> Thanks.
> I enjoy planning and doing the fabrication and installation work.
> But tuning is not my strength. For that; I turn to @AudioGal - she is truly a Jedi Master in this area.
> 
> ...


lol thanks jimmydee for the kind words. i am really looking forward to spending some time with your new system and hearing the improvements over the previous gear 😎


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

Wow! That is one heck of an update to an already great setup!! I bet is sounds sweet.

Just out of curiosity what are you doing with the stuff you removed? Asking for a friend.


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## gejef71792 (4 mo ago)

All parts as been upgraded looks cool


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## jlx40 (Aug 14, 2014)

JimmyDee said:


> I dont.
> The Audi has a fairly robust electrical system, which to date has provided sufficient power.


While this is true, that 75Ah battery is working pretty hard with all those amps especially with the start stop system doing its thing. The duty cycle on the alternator has to have increased a bit. I personally put in a factory 92 Ah battery and coded the car for it. But I never felt Audi's battery sizing was ever more than just adequate in a stock car. Just as another example of Audi's way of doing things, this is pretty much the same way I feel toward the intercooler sizing on my S5 where the factory cooling capacity can be easily maxed out on a hot day..


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

jlx40 said:


> While this is true, that 75Ah battery is working pretty hard with all those amps especially with the start stop system doing its thing.


RS vehicles don't have Start/Stop. 



jlx40 said:


> The duty cycle on the alternator has to have increased a bit. I personally put in a factory 92 Ah battery and coded the car for it. But I never felt Audi's battery sizing was ever more than just adequate in a stock car. Just as another example of Audi's way of doing things, this is pretty much the same way I feel toward the intercooler sizing on my S5 where the factory cooling capacity can be easily maxed out on a hot day..


I wouldn't argue that putting a larger alternator and battery would be beneficial. But to date; the OEM system has kept up.


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

StaudiA6 said:


> Just out of curiosity what are you doing with the stuff you removed? Asking for a friend.


Sold the W800-NEOs.
Sold the Helix Ultra.
Sold the Zapco sub amp.
Still have the Hertz Mille subwoofer - might sell it, but it's big and expensive to ship.
Still have the Audison tweeters - might hold onto them.


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## LBaudio (Jan 9, 2009)

You have an impressive equipment list, hats off to you!

that should sound insane when fine tuned, and all that power on midbass drivers… madness…🤩💪💪💪


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## jlx40 (Aug 14, 2014)

stock run flats as well? or did you remove the spare tire to make room for the amp board?


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## StaudiA6 (Nov 13, 2021)

JimmyDee said:


> Sold the W800-NEOs.
> Sold the Helix Ultra.
> Sold the Zapco sub amp.
> Still have the Hertz Mille subwoofer - might sell it, but it's big and expensive to ship.
> Still have the Audison tweeters - might hold onto them.


Let me know if you change your mind on the tweeters. Was interested in the W800 neos. Are the focal 8’s worth the $ compared to the neos? I have a feeling I should have went with 8’s on my build instead of 6.5”. Will know soon as I am planning on finishing install this weekend.


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## preston (Dec 10, 2007)

StaudiA6 said:


> I have a feeling I should have went with 8’s on my build instead of 6.5”.


Well D'uh !😁


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

jlx40 said:


> stock run flats as well? or did you remove the spare tire to make room for the amp board?


I removed the spare. Have a 12V mini compressor and a tire repair plug kit in the car.


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

JimmyDee said:


> Honestly... it was a sh!t-show getting the Audisons out... but I managed, with a bit of ingenuity.
> The Picollos are a nicer sounding tweeter (to me). I find they are a bit more precise. But variants in tuning can change a lot of things...
> 
> I found the Violinos were more _'laid back' _sounding. Similar to an AudioFrog GB15.
> They're still a damn fine tweeter... but I prefer the sound of the Morel Picollos.


Interesting, I have heard the Violinos before which is why I purchased them. Finally heard them in my Audi for the first time last night and found them to be very precise. Maybe firing into the windshield blurs them some… I tried them that way initially, but, wound up putting them on the pillars firing almost directly at the opposite pillar. Regardless, I am super pleased.


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## Frequentflyer (Mar 3, 2020)

Did this car have the Bang & Olufsen audio from factory?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Frequentflyer said:


> Did this car have the Bang & Olufsen audio from factory?


Yes


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## Frequentflyer (Mar 3, 2020)

JimmyDee said:


> Yes


 I'm on a waiting list for a new RS3 with the B&O. I'm going to start following these Audi builds more closely.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Why pay for b&o if you want to upgrade the audio


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## Frequentflyer (Mar 3, 2020)

dkc7 said:


> Why pay for b&o if you want to upgrade the audio


Comes with the tech package. Can't get it separately. Audi isn't dumb...


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Frequentflyer said:


> Comes with the tech package. Can't get it separately. Audi isn't dumb...


This


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

JimmyDee said:


> This


This, would have gladly done without it.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Damn, the tech package is nice. A few years back I was ready to lease an s3 technik. The only ones in canada all had the driver assist idiot warning package. Was gonna take 6 months to get one from germany. Bought a b7 a4 sline and did stage 3 instead.

oh, just installed the w800’s. What a difference but now I need more anti rattle foam.


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## surfsq (8 mo ago)

dkc7 said:


> oh, just installed the w800’s. What a difference but now I need more anti rattle foam.


What is rattling for you? Internal metal door or the door card? If its the card, Nick has some new thin-sulate that is outstanding, and clean.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Hard to tell but i do need decoupling foam are u talking resonix, my trunk lid is also rattling but goes away when i open it😖


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

dkc7 said:


> just installed the w800’s. What a difference but now I need more anti rattle foam.


8's make a huge difference in the front stage... and ya, I also had to sound deaden the [email protected] out of my doors!
Butyl on the metal, and dampening foam on the backside fo the door cards. Doors are solid (and silent) now.


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## dkc7 (Jan 7, 2022)

Jimmy dee what foam did u use


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

Just some cheap Noico material I got off Amazon... not the best, by far. But it definitely did the job, as far as negating any rattles.








 Noico Red 315 mil (8 mm) 20 sqft (1.9 sq.m)


Noico 315 mil 20 sqft car waterproof sound deadening material is the cost-effective automotive self-adhesive closed cell foam insulation.




noico.info





Stuck it all over the backside of my door skins:


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## LiquidClen (Dec 27, 2005)

JimmyDee said:


> RS vehicles don't have Start/Stop.


My RSQ8 begs to differ.

out of curiosity - is there a reason why you used an amp for left side and right side instead of one for tweets/midrange and bridging the other for mid bass?


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## JimmyDee (Mar 8, 2014)

LiquidClen said:


> out of curiosity - is there a reason why you used an amp for left side and right side instead of one for tweets/midrange and bridging the other for mid bass?


Yes.
Because tweeters draw about 10 watts (absolute max), and midrange speakers draw about 40 watts. Whereas the midbass draw a significant amount of power.

It would be foolish to have one amp powering what might be a total of 100 watts for all four speakers, while the other amp is getting cooking hot pushing a pair of 8" midbass speakers...

I'm just balancing the loads onto two separate amps power supplies.

There's also some theories about getting better channel separation by having a left amp and right amp. Personally, I don't have the ears to distinguish this kind of thing... but there's lots of discussion about it. My only intent was to divide the power draw evenly between my amps.


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## LiquidClen (Dec 27, 2005)

JimmyDee said:


> Yes.
> Because tweeters draw about 10 watts (absolute max), and midrange speakers draw about 40 watts. Whereas the midbass draw a significant amount of power.
> 
> It would be foolish to have one amp powering what might be a total of 100 watts for all four speakers, while the other amp is getting cooking hot pushing a pair of 8" midbass speakers...
> ...


That makes sense, thanks. I’m about to do similar with 2 JL 400/4’s on a 3 way active which is why I asked. Appreciate the response.


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## saltyone (Feb 2, 2019)

mumbles said:


> Hate it when that happens… oh well, first world problems, right?


I have found, if I'm quick on the draw, I can turn the volume down right before the signal is resent to music. You have to be quick though. 😁


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## vsaudi (Nov 27, 2012)

JimmyDee said:


> I couldn't get that Hertz sub to effectively play much below 40hz in that (undersized) enclosure.
> But with the Utopia sub; I need to cut 25hz and 32hz bands on the DSP, just to keep the thing from blowing itself out of the enclosure!
> 
> In all fairness;
> ...


I have the 10WM in same Basser box and really happy with the sound. I also noticed an improvement after 100 hour “breakin”. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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