# iPad digital optical out



## CarGuru

Hey, so I'm running an iPad with digital optical to a bit one. I have two methods that work but I'm looking for other ideas. I've currently been using the Pure I-20 dock and it even charges the iPad. I also used a turtle beach USB to toslink adapter in conjunction with a coolgear 12v USB hub. Any other methods?


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## slowride

Apple HDMI adapter to an HDMI to toslink adapter.


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## nubz69

Why are you considering changing from the pure i-20?


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## t3sn4f2

nubz69 said:


> Why are you considering changing from the pure i-20?


x2

The i-20 is going to give you the best of everything.  Cheap, trouble free docked functionality, low jitter from a single box device. And now that you confirmed it, it charges the iPad as well, not just trickle charing it like most though.


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## CarGuru

itsmyturn said:


> Apple HDMI adapter to an HDMI to toslink adapter.


any specific HDMI to Toslink adapter? I tried 2 and had no luck.

as for why im looking to change, im not, I just wanted to see what the other options are and what benefits/drawbacks they have


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## t3sn4f2

Some better quality hdmi to spdif extractors are from Startech, Gefen, and Kramer electronics.


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## t3sn4f2

The amazing iD100 iPad, iPhone, iPod touch digital dock


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## bengl3rt

t3sn4f2 said:


> Some better quality hdmi to spdif extractors are from Startech, Gefen, and Kramer electronics.


Can any of these do the HDMI handshake without an attached display?


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## t3sn4f2

bengl3rt said:


> Can any of these do the HDMI handshake without an attached display?


 How can you attach a display if the only hdmi port is going to the extractor?


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## bengl3rt

t3sn4f2 said:


> How can you attach a display if the only hdmi port is going to the extractor?


All of them have an HDMI out as well.

Some of the cheap ones are "dumb" boxes, and don't do the HDMI handshake themselves, relying on a display connected to the output to do it. Like this one:

For only $39.15 each when QTY 50+ purchased - 4X1 HDMI® Switcher w/ Toslink & Digital Coaxial Port (Rev.2) w/ 3D support. | Auto & Powered HDMI Switches

The only one that has definitively declared its ability to handshake HDMI *without* a display attached is this one:

Gefen, LLC - Digital Audio Decoder for HDMI



> *Optionally*, connect HDMI-compliant displays to the Decoder's HDMI outputs


As you can see there's quite a price difference between an "inline" audio extractor and a "standalone" one


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## shaneckc

Wow, I'm glad I stumbled across this thread. I've never hear of the pure i20 until now. I may have to pick one up to use with my bit one.


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## bbfoto

bengl3rt said:


> All of them have an HDMI out as well.
> 
> Some of the cheap ones are "dumb" boxes, and don't do the HDMI handshake themselves, relying on a display connected to the output to do it. Like this one:
> 
> For only $39.15 each when QTY 50+ purchased - 4X1 HDMI® Switcher w/ Toslink & Digital Coaxial Port (Rev.2) w/ 3D support. | Auto & Powered HDMI Switches
> 
> The only one that has definitively declared its ability to handshake HDMI *without* a display attached is this one:
> 
> Gefen, LLC - Digital Audio Decoder for HDMI
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see there's quite a price difference between an "inline" audio extractor and a "standalone" one


When I first tried this method of extracting digital SPDIF, I used the inexpensive Monoprice 4x switcher that you linked to and it worked perfectly even without an HDMI monitor attached to the output (both the digital Coax & Optical Toslink outputs worked simultaneously). However, I was using it in conjunction with a 5.3" Samsung Galaxy Note (GT-N7000) Phone/Tablet running Android Gingerbread v2.3.6, so YMMV. 

ATM, I would still say that the Pure i20 is the best way to do this if you're using an iDevice. We'll see what happens when Apple releases their iPad 7" with the new "mag-safe mini-dock" connector. I'm sure Apple will have an adapter to sell to you in order to use your OG 30-Pin dock connector, but who knows if it will it be compatible with the existing 30-pin digital-out docks?

I feel that they will move to wireless or possibly thunderbolt for connectivity. Time will tell.


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## Vdubbin

bengl3rt said:


> All of them have an HDMI out as well.
> 
> Some of the cheap ones are "dumb" boxes, and don't do the HDMI handshake themselves, relying on a display connected to the output to do it. Like this one:
> 
> For only $39.15 each when QTY 50+ purchased - 4X1 HDMI® Switcher w/ Toslink & Digital Coaxial Port (Rev.2) w/ 3D support. | Auto & Powered HDMI Switches
> 
> The only one that has definitively declared its ability to handshake HDMI *without* a display attached is this one:
> 
> Gefen, LLC - Digital Audio Decoder for HDMI
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see there's quite a price difference between an "inline" audio extractor and a "standalone" one



I'm currently using the monoprice adaptor with my iphone 4S and the apple digital media adaptor and it works fine for digital audio playback. its hooked up SPIDF coax to my home theater reciever but will be going in the car once the MiniDSP 2x8 arrives!


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## Vdubbin

it should be noted that i'm only using it for AUDIO and do not have a display connected to the output of the switch.....it may not work if you connect a display that isn't HDCP capable.


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## roduk

t3sn4f2 said:


> The amazing iD100 iPad, iPhone, iPod touch digital dock


I was going to say this one..

One thing I would love to know is if playing a music video (or film) which of these digital out devices allow the media to be played on the ipad screen and output the sound through the digital audio out?? (I have heard that some set the playback to the video out ports and therefore the ipad screen goes blank..)


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## Vdubbin

The iD100 is a sweet dock and even gives a AES/EBU digital output via XLR connector, but its $300! 

I'll test out tonight what happens if I play video with and without a display connected to the switch. hopefully it stays on the internal screen but still gives audio. I don't think it'll be an issue with the iphone 4s and ipad 2 but anything older that doesn't support mirroring might disable the internal screen with the digital media adaptor or i-20 hooked up.


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## Salad Fingers

Focal iBox will give you a toslink and RCA level outputs and transmits the audio over wifi. Supposed to be pretty neat.


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## bbfoto

^ It could be an plausable solution if it was <$300, but the $999 retail price is just nuts. When these devices cost more than the actual iDevice that you are using is when I have a problem with them. In this case you could purchase TWO new retina display iPad3's for the same price as the ibox.

As cool as the iBox seems, the Pure i20 is a much more cost-effective solution. You're going to be connecting your idevice to a 30-pin connector anyway for charging while you are in the car, so you might as well use the i20 instead to charge it and keep your cellular data and/or WiFi usable at the same time.


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## jtaudioacc

yup, wireless is cool, but to lose data really sucks.


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## Salad Fingers

bbfoto said:


> ^ It could be an plausable solution if it was <$300, but the $999 retail price is just nuts. When these devices cost more than the actual iDevice that you are using is when I have a problem with them. In this case you could purchase TWO new retina display iPad3's for the same price as the ibox.
> 
> As cool as the iBox seems, the Pure i20 is a much more cost-effective solution. You're going to be connecting your idevice to a 30-pin connector anyway for charging while you are in the car, so you might as well use the i20 instead to charge it and keep your cellular data and/or WiFi usable at the same time.


Apparently it is similar to a ~$3k home piece that does the same thing.

Good point on having to plug it in reguardless...




jtaudioacc said:


> yup, wireless is cool, but to lose data really sucks.


Do you think that these lose data?


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## jtaudioacc

Salad Fingers said:


> Do you think that these lose data?


yeah, from what I understand...once wifi is connected, no data. which means no apps that use data. specifically navigation apps that would suck if used in a car.

there's that other seagate or some brand that uses a hard drive to stream music to the ipad, same thing. great if all you are doing is listening to music. but i want an ipad in the car for more than that.

hopefully, i'm completely wrong, or some kind of work around has been found/made.


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## Salad Fingers

jtaudioacc said:


> yeah, from what I understand...once wifi is connected, no data. which means no apps that use data. specifically navigation apps that would suck if used in a car.
> 
> there's that other seagate or some brand that uses a hard drive to stream music to the ipad, same thing. great if all you are doing is listening to music. but i want an ipad in the car for more than that.
> 
> hopefully, i'm completely wrong, or some kind of work around has been found/made.


Sorry, I thought you meant loss of audio data. 

Yea, it does suck that it will look for internet from the wifi source. If/when I use an iPad in my truck, I will only be for music and not for any apps so it wouldn't be a biggie for me.

I like this thread!


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## t3sn4f2

I know there is a network router work around when using an Apple Airport Express. Think it involves the use of an actual router or just a parameter setting with the APE, not sure don't remember the details. 

I'll post the link to the thread if I remember, but I'm sure anyone with advanced experience in IT can figure it out quite easily.

Found it*

"Connect (your iPhone) to your (Airport) wifi and write down the IP address your router assigned you. Then, select (on the iPhone) the static tab instead of DHCP and fill in the IP address your DHCP server assigned to your iPad. Next, fill in the subnet mask but leave the rest of the fields empty.
You now have access to your wifi as well as 3G. 

Or you can also configure the router itself to do effectively the same thing on its own, making it so any device that connects won't look to the router for internet."


If all you want is a digital output and you have to have this wireless iBox/APE feature then the APE with the work around is a no brainier. And if you want that and need a high end DAC output then you can use he APE with a CEntrance DACmini CX.

CEntrance -> DACmini

http://centrance.com/products/dacmini/cx/i/dacmini_case_study.pdf 



















Thanks to the power supply designed with flexibility and mobility in mind, all you would need to use it in a car audio app is an in-line fuse. All inputs and output are highly regulated and/or isolated, even the USB port for carPC users (you won't find that anywhere theses days, not even on a Benchmark DAC).

Preamp output is at a true ~5 volts and stereophile has published a complete set of measurements so you know what you are getting, unlike the iBox. You can also get it with a master volume option on the preamp outputs so that you can control volume from it when you want to mount it up in the dash like a head unit. Then you can select source inputs on it and do volume control from one place. Go for those that want to keep an OEM head unit along with their tablet or smart phone.

This thing also runs off "driverless" USB audio. So you can connect it straight to an ipad camera kit USB port for a straight wired digital interface. CEntrance does OEM ASIO drivers for many high end USB DAC manufacturers including Benchmark, so you know they know how to do drivers correctly.

Another nice feature is it has a high quality head phone output that you can use to instantly reference how a song should sound like when tuning. The DACmini has advanced silent switching on all changes and will mute line outs when the headphone is plugged in so you can instantly hear the difference.

Price is on the highside, but in this case I really think you get what you pay for. And it approximately the same as an iBox after mods are added.

All that said, if you can go wired, not using an ipad, and don't need a digital output I would go with a pioneer 80PRS hidden away in the dash with a remotely mounted faceplate. Then run its analog output as usual. It even has high level inputs to run an OEM head though it for those that might want that.


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## AfterFx Customs

i went through this trouble a couple years ago. 
ditch the toslink fiber connection.

High Resolution Technologies - iStreamer

this product has been updated to work with ipad-2-3 for full charging. you can have the idevice screen on now and the istreamer will charge.

use the analog output directly to a BitOne. no issues. sounds the best too. no ambient hiss or noise either.

thanks-david


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## bengl3rt

Has anyone tried the Pure i20 with an iPhone 5 behind a 30 pin to Lightning adapter? I assume it would work as the USB just passes through unchanged, but you never know with these things...


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## cobb2819

I will have an answer for you on like the 25th if no one chimes in before then.


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## bengl3rt

cobb2819 said:


> I will have an answer for you on like the 25th if no one chimes in before then.


Awesome! Would appreciate it if you can post here. Thanks


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## oca123

If you just want audio, I really don't see a better option than the i20. The only gripe I have with it is that it's butt ugly bulky and heavy. In fact, if you take it apart, you will find *two weights* that are also used as spacers.
I ended up chopping mine up and making a small enclosure out of ABS. I made a small 12-15v to 7.5V and integrated it inside the same enclosure. I also relocated the 30pin connector to the side so the whole enclosure is just a rectangle, the size of ummm two packs of cigarettes next to each other.
it's held up shut with electrical tape but once I get around to it I will sand it and take some pics. I also started to relocate the IR eye but I dont really need it so I gave up on that.
The whole thing took 2h maybe, on and off over a few days.

For the 12V to 7.5V, originally when using the dock with its stock enclosure, i had a LM317-based voltage regulator but it got really hot. So this time I went a different route using a zener diode and transistor (2N3055 I think) - not only did this turn out to be cheaper, it runs cooler, is a lot easier to make (10 minutes) and so i was able to stuff it inside the enclosure for the i20.
if someone wants the layout and list of parts let me know and I will dig it up and post it here.


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## bbfoto

oca123 said:


> For the 12V to 7.5V, originally when using the dock with its stock enclosure, i had a LM317-based voltage regulator but it got really hot. So this time I went a different route using a zener diode and transistor (2N3055 I think) - not only did this turn out to be cheaper, it runs cooler, is a lot easier to make (10 minutes) and so i was able to stuff it inside the enclosure for the i20.
> if someone wants the layout and list of parts let me know and I will dig it up and post it here.


I for one would love to know the parts list and basic schematic for your custom PS/DC-DC converter/voltage regulator for the Pure i-20. Thanks!


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## Golden Ears

*DAC MINI vs Mini DAC*

Warning long detailed post.....

Hi JT! As you know I have been trying to integrate my ipad in my car. Head fi .com has been struggling with the lightning connector too.


I have an Apogee mini DAC which offers great sound but the USB is not going to see an IOS device. 

My thoughts were using ipad and kudo case to get a hdmi , and use a hdmi to spidif connection to Apogee mini DAC I have not tried it to see if mirroring works. One plus is a fully charged Kudo case and ipad will give you enough battery life that you could not run out in over 15 hours of use.

Of course you want to try and run hi rez files through the ipad using the iPad as a touch screen.

So the only thing I. Thought would work so far was this. I used to sell 3G routers.

So got to 3gstore.com. BUY a 3G /4G router and network card and you will have data over your ipad as well as being able or stream. The issue is that 3G and 4g turns off on your ipad when you use wi-fi as it connects to only one network at a time.

So as a test.... I took a wi-fi iPad 2 and connected to my Verizon iPhone 5 via its mobile hot spot to share 3G/4G data over wifi.

Then I found that the GPS of wi-fi only iPad was simply abysmal over shared 3g data on wifi and to top it off if I got a call while using Nav on the wi-fi only iPad which was super laggy and really too slow for real time driving anyhow... The phone call on Verizon knocked out my Data while using Nav so you stop getting nav updates. ( Disaster) so what about AT&T which can surf during a call ?.. AT&T sucks for Los Angeles and travel in general...makes your phone useless (dropped calls) unless traveling on main streets..and WAZE helps you to avoid traffic by taking you off busy main streets when they get congested. ... So WAZE MEANS VERIZON is necessary or you will miss and drop calls . 

I have not tried a cellular ipad yet though. But it would seem you need two data plans - one on your iphone and one on your ipad uuuughhhhh. And if you are navigating one your cellular ipad (ideal....see link below huge screen far better than iPhone 5 ...I mount mine over my center console not windscreen as in YouTube vid) and want to control your laptop,using the "remote app" you would have to turn your cellular ipad into a hotspot. This is lame because the hotspot connection is not very stable and I find I have to constantly reconnect if I lose connection or sleep the laptop. 

Too bad because using the iPad and "remote" I can run pure music on the laptop and stream 24bit/192kHz files to my Apogee mini DAC from my laptop over FIREWIRE 400 ( you can also get a USB Apogee mini DAC instead of FireWire) , and the Apogee mini DAC allows for SPdif optical, spdif coaxial, and AES/EBU Digital inputs as well. ( means cd changer digital coxial spdif in, and airport express spdif optical in for AirPlay from iOS devices and laptops of passengers ( limited to 24 bit 48kHz), and AES/EBU digital to spdif converter in for Sirius or blu- ray player... Or 1st gen Apple TV with huge upgraded video harddrive.

Using a wadia 171 dock and the older ipad 3 with 30 Pin would work as apogee mini DAC would not see the iOS device ( it would see the wadia ) and interface fine. But I tried an older wadia i170 and found the digital spdif coaxial out using ipod 4th gen and lossless was very audibly inferior to a streamed airport express signal to spidif optical ....both were sent to the apogee mini DAC.

The best resolution would be the antelope DAC with the apple camera conection kit (CCK) which can get a 24 bit 384khz signal through without down sampling... But I have not heard this DAC and sample rate is not the only factor in DACs for SQ.

One note... With iPhone 5 using WAZE while getting a call WAZE continues to NAV in the background ( not sure if it will do reroutes on the fly though) and stil gives you voice prompts as you near each way point to turn. Or exit. Much better than apples maps which just dies if you get a call over Verizon.

http://youtu.be/tmwvSOR8fl0

See it on ipad. 

WAZE rules for Los angles traffic. It has become my killer app. With digital out YU would be able to hear WAZE over iPads digital dock ...but not over airplay.

So unfortunately to do everything I need. 

1. talk on phone ( verizon iPhone with data plan)
2.run laptop hi rez using remote from ipad must have data plan or incoming call wipes out wi-fi from Verizon iPhone 5 hotspot
3. Nav using WAZE and iPad

I would need a iPhone with data, iPad withe cellular data for waze and iPad mini with data for remote...and shudder to think about updating all devices every year.
Using remote on iPhone 5 is lame ...less detailed GUI and tiny screen.

There has got to be a better solution.


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## oca123

bbfoto said:


> I for one would love to know the parts list and basic schematic for your custom PS/DC-DC converter/voltage regulator for the Pure i-20. Thanks!


This is what I use. you could add some caps to improve stability but i'm not sure there is a benefit, especially if the run between the DC-DC converter and the I-20 if short.
I got jitter from the i-20 once, due to a lose B+ wire (while testing stuff out) but that's it.

You could use a LM-based regulator design, but the I20 draws a lot of current, so you would need to heatsink the regulator. It's also a bit more complex. That was the route I went at first, but the LM melted because I didn't put a heatsink on it.

Or you could just buy a DC-DC converter, but that's a fun killer.


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## Golden Ears

The apogee min DAC was designed to run off of battery power 6-16 volts and works no matter the state of my battery.

Btw...in keeping with this... I also tried setting up airport express wi-fi from my home network and put ipad and my laptop on that same wifi network and used "Remote app" to control the laptop running Pure music program over iTunes to play 24bit/192kHz files and it works for a bit then freezes when driving if airport express can not get Internet because iTunes goes nuts without Internet....and of course genius stops working too.


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## Golden Ears

ok,

I got two Verizon iPhone 5's. Pretending that one of them is a Verizon Ipad... I set up a hot spot with the ipad and shared the 3g/4g connection to my laptop and the other iPhone 5.

The end result. You can Nav with Waze on the iPhone sharing the hotspot connection (the ipad) you can use remote from the Iphone to control Itunes... but you lose the ability to control itunes through remote on the 1st iPhone (iPad).

So you end up using remote on the iphone for ...not ideal. If you 2nd iphone was a Ipad mini phablet... it would be ok.


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## lovedoc1

I am completing my third gen ipad instal using the i20 and bit.1. My question is about the initial setup with the bit.1. T calibrate the master input level you must turn the source unit up to its maximum undistorted volume level. What level did you all use on the ipad for the maximum undistorted volume level?


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## AfterFx Customs

why are you wasting your time trying to figure out volume output and such?

High Resolution Technologies - iStreamer-12V

this product will save you a tremendous amount of time.


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## lovedoc1

Even if I went this route, which I did not, I would still need to go through the same setup on the Bit.1 just using different inputs. 

I really don't understand the thinking behind the istreamer route, unless your company sells them, especially if you are using the B1 anyway. On top of the istreamer you have to purchase a 30-pin cable and possibly a 90degree pass through depending on your install. 

With the i20 I use the DAC in the B1, no extra cable needed due to the length of the internal connection, and the dock piece is already a 90 degree piece. Plus it is smaller and lighter. I installed mine right on the back of the ipad mold. So, in summary the istreamer is more expensive, larger, heavier, no digital out, and needs more wires/connectors.


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## oca123

Volume all the way up gives me 0db undistorted from the i20 on its spdif output.


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## AfterFx Customs

you dont have to purchase a 30 pin usb cable, its included. 
the istreamer is about 2.25" x .75" x 5". so mounting the unit is very simple.

yes we sell the istreamer, it works excellent. we have tried many products from convoluted ways of an onkyo DAC, "your beloved i20", to simple cables. we have stopped trying products because the istreamer works the best in our applications. the product isnt all that expensive for what you are getting.

but all in all, if you found a product that you feel works the best for you. then great. 

im a firm believer of the istreamer along with other shops that have used the product too.


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## lovedoc1

oca123 said:


> Volume all the way up gives me 0db undistorted from the i20 on its spdif output.


Thanks!


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## cobb2819

AfterFx Customs said:


> why are you wasting your time trying to figure out volume output and such?
> 
> High Resolution Technologies - iStreamer-12V
> 
> this product will save you a tremendous amount of time.


I thought the title of the thread was iPad to Optical...this post doesn't have anything to do with the thread.


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## oca123

I like optical. No need to setup input sensitivity if using a processor, no risk of hum hiss ground noise, ever.
i looked at the istreamer that is linked to above, and the i20 does the exact same thing (white+red RCA line out)
but does the istreamer provide:
RCA video?
Optical?
A remote control?

How much does the istreamer cost?

Sure, the i20 is fugly, it doesn't have audiophile written on it, and its a little larger (though that can be fixed, mine is tiny now, smaller than your istreamer )
and I venture to guess, it's cheaper, because it wasn't "approved by apple" unlike the istreamer, whose maker probably has to pay apple for every unit sold


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## creed

I would be very interested and learn how u managed to shrink down the Pure I-20 size to something smaller than iStreamer.

Care to shed some lights?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## emilime75

While I haven't tried it, the Apple camera connection kit for the iPad seems to be a good way of converting from the Apple 30 pin connector to USB, at which point a USB to whatever audio convertor can be used. A long discussion can be read about it here iPad to Support USB Audio Interfaces via Camera Connection Kit?

It's also pretty cheap, like 30 bucks at WalMart, but, I don't think it charges the pad while in use so it isn't a good option for a permanent install. However, I would be surprised if someone hasn't popped it open yet and found/soldered a charging unit to the right pins to allow charging.


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## lovedoc1

creed said:


> I would be very interested and learn how u managed to shrink down the Pure I-20 size to something smaller than iStreamer.
> 
> Care to shed some lights?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


If you leave them both in their cases the iStreamer is much smaller. There is quilt a bit of room around the board of the i20 plus space accommodating 2 weights inside the housing. I put the board in the back of my fiberglass mount. The boards are probably pretty similar in size actually.


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## cobb2819

lovedoc1 said:


> If you leave them both in their cases the iStreamer is much smaller. There is quilt a bit of room around the board of the i20 plus space accommodating 2 weights inside the housing. I put the board in the back of my fiberglass mount. The boards are probably pretty similar in size actually.


I also desoldered the component video output board from the main board, and that saved a little more also. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## t3sn4f2

What are you guys doing for shielding?


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## cobb2819

t3sn4f2 said:


> What are you guys doing for shielding?


Shielding??


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## t3sn4f2

cobb2819 said:


> Shielding??


EMI, RF. I'm sure there is more to the i-20's case than just a structural housing.


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## cobb2819

t3sn4f2 said:


> EMI, RF. I'm sure there is more to the i-20's case than just a structural housing.


The factory case is only plastic, nothing special about it. I have mine mounted to abs and have no noise at all with the optical.


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## t3sn4f2

cobb2819 said:


> The factory case is only plastic, nothing special about it. I have mine mounted to abs and have no noise at all with the optical.


They use a special metalized paint on the interior to keep cost down when using plastic housings. The bitone uses this type if paint. Also some plastics are shielded as well. 

I'd just caution those that remove it from the case is since everyone's environment is not the same. Personally I'd move it into a tiny shielded electronics hobby box.


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## oca123

mine is now in an anodized aluminum case that i had CNCed with a plexiglass top. no issues. i will take a pic and post. its not super clean looking but it does the job. golden ears was over here yesterday and he saw it.
you could use a radioshack hobbycase too


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## sotelomichael

oca123 said:


> mine is now in an anodized aluminum case that i had CNCed with a plexiglass top. no issues. i will take a pic and post. its not super clean looking but it does the job. golden ears was over here yesterday and he saw it.
> you could use a radioshack hobbycase too


Some pics would be great if you would please post them. Thanks!

Also, I'm barely making the move to digital out/in on an iPad for a freshly acquired drx9255 

Does anyone know if there's a proven method into getting the newer 7" iPad working on pure digital out? 

Since the clarion can be fooled into accepting optical in from a hard drive/media player, I'd be very interested in doing a small screen iPad install with the drx9255 doing the DAC off the iPads digital out.

Any help/link/advice would be greatly appreciated


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## AfterFx Customs

You're probably going to run into the same problem as the regular iPad. We haven't tried the mini yet, but it should be the same as the new iPad 3 the lightning connector. 
If it is? I'm going to then recommend the method that's been working for us by using the iStreamer.


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## sotelomichael

If what I'm reading is correct, the istreamer connects to an analog input. That's not what I am looking for. Furthermore, it is doing the conversion on its own DAC. Which I don't want. I want the drx to do the digital to analog conversion. Unless I am mistaken, I don't see how this device would work for me since my head unit doesn't have an iPod app.


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## AfterFx Customs

So how the iStreamer works is it tells the iDevice that an Apple approved device is trying to connect to it via digital. Through its own DAC brings the output voltage up to 2.25v in an RCA (analog) form. 

Honestly, you're wasting your time trying to find a "digital" anything. We/I spent months figuring this out, spending countless amounts of cash on different products, until i was told about the iStreamer. 
The iStreamer has proven itself time and time again. 
If you feel you know better and want to explore, by all means go for it. 

Question for you. The DRX has RCA input correct? 

Why would you need an app?


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## cobb2819

The pure i20 works very with with a lightning to 30pin adaptor. Tried it out last weekend. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Golden Ears

t3sn4f2 said:


> They use a special metalized paint on the interior to keep cost down when using plastic housings. The bitone uses this type if paint. Also some plastics are shielded as well.
> 
> I'd just caution those that remove it from the case is since everyone's environment is not the same. Personally I'd move it into a tiny shielded electronics hobby box.


If you want to shield it you could wrap it in Mu-metal foil. That stuff is pretty amazing at blocking noise. 

One of the issues I have with an iPhone>ALO line out dock>TTVJ Tube amp is when I get a text message or someone near me gets a text message I hear it coming in over the amplifier.

MU-metal foil would shield it.

But just pump up the gains, maybe park near some high tension wires and text and if you hear nothing...I would not bother shielding.


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## Golden Ears

My lovely sounding Apogee mini DAC... is now, sady history. i sold it to a fellow and bought, what looks to be a very promising unit. One that looks ideal for Car audio....except..it's big...


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## sotelomichael

AfterFx Customs said:


> So how the iStreamer works is it tells the iDevice that an Apple approved device is trying to connect to it via digital. Through its own DAC brings the output voltage up to 2.25v in an RCA (analog) form.
> 
> Honestly, you're wasting your time trying to find a "digital" anything. We/I spent months figuring this out, spending countless amounts of cash on different products, until i was told about the iStreamer.
> The iStreamer has proven itself time and time again.
> If you feel you know better and want to explore, by all means go for it.
> 
> Question for you. The DRX has RCA input correct?
> 
> Why would you need an app?


I see what you mean now.

No, the DRX does not have an RCA input, only 4 RCA ouputs, and 1 optical input.

I thought I read in your post that I needed an ipad app. My mistake.


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## lovedoc1

To anyone who is using the pure i20: When the ipad is docked does siri come through the internal ipad speaker or through your external/car speakers? When I have my ipad sitting on my dock Siri comes out of the ipad internal speakers.


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## lovedoc1

I switched the charger to 9v and it seems to be working better. It is only 300ma though. I think this may be a problem. Will the 9v switch damage the pure i20? Should I get a different inverter?


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## t3sn4f2

lovedoc1 said:


> I switched the charger to 9v and it seems to be working better. It is only 300ma though. I think this may be a problem. Will the 9v switch damage the pure i20? Should I get a different inverter?


Better in what sense?


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## lovedoc1

When it was 7.5 within a few minutes the iPad would switch to not charging. If I did nothin on the iPad it would charge over time. If I was playing music and doing other things it would discharge. Since I have changed it to 9v the iPad never shows not charging no matter what I am doing on it.


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## t3sn4f2

lovedoc1 said:


> When it was 7.5 within a few minutes the iPad would switch to not charging. If I did nothin on the iPad it would charge over time. If I was playing music and doing other things it would discharge. Since I have changed it to 9v the iPad never shows not charging no matter what I am doing on it.


Sound like you need more amps at 7.5 volts. I dunno enough to say it's safe to run it at 9 volts but it probably isn't and you are likely lucky that current is lacking at 9 or it could have blown it if the PS was strong enough. You need something with 2 amps at 7.5 volts.


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## lovedoc1

I finally finished getting it ll in. This is my ipad install. It's my first use of fiberglass and bondo so it's not quite OEM looking but it works. I like how it all turned out.


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## lovedoc1

t3sn4f2 said:


> Sound like you need more amps at 7.5 volts. I dunno enough to say it's safe to run it at 9 volts but it probably isn't and you are likely lucky that current is lacking at 9 or it could have blown it if the PS was strong enough. You need something with 2 amps at 7.5 volts.


I am going to get the power stream PS that was recommended in a previous thread.


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## oca123

kinda overdue, but here are some ghetto pics. i replaced the CNC lexan top with a smoked plexi top and I put in a new, longer ribbon connected which i reinforced with some duct tape and then wrapped with tech flex.
The whole thing is a lot thinner. My processor is next to one of my amps on my rack, and because the processor is thinner, it is mounted on two mounting tabs so it is level with the amp. The i20 now fits UNDER the processor and I made a very short optical cable (2 inches long, if even) to connect the i20 to the processor.

The PSU under the rack, so I dont have a picture of it, but its roughly the size of a small BIC ligther.



















I will also admit that I did this mod not because it was functional (though it is) but more for the hell of it.


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## tuner culture

ok, Im looking to switch my HU for a IPAD mini. I would lik to run the IPAD Mini > optical > Bitone processor.

So if i run IPAD Mini > lighting connetctor to 30 pin converter> i-20 > optical out of >i-20 to > Audison Bitone.

How are you charging the IPAD Mini > I-20? how are you getting power to the i-20?

I would also like modify the i-20 to make it smaller in size to hide behind Ipad Minin in the dash.


Appreciate any help or flow diagrams of how you did this.


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## matdotcom2000

Can you control volume with the optical out of the i-20?


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## t3sn4f2

matdotcom2000 said:


> Can you control volume with the optical out of the i-20?


Yes but



t3sn4f2 said:


> The i20 has a digital domain master volume control which affects both the digital output and the analog stage simultaneously. However it is of very poor resolution (relative to others but maybe not in absolute terms), and it has a linear increment implementation that makes it all but functionally useless IME. ~30dB range only, instead of the typical 80dB. Plus it gets really loud really quick from the lowest setting (ie linear instead of LOG based).
> 
> Setting the volume to max bypasses it completely for both stages.
> 
> The remote is also low quality and need firm button presses aimed directly at the base, IME.


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## matdotcom2000

Thanks a bunch.. I am planning on dissassembling the i20 and putting a new IR on it and mounting it in the cabin to be accessable



t3sn4f2 said:


> Yes but


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## mathematics

why not just go wirelessly to an airport express and optical out of that to whatever you want? no cable runs from front to rear. all you have to do is mount the charging cable.


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## Golden Ears

mathematics said:


> why not just go wirelessly to an airport express and optical out of that to whatever you want? no cable runs from front to rear. all you have to do is mount the charging cable.


You need a network- and could use a seagate drive .

Airtunes is limited to 16bit 48kHz... and the new onkyo app whcih allows for hi- rez doesn't stream over airtunes.

There are newer wireless hirez formats however- but itunes integration is key the car. Particularly if you have a mute switch so you can mute and speak to your ipad.


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## mathematics

the network is provided by the airport express

i don't have anything higher than 16 bit / 44.1kHz / 320 kbps, so airplay works for me. If you need higher resolution (seems pointless in a car, however), then yea, you'd have to go with a different option.


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## UNFORGIVEN

shaneckc said:


> Wow, I'm glad I stumbled across this thread. I've never hear of the pure i20 until now. I may have to pick one up to use with my bit one.


Just be aware you're taking a chance that you may need to invest in a Audison SFC. I had popping and noise issues with my bit one and pure-i20


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## ccapil

Another option I'm thinking on doing in my new car is my ipad in my dash, straight to the mosconi dsp via AMAS Bluetooth streaming. That way there is no toslink wires or anything to run between the ipad and dsp or amps itself. It will give you high quality Bluetooth streaming. Also another plus is you can take your ipad out of the dash so a passenger can pick it up and choose music or browse the internet etc, since there are no connections like you would have connecting the ipad to a i20 etc. Plus I've heard there is no difference sound wise between fully optical with say a i20 and wireless AMAS.


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## bbfoto

ccapil said:


> Another option I'm thinking on doing in my new car is my ipad in my dash, straight to the mosconi dsp via AMAS Bluetooth streaming. That way there is no toslink wires or anything to run between the ipad and dsp or amps itself. It will give you high quality Bluetooth streaming. Also another plus is you can take your ipad out of the dash so a passenger can pick it up and choose music or browse the internet etc, since there are no connections like you would have connecting the ipad to a i20 etc. Plus I've heard there is no difference sound wise between fully optical with say a i20 and wireless AMAS.


Using my APT-X BT connection is REALLY convenient and sounds great. In my setup I have a separate APT-X BT receiver module going into my processor, and both of my main sources...Samsung Galaxy Note 8.0 (GT-N5100) and Galaxy Note II (GT-N7100)...have APT-X BT support built-in.

I haven't used the Mosconi DSP yet. Does the AMAS Bluetooth Module support the Hi-Res APT-X codec? Standard (non-APT-X) BT is quite lossy. However, even when using BT with APT-X, I can distinguish a difference between the wireless BT connection and a "hard-wired", direct SPDIF Coaxial or Toslink Optical connection to my processor.

It's not a HUGE difference, but I can definitely tell with careful listening. When you're driving it won't matter, but using a direct connection (non-BT) in my install with the engine off during quiet, focused listening evaluation, the individual vocals and instruments have a smaller, more pin-point source, and therefor have more space between each instrument and/or vocal (e.g. a golf ball size image using direct connection, as opposed to a softball size image using BT).

The sound stage isn't necessarily wider overall, but it _seems_ like it is due to having more space _between_ each pin-point instrument and/or vocal. So basically, better separation overall and more pin-point imaging when using good recordings.

Stage depth is better too, but not as noticeable as the improved separation/width. It is noticeable however with tracks with a lead vocal (front & center) backed by a choir, or any track recorded with good depth (e.g. Sara K.'s "If I Could Sing Your Blues" from the Chesky Ultimate Demonstration Disc, or Jimmy Cliff's "Bongo Man" from the Give Thanx disc).

With a direct connection, there also seems to be more detail, definition, or a crisper/clearer sound, but this may be side effect of the more focused imaging and placement. 

So, for everyday driving I will use the BT connection and my smartphone/phablet...it's just too easy and does sound fantastic. But when I'm stopped and focused on listening and/or tuning, I'll use a direct connection.

HTH


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## t3sn4f2

bbfoto said:


> Using my APT-X BT connection is REALLY convenient and sounds great. In my setup I have a separate APT-X BT receiver module going into my processor, and both of my main sources...Samsung Galaxy Note 8.0 (GT-N5100) and Galaxy Note II (GT-N7100)...have APT-X BT support built-in.
> 
> I haven't used the Mosconi DSP yet. Does the AMAS Bluetooth Module support the Hi-Res APT-X codec? Standard (non-APT-X) BT is quite lossy. However, even when using BT with APT-X, I can distinguish a difference between the wireless BT connection and a "hard-wired", direct SPDIF Coaxial or Toslink Optical connection to my processor.
> 
> It's not a HUGE difference, but I can definitely tell with careful listening. When you're driving it won't matter, but using a direct connection (non-BT) in my install with the engine off during quiet, focused listening evaluation, the individual vocals and instruments have a smaller, more pin-point source, and therefor have more space between each instrument and/or vocal (e.g. a golf ball size image using direct connection, as opposed to a softball size image using BT).
> 
> The sound stage isn't necessarily wider overall, but it _seems_ like it is due to having more space _between_ each pin-point instrument and/or vocal. So basically, better separation overall and more pin-point imaging when using good recordings.
> 
> Stage depth is better too, but not as noticeable as the improved separation/width. It is noticeable however with tracks with a lead vocal (front & center) backed by a choir, or any track recorded with good depth (e.g. Sara K.'s "If I Could Sing Your Blues" from the Chesky Ultimate Demonstration Disc, or Jimmy Cliff's "Bongo Man" from the Give Thanx disc).
> 
> With a direct connection, there also seems to be more detail, definition, or a crisper/clearer sound, but this may be side effect of the more focused imaging and placement.
> 
> So, for everyday driving I will use the BT connection and my smartphone/phablet...it's just too easy and does sound fantastic. But when I'm stopped and focused on listening and/or tuning, I'll use a direct connection.
> 
> HTH


How long does it take from the time you turn on the receiver till the time you can here music from it?


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## Schizm

oca123 said:


> This is what I use. you could add some caps to improve stability but i'm not sure there is a benefit, especially if the run between the DC-DC converter and the I-20 if short.
> I got jitter from the i-20 once, due to a lose B+ wire (while testing stuff out) but that's it.
> 
> You could use a LM-based regulator design, but the I20 draws a lot of current, so you would need to heatsink the regulator. It's also a bit more complex. That was the route I went at first, but the LM melted because I didn't put a heatsink on it.
> 
> Or you could just buy a DC-DC converter, but that's a fun killer.


I realize this is very very late...but would you have a picture of your converter before you enclosed it?

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Xparent Green Tapatalk 2


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## Figzls1

CarGuru said:


> Hey, so I'm running an iPad with digital optical to a bit one. I have two methods that work but I'm looking for other ideas. I've currently been using the Pure I-20 dock and it even charges the iPad. I also used a turtle beach USB to toslink adapter in conjunction with a coolgear 12v USB hub. Any other methods?


Do you still have the focal 6x9 I'm in desperate need of them!!!
Please email me if so
[email protected]


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