# Oscilloscope



## foosman

What size oscope do you use strictly for car audio (gain matching, etc) Ebay has so many different ones, all I really need is 20 to 20k. Is there any reason to buy one with higher range. Thanks


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## killerb87

i use a 60mhz tektronix 2213 scope and that is overkill. it is a good scope and can be had pretty cheap.


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## ErinH

I'd like to know the same. I'm looking to purchase one for a bench setup. I'd like to find something on the cheap, but I don't think $50 gets much. 


subscribed*


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## killerb87

i got a great deal on a tektronix 2247a 4 channel scope on ebay for $220 with the probes. keep on looking, you will find something.


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## foosman

I guess my main question is whether these big scopes will read down to the 20hz to 20K range. I've noticed the range on some dont come down to zero. I'm using it primarily for voltage anyway. Just hate to buy something that will not do other things I might learn about in the future.
I need to be able to play a test tone at a given freq and see the graph to maximize the output signal b4 clipping. Will all of them do this??


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## RYNOMOTO

I got a Tektronix 465B from ebay for $105 in good shape... then bought a good phillips 1x-10x probe for $19.99 shipped brand new...

as recommended by www.bcae1.com


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## killerb87

i would really stress getting a scope with a readout, its a pain to count the divisions for applitude and frequency.


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## foosman

Any examples??


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## chad

foosman said:


> Any examples??


Tektronix TDS340, stupid easy to use, has all the display and math you need but expensive


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## foosman

How about a stupid easy one that isn't expensive.


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## killerb87

tektronix 2247a


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## imjustjason

foosman said:


> How about a stupid easy one that isn't expensive.


I am thinking about getting one of these... 

http://www.designnotes.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=HPS10&Category_Code=

You can get them off of fleaBay for around 125 bucks... for car stereo app's, gains and what not it should be perfect. 

Anybody have experiences with one... good or bad?


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## 2f150

foosman said:


> What size oscope do you use strictly for car audio (gain matching, etc) Ebay has so many different ones, all I really need is 20 to 20k. Is there any reason to buy one with higher range. Thanks


You dont need to buy a fast oscope for audio. Like you said you'll be working in the audible range, so 20 to 20k is all you need to look at. These newer models $2k and up for ex, are supplied to keep up with the increasing speed of the newer electronics. If you won't be doing any high speed design, dont worry about bells and whistles. Best thing to do would be to understand how it works and how to use it, then you know what to buy. 

Go for an older tektronics or similar model. I found my 20Mhz tek for 50 bucks and it came with 4 probes from the local tweeker. He should have another one left. Prob stolen I cant justify spending money for ones like we had in school.


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## ErinH

So, as far as I can see, you simply try to find a 2-channel o-scope and that’s it?

I saw one that was a one-channel and came with a probe, but you’re going to need 2 probes, correct?


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## chad

You really don't NEED a dual trace scope but single trace scopes really aren't that much less expensive. Used is key here.


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## ErinH

yea, I'm looking at used ones on e-bay.

this is it:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Tektronics-310-...39:1|66:2|65:12|240:1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

I don’t know anything about these suckers. So, if it only has one probe, how does it work? Does it not need a +/- (2 probes)? 

I’m with Foos, here. I’m just looking for something cheap to plug into the amp’s terminals and adjust gain until I can see clipping. Nothing more, nothing less. Thus, it’s why I’m not for spending a lot of money since I won’t use it much.


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## ErinH

dbl post


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## chad

That fekin thing is older than your mother Bikini, I'd look a little newer


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## CheshRcat

It's way overkill for audio applications, but I have a Tek 2440 with (2) probes I could sell for $350 shipped.

I may also be able to get my hands on Tek 2236 for $150 shipped -- I ran into a guy a couple weeks ago who had 5 of them he was trying to get rid of.


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## chad

A 2236 for 150 is a kickass deal.


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## ErinH

so sub-$100 is probably out of the question, huh?


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## chad

Sell me your car for 500 bucks, as it stands now and I'll give you a scope.

How much do you have wrapped up an a SINGLE ****ing midbass?


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## ErinH

I use the midbasses EVERY DAY! For AT LEAST an hour! 
I'd use the o-scope once a month. 

Do the math! Jeez!!!!!


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## chad

It's a tool, a specialized one at that, I have plenty of tools worth more than 150 bucks I use less than my scope


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## imjustjason

Sooo...... what about the:

HPS10 : Velleman HANDHELD OSCILLOSCOPE 

Yes, no, maybe... I'm a moron?!

It looks like the perfect thing for use in a car... IDK?


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## chad

Never used one, don't like he resolution of hand-held scopes, especially cheap ones.


_Next Question....._

How much would you RENT a scope for? In yall's eyes what would be a good price and for what time frame.


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## CheshRcat

I would think shipping would drive the cost up too high...


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## killerb87

chad said:


> Never used one, don't like he resolution of hand-held scopes, especially cheap ones.
> 
> i agree about the resolution. its too hard to see when its clipping.


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## chad

killerb87 said:


> chad said:
> 
> 
> 
> Never used one, don't like he resolution of hand-held scopes, especially cheap ones.
> 
> i agree about the resolution. its too hard to see when its clipping.
> 
> 
> 
> To hard to see anything but ups and downs....
Click to expand...


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## chad

CheshRcat said:


> I would think shipping would drive the cost up too high...


the one I'm looking at is lighter than most, but would certainly be cased in an ATA case inside a cardboard box/foam.


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## tspence73

This one is cheap and local. Is it any good as a noob's toy project tool? :blush:
http://lasvegas.craigslist.org/ele/874614428.html


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## tspence73

Oooo. This one ain't bad. Hook it up to a laptop!
http://www.linkinstruments.com/mso19.htm


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## CheshRcat

tspence73 said:


> This one is cheap and local. Is it any good as a noob's toy project tool? :blush:
> http://lasvegas.craigslist.org/ele/874614428.html


Good buy...it'll do the job and then some. I'm not sure how available parts are if it doesn't work or breaks, but for the price there's no gamble.


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## Oliver

Working ? or only powers up ? 
better call and do a local pick up !

check on getting parts for it before you buy !!

http://lasvegas.craigslist.org/ele/874614428.html


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## chad

CheshRcat said:


> Good buy...it'll do the job and then some. I'm not sure how available parts are if it doesn't work or breaks, but for the price there's no gamble.


I'd still spend the extra 100 for the tek you were talking about, in fact I'm trying to push myself away from it  I'd have to put the 50 dollar one in a rack and the tek has a handle, soft rounded edges, etc whereas that rack mount unit would be a man-killer to haul out to the car.


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## ErinH

let's get some Teks, Chad! $150!?


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## chad

CheshRcat said:


> It's way overkill for audio applications, but I have a Tek 2440 with (2) probes I could sell for $350 shipped.
> 
> I may also be able to get my hands on Tek 2236 for $150 shipped -- I ran into a guy a couple weeks ago who had 5 of them he was trying to get rid of.





bikinpunk said:


> let's get some Teks, Chad! $150!?


See, I have a scope, and RMS voltmeter and freq counter, The 2236 (still think it's a kiler deal) has a 100 meg freq counter which for me would kill 2 birds with one stone, I don't however see a dire need for a freq counter for dialing in a rig. The 2240 has a voltage readout on the display, so for 350 you look at the waveform, see right where it tickles the top of the rails and read voltage, bingo, one glance, done! To do the exact same thing with the 2236 you would need a true RMS voltmeter which can run you easily 150-200 bucks for a good one so you are back at the price of the 2240, but you have a seperate meter for when you don't want to drag the scope out.

The TDS340 is digital, it has an autoset feature, shove it an input, hit autoset and bam, a waveform in perfect resolution, you can work from there, that's what makes it so stupid easy. It also corrects for /10 function on the probe, if you switch to /10 on most setups and are shobing it 34.3V then it reads 3.43, the TDS340 senses this and keeps the voltage reading at 34.3 
If I buy another I think I'm gonna go "all out" within my means and buy something like the TDS340 with a PC interface.

Chad


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## ErinH

I’m going to e-mail my old Measurements instructor and see if he has any oscopes around that he’d like to get rid of. 

I have a true RMS DMM. But, I do like the simplicity of an all in one unit. I actually like the handheld Jason linked, but apparently it’s not that good of an idea.


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## ErinH

Figured work would have some, but nope. There's a lot of stuff but the sale price is likely going to go into the hundreds.

Did some searching locally and found this:
http://huntsville.craigslist.org/tls/900171653.html

http://huntsville.craigslist.org/ele/872652902.html

^ this one is listed 3 times. Originally was asking $200, then $150, now $125 obo.


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## chad

bikinpunk said:


> I’m going to e-mail my old Measurements instructor and see if he has any oscopes around that he’d like to get rid of.
> 
> I have a true RMS DMM. But, I do like the simplicity of an all in one unit. I actually like the handheld Jason linked, but apparently it’s not that good of an idea.


Handhelds with great resolution are VERY expensive, in fact ont he digital TDS340 it's "refresh" was not real time and for doing tube bias work on gee-tar amps I preferred analog, I just rocked 2 scopes, one was used for tube stuff a bunch.


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## chad

bikinpunk said:


> Figured work would have some, but nope. There's a lot of stuff but the sale price is likely going to go into the hundreds.
> 
> Did some searching locally and found this:
> http://huntsville.craigslist.org/tls/900171653.html
> 
> http://huntsville.craigslist.org/ele/872652902.html
> 
> ^ this one is listed 3 times. Originally was asking $200, then $150, now $125 obo.


The 150 tek shipped is still a bettar deal.....


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## ErinH

The $75 (first link)... is that something I wouldn't want? I could probably get $50 for it and the guy lives in my city. If that would work for my application it seems like a no brainer to me.

Forgive me, I know nothing about oscopes. I'm just looking for a simple plug & chug. 

Could probably get $100 for the other one I linked.


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## chad

Anyone that says "works great" and the trace rotation is THAT off is nucking futs, My leader has a trace rotation trimmer on the front, don't know about that one.


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## ErinH

chad said:


> Anyone that says "works great" and the trace rotation is THAT off is nucking futs, My leader has a trace rotation trimmer on the front, don't know about that one.


lol. I see your point.

I'll see if the other guy could do $100. 

edit: nvmnd. dude sold it.


2236 might just be it for me...


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## CheshRcat

There are still a couple 2236's and 2235's in the pile -- I'll have to arrange to test them out, but that's not a big deal.

The 2236 has a built in RMS DMM that reads from the probe or from separate test probes via side connectors. The accuracy is comparable to a Fluke bench DMM which is a bit better than the 87 series V I usually use.

Chad, if you want to go all out, I have another source that will sell a TDS420 for $450 w/2 probes...I was very tempted to pick one up myself, but I couldn't justify the cost vs the 2236.


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## CheshRcat

Since I didn't want to deal with shipping, I was offering a Tek 475 on the "Washington Meet" thread for $50, a beer, and a demo of your system or tips on mine. 

I bought this before I found the 2236, but it has some issues -- channel A works fine (tested against the 2236), but Channel B not so much. Also, the vert pos knob for Channel A is broken off, but I have the piece so it can be epoxied or maybe soldered back on. There are a lot of parts for these on ebay, but I don't have the time to mess with it. If you want to pick up actual shipping costs, I can box it up for you.

Due to the problems it has, I don't really recommend it as a first scope unless you have somebody who knows more about them to check it out. But if you want a full featured scope for a cut-rate price, this might be for you.


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## chad

The deal on that 420 is not helping my savings venture


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## CheshRcat

Ah, but tools are an investment! ;-)


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