# Finally an Audio Forum That Doesn't Suck (long rant on car audio today)



## ender

Hey everyone out there, my name is Chris and I have been a professional installer for the past 9 years or so. I have been on many audio forums in the past and it looks like I have finally found one that puts more of the emphasis on the install rather than the equipment. I have been trolling through your site and while there are a few pretentious brand whores on this site it is far less than most. There has been a huge change in car audio today, back when I got into this if you had $10,000 to spend on a system most would spend $7000 on the install and $3000 on the equipment, nowadays if you have that same $10,000 to spend most would spend $9500 on the parts and then pay their neighbors kid $500 to toss it all in and wonder why those $1500 components barely sound better than their stock Bose, their amp always gets so hot they could grill an egg on it, their battery keeps dying, and theri headlights dim so much they might as well be off. I have made a lot of people very mad at SQ competitions when they find out that I am running some piece of crap Walmart special components and they sound better than their MB Quarts or Focals or Morels... because I have put the time and energy into sound dampening the crap out of the doors, building small enclosures for the mids inside the doors, and doing things like using time alignment and a nice parametric EQ with and RTA to get the absolute best out of what little I could afford. The thing that I really don't understand is that installers creativity has almost completely died. If I had some of the parts and materials back then that I have access to now I could have done some amazing things, but nobody wants to pay for nice installs anymore, they would rather just pay for nice stuff. It is also nice to find some people that look at a class ab amp that is rated at 1200 watts but fused at 30 amps and say that either the amp is running on a 40 volt circuit, its running at 278% efficiency, or somebody is full of crap. What I am trying to say with all of this is that it is very refreshing to find people out there like me. You will definitely be hearing more from me. Nice to meet all of you. Thanks for reading my rant.


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## ender

Feel free to call me out if you think I am wrong, on the same hand, let me know if you think I am right.

p.s. Sorry about the use of really really old phrases, I use them all the time. I guess I spent a little too much time with my grand parents when I was younger. 

p.p.s. I get questions about my handle all the time on other forums and anyone who likes to read some good sci fi novels already know where its from. If you don't know where its from then you need to read Enders Game by Orson Scott Card. I am not really a sci fi type of guy but that book is incredible.


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## fredridge

You should run some kicker L7's those are awesome and seriously bump


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## capnxtreme

I'm just here to figure out how to wire my L7's to get the right ohms.


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## chad

More Illinois members!

Watchout SoCal, we are catching up!


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## bretti_kivi

lol 

90% install, 10% components 

actually, that would pretty much fit my install...... hmm. Am I a cheapskate?


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## ender

bretti_kivi said:


> lol
> 
> 90% install, 10% components
> 
> actually, that would pretty much fit my install...... hmm. Am I a cheapskate?


Same here man... I have never had half as much money as the people who I compete against so I have to get every last bit out of what I have. I know this is more of an SQ site but I am going SPL for a minute. There is nothing better than betting someone with a 1000 watt amp and a pair of L7's with my little Memphis M-class 250D and single Memphis Power Reference 15 (Better yet, doing it on music when they are trying to burp test tones). Little do they know the frequency of the port is exactly matched to the resonant frequency of my car and I have 2 songs that play that exact note at very high levels. The sub I have is the cheapest one they make and the amp is the smallest mono amp they make but its good enough for a 144.6 on the term mic. I don't normally drive around with the 15 in the car, it's just for having fun every once and a while. My system as it stands right now consists of a Kenwood Excelon 791 Head unit. The fronts are Memphis Sync 6.5 comp mounted in the stock locations (anyone every try and fit a set of syncs in the door of a honda, 10 lbs of $h*t in a 5 lb bag). The rears are Memphis M-class coax 6x9's. A Memphis M-Class 75x4 running the mids and highs. The little Memphis 250D running the sub. The amps are supported by a yellow top under the hood and 2 Memphis 1 Farad caps. The sub setup depends on my mood, I either run the one big Memphis Power Reference 15(6.5 ft^3 box) or I run a pair of Memphis M-class 8's, both systems are in custom built ported boxes. I like Memphis a little if you couldn't tell. I think my next investment is going to be the new Memphis Belle amp, I really like the new look. Anyways... Nice to meet you guys


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## chad

You are in the right place, welcome, many of us are VERY frugal


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## fredridge

ender, post some pics....and you are definitely in the right place. was messing with you about the L7's

You should use L5's


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## ender

fredridge said:


> ender, post some pics....and you are definitely in the right place. was messing with you about the L7's
> 
> You should use L5's


ohh i know...nobody with an IQ over 50 really likes kicker...just kidding or am I??? I will try and get some pics up soon but life is pretty crazy right now... 2 jobs + side work+ girlfriends pregnant+ I have to move out of my apartment and into my house by Sunday = might be a while for the pics.


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## chad

Busy man! Welcome to the club 

Nothing like moving in August in Illinois 

I did it 4 years ago this week!


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## ender

chad said:


> Busy man! Welcome to the club
> 
> Nothing like moving in August in Illinois
> 
> I did it 4 years ago this week!


I have been bouncing from apartment to apartment for the past 6 years and every time I always end up moving in august. A couple of years ago I tried to get my landlord to let me stay till late September or early October, to try and break the cycle of madness but they said I could either leave or sign another year lease so I left. Hopefully I will be smart enough to not sell the house in august whenever I decide to move next but I will most likely end up moving in august. its normal for me by now, I guess.


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## chad

ender said:


> I have been bouncing from apartment to apartment for the past 6 years and every time I always end up moving in august. A couple of years ago I tried to get my landlord to let me stay till late September or early October, to try and break the cycle of madness but they said I could either leave or sign another year lease so I left. Hopefully I will be smart enough to not sell the house in august whenever I decide to move next but I will most likely end up moving in august. its normal for me by now, I guess.


Mid 80's for temps, it could be worse I guess


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## ender

chad said:


> Mid 80's for temps, it could be worse I guess


Yeah this has been one of the mildest August's I have experienced in a long time. Does that statement make me sound old?


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## chad

ender said:


> Yeah this has been one of the mildest August's I have experienced in a long time. Does that statement make me sound old?


Nope, I was just saying the same thing earlier today, except the statement started with "we are lucky"


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## ender

Hey chad, do you live in champaign (there for school,maybe a townie...)or do you live in danville and since no one knows where danville is you just say champaign, or maybe you live in danville but spend most of your time in champaign(school, maybe work)? I went to school at UIUC a few years back and when I was down there I worked over at Vibez Performance Car Audio (you can tell they are a cool shop because they use a z instead of an s and they have the word performance right in the name, jk), and for a very short time Neon City(which is out of business now). Who knows, I might have seen you around when I was down there. What kind of car did you drive 3-4 years ago? God am I ever nosy... I don't know whats up with that. Anyways....


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## ender

I just noticed that your profile says in the stick between... Never mind my last post. Apparently I am an idiot tonight for some odd reason.


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## ron2002si

Welcome man!


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## chad

ender said:


> Hey chad, do you live in champaign (there for school,maybe a townie...)or do you live in danville and since no one knows where danville is you just say champaign, or maybe you live in danville but spend most of your time in champaign(school, maybe work)? I went to school at UIUC a few years back and when I was down there I worked over at Vibez Performance Car Audio (you can tell they are a cool shop because they use a z instead of an s and they have the word performance right in the name, jk), and for a very short time Neon City(which is out of business now). Who knows, I might have seen you around when I was down there. What kind of car did you drive 3-4 years ago? God am I ever nosy... I don't know whats up with that. Anyways....


I work at UIUC, The wifey works in Danville, we live in a small town between away from the rat-race. I drive a Silver Honda Civic Si ('04), Before that a Red Dakota Magnum RT (95 molel year concept vehicle). Have not beent oi Vibez in a while, another member here has a car there as we speak! Don't remember Neon City, where the hell was that?

Chad


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## MiniVanMan

Hey there Mr. Morris, IL. I'm right down the road from you (Lockport), and I share your sentiment. In fact I think there are about 3 or 4 of us in the Chicagoland area that do. That's not a bad ratio is it?

Are you working as an installer now? If so where. I'd love to bring my wife's vehicle over for you to hear a REAL budget setup. 

I like whoring out my wife's car.


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## ender

MiniVanMan said:


> Hey there Mr. Morris, IL. I'm right down the road from you (Lockport), and I share your sentiment. In fact I think there are about 3 or 4 of us in the Chicagoland area that do. That's not a bad ratio is it?
> 
> Are you working as an installer now? If so where. I'd love to bring my wife's vehicle over for you to hear a REAL budget setup.
> 
> I like whoring out my wife's car.


First off I LOVE your sig. That statement perfectly describes my first post( maybe I should learn to pick my words better because your statement takes a lot less time to read than mine and it says the same thing). I love how I am making a huge speech all about how I need to be less "long winded" (<---irony at its best). Anyways( the ADHD is kicking in hard right now)... I do currently work at T&K Soundwerks, the owner Tim is another one of the few people that actually cares about the install rather than just the equipment. The really cool thing is that he also cares about the equipment. There is not a single item in that store that Tim wouldn't put on any one of his cars. He also cares about his customers pockets...(in a good way) It is pretty rare to find that now a days. Our main line is Memphis Car Audio, The stuff is rock solid and for the quality of product you are getting, the prices really aren't bad. Everyone always asks me why we a in such a crappy location and there are a couple of reasons for that... One the rent is dirt cheap and that help Tim keep overhead low, which allows us to offer really good service and still be competitive on prices. I am not trying to toot my own horn but there aren't very my shops around us that can beat our quality and service. Two, we get 99% of our business from our customers referrals. We don't advertise, we don't have a website, and we are not near any traffic for walk-ins and yet we stay very busy. In the past two and a half years of me being there I have not had a single day when there was nothing to do. The best form of advertisement, in my honest opinion, is word of mouth. Since our customers know where we are, they can tell their friends where we are, and the customers can find us that way. So we don't really need a big shop in a prime location. Just do a honest job for an honest rate and the business will come to you. With all that being said, my last day is tomorrow  Like I said before I have a child on the way so I have to give up my fun job at the shop to go work for a big corporate company, for less hourly pay too, but they offer health insurance. Tim couldn't offer it to me because health insurance for small business owners is absolutely outrageous, and brings back the whole low overhead thing. Now, with all that being said, now that I not working at the shop I can do my own thing( I think side work is very very bad business... The whole bitting the hand that feeds thing... not good). I am currently working on the legal side of opening the business but I just got some business cards made up( got them in the mail yesterday). I ordered some nice polo/golf type shirts with the logo on it( a little more professional than showing up in jeans and a t-shirt). I have a website being made. Here is my company logo...










I don't think I am going to buy a building any time soon. I like doing house calls, it seems to be so much more personal that way and so much easier for the customers. Doing things like that also keeps my overhead down to next to nothing so I can offer great service for really great prices. So yeah, if you, or some one you know, are looking into getting something done let me know. I would be more than happy to assist you. GOD...I NEED TO TALK LESS.



> I work at UIUC, The wifey works in Danville, we live in a small town between away from the rat-race. I drive a Silver Honda Civic Si ('04), Before that a Red Dakota Magnum RT (95 molel year concept vehicle). Have not beent oi Vibez in a while, another member here has a car there as we speak! Don't remember Neon City, where the hell was that?
> 
> Chad


Thats pretty cool. Champaign does get pretty crazy (with the whole rat-race thing) when all the students are down there. I may have seen you down there, depending on who you hung out with. I miss Champaign. I am sure that other member is in good hands at Vibez. Chris, Shawn, and Cliff bring a lot to the table and make a really good team. I am pretty sure those three are still there... Last time is was down there they were and they had just hired Cliffs brother( I don't know him so I can't say anything good or bad about him).


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## chad

ender said:


> Thats pretty cool. Champaign does get pretty crazy (with the whole rat-race thing) when all the students are down there. I may have seen you down there, depending on who you hung out with. I miss Champaign. I am sure that other member is in good hands at Vibez. Chris, Shawn, and Cliff bring a lot to the table and make a really good team. I am pretty sure those three are still there... Last time is was down there they were and they had just hired Cliffs brother( I don't know him so I can't say anything good or bad about him).


If you were ever at Highdive or Cowboy Monkey to hear bands you probably have seen/heard me. I was the bald sound guy  The only one with no hair and of the group that worked there the roughest on the subs :blush:

I stopped doing work for Nieto group in feb of '04


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## ender

Yeah Dude, Cowboy Monkey was one of my favorite bars down there (downtown bars FTW, Campus bars FTL). Most of the time the bars never have enough sub bass but every once and a while at cowboy monkey the sound was just right. I guess I have you to thank for that. Oh yeah... Neon city was at Neil and Springfield. A guy named Jeff Kenyon started it doing mainly remote starts. Then he teamed up with the guy that showed me the ropes, Alain "gee" Minguy, and they started to do audio. If you see a wall in anyones car in champaign I can almost guarantee "Gee" did it, He is by far the best installer I have ever known. Then when I left it all went down hill from there, "Gee" ended up back at Vibez (then left again... He doesn't get along well with the owners), then Jeff sold the shop to a couple of ghetto idiots then they flushed the toliet on it.


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## chad

Yeah, those guys don't really tie into the subs, I come from a different school, but we were ALL different and the bands preferred some sound to another. That was the cool thing, a ****-ton of bars and a team of guys that were best friends, and all very confident behind a console. 

After the HUM movement a ton of the bands went for a really dirty RAW sound and I prefer to have more of a polished mix, we had Jimmy and Bob, and that saved our asses for those. "Double "A"-Ron" and I took care of a lot of the groove, hip-hop, funk, and the more heavy blues bands, he ties into it too. Larry, the Bratpack guy, did a ton of the more mature stuff because he is polished, light on the subs, and VERY "adult friendly" I came off he road so I was a bit more "arena sounding," "Double"A"-Ron" and I are from the same hometown, a bunch younger, crazy as hell, and an awesome thinker/troubleshooter. I put him with the "old guys" that gave me my start and he came out kicking hard. He works for F&G now and is touring at times!

If you ever went to a tailgate streetfest the DIA puts on then I had that stage from 96-07 was FOH from 00-07.


Gee from Colorado? Owned a store in East Urbana for a very short period, Mile High Concepts?

Had ADIOPHIL or something like that on his plates?

Chad


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## ender

chad said:


> Gee from Colorado? Owned a store in East Urbana for a very short period, Mile High Concepts?
> 
> Had ADIOPHIL or something like that on his plates?
> 
> Chad


Thats the one. He taught me a lot of tricks. Great installer. Not so great at running a business. It didn't help that his ex wife was crazy a took everything he had when she left him. With all of his weird hobbies and tattoos he is definitely one of a kind. I definitely miss working with him.


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## chad

I knew him before the tats and wife, I lived in east Urbana and at MHC, I'd go over and tinker with stuff, technically, then, they really, well, nevermind. I remember a kicker solobaric install that they could not get low end out of. The enclosure was leaky as hell! Tightened that thing up and bingo! I just came over to say hi! Lil strange in that manner, but we were all young, I WAS young then :blush: I was fresh out of school and ready to put some electronics to use! They did not mind the "company" and it was a blast! That's the closest I have ever been to a shop  

The one thing I liked about Gee is that he is cocky and confident, but if you say "Gee, I have an idea," He's all ears, and he's willing to talk about it, then go for it!

Chad


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## ender

chad said:


> I knew him before the tats and wife, I lived in east Urbana and at MHC, I'd go over and tinker with stuff, technically, then, they really, well, nevermind. I remember a kicker solobaric install that they could not get low end out of. The enclosure was leaky as hell! Tightened that thing up and bingo! I just came over to say hi! Lil strange in that manner, but we were all young, I WAS young then :blush: I was fresh out of school and ready to put some electronics to use! They did not mind the "company" and it was a blast! That's the closest I have ever been to a shop
> 
> The one thing I liked about Gee is that he is cocky and confident, but if you say "Gee, I have an idea," He's all ears, and he's willing to talk about it, then go for it!
> 
> Chad


Whats with the then... nevermind... thing if you don't want to say it in the open pm me. I have noticed A LOT of his characteristic came through in me. When I take a step back and look at how I am acting I realize I am acting just like him. I am definitely very cocky because of him I am also very open to new things because of him. I am glad I learned from him because he showed me the old school way (the right way, back when installers knew car and electronics rather than just cars) of doing things with new school techniques.


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## robspeed325i

**** i just went through danville/champy... not too far away here in pfield, IN...


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