# Arc KS vs. Zapco Z-series



## cnwahlheim (Feb 11, 2010)

I am in the market for some new amps and was reading a lot about Arc and Zapco amps. My budget limits me the the Arc KS and Zapco Z-series lines. I do not have a local dealer who carries both, so I have not been able to A/B compare them. Has anyone compared these amps? If so, what was your impression of the sound quality?


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Go with ARC ..... The Z series is below average! Paying a high price for a Korean amp. Or save cash and look into C2K or DC reference (old type not new DC) - the problem with taking a forums opinion is that you never know if they are talk BS or not! 

My experience with the Z amps is that Zapco tried to sell amps on its old reputation rather than building a good amp - a lot of people are writing that they love them - but if it was my $$ I would demo a few cars to see what you like the most before buying 

Most of all you should never take any forum members advice


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## GLN305 (Nov 2, 2007)

Zapcos are Korean amps, which are solid construction and great design. Arc amps are Ubuy from Taiwan which is a solid build house. If it were me, I would look at price versus output and also take into consideration current consumption and size. The class G/H amps sound great and exist in many winning SQ installations as do the Zapcos. In reality it comes down to asthetics, current consumption and size. In the same install, it would difficult to hear a difference in them, in my opinion. Either choice would be great.


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## knever3 (Mar 9, 2009)

I concur with GLN305, you can't go wrong with either. I would not say by any means that the Zapco Z series is below average though. Zapco has done a lot of research and listened to competitors modifying their amps and have made changes to better them. It just so happens they are manufactured in Korea. American engineered, Korean built to American Zapco specs. That's how a LOT of good things are made now, it's a fact that "Made In America" just cost Americans more money because of our labor costs involved. It's still a great product.


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## hpilot2004 (Dec 13, 2011)

I have the 900.6 and like it very well. Puts out rated power and above in most all cases, great power when running in bridged mode 200x2 and 550 watts @ 4 ohms to sub. Nice, clean look and very solid connections. Only negative aspect I could really mention is the fan that cycles on, it can be heard, but it not overly loud. All in all, a great amplifier, one which should get your attention!


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

knever3 said:


> I concur with GLN305, you can't go wrong with either. I would not say by any means that the Zapco Z series is below average though. Zapco has done a lot of research and listened to competitors modifying their amps and have made changes to better them. It just so happens they are manufactured in Korea. American engineered, Korean built to American Zapco specs. That's how a LOT of good things are made now, it's a fact that "Made In America" just cost Americans more money because of our labor costs involved. It's still a great product.


I think it has a lot to do with what you currently have or had - I mean if you had a kenwood amp to start off - Zapco would be a big upgrade! 

It also depends on what you wish to achieve out of your system - a lot of guys just want power and don't believe in high price products others just want the best they can get for the $$$ they have at their disposal!

I have been educated on Chinese amps! How many of you know that the Ground Zero amps are made in China? Those beautiful Reference 4 and 2 amps and now the 2T amp as well! 

Not everything from the Far East is bad! The difficulty I have with Zapco is that the components are a lot cheaper than the C2K amps for eg. It's one thing manufacturing in Korea using top parts - it's another thing using cheap parts!


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Elektra said:


> I think it has a lot to do with what you currently have or had - I mean if you had a kenwood amp to start off - Zapco would be a big upgrade!
> 
> It also depends on what you wish to achieve out of your system - a lot of guys just want power and don't believe in high price products others just want the best they can get for the $$$ they have at their disposal!
> 
> ...


That pic is of a amp called EOS it's virtually identical to the Ground Zero 2T amp considering that this amp has been around longer than the 2T amp so it's not the case of some one copying GZ - they are made in the same factory in China! 

And sells for a third of the price!

Attached is the Ground Zero 2T amp notice how similar they are...


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## TommyDS (May 27, 2012)

Elektra: Where are you buying the EOS amps from? Unfortunately I met them only in Russia, but there is no official distributor for Europe. 
just for remark - not only GZ Ref are from the same buildhouse, also new GZ uranium SQ amps are "similar to EOS, and SPL Dynamics Dream series as well...


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

TommyDS said:


> Elektra: Where are you buying the EOS amps from? Unfortunately I met them only in Russia, but there is no official distributor for Europe.
> just for remark - not only GZ Ref are from the same buildhouse, also new GZ uranium SQ amps are "similar to EOS, and SPL Dynamics Dream series as well...


Unfortunately I am struggling to communicate with them - I managed to get a few emails between myself and them - but the emails were very slow! I got a price list from them but I am still waiting for them to respond to me on purchasing them. I have a BF980G which has been superceded by the AE 980F LE which has been upgraded. My board looks very similar to the GZ Reference 4 with all the mundorf caps etc - I have to say the best sounding amp I have heard so far... And I Brax X2400 GE and X2000 GE to compare them too. 

I think the AE 980F retails for about $500... The find of the century! Miles better than a Z amp and any Zapco amp before that as well - I tested it against a C2K 2.5x and really no contest! In fact I would say in another world!


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

The new Z series amps are fantastic. I run (2) of the Z-150.6's in my system. Gobs of clean power.

I previously ran the Arc cxlr series which I feel are better than the KS series. In fact, they have been my favorite amps for many years. The Zapco Z's certainly didn't let me down in the sound quality department when making the switch. I don't think you can go wrong with them.


I haven't taken the cover off of mine for pics yet, but here is a shot of the Z400.2


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## Darth SQ (Sep 17, 2010)

Subscribed.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

captainobvious said:


> The new Z series amps are fantastic. I run (2) of the Z-150.6's in my system. Gobs of clean power.
> 
> I previously ran the Arc cxlr series which I feel are better than the KS series. In fact, they have been my favorite amps for many years. The Zapco Z's certainly didn't let me down in the sound quality department when making the switch. I don't think you can go wrong with them.
> 
> ...


Hey Captain nice to see you again lol!

The internals of the GZ/EOS amp looks more hi end with high end capacitors etc with the class A bias included you simply can't compare the 2 - these amps are in a league of their own...

I know your going to say that nice caps don't make a nice sounding amp ... But I have experience with both and the GZ/EOS is superior.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> Subscribed.
> 
> 
> Bret
> PPI-ART COLLECTOR


Hey Bret

Nice to see you again lol!!! 

BTW love that quote.....!!!


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## GLN305 (Nov 2, 2007)

Nevermind


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

GLN305 said:


> I've run:
> 
> Autotek (Model 44,99,132, etc)
> Soundstream (Picasso Nano, Taratula, Reference)
> ...


Hey man - nice equipment list...

I too have a similar list ... I have never heard the ARC but with Robert Zeff in the mix I am sure it isn't junk either! 

I think they sound similar at same power is because they are in general very similar sounding amps I see we are not comparing the SE range in this mix.., 

Their is a lot to be said about the right quality components - it shows the world that they are not messing about.


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## BigRed (Aug 12, 2007)

hpilot2004 said:


> I have the 900.6 and like it very well. Puts out rated power and above in most all cases, great power when running in bridged mode 200x2 and 550 watts @ 4 ohms to sub. Nice, clean look and very solid connections. Only negative aspect I could really mention is the fan that cycles on, it can be heard, but it not overly loud. All in all, a great amplifier, one which should get your attention!


You can replace the fans with quieter ones. That's what some of us did on the se series amps


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## BigRed (Aug 12, 2007)

cnwahlheim said:


> I am in the market for some new amps and was reading a lot about Arc and Zapco amps. My budget limits me the the Arc KS and Zapco Z-series lines. I do not have a local dealer who carries both, so I have not been able to A/B compare them. Has anyone compared these amps? If so, what was your impression of the sound quality?


Having OWNED both, the Zapco is a superior amp. The ks is made in China and the Zapco in Korea. Who cares? The ks series is a good well made amp. 
Good luck with your decision from May of this year with no activity since.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

cnwahlheim said:


> I am in the market for some new amps and was reading a lot about Arc and Zapco amps. My budget limits me the the Arc KS and Zapco Z-series lines. I do not have a local dealer who carries both, so I have not been able to A/B compare them. Has anyone compared these amps? If so, what was your impression of the sound quality?


Dude your cash your car your decision....

Do yourself a favor and go and listen to all options available to you. Best advice anyone can give you right now...


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

BigRed said:


> Good luck with your decision from May of this year with no activity since.



Good catch 




Elektra said:


> .


PaTROLLing... :surprised:


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## Darth SQ (Sep 17, 2010)

BigRed said:


> Having OWNED both, the Zapco is a superior amp. The ks is made in China and the Zapco in Korea. Who cares? The ks series is a good well made amp.
> Good luck with your decision from May of this year with no activity since.


ROFl!
I didn't see that it's a resurrected thread. 
Guess Elektra for some strange reason is on a ZAPCO tear.


Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

Imagine that Elektra looking for another chance to bash the Zapco amplifiers. I believe the title of this thread was Arc KS vs Zapco Z. Elektra you admitted to not having heard the Arcs and everyone knows you are anti Zapco so what could you possibly hope to contribute? Your opinion is overly biased to anything but Zapco. That is pretty obvious by you chiming in and suggesting an amplifier you have never heard. 

One thing I am remembering from the last thread is the picture posted up of all the team Zapco winners from world finals. So the Z series is good enough to win several world finals but not good enough for Elektra? The way I see it Elektra is a nobody behind a keyboard.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Tnutt19 said:


> Imagine that Elektra looking for another chance to bash the Zapco amplifiers. I believe the title of this thread was Arc KS vs Zapco Z. Elektra you admitted to not having heard the Arcs and everyone knows you are anti Zapco so what could you possibly hope to contribute? Your opinion is overly biased to anything but Zapco. That is pretty obvious by you chiming in and suggesting an amplifier you have never heard.
> 
> One thing I am remembering from the last thread is the picture posted up of all the team Zapco winners from world finals. So the Z series is good enough to win several world finals but not good enough for Elektra? The way I see it Elektra is a nobody behind a keyboard.


Looks like the Zapco trolls have managed to climb out from under the bridge and ruin the party again... 

Dam you guys must have an Zapco alert system going - looks like the same 5 culprits all the time - you guys must really get girlfriends or boyfriends..

Say what happened to your Zapco thread? Lol!


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

Wow 3rd grade put downs, and to think I expected more from you.
I am not a Zapco fan boy I just think you are pathetic. But oh well, your a tool and anybody that comes across any of your post will be quick to see that. And a biased tool at that lol!
Let's see how long until you get this thread closed and maybe even banned from DiymA for being a tool trolling around.


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## SouthSyde (Dec 25, 2006)

Threads like this gives DIYMA a bad name...

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion... If Elektra dont like zapco and prefers Russian amps let him be.

And all the bickering doesnt help either... Just sayin...


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

I agree let him like what he wants, the problem is he intentionally is jumping from thread to thread bashing Zapco. That does not give anyone a fair chance to decide. I do not run the zapco Zs and am far from biased. I can respect his opinion once maybe even twice, heck I even did read his initial opinions and was subscribed to his initial reviews with open mind. but I have a problem when people start badgering a certain product intentionally.
I think that is the opposite of what the forum is all about. That's my 2 cents.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

SouthSyde said:


> Threads like this gives DIYMA a bad name...
> 
> Everyone is entitled to their own opinion... If Elektra dont like zapco and prefers Russian amps let him be.
> 
> And all the bickering doesnt help either... Just sayin...


Thank you!


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Tnutt19 said:


> Imagine that Elektra looking for another chance to bash the Zapco amplifiers. I believe the title of this thread was Arc KS vs Zapco Z. Elektra you admitted to not having heard the Arcs and everyone knows you are anti Zapco so what could you possibly hope to contribute? Your opinion is overly biased to anything but Zapco. That is pretty obvious by you chiming in and suggesting an amplifier you have never heard.
> 
> One thing I am remembering from the last thread is the picture posted up of all the team Zapco winners from world finals. So the Z series is good enough to win several world finals but not good enough for Elektra? The way I see it Elektra is a nobody behind a keyboard.



Dude... 

You don't have a clue! You say your not a Zapco fan boy but your aggressive response to a so far clean thread shows that you are!

I thought long and hard about an appropriate response to your comments but really could not as that means I would have stoop down to your level - which waaaay down south. 

I am simply not that stupid! So I can't! One thing I have noticed is that the few Zapco lovers that troll the internet and basically bully themselves onto discussions are in fact ruining the companies image and reputation.

I think John needs to reel his sheep in a bit before it's too late.

P.S. Moderator note that I have not started anything and note who is causing all the **** here! If they want to start something - I'll finish it.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Tnutt19 said:


> I agree let him like what he wants, the problem is he intentionally is jumping from thread to thread bashing Zapco. That does not give anyone a fair chance to decide. I do not run the zapco Zs and am far from biased. I can respect his opinion once maybe even twice, heck I even did read his initial opinions and was subscribed to his initial reviews with open mind. but I have a problem when people start badgering a certain product intentionally.
> I think that is the opposite of what the forum is all about. That's my 2 cents.


So were are the Zapco reviews done by professionals? The new stuff has been out for more than a year now so where are they? All your magical reviews are worth squat without backing from a impartial organization 

Instead of stroking other people awards as if you earned them and calling them "my precious" in a really freaky voice! You might want to consider that their is a world outside Zapco and that are leaps and bounds better. And maybe someone might really want to know more about them

Don't you think that this is what a forum is all about? A discussion on amps from multiple manufacturers which some might not like and some do.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

captainobvious said:


> Good catch
> 
> 
> 
> PaTROLLing... :surprised:


Hey I was on this thread BEFORE everyone else!

So who is paTROLLing now? 

Some people should really think before they post! Just makes them look bad!

Lol!!


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## Darth SQ (Sep 17, 2010)

Maybe, but you've made it personal with unwarranted attacks on numerous other DIYMA members to drive home your crusade against Zapco.
You've pissed off a lot of people on here and as a result, have our attention.

The very fact that you brought back to life a six month old and dead thread to continue the fight is dubious at best.

I suggest a change of attitude and maybe even a break for awhile before this all goes South for you.



Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## strakele (Mar 2, 2009)

Elektra said:


> So were are the Zapco reviews done by professionals? The new stuff has been out for more than a year now so where are they? All your magical reviews are worth squat without backing from a impartial organization


At risk of continuing this ridiculous debate which is not what I want to happen, I'd say all the world championships won in MECA, IASCA, and USAC are good enough "reviews from impartial organizations" for most anyone. Cars running these amps were judged by quality, reputable judges (they don't let just anyone judge world finals) and deemed to be superior to others. I didn't follow IASCA or USAC results closely (other than that a Zapco car won the triple crown), but I know that team Zapco won EVERY CLASS they had a car entered in MECA, in one of the most stacked finals in years, against cars running all kinds of other high end SQ amps.



I don't own and have never owned anything made by Zapco and I don't really believe that different amps of the same power sound different anyway. I'm not a fanboy of anything I'm just sick of seeing these threads.

We're all entitled to our opinion but not to stating our opinion as fact and insulting others who don't think the same.

Zapco results at the highest levels of car audio competition seem to speak for themselves.


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## GLN305 (Nov 2, 2007)

Amen, exactly why I changed my post minutes after hitting post. Unfortunately I wasn't fast enough.



SouthSyde said:


> Threads like this gives DIYMA a bad name...
> 
> Everyone is entitled to their own opinion... If Elektra dont like zapco and prefers Russian amps let him be.
> 
> And all the bickering doesnt help either... Just sayin...


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

I'm not a "fan-boy" of any brand either. I use what I like and what works for me in my car. That best I had used had always been the old Arc's, until I took a shot on the new Z series. I think they are fantastic.

I don't think anyone on this forum has a problem with differing _opinions_ on products. But when you flat out troll threads proclaiming that anyone who disagrees with your _opinion_ is wrong and then proceed to berate the product _and_ them for their decision to use it is simply not in the spirit of what this forum is about, nor would it be acceptable in a real conversation. Notice how I put the emphasis on _opinion_...this is because yours is not FACT despite what you may think. 

If you expect to stay here in our community, you need to digest and understand that simple concept.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> Maybe, but you've made it personal with unwarranted attacks on numerous other DIYMA members to drive home your crusade against Zapco.
> You've pissed off a lot of people on here and as a result, have our attention.
> 
> The very fact that you brought back to life a six month old and dead thread to continue the fight is dubious at best.
> ...


Bret

You are entitled to your opinion! Unlike me I can't say anything against a tested product. As moderator your supposed to be impartial - like a judge. But instead your just same as the others you carry the quote from Darrenforreal as if he is your big mate...

Who just happens to be a Zapco extremist - just how impartial are you? When things get too heavy for you and your mates you just close the forum. 

I asked this forum and the Zapco forum which you closed as well about reviews - I asked 10 times and nothing - what exactly are you guys hiding? 

You guys can't say a bad word about Zapco which is dubious to say the least. You guys simply can't look left nor right which makes having a friendly debate a real waste of time! As their are lots of products that will thrash ZAPCO's butt but as true audiophiles you won't hear any of it!

So for the 11th time show me the reviews or shut up! As your opinion is an opinion and not fact based on a biased opinion you and your buddies stuff down people throats - that's not a forum it's a Gestapo tactic to squash bad press on a product that should only compete with the likes of kenwood and new soundstream maybe...

Now prove to the rest of the world reading this thread that I am right and close the thread..


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

Your sadly mistaken. You are assuming our characters based on yours. You are incapable of having a meaningful conversation and are jumping around looking for a fight. Anybody that calls you out is immediately named a fan boy, or they arent playing fair... 

Let me say this very clearly so perhaps you can understand it. People do not have a problem with your opinion, the problem is the way you are going about sharing it. There is malice in your text in 99 percent of your post. 

Get that figured out so you can hang around a bit. You might even surprise yourself and learn a thing or two from the forum.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

Tnutt19 said:


> Your sadly mistaken. You are assuming our characters based on yours. You are incapable of having a meaningful conversation and are jumping around looking for a fight. Anybody that calls you out is immediately named a fan boy, or they arent playing fair...
> 
> Let me say this very clearly so perhaps you can understand it. People do not have a problem with your opinion, the problem is the way you are going about sharing it. There is malice in your text in 99 percent of your post.
> 
> Get that figured out so you can hang around a bit. You might even surprise yourself and learn a thing or two from the forum.


Well learning is a two way street - the original intention of a forum was to bring like minded people who love a hobby to share in things like tests, equipment and setup - things our wives and girlfriends don't have a clue about. 

The thing I have learned is that Zapco forum members don't want to learn new things or at least indulge in the idea that there are other brands one can look at to explore the ultimate quest of pure SQ. 

I am not interested in specific brands etc but if I find one to look at then why not share it with the community? After all are we not looking and continually looking for better? I know I am. 

You know if Zapco brought out an amp that I can honestly say and test to be better than what I have then I'll be the first to buy it. 

Why aren't you guys like this? Don't you strive for better?


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## MrsPapasin (May 21, 2013)

Elektra said:


> Well learning is a two way street - the original intention of a forum was to bring like minded people who love a hobby to share in things like tests, equipment and setup - *things our wives and girlfriends don't have a clue about*.


Speak for yourself, but some wives and girlfriends are reading this forum and LOVE this hobby. Don't make it any less fun for the few of us that are.


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

MrsPapasin said:


> Speak for yourself, but some wives and girlfriends are reading this forum and LOVE this hobby. Don't make it any less fun for the few of us that are.


Richard is a lucky man 

I wish that my wife was even a little intrigued by the hobby. Maybe it'll grow on her eventually...probably wishful thinking though


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## strakele (Mar 2, 2009)

Elektra said:


> I asked this forum and the Zapco forum which you closed as well about reviews - I asked 10 times and nothing - what exactly are you guys hiding?
> 
> So for the 11th time show me the reviews or shut up!


Once again...

2013 World Finals results:

1st Place Street Class (out of 10) - Rick Phillips - Team Zapco 
1st Place Modified Street Class (out of 7) - Grace Hedrick - Team Zapco
1st Place Modex Class (out of 6) - Kirk Proffitt - Team Zapco
1st Place Extreme Class (out of 7) - Steve Cook - Team Zapco

1st Place Pro/Am Class (out of 23) - Kirk Proffitt - Team Zapco
Triple Crown Winner - Kirk Proffitt - Team Zapco
Culbertson Cup Winner - Steve Cook - Team Zapco




These people WON WORLD FINALS in their classes competing against some of the other BEST CARS IN THE WORLD. And they didn't just win by a fraction of a point either - they were comfortably in the lead. This massive competition was judged by several well respected, experienced judges, many of whom are former world champions themselves. This is as good an impartial review from an unbiased organization as you are going to get. Much better than some reviewer who writes for some online magazine.




Again, I have never used any Zapco product. But come on dude - LOOK AT THE RESULTS.



Why don't you take some crappy Zapco amp and your beloved EOS or whatever, and go take $10,000 from Richard Clark? Should be easy for you.


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

MrsPapasin said:


> Speak for yourself, but some wives and girlfriends are reading this forum and LOVE this hobby. Don't make it any less fun for the few of us that are.


Sorry Ma'am my wife loses me after 2seconds when I discuss this! She has just grasped the concept of a soundstage - baby steps! 

She really can't understand my obsession and wishes I could make $$ out of it! Your husband is a lucky man!


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

Elektra said:


> Sorry Ma'am my wife loses me after 2seconds when I discuss this! She has just grasped the concept of a soundstage - baby steps!
> 
> She really can't understand my obsession and wishes I could make $$ out of it! Your husband is a lucky man!


Profit?

HAHAHA hell, my wife would settle for not _losing_ any money to it :laugh:


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## Elektra (Feb 4, 2013)

strakele said:


> Once again...
> 
> 2013 World Finals results:
> 
> ...


So you won a few trophies... Grand! 

I'll give you a great example I listened to the expert champions car a while back and while it was good make no mistake - it didn't blow me away to an extent that I thought it was leagues ahead of my car - on the contery it was only marginally better sounding - in fact my last score sheet rated my car above his in listening pleasure - my car wasn't even complete! 

This boils down to ability of setup and ability of build - if a kenwood car that was exceptionally well built and used the equipment in the best possible way to extract the absolute maximum out of the equipment - and brilliantly tuned it will beat any car of the day! 

Does this mean it's the best sounding car? We don't believe so but as long as it ticks the technical aspects and has all the install tricks it will be hard to beat. 

So I don't take much into trophies as it don't mean much... Consider that 90% of people who want car sound are not interested in competing and 99% of the installers don't have a clue in setting a car up for proper SQ it really relies on the quality of the equipment to bridge the shortfalls of an installer.

So congrats on your trophies....it still doesn't mean much! 

Btw no Zapco car has won anything in the last 10 years here and it's not from a lack of contestants.- plenty of C2K equipped cars!


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## decibelle (Feb 17, 2011)

This thread.


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## strakele (Mar 2, 2009)

Elektra said:


> This boils down to ability of setup and ability of build - if a kenwood car that was exceptionally well built and used the equipment in the best possible way to extract the absolute maximum out of the equipment - and brilliantly tuned it will beat any car of the day!


No freaking kidding dude. That's the whole point. Out of every component in a system, the amps make probably the least difference in how it ends up sounding assuming they make enough power for your intended listening level. The people I posted about who won with Zapco probably could have won with any brand. It's all about the knowledge and ability of the person building/tuning the car. Amp brand means NOTHING compared to that, so sitting here having a debate about which amp sounds best is useless.

All amps can be made to sound the same.


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

millerlyte said:


> This thread.


:laugh:

So well timed. 


You rock.


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## aj1735 (Feb 27, 2011)

Elektra said:


> So you won a few trophies... Grand!
> 
> I'll give you a great example I listened to the expert champions car a while back and while it was good make no mistake - it didn't blow me away to an extent that I thought it was leagues ahead of my car - on the contery it was only marginally better sounding - in fact my last score sheet rated my car above his in listening pleasure - my car wasn't even complete!
> 
> ...


I just don't understand all this going back and forth. Elektra you keep asking for a review. I think winning every class counts as much as possible for an unbiased review. Yes, we know they are all very good at tuning and have great installs, but they could choose to have any brand in their cars and they still picked Zapco. I don't know why you want a review over the proof? I would rather take those results as proof over some guy that is paid by some mag/website to give his one opinion. I would think that the opinion of multiple judges out weighs some magazine or web guy. 

You tried one Zapco Z amp and we all know that have read this and the closed thread that you didn't like it. You also said that you have never used Arc's either. So bottom line on this thread is that you have an one amp opinion compared to two whole series of amps. Sounds to me that should have been the end of the comments, not going on how to prove that zapco is better than whatever kind you use. 

I like my amps and I can say as i haven't used any arc's either. So i can't compare to each other. I really do like my ZX200.4. It has just tons of power and handles my mid bass very plus it has pleny of power bridged ([email protected]) to run my Morel Ultimo 12. So I can just say that I do like mine but I can't compare to the original question about Arc's.


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## Darth SQ (Sep 17, 2010)

Elektra said:


> Bret
> 
> You are entitled to your opinion! Unlike me I can't say anything against a tested product. As moderator your supposed to be impartial - like a judge. But instead your just same as the others you carry the quote from Darrenforreal as if he is your big mate...
> 
> ...


I didn't know my name was ZAPCO-Z COLLECTOR :shrug:



Bret
PPI-ART COLLECTOR


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

Well... I'm in before Elektra says something to finally get Bret to shut it down. 

I will state that I own two KS amps that will be going into my install. I have absolutely no plans to change that. 

I have not heard the Z series, but I have heard absolutely nothing that would keep me from auditioning them and using them in my own build. In fact, it wouldn't hurt my feelings one bit to learn that model to model, the Z series amps from Zapco were better than my KS!


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

PPI-ART COLLECTOR said:


> I didn't know my name was ZAPCO-Z COLLECTOR :shrug:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


HAHA its ok he called me a Zapco fan boy but in the last year I have owned and used in my car Audison thesis, vrx, Mosconi Zero and the list goes on... But he informed me I have no clue so I just went with it.. LOL.

I agree with Southsyde that this is counter productive to the DIYMA website, I should have never said anything because it does fuel the fire, so I admit I went about it in the wrong way.. oops.. still to this point though I say Elektra your opinion is just as valid as anyones, I just disagree with your way of sharing it. You have crossed from being informative to being bashful which hurts your credibility. The reason why I do not like that is because Zapco is on a short list of companies that actually care and take the time to support you after the sale. 

What amps are you using now Elektra?


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## BigRed (Aug 12, 2007)

Electra runs BANNED AUDIO


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## captainobvious (Mar 11, 2006)

BigRed said:


> Electra runs BANNED AUDIO


'Bout time...

A reading-only restriction should do him some good. Perhaps he'll get a better idea of how things run around here.


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

NOt even that just some decency and respect. But on the other hand, now how am I going to know what amplifiers are ok to use.. I am screwed!


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

I thought you knew? You should be importing E.O.S. amps from Russia! You know, their case looks similar to the Ground Zero Reference, so they must be identical. And at a fraction of the cost!


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

That is first time I have seen the memo. I feel so much better now thank you! I can not wait to get mine in LOL!


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

You can dump that junk C12XL while you're at it. I'll pay for the shipping if you would like me to take care of the recycling for you.


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

rton20s said:


> You can dump that junk C12XL while you're at it. I'll pay for the shipping if you would like me to take care of the recycling for you.


That is a good deal. WIll you take them both for me LOL!! HAHA! While your at it you will have to toss my carbon C8s c4s and all my utopia tweets. It just hurts to listen to it it sounds so bad!


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

Now boys, be nice...I think the point is we want to set a good example, right?


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## rton20s (Feb 14, 2011)

papasin said:


> Now boys, be nice...I think the point is we want to set a good example, right?


What? I was trying to do the responsible thing and recycle! 

I can take care of yours while I'm at it, if you'd like papasin.


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## Tnutt19 (Dec 22, 2010)

Very true!


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## papasin (Jan 24, 2011)

rton20s said:


> What? I was trying to do the responsible thing and recycle!
> 
> I can take care of yours while I'm at it, if you'd like papasin.


Absolutely _Zero_ complaints about my amps . Subs are OT  so won't go there.

For the record, looks like the OP did make a decision... (Arc SE amps and an Arc mini)

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/general-car-audio-discussion/150067-budget-sq-build-thread.html

Looks like he hasn't been on DIYMA for about a month. Imagine to his surprise if or when he comes back where this thread has ended up


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## Golden Ear (Oct 14, 2012)

It's mind-boggling that an amp can be used in so many championship cars yet because some rag said a cheap amp sounds better than it a person will go to every thread possible to bash it. You don't have to be a fan boy to stick up for Zapco in this case. I'm sure all the same defenses would have been made against any other amp that has won so many competitions. Is it just me or is this not rocket science? Again, I don't run Zapco but there's no reason I wouldn't. I know, it's over, but I just had to add my two sense, sorry.


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