# How serious is cancellation?



## Iwannalearnaudio (Jan 9, 2017)

With out super tuning with processors can 2 different subwoofers sound good together?

That's a general question for all subs but my specific situation is I have two JL 12tw3 and was thinking about adding a 13w7ae, but if the cancelation is really serious and make the system sound like crap I might just add two more 12tw3.

Wish I could try before I buy


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## SkizeR (Apr 19, 2011)

depends how you want to use them, but theres just no point in adding another different sub. just use one or the other. a 13w7 has more than enough output if thats what you looking for


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## Iwannalearnaudio (Jan 9, 2017)

My concern would be that if I add the w7 and removed the tw3 I would only gain about 30 (SD x xmax). This is also more expensive. So would I be better of with just adding 2 more tw3. 13w7 = like 130 (i dont no the word for number represents "SD x xmax"... maybe air it moves) but each 12tw3 = about 50 So 4 of them would equal about 200 If I added the 13w7 to the tw3 it would be like 230 but I understand there would be some cancellation and it wouldn't be cohesive (think that's the word)

I'm pretty sure I don't understand all the variables that go into creating spl, but the little bit I do know it seems the 4 x tw3 would create more spl. But there is something in me that finds it hard to believe 3 tw3 (150) is stronger than 1 13w7 (130)


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## Bayboy (Dec 29, 2010)

If you're trying to get more SPL then cone area is the easiest way to get it, but of course you will want to use the same drivers for the same range. Mixing subs for the same passband is never a good idea.


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## Justin Zazzi (May 28, 2012)

The number you are trying to describe is the volume of air the woofer can displace. The Xmax (in inches) multiplied by the effective surface area (in square inches) will give you the volume of air displaced (in cubic inches).

The 13W7AE has a displacement of about 130 cubic inches (in.^3) and the 12TW3 has about 50 in.^3 like you found, and a ratio of about 3:1 is pretty close. You'll end up with a larger box overall if you want to use three of the 12TW3's, but three of them will be slightly cheaper than a single 13W7AE as you mentioned too.

The amplifier you have might influence this choice too. How much power can it supply and how low of an impedance is it rated for?


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## benny z (Mar 17, 2008)

13w7 will play the bottom octaves with more authority and more accuracy than 12tw3 all day, every day, ime. only reason to ever use 12tw3 is in a space pinch, which, if you are considering a 13w7...why?


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## Iwannalearnaudio (Jan 9, 2017)

If I was to go with adding the tw3 I'd get another db drive a71100.1 and slave them together. I'd figure I could do this at 2 ohm for all 4.

But if I was going to go the 13w7 route I would by either the HD or slash 1200 from JL audio


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## Iwannalearnaudio (Jan 9, 2017)

Originally I thought I only had space under the back seat and pretty much only a shallow mount would fit. 6 months later I have decided I need more bass and I got the idea I could remove and remake the center console. This has about 3.5 of air space. So now I have that much air space I figure I can add the w7 (I've always wanted) it will hit the lower notes. But I'm pretty sure I'd have to remove the tw3. Because of this I'm trying to figure out what would "probably " be the oval best set up.


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## benny z (Mar 17, 2008)

so this is in a truck?

what truck?


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## Iwannalearnaudio (Jan 9, 2017)

Yes, 2016 ram 1500 crew cab


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## benny z (Mar 17, 2008)

nice truck. have you looked at the fox acoustics boxes?

DODGE QUAD & CREW CAB 2-12" VENTED

i put this box with two hybrid audio clarus 12" subs in my ram.

i would prefer this box with two capable traditional 12" subs to a center console box. ...unless you are absolutely dead set on a 13w7.


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## Iwannalearnaudio (Jan 9, 2017)

I was actually looking for this box after I saw it in a YouTube video. The only problem with this is even if I raise the back seat 1& 1/2 inches I still only get about .75 - inch of air space and the mounting depth is only like 8in. With that limited air space I don't know how much improvement I'd get with 2 traditional subs compared to adding 2 more tw3? Any suggestions on some subs that would really perform in that airspace?


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## Arenumbi (Jul 31, 2017)

Iwannalearnaudio said:


> With out super tuning with processors can 2 different subwoofers sound good together?
> 
> That's a general question for all subs but my specific situation is I have two JL 12tw3 and was thinking about adding a 13w7ae, but if the cancelation is really serious and make the system sound like crap I might just add two more 12tw3.
> 
> Wish I could try before I buy


13w7 is good enough


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## DPGstereo (Jan 16, 2013)

benny z said:


> nice truck. have you looked at the fox acoustics boxes?
> 
> DODGE QUAD & CREW CAB 2-12" VENTED
> 
> ...



I have a Ram truck. You may be surprised if if you used the box mentioned with two Illusion C12XL's. Amp on each sub. HD1200/1 if you like JL.
Sound quality and spl.


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## Hillbilly SQ (Jan 26, 2007)

If you want good output try inverting a standard subwoofer into one of the storage wells under the back seat. The box will be a thin wedge spanning all the way across. I did this with a Pioneer Champion series 12" (step up from the one Walmart sells) and was blown away by the output with just 400rms and signal from the factory headunit in my 2011 Ram. This is called corner loading. Some will disagree but I never had good luck firing into the back seat. Always had the best luck downfiring into the storage well to load off a hard surface in the corner. YMMV. Also had good luck with a side firing box behind the front passenger seat in the rear floorboard.


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## DPGstereo (Jan 16, 2013)

Same here, I've never been a fan of firing a sub right into the bottom of a seat. In my 13' Ram, going to try using both storage wells, connecting the two creating a thin air space in-between the two. Using a single Illusion C12XL. Did raise rear seat with a fabricated metal bracket, about 1.5". Sub will be in factory location. If the theory of raising the seat fails, trying to create more air space before first reflection, I'll raise the seat on the one side. Hopefully I won't have to but, plan B.


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