# HAT 6.5" sub. who's used?



## tlow98 (Oct 8, 2009)

Imagine I6SW 6.5" Subwoofer - 12v Electronics

who's already bought and used one of these? I'm hoping the 8 and 10" versions come out soon....6.5" looks Ok, I just really don't have a use for it at this time.


anyone out there in TV land? They don't even have a users manual on their site yet. Well, last time i checked, anyway.

EDIT: white paper (user's manual) is below in Scott's post


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## azngotskills (Feb 24, 2006)

to be honest it "looks" cheap...like a PE buyout driver for $160 

I am sure you can find comparable performance for cheaper or better performance for the same price....the Exodus Anarchy, Peerless SLS, or TB come to mind


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## tlow98 (Oct 8, 2009)

I can understand that, I'm more interested in it's performance bc HAT is walking into an incredibly crowded/competition oriented crowd going into subs. I'd be interested to hear some listening thoughts/comparos, but yes it's incredibly new to the scene.

The imagine line was never meant to 'look' good. Maybe some of the ones you mentioned are better, but without listening who knows. 

Just want to know how Hybrid's new 'entry' small sub is holding up against the others, especially the ones you mentioned which have a corner on the DIY market.


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## azngotskills (Feb 24, 2006)

that is the thing....performance results over marketing BS and "name"...well the way it used to be anyways


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## tlow98 (Oct 8, 2009)

Indeed. 

So where art thou, honest reviews?


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

I cringe everytime I see a cheap stamped steel frame on a expensive driver. I would have to agree with Mark on that one.


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## Scott Buwalda (Apr 7, 2006)

Cheap? Hold it in your hand and tell me that. It is significantly overbuilt. It dwarfs the Ultra Subs offering. Most others in its class (6.5-inch woofers) look small and unimpressive. I don't see anything cheap about it. 










The specification download is in fact on the website: http://www.hybrid-audio.com/Imagine I6SW.pdf

The lack of reviews are because its a brand new product. Here are two that I found:

Buwalda Hybrids International Bulletin Board • View topic - I6SW
Buwalda Hybrids International Bulletin Board • View topic - I6SW Specification Sheet Now Active (starting third post down)


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## Scott Buwalda (Apr 7, 2006)

Every 6.5-inch sub that I am aware of in this dealer cost and retail price range use stamped steel baskets. It has a 2-inch voice coil as compared to many others which use a 1.5-inch or 1.6-inch as well. Food for thought before the product is dismissed without actually seeing it or hearing it.


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

Scott Buwalda said:


> Every 6.5-inch sub that I am aware of in this dealer cost and retail price range use stamped steel baskets. It has a 2-inch voice coil as compared to many others which use a 1.5-inch or 1.6-inch as well. Food for thought before the product is dismissed without actually seeing it or hearing it.


Me personally, I dont like stamped steel baskets, or atleast cant justify them in higher priced drivers. But thats just me. I never stated anything about performance, but I do agree that other 6.5" subs out there would walk all over this one in sheer volume output, I also know thats prob not what you were going for. Dont know how it sounds, so I wont and cant comment on that. I also wouldnt use a 6.5" subwoofer myself, especially in a 16 liter enclosure when I could get more cone area to work in a box that size.

But what is really the point of reverse surrounds on drivers like these? I mean I know Kicker used them back in the day on their components, but I would think that if it was really a huge advantage over regular ones, surely other companies would use it, its not like its anything new.


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## tlow98 (Oct 8, 2009)

oh, i certainly am not trying to bash or dismiss anything. I'm looking for reviews, and thank you for sending those links. The Imagine line is not meant to impress with shiny bits, and personally that's what i like about my Imagine 61 set. After installing them this past weekend I'd love to have an I10SW... i didn't want to mention my imagine set for bias' sake.

i'd call the Imagine line understated.

Also, thanks for posting your white paper, i'll amend my original post.

Also, IMO i could care less if the basket were made of peanut butter...if it sounded better than the rest I'd buy it everytime.


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

I've heard great things about it considering it's a 6.5" sub!! Low frequency response is great, a pair of these is comparable to easily a great quality 10". Scott can correct me if i am wrong but I believe the motor is similar to most 10"s on the market. They are a great option for those looking to save space. 

Now, before I get flamed for it, yes I'm a hybrid dealer. I have not used these personally, but I am looking forward to it when i can. I'm also an ultra dealer and I think these will be more impressive, so take that for whatever you want.


Jacob Brown
Owner / (hdme)
505.750.8358
Sent from my iPhone


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

cobb2819 said:


> I've heard great things about it considering it's a 6.5" sub!! Low frequency response is great, a pair of these is comparable to easily a great quality 10". Scott can correct me if i am wrong but I believe the motor is similar to most 10"s on the market. They are a great option for those looking to save space.
> 
> Now, before I get flamed for it, yes I'm a hybrid dealer. I have not used these personally, but I am looking forward to it when i can. I'm also an ultra dealer and I think these will be more impressive, so take that for whatever you want.
> 
> ...


The output wouldnt be equal to a 10" most likely. As a typical 6.5" driver has around 140 cm2 compared to about 330 cm2 for a 10" so the 10" would still have more cone area and would definitely have more excursion, so a 10" would be louder. Curious if there is a big market for a 6.5" sub out there, as you dont see many use them. I guess guys will be using them for some up front bass in the competitions.


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## tlow98 (Oct 8, 2009)

BeatsDownLow said:


> The output wouldnt be equal to a 10" most likely. As a typical 6.5" driver has around 140 cm2 compared to about 330 cm2 for a 10" so the 10" would still have more cone area and would definitely have more excursion, *so a 10" would be louder*. Curious if there is a big market for a 6.5" sub out there, as you dont see many use them. I guess guys will be using them for some up front bass in the competitions.


I'm a relative noob and i know that, for a fact, such statements simply cannot be made. there are so many variables...ahhh nevermind, you seem quite stuck in your ways

edited as not to insult. i want this thread to be about results, not speculation


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## Scott Buwalda (Apr 7, 2006)

cobb2819 said:


> a pair of these


Quoted to clarify the post.


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## Scott Buwalda (Apr 7, 2006)

Now to highlight "why" small subs are made.

Corvettes
Land Cruisers
Jeep Cherokee's
5th Gen Camaro's
Mommy Wagons

The list goes on...


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## [email protected] (Jun 12, 2008)

tlow98 said:


> I'm a relative noob and i know that, for a fact, such statements simply cannot be made. there are so many variables...ahhh nevermind, you seem quite stuck in your ways
> 
> edited as not to insult. i want this thread to be about results, not speculation


When it comes to bass there is no replacement for displacement. Thats something you cant deny or refute. All things being equal, IE same type of enclosure (sealed or ported for both). I dont see them having more output. Not stuck in anyway. I will let you guys be and I hope you get the reviews you are looking for. But remember the basic I just posted about output, it always applies.


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## SQ Audi (Dec 21, 2010)

The thing about the HAT 6.5, the Ultra 6.5 and even the DD 6.5 are that they aren't designed to blast your ears out. They are used more in the capacity of Sound Quality where you need to bring in the lower frequencies for a completion of the complete musical spectrum, not to overpower the other speakers.

That being said, Scott, you forgot about the BMW's that have them under the seats too.


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## south east customz (Jan 17, 2011)

I've played with a set. They are pretty nice. Of course vented enclosure. 
They wouldn't fit into the project I had intended (damn e70 BMW no depth) 
The looks are deceiving they are stout and very high build quality. I've used a number of 6.5 subs btw.

In test boxes they do sound very good and IMO have output of a GOOD 10.


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## eggyhustles (Sep 18, 2008)

cobb2819 said:


> a pair of these is comparable to easily a great quality 10".
> 
> I have not used these



Oh...


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

eggyhustles said:


> Oh...


quote the whole statement...the parts that starts with "I've heard..." and ends with "...used these personally." does not mean i have not heard them, just means i have not installed them myself.


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## eggyhustles (Sep 18, 2008)

So.... you're basing someone else's opinion as fact? hmm...


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## cobb2819 (Jan 13, 2011)

eggyhustles said:


> So.... you're basing someone else's opinion as fact? hmm...


i'm basing someone else's results as more fact than opinion.


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## tlow98 (Oct 8, 2009)

well thanks to those that came with some facts and impressions. confirms what i have come to know of hat stuff. quality. an in depth comparo would be awesome, guess i'll have to wait for that.

haters, thanks as well.


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## Jsracing (Apr 1, 2011)

No mention of sealed enclosures in the manual, so I'm assuming that's not recommended for this sub? I'm looking for a sub solution that takes minimal space. I was looking at the JL 6W3v3 but was concerned it would provide enough bass (I don't want to shake the car next to me, but do like the bass to hit hard on certain songs), so I'm mainly looking at 8" now, but wouldn't mind a 6.5" to save the space if it performs really well.


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## azngotskills (Feb 24, 2006)

tlow98 said:


> well thanks to those that came with some facts and impressions. confirms what i have come to know of hat stuff. quality. an in depth comparo would be awesome, guess i'll have to wait for that.
> 
> haters, thanks as well.


nice for you to comment but there are facts presented in this thread for comparison I will use a few from the Exodus Ex-Anarchy ($85/ea) vs the HAT 6.5 ($159/ea)

cast vs steel basket?
XBL^2 motor vs standard motor?
Le: 0.84 mH vs Le not spec'ed?
Xmax: 12.5 mm one-way vs 7.75 mm?
$85/ea vs $159/ea
need more?

http://www.hybrid-audio.com/Imagine I6SW.pdf
DIYCable.com : Intro » Home » Exodus Subwoofers » 

Honestly not bashing or hating on HAT products but there are better performance options for the money. Dont get bought into the "name" and SQ behind it with mediocre construction and performance


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL (Jan 31, 2011)

Jsracing said:


> No mention of sealed enclosures in the manual, so I'm assuming that's not recommended for this sub? I'm looking for a sub solution that takes minimal space. I was looking at the JL 6W3v3 but was concerned it would provide enough bass (I don't want to shake the car next to me, but do like the bass to hit hard on certain songs), so I'm mainly looking at 8" now, but wouldn't mind a 6.5" to save the space if it performs really well.


.35 cu foot ported box, that number includes port and driver displacement.


I have one of these for my dads truck. I'll post when its installed.


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## Scott Buwalda (Apr 7, 2006)

azngotskills said:


> nice for you to comment but there are facts presented in this thread for comparison I will use a few from the Exodus Ex-Anarchy ($85/ea) vs the HAT 6.5 ($159/ea)
> 
> cast vs steel basket?
> XBL^2 motor vs standard motor?
> ...


Thank you for that. The Exodus is a nice looking *midbass*, and for the money can't be beat. But a few important specs were left out of your post. The Imagine subwoofer has:

Lower Re
Lower Fs
Higher SPL
Larger voice coil
Higher power handling; power handling not estimated
Shallower mounting depth
A warranty
Post-purchase support
Guaranteed lifetime value

If you paint a picture, please be sure to use all of the colors.

Look, I don't need a pissing match; both speakers do good in their intended application, no doubt. The Exodus is an absolute bargain for sure.


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## FartinInTheTub (May 25, 2010)

I'm very impressed with what I saw on the Exodus website. They are however 8ohm subs... most people would want either 4 or 2ohm impedence. The Hybrids look pretty nice... would really like to hear them.


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## azngotskills (Feb 24, 2006)

Scott Buwalda said:


> Thank you for that. The Exodus is a nice looking *midbass*, and for the money can't be beat. But a few important specs were left out of your post. The Imagine subwoofer has:
> 
> Lower Re
> Lower Fs
> ...


Fair enough Scott...good luck  Some have higher priorities in different specs and construction than others. Not that one is right or wrong though, it is just preference then


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

It's interesting that people have issues with the construction of these... Performance, price and design innovaions alone set these aside from most other 6" subs... I will say that the output of these subs are comparable to that of a 6w0 but you are getting the quality sound of the focal mini subs without the hit to the pocket... 

I've only heard one of these so far and I wouldn't say I was blown away but that's because I've been using 6 inch subs for the past 8 years in different applications... For the price range say $150 and below I wouldn't go with anything else unless I was making my decisons soley on looks or because of budget... 

At this point I would take these over just about every sub on the market if I was going for an all out sq car and wanted my bass to blend with everything up front and not give away it's location... If only I could still get them at cost! I know I'd have 6 of them strategically place in my truck... 

Maybe I will sell the **** ass jlw7's I've got laying around and commit to these-

hopefully this rant was the a little helpfully to the OP but I doubt it...


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## 000zero (Mar 12, 2011)

Can these be installed in a door? 

If they can I might be able to give a review in a few weeks


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL (Jan 31, 2011)

Theyre pretty deep, but if you can give them the right airspace (.35 cubic feet, ported, tuned for 38 hz, or .6 cubic feet, ported, tuned for 32 hz), and have the depth, then yes they can be door mounted.


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

I'm working on it...


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## trojan fan (Nov 4, 2007)

Hurry up Derick, I can't wait to hear your review


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## IIGQ4U (Aug 8, 2011)

Looking good!


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL (Jan 31, 2011)

Scott is now running 4 of these in his company demo car, in what looks like a 6th order.


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## trojan fan (Nov 4, 2007)

TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL said:


> Scott is now running 4 of these in his company demo car, in what looks like a 6th order.


If you go to Hybrid Audio's wall on Face Book you can view some pics of Scott's G35 demo car and the new enclosure


Try this link http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150284218243947.330240.189181953946


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

Work in progress... spy cam pictures:


*Small foot print, not bad at all when I'm seating on the passenger's side!*












Getting in the car...


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## sqcomp (Sep 21, 2009)

^Derick is using it as an up front dedicated woofer.

I'll be exploring the idea of using them as a dedicated mid bass in a very small sealed enclosure.

There's NO doubt that Scott gives you value. Be careful to notice that Scott did say what these are inteded for.


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## 60ndown (Feb 8, 2007)

hat 8 gets 1st place fo bass 

(An interesting side-note to this setup is that it’s also a replacement for a pair of 18″ drivers, and with noticeably better results.)

PWK Designs


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

sqcomp said:


> There's NO doubt that Scott gives you value. Be careful to notice that Scott did say what these are inteded for.


I recall something like *"to replace OEM subwoofer drivers and to install in motorcycles"* correct me if I'm wrong...


.
*I look at it this way*, at home a sound system with good bass, a single small subwoofer box... living space average area of 12'x14' (room) = 168 sq feet times 8' = *1344 cubic feet of air space.*

*My little Yaris*... let's say 6'x8'x4' = *192 cubic feet of airspace* mmm any thoughts?

I may be going in the wrong direction, but I'm very good telling the true and been honest so soon you will know how compares to my IDQ12


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

*Not as nice like PWK designs, but my own! and first DIY sub-box! (mini sub-box?)*


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## 60ndown (Feb 8, 2007)

whats the specks on that box ^ ??

looks like .5 cube @ 32hz??

*guess*


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

60ndown said:


> whats the specks on that box ^ ??
> 
> looks like .5 cube @ 32hz??
> 
> *guess*


I'm trying to accomplish HAT recommendations:

0.35 cuft @ 38hz


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## 60ndown (Feb 8, 2007)

gotta fill it with frozen peas/foam chips or something, then when its full, pour the stuff into a container and measure them for exact volume.

then run test tones and adjust the port length for 38hz.

nice work so far


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

60ndown said:


> gotta fill it with frozen peas/foam chips or something, then when its full, pour the stuff into a container and measure them for exact volume.
> 
> then run test tones and adjust the port length for 38hz.
> 
> nice work so far


I've been working on the internal volume since I started figuring out where to install the sub-box for the I6SW...

Check out my "*Build*" and go to *post # 363* where I start plying with my I6SW and internal volume of the enclosure...

*I will check the internal volume again*, I'm not afraid of ending with extra room, I could fix that very easy, I was afraid of ending with a smaller box, in other words here I was trying to over design just in case! besides this is my first DIY sub-box ! and I've been enjoying it a lot!

(O:


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

I did copy paste from my build:

*Ok, here are the first 100 miles of the I6SW...*


I have to be honest here... I was very exited this morning when I jumped in my car, and got my self going... the fist 10 miles... mmm, _*"Maybe I should use 2 I6SW" *_ I was a little dissapointed maybe even more because I remember thinking _*"I'm moving back the IDQ up front"*_

Well heading to my destination after 40 miles or so... I forgot I was testing the I6SW, and _*"What? this sounds good, feels like that little woofer it's growing"*_ no kidding started to come alive! well sort of.

By the time I was almost back home after 80 miles or so,* I just couldn't believe it!* I don't want to write here that "Hits Hard" *it doesn't* I'm sure I'm not going to wake up my neighbors, but the BASS up front is great! my chest, my arms, my shoulders are witness of this wonderful effect!

When I got home with a big smile on my face, I can tell you... this is not a LOUD woofer, it doesn't shake the car like crazy, but man does plays *"JUST RIGHT"*, This is what I wanted, some thing really cool, that sounds great, makes my music feel "BOLD" and at least to me a sweet spot for Sound Quality. And the fact that now* I feel the BASS coming from the front,* hitting my chest! vrs the BASS Shaking my seat and that rumble coming from the back. I really love having the BASS up front! You can tell I'm happy! :biggrin:

Ok ok,... too many good things about it, so here we go it's not a little monster, that likes to play at super high volumes (I don't really listen music at super high volumes any whay) it's more sensitive to changes than the IDQ12, and it sounds really good with some music but I didn't like it when *playing rap music, it just didn't feel right,* maybe after a break in period I could give more details. I remember the same feelings when I installed* my IDQ12, at the beginning was so-so, but after a while turned into a really good woofer. *

Now I have three *10" Kicker Solo Baric woofers, one 10" Bazooka tube, one IDQ12;* all these sound great, I was impressed with the Bazooka, and the power handling of the Solo Baric, and the IDQ12 has a special place in my heart, but nothing compares to the feeling having the BASS up front where everything else is happening.

For now the first two and a half hours took me from in-satisfaction to a _*"wow this sounds great, not bad for a 6.5" woofer"*_









.


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

So I've been playing with these little guys a lot lately (no ****/pedo)... and it seems that no matter what enclosure I build, the sound great. That being said they just don't do it for me... that sounds contradictory I know, but even with the awesome SQ I’ve managed to get out of them or better yet HAT designed them to produce, they just don’t displace the amount of air I need to put a smile on my face. I am all for SQ, but I think I’ve still got the need for more bass than the average SQ guy. 

I recently built a box for 1, I6SW to the recommended specs of .35 tuned to 38.1 Hz and gave it plenty of power (Alpine PDX 1.1000, I know right-just a lil over manufactures specs) . The little guy took all the amp was throwing its direction with minimal distress… although I made sure not to push it beyond its audible limits (never heard any mechanical distortion, voice coil/magnet issues)… I placed the woofer/enclosure in roughly the same location/position of Derrick’s and then in various other spots in the vehicle… As I previously stated, it sounded great… the biggest issue was, that it had a problem competing w/the 8” mid-bass driver’s I’ve got crossed over at 35 hz… however, I did find that it really added to the overall sound quality of my system… It just doesn’t do it for me for daily driving purposes…

Next I figured I’d build a box for 1 or 2 I6SW’s to the .6 vented spec tuned to 32.3… What I ended up doing is building a single box divided into 2 chambers so I could try the subs separately or as a pair and the results were IMO not significantly different from the smaller recommended enclosure when only using 1 sub, when hooking up both subs, things obviously changed a bit… it sounded closer to a nice sealed SQ 10” sub… nothing overbearing, just played what it needed to and played it well. Based on HATs recommendation to reduce the power 50% I ended up using an Xtant 1.1 to power the pair of subs, giving the pair only 100 watts. They seemed plenty happy with the power and for what is worth I was pretty happy overall with this setup… for 2. 6” subs to play like a 10” sub w/only 100 watts, who wouldn’t be a little excited… 

Cons; 
The stamped steel basket, it really is way TOO thin Scott, the heads of screws cause it to bend/push the lip outward with ease when installing… yes there are ways to avoid it, but a better product from the start seems like a better approach. I never had this issue w/ 6W0’s or 6W3’s.

Too much required airspace for them to really perform… @ .6 ft3, you might has well find an 8” or a 10” unless your location will only allow a 6”, but if that’s the case, you’ll probably have issues getting .6 out of that location anyway, but to play devil's advocate, .35 shouldn't be hard to achieve.

Pro’s;
Unarguable SQ and performance in a small package.

Can be installed in a variety of locations that an 8”, 10” 12” ect, could not be installed.

Efficiency/low power requirement.

I'll post pics of the test/demo boxes soon... Nothing special, just something to back this experiment...


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)




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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

I'm still struggling trying to justify where these speakers would fit in my set up. Having no door pods, and currently having the Tempo 6's in the kick panels, i do need a bit more up front. However, i'm also considering the 6W3v3, Ground Zero GZNW6.5 or maybe a pair of CDT M6+ enclosed in the passenger footwell, just to give me a bit more midbass up front. 



> (Alpine PDX 1.1000, I know right-just a lil over manufactures specs) . The little guy took all the amp was throwing its direction with minimal distress… although I made sure not to push it beyond its audible limits (never heard any mechanical distortion, voice coil/magnet issues)


Well I guess sticking a bridged 150-170 watt 4ohm load into them woon't be much of an issue then!


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## pocket5s (Jan 6, 2012)

when I built a test box at the .3ft^3 spec it wasn't too bad in my truck (even have a vid if you want to see it). took some bass boost, but then again my truck exhaust is fairly loud. About the same for the I8SW. 

However, when I put the I6SW in a bandpass box, world of difference. this thing came alive. Granted it takes up far more space and I could have used that space for a good 10 or 12, but I really like it as it is. No boominess, just hard hitting bass from a little 6.


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

captainscarlett said:


> I'm still struggling trying to justify where these speakers would fit in my set up. Having no door pods, and currently having the Tempo 6's in the kick panels, i do need a bit more up front. However, i'm also considering the 6W3v3, Ground Zero GZNW6.5 or maybe a pair of CDT M6+ enclosed in the passenger footwell, just to give me a bit more midbass up front.
> 
> 
> 
> Well I guess sticking a bridged 150-170 watt 4ohm load into them woon't be much of an issue then!


What type of vehicle and how much do you use your glove box? You could do a faux glove box and place one in there...

I'd like to state that I am in no way a spokesman for HAT and feel you should follow their recommended power specs... that being said, I would also state that in my opinion they could easily handle 150-170 in moderate to high volume level situations in the .35 cf box for sustained periods of time... 

Ex, I've been giving some Dayton RS225s (rated at 75 w RMS) 180 w RMS for nearly 5 years w/ no issues... same with about 3 sets of various Focals... 

While working in the car audio industry and even since I've left it, I've found a lot of people looking at 6" subs to help in limited midbass output situations... these can help, but make no mistake... these are designed as subs and are intended to be used as just that, subs... they really aren't intended to make up for lacking midbass... but then again depending on how they are installed and tuned, I'm sure you can/will get what you need out of them...



pocket5s said:


> when I built a test box at the .3ft^3 spec it wasn't too bad in my truck (even have a vid if you want to see it). took some bass boost, but then again my truck exhaust is fairly loud. About the same for the I8SW.
> 
> However, when I put the I6SW in a bandpass box, world of difference. this thing came alive. Granted it takes up far more space and I could have used that space for a good 10 or 12, but I really like it as it is. No boominess, just hard hitting bass from a little 6.


Post the vid! The more info, the better... and agreed, these things shine in a bandpass box... as do pretty much any lil 6" subs I've heard in bandpass boxes .. One of my projected projects is to do a dual 6 band pass box and post the results... and maybe one of these days I'll quit screwing around and finish an actual build I've started...


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## pocket5s (Jan 6, 2012)

TheDavel said:


> What type of vehicle and how much do you use your glove box? You could do a faux glove box and place one in there...
> 
> I'd like to state that I am in no way a spokesman for HAT and feel you should follow their recommended power specs... that being said, I would also state that in my opinion they could easily handle 150-170 in moderate to high volume level situations in the .35 cf box for sustained periods of time...
> 
> ...


Here ya go:





If you really want to see it move, jump to about 2:00.


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## TheDavel (Sep 8, 2006)

****, I haven't heard that song/CD in about 10 years... great memories for sure... Thanks for the vid! 

And I see your sub has the custom dented basket like both of mine... HAT, please fix this! even if it drives the price up 5-10 bucks per unit... you have a great rep in the industry and your standards are above this....


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

TheDavel said:


> What type of vehicle and how much do you use your glove box? You could do a faux glove box and place one in there...
> 
> I'd like to state that I am in no way a spokesman for HAT and feel you should follow their recommended power specs... that being said, I would also state that in my opinion they could easily handle 150-170 in moderate to high volume level situations in the .35 cf box for sustained periods of time...
> 
> ...


Don't get me wrong my car's a wreck and because I've not 'commited' to my final front speaker install, I've literally taped my Tempos in the kick panel. But I've got some Hybrid Imagines coming as soon as i get paid from a PPI claim (has your bank missold you payment protection insurance??? .. claim thing). 

I had issues with my sub seriously localising. I've reversed the phase by switching the sub cable at the amp, I set the LPF at 60, however last week i've lowered down to 50 which has helped even more. But I do need something to fill that .. subwoofer/midbass gap. 



And the 4" speakers point at your knees ... lovely! Nice thinking Toyota ... if in fact ... you were thinking at the time!



So so you think a dedicated midbass will be better than a dedicated sub? I'm playing around with my JL Audio CP108 subwoofer on a 'normal' setting on the amp, not the HPF or LPF settings ... just to give me an impression of how a mid or sub will sound. It helps with localising but it takes up too much room (of course). 

Again, I was hoping to leave the rear sub at LPF 50Hz which i really like, set the fronts on HPF with something to fill the gap.


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## cgw (Jan 31, 2009)

How do they fair against the DLS RW6 or the Focal 13WS using 1 or 2 of each?


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

cgw said:


> How do they fair against the DLS RW6 or the Focal 13WS using 1 or 2 of each?


I'd like to get a hold of these 6.5's (or 5.25's in the case of Focal)and do a back to back test. I hear varying opinions on each especially on CDT. I heard that some prefer the DLS RW6 over CDT 6's. But in the UK you could also throw the GroundZero GZNW 6.5 into the mix, which for the little acclaim it has had, it has gotten good reviews. But then there's the ol'd faithful 6w3v3 as well.


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## cgw (Jan 31, 2009)

Has anyone have any experience with the 3?


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

cgw said:


> Has anyone have any experience with the 3?


3 Wildman:mean: 

in the UK, the price of one maybe hard to justify. 2, and I'd be looking at a possible divorce! 3 would be straight jacket and/or white padded cell territory. It would be fun .... but i'd let someone else ... pay for that experiment. 

It would be nice to hear about the 8 and 10, which don't seem to get a mention anywhere apart from Pete (PWK) Youtube video on the I8SW.


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## cgw (Jan 31, 2009)

I mean experience with the 3 diferent brands, the Focal 13WS, DLS RW6 & HAT i6SW, in comparison with each other,lol, my bad.


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

cgw said:


> I mean experience with the 3 diferent brands, the Focal 13WS, DLS RW6 & HAT i6SW, in comparison with each other,lol, my bad.



NO, no .. its me. i always get the wrong end of the stick 

It would be cool, but for the most part, people avoid small subs, i guess everyone wants to get the best bang for their buck i.e. they end up buying a 12" or bigger or they let the midbass in their components do the job. I'm still thinking about a Van install for my friend. I was told that the HAT Imagine I61 midbass in a properly soundproofed door would negate the need for another small sub (i6sw). 

I suspect that without the i6sw video from Pete (PWK) then the i6sw would also have been banished into the realm of nothingness, just like the Ground Zero GZNW 6.5 which got a bit of a mention from talkaudio.co.uk one time ... and then never heard of again, never reviewed, no Youtube clips. The same could be said the for the others. 

The cheapest prices I could find in the UK:

*I6SW* - 6.5" Long throw subwoofer: £169.99
*DLS-RW6* £199.99 
*JL Audio 6w3v3* £99.95
*Ground Zero Nuclear 6.5" Car Subwoofer GZNW6.5* £129.99 
*Focal 13WS 5" Compact Reference Subwoofer* £184.49
*CDT AUDIO QES-680 PAIR* £239.99 + £9.00 shipping

*Total* £1033.40 

Me thinks it would be a bit cheaper in the U.S.! But it would be one heck of a cool review


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

This is a funny story I just can't let it go:

Some one asked me if I would sell him my old Premier (Pioneer) PRS-x720 amp, I told him "yes" but I was going to plug it in my car just to make sure it was working after a year in the closet.

*To my surprise the I6SW fell in love with this amp, I guess the extra power was just right. I had people sit in my car and they feel like If I had a 10" woofer in a sealed box, the gain to me with the PRS-x720 in a positive way is WOW! now feels like a 12"* (don't get me wrong, this is not a SPL woofer, it's pure SQ in my install)

I wrote back... I have bad news and good news, the amp is working!, but it works so well, that I'm having second thoughts about selling it. 


















.


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

derickveliz said:


> This is a funny story I just can't let it go:
> 
> Some one asked me if I would sell him my old Premier (Pioneer) PRS-x720 amp, I told him "yes" but I was going to plug it in my car just to make sure it was working after a year in the closet.
> 
> ...


maybe you should join in htis discussion. 

http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum...-pioneer-amps-more-popular-2.html#post1621190


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

For those using this in a bandpass, do you care to give specs? I think there are several 4th orders floating around and would love to get a general idea of size. I am looking at this between the DD 6.5 sub.


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

Jroo said:


> For those using this in a bandpass, do you care to give specs? I think there are several 4th orders floating around and would love to get a general idea of size. I am looking at this between the DD 6.5 sub.


*My i6SW is set like this:

Internal volume about 0.34 cf
Port Diameter 2"
Port Length 15.5"*














































.


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## pocket5s (Jan 6, 2012)

Jroo said:


> For those using this in a bandpass, do you care to give specs? I think there are several 4th orders floating around and would love to get a general idea of size. I am looking at this between the DD 6.5 sub.


mine is a 6th order series tuned bandpass, designed by PWK. I would have to check the specifics, but external dimensions are right at 2ft^3 for the enclosure, playing from 38-80hz, but I have mine crossed over at 60. 

i did have it in the recommended enclosure for a few weeks while waiting for my design. It didn't have enough output for me in that config. I have a loud truck though, but with the engine off it was pretty nice. Obviously nothing ground pounding.


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## Renegadesoundwave (Apr 9, 2012)

derickveliz said:


> *My i6SW is set like this:
> 
> Internal volume about 0.34 cf
> Port Diameter 2"
> ...



This looks mental 
I need to know / seemore !


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

pocket5s said:


> mine is a 6th order series tuned bandpass, designed by PWK. I would have to check the specifics, but external dimensions are right at 2ft^3 for the enclosure, playing from 38-80hz, but I have mine crossed over at 60.
> 
> i did have it in the recommended enclosure for a few weeks while waiting for my design. It didn't have enough output for me in that config. I have a loud truck though, but with the engine off it was pretty nice. Obviously nothing ground pounding.





pocket5s said:


> i6sw_enclosure
> 
> 
> Performance Data


And a nice enclosure it is. The truck looks good BTW. I wish i could afford the gas for that thing, but with Petrol in the UK being near $9 for an equivilent U.S. gallon, I'll have to stick with my little Toyota for now


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## pocket5s (Jan 6, 2012)

Thanks. Yea it isnt exactly economical. I drive it 35 miles a day at 11mpg. I can go 4 days on each of the two tanks, but I fill it up every three just to be safe (fuel gauge not yet hooked up) and switch tanks each time I do so one doesn't get stale. 

I'm going to be getting a 72 skylark soon that I plan to make into more of a daily driver. But I'll probably end up hotrodding that thing too


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## Brian Steele (Jun 1, 2007)

pocket5s said:


> mine is a 6th order series tuned bandpass, designed by PWK. I would have to check the specifics, but external dimensions are right at 2ft^3 for the enclosure, playing from 38-80hz, but I have mine crossed over at 60.


2 cu.ft. external for a 6.6" driver? That's wayyyy to big IMO.

For kicks, I ran the specs for the driver through HornResp. 4 of them in a tapped-horn that's about 341 cm long (38 cm^2 at the closed end, 240 cm^2 at the open end) will do 92 dB/2.83V/1M all the way down to below 40 Hz and should net over 113dB in the passband if played in-room (and therefore a lot more in-car). Box size should work out to 2 cu.ft. or less too, and it should give a much flatter passband and better power handling as well.

The low Qes / high BL of this driver suggests it might work well in a horn, so I'm going to run a few more sims to see what turns up..


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## subwoofery (Nov 9, 2008)

Brian Steele said:


> 2 cu.ft. external for a 6.6" driver? That's wayyyy to big IMO.
> 
> For kicks, I ran the specs for the driver through HornResp. 4 of them in a tapped-horn that's about 341 cm long (38 cm^2 at the closed end, 240 cm^2 at the open end) will do 92 dB/2.83V/1M all the way down to below 40 Hz and should net over 113dB in the passband if played in-room (and therefore a lot more in-car). Box size should work out to 2 cu.ft. or less too, and it should give a much flatter passband and better power handling as well.
> 
> The low Qes / high BL of this driver suggests it might work well in a horn, so I'm going to run a few more sims to see what turns up..


Do you have links that help you understand how to use Hornresp? I downloaded it but don't know how to use it yet... 

Thanks, 
Kelvin


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## Brian Steele (Jun 1, 2007)

subwoofery said:


> Do you have links that help you understand how to use Hornresp? I downloaded it but don't know how to use it yet...
> 
> Thanks,
> Kelvin


Check the DIYAudio Subwoofers forum - it's put to lots of use in the designs featured in that forum.


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

*2 cf subwoofer box!*... that takes away the purpose of this woofer in my install, where space is an issue. But I understand, what ever it takes to make it sound the way you like it.

BTW my little Yaris gets *42.3 MPG* Jeje


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL (Jan 31, 2011)

Dereck, I must say that I partially blame you for me deciding to try out a dash subwoofer set up lol. With the age of my car being what it is, I'm tearing the dash out and going bigger, but you partially got my itch going to try it.

BTW, nice MPG numbers. I'm right at 42.7 average in my neon. Working on bumping that up with improved aerodynamics.


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL said:


> Dereck, I must say that I partially blame you for me deciding to try out a dash subwoofer set up lol. With the age of my car being what it is, I'm tearing the dash out and going bigger, but you partially got my itch going to try it.
> 
> BTW, nice MPG numbers. I'm right at 42.7 average in my neon. Working on bumping that up with improved aerodynamics.


*Awesome, let us know how it goes with the sub up front!*

If I get more than 41 MPG I'm a happy man (only in winter I get about 40 MPG), because I just jump into the high way and set the cruise control at 75 mph and drive for 120-180 miles round trip every day.

.


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## TOOSTUBBORN2FAIL (Jan 31, 2011)

Will do, I'll actually be crudely testing an I10SW up front this weekend. I'll get pics up on my build log, and maybe a video walkthrough of the car and whats going on with it.

I know what you mean on mileage, I used to drive 110 miles a day. I used to be able to get around 52mpg doing 65mph, but I had a lot of aerodynamic modifications done. Those mods are being rebuilt now in a more permanent (and professional looking) fashion, as they significantly reduced road noise and improved mileage.


Ok, back to the I6SW. I'll post my thoughts once we get my dads I6SW up and going.


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## CaliAgents1688 (Feb 8, 2010)

How does the HAT I6SW compare overall (in the appropriate small ported enclosure) with the ol' JL 6w0?


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## emilime75 (Jan 27, 2011)

Just wanted to clear up some general misconceptions regarding stamped VS cast baskets on drivers. Many people automatically assume that a driver with a cast basket is higher in quality than a driver with a stamped basket. While there are many factors as to what does and does not make for a good basket for any driver, generally for sub woofer use a stamped steel basket can be just as good as a cast aluminum one if it is designed and built properly. Stamped steel baskets typically become a problem with mid range drivers due to the frequencies produced by those drivers can often cause the frame(basket) to resonate, or ring, which can often be heard and is highly undesirable. Other considerations for cast VS stamped are the fact that with cast aluminum, the basket can be made with much larger openings which blocks the back wave of the driver less, it essentially is more rigid which allows for better support of large magnets and higher build tolerances than stamped steel. With that said, there are still situations where there is absolutely nothing wrong with stamped steel as a choice for a driver's basket, and smaller woofers and sub woofers are the main suspects just like the small sub discussed in this thread. There are also many examples of woofers and sub woofers as large as 15" with stamped steel baskets that sound great and have no need for cast aluminum frames. There is absolutely no reason this driver needs the extra cost in materials and tooling for a cast aluminum basket except for marketing, bragging rights, eye candy... Anyway, just thought I throw that out there.


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

emilime75 said:


> Just wanted to clear up some general misconceptions regarding stamped VS cast baskets on drivers. Many people automatically assume that a driver with a cast basket is higher in quality than a driver with a stamped basket. While there are many factors as to what does and does not make for a good basket for any driver, generally for sub woofer use a stamped steel basket can be just as good as a cast aluminum one if it is designed and built properly. Stamped steel baskets typically become a problem with mid range drivers due to the frequencies produced by those drivers can often cause the frame(basket) to resonate, or ring, which can often be heard and is highly undesirable. Other considerations for cast VS stamped are the fact that with cast aluminum, the basket can be made with much larger openings which blocks the back wave of the driver less, it essentially is more rigid which allows for better support of large magnets and higher build tolerances than stamped steel. With that said, there are still situations where there is absolutely nothing wrong with stamped steel as a choice for a driver's basket, and smaller woofers and sub woofers are the main suspects just like the small sub discussed in this thread. There are also many examples of woofers and sub woofers as large as 15" with stamped steel baskets that sound great and have no need for cast aluminum frames. There is absolutely no reason this driver needs the extra cost in materials and tooling for a cast aluminum basket except for marketing, bragging rights, eye candy... Anyway, just thought I throw that out there.


The issue I've come up against is sealing. Not wanting to use a sealant around the sub, I went for a rubber gasket first, which wasn't perfect, but on reflection has probably been the best so far. 











Then i used foam tape. Problem is the foam tape has compressed where the screws are, but it has bent the outer rim out of shape. Now this thing blows like me after a Madras.










As I'm planning to do a big refurb on the i6sw, the only way around this is to drill four subsequent mounting holes, and use 8 screws to pin it down, apply the pressure more evenly.


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## jbcon (Feb 15, 2010)

Old thread I know, but it was asked earlier about specs for band pass enclosures... Are there any others who can share, 2 cu ft. seems really big. When I run this driver through my software using a .38 cu ft. for rear and .15 cu ft. for front enclosure I get a pretty good result (at least in software). What am I missing? Also, any one been able to compare one in band-pass with two in smallish ported


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

jbcon said:


> Old thread I know, but it was asked earlier about specs for band pass enclosures... Are there any others who can share, 2 cu ft. seems really big. When I run this driver through my software using a .38 cu ft. for rear and .15 cu ft. for front enclosure I get a pretty good result (at least in software). What am I missing? Also, any one been able to compare one in band-pass with two in smallish ported


*Sorry I don't have that feed back, but...

When the iasca judge came out from my car he though I had a pillow up front to absorb the reflections. lol maybe he was teasing me.* :laugh:

D.


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## jbcon (Feb 15, 2010)

derickveliz said:


> *Sorry I don't have that feed back, but...
> 
> When the iasca judge came out from my car he though I had a pillow up front to absorb the reflections. lol maybe he was teasing me.* :laugh:
> 
> D.


hmmm, that reference could mean several things. I am guessing the judge didn't mean that your system was so quiet it put him to sleep though...


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## derickveliz (May 15, 2009)

jbcon said:


> hmmm, that reference could mean several things. I am guessing the judge didn't mean that your system was so quiet it put him to sleep though...


lol

*He swear I had a woofer in my trunk... and when I show him the little i6SW he said..."very impressive".

D.*


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## captainscarlett (Mar 15, 2011)

derickveliz said:


> lol
> 
> *He swear I had a woofer in my trunk... and when I show him the little i6SW he said..."very impressive".
> 
> D.*


Like i said before, it is a little beast!


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