# My new install log. **Pics**



## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

This one is gonna take some time. I am completely gutting my setup and starting again. The only things that will stay for now are the amps and my IB15.

System rundown:

Head unit: Panasonic CQ-TW5500W
Processing: Berhinger DCX2496 w/ Envision conversion
Tweeters: Scan Speak 6600 AirCircs
Mids: Seas W18NX
Amps: eD Nine.4 and eD Nine.2
Sub: Dayton IB15

The plan is to have the mids and tweeters in the kicks similar to Randy and Matt R's vehicles. The mids will be AP'd with ScanSpeak VarioVents. The enclosures will be full of Mortar/Cement and molded into the floor with the deadening and new carpet foam and carpet.

Progress so far:

Workshop









Before...brand new leather seats....made this part nerve racking









After. Thought I had pics of both sides out..oh well









Baffle Mockup









Baffle drawn out on hard maple









Flush mount for w18 cut









Complete









Testing placement in car. This is the hard part for me right now. I am trying to decide what the best aiming would be for this. I need to go through the few kick panel install tuts. I have come across. Suggestions?

















From the ear shot of the second placement









Bottlehead in









DCX Converted
Before









After










This is where I am for now. I just ordered a roll of BXT and some low heat plastic to make the grills for the kicks. Also waiting on the backless carpet and foam. The W18's and 6600's should be here next week if all goes to plan.

More to come soon hopefully.

Comments/Suggestions/Critiques always welcome.


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## doitor (Aug 16, 2007)

LOVE the HU.
Sound's really interesting.
I'm subscribed.


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## daesonn (Jan 15, 2008)

i'm interested in how you keep the baffles set in the right place while you actually mold them or glue them to the kicks, whatever way you may be doing it....


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## Fran82 (Jul 30, 2007)

Arc said:


> Testing placement in car. This is the hard part for me right now. I am trying to decide what the best aiming would be for this. I need to go through the few kick panel install tuts. I have come across. Suggestions?


Looking good. My suggestion is to take your time with the speaker placement on those kicks. Sounds like you're trying to do it right, so make a temporary setup and start listening. You'll find what's right when you hear it.


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## ///Audience (Jan 31, 2007)

man i didnt know anyone on this site was running those headunits! thats awesome man!


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## syd-monster (Jan 7, 2008)

Fran82 said:


> Looking good. ... so make a temporary setup and start listening. You'll find what's right when you hear it.


 +1getoit!


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## rush1 (Nov 18, 2007)

He he.. that will be the two of us mate,









I am running it with a couple of the Milberts:









Sorry about the pic quality mate, not much of a photographer. 

I have replaced the original tube of the Panasonic, and what a dramatic improvements it makes. If you can get your hands on WE 396A, I would say it worths every penny mate.

Looking forward on your install.

Cheers,


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

rush1 said:


> He he.. that will be the two of us mate,
> 
> View attachment 4176
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tip on the Tube replacement. I was wondering about that.

Love the Milberts.


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## adrianp89 (Oct 14, 2007)

Love that HU. Noticed you said new seats, how mucht hat cost ya?


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

the727kid said:


> Love that HU. Noticed you said new seats, how mucht hat cost ya?


Dunno. Dad did it for me as a surprise for my 22nd BDay.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

rush1 said:


> He he.. that will be the two of us mate,
> 
> View attachment 4176
> 
> ...


Ok, I have to ask after looking around. Did you use a vintage NOS tube....or a current production 396A?

Because I can do the vintage price...but the current is a bit steep for me.
About $49 for a vintage...and $300 for current.


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## rush1 (Nov 18, 2007)

Arc said:


> Ok, I have to ask after looking around. Did you use a vintage NOS tube....or a current production 396A?
> 
> Because I can do the vintage price...but the current is a bit steep for me.
> About $49 for a vintage...and $300 for current.


I got a NOS (New Old Stock) 1968 Western Electric 396A from www.tubeworld.com for $200.00 it is steep, but well worth it IMHO. the vintage is it new? that is great price mate. 

cheers,


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## drake78 (May 27, 2007)

rush1 said:


> I got a NOS (New Old Stock) 1968 Western Electric 396A from www.tubeworld.com for $200.00 it is steep, but well worth it IMHO. the vintage is it new? that is great price mate.
> 
> cheers,


 $200? You can find those tubes on ebay for around $30 a pop.


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## rush1 (Nov 18, 2007)

drake78 said:


> $200? You can find those tubes on ebay for around $30 a pop.



Didn't find it mate...  are you sure it is NOS WE 396 for $30? Gosh...


Cheers,


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

rush1 said:


> Didn't find it mate...  are you sure it is NOS WE 396 for $30? Gosh...
> 
> 
> Cheers,


Yep. Unfortunately.


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## drake78 (May 27, 2007)

rush1 said:


> Didn't find it mate...  are you sure it is NOS WE 396 for $30? Gosh...
> 
> 
> Cheers,


You have to try the ebay.com, US website. There are always some for sale.


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## rush1 (Nov 18, 2007)

drake78 said:


> You have to try the ebay.com, US website. There are always some for sale.


   definitely will check it out before I buy anything next time mate. Thank you for the info.

Cheers,


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Quick question. In the kicks, should I deaden the floor under them before I fiberglass, or should I just glass, then deaden around them?

I should have a deadening update this weekend. I picked up a bunch of 1/2" thick industrial rubber to lay down between two layers of BXT. Should be fun.


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## GlasSman (Nov 14, 2006)

Arc said:


> Quick question. In the kicks, should I deaden the floor under them before I fiberglass, or should I just glass, then deaden around them?
> 
> I should have a deadening update this weekend. I picked up a bunch of 1/2" thick industrial rubber to lay down between two layers of BXT. Should be fun.


Lay down all your deadener and noise absorbing products FIRST.

Once it's all installed THEN start working on the kicks.. That way you reduce the chances of fitament problems.


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## Sideshow (Mar 6, 2007)

GlasSman said:


> Lay down all your deadener and noise absorbing products FIRST.
> 
> Once it's all installed THEN start working on the kicks.. That way you reduce the chances of fitament problems.


I have always preferred finishing the glass enclosures, attaching them to the vehicle with nothing inbetween them and the metal, then deadening the back of the inside of the enclosure, and then do the outside with the rest of the interior of your car so that looking at it you could hardly tell where the sheet metal ends and the fiberglass begins.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Sideshow said:


> I have always preferred finishing the glass enclosures, attaching them to the vehicle with nothing inbetween them and the metal, then deadening the back of the inside of the enclosure, and then do the outside with the rest of the interior of your car so that looking at it you could hardly tell where the sheet metal ends and the fiberglass begins.


This is what I am aiming for. Thanks.


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## GlasSman (Nov 14, 2006)

Sideshow said:


> I have always preferred finishing the glass enclosures, attaching them to the vehicle with nothing inbetween them and the metal, then deadening the back of the inside of the enclosure, and then do the outside with the rest of the interior of your car so that looking at it you could hardly tell where the sheet metal ends and the fiberglass begins.



The professional way to do it is to have the vehicle as close to the way it'll be when finished...meaning apply your deadening...barriers...whatever else you're using......reinstall the carpet....*THEN* and ONLY then do you start glassing. Unless of course the kick area and carpet don't touch like in many newer BMW installs where the speakers are actually mounted flush to the metal and fire towards each other.

Like I said....it minimizes the chance of fitament problems.

Otherwise it would be like making the kick panels...tossing a dozen eggs under the carpet and wondering why everything doesn't quite fit right. 

:blush:


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

GlasSman said:


> The professional way to do it is to have the vehicle as close to the way it'll be when finished...meaning apply your deadening...barriers...whatever else you're using......reinstall the carpet....*THEN* and ONLY then do you start glassing. Unless of course the kick area and carpet don't touch like in many newer BMW installs where the speakers are actually mounted flush to the metal and fire towards each other.
> 
> Like I said....it minimizes the chance of fitament problems.
> 
> ...


Well the kicks are going UNDER the carpet. They will be molded in as they are part of the car. That's the reason I asked.


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## GlasSman (Nov 14, 2006)

Well if you don't mind having nothing behind the kicks in the way of deadening and barriers...I guess it's alright to do it that way. I've always applied everything first then started working on kicks.

I was picturing you covering every square inch of the floor with deadener. Them trying to fit the kicks in and they just don't quite fit. 

Are you going for the same look RAndy aka the other hated guy has in his Accord?


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

GlasSman said:


> Are you going for the same look RAndy aka the other hated guy has in his Accord?


Yep thats the goal.


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## GlasSman (Nov 14, 2006)

Arc said:


> Yep thats the goal.


I might be forced to do that type of kick install in my Audi. Still thinking about getting another car.

Not sure yet.


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## flipGTO (Jan 23, 2008)

thats a crazy hu


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Got my Raammat,1/2" Rubber pad, some new distribution blocks, 100' of TechFlex, terminal strips, new heat shrink, connectors today. And my W18's came in today and the 6600's should be here early next week. Time for work Tomorrow!!


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## Whiterabbit (May 26, 2006)

you have a compressor by chance?

your kicks look hefty. some advice: with a compressor, buy an air hammer with a punch, chisel, and that weird three pronged deal that looks like it can snip metal pretty good. even just the punch and chisel alone are helpful. Then punch the space down where the w18 is gonna be and sink that bad boy as wide as humanly possible. reciprocating saw is a good tool that will help this also. With no compressor, a drill to punch or grinder with a cutoff wheel then a reciprocating saw (any kind) to buzz out the metal can help.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Whiterabbit said:


> you have a compressor by chance?
> 
> your kicks look hefty. some advice: with a compressor, buy an air hammer with a punch, chisel, and that weird three pronged deal that looks like it can snip metal pretty good. even just the punch and chisel alone are helpful. Then punch the space down where the w18 is gonna be and sink that bad boy as wide as humanly possible. reciprocating saw is a good tool that will help this also. With no compressor, a drill to punch or grinder with a cutoff wheel then a reciprocating saw (any kind) to buzz out the metal can help.


Thanks for the tip, looks like a trip to Lowes.

Yea I have a beefy compressor. I looked yesterday at the kicks, and they appear to be a double layer. There is another layer of sheet metal underneath that has a different shape. I am going to try and cut the first layer away and sink the W18's in and then AP the second skin.

I don't think I will do the cutting here at school, I don't feel 100% about it by myself, so I will wait with the cutting until next week. I have plenty to keep me busy until then.

On a side note, I LOVE working with the BXT. 

Pics of progress tomorrow night.


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## Whiterabbit (May 26, 2006)

by the way if you want to shortcut those kickpanels, cutting a hole in the metal is perfect. the back of the baffle just sinks in. Then you secure the face via struts to the remaining metal, then lay sheet damper to seal the front and rearwave. Its not as solid as glassing them in but shaves a day and a half off finish time. can lay the carpet backer right over the deadener.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Whiterabbit said:


> by the way if you want to shortcut those kickpanels, cutting a hole in the metal is perfect. the back of the baffle just sinks in. Then you secure the face via struts to the remaining metal, then lay sheet damper to seal the front and rearwave. Its not as solid as glassing them in but shaves a day and a half off finish time. can lay the carpet backer right over the deadener.



I am going to do this somewhat. I am hoping to cut a hole big enough for the rear motor of the w18's to sink into, then glass them in. I am aiming for around 7L of airspace and then I will AP them to the outside. Then anything over 7L will get filled with mortar.

I am planning on eventually switching out the w18's to a pair of AT 18H's, and according to Per, 7L AP'd should sound wonderful.


Also, on progress: I finished the first layer of BXT in the car. In the morning I will have the rubber mat and the w18's to play with. Then I am going to lowes and getting some carpet pad and some L brackets to mount the DCX to the underside of the rear deck. Pics tomorrow night.

And I just won this to measure everything once its in.


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## Whiterabbit (May 26, 2006)

I recommend facing the processor face forward. The hardest part of that install is making the wiring look OK from the trunk open. Do you let the wiring flop around? Do you make a cover for the wire? does the cover stop at the back of the processor? does the process rest on it? do you use a prefab rack shelf for the processor?

I dont think there is a good answer. making XLR's look good is damn hard.

BTW my mortar test failed miserably. No longer an automotive candidate material as far as I am concerned. I'd recommend running an experiment with sand filled fiberglass resin (instead of sand filled concrete) as a way to adhere to metal. lead shot filled resin was a fantastic success minus viscosity. I'm hoping with a thickening agent it will be the ideal material for this kind of work.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Whiterabbit said:


> I recommend facing the processor face forward. The hardest part of that install is making the wiring look OK from the trunk open. Do you let the wiring flop around? Do you make a cover for the wire? does the cover stop at the back of the processor? does the process rest on it? do you use a prefab rack shelf for the processor?
> 
> I dont think there is a good answer. making XLR's look good is damn hard.
> 
> BTW my mortar test failed miserably. No longer an automotive candidate material as far as I am concerned. I'd recommend running an experiment with sand filled fiberglass resin (instead of sand filled concrete) as a way to adhere to metal. lead shot filled resin was a fantastic success minus viscosity. I'm hoping with a thickening agent it will be the ideal material for this kind of work.


Thanks for the tip on the mortar.

On the processor. The plan is to mount it under the rear deck facing the rear. I will make an enclosure out of MDF, and mount it to the top with either self tapping screws or some bolts. I am trying to think of a way to try and isolate any vibrations. Right now I am thinking rubber grommets on the screw to kind of isolate the mounting brackets?

The cables will be made to length and will run under the rear deck and down to the amps. If done the way I am envisioning, there _should _be no wires visible.

Some pictures now:

First layer of BXT down. Tomorrow I will put the rubber down and one or two more layers of BXT, then carpet pad.









And just because it makes me warm and fuzzy inside:


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Steve, here is a pic of my trunk. If you have any other suggestions my ears are wide open.


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## Whiterabbit (May 26, 2006)

_always_ have suggestions . face it forward. its easier to tune from the backseat than it is to get out an pop the trunk. You say laptop only but its seriously convenient to have the face control. You'll probably be in the backseat anyways for microphone measurements. And having two laptop windows open isn't as convenient as having two dedicated interfaces to your products. Much less something as simple as running auto-TA (which by the way, if you hit that magic spot with the mic, is AWESOME).

Is your baffle in the way of a forward facing unit? the faceplate comes off. you can put the processor in the same spot, detach the head, and put it in front of the baffle.

But if you are going to do that, you may as well hide the processor and put the face above the subwoofer in the cabin.

But if you are going to do that, you may as well pick whatever convenient spot you like for the faceplate with the body hidden. lots of possibilities. (a good one being still forward facing just under the rear deck, but behind one of the seats. say behind the 40% seat if you have 60/40 rear seats)

and if you get the frying pan noise, hot glue on the ribbon connectors sill likely fix it. In fact, after powering the unit to verify no frypan, hitting it with hot glue will be preventative as well.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

That sounds good but my seats don't fold down and the baffle pretty much takes up all the room behind the seats. I will get a pic today of that. The only other option is under hte rear deck, and that is one project I don't have time for. Man, lots to do still.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Only had 2-3 hours to work today. Got some stuff from Lowes. Got the processor in. I need to get some glue for the rubber mat.

Here are some pics:

Rubber mat









Stuff. Got 100' of techflex from FuzzyLetters.

















Processor brackets and the processor mounted

























Mat in










My cables should be here tomorrow so I can start making all the XLR-->RCA connections for CD player to processor and processor to amp.


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## quest51210 (Dec 27, 2007)

dp you thonk that rubber mat is helpful? whats the thicknes?


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

quest51210 said:


> dp you thonk that rubber mat is helpful? whats the thicknes?


I think it will be. It is about 1/2" thick. There will be another layer or two of BXT on top of it, and the carpet pad on top of that.


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## Whiterabbit (May 26, 2006)

seats don't fold down, huh? Well, its probably for the best to have the face facing backwards then. the wiring really will be a hideous mess.

I don't like the hardware. I think there is room for improvement here. Off the top of my head, I can come up with a killer idea, and I know there are tons of options out there. you can buy aluminum very cheap all over, like from onlinemetals.com. You may be able to find 1.75x1.75" stock. I found it pretty easy. Two 1 ft lengths would be perfect and only $40. Next, you can buy a plate of aluminum or steel 12x19. $30 for .1 inch thick plate.

With this material you can use a drill press to put three screws through each extruded aluminum. you can then screw this assembly to your rear deck. It'll end up being a shelf 17 inches wide 12 inches deep with 1.75" wide sides you can drill and tap to hold four rack mount screws for the processor.

Machined aluminum looks much better than some bent bars and over sized washers 

I can think of even cheaper options if you have access to a welder.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Whiterabbit said:


> seats don't fold down, huh? Well, its probably for the best to have the face facing backwards then. the wiring really will be a hideous mess.
> 
> I don't like the hardware. I think there is room for improvement here. Off the top of my head, I can come up with a killer idea, and I know there are tons of options out there. you can buy aluminum very cheap all over, like from onlinemetals.com. You may be able to find 1.75x1.75" stock. I found it pretty easy. Two 1 ft lengths would be perfect and only $40. Next, you can buy a plate of aluminum or steel 12x19. $30 for .1 inch thick plate.
> 
> ...


Hmm. You bring up good points. The washers will be fixed, I was rushed to finish and just left em. I want to cut them down so they are not visible. 

There is a shelf underneath, granted it's only 1" wide. I will have a look into what you are describing at home.


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## Mesto (Feb 26, 2008)

kool


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## SSSnake (Mar 8, 2007)

I used the same Lowes rubber mat in the rear of my saturn. Combined with Raam mat is was great. A nice low cost sound proofing. I used standard contact cement to adhere and this stuff is there to stay.


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## pianist (Mar 10, 2006)

ummmm.... nice headunit


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## Fixtion (Aug 25, 2006)

someone needs to join the *TEAM BOTTLEHEAD* club 

;]


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

So over spring break I was able to get some stuff done. Its a big bonus that my parents are gone for 2 weeks so I don't have to take my car back and can finish next weekend.

So, what I got done this weekend:

-Holes are cut for additional area
-Fiberglass for passenger side is done
-Enclosure for passenger side is done
-Speaker wire ion passenger side is done
-RCA to XLR for tweeters are done

Pics:

Holes cut

















I sprayed rubberized undercoat throughout the holes and deadened them with 2 layers of Raammat. The holes lead into an enclosure that seems to be pretty big. Bigger than the overall size of the glass for comparison.


















The glassed base and enclosure is about 4-6 layers of chop mat. It is also layered inside with 2 layers of raammat and rubber. They weight about 8 pounds without drivers. They are secured by 3 selftapping metal screws, 2 on the bottom one on the side.

In with the rubber mat glued down. I still need to do the carpet pad and carpet for the passenger side. I will mold them in with bondoglass and see how they look.











For now I am going to leave them sealed. I have enough room underneath to do the AP vent but I want to see how this does first.

Quick pic of the cable










Thats it for now. Still more to do, hope to get some done tomorrow and next weekend.


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## Arc (Aug 25, 2006)

Well I have the front done. I am now installing the new carpet. With the padding and the rest of the work done, with the carpet laid over the top you can hardly notice that they are there. This is 5 layers of glass and almost a can of Bondo Glass. I can grab the mounting ring and move the whole car, they are rock solid. Now I just need to make a grill for the tweeters, the mids are done already.


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