# 2018 golf R build - clean, stealth, and first time using DSP!



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Hello fellow car audio enthusiasts,

Wanted to share my latest build - been out of the car audio scene for a few years, as the stock Fender system on the golf R was pretty acceptable with a simple sub upgrade, and I had other priorities going on. Now I am back with the bug!

2018 golf R in Lapiz blue - bought new in 2018, waited almost 4 months to get it. Really love the car as it does everything so well for a daily - not a huge fan of Volkswagen however. Just got my car back after 8 weeks at the dealership to repair some electrical issues causing many codes.

Anyways, it started as a 'oh let me just use up the old car audio equipment I have leftover from previous builds' to 'oh I need this - I need that - I NEED MOAR!'

This will be a Stealth build, and so all equipment will fit into trunk floor - I like clean and I need the space in the trunk!

Parts list for the build;
Front stage (for now): JBL C508 GTI - 5-1/4inch component set from previous build - will run passive for the time being but would like to eventually go active.
Rear fill: Kenwood KFC-1696PS coaxials (purchased new for this build)
Subs: Pioneer low-profile TSZ10LS4 10-inch subs (400w RMS each)
Mono amp: Clarion DPX11551 - 850 watts RMS x 1 at 4 ohms (1,550 watts RMS x 1 at 2 ohms)
4-channel amp: Pioneer GM-D8604 - 150W x 4 at 2ohm, 100w x 4 at 4ohm, bridgeable.
DSP: Zapco DSP Z8 IV - purchased new in box from another member on here - my first DSP so very excited!
Wire: 0-gauge kit from Crutchfield
Other: fast rings for speakers, two Knukonceptz BASSIK distribution blocks.

Head unit will remain stock - will be using the inputs behind OEM radio to go to the DSP's high-level inputs, I will have to recode the radio to bypass the Fender amplifier.

Here is a recent photo of my ride:













Started working on the audio build yesterday - first step was removing trunk panels, vacuum and sound deadening;

BEFORE:









AFTER:






































Next, I made a template for my false floor - used cardboard along with a marker and washer to copy the profile of each side of the wall, after a few iterations it came out pretty much perfect. taped together and now I have a rough template to copy onto a thin piece of MDF to make the actual template;























That's it for last weekend - also juggling home renos so hopefully things on the car will continue to progress. Only missing a few items to finalize the build, just need the time to work on it!


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

did i miss what sound deadner you used?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jroo said:


> did i miss what sound deadner you used?


Went with Noico - did much research, the only slightly better option would have probably been SecondSkin and it is literally 8 times the price to get it here - there is no way it is close to 8x the performance. I liked working with the Noico. Also did not notice any smell. Went on easy enough and cut nicely. I remember 10+ years ago using Fatmat - that stuff was not a treat! smelly as hell too since they used an asphalt base. 

Used 4 sheets in the trunk and have 5 left - probably will order another half pack (4-5 more sheets) since I would like to go heavy on the front doors, and light on rear doors. Also not sure if I will do the rear hatch yet, but probably do one piece in there.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

Unless you have a local dealer of a product line Noico is really our best option here. 

Much jealous of the R sir!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> Unless you have a local dealer of a product line Noico is really our best option here.
> 
> Much jealous of the R sir!


Thank you! absolutely love the car but have had many issues with it during my almost-3-year ownership. I think I got really unlucky, since I know quite a few people with R's and they have not had nearly as many issues as I have had. I think mine was built during Oktoberfest. I also really hate dealing with Volkswagen - it's always a fight/challenge and they really don't seem to care about their customers. 

Anyways, my DSP should arrive today so I am excited for that - next thing will be to continue building the sub box, make bracket for the DSP up on the side nook of the trunk. Also need to order some ABS to make a clean bracket in the engine bay for the fuse off the battery.


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Went with Noico - did much research, the only slightly better option would have probably been SecondSkin and it is literally 8 times the price to get it here - there is no way it is close to 8x the performance. I liked working with the Noico. Also did not notice any smell. Went on easy enough and cut nicely. I remember 10+ years ago using Fatmat - that stuff was not a treat! smelly as hell too since they used an asphalt base.
> 
> Used 4 sheets in the trunk and have 5 left - probably will order another half pack (4-5 more sheets) since I would like to go heavy on the front doors, and light on rear doors. Also not sure if I will do the rear hatch yet, but probably do one piece in there.


more than likely will go the same route. My neighbors both did their trucks over a year ago and they were super happy with the price and results.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Thank you! absolutely love the car but have had many issues with it during my almost-3-year ownership. I think I got really unlucky, since I know quite a few people with R's and they have not had nearly as many issues as I have had. I think mine was built during Oktoberfest. I also really hate dealing with Volkswagen - it's always a fight/challenge and they really don't seem to care about their customers.


hopefully its more of a dealer issue then VW themselves! Look forward to the updates!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Sub for updates


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> hopefully its more of a dealer issue then VW themselves! Look forward to the updates!


Unfortunately it is both dealerships and VW Canada. They really don’t value their customers. Will be the last VW I ever buy.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

small update - DSP came in today and I’m very excited 🤤


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

The dealer here in Daytona likes to argue until i show them the TSB about the roof leaking or the waterpump/thermostat issues. Like they don't know... All they gotta do is run the vin. VwoA reimburses them. Jerks.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Unfortunately it is both dealerships and VW Canada. They really don’t value their customers. Will be the last VW I ever buy.


As a person with the VW emblem tattooed on them, that's a shame. Good thing I like my old junk! hahaha

ok, MOAR AUDIO! Its funny that my 2003 Jetta has the EXACT same tie down D rings in the hatch


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

So went downstairs to fool around with the equipment layout, there will be a two level amp rack made of 3/8 inch thick HPDE sheets. Total height is 5.25 inches, enough to fit under the new trunk false floor I am building.

here are the two options I’m looking at for the layers (the wood is where I have to cut the HPDE):


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## James_H (Aug 18, 2021)

The bottom picture seems to better separate power and signal cables probably.


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## Jroo (May 24, 2006)

Used to be a vw apologist but moved away
From the brand several years back. Vw always seemed to do the r correctly but several I knew spent more time trying to get service and issues fixed.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jroo said:


> Used to be a vw apologist but moved away
> From the brand several years back. Vw always seemed to do the r correctly but several I knew spent more time trying to get service and issues fixed.


yeah, it is very frustrating. I guess I got more unlucky than others, but the worst part is that each issues is super expensive, so far the minimum repair has been around $1200 and it goes up from there. Thank god it was almost all warrantied, but still, out of warranty scares me - shopping a VW extended warranty currently for another 3 years since my bumper-bumper finishes next Feb. Hell, I had way less problems with my 2011 Subaru STI in my 5.5 years of ownership. I think my old friend who bought it off me still kicking it around.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

James_H said:


> The bottom picture seems to better separate power and signal cables probably.


yes, my only concern is I would rather have the distribution blocks on the bottom so that I could remove top layer without having to unplug the main 0-gauge power and ground. This would mean the mono amp and distro blocks would go on the bottom, but that leaves less room for adjustments on the mono amp. If I put both amps on the top, then I will have less access to the Zapco to plug in the USB when required to do some tuning or updates. What I might do is go with option 2 (picture 2) and just leave enough wire slack so that I could easily slide back the top level onto the rear seats (folded down) and access all equipment for setting gains, tuning, adjustments.


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

I think picture 2 is a better layout for routing purposes. But also you have the DSP, why not just skip the passive crossovers and go active from the start? Then you can remove them from the amp rack. Also, I like the build! Keep it up!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

dmb1650 said:


> I think picture 2 is a better layout for routing purposes. But also you have the DSP, why not just skip the passive crossovers and go active from the start? Then you can remove them from the amp rack. Also, I like the build! Keep it up!


so I have been debating doing that but as this is my first DSP, I am hesitant. I am worried about ruining the components. I know I have to take the time to set up the DSP before connecting the speaker outputs from the amp, but how will I ensure no bad signals get to the tweets? I would like to add some in-line resistors on the tweeters when I install them but no clue what size would suffice to protect them if ever my DSP fails and sends a bad signal to that channel - should I also be setting a high pass on the 4-channel amp for tweeter channel to add some protection, or would that just cause tuning issues?

Also, the main constraint to going active would be the 4-channel amp. I would need another small 2-channel amp to have 6 channels of amplification (tweets, mids, rear fill). The idea was to start with the passive crossover then upgrade and go active once everything was in and working and I had time to play around with it all.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

so what I COULD do... is get a cost effective Pioneer 2-ch amp for the tweeters - see below, can get for around $110 CAD plus tax;









Pioneer GM-A3702


2-channel car amplifier — 60 watts RMS x 2




www.crutchfield.ca





this would replace the two crossovers and allow me to run full active. Not sure if it would make a night and day difference or not, or if the quality of the cheap Pioneer amp on the tweets would come into play...

Small note: this build started as a 'oh let's just re-use your old equipment - shouldn't be more than a few hundred $' to full blown 'ok what are we missing to go full active' and quite a bit more budget LOL but hey - can always re-use the equipment down the line in future vehicles!


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## JetBadger (Jan 4, 2021)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Small note: this build started as a 'oh let's just re-use your old equipment - shouldn't be more than a few hundred $' to full blown 'ok what are we missing to go full active' and quite a bit more budget LOL but hey - can always re-use the equipment down the line in future vehicles!


Heh. My thinking on my build started the exact same way. Went (and is going) as well as you could guess.

I think since you already have a DSP, not going full active would be a waste of potential. Though instead of adding a 3rd amp, maybe a used 6ch amp would make sense after the extra wiring and distribution needed? But either way works.

To protect the tweeters you could (and should) place inline capacitors on them, there is info on the forum on how to pick one. It should not interfere with your crossover slope as it eitherway will be significantly lower than the actual crossover point you'd use there, so it will be fine.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

JetBadger said:


> Heh. My thinking on my build started the exact same way. Went (and is going) as well as you could guess.
> 
> I think since you already have a DSP, not going full active would be a waste of potential. Though instead of adding a 3rd amp, maybe a used 6ch amp would make sense after the extra wiring and distribution needed? But either way works.
> 
> To protect the tweeters you could (and should) place inline capacitors on them, there is info on the forum on how to pick one. It should not interfere with your crossover slope as it eitherway will be significantly lower than the actual crossover point you'd use there, so it will be fine.


thanks - in-line capacitor was what I was looking for - I'll do some research.

I would love to go with a 6-ch amp but I cannot allocate that much more budget - even if I sold my 4-channel (maybe $100-150) I would still need to fork out another $500-800 on a 6-channel. I do have the room on the distribution block however to add a small 2-channel.

The other thing I was debating currently is buying the UMIK-1 to get some good readings in the car while tuning - not expensive at $130CAD but another expense. Got to juggle my budget between major home renos, this build, and a baby on the way so I can't do everything all at once. Opportunity cost...


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## JetBadger (Jan 4, 2021)

Well I think if you're tight on the budget and do want to get into the process of tuning and care about a good result - I'd choose the mic over the 2ch amp and just ditch the rear speakers for the time being.


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

JetBadger said:


> Well I think if you're tight on the budget and do want to get into the process of tuning and care about a good result - I'd choose the mic over the 2ch amp and just ditch the rear speakers for the time being.


I agree with this. Leave the rears on the factory power, if possible? If you want you can fade them in and out when you don’t need them. The capacitor will be the fail safe on the tweeter. You can get started without the mic, you can set the crossovers and time alightment. You can match the output levels by ear. Have you read the Audiofrog tuning guide? It’s a good resource.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

dmb1650 said:


> I agree with this. Leave the rears on the factory power, if possible? If you want you can fade them in and out when you don’t need them. The capacitor will be the fail safe on the tweeter. You can get started without the mic, you can set the crossovers and time alightment. You can match the output levels by ear. Have you read the Audiofrog tuning guide? It’s a good resource.


did not read through the audiofrog tuning guide but saw it mentioned around here so I will look into it.

Running off factory power for the rears would be difficult and not sure it is worth it. I enjoy having rear fill as I find it adds some dimension to the music, more immersion for sure - I get that many SQ nuts enjoy the front stage to get that 'concert' feeling but I enjoy 360 degree sound. Keep in mind I have yet to hear a proper SQ build in person, I may change my mind.

I will consider going active up front, maybe experiment a little - I can easily swap it back with minimal wiring, as I plan to tap into my stock wiring harness under the seat (which I will be disconnecting from the OEM amp) so either way it is just a matter of switching a few wires around in the trunk. 

thanks for all the input everyone - definitely giving me some things to marinate over as the build progresses - hope to continue working on it this week.


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

https://testgear.audiofrog.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/A-Straightforward-Stereo-Tuning-Process-and-Some-Notes-About-Why-it-Works.pdf


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

Nothing wrong with building what you like and you are right it’s an easy change to make in the future with a little bit of rewiring.
I guess I jumped in head first with an active front stage and don’t feel I’m missing anything by not having rear speakers. I haven’t heard any competition level cars either. Wish I could.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

thanks! got that guide saved. Will read through it. I may bite the bullet and buy the small 2-channel as well as the UMIK-1 just to finish off the build right - would be relatively inexpensive and done proper off the bat.


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## James_H (Aug 18, 2021)

My opinion is that you should complete the installation with the parts you want to end up with. Going through all of the tuning with the passive crossovers and then later changing and re-tuning is a lot of extra work, unless you enjoy re-tuning. Spend the money on the front stage, that will keep you plenty busy and you can upgrade the rear later. I don't believe that will require a full re-tune, you'd just be tuning the rear speakers then and figuring out how to get them to fill in without pulling the stage to the rear.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

so over lunch I decided to remove the trim from my rear hatch (trunk) door - figured I would put a little sound deadening on there too since I could not make nay noise (wife on work calls upstairs lol) - pretty tight in there in terms of surface, but will cut some smaller squares to put in there. I saw on another forum some people put polyfill in between the two sheet metals (in the holes) - anyone have experience with that? I figure that just putting some small pieces of the noico on the sheet metal will already help quite a bit.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

its expensive but a bag of rockwool would serve you far better in that case. nearly $100 a bag at HD and its way more then you'd ever need. But with a baby on the way it makes a great acoustic insulation the house as well haha.

Going active off the hop is a bit more work and a bit more money but I think the difference is worth it. you need next to nothing for power for tweeters. There are always plenty of old A/B 2ch amps on kijiji around here for $50 or less. 

first baby? if so GET CRACKING! I started my install 6 months ago, 4 months ago our baby girl was born. all ive got done is the shell of one wall of the sub box and i've ran the power wire ha! aint no time for nothing now!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> its expensive but a bag of rockwool would serve you far better in that case. nearly $100 a bag at HD and its way more then you'd ever need. But with a baby on the way it makes a great acoustic insulation the house as well haha.
> 
> Going active off the hop is a bit more work and a bit more money but I think the difference is worth it. you need next to nothing for power for tweeters. There are always plenty of old A/B 2ch amps on kijiji around here for $50 or less.
> 
> first baby? if so GET CRACKING! I started my install 6 months ago, 4 months ago our baby girl was born. all ive got done is the shell of one wall of the sub box and i've ran the power wire ha! aint no time for nothing now!


yes very familiar with Rockwool haha I’ve been using it in my Reno’s to soundproof. Not quite enough space to stuff it in though so I’m going to stick with just the noico. Here’s the stripped hatch:










And congrats on the baby! That’s awesome - I’m very excited. Only due March and I plan on having this done by Xmas. Worst case I’ll have time off over Xmas to finish up. Once the baby arrives I’m pretty sure I’ll be preoccupied hahaha - not sure how you find ANY time at all for your build! All in good time though!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Started working on the base piece for my subwoofer box tonight. I hate when car manufacturers make uneven shapes! Used the router to cut the circular section and then the table saw for the straighter edges, later on this week I’ll round the corners, get rid of the rough edges near the 
and make it clean.
Reason I’m not making the bottom of the sub box completely flat is two-fold: firstly, that circular section is about an inch lower than the area around it, so by using that section I’m gaining quite a bit of box volume, since space comes at a premium to keep this build completely in the floor, I’ll take what I can get! Secondly, I’ll leave a bit of a lip on this piece sticking out of the bottom of the sub box, in which I will put two threaded inserts. The amp rack will screw into these threaded inserts to keep everything nice and secure.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Also, with everyone’s input, I will probably just go with the $100 Pioneer amp I mentioned earlier. It won’t break the bank to buy that and the UMIK-1, the amp is good for 2x60w at 4ohms which I imagine is more than enough, then I can go full active and also keep my rears. Who knows when I’ll need to fade to the rear to play baby shark in the future 🤣


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

If you check the stereo integrity audi build its where i got the rockwool idea from. he tears it off into little chunks and stuffs it into places he cant get deadener into.

oh you have plenty time then! and yeah, like i said. ive got the power wire ran in the last 4 months haha


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Be careful with anything that might soak up moisture. There's always that spray foam stuff but it can expand and bend metal or drip out while it's curing. If you get the mic and are done with it, you could always do a rental thing and ship it around to those in need (such as myself).


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> If you check the stereo integrity audi build its where i got the rockwool idea from. he tears it off into little chunks and stuffs it into places he cant get deadener into.
> 
> oh you have plenty time then! and yeah, like i said. ive got the power wire ran in the last 4 months haha


nice - too bad I just threw out a bunch of leftover rockwool scraps last week  and y’a I figure another month or two and I should be well on my way to finishing this build. We shall see!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Be careful with anything that might soak up moisture. There's always that spray foam stuff but it can expand and bend metal or drip out while it's curing. If you get the mic and are done with it, you could always do a rental thing and ship it around to those in need (such as myself).


good point - the rockwool is made of volcanic ash and so it won’t soak up moisture, only will retain some of it gets really wet , such as in the case of a serious leak. I’ve used spray foam in previous builds (Chevy cobalt) like ten years ago but not interested to do it again. Too many clip holes and stuff that it could expand into and effect cover panels. Also the stuff is messy. Always have a can on hand for home renos though lol

also for the mic, I figure it will be useful along with REW for my home audio tuning. I’ll definitely make use of it and friends are always welcome to borrow it.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Volcanic ash? I had no idea. Can't blame you for staying away from the can foam. I did a deck lid once. While it was great at killing the rattles, i missed taping a hole and it dripped onto a Boston acoustics amp. Didn't realize till the next day. Had to strip the amp coat and repaint it. Amp is in the wife's car. I'll never sell it for what it should be worth. It's hideous but functional. 125x4 ab and 400x1 class d. Balanced rca ins or speaker level. Thought about using it my the sportwagen and run 2 different sized subs but would be banned from this site for tomfoolery.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

Adurm said:


> Volcanic ash? I had no idea.


fancy hey! also in use it is generally in a cavity then sealed off with CLD. thats why i figured the hatch would be a good place for it. I wouldnt use it in a door.

With spray foam use the blue can. its similar to what this R likely has in its A pillars.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Volcanic ash? I had no idea. Can't blame you for staying away from the can foam. I did a deck lid once. While it was great at killing the rattles, i missed taping a hole and it dripped onto a Boston acoustics amp. Didn't realize till the next day. Had to strip the amp coat and repaint it. Amp is in the wife's car. I'll never sell it for what it should be worth. It's hideous but functional. 125x4 ab and 400x1 class d. Balanced rca ins or speaker level. Thought about using it my the sportwagen and run 2 different sized subs but would be banned from this site for tomfoolery.


Haha oops! Hey, the things we do in search of perfection 🤣 but i wouldn’t worry about selling, keep it until it dies - always a need for an amp in someone’s car in the family lol


Jheitt142 said:


> fancy hey! also in use it is generally in a cavity then sealed off with CLD. thats why i figured the hatch would be a good place for it. I wouldnt use it in a door.
> 
> With spray foam use the blue can. its similar to what this R likely has in its A pillars.


good ol’ blue « doors and window » foam - minimal expansion ☺ I might actually have a can of it.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

A little more lunch-hour progress:

got the rear hatch reasonably well deadened - used about one sheet total. Used the scraps on the plastic panel that covers it to give it some weight and minimize any chance of vibration (second photo). Should help. Didn’t want to do much more just because of all the wiring and clips that are in there. car is now back together as I need it to go into the office tomorrow. Wonder if I will hear any difference with my existing subwoofer. Or, maybe just reduce the drone from my muffler delete - LOL!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

That tool organization though.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> That tool organization though.


haha thanks - I am telling you it saves me SO much time staying organized. I take 10 minutes to put all my tools back where they go each time I work on the car or the house - sometimes I will let a specific set of tools stay out if I know I am coming out the next day but I then find myself looking for a square or a drill to try and do something else, so I end up just trying to put everything back always.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

I've found VW's to be pretty rattle proof from factory. If you dong already have some be sure to get some thin ccf and Tessa tape is great but hockey tape is usually cheaper and sticks better. Just don't use it under hood

Actually never mind. The only thing that I've had rattle problems with up front is the lock knob where it comes through the door panel. Your car won't have them.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> I've found VW's to be pretty rattle proof from factory. If you dong already have some be sure to get some thin ccf and Tessa tape is great but hockey tape is usually cheaper and sticks better. Just don't use it under hood


yes, I actually have a huge roll of tessa tape that I ordered for this project. I follow caraudiofabrications (Mark) on youtube and I love his vids - usually try to use the same process as him. All the wires I have encountered so far were pretty decently wrapped in tessa tape. I will do a bit extra work on the doors specifically for the clips to ensure no rattle takes place. CCF what are you referring to - closed cell foam? Also have a roll of that to wrap any larger harnesses/my sub wires etc. and then tessa tape around. And yes, I agree, the vibrations (or lack thereof) are pretty decent in my golf, even better in my wife's audi Q5 S-line - the stock B&O system is really good for a stock system, midbass is really on point but the subwoofer is garbage, OK at low volumes though.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

I updated my post above. But yeah closed cell foam. I use it mainly to separate things I've added, like amps racks and such. 

For the power layout, if you are concerned about mobility. For $16 you can get a 0ga plug at princess auto.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Just for information here is the previous sub I built to replace the OEM sub in the Fender audio system - definitely nothing fancy. Basically it was plug-and-play to the factory amp/harness for the OEM sub and ran well for the two years I had it installed (and still running). Probably not a ton of power coming from the OEM amp though! As you can see in second photo, it fits nicely underneath the OEM false floor.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> I updated my post above. But yeah closed cell foam. I use it mainly to separate things I've added, like amps racks and such.
> 
> For the power layout, if you are concerned about mobility. For $16 you can get a 0ga plug at princess auto.


It shouldn't be an issue, I plan to leave the distro blocks on bottom level - once everything is hooked up, should be easy enough to slide the top layer back for access to bottom layer. 

Not sure if any of you know but my next question would be what should I do for risers to hold the top level amp rack/space the racks out? My idea is to stack the leftover HPDE that I cut off the ends of the amps, making two separate risers at the 1/3 and 2/3 length down the bottom amp rack, that I can then tap into so that top layer can be fastened on with bolts. Another idea from caraudiofabrication. But, I know HPDE doesn't glue together well at all, which could pose some issues - I would have to pre-drill and screw the risers' multiple layers from the bottom of the lower amp rack. Anyone have experience working with HPDE in this capacity?


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## UNBROKEN (Sep 25, 2009)

I’ll be paying even closer attention to this thread now…picked up this guy a few hours ago. Wasn’t even on my radar until I saw it for sale. lol


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

UNBROKEN said:


> I’ll be paying even closer attention to this thread now…picked up this guy a few hours ago. Wasn’t even on my radar until I saw it for sale. lol
> View attachment 315419


nice looking ride! Love mine - I just hope that you won’t have any issues with it or warranty claims! Lol


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Welcome to the vw family, unbroken. Stage 1 tune on there is night and day compared to stock. Canuck and i are both doing audio builds, him a golf R (drool) and me a sportwagen (mehh). I'm stalking him for pro building ideas. I might post my own log if i make anything worth while.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Welcome to the vw family, unbroken. Stage 1 tune on there is night and day compared to stock. Canuck and i are both doing audio builds, him a golf R (drool) and me a sportwagen (mehh). I'm stalking him for pro building ideas. I might post my own log if i make anything worth while.


Haha I appreciate your comment about stalking me for « pro » build but I would definitely not consider myself a pro - got some good experience especially from going into the home theatre world (those guys are on another level!) and always willing to learn and improve! Seeing some of the other builds on here and just wow. I think the journey is the most important part and sharing with other enthusiasts, bouncing ideas back and forth helps us all bring our games the next level. 

i must say to that the R has been an incredible car in terms of fun, practicality and performance - I just wish I didn’t have all the issues and bad luck, plus crap service from VW. But I’m so happy to have her back again From the dealership.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

So my drive to work this morning was...sublime 

So nice to have my car back. However now that I'm into the audio build (and having had previous systems in other cars, I know how good it CAN sound) I keep finding faults in the OEM Fender system.

First off the system is clear but does not get very loud. Also not much midbass. When I turn the system up (past halfway) I do get a bit of rattling on the plastics, almost sure it is the plastic door panels themselves so will be putting the Noico on both door plastics as well as the sheet metal to attempt to reduce as much as possible. I am sure the Fast rings on speakers will also lend a hand. Another annoyance is that after about 60% volume, the sub output tapers off so speakers go louder but bass stays the same - this was definitely to protect the sad 6.5 inch OEM subwoofer from blowing, but annoying with my upgraded 12'' sub. 

Now as for the bass...Maybe it's just the placebo effect after doing all that sound deadening in the trunk, but it sounds to me like a noticeable difference. The bass sounds somewhat more tight (marginally) but also a bit more full and powerful - like I can reduce my 'Sub' setting in the head unit by 1 to have it match what it sounded like before. 

Side note - the sound deadening did nothing to limit the exhaust note (fine by me) but I have not really had a chance to do any highway at speed to see if that slight drone will be reduced (very specific frequency). 

Has anyone had very positive effects with Mass Loaded Vynil in their doors? I got a quote a while back and it was around $73 per sheet (48'' x 72'' which should be enough for both front doors) plus freight, so probably a little over $100CAD delivered once all said and done. The golf is decently sound proofed, especially as compared to previous cars I have owned. Wondering how worth it the extra step would be.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

So below are my front speaker specs - I am leaning towards going active with the purchase of a 2-channel amp for tweeters but having trouble figuring out what size cap I need to protect the tweets;










The tweeter itself doesn't seem to have marked any frequency range, however the crossover is marked '3500hz' so I am assuming this would be the crossover spot between midwoofer and tweeter - using the list in the link below it looks like a 10uF or 20uF capacitor would do - 20uF would result in a 2000hz crossover giving me more frequency width and the10uF would be higher at 4000hZ which may be too high. Thoughts?






Car Audio - Speaker Crossover Chart and Capacitance vs. Frequency Calculator(High-pass)


Use this JavaScript calculator to determine what value of capacitors you need to use for a crossover design.



www.carstereo.com


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

so found the answer to my own question. From my research (caraudiofabrication even has a vid on this on facebook) the formula seems to go as follows;

Capacitor value, C=0.159/(F*Rh) where F is the target frequency (see below) and Rh is the impedance (4ohms in my case)

Fs < F < crossover on DSP 

where Fs is resonant frequency of my tweeter - from the specs, my tweeter Fs = 1320Hz

so my capacitor would need to cut frequencies below 1320 - I could aim for 2000 or 2500 for value of F - assuming 2500, the capacitor value with the top equation would yield 15.9uF or 16uF

this would assume that the speaker impedance is actually 4 ohms, but it may be lower - I should perhaps measure the tweeter impedance with my multimeter and use that value in my calculation to be sure. 

Hopefully this post will allow someone else to learn what I just did!


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

All that is right. Just make sure the cap doesn't interfere with the slope you intend to cross at. 

There are reports that caps and class d amps don't always get along but you planned on using a/b so should be an issue.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Maybe shop for an amp with the ability to high pass at 2k or so and skip the cap. They do get warm but if you're feeding it higher frequencies, i don't know how it would respond. Yes as previously mentioned, you don't want the cap to interfere with your xover on your dsp. I say just trust the zapco to do it's job.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> All that is right. Just make sure the cap doesn't interfere with the slope you intend to cross at.
> 
> There are reports that caps and class d amps don't always get along but you planned on using a/b so should be an issue.


Perfecttt. Yet another justification to get the small Pioneer amp for the tweeters, since it’s a class AB. My other 4-channel is a class FD digital so maybe there would be issues running the tweets off those with the caps - either way I should be set.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Maybe shop for an amp with the ability to high pass at 2k or so and skip the cap. They do get warm but if you're feeding it higher frequencies, i don't know how it would respond. Yes as previously mentioned, you don't want the cap to interfere with your xover on your dsp. I say just trust the zapco to do it's job.


kinda limited in amps selection here and the small pioneer fits the bill perfectly otherwise. My engineering brain tells me that using a properly sized capacitor would be superior to setting a second crossover in the amp after the Zapco, but more of a feeling and not an expert. I like having a foolproof protection too, since everything in the Zapco is digital and who knows what shorting of equipment can do. Plus, my first time working with a DSP so rather the cheap insurance than make a small mistake and blow the tweeters!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

So, thinking about my Zapco remote and decided to go take a look for clean stealth placement in the car. Looked at three options: 
First was my original plan in the hideaway cubby in center console. However due to the cubby being fairy large in comparison to the remote, and the difficult access to it with shifter etc., it isn’t optimal:


























Next I thought a good spot could be the tray under the center console - however it’s a bit of a chore to have to move my arm, open and turn towards it to play with the knob or settings:



















Third position is probably my final choice, which is a small side pocket on the left of my steering wheel - I rarely use this side pocket for anything and it is a nice spot to access the remote without having to move from optimal listening position. I would also plan to put a USB extension from the Zapco right beside the remote so I could plug in there for tuning. Would use some 3/16 black ABS to make a template that fits in there:


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

4th and 5th option: abs the drivers air vent or take the door off the cubby and abs that.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

That cubby is a good spot. I keep a microfiber in the wife's car there. Shes had that thing for 13 years and I don't think she even knows about that spot


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> 4th and 5th option: abs the drivers air vent or take the door off the cubby and abs that.


That’s a great idea if you’re living in warmer climates! Unfortunately here I would rather keep the vents free since we get very cold weather and need a lot of heat through vents - I wouldn’t want to put all that on the electronics of the switch! But they make a very sexy P3gauge that goes in the right vent I’ve always found cool - it’s pricey tho and I don’t see it being super useful - plus sound system things are better lmao


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Good point. The p3 gauge is what popped to mind and i thought why not a remote instead. But ya you need the heat. I'm in the opposite situation where i need the cold ac 9 months per year. I'm going to try to mount mine in the cubby. Thinking of hanging an L bracket from the roof of the cubby. Not too sure about how close i can get to the front door. Previously just had it double sided taped face up in the cubby. For me it's just a volume knob. I won't be changing settings. 99.9% only me in there.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

I am hoping to barely use the remote at all besides changing the tune when I want - maybe doing a tune for me in the driver poaitikn then another for passenger side when I want to show it off - not sure how that would work and if each different tune includes time alignment etc or just a change to the eq. Will play with it and see when I get there!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Slow but steady progress this evening - after a few hours of measuring, routing, setting up template pieces, adjustable curve, I finally got a clean template for the subwoofer box top, which matches the profile of the trunk.
Adjustable curves with the router are great but definitely a learning process. I had to put two layers of template tape to keep it far enough away as to cut the entire piece of 1/4 MDF, while also ensuring the adjustable curve itself would not be cut by the bit. But very handy for making odd profiles. Also, electrical tape on the top of the curve is a must to keep it locked in place as the bit moves across it.

















Here’s the finished template - I cut it about 16 inches back because I only need the front section for sub box. Rear part will be for the amp rack cover, will be finalized more down the road.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I suspect you'll end up with at least 3 tunes: driver, passenger and center. But probably a few different driver tunes till you find the best one. I had multiple renditions with different crossover slopes trying to blend 2 way active. I'm really hoping widebands are magic. I was asking way to much of my 6.5s at 2k. Hoping to keep them 80 to 700hz or so. I need to stop highjacking your thread.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looks great! Wish you lived closer so you can build mine.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Some more progress on the subwoofer enclosure today. Finished the template for the bottom and did some trimming, finishing work on bottom piece. This will be a relatively intricate subwoofer enclosure, so taking my time since fitment will be important in the floor - making using as much of the space as I can. I will need to finish the enclosure before I start on the amp rack to see exactly how much space is left over under there. Here are some photos:

started with making a cardboard template (thanks extra thick cardboard from new hot water heater delivery!)


























transferred over to a 1/4inch HDF piece, using my top of floor template to match the curve with bottom. I then modified my other bottom piece as well to get clean lines and curves, then 45degree chamfer to help it fit into place easily;


































Finally, used the other bottom template together with this one above to make an inside area cut - see below what I mean. The extra space there is equal to about 210 square inches of airspace.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

reading this as i send a guy to tow a golf R without a spare. hahaha

I like how it looks soooo easy to follow those curve guides on youtube.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> reading this as i send a guy to tow a golf R without a spare. hahaha
> 
> I like how it looks soooo easy to follow those curve guides on youtube.


Ouch! I’ve only had one flat tire on my R and I keep a plug kit in the trunk - hope to never have a sidewall puncture though 🤣


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Ran out of double sided template tape yesterday so couldn’t work on anything today 😜 gave em an opportunity to do housework - leaves, change our hot water heater, all kinds of fun… 😁 should have the tape tomorrow and begin cutting the actual sub box this week!


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Ran out of double sided template tape yesterday so couldn’t work on anything today 😜 gave em an opportunity to do housework - leaves, change our hot water heater, all kinds of fun… 😁 should have the tape tomorrow and begin cutting the actual sub box this week!


is there any difference between 'template tape' and regular cheap double sided tape? i'm not convinced!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> is there any difference between 'template tape' and regular cheap double sided tape? i'm not convinced!


No clue actually, the only thing I know is that standard double sided tape that I would buy near me (Canadian tire or Home Depot) is thicker and a bit more spongy - anyways I order this off Amazon and it’s cheap and comes next day, can’t complain 😎


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

You decide on an amp for the rears? Sucks everything costs so much to get to our friendly neighbors to the north.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

Adurm said:


> You decide on an amp for the rears? Sucks everything costs so much to get to our friendly neighbors to the north.


The used market kills us I find. So many great things posted but the shipping can be murder


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> You decide on an amp for the rears? Sucks everything costs so much to get to our friendly neighbors to the north.


Yessir! Waiting on crutchfiels to refund me on the LC2i before putting in the order - they are late for the refund and despite it being delivered to them they are saying they can’t find it. Going to call them back tomorrow to see wtf is going on. Getting annoyed. However, decided I will go with the small pioneer amp - $109 for 2x60w RMS and a pretty small footprint will work perfectly for my needs and more than enough to power the two tweeters.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> The used market kills us I find. So many great things posted but the shipping can be murder


Seriously! Most forum members tend to be from south of the border and shipping is always complicated. Got pretty lucky with the Zapco honestly. My brother and sister are both in USA but haven’t travelled down there since before the pandemic. Used to visit my sister in NJ once or twice a year and so could ship a few things down before I went down but harder now.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

BOOM! Guess I'm going active folks! 2-channel class AB amp ordered and on its way for the tweeters - 60wRMS should be plenty for them. These will replace my crossovers. Other pioneer 4-channel will do the front mids and rear fill speakers. Eventually if I want I could even just do a 3-way setup in front but for now let's just start here 

Guess I have to get going on my sub box build so I can advance the amp rack and wiring! hopefully have some time this week. and more over the weekend.


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## Flygts (Aug 17, 2021)

I’ve been using carpet tape for template tape, have had no issues. Available at Lowe’s and Home Depot


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Flygts said:


> I’ve been using carpet tape for template tape, have had no issues. Available at Lowe’s and Home Depot


got a link to that? Home depot in USA has a lot better selection of materials versus Canada.

thanks


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

Flygts said:


> I’ve been using carpet tape for template tape, have had no issues. Available at Lowe’s and Home Depot


Pretty sure this is what I was thinking of. It's white and pretty darn stable.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> got a link to that? Home depot in USA has a lot better selection of materials versus Canada.
> 
> thanks


I feel like I have a new best friend, so many time I search for something and it comes up on HD usa site but we cant get it on the Canadian site haha


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I'd suggest your 4 channel doing all the front duty. The rears will be fine with 60w. They'd prolly be okay with 20w. I know your jbl are rated at 125w for the set/crossover. I don't know how that breaks down per speaker. Is there any rating printed on the back of the tweet? Even if it is 60, you may want that extra headroom on the amp.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I'd suggest your 4 channel doing all the front duty. The rears will be fine with 60w. They'd prolly be okay with 20w. I know your jbl are rated at 125w for the set/crossover. I don't know how that breaks down per speaker. Is there any rating printed on the back of the tweet? Even if it is 60, you may want that extra headroom on the amp.


No rating on the tweeters unfortunately and not even in the manual. However, I was thinking the 2-channel may be better suited for the tweeters since it's a true class AB amp and would avoid any popping issues at start-up (as another user mentioned earlier in my thread)? The 4-channel is class FD, so a type of Hybrid digital class D - not sure how this may affect the tweeters. Also not sure if there is any disadvantage to running tweets on a separate amp as the mids, and I doubt I would need close to 100w RMS on the tweets. What is everyone's input on this? I have less experience running active. Keep in mind that switching wiring over is pretty simple once all is installed, but rather do it proper the first time and keep wires clean and secured.


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## Flygts (Aug 17, 2021)

OneFastCanuck said:


> got a link to that? Home depot in USA has a lot better selection of materials versus Canada.
> 
> thanks





https://www.lowes.com/pd/Shurtape-1-88-in-x-75-ft-White-Double-sided-Seam-Tape/3407976


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Aah I can't seem to find that stuff here - anyways I received my tape from Amazon today - with Prime it was next day delivery.

I did find something available here at Canadian Tire (which I refer to as Crappy Tire) that I will try next time my current tape runs out;

https://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/cantech-double-sided-interior-carpet-tape-0676020p.html


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Also not sure if there is any disadvantage to running tweets on a separate amp as the mids


it really doesn't matter. many run a separate amp for each set of whatever.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I would lean towards whatever amp is going to give you the cleanest signal at the desired level for front stage. The fd class may not be the winner on paper. But the class ab might distort if you try to push it too much. Some people are great at setting gains by ear. I'm not and prefer a scope to get my max clean signal then turn down the amp or more likely the dsp output. My amp has detents and it's not a smooth knob roll. The dsp is easier to fine tune.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Forgot to mention I have an SMD-DD1 for setting gains, bought it like 8years ago. Not sure how that would come into play


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

It will be very helpful. I've always wanted to try one against my cheap oscope. Might have been 20 bucks on ebay. I don't trust it for rms readings but it does show me sine waves and clipping. One thing I've always struggled with was using a dmm to get high frequency voltage. Maybe with a fluke it's better but a cheaper one doesn't have the sample rate (Nyquist limit) to keep up with the oscillations. I have to run a 1khz signal, set it with that voltage, get the right xover point and hope for the best. This build with the widebands shouldn't be as tricky. If i ever make it that far.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

More goodies today. The small amp and 3/16 inch thick ABS arrived today (that was quick considering I ordered it yesterday morning - yay crutchfield!) 










also stopped at my favorite electronics store on the way home for the rest of my instal gear - I forgot how expensive these things get lol but man I like they store. Here’s what I got:

8-gauge 100% copper wire for small pioneer amplifier power and ground (they didn’t have any black left)
black expendable sleeving to use on 8-gauge - will use this over the ground wire to make it distinguishable from power wire.
4 sets of Rockford twisted RCA to connect the DSP to each amp (short lengths only required)
Roll of 16-gauge OFC speaker wire to go from amps to OEM wiring harness under driver seat
10-gauge OFC wire for subwoofers (wish they had smaller rolls but his was smallest they had at $32, more than I need but I’ll have for future projects!)










still waiting on the damn speed wire from Amazon which shipped from China - this speed wire will go from back of my OEM radio to the Zapco to feed the signal. Once that is set up I have to reprogram my car to make it think it does not have the Fender premium Audio system and instead output through the regular radio like the base models (as opposed to using MOST system to communicate with fender amp)

I really need to continue work on my sub box as it is holding the rest back right now. Once that is complete I can get proper measurements and cut the amp racks HPDE. Then I can do all the wiring possible outside the care before installing them in the car, after which I’ll run power wire from battery to trunk district blocks, then work on swapping out the speakers and finally reprogramming the radio to make the switch official 😎 fun times!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Sweet! Looks like you have time to get the box right before the shipment comes in. I don't think i have enough speed wire in my garage otherwise I'd ship it to you. I have a bin full of random lengths of ofc and cca wires, 4, 10, 14 ga. If you need stuff, tell me what and how long. I'm happy to at least see what shipping costs and if it's possible


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Sweet! Looks like you have time to get the box right before the shipment comes in. I don't think i have enough speed wire in my garage otherwise I'd ship it to you. I have a bin full of random lengths of ofc and cca wires, 4, 10, 14 ga. If you need stuff, tell me what and how long. I'm happy to at least see what shipping costs and if it's possible


Thanks! I can get the speed wire by tomorrow if I order it again - issue was that it went out of stock on Amazon when I ordered last month and so it shipped direct from supplier. Now it’s back in stock and next day delivery, but too late to cancel the order and I’m not really in a rush to get it. Should arrive by next week, I’ll be out of town that week anyways so not able to work on the car.
Just need some quality time rostering out the sub box panels now and then assembly should be pretty smooth. Hoping to make big progress this weekend as I’ll have less crap to do around the house.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Good call on not drilling out the molex plugs. I did my right rear by drilling out two adjacent empty holes. It was all jacked up but worked and went back together. Told myself I'd do better on the other side. ... Best laid plans. Repinned a couple to get more room. Still ended up wrecking it but again got it together. Note to self: don't use a screwdriver to scrape plastic out of the cabin side plug. Looked like 4th of July in my car last night. Had a mild heart attack.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Good call on not drilling out the molex plugs. I did my right rear by drilling out two adjacent empty holes. It was all jacked up but worked and went back together. Told myself I'd do better on the other side. ... Best laid plans. Repinned a couple to get more room. Still ended up wrecking it but again got it together. Note to self: don't use a screwdriver to scrape plastic out of the cabin side plug. Looked like 4th of July in my car last night. Had a mild heart attack.


hahaha oh man I know the feeling from past projects - that feeling when you feel like you're in to deep - but it's just a small thing!

Honestly, doing a lot of research and using my own electrical intuition, I don't see much of a need to run thicker wire for the new speakers. The OEM system was designed with an amp, I will verify but I am pretty sure the wires should be 16-gauge OFC with the Fender system. Auto engineers always design with some margin in mind for power, and 16-gauge OFC will be sufficient for 100w RMS of audio, and since I will most likely never use (or rarely use) the 100w RMS due to music being dynamic, I don't see why not to make my life easy!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Some progress this weekend - despite the large amount of housework I had to get done, managed to get an hour or two each day to get things moving on the car - working on the front wall of the sub box, and got the bottom piece cut using the template I made, had to slightly adjust the width (shifted 1/4inch from one side edge to the other) so that when I lifted it up it perfectly comes out of the trunk without hitting the walls/plastic pieces. Now for some photos!


















Next is the front wall - since the shape is so intricate, I am using a stacking method - the first piece was the hardest to make using several different methods - but once complete, it was just a matter of stacking, glueing + brad nailing each layer then copying the profile with the edge trim router bit, one at a time. I need 5 layers total to make up the 4inches of height of the box (not including the top and bottom) - here some pics of the process:











































and that’s pretty much how far I got. It’s intricate work, I believe I got some of the most challenging and meticulous work complete, the three other walls are straight so easy enough, and then I just need to cut the top of the box (including making hole for the subs) and glueing everything up. Will be away for a week, hopefully when I come back I’ll be able to put more hours back-to-back since the seasonal housework is done. Can’t wait to get this done and start on the amps rack!


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

oh i see rough router marks! time to throw it all out and start again! 

You've done a good job matching the hatch curve. thats always a pain with wood.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> oh i see rough router marks! time to throw it all out and start again!
> 
> You've done a good job matching the hatch curve. thats always a pain with wood.


Thanks! And yeah I’m pretty sure I’m burning a little bit - for the second layer, I was able to use a half inch bit with the bearing on the bottom to copy the profile which worked well, and cutting rough with the jigsaw to make it easier on the bit. However as I stacked more, I had to use a 1/4 inch flush trim bit with the bearing on top and normally should be only removing 1/8inch of material but couldn’t get closer to the profile with the jigsaw. I think what I need is a flush trim spiral bit? Would make it easier I copy the profile even if there is lots of material on the other side - or at least that’s what I noticed from watching caraudiofabrication on YouTube. Might order one this week. If it works better Then it’ll be a good bit to have on hand.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looks great! Keep it going!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Also, I really hope they once the box is assembled, it will fit smoothly inside and not catch on anything! Lol! Hard to test with just a 2D piece - once the box is 3D it’s kind of a “good luck to you” situation hahaha


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I'm pretty sure you're a measure 3 times cut once kinda guy. It'll fit. You account for carpet or covering of sorts if you're going that route? I've been burnt on carpet thickness at least once. Takes me a few times to learn something.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I'm pretty sure you're a measure 3 times cut once kinda guy. It'll fit. You account for carpet or covering of sorts if you're going that route? I've been burnt on carpet thickness at least once. Takes me a few times to learn something.


Haha yes I would agree with you! Yeah I accounted for carpet (visually) estimating about 1/8”, I don’t mind if it’s a bit tight (ie friction fit) for long as it slides in nicely. I will be doing carpet to match the trunk interior, as it is a stealth build.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

i think just a longer 1/2" flush trim would do the trick. that double width makes a HUGE difference in bit stability


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

I like the stacked method for the sub box. Are the other sides going to be their own individual stack and then all sides glued together? A router is definitely the next wood working tool I want to get. Is the hole on the bottom board for mounting purposes or for a terminal cup?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> i think just a longer 1/2" flush trim would do the trick. that double width makes a HUGE difference in bit stability


I agree with you! The half inch I was using (with bearing at the bottom) was definitely more stout - i actually have a half inch flush bit with the bearing on top, which I removed the bearing from to put a square bearing so that I can use it with my adjustable curve - I will probably switch it back to circular bearing to do the rest of the box. I don’t see a need for the adjustable curve for a while.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

dmb1650 said:


> I like the stacked method for the sub box. Are the other sides going to be their own individual stack and then all sides glued together? A router is definitely the next wood working tool I want to get. Is the hole on the bottom board for mounting purposes or for a terminal cup?


yes, an interesting technique indeed! Actually my first time trying it. Since the other three sides of the box are straight, no need to use stack method, I’ll just use a plain old 3/4inch piece for each side cut with a saw. Stack method is great for unique profiles, but definitely a lot more work.

that hole will be covered with a circular piece of 3/4inch MDF. I wanted to use it as a part of the profile to be able to center it and kind of lock it in place.
Not a huge fan of terminal cups if I can avoid them - I got a set of Dayton terminals (will grab a photo) that will work better since only have to drill two small holes, should result in almost no leakage. They’re popular in the home audio world and give a really nice clean finished look.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> I got a set of Dayton terminals (will grab a photo) that will work better since only have to drill two small holes, should result in almost no leakage. They’re popular in the home audio world and give a really nice clean finished look.


you mean bolts right?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> you mean bolts right?


hahaha yes, some very fancy bolts!


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

OneFastCanuck said:


> yes, an interesting technique indeed! Actually my first time trying it. Since the other three sides of the box are straight, no need to use stack method, I’ll just use a plain old 3/4inch piece for each side cut with a saw. Stack method is great for unique profiles, but definitely a lot more work.
> 
> that hole will be covered with a circular piece of 3/4inch MDF. I wanted to use it as a part of the profile to be able to center it and kind of lock it in place.
> Not a huge fan of terminal cups if I can avoid them - I got a set of Dayton terminals (will grab a photo) that will work better since only have to drill two small holes, should result in almost no leakage. They’re popular in the home audio world and give a really nice clean finished look.


 Makes sense. Looking forward to your progress. It will be nice to keep your cargo space available. I agree on not using terminal cups.


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## few35t (Dec 10, 2014)

In for more!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

few35t said:


> In for more!


Oh yes! I am in California this week for my brothers wedding  so no progress this week besides receiving my small fuse block (which will give power to both the dsp and small 2-channel amp) 

but when I get back it should be back to business 

also think I figured out how I will be making my bracket in engine bay to mount my fuse holder - will becopying the corner profile of the air box and using two of the bolts to attach it - with two bends, the fuse holder will sit beside the battery above the ÉCU:










Oh and excuse the dirty as hell engine bay - I had just gotten the car back from dealership after 8 weeks - definitely need to do an engine cleaning.


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## few35t (Dec 10, 2014)

Here’s part of the build in my gf’s mk7 GTI. We actually opted for the mounting kit and a Kenwood double din HU, vxi100/5, C5’s active, and 13tw5.
Great work here, look forward to more!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Very nice! Definitely retaining the OEM discovery head unit as it is beautiful and has tons of integrated features. How do those C5’s sound? JL audio gear is so expensive here.


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## few35t (Dec 10, 2014)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Very nice! Definitely retaining the OEM discovery head unit as it is beautiful and has tons of integrated features. How do those C5’s sound? JL audio gear is so expensive here.


The mounting kit actually retains all those integrated features! It’s pricy though at ~$350 but a small price to pay for a clean signal, the signal from the oem unit was miserably bad, there was distortion at like half volume. I find the C5’s a bit harsh and bright actually, have considered trying some other drivers.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

few35t said:


> The mounting kit actually retains all those integrated features! It’s pricy though at ~$350 but a small price to pay for a clean signal, the signal from the oem unit was miserably bad, there was distortion at like half volume. I find the C5’s a bit harsh and bright actually, have considered trying some other drivers.


nice - how did you get the OEM signal, from the back of the CD player in glove box like I plan to do, into the DSP?


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## few35t (Dec 10, 2014)

OneFastCanuck said:


> nice - how did you get the OEM signal, from the back of the CD player in glove box like I plan to do, into the DSP?


I actually didn’t do the install but I’m guessing speaker level inputs. This car didn’t have premium audio either.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

few35t said:


> I actually didn’t do the install but I’m guessing speaker level inputs. This car didn’t have premium audio either.


cool - I'll be using the speaker level inputs into DSP (reprogramming the car to output like a base model radio versus outputting to fender amp) - if I can't get it properly tuned to my liking I can always just use the direct aux input to my DSP for now and eventually use a Zen navtv to tap the MOST signal (but pricey at $1000 ish CAD)


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Some updates from yesterday before I go down to continue work - good progress and I’m starting to see a very dim light at the end of the tunnel 🤣

got the front wall finished up (5 layers of 3/4 MDF) and also cut the sides and back of the box and assembled those. Made sure fitment into the trunk was nice and smooth, then drew on the very bottom piece to ensure they were aligned properly in the car. Removed, glued and put them together with the stencil lined up - using my brad nailer to hold it all together. Also decided to add some small dowels that I made from leftover wood and used roundover hit as well togive a nice finish - the idea is two-fold - a little extra strength at the corners, and will help also to seal the corners where the front and back walls émet side walls and minimize leakage.









































































As you should be able to tell from photos (which seem to be out of order of how I uploaded them) there is a small tolerance around the box where it fits in the car of about 1/8”-3/16” - this will allow for a nice forment after I cover it with automotive carpet.

I did however run intoone small issue that worried me. As I assembled the front and sides, I realized that the whole time my head nailer had a nail stuck in it. Was an easy fix but I don’t know how long the nail was stuck since it seems it was like that since before yesterday, and I’m really hoping that it was not the case when I assembled the front layered sub wall - otherwise one of the layers might not have properly adhered to the other layers and couldresult in some leakage. However, when I was assembling the layers, I used a small applicator to spread the wood glue across the entire surface, and so even if I hadn’t clamped it or nailed it, the weight of the other layers would probably be sufficient for it to adhere alright, and once the whole box is assembled everything should be quite rigid.

now I need to do the top baffle today and see how it fits in the box - I think I should add one center brace to the box, in between the two subs, just to give it some extra strength/rigidity - thoughts?


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Extraordinary wood working skills! Yes, i think you should add a brace. I'm not sure if you should split the air space completely or leave an open brace. Either way, i think you'll run into some box flex if you don't. It's a wide panel.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Yea that’s what I waaa thinking - I’ll make an open brace, probably a window style brace - will be rigid enough and also allow good airflow through the box.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

More fun in the dust - managed to get a clean copy of the top of the box (baffle) transferred from my 1/4” HDF template I made 2 weeks ago but as I expected, the fit was tight. So I used a trick I learned from YouTube to make the entire piece 1/8incj smaller - used a 1-2inch rabbeting bit but swapped bearing for a 3/8 bearing so that I would only remove 1/8inch of material. Then went around the piece at half of its height. After that, cut the other half height of material with a flush trim bit (flipped the piece over) and voila! An exact copy of the original but 1/8inch smaller on every side. Re-tried and it fit like a glove.



































next step was to make the holes for the subs - finally getting to the fun part! Checked the templates with the subs and mapped out the center point of each hole. Kept the subs 2inches away from the center of the box to leave some space for more support and give it a nice amount of material in between. Did 1/8inch around the outer perimeter first, then cut the inner diameter of the subs second. The subs fit perfectly! Keep in mind, there will be a second 3/4inch panel going on top of this one - not sure yet if it will be permanently attached or just attached with magnets yet - I’ll wait until make the center brace then I glue the top to the rest of the box. It will be tricky to center the top of box onto rest of the box forglueing, everything has to be perfect to retain the forment once I remove and glue it outside of the car. I’ve got a few ideas on how to achieve that.

here’s the final progress for today:


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Coming along sweetly. Your planning and precision are showing.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Coming along sweetly. Your planning and precision are showing.


thanks bud! Wish it was going quicker but my mantra so far has been measure thrice, cut once, resulting in minimum swearing lol

I did some testing with the chamfer bit for the top beauty panel with both a 5/8" and 3/4" MDF. I like the idea of 5/8 inch MDF because, well, cheaper and also less weight, but just based on the depth of the subwoofer cones and their rubber surrounds, I think 3/4 will be the minimum to get it as flush mounted as possible (even then it sticks out a little). I think I need a slightly bigger chamfer bit as well - I have 3 different chamfer bits, a 22.5 degree which is too narrow, a small 45 degree x 1inch and a larger 45 degree by 1/2inch. It gives a nice finish around the edge but maybe not pronounced enough - I will see what others use, like caraudiofab. The goal is to make it look as factory as possible once it is installed. I also want another panel to fit inside the beauty panel where the subs are, to hide and protect the subs so I can go full stealth or load up the car with stuff without worrying about the subs.


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## Jheitt142 (Dec 7, 2011)

dont worry about it leaking thats what the glue is for!

looks sweet!. I'll have to go back and remind myself of what gear you are using


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I like how those pioneer subs are not covered in gaudy logos. Wish i could debadge my image dynamics sub. I pulled 13 letters off the back of my sportwagen. I hate that crap. At least the R is just an R. That's worth keeping.


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## JP Fabrication (Feb 20, 2008)

Great progress so far. Will be following.

Funny thing is, I just posted my build in my 2004 R32, also first time using a dsp/active, and I'm at the same point you are in your trunk which is also similar


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jheitt142 said:


> dont worry about it leaking thats what the glue is for!
> 
> looks sweet!. I'll have to go back and remind myself of what gear you are using


thanks man! Yeah, I was just worried that one of the layers of the front wall didn't adhere properly if ever the nail gun was shooting blanks (lol). But seems very solid and sturdy, and I will also be caulking the inside corners/joints for additional safe measure. 


Can anyone remind me what caulking is ideal for sub box interiors? I know that certain types are preferable to avoid degrading the sub internals.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I like how those pioneer subs are not covered in gaudy logos. Wish i could debadge my image dynamics sub. I pulled 13 letters off the back of my sportwagen. I hate that crap. At least the R is just an R. That's worth keeping.


I know right? I have actually never used a Pioneer sub before these - so I am curious to see how they sound. I know it is a more mainstream brand but hey I figured I would give them a try considering I got a good deal on them - just wish there were more people using these subs so I could get a better idea of how they perform - but I definitely like the looks of them! Worst case, I just re-measured the depth of my box last night with the top on, and I can actually fit two sundown 10" SD4 subs in there in terms of depth (or potentially some nice Focal subs) - If ever I find that the Pioneer shallow mounts don't play low enough for my liking.

I do hate tons of badging on the car. I was pleasantly surprised with the R. When I had my Subaru STI, I removed every badge from the trunk except for the STI logo. There were like 4 badges total on the trunk of that car. Why does everyone need to know the car is AWD with a badge? seriously lol.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

JP Fabrication said:


> Great progress so far. Will be following.
> 
> Funny thing is, I just posted my build in my 2004 R32, also first time using a dsp/active, and I'm at the same point you are in your trunk which is also similar


nice! Those R32 are sweet! Cant complain with that VR6! 

How is the audio outputs in the R32 versus newer models? this MOST communication method is probably great for OEM integration with low noise but man is it a pain to integrate to! Currently planning on re-programming to get the outputs from the radio instead of MOST system (so basically de-activating the FENDER system) but I have been told that when I turn volume on head unit up, the output changes in terms of the frequency curves - so technically I would have to keep the volume knob/steering wheel volume at a fixed level and use the DSP remote to turn up the volume - and I definitely don<t want that. Other option was to use a MOST integration unit but they are ridiculously expensive (the NavTV is $1K USD) and the other cheaper options don't list the golf as compatible, plus I cannot find anyone that has used successfully. Pain in the A$$


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Omg if you had to change to 2 sundown, what a tragedy. I had one sa10 v3 in a ported box with 600w. I had it underpowered but dang it pounded.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Small update - center bracing complete! Now trying to decide where to put the two Dayton audio terminal posts into the box - either centered on the back of the box or off to one side. Leaning towards putting it off to one side. 






























And after rounding over to have a smooth, aesthetic (OCD) finish:

























Still have to cut small circle of MDF to block the bottom hole on each side of the center brace (as seen in photos) before closing the box off. Also still need the top of the box to use as template for the top beauty panel (to locate the cut-out for subs and ensure it all lines up properly!)


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looks great. For the terminals, try to imagine having to access them to remove the box. I made the mistake of putting them directly in the back before (farthest from the hatch opening). Had to hold the false floor up with my head while i disconnected.


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## JP Fabrication (Feb 20, 2008)

What is your plan for the beauty panel? I'm still trying to figure out what I'm going to do on my R


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Looks great. For the terminals, try to imagine having to access them to remove the box. I made the mistake of putting them directly in the back before (farthest from the hatch opening). Had to hold the false floor up with my head while i disconnected.


Not so worried about that, as I have XT60 quick connect plugs for the subs (good to 60A loads) which will make disconnecting very easy from the amp rack side. It's more planning for clearance and also where the wires will come from the amp I suppose.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

JP Fabrication said:


> What is your plan for the beauty panel? I'm still trying to figure out what I'm going to do on my R


Pretty sure I will do it in two pieces - one which will be the same size as the sub box top piece I cut (as seen in photos) and another further back for the amp rack (at the same level/height). So only one seam. Doing one single piece makes it real tight to put in and remove the panel, as there are a few curves on each side of the trunk that make it difficult. Not sure if I am explaining myself well, hopefully it is clear! 

I plan to wrap both in automotive carpet to keep the oem look.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Some more progress this afternoon - I cut the very top piece which will go above the sub box, no photos though as I just did it to be able to copy the profile of the sub box itself, so I can install that piece on the box itself (hope my explanation makes sense LOL)

With that, I had to also make my lower amp rack to ensure everything fit together well...I LOVE when a plan comes together 

Some photos of the amp rack - using 3/8" HPDE, this will be the bottom layer of two layers. I cut it to fit in back of sub box and follows contour of trunk bottom. 






















































Once I was happy with fitment, I rounded over the top edges all the way around. I then marked two locations and drilled through the HPDE AND sub box tab (the floor piece which sticks out 2 inches in back of the box) and will be putting threaded inserts to basically keep the two fastened together with M10 bolts (no photos of that yet)














Let me know what you think of my layout - I think I<m pretty happy with it. Basically all power on the bottom, plus mono amp. Top will be the Zapco, 4-channel amp and smaller 2-channel amp. Left lots of space for passing and securing wiring. Open to any constructive criticism!!!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looks killer. I almost forgot you're raising the floor. Was wondering where that top layer was going. If you ever get tired of your full time gig, you would do very well for yourself building custom audio setups.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

More progress Sunday - got the second level of the amp rack completed. 


incoming picture dump!


Here are some of the bottom amp rack testing fitment with gear;






























Next the top amp rack - started by cutting the shape out to match more or less the OEM floor shape. Figured that the two side shelves, where the OEM false floor is held, would be a perfect spot to hold the top rack as well. 















Next, made a nice cutout in the front center of the second level for multiple reasons: Firstly, it allows access to the two M10 bolts where the bottom amp rack attaches to the subwoofer enclosure. Second, I will be passing all wiring from bottom to top through that opening. Third, and finally, it makes a really nice grabbing location to slide the top amp rack out of the way/remove. Since I do not have thousands of dollars worth of Mobile solutions templates (nor would they be justified since I do not do this full time) I got creative and cut a piece at 45 degree on each end, then used two more pieces but up against that to make my cut-out with the router;











Turned out exactly as I envisioned. Rounded over all edges for a nice clean finish (hard to see from photos);


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Next was to finish off the box (minus the top) - that includes, finishing and glueing the bottom round piece, adding my two Dayton terminal posts, and installing my two threaded inserts where the amp rack screws into the box;


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

*LAYOUT ADVICE ALERT!*

Here are two options for my top amplifier rack layout. Personally, I am really digging option 2, with the Zapco in the center of the two amps - also leaves lots of room for passing and securing all wiring. KEEP IN MIND' the cutout in the center was not done yet in these photos but I had marked it out in blue marker as seen on pics. 

Option 1:












Option 2:


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I like option 2 as well. Looking good.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I like option 2 as well. Looking good.


thanks!

Looks like option 2 it is! Maybe I can get some more progress in tonight after I hit the gym (which I desperately need!)


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## JP Fabrication (Feb 20, 2008)

Yep, #2


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Not much progress last night but the box is properly sealed for sure - used construction sealant on all joints, and decided hell why not, let's do the front stacked baffle so that if any stack didn't have quite enough glue, it'll be sealed anyways.

Used Sika construction sealant - full cure time 4-7 days, subs will not go in before then (ensure all off-gassing complete);


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## dmb1650 (Oct 26, 2015)

More support for option 2!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Small update - got the wiring done in sub box. Using 10-gauge because why not - probably could get away with 12-gauge but if I ever upgrade subs, the 10 could be handy. Will be pushing around 800w RMS to these. 

Wrapped the in-box portion in closed cell foam then tessa tape in order to avoid it making noise/viibrating/knocking in the car. Also fastened them to the box floor using cable clamps. The subs are being connected in parallel to get a 2-ohm load (they are single 4-ohm voice coil) hence one wire to connect the two and the other wire coming from the Dayton terminals.













































****

need some advice/experience sharing - I can't connect two wires into the push terminals on the first sub (see photo below) - trying to figure out the cleanest way to do it - open to suggesitons. Initial though is either solder a third wire to those two and shrink wrap, to connect to the push terminal of third sub - or use a small terminal block inside the box (less elegant) - what do you all do in this situation?


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looks very solid and secure. Instead of them twisted, can you have one wire from one side of the terminal and one from the opposite? Or maybe a reducer type terminal? Or big ass banana plug?


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Install Bay IBCPLR2 4 AWG to 8 AWG Nickel Plated Gauge Reducer


Install Bay IBCPLR2 • 4 AWG to 8 AWG Nickel Plated Wire Gauge Reducer • Wire Gauge Reducer • 4 AWG to 8 AWG • Nickel Plated • Deep Wire Recesses • Ultimate Power Delivery




www.sonicelectronix.com













Stinger SPT5501 Mono Banana Plugs - 2 Pack - Sonic Electronix


Stinger SPT5501 • Mono Banana Plugs - 2 Pack • Quantity: 2 •Red and Black Colors • Single Terminal Shoc-Krome




www.sonicelectronix.com


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Good ideas thanks for sharing Adurm

was thinking about it and jeeze, can’t I just wire the second left set of wires directly to the terminal posts on the side of the box ?!?! - result in the same and way cleaner. So basically two sets of wires coming from terminal posts - one set to each sub.


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## Flygts (Aug 17, 2021)

That’s what I usually do. I would use wires that are the same length


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## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

Since they're going to be parallel just run the second set of wires back to the binding post on the box wall with a second set of eyelets.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

pwnt by pat said:


> Since they're going to be parallel just run the second set of wires back to the binding post on the box wall with a second set of eyelets.


Yes that’s exactly what I’m doing (and tried to describe above) - I only had 2 eyelets for 10gauge wire, but went out and bought a pack earlier. Simple and clean!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Got the box finished up finally (minus the carpetting)

Re-routed wiring so each sub has their own cables - much cleaner. 



















Then made some finger grab holes in the top piece in order to be able to lift out of trunk floor. Works well.




















Made grooves in the side where box will be sitting on OEM floor sides, and also serves for me to cleanly wrap carpet around and tuck behind.






















Due to wanting the fitment being perfect, I decided to put glue and attatch the top to the box inside the trunk. This would allow me to align the box with the top exactly how it should be, put some finishing nails in to hold it together then remove the box. Protected the car with tape and rags of course.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

YAY it worked - with one small issue...













So to perfectly align everything, i thought it would be wise to put the two M10 bolts in behind the box, connecting the amp rack to the box using some M10 threaded inserts. Well, after securing the top to the box, I got too excited and tried to remove the box. Now you will know what happens when M10 threaded inserts get ripped out of their location due to impatient builders;





















So, I decided this could happen again and not worth the trouble. I then flush trimmed that little surface with the M10 inserts out and now the back of the box is perfectly flat/flush.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

The other "issue" I noticed was that, despite my patience and medium woodworking skills, I had managed to still have some tiny gaps between the top of the box and the walls. When I shined light I could see the light from the other side. This could not be left as I wanted the box perfectly sealed. So, I carefully used my hand/index finger inside the box with some sealant through the subwoofer cut-outs and applied to all corners between top of box and walls. Now there should be no gaps left un-sealed. Some photos of the results;


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Good job catching it now


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

More progress today...quite happy with how things are coming along. 

First thing I did was finalize the mounting for the top amp rack board. I decided the best way to make it solid was to put two little tabs on the back of the sub box (first photo) and one support at the back on the bottom rack, on which I would put two threaded inserts to hold the top and bottom racks together (but not the sub box!)




















Once I was happy with that, I started permanently mounting all the equipment on the top and bottom amp rack.


























I was then going to start routing the RCA cables but I realized that 6 footers I purchased were too long and I didn't want to deal with all the slack. I had one three foot but I would need at least two more (for zapco to two top amps) so I figured I would wait until I went back to the store to get 3-footers instead. Plus I was unsure of how to cleanly run the wires, whether to drill more holes and go down then up, or just use the slot at the front I made to go down, roll excess under then come back up. Since I was not too sure and didn't have cables in hand, I moved onto another area of the project; THE UNDER-HOOD FUSE BOX BRACKET.


Since the golf R engine has quite a lot going on, I had been struggling to find a good area to properly secure the bracket. I knew I wanted the fuse holder to be beside the battery, ideally in between battery and the ECU (to the right of it). So I used cardboard to make a rough template and see how it came out. I liked it, so I cut it out of ABS plastic;



















Used a butane torch to bend it at the two areas I needed, turned out better than I expected. This butane torch really came in handy for this and for soldering 10GA and larger wire terminals to the wires.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Then I drilled and tapped two mounting holes for the fuse holder and installed it in the engine bay - Although it isn't perfect, I am pretty happy with the look - not too in your face but clean, at least in my opinion!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

some photos of all the gear in the car after all this - you can see the top amp rack, the equipment is a little higher than the top of the sub box, which is fine - I plan on doing a stepped floor - the sub box beauty panel is in the third and fourth picture, the amps stick up less than 3/4inch beyond that.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Finally, I also got a little wiring done on the lower rack. Attempting the cleanest possible using ferrules and shrink wrap. I'm liking this method a lot.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Them ferrules look good! If i weren't so cheap and more so impatient I'd have to get those.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Them ferrules look good! If i weren't so cheap and more so impatient I'd have to get those.


they work awesome honestly - and I think I paid under $20 off Amazon for the kit - had 2/0 gauge, 1/0 gauge, 2-gauge and 4-gauge ferrules with the shrink wrap. Oddly enough, the shrink wrap only fits on the Knukonceptz brand 0-gauge, but not the Crutchfield one. The crutchfield 0-gauge is surprisingly good quality - I think there are a little bit more strands and the insulation is very slightly thicker. I will need to pick up slightly larger shrink wrap for the Crutchfield wire (which is the one coming from battery) both are OFC of course.


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## JP Fabrication (Feb 20, 2008)

Are you doing one more layer on top of the sub box or is that the beauty panel?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

That top layer of 3/4inch (last three photos in post 161) will be the beauty panel. Right now, when installed, it sits flush with the top of the subs surround, but my plan is to shim it a bit (use 1/4'' HDF on the bottom) to bring it up slightly. I am also debating whether to keep the two cut-outs circular shaped, or whether to join them (cut straight from top of circle to top of circle and bottom of circle to other bottom of circle) to make a big oval shape, round over the edges. Either way, I will be buying some mesh grill (diamond mesh) and forming it to cover each of the subs (or both subs in the case I make the big rectangular oval shape) to protect it from transporting building materials like 2x4 etc. Right now I am leaning towards cutting out the bigger oval shape but of course OPINIONS WELCOME!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Also will be using magnets to secure that top beauty panel - so will have to line up top and bottom piece and cut out and glue several magnets (probably 4 total) for easy on-and-off functionality.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

+1 for the big oval


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Thinking about doing a molded mesh setup over the subs for the beauty panel - did some research to find a good sizing and found a thread that JP Fab posted about molded mesh as well as his specs. 

Since McMaster-Carr is a US-based site, I worked to locate a local spot that sells this type of thing -for all my Canadian friends out there. Here is the link;





__





Perforated Sheet Metal » Accurate Screen & Grating







www.accuratescreen.ca





thinking using the exact same material as JP Fab posted as his photos looked good and said structurally it is goo (.125" Dia. x .187" Stg - 40% OA - and probably 16GA or 14GA)

I need to call and get a quote. They also have the hex design material which is very nice but probably quite a lot more expensive. We shall see - this would literally be the very last step of the build.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Got some wiring done yesterday but no time for photos ( I am renovating a full kitchen in one of our rental units in tandem with this audio project )

I did my rounds Monday night - went and picked up my NavTV zen-V that I ordered, then to Home Depot to get longer 10-24 bolts for my mini fuse panel to attach to the amp rack, then to electronics store for a few little missing items such as more shorter RCA (3-foot was sufficient for all amps, the 6 foot I got initially were too long).

Ran all my signal cables (RCA's) and attached via zip ties to amp rack - the subwoofer RCA's will stay loose about halfway to go up to top rack and connect to DSP. I may attach them to top rack but leave some slack in the middle so I can slide top amp rack out of the way.

Waiting on proper 8-gauge wire I ordered, since I am not too happy with the stuff I got a few weeks ago - it is very rigid versus the other power wires (knukonceptz and Crutchfield).

Also waiting on some ferrules for the 8-gauge - LITERALLY the only size ferrule I don't have in either of my ferrule kits! annoying!!! lol.

Right now I cannot find any OFC 4-gauge wire (looks to be scarce at the moment) unless I buy a whole kit which is silly for just a few feet. I have a bunch of leftover CCA 4-gauge from previous builds, it will have to do as I only need about 3-feet power and 3-feet ground in 4-gauge, IF that.


----------



## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I've got a whole box of 4ga ofc knu. I'm happy to send you some. Gotta go to ups store today anyways.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I've got a whole box of 4ga ofc knu. I'm happy to send you some. Gotta go to ups store today anyways.


that would be pretty awesome but it may take a while for me to get it- I was hoping to finish up wiring this weekend - I can always change it later as it will probably only be about 3 zip ties per power wire going up to the 4-ch amp.


----------



## edouble101 (Dec 9, 2010)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Got some wiring done yesterday but no time for photos ( I am renovating a full kitchen in one of our rental units in tandem with this audio project )
> 
> I did my rounds Monday night - went and picked up my NavTV zen-V that I ordered, then to Home Depot to get longer 10-24 bolts for my mini fuse panel to attach to the amp rack, then to electronics store for a few little missing items such as more shorter RCA (3-foot was sufficient for all amps, the 6 foot I got initially were too long).
> 
> ...


KunKonceptz has 4 gauge in stock.

BTW, your wire ferrules and heat shrink look great!


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

edouble101 said:


> KunKonceptz has 4 gauge in stock.
> 
> BTW, your wire ferrules and heat shrink look great!


thanks for the kind words!

yes but I am in Canada and shipping alone from knukonceptz is $26 USD! so for 4ft of red and 4ft black it's like $42 USD total! I found cheaper on Amazon Canada but most of it will take too long to get here. I thought for sure my electronics store would have but all they have is CCA which I already have. For this application the CCA will be more than fine for the time being.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Turns out the old 4-gauge wire I had from previous builds was in fact OFC, the oldschool type I suppose not tinned;


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Proceeded to add the 4-ch amp power and ground wires to the distribution blocks - the other ends are loose until I get to the point of installing the two levels into the car - I left enough slack so I could easily slide out the upper amp rack forward onto the seats for ease of access, tuning, etc. Just missing the 8-ga wire and ferrules which should come in tomorrow


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Now, concerning remote turn-on signal...

The NavTV Zen-V has a remote turn-on sensing from the MOST fiber. This in turn should also activate the Zapco via the optical cable (I hope), At least this is what the Zapco instructions alluded to)

I am wondering if I can get away with taking the Zapco remote turn-on output and simply split three ways to the three amps, or if most people put a relay in between to play it safe? I bought a relay Monday (you can see it on my photo above of the amp rack) but it is a normally closed relay which isn't right, I would need Normally Open (which would mean as soon as power/signal input, it closes the circuit and sends power to the rest of the remote wires).


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

OK so I figured out what I will need to do - the DSP will not turn on just with optical signal, only if it was speaker level inputs (see below from Zapco instructions). So, I will use the NavTV zen-V remote output to feed the Zapco remote in (red wire), and then use the Zapco remote out (blue wire) to go to a Bosch relay and power up the three amps. Boom!


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Found the exact relay I needed in my old electrical box. Yay! Wired it up the power and ground, as well as a small terminal block that will split the remote turn-on signal to the three amps to keep it super clean. No photos yet, will take a photo once I finish the 8-gauge wire runs, which should arrive today in the mail (I hope!). Also tested the relay on the car battery (I put pos neg on battery then put the relay activation on pos terminal, heard it click and saw voltage readings on my terminal block) - SUCCESS! ready to wire them to amps.


Afterwards, I hooked up my Knukonceptz terminal tot he battery along with the post, so I could retain factory connector on VW positive battery side. It's all good and tight and as clean as I can get it considering the circumstances (I really didn't want to cut the factory mounting ring off).



Here are some finished photos (note - fuses not in the fuse holder until whole system is complete and ready for install)













Once again don't mind the dirty engine bay - it is definitely due a cleaning - winter here now and it will get dirty again for sure in short time!


----------



## edouble101 (Dec 9, 2010)

OneFastCanuck said:


> OK so I figured out what I will need to do - the DSP will not turn on just with optical signal, only if it was speaker level inputs (see below from Zapco instructions). So, I will use the NavTV zen-V remote output to feed the Zapco remote in (red wire), and then use the Zapco remote out (blue wire) to go to a Bosch relay and power up the three amps. Boom!


You should use a relay diode to protect your head unit from voltage spikes when the system is turned off. I have done this by soldering the diode on the relay terminals.

You can read more about this here and here.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

edouble101 said:


> You should use a relay diode to protect your head unit from voltage spikes when the system is turned off. I have done this by soldering the diode on the relay terminals.
> 
> You can read more about this here and here.


yea I heard about this but I’mtaking the remote on from the NavTVzen V and not the head unit - does it make a difference? The navTV instructions don’t call for one.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I don't believe our head units have remote wires. I've only done 2 amps from a single remote. I've read 3 is okay but best to relay at that point.


----------



## edouble101 (Dec 9, 2010)

OneFastCanuck said:


> yea I heard about this but I’mtaking the remote on from the NavTVzen V and not the head unit - does it make a difference? The navTV instructions don’t call for one.


The relay has potential to send a high voltage spike back to any device connected to it whether it is a head unit or DSP.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

edouble101 said:


> The relay has potential to send a high voltage spike back to any device connected to it whether it is a head unit or DSP.


so funnily enough I had to pass by my “favorite” electronics store (i may be starting to get tired of it) to get zip ties and some blue wire shrink wrap (I want all the remote turn on wires blue).

So they actually have relay wiring harnesses with a built in diode for $3 so I just bought that even though I just need the diode - will transfer over the diode to my other relay harness that is already wired up on my amp rack and boom! Protection.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Now that we are 10 pages into this modest build, I’d like to thank everyone who contributed their knowledge and experience - its people like you who elevate the community and the people starting out, reading and following these threads, who learn an incredible amount. This is how we collectively get better.
We’ve all started somewhere!


----------



## JetBadger (Jan 4, 2021)

Regarding relays for remote, you can measure with a multimeter how much current each amp draws on the remote line. Chances are all added up will still be less than a single relay coil.

But does your DSP not have a remote out? If it does, it's much better to connect to that.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

JetBadger said:


> Regarding relays for remote, you can measure with a multimeter how much current each amp draws on the remote line. Chances are all added up will still be less than a single relay coil.
> 
> But does your DSP not have a remote out? If it does, it's much better to connect to that.


If you look back on the last page, I pasted the instructions directly from the DSP manual, and am following both the NavTV AND DSP instructions, which is basically:
NavTV remote-out wire to DSP remote-in wire (so NavTV tells my DSP to turn on) and then DSP remote-out wire to activate relay with constant 12V (as per the DSP manual) and that relay-out to my three amplifiers' remote-in.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Latest wiring photo as of yesterday afternoon of lower amp rack - almost complete - you can see the relay in there now for remote turn-on circuit. Still missing the 8ga ferrules required to finish wiring the small fuse block power and ground to distribution blocks, to finish off this rack.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

edouble101 said:


> You should use a relay diode to protect your head unit from voltage spikes when the system is turned off. I have done this by soldering the diode on the relay terminals.
> 
> You can read more about this here and here.


Can you confirm which pins on the relay to solder the diode to? between 85 (ground) and 86 (trigger) correct?


----------



## edouble101 (Dec 9, 2010)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Can you confirm which pins on the relay to solder the diode to? between 85 (ground) and 86 (trigger) correct?


Are you using the relay diagram like you had pictured in post #178? Post #178 has ground on pin 86. 

What you mention above is typical for a Bosch 5 pin relay for this use, pin 85 is ground, such as: 
30 = constant +12v 
85 = ground
86 = turn on from source unit (trigger)
87 = +12v from relay to units to turn on
87a = not used

The diode acts as a one-way switch for current. The diode goes across the control circuit, pins 85 and 86. The cathode (stripe on diode) on pin 86 and anode on pin 85.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

edouble101 said:


> Are you using the relay diagram like you had pictured in post #178? Post #178 has ground on pin 86.
> 
> What you mention above is typical for a Bosch 5 pin relay for this use, pin 85 is ground, such as:
> 30 = constant +12v
> ...


thanks this is what I thought - and yes that is the relay I am using. I already went down and soldered the diode between the two wires 85 and 86, taking note of the direction of the diode as mentioned above. One more thing done.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Finished up lower amp rack wiring yesterday - all that is left is to connect the loose wires to upper amp rack and of course the main power and ground from the engine bay battery. Small white triple terminal up top is for the Zen NavTV which will be replacing the amp under driver side seat. Still need to make a wiring harness for that, but will be attached from the under-seat bracket side. 







Made some side brackets which will mount to OEM bolting locations of some side trim. Took a while to get everything lined up and drilled out properly but no doubt it will be solid once installed;













So for the Zen NavTV, I removed factory amp (since that is where the MOST150 cable is) and copied the profile onto a piece of HPDF to make a proper bolt-on direct replacement bracket. I didn't grab photos of the OEM amp but basically this bracket matches up perfectly to the profile and bolting pattern. Turned out great - see below - Note: the Zen is just loosely placed - I afterwards drilled and tapped for permanent mounting - will take photos onc eit<s ready for install. For now I put my OEM amp back until everything is ready;


----------



## OCD66 (Apr 2, 2017)

Tasty work from a fellow MKVII owner.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

OCD66 said:


> Tasty work from a fellow MKVII owner.


Thank you 🥰 doing my best and definitely a learning experience!

Wish I had a harness to match the OEM amplifier harness to plug into OEM speaker wires


----------



## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Someone on the mk7 forum got a fender plug and repinned it. I saw it a while ago but i think he gave a part number.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Someone on the mk7 forum got a fender plug and repinned it. I saw it a while ago but i think he gave a part number.


Oh man I definitely need that - will make my life sooo much easier! Any idea what the thread would be called? I’ll do a general search in google for fender amp harness plug


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I don't recall. I searched for fender amp harness and couldn't find it. It wasn't too long ago, maybe a couple months. I'll scan through the electronics section and post here if i find it.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

__





Fender Audio Wiring Harness Schematic? - 2019 VW GTI MK7.5


No ill tone taken. I was joking how you posted a couple days ago to get a wiring diagram then pow! zen tv interface. I can confirm on the mib 2 non nav, non fender speaker wire outs are not flat nor do the frequencies increase linearly. I just hooked up the audiocontrol dm810 that has input and...



www.golfmk7.com





Best i could do. I thought he gave part number but he didn't. Maybe pm him?


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks, yeah I found that thread and read through yesterday but he finished by simply de-pinning the OEM harness in the end and just connecting the wires he needed, so I may do the same.


----------



## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Trying to figure out where i was in my life and what i was trying to contribute to that thread. Gotta learn to shut up sometimes.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Trying to figure out where i was in my life and what i was trying to contribute to that thread. Gotta learn to shut up sometimes.


haha oh man don't be so hard on yourself! The forum is for sharing and bouncing ideas - coming up with the best solutions.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Got my 0-gauge main power wire passed this evening - took me less time than expected, about 1.5 hours. Thank god for the existing large grommet on the firewall. Just removed the battery, pushed the grommet inwards and snipped it with some cutters and the 0-gauge pushed through perfectly. Then re-installed battery and the bracket with fuse holder and made the final connections. Pretty happy with it. 











inside the cabin was not much more difficult - removed the door trim (front and rear door was one long piece) and carefully moved it up out of the way - 0-gauge wire JUST fit in between stock harness and edge of the channel (door gasket basically). Trim clipped back on perfectly. No room for zip ties but the trim was nice and tight so I don't see the need. 





Driver side front kick panel (next to foot):







front door edge trim;













towards the back:













Now, can anyone give me some insight on how to cleanly and safely run and secure the 0-gauge wire under the rear seat? Just worried about the seat sitting on top causing some sort of impingement - the seat is foam but has a round metal structure. Not sure how much clearance is under there. I could just be over-thinking it too. No room to run around the side of seat especially since it is 0-gauge.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looking good. Man that hood release had me angry for a solid 5 minutes until i googled how to get it undone.

As for your power to get back in the boot, i pulled the plastic trim by the seatbelt off. That nut on the bottom isn't quite hex head. The sill trim has to be off first. There's a little plastic nub at the top that slides towards the center of the car then to the front a smidge. The whole trim pulls to the center of the car. I think 3 metal tabs. You'll have access to the seatbelt bolt, which is a good ground point once sanded. It's a prick to get that trim back on without bending a clip. Make sure the middle clip is lined up while you get the plastic top bit in then pull towards the door. Should give good clicks when it's back in.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looking good. Man that hood release had me angry for a solid 5 minutes until i googled how to get it undone.

As for your power to get back in the boot, i pulled the plastic trim by the seatbelt off. That nut on the bottom isn't quite hex head. The sill trim has to be off first. There's a little plastic nub at the top that slides towards the center of the car then to the front a smidge. The whole trim pulls to the center of the car. I think 3 metal tabs. You'll have access to the seatbelt bolt, which is a good ground point once sanded. It's a prick to get that trim back on without bending a clip. Make sure the middle clip is lined up while you get the plastic top bit in then pull towards the door. Should give good clicks when it's back in.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Looking good. Man that hood release had me angry for a solid 5 minutes until i googled how to get it undone.
> 
> As for your power to get back in the boot, i pulled the plastic trim by the seatbelt off. That nut on the bottom isn't quite hex head. The sill trim has to be off first. There's a little plastic nub at the top that slides towards the center of the car then to the front a smidge. The whole trim pulls to the center of the car. I think 3 metal tabs. You'll have access to the seatbelt bolt, which is a good ground point once sanded. It's a prick to get that trim back on without bending a clip. Make sure the middle clip is lined up while you get the plastic top bit in then pull towards the door. Should give good clicks when it's back in.


I think I know what you are referring to - basically the trim on the sides of the seat between the door? If so I looked there and there doesn’t seem to be any place for the wire that size to comfortable go through? hence why I left it going through the center of seat for now. Got a photo? 
Looked up some good grounding points online as well and seems the center baby seat anchor point is a good spot that could work for me.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Sorry no photo. Also i have the brace across the back of mine which is a tunnel basically. I think you're flat back there. I ran mine behind the seatbelt then across the back of the anchors.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

No worries - I ended up just running it as far up as I could then cutting across the back of seat and up, this seems to be the only way to avoid impingement of wires when I put the seat back up and down. I actually also made a solid ground there as well and zip tied both ground and power wire together, And seems to avoid the metal cross beams under the seat so just foam kn top of the wires, should be more than fine. The insulation is so incredibly thick on these wires. I might add some tech flex as another layer of security as well.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Nice! I don't suppose you metered that ground just to be sure? 

I'm still trying to figure out my amp turn on issue. I really don't want a relay. The bit manual is suggesting chaining the amps. But something is amiss.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Nice! I don't suppose you metered that ground just to be sure?
> 
> I'm still trying to figure out my amp turn on issue. I really don't want a relay. The bit manual is suggesting chaining the amps. But something is amiss.


Oh but of course! 😁 The ohm reading on my multimeter when I touched the two probes was 0.3 ohms, and when I went between negative battery terminal (disconnected from battery) and that grounding spot, it was fluctuating between 0.3 and 0.4 ohms - doesn’t get much better than that! Yay unibodies! Lol


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Also, don’t be too worried about adding a relay it’s quite simple (and cheap) solution. Did you try unplugging one of the two amps with your DSP and then doing the same with the other, and did they each both turn on in those situations? If so it could just be that the two amps together are pulling too much amperage for your dsp to handle with their remote turn on.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Thank you for testing the ground. I knew you would have but i would feel bad if you overlooked it and had issues.

I have not had a chance to just test the clarion. I'm trying to find literature about how many amps they draw. The relay is the cheaper option. Again my electrical knowledge limits me in that I'm curious if 4ga ground is enough for everything. I'll try to test it tomorrow or Thursday.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Thank you for testing the ground. I knew you would have but i would feel bad if you overlooked it and had issues.
> 
> I have not had a chance to just test the clarion. I'm trying to find literature about how many amps they draw. The relay is the cheaper option. Again my electrical knowledge limits me in that I'm curious if 4ga ground is enough for everything. I'll try to test it tomorrow or Thursday.


to be honest lol, my previous job was troubleshooting hahah - worked in automation and we were regularly on call (still am actually even though I’ve changed positions )! But a relay is definitely easy enough to walk through on line - and the forums are for learning!!!

i need to find a clean way of running my optical cable from under the driver seat (Zen-V) to the trunk (DSP) I’m thinking to follow the same path as my power cable for this due to it being a little more fragile than my other copper wiring. Will have to pull up the door floor panels again but will also run my DSP remote wire at the same time. Why not Lol


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I can't wait for you to get everything installed. You're laying down great work and helping the rest of us along the way. I'm grateful for you.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I can't wait for you to get everything installed. You're laying down great work and helping the rest of us along the way. I'm grateful for you.


thanks, that means a lot!

SO CLOSE to finishing but still some items on the list. Went and picked up a few items I was missing last night - some flex tubing for my speaker wire runs, as well as longer bolts to secure the amp rack to OEM location. 

Today is my last day of work before the holidays, and I am hoping to spend most of the day tomorrow working on speaker install in the doors. I also need to pick up my SMD-DD1 from a friend who borrowed it almost a decade ago lol...need to set my gains properly. 
Lastly I will need to make the bracket to fit my DSP remote in the small cubby beside steering wheel, and run wiring to there. Then we will be in the 'Fire it up and troubleshoot' phase. My main worry is two of the amps being old, the Clarion the oldest - hoping none of the caps have dried out or anything that would cause any issues in performance.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Now, can anyone give me some insight on how to cleanly and safely run and secure the 0-gauge wire under the rear seat? Just worried about the seat sitting on top causing some sort of impingement - the seat is foam but has a round metal structure. Not sure how much clearance is under there. I could just be over-thinking it too. No room to run around the side of seat especially since it is 0-gauge.


i used techflex for protection and cld to hold it in place.

you could use split wire loom over the exposed points.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> i used techflex for protection and cld to hold it in place.
> 
> you could use split wire loom over the exposed points.


Very nice and clean! Currently using tech flex on several other sections of the wiring and actually thought about it for the bigger wires under the seat - I think I may get some to fit the zero gauge and use it for the under seat section. I really like this stuff, although it isn’t super cheap! Thanks for the tip and the photo!


----------



## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

Another option is an hose separators and then rivnyt m3 or m4 screws in to the floor









Amazon.com: EVIL ENERGY 8AN Hose Separator Clamp,1/2 Fuel Line Mounting Clamp,Fuel Hose Divider for Oil Gas Water Brake Line,4Pcs Aluminum Black : Automotive


Buy EVIL ENERGY 8AN Hose Separator Clamp,1/2 Fuel Line Mounting Clamp,Fuel Hose Divider for Oil Gas Water Brake Line,4Pcs Aluminum Black: Automotive - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



www.amazon.com


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

be careful w/ drilling holes for rivnuts, the fuel tank should be under the rear seat


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## pwnt by pat (Mar 13, 2006)

Just use a socket some tube slipped over the drill bit for a stop and you won't have any issue.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

definitely not going to go the drilling route - you never know how car manufacturers do things as every one is different. I definitely noticed that while removing the door panels in this car - very different than previous cars I've owned (much better built actually but tighter tolerances)

Thanks for the suggestions, I don't see any need to drill and river as the wires are secure - it<s more to give them some added protection with anyone sitting in the back. I will opt for the Tech flex option as I have to run to the store to get some terminal forks for front speakers, since I ran out. This should give them enough protection and wear resistance.


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

HAPPY HOLIDAYS EVERYONE! With some time off comes PROGRESS. yay.


Got my speaker wire bundles all set up - decided to go 8ft which should give me 1-2 feet of extra just in case - only have to get from trunk to under driver seat. Did each pair in tech flex with a different color shrink wrap so I could distinguish each pair;







I also terminated the amplifier side of those bundles (the 4-channel is ferrules and the smaller 2-channel has fork terminals) but did not snap a photo. I have yet to run these wires in the car. Will be one of the last things I do.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Next were the doors - got both rear doors done.



Did decent coverage on the sound dampening. A bit more on the inner door skin, and one piece on the oter door skin which will probably be less prone to rattle due to all the curves of the sheet metal. 



The doors are quite solid and tolerance is good. One thing to like about these german cars. 



First had to drill out rivets of OEM speaker. Then made the hole a little bigger and used M5 threaded riv-nuts in the holes. Now I can screw any speaker using an M5 machine screw - including OEM speakers if and when I return to stock.



The rear fill speakers I bought actually fit almost perfectly to OEM holes so I used the bolts to attach them as well as the bracket that I made out of HPDE. Notice how I also made a small groove for speaker wires to pass through. I used the FAST ring backing to seal the HPDE bracket on the sheet metal.



Used fast rings although it was difficult to find a spot to stick them given that there was a cross bar right behind the speaker, so I just did my best to trim and stick them around/on top of it. 





Photos of left door:


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Then proceeded to passenger side rear door the next day;


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Currently finishing up the front door - went a bit heavier on the sound dampening to ensure good response from the speakers with minimal vibrations. Inner door skin was a PITA to get my hands in there and adhere the stuff!











































On another note, Volkswagen doors are pretty decently soundproofed from the factory - see below the inner door card, it actually has a nice piece of thick carpet material that blocks some noise/stops any rattling of door card against sheet metal;










I'll probably put just a little mass damping on the door card itself under the foam (direct on plastic) but more around the speaker. The rest looks good.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

finally I made the two front door brackets for front speaker. Since they are only 5-1/4, I ended up using M5 bolts with nuts in reverse to secure them, and counter-sunk the bolt heads to make it nice and clean. Used speaker gasket tape between the HPDE bracket and speaker for a good seal. Will do the same between the bracket and sheet metal. 




























































Now the speakers will simply bolt into the door super easily. Just missing fork terminals to attach speaker wires to the speaker - BACK TO THE ELECTRONICS STORE!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Great progress!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

The door cards seem to be problematic for rattles imo. Vw plastic welds all these pieces together and they are prone to vibration. If you're able to tap around these seams and strategically stuff some foam to fill the small void it will help. You may have to take them off again once you power it up if you still have issues. The mirror and overhead console are jerks too. I ended up forcing some fine thread around the mirror where the front and back of the plastic housing meets.


----------



## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

once i got my vw doors solid, the only rattling pieces were the window motor assembly. best thing i did was remove midbasses from the doors


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Nice. Ideally the midbasses would be in kick panels but I’m far from that level of build right now. Apparently the better door panels for midbass are actually Volkswagen and Audi since they’re better sealed. At least that’s what Peter from PSSound was saying on one of his YouTube videos, but he always says the ideal place for mid bass is outside of the door. Not sure about your VW but my door plastics seem quite solid.
Id love to do a three way setup with midbass in kicks and midrange/tweet in custom pods, but one step at a time, next car!


----------



## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

i've got a mk6 gti. indeed it's a pretty solid platform. you can always get spare interior plastics and door panels. just keep an eye on them in the forums.

only need spares when you're going back to stock 










all the pretty+hard work was done by jtaudioacc.com


----------



## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> i've got a mk6 gti. indeed it's a pretty solid platform. you can always get spare interior plastics and door panels. just keep an eye on them in the forums.
> 
> only need spares when you're going back to stock
> 
> ...


Beautiful! That’s the kind of build I would strive for. I figure I may eventually grab some new OEM pillars and chop them up to make some pillar pods. I like where your pods are actually, not in the pillars but in the door corner piece. Very clean! Bet it sounds amazing.


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## bertholomey (Dec 27, 2007)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Beautiful! That’s the kind of build I would strive for. I figure I may eventually grab some new OEM pillars and chop them up to make some poplar pods. I like where your pods are actually, not in the pillars but in the door corner piece. Very clean! Bet it sounds amazing.


It does sound amazing. I got a demo at Finals a couple years ago - incredible! Great install, top shelf equipment, and an amazing tune that Nick did himself - one of my favorite cars at Finals! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

OneFastCanuck said:


> I like where your pods are actually, not in the pillars but in the door corner piece. Very clean! Bet it sounds amazing.


thanks. sail pods have their advantages and disadvantages, like everything in car audio. 

and JT does awesome work


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## JP Fabrication (Feb 20, 2008)

nadams5755 said:


> thanks. sail pods have their advantages and disadvantages, like everything in car audio.
> 
> and JT does awesome work


Stinger Heigh10. Are you using the optical out?


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

yeah, to a ps8-pro. also analog-out to a minidsp 2x4 for rearfill.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

very cool guys!

and HAPPY HOLIDAYS to all - some New Years eve updates - photo dump incoming!


Anyways, got all 4 doors completed - Sound deadened inner and outer door skin, custom HPDE brackets and fast rings. Deadened the plastic door card on the front doors as well for good measure.


Also finished swapping tweeters in A-pillars. It was a journey to remove the first one - found a good guide online but still struggled a bit on the first one. Once I found an optimal way, the second one was off within minutes (next day). Fabbed up some ABS plastic brackets that lined up with OEM speaker hole, hot glued it to the back of A-pillar. New tweeters were press-fit into that bracket and wires secured with zip tie.


Tried everything with just the OEM amp and it all worked wonderfully, tested the polarity of all speakers and all good. 



One weird thing, the tweeters do a weird triple click when I turn the car on. Not sure what that is - maybe due to different impedance than OEM speakers and amp is doing some kind of check? I hope this issue doesn't carry over to the new system. 



Another thing is I am not sure if the 20uF capacitor I soldered onto positive side of tweeters was bipolar or not - there was a + sign that seemed to be more on one side but it wasn't clear at all. So I put that side away from tweeter (if that makes sense) since I figure current should flow into + and out - side even if on the positive wire. 


Front door and speakers install;


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

some photo's of my tweeters and the brackets installed;


































































Comparison between old and new tweeter - silk dome (old) versus titanium dome (new) - funny enough the new tweeter is quite a bit smaller. Just shows size doesn't matter


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

This morning, finished up passenger side tweeter (easier than the first!) and got to work on finishing up my subwoofer box. Added the threaded inserts for the subs, then added the carpeting. Keep in mind, the carpeting is more to protect the interior and make a nice tight fit as well - there will be a beauty panel on top of this sub box to finish things off nicely.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Thought I would finish up the car today and get some sound but boy was I wrong! Installing the Zen-V and running speaker wires I made to the driver seat took longer than expected. Took the front seat out to make things easier. Here is where I stopped for the day;





















speaker wires and power for zen-V ran under the rear seat;


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

I have to say, I always forget how good and clear aftermarket speakers sound - even when I was testing off the factory amp!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Getting close. Hopefully that click is what you said. I recall some vcds settings about speaker test signals so i think you're correct. One thing i found with the doors is the window control switch rattles, at least in my gsw.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Getting close. Hopefully that click is what you said. I recall some vcds settings about speaker test signals so i think you're correct. One thing i found with the doors is the window control switch rattles, at least in my gsw.


good to know, hopefully in my case there won’t be too much rattle and the sound dampening should help some.
I’m at the home stretch - ran the wire for the DSP remote and aux extension while I had the door sill panel off. Installed lower amp rack permanently and finished wiring main power and ground to it. Put back all panels. Next is plugging in the speaker wires to the OEM harness under the driver seat and putting driver seat back in. I can’t seem to get the wires out of the OEM amplifier harness through the release hole. Tried a sewing needle from wife’s kit and pushed into the release ports and the sewing needle bent. Wtf. If I can’t get it I’ll be temporarily connecting the wires into OEM harness to get everything working and see if I can’t order a specialized tool that fits and is more rigid.
Once my seat is back on, just need to connect the wiring to top amplifier rack and put sub box in and ready to fire her up. Hopefully today, possibly tomorrow morning.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

FINALLY got to the point where I flipped the power on (well, put the fuses in the fuse holder under the hood).



MOSTLY GOOD! but would not be a project without issues. One pretty minor issue and the other most likely major but I had expected trouble.



First issue is my remote turn-on circuitry is not working. THe Zen-V works GREAT and turns on my Zapco. But the relay isn<t doing its job to turn everything else on. Not sure if it is the zapco not sending out a signal or if it is a bad relay. Anyways for basic setup and to get some sound, I bypassed the remote turn on directly and went from my small fuse bloxk power to the remote turn on terminals so constant power while I worked.



That brings me to second problem. 4-channel and 2-channel amp fired up no problem. Mono amp no dice.



So I looked around, checked fuses and lo and behold they were blown (two 80A on the terminal block in trunk)



I replaced one and it blew again right away. 



I THINK the amp is toast. I had a feeling it may give me problems but I don't see how it would have a short circuit inside as when I took it out of my last vehicle it was working fine, I then put it in storage in a closed container. 



Anybody have any ideas for testing before I bite the bullet and start looking at new amps? Really liked this amp. I am hoping that there are still some sales on... Any suggestions on good clean mono amps available in Canada that won't destroy my budget? subs are 400W RMS a piece and they're wired for 2 ohms, shouldn't be too hard to find something that fits the bill.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

My only suggestion would be to double check your wiring. I had remote and ground mixed up and it caused a panic for a few days. You have a bunch of connections, hopefully one is just crossed.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Indeed there was a connection mistake! My ground and power were swapped! Did a quick switch and all good. Didn’t have time to test or set gains - will have to do that tomorrow. Need to remake the ground wire since it’s a rad too short now.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I'm so happy for you that was a simple fix. I look forward to tomorrow's update!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Both problems from yesterday were fixed once I swapped over the positive and negative - relay seems to now be doing its job and turning on all amps. Must have been affected by the positive/negative swap.



Now I have two other issues I am dealing with.



First is, the NAVTV zen-V seems to have retained my head unit EQ settings from before I swapped it over. Every time I put it back flat, and turn off car, when I turn it on again, EQ settings are back to old settings. Annoying since I can't really tune (mostly due to second problem)



Problem 2 is my car keeps telling me my battery is dead and after 20 seconds shuts down the infotainment. I have the car on a charger and it made it last a little longer but still shuts down the infotainment after 2-3 minutes and tells me 12v battery low. Weird because I just had my car in for a full inspection 2 months ago and battery checked out good. I know VW batteries are pure garbage, and I figured the pos-neg swap on mono amp might have drained the battery (have not started the car in a few days either due to it being in the garage). 



Other question - what is the best way to tune with SMD DD-1? I no longer have the disc as the friend who borrowed it like 7 years ago (and just gave it back last week FINALLY!) must still have it. I found some test tones on spotify but not sure if that will be optimal, or if I should just download the SMD tracks from their site and put it on a USB and play from there. I will be using apple carplay with spotify 90% of the time.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Maybe the navtv will retain settings once your battery is sorted. Not sure if you're doing this or not, but i wouldn't try to tune with the car not running. If that's the stock battery, it might be good for 3 years knowing vw. I know with the gti, you can get a bigger battery to fit in there. I forget the group number but the tray is big enough for 1 or 2 sizes bigger. You could have a parasitic draw somewhere. Not sure how to test that and locate it. As for the smd tones, I'd put them on whatever source you're using because all sources are different levels.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

the car will shut off accessories to reserve battery power for starting. you'll see other things won't power up, like dome lights when you open the door.

on my car, i don't begin to see that behavior until i begin to drop below like 12.1v.

to me it seems like your battery's reserve capacity's diminished? i remember having my factory battery do the same thing but the dealer also showed the battery healthy.

i'm able to keep my mk6 gti in accessory mode (enough to power up the radio) and on a 7a psu/charger (ctek 7002) for a couple hours. with the stereo off, it'll hang around 12.7v. stereo on, 12.4-12.5v. when it drops to 12.3v i'll get out the 45a psu or stop for the day.

maybe tolerances are tighter on newer vws now.

one of my buddies turns his hazards on his 370z to prevent his radio from going to sleep after 15 minutes (also needed for flashing the PCM)


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> the car will shut off accessories to reserve battery power for starting. you'll see other things won't power up, like dome lights when you open the door.
> 
> on my car, i don't begin to see that behavior until i begin to drop below like 12.1v.
> 
> ...


could be indeed, battery is 4 years old so maybe it is starting to show its age. Either way, turned car on for a bit with garage open to do some initial tuning and the warning went away, so maybe it sorted itself out, because after I turned off the car I was playing music for at least 10 minutes with no shut offs. Hopefully it will go away permanently. I have other errors but I think (I really hope at least) that it's just the JB4 since I removed negative terminal and have not driven the car yet - usually once I drive they go away.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

So, I was finally able to update the NavTV Zen-V using their cable as well as my Surface tablet. It fixed my problem with the head unit equalizer - all set to zero (flat) now.



Used spotify tones along with SMD-DD1 distortion detector to set all my gains on the 4-channel and 2-channel speaker ampsusing 1khz test tone at 0db. Gain was a little less than half for all, more or less.



For the sub amp, I found it weird, because at max volume on the head unit, I turned the gain up to max, the DD-1 was showing that it detected the 40HZ signal but NO CLIPPING! Am I to assume that the signal is clean and amp gain is optimal even at full? I know this amp is a pretty good one made by a renound electrical engineer so maybe it is true. Anyways, I have detected no clipping in the subs during my initial setup of DSP.



I then set up the DSP and MAN is this thing powerful! I just set up some basic EQ points for all speakers, measured to each speaker and did the time alignment calculation (had to double check the manual again for this as it was not super clear in the software how to do it right).



I am astonished on how clear the sound is - my wife sat with me in the car and we turned it up, you only realize how clear and loud it is when you try to speak and can't hear yourself.



Still need to do proper tuning with the UMIK-1 and REW to get things dialed in, and I am pretty sure the subs need some breaking in, but as it stands I am very happy with the initial sound.



Here are my basic crossover settings so far, feel free to shoot some tips/advice if you see anything - The only thing I can't figure out, is that I keep trying to set the curves to 24dB slopes, but after I download to DSP, it doesn't retain that and they all get set back to 12dB. I'll have to read the manual again and see if there is something I have to do or if this is a glitch.


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## Black Rain (Feb 27, 2011)

OneFastCanuck said:


> So, I was finally able to update the NavTV Zen-V using their cable as well as my Surface tablet. It fixed my problem with the head unit equalizer - all set to zero (flat) now.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I assume you are referring to the sub xover slope? Did you save any changes before loading to DSP? Stupid question but got to ask....

Also, curious why you are using a ZenV, when it seems like you didn't need it?

PS....Awesome build so far. Definitely following...

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Black Rain said:


> I assume you are referring to the sub xover slope? Did you save any changes before loading to DSP? Stupid question but got to ask....
> 
> Also, curious why you are using a ZenV, when it seems like you didn't need it?
> 
> ...


thank you for the kind words!

no all the crossover slopes default back to 12dB, the photo shows them how I set them but when I download then upload OR restart the Zapco program, all of crossover slopes are back to 12dB.

as for the zen-V, I did need it since I have the fender system. Otherwise I’d have to re-code My radio to eliminate fender amp (bypass) then take the high level outputs from OEM radio and input to DSP high level input. According to another member, it’s far from a linear response and so you would have to use the DSP remote for volume. This also means steering wheel volume is useless too. I have to say that the optical signal from the zen-V is excellent. Definitely the way to go. Also easy plug-and-play versus the alternative.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

With the audison software there's basic mode and expert mode. Expert gives you so many more options. Perhaps the zen has a similar drop down menu? Maybe since your sub is 12db, it wants to make everything 12db? If there's no way around it, I'd suggest making everything 12db. Then raise your tweet to 4k and lower your front mid to 2k ish. Should still give decent overlap without too much grief. I'm sure REW will show you what needs to be done for your specific environment.

When i measured my mk7 gti with base audio, nothing clipped at any level. Some frequencies just stopped increasing voltage at certain points while others continued to rise.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Yes I definitely need to get REW going and see what’s really happening as I’m only using my ears right now.
No expert mode - everything else works, it’s really just the crossovers. I also had the subs to 24db I just forgot to put them in that photo instance. Reading audio frog guide to crossovers I thought he had suggested 24db slope as most ideal for everything, I’ll give it another read anyways.


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## DaveG (Jul 24, 2019)

There’s also a -5dB & a -10dB tone @ 40hz available at SMD if you feel it’s down on sub.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

DaveG said:


> There’s also a -5dB & a -10dB tone @ 40hz available at SMD if you feel it’s down on sub.


for tuning purposes, wouldn't the best one to use be the 0dB tone? Wouldn't the -5dB and -10dB be lower in overall output at the reference volume (in my case 100% volume on the head unit)?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Also, to clean up the wiring under my seat, make it really plug-and-play and looking like OEM under there, I ordered the Male version of the amplifier plug so I can solder my speaker wires to it from the amp. Got the order info from another member on here (*01LSi) *and hoping that it comes in the next week or two so I can finalize those connections before I start driving around too much. 

Here is the info:

*TE Connectivity part number 1534531-1 TAB HEADER ASSY 38P *
AMP MCP Connector System, PCB Mount Header, Horizontal, Wire-to-Board, 38 Position, .197in [2.54mm / 4.2mm / 5.5mm] Centerline, Fully Shrouded








1534531-1 : AMP MCP Connector System Automotive Headers


Get 1534531-1 AMP MCP Connector System Automotive Headers specs, pricing, inventory availability, and more from TE Connectivity. Get a sample or request a quote.




www.te.com


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I'm surprised that connector is so cheap. That's awesome. I read most of that audio frog crossover pdf. From what i gather, 24db is best overall for speaker protection, phase issues etc. It just seems so steep. I can't bring myself to cross my sub at 60hz with the mids at 80. I'll try it but am skeptical.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I'm surprised that connector is so cheap. That's awesome. I read most of that audio frog crossover pdf. From what i gather, 24db is best overall for speaker protection, phase issues etc. It just seems so steep. I can't bring myself to cross my sub at 60hz with the mids at 80. I'll try it but am skeptical.


agreed - I think some experimentation is in order! I will have to make a few different presets to compare. Nice thing about the DSP is there are so many presets! 8 or 10 I believe. Remote is all wired up and working as well, I just have to mount it in the cubby which requires me to make a custom fitted plate - later this week


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

the crossover scheme works well, there’s usually enough cabin gain to allow it to work, plus it better plants the sound up front.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> the crossover scheme works well, there’s usually enough cabin gain to allow it to work, plus it better plants the sound up front.


which scheme are you referring to?


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

the sub crossover scheme in andy's tuning guide


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> the sub crossover scheme in andy's tuning guide


thanks for clarification - was about to re-read his guide now that I am into the tuning phase. Already read through it once a few months ago, I'll give it a proper read through while I go through tuning of each speaker set.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Another small update to share - got to working on the DSP remote, mounting it in a nice stealth location that was otherwise unused. Not perfect but I am pretty happy with the results. This was an imperfect shape to copy so I did my best.


Started with a cardboard template, then transferred over to ABS plastic, straightened out the sides with a straight piece of MDF to get a nicer finish and rounded top corners.



























Did a 1/8" chamfer all around the front side to ease wrapping it in carpet.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Then I drilled and tapped two mounting holes for the fuse holder and installed it in the engine bay - Although it isn't perfect, I am pretty happy with the look - not too in your face but clean, at least in my opinion!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dang you don’t happen to have another one of these lying around I can buy? My fuse holder currently sits between the battery and the unit to the side of it.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Adurm said:


> Trying to figure out where i was in my life and what i was trying to contribute to that thread. Gotta learn to shut up sometimes.


Yo all love bro! I enjoyed talking with you back and forth. There’s not a lot of dialogue on our vehicle and I appreciated it. I was surprised to learn that there still was little info still on the GTI when I was looking the last couple years. 

I just saw some random car installer website copy pasting my wiring diagram verbatim on their site without mentioning me lol. Which is fine just unexpected from a formal installer with a website.

I previously had a Acura TLX and I was almost the only one discussing and figuring out how to mod the audio system.

Ive gotten very very sick for a few years and medical bills out of pocket skyrocketed so my progress halted. So frustrated. The last step for me was just needing someone to fab some a pillars for the speakers I already bought , and find the right fabric, and tune it myself with what’s already installed, and I can finally be done


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Man I so want custom pillars with mods and tweets. Next car. These A pillars are a nightmare to fit - even Peter from PSSound (YouTube) did a 2022 mk8 VW GTI and was saying they were so difficult to build and fit - I find their angle to be quite aggressive and they’re so annoying to fit back into place to verify for clearance.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

01LSi said:


> Dang you don’t happen to have another one of these lying around I can buy? My fuse holder currently sits between the battery and the unit to the side of it.


No  I used up my ABs with this one. Only had smaller pieces left. Not super difficult to make though, used my router and torch


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## Willbo (Mar 23, 2014)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Man I so want custom pillars with mods and tweets. Next car. These A pillars are a nightmare to fit - even Peter from PSSound (YouTube) did a 2022 mk8 VW GTI and was saying they were so difficult to build and fit - I find their angle to be quite aggressive and they’re so annoying to fit back into place to verify for clearance.


Look up 2018 gti mk 7.5 a pillar speakers and there is a shop that used the little window to incorporate some GB25s and GB10s. It's pretty slick. My first attempt ended up with everything at weird angles. My second attempt used a teardrop template and came out pretty nice. Good luck!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Willbo said:


> Look up 2018 gti mk 7.5 a pillar speakers and there is a shop that used the little window to incorporate some GB25s and GB10s. It's pretty slick. My first attempt ended up with everything at weird angles. My second attempt used a teardrop template and came out pretty nice. Good luck!


very nice! Funny because when I started removing the first A-pillar, and was having trouble initially, I thought to myself 'that little useless window is an excellent spot for a pod, maybe I should just throw the tweeter in there so it is more on axis' - but it would have been quite a lot more work. I have tackled MANY build obstacles with this build and achieved many personal goals, which I am very happy about, learning some new skills and upping my install game - my next challenge will be pillar pods for a 3-way setup, however this will most likely be in the next vehicle, since I only plan to own this one for 3 more years max and I have a baby incoming in 2 months so no more personal time for projects for a while 

Not only will I be trying pillar pods next build, but I will also attempt woofers outside of the doors (if possible) in their own pods (footwell corners most likely). Following PSSound on youtube has really inspired me to push myself towards more professional builds and higher quality SQ systems. This would be the next stage in my mobile audio journey.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

i've pulled the pillars in my mk6 golf, definitely seems like they installed the windshield last when assembling the car. i could see removal/installation would be much easier without the windshield.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> i've pulled the pillars in my mk6 golf, definitely seems like they installed the windshield last when assembling the car. i could see removal/installation would be much easier without the windshield.


100%


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

FINALLY found a work-around for my DSP issue - although I think it is a major glitch in the processor GUI, unfortunately. Looks like not a ton of people are running the DSP-V8 original (more seem to be on the V8 II which has an updated GUI)

I had to basically connect to the DSP, delete all presets, then go to "factory settings" which seemed to do something funky to the DSP. I then exited the GUI on my tablet, shut off the car to power down everything, then re-connected and re-started inputting all my settings from scratch (I had a photo of course) and wrote it to the DSP and BOOM it worked. I really hope I don<t have to do this each time I want to change the crossover points as it is a pain BUT after measuring with REW I assume I would get a better final idea of where the drivers perform well and do one final adjustment on the crossover points, so not a deal breaker. 

My crossover slopes all set to 24dB now, tweets at 3000 Hz up, mids at 80-3000 Hz - rears full range from 100hz up (they have built in crossovers), and subs at 80hz low pass. 

Now I have a base setup I need to take the time to start measuring and tuning. Hopefully this weekend - I assume it's a good couple of hours job to get a basic tune in there. I will need to get some renos done on our upstairs unit first, so I may have to wait a week or two to tune this. At least I can listen though!

I don't seem to be getting much midbass from the door drivers; I tried just playing them on their own and observed this - not sure if it's just me or because they're small 5-1/4 and placement is in the doors which is imperfect. They're just not as punchy as I would have thought. . If I put them down to 60HZ crossover hey are a little more punchy, but their specs say 58hZ minimum frequency response and so I don't want to go too close and push them too much. 

I may have to re-do the gains on the amps because the DSP master volume was previously at max, but in reality it is supposed to be set to 0dB (third tick from max) which gives me more headroom at my head unit's max volume. It's pretty loud to begin with, but I have a feeling I will get used to it quick and when I am driving on highway I may want a little more - we shall see. I haven<t tried it much over half volume. 

Tried without the rears and I can confirm they do add something even if at lower volume than the rest - if gives a kind of larger image of sound stage - I like it but I really need to do more research, reading and watch some videos on how to optimally tune rear fill to have the greatest effect in my system.


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## SiW80 (Mar 13, 2019)

I run 5.25” up front and found crossing higher gives more punch and as I don’t expect them to play low I prefer the punch. 

I used 125Hz LR24 high pass. 

Then I used the sub to bring back the low end. 

I had to turn down the tweeters (2 way) to balance it - currently at -11db on the tweeters. 

Just need to play around with it 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SiW80 said:


> I run 5.25” up front and found crossing higher gives more punch and as I don’t expect them to play low I prefer the punch.
> 
> I used 125Hz LR24 high pass.
> 
> ...


Hey thanks For sharing that info!
I feel like my tweeters definitely need to be turned down some as they do play pretty loud in comparison. I’ll definitely play around with it. Love the overall clarity and intensity of the system as a whole though! Definitely in the right track.

i think I will try something similar to your settings as another preset and see how I prefer it. Just from listening, these subs definitely seem to Peak higher and don’t get super low (low profile) but sound really full and punchy, quite dynamic.
I really need to get an RTA measurement going to see exactly what the system is doing!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SiW80 said:


> I run 5.25” up front and found crossing higher gives more punch and as I don’t expect them to play low I prefer the punch.
> 
> I used 125Hz LR24 high pass.
> 
> ...


forgot to ask, was curious what your sub is crossed over at?


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## SiW80 (Mar 13, 2019)

OneFastCanuck said:


> forgot to ask, was curious what your sub is crossed over at?


Sub is at 96Hz LR24 low pass. It’s an 8” Alpine active sub so doesn’t drop real low but fine for most music. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I know you dropped the doors to 60hz but maybe do 12db 80hz. Should be safe and might give you a little oomph. I don't know if that would force the low pass into 12db as well though.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I know you dropped the doors to 60hz but maybe do 12db 80hz. Should be safe and might give you a little oomph. I don't know if that would force the low pass into 12db as well though.


I am at 80hz currently as the 60hz would be too close to their minimum and I don’t want any beaming at higher volume. I mean, they can take a little more power than my amp can give so maybe I’m not pushing them hard enough too! Lol


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SiW80 said:


> Sub is at 96Hz LR24 low pass. It’s an 8” Alpine active sub so doesn’t drop real low but fine for most music.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Aah makes sense. I’m running two pioneer Z10LS4 shallow mount (which nobody else seems to own) so they don’t seem to play too low either (not much under 30hz from the sounds of it) but they are very punchy.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I can't wait for you to get it all dialed in. You put in so much work and it's going to pay off. REW will show you the way (i hope). I expect to dive into it as well. I have too much of a scientific brain not to. Execution on the other hand....ehh.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I can't wait for you to get it all dialed in. You put in so much work and it's going to pay off. REW will show you the way (i hope). I expect to dive into it as well. I have too much of a scientific brain not to. Execution on the other hand....ehh.



definitely soon, within the next weekend or two - right now I am reading up on REW (just downloaded to my laptop and tablet) - the only thing is I find the instructions are not SUPER intuitive for a first-timer. I have a few very basic procedural questions such as - do we sit outside the car while tuning? In the passenger seat or back seat? All this would affect the reading (less so sitting in back seat I guess) but then if you sit outside the vehicle, you'll have to run the wire outside to the computer. I assume slightly lowering the window is preferable to leaving the door slightly ajar.


Also if I run the REQ tones through the DSP AUX input, I assume that would be fine because we are just taking measurements of each speaker characteristics themselves with sample noises rather than from a specific source (ie spotify etc.) so it shouldn't make much of a difference. It also states to remove all crossover settings to do the tests, do I assume this is also in the DSP, and then I will have to ensure that in REW, for tweeters measurement, the test tones don't go below Fs (ie 1350hZ)? Simple questions to help me get started, but the process itself seems straightforward enough, just time consuming!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

..or am I just better to skip the REW test tones/filters portion (as per the REW instruction page) and go with playing plain old pink noise from REW in each speaker individually, then in pairs, then check the summation, and manually tune from the DSP software at each step where I see dips and peaks? This is what I thought to have understood from most tuners (ie youtube etc.) but I never see them go through the actual process, only showing the before and after correction curves.


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## bertholomey (Dec 27, 2007)

I had the same reaction when I first considered using REW.....reading through all the stuff on the site didn’t make any sense. 

When you get good with REW, using it for frequency response and auto EQ, you find out that you only use a few things, and it is pretty simple. 

I have always used correlated pink noise played through my primary source. 

I set a consistent volume on the output so I always get a fairly consistent output on the graphs - makes it easier to compare results. 

There are some general view settings in the recording screen that is easy to duplicate from someone’s screenshot. 

It is pretty straightforward to record an all speakers, all one side, pairs of drivers, single driver. Get the pink noise going, hit the red button in the top right, move the mic around the head in whatever fashion you like, then hit the Save button to capture the response. 

Go to the output screen to see the result - hit the ‘All SPL’ tab (going from memory) - and you should see what you measured. 

On the left hand side, you can see an entry for each measured result - you can rename, change colors of the tracing, and save the result to your computer. 

At the bottom of the screen, you can pick the tracings to be displayed. 

I typically start with left tweeter, right tweeter, mids, mid bass, sub, all left side, all right side, all speakers. Then I go to the view screen - name everything, save everything, then choose what to view so I can start to decide on what changes need to happen. 

You can also pull in target curves as well to evaluate how your measured response lines up (or doesn’t) with a curve that lines up with your preferred sound. 

That is all I have from memory. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

bertholomey said:


> I had the same reaction when I first considered using REW.....reading through all the stuff on the site didn’t make any sense.
> 
> When you get good with REW, using it for frequency response and auto EQ, you find out that you only use a few things, and it is pretty simple.
> 
> ...


awesome thanks!

Opened up REW and had a look around, it’s a pretty awesome software. Noticed It has built in pink noise generator as well and you can modify what frequency ranges you want it to play. Ill probably go that route for measuring response of each speaker then each pair, and then summing all, using the aux input from my speaker directly to dsp.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Not to thread jack but if you tuned by ear or some other method first, did you change a lot after using REW?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Not to thread jack but if you tuned by ear or some other method first, did you change a lot after using REW?


I<m pretty confident that even if you are a pro installer, there would be a lot of peaks and valleys to fix, even if the placement and install were very good. Just looking at PSSound's tuning youtube vids of several of the cars he has done, he shows the before and after and a LOT of changes were made, even if minor, to get a proper response. I would say tuning is more important than getting higher quality speakers, as you could tune a really cheap speaker system (with good install) and get pretty amazing sound from it.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

It's settled, i have to buy a mic and do REW. Once i finish the build. So much for being done at xmas. Hoping for end of January now. 

It's interesting what you said about tuning and cheap speakers. I would agree with that. Dsp vs no dsp on some infinity kappa was night and day. They weren't bad speakers but really came alive once off the passive network.


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## SWRocket (Jul 23, 2010)

If you're following Andy's tuning guide, then the mic goes in the car and you go outside the car. You would have to crack the window for the USB cable. I'm not sure how much the cracked window effects the higher frequency measurements, but I do know in my car there is a bit more bass when the window is cracked open...


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SWRocket said:


> If you're following Andy's tuning guide, then the mic goes in the car and you go outside the car. You would have to crack the window for the USB cable. I'm not sure how much the cracked window effects the higher frequency measurements, but I do know in my car there is a bit more bass when the window is cracked open...


cool, yes I am currently following Andy's (audiofrog) guide to tuning. Well reading through it many times - have yet to begin the actual tuning phase.


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## SWRocket (Jul 23, 2010)

I should add that if you were only tuning front speakers and sub, you could sit in the back seat. But because you have rear speakers to tune, you'll need to be outside.
Unfortunately, in my car I can't sit in the back seat lol


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SWRocket said:


> I should add that if you were only tuning front speakers and sub, you could sit in the back seat. But because you have rear speakers to tune, you'll need to be outside.
> Unfortunately, in my car I can't sit in the back seat lol


haha thanks

As for my rear fill, I really wanted to try differential rear fill, but after looking into it, looks like my DSP is incapable of doing so. I still feel that the rears add something positive between when I mute and unmute them, but probably not optimal in terms of staging. Live and learn for the next build! I will be trying to set them crossed around 250hZ to 5000 Hz (as people do with differential rear fill) and see if that gives a more desired effect, I just can't give each speaker the 50% left and 50% right signals.


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## SWRocket (Jul 23, 2010)

In a post I can't find, Andy suggested that if you can't do differential, you can just delay and tune them as you would any speaker, and then lower their level until it sounds as well as it can.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SWRocket said:


> In a post I can't find, Andy suggested that if you can't do differential, you can just delay and tune them as you would any speaker, and then lower their level until it sounds as well as it can.


excellent - I tried searching for a response like that but very hard to find without people putting their two cents in about differential rear fill and how it SHOULD be set up. Will proceed like that. Right now they are crossed around 100dB but I may go higher to avoid having issues with my fronts.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Update: I have to add a post about CHECK - DOUBLE CHECK and TRIPLE CHECK all your settings when you think there is an issue somewhere. Despite being very detail-oriented, with so many factors in a build, including excitement to get it working, it's easy to forger small things. 

I hadn't mentioned this previously in the thread, but I always felt like my subwoofers were not performing as they should. They had amazing punch, but no low end. My gut told me something was off, and it can't just be due to them being low-profile subs, since I had a single low-profile 12 inch before in a box I built and it seemed to get lower.

I re-verified my amp crossover settings. I had put both subsonic and x-over filter to MAX, thinking that would leave them fully open so that the DSP would be the only one to do its thing.

Well, what I didn't realize is that I had the sub-sonic filter set the wrong way - was set at 80Hz when it should have been closer to the minimum (which is 10Hz) - just for added safety, I set it around the quarter turn mark which is 20Hz - i know these subs won't play under that. 

WOW did my music come to life...rap songs sound as they should. Too much so - I will have to cut the subs a bit.

Since I played with the filter settings, I will now go back and re-set the gain using my SMD-DD1 at head unit max volume, I have a feeling that I will detect some distortion at higher volume of gain now.


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## bbfoto (Aug 28, 2005)

SWRocket said:


> In a post I can't find, Andy suggested that if you can't do differential, you can just delay and tune them as you would any speaker, and then lower their level until it sounds as well as it can.





OneFastCanuck said:


> excellent - I tried searching for a response like that but very hard to find without people putting their two cents in about differential rear fill and how it SHOULD be set up. Will proceed like that. Right now they are crossed around 100dB but I may go higher to avoid having issues with my fronts.











Rear Differential Question


If an L-R signal is implemented in the rear speakers, shouldn’t a mono signal (correlated pink noise, for example) be completely silent through them? I muted everything but the rear, played a correlated pink noise track- and to my surprise they still play. is there something that i’m missing...




www.diymobileaudio.com


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

bbfoto said:


> Rear Differential Question
> 
> 
> If an L-R signal is implemented in the rear speakers, shouldn’t a mono signal (correlated pink noise, for example) be completely silent through them? I muted everything but the rear, played a correlated pink noise track- and to my surprise they still play. is there something that i’m missing...
> ...


excellent thanks!


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## Vincie (Dec 27, 2021)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Went with Noico - did much research, the only slightly better option would have probably been SecondSkin and it is literally 8 times the price to get it here - there is no way it is close to 8x the performance. I liked working with the Noico. Also did not notice any smell. Went on easy enough and cut nicely. I remember 10+ years ago using Fatmat - that stuff was not a treat! smelly as hell too since they used an asphalt base.
> 
> Used 4 sheets in the trunk and have 5 left - probably will order another half pack (4-5 more sheets) since I would like to go heavy on the front doors, and light on rear doors. Also not sure if I will do the rear hatch yet, but probably do one piece in there.


I used noico in my 2018 accord, worked really well and not expensive.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

small update: got my amplifier OEM male plug delivered today - will need to take some time to transfer the old plugs to this new one, solder and shrink wrap the connections. Nice thing is the pins on the back are easy to bend so I can make them straight and then trim to connect. I’ll be shrink wrapping the 12V power and ground to ensure they don’t mess with anything if the plug shifts under the seat while driving.



















tomorrow is TUNING DAY! Hoping I can get it done in a few hours (half day) but as it is my first real tune I’ll be taking my time. Will document and let everyone know how it goes!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I can't find the time to read all the stuff about REW. there's so much. I need the "do this, this and this" version. Maybe if i just download it, it will be easier. Oh and get a mic.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> I can't find the time to read all the stuff about REW. there's so much. I need the "do this, this and this" version. Maybe if i just download it, it will be easier. Oh and get a mic.


Just initially playing around with the program and connecting the mic, not all that bad. MiniDSP has a pretty good and quick setup guide to get going, then I’ll follow audiofrog guide from there!


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Good to know. Speaking of audio frog... While their crossover guide is full of excellent info, i do not like the way 24db slopes sound with my mids. They lack oomph. My ears prefer 12db LR. What REW shows might sway my perception once i see the graph. Hoping to get my sub and false floor done this weekend. It's tricky because the spare tire is off center by like 2 inches but i want the sub centered of course. That's for another thread though.


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## Willbo (Mar 23, 2014)

Adurm said:


> I can't find the time to read all the stuff about REW. there's so much. I need the "do this, this and this" version. Maybe if i just download it, it will be easier. Oh and get a mic.


The audiofrog guide gives you the basics you need to know to start tuning with REW. You can go from there but if you start with the guide you should see good results right off the bat.


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## James_H (Aug 18, 2021)

Go look at the Audiofrog measurement mic, there is a document on that page on setting up REW. The procedure will work with any mic.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

OneFastCanuck said:


> small update: got my amplifier OEM male plug delivered today - will need to take some time to transfer the old plugs to this new one, solder and shrink wrap the connections. Nice thing is the pins on the back are easy to bend so I can make them straight and then trim to connect. I’ll be shrink wrapping the 12V power and ground to ensure they don’t mess with anything if the plug shifts under the seat while driving.
> 
> View attachment 321795
> 
> ...


Nice.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

So, started tuning and WOW am I learning a lot. Honestly not hard for me, just very time consuming.

i started following the audiofrog guide but soon realized it was indeed very basic and the scale is also basic - I decided to follow the advice from pssound and set to 1/48db scale and saw quite a bit more detail in terms of peaks and valleys.

i started tuning with the graphic equalizer but you only can do certain frequencies and once it’s set and you go back to the PEQ page, you can’t go back after or it resets. You can always fine tune from the parametric EQ screen and settings save as long as you download. You canselect any of the 31 bands and virtually input any exact frequency, amountyou want to add or subtract and then the Q value. I found this method to be the easiest.

omly got a rough tune on the two door woofers and stopped for lunch.
Weirdly I found my right speaker to be a few sub lower overall from the right woofer so I lowered the output level of right speaker a tad (is this how you are supposed to do it?

fyi I downloaded the audiofrog target curve and imported it into REW and I am matching each speaker to that as best I can with 1/48db resolution.


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## James_H (Aug 18, 2021)

The fun starts when you play both sides together. Each side will look so good on its own, and then together will be much different.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Well, I already tried the woofers together and they sum up pretty equal.

they only have one dip around 600hz that I won’t be able to tune it, just the speakers and the cabin gain. I know that it happens.

Still have peaks and dips but much more linear than it was so progress!

will be moving to tweeters next then subs and hopefully everything sums nicely.


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## James_H (Aug 18, 2021)

In my car, the midrange is where most of the trouble is. When you display the left side, right side, and both together, you can see where you have phase issues between the sides by where the response for both sides dips down to meet or go below the individual sides. Something else I’ve tried to highlight phasing issues: play all speakers with correlated and uncorrelated pink noise. Where the response differs is likely caused by phase misalignment between the sides.

The part that took me the longest to be happy with was the subwoofer to midbass transition. Look at it carefully with each side + subs compared to all speakers. I don’t recall all the things I did to improve mine, I think I needed to adjust time alignment on both my sub (I only have 1) and one midbass driver, experiment with the crossover frequency, and crossover alignment.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

James_H said:


> In my car, the midrange is where most of the trouble is. When you display the left side, right side, and both together, you can see where you have phase issues between the sides by where the response for both sides dips down to meet or go below the individual sides. Something else I’ve tried to highlight phasing issues: play all speakers with correlated and uncorrelated pink noise. Where the response differs is likely caused by phase misalignment between the sides.
> 
> The part that took me the longest to be happy with was the subwoofer to midbass transition. Look at it carefully with each side + subs compared to all speakers. I don’t recall all the things I did to improve mine, I think I needed to adjust time alignment on both my sub (I only have 1) and one midbass driver, experiment with the crossover frequency, and crossover alignment.


Your midrange phase issues to me sound like a miscalculation in time alignment. I had no such issues tuning and I even tried for fun putting the tweeters out of phase and saw a big dip, then put em back and all speakers summed up nicely.

I will post screenshots in a bit of the before/after. All I can say is wow.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I'm happy you're getting the results you want so far. From your engineering background, previous systems and fabrication skills, i could tell this would be an awesome build. Maybe you can set me straight on something? When people talk about center stage, is this the center of the dash or center to your listening position? I have a hard time with it being center dash because that's to the right of me. But if i go center steering wheel I'm afraid I'll lose width (if that's a thing). Maybe I'm over thinking it.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Alright fellow audio enthusiasts, after 6 hours of tuning (2x 3 hours and a short break for lunch) I can say I am extremely happy with where my system is at - especially given it is the first time tuning a DSP EVER.

The umik-1 is a must honestly, it does MAGIC. 

Along with Audiofrog target curve, I was able to get a pretty linear response and fix MANY major dips and peaks. The biggest fix was the bass - these shallow mount subs can really hit. I had to turn them down to -10 at first, and after a bit of listening I settled on them being at -9 level since I like a little more bass in my music.

If I put more time into it, I am sure I could make it even more linear. But, as this is not a competition car, and I was using 1/48 octave RTA and 1/6 smoothing which is above what was suggested in the audiofrog guide.

As I have learned from my research and watching many vids from people like PSSounds, there are some dips that just are not fixable no matter how much you play with it. In my case, this was the 500-650hZ range, in which the install and cabin gain probably came into play with my midbass speakers. No worries though, sometimes you just have to accept that and do your best with the rest.

Now onto the screenshots - I just ended up taking of each pair of speakers, since after tuning each side of each pair, there were no real major differences besides matching the volume;


First off, the woofers pair before tuning;












After tuning;














next was tweeters BEFORE tuning - some major issues I had to iron out;














I am quite proud of how the tweeters turned out honestly, a reeally nice flat response up until around 15-16K and then dropped off due to them not being on axis (again - installation results) - had they been installed on axis in a proper pillar pod, they would most likely be flat up until 18-19khz, but I am very pleased nonetheless;











And now for the subs - I knew these were peaky around 40-55 Hz ish just by ear, and I was not far off. Also had to lower the volume to match well with the other speakers;













and tuned:












The rear fill I was less worried about but just wanted something somewhat linear from them - as such I did not spend as much time on them. They were quite a bit lower in volume than the fronts but that is OK, they are there for the effect. crossover points at 250hz to 5000hz;


before tuning:











and after tuning:
















finally, putting everything together, the entire system tuned;














besides the dip from 500-700-ish, I am very happy with the linearity for a non-pro installer and first time tuning.

There is another small dip at the crossover point of the woofer and tweeter around 2.8K, I may try to spend more time working that one out in the future, but after listening to some music honestly I am amazed at how much detail I now have and how everything sounds together. It gets loud enough and stays clear the entire way. More detail than I have ever heard before. Would love to hear a proper SQ system to compare and discover where my faults lie!

This was a fun journey and learning experience, which I am glad to share with you all.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Looks great to me. I'm sure it sounds amazing!


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## SWRocket (Jul 23, 2010)

Awesome results! Tuning is addictive though so I'm sure you'll end up spending a lot more time trying different curves, XO points and EQ just for fun. I just finally had to pull the USB cable and MIC out of my car yesterday, months after my install and first tune, because I couldn't stop messing around trying to improve lol.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

SWRocket said:


> Awesome results! Tuning is addictive though so I'm sure you'll end up spending a lot more time trying different curves, XO points and EQ just for fun. I just finally had to pull the USB cable and MIC out of my car yesterday, months after my install and first tune, because I couldn't stop messing around trying to improve lol.


oh I am sure I will go back and try some new things just for fun! I also wanted to do a passenger seat tune for demo'ing to friends. 

I really was focused on getting a good tune and finishing up this build before baby comes in about 7 weeks, since after that, I don't see myself working on the car at all! I'll call it a hard deadline 

All that is left for this build (other than enjoying it) is finishing up two beauty panels in trunk and re-connecting speaker wires via the OEM plug under the seat! I am waiting on a router bit to arrive that I ordered to do those beauty panels - it's a 60-degree bevel bit which will give the contour of my beauty panels a really nice OEM style finish. I even bought a new, larger router with 1/2-inch collet just to do these beauty panels! Was on sale for like 70% off though so can't complain!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Decided to keep a simple solution for the beauty panel above the subwoofers. I ordered two 12-inch round steel mesh speaker grills from my local electronics store, I plan to flush them into the top beauty panel, hopefully using magnets they will hold in place since they are metal. Then wrap the beauty panel in carpet. 60-degree bevel on the sides and front. Then I will have one more beauty panel from the rear of that panel to the rear of the seats, which will cover the amps, also wrapped in carpet. This will give a stepped look to the trunk, and protect all of my gear while allowing me to still transport all kinds of stuff in the hatch, including strollers, renovations supplies for my multiplex, etc etc. 

I really wanted to do the molded metal mesh, but the piece I would need to buy is $128 plus shipping, probably $150 for the small piece of aluminum mesh, then the work required to make the mold and then press it, will be too much before baby arrives. I will go with this solution and it will fit my needs albeit a little less fancy.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

my grills are pretty similar to this. Amazon.com

JT just bolted from the bottom:









daily driving mode with the factory false floor on top:


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> my grills are pretty similar to this. Amazon.com
> 
> JT just bolted from the bottom:
> 
> ...


Very nice! Thank you for sharing - that first picture SO CLEAN! I’d even leave it like that! You’ve confirmed my choice 
Since my subs and amp rack come up higher off the floor, I can’t use the OEM false floor. I could put another cover on top of the subs which would essentially come flush with amp racks floor and make the whole thing super stealth - maybe later on.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

i just cut my false floor back (near the back seat)


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

here's underneath:


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Ok you win. I'm not posting pictures ever again.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

please keep posting! 

JT's also been doing this for a long time with all the talent, skills, and experience that brings.

i don't have the time, space, tools, or skills to all of my own stuff; especially not the likes of people here. i post things to give others ideas and inspiration.


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## Willbo (Mar 23, 2014)

nadams5755 said:


> here's underneath:


Daaaaammmmnnnnnn.......


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> here's underneath:


that looks great! love the looks of those subs - are they shallow mount or are they regular sized (which would assume you have a GTI for the extra depth)?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Small update - got the grilles I ordered and I really am liking the honeycomb pattern. They are metal. Also ordered magnets and going to use them to attach the grill to the upper beauty panel.

Here is a photo of the grilles sitting on the subs plus their thickness (pretty thin) - really excited for how it is going to look.

I need to work on my upstairs unit again this weekend - new kitchen is almost done LOL need to put the countertop and new sink and a very small amount of painting left. I will try to take some time on Sunday to finish up at least the first beauty panel. Maybe even the second.

I also need to shorten the power and ground wires to the small pioneer amp on the left (as you can see from photo below)

I had to make my own baseplate for my new router in order for the giant 60-degree bevel bit to fit hahaha sometimes you just have to 'MacGyver' that ****.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Ok you win. I'm not posting pictures ever again.


seriously bro, we all start somewhere so Keep on sharing! You should have seen my previous builds like 7-8 years ago and earlier...VERY simple! I think maturity and patience played a role in this current build but obviously I have gained knowledge and experience during the years as well!


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

OneFastCanuck said:


> that looks great! love the looks of those subs - are they shallow mount or are they regular sized (which would assume you have a GTI for the extra depth)?


nope, regular c12xls. (the shallow c12s have magnets in front of the cone). it's a neo xbl2 motor structure, so it looks more like a traffic cone. 

c12xl  vs c12

the mk6 golf's spare tire well is like a bundt cake pan, with the evap canister/system under the center. the narrow+deep subs fit nicely. i don't know if a wide ferrite magnet sub would fit.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> nope, regular c12xls. (the shallow c12s have magnets in front of the cone). it's a neo xbl2 motor structure, so it looks more like a traffic cone.
> 
> c12xl  vs c12
> 
> the mk6 golf's spare tire well is like a bundt cake pan, with the evap canister/system under the center. the narrow+deep subs fit nicely. i don't know if a wide ferrite magnet sub would fit.


nice! I’m sure yours play lower than mine - think the FS of my subs is around 34hz which is not bad but they definitely drop off a little bit after 25-27ish hz and really don’t play much under 20hz. Still impressive for shallow mount subs.


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

you could add a little boost 20-25hz, as long as the subs don't sound like they're bottoming out.

i used to have it w/ a couple of raven 10xls but wanted some additional effortlessness in the bottom octave. i wanted less tactile feedback 20-30hz. more cone area helped.










same enclosure for the 12s as the 10s. 1cu ft each, 1100w each.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

nadams5755 said:


> you could add a little boost 20-25hz, as long as the subs don't sound like they're bottoming out.
> 
> i used to have it w/ a couple of raven 10xls but wanted some additional effortlessness in the bottom octave. i wanted less tactile feedback 20-30hz. more cone area helped.
> 
> ...


nice - honesty I’m pretty happy with the performance given the space I have - the subs play well in 90% of the music I’m listening to. They’re pretty linear until the low 20’s before they begin to drop. They’re currently at -9 in the DSP since they’re way louder than the speakers (and the speakers get LOuD!) but I could always put them at around -5 and then use the DSP to lower everything above 30hz so that the low end comes through and no need for boosting. The amp I have them on is pretty beast for sure - I hope it lasts me a long time.
I’m most likely going to make a “bass head” mode where I boost up the subs for those days when I just want some rap and SPL. Love how with the press of a button I can go to different times on the DSP- it’s just so cool!


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## 03blueSI (Feb 5, 2006)

Did you end up using the outputs in the glove box? If so what coding did you do?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

03blueSI said:


> Did you end up using the outputs in the glove box? If so what coding did you do?


After tons of research, I opted for the NavTV Zen-V. There is no other way to get a proper clean signal from the stock head unit otherwise. If you reprogram the head unit to bypass th fender system, you can use the high level inputs into the DSP and get a signal but it isn’t very clean and if you turn up the volume on stock head unit, the equalization changes and your tuning goes out the window. So, you would have to use the same volume on stock head unit all the time and only use DSP remote to control the volume (depending on the DSP and if it even has a remote). I could not live with that - if doing a proper audio system, it should be fully integrated and retain all OEM features. The zen-V, although expensive, retains all OEM features and perfect integration into the car - and having an optical signal to the DSP is a VERY big advantage. Clean signal up to 100% volume on the head unit - I’ve never seen that before even with aftermarket head units. Basically if I am putting 150+ hours of work into the car’s audio system, I’m not going to skimp on getting a decent signal. And, I figure it’s money i don’t have to spend on a head unit (which would cost almost a grand anyways). Proper Sound quality requires a decent budget, after doing several builds I have learned and realized that proper planning is key and spending in the right places is necessary. For example, I would never build a system without a DSP again - it just doesn’t make sense to me, knowing what I know now. Also, I would definitely opt for a three-way setup next time - I really like the idea of each pair of drivers playing in the region where they do best. My 5.25-inch midwoofers struggle to provide good midbass and upper end, and my tweeters are pretty decent to get down low, but the system could benefit from a proper midrange and let the tweeter do its thing from 10K upwards. 

Might eventually swap some larger drivers into the front doors (7" if possible) - for now I will take the time to enjoy the system and what I have accomplished, play with the tuning a little more, then decide where I would like to invest in changes.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Hey boss, you recall what size screws for the oem mids? I might be ditching the rears and bridging out to the fronts.


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

Admittedly, I have only read the first few pages and then jumped to the last few, so, sorry if I missed this... Did you end up using the passive crossovers or did you go active?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Hey boss, you recall what size screws for the oem mids? I might be ditching the rears and bridging out to the fronts.


You mean in the doors? They were actually riveted so drilled them out, put threaded riv-nuts and used M5 machine screws to secure them to the door. You could go slightly smaller but I found that size to be good and solid. This way if I ever return to stock (or upgrade my drivers) I just un-screw my speakers and screw in the replacements/OEM speakers.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

mumbles said:


> Admittedly, I have only read the first few pages and then jumped to the last few, so, sorry if I missed this... Did you end up using the passive crossovers or did you go active?


Nope - ACTIVE BABY and so glad I did. Happy to have had some forum members push me in the right direction with that. Passive is a waste of amp power and offers little control with a DSP.

i would definitely suggest a 3-way setup to anyone doing a build - doesn’t have to be expensive drivers either. Just doing the tuning, I can appreciate the need for each speaker to do what they are good at, meaning playing only the frequencies where they work best.
Also wish I was able to do the tweeters on axis but I wanted to minimize the work (custom pillars were out of the question with this one) and keep it OEM looking for now.
The imaging is probably the coolest part for me - it’s crazy how it sounds like the vocals are coming directly from the center windshield. And when I sit in passenger seat to give a demo to friend, that all goes out the window (image all messed up) - just shows how critical the tuning is.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

Thank you. Now i recall you saying that. Yes i want to put my stock ones back in. I have a rivet tool but it gets too close to the mount and i can't use it.


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## mumbles (Jul 26, 2010)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Nope - ACTIVE BABY and so glad I did. Happy to have had some forum members push me in the right direction with that. Passive is a waste of amp power and offers little control with a DSP.
> 
> i would definitely suggest a 3-way setup to anyone doing a build - doesn’t have to be expensive drivers either. Just doing the tuning, I can appreciate the need for each speaker to do what they are good at, meaning playing only the frequencies where they work best.
> Also wish I was able to do the tweeters on axis but I wanted to minimize the work (custom pillars were out of the question with this one) and keep it OEM looking for now.
> The imaging is probably the coolest part for me - it’s crazy how it sounds like the vocals are coming directly from the center windshield. And when I sit in passenger seat to give a demo to friend, that all goes out the window (image all messed up) - just shows how critical the tuning is.


Good deal... I was thinking the Zapco DSP was waaaay overkill if you were going to use passives.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Adurm said:


> Thank you. Now i recall you saying that. Yes i want to put my stock ones back in. I have a rivet tool but it gets too close to the mount and i can't use it.


alternatively, you could use a machine screw from behind with a bolt in front to hold the speaker - have seen someone do that with good results. I suggest you use stainless steel to avoid rust since the doors do get some moisture.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

mumbles said:


> Good deal... I was thinking the Zapco DSP was waaaay overkill if you were going to use passives.


Oh definitely! This thing is incredible!!!


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## nadams5755 (Jun 8, 2012)

screws/nuts suck, i've done it. just use a rivnut.


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Idk what I’m doing wrong, but half the time I tried to nuts on the Oem holes they would spin in the metal. They weren’t securing tight enough to stop spinning


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

01LSi said:


> Idk what I’m doing wrong, but half the time I tried to nuts on the Oem holes they would spin in the metal. They weren’t securing tight enough to stop spinning


You should put the bolts in from behind sheet metal, add a little bit of super glue (or other equivalent product) to keep them in place then tighten with a nut from the front. 

IMO, threaded inserts are a much more elegant solution. I have learned that in competitions they even check for these types of things (pretty cool actually!) and as an engineer, I have trouble half-assing things when I know there's a better solution (of course, as long as the cost isn't prohibitive) 

I purchased my stainless threaded riv-nuts off Amazon and also the tool separately - total cost for everything was a little under $100 CAD if I recall, but at least it is something you can re-use in the future for many things, both in automotive world and outside it (ex home furniture, home theatre builds for example) and for things like mounting amp racks in the trunk as well.


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## 03blueSI (Feb 5, 2006)

OneFastCanuck said:


> After tons of research, I opted for the NavTV Zen-V. There is no other way to get a proper clean signal from the stock head unit otherwise. If you reprogram the head unit to bypass th fender system, you can use the high level inputs into the DSP and get a signal but it isn’t very clean and if you turn up the volume on stock head unit, the equalization changes and your tuning goes out the window. So, you would have to use the same volume on stock head unit all the time and only use DSP remote to control the volume (depending on the DSP and if it even has a remote). I could not live with that - if doing a proper audio system, it should be fully integrated and retain all OEM features. The zen-V, although expensive, retains all OEM features and perfect integration into the car - and having an optical signal to the DSP is a VERY big advantage. Clean signal up to 100% volume on the head unit - I’ve never seen that before even with aftermarket head units. Basically if I am putting 150+ hours of work into the car’s audio system, I’m not going to skimp on getting a decent signal. And, I figure it’s money i don’t have to spend on a head unit (which would cost almost a grand anyways). Proper Sound quality requires a decent budget, after doing several builds I have learned and realized that proper planning is key and spending in the right places is necessary. For example, I would never build a system without a DSP again - it just doesn’t make sense to me, knowing what I know now. Also, I would definitely opt for a three-way setup next time - I really like the idea of each pair of drivers playing in the region where they do best. My 5.25-inch midwoofers struggle to provide good midbass and upper end, and my tweeters are pretty decent to get down low, but the system could benefit from a proper midrange and let the tweeter do its thing from 10K upwards.
> 
> Might eventually swap some larger drivers into the front doors (7" if possible) - for now I will take the time to enjoy the system and what I have accomplished, play with the tuning a little more, then decide where I would like to invest in changes.


Thanks. I was trying to find the options for my 2021 which seemed to have none of the options in vcds that people mentioned. Someone told me I needed to use adaptations instead but no one seemed to know what changes to make. the 2021 has MIB3 and no most. I ended up upgrading to a 2019 golf r which has most and now looking to get a zen v as well


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

03blueSI said:


> Thanks. I was trying to find the options for my 2021 which seemed to have none of the options in vcds that people mentioned. Someone told me I needed to use adaptations instead but no one seemed to know what changes to make. the 2021 has MIB3 and no most. I ended up upgrading to a 2019 golf r which has most and now looking to get a zen v as well


honestly, I know it’s crazy expensive, but I totally understand now why it is worth it - it retains all factory settings and the sound quality is literally like nothing else you can get (at least, for the signal going INtO your DSP via optical - the tuning from there is totally your responsibility 😅) the only other option I would see is to ditch OEM integration completely and just use Bluetooth to DSP or direct connect to DSP. However you’ll lose navigation, phone calls, etc which I didn’t want.


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

Enjoyed the thread!

Had a 2019 Golf R for just under a year.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Muu said:


> Enjoyed the thread!
> 
> Had a 2019 Golf R for just under a year.


Nice! Why so short? Love the car - it does exactly what I need for a daily and enough space - I'm just over 4 years of ownership now and plan on keeping it another 3 years minimum (only has 39,000km on it!)


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

They're really capable cars, but fancied another AMG so bought a C63S wagon. Have a Taycan GTS wagon coming in a year though.


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## Adurm (Jan 6, 2019)

I don't know if we get either of those state side


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Muu said:


> They're really capable cars, but fancied another AMG so bought a C63S wagon. Have a Taycan GTS wagon coming in a year though.


Yeah those are both awesome cars and definitely upgrades to the R. I’m still young and working to build my wealth, so keeping this car longer since it’s almost paid will help me achieve some other goals, and I really want a cayman GT4 as a “summer toy #2” (along side my motorcycle Loool) eventually. Gotta have goals in life!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Update - after a while not doing any fabrication on the car (other priorities) I finally finished the beauty panel for top of subwoofer box. Went decently smooth, I would say maybe 90/100 since I was rushed and the cutting around subwoofer holes is not as perfectly clean as I like but it will do its job well. 

I have just the back cover panel to make that will cover the amps/DSP so I can use my trunk for transporting whatever I need to transport 



































I thought I had taken a photo of it installed but I guess not! Will take one next time I have the chance.


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## bertholomey (Dec 27, 2007)

Wow! That looks fantastic! Well Done!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Now, I can safely say I dislike soldering. Especially when it is OEM style tiny pins.

I was unsuccessful in soldering my speaker wires to the OEM amplifier plug, and so I gave up and just went back to my <temporary< solution which is now a permanent solution. It isn't pretty, but it is functional and solid.

The main issue I had with the soldering of my wires to the OEM plug was that the solder did not want to stick well to the OEM plug pins, and as I heated the pin and wire to get solder on them, the plastic of OEM plug began to heat up and the OEM pins would get loose and out-of-line. I concluded that it just was not worth it.

A better solution would be to just solder on some VERY small female spade terminals to all my speaker wires, and then plug those onto the back pins of the OEM plug, then just plug into the original amp harness as planned, but I did not have female terminals that small (in fact I think it would be hard to find) and I just don't have more time to spend on something that works fine already. So I simply put it back how it was before, and zip tied everything down, then put the OEM plastic amp cover back on top of it all.

Here are some photos - I started with confidence and removed all pins from the harness that I did not need;






















Then finished frustrated with my now "Permanent" solution;

















I even jiggled the wires around and ensured that nothing would come loose when hitting the notoriously gigantic potholes of our run-down city. Although it hurts my eyes visually, I know it is secure.


Now just the top amp panel to finish - need another piece of MDF to do that.


I would LOVE to get larger door speakers for more midbass (move to a 7-inch instead of current 5.25) but then I feel I would also need a wideband to fill the middle frequencies (250-5000 ish Hz) and while I'm doing that might as well aim tweeters (and then begins the ascent into darkness...) so for now I will enjoy the WAY-BETTER-THAN-STOCK system and eventually upgrade one thing at a time. If I knew a shop here who did real nice work on A-pillar pods, I would probably get that done next year and put a nice mid and tweet, then upgrade the mid-bass, but as of right now I don't have much confidence in any shops to do the work to my expectations (especially assuming the price they would charge).


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

You know you can get connectors with long tails, rather than using the PCB header version?


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Muu said:


> You know you can get connectors with long tails, rather than using the PCB header version?


Thst would make things a lot easier but the link/source I had for the plug was only for that model - was not aware than one existed with tails. Oh well!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Got some time to work on the final trunk beauty panel and finished up the STEALTH look - didn't have the same carpet so ended up using some old carpet I had, matches like 80% and hurts my OCD but it is perfectly fine for me, given my current time constraints (Baby incoming any day now!!!)

The main point is...I can use my car exactly as I did before the system now. I can throw supplies from home depot for my renos, throw baby strollers back there, etc. without worrying about damaging any of the equipment. 

Definitely would love to get some time to do more tuning - I want to add a tune where I put the microphone in the center of the two front seats, for "general listening" with friends in the car, then one other tune as a "demo" mode for passenger (place microphone in passenger seat) so that imaging would be perfect for passenger when I want to give a demo of the system without changing seats. 
That all requires time though, so we will see if I get to it. 85% of the time I will be alone in the car and so I'm glad I have somewhat of a decent tune for my own listening.


Here's the top beauty panel in place after I routered it all out from 1/2-inch MDF:














Originally, I planned to put some supports on each of the back corners to hold it in place/keep it firm from bending even if some weight was on it. However, this was complicated as I would have to figure out how to secure it o the piece AND then wrap the whole piece, or wrap first then secure cleanly later.

Finally I decided, the easiest thing to do, is let it rest on the top of the Zapco DSP with a piece of closed cell foam I had left over from the build. The DSP doesn't really generate heat, and the foam protects it - the piece is already quite rigid too so I am not worried long-term.


Here is the piece after I wrapped it. I am by no means perfect at wrapping panels yet, but I think it looks pretty pleasing to the eye;













































Here is the back of the panel, including the piece of closed cell foam I placed on there for protection+support on the DSP;
















and finally, what we have all been waiting for - the FINAL product - STEALTH mode;




















You can't tell from the photo due to poor lighting, but in daylight (outside) the two different carpet shades are relatively evident. Oh well, it fits my needs and at this point I kind of ran out of time, just happy I was able to get all of my tasks done and the car is useable again  I can always re-wrap the upper piece eventually, but realistically the next time I touch a car audio system will be when I rip this one out to prepare to sell/trade in the car for the next beast


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Muu said:


> You know you can get connectors with long tails, rather than using the PCB header version?


The PCB version was the closest I found. Do you happen to know the model that would come with tails? 

Or are you saying in general they almost always have one with tails?


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Ideally if someone shares a harness with tails that’s perfect. But I stumbled on this in my photos. Could consider this we ever go back in there …


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Or this but I definitely prefer the above post I made …


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

Cut one of these up...


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## 01LSi (Jul 27, 2012)

Muu said:


> View attachment 328573
> 
> Cut one of these up...


wish someone shared that with me when I was trying to figure it out .... looks like it's for a Mercedes but looks like it's the same harness (*MATCH PP-MB 1.9BUR PLUG & PLAY CABLE FOR BURMESTER TO AFTERMARKET AMP INSTALLS)*


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## Muu (Jan 22, 2020)

Yeah, Merc one but the connector is the same, Bose Porsche too


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## 03blueSI (Feb 5, 2006)

OneFastCanuck said:


> Thst would make things a lot easier but the link/source I had for the plug was only for that model - was not aware than one existed with tails. Oh well!


Idatalink maestro has one that is for use with the ar amp replacement kit (works with some of the vw cars not the golf r though no firmware yet for it. Connector fits just doesn’t turn on the ar adapter with the vw firmware’s they have). Curious if you have which wires you used for which speakers. I’m getting ready to do my install. Only really need the ones for the front door woofer honestly because I am running the sun direct probably running tweeter direct and plan to use one output for a kick panel mounted midrange. But if you have all of them that would be great. May eventually run rear speakers to keep rear passengers happy.



https://www.idatalinkmaestro.com/en/accessory/1008/HRN-AR-VW1


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## Nemesis87 (6 mo ago)

01LSi said:


> wish someone shared that with me when I was trying to figure it out .... looks like it's for a Mercedes but looks like it's the same harness (*MATCH PP-MB 1.9BUR PLUG & PLAY CABLE FOR BURMESTER TO AFTERMARKET AMP INSTALLS)*


Don’t use that connector, or the ones for Merc. The VW one is a 38 pin and the Merc one is 32. It’ll work if you only want to use some of the pins, so you won’t be able to connect to the rear door tweeter wires. If you don’t have those, or care to use them, then you can remove that set of pins that doesn’t line up.

Mouser has a connector that you can attach your own wires to, Mouser #: 571-1534531-1, for $12 or the iDatalink harness that someone else posted, iDatalink HRN-AR-VW1, that Crutchfield has for $47.


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jsteezy28 said:


> Don’t use that connector, or the ones for Merc. The VW one is a 38 pin and the Merc one is 32. It’ll work if you only want to use some of the pins, so you won’t be able to connect to the rear door tweeter wires. If you don’t have those, or care to use them, then you can remove that set of pins that doesn’t line up.
> 
> Mouser has a connector that you can attach your own wires to, Mouser #: 571-1534531-1, for $12 or the iDatalink harness that someone else posted, iDatalink HRN-AR-VW1, that Crutchfield has for $47.


As mentioned earlier in the thread, we are 2 on the forum to have tried that Mouser connector and have failed. On my end, the Mouser connector is just too much work to integrate - almost impossible to solder my speaker signal cables onto the Mouser pins, so I would have to get individual female spade connectors to attach each wire onto the back of each pin. I ended up just keeping my male spade connectors (individual to each speaker wire) into the female OEM plug - not perfect and doesn't satisfy my OCD but my system has been running beautifully without any issues for about 8 months now. 

The iDatalink harness looks like a way better option but it<s $88 here in Canada and I haven't yet seen anyone on here use it (ie are all pins in right locations? etc.) so I won't go for that option for now but thanks for sharing, I will keep it in mind in the future.


System has been working very well and sound quality is pretty great for the type of build (2-way in stock location), though I long for A-pillars with tweets and mids - since the car is low km and I have an extended warranty, I still plan to keep it at least another 2-3 years, so maybe next year I'll order some spare pillars and slowly begin fabricating for a 3-way setup (always wanted one!) but I have a lot less time now with a 6-month old so we shall see!!


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## Nemesis87 (6 mo ago)

OneFastCanuck said:


> As mentioned earlier in the thread, we are 2 on the forum to have tried that Mouser connector and have failed. On my end, the Mouser connector is just too much work to integrate - almost impossible to solder my speaker signal cables onto the Mouser pins, so I would have to get individual female spade connectors to attach each wire onto the back of each pin. I ended up just keeping my male spade connectors (individual to each speaker wire) into the female OEM plug - not perfect and doesn't satisfy my OCD but my system has been running beautifully without any issues for about 8 months now.
> 
> The iDatalink harness looks like a way better option but it<s $88 here in Canada and I haven't yet seen anyone on here use it (ie are all pins in right locations? etc.) so I won't go for that option for now but thanks for sharing, I will keep it in mind in the future.
> 
> ...


I had ordered two of those connectors and planned to cut off the tabs at the bend, so the soldered wires run straight. I didn‘t actually get to it since I found out about the harness shortly after. I assume it must be the type of metal that they use or the type of solder that we would use, why the two wouldn’t stick 🤷‍♂️. I can still try one, with the solder I have, just to see if it’s possible to get it to hold well.

The harness arrived yesterday, and even though it’s not suggested to work for my car (2019 Golf w/ Fender amp) all the wires are there except 1 which I think is unused anyway, so it should just be a simple splice. I have some 11 conductor, 16 gauge wire from T-Spec that I’m planning to use to make two runs from the amps in the back, up to the 10 channels for the cabin speakers. Having the front door woofer be dvc is perfect for stealing a pair for mids.

I too toyed with the idea of a mid in the pillar, but wanted to remain ‘stealth’. I realised I can mount a mid next to the woofer (in the cup holder space) and still be able to aim it properly for both driver and passenger.

The harness and the multi-core wire ($75 for 20ft.) can be pretty expensive, but it allows for so much flexibility and utilises all the factory wiring without cutting a single thing. I’ll update once I’ve done it.

Congrats on the baby!


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## OneFastCanuck (Aug 18, 2021)

Jsteezy28 said:


> I had ordered two of those connectors and planned to cut off the tabs at the bend, so the soldered wires run straight. I didn‘t actually get to it since I found out about the harness shortly after. I assume it must be the type of metal that they use or the type of solder that we would use, why the two wouldn’t stick 🤷‍♂️. I can still try one, with the solder I have, just to see if it’s possible to get it to hold well.
> 
> The harness arrived yesterday, and even though it’s not suggested to work for my car (2019 Golf w/ Fender amp) all the wires are there except 1 which I think is unused anyway, so it should just be a simple splice. I have some 11 conductor, 16 gauge wire from T-Spec that I’m planning to use to make two runs from the amps in the back, up to the 10 channels for the cabin speakers. Having the front door woofer be dvc is perfect for stealing a pair for mids.
> 
> ...


cool thanks for the feedback - for the Mouser, I did exactly as you suggested (great minds think alike) - I un-bent them and cut them a bit shorter. I think it is the material they use for the pins, as you said - solder did not stick well when I tried. The other issue is that they become loose in the plastic when heated with the iron, which is really frustrating! That was the main issue for me. Although I am not a master solderer, I have decent experience. Even with a heat sink (ie pliers) between the pin and the plastic of the plug, there seemed to be enough heat transfer to soften the plastic housing around each pin and make it crooked - those pins are super tight to work on too!

I like the harness idea for sure as no splicing and it is a lot nicer than my option of just jamming my wires into the OEM female plug via spade connectors, like I have them now (even if they hold, one wrong pothole could cause issues down the line, you never know)

I do like the idea of stealth as well but my biggest issue is the aiming of my tweeters. When tuning, it's obvious that the tweeters would be much better on-axis, as I have to correct above 13-14K frequencies and by a decent margin - and I don't like to overcorrect (ie more than 6dB boost) since I do not want to clip the DSP. But I definitely did pretty well for the setup I have, and being the first time ever tuning when I first did it, pretty impressive (though far from perfect) and I learned a LOT from this first go!

thanks for the congrats, it definitely turns your life upside down having your first child - but man are there rewarding moments  plus I know I'll regain my life back in a decade or two LOL


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